IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2016-01-11

jonwilok so you only have 4 lines in your hildon-application-manager.list?00:01
jonwilthe 2 linenoise ones and the 2 extras ones?00:01
jonwilI mean ones00:01
fishbulbI don't know if they're all listed twice00:01
fishbulbnow I do, yeah, there are 500:02
jonwilso the 5 you have are the 2 linenoise ones?00:03
jonwiland then 3 for
fishbulbcommunity extras extras-testing    <-- for maemo.org00:03
fishbulband the two linenoise ones00:03
fishbulbit doesn't make sense00:03
jonwilok, you want to remove the one that says extras-testing00:03
fishbulbwait there could be some in fapman00:04
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jonwilanyhow, having extras-testing enabled is why your getting the wrong version of fmms00:04
fishbulbnope I depeted all the repos00:04
jonwilok so delete the extras-testing from sources.list.d and then reinstall fmms00:05
fishbulbI'll just disable it in app manager00:05
jonwilyeah do that00:05
jonwilthen reinstall fmms and see if that fixes your problem00:06
fishbulbI will do so immediately00:06
fishbulbapp manager is really slow00:07
fishbulbalthough for a "phone" that would have been in school for 2 years now it's not too bad00:07
fishbulbif it was a child.00:07
fishbulbhey should I apt-get update00:08
jonwilI would rather keep my N900 that use a Galaxy S6 or an iPhone 6S00:08
fishbulbI would rather use this, because I can keep it to texts calls and gps00:08
fishbulbthere's no facebook alerts, or other bullshit, constant dinging crap00:08
fishbulbit failed again00:10
fishbulbit tried to download an mms that failed00:11
jonwilyou deleted and reinstalled fmms?00:11
jonwilwhat version does it say its running now?00:11
fishbulband it came up with the contents still00:12
jonwilwhich is the right version for extras (non-testing/non-devel)00:12
jonwilwell I am out of ideas but at least you dont have any bogus repos there now00:12
fishbulbyeah. I'm thinking this should work. maybe the ones that were sent to the broken one won't open00:13
jonwili.e. anything you shouldn't have00:13
fishbulbyeah thanks for the help00:13
jonwilnever used fmms myself (never ever sent or received an MMS actually)00:13
fishbulbI'm pretty sure I did apt-get upgrade with the testing repo in there00:13
fishbulbI have to because everyone else with a phone does that all the time00:13
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jonwilwell you have the correct fmms version anyhway00:14
fishbulblike I use this phone to communicate with non tech people00:14
fishbulbI can send a picture to myself00:14
jonwilyeah if other people use mms then yes you need to :)00:14
fishbulbI'm not about to buy a wafer thin quadcore thing that goes flat in 4 hours00:15
jonwilthe physical keyboard on the N900 is the best I have used on any mobile device00:16
fishbulbI think it's the only one I've used?00:16
jonwiland much easier to type with than the crappy virtual keyboard on iPhones and etc00:16
fishbulbseriously even a mouse is easier to type with00:17
fishbulbsmudgy bullshit00:17
fishbulbthat needs serious processing power to predict all the failures that always happen00:17
jonwilI will keep using my N900 until one of 3 things happens:1.I somehow manage to get myself a Neo900 2.My N900 dies and cant be fixed or 3.I am unable to use my N900 anymore because of changes made by my cellular carrier or something00:17
fishbulbwhy would it stop working?00:18
jonwilthe carrier might switch frequency bands00:18
jonwilor I may need to switch carriers for some reason00:18
fishbulbwell I think only japan has abandoned gsm00:19
fishbulb3g won't disappear for another decade or two00:19
jonwilyeah but some carriers use (or might use) 3G frequency bands that the N900 cant do00:20
jonwili.e. 850MHz UMTS00:20
jonwilOne carrier uses it exclusively00:20
jonwiland other carriers are potentially going to use it00:20
jonwiland yes the carriers in Australia are looking at getting rid of GSM so they can have even more bandwidth for high-capacity LTE00:20
jonwilor whatever00:20
fishbulbwell gsm is the obvious one to go00:21
fishbulbthat's only half of this phone though00:21
jonwilyeah but like I said, it may be that I end up forced onto UMTS 85000:21
jonwilfor some reason00:21
jonwilwhich is when I would need to stop using my N90000:21
jonwilbut hey, until that (unlikely) event happens, I can keep using it :)00:22
fishbulbare you in australia?00:22
jonwilyes I am00:22
fishbulbyeah same00:22
jonwilwhich carrier are you with?00:22
jonwilI am with TPG (who use the Vodafone network)00:23
jonwilTPG used to use the Optus network but then they did a deal with Vodafone00:23
keriojonwil: i think i'll stop using the n900 soonish :\00:26
kerioneo900 costs almost more than a car00:27
kerioand n900 has awful specs to do anything except IRC00:27
fishbulbI can absolutely buy a working car for the price of the neo90000:27
Wizzup_Maybe go to #cars instead00:27
fishbulba working road legal car that would get me across the country00:27
bencohkerio: *00:28
keriodo note that it's not in any way a criticism of the neo90000:28
kerioi understand where the price is coming from00:28
kerioit's just too much for me :(00:28
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fishbulbwhy would it matter if it was a criticism?00:29
fishbulbit's more expensive than most other phones that exist00:30
kerioso what00:30
keriothat's like complaining that a concept car costs more than a house00:31
fishbulbI've built a touring car that "should" have cost as much as a house00:31
fishbulband cost me less than the worst new car you can find00:31
fishbulbnot worst, I mean cheapest00:32
jonwilMy 2 main wishes for the N900 right now are to improve the security of the N900 (which I am doing my best to help with) and a better browser that can visit more modern websites (e.g.
jonwilbut that last part isn't vital since I can still visit 99% of the sites I actually want to visit when I am out and about00:33
fishbulbI never bother visiting sites00:33
fishbulbthe screen is tiny and awful, the sites mostly have to be mobile ones00:34
fishbulbif I want to internet, I use an android tablet and a shitty wep or open hotspot on this phone00:34
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fishbulbthough what else from 7 years ago is still alright?00:37
fishbulbobviously everyone here keeps the thing for some reason.00:37
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bencohno real alternative? ;)00:53
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fishbulbI tried apt-get update01:02
fishbulband the keyring for the two linenoise repos is...01:02
fishbulbnot working for some reason01:02
fishbulbfMMS isnt' working anymore either.01:02
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fishbulbI mean still isn't working01:06
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fishbulbthis is really frustrating01:15
fishbulbI deleted the linenoise repos becuase they didn't seem to work01:15
jonwilno ideas01:16
ceenei've managed somehow to make qt4 use tlsv1.201:16
ceenenot that it's a solution right now01:16
ceenebecause i deleted things that need to be there01:16
ceenebut a little thingy i wanted to use that connected to a tlsv1.2 only https site now works with these changes i've made01:17
kerioqt4 being tls1.0 only is an endless cause of frustration01:17
ceeneyes it is01:17
ceenei have a piece of software that didn't work01:18
bencohit's plain stupid, too01:18
ceenebut now it connects to the server and everything seems fine01:18
ceenethe changes are pretty small01:18
ceenei have to restore back some things i deleted and debug it01:18
keriomumble/murmur :|01:18
ceenebut i think we can have a .deb soon01:18
kerioi have to tweak the port's makefile to make it use qt501:19
bencohI dont really get one thing though... why are there any change needed ?01:19
bencohceene: I guess you've built qt against openssl-1.x?01:20
ceenebecause it has code such as this01:20
ceene    case QSsl::SslV2:01:20
ceene        ctx = q_SSL_CTX_new(client ? q_SSLv2_client_method() : q_SSLv2_server_method());01:20
ceene        break;01:20
ceeneyes, i got openssl-1 on the n90001:20
bencohceene: yeah but that's for sslv2 vs sslv3 vs tlsv101:21
bencohwhat about tlsv1.0 vs 1.x?01:21
ceene    case QSsl::TlsV1:01:21
ceene        ctx = q_SSL_CTX_new(client ? q_TLSv1_client_method() : q_TLSv1_server_method());01:21
ceene        break;01:21
bencohwhat does q_TLSv1_client_method use?01:21
ceenebut if you want to use v1.2 you need to use q_TLSv1_2_client_method()01:21
bencohthat's silly01:22
kerioopenssl is pretty silly, yes01:22
bencohfishbulb: the gpg key used in mirrors is the same as the original ones (ie; the nokia ssu gpg key); it expired years ago01:23
bencohit doesn't mean mirrors dont work01:24
ceenei gotta go to sleep now01:25
ceenei'm quite happy with this!01:25
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fishbulbhey if I reflash01:52
fishbulbhow do I backup texts calls calendar01:52
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infobotsomebody said maemo-flashing was, or - on linux PC - download&extract, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh02:44
DocScrutinizer05>>(flashing the) eMMC aka *VANILLA*, which will replace the complete content of N900's internal 32 GB eMMC storage (embedded MMC), which is: the /home partition which has your stored browser passwords and game highscores and calendar and contacts etc.<<02:45
DocScrutinizer05vs >>(flashing the) FIASCO aka *COMBINED*, also referred to as "rootfs"<< which obviously does not touch those items in /home02:46
DocScrutinizer05then also >>It is strongly advised you regularly use the Backup application to create backups of your settings and data to a safe storage.<<02:47
DocScrutinizer05>>The Backup application will save: [...]<<02:48
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DocScrutinizer05also see:02:50
infobotit has been said that backupmenu is
DocScrutinizer05which is yet another backup method than the above referenced Backup App02:50
DocScrutinizer05I think I accomplished my daily duty of avoiding "RTFM" replies02:51
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fishbulbhey, every time this freenode webchat times out the text disappears03:07
fishbulbsomeone said something about a flasher and backup app?03:07
fishbulbis there a working whatsapp?03:07
fishbulbor any other way to either send pictures or chat on the n90003:08
fishbulbwith people who have normal phones03:08
DocScrutinizer05yappari they said03:15
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fishbulbit's not in the repos03:23
fishbulbum, the backupmenu restores the exact settings03:27
fishbulbI don't know how but clicking on the repo install thing changed something that broke the phone03:28
fishbulbfMMS won't send or open pictures properly anymore03:28
fishbulbthis is pretty crucial, I use it all the time03:28
fishbulbI get the mms, it comes through from a number, and fmms can't open it03:29
fishbulbit says the picture is sent, then the other person doesn't get it03:31
DocScrutinizer05fishbulb: please, if you repeat this "clicking on the repo install thing broke the phone" an N+1th time, I have to add you to my ignore list, to protect my sanity03:37
DocScrutinizer05no matter if true or (most likely) incorrect, we *all* have heard it now03:37
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fishbulbok I'm not sure how to diagnose how exactly fMMS stopped working03:40
fishbulb100% stopped working when it was working perfectly before03:40
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DocScrutinizer05when you didn't change anything, then probably something in the provider's infra/config changed. Nothing unheard of, actually. Providers do it all the time03:49
DocScrutinizer05did you make sure your account is actually working, I.E. you have a psitive balance and sending SMS and data connection are all fine?03:50
DocScrutinizer05[2016-01-10 Sun 14:10:47] <freemangordon> fishbulb: double check against your fmms settings   [2016-01-10 Sun 17:06:41] <fishbulb> I've double checked all of that :/03:53
fishbulbyeah just ignore that last part03:53
DocScrutinizer05I suspect it needs a triple check then, involving googling for additional info about recent changes or problems on provider side03:53
fishbulbthat's only the 10th +03:54
fishbulbtime where I say all the settings are correct03:54
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fishbulball the settings are exactly right04:00
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DocScrutinizer05and it's the at least 2nd time I try to tell you that "correct" is a literally relative term, since it needs a reference to which it compares for correctness. When you say your settings are correct in relation to then maybe that site is _not_ correct. That's why I said "...involving googling for additional info about recent changes or problems on provider side"04:19
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DocScrutinizer05from discontinuing an obsolete service on a particular deprecated APN to introducing a new version of the protocol used, there's a virtually endless number of possible changes on provider side04:22
DocScrutinizer05frals: ^^^ any comments?04:22
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DocScrutinizer05[2016-01-10 Sun 14:26:59] <freemangordon> what log says it that their DNS has no clue about [2016-01-10 Sun 14:27:09] <fishbulb> their dns? [2016-01-10 Sun 14:27:13] <freemangordon> yes [2016-01-10 Sun 14:27:16] <fishbulb> so it's their fault probably04:30
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DocScrutinizer05(([2016-01-10 Sun 14:27:32] <fishbulb> I recieved an mms  <fishbulb> it came to the phone, but I can't download the picture )) that's exactly a symptom of SMS with 'URL' to download the multimedia content arrived, but the URL doesn't resolve due to ^^^04:32
DocScrutinizer05I heard providers now and then have malfunctions. Sometimes for days or even weeks04:33
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fishbulbvodafone says there's no problem04:38
fishbulbthis phone hasnt' been flashed in years04:38
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DocScrutinizer05there are two options: 1) wait for frals suggesting how to do in-depth analysis and debugging of this. I doubt it will get any better than what freemangordon already told you, without frals who's the author of fMMS. 2) completely delete and reinstall fMMS, redo all config and test again.04:57
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DocScrutinizer05((vodafone says...)) I witnessed a 1 week complete breakdown of the 2G functionality of the cell servicing the area where I live. O2 never admitted any problems05:19
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DocScrutinizer05anyway a complete flashing can't hurt, particularly after using fapman and doing so since years without flashing.05:23
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KotCzarny<fishbulb> I'm pretty sure I did apt-get upgrade with the testing repo in there06:55
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fralsfishbulb: check fmms.log and see what error is reported when its trying to fetch the mms08:59
fralsand as DocScrutinizer05 said, theres about a million different reasons it can randomly fail, most of them on the provider side09:02
freemangordonfrals: nslookup cannot resolve the host needed to fetch the content09:03
fralsah, right09:03
fralstry manually connecting to their MMS apn and resolve the host, otherwise the operator is most likely having issues with their service09:04
freemangordonfrals: "manually connecting" - how?09:04
fralseasiest is probably modifying the "internet apn" through internet conenction settings to use the same settings as the MMS APN and just connect thru the normal ui09:05
fralsbut its been a couple of years since i last used a n900 :)09:05
freemangordonhmm, yeah09:06
freemangordonfishbulb: ^^^09:06
fralsjust scrolled waaaay back, make sure the proxy is set as well09:13
freemangordonhe said the proxy is set-up09:13
freemangordonbeen asked several times09:14
DocScrutinizer05hi frals :-)09:14
DocScrutinizer05thanks for helping out09:15
fralsshame the log pastebin expired, but easiest way to see if its fMMS or operator is by connecting through the standard interface and see if it works there09:15
fralsthe magic scripts i hacked together to bring up 2 connections at the same time arent as good as they should be.. but they mostly work ;)09:15
fralsno worries :)09:15
DocScrutinizer05frals: is sending MMS also involving sending of a SMS, or is that SMS only on receiver side?09:15
fralssms only on receiver, http on sender09:16
DocScrutinizer05ack, ta09:16
fralsthe "problem" is that sending is usually just posting to the mmsc, which some oeprators have  accessible through all their APNs, while getting the mms *might* be on a different host thats only accessible through their mms apn09:17
DocScrutinizer05so when fMMS says "MMS sent", this means it actually could upload the content via HTTP09:17
fralsand that the server on the other side didnt say http 4xx as reply iirc09:18
freemangordonthen it seems the APN is correct09:18
DocScrutinizer05the TX APN yes09:18
freemangordonif he is able to send09:18
freemangordonit is only one APN09:18
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fralsmmsc might not be accessible if hes not connected to the "right" APN, which is used for retrieving09:19
DocScrutinizer05I suspected wrong APN all the time actually09:19
freemangordonfrals: could we have different APNs for sending and receiving?09:19
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: see frals' post 3 up09:19
freemangordonah, you mean he is connected to the "internet" APN and is able to send, but not receive? that makes sense09:20
DocScrutinizer05or are you asling if fMMS supports this per default09:20
freemangordonyes, if this is supported09:20
fralsnot supported in fmms09:21
DocScrutinizer05frals: is there a way to ask modem which is the APN currently used?09:21
fralsuh icd had some stuff for that iirc09:21
DocScrutinizer05AT cmd?09:21
fralsgets bit tricky since fmms connects to 2 APNs in most cases... )09:21
DocScrutinizer05sorry, shouldn't pester you when google would do09:21
fralsbasically fmms has a setting to automatically connect you to the mms apn in the background without disrupting the internet connection.. might be that vodafone stopped supporting multiple contexts at the same time09:22
DocScrutinizer05so the BB5 actually supports 2 concurrent APN?09:22
fralsyeah, not sure what the upper limit was but 2 was fine09:22
DocScrutinizer054 iirc09:22
freemangordonfrals: he said he uses "havoc" mode09:22
DocScrutinizer05upper limit09:22
fralsok, havoc tries to connect automagically in the background09:23
fralsi hope i logged something if it failed to do that...09:23
fralsbut could be that he was connected to internet apn, and then the mms apn connect failed, and then that could explain what he was seeing09:23
fralschanging connection mode to the safe one could be worth trying09:23
DocScrutinizer05I suggest using pnatd to ask modem which contexts/APN (there was even another better name, no?) are active09:24
fralsanyway have to run to work, please ping me when he shows up / if i can help with anything else :)09:24
* freemangordon has to run too09:24
DocScrutinizer05another idea: aiui fMMS creates a second network device for the second context/APN. So we could use wireshark to see what's going on there09:25
DocScrutinizer05frals: freemangordon: have a nice day both of you guys!09:25
DocScrutinizer05(wireshark) actually a simple ifconfig before and after sending or trying to receive a MMS should already do, to see if any and how much traffic wnet via each of the two APN09:27
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DocScrutinizer05iirc (long ago that I last looked at MMS from some distance) you even need to tell provider that your device can handle and wants to use MMS, so the provider enables some services (possibly the special APN) for you09:28
DocScrutinizer05unless fishbulb gets rootsh and network tools (dig/host, ifconfig, etc pp) installed, and learns how to connect to phone via ssh session from PC, we won't get anywhere debugging this09:30
DocScrutinizer05first pretty simple test: spoil the standard APN for data connectivity, so we can be sure fMMS doesn't use "the internet" to send MMS09:32
DocScrutinizer05anyway I have to run as well. Need to sort my 2015 taxes09:33
DocScrutinizer05heck! when you google for 3GPP AT commands, 2nd hit is "radekp" :-)09:35
DocScrutinizer05HAH! "PDP context" was the name09:36
DocScrutinizer05ok, BB5 (aka N900) supports THREE PDP contexts:
KotCzarnyfrals: does fmms come with apn db or it fetches it from somewhere?09:41
DocScrutinizer05    search: "AT+CGDCONT"09:42
DocScrutinizer05or jump to page 18009:42
DocScrutinizer05o/ l8rs09:42
fralsKotCzarny: the device ships with mms apn db (since pr1.1 or 1.2) :)09:48
DocScrutinizer05duh, what?09:49
DocScrutinizer05sorry i'm missing context09:49
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KotCzarnyfrals, that's what i thought, because n900 didnt support mms, and settings were magically filled :)09:54
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DocScrutinizer05mms apn db? really now?10:02
DocScrutinizer05heck that thing must be out of date now10:03
fralsDocScrutinizer05: yeah, if fishbulb is comfy in the terminal it should be pretty easy to figure out where things go wrong10:24
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fralsyeah, probably a tad out of date by now.. :)10:25
fralsotoh from what i heard back while working on fmms operators rarely changed those settings10:25
fralssomeone could always write a small script to parse the OTA provisioning messages the operator sends out, but i didnt want to even look at that after reading the mms "standard" :D10:26
KotCzarnybut it can happen10:26
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fralsbiggest issue is usually new mvnos10:29
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fishbulbhey did I mention I can send MMS to myself10:42
bencohI think you did10:44
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fishbulbyappari seems to work10:45
fishbulband be available on most phones10:45
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fralsfishbulb: can you post the logfile to pastebin so i can have a look?11:01
fralsinclude sending to yourself + failing to retrieve one if possible11:01
fishbulbhi I'm here for a few minutes11:02
fishbulbI'll post the one log file I have and make another one too11:03
ceenefishbulb: yappari works indeed, but do not create any group or whatsapp will ban you11:06
ceenethat's something i'd really like to fix, but i don't know how11:06
bencohceene: did you try dumping traffic and compare it to what does an android phone to create groups?11:06
fishbulbok. I just need one way of sending pictures to normal people's phones11:07
ceenebencoh: it's easier than that, we have decompiled code of official whatsapp11:07
ceeneand i can't for the life of me get which is the difference between theirs and mine11:07
bencohceene: oh and, maybe you should disable the "create group" function meanwhile11:07
ceenethat's true11:08
ceenei placed a big red warning explaining that11:08
ceenebut still a couple people got banned11:08
KotCzarnyceene, then packet dump11:08
KotCzarnycould be easier11:08
bencohceene: this is why dumping traffic might be a good idea :)11:08
ceenetraffic is encrypted11:08
bencohif you cant work it out from the decompiled source11:08
ceeneand all that11:08
ceenexmpp protocol is first binary encoded11:08
ceeneand then it goes through ssl11:08
ceeneso it's quite a headache11:09
bencohTPROXY + ssltunnel (for instance)11:09
bencohbut yeah, it's a pain11:09
fishbulbthis is me trying to send one and trying to open one11:10
fishbulbI think I try to open one first11:10
fishbulband then I send one maybe?11:10
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fralsim thinking it doesnt work because of the failure to resolve the mmsc host to ip11:17
fralsand the fmms_magic script doesnt early out there, it pretends everything is fine even though it goes bonkers11:17
fralscan you try changing connection mode to the safe one11:17
frals"polite" or "rude"11:18
fralstry "rude" first, it'll bring down the current connection though11:18
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fralsor edit your normal 3G internet connection to use the MMS settings and see if you can receive mms while using that11:20
KotCzarnyfrals: what those rude/polite modes are for?11:27
frals* Polite (Default behavior <0.6): Only switch to MMS connection if no connection is active, otherwise do nothing (pretty much)11:32
frals* Rude: Force a disconnect of the active connection regardless of what it is, connect to MMS APN and then reconnect to the old one.11:32
frals* Havoc: Try to bring up a connection to the MMS APN in parallell with whatever is active, this is what most other phones do. Note that to get this functionality on the N900 there are a few ugly hacks active which might break stuff, but it *should* work11:32
frals ;)11:32
fralsfishbulb: so, change 3g internet connection settings to look like the mms one, set connection mode in fmms to polite, manually ocnnect to your 3g connection and then try to fetch the mms11:33
KotCzarnyfrals: thx11:34
fishbulboh some info11:34
fishbulbI don't really have the internet going all the time11:34
KotCzarnyfrals: may i propose names: 'lazy connect', 'force mms apn' and 'parallel' ?11:35
fishbulbit's never going actually.11:36
fishbulbthere's no autodisconnect stuff11:36
fishbulbwhoa, bowie is dead?11:36
fralsKotCzarny: needed one word to fit in the UI ;)11:36
fishbulbsorry I'm not gonna be much use right now11:55
fishbulbit's like 9pm and there's stuff happening11:59
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ceenejonwil: i don't know if you read me last night13:42
ceenebut i've hacked something onto qt413:42
ceeneand i've got it to connect to tlsv1.2 servers :)13:42
jonwilyeah I saw you did something with QT4 and newer openssl13:42
jonwilthats a good start13:42
ceeneyeah! :)13:42
ceenesomething nice about qt13:42
ceeneis that it doesn't link against openssl, but uses dlopen13:43
ceeneand searches for the most up to date version13:43
jonwilnice one13:43
ceeneso the patch i made last night is only needed to support new protocols13:43
ceenebut at least, simply installing openssl1 will make qt use it13:43
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ceenethere are quite a few changes on qt's network/ssl module between 4.7 and 514:05
ceeneso i din't know how feasible it is to backport all of that14:05
bencohwe probably dont need everything just to use the right TLSv*_method (or whatever the enum/functions is) anyway14:14
ceeneif that's the case, probably something very similar to what i've already done is enough14:15
bencohI'd just patch 4.7 with the few lines need to enable tlsv>1.014:15
ceenewhich should be the default protocol, if any?14:15
bencohmost probably yeah14:17
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ceenei can see you're pretty excited about this :P14:18
ceenei'm thinking14:19
ceenethat a priority based system could work14:19
ceenetry first tlsv1_2, if can't connect, try again tlsv1_114:19
bencohKISS, we're talking about ssl/tls ;p14:20
ceeneyeah, but14:20
ceeneif i change the enums14:20
ceenewe'd need to recompile every qt app out there14:20
ceeneand i don't want that14:20
ceenei want all qt applications to use the most secure protocol by default14:20
ceeneeven if they don't know nothing about tlsv1.2, which they don't because qt4.7 didn't support it14:21
bencohcurrent code goes through the protocols list in enum order?14:21
ceenecurrent one14:21
ceeneuses either user chosen protocol14:21
ceeneor a default one, which is     case QSsl::AnyProtocol:14:21
ceene    default:14:21
ceene        ctx = q_SSL_CTX_new(client ? q_SSLv23_client_method() : q_SSLv23_server_method());14:21
ceene        break;14:21
bencohthen you dont need to insert values in-between two enums, just add it at the end (?)14:21
ceenebut in that case i'll need to change the default to one of the new protocols14:22
ceeneotherwise, they wouldn't be usuable by anyone14:22
ceenei can add the tlsv1.2 code, but no application will know to chose it14:22
ceeneand sslv3 is completely deprecated, so I guess we shouldn't even allow it14:22
bencohjust change the default: line14:22
ceeneand set what?14:22
bencohsslv2 is deprecated as well14:23
ceeneso should i just set tlsv1.2 as the default14:23
ceeneand let applications choose something older if they want14:23
bencohI think there is a generic tlsv1 call in openssl1.x14:23
ceenethere may be, let me grep for it14:23
ceeneTLS_method(), TLS_server_method(), TLS_client_method()14:24
ceeneA TLS/SSL connection established with these methods may understand the SSLv3, TLSv1, TLSv1.1 and TLSv1.2 protocols.14:24
ceenebut it alows sslv314:25
bencohI think you can also pass it some flags to disable any protocol14:25
bencoh(same goes for ciphers)14:25
bencohI dunno if we want to completely drop sslv3 from default14:25
ceenemaybe not14:26
bencohwhat does qt5 do for default?14:26
ceenei think...14:26
ceene // SSLv2 and SSLv3 will be disabled by SSL options14:27
ceenei don't know where it does that14:27
ceenebut that comment is under SecureProtocols14:27
ceeneso i think it accepts everything and then disables those14:27
jonwilIn regards to what we enable/disable by default we should follow the practice of whatever others are doing (i.e. what QT5 does or what Firefox does or what Chrome does)14:28
ceeneqt5 doesn't disable it completely14:28
ceenebut seems to exclude it from the list of secure protocols14:28
jonwilAny site out there that actually needs SSLv3 and will fail with TLS is probably not a site worth caring about14:28
ceene    else if (protocol == QSsl::SecureProtocols)14:29
ceene        options = SSL_OP_ALL|SSL_OP_NO_SSLv2|SSL_OP_NO_SSLv3;14:29
ceenebut you are free to choose sslv3 if you want14:29
ceeneif i can invoke tls_method() and then disable sslv3, the i could set that as the default14:29
ceenebut let people choose sslv3 if they explicitely want to14:30
jonwilBoth browsers here on my system disable SSLv3 completly and only enable TLS (1.0, 1.1 and 1.2)14:30
ceenethat documentation i pasted before about TLS_method() seems to be wrong14:32
ceeneor non matching my openssl-1 version14:32
bencohceene: be careful, I'm sure TLS_client_method() is in openssl-0.9.x14:32
ceeneas there's no match for TLS_client_method14:32
ceeneyep, it's not there on 114:32
bencohright ;)14:32
ceeneso... what's the alternative on openssl-1?14:32
jonwilinternet explorer lets you enable SSLv2 and SSLv3 if you need to but they are off on my system14:32
jonwiland my other browser doesn't even have options for SSL14:33
bencohceene: I dont remember :)14:33
ceeneok, don't worry14:33
jonwilIts great that we are updating OpenSSL and QT and stuff but we still need to figure out how to update nss in microb14:33
jonwiland I am still getting nowhere with updating the root CA store14:33
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ceeneit seems tls_method will be back on openssl-1.114:36
ceeneor maybe not14:36
ceenei don't understand openssl changelogs14:37
bencohI think nobody understands openssl as a whole14:37
ceeneyeah, i think that's it14:37
ceeneit'll be on openssl-1.114:37
ceenewhich is yet to be released14:37
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bencohceene: SSLv23_client_method in openssl-1.0.x allows tlsv114:39
bencohand you can later restrict to disable sslv2 (or v3 for that matters) using SSL_set_options14:39
ceenebut only v1.014:39
bencohand in case you're wondering, yes, this API is plain shit.14:39
ceenethe names don't make any sense14:40
ceenenothing makes any sense in fact14:40
ceenei just want a secure_client() and a secure_server()14:40
ceenethat's why it's called open-ssl instead of o-secure-sl14:41
ceenebecause it's open, but being secure is something yet to proof14:41
bencohanyway, unless you want to rewrite the qt/ssl glue to use libressl, we'll have to deal with it14:42
ceenei don't think so14:42
ceenethat i'll rewrite that14:43
ceenei'll just deal with it :P14:43
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ceenei gotta go now15:00
ceenebut i'm doing that we've talked about15:00
ceenei hope this week i can post somewhere a couple of .deb so they can be tested15:00
bencohplease rather send a couple of git links :)15:00
bencohbut thx :)15:00
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DocScrutinizer05hmm, something for Pali, a pity he's not around:16:42
DocScrutinizer05>>Device units do exist on the file system, solely for ordering purposes. They are generated only for devices tagged “systemd” for udev to interpret in its rulesets. They have no options, and have their primary use to implement a so-called “device-based execution”, which is a conditional execution of units based on udev device availability – this is, in fact, done with the cooperation of udev itself which understands rules like16:42
DocScrutinizer05SYSTEMD_WANTS=. <<
DocScrutinizer05OOOUUUUUUUUuuuuuUUUU!  >>Automount units then are a further variation, as they drive autofs, though do explicitly queue jobs. In practice, they’re used to extend regular mount units by having mount points be attached lazily, i.e. deferring only until they are accessed.<<16:50
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DocScrutinizer05I've read ~40% now (up to >>The transaction manager<<) and I feel a strong nausea17:00
DocScrutinizer05not because of the article but because of what it describes17:01
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freemangordonWizzup_: you have gentoo booting on n900 with mainline kernel, ain't?22:34
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freemangordonPali: poweroff -f on device does nothing, is that expected?23:34
Palifreemangordon: no idea... look into /etc/init.d/mini* scripts23:36
Palithere are scripts which do shutdown/reboot23:36
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