| pupnik | meego does not use a windows filesystem, correct spide | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| spide | well atleast ubuntu image is in fat16/32 :) | 00:05 |
| spide | or is it unetbootin magic there. | 00:05 |
| johnx | yeah, lots of different ways to do a live boot | 00:06 |
| johnx | ubuntu uses a live-cd style even when booting from usb | 00:06 |
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| pupnik | ubuntu is trying very hard to piss me off, every month | 00:07 |
| johnx | they do it just for you | 00:08 |
| johnx | they all have meetings on IRC and talk about the next milestone for pissing off pupnik | 00:08 |
| pupnik | i knew it | 00:11 |
| johnx | so I'll bite. how did they piss you off this month? | 00:12 |
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| pupnik | < spide> well atleast ubuntu image is in fat16/32 : | 00:12 |
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| johnx | really? it's been like that for years | 00:12 |
| johnx | also: you must get pissed off pretty easily | 00:13 |
| pupnik | why use that filesystem for a bootable linux OS image | 00:14 |
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| johnx | because they do the bootable thing by just copying the iso into place and mounting it loopback | 00:14 |
| johnx | or rather they copy the contents of the iso | 00:14 |
| pupnik | oh oh nm then | 00:15 |
| pupnik | i misunderstood | 00:15 |
| johnx | that's the cause of a lot of ubuntu hate :) | 00:15 |
| odin_ | its all about, accessibility by windows users to Linux and trying to convert them to suck their blood | 00:15 |
| johnx | granted, there are things to hate about it :) | 00:15 |
| johnx | because canonical is staffed by the undead | 00:15 |
| johnx | their thirst for blood and their hunger for brains is insatiable | 00:16 |
| pupnik | that is so they can put thdeir readme on the usb/cdrom readble by winusers | 00:16 |
| odin_ | and not have their windows users bitch and complain that the USB key can't be used to put other stuff on at the same time | 00:17 |
| pupnik | i thought the livecd actually used some bastard vfat with metadata | 00:17 |
| pupnik | when i saw that comment | 00:17 |
| odin_ | how long you'd think it would last not in FAT and only usable by linux, its just a survival mechanism | 00:18 |
| odin_ | the longer it stays on the USB disk, the more chance the user might look at it | 00:19 |
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| pupnik | well said | 00:22 |
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| freddo | i resolved my problem with bootloader . Meego does not install bootloader . Try install other any distribution (archlinux for me) ... reboot and install meego with all erase partition. Meego use Grub MBR . | 01:43 |
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| CosmoHill | anyone know of a scsi to usb converter? | 02:07 |
| johnx | google seems to know of some. no idea how well they work | 02:08 |
| johnx | I dumped my SCSI stuff years ago | 02:08 |
| CosmoHill | i have some scsi hard drives | 02:09 |
| johnx | want some IDE hard drives? I have spares :) | 02:09 |
| CosmoHill | maybe... | 02:10 |
| johnx | shipping probably wouldn't be worth it sadly | 02:10 |
| CosmoHill | someone has a bundle of processors somewhere in his home | 02:14 |
| CosmoHill | i think he was gonna post it a year ago :/ | 02:14 |
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| trem | nite all, sweet dreams | 02:19 |
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| arjan | freddo: meego does not use grub but syslinux | 02:20 |
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| tmzt | CosmoHill: try old usb floppy drives | 02:37 |
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| CosmoHill | i have a load of them somewhere | 02:37 |
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| koupsaa | can i use moblin-web-browser instead of chromium .at toolbar? | 02:46 |
| koupsaa | meego-toolbar | 02:46 |
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| koupsaa | Empathy crash | 02:49 |
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| giasone | hi | 03:06 |
| giasone | somebody try to boot meego v.1.0 on parallels | 03:06 |
| giasone | the live version I mine? | 03:06 |
| arjan | koupsaa: realistically, you can use chrome or chromium.... | 03:09 |
| arjan | we've stopped work on any other browser | 03:09 |
| arjan | giasone: that's going to be painful; I don[t know of any virtualization thing that supports 3D well enough | 03:10 |
| CosmoHill | VMware player? | 03:10 |
| giasone | at the moment I istalling it on a virtualbox machine | 03:11 |
| giasone | and seems like it go forth | 03:11 |
| giasone | iI want give it a try before install on y netbook | 03:11 |
| koupsaa | arjan, ok, for now i use meego-chromium. but on somes site he doesn't work and after 3 or 4 tabs he become (became? sorry my english) very slow | 03:12 |
| CosmoHill | I've heard tabs 3 and later become slow | 03:12 |
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| koupsaa | arjan, http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=320 it's happen to me too | 03:14 |
| markatto | giasone: as far as I know, meego does not really work in virtualbox | 03:16 |
| markatto | giasone: If you get it working, let me know what you did | 03:16 |
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| giasone | i reboot the vm but give me boot error | 03:17 |
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| koupsaa | arjan, you and your team have made a nice work (specially UI) :) | 03:17 |
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| giasone | nice italian translation | 03:21 |
| * CosmoHill gives intel and nokia a box of cookies | 03:24 | |
| koupsaa | CosmoHill, and the others nothing? :( :) | 03:25 |
| * CosmoHill gives a box to contributors | 03:25 | |
| koupsaa | how many cookies for one rpm ? | 03:26 |
| CosmoHill | 1? | 03:27 |
| CosmoHill | maybe 2 | 03:27 |
| koupsaa | question: where can i posted my meego-rpm for the community | 03:28 |
| CosmoHill | I believe this was covered in the TSG | 03:28 |
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| CosmoHill | koupsaa: look in this weeks TSG logs | 03:37 |
| koupsaa | 2010/05/26 ? | 03:38 |
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| CosmoHill | yes | 03:38 |
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| giasone | markatto: black screen after first configuration | 03:45 |
| giasone | doesn't work | 03:45 |
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| markatto | giasone: yeah for me the installer works, but it can't actually boot | 03:55 |
| markatto | it hangs as soon as the wallpaper appears | 03:55 |
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| giasone | yes the same for me | 03:59 |
| giasone | but i try it on netbook directly | 04:00 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Any chance MeeGo will play nice with VMWare? | 04:01 |
| giasone | I don't know but sure doesn't with parallels and freeze on desktop image in virtualbox | 04:02 |
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| CosmoHill | you can probably get meego into command line only | 04:17 |
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| CosmoHill | cyas | 04:18 |
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| giasone | It works on my Acer one 110 | 04:28 |
| giasone | really fastly | 04:28 |
| s13ge | someone tested maemo @Asus 1101HA? | 04:30 |
| s13ge | *meego | 04:30 |
| s13ge | :) sry | 04:30 |
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| giasone | but what about a productivity software | 04:42 |
| giasone | openoffice and/or co? | 04:42 |
| giasone | i f i want read a document? | 04:42 |
| koupsaa | good night meego to sleep | 04:43 |
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| s13ge | giasone, perhaps meego has packet manager, or some repositorys | 04:45 |
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| s13ge | hope so :) | 04:46 |
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| unohu62 | Is anybody running meego on an N800 tablet? | 05:07 |
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| bjk | are there any plans for recent phones running symbian os to be able to "upgrade" to meego OS? like an alternate OS | 05:22 |
| Termana | bjk, doubtful. | 05:22 |
| bjk | i need a linux based phone but the symbian phones have all the hardware features i need. and i dont want to have to buy a new phone when meego is more widely available | 05:24 |
| bjk | some symbian based phones anyway | 05:24 |
| Termana | bjk, what about the n900? it doesn't suit your needs? | 05:24 |
| bjk | yeah, but i don't have that kind of money | 05:24 |
| bjk | i wonder if anyones working on a linux port for any symbian phones. need detailed hardware specs. | 05:26 |
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| microlith | good luck finding enough specs to port the kernel, then finding drivers for all the hardware | 05:32 |
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| Monotoko | bjk, i dont think the phones are quite powerful enough to run meego properly | 05:33 |
| Monotoko | besides...symbian is an good OS | 05:33 |
| bjk | isn't symbian opensource now? shouldn't the drivers be too? | 05:33 |
| microlith | bjk: it is open source, yes, but the drivers may not be there | 05:34 |
| bjk | even an openembedded recipe would be good. could put qtopia on there or anything X11 | 05:34 |
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| bjk | havent used symbian yet. i'm looking to get a new phone and i'd like to know my options for the future of it | 05:37 |
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| breakd0wn | hi, so both of the meego downloads either come with chrome or chromium? | 05:45 |
| breakd0wn | ok, now I see that is true. Horrible | 05:48 |
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| microlith | I know, lack of adblock and noscript sucks | 05:49 |
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| breakd0wn | i used to hate the word meego, but after looking around the site and seeing all the cool little cartoon guys. It kinda fits | 06:06 |
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| Termana | Miguel de Icaza to the rescue on the mailing list | 07:10 |
| Termana | Mono rescue* | 07:10 |
| Termana | I thought he worked for Microsoft though, but he is using a novell email address, so I guess not :P | 07:11 |
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| microlith | let me guess, he's defending mono against "bs" concerns regarding patents | 07:32 |
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| kisse | hola | 08:07 |
| th0br0 | gday | 08:27 |
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| kisse | hardly "good" :( I really wish I could figure out how to configure the power options on MeeGo | 08:31 |
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| lbt | o/ | 10:48 |
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| Termana | hey lbt | 10:50 |
| lbt | what a nice sunny morning :) | 10:50 |
| pupnik | we got some happy rain | 10:51 |
| pupnik | love it when it rains at night and I wake up to a freshly cleaned world | 10:52 |
| lbt | ....and wet cats | 10:53 |
| lbt | "IM WET AND HUNGRY FEEEEDZ ME!!!" | 10:53 |
| lbt | "bugger off - it's 6am" | 10:54 |
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| sivang | morning everybody | 11:33 |
| sivang | lbt: hehe | 11:33 |
| sivang | lbt: the cat ran out while it was raining ? | 11:34 |
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| lbt | sivang: seems like every time it rains.... soggy cat | 11:39 |
| sivang | lbt: hehe, you in the UK? | 11:39 |
| lbt | how did you guess ;) | 11:39 |
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| sivang | lbt: you're wonderful choice of words, and attitude :-) | 11:40 |
| sivang | lbt: I love the UK | 11:40 |
| sivang | lbt: I wish I could be there for a while. | 11:40 |
| lbt | yeah, it's a nice place | 11:40 |
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| sivang | lbt: bugger off is one of the nicest expression that had be concieved by human language. | 11:40 |
| sivang | lbt: it encompasses so many in it. | 11:40 |
| lbt | especially when said by a northerner | 11:41 |
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| pupnik | i thought the soggy cat gave it away | 11:44 |
| janne_oksanen | has anyone had problems extracting the sdk? After a while of extracing a ton of files I get a: | 11:45 |
| janne_oksanen | tar: Exiting with failure status due to previous errors | 11:45 |
| janne_oksanen | I can't see any errors right above that | 11:45 |
| janne_oksanen | not within as far as I can scroll back anyway | 11:46 |
| Frye | Disk full? You could redirect the output of the tar process to a file (with stderr too) and see if that reveals the reason. | 11:48 |
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| janne_oksanen | disk is not full, or even close | 11:48 |
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| janne_oksanen | I guess I make an error log file then | 11:48 |
| Frye | That is the easiest way. As the real error can be quite deep in the log | 11:49 |
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| Vortiago | janne_oksanen, got the same error myself. But the sdk seems to work none-the-less | 11:52 |
| janne_oksanen | Vortiago: I was thinking that it might be nothing | 11:52 |
| janne_oksanen | so far the only errors I'm getting are due to files already existing | 11:52 |
| Vortiago | ye | 11:52 |
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| janne_oksanen | and this time it went cleanly through | 11:57 |
| janne_oksanen | oh wait, the last message went into the log too | 11:57 |
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| gour | does meego work under vm (vbox) ? | 12:02 |
| janne_oksanen | hmmm... startmeego doesn't appear to have started the Meego desktop | 12:05 |
| janne_oksanen | I'm just getting a black box | 12:05 |
| janne_oksanen | owell, will have to get back to debugging this later | 12:08 |
| bogie11 | i had same kind of problems. | 12:08 |
| janne_oksanen | did you get it running eventuallt? | 12:08 |
| bogie11 | well i switched to other console and ran startx | 12:08 |
| bogie11 | it started twm | 12:08 |
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| bogie11 | i had weird problem, it kept switching after few seconds back to blank page. maybe because of some watchdog | 12:09 |
| janne_oksanen | k, thanks | 12:10 |
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| * gour is installing meego on under vbox | 13:21 | |
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| gour | well, i got it working (with the help from the forum), but having twm is not thrilling :-/ | 13:31 |
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| Vortiago | gour, what did you do to get it working? | 13:34 |
| gour | Vortiago: xorg & twm :-/ | 13:35 |
| Vortiago | ah | 13:35 |
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| gour | quite disappointed in comparison with moblin experience | 13:36 |
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| gour | the only 'advantage' is that meego can be properly shutdown :-D | 13:37 |
| CosmoHill | gour: what version of meego? 1.0 or 0.1 ? | 13:39 |
| gour | CosmoHill: 1.0-chromium | 13:39 |
| CosmoHill | this virtualbox 3.2? | 13:39 |
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| gour | CosmoHill: yes | 13:42 |
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| Vortiago | gour, then it's onwards to finding the startup-script and make changes so that the normal desktop runs | 13:44 |
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| CosmoHill | hey thiago | 13:51 |
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| gour | Vortiago: i'm not sure it can work due to 3d accel. stuff | 13:54 |
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| * CosmoHill wonders if anyone has vmware workstation / player | 13:55 | |
| gour | Vortiago: check http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=202 thread | 13:57 |
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| marquinos | Hi! Please, which installer is using MeeGo? | 16:01 |
| CosmoHill | what do you want to install it on? | 16:02 |
| marquinos | CosmoHill, I only want the name of the application | 16:02 |
| marquinos | it isn't debian installer, isn't it? | 16:03 |
| CosmoHill | i don't think so since meego uses rpm | 16:03 |
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| marquinos | I would localize it :) | 16:04 |
| marquinos | is Red Hat? is Suse?.... | 16:04 |
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| blabla | hi | 16:04 |
| blabla | Is here anyone who have meego on his eeePC 1000H ? | 16:04 |
| CosmoHill | does it support SSSE3? | 16:05 |
| CosmoHill | blabla: your device is supported | 16:05 |
| * lcuk installs meego on CosmoHill and hopes his brainstem supports SSSE3 | 16:06 | |
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| blabla | That's nice, but my wi-fi doesn't work. | 16:06 |
| * CosmoHill starts to drool | 16:06 | |
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| lcuk | nice fast 2d rendered drool i hope | 16:07 |
| lcuk | 3d | 16:07 |
| th0br0 | :D | 16:08 |
| th0br0 | hello everyone | 16:08 |
| CosmoHill | hey th0br0 | 16:08 |
| blabla | I set my wi-fi connection and hit connect but seems nothing is happening. | 16:08 |
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| blabla | any ideas? | 16:14 |
| CosmoHill | broadcom wiif? | 16:15 |
| blabla | ralink | 16:16 |
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| CosmoHill | lcuk: you watching the F1? | 16:48 |
| CosmoHill | dude is waving an ipad about | 16:48 |
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| lcuk | CosmoHill, couldnt care less about ipad tbh unless i can install regular linux | 16:49 |
| lcuk | ive had a 12" slate for the last 18 months | 16:49 |
| CosmoHill | if i had an ipad I'd be like "yay i have an ipad...now what?" | 16:50 |
| lcuk | exactly | 16:50 |
| CosmoHill | the ipad doesn't meet my requirments | 16:50 |
| lcuk | hardware wise it kinda does | 16:50 |
| CosmoHill | irc + touch screen? no thanks | 16:50 |
| lcuk | but not being able to write on it with anything more delicate than a sausage is fail | 16:50 |
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| CosmoHill | it's like people who have iphones | 16:51 |
| lcuk | really old photo: http://liqbase.net/liqbase_big.JPG | 16:52 |
| CosmoHill | what the | 16:52 |
| lcuk | :) thats the original liqbase running on both my n810 and the x41 | 16:53 |
| lcuk | once i knew that worked i started on the new liqbase framework | 16:53 |
| CosmoHill | I saw an N900 yesterday, a lot thinker than I thought they'd be | 16:54 |
| lcuk | yeah its a bit deeper than my 810 was | 16:55 |
| lcuk | and didnt fit in my crate properly | 16:55 |
| CosmoHill | I'd like it if nokia has a page that sony does | 16:57 |
| lcuk | ? | 16:58 |
| CosmoHill | where you go onto their website, enter your phone number and select your network | 16:58 |
| CosmoHill | then they send settings to your phone | 16:58 |
| lcuk | which phone are you having trouble with | 16:58 |
| CosmoHill | 6220c | 16:58 |
| lcuk | and providers are meant to periodically resend details anyway | 16:58 |
| lcuk | cant you request it from your provider.. | 16:59 |
| CosmoHill | it's an O2 phone on the vodafone network | 16:59 |
| lcuk | when you break the walled garden you are on your own :p | 16:59 |
| lcuk | ask vodaphone | 17:00 |
| CosmoHill | i did | 17:01 |
| CosmoHill | they go "please select your phone" and then don't list mine | 17:01 |
| lcuk | shit happens :P why would you expect nokia to know if your own provider doesnt | 17:01 |
| lcuk | since nokia would have to get the information from the provider | 17:02 |
| lcuk | you are going off piste | 17:02 |
| lcuk | try selecting a similar phone | 17:02 |
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| CosmoHill | in theory i should be able to select any phone | 17:03 |
| lcuk | CosmoHill, and you should also have a pony | 17:09 |
| CosmoHill | my aunty has a horse, does that count? | 17:09 |
| Termana | <lcuk> but not being able to write on it with anything more delicate than a sausage is fail | 17:10 |
| Termana | oh noes what will lcuk ever do when Nokia is using capacitive screens! | 17:10 |
| lcuk | Termana, what will nokians do when they cant use their nokias with capacitive screens in the cold? | 17:11 |
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| lcuk | what will the hong kong/eastern countries do when they cant do HWR with fingers | 17:12 |
| Termana | Call Ghost Busters? | 17:12 |
| lcuk | sure, theres a fad for capacitive, but its not the answer to everything | 17:12 |
| Termana | sure, but Nokia has said they will be making Harmattan and on devices capacitive | 17:13 |
| lcuk | sure and it will work rly rly well | 17:13 |
| lcuk | and loads of apps will play nicely on them :D (mine included) | 17:13 |
| Termana | Sure, but what are YOU going to do? | 17:14 |
| lcuk | i still write on my 810 | 17:14 |
| lcuk | i never stopped | 17:14 |
| Termana | Isn't Nokia like almost the only company still making anything resistive? :P | 17:14 |
| Termana | only company == only major company | 17:15 |
| lcuk | Termana, the nintendo ds.. | 17:15 |
| Termana | lcuk, I mean more in the smartphone/mobile computing arena | 17:16 |
| lcuk | ds big | 17:16 |
| * Termana notes lcuk avoiding the answer "yes" :P | 17:16 | |
| lcuk | Termana, doesnt bother me, apps still work | 17:16 |
| pupnik | capacitive is inferior tech for inferior minds | 17:17 |
| Termana | lcuk, sure, but didn't you just say you didn't like capacitive. Your going to be practically forced to use it | 17:17 |
| pupnik | like laptops with glossy screens | 17:17 |
| Termana | Doesn't that... boil your bubble or something like that? | 17:18 |
| lcuk | not at all | 17:18 |
| Termana | So its all... chip chip cherio? | 17:18 |
| lcuk | finger friendly ui is great for lots of things | 17:18 |
| pupnik | if you have a hardware keyboard, which is better, you can use a resistive screen | 17:20 |
| Termana | Just as an aside, HTC put out a resistive touchscreen smartphone - after doing so, they said they would never do it again | 17:20 |
| pupnik | did it have a keyboard | 17:20 |
| pupnik | now we learned something, didnt we | 17:20 |
| Termana | pupnik, I don't know to be honest, it didn't interest me to read to far into it | 17:21 |
| Termana | pupnik, when you crush cornflakes it turns into milk? | 17:21 |
| Termana | Is that what we learnt? | 17:21 |
| CosmoHill | lcuk: done :) | 17:21 |
| Termana | pupnik, I don't see what your point is anyway. Keyboard or no keyboard how does that make a difference | 17:23 |
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| pupnik | because people who type on a screen need a different screen behavior than people who click on a screen or tap urls on a screen | 17:24 |
| CosmoHill | bollocks | 17:24 |
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| CosmoHill | home page was wrong and it cost me money :( | 17:24 |
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| lcuk | CosmoHill, lol | 17:30 |
| CosmoHill | Welcome to O2, that will be 50p please | 17:30 |
| lcuk | normally its mms config thats sent! | 17:31 |
| lcuk | i never used internet on tinyphones | 17:31 |
| CosmoHill | i went on the browser and the homepage is set to O2 | 17:31 |
| CosmoHill | whenever I go online with my phone it's teathered to my laptop | 17:31 |
| ivarela | hi | 17:35 |
| ivarela | when using Meego in Applications / Settings / Languages, I've found an error. Which is the template translation to fix it? | 17:36 |
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| CosmoHill | now to get it working with my mac | 17:40 |
| CosmoHill | hmm | 17:42 |
| CosmoHill | the nokia 6220c isn't on the UK website :/ | 17:42 |
| Zapp | hi everyone | 17:44 |
| CosmoHill | hi | 17:46 |
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| Zapp | sometimes I lose my wifi conection, randomly (I've tried it with diferent acces points), my netbook is a eee 1000H wich comes with a ralink 2860sta ...any way to solve this, maybe a new module (even if its propietary) | 17:54 |
| * CosmoHill dances cos he has 3G working on his nokia from his mac | 17:54 | |
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| pupnik | nice hotspot app eh CosmoHill | 17:57 |
| CosmoHill | http://raoulpop.com/2008/10/24/use-a-nokia-n95-as-a-bluetooth-modem-on-a-mac/ | 17:59 |
| pupnik | ohh | 18:00 |
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| vgrade | meego 1.0 on GMA500 based O2 Joggler with touch, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUiSnITKeRY | 18:06 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | vgrade: am guessing you shoehorned IEGD onto it? | 18:08 |
| CosmoHill | meego looks sweet | 18:10 |
| CosmoHill | i want >.< | 18:10 |
| pupnik | would help if it had a descriptive title | 18:10 |
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| vgrade | long way to go here, but yes this is using old X as it must without 1.7 support from IEGD | 18:20 |
| vgrade | anyone know when the new driver is out, someone mentioned it was not called someting else | 18:20 |
| vgrade | eigd? | 18:22 |
| vgrade | emgd? | 18:22 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | yeah, they renamed it | 18:31 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | but i dunno to what | 18:31 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | :/ | 18:31 |
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| Abhijeet | Hi guys. | 18:43 |
| Abhijeet | I want to develop applications for Meego. To do so do I need to install the latest meego release or there are other ways to do so? | 18:44 |
| Stskeeps | meego sdk exists | 18:45 |
| Stskeeps | but look into the qt sdk stuff | 18:45 |
| Abhijeet | Stskeeps: i have downloaded the sdk... but there is nothing call Meego project in it. | 18:46 |
| Abhijeet | there is no tutorial on meego site just like android have videos explaining from scratch about application development on android. | 18:47 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: agreed | 18:48 |
| Stskeeps | i think this is under development. | 18:49 |
| Abhijeet | Stskeeps: let say, i have created normal project using Qt as it is done for linux os... then how we can package or test it if it is working fine on meego enviroment. | 18:50 |
| Abhijeet | is there any meego simulator there? | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | there is one .. sec | 18:51 |
| CosmoHill | you can chroot into meego | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | Abhijeet: actually, ask those questions on meego-dev mailing list. they're better at giving straight answerd | 18:52 |
| Stskeeps | s | 18:52 |
| Stskeeps | Abhijeet: you're a typical developer story so | 18:52 |
| Abhijeet | let me try there.... I think nokia and intel started this project in hurry... | 18:54 |
| Stskeeps | yes and no, i just think the sdk stuff isnt 100 percent out yet. its supposed to glue in with qt creator | 18:56 |
| Stskeeps | http://wiki.meego.com/Developer_Guide | 18:57 |
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| Abhijeet | Stskeeps: thanks. | 19:20 |
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| Stskeeps | np | 19:21 |
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| reenignEesreveR | i downloaded a CD image but it seems like a pretty normal linux distro ... i wanna see some eye-candy interfaces ... how can i do that? | 19:52 |
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| CosmoHill | huh? | 19:55 |
| arjan | what did you download? | 19:56 |
| CosmoHill | hey arjan | 19:56 |
| arjan | morning | 19:56 |
| reenignEesreveR | arjan, meego-1.0-preview-ivi-noemgd-201005121943.iso | 19:58 |
| thiago_home | ivi = in-vehicle infotainment | 19:58 |
| arjan | reenignEesreveR: that's just a core OS build | 19:58 |
| arjan | not a netbook/UI build | 19:58 |
| arjan | if you want to see the UI, get the netbook build | 19:59 |
| reenignEesreveR | ok | 19:59 |
| reenignEesreveR | btw does the netbook build have touch support in UI? | 19:59 |
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| reenignEesreveR | i mean, is it finger friendly? | 19:59 |
| arjan | not really | 19:59 |
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| arjan | again.. not really | 19:59 |
| arjan | for that we'll have the meego touch framework in meego 1.1 | 19:59 |
| reenignEesreveR | are you guys planning to use hildon or something else? | 20:00 |
| Stskeeps | by god, i hope not ;) | 20:00 |
| arjan | nope a QT based architecture | 20:00 |
| thiago_home | no hildon | 20:00 |
| CosmoHill | reenignEesreveR: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUiSnITKeRY | 20:00 |
| bogie11 | is there already working DUI packages, i think that i saw it somewhere? | 20:01 |
| reenignEesreveR | CosmoHill, thats cool ... how can i try that out? :P | 20:01 |
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| arjan | some of it is in gitorious | 20:01 |
| arjan | but I have to say that it's still quite rough around the edges | 20:01 |
| arjan | that's why it's aimed at 1.1 | 20:02 |
| Billius | How does composition work with Meego? do you use OpenGL ES for hwa composition? | 20:02 |
| thiago_home | OpenGL ES is used in most configurations | 20:02 |
| arjan | on netbook we use openGL for composition | 20:02 |
| thiago_home | OpenGL where available | 20:02 |
| arjan | openGL-es is for handset | 20:02 |
| arjan | it's a per-device-category thing | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | vgrade: i'm actually amazed the netbook ux can work sortof on the iegd configuration | 20:02 |
| arjan | tablets likely will be openGL for example | 20:02 |
| arjan | Stskeeps: it does? last we tested it fell rather appart badly | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | arjan: well, watch the video :P | 20:02 |
| Billius | any plans to use OpenWF-composition for lower power? | 20:03 |
| vgrade | stskeeps, yes you said it as not possible earlier :) | 20:03 |
| Stskeeps | that CosmoHill just linked - joggler's a gma500 and we hacked iegd onto meego | 20:03 |
| Stskeeps | hm | 20:03 |
| Stskeeps | seems like it's falling apart a little bit still | 20:03 |
| thiago_home | OpenWF is one of several technologies we're looking at in Qt | 20:04 |
| thiago_home | OpenKODE too | 20:04 |
| Stskeeps | but then again, it's on top of a nasty hack | 20:04 |
| * TSCHAKeee2 read that as OpenWTF | 20:04 | |
| arjan | meego requires opengl/es anyway | 20:04 |
| arjan | so why not use it | 20:04 |
| thiago_home | TSCHAKeee2: happened to me the first time too :-) | 20:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | heheh | 20:04 |
| thiago_home | Billius: but, no, for the moment X is used, so GLX is available. | 20:04 |
| arjan | thiago_home: btw I'd like to talk to you abuot qt timers some time ;) | 20:04 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | so, just to be sure, the first UX built atop Qt will be the Handset UX? | 20:05 |
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| thiago_home | arjan: before you do, try running the app/test without the glib mainloop (export QT_NO_GLIB=1) | 20:05 |
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| arjan | thiago: more API like things | 20:05 |
| thiago_home | ok | 20:05 |
| CosmoHill | hey trem | 20:05 |
| arjan | want to have range timers as an api | 20:05 |
| arjan | and as well as a "seconds" API that rounds internally (like I did for glib) | 20:05 |
| thiago_home | range timers? As in they fire for a while then auto shutdown? | 20:05 |
| arjan | no | 20:05 |
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| arjan | more like "I want a timer between 5 and 7 seconds from now" | 20:06 |
| arjan | and then within that 2 second window it coalesces with other existing timers | 20:06 |
| thiago_home | and then fire at the first oportunity that a timer is already set? | 20:06 |
| Billius | I'm new to X so I need to look into how it backends onto the hardware for composition. Obviously if you are using GPU for UI anyway then you can use it for composition. However for full screen video with some blended overlays it would be better to use alpha blending hardware in LCD controller or OpenVG h/w if present | 20:06 |
| arjan | rather than the current "I want a timer 5.0000000000 seconds from now" | 20:06 |
| arjan | thiago: yup | 20:06 |
| thiago_home | ok, I see | 20:06 |
| thiago_home | coarse timer | 20:06 |
| thiago_home | do you need to specify how coarse? | 20:07 |
| arjan | for glib I added an API that takes "seconds" only | 20:07 |
| arjan | and rounds behind the apps back | 20:07 |
| thiago_home | without letting the app specify how to round? | 20:07 |
| arjan | in fact, it rounds such that all apps in the system that use seconds, round to the same poinmts | 20:07 |
| arjan | (for recurring timers) | 20:07 |
| arjan | basically what I did for glib, was pick a point inside the second | 20:08 |
| arjan | which is the same point for all apps in the system | 20:08 |
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| arjan | and then "seconds" timers round to that point | 20:08 |
| arjan | and once you're on that point, obviously recurring timers will stay on that point | 20:08 |
| lcuk | is qildon being used | 20:08 |
| thiago_home | is that point inside the second fixed, or is it random per app? | 20:08 |
| thiago_home | lcuk: no | 20:08 |
| lcuk | and whatever happened to qtablet | 20:08 |
| arjan | it's the same within the system | 20:08 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: qildon is just to add qt widgets in hildon desktop | 20:08 |
| arjan | but different between systems | 20:08 |
| arjan | (basically a hash of a session env var) | 20:09 |
| lcuk | is that code around ? | 20:09 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: right | 20:09 |
| thiago_home | arjan: why not just stick to a constant section fraction of the monotonic timer? | 20:09 |
| arjan | by making it the same within the system, all apps group their background work timers to the same point | 20:09 |
| lcuk | cos that worked nicely on 8x0 | 20:09 |
| lcuk | or so the video showed | 20:09 |
| thiago_home | arjan: the monotonic clock isn't shared between systems | 20:09 |
| arjan | that could have worked I suppose | 20:09 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, by right its around? do you have url | 20:10 |
| arjan | so yeah that'd work too | 20:10 |
| arjan | as long as not all devices on the internet do the same one ;-) | 20:10 |
| thiago_home | Qt already uses the monotonic clock, so the simplest is to just use a known value of the seconds fraction | 20:10 |
| thiago_home | like 0 | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: qtablet is around somewhere, google for it, qildon too | 20:10 |
| arjan | thiago: yup | 20:10 |
| trem | hey CosmoHill | 20:10 |
| thiago_home | sounds easy and doable | 20:10 |
| lcuk | http://github.com/zchydem/qtablet | 20:10 |
| lcuk | qildon is on gitorious | 20:10 |
| lcuk | i know that | 20:10 |
| arjan | thiago: it's a good thing for power, since all those "once every few seconds do X" things do cause tons of distributed wakeups | 20:11 |
| lcuk | it was qtablet that was lacking | 20:11 |
| arjan | in glib, once the API was there as a very obvious right thing to use, people just use it automatically for all background stuff | 20:11 |
| thiago_home | arjan: we've been thinking of a coarse timer API for a while already | 20:11 |
| arjan | and... get the gain | 20:11 |
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| arjan | now the range timers are also potentially useful for finer grained stuff | 20:11 |
| arjan | but the second one is an obvious | 20:11 |
| thiago_home | things like a 30-second timer for a socket | 20:11 |
| thiago_home | it doesn't need to be precise | 20:11 |
| arjan | yup | 20:11 |
| arjan | the linux kernel also has the range timer concept | 20:12 |
| arjan | by default we give each timer like 50 usecs slack like that | 20:12 |
| thiago_home | we were actually wanting to do this for all timers | 20:12 |
| arjan | but each app can change that slack all the time | 20:12 |
| arjan | and the kernel will group it with various system events (say hw interrupts) within this interval | 20:12 |
| thiago_home | auto-coarse depending on the interval you select | 20:12 |
| arjan | (in meego we set the default to 1ms) | 20:12 |
| thiago_home | good, that's how it should be | 20:12 |
| arjan | auto-course with an optional "I want this one precise" | 20:13 |
| arjan | so if Qt knows the tolerance, it can tell the kernel | 20:13 |
| arjan | and the kernel will naturally group stuff between apps | 20:13 |
| thiago_home | we tell people that Qt timers below 15 milliseconds are imprecise already | 20:13 |
| arjan | thats something i haven't worked on for glib since it does not fit the glib api model | 20:13 |
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| arjan | on linux that's not really true | 20:13 |
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| arjan | we give nanoseconds to apps nowadays | 20:14 |
| * arjan did the work to move select/poll/etc away from jiffies to precise tiemrs | 20:14 | |
| arjan | timers | 20:14 |
| thiago_home | maybe, but the point was to ask that people don't count on it being exact | 20:14 |
| arjan | the nice thing with Qt/C++ is that you can just provide a different prototype for a precise set | 20:14 |
| arjan | on the same object | 20:14 |
| thiago_home | yeah | 20:15 |
| arjan | so you can within the same API, do a sane default and an optional "I know what i'm doing" option | 20:15 |
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| thiago_home | would you mind logging this as a suggestion in bugreports.qt.nokia.com ? | 20:15 |
| lcuk | what sorts of things need ms precision | 20:15 |
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| arjan | lcuk: media playback | 20:15 |
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| arjan | AV/sync kind of stuff | 20:16 |
| thiago_home | 60 fps screen updates | 20:16 |
| arjan | you don't want your audio to be 10 msec disconnected from your video stream. trust me ;) | 20:16 |
| lcuk | sure but thats different surely? | 20:16 |
| * thiago_home thinks this will require some C++ ugly hacks to get the new prototypes in QAbstractEventDispatcher | 20:16 | |
| thiago_home | probably QAbstractEventDispatcherV2 | 20:16 |
| arjan | lcuk: not really. to achieve that, you end up needing relatively precise timers | 20:16 |
| lcuk | or you just accept you can never get timing like that and make algorithm work based on interval since last ;) | 20:17 |
| lcuk | then it works on any machine whether slow or fast | 20:17 |
| arjan | the media people will kill you | 20:17 |
| arjan | they need that anyway | 20:17 |
| lcuk | not really | 20:17 |
| arjan | but they also want to get the common case working well | 20:17 |
| lcuk | its like a clock timer that needs to update seconds hand | 20:17 |
| arjan | if you show "seconds" on the default screen I'll yell at you anyway | 20:18 |
| arjan | one wakeup per second for a clock on the screen is silly | 20:18 |
| lcuk | same goes for minute | 20:18 |
| arjan | minute is fine, we give that a nice range | 20:18 |
| lcuk | you cant just set a 60second timer and expect it not to drift | 20:18 |
| CosmoHill | arjan: isn't that pretty resource intensive? | 20:18 |
| lcuk | each iteration you adjust, it might be 59.4 seconds you need | 20:18 |
| arjan | lcuk: sure | 20:18 |
| arjan | lcuk: just the sound people want to adjust every few milliseconds | 20:18 |
| arjan | and the more precise you give them *on average* the better they can do that without distortions | 20:19 |
| arjan | (or heavy compute work) | 20:19 |
| lcuk | sure | 20:19 |
| lcuk | anyway, teatime \o | 20:19 |
| thiago_home | anyway, we wanted to make the default timers coarse | 20:20 |
| thiago_home | and add a precise timer for precise things | 20:20 |
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| thiago_home | it's far more common that people need coarse | 20:20 |
| arjan | yep | 20:20 |
| arjan | in glib the 'seconds' api seems very popular | 20:20 |
| arjan | also because it conveys in the api what the person wants | 20:20 |
| arjan | he wants "10 seconds" | 20:20 |
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| arjan | so he'll rather pass "10" to something called "seconds" | 20:20 |
| arjan | than "10000" to something else | 20:21 |
| arjan | api psycology 101 ;) | 20:21 |
| thiago_home | of course | 20:21 |
| arjan | we have pretty nifty tools to show the effects and how well it works | 20:22 |
| arjan | (have you seen timechart ?) | 20:22 |
| thiago_home | no | 20:22 |
| thiago_home | have you seen FineToothComb? | 20:22 |
| arjan | shows on a nanosecond-to-nanosecond what happens in the system | 20:23 |
| * arjan googles | 20:23 | |
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| thiago_home | http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/09/29/exploring-qt-performance-on-arm-using-finetoothcomb/ | 20:23 |
| arjan | I've heared about that | 20:23 |
| arjan | slightly different level but very interesting | 20:24 |
| thiago_home | full-speed instruction dump | 20:24 |
| arjan | timechart soon will soon at least show you which functions are hot | 20:24 |
| arjan | but it also shows you who you're talking to | 20:24 |
| arjan | like you can follow a dbus conversation and why it's slow | 20:24 |
| arjan | and it's pure s/w, no special hw needed | 20:24 |
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| arjan | ftc will be one level more detail even | 20:25 |
| arjan | which is interesting for sure | 20:25 |
| arjan | timechart tries to be a multilevel representation, so you can zoom in for more details many times | 20:26 |
| arjan | while still also showing the high level behavior | 20:26 |
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| thiago_home | if you want talk to the author of ftc, I can put you in contact | 20:27 |
| arjan | I might have already | 20:27 |
| arjan | but some of that has nda's deeper than this server allows ;) | 20:27 |
| arjan | it'd be awesome to zoom timechart all the way into the actual instruction stream ;-) | 20:28 |
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| thiago_home | right, we can't give you the devices with the wings and ETM ports | 20:28 |
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| thiago_home | (that's why he had to draw it by hand) | 20:28 |
| thiago_home | but discussing the tool, how it works, etc., I'm sure we can | 20:29 |
| arjan | we have internal stuff as well like this that we can't share | 20:29 |
| arjan | but we're not even allowed to talk about them in public | 20:30 |
| arjan | or even under NDA normally :) | 20:30 |
| Robot101 | arjan: hey, have you seen bustle? | 20:30 |
| thiago_home | then we'll need some NDAs in order to get our hands in some of those things | 20:31 |
| thiago_home | :-) | 20:31 |
| Robot101 | arjan: d-bus sequence diagram tool - http://willthompson.co.uk/bustle/ | 20:31 |
| Robot101 | arjan: popular in the N900 performance team :) | 20:31 |
| Robot101 | like "why the hell does the media player take 2 years to start... oh hey, 50,000 d-bus round trips" | 20:31 |
| Robot101 | etc | 20:31 |
| pupnik | ty ty | 20:32 |
| arjan | not seen actual bustle | 20:32 |
| arjan | but I've had the same thing found with timechart | 20:32 |
| arjan | timechart can find it without you knowing it's dbus yet ;) | 20:32 |
| arjan | it just show you "oh you're talking to dbus daemon, and then waiting for a reply" | 20:32 |
| Robot101 | arjan: are you going to computex btw? | 20:33 |
| arjan | nope | 20:33 |
| arjan | no travel budget | 20:33 |
| Robot101 | ah, so not many meego folks? | 20:33 |
| * arjan makes too many other work trips | 20:33 | |
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| arjan | more like I travel too much already | 20:33 |
| arjan | for my budget group | 20:33 |
| Robot101 | I know the feeling :) | 20:33 |
| * arjan does not actually report into the meego group, travel budget wise | 20:34 | |
| * Robot101 is in a plane... on the ground... at heathrow. sigh. | 20:34 | |
| Robot101 | german ATC is closed due to a dead hamster or something, so 1-2 hour delay | 20:34 |
| arjan | I don't travel as much as I used to, but it's more last minute | 20:34 |
| arjan | which means more $$$ | 20:34 |
| Robot101 | do you know of (m)any meego folks from Intel going? | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | Robot101: wasn't it the german ATC that was running on linux and was 'rock solid'? ;p | 20:35 |
| arjan | at least a few from oregon are going | 20:35 |
| thiago_home | Stskeeps: not only that | 20:35 |
| thiago_home | Stskeeps: it runs Qt too | 20:35 |
| arjan | Stskeeps: dead hamsters are a biological attack ;) | 20:35 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 20:35 |
| thiago_home | but I guess the German traffic controllers are busy watching Lena arrive in Hamburg | 20:35 |
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| Robot101 | they'd better fix it, flightradar24 shows quite a lot of flights in the air above germant atm :) | 20:36 |
| Robot101 | *germany | 20:36 |
| vgrade | don't mention eurovision | 20:36 |
| vgrade | vgrade from UK | 20:36 |
| arjan | do not mention eurovision. | 20:36 |
| arjan | that does not exist. | 20:36 |
| Robot101 | I'm pretty sure that have some hung over friends who would beg to differ... :) unfortunately | 20:37 |
| CosmoHill | vgrade: cool, that would explain the O2 jogger | 20:37 |
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| Robot101 | *that I | 20:37 |
| * Robot101 seems to be terrible at typing today | 20:37 | |
| Billius | What's the Meego presence likely to be like at Akademy in Tampere? | 20:37 |
| thiago_home | Billius: there will be some people | 20:37 |
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| CosmoHill | Robot101: you should see reenignEesreveR, he's typing everything backwards | 20:38 |
| janne_oksanen | Billius: what academy would that be? | 20:38 |
| thiago_home | valtteri halla (Nokia, TSG, etc.) will be there giving a keynote | 20:38 |
| pupnik | my n900 cght a wlan beacon 30k feet over sweden | 20:38 |
| arjan | Billius: not sure if there's official meego.... I mean... meego isn't kde | 20:38 |
| Robot101 | Billius: collabora is sponsoring and I guess quite a few collabora folks will go | 20:38 |
| Robot101 | not sure if I will, will decide nearer the time :) | 20:38 |
| reenignEesreveR | ?tahW | 20:38 |
| thiago_home | you can expect a lot of Nokians too | 20:38 |
| thiago_home | we'll be 10-15 from the Oslo office | 20:39 |
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| Robot101 | heh, the collabora wiki has grown a recipes page since I last looked | 20:39 |
| janne_oksanen | would someone tell me what this academy in Tampere is? | 20:39 |
| janne_oksanen | I live near Tampere | 20:40 |
| thiago_home | janne_oksanen: Akademy | 20:40 |
| janne_oksanen | ah | 20:40 |
| janne_oksanen | I cee | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | http://akademy.kde.org/ | 20:40 |
| Billius | Hmm, might look into coming - Akademy http://meego.com/community/events/2010/akademy-2010 | 20:40 |
| Robot101 | oh look, there's a MeeGo party | 20:40 |
| Robot101 | we'll have to have a MeeGo vs Collabora party contest :D | 20:41 |
| Stskeeps | combine to make it a bigger one? ;p | 20:41 |
| thiago_home | Robot101: the one last year was awesome :-) | 20:41 |
| Robot101 | actually it might be the day trip from us this year | 20:42 |
| * Robot101 is also thinking what Collabora should do for its 5th birthday this summer | 20:43 | |
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| Billius | Mobile track on Sat - day one - looks ok. http://akademytest.kde.org/program/conference | 20:47 |
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| lcuk | Robot101, how far away is birthday | 20:49 |
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| arjan | thiago: btw .. there's a need for a Qt tutorial book that does not start with 15 chapters of GUI stuff | 20:52 |
| arjan | but focuses on all the other parts of Qt | 20:52 |
| thiago_home | sounds like a tutorial I'd like to see :-) | 20:53 |
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| * arjan wants to write a meego touch framework app... but want to get solid on qt fundamentals first | 20:56 | |
| arjan | just the qt gui stuff isn't as appropriate to start with | 20:56 |
| arjan | oh well. time to go to a long lunch L) | 20:56 |
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| * TSCHAKeee2 fries his evol buttermilk battered southern fried chicken, for lunch | 21:00 | |
| * CosmoHill noms pizza | 21:01 | |
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| bogie11 | cooked Macaroni with minced meat (+tuna fish) | 21:14 |
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| CosmoHill | I'm sure my server case shouldn't flex like that | 21:21 |
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| cwells | hi, just installed meego on a EEE 1001P. couple of small issues: doesn't seem to want to do update ("can't establish trust relationship") and can't install software from garage. I assume they are related | 21:45 |
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| mindThomas | Hi. Any UK guys in here? | 22:00 |
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| CosmoHill | maybe | 22:00 |
| Stskeeps | uk or dk? :P | 22:00 |
| CosmoHill | what's the follow up question? | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | I'm DK | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | but I'm looking for UK guys | 22:01 |
| Stskeeps | to buy a joggler? | 22:01 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | yup | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | :) | 22:01 |
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| Stskeeps | hehe | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | I'm really into embedded electronics | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | http://elec.tkjweb.dk <- that's my blog | 22:01 |
| Stskeeps | keep in mind the joggler has gma500 and hence may not have sane meego experience | 22:01 |
| mindThomas | and unfortunately I first saw today that it has been on sale for quite a while | 22:02 |
| mindThomas | It is going to be used with Linux | 22:02 |
| mindThomas | UNE | 22:02 |
| Stskeeps | it's a bargain at 50 quid, yeah | 22:02 |
| mindThomas | Ubunto Network Edition | 22:02 |
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| mindThomas | But I think it's the last day tomorrow | 22:02 |
| Stskeeps | it's good to some extent, but UNE isn't really a touchscreen os.. | 22:02 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:02 |
| mindThomas | as the campaign only runs throughout may | 22:02 |
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| Stskeeps | (i know, i run jogglerhacks.blogspot.com , hobby project for me) | 22:03 |
| mindThomas | anyways, then it can run some IRC bots or server for me :) | 22:03 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 22:03 |
| CosmoHill | half price but out of stock | 22:03 |
| mindThomas | wouldn't it be able to do that? | 22:03 |
| Stskeeps | sure | 22:03 |
| mindThomas | 1.3GHz and 512mb ram | 22:04 |
| Stskeeps | go read what's possible to do on it at my blog :P | 22:04 |
| mindThomas | that should be plenty :) | 22:04 |
| mindThomas | have read it | 22:04 |
| Stskeeps | you can pretty much boot a lot of things (android is fucking up) | 22:04 |
| mindThomas | out of stock :( | 22:04 |
| CosmoHill | that spec? that's better than my server :/ | 22:04 |
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| mindThomas | Is it only possible to buy them online? | 22:05 |
| mindThomas | From o2? | 22:05 |
| Stskeeps | think so, or in shop | 22:05 |
| Stskeeps | or on ebay, where people charge a shitload ;p | 22:05 |
| mindThomas | So theoretically there could be stock in a shop? | 22:06 |
| Stskeeps | theoretically | 22:07 |
| CosmoHill | hmmm | 22:08 |
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| CosmoHill | if i had one of them i could attach it to my speakers via the 3.5mm jack | 22:08 |
| CosmoHill | and use it for music | 22:08 |
| CosmoHill | http://www.openpeak.com/OpenFrame7.php | 22:10 |
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| * CosmoHill blinks | 22:12 | |
| CosmoHill | they wrote the applications in flash...for a linux based device..crazy people | 22:13 |
| Stskeeps | not a bad idea if you need simple dev env though | 22:13 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | I want to eventually make them an Orbiter for bedside use | 22:19 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | but i am still researching orbiter ideas that can run okay on that constrained GMA500 | 22:19 |
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| Stskeeps | it ran hildon desktop fine | 22:20 |
| mindThomas | Anyone who could be one for me? | 22:20 |
| CosmoHill | not me, sorry | 22:21 |
| Stskeeps | mindThomas: sorry, got mine from a guy in UK too :P | 22:22 |
| * CosmoHill blinks | 22:22 | |
| CosmoHill | I'm on a computer store and under "toys and gadgets" there is "Nissan Cars" :/ | 22:22 |
| mindThomas | Stskeeps: You did :P | 22:23 |
| Stskeeps | and i think he's maxed out atm :P | 22:23 |
| Stskeeps | (there's a limit on how many jogglers you can buy) | 22:23 |
| mindThomas | oh, there is? :O | 22:24 |
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| TSCHAKeee2 | yup. 2 | 22:26 |
| mindThomas | max 2? | 22:27 |
| TSCHAKeee2 | yup | 22:27 |
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| CosmoHill | I think there are two O2 shops in my town | 22:37 |
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| mindThomas | "None left in the central Newcastle-upon-tyne or Metrocentre stores. " - http://www.hotukdeals.com/item/646001/o2-joggler-49-99-now-with-free-app?page=137 | 22:38 |
| mindThomas | CosmoHill would you mind buying one for me? | 22:38 |
| lcuk | buying a whole shop? | 22:39 |
| mindThomas | haha :D | 22:40 |
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| sivang | lbt: hey, just responded to your email :) | 22:51 |
| sivang | lbt: so I Know which meeting, on the 2nd of june :) | 22:51 |
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| lbt | sivang: cheers | 23:38 |
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| rioch | Will meego also work on a mid/umpc? | 23:45 |
| thiago_home | meego works on netbooks | 23:46 |
| thiago_home | and eventually slates | 23:46 |
| markatto | and phones | 23:46 |
| markatto | I don't see why not mid | 23:47 |
| arjan | mid/umpc ... also depends on the hw in use | 23:47 |
| thiago_home | what's the difference between a netbook and a mid after all? | 23:47 |
| rioch | true, true | 23:47 |
| arjan | and the exact usage model you expect | 23:47 |
| arjan | from where I sit, mid/umpc does not exist | 23:47 |
| rioch | well, I want to write an application that I need to carry around with me all the time | 23:47 |
| arjan | it was more a vision of what turns out to be a few different device categories | 23:48 |
| thiago_home | well, what device are you going to carry that application on? | 23:48 |
| thiago_home | I can carry applications on a USB stick, but they're not very useful without another device | 23:48 |
| rioch | I haven't got a device yet. I need it to be touchscreen, around a 5 inch screen (not so small it's useless, not so big that it's not portable) | 23:49 |
| rioch | I've been looking at a few, like this one: http://carrypad.com/2010/05/21/evigroup-wallet-now-available/ | 23:49 |
| thiago_home | what's the difference between that and a slate? | 23:49 |
| arjan | netbook sized ones... I'm now using a lenovo s10 3t | 23:50 |
| rioch | thiago: it's small | 23:50 |
| rioch | I dunno, maybe it is a slate | 23:50 |
| arjan | it sounds halfway between an ipad and an iphone | 23:50 |
| arjan | size wise | 23:50 |
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| rioch | arjan: yeah, I'd say so | 23:51 |
| thiago_home | maybe slightly larger than an N810 then | 23:51 |
| lcuk | smartq is prolly closest :) | 23:51 |
| lcuk | that already ran mer | 23:51 |
| lcuk | the device is an arm11 one | 23:51 |
| lbt | didn't meego used to have lighttpd? | 23:51 |
| arjan | meego never had a httpd server yet | 23:51 |
| lcuk | doesnt qt have one | 23:52 |
| arjan | we've been asked a few times but with not-so-clear reasons | 23:52 |
| thiago_home | lcuk: no | 23:52 |
| lcuk | rly? | 23:52 |
| lcuk | surprised | 23:52 |
| arjan | also, doing http serving is.. interesting security wise | 23:52 |
| arjan | open port and all that | 23:52 |
| thiago_home | unless you count the MiniHttpServer I wrote in several unit tests | 23:52 |
| lbt | arjan: OK - I thought I'd found one... been asked about it | 23:52 |
| lcuk | i expected qkitchensink->httpserver or something thiago_home :D | 23:52 |
| arjan | I can see a small packaged apache as well if we'd really need one | 23:52 |
| arjan | kinda hoping we don't need one | 23:53 |
| arjan | (security) | 23:53 |
| rioch | thiago_home: so, how can I tell if it will work? Is there a list of compatible devices? | 23:53 |
| lcuk | in the default install i can see not including it | 23:53 |
| lcuk | but why prevent people from doing what they want | 23:53 |
| thiago_home | rioch: if it runs OMAP3, there's a high chance it will work | 23:53 |
| thiago_home | ARM11 isn't so | 23:53 |
| rioch | what is OMAP3? | 23:53 |
| thiago_home | an ARMv7 SoC from TI | 23:54 |
| lcuk | will the handset ux work on netbook | 23:54 |
| thiago_home | lcuk: if you install it, it will probably run | 23:54 |
| lcuk | so it will be open source enough to build or just a case of binaries for different platforms? | 23:54 |
| thiago_home | but it's meant to be used on a small-screen touch device, not on a medium-sized one with keyboard and touchpad | 23:54 |
| lcuk | well like in the arm11 example - could i theoretically (forgetting performance) run the handset ux on open moko | 23:55 |
| thiago_home | if you recompile, yes | 23:55 |
| thiago_home | the ARM builds are done for ARMv7 CPUs | 23:56 |
| lcuk | and theres no blockers for recompilation beyond software bugs | 23:56 |
| thiago_home | and the need for OpenGL ES | 23:56 |
| lcuk | well that can technically be emulated cant it? | 23:56 |
| thiago_home | yes | 23:56 |
| lcuk | ok, so its not a blocker as such | 23:56 |
| thiago_home | if you do the work of isolating and testing the non-OpenGL ES codepaths | 23:56 |
| thiago_home | I'm pretty sure the developers aren't doing it | 23:57 |
| lcuk | i dont blame them | 23:57 |
| arjan | actually | 23:58 |
| arjan | since tablets will use opengl and share a bunch of the underlying code | 23:58 |
| arjan | that'll get debugged as well | 23:58 |
| thiago_home | opengl2 is a superset of opengles2 | 23:58 |
| arjan | almost. | 23:58 |
| thiago_home | right | 23:59 |
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| thiago_home | but testing the raster and X11 codepaths may not happen | 23:59 |
| arjan | oh sure | 23:59 |
| thiago_home | or what happens for the effects and other portions of the code depending on opengl | 23:59 |
| benp_ | Hi there. Giving meego a try and have a bunch of questions. Is this the right place? | 23:59 |
| lcuk | mmm no x11? | 23:59 |
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