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| Oksanaa | It's... Debian's dependency hell. As in, if X wants to be started on start-up, then it depends on <X-init>, which is provided by either of X-systemd, X-upstart, X-openrc or whatever. Then X-openrc depends on both X and <openrc>, where <openrc> is provided by either openrc itself, or another <init>'s | 06:06 |
|---|---|---|
| Oksanaa | shim to handle openrc-style init scripts. | 06:07 |
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| Juesto | Oksanaa: you're putting it in the form of freedesktop alternatives way :) | 06:11 |
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| * Oksanaa wonders how people do it now... | 06:12 | |
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| Juesto | Oksanaa: you can always start up X manually, and do the init's job if you wanted even | 06:16 |
| Maxdamantus | I'm happy not having X started by the init system, like on all my desktop/laptop machines. | 06:16 |
| Juesto | sometimes it's just necessary | 06:16 |
| * Maxdamantus just logs in through a getty-spawned login and does `exec startx`. | 06:17 | |
| Juesto | x is started by dsme which in turn is started by the init | 06:17 |
| Juesto | lol | 06:17 |
| Juesto | there's always a odd dependency regarding display :0 | 06:18 |
| Maxdamantus | things like screensaver and xmonad and some environment variables are just handled by my ~/.xinitrc | 06:18 |
| Juesto | also don't forget display managers | 06:18 |
| Maxdamantus | Yeah, I don't use a display manager on any of my systems. | 06:18 |
| Maxdamantus | maemo doesn't use one either, unless its using one for a very strange purpose. | 06:19 |
| Juesto | dsme is the controller | 06:19 |
| Juesto | and without x there's no maemo | 06:20 |
| Maxdamantus | anything depending on X should be started within X. | 06:20 |
| Maxdamantus | maemo doesn't seem to follow that principle, judging by the fact that lots of things seem to just force the `DISPLAY` variable. | 06:20 |
| Juesto | yes but then it doesn't attempt to start again if X fails to start and it's later started | 06:21 |
| Juesto | all manual at that point | 06:21 |
| Juesto | it depends on a X server started on the expected display | 06:22 |
| Maxdamantus | when X is started again, it will again load the programs that are part of the X session. | 06:22 |
| Maxdamantus | that will be whatever is in ~/.xinitrc, or howerver the normal X session mechanism works. | 06:22 |
| Juesto | .xinitrc is first then stuff in etc/X11 | 06:24 |
| Juesto | don't remember | 06:24 |
| Maxdamantus | .xinitrc is the only thing. | 06:24 |
| Juesto | no it doesn't start programs like that, not without rebooting | 06:25 |
| Maxdamantus | Right, but it should conform to the paradigm I've described, because that's what normal Linux-based systems do. | 06:25 |
| Maxdamantus | The init system doesn't keep respawning your pidgin program or something. | 06:26 |
| Maxdamantus | You can configure gnome/kde to start it when your gnome/kde session starts. | 06:26 |
| Juesto | sure, for the sake of functionality when something critical fails it should be brought back up and related processes too | 06:27 |
| Juesto | especially when the consumer is a noob at computers | 06:28 |
| Maxdamantus | If you want to reload X programs on crash, imo that should still be done within X. | 06:30 |
| Juesto | yes and maemo doesn't do that for it's services | 06:31 |
| Juesto | deficiency | 06:31 |
| Maxdamantus | a very crude way would be to just run a script that does `while ! some-program; do sleep 5; done` | 06:31 |
| Juesto | lol | 06:31 |
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| Juesto | . | 06:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ? | 12:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://paste.opensuse.org/57849888 -t --start-restart=<cmd> -c --max-count=N | 12:44 |
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