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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~tell vectis3_about lazyflashing | 00:14 |
|---|---|---|
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~tell vectis3_ about lazyflashing | 00:14 |
| KotCzarny | his usb ir probably broken, so. | 00:14 |
| KotCzarny | *is | 00:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | this will fix your bootloop | 00:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I don't see a proof or strong indication for a broken USB | 00:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | to check VBUS, you hold 'U' key while plugging in charger | 00:16 |
| KotCzarny | vectis, when you connect usb cable, do you get orange light? | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | to check USB D+/- you ideally connect the phone to a linux box while less +F /var/log/[messages|syslog} | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | to check VBUS, you hold 'U' key while plugging in charger - on a POWERED DOWN phone | 00:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you even rather remove battery, connect to charger, hold 'U', then insert battery. Then check if USB logo on NOKIa screen stays | 00:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what vectis3_ encounters is a very clear ~bootloop which first of all needs reflashing | 00:19 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ~lazyflashing | 00:20 |
| infobot | methinks lazyflashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#The_Lazy_Approach | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | use lazyflashing, according to the interactive instructions given, and see if it works | 00:20 |
| sixwheeledbeast | that flash it all script? | 00:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 00:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it en passant clears any R&D flags etc that may make the device behave funny when inserting battery | 00:22 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I am reading through it now, clear script I don't know why it wasn't thought of before :) | 00:26 |
| sixwheeledbeast | checks md5sums too | 00:26 |
| sixwheeledbeast | s/clear/clever/ | 00:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2016-08-20 Sat 22:22:30] <vectis3_> yes, thats correct. I have just tried it on my working phone to confirm that I am doing it correctly. [2016-08-20 Sat 22:24:06] <KotCzarny> might be broken usb port [2016-08-20 Sat 22:24:49] <sixwheeledbeast> :nod: possible | 00:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Nope, most likely the device boots as soon as you enter battery, and when you connect it to PC then the flasher can't talk to the bootloader anymore since the device already booted. All reboots in bootloop are warmboots afaik which don't involve NOLO | 00:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | use ~lazyflashing according to the instructions and most likely everything just fine :-) | 00:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: thanks | 00:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 00:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ((clever script)) it even has sufficient legalese and obfuscation to cover my ass from trolling lawyers ;-P | 00:31 |
| sixwheeledbeast | lazyflashing does look to be a fool proof method. Hold U while inserting battery was suggested | 00:32 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Personal use only... | 00:32 |
| sixwheeledbeast | strictlymyworkingdir :) | 00:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hehe | 00:32 |
| sixwheeledbeast | the things we do to keep maemo alive | 00:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | tbh I mainly developed it for myself since I'm lazy and testing a few dozen phones gets boring quickly | 00:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | soon I have to test another 40 | 00:34 |
| sixwheeledbeast | at least thats a potential 40 more neos | 00:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | eventually I need to put fiascogen to a purpose, to create a customized rootfs that runs tests automatically | 00:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (40 more neos) that's exactly the purpose | 00:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I wonder if I could turn the magic incantation >> (wget http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz -O - 2>/dev/null| tar xvz)&&cd maemo-my-private-workdir&&sudo ./flash-it-all.sh << into a file with name flashitallstart.sh and mimetype application/shellscript or whatever, so users on linux PC only click the icon and it starts a shell - DUH! :-o | 00:38 |
| sixwheeledbeast | :) | 00:39 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Only for the fact that you are doing a job 40x, makes writing a script efficient time. I guess many have only flashed there N900 a handful of times | 00:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I also pondered to include a `find / -name *fiasco*` or somesuch, plus some filepicker requester magic, but... meh! | 00:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hardcoded path ~/mymaemoworkdir ? | 00:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | still doesn't help with pre-downloaded fiasco files | 00:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | in the end I thought, in times where everybody and their dog has their own DSL internet, a 200 or 300MB download are just the easiest thing to do | 00:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nobody really cares if you did before already | 00:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and the more fanc<y stuff I add, the higher the odds something will fail on some weird PC of some clueless user | 00:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the libusb32 hack is fancy ;-P | 00:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and nost weird, seems to work | 00:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | most* | 00:46 |
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| vectis3_ | DocScrutinizer05: Thanks for the suggestion, will have to try it tomorrow. Phones in bits atm. | 01:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 01:29 |
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| vectis3_ | DocScrutinizer05: I couldn't wait. Still no luck though :( | 02:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, I need more info to reply | 02:03 |
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| vectis3_ | I downloaded your script and followed the instructions. I opted to flash all. Two bin files were downloaded and both were checked ok. phonet was disabled and then as instructed, I removed the battery from the phone, plugged in the usb cable and then replaced the battery. The phone instantly shows the nokia logo, but the "Suitable USB device not found, waiting." message remains on my laptop screen. | 02:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | this is an indication that your USB is defect or messed up then | 02:14 |
| KotCzarny | rly? | 02:14 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | could you please watch your syslog while plugging in (and inserting bat) the phone | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | KotCzarny: unlike you I'm not guessing or assuming | 02:15 |
| KotCzarny | he clearly said that flasher didnt see the device even on battery insert | 02:15 |
| KotCzarny | and no rd mode was set | 02:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I clearly said this is normal when the device is already powered up when connecting it | 02:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and he can't even know if R&D mode is set or not - aside from me wondering how that's relevant here | 02:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and no, I didn't read anything about battery insert while device is already connected | 02:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I only read 'device boots up instantly on battery insert' | 02:17 |
| KotCzarny | anyway, it works on charged battery, so at least he got a parts donor/chance to repair | 02:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no it doesn't work - it bootloops | 02:18 |
| KotCzarny | screen/body is ok | 02:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | meh, please shut up. You're definitely not helpful for vectis3_ | 02:19 |
| KotCzarny | he also stated he got it 'not working', and your arent helping either | 02:20 |
| KotCzarny | *you're | 02:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | aha | 02:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | at least I don't tell him shit | 02:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | btw why he? why not she? | 02:20 |
| KotCzarny | because there are no girls on the internet | 02:21 |
| KotCzarny | thats a rule old as irc | 02:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: you said you got a working N900 too, right? | 02:22 |
| vectis3_ | http://pastebin.com/1YwMQFGh | 02:23 |
| vectis3_ | yep, I have one that is working. | 02:23 |
| vectis3_ | And no girls here. | 02:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: please do a "sudo less +F /var/log/messages" (or /var/log/syslog when you're on debian or another distro that doesn't have messages) and then plug your powered down working phone to your PC and watch what the diagnostic print in syslog. Then compare to the problem device | 02:24 |
| KotCzarny | hmm, differnt serial numbers | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | aah, you already did | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: this pastebin looks like a perfectly working N900 | 02:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | though it actually looks like two devices plugged in, bith already powered up | 02:26 |
| KotCzarny | btw. those numbers are old, were you connecting your old n900 few hours ago? | 02:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or rather (from serial number) same device pluged in twice in a row, while already powered up | 02:27 |
| vectis3_ | Ah, yes. I've had both plugged in. | 02:28 |
| KotCzarny | disconnect both, connect only new one | 02:28 |
| KotCzarny | check if it shows up | 02:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/PC_syslog_of_USB_enum for reference | 02:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Product: Nokia USB ROM is supposed to be bootloader | 02:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which is needed for flasher | 02:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Product: Nokia N900 (Update mode) too - second stage bootloader | 02:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Product: N900 (Storage Mode) is booted maemo already | 02:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: your log seems to lack the Nokia USB ROM which means it didn't coldboot when connected | 02:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so did you really first plug the phone to USB PC and *then* insert battery? | 02:34 |
| vectis3_ | ok, when I plug in the non-working phone, nothing shows. | 02:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-/ | 02:34 |
| KotCzarny | try cold boot | 02:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's pretty much a proof of USB (or cable) dead | 02:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and ignore KotCzarny, there's no such thing he suggests. There's only "insert battery *after* plugging phone to PC" | 02:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | all phones with working CPU and USB need to show Nokia USB ROM on that battery insertion | 02:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | all N900 phones, that is | 02:36 |
| vectis3_ | lol, ok. I have definately been inserting the battery after plugging in the usb cable. | 02:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | then your USB is defect | 02:37 |
| vectis3_ | ok. thanks for the help. | 02:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yw | 02:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbfix | 02:37 |
| infobot | i guess usbfix is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=75920 - and **NEVER** use epoxy (unless you want to seal your device for underwater), or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYz5nIHH0iY#t=1866, you will basically need two irons: a small good one (or better hot-air reflow) and a 60+ Watt | 02:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | also visually inspect the contacts of USB receptacle, often there's just debris or oxidation or somesuch | 02:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wtah *might* help is carefully and gently setting the phone so it rests with USB plug on a tachbox. So the weight of phone alone (DO NOT press on screen or kbd or anything) slightly bends the USB plug and jack | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what* | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and matchbox | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | do not apply more force that the weight of N900 would do in such situation. More force won't fix things, it will break them more | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: ^^^ | 02:41 |
| vectis3_ | ok, that popped up the following: usb usb8-port2: Cannot enable. Maybe the USB cable is bad? | 02:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | also don't miss to try boot the device with kbd slider and camera door open, and while pressing camera trigger and vol+ button. Some users might have installed stuff that breaks out of the bootloop into whatever service mode, e.g. backupmenu would detect open slider and get you to a menu where you could enter a shell to fix stuff | 02:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, seen bad usb cables a dozen times or more | 02:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | from here on you're basically on your own (except for actual soldering howto etc), I provided all the known info/help relevant for your case | 02:46 |
| vectis3_ | I don't believe its the cable, it works fine with my other phone. Was thinking that pressing on the usb port as you suggested, made some sort of contact. | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | maybe repeat a few times. Eventually you might be lucky | 02:49 |
| KotCzarny | yeah, break the port more | 02:49 |
| KotCzarny | its helping | 02:49 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | STFU! | 02:49 |
| KotCzarny | you are not helping him, if he breaks the pads | 02:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you're not helping when he explodes reading such shit | 02:50 |
| KotCzarny | you are drunk pushy bully | 02:51 |
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| *** KotCzarny was kicked by DocScrutinizer05 (T900: "User terminated!") | 02:51 | |
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| KotCzarny | idiot. | 02:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: try placing the device on matchbox with screen down | 02:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: but long term you'll need ~usbfix anyway, unless your cable is a very special breed that works only with your old N900 but not the new one | 02:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | odds are your N900's usb receptacle is about to come off the PCB | 02:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | alas a known issue | 02:57 |
| vectis3_ | It seemed solid when I took it apart earlier. Not to worry though, I bought it for spare parts and thats what I have got. Thanks for all the help and suggestions. | 02:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~unplug-usb | 02:59 |
| infobot | unplug-usb is probably http://maemo.cloud-7.de/share-service/20140721_002.mp4 | 02:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | people known to break their USB receptacles when not taking care by e.g. following the procedure in this video | 03:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: it seems solid until it falls off the PCB :-) Doesn't mean it's not defect already | 03:01 |
| Wizzup | vectis3_: if you're unlucky the traces are gone | 03:01 |
| Wizzup | then spare parts do not help a lot | 03:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Wizzup: >>I bought it for spare parts<< | 03:02 |
| Wizzup | Ah, sorry | 03:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | np :-) | 03:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ; /msg nickserv info bencoh | 03:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | damn konversation! | 03:16 |
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| bencoh | DocScrutinizer05: hmmm ? :) | 09:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, accidental highlight | 09:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I tested "scripting" in konversation | 09:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | happened to use your nick in userlist to test my whois-info quickbutton | 09:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | meanwhile I'm doing more ambitioned stuff that finally ended with somebody pointing me at https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=114237#c12 and the general shortcomings of konversation when it comes to scripting | 09:22 |
| povbot_ | Bug 114237: was not found. | 09:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | #c11 (above) is also very much to the point | 09:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ((quickbuttons)) just if you wonder: it's defined to do /WHOIS %s,%%u%n/msg nickserv info %u%n now, %n being the trick | 09:26 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | Reading over what happened early is vectis3_ using 64bit OS or a USB hub? | 10:27 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I had similar issue using the front USB port on my desktop instead of the rear ones for example. | 10:28 |
| sixwheeledbeast | If the flasher is known to flash another device this will not be the case, but just a thought | 10:30 |
| KotCzarny | worth a try | 10:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: a hub or low quality hostport/cable/whatever will usually result in lots of -101 errors in syslog | 10:50 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ok | 10:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | could also be -78 or whatever, though I seem to recall -101 was most common | 10:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | usb 5-1: device descriptor read/64, error -71 | 11:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and eventually hub 5-0:5.1: unable to enumerate USB device | 11:03 |
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| Youbi | Hello all o/ | 14:03 |
| CatButts | uhllo | 14:05 |
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| fishbulb | how can I watch youtube on an n900? | 14:17 |
| KotCzarny | cutetube2 | 14:18 |
| fishbulb | there's a sequel? | 14:18 |
| fishbulb | which repo is it in? | 14:19 |
| KotCzarny | probably extras-devel | 14:20 |
| fishbulb | and it does work? | 14:20 |
| KotCzarny | few months ago it worked, i dont use it, so you just have to install it and check | 14:20 |
| fishbulb | cutetube doesn't anymore | 14:20 |
| KotCzarny | did i say cutetube or cutetube2? | 14:20 |
| bencoh | cutetube2 does work | 14:21 |
| fishbulb | please don't hit me! | 14:21 |
| bencoh | ah that reminds me marxoft killed the local videos plugin | 14:22 |
| bencoh | marxian* | 14:22 |
| KotCzarny | bencoh, why so? | 14:22 |
| bencoh | (well actually he didn't fully re-implement external plugin support with his new plugin system) | 14:22 |
| bencoh | so afaict it doesn't work thus far | 14:23 |
| bencoh | the thing is he's not on irc so .... | 14:23 |
| bencoh | (discussing that kind of stuff on TMO isn't exacctly handy) | 14:23 |
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| Youbi | youtube-dl does work. | 15:17 |
| Youbi | It’s cli, though. You have to open yt in the web browser, get the URL, and download the video. | 15:17 |
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| atk | Any way to test if a physical key is working on the N900 (or does anyone have any ideas why my ctrl, fn, shift, t, down arrow and right arrow keys stopped working? | 19:33 |
| APic | Maybe Dirt stuck under the physical Keyboard. On my Replacement-N900 i recently received per physical Snail-Mail, some Keys are stuck because of Dirt stuck under the physical Keys. So when my current N900 will stop working (i hope never) i will have to screw it up, shake the Dirt out, and then reassemble. | 19:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: see http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Subsystems#Keyboard | 21:10 |
| atk | APic: I have taken it apart a few times now, no dirt found | 21:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | looks like your QROW4 is dead, for whatever reasons | 21:10 |
| atk | Yep | 21:10 |
| atk | hmm | 21:10 |
| atk | I did get a tiny amount of water on the keys on friday, it was raining | 21:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: if you like (logical) puzzles, you might read my explanation about key ghosting aka rollover in http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Subsystems#Keyboard and maybe exploit that to determine what's actually wrong with QROW4 | 21:12 |
| atk | I was just reading that, indeed. | 21:13 |
| atk | Seems interesting. | 21:13 |
| atk | So there is no diode for each key? | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no, not in N900 | 21:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no diodes at all | 21:16 |
| atk | Well, certainly the actual physical keys are all working fine, I can cause ghosting using the keys in row 4 | 21:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | with N-Key rollover you should be able to determine if QROW4 is disconnected from chip (broken trace) so no signal reaches chip, or if QROW4 is shorted to GND or whatever and thus will short other QROWs to GND as well with N-key rollover | 21:18 |
| atk | For example fn+ctrl + h gives me hj | 21:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | when pressing Shift+T+X you should see X+E when QROW4 floating (broken solder joint or trace), and you see no keypress at all (after initial settling) when QROW4 is shorted to GND | 21:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, fn+ctrl+h ->j means your QROW4 is floating | 21:23 |
| atk | ah, it appears there must be a broken solder joint or trace. | 21:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 21:23 |
| atk | Darn | 21:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry | 21:24 |
| atk | I would need to remove the domesheet and attempt to inspect the board I presume? | 21:24 |
| atk | Unless it goes to an internal layer, but I can't image how that would break. | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | might help, might fail | 21:24 |
| atk | I guess I did only pay £40 for this N900 :P | 21:25 |
| atk | It has lasted me a year (although I only started using it not long ago) | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | odds are a ball of TPS65950 aka GAIA aka TWL4030 came loose | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or a via broke | 21:25 |
| atk | :( | 21:25 |
| atk | If it's a ball, I could test it by applying pressure to the chip. | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/Gallery-N900-exploded/platine_01.jpeg | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 21:27 |
| atk | It appears there are a few chips on there that are BGA chips | 21:27 |
| atk | Any idea which one? | 21:27 |
| atk | (also, most of those are under a shield) | 21:28 |
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| *** flo_lap is now known as florian | 21:28 | |
| atk | Well I certainly do plan on using an N900 until the Neo900 comes, so any idea where I can get a good relatively cheap refurbished / new replacement? (I don't mind if it's more than £40, that was a deal of a lifetime I feel) | 21:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dang, QROW4 is *not* via ESD chip Z4302, that would have been a great chance for an easy fix, one way or another | 21:31 |
| atk | :( | 21:32 |
| atk | Is the shield soldered down or is it a press fit between a shield fence thing (metal bit around the periphery) and a lid? | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | check ownta,com | 21:32 |
| atk | It looks like the latter. | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, shiled can opening is a zen thing | 21:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you need to carefully pry it open, latch by latch, with a pinpoint tiny knife or something. Takes easily 10 min per lid | 21:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | start at a corner | 21:34 |
| atk | 109 USD, and that comes up to around £108 after conversion + tax + paperwork | 21:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yup | 21:35 |
| atk | I have some fine point tweezers, will they work? | 21:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | at least I already used ownta, they seem to be no scam | 21:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (tweezers) if you don't mind to ruin them, yes | 21:35 |
| atk | Do they give any warranty? | 21:35 |
| atk | Ah, I'd rather not ruin them. | 21:35 |
| atk | I use them for doing fiddly electronics things. | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I think the ususal DOA warranty, yes | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: http://wstaw.org/m/2016/08/21/plasma-desktopNQ2277.png TWL5030 | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | get Nokia_N900_RX-51_Schematics.pdf | 21:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxuaXRkcm9pZHxneDo0ZDBkZThmOGFiZThlNmU0 for example | 21:40 |
| atk | success! | 21:45 |
| atk | That really did take about 10 minutes | 21:45 |
| atk | But the shield looks like I haven't even touched it. | 21:45 |
| atk | Hmm... Is this some kind of tiered design? | 21:45 |
| atk | (for the big chip on the right) | 21:46 |
| atk | nope, no amount of light tapping or pressure appears to allow any kind of t to appear on the screen of xterm | 21:49 |
| atk | Well, I am certainly confused as to how this came to be. But I can guess that unfortunately there's not much I can do about it. | 21:50 |
| atk | DocScrutinizer05: Another question: do the refurbished N900s come with a supercap to replace the battery out of the box? | 21:51 |
| atk | Or will I need to replace the battery after a year too? | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I guess you should replace it right away, I'm pretty sure they didn't fix that | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I admit I didn't even test bupbat on the refurbs I got so far | 21:54 |
| atk | I guess I'll just remove it when it fails (I don't even really need it that much) | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no surprise since I'll kick out the mobos and fit in NeoN boards anyway | 21:54 |
| atk | I don't take the battery out and when I do I have the device set to receive the time from the network. | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: same here | 21:55 |
| atk | I presume the NeoN doesn't have the issue of a leaky hard wired battery and uses a durable supercap instead/ | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, of course :-D | 21:56 |
| atk | I wonder, the N900 apparently also had some issues with balls cracking for the chip which deals with the sim card (and sim cards randomly losing connectivity) | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://neo900.org/stuff/block-diagrams/neo900/neo900.html | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hover over "backup battery" | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: yes | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the dreaded No-SIM bug | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~springfix | 21:58 |
| infobot | hmm... springfix is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1243160#post1243160 and http://www.jabawok.net/?p=14 | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ((chip which deals with the sim card)) aka Modem aka BB5 aka Rapuyama and friends | 21:59 |
| atk | Was it a chip issue? | 22:00 |
| atk | Or a manufacturing issue? | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | solder points snapping open is my wild guess | 22:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | manuf issue with reflow temperature profile or somesuch, which also might be culprit of several of the USB-loose issues | 22:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or maybe not temp profile but a simple sloppy solderpase stencil print | 22:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | IOW too few solderpaste | 22:02 |
| atk | Have you guys done any durability tests on the USB (it has been a constant fear of mine for the N900 :P) | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm using several N900 since they 'were born' and never had any USB incident | 22:03 |
| atk | (For the Neo900) | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and I actually didn't reinforce my USB | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Neo900 will use a different design that makes it wirtually impossible for USB kack to come off | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Neo900 will use a different design that makes it virtually impossible for USB jack to come off | 22:04 |
| atk | Cool | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bizzword through hole | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | damn, my typing sucks. lack of caffeine | 22:05 |
| atk | Ah, very cool. | 22:05 |
| atk | Hmm. | 22:05 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: can you use a microusb cable to fling a neo900 without the musb port breaking | 22:06 |
| atk | I wonder, you know how USB specifies that A is for the host and B is for the device? And apparently phones which support OTG are supposed to use micro AB? | 22:06 |
| atk | Do phones that support OTG actually use micro AB? | 22:06 |
| kerio | atk: yeah but nobody ever cared about that | 22:06 |
| kerio | i think | 22:06 |
| kerio | starting from the samsung galaxy s...3? | 22:07 |
| atk | I've been wondering this ever since I got a device which came with a "OTG" cable for plugging it into a phone. | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: yes, Neo900 uses micro-AB | 22:07 |
| atk | the cable is B on both sides | 22:07 |
| kerio | which had a musb B plug - usb A port adapter | 22:07 |
| kerio | atk: the op pyra has an actual microusb 3 A port | 22:08 |
| kerio | it looks super dumb | 22:08 |
| atk | I wonder why the USB-IF doesn't get unnecessarily angry about it :P | 22:08 |
| kerio | because samsung? | 22:08 |
| atk | I guess | 22:08 |
| atk | They seem to have completely done away with the A B stuff with usb C which appears to be both without needing an AB variant. | 22:09 |
| atk | It probably still has an ID pin I presume. | 22:09 |
| atk | Although, oddly enough I have a Teensy 3.2 which supports switching between device and host mode but doesn't seem to detect if it is being used as a host with an ID pin | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fsck USB, next year they will replace mains outlets worldwide by USB-E | 22:10 |
| atk | I guess the ID pin isn't actually needed. | 22:10 |
| atk | Heh | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) | 22:11 |
| atk | I wouldn't be surprised. | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: in N900 it would have been friggin mad useful if used correctly | 22:11 |
| atk | I also wonder if usb C will have the same issue that apple's lightning connector has | 22:11 |
| atk | i.e. breaking after a single use | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | LOL, didn't hear that | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sounds convenient... for apple | 22:12 |
| atk | I know a few apple users (who complain about apple but still use it) who are always going on about the new connectors. | 22:12 |
| atk | No matter if you purchase from apple or not, the connectors have about a week of lifetime in them. | 22:12 |
| atk | sometimes you're lucky and get a month, sometimes you're unlucky and get a day. | 22:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ouch | 22:13 |
| atk | I have no idea how they've engineered a design that can't be implemented in a reliable way. | 22:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | micro-USB is basically rather sturdy regarding this. Way better than mini-USB | 22:14 |
| atk | But I guess it was probably on purpose, I mean apple don't seem to have managed to design a laptop which doesn't have one fundamental flaw (as can be seen from louis rossman's videos) | 22:14 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 needs coffee | 22:15 | |
| atk | Coffee is good | 22:15 |
| atk | Especially freshly ground coffee. | 22:15 |
| atk | With some cow extract and just enough sugar (less than half a teaspoon) to break through the bitterness. | 22:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | cow juice that is | 22:16 |
| atk | Brewed with hot but not boiled or boiling water. | 22:16 |
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| atk | Just before boil (white boil as some call it) | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wow, an expert. I'm an ignorant | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | basically I was a tea person | 22:17 |
| atk | Or you can use an old fashioned coffee machine which manages to get the temperature perfect using the integrated pot warming water boiling water pumping design. | 22:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | switxched to coffee because... lazyness | 22:17 |
| dkbrz | therw when tey grow it, they sez milk and sugar is for killing the taste of bad coffee | 22:17 |
| atk | In fact, those coffee machines are pretty amazing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j4Q_YBRJEI | 22:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dbthey also have a saying that there are two qualities of coffee they sell, the global good one and the crap for Germany where nobody cares | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: ^^^ | 22:19 |
| atk | :P | 22:21 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 changes his mind | 22:21 | |
| * DocScrutinizer05 prepares some 10EurCt/g fine tea instead some crappy instant coffee | 22:22 | |
| atk | Tea can be very good too. | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | also need fewer cow juice to be tasty | 22:22 |
| atk | It's also seems easier to get right. | 22:22 |
| atk | It doesn't need any cow extract! Just lemon | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | basically yes | 22:23 |
| atk | Nobody here in the UK seems to know about tea with lemon | 22:23 |
| atk | Everyone seems to prefer the tea with cow extract. | 22:23 |
| KotCzarny | isnt that actually german invention? | 22:23 |
| KotCzarny | bavarian etc | 22:24 |
| dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: I buy some coffee via Germany :) it's a bit of politics, but 'Estrella Negra' via aroma-zapatista.de is good :) | 22:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, some few sources here know and trade good coffee | 22:26 |
| atk | The black market? | 22:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | however what 99% of unwashed masses consome is the junk from production | 22:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Eduscho, Tchibo, even Moevenpick are basically crap | 22:27 |
| sicelo | KotCzarny: by the way, oscp uses gstreamer for general audio playback, or only when processing videos? | 22:30 |
| atk | Hmm I found a 12 month warranty "grade A" n900 for £80 on ebay | 22:30 |
| KotCzarny | only for playing videos, when disabled it decodes audio via libav | 22:30 |
| atk | (I know, ebay, paypal scum) | 22:31 |
| atk | Lacks charger and cables | 22:34 |
| KotCzarny | stolen? | 22:35 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 22:35 |
| atk | I would be very sad if someone stole my N900 | 22:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not like it would really matter, those chargers are legion and allegedly genuine Nokia are cheap | 22:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but sounds weird for a "grade A" n900 | 22:37 |
| atk | DocScrutinizer05: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361628670128 | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | an AV-cable is of higher value than a cheesy USB charger | 22:38 |
| KotCzarny | atk, try craigslist | 22:39 |
| KotCzarny | and other local classifieds sites | 22:39 |
| atk | Does the Ownta one come with an av cable? | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | atk: looks good | 22:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (Ownta) nope | 22:41 |
| atk | craigslist.org -> N900 -> prebuilt pc | 22:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not afaik | 22:41 |
| atk | Well, unless I can find something cheaper locally, I'll just go for that. | 22:42 |
| atk | If they can get it here within the week I can even collect it | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.amazon.com/Nokia-Video-Video-Out-Cable-CA-75U/dp/B0026H9HN6 waaay too expensive, you can find cheaper ones though. And you need only one or two anyway | 22:43 |
| atk | Hmm, apparently this craigslist thing has a "prohibited button" which lets random people on the internet irreversibly flag a posting for deletion. | 22:44 |
| atk | So I may have irreversibly flagged this poor guy's listing for deletion. | 22:44 |
| atk | I have no idea why such a feature exists. | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.amazon.com/HDE-3-5mm-Composite-Audio-Video/dp/B00GO4EPKC/ref=pd_sim_sbs_107_10 | 22:45 |
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| KotCzarny | atk, they still check it before deletion i think | 22:46 |
| atk | It seems like even if the post doesn't break guidelines, you have to repost it :P | 22:46 |
| atk | I don't know, I see buttons on a website and I always have an urge to click them all. | 22:47 |
| KotCzarny | dangerous habit | 22:47 |
| atk | Not at all. | 22:47 |
| atk | What are other "craigslist" style websites for the UK? | 22:48 |
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| atk | ah, that was it "gumtree" | 22:48 |
| KotCzarny | yeah | 22:48 |
| atk | https://www.gumtree.com/p/nokia/nokia-n900-phone-linux-phone/1184138244 | 22:49 |
| KotCzarny | good deal if true | 22:50 |
| atk | Manchester though | 22:50 |
| atk | I don't have a car | 22:50 |
| KotCzarny | but i always suspect 'no charger no cable' to be stolen goods | 22:50 |
| atk | The bus ticket to get there would cost more than the phone | 22:50 |
| KotCzarny | up to you | 22:51 |
| atk | It comes with the AV cable though :PO | 22:51 |
| KotCzarny | and a box | 22:51 |
| atk | AV cable and 2 BL-5J | 22:51 |
| KotCzarny | and a box | 22:51 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 22:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (AV cable) however watch out! AHS vs normal pinout https://www.amazon.com/review/R1E5TR0T16E6YG/ref=cm_cr_dp_title?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B00GO4EPKC&channel=detail-glance&nodeID=172282&store=electronics | 22:51 |
| KotCzarny | atk, you might search for few more classifieds sites | 22:53 |
| atk | I have no experience with these :P | 22:54 |
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| KotCzarny | google? | 22:54 |
| KotCzarny | try: nokia n900 <your city> | 22:54 |
| atk | (Actually, I would need to take a train to get to manchester, that would definitely end up costing at least as much as I paid for my current N900 | 22:55 |
| atk | Hmm, nope (google doesn't usually update that fast anyway) | 22:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | don't you have parcels in UK? | 22:55 |
| atk | Nope | 22:56 |
| atk | :P | 22:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | o.O | 22:56 |
| atk | (of course we do | 22:56 |
| KotCzarny | google updates FAST | 22:56 |
| KotCzarny | you would be surprised | 22:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I think for GBP10 plus a 5 for parcel shipping you can't go wrong | 22:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I need to test a script ;-) | 22:58 |
| atk | Gumtree appears to insist that shipping items is a bad idea though. | 22:58 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer05 | 22:58 | |
| *** DocScrutinizer05 was kicked by DocScrutinizer05 (T900: "User terminated!") | 22:58 | |
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| KotCzarny | yeah, you can get a potato | 22:58 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 22:58 |
| KotCzarny | and you wouldnt have anything to do about it | 22:59 |
| atk | Of course | 22:59 |
| KotCzarny | s/wouldnt have/couldnt do/ | 23:00 |
| infobot | KotCzarny meant: and you couldnt do anything to do about it | 23:00 |
| KotCzarny | uh. but you know what i mean | 23:00 |
| atk | That makes less sense. | 23:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nfc how that craigslist stuff works, but can't you contact seller, possibly *after* purchase? | 23:00 |
| KotCzarny | also, those classifieds are all about dealing locally | 23:01 |
| atk | I think what black cat means is that if the seller decides to take your money and run, you can't do much. | 23:01 |
| KotCzarny | face to face | 23:01 |
| KotCzarny | which city you are in? | 23:01 |
| atk | I have always wondered about your name KotCzarny, even in polish CzarnyKot is more common than KotCzarny. | 23:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | whatever... | 23:01 |
| atk | Nottingham | 23:01 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 sips his tea | 23:02 | |
| atk | (It's a more common way of saying black cat, I mean) | 23:02 |
| atk | (Of course, since Polish is.... Polish... "Kot Czarny" is still perfectly ok.) | 23:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | black cat? ooh | 23:03 |
| atk | It's what Kot Czarny means in polish. | 23:03 |
| KotCzarny | try https://www.google.pl/#hl=en&q=%22Nottingham%22+classifieds | 23:04 |
| atk | Why is it called a "classified" ad? | 23:05 |
| KotCzarny | who knows, english is my second language | 23:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (OT) >>Others will have to wait until we fix bug #114119<< (https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=114237#c3) *awesome* | 23:06 |
| povbot_ | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/114119 was not found. | 23:06 |
| povbot_ | Bug 114237: was not found. | 23:06 |
| KotCzarny | try m-w.com for definitions | 23:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | povbot_: shut up! | 23:06 |
| povbot_ | DocScrutinizer05: Error: "shut" is not a valid command. | 23:06 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 ponders to pester mgedmin to fix this useless function | 23:07 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | 'classified' like 'XXX rated' ;-P | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classified_advertising | 23:09 |
| atk | ah, classified in the "sorted into classifications" sense | 23:10 |
| atk | I thought that might be the case | 23:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | product group classifications? | 23:14 |
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| atk | service classifications too | 23:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nfc | 23:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | maybe it doesn't matter anymore. Prolly a term that meanwhile lost its original meaning and gained a new unique one | 23:16 |
| atk | KotCzarny: Well, none of the ones on the first page have any N900 listings | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | when you dig deep enough you will find more than 50% of words are of this type | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | chauvinism | 23:17 |
| KotCzarny | atk, browsing ads is similar to hunting, you have to spend some time before you get your prize | 23:18 |
| KotCzarny | might take some time if game is alredy rare :P | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lost its meaning in common usage, rather used as an almost synonym to sexism | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there are lost more | 23:19 |
| dkbrz | hmm... maybe someone is aware of existing rx51-us console keymaps which would resemble standard maemo keyboard behaviour with toggless stickiness? looks like everybody are using https://raw.githubusercontent.com/archlinuxarm-n900/n900-keymaps/master/rx51_us.map | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? | 23:20 |
| dkbrz | it's difficult to type when you need several fingers :) | 23:20 |
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| atk | KotCzarny: Can I pay you £10 to hunt for me? :P | 23:21 |
| KotCzarny | atk, n900 is PLENTY in .pl usually priced between 10 and 20 quids | 23:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~listvalues vi.*kbd | 23:21 |
| infobot | Factoid search of 'vi.*kbd' by value returned no results. | 23:21 |
| atk | Well, hmm, I guess I am visiting poland in a few weeks. | 23:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~listvalues vi*kbd | 23:22 |
| infobot | Factoid search of 'vi*kbd' by value (4): vi-kbd ;; n900-kbd-mapping ;; #maemo kbd ;; #maemo awesome-keymap. | 23:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~awesome-keymap | 23:22 |
| infobot | methinks awesome-keymap is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping | 23:22 |
| atk | Maybe I can hold out with the softkeyboard | 23:22 |
| * atk throws up at the thought of softkeys) | 23:22 | |
| dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: it's about using it outside maemo - like debian900 or rescueOS-like on pure console tty, without x | 23:23 |
| KotCzarny | grab some cheapo bt kb? | 23:23 |
| atk | Although, when I am going to Poland I will be going to the middle of nowhere effectively. | 23:24 |
| dkbrz | KotCzarny: I use n900 because of the keyboard :)) | 23:24 |
| atk | Not like Warszawa or Bydgoszcz or somewhere big, but a small place near Ełk | 23:24 |
| KotCzarny | dkbrz, sorry, that was meant to atk ;) | 23:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard | 23:24 |
| KotCzarny | atk, you will still go through airport in warsaw | 23:24 |
| KotCzarny | plan your journey before and contact the potential seller, or buy via parcel | 23:25 |
| atk | Well, apparently not, apparently there's an airport in Olsztyn | 23:25 |
| KotCzarny | or if you'll be staying at friends/family place make them do the deal | 23:25 |
| atk | Flights from london apparently can get there | 23:25 |
| atk | Ah, buy via parcel, yes, excellent idea | 23:26 |
| atk | Any reliable place to buy from which can get me a good deal? (good condition and all, don't care if there's a battery or not, recently bought a procell replacement) | 23:26 |
| KotCzarny | olx.pl (but requires knowing language) | 23:27 |
| KotCzarny | and allegro.pl | 23:27 |
| atk | I know polish | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: ((standard maemo keyboard behaviour with toggless stickiness)) please elaborate | 23:29 |
| atk | "Sprzedam lub zamienię telefon Nokia N900!" - "Will sell or exchange Nokia N900 phone!" exchange?? | 23:29 |
| atk | People exchange phones? | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep, for chainsaws | 23:29 |
| atk | 210 pln is already very cheap | 23:29 |
| KotCzarny | nah, go for ~100pln range | 23:30 |
| KotCzarny | you can get a deal | 23:30 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 tries to decode "toggless stickiness" | 23:30 | |
| atk | All I actually need is a new mainboard | 23:31 |
| KotCzarny | look for bad screen ones, they show up sometimes | 23:31 |
| KotCzarny | you have few weeks | 23:31 |
| dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: In Maemo whan I press blie arrow with one finger, and release it, and then press T/5 key, I get '5'. In console i need to press blue arrow and T simultaneoulsy to get '5'. | 23:34 |
| dkbrz | toggle - next key is 5. sticky - all keys are 5 | 23:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | dbalas that's a maemo closed blob doing that | 23:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: dang your nick puzzles me | 23:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 23:36 |
| dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: it's russian for porcupine :) | 23:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | aaah russian, that explains why the char sequences are just breaking my fingers (and tongue if I'd try to speak it) | 23:38 |
| dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: ok then' i'll try to reimplement it via standard means and put it on github if ok. just being lazy, hoping someone already did it for me :( | 23:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure ok :-D | 23:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | alas nobody dared to touch that stuff so far, not even jonwil | 23:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | weird | 23:39 |
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| atk | http://olx.pl/oferta/malowanie-obudowy-telefonu-np-nokia-n900-CID619-IDc3FSd.html#a7ef6ca056 | 23:57 |
| fishbulb | does anyone have a confirmed working version of fmms | 23:57 |
| atk | I am not sure about orange, but apparently the N900 is so popular in poland that people offer to paint it. | 23:57 |
| fishbulb | anything can be painted :) | 23:58 |
| dkbrz | omg. orange. | 23:58 |
| atk | fishbulb: oh yes, but this ad is specifically about the N900 :P | 23:59 |
| dkbrz | i've seen it before. in 'Hackers' movie. where zero-cool paints his keyboard in camouflage... | 23:59 |
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