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| foowaffle | hey | 05:59 |
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| foowaffle | i wondering if meego any good | 06:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | What changed to allow the N900 images on repo.meego.com? | 06:18 |
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| wmarone | they got clearance to redistribute the SGX drivers and firmware blobs | 06:20 |
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| Mat_Matan | morning | 06:47 |
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| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: we managed to get redistributable licenses for the few closed bits we have | 08:23 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: text might be a little too sensationalist :) | 09:09 |
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| rsadhu | hi | 10:34 |
| rsadhu | i need some info regarding meego platform (sim related apis) | 10:34 |
| rsadhu | i want to know , is there any api which can be used to set the simstatus though sim card in inserted into the device | 10:35 |
| rsadhu | actually i need this to test some use case for my app | 10:35 |
| Stskeeps | ofono | 10:35 |
| Stskeeps | or qt mobility | 10:35 |
| rsadhu | so i want to set the sim status | 10:35 |
| rsadhu | anything | 10:35 |
| rsadhu | i was searching in qtmobility | 10:35 |
| rsadhu | but i cudnt find any such api which can set the sim status | 10:36 |
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| rsadhu | http://doc.qt.nokia.com/qtmobility-1.0-tp/qsystemdeviceinfo.html | 10:36 |
| rsadhu | i looked into this | 10:36 |
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| rsadhu | but cudnt find anything which i need | 10:37 |
| rsadhu | so is there any way | 10:37 |
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| TermanaDesire | rsadhu: use dbus to communicate with ofono to find out what you need then | 10:38 |
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| rsadhu | ofono?? whats that | 10:39 |
| rsadhu | thats some service which dbus can communincate to | 10:39 |
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| ljp | why would you want to set the sim status? | 10:40 |
| TermanaDesire | Ofono is a part of the telephony stack for meego | 10:40 |
| rsadhu | ok | 10:40 |
| rsadhu | i want it to simulate one use case | 10:41 |
| rsadhu | called hotswap | 10:41 |
| rsadhu | i m working on javascript extensions | 10:41 |
| rsadhu | so there is one use case | 10:41 |
| rsadhu | where i need to do this | 10:41 |
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| rsadhu | @TermanaDesire :: can you please guide , how would i use the dbus to query from ofono ? | 10:42 |
| ljp | look into ofono and phonesim, unless you need a real sim | 10:42 |
| rsadhu | any example | 10:42 |
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| ljp | rsadhu: in qsysteminfo's master branch would be the connman/ofono code | 10:43 |
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| ljp | there is also some in meego repo | 10:45 |
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| TermanaDesire | rsadhu: I suggest you Google for an explaination | 10:46 |
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| rsadhu | ok thanks | 10:47 |
| rsadhu | for help | 10:47 |
| TermanaDesire | I'm not so great at giving lengthy explainations and examples from a virtual keyboard that likes to auto correct things not in it's dictionary ;p | 10:47 |
| rsadhu | :) | 10:47 |
| rsadhu | ha ha:) | 10:47 |
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| e2e | jos laitain leave tai part komennon niin sanoo 10:35 -!- Sage_: No such channel | 11:03 |
| e2e | sorry, wrong channel | 11:04 |
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| Sage_ | ? :) | 11:04 |
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| thiago | Stskeeps: ping | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | pong | 11:24 |
| thiago | hardfp: do you know the latest? | 11:24 |
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| * thiago has just got a report saying that softfp introduces severe performance penalties | 11:24 | |
| Stskeeps | thiago: well, i haven't heard anything new in my communication channels | 11:24 |
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| thiago | do you know of a task in the bugtracker? | 11:25 |
| * thiago starts searching | 11:25 | |
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| Stskeeps | thiago: there's also a problem that hardfp and softfp is ABI incompatible (i believe) and in addition to that, fennec breaks with it atm.. | 11:25 |
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| thiago | that's the point | 11:26 |
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| thiago | we should *really* choose hardfp now to avoid breakage in the future | 11:26 |
| Stskeeps | with 20 days before release? :P | 11:26 |
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| thiago | Harmattan is switching to hardfp. If MeeGo doesn't switch, apps will be ABI-incompatible. | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | thiago: well, i've tried to raise that point before but noone took heed, if you can raise hell about it better within the organisation, that'd be good | 11:27 |
| thiago | I will | 11:27 |
| thiago | that's why I am asking if you know of a task :-) | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | thiago: and people really need to start running test suites of 'does this binary app work on both H and meego arm' | 11:28 |
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| Stskeeps | i know for a fact qtopengl tying to libGLESv2.so (without .2 suffix) will break | 11:28 |
| thiago | then again, it's probably a bad idea to do that | 11:28 |
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| Stskeeps | qtopengl apps, that is | 11:28 |
| thiago | they're different Linux distros | 11:28 |
| TermanaDesire | Is harmattan *suppose* to be ability compatible though? | 11:29 |
| TermanaDesire | Abi | 11:29 |
| Stskeeps | thiago: i think there exists some kind of marketing belief that an app for meego arm would work on harmattan arm.. | 11:29 |
| Stskeeps | or reverse | 11:30 |
| Stskeeps | (if only using meego apis) | 11:30 |
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| thiago | we've been telling linux users not to install binaries from another distro for 20 years | 11:30 |
| thiago | Stskeeps: OpenGL doesn't count. The driver makes need to clean up their mess first. | 11:31 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 11:31 |
| thiago | make *one* library that works in GL and GLES | 11:31 |
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| thiago | settle on the API and ABI for it, then we'll start publicising it | 11:31 |
| thiago | otherwise, stick to QPainter and QML if you want code that works in both. | 11:31 |
| Stskeeps | well, it's more along lines of inadvertent link dependancies | 11:31 |
| * thiago checks if qmake adds the GL libraries | 11:32 | |
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| Venemo | hey guys | 11:32 |
| Venemo | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=832817#post832817 | 11:33 |
| Venemo | is this serious? | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: keep in mind what is being released: a platform, default images may not have xterm but it's entirely possible to make your own image or install one | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | in fact, n900 images have ssh open over usb | 11:33 |
| Venemo | quote: "In a surprising turn of events, the next major release of MeeGo (1.1, which is due this month), may not ship with an email client (due to quality issues in it); a terminal to access the underlying OS or the ability to run any third party Qt applications." | 11:33 |
| Venemo | well | 11:33 |
| thiago | yes, qmake auto-adds CONFIG += opengl when you link to QtOpenGL | 11:33 |
| thiago | which adds the GL libs | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: and the E-mail client is broken beyond belief, so not getting included (a buggy app is worse than the lack of it) | 11:34 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: if it won't be able to run 3rd party apps, then how can I run one? :D | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: third party apps issue is a bug in the compositor we're insisting on getting fixed | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: all the source for the email client etc is there, though | 11:34 |
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| Stskeeps | the headline is a bit sensationalist | 11:34 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: I agree | 11:35 |
| thiago | Venemo: install kontact mobile if you want an email client | 11:35 |
| lcuk | you wrote the sensationist part of it though Stskeeps | 11:35 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: okay, but what does this 3rd party app thing mean? | 11:35 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: is there no way in MeeGo to run 3rd party apps or what? | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | no.. | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | in fact, i just ran xterm earlier after killing mdecorator | 11:35 |
| lcuk | thiago, that would be fine except for the "no 3rd party apps" thing | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: it just means there's a bug in the compositor that non-MeegoTouch apps don't view properly | 11:35 |
| thiago | lcuk: oops | 11:36 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: aaah... well that's serious | 11:36 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: yes and someone didn't see the whole implication of not marking this bug srious | 11:36 |
| lcuk | not worried about lack of official apps or placeholders, its getting other apps running | 11:36 |
| lcuk | maemo has compatability for lots of frameworks | 11:36 |
| Stskeeps | hence the bug.. | 11:36 |
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| Stskeeps | give people time to answer, it was weekend :) | 11:37 |
| Stskeeps | it's a bug, not a policy | 11:37 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: so in fact I can run 3rd party apps, but the non-MeeGoTouch apps will look ugly? | 11:37 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: what about Gtk/Hildon? | 11:37 |
| TermanaDesire | Non-meegotouch apps wont show | 11:37 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: the problem is a bug in the compositor that needs to be fixed | 11:37 |
| Stskeeps | and ugly is only if they look ugly in general | 11:38 |
| TermanaDesire | ;p | 11:38 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: ahm, and what about the part that says that this is "not targeted for 1.1"? | 11:38 |
| lcuk | does meegotouch work on symbian? what do you write qt apps targetting symbian with? | 11:39 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: that's the part about someone not understanding the implications of a bug. | 11:39 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: it can be interpreted as 'no 3rd party apps in 1.1 at all' which is an insane interpretation as we might as well not publish a SDK then | 11:40 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: which isn't what it means | 11:40 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: the problem is that even qt apps are getting broken by this :) | 11:40 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: I get it, thanks for explaining :) | 11:40 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: I heard that people can now make phone calls with new MeeGo images on the N900 | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | and again, remember that 1) it's a platform 2) we're forced into a fixed release schedule 3) noone says things won't be fixed in 1.1 post-release 4) what's ready and quality by release gets in | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | and 5) you can base your own end-user system on top of it | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: yes | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: and no pesky eula | 11:41 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: that's good to hear | 11:42 |
| Venemo | hm | 11:42 |
| Venemo | in the end, are there homescreen widgets in MeeGo? | 11:43 |
| Stskeeps | i think there's support except we don't have any | 11:43 |
| Venemo | that's great news | 11:43 |
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| Venemo | and will the Nokia Qt SDK support MeeGo? | 11:43 |
| Venemo | I heard alterego had success with making a MeeGo sysroot for MADDE | 11:44 |
| Stskeeps | i bloody hope so :) | 11:44 |
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| Venemo | and... is there Maemo-like multiple homescreens? | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | dunno | 11:45 |
| sx0n | i believe so. | 11:46 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Sensationalist might get it the attention it deserves. | 11:47 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: I did try and make it clear that MeeGo 1.1 is not an end-user platform; but it was Sunday, and late, and I may have misworded it. | 11:47 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 11:49 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=832839&postcount=5 | 11:53 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: thanks! | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | in fact i think people should start organising | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:02 |
| Venemo | organising what? | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | end-user targetted meego-based distro on n900 | 12:03 |
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| Stskeeps | based on top of 1.1 | 12:03 |
| Jaffa | TBH, productising MeeGo as it is right now looks hard. MTF/Qt seems to have things which are scrollable which shouldn't be; massive gaps in the themeing etc. | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: agreed, 1.2 should be easier | 12:03 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, you mention the Nokia Meego, Suse Meego etc having all the mp3 codecs | 12:03 |
| * Jaffa 'd rather stick with M5 and maybe play with Harmattan HE | 12:03 | |
| lcuk | does the default netbook install include those things? | 12:04 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Nope | 12:04 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: no | 12:04 |
| lcuk | ahh | 12:05 |
| Venemo | mp3 is considered patent-encumbered, so the free software people don't like to include it in their projects | 12:06 |
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| Venemo | anyways, I think we could "borrow" some components from Maemo 5 | 12:07 |
| lcuk | s how do people play their music in meego at all, do they dualboot a regular media player ? :p | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: i wouldn't bother, just wait for 1.2 and ackport our DSP codecs | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | they're free to download, too, we just can't host them on meego.com | 12:07 |
| lcuk | our DSP codecs? | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | well, TI's | 12:08 |
| lcuk | from which distro? | 12:08 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: if 1.2 is released, what's the point of backporting stuff from 1.2 to 1.1? why don't we simply run 1.2 from then on? | 12:08 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo: mostly because there's a scary as hell phase to end-users called 'invasive changes' | 12:09 |
| lcuk | Venemo, LTS dictates that you maintain stable ABI and component surface against the 1.1 release | 12:09 |
| Venemo | LTS=? | 12:09 |
| lcuk | even with a newer 1.2 release | 12:09 |
| lcuk | not everyone is capable of moving | 12:10 |
| stephg | Do you mean LTS or LSB? | 12:11 |
| lcuk | Venemo, long term support, not directly a meegoism but it explains why you dont simply stop making a branch available | 12:11 |
| stephg | ah | 12:11 |
| Venemo | lcuk: I don't thing the community can do that. If we can keep up with the latest MeeGo releases, that in itself is a miracle | 12:12 |
| TermanaDesire | lcuk: I think 1.2 would make a better LTS target at the moment anyway | 12:12 |
| lcuk | sure | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: i think you're quite well equipped for it actually | 12:12 |
| lcuk | but based on what Stskeeps said about backporting | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: several people know how to build images from .ks'es, people have OBS experience.. | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | in fact, i think even lcuk could do it | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | ;p | 12:13 |
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| Venemo | well, I dunno | 12:13 |
| * lcuk is actually downloading: http://download3.meego.com/sep09/meego-handset-ia32-1.0.80.9.20100706.1-sdk-pre0901.raw.tar.bz2 | 12:13 | |
| lcuk | this very second :) | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | with the fact we don't have any pesky eulas anymore, the road should be open | 12:14 |
| Venemo | is there a list about what is missing from MeeGo 1.1 that is necessary for a good end user experience? | 12:14 |
| Venemo | e-mail client is one | 12:14 |
| lcuk | Venemo, short answer: quite a bit | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: we can start with power management. | 12:14 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: what about it? | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | device gets awfully hot and uses a lot of power :) | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | we plan to work on this in 1.2 | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | (same kernel version) | 12:14 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: so it depletes the battery too soon? | 12:15 |
| Stskeeps | right | 12:15 |
| Venemo | well, that means that I won't have MeeGo for another half year :) | 12:15 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: the point is that if people start working on it now and provides a 'community-minded' remix as 1.2 development goes on, we have something in short term, as well as an empowered community by 1.2 releases | 12:15 |
| lcuk | whats the netbook story turning out like, are qt apps happily running there | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | in practice it'd be about shuffling around packages and building images | 12:17 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: yeah, but if the "something in short term" is barely usable at best, what's the point? | 12:17 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: sorry for the rude question | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: you're right - and that's where the 1.2 bits come in | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | cos we are going to devote a lot of time to make things usable | 12:17 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: good news | 12:17 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: and when is 1.2 due to arrive? | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | in 6 monts | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | hs | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | with full open repositories from day one (already there now) | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | and weekly images | 12:18 |
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| lcuk | Venemo, supposing the widgets story needed improvement. as a developer you know how much of a building site things are | 12:21 |
| Venemo | lcuk, yes I do | 12:21 |
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| lcuk | you also know about whats needed for your app, how about you have a look at just what support there is now and what you believe you may need | 12:22 |
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| Venemo | lcuk, well, non-MeeGoTouch apps currently don't work at all. So that's the end of the story for my app right now | 12:23 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: yeah.. and that bug needs fixing :) | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | we can all agree on that | 12:24 |
| Venemo | the other thing is that I would be interested in is homescreen widgets. Noone seems to know about them. Is there a wiki page or something that can tell me how to create a homescreen widget for the MeeGo handset UX? | 12:24 |
| lcuk | yup | 12:24 |
| lcuk | Venemo, it might simply not be in place yet. | 12:25 |
| lcuk | since people have not been trying to run anything else or make their own apps | 12:25 |
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| Venemo | lcuk, well, Stskeeps said that the UX is capable of showing homescreen widgets, just they don't have any | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | i think it is, but i haven't looked closely | 12:26 |
| Venemo | so, is there anyone on this channel who knows something about this? | 12:27 |
| lcuk | we need a live meegocam | 12:27 |
| Venemo | meegocam? | 12:28 |
| lcuk | timelapse snapshots of whats being hacked on on meego as commits and merge requests are accepted | 12:28 |
| Venemo | mhm | 12:29 |
| Aard | about meegotouch, there's an update to .45 staged right now, which should fix lots of bugs present in the (completely outdated) meegotouch .25 released with 1.1 | 12:29 |
| Venemo | btw, what does MeeGo use for package management? rpm+yum? | 12:30 |
| Stskeeps | rpm+zypper | 12:30 |
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| Venemo | why not yum? | 12:30 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: python isn't the fastest on embedded devices and zypper is fast | 12:31 |
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| Venemo | heh, yum is written in python? | 12:32 |
| Venemo | lol, I didn't know | 12:32 |
| psycho_oreos | it is | 12:32 |
| Venemo | psycho_oreos: okay, then, it was the right decision | 12:32 |
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| psycho_oreos | Venemo, probably | 12:35 |
| Venemo | out of the images on http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/meego-codedrop.php which is the one that I can flash to the N900 with the flasher tool? | 12:37 |
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| Stskeeps | don't use those | 12:38 |
| Venemo | why not? | 12:38 |
| Stskeeps | and you need a microsd, and get it from repo.meego.com | 12:38 |
| Stskeeps | cos they're obsolete already :) | 12:38 |
| Venemo | no way I'm gonna install it to a microsd | 12:39 |
| Stskeeps | well, no other way atm | 12:39 |
| Stskeeps | we don't support NAND installs, system is too big and we don't want a /opt nightmare again | 12:39 |
| lcuk | hm Venemo whats up with microsd install? | 12:39 |
| Venemo | I'd like to flash it to the rootfs. with that, I could compare the speed of the System to Maemo | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: not possible, sorry - we exceeded the space 5 months back :) | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | the future is emmc installs or microsd | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | (NAND is only ~240mb worth of compressed space) | 12:41 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: this is just plain awful. | 12:41 |
| Stskeeps | also, we're doing this so people can continue using maemo without destroying it | 12:41 |
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| Venemo | well I prefer to use one OS at a time | 12:42 |
| Venemo | so the NAND is gonna be sitting there empty, and we will live with the thought that its speed could have been used for something useful, but it isn't. | 12:42 |
| Venemo | great! | 12:42 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: we plan to use it for swap | 12:42 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: good idea | 12:43 |
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| lcuk | Venemo, consider the current maemo install as a safe base camp :) | 12:43 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: it'll be faster than the current swap on the eMMC | 12:43 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: very good point actually | 12:43 |
| Venemo | lcuk, I don't like dual boot systems | 12:43 |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: so um | 12:43 |
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| timeless_mbp | someone poked me to look at mxr.meego.com /meego/ v. /repo.meego.com/ | 12:44 |
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| timeless_mbp | afaik there's no vcs for certain pieces of meego (e.g. the compiler), is that correct? | 12:44 |
| lcuk | timeless_mbp, I know docS in #maemo noticed some mxr problems | 12:44 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: there was a box change for mxr.maemo.org a while ago which resulted in glimpse not being binary compat w/ the new glibc | 12:44 |
| timeless_mbp | i fixed that yesterday | 12:45 |
| lcuk | oh cool beans! :D | 12:45 |
| timeless_mbp | and would people rather have certain "gaps" filled in, or is it ok to have things missing | 12:45 |
| * timeless_mbp takes a moment to kick git for being "odd" | 12:45 | |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: yes, it's upstream sources with minimal patches | 12:45 |
| lcuk | I think just do what you can normally and fill in as and when they are noticed? | 12:45 |
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| timeless_mbp | user: timeless <timeless@gmail.com> | 12:46 |
| timeless_mbp | date: Mon Oct 04 11:01:42 2010 +0900 | 12:46 |
| timeless_mbp | summary: Merge branch 'master' of git://gitorious.org/tracker/tracker | 12:46 |
| timeless_mbp | does git always do that? | 12:46 |
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| thiago | timeless_mbp: do you know anything about an issue on fennec with hardfp? | 12:50 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm | 12:50 |
| timeless_mbp | which compiler is this | 12:50 |
| thiago | gcc 4.4/4.5 | 12:50 |
| timeless_mbp | and keep in mind that i just got back from a month long vacation yesterday | 12:50 |
| thiago | just asking if you've heard of this | 12:51 |
| * timeless_mbp hopes people have blacklisted 4.5.0 | 12:51 | |
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| Stskeeps | thiago: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=600514 | 12:54 |
| Stskeeps | the crash in question isn't hardfp specific though, but note comments | 12:54 |
| cyberjames | Hi. Is mail logs located in /var/log/maillog ? | 12:55 |
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| bunk | Stskeeps: Is the known xulrunner 1.9.2 miscompile with cs2009q3 fixed in this tc? | 13:01 |
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| Stskeeps | bunk: you'll have to give me some more details than that :) | 13:03 |
| bunk | http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=45112 | 13:03 |
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| timeless_mbp | thiago: technically i read that bug this morning :o | 13:03 |
| timeless_mbp | thiago: the bug basically describes it as "we're doing something that isn't remotely supported but existing code and expecting miracles to happen" | 13:05 |
| timeless_mbp | = we're stupid | 13:05 |
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| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: i'll visit work sometime today and talk to people about splitting the bug into useful work items | 13:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | because there should be <xpcom: add support for hardfp arm abi>, <nanojit: add support for hardfp arm abi>, <jm: add support for hardfp arm abi> | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: right, the funny part is that the crash happens on meego softfp too.. | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: so i think it's not only hardfp :) | 13:07 |
| timeless_mbp | exactly the same crash? | 13:07 |
| ShadowJK | "softfp allows the generation of floating point instructions, but still uses the soft-float calling conventions." | 13:08 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: yes, same backtrace | 13:08 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: happened after our 0908 snapshot | 13:08 |
| Stskeeps | (gcc 4.5) | 13:08 |
| timeless_mbp | iirc it's possible to build w/o jit/jm | 13:09 |
| timeless_mbp | you could try that | 13:09 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 13:09 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 13:09 | |
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| Stskeeps | i spent a week diving into the crashes we had on startup in fennec and ended up with a solution that works | 13:09 |
| timeless_mbp | how do i move 10gb of photos from my eMMC to my mac? | 13:09 |
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| Stskeeps | i don't intend to spend another hour with fennec unless i'm ordered to :P | 13:10 |
| timeless_mbp | ah, that's better | 13:10 |
| timeless_mbp | (for some reason only the uSD card was exported the first time, now the eMMC is too) | 13:11 |
| ShadowJK | Stskeeps, so are you changing -mfloat-abi=softfp to -mfloat-abi=hard or something? | 13:11 |
| Stskeeps | ShadowJK: not in meego | 13:12 |
| Stskeeps | ShadowJK: at least that's not how it is atm | 13:12 |
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| ShadowJK | Stskeeps, which was is it now? | 13:13 |
| Stskeeps | softfp | 13:13 |
| ShadowJK | ok, and you're letting it remain that way, right? | 13:15 |
| ShadowJK | both short-term and long-term? | 13:15 |
| Stskeeps | well, i don't know what architecture will decide | 13:15 |
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| ShadowJK | So when you speak of hardfp vs floatfp, it's about -mfpu=? | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | float-abi | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | afaik | 13:16 |
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| bunk | -mfloat-abi= | 13:18 |
| ShadowJK | so have you recently changed this from -mfloat-abi=softfp to something else, or recently changed from something else? | 13:18 |
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| Stskeeps | none, flags have been static in meego | 13:19 |
| ShadowJK | I'm a bit confused because you talk as if you've got two versions, or are in the middle of a transition shaking out bugs from that | 13:20 |
| Stskeeps | ShadowJK: harmattan's hardfp, meego's not.. | 13:21 |
| ShadowJK | oh | 13:21 |
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| ShadowJK | ok, that's a bit wtf :) | 13:22 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, :P this will amuse you http://www.lolpix.com/pictures/4/Funny_Pictures_880.htm | 13:57 |
| lcuk | best come back to your blog post I have seen :D | 13:57 |
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| thiago | fabo: ping | 14:19 |
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| fabo | thiago: pong | 14:20 |
| thiago | fabo: mobility 1.1 packages, do we have them? | 14:20 |
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| fabo | thiago: we have Qt Mobility packages from master branch | 14:21 |
| fabo | thiago: we're skipping 1.1 | 14:21 |
| thiago | fabo: so you're on 1.2-pre ? | 14:21 |
| fabo | yes | 14:21 |
| thiago | how about meego 1.1, will that ship 1.0? | 14:21 |
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| fabo | MeeGo 1.1 ships QtMobility 1.0.2 | 14:21 |
| thiago | ok, thanks for the help | 14:22 |
| fabo | MeeGo 1.2 will ship QtMobility 1.2.x | 14:22 |
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| bunk | Stskeeps: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=600514#c19 | 14:55 |
| thiago | Stskeeps: that task is that the JIT doesn't understand the hardfp ABI | 14:56 |
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| bunk | thiago: I think you have two completely different problems here | 14:57 |
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| thiago | bunk: could be | 15:11 |
| thiago | but the JIT issue would affect webkit too | 15:11 |
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| dneary | troubalex, Ping? | 16:19 |
| troubalex | pong | 16:21 |
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| fabo | thiago: what's QMeeGoGraphicsSystemHelper? | 16:23 |
| thiago | internal stuff | 16:23 |
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| thiago | it's an internal library for controlling the meego graphics system | 16:23 |
| thiago | no SC or BC guarantees | 16:23 |
| thiago | it might disappear in future versions | 16:23 |
| fabo | ok | 16:23 |
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| vlj | err | 16:25 |
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| troubalex | dneary: my fault. another try. pong. | 16:49 |
| dneary | troubalex, I see you now :) | 16:49 |
| dneary | troubalex, I was indeed waiting for the notification, doing something else at same time | 16:49 |
| troubalex | dneary: I figured | 16:49 |
| troubalex | dneary: I have a case of the Mondays | 16:50 |
| troubalex | ;) | 16:50 |
| dneary | troubalex, I think andy80 (Andrea Grandi) might be around here somewhere too... | 16:50 |
| troubalex | coo | 16:50 |
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| troubalex | +l | 16:50 |
| dneary | troubalex, Seems not... never mind. | 16:50 |
| leinir | No... No man, no. I believe you'd get your ass kicked saying somethin' like that, man. ;) | 16:51 |
| dneary | troubalex, So - for the early bird events, you think you can help out? | 16:51 |
| troubalex | dneary: it depends. | 16:51 |
| troubalex | dneary: I am trying to figure out what you're actually thinking :) | 16:52 |
| dneary | OK | 16:52 |
| dneary | Let me help with that | 16:52 |
| troubalex | I suggest pestering Till/Mirko for the introduction | 16:52 |
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| dneary | Yeah, my thoughts too | 16:53 |
| troubalex | they basically pull that out of their drawers... | 16:53 |
| troubalex | hands-on might be more something we could do | 16:53 |
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| dneary | so basically, for people arriving in Dublin earlier (Saturday or Sunday) we thoughht it would be nice to have some geeky type stuff over the weekend in the hotel | 16:53 |
| dneary | So we asked whether there might be some room and we're sorting that out now | 16:54 |
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| dneary | We're looking for 2 rooms for 20-30 people with power & network in the hotel | 16:54 |
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| * troubalex nods | 16:54 | |
| pexi_ | gets quite crowded in those rooms | 16:54 |
| dneary | One room will be existing developers looking for help with problems, meeting up with experts in the domain (what we're calling workshops or hands-on sessions) | 16:54 |
| troubalex | ah! | 16:55 |
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| troubalex | okay, now it makes more sense | 16:55 |
| troubalex | which domains are you looking at? | 16:55 |
| dneary | One room more traditional tutorial/training sessions, with a trainer, giving an overview of some aspect of meego development, helping people to get startedd | 16:55 |
| troubalex | mm | 16:55 |
| dneary | Right now, I'm thinking Qt, MeeGo SDK, and Linux developer tools | 16:56 |
| dneary | (seem like the biggest areas where we can help people get a foot-hold) | 16:56 |
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| dneary | At the end of those 3 sessions, you will be (more) comfortable with git, gdb, valgrind, and have a meego sdk up & running on your laptop, and be able to get a simple sample Qt app up & running in it | 16:57 |
| dneary | (if you go to one, but not the others, then they should still be useful) | 16:57 |
| jani | im trying to get dublin already on the weekend too. | 16:57 |
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| dneary | jani, Cool | 16:57 |
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| dneary | troubalex, I'm also organising a bridge building contest :) | 16:58 |
| dneary | And we'll be having a geocache too | 16:58 |
| troubalex | dneary: okay, I'm with you. that is for the training sessions or the hands-on ones? | 16:59 |
| troubalex | bridge building contest??? | 16:59 |
| dneary | troubalex, Yeah | 16:59 |
| dneary | Out of lollipop sticks | 16:59 |
| troubalex | lol | 16:59 |
| alexbodn | hello friends, | 16:59 |
| alexbodn | could any android device be run by meego? | 16:59 |
| dneary | Chill-out practical stuff to finish the day :) | 16:59 |
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| dneary | alexbodn, I'm aware of a project to get MeeGo handset working on a Nexus One, but I have no idea how far along it is (and I would not try it on my phone!) | 17:00 |
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| troubalex | dneary: I was very amused about the "fun-run" | 17:01 |
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| alexbodn | dneary: are your doubts based on some closed source drivers used by android? | 17:01 |
| dneary | troubalex, That's because Dirk likes to go for a jog in the morning, and this way it gets on the agenda :) | 17:01 |
| Termana | alexbodn, status for all the ports available to Android based phones are basically here: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/MSMQSD | 17:02 |
| troubalex | dneary: how can it be fun to run 5k in the middle of the night? | 17:02 |
| troubalex | any how | 17:02 |
| troubalex | dneary: hands-on session Qt. | 17:02 |
| dneary | alexbodn, You might be interested in Aaron Williamson's project to have a completely free android-based OS for the Google G1. He's nearly there (but yes, some hardware has proprietary drivers) | 17:02 |
| dneary | troubalex, I'm going to go for a jog :) | 17:02 |
| dneary | troubalex, That's the only time to do it, when you're at a conference | 17:02 |
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| troubalex | dneary: exactly why I don't :-P | 17:03 |
| alexbodn | dneary, i understand, thanks. i'll follow the link to know more :) | 17:03 |
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| troubalex | dneary: hands-on sessions? | 17:05 |
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| dneary | troubalex, The hands-on sessions are more like "meet the exdpert" | 17:05 |
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| troubalex | dneary: exactly. | 17:06 |
| troubalex | dneary: any candidates you have in mind? | 17:06 |
| dneary | troubalex, Sessions we have in mind are: porting to MeeGo, Hands-on Qt, hackathon | 17:07 |
| dneary | troubalex, These sessions are still in early days - for the tutorials we're a bit further along. | 17:07 |
| troubalex | dneary: okay, I think I know someone who could do hands-on Qt on Sunday afternoon | 17:07 |
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| dneary | We also want a UX workshop - have UX designers appraise & work on a design for existing developers | 17:07 |
| dneary | troubalex, We're still working out the timetable (so far, a lot of people would like to do something on Sunday afternoon, not so many of Saturday afternoon ;) ) | 17:08 |
| troubalex | hehe | 17:08 |
| troubalex | dneary: you can try to charm Thiago into booking an earlier flight ;) | 17:09 |
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| troubalex | dneary: otherwise we can try to find some KDE peeps for example | 17:09 |
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| dneary | For many of the sessions, there's a decent chance that we'll be seeing community developers be "the experts" - esp. around getting started on ARM and similar. | 17:16 |
| dneary | developer tools will be a community session too. | 17:16 |
| troubalex | I guessed so. | 17:16 |
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| troubalex | dneary: just keep me in the loop as you go along and we can figure something out. | 17:24 |
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| dneary | troubalex, OK, will do | 17:25 |
| troubalex | dneary: I'll introduce you to someone, maybe that helps. | 17:25 |
| dneary | troubalex, I'll pencil Thiago in to help out with the hands-on Qt session | 17:25 |
| troubalex | dneary: he's got tons on his plate. just keep that in the back of your head | 17:25 |
| dneary | troubalex, I'll let him know you volunteered him & said he should take a flight on Saturday :) | 17:25 |
| troubalex | hehe | 17:26 |
| dneary | troubalex, It really was not nice of you to do that without asking him first ;) | 17:26 |
| troubalex | dneary: I did ask him :-P | 17:27 |
| dneary | ah | 17:27 |
| * troubalex grew up in a furnished home | 17:27 | |
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| qgil | Hi there, does this link work for you? http://meegozone.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/MeeGo-Openness-White-Paper.pdf | 17:34 |
| * Stskeeps looks | 17:35 | |
| fiferboy | Does anyone know if sponsorship for the conference is still on schedule as listed on http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_Conference_2010#Time_line | 17:36 |
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| Stskeeps | qgil: works for me | 17:36 |
| Termana | qgil, doesn't work for me | 17:36 |
| qgil | it seems to be quantic link :) | 17:36 |
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| qgil | I find people that make it work, some other don't. I only get "Page Not Found" | 17:38 |
| qgil | can some other people try? To see the frequence of the problem | 17:38 |
| qgil | Stskeeps Termana what browser OS are you using? | 17:38 |
| fiferboy | qgil: Page Not Found | 17:38 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: ubuntu, firefox 3.6.6 | 17:39 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps: and can you download the pdf? | 17:39 |
| Termana | qgil, I'm using Chrome 5.0.375.70 in Ubuntu 10.04 | 17:39 |
| fiferboy | qgil: ubuntu, Chrome dev version | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: yes | 17:39 |
| qgil | ok, Fireforx downloads, Chrome doesn't since I'm using the one in MeeGo :) | 17:39 |
| qgil | pattenr found - thanks! | 17:40 |
| ayanes | still open the possibility to teach some long session at early bird event? | 17:40 |
| Termana | qgil, no | 17:40 |
| Termana | qgil, I just tried in Firefox 3.6.3 - it still won't download | 17:40 |
| qgil | fiferboy: we are quiteon schedule deciding about sponsorship requests BUT Angela from The Linux Foundation was busy with LinuxCon Japan last week and didn't send any emails. Today, hopefully. | 17:41 |
| qgil | Thanks Termana - that is even more weird | 17:41 |
| fiferboy | qgil: Thanks! I know I can't be the only one anxious to hear :) | 17:41 |
| qgil | anyway, I'll let know the meegozone people - Stskeeps do you mind uploading the pdf somewhere at wiki.meego.com ? I got Intel¡'s permission | 17:42 |
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| qgil | ayanes: Andrea and Thomas Perl are coordinating the Early Birds | 17:43 |
| ayanes | ok | 17:43 |
| ayanes | thanks | 17:43 |
| * thiago heard of the early bird today | 17:43 | |
| thiago | probably should take that into account when reserving flights | 17:44 |
| qgil | thiago: did you read the email we sent to all the conference participants (or even all the meego.com users) last week | 17:44 |
| qgil | thiago: i'LL TRY TO LAND ON sATURDAY MORNING | 17:44 |
| qgil | oops | 17:44 |
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| ayanes | thp are you around ? | 17:45 |
| thiago | qgil: I don't remember reading it | 17:46 |
| thiago | the "status update" ? | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: http://wiki.meego.com/File:MeeGo-Openness-White-Paper.pdf | 17:47 |
| * thiago sees it now | 17:47 | |
| qgil | thiago: this was the content http://conference2010.meego.com/news/meego-conference-status-update | 17:47 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps: thanks a lot! | 17:47 |
| thiago | I haven't reserved hotel either | 17:47 |
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| * Chani notes that there are 10 euro hostel beds available - oh! I haven't booked yet either... | 17:50 | |
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| thp | ayanes: yes, around | 18:07 |
| ayanes | I checked the wiki about the early bird event | 18:08 |
| ayanes | do you have someone for the Qt workshop? | 18:08 |
| thiago | for hosting it? | 18:08 |
| thp | i don't think we have. achipa said in the thread that FN is available for doing Qt-ish sessions | 18:09 |
| thiago | Qt and KDAB are also available | 18:09 |
| ayanes | the think is the material that we have is for 2 hours 30 minutes ~ | 18:09 |
| ayanes | and we got 40 minutes.. | 18:09 |
| ayanes | so maybe we can teach also in the weekend | 18:09 |
| ayanes | (for libmeegotouch) | 18:09 |
| thiago | we can't help with that (Qt or KDAB) | 18:10 |
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| thp | ayanes: can you add information about your sessions + contact info to http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_Conference_2010/Early_Bird_Events ("Ideas for the program")? | 18:11 |
| ayanes | sure | 18:11 |
| thp | in "Session ideas". if you add some background about yourself and contact info (i.e. user profile link) that will help later on | 18:12 |
| ayanes | ok | 18:13 |
| thp | thanks :) | 18:13 |
| ayanes | np | 18:14 |
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| ayanes | thp done | 18:27 |
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| jbocklage | I'd really like to hear/talk/work something about/with Buteo on Sunday (early bird)... Can I suggest this on the wiki page? | 18:40 |
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| sivang | who's the person to talk to about the conference sponsorship ? | 19:04 |
| qgil | sivang: hi :) | 19:04 |
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| qgil | sivang: what do you need to know? | 19:05 |
| sivang | qgil: see PM | 19:06 |
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| qgil | hi, to everybody contacting me about sponsorship: we haven't send any emails yet - hopefullt this week (even today/tomorrow) we will start sending them | 19:22 |
| qgil | http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_Conference_2010#Sponsored_participants contains all the info | 19:22 |
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| Stskeeps | qgil: how bad marketing wise is it if Qt applications simply don't work on MeeGo 1.1 Handset? | 19:25 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps: what I'm expected to answer you :) | 19:25 |
| Stskeeps | i don't know :P i'm troubled by http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7881 which really makes everyone involved look like idiots, which is hard for me | 19:26 |
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| wmarone | uhwow | 19:28 |
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| wmarone | yeah, there's some broken lines of communication going on here if something that critical is rejected as a blocker... | 19:30 |
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| amjad | agreed | 19:30 |
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| wmarone | I wonder if this a non-issue on the Aava handset, which might give the Intel team a skewed perspective...? | 19:32 |
| Stskeeps | it happens even on handset SDK | 19:32 |
| Stskeeps | to my knowledge | 19:32 |
| wmarone | yikes | 19:33 |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: it's not isolated to middleware/kernel/qt level? such a bug surely should be experienced on netbook or othe rplatforms as well? | 19:34 |
| * sivang still reads the bug report | 19:34 | |
| Stskeeps | sivang: it's isolated to the mcompositor implementation and simple to do something about | 19:34 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps: is yours a bug against http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2959 (that appears as FIXED) ? | 19:35 |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: what's holding you from fixing it then? | 19:36 |
| berndhs | Stskeeps: I don't follow the "too risky" judgement in the rejection, it seems that basically all of the Qt development on the UX target is broken, so what further risk is there? | 19:36 |
| Stskeeps | sivang: there seems to be a weird statement that it's not a release blocker | 19:36 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: yes, i guess that's the feature area | 19:36 |
| qgil | Stskeeps: http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=3943 isn't this just a dupe (or yours is a dupe of that one) | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: it's same cause, yes, rejected for 'we have no third party apps targeted for 1.1 ' | 19:38 |
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| wmarone | someone needs to be hounded for using that as an excuse to not block 1.1 | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: in practice it means that our developer story breaks down. i can't sit down with qt creator and make an app that will run in a meego 1.1 handset ux | 19:40 |
| qgil | i see | 19:41 |
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| qgil | commenting on these bugs... | 19:41 |
| berndhs | Stskeeps: with this bug, why would any 3rd party target 1.1 ? | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | unless i use MTF, which is actually against what is recommended to do | 19:41 |
| wmarone | berndhs: precisely, no one would even bother with exploratory development | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | berndhs: the APIs are what matters | 19:42 |
| berndhs | Stskeeps: right, so it looks like apps based on the regular Qt API can't be verified on the UX | 19:43 |
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| sivang | and MTF is okay to go? | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | i wouldn't be this passionate about if it wasn't for the fact i believe that not fixing it is a really bad mistake to make for an up-and-coming platform :/ | 19:44 |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: this of all the people who would like to try this demo on it.. | 19:46 |
| sivang | where opengl is hot subject and we're getting asked about it daily | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | it's all qt demos | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:47 |
| sivang | s/opengl/qtgl/ | 19:47 |
| infobot | sivang meant: where qtgl is hot subject and we're getting asked about it daily | 19:47 |
| sivang | ;) | 19:47 |
| * sivang looks to vote | 19:47 | |
| * Stskeeps has some soup | 19:48 | |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: what's the packaging aspects to this? or should I read on? :p | 19:52 |
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| Stskeeps | hmm? | 19:53 |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: "Simple packaging tutorial does not work with Handset UX." | 19:53 |
| sivang | Stskeeps: is this related to the compositor? | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | sivang: yes, because it concerns the archetype meego app, a Qt app | 19:54 |
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| Chani | Stskeeps: wow. >.< | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: thanks | 19:56 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps: and http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2959#c4 | 20:02 |
| GAN900 | qgil, out of interest, are we still on schedule on the queue listed on the wiki page? | 20:02 |
| qgil | GAN900: which queue / wiki page? (I have some to queues to choose from) :) | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: :nod: cc'ing myself on the feature | 20:02 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Looks like 7881 is going the same way as the others. | 20:04 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Who is Hilary? | 20:04 |
| GAN900 | qgil, the one on the page you linked earlier for the notification schedule. | 20:04 |
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| qgil | GAN900: we are on schedule when it comes to internal voting, but the first wave of email notifications didn't go out last week because Angela was bsuy at LinuxCon Japan - they should be sent today/tomorrow, and more byt the end of the week | 20:06 |
| qgil | I hope to have only corner cases left by next week, depending on budget available etc | 20:06 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: let's see where this bug report goes - i'm not entirely sure of Hillary's exact role. | 20:07 |
| Stskeeps | (not listed on governance) | 20:07 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Are you sure it's "Hillary", nick is "hirally" but no name listed on http://meego.com/users/hirally | 20:08 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: er, Hirally.. it's one of those names I have difficulties spelling right | 20:08 |
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| Stskeeps | oh, and i typoed in my response | 20:09 |
| * Stskeeps sighs | 20:09 | |
| felipec | qgil: ooo, I don't recall seen you in IRC :) Hi | 20:09 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Could've been Hillary Rally \male), Hilary Smith (girl) who married a Mr. Rally, or s Hill?ary who likes rallying ;-) | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | don't confuse me | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:10 |
| Jaffa | regex fell down with N900-typos. | 20:11 |
| qgil | felipec: I remember seeing you many times :O) | 20:11 |
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| sivang | Stskeeps: http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7881#c13 | 20:12 |
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| felipec | qgil: what do you think about getting DSP acceleration for Theora? How useful do you think it would be to MeeGo in a scale from 1 to 10? | 20:16 |
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| sivang | Jaffa: hehe | 20:16 |
| * felipec is thinking on ways to convince his managers to work on this | 20:16 | |
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| Stskeeps | felipec: you intend on doing it with dsp or their current impl? | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | right, BMC#7881 is getting reevaluated - i hope it will come with a good outcome | 20:17 |
| sivang | yay! | 20:17 |
| awayfar | NishanthMenon: hey man, is there a kernel repo I can use for Blaze and/or pandaboard? | 20:17 |
| felipec | Stskeeps: well, I'm thinking on porting Leonora to gst-dsp... shouldn't be that hard | 20:17 |
| sivang | Stskeeps: I'd hate to add it to next year's "learning from mistakes of the past and beyond" ;) | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | felipec: :nod: that'd be cool | 20:18 |
| felipec | yeap... but there's so much to do... I just found that dspbridge is broken on mainline, probably omapfb too | 20:19 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, what I find shocking is how come nobody has even tried to install a qt application | 20:19 |
| lcuk | until yesterday | 20:19 |
| sivang | lcuk: yep, this is quite alarming | 20:19 |
| lcuk | how did all the packaging documentation etc get run through | 20:19 |
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| NishanthMenon | awayfar, try the devel:kernel | 20:20 |
| * sivang is off with the hope the good lords of release blockage will show mercy. | 20:20 | |
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| NishanthMenon | awayfar, we still have to create a package for pandaboard | 20:20 |
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| lcuk | sivang, I am not sure what good it will do | 20:20 |
| NishanthMenon | not there yet.. yogeshd had issues with offline builds.. i think i resolved it today.. gotta check | 20:20 |
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| NishanthMenon | awayfar, posted my patches to meego-dev and meego-packaging.. /me should have send it to meego-kernel | 20:21 |
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| sivang | lcuk: let's see, this cannot be left like this | 20:22 |
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| Stskeeps | NishanthMenon: while you're at it, could you ask that the dev kernel is published automatically to gitorious? | 20:22 |
| awayfar | NishanthMenon, I'll check it out, thanks. May ping you later for more info | 20:22 |
| wmarone | woo, pandaboard | 20:22 |
| NishanthMenon | Stskeeps, i did not know there was a git tree for it | 20:22 |
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| lcuk | thp, you were able to run gtk application without this problem ( bug#7881 ) werent you? | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | NishanthMenon: sec | 20:22 |
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| lcuk | or is this a *regression* | 20:22 |
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| Stskeeps | NishanthMenon: well, packaging repo, not a full kernel tree | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | NishanthMenon: http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-os-base/kernel-source | 20:23 |
| * NishanthMenon looks | 20:23 | |
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| NishanthMenon | Stskeeps, thx.. gotta look.. /me looks better after food in tummy ;) | 20:24 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, do we have a testing team? | 20:25 |
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| Stskeeps | lcuk: yes indeed we do :) | 20:25 |
| Stskeeps | the QA heroes | 20:25 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: admittedly 'install a qt app' is not in their testcases and maybe it should have been | 20:25 |
| lcuk | well you can only build testcases once you know to look for them | 20:26 |
| qgil | felipec: you are asking the wrong guy ;) | 20:26 |
| qgil | Stskeeps: in fact there is not a feature/requirement defined for running a simple Qt app in Handset UX (same applies for other UXs) and this is what is missing in the first place | 20:27 |
| Stskeeps | yeah.. i hope requirements work is better in 1.2 | 20:27 |
| qgil | lucky us it is obvious in the meego.com context,, even if there is no bugzilla report created :) | 20:27 |
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| Stskeeps | it came up quite late in the 1.1 process, but was glad to see it | 20:28 |
| sNiff3ls | hi everybody, can you tell me how i add software sources in meego (ivi) to install qt 4.7.0 or have i to compile it from the sources? (if i have to compile it by myself i need to know how to add software source for dev packages) | 20:29 |
| thp | luck: which bug tracker does bug#7881 refer to? | 20:29 |
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| Stskeeps | thp: bugs.meego.com | 20:30 |
| lcuk | thp bugs.meego.com | 20:30 |
| lcuk | qgil, was that your first visit to that market (you tweeted you met an old friend there) - theres no real big farming markets near us | 20:30 |
| thp | yes, but let me re-check with the latest build | 20:31 |
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| lcuk | cool thanks thp | 20:31 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, shall find out if its a regression (which may swing any discussions) | 20:32 |
| thp | booting into 1.1.80.0.20101001.1 - could take a while :) | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: shouldn't :) | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | er | 20:32 |
| lcuk | breaking something that used to work is different to not knowing it it was broke all along ;) | 20:32 |
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| qgil | lcuk: I go to http://cafarmersmkts.com/mtnview.html every other week or so - it's very good! (although sometimes expensive) | 20:34 |
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| thp | lcuk, Stskeeps: no yum in 1.1.80.0.20101001.1 for n900? | 20:35 |
| Stskeeps | thp: all zypper now | 20:35 |
| Stskeeps | thp: brave to be on 1.2 branch already :) | 20:35 |
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| lcuk | qgil, the expense cannot be helped as with most things, whats the strangest fruit you have dared to try from there? | 20:38 |
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| * lcuk grabs bunches of vine tomatoes when I see them | 20:38 | |
| qgil | yesterday I got a bunch of purple http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohlrabi | 20:39 |
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| thp | lcuk: ok, so the (fullscreen) main window is white, while dialog windows are visible (without window border), and Ctrl+BkSpc makes the main window contents visible in the switcher | 20:43 |
| thp | and dialog windows do have their content visible (i.e. you can see and read what's in them) | 20:43 |
| lcuk | ok thp, so theres obviously something odd going on with native qt applications | 20:44 |
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| lcuk | dare we say... gtk 1 : qt 0 :p and I wonder how much that information would change the importance of the bug | 20:45 |
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| thp | lcuk: i believe it has something to do with mdecorator | 20:45 |
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| lcuk | yeah, thanks for the retest though, I was sure *something* was able to run | 20:46 |
| thp | lcuk: try starting it with "mdecorator -remote-theme &" and kill the old one (it has '-software' in its command line) | 20:46 |
| thp | if i do that, the main window has its contents shown | 20:46 |
| lcuk | thp, it was just based on the bug report and remembering you had run a self build application | 20:47 |
| sNiff3ls | is there any repo where i can find qt 4.7? | 20:47 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, does that snippet of info help any? ie can the startup parameter for mdecorator be altered without the code change | 20:48 |
| lcuk | ie without a serious retest | 20:48 |
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| lcuk | qgil, those kohlrabi's look awesome, like pumpkins with arms! what are you going to make with them? | 20:48 |
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| qgil | you peel them and you eat them raw. delicious! | 20:49 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: killing the mcdecorator in general helps | 20:49 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, but if its started up by default using alternative parameters, then its not going to break stuff? | 20:50 |
| thp | Stskeeps: why is MeeGo Handset UX still so slow on the N900? driver missing or something? | 20:50 |
| Stskeeps | thp: bored and got 20 minutes to spare? | 20:50 |
| lcuk | thp, being looked at and people are being flogged as we speak | 20:51 |
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| sp3000 | "paint faster!" | 20:51 |
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| thp | Stskeeps: not bored per se, but happy to try something out. | 20:51 |
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| Venemo | will MeeGo's package manager have DeltaRPM support? | 20:56 |
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| TuxBrother | hello | 22:07 |
| TuxBrother | is there any good guide for setting up Meego 1 (with UI?) on the N900? | 22:07 |
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| GAN900 | TuxBrother, somewhere on the wiki. | 22:13 |
| GAN900 | emmc meego n900 likely being effective Google keywords. | 22:13 |
| GAN900 | TuxBrother, it's not particularly functional, though. | 22:14 |
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| Jaffa | thp's gone quiet. Stskeeps' experiments have blown his N900, and him, up. | 22:17 |
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| naknomik | I am trying to debug connections issues on a corporate network, how do I run wpa_supplicant with debug output? | 22:17 |
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| thp | Jaffa: no, just fascinated about the speed of the meego desktop on my n900 now :p | 22:20 |
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| thp | now i just need a way to compile sources against the version of mtf shipped in the image | 22:21 |
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| thp | turns out everything is available on-device and installable via zypper ;) | 22:29 |
| Stskeeps | except the fs isn't very big | 22:30 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:30 |
| * stephg is moving to his laptop | 22:30 | |
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| thp | and btrfs-endio-0 is constantly using lots of CPU.. i wonder if putting out an ext3 image would make things much more faster | 22:32 |
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| Jaffa | thp: did they make that much difference? | 22:32 |
| Jaffa | thp: share the kernel? | 22:32 |
| Stskeeps | thp: on the contrary | 22:33 |
| thp | Jaffa: Stskeeps has the link + updated packages. | 22:33 |
| Stskeeps | thp: ext3 is horrible for it cos of sample media and stuff like that being copied | 22:33 |
| Stskeeps | thp: the I/O usage may be other problems | 22:34 |
| Jaffa | +1 for auke's suggestion | 22:34 |
| Stskeeps | the sample media one? | 22:34 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:34 |
| Jaffa | thp: I thought it involved extracting something... | 22:34 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: yeah | 22:34 |
| Stskeeps | it's still a problem at firststartup even at smaller sizes | 22:35 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:35 |
| Stskeeps | thp: i pretty much plan to see why on earth our I/O is so horrible on n900 | 22:35 |
| Stskeeps | it's worse than i would expect it to be, and I've run Mer off a 770 | 22:35 |
| thp | Stskeeps: have you tried ext3 already? | 22:36 |
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| Stskeeps | thp: yes, that was how our previous images were | 22:36 |
| Stskeeps | when we switched to btrfs performance actually improved a lot | 22:36 |
| thp | could the microsd be the bottleneck? | 22:37 |
| Stskeeps | it's one, but there's a performance issue for sure as test cases return worse results than on fremantle | 22:37 |
| Stskeeps | plan to be looking closely at it for 1.2 | 22:40 |
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| auke | I've been looking at faster uSD cards... apparently there's class-10 4gb ones around that are twice as fast as the normal ones we have | 22:46 |
| CosmoHill | cool | 22:46 |
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| CosmoHill | what brand? | 22:46 |
| auke | kingmax | 22:47 |
| auke | never heard of em before | 22:47 |
| stephg | bet they get hot. Without the power management my desk will melt | 22:47 |
| CosmoHill | auke: you could always email Phornex and ask them to to tests :) | 22:47 |
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| auke | heh | 22:48 |
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| auke | any comments on the splitting of the sample-media package? | 22:50 |
| stephg | do it | 22:50 |
| stephg | please | 22:50 |
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| stephg | if you're testing the different repos and not on the worlds fastest internet connection it's a pain | 22:51 |
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| thp | cool - i got my mtf test app compiled on the n900. took very long, but it works now :) | 22:55 |
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| TuxBrother | I have flashed Meego to my MicroSD | 22:55 |
| TuxBrother | installed the kernel | 22:55 |
| TuxBrother | now - how to boot? | 22:56 |
| stephg | TuxBrother: flasher | 22:56 |
| TuxBrother | I need the flasher to boot? | 22:56 |
| stephg | yeah | 22:57 |
| stephg | \/path/to/flasher-3.5 -b -l -k /path/to/kernel | 22:57 |
| CosmoHill | stephg: you can start a line on irc with a slash by using another flash | 22:57 |
| CosmoHill | i.e. you type two slashes instead of one to start off | 22:58 |
| * stephg is new irc, thanks | 22:58 | |
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| TuxBrother | I have bootmenu installed | 23:04 |
| TuxBrother | and added the menu item | 23:04 |
| TuxBrother | now it keeps saying booting meego | 23:04 |
| TuxBrother | and then it powers off | 23:04 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, don't use that one | 23:04 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:04 |
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| TuxBrother | got it | 23:07 |
| TuxBrother | now it is a screen with unreadable text | 23:07 |
| Stskeeps | better | 23:07 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:07 |
| TuxBrother | only I can see it hangs | 23:07 |
| Stskeeps | is your back cover on? | 23:07 |
| TuxBrother | yes | 23:07 |
| Stskeeps | how did you dd it to th emicrosd? | 23:08 |
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| TuxBrother | bzcat <raw_image>.bz2 | pv | sudo dd bs=4096 of=/dev/sdX | 23:08 |
| Stskeeps | well, you have me beat | 23:09 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:09 |
| TuxBrother | why? | 23:09 |
| Stskeeps | did you check nothing was mounted from sdX before? | 23:09 |
| auke | pv? | 23:09 |
| Stskeeps | auke: progress indicator for pipes | 23:09 |
| auke | interesting | 23:09 |
| TuxBrother | nothing was mounted before | 23:09 |
| * thiago_home doesn't have pv | 23:09 | |
| thiago_home | found it in a package called "pv" | 23:10 |
| * auke makes his distro install it | 23:10 | |
| TuxBrother | now | 23:11 |
| TuxBrother | how can I get it to boot? | 23:11 |
| TuxBrother | the kernel hangs | 23:11 |
| Stskeeps | TuxBrother: what message does it say? | 23:11 |
| CosmoHill | auke: a custom distro? | 23:11 |
| TuxBrother | mtdoops: ready 4, 9 (no erase) | 23:12 |
| TuxBrother | that's all I can read | 23:12 |
| auke | CosmoHill: sorta, yes :) | 23:12 |
| Stskeeps | TuxBrother: anything above that? | 23:12 |
| CosmoHill | auke: same here :) | 23:12 |
| auke | Downloading source file pv-1.1.4.tar.bz2 for module pv... | 23:12 |
| TuxBrother | please append a correct root boot option or so | 23:13 |
| * thiago_home benchmarks pv /dev/zero > /dev/null | 23:13 | |
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| slavik | hi all | 23:16 |
| auke | thiago_home: how much you getting? :) | 23:16 |
| thiago_home | 3.48 GB/s | 23:16 |
| auke | 15.5GB/s | 23:16 |
| Stskeeps | TuxBrother: ah, flasher -l -k /apth/to/kernel -b | 23:17 |
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| auke | of course, I should try on a handset prototype instead :) | 23:17 |
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| * thiago_home left his proto off at the office | 23:17 | |
| thiago_home | otherwise I could just ssh in | 23:17 |
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| thiago_home | the workstation is on, though | 23:19 |
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| auke | hmmm my t400 meego laptop only gets 3.1GB/s | 23:19 |
| thiago_home | 13 GB/s on the Core-i7 workstation | 23:19 |
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| * TuxBrother has got its MeeGo to boot | 23:22 | |
| Stskeeps | congrats | 23:23 |
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| TuxBrother | I must go | 23:23 |
| TuxBrother | ttyl | 23:23 |
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| Stskeeps | evening wazd | 23:24 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: heya :) | 23:24 |
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| Stskeeps | how's the visa nightmares going? | 23:26 |
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| naknomik | Where is wpa_supplicant invoked from in MeeGo, I need to run it with debug on and see the debug output. | 23:30 |
| Stskeeps | dbus activation | 23:31 |
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| thiago_home | or connman, isn't it? | 23:35 |
| Stskeeps | connman activates wpa_supplicant through dbus activation :) | 23:35 |
| Stskeeps | i learnt this the hard way | 23:35 |
| thiago_home | if it's dbus activation, then you can start it manually | 23:36 |
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| thiago_home | provided it registers in dbus | 23:36 |
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