IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2015-11-08

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Luke-Jrhawaii: a free OS that has GPS capabilities?01:12
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OksanaaThe most curious part, for me, is adding into location-searcher capability to use cellular towers' signals + database of cellular towers' locations to give coarse location01:56
OksanaaWithout connecting to Internet or downloading almanac from satellites01:56
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Vajbhow did u made body for those parts? Some sort of epoxy?08:16
MaxdamantusYes, just five-minute epoxy.08:17
Vajbwere u able to make shape from fresh epoxy or u carved it after it cure?08:18
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MaxdamantusFresh, but usually with multiple applications a few minutes apart.08:19
keriowtf is htat08:19
MaxdamantusMy modularised earphones.08:20
Vajbi see. Should be sturdy and even waterproof.08:20
MaxdamantusUnfortunately there are still jacks for water to get into.08:22
MaxdamantusIn the case of the earpieces though, the crevasses for the jacks are isolated from the ones for the speakers.08:23
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nick20151916my n900 asks08:27
nick20151916my n900 says "insufficient charnign power" on half of laptop usb ports. Is it possible to fix this?08:28
Maxdamantusnick20151916: is the laptop on?08:28
nick20151916it is on different PCs08:31
nick20151916I believe that it's possible to change n900's requirements to power08:32
Luke-Jroffline mode probably will help08:32
ecc3gwhenever I see "insufficient charging power" the USB port really is too weak...08:34
nick20151916btw, my external battery(XP18000) doesn't charge it too08:34
ecc3gif I can't get 100mA from the USB port, I don't bother08:35
nick20151916so it is obvious that the problem is in n900, not in other devices08:37
ecc3gif a regular wall charger can charge it, then it's not a problem with the n900 either...08:39
VajbMaxdamantus: maybe u could put o-rings over plugs. So it would seal when connected.08:39
MaxdamantusI suspect it's already pretty much water-resistant when connected.08:40
nick20151916ecc3g the problem is that my n900 is the only device that is charging reliably with wall chargers only.08:42
nick20151916my 7" tablet never complains about the chargers08:43
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J0hnnyBrav0Trying to work through well documented issue about failed catalogues. I tried the solutions I found...but seems like the repos are no longer up. Can someone point me to the proper repos please?09:17
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infobotwell, maemo-repos is
KotCzarnynick20151916: maybe the cable is bad?09:23
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J0hnnyBrav0Thank you!09:27
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Vajbyes cable could be the problem also. I have one powerbank with extendable cable. It doesn't charge n900 at all. Even though it looks like standard cable.09:49
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jonwilmerlin1991: ping09:59
nick20151916I used different cables10:19
nick20151916the problem have persisted for 5 years so i tried different combinations10:20
KotCzarnynick20151916: maybe your n900 is special10:35
KotCzarnyunless all the devices you've tried are having some incompatibility10:36
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Vajbis there program for measuring g-forces?11:12
KotCzarnyi dont think internal sensor is accurate enough11:12
KotCzarnyif there is one, that is11:13
Vajbyes. I heard they were planning to implement racechrono for maemo, but that didn't happen 'cause maemo didn't make it to mainstream.11:14
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Maxdamantus`ameter` seems to work fine.11:19
MaxdamantusThe sensor seems accurate enough. It tells me the expected rate of upward acceleration it's feeling as it's sitting on a table (9.81 something m/s^2)11:20
Maxdamantusactually, it uses units of "g"11:20
Maxdamantusalso, I think Nokia themselves made some ball game using the accelerometer.11:24
KotCzarnymine doesnt seem to work then11:24
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Vajbk will try ameter11:26
Maxdamantusameter seems more natural with the default value for g negated.11:29
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Vajbat least it stays constant 1g if device is held vertically11:35
KotCzarnyyou are in one11:35
Vajbwill try how it works in car11:35
MaxdamantusIndeed. That's because your hand is accelerating upwards at 1 g.11:35
Vajbyeah. Im faster than bruce lee11:36
Vajbonly thing missing is storing max g values11:37
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brolin_empeyOksana: Years ago, I bought dedicated Nokia BL-5J/BL-4J battery chargers on eBay.  I do not know if such chargers are still available, though.11:58
KotCzarnyli-ion is a li-ion11:59
KotCzarnyif you know the pins11:59
brolin_empeyI have already replaced my replacement for my Nokia N900, though.  I replaced my Nokia N900 with a Geeksphone Revolution, which I have replaced with a Samsung Galaxy Note 3.12:01
KotCzarnynice, atom phone12:06
keriomy replacement for the n900 was another n90012:06
KotCzarny+1 kerio12:06
KotCzarnyi already have 2.5 spare n900s12:07
kerioi might bite the bullet and switch to android though12:07
KotCzarnyi've tried android, it was awful12:07
kerioyea but it's got specs12:08
kerioi like specs12:08
KotCzarnyand os eats 3/4 of them12:08
Wizzupthe n900 also has specs12:08
KotCzarnyand also os eats 3/4 of them12:08
Wizzupmore than many others12:08
WizzupKotCzarny: :P12:08
kerioWizzup: the n900 has a keyboard12:09
kerioa screen12:09
kerioand no ram12:09
KotCzarnybut still, if you start with 1G of ram 1/4 of it is more than 1/4 in n90012:09
Wizzupkerio: no ram?12:09
kerioMem:      fuck all        all       none12:11
keriokinda like that12:11
KotCzarnyif we replace hildon-dekstop with fluxbox we can regain some12:13
brolin_empeykerio: I meant replacement in terms of model, not in terms of instances of same model.  My first Nokia N900 was replaced with another Nokia N900 due to broken microUSB connector.12:15
KotCzarnyi still use my first n90012:16
KotCzarny(since 2009)12:16
keriothis one has a broken wifi12:16
keriothe old one has a broken musb12:16
keriofeels bad man12:16
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KotCzarnyit even has the original battery which holds charge for 4-5 days12:16
KotCzarnyand if one doesnt need modern (bloated) browser it has very good set of features12:17
KotCzarnyfm transmitter, ir transmitter12:18
KotCzarnyand of course linux12:18
kerioas it is, we have no way to run a recent enough glibc12:20
KotCzarnyif what sicelo said is true recent kernel has working cmt-speech12:22
kerioalso fuck linux12:23
kerioit's bad12:23
keriobsd or death12:24
KotCzarnysure, whatever12:24
brolin_empeyAnyway, is there a model of fanless >=80686 notebook computer with a decent/proper integrated display instead of a pathetic TN AMLCD panel like in my Dell Latitude X1?12:26
keriobrolin_empey: macbooks have IPS panels12:28
keriothe 2015 macbooks12:29
keriothe ones with less specs than the ipad pro12:29
keriooh hey, the specs are similar to the latitude x1 huehueahueh12:31
keriono but seriously the 2015 macbook is trash12:32
brolin_empeykerio: Is the 2015 MacBook proper (not MacBook Pro) fanless?  Reportedly it is but I do not know based on my own experience.  Does it have an integrated numeric keypad (overlaid is OK) and an integrated Ethernet port?12:35
kerioyes, no, no12:35
kerioit doesn't have ports12:35
keriowell idk about the numeric keypad12:36
kerioi guess you can just kludge it with a keyboard layout12:36
keriothe 2015 macbook has a headphone jack (supports mic, iirc), and a usb C port12:37
KotCzarnyone can hack ips display into thinkpad x4012:37
keriothat's it12:37
KotCzarny(which is the last truly fanless machine)12:37
kerioKotCzarny: but the macbook is fanless .-.12:37
KotCzarnyand what can you do with the macbook?12:37
keriorun a browser12:38
KotCzarnycan you run realBSD on it?12:39
kerioi dunno12:39
kerioit likely runs netbsd12:39
keriobecause, you know, netbsd12:39
KotCzarnyosx is not realbsd12:39
kerio1.1ghz dual core intel core M with boost up to 2.412:39
kerioexcept that you will never actually boost to 2.412:40
kerioand, in fact, sustained loads will throttle it down to like 900mhz12:40
brolin_empeyCan an x86 Mac even directly boot from an HDD/SSD using the MBR/MS-DOS disk label instead of the newfangled GPT?12:40
KotCzarnygpt is not bad12:40
keriobrolin_empey: i'm actually not sure about the latest versions actually12:40
KotCzarnyyou are thinking of uefi12:41
keriobecause in theory they dropped w7 support12:41
kerioand both 8 and 10 boot via efi12:41
kerioxp, vista and 7 used to boot via bios emulation, yes12:41
keriowith all that protective mbr crap12:41
keriofreebsd can boot via uefi12:42
KotCzarnythats assuming uefi bios allows it12:42
keriomacs don't have secure boot12:42
KotCzarnybut they go into that direction too12:43
KotCzarnyso they probably have it, just not used yet12:43
keriodo they?12:43
keriothey mostly ignored the efi stuff, actually12:43
kerioos x boots without an efi system partition12:43
kerioyou only need it for firmware upgrades12:44
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: I currently have no need to switch from the IBM Personal Computer-compatible BIOS and MBR/MS-DOS disk label, hence my question.12:44
keriobrolin_empey: no good reason to stay on it either, though12:44
KotCzarnybrolin, i think grub2 can happily boot gpt partitions12:44
kerioand yea, you only need a specific partitioning system to boot from a partition12:45
keriobut booting from partitions is like not even well supported anymore, anyway12:45
keriogrub on debian complains if it's not installed on a disk12:45
KotCzarnyas i said, gpt is not evil, uefi is12:46
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: I never said GPT is evil.  I said GPT is newfangled, which it is compared to the 1980s establishment.12:47
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keriothe future is bootloaderless12:48
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brolin_empeykerio: Does the 2015 MacBook have internal removable non-volatile memory?12:56
KotCzarnyit will only reach bootloaderless state when all memory becomes nonvolatile12:56
KotCzarnyotherwise you will always need some kind of 'load the next stage'12:57
keriobrolin_empey: idk if the m2 ssd is removable12:57
KotCzarnym2 by definition is socketed12:57
KotCzarnyotherwise its just pcie12:57
kerionope, not removable12:58
kerioit's the orange12:59
KotCzarnybut then again, its not m.212:59
KotCzarnyjust connected to the system bus12:59
kerioin fact, it's custom made12:59
KotCzarnyBuses exposed through the M.2 connector are PCI Express 3.0, Serial ATA (SATA) 3.0 and USB 3.013:00
KotCzarnyBeside socketed modules, the M.2 standard also includes support for permanently soldered single-sided modules.[11]13:02
brolin_empeyI have been screwed too many times by relying on non-volatile memory fixed on a motherboard.  My Dell Latitude X1 boots from a removable 1.8-inch PATA SSD.13:03
kerioit's not standard i think13:03
KotCzarnykerio, it is13:03
keriobrolin_empey: yea but this one is a ssd :313:03
kerioKotCzarny: no, the macbook one13:03
KotCzarnybrolin, i'm using 1.8" pata-ssd(msata) adapter for my thinkpad x4013:04
KotCzarnyworks like a charm13:04
KotCzarnyand you can get newer/bigger/cheaper ssds that way13:05
KotCzarnypata ssds are overpriced, 1.8" are overpriced^213:05
brolin_empeykerio: As opposed to what?  I said SSD, not HDD.  I bought my Latitude X1 used without neither an HDD nor an SSD.13:06
keriosata is too slow for modern ssds13:08
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KotCzarny70MB/s with instant seeks is enough13:09
KotCzarnyunless you constantly move gigs of data13:09
kerioi didn't say sata is too slow for you13:09
kerioi said sata is too slow for modern ssds13:09
KotCzarnyits the iops that matters for daily use13:09
KotCzarnyand mind you, i used to run that x40 from compactflash card13:10
KotCzarny(half of the os was in tmpfs, he he)13:10
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brolin_empeyKotCzarny: Does your ThinkPad X40 have an IPS panel?13:21
KotCzarnyi was thinking about it, even got me panel, but never made a cable needed13:22
Maxdamantustmpfs is subject to swapping. Use ramfs.13:22
KotCzarnymy soldering skills are close to 013:22
KotCzarnyand soldering something to flexcable needs a bit of these13:23
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: And is a ThinkPad X40 with IPS panel still obtainable?13:23
KotCzarnythere were never x40 model with ips panel, but if you find cmpatible and flexcable modded, it just works13:24
KotCzarnyit doesnt require any electronics, just pin reorder13:25
KotCzarnyalso, mind you, x40 is singlec core pentium-m13:25
KotCzarnyx60s is obtainable with ips display, but its not as energy efficient as good ol' x4013:26
KotCzarnyx40 in idle without any fan achieves ~35-40C13:27
keriomy mbp reaches 100C with full load on cpu and gpu13:27
KotCzarnywell, with fan on and full load x40 reaches ~60-67C13:28
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: I have not yet looked up the specifications of the ThinkPad X40.  However, my Latitude X1 has a 1.1-GHz Pentium M.13:28
KotCzarnyx40 has 1.2 or 1.5GHz cpu13:28
KotCzarnyx60 can have 1.6-2.2GHz coreduo13:29
KotCzarnyx60s has 1.83 max i think13:29
KotCzarny(low voltage)13:29
KotCzarnythere were ulv models too13:30
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brolin_empeyKotCzarny: If the ThinkPad X40 has a fan, why are we discussing the ThinkPad X40?  A computer with a fan that can be configured to run without using the fan is not the same as a computer without a fan.  The Latitude X1 is literally fanless.13:33
KotCzarnybrolin, it has a fan, but it can be disabled13:33
kerioi'm confident that my macbook pro would work without fans13:33
kerioit would work really badly, but it would work13:33
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KotCzarnybrolin, and as i said, in idle without a fan has <40C, undervolted and throttled to 1.2GHz it can run without fan too13:35
KotCzarnywhich is why 1.1GHz in your latitude can go without13:36
kerioyeah but you still have fans13:36
keriothey still take up space13:36
KotCzarnysure, but they are configurable if you need cpu power13:36
keriothey still weigh13:36
KotCzarnyyou know x40 weighs ~1.5kg?13:36
KotCzarnya bit less with ssd ?13:36
KotCzarnyMinimum: 1.23kg (2.7lb)13:38
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: How is the fanless configuration achieved?  By configuring only the BIOS or other firmware, or by configuring the OS installation?13:40
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keriomy mbp weighs 2kg13:44
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KotCzarnybrolin: user space app (and kernel support for thinkpad bios functions)14:10
KotCzarnybrolin, google thinkpad fan control14:11
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: More generally, by configuring the OS installation.14:13
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: I looked up the specifications of the ThinkPad X40 (  Compared to the Latitude X1, the ThinkPad X40 has fewer columns on the integrated display (1024×768 instead of 1280×768), uses one generation earlier of DRAM (DDR1 SDRAM instead of DDR2 SDRAM), and possibly has a lower maximum amount of main memory.14:20
KotCzarnymax is 1.5GB14:21
KotCzarnybut its enough for most things (unless you run gnome/kde behemoths)14:21
KotCzarnyfor single core and quite operation xfce/fluxbox is recommended tho14:22
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brolin_empeyKotCzarny: The Latitude X1 supports up to approximately 2 GiB using a 2-GiB SODIMM but Dell says the maximum for the Latitude X1 is 1.25 GiB (256 MiB fixed on motherboard + 1 GiB on SODIMM) because a 2-GiB SODIMM was not available when the Latitude X1 was developed.14:25
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keriohow can you use that14:26
KotCzarnyuse what?14:26
keriomy irc client is currently using 550mb of ram14:26
KotCzarnyunless they crippled it in bios/chipset latitude x1 should work with 2GB module14:26
KotCzarnykerio, is that systemd-irc ?14:27
bencohkerio: web irc client?14:27
keriobut it's an irc client that uses webkit for rendering14:27
kerioand i have huge scrollbacks14:27
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KotCzarnymy irc client uses whatever-the-f*ck-terminal-you-are-using rendering14:28
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KotCzarnyand doesnt rely on big gfx buffers to render things14:28
keriohaters gonna hate14:28
KotCzarnyusers gonna use14:28
bencohkerio: seriously, which one is it?14:28
kerio(ironically enough)14:29
KotCzarnyhe he14:29
kerioi mean14:30
kerioi *am* keeping 5 days of messages right now14:30
kerio2000 messages14:30
KotCzarnysure, 2000*512byte msg len == what, 1MB ?14:31
kerioayy lmao14:31
KotCzarnyin that case my irc client can store 500 days of messages in 500megs14:31
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: You seem to have incorrectly assumed that I want to run GNU+Linux(+X) on a fanless >=80686 notebook computer.  My Latitude X1 runs Windows 8.1 Enterprise for x86-32 (with hostname “solidarity” because it is a solid-state computer).14:32
keriohold on i just realized that you are talking about 32bit computers14:32
keriofucking disgusting14:32
KotCzarnybrolin, you didnt mention any os14:33
bencohkerio: wai, what?14:33
KotCzarnyalso, win8, seriously?14:33
keriobencoh: something something aslr14:33
KotCzarnyits designed for touch screens14:33
KotCzarnythinkpads x61 are the ones with 64bit capable cpus14:33
KotCzarnyalso, running windows on anything less than 2GB is a mistake14:34
keriodoes windows fundamentals have a w7 equivalent?14:34
brolin_empeyKotCzarny: My Latitude X1 has approximately 2 GiB of main memory.14:35
KotCzarnystill, its a waste imo14:38
brolin_empeykerio: My primary (desktop) computer at both ${HOME} and ${WORK} has a Core 2 x86-64 CPU but I do not use long mode because I use an x86-32 OS with PAE.  Also, the Nokia N900 is a 32-bit computer. :-P14:39
KotCzarnyfor old cpus one shall disable as much as you can14:39
KotCzarnyone useful feature that often comes with -64 is virtualization14:42
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bencohby the way, looks like my headphones (or headphones jack) are dead, not my n900 :)15:46
bencohyup :)15:46
bencohI really didnt want to mess with it open15:46
KotCzarnydid you meet someone new too?15:46
bencohnah, I just got home15:46
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vakkovcan someone tell me a command to change the date ... date -s doesnt work15:58
KotCzarnyntpdate pool.ntp.org15:58
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vakkovno, i broke the os :P doesnt matter :D date 110813452015 does it16:05
vakkovnow i need to synchronise the hwclock :D16:05
KotCzarnyhwclock -w16:05
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KotCzarnybut ntpdate is the best as long you have internet connection16:07
KotCzarny(or working server on the network)16:07
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ceenei was wondering16:16
ceeneis there any app for n900 that does ocr on more or less real time?16:17
ceeneor even just ocr16:17
ceenewithout any kind of real time :)16:17
ceenei mean, handwritten ocr16:17
KotCzarnytry tesseract from google?16:17
KotCzarnyor do you mean user entry text?16:17
ceeneuser entry text16:18
ceenei want to draw on a note taking app16:18
ceeneand select a chunk of it and ask it to ocr that16:18
KotCzarnydont remember if n8x0 had one16:18
ceeneso i can take notes with drawings and have the text converted to, well, text16:18
ceenei believe there are apps for that for ios and android16:18
KotCzarnyand actually its not done via ocr but capturing pen moves16:18
ceenethat'd be cool too16:18
ceenei could even go with something like palm's alphabet16:19
ceenethat was fast16:19
KotCzarnyi mean, its just gestures, right?16:19
ceeneyep, in the end it is16:19
ceenei used to take notes on my palm tx16:19
ceeneand it was quite fast16:19
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ceenegraffiti it was called!18:42
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Siceloceene: graffiti looks like handwriting recognition? try cellwriter on N90020:38
ceeneit isn't on the repos it seems20:41
ceeneoh, but it's on the garage20:42
Sicelohas one annoying bug .. on reboot, loses your learned strokes :(20:42
Sicelomaybe you can fix that :)20:42
KotCzarnylooks like it doesnt save its data/config?20:43
KotCzarnymaybe tries to write protected dir20:43
ceeneit's less than 8000 lines of C20:44
ceenei'll try it20:44
ceeneand i don't discard fixing that if it's feasible20:45
KotCzarnyand you can even make it into systemwide input plugin?20:45
ceenethat'd require some n900 specific api knowledge20:46
ceeneso i won't promise anything :P20:46
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KotCzarnybut if you like taking notes or just prefer writing instead of tapping letters..20:46
Siceloit is system-wide already20:46
Sicelojust this non-saving issue20:46
ceenegconftool-2 --type string /apps/osso/inputmethod/default-plugins/finger -s him_cellwriter20:47
ceeneso i do that20:47
ceeneand instead of the virtual keyboard20:47
ceenethe cell thing will appear so i can write there20:47
Siceloexactly :)20:47
Sicelofirst time you may need to reboot20:47
ceeneis there something else i need to run first to configure?20:47
Sicelonothing besides that gconf one-liner20:48
ceenerebooting then20:50
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ceeneit works20:58
Sicelolooks like there's even a gui for it :)20:58
ceenei didn't expect that20:58
Sicelonever seen this before20:58
Siceloyes, haha. it works20:58
Siceloah.. bad link ..
KotCzarnyfunnily how many things work on n900, isnt it?20:59
ceenewith a little more attention it could have been huge20:59
ceenethe thing is that i have to train it21:00
ceeneand the problem is that it loses the training files?21:00
ceeneso it's basically useless right now21:01
Arch-TKceene: what? n900?21:01
ceeneArch-TK: yep21:01
Siceloif you don't reboot, it's useful :D21:01
ceenei think the saving code is there21:01
Arch-TKceene: I don't know about that, people don't like options, customisation and configurability.21:01
KotCzarnypeople who use n900 do like options21:01
KotCzarnyand customisation21:01
Arch-TKceene: people like monolithic crap which lets you configure the colour and that's it.21:01
Arch-TKThat's a minority.21:01
KotCzarnypeople who like monolithic crap buy mainstream phones21:02
KotCzarnypeople who use n900 buy it for specific reasons21:02
ceenei don't think that's completely true21:02
ceenelook at the huge number of cyanogen installs21:02
Arch-TKthat's why n900 wouldn't have been huge ever21:02
Arch-TKthat's still a minority21:02
ceenethat's people wanting to do something more than what stock android does21:02
ceeneyou have to admit that the n900 is lacking lots of things21:03
ceenepeople want phones that work21:03
ceeneand as much as i love my n900 there are things which doesn't does as well as other phones21:03
KotCzarnywell, my phone works21:03
ceeneand that's now with cssu21:03
ceeneimagine back then when it was released21:03
ceenethat couldn't do portrait mode :)21:03
KotCzarnyand it had non working player (not up to my expectations) so i wrote myself one21:03
KotCzarnyso in the end it WORKS as i want21:04
Arch-TKI guess the main issue I have with n900 is that all of the browser options I've tried have been rather sub-standard.21:04
KotCzarnymain problem with the browser is lack of memory21:04
KotCzarnyno going around that21:04
ceenei've resorted to using midori under debian21:04
KotCzarnyeven on desktop 128MB for firefox is under reqs21:04
KotCzarny512MB of RAM21:05
Arch-TKn900 users and cyanogen users are a minority (or just users of the lesser known android phones who are also not quite interested in what CM can do.21:05
KotCzarnynow do you expect 128M of ram to render monstrosities with all features?21:05
M4rtinKfrom me experience one needs about 16 GB of RAM to really use Firefox without issues on desktop :)21:07
KotCzarnyhe he21:07
KotCzarnynow, even simple webpagees can easily eat memory in a blink21:08
KotCzarny10 full size images and you start swapping like crazy21:08
SiceloArch-TK: so what is your point?21:08
KotCzarnynow, fremantle on n9 would be huge21:09
Arch-TKMy point is that n900 wouldn't have been huge even with more attention.21:09
KotCzarnynot true21:09
Arch-TKIt's something I want and many people like me like, but something nobody else wants.21:09
KotCzarnyin 2009 it had a chance21:09
keriobtw , safari sis like the best browser i've ever used21:10
Arch-TKIt's just the sad truth, the reality.21:10
KotCzarnynow, if you dont need fancy web rendering, its very usable21:10
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Sicelook Arch-TK. gotcha21:12
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KotCzarnywe can easily use linux software, unless we run out of hardware specs21:13
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KotCzarnythat's why i always wanted to slim it down as much as possible21:14
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ceenewhat i don't like of cellwriter is that it fills the enter screen21:39
ceenei expected it to fill just one arrow of cells21:39
ceeneso i can see what was written previously21:39
KotCzarnyyou are a coder, you should manage21:39
ceenebut i don't always have the time or the interest :P21:40
KotCzarnynow you have interest :P21:40
ceenebut the interest has to surpass the lazyness21:40
KotCzarnyin this case it does21:40
ceenei don't know21:40
ceenealthough i like very much that it's written on C21:41
ceenethat scores points in favor of doing something with it21:41
KotCzarnyi see fellow c lover?21:41
KotCzarnyc++ is nice but tends to obfuscate too much in the process21:41
ceeneyes, very much21:42
ceenei could survive yappari because, to be honest, it's very well written21:42
ceeneand it's more qt than c++21:42
KotCzarnyqt is c++21:42
ceeneso it's quite constrained to c with classes and little more21:42
ceenein theory yes21:42
ceenein practice it could have been hell itself21:42
ceenebut it's something manageable21:42
KotCzarnyi manage c++ libs by hacking c interfaces into them21:43
KotCzarnymake libyappari21:43
ceenethat's something that i really won't do :P21:43
ceenei don't even know how to write UIs21:43
ceeneif it weren't because the interface is already done21:44
ceenei wouldn't even know where to start coding one21:44
KotCzarny1/ choose toolkit21:44
KotCzarnyi wrote complete app in pygtk because i was lazy21:45
KotCzarnyit started as some proof of concept21:45
KotCzarnythen.. just happened21:46
KotCzarnybut its inefficient a bit21:46
KotCzarnystill, i can close it after setting playlist and core will continue to work, so its passable21:47
ceenethere's a newer version of cellwriter21:49
ceenenot for maemo specifically21:49
ceenewell, there are several versions21:50
ceenelatest says this:21:50
ceene* Possible fix for profile not being saved correctly. Return code was not being correctly checked.21:50
ceenei don't like the 'possible'21:50
ceenei have several like that on yappari21:50
ceeneand they always mean "Don't"21:51
KotCzarnyif it can barf out, it will?21:51
ceenei guess21:51
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Siceloanyone looked at linkedin API? i'm 'forced' to have to use LinkedIn for something .. but it looks like the API is almost closed. Or am I missing something? Basically I would be happy if someone (myself) could write a working LinkedIn application for N90022:16
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KotCzarnythey have web interface?22:17
Sicelowebsite? of course, but microb can't handle it22:17
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ceenewhat happened to my keyboard22:18
ceenethat-s for playing with cellwriter22:19
ceenei think midori from debian is the best browser on maemo right now22:20
ceenei won't get tired of advising it22:20
Siceloi'll try it :)22:20
ceeneby the way, does anybody know a way to sync google contacts, including photo, to anything else, such as owncloud, a carddav server or something more standard?22:24
ceenei've found things which doesn't support pictures, which is what I'm most interested in22:24
bencohceene: "midori from debian"?22:26
bencohstraight from squeeze?22:26
ceenebencoh: in practice that means installing easy debian22:26
bencohI dont really like the easy-debian idea22:26
ceenewhy not?22:27
bencohpartly because of the lack of memory22:27
KotCzarnya bit of overhead22:27
ceenestorage is cheap22:27
ceeneram is not, of course22:27
ceenebut if you're only going to run a couple applications22:28
ceeneyou won't notice22:28
ceenemidori, even having to use debian's libraries and not reusing those from maemo, runs much more faster than any other browser22:28
ceeneso even if in theory using easy debian is an overhead, it simply works better22:28
ceeneif i had another n900 i'd consider just running debian on it, with no maemo22:29
M4rtinKceene: saw a talk from a guy doing just that today on a conference22:29
Siceloit works pretty well22:29
M4rtinKceene: with a vanilla kernel :)22:29
bencohM4rtinK: who?22:29
M4rtinKbencoh: Pavel Machek22:30
SiceloN900 kernel guru22:30
Siceloany link available?22:30
M4rtinKtalk synopsis: (in Czech though)22:31
M4rtinKand IIRC there should be video some time later22:31
bencoh"New Mer is "broken beyond repair" for n900.. as it uses qt5" so true :/22:31
KotCzarnyhmm, pavel machek sounds familiar22:31
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Sicelosubmitted many patches for n90022:34
Siceloi might be mistaken, but i vaguely recall he worked for nokia at some point.22:34
KotCzarnylinks2 browser22:35
KotCzarnyand other stuff22:42
KotCzarnyqweb is web browser22:42
M4rtinKBTW, looks like I have found his slides from the talk22:42
KotCzarnyaged now22:42
M4rtinKthey are in Czech though22:42
l_bratchGood evening!  Is there a way to make osso-xterm (or another Maemo terminal) give an alert when receiving a bell?  (like how xterm can set urgent on bell to flash the window on a regular Linux system)22:45
bencohnow that's a good question22:46
bencohI doubt it, but I guess you could patch it :)22:46
Sicelowhat do you need it for? might be easier to patch your application22:47
KotCzarnynope, bell (ctrl-g) is standard22:47
KotCzarnyand its up to terminal what to do with it22:47
Siceloin short, it is not supported in xterminal22:48
KotCzarnyis it?22:48
KotCzarnylast time i checked xterm did the audio bell22:48
l_bratchThe reason I need it is that I'd like to get irssi alerts to give me a beep and/or an LED flash!  And the reason I'm using irssi rather than XChat is because I can use irssi in a screen session over Mosh so I don't need to worry about roaming between networks...22:49
SiceloN900 xterminal? let's exchange N900s22:49
KotCzarnyyou mean osso-term? :P22:49
bencohI stopped using osso-xterm a really long time ago, I just use xterm22:49
Siceloaha .. l_bratch .. easiest way is use one of the perl scripts. that's why i asked what you want to do with it. adjust the script to play a desired sound22:50
l_bratchSicelo: an irssi perl script?22:50
Siceloyes, from irssi's official repo22:51
l_bratchI was thinking about that, but I can't think of a good way to get a remote script (I'm running irssi remotely!) to somehow traverse back through my screen session and trigger a load alert on my N90022:51
l_bratcha local alert*22:51
Siceloah. i get you22:51
KotCzarnytold you22:51
KotCzarnyhe needs working terminal22:51
l_bratch(hence why I thought utilising terminal bells would be the best answer)22:51
bencohjust tried bells in osso-xterm and it just doesnt do anything ... no flash, no sound, no notif ... nothing. you'll have to patch it :)22:52
l_bratchOK, I'll look into patching it!22:52
Siceloof course bells don't work.22:52
bencohl_bratch: vbell is the indeed the right way :)22:52
l_bratchdoes hildon-desktop trigger an alert/beep/etc. on a normal X11 urgent hint?22:52
bencohthat's the other thing I was gonna check ;)22:53
l_bratchhehe :D22:53
bencohlet's try with xterm22:53
bencoh(the real one)22:53
l_bratchha, I was just installing xterm!22:53
KotCzarnymrxvt? aterm?22:53
bencohl_bratch: nope :(22:55
bencohlet's patch hildon-desktop as well? :D22:56
KotCzarnyit can just play sound22:56
bencohKotCzarny: ?22:56
KotCzarnyon bell22:56
bencohyeah, but H-D properly handling wm urgency hint would be nice22:57
l_bratchbah, confirmed locally too: no response to urgency hint22:59
l_bratchwell, I will try to produce a patch for both things22:59
Siceloceene: which ED image you use?22:59
* l_bratch better get the Maemo SDK working then23:00
l_bratchthanks for the help everyone :)23:00
bencohthat reminds me I should probably patch urxvt to not set the urgencyhint when it has focus23:01
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ceeneSicelo: don't remember...23:18
ceenethe latest?23:18
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