IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2013-10-14

*** jrocha has quit IRC00:02
*** _rd_ has quit IRC00:02
*** sq-one has quit IRC00:04
*** janemba has quit IRC00:13
*** janemba has joined #maemo00:14
*** janemba has joined #maemo00:19
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo00:31
*** lexik has quit IRC00:31
*** lexik has joined #maemo00:31
*** dafox has quit IRC00:35
*** teotwaki has joined #maemo00:38
*** lexik has quit IRC00:38
*** lexik has joined #maemo00:39
*** Custodian has quit IRC00:43
*** lexik has quit IRC00:43
*** Vanadis has joined #maemo00:43
*** lexik has joined #maemo00:44
*** shentey has quit IRC00:47
*** lexik has quit IRC00:47
*** Vanadis_ has quit IRC00:47
*** lexik has joined #maemo00:49
*** at1as has joined #maemo00:56
*** lexik has quit IRC00:56
*** OkropNick has quit IRC01:09
*** LauRoman has quit IRC01:13
*** node00 has quit IRC01:15
*** robotanarchy has quit IRC01:16
*** tzafrir has joined #maemo01:16
*** robotanarchy has joined #maemo01:18
*** teotwaki has quit IRC01:24
*** Macer has quit IRC01:29
*** zammy has quit IRC01:31
*** Martix_ has quit IRC01:37
mashinaE: Encountered a section with no Package: header01:40
mashinaE: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/
mashinaapt-get update gets same thing01:41
mashinafixed it, had to kill off apt lists01:47
mashinaanyways, dealing with cert errors01:47
*** florian has quit IRC01:48
*** Macer has joined #maemo01:50
dos1hmm, is there any way to get a bit better results from front cam?01:50
dos1in quite bright room with small light headed directly at my face, I can see my nose :D01:51
*** Macer has quit IRC01:52
mashinathe front facing cam is shitty01:55
mashinatrust me it's a LOT worse on N800 ;)01:55
mashinaanyways, i want autoconf, where can I get that?01:55
mashinaautoconf2.64 is self-described as obsolete and it's a broken package anyways01:55
*** cybrNaut has quit IRC01:56
*** cybrNaut has joined #maemo01:57
dos1is it really *that* shitty? I would expect people I talk with to see more than end of my nose :)01:59
kolp_Reminds me that my n900's main cam is somwhow b0rked. When pressing the shutte rbutton the focus rectangle will always turn red, never green02:04
kolp_Needless to say that pictures are crap02:04
mashinamy brother had an xperia play with a very green tinted camera02:04
*** kolp_ is now known as kolp02:04
kolpdos1: Have you tried the mirror app? The picture it shows is semi-acceptable02:06
dos1kolp: yes, that result is from mirrot app02:06
kolpdos1: back then mirror's author said the quality is limite dby hardware02:12
kolpAh, and there is the banner when starting it02:12
xesdos1: my opinion about the front camera is that there is some N900 that gives worst images02:14
dos1it looks better in video call02:14
dos1much better02:14
dos1i can see my face there02:14
mashinai NEVER use a front camera anyways02:14
dos1an now, after using video call, it looks better in mirror too :D02:15
mashinathe nasty cameras like front cameras are betyter as entropy genegrators instead of picture machines02:15
kolpTrue, I vaguely rember that video call quality was much better...02:15
infobotkolp meant: True, I vaguely remember that video call quality was much better...02:15
mashinai live in the dark so they dark shite pics ;)02:15
kolpdos1: Heh, interesting02:16 seems incredible that nokia used this f**ing orrible camera module02:16
*** SmilyOrg is now known as Smily02:18
*** Ariadeno has quit IRC02:20
mashinaanyways, anyone use autconf (blech) on phone?02:23
*** XXXXX has joined #maemo02:26
*** XXXXX has quit IRC02:26
mashinafor the people who got their N900s second hand - how much did you pay?02:30
mashinaI paid $100 in Canadian dollars, with $20 shipping02:31
mashinai'd say I got a very good deal02:31
*** xes has quit IRC02:33
kworkthats nice price indeed02:48
mashinaeverything works, in great condition02:49
mashinaeven usb and sim tray (i snapped it off and it came right back on! it's really fiddly though)02:49
*** at1as has quit IRC02:51
kworkmy sim tray seems to be failing :(02:53
Hurrianmashina: got my 5th N900 for $2002:57
Hurrianit was mint (lady-owned...) except that the USB port fell out02:57
Hurriansoldered a new one on, good as new!02:58
*** janemba has quit IRC02:59
*** janemba has joined #maemo02:59
*** janemba has quit IRC03:01
*** janemba has joined #maemo03:04
*** HylianSavior has quit IRC03:05
*** HylianHero has joined #maemo03:05
*** nikosapi has joined #maemo03:10
*** M4rtinK has quit IRC03:11
*** janemba has quit IRC03:17
*** janemba has joined #maemo03:28
*** nox- has quit IRC03:35
*** Macer has joined #maemo03:54
Macerwell. nice to see that i have been fighting with my router just to discover it is ddwrt that was the culprit03:54
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo03:58
*** janemba has quit IRC03:59
ecc3gthe problem is still your router?03:59
*** janemba has joined #maemo04:00
*** kolp has quit IRC04:08
*** kolp_ has joined #maemo04:08
*** at1as has joined #maemo04:08
Macerit was04:09
Maceri installed tomato. no more issues04:09
mashinawhat router?04:09
Macerit was ddwrt04:10
mashinai have to use isp stock router with stock firmware04:10
mashinaMacer: no the router04:10
mashinait's like asking what model of phone and you say android04:10
Maceri was answering ecc3g heh04:10
Macerit's a wrt610n04:10
mashinai have an actiontec R1000H here04:11
Macerheh. it was awful04:12
Macerhad me pulling out my hair04:12
Macerit is nice now04:15
Maceralthough i'm getting some latency that i need to figure out04:15
*** Defiant has quit IRC04:17
*** goldkatze has quit IRC04:18
mashinadoes the ctrl and shift keys feel a little creaky/suishy to you.04:18
Macerno. heh04:19
Maceri'm talking about from a laptop04:19
Macerthe n900 is acting a big laggy too04:19
Maceri have to check out the options and see where the problem is04:19
Macercould just be crappy signal although the surface is going 6MB/s04:19
Macerbefore i was happy if i hit 1MB/s04:19
HurrianMacer: tomato <304:20
Macerthe 2.4GHz radio seems laggy04:21
Hurrianthe newest builds finally have muli-ssid, bringing feature parity with DD-WRT04:21
Maceri'm trying to figure out the problem. n900 is really bad04:21
HurrianMacer: sequential transfer performance, or burst transfers?04:22
*** goldkatze has joined #maemo04:22
mashinayou have a surface?04:23
*** Defiant has joined #maemo04:23
*** goldkatze has quit IRC04:25
*** dos1 has quit IRC04:25
Macerwth is wrong with this 2.4GHz line? heh04:26
Macerit is lagged to hell04:26
*** jonwil has joined #maemo04:26
mashinaMacer: rt or pro04:27
Macerespecially on n90004:27
Macerthe laptop doesn't do it nearly as bad04:28
mashinado you like it?04:28
mashinawhat do you do with it?04:28
Maceryeah. it's actually not bad at all04:28
Macermostly just layman stuff04:28
Macerbrowse, office work, facebook, etc heh04:28
mashinai was considering a surface because its portable and itd run teamviewer (what i use for remote support)04:29
mashinai run windows 8 on 2006 HW perfectly so i think it'd be fast on rt/tegra, yes?04:30
Maceri got the rt because it is awesome with the battery life04:30
Macerand is always on04:30
Macerpro sleeps04:30
Macerbut then again the pro is an x86 so you can install anything on it04:30
mashinais there lag? (not network, usage)04:30
Maceryou can "jailbreak" the rt and install some apps04:30
Macernot that i've noticed04:30
mashinaMacer: if only official04:30
Macerti's actually rather quick04:31
Maceryeah. it isn't heh04:31
Macerthe jailbreak isn't a supported method04:31
mashinai'd love for ms to approve and sign desktop apps04:31
Maceryeah but i doubt they will04:31
mashinamaybe thered be a maemoesque community04:31
Macerbecause then everybody would just dev for the arm lol04:31
Maceri mean.. there isn't much you need the desktop for anyways04:31
mashinabecause the android community is a joke04:31
Macereven the apps i did install i hardly use . like putty04:31
Maceryou mean the high school virgin club? :)04:31
mashinassh is my n900s main use04:31
mashinaMacer: theres no organization at all04:32
Maceroh i use my n900 for almost everything04:32
Maceryou find that in all open communities lol04:32
Macernot just android04:32
mashinaupstream is opaque04:32
Macerif android lost google04:32
mashinaandroid dev process is opaque04:32
Macerandroid would be a nothing in a year or two04:32
Macerjust like any other "open" project that loses its company support04:32
mashinacustom roms are a foolish endavour (zipaligned deodexed)04:32
Maceri still don't understand why they call them "ROMs"04:33
mashinacommunity doesn't focus on quality or contributing to open source04:33
mashinagoogle is closing parts of android04:33
mashinasad world in mobile04:33
Macerthey are closing parts of google tbh04:33
Macerstarting with connectivity with win8 and xmpp heh04:33
mashinai was never in google ecosystem04:34
Maceri used it quite a bit.. but it was a decade long bait and switch04:34
Macernow they'll start closing everything off04:34
mashinai was a little concerned they were tracking people for years before prism04:34
Macernot tracking them like that04:34
mashinai was slightly but never fully paranoid04:34
Macerjust tracking them inasmuch they want to advertise to you better04:34
Macerbut that was a known04:34
mashinai imagine theyd keep your data with them only04:35
mashinawhy share with stasi if you dont have to?04:35
Macerbecause people buy it ;)04:35
Macerif something can be sold someone will sell it04:35
Maceryou didn't think all that free stuff was actually free did you? hehe04:36
*** goldkatze has joined #maemo04:36
Macerbut google realized that it now has a large enough user base where it can close off shop04:36
Macerand handle everything and run exactly like ms and apple04:37
ecc3gjust hope people realize that their data is not theirs anymore when trading it for convenience...04:37
Macerand wean the community off them and then abandon them lol04:37
Macerecc3g: yeah. pretty much.04:37
Macerah well. time for me to go. ttyl.04:37
* ecc3g runs own server... only way to do it.04:37
* mashina shares with friends04:38
mashinabecause its more fun when you split costs and avoid duping04:39
mashinathat and it feels like a mainframe with timesharing04:39
ecc3git's all your choice when you decide to give everything away...04:39
*** robbiethe1st has joined #maemo04:40
mashinalooking for good caldav server04:41
mashinafriend likes owncloud but we dont need owncloud's other bloat (that and he runs private instance on his private serv)04:41
mashinaplus owncloud is flaky04:42
ecc3gnah, need to avoid big packages of bloat...  I'll trade inconvenience for security.04:42
ecc3gor rather, i don't mind the inconvenience as long as I get the security...04:43
mashinai bet youre an openbsd user04:43
mashinai love openbsd but im not paranoid04:44
mashinajust practical04:44
ecc3gno 100% linux04:44
ecc3gI run maemo after all... :o04:44
mashinai myself would drop linux (except maemo) completely if it just had virtualization04:45
ecc3ggo and port it and have someone steal it and sell it?04:45
mashinaoh no gpl purists04:46
ecc3ggo ahead and port it, I'm not stopping you.04:47
mashinaport what04:47
ecc3gvirtualization software.04:47
mashinait has qemu but its in software04:48
mashinayoud need kernel level changes afaik for hardware or even ring virt04:48
ecc3gport kvm... oh wait you can't, go design your own from scratch.04:48
ecc3gand give it away in the openbsd kernel... and watch it show up in ios04:49
*** mschlens has joined #maemo04:54
*** kolp_ has quit IRC04:56
*** mschlens_ has quit IRC04:58
*** beford has joined #maemo04:59
*** goldkatze has quit IRC05:05
*** guerby has quit IRC05:05
*** guerby has joined #maemo05:11
*** at1as has quit IRC05:46
*** at1as has joined #maemo05:47
*** lxp has joined #maemo06:01
*** lxp1 has quit IRC06:03
*** maybeWTF has quit IRC06:33
*** maybeArgh has joined #maemo06:33
DocScrutinizer05the convo about frontcam was very inspiring. I think we need to check indepth how it#s handled and what might apps like "video call2 do to the hw config in cam chip06:55
DocScrutinizer05yes it's known to need lots of light to work semi-decent06:56
DocScrutinizer05it's also known from early N900 days that Nokia shiped several camdriver improvements to main cam but iirc also to frontcam06:56
*** robbiethe1st has quit IRC06:56
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: ^^^ you might be interested in those details as of convo above06:57
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: hmm?06:58
DocScrutinizer05abysmal quality of frontcam when using mirror, until you did a video call after which is seems to be much better. Interesting, isn't it?06:59
DocScrutinizer05("mirror" is an app)06:59
freemangordonno, it isn't, it just shows that mirror is of bad quality06:59
freemangordonthere is V2L API to control front cam properties, obviously mirror isn't using it07:00
DocScrutinizer05but how would frontcam the "get better" after doing a video call, for mirror app?07:01
freemangordonit is the same story about gtalk video has way better quality than skype07:01
DocScrutinizer05wouldn't cam get powered down and reset each time it gets opened?07:01
freemangordonsure, but driver restores what's been last set07:01
DocScrutinizer05s/the7then get better...07:02
freemangordonor v2l, not sure which layer07:02
DocScrutinizer05so where's the "persistance storage"?07:02
freemangordonthe same happens if you use man camera through gstreamer07:02
freemangordonif you want good quality, you need to open the camera-ui, close it and then use gstreamer07:03
DocScrutinizer05kernel module var area?07:03
DocScrutinizer05cam chip registers themselves?07:03
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: not sure, but I think it is kernel, as it saves the context on suspend and restores it on resume, iirc07:04
freemangordonthe context == registers07:04
DocScrutinizer05yep, so a modprobe -r should "fix" that, eh?07:04
freemangordonmaybe, never tried07:04
DocScrutinizer05IOW unloading the kernel driver module should kill qulaity again07:04
DocScrutinizer05we need sb to test this07:05
DocScrutinizer05I never even noticed the effect to start with07:05
freemangordonever used the mirror app?07:05
DocScrutinizer05and yes the quality is abysmal07:06
freemangordonfor sure the quality is bad07:06
DocScrutinizer05I never noticed it getting better, not to think of *how* to do that07:06
DocScrutinizer05no video calls here07:06
freemangordonmake a video call :)07:06
DocScrutinizer05never managed to do a single video call in my life07:06
freemangordonregister 2 google accounts and call your PC from your n90007:07
freemangordonor the opposite07:07
freemangordonvideo call that is07:07
DocScrutinizer05I tried from one SIP client to another one on same account, but my SIP provider doesn't even support video calls at all07:07
*** ZogG_laptop has quit IRC07:07
freemangordongtalk supports07:07
DocScrutinizer05I for sure won't register a google account07:08
freemangordonas is skype :P07:08
DocScrutinizer05no skype on my devices07:08
DocScrutinizer05thus I said "we need somebody..."07:08
DocScrutinizer05best somebody who actually noticed the improvement already07:09
freemangordonno options left then, but you can ply a bit with mplayer, afaik it should support camera properties07:09
freemangordonso you can tweak exposure etc from it07:09
DocScrutinizer05sure, I know07:09
freemangordonbtw what do you want to "test"?07:10
DocScrutinizer05but I'd prefer to get the improvement anf reversal thereof by rmmod approved first07:10
freemangordonuse mplayer to put brightness/exposure to max, check the quality with mirror, rmmod, modprobe, check agaimn07:11
DocScrutinizer05that would assume I see an improvement and I'd know to play with mplayer07:11
DocScrutinizer05I want the effect as reported by dos getting checked via "rmmod"07:12
DocScrutinizer05that's all07:12
freemangordonyou'll see improvement, that is for sure, I already tried it an year or so ago :)07:12
DocScrutinizer05once we know how that improvement works, we can think of proper initialization on modprobe07:12
freemangordonI even got mirror sources thinking to fix it, but I gave up as there were more interesting things to play with07:13
DocScrutinizer05this shouldn't get done on a per-app basis. udev is the right place to invoke a post-modprobe configurator daemon07:14
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: you can't, setting camera props should be done on as-needed basis07:14
DocScrutinizer05this would fix _all_ usecases that forget to do proper init themselves07:14
DocScrutinizer05sure, but it can't hurt to have optimized defaults07:15
freemangordonno, you can't know in advance what the light conditions will be when those broken apps are started07:15
DocScrutinizer05obviously what modprobe resp kernel driver init gives you is suboptimal07:15
freemangordonthe same for the resolution btw07:16
freemangordonthe default that driver gives you, is everything set to min07:16
freemangordoninc resolution07:16
freemangordonwhich is sane IMO07:16
DocScrutinizer05so what? since you can't know which light we will have, you configure the module to 1billion lux ambient in kernel init?07:16
freemangordonit is up to the application to decide how to use the camera07:17
DocScrutinizer05that's insane approach07:17
freemangordonthe option is to implement some "auto mode" in the driver07:17
DocScrutinizer05every hardware should come up with semi-usable defaults, not any crap that leaves it semi-broken07:17
DocScrutinizer05obviously frontcam startup defaults are unbearable for *every* usecase07:18
DocScrutinizer05they aren't optimized for *anything*07:18
freemangordonsure they aren't, but again, it is not the driver to guess what application wants to do07:19
DocScrutinizer05so no matter for what you optinize them - nightview or flash use - OPTIMIZE THEM for something!07:19
freemangordonit is the application to tell the driver07:19
DocScrutinizer05again, that's an insane rationale07:19
freemangordoncould be, but this is what I think07:19
DocScrutinizer05ok, what are the values you'd pick for defaults of frontcam?07:20
DocScrutinizer05your birthday?07:20
freemangordoneverything on min07:20
DocScrutinizer05or something that at least *sometimes* works?07:21
freemangordonand this falls in your "sane defaults" category :)07:21
DocScrutinizer05why not everything at max?07:21
freemangordonno reason07:21
DocScrutinizer05no, it does NOT07:21
freemangordonthat is why it is hard to define "sane default values"07:21
DocScrutinizer05sane default values are what works best with the most common usecase07:21
DocScrutinizer05it's not at all hard to define07:22
freemangordonthe most common usecase for the front cam is video calling07:22
chainsawbikefreemangordon, DocScrutinizer05, to add my 2c - the app _needs_ to be changing these as it is environment Dependant, but semi-usable default would be nice (if only for testing)07:23
DocScrutinizer05hten make kernel module configue the chip to the values needed for video calling, on module init07:23
DocScrutinizer05otherwise I insist in using MY birthday date for register init, not min, max, or freemangordon's birthday ;-P07:24
freemangordonchainsawbike: you can use V2L API to set the camera to whatever you like, V2L is still driver "layer" albeit not in the kernel07:25
DocScrutinizer05that's all fine and would be sad if it wasn't like that07:25
freemangordonmaybe V2L have a way to set some defaults, dunno07:25
DocScrutinizer05but that doesn't change *anything* in the reasoning to get *sane* defaults on module init07:26
*** beford has quit IRC07:26
kerioi don't think you can have sane defaults07:26
*** jeropun has joined #maemo07:27
keriocamera settings depend on the outside world too much07:27
DocScrutinizer05sure, we can easily do a helper that gets invoked by udev on modprobe and opens cam for 0.01s with correct parameters, exploiting gstreamer or whatever you see fit07:27
DocScrutinizer05kerio: please read backscroll!!!!07:27
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: and that would make absolutely no difference to now07:28
DocScrutinizer05kerio: while you can't have sane defaults maybe, this is no exciuse to have MAD defaults07:28
freemangordonbecause I am saying that putting everything to min is best for me as I livo on the beach and use the cam only between 10 and 1607:28
DocScrutinizer05even then you can't use that default since it simply doesn't work07:29
DocScrutinizer05it's a flaw of kernel module devels who simply didn't think of initializing their values to something semi-decent. Just like with current-max on LP552307:30
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: and what about is someone changes those settings07:30
DocScrutinizer05then they are changed?07:31
DocScrutinizer05don't get you07:31
freemangordonbut they are no more those "works for everyone" defaults07:31
freemangordonshould we keep them or reset?07:31
DocScrutinizer05DOENT work for everyone is what we got now07:31
DocScrutinizer05aaah *now* I get it07:32
DocScrutinizer05I'm talking about kernel init07:32
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: see, it is not only the exposure etc, it is also the resolution07:32
freemangordonwhat is the best resolution?07:32
DocScrutinizer05that's why I asked for checing if those persistent settings go away with rmmod07:32
DocScrutinizer05when they vanish with rmmod you want have new sane ones with insmod07:33
freemangordonand not only the resolution, but framerate too07:33
DocScrutinizer05all quite irrelevant07:33
DocScrutinizer05every app is free to change that to whatever it needs07:33
freemangordonand not only free to, but have to07:34
DocScrutinizer05I#m talking about the initial defaults07:34
freemangordonI know07:34
*** Custodian has joined #maemo07:34
DocScrutinizer05and those HAVE TO be saner than they are now, cause the ones we have now are defunct07:34
* chainsawbike would set it to work under the ambient lighting of my workspace by default to make testing easy and call any application broken that did not adjust it for the current conditions 07:34
DocScrutinizer05chainsawbike: exactly07:35
DocScrutinizer05since that's most likely the most common usecase anyway07:35
freemangordonBut a camera application that simply starts a stream without giving the user a tool to control the camera is simply broken. IMO07:35
DocScrutinizer05so what?07:35
freemangordonand I would call that WFM approach :P07:35
DocScrutinizer05yes, it is07:35
DocScrutinizer05I would call that a "let's punish them2 approach by the kernel driver devels07:36
*** ZogG_laptop has joined #maemo07:36
*** ZogG_laptop has quit IRC07:36
*** ZogG_laptop has joined #maemo07:36
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: if we assume something is broken, I'd rather say it is V2L, not the module07:37
DocScrutinizer05"ooh your PSU exploded? too bad, you shouldn't have activated it without proper config of mains power range before you do so"07:37
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: on the opposite, keeping everything to min is the safest approach07:37
DocScrutinizer05in my book every module should come up with sane safe working defaults07:38
DocScrutinizer05safe for what, goddamn?07:38
freemangordonfor your PSU07:38
freemangordonI took your example07:38
DocScrutinizer05safe for making every crappy app fail epically07:38
freemangordonit is not the kernal that should babysit crappy apps07:39
freemangordonkernel even07:39
DocScrutinizer05in my PSU example keeping mains voltage to min is a sure way to make the PSU explode ;-P07:39
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: you're arguing on a "let's punish them,CBA to init that to 100 instead of using the compiler default" approach07:40
jonwilhmmm, I recon I could clone libdevlock if it wasnt for the totally confusing function that actually stores the devicelock in CAL :P07:41
DocScrutinizer05keeping everything at 0 on module init has ZILCH rationale nor benefit07:41
freemangordonDocScrutinizer51: if we apply "sane defaults" to the audio for example, what would be it?07:41
DocScrutinizer05except for one default volume path07:42
freemangordonexactly the same for the video07:42
DocScrutinizer05since video is a sensor, no actor07:42
freemangordonwhat about microphone?07:42
freemangordonshould it be disabled or enabled? with what gain?07:43
DocScrutinizer05obviously should be set to a sane boost level and gain to semidecently handel a 60dBm07:43
DocScrutinizer05though that's ALSA stuff, not kernel module. And ALSA DOES that already07:44
freemangordonthere is no "sane level" for sensors which vastly depend on the outside world conditions07:44
DocScrutinizer05it restores last settings on boot time07:44
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: stop telling nonsense, of course there are settings that are more sane than others07:44
*** dafox has joined #maemo07:45
DocScrutinizer05when there is no "sane level2 in your book, then why arguing against my request to change those settings from 0 to maybe 100 or whatever I may come up with?07:45
chainsawbikefreemangordon, yes it is very dependant on external factors but what is the harm in setting it up to work somewhere by default ( a dev workspace for example)07:46
DocScrutinizer05there *is* something like a "standard" environment07:46
freemangordonmy point is - you can change the defaults to whatever you like (in the kernel), but broken apps are just that - broken apps, and it is not the kernel that sould fix them07:47
DocScrutinizer05and a sensor should work OOTB for such standard environment07:47
DocScrutinizer05SO WHAT??????07:47
DocScrutinizer05"punsih them!!"?07:47
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: what is the standard environment for a handheld device?07:47
DocScrutinizer05earth, 12 noon, aequator07:48
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: exactly, punish them don't tolerate lazy developers07:48
freemangordoncomeon, setting camera properties is like 50 lines of code07:49
DocScrutinizer05it's NOT "inside an atomic explosion" or "11km deep in marian trench"07:49
*** DrCode has quit IRC07:49
DocScrutinizer05SO WHAT??????????????????????????07:49
* chainsawbike likes a dev workspace so you get something resembling a picture not garbage when you first init the camera, rather than wondering wtf the garbage you are getting is, and wasting time realizing it really is the camera output07:49
DocScrutinizer05chainsawbike: ack07:50
*** DrCode has joined #maemo07:50
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: and you wonder why lots of app devels and users think kernel devels are mad and assholes?07:51
freemangordonguys, mirror is not even setting the resolution, what "sane defaults" we talk about here07:51
DocScrutinizer05I'm NOT talking about mirror app, at least07:51
chainsawbikefreemangordon, i consider mirror _broken_07:51
DocScrutinizer05forget that friggin app07:52
DocScrutinizer05I want a sensor to work OOTB, no matter how poorly07:52
freemangordonand that is what you have07:52
DocScrutinizer05it makes no sense to initialize it to a state where it doesn't work at all07:52
*** drussell has quit IRC07:53
DocScrutinizer05definizely not true for frontcam07:53
freemangordonit works OOTB and if there is enough light around, you'll even see an image of youself07:53
DocScrutinizer05meh, i'll patch that shite myself and upstream it. Don't need you for that07:54
chainsawbikeDocScrutinizer05, enough light...07:54
DocScrutinizer05setting everything to zero is definitely the most idiotic setting you could find for cam07:56
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: try it (upstreaming) but I bet you'll get exactly the same responce as mine :)07:56
DocScrutinizer05even setting everything to max sensitivity is better than that07:56
freemangordonthough... who knows07:57
* jonwil wonders if reverse engineering libdevlock and devlocktool is worth the effort...07:57
DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: I bet against that, since I can support my point using the cam manuf's suggested range of opperation values from datasheet, and setting values for the module somewhwre to the arithmetic or geometric middle of those is for sure a more sound approach than setting everything to zero07:58
jonwilprobably not :)07:58
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: ok07:58
freemangordonwhat about resolution and framerate?07:59
DocScrutinizer05you said yourself it's usually used for video07:59
freemangordonfrontcam supports 180x120, 320x240 and 640x48007:59
freemangordonnot sure about the framerates08:00
DocScrutinizer05that makes VGA 25fps in my book, nit 0 fps and 0 resolution08:00
freemangordonnot sure n900 can handle VGA@25fps video streaming08:00
DocScrutinizer05and of course you configure sensors to their full capability, not to sth downsized08:00
*** LauRoman has joined #maemo08:01
freemangordonskype uses 180x120, gtalk 320x240 iirc08:01
DocScrutinizer05when N900 can't support 25fps then you obviously set it to the max it *can* support08:01
freemangordonand ofc it depends on what the other side can handle08:02
freemangordonand iirc ususlly video call is @ 12fps08:02
DocScrutinizer05the sensor shall work by the most simple means, like "cat $input >$output"08:02
DocScrutinizer05and it should provide the best it can, in that mode08:03
DocScrutinizer05this is a general rule for all sensors08:03
DocScrutinizer05so max resolution, max sampling rate, max sensitivity and so on08:04
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: maybe you should check what ISP in OMAP is08:04
DocScrutinizer05maybe I should stop arguinfg with somebody who thinks "punish them" is a good approach since it doesn't require the kernel devel to muse about sane defaults08:05
freemangordonit is not only the sensor (and its module), there is dedicated HW who does exactly what you need, it even gives yout the histogram08:05
DocScrutinizer05and I couldn't care less about that last point of yours since it won't change my notion on this08:06
freemangordonok, lets agree to disagree :)08:06
DocScrutinizer05setting everything to zero just because compiler initializes vars to zero is a poor and silly approach08:06
DocScrutinizer05pathetic approach even08:06
DocScrutinizer05as soon as you start to think about that, you easily find ~65534 better values to initialize than just zero08:08
*** dafox has quit IRC08:08
DocScrutinizer05and probably any optiomum is anywhere between 500 and 3000008:10
DocScrutinizer05definitely zero is no optimum, not even a lame compromise, not even any rationale at all to support that approach. Except "let's punish them"08:11
*** jeropun has quit IRC08:11
DocScrutinizer05what is the default baudrate of an UART? zero?08:13
freemangordon9600 iirc, but it is not set by the kernel UART driver iirc08:14
*** HylianHero has quit IRC08:14
DocScrutinizer05sure you *should* use stty to configure the 8n1 and 9600 or 19200 or 64k or whatever you want. but ZERO for sure is the most idiotic value for UART baudrate to have as default. Same for camera08:14
freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: it is not UART driver that sets the default, get my point?08:15
freemangordonafaik it is tty driver08:15
DocScrutinizer05uhuh, so who else is setting uart to a particular speed? is it random?08:16
DocScrutinizer05there MUST be some speed the UART is set to when it gets loaded08:16
DocScrutinizer05and I doubt you even *can* set that to zero08:17
freemangordonit is passed through cmdline08:17
DocScrutinizer05nonsense, you *can* pass that via cmdline. That's not any default though08:17
DocScrutinizer05meh, I'm tired of this discussion08:17
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC08:20
*** _jester_ has joined #maemo08:20
*** hardfalcon has joined #maemo08:22
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo08:23
*** _jester_ has quit IRC08:24
DocScrutinizer05(just on a sidenote: for UARTs there seem to be ~4 "sane" defaults: 300, 1200. 9600, 19200. No kernel driver or whoever will initialize a UART to 120, 600, 38400 or whatever)08:26
DocScrutinizer05these values have historical and practical reasons, and they have sound rationale why they are used08:27
DocScrutinizer05for every sensor you can find similar reasoning why you should use a certain (range of) values for module init default08:29
DocScrutinizer05I honestly doubt zero for all values of a camera has *any* such sound rationale08:30
DocScrutinizer05e.g stabdard PAL or NTSC or VGA would be a sane fallback and default08:31
DocScrutinizer05and a exposure that somehow meets a normal daylight outside situation08:33
DocScrutinizer05a less crappy chip would automatically set those values on reset08:34
DocScrutinizer05in taht case the kernel module usually wants to just keep whatever the chip came up with08:34
DocScrutinizer05in other cases manufactuers clearly state defaults08:35
DocScrutinizer05when they don't then they state recommended operating conditions which usually are ranges and you want to pick a value for defaults that is "middle" of the range by whatever algo you use to find that middle08:36
DocScrutinizer05for other sensors you want them to come up with maximum sensitivity08:37
DocScrutinizer05actors you usually make come up with actual operation set to inactive, and limits set to those the hw manufacturer specified08:37
DocScrutinizer05but you ALWAYS can find a better and less embarrassing (for your reputation as developr) value for defaults, than simply "all zero"08:38
DocScrutinizer05there are situations where you don't want to come up with any sane working default at all - e.g. firmware for WLAN chip. But that's another topic not applicable for simple settings like exposure and ISO and framerate/resolution of a camera08:40
DocScrutinizer05btw I never looked in V4L2 or the camdriver kernel API, but I could figure there are mandatory parameters you _must_ pass to an open(). When e.g resolution was one of those mandatory parameters then any default for resolution is moot anyway.08:49
DocScrutinizer05you don't have a default for filename on an open() either08:50
*** XATRIX has joined #maemo08:54
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC08:59
*** goldkatze has joined #maemo09:02
*** int_ua has joined #maemo09:04
*** FlameReaper has joined #maemo09:06
*** dafox has joined #maemo09:07
*** XATRIX has quit IRC09:19
*** XATRIX has joined #maemo09:23
*** bef0rd has quit IRC09:26
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo09:27
*** DrCode has quit IRC09:28
*** DrCode has joined #maemo09:28
*** bef0rd has quit IRC09:31
*** dafox has quit IRC09:32
*** pcfe has quit IRC09:38
jonwilbah this is annoying09:50
*** topro has joined #maemo09:53
*** zammy has joined #maemo10:01
*** trx has quit IRC10:03
*** unclouded has quit IRC10:06
*** shentey has joined #maemo10:12
*** shentey has quit IRC10:16
*** int_ua has quit IRC10:19
*** shentey has joined #maemo10:20
*** shentey has quit IRC10:26
*** Martix_ has joined #maemo10:30
*** maybeArgh has quit IRC10:33
*** florian_kc has joined #maemo10:35
*** maybeHere has joined #maemo10:36
*** florian_kc is now known as florian10:36
*** edheldil has joined #maemo10:37
*** OkropNick has joined #maemo10:42
*** LauRoman has quit IRC10:42
*** Martix_ has quit IRC10:43
jonwiltrying to figure out the libdevlock change_devlock_code function and its so far eluded my ability to reverse engineer it (even with an x86 binary to play with)10:44
jonwilits doing something really funky for generating the salt and I cant work it out10:45
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo10:47
*** M4rtinK has quit IRC10:56
*** croppa has joined #maemo11:03
DocScrutinizer05you don't need to understand how it generates salt. You just need to generate own salt and understand how salt is added to the hash, so you can verify existing hashes incl salt11:03
DocScrutinizer05since jack-the-ripper can crack the hash, I guess salt is added in a pertty standard way11:04
DocScrutinizer05err johm-the-ripper11:04
DocScrutinizer05have you already found the   if (hash == "12345") then return 0; ?11:08
*** N-Mi has joined #maemo11:08
DocScrutinizer05funny enough the original default hash for default lockcode 12345 is also 12345 ;-P11:09
FatPhilyeah, ignore salt generation. A counter is just as salty as a something random11:10
DocScrutinizer05for device lockcode for sure11:11
DocScrutinizer05it's a hoax in the end, anyway11:11
*** dhbiker has quit IRC11:12
FatPhilAnd as the salt must be stored in the clear, it adds very little security to what's intrinsically a small brute force problem11:12
*** dhbiker has joined #maemo11:12
*** Ex-Opesa has quit IRC11:13
*** LauRoman has joined #maemo11:14
*** eMHa_ has quit IRC11:14
DocScrutinizer05yep. Salt only got invented to make rainbow table attacks harder11:19
DocScrutinizer05and maybe to hide password changes11:20
*** AD-N770 has joined #maemo11:20
DocScrutinizer05in the sense that you could use same password but still a different hash each day11:20
ApicA splendid wonderful fine Morning (UGT) on this gorgeous Boomtime!11:25
ApicDiscordian Weekday11:29
ApicRead http://principiadiscordia.com11:29
*** florian has quit IRC11:30
*** florian has joined #maemo11:42
FatPhilSalt predates rainbow tables by decades11:43
* sono would rather go outside and play sink11:45
* sono eyes the pond11:45
* sono eyes the headachy embedded devices from hell next to his desk11:45
sonoyea, sink sounds good11:45
*** SpeedEvil has quit IRC11:48
*** marainein has quit IRC11:48
* sono hands Apic a PIC32 based industrial thing with an oldschool LCD. a JTAG cable dangles from it.11:48
* sono nods at the pond11:48
* sono grabs something else that looks like the unholy union of an acer netbook and an ipad11:49
* sono yells something undiscernable and PULLs11:49
ApicThank You very much!11:49
ApicShift to the Left, shift to the Right, push up, pull down, Byte, Byte, Byte!11:50
Apic\o\ /o/ ^o^ ,o, o< o< o<11:50
*** eMHa_ has joined #maemo11:57
*** rcg has joined #maemo11:59
*** marainein has joined #maemo12:00
FatPhilDrink all the booze, hack all the stuff?12:06
ApicDo You know Operation Swordfish, the Movie?12:09
ApicLog on, hack in, go anywhere, steal everything!12:09
psycho_oreosWhat a horrid movie that was.12:12
ApicI liked it.12:12
*** eMHa_ has quit IRC12:19
*** tzafrir has quit IRC12:20
psycho_oreos._." there was simply too much blockbuster crap compared to what infosec was all about.12:20
sonopopular movies are generally quite horrid. if some random persons likes a movie, that actually increases the odds that it's quite meh.12:21
sonorandom persons on average are quite meh.12:21
sonoor one could simply say,12:21
sonolaw of averages12:21
sonoand be done12:21
psycho_oreosIt's more apparent if one has underlying knowledge of what the theme of the movie is trying to portray.12:21
sonoi haven't seen it, but i can imagine.12:22
sonodid they create a gui in visual basic?12:22
psycho_oreosI read in reader's digest awhile ago of some guy whom collect's spy paraphernalia. When asked how would the James Bond do in real world, he quoted from a ex KGB spy stating the real James Bond would not last in the spy world for more than 4 minutes or something.12:23
psycho_oreosI actually don't want to think about swordfish, I could imagine swordfish would be interesting is if I was stoned.12:23
sonosurely he meant "before being fired"12:24
*** Venusaur has quit IRC12:24
psycho_oreosNo, probably before James Bond dies because he would be outsmarted by real spies probably.12:24
sonowell if you're stoned, gravity is a much better movie to begin with12:24
sonoreal spies don't go around killing each other12:24
psycho_oreosWell I haven't watched gravity yet anyway.12:25
sononot as a day to day practice anyway.12:25
sonoi don't doubt it has happened in the past.12:25
psycho_oreosThe ex-KGB guy quoted that when spies pulls out their gun, intelligence ends.12:25
jonwilGravity wasn't bad actually12:25
sonobut there are some good boooks about the history of the services if you're in for a long flight or something.12:26
sonono need to rely on holywood.12:26
psycho_oreosActually it's a little appealing if movies were to be based on more factual stuff rather than sci-fi crap and overexaggeration.12:26
psycho_oreosKids these days playing with real pentesting tools used by professionals thinking they are the bomb but have no actual clue let alone the common sense when it comes to proper pentesting.12:27
sonogravity is a lot of action, and of course it's highly unrealistic as far as the entire story goes. but it somehow manages to take you along with it, and manages to rarely be outrageously impossible.12:27
sonoso as far as blockbusters go, it is excellent12:27
sonoand it has all the magic12:28
sonoand a good arrangement, too12:28
sonoand acting!12:28
psycho_oreosLike Harry Potter?12:28
sonomagic = mood establishment etc pp12:29
sonoi'm sure there are filmologists who can explain all the magic.12:29
sonoi am not one.12:29
psycho_oreosKind of like creative thinking, but in hollywood sense it would be probably more closely related into over-exaggeration of stated facts.12:29
psycho_oreosNeither am I, I just get annoyed thinking the likes of swordfish.12:30
psycho_oreosIf someone were to tie swordfish with movies about IT security I'd lart them for that.12:30
* sono points at oreos "he knows how to lart"12:31
sonoso oldschool12:31
* sono is young enough to only know the term from reading the jargon file when he was 16.12:31
sonoand i'm 37!12:32
sonowell i am also contiental so maybe the slang is just different12:33
sonobut i don't think i have heard someone use the term in 5 years or so12:33
*** eMHa_ has joined #maemo12:37
Veggensono: I'm 42, and I'm old enough to have made it into the jargon file ;) (check, towards the bottom)12:40
* psycho_oreos is 29 but doesn't care about using old terminologies. :p12:41
*** Venusaur has joined #maemo12:42
*** trx has joined #maemo12:48
*** edheldil has quit IRC12:49
*** unclouded has joined #maemo12:49
*** edheldil has joined #maemo12:51
*** trx has quit IRC12:52
*** trx has joined #maemo12:57
*** rcg has quit IRC13:10
*** RP_ has quit IRC13:13
*** RP_ has joined #maemo13:13
*** foo` has joined #maemo13:24
*** andre__ has joined #maemo13:27
*** tzafrir has joined #maemo13:33
*** croppa has quit IRC13:42
*** norrsken has joined #maemo13:43
merlin1991~lart sono13:45
* infobot lowers sono's priority13:45
FatPhilI've fallen into the habit of always doing an ls -lart when I don13:46
FatPhilt have any reason not to13:47
*** Pali has joined #maemo13:48
*** andre__ has quit IRC13:57
*** psychologe has joined #maemo14:07
*** psychologe has quit IRC14:08
*** kolp has joined #maemo14:24
*** lizardo has joined #maemo14:31
*** lassefaxoe has quit IRC14:41
DrCodehi all14:41
DrCodecan I use backupmenu with microsd ext2?14:41
DrCodeI want to backup my maemo14:41
ApicDunno, just try ;-)14:44
ApicNot much can go wrong14:44
*** joshgillies has joined #maemo14:51
*** uen| has joined #maemo15:04
*** uen has quit IRC15:09
*** uen| is now known as uen15:09
*** YnG has joined #maemo15:21
*** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo15:28
*** YnG has quit IRC15:31
*** HylianSavior has joined #maemo15:32
*** konelix has joined #maemo16:03
*** wmarone__ has joined #maemo16:09
*** wmarone_ has quit IRC16:12
*** x29a has quit IRC16:12
*** Veggen has quit IRC16:12
*** x29a has joined #maemo16:13
*** Veggen has joined #maemo16:13
*** pcfe has joined #maemo16:17
*** drathir has quit IRC16:20
*** drathir has joined #maemo16:20
*** KhertanAtwork has joined #maemo16:23
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo16:36
*** otep_ has joined #maemo16:50
*** otep has quit IRC16:51
*** ZogG_laptop has quit IRC16:54
*** trx has quit IRC17:09
*** KhertanAtwork is now known as Khertan17:11
*** trx has joined #maemo17:13
*** trx has quit IRC17:14
*** trx has joined #maemo17:14
*** freemangordon has quit IRC17:14
*** florian has quit IRC17:14
*** XATRIX has quit IRC17:19
*** shentey has joined #maemo17:21
DocScrutinizer05~lart sono17:24
*** shentey has quit IRC17:24
* infobot acting on orders from an unspecified client drags sono into court suing for $200 million17:24
*** shentey has joined #maemo17:24
Paliwho is sono?17:24
DocScrutinizer05[2013-10-14 11:31:42] * sono is young enough to only know the term from reading the jargon file when he was 16.17:24
DocScrutinizer05ooh, merlin1991 beaten me to it ;-P17:25
*** ZogG_laptop has joined #maemo17:26
*** ZogG_laptop has quit IRC17:26
*** ZogG_laptop has joined #maemo17:26
*** Pali has quit IRC17:30
*** trx has quit IRC17:33
*** trx has joined #maemo17:37
*** sq-one has joined #maemo17:39
*** shentey has quit IRC17:39
*** shentey has joined #maemo17:39
*** shentey has quit IRC17:41
*** otep_ is now known as otep17:41
*** cybrNaut has quit IRC17:41
*** cybrNaut has joined #maemo17:41
*** joshgillies has quit IRC17:42
*** FlameReaper has quit IRC17:52
*** FlameReaper has joined #maemo17:54
*** andre__ has joined #maemo17:55
*** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo17:59
*** kolp has quit IRC18:01
*** kolp_ has joined #maemo18:01
*** HylianSavior has quit IRC18:01
*** kolp_ is now known as kolp18:02
*** Smily has quit IRC18:02
sonoVeggen: vegard? =) hey that's new. i didn't even know about it.18:07
*** NIN101 has joined #maemo18:07
*** freemangordon has joined #maemo18:07
zammyguys meybe I will install the archlinux system on my n90018:08
sonoVeggen: does this mean you lost 5 pidgeons? =D18:08
jonwilZammy: I doubt you can do that and have a working device18:08
jonwilNot if you want to make phone calls, use data, send SMS etc18:08
sonojonwil: nice constraint there.18:08
freemangordondepends on the definition of "working" :)18:09
zammythe I mean I am going to install in my next future the ArchLinuxARM-N900-2013.02-rootfs.tar.gz18:09
jonwilI doubt ArchLinux has working battery charging either18:09
freemangordonjonwil: it has18:10
freemangordonpali's drivers18:10
freemangordonafaik :)18:10
zammybut I must buy first a microsd to it18:10
zammyfor it18:10
zammyofc testing before using it definately18:11
zammyis it faster right?18:12
zammyand I mind to use it mainly for command lines usage... that's pretty cool18:12
jonwilgod reverse engineering hildon status bar gadgets is hard, especially when they use like half of GTK and have a class size of 0x1A0 and a private class size of 0x3C18:13
zammyanyway I did not find any video around googling about this archlinux on n90018:14
jonwiloh wait the 0x1A0 is misleading since the class is entirely composed of a HDStatusMenuItem structure18:15
zammyjust some in which you can see the archlinux os for computers emulated like debian img... nothing about this ArchLinuxARM-N90018:16
jonwilstill, 0x3C of private class data is going to be annoying18:16
freemangordonjonwil: (0xA10 size) - most probably the first member variable is some GObjectClass descendant type18:20
jonwilyes it is18:20
jonwilIts a HDStatusMenuItem18:21
freemangordonwhich leaves you woth only a couple of members to find18:21
freemangordonjonwil: is ther x86 binary?18:22
freemangordonor only ARM18:22
jonwilno x86 unfortunately18:22
freemangordonyeah, thats bad18:22
*** pcfe has quit IRC18:26
*** florian has joined #maemo18:27
*** HylianSavior has joined #maemo18:30
*** HylianSavior has quit IRC18:30
*** FlameReaper has quit IRC18:33
jonwilanyone know what /dev/ttyGS* might be?18:35
keriogadget serial?18:37
jonwilquite possible18:37
zammyso... what about this ArchLinuxARM-N900?18:40
zammyI did not understand in tecnical language how is it ... is it bad or good?18:40
jonwilI am about convinced that it would be easier for someone with GTK skills to write a totally new hildon-status-bar-usb (figuring out all the non-UI things the stock one is doing should be fairly simple from what I can see) than it would be to try and reverse engineer all the GUI bits in the stock one18:40
jonwilmostly because there is no x86 binary for the stock one18:41
jonwiland that the UI is more complex than it would appear to be18:41
*** pcfe has joined #maemo18:42
*** jmlich has quit IRC18:47
jonwilmost of the other status-bar-widget clones arent 1:1 clones, they are also only functional clones18:48
* jonwil wonders if there is a GTK book that is as good as his QT book18:49
*** florian has quit IRC18:49
MohammadAGBrought to you by the largest Israeli bank's website18:50
MohammadAGTo view our Web site you may use , Internet Explorer version 6 or above or Netscape version 7 or above.18:50
zammy... anyway I want to see a faster n900... this maemo is too slow now....18:51
zammyto me it is maybe too tasks simultaneous...18:52
mashinaif they ask for netscape lie18:59
MohammadAGwtf is CLS18:59
jonwilMy bank is great, not only does it have a mobile site that works great on the N900 but their main desktop online banking site works on every browser I have tried (I cant find the cite right now but I remember seeing something in their online banking info that mentioned Linux by name)18:59
MohammadAGI hate banks18:59
MohammadAGI want the IBAN number18:59
MohammadAGI can't figure out which to use
jonwilOf course this is a small bank owned by its members (it used to be a credit union until the rules changed and it became a bank)19:01
jonwiland as such, they have none of the usual suckiness of a bank19:01
*** FlameReaper has joined #maemo19:02
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo19:10
jonwilpali: ping19:13
*** MohammadAG_ has joined #maemo19:13
*** MohammadAG has quit IRC19:14
*** MohammadAG_ is now known as MohammadAG19:14
*** HylianSavior has joined #maemo19:18
*** florian has joined #maemo19:18
*** arcean has joined #maemo19:19
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC19:24
*** sq-one has quit IRC19:25
*** dos1 has joined #maemo19:30
*** psychologe has joined #maemo19:34
*** psychologe has quit IRC19:35
*** pcfe has quit IRC19:39
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo19:46
*** nmmm has joined #maemo19:47
*** HylianSavior has quit IRC19:48
*** dafox has joined #maemo19:48
*** Luke-Jr has quit IRC19:50
*** discopig has quit IRC19:50
*** Luke-Jr has joined #maemo19:51
*** Luke-Jr has quit IRC19:52
*** Luke-Jr has joined #maemo19:52
*** Luke-Jr has quit IRC19:52
*** Luke-Jr has joined #maemo19:53
*** tanty has quit IRC19:53
*** Luke-Jr has quit IRC19:54
*** Luke-Jr has joined #maemo19:55
*** Luke-Jr has quit IRC19:55
*** Luke-Jr has joined #maemo19:55
*** AD-N770 has quit IRC19:59
*** tanty has joined #maemo20:00
*** Ex-Opesa has joined #maemo20:02
*** nmmm has quit IRC20:06
*** dafox has quit IRC20:08
*** sq-one has joined #maemo20:09
*** bef0rd has quit IRC20:10
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo20:10
*** bef0rd has quit IRC20:15
*** hardfalcon has quit IRC20:20
*** hardfalcon has joined #maemo20:20
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo20:31
*** shanttu has joined #maemo20:32
*** dhbiker has quit IRC20:41
*** dhbiker has joined #maemo20:42
*** nmmm has joined #maemo20:46
*** node00 has joined #maemo20:53
*** node00 has quit IRC20:54
*** e-yes_ has quit IRC20:58
*** discopig has joined #maemo20:58
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC20:58
*** HylianSavior has joined #maemo21:00
*** frafl has joined #maemo21:01
*** jonwil has quit IRC21:03
*** dafox has joined #maemo21:03
*** jrocha has joined #maemo21:11
*** shentey has joined #maemo21:13
*** Pali has joined #maemo21:17
*** piggz has joined #maemo21:22
*** mkaindl has joined #maemo21:26
*** arcean has quit IRC21:36
*** arcean has joined #maemo21:44
*** FlameReaper has quit IRC21:47
*** _rd_ has joined #maemo21:58
*** uen has quit IRC22:01
*** frafl has quit IRC22:03
Maceri'm having a hell of a time getting the manual dns to work in maemo22:05
Macersetting the ip/dns doesn't seem to work well22:07
* Macer facepalm22:08
Macerif i set the ip and dns manually it won't work :-/22:08
Macerwhy must everything use dnsmasq?22:08
Maceri've  no idea what is going on here but the n900 has gone astray22:09
*** teotwaki has joined #maemo22:09
PaliMacer: you need to configure ip/dns in icd2 configuration/gconf22:11
PaliMacer: Maemo using dnsmasq for caching22:11
*** teotwaki has quit IRC22:12
Paliit speed up dns resolving, because lot of mobile operators have slow recursive dns servers with slow dns responce22:12
Maceri guess. i'm having problems with my new install with tomato22:14
Macerand the n900 seems to be the only device with me about to rip my hair out22:14
Macermy problem is i have a dns on a local 192. subnet22:14
DefiantMacer: yeah..had to modify my maemo a bit for lan dns resolution22:15
*** nmmm has quit IRC22:16
*** arcean has quit IRC22:16
Maceryeah it doesn't seem to be working out too well :-/22:17
Maceri figured it was just a matter of unchecked automatic resolution22:17
Macerin advanced22:17
Macerand setting the ip22:17
Macerbut it doesn't seem to be working out at all for whatever reason22:17
Defiantin my case it didn't append the suffix22:17
Macerand the wifi network seems totally broken22:17
Maceri think i know the problem...22:18
*** YnG has joined #maemo22:19
Macerwell.. how about that22:21
*** LauRoman has quit IRC22:24
Maceri think the problem is that the dhcpd on the router is sending the gateway as itself22:26
*** YnG has left #maemo22:28
*** _rd_ has quit IRC22:30
*** Macer has quit IRC22:32
*** at1as has quit IRC22:32
*** Martix has joined #maemo22:34
*** uen has joined #maemo22:38
*** eMHa_ has quit IRC22:38
*** brutal_ has quit IRC22:42
*** Macer has joined #maemo22:42
Macerfigured it out22:43
*** Martix has quit IRC22:45
*** Martix has joined #maemo22:46
*** RiD has joined #maemo22:51
*** Martix has quit IRC22:56
*** Martix has joined #maemo22:56
*** Kabouik has joined #maemo22:56
*** Martix has quit IRC22:57
*** tzafrir has quit IRC22:58
*** Martix has joined #maemo22:58
*** sunny_s has joined #maemo23:02
*** shanttu has quit IRC23:04
*** YnG has joined #maemo23:05
*** Pali has quit IRC23:07
*** xes has joined #maemo23:08
*** valerius has quit IRC23:14
DrCodehi all23:22
DrCodeI have setup apn and mms23:22
DrCodecan I use both mms and apn in single connection?23:22
DrCodeI mean  3g data and mms in single connection ?23:23
*** valerius has joined #maemo23:29
*** Macer has quit IRC23:29
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo23:40
ShadowJKWell, the grass isn't that much greener on the other side23:42
ShadowJKLooks like ZTE's firefox phone is "abandoned" after ~3 months :)23:42
MohammadAGan Ubuntu ZTE phone might work23:43
MohammadAGthe Edge looked nice :/23:43
MohammadAGDrCode, why would you do that?23:43
ShadowJKThey called it "ZTE Open", and included something saying something like "If you know how to code web, you know how to code firefox, take back your freedom!"23:43
ShadowJKThen they locked it down, locked the bootloader, etc23:44
MohammadAGnot unlockable?23:44
ShadowJKThere's a kernel exploit allegedly23:44
MohammadAGstill better than samsung I guess23:44
ShadowJKUbuntu ZTE would have the same problem, if ZTE shipped it without a working sudo/su or root account, and with locked loader, etc :)23:45
MohammadAGseen the Samsung efuse stuff?23:47
MohammadAGback when the S2 was out they touted openness23:47
MohammadAGeven sent Cyanogen a device23:47
MohammadAGnow they include an efuse that blows when you root it (Note 3)23:48
MohammadAGthat decides whether or not you get hardware warranty23:48
*** Martix has quit IRC23:48
MohammadAGwhich with Apple or Nokia you might not need23:49
raccoon_MohammadAG: got any more info on that?23:49
MohammadAGsure, everyone knws about it23:49
raccoon_i seem to have missed the news23:49
*** Martix has joined #maemo23:49
raccoon_ok got some stuff of the web23:50
RiDMohammadAG what if the efuse blows randomly :v23:51
*** Macer has joined #maemo23:51
*** robotanarchy has quit IRC23:51
*** lizardo has quit IRC23:52
MohammadAGRiD, you don't get warranty :D23:52
DrCodeI want to use mms also23:54
MohammadAGuse fMMS23:54
DrCodeafter I have install fmms , I got new wifi AP call mms23:54
MohammadAGumm there are three modes23:54
DrCodeso I have my 3g data AP and MMS23:54
MohammadAGI think the one that allows simultaneous use is havoc23:54
DrCodeI can't use both 3gdata and mms in on AP23:55
DrCodealso how can I change to what AP it will connect automticly?23:56
MohammadAGset it to havoc23:56
DrCodenow it connect to mms and not 3g23:56
DrCodewhat is havoc?23:56
*** RiD has quit IRC23:57
*** robotanarchy has joined #maemo23:57
DrCodein fmms?23:57

Generated by 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at!