IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2013-07-31

*** shentey has quit IRC00:01
*** brolin_empey has joined #maemo00:21
*** valeriusL has quit IRC00:22
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo00:23
*** Mike11 has quit IRC00:27
*** mavhc has quit IRC00:29
*** mavhc has joined #maemo00:31
*** sq-one has quit IRC00:38
*** kolp has quit IRC00:44
*** Hurrian has quit IRC00:50
*** NeutrinoPower has quit IRC00:55
*** eijk_ has quit IRC01:06
*** sardini_ has quit IRC01:08
*** BCMM has quit IRC01:10
*** drathir has quit IRC01:12
*** hardfalcon has quit IRC01:17
*** npm has quit IRC01:19
*** npm has joined #maemo01:20
*** hardfalcon has joined #maemo01:20
*** mvp has quit IRC01:22
*** Hurrian has joined #maemo01:27
*** BCMM has joined #maemo01:32
*** amin007110 has quit IRC01:33
*** florian has quit IRC01:40
*** rcg has quit IRC01:43
*** konelix has quit IRC01:48
*** sardini has joined #maemo01:50
*** GI_Jack has quit IRC01:55
DocScrutinizer05a short update for those wondering what's going on with all our woes on autobuilder|repo-management|administrative_maintenance:02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:29:53] <DocScrutinizer05> freemangordon: see /usr/share/php/midcom/lib/midcom/core/querybuilder.php line260 ==>02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:16] <DocScrutinizer05>         /* Force read only mode when in anonymous mode */02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:16] <DocScrutinizer05>         if (!$_MIDCOM->auth->is_valid_user())02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:16] <DocScrutinizer05>         {02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:16] <DocScrutinizer05>             $this->toggle_read_only(true);02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:16] <DocScrutinizer05>         }02:04
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-31 00:30:44] <DocScrutinizer05> comment out dat shite, done!02:04
bef0rdwon't that allow anonymous users to "write" something?02:06
*** GI_Jack has joined #maemo02:06
*** dos11 has quit IRC02:07
DocScrutinizer05this little "optimization" crept in with some install of midgard packages between Dec 2012 and may of this year, and rendered broken an estimated 50..75% of the cronjobs that do all the updates of karma, planet, news, package-interface, repo, younameit02:07
*** dos11 has joined #maemo02:07
*** ruskie has quit IRC02:07
DocScrutinizer05no, since normal authentication still applies02:09
DocScrutinizer05this is just an optimization done to db-objects (queries) that are r/o and thus you can't change their properties/values/whatever-the-name. It does NOT control if you can or can not do an update to db02:11
*** dos11 has quit IRC02:11
DocScrutinizer05it's kind like a "const" statement in c02:12
DocScrutinizer05according to midgard devels it's been done to reduce memory consumption02:13
DocScrutinizer05see for example /lib/midcom/core/querybuilder.php02:14
DocScrutinizer05(disclaimer: I have NFC about PHP)02:14
*** jrocha has quit IRC02:14
bef0rdah ok, I see some functions there to check privileges02:15
DocScrutinizer05...and I hope that will _never_ ever have to change. I don't want to touch that stuff with a 15ft pole02:15
DocScrutinizer05I've been tackling this since quite some time now02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:16:56] <mashiara> that warning comes from some legacy code trying to rewrite an ISO datetime to UNIX timestamp directly to an object02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:17:15] <mashiara> but if there is no used logged in objects are returned as read-only as this will increase performance02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:17:30] <mashiara> said legacy code is likely in the templates somewhere02:19
*** drathir has joined #maemo02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 13:01:49] <DocScrutinizer05> mashiara: this is very first line of that kind that shows up in www VM maemo_http_error.log:02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 13:01:53] <DocScrutinizer05> [Fri Dec 28 09:31:26 2012] [error] [client 10.0.0.1] PHP Warning:  (pid:20625): Can not write property. Object in read only mode in /usr/share/php/midcom/lib/midcom/core/dbaobject.php02:19
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:55:02] <mashiara> it's old code trying to do things now forbidden issue02:21
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:55:33] <mashiara> say we have $object->start property which contains ISO datetime as string02:21
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:55:51] <mashiara> but we want to format it with date, in a few places02:21
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-10 15:56:12] <mashiara> the clever template coder back in the day did $object->start = strtotime($object->start);02:21
DocScrutinizer05this bites us on a multitude of levels02:22
DocScrutinizer05commenting out just one line might put maemo.org from - say - 30% working to 98% working02:23
DocScrutinizer05I mean, all that stuff worked once, some year plus change ago02:24
DocScrutinizer05broke down during migration#1 basically02:25
DocScrutinizer05obviously due to some slightly newer midgard version got installed on the interim infra02:26
*** valerius has quit IRC02:29
*** valeriusL has quit IRC02:30
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo02:30
*** sr71_ is now known as sr7102:30
DocScrutinizer05I first time since March see a chance to get maemo.org back to old shape, maybe even til end of this week02:31
DocScrutinizer05thanks to freemangordon and his incredible energy investigating this particular issue02:32
*** Martix has quit IRC02:33
DocScrutinizer05oooh, on a sidenote, I deleted that rogue x11-data_withxdg package from repo for good, and freemangordon pushed repo-management to rebuild Packages.gz - so as a result this issue got solved today as well02:34
DocScrutinizer05autobuilder should work again as much as it did before 19th of this month02:35
*** OkropNick has quit IRC02:41
*** valerius has joined #maemo02:43
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo03:01
*** tg has joined #maemo03:03
*** robbiethe1st has joined #maemo03:04
*** GI_Jack has quit IRC03:07
*** vogon has quit IRC03:08
*** e-yes_ has quit IRC03:16
*** LauRoman has joined #maemo03:26
*** BCMM has quit IRC03:29
*** ruskie has joined #maemo03:34
*** amin007110 has quit IRC03:37
*** shawnjefferson22 has quit IRC03:54
*** mschlens has joined #maemo04:03
*** mschlens_ has quit IRC04:06
*** guampa has quit IRC04:14
*** guampa has joined #maemo04:17
*** keithzg has quit IRC04:25
*** brutal has quit IRC04:31
*** hardfalcon1 has joined #maemo04:41
*** hardfalcon has quit IRC04:43
*** FIQ has quit IRC04:44
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo04:44
*** FIQ has joined #maemo04:48
*** user has joined #maemo04:52
userare you friggin kidding me04:52
userjust started up phone04:52
usergot some issues with some custom made scripts not working04:53
userthe reason?04:53
userls: cannot access fixdate: Stale NFS file handle04:53
userperfect04:53
useroh and04:54
robbiethe1ststale nfs file handle, at least on mine, means filesystem corruption04:54
*** user is now known as FIQ|n90004:54
FIQ|n900yes I know04:54
FIQ|n900the thing is04:54
*** FIQ|n900 has quit IRC04:54
*** FIQ|n900 has joined #maemo04:54
FIQ|n900I already recovered the file system from an issue like this04:55
FIQ|n900last week04:55
robbiethe1stIt seems that whenever my N900 crashes, the optfs goes wonky04:56
FIQ|n900will reboot and attempt to solve this with BM *again*04:56
FIQ|n900hopefully it doesn't ruin the fs this time04:56
robbiethe1stAny damage is already done at this point04:56
FIQ|n900what do you mean?04:57
FIQ|n900also04:57
robbiethe1stThe fact that it said 'stale nfs handle' means that that file is, more or less, gone04:57
FIQ|n900this time it was definitely not caused by a hard reboot04:57
FIQ|n900it might have been last time04:57
robbiethe1stfdisk can probably fix the rest, but you probably won't get the file back04:58
FIQ|n900oh but I have a backup of that file04:58
robbiethe1stYeah, that's the only way04:58
FIQ|n900my problem is mainly actually solving it with fsck04:58
FIQ|n900last time I fsck-ed optfs04:58
FIQ|n900it destroyed the file system somehow04:58
robbiethe1stYeah, happens to me too04:58
robbiethe1stBest thing is to back it up, then restore04:58
FIQ|n900and e2fs claimed I was being a bonehead for having it mounted (it wasn't)04:58
robbiethe1stpart of the restore is a complete FS wipe/repartition in BM04:59
FIQ|n900you're the author of bm, right?04:59
robbiethe1stYeah05:00
FIQ|n900just curious, will creation of optfs backup actually work on a corrupted file system?05:00
robbiethe1stIt'll try.05:00
FIQ|n900otherwise I'll have to tar it manually with tar (that worked last time)05:00
robbiethe1stIf it's mountable, it'll mount and backup whatever files are there05:00
robbiethe1stConsidering it does exactly that, it should do as well as you can05:00
FIQ|n900mkay05:00
FIQ|n900will backup05:00
FIQ|n900try to fsck05:01
FIQ|n900if fsck fail, restore optfs only05:01
robbiethe1stYeah05:01
robbiethe1stHeck, you can restore your old optfs backup, if you haven't installed too many programs since05:01
FIQ|n900hm05:02
FIQ|n900that's true05:02
FIQ|n900but then I have to deal with the application desynchs I had to deal with before05:02
FIQ|n900oh well, at least I know *which* broke now05:02
FIQ|n900instead of discovering them as I go lol05:02
FIQ|n900see you05:02
robbiethe1stbtw, apt-get install --reinstall helps with that05:02
FIQ|n900yeah I know05:03
robbiethe1stk05:03
FIQ|n900did that a lot last optfs restore (didn't restore rootfs because I lacked rootfs for the right kernel)05:03
*** FIQ|n900 has quit IRC05:03
*** LauRoman has quit IRC05:08
DocScrutinizer05robbiethe1st: there's a pretty fuzzy naming around BM05:13
DocScrutinizer05optfs is not existing05:13
DocScrutinizer05I suggest to clearly name either the partition or the mountpoint05:14
robbiethe1stUh... huh?05:14
DocScrutinizer05so mmcblk0p2, or /home05:15
DocScrutinizer05optfs is no term you can actually find anywhere in an docs, and it suggests that maybe only /opt is saved which probably(!?) is incorrect05:16
DocScrutinizer05I don't need to explain that /opt is a bindmount05:17
*** trumee has quit IRC05:17
*** trumee has joined #maemo05:19
DocScrutinizer05robbiethe1st: you were a bit ambiguous if you'd appreciate a devel device or not. I'd like to make this happen anyway unless you say you do not accept any such support05:21
robbiethe1stOh, I thought I said 'yes'05:24
robbiethe1stLet me edit my post slightly05:25
robbiethe1stThere05:26
robbiethe1stMust have been slightly tired05:26
DocScrutinizer05:-)05:26
robbiethe1st(well, really tired. which is typical)05:26
DocScrutinizer05I'm also a bit tired right now, which is completely atypic for me, but maybe related to the percieved great achievement in bugfixing maemo.org today05:27
DocScrutinizer05feels good to smash the bug05:28
DocScrutinizer05well, right now we got it just sitting in the bucket, smashing happens tomorrow ;-D05:28
DocScrutinizer05robbiethe1st: I just checked your edit, and I think it's just more confusing XD05:33
robbiethe1st*sigh*05:34
DocScrutinizer05maybe get some sleep first ?05:34
DocScrutinizer05:-)05:34
robbiethe1stHow do I say05:34
robbiethe1st"yeah, i'm poor, I'll take it" but be very polite and humble about it05:34
robbiethe1st<_<05:34
DocScrutinizer05hehehe05:35
DocScrutinizer05lemme help you out ;-)05:35
robbiethe1stYeah...05:36
GeneralAntilles"HELL YEAH! MINE MINE MINE MINE!!"05:37
*** guampa has quit IRC05:41
*** nox- has quit IRC05:43
robbiethe1stGeneralAntilles, might be what I'm thinking, but I'd not say it05:47
robbiethe1stCause, you know, I at least /pretend/ to be humble. Because polite05:48
GeneralAntillesWhatever, man.05:52
*** lxp has joined #maemo06:01
*** lxp1 has quit IRC06:03
*** Psi has quit IRC06:16
*** Gh0sty has quit IRC06:20
*** Gh0sty has joined #maemo06:21
*** maybeWTF has joined #maemo06:31
*** maybeHere has quit IRC06:34
*** robbiethe1st has quit IRC06:34
*** SmokeyD has quit IRC06:47
*** SmokeyD has joined #maemo06:48
*** args[0] has quit IRC07:07
*** SAiF has joined #maemo07:20
AndrewX192hm... I can't enter my lock code (despite cracking it) on a device that hasn't been turned on in a few months - ideas?07:23
AndrewX192(I can't reflash since the USB port is dead)07:23
AndrewX192I'm in BackupMenu currently07:24
SAiFhmm.. anyone?07:30
psycho_oreosIf you have also tried the default lock code which also fails (there should be two types) then you are probably better off at getting that USB port fixed.07:34
AndrewX19212345? doesn't work07:36
AndrewX192It's like /dev/mtd1 is corrupt.. if I look at the whole thing I see my lock code (hashed) where I can crack it, and it's what it's supposed to be07:37
AndrewX192but if I use "getlockcode" it returns root::07:37
psycho_oreosTry 0000007:37
AndrewX192that doesn't work either07:38
AndrewX192I might as well chroot it or something07:39
AndrewX192stupid charge.sh spams a lot though07:39
*** piscodig has joined #maemo07:44
*** discopig has quit IRC07:45
*** VDVsx has quit IRC07:47
*** piscodig is now known as discopig07:48
psycho_oreosIdeally it would be wise to get that USB port fixed.07:56
*** marainein has left #maemo07:59
*** brutal has joined #maemo08:05
*** VDVsx has joined #maemo08:13
*** bef0rd has quit IRC08:33
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo08:33
*** goldkatze has joined #maemo08:38
*** bef0rd has quit IRC08:38
kerioFIQ: obligatory protip: don't use the stock fsck, it's shit08:39
kerioeither install an updated version, or work on a recent linux install on a computer08:39
kerioand to avoid any flash wonkiness, dd the whole partition, fsck it, copy the data, then rebuild the partition on the n900 and copy the data back08:40
SAiFwhat does this mean to an ordinary user like me?08:47
*** sardini_ has joined #maemo08:53
*** sardini has quit IRC08:56
kerioSAiF: keep calm and reflash09:02
kerioalso, wtf09:02
kerioif you're an ordinary user, why are you using a n90009:03
kerio?09:03
*** e-yes_ has joined #maemo09:05
SAiFhahaha!!!09:06
SAiFI am just ordinary user, but I wish to become like you, and thats why I am listening to this channel09:07
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo09:07
*** sardini_ has quit IRC09:08
SAiFand I am always calm, english as a second language, I just  dont know emotions in my sentences, I just only know the meanings,09:10
SAiFsorry, if I sounded rude.09:10
SAiFkerio:  :)09:11
*** XATRIX has joined #maemo09:12
*** npm has quit IRC09:18
*** amin_007110 has joined #maemo09:21
*** mavhc has quit IRC09:21
*** amin007110 has quit IRC09:23
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC09:23
*** mavhc has joined #maemo09:24
*** mavhc has quit IRC09:27
*** mvp has joined #maemo09:28
*** mavhc has joined #maemo09:29
*** dos11 has joined #maemo09:35
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo09:35
*** amin_007110 has quit IRC09:38
*** FIQ has quit IRC09:41
*** dos11 has quit IRC09:41
psycho_oreosAn ordinary user still using N900? that's rare, the majority would have probably migrated to some other software leaving mainly the rest behind.09:44
*** amin_007110 has joined #maemo09:47
joga? migrated to other software?09:48
psycho_oreos*ahem* as in using other <insert_some_other_phone_phablet_tablet_etc_OS_here>.09:49
jogaI will, when someone releases a phone that's even half of n90009:49
*** amin007110 has quit IRC09:50
jogapreferably the hw keyboard half09:50
jogaI own an android tablet and they're such toys in comparison09:50
psycho_oreosI think motorola does produce some android phones with qwerty keyboard. Albeit usually old and rare.09:51
jogajust the hw keyboard is not really enough, it's the bare minimum09:52
jogaand sadly I don't even trust android enough to do anything serious with it, like using ssh :p09:52
psycho_oreosA few of us I guess are thinking of the same thing as well.. to migrate would be something at least half of what maemo was. Inevitably trend won't head that way in the foreseeable future.09:54
jogaso obvious solution is to use n900 until it breaks09:54
* joga tries to be very gentle with it ;p09:54
psycho_oreosand/or keep more copies of N900 :)09:54
jogayeah, wish I had had spare money when some used ones were still available for cheap, would have bought like 5 or something09:55
psycho_oreosYou might still be able to obtain more, the question lies invariably on availability and/or the quality. These days I hear more and more stories of owners with broken N900 USB ports.09:57
jogayeah, I've been fortunate (or careful enough) to be spared of that fate09:57
psycho_oreosSame here except I don't think that is the only place to be aware of. Just recently I heard an owner of (what is now very much a) dead N800, I guess it will be matter of time too for N900's turn.09:59
psycho_oreoss/much a)/much) a/10:00
infobotpsycho_oreos meant: Same here except I don't think that is the only place to be aware of. Just recently I heard an owner of (what is now very much) a dead N800, I guess it will be matter of time too for N900's turn.10:00
jogaheh my n800 is still fine10:00
* psycho_oreos shrugs I've only managed to get into the scene was matter of pure coincidential values with N900. Never knew about the rest of the maemo family.10:01
psycho_oreosRather before getting introduced to N900 was when I never heard of maemo.10:03
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo10:03
*** amin_007110 has quit IRC10:03
*** murrayc has joined #maemo10:04
*** xmlich02 has joined #maemo10:10
*** eMHa has quit IRC10:11
*** xmlich02 has quit IRC10:11
*** xmlich02_ has joined #maemo10:11
*** DrCode has quit IRC10:13
*** vogon has joined #maemo10:13
SAiFHas anybody here seen this project? http://tox.im/10:13
*** kolp has joined #maemo10:14
*** amin_007110 has joined #maemo10:15
*** SmilyOrg is now known as Smily10:16
*** amin007110 has quit IRC10:18
*** triggerhappy has joined #maemo10:18
*** DrCode has joined #maemo10:19
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo10:29
*** sasquatch has joined #maemo10:29
*** amin_007110 has quit IRC10:30
*** amin007110 has quit IRC10:31
*** utanapischti has quit IRC10:32
*** thedead1440 has joined #maemo10:36
*** jmlich has joined #maemo10:53
*** jmlich has quit IRC10:54
*** AD-N770 has joined #maemo10:55
*** florian_kc has joined #maemo10:58
*** teotwaki has joined #maemo10:59
*** florian_kc is now known as florian11:01
*** vogon has quit IRC11:05
*** e-yes_ has quit IRC11:08
*** _Nicki has joined #maemo11:11
*** _Nicki has left #maemo11:12
*** croppa has joined #maemo11:12
*** eMHa has joined #maemo11:12
*** SAiF has quit IRC11:13
*** trx has quit IRC11:14
*** OkropNick has joined #maemo11:17
drathirbrolin_empey: sadly mine isnt on warranty, need to find repair place, but if i good saw in poland is person knowing about that, maybe get me some tips...11:21
*** rcg has joined #maemo11:31
*** eijk_ has joined #maemo11:31
*** trx has joined #maemo11:33
*** trx has joined #maemo11:33
*** eijk has joined #maemo11:41
*** eijk_ has quit IRC11:42
*** geaaru has joined #maemo11:51
*** xmlich02_ has quit IRC11:51
*** sunny_s has joined #maemo12:05
*** e-yes_ has joined #maemo12:28
*** Superpelican has joined #maemo12:55
*** mvp has quit IRC12:56
keriono powersaving on wifi is ridiculous13:00
*** OkropNick has quit IRC13:00
keriodrains my battery dry13:01
*** Superpelican has left #maemo13:02
edheldilpsycho_oreos:  add to it owners with broken GSM modem13:10
Lava_Croftoh the joy of flashing android crap13:13
psycho_oreosedheldil, not as many as those with broken USB ports but granted yes. There are also owners with broken bits and pieces :) I heard maybe a few with minijack playing up along with one that has a dead eMMC. Also a fair few would be affected with that faulty built-in cell battery.13:14
kerionobody has a working bupba13:14
keriot13:14
psycho_oreos~bupbat13:15
infobotmethinks bupbat is use the capacitive type, LiIon are breaking during 12 months, or http://www.digikey.de/product-detail/de/PAS414HR-VG1/587-2157-1-ND/1959153, or https://hbe-shop.de/KONDENSATOR006F-33V-STAKED-COIN13:15
jpinxn900's don't seem to have a date of manufacture anywhere13:15
*** BCMM has joined #maemo13:15
*** Psi has joined #maemo13:15
psycho_oreosjpinx, they sort of do on the fancy box itself iinm.13:15
jpinxwhere?13:16
* jpinx has the battery out13:16
psycho_oreosWhere the barcode is, there is a number there somewhere which sort of narrows it down to month and year of manufacture iinm.13:17
*** Martix has joined #maemo13:18
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo13:20
psycho_oreosjpinx, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=546651&postcount=81013:23
*** kwtm has joined #maemo13:24
kwtmHello. How do I find which package a given file/program is in?  e.g. if I want to run Program1, do I install PackageOfProgramsA, or PackageOfProgramsB, etc.?  (I already know how to use "apt-file list pkgname" if I already know the package name, but I'm trying to find the package name, which is likely not yet installed)13:25
*** psychologe has joined #maemo13:25
*** M4rtinK has quit IRC13:25
*** lizardo has joined #maemo13:25
keriodpkg -S pathname13:26
keriooh13:26
psycho_oreosI was about to say :)13:26
kerionot installed?13:26
kerioit's stored inside debs13:26
keriotough luck13:26
psycho_oreosIf you know the exact name of the program and where its stored (ideally the full path) you can probably google it up and then try narrowing it down to maemo specific. If lucky you might get it.13:27
kwtmkerio: Ok. Thx anyway. Yeah, I'm basically trying to figure out what to install. It's unlikely that I've already installed it, in such circumstances.13:29
kwtmpsycho_oreos: Thx anyway. I'm going to try looking it up in the Ubuntu search --usually they keep the same package arrangements as the rest of Debian.13:30
keriokwtm: what do you want to install?13:31
jpinxpsycho_oreos: here's my label, but no date that I can figure out :(  http://picpaste.com/20130731_009-9SWZoXzv.jpg13:34
kwtmkerio: Looking for an image viewer for KDE that doesn't crap out when meta information is corrupted (but the image data itself is fine)13:35
psycho_oreosjpinx, not your N900 lol. The retail packaging box (if you still have it).13:35
kwtmOh, look, apparently in addition to "apt-file list", there's "apt-file search" that can find what package a file is in, without the package needing to be installed.13:35
jon_ytruly, apt is the perfect app manager13:36
jpinxkwtm: or dpkg -l | grep <packagepartname>13:36
jon_ypraise be to debian13:36
kwtmjpinx: No, that doesn't work: the package has to be installed first.13:36
psycho_oreosjpinx, that's only for installed packages, and its a crude way :)13:36
jon_ymaybe google <programname> debian for clues13:37
kwtmjpinx: Also, it's dpkg -L, not dpkg -l (the latter lists package names, not filenames)13:37
psycho_oreosYou can make it into a for loop but its one hell of a ugly hack with excess pipes and other tools like awk/sed required.13:38
kwtmHmm, looks like I found the answer.  I had heard of "apt-file list" and "apt-cache search" but had not realized there was a "apt-file search" before today.13:38
kwtmThanks, people! :)13:38
psycho_oreosYeah I learnt dpkg -S just the other day :).13:39
* jpinx missed the bit where the pkg isn't actually installed yet13:39
jpinxkwtm: explore packages.debian.org (or is it .net)13:40
*** SAiF has joined #maemo13:40
psycho_oreosjpinx, you still have that retail packaging box for your N900?13:40
jpinxpsycho_oreos: nope :(  long gone - but still have the paper manual :)13:42
jpinxit's about 5 years old13:42
psycho_oreosYeah the label on the retail packaging would have indicate the week and year of manufacture. By no means that is exact but its probably better than nothing.13:43
*** Vlad_on_the_road has joined #maemo13:43
jpinxI know it's a very early one, but it's soldiering on well13:45
psycho_oreosLooking at that photo and trying to decrypt various printing on it. I think the one with three forward slashes is probably the IMEI number, thought it might be useful for trying to pinpoint the manufacture dates. Apart from that it seems like the warranty or protection something is voided. There's Chinese words on that sticker near the JTAG area with a hole in it.13:45
*** psychologe has quit IRC13:45
psycho_oreosNot as early as the pre-release ones, they were made in Finland and probably not many are still working well.13:46
jpinxyea - I've had it apart a couple of times after a local (thailand) shop tried to fix a screen problem13:46
psycho_oreosAhh.13:46
jpinxthey stuck chinese stickers everywhere13:47
jpinxand I ended up fixing the screen myself -13:47
*** psychologe has joined #maemo13:47
jon_y this land is now claimed by China :)13:47
jpinxyea - something like that13:47
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo13:48
jon_yI still have my N900 box13:48
psycho_oreosRather "this piece of equipment is now owned by China" lol.13:48
jpinxI travel too much to accumulate a lot of stuff13:48
jpinxI have an eeepc and 2 n900's13:48
jon_yI need more n900s13:49
jpinxbeen contemplating how to replace them when they die - all are getting old and well used13:49
jpinxjon_y: you want one of mine ? :)13:49
jon_yjpinx: sure13:49
psycho_oreosYeah I know when travelling its never fun to take too many N900 retail boxes (for each N900 bought overseas). It tends to give customs the wrong impressions.13:49
jon_yif it boots and usb isn't broke13:49
jpinxjon_y: it's cool - did you pick up the link to the picpaste?13:50
jon_ypsycho_oreos: tell them it calms you down psychologically :)13:50
jon_ynot yet13:50
psycho_oreosApart from excess luggage that is. Nonetheless the N900 packaging was fancy of its day and age. I still have most of my retail packaging boxes however.13:50
psycho_oreosjon_y, after paying import taxes yes :)13:50
jon_yhow much after tax? :(13:51
jon_ywhere are you at anyway?13:51
jpinxI'm in Thailand atm :)13:51
psycho_oreosI don't know, at the time N900 was still available to purchase from the shops overseas (despite only a handful of stores that still manage to carry them).13:51
jon_yin that case, I'm just down south in Malaysia13:52
jpinxjon_y: pm?13:52
jon_ysure13:52
psycho_oreosIt was best that I carry the extra N900s in my pockets and hope they won't question about it all.13:53
jpinxone in pocket and one in handluggage ;)13:55
*** sunny_s has quit IRC13:56
*** psychologe has quit IRC13:58
psycho_oreosFor me (at the time) it was one in outer (visible) jacket pockets and the other on the inner (hidden) jacket pockets. I love how asians design the jackets, they've considered about people pickpocketing and those extra (hidden) pockets can come in handy for various purposes.13:58
*** OkropNick has joined #maemo14:00
jpinxgoing through security kinda blows that ;)14:09
psycho_oreosIt does but its best hope that they're in good mood, if you're having constant misfortune you might end up getting thoroughly searched and thorougly taxed for whatever you failed to claim.14:11
psycho_oreoss/best hope/best to hope/14:12
infobotpsycho_oreos meant: It does but its best to hope that they're in good mood, if you're having constant misfortune you might end up getting thoroughly searched and thorougly taxed for whatever you failed to claim.14:12
*** mvp has joined #maemo14:17
*** drussell has quit IRC14:26
*** M4rtinK has quit IRC14:28
*** sunny_s has joined #maemo14:28
*** frals_ is now known as frals14:36
Lava_Crofthttp://webnewsvoice.com/nexus-5-and-nokia-focus-release-with-android-5-0/14:39
* Lava_Croft chuckles14:40
*** mvp has quit IRC14:40
jon_yLava_Croft: what unholy union is this?14:43
*** uen| has joined #maemo14:43
jon_yunholy struct, unholly enum hehe14:43
*** ketas- has joined #maemo14:44
*** ketas- has quit IRC14:44
*** Martix has quit IRC14:45
Lava_Croft:)14:46
*** uen has quit IRC14:47
*** uen| is now known as uen14:47
drathirlol right made in korea not finland :/14:53
jon_yif it means I can root it and install maemo, I might just forgive Nokia14:54
jon_ygnu userland would be pretty nice14:55
*** kwtm has quit IRC14:56
psycho_oreos... you do realise that new phone isn't going to happen right?15:02
*** Vlad_on_the_road has quit IRC15:10
*** jmlich has joined #maemo15:18
*** mvp has joined #maemo15:18
Lava_CroftAny reason why tracker, when rebuildings its db, seems to now ignore a lot of my music files15:19
Lava_Crofthmm, maybe it just takes longer to index flac files15:21
Lava_Croftor not15:21
Lava_Croftit popped up the notification about adding new files and then didnt add anything new15:21
*** SAiF has quit IRC15:22
*** valerius has quit IRC15:25
Lava_Croftreinstalling ogg-support fixt it15:25
*** SAiF has joined #maemo15:26
*** mvp has quit IRC15:27
LjLnice to see Fennec on Maemo is as slow as i remember Fennec on Android being :P15:32
*** LauRoman has joined #maemo15:34
Lava_Croft:D15:34
Lava_Croftcurrent android firefox is kind of ok15:35
Lava_Croftit just has a horrible UI15:35
*** DocScrutinizer05 has quit IRC15:36
*** DocScrutinizer05 has joined #maemo15:36
LjLi haven't used the more recent versions. besides, on my Milestone i doubt it would be very usable anyway, it's just an old phone by now...15:37
LjLanyway it's ok since i don't mind MicroB15:37
Lava_Crofti dont mind microb if im stuck in a bubble where time moves 10x slower than the rest of the world15:38
Lava_Crofter faster15:38
Lava_Crofthurrr15:38
LjLheh15:38
LjLyeah it's a bit slow15:38
LjLbut then so is Fennec, so not sure what other choices i have :P15:38
LjL(except ones that look ugly)15:38
*** valeriusL has quit IRC15:41
*** valerius has joined #maemo15:43
*** SAiF has quit IRC15:48
DocScrutinizer05infobot: bupbat is also http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=9086415:48
infobotDocScrutinizer05: okay15:48
*** guampa has joined #maemo15:49
*** SAiF has joined #maemo15:53
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo15:54
*** lurker_412 has joined #maemo15:56
*** lurker_412 has left #maemo15:58
DocScrutinizer05((<Lava_Croft> hmm, maybe it just takes longer to index flac files)) missing flac support in tracker is a known issue, cured by re-running the postinstall of flac package iirc15:58
DocScrutinizer05ooh, or ogg package ;-P15:58
*** valerius has quit IRC16:03
kerioLava_Croft: mh, i always found microb to be much faster than any other browser, on n90016:09
kerioexcept for opera mobile16:09
keriowhich is not a browser16:09
*** e-yes_ is now known as e-yes16:10
jon_yopera is an image downloader :)16:15
LjLkerio: it's slow compared to my Android browser (which runs on a very similarly specced phone), though16:17
LjLDocScrutinizer05, is advanced-power and advanced-power-monitor a good idea to install, or somehow troublesome?16:17
kerioLjL: it's crap16:17
kerioif you want a fancier battery applet, install the one from pali16:17
keriothe package is in cssu-devel16:18
LjLugh, so many repositories :P can i install that while not actually having cssu-devel installed?16:18
kerioyes16:18
kerioa repository is just a bunch of files16:18
kerioLjL: http://maemo.merlin1991.at/cssu/community-devel/pool/free/s/status-area-applet-battery/status-area-applet-battery_1.0-8_armel.deb16:19
kerioit should Just Work™16:19
LjLyeah i know, but it's possible a package from a repository will break stuff if it's supposed to be used with everything from that repository up to date16:19
LjLok16:19
keriowhy do you want advanced power monitor?16:19
kerioare you using some kind of bme replacement?16:19
kerioidk if it'll help, actually16:19
keriomake sure you're in a position where you can reinstall the stock one16:20
keriojust by uninstalling and reinstalling, it would work16:20
*** valerius has joined #maemo16:22
LjLkerio: i have nothing fancy, would just like some more detailed battery info (although i realize they can be inaccurate) than just a green block that i have to guess the tallness of :P16:23
keriothen the new battery applet should help with that16:23
keriobut it's still awfully inaccurate, unless you calibrate bq27k16:23
kerioin face16:23
keriofact16:23
keriocalibrate bq27k16:24
kerioit's cool16:24
LjLi'll probably do that later, just not got around to it yet16:26
*** valerius has quit IRC16:27
kerioespecially if you then install the bme replacement16:28
kerioyou get a stupidly accurate meter16:28
keriofor everything16:28
kerioDocScrutinizer05: how precise is bq27k?16:28
*** AD-N770 has quit IRC16:30
DocScrutinizer05kerio: in its principles of operation it's extremely precise16:32
*** AD-N770 has joined #maemo16:32
*** drussell has joined #maemo16:32
LjLmeh, i'm looking at cssu-testing and wanting to install bits of this and bits of that, is it going to be tragic if i just upgrade to cssu-testing? how "testing" is it? :P16:33
DocScrutinizer05of course there are factors like battery chemistry introduced efficiency (ratio between energy you charged and energy that can get discharged) that bq27200 can not meter16:34
kerioLjL: it's literally the testest16:35
DocScrutinizer05but that gas gauge as such is very accurate16:35
*** mhlavink_away has quit IRC16:36
*** mhlavink has joined #maemo16:37
DocScrutinizer05cssu-t for long time been pretty stable and of good quality add-on on top of stock fremantle. Recently though it tends to transform towards some sort of experimental independent incompatible distro16:38
kerioeeeeh16:40
keriowe just need to hold pali back a bit16:40
*** valerius has joined #maemo16:44
LjLuhm16:44
*** mhlavink has quit IRC16:45
*** bef0rd has joined #maemo16:53
*** vogon has joined #maemo16:56
kerioalso, DocScrutinizer05 is lyin16:56
keriog16:56
*** Kaadlajk_ is now known as Kaadlajk17:00
LjLkerio: ah, the applet looks good, no frills and it just gives me some estimate. it's what i was looking for. i'll install cssu-testing now17:04
DocScrutinizer05kerio: yes, always I'm lying. So cssu-t was shit all times, and didn't change at all recently17:05
LjLhow come HAM and FAM have different repository lists? that's a bit annoying. i assumed they both just used /etc/apt/sources.list but apparently not17:06
*** mhlavink has joined #maemo17:06
DocScrutinizer05kerio: are you aware that an accusation of lying is a severe insult?17:06
*** andre__ has joined #maemo17:06
DocScrutinizer05~fapman17:06
infobotwell, fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default.17:06
LjLDocScrutinizer05, often saying "x is lying" after someone says something in a bit of an exaggerate/playful way merely means "x is being facetious, he doesn't really mean it". that's how i took it, anyway17:07
DocScrutinizer05well, I didn't17:08
DocScrutinizer05neither of both17:08
*** VDVsx has quit IRC17:08
DocScrutinizer05each single word of my staement about cssu-t above been carefully chosen17:11
DocScrutinizer05to support that statement I may say that I refuse to update since cssu-t7.217:12
*** waelsy123 has joined #maemo17:12
DocScrutinizer05and I honestly consider to reflash my daily phone and then swtich to CSSU-S17:13
LjLi sense that while there is a lot of expertise around Maemo and friends, there may also be a fair bit of mutual developer hostility ;(17:13
*** Mike11 has joined #maemo17:13
*** amin007110 has joined #maemo17:14
DocScrutinizer05I don't agree with either of your two statements in there17:14
LjLi could certainly be wrong about them since i just came here. it's just a general first impression.17:15
DocScrutinizer05btw cssu-devel is basically NOT a repo17:18
DocScrutinizer05at least not in the sense any normal user would understand the term17:19
DocScrutinizer05as a general rule, you should stay away from it by all means, unless you're interested in breaking your device to test a particular package17:20
DocScrutinizer05it's developers' dropbox17:21
*** jmlich has joined #maemo17:22
LjLyeah, i read the TMO disclaimers17:22
LjLi just installed that battery applet17:22
*** konelix has joined #maemo17:22
*** shanttu has joined #maemo17:23
DocScrutinizer05good17:24
DocScrutinizer05even better if it actually works for you17:24
LjLis there a way to have a reasonably working portrait keyboard? the default one gets all crammed in portrait mode (when it shows up as such at all), i saw there's a dialpad-style "portrait-keyboard", but when i install it, it gets used for landscape too17:27
*** totalizator has quit IRC17:28
DocScrutinizer05sorry, I don't know. I'm not particularly interested in portrait mode, since otherwise... I could have moved on to N9 already17:29
LjLheh17:29
LjLi'm used to use a portait virtual keyboard and the physical keyboard alternatively, depending on how much and what kind of stuff i need writing17:30
DocScrutinizer05there been a few quite nice keyboards in openmoko, you might want to port and test them maybe ;-)17:30
DocScrutinizer05full qwerty kbd needs stylus for the minuscule keys. predictive error-correcting keyboard is useful only for plain text that the dictionary can predict/correct. The transparent fullscreen kbd is pretty nice for some usecases and actually finger-friendly17:32
*** amin_007110 has joined #maemo17:33
*** amin007110 has quit IRC17:36
*** guerby has quit IRC17:38
*** guerby has joined #maemo17:39
jaskasharp fingernail also kinda works.. being resistive ts17:39
*** jmlich has quit IRC17:51
*** mvp has joined #maemo17:54
*** jmlich has joined #maemo17:55
*** waelsy123 has quit IRC18:00
*** jmlich has quit IRC18:09
*** amin_007110 is now known as amin00711018:11
*** jmlich has joined #maemo18:11
*** Martix has joined #maemo18:11
*** valerius has quit IRC18:13
*** mvp has quit IRC18:13
*** jmlich has quit IRC18:17
*** valeriusL has quit IRC18:21
*** otep has quit IRC18:28
*** otep has joined #maemo18:28
*** Martix has quit IRC18:32
*** user_ has joined #maemo18:32
*** NIN101 has joined #maemo18:32
*** user_ has quit IRC18:33
*** user_ has joined #maemo18:34
*** mvp has joined #maemo18:39
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo18:40
*** Mike11 has quit IRC18:40
*** Mike11 has joined #maemo18:40
*** Mike11 has quit IRC18:42
*** Mike11 has joined #maemo18:43
*** Mike11 has quit IRC18:43
*** Mike11 has joined #maemo18:43
*** valerius has joined #maemo18:46
*** eijk has quit IRC18:49
*** XATRIX has quit IRC18:53
*** rcg has quit IRC18:54
*** user_ has quit IRC18:57
*** valeriusL has quit IRC19:07
DocScrutinizer05[notice] preemptively announcing maemo.org service downtime later on19:08
DocScrutinizer05tmo probably will be fine19:08
DocScrutinizer05the rest might go down for a few hours19:09
*** triggerhappy has quit IRC19:14
*** dos11 has joined #maemo19:17
*** npm has joined #maemo19:19
*** Kabouik has joined #maemo19:20
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo19:20
LjLjaska: yeah, i often use my nails with resistive screen, took me a while to adjust to "clumsy" capacitive thumb usage19:21
*** e-yes has quit IRC19:21
LjLalthough now i'm back on a resistive screen, of course, it feels awkward being now used to capacitive :P19:21
jaskayeah im incapable of operating capacitive without a conductive stylus19:21
*** vogon has quit IRC19:22
LjLi just hate using virtual keyboards on one19:22
*** VDVsx has joined #maemo19:22
jaskai just refuse to use keyboardless :)19:22
Lava_Croftstylus is tool of the gods19:22
*** vogon has joined #maemo19:23
LjLkerio, can you give me a pointer about the alternative BME? all i know about it is that when i tried installed advanced-power a few days ago, there was "BME Alternative" in the options :P19:24
* DocScrutinizer05 beats Lava_Croft with his eten-M800 stylus19:24
DocScrutinizer05;-P19:25
LjLalso, i'm not sure, but it seems maybe GPS assistance works again after i installed this random hack from cssu-devel O.o actually i have satellites now, but i'm indoors, so i doubt it got a fix without assistance19:25
Lava_CroftDon't you beat me, nerd!!!119:25
Lava_CroftI cycled today, muscles ache19:25
Lava_Croftalso it rained, so my carton n900 bicycle case died19:25
Lava_Croftso the last thing i need is someone hitting me with his 'stylus'19:25
Lava_Croft:)19:26
LjLthe N810 might not be as hardware-capable as the N900 but damn does it look sleek19:26
DocScrutinizer05YES!19:27
LjLN810 isn't actually mine, it was a present for my sister, but by now my sister has got an Android phone and stopped using the N810, so i reclaimed it :P19:27
DocScrutinizer05and I still think it has the better kbd. Others like to disagree19:27
DocScrutinizer05the N810 key mapping is weird, but the kbd hw feels better to me than the N900's19:29
LjLi don't know about that... the keys are more spaced, it "looks" better, it has more of them... but they're SO HARD to press19:29
LjLthe N950 keyboard looks very nice, but i never had the luxury to see it for real19:29
Lava_Croft5510 had the lovely KB19:29
LjLew, no19:30
LjLif we want to talk about lovely keyboards, let's talk Psion19:30
Lava_Croftpsion, Keyboards with an attached screen!19:30
Lava_Croft>_>19:30
DocScrutinizer05N950 keyboard is abysmal19:30
Lava_Croftyes, those were very nice19:30
LjLDocScrutinizer05: oh?19:30
Lava_Croftn950 keys look all flat19:31
DocScrutinizer05you basically can't type "blind"(?) on it19:31
DocScrutinizer05the keys are *very* hard to distinguish tactile19:31
*** NeutrinoPower has joined #maemo19:32
LjLhmm. weird, in the pictures, they look more spaced than on either the N900 or the N810, so i assumed you could feel the space between them much better19:32
Lava_Croftn950 keyboard looks like an apple one19:32
Lava_Croftwhere the keys are just flat19:32
LjLon the N900 i basically can't, the only thing that helps is the keys themselves being curved19:32
LjLyeah19:32
DocScrutinizer05they ARE just flat19:32
Lava_Crofthorrible:<19:32
Lava_Croftthey need to be curved either convex or concave19:32
Lava_Croftif those are even the right terms19:33
LjLfortunately my Milestone, too, has curved keys - because apparently some versions of it didn't - and i'm pretty sure i couldn't type on it with flat keys19:33
LjLLava_Croft: they should be19:33
*** vogon has quit IRC19:33
LjLstill, my tactile cue on keyboards like the Psion's is not so much the curvature, but the "edges" of the keys. that's missing on the N900, N810 and Milestone19:33
*** vogon has joined #maemo19:34
*** mvp has quit IRC19:35
DocScrutinizer05N950 kbd is the second worst hw qwerty kbd I ever ran into. Absolute winner in that category is eten-M800 which not even has gaps between keys, and they are all black except the tiny writing which isn't at center of keycap19:36
DocScrutinizer05so even when you look at the keyboard you always press some additional keys above and/or left of the one you intended to press19:37
Lava_Croftmy western european hands work fine with n90019:38
DocScrutinizer05particularly in the dark19:38
Lava_Croft(ie. big hands)19:38
Lava_Crofti must admit that it got a bit old to carry around a BT keyboard19:38
Lava_Croftand on the train put your phone on the table and get out the keyboard19:38
*** florian has quit IRC19:39
LjLWM phones... i have an HTC Universal, that's not bad, both keyboard-wise and in other ways19:42
LjLhowever (i assume that's common to all WM phones) when you "turn it off", it actually goes into some suspend mode and can't stay connected to TCP/IP... if you actually want it to stay connected, then the battery dies in like 4 hours19:43
LjLi guess it's intended to be more of PocketPC + a phone module thing, than an always-on device19:43
*** eMHa has quit IRC19:48
*** ruskie has quit IRC19:48
DocScrutinizer05http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1364135#post136413519:53
*** mavhc has quit IRC20:01
*** mavhc has joined #maemo20:01
*** FIQ has joined #maemo20:02
*** Martix has joined #maemo20:04
*** ruskie has joined #maemo20:04
*** mavhc has quit IRC20:07
*** mavhc has joined #maemo20:09
*** geaaru has quit IRC20:13
*** eMHa has joined #maemo20:14
*** Martix has quit IRC20:16
*** thomasjfox has joined #maemo20:23
*** Mike11 has quit IRC20:29
*** BCMM has quit IRC20:33
*** GI_Jack has joined #maemo20:34
*** BCMM has joined #maemo20:35
*** FredrIQ has joined #maemo20:39
*** FIQ has quit IRC20:39
*** FredrIQ is now known as FIQ20:39
*** piggz has joined #maemo20:40
*** ab has quit IRC20:44
*** ab has joined #maemo20:45
*** ced117 has joined #maemo20:46
*** RzR has joined #maemo20:49
RzRhi20:49
RzRanyone from south america around ?20:49
*** BCMM has quit IRC21:10
*** Kabouik has quit IRC21:13
*** LauRoman has quit IRC21:17
*** eMHa has quit IRC21:18
*** Milhouse has quit IRC21:25
*** andre__ has quit IRC21:25
*** mvp has joined #maemo21:30
*** Milhouse has joined #maemo21:31
*** valerius has quit IRC21:31
*** valeriusL has quit IRC21:34
*** louisdk has joined #maemo21:44
*** mvp has quit IRC21:44
*** valeriusL has joined #maemo21:46
*** valerius has joined #maemo21:50
*** bertogg has joined #maemo21:51
*** florian has joined #maemo21:56
*** florian has joined #maemo21:56
*** sq-one has joined #maemo21:58
*** eMHa has joined #maemo22:00
*** BCMM has joined #maemo22:02
*** _rd has joined #maemo22:03
*** eMHa has quit IRC22:07
DocScrutinizer51[GENERAL NOTICE] maemo.org going down for maintenance NOW22:07
*** eMHa has joined #maemo22:22
*** _rd has quit IRC22:29
*** piggz has quit IRC22:34
*** _rd has joined #maemo22:36
*** sunny_s has quit IRC22:44
*** e-yes has joined #maemo22:48
*** _rd has quit IRC22:48
*** _rd has joined #maemo23:00
*** drussell has quit IRC23:06
*** _rd has quit IRC23:10
*** SAiF has quit IRC23:13
*** SAiF has joined #maemo23:13
*** sunny_s has joined #maemo23:23
*** mvp has joined #maemo23:26
*** ced117 has quit IRC23:26
*** rcg has joined #maemo23:29
*** sq-one has quit IRC23:30
*** piggz has joined #maemo23:30
*** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo23:33
*** Smily has quit IRC23:36
*** piggz has quit IRC23:39
*** npm has quit IRC23:39
*** OkropNick has quit IRC23:45
*** shawnjefferson22 has joined #maemo23:47
*** Martix has joined #maemo23:47
*** kolp has quit IRC23:52
*** kolp_ has joined #maemo23:53
*** mvp has quit IRC23:54
*** lizardo has quit IRC23:55
*** M4rtinK has joined #maemo23:59

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!