| GeneralAntilles | Anidel, you can also catch a bit of my head and shoulder in Sebastian's frat shot on tigert's photostream. ;) | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| Gadgetoid | crashanddie, aggreed on sennheisers | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigert/4160666201/ | 00:00 |
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| Anidel | these two are fine and I can confirm you exist :p well.. that at least there exist somebody who claim it's the ga on IRC and t.m.o | 00:00 |
| Anidel | :p | 00:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anidel, here too: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigert/4166413835/ | 00:01 |
| RST38h | Anidel: Hey, Myrrti was asking for the comeback of the normal xournal UI today | 00:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 00:01 |
| Anidel | crash everything's fine.. just miss the weather in Barcelona | 00:01 |
| RST38h | Anidel: Any better idea when? =) | 00:01 |
| * GeneralAntilles isn't just a figment on the internet! | 00:01 | |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, it was really bizarre. | 00:01 |
| Gadgetoid | the almighty general? a figment? | 00:01 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: i thought you were a bot until pictures showed up | 00:01 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, it's like, "Well, can you find somebody else to film around?" | 00:01 |
| Anidel | rst38h: I'll prepare a wiki page on maemo.org about that.. need some time to re-organize it and schedule everything | 00:01 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigert/4159208145/in/photostream/ - neat | 00:01 |
| derf | Stskeeps: They're probably shopped. | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Anidel: ack. | 00:02 |
| derf | You can tell because of the pixels. | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, indeed. | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Maybe e is a physical bot! | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Dalek in disguise | 00:02 |
| Gadgetoid | a mechanical turk? | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | SpeedEvil, yeah, was wondering around BCN at night looking for a place to eat with VDVsx, andy80 and yerga and walked past that in the dark. | 00:02 |
| Anidel | I've got very nice feedback there and Xournal will improve a lot in usabilty... next Qt version (yes there will be one) will have..how they say it "next generation UI"? | 00:02 |
| Anidel | :) | 00:02 |
| Anidel | dinner's ready! | 00:02 |
| Anidel | ttyl | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | SpeedEvil, I looked up and my mouth dropped open. | 00:03 |
| SpeedEvil | GeneralAntilles: It looks disney. | 00:03 |
| Gadgetoid | oooo xournal polishing? yummy | 00:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | SpeedEvil, I then commented on the fact that in the city I grew up in my 1920s neighborhood is one of the oldest in the city. :D | 00:03 |
| RST38h | Anidel: just bring back all the old options into the current version first =) | 00:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | tigert, why the low resolution on your Flickr stuff, by the way? | 00:03 |
| SpeedEvil | ;) | 00:03 |
| Gadgetoid | it drives me nuts how xounal handles, or rather doesn't, word wrapping | 00:04 |
| Gadgetoid | otherwise it's a cracking app | 00:04 |
| Eightace | :) | 00:05 |
| aSIMULAtor | nomnom? | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Anyone knows the URL of the DDP eStore order tracking page? | 00:05 |
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| mikhas | GeneralAntilles, perhaps full resolution would have been too expensive for his data plan? IIRC he was uploading everything instantly | 00:06 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, I just had it. | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, think you can go to home. | 00:06 |
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| RST38h | and? | 00:06 |
| RST38h | I see no tracking link :( | 00:07 |
| aSIMULAtor | cause he has some print quality photos on his flickr and i'm guessing he doesn't want to share those print quality photos in high res | 00:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, or maybe MyAccount | 00:07 |
| mikhas | evil =) | 00:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | One second. | 00:07 |
| RST38h | hmmm | 00:07 |
| javispedro | RST38h: can't sleep eh? :) | 00:07 |
| javispedro | RST38h: I just copied a folder and the entire build system broke | 00:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, https://pro.forum.nokia.com/getUserServiceOrders.do | 00:07 |
| RST38h | javispedro: almost asleep, gotta read some Mieville and shut myself down | 00:08 |
| RST38h | general: Thanks! | 00:08 |
| RST38h | ahaaaaa! | 00:08 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: wankers | 00:08 |
| woglinde | rst when will ir arrive? | 00:09 |
| crashanddie | we need more mods on tmo :( | 00:10 |
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| RST38h | woglinde: mine does not appear to be shipped yet | 00:11 |
| crashanddie | what we need is a mod system that only gives you x actions per day/week | 00:11 |
| woglinde | rst oh | 00:11 |
| SpeedEvil | crashanddie: What does it pay? | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | woglinde: then it will hit christmas and get lost I am afraid :( | 00:11 |
| woglinde | sure | 00:11 |
| crashanddie | SpeedEvil: a line in your posts and a lot of shit from users | 00:11 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 00:11 |
| woglinde | with luck in the new year | 00:11 |
| derf | crashanddie: So, you want to make /.? | 00:11 |
| crashanddie | derf: I didn't say anyone got to moderate | 00:12 |
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| RST38h | woglinde: I do have a loaned preproduction unit, so not a roadblock to development, just a minor annoyance | 00:12 |
| crashanddie | derf: just double the amount of mods, but relieve their functions after some time/actions so they don't burn out | 00:12 |
| woglinde | rst ah okay | 00:12 |
| derf | If you limit how much action a moderator can take, you necessarily lower your standards for moderators. | 00:12 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: you know there is an easier way to handle it? | 00:12 |
| crashanddie | RST38h: how so then? | 00:13 |
| woglinde | seems I should have travel to amsterdam too | 00:13 |
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| crashanddie | derf: what do you mean? | 00:13 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: genocyde. | 00:13 |
| * RST38h laughes heartily | 00:13 | |
| crashanddie | RST38h: or maybe we could create an underground fora, with only a few people, the ones who are really worth it | 00:13 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: actually, I suggested that on multiple occassions | 00:13 |
| crashanddie | we'll start out as a secret organisation, and only people who pass the test get access | 00:13 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: it is the sanest of options | 00:14 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: reading open for everyone, posting by invitation only | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, I say we just give root access to Darius. | 00:14 |
| derf | crashanddie: I thought that's what _this_ was. | 00:14 |
| crashanddie | we'll get together every 3 full moons, in a secret base just off the m25 near ipswitch, an old nuclear bunker | 00:14 |
| RST38h | General: You of all people should know that Darius is undergoing his seasonal maintenance at some Polish bedlam | 00:15 |
| crashanddie | and then we'll gang bang the 3 only girls that were silly enough to join our ranks, and share memories from when tmo used to be cool and elitist during our collective post-coital glow | 00:15 |
| RST38h | So, he is unavailable! | 00:15 |
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| woglinde | lol | 00:15 |
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| RST38h | But yes, I do suggest we seriously consider idea of one-two subforums that are invitation only | 00:16 |
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| crashanddie | some will say we are a sect of some sort, that we should be stopped, we will get jailed, and some of us even burnt on a stake, but in our hearts we will know we were true to ourselves | 00:16 |
| RST38h | Either that, or genocyde, or you start breeding cranky moderators who still end up with genocyde | 00:16 |
| mikhas | The only thing I'd really need, on top of thread subscriptions: a service (email) that announces new threads to me (only from selected forums, of course). then, I would decide which ones to follow. perhaps the mail would be formatted in such a way that I delete all threads from it I dont want to follow, and just send it back .... | 00:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, man, I can just see geneven running with that idea. | 00:17 |
| javispedro | just put up a random .deb file in tmo which triggers battery explosion in n900 | 00:17 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: not sure what you are driving at, I am mostly after very practical goal of keeping signal to noise ratio off the epsilon mark | 00:17 |
| javispedro | and let the problem fix itself | 00:17 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i think most of the crowded-news issue is due to the reliance of people using "New Posts". | 00:18 |
| RST38h | javis <-- took words out of my mouth | 00:18 |
| mikhas | if such a email would come to me once a day ... | 00:18 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: I am not talking of news. | 00:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, I'd prefer it uploading GPS coordinates and nuking those locations from orbit. | 00:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's the only way to be sure. | 00:18 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i meant crowded-forums | 00:18 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: I am talking of hordes of people infinitely repeating the same false rumors or half-correct instructions for bricking their devices | 00:18 |
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| crashanddie | RST38h: I was being satirical because most "secret organisations" inside communities fail miserably -- they believe they beat the system, but they're just asocial nerds who think they're being original | 00:18 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: meh, wasn't it like this a year ago on tmo anyway? | 00:19 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:19 |
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| RST38h | crashanddie: no need to make it secret, just make people take a sentience test | 00:19 |
| kevloral | javispedro: so you basically want to turn a n900 into an iPhone, right? :-) | 00:19 |
| javispedro | RST38h: whishing those "half-correct" instructions were "fully-correct" instructions to brick their devices :) | 00:19 |
| crashanddie | instead, just concentrate your efforts on making the community a more interesting place -- trolls die young | 00:19 |
| javispedro | oh kevloral, now I remember you! | 00:19 |
| Stskeeps | crashanddie: agreed | 00:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anidel, I forgot to thank samantha for the art work, by the way. | 00:20 |
| crashanddie | RST38h: if you want to better the signal to noise ratio, don't prevent noise from being generated, just create more signal! | 00:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anidel, wearing (and digging) the t-shirt as we speak. | 00:20 |
| RST38h | crashanddie: this does not work | 00:20 |
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| convulted | good day all! | 00:20 |
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| RST38h | crashanddie: not at the current concentrations of eager but clueless people | 00:21 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ugh, -developers is up to 250 unread. | 00:21 |
| Xisdibik | Ugh indeed GeneralAntilles | 00:21 |
| * javispedro uses Pan to read -developers | 00:22 | |
| * GeneralAntilles didn't read enough email over the weekend. | 00:22 | |
| RST38h | crashanddie: you can still do it in a separate semi-controlled subforum, but not in an open forum where 90% of people joined in the last 3 months and 70% of them do not have actual devices | 00:22 |
| kevloral | javispedro: yep, I remember you too. | 00:22 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Let's just strap crashanddie to a chair Clockwork Orange-style and make him moderate. | 00:22 |
| mikhas | =) | 00:22 |
| javispedro | kevloral: was trying to pm you, but I guess your client is ignoring pms too | 00:22 |
| crashanddie | me a moderator? Man you're in for a ride | 00:22 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lol | 00:23 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: that being said, the clockwork orange style is strangely compeling | 00:23 |
| javispedro | moderator! | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, well, there are two possible outcomes. | 00:23 |
| crashanddie | one certain out-cum | 00:23 |
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| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, wrong scene, sorry. | 00:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | The one later. :P | 00:24 |
| crashanddie | haha | 00:24 |
| RST38h | "When eaten, there are two possible outcomes!" | 00:24 |
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| RST38h | ok, now I am really out | 00:24 |
| timeless_mbp | !seen qwerty | 00:25 |
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| javispedro | ~ping | 00:25 |
| javispedro | infobot's still dead | 00:25 |
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| pillar | hmm it seems that network doesn't work from my maemo5 sdk xephyr, is there something that should be setup beforehand? network works in the virtual machine and scratchbox | 00:26 |
| cehteh | did you fixed /etc/resolv.conf ? | 00:27 |
| woglinde | 3pillar check resolv.conf | 00:27 |
| mikhas | pillar, check your /scratchbox/resolv.conf | 00:27 |
| cehteh | hehe | 00:27 |
| mikhas | the problem becomes appearant on laptops, where you often change networks but sbox sticks with the wrong resolv.conf | 00:27 |
| cehteh | debugging by voting :) | 00:27 |
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| mikhas | just coping the recent one to /scratchbox/resolv.conf + relogin to sbox should solve it | 00:28 |
| javispedro | so, just install pdnsd o dnsmasq and fix the problem | 00:28 |
| mikhas | hm | 00:28 |
| pillar | whoa, didn't expect so many answers all at once :) I think it is okay, since the network works in scratchbox? it is just inside xephyr that when my app tries to connect it won't work | 00:28 |
| javispedro | "inside xephyr" doesn't make much sense | 00:29 |
| javispedro | unless you're talking about graphics. xephyr only handles graphics. | 00:29 |
| cehteh | thats fairly impossible xephyr just displays apps | 00:29 |
| pillar | javispedro I realise that, I don't know what is a correct way to say this, I don't like to call it an emulator | 00:29 |
| mikhas | I can install apps from the hildon-desktop app man when running in xephyr .... | 00:29 |
| javispedro | pillar: you called it scratchbox already, that's fine. | 00:30 |
| cehteh | pillar: xephyr is only the 'nested' Xserver | 00:30 |
| pillar | what I mean is that I am running my app in the scratchbox, which is shown in xephyr | 00:30 |
| Anidel | back | 00:30 |
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| pillar | but scratchbox command line network works just fine, not in my app or for example the web browser in maemo5 "emulator" | 00:31 |
| Anidel | generalantilles: just thanked Samantha for you :) she's happy about that! | 00:31 |
| javispedro | pillar: which network tools work? | 00:31 |
| pillar | javispedro wget, scp | 00:31 |
| pillar | apt-get | 00:32 |
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| pillar | it wasn't working at one point, so I did copy resolv.conf, but that has been days | 00:32 |
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| javispedro | pillar: so this is your app's problem... because you're probably waiting for icd2 to signal there's internet -- like the app mgr does. | 00:33 |
| Gadgetoid | crashanddie mod me, i'm not around often enough to abuse the power | 00:33 |
| Gadgetoid | or... really... ever | 00:33 |
| javispedro | pillar: or maybe you missed some resolv.conf files | 00:34 |
| javispedro | in the /scratchbox directory | 00:34 |
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| pillar | javispedro: ok, how do I achieve that then? I mean, there has to be a way to debug apps that require network connection | 00:34 |
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| Xisdibik | Is anyone here using DosBox on their trusty N900's? | 00:34 |
| luke-jr | "trusty" is not a word I'd use for N900 | 00:35 |
| luke-jr | can't trust something with blobs | 00:35 |
| Gadgetoid | mine's been pretty trusty thus far | 00:35 |
| javispedro | Xisdibik: ...yes? | 00:36 |
| crashanddie | Gadgetoid: you talk to me like I have any powers on the fora | 00:36 |
| javispedro | pillar: don't remember the connection detection details, so try do the resolv.conf one first | 00:36 |
| Gadgetoid | can i ask more than for the ability to idle irc all day on wifi with something that fits in my pocket | 00:36 |
| pillar | mine too, I don't know how people have this thing rebooting all the time, I have only had a couple and they have been because battery ran out | 00:36 |
| javispedro | pillar: find every resolv.conf file under /scratchbox and check if they're fixed | 00:36 |
| pillar | javispedro: ok I'll do that thanks | 00:37 |
| Gadgetoid | crashanddie I haven't got the foggiest what powers anyone has.... and don't really care... unless they can see through clothing | 00:37 |
| hardaker2 | I reboot mine only once in a while, usually to recover memory as at some point pdfreader won't open docs any longer. Other than that, it's been very stable. | 00:37 |
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| hardaker2 | but I want a bigger battery. | 00:37 |
| Gadgetoid | just use a portable top up charger hardaker2 | 00:38 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: go boy, go: | 00:38 |
| crashanddie | shit, ctrl paste afil | 00:38 |
| hardaker2 | Gadgetoid: ugh. | 00:38 |
| crashanddie | fail | 00:38 |
| crashanddie | aargggh | 00:38 |
| Gadgetoid | also called a netbook | 00:38 |
| Xisdibik | javispedro: is there a fix for the keys that dont work? | 00:38 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: go boy, go: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=36344 | 00:38 |
| Xisdibik | javispedro: as i cant get a / which makes it hard to mount stuff :) | 00:38 |
| javispedro | Xisdibik: see http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35244 | 00:38 |
| Xisdibik | arigatou javispedro | 00:38 |
| javispedro | Xisdibik: the answer is "not yet", though | 00:39 |
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| Xisdibik | you still need your 30 minutes? ;) | 00:39 |
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| javispedro | yeah, had to fill today's free 30 minutes with searching some "lost thread" in a 5 GiB phpBB database because of a phpBB glitch. | 00:40 |
| convulted | Developer question: Can I do something to get a hildon pannablearea to jerk less when doing inertial scrolling of an image? | 00:40 |
| Xisdibik | javispedro: yuck, that doesnt sound fun :/ | 00:40 |
| Gadgetoid | woah a dude from WinCE wondering why the n900 lacks polished core functionality ... which it doesnt anyway | 00:41 |
| Gadgetoid | the iphone is soooo boooring | 00:43 |
| Xisdibik | lack of polished core functionality? | 00:43 |
| Ceron^ | its impossible to copy stuff | 00:43 |
| woglinde | Gadgetoid lol | 00:43 |
| Ceron^ | with pc suite | 00:43 |
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| Ceron^ | to phone.. | 00:43 |
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| pillar | javispedro: I think I got it working, you were right, there was still one resolv.conf with wrong settings | 00:43 |
| Ceron^ | how to access samba shared folder | 00:43 |
| Ceron^ | from n900 | 00:43 |
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| Ceron^ | i hate this pc-suite crap | 00:43 |
| Gadgetoid | well complaining that people keep saying "get an ipod" or "get an iphone" every time someone criticises the n900 | 00:43 |
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| javispedro | Ceron^: no way so far, unless someone uploaded samba to extras | 00:44 |
| mikhas | Ceron^, without smbclient? you dont. but I heard it is easy to compile. | 00:44 |
| Ceron^ | :( | 00:44 |
| Gadgetoid | use ftp Ceron | 00:44 |
| Ceron^ | i cant even get one ftp! | 00:44 |
| javispedro | or sftp | 00:44 |
| Ceron^ | mp3 | 00:44 |
| Ceron^ | lol | 00:44 |
| Ceron^ | uplaoded with pc suite | 00:44 |
| javispedro | use the cable and mass storage mode | 00:44 |
| Gadgetoid | i use ftp to grab files to my n900... or bittorrent | 00:44 |
| javispedro | they put mass storage for a reason. say no to pc suite mode (just in case some uy decides in the future to only have "pc suite" mode) | 00:45 |
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| Ceron^ | ooh :D | 00:45 |
| Ceron^ | mass storage mode | 00:45 |
| Ceron^ | works fine thx | 00:45 |
| javispedro | s/uy/guy | 00:45 |
| hardaker2 | scp: easiest way to go. | 00:45 |
| Ceron^ | always tried pc suite way | 00:45 |
| hardaker2 | or even sshfs if you really want (I've done it) | 00:45 |
| * hardaker2 goes off to port the NFS modules. | 00:45 | |
| ali1234 | i like to use scp over wifi | 00:46 |
| Gadgetoid | haha sshfs | 00:46 |
| javispedro | "port" the nfs modules? | 00:46 |
| woglinde | hardaker2 there is nothing to port | 00:46 |
| ali1234 | anyway, new psx4all video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUdRFapNLDI | 00:46 |
| woglinde | you can even use samba | 00:46 |
| Gadgetoid | i will stick with my softy ftp solution :) | 00:46 |
| hardaker2 | I haven't actually tried; I'm just surprised no one mentioned it so I figured nokia left them out by default. | 00:46 |
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| javispedro | ~seen pupnik | 00:46 |
| javispedro | this reminds me | 00:47 |
| woglinde | javis lol | 00:47 |
| woglinde | ~seen bot | 00:47 |
| javispedro | where's qwerty? | 00:47 |
| javispedro | didn't see him for a while? | 00:47 |
| Gadgetoid | seen the n900s tilde key | 00:47 |
| VDVsx | javispedro, spot him a while back at tmo | 00:47 |
| javispedro | ali1234: good job! | 00:47 |
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| ali1234 | i just found out the psx4all git repo is a year and a half old | 00:48 |
| ali1234 | i bet they have faster code by now | 00:48 |
| javispedro | that happens, email the maintainers | 00:49 |
| javispedro | (i personally find the gp2x/pandora a bit sloppy on that regard) | 00:49 |
| ali1234 | yeah, zod is on holiday for xmas tho | 00:49 |
| javispedro | *the xxx guys | 00:49 |
| integer` | where i can find nfs-client for n800 ? | 00:49 |
| Gadgetoid | Pandora is god!!!!!!!!! heathen | 00:49 |
| woglinde | integer? | 00:49 |
| woglinde | integer just compile mount and nfs modul | 00:50 |
| integer` | there is now any repo with already compiled? | 00:50 |
| javispedro | i think there is, for diablo. | 00:50 |
| integer` | s/now/no/ | 00:51 |
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| * ali1234 waits for all the "zomg where i get file?" comments | 00:51 | |
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| javispedro | ali1234: ah yeah, welcome to the emulator porters club. get your spam filters ready. | 00:52 |
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| woglinde | compiled kernel with nfs-module is not in the repo right | 00:53 |
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| javispedro | there's no need to recompile the kernel | 00:53 |
| Anidel | wanna walk into Pompeii's ruins? http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=pompeii,+italy+ruins&sll=40.716428,14.537315&sspn=0.061672,0.132351&ie=UTF8&hq=pompeii,+italy+ruins&hnear=&ll=40.748902,14.484834&spn=0,359.991728&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=40.748902,14.484834&panoid=1e-bu_kis-dL1BnVGZhDdw&cbp=12,209.48,,0,7.63 | 00:53 |
| woglinde | javis only modul? | 00:53 |
| javispedro | woglinde: module, and maybe nfs-utils or portmap | 00:54 |
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| javispedro | oh hi Anidel! | 00:54 |
| Anidel | hi Javi | 00:54 |
| Ceron^ | how to get "newest messages on desktop" | 00:54 |
| Ceron^ | on the n900 | 00:54 |
| Ceron^ | :l | 00:54 |
| Anidel | uploading 112Mb of images to flickr.com via N900..let's see | 00:55 |
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| redeeman | hardaker2: are fuse compiled in on the n900? | 00:56 |
| cehteh | yes | 00:57 |
| redeeman | so all i need to do is get sshfs compiled for armel? | 00:57 |
| cehteh | isnt that already packaged? | 00:58 |
| cehteh | maybe extras-* devel or testing | 00:58 |
| redeeman | not in standard extras atleast | 00:58 |
| redeeman | in -devel it is, nice | 01:00 |
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| hardaker2 | redeeman: no... I mount the other direction. from my linux desktop to the n900 | 01:11 |
| hardaker2 | I don't know about the reverse as I haven't tried it. | 01:11 |
| redeeman | apparently its there | 01:11 |
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| pwnguin | is there a flashlight widget? something to turn on the camera leds and leave them on for extended periods of time? | 01:15 |
| pwnguin | (for n900) | 01:16 |
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| pwnguin | hmm. liqtorch and moodlight claim to have flashlight modes, but i'd need to enable extras-testing? | 01:18 |
| redeeman | you could probably make a simple shellscript | 01:18 |
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| redeeman | they are probably controlled via the leds class | 01:18 |
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| archebyte | hello all | 01:18 |
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| pwnguin | which shell scripts are object oriented? | 01:18 |
| redeeman | anyone that knows if the community provided qt4 can set portrait mode? | 01:18 |
| pwnguin | i guess perl, but bleh | 01:19 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: you do not need objected oriented to do that | 01:19 |
| redeeman | but i can tell how how the leds framework works | 01:19 |
| redeeman | basically its just a file | 01:19 |
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| redeeman | and you write a value in it, to control the led strength | 01:19 |
| tKMFDM | does the maemo 4 evince package work on the n900? | 01:19 |
| redeeman | (some leds only support on/off though) | 01:19 |
| pwnguin | sorry, i thought you had a specific meaning for class | 01:19 |
| archebyte | did the nintendo emulator disappear from extras-testing? | 01:20 |
| redeeman | pwnguin: ah, i mean a class in linux | 01:20 |
| redeeman | pwnguin: the kernel | 01:20 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: look at /sys/class/leds | 01:20 |
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| pwnguin | redeeman: the most kernel hacking ive done is a MINIX course | 01:20 |
| archebyte | I remember installing it a few weeks ago.. it was name iNES or something.. | 01:20 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: you need not touch the kernel source at all, you just manage the devices via files | 01:20 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: then i guess it's a shell script after all ;) | 01:21 |
| redeeman | or a c++ app if you want :P | 01:21 |
| pwnguin | but i think liqtorch does what i need? | 01:21 |
| redeeman | hmm i might write such an app | 01:21 |
| redeeman | oh i don't know that app | 01:21 |
| pwnguin | me either | 01:21 |
| redeeman | do you have a link? | 01:21 |
| pwnguin | http://maemo.org/packages/view/liqtorch/ | 01:22 |
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| pwnguin | the question is, how dangerous is extras-testing, really? | 01:22 |
| redeeman | only as much as the stuff you install | 01:23 |
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| pwnguin | so how exactly does this thing work? | 01:23 |
| pwnguin | can i upload a new liqtorch with higher version? | 01:23 |
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| pwnguin | or is that package owned by the maintaner? | 01:23 |
| n900ev1l | I have had no major issues with testing | 01:24 |
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| pwnguin | ie, can someone without clue upgrade libraries or python or something | 01:24 |
| pwnguin | i know ubuntu's still struggling somewhat with group permissions | 01:24 |
| redeeman | just looked at liqtorch source | 01:25 |
| redeeman | does not appear to have any code to turn on/off the lights | 01:25 |
| redeeman | i cant even gather what that thing does | 01:26 |
| n900ev1l | liqtorch just displays a white screen I thought | 01:26 |
| redeeman | yeah i think so too | 01:27 |
| pwnguin | hmm | 01:27 |
| redeeman | it certainly doesn't poke sysfs | 01:27 |
| redeeman | i'll look at the moodlight code | 01:27 |
| pwnguin | i dont think moodlight does it either | 01:27 |
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| pwnguin | did the n810 have a camera | 01:27 |
| redeeman | moodlight also appears to just display stuff | 01:28 |
| redeeman | well pwnguin, it should be easy to make a program that can turn it on/off | 01:28 |
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| n900ev11 | liqtorch just displays a white screen I thought | 01:29 |
| Gadgetoid | pwnguin, what do you mean "did" | 01:29 |
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| javispedro | well, #maemo has been divided already... when's tmo scission? | 01:30 |
| * n900ev11 wishes there was a way to not connect to a net that you explicitly disconnected from. | 01:30 | |
| Gadgetoid | n810 is in its prime, awesome tablet, good library of software and cheap spare batteries... and a crappy front camera with littlem practical use | 01:31 |
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| Gadgetoid | although i pretty much only use mine as an ebook reader now | 01:32 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: damn, seems like its not registered in the leds framework | 01:33 |
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| woglinde | hm there is something wrong in the sdk somehow | 01:34 |
| woglinde | linking with -L /usr/lib -lX11 dont works really | 01:34 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: maybe it's tied into the camera chip directly? | 01:34 |
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| woglinde | problem with libXdmcp.so.6.0.0 | 01:35 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: that's a definite possibility, theres no other good reason not to have it there | 01:35 |
| pwnguin | Gadgetoid: as in the n810 is in the past, and n900 is the future :P | 01:35 |
| pwnguin | (for six months) | 01:35 |
| redeeman | that would be somewhat annoying though, i used the light alot on my previous phone | 01:35 |
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| Arkenoi | btw is 810 still in production? | 01:37 |
| woglinde | Arkenoi dont think so | 01:37 |
| Gadgetoid | i wubb my n810... fbreader will have to improve in leaps and bounds on the n900 before i retire it | 01:37 |
| paddy_melon | Hey guys... what products other then the NITs/n900s run Maemo... I'd love an n810 or n800 but... it's out of my price range... I can't find anything on google. Any help? | 01:37 |
| woglinde | anyone intressed in imagemagick for fremantle? | 01:38 |
| pwnguin | paddy_melon: there's like an n700, but thats really pushing history | 01:38 |
| pwnguin | woglinde: why not use graphicsmagick | 01:38 |
| paddy_melon | pwnguin... hasn't Maemo been ported to other devices? | 01:38 |
| woglinde | pwnguin because the package I really wanted has dep against libmagick++ | 01:39 |
| pwnguin | paddy_melon: you want mer, the open source version | 01:39 |
| redeeman | woglinde: chances are it will work with graphicsmagick aswell | 01:39 |
| paddy_melon | ok... what runs mer then? | 01:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | (<pwnguin> redeeman: maybe it's tied into the camera chip directly?) you bet it is | 01:39 |
| woglinde | maybee it has the same deps as imagemagick | 01:40 |
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| redeeman | DocScrutinizer: that's bad | 01:40 |
| pwnguin | woglinde: if it's tied to a lib, it needs symbols to be the same; i know theres a compatible cli, not sure if the libs are too | 01:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | thought about putting fotoflash LED to purpose as well | 01:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer | think you need to talk camera into lighting it up | 01:41 |
| redeeman | DocScrutinizer: that's a huge fuckup on nokias part, it should have been outside the cover, and able to be turned on at will | 01:41 |
| Xisdibik | Welcome SpeedEvi1 | 01:41 |
| pwnguin | paddy_melon: name a device that's like the n800 | 01:41 |
| woglinde | hm same deps despit of openexr | 01:41 |
| woglinde | openexr segfaults at compiling | 01:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | redeeman: I agree | 01:41 |
| paddy_melon | pwnguin... I'm not sure... say a Q5 or other MID? | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | basically | 01:42 |
| pwnguin | paddy_melon: there's also a #mer channel | 01:42 |
| paddy_melon | ok | 01:42 |
| * SpeedEvi1 sighs. | 01:42 | |
| paddy_melon | thanks | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvi1: ehazzup? | 01:42 |
| pwnguin | its mostly populated by users whose devices have been left behind | 01:42 |
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| pwnguin | paddy_melon: "*" | 01:43 |
| pwnguin | Mer runs on : 770, N800, N810, FreeRunner, SmartQ5, SmartQ7, Beagleboard, and to some degree on Zaurus, Loox; we'd like to support other devices too... talk to us. | 01:43 |
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| SpeedEvi1 | rede: it's a seperate led driver chip on the IWOMAN bus | 01:43 |
| pwnguin | i know it ran on my virtualbox | 01:43 |
| SpeedEvi1 | err | 01:43 |
| SpeedEvi1 | I2C | 01:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvi1: for the fotoflash? | 01:44 |
| pwnguin | how do you screw up IWOMAN and i2c? | 01:44 |
| pwnguin | those keys are nowhere near each other | 01:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvi1: well I dunno for sure. but usually you control those from cam directly | 01:45 |
| redeeman | i wonder whom one should contact within nokia to have them not do this shit on next device | 01:45 |
| SpeedEvi1 | docs: apparantly | 01:45 |
| pwnguin | also, who decided to abbreviate iic i2c? | 01:45 |
| Gadgetoid | tell them the stand sucks bals whilst you are at it redeeman | 01:45 |
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| redeeman | haha yeah it does | 01:46 |
| SpeedEvi1 | pwn: autocomplete | 01:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | pwnguin: EE did that looong ago | 01:46 |
| pwnguin | DocScrutinizer: it saves no space! | 01:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | EE folks even | 01:46 |
| Gadgetoid | i mean hardcore superballs... how the fuck did it pass muster... its useless | 01:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | as does A2DP | 01:46 |
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| Gadgetoid | i uaw my n810 to prop up my n900 | 01:46 |
| pwnguin | at least w3c is shorter than wwwc | 01:46 |
| SpeedEvi1 | also - drill 2 holes, fill with clear, and you have leds | 01:46 |
| SpeedEvi1 | however | 01:47 |
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| SpeedEvi1 | flash leds probably aren't continually rated | 01:47 |
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| redeeman | SpeedEvil: perhaps not, but the ones on my SE phones have been running for more than 24 hours straight once | 01:48 |
| redeeman | and i've been using the led atleast ~10 min every day for more than a year | 01:48 |
| redeeman | it uses one of those special weird leds | 01:48 |
| woglinde | args graphmagics drags in transfig which needs texlive | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | Oh. | 01:48 |
| redeeman | nokia could use those aswell | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: it's compromises | 01:48 |
| lbt | night all | 01:48 |
| redeeman | one of those are atleast as powerful as the two the nokia have | 01:48 |
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| SpeedEvil | redeeman: power LEDs are quite hard to heatsink right | 01:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvi1: yes, but seems you can dim it to a 100% duty cycle | 01:48 |
| pwnguin | transfig? | 01:49 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: that's REALLY powerful ones | 01:49 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: And some have very limited rated lifes. As in a couple of hours. | 01:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | As they are intended for flash use. | 01:49 |
| pwnguin | woglinde: as a build-dep? | 01:50 |
| redeeman | well.. again, the ONE in my SE phone has been in use ~10 min every day for a year, and sometimes i forgot it on for more than a day, and it works fine | 01:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: but lifetime goes thru the roof if you go down to maybe 25% of max power | 01:50 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: yes | 01:50 |
| redeeman | and its as powerful as the two in the N900 | 01:50 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: sure. Powerful is quite irrelevant. | 01:50 |
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| SpeedEvil | redeeman: The important fact is the datasheets of the LED involved, and the heatsinking. | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | redeeman: that means exactly nuttin | 01:51 |
| lardman|home | re | 01:51 |
| redeeman | DocScrutinizer: it means that nokia could do the same, that's what my point is | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: yo | 01:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Having said that - at 25% output, I'd be quite comfortable saying it's ok. | 01:51 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: There are always compromises. | 01:51 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: except you can build it cheap or reliable | 01:51 |
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| redeeman | yes well.. this is one there didn't have to be | 01:51 |
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| redeeman | pwnguin: i doubt its cheaper that way | 01:51 |
| redeeman | and its certainly not unreliable | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: size/space/heatsinking/cost/life are a real tradeoff for LEDs. | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: and yes, it is actually cheaper that way in some cases. | 01:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: make that 10% and you bet you're safe side of fence | 01:52 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: have you ever priced bright leds? | 01:52 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: theres no heatsink on that led, and life has been exceptional, and MANY other people do that | 01:52 |
| jebba | why can't i do something like? wget --no-check-certificate https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/mr0/kernel_2.6.28-20094102.3+0m5_armel.deb I feel i'm missing something obvious? I just want to grab the stock kernel debs.... | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: And that is one LED, of one design, it says little about others. | 01:52 |
| redeeman | pwnguin: im not talking those insane leds, it costs maybe $2-4 in retail for such a LED, when nokia buys, ALOT less | 01:52 |
| lardman|home | jebba: why not grab them from extras? | 01:53 |
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| lardman|home | or the standard repo? | 01:53 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: what it says is that its doable, and its something that adds alot of use | 01:53 |
| jebba | nvm http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/k/kernel/ | 01:53 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: Shaving $.5 off the cost of a LED circuit by overdriving it is _IMPORTANT_ if you're making phones. | 01:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | redeeman: I'm actually not interested in that utterly non-EE approach to the issue | 01:53 |
| redeeman | i would have paid $10 more for this | 01:53 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: And no, things that are not key design factors for the phone are not specced. | 01:53 |
| redeeman | this is a key feature, its something many people use | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: So you can't say you can safely use the LEDs 100% of the time, or plug it directly into a car battery, or use it to open walnuts. | 01:54 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: im sure you would, but everyone has a different ten dollar addon, and the end result is a phone nobody can afford | 01:54 |
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| redeeman | who said they needed to say any garantuee? | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: that does not matter. What matters if, at spec time - the 'LEDs must run continuously' was in there. | 01:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: thaks. couldn't have put it better | 01:54 |
| redeeman | who said it must run continously? | 01:54 |
| redeeman | nobody did, except you | 01:55 |
| redeeman | i said the SE phone CAN | 01:55 |
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| pwnguin | you want to trigger a flash? | 01:55 |
| redeeman | theres a distinct difference | 01:55 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: where continuously is designed to work for well over 5s at a time. | 01:55 |
| pwnguin | and then you lept from SE can to "so can n900" | 01:55 |
| jebba | lardman|home: ah, but that doesnt have kernel-flasher for some reason hmm | 01:55 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: and as i've said, a single led that needs no heatsink can do this, so what's the issue? | 01:56 |
| lardman|home | jebba: the flasher is not open afaik, you download that elsewhere | 01:56 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: you're free to hack your device and plug in your led | 01:56 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: because some LED datasheets I have seen that are labelled for flash use are not specified to be used at their flash rating all of the time. | 01:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | redeeman: you sound like santa claus talking bout easter | 01:56 |
| * timeless_mbp frowns | 01:56 | |
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| redeeman | SpeedEvil: so it must actually say "for flash usage", nevermind what the product actually can do, is that how stupid the people involved are? | 01:57 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: and there are of course no data published on the nokia design. | 01:57 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: No, of course not. | 01:57 |
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| jebba | lardman|home: i meant the package named kernel-flasher, not the maemo_flasher program. They are different. `dpkg -l | grep kernel` on your system, you'll see a kernel-flasher deb | 01:57 |
| redeeman | i'll bet you the datasheet for the ram piece they buy doesn't say: "for storing photos in" | 01:57 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: please stop trolling | 01:57 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: it sounds the only thing that you'll believe is the actual LED specsheet. | 01:57 |
| redeeman | DocScrutinizer: you sound like you do not understand what im trying to say | 01:57 |
| lardman|home | jebba: nope, I don't see that in Fremantle SDK | 01:58 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: The LED has a maximum pulse rating - this is used for flash often. | 01:58 |
| pwnguin | i know i saw a teardown of n900, is there a BOP yet? | 01:58 |
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| SpeedEvil | redeeman: It is not rated - for thermal and other reasons - for continual use at this current | 01:58 |
| pwnguin | though identifying leds must be damn near impossible | 01:58 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: would you use the flash on your actual camera to light your living room? | 01:58 |
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| jebba | lardman|home: the kernel-flasher .deb gets built along with the kernel-modules and kernel.deb, so i'm surprised its not in the same dir | 01:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | (me trows dice on leaving chan or /ignore redee* | 01:58 |
| lardman|home | jebba: fair enough | 01:59 |
| redeeman | crashanddie: i can only conclude you haven't read what i wrote, i do NOT want to have it on constantly, what i want is to have a light with my always, so for instance if its dark and i need to find something, like the lock on a door or something | 01:59 |
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| redeeman | or when i walk my dog at night | 01:59 |
| redeeman | not long periods | 01:59 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: continously means longer than milliseconds | 01:59 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: install liqtorch | 01:59 |
| jebba | lardman|home: what do you get if you just download it? I think you can do something like `apt-get -d install kernel-flasher` or something (yumdownloader is what i would use in fedora space, not sure of equiv with apt) | 02:00 |
| pwnguin | if you just want a flash, well, take a picture of the dark | 02:00 |
| redeeman | pwnguin: and as for you, you say i only care about the specsheet, i specifically said i didn't care about the datasheet, as long as the device can do what i want | 02:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | redeeman: everything >10sec is a prolonged period for hardware | 02:00 |
| lardman|home | jebba: It's not available afaict | 02:00 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: The datasheet does not say it can. If you exceed the limits - it is free to burn out. | 02:00 |
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| pwnguin | redeeman: the spec sheet's the only thing that can be trusted, as the manufacturer is liable if it's wrong | 02:00 |
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| lardman|home | jebba: apt-get install <blah> | 02:00 |
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| SpeedEvil | redeeman: And some actually will if used continuously. Some will not - but... | 02:01 |
| redeeman | i see, so your point is that theres no leds that officially supports this? because that's fine then | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: did it say in the spec that the flash could stay on for more than a few milliseconds? | 02:01 |
| Sachin007 | so did your n900 ship :) | 02:01 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: no - many LEDs do. | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: did the features include torch or pocketlight? | 02:01 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: the point was we dont know whether these LEDs condone it; they might, they might not | 02:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: just find the sysnode for redeeman and ask him to report how long the LED took to burn out. Everybody happy ;-) | 02:01 |
| redeeman | crashanddie: you are not staying on topic, i didn't claim anything said that, i said i WANTED that feature | 02:01 |
| lardman|home | I've got some nice 16W LED arrays, get rather warm though | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | well then stop ranting about it | 02:02 |
| jebba | lardman|home: i meant do download the actual .deb itself. I kind of pooched things up and am trying to recover. Long story heh. I just want this deb, basically: kernel-flasher 2.6.28-20094102.3+0m5 but dont see it anywhere (neither does google) | 02:02 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: Is the LED in the n900 one, and is it, all the power supply circuitry, and the thermal environment it's in all capable of doing it. | 02:02 |
| crashanddie | you've made your point, fair enough, now let's move on | 02:02 |
| redeeman | i don't appear to | 02:02 |
| redeeman | because you're all arguing against points im not trying to make | 02:02 |
| crashanddie | ok, let me help you | 02:02 |
| lardman|home | jebba: and I meant that apt-get doesn't see it from scratchbox, so I can't. Sorry | 02:02 |
| Sachin007 | i wonder what the rest of users are doing? | 02:02 |
| lardman|home | plus I'm compiling BLAS atm | 02:02 |
| SpeedEvil | The LED flash is driven by the adp1653 module | 02:03 |
| jebba | lardman|home: ah gotcha. thanks for checking tho :) | 02:03 |
| SpeedEvil | in the kernel | 02:03 |
| crashanddie | "Hey guys, wouldn't it have been awesome if the N900 supported a feature where we could use the camera led to light our environment for a few seconds? Oh well, maybe in the next version of the platform. Can I put feature requests in somewhere for the next releases? Thanks" | 02:03 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: copy paste the above, then /quit | 02:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: now U r talking :-D | 02:03 |
| pwnguin | heh | 02:03 |
| redeeman | crashanddie: yet that wasnt what we were arguing about, you and the others came with insane arguments against points i had never tried to make | 02:04 |
| * Arkenoi is really annoyed with dirt collecting border around n900 screen - what is it for, really? | 02:04 | |
| Sachin007 | so how to get rid of the red lite while recording video? | 02:04 |
| jebba | "Package kernel-flasher is not available, but is referred to by another package." :( | 02:04 |
| pwnguin | redeeman: people interpreted what you said differently than you intended; comparing the existing leds to other leds | 02:04 |
| crashanddie | redeeman: then make your bloody point already? The only thing I've seen you do is: "<nickname> That's not what I'm talking about, you're wrong, I'm not listening to you?"... Rinse and repeat | 02:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: Firmware update in 6 monts for $50 will peel off the bits to reveal a 4.5" screen. | 02:05 |
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| Arkenoi | :-)) | 02:05 |
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| redeeman | crashanddie: i did, i said that SE had a led that can do this, and that means nokia could get that too, but apparently you are unable to read it, and just kept on trolling | 02:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: practically - packing stuff into a mobile phone is _hard_. | 02:05 |
| SpeedEvil | redeeman: nokia can - of course they can - nobody is arguing that. The point is that you can't assume from the fact that they can that they have. | 02:06 |
| Sachin007 | i would kill for a 4.5 to 5 inch n900 | 02:06 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: and the great part is, i _NEVER_ did | 02:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Sachin007: me too. | 02:06 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: i said i WANTED that, not that they had done it | 02:06 |
| Arkenoi | me too | 02:06 |
| Sachin007 | wonder what is stopping them? | 02:06 |
| SpeedEvil | yes, actually, you were. | 02:06 |
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| Arkenoi | though i've seen damn many people complaining that n900 is big and they want n97-mini size | 02:06 |
| redeeman | SpeedEvil: care to point out when? | 02:06 |
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| Arkenoi | assholes | 02:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | redeeman, that's starting to get annoyingly noisy spam | 02:07 |
| Sachin007 | yeah have multiple devices.... who said no? | 02:07 |
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| redeeman | SpeedEvil: i wanted to use the led for that before i realized it was impossible due to not having control, and then i started talking about how nokia should make this feature for next device, that's all | 02:07 |
| redeeman | DocScrutinizer51: well if you had read what i actually wrote, this wouldn't have come this far | 02:07 |
| Arkenoi | we are going to have only one new maemo phone next year and i am almost sure it will have no qwerty | 02:08 |
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| javispedro | and a capactive screen | 02:08 |
| Sachin007 | do u guys think we may have a keyboard less variant next year? | 02:08 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | *sigh* | 02:08 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | bye | 02:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | too much | 02:08 |
| redeeman | is it known when that maemo devices comes out next year? | 02:08 |
| iDialekt | :( | 02:08 |
| Arkenoi | nokia said semi-officially that there will be just one | 02:08 |
| Sachin007 | so no more resisitve screens? | 02:09 |
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| jebba | DocScrutinizer51: just /ignore | 02:09 |
| Sachin007 | u think the next devixe will come with maemo 6? | 02:09 |
| Sachin007 | i dont think so... may be the one after.. | 02:10 |
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| lardman|home | another one bites the dust | 02:12 |
| lardman|home | BLAS this time | 02:12 |
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| SpeedEvil | Okaay. | 02:14 |
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| SpeedEvil | Where can I find a tarball or patches of the n900 kernel? | 02:14 |
| * SpeedEvil fails at google. | 02:14 | |
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| * lardman|home wonders how fort77 is already in Diablo extras-devel when f2c and libf2c(2) weren't | 02:15 | |
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| SpeedEvil | I can find the adp1653 driver being pushed to upstream | 02:15 |
| lardman|home | SpeedEvi1: see the link jebba gave above | 02:15 |
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| lardman|home | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/k/kernel/ | 02:16 |
| jebba | SpeedEvil: you can also run apt-get source kernel | 02:16 |
| SpeedEvil | ah - right | 02:16 |
| jebba | SpeedEvil: i have more docs on kernel building on my page now. http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba | 02:16 |
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| SpeedEvil | meh - E: Package gcc has no installation candidate | 02:17 |
| derf | So where are "the allowed user/* sections" listed? | 02:17 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 02:17 |
| jebba | i've actually got one up and going that I built. Then i did another one, but stupidly installed some old crappy one i did the other day by accident, so i'm trying to recover from that ;) | 02:17 |
| woglinde | hi jebba | 02:17 |
| jebba | heya | 02:18 |
| SpeedEvil | jebba: thanks - I'm not tracking this stuff as well as I should. Health problems suck. | 02:18 |
| mgedmin | VDVsx, anticipating your request, here are IRC logs for the new channels: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-bugs-irclog/ http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-devel-irclog/ http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-ui-irclog/ | 02:18 |
| GAN900 | Ah | 02:21 |
| GAN900 | Cracker Barrel | 02:22 |
| jebba | any irc chanops types of gurus who know how i can hand a channel over to VDVsx that i registered? | 02:22 |
| GAN900 | First time I've been really full in days. :D | 02:22 |
| mgedmin | jebba, have you tried chatting to chanserv? /msg chanserv help etc. | 02:23 |
| lardman|home | GAN900: what! airline food not good enough for you?! | 02:23 |
| SpeedEvil | hmm | 02:23 |
| SpeedEvil | Looks like the LED driver can do flashlight mode - and there are no huge warnings over the code | 02:23 |
| crashanddie | jebba: ask in #freenode, they'll be able to help | 02:23 |
| SpeedEvil | seems to be a v4l2 ioctl - this may imply that the camera has to be on with the current implementation - though I have not checked | 02:24 |
| lardman|home | take a look at the gst_photography fns then, you may find one which turns it on all the time | 02:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, sounds promising | 02:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, what scares me a little is the fact you can,t enable video flashlight | 02:28 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, so much for the warnings | 02:28 |
| Xisdibik_ | are you scared of hte dark? | 02:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | yeah | 02:29 |
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| SpeedEvil | I think these things will present as controls of /dev/video0 | 02:30 |
| lardman|home | Xisdibik: probably not going to have any luck re subtitles with the built-in media player | 02:30 |
| derf | Oh, you renamed user/tools to user/utilities. | 02:30 |
| derf | I guess the former was too short and concise. | 02:31 |
| SpeedEvil | So you should see 'torch intensity' which is a slider which goes from 0-1 (and has two values) | 02:31 |
| Xisdibik | lardman|home: yea i gave up on that, im going to load up mplayer when i really need the subtitles | 02:31 |
| Xisdibik | lardman|home: do you think there is a way to like etch the subtitles into the movie using some program on the desktop? | 02:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, should? | 02:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, where? when? | 02:32 |
| * hardaker2 thinks it should go from 0 to 11 | 02:32 | |
| lardman|home | Xisdibik: yep that is possible | 02:32 |
| Xisdibik | lardman|home: how about taking a movie with more than one audio track and extracting the movie with just one of the audio tracks? | 02:32 |
| lardman|home | Xisdibik: or, as lots of people are moaning about the built in, we just port something that also uses gst | 02:32 |
| lardman|home | Xisdibik: yep all those sorts of things are possible | 02:32 |
| pwnguin | so we've gone from "you can't assume that!" to "i bet this could work?" on the flashtorch? | 02:33 |
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| lardman|home | Xisdibik: but I'd prefer to not have to mess around like that tbh | 02:33 |
| Xisdibik | lardman|home: know a good program (free preferably) that i could use to do those things with? ;D | 02:33 |
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| lardman|home | http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/apps/ | 02:33 |
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| woglinde | hms | 02:34 |
| red | how to rebind the meta key | 02:34 |
| woglinde | next build of imagemaick started | 02:34 |
| red | dislike having esc at the touchscreen | 02:34 |
| red | tried: /bind å key meta | 02:35 |
| woglinde | red this is same as n810 | 02:35 |
| red | but no dice | 02:35 |
| red | what? | 02:35 |
| woglinde | esc only as touchscreen key | 02:35 |
| red | ye, but dont get why rebinding the meta key is such a hazzle | 02:36 |
| SpeedEvil | aha! | 02:36 |
| red | cant figure out how to do it in maemo | 02:36 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: a video player app that can play v4l devices - and present the arbitrarily named controls they may have | 02:37 |
| red | already binded window changing to qwert.. so i dont need to usefn+ numbers | 02:37 |
| red | missing the most important | 02:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | Aha = the LEDs must have no more than 320mA pulse for .5s, or 50mA continuous. | 02:37 |
| SpeedEvil | ./arch/arm/mach-omap2/board-rx51-camera.c lines 576-598/754 78% | 02:38 |
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| lardman|home | not quite up to my 1.2A ones then ;) | 02:38 |
| red | woglinde: have you been able to rebind the meta key | 02:38 |
| * SpeedEvil got a shiny new xp-g in the post | 02:39 | |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, here you are :-) | 02:39 |
| woglinde | red didnt try this | 02:39 |
| red | k | 02:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman|home, nah, European food! :P | 02:39 |
| lardman|home | hmm, fort77 moving to extras-devel not having happened yet, me goes to bed | 02:39 |
| red | ill keep searching | 02:39 |
| lardman|home | GeneralAntilles: small portion sizes hey? ;) | 02:39 |
| red | tried 3 different x terminal commands and two different methods inside irssi | 02:39 |
| lardman|home | night all | 02:39 |
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| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: wonder how strong 50ma is | 02:41 |
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| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: you think the spec sheet has a amperage-runtime curve? | 02:42 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: probably around 10-15lm | 02:42 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: this was based on the notes in the kernel driver for the flash chip | 02:42 |
| jebba | how to talk screen shot? | 02:42 |
| pwnguin | ie, one minute gets you 60mA | 02:43 |
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| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: you said you'd read led spec sheets before, so i was wondering if that was something they published | 02:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | err. you lost me | 02:43 |
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| redeeman | he meant if it can run .5sec with 320mA, how long can it run with 100mA or 60mA | 02:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | no hard figures on any of these | 02:46 |
| jebba | ctrl-shift-p | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: typically not. | 02:46 |
| pwnguin | nuts | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: they give a pulse and a continuous figure | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer? | 02:46 |
| Xisdibik | pwnguin: cashew, pecan, peanut, almond? | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | I lost me sometime back in 1985, you're not unique. | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvi1, Q: how long on 100mA. A: no facts. not tested. not guaranteed | 02:47 |
| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: im guessing the curve would pretty much be a step function anyways | 02:48 |
| pwnguin | ie, you cant go much above 50 for long | 02:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | guessing won't help though | 02:48 |
| pwnguin | estimating | 02:49 |
| dmj7261 | UMA sounds pretty cool. Anyone using it? | 02:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | you simply *must* not go over 50mA for longer than 0.5 | 02:49 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | everything else is handwaving | 02:50 |
| SpeedEvil | yes. | 02:50 |
| SpeedEvil | I would - however - be astonished if you got any damage at 55mA if it's on for a week even. | 02:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yesyes | 02:50 |
| SpeedEvil | but - that is in the handwavy area | 02:50 |
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| woglinde | good nite | 02:50 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: i heard the n900 didnt support it | 02:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | but given physiological facts of light perception it also won't make amy difference | 02:51 |
| SpeedEvil | It would typically be something like you can assume pretty safely that 170mA for 1s is safe. | 02:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | for user | 02:51 |
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| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: now that's handywavy | 02:51 |
| jebba | hmm. i think i've asked this before... But how do i tell from which repo i got a package (e.g. from extras, extras-testing, etc)? | 02:52 |
| pwnguin | i guess the most important question is how that output compares with the damn screen | 02:52 |
| pwnguin | jebba: apt-cache policy pkg-name | 02:52 |
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| jebba | pwnguin: thx := | 02:53 |
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| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: lots better. /me tries to relate it to a measure people might be familiar with. | 02:53 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: it's going to be brighter significantly than the little keychain 1 LED torches. | 02:54 |
| pwnguin | yea, perceptions a drag man | 02:54 |
| pwnguin | SpeedEvil: at 50mA? | 02:54 |
| jebba | pwnguin: actually that doesn't show it. http://pastebin.ca/1707697 | 02:54 |
| pwnguin | alternative theory | 02:54 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: yes - they are probably running more like 30mA - and are probably generally less efficient LEds | 02:54 |
| pwnguin | Nightvision! | 02:54 |
| dmj7261 | Xisdibik: Where'd you find that? | 02:54 |
| iDialekt | Is it worth going maemo on t-mobile? | 02:54 |
| iDialekt | N900 | 02:55 |
| SpeedEvil | dmj7261: uk? | 02:55 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: was on a thread on maemo talk i think, let me see if the school connection is good enough to find it quickly ;) | 02:55 |
| dmj7261 | US on tmobile? | 02:55 |
| pwnguin | iDialekt: it handles tmobile 3g, if thats what you mean | 02:55 |
| SpeedEvil | ah. | 02:55 |
| pekuja | iDialekt: what does it have to do with T-Mobile? bad connectivity? | 02:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | some basics about LEDs: they usually don't burn out in a sudden. Rathermthey deteriorate and get dim. This is a process that starts to get much faster on higher currents as well as hifgher temperature | 02:56 |
| SpeedEvil | or being shit. | 02:56 |
| Sachin | yeah tmobile is perfect for n900 | 02:56 |
| SpeedEvil | I have some LEDs from ebay that at their nominal power reach around 5% brightness in a month. | 02:56 |
| nomis | A fun way to burn out LEDs is to forget the current limiting resistor in series. | 02:57 |
| Sachin | also u get the 10$ unlimited internet for phones | 02:57 |
| nomis | smells quite bad. :) | 02:57 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32388&highlight=UMA&page=3 << I think this is it, but im not 100% sure | 02:57 |
| red | Any ideas how to rebind the meta key in maemo? | 02:57 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: yes, US tmobile | 02:57 |
| red | or any resources | 02:57 |
| pwnguin | heh, its amazing (to me) how much people study LEDs | 02:57 |
| Sachin | i use tmobile | 02:57 |
| SpeedEvil | t-mobile UK is more awesome perhaps. 25 quid - including a SIM - gets you internet for 6 months and nothing else to pay | 02:57 |
| iDialekt | pwnguin: Well just wondering how they are as a carrier | 02:58 |
| Xisdibik | SpeedEvi1: ive heard that phrase from you like 500 times ;) | 02:58 |
| pwnguin | iDialekt: ive just been using tmo as a prepaid sim; data over wifi | 02:58 |
| Sachin | i swiched from at&t call clarify is phenomenal | 02:58 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: the field is coming on amazingly. A decade ago, the most efficient white LED was perhaps 1/10th as efficient as now. | 02:58 |
| Xisdibik | SpeedEvi1: im very happy that you can pay 25 squids for a SIM card and 6 months internet, we dont have that option here ;) | 02:58 |
| SpeedEvil | Sorry :) | 02:58 |
| Sachin | 3g speeds are also good | 02:58 |
| iDialekt | Sachin: Yeah they use full hmr while AT&T uses half | 02:59 |
| red | my 3.6mbps 3g costs 9,9e/month | 02:59 |
| iDialekt | Big call quality difference | 02:59 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: To the extent that if they repeated that in the next 10 years, the LED would create more energy in light than it uses in electricity. | 02:59 |
| Sachin | i pay 60$ after taxes for 1000mins and data | 02:59 |
| pwnguin | i mean, sure, theres people hunting blue leds | 02:59 |
| iDialekt | Wow | 02:59 |
| iDialekt | T-mobile rocks in that departmet | 02:59 |
| Xisdibik | Sachin: ur not getting SMS? | 02:59 |
| red | ouch, 60 dollars for 1000mins and data? | 02:59 |
| iDialekt | Coverage is tolerable? | 02:59 |
| Mika_i | t-mobile will upgrade their 3g to 7.2 | 02:59 |
| Sachin | without contract | 02:59 |
| pwnguin | but most of my EE friendes seem more interested in things beyond diodes | 02:59 |
| Mika_i | by the end of the year | 03:00 |
| Xisdibik | red: im paying 59.99 for 500 minutes + unlimited SMS / Data | 03:00 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: It all comes down in the end to I/O devices. | 03:00 |
| Xisdibik | red: for the same stuff, i had to pay like 101.83 at AT&T | 03:00 |
| SpeedEvil | pwnguin: be they LEDs, LCDs, or pulsed thermonuclear fusion devices. | 03:00 |
| Sachin | ya | 03:00 |
| iDialekt | Yeah very soon. | 03:00 |
| go1dfish | tmobile here to | 03:00 |
| iDialekt | Sachin: you on month to month ? | 03:01 |
| Sachin | xis is that pre tax? | 03:01 |
| go1dfish | good coverage | 03:01 |
| Xisdibik | 59.99 is not pretax | 03:01 |
| Xisdibik | 101.83 included taxes and fees | 03:01 |
| dmj7261 | ok...I would like to see uma added to the n900 if possible | 03:01 |
| Sachin | ya | 03:01 |
| go1dfish | also on the 500min plan no contract | 03:01 |
| Xisdibik | 500 minutes is plenty imho | 03:01 |
| pwnguin | right now i spend 100 a year on tmo | 03:01 |
| Xisdibik | ive used like 10 minutes | 03:01 |
| go1dfish | i dont like phone/calls much | 03:01 |
| pwnguin | thats 1000 minutes a year; i donno who the hell complains about too few minutes | 03:01 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: as would i | 03:01 |
| go1dfish | so yeah plenty for me | 03:02 |
| Sachin | yeah i will think of changing to 500 mins | 03:02 |
| dmj7261 | seems like it would be a killer feature | 03:02 |
| go1dfish | free nights and weekends to | 03:02 |
| simula__ | i wish there was a cheap data only plan :P | 03:02 |
| pwnguin | simula__: there kinda is | 03:02 |
| simula__ | what pwnguin? | 03:02 |
| Xisdibik | data is 39.99 i think, thats not cheap | 03:02 |
| pwnguin | i donno if they've closed it off | 03:02 |
| pwnguin | there used to be a 10 dollar prepaid plan | 03:02 |
| pwnguin | for data | 03:02 |
| Xisdibik | not anymore i think | 03:02 |
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| Xisdibik | they totally redid their plans | 03:02 |
| dmj7261 | (iphone will never have it, and it would boost the value that plans provide as well as massively increasing coverage) | 03:02 |
| dmj7261 | (lots of wifi routers in the houses of people who live in rural areas) | 03:03 |
| Xisdibik | dmj7261: UMA is apparently not just software based but is hardware based aswell, so dont get your hopes up on it | 03:03 |
| SpeedEvil | It requires support on the network - and also on the hardware radio | 03:03 |
| Arkenoi | if you have unlimited data you may have dirt cheap voice with voip | 03:03 |
| dmj7261 | still could be untapped hardware support | 03:03 |
| simula__ | arkenoi... exactly | 03:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | It is basically 'handing off' to another cell - but that cell is connected over wifi | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | and is a virtual cell at the telcos home office | 03:04 |
| Xisdibik | heres a question for you guys, i was enjoying some nice SUper Tux on the train ride today, and when i quit, it was still in mouse mode, and had a big black square covering the screen (i could see my desktop at the edge of the screen just a bit,a nd wouldnt go away, anyone know whats up with that?> | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | So you need the underlying modem hardware to understand that. | 03:04 |
| iDialekt | What about lte 4g? | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | iDialekt: no hardware | 03:05 |
| dmj7261 | lte definitely isn't supported unless there's a massive easter egg in there. | 03:05 |
| Xisdibik | 7.2 mpbs seems plenty reasonable for a mobile anyways | 03:05 |
| Xisdibik | mbps* | 03:05 |
| iDialekt | T mobile has been on the bottom of carrier list for sometime | 03:05 |
| Xisdibik | T Mobile is vastly underrated imho | 03:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Xisdibik: power button -> end task do anything? | 03:06 |
| Sachin | i thought the n900 can handle upto 10 mbps | 03:06 |
| Xisdibik | SpeedEvi1: hadnt tried that, i hit poweroff before i realized i could hit end task ^^ | 03:06 |
| Xisdibik | Sachin: yea, but tmobile isnt going to up 3G to 10mbps, it will stop at 7.2mbps, and jump after the 3G | 03:07 |
| Xisdibik | er 4G* | 03:07 |
| Xisdibik | and the = to | 03:07 |
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| Arkenoi | i think there are much more wimax networks actually deployed than lte at the moment | 03:07 |
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| Xisdibik | is there an app yet for the n900 for Google Voice? | 03:09 |
| dmj7261 | sounds like LTE is going to be deployed more though | 03:09 |
| redeeman | Xisdibik: i think it already has that builtin | 03:09 |
| Xisdibik | yea, LTE will be the next big thing | 03:09 |
| Xisdibik | redeeman: where abouts, (and i dont mean Google Talk if your confusing the two) :) | 03:09 |
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| redeeman | Xisdibik: oh, sorry | 03:10 |
| Xisdibik | redeeman: np ;) | 03:10 |
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| iDialekt | I'm Right on the fence with android and maemo | 03:12 |
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| iDialekt | Android is obviously gaining popularity and more widespreaad devices | 03:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | iDialekt, what's more important, quantity or quality? | 03:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | iPhone has more market share than Android. | 03:15 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Are you on the fence about that? :P | 03:15 |
| iDialekt | Hmmm well I dunno I guess I'm simply tied to the eco system of my device (iPhone) | 03:15 |
| iDialekt | I want to change but find it hard to switch when I look at everything I want in a device | 03:16 |
| iDialekt | Android is very intuitive and the hardware is finally catching up.. | 03:16 |
| iDialekt | The n900 seemed like it had a slight learning curve to it | 03:16 |
| iDialekt | Portrait mode enabled yet? | 03:17 |
| Xisdibik | iDialekt: no | 03:17 |
| Xisdibik | iDialekt: but it hasnt bothered me yet | 03:17 |
| iDialekt | Yeah but it bothered me upon using it | 03:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | iDialekt, meh. | 03:18 |
| iDialekt | (just being honest) | 03:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Portrait is largely overrated | 03:18 |
| aspidites | plus there is a growing list of alternate apps that support portrait mode | 03:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | and really not particularly useful in Maemo. | 03:18 |
| * Xisdibik agrees with GeneralAntilles | 03:18 | |
| iDialekt | I know I know. But for me it's not | 03:18 |
| iDialekt | I do a lot one handed | 03:18 |
| Arkenoi | the first truly user-oriented (not a geek toy) android phone is out not long time ago | 03:18 |
| Xisdibik | iDialekt: Apple store is that way ;) | 03:18 |
| aspidites | for example midori browser has portrait mode support | 03:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | PR1.1 has portrait browsing | 03:19 |
| Arkenoi | so there is no surprise iPhone has bigger market share at the moment | 03:19 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | GeneralAntilles, ack | 03:19 |
| Xisdibik | Arkenoi: which one are you referring to? | 03:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Should be out in a few weeks, apparently. | 03:19 |
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| Arkenoi | Hero, for sure | 03:19 |
| iDialekt | Bravo? | 03:19 |
| Xisdibik | Arkenoi: ok then i agree ;) | 03:19 |
| iDialekt | Bravo/passion from htc? | 03:19 |
| Xisdibik | GeneralAntilles: PR1.1? | 03:19 |
| aspidites | bravo is out q1 next year isn't it? leaked htc road map right? | 03:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Public Release 1.1 | 03:19 |
| Xisdibik | ah | 03:20 |
| iDialekt | Yes | 03:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer | GeneralAntilles: PR1.1 of maemo5? | 03:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, yes. | 03:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-) | 03:33 |
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| derf | So, is the Maemo Packages Interface completely busted? | 04:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | hrm, JourneyMan is neat | 04:15 |
| timeless_mbp | maemo.org news is 0 bytes | 04:16 |
| timeless_mbp | i'd say maemo.org is busted :) | 04:17 |
| GAN900 | Server migration, maybe. | 04:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | n900 ran out of battery | 04:17 |
| timeless_mbp | :) | 04:17 |
| GAN900 | timeless_mbp, 770s to N810s, I think. | 04:19 |
| timeless_mbp | GAN900: so... | 04:19 |
| timeless_mbp | i need to figure out how to deal w/ the call ui, got time? | 04:20 |
| * timeless_mbp wants to strangle someone | 04:20 | |
| timeless_mbp | btw, i've got a great photo | 04:20 |
| GAN900 | timeless_mbp, my brain is mostly slush atm. | 04:20 |
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| GAN900 | Ugh, I'm getting about 2 dozen hildon-home crashes a day. | 04:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | what extensions are you using? | 04:25 |
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| GAN900 | Bookmarks, contacts, shortcuts, location, media player | 04:26 |
| timeless_mbp | so nokia items? | 04:27 |
| GAN900 | Only reason I know it's crashing is Nitro | 04:27 |
| GAN900 | Yeah | 04:27 |
| GAN900 | Nothing 3rd-party | 04:27 |
| GAN900 | Although I do have some installed and have used them in the past. | 04:27 |
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| GAN900 | Managed to crash browserd at the hotel Saturday night then spent 5 minutes typing out a description and realized I didn't have a connection. . . . | 04:28 |
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| AndrewFBlack | konttori_work_no, pong | 04:30 |
| AndrewFBlack | konttori_work_no, ping I mean lol | 04:30 |
| pekuja | it's 04:30 in the morning in Finland so I'm guessing he's not around | 04:32 |
| Macer | blah | 04:32 |
| Macer | stupid osx | 04:32 |
| pekuja | assuming he's in Finland, which I'm assuming based on his name | 04:32 |
| Macer | i guess insomniaX doesn't work on it anymore with the 10.5.8 update | 04:32 |
| AndrewFBlack | I thought it was later there ohh well I was thinking we where like 12 hour apart | 04:32 |
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| pekuja | AndrewFBlack: where are you? | 04:32 |
| AndrewFBlack | new theme maker is locking up on my | 04:33 |
| AndrewFBlack | Alabama | 04:33 |
| crashanddie | AndrewFBlack: west coast is 9 hours from mainland europe | 04:33 |
| crashanddie | AndrewFBlack: you central time? | 04:33 |
| AndrewFBlack | yeah | 04:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, here 3:33 | 04:33 |
| crashanddie | so probably 7 or 8 hours | 04:33 |
| crashanddie | for you | 04:33 |
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| AndrewFBlack | 8 if its 4:30 there | 04:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I doubt Finland is +1 from Germany | 04:35 |
| Mika_i | hmm | 04:35 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | Germany = GMT +2. Finland = GMT =3. | 04:37 |
| Ronaldo38741 | +3 | 04:37 |
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| crashanddie | Finland is GMT+@ | 04:38 |
| crashanddie | Finland is GMT+2 | 04:38 |
| crashanddie | germany is GMT+1 | 04:38 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | True | 04:39 |
| ShadowJK | +1 to both in summer | 04:39 |
| crashanddie | it's bloody december | 04:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | amazing | 04:39 |
| * Ronaldo38741 looks for blood | 04:39 | |
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| * crashanddie RDP's into a win box in order to ESX into a Linux box... | 04:40 | |
| crashanddie | (from osx) | 04:40 |
| * DocScrutinizer puzzled | 04:40 | |
| Macer | huh? | 04:42 |
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| Macer | crashanddie: yeah. i thought there only being a win client for esx was kind of stupid | 04:43 |
| Macer | espeically considering they use a linux hal for it :) | 04:43 |
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| Macer | the hardware support for esx is rather lacking | 04:44 |
| Foxx | Would anyone happen to have information on how to add menu items to the apps list in maemo 5 (diablo)? A URL with some info perhaps? | 04:45 |
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| summel | is there any information on when maemo.org will be online again? -_- | 04:47 |
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| ShadowJK | before dnf | 04:48 |
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| paroneayea | so, if I ssh into my desktop and enter emacs in an xterm | 04:49 |
| summel | dnf? | 04:49 |
| paroneayea | enter does not emit kp-enter | 04:49 |
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| paroneayea | instead it emits M-o m | 04:49 |
| ShadowJK | duke nuken forever | 04:50 |
| paroneayea | anyone have any idea why enter might not be mapping to enter? | 04:50 |
| summel | -_- | 04:50 |
| summel | not helping | 04:50 |
| ShadowJK | :) | 04:50 |
| summel | i dont think it is funny | 04:50 |
| summel | i just wanted to download the sdk | 04:50 |
| summel | but since meamo.org is down for weeks now i just give it up | 04:50 |
| Foxx | this is freenode, there arent too many helpful people here | 04:50 |
| summel | -_- | 04:50 |
| summel | i hate nokia :O | 04:50 |
| ShadowJK | it was up earlier today atleast | 04:51 |
| summel | Foxx: nothing to do with freenode... more like IRC | 04:51 |
| summel | :P | 04:51 |
| summel | ShadowJK: it is down for weeks now for me | 04:51 |
| summel | i had the main homepage shown 2 times today but http://maemo.org/development/sdks/ does never work | 04:51 |
| Foxx | lostcarrier.net has very helpful folk | 04:51 |
| summel | only maemo.org | 04:51 |
| GAN900 | Foxx, add a .desktop file. | 04:51 |
| Foxx | thank you GAN900 | 04:51 |
| summel | why is there a link to http://maemo.org/development/sdks/ when the sdk is on forum.nokia.com which works just fine? | 04:52 |
| summel | -_- | 04:52 |
| summel | FAIL | 04:52 |
| GAN900 | paroneayea, because Nokia is stupid. | 04:52 |
| ShadowJK | and on tablets-dev I guess | 04:52 |
| Foxx | thats 3 out of 439 people that have been in any shape or form a help so far | 04:52 |
| GAN900 | summel, because SDKs on Forum Nokia were a VERY recent development. :) | 04:52 |
| summel | still | 04:53 |
| summel | this is just sooo much faiöl | 04:53 |
| summel | -_- | 04:53 |
| GAN900 | Foxx, don't expect more help if you'd rather troll. :) | 04:53 |
| Foxx | im not, im trying to convey my appreciation | 04:53 |
| Foxx | humm, how about this one... I have btscanner installed, no thanks to the built in application manager | 04:54 |
| GAN900 | Sounds more like you're denigrating the people in this channel and this network to me. | 04:54 |
| Foxx | id like to get an external USB HCI adapter going, but damned if hcitool or hciconfig commands work | 04:54 |
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| GAN900 | USB OTG is not supported. | 04:55 |
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| GAN900 | USB host is questionable. | 04:55 |
| Foxx | it shouldnt need OTG mode | 04:55 |
| Foxx | yeah, ive heard a lot of borderline stuff with hsot mode | 04:55 |
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| Foxx | I got a 500GB HDD working, external power of course, but that was for the shits and giggles of it | 04:56 |
| GAN900 | On the N900? | 04:56 |
| Foxx | n800 | 04:56 |
| Foxx | I wish I could afford a n900! | 04:56 |
| GAN900 | Why are you asking about 5 then? | 04:57 |
| GAN900 | N800 runs Maemo 4 or 3 | 04:57 |
| Foxx | I was under the assumption that the latest build for the n800 was maemo 5 | 04:57 |
| GAN900 | No, that's Fremantle. | 04:57 |
| Foxx | again, thanks for the clarification | 04:57 |
| Foxx | no scarcasim there | 04:58 |
| GAN900 | Anyway, Bluetooth USB adaptors I can't help with. | 04:58 |
| Foxx | not too many people can, to be honest | 04:58 |
| Foxx | its a bit tricky under linux | 04:58 |
| Sir_Lancelot | Hi fellows, I just bought a N900, but I'm kinda noob on Linux.... | 04:58 |
| Sir_Lancelot | so... | 04:58 |
| Foxx | as long as you stick wit CSR radios, its not a big deal, but knowing if an adapter is CSR or not is pretty much hit or miss | 04:59 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | what should I start doing / reading / going? | 04:59 |
| Sir_Lancelot | I'm kinda lost with this.. | 04:59 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I come from WM devices | 04:59 |
| Foxx | Well, what would you like to do with the device? That is a good place to start | 05:00 |
| wylhistory | I like N900 | 05:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Sir_Lancelot: you've read the user manual that's in MyDocs on N900 somewhere? | 05:01 |
| ali1234 | i like turtles | 05:01 |
| ali1234 | Foxx: have you actually tried some usb bluetooth? | 05:01 |
| Sir_Lancelot | yes I did | 05:01 |
| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 05:01 |
| Sir_Lancelot | I'm not thaaaaaaaaat noob :D | 05:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | so seems you should learn about Linux in general then, to start with | 05:02 |
| Sir_Lancelot | but aren't there already developed apps for the phone? | 05:02 |
| Sir_Lancelot | somewhere | 05:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | and then Foxx had the right question for you | 05:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, a lot | 05:03 |
| Sir_Lancelot | where can I get them from? | 05:03 |
| Sir_Lancelot | and how does this work? | 05:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | go to app manager, check extras catalog | 05:03 |
| Sir_Lancelot | I've been there | 05:03 |
| ShadowJK | csr doesn't always help, if the phone/device you're connecting to isn't csr too | 05:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | Sir_Lancelot: you enabled the preconfigured extras catalog? | 05:04 |
| Sir_Lancelot | yes | 05:04 |
| Sir_Lancelot | and also added the catalog for the beta apps from meamo.org | 05:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | so you should see quite a number of apps | 05:04 |
| Sir_Lancelot | yes I did | 05:04 |
| redeeman | Foxx: what's the problem with bluetooth usb? | 05:04 |
| Sir_Lancelot | but is that catalog the only source of apps? or are there other catalogs? | 05:05 |
| Foxx | I cant bring the adapter up | 05:05 |
| Foxx | well, mind you this is an external USB stick | 05:05 |
| ali1234 | Foxx: what does dmesg say? | 05:05 |
| redeeman | i assume it uses the standard hci_usb interface? | 05:05 |
| Foxx | yup | 05:05 |
| redeeman | what does hciconfig say? | 05:05 |
| Foxx | normally I would issue an hciconfig set up command in shell, but there is no hciconfig | 05:05 |
| redeeman | well theres your problem | 05:06 |
| red | Sir_Lancelot: there are mainly three catalogs at the moment afaik, one of which is testing extras that you can basicly screw your device over if you dont understand linux and fiddle around | 05:06 |
| redeeman | you need bluez | 05:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | Sir_Lancelot: http://wiki.maemo.org/Downloading_apps | 05:06 |
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| ali1234 | ah i see - then just compile bluez-utils | 05:06 |
| red | good place to browse for software rathern than app packages is from ur web bookmarks the maemo select | 05:06 |
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| ali1234 | or snatch the debian armel bins if you're feeling lazy | 05:06 |
| ShadowJK | do you have a hci_usb kernel module loaded? | 05:06 |
| red | some must have apps listed there better explained | 05:06 |
| Foxx | apt is telling me its installed | 05:06 |
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| Foxx | last I can recall, all CSR radios are supported under blue-z, which is why I try to stick with them | 05:06 |
| Foxx | plus I like the hardware | 05:07 |
| redeeman | Foxx: i don't know anything about maemo 4, but bluez-utils provides hciconfig and hcitool and such | 05:07 |
| redeeman | and afaik, hci_usb should support ALL bluetooth usb standard compliant devices | 05:07 |
| redeeman | (which is required to get approval from the bluetooth people) | 05:07 |
| Sir_Lancelot | ok, so this means that in what concerns apps, I'm not as far behind as I thought | 05:07 |
| ShadowJK | is the hci_usb module loaded though? | 05:08 |
| red | is tethering ubuntu + n900 hard btw? i found that the usb itself finds the device perfectly and i can browse files on the phone np | 05:08 |
| Sir_Lancelot | which leaves me in the right position so start learning Linux basics then ;) | 05:08 |
| red | but im wondering about using the phone as a modem for my netbook | 05:08 |
| ali1234 | red: works ootb for me | 05:08 |
| ShadowJK | it wouldn't be normally, because the device's own bluetooth isn't on uab | 05:08 |
| Foxx | thats where I have been cought up on | 05:08 |
| red | ali1234: where should i go for some tutorial about adding the phone as modem? | 05:08 |
| ali1234 | red: select pc suite mode, nm will see a standard mobile broadband device | 05:08 |
| redeeman | Foxx: lsmod | grep hci_usb | 05:08 |
| red | mmh, pc suite for linux? what | 05:09 |
| Foxx | redeeman, working on it, booting the n800 now | 05:09 |
| nez800 | pc suide for linux? | 05:09 |
| ali1234 | red: no select it on n900 when you plug it in | 05:09 |
| redeeman | or if you have a very new kernel, its called btusb instead of hci_usb | 05:09 |
| red | ahh, select pc suite state and it recognizes it as a modem? | 05:09 |
| ali1234 | red: yes, and then use the mobile broadband wizard in n-m | 05:09 |
| red | didnt think of that as i was plugging it in to a linux and crossed out the possibility alltogether | 05:10 |
| red | alright, ill give it a go, brb | 05:10 |
| Sir_Lancelot | btw: my n900 didn't bring a CD with Pc Suite | 05:10 |
| nez800 | ^ same | 05:10 |
| redeeman | afaik it won't expose it as a modem, but rather usb cdc ethernet device | 05:10 |
| Sir_Lancelot | where can I get Pc Suite for N900....and from the Pc side, it's a regular XP SP3 | 05:10 |
| red | ali1234: so u are using the cord for that btw | 05:10 |
| red | id prefer bluetooth, but can live without | 05:11 |
| ali1234 | redeeman: it has both | 05:11 |
| ali1234 | red: yes usb cable | 05:11 |
| redeeman | ali1234: ah i see | 05:11 |
| red | do you know if its possible over bt? | 05:11 |
| redeeman | red: it is, but not with default configuration | 05:11 |
| red | alright, where should i go look for the documentation on that (if there is any done) | 05:11 |
| redeeman | there is on the maemo.org wiki, but i don't know if that's online now | 05:12 |
| red | googling for it was a waste of time, didnt find anything relevant | 05:12 |
| red | might be that im using wrong keywords | 05:12 |
| redeeman | google for bluetooth dun n900 | 05:12 |
| ali1234 | nah don't use DUN it sucks | 05:12 |
| ali1234 | you want to set up a PAN if possible | 05:12 |
| redeeman | dun has worked fine for me on lots of devices | 05:13 |
| ali1234 | with dun you have to keep redialing if the connection drops | 05:13 |
| Foxx | is there a speed limit you can do over DUN? I have never really used it | 05:13 |
| redeeman | true, pan is nicer, but more elaborate to setup | 05:13 |
| red | i dont regard reconnecting as issue | 05:13 |
| red | as it is that way via default pc suite windows + usb tethering | 05:14 |
| red | and generally i dont experience disconnects unless i am on the move, and if i am - laptop will be closed | 05:14 |
| Foxx | no hci__usb module loaded | 05:14 |
| ali1234 | hang on, doesn't the n800 have bluetooth built in?? | 05:15 |
| Foxx | yes, I want to use a more powerful adapter with high gain antenna | 05:15 |
| Foxx | or at least with a standard 2dB gain rubber duck | 05:16 |
| Foxx | im not going to stress too hard over this, its not important | 05:17 |
| Foxx | its more like... I have the adapters, antennas, and the n800, just seeing if it can do it | 05:17 |
| Foxx | BTScanner on the n800 is a major eye strain either way | 05:18 |
| nez800 | how does one toggle SSH on/off on the N900? | 05:20 |
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| crashanddie | nez800: "toggle" ? | 05:21 |
| nez800 | turn on/off | 05:21 |
| wylhistory | maybe the dropbear or ssh in /etc/rc2.d/* | 05:21 |
| crashanddie | /etc/init.d/sshd stop? | 05:22 |
| nez800 | oh, I was hoping there was a graphical applet for it. I know there is a Services applet for N800 | 05:22 |
| wylhistory | I think there is no. | 05:22 |
| red | jesus christ its a buttload of work for bluetooth tethering | 05:22 |
| Foxx | hah | 05:23 |
| Foxx | yeah, thats how it usually is | 05:23 |
| red | wonder why such functionality isn't completed out of the box.. as BT draws less power than usb/wif tether | 05:23 |
| Foxx | I have this book "Bluetooth Demystified" | 05:23 |
| crashanddie | red: yeah, and cursing on IRC will definitely ease the process :) | 05:23 |
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| Foxx | its about 300 pages, and "bluetooth made simple and easy to understand" | 05:23 |
| red | hey its 5am and im tired, little venting out isn't forbidden I hope =) | 05:23 |
| red | Foxx: hah | 05:24 |
| red | oh well, it was simple and easy for my nokia 9300 which is years and years old | 05:24 |
| crashanddie | red: not at all, just don't take the lord's name in vain | 05:24 |
| red | odd that some features go backwards in time | 05:24 |
| |R | I'm about to replace my old nokia phone which doesn't even have BT with the n900 :P | 05:24 |
| red | plug in my bt dongle, open pc suite, connect device and dial gprs | 05:24 |
| crashanddie | red: just kidding, slam the bastard :P | 05:25 |
| red | this phone is in every way better than my old devices.. except tethering :) | 05:25 |
| crashanddie | red: n900? | 05:25 |
| red | yes | 05:25 |
| crashanddie | red: and you're trying to tether in which direction? | 05:25 |
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| red | for my netbook to be able to bluetooth connect to internet via my n900 | 05:25 |
| crashanddie | oh, like so | 05:26 |
| red | via usb it shouldn't be a hazzle | 05:26 |
| red | but that draws more power and i need to keep the cord with me which i dont like | 05:26 |
| red | since it will recharge the phone at the same time, drawing more power | 05:26 |
| crashanddie | actually, USB wouldn't draw more power from your N900 | 05:26 |
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| crashanddie | giving your N900 more uptime :P | 05:26 |
| red | it would draw more power from my NETBOOK :p | 05:26 |
| crashanddie | yeah but as long as your netbook doesn't run maemo, we couldn't care less :D | 05:26 |
| red | 7,5h uptime about using ubuntu netbook remix and making notes during schoolday, some ircing and internet browsing | 05:27 |
| red | via bt tethering on nokia n9300 that is | 05:27 |
| red | via cord, ~2h away from that, so it wont last the whole day :) | 05:27 |
| crashanddie | red: 7 hours of uptime with full core 2 duo + 4 gigs of ram ;) | 05:27 |
| crashanddie | and a real screen plus real keyboard :P | 05:27 |
| red | i be using a cheapo asus eee pc 9xx :p | 05:27 |
| red | just what i could afford as a student year ago | 05:28 |
| red | guess ill keep my years and years old communicator with me at school until bt tethering is sorted | 05:28 |
| red | not optimal, but beats having few hours less uptime on the laptop | 05:28 |
| crashanddie | red: what issues are you getting? | 05:28 |
| red | no idea how to tether n900 using bluetooth | 05:29 |
| red | :p | 05:29 |
| crashanddie | and no, "it doesn't work" isn't a valid answer | 05:29 |
| red | read some threads at maemo.org but cannot get any viable solutions | 05:29 |
| crashanddie | red: basically, you need to install iptables on the N900, and then get BT networking up and running | 05:29 |
| ali1234 | n900 kernel doesn't have iptables support | 05:29 |
| crashanddie | ah damn | 05:29 |
| red | mostly everyone replying there that it isn't functional yet | 05:30 |
| crashanddie | do we have some kind of proxy then? | 05:30 |
| ali1234 | you have to use dun currently | 05:30 |
| crashanddie | ali1234: have you tried it? | 05:30 |
| ali1234 | which means setting up rfcomm | 05:30 |
| ali1234 | crashanddie: no. somebody made a custom kernel with iptables support though | 05:30 |
| crashanddie | ali1234: you wouldn't happen to have a link? | 05:30 |
| red | ali1234: if at any point of your life you feel bored enough to paste me some tutorials or explain it to me, you'd make one happy Finn | 05:30 |
| crashanddie | oh, you're a Finn, not talking to you anymore | 05:31 |
| red | haha | 05:31 |
| crashanddie | just go knock on some Nokian's (probably a neighbour) door | 05:31 |
| nez800 | lol | 05:31 |
| ali1234 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=30916 | 05:31 |
| ali1234 | red: rfcomm is a huge pain in the ass to set up even when you've got all the kernel modules | 05:32 |
| red | alright, lets forget it the. ty anyway :) | 05:32 |
| ali1234 | if it was me, i'd rather try to compile iptables and use PAN, than screw around with DUN, that's how bad it is | 05:32 |
| nez800 | is the maemo.org main site down for other people?? | 05:32 |
| red | yeah, I think I get the picture | 05:32 |
| toggles_w | woot! my n900 is in the mail! | 05:33 |
| nez800 | w00t! | 05:33 |
| red | gz :p | 05:33 |
| nez800 | I just got mine today :D | 05:33 |
| nez800 | maemo.org is timing out for me | 05:33 |
| nez800 | I can not get to it... | 05:33 |
| toggles_w | nez800: woot in deed, just in time too! | 05:34 |
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| ali1234 | let's have a look at this kernel source then | 05:34 |
| Sir_Lancelot | see you guys tomorrow | 05:35 |
| Sir_Lancelot | It's 3:35 am.m here | 05:35 |
| Sir_Lancelot | :s | 05:35 |
| nez800 | goodnight! | 05:35 |
| Sir_Lancelot | [[[]]] | 05:35 |
| red | 5.30 here :p | 05:35 |
| red | slapped the N900 into my netbook now and enabled the pc suite mode from the phone | 05:36 |
| toggles_w | nez800: same here, timeout.. | 05:36 |
| red | off to research about modem installation, brb | 05:36 |
| nez800 | How can I prevent dropbear/sshd from starting on boot? | 05:37 |
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| |R | anyone wants a google wave invite? | 05:40 |
| |R | Nobody wants them anymore hehe | 05:40 |
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| ali1234 | hmm we have ip_tables as a module now | 05:41 |
| nez800 | i have wave invites if anyone wants lol | 05:41 |
| |R | :) | 05:41 |
| |R | 18 of them to throw away... | 05:42 |
| ali1234 | we have usb-storage.ko too... how odd | 05:42 |
| ali1234 | am i on the right box? | 05:42 |
| ShadowJK | lol | 05:42 |
| ali1234 | yes, i am | 05:42 |
| toggles_w | nez800: maemo came good mate | 05:43 |
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| red | unbeliveable how easy the tether was via usb cable =) | 05:43 |
| red | just clicked "add a connection thru mobile gsm device" | 05:43 |
| red | all my isp settings were hardcoded into this netbook remix of ubuntu by default and took about 15 seconds to get the connection up and running :) | 05:44 |
| ali1234 | they're in all versions | 05:44 |
| ali1234 | they're in n-m | 05:44 |
| red | speedtest was 2.4mbps/0.7mbps :) | 05:44 |
| ShadowJK | I never get that much with bluetooth :) | 05:48 |
| pwnguin | that reminds me to test that tomorrow | 05:49 |
| Foxx | it can be fun to toy with | 05:49 |
| pwnguin | for the next massive network failure | 05:49 |
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| Foxx | I modded some of my CSR Class 1 BT adapters with antenna jacks, and built beefed up antennas | 05:50 |
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| redeeman | Foxx: interresting, how much better range do you get with that? | 05:50 |
| Foxx | well, out of the box my adapter couldnt go across my livingroom | 05:51 |
| Foxx | with my waveguide, it went across the house | 05:51 |
| Foxx | with the waveguide and parabolig dish, it went through the house | 05:51 |
| Foxx | ... across the street | 05:51 |
| Foxx | I have some pictures if you would like to see them, just PM me for the link | 05:52 |
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| pwnguin | any way to identify the imei without taking the back cover off? | 05:58 |
| nez800 | yes | 05:58 |
| nez800 | in settings | 05:58 |
| nez800 | about device has the imei information | 05:58 |
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| pwnguin | so it does | 05:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | usually *#06# should display IMEI, but hmmm... | 06:22 |
| pwnguin | the mail in rebate suggested opening the device | 06:23 |
| nez800 | settings -> about device | 06:23 |
| pwnguin | yes | 06:23 |
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| pwnguin | nez800: ive already followed your advice, thanks | 06:24 |
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| nez800 | no prob. youre welcome | 06:25 |
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| nez800 | None of the # codes seem to work on N900 | 06:25 |
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| nez800 | t-mobile #646# to check minutes, for example, does not get processed | 06:26 |
| nez800 | has anyone noticed this? | 06:26 |
| Mika_i | everybody know that | 06:26 |
| nez800 | I just got the N900 today so wasn't sure | 06:26 |
| pwnguin | i wondered why that wasn't working. is that the downside to unlocked phones? | 06:27 |
| nez800 | no I have had unlocked phones before that worked fine with those codes | 06:28 |
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| crashanddie | NIY | 06:29 |
| pwnguin | yet implies a plan to implement? | 06:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | that,s plainly spoken a bug in dialer | 06:37 |
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| pwnguin | ok, the facebook installer package is actually bigger than the facebook package? | 06:37 |
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| pwnguin | clearly i dont understand the point | 06:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | N.B. a bug implemented on purpose XD | 06:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | some funny mood made devels think it'd be a good idea to check numbers for valid format | 06:39 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | result: bold fail | 06:40 |
| johnx | mornin' LL | 06:40 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Linux Losesrs? | 06:42 |
| nez800 | LUE? | 06:42 |
| johnx | s/caps_lock/a/ :) | 06:42 |
| nez800 | it's an acronym | 06:42 |
| pwnguin | but for what | 06:43 |
| nez800 | Life, Universe, Everything | 06:43 |
| johnx | pwnguin, I really don't know... | 06:43 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | aaaA KFJ | 06:43 |
| nez800 | I don't understand the need for "installer packages"... can't I just install the app through the apt-get front end? | 06:43 |
| johnx | nez800, you mean the ones pre-included? | 06:44 |
| nez800 | yes, but they also show up in the app manager | 06:44 |
| johnx | the package that has the "installer" binary itself you mean? | 06:45 |
| pwnguin | nez800: i could kinda understand a promotional aspect to save on larger packages, but it's tiny | 06:45 |
| johnx | yeah. that's so you can remove it :) | 06:45 |
| nez800 | I did | 06:45 |
| johnx | great. then you're all set | 06:45 |
| nez800 | but of course it is available to install in the app manager | 06:45 |
| nez800 | so I see "facebook" and "facebook installer" as two entries | 06:45 |
| pwnguin | the actual fb app is smaller according to dpkg than the facebook installer | 06:45 |
| nez800 | doesn't really matter to me but it might be confusing to other users | 06:46 |
| nez800 | also did I mention this device shoots amazing video? | 06:46 |
| ali1234 | pwnguin: it probably has crazy deps | 06:46 |
| nez800 | because it does | 06:46 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | wtf is facebook ;-P | 06:46 |
| Xisdibik | its a book of faces | 06:46 |
| nez800 | Bookface | 06:46 |
| ali1234 | s/faces/faeces/ | 06:46 |
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| nez800 | s/faces/feces/g | 06:47 |
| Xisdibik | s/faces/feces/? | 06:47 |
| nez800 | oh snap! | 06:47 |
| Xisdibik | lol | 06:47 |
| pwnguin | DocScrutinizer51: a long long time ago, in 2004, it was a website where hot chicks in college would create profiles; theoretically it was for communicating with your classmates | 06:47 |
| Xisdibik | Jinx nez800 ;) | 06:47 |
| nez800 | not anymore :( | 06:47 |
| pwnguin | but it's basically a dating tool =/ | 06:47 |
| nez800 | psh no it's not | 06:47 |
| johnx | is it like yourfaceinatube? | 06:47 |
| nez800 | it's a farmville playing tool >_> | 06:47 |
| pwnguin | johnx: its not anymore, now that they lifted the .edu email restriction | 06:48 |
| johnx | pwnguin, you missed a reference :) | 06:48 |
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| pwnguin | err | 06:48 |
| pwnguin | bad aim | 06:48 |
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| pwnguin | nez: its not anymore, now that they lifted the .edu email restriction | 06:49 |
| nez800 | I know. I have a facebook | 06:49 |
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| Xisdibik | nez800: is farmville fun? | 06:49 |
| nez800 | I don't know, I don't play it. But my friends who do spam my newsfeed with their updates about it | 06:49 |
| johnx | Xisdibik, that depends. Do you like watching pretend plants grow? | 06:49 |
| pwnguin | anyways, its a social networking website that people upload pictures to and do stupid things on | 06:50 |
| Xisdibik | johnx: yes, i really like the harvest moon series games on the consoles | 06:50 |
| nez800 | harvest moon >> farmville | 06:50 |
| Xisdibik | nez800: :) | 06:50 |
| johnx | Xisdibik, this is apparently like the gutted carcass of harvest moon | 06:50 |
| nez800 | by the way, I made an xkcd app on facebook, in case anyone here likes xkcd | 06:50 |
| Xisdibik | johnx: then not what i want ;) | 06:50 |
| pwnguin | nez800: YOU ARE WHAT IS WRONG WITH AMERICA | 06:50 |
| Xisdibik | are there any harvest moon type games out (aside from harvest moon)? | 06:51 |
| nez800 | sweet! :D | 06:51 |
| Xisdibik | if not one of you programmer peoples needs to go and make one! | 06:51 |
| johnx | Xisdibik, it could also be accurately described as a pyramid scheme without the money | 06:51 |
| pwnguin | we already have an xkcd app | 06:51 |
| pwnguin | its called xkcd | 06:51 |
| nez800 | the fb app just pull's xkcd.com's JSON feed and writes it to your profile's FBML | 06:51 |
| nez800 | err... pulls* | 06:52 |
| pwnguin | does it do img hover? | 06:52 |
| nez800 | hell yeah. I'm not up to version 2.3 for nothing! | 06:52 |
| pwnguin | heh | 06:52 |
| pwnguin | whatev. feed readers handle it just fine | 06:53 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | omg, now I finally realize N900 is a tool to finally get world dominion of the dark side | 06:53 |
| pwnguin | without spamming about who hit that wuzzle last night | 06:53 |
| nez800 | no lie: I know people who have facebook as their homepage | 06:53 |
| pwnguin | nez800: like my mom | 06:53 |
| nez800 | oh god :( | 06:53 |
| crashanddie | people like that should be put up to a wall and shot in the back of the head | 06:54 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | DAAAARK SIDE | 06:54 |
| crashanddie | or maybe line them up, use one bullet for multiple deaths | 06:54 |
| nez800 | this might be a dumb question, but is there any way I can sync my MacBook's address book to my N900? | 06:54 |
| * Xisdibik uses the force to choke pwnguin's mom ;) | 06:54 | |
| nez800 | I have like 80 contacts | 06:54 |
| crashanddie | nez800: address book -> gmail -> n900 | 06:54 |
| nez800 | I can't do that. Gmail messes it up ... already tried | 06:54 |
| Xisdibik | nez800: i can tell you one way that i know. it involves a combination of a mouse, and your thumbs and will take you a long time | 06:55 |
| nez800 | thanks for the sarcasm =) | 06:55 |
| pwnguin | ubuntu has a couchdb thing | 06:55 |
| Xisdibik | nez800: anytime :) | 06:55 |
| pwnguin | maybe import from address book to evolution | 06:55 |
| johnx | nez800, vcards via bluetooth? | 06:55 |
| nez800 | ooh that game me an idea | 06:55 |
| Xisdibik | game you an idea? :) | 06:55 |
| nez800 | I'm going to see how Mac OS X stores its address book | 06:56 |
| nez800 | if it is plain text I can write a script to convert it to a format I can import on the N900 | 06:56 |
| Xisdibik | nez800: you can probably export the address book in several formats | 06:56 |
| nez800 | nope. only "abbu" | 06:56 |
| Xisdibik | Macs are lame ;) | 06:56 |
| pwnguin | i wish i knew more about old macs | 06:56 |
| pwnguin | so i could mention a list of incompatible old contact formats | 06:56 |
| Xisdibik | ^^ | 06:56 |
| nez800 | I use a Mac for most things... I have a Linux laptop for coding | 06:57 |
| crashanddie | nez800: works for other people | 06:57 |
| pwnguin | i have a mac, a pc and ubuntu on my desk | 06:57 |
| pwnguin | its pretty damned ridiculus | 06:57 |
| johnx | nez800, let me boot this powerbook into os x. you're on 10.5 or 10.6, right? | 06:58 |
| nez800 | 10.6 | 06:58 |
| pwnguin | i get but i dont use the mac much. too annoying | 06:58 |
| nez800 | someone wrote a program to convert ABBU to CSV | 06:58 |
| nez800 | yes! link - http://homepage.mac.com/kenferry/software.html | 06:59 |
| pwnguin | heh | 06:59 |
| * paroneayea kinda wants to convert his camera shutter button to be an alt key | 06:59 | |
| nez800 | why? | 06:59 |
| pwnguin | the life of a programmer is mainly building pipe fittings | 06:59 |
| nez800 | and duct taping things ^ | 06:59 |
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| johnx | I want to convert the camera button to do the same as the "switch apps/show all apps" button on the screen | 07:00 |
| paroneayea | nez800: in case that was directed at me, because I want to use emacs easier :P | 07:00 |
| nez800 | johnx: that would be nice | 07:00 |
| pwnguin | so how do i file a bug against a specific package? | 07:00 |
| nez800 | especially given that the camera slider already is a way to lauch it | 07:00 |
| pwnguin | maemo-applet-fmtx | 07:00 |
| crashanddie | pwnguin: bug.maemo.org | 07:01 |
| crashanddie | pwnguin: bugs.maemo.org | 07:01 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | I want a settings plugin to customize all that foo | 07:01 |
| johnx | nez800, select all your contacts, click file -> export -> vcard | 07:01 |
| pwnguin | i wish lp had been open sourced sooner, cuz i really hate bzilla | 07:01 |
| johnx | you should end up with a single file that you can pass to your N900 that included all your contacts | 07:01 |
| nez800 | johnx: you da man! | 07:02 |
| nez800 | doing that right now. | 07:02 |
| Xisdibik | Good work johnx | 07:02 |
| johnx | and if it imports with no problem that you win even more (never tried it ) | 07:02 |
| * Xisdibik puts a gold star on johnx | 07:02 | |
| nez800 | hmm the interface is deceptive - it appears you can only export one vcf at a time, but selecting all lets you do multiple so meh. | 07:03 |
| nez800 | this is going to make syncing a pain | 07:03 |
| pwnguin | i think thats what "ovi" is for | 07:04 |
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| pwnguin | except they want to sync with your other phone | 07:04 |
| nez800 | yeah | 07:04 |
| johnx | really, I want LDAP for my address book :/ | 07:04 |
| pwnguin | and its what couchdb is for, except nobody uses evolution | 07:04 |
| nez800 | I just want things to work properly ... | 07:04 |
| pwnguin | nez800: you could do something with unison | 07:04 |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 07:05 | |
| nez800 | "Import Contacts file"..."no files/folders" | 07:05 |
| nez800 | oh c'mon | 07:05 |
| johnx | ouch | 07:05 |
| paroneayea | hey hey | 07:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | huh? | 07:05 |
| paroneayea | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35089&goto=newpost | 07:05 |
| nez800 | oh | 07:05 |
| paroneayea | so those are the files you edit | 07:05 |
| nez800 | when you are in mass storage mode | 07:05 |
| johnx | huh. did you try shooting the vcard over bluetooth? | 07:05 |
| nez800 | you can't see files on the flash memory when you are in USB mass storage mode. have to unmount it first... | 07:06 |
| Xisdibik | yep | 07:06 |
| Xisdibik | :) | 07:06 |
| nez800 | contacts importing.... | 07:06 |
| johnx | it seems like every night a different group of people talk about syncing and I try and plug syncevolution.org :) | 07:06 |
| nez800 | w00t! | 07:06 |
| * Xisdibik crosses fingers | 07:06 | |
| johnx | nez800, do they look good? | 07:07 |
| nez800 | let me check | 07:07 |
| Xisdibik | everything looks sexy on a n900 screen | 07:07 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nez800, sure.mass storage unmounts the whole fs | 07:07 |
| nez800 | yeah just realized that. | 07:07 |
| Xisdibik | but hes on a n800, so who knows | 07:07 |
| nez800 | like when the N800 unmount the SD card if you take off the back cover | 07:07 |
| nez800 | no I am on a N900 | 07:07 |
| nez800 | well, both, actually | 07:07 |
| pwnguin | my solution is to have no friends | 07:08 |
| * nez800 N800 looks in envy at N900's Maemo 5 | 07:08 | |
| pwnguin | with no friends i have no contacts to maintain! | 07:08 |
| nez800 | contacts imported successfully - including pictures too! | 07:08 |
| nez800 | I am very pleased | 07:08 |
| nez800 | pwnguin you should try having friends sometime. I heard it's not all too bad. | 07:08 |
| nez800 | except for friend drama. that sucks. | 07:08 |
| *** nez800 is now known as nez900 | 07:09 | |
| nez900 | there we go | 07:09 |
| pwnguin | actually, i have friends, its just i only keep in touch with the ones that know IRC | 07:09 |
| nez900 | IRC > Jabber/GTalk > AIM > pretty much anything > facebook chat (oh god the horror) | 07:10 |
| pwnguin | is maemo-applet-fmtx an official desktop widgit? | 07:10 |
| Xisdibik | pwnguin: ill be your friend | 07:11 |
| Xisdibik | but only because your name is a play on Penguin | 07:11 |
| pwnguin | pwnage and penguins, whats not to like? | 07:11 |
| nez900 | I want to play supertux now .... | 07:11 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: i have Gtalk, and Skype active on my n900, everything else has the boot | 07:11 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: can you test something once u have it installed, play the game, then quit, and tlel me if it leaves a big black square on your screen | 07:12 |
| Xisdibik | :D | 07:12 |
| nez900 | I tried staying signed on to Gtalk and skype from my N900 but the problem is people keep messaging me thinking I am at my desk | 07:12 |
| Xisdibik | and leave u in mouse mode | 07:12 |
| * pwnguin takes linux to lanparties | 07:12 | |
| Xisdibik | nez900: i made new accounts for both, so people know ones mobile and ones not | 07:12 |
| nez900 | Xisdibik I was going to play it on my laptop but hold on I will try on the N900.. need to install it now | 07:12 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: sure :D | 07:12 |
| nez900 | also that's a good idea. | 07:12 |
| johnx | timeless_mbp, hey. are you around? | 07:12 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: for skype its nice, though if i decide to subscripbe to a service from them, it means one account will have it one wont, but i can live with that, login to the subscribed one if i need calls from laptop | 07:13 |
| * johnx needs to figure out what he installed that broke pulseaudio on his N900 | 07:14 | |
| Xisdibik | nez900: for GTalk, ive had two gmail accounts for ages, because i dont want ppl mailing my phone all the time, only select people have that one :) | 07:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: ouch | 07:14 |
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| nez900 | I am concerned over the battery drain leaving IM signed in all the time | 07:14 |
| Xisdibik | i have it set to use 2.5G only | 07:15 |
| Xisdibik | and wifi is on all the time (and active with wifi around) | 07:15 |
| nez900 | I get 3.5G in some parts of campus | 07:15 |
| Xisdibik | and it goes the whole day and more | 07:15 |
| nez900 | and 2G in others | 07:15 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, it's not like I didn't have it coming. I'd just like to figure out how it happened and get it fixed before tomorrow | 07:15 |
| Xisdibik | i get 3-3.5G in alot of places, but i keep it set for 2G | 07:15 |
| Xisdibik | as its fine for IM | 07:15 |
| nez900 | do you have an opinion on a good twitter client for N900? | 07:15 |
| Xisdibik | i had Mauku widget | 07:16 |
| Xisdibik | didnt use it much | 07:16 |
| Xisdibik | removed it | 07:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: actually I wonder which pkg could bork PA | 07:16 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, it's actually pretty weird. something happened that's causing PA and the system tray thing to both use 50% of the CPU time and sound and touchscreen vibrations don't work | 07:16 |
| pwnguin | maybe i'll just send an email to the maintainer field and let them figure out where it belongs in bugzilla | 07:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yay | 07:17 |
| pwnguin | cuz ive got no clue; are there allowed to be packages in extras without a product in bugzilla? | 07:17 |
| johnx | and weirdest of all it seems that video no longer plays either (!!) | 07:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: some hungup notification? | 07:17 |
| johnx | maybe. I really hope it was some weird package I installed, but i first noticed it while plugging in headphones and switching to silent mode at the same time | 07:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | video... jmm. Some flash in browser then? | 07:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | seen that on quite a number of desktops | 07:18 |
| johnx | dunno about the browser | 07:19 |
| nez900 | SuperTux is working fine for me. Game play is laggy though. | 07:19 |
| johnx | I mean even the boot-up "Nokia hands" video | 07:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: rebooted? | 07:19 |
| johnx | rebooted, pulled battery, left off with battery out for 8 hours (x2) | 07:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | so all my previous ideas are moot | 07:19 |
| johnx | yeah. it's got me pretty stumped, and I like to think I have at least a passing familiarity with the maemo architecture | 07:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | plugged/unplugged headphones once or twise again? | 07:20 |
| johnx | ...nothing interesting in dmesg... | 07:20 |
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| johnx | yeah. I'll try the headphones again | 07:21 |
| nez900 | Putting phone into portrait mode should toggle Phone app, right? | 07:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | known issue from FR | 07:21 |
| nez900 | or do I have to check a setting | 07:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, in phone settings | 07:21 |
| johnx | and not where you think either. ;) it's phone -> settings rather than settings -> phone | 07:22 |
| nez900 | settings -> phone has nothing related to it | 07:22 |
| nez900 | thanks for the info johnx would not have found it there | 07:22 |
| johnx | took me a while, even after someone told me the setting existed | 07:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | oops sorry for talking ambiguous | 07:22 |
| johnx | not your fault | 07:23 |
| johnx | it's an ambiguously located setting | 07:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | lol - yeah | 07:23 |
| Macer | Relay access denied; from=<itidgh483987@hotmail.com> to=<s2288@mail2000.com.tw> | 07:23 |
| Macer | haha | 07:23 |
| nez900 | erm... where is settings in the phone app? | 07:23 |
| Macer | hotmail trying to spam .tw relaying through my mail server? :) | 07:23 |
| johnx | so hildon-status-menu and pulseaudio are both going nuts (load average is ~2). no sound, no vibrate-on-screen tap. videos refuse to play | 07:23 |
| Macer | what is this world coming to? | 07:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: what's up now with Ur audio? | 07:24 |
| Macer | wtf uses hotmail anymore? | 07:24 |
| johnx | nez900, from the menu at the top | 07:24 |
| nez900 | never mind I found it .. "Turning control" | 07:24 |
| nez900 | johnx: what happens if you kill pulseaudio? | 07:24 |
| Macer | now that i think about it... does anybody use aol anymore? | 07:24 |
| johnx | it respawns with the same problem | 07:24 |
| Macer | like actual aol? didn't tw buy them out or something? | 07:24 |
| johnx | nez900, a terrifying amount | 07:24 |
| johnx | hmmm...though maybe that's just people who have @aol.com webmail addresses | 07:25 |
| nez900 | .com.tw is not time warner | 07:25 |
| nez900 | it's taiwan | 07:25 |
| johnx | do they give those out free now? | 07:25 |
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| johnx | are you sure time warner doesn't own taiwan? | 07:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: booting or shutdown with hs plugged is a known problem on some linuxes | 07:25 |
| johnx | yup | 07:25 |
| johnx | been through multiple reboots now | 07:25 |
| johnx | and some other things with the status-area seem to be "wacky" | 07:26 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: tested Super Tux yet? | 07:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: weird. scary | 07:26 |
| nez900 | Xisdibik: yes I said earlier that it worked fine although gameplay was a bit laggy | 07:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: anyway I'm short of ideas now | 07:26 |
| johnx | actually the status-area menu no longer shows any buttons, just a flat dark grey box | 07:26 |
| Xisdibik | nez900: strange ok | 07:26 |
| nez900 | and by a bit I mean it was jumping around ... | 07:26 |
| * johnx digs into gconf | 07:27 | |
| Xisdibik | nez900: was smooth as butter for me | 07:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | gonna get me some food and g'night then | 07:27 |
| nez900 | strange. and my N900 is brand new | 07:27 |
| zgold | ali1234: ping | 07:27 |
| nez900 | goodnight doc | 07:27 |
| johnx | 'night DocScrutinizer | 07:28 |
| nez900 | sometimes my N900 screen goes totally black and I have to slide the keyboard out and in to make it come back | 07:30 |
| nez900 | is this normal? | 07:30 |
| Foxx | my n800 does that when its idle. I need to hit a hardware button to wake it up | 07:30 |
| johnx | the phone is locking :) | 07:31 |
| johnx | you can use the slider on the side to turn it back on as well | 07:31 |
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| nez900 | no, I mean in the middle of using an app | 07:31 |
| nez900 | I know when it locks | 07:31 |
| nez900 | duh | 07:31 |
| nez900 | :P | 07:31 |
| johnx | sorry :P had someone ask the same question the other night and he *didn't* know it locked | 07:31 |
| nez900 | oh | 07:31 |
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| johnx | it does go to screen-off pretty quick though | 07:32 |
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| nez900 | yeah at first I thought the slider was to take off the back cover | 07:32 |
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| nez900 | but the manual (who reads those!?) said it was not | 07:32 |
| Foxx | that one suprised me a bit, because I use x11vnc to work on it and out of nowhere it will lock and hald the inputs dont work via VNC anymore | 07:32 |
| johnx | heh. brute force is to take off the back cover | 07:32 |
| Foxx | half* | 07:32 |
| nez900 | I was scared I was going to break it | 07:32 |
| nez900 | I bricked my N800 the first day I had it when upgrading IT OS2008 | 07:32 |
| johnx | it loosens up a bit after a while | 07:32 |
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| johnx | like actually bricked it? | 07:33 |
| johnx | that's pretty rare | 07:33 |
| nez900 | I don't really see a need to take the back cover off all too much unless your N900 freezes though | 07:33 |
| nez900 | yeah. really bricked. | 07:33 |
| nez900 | wouldn't even turn on the blue LEDs under the D-pad | 07:33 |
| johnx | did the battery completely die during flash? | 07:34 |
| nez900 | the now-defunct circuit city honored the return policy not knowing that my USB hub reset itself during the flashing process | 07:34 |
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| johnx | my local circuit city is now an empty building with a christmas tree lot out front in the parking lot | 07:35 |
| RST38h | moo all | 07:36 |
| johnx | m00f RST38h | 07:37 |
| RST38h | heya | 07:37 |
| Arkenoi | moo | 07:37 |
| RST38h | johnx, Arkenoi: Vulture's Eye is now in Extras-Devel | 07:38 |
| RST38h | It is optified, so safe to install | 07:38 |
| Arkenoi | will try | 07:38 |
| johnx | RST38h, what was the permissions weirdness? | 07:38 |
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| RST38h | johnx: Looks like my chmod g+s did not quite work yesterday morning | 07:39 |
| RST38h | the ali124 guy noticed it in the ls -la yesterday night | 07:39 |
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| pupnik | uqm package says it depends on joydev package, which is unavailable | 07:43 |
| RST38h | hey pupnik | 07:43 |
| nez900 | GUYS I JUST MADE an amazing discovery! Ovi is like Mobile Me except... FREE. Let's all go tell those iPhone users to shove it! | 07:43 |
| RST38h | pupnik: yea, uqm is currently broken in the repo. But you can always play with V instead :) | 07:43 |
| RST38h | What us Mobile Me? Who needs it? Who needs Ovi, too? | 07:44 |
| ShadowJK | beats me | 07:44 |
| Arkenoi | uqm as most games is not playable on 2-arrows keyboard :-( | 07:45 |
| Arkenoi | it is quite common bug | 07:45 |
| nez900 | yeah :( | 07:45 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: bit the bullet and tell Maemo that your keyboard is "Netherlands/UK"? | 07:46 |
| RST38h | s/bit/bite | 07:46 |
| Arkenoi | RST38h, i need a dynamic switcher then - i type much of cyrillic text | 07:47 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: ukeyboad may help, try | 07:47 |
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| RST38h | ukeyboard | 07:48 |
| tigert | you could maybe have the touchscreen kbd in one layout and the hw one in another? | 07:52 |
| tigert | if that works for you | 07:52 |
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| RST38h | it does not work for him. | 07:52 |
| RST38h | nor fo anyone, really =( | 07:53 |
| johnx | anyone else have an idea on why hildon-status-menu and pulseaudio are both trying trying to use all my CPU time (50% user, 50% system)? Otherwise, I'll just backup my stuff and reflash | 07:56 |
| * johnx <3 the touchscreen keyboard | 07:57 | |
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| RST38h | johnx: I would kill pulseaudio process | 08:02 |
| redeeman | johnx: my pulseaudio only uses ~20-30% cpu when theres audio playing | 08:03 |
| RST38h | probably got stuck somewhere | 08:03 |
| redeeman | i think its very high though | 08:03 |
| pupnik | no redeeman that is there to show you how fast the N900 cpu is | 08:03 |
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| johnx | RST38h, yeah. it got stuck over like 5 reboots and a battery pull. i can summarize other things I've tried if you're interested | 08:04 |
| redeeman | pupnik: theres no excuse whatsoever for an audio daemon using that much cpu on a fast system like the N900 :) | 08:04 |
| flx_ | redeeman, that sounds quite hich indeed. maybe for some reason it needs to do resampling? | 08:04 |
| pupnik | the excuse is a mistake was made. ever made a mistake redeeman ? | 08:04 |
| johnx | redeeman, what if the CPU is running at low speed? | 08:04 |
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| redeeman | pupnik: well.. true, but that should have been caught | 08:05 |
| RST38h | johnx: What are you running in background? Any specific widgets? | 08:05 |
| redeeman | johnx: yeah, i've been thinking that, but i don't think the cortex-a8 can scale that low | 08:05 |
| redeeman | johnx: and realistically, we're talking seriously low frequency for it to consume that much | 08:05 |
| johnx | redeeman, it scales to 250MHz | 08:05 |
| redeeman | unless it resamples and uses a VERY fancy algorithm | 08:05 |
| * RST38h reiterates his desire to exterminate everyone who starts another audio framework for Linux | 08:06 | |
| pupnik | :) glad you are also bothered by it redeeman | 08:06 |
| johnx | redeeman, it involves "digital amplification" IIRC :) | 08:06 |
| redeeman | RST38h: no, you should rather exterminate those who would use it | 08:06 |
| johnx | that's an interesting thought. but I'm not running anything I wasn't before this happened | 08:06 |
| RST38h | redeeman: I am going for a greener solution. Fewer bodies. | 08:07 |
| redeeman | RST38h: more bodies means less wasteful cars used | 08:07 |
| redeeman | :) | 08:07 |
| johnx | the part that weirds me out is hildon-status-menu using up CPU as well | 08:07 |
| redeeman | yes, that's strange | 08:07 |
| RST38h | BTW, if I understand things correctly, Maemo6 will be switching to Phonon? ;))) | 08:07 |
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| redeeman | RST38h: hopefully | 08:07 |
| RST38h | johnx: Why not kill the process? It should restart. | 08:08 |
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| RST38h | johnx: or strace by pid and see what it is doing | 08:08 |
| redeeman | it seems very likely they will switch to phonon, they have after all integrated it as part of Qt, and it is superior to pulseaudio :) | 08:08 |
| redeeman | i really want maemo 6 :D | 08:08 |
| RST38h | yea, right...superior...yeah... | 08:08 |
| johnx | RST38h, tried rebooting, tried killing processes | 08:08 |
| johnx | haven't straced yet | 08:08 |
| johnx | I will now that I'm backed up | 08:08 |
| redeeman | RST38h: pulseaudio is below garbage for a wide variety of reasons | 08:09 |
| RST38h | that's what they all say... | 08:09 |
| redeeman | i hope so | 08:09 |
| RST38h | <other framework> is garbage | 08:09 |
| redeeman | yes well.. the difference is, most of them don't know anything about it | 08:10 |
| redeeman | they probably had some issue, and go "garbage" | 08:10 |
| RST38h | and you do? :) | 08:10 |
| redeeman | as a matter of fact, yes | 08:10 |
| * RST38h wants /dev/dsp back. | 08:10 | |
| johnx | redeeman, cool. why is phonon better than pulseaudio | 08:10 |
| RST38h | Or /dev/pcm. Or /dev/audio. | 08:10 |
| * johnx is curious | 08:10 | |
| redeeman | i agree, oss was better(in principle, the linux implementation was crap) | 08:11 |
| RST38h | That was the last working audio. | 08:11 |
| redeeman | alsa works too | 08:11 |
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| RST38h | as long as it is /dev/dsp, yes | 08:11 |
| RST38h | when it is ALSA, it does not work | 08:11 |
| redeeman | it does | 08:11 |
| redeeman | you probably use a distribution that ships a non default config | 08:11 |
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| redeeman | or one that ships broken application configs | 08:11 |
| johnx | yay. we're having this discussion again! just what I always wanted | 08:11 |
| * RST38h sighs | 08:11 | |
| ShadowJK | the free linux implementation was limited | 08:11 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: And that is exactly how I like it. Limited. | 08:12 |
| pupnik | the only mp3 player that has 'delete current track' appears to be 'dbpoweramp' | 08:12 |
| johnx | pro tip: you guys won't convince each other. | 08:12 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: To playing audio. | 08:12 |
| johnx | now fix my problem instead :) | 08:12 |
| redeeman | johnx: pulseaudio is extremely buggy, that can ofc be fixed, but its also having various issues, for instance relatively high latency, it messes up badly with lots of streams, it has a tendancy to introduce jitter | 08:12 |
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| ShadowJK | oss has alsa emulation these days, amusingly enough :) | 08:12 |
| johnx | redeeman, and you think this is inherent to the design rather than implementation? | 08:12 |
| * ShadowJK wonders if it still costs money | 08:12 | |
| johnx | ShadowJK, everything has everything emulation :) | 08:13 |
| redeeman | johnx: nah, it can probably be fixed, though its design is somewhat limited in the latency regard - allthough phonon isn't designed for lowlatency either | 08:13 |
| ShadowJK | alsa is highly capable of introducing multisecond jitter of its own :-) | 08:13 |
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| johnx | ShadowJK, but it's easier if we use pulseaudio! hey, wait... | 08:14 |
| ShadowJK | then you have alsa redirecting to pulse redirecting to alsa that eventually feeds it to hw... | 08:14 |
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| redeeman | yes lol, complete madness | 08:14 |
| johnx | except that lowest level alsa is actually really oss-alsa emulation | 08:15 |
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| redeeman | some people also pipe it over jack from pulseaudio | 08:15 |
| redeeman | which then goes alsa | 08:15 |
| johnx | can we get esd involved somehow? or maybe arts? | 08:15 |
| redeeman | yes, but not easily :P | 08:15 |
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| redeeman | ofcourse not that the other stuff is easy | 08:15 |
| nez900 | goodnight all! I thank you for your help. | 08:16 |
| redeeman | plain alsa is far easier | 08:16 |
| johnx | nez900, 'night | 08:16 |
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| johnx | yeah. I was pretty happy with alsa+dmix | 08:16 |
| redeeman | the thing is | 08:16 |
| ShadowJK | mplayer without the "I have broken sound"-switch is alot smoother if you tell it to access alsa hw:0.0 directly instead of alsa default device :-) | 08:16 |
| redeeman | 99% of the people that complain about audio on linux | 08:16 |
| ShadowJK | ... if you haven't got broken sound drivers, that is | 08:16 |
| redeeman | are either using a distribution with an insane setup, like.. pulseaudio or worse, or uses applications that access hw directly | 08:17 |
| redeeman | dmix works very well for nearly all uses | 08:17 |
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| redeeman | so all people gotta do is instruct their application not to take the hardware by the balls, and they'll do fine | 08:17 |
| redeeman | (which should be a sane default, and is in most applications) | 08:17 |
| ShadowJK | dmix was worse than pulseaudio by miles | 08:17 |
| redeeman | dmix has worked without issues since they enabled it by default many many years ago | 08:18 |
| redeeman | with a few exceptions such as mmaping etc | 08:18 |
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| ShadowJK | the first version forked behind an application's back, and you were left with dozens of rogue copies of random programs, all hanging dmix in some way until you went hunting for them | 08:19 |
| ShadowJK | they changed that later I think | 08:19 |
| redeeman | i've never had that | 08:20 |
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| redeeman | and i've used it since on my first amd64 box, which was when amd64 was introduced | 08:20 |
| redeeman | so needless to say, its a long time ago | 08:20 |
| luke-jr | ShadowJK: that's a problem with the fork design of *nix :/ | 08:20 |
| ShadowJK | not sure if dmix ever gave correct buffer fill data back to apps. When I last tried it, it could say "there's 500ms worth of audio in the buffer" for 400ms and then jump to 0 | 08:21 |
| redeeman | i don't know if i've tried that, i've had some files that played weirdly, but i suspect that's the files, though i obviously cannot be 100% sure | 08:22 |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr: it's why libraries shouldn't unexpectedly fork() behind an application's back. it's asking for bugs, and bugs it got | 08:22 |
| redeeman | oh well.. time for me to sleep, its 07:24 :) night | 08:24 |
| luke-jr | ShadowJK: unfortunately, there is no clean way to create a new process other than forking | 08:24 |
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| luke-jr | there might be some clone() variant that can do it, but clone isn't POSIX | 08:25 |
| ShadowJK | it's alsa, they don't have to be portable | 08:25 |
| luke-jr | true :) | 08:25 |
| luke-jr | they could probably even just use threads actually | 08:25 |
| redeeman | linux doesn't have the ordinary concept of threads | 08:26 |
| luke-jr | ... | 08:26 |
| redeeman | but yeah | 08:26 |
| simula | are the maemo sdk images for virtualbox or vmware? | 08:26 |
| ShadowJK | creating threads behind an apps back is also evil | 08:26 |
| luke-jr | whatever 'ordinary concept' means | 08:27 |
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| crashanddie | It's 22:27, and I'm still at the office | 08:27 |
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| crashanddie | We're waiting for this chick in Oz to finish some stuff for us before we can go home | 08:28 |
| johnx | crashanddie, why? | 08:28 |
| johnx | ah | 08:28 |
| johnx | is her name Dorothy? | 08:28 |
| crashanddie | we're throwing stress balls at each other because of the boredom | 08:28 |
| Flandry | hyuk hyuk | 08:28 |
| ShadowJK | basically, it's like they wanted to hide that there existed a sound server, so they made their lib fork a new process for every app and communicate over shm (or something like that).. they could've avoided all the wtf by not trying to hide it :) | 08:29 |
| crashanddie | Two of the balls collided in mid-air | 08:29 |
| crashanddie | We burst out in laughter, and I semi-yell: "Haha, I love it when our balls smash into each other" | 08:29 |
| crashanddie | The girls goes: "WTF?" | 08:29 |
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| crashanddie | I'm supposed to be her boss... | 08:30 |
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| ShadowJK | you should've just asked if she's got anything against guys having fun | 08:31 |
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| crashanddie | we're done | 08:33 |
| crashanddie | I'm out | 08:33 |
| crashanddie | talk later | 08:33 |
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| red | hey, using butterfly IM in maemo | 08:55 |
| luke-jr | ... | 08:55 |
| red | i see msn info in the contacts compartment for every contact that isn't online | 08:56 |
| red | and for the ones that are online, theres the green dot next to their image, naturally - but the msn icon / contact adress isn't listed in the view | 08:56 |
| red | unless I click edit, then I can see it | 08:56 |
| red | so basicly, butterfly lets me contact offline contacts by doubleclicking the address.. but it disappears for online ppl, so i have to navigate manually to Instant Messaging and pick them off from that list | 08:57 |
| red | it's np in a way, but seems bit odd that i can call them, sms them from the normal contact field, even send im messages - but not if they are online | 08:58 |
| red | is this some sort of bug or intended, anyone know? | 08:58 |
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| johnx | I'm thinking it's a bug | 08:59 |
| johnx | did you try msn haze? | 08:59 |
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| red | definately a bug, tested with a fresh contacts (emptied, rebooted device, tested on 2ndary msn account) | 09:11 |
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| red | can see the icon to send im for everyone - except the two contacts that are online | 09:12 |
| red | johnx: does msn haze integrate into contacts so that i can IM straight from there? | 09:12 |
| johnx | yeah | 09:12 |
| andre__ | at least for me that worked | 09:12 |
| red | aight | 09:12 |
| red | saw fring | 09:12 |
| johnx | it's like "account-plugins-haze" or something | 09:12 |
| red | and atleats on iphone it was just standalone app | 09:12 |
| red | ill dl haze and give it a go ty | 09:13 |
| johnx | sure. :) | 09:13 |
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| red | no hits for "haze" via search in N900 app control | 09:15 |
| red | am i missing some app list? | 09:15 |
| red | got extras-testing and fremantle tools added | 09:15 |
| johnx | ah. it might be in extras-testing or extras-devel | 09:15 |
| johnx | it'll be account-plugins-<something> I think | 09:15 |
| red | search will search the extras testing too ofc? | 09:15 |
| johnx | I think so | 09:16 |
| johnx | I just looked at the "All" listing | 09:16 |
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| red | only have two account-plugins | 09:16 |
| johnx | actually, I'll help you look in a sec. I'm reflashing now | 09:16 |
| red | idle and salut | 09:16 |
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| red | ill search for devel list meanwhile, dont think i have it | 09:16 |
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| johnx | you might want to disable devel after installing account-plugins from it as stuff there can be a little shakier than extras or testing | 09:17 |
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| red | i've gathered as much | 09:18 |
| red | dont feel like taking my device to service after i finally have everything set up :) | 09:18 |
| red | im happy having root control, apt-get, wget, nano, ircing, msn | 09:19 |
| red | but the 1 is lacking so bit more tweaking =) | 09:19 |
| pupnik | i love how maemo.org requires three different logins | 09:19 |
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| red | johnx: i read some bugging in haze aswell | 09:25 |
| red | some guy having his msn connection stuck, uninstalled haze but couldnt get any other work afterwards | 09:25 |
| red | and incorrect setting of nick / status | 09:25 |
| red | so unsure if its worth the hazzle? or do you have any knowledge about recent bugfixes in it? | 09:26 |
| johnx | errr...I was using it up until last night | 09:26 |
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| johnx | it seems to work just fine most of the time | 09:27 |
| mece | Is there a bugtracker for Witter? | 09:27 |
| johnx | it did have trouble getting "stuck" in some situations I think, though | 09:27 |
| rashed2020 | Does Mono come preinstalled on the N900? | 09:27 |
| pupnik | no | 09:28 |
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| mece | rashed2020, no mono for N900, but I read somewhere that it's coming. Maybe. | 09:29 |
| rashed2020 | mece: No mono, period? Or no Mono installed? | 09:30 |
| rashed2020 | Oh, I got it. Shame :/ | 09:31 |
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| Stskeeps | no mono installed or ported yet i think | 09:32 |
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| adeus | I think it was for the previous maemos, so porting it should not be a big issue | 09:33 |
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| mece | rashed2020, no mono _yet_ :) I did read on a blog somewhere that it's actually in the works. I forget where so might not be reliable. | 09:36 |
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| luke-jr | mono sucks | 10:15 |
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| Vratha_ | hi | 10:34 |
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| Vratha | any of you know how to create a ringtone for the n900? i just took one of my aac files from itunes and threw it in the ringtones folder | 10:35 |
| Vratha | but it doesn't show up in the list of ringtones. does it limit it by size? | 10:35 |
| Termana | lol | 10:35 |
| Foxx | I dont have a n900, but im pretty sure AAC files are locked to iTunes and your specific ipod | 10:35 |
| Foxx | try an MP3 | 10:35 |
| Termana | i don't think the n900 has native aac support | 10:35 |
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| Termana | ^^ what foxx said as well | 10:36 |
| Vratha | all the default ringtones on the n900 are .aac files | 10:36 |
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| Foxx | iTunes still locks the files so they cant be played on anything else | 10:36 |
| wazd | hello maemo | 10:37 |
| Vratha | no, i tunes doesn't do that naymore | 10:37 |
| Vratha | itunes* | 10:37 |
| tekojo | hello wazd | 10:37 |
| frals_ | mornin all o/ | 10:37 |
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| Vratha | i can already play my aac file on the n900 music player | 10:37 |
| Foxx | no?? *shrugs* that is why I stopped using it, that and its a horrible piece of software in general | 10:37 |
| Vratha | i just can't get it working as a ringtone | 10:37 |
| Vratha | no, apple removed drm months ago | 10:37 |
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| Foxx | I dont see how they could have gotten away with that with the RIAA and all | 10:38 |
| Vratha | uh | 10:38 |
| Vratha | this happened ages ago | 10:38 |
| Vratha | all the big record labels got on board | 10:38 |
| Foxx | well, have you tried an MP3 to rule out a file format issue? | 10:39 |
| Vratha | not yet, but i was going to try. i'm just trying to find a converter | 10:39 |
| Foxx | or perhaps read the owners manual? | 10:39 |
| Foxx | what OS do you use? | 10:39 |
| Vratha | OS X | 10:39 |
| Vratha | also, since my file formats match between the default ringtones and my music file, you'd think it'd work | 10:40 |
| Foxx | whelp, im useless, I dont have a mac | 10:40 |
| Foxx | I like having computers that go beyond the sloagn "it just works" | 10:40 |
| Foxx | otherise I would have suggested mediacoder | 10:40 |
| wazd | Pandora looks so oldskool, oh my :) | 10:41 |
| Vratha | Foxx: oh, you don't know macs very well then :) | 10:41 |
| Foxx | not very well, all of my development is done under linux and windows | 10:41 |
| Foxx | OSX doesnt allow hardware level access to my hardware | 10:42 |
| Vratha | alright, got the N900 mounted on my mac and am using "file" to check the file formats. they do in fact differ | 10:42 |
| Vratha | will just have to convert this i guess, even though both are aac | 10:42 |
| Vratha | they are just different aac | 10:42 |
| Foxx | dont get me wrong, im not against macs or OSX, but for my personal applications they dont work for me | 10:43 |
| Foxx | hell, I still use DOS | 10:43 |
| Vratha | yeah | 10:43 |
| Foxx | the right tool for the right job, as they say | 10:43 |
| Vratha | i don't hold it against you; everyone has their style | 10:43 |
| Vratha | yeah | 10:43 |
| Foxx | I recently did a class on NES Hacking and such, there are no decent debuggers for OSX | 10:44 |
| wazd | I'm not against OSX or Macs, but Apple sucks :D | 10:44 |
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| Foxx | Linux and Windows, I had to help someone cross compile an old branch of the FCE Ultra emulator | 10:44 |
| wazd | just kidding :) | 10:44 |
| Vratha | Foxx: what kind of debuggers? | 10:44 |
| Vratha | we have xcode | 10:44 |
| Foxx | NES | 10:44 |
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| Vratha | using gdb in the backend, but i don't know what you were doing exactly | 10:44 |
| Foxx | Nintendo Entertainment System | 10:45 |
| Termana | funny, i thought a osx user would buy an iphone not a non-consumer rated n900 | 10:45 |
| Vratha | yeah, i know the NES. they have a special debugger for that? | 10:45 |
| Termana | an* | 10:45 |
| RST38h | 10:45 | |
| Foxx | I wouldnt call it special, its all open source | 10:45 |
| Vratha | Termana: i do own an iphone | 10:45 |
| Vratha | but this just shows your ignorance :) | 10:45 |
| Foxx | just nobody has really gotten it ported to OSX with specific optomizations | 10:45 |
| Vratha | Foxx: ah, understood | 10:46 |
| Foxx | this is one of those cases where a 400Mhz PC is a good enough tool, just because the tools exist | 10:46 |
| Foxx | I have some kick ass hardware fpr my hacking stuffs that have no OSX support at all | 10:46 |
| Termana | no, i'm just recalling the fact most males that use a mac have man-love with steve jobs. females love him too, just look at ijustine | 10:46 |
| Foxx | EEPROM/FlashROM emulators and programmers, and things of the like | 10:47 |
| Vratha | i do love steve jobs | 10:47 |
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| Vratha | i have a man crush | 10:47 |
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| Foxx | I also dont know of any circuit simulators for OSX, although it would probably outperform a PC | 10:47 |
| Vratha | but it stops at the app store and their approval (rejection?) process | 10:47 |
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| Vratha | Foxx: hmm, i can't help you there. i would like to know of one myself | 10:48 |
| Foxx | if you find out, let me know? | 10:48 |
| Termana | well at least you admit your man crush :P lol | 10:48 |
| Foxx | lol | 10:48 |
| Vratha | i'm not a big EE guy (yet), but i do dabble in hobby robotics sometimes | 10:48 |
| Vratha | Termana: totally :-) | 10:49 |
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| KMFDM | does anyone else have an issue with the the IM sound being played if you get an IM with headphones connected while playing something in the media player even though my IM sound volume is zero | 10:51 |
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| KMFDM | it only happens with headphones in and media playing | 10:52 |
| KMFDM | well with media playing i haven't tested with ehadphones out | 10:52 |
| andre__ | KMFDM, There is an "IM sound volume"? | 10:53 |
| KMFDM | andre__, yeah | 10:53 |
| KMFDM | in profile | 10:53 |
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| KMFDM | together with sms | 10:53 |
| KMFDM | 10:53 | |
| KMFDM | and ringtone | 10:53 |
| KMFDM | it is incredibly annoying as im usually carrying on 3-4 IM chats | 10:54 |
| KMFDM | and now i can't play music on the phone | 10:54 |
| KMFDM | it only happens since I flashed the device | 10:54 |
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| KMFDM | perhaps it is a media player setting i forgot to change back | 10:54 |
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| andre__ | oh. hehe :) | 10:55 |
| slonopotamus | wow, just wow | 10:56 |
| andre__ | KMFDM, what account type? | 10:56 |
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| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: mm? | 10:56 |
| KMFDM | andre__, what IM account type is causing the beeps? | 10:56 |
| * slonopotamus goes tomorrow to local nokia representative get his n900-gift-from-nokia | 10:56 | |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: scary - what'd you have to do to get that? :P | 10:57 |
| andre__ | KMFDM, Gmail, XMPP, Jabber, ICQ, MSN? :-P | 10:57 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: N900 key chain? :) | 10:57 |
| KMFDM | yeah i wnanted to be sure that is what you meant/ I have only tested with gmail so far | 10:57 |
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| andre__ | KMFDM, want to send me a message via Gmail so I can test it? :-) | 10:57 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: you won't believe me. absolutely nothing :) just got email yesterday that they wanted to give it to me since i am 'expert in this area and my opinion is important to them' :) | 10:57 |
| wazd | I wonder why nokia is so kind to everyone except me :D | 10:58 |
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| jysky | does anyone have any idea how to install crl:s to n900. S60 phones had it through browser but N900 browser doesn't understand certificate files | 10:58 |
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| KMFDM | sure PM me your address or post it here | 10:58 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade: :P | 10:58 |
| andre__ | slonopotamus: sounds like a typical spam mail. Will you also receive millions of dollars? ;-) | 10:58 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: you're obviously doing too much. if you had kept quiet, they would have slipped you one? ;p | 10:58 |
| slonopotamus | andre__: they're really nokia representative. and they confirmed when i called them by phone | 10:59 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: yeah, maybe the world has changed :D | 10:59 |
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| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: and you won't be kidnapped and put to work in the Maemo Siberian Work Camp for Coders? | 10:59 |
| slonopotamus | wazd: maybe someone from nokia likes gentoo :D | 10:59 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: less action -> more free stuff :) | 10:59 |
| Vratha | gentoo, where you become an expert overnight by watching shit scroll by the screen | 11:00 |
| Vratha | the faster it goes, the more expert you are | 11:00 |
| slonopotamus | Vratha: wrong | 11:00 |
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| Vratha | well, that's what a website told me | 11:00 |
| slonopotamus | Vratha: it shouldn't go too fast | 11:00 |
| slonopotamus | Vratha: there's some local optimum | 11:01 |
| wazd | slonopotamus: yeah, that's how it works I guess :) You need to be loved by someone in nokia :) | 11:01 |
| vesa | hmm, application manager startup says: operation failed. log shows 'apt-worker exited.' and 'sudo: /etc/sudoers is zero length'. time for a reflash? =) | 11:01 |
| Vratha | gentoo goes for a global optimum | 11:01 |
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| Vratha | with racing stripes | 11:01 |
| slonopotamus | wazd: i wonder whom i'll have to thank for that :) | 11:01 |
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| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: i see what they're doing.. trying to get as many coders away from n8x0 as possible :P | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | if suddenly luke-jr receives one, we have to be suspicious | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:02 |
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| slonopotamus | hehe :) | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | wazd, your best tactic is obviously to only do gfx for n8x0 ;) | 11:03 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: wazd :D | 11:04 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: heh :) | 11:04 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: that's a bit boring :) | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | yeah :P | 11:05 |
| andre__ | KMFDM, seen my PM? | 11:05 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: did you try qt designer and such yet btw? | 11:06 |
| slonopotamus | btw, is n900 as brickable as n8x0? | 11:06 |
| * andre__ realizes that he has blogged this morning. damn scheduled posts :-P | 11:06 | |
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| lbt_ | mutter - is texrat for real? | 11:06 |
| flx_ | vesa, do you have an ssh-server running? | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | what did he do now? | 11:06 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: yep, nice stuff | 11:06 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: haven't tried it really close though | 11:07 |
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| pwnguin | is there an alt key (meta?) | 11:07 |
| Stskeeps | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=417989&postcount=11 <- insane insane people | 11:07 |
| flx_ | stskeeps, I wouldn't be surprised if the device starts failing after some time after the water test.. | 11:08 |
| vesa | flx_: i use sshfs, but no server running afaik | 11:09 |
| Foxx | thats almost as bad as 'Will it Blend?' | 11:09 |
| woglinde | stskeep lol | 11:09 |
| pwnguin | i guess esc suffices | 11:09 |
| wazd | oh, I've reached 11k downloads total in Maemo 5 extras! Celebrate! :D | 11:09 |
| woglinde | hm maybeee they had choose fire | 11:09 |
| Foxx | someone needs to tell that person smashing a device does not equal a brick | 11:09 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Check out his youtube videos. | 11:09 |
| woglinde | morning x-fade | 11:10 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: The phone takes quite some abuse. | 11:10 |
| lbt_ | Stskeeps: community flyer ... quim offered a critique and he threw his toys out of his pram | 11:10 |
| pwnguin | not manhy moving parts to fail | 11:10 |
| flx_ | vesa, well, I think in that case you're out of luck.. | 11:12 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt_: ah, yeah | 11:12 |
| homeasvs | X-Fade, erlang still going I presume ? | 11:12 |
| vesa | flx_: thought so, oh well. i have backups | 11:12 |
| homeasvs | X-Fade, if so, is there a prize for 'longest build' ? :) | 11:12 |
| Stskeeps | isn't that webkit? | 11:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:13 |
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| X-Fade | homeasvs: inet_gethost inet_gethost 4 | 11:13 |
| X-Fade | homeasvs: Does that try to connect to the outside world? | 11:13 |
| homeasvs | X-Fade, well, at least it's stumbling towards the finish line :) | 11:13 |
| homeasvs | I am not sure to be honest | 11:13 |
| homeasvs | let's hope not | 11:13 |
| homeasvs | I assume your build machine would block that | 11:14 |
| X-Fade | homeasvs: host is sandboxed, so that doesn't work. | 11:14 |
| homeasvs | but it would make it error out no ? | 11:14 |
| X-Fade | homeasvs: Depends on the app ;) | 11:14 |
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| X-Fade | homeasvs: If it has a timeout, then yes. | 11:14 |
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| KMFDM | andre__, i replied | 11:15 |
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| andre___ | thanks | 11:17 |
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| woglinde | hijo wazd | 11:18 |
| woglinde | damn why they fremantle sdk needs -Wl,--rpath-link so often | 11:19 |
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| wazd_n800 | woglinde, heya again :) | 11:19 |
| woglinde | instead of -L -l | 11:19 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Hi folks - can anyone tell me where to obtain powertop for n900? | 11:22 |
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| woglinde | AdmiralSausage install sdk grab the debian package recompile it | 11:26 |
| woglinde | and install it | 11:26 |
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| woglinde | but maybee it will not work | 11:26 |
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| woglinde | because its focused on x86 | 11:27 |
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| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: Ah OK thanks. Only had this thing 1 day - I will get to that point but I'm not there yet. Other folks are using it happily on the N900 already (& I don't think they each compiled it individually but could be wrong) | 11:27 |
| jbn | woglinde: it will work, just compile it against arm | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | powertop should really be in extras | 11:28 |
| Stskeeps | i mean, people should use it for extras-testing | 11:28 |
| woglinde | Stskeeps it isnt | 11:28 |
| woglinde | I checked it | 11:28 |
| Stskeeps | weird | 11:28 |
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| woglinde | hm or has extras-testing non-free seciton? | 11:29 |
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| woglinde | hm it hase | 11:30 |
| woglinde | but no powertop | 11:30 |
| woglinde | hm I will upload it tomorrow | 11:30 |
| wazd_n800 | ok, can anybody tell me, does n900 has usb-host?) | 11:31 |
| sejo | how do you gain root on the device? r | 11:31 |
| sejo | can I reset the users password? | 11:31 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: we're not sure. it doesn't have usb otg. | 11:31 |
| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: That's great, thanks. I will wait till then! | 11:31 |
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| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, yeah, that's what I heard | 11:32 |
| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, how Nokia Push works then? | 11:32 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: bluetooth probably | 11:32 |
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| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, hmm | 11:33 |
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| woglinde | AdmiralSausage I quick test if it compiles right now | 11:34 |
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| hrw | morning | 11:34 |
| florian | good morning | 11:35 |
| sejo | morning | 11:35 |
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| wazd_n800 | noon | 11:35 |
| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: Thanks. Weird cos some of the posts on talk.maemo.org imply that is comes preinstalled ("you don't have to install it you just have to be root"). Maybe it was on a prerelease/testing firmware | 11:35 |
| woglinde | AdmiralSausage hm | 11:36 |
| woglinde | I am testing in sdk | 11:36 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:36 |
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| wazd_n800 | Jaffa, heya | 11:36 |
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| woglinde | AdmiralSausage hm dont you have powertop? | 11:37 |
| AdmiralSausage | No. "/bin/sh: powertop: not found" | 11:38 |
| sejo | did someone succeed in doing a screencast with the load-applet tool? | 11:38 |
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| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: "find / -name powertop" comes back with nothing too. | 11:38 |
| woglinde | sudo powertop? | 11:39 |
| woglinde | -> mgedmin'sudo powertop' worksforme on the .41-10 fw | 11:39 |
| woglinde | that was 3.11.2009 | 11:39 |
| woglinde | here | 11:39 |
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| flx_ | nice, the device has powertop, hadn't noticed :) | 11:41 |
| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: "sudo powertop" asks me for a password if I'm user. As root, it returns immediately with no output (as it does for any nonexistant binary) | 11:41 |
| Jaffa | AdmiralSausage: Become root (install rootsh, and then type 'sudo gainroot' or 'root'); then you can run powertop. | 11:41 |
| Jaffa | `user' doesn't have sudo power OOTB | 11:42 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Jaffa: I did. I don't have the binary. | 11:42 |
| flx_ | does C4 level mean full sleep? | 11:42 |
| AdmiralSausage | Jaffa: where does it live on your device? | 11:42 |
| flx_ | admiralsausage, how about, after going root, doing apt-get install powertop ? | 11:42 |
| flx_ | /sbin/powertop here | 11:43 |
| pupnik | ntp security updates | 11:43 |
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| AdmiralSausage | flx_: "E: Couldn't find package powertop" | 11:43 |
| AdmiralSausage | flx_: I don't have a /sbin/powertop either | 11:44 |
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| AdmiralSausage | I have FW version 1.2009.42-11.203.2 | 11:45 |
| flx_ | funny, grep -l powertop /var/lib/apt/lists/* says nothing to me | 11:45 |
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| flx_ | (and I have extras, extras-devel in addition to the standard nokia site) | 11:45 |
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| X-Fade | flx_: sdk/tools ? | 11:46 |
| flx_ | admiralsausage, does your prompt say Nokia-N900-42-11? | 11:46 |
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| serenity | hi | 11:47 |
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| woglinde | hi pupnik | 11:47 |
| AdmiralSausage | flx_: No, it says '~ $' | 11:47 |
| serenity | there was a list of available apps in extras-devel, but didn't bookmarked it. Where can i find it? | 11:47 |
| flx_ | admiralsausage, and how about after sudo gainroot? | 11:47 |
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| AdmiralSausage | flx_: '/home/user #' | 11:48 |
| Lorthirk | i'm sorry, are you trying to see his kernel version? | 11:48 |
| flx_ | admiralsausage, bah, actually I was logged in via ssh when I said that, normal sudo gainroot gives me that too | 11:49 |
| Lorthirk | why not uname -a? | 11:49 |
| flx_ | well, that works too ;) | 11:49 |
| AdmiralSausage | If you're looking for my FW version I posted it above (I think): 1.2009.42-11.203.2 | 11:50 |
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| AdmiralSausage | uname says "Linux Nokia-N900-42-11" | 11:50 |
| Lorthirk | ok... it's just that i joined in the middle of the conversation and it seemed to me that you were trying to see the kernel version | 11:50 |
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| ersin | hi all | 11:51 |
| flx_ | lorthirk, the root of the problem is that admiralsausage doesn't have /sbin/powertop, and there appears to be no idea how to get him one | 11:51 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: well it looks like I have a different version of *something* | 11:51 |
| flx_ | btw, I needed to mkdir /debug before powertop worked for me | 11:51 |
| woglinde | hm linking with g++ when a c++lib needs a c-lib is broken with codesourcery toolchain | 11:51 |
| Lorthirk | let me try on mine | 11:52 |
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| lardman | morning all | 11:52 |
| woglinde | hi lardman | 11:52 |
| lardman | hey woglinde | 11:52 |
| Lorthirk | ok, i have it | 11:52 |
| lardman | so do the autobuilders run on a real device? ;) | 11:52 |
| Lorthirk | i just did cd /sbin; ls powertop | 11:52 |
| lardman | not taking the piss this time, but for things like BLAS and Atlas, the on-device tests decide which algorithms will be used in the final libraries | 11:53 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: i managed to get my laptop screen at a tolerable level and so i did a bit more work...i got the fremantle pango/cairo/glib/pixmap packages working and installing properly, i'm in the middle of building gtk 2.14 now | 11:53 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: "ls: /sbin/powertop: No such file or directory" - so what't *your* firmware version? I only got this n900 yesterday | 11:53 |
| Lorthirk | same as yours | 11:54 |
| Lorthirk | where are you from? | 11:54 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: damn. From UK. | 11:54 |
| Lorthirk | where did you buy the phone? | 11:54 |
| Lorthirk | mmmh | 11:54 |
| Lorthirk | maybe it's a different version? | 11:54 |
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| Lorthirk | let me check one thing pls | 11:54 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: Nokia shop. I *did* uninstall facebook widget and a couple of other toys to save space - you think powertop could have been packaged with one of them? | 11:55 |
| Lorthirk | no, i really don't think so | 11:55 |
| flx_ | powertop is in its own package powertop | 11:55 |
| woglinde | lardman hihi welcome to the crappy world | 11:55 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: cool | 11:56 |
| Lorthirk | what's exactly the "couple of other toys"? | 11:56 |
| lardman | woglinde: hmm, I'll have to talk to X-Fade, or have my own repo to host code compiled using cpu-transparency (bad lardman!) | 11:57 |
| lardman | X-Fade: ping | 11:57 |
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| woglinde | lardman I am fighting here with erros when g++ is used as linker | 11:57 |
| ersin | stskeeps: uh, has that been done before? or is it gtk that's blocking progress | 11:57 |
| X-Fade | lardman: What are you doing? | 11:57 |
| lardman | woglinde: ah, I was just scratching my head about some FORTRAN code using a LOADER env var, thought it should probably be gcc then, but turns out fort77 works | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: we use fremantle gtk2.14 in mer, but the interesting part is if you manage to get it to be fairly trivial to patch to later gtk versions | 11:58 |
| lardman | X-Fade: maths sw | 11:58 |
| ersin | ah, i see | 11:58 |
| woglinde | x-fade blas at atlas are really sepcial | 11:58 |
| X-Fade | lardman: And that doesn't compile with qemu? | 11:58 |
| lardman | X-Fade: a fair few packages will run tests during the compilation process and choose the fastest method to compile in | 11:58 |
| Lorthirk | AdmiralSausage: does this program has some libraries? | 11:59 |
| Lorthirk | otherwise I could send the executable | 11:59 |
| lardman | X-Fade: it compiles, but it won't reflect the device arch and what's fastest there | 11:59 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Can't you just hardcode? | 11:59 |
| lardman | X-Fade: probably, but that would be bad style ;) | 11:59 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Just add that as .diff.tar.gz ? :) | 12:00 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: I don't know - I don't have a dev environment set up to do a ldd (?) or anything but sure, please try! | 12:00 |
| X-Fade | lardman: So the original source is left alone? Just a maemo only change? | 12:00 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: will need major changes to the Makefiles etc, so pre-select the algorithms to use; but probably doable | 12:01 |
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| Lorthirk | ok, wait :) | 12:01 |
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| lardman|home | oh, what happened there I wonder | 12:01 |
| lardman|home | ah, work pc | 12:01 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: ok, i think everything's coming together in my mind at last. because nokia's deb source packages don't use patches during the build and just have them hardcoded, that's what's causing trouble? or are there other problems? | 12:01 |
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| X-Fade | Clone ;) | 12:01 |
| lardman|home | X-Fade: nah, is me still, should have turned work pc off | 12:01 |
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| mece | Anyone here know Philip Van Hoof ? | 12:01 |
| lardman|home | X-Fade: could I manually upload a replacement binary package? | 12:01 |
| Stskeeps | mece: -> pvanhoof | 12:01 |
| lardman|home | X-Fade: e.g. make sure the source builds, then replace it with an optimised version? | 12:02 |
| mece | pvanhoof? | 12:02 |
| X-Fade | lardman|home: If you increase the epoch, yes. | 12:02 |
| mece | righty-o | 12:02 |
| X-Fade | ehm, revision.. | 12:02 |
| Lorthirk | AdmiralSausage: i'm sending the exec | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: yeah, ideally need to establish an easy way to patch with the maemo gtk+ additions | 12:03 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: "Received a malformed DCC request from Lorthirk" don't know if it's you or me - I'm on xchat | 12:03 |
| Lorthirk | probably it's me | 12:03 |
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| Lorthirk | tell me another system you prefer :) | 12:03 |
| lardman|home | X-Fade: no, I meant a binary only overwrite | 12:03 |
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| pvanhoof | mece, yes that's me | 12:03 |
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| lardman|home | X-Fade: the source is the same, but I'll compile a binary here which uses sbrsh and is therefore optimised | 12:04 |
| mece | pvanhoof, are you still working on the google-album-art-downloader? | 12:04 |
| pvanhoof | mece, no | 12:04 |
| pvanhoof | go ahead and pick it up | 12:04 |
| X-Fade | lardman|home: You can't upload binary packages to free at least. | 12:04 |
| ersin | stskeeps: well then working from fremantle svn is fine for mer, because mer is trying to be all fremantle, but then for upgrading diablo shouldn't the hildon code that will go into the patch come from the diablo packages? i.e. extract the hildon code from gtk2.10 and make a patch set for diablo, and then from gtk2.14 and make a patch set for fremantle? | 12:04 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: I am petechap on gmail if you can send an attachment? | 12:05 |
| lardman|home | I know, can *you* manually overwrite the autobuilder generated package with one I give you? | 12:05 |
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| Lorthirk | of course | 12:05 |
| mece | pvanhoof, I'll take a look. did it ever work? the installer seems borken | 12:05 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: ideally i'd like to see 2.16/2.18 :P | 12:05 |
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| pvanhoof | mece, it once worked | 12:05 |
| woglinde | next try with imagemagick | 12:05 |
| Lorthirk | AdmiralSausage: sent | 12:05 |
| Foxx | would anyone happen to have a binary of spectool_gtk for the Metageek Wispy device? | 12:06 |
| woglinde | why always I find such bad things | 12:06 |
| mece | pvanhoof, ok. I'll see if I can compile it in sdk. | 12:06 |
| pvanhoof | mece, it was a proof of concept that nokia can't release for obvious legal reasons | 12:06 |
| pvanhoof | so i got its copyrights, packaged it, and released it, but I have no focus or priority for it | 12:06 |
| ersin | stskeeps: me too...what i'm saying is that to make the patches we need to extract hildon-specific code from one of nokia's gtk packages...for fremantle, that should be 2.14, and then apply it to 2.18...but for diablo, we should extract from 2.14 and then again apply to 2.18, no? | 12:07 |
| mece | pvanhoof, k. well it might just be the packaging that's busted. | 12:07 |
| ersin | stskeeps: i'm assuming that fremantle gtk and diablo gtk are very different | 12:07 |
| ersin | stskeeps: or different enough | 12:07 |
| ersin | stskeeps: i mean i have no experience with fremantle really other than watching n900 videos on youtube ;) | 12:07 |
| pvanhoof | mece, possible | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: i have doubts though, but we'll see | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | i'm not 100% sure what patches exist | 12:08 |
| pvanhoof | mece, try the dbus api too, to check if it still downloads anything | 12:08 |
| pvanhoof | you might have to change the search string that it uses to find the actual image | 12:08 |
| ersin | stskeeps: uh, i thought there aren't any patches | 12:08 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: Thanks. I get "Powertop 1.13.3 \n status: Unknown job: pmtrackerdaemon \n Mounting debugfs...FAILED" | 12:08 |
| Lorthirk | well.. me too | 12:08 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: so I guess there is some dependency after all? | 12:09 |
| woglinde | AdmiralSausage kernel | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: well, as in, what is actually modded gtk -> maemo gtk | 12:09 |
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| woglinde | isnt properply configured | 12:09 |
| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: I need to install a separate kernel? | 12:09 |
| hrw | time started ticking... one week and counting | 12:09 |
| ersin | stskeeps: what's the difference? aren't we working from one unified set of gtk sources? | 12:09 |
| lardman|home | X-Fade: anyway not an immediate problem, let me get things pushed to extras-devel first | 12:09 |
| ersin | stskeeps: that is, maemo gtk in the fremantle branch? | 12:10 |
| mece | pvanhoof, I'll check it out when I have time. Thanks for the info. | 12:10 |
| pvanhoof | np, have fun | 12:10 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: sorry, context switching between my thesis and this :) as in, 1) i'm not sure what specific changes are done to gtk+ to make it become maemo gtk+ 2) i'm not sure what fremantle-only things exist in latest maemo gtk+ | 12:11 |
| ersin | stskeeps: ah, yes i see what you mean. | 12:11 |
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| Stskeeps | the interesting thing is if we can extract those into a sane set of patches | 12:12 |
| ersin | stskeeps: well then i'll make patches based on diablo gtk and then fremantle gtk, and then compare them...maybe even gregale gtk O_o | 12:12 |
| AdmiralSausage | woglinde, Lorthirk: I guess that's why powertop wasn't shipped with the device - if the kernel can't support it. This is turning into a much bigger task than I'd imagined, so I'll leave it for now. Thanks for your help. | 12:13 |
| woglinde | AdmiralSausage jupp | 12:13 |
| woglinde | seems so | 12:13 |
| * lardman|home twiddles his thumbs waiting for LAPACK to compile | 12:14 | |
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| AdmiralSausage | woglinde: actually seems if you run it the second time it works! | 12:15 |
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| flx_ | admiralsausage, ah, so maybe me mkdirring /debug didn't change a thing, it was the restart :) | 12:17 |
| woglinde | AdmiralSausage lol | 12:17 |
| yannj | I need to code a SMS monitor, is that difficult to do? | 12:17 |
| Lorthirk | AdmiralSausage: really glad i helped :) | 12:17 |
| AdmiralSausage | flx_: I don't know - I had mkdir'd the /debug anyway just to be sure | 12:18 |
| woglinde | yannj seems you have a fine dbus apu | 12:18 |
| woglinde | args api | 12:18 |
| woglinde | so it shouldnt be that hard | 12:18 |
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| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: Really glad too, thanks x100. | 12:18 |
| yannj | woglinde : you can register to receive an event on new SMS? | 12:19 |
| yannj | woglinde : kind of use of the proxy pattern? | 12:19 |
| AdmiralSausage | Lorthirk: running random executables from guys on IRC is a *good* idea - who knew?! | 12:19 |
| johnx | andre___, around? | 12:19 |
| Lorthirk | :) | 12:19 |
| andre___ | johnx, aight? | 12:19 |
| suihkulokki | AdmiralSausage: dont worry, just run it as root and you are safe! | 12:20 |
| johnx | I can reproduce the desktop wallpaper .desktop crash! | 12:20 |
| andre___ | johnx, which is bug number...? | 12:20 |
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| johnx | it's in my email. one sec | 12:20 |
| johnx | bug 5866 | 12:21 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5866 malformed wallpaper collection | 12:21 |
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| andre___ | johnx, crash reporter installed? feel free to add a comment to that report with exact steps... | 12:24 |
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| lbt_ | ersin: I'd be interested in the gtk->maemo-gtk patchset too | 12:24 |
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| woglinde | yannj hm qwerty could answer this better than me | 12:25 |
| cm0901 | AdmiralSausage: don't worry, i'll wait another 2 or 3 minutes before i get access to all your personal informations | 12:25 |
| cm0901 | :D | 12:25 |
| woglinde | yannj hm search the maemo-dev ml-list | 12:25 |
| lbt_ | ersin: is that on a git branch anywhere? | 12:25 |
| woglinde | there were some hints | 12:25 |
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| AdmiralSausage | cm0901: You'll have to do it using minimal power or I'll notice you now :) | 12:26 |
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| Lorthirk | AdmiralSausage: i'll try to :D | 12:26 |
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| lbt_ | andre__ loses a _ | 12:28 |
| woglinde | horray imagemagick builded at least | 12:28 |
| andre__ | lbt, unstable network. tomorrow will be even more fun as I won't have electricity around :-P | 12:29 |
| johnx | andre__, I can do better. I'm attaching a .desktop anyone can use to crash their "hildon home screen" | 12:29 |
| andre__ | johnx, yeah, that's more fun for me too :-D | 12:30 |
| johnx | it's fun for everyone :D | 12:30 |
| johnx | and I think every .desktop file linked from n900wallpapers.com is a "winner" :D | 12:30 |
| hrw | omg... I know now why nokia did not made video calls for n900 | 12:30 |
| lbt_ | andre__: heh no electric irc that I want to see... | 12:31 |
| bilboed-pi | anyone knows how usable mer is on n800 ? | 12:31 |
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| hrw | bilboed-pi: it boots and more or less works | 12:31 |
| hrw | bilboed-pi: you have web browser, IM and can use them over wifi | 12:32 |
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| bilboed-pi | hrw, do you mean 0.16 or 0.17pre ? | 12:33 |
| hrw | bilboed-pi: I tried 0.16pre on n810 | 12:33 |
| hrw | ~curse nokia for h-a-m being still broken after 4 years of development | 12:34 |
| infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, nokia for h-a-m being still broken after 4 years of development ! | 12:34 |
| johnx | Updated bug 5866 | 12:34 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5866 malformed wallpaper collection | 12:34 |
| andre__ | thanks | 12:34 |
| johnx | bilboed-pi, 0.17testingN on the N8x0 probably won't be very fun | 12:35 |
| woglinde | morning johnx | 12:35 |
| johnx | mornin' woglinde | 12:35 |
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| hrw | ok, which repository keeps basic stuff like less, coreutils etc? | 12:41 |
| Stskeeps | sdk repos possibly | 12:42 |
| lbt_ | for sure | 12:42 |
| hrw | ok | 12:43 |
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| johnx | hey. where'd everyone go? | 12:44 |
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| FIQ | netsplit | 12:45 |
| FIQ | nice timing for me joining | 12:45 |
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| woglinde | hm | 12:50 |
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| hrw | question: is there a tool to automerge Jabber/Skype/ICQ/etc contacts with contacts? | 12:55 |
| ersin | lbt_: sorry, just got your message. no, no git branch yet, just me and my laptop =) | 12:55 |
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| hrw | or I have to go through all >200 entries and do that by hand? | 12:56 |
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| ersin | lbt_: are you interested in helping develop one? i have no idea how to set up a git branch or anything like that | 12:56 |
| johnx | hrw, nah. but at least in my case the merge built into contacts was reasonable (though manual). it'd be a pain if you have a lot of contacts though | 12:56 |
| hrw | johnx: I have ~400 contacts now | 12:57 |
| johnx | yeah. that'd be a pain | 12:57 |
| ersin | hrw: damn yo | 12:57 |
| lbt_ | ersin: sure - we do a lot of that over in #mer | 12:57 |
| hrw | ersin: 323 merged from s60 phone | 12:57 |
| ersin | hrw: i'm not sure i know 400 people, period | 12:57 |
| lbt_ | one thing mer does is try to look at fremantle as a downstream of another distro - so seperating out functional patches. | 12:58 |
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| lbt_ | doing it for gtk is a big job and complex code - are you up for that? | 12:58 |
| ersin | lbt_: hells yeah =) that's what i've been working on | 12:59 |
| lbt_ | Take a look at http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Build to start .... | 12:59 |
| lbt_ | then move on to scan http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Build/UsingGitorious | 13:00 |
| Myrtti | Anidel: would you like a pair of new woollen socks or mittens? :-> | 13:00 |
| lbt_ | which is the full-on branching stuff explained as best I can | 13:00 |
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| lbt_ | also, we're looking to simplify that process for normal Mer usage :) | 13:01 |
| ersin | uh wow | 13:01 |
| ersin | lol | 13:01 |
| lbt_ | yeah - I don't know what level you're working at? | 13:01 |
| johnx | ersin, do you have experience with branching in another scm? | 13:02 |
| lbt_ | clearly you need to have a fiddle with git if you've not done that... | 13:02 |
| ersin | i should mention i'm kind of a noob hacker, i only just started working w/ open source stuff about a month ago, though i have a knack for diving right in, so a lot of the ancillary stuff like how to use git will take me a while to learn lol | 13:02 |
| lbt_ | ah | 13:02 |
| lbt_ | right ... this isn't a good start | 13:02 |
| johnx | ersin, for now, just try and keep your patches separated into groups according to what feature they add | 13:02 |
| lbt_ | at least, not for git | 13:02 |
| johnx | the goal being to be able to apply one "feature" without the others | 13:03 |
| woglinde | ersin after some time you will love it | 13:03 |
| lbt_ | ersin are you trying to create gtk -> maemo-gtk patches | 13:03 |
| johnx | (except where one feature clearly depends on another) | 13:03 |
| ersin | johnx: right now i'm just going through diffs between the c files of gtk2.10 vs. gtk2.18...no patchsets yet =) | 13:04 |
| lbt_ | I'd suggest looking at gitk and playing with that | 13:04 |
| ersin | woglinde: thanks for the encouragement =) i'm already a fan | 13:04 |
| lbt_ | I find it helps visualise | 13:04 |
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| ersin | lbt_: gotcha | 13:04 |
| lbt_ | and makes branch mgmt easy - and the ability to diff any two commits on a clicky-whim is brilliant | 13:04 |
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| ersin | is that what's special about git? | 13:05 |
| takku | hi | 13:05 |
| ersin | er, i guess gitk | 13:05 |
| ersin | well before i start any of this i have a bigger problem, namely that my girlfriend accidentally kicked my laptop off the bed and now my video chip is messed up, all kinds of artifacts everywhere | 13:06 |
| Myrtti | :-D | 13:07 |
| Myrtti | *cough* | 13:07 |
| ersin | moving an xterm window into the corner somehow makes it just tolerable, but it's starting to straing | 13:07 |
| ersin | myrtti: haha | 13:07 |
| ersin | s/straing/strain | 13:07 |
| takku | so i dont get it what im doing wrong when im trying to add shortcut for script to open irssi | 13:07 |
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| takku | trying to do it with this | 13:10 |
| takku | hups | 13:10 |
| takku | http://www.matkapuhelininfo.com/keskustelu/showpost.php?p=1058184286&postcount=945 | 13:10 |
| takku | done the file and i think its just fine but no. cant find it when trying to add it | 13:11 |
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| Mece | is openarena working? | 13:12 |
| Myrtti | takku: you've got all the applications needed installed of course? openssh, osso-xterm...? | 13:12 |
| takku | hmm maybe not that osso.. ill checkit | 13:14 |
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| ruskie | osso-xterm should be there if you hav an X Terminal thing | 13:16 |
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| ersin | can someone give me a bit of advice on diff? | 13:17 |
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| homeasvs | anyone know why the phone has 'su' (provided by the busybox package) but sbox doesn't ? | 13:18 |
| ersin | so i'm making these patches, but i have to edit some by hand and i'm worried about the range numbers | 13:18 |
| ersin | do i have to worry about the second number in each range (# of lines?) | 13:18 |
| ersin | johnx? lbt_? stskeeps? | 13:18 |
| X-Fade | homeasvs: You answered that yourself? :) | 13:18 |
| johnx | ersin? | 13:18 |
| ersin | lol | 13:18 |
| ersin | when i'm using diff | 13:18 |
| Myrtti | takku: did you figure it out yet? | 13:18 |
| ersin | and i edit the patches by hand | 13:19 |
| homeasvs | X-Fade, huh ? | 13:19 |
| johnx | why are you having to edit by hand? | 13:19 |
| ersin | do i have to worry about the number of lines part of the range numbers? | 13:19 |
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| ersin | uh this is difficult to explain via irc... | 13:19 |
| ersin | basically | 13:19 |
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| ersin | i'm trying to get it so that all you have to do is run patch and it will add the hildon functionality to the gtk c code | 13:19 |
| takku | Myrtti: no not yet, im at work so hard to to two things at the same time | 13:20 |
| ersin | but there's a lot of differences between gtk2.10 and 2.18 | 13:20 |
| johnx | with you so far :) | 13:20 |
| lbt_ | homeasvs: heh | 13:20 |
| ersin | so stuff gets moved around radically, so diff messes things up by default | 13:20 |
| ersin | like | 13:20 |
| ersin | if i were to run patch on the diff that diff outputs | 13:20 |
| lbt_ | homeasvs: symlink su to busybox | 13:21 |
| ersin | it would remove large parts of the functionality | 13:21 |
| lbt_ | I found that a while back | 13:21 |
| ersin | whereas what i need to do is essentially add some preprocessor logic | 13:21 |
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| johnx | ersin, think I'm understanding a bit | 13:21 |
| ersin | that didn't exist in 2.10 | 13:21 |
| ersin | johnx: ok i will get explicit here (not cuss words, just more technical) | 13:21 |
| johnx | I think I get the general idea | 13:22 |
| ersin | alright | 13:22 |
| johnx | I really think that editing diffs by hand might not be the right solution | 13:22 |
| ersin | probably =) | 13:22 |
| ersin | but how else would i create a patch set? | 13:22 |
| ersin | i mean, tbh, i'm not sure patches are an ideal solution | 13:23 |
| X-Fade | ersin: local SCM repo? | 13:23 |
| ersin | x-fade: hmm i don't know what scm is...wikipedia | 13:23 |
| johnx | scm: cvs/svn/git | 13:23 |
| X-Fade | ersin: git or svn for instance. | 13:23 |
| sejo | did someone succeed in making a screencast with the load-applet? | 13:23 |
| ersin | ty | 13:23 |
| homeasvs | lbt_, there is no install for busybox in sbox, is there ? | 13:24 |
| johnx | anyways, in the meantime, unpack two gtk 2.18 trees. hack in one and then patch against the other | 13:24 |
| ersin | so you're suggesting that i just edit the files by hand and let scm take care of the versioning? | 13:24 |
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| ersin | johnx: gotcha | 13:24 |
| Gadgetoid | hmm vnc server is a bit fail | 13:24 |
| johnx | using scm is also a very good option :) | 13:24 |
| lbt_ | homeasvs: mmmm what are you doing | 13:25 |
| X-Fade | ersin: The scm can then automatically track changes in the upstream tree too. | 13:25 |
| fnordianslip | i've not seen mercurial for maemo5 yet. does it exist? | 13:25 |
| homeasvs | lbt_, I made a couchdb package, it has a script in /etc/init.d | 13:25 |
| lbt_ | I was completely screwing around with chroots and stuff | 13:25 |
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| ersin | johnx: well i've been thinking about it and what would probably be ideal is almost something like a detection script that would see where the changes have been made between versions and insert code at the appropriate line | 13:25 |
| homeasvs | lbt_, this script uses su to launch couchdb as the couchdb user | 13:25 |
| homeasvs | lbt_, works fine on the phone since that has su | 13:25 |
| homeasvs | lbt_, doesn't work in scratchbox because it doesn't have su | 13:25 |
| lbt_ | ah, I see | 13:26 |
| ersin | x-fade: that sounds like what i was thinking of lol | 13:26 |
| homeasvs | maybe maemo has a different preferred way of launching a program as a certain user ? | 13:26 |
| lbt_ | sbox isn't meant to emulat that stuff really | 13:26 |
| lbt_ | it's not a true machine emulator | 13:26 |
| homeasvs | I saw hildon-desktop doing some stuff, checking that if it was in scratchbox it didn't need anything to launch as user, and so on the phone it uses su | 13:26 |
| X-Fade | ersin: There were a lot of smart people who solved that problem a long time ago ;) | 13:26 |
| homeasvs | well, that's too bad - it wouldn't be too hard to make stuff like this work | 13:26 |
| X-Fade | ersin: We just need to use these tools ;) | 13:27 |
| johnx | ersin, ok...there are two sane ways to do this I think: keep two copies of gtk+ 2.18 around. hack in one. make changes in the other and generate your patch with diff -urN | 13:27 |
| lbt_ | ersin: or learn and use git | 13:27 |
| ersin | johnx: that's what i've been doing so far | 13:27 |
| lbt_ | which makes life trivial | 13:27 |
| hrw | or use quilt | 13:27 |
| lbt_ | after the curve | 13:27 |
| ersin | lbt_ and x-fade: i agree, i'll start learning those | 13:27 |
| ersin | i just wasn't aware...i'm still learning these tools | 13:27 |
| johnx | ersin, the other way to do it (which is probably the right way), is to just use git, even in its most basic form and let it generate the patches | 13:27 |
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| ersin | so then ideally would i start a git branch on the maemo servers and work from there? | 13:28 |
| ersin | wouldn't i need some kind of access permissions | 13:28 |
| ersin | ? | 13:28 |
| johnx | you basically "clone" their repository | 13:28 |
| lbt_ | local git install | 13:28 |
| lbt_ | gogle dvcs... | 13:28 |
| lbt_ | +o | 13:28 |
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| ersin | i'm on it | 13:29 |
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| ersin | just curious, am i the only crazy american to be up at 6:30 AM hacking maemo? | 13:29 |
| johnx | I guess it depends on which way you want to go: adding maemo stuff to gtk 2.18 or adding 2.18 to maemo-gtk 2.10 | 13:29 |
| johnx | could be | 13:29 |
| johnx | only 3:30AM here :) | 13:30 |
| ersin | lol | 13:30 |
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| johnx | but then again, I have work in 6 hours ;) | 13:30 |
| ersin | yikes | 13:30 |
| chaosteil | urm | 13:30 |
| Myrtti | *sigh* maemo.org is so bloody slow | 13:30 |
| woglinde | Myrtti *g* | 13:31 |
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| ersin | well that counts lol, i should have said "north american" then | 13:31 |
| johnx | ersin, so I should really sleep. but I would be completely remiss if I didn't try to help nudge you along. you're the only person I've known to take one forward-porting the maemo patches to gtk I think | 13:31 |
| chaosteil | am I the only one when trying to use profiles_free_profiles() from libprofile who gets a double free error? | 13:31 |
| jebba | Myrtti: vote for this bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5818 | 13:31 |
| povbot | Bug 5818: We need servers | 13:31 |
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| ersin | johnx: well thanks very much for all the help | 13:31 |
| johnx | sure. I hope some of it makes sense | 13:32 |
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| ersin | johnx: i should probably get to sleep too...but i will look into getting git going and start working through that | 13:32 |
| lbt_ | Myrtti: think +ve ,.... it's all the new users .... which in turn drives up demand+nokia resource needs.... which means you keep your job :) Slow servers are good! | 13:32 |
| johnx | Remember: if you find yourself fighting your tools, stop and look around a bit | 13:32 |
| ersin | oh it does, just takes a while to sink in ;) | 13:32 |
| ersin | alright | 13:32 |
| ersin | oh btw | 13:32 |
| ersin | in response to what you said earlier | 13:32 |
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| ersin | my intention is to port gtk2.18 to maemo, not the other way around | 13:33 |
| ersin | er...did that make sense... | 13:33 |
| ersin | ok i'm going to bed too | 13:33 |
| ersin | goodnight, world | 13:33 |
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| lbt_ | kinda.... | 13:33 |
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| Myrtti | jebba: I would, if I could log in | 13:34 |
| jebba | haha | 13:36 |
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| melmoth | hmmm, just recieve the n900, where can i enable the extras repository ? | 13:38 |
| X-Fade | melmoth: Go to maemo.org/downloads and click on an app. | 13:38 |
| rEv9 | go to repo, and uncheck the disabled checkbox | 13:38 |
| chaosteil | http://wiki.maemo.org/Red_Pill_mode | 13:38 |
| johnx | chaosteil, not helpful | 13:38 |
| chaosteil | aw, I see | 13:38 |
| chaosteil | it's how I enabled it | 13:39 |
| johnx | sorry to jump on you there, but red pill mode is totally different from extras | 13:39 |
| chaosteil | ah, just extras | 13:39 |
| chaosteil | nvm | 13:39 |
| Gadgetoid | hmm missed the nokia christmas party... boooo | 13:40 |
| melmoth | ok, found ssh :) | 13:41 |
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| sejo | hmm does the n900 support 3G? | 13:42 |
| adeus | yes | 13:42 |
| sejo | I only see 3G in the status (however using the 3G APN) | 13:42 |
| Stskeeps | provider? | 13:42 |
| sejo | Proximus belgium | 13:43 |
| X-Fade | sejo: Should work. | 13:43 |
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| sejo | dunno why I get the 2G then.. | 13:43 |
| Ashenburger_ | I even see 3.5g at work :) | 13:43 |
| X-Fade | sejo: No 3G reception? | 13:43 |
| Ashenburger_ | not at home though :( | 13:43 |
| sejo | my e71 does have 3g here | 13:44 |
| sejo | maybe switch the sim and check? | 13:44 |
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| arachnist | i get 3.5g on my n900 in warsaw | 13:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | I get 3.5G if I hold it just right on the sofa. | 13:46 |
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| lardman_ | Mine switches between nothing > 2G > 3G and 3.5G at work | 13:46 |
| LinuxCode | sejo, some sims are locked to 2g | 13:46 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: apparently this one shouldn't be | 13:47 |
| sejo | ok switched the sim and still get 2G | 13:47 |
| * LinuxCode doesnt do apparently | 13:47 | |
| LinuxCode | go outside | 13:47 |
| LinuxCode | see if for some reason, it wont get proper reception | 13:48 |
| LinuxCode | maybe you need to change a setting ?!?! | 13:48 |
| melmoth | hmmm, i can ssh to localhost but not from the network, no ssh prompt | 13:48 |
| LinuxCode | but then I still havent got a N900 | 13:48 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: switching sim from phone is all I need to get 3G on the E71 I have with both sim cards 3g | 13:50 |
| sejo | on the n900 with both 2G | 13:51 |
| LinuxCode | could be a config setting | 13:51 |
| LinuxCode | but as I said, I dont have a N900 yet | 13:51 |
| frals | the wait for the ups guy with my package is dreadful :< | 13:51 |
| LinuxCode | so I am guessing | 13:51 |
| sejo | found it, in settings--phone set mode from GSM to 3G | 13:52 |
| sejo | w00t | 13:52 |
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| melmoth | how can i enter weird character such as { ? | 13:52 |
| LinuxCode | sejo, educated guesses work sometimes | 13:52 |
| LinuxCode | ;-p | 13:52 |
| sejo | lol indeed | 13:52 |
| X-Fade | melmoth: sym key | 13:52 |
| arachnist | melmoth: press "fn" and "Sym/Ctrl" after that | 13:53 |
| sejo | well after switching I knew it had no be a setting, and you confirming it | 13:53 |
| melmoth | thanks | 13:53 |
| melmoth | now, lets try to enter a long weird wpa key | 13:53 |
| Eightace | OT: using xchat on n900 - does it save log files? | 13:53 |
| melmoth | may be ssh wills works better on my lan :) | 13:53 |
| jebba | Eightace: not by default | 13:54 |
| toggles_w | frals: i hear ya | 13:54 |
| Eightace | jebba: any way to do it? | 13:54 |
| sejo | now for the screencast to work and I'm pretty happy | 13:54 |
| jebba | err, Eightace i take that back and change to i dont know. I do have a "scrollback" dir at least for this channel tha ti dont think i activated | 13:54 |
| jebba | Eightace: probably: irc_logging = 1 in ~/.xchat2/xchat.conf | 13:55 |
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| jebba | Eightace: there are logs though already fyi: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/latest.log.html | 13:55 |
| Eightace | thanks I will get them online for now | 13:56 |
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| hrw | hmm.. | 14:03 |
| nomis | yay! | 14:04 |
| nomis | Subject: Forum Nokia Order Complete Confirmation | 14:04 |
| hrw | nomis: grats | 14:04 |
| hrw | ~curse microusb in n900 | 14:04 |
| infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, microusb in n900 ! | 14:04 |
| melmoth | still no route to host. | 14:05 |
| melmoth | no ssh possible to n900. works ok on the n810 on the same network though | 14:05 |
| hrw | melmoth: installed openssh or dropbear on n900? | 14:05 |
| melmoth | openssh | 14:06 |
| hrw | is it normal that plugging CA-101 (microusb official nokia cable) results in "charging..." and then "charging error" if n900 move a bit | 14:06 |
| hrw | ? | 14:06 |
| X-Fade | hrw: blame the eu. | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | hrw: didn't see that one myself | 14:06 |
| hrw | X-Fade: and/or quality of microusb connector in n900 | 14:07 |
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| X-Fade | hrw: But no, that is not normal. I can hang my device by the cable, without problems. | 14:07 |
| hrw | and how to force n900 into usb-storage mode? now it works as usb-net/acm combo | 14:07 |
| jysky | yeah, no probs with microusb connector with me eighter | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | hrw: it should ask when you plug in | 14:07 |
| auenf | n900 will ask what mode when you plug it in | 14:07 |
| auenf | there might be a setting to auto to a particular mode, but i though that was only on symbian and not on maemo | 14:08 |
| hrw | thats what also manual says... but not happens | 14:08 |
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| X-Fade | hrw: it should. | 14:09 |
| jysky | hrw, have you tried with other usb port on computer? | 14:10 |
| jysky | windows sometimes doesn't do well with usb devices repeatedly connected and disconnected | 14:10 |
| hrw | jysky: will have to (now it is 7port powered hub) | 14:10 |
| jysky | rebooted both systems? | 14:11 |
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| hrw | ok, under desk port helped | 14:11 |
| hrw | jysky: I do not reboot my linux box | 14:11 |
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| bobbyd | hi | 14:11 |
| jysky | ah, it's not windows! well mine n900 worked swell with linux yesterday | 14:12 |
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| bobbyd | I've been searching on talk.maemo.org, but I can't find a way to connect to a Microsoft (pptp) VPN? even if it's complicated? | 14:13 |
| * timeless_mbp sighs | 14:13 | |
| bobbyd | sorry, on the n900 | 14:13 |
| * timeless_mbp wants to smack the person who runs maemo.org | 14:13 | |
| timeless_mbp | www.maemo.org uses an invalid security certificate. | 14:13 |
| timeless_mbp | The certificate is only valid for maemo.org | 14:13 |
| timeless_mbp | (Error code: ssl_error_bad_cert_domain) | 14:13 |
| jysky | hmm. now to think of it.. i think that i might not have had that query of which mode to go on my windows, when i didn't have latest pc suite and not driver for n900. after i installed pc suite it started asking. but on opensuse machine it just worked like on mac os x | 14:14 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: www? who uses that? | 14:14 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: probably my browser when the maemo.org server doesn't answer | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | dunno | 14:15 |
| tbf | timeless_mbp: the big fun of SSL vs virtual domains | 14:15 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: We don't link to https://www at least? | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | tbf: this was a solved problem 3 years ago | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: not certain actually | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | oh | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | to https? no | 14:15 |
| timeless_mbp | but www ? maybe | 14:15 |
| tbf | timeless_mbp: sure? | 14:16 |
| timeless_mbp | i probably added the s when http didn't work | 14:16 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: www redirects to maemo.org | 14:16 |
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| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: So login will never take you to https://www | 14:16 |
| tbf | timeless_mbp: i am not aware that STARTTLS for HTTP got implemented | 14:16 |
| timeless_mbp | which is a horrible mistake | 14:16 |
| timeless_mbp | we should use www like the rest of the world | 14:17 |
| timeless_mbp | so that cookies don't get shared unless asked | 14:17 |
| timeless_mbp | and so that i can block spam from www and still get it from elsewhere | 14:17 |
| X-Fade | www is so last century | 14:17 |
| tbf | X-Fade: prefix should be w20 at least :-D | 14:17 |
| melmoth | weird,in order to log in the n900 with ssh, i have first to log ona remote box from the ssh with -R 7777:localhost:22 and then from this box, to ssh on localhost 7777 | 14:18 |
| melmoth | so i can have a connexion, but not directly. | 14:18 |
| melmoth | anyone having the same issue ? | 14:18 |
| X-Fade | melmoth: No, I can login to my n900 directly. | 14:18 |
| timeless_mbp | melmoth: did you just install ssh? | 14:18 |
| timeless_mbp | because the postinst doesn't start the daemon | 14:19 |
| Stskeeps | melmoth: PSM | 14:19 |
| timeless_mbp | although that wouldn't do it | 14:19 |
| timeless_mbp | psm? | 14:19 |
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| melmoth | i installed the virtual package, so i got client and server | 14:19 |
| melmoth | the only onther stuff i installed was homeip | 14:19 |
| melmoth | what is psm ? | 14:20 |
| melmoth | i can log in from the n900 to localhost too, so daemon is started | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | ~wifi-psm | 14:20 |
| infobot | [wifi-psm] http://wiki.maemo.org/Wifi_Power_Saving_Mode_(PSM) | 14:20 |
| X-Fade | Ok, who is building glib for extras-devel? | 14:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: why? :) | 14:22 |
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| lardman_ | X-Fade: doesn't the builder tell you who uploaded it? | 14:22 |
| melmoth | timeless_mbp: thats it thanks ! | 14:22 |
| woglinde | lardman *g* | 14:22 |
| timeless_mbp | not me | 14:22 |
| X-Fade | We have a genius trying to get that in diablo extras-devel | 14:22 |
| melmoth | i m using free ISP wich is noted as having issue with psm | 14:22 |
| woglinde | lardman I wanted to ask the same | 14:22 |
| melmoth | ok, one things done :) | 14:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | 'free isp'? | 14:23 |
| melmoth | French ISP Free.fr Freebox (Maemo #3481 and Free #2538) | 14:23 |
| melmoth | at the bottom of the psm wiki page | 14:23 |
| lardman_ | woglinde: apparently it's just in the queue atm | 14:24 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: well ersin who was in here earlier was working on it, but i didn't have the impression he was using extras-devel for the purpose | 14:24 |
| lardman_ | s/apparently/presumably | 14:24 |
| X-Fade | ersin: ??? | 14:24 |
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| Stskeeps | (who's not in here anymore) | 14:24 |
| sejo | total w00tness got 2 gig dataplan from work on the maemo! | 14:24 |
| sejo | w00t | 14:24 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: yeah, it is him. Ok, what shall I do to stop him? | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: kill the builder jobs and send him a mail? :P | 14:25 |
| slonopotamus | sejo: 'from work on maemo'? | 14:25 |
| X-Fade | Ah he is uploading a lot more crap too. | 14:25 |
| X-Fade | libpixman for instance. | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | he was working on updating glib and gtk (+ maemo patches) for diablo, but it's a bit stupid way to do it if he's uploading it to extras :) | 14:26 |
| Stskeeps | so a slightly cluebat mail should help | 14:26 |
| sejo | slonopotamus: on the n900 sorry | 14:26 |
| lardman_ | well at least it will prove the point that enabling extras-devel is dangerous ;) | 14:26 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: so, worthwhile work, stupid method :) | 14:26 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: yeah, indeed. Killed his access for now. | 14:27 |
| X-Fade | Will send him a mail. | 14:27 |
| woglinde | lardman_ nope autobuilder should rejected packages that are in any other repo | 14:27 |
| slonopotamus | what's wrong with uploading gtk to extras? :) | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: will screw up subsequent builds horribly probably | 14:27 |
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| woglinde | and it should be much work to make a mapping for x-fade if someone changes names | 14:28 |
| lardman_ | what about woglinde's comment then? | 14:28 |
| lardman_ | how can it even be uploaded? | 14:28 |
| lbt_ | heh... what you need is a build system where each user has their own area.... | 14:29 |
| X-Fade | It doesn't do any checking for diablo. | 14:29 |
| lbt_ | I wonder where we can find one of them? | 14:29 |
| X-Fade | We have a check in place for fremantle, but not diablo. | 14:29 |
| lardman_ | ah I see | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | was the "N810 GPS crap" bug fixed in fremantle btw? | 14:30 |
| lbt_ | Stskeeps: ROFL | 14:31 |
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| Stskeeps | ar, no, 'WONTFIX' | 14:33 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:33 |
| X-Fade | GPS now works well, _if_ you have a data connection available. | 14:34 |
| fnordianslip | and OVI maps is a joke | 14:34 |
| X-Fade | Otherwise it is kind of impossible | 14:34 |
| hrw | Stskeeps: basically if machine!=n900 then close as wontfix | 14:34 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: what i worry about is if it caches SUPL data at all | 14:34 |
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| * lbt_ suggests the GPS problem is a conspiracy with carriers to sell data plans | 14:35 | |
| lardman_ | Stskeeps: the chap who gave the talk about location stuff at the summit said it does | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | lardman_: mmk | 14:35 |
| lardman_ | though I don't believe him | 14:35 |
| lbt_ | maybe I should post that on tmo? | 14:35 |
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| lardman_ | lbt_: you mean no-one's come up with that one already!? | 14:36 |
| zaheerm | X-Fade, did thomasvs/homeasvs 's erlang build complete on fremantle autobuilder? | 14:36 |
| tigert | hmm | 14:36 |
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| tigert | tuxpaint expects a splash image un /usr/share | 14:36 |
| timeless_mbp | tigert: so? | 14:37 |
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| tigert | it crashes | 14:37 |
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| tigert | since the package is optified | 14:37 |
| timeless_mbp | sounds like a maemo app | 14:37 |
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| homeasvs | zaheerm, looks like it's still there | 14:37 |
| timeless_mbp | tigert: sounds like someone did a bad job packaging | 14:38 |
| tigert | haha, braek is awesome :) | 14:38 |
| zaheerm | homeasvs, how long did your n900 take building it? | 14:38 |
| homeasvs | zaheerm, 9 hours I think | 14:38 |
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| RST38h | Oh, the Tentacled One! What have I started with that GPS bug... | 14:39 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: a repeat of https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2878 | 14:39 |
| povbot | Bug 2878: Very poor satellite acquisition with internal GPS | 14:39 |
| takku | http://www.matkapuhelininfo.com/keskustelu/showpost.php?p=1058184286&postcount=945 so this should add a shorcut to menu where to add shorcuts to desktop. But i just dont get it why it wont | 14:40 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: No | 14:42 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: In n900, it is not "very poor". It is "nonexistant" | 14:43 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: I do not know a single person who has managed to get a lock while offline | 14:43 |
| naxxatoe | i did once | 14:43 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: location-test-gui(sp) should help diagnose it a little better | 14:43 |
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| naxxatoe | but i guess that was the 1:10000 chance | 14:43 |
| RST38h | Sts: where to get it? | 14:44 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: e-d | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | (afaik) | 14:44 |
| naxxatoe | at my garden | 14:44 |
| naxxatoe | open space | 14:44 |
| naxxatoe | no wirless or cellular service there | 14:44 |
| naxxatoe | i was highly suprised | 14:44 |
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| RST38h | Sts: ack | 14:45 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: using that we can probably get fact on some of the issues | 14:48 |
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| RST38h | Sts: What I wonder about though is why WE should be debugging this | 14:52 |
| RST38h | Sts: blindly too | 14:52 |
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| zaheerm | andre__, is there an internal bug report for https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 ? | 14:52 |
| povbot | Bug 5337: Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 14:52 |
| Stskeeps | zaheerm: there's one listed as an alias | 14:52 |
| pupnik | maps still breaks immediately when i leave my wlan | 14:52 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: cos "let nokia do it" doesn't always work | 14:52 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:52 |
| zaheerm | Stskeeps, wow i'm blind | 14:52 |
| filipecalegario | Hello! I would like to know how to send a simple message through a bluetooth serial port. Could anybody help me? | 14:53 |
| Laiska | takku: Actually, if you read that post with thought, it says that it will add an option to create a new shortcut for irssi under the "Create a new shortcut menu" ..so, if you don't see the whole "add new shortcut" -menu that's probably your problem.. Just guessing, as I dont have the device in front of me. | 14:53 |
| zaheerm | so second question is judging by all the comments on that bug, it should be reopened...... | 14:53 |
| lardman_ | filipecalegario: open the serial device with fopen, write | 14:53 |
| zaheerm | s/question/statement/ | 14:53 |
| infobot | zaheerm meant: so second statement is judging by all the comments on that bug, it should be reopened...... | 14:53 |
| RST38h | Sts: It is not even a request for enhancement though | 14:53 |
| lardman_ | ? | 14:53 |
| RST38h | Sts: GPS is just plain broken | 14:53 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: well obviously not totally since AGPS works | 14:54 |
| RST38h | Sts:" GPS does not though -> broken | 14:54 |
| red | i use an alias for screened irssi in xterm | 14:54 |
| pupnik | stskeeps, is there a way for me to preload the map data for my destination? | 14:54 |
| Stskeeps | pupnik: there was a talk thread on this | 14:55 |
| pupnik | there must be a way to use a map like nIqP | 14:55 |
| pupnik | ahh | 14:55 |
| lardman_ | pupnik: Jaffa had a blog post about using the Windows tool to download it | 14:55 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i don't like the issue either but i think it's good to look at alternative ways for working around it | 14:55 |
| pupnik | ty! | 14:55 |
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| X-Fade | pupnik: Yeah, you can download zip files with maps. Worked fine for my trip to australia. | 14:56 |
| mthmob | Is there an irc app with gui for n900 available yet? | 14:56 |
| X-Fade | pupnik: Well, the maps worked. The app itself.... | 14:56 |
| hrw | mthmob: xchat | 14:56 |
| mece | mthmob, which is in devel | 14:56 |
| hrw | X-Fade: I have to copy maps from my e66 phone | 14:56 |
| mthmob | ahh ok, thx. | 14:57 |
| RST38h | Sts: Not use internal GPS? :) | 14:57 |
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| red | takku: did u get it to work? | 14:57 |
| red | using that same solution myself. | 14:57 |
| takku | Laiska: yes. i can get to that menu where u can add shorcuts to desktop. but i wont find that one from there | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: no, ability to pre-cache, but we already agree on this | 14:57 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: yeah | 14:58 |
| Gadgetoid | mthhob scrolling in xchat is pure pain | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: if there's a sane API made for this, it could even be a daemon / extras app | 14:58 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: if we know the cached data format of course | 14:58 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: The Diablo AGPS app was in Extras too | 14:58 |
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| mthmob | gadgetoid> so its a scrollbar in the side? | 14:58 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Nope | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: like "Maemo Traveller" where it precaches stuff for the area your airport is in | 14:58 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: gadgeteer | 14:58 |
| lardman_ | RST38h: we probably won't be allowed to know the format, but an api that would allow us to send SUPL messages would work | 14:59 |
| red | takku: hmm i didnt notice the shortcut part earlier actually | 14:59 |
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| Stskeeps | pre-caches maps, AGPS info for the next 7 days | 14:59 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Or tableteer. whatever. | 14:59 |
| takku | red: nope, i dunno what im doing wrong did u got it? | 14:59 |
| Gadgetoid | yes mthmob | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | i'd personally use that app | 14:59 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Ah, ok...Where is gadgeteer now btw? | 14:59 |
| RST38h | or tableteer...is it still around? | 14:59 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Basically that is Nokia apps on N900 | 14:59 |
| Laiska | takku: Rebooting the device makes no difference either? | 14:59 |
| RST38h | Aha | 15:00 |
| takku | Laiska: nope | 15:00 |
| * RST38h rejoices at receiving "order processed" email from DDP. No DHL tracking number though. | 15:00 | |
| red | i only did the terminal alias part | 15:00 |
| red | fast enough for me | 15:00 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: :) | 15:00 |
| red | con would be better i guess but it seemed like a hazzle | 15:01 |
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| takku | damn thats the last thing for me to setup this phone | 15:02 |
| takku | everything else is fine except that | 15:02 |
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| red | i didnt find any decent way for msn | 15:03 |
| filipecalegario | lardman_: thanks for the idea, but is there any simple terminal command that does it already? | 15:03 |
| red | butterfly is buggy, cant msg online contacts via contact view | 15:03 |
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| takku | red: hehe bitlbee inside irssi :) | 15:03 |
| lardman_ | filipecalegario: probably not, you also need to connect to the BT device and setup the serial port iirc | 15:03 |
| red | the im address is only visible for offliners | 15:04 |
| red | bitlbee is gimped :( | 15:04 |
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| red | no sound alarm, ppl that i dont have added appear only in the spammy status to | 15:04 |
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| filipecalegario | lardman_: thanks! I will try with fopen then. | 15:05 |
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| red | and too many random dc and cant msg offliners or ppl appearing as offline even when they msg u | 15:05 |
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| frals | so | 15:08 |
| frals | im terrifed to get the back cover off my n900 | 15:08 |
| naxxatoe | me 2 | 15:09 |
| naxxatoe | i tought about adding a 16 gig microsd | 15:09 |
| naxxatoe | but i cant remember how to take the back cover off | 15:09 |
| mece | frals, I think it feels quite nice. Seems much less breaking prone than the N95 back cover imo. | 15:09 |
| X-Fade | frals: Use a creditcard on the side. | 15:09 |
| frals | ah good one, cheers | 15:10 |
| naxxatoe | tell me how it went | 15:10 |
| X-Fade | works quite well | 15:10 |
| naxxatoe | i am curious if i should do it | 15:10 |
| edgar2 | my experience is that the back cover plastic will bend nicely over time, so it becomes quite easy to open the cover after awhile | 15:10 |
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| X-Fade | First few times the sound is scary though ;) | 15:10 |
| SpeedEvil | naxxatoe: it's easy - slide the switch - use the fingernail grab to pop the cover off at the back - slide your nail up the gap left towards the top of the phone, repeat on the other side | 15:11 |
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| X-Fade | SpeedEvil: Switch? | 15:11 |
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| frals | not too happy about ups manging to wreck the box it came in (not wreck but its a decent dent in it.. thank god the device is unhurt!) | 15:12 |
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| naxxatoe | what switch? | 15:12 |
| melmoth | is there a way to be sure the n900 will never ever try to use 3G while still accept receiving calls ? | 15:12 |
| melmoth | off line mode makes me miss call | 15:12 |
| lardman_ | good lord, you don't know about the switch! | 15:12 |
| lardman_ | melmoth: in internet settings tell it to not use it | 15:13 |
| X-Fade | melmoth: Just don't set it to autoconnect. | 15:13 |
| X-Fade | melmoth: And it will ask for roaming. | 15:13 |
| melmoth | hmm, i rummaged in there without finding such option. I ll try again | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | X-Fade: the battery catch switch - just next to the headphone port | 15:13 |
| lardman_ | Settings > Internet Connections > Connect Automatically | 15:14 |
| X-Fade | SpeedEvil: lol, that is just an electrical switch to send a signal. | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | argh | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | I assumed it had some mechanical signal | 15:14 |
| lardman_ | that allows you to lock/unlock the device | 15:14 |
| zaheerm | whoever doesn't have an n900 yet, look away now: http://blog.barisione.org/2009-12/early-christmas/ | 15:14 |
| Stskeeps | zaheerm: ow | 15:14 |
| melmoth | ok, "always ask". thanks :) | 15:14 |
| X-Fade | zaheerm: lol ;) | 15:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | zaheerm, lol. | 15:15 |
| barisione | zaheerm: :D | 15:15 |
| mece | nice | 15:15 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: that also removes one of my bugbears about the locking. | 15:15 |
| Stskeeps | that looks a bit like the summit piles | 15:15 |
| lardman_ | :) | 15:15 |
| SpeedEvil | lardmanwhich is nice | 15:15 |
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| xorAxAx | what can we do to put pressure on the nokia developers to fix the gps problem? recommend people not to buy the n900 because of it? | 15:16 |
| xorAxAx | its WONTFIX, so a serious bugger | 15:17 |
| Robot101 | zaheerm: we actually put them out of stock in the UK for a few days *whistles* | 15:17 |
| SpeedEvil | xorAxAx: i find an axe-handle across the neck works well. | 15:17 |
| sebasmagri | Hi people, I'm having some problems with a n810... it turns off after 3 seconds of pressing the power button... | 15:17 |
| sebasmagri | I already tried a hard reset... | 15:17 |
| lardman_ | battery? | 15:17 |
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| Stskeeps | xorAxAx: be vocal? | 15:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | xorAxAx, no, threats don't work well. :) | 15:18 |
| zaheerm | Robot101, lol shows the lack of availability i guess, you guys are what around 75 people? | 15:18 |
| SpeedEvil | don't press the power button? | 15:18 |
| xorAxAx | Stskeeps: i cannot sing | 15:18 |
| SpeedEvil | xorAxAx: youtube video rap about the issue? | 15:18 |
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| LinuxCode | xorAxAx, take the device back and say you want it fixed | 15:18 |
| zaheerm | xorAxAx: get https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 reopened :) | 15:18 |
| povbot | Bug 5337: Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 15:18 |
| pupnik | vote! | 15:18 |
| LinuxCode | if they say it is not broken, go to trading standards | 15:18 |
| timeless_mbp | so our channels have forked? | 15:18 |
| xorAxAx | pupnik: i did so already | 15:19 |
| lardman_ | LinuxCode: don't be silly | 15:19 |
| LinuxCode | lardman_, do I look like I am being silly ? | 15:19 |
| xorAxAx | indeed, WTO! | 15:19 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: not forked but established seperate rooms for concentrated discussion | 15:19 |
| LinuxCode | lardman_, GPS in the N810 never worked right | 15:19 |
| timeless_mbp | threads? | 15:19 |
| timeless_mbp | s/threads/threaded/ | 15:19 |
| infobot | timeless_mbp meant: threaded? | 15:19 |
| lardman_ | LinuxCode: it doesn't specifically say it will work without a network | 15:19 |
| xorAxAx | can we sue nokia for such a bad gps? | 15:19 |
| Robot101 | zaheerm: yeah we ordered 69 and they had around 100 on friday | 15:19 |
| pupnik | how can i set a POI in nOPP maps:: | 15:19 |
| xorAxAx | Robot101: who? | 15:19 |
| cehteh | xorAxAx: DoS them wie new and new bug reports of the same issue :) | 15:19 |
| lardman_ | LinuxCode: I know about the n810, I'm just talking about Trading Standards | 15:19 |
| LinuxCode | xorAxAx, if you paid for a device, that does not work right, you have consumer rights | 15:20 |
| pupnik | how can i set a POI in n900 maps? | 15:20 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone here near the Chicago or New York flagship stores? | 15:20 |
| flx_ | wouldn't the bug be simple to test by putting the device into offline mode? | 15:20 |
| timeless_mbp | i need someone to take a field trip to them | 15:20 |
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| xorAxAx | cehteh: hehe, with a markov chain text generator and a botnet :) | 15:20 |
| timeless_mbp | (London store too) | 15:20 |
| flx_ | but indeed, n810 never got lock as fast as my standalone gps did | 15:20 |
| zaheerm | Robot101, nokia's online shop or the retail stores? | 15:20 |
| flx_ | thought that it just had bad sensitivity | 15:20 |
| flx_ | but n900 takes lock almost immediately in places where my normal gps wouldn't lock :-o. I suppose AGPS help there quite a bit, though. | 15:21 |
| pupnik | n900 gps does not exist as a feature for me at this time | 15:21 |
| timeless_mbp | pupnik: ? | 15:21 |
| LinuxCode | lardman_, sales of goods act is quite clear | 15:21 |
| xorAxAx | hmm, if there is a conspiracy with the data plan providers, we could also start an antitrust case, right? | 15:21 |
| LinuxCode | fix or refund | 15:21 |
| zaheerm | LinuxCode, does it not advertise agps rather than gps :) | 15:21 |
| lardman_ | LinuxCode: which is why I said to you that it never claimed to work with out a network | 15:22 |
| xorAxAx | do we have lawyers here? :) | 15:22 |
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| Stskeeps | xorAxAx: find a spot in the specification where it says GPS without AGPS or that GPS is possible without sim card usage | 15:22 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:22 |
| lardman_ | xorAxAx: steer clear of litigation if at all avoidable | 15:22 |
| pupnik | nice stskeeps | 15:22 |
| xorAxAx | lardman_: why? :) | 15:22 |
| lardman_ | Stskeeps: thanks | 15:22 |
| lardman_ | xorAxAx: it's expensive and wastes lots of time | 15:22 |
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| pupnik | that is honest. | 15:23 |
| Robot101 | zaheerm: Nokia direct | 15:23 |
| pupnik | bbl | 15:23 |
| lardman_ | personally, I'd prefer in almost all cases to get on with life | 15:23 |
| xorAxAx | so lets start with bad reputation :) | 15:23 |
| xorAxAx | "the n900 is worse than the nokia online shop" | 15:23 |
| Stskeeps | unpossible | 15:23 |
| Robot101 | zaheerm: they said every other call was about the N900 | 15:23 |
| Robot101 | and had much more interest than the N97 | 15:23 |
| Robot101 | :) | 15:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | xorAxAx, jumping to suing is not productive. | 15:23 |
| zaheerm | Robot101, the rest of their phones seem to be sold by people other than nokia however | 15:23 |
| zaheerm | Robot101, like the operators, but yah i'm not surprised if it outsells the n97 | 15:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | xorAxAx, the people at Maemo Devices are reasonable folks. Think about how you reacted if instead of having somebody approach you with an issue then went off to start litigation. | 15:24 |
| mece | Iis openarena stable and useable? | 15:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | xorAxAx, not likely to drive up your desire to work with them, is it? | 15:25 |
| lardman_ | xorAxAx: in any case you would never win | 15:25 |
| xorAxAx | lardman_: just a matter of the right lawyer :) | 15:25 |
| lardman_ | no not really, the right amount of money | 15:25 |
| xorAxAx | also that | 15:25 |
| lardman_ | mainly that I would think | 15:25 |
| lardman_ | anyway, back to useful work | 15:25 |
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| lardman_ | like a SUPL feeding api so we can actually feed the GPS some data of our own | 15:26 |
| zaheerm | lardman_, you sniffing network traffic? | 15:26 |
| lardman_ | no, why's that? | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | has anyone worked out where it stores the GPS state? | 15:26 |
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| Stskeeps | lardman_: it's SSL, ltrace, i guess | 15:27 |
| fnordianslip | hmm. in the bug comments quim says he's going outside to test the gps. hope he finds his way back :) | 15:27 |
| lardman_ | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3833 | 15:28 |
| povbot | Bug 3833: Request for information to allow hooking into A-GPS location framework | 15:28 |
| Stskeeps | lardman_: still relevant i guess | 15:28 |
| xorAxAx | fnordianslip: lol | 15:28 |
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| xorAxAx | maybe he has a data plan | 15:28 |
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| lardman_ | I know we could insert SUPL data, but I would like an api so we could provide e.g. ephemeris data if we're offline | 15:28 |
| fnordianslip | cheats | 15:28 |
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| lardman_ | anyone happen to know about homo/heterodyning lockin systems? | 15:31 |
| fnordianslip | i thought a gps rx got ephemeris data from the sats themselves | 15:31 |
| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: yes, it should do that too | 15:32 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: yes, but it can be pre-loaded so it doens't need to wait so long to download the infp | 15:32 |
| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: it should take no more than 60s to download or so. | 15:32 |
| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: in a good signal area. | 15:32 |
| lardman_ | I thought 60s was the almanac? | 15:32 |
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| lardman_ | wasn't there a 12min cycle in there somewhere? | 15:32 |
| fnordianslip | indeed. but it doesn't seem to do it, does it. | 15:32 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: no - the almanac is broadcast on a 12.5 min cycle. | 15:32 |
| lardman_ | ah ok | 15:32 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: the ephemeris is 30s cycle - but you need a complete cycle | 15:33 |
| fnordianslip | i though abt 15 mins to get almanac, so sounds right | 15:33 |
| fnordianslip | thought, even | 15:33 |
| lardman_ | I wonder if the almanac info is scrubbed from our chipset, even though it should last a long time | 15:33 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: and the initial lock to any satellite will take a few s, so that's a few seconds plus a random place in the 30s cycle | 15:33 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: me too | 15:33 |
| lardman_ | SpeedEvil: yep | 15:33 |
| melmoth | /etc/email-addresses or something ? | 15:34 |
| melmoth | oups | 15:34 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=417816 | 15:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ehehe | 15:35 |
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| * fnordianslip fondly remembers hanging wires out of planes in an effort to get dgps correction data from lighthouses | 15:35 | |
| lardman_ | lol | 15:35 |
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| fnordianslip | i lost a 3/8" spanner that way, somewhere over bournemouth | 15:36 |
| AndrewBlack | konttori_work_no, Ping | 15:36 |
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| lardman_ | fnordianslip: glad I don't live there | 15:36 |
| fnordianslip | me too | 15:37 |
| lardman_ | what were you doing with a spanner in-flight? | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | and who got hit by it? | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:37 |
| glass_ | opening up the plane probably | 15:37 |
| fnordianslip | it was tied to the end of the wire to stop it flapping around so much. was being the operative word. when i pulled the wire in, the spanner was gone | 15:37 |
| lardman_ | hmm | 15:38 |
| fnordianslip | indeed | 15:38 |
| lardman_ | what were you flying? | 15:38 |
| Jagoo | has someone made a maemo port of gnu nano editor yet? :) | 15:38 |
| fnordianslip | cessna 406 | 15:38 |
| lardman_ | and you let a spanner clonk around out the back?! | 15:38 |
| red | nano works straight up | 15:39 |
| AndrewBlack | I´m starting to thing that only 15 people ready planet.maemo.org lol thats the average number of votes either up or down that posts get :) | 15:39 |
| red | no port required | 15:39 |
| fnordianslip | there was much more then just a spanner on a wire hanging out the back | 15:39 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: ah ok | 15:39 |
| RST38h | Jagoo: nano port exists but it coredumps on ^W | 15:40 |
| RST38h | (AGAIN I must add) | 15:40 |
| fnordianslip | and we flew at 2ft above the sea near whitley bay | 15:40 |
| red | hmm | 15:40 |
| lardman_ | I trust it was flat calm | 15:40 |
| xorAxAx | RST38h: W means write, it wrote something with your written text in it, | 15:40 |
| fnordianslip | ish | 15:40 |
| red | i just wget nano | 15:40 |
| xorAxAx | isnt that enought? :) | 15:40 |
| red | and it worked without any changes | 15:40 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: why? | 15:40 |
| red | using n900 | 15:40 |
| RST38h | xorAxAx: ^W means Search | 15:41 |
| fnordianslip | damned pilot was mad | 15:41 |
| xorAxAx | RST38h: oh | 15:41 |
| xorAxAx | how unintuitive | 15:41 |
| red | apt-get i mean ffs | 15:41 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: ah ok, not part of the job then | 15:41 |
| fnordianslip | ish | 15:41 |
| RST38h | xorAxAx: Not liking it? Use vi instead. | 15:41 |
| Jagoo | after playing around with a retail N900 at work I placed an order for one :) | 15:41 |
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| xorAxAx | RST38h: i plan to, yeah | 15:41 |
| Jagoo | now reading up on what kind of apps there are | 15:41 |
| red | good pick | 15:41 |
| fnordianslip | he wanted to look for topless sunbathers on the beach, and we agreed on 15ft | 15:42 |
| red | not that many apps yet, im an ex iphone user | 15:42 |
| xorAxAx | fnordianslip: lol | 15:42 |
| red | but still loving the device | 15:42 |
| sejo | *all you need is VI, vi* | 15:42 |
| sejo | *vi is all you need* | 15:42 |
| sejo | even the beatles knew vi! | 15:42 |
| Jagoo | the main sell for me (switching from a N95 8gb) is the qwerty kbd and a browser thats actually fast | 15:42 |
| red | took some fiddling to get root priviledges and msn is a bit bbuggy | 15:42 |
| xorAxAx | sejo: now sing it :) | 15:43 |
| red | keyboard is ok i guess. still a bit small for my taste | 15:43 |
| red | liked 9300@keyb | 15:44 |
| AndrewBlack | I like n900 better then iphones and now better then n810 | 15:44 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewBlack: :) | 15:44 |
| xorAxAx | AndrewBlack: then you didnt try gps with a data plan :) | 15:44 |
| xorAxAx | +out | 15:44 |
| AndrewBlack | xorAxAx, I did worked fine | 15:45 |
| xorAxAx | you got a fix? | 15:45 |
| xorAxAx | without internet connection? | 15:45 |
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| AndrewBlack | ahh I though you said with data plan lol | 15:45 |
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| AndrewBlack | dont know I havn't tried it with out data on | 15:46 |
| xorAxAx | sell your n900 and buy a pre | 15:46 |
| sejo | xorAxAx: no john would resurrect to kick my arse! | 15:46 |
| xorAxAx | AndrewBlack: just as a means to protest | 15:46 |
| AndrewBlack | why no have a data plan only $10 a month | 15:46 |
| xorAxAx | does it work internationally as well? | 15:47 |
| AndrewBlack | nope you have to move to the US | 15:47 |
| AndrewBlack | but its worth it :) | 15:47 |
| joppu_ | Is Mer in need of some custom icons? | 15:47 |
| xorAxAx | ah, US. i meant roaming. but americans probably have less vacation in non-home countries than europeans | 15:47 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: possibly - wazd has some degree of overview | 15:48 |
| joppu_ | I have been working on something called "freemanle icons" | 15:48 |
| xorAxAx | imagine yourself doing holidays in mexico, AndrewBlack | 15:48 |
| xorAxAx | no gps fix, lost! | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: mm? | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: we have a freemantle-icons set too ;) | 15:48 |
| AndrewBlack | I always get prepaid sim cards when I leave country | 15:48 |
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| Stskeeps | based on Oxygen | 15:48 |
| joppu_ | haha, I think I stole that name from there :D | 15:48 |
| xorAxAx | AndrewBlack: hmm | 15:49 |
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| xorAxAx | no solidarity? :-/ | 15:49 |
| hrw | http://www.flickr.com/photos/hrwandil/4171053791/ | 15:49 |
| AndrewBlack | joppu_, can you do me a favor? | 15:49 |
| Stskeeps | xorAxAx: we'll see what quim says when he reemerges from the wilderness after being lost with his gps | 15:49 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:49 |
| joppu_ | sample: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/805039/maemo/folder_document_bold.svg | 15:50 |
| RST38h | Sts: I suggest Ari Jaaksi himself does that | 15:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | hrw, DDP? | 15:50 |
| RST38h | Sts: Will be way way more effective | 15:50 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i suggest nokians get stripped of free roaming aboard for testing the N900 :P | 15:50 |
| hrw | GeneralAntilles: yes | 15:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, amen! | 15:50 |
| Stskeeps | abroad | 15:50 |
| woglinde | offroad | 15:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, Quim wanted to use Twitter for organizing after-hours meetups in BCN. | 15:51 |
| RST38h | Sts: That will also solve us the offline map download problem | 15:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | hrw, cool. | 15:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wonder when fanoush'll get his. | 15:51 |
| hrw | GeneralAntilles: so do I | 15:51 |
| RST38h | hrw: So, are you liking your N900 so far? | 15:51 |
| hrw | RST38h: n900 like n900... I like the power of omap3 | 15:52 |
| hrw | n900 is too thick | 15:52 |
| suihkulokki | hrw has sertainly been touching the screen a lot :p | 15:52 |
| * RST38h smiles noticing how similar Polish idioms are to Russian | 15:52 | |
| hrw | it reminds HTC Tytn-II which was few years old | 15:52 |
| hrw | RST38h: ;D | 15:52 |
| AndrewBlack | anyone on linux with Theme Maker 1.2.5+ want to build a theme for me so I don have to wait til I get home? | 15:52 |
| RST38h | Yea, or HTC Diamond Pro | 15:52 |
| woglinde | hm htc will ship 8 new phones in fist half of 2010 | 15:52 |
| RST38h | The beefy one with the keyboard | 15:52 |
| woglinde | mostly android | 15:53 |
| hrw | RST38h: never saw diamond newer then first one | 15:53 |
| joppu_ | By the way, anyone know if they have any spare part for the N900 in their... repair facilities? I sent mine in for repairs and they promised it'd be complete in 5-10 days. | 15:53 |
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| joppu_ | *spare parts | 15:53 |
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| RST38h | hrw: http://www.baekdal.com/future/Mobile/HTC-touch-diamond-pro-2/ | 15:53 |
| RST38h | hrw: Notice how similar it is (sans WinCE of course) | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: what was your issue btw? | 15:54 |
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| joppu_ | Stskeeps: screen failure | 15:55 |
| hrw | RST38h: http://www.phonearena.com/htmls/Nokia-N900-phone-size-compare-pc_4008.html is nicer | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: ah | 15:55 |
| RST38h | yea, guess so | 15:55 |
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| SpeedEvil | joppu_: did you do anyting to it? | 15:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | lardman: so, i'm told by a birdie @ nokia that you can setup a bluetooth gps daemon on another computer | 15:56 |
| timeless_mbp | specifically gpsfeed+ | 15:56 |
| hrw | RST38h: and I use nokia e66 now so going to n900 is ;( | 15:56 |
| timeless_mbp | and use it to lie to your n900 (select that as your gps source) | 15:56 |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless: well - it's actually in the location menu in settings | 15:56 |
| hrw | RST38h: need to buy new case for it for example | 15:56 |
| RST38h | hrw: I already know N900 is exactly the size of iPhone, just thicker though =) | 15:56 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: oh - no - the other way round | 15:56 |
| joppu_ | SpeedEvil: 2 hours on after unboxing, installed a few apps (ssh and hermes) locked the screen, unlocked it and bam, screen is pitch black with backlight still on | 15:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | joppu_: :/ | 15:57 |
| xorAxAx | 14:56:36 -!- Irssi: New peak in #maemo@freenode : 492 | 15:57 |
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| joppu_ | Reflash didn't do anything | 15:57 |
| X-Fade | joppu_: removed battery? | 15:57 |
| joppu_ | X-Fade: For 2 hours | 15:58 |
| X-Fade | joppu_: That should have been more than enough :( | 15:59 |
| tbf | i wonder how winter season and impatience of users contributes to n900 hardware faults | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | and drool | 15:59 |
| frals | god im in love with this device | 15:59 |
| tbf | on the other hand: it's a phone, not a hard disk | 15:59 |
| timeless_mbp | Jagoo: =) re fast browser | 15:59 |
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| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: having encountered a non free phone bill | 16:00 |
| timeless_mbp | i should note that it isn't technically free roaming abroad | 16:00 |
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| joppu_ | I really suspect a serious lack of quality control | 16:00 |
| xorAxAx | "It | 16:00 |
| xorAxAx | may WORKSFORYOU, but it certainly doesn't work on mine, and it's going back | 16:00 |
| xorAxAx | under warranty if this isn't fixed in the next update." | 16:00 |
| timeless_mbp | just nearly free roaming w/in the civilized world | 16:00 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Any idea why I sometimes only get the checkered background when going back through the graphical history thingy? | 16:00 |
| xorAxAx | +1 | 16:00 |
| timeless_mbp | and that only applies to europeans | 16:01 |
| wazd | yes it needs | 16:01 |
| joppu_ | The failure rates are almost as bad as the xbox360 :P | 16:01 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: I then need to switch between apps a bit to get it redrawn? | 16:01 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: eh? | 16:01 |
| bobbyd | hi, sorry to ask again, but is there any way to get a pptp VPN working on the N900 atm? I can see a thread on talk.maemo.org, but it appears to be saying that the kernel that ships with the unit doesn't have pptp enabled. There's another page talking about the n800, but nothing I can find for the n900 | 16:01 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless; eh? | 16:01 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: can you explain in more detail? | 16:01 |
| bobbyd | timeless_mbp: SpeedEvil eh? | 16:01 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: oh | 16:01 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: what other way around? | 16:01 |
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| till- | bobbyd i'm using pptp on my n800 | 16:02 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: browse page, click through, swipe from right, click on previous page. | 16:02 |
| timeless_mbp | ok | 16:02 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: I misarsed your comment to refer to using an external bluetooth GPS with the n900 - which I've seen as an option in settings - though not actually tried. | 16:02 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Previous page then only shows the checkered pattern. | 16:02 |
| till- | i had to built a custom kernel for mppe encryption support and installed pptp-linux | 16:02 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: that's what i'm talking about | 16:02 |
| bobbyd | till-: ok, do you know of any solution for the n900, or was that just information? | 16:02 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: oh | 16:02 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Happens quite a lot with a few browser windows open. | 16:02 |
| till- | i don't own a n900 | 16:03 |
| timeless_mbp | i think in order to actually run gpsfeed+ on host and make it serve your n900 will probably require an interesting hack | 16:03 |
| timeless_mbp | host=n900 in that | 16:03 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: so.. confused | 16:03 |
| till- | but if the configuration is similar you may need a new kernel for the encryption | 16:03 |
| timeless_mbp | you get a proper preview of the page when you are in the back history list, right? | 16:03 |
| till- | if your vpn uses mppe | 16:03 |
| bobbyd | I can live with all the other stuff that the n900 doesn't do, but not being apbe to VPN is a killer for me :/ | 16:03 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: I'm proibably being slow - but why would you want to pretedn youre n900 is connected to a bluetooth gps that is really the internal n900 gps | 16:03 |
| timeless_mbp | it's just the checkerboard when you click on the page | 16:03 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Yes. | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: someone was talking about wanting to send random bits to the supl server | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | not sure what they wanted to do or why | 16:04 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: And it doesn't redraw. | 16:04 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: ah | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | i know i want to be able to take a picture of an island and claim i'm in tahiti | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | because i need to test the geotagging | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: we want to cache SUPL data for getting GPS fixes while abroad and without data roaming | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | and nokia won't pay for my flight | 16:04 |
| timeless_mbp | ok | 16:04 |
| flux | bobbyd, well, if it consolates you at all, my openvpn-based vpn is working great! ;) | 16:05 |
| timeless_mbp | well, roughly, what i'm suggesting is how you'd do it | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: I have doubts that caching data for more than some hours is going to help | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | err | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: | 16:05 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: *shrug*, "not my problem" | 16:05 |
| xorAxAx | bobbyd, flux: and vpnc seems to be available as well | 16:05 |
| * SpeedEvil notes that he has a horrible throat infection, and is probably not tracking very well. | 16:05 | |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: so... | 16:05 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: i would gladly use 2gb of data if that helped anything. | 16:05 |
| hrw | btw - what kind of #$^##@$#!@ wrote maemo5 'so called email application'? | 16:05 |
| timeless_mbp | about the checkerboard (and this really needs to be a blog entry) | 16:05 |
| hrw | it is not even useless :( | 16:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | hrw: It's certainly different. | 16:06 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: um | 16:06 |
| timeless_mbp | please calm down | 16:06 |
| SpeedEvil | hrw: It won't actually connect at all for me over pop3 | 16:06 |
| frals__ | god this is so awesome | 16:06 |
| Myrtti | hrw: have you used the maemo<5 mail clients? | 16:06 |
| timeless_mbp | the guy who wrote the email application is probably called a "contractor" | 16:06 |
| hrw | no access to imap folders other then inbox/sent/drafts | 16:06 |
| mece | frals__, what is? | 16:06 |
| hrw | Myrtti: I used Claws on n810 | 16:06 |
| wazd | joppu_: yes, Mer needs custom icons | 16:06 |
| timeless_mbp | contractors are guys who do whatever someone else tells them to do | 16:06 |
| Myrtti | hrw: did you use the default one? | 16:06 |
| Myrtti | hrw: did you try it? | 16:06 |
| frals__ | the n900 :D | 16:06 |
| timeless_mbp | typically someone called a "ui designer" writes out lists of demands | 16:06 |
| hrw | Myrtti: tried once and decided against it | 16:07 |
| timeless_mbp | the ui designer, potentially also a "contractor" | 16:07 |
| mece | hrw, my imap folders work just fine... | 16:07 |
| timeless_mbp | is ordered to solve a problem based on a list of "requirements" | 16:07 |
| X-Fade | hrw: It uses folders for me on gmail imap just fine? | 16:07 |
| timeless_mbp | the requirements come from some database of old and irrational requirements | 16:07 |
| Myrtti | hrw: I think you'd need to put a lot of effort to make things worse than that | 16:07 |
| timeless_mbp | this is all bundled together into a schedule by a guy called a "project manager" | 16:07 |
| Myrtti | hrw: which I doubt has been done, effort is such a horrible thing to waste | 16:07 |
| timeless_mbp | that guy says "oh, we don't have time for X, drop it" | 16:07 |
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| timeless_mbp | roughly, the people who work on an app in a company are not responsible for its quality | 16:08 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: I know how project managing works and what deadline means | 16:08 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: the requirements which may be drawn up by someone that hasn't actually used mobile email ever - for example - and is inventing logical requirements. Which adds fun. | 16:08 |
| timeless_mbp | they're the victims of people they can't control ("managers") | 16:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil++ | 16:08 |
| timeless_mbp | that seems to describe 95% of our requirements on average | 16:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | e.g. the requirement not to use 'Re:' for all localizations | 16:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | "We must support Outlook Express style localized Re prefixes" | 16:09 |
| lardman_ | Stskeeps, SpeedEvil: so who do we actually try to talk to to get some more progress on the GPS? | 16:09 |
| * timeless_mbp grumbles | 16:09 | |
| suihkulokki | 16:06 < hrw> no access to imap folders other then inbox/sent/drafts | 16:09 |
| suihkulokki | on maemo5? not true. | 16:09 |
| timeless_mbp | Targeted to be Fixed in some service release | 16:09 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: that information is not as I understand it public | 16:09 |
| lardman_ | SpeedEvil: that's why I asked Stskeeps too ;) | 16:09 |
| timeless_mbp | lardman: what do you mean pogress? | 16:09 |
| timeless_mbp | s/pog/prog/ | 16:10 |
| infobot | timeless_mbp meant: lardman: what do you mean progress? | 16:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | other than the fact that the checkboxes for gps are too intimately tied to work well | 16:10 |
| Myrtti | I think it's time for some music | 16:10 |
| Myrtti | http://www.thesixtyone.com/crazygibbon/song/PokemonFace/sEKkurubxQT/ | 16:10 |
| timeless_mbp | and that the camera app uses them in a stupid place | 16:10 |
| lardman_ | well I'd like to find out about caching definitively and as whether we might ever get an api to provide our own assistance data | 16:10 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't see specific problems w/ gps | 16:10 |
| Stskeeps | lardman_: i know who to poke but i'm not sure how it can be done | 16:10 |
| hrw | http://www.flickr.com/photos/hrwandil/4171933732/ is what I have on screen | 16:10 |
| timeless_mbp | lardman: you can replace supl.nokia.com in the settings>location panel | 16:10 |
| lardman_ | timeless_mbp: not problems per se, but progress | 16:10 |
| lardman_ | timeless_mbp: I would prefer local data provision, but I guess running a local supl server would be possible | 16:11 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: anyway, about checkerboards | 16:11 |
| hrw | no other folders, no way to go to inbox->mailinglists->development->oe->poky folder | 16:11 |
| timeless_mbp | lardman_: i'm offering a public api :) | 16:11 |
| lardman_ | bbl | 16:11 |
| timeless_mbp | you're asking for work to be done | 16:11 |
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| lardman_ | oh I see | 16:11 |
| lardman_ | timeless_mbp: well I'd like to know what is cached too | 16:12 |
| hrw | suihkulokki: where should I get folders on that screen? | 16:12 |
| lardman_ | as it doesn't seem to work well atm | 16:12 |
| Stskeeps | lardman_: oh that's not a bad idea timeless has.. | 16:12 |
| lardman_ | anyway, got to go, bbl | 16:12 |
| Stskeeps | lardman_: make a localhost supl server that gives us data :P | 16:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | well, we're supposed to be partying today like we shipped the "Nokia 900" http://www.webwizardry.net/~timeless/n900/nokia-900.jpg | 16:12 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: oh dear | 16:12 |
| timeless_mbp | so i wouldn't expect anything today (other than drunken finns) | 16:12 |
| SpeedEvil | well - I have one valid bug on the GPS - the truncation of GPS coordinates precision in geotags of pics. | 16:13 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Duh ;) | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: 43, 47? :P | 16:13 |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: photo from the Helsinki Nokia Flagship store window display | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | But I haven't properly verified the long lock with no net | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: ? | 16:13 |
| timeless_mbp | hires photo w/ geotagging available | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: rounds to integers? | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: yes | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: sigh | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: integer seconds of lat/lon | 16:13 |
| woglinde | hhi | 16:13 |
| woglinde | hihi | 16:13 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: back to checkerboarded | 16:13 |
| woglinde | epic fail | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: any good reason why http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/non-free/l/location-test-gui/ is blank btw? | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: (~30m grid at the equator) | 16:13 |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: heh | 16:13 |
| suihkulokki | hrw: in my case they are under sent folder. | 16:14 |
| Jaffa | timeless_mbp: And you've not been shot for highlighting it yet? | 16:14 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Need to ask Soumya. | 16:14 |
| SpeedEvil | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6584 | 16:14 |
| povbot | Bug 6584: GPS geotagged pictures truncate precision of GPS reading. | 16:14 |
| timeless_mbp | Jaffa: well, i got two or three nastygrams from people at Nokia House | 16:14 |
| timeless_mbp | i think they want to shoot me | 16:14 |
| timeless_mbp | it's ok, the feeling is mutual | 16:14 |
| * SpeedEvil passes timeless a suit of powered armour. | 16:14 | |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: i do wonder how you keep your job at times :P | 16:14 |
| hrw | suihkulokki: I do not know... maybe it is refreshing folderlist in background... but I did not found email app which would require so big amount of time to scan it | 16:14 |
| * SpeedEvil hopes timeless has enough bl5cs. | 16:15 | |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: i wonder how long i'll keep my job every day or so | 16:15 |
| hrw | I have just ~100 folders | 16:15 |
| suihkulokki | hrw: all subscribed? | 16:15 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: try subscribing to only 5 | 16:15 |
| timeless_mbp | (preferably small folders!) | 16:15 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: first I want to get option to subscribe to them | 16:15 |
| timeless_mbp | be nice to the tinymail program | 16:15 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: not implemented | 16:15 |
| timeless_mbp | use thunderbird | 16:15 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: I want my OE folder with 14000 mails in it | 16:15 |
| Myrtti | you're all silly, have some cheesecake | 16:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | Myrtti: that doesn't sound finnish | 16:16 |
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| Myrtti | timeless_mbp: rahkapulla then | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | there's no subscribe to imap folders functionality? | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:16 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: ok, so looks like I have to wait for alternative email client for n900? | 16:16 |
| hrw | f..k | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | hrw: claws should exist | 16:16 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: gmail/h and gmail/x work nicely | 16:17 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: I have all my folders subscribed | 16:17 |
| Stskeeps | claws would be so much cooler if they didn't have an elitist attitude about contacts.. | 16:17 |
| hrw | timeless_mbp: I do not wnt to move my mail to gmail | 16:17 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: so fix it w/ another client once | 16:17 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 16:17 |
| Myrtti | timeless_mbp: http://mediaserver-2.vuodatus.net/g/33648/743281.jpg | 16:17 |
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| * Stskeeps likes claws though | 16:17 | |
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| timeless_mbp | Myrtti: yum | 16:17 |
| timeless_mbp | MfE works if you can get your mail server admin to add support for it | 16:17 |
| timeless_mbp | it turns out that google supports some version of MfE... hypothetically someday some MfE clients might support it too :) | 16:18 |
| sejo | timeless_mbp: problemthere is that it's mostly paying addons :/ | 16:18 |
| timeless_mbp | ? | 16:18 |
| sejo | the mfe addons on zimbra, zarafa etc | 16:19 |
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| timeless_mbp | interesting | 16:20 |
| timeless_mbp | so for 50USD / year i can get decent mobile access to my mailbox? | 16:20 |
| timeless_mbp | that's a bargain | 16:20 |
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| woglinde | timeless set up your own zimbra | 16:21 |
| woglinde | or what is mfe really? | 16:21 |
| timeless_mbp | microsoft's replacement for imap | 16:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | (roughly) | 16:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | it's a server controlled windowed push protocol | 16:22 |
| woglinde | ieehks | 16:22 |
| xorAxAx | news on bug 5337 | 16:22 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 16:22 |
| woglinde | the blackberry death | 16:22 |
| timeless_mbp | the server says "I know you have X, Y, Z. Forget them" | 16:22 |
| woglinde | nobody needs this | 16:22 |
| fnordianslip | so, quim got a fix and made it back. he claims to have no SIM in but then says that he installed the Location widget, so presumably he had Wifi connectivity. | 16:22 |
| timeless_mbp | "Add A, B, C with data: ..." | 16:22 |
| xorAxAx | quim found his way back! :o | 16:22 |
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| GeneralAntilles | fnordianslip, location widget is built-in. | 16:23 |
| woglinde | lol | 16:23 |
| fnordianslip | ah | 16:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | fnordianslip, he means "added the location widget to the desktop" | 16:23 |
| fnordianslip | ok | 16:23 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: odd | 16:23 |
| timeless_mbp | isn't the location widget a default on widget? | 16:23 |
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| flux | no. | 16:24 |
| makel | hello | 16:24 |
| * timeless_mbp removes most of the default widgets anyway | 16:24 | |
| timeless_mbp | (first run task) | 16:24 |
| timeless_mbp | "gotta zap them all" | 16:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, quite possibly. | 16:24 |
| zap_ | ORLY? | 16:24 |
| timeless_mbp | zap_: =) | 16:25 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm not much of a collector | 16:25 |
| timeless_mbp | and they slow down boot remendously | 16:25 |
| timeless_mbp | i like a nearly pristine mobile desktop | 16:25 |
| *** zap_ is now known as zap | 16:25 | |
| timeless_mbp | unlike my work desktops where i have hundreds or thousands of objects :) | 16:25 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure that 'no GPS lock without a connection' is actually valid if you've had a GPS connection which may have stored data recently | 16:25 |
| SpeedEvil | recently = 12h-3 weeks | 16:25 |
| SpeedEvil | depending on stuff | 16:25 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: he flashed it first | 16:26 |
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| ccooke | heh. One of my coworkers just had his n900 arrive | 16:26 |
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| Stskeeps | that said, his GPS experience sounds tortorous | 16:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, yeah, I feel like he's splitting hairs over the summary and resolution. | 16:29 |
| mece | ccooke, was there cheering involved? | 16:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, a process that, in the end, is just generating ill-will and preventing us from actually getting any bugs addressed. | 16:29 |
| ccooke | *laugh* | 16:29 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: obviously GPS fixes are possible, but it's not very strong | 16:30 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, and my experience in BCN was that they're not possible. | 16:30 |
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| Stskeeps | that they're buggy is something else :P | 16:31 |
| wazd | ~seen fiferboy | 16:31 |
| infobot | fiferboy is currently on #maemo (49m 45s), last said: 'You can set them up to, or add alpha to an RGB pixbuf'. | 16:31 |
| fiferboy_ | Hey wazd | 16:31 |
| wazd | fiferboy_: heya :) | 16:31 |
| Stskeeps | joppu_: so what did you base your icon set on? | 16:32 |
| wazd | fiferboy: how's it going? :) | 16:32 |
| fiferboy_ | wazd: He's a ghost | 16:32 |
| wazd | fiferboy_: ah :) | 16:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Egads the Pandora is ugly. | 16:32 |
| guerby | hi N900 seems to be completely sold out in France. Vendor the phone house report only 5 out of 300 stores with a N900 in stock. How is it going in other countries? | 16:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | and people call the N900 thick. . . . | 16:33 |
| mece | guerby, heard uk was low on N900's | 16:33 |
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| wazd | fiferboy_: do you have any progress on PC? ;) | 16:34 |
| w00t | GeneralAntilles: I don't understand that to be honest | 16:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | w00t, nor I. | 16:34 |
| fiferboy_ | wazd: Not since the baby | 16:34 |
| guerby | mece, /www.expansys.co.uk is out of stock too | 16:34 |
| w00t | GeneralAntilles: n900 is a bit thick *I SUPPOSE*, compared to other phones, but it's certainly not huge | 16:34 |
| w00t | it's smaller than my previous phone (HTC Universal) by alot | 16:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pandora really needs Mer. | 16:35 |
| LinuxCode | guerby, *play.com* cough | 16:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Talk about waiting a while for boot. | 16:35 |
| wazd | fiferboy_: ah, sure :) | 16:35 |
| timeless_mbp | w00t: it's about as thick as most phones with useful slide out keyboards | 16:35 |
| timeless_mbp | if it didn't have the keyboard it could be thinner | 16:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6m1y01LXtM | 16:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | gur | 16:35 |
| timeless_mbp | and then people could complain it doesn't have a keyboard | 16:35 |
| LinuxCode | nvm pre-order | 16:35 |
| timeless_mbp | people will always complain | 16:35 |
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| hrw | timeless_mbp: but why n810 is not so thick? | 16:36 |
| timeless_mbp | hrw: it also didn't have a cellular radio | 16:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | hrw, wider, taller | 16:36 |
| suihkulokki | less hardware, larger other dimensions? | 16:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Plus fewer electronics. | 16:36 |
| hrw | n810 is just like n900 base | 16:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The stylus tappin' on the Pandora makes me chuckle. | 16:36 |
| zaheerm | guerby, collabora bought up all the uk stock according to Robot101 :) | 16:36 |
| timeless_mbp | i've heard rumors that to get a working signal w/ AT&T's network, your phone needs to be somewhat thick - just for the radio | 16:36 |
| timeless_mbp | i'd always wondered why the iPhone was so much thicker than my iPod touch | 16:36 |
| timeless_mbp | i have to believe that it really is a radio requirement | 16:37 |
| zaheerm | timeless_mbp, i managed with my e71 fine when i was in usa | 16:37 |
| mece | downloading openarena over 3g 384kbps was a stupid idea... | 16:37 |
| timeless_mbp | zaheerm: on at&t 3g? | 16:37 |
| suihkulokki | iirc it has been rumoured the reason n900 is thick is the camera module | 16:37 |
| mece | oh well, it's still ticking. | 16:37 |
| zaheerm | timeless_mbp, aah only 2g | 16:37 |
| w00t | timeless_mbp: my point is, really, I don't see why people are complaining about the size | 16:37 |
| w00t | it's not unmanageably big | 16:37 |
| timeless_mbp | zaheerm: sounds like you're proof that it's the radio :) | 16:37 |
| timeless_mbp | w00t: me neither | 16:37 |
| zaheerm | i don't think my e71 had at&t 3g freqs | 16:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Damnable lack of AT&T 3G. | 16:37 |
| zaheerm | also when i travel i always set my radio to 2g | 16:38 |
| * GeneralAntilles really hates Nokia for that. | 16:38 | |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: that was clearly a business decision | 16:38 |
| timeless_mbp | it sounds like working w/ at&t is painful | 16:38 |
| timeless_mbp | and requires a lot of up front planning | 16:38 |
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| zaheerm | or that t-mobile paid some money for not having at&t freqs ;) | 16:38 |
| timeless_mbp | it took apple, what 2-3 years to design the iPhone in concert w/ at&t, no? | 16:38 |
| wazd | fiferboy_: maybe I'll just start to make some skins :) | 16:38 |
| mece | GeneralAntilles, Isn't that cdma? Also known as the hd-dvd of telecom? | 16:38 |
| wazd | fiferboy_: and you'll catch up when ready :) | 16:39 |
| timeless_mbp | mece: no | 16:39 |
| timeless_mbp | verizon/sprint and friends are cdma | 16:39 |
| timeless_mbp | at&t and tmobile are the gsm providers in the usa | 16:39 |
| mece | ok. well then it's just a bummer. | 16:39 |
| fiferboy_ | wazd: That sounds good | 16:39 |
| mece | I'm off. toodles. | 16:39 |
| timeless_mbp | (ignoring minor bit players and sublicensees) | 16:39 |
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| suihkulokki | timeless_mbp: well, the iphone proves that if you have a great product with a overhyped brand, at&t will take it, no matter how bad the deal is to them.. | 16:39 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: heh | 16:40 |
| timeless_mbp | well, that's no problem for Nokia | 16:40 |
| timeless_mbp | we don't have any of that :) | 16:40 |
| suihkulokki | indeed. | 16:40 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: care to join me for a field trip to the Nokia Flagship store? | 16:40 |
| timeless_mbp | we can see if they manage to spell our product's name right :) | 16:40 |
| lardman | re | 16:40 |
| Myrtti | http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2009/12/us-west-coast-drunk-on-iphone-yes-but-android-is-not-the-answer.html <-- intresting read | 16:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, adding a radio frequency hardly seems like something that'd involve much talking with AT&T. | 16:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | More likely is that it was part of their agreement with T-Mobile US not to include AT&T 3G support. | 16:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, yes, a business decision. | 16:41 |
| suihkulokki | timeless_mbp: yeah, I could | 16:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | and a stupid and irritating one since T-Mobile has shit for coverage. | 16:41 |
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| lardman | re | 16:42 |
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| lardman | SpeedEvil, Stskeeps: still about | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: ok, i'm feeling unwell, can you head to kaampi metro station near the radisson hotel? | 16:42 |
| suihkulokki | timeless_mbp: I presume we'll head to the same place afterwards | 16:42 |
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| lardman | re local supl servers | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | i can meet you there at 5pm | 16:42 |
| fiferboy__ | Darn network connection >:| | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: yeah | 16:42 |
| suihkulokki | not at office? | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: you have my phone number, right? | 16:42 |
| sayjava_ | cant get the phonon to work properly on maemo | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: i'm feeling unwell | 16:42 |
| sayjava_ | :( | 16:42 |
| timeless_mbp | but yeah, we'll head to the same place afterwards | 16:43 |
| lardman | timeless_mbp: get well soon | 16:43 |
| timeless_mbp | you can lead since i have no idea where it is | 16:43 |
| * suihkulokki wonders if it is healthy to meet you then :P | 16:43 | |
| timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: oh, i'm fine :) | 16:43 |
| lardman | take one of those masks ;) | 16:43 |
| hrw | http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/2009/12/09/n900-arrived/ | 16:43 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: mm? | 16:44 |
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| Hydroxide | I've got an n900 customizability question for anyone who might know. given that most of the SMSes I receive are work-related and most of the voice calls I receive aren't, I'd like to make SMS messages produce an audible noise but voice calls only vibrate. is there a way I can hack together something (even through the terminal) to do that? | 16:45 |
| lardman | SUPL server to allow GPS data injection when there's no web link | 16:45 |
| lardman | Hydroxide: I think you can change the volume for different things can't you? | 16:46 |
| Hydroxide | that would be my preferred behavior for the 'general' profile. for the 'silent' profile I'd like SMSes to vibrate and voice calls to make no vibration/noise | 16:46 |
| timeless_mbp | Hydroxide: not given the current stack | 16:46 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: yeah, that would be one way to do it. but i worry that it then tries to make a data conn anyway | 16:46 |
| timeless_mbp | it's definitely doable in software | 16:46 |
| Hydroxide | lardman: I don't know a way to configure vibration for sms and voice separately | 16:46 |
| hrw | uf... after looong time email app finally shown folder list | 16:47 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: well I guess if it's written properly it should just try for the supl server address it's given | 16:47 |
| Hydroxide | timeless_mbp: is there a way I can write a component for something, or do I have to file a feature request with nokia and wait for them to take action? | 16:47 |
| lardman | Hydroxide: oh vibration, dunno then sorry | 16:47 |
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| hrw | just to tell that they are empty ;D | 16:47 |
| timeless_mbp | Hydroxide: my impression is that you could do it | 16:47 |
| timeless_mbp | the ui is afaiu built around dbus hooks | 16:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | so it should be possible, i believe | 16:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | but i work on the web browser | 16:47 |
| timeless_mbp | i've never actually looked at any of this, and i don't want to | 16:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | -- ie don't quote me | 16:48 |
| Hydroxide | timeless_mbp: yes. it's fine if you don't know the details. what would be ideal is simply a pointer to the relevant public docs | 16:48 |
| Hydroxide | I wouldn't mind learning dbus and telepathy anyway | 16:48 |
| timeless_mbp | well, mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/ has the public sources | 16:48 |
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| timeless_mbp | dbus and telepathy docs are probably best found somewhere not in *.maemo.org | 16:48 |
| Hydroxide | ok... | 16:48 |
| timeless_mbp | my impression from people internally is that we (perhaps thankfully) don't have our own better docs | 16:49 |
| Hydroxide | heh, probably :) except for whatever maemo-specific components there are. | 16:49 |
| frals | hmm, tempted to upgrade to exchange 2007 just so i can sync with exchange.. wonder if its worth the hassle of running it on x86 >-< | 16:49 |
| timeless_mbp | for the most part we're apparently using bog standard telepathy apis | 16:49 |
| timeless_mbp | (again probably a very good thing) | 16:49 |
| Hydroxide | I could also ask some of the collabora guys I know from debian, but I'll start by looking at standard docs, the maemo sdk docs, the URL you gave me, etc. thanks! | 16:49 |
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| Stskeeps | lardman: openssl s_client -tls1 -connect supl.nokia.com:7275 | 16:49 |
| Hydroxide | and yes, reusing standards is a major plus of the n900 and maemo generally | 16:49 |
| timeless_mbp | Hydroxide: sounds like pretty much the right approach | 16:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | it sounds like the collabra guys really are the best source | 16:50 |
| Hydroxide | yep. that was my plan all along - was just hoping for pointers | 16:50 |
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| lardman | Stskeeps: nice | 16:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | the notification apis are probably the part where you'll diverge from the standards | 16:50 |
| timeless_mbp | and need to play w/ maemo stuff | 16:50 |
| * SpeedEvil passes Hydroxide a *. | 16:50 | |
| timeless_mbp | but that's expected | 16:50 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: still trying to explain checkerboarding | 16:51 |
| Hydroxide | yeah, they seem to be focused especially on that stuff. it's a shame that the most technical IRC chatrooms related to this part of the maemo stack are on collabora's staff-only IRC network according to them :P | 16:51 |
| Hydroxide | SpeedEvil: careful - that almost got dereferenced in transit! | 16:51 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: An alternative is to explain it to me over lunch next week ;) | 16:51 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: http://www.openmobilealliance.org/technical/release_program/supl_v1_0.aspx | 16:51 |
| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: well, i want to write this up into a document | 16:51 |
| timeless_mbp | because i'm tired of explaining it | 16:52 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: v2 now I think | 16:52 |
| timeless_mbp | but yes, lunch next week sounds good | 16:52 |
| lardman | http://www.openmobilealliance.org/Technical/release_program/supl_v2_0.aspx | 16:52 |
| * timeless_mbp tries to figure out pants for this evening | 16:52 | |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless: mankini | 16:52 |
| lardman | ok, so I'll hack a Python server together to pass data through and allow us to look at it too | 16:53 |
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| lardman | SpeedEvil: are there any opensource apps which generate ephemeris and almanac dara? | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | there's a database i think | 16:55 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: not as far as I'm aware. | 16:55 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: you can get two line element sets for the sats | 16:55 |
| lardman | what we really need to make it useful is forward predictions | 16:55 |
| SpeedEvil | http://celestrak.com/NORAD/elements/supplemental/ | 16:55 |
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| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Fixed: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/non-free/l/location-test-gui/ | 16:56 |
| woglinde | lardman/speedevil what you are working on? | 16:57 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: thanks, was a bit baffled by it | 16:57 |
| lardman | woglinde: injecting supl data | 16:57 |
| SpeedEvil | woglinde: I'm just trying to work out why I sometimes get bad lock times for the GPS | 16:57 |
| lardman | woglinde: specifically when there's no net link | 16:57 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Turned out to be a broken regex.. | 16:57 |
| fnordianslip | given a set of tles, predict should do it | 16:57 |
| SpeedEvil | woglinde: I'm perhaps a bit obsessed - I'm working on a software GPS too | 16:57 |
| lardman | what does location-test-gui do? | 16:57 |
| woglinde | hm isnt it gpsd again? | 16:57 |
| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: yes - but then you need to go to the ephemeirs format | 16:57 |
| lardman | woglinde: that's above the level we're looking at | 16:57 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: it's a tool for testing the location framework | 16:58 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: you'll probably have good use for it | 16:58 |
| lardman | cool, thanks both then | 16:58 |
| woglinde | lardman hm okay so you are on the paths of guypsy | 16:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | X-Fade: http://viper.haque.net/~timeless/blog/165 | 16:59 |
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| timeless_mbp | rough writeup | 17:00 |
| timeless_mbp | a better one later | 17:00 |
| * timeless_mbp goes out | 17:00 | |
| woglinde | ciao timeless | 17:00 |
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| *** zpol is now known as lopz | 17:01 | |
| lopz | hi ;D | 17:01 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Yeah, I get that. But why doesn't scrolling trigger a redraw? | 17:01 |
| lardman | hmm, when a dialog is in the fg and the bg is blurred out, it doesn't reflect any changes in the underlying app | 17:01 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: Or re-render. It just doesn't do anything but show the checkerboard at that point. | 17:01 |
| timeless | it should, eventually | 17:01 |
| fnordianslip | timeless_mbp: sometimes it doesn't render anything after the page loads, i just get a whiteout, until i scroll or something | 17:02 |
| SpeedEvil | X-Fade: installing load applet gets you a better idea of what the CPU is doing | 17:02 |
| X-Fade | SpeedEvil: I know and cpu is idle then ;) | 17:02 |
| lardman | I hate HAM | 17:03 |
| X-Fade | lardman: SPAM any better? | 17:03 |
| lardman | perhaps SPHAM - simon pickerings hacked hildon app manager? | 17:03 |
| lardman | the other thing that really annoys me, is the way the browser flicks up and down when it opens | 17:05 |
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| Stskeeps | right, GPS bug is turning toxic | 17:05 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:05 |
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| Hydroxide | I was able to get the gps to get a fix by running ecoach | 17:06 |
| lardman | timeless_mbp: any chance of not resizing the browser window when the url bar is displayed? | 17:06 |
| Flandry | Who here thinks that omission of up and down arrow keys in some localizations is a defect? | 17:06 |
| Hydroxide | maemo-mapper and the built-in stuff and gpxview all couldn't get a fix, but they could use the fix once ecoach got it | 17:06 |
| X-Fade | lardman: There is an option to start in full screen mode. | 17:06 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: i'm not sure MM is using liblocation correctly | 17:07 |
| * toggles_w is unboxing.. | 17:07 | |
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| wjt | Jaffa: just wanted to say thank you for hermes | 17:07 |
| lardman | X-Fade: it's also the way it changes the screen though when the url bar comes up, so if you've clicked the wrong link you need to reaim | 17:07 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: it might not be. what programs/tools besides ecoach are supposed to be able to get a fix currently? | 17:07 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, seems like GPS bugs always turn toxic. | 17:07 |
| * RST38h continues watching bug 5337 in complete awe | 17:08 | |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 17:08 |
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| Flandry | yeah that's ridiculous | 17:08 |
| Flandry | btw queue Britney Spears :P | 17:08 |
| RST38h | Quim and a few other people should be in emergency rooms with deadly bouts of hiccups by now | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: well, technically it should take 12.5min for a totally cold fix | 17:09 |
| lardman | X-Fade: actually I think the open in full screen mode is the thing that's annoying me, as it seems to open then go full screen | 17:09 |
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| homeasvs | how can an app detect going to portrait mode ? | 17:09 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: note, I actually have had a network connection every time I've tried the GPS, so this is unrelated to #5337. ecoach was able to get a fix in seconds with a network connection, and no other program I've found yet could get one in several minutes in the same exact situation | 17:09 |
| lardman | homeasvs: read the docs, dbus message | 17:09 |
| fnordianslip | i wonder if the sat signals are two weak to read the almanac data without errors under some circumstances, perhaps. | 17:09 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: am I missing something key? | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | fnordianslip: also a good theory | 17:10 |
| GAN900 | Stskeeps, with optimal conditions perhaps. | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: location-test-gui would be a good tool for it | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | GAN900: yeah | 17:10 |
| GAN900 | Stskeeps, but, like I said, I couldn't get a fix at all in BCN. | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | GAN900: even with wifi connected? | 17:10 |
| lardman | ooo, that gps test program is cool | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | and a sim | 17:11 |
| fnordianslip | perhaps we could aggregate different almanac cycles with an algorithm to combine them and mitigate the errors | 17:11 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: what package is that in? | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: url was mentioned above, it's in tools non-free | 17:11 |
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| _berto_ | with internet connection it works fine, but without it I haven't been able to get a fix either | 17:11 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: oh, in the source? gotcha | 17:11 |
| Flandry | that sounds like a good idea | 17:12 |
| GAN900 | Stskeeps, even with. | 17:12 |
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| fnordianslip | i've just got a fix using Location test GUI in GNSS mode, after about 20 mins. I do have 3G and wifi on, but that shouldn't in theory make a difference | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | GAN900: that's odd | 17:12 |
| GAN900 | Although I didn't spend more than 5 minutes trying outdoors. | 17:12 |
| lardman | I'm surprised no-one is more excited about Latitude working | 17:12 |
| GAN900 | It almost sounds like a bug. ;) | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | is it in extras yet? | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:13 |
| Jaffa | wjt: You're welcome :) | 17:13 |
| zaheerm | lardman, i am, it is in my bookmarks :) | 17:13 |
| lardman | oh good :) | 17:13 |
| wjt | Jaffa: :) We just got a shipment of N900s, and my address book looks much prettier post-Hermes | 17:13 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: Latitude? Is a bookmark | 17:13 |
| * agi waves at _berto_ | 17:13 | |
| Stskeeps | lardman: ah | 17:13 |
| wjt | although osso-abook is happily chomping my CPU | 17:14 |
| wjt | guess it takes a while | 17:14 |
| _berto_ | hi agi ;) | 17:15 |
| * Flandry wishes he had his N900 already :/ | 17:15 | |
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| _berto_ | you here? | 17:15 |
| agi | _berto_: yep :) | 17:15 |
| agi | _berto_: bought a n900 (and had to return it 2 days afterwards) | 17:15 |
| _berto_ | mic not working ? | 17:16 |
| agi | #6334 | 17:16 |
| agi | _berto_: more reboots than uptime | 17:16 |
| _berto_ | wow | 17:16 |
| _berto_ | :? | 17:16 |
| agi | lovely device, waiting for a new one | 17:16 |
| agi | hope the next one works, reading #6334 scares the hell out of me | 17:17 |
| _berto_ | I didn't know that one existed | 17:17 |
| _berto_ | I heard about problems with the microphone, though | 17:17 |
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| * fnordianslip wonders if Location Test GUI could show status of almanac data recieved, etc | 17:18 | |
| sejo | I only had issues when installing fm radio | 17:18 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: thanks for the pointer to the tools repo - I'm going to enjoy having less and screen around :) | 17:18 |
| lardman | I think I'll have to write a daemon that sends location info to the Google server rather than having the browser open all the time | 17:18 |
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| zaheerm | lardman, that'd be better definitely | 17:18 |
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| lardman | I need to do some tcp/ip sniffing and work out the format | 17:18 |
| agi | _berto_: never heard of this problem until I received my device. Now it seems to be a big problem in a lot of devices. Hopefully just a bad batch... | 17:19 |
| _berto_ | I hope so | 17:20 |
| zaheerm | lardman, no public api for sending the location data to latitude? | 17:20 |
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| wjt | Jaffa: hey, it'd be really nice if i could type to search the facebook contacts when manually pairing up unmatched people | 17:22 |
| frals | agreed with wjt, other than that much love for creating hermes :D | 17:26 |
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| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: ok, will have to try location-test-gui when I'm next outdoors. if that works, what does it mean with regard to my gps issues? (I think maemo-geolocation wasn't able to get a fix either - haven't yet tried with a fix already established by ecoach) | 17:27 |
| lardman | zaheerm: nope | 17:27 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: well it will help pinpoint issues | 17:28 |
| lardman | Hydroxide: they all use the same backend | 17:28 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Once again: where do I get lcoation-test-gui? It does not appear in Extras-devel for me | 17:28 |
| lardman | RST38h: grab it manually from the extras repo | 17:28 |
| RST38h | aha | 17:28 |
| lardman | non-free | 17:28 |
| fnordianslip | i've noticed that LTG can show a lock and Ovi Maps can shows a position, then the red dot just disappears from Ovi maps, yet LTG still shows a lock. must be a different issue. | 17:28 |
| Stskeeps | don't you mean SDK tools repo, lardman? | 17:28 |
| lardman | nope | 17:28 |
| Hydroxide | lardman: I had to add the tools repository and then find it in the second Other repository | 17:28 |
| Hydroxide | or maybe System | 17:29 |
| zaheerm | fnordianslip, that is an ovi maps bug i believe | 17:29 |
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| lardman | I just downloaded it in a browser from extras | 17:29 |
| fnordianslip | zaheerm: tnx | 17:29 |
| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Don't look too much at Ovi Maps. It doesn't seem to use liblocation correctly it seems. | 17:29 |
| lardman | or did I | 17:29 |
| fnordianslip | k | 17:29 |
| Hydroxide | maemo-mapper was able to track my bus ride once I had a fix | 17:29 |
| X-Fade | Nor do anything else that makes sense ;) | 17:29 |
| Hydroxide | so it's clearly using liblocation at least semi-correctly :) | 17:29 |
| Hydroxide | I know MM != OM though | 17:30 |
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| lardman | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/non-free/l/location-test-gui/ | 17:30 |
| lardman | whatever repo that is | 17:30 |
| RST38h | hmmmm | 17:30 |
| X-Fade | Tha is SDK | 17:30 |
| sejo | hmm using the jabber in accounts makes my ejabberd flip :p | 17:30 |
| Hydroxide | lardman: that is just the pool used by all the maemo.org repos | 17:30 |
| sejo | probably empathy issue | 17:30 |
| sejo | still annoying | 17:31 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: ah, ok | 17:31 |
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| jebba | is erlang still building? | 17:31 |
| fnordianslip | ah. LTG is non-free, that's why i just failed to find the source | 17:32 |
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| X-Fade | jebba: looks like it: inet_gethost inet_gethost 4 | 17:33 |
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| RST38h | Location Test GUI works | 17:34 |
| RST38h | gotta try it without network though | 17:34 |
| fnordianslip | I'm just trying LTG in ofline mode now | 17:34 |
| RST38h | nice little app, /me loves it =) | 17:34 |
| fnordianslip | source please | 17:34 |
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| fnordianslip | hmm. if almanac data is sent every 12.5 mins, then in worst (viable) case, you might have to wait just less than 25 mins to receive it | 17:37 |
| fnordianslip | assuming it tales 12.5 minutes to send it | 17:37 |
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| RST38h | fnordianslip: I assume 3 hours can still be considered as "it does not work" though? | 17:38 |
| Ceron^ | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 <- lol | 17:38 |
| povbot | Bug 5337: Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 17:38 |
| Ceron^ | its true the gps really is crap | 17:38 |
| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Unless you have a slight interruption in reception while the almanac stream comes down. | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | Ceron^: it is deeper than that though | 17:39 |
| Ceron^ | Stskeeps: deeper? | 17:39 |
| TomaszD | jesus christ, I guy just came in to ask to sign a petition not to build a base station in the vicinity | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | base station? hell yes! | 17:39 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: This makes me wonder: is there ANY device on the market where TI5500 chip (or whatever it is in N900) works well? | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | faster 3g? ;p | 17:39 |
| Flandry | Ceron^: GPS hardware is ok, just not the software | 17:39 |
| fnordianslip | that's why i wondered about accumulating almanac data, containing residual errors, and trying to average them out | 17:39 |
| Ceron^ | Flandry: you sure? | 17:39 |
| TomaszD | I was the only one who signed who agrees with the build | 17:40 |
| Ceron^ | Flandry: what chipset is n900 useing for gps? | 17:40 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: So have you signed? ;) | 17:40 |
| fnordianslip | not sure if that is feasible though | 17:40 |
| Ceron^ | sirf3? | 17:40 |
| Flandry | well in theory anyway :D | 17:40 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: I would also write "And kill all the whales please" =) | 17:40 |
| TomaszD | RST38h, you had a choice Yes, build or No, don't build, I was the only one who signed up as Yes, build | 17:40 |
| TomaszD | fucking crazy backwoods people | 17:40 |
| Flandry | Don't think it's a sirf | 17:40 |
| RST38h | Ceron: N900 uses TI's NaviLink | 17:40 |
| RST38h | Ceron: Probably a 5500 | 17:41 |
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| RST38h | TomsazD: Could you at least put "10" in the "yes" field? =) | 17:41 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i wonder if it caches almanac data as well | 17:41 |
| Flandry | the point is with AGPS it can get a fix fast | 17:41 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: cos if it does a completely cold fix every time, that's obviously not good | 17:41 |
| Flandry | suggests to me there are problems with implementation/drivers | 17:41 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: At least the Exchange connector guy had enough care for his work to come to t.m.o and ask for feedback | 17:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, it feels good to drive yourself again. ;) | 17:42 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: One can only wish the GPS guy would do the same... | 17:42 |
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| Ceron^ | anyone got a review on Texas Instruments Navilink 5500 gps | 17:42 |
| Ceron^ | im intrested to know its performance :p | 17:42 |
| * RST38h suspects N900 uses NL5350 rather than NL5500, right or wrong? | 17:42 | |
| Ceron^ | and accuaricy :p | 17:43 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: exchange guy was russian, he's able to deal with people with pitchforks standing at his doorstep | 17:43 |
| RST38h | Anyone has a hires image of a gutted N900? =) | 17:43 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Sadly, yes | 17:43 |
| TomaszD | what the hell is with those people commenting on the gps bug as if this was some kind of a forum | 17:43 |
| Ceron^ | yeh wierd ppl | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i'm not sure this goes for the GPS guy | 17:43 |
| wjt | what's Sync meant to do on n900wallpapers? | 17:43 |
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| Ceron^ | they should find a solution not flame it | 17:43 |
| Flandry | Ceron^: there's a discussion of N900 GPS in the preview on symbian world that is continued in the forum thread | 17:43 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: (sadly in the sense that I wish everyone would be able to do that) | 17:43 |
| TomaszD | move the discussion to tmo, I'm getting spammed with useless bugzilla comments | 17:44 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: Quim marked it as worksforme, with a really screwy explanation | 17:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | TomaszD, people who don't get Bugzilla. | 17:44 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: LOTS of people are watching this bug and they are royally pissed off | 17:44 |
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| RST38h | TomaszD: So, it probably felt like the last drop to them, and many cracked | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: well, definition of 'WORKS' is interesting. it seems like fixes are indeed possible but take ages | 17:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, still doesn't excuse the spam. | 17:45 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38hdunno - I'm fairly sure it's no tthe 5500 - as that has more radios in - and they duplicate the existing FM and bluetooth | 17:45 |
| Hydroxide | for people who aren't used to bugtracking systems, I can understand the confusion. (and the anger.) | 17:45 |
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| RST38h | General: I would not call it "spam", just a wrong place fo rcomments like these | 17:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: nl5350 may be it I suppose | 17:45 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: 5350 then. N810 had 5300. | 17:46 |
| Flandry | Klapper does a bit of bugzilla spam of his own from time to time | 17:46 |
| RST38h | This is not the confusion | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: so make a new bug "GPS fix seems to take incredibly long time without a network connection" | 17:46 |
| RST38h | Anger mostly, judging from comments | 17:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, does it contribute anything useful to the bug? No. Spam. | 17:46 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: but - why are we sure it's a TI part? | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: which is the main issue in this one | 17:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Flandry, in the form of whiny comments? :) | 17:46 |
| RST38h | Flandry: You meanm, he offers penis extensions? What is the bug #? =) | 17:46 |
| Flandry | lol no not extenze ads | 17:46 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Seen a reference to NaviLink | 17:46 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: where? | 17:47 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: no longer remember, sorry | 17:47 |
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| pupnik_ | Performing your work with joy leads to better results. - Aristotle | 17:47 |
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| fnordianslip | Stskeeps: When it doesn't work, it doesn't work (for some definition of) forever, not for a known finite time | 17:48 |
| *** GeneralAntilles sets mode: -o GeneralAntilles | 17:48 | |
| RST38h | fnordianslip: If it does not work until Nokia replaces it with a different kidn of a chip, is this considered a finite time? | 17:48 |
| Flandry | er whatchadoin GeneralAntilles | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | fnordianslip: well, realistically we should have a fix within 12.5 mins. if it's more, quality of gps signal is bad | 17:48 |
| * RST38h laughes demonically | 17:48 | |
| Stskeeps | fnordianslip: ok, 25 | 17:48 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSqldvt9RK8 wacky. navilink 6 | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Flandry, killing a ban I set on a spammer from 34,000 feet Monday. | 17:49 |
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| RST38h | wacky | 17:50 |
| Flandry | lol they need a new bugzilla status "WORKSFORME-ATT=HARMATTAN" | 17:50 |
| RST38h | aerobanhammer | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, indeed. | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, BANNED FROM SPACE! | 17:50 |
| X-Fade | It seems to me that the GPS data is just not used correctly. | 17:50 |
| Flandry | satellite-based defense? | 17:50 |
| RST38h | General: There is a relatively well known story about someone calling HP service center about a printer | 17:51 |
| RST38h | General: With the service guy asking the caller to bring the printer for service | 17:51 |
| toggles_w | anyone know what the chrage time on these things is from flat? | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: well, ovi maps giving up after a little while doesn't help impression | 17:51 |
| X-Fade | The location test sometimes knows my location with reasonable < 1km accuracy with 0/12 sats. | 17:51 |
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| Stskeeps | X-Fade: with cell-id probably | 17:51 |
| X-Fade | That should be quite ok to start with. | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: that requires a network though | 17:52 |
| fnordianslip | X-Fade: in which mode? try GNSS | 17:52 |
| RST38h | General: And the caller answering that he is on the space station, so it is kinda problematic, but if the HP guy tells him what joint to solder... | 17:52 |
| AndrewBlack | where does .desktop file for loopable backgrounds go? | 17:52 |
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| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Ok. Let me try that. | 17:52 |
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| Flandry | why would a guy from the space station go on an ordinary support line | 17:53 |
| SpeedEvil | http://community.ti.com/blogs/mobilemomentum/archive/2009/08/28/newest-omap-3-processor-based-device-sets-even-higher-standards-in-mid-market.aspx | 17:54 |
| Flandry | he should just use the replicator :P | 17:54 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I would have expected 'and navilink 5 for ...' in there | 17:54 |
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| lardman | I can't believe it's a navilink 6 | 17:55 |
| X-Fade | It looks like the erlang build really got stuck. | 17:55 |
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| Stskeeps | lardman: i haven't found any proof what chip it is either | 17:56 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: I really doubt that | 17:56 |
| X-Fade | My guess is that it hangs on ip tests.. | 17:56 |
| lardman | would duplicate 2 extra chips, seems a bit silly really | 17:56 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: I can't see any reports from any sources other than guesswork that it's even a navilink | 17:56 |
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| lardman | we need to find the gspdriver equiv and run strings on it, that's how I worked out the N810 had the 5300 | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: there's none, as far as i can tell | 17:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wish I could tell what was going on with my DDP order(s). | 17:57 |
| lardman | how do things talk to it? through a dev entry? | 17:57 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: I haven't found that - I need to look properly | 17:57 |
| RST38h | General: Well I have just got a DHL tracking # on it | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: i think it spits out NMEA | 17:57 |
| RST38h | General: So, things do get done. Eventually. | 17:57 |
| lardman | I've not looked too hard either, but if it doesn't have ARM-side processing it's not a 5300 | 17:57 |
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| fnordianslip | hmm. 35 minutes with offline n900 and LTG in user mode and | 17:59 |
| fnordianslip | no lock | 17:59 |
| lardman | can someone with a toolchain in front of them run strings on liblocation? | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | fnordianslip: outside? :P | 17:59 |
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| lardman | fnordianslip: using the test app? | 17:59 |
| fnordianslip | ish | 17:59 |
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| fnordianslip | yep LTG | 17:59 |
| lardman | ah ok | 18:00 |
| lardman | how many sats? | 18:00 |
| fnordianslip | 0/10 | 18:00 |
| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Got a fix in about 5 mins. | 18:00 |
| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Inside with concrete root and window looking West. | 18:00 |
| fnordianslip | was the device offline or just GNSS mode selecetd? | 18:01 |
| X-Fade | fnordianslip: Just GNSS selected. | 18:01 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: you're assuming it's not doing the processing in the phone hardware, which is possible | 18:01 |
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| lardman | yes indeed | 18:01 |
| fnordianslip | so it was online. ok | 18:01 |
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| X-Fade | fnordianslip: yes, it was on wifi | 18:01 |
| fnordianslip | X-Fade: ok. i have my device offline and just trying gnss method | 18:01 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: I find mention that the 5350 is used in quite a lot of other nokia devices - n95/97 | 18:02 |
| lardman | would be interesting to know how much feeback the chipset gives about almanac/ephemeris downloads | 18:02 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: so it's not completely implausible | 18:02 |
| * lardman looks up that chips | 18:02 | |
| lardman | -s | 18:03 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: err - that was meant to be the navilink 5 number. I may have gotten it wrong | 18:03 |
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| * SpeedEvil sighs and wants a broken n900. | 18:05 | |
| SpeedEvil | (in addition to my non-broken one) | 18:05 |
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| fnordianslip | SpeedEvil: buy another, you might get lucky | 18:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: My lounge is currently at 8.5C, for economy reasons. | 18:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Actually - I lie. 9C. | 18:07 |
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| fnordianslip | SpeedEvil: hm. it was a joke, but you have my sympathy. | 18:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | yeah, I know. | 18:07 |
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| guerby | zaheerm, indeed :) http://blogs.gnome.org/uraeus/2009/12/09/n900-arrival/ | 18:08 |
| SpeedEvil | It's just frustrating to know that 5 min with a screwdriver can answer this. | 18:08 |
| fnordianslip | 10 secs with a hammer | 18:08 |
| guerby | LinuxCode, play.com N900 "Pre-order. | Due for release on 31/12/2009" | 18:08 |
| lardman | SpeedEvil: doesn't really matter atm anyway | 18:08 |
| zaheerm | guerby, so xmas tree or being used? | 18:09 |
| lardman | SpeedEvil: as we don't have the source that would control it anyway | 18:09 |
| guerby | zaheerm, no idea :) | 18:09 |
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| SpeedEvil | lardman: if the kernel can be rebuilt, and it works, we do. | 18:10 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: or rather - we have the source of the intermediate level which we can strace. | 18:11 |
| Jaffa | wjt: frals: patches welcome - turns out that find-as-you-type isn't as easy as it should be (GtkTreeView allows it, but Hildon's broken it) | 18:11 |
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| lardman | SpeedEvil: depends if it's in the cell phone bit though | 18:11 |
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| ali1234 | what package is strings usually in? | 18:11 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: true | 18:12 |
| lardman | ali1234: in the toolchain I think? | 18:12 |
| ali1234 | well yeah but i dont want to install the whole toolchain on to the phone | 18:12 |
| lardman | wow got a lock from scratch in <1m | 18:12 |
| lardman | no ephemerides according to the test app, may still have had the alamanac | 18:13 |
| lardman | and no connections | 18:13 |
| lardman | other than the cell country | 18:13 |
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| _berto_ | Jaffa: find-as-you-type has been implemented recently http://maemo.gitorious.org/hildon/hildon/commit/d6768a7070a8588425d806ad9f3e5aadb863c376 | 18:14 |
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| lardman | ok, then disconnect and it reconnected within 10s | 18:14 |
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| Stskeeps | ok, so it does cache almanac at least | 18:15 |
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| ali1234 | strings of liblocation from sdk armel target: http://pastebin.com/f2919db86 | 18:15 |
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| fnordianslip | lardman: is your n900 offline? | 18:16 |
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| lardman | it was, yes | 18:17 |
| fnordianslip | how did it get the cell country? | 18:17 |
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| lardman | cell was online, wifi off, data off | 18:18 |
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| Stskeeps | fnordianslip: those gconfs look interesting | 18:18 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: maybe - that depends. For example, it may keep a trickle of power going to the GPS to maintain clocks and ephemeris. | 18:18 |
| lardman | thanks ali1234 | 18:18 |
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| fnordianslip | lardman: I put mine in Offline state, i.e. airplane mode | 18:19 |
| lardman | ok, just done that, lock in 5s | 18:19 |
| fnordianslip | curiouser | 18:19 |
| RST38h | make it offline, wait for 3 hours then try | 18:20 |
| lardman | so it seems something is cached | 18:20 |
| lardman | yeah | 18:20 |
| RST38h | at least something yes\ | 18:20 |
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| Khertan | Hi ! | 18:22 |
| lbt_ | GPS bug is noisy :) | 18:24 |
| cehteh | good :) | 18:24 |
| cehteh | there should be a vote "i dont want a n900 with buggy GPS" .. just to show nokia how much sales they loose | 18:25 |
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| lardman | works for me | 18:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | cehteh, Bugzilla isn't the place for it. :) | 18:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | cehteh, if you want to spam, hit Talk. | 18:26 |
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| lardman | what's the bug? | 18:26 |
| lardman | # | 18:26 |
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| cehteh | lardman: without data connection it doesnt get a fix | 18:26 |
| lardman | cehteh: does for me | 18:26 |
| pupnik_ | i agree with cehteh | 18:26 |
| lardman | though with cached almanac probably | 18:27 |
| cehteh | lardman: yes likely | 18:27 |
| pupnik_ | nokia N900 gps is broken and unusuable due to software, not hardware. and the bug is an easy easy easy fix | 18:27 |
| lardman | how so? | 18:27 |
| lardman | the easy fix? | 18:27 |
| cehteh | but it expires the alamanc too early | 18:27 |
| pupnik_ | give me access to the gps when i leave my wlan, lardman | 18:27 |
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| lardman | pupnik_: I just tested it and it works | 18:27 |
| cehteh | some tell the GPS just shuts down too early while acquireing a fix | 18:27 |
| pupnik_ | i just tested it and it doesn't work | 18:28 |
| lardman | cehteh: well that might be true | 18:28 |
| lardman | but that's a problem with the location stuff not the gps then | 18:28 |
| pupnik_ | normally i would trust lardman over my own eyes, but not this time | 18:28 |
| cehteh | its a crappy gps chip .. ok .. but the software makes it much worse | 18:28 |
| lardman | using the test app it seems to work ok with no connectivity but with a recent almanac | 18:28 |
| cehteh | well i want to get a fix without data connection in less than 10minutes at least .. anywhere on this planet | 18:29 |
| cehteh | if it can not do that this would be a showstopper | 18:29 |
| Stskeeps | cehteh: then you need to be in a place where the receiption is OK | 18:29 |
| lardman | that is not necessarily possible due to the spec of the gps signal | 18:29 |
| Stskeeps | cehteh: otherwise you need to cache almanac | 18:30 |
| cehteh | ok lets say on 'average conditions' ... good view to the sky, 3-4 sattelites visible | 18:30 |
| lardman | is it worth adding something to that bug, or is the SNR too low now? | 18:31 |
| cehteh | that should be given most of the time unless you are in a canyon, under heavy trees or in a city with high buildings | 18:31 |
| cehteh | i dont know i dont have a device yet, just seeing many people complaining | 18:31 |
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| cehteh | when my device arrives that will be the first thing i test .. else i send it back | 18:32 |
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| cehteh | so nokia, you have some days or perhaps weeks to fix it, heared me? :) | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | cehteh: your loss | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 18:32 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lol . . . | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | and IRC is always the best place to bitch | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Deal breaker! | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | cehteh, call up Nokia Care. | 18:32 |
| fnordianslip | lost with it, lost without it :) | 18:32 |
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| GeneralAntilles | cehteh, bitching here just irritates people who can't help you. :) | 18:33 |
| cehteh | hehe .. nah i think thats political .. xorAxAx bitched too .. and the more people bitch about it the more serious it will taken | 18:33 |
| cehteh | some nokia officals are here or? :) | 18:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | cehteh, well, consider this warning #1. | 18:34 |
| lardman | how long do ephemerides remain valid? | 18:34 |
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| cehteh | the gps specs/firmware isnt free .. so nothing know about or? | 18:34 |
| lardman | I know everything about it | 18:34 |
| VDVsx | spot the N900 in stores today :) | 18:34 |
| VDVsx | well only only store has it :P | 18:35 |
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| SpeedEvil | cehteh: the GPS specification is freely available - that is of the signals | 18:35 |
| SpeedEvil | cehteh: http://www.colorado.edu/geography/gcraft/notes/gps/gps.html | 18:35 |
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| cehteh | SpeedEvil: i meant for the chip in the n900 not GPS signals in general | 18:35 |
| lardman | ah, 2hrs for the ephemeris to get stale probably | 18:36 |
| _berto_ | a galician carrier is already selling the n900 subsidized (starting from 180 eur) | 18:36 |
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| lardman | so we need to check for cached almanac + stale ephemeris; stale almanac + stale ephemeris | 18:36 |
| SpeedEvil | cehteh: ah | 18:36 |
| zaheerm | _berto_, how much a month and how long is contract? | 18:37 |
| pekuja | do people actually look at subsidies and think they're getting a phone for a third of the price? | 18:37 |
| cehteh | cant one do some anticipatory calculations to keep the almanac warm? instead just throw it away? | 18:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | pekuja, yes. Next question. | 18:37 |
| lardman | pekuja: you need a contract anyway | 18:37 |
| pekuja | heh | 18:37 |
| lardman | pekuja: so factor in the price, etc | 18:37 |
| cehteh | at worst it might drift and be inaccurate but thats still better than no alamac at all | 18:37 |
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| xorAxAx | what do you think about an application which syncs evolution and the addressbook of the n900 on a file level? | 18:37 |
| xorAxAx | i am thinking about implementing that | 18:37 |
| pekuja | lardman: you do, but you can get cheaper contracts | 18:37 |
| _berto_ | zaheerm: depends on the type of contract, if you want it for 180 eur it's 60 eur/month | 18:37 |
| cehteh | xorAxAx: rsync? :) | 18:38 |
| _berto_ | which is very expensive imho | 18:38 |
| zaheerm | _berto_, ouch | 18:38 |
| pekuja | lardman: usually the subsidised contract forces you to get something very expensive | 18:38 |
| xorAxAx | cehteh: not really | 18:38 |
| pekuja | _berto_: hah, that's a pretty bum deal | 18:38 |
| cehteh | xorAxAx: you dont have the device yet? | 18:38 |
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| _berto_ | with a 30 eur/month contract you can get it for 300 eur | 18:38 |
| xorAxAx | cehteh: no, why? | 18:38 |
| cehteh | just curious | 18:38 |
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| xorAxAx | cehteh: but i just looked at the particular file | 18:38 |
| xorAxAx | its a bdb with vcards in it | 18:38 |
| zaheerm | _berto_, not really a good deal :( | 18:39 |
| _berto_ | zaheerm: no :( | 18:39 |
| xorAxAx | does anybody of you need a syncing solution? | 18:39 |
| zaheerm | _berto_, in UK it is free on contract for < 60 euro/month | 18:39 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, syncing of what? | 18:39 |
| xorAxAx | hmm, or i write a multisync plugin | 18:39 |
| xorAxAx | zaheerm: contacts | 18:39 |
| _berto_ | yes, it should be free if you pay that much every month | 18:39 |
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| pekuja | my contract is about 24e/month for two years with no money up front ("free" phone) | 18:40 |
| xorAxAx | wouldnt that be cool - a multisync plugin for osso-abook? | 18:40 |
| _berto_ | they should even send you a box of chocolates by christmas | 18:40 |
| pekuja | but that doesn't really include anything | 18:40 |
| pekuja | I pay separately for mobile internet, calls, etc. | 18:40 |
| Micha_ | pekuja: ouch | 18:40 |
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| pekuja | Micha_: ouch? I don't think it's bad at all | 18:40 |
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| Micha_ | No internet/calls included in that? So you've effectively paid 576e for the phone.. | 18:41 |
| pekuja | Micha_: yeah. that's how much the phone costs | 18:41 |
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| pekuja | Micha_: I doubt you can get it much cheaper in Europe | 18:42 |
| xorAxAx | hmm, or i try the syncml plugin | 18:42 |
| Micha_ | Why lock yourself into a contract though? | 18:42 |
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| pekuja | Micha_: when you tally the contracts | 18:42 |
| pekuja | Micha_: so that I get to pay the phone in two years instead of all at once | 18:42 |
| zaheerm | it's a loan | 18:42 |
| pekuja | basically | 18:42 |
| * Micha_ paid 82GBP, plus 40GBPpcm for 12 month, including unlimited internet, text, and 300min of calls per month | 18:42 | |
| xorAxAx | pekuja: the german providers offer the n900 for 497 EUR | 18:42 |
| pekuja | xorAxAx: ok, that's pretty good | 18:42 |
| xorAxAx | s/providers/dealers7 | 18:43 |
| xorAxAx | s,7,/, | 18:43 |
| pekuja | anyways, on top of that, I'm paying 10e/month for 384kbps 3G internet | 18:43 |
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| cehteh | well besides they can not ship because they dont have the device :) | 18:43 |
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| pekuja | and around 7 cents a minute for calls and 7 cents a piece for SMS's | 18:43 |
| cehteh | lets see if i get mine before chrismas | 18:43 |
| Micha_ | Given my expired contract was 22GBP pcm, I'm effectively paying 18GBP pcm *12 + 82 GBP for the phone ~== 300GBP for the phone | 18:43 |
| pekuja | cehteh: I'm hoping for that too | 18:43 |
| pekuja | Micha_: what's pcm? | 18:44 |
| cehteh | where did you order? | 18:44 |
| cehteh | eh .. not german .. | 18:44 |
| Micha_ | pcm = Per Calendar Month | 18:44 |
| pekuja | cehteh: my operator | 18:44 |
| pekuja | Micha_: I see | 18:44 |
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| Eightace | Whats the best sim only contract in theU | 18:44 |
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| pekuja | one of the contracts that's available here now is around 60 euros a month for all phone calls, SMS's and 3G internet use you want | 18:44 |
| * lardman heads home | 18:45 | |
| Eightace | Uk I mean | 18:45 |
| FIQ | 60 euros | 18:45 |
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| pekuja | which is pretty sweet, but I don't need that much so I opted for a cheaper plan | 18:45 |
| FIQ | O_o | 18:45 |
| pekuja | FIQ: including the phone | 18:45 |
| FIQ | that's much | 18:45 |
| FIQ | oh | 18:45 |
| pekuja | FIQ: for unlimited use though | 18:45 |
| pekuja | I gotta go -> | 18:45 |
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| VDVsx | _berto_, wow, here is just 600 € :P | 18:46 |
| * Micha_ doesn't make a lot of phonecalls. The 'standard' offer here at the Nokia store is free phone @ 35GPB pcm for 2 years. | 18:46 | |
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| * FIQ likes the three offer in sweden and is paying around 150kr/month, unlimited phone-calling, sms (in three, 0.69kr/min and 0.69kr/sms in other networks, 6Mbit/s data plan, max 5GB use). 1 kr ~= 8 euro | 18:48 | |
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| rrr__ | FIQ, mind sharing a link for that? | 18:50 |
| SpeedEvil | eightlace: you mean if you have the phone? t-mobile-UK pay-as-you go. add an internet booster for 6 months - 20 quid qwith a 1G/mo fair usage. so 25 quid gets you 6.50 credit and free net. | 18:51 |
| FIQ | to three or the abonnemang/offer's i use? | 18:51 |
| rrr__ | yeah | 18:51 |
| FIQ | k | 18:51 |
| FIQ | brb google | 18:51 |
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| zgold | ali1234: ping | 18:56 |
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| * fnordianslip now thinks there is something to the cache expiry theory for the N900s gps issue. after failing to get a lock with LTG in offline/UserSelected and offline/GNSS mode (for 30 mins each), i tried online/AGNSS to get a lock, then went back to offline/AGNSS and offline/GNSS, and got a lock in both modes within 2-3 mins. | 18:57 | |
| fnordianslip | all in same location, near the window | 18:57 |
| FIQ | tre.se/templates/Sporg3_03.aspx?id=28732 - the main one | 18:58 |
| FIQ | About the dataplan (name = 3surf plus), seems like i cannot find it on the desktop site for same price (seems like it's for 199kr/month at the desktop site), just on the phone | 18:58 |
| FIQ | @ rrr__ | 18:58 |
| * timeless @party | 18:59 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Only Maemo users. . . . | 19:01 |
| fnordianslip | all party goers sitting in corner with their n900s ? | 19:01 |
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| FIQ | afk | 19:02 |
| * w00t parties with his n900 | 19:02 | |
| SpeedEvil | like it's 1999? | 19:02 |
| w00t | slightly more geekily than that | 19:03 |
| w00t | i don't lug around a crt with me after all | 19:03 |
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| Myrtti | urp | 19:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | 'lo, Myrtti. | 19:05 |
| Stskeeps | "N900: so you don't have to lug a laptop around with you" | 19:05 |
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| Myrtti | GeneralAntilles: oink oink | 19:09 |
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| * Khertan think that splitting maemo irc channel was a bad idea | 19:11 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Khertan, I think it'll be useful so long as people are careful about where they move stuff. | 19:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | i.e., stick to #maemo until the noise gets too high. | 19:12 |
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| Khertan | hum... at least the most important things to do first should be splitting talk.maemo.org ... in talk.m.o and whinning.m.o | 19:12 |
| Khertan | :) | 19:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | 'lo, Kathy. | 19:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Khertan, yeah, and I'm nominating you to moderate whining.m.o. :P | 19:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Khertan, you suck for not being at BCN, by the way. ;) | 19:13 |
| plr_ | does someone know whether nokia is updating default pdf reader or anyone else making their own? as of right now, it is sort of useless | 19:14 |
| Khertan | GeneralAntilles: i wasn't invited :) | 19:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, yes, could be expensive then. | 19:15 |
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| Khertan | GeneralAntilles: nominate me as a moderator is always the worst things to do ... i most of the time doesn't take the time to think twice before swording :) | 19:15 |
| plr_ | Khertan: what other maemo channels exist? | 19:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Khertan, hehehe, that was the point. :D | 19:16 |
| Khertan | GeneralAntilles: this is mainly because i got already some meeting elsewhere | 19:16 |
| woglinde | hi Khertan | 19:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, too bad. | 19:16 |
| Khertan | plr_: #maemo-devel | 19:16 |
| Stskeeps | plr_: it's open source, feel free to improve it | 19:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | By the way, any North American folks have an opinion about an NA Long Weekend in either the US or Canada? | 19:16 |
| Khertan | hi woglinde | 19:17 |
| RevdKathy | 'Lo GA. You changed your name | 19:17 |
| plr_ | Stskeeps: I wish I had the skills.. but good to know it's open | 19:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, GAN900 is just for the portable devices. | 19:18 |
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| RevdKathy | Ahh right. If you're talking mods, why did they nuke the naughty thrad? | 19:18 |
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| melmoth | hey RevdKathy is here. | 19:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, I tend to be a bit more curt on limited keyboards so it helps for people to know when I'm on them. ;) | 19:18 |
| RevdKathy | Ahh right | 19:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, no idea, was just proposing Khertan to moderate whining.maemo.org. ;) | 19:19 |
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| RevdKathy | Don't blame you | 19:19 |
| RevdKathy | How about an IRC channel: #maemo-whining? | 19:19 |
| woglinde | hihi | 19:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd just register it with a bot and have it autokick anybody who joined. | 19:19 |
| woglinde | #n900-whining | 19:19 |
| RevdKathy | I listen more than I talk usually - though maemo whining is one of my specialist subjects | 19:19 |
| Khertan | GeneralAntilles: nice idea | 19:20 |
| RevdKathy | Nah - get God and Megacrazy to mod it | 19:20 |
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| AndrewBlack | what font is maemo.org logo in? | 19:20 |
| Khertan | AndrewBlack: Whinning True Type ? | 19:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | AndrewBlack, I kind of assumed it was custom. | 19:21 |
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| RevdKathy | t.m.o. needs a 'whine' button. If enough people designate you a whiner your IP is blocked for a week | 19:22 |
| plr_ | :) | 19:22 |
| penguinbait | RevdKathy -- Stop Whining | 19:22 |
| RevdKathy | LOL ok ;) | 19:23 |
| plr_ | there's been plenty of whining lately, that's for sure | 19:23 |
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| lardman | re | 19:24 |
| * Stskeeps clicks the 'whine' button on penguinbait | 19:24 | |
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| lardman | whining about what? | 19:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | About lardman. | 19:25 |
| RevdKathy | whining about other people whining | 19:25 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ugh, lardman. | 19:25 |
| * lardman considers one touch ban and cleaning anyone who whines about him | 19:25 | |
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| penguinbait | I have been quiet, no whining here | 19:25 |
| mgedmin | oooh, the flames in the gps bug | 19:25 |
| penguinbait | bitchin maybe | 19:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | I want some admin wars to keep things interesting. | 19:25 |
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| lardman | I hate how the comments on applications seem to come across like commands | 19:26 |
| RevdKathy | it's the sense of entitlement annoys me | 19:26 |
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| melmoth | mgedmin: is it me or was the bug just closed ? | 19:26 |
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| lardman | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/mbarcode/0.0.7-0/ | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | quim marked it as a WORKSFORME | 19:27 |
| AndrewBlack | GeneralAntilles, I figure he used a basic font ofr part of it | 19:27 |
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| mgedmin | some people demand, nay, DEMAND! that a N900 MUST ABSOLUTELY be able to get a GPS fix from cold start in under 2 mintues | 19:27 |
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| woglinde | re wazd | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | afaiu that's physically impossible | 19:27 |
| melmoth | i just received the n900 today, did nto have time to tes the gps, but i fear it wont work for me (no 3G data plan) | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | the satellites don't transmit enough date to get a cold fix in under 12 minutes or so if you don't have a current almanac and ephemeris precached | 19:27 |
| lardman | mgedmin: not necessarily impossible, but that's then down to the abilities of the chipset | 19:28 |
| RevdKathy | I can't get a gps fix as I won't let it use the data | 19:28 |
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| melmoth | i hope it will at least as , well...good (sigh) as the n810 | 19:28 |
| RevdKathy | i use a paper map | 19:28 |
| Stskeeps | i think the problem is also with ovi maps's insane low timeout for gps | 19:28 |
| lardman | mgedmin: if your receivers are good and many, I understand that it is possible | 19:28 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: yes, I think that is part of the issue | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | "12.5 minutes are required to receive the entire almanac from a single satellite" says Wikipedia | 19:28 |
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| melmoth | ah, may be. I wonder if maemomapper is planned for fremantle. | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | melmoth, it exists already | 19:29 |
| mgedmin | I just installed it today | 19:29 |
| *** fluff|afk is now known as fluff | 19:29 | |
| lardman | mgedmin: if you have enough receivers to search for each freq you don't need the almanac | 19:29 |
| melmoth | mgedmin: extras devel ? extars testing, or svn build yourself ? | 19:29 |
| mgedmin | extras something, probably devel | 19:29 |
| melmoth | hehe | 19:29 |
| lardman | but that's not reasonable for a cheap chip | 19:29 |
| mgedmin | doesn't really look extras-final-material, e.g. diablo-styled main menu still | 19:29 |
| crashanddie | it shouldn't be | 19:30 |
| crashanddie | the problem is that IIRC, the QA process doesn't judge on quality of the UI, rather usability and stability | 19:30 |
| * mgedmin reads http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_to_first_fix | 19:31 | |
| lardman | thanks for the thumbs down for mbarcode Michael Cronenworth, really encouraging me to actually bother with users | 19:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, it's in Extras-devel. | 19:31 |
| mgedmin | maemo-mapper's usability is poor: zoom buttons lag, volume buttons control volume rather than zoom, cpu usage is kinda high when it's downloading maps, which feels kinda slow over 3g... | 19:31 |
| mgedmin | still, better than Ovi Maps ;) | 19:31 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: I don't even know we're talking about :) | 19:32 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: my usual off-topic babbling | 19:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, the fact that Maemo Mapper is available. | 19:32 |
| Stskeeps | mgedmin: i suspect it might be an unoptimized sqlite | 19:32 |
| crashanddie | hmm | 19:32 |
| mgedmin | runnin file on the map .db file told me "GDBM" once | 19:32 |
| mgedmin | places.db is sqlite, otoh | 19:33 |
| Stskeeps | old one though | 19:33 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: how are ya buddy? | 19:33 |
| mgedmin | lots of I/O == massive fail on a NIT | 19:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, great! | 19:33 |
| penguinbait | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6m1y01LXtM | 19:33 |
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| penguinbait | man thats looking sweet | 19:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Went to Cracker Barrel last night to reboot my digestive system. *g* | 19:33 |
| Stskeeps | penguinbait: plastic looks as weak as the q5 | 19:34 |
| RevdKathy | General Antilles - now I'm jealous | 19:34 |
| penguinbait | It was not final finish, but who cares | 19:34 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lol . . . "sweet" | 19:34 |
| penguinbait | dude | 19:35 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: I would like to propose a vote for maemo.org | 19:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, I vote that Nokia finances my tourism of Europe. | 19:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | What? | 19:36 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: to randomly give a community member, once per day, the right to shut up | 19:36 |
| crashanddie | as long I am used as the randomness generator | 19:37 |
| penguinbait | crashanddie, your earned it ;) | 19:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, can we put the same sort of magic on this algorithm that picks maemo.org members to highlight for the sidebar? *eg* | 19:37 |
| crashanddie | indeed | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Everybody can be lardman's day. :P | 19:37 |
| crashanddie | everybody? | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/Everybody/Every day? | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er, yeah. | 19:38 |
| crashanddie | L | 19:38 |
| Myrtti | meh | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | All of those non-native speakers I was around broke my English. ;) | 19:38 |
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| Myrtti | I wonder should I do a brainstorm about that applet thingy | 19:38 |
| Myrtti | eenie meenie miney moe | 19:38 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: brainstorm is broken -- nobody reads it unless they're hardcore about an idea or just hyper-dedicated to Maemo | 19:39 |
| * GeneralAntilles sure doesn't. | 19:39 | |
| lardman | nor does /me | 19:39 |
| crashanddie | I've read it once | 19:39 |
| Khertan | crashanddie: it was from the start | 19:39 |
| Khertan | hi crashanddie | 19:39 |
| crashanddie | about 6 months after it was launched | 19:39 |
| crashanddie | hey Khertan | 19:39 |
| RevdKathy | General Antilles. *Cough* non-native speakers??? | 19:39 |
| crashanddie | o/ lardman | 19:39 |
| lardman | I've put 2 bugs into there at Quim's behest, but no desire to read it ever again | 19:39 |
| lardman | hey crashanddie | 19:39 |
| crashanddie | RevdKathy: yes, people who don't speak an indian dialect | 19:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, yeah, what were there about 6 native ones? :P | 19:40 |
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| Myrtti | oh, ok. I'll just whine to you about my idea then. | 19:40 |
| RevdKathy | Yeah, but we were all in the docs event :p | 19:40 |
| Myrtti | would someone please make me a counter widget? | 19:40 |
| Myrtti | kthx | 19:40 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: in a pedantic way, everyone is a native speaker | 19:40 |
| Khertan | hihi | 19:40 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: maybe not a native English speaker -- but still | 19:40 |
| Khertan | true | 19:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | When the first solutions I saw on Brainstorm were either "Nokia should do it" or "Community should do it" with the vote split about 50/-50/ in favor of the former. . . . | 19:40 |
| Khertan | oh really maybe i should add a idea... community and nokia ban it for whinning and pollution :) | 19:41 |
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| crashanddie | There should be two ways to handle something | 19:42 |
| crashanddie | well, three really | 19:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, actually, more like 5 since lcuk doesn't count. *g* | 19:42 |
| Khertan | There should be 10 ways to handle something ... | 19:42 |
| crashanddie | 1/ Something doesn't work, you file a bug or 2/ enhancement request for the next platform (yes, we need a formal way to express our | 19:42 |
| crashanddie | cock | 19:42 |
| Khertan | 1/ They understand binary | 19:42 |
| Khertan | 2/ The other :) | 19:42 |
| Khertan | 2/ those which don't | 19:42 |
| RevdKathy | General Antilles - you reckon Manc isn't really 'native English'? | 19:43 |
| crashanddie | our requirements or things we'd like. -- 3/ You build it yourself. We have garage, we have a good community, just motivate someone and get cracking | 19:43 |
| zaheerm | RevdKathy, manc is what rebellious scousers speak, right? | 19:43 |
| RevdKathy | No, Manc is what Mancunians speak :p | 19:43 |
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| penguinbait | el pollo loco en la cabasa | 19:43 |
| * zaheerm thinks of rooney/owen :) | 19:43 | |
| crashanddie | look at lardman, he wanted to play with barcodes and had a pet project -- he kept working on it and now there's more and more people working on it. He didn't brainstorm it, he didn't moan about it. "If you build it they will come" | 19:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | RevdKathy, Gary said a lot of things to me Saturday morning at breakfast. I think I all I understood was "Bacon!" when the waiter set the plate in front of him. :D | 19:44 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: but lcuk isn't a native speaker :P | 19:44 |
| zaheerm | GeneralAntilles, are you american? ;) | 19:44 |
| RevdKathy | LOL. I lived in Manchester for 3 years - understood every word | 19:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, exactly my point! | 19:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | zaheerm, what, you couldn't tell? :P | 19:44 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: he speaks northern, an estranged dialect that requires many CPU-cycles to compute | 19:44 |
| RevdKathy | 'Northern' has many variant dialects | 19:45 |
| zaheerm | GeneralAntilles, i was told they toned down the accents in the full monty for americans :) | 19:45 |
| Myrtti | *sigh* I'll just go read my Snake Wrangling for kids then and dream of some day be able to code what I want. So far my attempts have mainly failed, everytime I've tried. | 19:45 |
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| * Myrtti goes to get more coffee and yarn | 19:45 | |
| crashanddie | one of the new guys on my team -- in Australia -- had a bit of an accent. At some point I interrupted him and asked "mate, are you from Skelmersdale?" -- Big silence, then he goes "Actually, I'm from Wigan, how'd you know?" | 19:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, what was the one I had a lot of trouble with recently . . . Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels maybe? | 19:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, that, and Trainspotting. ;) | 19:46 |
| zaheerm | GeneralAntilles, so i guess hey you're the non-native english speaker :) | 19:46 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: try snatch | 19:46 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: and in bruges | 19:46 |
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| zaheerm | aah i haven't watched in bruges | 19:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, saw Snatch. | 19:47 |
| toggles_w | damn.. ext3 not supported on uSd in n900? | 19:47 |
| RevdKathy | You can't tell a Skem accent from Wigan??? | 19:47 |
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| clmntch | hrm | 19:47 |
| melmoth | i loved snatch. Anything to declare ? YES dont go to england ! | 19:47 |
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| lardman | RevdKathy, GeneralAntilles: no Manc is definitely not English | 19:47 |
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| lardman | where is qwery when I need him? | 19:47 |
| lardman | and where's lcuk when I want to give him some abuse? ;) | 19:48 |
| RevdKathy | Manc is nearly as pure British as Black country | 19:48 |
| lardman | indeed, almost as British as say, German | 19:48 |
| lardman | ;) | 19:48 |
| lardman | except I understand German better | 19:48 |
| lardman | RevdKathy: Are you another Northerner? :) | 19:49 |
| RevdKathy | No, but I have lived all over the country | 19:49 |
| lardman | ah, ok | 19:49 |
| lardman | multi-lingual then | 19:49 |
| RevdKathy | lardman, I'm from the deep south... west | 19:49 |
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| lardman | ah, I live in Bath | 19:50 |
| RevdKathy | ooh! That may make you the nearest known maemo user to me. Fargus visite Exeter occasionally | 19:50 |
| lardman | what's up with that Maemo.org member map anyway, is that happening? | 19:51 |
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| penguinbait | http://www.rosswalker.co.uk/movie_sounds/sounds_files_20081223_3107713/kindergarten_cop/stop_whining_x.wav | 19:51 |
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| lardman | :) | 19:51 |
| RevdKathy | There were two opinions on the member map. Qgil wants it for event planning. The paranoid amon us are afraid they'll get stalked | 19:52 |
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| lardman | well, people can work out where you live if they want to stalk you | 19:52 |
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| markus_ | hy everybody | 19:52 |
| Markus23 | Does upgrading maemo works trough dist-upgrade or is flashing necessary? | 19:52 |
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| Markus23 | markus_: hi :-) | 19:52 |
| Myrtti | lardman: why make it easier? | 19:52 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Markus23, well, dist-upgrade can work depending on the repositories you have installed | 19:52 |
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| GeneralAntilles | but it can also throw you into a reboot loop if you have bad ones. | 19:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, your binary selection there isn't appropriate. | 19:53 |
| lardman | RevdKathy: you've got a proper Sky address, an IP would make life easier | 19:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Upgrades are done via a metapackage in the application manager. | 19:53 |
| RevdKathy | Have I? I never noticed | 19:53 |
| RevdKathy | you try explaining anything like thsat to sly support :p | 19:53 |
| lardman | well your IP is 90.206.3.200 | 19:54 |
| RevdKathy | Sky support only know how to tell you how to reboot the moem. They don't know what an IP address is :p | 19:54 |
| lardman | so I guess one of those IP to locations things could work that out, etc., etc | 19:54 |
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| lardman | RevdKathy: yeah tech support for Sky is pretty crap :) | 19:54 |
| zaheerm | yah the geoip databases are reasonably good | 19:55 |
| Myrtti | lardman: or firefox location thingamajing. or fire eagle backend. or something. | 19:55 |
| lardman | and for everything for that matter - TalkTalk no less crap | 19:55 |
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| lardman | Myrtti: exactly | 19:55 |
| RevdKathy | whois isn't much help - it suggests Amsterdam | 19:55 |
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| RevdKathy | which is... less than acurate | 19:55 |
| lardman | though it you try to reverse geo me, I appear to be in Brum | 19:55 |
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| zaheerm | RevdKathy, same continent arguably ;) | 19:56 |
| lardman | Birmingham for the non-British | 19:56 |
| RevdKathy | wrong side of water... Though I wonder if I'm nearer Amsterdam than Brum | 19:56 |
| Myrtti | I'm recognized to be in the correct town atleast. | 19:57 |
| Jaffa | lardman: BTW, Firefox 3.5, Google Latitude and the iPhone URL puts me pretty exactly at both home and work using wifi triangulation on both Windows & Linux :) | 19:57 |
| lardman | Myrtti: letting information slip ;) | 19:57 |
| * microlith jabs Newegg with a sharp stick | 19:57 | |
| lardman | Jaffa: wb | 19:57 |
| RevdKathy | Ouch! maxmind is pretty accurate! | 19:57 |
| lardman | Jaffa: how's Latitude working on-device for you? | 19:57 |
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| Myrtti | lardman: and you find out what my ip is, then... | 19:57 |
| zaheerm | RevdKathy, yah we use max,mind at work for geoip blocking streams | 19:57 |
| * RevdKathy starts locking the doors and windows in case of stalkers | 19:57 | |
| lardman | Myrtti: I'm not the stalking kind ;) | 19:58 |
| Myrtti | lardman: sadly I've got enough of them already... | 19:58 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: It was quite cool in the bus on the way back from the airport yesterday; but there needs to be some control panel setting for whether microb geolocation should use coarse or precise accuracy in liblocation. Tootling around with the GPS on all the time doesn't appeal for the battery life; and it'd be good to have it somewhat reverse-engineered so there was a daemon updating my location occasionally and I could open an app (probably just embedding the | 19:59 |
| Jaffa | sort of "report" vs. "rendezvous" modes. | 19:59 |
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| RevdKathy | I'm open to a little stalking if you're Qt | 19:59 |
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| zaheerm | Jaffa, you at work? | 19:59 |
| lardman_ | hmm, the wonders of TalkTalk | 19:59 |
| Jaffa | zaheerm: ATM, yup | 20:00 |
| * zaheerm spots jaffa not too far from the thames | 20:00 | |
| Jaffa | Indeed, less than 10 min walk to Tower of London | 20:00 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: "Friends list" on the map didn't work on my N900; and I dunno if the shift-double click to zoom out which works in Firefox will work on device (not tested) | 20:01 |
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| lardman_ | Jaffa: hmm, works for me | 20:02 |
| lardman_ | Jaffa: are you online atm? | 20:02 |
| lardman_ | 19m ago you were | 20:03 |
| lardman_ | London, just north of London Bridge | 20:04 |
| lardman_ | on the corner of the A10 and A12?? | 20:04 |
| lardman_ | where ?? matches 2 chars that look like 11 but are obscured by your avatar | 20:05 |
| lardman_ | ~ping | 20:06 |
| infobot | ~pong | 20:06 |
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| lardman_ | oh good, was just a bit too quiet | 20:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 20:06 |
| lardman_ | how does one make the browser go back to normal zoom? | 20:06 |
| lardman_ | this page is a bit flawed as you can't zoom afaict | 20:06 |
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| lardman_ | nor can you pan | 20:07 |
| lardman_ | I guess that is actually possible on an iPhone though? | 20:07 |
| lardman_ | anyone got one? | 20:07 |
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| lardman_ | you can PM me if you don't want to admit your shame in public ;) | 20:08 |
| fdv | lardman_: what is possible? | 20:08 |
| lardman_ | zooming and panning the Latitude page | 20:08 |
| fnordianslip | what page are you guys looking at? let me see | 20:08 |
| * lardman_ looks for it in yesterday's logs | 20:09 | |
| fdv | oh, that's a gps app? | 20:09 |
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| lardman_ | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=417739&postcount=59 | 20:09 |
| lardman_ | no, webpage with location plugin | 20:10 |
| fdv | ah | 20:10 |
| fdv | but you'll still need a gps, so my 2g phone won't do much good :) | 20:10 |
| fnordianslip | is the plugin in e-d ? | 20:10 |
| lardman_ | yep | 20:11 |
| fnordianslip | cheers | 20:11 |
| lardman_ | fdv: what phone do you have? | 20:11 |
| fnordianslip | no brickey-brickey with the plugin ? | 20:11 |
| lardman_ | no, should be fine | 20:11 |
| fnordianslip | tnx | 20:11 |
| lardman_ | (evil cackle) | 20:11 |
| fdv | lardman_: iphone 2g and n900 | 20:11 |
| lardman_ | well will probably work on the iphone as that's what it's designed for | 20:12 |
| lardman_ | on n900 install the plugin and open the webpage | 20:12 |
| fdv | working on it :) | 20:12 |
| lardman_ | http://googlemobile.blogspot.com/2009/07/google-latitude-now-for-iphone.html | 20:13 |
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| fdv | where'd you say the plugin could be found? | 20:14 |
| DanielWm | hi | 20:14 |
| lardman_ | fdv: extras devel | 20:14 |
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| fdv | oh | 20:14 |
| lardman_ | fdv: I'll get you the url so you don't need to enable the repo | 20:14 |
| fdv | lardman_: is the repo that unstable? | 20:14 |
| LuciusMare | can anyone tell me why there is still "preorder" for n900 at nokia store? | 20:14 |
| lardman_ | fdv: not imo, but still | 20:15 |
| fdv | :) | 20:15 |
| lardman_ | http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/m/maemo-geolocation/ | 20:15 |
| Myrtti | LuciusMare: depends on what nokia store you're looking at | 20:16 |
| LuciusMare | Myrtti: europe | 20:16 |
| LuciusMare | germany,UK,Austria | 20:16 |
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| zaheerm | LuciusMare, i think because they keep running out of stock | 20:17 |
| lardman_ | http://iphoneworld.codinghut.com/tag/google-latitude/ | 20:18 |
| lardman_ | interesting, someone has already hacked the api on the iPhone | 20:18 |
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| lardman_ | that page needs panning and zooming, so will have to do likewise, plus to save battert | 20:18 |
| lardman_ | battery | 20:19 |
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| lardman_ | I guess a library would be the best bet, feed it your google account info, it returns a list of your contacts and their locations | 20:24 |
| lardman_ | with a callback for changes in location, etc | 20:24 |
| zaheerm | that stuff is public api right? | 20:24 |
| zaheerm | so could go into libgdata | 20:24 |
| lardman_ | no | 20:24 |
| crashanddie | http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Exploding-Chewing-Gum-Ukraine-Man-Killed-In-Konotop-After-Dipping-Gum-In-Unknown-Substance---Report/Article/200912215496442?lpos=World_News_First_Home_Article_Teaser_Region_7&lid=ARTICLE_15496442_Exploding_Chewing_Gum%3A_Ukraine_Man_Killed_In_Konotop_After_Dipping_Gum_In_Unknown_Substance_-_Report | 20:25 |
| lardman_ | I need to reverse engineer it afaict | 20:25 |
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| lardman_ | oops | 20:26 |
| crashanddie | Looks like another episode of Mythbusters | 20:26 |
| zaheerm | lardman_, http://radar.oreilly.com/2009/05/googles-sneaky-launch-of-latitudes-location-sharing-api.html | 20:27 |
| crashanddie | do we know if the uSD port is SDIO-enabled? | 20:27 |
| lardman_ | zaheerm: saw that, but only allows you to lookup your own location afaict | 20:28 |
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| zaheerm | lardman_, ah ok, so a little less useful | 20:28 |
| LuciusMare | back to preorder at shops,i dont think so | 20:28 |
| LuciusMare | availibility is coming soon | 20:28 |
| LuciusMare | not out of stock | 20:28 |
| lardman_ | not useful at all, though I had the same good thoughts to begin with, as we already know our lat/lon, so no need for Google to tell us | 20:29 |
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| Jaffa | crashanddie: are you down under yet? | 20:31 |
| crashanddie | Jaffa: nope, still in California | 20:32 |
| Jaffa | lardman_: on desktop on that page you can zoom in with double-click and zoom out with shift-double click. I guess, you'll have to disable the pan mode using the left toggle button | 20:32 |
| Jaffa | crashanddie: nice? | 20:32 |
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| red | Can I use my N900 as a remote controller for my PC via WiFi or internet? | 20:34 |
| red | used to this functionality on my older devices so just wondering | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | bluemaemo? | 20:34 |
| tigert | red: vnc for example | 20:35 |
| tigert | depends what you mean | 20:35 |
| red | bluemamo is bluetooth? | 20:35 |
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| red | well for example mousecursor controlling | 20:35 |
| red | or sending keystrokes | 20:35 |
| tigert | vnc is what you need then | 20:35 |
| tigert | or rdesktop | 20:35 |
| red | vnc oughta work adequatly | 20:35 |
| red | but could be horrible performancewise dno :p | 20:35 |
| tigert | theres both vnc or rdesktop | 20:35 |
| tigert | its ok if you have a fast wlan | 20:35 |
| red | oki, ill dig into it | 20:35 |
| red | 3.6mbps gprs or wlan as fast as n900 can deliver | 20:36 |
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| lardman_ | Jaffa: thanks | 20:37 |
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| lardman_ | still think something not tired to a webpage is a better bet though really, from a power saving point of view if nothing else | 20:37 |
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| Jaffa | lardman_: agreed | 20:38 |
| lbt | stupid adsl | 20:38 |
| crashanddie | Jaffa: cold | 20:38 |
| Jaffa | good news: seems to be doing wifi triangulation on N900 too | 20:38 |
| crashanddie | Jaffa: appears to be one of the coldest winters in years | 20:38 |
| fnordianslipup | lardman_: perhaps just range and bearing would do | 20:38 |
| RST38h | mooo | 20:38 |
| jrocha | lizardo, hey | 20:38 |
| RST38h | lardman: Ok, I tried that location test app | 20:39 |
| RST38h | lardman: Got interesting results. | 20:39 |
| lbt | RST38h: worth getting? | 20:39 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: they will return lat/lon | 20:39 |
| Jaffa | Status area had it as "general", but showing me pretty precisely at euston | 20:39 |
| lardman_ | RST38h: go on | 20:39 |
| lizardo | jrocha: hi | 20:39 |
| RST38h | ladman: Looks like gps stuff itself is not to blame. It does get a fix, after a while, even in offline mode | 20:39 |
| RST38h | lardman: BUT | 20:39 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I got a doubt about packaging a Python app | 20:39 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Ovi Maps. It starts gettng location, GPS icon starts flashing, then after about 40-100 seconds, Ovi Maps shuts GPS down, asks for an uplink (continue in offline mode? yes/no) and initializes GPS again | 20:40 |
| RST38h | lardman: Of course, if you are flipping the gps like crazy every minute or two, it will NEVER get a fix | 20:40 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I build a deb package on SB and it will get me the tarball of the package as ...i386.tar.gz | 20:40 |
| RST38h | Will have to try with Maemo Mapper though | 20:41 |
| jrocha | lizardo, and the build dependencies I have for it are only available on i386 target (python-runtime) | 20:41 |
| lardman_ | RST38h: ok, so that's ovi maps' fault not liblocation's then? | 20:41 |
| RST38h | or eCoach for that matter | 20:41 |
| RST38h | lardman: Looks so to me, at the moment | 20:41 |
| lizardo | jrocha: are you on a x86 or armel target ? | 20:41 |
| RST38h | lardman: Needs more testing with other GPS apps though | 20:41 |
| lardman_ | Ovi Maps really is a pile of shite | 20:41 |
| jrocha | lizardo, but I would like the tarball to be arch independent | 20:41 |
| jrocha | on the X86 | 20:41 |
| * lardman_ considers adding that to the bugtracker | 20:41 | |
| RST38h | lardman: I had that idea long ago | 20:42 |
| lardman_ | RST38h: ok | 20:42 |
| lizardo | jrocha: BTW, you should not depend on the "python-runtime" package ... it is a meta-package to be installed by developers, not to be used on debian/control | 20:42 |
| lardman_ | well yeah, just extra confirmation ;) | 20:42 |
| RST38h | lardman: There is really no right way to file Ovi Maps bugs | 20:42 |
| RST38h | lardman: Other than "It sucks." | 20:42 |
| lardman_ | dpkg --remove | 20:42 |
| lizardo | jrocha: in that case you should use "Architecture: all" on debian/control | 20:42 |
| jrocha | hmm, lizardo I used it for builde-dep only | 20:42 |
| lizardo | jrocha: even so, I'd suggest you depend only on the Python packages you really use | 20:43 |
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| jrocha | lizardo, I got Architecture: all in debian/control | 20:43 |
| lardman_ | I need a Windows app which will sniff tcp/ip data and allow me to filter by process, any ideas? | 20:43 |
| jrocha | lizardo, okay | 20:43 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I noticed hermes or gpodder (don't recall which exactly) also had it that way | 20:44 |
| lizardo | jrocha: are you sure it is not "Architecture: any" because "all" should generate a *_all.deb package, not a *_i386.deb one | 20:44 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: did you ever try bluemaemo with your mac? | 20:44 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: can't seem to get it to work | 20:44 |
| lizardo | jrocha: yes, I still need to notify the packages that do this :) it is some old habit from Diablo times, I suppose | 20:44 |
| fnordianslip | lardman_ Open Ports to see which stream are for which process, and Wireshark | 20:44 |
| vrp | hello all, could someone help me with an issue installing the SDK on Ubuntu? | 20:45 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I get a all.deb package but I get a i386 tarball | 20:45 |
| jrocha | "Architecture: all" copied+pasted | 20:45 |
| lardman_ | wireshark, ok | 20:45 |
| vrp | after i login to scratchbox, i and run af-sb-init.sh I get "command not found" | 20:45 |
| vrp | I ran the gui installer from the nokia site | 20:45 |
| vrp | i manually installed the nokia binaries using apt-get install mameo-explicit | 20:45 |
| fnordianslip | lardman_: there's an app for Win called "Open Ports" | 20:46 |
| lizardo | jrocha: but you know that having "python-runtime" on Build-Depends (or any other python-* dependency) does not guarantee that the Dependency will be available at run-time , right ? the Depends: field will not contain any python-* dependencies that you defined only on Build-Depends | 20:46 |
| lizardo | jrocha: which parameters you pass to dpkg-buildpackage to generate the packages ? | 20:46 |
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| lizardo | jrocha: that's really strange, I always get a .orig.tar.gz+.diff.gz or .tar.gz package only... | 20:47 |
| jrocha | -us -uc -rfakeroot | 20:47 |
| lardman_ | fnordianslip: can I have more than one filter at a time? | 20:47 |
| jrocha | -us -uc -rfakeroot | 20:48 |
| lizardo | jrocha: well, that's really weird, I never seen Debian packages generating some .i386.tar.gz ... | 20:48 |
| jrocha | ups | 20:48 |
| lardman_ | wireshark doesn't seem to record the process name | 20:48 |
| jrocha | well, i does for me :D | 20:48 |
| lizardo | jrocha: maybe something you put on your debian/control ? | 20:48 |
| fnordianslip | lardman_: in wireshark - like "tcp.port eq 80 and udp.port eq 2000" | 20:48 |
| lardman_ | ok cool | 20:49 |
| lardman_ | thanks | 20:49 |
| jrocha | lizardo, http://gitorious.org/seriesfinale/seriesfinale/blobs/master/debian/control | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lardman_, there's even a convenient UI for filter setup | 20:49 |
| jrocha | lizardo, so, for build-depends maybe only python2.5 is enough? | 20:50 |
| crashanddie | GAN900: ? | 20:50 |
| lizardo | jrocha: I suppose you are using sb1 and not sb2 , right ? | 20:50 |
| lardman_ | yeah, couldn't see how to join filters though, but if "and" works that's fine | 20:50 |
| jrocha | SB2 | 20:50 |
| crashanddie | lardman_: how's Qt? | 20:50 |
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| lardman_ | crashanddie: progressing slowly | 20:51 |
| crashanddie | the important word being "Progress" | 20:51 |
| fnordianslip | lardman_: i might have meant "or" thinking about it | 20:51 |
| lardman_ | yep | 20:51 |
| lardman_ | nah, have started writing code | 20:51 |
| Jaffa | DocScrutinizer51: "convenient" might be overstating it a little ;) | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | k | 20:51 |
| lardman_ | trying to work out how to encapsulate everything in these funny things called classes | 20:51 |
| lizardo | jrocha: yes, either "Depends: python (>= 2.5)" or "Depends: python2.5" (if you also target Diablo) | 20:52 |
| Jaffa | Latitude on N900 is doing a good job of my journey home | 20:52 |
| lizardo | jrocha: s/Depends/Build-Depends/ | 20:52 |
| jrocha | ups yes, that's what I meant :) | 20:52 |
| Jaffa | lizardo: get him to specify the optified version ;) | 20:52 |
| * lardman_ logs on to check | 20:52 | |
| * Jaffa is going to in his next Hermes build | 20:52 | |
| jrocha | lizardo, ok, I'll check if I get arm.tar.gz on arm target | 20:53 |
| lizardo | Jaffa: that's not really necessary... the optified version is already in testing, there is nothing mor ewe can do to push it further :) | 20:53 |
| vrp | anyone? | 20:53 |
| lardman_ | Jaffa: Berkhamstead? | 20:53 |
| lardman_ | s/a// | 20:53 |
| infobot | lardman_ meant: Jffa: Berkhamstead? | 20:53 |
| lardman_ | no he didn't | 20:53 |
| lizardo | Jaffa: actually the "how to push non-user/* package updates to the user" issue is still open | 20:53 |
| DanielWm | where can i find the source packages for the packages on repository.maemo.org ? | 20:54 |
| lizardo | and "make all packages depend on specific versions of packages" is not a good solution IMHO :) | 20:54 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | is there any widely accepted best practice to avoid /fs cramming ewhile installing all kinda devel-foo? like e.g. moving /usr | 20:54 |
| Jaffa | lizardo: >= is possibly good enough | 20:54 |
| derf | The correct solution, obviously, is to put everything in user/*. | 20:54 |
| jrocha | lizardo, ... I'm sorry I told you i386.tar.gz... it is the .changes that have the arch attached | 20:55 |
| Jaffa | Has anyone tested user/hidden with the shipping Fremantle HAM? | 20:55 |
| lizardo | jrocha: in that case this is no problem at all | 20:55 |
| Jaffa | lardman_: sounds about right | 20:55 |
| lizardo | jrocha: you don't want a arch attached to it , use the -S option | 20:55 |
| lizardo | jrocha: and -sa | 20:55 |
| lardman_ | Jaffa: Aldbury now | 20:56 |
| lizardo | jrocha: in short : dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -rfakeroot -sa -S | 20:56 |
| lizardo | jrocha: (I think this is the recommended command for extras-devel uploads) | 20:56 |
| derf | No, that's not the one in the docs. | 20:56 |
| jrocha | lizardo, ok, my problem is just that I uploaded it to extras devel and it built it to me for 'maemo-fremantle-i386-extras-devel' target | 20:56 |
| jrocha | ok | 20:56 |
| lizardo | jrocha: but not the "-S" will build only the source package :) | 20:57 |
| Jaffa | lardman_: exciting my train journey, isn't it? | 20:57 |
| lardman_ | lol | 20:57 |
| lardman_ | but nice it works ;) | 20:57 |
| zaheerm | Jaffa, you live in herts? | 20:58 |
| lardman_ | right, going to do some tcp sniffing so will shutdown to avoid too much extra noise | 20:58 |
| lardman_ | bbiab | 20:58 |
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| RevdKathy | tcp sniffing? Sounds... deadly | 20:59 |
| DanielWm | where to find the source of the lirc package? | 20:59 |
| jrocha | lizardo, -sa will still give me i386.changes | 21:00 |
| fnordianslip | can't get good glue anymore | 21:00 |
| RST38h | Each American Consumed 34 Gigabytes Per Day In '08 | 21:00 |
| |R | awkward amount | 21:00 |
| fnordianslip | of what? burgers? | 21:00 |
| jrocha | lizardo, using -S gives me ...-source.changes | 21:00 |
| RevdKathy | In the absence of glue, try whiteboard parker pens | 21:00 |
| RST38h | porn! | 21:00 |
| |R | only? | 21:00 |
| |R | :P | 21:00 |
| Jaffa | zaheerm: no, I'm still going | 21:00 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | RevdKathy, nah, tcp is considered one of the more soft recreational drugs | 21:00 |
| RST38h | well, some advertising too | 21:01 |
| fnordianslip | you're thinking of pcp | 21:01 |
| zaheerm | Jaffa, long commute, then :) | 21:01 |
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| RevdKathy | tcp is an antiseptic. It would do nothing for you! | 21:01 |
| lizardo | jrocha: yes, it's because it builds the binaries... it will always append the arch where the package was build, even if all packages in debian/control are Arch: all | 21:01 |
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| lizardo | jrocha: the -S will append only _source.changes | 21:01 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I see | 21:01 |
| RST38h | And PCP is what koalas getting high on? | 21:01 |
| lizardo | jrocha: but I'm not sure why that's a problem :) you don't need to distribute the .changes file anyway | 21:01 |
| jrocha | lizardo, I'm obviously a noob on deb pkg generation | 21:01 |
| * RST38h throws more wood on the bug 5337 fire | 21:02 | |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337 Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 21:02 |
| Jaffa | zaheerm: 90mins door-to-door | 21:02 |
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| lizardo | jrocha: the changes file is only required for uploading to extras-devel, and for that you must use "-sa -S" AFAIK | 21:02 |
| zaheerm | Jaffa, ok that's not too bad | 21:02 |
| zaheerm | my commute tomorrow will be like 4 hours door to door | 21:02 |
| jrocha | lizardo, it's just that I scped the changes, tar.gz and dsc to extras devel and its build says at some point: [2009-12-09 18:10:26] Building seriesfinale 0.1-1 for target 'maemo-fremantle-i386-extras-devel' | 21:02 |
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| lizardo | jrocha: yes, that's just the name of the sbox target on the autobuilder machine | 21:03 |
| lizardo | jrocha: but given the package is Arch: all, it builds only on i386 | 21:03 |
| lizardo | jrocha: because the package generated there is also installable on the armel target | 21:03 |
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| jrocha | lizardo, so the package will be available on armel as well in the end | 21:04 |
| lizardo | jrocha: if you had any Arch: any packages in debian/control, it would build on both targets | 21:04 |
| lizardo | jrocha: yes ;) | 21:04 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | c'mon devels. I'm probably not the only one with / at 93%. How to tackle that? | 21:04 |
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| lizardo | jrocha: it would not be available only if you used Arch: i386 specifically | 21:04 |
| jrocha | lizardo, oh! nice then :D ... and I've been wasting your time.. | 21:05 |
| lizardo | jrocha: no prob :) | 21:05 |
| derf | DocScrutinizer51: Re-flash. | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | bah | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | want to get even more tools on the device - not reset to default | 21:05 |
| jrocha | lizardo, so the recommended way is to have Arch: all on debian/control and build it using -sa -S, hence uploading the ....-source.changes to extras devel? | 21:06 |
| SpeedEvil | chroot! | 21:06 |
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| * SpeedEvil wants a nice 3GB package of all possible tools in a chroot. | 21:06 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, duh. sounds like overkill... | 21:06 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | bu then. it has charming aspects | 21:06 |
| SpeedEvil | gcc/gdb/firefox/xephem/quake/... | 21:07 |
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| Vanadis | hai thar | 21:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | so nobody did a simple move of /usr and /var so far? | 21:08 |
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| ali1234 | it isn't necessary to move anything | 21:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | ali1234, please toss a better procedure then | 21:10 |
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| ali1234 | um, install whatever you want to a loopback filesystem, mount it, path it, that's it | 21:11 |
| RST38h | lardman, Jaffa, Stskeeps, SpeedEvil: Take a look here: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337#c74 | 21:11 |
| povbot | Bug 5337: Can't get GPS lock without network connection | 21:11 |
| lizardo | jrocha: AFAIK , yes | 21:12 |
| jrocha | lizardo, ok, thanks | 21:12 |
| lizardo | jrocha: as long as your package is readlly architecture independent (i.e. does not compile anything) :) | 21:12 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: good job investigating | 21:13 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Seems to be OVI MAPS | 21:13 |
| jrocha | lizardo, ok, thank you for the help | 21:13 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: please state what mode you used in LTG | 21:13 |
| Stskeeps | GNSS/etc | 21:13 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I saw something that looked like that with something else... | 21:13 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: ah | 21:14 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: gpsjinni was doing that too | 21:14 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: defaults | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ali1234, thanks. but that doesn't disclose its's advantages in everyday use to me' compared to moving /usr | 21:14 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: the shut down the GPS thing | 21:14 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: looks good | 21:14 |
| ali1234 | DocScrutinizer the advantage is you don't have to more /usr and potentially screw the device in the process | 21:14 |
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| RST38h | Jaffa: Of course if it is OVI MAPS, Maemo Mapper is our only hope | 21:14 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i suspect ovi maps wants cellid - it went totally crazy once and mixed cellid and gps input | 21:14 |
| RST38h | There is no way anyone is gonna fix THAT pile of fecal substance | 21:14 |
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| ali1234 | if you don't mind that nobody else has tried it, and you might mess it up, then feel free to choose the difficult option | 21:15 |
| luke-jr | "Mostly, nobody knows I'm drunk until I've decided to use shared libs in a taste test" | 21:15 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Once you have Location Testing thingie keep GPS up, OVI MAPS works :) | 21:15 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: GPXview is a quite nice map viewer | 21:15 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 21:15 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: also seemed to keep gps location fix up - gpxview - IIRC | 21:15 |
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| Jaffa | yayp nearly home | 21:16 |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, first two screens of vulture's eye are a bit off the screen | 21:17 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps, Jaffa, SpeedEvil: There is one more possible cause for this problem | 21:17 |
| * VDVsx gonna thumb down :D | 21:18 | |
| RST38h | VDVsx: They are made for a bigger screen | 21:18 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: The pope? | 21:18 |
| * VDVsx is kidding :P | 21:18 | |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: The illuminati? | 21:18 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, resize them | 21:18 |
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| RST38h | Stskeeps, Jaffa, SpeedEvil: Consider a situation where OVI MAPS DOES NOT forcibly shut GPS down | 21:18 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: yeah - I was wondering if it was a somewhat lower level library | 21:18 |
| RST38h | Intead it simply stops using GPS and the GPS subsystem shuts GPS down, rather than keep it up for another few minutes in the hopes that someone may need it | 21:18 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: shutting down the gps as it confused idle with no fix | 21:19 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, the bugtracker points to tmo, lol | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | anybody knows how to set up a dualboot system on n900? (only bootloader) | 21:19 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: 'shutdown if nobodies got a position report in 1 min' | 21:19 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer51: rootfs or kernel? | 21:19 |
| RST38h | Given how expensive it is to reacquire them damn lock, GPS should be kept up for at least a few minutes when it is unused | 21:19 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: meh | 21:19 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: No shit Sherlock :) | 21:19 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: I really had no idea where to direct bug reports | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Stskeeps, mostly rootfs. wouldn't mind kernel as well | 21:20 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Don't think Clive has a forum | 21:20 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I meant today to get an oscilloscope hooked to measure the instantaneous current. So I can see how expensive exactly a packet is over GPRS and 3G and ... | 21:20 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, well, at least it should point to a specific thread | 21:20 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: but feeling horrible today | 21:20 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Probably, yes | 21:20 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: If you feel like adjusting the graphics and icons, please do | 21:20 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: also good for gps of course | 21:20 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Send the resulting data to me *and* javispedro who is trying to get it through autobuilder | 21:20 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer51: had a n810 with bootmenu? | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | no :-S | 21:21 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: How expensive in terms of TMobile/ATT exec time? :) | 21:21 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, bugtracker and the first two screens, nothing else | 21:21 |
| VDVsx | works fine so far | 21:21 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: :) | 21:21 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer51: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=372885&postcount=22 | 21:21 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Feel free to fix the screens (/opt/vultures/graphics) | 21:21 |
| * VDVsx installs braek 0_0 | 21:22 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Stskeeps, tnx for ptr | 21:22 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer51: 'tis my job | 21:22 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:22 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I was more thinking of how many millijoules a 64/512/4096 byte packet takes over 3g/gprs/wifi, and what the breakdowns are of data quantity/latency | 21:22 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: I remember overhearing that one minute of a transatlantic phone call cost AT&T about $.02 7 years ago | 21:22 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Also, AT&T owned the damn cable | 21:23 |
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| RST38h | SpeedEvil: So, we are takling about 500%+ margins here | 21:23 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: oh I believe it | 21:23 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: It's also misleadin if you odn't count amortisation of the cost of the cable, and replacement cable funding of course. | 21:23 |
| fnordianslip | SpeedEvil: don't forget bluetooth too, in your comparison | 21:25 |
| markus_ | how does the include line has to look like? "#include "SDL/SDL.h" seems not to work | 21:25 |
| SpeedEvil | fnordianslip: true. I don't happen to have a bluetooth pan device setup - I suppose a mouse would work | 21:25 |
| ali1234 | Stskeeps: the bootmenu is post kernel though right? | 21:26 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: I think it has all been included | 21:26 |
| fnordianslip | SpeedEvil: not ideal though. still, what you propose is interesting enough | 21:26 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: $.02/min was a bulk rate at which AT&T sold minutes to other companies | 21:26 |
| Stskeeps | ali1234: yes, kexec is broken | 21:26 |
| ali1234 | are there public docs on how to build a flashing jig yet? | 21:27 |
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| ali1234 | (for n900 or n800) | 21:27 |
| Stskeeps | n800 or n810 had some.. | 21:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, Ws/byte. A nice evaluation :-) | 21:29 |
| RST38h | Meanwhile, in the less known bug... https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2501 | 21:29 |
| povbot | Bug 2501: Hardware keyboard doesn't switch Input language when pressing Ctrl+Space | 21:29 |
| RST38h | \ | 21:29 |
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| ersin | hi all | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: did you by chance put the glib and so on stuff in extras-devel? :P | 21:31 |
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| ersin | does anyone know if there's anything bad about disabling the hw watchdog? a lot of people seem to complain about random reboots | 21:31 |
| ersin | stskeeps: YES! i'm so, so sorry about that | 21:31 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: hehe, next time it's better to set up your own repo :) | 21:31 |
| ersin | i got an e-mail from x-fade | 21:31 |
| Stskeeps | or dpkg -i stuff manually | 21:31 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: absolutely, i don't know what i was thinking, i just got caught up in it all | 21:31 |
| ali1234 | ersin: they'll just get random freezes instead of random reboots :P | 21:31 |
| ersin | ali1234: oh...lol | 21:32 |
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| ali1234 | i mean it's unlikely that the system will unfreeze if it freezes long enough to trip the watchdog | 21:32 |
| ali1234 | possible... but unlikely | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | random reboots might be caused by filled rootfs and any write() failing/blocking | 21:33 |
| derf | No, it's fairly likely. | 21:33 |
| derf | What's unlike is that the user cares enough to wait for it. | 21:33 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: i was thinking about starting a thread on talk.maemo.org for sharing some adhoc builds of mer/fremantle packages ported to diablo, i'm sure lots of people would like to try if there were just a set of easy links (lots of disclaimers of course) | 21:33 |
| derf | *unlikely | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: talk to the community SSU guys | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | they might be interestes | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | d | 21:33 |
| ersin | ali1234: no but there's plenty of times when it will just reboot for no reason | 21:34 |
| derf | I was able to make my N810 trip the watchdog fairly easily just by swapping too much. | 21:34 |
| derf | And I was usually happy when it did. | 21:34 |
| ersin | ali1234: like when using easy debian openoffice | 21:34 |
| ali1234 | that's kind of ... bad | 21:34 |
| lbt | hmm, ersin... what device have you got? | 21:34 |
| ersin | stskeeps: didn't realize there was a group like that, are they on irc? | 21:34 |
| ersin | lbt: n800 | 21:34 |
| * lbt wonders why you're not building on Mer/OBS then :) | 21:35 | |
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| lbt | Mer is about porting fremantle stuff | 21:35 |
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| lbt | and provides a clean place for you to up the gtk version in your own project space | 21:35 |
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| ersin | lbt: well i'm getting there...my reasons for sticking to diablo in the short term are obscure but important to me | 21:36 |
| lbt | yeah, np | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | ersin: lma and SD69 | 21:36 |
| andre__ | somebody having a UPnP share here and running 1.2009.42-11? can you please tell me if https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6736 also happens in English? | 21:36 |
| povbot | Bug 6736: Polish string too long durung UPnP browsing | 21:36 |
| lbt | just trying to provide options | 21:36 |
| ersin | lbt: but i am very much interested in contributing to mer, trust me it will happen =P | 21:36 |
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| ersin | thank you, much appreciated | 21:36 |
| RST38h | 18:07 | 21:37 |
| ersin | stskeeps: noted | 21:37 |
| RST38h | Processed at Helsinki - Finland! | 21:37 |
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| lbt | RST38h: heh <grin> | 21:37 |
| lbt | neighbours then | 21:37 |
| RST38h | lbt: You and my N900? :) Indeed | 21:38 |
| lbt | Departed from DHL facility in Helsinki | 21:38 |
| RST38h | Ahhahahaha | 21:38 |
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| RST38h | yours is leaving first! | 21:39 |
| JackSMith | get windows keys for cheap http://bit.ly/5Tgz2X :) | 21:39 |
| * Stskeeps should get that rebate at some point.. | 21:39 | |
| lbt | 1st class | 21:39 |
| RST38h | still need to get a decent case | 21:39 |
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| * dinmin_ välter kulve | 21:40 | |
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| lbt | yeah, and maybe a protector | 21:40 |
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| RST38h | I ordered protector | 21:41 |
| RST38h | They are backordered though | 21:41 |
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| dinmin | Meh... kurtan* | 21:41 |
| kurtan | meh! | 21:41 |
| ali1234 | andre__: (upnp) no it doesn't happen for me (the text is smaller and on two lines) | 21:41 |
| andre__ | ali1234, thanks a lot! | 21:42 |
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| RST38h | ZAGG has got a near perfect order tracing system | 21:42 |
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| * RST38h has never seen anything this good | 21:42 | |
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| lardman | re | 21:43 |
| JosefAssad | hm | 21:44 |
| JosefAssad | so if I'm following http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo5_Final_Installation and I get to the ./maemo-sdk-install_5.0.sh | 21:44 |
| fnordianslip | ali1234: i'm confused. I can't see anything to do with upnp in Media Player, although I can see my twonky server in File Manager. how do you select a upnp share in MP? | 21:45 |
| JosefAssad | and I get IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/scratchbox/users/josef/targets/FREMANTLE_ARMEL.config' <-- what obvious step did I miss? | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | fnordianslip: it just appears at the bottom of the main media player screen | 21:45 |
| fnordianslip | ali1234: er, or not in my case. hmmm | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | upnp can be hit and miss | 21:46 |
| ali1234 | mine appears but all the folders are empty | 21:46 |
| ali1234 | i'm using gmediaserver | 21:46 |
| fnordianslip | file manager hots and media player misses. hmm. | 21:46 |
| fnordianslip | hits, i meant | 21:46 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: so for git, once i clone my own repository, i should just change the code directly and committing will keep a record of it that can be pulled by the gitorious branches? | 21:48 |
| ersin | stskeeps: i.e., i don't have to worry about doing diff patches, right? | 21:49 |
| Stskeeps | right | 21:49 |
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| ersin | that is absolutely awesome | 21:49 |
| wazd | I wonder if Pandora guys are planning to release Pandora 2 :) | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: any concise summary about bootloader, initfs, partitions etc.? (like "on power-up, bootloader is moved to ram from...") | 21:49 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: nolo,x-loader loads a zImage from internal flash | 21:50 |
| VDVsx | wazd, of course the major hit will be duke nukem forever 2 :D | 21:50 |
| Stskeeps | can't recall what partition | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: what's x-loader? ;-) | 21:50 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: something magical | 21:50 |
| Stskeeps | no idea, actually | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | lol | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | k | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | so first step user has any control is the content of zImage | 21:51 |
| Stskeeps | right | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | k, thanks | 21:51 |
| Stskeeps | or at nolo, booting kernel from USB | 21:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | what's nolo then? | 21:52 |
| Stskeeps | bootloader | 21:52 |
| Stskeeps | Nokia Loader | 21:52 |
| ersin | docscrutinizer: i found that looking at the initfs's linuxrc script is very helpful | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah | 21:52 |
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| ersin | that's the script that's run right after the magical nokia boot stuff takes place | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | ersin: thanks | 21:53 |
| ersin | yep | 21:53 |
| Stskeeps | no initfs in n900 | 21:53 |
| Stskeeps | well | 21:53 |
| BluesLee | hi, is there a widget for taking notes or one where i can manage my todos? (the calendar widget doesnt show me my todos) | 21:53 |
| Stskeeps | not a used one | 21:53 |
| ersin | oh, my bad | 21:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: so what's your multiboot actually doing? tweaking bootloader (guess no), or kexec, or sth even different? | 21:55 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: starts in /sbin/preinit | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah, I see. It's not for different kernels. You asked me if I need rootfs, or kernel multiboot | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | it's for rootfs | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | k, ic | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | kernel multiboot is not possible atm :/ | 21:56 |
| * andre__ confused: Are Bluetooth mice officially supported for the N900? | 21:56 | |
| DocScrutinizer | thanks | 21:56 |
| VDVsx | andre__, no HID | 21:56 |
| andre__ | VDVsx, heh. thanks :) | 21:57 |
| VDVsx | mice/keyboard uses the same profile | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | andre__: there's a package somewhere in devel or dunno claiming to do HID for BT though | 21:58 |
| andre__ | yeah, I know... | 21:58 |
| andre__ | just wondered if it's technically the same as with keyboards... | 21:58 |
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| VDVsx | DocScrutinizer, if your're talking about bluemaemo is the opposite, the device acts as a HID keyboard/mice | 21:59 |
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| VDVsx | andre__, yes, plus the UI that doesn't support a pointer | 22:00 |
| VDVsx | except the browser | 22:00 |
| VDVsx | there a BT mouse works | 22:00 |
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| Markus23 | but for keyboards there are still problems with umlauts? | 22:04 |
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| Markus23 | n900 is really great however | 22:04 |
| Markus23 | can't await christmas :-) | 22:04 |
| lardman | hmm, interesting, the location data is indeed JSON | 22:05 |
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| crashanddie | Markus23: you can't really "not await" something | 22:05 |
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| Markus23 | crashanddie: bad english? | 22:06 |
| crashanddie | Markus23: I'm awaiting something | 22:06 |
| crashanddie | Markus23: or, I can't wait for something | 22:07 |
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| Markus23 | ok, so I can't wait for christmas :-) | 22:07 |
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| Markus23 | thanks for correction | 22:07 |
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| Gadgetoid | not being able to reliably use my bt keyboard with the n900 is annoying | 22:11 |
| Markus23 | Gadgetoid: any chance that it will be fixed? | 22:11 |
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| LuciusMare | Gadgetoid: youcan use a bt keyboard with n900? | 22:11 |
| Gadgetoid | lack of mouse i am kind of used to... it doesnt work well on the n810 either | 22:11 |
| Gadgetoid | LuciusMare, barely... only the letter keys work | 22:12 |
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| Gadgetoid | mouse wont even connect | 22:12 |
| Gadgetoid | and Markus23, an official fix seems unlikely... the bug raised was shot down | 22:13 |
| Markus23 | seems like they want to sell their own bt keyboard | 22:13 |
| Gadgetoid | there are some smart folks here... though... if any of them want it fixed, it will be fixed | 22:14 |
| Gadgetoid | i agree markus23 | 22:14 |
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| Gadgetoid | makes sound business sense... and i would buy such a keyboard if it didnt suck | 22:14 |
| Markus23 | why does it suck? | 22:14 |
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| Gadgetoid | although the hid profile is totally disabled... not sure how they would get onet to work without firmware changes | 22:15 |
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| Ceron^ | http://vigor.sourceforge.net/screenshots/ AWSOME ITS FINALLY HERE | 22:15 |
| Ceron^ | http://vigor.sourceforge.net/ port this to maemo | 22:15 |
| Ceron^ | priority nr.1 | 22:15 |
| Gadgetoid | it probably will suck... i don't think suvh a keyboard yet exists | 22:15 |
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| Markus23 | Gadgetoid: whats special about firmware changes? isn't it a dist-upgrade and reboot afterwards? | 22:16 |
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| Gadgetoid | i guess Markus23 but it requires a small config change either way | 22:17 |
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| Gadgetoid | which anyone who knows their way 'round terminal can do themselves in about 30sec | 22:18 |
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| Ceron^ | whats the newest firmware | 22:19 |
| Ceron^ | on the n900 | 22:19 |
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| Gadgetoid | thats odd... no cable to my homeplus network | 22:19 |
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| Gadgetoid | haha | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yeah | 22:23 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | friggin splits | 22:23 |
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| Vink_ | Hi, any solution for this? | 22:23 |
| Vink_ | [sbox-maemo-beagle: ~] > fakeroot ./make_rootfs.sh | 22:23 |
| Vink_ | /scratchbox/tools/bin/fakeroot: line 185: ./make_rootfs.sh: No such file or directory | 22:23 |
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| Gadgetoid | never seen 'em so common | 22:23 |
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| AbstractW | Is Maemo 6 going to be Qt based, rather than gnome based? | 22:28 |
| VDVsx | yes | 22:28 |
| AbstractW | Are they completely ditching Hildon? | 22:28 |
| woglinde | AbstractW yes but gtk-maemo apps will run as well | 22:28 |
| VDVsx | think so | 22:28 |
| toggles_w | what, my moe six? i just got five... | 22:29 |
| AbstractW | Hearing about that switch, has me tenative to purchase an N900 | 22:29 |
| AndrewBlack | I´m a little confused who would pay $20 for Documents to go viewer if you have atleast 1 other free viewer? | 22:29 |
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| AbstractW | Unless the N900 is supposed to be one of the target devices for maemo 6 | 22:29 |
| toggles_w | AbstractW: n900 is very very sweet | 22:29 |
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| go1dfish | I don't think there has been a confirmation either way on that, re n900/maemo6 | 22:29 |
| Scummer | 'lo | 22:30 |
| go1dfish | but whether it happens officially or not, I'd be extremely surprised if it didn't happen unofficially | 22:30 |
| AbstractW | I have no doubts it'd happen unofficially. | 22:30 |
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| go1dfish | I myself am looking forward to the qt switch | 22:31 |
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| go1dfish | as a user, I used to hate qt apps, and was much more of a gnome guy | 22:31 |
| AbstractW | I think most people were that way. | 22:31 |
| RevdKathy | Are you Qt, goldfish? | 22:31 |
| go1dfish | but qt4 is very sweet, no matter how you look at it really, good from both a dev and user perspectiv | 22:31 |
| go1dfish | no | 22:32 |
| woglinde | goldfish jupp | 22:32 |
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| go1dfish | still running gnome, and mostly gtk apps on my desktops I must admit, kde4 is too rushed and incomplete | 22:32 |
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| go1dfish | jupp? | 22:33 |
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| woglinde | go1dfish yes | 22:33 |
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| woglinde | qt is nice from user and dev site | 22:33 |
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| go1dfish | ah, cool | 22:33 |
| woglinde | kde4 is kde4 | 22:33 |
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| woglinde | only based on qt | 22:33 |
| petteri | hopefully maemo 5 -> maemo 6 is not kde 3 -> kde 4 all over again :D | 22:33 |
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| mikhas_ | petteri, was kde3 written in gtk? | 22:34 |
| VDVsx | lol | 22:34 |
| petteri | mikhas_: what do you think :D | 22:34 |
| luke-jr | no, KDE 3 was Qt3 | 22:34 |
| luke-jr | which would suggest that Maemo 5 -> Maemo 6 could be far worse or far better | 22:34 |
| luke-jr | since GTK sucks that much more than Qt3 | 22:34 |
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| petteri | i am also hoping to run maemo 6 on my n900 | 22:35 |
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| Scummer | are there svn trees for maemo 6 available ? | 22:35 |
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| petteri | Scummer: look here: http://maemo.gitorious.org | 22:36 |
| N900_fanboy | this maemo 6 for n900 is interesting question. is n900 "history" when maemo 6 is out? | 22:36 |
| mikhas | Scummer, maybe. if there is git2svn =) | 22:36 |
| Scummer | pett: ok thanks | 22:36 |
| Scummer | git is fine | 22:36 |
| Stskeeps | N900_fanboy: people's n810's work just fine still | 22:36 |
| AbstractW | The N900 was a device designed specifically for maemo 5. | 22:36 |
| * VDVsx 's n810 rocks!! | 22:37 | |
| Scummer | the n900 is way to cool not to be running maemo 6 :) | 22:37 |
| woglinde | aeh | 22:37 |
| woglinde | maemo5 was designed for n900 | 22:37 |
| * Stskeeps is personally looking forward to insert the first qt4.6 stuff and DUI and such and put on mer/n900 | 22:37 | |
| woglinde | kinetic stuff yeah yeah | 22:38 |
| woglinde | animationframework | 22:38 |
| woglinde | statemachine | 22:38 |
| woglinde | yeah yeah | 22:38 |
| go1dfish | heh I've already got a little python/qt4 app I wrote last year ported to maemo5 | 22:38 |
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| VDVsx | Stskeeps, you can test some of the new Qt stuff in the n900, works quite good ;) | 22:39 |
| |R | yé just got the n900 ! | 22:39 |
| |R | now, how the hell do you open the back :P | 22:40 |
| mikhas | VDVsx, care to upload the ported examples as .deb? | 22:40 |
| Scummer | just pop it open | 22:40 |
| mikhas | "ported", heh | 22:40 |
| |R | just pulling hard where the little line-hole is ? | 22:40 |
| VDVsx | mikhas, which ones ? | 22:40 |
| mikhas | if one line can count | 22:40 |
| Scummer | yes | 22:40 |
| mikhas | oh, they all are? | 22:40 |
| Scummer | no sliding or anything.. just pop it | 22:40 |
| |R | not enought nails haha i ll get something to do a lever ;) | 22:41 |
| * mikhas needs to check! | 22:41 | |
| go1dfish | heh when I first got my loaner, the little sticker with the instructions wasn't there | 22:41 |
| go1dfish | so I thought the suspend/resume switch | 22:41 |
| VDVsx | mikhas, the ones that a did based in the symbian stuff or the new ones from OpenBossa ? | 22:41 |
| go1dfish | was a latch for the battery cover | 22:41 |
| Scummer | hehe.. i thought the same thing :) | 22:41 |
| go1dfish | didn't realize it had another purpose till days later | 22:41 |
| Scummer | i didn't read the manual | 22:41 |
| go1dfish | I don't think I got a manual | 22:41 |
| go1dfish | going to go check | 22:41 |
| Scummer | who does afterall :) | 22:41 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: do you know why bluemaemo doesn't work on macs? | 22:42 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: if you tell me "because I don't have a mac", I"m slapping you | 22:42 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, did you removed the parings ? | 22:42 |
| * lardman fears he has underestimated reversing the Google Latitude protocol | 22:42 | |
| VDVsx | *pairings | 22:42 |
| crashanddie | remove them? | 22:42 |
| crashanddie | should I let bluemaemo do the pairing? | 22:42 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, yes I don't have a Mac to test | 22:42 |
| toggles_w | lardman: lol | 22:42 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, yes | 22:42 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: ok, lemme check | 22:43 |
| Scummer | anyone have a trunk svn modest app running? i haven't set up email yet because of the bug with the sorting | 22:43 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, remove them from the device and mac | 22:43 |
| fdv | lardman: seems to work like a charm (latitude) :) | 22:43 |
| go1dfish | hmm nope, no manual (I won mine at a raffle in santa clara) =D | 22:43 |
| Scummer | nice :) | 22:43 |
| lardman | fdv: Good :) | 22:43 |
| Scummer | i won mine from newegg after I paid 500$ for the raffle ticket :) | 22:43 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, that's because a new service is adv and the system saves these stuff in a conf file for paired devices | 22:44 |
| fdv | anybody know if there is a currency converter that can be used for fremantle / n900? | 22:44 |
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| go1dfish | fdv: google | 22:44 |
| Scummer | fdv : extras testing maybe ? | 22:44 |
| go1dfish | fdv: 3 dollars in euros | 22:45 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: removed it from both -- however nothing happens after I do "Establish connection" (it pairs, but that's it) | 22:45 |
| go1dfish | I don't know of any native apps for it yet | 22:45 |
| fdv | go1dfish: well, converting currency is typically useful abroad, and roaming charges are prohibitive :) | 22:45 |
| go1dfish | good point heh | 22:45 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, did it goes to the menu? | 22:45 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: and from the mac I only see browse and send file when looking at the N900 | 22:45 |
| Scummer | bluemaemo.. interesting app | 22:45 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: doesn't look like it | 22:46 |
| Scummer | gotta try that | 22:46 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, n900 right ? | 22:46 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: I only see Wait for connection, reconnect and establish connection | 22:46 |
| dreamer_ | fdv: isn't the exchange rate constanly changing though? | 22:46 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: correct | 22:46 |
| lardman | hmm, can't see where my lat/lon is uploaded | 22:46 |
| fdv | dreamer_: yeah, but if I have wifi access at the hotel, I can refresh the rates daily | 22:46 |
| fdv | and they don't change *that* much ;) | 22:47 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, well, after the "establish connection" it should go to the menu | 22:47 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, any error ? | 22:47 |
| dreamer_ | write a perl script ;) | 22:47 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: no error -- are there logs? | 22:47 |
| fdv | crossed my mind | 22:47 |
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| fdv | or just use the one I'm using at my pc | 22:47 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, after the pairing do you see a screen saying to connect to your pc ? | 22:47 |
| VDVsx | like it yes or no ? | 22:48 |
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| crashanddie | VDVsx: nope, after pairing it just returns to the wait for connection / reconnect /establish connection screen | 22:48 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: on the mac the device is registered as supporting Bluez HID mouse and keyboard though | 22:49 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, so you're already paired or the pairing failed | 22:49 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, try reconnect now | 22:49 |
| Stskeeps | mm, x11vnc and n900 is really a godsend | 22:49 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, GAN had success with his mac | 22:49 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: hmm, I'll with him then | 22:50 |
| crashanddie | see/ | 22:50 |
| crashanddie | now bluemaemo doesn't start anymore... :/ | 22:50 |
| DanielWm | mhh. let me ask again. i cant find the source package for the lirc package. where can i get that? | 22:50 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, he only removed the pairings and establish the connection | 22:50 |
| Scummer | keeps : openssh is the killerapp :) | 22:51 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, note that a pin code should be requested otherwise is there a existent pairing in one of the sides | 22:51 |
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| AbstractW | Maemo has caused this .net guy to start writing gtk code :P | 22:51 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, ?? | 22:52 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: I removed pairing from both sides; when I clicked "Establish connection" it started the pairing (I selected the mac from my N900). It then showed a PIN on both machines and asked me to confirm, I confirmed on both -- then BlueMaemo just showed the previous screen again | 22:52 |
| Scummer | hmm.. maybe not ssh.. but drnoksnes with wiicontrol is great for airplane rides :) | 22:52 |
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| DanielWm | i cant even find that package on repository.maemo.org/pool though i installed it from extras devel? | 22:53 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, never experienced that, strange, there's no code there to return to the previous screen for that stage o_0 | 22:53 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: I'm rebooting the N900, starting over | 22:54 |
| hrw | re | 22:54 |
| Scummer | daniel : lirc can be used as a receiver and transmitter? | 22:54 |
| DanielWm | transmitter | 22:54 |
| hrw | Scummer: working on getting irda on n900? | 22:54 |
| Stskeeps | Scummer: bring down a plane with that wiimote? | 22:54 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:54 |
| Scummer | ;) | 22:54 |
| pupnik_ | microsoft word 2003 refuses to open abiword documents because of some idiotic url abiword inserts | 22:54 |
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| Scummer | daniel : oh.. so universal remote control ? | 22:54 |
| DanielWm | working on controlling a mini rc helicoper with my n900 | 22:55 |
| DanielWm | it basicly works | 22:55 |
| SpeedEvil | DanielWm: with it in the pilot seat? | 22:55 |
| Scummer | hmm.. i could use that for my HTPC | 22:55 |
| DanielWm | lol really mini | 22:55 |
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| SpeedEvil | DanielWm: accellerometer + gps +cam + helicopter = win | 22:55 |
| pupnik_ | nice DanielWm | 22:55 |
| SpeedEvil | DanielWm: the IR ones? | 22:55 |
| pupnik_ | look at quadcopters | 22:56 |
| DanielWm | ir one yes | 22:56 |
| AndrewBlack | t.m.o says .desktop for image sets goes in .images is that right? | 22:56 |
| * SpeedEvil is currently doing a sillycopter. | 22:56 | |
| DanielWm | i can start it already | 22:56 |
| Gadgetoid | pupnik_ don't use word then? | 22:56 |
| SpeedEvil | (well - doing in the sense that it's in the middle of my stack above the orbital rocket) | 22:56 |
| SpeedEvil | vectored thrust climb optimised helicopter. | 22:56 |
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| SpeedEvil | 1-4Km altitude in 2 mins. | 22:57 |
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| DanielWm | the problem is i need the lirc source from the package used on the n900 | 22:57 |
| DanielWm | i believe i look at the wrong place | 22:57 |
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| DanielWm | but can't find the correct one | 22:57 |
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| Scummer | daniel: you've looked here: http://maemo.org/packages/view/lirc/ | 22:58 |
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| DanielWm | not yet. will do when home. walkinh and typing is not safe | 22:59 |
| Gadgetoid | stskeeps, x11vnc hangs for me :( | 22:59 |
| Stskeeps | Gadgetoid: it's supposed to | 22:59 |
| Stskeeps | connect to your n900 IP afterwards | 22:59 |
| AbstractW | hehe. | 22:59 |
| AbstractW | http://funroll-loops.info/ | 22:59 |
| Gadgetoid | i tried at work... will try again | 22:59 |
| odin_ | come back holmes! | 22:59 |
| Scummer | daniel : there is 0.8.4b for fremantle to be found | 22:59 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: there's an exception! | 22:59 |
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| crashanddie | ERROR:dbus.connection:Exception in handler for D-Bus signal... | 23:00 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, some someone messed with the deps :( | 23:00 |
| andre__ | some bug reports are weird... Does anybody else have undeletable contacts listed in his addressbook that he does not know? Or a wrong non-editable phone number under "My information"? ( https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6712 ) | 23:00 |
| povbot | Bug 6712: my information has some(wrongly and strange) predefined phone numbers | 23:00 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: no, it's because of the name of my computer! | 23:00 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, eehehhe | 23:01 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: self.part_text_set("label_name_, self.main.current_adapter_name + " ?") (file edje/edje.c_edje.c:10210) | 23:01 |
| woglinde | x11vnc reminds me to put qtnx in extras-testing for fremantle | 23:01 |
| SpeedEvil | andre: that's likely a per-network ID loaded on the SIM - for voicemail or price info | 23:01 |
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| VDVsx | crashanddie, lol | 23:01 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: UnicodeEncodeError: 'ascii' codec can't encode character u'\u2019' in position 17: ordinal not in range(128) | 23:01 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, so is really the name | 23:01 |
| VDVsx | OMG | 23:02 |
| andre__ | SpeedEvil, aha? how does that work? | 23:02 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: ahaha, it's because my computer is named "Sebastian Lauwers' macbook" | 23:02 |
| woglinde | crashanddie uauuaahahaha | 23:02 |
| SpeedEvil | andre: I've got some SIMs with numbers like 123 and stuff preprogrammed | 23:03 |
| woglinde | the evil space in hostname | 23:03 |
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| VDVsx | crashanddie, thanks for find this :), thats should be a problem with the edje lib ;) | 23:03 |
| andre__ | SpeedEvil, ah. thanks | 23:03 |
| pupnik_ | tested zeemote with snes last night. using the analog joystick as dpad doesnt feel right. it would be better suited as a mouse / pointer | 23:03 |
| Scummer | 123 is VM for t-mobile | 23:03 |
| Gadgetoid | works a treat stskeeps although i am vnced into my n900 from my n810 | 23:03 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, now change the name and try again :p | 23:03 |
| Gadgetoid | which has a weird key repeat rate bug | 23:03 |
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| andre__ | Gadgetoid, which one? I know of one bug report? | 23:04 |
| Gadgetoid | mmaakkiinngg iitt iimmppoossssiibbllee ttoo ttyyppee | 23:04 |
| Gadgetoid | andre__, when i try to type on my n900 via vnc from my n810 | 23:05 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, so it crash on start because of that too ? | 23:05 |
| Gadgetoid | iitt ddoeoess tthhiiss | 23:05 |
| VDVsx | *crashes | 23:05 |
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| crashanddie | VDVsx: works now | 23:06 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, that a big issue, because a lot of folks use ' in the PC name | 23:06 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: yup, basically the screen where it shows reconnect / establish connection never gets updated | 23:06 |
| crashanddie | no error is displayed or anything | 23:06 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: it's the default on macs | 23:06 |
| Gadgetoid | which is irritating becuase i would love to use my n900 from my n810.. i prefer the feel/keys of the latter | 23:07 |
| andre__ | Gadgetoid, that's a known bug, I also had it once here | 23:08 |
| Gadgetoid | the onscreen keyboard works well via vnc though | 23:09 |
| Scummer | hmm... tcpdump would be nice to have | 23:09 |
| andre__ | Gadgetoid: feel free to file a new bug report in bugs.maemo.org against Desktop platform > Input methods and set Alias field to int-140547 | 23:10 |
| woglinde | Scummer should be extras-devel or extras-testing | 23:10 |
| Scummer | *looking* | 23:10 |
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| Scummer | yep it is.. | 23:10 |
| woglinde | args | 23:11 |
| woglinde | cmake dont works in sdk+ | 23:11 |
| Scummer | that should make it easier to debug problems with vnc and such easier | 23:11 |
| woglinde | dman | 23:11 |
| woglinde | damn | 23:11 |
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| crashanddie | VDVsx: feature request: support portrait mode when using mouse :) | 23:11 |
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| Scummer | woglinde: but it seams not in the maemo5 testing-devel.. seems like it's for 4.1 triying to install the .deb and see what happens | 23:14 |
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| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, by the way, can you drop the confirmation step from the reconnect process? | 23:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | any news on fixing xchat segfault? | 23:17 |
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| SpeedEvil | I will give anyone that fixed xchat a whole apple. | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | hehe | 23:18 |
| Scummer | heh.. nice tcpdump works | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | so seems I need dualboot to install gdb to trace xchat | 23:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: why - it seems to install fine on phone | 23:20 |
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| SpeedEvil | (well - it's not finished instlaling yet admittedly) | 23:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yeah. but root at 93 percent | 23:20 |
| SpeedEvil | have you tried a reboot? | 23:21 |
| SpeedEvil | It seems to free up some usually for me. | 23:21 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | not yet | 23:21 |
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| SpeedEvil | And I know it shouldn't | 23:21 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | k. so dualboot postponed | 23:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | grrrr. really reluctant to nuke my uptime | 23:22 |
| * GeneralAntilles is official jetlagged. | 23:22 | |
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| Scummer | scrutinizer: why not install xchat in a dev environment and start debugging ? | 23:23 |
| SpeedEvil | oh - no debugging symbols in xchat | 23:23 |
| SpeedEvil | 0x410524b8 in raise () from /lib/libc.so.6 | 23:23 |
| SpeedEvil | 0x410524b8 <raise+68>:cmnr0, #4096; 0x1000 | 23:23 |
| SpeedEvil | is probably not very useful. | 23:23 |
| * RevdKathy soothes General Antilles jet-lagged brow | 23:23 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Scummer, that's the alternative. yes | 23:23 |
| Scummer | easier and faster too | 23:24 |
| RevdKathy | Goodnight all! | 23:25 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, there,s a whole lot on how to debug native to be found on wiki. speedred it ryesterday | 23:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: If the error happens with x86 too - sure | 23:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, I,m not suggesting to go x86 (yet) | 23:27 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 23:27 |
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| javispedro | so how many thousands of irc channels do I have to follow if I want news? | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | tbh have no clue | 23:27 |
| Xisdibik | javispedro: over 9000 | 23:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, all of 4. :P | 23:28 |
| Stskeeps | javispedro: #maemo is primary one, the other ones are probably side channels for intense discussion :P | 23:28 |
| Scummer | N900 ? | 23:28 |
| Scummer | :) | 23:28 |
| RST38h | depends on which news | 23:28 |
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| crashanddie | VDVsx: do you think it would be possible to do it the other way around? | 23:28 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: Simply building xchat with debug syms would be the easiest option I sispect | 23:28 |
| crashanddie | VDVsx: use HID to control the N900 from a laptop? | 23:28 |
| Scummer | speed: ACK | 23:29 |
| crashanddie | I concirr! | 23:29 |
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| crashanddie | sispucion is the mother of all evil! | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, sure | 23:29 |
| Scummer | crash : your u and i is swapped on your keyboard :) | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | or get xchat-debug? | 23:29 |
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| Scummer | daniel : ran into a lamp post or something while typing ? :) | 23:30 |
| SpeedEvil | no such package | 23:30 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | hi there folks | 23:30 |
| Sir_Lancelot | :) | 23:30 |
| javispedro | I am happy with "spinoffs" for specific topics -- maemo-qt, maemo-ui, etc. but maemo-devel... | 23:30 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, more like a Q than a advice? | 23:31 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 23:31 |
| Sir_Lancelot | where can I get xchat? | 23:31 |
| Sir_Lancelot | I could only find irssi | 23:31 |
| Scummer | lance: testing i think | 23:31 |
| SpeedEvil | apt-get install xchat | 23:31 |
| SpeedEvil | after configuring the extras-deviants repository | 23:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, dunno if gdb can use externally supplied symtabs | 23:31 |
| Xisdibik | deviants? | 23:31 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah - texting | 23:31 |
| Xisdibik | texting lol? | 23:31 |
| SpeedEvil | meh | 23:31 |
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| Scummer | hehe | 23:32 |
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| BernardV | Sir_Lancelot: Why would you need xhat if you have irssi? :) | 23:33 |
| Scummer | are there any german pay as you go sim cards with data for.. uhmm.. relatively cheap ? | 23:33 |
| pupnik_ | tschibo scummer | 23:33 |
| Scummer | pupnik : hmm.. ok | 23:33 |
| pupnik_ | i just researched | 23:33 |
| range | pupnik_: But aren't those data only? | 23:33 |
| Scummer | i need data and phone | 23:33 |
| pupnik_ | i asked in the store and they said d5@plus voice | 23:34 |
| pupnik_ | after calling their tech folks | 23:34 |
| Sir_Lancelot | because I didn't like much the interface of irssi, BernardV | 23:34 |
| Scummer | since i'm back at home for 2 weeks | 23:34 |
| pupnik_ | data plus voice | 23:34 |
| * mikhas is interested ... phone + umts, flat or prepaid | 23:34 | |
| Sir_Lancelot | is there a place also with a list of repository links? | 23:34 |
| SpeedEvil | I found the zoom buttons on xchat changes channels | 23:34 |
| SpeedEvil | this is probably documented somewhere | 23:34 |
| BernardV | If i'm correct the extra's repos is: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/install/extras-devel-fremantle.install | 23:35 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Scummer, I use O2 loop with internet-l 5GB/month | 23:35 |
| Scummer | 5GB/month is enough.. i'm only there for 2 weeks | 23:35 |
| range | pupnik_: Ah. The tariff details tells more :) | 23:35 |
| Scummer | *looking* | 23:35 |
| Xisdibik | see i want the same thing as that DocScrutinizer but in Japan :P | 23:36 |
| andre__ | whouah, http://repository.maemo.org/ needs an update. sigh. | 23:36 |
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| Scummer | has been a while since Tschibo only sold coffee ;) | 23:36 |
| range | Scummer: They still do that? >:) | 23:36 |
| Scummer | hehe | 23:36 |
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| pupnik_ | i wore through the paint on the raised nubs on the N900 "j" and "f" keys already | 23:37 |
| andre__ | Scummer: if you find out (assuming you refer to DE), please let me know too :-D | 23:38 |
| pupnik_ | need to wash grit off thumbtips | 23:38 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ooooh FSCK | 23:38 |
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| Scummer | andre: yeah.. .de | 23:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | pupnik_, that's annoyance to hear :-( | 23:39 |
| Scummer | so its tschibofonieren instead of telefonieren... how about onanieren ? man oh man | 23:39 |
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| zs | hi, I am trying to compile hello world example but no hildonmm package found, what is the name of package for it? | 23:40 |
| andre__ | Scummer, marketing guys on crack... | 23:40 |
| Scummer | no kidding | 23:40 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | pupnik_, I really hoped Nokiausea learnt from N810 | 23:40 |
| javispedro | hi pupnik_ ! | 23:40 |
| javispedro | pupnik_: have you tried drnoksnes after killing hildon-desktop? | 23:40 |
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| pupnik_ | no javispedro - speedups? | 23:42 |
| javispedro | pupnik_: _fscking speedup_ | 23:42 |
| javispedro | nearly doubled | 23:42 |
| javispedro | reaches full speed on mario kart | 23:42 |
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| Scummer | 24 cents per MB data | 23:43 |
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| Stskeeps | javispedro: and you did disable compositing? :P | 23:43 |
| javispedro | Stskeeps: I've still not done any real tests, ali1234 suggested that disabling compositing didn't get such an speedup | 23:44 |
| Xisdibik | javispedro: any 30 minutes today? :D | 23:44 |
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| ali1234 | disabling compositing via the WM hints has no effect on framerate, in my tests | 23:44 |
| Stskeeps | hm | 23:44 |
| Stskeeps | how about the key shortcut? | 23:44 |
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| pupnik_ | very interesting result javispedro. thanks on behalf of future games | 23:44 |
| ali1234 | it's possible i'm doing it wrong tho | 23:44 |
| ali1234 | what is the key shortcut? | 23:45 |
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| ali1234 | btw, i'm using SDL, so had to ask SDL for the X window references - so SDL could be broken | 23:45 |
| range | Scummer: That's still cheaper than data over SMS :) | 23:45 |
| javispedro | ah, that reminds me I need to check if sdl creates two x11 windows even in non fullscreen mode | 23:45 |
| Scummer | data over SMS... eeks.. | 23:45 |
| ali1234 | javispedro: yeah that's what i'm thinking too | 23:46 |
| ali1234 | although the window does behave differently when compositing is disabled. just no effect on framerate | 23:46 |
| javispedro | does it get drawn in the task switcher? | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | hmm. yes | 23:47 |
| javispedro | then it's composited. | 23:47 |
| mikhas | zs, libhildonmm et al | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | let me check that | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | yeah, confirmed | 23:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, you got a Flickr account? | 23:49 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: yep | 23:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, don't see it. | 23:50 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: I have a y! account iirc (javispedro) | 23:50 |
| javispedro | no photos on flickr though | 23:51 |
| javispedro | hmm I used to have... | 23:51 |
| javispedro | either way they were some ugly palmos apps screenshots, so ... nothing of value was lost. | 23:51 |
| ali1234 | hmm not even the transitions are disabled | 23:53 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | pupnik_, http://media.share.ovi.com/m1/st/1501/311a8277e576425991265eae09c303cd.jpg | 23:54 |
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| ali1234 | code: http://pastebin.com/m792aed26 | 23:56 |
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| javispedro | btw, eduroam PAP'rs. please test the nokia provided .deb package in the eduroam PAP bug. | 23:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | actually http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.mymedia/joerg900.10003 | 23:57 |
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| pupnik_ | hehe DocScrutinizer51 | 23:58 |
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| lbt | lcuk: ping | 23:59 |
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