IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2013-07-22

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rlinfatiDocScrutinizer51, hey, the extras-devel repository has some md5/sha1sum checksum error , see
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DocScrutinizer05merlin1991: ^^^01:30
FIQ|n900I've used a N900 for umm01:34
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FIQ|n900when was it released?01:35
FIQ|n900end of 2010 or something like that, wasn't it?01:35
FIQ|n900oh wait01:37
FIQ|n900it was 200901:37
FIQ|n900I've used this thing for over three years01:37
FIQ|n900that's crazy lol01:37
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DocScrutinizer05you know what's crazy? that you can't get repair for those devices after actually only 2 years03:26
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Lava_Croftyou couldnt get repairs before those 2 years03:34
Lava_Croftonly replacements03:34
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psycho_oreosFIQ|n900, ping03:54
FIQ|n900psycho_oreos: pong03:58
psycho_oreosFIQ|n900, I can't quite see any reasons why /opt/python would fail. Though that last link you posted contains fair bit of private info :)03:59
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FIQ|n900psycho_oreos: mhm?04:01
FIQ|n900looked at it a little before pasting04:02
FIQ|n900didn't see anything critical though perhaps I missed something04:02
psycho_oreosSomehow I don't think failed mounts (particularly at bind mounts) would be shown via syslog.04:03
FIQ|n900psycho_oreos: and DocScrutinizer05 asked about a syslog dump earlier and I assumed it didn't contain anything critical by that04:03
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FIQ|n900private info how exactly?04:04
psycho_oreosFIQ|n900, no doubt he did though to this point I believe it was to tell you that we basically needed a lot more information when MH was only partially working. I can't see any information about python issues in syslog personally.04:05
psycho_oreosYour IMEI is visible. There's a few other interesting but not exactly private info, such as your bootup video, your (failed) desktop wallpaper preferences (the images probably failed), and your WAP info.04:06
FIQ|n900DocScrutinizer05 mentioned something about a potential bug where python bindmounts would fail if a fsck was ran on the partition04:06
FIQ|n900psycho_oreos: ok04:06
FIQ|n900my desktop wallpaper is fully intended to not show up04:07
FIQ|n900I don't care about boot video information04:07
FIQ|n900IMEI is a bit more critical though :p04:07
FIQ|n900good to know...04:07
DocScrutinizer05FIQ|n900: that been wild speculations04:07
FIQ|n900DocScrutinizer05: ok04:08
psycho_oreosYeah but I think the underlying fault would be to do with /home /opt being the main premise. If that were to occur, /home and /opt would not be mounted imo.04:08
FIQ|n900"your WAP info" i.e. apn info?04:08
FIQ|n900isn't this just telling what my operator is? because that's not something I would consider private04:09
DocScrutinizer05I said in theory the patch to fstab in CSSU-T might have changed the timing of bindmounts, so in ever farther fetched theory, a python command could run and fail during that time where now python bindmounts are not done while formerly they were04:09
FIQ|n900allthough perhaps it was silly by me to paste the entire syslog, I dunno04:09
psycho_oreosFIQ|n900, no not your wallpaper.. I'll give you a bit of info: hildon-desktop[1149]: GLIB WARNING ** default - Error loading cached background image /home/user/.backgrounds/background-6.***. Misslyckades med att öppna filen "/home/user/.backgrounds/background-6.***": No such file or directory04:10
psycho_oreosYeah APN info, and your IP address, etc was also visible. Also your SMS centre number.04:11
FIQ|n900should be intended @ background failing04:11
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FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: regarding desktop background - since I installed cssu, I've walked into desktop settings and removed all desktop views except for number #5 which gave a completely black background as the image was only adjusted for 404:15
FredrIQ|n900not really what the thing was intended for, but meh :p04:15
FredrIQ|n900perhaps that's something else though04:15
* psycho_oreos is still quite stumped at the issue. So nothing exists in those binded mounts? and those mounts for python doesn't exist meaning that maybe they're not in fstab or something?04:15
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FredrIQ|n900but they are04:16
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FredrIQ|n900issuing "mount" fixes the issue04:16
FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: well obviously I didn't realize that the info was quite critical but oh well, can't undo it now :P04:16
FredrIQ|n900and it wasn't too bad, could have been worse lol04:16
psycho_oreosFredrIQ|n900, ahh though it goes from 6-9 with that error so yeah. Again not really private info but was somewhat interesting to see (I mean from the perspective of another user with 9 home screens) :D04:17
FredrIQ|n900I don't use the desktop at all04:17
psycho_oreosFredrIQ|n900, *nods* oh well you learnt something ;) not that I care about all the private info anyway.04:17
FredrIQ|n900that's why I wanted no (or black) bg04:18
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psycho_oreosissuing "mount" fixes issue.. wait.. by mount as in just "mount" with no args? by default "mount" with no args just lists the mounted fs.04:18
FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: yes, I found this quite strange that it did fix the issue...04:19
FredrIQ|n900perhaps it was a coincidence but, mounting being that delayed (startup, attempting mh and failing, firing up terminal) doesn't make any sense...04:19
psycho_oreosFredrIQ|n900, I somehow don't think its actually coincidential. If you have something like cpumem-applet installed you might be able to see if N900 was still busy loading up or not.04:20
FredrIQ|n900(tried to fire up MH to see if the error was apparent right now to be able to debug more, but MH worked fine)04:20
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FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: hmm ok04:21
FredrIQ|n900well I'll try to look into it a little next time it fails04:21
psycho_oreosFredrIQ|n900, also install useful applet like the one I mentioned :) its priceless for power-users imho.04:22
psycho_oreosThere were some notable warnings from dbus within that syslog and then later on issues with ISI_SMS. Whether or not do they play a part in making the device seem sluggish and/or to make "mount" command itself coincidentally fixes up issues with python is a bit beyond me. Though it is probably notable that I'm guessing there are commands/things that the device has to do, the "mount" command itself can't quite possibly automagically mount all the pyt04:26
psycho_oreoshon binding mounts. It simply just doesn't add up imo04:26
DocScrutinizer05I weird idea: umount those python bindmounts and *then* check what's inside the mountpoint dirs04:27
FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: indeed it didn't make any sense04:27
FredrIQ|n900DocScrutinizer05: well I did that indirectly before, didn't I?04:28
FredrIQ|n900they was empty04:28
DocScrutinizer05didn't follow the details04:28
FredrIQ|n900I guess I can check after umounting manually though04:28
psycho_oreosFredrIQ|n900, its not like the optification somehow automagically hacked the "mount" binary to mount any unmounted stuff needed for python. Another possibility is I/O lag, lag from within the data throughput that is causing the python mounts to not come up instantaneously.04:29
FredrIQ|n900psycho_oreos: indeed - it doesn't make any sense04:31
FredrIQ|n900so perhaps it just was a coincidence04:31
psycho_oreosI'm still willing to place my money it isn't a random artifact, there has to be a meaningful explanation.04:32
FredrIQ|n900also, checked directories after umounting - empty04:33
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FredrIQ|n900also tried to issue "mount" - and it did not do anything funny (as expected)04:33
FredrIQ|n900so it seems to have been a coincidence then04:33
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psycho_oreosWhen for the first time you issued that "mount" command, was there any sort of lag? even if it was just a mere 1 second lag?04:34
FIQ|n900not that I recall04:35
psycho_oreosHmm :/04:35
FIQ|n900but it's possible that, after my check of directories finding them empty, that I timed the mount command right after they were mounted04:36
FIQ|n900which would produce such behaviour04:36
FIQ|n900btw what's isi_sms?04:36
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psycho_oreosWas it at the time when you checked it was empty, the device was still booting up?04:37
psycho_oreosNot particularly sure, its something to do with text messages lol.04:38
psycho_oreosOr rather I guess its something to do with text messages :x04:38
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FIQ|n900sounds as a legit guess given "(...)sms"04:40
psycho_oreosI know there was some guy playing with things like that before, he was the one that got the cell info to work with cssu. I can't recall his handle anymore :/04:41
FIQ|n900psycho_oreos: I booted up, entered pin, (tried to) start MH and failing, immediately fire up the terminal and checked if the error was the usual, and then tried to do similar debugging steps as done last time when talking in here04:41
psycho_oreosApparently the stuff he was playing also started with ISI, so he might have a clue with ISI might stand for.04:41
FIQ|n900including setting PYTHONHOME (which didn't help at all), checking directories (which were empty) and then checking mounts with "mount"04:42
FIQ|n900and you know the rest04:42
psycho_oreosFIQ|n900, from between after entering the pin correctly to starting MH, how many seconds did you wait?04:42
FIQ|n900the device lags slightly at first when booted so I usually wait half a minute before doing anything04:43
FIQ|n900which was the case here too04:43
psycho_oreosYeah, I was thinking you didn't give the device anytime to finish loading up properly hence that could be the reason why its still loading hence failed. Then again without cpumem-applet its hard to rule that out.04:44
FIQ|n900I have that thing now04:45
FIQ|n900and if this happens again04:45
FIQ|n900(and given previous experience - it will)04:45
FIQ|n900I might try simply waiting04:45
FIQ|n900before doing stuff04:45
psycho_oreosHopefully it won't be just a coincidence with a simple "mount" command :) I'm just really not willing to rest it on pure random "luck" factor.04:46
FIQ|n900but my assumption was that mounts was taken care of way before hildon even starts up...04:46
psycho_oreosI'm not sure, the proper (normal) fs mounts are done well beforehand.. notably the binding mounts were done afterwards and even with python.04:46
psycho_oreosI just found the upstart script, it starts after loading rcS-late.04:50
FIQ|n900it says in /etc/fstab that it's generated by rc--late04:51
FIQ|n900fstab that is04:51
psycho_oreos /etc/event.d/rcS-late starts after hal is fully started. The contents shows that it mounts home dir.04:52
psycho_oreosCorrection, home, MyDocs and swap.04:53
psycho_oreosIn other words the script pymaemo-optify should have started quite early.04:54
psycho_oreosHmm, I think I recall the guy who tinkered with cell tower info.05:01
infobotpsycho_oreos meant: Hmm, I think I recalled the guy who tinkered with cell tower info.05:01
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DrCodehi all07:48
DrCodeis there feedly like in meamo?07:48
DrCodeI also looking for google+ client , any idea?07:48
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FIQjust  got the same issue again - this time I simply waited, issuing "df -h" every now andd then to see what happened and if it would fix itself09:44
FIQand indeed - after 2 minutes of waiting - python bindmounts was done09:44
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FIQand the cpumem-appled showed no significant load at all09:44
FIQthat's a pretty long wait IMO, but at least it does do its' job if you're patient09:45
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psycho_oreosYeah I usually wait around a minute or two after bootup before doing anything with my N900.09:52
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DrCodehi all11:30
DrCodeis there appliction like feedly?11:30
DrCodeI love to get update to my rss11:30
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DocScrutinizer05hey psycho_oreos FIQ12:32
psycho_oreoshi DocScrutinizer0512:33
DocScrutinizer05I now finally think I have a nice explanation12:33
psycho_oreosFor that python issue?12:33
DocScrutinizer05didn't you say you installed some huge map data or whatever, FIQ?12:33
FIQI installed what?12:33
FIQmap data.. I don't use ovi maps or any equavilent on maemo12:34
DocScrutinizer05dang, thought I had a story12:34
FIQ(there's 2 reasons to that actually, 1 I don't need it, 2 my GPS seems broken, possibly caused by me feeding my N900 once)12:34
DocScrutinizer05aaah wait, you rstored12:34
DocScrutinizer05also huge data written to ext312:35
FIQI restored the optfs yes, BUT12:35
* psycho_oreos is reminded he needs to redo up that entire world map data again, after 30+ times in fsck.ext3 rendered the majority of the map data corrupted.12:35
FIQthe issue existed before that as wel12:35
FIQjust that I never bothered to actually look into it12:35
FIQDocScrutinizer05: I'm still interested to hear your theory though12:36
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DocScrutinizer05anyway my story goes like this: ext3 is a journalling fs, and on mount the journal gets replayed, which can take ages depending on size. and all that won't show up in cpu-load-applet since kernel stuff12:37
FIQwould there be a solution to that?12:37
DocScrutinizer05sure, clean umounts12:38
FIQbut this issue, wouldn't it cause a significant delay at the initial mount but not otherwise?12:38
FIQi.e. the mount of the /opt partition, not the bindmounts12:38
DocScrutinizer05that's right I *guess*12:39
psycho_oreosBinding mounts doesn't really require replaying journal because binding mounts aren't real mounts imo.12:39
FIQbtw I wonder another thing regarding fsck12:39
FIQas you're aware, fsck completely messed up the partition earlier12:39
FIQand fsck blamed on a mounted partition12:40
FIQallthough this isn't *really* relevant atm, I wonder what caused it in first place12:40
FIQI wonder if this is due to the drive being a flash drive?12:40
FIQafaik things aren't written the order they're issued12:40
FIQand thus, fsck's actions would get messed up12:41
DocScrutinizer05on a less tired-flawed think a fsck on a mounted partition is *always* an idiotic thing to do, sorry for suggesting it12:42
FIQI didn't do that12:42
FIQas I said yesterday, I fsck-ed in the BM root terminal12:42
FIQand in this environment, mmcblk0p2 isn't mounted12:42
DocScrutinizer05that should work12:43
FIQ(or whatever the exact error message is)12:43
FIQI halted execution of the fsck once it said that, and verified it wasn't mounted12:43
FIQand indeed it wasn't12:44
DocScrutinizer05yes, I encountered similr problem years ago, something odd with this stuff12:44
DocScrutinizer05fsck has different sources to get info about mounted state. sometimes these sources get out of sync12:44
DocScrutinizer05e.g mount and /proc/mounts12:44
FIQbasically, what I asked was if the inconsistency was caused by the drive being a flash drive12:44
FIQas I assumed fsck did that assumption because things changed in unexpected ways12:45
DocScrutinizer05no, I think it's a falw in maemo or in fsck12:45
XATRIXHi, i still have the same problem :) I found that tech spec says the standby time should be within: 12.0 days (288 hours) , and talk time: 6.30 hours12:46
DocScrutinizer05might be related to kernel renaming /dev/mmcblk0 to mmcblk112:46
DocScrutinizer05and vice versa12:46
XATRIXAs long as i see, my handset lasts over 24 h. Mixed time, talk/standby. So the max standby time is over 2 days12:47
DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: *UP TO...*12:47
XATRIXHow can i check/improve my system12:47
FIQinteresting fact: earlier I had a corrupted FAT (MyDocs) - this issue was even worse to begin with, but fsck managed to solve all issues just fine - and yet it failed miserably on a much less corrupted FS (the fat partition had a lot of issues, optfs had 4 corrupted files and some index issue somewhere, as seen by fsck -nv before)12:47
DocScrutinizer05move closer to BTS12:47
DocScrutinizer05get your own BTS12:47
DocScrutinizer05don't allow any inbound anf for sure no outbound traffic12:48
DocScrutinizer05increst T3212 timer to insanely high values12:48
infobothmm... bts is Please check the Debian bug tracking system at before reporting bugs in  testing or sid -- it's more likely to help you than IRC users are.  If you don't find your issue please  consider reporting it.12:48
* infobot starts crying and hides from docscrutinizer05 in the darkest corner of the room. :(12:48
FIQbase station?12:48
DocScrutinizer05base transmitter station12:48
DocScrutinizer05also called cell tower12:49
FIQah transmitter was the 2nd word12:49
XATRIXYou really think that it is possible ?12:49
DocScrutinizer05at 27C3 and at chaos communication congress we had our very own BTS ;-D12:50
DocScrutinizer05thanks to Harald Welte, Zecke, and other guys of osmocom12:50
FIQis setting up a private bts even legal?12:51
DocScrutinizer05not without a permission12:51
FIQafaik, at least in my country, you need a permission from the operator12:51
psycho_oreosThere are possible tune up tips to maximise battery usage such as probably using the lowest setting for backlight, having the screen timeout (screen turns off) helps. Also don't have too many background tasks running. I'm not sure if autodisconnect is recommended still but that is a nifty thing to have when setup correctly.12:51
FIQto verify that the equipment wont have the opposite issue and make signal worse instead (for you, and others in close range)12:51
DocScrutinizer05yes, you definitely need a permission, dunno if from operatior or some institution12:51
psycho_oreosEven worse you could also abuse that BTS priviledge by doing MITM evesdropping ;)12:52
DocScrutinizer05we got a lab test permission for one channel for a small area for a week or two12:52
DocScrutinizer05was only a few 100 bucks12:52
FIQ"a week or two"12:53
FIQyeah that's nothing12:53
FIQ*"only a few 100 bucks"12:53
psycho_oreosI don't think its to just benefit them, the license to use certain bands are regulated by government or at least federal agencies.12:54
psycho_oreosThose licenses aren't cheap.12:54
DocScrutinizer05FIQ: I just tell you how those standby upper limits get evaluated by manufacturers12:55
DocScrutinizer05it's as fake as the L/100km (miles / gallon, for our imperial friends)12:56
DocScrutinizer05you never can reach that12:56
DocScrutinizer05and actually I'm talking to XATRIX12:57
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XATRIXI'm in the center of our capital :(12:58
DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: when your device sits idle, with no APN configured (GSM "offline"), and no WLAN, just listening to BTS for inbound calls, you still might encounter bad luck and your device is at the boundary line between two BTS of different local-area(-codes), and does a cell reselection every minute due to natural fluctuations in signal strength from both BTS13:00
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DrCodehi dockane_13:01
DrCodeDocScrutinizer05, what up13:01
DrCodeI am looking for feedly like in maemo13:01
DrCodeany idea?13:01
DocScrutinizer05and in center of a capital cell diameters are particularly small, often only a few 100m13:01
XATRIXBut why does it try to reassign the BTS station if there already is a good qual. link between ?13:01
DocScrutinizer05DrCode: sorry, nope13:02
infoboti guess pkg is
DrCodeand google+ ?13:02
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DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: google for GSM C1 C2 cell handover criterion13:03
XATRIX:( C1 and C2 is a sleep states of the CPU ?13:03
DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: it doesn't matter how good the signal is in absolute dB, it's just the question if neighbour cell is C1/2 dB better than serving cell13:04
DocScrutinizer05BTS will tell mobile about the C1/2 threshold13:05
XATRIXEven if this 'better' cell is from another provider ?13:05
DocScrutinizer05cell reselection / handover is not a simple thing13:05
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DrCodewhen I am in terminal or in xchat its very small, can I zoom it or somthing?13:05
DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: obviously not13:05
DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: that's called roaming then and happens only when zero own cells are available to mobile13:06
DocScrutinizer05DrCode: in xterm it's simple: use volume keys13:07
DocScrutinizer05in xchat you need to select huger font in settings13:07
DrCodewow , ok , thankyou13:08
DrCodeI have my mobile only 3 days and Its defiantly the best phone I had13:08
DocScrutinizer05yeah, n900 defiantly refuses to die13:09
XATRIXDocScrutinizer05: what device are you using ? :) != n900?13:10
DocScrutinizer05n900, what else13:10
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DocScrutinizer05I guess when I would switch to sth else before I used up my 6 working N900, some troll will pop up and beat me to death with a bag of chips and other smd components13:12
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DrCodeI am using Mail for exchange for work mail and Imap for gmail , I am using eminnig-ng to sync gmail clander13:15
DrCodebut I didn't found way to sync contact to gmail13:15
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DrCodeMFE have only one account13:15
DrCodealso is it possible to save my contact into SIM?13:15
DrCodeor better to leave it in gmail?13:16
DocScrutinizer05you only can import from SIM13:16
DrCodehow can I sync my contact to gmail?13:16
DrCodeI use Mail For Eschange to download all my contact to maemo13:16
DrCodethen I delete this account and connect to my work mail13:17
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DocScrutinizer05I don't think there are simple ways to sync to google contacts (and I'm kinda happy about that, since it increases the chances that my contact data will not be sold to google)13:20
DocScrutinizer05not by me but by others who think sharing my contact data to whatever rogue public free service was a good idea13:20
DrCodeU are right13:21
DrCodebut I will be able to export my contact if I need13:21
DocScrutinizer05particularly lovely mates make facebook and linkedin spam me with invitation mails13:22
Lava_Croftits uncalled for13:22
DrCodeI had problem also with youtube13:22
DrCodeall 3 appliction dosn't work any more with youtube13:22
DrCodeit load player and shutdown13:23
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-20 18:09:59] <DocScrutinizer05>  --- just works (with some stuttering in video but OK audio) --- in microB13:25
DocScrutinizer05ok, you won't want to watch real movies this way, particularly not via AV on big TV screen13:26
DocScrutinizer05fekkin HD videos in youtube don't even play nicely on my i513:27
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DrCodeDocScrutinizer05, do U use yappari?13:30
DrCodewhats up client13:30
DocScrutinizer05otoh I actually use N900 as VDR to playback DrHouse.mp4 to my TV13:30
DocScrutinizer05DrCode: nope, I don't think I know of a single usecase for that nonsense13:31
DrCodethankyou again13:31
DocScrutinizer05I don't use facehook or myChase or litter either13:31
DocScrutinizer05nd until recently I even refused to open litter html pages in my webbrowser since they usually resulted in a all blank page with a tiny blueish bird in one corner, after minutes of loading time13:33
DocScrutinizer05I can see how certain groups of people can make decent use of twitter (see the twitter revolution in arab coutries), but honestly I prefer hashtag-maemo(IRC) to hashtag-dunnowhat(twitter)13:36
DocScrutinizer05and AIUI that wattsap stuff is eeven a knock-off of a knowck-off13:38
DocScrutinizer05dang, keep the typos13:38
Lava_Croftyour browser must be broken if it takes minutes to load twitter13:40
DocScrutinizer05my browser is configured in a sane way13:41
Lava_Croftwhich is showcased by it needing minutes to load twitter, you were about to say13:41
DocScrutinizer05e.g disabled JS and Java and other plugins13:41
Lava_Crofta website that loads near instant even on my netbook13:41
Lava_Crofti enable JS on a per-site basis13:41
Lava_Croftoh, apple dev center was down because of an 'intruder'13:42
DocScrutinizer05and what makes you think I'd bear with using a broken browser?13:42
Lava_Croftyou use firefox13:43
DocScrutinizer05it works excellent with 99% of webpages - except those that abuse BS undefined features only available in one or two mainstream browsers13:43
DocScrutinizer05you use assumptions13:44
Lava_Croftthats because its fun to use assumptions13:44
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XATRIXFound a wifi Bleeding edge drivers applet for tray15:13
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XATRIXWill try to experiment, maybe if it completely disable kernel module15:14
XATRIXit will save some power15:14
XATRIXI know it's stupid, and will save 0.00009 W :)) but i will try to15:14
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DocScrutinizer05GRRR  6 processes alive, 8 zombified15:37
DocScrutinizer05actually 5/915:38
XATRIXzombies are undead processes15:42
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DocScrutinizer05XATRIX: nope it wont15:49
DocScrutinizer05stock maemo already does exactly this (unload wlan driver kernel module) since otherwise wlan chip will eat *way* more than 0.00009 W while scanning for APs all the time15:50
DocScrutinizer05bleeding edge drivers won't help anything there, rather they make things worse15:51
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XATRIXNo, i'm not going to use bleeding edge DRIVERS, i'm gonna use applet15:52
XATRIXTo unload kernel module from15:52
DocScrutinizer05congrats, it likely will mess up system level stuff doing exactly same15:53
infobotrumour has it, speedpatch is >>first i don't realy understand what does this patch do (that is why it is called miracle patch)<< [/quote original-author-of-speedpatch]15:54
DocScrutinizer05might also help ;-D15:54
infobothmm... jrtools is
DocScrutinizer05**DO NOT install speedpatch, batterypatch, or auto-disconnect _ever_!! All three do not uninstall and do not work.**15:57
DocScrutinizer05seems that applet is of category auto-disconnect, just it is not "auto"15:57
XATRIXWhy not ?15:58
XATRIXI never saw system utils unload wifi15:58
XATRIXnever ever!15:58
XATRIXIt simply constantly scans area for available wlans15:58
DocScrutinizer05well, then maybe because with PR1.2 they fixed rfkill15:59
DocScrutinizer05and BULLSHIT, see settings of internet connections, for scan period15:59
DocScrutinizer05if yours does constant scan for APs, then you already *did* mess up your system, by any such "patch"16:00
XATRIXOk, i have Auto-connect = WLAN , scanning interval = Never in "internet connections" section16:01
XATRIXBut if i open system tray app, and click connections, it always shows me available wlans16:01
DocScrutinizer05what do you think the Nokia devels means by "scanning interval = Never"?16:01
* DocScrutinizer05 headdesks16:01
DocScrutinizer05SURE it does, since you *asked* for it16:02
XATRIXI mean the scanning interval FOR WLANS i was previousely connected to16:02
XATRIXNo, you're talking about the auto-scan->autoconnect feature. And i'm talking about idle mode16:03
DocScrutinizer05define idle-mode please16:03
XATRIXIn idle mode it still shows me available networks in area i can connect to16:03
DocScrutinizer05SINCE YOU ASKEd FOR IT!!16:04
XATRIXOnly after i click it ?16:04
DocScrutinizer05Of COURSE it does a AP scan as soon as you open "networks"16:04
DocScrutinizer05what the heck else is it supposed to do??16:04
DocScrutinizer05tell you "sorry dude, you said >never scan for APs<, this function is not available!"??16:05
XATRIXI thought i always scans for available networks, and connects only when i click the needed one16:05
DocScrutinizer05you can see pretty easily from slow filling of list of available APs that this is a realtime scan initiated by you opening the selection list16:06
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DocScrutinizer05it's done ONLY when you open the list of available networks16:07
DocScrutinizer05when you set scan interval = never16:07
XATRIXSounds if it is...16:07
DocScrutinizer05the devels of this stuff not been that thick16:07
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DocScrutinizer05we actually had that problem of WLAN chip eating massive from battery on PR1.0. In Pr1.1 (iirc) it been fixed by unloading kernel driver as a workaround. Again iirc with PR1.2 the rfkill got fixed in driver, so kernel driver unload wasn't needed anymore. Maybe your applet is from PR1.0 times16:11
XATRIXDoes rfkill disable TX only or both ?16:12
DocScrutinizer05please don't use it, it will mess up the pretty flawlessly working WLAN handling done by ICD2 and relatives16:12
XATRIXIt sounds as a radiofrequencykill swich16:12
DocScrutinizer05rfkill is a API iirc, that allows power-mode handling of all radio stuff16:13
DocScrutinizer05google for rfkill16:13
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XATRIXBut wait16:21
XATRIXrfkill doesn't disable blutooth simultaneously with wif-fi16:22
XATRIXIt's separate16:22
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XATRIXAnd rfkill isn't connected to GSM16:22
DocScrutinizer05you don't want to bother about it16:23
DocScrutinizer05maemo does that for you16:23
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DocScrutinizer05possibly maemo's ancient kernel even does pre-rfkill generic powermode handling of rf-systems16:29
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DocScrutinizer05but it does *some* *working* handling anyway16:29
DocScrutinizer05since PR1.2 the latest16:30
DocScrutinizer05there are tablet-mode and airplane-mode apps for powerbutton-menu16:30
XATRIXI saw it16:31
XATRIXIt completely disables all the radio16:31
DocScrutinizer05while tablet-mode only shuts down GSM modem, airplane mode shuts down everything. For all other finegrained stuff like not constantly running WLAN chip in power-greedy AP scan mode, ISC2 is responsible16:31
DocScrutinizer05honestly, you don't want to waste your time and ruin your system config to try and improve what's already there in stock maemo. You can't get any better on it16:33
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DocScrutinizer05most definitely not by installing random applets16:34
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XATRIXThis thesis i can't argue with...16:36
DocScrutinizer05if you suffer from WLAN created battery drain then that's caused by too frequent AP scan during times where no WLAN is in vicinity that's suitable for associating to it. You may want to change interval to "never" in that case16:38
DocScrutinizer05interval of "5minutes" is known to somewhat drain battery under certain circumstances (not associated)16:39
DocScrutinizer05also those cyclic wlan scans are known to cause dropouts in BT audio listening - e.g while jogging and listening to mp316:40
DocScrutinizer05you can easily verify by comparing periodicity of dropouts with interval set for wlan scans in "internet settings"16:40
DocScrutinizer05no surprise since wlan and BT share same subsystem, via hardware coexistence interface16:41
jon_yDocScrutinizer05: does it try to scan even if you are not trying to connect?16:42
XATRIXYea, since today, i started to finally realize how it works here16:42
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Lava_Croftsomeone turn off the heating16:43
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DocScrutinizer05jon_y: see interval=<period> setting16:45
jon_yDocScrutinizer05: so it still does?16:46
Sicelowhere is that setting?16:46
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jon_yhow do I set it?16:46
DocScrutinizer05jon_y: unless you've set interval=never or auto-connect=never, maemo is an always-online system16:46
Sicelook :P16:46
jon_yyes, I never do auto connect16:46
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo: settings->internet16:47
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jon_yok, thanks16:48
DocScrutinizer05maemo(5) doesn't tear down internet connection as soon as "nobody is using it" - like e.g android does afaik. Rather it relies on powersaving mode (PSM) for WLAN, and on carrier side firewalling of inbound unsolicited packets spam for GPRS16:50
DocScrutinizer05a passive GPRS connection eats some 2mA16:50
DocScrutinizer05no use in shutting it down16:50
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DocScrutinizer05a idle WLAN connection on maximum (and working) PSM probably needs even less16:52
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DocScrutinizer05and that's btw one of the properties the hardcore maemo fans love most about this system: it's always ready to react on arbitrary inbound traffic, be it IRC, or IM, or any other service16:54
Lava_Croftits a PC, not a glorified phone16:55
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Sicelodoes android really tear idle connections down?16:55
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Lava_Croftiirc windows phone does16:55
DocScrutinizer05unlike most other mobile/embedded OS where you will see your IRC client go offline as soon as you lock the screen16:55
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Lava_Croftios doesnt go iffline, nor does android16:56
Siceloanyway, i know android is always generating traffic :P16:56
jon_yis it because it is telling google about your latests rendezvous? :)16:57
jon_yyfw when big borther's image get sold to the masses as a caring big brother rather than a scary telescreen telling you what to do16:58
DocScrutinizer05first iPhone concept been all about webservices, means *nothing* gets done locally, you always only connect to some central services via a glorified webbrowser16:58
jon_yremember to pick up your kids after your groceries!16:58
DocScrutinizer05then they noticed that this means your whole device stops working as soon as you lose connectivity16:58
Lava_Croftwhich are the mobile/os's that are part of your 'most mobile/embedded OS's"16:59
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jon_yI'm using a dumb phone while my N900 is put in coldstorage for preservation17:01
DocScrutinizer05we had a time of laughter and hilarity at openmoko and before, during that17:01
DocScrutinizer05since evry fool can see without any sight aid that this never will fly17:02
jon_ywell, can't get a phone here unless it had some huge huge backing from service providers17:02
jon_ylike Lumia, for awhile17:02
jon_yand then it's all Galaxy S17:02
jon_yand iphones17:03
Lava_Croftthey tried with lumias here, but people dont want windows in their pocket17:03
jon_ythere aren't any variety at all, they're all the same17:03
jon_ylooks like everyone is racing to be the same17:04
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jon_ythe thinest anorexic phone, the widest screen17:04
jon_ythey don't even fit in my pocket anymore17:04
Lava_Croftand if they do, bending over splits the screen17:04
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Lava_CroftN9 is still my favorite smartphone form factor17:05
jon_yyeah, I get weird looks at office when I take out my dumb phone17:05
Lava_Croftperfect size, shape and weight17:05
DocScrutinizer05((looks like everyone is racing to be the same)) that's how apple mesmerizes the industry, as paralleled by how they hypnotize their customers17:05
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Lava_Croftapple is a good brand17:05
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jon_yDocScrutinizer05: none of the manufacturers dare make something different17:05
Lava_Croftthey can sell manure as perfume17:05
jon_ycause status quo makes profit17:06
Lava_Croftthats not entire true tho17:06
Lava_Croftsamsung does try things17:06
Lava_Croftcurrently samsung, in relation to weirdo phone designs, took over Nokia's place17:06
Lava_Crofteven tho Nokia had much crazier designs17:06
jon_yI'm waiting for one with hard keyboard17:06
Lava_Croftthere's several droids which have that17:06
jon_yand not blackberry17:07
jon_yand not blackberry style keyboards that eat half the screen17:07
DocScrutinizer05Nokia once did a real step towards breaking new ground with their organizers, but when it came to N9 they got hynotized by "iPhone is THE BIBLE" as everybody else17:07
jon_yN9 is nice, the N950 was better17:07
infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: Nokia once did a real step towards breaking new ground with their communicators, but when it came to N9 they got hynotized by "iPhone is THE BIBLE" as everybody else17:07
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jon_ytoo bad the iphone happened17:08
DocScrutinizer05N9 is a phone17:09
Lava_Croftthe problem is not that iphone is the bible17:09
DocScrutinizer05that's it17:09
Lava_Croftthat problem is that people love iphones17:09
Lava_Croftand that iphone set a standard17:09
Lava_Croftnokia had to adapt17:09
DocScrutinizer05nobody *has to* adapt17:09
Lava_Croftthey do17:09
Lava_CroftNokia is not Apple17:09
Lava_CroftApple cant make the people adapt17:09
Lava_CroftNokia cant do that17:10
jon_yNokia was doing fine before they announced lumia17:10
Lava_CroftNokia can only adapt to the people17:10
Lava_Croftare you silly?17:10
jon_yyes, stocks still going up, until burning platform17:10
Lava_Croftthat doesnt mean its doing fine17:10
Lava_Croftnokia would sooner or later have ran into troubles with symbian and low-cost phones17:10
Lava_CroftElop just made it all worse17:11
jon_yproblem is that they dropped *everything*17:11
Lava_Croftthat was the real error17:11
DocScrutinizer05no, i just again question your generalizations, like "the people". that's for sure how all the market droids think, no matter if in Nokia or Samsung or Aplle or whatever. Though apple started to break *new* grounds17:11
jon_yno sales no profit, they forgot to sell anything17:11
DocScrutinizer05but they won't suck in me17:11
Lava_Croftthey dont have tpo17:11
Lava_Croftthey have no need for people clinging to dead HW or projects born dead17:11
Lava_Croftlike openmoko or n90017:11
Lava_Croftyou are not part of the target market17:12
DocScrutinizer05you are not defining target market, btw there are a multitude of markets17:12
Lava_Croftthe problem that people like us have, is that we very much overvalue the worth that people assign to their mobile17:12
Lava_Croftand most people dont give a shit about their mobile, its brand or its OS17:13
DocScrutinizer05it's just every hw making fool wnats to focus on the largest existing segment17:13
jon_yis why we never get cool stuff17:13
Lava_Croftjon_y: making devices costs money17:13
Lava_Croftso unless you are Jolla and you have some help, it will be rather hard to make a good product and sell it17:14
Lava_Croftask DocScrutinizer0517:14
jon_yyup, mass production or it ain't happening17:14
Lava_Croftfuture is looking better and better tho17:14
Lava_Croftbut things get into fashion and go out of fashion17:15
Lava_CroftHW keyboards and resistive touchscreens are among them17:15
DocScrutinizer05look, there seems to be a trend to have some ugly tatoo right above your ass. I'm not one of those who run to next tatoo studio to get one17:15
Lava_Crofteven tho I love both deeply17:15
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Lava_Croftmost people arent like that, DocScrutinizer0517:15
jon_yooh, are those caused by vampire novels?17:16
DocScrutinizer05and if 95% of idiots think they need a smartphone (and define "smartphone" as "looks like an iphone"), I won't be one of them17:16
Lava_Croftthey dont think they need a smartphone just by themselves17:16
Lava_Crofta need is created for them17:17
Lava_Croftso you have to lure them into thinking they need one17:17
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Lava_Croftmarketing is awesome17:17
DocScrutinizer05and I see a opportunity for really innovative players in the market to define and provide new trends, rather than running like sheep after what is newest trend defined by Apple17:17
Lava_Croftpeer pressure, as you described, is part of this17:17
Lava_CroftApple doesnt define trends17:17
Lava_Croftthat was with ipad release, which is years ago17:17
Lava_Croftthey havent defined any trend the last couple of years17:18
jon_yyeah, welcome to engineering consent 10117:18
jon_ymagazines tell you what to buy17:18
jon_yTV tells you what to want17:18
Lava_Croftif the people want to buy it, then they do17:18
Lava_Croftand they are correct17:18
Lava_Croftmagazines and TV only tell old people what to buy17:19
DocScrutinizer05it depends what you want to sell. Do you want to sall arbitrary crap as long as it gets you the maximum net income, or do you want to produce sth that you like and are convinced of17:19
Lava_Croft'arbitrary crap' is an opinion17:20
Lava_Croftso a bit hard to gauge17:20
jon_ymore like the internet is telling what is cool now17:20
jon_yfacebook et all17:20
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DocScrutinizer05no, it's a definition of a relationship of a manufacturer to his product17:20
Lava_Croftfacebook is for your parents17:20
Lava_Croftkids these days dont dig FB that much, since their parents post on there too17:21
jon_ywhatever $hippest_media_of_the_moment17:21
Lava_Croftsame with iphones17:21
Lava_Croftthey barely sell in NL, because only old people buy iphones17:21
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DocScrutinizer05so tell a zombie like me, what's hip with youngsters this morning (I almost said "today" until I realized that's a way too long timespan)17:22
jon_yI dunno, ask the youngsters17:23
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DocScrutinizer05Lava_Croft seems to know17:23
SAiF__go for galaxy.. my friends always do that..17:23
Lava_Croftits what the youngsters tell me17:23
Lava_Croftand what i see in their hands17:24
jon_yprobably Chinese news on the telly17:24
Lava_Croftno iphones, lots and i mean lots of Notes17:24
Lava_Croftapparently they dig that horrible half-TV samsung Note17:24
Lava_Crofti cant help it my nephew says he and his friends only use FB to make it look nice for the parents and school17:24
Lava_Croftand they use for example twitter and g+ instead of FB17:24
Lava_Croft(dont start telling me how G+ or Twitter isnt any better/different/whatever, because i dont give a shit)17:25
DocScrutinizer05not that any of that makes any difference to me17:25
jon_ykids on g+17:25
Lava_Croftwhy should it17:25
jon_yI must be way behind times17:25
Lava_Crofti only know google_ because it has my name and a + above my gmail inbox17:25
Lava_Crofter google+17:26
DocScrutinizer05jon_y: prolly. You forgot to get your new device of the day I guess17:26
Lava_CroftDocScrutinizer05 went into puberty mode17:26
jon_ycan't afford it :(17:26
Lava_Croftjust call it debt17:26
DocScrutinizer05Lava_Croft: you're again trying to insult me?17:27
jon_yhow is it these bourgeoisie are everywhere!!?17:28
jon_ytime for class revolution!17:28
DocScrutinizer05I can't help to think this fad must be linked to your nationality somehow17:28
jon_ywhat nationality does it imply?17:29
DocScrutinizer05netherlands or belgium. always in for a tacky insult based on nothing17:29
DocScrutinizer05at least based on heuristics17:29
DocScrutinizer05(this observation/notion about those two nationalities, that is)17:30
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jon_ythe stereotype I get about Belgium is that they can't decide if they are French or German :)17:31
jon_yNetherlands seem to be a blend of the whole continent, linguistically17:32
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Lava_Croft"blabla what is the daf today?" "blabla got your hip device of the day" "bla bla"17:37
Lava_Crofti call that puberty mode, wether you think its an insult is your call17:37
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DocScrutinizer05anyway it's pretty clear that Nokia ditched the concept of communicators, later NITs, in favor of another me-too-iPhoneish thing called N9.17:38
Lava_Croftthe plans were the for keyb devices too17:38
Lava_Croftand you cant deny that iphone design is the standard17:38
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Lava_Croftjust like nokia design was the standard before17:38
DocScrutinizer05I call your brain impaired, in the parsing / analytics section - your call if you feel insulted17:39
Lava_Crofti never feel insulted online17:39
DocScrutinizer05that's part of the problem17:39
Lava_Croftits perfectly sane to first release the mainstream full-touch device17:40
Lava_Croftinstead of the niche hw keyb device17:40
Lava_Croftbesdies, whole N9 history is mangled17:40
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Lava_Croftdowe even know what the plan was, before it changed like 3 times17:40
Lava_Croftand heat makes me type awful17:41
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jon_yeveryone was laughing when the lawyer failed to tell the iphone from the galaxy apart17:43
jon_yI didn't, because I really couldn't17:43
DocScrutinizer05I wouldn't even care to do17:43
Lava_Croftone thing people do know17:43
Lava_Croftwhat is a lumia and that they dont want it17:43
Lava_CroftMS should really not have gone with the Windows brand17:44
Lava_Croftits so tainted17:44
jon_ythey're stuck in their bubble wrapped reality17:45
Lava_Croftwell, their mobile OS really isnt that bad, compared to the others17:45
Lava_Croftthats why is a bit sad17:45
Lava_CroftWindows these days, both mobile and desktop, really isnt that bad17:45
jon_yLava_Croft: its just that nothing is happening there17:45
Lava_Croftbut its been so goddamn horrible in the past, that it just will keep haunting them17:45
Lava_Croftjon_y: yeah, MS is moving much too slow17:45
jon_ythe mobile side of things anyway17:45
Lava_Crofteven my younger brother, who has been wp user since the first devices, is not out of love:<17:46
jon_ythe Windows side is nice, the underlying layers anyway17:46
Lava_Crofthe got Oppo Find 517:46
Lava_Croftyes, the OS feels really good too17:46
ShadowJKthe new w8 on desktop is pretty hard to use for normal people17:46
Lava_Croftwell, yeah17:46
jon_ythe windows desktop is only good in the underlying layers17:46
jogawindows has the 'mall' feel to it I dislike17:46
Lava_CroftMS is very american, blunt17:46
ShadowJKrandom things popping up everywhere if you accidentally move pointer too close to things etc17:47
jon_ybut users don't care about underlying layers17:47
Lava_Croftyeah, i tried win8 but ditched it17:47
jon_yor anything technical17:47
Lava_Croftbut their mobile wintoons is rather nice17:47
Lava_Croftcertainly if you have a nexus7 and a lumia, the difference is funny17:47
jogaI set up win8 for my dad and in many parts it was a ridiculous heap of crap17:47
Lava_Croftbeast HW nexus7 still being sluggish17:47
Lava_Croftyeah, the metro shit must go on the desktop17:47
Lava_Croftit just doesnt work on any monitor made after 199217:48
jogathe UI decisions have been awful in parts17:48
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Lava_Croftwell, Win7 is great17:48
Lava_Croftstill windows, but meh17:48
Lava_Croftlinux is still linux too :)17:48
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DocScrutinizer05hi ShadowJK :-)17:49
jogaeven with all the faults of linux I still find it much more suitable for my use17:49
ShadowJKthe sad thing is, while Metro kinda works on an actual tablet, it gets ruined by stuff throwing you into desktop mode with impossinly small text and icons... and desktop mode on desktop is ruined by stuff throwing you into metro and its move-mouse-across-mousepad-five-times to do anything at all17:49
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Lava_Croftthats personal taste and character:)17:49
Lava_Crofti use both with pleasure17:49
jon_yShadowJK: yes, I used desktop mode on a tablet before17:49
jogaI admin windows boxes17:49
Lava_Croftwindows more, windows has the support for games:)17:50
jon_yone of the surface beta models17:50
jon_yfat fingers!!!!!17:50
jogait's pure horror in some stuff17:50
Lava_Croftlinux is pure horror in some stuff too17:50
jogaand very convenient in others, if you can't handle cli17:50
jon_yreally, the only thing holding me on windows is just games17:50
Lava_Croftthe places of the cancer differs, but it still cancer17:50
Lava_Croftlinux will 'win' in the end of course, because its powered by people17:50
jon_yand IE, for tax forms17:50
SAiF__me too jon_y17:50
Lava_Croftjon_y: yes17:50
jogafor tax forms?17:51
Lava_Crofttax forms are usually done inside shitty closed apps17:51
Lava_Croftwhich require probably win3217:51
Lava_Croftand compat mode on win7, right17:51
jon_yfilling in yearly tax forms on the gov website17:51
joganot so here17:51
DocScrutinizer05jon_y: ELSTER?17:51
Lava_Croftits web-based here too, now17:51
Lava_Croftbut those websites arent always built properly17:52
jon_yDocScrutinizer05: no idea what is that, it is web based, but it doesn't quite work in firefox17:52
DocScrutinizer05yes, sounds like ELSTER17:52
Lava_Croftsteam on linux is cute, but its still steamdrm and still crappy17:52
jon_ywhat is ELSTER?17:52
jogaat the uni I work for we have a service desk system that uses activex, fortunately we have competent enough people to clunk it workable on firefox too17:53
jon_ysteam DRM is still DRM, unfortunately17:53
DocScrutinizer05ELectronic (LSt)[tax] (ER)[acquisition]17:53
Lava_Croftjon_y: yes, its an annoying layer of crap17:53
DocScrutinizer05Electronische LohnSTeuer ERfassung17:53
Lava_Croftelectronic salary taxes?17:54
jon_yI think it was a mix of php and coldfusion17:54
mschlens_PHP and confusion? Yeah, that usually goes hand-in-hand.17:54
jon_y.cfg, whatever it is17:55
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DocScrutinizer05the fun detail in ELSTER: you're basically urged to get a windows PC to declare your taxes. Alternatives not supported, and even handing in good old paper forms isn't generally allowable anymore17:58
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DocScrutinizer05I won't start bitching about the missing linux support (or even general platform independance) - just remarking that all the Mac guys feel pretty pissed17:59
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mschlens_DocScrutinizer05: Hey, you gotta remember, it's all #neuland18:02
teotwakiDocScrutinizer05: I have to admit, taxes are pretty painless in France.18:02
teotwakiI mean, the process to pay your taxes is painless. The actual amounts, however, are about as painful as shoving a fistful of rusted nails up your bum.18:03
mschlens_I almost wanted to object18:03
teotwakiBut you can do it via Windows, Linux and Mac, iOS or Android.18:04
teotwakiYou get this nice letter, with a QRCode on it, which allows you to access your file on your phone easily.18:04
DocScrutinizer05teotwaki: sure. I bet you had no govenrment working group doing that software18:05
teotwakiIn my case, I had to declare a few extra things due to overseas funds and stuff, but even then, I just moved to one of the computers, logged in again, declared whatever I had to declare, and setup a monthly invoice.18:05
teotwaki(the overseas bits weren't supported on the mobile version, but my girlfriend did her declaration 100% on the phone)18:06
DocScrutinizer05yeah, while here they do artistic tricks like the literal circus clown around SSL certs and PKI, to make sure nobody will forge your tax declaration18:08
DocScrutinizer05and of course use activeX or whatever the shit is called, to do that18:08
teotwakihehe, not here :)18:08
teotwakiAFAICT, they use your SSL session key to sign the document, no ActiveX or whatever needed.18:09
DocScrutinizer05a brainfart18:09
teotwakiProbably not as secure as the consultants would want them to believe18:09
teotwakiBut as long as there's no fuckups like the one that happened in Sweden, where everyone who logged in accessed one poor dude's account.18:10
teotwakiYou didn't hear about that one?18:10
teotwakiNorway, not Sweden, my bad18:11
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teotwaki" Logging in is fairly simple: you type in your social security number and a personal password, and you receive a pin-code that you need to type in."18:12
teotwaki"At 6:17 PM local time, every single user who tried to log in went right past the login screen, and found themselves logged in as Kenneth, a 36 year old man from Oslo."18:12
teotwaki"Users then had access to all financial data of this unfortunate person over two years back in time, in addition to the financial information of his wife and the company he worked for. Altinn shut down some 15 minutes later"18:12
SAiF__poor fellow18:13
teotwakiAnyway, my take on it is: You pay a lot of taxes in France, but at least the service is well-thought and accessible.18:14
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DocScrutinizer05teotwaki: HAHAHA
* DocScrutinizer05 ponders restarting apache on www18:26
* DocScrutinizer05 ponders restarting apache on www by a cronjob18:26
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SAiF__that link only showed me some ads.. dont care..18:27
DocScrutinizer05while pushing up the timeout from 30 to 101s significantly reduced number of frozen apache2 processes per day, it still didn't solve the issue of freezing processes18:28
DocScrutinizer05SAiF__: strange18:28
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DocScrutinizer05>> the "server" caching Kenneth's data, was actually the F5 BigIP load balancer (). I'm no fan of Accenture, the distinguished vendor behind the unscalable Altinn-behemoth, but let's give "credit", where "credit" is due - this was a case of the BigIP-boxes performing "queue management" .... <<18:29
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DocScrutinizer05root@www1:~# grep "invoked oom-killer" /var/log/messages21:03
DocScrutinizer05Jul 22 03:25:49 www1 kernel: [1685908.848475] php invoked oom-killer: gfp_mask=0x200da, order=0, oom_adj=0, oom_score_adj=021:04
DocScrutinizer05Jul 22 03:32:16 www1 kernel: [1686295.078488] ntpd invoked oom-killer: gfp_mask=0x201da, order=0, oom_adj=0, oom_score_adj=021:04
DocScrutinizer05Jul 22 03:37:52 www1 kernel: [1686630.908536] apache2 invoked oom-killer: gfp_mask=0x201da, order=0, oom_adj=0, oom_score_adj=021:04
DocScrutinizer05Jul 22 03:44:07 www1 kernel: [1687006.843927] apache2 invoked oom-killer: gfp_mask=0x201da, order=0, oom_adj=0, oom_score_adj=021:04
DocScrutinizer05oops ECHAN21:04
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DocScrutinizer05but this is for here:21:06
DocScrutinizer05  PID USER      PRI  NI  VIRT   RES   SHR S CPU% MEM%   TIME+  START Command21:06
DocScrutinizer05 5946 www-data   20   0 1974M 1712M 20032 R 46.0 29.0 14:09.81 17:12 /usr/sbin/apache2 -k start21:06
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DocScrutinizer05and this for matters of "MAINTAINERS URGENTLY WANTED!":21:40
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-22 20:35:14] <DocScrutinizer05> compare [2013-07-22 17:35:06] <DocScrutinizer05> #log: did no restart but a  >#  kill -9 9417 10366 10970 14664 14664 19857 23836 24837 26642 3055221:40
DocScrutinizer05[2013-07-22 20:35:45] <DocScrutinizer05> and
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Sicelointeresting.. my gps doesn't work today even with agps enabled, and using
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Siceloa valid sim is on and registered on the network22:30
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Sicelohmm, is the wifi perhaps blocking some traffic? :-/22:33
* Sicelo switches to 3G22:33
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SiceloLocation test gui says 10 sats available, not associated with any22:36
DocScrutinizer05visible means nuttin22:40
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DocScrutinizer05it's just the rsult of the almanac equation which sats should be above horizon22:41
Siceloi have clear sky as well btw22:41
DocScrutinizer05is your date/time correct?22:41
Siceloyes, i update my time via ntpdate22:41
DocScrutinizer05and you have a working connection to internet?22:42
Siceloyes, am actually writing this from N900 itself22:42
DocScrutinizer05hmm, did you roam recently?22:42
DocScrutinizer05or swapped SIM?22:42
Sicelonop. none of those22:43
DocScrutinizer05start "location test "22:43
DocScrutinizer05ooh, you did already22:44
DocScrutinizer05what does location test say about your current location as estimated?22:44
Siceloi'm going to paste 4 lines of syslog now..22:44
SiceloJul 22 21:43:28 fremantle location-proxy[1225]: GLIB DEBUG default - Socket to opened, fd=10, verify_res=022:45
SiceloJul 22 21:43:31 fremantle location-proxy[1225]: GLIB WARNING ** default - ssl_read_data: SSL_ERROR=5, ret=0, errno: Success22:45
SiceloJul 22 21:43:31 fremantle location-proxy[1225]: GLIB WARNING ** default - error:00000000:lib(0):func(0):reason(0)22:45
SiceloJul 22 21:43:31 fremantle location-proxy[1225]: GLIB WARNING ** default - Couldn't close socket: 1022:45
DocScrutinizer05hmm, sounds like a cert issue22:45
Siceloyes :-/22:46
DocScrutinizer05you should try to disable A in GPS settings22:46
DocScrutinizer05or switch to not working22:46
Siceloi thought doesn't work at all22:47
Siceloany other free one? i remember someone mentioned a few some days ago..22:47
DocScrutinizer05it seems there are not many free ones22:47
PaliI do not know about any other free supl server22:48
Sicelook.. let me see if relying on plain gps helps22:48
Palinow tested and it not working too :-(22:49
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nox-hm i just ran gpsrecorder and it set the clock for me...22:49
nox-and i never changed the supl server so i guess it's still using nokia's22:50
PaliI'm getting: "SUPL protocol error -3" or "SUPL protocol error -6" from via ./supl-client22:50
Sicelonox-: maybe your N900 had a recent fix.. and therefore easy for it to 'sync' whatever22:50
SiceloPali: where do you see that22:50
PaliSicelo: in program supl-client22:50
nox-Sicelo, hm ok i set the clock before here...22:50
nox-i mean ran gpsrecorder to do it :)22:51
SiceloPali: available on stock?22:51
PaliSicelo: no22:51
Palithis is only one supl client which I found and is FOOS22:51
Palino deb22:51
PaliI'm running it at desktop22:52
Siceloanyway, finally got a fix without AGPS22:52
ecc3gi was wondering why getting a fix was taking forever yesterday :(22:52
Sicelohmm, so we're getting screwed day by day.. soon we'll only rely on pure gps fix ..22:53
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ecc3ggoogle will only let android supl in?22:56
Sicelobtw, does still work for symbian phones?22:57
ecc3gi'll have to try it... but I have to move my sim card back...22:57
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DocScrutinizer05you know that A is also available via GSM/UMTS ?23:05
infobotrrlp is, like, the Radio Resource LCS (Location Service) Protocol as specified first in GSM TS 04.31, or
Siceloyes DocScrutinizer05. that's whhy i always make sure i have a correctly-registered sim on N900 if i want to use gps23:06
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Sicelowhich language/region combination on N900 uses yyyy-mm-dd format for date?23:13
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DocScrutinizer05$LC_TIME = de_DE23:24
Sicelomine is on en_US23:25
DocScrutinizer05but I guess I still did some other patches to get yyyy-mm-dd23:26
DocScrutinizer05and actually I see this format in ls -l but of course not in a plain date23:28
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DocScrutinizer05sorry, this stuff doesn't act like I thought it should. Not at all23:35
Siceloyeah. thanks for the effort thoguh :)23:36
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