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| Sage | lcuk: ok. I htink the right person is the calc devels as those are the people that should integrate your patch anyway. | 00:00 |
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| seif | any1 have an idea how to disable aegis? | 00:01 |
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| Elleo | seif: currently no one seems to know how, except with an R&D certificate that we don't have (or possibly by installing your own kernel) | 00:05 |
| Elleo | seif: it is possible to get it to relax a little though I believe | 00:05 |
| Elleo | with the aegis-developer-tool --relax-exec (only works for the devel user, not for root though iirc) | 00:05 |
| seif | Elleo, that would be great | 00:06 |
| seif | because i have a demo here that requires me to get permission from aegis | 00:06 |
| seif | and while developing and testing its just a pita | 00:06 |
| Elleo | http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3827 <-- has the details | 00:07 |
| Elleo | otherwise when you build a deb with obs or the harmattan scratchbox it gives that binary permission in aegis, which is another way to go | 00:07 |
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| vgrade | ok,build from may, still no mouse cursor, just doing a 1.2.0.90 build from last week. I'm thinking this is a intel vs arm thing | 00:11 |
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| andyross | vgrade: seems unlikley, it's just an Xorg argument. No device-specific code involved. | 00:19 |
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| Elleo | seif: I think I've got the package into a state where it should build against harmattan without needing anything extra, however OBS seems to be a bit broken at the moment, nothing seems to be getting sent to build so it probably won't actually get built until someone gives it a kick ;) | 01:25 |
| Elleo | seif: but you can keep track of its progress on https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=geoclue&project=home%3Aelleo | 01:25 |
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| Elleo | seif: ignore the current "finished" status though, that's lieing and just gives an rpc timeout when actually trying to get build info | 01:26 |
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| seif | Elleo, awesome thanks | 01:28 |
| Elleo | no worries :) | 01:28 |
| Elleo | you don't need the skyhook provider do you? | 01:28 |
| Elleo | I had to disable that one to avoid pulling in libsoup-gnome (which in turn needs a stack of other things) | 01:29 |
| lbt | seif: did you want your account enabling | 01:29 |
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| vgrade | http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/libmeegotouch/src/corelib/core/mcomponentdata.cpp#192 | 01:34 |
| lbt | night all | 01:35 |
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| TSCHAKeee | am I hallucinating | 01:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | or does the N950 not have a MicroSD slot? | 01:54 |
| CosmoHill | TSCHAKeee: is it under the battery? | 01:57 |
| TSCHAKeee | no, there is no microSD slot, bummer | 01:57 |
| TSCHAKeee | no, battery is sealed. | 01:57 |
| CosmoHill | oh | 01:57 |
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| CosmoHill | sounds iphone ish :/ | 01:57 |
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| CosmoHill | cyas | 02:14 |
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| Damion3 | anyone awake and know anything about the n950 going in to a reboot loop? | 03:03 |
| ali1234 | what did you do? | 03:07 |
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| Damion3 | nothing | 03:10 |
| Damion3 | the terminal app wouldn't start a terminal but other apps started | 03:10 |
| Damion3 | so I turned it off and on again and now it just reboots until it gives up after about 20 times | 03:10 |
| ali1234 | well this is what i would do | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | get the flasher utility | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | enable all the fancy r&d/debug stuff | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | disable the watchdogs | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | and see if you can see what is happening | 03:11 |
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| Damion3 | yeah I was just looking for the flash util | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | but ultimately you're probably going to have to just reflash it | 03:11 |
| Damion3 | is it the same as with the n900 ? I can't find much about the n950 | 03:11 |
| ali1234 | i think so | 03:12 |
| ali1234 | i don't have one | 03:12 |
| ali1234 | but the flasher util has all the same args | 03:12 |
| Damion3 | do you know where I get the flasher binary? | 03:13 |
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| Damion3 | I'm skimming http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 03:14 |
| ali1234 | not sure | 03:14 |
| ali1234 | it is included with the firmware files | 03:14 |
| ali1234 | the one that you shownload and run and it self extracts | 03:14 |
| Damion3 | I've found an n950 flasher .deb on tablets-dev.nokia.com | 03:15 |
| ali1234 | http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N950 | 03:15 |
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| Damion3 | well it's responding to flasher commands | 03:26 |
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| Damion3 | disabling r&d mode didn't help so far | 03:27 |
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| Damion3 | I need images | 03:30 |
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| Damion3 | ali1234: oh, you wrote the lzo decompressor | 03:35 |
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| ali1234 | yeah, that was me | 03:43 |
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| Damion3 | I have backups of almost everything but really annoyingly don't have a backup of a number of phone contacts I added in the past fortnight | 03:50 |
| Damion3 | my phone bill will help slightly, but I might have to call people at random to confirm who they are ;) | 03:51 |
| * Damion3 reluctantly goes back to the n900 | 03:51 | |
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| berndhs | "error copying timezone info", of all the reasons mic-image-create could fail | 03:59 |
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| sosborn | Anyone know why I would be getting "Running non-meego graphics system enabled MeeGo touch, forcing native graphicssystem" | 08:45 |
| sosborn | I'm going through http://apidocs.meego.com/git-tip/mtf-old/mtf/tutorial.html | 08:46 |
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| smoku | X-Fade, ping. | 08:55 |
| smoku | https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=hildon-theme-marina&project=home%3Asmoku%3Acordia is stuck in 'building' for hours, and block my repository form being published. | 08:55 |
| Stskeeps | can't you osc abortbuild? | 08:56 |
| smoku | oh. I tried aborting with the web ui, but forgot about abortbuild | 08:57 |
| Stskeeps | if that fails, then yeah, admins can help :P | 08:57 |
| smoku | 'finished' | 08:58 |
| smoku | thanks :) | 08:58 |
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| Termana | morning | 09:15 |
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| Alison_Chaiken | morning Termana. | 09:25 |
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| arfoll | X-Fade, lbt, is c.obs publisher working? | 09:30 |
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| iekku | morning | 10:08 |
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| djszapi_ | lbt: What is this "rpc" timeout about on the Community OBS ? What activity is inactive why it happens ? It is odd because it happens only with one package of the many. | 10:17 |
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| dm8tbr | djszapi_: IIRC he said yesterday it was some OBS issue or some other OBS not responding | 10:23 |
| djszapi_ | sure, it is OBS issue, something is not responding, but my question is what. It needs investigation and we need to solve it. We need to proceed ;-) | 10:24 |
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| Summeli | does anyone here know how to disable swipe in fullscreen game with N950? | 10:28 |
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| dm8tbr | Summeli: #harmattan might know more | 10:31 |
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| Ans5i | Summeli: did you try installing eventFilter? | 10:33 |
| Ans5i | hm. probably not help though | 10:33 |
| Summeli | Ans5i: yeah, no luck with that one | 10:33 |
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| Summeli | dm8tbr: thanks, I'll try harmattan too :) | 10:34 |
| Summeli | that's pretty much the last thing that I'm currently missing :P | 10:34 |
| Ans5i | might be difficult to configure | 10:34 |
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| Summeli | it's documented in UI guidlines, so it should be possible somehow :) http://www.developer.nokia.com/swipe/ux/pages/Full_Screen.html | 10:36 |
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| Ans5i | Summeli: ok. i am reading where that is meantioned http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3607 | 10:39 |
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| Ans5i | Summeli: http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/N9DevelopmentTipsAndTricks#Disabling_the_Swipe | 10:43 |
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| Summeli | Ans5i: I had no luck with that XWindow flag :( | 10:45 |
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| Ans5i | Summeli: mdeclarativescreen should have/will have method, it | 10:50 |
| Ans5i | it's just integrated 19 days ago | 10:50 |
| Ans5i | *merged | 10:51 |
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| Summeli | ok, maybe I don't have that stuff on my FW yet.. :) | 10:53 |
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| wonmin82 | hi | 10:58 |
| wonmin82 | hi | 10:59 |
| Stskeeps | hi | 10:59 |
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| Stskeeps | how can we help you, wonmin82? | 11:00 |
| wonmin82 | oh, thank you | 11:00 |
| tonberry_ | hi stskeeps, u got it already? | 11:00 |
| wonmin82 | I have a question. | 11:00 |
| Stskeeps | tonberry_: got what? | 11:00 |
| tonberry_ | harmattan | 11:01 |
| Stskeeps | tonberry_: i have a n950 yes | 11:01 |
| tonberry_ | when u got it? have u tried the browser? | 11:01 |
| Stskeeps | tonberry_: 5 days ago and browser is fine, but think there's fixes in later firmware | 11:01 |
| Stskeeps | wonmin82: feel free to ask - you don't need to ask to ask :) | 11:02 |
| tonberry_ | i cant download mp3 from the browser itself | 11:02 |
| tonberry_ | lol | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | tonberry_: probably a better discussion for #harmattan | 11:02 |
| wonmin82 | I want to use TFT LCD Monitor which has the RGB interface on my Northville board(which has ST micron IOH), and I want to use dual(LVDS and VGA) display environment on Northville board. How can I acquire appropriate xorg.conf? I have worked in several days, but little progress T.T. | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | which GMA is that? | 11:04 |
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| Stskeeps | ie, the gpu it uses | 11:04 |
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| wonmin82 | hmm. | 11:04 |
| wonmin82 | It's Intel Automotive reference board, please wait, i'll find it | 11:04 |
| wonmin82 | its CPU is Intel Atom E6xx series, and i think no external GPU | 11:06 |
| vgrade | lbt, xfade, can you kick armv8el | 11:06 |
| wonmin82 | but I know it is operated by MeeGo IVI 1.2 and Intel EMGD driver | 11:06 |
| lbt | vgrade: will look - on call | 11:06 |
| sebas | Hey :) | 11:07 |
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| Stskeeps | wonmin82: you might have luck looking in the documentation for emgd then, or talk on the support forums for emgd | 11:07 |
| sebas | I'm playing around with the n950, trying to get a package installed, but I'm struggling with the device's security | 11:07 |
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| Stskeeps | sebas: #harmattan might be good for that as it's a vendor specific problem | 11:07 |
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| tonberry_ | oh.. my group already create the meego page for my region, can meego.com link the page? | 11:07 |
| sebas | Stskeeps: good call, thanks | 11:07 |
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| Venemo_N950 | good morning meegoists | 11:30 |
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| meivi_ | hello? | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | hi | 11:33 |
| meivi_ | =D | 11:34 |
| meivi_ | wanna ask | 11:34 |
| meivi_ | is there support for VLC on meego ivi? | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | well you can build it for it | 11:34 |
| meivi_ | um, i found a guide for the netbook version but apparently it doesnt work on ivi | 11:35 |
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| meivi_ | um, am i suppose to dl the source code and work from there? | 11:36 |
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| meivi_ | ..hello? | 11:38 |
| Stskeeps | pretty much | 11:39 |
| meivi_ | x_x | 11:39 |
| Stskeeps | or find a place that already built vlc | 11:40 |
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| djszapi | lbt: rulez! no rpc timeout anymore (I have not changed anything) :) | 11:41 |
| meivi_ | i searched for VLC for meego IVI.. nothing. | 11:41 |
| arfoll | meivi_, why vlc exactly? GStreamer is the prefered media architecture for MeeGo | 11:41 |
| meivi_ | coz my boss said so >_< | 11:42 |
| meivi_ | i already done gstreamer | 11:42 |
| arfoll | meivi_, and does your boss now ffmpeg's special legal status? | 11:42 |
| arfoll | s/now/know | 11:42 |
| meivi_ | i dont know =L | 11:43 |
| meivi_ | im an intern, i dun get briefed much.. >_< | 11:43 |
| meivi_ | they are buzy juggling other projects i guess | 11:44 |
| arfoll | meivi_, since you are at intel I'll advise you that building any ffmpeg projects on build.meego.com will get that project deleted (I would know...) | 11:44 |
| meivi_ | that obvious? o_0 | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | heh, good to see that rules are enforced ;) | 11:45 |
| meivi_ | I'll check with my supervisor then | 11:47 |
| meivi_ | =D thanks | 11:47 |
| meivi_ | owh, my proxy is listed... | 11:50 |
| arfoll | meivi_, ;-) i'm not a mind reader... | 11:50 |
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| iekku | A Nokia N950 is waiting for you \o/ | 12:06 |
| meivi_ | For free? =D | 12:06 |
| iekku | not really, i will work for it :P | 12:07 |
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| Damion3 | I've not heard anything since my email | 12:08 |
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| balor | Is this meego in the Audi A7 http://www.broadsheet.ie/2011/07/19/heads-up-audi/ ? | 12:12 |
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| dm8tbr | the laptop UI looks MeeGoIsh | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | indeed it does | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | or mac-ish :P | 12:13 |
| dm8tbr | the IVI screen though features a suspicious little fecker and a google logo | 12:13 |
| dm8tbr | ah, yes could also be. prolly an fruitpad | 12:14 |
| balor | no, it's an iPad | 12:14 |
| balor | source http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/16/2012-audi-a7-features_n_900788.html#s310140&title=InVehicle_WiFi_For | 12:14 |
| balor | :( | 12:14 |
| dm8tbr | fruitpad, just what I said | 12:14 |
| meivi_ | ...isnt "msg suppose to start a private chat? | 12:15 |
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| dm8tbr | /msg meivi_ foo bar | that would send 'foo bar' to a private chat window of meivi_ | 12:16 |
| meivi_ | no it didnt =P | 12:17 |
| dm8tbr | *shrug* | 12:17 |
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| meivi_ | isnt it dangerous to have an IVI.. | 12:19 |
| meivi_ | woa, is that AR? | 12:19 |
| balor | It's a heads up | 12:19 |
| arfoll | usually those damned IVI won't play video or do anything good while actually driving | 12:20 |
| arfoll | also you get these cool screens that display something different to the driver and passenger - just to make sure driving is still boring | 12:20 |
| balor | What humanity needs is a pr0n feed whilst piloting 1 tonne of metal at 60 mph | 12:20 |
| meivi_ | why not.. the plane usually fly itself | 12:21 |
| arfoll | you got a 1 ton plane that only goes 60 mph? | 12:21 |
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| meivi_ | lol | 12:21 |
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| smoku | with radar guided cruise control it's almost true ;-) | 12:28 |
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| arfoll | lbt, OBS is still being weird looks like store-vlan60.pub.in.meego.com is not playing nice? | 12:48 |
| lbt | what makes you say that? | 12:48 |
| arfoll | https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=i586&package=satsolver&project=home%3Aearthling%3Ameego-tools&repository=Fedora_15 | 12:48 |
| lbt | ta | 12:48 |
| arfoll | is that what's blocking all the builds? | 12:49 |
| lbt | is that happening right now ? | 12:50 |
| arfoll | i have 15 packages as 'scheduled' in home:arfoll:xbmc and OBS doesn't look busy | 12:50 |
| lbt | ok ... sec | 12:51 |
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| arfoll | also packages from home:arfoll:opencpn are not getting pushed to repo.pub.meego.com/xxx | 12:51 |
| lbt | Niels is looking at that | 12:52 |
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| arfoll | cool, it sucks dloading pkgs from the OBS interface... | 12:53 |
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| X-Fade | arfoll: new builds should appear now. | 12:54 |
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| X-Fade | arfoll: I'm not sure about builds that happened yesterday. | 12:55 |
| arfoll | X-Fade, should I trigger a rebuild or will they slowly trickle in? | 12:55 |
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| arfoll | wow and stuff is building on DE_Trunk - magic | 12:56 |
| X-Fade | arfoll: Yes, it turns out that the scheduler caches old responses :( | 12:56 |
| X-Fade | arfoll: So it thought that api.meego.com was still down. | 12:56 |
| * arfoll kicks stupid scheduler | 12:57 | |
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| wazd | Hi all | 13:18 |
| Stskeeps | lo wazd | 13:18 |
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| Stskeeps | how are things? | 13:18 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: well, not quite positive, but I'm trying to hold on :) | 13:19 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 13:19 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: yours? :) Already hacked n950 to run mce? :) | 13:20 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: they're okay, we have some small problems, but i'm working on some more global issues right now for all devices | 13:20 |
| Stskeeps | you're on gprs atm? | 13:21 |
| wazd | Yep | 13:21 |
| wazd | Heading home | 13:21 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 13:22 |
| wazd | Still no word bout n950 from Nokia :) | 13:22 |
| Stskeeps | don't worry, you're not the only one afaik :) | 13:22 |
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| wazd | I'm not in a hurry anyway, have lot's of things to do with existing devices :D | 13:23 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, on the n900-ce there is a video sintel_trailer - have you seen it? | 13:44 |
| Stskeeps | nop | 13:44 |
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| lcuk | n950 cannot play .ogv movies bah | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | really? thought theora was supposed to be there | 13:50 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, I just copied the trailer from n900-ce (sintel) to the n950 | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | still | 13:54 |
| Ronksu | aaaaaaaaargh (castle of) | 13:56 |
| lcuk | I was trying to see if I could get a regular app to exhibit bug 13084 on n950 | 13:56 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, carsten, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink | 13:56 |
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| * Ronksu goes to ponder to the correct channel ; | 13:56 | |
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| djszapi | lbt: It built kdelibs, but got stuck after 100% for one hour or so: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=kdelibs&project=home%3Adjszapi&repository=MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan | 14:01 |
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| lbt | hmm ... as an aside with stuck builds like that it's a good idea to try to replicate the build on your desktop if you can | 14:03 |
| lbt | I wonder if it's a memory issue | 14:03 |
| djszapi | lbt: I do not have this issue locally. | 14:04 |
| djszapi | but since kdelibs build is like 3-4-5 hours, it is not nice if it means it is not okay because of this. | 14:05 |
| dm8tbr | Viltapi might know, he had memory constrained workers in his cloud OBS project | 14:05 |
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| dm8tbr | and I think Qt and chromium both exploded for him because of OOM | 14:06 |
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| Elleo | seif: geoclue packages all built last night and are in my repo: http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/elleo/Harmattan/armel/ | 14:13 |
| Elleo | seif: you can either download them manually or just download http://mikeasoft.com/~mike/elleo.list into /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ and apt-get them | 14:13 |
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| Greatgib | Hi | 14:30 |
| Greatgib | Someone now how to extract binaries from a zipper rpm package without zipper or install it? | 14:30 |
| Greatgib | something like extracting a deb | 14:30 |
| tomeu | Greatgib: hi, google for "extract rpm" | 14:31 |
| dm8tbr | cpio to the rescue :) | 14:31 |
| Greatgib | ok i see: rpm2cpio mypackage.rpm | cpio -vid | 14:33 |
| Greatgib | but isn't there a solution without needing a special program like rpm2cpio ? | 14:33 |
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| djszapi | lbt: I did not compile and build kdelibs with such an option so that it puts all the cpp files into a bunch and makes one object file. Hence the OOM thing is a bit less chancy. | 14:36 |
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| tomeu | Greatgib: from what I know, the rpm format is complex enough that it's better to rely on rpm2cpio | 14:39 |
| Greatgib | :s that sucks | 14:39 |
| tomeu | I might be wrong, you may want to go read a bit about rpm | 14:39 |
| Greatgib | tomeu: no I think that you are right because that was that i found and so why I asked here | 14:39 |
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| tomeu | Greatgib: http://www.rpm.org/max-rpm/s1-rpm-file-format-rpm-file-format.html | 14:42 |
| * dm8tbr uses midnight commander to explore deb and rpm files ;) | 14:42 | |
| Greatgib | tomeu: thanks. | 14:45 |
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| seif | Elleo, i love you | 14:56 |
| Elleo | you're welcome :) | 14:58 |
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| lbt | djszapi: can you abortbuild it? | 14:59 |
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| djszapi | lbt: if there is no other option...then yeah, but that is another 5 hours :(:( | 14:59 |
| lcuk | djszapi, when you have built the kdelibs, where are you deploying them to? | 15:00 |
| lbt | sorry... this is all still fairly experimental at the H level... and kdelibs is big | 15:00 |
| lcuk | handset/netbook/n950? | 15:00 |
| * CosmoHill looks at his CV and giggles | 15:00 | |
| lcuk | CosmoHill, adding a joke of the day section to a CV is not wise :P | 15:01 |
| CosmoHill | GCSEs: alright, Cs with a few Bs and Ds, A Levels: Ds and Es, Uni: first class with honours | 15:02 |
| lcuk | \o/ | 15:02 |
| CosmoHill | if my education was a golf course then my A levels would be a massive sand trap which I got the ball out of and into the hole in one swing | 15:03 |
| djszapi | lbt: ok, rebuild then... | 15:03 |
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| djszapi | lbt: how much memory have on the build machines btw ? | 15:09 |
| djszapi | * do you have | 15:09 |
| lbt | 6Gb iirc maybe Gb | 15:10 |
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| djszapi | yeah, that might be no enough for more paralel builds. | 15:12 |
| djszapi | mainly, if someone tries to reduce the compilation time with one big blob. | 15:13 |
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| javier | no build-ids on meego. do you think it would be possible to enable it? ie: by applying the following patch https://build.opensuse.org/package/view_file?file=buildidprov.diff&package=rpm&project=Base%3Abuild&srcmd5=786860dddfef001a89995dd6b4898fc0 | 15:16 |
| javier | perhaps for next release? | 15:16 |
| Reffy | lbt/X-fade, if either of you are here, I'd like to request access to the Community OBS, please | 15:16 |
| lbt | Reffy: sure | 15:16 |
| lbt | details... | 15:16 |
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| Reffy | Username = reffy | 15:17 |
| lbt | opensource? community OBS for apps? right? | 15:18 |
| Reffy | Yeah | 15:19 |
| lbt | done : | 15:19 |
| Reffy | Thanks a lot | 15:20 |
| Reffy | Apologies for disturbing you | 15:20 |
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| lbt | np at all ... enjoy | 15:21 |
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| djszapi | lbt: Can we have a shared community repository for Harmattan soonish ? | 15:22 |
| djszapi | or should I create one and advertise or what is the idea now ? | 15:22 |
| lbt | I would love to do that djszapi | 15:23 |
| lbt | that is what Surrounds is for | 15:23 |
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| lbt | I suggest we have Surrounds:Testing for a while | 15:23 |
| lbt | have you read my blogs on Surrounds/Apps? | 15:24 |
| djszapi | lbt: when can we get accesses ? I know more people with more than 20 packages (including myself) and it would be nice to avoid the duplication even before starting packaging by just checking out that repository. It would be comfortable. | 15:24 |
| djszapi | lbt: link, please. | 15:24 |
| lbt | as soon as someone other than me starts asking/pushing | 15:24 |
| lbt | ie "now" | 15:24 |
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| lbt | and "thankyou thankyou thankyou" | 15:24 |
| lbt | please read http://wiki.meego.com/Community_Office/Task_Forces/MeeGo_Surrounds_and_Extras | 15:25 |
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| lbt | I/we put a lot of effort into thinking about this | 15:25 |
| lbt | it isn't trivial to get right | 15:25 |
| lbt | at least read the blog post linked to and think about the issues | 15:26 |
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| lbt | we saw the problems in Extras ... so we want to get it right (or at least better) this time | 15:26 |
| djszapi | lbt: ok reading :) | 15:26 |
| lbt | and add yourself to the team if you like the approach... | 15:27 |
| djszapi | lbt: how can I re-trigger a build (kdelibs) from the webinterface ? | 15:27 |
| djszapi | https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=kdelibs&project=home%3Adjszapi&repository=MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan -> I see no option for that | 15:27 |
| djszapi | The problem is that in this case the build is in an in-between limbo state =) | 15:28 |
| lbt | mmm ... it needs to be aborted first | 15:28 |
| djszapi | how ? | 15:28 |
| lbt | and there should be a link for that... | 15:28 |
| lbt | if not it may be osc time | 15:29 |
| djszapi | duh.. | 15:29 |
| djszapi | lbt: feature request for this is being opened... | 15:29 |
| lbt | upstream please | 15:29 |
| djszapi | another duh... :) | 15:29 |
| lbt | ah | 15:30 |
| lbt | now the log has "trigger rebuild" | 15:30 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, I killed the build :) | 15:30 |
| lbt | and what is cool.... I didn't refresh the page | 15:30 |
| djszapi | someone killed it | 15:30 |
| djszapi | some big killer, like X-Fade :) | 15:30 |
| lbt | it just appeared ... as if by ajax | 15:30 |
| lbt | yeah .. he lurks | 15:30 |
| djszapi | X-Fade: How can we make sure if a build runs out of memory ? | 15:31 |
| djszapi | do we have at all enough memory for kdelibs which is a goliath ? ) | 15:31 |
| djszapi | :) | 15:31 |
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| X-Fade | djszapi: run it again and see if helps :) | 15:31 |
| djszapi | another 5 hours another duh ... :) | 15:31 |
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| X-Fade | djszapi: That is a sign that the package is far too big :) | 15:32 |
| X-Fade | ... kitchen sink. | 15:32 |
| djszapi | X-Fade: kde is feature rich :p | 15:32 |
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| djszapi | X-Fade, lbt: does it make a clean session between the builds or it just runs dpkg-buildpackage -nc in this special case ? | 15:40 |
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| lbt | it *always* creates a brand new root | 15:41 |
| djszapi | right | 15:42 |
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| seif | Elleo, can i ask for one more thing :) | 16:03 |
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| seif | the python bindings for geoclue ? | 16:03 |
| Elleo | seif: okay, I'll see what I can do :) | 16:04 |
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| seif | also is there a way to disable aegis for developer? | 16:05 |
| djszapi | X-Fade, lbt: *sigh* This happened last times for days: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=kdelibs&project=home%3Adjszapi&repository=MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan -> As of now, it does not even try to build kdelibs. | 16:05 |
| djszapi | and this ends up "rpc timeout" without knowing what causes it and how it can be fixed and so forth. | 16:06 |
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| lcuk | djszapi, prior to the last week, how did you go about building kdelibs and distributing them? | 16:08 |
| lcuk | lets say for n900-maemo, did you push the entire build to autobuilder? | 16:08 |
| X-Fade | djszapi: It can just be that the worker setup takes a long time, as these packages need to be fetched from an external server. | 16:08 |
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| djszapi | lcuk: I can publish on my website | 16:09 |
| djszapi | X-Fade: last time it took for days. | 16:09 |
| lcuk | djszapi, is that how you normally do it for each platform? | 16:10 |
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| djszapi | lcuk: not sure what your point is | 16:11 |
| lcuk | just curious how you deployed the built kdelibs in the past | 16:11 |
| * lcuk conversing | 16:11 | |
| djszapi | lcuk: It is a different discussion. I am trying to get things done with feedbacks in order to proceed really. | 16:12 |
| djszapi | it does not really matter what happened before regarding that. I am now focusing on this issue ;) | 16:12 |
| lcuk | of course and once obs is working happily then the kdelibs can be deployed from any of the numerous build targets obs supports | 16:13 |
| djszapi | lcuk: but the thing is that it does not work happily and we need to proceed somehow in order for it to work happily... | 16:14 |
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| djszapi | it needs feedback, more information about the system and so forth. | 16:14 |
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| * lcuk nods | 16:15 | |
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| djszapi | lcuk: ok, I gave up, ping me when it is more mature. | 16:22 |
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| X-Fade | Impatient fellow :) | 16:36 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, you said this morning you wonder why the n900-ce tablet build was slow | 16:41 |
| lcuk | i just got it booted up and encountered http://liqbase.net/20110719_003.jpg | 16:41 |
| lcuk | where should I file the bug? | 16:42 |
| seif | guys | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: well, a patch is probably better, file it as [CE] first | 16:42 |
| seif | is there a way to disableaegis on the n950 or at least reduce the security for the developer user | 16:42 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, I understand patch is better, but first step to patches is recognising and writing down the bug :P | 16:43 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: start out as a [CE] bug as i think we're shrinking the design a bit | 16:43 |
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| Elleo | seif: I don't think there's anything other than what's mentioned in that thread I linked yesterday (--relax-exec mode), there isn't much in the way of documentation about aegis available yet; lots of people have been asking that question in #harmattan without any real solution coming up | 16:46 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, understood bug 21416 | 16:47 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=21416 nor, Undecided, ---, rusty.lynch, NEW, [CE] App launcher in landscape n900 is odd | 16:47 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 16:47 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, simplicity of components and everything will be welcome by all, it allows more focused efforts and less duplication | 16:48 |
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| djszapi | X-Fade, lbt: I am now getting "No Results", funky :) | 16:53 |
| djszapi | who understands it... | 16:54 |
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| lcuk | w00t, \o | 16:58 |
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| lbt | djszapi: sorry... got work I need to get done | 16:59 |
| lbt | bug me later though | 16:59 |
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| djszapi | lbt: well there has been a bugreport about the rpm timeoutS for a while. You can actually solve them anytime. | 17:00 |
| djszapi | when you get there... | 17:01 |
| X-Fade | djszapi: We're both volunteers. | 17:01 |
| X-Fade | djszapi: You can't demand service. | 17:01 |
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| X-Fade | djszapi: If you want a support contract, I can send you a quote. | 17:02 |
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| djszapi | X-Fade: nobody demanded anything. | 17:04 |
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| w00t | lcuk: o/ | 17:11 |
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| vgrade | lbt, thanks for looking at the arm scheduler | 17:21 |
| vgrade | lbt, my package now built, | 17:21 |
| Venemo | I've just read in the news that they don't teach handwriting anymore in the USA... is this true? | 17:22 |
| thiago | that would be stupid | 17:22 |
| thiago | they may not teach calligraphy | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | i learnt my handwriting from my c64 screen | 17:22 |
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| X-Fade | They now just learn to mimic a screen font in handwriting. | 17:23 |
| Venemo | http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2011/jul/14/children-signing-name-with-x | 17:24 |
| tomeu | andre__: you don't know that OBE can be "Overcome By Events" or "Out of Body Experience" or "Order of the British Empire" ? | 17:24 |
| lcuk | :( | 17:24 |
| Venemo | "Indiana is the 42nd state to give up on joined-up writing and concentrate on keyboard skills." | 17:24 |
| lcuk | handtyping will improve all that | 17:24 |
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| seif | Elleo, can u show me the link again | 17:25 |
| RST38h | Venemo: I look at this from the positive side: my kids will have an advantage over the illiterate masses =) | 17:25 |
| Elleo | seif: to the repo or to the aegis discussion? | 17:26 |
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| Venemo | RST38h yeah, you can see it that way. :) | 17:26 |
| andre__ | tomeu, none of them happened to be recently :) | 17:26 |
| andre__ | s/be/me | 17:26 |
| Stskeeps | Overcome by Events may qualify | 17:27 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:27 |
| Stskeeps | ;) | 17:27 |
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| Elleo | seif: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3827 is the aegis stuff, http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/elleo/Harmattan/armel/ is the debs, or http://mikeasoft.com/~mike/elleo.list if you want something to stick in your /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ | 17:27 |
| Elleo | that's all the links I can think of ;) | 17:27 |
| Elleo | seif: oh and: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=python-geoclue&project=home%3Aelleo if you want to keep an eye on the python-geoclue stuff | 17:28 |
| Robot101 | anyone seen dwmw2 around? | 17:28 |
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| arfoll | X-Fade, lbt, cheers for all the OBS fixing! have a virtual beer on me | 17:41 |
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| * CosmoHill can hear a variety of windows error sounds coming from next door | 17:46 | |
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| seif | hey Elleo any ideas about how i can communicate with the music player via dbus | 18:12 |
| seif | ? | 18:12 |
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| Beineri | X-Fade, lbt is there still a problem with publishing? build monitor says that "Repository has been published" but the new build doesn't appear on repo.pub.meego.com :-( | 18:17 |
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| seif | Elleo, i just found http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/t/telepathy-python/python-telepathy_0.15.17-1_all.deb which i need | 18:21 |
| seif | but sadly aegis is bitching again | 18:21 |
| seif | wont let me install it | 18:21 |
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| vignatti | hello all | 18:22 |
| vignatti | 'm trying for 1 hour already make my zypper work again | 18:22 |
| vignatti | I can refresh all my repos, but whenever I try to find a particular package, zypper only finds the local ones installed | 18:23 |
| vignatti | so "zypper search" doesn't give me any remote content, even after I make sure it's refreshed | 18:23 |
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| vignatti | what could be the problem? | 18:23 |
| vignatti | the repo is enabled, yes | 18:23 |
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| eg81 | vignatti: maybe this will help zypper clean | 18:29 |
| eg81 | --all | 18:29 |
| iekku | hmmm, what to use with exopc if wanting to use it as a music and movia player? some good meego image or wetab? | 18:29 |
| vignatti | eg81: I tried already, followed by a refresh | 18:30 |
| vignatti | no lucky though | 18:30 |
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| CosmoHill | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nlk0AjvT6yY << and people say trains are better than cars for the environment | 18:32 |
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| lcuk | vignatti, is this a new install? on which ux is it happening? | 18:33 |
| lcuk | did it happily work before | 18:33 |
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| vignatti | lcuk: it worked before, yes | 18:34 |
| vignatti | was working like one week ago | 18:34 |
| lcuk | can you pastebin the logs of what you are doing | 18:34 |
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| Ulf^ | vignatti, sounds familiar | 18:41 |
| Ulf^ | vignatti, sounds like a bug in libzypp with one set of images | 18:42 |
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| Ulf^ | vignatti, https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19659 | 18:45 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug 19659 cri, High, ---, qiang.z.zhang, RELE FIXED, [trunk:testing][REG]Execute "zypper in ..." can't install packages successful | 18:45 |
| Ulf^ | thx MeeGoBot ;) | 18:45 |
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| lcuk | ot from meego-meeting: yeah sabotage, bug 13084 prevents using XV mode | 18:48 |
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| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, carsten, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink | 18:48 |
| lcuk | and I dont know how to fix it myself | 18:48 |
| lcuk | and it also impacts harmattan too | 18:48 |
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| npm | iekku: i use latest meego tablet release plus http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo-Lem and it works nicely for music/movie playing | 19:00 |
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| npm | also http://wiki.meego.com/tubelet-and-cutetube-port | 19:01 |
| npm | i'm about to try it out on my new n950 | 19:01 |
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| npm | actually, i'd love to find out the codec-situation on "stock" meego tablets w/r/t my cutetube port at http://ytd-meego.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/playground/qmltube | 19:03 |
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| npm | and on harmattan as well. so far, i tried playing a .flv .mov .mp4 and .avi and all failed... but a 3gp succeeded | 19:04 |
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| seif | i keep getting | 19:06 |
| seif | RM680-22-6_PR_RM680:~# aegis-developer-mode --relaxed-exec | 19:06 |
| seif | Error: Permission denied | 19:06 |
| npm | speaking of N950, will a Nokia E7 case protect it? http://mynokiablog.com/2011/06/26/gallery-nokia-n9-vs-n950-vs-n900-vs-e7-vs-samsung-sgsii-vs-iphone-4/ makes it look like e7 has similar dimensions, other than camera-hole on back | 19:07 |
| ShadowJK | npm: would be interesting to see response to a bugreport of flv mov mp4 avi not working | 19:07 |
| ShadowJK | especially as N9 is marketed with its "amazing" ability to play everything | 19:08 |
| npm | well it might just be operator error. | 19:08 |
| npm | i had just gotten the device | 19:08 |
| npm | maybe it is a security setting that needs to be changed? | 19:08 |
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| ShadowJK | Security shouldn't prevent the user from using the device | 19:09 |
| npm | sure it could | 19:09 |
| ShadowJK | If you have to change security settinga just to watch a video, something is seriously wrong | 19:10 |
| npm | if i were doing the security arch for a handset, i'd be concerned about the provenance of incoming media as well. | 19:10 |
| ShadowJK | whether it's wrong by design or not I don't know :) | 19:10 |
| npm | ShadowJK: it depends on how much you know about security. if done right at the app level, you wouldn't need to see, but i wasn't coming in at the app level | 19:11 |
| ShadowJK | So what, you can only play videos specifically approved by some secret mystical video approval cabal? | 19:11 |
| npm | i was sshing in media files behind it's back | 19:11 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah that's how I would move stuff to the device too | 19:11 |
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| npm | maybe they need some kind of special "blessing" to say they're legit | 19:11 |
| ShadowJK | as there are no other methods left besides bouncing files via a web server :) | 19:12 |
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| npm | i would assume commercial mobile devices would support drm and thus one may need to be concerned over working with drm | 19:12 |
| lcuk | usb mass storage | 19:13 |
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| npm | hoping someone w/ expertise will inform me of specifics, so i don't have to complain in such careful generic terms :-) | 19:13 |
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| ShadowJK | usb mass storage is unusable unless they solved the umounting problem | 19:14 |
| npm | anyways i'll be findig out at the qt and qtmobility level pretty soon as i've only had a few hours w/ device | 19:14 |
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| npm | which has mostly been playing and pinching it's cheeks and coohing and going oooh how qt! | 19:16 |
| ShadowJK | It'd be pretty stupid and not fit for purpose if it was only able to plau DRMd files :( | 19:16 |
| lcuk | http://blogs.amd.com/home/2011/07/15/the-revenge-of-pen-computing/ | 19:16 |
| lcuk | bah pen computing | 19:16 |
| npm | speaking of pen computing, what kindof stylus for n950 | 19:17 |
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| ShadowJK | missing stylus holder :) | 19:17 |
| leinir | npm: i suspect one might be able to use the bamboo stylus thing wacom did... | 19:18 |
| npm | hi leinir! | 19:18 |
| TSCHAKeee | /me chuckles | 19:18 |
| TSCHAKeee | stylus on a capacitive screen | 19:18 |
| TSCHAKeee | good one. | 19:18 |
| npm | there are capacitive styluses | 19:18 |
| ShadowJK | finger to pixel size ratio is enormous :) | 19:18 |
| npm | i personally would like to see phones designed w/ screens so hard that they can withstand a ballpoint pen | 19:19 |
| ShadowJK | stylus to pixel ratio is approaching usable | 19:19 |
| TSCHAKeee | yes, there are... but it's awkward at best | 19:19 |
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| npm | so that you can grab anything you need any time you need to "write" | 19:19 |
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| npm | and not worry about keys in the pocket | 19:19 |
| * TSCHAKeee rolls his eyes and walks off. | 19:19 | |
| ShadowJK | npm, yeah that'd be awesome | 19:19 |
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| ShadowJK | But I don't think there exists any scratch proof materials yet | 19:20 |
| npm | if they'd stop trying to use nanotech to kill people and did something useful with it.... | 19:20 |
| ShadowJK | lol | 19:20 |
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| npm | other than intel's contributions of course... :-) | 19:21 |
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| ShadowJK | Atleast with screen protectora you can replace them once you've accumulated scratches, and the touch window on N900 is relatively inexpensive enough that you can swap that too.. | 19:21 |
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| ShadowJK | Allegedly N9's screen assembly is all in one unit and the most expensive part of the device though | 19:22 |
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| npm | leinir: please check out http://code.google.com/p/qtzibit/ see screenshots in http://nielsmayer.com/meego/qml/ .... | 19:26 |
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| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: And there do - diamond | 19:32 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: Although you can actually get large slabs of sapphire - which are almost as good | 19:32 |
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| ShadowJK | both are obscenely expensive I guess? :) | 19:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Well - actually... | 19:39 |
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| lcuk | http://gizmodo.com/337529/asus-ls201-resists-crossbow-arrow-impact | 19:41 |
| lcuk | that woould handle your piffly pens | 19:41 |
| SpeedEvil | I found a linka while ago for diamond coated scan windows for barcode scanners. | 19:42 |
| SpeedEvil | The sort that you run cans over all day every day | 19:42 |
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| lcuk | auke, this updating version thing | 19:44 |
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| DawnFoster | Reminder: MeeGo Events meeting in #meego-meeting starting in 15 minutes: http://wiki.meego.com/Events/Meetings | 19:44 |
| lcuk | bug 9205 | 19:44 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9205 enh, High, 1.3, auke-jan.h.kok, NEW, Cannot Update from 1.0 to 1.1, from 1.1 to 1.2 | 19:44 |
| lcuk | \o DawnFoster | 19:44 |
| DawnFoster | hey lcuk | 19:45 |
| lcuk | auke, which other OS/distro is this not updating thing based on? | 19:45 |
| lcuk | DawnFoster, do I recall a whole boatload of intel/meego demo devices shown somewhere a few months ago? | 19:46 |
| lcuk | i remember a video with a guy with about 5 devices next to him | 19:46 |
| DawnFoster | maybe at the meego conference? | 19:47 |
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| DawnFoster | or at mobile world congress maybe | 19:47 |
| lcuk | no, it was a video and afaik was even before the conf | 19:47 |
| lcuk | perhaps but it did not look like conference surroundings | 19:47 |
| * lcuk will do some research | 19:47 | |
| DawnFoster | not sure - I know we've done some demos like that, but not sure about the video | 19:48 |
| lcuk | DawnFoster, on another topic: | 19:48 |
| lcuk | http://blogs.amd.com/home/2011/07/15/the-revenge-of-pen-computing/ | 19:48 |
| lcuk | seems that htc flyer is doing what I have been trying to organise for a while | 19:49 |
| * lcuk never seems to do anything right | 19:49 | |
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| pixelgeek | lcuk: I'm curious about your question. Let me know if you find your video. Why are you asking? | 20:04 |
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| lcuk | pixelgeek, to see and experiment with different form factors | 20:22 |
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| lcuk | i have been longtime wanting a large format, dual mode tablet | 20:22 |
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| lcuk | the htc flyer seems to have requirements | 20:22 |
| lcuk | but for the android | 20:22 |
| * lcuk strongly prefers meegosince liqbase runs on it | 20:22 | |
| pixelgeek | Are you coming to OSCON or Linuxconf NA? | 20:23 |
| lcuk | I never have finances to fly out to conferences | 20:23 |
| * pixelgeek nods | 20:23 | |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.20110623_015300.liqbase-playground.scr.png is my current meego device | 20:23 |
| lcuk | the ideapad I got from meego conf dublin | 20:24 |
| * lcuk thinks he is the only person using meego day to day | 20:24 | |
| mosty | how do you exit the wireless settings in the meego 1.2 tablet ux? | 20:24 |
| pixelgeek | mosty: You should be able to go back to the home screen? | 20:25 |
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| pixelgeek | lcuk: I use it at home most days. | 20:25 |
| mosty | pixelgeek, how? what guesture? there's no obvious buttons to press that do that | 20:25 |
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| lcuk | pixelgeek, which ux? | 20:25 |
| pixelgeek | ExoPC? | 20:25 |
| mosty | pixelgeek, yes | 20:25 |
| pixelgeek | lcuk: netbook | 20:25 |
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| pixelgeek | mosty: there is a magic hidden sensor in the top left of the screen | 20:26 |
| pixelgeek | It functions like a home button | 20:26 |
| lcuk | pixelgeek, how do you find the multitasking | 20:27 |
| pixelgeek | (Or bottom right if you're holding the tablet the other way up ;) ) | 20:27 |
| mosty | pixelgeek, aha that round thing | 20:27 |
| lcuk | on netbook when I am sat in the garden developing | 20:27 |
| lcuk | i have folder window, editor window, console window and app window | 20:27 |
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| lcuk | and alt-tabbing is horrid on concentration | 20:27 |
| pixelgeek | Yes. | 20:27 |
| pixelgeek | I tend to use it for reading email or websurfing. | 20:27 |
| lcuk | i filed a bug about it but it wont be changed | 20:27 |
| mosty | pixelgeek, thanks :) a label or home icon would not have been a bad idea... | 20:27 |
| pixelgeek | Not too much back and forth | 20:27 |
| pixelgeek | mosty: ExoPC is just being used as a development vehicle. | 20:28 |
| lcuk | bug 10544 | 20:28 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10544 nor, Medium, ---, tf, RESO WONTFIX, Alt-Tab app order not reflected in applications | 20:28 |
| mosty | pixelgeek, i know, i can't imagine this competing as a consumer device | 20:29 |
| pixelgeek | mosty: repurposing Windows hardware. I guess Windows doesn't need a home button because you never leave the home screen. | 20:29 |
| lcuk | bug 4804 is similar | 20:30 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4804 enh, Medium, ---, nicholas.e.richards, NEW, The animation for window transition is too slow (task switcher with alt-tab) | 20:30 |
| pixelgeek | Actual product specifications will be different. | 20:30 |
| pixelgeek | lcuk: I always find the Windows tab order seems random... | 20:30 |
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| lcuk | pixelgeek, yeah | 20:31 |
| pixelgeek | I agree on the transition animation timing though | 20:31 |
| lcuk | i wish I knew where in the code to look | 20:31 |
| * lcuk cannot grok lots of the code to fix it myself | 20:31 | |
| * pixelgeek too | 20:31 | |
| lcuk | i am happiest prototyping and tinkering | 20:31 |
| pixelgeek | <sigh> | 20:31 |
| * pixelgeek off to another meeting | 20:31 | |
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| iekku | npm, ok, thanks :) | 20:44 |
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| djszapi | lbt: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=kdelibs&project=home%3Adjszapi&repository=MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan Build is ready again after hours, after the building, it is getting stuck again...It has been like that for hours. C-OBS does not like something after building. | 20:46 |
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| thiago | DawnFoster: oh, could I ask a favour? Could you add my new blog to the MeeGo aggregator? | 20:50 |
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| DawnFoster | thiago: sure! did you file a bug with the feed address? | 20:51 |
| DawnFoster | (i'm way behind on bugs) | 20:51 |
| lcuk | a FEA request ;) | 20:51 |
| thiago | DawnFoster: http://www.macieira.org/blog/author/thiago/feed/ | 20:51 |
| thiago | no | 20:51 |
| lcuk | new blogs should not start out as bugs! | 20:51 |
| thiago | I didn't | 20:51 |
| thiago | didn't know I should | 20:51 |
| thiago | I'll do that if you want me to | 20:51 |
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| DawnFoster | thiago: can you give me a meego-specific feed? | 20:52 |
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| thiago | sure | 20:54 |
| thiago | sec | 20:54 |
| DawnFoster | like for a specific meego category or tag, like http://fastwonderblog.com/tag/meego/feed/ | 20:54 |
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| thiago | http://www.macieira.org/blog/category/meego/feed/ | 20:55 |
| thiago | there's nothing there yet | 20:55 |
| thiago | but I wouldn't mind if you added http://www.macieira.org/blog/category/qt/feed/ too | 20:56 |
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| DawnFoster | i'll probably just add the meego category | 20:57 |
| DawnFoster | and you can put some qt stuff in the meego category, too | 20:57 |
| DawnFoster | assuming you're using WP, which allows mulitple categories?? | 20:57 |
| lcuk | can I add blogging software to my godaddy hosting thingy? | 20:57 |
| thiago | yeah | 20:57 |
| thiago | lcuk: you can add WP I think | 20:58 |
| thiago | otherwise, you can get one at wordpress.com | 20:58 |
| * lcuk does not understand all this faff :$ | 20:58 | |
| thiago | if you can't ask the godaddy control software to install for you, installing WP is pretty easy anyway | 20:59 |
| lcuk | I used my slashdot journal for blogging in the past | 20:59 |
| DawnFoster | thiago: can you go log in here? http://planet.meego.com/mgd:login | 20:59 |
| albanc | stormer, the old pacrunner provides /usr/lib/libproxy.so.0 and glib-networking requires libproxy.so.1... new pacrunner provides .1 but does not have .0 anymore and .0 is required by some other packages | 20:59 |
| lcuk | but the maemo planet made a hash of the posts | 20:59 |
| DawnFoster | thiago: that will create your planet account | 20:59 |
| albanc | stormer, any suggestions? :) | 20:59 |
| lcuk | \o al | 20:59 |
| lcuk | \o albanc | 21:00 |
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| thiago | DawnFoster: done | 21:00 |
| thiago | my blog links to https://meego.com/aggregator | 21:00 |
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| thiago | should I keep that? should I add planet.meego.com? | 21:00 |
| DawnFoster | thiago: probably link to planet.meego.com, since that will be the new one | 21:02 |
| thiago | ok | 21:02 |
| DawnFoster | thiago: ok, you're added to both now | 21:02 |
| * thiago will update | 21:02 | |
| thiago | link updated | 21:05 |
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| npm | anybody know how to get around this trying to send my first program to N950: :-1: error: Deployment failed: Qemu was not running. It has now been started up for you, but it will take a bit of time until it is ready." | 21:11 |
| npm | the thing is why would qemu need to run to send my compile program to n950 to run? | 21:12 |
| lcuk | auke, *blink* | 21:12 |
| stormer | albanc, rebuild | 21:12 |
| stormer | cause I don't think a symlink is fine for a distro | 21:13 |
| stormer | albanc, all package build agains 0 should work find with 1 | 21:13 |
| albanc | stormer, I rebuilt pacrunner and glib-networking... already | 21:14 |
| auke | lcuk: ? | 21:15 |
| albanc | should libzypp and others be rebuilt? | 21:15 |
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| lcuk | auke, the current discussion on bug 9205 | 21:16 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9205 enh, High, 1.3, auke-jan.h.kok, NEW, Cannot Update from 1.0 to 1.1, from 1.1 to 1.2 | 21:16 |
| auke | ah, lol | 21:16 |
| lcuk | with all the talk of compliancy and applications being compatible | 21:16 |
| lcuk | should really flow to the OS to | 21:16 |
| lcuk | and really, it should be a special case that updates are not possible | 21:16 |
| lcuk | I think every developer maintaining a codebase understands that | 21:16 |
| lcuk | the simple act of "maintaining" instead of rewriting it from scratch every 6 months | 21:17 |
| lcuk | shows that updatable packages are in mind | 21:17 |
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| auke | lcuk: I hate to pop bubbles, but upgrading an OS is not an easy thing to do | 21:17 |
| lcuk | understood | 21:17 |
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| auke | I'll be the last person to merge some haphazard junk script that breaks 99% of the time | 21:18 |
| lcuk | I went through it with the teams around fremantle 1.2 -> 1.2 -> 1.3 | 21:18 |
| auke | and leaves people without anything | 21:18 |
| lcuk | and saw first hand the complexities | 21:18 |
| lcuk | that is why we have bugs and regression tests and competent engineers | 21:18 |
| auke | wtf? | 21:19 |
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| auke | you have competent engineers? | 21:19 |
| auke | send them to me pls | 21:19 |
| auke | :) | 21:19 |
| berndhs | auke: I'm available :) | 21:19 |
| lcuk | auke, perhaps you should contact collabora :) most of the guys there know their stuff | 21:19 |
| lcuk | auke, with modern merge review processes and continuous integration and automated testing around meego | 21:20 |
| lcuk | it should be practically impossible to get a pad apple patch in | 21:20 |
| lcuk | whole teams around -qa work hard to ensure the tooling is in place | 21:21 |
| lcuk | and developers from each team have created sets of tests | 21:21 |
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| lcuk | auke, if you can find me the design documentation which states that OS level updating is not practical, I would gladly work with people to amend it | 21:22 |
| lcuk | and file bugs and work towards ensuring that 0.x level updates can be updated | 21:23 |
| auke | there is no documentation stating anything like that | 21:23 |
| lcuk | > So what is it that makes it impossible? Is it a technical issue? | 21:24 |
| lcuk | Yes. But ultimately, it is a design choice. | 21:24 |
| lcuk | "it is a design choice" you said. | 21:24 |
| auke | you misread that | 21:24 |
| lcuk | as with anything around meego, there would normally be several forms to be filled in and signed by both sets of grandparents | 21:24 |
| auke | it is a design choice to not make meego continuously upgradable -> IOW, make meego packages require fully regressable/upgradable | 21:24 |
| lcuk | ok, so then the bug report *could* be made into a feature request | 21:25 |
| auke | it technically is a feature request | 21:25 |
| lcuk | and word could be spread amongst developers that updates are wanted where possible? | 21:25 |
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| lcuk | ie, just a piece of hacker lore around meego "will this patch help or prevent updating end users installations?" | 21:26 |
| lcuk | if the answer is that it will prevent the update, ask why it is required | 21:26 |
| lcuk | and whether a simple refactor would allow seamless updating | 21:26 |
| stormer | albanc, I think it's already understood, but just in case, I meant that you should rebuild the other packages too | 21:26 |
| lcuk | \o stormer | 21:27 |
| auke | I think you're making more out of this than it is. In itself, doing an OS upgrade is trivial, but inherently incomplete. | 21:27 |
| auke | what if a user installs an AppUp package? | 21:27 |
| stormer | lcuk, hello | 21:28 |
| lcuk | auke, same occured in maemo | 21:28 |
| lcuk | user installs app from ovi | 21:28 |
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| lcuk | whilst using maemo 1.2 | 21:28 |
| lcuk | angry birds! | 21:28 |
| lcuk | after updating to maemo 1.3 | 21:28 |
| lcuk | hey ho, magically angry birds still works | 21:28 |
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| lcuk | auke, windows: user has windows 7. installs boat load of stuff | 21:29 |
| lcuk | installs sp1 | 21:29 |
| stormer | albanc, hmm, thinking of it, you should probably make pacrunner install a symlink for 0, at least in 1.2, and drop it for 1.3 | 21:29 |
| lcuk | boatload of stuff is still there | 21:29 |
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| lcuk | auke, I can honestly understand it around x.0 updates, but the 0.x should work happily | 21:30 |
| berndhs | lcuk: i have upgraded fedora many times, and ubuntu a few. upgrades work perfectly only on virgin systems | 21:30 |
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| auke | well, I'm just repeating things here, but, with MeeGo we chose to not support a `zypper dup` type OS upgrade from 0.x to 0.x+1 | 21:31 |
| auke | we can use alternative methods | 21:31 |
| auke | that's what I'm considering to implement | 21:32 |
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| auke | perhaps it will be `zypper dup`-based under the hood | 21:32 |
| auke | but most likely, it will be heavily using btrfs subvolumes as a safety net | 21:32 |
| auke | and also allow you to do a clean replacement of the OS without reformatting/removing user data | 21:33 |
| auke | because those parts make a ton of sense | 21:33 |
| auke | OS upgrade method 1 failed? now you can try method 2, or just upgrade-install while saving userdata | 21:34 |
| auke | and afterwards? you can revert back | 21:34 |
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| auke | fixing this <within> the package management would mean that the cost of maintaining packages skyrockets | 21:34 |
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| auke | lol, it's a funny bug | 21:38 |
| auke | everyone is like | 21:39 |
| auke | OMG A DEVELOPER REPLIED!!! JUMP HIM!!! | 21:39 |
| auke | :) | 21:39 |
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| lcuk | auke, the replace os route will not be appup supported? | 21:42 |
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| ali1234 | making a whole new volume and basically doing a fresh install isn't going to sit very well if there's three security bugs in a week | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | you *are* going to release timely security updates, right? | 21:45 |
| npm | ok someone want to help me debug the nonplaying of video in http://nielsmayer.com/meego/qml/qmltube_1_0_6_armel.deb on harmattan (my meego port works on harmattan too) | 21:45 |
| npm | almost anyways | 21:46 |
| ali1234 | or are we going to get those in the once-every-three-months-if-you're-lucky monolithic updates too? | 21:46 |
| npm | btw, i've been "continuously updating" meego 1.2 on netbook and tablet w/ no problems. it's just a few scripts... (see PS on http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-community/2011-June/004169.html ) | 21:48 |
| ali1234 | i tried to do it once... it killed the whole install | 21:49 |
| npm | well you have to do it right :-) | 21:49 |
| npm | and not go off and reboot without making sure things work | 21:49 |
| ali1234 | how do you make sure things work right? | 21:50 |
| npm | cross my fingers :-) | 21:50 |
| ali1234 | i just changed repos from 1.2 -> 1.3 and updated everything and rebooted. it didn't work :) | 21:50 |
| auke | ali1234: for security processes, please talk to Ryan Ware... the security team however does (and has, in the past) push out security updates out-of-band from the normal updates... | 21:50 |
| npm | oh well that's another story | 21:50 |
| npm | 1.3 isn't ready for primetime IMHO | 21:50 |
| npm | 1.2.1 is | 21:50 |
| auke | ali1234: told ya hehehe :) | 21:50 |
| auke | well, 1.3 is starting to look great from a developers perspective, especially concerning the systemd change | 21:51 |
| npm | i'll cross that burning bridge when i've done crossing this burning platform | 21:51 |
| auke | I run it on a lot of systems | 21:51 |
| auke | but, migrating from 1.2.0 to trunk is a no-go | 21:52 |
| Ulf^ | that's for sure | 21:53 |
| npm | yeah i was just talking about live upgrading from say the exopc conference tablets to 1.2.0.90 latest | 21:53 |
| ali1234 | i still didn't manage to get it installed but i think it's fixed now... just no image with the fix yet | 21:53 |
| ali1234 | or maybe there is in a daily image somewhere and i can't find it | 21:53 |
| npm | ok well off to build and install my second program on harmattan ( http://code.google.com/p/qtzibit/ ) | 21:54 |
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| ali1234 | for the installer-shell it would be nice if there was an option "just give me a shell" | 21:57 |
| ali1234 | instead of having to load up the full UI | 21:57 |
| npm | just built an interesting youtube browser in qtzibit: http://nielsmayer.com/meego/qml/qtzibit-youtube.png | 21:58 |
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| ali1234 | npm: none playing video: is it a video with adverts on it? those won't play out of the browser | 21:59 |
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| npm | hmmm good point. the thing is the same vids play on n900... perhaps i'll turn on the "only give 3gp vids" param to youtube and see if that fixes | 22:00 |
| ali1234 | there is a way to filter only videos without adverts... mythtv youtube plugin does it | 22:00 |
| npm | yes | 22:00 |
| npm | format 5 or 3 or something | 22:01 |
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| auke | ali1234: just TAB in the installed, then add '3' to the "boot meego" option and it'll boot to console? | 22:52 |
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| ali1234 | auke: iow the option exists and you just need to work on usability :) | 23:04 |
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| auke | more options, not a good thing | 23:07 |
| ali1234 | how about this for an idea? after you write the USB image, drop a script into a magic location with any commands and settings you want, and the installer will run it automatically | 23:07 |
| auke | more complexity, not a good thing | 23:07 |
| auke | you are a developer | 23:07 |
| auke | you dont need another option | 23:07 |
| ali1234 | i thought meego was for developers anyway? | 23:07 |
| ali1234 | i wish you guys would make your minds up | 23:08 |
| auke | I don't work for Nokia | 23:08 |
| ali1234 | so meego is now an end user distro again? | 23:08 |
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| ali1234 | meant to be installed after market? | 23:08 |
| auke | are you trolling or do you want a serious discussion? | 23:08 |
| SpeedEvil | Meego is both. | 23:08 |
| SpeedEvil | It's a framework on which manufacturers can elaborate. | 23:09 |
| ali1234 | more options are not going to affect an unattended OEM install, because nobody is going to be around to get confused by them | 23:09 |
| SpeedEvil | In addition, there are various 'user experiences' that are end-user code. | 23:09 |
| auke | ok, fair point | 23:09 |
| auke | I'll add 20 or so options to the meego boot images | 23:09 |
| * auke giggles | 23:10 | |
| auke | where do you draw the line though? | 23:10 |
| lcuk | prease prefix action points with #ACTION: ;) | 23:10 |
| lcuk | please even | 23:10 |
| auke | #ACTION: smack lcuk around a bit. | 23:11 |
| ali1234 | i dunno, but adding one option that just drops to a shell where you can do whatever doesn't seem like too much to me | 23:11 |
| the-boss | auke: Error: "ACTION:" is not a valid command. | 23:11 |
| lcuk | :D | 23:11 |
| auke | ali1234: perhaps. But, you are not a statistically significant sample :). | 23:11 |
| ali1234 | i'd put it in the installer-shell, not the boot menu | 23:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | luckily not even the whole meego is statistically significant | 23:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | otherwise I'd re-educate to do a job as bricklayer or butcher | 23:14 |
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| ali1234 | DocScrutinizer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKcO4i3shDM&feature=player_detailpage#t=222s | 23:18 |
| lcuk | #MeeGo is an awesome #Linux based #MMORPG where you level up by submitting code patches and conquering the OBS machine! http://twitter.com/lcuk/status/93414143234805760 | 23:18 |
| the-boss | lcuk: Error: "MeeGo" is not a valid command. | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 23:18 |
| lcuk | Are you a #developer? Are you #bored on the #internet now? Roll your sleeves up and get involved with #MeeGo Help build an awesome platform http://twitter.com/lcuk/status/93413776933666816 | 23:19 |
| * lcuk enjoying a bit of twitter fishing | 23:19 | |
| lcuk | anyone else care to join in? :O | 23:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: sorry, but you know I radically refuse to enter any URL beginning with http://twitter.com/ - and this is as my browser refuses to render that nonsense | 23:24 |
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| djszapi_ | X-Fade: Could you kill the build again ? https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=kdelibs&project=home%3Adjszapi&repository=MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan | 23:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | the fifth time I sat in fron of an empty screen after kilcking such url and watching 105 images getting downloaded to /dev/null, I did >> echo 0.0.0.0 twitter.com >/etc/hosts << | 23:26 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, that is ok I just thought you would find that one amusing. since I posted the tweet in full you have no need to visit the website \o | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: much appreciated. Indeed it's quite amusing | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm just sorry I can't join in | 23:28 |
| lcuk | you need to create nottwitter.com or something | 23:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer | how's about no-aegis.fsf.org | 23:33 |
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| [Rui] | Hi. Got a wetab, install seems frozen. Anyone familiar with this? | 23:38 |
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| [Rui] | It's stuck for well over an hour in step 3, installation. :-( | 23:39 |
| * lanfear shakes her head. | 23:40 | |
| [Rui] | Since it's a meego device, I'm going to find someone with familiar experience in this device. | 23:40 |
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| andyross | [Rui]: what are you installing? MeeGo tablet? | 23:47 |
| [Rui] | Andyross nothing yet, I thought of giving it at least a week with the default meego system. | 23:48 |
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| andyross | The default system isn't really MeeGo. They started with an early MeeGo release at the kernel and middleware layer, but everything above the X server is custom. You'll need to get installation help from them. | 23:49 |
| [Rui] | Andyross, I just unboxed it and it's running its first time setup. | 23:49 |
| andyross | But it makes an excellent toy to play with MeeGo tablet releases. We can help you with that if you like :) | 23:49 |
| [Rui] | Ah, there's a problem then. :-( | 23:49 |
| berndhs | the wetab people have a channel #wetab on devnde.net, but its pretty empty | 23:50 |
| berndhs | s/devnde/devnode/ | 23:50 |
| infobot | berndhs meant: the wetab people have a channel #wetab on devnode.net, but its pretty empty | 23:50 |
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| [Rui] | They should have one on free node but I guess that after making fake reviews on Amazon, it is a minor error :-) | 23:51 |
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| berndhs | i don't know where they should be or not, but that's where they are | 23:52 |
| [Rui] | Ok. After almost two hours, I'm going to see what happens after I force a reboot, then I can ask some help on getting a more standard meego in it, ok? :-) | 23:52 |
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| arfoll | X-Fade, my DE_Trunk builds in home:arfoll:opencpn aren't being pushed to repo.pub... :-( can you help? | 23:57 |
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