IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2010-12-28

toresbeYou know, I WANT that feature now.00:00
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toresbeOh, hell. Now I feel an urge to wire my morse key to the headphone cable and writing a HID driver.00:00
toresbeMohammadAG: I was asking more in terms of if you knew whether it was possible to do it in the API00:00
lcukSpeedEvil, morse would be slow00:01
SpeedEviltoresbe: Consider a morse-key worn like a medallion, with bluetooth.00:01
lcukbut since you are on about headphones00:01
lcukcould use mic00:01
SpeedEvillcuk: Depends on the operator00:01
* lcuk nods00:01
SpeedEvilThough I do question if anyone could hit 60wpm on the headset switch.00:01
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SpeedEvil(though I'd pay to see that)00:02
toresbeSpeedEvil: My Junker key would, if worn around my neck... wear down my neck :)00:02
timeless_mbpsp3000: so00:03
MohammadAGtoresbe, not exactly, you have to kill the notification00:03
timeless_mbpmy n900 sees an update available for my packages00:03
MohammadAGtoresbe, nicolai's app does that nicely00:03
timeless_mbpi guess i can add some instrumentation to the current packages (the ones about to go away)00:03
toresbeOh, it's in there already? Neat!00:03
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timeless_mbpMohammadAG: i don't think "media player" can be copyrighted, so that's not an issue00:09
SpeedEvilmomedia works for me00:10
SpeedEvilWith the companion animation player MoToons.00:12
MohammadAGmyTunes? :P00:12
MohammadAGI wonder if apple would sue00:12
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SpeedEvilFree publicity!00:12
MohammadAGmyTunes, sounds like maetunes00:13
lcukMohammadAG, "mae[APP]" has been used by a number of apps00:13
RST38hmae- is dead00:13
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MohammadAGmeemoplayer? :P00:14
RST38hWill Playdo do?00:14
lcukRST38h, well strangely this app is a look and feel replacement of Maemo specific media player, so its not that wrong00:14
RST38hlcuk: Then call it MediaPlayer+ and be done with it00:15
MohammadAG+ is an invalid character :P00:15
lcukwe are mostly men here00:15
lcukwe should just use the first name found00:15
MohammadAGMoPlayer then?00:16
* lcuk nods00:16
RST38hMohammedia Player indeed00:16
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JaffaPutting ones own name isn't exactly inclusive for contributions from others.00:16
noobmonk3yMoPlayer works though00:17
MohammadAGbut Mo isn't my name :P00:17
MohammadAGMoe is a nick otoh xP00:17
lcukisnt debian named after some hackers girlfriend00:17
MohammadAGJaffa, if you thought for one bit I'm using Mohammedia...00:17
Jaffalcuk: Deb(orah) & Ian00:17
lcukmind you, we can add contributions to her :O00:17
Skaldyay just got kmplayer + mkv video + subtitles working on n900 flawlessly ;D00:18
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noobmonk3yMohammadAG, just call it Playa then ;) lol00:19
* noobmonk3y cringes at tom cruise saying "Pllllllayer" in a random film00:19
timeless_mbpJaffa: Debra :)00:20
alteregoI think that was Tropic Thunder00:20
noobmonk3yyup ;)00:21
Jaffatimeless_mbp: According to Wikipedia you are correct.00:21
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pradeephi all00:30
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alteregoTake it extras-devel uploading is out-of-order as well00:35
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toresbeMohammadAG: btw, is this nicolai fellow on the intermIRC?00:48
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alteregoNow, do I continue to package all of this seperately, or do I make a single "columbus" source tree that just packages the components in different debs like most other projects ..00:51
alteregoThink I'll ponder on it.00:51
MohammadAGtoresbe, sometimes, he is00:52
MohammadAGalterego, think of it like this00:52
toresbeWhat's his nick?00:52
MohammadAGalterego, if you want to update plugins, you need to update the whole source00:52
MohammadAG_nicolai sometimes00:52
MohammadAGor nicolai_, not sure00:52
toresbeMohammadAG: thanks for the info. :)00:53
alteregoGood point ..00:53
MohammadAGalterego, a problem I faced with PSFreedom00:53
MohammadAGevery time I update app, the modules have to be rebuilt00:53
alteregoYeah, seperate versioning is probably useful.00:53
alteregoThat was kind of the reason for doing this.00:53
MohammadAGand I couldn't change this since it would involve a lot of changes to paths00:53
MohammadAGotherwise dpkg would try to overwrite files and fail00:53
MohammadAG(btw, just a theory, I didn't even try to split it, since I thought of overwriting modules in a different package)00:54
MohammadAGso, have different sources, you can update the app without rebuilding the modules and vice versa00:54
MohammadAGalso, have the plugins in a user/ section so users can update them separately00:54
MohammadAGbut keep in mind, you need to make it compatible with the new/old plugins00:55
alteregoHrm ..00:56
alteregoWell, I don't really want my plugins in user/blah00:57
alteregoBut I'll think about that aswell.00:57
alteregoI was thinking of basically having columbus-maemo5 depend on columbus-plugins-core, libcolumbus & librxsupport00:57
MohammadAGalterego, what if you update plugins without updating the app?00:58
MohammadAGyou would still need to push two debs if you do that00:58
alteregoI'll think about it.00:59
alteregoOr maybe do both00:59
MohammadAGthink about it now, or you'll have to restructure again :P01:00
alteregoBecause you want plugins to be installed when you install, not separately.01:00
alteregoBut an update to plugins will force an update to plugins but leave everything else intact without breakages.01:00
alteregoYeah, I'll do both :P01:01
alteregoBut then there is also libcolumbus :)01:01
alteregoSo, HAM wont update any packages unless they're in user/*, ghey :)01:02
alteregoOoo, user/hidden!01:02
alteregoLike Ovi, that scht works :)01:02
MohammadAGuser/hidden is retarded01:02
MohammadAGanyone who uses apt-get will be f'd in the ass :P01:02
alteregoIt's useful for this.01:02
MohammadAGE: Handler Silently Failed01:02
MohammadAGtry it01:03
MohammadAGapt-get install panorama01:03
MohammadAGyou need a modified apt package01:03
alteregoWhat about dual sections ^.^01:03
MohammadAGdnl Check whether to disable the user/hidden packages01:03
MohammadAG  --disable-block-hidden  Don't block 'user/hidden' packages],01:03
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alteregoMeh, can't upload to incoming-builder then ..01:06
MohammadAGalterego, it's down01:07
alteregoI know.01:07
alteregoall day ..01:07
MohammadAGtalk's an exception01:08
alteregoYes, this isn't the first or even second or third time I've suffered this :D01:08
MohammadAGnowplayingwindow.ui? :P01:08
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alteregoWhat massive ISP firms should do is employ people from all kinds of different religions then get other workers to take the slack when a religion has its' massive holidays.01:11
alteregoThus solving religious wars and such.01:11
alteregoWe'd all be one happy connected family then :)01:11
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loft306thats to easy alterego01:14
alteregoObviously agnostics and atheists would have to be donated holidays.01:15
alteregoMaybe even they could get all religious holidays off for showing common sense.01:15
luke-jralterego: that would encourage false religions01:16
alteregoluke-jr: "false" religions?01:16
alteregoYou mean, "religions"?01:16
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luke-jrI mean false religions01:16
alteregoAnyway, this is one of the no-noes in #maemo01:16
alteregoAll religions are false to another religion tbh ..01:17
alteregoSo that argument makes no sense.01:17
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luke-jralterego: false is an objective measure01:19
alteregoWhich gets thrown out the window when you talk about religion :P01:19
* alterego needs to setup his own repository.01:20
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loft306the'll just have to work all the time01:21
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alteregoThink I might start mirroring extras ..01:21
loft306ack! was scrolled01:21
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alteregoReally impressed how well Columbus runs in scratchbox ..01:23
alteregoTomorrow I'm implementing columbus<->columbus streaming01:23
alteregoAnd finishing with my header sanitization.01:24
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alteregoWow, portrait is really screwed in scratchbox ..01:26
* loft306 eyes are fuvvy today cont see the device 01:27
loft306much less read onything on the screen01:28
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MohammadAGalterego, how are you turning it to portrait mode?01:30
alteregoUsing Qt01:30
MohammadAGactually, nvm, the Xeyphr window's the same01:30
alteregoThe normal way in qt by setting window flags.01:30
MohammadAGso the controls will be...01:31
DocScrutinizerfriggin maemo STILL down? >:-(01:31
MohammadAGyeah, but controls won't be flipped01:31
alteregoWell, it stopped working.01:32
DocScrutinizercrashanddie: stop your DoS attack now!01:32
crashanddienot me01:32
alteregoOrientation was fine, but menu didn't work and my swipe to pan views stopped working.01:32
* DocScrutinizer suspects maemo has created his own DoS suicide. recursive CSS01:33
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DocScrutinizerand all programmers know a recursion needs a termination condition. Maemo's is "if server_down == 100"01:35
* loft306 opens ffx with 12 maemo tabs01:35
loft306all but one loaded01:35
loft306the wviki still out to lunchL01:36
loft306what happenedL christamas ?01:37
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DocScrutinizernxt time friggin wiki is up I'll have to wget it. Completely01:38
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* alterego wonders why madde isn't picking up his header files in sysroot/usr/include ..01:39
loft306Hint to nokia: hawe a bacjup snerver01:39
loft306fingers gona alreaiy01:39
alteregoDocScrutinizer: google cache?01:39
achipahint to loft306: have a spellchecker :)01:40
loft306i do01:40
DocScrutinizergoogle cache will survive a final teardown of m.o by Nokia just so long01:40
loft306but its not me spelling just rired fingers01:40
achipabut anyway, will have to ask what our distinguished SLA is...01:40
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alteregoNo one is talking about a final tear-down ffs.01:41
loft306and need spell fixer01:41
alteregoAnd that is _years_ away ..01:41
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achipaprolly 95% :S01:41
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DocScrutinizeralterego: that's the problem with teardowns. They often happen without any warning01:42
alteregoYou're doing that annoying thing again01:42
alteregoYou obviously don't believe it's some conspiritorial Nokia tear down.01:42
* loft306 scratches head01:42
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alteregoAnd costs so little to run from their perspective, they've also promised it'll be up as long as we're still here.01:43
alteregoAnd they wouldn't turn it off without telling us.01:43
DocScrutinizerI don't believe anything except my own backups01:43
alteregoDespite what you may think of them,01:43
alteregoWell, give them an offer for :P01:44
alteregoBesides, is controlled by a sub-contractor.01:44
DocScrutinizereven worse01:44
alteregoNokia have very little input into it.01:44
ShadowJKIt's not hosted at nokia :-)01:44
jacekowskiwhen red bend started sending c&d letters01:44
alteregoNot really, the sub-contractor is a massive maemo fan01:44
jacekowskithey were very eager to do it01:44
jacekowskiand nokia lawyers got involved01:45
alteregoIt's a FOSS pushing company, can't remmeber what they're called.01:45
DocScrutinizerI don't care - I just like to have my backup. And I honestly doubt anybody needs to flame me for that01:45
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alteregoSorry, it's just your attitude :P01:45
alteregoYou're always, "It's the end of the world!" .. "Nokia are destroying the best mobile platform" bleurgh01:46
DocScrutinizerwhere do you conclude about my attitude. I don't offer enough detail for you to have the slightest idea about my attitude01:46
alteregoNow why doesn't madde see my freain' headers ..01:46
alteregoIt is how you come across DocScrutinizer, it's nothing personal but the way you word things often get missinterpreted (or maybe not) as rude and generally quite negative.01:47
alteregoThough, I'm british and it's a pretty common tone ..01:47
jacekowskiwell i'm really surprised that nokia isn't hosting it on their own servers or something01:47
jacekowskibut have it like that outsourced01:47
ShadowJKjacekowski, iirc because wanted more flexibility than what having nokia IT people standing over their shoulders would have given01:48
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alteregonyurgh ..01:49
DocScrutinizereven when I say "XY sucks!" you can't know if I'm bitter or have tongue in cheek01:49
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ShadowJKThat's why you don't do tongue in cheek on IRC without having the tongue in cheek smilies01:49
DocScrutinizerI need no smilies, I'm smiling myself01:50
alteregoSo, Qt Creator seems my header, but it fails to find it when included ..01:50
ShadowJKThat's communication failure then01:50
DocScrutinizeraaaaall the time01:50
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DocScrutinizeryeah, I'm admittedly poor at communications01:51
alteregoOh, that is just absurd01:51
alteregoIt compiles when I build it manually in madde ..01:51
alteregoBut qt creator fscks it up.01:51
DocScrutinizercheck env01:52
alteregoYeah, doing it.01:52
alteregoLooks fine.01:52
alteregoOh well ..01:52
GAN900DocScrutinizer sucks!01:53
DocScrutinizerI concur01:53
* GAN900 complains ironically about cold weather.01:53
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lolloohow do I make softcamera button do CTRL+SHIFT+R01:56
lolloofor portrait mode.01:56
lolloois there a way to let softcamera button click these .01:58
DocScrutinizererrr, there's "an app for that" - well not exactly. Something like cam-menu or whatever01:58
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lollooshortcutd app01:59
DocScrutinizerjust the question what ctl-sh-R really does01:59
lolloorotation portrait mode.02:00
lolloofor all apps on N90002:00
DocScrutinizerI know THAT02:00
DocScrutinizerbut HOW02:00
lolloojust click it02:00
lollooamazing u never knew02:00
DocScrutinizersorry I expected a developer answer02:00
lollooyeah Shortcutd is developed by developer02:01
lollooso get it and dont ask.02:01
DocScrutinizerlolloo: there's some method called in system, whether it's a dbus call, invocation of xrndr or whatever02:01
DocScrutinizerlolloo: you starting to get unpolite02:01
lolloono I use shortcutD02:01
lollooits cold02:02
DocScrutinizerso if it needs any more proof I suck on conversation....02:04
DocScrutinizeranyway, get your answer elsewhere then02:04
lollooMe too when its cold.02:04
zutesmogDocScrutinizer: I don't blame  you!02:04
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lollooomg I was looking for one.02:10
lolloodoes it apply to N900?02:10
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DocScrutinizerwow, I'm wondering which brilliant answer will take so long to write down02:12
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lolloosince it's QT I think it applies to N900 maemo502:12
DocScrutinizeranyway, I'm off before *I* start to become unpolite02:13
lollooP.R1.3 has QT support I think.02:13
alteregoWe've had Qt since PR1.2 actually.02:14
alteregoWell, before in fact but officially in images in PR1.202:14
lolloooh never knew.02:14
lolloostupid me.02:14
alteregoAnyway, that book is probably fairly applicable to maemo5 and Qt02:15
alteregoBut obviously maemo specific things will be missing02:15
lolloommm any books pleeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaase02:15
lollooQT specially02:15
lollooQT will support new phones too. right?02:16
alteregoWell that worked.02:16
alteregoTo use mad for packaging you have to use -d to ignore dependencies.02:16
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alteregololloo: to be honest, I don't know any decent books for Qt, I learned everything looking at Qt source and reading API docs.02:17
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lolloothats you.02:17
lolloome nooooooooooob02:17
alteregoIf you've never programmed before, a book is probably advisable, though not always neccessary02:17
pupnikthis npm guy did some cool work with high-level GUI toolkits back in 1990
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lollooI want something future proof, I dont want to waste time.02:18
lollooI know C++02:18
alteregoIf you know C++ you shouldn't need a book on Qt02:18
alteregoIt's just a C++ application framework.02:18
alteregoThere's the official Qt book, which has a slightly older version online.02:19
alteregoFor free02:19
lcuki like reading real books sometimes02:19
alteregoNewer technologies, well, there's probably a lot more useful information in blogs and examples tbh02:19
alteregoSure, I'm just saying.02:19
alteregoIf you want something futureproof, don't buy a book on programming in an API that changes quite a lot over time :)02:20
lcukblogs and examples are too easy to get sidet ... oh cool, a new comment02:20
lcukif the api changes so drastically with each revision that the fundamentals are not important then there is something wrong.02:21
alteregoI really like this mouse I got for Crimbo :)02:21
alteregoI don't think the fundamentals of Qt are worth a book :)02:22
lcukthen the book is not aimed at you02:22
lolloowhat books you got lcuk.02:22
lcukbeen reading the gruffalo recently02:23
alteregoI would recommend the Qt book though, I read the online version, well, some bits of it, and it seems nice.02:23
lcukanother few days and I might actually finish it02:23
alteregoThe Gruffalo! :D02:23
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alteregoHrm, note to self, packaging using mad is impossible (I think)02:24
alteregoWell, dh_shlibdeps is failing now.02:24
lcuklast book I actually sat down and read was {fleet/juggler/destroyer} of worlds series by Larry Niven02:24
alteregoI wonder how it gets its' dep list.02:24
alteregoIt's found the library but can't tell what package that library comes from.02:25
* DocScrutinizer shakes head about Lennart's appearance @ 27C302:25
DocScrutinizerreminded me at balmer rap02:26
alteregoOooo, the button on the side is a "back" button.02:26
DocScrutinizer"developers developers developers " errr "it's freeeeeeeeee! it's freeeeeeeeeee!!!"02:26
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lolloocongrat me. I bought the book02:31
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DocScrutinizerat least i'm now clear about how PA managed to creap in everywhere02:32
alteregoHrm, I'm gonna need to come up with a better development setup now :/02:32
alteregoI guess if I could work on integrating Qt Creator better with scratchbox so I get code completion02:32
DocScrutinizerprobably Lennart visited the major distro HQ and acted ther the same way he did @ 27C3, until they promised to include PA to next release if only he leaves and never comes back02:33
pupnikDocScrutinizer: was berlin fun?02:35
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npmpupnik: i also used WINTERP to build and (doing "web" before the web, using email)03:11
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alterego" (except talk.) down?" 14 posts03:16
alteregoI guess maemo really is becoming small.03:16
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npmany mention on when it'll be back up?03:26
Arkenoiso the flash player 10 from TI is actually even _slower_ than default one?03:27
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nox-i think it was mentioned here that the default one was optimized by nokia too...03:33
jacekowskiand it's not real flash 10 as such03:34
jacekowskisome things are missing03:34
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ShadowJKwhat things?03:35
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ShadowJKreal features or just "hw accel missing", which was pretty much a given as there was no hw accel in the desktop linux version either.03:38
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ArkenoiShadowJK, but it is *not* mising in android version, right?03:40
ShadowJKeh nfi :)03:41
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lucentchecking out the T-Mobile IPv6 Friendly-User-Trial, now. Still setting up N900 and Maemo04:50
lucentit's weird that I have to work around the Maemo interface to get it done, hmm... what's a sensible way to add IPv6 DNS?04:50
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luke-jrlucent: what plan do you use?04:53
lucentluke-jr: it's EvenMorePlus500 basic and I've added unlimited net for $10/month04:54
luke-jrlucent: you can possibly drop that to $5/mo via retentions dept04:54
* luke-jr doesn't want to risk upsetting his $0/mo unlimited data >_<04:55
lucentheh, good advice! :)04:55
lucenthave you tried the IPv6 trial, then?04:56
luke-jrGoogle sez T-Mo does have a $5/mo data plan for "old" customers04:56
luke-jrno, since I don't want to risk losing my plan :P04:56
luke-jrI'm sure if anyone looked into it, they'd say too bad04:56
lucentoh okay, now I understand04:56
luke-jrnow if someone else with it has succeeded…. then I'll try :P04:57
lucentaccording to the individual who is sheparding the effort, he has direct access to tinker with stuff, but it gets reset if you make changes to your account04:57
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lucentluke-jr: I won't cover your losses if I'm wrong, but I think that this person is not concerned with how much you're paying04:58
luke-jrwell, the beta page does say you need one of their "unlimited" plans. so he might care that I'm on a standard unlimited plan04:58
lucentyeah I don't think it would be risky to apply on the form05:00
luke-jrI mean that I'm *not* on a standard plan05:00
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lucentright, but from a company view, the guy is going to check "can I sign this person up for the FUT or not?" and not worry about your details05:01
lucentjust my two cents man, don't mind me :)05:01
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lucentgiven that /etc/resolv.conf contains a line "nameserver", how to make that IPv6 enabled?05:02
MohammadAGi think you need kernel-power05:02
lucentis it what, dnsmasq or something? will that listen on ::105:02
lucentoh, correct MohammadAG and actually I do have kernel-power :)05:03
merlin1991lucent, yes it's dnsmasq05:03
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MohammadAGjust making sure ;)05:03
* MohammadAG wants orientation lock05:03
lucentI have kernel-power, n900ipv6 goodies from
lucentha orientation lock05:03
MohammadAGit's annoying in photos05:04
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lucentI want the phone to wake up when I get a call without it lagging on orientation changes and the "ANSWER" button not suddenly shifting around05:04
lucentheard of anyone successfully making a hardware button answer the phone when it rings? would work for me if it did05:05
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lucentmerlin1991: how to make dnsmasq listen on localhost ::1 ?05:13
luke-jrlucent: it does by default for me05:15
lucentoh, how can you tell?05:16
luke-jrnetstat -t05:17
lucentmine says only "tcp 0* LISTEN"05:17
lucentno tcp605:17
luke-jrmaybe Maemo's dnsmasq was built w/o IPv6 support05:18
lucentoh, that could be05:18
lucentluke-jr: does that mean, you have built your own dnsmasq?05:20
luke-jrlucent: no, I was looking at my router :P05:21
lucentseems to be /etc/event.d/dnsmasq05:23
lucent"exec /usr/bsbin/dnsmasq -k -i lo -a -z" hardcoded05:23
lucenttypos obviously ^^05:24
lucentgoing to try "exec /usr/sbin/dnsmasq -k -i lo -a -a ::1 -z"05:26
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lucentshoot, doesn't work05:30
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lucentdon't know why it doesn't start correctly, when I start it manually it works fine05:34
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lucentluke-jr: any idea why "-a ::1" would make dnsmasq fail to execute from /etc/event.d/dnsmasq ?05:43
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pupnik2 hours of mp3 playback and battery meter reads 99%06:00
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lucentha, battery meter not working?06:00
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pupniklucent: guess what, it's not a n90006:10
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hatake_kakashiand so the million dollar question is: what phone is it?06:16
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pupnikinternet tablet hatake_kakashi - archos a70s running linux06:17
hatake_kakashipupnik: ahh a different distribution yet again :)06:18
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pupnikhatake_kakashi: i wish nokia had continued the internet tablet tradition06:19
hatake_kakashitoo bad that device doesn't have phone functionality built-in06:19
pupniki think it's better without06:19
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hatake_kakashipupnik, then again nokia is bleeding red after having iphone as well as android phones eating away it's share of phone market06:21
SpeedEvilblackberry on the other side06:22
psycho_oreosand speaking of which about blackberry:
luke-jrlucent: [22:18:12] <luke-jr> maybe Maemo's dnsmasq was built w/o IPv6 support06:23
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pupnikhatake_kakashi: well the pioneer of a technology often isn't the one who capitalizes on the idea06:24
hatake_kakashipupnik, granted however nokia isn't a company that just focuses on internet tablets06:25
pupnikthey invented the first usable ones06:26
pupnika courageous band of real computer geeks within the company06:26
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pupnikso the nokia geeks pioneered the way and showed the world it could be done06:27
pupnikthen apple and google showed the business world how that tech could be used for evil, and profit :D06:27
hatake_kakashithen again I think it was the whole reality of marketing and trends saw internet tablets as a niche market06:27
luke-jrpupnik: nonsense06:28
pupnikyes... but apple saw how to make money off operators06:28
pupnikand google saw how to make money off advertisements06:28
pupnikwith the same tech06:28
luke-jrinternet tablets have existed before Nokia even dreamed of it06:28
hatake_kakashiapple made a killing from its app store from what I understood06:28
pupniknah, 770 was the first real one06:28
pupnikprevious 'tablets' didn't have the battery/cpu/size/screen magic bullet06:29
luke-jrpupnik: bs06:30
luke-jr770 was a failed idea06:30
luke-jrit was underpowered for its generation06:30
luke-jrthe earlier tablets at least had appropriate batt/cpu/size/screen for their time06:30
johnxit really was, considering it came *after* the zauruses06:30
luke-jr64 MB made sense back in 2003, not 200706:31
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pupnikyes but the zaurus was 700 euro and the 770 was 35006:31
luke-jrbut the 770 was far less capable06:31
luke-jrit lacked a keyboard, etc06:32
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tzafrir_laptophmm..... does the N900 respond really poorly to being short on battery?06:32
luke-jreven today, the Zaurus keyboard is far superior to even the N810 and N90006:32
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: it shuts down06:32
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: if it's too slow, it won't even charge*06:32
pupnikok sharp was first you're right06:32
tzafrir_laptopluke-jr, I'd be glad if it were only that. I have it connected to USB for several hours now,06:33
tzafrir_laptopand it still won't power up06:33
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: try using the wall adapter for 30 mins06:33
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tzafrir_laptopluke-jr, what's the difference?06:33
lucenthar, zaurus, I owned that once06:34
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: the wall adapter is supposed to charge faster I think06:34
tzafrir_laptop(and yesterday I connected it to the wall adapter, and it took quite a while06:34
tzafrir_laptopAren't both just USB?06:34
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: actually, might not matter since the emergency-charge-mode is only ultra-slow06:34
luke-jrlucent: one of the PDAs, or the handhelds/i.tablets?06:35
lucentthe C320006:35
luke-jrah, that was the last gen06:35
lucentand the C3000, for what it matters they were the same06:35
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luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: there is no 'just USB'06:35
tzafrir_laptopThe sad thing is that it was connected to USB power all day, but 5 minutes after I left the office I noticed that the battery is almost empty06:35
luke-jrlucent: what happen to it?06:35
lucentluke-jr: I never found a daily use for it, and sold it06:36
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: sure? plugged in != charging06:36
lucentnice hardware, though.06:36
tzafrir_laptopluke-jr, do I have to ask it to start charging?06:36
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: if you connect it to Windows, you do I think06:36
johnxtzafrir_laptop, the wall charger will give it more than 500mA. a USB port on a PC will probably only give it 500mA max06:36
luke-jrLinux just tells it OK go ahead06:37
lucentN900 is my return to a "pocket linux" device, and I think I'm actually using it because it has a phone and a nice camera06:37
tzafrir_laptopluke-jr, so if I just connect it, it won't start charging immediately?06:37
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: I don't think Windows will, no06:37
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tzafrir_laptopregardless of what connection it will use?06:37
tzafrir_laptopI use Linux06:37
lucenttzafrir_laptop: I think zaurus needs 24 hours to charge, if the battery was too low06:38
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: Linux will probably, but then it depends on the motherboard's capabilities06:38
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: it's also possible to have N900 doing too much that it can't charge06:38
luke-jrthat is, using more power than it can get06:38
tzafrir_laptopluke-jr, there are many USB-powered devices (that only take power). IIRC I don't see them on lsusb06:39
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: irrelevant06:39
lucentkernel can shut down power if it sees too much drain, I think06:39
johnxalso, I've had mine fail to begin charging and needed to unplug and re-plug before it started charging06:40
lucenttzafrir_laptop: are you trying to charge an N900, or a zaurus? sorry I was missing this06:40
* tzafrir_laptop wonders when he will eventually give up and start using a phone that Just Works06:41
luke-jrdown with phones!06:41
johnxtzafrir_laptop, when someone makes one?06:41
tzafrir_laptopAs opposed to a computer that is also a resonably nice phone06:41
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tzafrir_laptopjohnx, my previous mobile phones work nicely.06:41
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luke-jrmy grandmother's cell phone is amusing06:42
tzafrir_laptopThey don't do anything close to what the N900 does, but they do it well06:42
luke-jrit doesn't have a display, just a numpad06:42
lucentI have no illusions, it is true that N900 has a bonus feature called a phone06:42
* johnx pictures tzafrir_laptop with a rotary dialed phone from the 50s :)06:42
luke-jrthat would be a killer app06:42
luke-jra rotary dialer06:43
tzafrir_laptopjohnx, look for my avatar on jabber.org06:43
luke-jrfor N90006:43
lucentwith resistive touchscreen? I'm not liking that :/  but great idea06:43
psycho_oreoswait for the novelty to wear off for today's trends06:43
lucentwould rock on a capacitive screen06:43
tzafrir_laptopanalog phone networks of today still support pulse dialing. I suspect GSM networks don't06:44
luke-jrtzafrir_laptop: well it would emulate that side ofc06:44
tzafrir_laptopthere's a simpler interface than the dial:06:44
tzafrir_laptopclick once for 1, 2 for 2, etc.06:45
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tzafrir_laptopWhich is the pulse that is actually sent.06:45
tzafrir_laptopAnd which nobody will get right on a touch screen :-)06:45
lucentluke-jr: as in
psycho_oreosand traditional rotary dials did not have an undo button, one mistake and you're going to have to repeat the whole sequence again.. I can imagine how much fun that'll be when it comes to international calling combined with calling cards that use automated responses within a time frame06:46
lucentluke-jr: FYI the fix for IPv6 was to add "::1" nameserver to resolv.conf, and to make sure dnsmasq started WITHOUT the "-z" (bind interfaces) option06:48
lucentnot totally sold that it's the correct solution, but it is close to what I wanted06:48
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lucentbetter would be to get dnsmasq bound to ::1 and retain the -z option06:49
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lucentwhen I tried "-a -a ::1 -z" then dnsmasq would not start from its upstart job06:49
lucentsimply "-a" it starts, and I'm sure will cause problems if I want another instance of dnsmasq running, but I don't need that right now and haven't an idea how to do it correctly06:50
tzafrir_laptopspeaking of dnsmasq: is there any problem with not preventing it from resolving local addresses?06:52
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lucenttzafrir_laptop: double negative logic, could you rephrase a bit?06:52
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alteregoJust sent my gf away in a taxi to Paris06:53
alterego5am, nuergh06:53
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johnxtzafrir_laptop, errr, what do you want it to do that it's not doing right now?06:55
* tzafrir_laptop looks for the name of that option06:56
tzafrir_laptopuntil I find it: here's what telephony people think about rotary phones:
tzafrir_laptop(from the Asterisk 'extra' sounds tarball)06:58
lucentthe amplitude on that audio file is pretty low, wonder why that isn't normalized07:00
johnxtzafrir_laptop, which is funny, because that's approximately how I feel about phone menus :)07:00
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tzafrir_laptopthe option is 'domain-needed' . What happens if I remove '--domain-needed' from the dnsmasq command-line?07:01
johnxprobably nothing helpful but nothing bad?07:02
johnxif the DNS server on your local network answers queries like that it might actually be helpful07:03
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johnxtzafrir_laptop, cool. that's actually helpful for me07:07
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MaKaurgent help needed..07:56
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slonopotamusis there any way to see _all_ mail headers for message in modest?07:57
johnxMaKa, just ask the question :)07:57
MaKaafter installing multiboot,on the very next reboot,i dont find any kernel to select07:57
MaKanow its a kinda deadlock:()07:57
MaKai cant boot into my maemo..:(07:57
MaKanor into my memorycard..07:58
johnxMaKa, do you have a linux desktop to use?07:58
MaKayep,but i am far away from it right now..07:58
MaKaas far as my office from my home :P07:58
MaKaany root cause upto ur knowledge johnx?07:59
johnxah, well you could probably use your nokia flasher on your linux desktop to load the stock kernel into RAM once so you could boot into maemo and fix things07:59
MaKai have the meego image on the MicroSD card..07:59
johnxnope. never played with multiboot07:59
MaKai was using bootmenu-n900 so far..07:59
MaKajust  gave a try for multiboot and i am hung.. :D08:00
MaKado i need to reflash anything?08:00
MaKaor just run the kernel flasher command to just load the rootfs??08:00
johnxprobably not if you can get booted into maemo08:00
MaKaya okay thanks johnx...08:01
johnxluckily you can reflash just the kernel+bootloader+initfs without reflashing the rootfs+emmc08:01
MaKaam desperately in need of a solution to boot now without having to goto a desktop,which seems to be impossible now:P08:01
MaKathanks to #maemo :)08:02
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Termanagood morning08:02
johnxthere should be a CLI flasher for windows and mac, but I don't know enough about them to be helpful08:02
johnxmornin' Termana08:02
MaKathere is a maemo flasher for windows and it works as fine as the Linux thing..08:03
MaKamorning Termana :)08:03
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MaKahey johnx,what shud i do now exactly??? :P08:06
MaKai mean i dont know how exactly to load the stock kernel into RAM08:06
johnxhave you used flasher before?08:07
MaKayeah,i have used it for flashing the emmc and the firmware..08:08
johnxso first of all: download a copy of the normal firmware08:09
johnxmake sure it matches whatever you have installed08:09
MaKaya okay,,08:09
MaKai have the same thing,that is okay!!08:09
johnxerrr, before we start,  you've googled a bit first, right? ;)08:10
MaKaright :)08:10
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johnxso you tried holding 0 to boot maemo?08:10
MaKait shows ,what08:11
MaKawait i will tell you now what it tells me..08:11
MaKait says,can't flash kernel,required files not found08:11
johnxerrr, it says that when booting your N900?08:12
MaKaGuru meditation#00000025.6201771208:12
MaKaafter pressing the 0 on multiboot screen..08:12
MaKaalso says hit any key to panic.. :(08:13
johnxso first I'd unpack the firmware image: flasher-3.5 -u firmware.bin08:14
MaKaokay,i will have the unpacked image..08:15
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johnxflasher-3.5 -k kernel-image.bin -l -b08:15
johnxI don't know the exact filename08:15
MaKathis will boot the n900 with native os,right?08:16
MaKathanks Johnx:)08:16
johnxyou might want to look at flasher-3.5 --help so you can double check, before just trusting me08:16
johnxMaKa, it should load the maemo kernel into RAM, *once*08:16
johnxbut I honestly don't know exactly how multiboot works, so that may or may not be enough08:16
MaKaya,ONCE...that is enuf for me to uninstall this multiboot :)08:17
MaKaoh my god :(08:17
MaKalet me give it a kick.. :)08:17
MaKathe above link is down i guesss..08:17
MaKacant open in my network..08:17
johnxme neither08:18
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johnxback in a couple minutes08:19
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johnxany luck MaKa ?08:30
MaKaNot so far..08:31
johnxis flasher managing to load the kernel?08:31
MaKaflasher when done in updating mode,directly loads the kernel..08:34
MaKai guess i will be able to boot into maemo soon :)08:34
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jon8cute spam guys09:11
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jon8ah, n/m..09:11
jon8geneven was trying to join here09:11
jon8and didnt send the command properly.09:11
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*** trx has joined #maemo09:42 should be online, if ISP did what I asked from them09:43
aslanisorry for huge delay, but their customer support is not the best09:44
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xDaReaperxwho's the ISP ?09:47
xDaReaperxit's down majority of the time09:48
aslaniwell, it's probably better that we do not start blaming anyone here09:48
aslanithey really had big issues09:49
aslanitwo of their DCs went totally powerless09:49
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xDaReaperxatleast it's back now09:55
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achipawell... not entirely, the autobuilder is still pretty much dead10:06
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Milo-where does maemo5 hold its 'current ringtone' link or file?10:07
xDaReaperxthere's an actual load on the server ?10:08
Milo-or in which configuration file is that defined in?10:08
Milo-or is it unaccessible information?10:08
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timeless_mbpMilo-: iirc it's copied to some space outside of MyDocs10:50
timeless_mbpso that it can be used in all cases10:50
timeless_mbpyou could figure it out by using strace or strings or something10:50
timeless_mbpit's probably fairly obvious10:50
timeless_mbp(i'm too lazy to look for the ui spec, sources, or similar)10:50
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Venemogood morning guys11:03
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xDaReaperxAfternoon !11:14
timeless_mbpgood night!11:14
timeless_mbpfor people too young to remember that, it's
xDaReaperxI'll step back11:15
xDaReaperxcause i'm not American11:15
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Khertan_Hum ... seems back to life :)11:36
Khertan_Morning all !11:37
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Venemomorning Khertan_ :)11:48
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Khertan_morning Venemo11:52
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rcgdid the autobuilder also pick up the work again?11:58
rcgmorning btw ;)11:58
xDaReaperxall the homepage posts at's homepage is gone12:00
xDaReaperxtheres only one12:00
rcgah, apparently it did12:01
Khertan_rcg: autobuilder seems to work12:02
Khertan_but my packages aren't push yet to repository12:03
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X-FadexDaReaperx: The homepage post just have aged because no new votes were given over the past 24 hours.12:03
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xDaReaperxoh okay12:03
X-FadexDaReaperx: That is a good thing normally, but now it looks a bit weird :)12:04
Khertan_rcg: but it s normal as i ve pushed it 10m ago12:04
xDaReaperxHaha yeah it does12:04
Khertan_X-Fade: thx for having pushed the missing dependencies of Khweeteur in extras12:05
X-FadeKhertan_: I just managed to do that before the outage ;)12:05
Khertan_X-Fade: :)12:05
Khertan_indeed, Khweeteur user was whinning because while i ve pushed a broken new version in extras (due to missing dependencies), pyside team pushed new beta of binding which break the devel version of Khweeteur12:07
X-FadeKhertan_: Life of a repository manager is great ;)12:07
Khertan_the life of a developper/packager isn't bad too :)12:08
Khertan_also i ve a question to the good repository manager you are :)12:09
Khertan_did you think should not be removed from extras-devel as, it s outdated and unmaintained ?12:10
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rcgX-Fade: our hero! .. as in
X-FadeKhertan_: I wonder what is up with that one :)12:14
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Khertan_X-Fade: :)12:16
X-FadeKhertan_: After 3 package name changes, it is a bit confusing.12:17
Khertan_X-Fade: indeed12:17
X-FadeKhertan_: python-pyside is the latest one it seems.12:17
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Khertan_X-Fade: yes it is12:18
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Khertan_X-Fade: the last bugged one :) (but it s another story)12:18
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Khertan_X-Fade: if only one day we can have same package name between each distributions too ... it ll be marvelous !12:19
X-FadeKhertan_: Yes, the stable api promise should come at some point :)12:20
Khertan_example : qt4-devel, qt-devel, qt4-dev, ... :)12:20
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Khertan_X-Fade: yep ... but it ll come only if i stop inserting bug in their bugzilla :)12:20
Khertan_anyway they made a great quality binding in really few time12:21
Khertan_i ll be happy to be the first to push an app which depends on it :)12:21
Khertan_s/push/push to extras12:21
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X-FadeKhertan_: Yeah, we probably would need to help it a bit with all the python dependencies. But let's see.12:22
DocScrutinizerev'rything back to normal? (except infobot missing)12:23
X-FadeDocScrutinizer: Should be.12:23
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*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | | Maemo Community Council | |"12:23
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Khertan_X-Fade: the 4 previous release of Khweeteur in devel was depending on pyside without any problems12:24
Khertan_but i ven't try to push to extras :)12:25
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X-Fadezap: unzip zapped.12:31
Ex-OpesaI installed apmefo and now catorise is not working. What should I do?12:31
Ex-OpesaI removed apmefo and catorise and reinstalled catorise still its not working.12:32
Khertan_Ex-Opesa: v 0.9-6:      Add compatibility with Catorise. Both applications can now be installed next to each other without either one messing up the other. To switch between them, simply choose Activate or Deactivate from within ApMeFo.12:33
Khertan_it should not happen12:33
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RST38hMore riots!12:34
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Ex-OpesaKhertan_, Thanks for the reply. Well I did deactivate before uninstalling ApMefo. I am now again installing apmefo to try.. :S12:34
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acidjazzsup yall12:35
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acidjazzcool gingerbread hack on the n90012:35
acidjazzi just dusted mine off and turned it on12:35
acidjazzanything cool/new ?12:35
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Venemoacidjazz: if you refer to NITdroid, ask on #nitdroid12:36
Ex-OpesaKhertan_, My device ones stuck while using catorise's GUI. I had to restart the device. Could this be the problem that catorise is not working again?12:37
Khertan_Ex-Opesa: don't know i didn't use it12:37
Khertan_contact his autor12:37
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Ex-OpesaKhertan_: Okay.12:37
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zapX-Fade: thank you, will submit again this evening, wonder what'll happen :)12:46
X-Fadezap: You and me both :D12:46
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JaffaEx-Opesa: What's happening with Catorise?12:51
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JaffaEx-Opesa: Although I don't know who wrote CatoriseGUI, so I don't support *that*12:51
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psycho_oreosEx-Opesa, happened to me before, its a config somewhere that's fubared.. I didn't bother investigating and did a complete reflash/setup.. even the osso-backup will make catorise not work12:53
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Jaffapsycho_oreos: Ex-Opesa: /opt/catorise/menu is probably the one in question;  but no-one's raised a bug AFAIK12:57
psycho_oreosJaffa, heh I never bothered, my bad12:57
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: ping13:03
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Ex-OpesaJaffa, psycho_oreos: I just solved it now. Deleted the file. It automatically made new file and now catorise and everything works normal. :)13:03
timeless_mbppool/itunes-library   54Gi   54Gi  629Mi    99%    /Users/timeless/Music/iTunes13:04
* timeless_mbp has decided it's time to clean out a directory :(13:04
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: Is it possible via DBus, or some other mechanism, to query microb's current URL etc? Trying to move to OAuth 2.0 for Facebook & Hermes, and it's... complicated.13:05
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* timeless_mbp ponders13:06
edheldilHi all, is there any progress in getting JavaME on n900?13:07
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: Or, is it possible to embed microb in a widget and have full control over it & an API for changing URL/querying current URL?13:07
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RobbieThe1stedheldil:  I don't think so, due to patents and such. JavaSE, however works(though patent-legality is dubious13:08
timeless_mbpJaffa: microb is basically embedable13:08
timeless_mbpthat's how the tutorial app and maps work13:08
timeless_mbpoh and conversations13:08
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: Do you know of any simple examples?13:09
Khertan_Jaffa: maybe it s better to use qt webkit for futur compatibility ?13:10
timeless_mbpJaffa: iirc browser.garage has a sample13:10
edheldilRobbieThe1st:  I was afraid it would be like that :(. It's sad that Nokia does not bother :(13:10
JaffaKhertan_: Very possibly, but I'm not sure I want to move the whole app to Qt to fix one bug13:10
timeless_mbpedheldil: eh13:10
JaffaKhertan_: Or maybe I can have a hybrid Qt & Gtk app13:10
Khertan_Jaffa, theorically the user should input manually the pin code ...13:10
timeless_mbpedheldil: it's sad that nokia doesn't spend $$$$$ on something of minimal value?13:10
RobbieThe1stedheldil: Not sure what it's useful for, though. Between Debian apps and custom-n900 stuff...13:11
Khertan_Jaffa: did you plan to use python-oauth2 ?13:11
DocScrutinizerJaffa: maybe with a custom CSS? which just wraps up the original webpage but exports the URL to "<anywhere>"13:11
RobbieThe1stedheldil: And with JavaSE(Icedtea) good enough to run frigging -runescape-, it's not like you can't just use desktop Java apps(slowly).13:12
JaffaKhertan_: I just started with something small. The problem is that I can redirect the user to a page where 'code' is in the URL param and pull that out via JS and ask the user to enter it. However, Facebook's 'code' parameter (which you then pass back to get an access_token) is about 32 characters.13:12
edheldilthe usual reason :). There are many apps for JavaME ... even if dumb, they are useful and they are NOW :)13:12
JaffaKhertan_: Making retyping it from a webpage annoying13:12
RobbieThe1stedheldil: What - specifically - are you looking for?13:13
timeless_mbpJaffa: anyway, in short there's a sample demo source in our old svn repo13:13
edheldilOpenWIG :)13:14
Jaffatimeless_mbp: Thanks13:14
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RobbieThe1stedheldil: Hm... what about MicroEmulator?13:15
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: wasn't that you who told me user can define custom CSS for microB?13:15
timeless_mbpcould have been13:15
* timeless_mbp does13:16
tybollt_meh, meego source too big for a 2G card :-P13:16
timeless_mbpwhich reminds me, i have an 8gb card from nokia california13:16
* timeless_mbp should bring it in13:16
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edheldilRobbieThe1st:  thank you, sounds cumbersome (needs IcedTea, right?), but perhaps doable.13:17
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: and such a custom CSS could contain script code, right?13:18
timeless_mbpnot generally13:19
DocScrutinizerhmm :-S13:20
DocScrutinizerJaffa: so another idea: use a local "proxy", that is parsing the HTTP traffic13:22
timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: it should be https traffic..13:22
*** leandrosansilva has joined #maemo13:23 I gather the REFERER won't contain the complete info you need, when you just direct microB to a local page reading it out13:23
timeless_mbpyou could run a local web server13:24
timeless_mbpdepending on how oauth works13:24
timeless_mbpperhaps you can get the oath thing to redirect to your server at the end?13:25
rcgedheldil: looking for ?13:25
Jaffatimeless_mbp: Oooh, good idea. It should be able to redirect to http://localhost:<somerandoport>13:26
timeless_mbpthe amount of web server that you need to implement for this would be trivial13:27
JaffaHell, it knows it's only going to get a single request.13:27
* Jaffa ponders whilst he goes out bed shopping.13:27
JaffaThanks DocScrutinizer, khertan, timeless_mbp13:27
DocScrutinizerhmm, so just a lil bit smarter than a "proxy"13:27
timeless_mbpproxies are hard to do13:29
timeless_mbpbut the key is that this is more or less how oauth was designed13:30
timeless_mbpyou were trying to fight the design, which is silly13:30
DocScrutinizermaybe. I'm a complete noob regarding HTML and all that is related13:31
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DocScrutinizerand I never heard of oauth, so quite possibly you're right :-D13:33
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timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: that's why i get all the web questions ;-)13:37
timeless_mbpanyway, time for me to head in13:37
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trumeeanybody using a tomtom stanav?13:49
trumeei was wondering how well the bluetooth connectivity works with N90013:49
* trumee swears never to connect a TomTom to a linux system. It kills the TomTom13:50
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tybollt_trumee: ? my 730 works just fine w/ my n90013:53
trumeetybollt_: thanks for letting me know. i was planning to get a 750.13:53
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trumeetybollt_: so does handsfree work on TomTom connected to N900 via bluetooth?13:54
tybollt_granted I don't use it at all - seeing as I have another system for handsfree :)13:54
tybollt_trumee: supposedly yes - it announces the capability and such - never tried it though13:54
trumeetybollt_: another system?13:55
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trumeetybollt_: can tomtom use the internet on N900?13:56
tybollt_trumee: Parrot MKI9200 in specific13:56
tybollt_trumee: yes, I have made it tether on the n90013:57
trumeetybollt_: sorry i only had a basic TomTom One until now so i am a noob. What is the advantage of tethering TomTom to N900?13:58
tybollt_none - far as I can see13:58
tybollt_well it can download the sat quickfix13:58
trumeeah! i see. The 750 model has Live services, not sure if it can use N900 bluetooth13:59
trumeetybollt_: what is the advantage of Parrot system over TomTom?14:00
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trumeetybollt_: will it be possible to play the music stored in N900 on the TomTom?14:05
trumeetybollt_: ?14:07
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edheldilrcg: yes, thank you14:23
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TiagoTiagowould it be safe to plug my N900 to a pc and run chkdisk on it? With dmesg i spoted several error lines like "fat_bmap_cluster: request beyond EOF" and i'm having some issues with playing and recording videos and a few other things14:58
keriorun fsck on it14:59
TiagoTiagodoes the N900 got that?15:00
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keriodunno, maybe?15:01
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TiagoTiagook, found it15:02
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trumeeis it possible to send send phobe calls over bluetooth, but play music through headphone jack?15:12
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trumeeor send music via fm-transmitter and phone calls through bluetooth?15:14
trumeeis this sort of hack possible at all?15:15
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TiagoTiagofsck has halted, what do i do?15:18
TiagoTiagowould control-C screw up my MyDocs?15:20
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trumeeTiagoTiago: channel is a bit quiet today :(15:22
satmdTiagoTiago: it won't15:23
satmdunless it warned you15:23
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satmdfor fsck you need to *unmount* the partition in question15:24
TiagoTiagoit is safe to control-C out of it?15:24
TiagoTiagoalready done15:24
satmdthen, yes15:24
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DocScrutinizertrumee: technically it's of course possible. But I have no clue how mafw is dealing with that and how to tweak it so e.g. mediaplayer is using headset-jack despite bluetooth headset is connected15:26
trumeeDocScrutinizer: i would be happy even with mplayer or Mediabox.15:26
DocScrutinizerfor sure it would be mutually exclusive usually, means playback of music will stop while doing a phonecall15:27
TiagoTiagowell, i interrupted and fired it up again and it gave me all the same msgs again then stoped at the same point :(15:27
trumeeDocScrutinizer: i want send phonecalls to the TomTom over bluetooth and music to car stereo over headphone-jack15:27
DocScrutinizerI see15:27
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trumeeDocScrutinizer: mutually exclusive will be good in my case15:28
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DocScrutinizerif maemo audiosystem wouldn't be so errr. how to say that... suboptimal and of limited versatility, then it should be simple to define e.g output of audiodevice used by mplayer to go to hs-connector unconditionally15:29
trumeeDocScrutinizer: so something needs to be done in pulseaudio?15:31
DocScrutinizerI guess you have to fumble with that PA-policy definition files etc. Alas I have no idea how those work, or where to get info how they work15:31
TiagoTiago <- this is what is happening15:32
TermanaWhat DocScrutinizer is really trying to say is PA is a piece of garbage.15:33
Termanaaucat/libsndio FTW!15:33
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TiagoTiagowhat should i do?15:36
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RST38hTiago: You should sacrifice some mammals to the Tentacled One15:37
RST38hFor your FAT partition has been majorly fucked up.15:37
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TermanaTiagoTiago, rm -rf /15:38
TiagoTiagoi don't think that command is safe....15:39
TermanaNaw, would I give you an unsafe command?15:39
MohammadAGTermana, include a smiley next time15:39
trumeei had similar sorts of issues as TiagoTiago reading fat drive of my TomTom yesterday.15:41
trumeeIt died eventually.15:41
MohammadAGmay it rest in piece15:42
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trumeeMohammadAG: well it is, after burning a hole in my pocket15:43
TiagoTiagoSo my N900 is on its las breaths? 0.015:43
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trumeeSomehow i feel that vfat fs  works best with windows15:44
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TiagoTiagodo you mean when it is running or to fix it?15:45
trumeeWith TomTom it was all the time i think15:47
E0xhmm exist a way of i can use the n900 keyboard in a remote machine ?15:48
E0xi mean use it for remote input data15:48
E0xin X15:48
Khertan_vnc over ssh15:48
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E0xlet me google15:49
TiagoTiagowould it be safe to delete the files that it says has errors in them? And would that help or make things worse?15:49
TermanaSlap a couple of things together and you a whole new thing15:49
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: while your fsck.vfat output clearly shows there's something fishy with your fs, I can't see why it shouldn't eventually succeed to fix this. fsck might take a long time to finish. what exactly did you do?15:49
trumeeanybody used Sygic?15:50
Termanaget a*15:50
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* trumee is wondering if Sygic is the way forward after the death of TomTom15:50
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: deleting files on a messed up fs is a bad idea15:50
TiagoTiagodunno, been having issues with the N900 freezing for a few seconds while recording videos and some weird msgs when trying to play some videos15:51
DocScrutinizeralso most probably will not work at all, as your vfat partition should be mounted r/o for all I understand15:51
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TiagoTiagoAnd i think at one point i had i run out of battery while recording a video15:51
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TiagoTiagoif interrupt fsck and mount MyDocs again it will become readonly?15:52
DocScrutinizerI think so. Try adding parameter -v to fsck.vfat15:53
TiagoTiagointerrupt it and run it again with that parameter added?15:53
Spookjefrom the fsck.vfat man page: When dosfsck checks a file system, it accumulates all changes in memory and performs them only after all checks are complete. This can be disabled with the -w option.15:54
Spookjeso no changes have been made if you interrupt it15:55
TiagoTiago(btw, if i disapear its because things went really bad, and since my desktop machine is also in need of repairs i won't have a way to come back here soon :(15:55
Spookjeand I doubt it will make changes on a mounted fs.15:55
TiagoTiagoi unmounted it15:55
Spookjethen i'd try running fsck with -v15:56
TiagoTiagoor at least i told it to unmount it and it didn't complain15:56
Spookjesee what happens.. and wait...15:56
TiagoTiagook, here it goes15:56
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DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: you also can have an occasional look at dmesg in other xterm15:57
DocScrutinizerreally severe hw IO-errors should show up there15:57
Spookjeso we hope they don't...15:58
Spookjebut running out of power while filming seems to me like common FAT problems15:59
DocScrutinizerfsck'ng 28GB on eMMC can take incredibly long. Especially when swap kicks in15:59
RST38hWell... Try copying a video file from eMMC to the uSD or back.15:59
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DocScrutinizeryou might be better off to try and connect the vfat partition to your PC via mass storage and then run fsck there (if that even works)16:00
DocScrutinizerRST38h: duuring fsck run?16:00
TiagoTiago with the -v16:01
MohammadAGoh nice16:02
MohammadAGthe packet injection driver went FOSS16:02
MohammadAGbut he wants donations for that FOSS16:02
MohammadAGso not exactly F16:02
RST38hDoc: No, just during normal operation, will be enough16:03
RST38hMohammad: FOSS enough. He does not force you to donate, just asks for donations (which he will not get)16:03
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what's wrong with asking for donations?16:04
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MohammadAGRST38h, he does, you need to donate to get a link16:04
MohammadAG"After your donation you receive a download link including"16:05
TiagoTiagoDunno if it has anything to do with my problem, but sometimes i've tried OC'ing, and i got Fcam installed16:05
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, you ask for them, after you provide me with something16:05
MohammadAGnot before16:05
MohammadAGOCing corrupts the FS16:05
* MohammadAG has seen that on a lot of devices here16:05
* MohammadAG ponders donating then pushing the source into kernel-power16:06
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DocScrutinizerOCing also can eat your eMMC interface hardware, so don't complain when it turns out your MyDocs has permanent random errors16:07
MohammadAGthat is not FUD ^16:07
TiagoTiagoHow people run around keeping their N900s OC'd at high values and don't report any issues?16:08
DocScrutinizerbecause those issues build up over time, and most people olso won't attribute their issues to OC, as you didn't16:08
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MohammadAGhow do some people die at the age of 15?16:09
MohammadAGwait what16:09
keriohow do i shot web?16:09
MohammadAGThe driver is Matan's code, and lxp's selling it o_O16:09
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DocScrutinizernooo MohammadAG - there's not a single one here who reported he died at age of 15 yet :-P16:10
* MohammadAG can't believe he thanked Matan, oh well16:10
TiagoTiagoIs undervolting also way more dangerous than people make it seem to be?16:10
alteregoAh, I see the Anti-FUD around OCing effect is still in full swing.16:10
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DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: undervolting is just silly16:11
keriomy grandfather died at 89 after smoking two packs of cigarettes each day for like 70 years, with no problems at all16:11
kerioit doesn't mean that smoking is not dangerous16:11
felluIs there any application for tracking GPS-signal and upload it to internet?16:11
felluLike with google maps, or something16:11
felluSo ppl can see my location real time..16:11
keriofellu: well there's google latitude16:11
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felluOh, how it works16:12
felluLets see.16:12
TiagoTiagoThere is a rare percentage of humans that are immune to HIV infections16:12
felluDoes it work on maemo or symbian^3, kerio ?16:13
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kerioit uses browser geolocalization afaik16:14
kerioso... maybe?16:14
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DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: (-v) I've hoped fsck would be a lot more informative with this parameter. Anyway I'd think as long as it just runs, you should keep it running. There's no reason to assume it froze or anything, unless no diagnostic output for >50h (sic!)16:14
TiagoTiagoaren't there some native clients?16:14
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MohammadAG^Cing fsck isn't a nice thing, I've done it to /home :P16:16
alteregoAh, m.o is back up :)16:16
alteregoI can upload my packages now.16:16
* MohammadAG passes around the beer16:16
DocScrutinizersee /tpic16:16
DocScrutinizer/topic even16:16
TiagoTiagoan ASCII throbber indicating it is doing somthing would be nice16:16
MohammadAGis the throbber this thing -> [\-/]?16:17
DocScrutinizeryou can tell from a htop in another terminal though16:17
Spookjeyou might just check with top or ps or something16:17
fellukerio, ot16:17
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TiagoTiagothat could be one way to do it16:17
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: even attach strace to fsck, from another terminal16:18
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: though I do not recommend that16:18
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DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: whatever - freeing up as much memory as possible, esp by closing browser windows and other mem hogs, should help a bit in speeding up fsck16:20
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TiagoTiagoseems fsck is using about 90% of processor time16:22
DocScrutinizeractually I guess sth along the line of a swapon /myswapfile; swapoff /dev/mmcblk0p4 would be a good idea prior to running a fsck against eMMC16:22
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: 90% is ok I'd say16:23
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DocScrutinizertbh I have no idea how long a fsck.vfat of 28GB could take on a OMAP3430 @ 500MHz, but I know it takes quite a bit on my 2GHz Pentium with 2GB RAM16:25
fellukerio, thanks. :)16:26
felluWorking perfectly16:26
felluThat is just what I was looking for. :D16:26
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DocScrutinizerwhat? Author: Werner Almesberger? :-D16:29
DocScrutinizeraka wpwrak16:30
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alteregoNo it isn't "2011-01-03 14:21 UTC"16:32
alteregowtf ..16:32
alteregoLook at the "Changes" ..16:33
TiagoTiagoi have it partitioned a tad differently; though the vfat partition probably not smaller enough to reduce the total time all that much....16:34
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DocScrutinizeralterego: heh, now you found out how got fixed. They advanced the time beyond the critical dates :-P16:38
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SpeedEvilThe real problem is the got hit by stuxnet16:40
DocScrutinizerwas about to write something similar16:40
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TiagoTiago"FATs differ but appear to be intact, using the first", so there is more than one, would using the second one possibly not give me the errors?16:44
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DocScrutinizer51meh, finally kill this blue flashing...16:46
DocScrutinizerDocScrutinizer51: ping16:47
DocScrutinizeraaah better16:47
DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: possibly16:48
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TiagoTiagoany way i can test that hipothesis?16:49
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DocScrutinizerTiagoTiago: -r instead of -y might help. Needs your attention though16:50
TiagoTiagothay would offer the option of using the other FAT?16:50
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alteregoHrm, anyone know how shlibs works?16:52
alteregoI've got a library, which I've debianised.16:53
MohammadAGis it me16:53
alteregoThen I've got another library that depends on the first, which is now debianised. But shlibs isn't picking up the first package as a dependency.16:53
MohammadAGor is QGraphicsView piss easy?16:53
TiagoTiagois it safe to run more than one fsck in the same partition simultaneously?16:53
ShadowJKTiagoTiago: absolutely not16:54
DocScrutinizerI doubt it would even work16:55
MohammadAGalterego, ever used it?16:56
MohammadAGI'm looking at an example of image reflections16:56
MohammadAGit looks kinda easy16:56
DocScrutinizer(using 2nd FAT) no idea where I've seen an option to do this. I know I've read about it. Maybe with some undelete or recovery tool16:56
alteregoA bit, it's quite easy, you thinking of using it for video?16:56
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MohammadAGalterego, no, reflected album art16:57
alteregoOh cool :)16:57
MohammadAGalterego, reflecting video/processing it in real time is kinda... stressful16:57
MohammadAG found this16:57
DocScrutinizerplease have an option to disable such CPU and reel estate hogs16:59
MohammadAGit's not a hog17:00
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DocScrutinizerwhatever else it is, at very least it's sometimes quite ugly and inadequate17:00
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DocScrutinizerand obviously it needs a place to display the reflexion17:01
DocScrutinizerusually there's better use for that space, on a 4" screen17:02
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DocScrutinizerbut anyway. An option to disable it is easy and just fine17:02
DocScrutinizerautomatically using the freed screen space for something really useful is less easy to implement17:03
alteregoIf it looks nice and doesn't hinder usabilty. keep it :)17:03
alteregoDon't bother with some option to turn it off.17:04
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alteregoUsers don't care about it and I'd rather something that looked pretty tbh17:04
DocScrutinizerlooks nice to whom? YOU?17:04
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MohammadAGactually, Jaffa17:04
alteregoDocScrutinizer: I wouldn't guess, I've not seen it yet.17:04
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MohammadAGhe provided the concept :P17:04
DocScrutinizerI don't want to have my album cover art reflected17:04
alteregoDocScrutinizer: don't use this media player then :)17:05
alteregoMohammadAG: have you got type-to-search working yet?17:05
alteregoAnd categorisation?17:05
ShadowJKheh. The album art already steals so much space the artist album and song titles don't fit :P17:05
MohammadAGalterego, no17:05
MohammadAGalterego, I need crashanddie to finish with Mafw source calls17:05
DocScrutinizeroh yeah - "it's freeeeeeeeee!!" - Lennart your brother?17:05
MohammadAGalterego, type-to-search is in Fapman though17:06
lcukMohammadAG, albumart+=effect_reflect();  if(username=='DocScrutinizer') albumart+=effect_shimmer();17:06
DocScrutinizeryeah, why have a flag when you can hardcode17:07
lcukawesome MohammadAG - he agrees to the tweak as well!17:07
* alterego chuckles17:07
DocScrutinizers/username/groupnmae/ though17:08
DocScrutinizerand here we are, another flavout of a flag17:08
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TiagoTiagoyay it's done, running again to see if there is anything left17:09
DocScrutinizer(actually even username is a flag, though a quite inappropriate one for the usecase)17:09
lcukDocScrutinizer, kotzcarny has been working on some pixel effects which would make albumart extra awesome17:09
lcukdissolve effects and fades and stuff :D17:09
DocScrutinizerI make my album art awesome in my own special way. I don't appreciate somebody doing it for me in a predefined way17:10
lcukit can be randomised with page curls and crumple effects and all sorts17:10
DocScrutinizerHoly Shit!17:11
lcukwith 16777215 different combinations, your pictures will never be shown the same way twice!17:11
MohammadAGthey will, eventually17:11
lcukbetter and better17:11
lcukMohammadAG, shh17:11
DocScrutinizernow just rename the songs randomly :P17:11
MohammadAGsounds like a good idea!17:12
lcukthis feature list is made of pure awesome17:12
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, hmm, it hasn't raped startup time - yet17:12
lcukMohammadAG, in all seriousness, DocGrumpy is right, there are people who just want the data17:12
DocScrutinizeradd random instrument tracks to the mp317:12
MohammadAGlcuk, it's FOSS...17:13
DocScrutinizerand you're Lennart17:13
lcukMohammadAG, and don't make us have to reimplement the whole damn player just to change a single feature17:13
TiagoTiagonow to see if the media player still has issues with the videos17:13
MohammadAGlcuk, it took me less than 5 minutes to add it17:13
lcukMohammadAG, sure thing - and it could take you a whole 5 minutes to just make it a gconf key or something to check for17:14
DocScrutinizergreat, how long will it take me to set up the dev env to remove it in 5 sec and then recompile in 20min?17:14
lcukno need for ui yet, just make it an internal option17:14
TiagoTiago"retrieving blablahblah six minutes remaining17:14
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alteregoAha, fixed it.17:16
DocScrutinizerlcuk: thanks for helping me out :-D17:16
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TiagoTiagobe back in a bit17:18
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alteregoHow can I make a postinst & postrm script in debian package only used in one of the packages from a single source tree?17:32
loft306hmmmm ispy the wiki is up17:33
alteregoI have a lib, generating lib and lib-dev, but lib-dev is running my postinst and postrm scripts and it shouldn't.17:33
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tybollt_for android there's an app that kicks in just when a call is received and checks w/ an online source who is the owner of the number (case it is not a number in the phonebook) and shows it on the screen - is there such an app for maemo?17:36
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Khertan_alterego: did you mean that the postrm script is run after the update of the new version ?17:41
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Khertan_as i got the same problem with khweeteur :)17:42
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alteregoKhertan_: well, I have a project, it's a shared library, my debianization creates two packages lib and lib-dev17:43
alteregoBut the hook scripts I only want in lib.17:43
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alteregoNot in lib-dev, but postinst and postrm are being executed for both lib and lib-dev packages. Which will screw things up if you remove lib-dev17:44
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DocScrutinizeralterego: nice17:54
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alteregoMeh, fixed it.17:56
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abhyI was planning to buy N900 is it going to help me in Meego Development, please let me know18:07
SpeedEvilyes, certainly.18:07
SpeedEvilCompared to having no platform.18:07
SpeedEvilThe question is - will it be the most heavily developed platform.18:08
SpeedEvilIt's pretty much so at the moment.18:08
SpeedEvilFor phone anyway18:08
abhyCan I make Meego apps, then wont it be restricted to only N900 and contrary N900 will not be supporting it18:08
SpeedEvilbut what's coming down the pipe is a different question18:08
MohammadAGwith the vsync SGX driver, it's kinda cool18:08
MohammadAGand it's not as slow as it used to be18:08
MohammadAGabhy, no18:08
SpeedEvil'Meego' apps are meant to be mostly portable18:08
MohammadAGThat's the point of Qt18:08
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SpeedEvilYou won't be able usually to simply run the binaries, but it should be a simple recompile, and screen-dimensions thing.18:09
SpeedEvilPretty much18:09
MohammadAGif properly coded, you should be able to run the apps on Maemo 5, MeeGo, Windows, Linux, Mac and Symbian18:09
MohammadAG(Note: Symbian might be retarded)18:09
abhyokay...  thanks guys... but just one question, though its not good to ask, do you think Meego will not come up to the mark in front of Android18:12
MohammadAGtbh, I think Android will fall down to the mark of it18:12
TiagoTiagoYou shouldn't be making a program with hardcoded screen resolution nor aspect ratio18:13
alteregoOnce MeeGo core becomes stable on the N900, it will be come what we make of it.18:13
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alteregoOnce we have full functionality, camera, gps, blah, blah.18:14
alteregoIt's just a matter of fine tuning it and turning the ux into something we can enjoy using.18:14
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abhythank you guys, will soon be joining you all18:16
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mecehello tharr!18:21
Khertan_<SpeedEvil> 'Meego' apps are meant to be mostly portable <<< or not ... they are pushing for QML ... beurk18:21
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MohammadAGQML's portable afaik18:25
meceqml is definately portable. well as portable as qt 4.7 I suppose.18:26
MaKawhat is the command to unpack a Fiasco image???18:26
MohammadAGflasher-3.5 --help18:27
MohammadAG(hint -u)18:27
MaKafound.. thanks :)18:27
MaKainstalled Multiboot and i cant boot into my device..18:28
MaKanor into my MicroSD too :)18:28
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DocScrutinizerI really wonder what's wrong with this multiboot thing. Never looked into it, but it seems to me it's quirky, obsolete, and #1 on causing problems and making people reflash their device18:32
DocScrutinizerplus its name is always called in same context as *droid18:33
MaKai shud now completely reflash or just coldflash???18:33
meceMaka, try flasjing just kernel18:33
MohammadAGwhat exactly is the problem?18:33
KaadlajkI had device with nitdroid at work and only managed to flash it with flashing jig18:33
meceMaKa, did you follow the instructions?18:34
Kaadlajkwould not try nitdroid with my own device :P18:34
meceKaadlajk, nice :)18:34
MohammadAGnitdroid doesn't touch the bootloader18:34
MaKai actually tried this multiboot thing not for nitroid,but for MeeGo :P18:34
MohammadAGmultiboot for MeeGo is a bad decision18:34
mecewhy would you try nitdroid? Isn't that some stripped phone os?18:34
MaKawas using MeeGo with bootmenu-n900 and was working fine..18:34
mecemultiboot for meego works perfectly.18:34
MohammadAGthey got uBoot working for a reason18:35
MaKatried with multiboot, and am dumbstruck..18:35
meceI meant uboot18:35
* DocScrutinizer recalls some wikipage where coldflashing was mentioned, completely misleading about its purpose, among other random bogus instructions.18:35
MaKaya i understand..18:35
meceI thought we were talking about uboot this whole time *bonk self*18:35
MaKabut multiboot shud show the list of native kernel atleast if not the MicroSD kernel..18:36
MaKathere is no OS listed in the list..18:36
MaKawhen pressed '0',18:37
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DocScrutinizerscrew multiboot18:37
MaKait says,can't flash kernel,required files not found18:37
MaKaGuru meditation#00000025.6201771218:37
MaKaalso says hit any key to panic.. :(18:37
MaKahow do i identify the kernel image for this device without opening its back cover now18:38
DocScrutinizerfriggin multiboot is reflashing your kernel on every boot (as judging by above error msg) which CERTAINLY is a thing you should NOT do18:38
mecehaven't seen guru meditation since the 80ies18:39
satmdsame here18:39
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MaKabut i never knew this multiboot installation wud bring this error :(18:39
meceis the guru meditation message in a box with a red border?18:39
MaKajust installed it,rebooted and am hung here :(18:39
mecewait what? it is?18:40
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MaKared box like a teaser msg :(18:40
MohammadAG<MaKa> was using MeeGo with bootmenu-n900 and was working fine..18:40
DocScrutinizerforget multiboot!18:40
MohammadAGYou have 2.6.35 for Maemo 5?18:40
mecelike this:
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MaKasame as that image...18:41
MaKawith the msg on the top changed to "can't flash kernel,required files not found"18:41
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MohammadAGWell, if you have 2.6.28, MeeGo won't work, so it obviously wasn't working properly with bootmenu18:41
MohammadAGJust use flasher-3.5 -k zImage -f -R18:42
DocScrutinizerMaKa: you are aware of the true implications of what it says it's (not) doing there?18:42
MohammadAGassuming you unpacked the zImage to .18:42
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MaKayes MohammedAG18:42
MaKadoing it..18:42
MaKaNot exactly Doc18:43
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MohammadAGalso, you can complete nicknames using tab18:43
mecethis guru meditation thing is a joke, right?18:44
MohammadAGmece, it's the way multiboot handles error numbers18:44
DocScrutinizeryou are (multiboot is) *flashing* your kernel on boot. Flashing wears NAND, and is generally a thing you don't want to do in the field.18:44
meceMohammadAG, yeah, it's still a joke though. Or a pun or whatever you call it.18:44
DocScrutinizergenerally speaking flashing kernels is dangerous18:44
meceretro cleverlry18:44
MohammadAGJay-C had a nat/nokia cloak18:45
MohammadAGmultiboot was written by a Nokia employee18:45
MaKaYa,but i remember reading somewhere That NAND wears is still lesser than what we do with the normal HDD so it can be negligible..18:45
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MaKaKernel image boot failure MohammedAG18:46
DocScrutinizerflashing a kernel or (for mainboards) a BIOS isn't anything you do on the fly18:46
MohammadAGthat's not an error I've heard of18:46
MohammadAGhit 018:46
DocScrutinizeruse uBoot18:47
DocScrutinizermultiboot, what a clever sick hack18:47
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, multiboot hooks onto preinit, flashing uBoot won't help since this is loaded before it18:48
DocScrutinizerto get rid of multiboot there's of course no use in flashing uBoot18:48
meceso it fails before kernel is loaded?18:49
MohammadAGit makes /sbin/preinit_orig18:49
meceI mean18:49
* MohammadAG thinks he knows of a way18:49
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MaKaMohammadAG: Done :)18:49
DocScrutinizerexcept with uBoot you *could* still boot up the non-fubar'd OS and fix the one infected by multiboot preinit hook18:50
MaKamece: thanks:)18:50
meceboot some os fro microsd card18:50
MohammadAG"init=/sbin/preinit_orig ubi.mtd=rootfs root=ubi0:rootfs rootfstype=ubifs rootflags=bulk_read,no_chk_data_crc rw console=ttyMTD,log console=tty0 snd-soc-rx51.hp_lim=42 snd-soc-tlv320aic3x.hp_dac_lim=6"18:50
mecelike meego :)18:50
MohammadAGflasher-3.5 -k zImage -l --boot="init=/sbin/preinit_orig ubi.mtd=rootfs root=ubi0:rootfs rootfstype=ubifs rootflags=bulk_read,no_chk_data_crc rw console=ttyMTD,log console=tty0 snd-soc-rx51.hp_lim=42 snd-soc-tlv320aic3x.hp_dac_lim=6"18:50
MohammadAGthat should override multiboot18:50
meceMohammadAG, oo :D18:50
meceMohammadAG, that's actually pretty brilliant18:51
MohammadAGit's a modified stock kernel CMDLINE :P18:51
MaKanow removing this multiboot shud get me rid of this problem right?18:51
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DocScrutinizermece: that's not brilliant, that's obvious. Getting the parameters right is brilliant, but we still wait to see that :-D18:52
meceDocScrutinizer, I'm just assuming they're correct :)18:52
MohammadAGthey are ;)18:52
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DocScrutinizeryou're still on your own to get rid of multiboot, after that. I suggest for a first measure you cp /sbin/preinit_orig /sbin/preinit18:54
MaKaSo MohammadAG, DocScrutinizer , uBoot is ur suggestion?18:54
luke-jrMohammadAG: flasher's --boot thing doesn't work fyi18:54
DocScrutinizeris my alternative to using multiboot which is crap18:55
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, multiboot does that in postrm18:55
MohammadAGluke-jr, it does, FYI18:55
luke-jrMohammadAG: nope, I tried many times18:55
MohammadAGyou fail then :P18:55
MohammadAGI use it to boot MeeGo from the eMMC18:55
MohammadAGso obviously, it does work18:55
MohammadAGluke-jr, you might be forgetting to escape spaces or wrap it with ""18:56
MaKaMohammadAG: Correction,I used -f <image> -l -b to boot the MeeGo :p and so that was no part bootmenu-n900 does in it :P18:56
MohammadAGbut it does work, I'm sure of it18:56
MaKawrong understanding :P18:56
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luke-jrMohammadAG: maybe it was fixed in 3.518:56
luke-jrI only have 3.0 (last 64-bit ver)18:56
* MohammadAG uses 3.5 on 64-bit18:57
luke-jrwhere do you get 64-bit 3.518:57
MohammadAGyou don't, --force-architecture and get ia32-libs ;)18:57
luke-jrthen you're not using it on 64-bit18:57
MohammadAGunless you're using windows18:57
luke-jrthat's hybrid 32/64 bloat18:57
DocScrutinizerpleeeease not this again18:58
MohammadAGhey, it works for me :)18:58
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: for luke-jr Qt is no c++ but a new language. And linux with a custom driver no linux. And flasher with ia32 libs not running on 64bit18:59
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* DocScrutinizer wonders what's an app running under wine for luke-jr19:00
luke-jra Windows app ofc19:01
MaKaDoes MeeGo work functionally fine??19:01
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DocScrutinizerI heard of nobody using it on N900 for a daily phone19:01
MaKaI mean in terms of call and sms and Internet?19:01
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MaKaThe same with NiTDroid?19:02
DocScrutinizernice toys for developers19:03
alteregoFailed to fetch http://stage/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/libr/librxsupport/librxsupport_0.1.0-3_armel.deb  Size mismatch19:03
MohammadAGcalling works19:03
alteregoAny ideas?19:03
MohammadAGand SMS receiving works19:03
MaKabut i found it not working..19:03
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DocScrutinizerand if I wanted a android phone then I'd not have bought an N90019:03
MohammadAGalterego, wait 5 mins, it might recreate the index19:03
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MaKaIt just remained in flight mode..19:03
MohammadAGpin code?19:04
MaKai cudnt detect the signat even..19:04
MohammadAGagain, got a pin code?19:04
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MaKapin code?? asking me??19:05
Spookjedo you have a pin code on your sim? did you enter it correctly? if not, you remain in flight mode..19:06
MaKai never knew this..19:07
MaKabut where does meego ask for the pincode?19:07
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nox-afaik by default its configured not to ask19:08
nox-but you can change that, `somewhere'...19:09
nox-err sorry i meant maemo haha19:09
MohammadAGMaKa, it doesn't19:09
MohammadAGMaKa, so you have to get rid of it19:09
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MaKaAny idea how to add more user profiles in n900 other than general and silent?19:12
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Spookjewith tweakr for example.....19:14
MohammadAGprofilex or something19:14
Spookjetook me a whole second to google that btw19:14
MaKaMaKa is :P lazy bum :D19:15
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yashadid somebody try already the injection patches?19:26
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DocWAnyone know how to change default search engine for Opera on the N900?19:28
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trumeeno cli ftp client in N900?19:50
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yacctrumee, ncftp?19:51
trumeeyacc: that would it be nice, is that in extras-devel?19:51
yacctrumee, guess so, I've got devel enabled.19:51
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yaccAnd automatic upgrade lookup disabled ;)19:52
trumeeyacc: thanks, i will install ncftp19:52
piggzoh yeah!
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yashaanybody checked out the injection patches?19:55
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DocScrutinizertrumee: mc20:03
trxim trying to connect a usb wireless adapter to n90020:03
DocScrutinizerwell, not exactly 'cmdline' :-)20:03
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trxim using an active hub20:04
trumeeDocScrutinizer: ncftp is the perfect cli ftp client20:04
DocScrutinizerI'm happy with mc20:04
trxand the device is there if i check with dmesg20:04
trxbut there is no wlan0 interface20:04
DocScrutinizertrx: lsusb20:05
Sicelotrx: tried ifconfig -a?20:05
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DocScrutinizertrx: and of course you'll need the matching drivers for that dongle20:05
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trxlsb usb can see both the hub and the device20:06
DocScrutinizertrx: also what means "the device is there if i check with dmesg"? What exactly is there?20:06
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trxatheros based device tho20:06
MohammadAGthat's uboot gone20:06
* MohammadAG grumbles20:06
trumeeis it possible for N900 to become a bluetooth audio receiver, ie it plays the audio broadcasted by TomTom bluetooth?20:06
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trxDocScrutinizer it displays the informations about the device20:07
trxsome errors too20:07
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* trumee dont know what is it called in terms of bluetooth profile20:07
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trxwould you be willing to take a look?20:07
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DocScrutinizertrx: if that's USB messages in dmesg then it doesn't mean a lot20:07
DocScrutinizeryou'd need the proper kernel driver to handle the WLAN dongle20:08
DocScrutinizerI'd not expect maemo to ship that driver by default20:08
trxhmm, i taught that linux would have the drivers for tp-link's atheros based adapter20:08
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trxso, its prolly the drivers?20:09
trxhow can i check that?20:09
DocScrutinizeryou need to modprobe the correct driver for the 'card' (usually that's done automatically by udev or sth)20:09
trxnote that i tried usb ethernet adapter, god knows what brand it is20:10
trxand it works, guess im lucky :)20:10
DocScrutinizertrx: easiest way is to plug the dongle to a PC where it should work, then find out which driver it is using20:10
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trxill try and do that20:11
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DocScrutinizerthen see if you can find or compile that driver for maemo20:11
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DocScrutinizeror you use google with the VID and PID of lsusb and find info about that driver's name20:13
trxill try that too20:13
trxthank you20:13
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Arkenoitrx: are you trying to find a driver with injection working out of the box?20:15
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RST38hGood evening, gentlemen20:16
trxany driver will do, i just need the adapter to work20:16
GAN900RST38h, yo.20:17
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GAN900The N9 rumor mill really isn't a happy one these days, is it?20:18
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RST38hGAN: No, it is not.20:19
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JaffaGAN900: There are new ones? Of use?20:25
yashaany of you guys tried the new injection patches??20:25
JaffaGAN900: See the meego-* email from a Nokian about Flash, homescreen widgets etc?20:25
lcuk2Jaffa, link?20:26
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Jaffalcuk2: trying to find it20:26
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jacekowskiflash sucks20:27
Arkenoiare they nuts?20:28
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Jaffalcuk: In the "PCWorld" thread on meego-community20:29
lcukta jaffa20:30
Jaffalcuk: Search for "interestingly Marko Ahtisaari talks about having customisable"20:30
lcukyeah i have it its ok \o20:31
RST38hgyfvutgy]'tdxrbgbn v?20:31
Jaffalcuk: There're references to "Dali" which I don't understand tho'20:31
JaffaSo it could mean something else20:31
_trinecan I ask if it allowed for a person to charge for linux source code ?20:31
_trineI was thinking about the wl1251 wifi drivers20:32
Jaffa_trine: Only for media and P&P, i.e. "reasonable"20:32
_trinewell is this ok :-
GAN900Jaffa, one would assume hardware codename.20:32
* alterego starts thinking of a new icon for Columbus20:32
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JaffaGAOne would20:33
JaffaGAN900: One would20:34
GAN900Jaffa, googling around turns up N9 pictures20:34
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MohammadAG@ Jaffa GAN90020:35
DocScrutinizer_trine: this is perfectly allowable20:36
_trineDocScrutinizer: ok but I thought source code had to be free but I'm no linux expert20:36
MohammadAGmohammad@mohammad-i5laptop:~/wl1251-maemo/patches$ cat `find -name *patch | grep patch` | wc -l20:37
DocScrutinizerin fact you can charge whatever you want for sourcecode for linux that you have written yourself20:37
MohammadAGit's understandable20:37
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_trineok thanks20:37
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DocScrutinizeryou mustn't charge for sourcecode that others have written though - also if it's only parts or derived work20:38
DocScrutinizeryet you can charge for *providing* the sourcecode. That's what e.g. Suse linux did for long time with their CD/DVD based distros20:39
alteregoMohammadAG: and divide that line count by four and you probably get his actual contribution :P20:39
MohammadAGmohammad@mohammad-i5laptop:~/wl1251-maemo/patches$ cat `find -name *patch` | grep + | wc -l20:40
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_trineit seems like these people are having 2 bites at the cherry first it was neopwn everyone was asked to donate to then apparently because the neopwn person didn't pay the developer the developer wants more donations now20:40
MohammadAGmohammad@mohammad-i5laptop:~/wl1251-maemo/patches$ cat `find -name *patch` | grep \+ | grep -v +++ | wc -l20:41
MohammadAGalterego, ^20:41
alteregoYes, I saw :P20:41
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* yacc wonders if MeeGo binaries will also run on Maemo? If so, there might be hope to get a fully working Ovimaps on the n900 ;)20:42
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lcukyacc, maybe in time - have you looked at cloudgps by the way? :) its surprisingly slick20:43
alteregoOh, forgot you can't start hildon home in scratchbox arm target20:44
ShadowJKyacc: apparently ovi maps is browser plugins and a shitload of javascript20:44
DocScrutinizer_trine: so what?20:45
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_trineDocScrutinizer: is that a question ?20:45
DocScrutinizer_trine: do you think it'd be better he rm wl1251/* and dummy up?20:45
_trineDocScrutinizer: clam down your English is not understandable20:46
yaccShadowJK, well, perhaps, does not matter to me, but it's basically slow to start up, and does not provide full navigation, basically slightly worse than google maps was in Android 1.0, ...20:46
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DocScrutinizerdo you prefer the student that developed a nice driver for WL1251 - which was a lot of work for him - just discards all that because the customer that ordered that work at him didn't pay?20:47
_trineDocScrutinizer: if he sold something then didn't get paid for it why should he be able to sell it twice when others have already paid towards it20:48
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DocScrutinizerhell, he's asking for a *donation* - and you are free to donate as little as 1 ct20:48
_trineDocScrutinizer: i doubt that20:49
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_trineanyway I was only asking the question I don't want to get into a debate20:49
DocScrutinizerI doubt you have any means to force him to serve you for free20:49
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_trineI am not a linux person really so I really honestly didn't know20:50
yaccNice, managed to make pcsuite mode to startup even the vncclient on my desktop :)20:50
DocScrutinizerAnd I think he deserves some donation, as he didn't do anything odd as far as I can tell20:50
yacc_trine, actually, you can donate 1€, and then setup your own site and allow free download if you like, that's how the GPL works, ..20:51
yashaI lost the n900 icon in the desktop after flashing20:51
_trineyacc I would not want to do that20:52
yashawhere can I get it back?20:52
yaccHe basically asks for a donation for the priviledge of delivering the stuff to you.20:52
DocScrutinizeryou for sure can't argue against hosting costing money, and he's free to ask for refund of that expense, even if the work hosted wasn't any bit of his own work20:52
yacc_trine, yeah, probably not overly nice, but that's the "self-governing" that the GPL forces.20:52
yacc_trine, if the guy gets naughty and asks for brash stuff, anybody can "undercut" him.20:54
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lcuknot quite anybody  somebody who has the driver themselves...20:54
yashadid you use the driver already??20:54
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lcukyasha, if he supplied a paper printed document along with source code on cd delivered to your house would you pay more?20:56
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yacclcuk, yeah, but basically it's a simple fix, you can ask rather unreasonable fees for GPL code, but if you do so extremely, you can do probably only a small number of times, ...20:57
lcukyacc, depends20:57
lcukits quite obvious this code manages something people want20:58
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lcukand its not at a point of being generally available20:58
lcukand tbh as long as he is actually honouring the license then more power to him20:58
RST38hyacc: You do not get money for GPLed code.20:58
RST38hyacc: In fact, you do not even getmoney for supporting GPLed code, most of the time20:59
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yashadid somebody tried already?20:59
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MohammadAGhow about refreshing the thread, you asked about 5 times here already21:01
MohammadAGand yes it works21:01
yashaI also think he should get some donations21:02
yaccyeah, asking for donations is quite reasonable, considering that it's not exactly mainstream appealing code, ...21:02
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yaccit's a niche product for a product that is not really mainstream by itself (the n900).21:03
yashanobody give me an answer Moha21:03
yashanow I know21:04
yashaI'll give him a donation21:04
yashais just funny that took so long to somebody to code that stuff21:05
MohammadAGit's been available since neopwn was released, but it was closed source (and licensed under the GPL...(21:05
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yashaany way21:07
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rysiek|plguys, is there a way to *completely* erase *all* data (contacts, sms, etc) from the simcard in an n900?21:12
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yaccrysiek|pl, why the sim card?21:20
lcukrysiek|pl, what about the other information on it?21:20
lcukie its real actual phone number and stuff21:20
yaccrysiek|pl, modern mobiles, including the n900 basically do not store anything on the SIM, ...21:20
lcukdo you want to erase that too?21:20
yaccrysiek|pl, SMS are also usually automatically pulled from the SIM to the phone, as the SIM has only a limited number of buffer slots, ...21:21
* GAN900 ate way too much cheeseburger.21:22
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DocScrutinizerROAARR cheeezburger.21:33
DocScrutinizer(slots) some 821:35
DocScrutinizeryou could try if pnatd would play nice with Kandy or gnokii21:36
DocScrutinizeror would accept direct ATcmds even to erase contacts and SMS storage21:36
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DocScrutinizerfor the *complete* erase there's probably another even better method than fire: hard X-ray21:38
DocScrutinizerreliably erases all types of flash memory21:38
nox-baseband security talk in saal2 btw21:39
DocScrutinizerdamn, I was about to head out for dinner21:39
DocScrutinizerevery 7 days I need some food21:39
pupnikeating bad really isn't good21:40
DocScrutinizermeh, nothing new there. Can read up the sum-up later, or watch the video21:41
nox-the new stuff is later i think21:41
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rysiek|plyacc, lcuk: the n900 is my own; the SIM card is my employer's; now I got a new SIM (and a new number) and am supposed to return the old SIM, so I want to delete all my personal and whatnot info on the SIM to be returned21:42
yaccrysiek|pl, there is basically no personal data on the SIM card.21:42
yaccrysiek|pl, the n900 does not store any contact data on the SIM.21:43
yaccrysiek|pl, modern phones for the last decade have not done that.21:43
rysiek|plrysiek|pl: the SIM card was previously used with a different phone21:43
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rysiek|plyacc: there are personal info (contacts at the very least) on the SIM card, it has been used with different phones21:44
yaccrysiek|pl, did the last phone use a Name:/Surname:/Email:/... schema? If so it did not store the stuff on the SIM card, as the contacts on the SIM are a simple text string for "name" and one phone number per contact.21:44
yaccrysiek|pl, well, the n900 does not care for the contacts on the SIM card, I'd guess.21:44
rysiek|plyacc: could you please just get over the fact that yes there ARE personal contacts on this very sim card?21:44
DocScrutinizerwow Human Body Model surge test: 5mm spark on trying to unplug USB charger from N900. Still alive (both :-D)21:45
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rysiek|plyacc: I can put this sim card to another phone and "import" the data to the address book there. that would suggest that the info is on the SIM card, wouldn't you agree?21:45
yaccrysiek|pl, could you get over the fact that the n900 does not access the contacts at all, hence no standard program will be able to modify/delete them?21:45
rysiek|plyacc: well, had you answered directly before I would not bother you anymore :)21:46
rysiek|plyacc: and yes, n900 accesses the contacts - the "Import" feature of the Contacts app ;)21:46
yaccrysiek|pl, in theory perhaps the pnatd thing can access the contacts via AT commands, ...21:46
rysiek|plyacc: well, the "import from sim" went fine last time, so apparently it does work21:47
yaccrysiek|pl, well, it never offered me to import the SIM numbers ;)21:47
nox-now `where to look for bugs'21:47
DocScrutinizerrysiek|pl: could you please just get over the fact that N900 didn't store these contacts and has no way to delete them either21:47
yaccrysiek|pl, my contacts app has no import command, wonder why?21:47
rysiek|plDocScrutinizer: already got over that, as soon as somebody did actually directly answer the question, thanks :)21:48
rysiek|plyacc: gimme a sec, my n900 is booting21:48
yaccAh, the German localization is crazy, "pulling contacts", ...21:48
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-28 20:35:59] <DocScrutinizer> you could try if pnatd would play nice with Kandy or gnokii21:48
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-28 20:36:36] <DocScrutinizer> or would accept direct ATcmds even to erase contacts and SMS storage21:48
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-28 20:38:08] <DocScrutinizer> for the *complete* erase there's probably another even better method than fire: hard X-ray21:48
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yaccDocScrutinizer: Well, he is returning the SIM card, ....21:49
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rysiek|plDocScrutinizer: sorry, didn't notice your answers21:49
yaccDocScrutinizer: Wonder what would happen if he puts it for say 30 seconds into a microwave, ...21:49
rysiek|plDocScrutinizer: makes sense; but the SIM has to be operational (otherwise I would just shred it)21:49
yaccDocScrutinizer: You know, SIM cards go bad at the most curious moments, e.g. when he pulled it from his phone to return it :)21:49
rysiek|plyacc: fire up the Contacts app; tap the menu/top bar21:49
yaccrysiek|pl, well, shred => it's visibly dead. ;)21:49
rysiek|plyacc: yes. as I said, if I didn't have to return it21:50
yaccrysiek|pl, I found it, but it only offers import, no export, hence no way to modify SIM contacts.21:50
rysiek|plyacc: yup21:50
yaccrysiek|pl, well, the question is, why does it need to work?21:50
yaccrysiek|pl, why couldn't it just fail the day you return it, you know SIM cards have been known to go bad at the most curious times, ...21:51
yaccrysiek|pl, that's why carriers need to replace SIM cards from time to time, happened to me once or twice before, ...21:51
rysiek|plyacc: I work in a mobile platforms R&D lab at Warsaw Uni of Tech., founded by the largest polish mobile provider21:51
rysiek|plyacc: let's just say I won't play those games ;)21:51
yaccrysiek|pl, then you should know the AT commands by heart, start pnatd and see if it can modify the SIM content that way ;)21:53
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* yacc hates dumb mobiles, or to be more specific guessing around what mencoder parameters I need.21:53
rysiek|plyacc: I'm a sysadmin, so while I am able to write a chat script from memory I am not familiar with all AT commands ;)21:53
yaccDocScrutinizer: There has been a time when I would know them by heart, but that's about a decade ago ;)21:54
DocScrutinizer2 years21:54
DocScrutinizerkandy has them all, nicely listed21:54
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yaccLet's see if the dumb Samsung Star of my daughter can play videos encoded for an ipod, ...21:56
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nox-have a link DocScrutinizer? :)21:58
rysiek|plis kandy still supported and under development? I thought the project died21:58
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eppI just ordered my n900 off ebay!22:01
pupnikhow much22:02
rysiek|ploone, I suppose.22:02
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pupniki recall mercedes had this product policy similar to nokia22:03
noobmonk3yooo i'm intruiged how much they are too ;)22:03
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pupnikdesign one car and sell it for ten years22:03
pupnikat least that's how the maemo branch of the business was handled22:04
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yaccpupnik, what's wrong with this? The N900 looks quite okay compared to modern Android mobiles, ...22:06
yaccpupnik, the only thing that will be a problem at some point is the 256MB RAM thing, ...22:06
DocScrutinizer51 sorry I guess it's discontinued since kde422:09
pupnikyacc: i really don't understand selling phones, but as a nerd i'd enjoy seeing incremental improvements / variants22:10
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yaccAh, one step forward, two to the side, now that %$§& says something like "unsupported format or bitrate over" (it gets cut off before telling what the allowed bitrate might be), ...22:13
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yaccWhy, why, stupid Samsung insists on using their own OS instead of a sensible Android (even without the Google apps as the low end phones don't meet Google's requirements), ...22:15
yaccsigh, my life was so much easier without females at home, ...22:16
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epprysiek|pl, 370 USD22:19
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nox-o_O  gsm modules in cars directly connected to canbus...22:22
yaccnox-, canbus is probably not the one you want ;)22:23
nox-well thats what he mentioned22:24
nox-(the guy in saal2)22:24
nox-something called `driver assist'(?)22:25
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louis__Hi. I'm trying to transfer my contacts form my Android phone to my N900 though the "Transfer & sync" tool. The creation of the job goes fine both then it trys to get the data it just says "Failed" without any reason. Does anyone knows how to solve this problem?22:28
yacclouis__, Just sync your stuff from Google?22:29
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louis__Why can't I use the tool "Transfer & sync"? Is it buggy?22:30
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louis__yacc, yacc, Why can't I use the tool "Transfer & sync"? Is it buggy?22:32
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jacekowskilouis__: it's only for nokia phones as far as i know22:39
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louis__jacekowski: Okey. Thanks.22:40
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DocScrutinizernox-: kdepim3-mobile [ Pfad: /opt/kde3/bin/kandy, Repository: zypp (kde3) ]  sudo zypper install kdepim3-mobile22:47
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nox-ah, thx22:48
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DocScrutinizernox-: yacc: what's wrong with canbus? Except it's a bus made for Controllers, not for raw data transfer like in IP / PPP or whatever22:58
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nox-well the talk was about gsm stack security holes exploitable over the `air'...22:59
DocScrutinizerOTA vs CANBUS? strange22:59
nox-so attacker gets control of baseband cpu -> can talk to canbus22:59
DocScrutinizerI might think about arbitrary GSM modules attacking the ABS I'm going to develop, via CANBUS :-D23:00
nox-(just as a possiblilty, but a scary one :)23:00
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DocScrutinizerindeed that'd need more than just one braindead vulnerability in canbus linked controllers23:01
RST38h"App store milestones: Windows Phone 7 hits 5,000 as Android passes 200,000 available apps"23:02
RST38hWhat is this craziness anyway?23:02
DocScrutinizerABS can't get triggered via canbus usually. As GSM OTA can't access canbus at all23:02
yaccDocScrutinizer: It's a bus that is really not very useful for random data transfers, OTOH, it does make sure that each device that you've designed into it get's the allocated amount of wire time ;)23:03
DocScrutinizerI know canbus23:03
DocScrutinizerI'm supposed to, to work in industry on development of canbus controlled ABS23:03
DocScrutinizerESP, whatever23:04
DocScrutinizeraen't TLAs nice? Electronic Stability Program pretends to equip the car with Extra Sensorical Perception :-P23:06
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yaccDocScrutinizer: 9 months in Munich in the industry as a freelancer, and I have to admit that I wonder why cars designed this way even manage to start the engine ;)23:07
BCMMRST38h: counts of things in "app stores" fail to account for what fraction don't actually do anything, but instead present basically static information from the website of a band or a shop or something23:07
DocScrutinizeryacc: Munich? nice, seems I will foolow up your footsteps23:08
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aptHi crashanddie! I'm infobot's stand-in. If infobot resurrects, please /kick me23:16
aptHi crashanddie! I'm infobot's stand-in. If infobot resurrects, please /kick me23:16
keriowait, what23:17
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tybollt_~sod off23:18
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BCMM - heh, i wonder if you could use this to use an old-fashioned phone as a handset23:27
BCMM(found while looking for unrelated USB things)23:27
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alteregoOoo, cake23:29
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nox-BCMM, also the modem would need voice commands, but maybe those are really standard nowadays...23:36
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DocScrutinizererr what's wrong with apt now. She's stammering23:57
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DocScrutinizerhmmm OK -
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