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| jonwil | Is there anyone around who can help me out by testing something on their N900? | 00:25 |
|---|---|---|
| Sicelo009N | what is it, and what conditions for the test? | 00:28 |
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| jonwil | I just want someone to try installing my new updated maemo-security-certman packages and then see what happens when they visit certain https websites | 00:44 |
| jonwil | Doesn't matter if you are running CSSU or not or what, I just want more data points | 00:44 |
| jonwil | right now we have one data point (me) that says "its broken" and another one from the forum that says "it works" | 00:45 |
| bencoh | hmm | 00:45 |
| Sicelo009N | i saw the thread | 00:45 |
| Sicelo009N | okay. will install | 00:45 |
| bencoh | I guess you're just not trying the same sites? | 00:45 |
| Sicelo009N | they are :) | 00:46 |
| jonwil | we are definatly trying the same sites | 00:48 |
| jonwil | Sicelo009N: Are you running CSSU? | 00:48 |
| Sicelo009N | yes, cssu testing on one, and thumb on the other. | 00:49 |
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| jonwil | ok, great | 00:51 |
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| Sicelo009N | taking long ... 2nd N900 acting up for some reason. rebooting it | 01:00 |
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| jonwil | ok | 01:09 |
| Sicelo009N | installed. rebooting again just to be sure. on to testing websites | 01:09 |
| Sicelo009N | jonwil: please remind me link for your bank. | 01:11 |
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| jonwil | try www.entrust.com | 01:12 |
| jonwil | that one doesn't work | 01:12 |
| jonwil | its the main website for the CA that is used by a bunch of broken sites | 01:12 |
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| Sicelo009N | my bank's https site works .. entrust-based. trying entrust itself now | 01:13 |
| jonwil | is this on cssu-thumb or cssu-testing? | 01:14 |
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| Sicelo009N | cssu-testing. | 01:16 |
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| Sicelo009N | entrust opening very slowly .. let's see what happens | 01:17 |
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| Sicelo009N | seems fine too | 01:20 |
| Sicelo009N | (hate it when microb sits there not loading a website when there's even no load on system) | 01:22 |
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| Sicelo009N | jonwil: microsoft site fine too. so looks like you fixed the thing for us, and somehow left yourself in the dark. i got no idea how to help | 01:26 |
| jonwil | Its likely that something in CSSU may be a factor here | 01:27 |
| jonwil | Or something in one of my self-built packages | 01:27 |
| jonwil | I am going to see what happens if I use my "restore packages to stock" switcher and see what happens if I install just the new certificates | 01:27 |
| Sicelo009N | you're not on cssu? | 01:28 |
| jonwil | no, I am on a set of self-built packages built from CSSU Git | 01:31 |
| jonwil | mostly | 01:31 |
| jonwil | I just dont want all of CSSU for various reasons | 01:31 |
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| Sicelo009N | in my culture, a person must eat food he cooks, just in case it's poisonous :p | 01:32 |
| jonwil | I am running all the packages that I have actually written code for (except those that aren't yet complete) | 01:33 |
| Sicelo009N | ah, at least | 01:34 |
| bencoh | :] | 01:35 |
| jonwil | ok, so running stock with just the new certman bits doesn't work either. Its entirely possible that there is something in CSSU that is impacting it or its possible something in your local system is making it work somehow | 01:35 |
| jonwil | e.g. some certificate has been cached by microb at some point or otherwise added to microb | 01:35 |
| jonwil | and that is causing things to work for you | 01:35 |
| Sicelo009N | ping anytime you need further tests :) | 01:36 |
| bencoh | jonwil: what about the certman-related entries in http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU/Changelog ? | 01:36 |
| jonwil | I have all those patches | 01:36 |
| jonwil | My code lives in community ssu git after all :) | 01:37 |
| Sicelo009N | rebooting thumb N900 for the certs update. | 01:37 |
| jonwil | ok | 01:37 |
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| jonwil | if GDB wasn't failing to properly debug microb-engine, I could see what is going wrong... | 01:38 |
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| Sicelo009N | hmm, on my thumb system, all certificates are messed up now. many missing | 01:43 |
| Sicelo009N | only invalid ones remaining | 01:43 |
| Sicelo009N | will reinstall the packages | 01:43 |
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| Sicelo009N | oh gosh | 01:46 |
| Sicelo009N | jonwil: on your device, what do you see in the list of certificates? maybe you have invalids like i do here. | 01:48 |
| jonwil | Every certificate I see in the certificate manager applet is legit | 01:50 |
| jonwil | The ones marked "certificate not currently valid" is correct since those are the blacklisted ones | 01:50 |
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| Sicelo009N | in my case i have only few certs, all invalid | 01:50 |
| Sicelo009N | what could be cause? | 01:50 |
| Sicelo009N | Leaving `diversion of /usr/lib/microb-engine/libnssckbi.so to /usr/lib/microb-engine/libnssckbi.mozilla by libmaemosec-certman0' | 01:50 |
| Sicelo009N | anything amiss with that line? | 01:51 |
| jonwil | nope, thats lefit | 01:51 |
| jonwil | what do you have in /etc/certs? | 01:51 |
| Sicelo009N | the 3 categories | 01:52 |
| Sicelo009N | in common-ca, lots of them | 01:52 |
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| Sicelo009N | 460 according to wc-l | 01:53 |
| jonwil | what about /etc/secure? | 01:53 |
| Sicelo009N | two directories, e and s. | 01:55 |
| jonwil | and in the s folder? | 01:55 |
| Sicelo009N | nothing in e, and 3 files in s | 01:55 |
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| Sicelo009N | certman.common-ca does contain what seems to be a valid list | 01:57 |
| jonwil | ok, weird that it isn't installing properly on your thumb device when it worked for someone else with cssu-thumb and it worked for you on your other device | 01:58 |
| Sicelo009N | any idea how to recover? :/ | 02:07 |
| Sicelo009N | trying to apt get reinstall those packages gives me "reinstallation is not possible, it cannot be downloaded" | 02:08 |
| Sicelo009N | let me look for debs | 02:08 |
| Sicelo009N | solved reinstallation, but my cert manager still only with invalid certs | 02:16 |
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| jonwil | What version of maemosec-certman-applet do you have installed? | 02:31 |
| Sicelo009N | now install 0.2.3 | 02:36 |
| Sicelo009N | maybe must reboot after reinstalling? | 02:36 |
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| jonwil | yeah maybe | 02:37 |
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| Sicelo | didn't help | 02:39 |
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| Sicelo009N | i hope there's a way to fix this without reflash. not keen on doing that | 02:40 |
| jonwil | Ok try this. dpkg -P on each of the maemosec-certman packages | 02:41 |
| jonwil | Then remove /etc/certs/* and /etc/secure/* | 02:41 |
| jonwil | then reinstall | 02:41 |
| jonwil | Thats the only thing I can suggest | 02:41 |
| Sicelo009N | what does dpkg -P do? | 02:41 |
| jonwil | Remove the package and all its config files | 02:42 |
| Sicelo009N | mp-fremantle... tied to it. cannot be removed :) | 02:42 |
| Sicelo009N | i'll remove the /etc/ stuff as you suggest and do a reinstall. let's see | 02:43 |
| jonwil | yeah try that | 02:43 |
| jonwil | Thats the only suggestion I have | 02:43 |
| Sicelo009N | absolutely no certs now | 02:45 |
| jonwil | ok, try reinstalling libnss3 and libss3-certs | 02:45 |
| jonwil | that might do something | 02:45 |
| jonwil | also try reinstalling maemosec-certman-applet and libmaemosec-certman-applet0 | 02:45 |
| Sicelo009N | peop.e must not delete /etc/certs/* or /etc/secure/* it seems | 02:48 |
| jonwil | hmmm, I have no idea how to fix then, sorrry | 02:48 |
| Sicelo009N | when installing libmaemosec* now there's 'list' of certs that gets updated. | 02:48 |
| Sicelo009N | i guess i'll copy it over from 2nd N900 | 02:48 |
| jonwil | yeah try that | 02:49 |
| jonwil | see what happens | 02:49 |
| Sicelo009N | jonwil: could it be that some of the postinst scripts in the debs has problem? | 02:50 |
| jonwil | Those haven' | 02:50 |
| jonwil | Haven't been touched from the Nokia originals | 02:50 |
| Sicelo | before copying over from 2nd N900, trying to downgrade back to 0.2.3 in case that makes a difference | 02:52 |
| jonwil | yeah try that | 02:52 |
| Sicelo | seems to be working .. pem files are coming in :) | 02:52 |
| Sicelo | okay.. seems good. let's see what applet seed | 02:53 |
| Sicelo | still blank. hmm | 02:53 |
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| Sicelo | jonwil: seems to me that some sort of "link" is missing/not being created? | 02:56 |
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| jonwil | no idea | 02:56 |
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| Sicelo | cmcli -T common-ca -L gives no output. | 03:01 |
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| jonwil | Whats in /etc/secure/s? | 03:07 |
| Sicelo | certman.blacklist and certman.common-ca | 03:09 |
| Sicelo | this is really weird :-/ | 03:09 |
| jonwil | whats the md5sum of those files? | 03:10 |
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| Sicelo009N | 91794a35d379f34c89cf1599009d1f10 /etc/secure/s/certman.blacklist | 03:12 |
| Sicelo009N | ee7333ca72a2fe3d84406e0f9e37cb8b /etc/secure/s/certman.common-ca | 03:12 |
| jonwil | ok, those are what I have | 03:12 |
| jonwil | what do you have in /etc/certs | 03:12 |
| jonwil | trusted, common-ca, blacklist, right? | 03:12 |
| Sicelo009N | yes | 03:13 |
| jonwil | and in trusted you have? | 03:13 |
| Sicelo009N | nothing. hmm | 03:14 |
| jonwil | yeah that's your problem | 03:15 |
| jonwil | you should have root.ca and root.key there | 03:15 |
| Sicelo009N | comes from libmaemosec0, let me reinstall that | 03:15 |
| jonwil | yep | 03:15 |
| Sicelo009N | but this was there before.. | 03:15 |
| jonwil | I am totally out of ideas to fix your system... | 03:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fwiw: 'default' CSSU system: http://paste.opensuse.org/99788683 | 03:16 |
| Sicelo009N | wtf! reinstalling doesn't restore root.ca & root.key | 03:18 |
| Sicelo009N | :/ | 03:18 |
| jonwil | weird | 03:18 |
| jonwil | copy from your other N900... | 03:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I can't find any root.ca and root.key in http://oss.fruct.org/repository/pool/maemo5.0/non-free/m/maemo-security-certman/libmaemosec-certman0_0.1.6+0m5_armel.deb | 03:24 |
| Sicelo009N | good now :) | 03:24 |
| Sicelo009N | certificates showing in applet | 03:25 |
| Sicelo009N | and looking the same as other N900. | 03:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.org/packages/view/libmaemosec0/ also sucks | 03:26 |
| jonwil | and do microsoft etc work or fail? | 03:26 |
| jonwil | since both should now be running the new set of root CA certs I believe | 03:27 |
| Sicelo009N | fail :( | 03:27 |
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| Sicelo009N | rebooting, although this doesn't seem to really help ... | 03:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: whats the problem with gdb? | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | missing source? | 03:32 |
| jonwil | no | 03:32 |
| jonwil | I connect to browserd with gdb --pid then break on the function I want then trigger it and gdb prints "Program terminated with signal SIGTRAP, Trace/breakpoint trap." | 03:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | err | 03:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | o.O | 03:34 |
| jonwil | very weird | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | >> I partially solved the issue by starting the application with GDB (instead of attaching the process)... Then its working fine.. No idea abt the root cause though..<< | 03:36 |
| jonwil | Starting with gdb wont work because of how browserd is started | 03:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | maemo-launcher? | 03:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ooh /sbin/dsme -p /usr/lib/dsme/libstartup.so | 03:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | hmmmm, I think you could patch the dsmetool command that starts browserd | 03:39 |
| jonwil | yeah probably | 03:40 |
| jonwil | not sure how though | 03:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or simply stop the browserd process via dsmetool and start it plain in gdb instead - after all dsme is only a glorified process monitor | 03:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | friggin dsmetool has no option to list active processes | 03:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | -k --stop=<cmd> Stop a process started with cmd | 03:42 |
| jonwil | that doesn't seem to work | 03:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | stopping doesn't work? | 03:44 |
| jonwil | it says "not found, not root or kill failed" | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wrong <cmd> | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | IroN900:~# dsmetool -k blabla | 03:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Process not killed: not found, not root or kill failed | 03:45 |
| jonwil | I dont know what to pass | 03:45 |
| jonwil | tried browserd | 03:45 |
| jonwil | and /usr/sbin/browserd | 03:45 |
| jonwil | no go | 03:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | try /usr/sbin/browserd -d | 03:45 |
| jonwil | nope, no error but nothing is killed either | 03:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | killall browserd until dsme gives up? dunno if it reboots system then | 03:46 |
| jonwil | yeah system reboot | 03:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | find the cmdline "dsmetool.*browserd" in /etc | 03:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and /lib etc | 03:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or even xsession | 03:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | /etc/X11/Xsession.post/30tablet-browser-daemon | 03:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | simply remove/rename/chmod >>if test -x /usr/sbin/dsmetool; then<< ;-) -- then reboot | 03:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or edit that file | 03:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually it starts browserd classical way when there's no dsmetool available | 03:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | if test -x /usr/sbin/dsmetool; then /usr/sbin/dsmetool -c 3 -T 180 -m -17 -t "/usr/sbin/browserd -d" else | 03:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | run-standalone.sh /usr/sbin/browserd -d -b fi | 03:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sheet | 03:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway I can see how dsmetool might be doing things to browserd process that are not compatible with gdb | 03:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | iirc there can only be one process monitor | 03:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dunno if dsme is a process monitor in that sense | 03:55 |
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| jonwil | Not even sure that is the right browserd instance, my system is running 3 of them | 04:21 |
| jonwil | -d, -s 1512 -n RTComMessagingServer and -s 1539 -n browserui | 04:21 |
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| jonwil | hildon-application-manager.launch also references browserd | 04:22 |
| jonwil | as does rtcom-messaging-ui | 04:23 |
| jonwil | if I can figure out what to do with a couple maemo-local patches for NSPR I might have another play at throwing in the most recent NSS/NSPR code (whatever is currently in mozilla-central mainline) and see if it builds or not | 04:26 |
| jonwil | but right now I gotta go out, got an appointment with a hairdresser :) | 04:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: http://wstaw.org/m/2016/02/11/plasma-desktophj3616.png all those browserd instances are childs of one parent process. That's the essential 'trick' with browserd | 04:36 |
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| Maxdamantus | They're basically "threads". | 05:05 |
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| brolin_empey | KotCzarny: Other than more connectors, is there any disadvantage to using an mSATA card on an mSATA ↔ 2.5-inch SATA adapter board instead of using a 2.5-inch SATA SSD? | 08:18 |
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| brolin_empey | Theoretically, an mSATA SSD installed on an mSATA ↔ 2.5-inch SATA adapter board is functionally equal to a 2.5-inch SATA SSD. However, I know from my personal experience that a CompactFlash (not CompactMagnetic) card installed on a CompactFlash card ↔ PATA adapter board is often not a drop-in replacement for a PATA HDD while a PATA SSD (not CompactFlash) is a drop-in replacement for a PATA HDD. | 08:26 |
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| KotCzarny | brolin_empey: if you see at the benchmarks of the same model of ssd, they are the same for ssd and msata (because connectors are just sata pins) | 08:59 |
| KotCzarny | one thing to note, if you install in pata--(m)sata adapter there is always controller chip issue | 09:01 |
| KotCzarny | but as i said, msata allows you to choose almost any drive model, and ssd with pata interface is almost always old and/or overpriced (2-3x) | 09:02 |
| Sicelo | freemangordon: please help jonwil with certificates :) | 09:02 |
| Sicelo | my daily N900 can no longer open https sites. | 09:02 |
| Sicelo | i remember you did some certificate magic for nokia supl server. maybe you would know what's going on here. by the way, the maemosec packages he produced work just fine for a user with cssu-thumb, work fine on my cssu-testing n900, but not on my thumb device, nor on jonwil's device. | 09:04 |
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| freemangordon | Sicelo: it was more than 2 years i played with that. However, what I remember is that certificate order is very important | 09:06 |
| freemangordon | also, I don't understand what he does and why so many problems, iirc what one needs is essentially - use cmcli to import or remove the certificates, then copy the result in the source tree and rebuild | 09:08 |
| KotCzarny | well, he learns on-the-go | 09:10 |
| freemangordon | ok, here is what a certificate change commit looks like https://github.com/community-ssu/maemo-security-certman/commit/2cbd96e89d7529e1ce25801824fb76f39b05b836 | 09:12 |
| freemangordon | I see nothing specia | 09:12 |
| freemangordon | l | 09:12 |
| freemangordon | see https://github.com/community-ssu/maemo-security-certman/commit/0be038825a98dae2d80fd411a02cb4c86ed1b36a too | 09:13 |
| Sicelo | he updated certificates, and all is good. but microb won't "see" them | 09:13 |
| freemangordon | does openssl see them? | 09:14 |
| freemangordon | openssl s_client that is | 09:14 |
| Sicelo | let me check. what's the command-u for that? | 09:14 |
| freemangordon | search google fro openssl s_client connect | 09:14 |
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| freemangordon | also, make sure to give CApath to openssl | 09:15 |
| Sicelo | what should that be? | 09:16 |
| freemangordon | /etc/$something | 09:16 |
| freemangordon | the certificates location | 09:17 |
| Wizzup | https://packages.debian.org/sid/ca-certificates perhaps this is somehow useful? | 09:18 |
| Wizzup | I am not sure if the took the certificates from there? | 09:18 |
| Sicelo | working | 09:19 |
| Sicelo | hmm,testing microsoft.com says "unable to get issuer certificate" .. so i guess that means not working? | 09:22 |
| KotCzarny | sicelo, i get that message also on stock n900 | 09:22 |
| KotCzarny | and also on my laptop i think | 09:22 |
| Sicelo | hmm, well 2nd N900 does not return such message. | 09:25 |
| Sicelo | freemangordon: so looks like openssl not happy with them either :/ | 09:26 |
| KotCzarny | it might be that my cert store on laptop is broken too | 09:26 |
| KotCzarny | is your 2nd n900 stock? | 09:26 |
| freemangordon | Sicelo: could you tell openssl to be verbose and pastebin the output? | 09:27 |
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| freemangordon | jonwil: hi! | 09:27 |
| jonwil | hi | 09:28 |
| freemangordon | jonwil: which gdb do you use for debugging microb? | 09:28 |
| freemangordon | jonwil: also, read the backscroll | 09:28 |
| freemangordon | Sicelo: also tell openssl to dump the certificate chain | 09:29 |
| Sicelo | got to go see man page. no idea about those things haha | 09:29 |
| jonwil | gdb -v sayhs " | 09:30 |
| freemangordon | hmm? | 09:30 |
| jonwil | gdb -v says "6.8.50.20090417-debian" | 09:30 |
| freemangordon | try 7.1 from extras-devel | 09:30 |
| freemangordon | I put it there on a reason :( | 09:30 |
| jonwil | ok | 09:30 |
| freemangordon | jonwil: also, see my comment on certman commit | 09:31 |
| jonwil | FYI, cmcli -T verifies the chain of trust properly | 09:33 |
| freemangordon | jonwil: and what about openssl? | 09:33 |
| jonwil | I mean cmcli -T common-ca -v www.blah.com:443 | 09:33 |
| jonwil | and yes openssl s_client does work | 09:33 |
| jonwil | so that means the certificates themselves are correct | 09:33 |
| freemangordon | hmm, "( 9,26,03) Sicelo: freemangordon: so looks like openssl not happy with them either :/" | 09:33 |
| freemangordon | though he might be using incorrect cmd | 09:34 |
| jonwil | yeah probably | 09:34 |
| freemangordon | jonwil: do you use openssl from cssu? | 09:34 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: what's the correct openssl cmd? | 09:35 |
| jonwil | If I run openssl s_client -CApath /etc/certs/common-ca -connect www.blah.com:443 it works for the sites that fail in microb | 09:35 |
| Sicelo | that's same command i ran. doesn't work for my 'bad' N900, but works on 2nd one | 09:36 |
| jonwil | what does it say when you run it on your failing N900? | 09:36 |
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| Sicelo | unable to get local issuer certificate | 09:36 |
| Sicelo | let me try with cmcli | 09:37 |
| jonwil | yeah try cmcli -T common-ca -v www.blah.com:443 | 09:37 |
| Sicelo | 35ce3296a4a08fe1aa8d09650a9b3acb2cc1da64 www.entrust.net Verification failed: unable to get local issuer certificate | 09:37 |
| jonwil | weird | 09:38 |
| jonwil | so you are doing cmcli -T common-ca -v www.entrust.net:443 and its giving that error? | 09:38 |
| Sicelo | yes | 09:38 |
| jonwil | Ok can you grab the entire contents of /etc/certs and /etc/secure on your N900 and get them to me? | 09:39 |
| jonwil | I can see if they match my device (where that command I just typed works) | 09:39 |
| jonwil | Or I can help you undo all your changes and go back to what you had before you fiddled with maemo-security-certman earlier | 09:40 |
| Sicelo | http://paste.debian.net/379881/ .. this is output of | 09:40 |
| jonwil | Then you have a 100% working N900 again | 09:40 |
| Sicelo | openssl s_client -connect www.entrust.net:443 -CApath /etc/certs/common-ca/ -showcerts > MyDocs/openssl.txt | 09:40 |
| Sicelo | i can help a bit more :) will let you know when i can't take it anymore, haha. just this is my daily device where certs refused to work. Murphy's law | 09:41 |
| jonwil | Ok so get me the contents of /etc/certs and /etc/secure and I will see how that differs from what it should be | 09:42 |
| jonwil | Once we get cmcli working correctly then at least we know that that bit is working again | 09:42 |
| jonwil | Wizzup: the certificates came from the Mozilla certdata.txt file (the mozilla root CA store) and were updated following instructions and other bits given to me by Juhani Mäkelä (original Nokia author of maemo-security-certman package) | 09:43 |
| Sicelo | tar'red them up. where can i upload? | 09:44 |
| jonwil | You could post in http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=96433 and attach to the post? | 09:45 |
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| jonwil | That would work | 09:45 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: in case you, or i, disappear for some reason ... please document the 'recovery' method for whenever i may need it | 09:45 |
| jonwil | Its not something that can be easily documented since at various points in the process it would require you to do certain things then me to make decisions on what to do next based on certain information you give me :) | 09:46 |
| Wizzup | jonwil: ah, ok | 09:46 |
| jonwil | dont worry I wont be leaving IRC for houors (even if I go afk for a bit to e.g. have food) | 09:47 |
| jonwil | hours | 09:47 |
| Wizzup | jonwil: I was just wondering because it seems many linux distros take the certs from that package (including gentoo) | 09:47 |
| Wizzup | but they may just take it from mozilla as well | 09:47 |
| jonwil | Yep they do | 09:49 |
| jonwil | Lots of places get it from Mozilla because they trust the vetting process Mozilla uses | 09:50 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: posted to tmo | 09:50 |
| jonwil | Not sure where Chrome gets its root certificates from | 09:50 |
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| jonwil | ok so do you want me to help you get your system back to a functional state or do you want me to help you get the certificates to the same "working with cmcli etc but failing with microb" state I am in? | 09:55 |
| Wizzup | jonwil: one question, are all, or only some certificates failing with microb | 09:56 |
| jonwil | only some | 09:56 |
| Wizzup | And might that be related to perhaps using stronger crypto/hashes that are not supported by nss at that time | 09:56 |
| Wizzup | like some old browser having trouble with sha2 | 09:56 |
| jonwil | Yes thats why I am looking into updating NSPR and NSS | 09:57 |
| Wizzup | that is, perhaps it will only be fixed by upgrading nss | 09:57 |
| Wizzup | Okay | 09:57 |
| Wizzup | Just wanted to point that possibility out :) | 09:57 |
| jonwil | Just need to deal with some microb-local patches to NSPR somehow | 09:57 |
| Wizzup | I see | 09:57 |
| jonwil | Sicello: Which option do you want? | 09:57 |
| kerio | Wizzup: no way, microb supports sha-256 signatures | 09:58 |
| Wizzup | kerio: okay, well, I'm guessing something out there may be missing | 09:58 |
| jonwil | Back to fully working or up to "works with cmcli but not with microb"? | 09:58 |
| jonwil | Updating NSS cant hurt anyway | 09:58 |
| Wizzup | I guess my sha2 example was a bad one :) | 09:58 |
| Wizzup | jonwil: indeed! | 09:58 |
| jonwil | and we need to do it if we want TLS1.2 etc | 09:58 |
| kerio | is there a more specific error message? | 09:58 |
| kerio | jonwil: +1 | 09:58 |
| Wizzup | jonwil: +1 | 09:58 |
| Wizzup | :) | 09:59 |
| kerio | and yes, we DEFINETELY want tls 1.2 | 09:59 |
| kerio | "This seems like a good moment to reiterate that everything less than TLS 1.2 with an AEAD cipher suite is cryptographically broken." -- agl | 09:59 |
| jonwil | In terms of what we enable and disable there, we should trust Mozilla on that one | 09:59 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: out of which options? :) | 10:00 |
| jonwil | well we know Mozilla turns off SSL3 | 10:00 |
| jonwil | and doesn't support it anymore | 10:00 |
| jonwil | so we should do the same when we update NSS | 10:00 |
| jonwil | But for example we should trust Mozilla when it comes to which versions of TLS to turn on and which to turn off | 10:00 |
| kerio | yeah just go with what firefox does | 10:01 |
| jonwil | I suspect trusting Firefox on issues related to SSL/TLS/HTTPS/CAs/etc is probably a fairly safe and sane thing to do | 10:01 |
| kerio | i mean, there's something to be said about disabling aes-256 ciphersuites | 10:01 |
| jonwil | Especially if we are using all their codebase for this stuff :) | 10:02 |
| kerio | because we're kinda lacking in... everything | 10:02 |
| Sicelo | okay. hmm, can't make up my mind. part of me wants to go on with the testing, but this is my daily device, so maybe let's just get it back to working state | 10:02 |
| jonwil | Ok so you are running what version of CSSU on this device? | 10:02 |
| jonwil | ? | 10:03 |
| Sicelo | cssu thumb | 10:04 |
| jonwil | latest version of cssu-thumb? | 10:09 |
| jonwil | what version of mp-fremantle-community-pr does the system say you have? | 10:09 |
| jonwil | ? | 10:12 |
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| jonwil | Looks like Sicelo went AFK :P | 10:18 |
| Sicelo | sorry | 10:22 |
| Sicelo | at work | 10:22 |
| jonwil | oh ok | 10:22 |
| jonwil | but yeah what version of mp-fremantle-community-pr do you have? | 10:22 |
| Sicelo | *** 21.2011.38-1Tmaemo11+thumb0 | 10:23 |
| jonwil | Ok so that's the most recent | 10:24 |
| jonwil | What you want to do is to open a root terminal | 10:24 |
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| Sicelo | sure | 10:24 |
| jonwil | You want to do dpkg -r mp-fremantle-community-pr | 10:25 |
| jonwil | then dpkg -P libmaemosec-certman0 | 10:25 |
| jonwil | then dpkg -P libmaemosec0 | 10:25 |
| jonwil | then dpkg -P maemosec-certman-common-ca | 10:25 |
| jonwil | then dpkg -P maemosec-certman-tools | 10:25 |
| jonwil | Then tell me what, if anything, is left in /etc/certs or /etc/secure | 10:25 |
| jonwil | You will be reinstalling all those packages including mp-fremantle-community-pr in a sec, don't worry | 10:26 |
| Sicelo | dependency problems with that .. wants to remove almost everything, due to mp-fremantle* | 10:26 |
| jonwil | hmmm ok | 10:27 |
| Sicelo | dpkg: error processing libmaemosec-certman0 (--purge): dependency problems - not removing | 10:27 |
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| jonwil | ok | 10:27 |
| ceene | you can always do find /etc/certs -exec dpkg -S {} \; | 10:27 |
| ceene | and then compare it with the output of find /etc/certs | 10:27 |
| jonwil | Ok so remove /etc/certs completly | 10:27 |
| jonwil | and also /etc/secure | 10:27 |
| jonwil | Then download the .deb files in this paste | 10:28 |
| jonwil | http://pastebin.com/CSzTrD61 | 10:28 |
| jonwil | and install them with dpkg -i in the order listed | 10:28 |
| jonwil | it may complain about certain packages being a downgrade but it should install them anyway | 10:28 |
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| Sicelo | ok. doing it now | 10:32 |
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| kerio | hold on why are those in community-thumb | 10:36 |
| kerio | instead of community-devel | 10:36 |
| kerio | :| | 10:36 |
| bencoh | I think he wants to rollback to a working state | 10:38 |
| bencoh | (on a thumb device) | 10:38 |
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| jonwil | They are in community-thumb because there is no thumb specific version of those | 10:39 |
| kerio | oooh i see | 10:39 |
| jonwil | and yes he wants to back to what he had before he started | 10:39 |
| jonwil | hence the need to go back to those packages | 10:39 |
| ceene | talking about certs, i think yappari registration is failing due to non compatible ciphering between WA servers and n900 supported protocols | 10:39 |
| Sicelo | why 0.2.2 though? why not 0.2.3 | 10:39 |
| kerio | ceene: compile it with a static, more-recent openssl? | 10:40 |
| jonwil | 0.2.2 is what cssu-thumb shipped | 10:41 |
| jonwil | and what mp-fremantle-community-pr for thumb points to | 10:41 |
| jonwil | why 0.3.2 isn't in cssu-thumb you will have to ask the maintainer of that | 10:41 |
| jonwil | I mean 0.2.3 | 10:42 |
| ceene | kerio: i'm on it... i've already created an openssl deb package for n900, backported from debian | 10:43 |
| ceene | qt is smart enough to use latest installed openssl | 10:43 |
| kerio | hm, that would mess up with things tho | 10:43 |
| ceene | it won't | 10:43 |
| ceene | i've got both openssl packages installed on my n900 right now | 10:43 |
| Sicelo | ok | 10:43 |
| kerio | have you removed the symlink between libssl.so and libssl.so.yourversion | 10:43 |
| ceene | without any problem in a couple months or so | 10:43 |
| ceene | the thing is, most apps will search for the exact version of the library they were compiled against | 10:44 |
| ceene | but QT searches for all libssl.so* versions and dlopen()s it | 10:44 |
| bencoh | kerio: qt dlopens | 10:44 |
| kerio | D: | 10:45 |
| kerio | that sounds like a horrible way to do things | 10:45 |
| bencoh | qt inside. | 10:45 |
| kerio | lol | 10:46 |
| ceene | horrible or not, it's just what we need :) | 10:47 |
| ceene | i've still got to do a couple things | 10:47 |
| ceene | to disable ssl3 | 10:47 |
| ceene | so i may have to patch qt itself | 10:47 |
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| jonwil | Sicelo: Does your system work again now? | 10:51 |
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| kerio | ceene: how does qt know how to use all the versions of openssl, though? | 10:54 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: mp-fremantle-community-pr depends on maemosec-certman-tools (>= 0.2.3); however: Version of maemosec-certman-tools on system is 0.2.2. | 10:56 |
| ceene | kerio: by finding /lib/libssl* and parsing the filename | 10:57 |
| ceene | i mean | 10:57 |
| ceene | you have to add support to the functions it will use | 10:57 |
| ceene | if there's some api change, then it has to implement it | 10:57 |
| Sicelo | crazy stuff going on here, lol. you found that we should be having 0.2.2? | 10:57 |
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| jonwil | ok, try http://repository.maemo.org/community-testing/pool/fremantle/free/m/maemo-security-certman/libmaemosec-certman0_0.2.3_armel.deb http://repository.maemo.org/community-testing/pool/fremantle/free/m/maemo-security-certman/libmaemosec0_0.2.3_armel.deb http://repository.maemo.org/community-testing/pool/fremantle/free/m/maemo-security-certman/maemosec-certman-common-ca_0.2.3_all.deb... | 10:58 |
| jonwil | ...http://repository.maemo.org/community-testing/pool/fremantle/free/m/maemo-security-certman/maemosec-certman-tools_0.2.3_armel.deb | 10:58 |
| jonwil | That should work | 10:59 |
| Sicelo | can i just use apt-get install :) specifying version? | 10:59 |
| jonwil | no since you already have a more recent version | 10:59 |
| jonwil | I dont know if apt-get can downgrade a package | 10:59 |
| jonwil | if it can, feel free to try it | 10:59 |
| Sicelo | it can | 11:00 |
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| Sicelo | few certs in /etc/certs/common-ca/ | 11:05 |
| Sicelo | less than 10 | 11:05 |
| Sicelo | nothing in /etc/certs/trusted | 11:05 |
| ceene | can you find /etc/certs/common-ca/ -exec dpkg -S {} \; ? | 11:08 |
| ceene | I'm curious as to what is kept ther | 11:08 |
| ceene | *there | 11:08 |
| jonwil | They only come from maemosec-certman-common-ca | 11:18 |
| jonwil | what do you see if you dpkg -L maemosec-certman-common-ca? | 11:19 |
| jonwil | Also you may want to try manually downloading the deb files and installing them with dpkg, that will probably restore the missing files | 11:19 |
| Sicelo | i did | 11:20 |
| jonwil | apt-get may not install the files when downgrading for some reason | 11:20 |
| Sicelo | dpkg -L lists all of the certs, but they are definitely not there | 11:20 |
| Sicelo | now that's crazy | 11:20 |
| jonwil | Very weird | 11:20 |
| jonwil | I am out of ideas | 11:21 |
| Sicelo | even the install process doesn't show the rest being installed | 11:21 |
| Sicelo | re-doing it make no difference | 11:21 |
| Sicelo | lemme reboot | 11:22 |
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| jonwil | freemangordon: ping | 11:29 |
| Sicelo | dpkg -L is likely just spitting out contents of /var/lib/dpkg/info/maemosec-certman-common-ca.list even though the files themselves aren't there. let me extract the deb | 11:38 |
| jonwil | ok | 11:40 |
| Sicelo | so i dpkg -x the package, and manually ran its postinst. cmcli is happy now. | 11:43 |
| Sicelo | let me check microb | 11:43 |
| Sicelo | seems okay. loading entrust website successfully. | 11:47 |
| Sicelo | yhansuthanks for the help :) | 11:48 |
| Sicelo | bad typing :( | 11:48 |
| Sicelo | i'll play with your 0.2.4 stuff in the evening :) | 11:48 |
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| jonwil | ok, great :) | 11:53 |
| jonwil | Might help if I download the armel version of gdb 7.3.1 and not the i386 version :) | 11:54 |
| jonwil | Lets try that agaon | 11:54 |
| jonwil | again | 11:54 |
| Sicelo | this is going to be 'fun' one to debug i guess, as there is no consistency of behaviour | 11:54 |
| jonwil | Not really, once I actually get GDB working I should be able to see whats up | 11:55 |
| jonwil | right now if I visit www.entrust.com I get a SEC_ERROR_UNKNOWN_ISSUER error from microb | 11:56 |
| jonwil | so I intend to break on the function that spits out the error (PORT_SetError in nss) and from there work backwards | 11:57 |
| jonwil | and eventually I will be at some function I can single step or trace and see just what is going on | 11:57 |
| Sicelo | :) | 11:58 |
| jonwil | hmmm. newer version of GDB doesn't help | 11:59 |
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| Sicelo | installed 0.2.4 again .. now i'm at least in same situation as you. no worse | 12:15 |
| Sicelo | openssl and cmcli both happy | 12:16 |
| kerio | jonwil: does https://nethack.dank.ninja/ work | 12:22 |
| Sicelo | yes | 12:23 |
| jonwil | That works for me | 12:23 |
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| jonwil | hmmm, I wonder if there is some sort of way to run microb-engine but not browserd | 12:26 |
| jonwil | Let me see what these other packages I get when building microb-engin edo | 12:27 |
| bencoh | ? | 12:28 |
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| jonwil | microb-engine builds a bunch of packages that aren't installed in the phone | 12:28 |
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| bencoh | how would you run microb-engine without browserd? | 12:29 |
| jonwil | I dont mean using the browser UI | 12:30 |
| jonwil | browserd links to several libraries | 12:30 |
| jonwil | which contain the actual rendering engine and stuff | 12:30 |
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| jonwil | There are things built from the microb-engine source package that might provide a way to load that actual gecko code and pull web pages and stuff without going through browserd, browser-neteal or the normal browser UI | 12:31 |
| Maxdamantus | There's microb-xulrunner already in the repository fwiw | 12:33 |
| Maxdamantus | It's able to run things like an old version of Conkeror. | 12:33 |
| Maxdamantus | or maybe a newer one having manually added some promises library, iirc | 12:34 |
| jonwil | Yeah thats what I mean, getting microb-xulrunner and things from my microb-engine tree | 12:35 |
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| Maxdamantus | http://maxdamantus.eu.org/c900.png | 12:41 |
| Maxdamantus | It's reasonably usable tbh | 12:42 |
| Maxdamantus | The issue I had with Conkeror on my desktop is that the UI is convenient enough to have hundreds of tabs open. | 12:42 |
| Maxdamantus | which was kind of okay while I only had 3 GiB of RAM, since once it got to 120 or so tabs I'd just close a bunch of them to avoid unnecessary swapping. | 12:43 |
| Maxdamantus | now with 32 GiB of RAM it bottlenecks on the CPU at around 500 tabs, and cbf cleaning up 500 tabs. | 12:44 |
| Maxdamantus | Don't really want to have that issue on my phone. | 12:44 |
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| KotCzarny | o.o | 12:58 |
| KotCzarny | i usually have ~10-20 tabs at most | 12:58 |
| KotCzarny | if i want to read the site but dont want the tab i just bookmark it into 'to read' folder | 12:59 |
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| jonwil | ok, the plot thickens... | 13:00 |
| Wizzup | hm? | 13:01 |
| KotCzarny | nobody expected spanish inquisition | 13:03 |
| jonwil | If I access https://www.entrust.net/ in microb, it gives an error. If I access the same domain via microb-refui (built alongside the microb-engine bits I am using) the URL loads just fine | 13:05 |
| jonwil | by "in microb", I mean in the standard Maemo web UI | 13:05 |
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| zGrr | moin | 13:09 |
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| Sicelo | still doesn't answer why microb in other devices doesn't mind the new certs :/ | 13:38 |
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| jonwil | HOLY CRAP I found the problem | 13:56 |
| bencoh | ? | 13:57 |
| jonwil | making a forum post now | 13:57 |
| bencoh | suspens... | 13:57 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 13:58 |
| kerio | woop | 14:00 |
| jonwil | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=96433&page=2 | 14:01 |
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| kerio | jonwil: i strongly doubt anyone actually uses personal certificates in microb | 14:02 |
| kerio | so you can probably just delete it | 14:02 |
| bencoh | ? | 14:03 |
| bencoh | some people add exceptions, I guess (?) | 14:04 |
| kerio | how did they end up being stale, though? | 14:04 |
| jonwil | No idea | 14:06 |
| kerio | hold on gimme the debs | 14:06 |
| jonwil | I suspect they are intermediate certificates chaining off a specific root that is not in the new root CA store | 14:06 |
| kerio | makes sense | 14:07 |
| jonwil | but when the intermediates aren't in cert8.db, microb uses some newer intermediates chaining off a newer root that is in the new root CA store | 14:07 |
| jonwil | as for the debs of the new root CA stuff, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=96430 has what you need | 14:07 |
| kerio | yeah but gimme some links i can wget | 14:08 |
| jonwil | I dont have the files uploaded anywhere you can wget | 14:09 |
| jonwil | unless you can wget forum attachements | 14:09 |
| Sicelo | i do use personal cert in microb | 14:09 |
| KotCzarny | i think you can | 14:09 |
| kerio | ;-; | 14:10 |
| jonwil | At least I have the cause now | 14:10 |
| jonwil | Although that doesn't mean I wont keep trying to update NSS, we do want TLS1.2 support after all :) | 14:11 |
| Sicelo | \m/ | 14:11 |
| Sicelo | jonwil: quick fix available? | 14:12 |
| jonwil | quick fix for what? | 14:12 |
| jonwil | the cert8.db problem? | 14:12 |
| jonwil | no, I dont have a fix yet | 14:12 |
| Sicelo | okay | 14:12 |
| jonwil | other than deleting the file and risking problems | 14:12 |
| jonwil | We need to find a proper way to clean out the crap without deleting anything important | 14:13 |
| Sicelo | agreed | 14:13 |
| kerio | how do i verify that jonwil's package isn't backdoored | 14:14 |
| jonwil | You cant really, but you have to trust the people who wrote CSSU for example didn't backdoor things | 14:15 |
| jonwil | or for that matter that original Nokia packages dont have backdoors | 14:16 |
| jonwil | Not that I would intentionally backdoor something | 14:16 |
| jonwil | I think backdoors are bad | 14:16 |
| kerio | suuuuuuure ;) | 14:16 |
| bencoh | kerio: does his package contain machine code? | 14:16 |
| bencoh | isn't it just certificates? | 14:16 |
| kerio | yes, it's "just" certificates | 14:16 |
| bencoh | """just""" ;] | 14:16 |
| kerio | what if now my n900 is trusting "jonwil's super legit root CA" | 14:17 |
| Sicelo | i use personal certto access Outlook Web Access for work emails. can't use exchange activesync due to provisioning, and no imap/pop enabled | 14:17 |
| kerio | oh god i have to update like 8 billion things | 14:17 |
| bencoh | it isn't worse than, say, states CA :) | 14:17 |
| kerio | Sicelo: you should most definetely not delete cert8.db | 14:17 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 14:18 |
| KotCzarny | why not? | 14:18 |
| kerio | because it's likely that he has a client certificate stored there | 14:19 |
| kerio | do we have certutil? | 14:19 |
| kerio | yep, cert8.db has the certificates, key3.db has the keys | 14:20 |
| jonwil | The set of root certificates in my updated maemo-security-certman is an unchanged set from mozilla certdata.txt as of http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/64df3815df9c | 14:20 |
| kerio | did you do a conversion to it, or do the package scripts do that? | 14:21 |
| jonwil | Or rather its that set of certificates minus whichever ones cmcli decided not to import (would need to dig deep into openssl source code to find out exactly the criteria for rejecting a certificate for import) | 14:21 |
| kerio | :| | 14:21 |
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| jonwil | This commit https://github.com/community-ssu/maemo-security-certman/commit/9076865275fb4e78578276afdff45f6f47389872 contains a backport of a fix from Harmattan | 14:21 |
| jonwil | plus a new set of root CA certificates | 14:21 |
| jonwil | plus the tool and instructions for importing mozilla certdata.txt file | 14:22 |
| Sicelo | kerio: i still have the original pfx files ;) | 14:23 |
| jonwil | You can thank Juhani Mäkelä (original author of maemo-security-certman) for their help in getting all this working | 14:23 |
| jonwil | They provided the parse-certdata-txt.c file and some very useful info on how to get things going (including the right cmcli commands to run and the right stuff to backport from Harmattan) | 14:24 |
| jonwil | I dont know enough about finnish names to tell if that is a man or a woman :P | 14:25 |
| kerio | entrust.com worksforme | 14:27 |
| kerio | or rather | 14:27 |
| kerio | i think it works for me | 14:27 |
| kerio | the page is very slow to load | 14:27 |
| jonwil | you must not have whatever bogus certificates are in my cert8.db file then | 14:27 |
| jonwil | does ib.boq.mobi work for you? | 14:27 |
| kerio | do we have a package with the nss certutil in | 14:27 |
| jonwil | I haven't figured out how to build the nss command line tools although I would really like to do that | 14:28 |
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| jonwil | anyhow, my phone is running out of juice after all this testing, better go plug it in to charge up :) | 14:30 |
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| kerio | jonwil: libnss3-tools in debina? | 14:33 |
| kerio | debian | 14:33 |
| kerio | certutil: function failed: SEC_ERROR_LEGACY_DATABASE: The certificate/key database is in an old, unsupported format. | 14:33 |
| jonwil | We need to build the tools from the same nss source tree we have in microb-engine | 14:34 |
| kerio | this makes things a bit harder | 14:34 |
| jonwil | I am sure there is a way to modify the microb-engine build tree to build libnss3-tools or something similar | 14:34 |
| jonwil | Do that and we are golden | 14:34 |
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| * Maxdamantus wonders why he wasn't able to copy his bootloader from one N900 to another by just reading/writing from/to /dev/mtd3 | 14:47 | |
| KotCzarny | maybe it was something else broken too | 14:50 |
| Maxdamantus | What sort of thing? | 14:51 |
| KotCzarny | fs corruption? kernel corrupted? config partition corrupted? | 14:51 |
| Maxdamantus | Everything worked the first time once it was able to load by u-boot build. | 14:51 |
| KotCzarny | dont know what were you doing | 14:51 |
| Maxdamantus | Copying my existing setup to another N900 I acquired. | 14:52 |
| KotCzarny | hmm, different revisions? | 14:52 |
| Maxdamantus | I just zeroed out the eMMC and emptied ubifs, repartition the eMMC and copied a backup of the main filesystem in. | 14:52 |
| Maxdamantus | and copied my boot directory and ubifs as it currently was on my existing one. | 14:53 |
| Maxdamantus | Who needs flasher? | 14:53 |
| KotCzarny | why do we care about ubifs anyway? | 14:54 |
| KotCzarny | it eats cycles and memory | 14:54 |
| KotCzarny | i remember using overlay fs long time ago on ancient 586 200mhz box, and it was noticably slower in disk operations | 14:54 |
| Maxdamantus | I'm still using kernel-power, which doesn't have built-in support for omap-hsmmc or ext4. | 14:54 |
| Maxdamantus | Don't really want to bother with an initramfs. | 14:55 |
| Maxdamantus | ubifs is basically my initramfs. | 14:55 |
| KotCzarny | who needs initramfs | 14:55 |
| Hurrian | nah, don't dd from one device to another - it doesn't handle the bad blocks quite right | 14:55 |
| Maxdamantus | Hm. That'd probably explain it. | 14:55 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 14:56 |
| Hurrian | you should prolly use "flasher --local" | 14:56 |
| Hurrian | :3 | 14:56 |
| * Maxdamantus also noticed a bunch of messages about ECC when doing `rm -rf *` in the ubifs. | 14:56 | |
| * Maxdamantus should probably have just recreated the filesystem, though he's not really familiar with ubifs/mtd. | 14:57 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ((<ceene> but QT searches for all libssl.so* versions and dlopen()s it)) now that explains some nasty effects. e.g. why Silego GreenPack3 software mostly works on my OpenSuse system but simply blows chunks on "Save as..." | 14:58 |
| Hurrian | now, off to go and find myself another N900. | 14:59 |
| * Maxdamantus is meant to be getting a third one soon too. | 14:59 | |
| Maxdamantus | then I'll have five N9* devices. | 14:59 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 14:59 |
| KotCzarny | i have 3.5 | 14:59 |
| jonwil | I have just the one although I wish I had a second one for if/when this one stops working | 15:00 |
| Hurrian | mine croaked aaaaaaageeees ago, but it was way, way more useful than pretty much any other mobile device I have now | 15:00 |
| jonwil | but right now I dont have the funds for anything even vaguely related to tech stuff | 15:00 |
| Hurrian | if only I could find one on eBay that wasn't a refurb for $200... | 15:00 |
| Maxdamantus | I haven't confirmed that the $2 N97 works yet though .. I think the guy mailed the battery in a separate package. | 15:00 |
| Maxdamantus | and it seems like it's in fairly bad condition. | 15:01 |
| Maxdamantus | came with a 16 GB microSD card though. | 15:01 |
| * Maxdamantus sleeps. | 15:02 | |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juhani | 15:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | male | 15:17 |
| jonwil | ok | 15:18 |
| Sicelo | didn't someone offer you N900 jonwil? :) | 15:20 |
| jonwil | possibly | 15:20 |
| jonwil | but I never followed it up | 15:20 |
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| Sicelo | around the time you had bad USB port | 15:23 |
| jonwil | yeah that | 15:24 |
| jonwil | My phone works at the moment so I have no urgency to worry about replacing it or dealing with it | 15:24 |
| KotCzarny | if one would setup usb-fixing shop, there would be a lot of good n900s | 15:25 |
| kerio | KotCzarny: why shouldn't we care about ubifs? | 15:26 |
| kerio | the mtd is the fastest storage unit in the n900 | 15:26 |
| KotCzarny | kerio, use nand only for booting part and move everything else to emmc/sd | 15:27 |
| kerio | which makes things waaaaaay slower | 15:27 |
| KotCzarny | does it? | 15:28 |
| KotCzarny | the slowest part is swapping | 15:29 |
| KotCzarny | not fs | 15:29 |
| KotCzarny | also, i run bpi/opi from sd card, and its fast enough (stride/stripe helps) | 15:31 |
| * jonwil wishes it wasn't so hard to find people who actually understand the inner workings of the Gecko rendering engine... :( | 15:32 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: indeed I always wondered how much sense it would make to have a - say - 200MB swap on mtd and move the whole rootfs (modulo a stub pivotroot aka "initrd" of sorts) to mmc | 15:34 |
| kerio | it would probably make a lot of sense for the purpose of convenience | 15:34 |
| kerio | but it *is* a performance hit | 15:34 |
| KotCzarny | kerio, did you measure it? | 15:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nah, fast swap (particularly on write) way better for system performance on a system starving on RAM than a faster rootfs | 15:35 |
| kerio | not personally but i don't remember who did | 15:35 |
| kerio | someone did, tho | 15:35 |
| KotCzarny | 10%? 50%? | 15:36 |
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| * DocScrutinizer05 suspects a nasty global-action TBIC button on jonwil's devices | 15:38 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | how else comes he never says bye | 15:38 |
| KotCzarny | ~greetings | 15:39 |
| infobot | greetomgs! | 15:39 |
| KotCzarny | ~hello | 15:39 |
| infobot | Howdy Bub | 15:39 |
| KotCzarny | ~internet time | 15:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | for some of you geeks this is possibly a nice read: http://www.dwheeler.com/essays/fixing-unix-linux-filenames.html | 15:44 |
| bencoh | ~ugt | 15:44 |
| infobot | methinks ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and the links like http://www.dwheeler.com/essays/filenames-in-shell.html | 15:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | this guy actually knows what he's talking about | 15:46 |
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| Avasz | hi, I was happily browsing site in the afternoon (talk.maemo.org) and reviving my old n900. I haven't posted or done anything at all, just browsing the forum. And, now it says my ip is blocked. Can anyone help please? | 16:58 |
| Avasz | also, would like to know the reason why it was blocked. | 16:58 |
| KotCzarny | as for reviving: | 16:59 |
| KotCzarny | ~flashing | 16:59 |
| Avasz | no. | 16:59 |
| infobot | well, maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware, or - on linux PC - download&extract http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh | 16:59 |
| Avasz | I mean, I need to unblock my ip, such that I can visit the forums. :) | 16:59 |
| Avasz | reviving = using it as server :D | 17:00 |
| KotCzarny | ~unbanip | 17:00 |
| infobot | unbanip is probably please contact techstaff <at> maemo <dot> org with your request, or see ~techstaff | 17:00 |
| Avasz | sure, thanks. | 17:01 |
| Avasz | it said to contact staff in #maemo too, don't know who is the staff here though. | 17:01 |
| KotCzarny | and most likely your ip is in some spam db | 17:01 |
| Avasz | Sorry, it seems that you are using an IP address or a proxy that is listed in the forum anti spam blacklist. | 17:02 |
| Avasz | Feel free to contact our staff on irc freenode #maemo channel. | 17:02 |
| KotCzarny | change <at> into @ and <dot> into . | 17:02 |
| Avasz | sure, understood that. | 17:02 |
| Avasz | was browsing around 30 mins earlier, and next time trying to check a post about python 2.75 and it gets blocked. :( | 17:03 |
| KotCzarny | and if you are on dynamic ip try reconnecting modem | 17:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Avasz: please ping chem|st, your IP is on some anti-sorum-spam blacklist | 17:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | forum even | 17:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | chem|st: staff (for all that matters to talk.maemo.org | 17:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's a pretty weird concept to have forum block users from *reading* stuff, but it seems nobody is willing to implement a better approach to only block login | 17:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Avasz: anyway not your fault | 17:51 |
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| chem|st | !ipunblock | 17:57 |
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| bencoh | ? | 17:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~ | 17:59 |
| chem|st | DocScrutinizer05: it is not only login, we got ddos'ed, and registration spammed, you cannot prevent a crowd attack from asia as those are real people | 17:59 |
| chem|st | ~ipunblock | 17:59 |
| chem|st | ~+bosnack | 17:59 |
| chem|st | ~botnack | 17:59 |
| chem|st | nvm | 17:59 |
| chem|st | I did not set it and do not remember | 17:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~unbanip | 17:59 |
| infobot | methinks unbanip is please contact techstaff <at> maemo <dot> org with your request, or see ~techstaff | 17:59 |
| bencoh | ~techstaff | 18:00 |
| infobot | it has been said that techstaff is techstaff(AT)maemo.org - the folks that keep your maemo infra running. Devotion to Duty http://xkcd.com/705/ | 18:00 |
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| chem|st | and that is what the block page should read too | 18:01 |
| chem|st | xes: maybe you can setup a nicer notification to the blocking, incl mentioning that most bigger TOR nodes are blocked for obvious reasons | 18:02 |
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| capitanocrunch | hi | 18:03 |
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| chem|st | capitanocrunch: hi | 18:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | on unrelated OT sidenote: deadbeef is an awesome music player | 18:03 |
| capitanocrunch | i noticed issue for navit packages in maemo repos when apt-upgrade | 18:04 |
| capitanocrunch | iled to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/n/navit/navit_0.5.0+dfsg.1-1maemo1-6563_armel.deb Size mismatch | 18:04 |
| capitanocrunch | Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/n/navit/navit-data_0.5.0+dfsg.1-1maemo1-6563_all.deb Size mismatch | 18:04 |
| bencoh | size mismatch? | 18:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's what they saud | 18:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | said* | 18:05 |
| bencoh | do you need to update your catalogue? | 18:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | apt upgrade is *strongly* deprecated | 18:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | PARTICULARLY from maemo-devel | 18:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | almost sure bet to bork your system | 18:06 |
| capitanocrunch | im using apt-get update and then apt-get upgrade | 18:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see ^^^^ | 18:06 |
| capitanocrunch | why deprecated? | 18:07 |
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| capitanocrunch | so we have to use fapman? | 18:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | top ten things to know about maemo: #1 maemo is almost a plain debian #2 maemo is NOT a plain debain #3 NEVER do apt-get upgarde or apt-get dist-upgrade when you got any but the basic repos enabled #4 never do apt-get upgrade at all #5... $yourcall | 18:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~fapman | 18:09 |
| infobot | hmm... fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU), or actually for anything since ~speedyHAM. It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default. In short, it's been identified as source of system corruption and thus deprecated, or see ~hamvsfam | 18:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~speedyham | 18:10 |
| infobot | hmm... speedyham is 30 times faster than HAM http://maemo.merlin1991.at/cssu/community-devel/pool/free/h/hildon-application-manager/hildon-application-manager_2.2.73-2_armel.deb | 18:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | infobot: speedyham is also SpeedyHAM is included in CSSU now | 18:10 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer05: okay | 18:10 |
| bencoh | nope, not in -stable | 18:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ok | 18:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~literal speedyham | 18:11 |
| infobot | "speedyham" is "30 times faster than HAM http://maemo.merlin1991.at/cssu/community-devel/pool/free/h/hildon-application-manager/hildon-application-manager_2.2.73-2_armel.deb. SpeedyHAM is included in CSSU now" | 18:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | infobot: no, speedyham is <reply>SpeedyHAM is 30 times faster than HAM http://maemo.merlin1991.at/cssu/community-devel/pool/free/h/hildon-application-manager/hildon-application-manager_2.2.73-2_armel.deb. SpeedyHAM is included in CSSU-testing now | 18:12 |
| infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 | 18:12 |
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| capitanocrunch | never knew of speedyham | 18:17 |
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| capitanocrunch | since im on cssu-stable, should i dpkg install the deb and give it a try? | 18:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure, go ahead | 18:19 |
| freemangordon | I guess you can't, it has dependency to a newer glib | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dang | 18:20 |
| bencoh | iirc I had to rebuild | 18:20 |
| freemangordon | :nod: | 18:20 |
| bencoh | I might have it around | 18:20 |
| freemangordon | maybe bencoh could hand you the .deb | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but wait, you say testing has new glib, stable doesn't? | 18:20 |
| freemangordon | :nod: | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | capitanocrunch: move to testing ;-) | 18:21 |
| bencoh | new revision | 18:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's the new stable :-P | 18:21 |
| freemangordon | or pester merlin1991 to issue a new -stable | 18:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | "testing is the new stable" being a common meme in all $FOSS | 18:21 |
| freemangordon | it is about time already | 18:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed | 18:22 |
| bencoh | indeed :) | 18:22 |
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| bencoh | hmm, I wonder where it comes from, I cant find it on my server or my sb | 18:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lol | 18:22 |
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| bencoh | maybe it didn't depend on newer glib in the end | 18:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, I'd strongly hope new glib wouldn't breal $all-old-packages | 18:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | break even | 18:24 |
| bencoh | dpkg-deb -I shows "libglib2.0-0 >= 2.20.0" | 18:24 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: it is in -testing for umm... 2 years? | 18:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wouldn't make much sense to give a new lib to cssu-testing that renders all closed stuff borked and needs recomile for all open stuff | 18:24 |
| capitanocrunch | btw the top 10 things to know about maemo seem to be five not ten :0 and what $yourcall stands for? | 18:25 |
| bencoh | capitanocrunch: I suggest you give the .deb link a try | 18:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's a vebose elipsis | 18:25 |
| bencoh | you know how to use dpkg/apt-get in case of trouble anyway ;p | 18:25 |
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| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: https://github.com/community-ssu/glib/commit/c197df81ced094816f116ccd8d63d5fc507bf1ac | 18:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | just rename the ham binary and copy the new one into place | 18:26 |
| bencoh | yuk | 18:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hrhr | 18:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | quick&dirty, easy to revert | 18:27 |
| freemangordon | iirc it is not that easy | 18:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, maybe not THAT easy, HAM might be under maemo-launcher | 18:27 |
| freemangordon | there are more binaries | 18:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | plus a few other unexpected little fancies | 18:28 |
| freemangordon | like apt-worker | 18:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 18:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the correct method would prolly be to temporarily add cssu-testing repo and then do an apt-get install | 18:29 |
| bencoh | you'd need to do some apt-pinning for that to work | 18:30 |
| bencoh | otherwise, you're doomed | 18:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or move to cssu-testing right away. it's really stable enough, as long as you can live with stock camera and a few other getting replaced by FOSS versions without real need for such update | 18:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bencoh: hiuh? why? isn't that supposed to only install 'new' version of HAM? | 18:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | NB I didn't suggest apt-get upgrade but apt-get install $HAM | 18:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | of course it *might* pull in dependencies you don't want, but then... what are your options, other than moving to cssu-t anyway | 18:32 |
| freemangordon | I wouldn;t recommend that, it will pull newer glib and there are some packages which are known to be broken (fixed in -testing) | 18:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so MEH, upgrade to testing, by simply installing cssu-testing over the cssu-stable version on your device | 18:33 |
| bencoh | :] | 18:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | the instructions on ~cssu apply | 18:34 |
| capitanocrunch | ok, im going for testing | 18:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~cssu | 18:35 |
| infobot | i guess cssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU, or (Community Seamless Software Update) | 18:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | one click and you're basically done ;-) | 18:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~hamvsfam | 18:36 |
| infobot | somebody said hamvsfam was https://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2013-10-28.log.html#t2013-10-28T10:44:33, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=93227 | 18:36 |
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| Maxdamantus | 02:44:25 < DocScrutinizer05> for some of you geeks this is possibly a nice read: http://www.dwheeler.com/essays/fixing-unix-linux-filenames.html | 21:07 |
| Maxdamantus | You should be able to easily pass around arbitrary strings from shells to programs without it interpreting them in special ways. | 21:08 |
| Maxdamantus | anyway, gtg | 21:08 |
| * Maxdamantus has been thinking of writing a more sensible shell recently. | 21:08 | |
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| ecc3g | <sarcasm>I want to name my files with carriage returns and beeps so they stand out in ls -l ... </sarcasm> | 21:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ecc3g: not far from reality, with path names like >>file:///home/jr/Musik/King Crimson/King Crimson - 40th Anniversary Series/1974 - King Crimson - Red (2009, 40th Anniversary Series, CD+DVD-A, Discipline Global Mobile, UK, KCSP7)/DVD-A/KC_RED/KC_RED.iso<< | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I got stuff with +;,{}()*?!$% in it | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, *generally* you get away just with proper quoting | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but proper quoting easily gets annoyingly complicated | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | particularly when you want to parse filenames, e.g. for a scripted renaming | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | at times even regex in sed turn into gibberish | 21:52 |
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| peetah | :xa | 22:12 |
| peetah | :xa | 22:12 |
| peetah | :xa | 22:12 |
| bencoh | Not and editorcommand | 22:13 |
| bencoh | (huhu, looks like I cant type) | 22:13 |
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| jonwil | hi | 22:41 |
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| Sicelo | hi jonwil :) | 22:59 |
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