IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2013-10-28

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DrCodehi all00:27
DrCodeI have strange problem, some calls ring one time and forward to answering , any idea?00:27
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sixwheeledbeastany additional software00:36
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SAiF8.3 huh?05:27
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Sicelohmm, Hamster file manager... it's nice, but i think some stuff is just too winded..09:18
Siceloi seen on tmo some were hoping to have it as standard file manager on cssu. :-/09:18
Sicelodon't think i agree09:18
Sicelomost processes need you to first move the file onto clipboard :(09:20
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DocScrutinizer05Sicelo: "have it as standard filemanager on CSSU" is fundamental nonsense, since CSSU is exactly NOT about such changes09:42
DocScrutinizer05"have a method in CSSU to *select* the standard filemanager" is the only thing you may hope for09:43
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sixwheeledbeastSicelo: I feel that was possibly my opinion and I agree with DocScrutinizer09:46
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Chat-neldoes someone know where Faster App Manager stores its repositories ?09:57
Chat-nelI would like to add some repo with the command line09:59
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infobotwell, fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default.10:01
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DocScrutinizer05~literap fapman10:36
DocScrutinizer05~literal fapman10:36
infobot"fapman" is "Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default."10:36
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DocScrutinizer05infobot: fapman is also in short, it's deprecated10:37
infobotokay, DocScrutinizer0510:37
DocScrutinizer05~literal fapman10:37
infobot"fapman" is "Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default. in short, it's deprecated"10:37
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DocScrutinizer05aka "Faulty APplication MANager"10:42
jaskaand the other one is horrible application manager10:43
DocScrutinizer05the long story: fapman obviously been developed by somebody who had some knowledge about apt and gui coding, but no thorough understanding of the differnces between maemo and a standard debian distro, regarding packaging and the requirements this introduces and which get handled by HAM10:44
DocScrutinizer05evidence: HAM sourcecode always been free & open, and every reasonable programmer had first analyzed the HAM code and considered to improve *that*, rather than writing something new from scratch. Even when analysis of existing code resulted in "It's rotten to the bones, we need to start from scratch", this approach had revealed details that are mandatory to consider and implement to a App Manager, and any rewrite from scratch would have10:51
DocScrutinizer05based more on the _woring_ concepts in HAM or at least explained why they can get ignored and what's the implications in doing so10:51
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infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: based more on the _working_ concepts in HAM or at least explained why they can get ignored and what's the implications in doing so10:53
PaliHAM is slow because of 1) parsing uuencoded applications icons from Packages.gz text files (from apt repository) 2) parsing Maemo specified fields from that file 3) parsing is slow for too many packages and repositories10:54
Palionly idiot could get idea to put application icons into debian package control file...10:54
Palithis totally slow down downloading info from apt repository and parsing huge text file where is uuencoded icons...10:55
DocScrutinizer05I tend to agree 100% for the icons10:57
DocScrutinizer05they make packages.gz bloated and gibberish to read10:57
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l4m3rxPali, about kp52+git. I've been using it for the last few days.... (heavly using the headset button) and I didn't notice any slowdowns.11:08
Palil4m3rx: ok, thanks for testing11:08
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PaliI'm preparing new version from git for testing with other patches by dfries11:09
PaliI will update TMO post when packages will be ready for testing11:10
l4m3rxWhere can I take a look at "what's to come" ? :)11:14
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shimmyHi. How can I get a virtual keyboard on screen in terminal on an N900?12:37
shimmyThe virtual keyboard is enabled in settings.12:37
Palijust click on the terminal screen with closed HW keyboard12:40
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shimmyPali: nothing.12:48
shimmyIf it was that simple I wouldn't have the need to ask here.12:49
shimmyAfaik I have never had a virtual keyboard in the terminal.12:50
shimmyOfcourse, I havent had the need to use until now because I want to use a character so unusual in it's use in terminal that the devs forgot to add a default binding for it. The illusive pipe |12:51
psycho_oreosYour vkbd might be broken. Also you can add pipe into your xterm window via gconftool12:51
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shimmyI am unfamiliar with gconftool12:53
shimmyThe reason I need a pipe is to PS fmms processes.12:54
shimmyI cannot receive MMS, it just says "Operation failed". Double, triple, quadruple and quintuple checked all the settings, they are correct.12:54
psycho_oreos <--- gconftool in use with examples and all.12:55
shimmyYeah, thats a lot simpler than using a virtual keyboard, lol12:57
shimmyI'd still like my virtual keyboard to work.12:57
shimmyin the terminal, no keyboard showing up12:57
psycho_oreosWith MMS using fMMS, you might be able to get by via tweaking the policy to aggressive. That's how I got MMS working at one stage on my N900.12:57
psycho_oreosSo SSH into the device and check what's up with it.12:58
shimmypsycho_oreos: I cant do the gconf thingy because I need square brackets12:59
shimmyand ofcourse, without a virtual keyboad I cannot type them12:59
psycho_oreosshimmy, did you not read what I wrote just now?12:59
shimmySo, how does one get a virtual keyboard for the terminal?12:59
psycho_oreosI mentioned SSH.12:59
shimmypsycho_oreos: so I have to config SSH on the phone first12:59
shimmyto get a virtual keyboard up and running12:59
psycho_oreosYou don't need virtual keyboard to config SSH, there's already packaged openssh thing that allows easeof setting up and getting SSH running.13:00
psycho_oreosThe only area that you might need the keyboard (and physical keyboard will do) is to setup the password.13:01
shimmyI want MMS to work, it does not, in order to find out why I need to use a pipe and in order to get a pipe character I need a virtual keyboard, but to get the virutal keyboard working I need ssh so I can find out why the virtual keyboard isnt working.13:01
shimmyI have a feeling this is gonna be a productive day.13:01
kerioshimmy: oh13:01
keriofn and then ctrl13:01
shimmykerio: THANK YOU!!! :)13:02
shimmyyeah "operation failed" in fMMS13:03
shimmyis there a log for fmms?13:03
shimmypsycho_oreos: where is this policy? only option I see is network mode which I can set to polite, rude or havoc13:04
psycho_oreosshimmy, so it's havoc then.13:04
shimmyAlso, I use this for my settings
psycho_oreosTry messing around and see which one will work.13:05
shimmyoperational failed on all three13:05
shimmyresize is "medium", im hoping thats ok13:05
psycho_oreosMine's on normal.13:06
shimmyok, I can only conclude that my operator must have broken MMS messages on the server.13:06
shimmyI have "medium"13:06
shimmyEh. Well, all new messages cant be broken, that seems odd.13:07
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shimmyMy MMS internet connection was just removed automagically from all lists and cannot be find.13:15
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shimmyAfter a while the entire phone connection gets stuck on "fmms downloading mms" even though the application has since long been killed, but the top menu just indicates that "heck yeah, we're doing the MMS thing", but alas there is no MMS downloaded13:19
shimmyps -A | grep -i mms does not show any apps.13:19
shimmynot sure what to kill13:19
shimmy"Operation failed13:22
shimmyAre there any alternatives to fMMS? It obviously isnt working with my provider.13:23
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shimmyMMS to new and high tech, like zooming images in the Photos app.13:31
shimmyAh, 2009, so long ago before such things were invented. It was a simpler time.13:32
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HerbstbertHello. Is there a repository for mosh? I just found the page on describing the installation on meego.13:36
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DocScrutinizer05kudos to FatPhil!14:42
infobotrumour has it, zzztop is - the better and even FOSS powertop, or "" root; cd /usr/local/bin; wget -O zzztop; chmod +x zzztop "", or
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DocScrutinizer05highly recommended14:42
qwerty123Gt a cssu update notification!! Will it update the kernel??!! ( Went down from kp52 to kp51r1)14:43
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DocScrutinizer05for now CSSU doesn't touch your kernel14:43
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: thanks!! :) And where to get the changelog??!14:44
DocScrutinizer05(this might change eventually, and I shudder when thinking about that)14:44
infobotrumour has it, cssu is
DocScrutinizer05I didn't notice any CSSU upgrade lately though14:45
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: no idea!! Just got one now!!14:45
qwerty123Said maemo update!!14:46
DocScrutinizer05what exactly?14:46
DocScrutinizer05and save your "!", you eventually might need them14:46
DocScrutinizer05   14.06.201314:47
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qwerty123 umm. Okay. I had just ignored the update. Checking ham.14:48
DocScrutinizer05qwerty123: what's your CSSU version in settings->"about CSSU"? What's the exact name of the update you see?14:48
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: flavour testing, maemo8.2. It just said maemo update.14:50
DocScrutinizer05hard to believe14:50
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: ham is still loading.....14:51
DocScrutinizer05sure, that takes a while, particularly when you got extras-devel enabled which you never should have14:52
DocScrutinizer05I guess it will offer updates for a few packages, but not for maemo Community SSU system14:53
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: whats the problem with ham?14:53
DocScrutinizer05problem? no problem. Just lots of data to process14:53
qwerty123It just said maemo update.14:54
DocScrutinizer05lots of package data for all the packages in extras-devel14:54
DocScrutinizer05no, it never only says "maemo update"14:54
DocScrutinizer05there's a notifier that says sth like "maemo update available! 5 new packages..."14:55
qwerty123Got it. Maemo 5 community ssu package.14:56
DocScrutinizer05and if you're lucky it even lists the packages avalable for update14:56
qwerty123From status menu, it shortens it i think!14:56
qwerty1238.3 292kb in size.14:57
DocScrutinizer05merlin1991: you rolled out 8.3???14:57
DocScrutinizer05HECK, if only we'd get a heads up beforehand14:58
DocScrutinizer05then I'd not waste 15 min to talk users thru verifying there's actually a CSSU update available14:58
DocScrutinizer05honestly, can't be that hard to leave a oneline note in here15:00
qwerty123DocScrutinizer05: are you not on cssu?15:00
DocScrutinizer05I "broke" it with 7.215:00
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DocScrutinizer05since I didn't want to forego procps15:01
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DocScrutinizer05installing procps uninstalls the package you just received an update for15:02
DocScrutinizer05which doesn't mean it uninstalls CSSU15:02
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DocScrutinizer05qwerty123: (changelog) it is a best practice in CSSU to deliver the changelog 2 or 3 days *after* the update rolled out ;-P15:06
DocScrutinizer05to keep users alert15:06
DocScrutinizer05it's more fun to update and then after a few days check how many of the improvements you were able to spot X-P15:07
DocScrutinizer05if you think that's no fun at all, I suggest to ignore the update and wait for HAM to pop it up next time. Then check if changelog already available, and proceed accordingly by either deciding to update or ignore for another period of time15:08
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DocScrutinizer05LOL, I guess he already updates15:09
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sonoHerbstbert =)18:29
Herbstbertsono :D18:29
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Herbstbertsono: Once upon a time in the freenode network...18:29
* sono nodnods, is still at work18:29
HerbstbertMe 218:30
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qwerty123Hey is it safe to simply replace the fonts in /usr/share/fonts/nokia wid some other fonts renamed ro be same as the ones already present??!!19:06
qwerty123Hey is it safe to simply replace the fonts in /usr/share/fonts/nokia wid some other fonts renamed ro be same as the ones already present??!!19:06
qwazixqwerty123, it doesn't sound risky but prolly won't do what you expect though19:08
qwazix(except if you open the fonts in fontforge and change the names *inside* the file too)19:08
qwerty123qwazix: fontforge??19:11
qwazixFOSS app to create fonts19:11
qwazixavailable on desktop linuxes, and windows19:11
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qwazixbut it might be the wrong way to go. What are you trying to achieve?19:12
qwerty123qwazix: okay thanks!! :) Just asking, hav yu tried sumthing like thiss???19:13
qwazixI usually use themecustomiser to change system fonts plus edit transitions.ini19:13
qwazixsee above19:13
qwazixthemecustomiser IIRC has some incompatibilities with CSSU, but if you only touch fonts you are safe19:14
MalinuxI am trying to install the backupmenu software to restore a backup. I get this output from terminal about dependencies19:14
qwerty123qwazix: i have done that!! But that doesnot change the font of vkb (only text area).. Need to change that.19:15
qwazixqwerty123, weird, my vkb font is changed correctly19:16
qwazixscratch that19:16
qwazixyou are right text area is old font yes19:17
qwerty123qwazix: font of the text area too apart from the keys??!!19:17
qwerty123qwazix: yeahh!!19:17
qwerty123Thats what i need to change.19:17
qwerty123qwazix: fonts/nokia seems to contain the default fonts, dats y i ws wanting to change it..19:19
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qwazixqwerty123, you can try, but fonts in linux aren't used by filename19:22
qwazixbut with font name, which is a field inside the font file19:22
qwazix(I tried on the N9, it doesn't work)19:22
qwerty123qwazix: fontforge on debian repo??19:23
qwazixshould be yeah19:24
qwerty123its dere!! Downloading in easy deb!qwazix:19:24
qwazixoh, good luck with that! I struggle with the interface even on my pc19:25
qwerty123Aaaahhh!! Just 5 mb! Still??!19:26
sixwheeledbeastthemecustomizer isn't perfect.19:29
qwazixno, it isn't, but neither is renaming the fonts19:29
Malinuxmaybe backup-menu depends multiboot and that's why I can't install backup-menu19:30
qwazixMalinux, no backupmenu doesn't depend on multiboot19:30
qwazixit may conflict with it even19:31
Malinuxqwazix: okey. So. I am trying to install backup-menu to restore a bacup from another N90019:31
Malinuxand the output I get in terminal did I post here19:32
qwazixI saw that but I don't really know why you get that19:33
qwazixdid you try installing mtd-utils by hand and see the output? Might provide some info19:33
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MalinuxI tried and I can show that info as well19:43
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MalinuxI lost ssh connection to the N900, so I have to reboot to see if I can reconnect19:48
Malinuxno rout to host message19:49
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MalinuxI got connection again after reboot and here is my output
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Malinuxqwazix: I kind of solved it by manually downloading and installing this package:
Malinuxit's a dependencie of mtd-utils which is a dependencie of backupmenu :)22:31
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