IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2013-08-08

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lexikSo ive just read the "Saera thread" and ive started thinking about a "true" AI :) here is what im going to play with: www.pybrain.org00:14
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lexikbut i seriously have no idea how powerful it could be on N900 HW... maybe create a grid of n900 and make a decetralized n900 based brain :D.. ok.. thats utopy but im going to take a look on it.. it could be interesting00:16
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sixwheeledbeast~seen Pali00:52
infobotpali <~pali@Maemo/community/contributor/Pali> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 3h 18m ago, saying: 'kerio: provide output of hal-device bme'.00:52
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LjL-Alps1) is it typically worth to make some adjustments to the default Maemo 5 swap parameters, and if so, are the parameters suggested by Swappolube any good? 2) does compcache at least tend to not make matter worse?01:55
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HtheBrobbiethe1st: hi03:59
HtheBhow are you?04:00
robbiethe1stHi there04:00
robbiethe1stDid I tell you? the second/third or w/e package didn't come as of last Sunday that i know of04:00
robbiethe1stI'll check this weekend04:00
HtheBcould be, I just had some message from ebay that they were just sent04:01
HtheB(just marked as sent)04:01
HtheBstill no hurries.. :D04:01
HtheBdont worry04:01
HtheB(thats the enjoyment of completing a collection)04:01
HtheBit takes time ^_^04:01
HtheBand patience :D04:01
robbiethe1stI ain't got no patience!04:02
robbiethe1st's why I got annoyed about not being able to pass people in my '88 Diesel truck, and threw my new turbo on last weekend04:02
robbiethe1stInstead of, you know, waiting until I had all the parts right etc.04:03
robbiethe1stSo it's missing a gasket or two, there's no exhaust in the truck..04:03
HtheBno exhaust?04:03
HtheBkinda hard to drive eh04:03
robbiethe1stIt's a bit loud, but...04:03
HtheBwhat kind of a truck is it?04:04
robbiethe1stThe outflow pipe from the turbo basically stops right at the bottom of the engine. just open from there04:04
HtheBpick up?04:04
HtheBMonster truck? :D04:04
robbiethe1st88 F250:
robbiethe1stNicotine yellow/brown truck in front04:05
HtheBpickup it is04:05
robbiethe1st7.3L idi, mechanical injection.04:06
HtheBmech injection04:06
robbiethe1stIt's cool because the engine can be made to run without any power what so ever.04:06
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HtheBhow much did this cost you?04:07
robbiethe1stFree(sort of) - got it from my parents, because they weren't using it. It cost them $2500 a few years back04:07
robbiethe1stHowever, I've probably put $1500 into it so far04:08
HtheBhow much worth is it not?04:08
robbiethe1stNothing? Nah, probably a good $1500, perhaps $2000 in scrap/parts04:08
robbiethe1stIt's a vehicle that will never be sold for money. It's a driver, and that's it.04:09
HtheBwell, maybe for a classic lover?04:09
robbiethe1stWhen it's no longer useful(crashed, or whatever), I'll pull whatever parts I want off of it and put it in the weeds as a spare parts truck04:09
robbiethe1stNah, these things are common as dirt over here - You can find ones in much better shape than mine on craigslist all the time04:10
robbiethe1stWhat it is, though, is a daily driver.04:10
robbiethe1stTo me, it's worth a good 5-8K+, as I'd have to spend that much to get a compariable vehicle04:10
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robbiethe1st dash04:17
robbiethe1stwith my mods04:18
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HtheBi have a Mitsubish Colt04:31
HtheByes, a white car :P04:32
robbiethe1stHm, a speed bump04:37
RST38hrobbie: What do you do with those wall switches?04:38
robbiethe1stReplace original functions - left two are Windshield wipers (on/off) (high/low)04:38
robbiethe1stThe white one is "main power", button next to it is for the starter04:39
robbiethe1stBypassed the original starter switch circuit due to the silly interlock preventing you from cranking it with the clutch out04:40
RST38hrobbie: you obviously need larger, more menacing buttons04:40
robbiethe1st(and, therefor, preventing you from moving it with the starter, if needed)04:40
robbiethe1stRST38h, yeah, I've been thinking about it04:40
RST38hstandard issue US wall switches just don't cut it04:40
robbiethe1stBut they do bring nerd cred. Nobody talks about toggle switches "Oh, it's just another toggle switch"04:41
robbiethe1stLight switches, however...04:41
robbiethe1stEveryone I've shown it to has asked about them04:41
RST38hrobbie: and install 'em on vertical aluminium pipes painted red04:42
robbiethe1stWhat I *really* want to do is find one of the start switches for here:
robbiethe1st(right side, halfway down the generator)04:43
robbiethe1stmetal handle/knob, has off/on/start position and is just good and "solid"04:44
robbiethe1stOld ones04:45
RST38hthey don't make new ones as they used to =)04:45
robbiethe1stHell, those house switches are probably 10-30 years old, so...04:46
RST38hactually the easiest thing will be to steal a whole trolley switch panel somewhere04:48
RST38hwith 20-30 switches on it =)04:48
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psycho_oreosfennec has become quite bloated. I wonder how much more longer does it take for a non-thumb user to try and load up the latest fennec (17.0)09:11
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freemangordonPali: hmm, why not promote KP51r1 to testing?11:42
Palibecause kp51r1 is old?11:42
Palikp52 should be there11:42
Palithen we can see bug reports against old kp51 version11:42
freemangordonPali: hmm, is KP52 stable enough?11:44
freemangordonif it is, just promote it11:45
Palikp52 is missing in interface :-(11:45
freemangordonis it?11:45
freemangordonoh, it is11:46
freemangordonPali: are you aware I am the autobuilder maintainer?11:46
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freemangordonPali: hmm
freemangordonoh, missing dependencies :(11:47
Palionly flasher is there11:47
Paliother v52 packages are missing11:47
freemangordonPali: we should fix that, once and for all11:48
Paliok :-)11:48
freemangordonPali: how did older version appear?11:50
Palisome automatically and some X-Fade imported manually11:50
freemangordoni see11:50
freemangordonhmm, going to check the import script11:52
wndbtw what is the preferred way to back everything up (as in restoring entire system would be as automated as possible) before trying out cssu-thumb?11:54
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nuncan anyone upload kp 51r1 zimage please12:15
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keriownd: backupmenu12:33
kerionun: no, it's older than dirt12:33
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nunthanks kerio used bootimg  and got it12:38
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wndpsycho_oreos, kerio, thanks, that's what I thought. Flash the stock image, install kp, backupmenu, restore from backup? I suppose N900 doesn't load the kernel from fs.12:41
keriownd: you suppose correctly12:42
kerioat least until the second-to-latest version, backupmenu didn't restore the kernel12:42
keriothe kernel mtd partition, that is12:42
kerioand by default, the kernel is stored there12:42
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kerioso to restore a backup, you have to reinstall the matching kernel manually12:44
kerioor at least A kernel with the installed modules12:44
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* lexik is installing the PyBrain on his n900 now.. 13:39
* psycho_oreos ponders if its possible to add backing up of kernel as a feature request to backupmenu. /dev/mtd3 gets backed up into a file via dd and is restored via dd if somehow /dev/mtd3 has a checksum mismatch.13:40
psycho_oreoslexik, did you see my previous message about not being able to register?13:41
psycho_oreosWhat do you mean maybe? that doesn't make any sense.13:41
lexikim not sure if i saw some stuff related to TMO register problems :)13:42
lexik(from you)13:42
lexiki know there is an issue on bugzilla about it13:42
lexikany news?13:42
psycho_oreosI filed a bug.13:42
psycho_oreosOne person has reported updating firefox would work to 23.013:42
psycho_oreosThere are potentially other browsers you might want to try and see if you can avert the problem.13:43
psycho_oreosI've also noted down on bugzilla a fairly comprehensive list of browsers one can try whilst on N900.13:43
lexiki know only about microb, fennec and chromium from jacekowski :) i will try some other browsers...13:44
lexikbut its weird its caused by browser13:45
lexikis it some kind of bot protection or so?13:46
lexikor "just" bug? (sry, feature?)13:46
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psycho_oreosI am not particularly sure myself, I was thinking that there might be a remote possibility to do with webkit or browser's engine to not function. Though what you mentioned maybe possible but I'm not certain on it.13:50
lexikhow i said.. i will try some other browsers (or update the chrome on the XP box) and let you know..13:51
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lexikfuuuu... i have to install scipy to get pybrain working -_-13:55
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psycho_oreosOn second thoughts about what you said to prevent spammers. I'd say it would be somewhat unlikely considering how there's people that might still be using certain versions of browsers. If that were to be the case I'm sure bugzila would be filled with <insert_name_of_browser> being banned.13:59
psycho_oreosI did see for a couple of times once the user agrees to terms and conditions, amongst all the regular things the user needs to fill out, there's a captcha image there. I'm guessing that's the only way to prevent spammers with automated registration processes.14:00
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LjL-Alpsis it typically worth making changes to swappiness and other parameters (and if so, are the ones proposed by Swappolube any good)? and is compcache worth a shot?14:46
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psycho_oreosI was told swappolube proposed config is nice.15:08
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keriopsycho_oreos: don't EVER use dd to read from a mtd partition15:11
kerioPali: does your uboot only ever read bootmenu.scr from the first partition of the emmc?15:14
kerioor does it try multiple places?15:14
Palionly first partition15:16
kerioPali: can't you make it also try the other partitions, in order?15:17
kerioit would be neat15:18
keriobecause you could put bootmenu.scr and bootmenu.img.d in /home15:18
kerioand it would get backed up by backupmenu15:18
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infobotrumour has it, pali is
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psycho_oreoskerio, then what are your proposals to read /dev/mtd3?15:41
kerioand nandwrite to write it15:41
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psycho_oreosHmm heard of that from somewhere.15:44
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qwerty123vkb dsnt work in fennec 8.0??16:16
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qwerty123any way to make it work??!16:27
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keriodrive-by irc16:48
auenfyes, leaving before the answer is the correct way to make it work16:49
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LjL-Alpsspeaking of virtual keyboards, is there some trick to making FastSMS-as-a-keyboard work? i also have the input method selector control panel installed, and the fastsms module is selected, but i still see the default hildon one17:13
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DrCodehi all17:53
DrCodeI have bout new can that have option to download contacts17:53
DrCodeI can connect to blue tooth but can download contacts to my car, any idea?17:54
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haltHi guys, I saw some demo about the maemo but cloud not find any recent phone with it, what is the most recent one,  I found one which I like but could not find anywhere ( N950 from Nokia )18:06
freemangordonhalt: get n90018:06
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ShadowJKN950 was never sold18:07
freemangordonhalt: N950 has faster CPU and more RAM, but that is all it has more than n900.18:07
freemangordonShadowJK: well you can buy on ebay :)18:07
haltfreemangordon: I have one and I one to upgrade to something more decent, it's big heavy and week with the battery18:08
haltfreemangordon: I did not found any on ebay, clound you give me a link maybe ?18:08
haltShadowJK: it's just a dev device, yes I know but it's too good, to just left behind18:09
freemangordonhalt: N950 is as heavy as N900, with worse battery life ;). Last time I checked the price of new N950 was about 2000 euro18:09
freemangordonhalt: no, it just looks too good, trust me on that one, I have both n900 and n95018:10
freemangordonhonestly, the design is killer18:10
freemangordonbut that's all18:10
haltfreemangordon:  :(   it's soo said, so you saying there is no "good phones" on the market ?18:11
freemangordonhalt: depends on how you define "good phone" :)18:11
freemangordonhalt: but if you ask for a phone to replace n900 with, there is no such device IMO18:12
ShadowJKThis is why I own about 5 N900s..18:13
freemangordonShadowJK: yesterday I bought my 3rd one, for my GF :)18:14
haltfreemangordon: that's true, there are people outside who can live without an qwerty keyboard, who is happy to use an "tracked" os, and they are happy to be a marketing target, personly I will be happy even with an black&white dot screen , and stuff like that, if they will match otherwise18:14
haltShadowJK: nice collection :)18:15
ShadowJK3 of them are broken, 4th in use, 5th as spare18:15
freemangordonhalt: n900 would not become less builkier, but actually it is not that ugly. You'd better try to make it faster, if speed is your problem18:16
haltShadowJK: oh that's an othere case18:16
haltfreemangordon: it's not about the the design, i give a shit about the the design ( until a level ) but the battery time and the weight is important, actaly my current n900 just brocken now, ( the usb port lost the contact ) so if i have to buy an othere one I was hoping there is a new version or better option18:19
haltbut look like there is no better option ...18:19
freemangordonGuess why we have more than one device :)18:19
freemangordonhalt: hmm, what is wring with battery life on n900?18:20
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kerionothing, if you have a good battery =D18:21
haltI cahanged to N900 from E72 there I had days with the n900 i have only hours18:21
kerioyou didn't have days of usage on your e7218:21
keriodays of screen on, at least18:22
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freemangordonkerio: you know what, BME got confused while I was on holiday 2 weeks ago, because I went offline. So by the end of the day I got about 80% battery, and BME decided my battery capacity is about 300 mAh18:22
keriowhich bme?18:22
ShadowJKI'd get about 4 days out of N900 if I used it for same things I used E7518:23
freemangordonkerio: well, Pali's widget(or whatever it is called), but Nokia BME18:23
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freemangordonkerio: so I am not exactly sure where Pali got those 300 mAh from, but still something went totally confused18:24
haltfun I used to studie on a uni called BME :) but i guess here it's mean Battery Manager E..?18:25
freemangordonShadowJK: on stock device I guess, with some tweaking I think we can do 5 or more18:25
haltI see thanks,... well said to hear that, but have to accept the fact, so I'm ordering two n900 and that would be good until some time, let's hope so some manufacture pick up the needs and build a phone for a geeks like us18:29
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haltor... we should build one for ourself :D
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haltjust double checked and the N900 came out in 2009 !! 4 years ago and there is sill no real rivals18:42
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freemangordonhalt: :D18:55
haltfreemangordon: nice, but it's way less in India
haltand actualy our company has coderst there, and will ask them to buy it for me i think :)18:57
SpEeDEvIiLhalt: that is a lie18:57
freemangordonhalt: I'd be surprised if that offer (the India one) is not fake, just check the device specs18:58
SpEeDEvIiLit's not actually been released18:58
SpEeDEvIiLno microsd slot18:58
haltwell this is why I ask them to buy it if they can...18:59
SpEeDEvIiLno video editor, no java18:59
freemangordonhalt: forget about it, it's been never released18:59
SpEeDEvIiLcamera is wrong19:00
* freemangordon wonders if he should try to sell his broken-screen N95019:00
freemangordonit is in worse condition than
freemangordonstrange, the black spot on my device are on exactly the same place as on ^^^19:03
freemangordonPali: hi, have a couple of minutes to finish that damn kcssu assess table (together)?19:04
Paliplease later19:05
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freemangordonPali: np, ping me when you have some free time19:05
Palinow reading couple of mails...19:05
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psycho_oreosPicture of the main photo on tht website is from lol suspicious.19:18
psycho_oreosAlso I do believe the silver N950 is even more rare than the black N950. Whilst black N950 were being handed out to accepted Qt developers for the (what was then the upcoming) meego platform. The silver N950 was never handed out. Unless if that silver N950 was photoshopped or the seller somehow managed to paint his N950 silver.19:20
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psycho_oreosiirc, a silver N950 appeared in the N950 teaser video, where they used "Jesse's girl" as the theme song.19:23
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psycho_oreosfreemangordon, I wonder if its possible (just wildly thinking) to replace N950's screen with n9 in a bid to get the screen to work.19:27
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psycho_oreosFrom the hardware specs it seems apart from mainly the board is different and the hinges being extra on N950. It might still be remotely possible that for the remaining parts (obviously not including keyboard as well) N950 may share same parts as is with n9.19:29
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sixwheeledbeastI don't think we will see another N900-like device, concord moment. I'd be happy if the N900 was produced again as it is, obviously with uUSB reinforced and better soldering to avoid modem issue.19:34
Palishit - my n900:19:36
Pali$ du -hs /var/log/syslog.old19:36
Pali147M    /var/log/syslog.old19:36
psycho_oreosSad but inevitably true, there's a very small market dedicated to having devices/phones with proper hw keyboard. Furthermore, capitalism (now go figure).19:36
psycho_oreoslol. I've compressed mine (I do it every so often).19:36
Palinow I removed it and 0MB free space increased to 4,2MB19:37
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PaliI forgot to update all pulseaudio packages and now I see this: pulseaudio[849]: client-ext.c: client-ext.c: Can't obtain command line19:37
Pali10000 messages per second19:38
psycho_oreoseww.. good way to fill up syslog for sure.19:38
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Paliit is possible to configure syslog to accept only N messages per second?19:39
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PaliI'm happy that rootfs is compresses, otherwise I do not know how 147MB of syslog will be stored to rootfs...19:40
psycho_oreosI personally doubt it. Though I thought there's some process (could even remotely be kernel) that would try to truncate output by beverity when it receives too much messages in a short timeframe. Then again that is mainly kernel specific stuff not really userland programs.19:41
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psycho_oreosCompressed? o.O19:42
kerioubifs is compressed19:42
keriounless you're as cool as i am19:43
psycho_oreosD: news to me. I've tried (without success) symlinking syslog into /home/opt instead.19:43
SAiFcan you use  wlan together with 2g in n900 (yes or no)19:44
psycho_oreosThink you can, it shouldn't matter.19:44
PaliDocScrutinizer05: Who did backup of all maemo/n900 firmware images which was availablae on nokia site?19:44
* psycho_oreos personally thinks DocScrutinizer51 is still in "offtime".19:45
keriolet's all nickping DocScrutinizer5119:47
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Palihe has bot which send him all messages :-)19:47
fastforwardthe normal connection thing only allows to connect to one connection19:47
keriohe's a bot19:47
fastforwardwifi or gprs,19:47
fastforwardmaybe possible through command line then19:47
kerioicd2 can deal with multiple connections, but not the ui19:48
kerioand you can configure the network manually ofc19:48
Palikerio: will you create new UI? :-)19:48
kerioyou just wait19:48
Paliicd2 gui (both status menu and control panel) is BAD19:49
kerioPali: btw, i appreciated the bmerep repository :D19:50
SAiFI have both slow connections... I have to wait till I learn how to write programs.. or till some one helps..19:53
psycho_oreosThe question sort of begs as to why would you want that? having two gateways? you'll need to play with bridge mode.19:54
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SAiFif its tough just drop it, i thought if there is some simple solution, I could give it  a try.19:55
SAiFwifi speeds are capped at 30kbps download after per mionth  limit is reached. and 2g also give just 30kbps.    3g prices are way too much..19:57
SAiFits one of the countries with worst internet..19:57
psycho_oreosProbably better that than being charged excessively for going over the amount, having to check their site and only to find out that there's a forewarning the quotas are not updated "live" but rather every second day.19:58
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SAiF:) that type of plans in my country gives the fastest speeds. so that we could easily go over limit and they could charge as they wish..20:01
psycho_oreosThe way I understand it, if you want to use both connections simultaneously you'll need bridge-utils (or whatever it is). Plus whatever other stuff you'll need to configure (maybe stuff to do with iptables, QoS, etc).20:01
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SAiFaaah... I drop it.. Qos, iptables, bridge.. bla bla ..  I cant stand20:02
SAiFI am good with 30kbps20:02
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psycho_oreosYup, over here (where I live) packet data has no traffic shaping rules. Meaning there's no provider that will be willing to give you 2g/2.5g/3g/3.5g or even 4g without trying rack up your money.20:03
SAiFpsycho_oreos  by the way that slider magnet issue was resolved after he placed the magnet this time..20:04
psycho_oreosI'm not sure, you'll definitely need bridging that's again if you want to use both connections simultaneously. The first thing you'll encounter is multi-gateways in your routing table which would mess programs up because they can't pick one.20:04
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SAiFit was just a thought. I am not thinking abt it anymore..20:05
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psycho_oreosDid he put the original magnet back in? or did he used some other magnet (even worse using one of those "normal" magnet) to do some experiments and hack up a way with that.20:06
SAiForiginal one, from the old touch panel20:06
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psycho_oreosIt's not impossible, its just work into researching, experimenting, thinking, etc. I just don't think there's any package available on that would do exactly just that. There maybe are articles for it.20:07
psycho_oreosAhh, well I guess problem solved :) no need to fuss about sensor playing up.20:07
SAiFand that portrait mode call menu is again not showing up. will be flashing soon.  When I get a call now, I slide up to see whos calling.20:08
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* psycho_oreos wonders if that is related to lack of RAM available. Sometimes when N900 is left on for a couple of days (this is with non CSSU-Thumb mind you), programs start to get progressively slower to load up. This is even more visible when receiving calls.20:12
SAiFWell I tried restarting ofcourse, and it got cssu.. and its just a problem with the call menu. no other programs lags or anything. any way.. will be flashing soon.20:16
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sixwheeledbeastswap defragmentation?20:21
SAiF   and search some videos on youtube if you have time..20:26
SAiFsee you .. good nite.20:26
LjL-Alpsis the red "privacy" LED of the camera an actual red-only LED, or is it like the front LED, i.e. can it be set to any color? if not, can the "flashlight" (white) led be turned on at the same time as the red one?20:27
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sixwheeledbeastbetween the flash leds?20:29
sixwheeledbeastLjL-Alps: it is a red only led, see lanterne thread for more.
LjL-Alpssixwheeledbeast: yeah - at least if you say it's between them, i guess it is!20:31
LjL-Alpssixwheeledbeast: thanks20:31
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LjL-Alps(for the record, i'm thinking about the "heart rate monitor" apps there are for other OS's, which use the white LED to shine light through your finger. now, actual pulse oxymeters are similar but use *two* frequencies of light, one infrared... this is probably crazy, but i was thinking maybe the red LED comes close enough if used together with the white one)20:35
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sixwheeledbeastred led is not close to IR. IIRC you can't have flash and red led's on at the same time.20:38
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LjL-Alpssixwheeledbeast: ah, bummer.20:39
LjL-Alpsi know it's not really close to IR, i was just wondering that maybe two separate frequencies, even if neither of them is IR, might work20:40
sixwheeledbeastI don't understand how the device "detects" your heartrate. Led's are outputs.20:41
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keriowith the camera20:42
LjL-Alpssixwheeledbeast: yeah, with the camera. it looks at subtle variations in your fingertip's color, but for that to work, there needs to be a lightsource bright enough to shine through your fingertip20:43
LjL-Alpsthe sun works, but LED flashes are usually handier ;)20:43
LjL-Alpsthese apps do work quite well in my experience20:44
sixwheeledbeastSo why does the two LED frequencies make a difference?20:45
LjL-Alpssixwheeledbeast: for just determining your heartrate, they don't, white LED works fine - but a pulse oxymeter can also tell you what the percentage of oxygen in your blood is (that's the main feature). to do that, you need to determine the color of the blood, basically, and if you only have one frequency, then you can tell "now it's brigher" and "now it's darker" but you need two to make an actual measurement20:47
LjL-Alpsnote i only know these things from Wikipedia, so what i say may not be entirely accurate20:47
sixwheeledbeastI see. However I see little need for it built in to my N900. I'd be looking for an accurate "fit-for-purpose" solution.20:49
LjL-Alpsto each one his own20:50
LjL-Alpsyay, my N900 crashed in the middle of a CSSU-Thumb2 install20:51
keriodo you have a thumby kernel already?20:51
LjL-Alpskerio: yeah i have kp5220:51
keriomeh, then20:51
LjL-Alpsi hope the thumb thing hasn't overwritten it though20:51
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kerioit doesn't do that20:52
LjL-Alpsactually, i don't think the phone crashed... the screen just looks weird, and there is currently a dialog asking me whether i want to flash the new kernel image to NAND (NO i don't!), except it's not in the right place in the screen and i can't seem to cancel it20:52
LjL-Alpsit says "Old kernel version: U-Boot 2013.04, New kernel version:", and that *really* seems like something i'd want to cancel20:53
LjL-Alpsnot looking forward to having my U-Boot overwritten20:53
LjL-Alpsreally weird. this dialog is still responsive (i can click on "I agree"), but i can't even turn off the phone by long-pressing Power20:55
LjL-Alpsi guess next step is taking the battery out20:55
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LjL-Alpsmeh, i agreed to overwrite U-Boot with the new kernel, and it's booting normally now. could have let me keep it, though21:11
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sixwheeledbeastPali: freemangordon: This can now be promoted to extras. However, please note that one person has been able to vote twice, I cannot reproduce.21:43
sixwheeledbeastWhat's the plan to fix KP package repo issue?21:44
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Palisixwheeledbeast: maybe race condition?21:52
Palilook at this:
Palisixwheeledbeast: sometimes when I had bad internet connection maemo interface got 4 votes from me...21:53
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Malinuxon Nokia N9 (there is no meego-channel, that's why I am asking here) I have trouble using google calendar with the caldav-app22:24
freemangordonMalinux: there is, #harmattan22:24
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Malinuxfreemangordon: sure. thanx :) <3 I will try it :)22:26
freemangordonMalinux: BTW I didn't mean to kick you off the channel :)22:27
Malinuxfreemangordon: NP :) I have been on this channel for a while :) I love maemo, but I got an N9 as replacement for my N900 :(22:28
MalinuxI have bought a used N900 because I like it so much. Don't use it at the moment though22:28
freemangordonis it broken?22:29
ashleyI've owned a N900 for a while and after my previous phone (a Nokia 5730) somewhat broke down, I switched to the N900 and I'm lovin' it \o/22:29
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Malinuxfreemangordon: the usb-connector got broke22:39
ashleyit's possible to repair that (and you definitely should, IMO)22:40 should have a relevant thread22:40
freemangordonthat one22:40
freemangordonor bring it to the nearest mobile phones repair centre22:41
Sysaxedit's so nice to see people still buying or getting n900s in 201322:41
Malinuxashley: probebly. The problem is. Nokia took it and sendt me an N9 instead. I like N9 beside it's a downgrade in some cases, and an upgrade in other22:41
freemangordonSysaxed: It is rather unfortunate that there is no replacement :(22:41
MalinuxI miss a physical keyboard.22:41
freemangordonMalinux: upgrade O.o22:42
Malinuxhehe :)22:42
ashleyphysical keyboard is one of the many awesome features the N900 has22:42
Malinuxit is22:42
ashleyI have both a N900 (well, two) and a N922:42
freemangordonno, really, what is upgraded, besides CPU and RAM?22:42
Malinuxto be honest. I like the N9 in many ways.22:42
freemangordonMalinux: BTW I have n950, so I know harmattan a bit ;)22:42
Malinuxthe new (used N900) I brought has american keyboard... The one I had, had scandinavic... that's suck22:42
Malinuxfreemangordon: really?! wish they sendt me a N950 instead of N9....22:43
infobotusbfix is, like, - and **NEVER** use epoxy (unless you want to seal your device for underwater)22:43
freemangordonMalinux: what for? n900 kbd is waaay better than the one in n950 IMO. Not to say that opening the keybaord on n950 is a nightmare, I am afraid it'll jump off my hands everytime I open it22:44
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Malinuxfreemangordon: ok. I didn't know that. there is 250 people who have a N95022:45
freemangordonMalinux: well, actually I believe there are more, I guess lots of ex-Nokians have one22:46
sixwheeledbeastI prefer the N900 style slider, over the weird left screen up version in N950.22:47
Malinuxokey... hm.. I always wanted the N950 so badly, but well... :( :'(22:47
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freemangordonMalinux: trust me, n900 goes circles around it.22:48
freemangordonMalinux: as everyday phone ofc, not if you have to impress your friend with iCrap or S3 :D22:49
infobotfreemangordon meant: Malinux: as everyday phone ofc, not if you have to impress your friend owning iCrap or S3 :D22:49
sixwheeledbeastFremantle is "way" better then harmattan IMO ;)22:50
Malinuxfreemangordon: I know... the N900 is amesaing.22:50
Malinuxhm, not the correct way to spell it :S22:50
Malinuxor something22:50
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: hi. are you some kind of package interface admin/tester/something?22:50
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: why I ask...22:50
Malinuxis there a way to change the keyboard on the N900 to scandinavic or so?22:50
freemangordonis, because I looked at QA queue22:50
freemangordonthere are lots of (maybe orphaned) packages with karma > 622:51
freemangordonand noone to promote them22:51
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: there is an old thread on TMO with similar matter, I was wondering is it a good idea to resurrect it, now the package interface is ok22:52
freemangordonor maybe open a new thread, asking for "does anyone have objections if we promote those packages to extras" and if there are no, in a week or so, to promote those22:54
sixwheeledbeastfreemangordon: Yes and yes I think this is a good idea. Ivan and I we're pushing for maintainers a while back, DARP?22:54
Sysaxedfreemangordon: well, some phones with ubuntu edge are going to be released soon, so after somebody makes a real mobile linux OS (ubuntu edge os is going to suck for sure) we can finally switch to it.22:54
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sixwheeledbeastDarp is
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: I am talking about packaes in extras-testing ;)22:56
Sysaxeduhhh, is there any way to make whole home folder to be visible from a pc, not just mydocs?22:56
freemangordonSysaxed: yep, use ssh22:56
freemangordon(or winscp if you are on windoze)22:56
sixwheeledbeastAh, ok well if they have passed QA, they "should" be stable.22:57
Sysaxedfreemangordon: of course I can access them using ssh, but I want to open it via file manager22:57
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: yep22:57
sixwheeledbeastdo you have a list of pkgs?22:57
freemangordonthere are at least 10 of those22:57
freemangordoni just saw that while was fighting with autobuilder/promotion stuff22:58
freemangordoncheck "Fremantle Extras-testing QA queue. (user applications)"22:59
sixwheeledbeastIt would be nice for them to have a maintainer, lol at the link... ;)22:59
freemangordonand "Fremantle Extras-testing QA queue. (all packages)"22:59
freemangordonyeah :)22:59
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: sure it would be, but...22:59
freemangordonwhat is funny, is that qwazix's rawcam is amongst those :)23:00
sixwheeledbeastI think it would also be a good idea to purge some of the broken/duplicate packages23:00
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: duplicate?23:00
sixwheeledbeastmaemoreactor etc...23:01
freemangordonyeah, maybe23:01
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freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: BTW the main reason behind wanting that promotion to happen is pure PR :)23:01
freemangordonusers (part of them ofc) will see the maemo is still alive ;)23:02
freemangordonno matter it is dead man walking for the last 2 years :D23:02
sixwheeledbeastI agree we NEED to get promotion on the go for N900 users to see orange status menu icon, FYI K9 Call is incompatible with CSSU23:03
sixwheeledbeastbut has votes23:04
sixwheeledbeastas is DrLaunch IIRC23:04
freemangordonhmm, why is that?23:04
freemangordonooh, I see23:05
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freemangordon"...that supports portrait mode."23:05
MalinuxI found a scandinavic keyboard here... :D not sure if it difficult to change it
Malinuxand I don't know how to buy things from that site :p23:05
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: are you going through QA queue?23:06
sixwheeledbeasthildon desktop rotats and Dr launch rotates the opposite way, yes I am.23:06
Sysaxedso, once again. Is there any way to make whole home folder visible from pc instead of just MyDocs in mass storage mode?23:06
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freemangordonSysaxed: I guess no, as /home needs to be mounted23:07
freemangordons/nneds/have to/23:07
sixwheeledbeastOpera 12 is buggy too, there maybe an issue with promoting "all" QA'ed packages, I feel.23:08
freemangordon22:54 <freemangordon> or maybe open a new thread, asking for "does anyone have objections if we promote those packages to extras" and if there are no, in a week or so, to promote those23:08
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: well, the correct way to deal for packages not suitable for extras is to vote them down23:10
freemangordons/deal for/deal with/23:10
infobotfreemangordon meant: sixwheeledbeast: well, the correct way to deal with packages not suitable for extras is to vote them down23:10
sixwheeledbeastI agree but remeber these maybe votes pre-CSSU? and they work ok on stock.23:11
infobotsixwheeledbeast meant: I agree but remember these maybe votes pre-CSSU? and they work ok on stock.23:11
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: yeah, somemone need to test those. but it shouldn't be that hard, we talk about 10-20 packages I guess23:12
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freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: and if there is a bug not captured, it is supposed to be reported to the package maintainer. And we can withdraw a packge from extras anytime23:14
sixwheeledbeastMaybe ping the maintainers to see if they will come back and promote there product? I can start package testing again in the testing squad.23:14
freemangordonIIUC that is how package interface is supposed to work23:14
sixwheeledbeastNo good if the maintainer is AWOL23:14
sixwheeledbeastand you have promoted them.23:15
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: that would be great, I suspect the promotion not working was a big obstacle :)23:15
sixwheeledbeastbig is an understatement.23:15
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: yep, but there is always a chance someone else o take over the maintainership23:16
sixwheeledbeastSo if I list the packages for promotion and test them, post on TMO for any objections then promote or push back to devel?23:17
freemangordonyep, something like that should do the job. We should try to make the machinery running again.23:19
sixwheeledbeastI definitely can't agree to promoting them now without testing them again. I see packages I may have promoted 2 years ago, that have issues or don't work now.23:20
freemangordonafter all that was the point of community owned infra aiui23:20
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: sure23:21
sixwheeledbeastOk well actually I could do a couple at a time and bump the TMO thread if available.23:22
freemangordonmaybe. maybe discuss with the other councilors23:24
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freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: see, I don't want to lose the momentum we have now, see;O=D23:27
freemangordonI can only hope this will get better, but we should help that process IMO23:27
sixwheeledbeastYep, I agree.23:29
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sixwheeledbeastwell, innerspin and papertoss I have had on my device for ages with no issues.23:30
* freemangordon is going to check WTF are those :D23:30
sixwheeledbeastfreemangordon: mompls23:31
freemangordondon;t forget to check for optification23:32
freemangordonooh, games :D23:33
sixwheeledbeastthis is Pali's
sixwheeledbeastIf I have voted I have checked /opt23:35
freemangordonM4rtinK: do you consider promoting modrana 0.42.1 to extras-testing?23:35
M4rtinKfreemangordon: I have a new version about ready for release23:37
freemangordonoh, great23:37
M4rtinKhas quite a few important fixes23:37
M4rtinKso I would probably fix that if no serious issues show up after it is released23:37
M4rtinKBTW, one of the fixes is working address search :)23:38
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freemangordonM4rtinK: maybe I should start using modrana some day. But MM10 does descent job for me.23:39
freemangordoneven if only to support the great job you're doing :)23:39
M4rtinKMM10 ? :)23:40
freemangordonSygic Mobile Maps23:40
M4rtinKas long it works :)23:41
sixwheeledbeastSMM10 is easier for me to use day-to-day due to onscreen keyboard and map packs. However I love the work going into modRana I have that installed too. :)23:41
freemangordonnever failed on me23:41
M4rtinKBTW, regarding modRana progress23:41
M4rtinKI have some mid term plans for offline map rendering23:41
M4rtinKand near term plans for a new Qt 5 GUI (in addition to the GTK one and Qt4 one)23:42
freemangordonjolla eh?23:42
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: BTW could you look some day at
M4rtinKwell, actually thanks to the work thp and Khertan did on the pyotherside Python-Qt bindings23:42
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sixwheeledbeast works well too. going through and voting on packages now.23:43
M4rtinKthey are very minimal, but very simple & can work asynchronously23:43
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: I am still not sure if I should abuse my admin powers and promote that to extras :D (extmou)23:43
freemangordonM4rtinK: did you try QT5 on n900?23:44
sixwheeledbeastI have never used extmou only extkbd23:44
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: I am talking about comments23:44
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M4rtinKthe main target are of course new devices (Jolla, Ubuntu touch and Android (better supported by Qt5))23:44
M4rtinKbut IMHO should work quite nicely even on the N90023:44
M4rtinKfreemangordon: not yet, but it seems to be coming along quite well23:45
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* freemangordon thinks he should try to upgrade GPU drivers some day23:45
freemangordonthe ancient 1.3 version we use just sucks23:46
M4rtinKdepending on how well the Qt5 will go, I might even scrap the Qt4 GUI23:46
freemangordonmost of the time23:46
M4rtinKI plan to use the built-in Controls Qt components, sou that should result in less dependencies23:46
M4rtinKfreemangordon: are there any distributable updated SGX drivers ?23:47
freemangordonM4rtinK: those from Meego CE/Nemo? there is softfp one23:47
sixwheeledbeast:D "Leaving for now as my GF is becoming nervous."23:48
freemangordonyeah, run :D23:48
freemangordonM4rtinK: gimme a minute to find the tar name23:49
M4rtinKfreemangordon: so they do vsync ?23:49
sixwheeledbeastWell I see the argument for extmou.23:49
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freemangordonand friends23:50
sixwheeledbeastfreemangordon: you need to push your small update for extkbd to testing ;)23:50
freemangordonM4rtinK: assuming I have to backport powervr driver too, yes23:50
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M4rtinKfreemangordon: well, that would indeed be nice :)23:51
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: hmm, right, I should check what was the status there and why I didn;t promote that back then. there was a reason23:51
M4rtinKfreemangordon: but still, what about the redistributability ?23:52
sixwheeledbeastI bump you about it on extkbd thread IIRC.23:52
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: thanks23:52
freemangordonM4rtinK: AFAIK this is freely redistributable23:52
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sixwheeledbeastAs for extmou it doesn't depend on HEN etc so I see this a non-issue? It is obvious IMO that USB mouse will require additional packages etc.23:54
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: exactly23:54
freemangordonand now KP is in extras...23:55
sixwheeledbeastDoes it work with a BT mouse ok? Still KP or HEN are a non-issue due to not "depending" on them.23:55
freemangordonyou only need a BT mouse :)23:56
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sixwheeledbeastI don't have one :(23:56
freemangordonM4rtinK: I am not a lawyer, but I read that as "you can use this SW on N900"23:56
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M4rtinKfreemangordon: well that is indeed nice :)23:59
M4rtinKfreemangordon: it is just that I've seen cases when the drivers couldn't be even distributed as part of the flashable image23:59

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