| timeless_w7ip | if Corel used debian code but rpm as a package manager | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| timeless_w7ip | then it could have been "debian like", but there would not have been an upgrade path | 00:00 |
| timeless_w7ip | beyond an upgrade path or community support from a wider community, it basically doesn't matter | 00:00 |
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| * timeless_w7ip goes to feed some code to an indexer | 00:01 | |
| vgrade | smoku, is the ideapad, gma500? | 00:01 |
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| javispedro | nope, the s10-3t is gma3150 | 00:02 |
| smoku | vgrade, N455 | 00:02 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVOliDG4AAc&feature=feedlik - completely off-topic. 555 timer adding machine. | 00:02 |
| SpeedEvil | (broght to mind by the 455 comment) | 00:02 |
| vgrade | smoku, emgd is only supposed to be for gma500 based embedded boards, but as we know a lot of oems built netbooks with it | 00:04 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, nice video by the way | 00:04 |
| gabrbedd | vgrade: All N450 processors use GMA3150, because it's integrated into the CPU. | 00:04 |
| gabrbedd | vgrade: Ideapad has an N450. | 00:04 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: thank you. I'm refining it even more. | 00:05 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, care to paste a ks? | 00:05 |
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| rgs_ | any ideas where i could get Tracker 0.10.x RPMs? | 00:09 |
| thiago_home | rgs_: if they are not in the MeeGo Core repository, they're nowhere | 00:10 |
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| timeless_w7ip | grr | 00:11 |
| * timeless_w7ip grumbles | 00:11 | |
| timeless_w7ip | curl is being stupid | 00:11 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: sure. | 00:11 |
| gabrbedd | BAD, Curl! BAD! | 00:12 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: http://pastebin.com/WbwA1Fjk | 00:14 |
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| npm | how do i get QML to support jpg? QML Image: Error decoding: http://i.ytimg.com/vi/fCu4_mhcdJg/default.jpg: Unsupported image format | 00:16 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: i need to massage it a bit and make it not depend on stuff on my filesystem (two files basically) | 00:17 |
| npm | hmmm nm... it helps to click on the image first | 00:17 |
| npm | (doh) | 00:17 |
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| npm | oh actually the images are valid -- this is on netbook 1.2 using qmlviewer: QML Image: Error decoding: http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-2wyyOaX45s/default.jpg: Unsupported image format | 00:20 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, thanks for sharing, talk to dm8tbr once you have an image, get it up on bug10738.openaos.org | 00:21 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10738 nor, Undecided, ---, tero.kojo, NEED, Meego community ftp server or similar needed | 00:21 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: ok, i have an image, i'm just making it look and boot better | 00:22 |
| npm | gives up and installs http://get.qt.nokia.com/qtsdk/Qt_SDK_Lin32_offline_v1_1_beta_en.run on meego | 00:24 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, nice work on the ks. | 00:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | thanks | 00:25 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, nice to see, http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/vgrade/MeeGo_current_Core_standard | 00:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | hehehe | 00:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | it's why the joggler works | 00:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | :D | 00:25 |
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| * TSCHAKeee can't wait for working Tegra2 drivers | 00:26 | |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, I'm not holding my breath on that | 00:27 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, we should try the newer builds on EMGD with libva support see if we can get video on the device | 00:28 |
| TSCHAKeee | :( | 00:28 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: i agree. | 00:28 |
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| vgrade | http://download.meego.com/live/devel:/x11:/ivi/Trunk/i586/ | 00:28 |
| TSCHAKeee | oh hey there | 00:29 |
| vgrade | It may required an associated kernel patch | 00:29 |
| TSCHAKeee | damn, brand new | 00:29 |
| vgrade | that is MAY require, let me know | 00:29 |
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| TSCHAKeee | ok | 00:30 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, you can probably reduce the delay time in the grub cfg and also add 'quiet' to clean up the boot process | 00:34 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, did orbiter build for ARM? | 00:35 |
| TSCHAKeee | oh yes, it did | 00:36 |
| TSCHAKeee | we've had orbiter targets for arm all the way back to ARMv4 | 00:36 |
| TSCHAKeee | running on Windows CE | 00:36 |
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| vgrade | adds that to the growing list of MeeGo Ux | 00:37 |
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| XaToR | hi all | 00:52 |
| CosmoHill | hello | 00:52 |
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| XaToR | For problem with "MeeGO" on eeePC 701 (4G), can talk here? | 00:52 |
| CosmoHill | yep | 00:53 |
| CosmoHill | what version of MeeGo (lower case O) | 00:53 |
| XaToR | I have installed MeeGO (1.1), but when run "Update Software" it "Hans" at "Load list of software" | 00:53 |
| XaToR | or if open banshee music player, don't open | 00:54 |
| XaToR | why? | 00:54 |
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| XaToR | "Hangs"* | 00:54 |
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| CosmoHill | is it connected to the internet when you run software update? | 00:55 |
| XaToR | Yes, with Wi-Fi (DHCP) | 00:55 |
| CosmoHill | try "zypper update" from the command line | 00:55 |
| XaToR | mmh, ok wait, i'm reinstall meego | 00:56 |
| XaToR | and test "zypper update" | 00:56 |
| CosmoHill | is it a fresh install that is giving your problems or have you been using it for a while? | 00:56 |
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| XaToR | Fresh Install, it's my primary installation | 00:57 |
| gabrbedd | XaToR: That Eee is pretty old, isn't it? | 00:57 |
| XaToR | Yes, is pretty old :/ | 00:57 |
| CosmoHill | is it an intel celeron? | 00:58 |
| gabrbedd | XaToR: From a terminal screen... if you type this command: "cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep flags" | 00:58 |
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| gabrbedd | XaToR: Do you see "ssse3" ? | 00:58 |
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| XaToR | Wait, gabrbedd, i'm reinstalling meego ;) | 00:58 |
| gabrbedd | (That's three 's', 1 'e', 1 '3') | 00:58 |
| gabrbedd | :-) | 00:59 |
| gabrbedd | Chances are that your processor is not supported. | 00:59 |
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| CosmoHill | gabrbedd: you're like me, you swap from words to numbers mid-sentance | 00:59 |
| CosmoHill | XaToR: is it an Intel Celeron processor? | 00:59 |
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| gabrbedd | CosmoHill: I think he's got a Celeron-M ULV... at least according to Wikipedia | 00:59 |
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| XaToR | CosmoHill: yes, from bios Intel Celeron | 01:00 |
| CosmoHill | I'm trying to get him to say yes so I can say "that explains it, the package manager and banshee need SSSE3 to run" | 01:00 |
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| gabrbedd | Yeah, but "Celeron" is hard to pin down. I've had MeeGo work just fine on a CULV. | 01:01 |
| CosmoHill | http://wiki.meego.com/Supported_Processors | 01:01 |
| gabrbedd | ...and the CULV is technically a celeron. | 01:01 |
| CosmoHill | ah, I've been proven wrong by my own wiki page | 01:02 |
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| CosmoHill | gabrbedd: EEEPcs used Celeron and Atom processors, the Celeron ones don't have SSSE3 | 01:02 |
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| gabrbedd | CosmoHill: Right. | 01:03 |
| XaToR | mmmh, install meego with Chromium or Google Chrome? | 01:03 |
| CosmoHill | doesn't matter, something will require SSSE2 and brake | 01:04 |
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| CosmoHill | the google chrome one requires you to agree to a EULA | 01:04 |
| gabrbedd | XaToR: Doesn't matter which. And we're pretty sure your machine won't run MeeGo. | 01:04 |
| CosmoHill | I was thinking of a suppported device / laptop list but that would be crazy to maintain | 01:05 |
| CosmoHill | btw, do anyone in here have an AMD Fusion processor? | 01:05 |
| XaToR | gabrbedd: But will be supported? I do not know who put them on OS .. | 01:05 |
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| gabrbedd | CosmoHill: Probably would be better for the anaconda installer to check for cpu caps. | 01:06 |
| gabrbedd | XaToR: No, it won't be. Sorry. | 01:06 |
| XaToR | :( | 01:06 |
| wmarone__ | CosmoHill: not yet, sadly. do want one though :/ | 01:06 |
| wmarone__ | it does support SSSE3, however | 01:06 |
| gabrbedd | XaToR: for x86 hardware, MeeGo will only support Core2, Atom, or later. | 01:06 |
| vgrade | wmarone__, hi | 01:06 |
| wmarone__ | (but then you're trading off cpu compatibility to for graphics) | 01:07 |
| wmarone__ | vgrade: hello, saw the image you linked earlier | 01:07 |
| CosmoHill | gabrbedd and XaToR, check out the non-SSSE3 wiki page | 01:07 |
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| vgrade | wmarone__, you were on viewsonic right | 01:07 |
| wmarone__ | yes | 01:07 |
| CosmoHill | the latest generation of AMD support SSSE3 as does VIA but I don't want to add them to the list without someone running MeeGo on them first | 01:07 |
| vgrade | wmarone__, loads of errors after you enabled SIGNALFD | 01:08 |
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| gabrbedd | XaToR: http://wiki.meego.com/Devices/nonSSSE3 | 01:09 |
| CosmoHill | hey vgrade | 01:09 |
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| wmarone__ | vgrade: yes, and only a nonfunctional mouse/keyboard once disabled | 01:09 |
| XaToR | gabrbedd: i have read.. :/ | 01:09 |
| vgrade | CosmoHill, hi, hotting up in the championship | 01:10 |
| vgrade | wmarone__, ok, I removed CONFIG_TEGRA_MTD (something like that, don't have my VM booted) and enabled SYSVIPC | 01:11 |
| CosmoHill | vgrade: no idea what you're refering to | 01:11 |
| wmarone__ | ah | 01:11 |
| vgrade | wmarone__, then use the image at http://bug10738.openaos.org | 01:11 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10738 nor, Undecided, ---, tero.kojo, NEED, Meego community ftp server or similar needed | 01:11 |
| wmarone__ | yeah I disabled the tegra mtd drivers as well, but I don't have the gtablet anymore | 01:12 |
| wmarone__ | I might take a stab again when Compulab releases their "Trim Slice" | 01:12 |
| vgrade | CosmoHill, I thought you were reading | 01:12 |
| CosmoHill | ah yes | 01:12 |
| vgrade | CosmoHill, Leeds here | 01:12 |
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| vgrade | wmarone__, trim slice? | 01:13 |
| CosmoHill | 6 points ahead of us | 01:13 |
| wmarone__ | vgrade: http://www.slashgear.com/trim-slice-tegra-2-ultra-compact-desktop-gets-video-demo-04137807/ | 01:14 |
| vgrade | CosmoHill, not many games left, | 01:14 |
| wmarone__ | $250, ethernet, lots of usb and... rs232 | 01:14 |
| CosmoHill | yay, 3 -1 to Ipswich today, totally forgot about that >.< | 01:14 |
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| vgrade | wmarone__, ah yes | 01:16 |
| CosmoHill | vgrade: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/reading/9418771.stm :( | 01:16 |
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| berndhs | poor guy | 01:17 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: know anyone who is working with Sodaville hardware? | 01:22 |
| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 01:22 | |
| timeless_w7ip | anjunta is annoying me | 01:22 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, no, whats that | 01:22 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: Intel CE4100... intended for consumer electronics device designs | 01:22 |
| timeless_w7ip | it does evil things to files from outside its file system | 01:22 |
| TSCHAKeee | basically i think intel intends it for set top boxes | 01:23 |
| vgrade | ah, yes the one boxeeeeeee jumped to when they said tegra was not upto the job | 01:23 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: ahh so that's what the boxee box is | 01:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: the Boxee lead dev tried to make fun of me at SCALE | 01:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: at the media center panel | 01:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: with the microphones on, and the public watching in the room | 01:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: before the show started... "oh yeah, how many users do you have? oh that's right, you don't HAVE any users." | 01:25 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, if anyone wants to send me one, I'll put MeeGo on it :) | 01:25 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, wa*****r | 01:25 |
| timeless_w7ip | berndhs: hey, did you try building some package for me a few days back? | 01:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: WTF right? I took it on the chin and laughed...and when we were doing our introductions... I started my intro, "Hi we're LinuxMCE and we play media too, but we also unify and control virutall all tech inside the house...and we also.." and the Boxee guy interrupts me..... | 01:26 |
| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: I built the one with the strange Obsoletes | 01:26 |
| berndhs | the one that obsoleted itself | 01:26 |
| berndhs | the build didn't complain | 01:26 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: he says, "Wow so you can do this and this and that?" "Yes.. *explain* .... You can do that too?!?!?! (Yes, *explain)... You can do that too?!?!?!! (Yes, explain...)" | 01:26 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: and after two minutes of that, and pausing, he says, "Wow. cool." | 01:26 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: I put the fucker in his place. Check mate in one move :P :) | 01:26 |
| vgrade | CosmoHill, sorry to hear that, | 01:27 |
| TSCHAKeee | and see that was the thing, I came there admiring those guys, wanting to work with them to help make our system better too... | 01:27 |
| TSCHAKeee | but after all that shit happened... I have one mission in life, and that is to DESTROY Boxee and XBMC | 01:27 |
| TSCHAKeee | :P :) | 01:27 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, don't get mad | 01:29 |
| TSCHAKeee | i'm just flabberghasted at the shallowness that has permeated F/OSS software | 01:29 |
| TSCHAKeee | everybody wants fame, fortune, power | 01:29 |
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| TSCHAKeee | go somewhere else for that.. it's not her.e | 01:29 |
| berndhs | TSCHAKeee: i would settle for an income :P | 01:29 |
| TSCHAKeee | berndhs: i make an income solving problems for other people | 01:30 |
| TSCHAKeee | berndhs: i use that income to fuel my joys and passions, one of them working on free software. | 01:30 |
| berndhs | its good that you can do that | 01:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | berndhs: ok | 01:30 |
| TSCHAKeee | that way, I don't burn out. | 01:30 |
| XaToR | CosmoHill: With "Zypper Update", have 3 message (localhost klogd etc..) | 01:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | so, conclusion, it's legal, but strange? | 01:30 |
| TSCHAKeee | because I tried doing what I love, for income | 01:30 |
| TSCHAKeee | and I damn near ended up in a straight jacket | 01:31 |
| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: I don't know if its legal, just that it gets away with it | 01:31 |
| timeless_w7ip | berndhs: ok | 01:31 |
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| timeless_w7ip | my assumption is that the package is buggy and was trying to do something else | 01:31 |
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| berndhs | TSCHAKeee: oh sure, going both at the same time is a low percentage shot | 01:31 |
| timeless_w7ip | not sure what else, but something else | 01:31 |
| timeless_w7ip | berndhs: can i get you to try another package? | 01:32 |
| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: yes I would guess it was trying something else too, but not sure what | 01:32 |
| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: not right now, I dont have meego running anywhere | 01:32 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, interesting topic | 01:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | berndhs: high latency is fine w/ me | 01:32 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, OSS vs day job | 01:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | anthy-9100h-4.13.src.rpm is the package | 01:32 |
| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: ok :) | 01:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | i get: root/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.jT7PVV: 34: Syntax error: "(" unexpected | 01:33 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: the two for me are separate, and are the result of some severely hard knocks I've had in life so far. | 01:33 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: i spent my 20s doing it the wrong way, burning out to the point, where I actually had to dig out my old Atari 800, and start from the very beginning, and write a game...just so I could REMEMBER, and FEEL what it was like, WHY I got into computing in the first place. | 01:34 |
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| TSCHAKeee | don't ever do what you love for a day job. | 01:35 |
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| TSCHAKeee | you will no longer love it. | 01:35 |
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| timeless_w7ip | hrm, is "function stupid(){}" a bashism? | 01:36 |
| TSCHAKeee | php too | 01:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | assume i'm only dealing w/ a shell | 01:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | i don't know which shell | 01:37 |
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| TSCHAKeee | yeah that's sh/ksh/bash | 01:37 |
| berndhs | if its a shell and it doesn't say, its supposed to be sh | 01:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | yeah i know | 01:38 |
| timeless_w7ip | but i'm dealing w/ <random error from shell based on random "shell script input"> | 01:38 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'm trying to determine if the shell-script-input is bash-ist | 01:38 |
| timeless_w7ip | and if the shell that's running that input is !bash | 01:38 |
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| miksuh | Could someone please update the Debian repository containing MeeGo SDK | 02:16 |
| miksuh | there is this repository: | 02:16 |
| miksuh | http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/sdk/host/repos/debian/5.0/ | 02:16 |
| miksuh | but that is for the Debian 5.0 'Lenny' and Debian 6.0 'Squeeze' was released month ago | 02:17 |
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| berndhs | timeless_w7ip: the anthy srpm builds ok here, whats special about it ? | 02:41 |
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| vgrade | night night | 02:46 |
| CosmoHill | cyas | 02:47 |
| lcuk | gnite vgrade \o | 02:47 |
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| xiambax | Anyone get meego to run on view pad 10? | 03:08 |
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| djszapi | http://paste.kde.org/6830/ -> How can I fix it ? I always thought if I just make an scp from the host meego image /etc/zypp into the n900 phone /etc/ folder, the network should work if the resolv, route etc are correct, seems not, what do I do wrong ? I can ping the google.com from the target device tho. | 03:24 |
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| TSCHAKeee | vgrade: dude, what GRUB are you using? | 04:14 |
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| berndhs | good night | 05:19 |
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| djszapi | moin | 05:20 |
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| TSCHAKeee | i notice that matchbox-keyboard in meego is being built without GTK+ IM support | 06:08 |
| * TSCHAKeee is making a version of the package that can do this. | 06:09 | |
| TSCHAKeee | very odd because | 06:09 |
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| TSCHAKeee | it would actually MAKE NetBook UX USABLE on tablets. | 06:09 |
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| Termana | morning | 06:47 |
| xiambax | Its 9pm :D | 06:47 |
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| Termana | xiambax: | 06:49 |
| Termana | ~ugt | 06:49 |
| infobot | i heard ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html | 06:49 |
| xiambax | Wow. Ive been using irc for 14 years and i have never heard that before. | 06:50 |
| xiambax | On the other hand. I know what an OGT is | 06:50 |
| Bostik | good `timeofday()` | 06:50 |
| Termana | it's not morning here either, but I still say good morning | 06:50 |
| xiambax | ~ogt | 06:50 |
| xiambax | Meh | 06:50 |
| xiambax | So Im doing some research on the Viewpad 10. | 06:50 |
| xiambax | Seems like a good buy if I can get Alpha to run on it | 06:51 |
| xiambax | and the touch screen sensitivity working properly | 06:51 |
| xiambax | Thoughts? | 06:51 |
| Termana | OGT == Official Game Time? This is no game son, I am disappoint. | 06:51 |
| timoph | no. it's 6.50am :) | 06:51 |
| xiambax | http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=OGT | 06:51 |
| xiambax | The tool reference | 06:52 |
| xiambax | Anyway. | 06:52 |
| xiambax | Back to the view tab. | 06:52 |
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| Termana | Didn't you really answer your own question if you've done the research? | 06:54 |
| Termana | :p | 06:54 |
| xiambax | To be honest the whole tablet market overwhelms me | 06:54 |
| xiambax | I have so many options | 06:54 |
| xiambax | I just need someone to reaffirm my research and suggest alternatives | 06:54 |
| xiambax | and/or suggest alternatives | 06:54 |
| Termana | Try tampons instead | 06:55 |
| xiambax | facepalm | 06:55 |
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| Termana | I'm kidding :p Anyway, mostly your choice is between the iPad, the Samsung Galaxy S Tab, the Motorola Xoom and any x86 tablet/netbook that flips around. | 06:56 |
| xiambax | I was thinking ExoPC or Viewpad | 06:57 |
| xiambax | Cause I could install my own os | 06:57 |
| xiambax | You can't install third party os's on galaxy S can you | 06:57 |
| raster | you can | 06:57 |
| raster | if u root it | 06:57 |
| Termana | I think you probably could run MeeGo on it | 06:58 |
| raster | someone started a meego port somewhere | 06:58 |
| xiambax | via vac or baremetal? | 06:58 |
| raster | they have it bnooting to a console | 06:58 |
| raster | i think its baremetal | 06:58 |
| raster | good luck in getting opengl drivers working | 06:58 |
| raster | :) | 06:58 |
| raster | which means experience will be middle to poor until they do | 06:59 |
| raster | and that'll pretty much not happen | 06:59 |
| Termana | raster, It would help if Samsung released some drivers that would work properly with MeeGo | 06:59 |
| Termana | *hint* *hint* | 06:59 |
| raster | bwahahahahahah | 06:59 |
| xiambax | yeah its all virtualized with vnc | 07:00 |
| Termana | xiambax, Anyway, it seems like there might be a bit of a community around the ViewPad vs the ExoPC from a quick search. | 07:00 |
| Termana | bit more* | 07:01 |
| raster | xiambax: not the port i read up on | 07:01 |
| raster | actual booting real kernel | 07:01 |
| raster | and up to console | 07:01 |
| raster | noone of that hack vnc+chroot et al. stuff | 07:01 |
| Termana | When you have a community chucking everything they can on something, it's probably a good buy to be able to use niche OSes | 07:01 |
| raster | but its only up to console | 07:01 |
| raster | good luck in getting all the rest to work | 07:01 |
| raster | will be a fair bit of work | 07:01 |
| Termana | s/niche/small market | 07:01 |
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| xiambax | the view pad 10 seems to have better specs | 07:03 |
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| raster | if u want a tablet to put meego on i'd suggest an atom one | 07:07 |
| raster | going to be easier | 07:07 |
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| raster | beware... you'd need to worry abotu drivers then for touch panel and other components - may be easy, work out of the box, or not work at all and mean you need to write some code | 07:11 |
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| araujo | raster, j0 | 07:13 |
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| raster | araujo: moo | 07:28 |
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| xiambax | it is atom | 07:32 |
| xiambax | http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=42503 | 07:32 |
| raster | yes | 07:32 |
| raster | but what about wifi, touchscreen, etc. etc. | 07:33 |
| raster | :) | 07:33 |
| raster | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1654388 | 07:34 |
| raster | for example | 07:34 |
| raster | ppl having no end of problems | 07:34 |
| raster | getting touch to work | 07:34 |
| raster | http://ollie-reardon.co.cc/?p=182 | 07:34 |
| raster | ]and there someone has a howto | 07:35 |
| raster | :) | 07:35 |
| iekku | good morning | 07:35 |
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| RST38h | moo all | 07:59 |
| Stskeeps | moo | 08:00 |
| raster | moo2! | 08:01 |
| RST38h | Any...mhm...more news today? =) | 08:01 |
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| Stskeeps | well, nokia's waking up regarding meego (finally) it seems, statements by peter schneider | 08:03 |
| Stskeeps | but besides that, no | 08:03 |
| RST38h | Innnnteresting =) URL? | 08:04 |
| TSCHAKeee | muuahahahha | 08:04 |
| TSCHAKeee | success | 08:04 |
| Stskeeps | http://meego.com/community/blogs/petermeego/2011/nokia-appoints-new-head-meego-efforts , http://twitter.com/PeterMeeGo | 08:05 |
| * TSCHAKeee rebuilt matchbox-keyboard with the required gtk im bridge and it works yay | 08:05 | |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee: the good thing about old-school mobile linux software is that it's been beaten so much in various distros and cross build tools that it usually does what it's supposed to when you tinker with something :P | 08:06 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: well, i really wanted to use the meegotouch keyboard | 08:07 |
| TSCHAKeee | problem is,.. i have yet to actually see it work properly | 08:07 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Nah, this does not sound like waking up, more like "release the Harmattan thingie, then see what to do next", i.e. no changes | 08:07 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: and the carrick network applet is gtk/mx so it made more sense to use matchbox. | 08:07 |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee: right | 08:07 |
| TSCHAKeee | i really want to know, is all of handset going to be retooled? | 08:08 |
| TSCHAKeee | to use Qt Quick instead of MTF? | 08:08 |
| RST38h | TSCHAK: most likely yes. | 08:08 |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee: so, what i think will happen is that many things will be replaced with tablet UX stuff, which is qml + intel's qml components | 08:08 |
| RST38h | TSCHAK: Isn't QtQuick not the same thing though? | 08:09 |
| Stskeeps | of course this is not open yet. | 08:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | it will be very nice | 08:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | and when that happens | 08:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | i will FINALLY start work on the new orbiter | 08:09 |
| RST38h | Sorry, Stskeeps: isn't QtQ the same as QML+ components? | 08:09 |
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| TSCHAKeee | all in all though, i am glad I was able to build an orbiter stack atop meego core | 08:10 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: there's some definition of qt quick, but i can't recall it just yet :P | 08:10 |
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| RST38h | Stskeeps: afaik that is it :) | 08:11 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: + a bit of javascript for elementary interactions | 08:12 |
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| michaelg|nok | qtq = qml + qtdeclarative etc. components is extra | 08:14 |
| RST38h | Isn't qtd the same as qml? | 08:15 |
| * RST38h is lost now | 08:15 | |
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| michaelg|nok | well.. qml is the language, qtd is the C++ api | 08:15 |
| djszapi | Stskeeps: do you have any idea about the repository issue ? | 08:15 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: sorry didn | 08:15 |
| Stskeeps | ''t read my backlog yet | 08:15 |
| djszapi | the problem is shortly that I cannot use zypper on the gadget in order to install packages using the network connection of the host PC. | 08:16 |
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| Stskeeps | djszapi: do you have set up iptables NAT on the host PC? | 08:17 |
| djszapi | at least I did the same as with fremantle and that works | 08:17 |
| djszapi | iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -s 192.168.2.15/32 -j MASQUERADE && echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | ok, that's what i was hinting on | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | you said ping works? | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | to www.google.com | 08:18 |
| djszapi | fex. I could ping the google site, so it is clearly zypper repository issue | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | what error do you get? | 08:18 |
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| Stskeeps | or it just stalls | 08:19 |
| djszapi | http://paste.kde.org/6830/ | 08:19 |
| RST38h | michaelg: Same thing then, as one is useless without another | 08:19 |
| Stskeeps | does ping repo.pub.meego.com work? | 08:19 |
| RST38h | Although I guess you can run limited scope QML-only apps in a player | 08:19 |
| djszapi | iirc name resolution issue with ping, too. | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: ok, what's in your /etc/resolv.conf ? | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: this file gets reset at every boot | 08:20 |
| djszapi | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking -> what this page writes. | 08:21 |
| Stskeeps | i mean /etc/resolv.conf on n900 side | 08:21 |
| djszapi | yes | 08:21 |
| Stskeeps | ok, try to remove the 127.0.0.1 line | 08:22 |
| Stskeeps | i just use nameserver 8.8.8.8 personally | 08:22 |
| timoph | chattr +i might help | 08:22 |
| thiago_home | connman is the DNS server | 08:23 |
| Stskeeps | thiago_home: yeah, but because connman ignorantly refuses to deal with usb gadgets, we can't use that :P | 08:23 |
| Stskeeps | as it assumes there's no connection alive and doesn't pass it on | 08:23 |
| djszapi | Stskeeps: seems it works now | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: o | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | k | 08:27 |
| djszapi | 08:20 < Stskeeps> djszapi: this file gets reset at every boot -> will it keep this 8.8.8.8 then or should I add it manually all the time ? | 08:28 |
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| Stskeeps | djszapi: won't keep it, because connman will overwrite it each time | 08:29 |
| djszapi | my application just crashes out of my code (according to the backtrace): https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14286 | 08:30 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug 14286 nor, Undecided, 1.0.90.4, ulf.hofemeier, NEW, Crash with a simple Qt application | 08:30 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: ah, the fantastic mtf qt style.. | 08:30 |
| djszapi | ? :) | 08:30 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: 1) are you running as user meego? 2) are you export DISPLAY=:0? | 08:30 |
| Stskeeps | just have to verify that first | 08:31 |
| djszapi | 1) no, but root 2) yes. | 08:31 |
| Stskeeps | ok, X server won't accept your X app as root | 08:31 |
| Stskeeps | su meego | 08:31 |
| djszapi | my qml app launches just fine tho. with root. | 08:32 |
| djszapi | and it is a binary with qml resource files. | 08:32 |
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| timoph | djszapi: huh? AFAIK that's not supposed to work | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: do you log in as meego first or as root? | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | with ssh | 08:33 |
| djszapi | root | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | odd | 08:33 |
| djszapi | I am always root everywhere apart from the xhost + | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | that's not supposed to work ;) | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | ah, ok | 08:33 |
| thiago_home | use the non-root user | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | that was the missing piece of the puzzle | 08:34 |
| djszapi | well, it is odd I cannot run an application as root... | 08:34 |
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| timoph | not really. IMO root is not supposed to run GUI apps | 08:34 |
| thiago_home | there are many reasons why this could happen | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: does the crash still happen if you run as 'meego'? if yes, then rm the file named something-meego-something in /usr/lib/qt4/plugins/styles/ | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: and then try again | 08:35 |
| thiago_home | one is that the D-Bus server doesn't allow you to connect and this is the most likely issue | 08:35 |
| thiago_home | other reasons might be that the style requires some shared files found in the user's home dir, so having a different $HOME causes it not to find them | 08:35 |
| djszapi | well, segfault as 'meego' user, too. | 08:36 |
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| Stskeeps | ok then, try rm'ing the file i mentioned | 08:36 |
| thiago_home | can you post the debugging-enabled backtrace? | 08:37 |
| Stskeeps | or better yet, mv'ing it somewhere else | 08:37 |
| djszapi | well the backtrace is the same | 08:37 |
| thiago_home | valgrind trace would also help | 08:38 |
| djszapi | Stskeeps: there is just one file there: rm /usr/lib/qt4/plugins/styles/libmeegotouchqtstyleplugin.so | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: ok, mv this to /root | 08:38 |
| djszapi | thiago_home I do not have more space to install valgrind | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: and try again | 08:38 |
| djszapi | right now. | 08:38 |
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| thiago_home | the more information you give, the more likely it is to get the bug fixed | 08:38 |
| djszapi | sure, but as said I do not have time now to be sysadmin on my system and free up spaces. | 08:38 |
| djszapi | I can do it tonight, but not now | 08:39 |
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| djszapi | Stskeeps: seems it works afterwords, even with root. | 08:41 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: ok, then the bug is probably in meegotouchqtstyleplugin, when you have time, file a bug with a proper backtrace | 08:41 |
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| djszapi | well, I sent the backtrace for the segfault, what else should I send ? | 08:42 |
| thiago_home | the backtrace containing debug symbols | 08:42 |
| djszapi | ok | 08:42 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: you may need to install libmeegotouch-debuginfo | 08:43 |
| thiago_home | why are you using 1.0.90? | 08:43 |
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| djszapi | thiago_home: that was the newest image last week. | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | 1.0.90? you mean 1.1.90 surely :) | 08:43 |
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| djszapi | yes | 08:43 |
| thiago_home | please include the package versions too, since you're using a snapshot release | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | djszapi: also, add what exact image you used in the bug report and hardware it happened on | 08:44 |
| djszapi | hardware is added | 08:44 |
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| Stskeeps | ok | 08:44 |
| djszapi | yeah, I was quite lame with the version... | 08:45 |
| djszapi | :p | 08:45 |
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| Tm_T | it's not thursday | 08:55 |
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| thiago_home | right, so it's not yellow day | 08:59 |
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| timeless_w7ip | grr | 09:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | so, are there any rules about bashisms in .spec files? | 09:34 |
| Stskeeps | /bin/sh is stated to be bash in meego, for some reason | 09:34 |
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| timeless_w7ip | grr | 09:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | to enable bashisms i take it? | 09:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | bashisms are a reason that at least one of the meego rpm files failed to index on mxr | 09:35 |
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| mikhas | just install bash then | 09:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | mikhas: um, there's a difference between having bash <installed> and having bash = /bin/sh | 09:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | imagine i'm not root (and i'm not) | 09:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | making me screw up all scripts globally just so a couple of poorly implemented things can assume /bin/sh = /bin/bash is not nice | 09:38 |
| timeless_w7ip | (especially since i can't do that, not being root and all) | 09:38 |
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| * timeless_w7ip wonders if __sh exists and can be used to ask rpmbuild to use a diferent shell | 09:39 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | ___build_shell looks promising | 09:42 |
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| timeless_w7ip | stskeeps: ok, so... | 09:49 |
| timeless_w7ip | for some reason rpmbuild of a linux kernel package has decided it would be a good idea to run some interactive form of the kernel configurator | 09:50 |
| timeless_w7ip | any idea how one could prevent rpm scripts from accidentally triggering stuff which tries to read from stdin ? | 09:50 |
| ali1234 | yes | rpmbuild ... | 09:51 |
| ali1234 | but seriously | 09:51 |
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| ali1234 | when the kernel does that it usually means one of two things: | 09:51 |
| ali1234 | either ARCH isn't set properly or your .config is out of date | 09:52 |
| timeless_w7ip | well, i was hoping it wasn't going to do whatever this configure step is | 09:52 |
| timeless_w7ip | since that belongs in %build not %prep | 09:52 |
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| ali1234 | what is it trying to do? | 09:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | hold on | 09:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/rpmbuild-kernel-err.txt | 09:55 |
| timeless_w7ip | the last line 'error in reading' is because i sent a ^D through to the rpmbuild script | 09:55 |
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| ali1234 | ah ok | 09:56 |
| ali1234 | make ARCH=x86 oldconfig | 09:56 |
| ali1234 | this is the command to update an old .config, and it will go interactive if the config is old | 09:57 |
| ali1234 | i have no idea why that is in a spec file | 09:57 |
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| timeless_w7ip | to piss me off? | 09:57 |
| timeless_w7ip | # We want to run the config checks of all configurations for all architectures always.rn# That way, developers immediately found out if they forget to enable not-their-nativern# architecture. It's cheap to run anyway. | 09:57 |
| timeless_w7ip | cheap my ass | 09:57 |
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| ali1234 | ah | 09:58 |
| ali1234 | also, why is it grepping for CONFIG_ARM? | 09:59 |
| timeless_w7ip | hold on | 09:59 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/kernel.spec | 09:59 |
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| timeless_w7ip | basically it's testing each config file | 10:00 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 10:00 |
| timeless_w7ip | i think i claim this belongs in %build | 10:00 |
| ali1234 | if you take a .config for arm and attempt to run make oldconfig with ARCH=x86, that is pretty much guaranteed to go interactive since arm has a bunch of config options that x86 doesn't | 10:00 |
| timeless_w7ip | i don't think it's doing that here though | 10:01 |
| timeless_w7ip | it's trying to pick the ARCH= based on which arch the .config has | 10:01 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 10:02 |
| ali1234 | maybe you found an actual bug in that mechanism | 10:02 |
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| * timeless_w7ip wonders how to figure out where in its state machine this thing is | 10:02 | |
| ali1234 | which thing? | 10:03 |
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| timeless_w7ip | well rpmbuild or the build script | 10:04 |
| timeless_w7ip | the .config says Linux kernel version: 2.6.28.rc7-4.netbook | 10:04 |
| timeless_w7ip | CONFIG_X86_32=y .. CONFIG_X86=y .. CONFIG_ARCH_DEFCONFIG="arch/x86/configs/i386_defconfig" .. | 10:04 |
| ali1234 | so... that's an ancient kernel | 10:04 |
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| timeless_w7ip | not sure if the kernel is ancient | 10:05 |
| timeless_w7ip | it could be that the idiots "maintaining" the ".config" file aren't doing a great job | 10:05 |
| timeless_w7ip | remember, my build path is kernel-2.6.37/linux-2.6.37 | 10:06 |
| timeless_w7ip | grr | 10:07 |
| timeless_w7ip | where's this file coming from? SOURCE? | 10:07 |
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| ali1234 | the source rpm has config-x86 | 10:07 |
| ali1234 | and config-generic | 10:07 |
| timeless_w7ip | this seems to be config-generic | 10:08 |
| ali1234 | yeah config-x86 seems to be some kind of diff | 10:08 |
| timeless_w7ip | is it likely that a config file from 2.6.28 won't work w/ 2.6.37? | 10:08 |
| ali1234 | it will "work" | 10:09 |
| tomma | "make oldconfig" | 10:09 |
| ali1234 | but any option that is in the kernel and not the config will be prompted for | 10:09 |
| ali1234 | which is what you are seeing | 10:09 |
| timeless_w7ip | ali: "prompting for" violates my definition of "work[ing]" | 10:09 |
| ali1234 | then it is highly unlikely to work | 10:09 |
| timeless_w7ip | tomma: http://mxr.meego.com/rpmbuild-kernel-err.txt | 10:10 |
| timeless_w7ip | the script /tried/ to do that | 10:10 |
| ali1234 | can you tell me what it prompts you for? | 10:10 |
| timeless_w7ip | it looks like it failed miserably a few lines back | 10:10 |
| Myrtti | I think my email client or something is broken | 10:10 |
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| Myrtti | how come I get so little email now from the mailing lists | 10:10 |
| timeless_w7ip | write(2, "\nError in reading or end of file"..., 34) = 34rnwrite(1, "Generic x86 support (X86_GENERIC"..., 3346) = 3346 | 10:11 |
| timeless_w7ip | iirc it was asking about a multiprocessor thing the second time around | 10:11 |
| timeless_w7ip | i can't tell you what it asked about the first time around | 10:12 |
| ali1234 | run rpmbuild interactively | 10:12 |
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| timeless_w7ip | grr | 10:12 |
| timeless_w7ip | that's going to totally confuse this poor script which wants to get work done | 10:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | but ok | 10:13 |
| ali1234 | do it in another folder or something | 10:13 |
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| * timeless_w7ip is amused by 'folder' | 10:13 | |
| timeless_w7ip | /usr/bin/ld: reopening scripts/basic/fixdep: Text file busy | 10:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | that's amusing | 10:14 |
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| timeless_w7ip | - /usr/bin/ld: final link failed: Text file busy | 10:15 |
| ali1234 | well, this sounds pretty serious | 10:15 |
| ali1234 | failure to build a proper config is merely a symptom | 10:16 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1138984 | 10:16 |
| ali1234 | that's the very first thing it goes interactive on? | 10:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | yep | 10:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | :) | 10:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | i didn't export any vars, so it's possible i did something wrong by not | 10:18 |
| timeless_w7ip | but we're asssuming the config is x86 and my host is x86, so i doubt i need any | 10:18 |
| timeless_w7ip | if you want me to export stuff, you'd have to hold my hand | 10:18 |
| ali1234 | "Makefile.config" is supposed to patch config-generic with config-x86 using merge.pl | 10:19 |
| * timeless_w7ip ponders bug 14224 | 10:19 | |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14224 is not accessible | 10:19 |
| ali1234 | i would guess that isn't happening | 10:19 |
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| timeless_w7ip | um | 10:19 |
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| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/repo.out was the full out for my initial unhappy life | 10:23 |
| timeless_w7ip | and http://mxr.meego.com/repo.err is the full err for the same | 10:23 |
| ali1234 | neither config-generic nor config-x86 has KERNEL_GZIP | 10:23 |
| timeless_w7ip | all things considered, there aren't many errors | 10:23 |
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| ali1234 | i suspect you really could fudge this one with just yes "" | rpmbuild | 10:25 |
| ali1234 | i don't understand how this rpm is supposed to build without that though | 10:25 |
| timeless_w7ip | how does yes work for a 4 answer question? | 10:25 |
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| ali1234 | yes "" will just send lots of newlines | 10:26 |
| ali1234 | causing make oldconfig to select the default answer marked with ">" | 10:26 |
| * timeless_w7ip tries | 10:26 | |
| timeless_w7ip | ali: btw, i owe you a dinner | 10:27 |
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| ali1234 | hmmm: http://build.meego.com/package/rawlog?arch=i586&package=kernel&project=Trunk&repository=standard | 10:27 |
| ali1234 | i see a bunch of errors just like yours... | 10:27 |
| timeless_w7ip | ... | 10:28 |
| timeless_w7ip | Error in reading or end of file. | 10:28 |
| ali1234 | ah... | 10:28 |
| ali1234 | i wonder | 10:28 |
| timeless_w7ip | that's the bit where the system sends ^D or an equivalent as a "Get me the F*** out of here you lame ****er" | 10:28 |
| ali1234 | what does make oldconfig do if there is no tty? and how are you running your script? | 10:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | my script has a tty because i'm running it from one while i'm doing debugging | 10:29 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 10:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | rpmbuild -bp kernel.spec < /dev/null ? | 10:30 |
| ali1234 | i suspect make oldconfig behaves differently without one, ie it just skips all questions | 10:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | fwiw i still got the /usr/bin/ld: reopening scripts/basic/fixdep: Text file busy error bit | 10:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | w/ yes "", but at least it didn't hang | 10:30 |
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| ali1234 | yes, make config < /dev/null does not ask questions... and prints that "Error in reading or end of file." message a lot too | 10:32 |
| ali1234 | so yeah, that would be the answer | 10:32 |
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| ali1234 | and it still outputs anyway | 10:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | ok, i should be able to pass dev null to rpmbuild | 10:32 |
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| ali1234 | yeah | 10:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | hrm, i have a feeling i'm going to need Open3 for this | 10:34 |
| ali1234 | are you using popen or something? | 10:36 |
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| timeless_w7ip | i'm currently using perl's system() to call rpmbuild | 10:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | which is a bad idea | 10:36 |
| ali1234 | ah | 10:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | since it results in stdout/stderr going to stdout/stderr | 10:36 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 10:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | it's the only part of my code that's naive like that | 10:37 |
| ali1234 | so you need to popen and then close the stdin | 10:37 |
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| ali1234 | or something | 10:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | i wonder if this would have worked differently if i used `` or something | 10:37 |
| timeless_w7ip | i think i was playing w/ system() just because | 10:37 |
| ali1234 | can't you just do "myscript.pl < /dev/null"? | 10:38 |
| timeless_w7ip | i was trying to use a form of a perl command that passed arguments as arguments instead of constructing a script and evaluating it | 10:38 |
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| timeless_w7ip | trying to make my code more audit friendly and theoretically more tolerant of evil random characters | 10:38 |
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| ali1234 | yeah that can trip you up if you try to use shell stuff like redirects | 10:39 |
| timeless_w7ip | right | 10:39 |
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| timeless_w7ip | i can either switch back to using `` and friends or move to open3 | 10:39 |
| ali1234 | but the simple (and probably bad) way around that is to make the first arg be "/bin/sh" or similar | 10:39 |
| ali1234 | eg /bin/sh "rpmbuild ... < /dev/null" | 10:40 |
| timeless_w7ip | right, but doing that means i have to ensure that <...> isn't dangerous | 10:40 |
| ali1234 | yes | 10:40 |
| timeless_w7ip | by having each of the components of <...> as its own argument to rpmbuild, i was mostly protected against some forms of dangerous | 10:41 |
| timeless_w7ip | (and yes, i'm well aware that rpmbuild is *incredibly* dangerous) | 10:41 |
| ali1234 | so... | 10:41 |
| timeless_w7ip | i mean, $x = `rpmbuild -bp foo.spec < /dev/null 2>&1` | 10:41 |
| timeless_w7ip | is probably good enough for my purposes | 10:42 |
| timeless_w7ip | i actually don't think i have any interesting arguments | 10:42 |
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| ali1234 | does system wait for the command to finish? | 10:43 |
| timeless_w7ip | yes | 10:44 |
| timeless_w7ip | or at least, i hope so :) | 10:44 |
| ali1234 | if so, using popen (or Open3 as it seems to be called on perl) would let you run multiple tasks in parallel | 10:44 |
| ali1234 | if you wanted to hammer your server for some reason | 10:44 |
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| timeless_w7ip | i've already done that once | 10:45 |
| timeless_w7ip | i had to ask a sysadmin to kick it | 10:45 |
| timeless_w7ip | since he's 10hrs west of me, that was rather inconvenient :) | 10:45 |
| timeless_w7ip | there's no real need to parallelize here | 10:45 |
| timeless_w7ip | as long as the system can incrementally update sources for only packages which have been updated, the general load to the update step is low | 10:46 |
| timeless_w7ip | and in theory the pieces are close to available to make that happen | 10:46 |
| timeless_w7ip | (they aren't ready yet, but that's hopefully a couple of day's work) | 10:46 |
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| timeless_w7ip | stskeeps: are you in Security_Group ? | 10:51 |
| timeless_w7ip | andre: ping | 10:52 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_w7ip: no, i'm a heathen | 10:52 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ferenc! | 10:52 |
| andre | timeless_w7ip: I'm the wrong one | 10:52 |
| timeless_w7ip | are you in Security_Group ? | 10:52 |
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| timeless_w7ip | andre: you're the wrong andre? | 10:52 |
| timeless_w7ip | disappointing. can you get the right one for me? :) | 10:52 |
| ferenc | timeless_w7ip: hi timeless! | 10:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | hi | 10:53 |
| andre | timeless_w7ip: yes | 10:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'm looking at bugzilla and i think something broke it | 10:53 |
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| ferenc | timeless_w7ip: are you referring to maemo bugzilla? | 10:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | meego sadly | 10:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | just hoping that there was a transitivity property active | 10:54 |
| ferenc | timeless_w7ip: I have got nothing to do with meego bz. | 10:54 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ok | 10:55 |
| * timeless_w7ip figures it out | 10:55 | |
| timeless_w7ip | either i did a really really bad job of cloning | 10:55 |
| ferenc | timeless_w7ip: you could try sending a mail to the meego-it list. | 10:55 |
| timeless_w7ip | or cloning dos something really really really stupid | 10:55 |
| timeless_w7ip | s/dos/does/ | 10:55 |
| infobot | timeless_w7ip meant: or cloning does something really really really stupid | 10:55 |
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| * timeless_w7ip can't tell which | 10:55 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | ali: so... | 10:57 |
| timeless_w7ip | is it reasonable to claim that a package as pushed should work w/o requiring < /dev/null ? | 10:57 |
| timeless_w7ip | i.e. that the package is buggy and the maintainer negligent | 10:57 |
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| ali1234 | hmm | 11:00 |
| ali1234 | possibly | 11:00 |
| ali1234 | i mean they should probably be running make oldconfig < /dev/null in the rpm if that's what they want | 11:00 |
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| ali1234 | because if you run rpmbuild interactively you should not get a prompt with the potential to select bad settings | 11:01 |
| ali1234 | so i'm going to say yes | 11:01 |
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| ali1234 | otoh it looks like it is partly by design | 11:02 |
| ali1234 | but still, whatever it is they are trying to do, there must be a better (although possibly less clever) way to do it | 11:03 |
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| pillar_ | are the qt qml components in somewhat usable state on meego? | 11:08 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ali: can i get you to file the bug for this | 11:11 |
| timeless_w7ip | personally i think the right behavior is for the rpm to abort if it that make thing asks for input | 11:12 |
| timeless_w7ip | because it means that the configuration is incomplete | 11:12 |
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| timeless_w7ip | and given that the spec automatically tests all such configs, it's trivial for the maintainer to update the package before submitting | 11:13 |
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| ali1234 | well making it do that would be tricky | 11:14 |
| ali1234 | rpm i mean | 11:14 |
| ali1234 | if i were going to file a bug on this it would be along the lines of "tried to build kernel, got weird menu" | 11:15 |
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| ali1234 | thing is, there's nothing wrong with not including every config option as long as you are willing to accept the default | 11:16 |
| timeless_w7ip | well, in theory you could use yes " " | stupid | magic "if /choice/ DIE!" | 11:16 |
| ali1234 | yeah but you would have to put that in every spec | 11:17 |
| ali1234 | imean there's no simple way to make rpm die if anything it runs ever asks for input | 11:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | i think it only applies to this one | 11:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | well, it depends on what the heck they're trying to do here | 11:18 |
| timeless_w7ip | if they want to see when their conf is incomplete, it should do something like this | 11:19 |
| timeless_w7ip | if not, it should use </dev/null | 11:19 |
| ali1234 | either way it should never be asking the user for input | 11:19 |
| timeless_w7ip | oh, it's my favorite | 11:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | IO-Socket-SSL-1.35 | 11:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | + /usr/bin/iconv -f iso-8859-1 -t utf-8 -o README{.utf8,} | 11:21 |
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| ali1234 | er... how do i set up source repos? | 11:22 |
| Stskeeps | they're rpms like any other | 11:22 |
| Stskeeps | i think | 11:22 |
| * timeless_w7ip shrugs | 11:23 | |
| timeless_w7ip | i can give you the script i use :) | 11:23 |
| ali1234 | when i try to zypper source-install kernel it says "Source package 'kernel' not found." | 11:23 |
| ali1234 | yeah i want this bug report to actually be reproducable :) | 11:23 |
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| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/crawl-meego-repo.pl.txt?raw=1 | 11:24 |
| timeless_w7ip | that will get you *all* srpms for a given 'version', defaulting to trunk latest | 11:25 |
| ali1234 | so i just needed to nano -w /etc/zypp/repos.d/oss.repo and set enabled=1 for oss-source repo | 11:25 |
| * timeless_w7ip wonders what -w does | 11:25 | |
| ali1234 | me too | 11:26 |
| timeless_w7ip | disables wordwrap | 11:26 |
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| timeless_w7ip | right, so... that takes me back to my friendly stupid IO thing | 11:27 |
| timeless_w7ip | for some reason it thinks that it'd be a good idea to read from stdin too | 11:27 |
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| timeless_w7ip | is {} another bashism? | 11:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | dash -c "echo /usr/bin/iconv -f iso-8859-1 -t utf-8 -o README{.utf8,}" | 11:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | > /usr/bin/iconv -f iso-8859-1 -t utf-8 -o README{.utf8,} | 11:30 |
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| timeless_w7ip | bash -c "echo /usr/bin/iconv -f iso-8859-1 -t utf-8 -o README{.utf8,}" | 11:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | > /usr/bin/iconv -f iso-8859-1 -t utf-8 -o README.utf8 README | 11:30 |
| timeless_w7ip | ok, so in theory when i switch rpmbuild to using bash, my problem w/ IO-Socket-SSL will go away | 11:31 |
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| timeless_w7ip | could someone please explain to me *why* it makes sense to write README{.utf8,} instead of README.utf8 README | 11:31 |
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| timeless_w7ip | especially given that the thing before this is <-o> | 11:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | so what you have is a token which takes one argument followed by a token which produces two arguments, one for the preceding argument, and one for something else | 11:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | i mean, i reserve the right to be cute occasionally, but this does not count | 11:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | so... | 11:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | if i wanted to use the community obs w/ my own rpmmacros, could i do it? | 11:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'd love to see all of the errors triggered by fixing _build_shell to /bin/dash | 11:34 |
| ruskie | hehe | 11:34 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ruskie: keep in mind that i'm hitting each and every stupid error related to this | 11:34 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ooh, my long running process finally reached apr 6 (target is apr 30) | 11:35 |
| ruskie | README{.utf8,} <-- just reduces the amount of things to type | 11:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | ruskie: in a .spec file?! | 11:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | you type it once | 11:35 |
| ruskie | hehe | 11:35 |
| ruskie | people still do it since they get used to it | 11:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | if this where something i was running in a shell, sure, but in a spec file, being magical like this seems stupid | 11:36 |
| timeless_w7ip | s/where/were/ | 11:36 |
| infobot | timeless_w7ip meant: if this were something i was running in a shell, sure, but in a spec file, being magical like this seems stupid | 11:36 |
| * timeless_w7ip makes typos when angry | 11:36 | |
| ruskie | hehe | 11:36 |
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| ali1234 | ok, when you zypper source-install... what does it do with it? | 11:37 |
| ruskie | btw how would switching the build shell to dash solve problems? | 11:37 |
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| ali1234 | it wouldn't | 11:38 |
| ali1234 | it would just expose them | 11:38 |
| ali1234 | oh ok it puts it in a folder called rpmbuild... | 11:38 |
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| ali1234 | ok, zypper si -d kernel did not install gcc. pretty sure you need that to build a kernel. | 11:41 |
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| timeless_w7ip | heh | 11:42 |
| timeless_w7ip | source install installs the source | 11:42 |
| timeless_w7ip | it clearly doesn't install the build dept | 11:42 |
| timeless_w7ip | s/dept/deps/ | 11:42 |
| infobot | timeless_w7ip meant: it clearly doesn't install the build deps | 11:42 |
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| ali1234 | si -d does | 11:42 |
| timeless_w7ip | oh | 11:42 |
| ali1234 | it's supposed to anyway | 11:42 |
| ali1234 | what it actually does is install the deps that the package maintainer thinks you probably don't have | 11:43 |
| ali1234 | "gcc? everyone has that right?" | 11:43 |
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| dm8tbr | on debian there's build-essential for meego we have that package group meego-..... can one add that as a dependency? asking out of curiosity here | 11:44 |
| ali1234 | dunno... but can you tell me what it is called so i don't have to play hunt the dependency? | 11:44 |
| ali1234 | is it unreasonable to think that this would work: http://pastebin.com/6hb8PnWV | 11:48 |
| ali1234 | i can tell you from experience that the equivalent works on ubuntu | 11:48 |
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| arfoll | "Development Tools"? | 11:50 |
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| ali1234 | probably need meego-packaging-tools too | 11:54 |
| ali1234 | that probably would pull in rpm-build | 11:54 |
| ali1234 | hmm that installed yum | 11:55 |
| ali1234 | i thought yum was gone | 11:55 |
| arfoll | i think it was decided a while back on the mailing list these "obvious" deps would be ommited from spec files | 11:55 |
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| arfoll | ali1234, not surprised yum is still in meego 1.1 - not sure why, maybe a bug should be filed | 11:56 |
| ali1234 | i'm using trunk | 11:56 |
| arfoll | then there should be a bug | 11:56 |
| ali1234 | i need a bug tracker just to keep track of the bugs i need to file | 11:57 |
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| ali1234 | is bug 12714 related? | 11:58 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12714 nor, Medium, ---, yi.y.yang, REOP, devel:packagemanagement and devel:tools:building are not in sync | 11:58 |
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| jbos | hey did anyone ever tried to run meego on a archos 70? | 11:59 |
| arfoll | ali1234, yeah looks related, apparently yum is still used by mic2 | 11:59 |
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| ali1234 | well "rpmbuild kernel.spec" still does nothing... | 12:03 |
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| ali1234 | ok "rpmbuild -bp kernel.spec" is doing something | 12:04 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ali: yeah, i need to switch to using gmail to draft the bugs i need to file | 12:05 |
| timeless_w7ip | right now i use firefox tabs distributed across computers | 12:05 |
| timeless_w7ip | (and sites) | 12:05 |
| ali1234 | hmm this is new | 12:06 |
| ali1234 | i don't get a config menu | 12:06 |
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| ali1234 | i get "error: Bad exit status from /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.LfaXz9 (%prep)" and then rpmbuild bails out | 12:06 |
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| ali1234 | it's at the same point though | 12:07 |
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| vgrade-nexus | TSCHAKeee: http://jogglerhacks.blogspot.com/2010/04/grub2-on-joggler.html | 12:14 |
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| ali1234 | so i'm kind of at a loss now... can't reproduce the config menu thing, cos it just crashes out here... which is arguably more correct | 12:19 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ali: i shoud probably give you my rpm --showrc | 12:26 |
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| timeless_w7ip | because a bunch of my problems have come from having non meego values | 12:26 |
| timeless_w7ip | e.g. not supporting bashisms | 12:26 |
| CosmoHill | timeless_w7ip: you're using a .rpmrc file? | 12:28 |
| timeless_w7ip | cosmohill: i'm not running meego | 12:28 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'm running debian | 12:29 |
| CosmoHill | even better | 12:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | if you don't run meego, then whatever defaults from your system rpmmacros will not match the ones from meego | 12:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | i didn't pick dash, that came from my system | 12:29 |
| timeless_w7ip | heck, my rpmmacros file wouldn't naturally tell you that /bin/sh is not a bashist | 12:29 |
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| CosmoHill | I have issues on my distro cos /bin/sh points to zsh which emulates sh when linked to that way | 12:31 |
| ali1234 | timeless_w7ip: i'm using meego though... | 12:32 |
| CosmoHill | then again any issues with my distro are entirely my fault | 12:32 |
| ar | CosmoHill: zsh isn't exactly posix shell, even when invoked as such | 12:34 |
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| CosmoHill | I had to tell rpm to use /bin/bash instead of /bin/sh | 12:34 |
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| CosmoHill | damn, I may actually have to buy books for uni | 12:39 |
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| ali1234 | ok, am i still missing something, or should this work? http://pastebin.com/Ycj7C73Y | 12:53 |
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| timeless_w7ip | ali: what happens when you do it? | 13:11 |
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| ali1234 | timeless_w7ip: http://pastebin.com/4979G8A0 | 13:22 |
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| timeless_w7ip | very helpful, ain't it? | 13:34 |
| timeless_w7ip | ok, so, my current version of my script managed to process 9 more packages than the one that generated the current view | 13:35 |
| timeless_w7ip | oddly, none of them seem to be things which my recent work should affect | 13:37 |
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| ali1234 | well, gonna bug report it anyway | 13:47 |
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| ali1234 | bug 14307 | 13:49 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14307 nor, Undecided, ---, yong.y.wang, NEW, kernel build with rpmbuild fails during prep | 13:49 |
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| lcuk | ahhh technology http://twitter.com/DougRDNaylor/status/45450616503418880 | 13:56 |
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| timeless_w7ip | lcuk: awesome | 14:17 |
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| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, yeah, going to monitor it and see | 14:17 |
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| * lcuk interested to know which device | 14:18 | |
| * timeless_w7ip grumbles | 14:21 | |
| timeless_w7ip | ali1234: so... | 14:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | my script "finished" | 14:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | but um | 14:21 |
| * timeless_w7ip got no output :( | 14:22 | |
| * timeless_w7ip grumbles | 14:22 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | oh, well, heh | 14:31 |
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| timeless_w7ip | no output isn't necessarily a bad thing | 14:31 |
| timeless_w7ip | ali1234: http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/source/chromium/ | 14:32 |
| timeless_w7ip | hrm, something -very-bad- is happening in that tree | 14:34 |
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| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 14:42 | |
| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, what is the badness factor based on? | 14:43 |
| timeless_w7ip | lcuk: try loading http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/source/ | 14:43 |
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| timeless_w7ip | open a new window | 14:43 |
| timeless_w7ip | in it, load http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/source/chromium/README?force=1&colorwithjs=0 | 14:44 |
| timeless_w7ip | then load http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/source/? | 14:44 |
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| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 14:46 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | what the heck is up w/ these random permisions in tarballs | 14:46 |
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| timeless_w7ip | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1139424 | 14:47 |
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| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 14:48 | |
| timeless_w7ip | that isn't even a correct find | 14:48 |
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| timeless_w7ip | or maybe it is | 14:51 |
| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, hm | 14:53 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1139436 | 14:54 |
| timeless_w7ip | is the corrected version | 14:54 |
| timeless_w7ip | lcuk; were you hm'ing about 'bad [source]' or 'heck [pastebin]'? | 14:55 |
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| lcuk | bad src | 14:56 |
| timeless_w7ip | if you're interested in that.. | 14:56 |
| lcuk | curious as to what is causing it | 14:56 |
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| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 14:56 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/mxr/source/lib/LXR/Common.pm | 14:58 |
| timeless_w7ip | look for 'colorwithjs' | 14:58 |
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| timeless_w7ip | actually, hrm | 14:59 |
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| timeless_w7ip | yeah | 15:00 |
| timeless_w7ip | i don't have gzip stuff here | 15:00 |
| timeless_w7ip | so i believe it *should* be from the colorwithjs compression alg | 15:00 |
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| timeless_w7ip | grr | 15:03 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'm having trouble triggering this with curl | 15:03 |
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| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, there is an odd cookie mention in that file, line 1621 - is that the normal way you remove a cookie? | 15:08 |
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| timeless_w7ip | cookie removal is done by setting an expiry in the past | 15:10 |
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| * lcuk just eats cookies | 15:10 | |
| lcuk | with milk | 15:10 |
| timeless_w7ip | 2000 isn't necessarily a wonderful choice as expiration dates go, since there used to be pages in 2000 | 15:11 |
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| timeless_w7ip | but your n900's default date is newer than that, so it's relatively safe :) | 15:11 |
| lcuk | yes | 15:11 |
| lcuk | but this is mxr code | 15:12 |
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| lcuk | which runs on normal systems | 15:12 |
| timeless_w7ip | yeah, but basically unless you have a visitor who sets his clock to 1999 | 15:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | because he's testing for milenium bugs, your cookie is safely eaten | 15:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | and even if it isn't eaten, it's set to empty which is treated as not 1 iirc | 15:13 |
| lcuk | sure | 15:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | you can think of colorwithjs as a context aware modgzip | 15:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | but it relies on client js to decompress | 15:14 |
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| Myrtti | ho hum | 15:38 |
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| * lcuk looks forward to another visit to MOSI this weekend :) | 15:39 | |
| jainjacob | anyone installed meego 1.2 on Nikia N900?? | 15:39 |
| lcuk | jainjacob, I have todays daily testing image in front of me now | 15:40 |
| timeless_w7ip | mosi? | 15:40 |
| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, Museum of science and industry, here in Manchester | 15:40 |
| * lcuk gets the tweet | 15:40 | |
| lcuk | Meet the... Telecommunication Engineers this weekend http://ht.ly/49XlR Take a look around the Connecting Manchester gallery too! http://twitter.com/voiceofmosi/status/45210945613594624 | 15:40 |
| jainjacob | @lcuk How is it..? Any improvements ?? Am asking about speed?? | 15:41 |
| lcuk | jainjacob, speed of what? | 15:41 |
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| jainjacob | @lcuk, any lagging? | 15:42 |
| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, a bit more info: http://www.britishscienceassociation.org/forms/events/view-event.asp?id=11502 | 15:43 |
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| lcuk | jainjacob, what apps are you interested in? | 15:43 |
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| * lcuk is testing the vkb | 15:43 | |
| lcuk | and adding contacts and stuff | 15:43 |
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| jainjacob | lcuk, web browser | 15:44 |
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| lcuk | jainjacob, how about you get yourself a testing image and check for yourself | 15:45 |
| lcuk | http://download.meego.com/testing-daily/builds/trunk/1.1.90.6.20110308.89/images/meego-handset-armv7l-n900/ | 15:45 |
| lcuk | because the websites I use will not be the same ones you do | 15:45 |
| * timeless_w7ip wonders what web browser | 15:46 | |
| lcuk | and plus, I do not have networking configured (custom wifi) | 15:46 |
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| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, fennec is the top left first icon on the app grid :) | 15:47 |
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| jainjacob | lcuk, sorry, I don't hav an N900. I'm gonna buy one.. thats why am asking.. :) | 15:48 |
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| timeless_w7ip | jainjacob: don't buy based on what isn't part of the product | 15:50 |
| timeless_w7ip | if you aren't comfortable w/ the n900 running maemo, then you're making a huge investment in assuming that meego will eventually do what you want on your n900 | 15:50 |
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| jbos | i wonder, what is the unifined way to start applications which handle specific mimetypes | 15:52 |
| lcuk | sage advice about many things. | 15:52 |
| jbos | on handset there is libcontentaction | 15:53 |
| jbos | but there is not such a thing in core compliance | 15:54 |
| jbos | mhm | 15:54 |
| lcuk | jainjacob, the MeeGo N900 experience and target is to ensure it is usable as a DeveloperEdition phone with base working functionality to build up from | 15:54 |
| timeless_w7ip | jboss: there's probably an opendesktop dispatch standard | 15:54 |
| lcuk | http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DeveloperEdition | 15:54 |
| lcuk | not for an end user product | 15:54 |
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| jbos | lcuk do voicecall (celluar) already work ? | 15:55 |
| jbos | wasn't able to get them working | 15:55 |
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| Stskeeps | jbos: yeah, if you don't have a PIN on your sim | 15:56 |
| lcuk | jbos, IDK actually, will stick my sim in to see now whilst I have it booted | 15:56 |
| jbos | lcuk, btw. we are just landing some good patches for fennec in upstream | 15:56 |
| lcuk | (well, reboot etc) | 15:56 |
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| lcuk | jbos, ++ | 15:56 |
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| jbos | so we have connectivity support and rotation support | 15:56 |
| jbos | :) using qt mobility (non meegotouch) | 15:57 |
| jbos | firefox mobile / fennec wants to be core compliant - that is why we kicked meegotouch | 15:58 |
| jbos | but well... content action should go too | 15:58 |
| jbos | ... lcuk are you working on N900 Developer Edition? | 15:59 |
| jbos | do you know when deadline is? | 15:59 |
| timeless_w7ip | jbos: there used to be a gconf/dbus dispatch | 15:59 |
| jbos | so we can have a good fennec version prepared | 15:59 |
| jbos | mhm | 15:59 |
| timeless_w7ip | but you should really check freedesktop.org | 15:59 |
| jbos | timeless_w7ip, i see :) | 15:59 |
| lcuk | jbos, not sure, the initiative has only been brewing for a week or so and do not think everything has been ironed out yet | 16:00 |
| jbos | ok, so but you are in this initiative? Official? | 16:00 |
| Stskeeps | jbos: meego-handset@, get a discussion started | 16:01 |
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| lcuk | jbos, aren't we all on this initiative? is it not in the interests to ensure we have a usable MeeGo OS on our Nokia devices? | 16:03 |
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| timeless_w7ip | jbos: you might try QDesktopServices::openUrl | 16:06 |
| * timeless_w7ip sighs | 16:07 | |
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| timeless_w7ip | | //to open vedio file in realplayer give full path here. | 16:07 |
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| timeless_w7ip | i don't think i've seen that spelling before | 16:07 |
| lcuk | nice | 16:08 |
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| timeless_w7ip | that's from FN | 16:12 |
| gabrbedd | timakima: w7ip: if you didn't see... I filed the "Obsoletes: meego-netbook-settings" bug. | 16:13 |
| gabrbedd | timeless_w7ip: ^^^ | 16:13 |
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| timeless_w7ip | gabrbedd: oh, thanks! | 16:24 |
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| timeless_w7ip | gabrbedd: hey, could i get you to file bugs about the packages which have go-rx ? | 16:25 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1139436 | 16:26 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'm not sure if there's a policy that says files should be world readable and directories should be world enterable | 16:26 |
| timeless_w7ip | but it's really annoying and totally stupid to have otherwise | 16:26 |
| timeless_w7ip | since files in repositories are open source, or at least if you can download them you can read them | 16:27 |
| timeless_w7ip | anyone who actually wants to enforce local permissions should do so using umask locally | 16:27 |
| timeless_w7ip | whereas right now people who want to install things for other users have to manually fix up permissions -- there's no *anti* umask | 16:27 |
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| gabrbedd | timeless_w7ip: ok. | 16:33 |
| timeless_w7ip | thanks | 16:35 |
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| jbos | lcuk did the sim stuff work for y` | 16:58 |
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| lcuk | jbos, I got a call on my phone just as I was taking out the battery and got sidetracked | 16:59 |
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| * lcuk tries now | 16:59 | |
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| lcuk | jbos, yes | 17:06 |
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| lcuk | i just called tracy | 17:06 |
| lcuk | and it came out of the earpiece as expected but stuff was not all working, (dialer has a range of bugs already) | 17:07 |
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| Stskeeps | sound's pretty good though | 17:07 |
| lcuk | and somewhere in the middle of the conversation it changed from earpiece to speakers | 17:07 |
| lcuk | and I could not get it back | 17:07 |
| RST38h | hey vasvlad =) | 17:07 |
| timeless_w7ip | ali1234: i think http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1139786 might solve my problems | 17:07 |
| lcuk | which was odd because the speakers were quieter than earpiece | 17:07 |
| timeless_w7ip | (yes, that's patching tar, no XXX isn't defined, i'd need to add some glue) | 17:08 |
| jbos | mhm which version do you use? | 17:08 |
| jbos | of meego on n900 | 17:08 |
| jbos | latest weekly? | 17:08 |
| TSCHAKeee | vgrade-nexus: i'm trying to get the kernel penguins and kernel messages to not show up at bootup...problem is that plymouth loads way late in the boot process and it only shows up for a few moments... | 17:08 |
| jbos | lcuk ^^^ | 17:09 |
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| lcuk | jbos, daily testing as normal | 17:09 |
| lcuk | http://download.meego.com/testing-daily/builds/trunk/1.1.90.6.20110308.89/images/meego-handset-armv7l-n900/ | 17:09 |
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| timeless_w7ip | has anyone here seen my house keys? :( | 17:10 |
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| lcuk | timeless_w7ip, that patch seems sensible really, though isn't tar meant to retain and drop the file trees as expected | 17:11 |
| lcuk | and would it be simpler to scan the directory tree after tar has finished its normal run? | 17:11 |
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| timeless_w7ip | not really | 17:11 |
| timeless_w7ip | i mean, in theory a perl script could recurse through the entire tree | 17:11 |
| timeless_w7ip | there are only 1.1 million files in repo.meego.com as of the last index | 17:12 |
| timeless_w7ip | the problem is that the logic really is as painful as written there | 17:12 |
| ar | running a perl script over a 1.1 milion files sounds... slow | 17:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | so one can't simply use 'find' and ask it to do work | 17:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | ar: it's hardly ideal | 17:13 |
| timeless_w7ip | especially when asking tar to not be annoying is easier | 17:13 |
| lcuk | you might have 1.1 million uses of tar though, but general folks have many more between them | 17:14 |
| lcuk | if it is a new parameter, as you say XXX_ is not defined yet | 17:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | ar: otoh, a perl script has to visit each file anyway to read its contents, so technically it could always reset perms as it goes | 17:14 |
| lcuk | it wuold be reasonable | 17:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | the problem is dealing w/ directories | 17:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | an indexer has no business screwing w/ permisions in general | 17:14 |
| timeless_w7ip | they should come to it correctly | 17:15 |
| timeless_w7ip | thus it should either be something before tar, tar, or something right after tar | 17:15 |
| timeless_w7ip | personally i'd favor something before tar - i.e. package maintainers shouldn't be able to submit source packages w/ crappy perms | 17:15 |
| timeless_w7ip | i'd rather not patch tar, as lcuk notes the number of users of tar is huge so adding a patch to it hurts average cases to favor not being screwed by stupid maintainers | 17:16 |
| timeless_w7ip | which is unfortunate | 17:16 |
| lcuk | just write your feather script to run directly after tar | 17:17 |
| lcuk | on the specific folder tar just extracted | 17:17 |
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| timeless_w7ip | but, from a user perspective, even w/o an xref, i like being able to say "I want these files extracted, but i want you to honor my umask, not the umask of the idiot who made the archive for me" | 17:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | lcuk: mildly hard | 17:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | tar isn't run by me, it's run by rpmbuild | 17:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | or a script triggered by something in a spec file | 17:17 |
| timeless_w7ip | writing a proper wrapper for tar which can fix up perms is technically doable, but incredibly painful | 17:18 |
| lcuk | and now the full reason for digging directly in tar becomes clearer! | 17:18 |
| timeless_w7ip | you have to properly handle all arguments to tar | 17:18 |
| timeless_w7ip | and no, i do not want to sandbox tar, nor do i want to strace it, or ldpreload hack it, or virtualize it | 17:18 |
| lcuk | I thought tar was just one of the normal steps you used building mxr, I did not think it was deeper within | 17:18 |
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| timeless_w7ip | tar is only used because rpm / deb use it | 17:19 |
| timeless_w7ip | mxr doesn't use tar on its own | 17:19 |
| timeless_w7ip | it just becomes a victim if tar is involved | 17:19 |
| lcuk | roger | 17:20 |
| lcuk | I have to go anyway, bbl | 17:20 |
| timeless_w7ip | http://mxr.meego.com/repo.meego.com/source/gdbm/ | 17:20 |
| timeless_w7ip | for example | 17:20 |
| * timeless_w7ip should have gone 8 hours ago | 17:21 | |
| * timeless_w7ip goes | 17:21 | |
| * timeless_w7ip found keys | 17:21 | |
| lcuk | \o | 17:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | anyway, as far as mxr is concerned, that's a perfectly valid behavior | 17:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | and i intend to improve mxr to support more such cases | 17:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | it's perfectly reasonable for mxr to be configured so that some visitors can't see some files | 17:21 |
| timeless_w7ip | so it's really wrong for mxr to try to fix it up | 17:22 |
| * timeless_w7ip really leaves | 17:22 | |
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| gabrbedd | Question for an ARM expert: Is reading/writing an integer from/to memory an atomic operation? (For example, it's true on x86 for >=P6, and for others if they are memory aligned) | 17:36 |
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| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: isn't there this thing called memory barriers or something? | 17:40 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, the indivisable RMW cycle you mean? | 17:40 |
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| gabrbedd | No, I mean that when I read an integer from memory... will I ever read a "half-written" value? | 17:44 |
| lcuk | has that ever happened in the past? | 17:44 |
| gabrbedd | has gabe ever used ARM in the past? | 17:44 |
| gabrbedd | :-) | 17:44 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, so older pentiums can get part written values? | 17:45 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: As I understand it... yes, if the data is not aligned. (Intel sofware manual vol 3a sect. 8.1.1) | 17:47 |
| berndhs | how could the processor prevent this, if the integer is in 2 different memory words ? | 17:48 |
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| gabrbedd | The discussion at-hand is actually off-topic... it's whether or not JACK needs to use memory barriers/atomic ops on its ringbuffer implementation. | 17:48 |
| gabrbedd | The current decision by the devs is that "reading an int from memory is atomic on all modern arch's" | 17:49 |
| berndhs | ah | 17:49 |
| lcuk | what is JACK? | 17:49 |
| berndhs | that's a silly assumption IMO :) | 17:49 |
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| gabrbedd | I'm just doing my homework on ARM... since there are ARMians here. :-) | 17:49 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: IDK and don't care /how/ the processor prevents it. I only care if they /promise/ to prevent it. :-) | 17:50 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: http://jackaudio.org | 17:50 |
| berndhs | its a bad assumption because it is unrelated to what jack does | 17:50 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: disagree about the assumption being silly. It seems to be true. | 17:51 |
| berndhs | someone wants to re-target it do a new kind of processor, and they can get mysterious problems | 17:51 |
| berndhs | whether or not it is true is not the same as whether it is silly :) | 17:51 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: JACK is a professional audio library that has arbitrary input/output routing and low latency. I've used it in my studio setup. | 17:52 |
| TSCHAKeee | has anyone tried to get glibc-common to not be so @#($%#@ big? | 17:52 |
| berndhs | the conditions can change, quite unrelated to JACK | 17:52 |
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| jbos | lcuk ping | 17:55 |
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| jbos | i put meego from nightly | 17:55 |
| jbos | on n900, after booting i just see lock screen | 17:55 |
| jbos | but can not exit it | 17:55 |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee: locales? | 17:56 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: a-yup | 17:56 |
| jbos | ah wait... now it works | 17:56 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: i'm also trying to squeeze in busybox | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | why.. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:56 |
| jbos | where should i be able to enter pin? | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | jbos: that's the catch, we don't have PIN support yet | 17:56 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: 1GB flash, and i'm almost out | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | thought i said that earlier | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee: remove sample media | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:56 |
| jbos | ah | 17:56 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: already did | 17:57 |
| TSCHAKeee | Stskeeps: i am building against meego core, but i have an explicit - for it | 17:57 |
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| jbos | :O ok how do i disable pin on my sim? | 17:57 |
| miksuh | I repeat this because in now there is more people her than was in last night :) So maybe someone can do this: | 17:57 |
| miksuh | but that is for the Debian 5.0 'Lenny' and Debian 6.0 'Squeeze' was released month ago | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | jbos: do it in maemo | 17:57 |
| miksuh | damn | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | miksuh: there's a bug for the debian 6.0 stuf | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | f | 17:57 |
| miksuh | Stskeeps: ah ok, what kind of bug? | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | miksuh: search for debian 6.0 on bugs.meego.com | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | the problem is that our build service doesn't support it yet | 17:58 |
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| miksuh | ok, I can wait :) | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | vote for the bug,e asier | 17:59 |
| jbos | mhm when is pin support scheduled | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | jbos: that's part of what we hope to fix in DE | 18:00 |
| jbos | DE? | 18:00 |
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| jbos | what is DE? | 18:02 |
| jbos | stskeeps^ | 18:02 |
| Stskeeps | Developer Edition | 18:02 |
| jbos | i see | 18:02 |
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| lcuk | Space Shuttle Discovery touched down safely :) | 19:00 |
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| gabrbedd | \o/ | 19:01 |
| berndhs | 1 down, 2 to go | 19:02 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, ? | 19:05 |
| berndhs | 2 more trips, and that's it | 19:05 |
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| gabrbedd | berndhs: lcuk 2 more for the shuttle program. Discovery is going out to pasture. | 19:13 |
| gabrbedd | :-) | 19:13 |
| berndhs | right, 1 each for the other shuttles | 19:14 |
| lcuk | berndhs, gabrbedd yeah | 19:14 |
| * lcuk sidetracked by sms | 19:14 | |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: I was sure that you knew... but it was news to me last week... :-) | 19:15 |
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| lcuk | sabotage, well said on bug 7074 :) | 19:28 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7074 nor, High, ---, shane.bryan, ASSI, Incoming call can not be answered if dialer not open when call is received. | 19:28 |
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| * timoph voted on 7074 | 19:46 | |
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| lcuk | \o/ timoph | 19:47 |
| * lcuk goes decorating anyway, bbl | 19:48 | |
| gabrbedd | VOTE 7074 IN 2011!! | 19:48 |
| timoph | :D | 19:48 |
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| * SpeedEvil votes 7486 exclusively. | 19:49 | |
| slonopotamus | who needs calls anyway... | 19:49 |
| lcuk | slonopotamus, \o my phone has been ringing non stop last couple of weeks | 19:50 |
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| slonopotamus | lcuk: did it make you happier? | 19:50 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: Pick it up then! | 19:51 |
| lcuk | hah! | 19:51 |
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| GAN900 | bug 7074 | 20:00 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7074 nor, High, ---, shane.bryan, ASSI, Incoming call can not be answered if dialer not open when call is received. | 20:00 |
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| timeless_office | ali1234: did you ever get video conf working? | 20:03 |
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| Myrtti | nice | 20:15 |
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| iekku | hmm | 20:18 |
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| timoph | iekku: fire away | 20:19 |
| gabrbedd | *cough* | 20:19 |
| iekku | timoph, have been wondering that bug | 20:20 |
| gabrbedd | timeless_office: Not sure I understand this file perms bug... let me run it by you. | 20:20 |
| timoph | the call answering thing? | 20:20 |
| timeless_office | sure | 20:20 |
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| timoph | IMHO it should be fixed | 20:20 |
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| gabrbedd | timeless_office: On MXR, when you un-tar the sources... the group and world permissions are set wrong. Right? | 20:21 |
| timoph | s/should/must/ | 20:21 |
| infobot | timoph meant: IMHO it must be fixed | 20:21 |
| timeless_office | yep | 20:21 |
| timeless_office | gabrbedd: technically when rpmbuild asks tar to untar | 20:21 |
| timeless_office | gabrbedd: it could apply on a public system where an admin user helpfully decides to install sources for meego | 20:22 |
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| timeless_office | and then users have their own individual accounts on that system | 20:22 |
| timeless_office | those users would be able to see 1410/1430 or so packages | 20:22 |
| gabrbedd | timeless_office: So... /what/ is untarring the sources to that folder? Because `zypper si` doesn't untar the sources. | 20:22 |
| timeless_office | gabrbedd: rpmbuild -bp does it, i think ali1234 listed a command earlier today that was zypper based | 20:23 |
| gabrbedd | Hmmm... Seems to me that `rpmbuild -bp` should be run by the user... If it's being used to install patched source trees to /usr/src it makes more sense to post-process the perms. | 20:25 |
| gabrbedd | But rpmbuild isn't meant for installing the unpacked sources to the system | 20:26 |
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| timeless_office | gabrbedd: from my perspective, i don't see why 15 or so packages can't behave like the other 1000+ packages | 20:26 |
| gabrbedd | timeless_office: Agreed, but it's an upstream "problem" with those packages. | 20:27 |
| gabrbedd | And it's really only a problem in your use-case. | 20:28 |
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| wmnnd | Hi there, are there any packaging tools for Meego? I find it quite annoying that the Meego Wiki shows one way to package applications for Meego via RPM but those packages don’t fulfill the packaging guidelines for Intel’s MeeGo app store … | 20:29 |
| timeless_office | heh | 20:29 |
| timeless_office | so you've been to http://appdeveloper.intel.com/en-us/ ? | 20:30 |
| timeless_office | and you Download[ed] [the] Intel AppUpSM Beta SDK for MeeGo* ? | 20:30 |
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| wmnnd | timeless_office: Does that include packaging tools? | 20:33 |
| timeless_office | dunno, login required | 20:33 |
| timeless_office | but since it was the first hit for your query it seems like you should find out | 20:33 |
| wmnnd | timeless_office: Mhm … it's quite su | 20:35 |
| wmnnd | *stupid to install everything to /top/application_name/ … | 20:35 |
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| timeless_office | ? | 20:36 |
| gabrbedd | wmnnd: You mean /opt ?? | 20:37 |
| wmnnd | Err … sorry, just a typo, gabrbedd :) | 20:37 |
| gabrbedd | wmnnd: And it's stupid because.... ?? | 20:37 |
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| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Because installing this in the normal file system works fine on every other Linux distribution. | 20:38 |
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| gabrbedd | wmnnd: No, it doesn't. Not unless you are /part/ of the other Linux distribution. | 20:38 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Of course it does. | 20:39 |
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| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Usually, all applications are installed to /usr/ | 20:39 |
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| gabrbedd | gabrbedd: What happens if you supply /usr/lib/libwmnnd.so.0 | 20:40 |
| gabrbedd | gabrbedd: And so do I with my package? | 20:40 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: You don’t do that. | 20:40 |
| gabrbedd | Why not? | 20:40 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: That’s why you have dependencies. | 20:40 |
| wmnnd | You don’t have to supply any libs. | 20:41 |
| gabrbedd | Dependencies on what? | 20:41 |
| gabrbedd | What if I *am* supplying a lib that my app needs? | 20:41 |
| gabrbedd | And I want to call it the same name as yours (because we haven't met before today). | 20:41 |
| berndhs | isn't the /opt thing an artifact of maemo, where the Nokia devices didn't have enough space in the normal file system ? | 20:41 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Then you are doing something wrong :) | 20:42 |
| gabrbedd | Then when the user isntalls your package... it doesn't install because it'll overwrite my file. | 20:42 |
| gabrbedd | Then your users file bugs about how your package won't in stall. | 20:42 |
| wmnnd | Because you have done something wrong. | 20:42 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Not a single linux distribution I know uses this weird system. | 20:42 |
| gabrbedd | What did I do wrong? | 20:42 |
| gabrbedd | The LSB specificies /opt for this very purpose. | 20:43 |
| gabrbedd | Your linux distros don't use it because the distros coordinate your packages. | 20:43 |
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| gabrbedd | But /opt is for packages distributed by 3rd-party vendors who aren't part of your distro. | 20:43 |
| gabrbedd | For example, google packages chrome for /opt because that's where it belongs. | 20:44 |
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| gabrbedd | Like wise, Adobe Acrobat Reader usually installs in /opt, because that's where it belongs. | 20:44 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: adobe stuff is in /usr on my system | 20:45 |
| slonopotamus | Acrobat Reader usually isn't installed at all | 20:45 |
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| berndhs | i didn't put it there on purpose | 20:45 |
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| gabrbedd | If you download the reader directly from Adobe... I bet it'll install in /opt | 20:45 |
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| berndhs | gabrbedd: i have the flash crap installed because there's no way around it, from adobe, its in /usr | 20:46 |
| SpeedEvil | gnash! | 20:46 |
| * SpeedEvil wishes gnash was a replacement. | 20:47 | |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: ok. Doesn't change the purpose of /opt. | 20:47 |
| gabrbedd | SpeedEvil: Does gnash still fork-bomb machines? :-p | 20:47 |
| berndhs | SpeedEvil: yeah, gnash works for 80% of each video :) | 20:47 |
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| berndhs | gabrbedd: my point is that /opt isn't uniformly used, even if there is a standard that says it should be | 20:48 |
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| iekku | hmm, should I or shouldn't I add "bug" to hilight list or not | 20:48 |
| iekku | if I add it I could feel popular :P | 20:49 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: Well, if you're writing a "MeeGo Compliant Application" (i.e. and app-store application) -- it must be in /opt, per the meego compliance spec. | 20:49 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: yes probably | 20:49 |
| berndhs | another standard to adhere to, everyone can have their own :P | 20:49 |
| gabrbedd | The reason it goes to /opt is so that packages don't overwrite each other's files beacuse I have a /usr/bin/foo and you have a /usr/bin/foo, too. | 20:49 |
| slonopotamus | proper apps go wherever ./configure --prefix=... they were put | 20:50 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: so you have /opt/bin/foo and I have /opt/bin/foo, how is that any better ? | 20:50 |
| slonopotamus | and they do not care what hierarchy is preferred in what distro | 20:50 |
| gabrbedd | Nope. It's supposed to be /opt/berndhs/bin/foo and /opt/org.is-a-geek.gabe/bin/foo | 20:51 |
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| slonopotamus | gabrbedd: you're a PATH pollution fan? | 20:51 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: yes and then your $PATH is 256Kbytes long :) | 20:51 |
| gabrbedd | slonopotamus: You've obviously never had to maintain a distro. | 20:51 |
| slonopotamus | ... | 20:51 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: How else do you suggest we coordinate the names of our package files? | 20:52 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: first you realize that you ahve to coordinate them | 20:52 |
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| gabrbedd | With who? | 20:52 |
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| lcuk | obviously the only sane way is to have the shell do a "find ...." for each command it encounters :P | 20:52 |
| berndhs | because /opt/this/bin and /opt/that/bin doesn't solve the problem | 20:52 |
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| timeless_office | path pollution isn't an issue | 20:52 |
| timeless_office | MeeGo and most users deal w/ GUIs | 20:53 |
| timeless_office | there's no requirement that Apps be in $PATH | 20:53 |
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| gabrbedd | berndhs: How does it not solve the problem? | 20:53 |
| timeless_office | apps should register with a mime-database and a .desktop database | 20:53 |
| berndhs | timeless_office: GUIs use $PATH | 20:53 |
| slonopotamus | timeless_office: that's a good tone | 20:53 |
| gabrbedd | GUI's us /usr/share/applications/FOO.desktop | 20:53 |
| timeless_office | if an app wants to talk to another app, it should use the /usr/bin mime-database dispatch or the /usr/bin .desktop database dispatch | 20:53 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd:/opt/this/bin//foo and /opt | 20:53 |
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| wmnnd | Mhm … the MeeGo SDK doesn’t contain a nice tool for packaging. | 20:54 |
| timeless_office | slonopotamus: sorry, i couldn't parse your statement | 20:54 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: /opt/thi/sbin/foo and /opt/that/bin/foo are now order dependent, that is still a collision | 20:54 |
| timeless_office | wmnd: is that the thing i mentioned? if so, please send intel feedback, it's in Beta | 20:54 |
| timeless_office | beta's generally exist to collect feedback | 20:54 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: Right... but it still installs fine, and for GUI apps this becomes a non-issue. | 20:55 |
| wmnnd | Ah, that sucks. | 20:55 |
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| timeless_office | collecting feedback sucks? | 20:56 |
| timeless_office | you'd rather people *not* collect feedback? | 20:56 |
| wmnnd | I mean … they are very nice guys at Intel and the idea behind MeeGo is great … but if you can’t create a simple package for it … | 20:56 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: gui aps don't use $PATH ? all the stuff from gnome, KDE, xfce menus is started depending on $PATH | 20:56 |
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| berndhs | gabrbedd: unless your .desktop file contains a full path name | 20:57 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: It is trivial to have you .desktop file call a shell script that modifies the $PATH for your application. | 20:57 |
| timeless_office | .desktop files certainly *can* contain full paths | 20:57 |
| timeless_office | and they really should | 20:57 |
| gabrbedd | s/have you/have your/ | 20:57 |
| infobot | gabrbedd meant: berndhs: It is trivial to have your .desktop file call a shell script that modifies the $PATH for your application. | 20:57 |
| thiago_helsinki | apps most often don't start other apps | 20:57 |
| thiago_helsinki | when they do, they usually know the full or relative path to the other service | 20:57 |
| timeless_office | thiago: hey, you're in town? | 20:57 |
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| thiago_helsinki | relative to its installation or to $KDEDIRS or to $XDG_DATA_DIRS, etc. | 20:58 |
| berndhs | gabrbedd: its trivial but dirty | 20:58 |
| thiago_helsinki | timeless_office: yes, just tonight | 20:58 |
| timeless_office | can i buy you a drink or something? | 20:58 |
| gabrbedd | If your app has private libs, you can also manipulate $LD_LIBRARY_PATH | 20:58 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: apps stores make me feel dirty. :-p | 20:58 |
| thiago_helsinki | timeless_office: I still need dinner. Let me figure out what time a call will happen tonight and I'll let you know if I'm free. | 20:58 |
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| wmnnd | Has anyone here ever created an RPM package for a MeeGo app? | 20:59 |
| slonopotamus | no, it's too dark magic | 21:00 |
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| andrewfblack | hey did the conferance lenovo s10-3t already have Meego on them? | 21:00 |
| berndhs | wmnnd: yes but they are probably not compliant :) | 21:00 |
| slonopotamus | berndhs: :D | 21:00 |
| thiago_helsinki | andrewfblack: no, they came with windows. But you weren't allowed to leave the room before you installed MeeGo on it :-) | 21:00 |
| wmnnd | Mh, which conference, andrewfblack? | 21:01 |
| andrewfblack | thiago_helsinki: ok Intel sent me one this week and it has windows and a non us plug I was wondering if they sent me one meant for someone else | 21:01 |
| wmnnd | andrewfblack: I received one with a US plug … but I live in Europe ;) | 21:02 |
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| andrewfblack | wmnnd: lol I don't know what country its from. Its not euro because my N900 came with a euro plug maybe china? | 21:03 |
| gabrbedd | wmnnd: http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging | 21:03 |
| thiago_helsinki | andrewfblack: yeah, we got UK/IE plugins in Dublin | 21:03 |
| thiago_helsinki | and I live in Europe | 21:03 |
| andrewfblack | yep its chinese I just googled it I wonder why a place in the US sent me a Computer to the US with a Chinese plug crazy | 21:04 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: That redirects to http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Guidelines and there you learn how to create packages that work fine but aren’t compilant with Intel’s guidelines^^ | 21:04 |
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| gabrbedd | timeless_office: back to the file perms bug... I think I'll pass on filing bugs. Sorry. :-) | 21:04 |
| andrewfblack | take that back its british. looks like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:G_plug.png | 21:05 |
| andrewfblack | can I just switch out the end after the inverter with a US one? I have one that will fit | 21:06 |
| SpeedEvil | andrewfblack: Does the power supply say 100-240V onit? | 21:07 |
| gabrbedd | wmnnd: I don't see the discrepency. And the requirement to install in /opt is a MeeGo requirement from here: http://wiki.meego.com/Quality/Compliance (section 3.3.4) | 21:07 |
| SpeedEvil | If so, almost certainly | 21:07 |
| andrewfblack | keyboard is funny on it also the @ is down near shift well atleast the sticker is you have to hit shift 2, if you didn't know how to type it would suck lol | 21:07 |
| andrewfblack | SpeedEvil: not sure I will have to look when I get home | 21:08 |
| wmnnd | andrewfblack: You can do that. At least I did that^^ | 21:09 |
| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Well, it shows you how to create a package but not one that is MeeGo standards compilant^^ | 21:10 |
| andrewfblack | thanks I'll give it a try when I get home | 21:10 |
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| gabrbedd | wmnnd: Standards complaince is a lot bigger issue than writing a .spec file. | 21:21 |
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| wmnnd | gabrbedd: Is it? | 21:22 |
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| ali1234 | what does the .spec even have to do with compliance? | 21:22 |
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| berndhs | the term "standards compliance" makes me think of former cardinal Ratzinger | 21:23 |
| wmnnd | berndhs: Ewww … don’t be gross ;) | 21:23 |
| berndhs | sorry | 21:23 |
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| ali1234 | hmm so is the community/extras repo expected to optify all packages too? is that document just for appstore type stuff? | 21:24 |
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| gabrbedd | berndhs: I don't get the joke. Are you talking about The German Shepherd? | 21:25 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: appstore type stuff. | 21:25 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: "compliant apps" can't have any deps outside of meego core, either. | 21:25 |
| berndhs | Joseph Aloisius Ratzinger | 21:25 |
| berndhs | his holiness himself | 21:26 |
| ali1234 | gabrbedd: so community apps quite often won't be compliant anyway... ok | 21:26 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: Right. However, I think there's some interest in creating a "meego compliant repository" concept for something like Extras/Surrounds | 21:28 |
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| ali1234 | dunno why anyone would be interested in that... | 21:28 |
| ali1234 | it would just be like extras/extras testing/extras devel | 21:29 |
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| ali1234 | ie pointless because nothing ever gets to extras and so everyone just enables testing and devel | 21:29 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: Yep, just like extras/surrounds -- but an open spec so that people can provide their own hot-rod repos (something along the lines of Planet CCRMA for Pro Audio packages) | 21:29 |
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| ali1234 | and the reason nothing ever gets to extras is because of the stupid rules about packaging things | 21:30 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: And *that* would be the point of a "spec" for such a repo... you don't need OBS commit access to make/host/develop one. | 21:31 |
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| ali1234 | you don't need any access to make a repo for maemo either :) | 21:34 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: You don't need any to make a repo for MeeGo, either. :-) | 21:35 |
| ali1234 | see http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/maemo/fremantle/ | 21:35 |
| ali1234 | yeah i know | 21:35 |
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| ali1234 | but at least on meego you can make what is effectively a ppa if you do have access, and it's much easier :) | 21:36 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: But if you make one... you can't /market/ it for MeeGo (AFAIK) because it doesn't meet any of the things MeeGo *is*. | 21:36 |
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| berndhs | you can market it for MeeGo, you just can't call it that | 21:37 |
| ali1234 | well, ok, i have my foss hat on now... i don't care about marketing, i just want to make the software available to people who know what they want, and how to get it | 21:39 |
| ali1234 | if i am doing something commercial, then of course compliance is the way to go | 21:39 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: IANAL, but if a FLOSS repo says it's a "Add on for MeeGo", I bet there will be problems (a la smeegol). | 21:42 |
| ali1234 | um, so how will the community repo get around this? | 21:43 |
| berndhs | someone could try "Forbidden by MeeGo" | 21:43 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: Right now, they're managing it by rejecting packages. :-) | 21:44 |
| ali1234 | so packages must be compliant to go in the community repo or not? | 21:44 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: I dunno... you're the one that said packages were being rejected from Extras for "silly packaging reasons" or some such. | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | yes, they were | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | such as "not optified" | 21:45 |
| ali1234 | is the same true of meego? | 21:45 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee, did you try the quiet parameter | 21:46 |
| gabrbedd | Extras/surrounds *is* meego... that's why you're having to deal with MeeGo QA on it. | 21:46 |
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| ali1234 | gabrbedd: i was refering to maemo before | 21:47 |
| gabrbedd | ali1234: OK. | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | i want to know if meego extras is going to require all packages to be compliant | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | ie no deps, must be optified | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | because imo this is what made maemo extras suck (even though there were technical reasons why it had to be done) | 21:48 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: I would think there is some place in Extras/Surrounds for non-compliant apps that are coordinated by the community. | 21:49 |
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| gabrbedd | ali1234: If not, I'm not sure *I* see the point of Extras/Surrounds. :-) | 21:49 |
| ali1234 | afaik the technical reasons on meego are much less due to things like btrfs | 21:49 |
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| GAN900 | ali1234, don't think so. | 22:16 |
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| djszapi | where can I get this package from ? docbook-dtd-xml | 22:22 |
| djszapi | Is there any package search engine like in case maemo5, fremantle ? | 22:22 |
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| Stskeeps | evening wazd | 22:27 |
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| djszapi | no clue where to get this package from: error: Failed dependencies: docbook-dtd-xml is needed by docbook-style-xsl-1.75.2-6.11.noarch | 22:33 |
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| djszapi | http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/1.1.90.5.20110301.7/repos/oss/armv7l/packages/noarch/ -> docbook-style-xsl-1.75.2-6.11.noarch, but the dependency of it cannot be found :/ | 22:35 |
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| gabrbedd | djszapi: I see it in builds/trunk/latest/oss... | 22:36 |
| djszapi | link, please ? | 22:36 |
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| gabrbedd | I see it in that repo, too. | 22:37 |
| djszapi | docbook-dtd-xml ? odd | 22:37 |
| djszapi | it is not displayed here, zypper does not find it either. | 22:37 |
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| gabrbedd | djszapi: Follow the url you gave ^^ | 22:38 |
| gabrbedd | djszapi: Also try zypper clean --all | 22:38 |
| gabrbedd | and then zypper refresh | 22:38 |
| djszapi | well I did not find it there that is why I asked. | 22:38 |
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| djszapi | it did not change, my eye and ctrl+f dop not find anything | 22:39 |
| djszapi | * do | 22:39 |
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| djszapi | please give me a link, if you find it ? | 22:40 |
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| gabrbedd | djszapi: Oh, you're wanting docbook-dtd-xml... (last URL looked like you wanted docbook-style-xsl) | 22:41 |
| djszapi | no, I want docbook-dtd-xml as said more times. | 22:41 |
| djszapi | seems a broken repo ? | 22:41 |
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| gabrbedd | djszapi: Just a guess: Perhaps docbook-dtd-xml is replaced by docbook-dtds. | 22:42 |
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| gabrbedd | Whether it is or not, you should file a bug because it's a broken package. | 22:42 |
| djszapi | it is quite broken, yes. | 22:42 |
| djszapi | but knowing that my last 2-3 critical bugs were answered either, I lost my sake to report anything | 22:43 |
| djszapi | or deal with. | 22:43 |
| djszapi | * were not | 22:43 |
| gabrbedd | djszapi: It won't get fixed if you don't file a bug. | 22:43 |
| djszapi | I do not care any longer ? :) | 22:44 |
| djszapi | whether it is fixed or not if they do not care about my critical reports ? | 22:44 |
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| npm | anybody got a reference to a "lightbox popout" style window in qml ... i want something that pops out of a button (with a "tunnel" from the originating button) and pops back in when you touch the "tunnel" -- (e.g. i want a youtube video window like i have in -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peC-ABhDEMQ -- to pop out of the thumbnail i have in https://bugs.meego.com/attachment.cgi?id=4861 ) | 22:48 |
| npm | s/lightbox/telescoping | 22:48 |
| djszapi | gabrbedd: which component ? | 22:49 |
| djszapi | https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14317 | 22:51 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug 14317 cri, Undecided, 1.1.90.4, ulf.hofemeier, NEW, Missing docbook-dtd-xml or/and broken docbook-style-xsl | 22:51 |
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| gabrbedd | djszapi: Looks good. Thanks. I would have put it in Core OS... but the bug people can change it. | 22:54 |
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| djszapi | no idea why Core OS... | 22:54 |
| lcuk | npm, transition class, specify start dimensions, end dimensions, curve etc? | 22:55 |
| djszapi | n900-devel (devel!) does not need it either, how can it be core then ? | 22:55 |
| lcuk | or however it should be done in qml | 22:55 |
| djszapi | btw, it seems silly package repository can be broken and there is no automated tool for such checks... | 22:56 |
| gabrbedd | djszapi: Docbook DTD's is not specific to any UX or application, and is provided as a core part of MeeGo. | 22:57 |
| djszapi | n900, n900-devel images do not contain it. | 22:57 |
| djszapi | those images miss the core part of MeeGo, what are they then ? | 22:57 |
| gabrbedd | djszapi: All the more reason why it's not a "Handset UX" issue. | 22:57 |
| djszapi | feel free to reassign really... | 22:58 |
| djszapi | well, it happens with me on handset | 22:58 |
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| djszapi | but it is general, yes. | 22:58 |
| djszapi | but for sure, not core. | 22:59 |
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| qgil | can you recommend a microSD card that is sufficient to run MeeGo? Many reviews online report slowness despite class rating. - see http://identi.ca/notice/66576282 | 23:21 |
| qgil | for the N900 | 23:21 |
| TSCHAKeee | it has pretty much shown universal suckage for me too, and i am using class 6 cards | 23:21 |
| GAN900 | Really makes you miss fullsize SD | 23:22 |
| qgil | GAN900: is it really about the size? | 23:22 |
| ljp | I think all SD will be slow in the n900 | 23:23 |
| djszapi | :D:D | 23:23 |
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| djszapi | ljp: why ? | 23:23 |
| GAN900 | Well, they don't make microSD cards that push what the fastest fullsize SanDisks do, so I'm forced to assume some correlation. ;) | 23:23 |
| ljp | sd is slow | 23:23 |
| djszapi | true | 23:23 |
| ljp | should be installed to the internal drive... | 23:24 |
| ljp | its big enough | 23:24 |
| ljp | or, meego needs to reduce it's bloat | 23:25 |
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| lcuk | ljp, the internal memory is 256mb. | 23:26 |
| lcuk | the meego image is 2gb | 23:26 |
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| ljp | isnt there a 'home' thats gb on th en900? | 23:26 |
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| lcuk | ljp yeah, but the layout differences are quite drastic and maemo had some pretty ummmm special ways it had to deal with it | 23:29 |
| GAN900 | ljp, that's eMMC | 23:29 |
| GAN900 | Slower than a microSD in some cases. | 23:29 |
| lcuk | (noted because I was on one of the teams that implemented it) | 23:29 |
| tomma | meego image 2gb? | 23:29 |
| lcuk | qgil, best thing for a first time is just simply the best you can get | 23:29 |
| ljp | then meego needs to get unbloated :) | 23:29 |
| lcuk | tomma, 500mb download, expand to 2gb | 23:30 |
| tomma | aa true it is whole mmc image | 23:30 |
| lcuk | video overview of the maemo rootfs situation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJ0oOHdt4Zk | 23:31 |
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| lcuk | ljp, I think if an analysis of code size for each library (compared iwth functionality) would probably yeald quite some drastic improvements to space and potentially even load time requirements | 23:33 |
| ljp | and also what gets installed by default | 23:34 |
| GAN900 | qgil, just got a KingMax card to boot in my Nook Color. Seems to work OK. | 23:34 |
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| npm | qgil: i think the suggestion for "class 6" or better should be changed to "class 10" or better. | 23:43 |
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| qgil | npm: what do I know :) Has anybody here got a reasonable satisfactory performance with MeeGo in the N900? | 23:43 |
| npm | i got it to work. i wouldn't call the performance satisfactory. | 23:45 |
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| npm | startup performance seemed particularly bad, but i also recall seeing a report somewhere that meego on n900 was 15% (?) slower than maemo? | 23:45 |
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| npm | I use http://www.amazon.com/Kingmax-MicroSDHC-Class-Performance-Memory/dp/B003TT23QI | 23:46 |
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| lcuk | qgil, graphically wise the n900 is capable, however the starting app time currently makes for the most frustration | 23:47 |
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| lcuk | ie lists and things move once running | 23:47 |
| lcuk | and the dashboard moves | 23:47 |
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| lcuk | I have been blocking on network to get some test software on there to know whether it is os or card | 23:48 |
| npm | those with larger budgets should go sandisk not kingmax :-) | 23:48 |
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| lcuk | speaking of which, I wonder now - bbl | 23:49 |
| npm | https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13833 | 23:49 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug 13833 nor, Undecided, ---, ilkka.koskinen, NEW, N900 operating at 500mhz, 16% slower than Maemo | 23:49 |
| npm | ok off by one percent. | 23:49 |
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| GAN900 | npm, indeed. | 23:50 |
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| lcuk | npm - the original bug said 20% (if you increase speed 20% you get the 600mhz) | 23:50 |
| * lcuk failed math that day | 23:50 | |
| mikhas | qgil, no not really - MeeGo on N900 always felt slow | 23:50 |
| npm | so what happens if you operate at 600mhz?? do you need to add fins to the n900 so it looks like a 50's cadillac? :-) | 23:51 |
| qgil | hi mikhas :) | 23:51 |
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| mikhas | heya | 23:51 |
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| mikhas | w00t_, is it correct to use MeeGo ML for sending patches? | 23:52 |
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| mikhas | no one seems to comment ... | 23:52 |
| qgil | thanks guys for the feedback on N900 performance - I will ask Jukka in meego-handset whether the DevEdition also has a target in performance, not only features | 23:52 |
| mikhas | I dont even know which component it affects :-) | 23:52 |
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| mikhas | qgil, need to avoid compositing AFAIK | 23:53 |
| npm | there was some speculation in https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7790 regarding warmth correlated to memory speed | 23:53 |
| _MeeeGoBot_ | Bug 7790 nor, Medium, 1.0.90.4, ilkka.koskinen, ASSI, N900 turns warm quickly after boot | 23:53 |
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| mikhas | (and try to get this MeeGo graphicssystem running there, perhaps - no clue about the actual status) | 23:53 |
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| vgrade | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350446170112 | 23:54 |
| qgil | mikhas: the other day I was thinking whether MeeGo & Harmattan would need Miniature... | 23:54 |
| mikhas | also, one could try playing with GL texture cache sizes for MTF apps ... | 23:54 |
| mikhas | it runs | 23:55 |
| npm | qgil: can you also ask whether dev-edition has video recording and camera functionality (needed for http://code.google.com/p/ytd-meego/ ) | 23:55 |
| qgil | mikhas: (don't through stones at me) | 23:55 |
| mikhas | but it's still useless :-( | 23:55 |
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| qgil | mikhas: ivanfrade and me had some good times at the bar :) | 23:55 |
| mikhas | I can imagine! | 23:55 |
| mikhas | Did it include Berlinale? | 23:55 |
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| qgil | mikhas: ah, not with me | 23:56 |
| qgil | mikhas: I mean at the bar with Miniature :) | 23:56 |
| mikhas | ehehe | 23:56 |
| mikhas | yeah, feature request: add tracker support =p | 23:56 |
| mikhas | It *must* be that. | 23:57 |
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| mikhas | npm, do we have a bug where we could speculate a bit about performance? | 23:57 |
| w00t_ | mikhas: it's correct, yes | 23:57 |
| mikhas | (in general) | 23:57 |
| w00t_ | feedback sometimes takes a while | 23:57 |
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| npm | mikhas: i think the speculation is in the bug-cloud but it might make sense to have a meta-bug | 23:58 |
| mikhas | w00t_, ok - so how would find the repo that your patch targets? | 23:58 |
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| mikhas | npm, perhaps - would you report such bug then? | 23:59 |
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| w00t_ | mikhas: that bit, I have no idea about, I can tell you if you're curious | 23:59 |
| mikhas | I will talk to some MTF guys tomorrow then, ask for direct feedback on that back | 23:59 |
| npm | i think i need to give myself a bug-reporting timeout (like a small child) due to excessive crankiness in recent reporting :-) | 23:59 |
| mikhas | w00t_, just thinking it would be nice in general to have the context | 23:59 |
| *** swc|666 has quit IRC | 23:59 | |
| mikhas | :-) | 23:59 |
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