IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2014-03-05

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Sicelohi. it could just be i'm bad at searching, but could someone please ponit me to the location api for Maemo 501:20
r00t|homegoogle: maemo location api  , first two results?01:21
Siceloi seem to not be getting there01:21
* Sicelo retries01:22
Sicelohmm. weird. thanks01:22
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Sicelothe reason i was looking for this is that Nokia Maps seems to not open the right location when i tap on an address specified for a contact01:50
Siceloany ideas  wy this would be the case?01:50
Siceloaddress is entered properly01:50
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r00t|homeno idea01:59
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Siceloby the way, lol, recently, Nokia Maps also has a tendency to give a winding course, when a more straigh/simpler course exists.02:02
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DocScrutinizer05addr based location and routing is off-board02:46
DocScrutinizer05only lon-lat is directly usable by liblocation afaik02:47
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo: ^^^02:47
DocScrutinizer05and actually liblocation doesn't do any of that, liblocation only is a glorified gypsy GPS interface02:48
DocScrutinizer05IOW location != maps02:49
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DocScrutinizer05but yes, I can reproduce that03:08
DocScrutinizer05my location is about 1km off03:09
DocScrutinizer05-- though only tested with one source addr, so I can't claim any relation between source and what's shown03:09
DocScrutinizer05btw does any of you still remember that "click addr to open in maps" only came with PR1.3?03:11
DocScrutinizer05or was it PR1.2?03:11
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DocScrutinizer05yes, reproducable03:14
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DocScrutinizer05tested with a second origin addr and again the shown addr is maybe a 1km off03:15
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DocScrutinizer05this feels like a damn deja-vu, like if I dreamed some fool specified decimal lon-lat and another fool delivers ° and ' "03:21
DocScrutinizer05or vice versa03:22
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DocScrutinizer05hmm, searching for  11° 00'E,  49° 02' 13,7"N  Am Rohrberg, Gänswirtshaus, Weißenburg i. Bay., Landkreis Weißenburg-Gunzenhausen, Mittelfranken, Bayern, 91798, Deutschland, Europäische Union04:04
DocScrutinizer05it gives me:  10° 59' 13,6"E,  49° 01' 58,4"N  5, Gerhart-Hauptmann-Straße, Wülzburger Hang, Weißenburg i. Bay., Landkreis Weißenburg-Gunzenhausen, Mittelfranken, Bayern, 91781, Deutschland, Europäische Union04:04
DocScrutinizer05but only when address entered to contacts and clicked. When I search for the addr directly in ovi maps, it is precise to the point04:05
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DocScrutinizer05roundabout one kilometer off in direction east-north-east:
DocScrutinizer05that's absolutely strange04:11
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Sicelovwin 2306:45
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ApicCan the N900 record from the analog Video Input, too, or just Playback?12:25
hxkaYou can capture it on camera ^_^12:29
hxkaIIRC Neo900 will have that feature12:29
hxkaNo, it won't12:30
ApicThen i'll unbury my DBOX212:30
hxkaI confuesd it with stereo line-in12:31
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DocScrutinizer05we'd love to get that, but too much BOM13:31
DocScrutinizer05you'll need to use a USB video digitizer dongle ;-)13:32
DocScrutinizer05unless somebody comes with a pretty cool and cheap one-chip solution13:33
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DocScrutinizer05matching wequirements of embedded13:34
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SiceloN900 has analog video input?17:34
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hxkaNo, it doesn't17:40
r00t|homeSicelo: output17:40
r00t|homewhat would a phone have video input for17:41
r00t|homeuse usb-host to attach an external video grabber?17:41
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo: exatly, read again17:43
* DocScrutinizer05 waits for $some-user pointing to and asking "how do I make video input of N900 work?"17:44
DocScrutinizer05btw I wonder why instantly forwards my browser to
Sicelomine has out, and of course, always knew that :D17:46
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ChiaSmurfis maemo/n900 affected by the gnutls bug?18:02
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hxkaN0, Maemo uses OpenSSL :)18:12
ChiaSmurfok ty18:12
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*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer0518:16
*** DocScrutinizer05 sets mode: -q Gear_!*@*18:17
Gear_I'm having real trouble keeping the n900 as my main phone :(18:17
*** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer0518:18
raininjais it gone from Qt?18:18
Gear_in thailand the GPS took like 15 minutes to get a lock, I was using a thai sim card and that worked for calls18:18
Gear_back in australia it took another 15 minutes to get a lock18:18
Gear_there's no Agps I don't think18:18
Gear_so I had no friggen gps in thailand which ended up costing me more than just buying a phone while over there18:19
Gear_half the apps don't work anymore. none of the weather apps do. is maemo being maintained with this functionality in mind?18:20
DocScrutinizer05set your supl-server to google18:20
Gear_it is.18:20
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Gear_but the weather apps don't show the correct day anymore18:21
Gear_none of the weather apps actually work anymore18:21
DocScrutinizer05then fix your date and time on device. Will also *massively* improve GPS18:21
Gear_it's the correct time and date zone18:21
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Gear_the maps are working again in australia, but so far only modRana18:23
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* DocScrutinizer05 checks ForeCa and looks forward to a 15°C on Sa and Sun18:23
DocScrutinizer05ovi maps have a defect right now, when calling an addr lookup from contacts. The position of addr is ~1km off in maps app18:25
Gear_just asking whether maemo is being maintained for the functionality it used to have or just so the phone can keep doing it's linux geek stuff18:25
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Gear_the weather app doesn't work here18:25
DocScrutinizer05there are like 5 weather apps18:25
Gear_ok I forget the name, it had a widget where it showed today and the next few days if you wanted it to18:26
DocScrutinizer05and well, "maintenance" is a pretty fuzzy term18:26
Gear_well one day the weather just stopped showing the correct "today" and the maps are a bit f'd up, there's only one that shows me where I actually am18:27
DocScrutinizer05nobody is (or ever was) maintaining whole maemo18:27
Gear_I'm just asking why these bugs showed up and whether anyone really cares18:27
DocScrutinizer05and maps apps use a multitude of different web based data sources18:27
Gear_I'm trying to use this as my only and main phone but these things are pretty important, I'd hate to have to give up on the n90018:27
DocScrutinizer05sorry, those bugs are unrelated18:28
Gear_maps and weather are some of the most important features of having a phone18:28
DocScrutinizer05for each single one you need to find the answer to your above question separately18:28
DocScrutinizer05and particularly web based online apps like maps or weather forecast are dependant on the web site they use to get their data18:29
Gear_ok but these things just happened one day and I can't seem to find out how to fix them18:29
Gear_yeah google weather?18:29
Gear_why would it show the wrong day one day out of the blue, it shows the day after today18:29
DocScrutinizer05I'm pretty sure foreca uses or sth like that18:30
raininja#include <QtMaemo5>18:30
Gear_which is not useful18:30
Gear_also what's the next best OS for this phone?18:31
Gear_is there one that has everything working?18:31
DocScrutinizer05Gear_: as long as not even *you* know *which* weather forcast app you're using, nobody can tell you why it stopped working18:31
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DocScrutinizer05Gear_: and no, there basically is no "other OS" for N90018:32
* sixwheeledbeast checks OMWeather and looks forward to "showers"18:32
sixwheeledbeaston sat-sun18:32
ChiaSmurfom weather had an update ready18:32
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DocScrutinizer05Gear_: considered reflashing?18:33
sixwheeledbeastChiaSmurf: yes but NFC what it does.18:33
sixwheeledbeastchangelog = "Debugging" IIRC18:34
Gear_phone is fine18:34
Gear_well it's not, but reflashing it won't change anything that I know of18:34
DocScrutinizer05you know of ?18:35
Gear_unless some app changed something which isn't really possible18:35
Gear_I stayed away from dodgy crap18:35
DocScrutinizer05to me it seems your idea of maemo OS is kinda ... too holistic18:36
DocScrutinizer05anyway when nothing in your device can get fixed by a reflash then odds are you will need a new phone18:37
Gear_I have 3 here18:37
Gear_I think it was OMweather that was the one that didnt' work anywhere in australia18:37
Gear_showed the wrong day18:37
Gear_maybe it was foreca18:38
Gear_the one with the little animated sun and the details showed humidity and sunset and all kinds of extra stuff18:38
DocScrutinizer05maybe it shown the day of the location you had set it to18:38
DocScrutinizer05which might easily be a day off from day of week in Australia18:38
Gear_why would I set my phone to anywhere else but australia18:39
DocScrutinizer05I think in australia already 2014-03-0618:39
Gear_this phone is totally useless for travelling now I know that much18:39
Gear_but IN australia the weather app doesn't show the right day18:40
Gear_I explained it and I think you know which one I mean18:40
DocScrutinizer05ok, thanks for sharing this insight, even while it's not in line with what other here think. Now can we please stop that useless bashing18:40
Gear_I'm telling you what my phone is doing18:40
Gear_do you have other australian users here?18:41
DocScrutinizer05no, you're telling what you think is going on, and you don't even consider that others here might have advice for you18:41
Gear_are there ANY australian n900 users18:41
Gear_who report things18:42
Gear_do they use things like weather and maps18:42
ChiaSmurfprobaly not18:43
Gear_because day to day all the linux stuff is totally secondary to knowing what to wear, and where the hell to go.18:43
ChiaSmurfthey do have websites that show the weather you know18:43
ChiaSmurfeven if a widget doesnt work right18:43
Gear_the n900 is a very very old phone now18:44
ChiaSmurfi just bought mine18:44
DocScrutinizer05I start to recall why there been a +q18:44
Gear_the widget was useful, the website is irritating and slow18:45
ChiaSmurfwell im sure theres more than one18:45
ChiaSmurfi use, its almost instant, dont know what the australian equivalent would be18:46
Gear_any website. the mozilla browser doesn't work with much anymore18:46
Gear_only opera seems to actually work, and it's that terrible mobile view18:46
DocScrutinizer05Gear_: stop ranting please! we're not interested in your opinions about age of phone, or general critics at browsers unless you suggest alternatives. We all know how old and how slow (or fast) the N900 is18:47
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Gear_uh ok, are there any alternatives to these things18:48
Gear_I do not know of any. I thought maybe a channel full of n900 users might18:49
DocScrutinizer05we're all customers who paid money for their devices just like you did, and nobody of us is responsible for your bad user experience with that device, since we are not doing "maemo maintenance" at large, nor do we customer service here18:49
ChiaSmurfyou could go to #n900 and wait for an answer18:50
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DocScrutinizer05Gear_: I told you foreca works for me. and * sixwheeledbeast checks OMWeather and looks forward to "showers"18:51
ChiaSmurfmy omweather works as well18:52
Gear_and I told you it doesn't work in australia18:54
Gear_then I asked if anyone else even used it in australia that you know of18:55
DocScrutinizer05so, there are already TWO weather forecast apps supposed to work. When they don't for you, don't you think the problem could be at your end?18:55
sixwheeledbeastfirefox on N900 has been unusable for a long time. Opera or MicroB.18:55
Gear_yeah microB doesn't work with any of the things I'd want to use it for18:56
Gear_and opera is opera18:56
sixwheeledbeastAlso it may depend which version you are using18:56
sixwheeledbeastFell free to contribute to embedlite18:56
infobotsixwheeledbeast meant: Feel free to contribute to embedlite18:56
Gear_should I not be using the latest version of everything?18:56
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sixwheeledbeastthat also depends on what you are calling "latest"18:57
Gear_the last one to come out in the repositories18:57
sixwheeledbeastand which repos/catalogues you have enabled18:57
DocScrutinizer05opera? repository?18:57
Gear_apps extras extras devel18:58
Gear_mostly extras devel is never used18:58
Gear_because most of those things don't work18:59
DocScrutinizer05extras-devel is supposed to not stay enabled at all18:59
sixwheeledbeastopera 11 seems to be the most stable IMO. As for OMWeather I am using the latest extras-devel versions including the DB files.18:59
Gear_I use things out of extras18:59
Gear_then there's all the wifi hacking stuff but that gets boring quickly19:00
Gear_since anything past WEP takes longer than the battery19:00
DocScrutinizer05I don't, but nevertheless I'm afk now19:01
* DocScrutinizer05 think in 1st-level-helpdesk domain they must have a name for such days19:01
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Gear_sixwheeledbeast I'll have to try the extras devel OMweather19:02
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Gear_opera is 12.something here, I don't know how to roll back to 1119:03
Gear_opera isn't really the problem19:03
Gear_everything else going past microB is, I have to use bare html for some sites19:04
Gear_no flash support but there never really was any19:04
Gear_cutetube seems to never load the video, I'm not sure why19:05
DocScrutinizer05please stop unqualified rant!19:05
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Gear_cutetube never loads any video ever. it has the loading screen then just goes back to the search function19:06
Gear_does meego work on this phone?19:06
DocScrutinizer05I already told you there's no other OS for N90019:07
DocScrutinizer05why change OS? why not change device?19:07
Gear_backlit keyboard.19:07
DocScrutinizer05get a nice android device! cheaper, more modern, faster19:08
Gear_and linux19:08
Gear_you said you were AFK19:08
DocScrutinizer05android is linux too, they say19:08
Gear_I hate android19:08
DocScrutinizer05I hate rant that doesn't point towards any direction for the better19:08
Gear_you asked why not get a modern device, that is my answer19:09
DocScrutinizer05that wasn't a question, that been a suggestion19:10
DocScrutinizer05since all your rant here won't change your user experience with N90019:10
Gear_go AFK19:10
DocScrutinizer05aaah that been the reason19:11
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DocScrutinizer05dos1: you just missed a really great experience19:14
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DocScrutinizer05[Wed 05 March 2014] [18:12:04] <Gear_> you're the one trying to steal money for that n900 motherboard that still doesn't exist19:15
DocScrutinizer05I honestly never knew that there could be anything less than absolute vacuum anywhere19:16
sixwheeledbeastagain cutetube is about which version, youtube keep changing things so marxian has to fix it, no issues here.19:16
DocScrutinizer05sixwheeledbeast: you can stop, I +q'ed him again19:17
sixwheeledbeastI know but FTR, there are answers to all of them rant topics.19:17
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DocScrutinizer05yep, that's the point. Or rather that he's absolutely not interested in learning about them19:18
DocScrutinizer05instead continues to rant and insult people19:18
DocScrutinizer05he had a +q for exactly that, asked me to remove it, and a mere 30min later been at same point again19:19
sixwheeledbeastIf you really want to get the best out of your N900 you have to commit effort to the community. Especially now post-Nokia.19:20
sixwheeledbeastAs you say ranting helps noone19:21
DocScrutinizer05and just for the record: a) for now I don't even have access to a single cent of the donations to Neo900. b) the donations are for *DEVELOPMENT* of a new N900 mainboard. So how could any such mainboard already exist?19:27
DocScrutinizer05I won't go on at c) d) e) f)... since it's to plain obviously silly an accusation19:29
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raininjai do not want to rely on old code dammit20:02
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DocScrutinizer05copy it! ;-P20:12
DocScrutinizer05`touch /path/to/old/code.c`20:12
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DocScrutinizer05it's a rather strange notion that code gets "old" like vegetables20:13
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raininjaDocScrutinizer05: well in this case, it is even more of a pita21:57
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raininjaI am just trying to get this code up to modern, then to qt5 for sailfish21:58
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DocScrutinizer05tbh I dunno what you're talking about22:31
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raininjafk it, building my own qt for maemo522:47
ShadowJKgps pretty much needs coldstart after moving large distances, in my experience :)22:51
ShadowJKforeca works for me, on N810 :)22:52
DocScrutinizer05ShadowJK: on hindisght it seems pretty unclear to me if that guy moved at all22:53
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DocScrutinizer05whatever, GPS is known to work much better with carrier side assistence22:54
ShadowJKSeems impossible to get rid of "mobile view" on any "modern" browser these days :(22:55
infobotrrlp is probably the Radio Resource LCS (Location Service) Protocol as specified first in GSM TS 04.31, or
DocScrutinizer05RRLP, right, that's been the name22:55
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ShadowJKThat thing isn't used afaik :)22:57
ShadowJKIt's all cellid, and hoping google/nokia knows where that cellid is located22:57
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DocScrutinizer05most likely not22:57
ShadowJKAs my non-gps location and reported accuracy changes consistent with the local celltowers when I switch 2g to 3g :)22:58
DocScrutinizer05I definitely seen a go/nogo in a A/B comparison between a N900 with and one without SIM, both locale DE_de and with a previous fix and with no network connectivity on either WLAN or WWAN22:59
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DocScrutinizer05I *bet* BB5 firmware *is* using that23:00
DocScrutinizer05and the go/nogo swapped with SIM from one N900 to other one23:02
ShadowJKIf I change supl provider to the broken one, best I get without gps is middle of country with estimatedaccuracy of 600km23:03
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DocScrutinizer05but "without GPS", what are we talking about?23:03
ShadowJKOnly network location23:04
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DocScrutinizer05AGPS is not about complementary means to GPS to determine location, it's about helping GPS to get a faster/better fix23:04
DocScrutinizer05when you got NO gps and NO cellid, it's pretty obvious your device has a hard time to determine your location23:05
ShadowJKYeah but it helps if it knows where you're roughly, when it starts looking for sats?23:06
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DocScrutinizer05+- 500km or somesuch23:06
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DocScrutinizer05SpeedEvil: maybe you can help us out here?23:08
DocScrutinizer05what *really* helps is right time23:09
SpeedEvilIn principle, yes, it helps. In practice, there seem to be bugs that can be confused by mis-set time, and possibly also mis-set location, and never come up with a position23:10
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DocScrutinizer05and, sorry, I just notice that I might have missed to set right time on my A/B comparison when swapping SIM. Dunno if my bupbats were still OK back when23:10
SpeedEvilreset AGPS, put it outside in view of the sky for 15 min or so.23:11
SpeedEvilWith a correctly set time.23:11
SpeedEvilIf it doesn't get a locttion then, it's pretty much never going to.23:11
ShadowJKyeah I've had to use the reset app a couple times23:11
DocScrutinizer05yeah, actually a broken/confused (by wrong time e.g.) A-GPS is worse than a GPS without A, I'd say23:12
DocScrutinizer05better search for all possible SV than only for those that are in an outdated almanach23:13
SpeedEvilSigh. So much pointless crap. Got to fix the kitchen window now. :/ Zero time for fun stuff.23:13
DocScrutinizer05SpeedEvil: hoe did you survive the terrible weather at your side?23:14
DocScrutinizer05I heard about floods and storms and dunno what23:15
DocScrutinizer05Hope everything OK23:15
SpeedEvilNo flooding here - it's been a moderately OK winter - it's just not enough energy to get the basics done. :/23:16
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DocScrutinizer05no flooding, good! :-)23:16
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SpeedEvilAnd screw it - I'm going to sleep. Night.23:17
* DocScrutinizer05 tries to leave flat for dinner. About time to do this once more23:17
DocScrutinizer05night SpeedEvil, have a relaxing rest!23:18
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