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| ali1234 | timoph: lbt was quoting the report i linked, see http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2011/07/the-open-governance-index-measuring-openness-from-android-to-webkit/ | 01:24 |
|---|---|---|
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| ali1234 | you know, there's a big fat elephant missing from that report: ubuntu | 01:33 |
| ali1234 | just saying :) | 01:34 |
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| * thiago needs to fully read the report and reply to its author | 01:40 | |
| thiago | she interviewed me last year for it | 01:40 |
| thiago | I spent most of my time talking about open governance, open standards, open development | 01:41 |
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| ali1234 | apparently a project that requires full copyright assignment is "more" open than one that doesn't | 04:50 |
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| Termana | morning | 04:56 |
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| antman8969 | does anyone have a link to the page that lists what libs people have compiled? | 05:52 |
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| thirteenth | Hi all, I'm sorry to bother you, but I had some questions on Meego | 06:57 |
| wmarone | hmm | 07:08 |
| wmarone | probably have some answers | 07:08 |
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| sofar | thirteenth: go ask.... | 07:29 |
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| * TSCHAKeee pissed off that the US is not on the list to get the N9. | 08:03 | |
| thirteenth | WHAT!? | 08:04 |
| thirteenth | It's not!! | 08:04 |
| thirteenth | Grr | 08:04 |
| sofar | thirteenth: you had questions? | 08:04 |
| thirteenth | Sorry yeah | 08:05 |
| thirteenth | I just got back | 08:05 |
| thirteenth | Is there anyway I can play with Meego? I have an ARM WM/VIA8505 netbook, or an HTC Incredible. Now don't judge, but what I've read about Meego I really like, but it seems with those two platforms I couldn't really experiment much.. | 08:05 |
| thirteenth | The N9 looks like a cool phone too :/ | 08:06 |
| thirteenth | Wait, no, those are silly questions. | 08:06 |
| thirteenth | Sorry | 08:06 |
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| sofar | alright fess up | 08:13 |
| sofar | who took build.meego.com down? | 08:13 |
| sofar | arfoll: you again? | 08:13 |
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| dm8tbr | huomenta | 09:20 |
| dm8tbr | OW FOR F*... | 09:21 |
| * dm8tbr goes to check | 09:21 | |
| dm8tbr | core OBS is down | 09:22 |
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| dm8tbr | 02:27:10< forMeeGoBot> PROBLEM build.meego.com HTTP CRITICAL CRITICAL - Socket timeout after 10 seconds Sat Aug 6 02:26:20 UTC 2011 | 09:22 |
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| * dm8tbr commented bug 22134 | 09:33 | |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22134 maj, Undecided, ---, anas.nashif, NEW, Main meego obs down | 09:33 |
| vgrade | not again | 09:34 |
| dm8tbr | like I wrote in the bug: any given weekend | 09:35 |
| dm8tbr | it's like a real life satire version of 'ground hog day'. Every saturday you wake up and OBS is down. | 09:36 |
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| timoph | down again? | 10:08 |
| * timoph wonders if someone switches the power off when leaving work for the weekend | 10:09 | |
| andre__ | garrr... | 10:11 |
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| Vampir3 | hi every body | 10:24 |
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| Vampir3 | how i can have fedora 15 and meego together? | 10:24 |
| dm8tbr | timoph: I think 'apps' should be the _least_ worries of LF. Getting their *core* OBS in line should be top priority as it _enables_ the _business_ usage they are so longing for with MeeGo... | 10:25 |
| dm8tbr | Vampir3: which UX? | 10:25 |
| timoph | dm8tbr: yep | 10:25 |
| timoph | netbook 1.2 iirc | 10:26 |
| Vampir3 | what? | 10:27 |
| dm8tbr | Vampir3: are you trying to install the netbook edition? | 10:27 |
| Vampir3 | oops :-S yeah yeah | 10:27 |
| Vampir3 | i download it and install on USB Drive | 10:28 |
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| Vampir3 | now i'm chating from meego. now i want meego and fedora together | 10:28 |
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| dm8tbr | Vampir3: it should be possible to install it in parallel on free disk space | 10:28 |
| dm8tbr | Vampir3: the only thing you might need to do is adjust the boot loaders | 10:28 |
| Vampir3 | i'm not very profesional in boot setting, can you explain me more? :( | 10:29 |
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| reikalusikka | do you have more than 1 partition on the notebook | 10:31 |
| reikalusikka | HD*/SSD* | 10:32 |
| Alison_Chaiken | Vampir3, note that parted and its variant don't work with btrfs. Use ext* instead of btrfs with meego if you install Fedora first. | 10:32 |
| Alison_Chaiken | To resize btrfs partitions, you must use btrfs' own tools, as with lvm. | 10:32 |
| Vampir3 | my partitions is ext | 10:33 |
| Vampir3 | one point, i have window$ 7 on my netbook too | 10:33 |
| Alison_Chaiken | Some of the MeeGo installers stomp on other partitions no matter what you do. IIRC latest meego-ivi still does. | 10:33 |
| Alison_Chaiken | If MeeGo installer is ill-behaved, put MeeGo on first, then resize it using less buggy Fedora installer. | 10:34 |
| Alison_Chaiken | I'm triple-booting Windows something-or-other, MeeGo Tablet and MeeGo IVI on my ExoPC. | 10:35 |
| Alison_Chaiken | The Windows was a pre-install, natch. | 10:35 |
| reikalusikka | is the ExoPC a neat device? | 10:35 |
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| Vampir3 | i dont understand | 10:36 |
| Vampir3 | sory for questions :( | 10:38 |
| reikalusikka | I think he meant you should install Meego as the first OS on the device | 10:39 |
| Vampir3 | no no | 10:39 |
| Vampir3 | Look | 10:39 |
| Vampir3 | i have window$ anf fedora together, now i want meego to | 10:40 |
| reikalusikka | yeah | 10:40 |
| reikalusikka | as a third OS? | 10:40 |
| Vampir3 | yes | 10:40 |
| reikalusikka | well I understood from the earlier answers that you should format yout machine and install meego as the first OS | 10:41 |
| reikalusikka | your* | 10:41 |
| reikalusikka | after meego is installed you shouldn't have problems installing fedora and windows on the machine also | 10:41 |
| reikalusikka | but not sure about that, at least I had some problems with another OS making problems on my HD | 10:42 |
| reikalusikka | and I had to install them in a different order for it to work | 10:42 |
| reikalusikka | but don't act based only on my comment.. I could easily be wrong lol | 10:43 |
| Vampir3 | but i dont want format the machine and install the OS's ( and programs again) , this kill me install all programs again | 10:44 |
| Vampir3 | sory for my bad emglish | 10:45 |
| Vampir3 | english* | 10:46 |
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| Myrtti | there is a real chance that the meego installer may format your machine anyway, depending on which meego you would install | 10:47 |
| Alison_Chaiken | Vampir3 and reikalusikka, here's what I did recently: http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_IVI_on_ExoPC | 10:47 |
| Myrtti | if you want to play safe, try in a vm first | 10:47 |
| reikalusikka | Alison_Chaiken: awesome | 10:48 |
| Alison_Chaiken | I preserved pre-installed Windows and installed two MeeGos alongside. If you don't want Tablet and IVI (the two UXes I picked), your instructions will vary, and note that some MeeGo UXes (at least in past) will not install without overwriting the whole disk. | 10:49 |
| reikalusikka | I wish to get myself one of those but I first need to develope my skills and program a bit for the handheld I'm possibly getting | 10:49 |
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| dm8tbr | netbook has an sort of sane installer | 10:50 |
| dm8tbr | I think the only bit was the boot loader | 10:50 |
| Alison_Chaiken | Also note that when you reboot Windows, it may come up with a "disk corrupted" error or somesuch. *Ignore this warning.* If you let Windows run its disk-fixer, it will mark its partition as the only bootable one. | 10:51 |
| Alison_Chaiken | I have some other notes about triple-booting here: | 10:51 |
| Alison_Chaiken | http://wiki.meego.com/Installing_MeeGo_and_Handset_Images_on_ExoPC | 10:51 |
| Alison_Chaiken | although they are for MeeGo 1.1 and may be largely irrelevant now. | 10:51 |
| Alison_Chaiken | The other URL is for MeeGo 1.2 ISOs. | 10:52 |
| RzR | as someone a backup of win7 ? | 10:52 |
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| Alison_Chaiken | Yes, reikalusikka, +1 for the "different order." | 10:53 |
| dm8tbr | wrong channel? | 10:53 |
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| Alison_Chaiken | I've kept the Windows pre-install on all the devices I have, but I have never ever booted it except to see whether it still worked. | 10:53 |
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| Vampir3 | thank u guys | 10:54 |
| Alison_Chaiken | 1 AM here: off to bed. Plenty of time to ruin more expensive HW tomorrow. | 10:55 |
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| Vampir3 | i think i should work with meego on usb drive for now until i find a clearly steps for install it :) | 10:56 |
| Vampir3 | bBye | 10:57 |
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| * arfoll is proud his OBS release cycle must has been made official - http://twitpic.com/609oge | 11:09 | |
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| dm8tbr | arfoll: LOL | 11:15 |
| timoph | :D | 11:18 |
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| sivang | re all | 11:20 |
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| lbt | dm8tbr: I'm beginning to wonder if someone is taking the main OBS down at the weekend | 13:34 |
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| dm8tbr | lbt: did you see the twitter image? | 13:36 |
| dm8tbr | https://twitter.com/#!/tbr23/status/99776577478475776 | 13:36 |
| dm8tbr | someone posted it here | 13:37 |
| lbt | nrofl | 13:37 |
| arfoll | its the truth... | 13:39 |
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| arfoll | btw does anyone know how to configure twm to not need a mouse click to create a window? | 13:39 |
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| lbt | so is this the 4th weekend in a row? | 13:44 |
| arfoll | yup | 13:45 |
| pebcak | man twm? | 13:45 |
| lbt | has there been even a single response? | 13:45 |
| arfoll | i havent heard anything, except that anas may be on holiday | 13:45 |
| arfoll | pebcak, i didn't find anything that looked like it :-( | 13:46 |
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| pebcak | arfoll did you try UsePPosition | 13:52 |
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| arfoll | pebcak, makes no difference | 13:55 |
| arfoll | i also tried RandomPlacement but doesnt change either | 13:56 |
| arfoll | i set UsePPosition to "off" since the default in "on" | 13:56 |
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| arfoll | well i fixed my issue by switching to openbox... | 14:09 |
| pebcak | hehe | 14:11 |
| * pebcak is fvwmuser | 14:12 | |
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| arfoll | lbt, i'm not sure my image will make the bug taken seriously but at least it might make some smile :-) | 14:27 |
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| * dm8tbr presents http://isobsdown.bfst.de/ | 15:00 | |
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| dm8tbr | it reflects the state of build.meego.com as to http availability. driven by icinga, so a full state transition may take 10min or more from UP to DWON | 15:01 |
| GAN900 | That just figures | 15:04 |
| GAN900 | 3rd freaking USB port I've lost. | 15:04 |
| GAN900 | wrong channel. | 15:04 |
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| lcuk | timoph, if obs is down then making light sabres is tricky | 15:20 |
| lcuk | I can see obi wan sitting there clicking f5 | 15:21 |
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| * lcuk writes a paper on "Compiling MeeGo apps without scratchbox or OBS" | 15:32 | |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, | 15:34 |
| lcuk | would this be able to interface with your stuff: | 15:34 |
| lcuk | http://sandst1.wordpress.com/2011/08/06/funkeysynth-0-12-1-for-harmattan-available/ | 15:34 |
| lcuk | so a collection of meego devices could happily work together to produce awesome music | 15:35 |
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| lcuk | http://build.meego.com/package/files?package=xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx&project=MeeGo%3A1.2.0%3Anon-oss | 15:45 |
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| lcuk | lbt, timoph - you guys are good with obs, can you give me a hint how I would download this and work with it - I do not know the mechanism to merging the patches etc | 15:46 |
| lbt | branch it to your home in the c.obs | 15:47 |
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| lcuk | branching it does not extract the patches though | 15:47 |
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| lbt | osc branch MeeGo.com:MeeGo:1.2.0:non-oss xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx home:lcuk | 15:48 |
| lbt | frankly the correct solution is to find the git repo | 15:48 |
| lbt | but if you check the tarball into git | 15:48 |
| lbt | then apply each of the patches in order as commits | 15:49 |
| lbt | (quilt to git) | 15:49 |
| lbt | then you have a nice git repo checkout and any changes you make will be additional patches | 15:49 |
| lbt | so git to quilt to recreate them | 15:49 |
| lcuk | lbt, I had the same issue when I was creating .spec file for libliqbase | 15:50 |
| lcuk | I did not know how to make the patches rather than editing inside the .tar.gz | 15:50 |
| lcuk | infact, exactly the same when I was trying to fix bug 20099 | 15:52 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20099 nor, High, ---, geoff, ASSI, [CE] Calculator crashes after pressing any button and then "." . | 15:53 |
| lcuk | thanks for the command line to create a branch, I now have the fbdev package on my branch | 15:53 |
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| * lcuk would be further to fixing bug 13084 had I been able to complete this puzzle | 16:01 | |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, liquid, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink | 16:01 |
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| bulletxt | hi, does meego (netbook) have some sort of gksudo ? | 16:15 |
| bulletxt | I've noticed fuse module is not loaded by default from Meego and I have to find some good way from a UI to load it, any suggestions? Thanks in advance | 16:16 |
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| bulletxt | someone.. ? :) | 16:20 |
| lcuk | what is gksudo? | 16:21 |
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| bulletxt | a way to prompt for password inside an UI , like kdesudo or gksudo | 16:22 |
| bulletxt | my software needs to load fuse module since meego doesn't do it by default, what would be the best solution to get it loaded? | 16:26 |
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| bulletxt | will meego ever ship mplayer/mencoder? | 16:32 |
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| lcuk | bulletxt, yes. In 3.4 due for release in 2016 | 16:34 |
| lcuk | as for your sudo problem, not sure | 16:35 |
| lcuk | can you load the module as part of the init.d thingies? | 16:35 |
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| lcuk | lbt, there is no direct quilt file given with the patches on fbdev so that approach will not work | 16:44 |
| * lcuk pulls hair out | 16:44 | |
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| berndhs | lcuk: at least you have hair, think of poor Elop | 16:45 |
| lbt | lcuk: patch order is specified in .spec | 16:45 |
| lcuk | lbt, sure it is but that is not a direct working mechanism, how do people actually work on obs currently? | 16:46 |
| lcuk | or does everybody have this issue | 16:46 |
| maour | How can i compile Qt Apps for WeTab using MeeGo SDK ? as this page says "You can find all the official MeeGo SDK for native WeTab apps here" it should be possible ! anyone tried ? http://wetab.mobi/en/developers/downloads-and-howtos/ | 16:48 |
| lcuk | it does not help that searching google for "OBS" comes up with "jobs" as auto correction | 16:48 |
| maour | I don't want to use VM! i already have a WeTab device ! | 16:49 |
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| AWasisto | I'm wondering why N9's UI looks different from UI on Handset UX or Tablet UX? Is N9's MeeGo UI was made by Nokia? | 17:05 |
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| berndhs | AWasisto: it's a different UI, that's why it looks different | 17:06 |
| GAN900 | Yes. | 17:06 |
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| GAN900 | But UI is supposed to be one of the differentiation points. | 17:06 |
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| berndhs | Nokia wants their customers to know they spent their hard earned money on a Nokia product | 17:07 |
| Venemo | AWasisto, the N9's UI is based on the Handset UX. it only has some closed-source plugins | 17:09 |
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| AWasisto | Is it Open-Source? Can we port it to Handset UX? *I think Nokia won't open the source* | 17:12 |
| Venemo | as I said, it has closed-source plugins. | 17:12 |
| AWasisto | We should develop our UI ourselves... | 17:12 |
| Venemo | eg. swipe and their three homescreens are closed. | 17:12 |
| lcuk | swipe itself is not revolutionary, the n900 homescreens do it | 17:13 |
| GAN900 | Swipe should clearly be reimplemented. | 17:13 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, completely missing the point. | 17:13 |
| GAN900 | EVERY mobile platform does that. | 17:14 |
| lcuk | which point is that? | 17:14 |
| GAN900 | But they don't do it everywhere. | 17:14 |
| Venemo | lcuk, swipe to switch apps is what's revolutionary | 17:14 |
| GAN900 | Which is what's notable about swipe. | 17:14 |
| * lcuk shrugs | 17:14 | |
| berndhs | i don't know if "revolutionary" is really appropriate | 17:15 |
| AWasisto | N900 don't have swipe. It just have multiple homescreen. | 17:15 |
| GAN900 | berndhs, used it yet? | 17:15 |
| berndhs | lightbulbs were revoulutionary as opposed to candles | 17:15 |
| GAN900 | Revolutionary is probably a stretch, but it's awfully slick. | 17:15 |
| berndhs | swipe instead of buttons isn't revolutionary, unless you work for marketing :) | 17:16 |
| GAN900 | When you start trying to use a new UI concept on every other platform you use, well. | 17:16 |
| GAN900 | berndhs, wait until you have it in your hands. | 17:16 |
| berndhs | oh give me a break | 17:16 |
| GAN900 | and hand it off to people and watch their eyes light up. | 17:16 |
| berndhs | too much hype these days, kreeping into engineering talk as well | 17:18 |
| GAN900 | Meh | 17:19 |
| GAN900 | Use it first, then get back to me. | 17:19 |
| lcuk | GAN900, you complain you are not using it in #harmattan | 17:19 |
| berndhs | i get back to you when I feel like it, not when you say :) | 17:19 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, 'cause it doesn't do what I need it to do for daily use. | 17:20 |
| GAN900 | berndhs, relax, guy, nobody has honor on the line here. ;) | 17:20 |
| berndhs | GAN900: i dont like people telling me when i can talk and when i can't, I'm a big believer in free speech | 17:21 |
| berndhs | GAN900: and you in particular cannot tell me when to speak and when not to | 17:21 |
| arfoll | free speech != talk whenever you like | 17:21 |
| berndhs | arfoll: you can't either :) | 17:22 |
| * arfoll whitsles | 17:22 | |
| * arfoll can't spell | 17:22 | |
| berndhs | very melodic indeed | 17:23 |
| lcuk | https://build.pub.meego.com/search/search?search_text=ti-omap3-sgx-devel&commit=Search&project=1&package=1&name=1&title=1&description=1&attribute=&advanced=on | 17:23 |
| lcuk | Search results for "ti-omap3-sgx-devel" (0) | 17:23 |
| lcuk | Your search returned no results. | 17:23 |
| * lcuk gives up on obs for today | 17:23 | |
| GAN900 | berndhs, very melodramatic. | 17:23 |
| arfoll | lcuk, pkg name won't have -devel | 17:23 |
| berndhs | ah nevermind | 17:23 |
| GAN900 | It was merely a suggestion that using it in person may be a revealing and pleasant experience. | 17:24 |
| AWasisto | Which one is better for my N900? Handset UX? Or Tablet UX? I mean better for application testing. | 17:24 |
| lcuk | arfoll, Search results for "ti-omap3-sgx" (0) | 17:24 |
| lcuk | Your search returned no results. | 17:24 |
| berndhs | oh i am sure it is very pleasant and it is a very good user interface | 17:24 |
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| GAN900 | Not a pronouncement from on high to shackle you in the dungeons. | 17:24 |
| lcuk | thanks though | 17:24 |
| AWasisto | Or both is good? | 17:24 |
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| arfoll | lcuk, isn't it ti-omap3-gfx? | 17:24 |
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| berndhs | i just don't like marketing hype, so I call people on it in engineering channels | 17:25 |
| lcuk | arfoll, I have a clone of https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx&project=home%3Alcuk | 17:25 |
| lcuk | it says that it is unresolvable | 17:25 |
| berndhs | in marketing channels it is a different story | 17:25 |
| lcuk | since its unresolvable I searched for the package it said had the problem | 17:25 |
| * lcuk is really trying to advance and fix video rendering bug | 17:25 | |
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| arfoll | well problem is that the pkg has the wrong name in PkgBR | 17:26 |
| AWasisto | When is SDK for 64-bit System will be released? | 17:26 |
| lcuk | arfoll, how does the same package build on the main obs? | 17:26 |
| lcuk | since it is happily installed on my n900-ce | 17:26 |
| lcuk | ie, it is resolved | 17:27 |
| arfoll | lcuk, pkg fails on meego obs too | 17:27 |
| lcuk | huh/ | 17:27 |
| lcuk | ? | 17:27 |
| arfoll | lcuk, my bad was looking in trunk:non-oss | 17:28 |
| lcuk | trunk:non-oss might be what I need to add | 17:28 |
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| lcuk | but IDK how to do this, its all way over my head | 17:28 |
| arfoll | where did you clone from? | 17:28 |
| lcuk | osc branch MeeGo.com:MeeGo:1.2.0:non-oss xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx home:lcuk | 17:29 |
| arfoll | lcuk, you probably want to branch from devel:devices:n900 | 17:29 |
| lcuk | personally, I would rather ask somebody who understands how this all works to do it and fix the bug while they are at it ;) | 17:30 |
| arfoll | and you'll want to branch the ti-omap3-sgx pkg as well because it lives there | 17:30 |
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| lcuk | I don't think I have seen devel:devices:n900 anywhere on the cobs, let me see if I can find it. thanks | 17:32 |
| arfoll | its not, its on meego obs MeeGo.com:devel:devices:n900 | 17:32 |
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| lcuk | ahh yet more indirection, no wonder the web interface would not list them | 17:33 |
| arfoll | if you look on the web interface for meego.com it will actually tell you the pkg is managed in that dir | 17:34 |
| arfoll | when branching from meego obs its best to check on there first, then do the branch from where the pkg is actually managed | 17:34 |
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| lcuk | arfoll, thanks, I see the searching bringing back many results now \o/ | 17:35 |
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| lcuk | http://build.meego.com/search/search?search_text=ti-omap3-sgx&commit=Search&project=1&package=1&name=1&attribute=&advanced=on | 17:36 |
| arfoll | lcuk, no worries, working from c.obs for meego pkg is always a bit of a pain | 17:36 |
| lcuk | well I have to make sure any potential fix works first! | 17:36 |
| * lcuk would feel happier opening *.vbp :) | 17:37 | |
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| blauzahl_ | if i have to pull a file off a usb stick, and i forgot my external keyboard, (exopc) what is the best way to do this? | 17:55 |
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| anapospastos | anyone knows something about translating the meego of N9? will this project gonna help? https://meego.transifex.net/projects/p/meego/r/meego-1-2/ | 18:01 |
| thiago | no, the N9 doesn't use transifex | 18:01 |
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| anapospastos | do you know how it will be done? for N900 we had used transifex | 18:03 |
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| lcuk | blauzahl_, vkb? | 18:04 |
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| CosmoHill | retarded laptop. I typed in my password wrong once to many and it went to sleep | 18:06 |
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| lcuk | CosmoHill, nothing new there | 18:08 |
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| lcuk | computers only do as we tell them | 18:08 |
| CosmoHill | from the screen saver | 18:08 |
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| berndhs | some screen saver designs are peculiar indeed | 18:09 |
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| mase76 | hi! | 18:12 |
| mase76 | anybody can help with powervr? | 18:13 |
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| mase76 | could there be a problem with powervr and xorg 1.10? | 18:16 |
| blauzahl_ | lcuk: can you do that in the xterm? i don't think i get that in the meego version i have installed | 18:16 |
| lcuk | blauzahl_, not sure, I thought wetab had one? | 18:16 |
| lcuk | err exopc rather | 18:16 |
| blauzahl_ | not in this version anyway, afaikt. | 18:18 |
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| berndhs | blauzahl_: ssh into the meego machine | 18:19 |
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| mase76 | no pvr experts here? | 18:21 |
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| dm8tbr | mase76: unless you manage to state your problem in a more meaningful way nobody will care | 18:31 |
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| mase76 | i installed debian sid on the n900. i copied the closed libs from meego to it. also i use its kernel. the modules pvrsrvkm and omaplfb were loaded. pvrsrvinit was run. however x does not start in accelerated mode. | 18:33 |
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| dm8tbr | a) this is not a meego problem | 18:34 |
| dm8tbr | b) you would have more chances on #meego-arm if at all, but carsten seems not to be online this weekend | 18:35 |
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| mase76 | i did not say, that it is a meego problem. i only asked for some help. | 18:35 |
| berndhs | debian on n900 adding unusual non-debian stuff sounds like a low percentage shot | 18:36 |
| ShadowJK | Isn't debian compiled for armv5, and Meego for armv7 hardfp? | 18:36 |
| Clint | debian armhf is coming | 18:37 |
| ShadowJK | If you copy closed hardfp libs onto softp system, it wont work, right? | 18:38 |
| Clint | you can use both, just not together | 18:38 |
| lcuk | I thought it was only where fp calls were made? | 18:38 |
| dm8tbr | ShadowJK: extremely unlikely | 18:38 |
| mase76 | at least the kernel runs. | 18:38 |
| dm8tbr | kernel can be compiled however you want | 18:39 |
| ShadowJK | kernel doesn't have floating point ;p | 18:39 |
| dm8tbr | kernel and userpsace don't pass FP | 18:39 |
| mase76 | and 2d pvr also works. | 18:39 |
| dm8tbr | mase76: basically you'll want to find the _old_ SGX blobs that were compiled for armv7l | 18:40 |
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| lcuk | if I want to launch a new gui app from within an existing one | 19:07 |
| lcuk | how would I go about this? | 19:07 |
| lcuk | (in maemo there was an osso command for it) | 19:07 |
| lcuk | ( osso_rpc_async_run ) | 19:08 |
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| berndhs | QProcess should work, shouldn't it ? | 19:10 |
| berndhs | ot just int system (const char *command) | 19:11 |
| lcuk | berndhs, ta, will try later \o | 19:12 |
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| lcuk | Sage, what apps do you use with your wacom? | 21:46 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: yeah, funkeysynth would probably work fine (through pulseaudio) | 22:25 |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, funkeysynth works really well, except for the playing music part | 22:30 |
| lofty306 | what? no output? | 22:31 |
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| lcuk | lofty306, nope | 22:34 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: hee hee. :-( | 22:47 |
| lcuk | did I hear about an intel os somewhere or other last couple of days? | 22:49 |
| lcuk | http://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/parallax-parallel-computing/?cid=sw:social_software_om | 22:50 |
| lcuk | ahh | 22:50 |
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| berndhs | there is hope for connman and ipv6 http://connman.net/blogs/sameo/2011/connman-076 | 23:14 |
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| berndhs | for the log record :) | 23:15 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, nice | 23:19 |
| lcuk | ad-hoc networking is one of the other limitation | 23:19 |
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| berndhs | actually now that you mention it, ad-hoc would be really valuable for the marine stuff | 23:20 |
| berndhs | networking to other boats/ships close by | 23:20 |
| arfoll | berndhs, what information would you give that isn't provided by AIS? | 23:20 |
| berndhs | don't know if that's at the level of these devices though | 23:20 |
| berndhs | AIS ? in what context ? | 23:21 |
| arfoll | well ships communicating over wifi to do what? | 23:21 |
| berndhs | to cooperate, like avoid collisions | 23:21 |
| berndhs | in cases where satellite links are slow | 23:22 |
| arfoll | AIS allready does that, wifi would be not be terribly good at that | 23:22 |
| berndhs | or other small fleet stuff | 23:22 |
| berndhs | similar to talking on radio, jsut chat | 23:22 |
| arfoll | in my mind adhoc would be nice on small boats to remove infrastructure for people connecting mobile devices to their boat | 23:23 |
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| arfoll | on larger boats there would allready be wifi | 23:23 |
| lcuk | i would suggest collaborative sonar for fishing vessels | 23:23 |
| arfoll | lcuk, because fisherman are the most cooperative guys ;-) | 23:23 |
| berndhs | yes for fairly small boats that cooperate fairly locally | 23:24 |
| arfoll | lol usually fisherman turn off AIS and all comms when finishing so that other boats dont see where they are fishing and copy | 23:24 |
| berndhs | normal wifi is too short range, but that's mainly an issue of antennas I think | 23:24 |
| arfoll | yes but they allready have comm radios on all their ships with v.good range | 23:24 |
| berndhs | chat is better than talk radio | 23:25 |
| berndhs | and exchange of simple data | 23:25 |
| berndhs | any given weekend, there must be hundreds of races in the world | 23:25 |
| berndhs | thousands of parties to coordinate | 23:26 |
| berndhs | consumer stuff | 23:26 |
| arfoll | and they all have a VHF due to regulations | 23:26 |
| berndhs | yes but still, text chat is better than talk for many purposes | 23:26 |
| arfoll | can't organise a race and force everyone to have a directional wifi antenna | 23:26 |
| arfoll | text chat in a race would be useless, can't maintain sails, navigate and type at the same time ;-) | 23:26 |
| arfoll | voice is the only way | 23:27 |
| berndhs | i don't think so | 23:27 |
| berndhs | the NATO planes bombing Libya communicate with AWACs by IRC | 23:27 |
| berndhs | at least some of them | 23:27 |
| arfoll | yeah planes, they dont wear gloves, have splashing water and usually handled by a very small team of guys without a dedicated comm team ;-) | 23:28 |
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| berndhs | you need 1 person that can read, and 1 person that can type | 23:28 |
| berndhs | if that's a dedicated comm team... | 23:28 |
| Bostik | bwah | 23:28 |
| arfoll | even on the big racing yachts there arent 2 spare guys for that | 23:28 |
| berndhs | you need 0.1 spare guy maybe | 23:28 |
| berndhs | people already read all kinds of stuff during a race | 23:29 |
| berndhs | use large fonts :) | 23:29 |
| arfoll | and what kind of keyboard? | 23:29 |
| berndhs | water resistant | 23:30 |
| arfoll | on a AWACs they can fit a whole desktop PC with a keyboard and CRT monitor | 23:30 |
| arfoll | and a chair for the guy sitting at it | 23:30 |
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| berndhs | you velcro a tablet to someplace vertical | 23:30 |
| arfoll | actually i've done that, its nearly impossible to type as the ship moves too much. when on anchor it's ok | 23:31 |
| arfoll | mind you this was a wetab not exactly the nicest touchscreen ever | 23:32 |
| berndhs | right, that's why they will need my new-fangled outdoor UI :) | 23:32 |
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| arfoll | outdoor? i've only seen real nasty touchscreens that can wistand marine water | 23:32 |
| berndhs | for stuff that moves on you, and for people with bad coordination | 23:33 |
| arfoll | sounds like a UI for me | 23:33 |
| Bostik | touchscreen that can hold against marine conditions? | 23:34 |
| arfoll | Bostik, yeah you know any? | 23:34 |
| Bostik | I would love the see specs for that | 23:34 |
| arfoll | raymarine do some touschreen stuff but its real nasty | 23:34 |
| berndhs | all kinds of electronic hold up in marine conditions | 23:35 |
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| berndhs | but you can't rely on intricate millimeter accurate gestures | 23:35 |
| arfoll | definitly no capacitive screens | 23:35 |
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| Bostik | combination of constant splashy humidity with occasional freezing AND salt sounds like possibly the most hostile environment to electronics.. | 23:35 |
| berndhs | there already are plenty of electronics that cope with that | 23:36 |
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| Bostik | goodness | 23:36 |
| berndhs | and very little recreational boating takes place in freezing conditions | 23:36 |
| arfoll | berndhs, they do freeze at port | 23:37 |
| lcuk | really? | 23:37 |
| lcuk | finland have immense boating community | 23:37 |
| berndhs | so you take the tablet with you | 23:37 |
| lcuk | england too | 23:37 |
| arfoll | berndhs, and your plotter? | 23:37 |
| berndhs | I'm talking about the UI, not plotters | 23:37 |
| arfoll | well you cant hang your tablet outside the boat, so its no fun | 23:38 |
| berndhs | there are lots of recreational sailors where it freezes, but they don't sail in the winter | 23:38 |
| berndhs | actually I think one big problem is reading displays in bright sunlight | 23:39 |
| Bostik | in scandic region they sail well into the time when it can freeze for a while at nght | 23:39 |
| Bostik | not too gladly, but they apparently do.. | 23:39 |
| lcuk | so what apps do you need where internet is spotty, weather is changeable and the only thing you can probably get really clear signal from is gps? | 23:39 |
| arfoll | but i think berndhs is talking about a tablet that you can keep inside the boat and take out at night etc... | 23:39 |
| berndhs | right, mobile stuff | 23:39 |
| Bostik | (I know of one) | 23:39 |
| lcuk | calendar | 23:40 |
| arfoll | lcuk, you get VHF and AIS too and sometimes sattelite internet. Not so isolated. | 23:40 |
| Bostik | lcuk: email | 23:40 |
| berndhs | and the point of my project is that the current mobile UIs are not right for this type of use | 23:40 |
| lcuk | arfoll, conceptual question | 23:40 |
| lcuk | thinking in terms of boating is practical | 23:40 |
| lcuk | because in peoples minds it is distant | 23:40 |
| lcuk | and use cases would be different | 23:40 |
| lcuk | but equally good apps will work in your lounge | 23:40 |
| berndhs | actually that is another point, some people will use the "outdoor" UI on their sofas | 23:41 |
| lcuk | charter vessels need contisgnment and hold details | 23:41 |
| Bostik | and most importantly, IMAP email - since you get a listing of subjects as opposec to whole spammed-into-oblivion mailbox | 23:41 |
| lcuk | consignment | 23:42 |
| berndhs | many people buy off-road capable cars, practically none of them ever drive off road | 23:42 |
| lcuk | indeed berndhs | 23:42 |
| arfoll | berndhs, yeah but eveyryone that buys a boat puts it in water ;-) | 23:42 |
| * arfoll hopes anyways | 23:42 | |
| Bostik | I'm told satellite phone data is obscenely priced | 23:42 |
| lcuk | i maintain that good apps must work in supermarkets without gps or phone systems | 23:42 |
| berndhs | they put their boats in water, but 80% of them never leave the dock | 23:42 |
| arfoll | berndhs, oh definately true. isn't it the average leisure boat is used 5 days a year? | 23:43 |
| lcuk | consignment tracking and linking with port systems and mapping would be good | 23:43 |
| lcuk | this cargo, that port, this route etc | 23:43 |
| berndhs | its like people who have caravan trailers and RVs parked in the same spot for years | 23:44 |
| lcuk | consignments can equally be tourists | 23:44 |
| lcuk | and the app relating to boat information | 23:44 |
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| berndhs | actually charter boats would be a good market for the marine stuff | 23:44 |
| lcuk | "on this ship you are sailing, there are ...." e-guides | 23:44 |
| lcuk | one of my mates is captain of a charter yacht | 23:45 |
| berndhs | of course charter boats are notoriously under-crewed wit shady individuals :) | 23:45 |
| arfoll | you need music and music control for the parties ;-) | 23:45 |
| berndhs | ok except for your mate there | 23:45 |
| lcuk | scaleable and depending on many factors berndhs | 23:45 |
| berndhs | right you need resource management for the parties | 23:45 |
| lcuk | i think the marine e-guide would make for a good start | 23:46 |
| berndhs | beer cans and empties need to be managed | 23:46 |
| lcuk | one about each vessel | 23:46 |
| lcuk | berndhs, waste in general | 23:46 |
| arfoll | i wasn't thinking beer management but sure | 23:46 |
| lcuk | i was talking to a mate in the council about recycling berndhs - that app would count on land | 23:46 |
| berndhs | beer, champagne, lobsters,... | 23:46 |
| arfoll | still not my train of thought ;-) | 23:47 |
| lcuk | so we just scoped out a complete hotel management system | 23:47 |
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| berndhs | well, charter boats are little hotels | 23:47 |
| lcuk | sure | 23:47 |
| lcuk | so we get onto radisson blu and see whether they want linking with yachts ;) | 23:47 |
| berndhs | and the same stuff applies for homes, except on boats the system boundaries are better defined, and the resources | 23:48 |
| lcuk | so when vessels come to port they have nearest hotels already planned ;) | 23:48 |
| lcuk | I should bagsie this first: IIS Management system. | 23:48 |
| lcuk | MeeGo in space! | 23:48 |
| lcuk | ISS even | 23:48 |
| berndhs | even better definition of system boundaries :) | 23:49 |
| arfoll | meego+critical systems... NO! | 23:49 |
| berndhs | probably not at this point, no | 23:49 |
| lcuk | arfoll, could be part of a combined system, we should make the app in different oses to be sure ;) | 23:49 |
| lcuk | who will do the windows port? | 23:50 |
| arfoll | ahaha | 23:50 |
| berndhs | you can only use windows in port, not at sea | 23:50 |
| arfoll | plugged in the generator | 23:50 |
| lcuk | ships don't have Windows. they run Portholes 98 | 23:51 |
| berndhs | even portholes are bad news, potential leaks if not secured properly | 23:51 |
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| lcuk | http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGoVerse | 23:54 |
| lcuk | texrat just reminded about the meegoverse | 23:54 |
| lcuk | http://tabulacrypticum.wordpress.com/2011/07/29/achievement-badges-not-just-for-gamers/ | 23:55 |
| berndhs | there should be an award for the worst pun of the month | 23:55 |
| lcuk | berndhs, add it | 23:55 |
| lcuk | give it a great name | 23:55 |
| berndhs | I forget the name of the Callahan customers | 23:56 |
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| *** CosmoHill has joined #meego | 23:59 | |
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