| N900addikt | Ok | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| Stskeeps | N900addikt: so what do you think of the latest images of meego on n900 now that we've upgraded the graphics drivers? | 00:04 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: is hardfp there yet? | 00:04 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo: waiting for a OBS patch, but it's comparable in ability to softfp | 00:05 |
| N900addikt | I havent tried yet | 00:06 |
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| Stskeeps | N900addikt: ah, that's a shame | 00:07 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: so, did it bring the improvements you guys hoped from it? :) | 00:07 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: fairly, but there's still issues to be ironed out | 00:07 |
| Stskeeps | N900addikt: so what are you expecting from meego on n900? | 00:08 |
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| N900addikt | Id like to run smoothly | 00:12 |
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| N900addikt | Like it | 00:12 |
| Stskeeps | that's what we're hoping too - i mean, it is a project demonstrator | 00:12 |
| N900addikt | Yes | 00:12 |
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| N900addikt | To be honest i think the hardware of n900 will be too weak to show meego's true potential. | 00:13 |
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| Stskeeps | well, to some degree you're right, but consider that if it performs quite well on low spec, it'll absolutely rock on later spec | 00:14 |
| Umeaboy | Stskeeps: On www.meegosweden.com they wrote that #meegosweden is the place to go if you're a Swedish MeeGo-user, but noones there when checking. | 00:15 |
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| Umeaboy | No activity at all. | 00:15 |
| Stskeeps | Umeaboy: well, not much irc'ers then - raise a topic on their forums maybe | 00:15 |
| Stskeeps | N900addikt: i'm personally looking forward to seeing tablets with omap4 or tegra2 with meego arm port on, that'd be delicious | 00:16 |
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| Umeaboy | I can't login to that forum. I just regged. | 00:19 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, ok | 00:19 |
| Umeaboy | I have activated my account as well. | 00:20 |
| Stskeeps | don't know, sorry | 00:20 |
| Umeaboy | Okey. | 00:20 |
| Umeaboy | How do I run .-files? | 00:21 |
| Umeaboy | Run-files. | 00:21 |
| Stskeeps | hmm? | 00:21 |
| Umeaboy | ./XXXX doesn't work. | 00:21 |
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| Umeaboy | I went to the unzipped directory & wrote ./skype for example. | 00:21 |
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| Umeaboy | No such command. | 00:22 |
| Umeaboy | .....? | 00:22 |
| Stskeeps | oh, chmod +x them first | 00:22 |
| Stskeeps | or /lib/ld-linux.so.2 filename (or 3 for arm) , if you're feeling insane | 00:23 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:23 |
| Umeaboy | I AM insane. | 00:23 |
| Umeaboy | I don' | 00:23 |
| Umeaboy | t want to be like other people. | 00:23 |
| Umeaboy | I want to be myself. | 00:24 |
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| Umeaboy | Who I am as a person. | 00:24 |
| Stskeeps | here, have a cookie | 00:24 |
| * Stskeeps ponders sleep | 00:24 | |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps, does MeeGo accept contributions from random people? | 00:26 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: eg. if I clone the repo of a meego app and do stuff with it, will my work be accepted to upstream? | 00:27 |
| Umeaboy | I guess when it's properly tested. | 00:27 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo: short and long answer: yes | 00:27 |
| Venemo | just asking because one of the main problems of Maemo was that they never ever accepted a patch from the community | 00:27 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: http://meego.com/about/contribution-guidelines , no paperwork, just signed-off-by | 00:28 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: yes, you mentioned it | 00:28 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: sounds nice :) | 00:28 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: one last question for today, do you have a guide to set up a MeeGo chroot on F14? | 00:31 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: or does the MeeGo SDK do that? (Is it similar to the Maemo5 SDK?) | 00:32 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: meego platform sdk does that, but meego sdk with madde is really the way to go if you're doing meego api stuff | 00:33 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | vgrade: has anyone been hacking on the GMA500 situation lately? | 00:33 |
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| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee2: actually there's a xorg 1.9 driver out | 00:34 |
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| Stskeeps | still has quirks, i think | 00:34 |
| Venemo | okay thank you Stskeeps | 00:34 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | *blink* REALLY?! wow! | 00:34 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | damn, that's great news..even if it only half works :P | 00:34 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | I love emgd to death | 00:35 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | but the whole VA-API situation damn near burst a blood vessel in my head. | 00:35 |
| Stskeeps | http://edc.intel.com/Software/Downloads/EMGD/ | 00:35 |
| Stskeeps | (read release notes) | 00:35 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | :) | 00:35 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 hugs Stskeeps | 00:35 | |
| Stskeeps | TSCHAKeee2: also, supposedly license terms has improved for redistribution | 00:35 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | good :) | 00:36 |
| Stskeeps | at least the one i spotted in meego | 00:36 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | I'm currently making a small set of OBS build projects | 00:36 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | so I can build our current orbiter packages for meego | 00:36 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | i've got the main project built, but i am moving over package specs from Fedora Core 13 for SDL_ttf and a coulple of others. | 00:37 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: do you make use of the 'merge request' feature on Gitorious, or submitting patches via mailing list/bugzilla is the way to go? | 00:40 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo: mailing list or bugzilla, MR's don't get proper notifications | 00:40 |
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| javispedro | lcuk: if you're that interested in running vb6, buy crossover :). it worked very well for me (had to install ie6 first though). | 00:42 |
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| mwichmann | I tried to use that for something and never could get it working very well | 00:43 |
| Stskeeps | or just install virtualbox.. | 00:43 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:43 |
| mwichmann | it wants to install this, then that, then a third, and all of a sudden the whole setup has stopped working | 00:43 |
| mwichmann | (crossover / wine, that is) | 00:43 |
| javispedro | virtualbox on the lenovo unfortunately... (no vt-d) | 00:43 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee2, http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/vgrade/MeeGo_current_Core_standard/i586/ | 01:07 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee2, image will be up at http://bug10738.openaos.org/ soon | 01:08 |
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| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10738 nor, Undecided, ---, tero.kojo, NEED, Meego community ftp server or similar needed | 01:08 |
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| auke | bug 11626 | 01:12 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11626 is not accessible | 01:12 |
| auke | ha, didn't know our bot was useful | 01:12 |
| Umeaboy | Stskeeps: Stupid question, but do you know anyone good at reading Spanish? | 01:13 |
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| CosmoHill | did someone ping me? | 01:23 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | vgrade: no yum repo data? ;) | 01:28 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 runs!!! | 01:28 | |
| CosmoHill | try zypper, it's just as yummy | 01:29 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | don't care, was asking about repo data | 01:31 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | that could be used by MIC | 01:31 |
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| vgrade | TSCHAKeee2, see http://wiki.meego.com/User:Vgrade | 01:40 |
| vgrade | http://pastebin.com/UHPiCuzd | 01:40 |
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| CosmoHill | it's coming up to Meegos 1st Birthday | 01:44 |
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| vgrade | TSCHKeee2, http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/vgrade/MeeGo_current_Core_standard/ | 01:47 |
| wmarone | hi vgrade | 01:48 |
| vgrade | hi there, | 01:48 |
| vgrade | just catching up after the rush to get things ready for the Cambridge network meet | 01:48 |
| wmarone | coolo | 01:48 |
| wmarone | -o | 01:48 |
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| vgrade | any news on tegra? | 01:49 |
| wmarone | nope, haven't had time to do anything with it | 01:49 |
| Umeaboy | How's it possible to get my 3G-modem from Ericsson working in MeeGo? | 01:49 |
| CosmoHill | Umeaboy: can you get it working with other linux distros? | 01:50 |
| vgrade | wmarone, I have to get the joggler and pandaboard images uploaded then I will have another look at tegra | 01:51 |
| Umeaboy | CosmoHill: Uuuuuuuuuuhm. It's missing a working driver, but yes. | 01:51 |
| Umeaboy | The driver it comes with doesn't wake it up. | 01:52 |
| wmarone | vgrade: ok, no hurry. I imagine those are a lot easier to get working. | 01:52 |
| vgrade | wmarone, both images are booting to ux but are not in any shape or form proper adaptations yet | 01:53 |
| wmarone | sure, but they boot :) | 01:53 |
| vgrade | wmarone, yes. MeeGo core boots to xterm if you disable udev on my tegra | 01:53 |
| wmarone | disable udev, huh | 01:54 |
| vgrade | wmarone, udev did not start due to CONFIG_SIGNALFD missing from the stock kernel, but it booted to xterm | 01:55 |
| wmarone | see I had it booting to xterm before the errata bug | 01:55 |
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| wmarone | but it only worked once | 01:55 |
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| wmarone | weord, I'll try and squeeze a look-see in this evening | 01:55 |
| wmarone | weird* | 01:55 |
| vgrade | once I had the kernel source I enabled SIGNALFD then I think I see the same things you do, ie loads of stack traces and nothing in messages | 01:56 |
| wmarone | ok | 01:56 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | what are you guys using for tegra test hardware? | 01:57 |
| vgrade | advent vega | 01:57 |
| wmarone | viewsonic g-tablet | 01:57 |
| vgrade | 230 GBP, a steal | 01:57 |
| vgrade | I'm guessing that whatever udev is doing its allowing access to something which MeeGo is not handling | 01:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | wow | 01:59 |
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| wmarone | vgrade: I've gotten some stack traces out via some USB serial adaptors, but they're too slow to catch the data in a complete enough manner | 02:00 |
| vgrade | TSCHAKeee2, the problem with the one I have is that its was bought for my son at christmas | 02:00 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | *nod* | 02:01 |
| vgrade | make an ideal orbitor | 02:01 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | I need to find these tablets over here ... hmm... | 02:01 |
| vgrade | here is? | 02:01 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | USA | 02:01 |
| wmarone | TSCHAKeee2: Sears carries the g-tablet | 02:02 |
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| vgrade | the g-tablet is over there I think, wmarone? | 02:02 |
| wmarone | mine was $430 with tax, see if you can get a discount | 02:02 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | and yup, i am looking at the tegra hardware as another target for both orbiter and media playback | 02:02 |
| vgrade | *WARNING* | 02:02 |
| vgrade | as usual graphics drivers are an issue | 02:03 |
| vgrade | nVidia has a linux4tegra download, but its locked to xorg 1.6 | 02:03 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 facepalms | 02:03 | |
| TSCHAKeee2 | of course. | 02:03 |
| vgrade | you must be used to that with GMA500 :) | 02:04 |
| blizzow | has anyone put to rest the rumour that the N9 is canceled or confirmed it? | 02:04 |
| vgrade | I can confirm the rumour | 02:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ... | 02:05 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | go Nokia | 02:05 |
| blizzow | bummer :( | 02:05 |
| vgrade | sorry, confirm there is a rumour | 02:05 |
| wmarone | haha | 02:06 |
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| vgrade | TSCHKeee2, EMGD is now building for latest meego now so it looks like the EMGD and MeeGo releases are in step, for now at least. http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.1.80/daily/non-oss/repos/ia32/packages/i586/ | 02:07 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | do I have to submit a package upstream, to resolve "unresolvable" ? | 03:42 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | i've got a package needed by my main home project, built successfully as a sub project | 03:43 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | but the builder is still saying unresolvable, looking for the same package. | 03:43 |
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| neopsis | which one do you guys think better, raid server or desktop with raid 5 supported? | 04:02 |
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| wmarone | server with hotswap and RAID 6 | 04:09 |
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| Lopi | Stskeeps: ping | 04:32 |
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| Termana | morning | 08:05 |
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| plr___ | hi, is it possible to install meego sdk and use qemu on win7 64bit? | 10:32 |
| plr___ | I guess not.. | 10:35 |
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| lbt | hey Jaffa | 10:52 |
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| lbt | & X-Fade :) | 10:52 |
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| Stskeeps | morn lbt | 10:52 |
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| lbt | and you :) | 10:52 |
| Termana | hello lbt | 10:52 |
| lbt | hey to all :) | 10:53 |
| * lbt just reading arjan and ryan's response on packaging ml | 10:53 | |
| lbt | I think I'm going to reply via the surrounds proposal to TSG | 10:53 |
| Cope | don't do that | 10:54 |
| lbt | There are plenty of "Yet another Linux distro"s out there - MeeGo is different at it has a very different target: to be a compliant baseline for building product on. One way to do this is to have the COBS as a reference vendor and focus on efficient delivery processes | 10:54 |
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| lbt | hey Cope | 10:54 |
| Cope | woo lbt | 10:54 |
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| Stskeeps | products | 10:55 |
| lbt | you know ... like the "big I" | 10:56 |
| lbt | the codename that everyone knows and isn't allowed to say even though it's a codename for a publicly announced project | 10:56 |
| lbt | that kind of product... | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | yes, but i meant "building product on" | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | products | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:57 |
| lbt | :P | 10:57 |
| lbt | name the second? | 10:57 |
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| Stskeeps | any other | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | product implies nokia is only user of meego and ever will be, that it only exists to serve it's purpose | 10:57 |
| lbt | you can't... meego sucks at having a coherent MeeGo -> Vendor process | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:57 |
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| lbt | actually product is plural in this context | 10:58 |
| lbt | but that's subtle grammar I grant you | 10:58 |
| Stskeeps | "building a product on" | 10:58 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 10:58 |
| lbt | I left out the "a" | 10:58 |
| Stskeeps | sigh, english grammar.. | 10:58 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:58 |
| lbt | yep.... sorry | 10:59 |
| lbt | but I will change it | 10:59 |
| * Stskeeps offers lbt some polish adjectives | 10:59 | |
| * lbt declines politely but firmly | 10:59 | |
| lbt | so Cope... is this meego friday for you? | 11:00 |
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| arfoll | vgrade, you wanted to know the status of the arm builds? | 11:04 |
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| wazd | heya everyone | 12:11 |
| Stskeeps | lo wazd | 12:11 |
| CosmoHill | hey | 12:11 |
| CosmoHill | Stskeeps: could you grab auke's op sword since he shouldn't be sleeping with it | 12:11 |
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| Stskeeps | CosmoHill: i'll let him do that himself | 12:11 |
| CosmoHill | fair enough | 12:12 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps, CosmoHill: o/ | 12:18 |
| CosmoHill | http://www.esecurityplanet.com/trends/article.php/3086051/Is-Linux-Really-More-Secure-Than-Windows.htm | 12:19 |
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| CosmoHill | I'm just reading this and thought others might find it interesting | 12:19 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: Now I know the reason why "The Astonishing Tribe" guy decided not to go to the MeeGo Conference :) TAT has been aquired by RIM :D | 12:20 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: yes, we realized that too :) | 12:20 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: somehow missed that, it just popped out on engadget post about PlayBook | 12:20 |
| thiago | wazd: I thought the same | 12:22 |
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| thiago | wazd: but they cancelled before the acquisition was announced | 12:22 |
| thiago | having gone through an acquitision, they don't let this happen | 12:22 |
| thiago | before the acquisition is approved by proper authorities, the two companies *must* operate separately | 12:23 |
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| wazd | thiago: oh | 12:25 |
| thiago | even more so, before the announcement, most people inside each company don't know about the plans | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: out of curiousity, have you tried to be playing with qml yet? | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | i'd be really interested to see what magic you can acheive with it | 12:26 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: you bet :) | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | i mean, when an idiot like me can make something that might fool someone into believing it's a professional interface, my imagination doesn't stretch far enough to see what you'd be able to ;) | 12:27 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: I'm having a "JavaScript for dumb designers" book right in front of me :D | 12:27 |
| thiago | wazd: try the tooling in the new Creator 2.2 | 12:27 |
| thiago | I especially like the "modification highlighting" | 12:27 |
| thiago | if you make changes in the visual editor, the text editor shows where they are | 12:28 |
| wazd | thiago: my creator is 2.0.1, I guess it's ancient :) | 12:28 |
| Stskeeps | i wonder how long time it would take to rebuild honeycomb UI in QML, given enough talent in graphics | 12:29 |
| Stskeeps | could make an excellent case study | 12:29 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: It's possible to do virtually any ripoff | 12:29 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: without mad skills | 12:30 |
| thiago | wazd: positively jurassic :-) | 12:30 |
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| thiago | Stskeeps: if you take their files, probably a couple of days | 12:30 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: but also it's possible to do things far beyond existing UI's | 12:31 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: and that makes me crazy :D | 12:32 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: ah, making graphics people froth around the mouth is probably a good sign ;) | 12:32 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: sort of :D | 12:38 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: thp and I are currently making QML gPodder UI, hope it well be a nice showreel of basic QML capabilities | 12:41 |
| Stskeeps | nice | 12:42 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: http://s55.radikal.ru/i149/1102/78/4300e87f1fda.jpg <- something like this :) | 12:48 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: nice | 12:48 |
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| * Stskeeps gets tired of hearing the 'meego is a joke in the tech industry' article in a bunch of media | 12:51 | |
| arfoll | Stskeeps, americans predicting Nokia's death is nothing new | 12:52 |
| Stskeeps | then again, i guess a rebuttal to the pissing in pants to keep warm was to come at come point | 12:52 |
| * Stskeeps goes back to thinking meego's actually ahead of the times instead of behind | 12:54 | |
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| odin_ | yes indeed Stskeeps keep at it, hopefully as the device count increases the PR might change, in some ways the OS is ahead of the (times) devices :( | 13:02 |
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| niala | hello, | 13:28 |
| CosmoHill | hi | 13:29 |
| niala | bad news for meego ? nokia will use win7 phone and abandon meego ? | 13:29 |
| niala | hi CosmoHill | 13:29 |
| Stskeeps | niala: that's just rumours | 13:30 |
| niala | sorry it's french http://www.businessmobile.fr/actualites/nokia-sous-pression-pour-adopter-windows-phone-7-39758013.htm | 13:30 |
| niala | Stskeeps: ok, wait and see so ? | 13:31 |
| Stskeeps | as always | 13:31 |
| Stskeeps | i like to work on meego to make it better instead of bothering with stupid rumours :) | 13:31 |
| niala | like one year :) | 13:31 |
| Stskeeps | even without nokia, meego has a lot of ability, not only potential | 13:31 |
| Stskeeps | it's a lean and mean qt stack | 13:31 |
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| niala | yes i like meego to for this reason, i m juste a little afraid to saw you work for windows !!! :) | 13:32 |
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| CosmoHill | I very must doubt that Nokia will invest a lot of time and money developing a new product and then throw it away and buy someone else's product | 13:32 |
| Stskeeps | ah, i'm not in nokia if that's what you are implying | 13:32 |
| niala | Stskeeps: thanks for your answer | 13:32 |
| niala | Stskeeps: ok but all the other risk to migrate... | 13:33 |
| niala | ok i ll stop to troll :) | 13:33 |
| Alex-Meego | niala, and don't bother =) no win for nokia | 13:34 |
| Alex-Meego | no win7! ... | 13:34 |
| iekku | :D :D :D | 13:35 |
| iekku | taking win isn't win? | 13:35 |
| iekku | :P | 13:35 |
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| niala | I never understand anything about business | 13:36 |
| CosmoHill | for some reason all this reminds me that I need a new battery for my phone | 13:38 |
| niala | people want just to clic, they don't now why or how, but they want to clic | 13:39 |
| CosmoHill | click* ? | 13:40 |
| niala | CosmoHill: ways of spirit are strange sometimes :) | 13:40 |
| iekku | manara's click? | 13:40 |
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| niala | yes click sorry | 13:40 |
| CosmoHill | it's annoying having the low battery sound play in your ear whenever you make a call | 13:41 |
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| iekku | CosmoHill, that's familiar with n900 | 13:41 |
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| Alex-Meego | but not with android - your battery is over before you call =) | 13:42 |
| iekku | :D | 13:42 |
| CosmoHill | does it go "omg I'm low on battery" but afterwards "actually my bad, I'm full" | 13:42 |
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| wazd | Nokia Ovi Suite just told me "I'm busy right now, ask again later" | 13:45 |
| wazd | wtf | 13:45 |
| wazd | :) | 13:46 |
| CosmoHill | mine told me there was a new update available but forgot to mention how ugly it looked | 13:46 |
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| Alex-Meego | XmlListModel works on meego from qml? | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | should, i think | 13:52 |
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| Hq` | yes it does | 13:56 |
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| Alex-Meego | hm... so it is strange. Parsing data with XmlListModel works on windows. But from meego ivi my list is always empty. But reading the same file with QDomDocument - ok | 13:57 |
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| Alex-Meego | going to make "debug" file. May be there will be something new with xml | 14:01 |
| Alex-Meego | are there any plans to release images for qemu for Meego IVI??? | 14:02 |
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| Alex-Meego | I have a question about meego. There is package like rdsd-0.1-1.2.rpm. Does it mean that there's Radio RDS (digital data) is available on Meego? Anybody tried it? | 15:10 |
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| * CosmoHill looks at his assignment and thinks "I need a white board" | 15:16 | |
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| mdp | hrm, anybody know of any work around coupling UI design layout with internationalization? specifically, there's an issue that arises when some translation exceeds the capacity of the designer's space for text. | 16:00 |
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| mdp | and they can't see that problem until they cycle through and probably are late in QA :) | 16:02 |
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| Alex-Meego | mdp, Qt layouts automatically fit sizes to text inside (depends on layout policy) | 16:05 |
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| mdp | Alex-Meego, yeah, I've got some designers that don't want adaptive components, but want to be warned somehow if their fixed size components will cause problems | 16:08 |
| mdp | I suspect they may need to change their ways from their old HMI design | 16:08 |
| mdp | in theory, one could create a tool (having all the translations done) to validate fixed size text components...but you have to have all the translations done | 16:09 |
| Alex-Meego | want to be warned somehow? they will be warned by testers and programmers =) | 16:09 |
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| Alex-Meego | yes. I think that it simply should be tested. | 16:10 |
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| mdp | Alex-Meego, well, they want to validate their fixed layout versus the content :) | 16:12 |
| mdp | I bring it up here in case I was missing something obvious...my preference is to force the issue of them giving up their fixed layout mentality | 16:12 |
| mdp | this particular team has had the "luxury" in the past of assuming one screen layout / resolution and using it for 10+ years..so they just design for that...so they're stuck in that thinking | 16:14 |
| Alex-Meego | also I am missing something =) | 16:14 |
| Alex-Meego | you may calculate text width for Painter and compare it with widget | 16:14 |
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| Alex-Meego | but it not so obvious | 16:15 |
| mdp | text width varies based on translation though | 16:15 |
| Alex-Meego | yes | 16:15 |
| Alex-Meego | to make some system to calculate text width before (on while) passing text to widget | 16:16 |
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| mdp | right, ok | 16:16 |
| Alex-Meego | or not with widget but with your inner array of Sizes - you already know them | 16:17 |
| mdp | right | 16:17 |
| Alex-Meego | my greetings to your desiners =) | 16:17 |
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| Alex-Meego | *designers | 16:18 |
| mdp | I do see the big picture issue they have...you need to know your worst case text width (whatever glyph set and translation it is) in order to be sure your screen layout is usable | 16:18 |
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| mdp | any automagic adaptation may produce undesirable "designer" results :) | 16:18 |
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| mdp | Alex-Meego, I'm not sure I can even convey a greeting to the designers...they don't communicate the same way :) | 16:20 |
| Alex-Meego | design without layouts or anchors is always "undesirable" =) | 16:20 |
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| mdp | that's what I'm going to try to push as I believe it's the case. always an uphill battle with an old corporate design group :( | 16:21 |
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| Alex-Meego | have you thought about making design in qml? | 16:21 |
| mdp | thx for the help | 16:21 |
| mdp | this is what I'm introducing them to | 16:21 |
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| mdp | I use it in my hacking so I'm familiar | 16:21 |
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| mdp | we are selecting an HMI framework for a product...and although it's OSS-based I have to compare Qt to several commercial options..such as TAT Cascades | 16:22 |
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| mdp | one of the groups with input on reqmts is the design team :) | 16:23 |
| mdp | so the matrix has all the usual stuff about Qt Designer, QML, and the declarative UI model covered for Qt. | 16:24 |
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| mdp | AFAIK, nobody else has any special translation validation tools like this so it probably doesn't matter...but they sure liked to talk about the problem for 1+ hours | 16:25 |
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| wazd | thiago: still around? :) | 16:34 |
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| thiago | wazd: yep | 16:36 |
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| wazd | thiago: where can I get that fancy new Qt creator? :) | 16:36 |
| thiago | wazd: I get the sources and compile. | 16:37 |
| wazd | thiago: aw :) | 16:38 |
| wazd | thiago: rude joke on me :D | 16:38 |
| mdp | thiago, is there a handy link with new features for the designer tool included in 2.2? | 16:39 |
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| thiago | wazd: the new Qt SDK 1.1 beta should have it | 16:40 |
| thiago | mdp: I don't know. | 16:40 |
| mdp | ok, use the source | 16:41 |
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| CosmoHill | slaine: .o/ | 16:54 |
| slaine | Howdy | 16:55 |
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| * CosmoHill stabs MSDN-AA for not being a decent service | 17:01 | |
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| * thiago needs a kernel developer to talk to | 17:10 | |
| thiago | where's arjan when you need him? | 17:10 |
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| hena | thiago, what do you need? | 17:19 |
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| thiago | hena: I need a new syscall :-) | 17:19 |
| hena | ok, not a big thing in general | 17:20 |
| thiago | I need a pidfd or waitfd | 17:20 |
| thiago | signalfd is useless for libraries | 17:20 |
| hena | getting it into linus tree is not gonna happen ;) | 17:20 |
| thiago | why not? | 17:20 |
| thiago | using SIGCHLD for notification of child processes dying is pre-historic | 17:20 |
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| hena | syscall policy is really anal | 17:20 |
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| thiago | we need something more modern, thread-safe, etc. | 17:21 |
| thiago | I see new syscalls in every release | 17:21 |
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| hena | i wonder if greg let's stuff go past more easily ;) | 17:21 |
| thiago | not even if I have a very good reason for this? | 17:22 |
| hena | but yeah, there's changes often, but it really has to be something to get thru | 17:22 |
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| mwichmann | to those who are interested in such things, there's a new draft of the compliance spec on the wiki | 17:44 |
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| CosmoHill | mwichmann: cool | 17:44 |
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| niala | a link mwichmann ? | 18:00 |
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| CosmoHill | niala: http://wiki.meego.com/Quality/Compliance#Specification | 18:01 |
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| niala | CosmoHill: thank you darling | 18:02 |
| CosmoHill | you're welcome dear | 18:03 |
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| niala | CosmoHill: if i remember right, you have a minimal .spe somewhere ? | 18:05 |
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| CosmoHill | oui, a moment | 18:08 |
| CosmoHill | http://download.bluesquarelinux.co.uk/felix/SPECS/template.spec | 18:08 |
| CosmoHill | I might have a look at the spec and try and write a better one | 18:09 |
| Jartza | "oui" reminds me, I have to check if there is some french-courses beginning soon | 18:09 |
| CosmoHill | or I might download a meego .src.rpm and blank it's spec file | 18:09 |
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| Jartza | I need to learn some french in 3 months | 18:12 |
| CosmoHill | niala: it should be noted that my .spec files are questionable at best | 18:12 |
| CosmoHill | having said that I've put them all together in a distro and they've been running for 2 years :) | 18:14 |
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| niala | yes ./configure ./makee thats all | 18:16 |
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| niala | need to say to privoxy.rpm that's his config file is in /etc | 18:18 |
| CosmoHill | feel free to have a look at the other spec fles in there | 18:18 |
| CosmoHill | Stskeeps: kudos, I downloaded binutils.src.rpm from meego and the .spec file looks scary | 18:20 |
| niala | pfff i don't remember pass for build.meego | 18:20 |
| CosmoHill | it's the same as meego.com | 18:21 |
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| CosmoHill | niala: http://download.bluesquarelinux.co.uk/felix/SPECS/clamav-4.spec << lastest spec file | 18:22 |
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| niala | CosmoHill: do you use build.meego ? | 18:23 |
| CosmoHill | nope | 18:23 |
| niala | oh we need your rpm :) | 18:24 |
| CosmoHill | I think I'd need to clean my up a lot before it would be compliant / up to scratch | 18:25 |
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| CosmoHill | actually I did try compiling that spec file and it failed with something about debug | 18:25 |
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| niala | do a cluster-meego.rpm | 18:25 |
| CosmoHill | I have openmpi.rpm somewhere | 18:26 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | anyone around to help me with submitting a package upstream from OBS? | 18:26 |
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| niala | TSCHAKeee2: how? | 18:27 |
| Coke | Hello! I've put the meego image on an usb stick using dd, but it won't boot. I've tried the same stick using slackware 13.1 and archlinux images, they both boot fine. What do I need to get the meego image booting? | 18:27 |
| Coke | (this is on an eeepc) | 18:27 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | I need to figure out what "project" to submit these to... basically, I've got a whole set of packages that are dependencies for my big package | 18:28 |
| Venemo | Coke: http://meego.com/devices/netbook/installing-meego-your-netbook | 18:28 |
| Coke | Venemo: that doesn't tell me why it won't boot. | 18:28 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | and I can't get my dependencies to resolve | 18:28 |
| Venemo | Coke: did you follow the instructions? | 18:29 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | even though they are part of my project as a subproject..so i am wondering if i have to submit my individual dependencies upstream | 18:29 |
| niala | TSCHAKeee2: what package? | 18:29 |
| Coke | Venemo: yeah. | 18:29 |
| Coke | Venemo: i've tried a few other images for other distros, they all boot fine. | 18:29 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | niala: SDL_ttf, sge, mysql (client) | 18:30 |
| CosmoHill | oh bugger, I can't find my own FAW | 18:30 |
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| Venemo | Coke: hmm. maybe the image you downloaded is corrupted? | 18:30 |
| CosmoHill | FAQ* | 18:30 |
| Venemo | Coke: I'm just guessing | 18:30 |
| Coke | Venemo: took it down twice | 18:30 |
| Coke | Venemo: can I check with an md5 somewhere? | 18:30 |
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| CosmoHill | http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_Distribution_Frequently_Asked_Questions | 18:30 |
| Venemo | Coke: search for md5 on http://meego.com/downloads/releases/1.1/meego-v1.1-netbooks | 18:31 |
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| Coke | Ah. It's the same. | 18:32 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | sorry, empathy crashed. | 18:32 |
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| niala | crash often i use pigdin now, sorry for integration with people panel :( | 18:34 |
| CosmoHill | you know "meego" is a distro right, how would you describe the rest of it | 18:34 |
| Coke | Venemo: mounting the image it says it's mounted as iso9660 | 18:34 |
| niala | TSCHAKeee2: i think you will have more response in mailing list, | 18:34 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | niala: it's okay. | 18:34 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | niala: noted. | 18:34 |
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| Coke | Is meego booting using lilo or grub? | 18:37 |
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| Coke | (from the usb image) | 18:37 |
| CosmoHill | the livecd uses sysimg or something | 18:38 |
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| Coke | syslinux yeah, but its not the bootloader | 18:38 |
| hj | Does anyone here knows how to set the screen resolution of the Meego handset? | 18:39 |
| hj | I'm using the beagleboard. I set the boot to start with the 1024x768 and the /usr/share/meegotouch/targets/N900.conf to the same resolution, but it does not worked as I expected | 18:40 |
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| hj | Is there an easy way to do this? | 18:40 |
| CosmoHill | Coke: syslinux is a boot loader | 18:40 |
| CosmoHill | hj: there might be something on the wiki about it | 18:40 |
| niala | meego boot on extlinux isn't it ? | 18:41 |
| CosmoHill | once installed is uses grub | 18:41 |
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| Coke | CosmoHill: y youre right | 18:41 |
| Coke | But syslinux won't boot for some reason | 18:42 |
| CosmoHill | do you get the boot loader menu pop up at all? | 18:42 |
| Coke | no | 18:42 |
| Coke | the lappy doesn't find a bootable device. | 18:42 |
| CosmoHill | have you booted other distos from USB? | 18:42 |
| Coke | i tried with slackware (extlinux) and archlinux (syslinux) | 18:42 |
| Coke | both work fine | 18:43 |
| CosmoHill | have you checked the md5sum of the meego image? | 18:43 |
| niala | /boot/grub is empty only a splash.xpm.tgz | 18:43 |
| Coke | yes. | 18:43 |
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| CosmoHill | niala: if it didn't have grub there wouldn't be /boot/grub at all :) | 18:44 |
| niala | and win and other Os are add on /boot/extlinux/extlinux.conf | 18:44 |
| Coke | I've seen blogs and screenshots of meego on the eeepc so some do get it working | 18:44 |
| hj | CosmoHill: I've being looking for it for 3 days. The solutions that I found does not work so good. | 18:45 |
| hj | Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place | 18:45 |
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| hj | CosmoHill: Do you know where exactly I can found it in the Wiki | 18:45 |
| hj | I mean, in what part of wiki | 18:46 |
| CosmoHill | have you tried a different USB stick / SD card? | 18:46 |
| hj | yes | 18:46 |
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| Coke | CosmoHill: no, since it works with slack and arch. but im trying it now | 18:46 |
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| CosmoHill | ahh you're both confusing me | 18:47 |
| Coke | How can I clarify? :) | 18:47 |
| CosmoHill | Coke: does you eeePC have an Celeron or Atom processor? | 18:47 |
| * Coke casts clarity on CosmoHill | 18:47 | |
| Coke | CosmoHill: atom | 18:47 |
| CosmoHill | awesome, then meego will work | 18:48 |
| niala | synergys | 18:48 |
| niala | oups :) | 18:48 |
| Coke | CosmoHill: sweet. how do I get it to boot? | 18:48 |
| CosmoHill | no idea | 18:48 |
| CosmoHill | I just stuck the DVD in the drive but you don't have one | 18:49 |
| Coke | I'm gonna try the second usb stick here. its a different vendor too | 18:49 |
| Coke | dee vee dee? as in the obsolete optical media? :) | 18:49 |
| Coke | Nope. The other USB stick did not work either. | 18:50 |
| niala | well i remember amstrad cpc464 with tape....... | 18:50 |
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| Coke | Guess this is a sign that I should be social on a friday night rather than tinker with the computer. | 18:51 |
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| vgrade-nexus | arfoll, yes, a joggler in control of XBMC on a pandaboard with big tv would make a great demo | 18:52 |
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| arfoll | vgrade-nexus, yes that would be very nice - unfortunately i have no pandaboard hardware :-( | 18:52 |
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| * TSCHAKeee2 will have Joggler running LinuxMCE Orbiter very soon | 18:53 | |
| CosmoHill | Coke: yes, you should sod off and pull | 18:53 |
| CosmoHill | :p | 18:53 |
| Coke | CosmoHill: gonna try Debian's live system now | 18:53 |
| Coke | CosmoHill: if it works, where can I file a bug? | 18:53 |
| arfoll | I was actually thinking of going one further, running XBMC on the joggler, and writing a player that is actually just a JSON querier that connects to the pandaboard | 18:53 |
| CosmoHill | bugs.meego.com | 18:53 |
| Coke | or, is meego even supposed to work on an eeepc? i dont know the rules. | 18:53 |
| CosmoHill | make sure you specific you exact model | 18:54 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 rolls his eyes at the sheer hackery | 18:54 | |
| arfoll | but there is still the problem that the EMGD drivers are still too unstable. Although is there any chance the new drivers may include GLES2? | 18:54 |
| Coke | CosmoHill: man. i dont remember. :) | 18:54 |
| Coke | CosmoHill: does meego work on an i7? | 18:54 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: you should look at LinuxMCE sometime...we have a lot of plumbing for what you're trying to do, already there as standard operating procedure. ;) | 18:54 |
| vgrade-nexus | arfol, have you seen the 1812 drivers | 18:54 |
| CosmoHill | I'd image you'd read it since it's intfront of you | 18:54 |
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| CosmoHill | Coke: http://wiki.meego.com/FAQ | 18:55 |
| arfoll | vgrade-nexus, don't know do you have a joggler image with them on? | 18:55 |
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| Coke | oh, asus eeepc S101 | 18:55 |
| Coke | said on the bottom | 18:55 |
| niala | Coke: http://wiki.meego.com/Devices | 18:55 |
| niala | Coke: yes s101 it s me :) | 18:55 |
| Coke | it should work | 18:56 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, looks interesting i have to read :-) | 18:56 |
| Coke | niala: u running 1.1? | 18:56 |
| niala | out of box Coke yes I confirm | 18:56 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: it's the most advanced smart home platform in existance. ;) | 18:56 |
| vgrade-nexus | arfoll, yes, i'll be uploading the image this weekend, http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.1.80/daily/non-oss/repos/ia32/packages/i586/emgd-bin-1812-1.1.i586.rpm, http://wiki.meego.com/User:Vgrade | 18:56 |
| arfoll | vgrade-nexus, great i'll be waiting for it ;-) | 18:57 |
| arfoll | does it provide GLES? | 18:57 |
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| Coke | niala: did u install any firmware on your asus? | 18:57 |
| vgrade-nexus | arfoll, yes | 18:57 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, is there a 10ft UI? And is the playback implemented with gstreamer? | 18:57 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2176025602905109829 <-- demo video. old, but still apropos. | 18:57 |
| Coke | So, arch and slack boots, debian and meego does not. | 18:57 |
| arfoll | vgrade-nexus, awesome i'll have to play then :-) | 18:58 |
| niala | Coke: you mean bios update? no | 18:58 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: we have a massively distributed UI called orbiter, runs on-screen, and on lots of off-screen devices | 18:58 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: playback is much more abstracted than that. You don't understand yet.. that's okay ;) | 18:58 |
| wmarone | vgrade-nexus: you were right, I disabled signalfd and it came right up | 18:58 |
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| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, yes but is your backend gstreamer based? | 18:58 |
| vgrade-nexus | wmarone, :) | 18:59 |
| Coke | niala: very weird | 18:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: no, we provide xine and mplayer devices... nothing stopping anyone from doing a gstreamer player though | 18:59 |
| wmarone | I'm working with one of the Android community kernels to get WiFi going | 18:59 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, :-( | 18:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: to our system, software players and hardware players are interchangeable | 18:59 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: we offer a great deal of flexibility that doesn't exist elsewhere | 18:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: stop thinking so narrowly. | 19:00 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ;) | 19:00 |
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| * CosmoHill gets an email | 19:00 | |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: this isn't some duct taped together system | 19:00 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, lol i'm still watching | 19:00 |
| CosmoHill | "Hi, we are looking for 1000 students to program in java and .net DELETE" | 19:00 |
| niala | Coke: what is your problem in fact ? | 19:01 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, the UI is not very pretty, tbh - but the features are very interesting | 19:02 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | arfoll: we know. | 19:02 |
| Coke | niala: the meego image wont boot | 19:02 |
| Coke | TSCHAKeee2: all those things you mention are only a benefit to users | 19:03 |
| niala | usb stick is the problem, meego work on live on eeepc s101 | 19:03 |
| Coke | niala: tried a different | 19:03 |
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| Coke | niala: slack and arch both work on that stick | 19:03 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | Coke: we provide a whole set of tools to quickly develop new devices for the system | 19:03 |
| Coke | TSCHAKeee2: the industry wants lock down and control | 19:03 |
| Coke | TSCHAKeee2: most popular phone is the most locked down. users dont care. | 19:03 |
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| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, i'm not sure i like the license though ;-) | 19:04 |
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| Coke | niala: gonna see if ubuntu live boots or not | 19:04 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | Coke: I honestly don't give a fuck. | 19:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | Coke: We are designing this system for people who want it. | 19:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | Coke: and me being a researcher, this is a platform for long term research | 19:05 |
| Coke | TSCHAKeee2: yeah. im one of those people. | 19:05 |
| niala | Coke: i have already have issue with usb-stick when i write unbutu and after meego on same key. I have used windows to erase completly usb stick. I don't no why | 19:05 |
| Coke | niala: you use dd? | 19:05 |
| niala | Coke: yes dd | 19:05 |
| Coke | dd overwrites everything | 19:05 |
| niala | yes, i know.... sometines they are gremlins ........ | 19:06 |
| Coke | Hmmm. | 19:06 |
| Coke | Odd. Arch and slack works, they use extlinux, ubuntu debian and meego does not boot they use syslinux and isolinux | 19:06 |
| vgrade-nexus | wmarone, do you have kb and mouse control in x/xterm? | 19:06 |
| Coke | ok thanks for your help | 19:07 |
| Coke | im gonna reboot and see if meego works on this box | 19:07 |
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| wmarone | vgrade-nexus: no, it's unresponsive once X starts | 19:07 |
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| vgrade-nexus | wmarone, same here, I guess its because udev has not run due to the lack of signalfd | 19:08 |
| vgrade-nexus | wmarone, we need to find out what signalfd allows | 19:08 |
| vgrade-nexus | which is causing the traces | 19:09 |
| wmarone | I cut out all the Android build options, might try re-enabling signalfd | 19:09 |
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| vgrade-nexus | or what does udev allow access to, which causes MeeGo to trace | 19:10 |
| arfoll | TSCHAKeee2, thanks for the video, i'm going to look into it, however what are the binariy parts of the project? | 19:12 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | nothing on our end. most of the binary blobs are device drivers for stuff like the nvidia GPU, etc. | 19:13 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | and a few small bits for the USB UIRT, Tira, and IRTrans transcievers (because they contain built in PRONTO translation code.) | 19:14 |
| arfoll | ok, cheers | 19:15 |
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| Coke | Meego boots on my clevo stylenot. :) | 19:16 |
| ilpokuikka | can someone explain how do i restore my USB stick to normal, after byte-copying meego to it with Win32DiskImager ? | 19:16 |
| ilpokuikka | it shows 832MB capacity though it's 16GB... | 19:16 |
| Coke | so it's a night home with the lappy | 19:17 |
| berndhs | i dont like connman | 19:17 |
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| niala | Coke: usb stick boot on anotherlaptop and no on s101... very strange.. try escape key when you turn ons101 | 19:21 |
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| niala | CosmoHill: reading fc last ? | 19:34 |
| CosmoHill | in 2 hours | 19:35 |
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| niala | they are last if they loose? i m right ? | 19:36 |
| CosmoHill | ? | 19:36 |
| niala | in 2 hours? | 19:36 |
| CosmoHill | http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_div_1/9383510.stm | 19:37 |
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| hena | "sorry, myzone is broken" | 19:39 |
| hena | how sweet! | 19:39 |
| niala | CosmoHill: ohh atdhe is closed!?!? :( sad news | 19:39 |
| niala | hena: it's happen sometimes, restart and it works again | 19:40 |
| hena | don't wanna restart | 19:42 |
| hena | have stuff open | 19:42 |
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| berndhs | connman sucks | 20:24 |
| berndhs | gives no indication of errors, warnings, network just stops working | 20:25 |
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| niala | question: if i change my password on meego.com Build Obs will update alone ? | 20:44 |
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| sbegley3 | hi all, i just installed MeeGo on my EEE 900HA. When I run Fennec, it only uses about 2/3s of the screen (starting from the upper left corner). There is an, unusable, white bar at the bottom and right side. Any suggestions? | 20:51 |
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| sbegley3 | anyone here? | 20:57 |
| niala | fennec -target slate | 20:58 |
| iekku | there's going to be fennec update soon | 20:58 |
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| iekku | don't know estimate | 20:58 |
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| sbegley3 | ok thx for the info. @niala, i assume that how i should call fennec. where can i change the built in Fennec link? | 21:00 |
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| niala | " fennec -target slate " in a term to have fennec in fullscreen. maybe you change desktop file | 21:01 |
| sbegley3 | ill look for it | 21:01 |
| niala | /usr/share/applications/fennec.desktop | 21:01 |
| sbegley3 | thanks | 21:02 |
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| sbegley3 | what is the default root password? | 21:05 |
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| niala | your user password if it s installed or meego on live | 21:05 |
| sbegley3 | hmm... i installed but it didnt ask me for a user password | 21:05 |
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| dirk2 | I'd like to use sreadahead http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-os-base/sreadahead on a stock kernel.org kernel. Are there any kernel patches necessary for this? | 21:07 |
| dirk2 | The (outdated?) Google repository http://code.google.com/p/sreadahead/ comes with a (2.6.29?) kernel patch | 21:08 |
| dirk2 | And http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-os-base/sreadahead/blobs/master/readahead.c#line182 touches /sys/block/mmcblk0/read_ahead_kb which I'm not sure is part of the standard kernel? | 21:08 |
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| thiago_home | compare that file to the stock kernel | 21:12 |
| thiago_home | the kernel .src.rpm in the MeeGo repo will have any patches that were applied on top of the stock | 21:12 |
| dirk2 | thiago_home: Thanks | 21:13 |
| sbegley3 | @naila got fennec working, thanks | 21:14 |
| dirk2 | thiago_home: Before I search, any link to the src.rpm? | 21:14 |
| CosmoHill | repo.meego.com | 21:15 |
| CosmoHill | it's about 70MB | 21:15 |
| dirk2 | I was looking in the git http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-os-base/kernel-source but I think I can't see the individual patches there | 21:15 |
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| thiago_home | you can probably check that out and compare via git diff to the stock kernel | 21:16 |
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| * dirk2 looks at http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/releases/1.1/core/repos/source/kernel-2.6.35.3-10.3.src.rpm | 21:17 | |
| wmarone | hm, wonder what nokia is going to say next week... | 21:20 |
| Wellark^ | why so? | 21:22 |
| wmarone | because, it'll either quiet the flamewars and fudstream, or make 'em even stronger ;) | 21:22 |
| wmarone | that and whatever is announced will have a huge impact on MeeGo itself | 21:23 |
| Wellark^ | flamewars? fudstream? have I missed something? :D | 21:23 |
| * epx quite curious, too | 21:24 | |
| wmarone | http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/04/nokia-microsoft-announcing-partnership-next-week-possibly-invo/ <- this whole mess, which is just more of what's been rolling around for weeks | 21:24 |
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| Wellark^ | oh, that news XD | 21:25 |
| Wellark^ | ok | 21:25 |
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| makulkar_laptop | sudo ssh root@192.168.2.15 | 21:33 |
| makulkar_laptop | ssh: connect to host 192.168.2.15 port 22: No route to host | 21:33 |
| makulkar_laptop | need help! I'm getting this error when I moved to my laptop | 21:33 |
| CosmoHill | 1. why do you need to run ssh with sudo ? | 21:33 |
| CosmoHill | 2. can you prin the host? | 21:33 |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, all random tries ;) | 21:33 |
| CosmoHill | ping* | 21:33 |
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| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, 2) yes | 21:34 |
| CosmoHill | can you connect to the host from other computeres? | 21:34 |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, yes | 21:34 |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, i was successfully ssh'ng on desktop | 21:34 |
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| Wellark^ | which address does your laptop have? | 21:35 |
| CosmoHill | what is your laptop's ip address? | 21:35 |
| CosmoHill | what Wellark^ said | 21:35 |
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| makulkar_laptop | Wellark, CosmoHill what address as in? It has a IP some random number? | 21:36 |
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| CosmoHill | 169.x.x.x ? | 21:36 |
| makulkar_laptop | 172.x.x.x | 21:36 |
| CosmoHill | your laptop is on the wrong range | 21:36 |
| CosmoHill | you should have 192.168.2.x | 21:36 |
| Wellark^ | are you using your neighbours WLAN? ;) | 21:37 |
| makulkar_laptop | my desktop and laptop are on same network so they both are in same range | 21:37 |
| CosmoHill | so your desktop is also 172.x.x.x ? | 21:37 |
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| makulkar_laptop | Wellark, heh im @ office | 21:37 |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, yes | 21:37 |
| CosmoHill | try running traceroute on both computers | 21:37 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | wmarone: once more, engadget is talking out its ass. | 21:38 |
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| Wellark^ | TSCHAKeee2: so I should stop updating my CV, then? ;) | 21:39 |
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| thiago_home | 172 can be a valid, routed IP | 21:39 |
| thiago_home | unless the second octet is between 16 and 31 | 21:39 |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, Wellark im on office LAN. traceroute to what addess? | 21:39 |
| CosmoHill | the one your trying to connect to | 21:39 |
| CosmoHill | at uni ethernet and wifi have different firewall rules | 21:40 |
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| hirabayashitaro | is there a wiki or giude about emulation of hanset distribution on linux? | 21:40 |
| niala1 | question about ip is ipv4 full ? it will be soon? | 21:40 |
| makulkar_laptop | thiago_home, yes it is in that range | 21:40 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | niala1: the last /8 block was allocated today. | 21:40 |
| CosmoHill | makulkar_laptop: never mind, a firewall will be invisable | 21:40 |
| thiago_home | then it's an RFC1918-reserved address | 21:40 |
| thiago_home | TSCHAKeee2: the last 5 were | 21:40 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | yes | 21:40 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | the last 5 | 21:40 |
| thiago_home | TSCHAKeee2: the IANA is out, though technically since Tuesday | 21:40 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | again, yes. | 21:41 |
| thiago_home | 1-2 years later than originally expected | 21:41 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | yeah | 21:41 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | and just as predicted a decade ago, still no solid plans to move everybody into IPv6 space. | 21:42 |
| thiago_home | hmm... my blogs are #4 and #5 on http://www.google.com/search?q=the+great+crash+of+2009 | 21:42 |
| niala1 | ipv4 is over, the end of the world, stone age :) | 21:42 |
| thiago_home | http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2008/11/07/the-great-crash-of-2009/ | 21:42 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | everybody just stuck their fingers in their ears and "lalalalalalalla" | 21:42 |
| mwichmann | well, that's unusual how? | 21:42 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: indeed. they should have done an ipv5 that is exactly like ipv4 but uses 64-bit addresses | 21:42 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: then migration would have been a lot easier | 21:43 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ... | 21:43 |
| mwichmann | nearly all home routers, and an awful lot of isps, have no idea about ipv6, it's somewhat grim | 21:43 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 is not even going to get into that argument. | 21:43 | |
| thiago_home | lindi-: I hope that was meant as a joke, even though I don't see any emoticons | 21:43 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 too | 21:44 | |
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| thiago_home | TSCHAKeee2: I wonder how long until someone decides to use the 16 /8 remaining in Class E | 21:44 |
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| * TSCHAKeee2 chuckles | 21:44 | |
| TSCHAKeee2 | thiago_home: hmmm, a week? ;) | 21:44 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: when you send a packet on the wire and the address is larger than 2^32 it'd just generate an ipv5 packet :) | 21:44 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | uhhh | 21:45 |
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| * TSCHAKeee2 just walks away, laughing. | 21:45 | |
| makulkar_laptop | CosmoHill, Wellark, also when It tries to mount and fails saying unable to lock the device | 21:45 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: so everyone could migrate to this mysterous "ipv5" without having to worry about not being to talk to others :P | 21:45 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | lindi-: you...need...to do some homework... ;) | 21:45 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | i'm being ---really--- nice here. | 21:46 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: heh, I suppose some of the new features of ipv6 are useful but since they are new people are afraid :) | 21:46 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | right now, all the discussion surrounding ipv6 is centered around trying to shove as many people as possible into 6to4 | 21:47 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | which just...yeaugh. | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | lindi-: IP packets are based on fixed sized structs | 21:47 |
| berndhs | lindi-: yeah people in the high-tech industries at the leading edge are afraid of new things :P | 21:47 |
| lindi- | ali1234: yes | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | if you increase the address size it will be completely incompatible with regular ipv4 | 21:47 |
| ali1234 | besides 6to4 does this anyway | 21:48 |
| hirabayashitaro | sorry for reposting, but is there a way to test the meego for handsets on virtual box or something? | 21:48 |
| ali1234 | except, in a way that actually works | 21:48 |
| lindi- | ali1234: well you could consider "ipv4" to mean 32-bit addresses and "ipv5" to mean 64-bit addresses, this way you'd effectively get variable length addresses | 21:48 |
| ali1234 | so how you going to tell the difference between ipv4 packets and ipv5 packets in this scheme? | 21:48 |
| lindi- | ali1234: version number field | 21:49 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | .... | 21:49 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA | 21:49 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | sorry, that made me spit out my drink. ;) | 21:49 |
| niala1 | hirabayashitaro: yes look at wiki.meego.com or at forum.meego.com | 21:49 |
| lindi- | ali1234: hmm, does 6to4 help if I have devices in LAN that only talk ipv4? | 21:50 |
| ali1234 | no of course not | 21:50 |
| ali1234 | neither would ipv5 | 21:50 |
| ali1234 | or anything else | 21:50 |
| ali1234 | if they only do ipv4 they only do ipv4 | 21:50 |
| Wellark^ | niala1: is there x86 version of handset available somewhere? I only found images for N900 and Aava ? | 21:51 |
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| lindi- | ali1234: if you just assign these legacy devices addresss that are < 2^32 then they'll be able to understand your packets since they will be normal ipv4 ones | 21:51 |
| ali1234 | no, they wont | 21:51 |
| mwichmann | test-ipv6.com can be amusing.... | 21:51 |
| lindi- | ali1234: in my hypothetical ipv5 world they will :) | 21:51 |
| ali1234 | you can run ipv4 and ipv6 at the same time anyway, assuming you set it up right | 21:51 |
| niala1 | Wellark^: aava | 21:52 |
| Wellark^ | grrhh.. what am I talking.. | 21:52 |
| Wellark^ | sure | 21:52 |
| Wellark^ | XD | 21:52 |
| lindi- | ali1234: yeah but then you need to worry about both iptables and ip6tables :) | 21:52 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: you're describing ipv6, with the exception of 64-bit instead of 128-bit addresses | 21:52 |
| mwichmann | pretty typical result: | 21:52 |
| mwichmann | 7/10for your IPv4 stability and readiness, when publishers offer both IPv4 and IPv6 | 21:52 |
| mwichmann | 0/10for your IPv6 stability and readiness, when publishers are forced to go IPv6 only | 21:52 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: and you're conveninently leaving out ALL of the problems | 21:52 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: I understood that ipv6 was a lot more than just larger address space | 21:52 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: it's just a larger address space | 21:53 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: except that the address space doesn't fit into the 32-bit field of the IPv4 header | 21:53 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: so they changed the version number in that header and expanded to fit more bytes | 21:53 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: just a larger address space? | 21:53 |
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| thiago_home | of course, that also means that applications need to know that they need more than one uint32_t to fit the address | 21:54 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: it also contains things like link local addresses? | 21:54 |
| thiago_home | that's just because they could | 21:54 |
| thiago_home | since we're going to create this new thing anyway, why not fix some of the issues of IPv4? | 21:54 |
| thiago_home | besides, IPv4 has link-local too: 169.254.0.0/16 | 21:54 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: because it slows down migration :) | 21:54 |
| thiago_home | no | 21:54 |
| Wellark^ | if you agree with me that ipv6 support is a must then please comment on meego-dev so that we can get that in to the compliance spec :) | 21:55 |
| thiago_home | the migration is slowed down because it costs money to do the switch | 21:55 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: and I also understood that ipv6 does not address many of the security issues of ipv4 in the modern world either | 21:55 |
| hirabayashitaro | niala1: The wiki is only the netbook edition, nothing for the handset one? | 21:55 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: exactly. IPSec is supposedly mandated. | 21:55 |
| Wellark^ | imho any component not supporting ipv6 fully in meego trunk should have bugs opened with critical severity | 21:55 |
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| thiago_home | lindi-: but the point is that IPv6 is nothing but an expanded address space, with some things fixed. It requires new APIs. | 21:55 |
| thiago_home | Wellark^: I actually agree. | 21:55 |
| Wellark^ | and yes, it has to be stated in the spec | 21:56 |
| * thiago_home points out that Qt4 has supported IPv6 since 4.0 -- in 2005 | 21:56 | |
| niala1 | hirabayashitaro: sorry i don't remember the question | 21:56 |
| Wellark^ | one would think that "nobody can be so ignorant to leave it out these days" | 21:56 |
| thiago_home | unfortunately, we didn't add multicasting support until 4.8 | 21:56 |
| hirabayashitaro | niala1: virtualization of handset distro in vbox | 21:56 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: I don't buy that it is just larger address space :/ | 21:57 |
| Wellark^ | but N900 came out just under two years ago and it doesn't have it which completely proofs the point that if something is not required there's always some vendors who will leave it out | 21:57 |
| Wellark^ | and there are ready exists devices with drm which will prevent you from flashing in your custom kernel for them | 21:58 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: it also has path mtu discovery afaik | 21:58 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: which IPv4 has too | 21:59 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: why don't you go read the IPv6 specs and materials? | 21:59 |
| thiago_home | I've been doing this for 11 years | 21:59 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: it's a lot of material | 21:59 |
| thiago_home | I know what I'm talking about. | 21:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | lindi-: yeah, um.. you need to go do some homework... | 21:59 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | i have been doing ipv6 work off and on for a long time now, as well, and I did IP multicast stuff in the late 90s... | 22:00 |
| hena | i'm sorry if i seems like a total lamo, but why the heck would qt4 need to support ipv6? | 22:00 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ... | 22:00 |
| thiago_home | hena: because sockaddr_in6 is not sockaddr_in | 22:00 |
| hena | ok, any ip | 22:00 |
| thiago_home | hena: because there's a class like QTcpSocket | 22:01 |
| hena | why | 22:01 |
| hena | :) | 22:01 |
| thiago_home | if you tell it socket.connectToHost("meego.com", 80);, it needs to resolve meego.com and connect | 22:01 |
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| lindi- | thiago_home: well at least the headers are fixed length with everything else pushed to options? | 22:01 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | any software that wants to do ipv6 has to be aware of the changes in ipv6...including bigger data structures to hold addresses. | 22:01 |
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| thiago_home | lindi-: yes | 22:01 |
| lindi- | TSCHAKeee2: and you need to support ipsec? | 22:01 |
| thiago_home | QHostAddress supports IPv6 | 22:02 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ipv6 mandates it | 22:02 |
| thiago_home | QHostInfo resolves IPv6 | 22:02 |
| thiago_home | QTcpSocket can connect to IPv6 | 22:02 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: and routers do not fragment packets? | 22:02 |
| thiago_home | this all has been working since 2005 | 22:02 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: (Sorry, found a ipv4 vs. ipv6 cheatsheet) | 22:02 |
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| CosmoHill | I'm confused, did we get the guy's laptop working? | 22:03 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 laughs | 22:03 | |
| lindi- | thiago_home: we have source code for ipv4 stack for VMS. If ipv6 was "just larger address space" I suppose I could easily upgrade that stack to ipv6? ;) | 22:03 |
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| hena | somehow i'm just in the mindset that gui lib doesn't need to know anything about ip or any other network protocol | 22:03 |
| lindi- | thiago_home: even a nice document named "The Joy of CMU TEK/IP" | 22:03 |
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| hena | but i'm not really a gui programmer anyways... | 22:03 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | hena: Qt is a comprehensive toolkit including both GUI and non-GUI functions. | 22:04 |
| ali1234 | qt isn't a gui lib | 22:04 |
| ali1234 | it is a portable toolkit | 22:04 |
| ali1234 | socket code usually isn't very portable | 22:04 |
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| ali1234 | not when compared to some Qt code anyway | 22:04 |
| hena | the things you learn... | 22:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | man, did the room just flood with Karl Pilkingtons all of a sudden? | 22:05 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | ;) | 22:05 |
| haroun | Hi All, Need a help .. Is it possible to convert Meego USB image to mrstnand image [ using mic-convertor tool ] ???... I am getting "Target image format 'mrstnand' not supported" error.. any suggestions ? | 22:06 |
| ali1234 | who is karl pilkington? | 22:07 |
| niala1 | hirabayashitaro: sorryi say something stupid qemu not vbox | 22:07 |
| hena | prolly some efl programmer ;) | 22:08 |
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| hirabayashitaro | niala1: do I need the SDK first? | 22:10 |
| hirabayashitaro | niala1: well, I give up. Just wait for 1.2 release | 22:12 |
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| maximus_ | hello | 22:18 |
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| maximus_ | question? | 22:18 |
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| maximus_ | help | 22:20 |
| wmarone | just ask | 22:20 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: of course it's not that straightforward | 22:20 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: the lower-layer protocols need updating to support it | 22:21 |
| maximus_ | i got a new laptop with meego installed, wifi shows only secured wifi spots | 22:21 |
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| maximus_ | how can I find the unsecured networks, that are on my other laptop | 22:23 |
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| maximus_ | so, any idea | 22:24 |
| topaz_ | can someone plz explain how to use the debuginfo packages in the follwing link? http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/releases/1.1/core/repos/armv7l/debug/ | 22:24 |
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| maximus_ | how can I connect with meego to wifi network | 22:26 |
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| lindi- | thiago_home: yep, that's why it sounds odd to talk about just changing the address space | 22:27 |
| Lopi | will Meego boot to GUI with framebuffer only? | 22:27 |
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| Venemo | maximus_: it would be better if you could tell us what hardware is that | 22:28 |
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| thiago_home | lindi-: it's changing the protocol | 22:39 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: you can't expand the size of the IPv4 header | 22:39 |
| thiago_home | lindi-: you need a new protocol | 22:39 |
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| * thiago_home heard some horror stories about some network operators trying to get 2 more bits in the IP address by stealing them from the port number | 22:39 | |
| TSCHAKeee2 | oh jesus | 22:40 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | hahah | 22:40 |
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| * CosmoHill blows in the front door | 22:40 | |
| thiago_home | I've been following the Nokia discussions with the IETF and operators | 22:40 |
| thiago_home | they were discussing for a while what solutions to use: NAT64, proxy, P+A (the 2 bits from the port thing), dual stack, etc. | 22:41 |
| thiago_home | thankfully they came to their senses and agreed that the only solution is dual stack | 22:41 |
| * thiago_home thinks Intel and AMD will face a similar problem soon when they run out of opcodes in the x86 assembly | 22:42 | |
| thiago_home | AVX is one huuuuge hack | 22:42 |
| thiago_home | I think they expect people to move off 32-bit before this becomes a problem | 22:43 |
| CosmoHill | I wonder if you can get x86 RISC processors | 22:44 |
| hena | no | 22:44 |
| CosmoHill | but I like simple things | 22:44 |
| hena | simple is an opinion | 22:45 |
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| hena | i could say mips is simple :) | 22:45 |
| hena | which it is, but definetily there would be an argument | 22:45 |
| CosmoHill | "le mips" is an anagram of simple | 22:45 |
| hena | alpha is risc and far from simple i would say | 22:46 |
| kallam | It is shame that AMD expand X86 to 64bit prosessors | 22:47 |
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| thiago_home | kallam: would we all be using IA-64 today if they hadn't? | 22:47 |
| hena | why? | 22:47 |
| CosmoHill | kallam: you mean the AMD Athlon 64 should have been pure 64? | 22:47 |
| hena | not that i have anything against later itaniums, but it's just not feasible | 22:48 |
| hena | alpha lost to x86 just the same way | 22:48 |
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| thiago_home | Alpha was already 64-bit | 22:49 |
| thiago_home | it's not about the quality of the assembly language | 22:49 |
| hena | yeah, and it was advanced, fast and expensive | 22:49 |
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| thiago_home | not that expensive | 22:50 |
| hena | just like itanium, who want's that when you get a better price/flops with x86_64 | 22:50 |
| hena | compared to x86, it was wayyy more expensive | 22:51 |
| thiago_home | at one point, an Alpha machine of better specs than the best consumer Pentium III was cheaper | 22:51 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | yup, that was late 99 | 22:51 |
| thiago_home | yep | 22:51 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | i was using alpha hardware back then...loved it to death | 22:51 |
| Ans5i | i didn't have games for my alpha | 22:51 |
| * thiago_home remembers the 21164 of 667 MHz being cheaper than the Pentium III of 550 MHz | 22:51 | |
| Ans5i | my school's alpha.. but well.. :) | 22:52 |
| thiago_home | btw, the Athlons and the Alphas shared the core architecture | 22:52 |
| kallam | backward compatible was one think why AMD-64 success in markets | 22:52 |
| hena | and takes sims in blocks of 8? :) | 22:52 |
| thiago_home | kallam: the Itanium had (until recently) an IA-32 core | 22:53 |
| thiago_home | they could run IA-32 programs no problem | 22:53 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | this is a basic lesson, nothing ever turns out like you think it will... the 8086 was designed as a stop gap processor..while Intel finished the iAPX-432 | 22:53 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | and bits of it are still..with...us....today.... | 22:53 |
| kallam | thiago_home: do they boot to old mode? | 22:54 |
| thiago_home | kallam: not sure. I don't remember the specs that well. | 22:54 |
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| hena | but from the admin side, DCL ruled | 22:54 |
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| thiago_home | kallam: since I think they contained a *full* IA-32 core, they probably could | 22:55 |
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| Lopi | is the xorg log located at /var/log/ on meego? | 23:10 |
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| Wellark^ | Lopi: no, it's under /tmp | 23:25 |
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| Lopi | Wellark^: ah thanks | 23:26 |
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| CosmoHill | niala1: Reading 0 - 1 QPR:( | 23:39 |
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| niala1 | CosmoHill: sorry, burn your shirt :) | 23:45 |
| CosmoHill | hell no | 23:45 |
| makulkar_laptop | I tried few wikis related to USB networking in maemo.org btu still not luck :( | 23:45 |
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| makulkar_laptop | ifconfig -a shows all up and running. Im not able to ssh to the device! | 23:46 |
| makulkar_laptop | or even ping | 23:46 |
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| araujo | makulkar_laptop, http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking | 23:48 |
| araujo | that one worked for me | 23:48 |
| araujo | also, make sure your router is not blocking your connection | 23:48 |
| makulkar_laptop | araujo, tried exact same thing. No errors in any step. But still no ping! | 23:48 |
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| araujo | http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Tips_and_Tricks/N900_USB_Networking | 23:50 |
| araujo | that one is very straight too | 23:50 |
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| makulkar_laptop | araujo, that one too i tried. goes all the way till last command without error but still ping timeout | 23:51 |
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| makulkar_laptop | how do i check if my laptop doesnt block any connection? | 23:51 |
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| araujo | makulkar_laptop, well, check your firewall config | 23:52 |
| araujo | and also if you have any firewall in the router | 23:52 |
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