IRC log of #maemo for Saturday, 2013-06-15

sixwheeledbeastAnother full sized USB mod
* sixwheeledbeast starts to mumble about mating cycles00:03
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sixwheeledbeastAt least it's a tidier job than the last one I saw on TMO00:05
sixwheeledbeastIIRC hotglue everywhere.. :cry:00:05
DocScrutinizer05>>So yes the solar panel mod will only became usefull in case of a plane crash in a deserted island<< could have told him, simple math is all it needs00:14
DocScrutinizer05sunlight = 1000W/m^200:15
DocScrutinizer05area of N900: 0.1*0.05m00:16
DocScrutinizer05*5% efficiency00:16
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DocScrutinizer05= 250mW00:17
DocScrutinizer05250/5 = 50mA charging current equivalent00:17
DocScrutinizer05not exactly a fastcharger00:17
kerioalso, you're leaving your n900 in the sun00:24
infobotmethinks hostmode-powered is
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DocScrutinizer05I#m amazed the guy didn't build in some LAZORS and SHARKS00:34
infobotextra, extra, read all about it, mthel is
DocScrutinizer05he now doesn't need an adapter ideally the size of my thumb max, but he killed one of the stereo channels for that, of a device that's already not exactly known for extreme sound volume. So I wonder what he needs to carry with him instead of the adapter now00:36
DocScrutinizer05~factinfo mthel00:36
kerioclearly, a usb sound card00:36
infobotmthel -- created by DocScrutinizer05 <~HaleBopp@openmoko/engineers/joerg> at Fri Oct 12 21:02:44 2012 (245 days); it has been requested once, last by kerio, 19s ago.00:36
DocScrutinizer05meh, forget that, as infobot does as well, on every boot00:39
DocScrutinizer05actually I think she needs a ~save to memorize it00:40
DocScrutinizer05probably a graceful shutdown does a ~save, but then how often does bot gracefully shutdown00:41
infobotmthel is, like,
DocScrutinizer05~factinfo mthel00:41
infobotmthel -- created by DocScrutinizer05 <~HaleBopp@openmoko/engineers/joerg> at Fri Oct 12 21:02:44 2012 (245 days); it has been requested 2 times, last by DocScrutinizer05, 11s ago.00:41
DocScrutinizer05watch for next bot restart (infobot joining chan) and then check ~factinfo mthel00:42
DocScrutinizer05but maybe it's not the bot but mysql that forgets it00:43
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DocScrutinizer05I dunno if mysql gets a restart too when bot restarts00:43
DocScrutinizer05~factinfo joerg00:44
infobotjoerg -- created by jOERG <> at Thu Oct 23 12:00:02 2008 (1695 days); last modified at Fri May 31 01:09:31 2013 by DocScrutinizer05!~HaleBopp@openmoko/engineers/joerg; it has been requested 52 times, last by DocScrutinizer05, 1d 14h 41m 8s ago; it has been locked by jOERG.00:44
DocScrutinizer05I guess I called that more often since creation00:44
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DocScrutinizer05~factinfo flashing00:44
infobotflashing -- created by GeneralAntilles <n=GeneralA@pdpc/supporter/active/generalantilles> at Tue Jul  1 17:47:33 2008 (1809 days); last modified at Wed Jul 27 15:20:19 2011 by DocScrutinizer!~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg; it has been requested 667 times, last by merlin1991, 1d 3h 39m 28s ago.00:44
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merlin1991DocScrutinizer05: re repo repository-qp is still not doing it's job, so it was a sideeffect from me doing stuff00:52
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DocScrutinizer05which is extremely strange00:55
DocScrutinizer05since I dunno what exactly you did, but aiui it shouldn't have any impact on autobuilder queue?00:56
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merlin1991autobuilder queue is yet another beast00:56
merlin1991it goest autobuilderquue -> incoming folder -> cornjobs -> repository-qp00:57
merlin1991and the last bit isn't running00:57
DocScrutinizer05so you ran qp manually?00:57
merlin1991I ran one part of it, the sync to repo bit00:58
merlin1991the other half is the delete/promote/demote queue00:58
merlin1991(which is the stuck bit)00:58
DocScrutinizer05but you wouldn't touch extras-devel repo by that, no?00:58
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merlin1991the sync to repo bit takes stuff from the cronjobs and puts it into the fitting repos, devel and the cssu repost00:59
DocScrutinizer05what a mess00:59
DocScrutinizer05ok, then yeah, I see how you caused it00:59
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DocScrutinizer05hmm, that's been just as expected now the comments on "my modified n900 " getting more bizarre with each new post01:03
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sixwheeledbeastnight #maemo o/01:09
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sixwheeledbeastoh BTW merlin1991: Pali and I have updated the Testing changelog page :)01:11
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GeneralAntillesUgh, I hate writing emails on smartphones.01:15
GeneralAntillesDamn autocorrect.01:15
merlin1991sixwheeledbeast: I had the complete changelog finished, but then a windows update kicked in and rebooted my pc even though I've set it to always ask :/01:15
merlin1991at that point I decided I'll do it another day :D01:16
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DocScrutinizer05GeneralAntilles: \o/01:26
DocScrutinizer05GeneralAntilles: damn html mail01:26
DocScrutinizer05GeneralAntilles: what's been jaffa's mailß blegblegbleg at what?01:27
DocScrutinizer05merlin1991: awesome01:27
DocScrutinizer05ugh, smartphone01:28
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DocScrutinizer05wow, jaffa!!! I can't believe it01:40
DocScrutinizer05now if eventually javispedro would drop by to say hello, I'd start to think sth beamed me back in time to the nice times 4 years back01:41
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infobotDocScrutinizer: infobot joined!01:52
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Win7Macdo nominations have to be accepted _in nomination period_ or in contemplation period?01:53
DocScrutinizer05of course in nomination period01:53
Win7MacOMG... my list ;)01:54
Win7Macno need for it happily01:54
GeneralAntilles6 or 7 for 5-man?01:58
GeneralAntillesWin7Mac, go nominate.01:59
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GeneralAntillesWriting up a nomination for sjgadsby.01:59
Win7MacMy nominations-mail "Is being held until the list moderator can review it for approval." anybody can do that?02:00
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freemangordonare there enough candidates for BoD elections to be held?02:06
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freemangordonphew :)02:09
freemangordonoh, no more 2 councils, good02:10
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: please post your *original* mail to tmo as well02:12
DocScrutinizer05to the thread where the candidates introduce themselves02:13
Win7MacI will. who is list moderator?02:13
DocScrutinizer05we have none I'm afraid02:13
Win7Macwell, then who can approve my mail?02:15
DocScrutinizer05you probably should register to maemo-community ML02:17
DocScrutinizer05then resend it02:17
DocScrutinizer05so far I have no clue who and how would approve ML mails02:18
Win7MacI am registered02:18
ashleyadministrative interface is at and it says that "maemo-community list run by listadmin at" though the listadmin actually links to maemo-community-admin e-mail address...someone with access either to the box running lists and/or the mentioned e-mail address could probably approve the messages, I guess02:23
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DocScrutinizer05  GeneralAntillesincredible, now you opened your trick box eh?02:37
DocScrutinizer05ashley: many thanks02:38
DocScrutinizer05I can set up according aliases now02:38
ashleyyw :-)02:38
GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer05, I bet sjgadsby is going to studiously ignore me until well after the deadline. ;)02:39
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GeneralAntillesI've done this to him before.02:39
GeneralAntillesThrough some trick of insane Talk voters he managed to never get elected to the community council.02:40
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DocScrutinizer05damn, I thought he did at least 2 terms in council02:42
GeneralAntillesHe might as well have02:45
GeneralAntillesBut, no, voters suck.02:45
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DocScrutinizer05another 12 minutes, right?02:48
rikaneeGeneralAntilles: what was the turnout for the latest election?02:49
DocScrutinizer05which one?02:49
DocScrutinizer05 of those?02:49
GeneralAntillesWin7Mac, put the text of your email on the thread.02:53
Win7Macits the main content02:53
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Win7Macok now?02:58
GeneralAntillesI see it.02:59
* GeneralAntilles posts to mwkn02:59
Win7Macis it samwatt valid?03:00
GeneralAntillesI'd call it valid.03:00
DocScrutinizer05we need garage and tmo account name of all you guys, to verify your karma and account age03:00
GeneralAntillesModeration queues are still timestamped.03:00
GeneralAntillesGuess no sjgadsby.03:00
GeneralAntillesStill made 6, though.03:01
DocScrutinizer05but jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/ and jaffa \o/ and GA \o/03:01
DocScrutinizer05pending karma verification03:02
rikaneemmm, just saw the announce on TMO03:07
Win7Macoh... c'mon...03:07
rikaneegrats DocScrutinizer0503:07
rikaneeDocScrutinizer05: for getting into M/HFC, of course!03:08
DocScrutinizer05been about time ;-D03:09
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DocScrutinizer05seems we might actually have SIX (6) valid eligible candidates for BoD03:11
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DocScrutinizer05ok, fw190: account age and karma verified, Win7Mac: account age and karma verified03:23
DocScrutinizer05for the other 4 we don't need to verify anything03:24
GeneralAntillesGogo 5-man board.03:24
DocScrutinizer05...since they all already had positions that required sufficient karma03:25
DocScrutinizer05this is an official statement03:25
DocScrutinizer05we have 6 valid candidates03:26
DocScrutinizer05chem|st, fw190, GeneralAntilles, jaffa, Win7Mac, Woody1461903:27
DocScrutinizer05now we need to make BIG NOISE about the vote03:29
DocScrutinizer05so a few community members even notice03:29
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Win7Macoh... let me have a look ;)03:30
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Win7Macin some minutes03:31
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DocScrutinizer05~341**0.5 + 8 * 232**0.503:37
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Win7MacDocS, noisy enough?
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DocScrutinizer05waaaay too small ;-)04:18
DocScrutinizer05but ok, i guess we can use it (though I hardly can read it with this transparent background)04:19
Win7Macjeez, dl and look04:19
Win7Macyou wanted direct links04:20
DocScrutinizer05actually the browser did download it and dispayed it04:21
DocScrutinizer05watching it in gwenview, same result, background gray checkered04:21
Win7Macstart gettin' on my nerves already...?! ;-)04:21
Win7Macsame same as nominations04:22
DocScrutinizer05watching in showphotos: finegrained gray checkered with gray text on it04:23
Win7Macchech win photoviewer ;)04:23
DocScrutinizer05trying gimp(!=)04:23
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DocScrutinizer05same checkered background. I start to wonder if that's actually how it looks04:24
Win7Macput a white BG in gimp then04:25
DocScrutinizer05meh, sorry. No time for that right now04:25
Win7Macdude you serious? - same as nomin.banner... :?04:26
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Win7Macextrabrightwhite: ;-)04:29
GeneralAntillesGood day, today, folks.04:33
* GeneralAntilles celebrates himself, briefly.04:33
Win7Mackind of feel the same. hope fully thursday 10 Eastern will be a good time.04:35
Win7MacI'm somewhat suspicious that rob didn't nominate and adumbrates stepping down are alike04:42
GeneralAntillesGuess we'll see.04:44
Win7Macyeah, as always04:44
DocScrutinizer05know what? I don't care what's written on this thing, and I don't care if I can read it or not. I will upload it and replace the current one with this new one04:53
DocScrutinizer05ooh, the second one is nice, on this blank page of browser04:54
DocScrutinizer05I nevertheless will use first one, since I seem to recall the other one looked the same04:54
Win7Macactually, i didn't read your msg at [03:19], all good04:55
Win7Macyeah 1st one is great ;)04:56
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DocScrutinizer05is it? I think it could be more... aggressive05:07
DocScrutinizer05like 50% larger, and alarm red05:07
DocScrutinizer05or flashing!!05:08
Win7Macneed to ask someone like dave999 for flashing gifs or so05:09
DocScrutinizer05I think this one might go unnoticed05:11
DocScrutinizer05it's just too good style in style05:11
DocScrutinizer05while those two "?" in their huge circles stare at me like a pair of evil eyes05:12
DocScrutinizer05am I dreaming or did we have real pictures for "hot2 and "fresh", a few days ago for a short moment?05:13
Win7Macwill add "vote now" stamp for election period, need some sleep, good night. :happy to serve:05:14
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sixwheeledbeastWhy do important thinks appear to happen when I am asleep :)09:51
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joshueHello. I have a Nokia N900 phone. How do you turn it on? I've owned it for two years, and I still can't figure that out. If I hold the button for less than a couple of seconds, it shows a splashscreen10:12
joshueand doesn't boot. If I press it for more than a minute, it shows some strange images and still doesn't boot10:12
joshueI usually get it right on the third-fourth try, but I am still not sure what I have done exactly to achieve booting10:13
jogayou should hold the powerbutton until the led lights up white and it vibrates once10:14
joshueAh. Thanks.10:14
joshueThat explains it.10:14
jogahowever, if the battery is empty and you have the charger plugged in, it may not work as you'd expect10:14
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joshueWhat happens then?10:15
jogaif the battery doesn't have enough power it seems to stick to recharging state no matter if you press the power button or not, it just falls back somehow, I'm not familiar with the details of that, but if I've run out of battery I charge it for a few minutes, then unplug the charger, turn it on, enter pin etc and plug it back in after that10:17
joshueI see. Thank you very much :)10:18
jogaif it can't get to security code / pin queries it needs more charging10:18
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sixwheeledbeastAnother happy customer, eh?10:24
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Lava_CroftDT-33 can be a lifesaver for N900 users10:27
ShadowJKIs pretty good on N900 as long as the battery isn't totally worn out10:31
ShadowJKplug in wait awhile, press powerbutton10:31
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_rdCan anybody tell how I get the > character with rescueOS?10:34
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chem|stDocScrutinizer05: yeah lets make some noiZe11:27
sixwheeledbeastBest TMO post I have seen in a while
freemangordonchem|st: now you're here... What do you plan for CSSU-T?11:29
freemangordonCSSU-S that is11:29
freemangordonchem|st: I hope you;re aware if the issue with gmail11:29
* freemangordon *yawn* too11:30
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chem|stfreemangordon: wrong channel11:31
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eddybso I grabbed the EMMC FIASCO image to flash, I extracted it with 0xFFFF, then I took a look at the resulting image, and it has a msdos header thingie (including 55 AA), but no partition table :(14:08
keriofor what?14:13
keriorootfs, homefs or mydocs?14:13
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Sicelobtw, freemangordon.. the gmail fix can be installed on cssu-S?14:54
* Sicelo has only recently noticed it (because he uses mutt most of the time)14:55
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DocScrutinizer05eddyb: see15:13
infoboti guess jrtools is
DocScrutinizer05eddyb: you wouldn't want to download and flash a 32GB physical device image15:14
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DocScrutinizer05eddyb: so the VANILLA is not an image but rather a job15:17
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sixwheeledbeastDocScrutinizer05: nice post ;)15:24
sixwheeledbeastwell until merlin kicks the builder box again I can sleep or better still get back to watching the GP QP.15:27
DocScrutinizer05GP QP?15:27
sixwheeledbeastMotoGP Qualifying :)15:28
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DocScrutinizer05aaah :-)15:29
DocScrutinizer05you by any chance got a link to unification tmo thread?15:29
DocScrutinizer05nm found it
DocScrutinizer05:-D thanks :-)15:31
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sixwheeledbeastsnap ... again15:31
sixwheeledbeastsearched for "align" ;)15:32
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eddybDocScrutinizer05: sorry, I was napping. so I read the .layout file, however I don't see enough info to get a complete EMMC out of the 250MB image15:38
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Siceloeddyb: the emmc is mostly yours anyway.. system takes up only asmall portion.15:40
DocScrutinizer05eddyb: what would be missing? fdisk and mkfs probably only need a few hundred bytes input to create arbitrary number of arbitrarily sized partitions on any device15:41
eddybDocScrutinizer05: mapping between the 250MB file and the EMMC15:41
DocScrutinizer05which btw is the reason why you need a semi-functional rootfs to flash eMMC15:42
DocScrutinizer05what mapping?15:42
eddybthere's a 250MB file and a .layout file15:43
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eddybthe .layout may be used to create the empty partitions. but there's no info on how/what to copy from the 250MB and how/where to put it in the EMMC15:44
eddyb*250MB file15:44
DocScrutinizer05sfdisk <partitoninginfo.txt && makfs.vfat /dev/mmc1p0 && tar -x thearchive.tgz15:44
DocScrutinizer05sure, what else?15:45
eddybthere's a 250MB image mmc_RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA that has a msdos header15:45
DocScrutinizer05it has? omg15:45
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DocScrutinizer05are you sure that hader not been created by 0xffff to provide a proper file to loopmount?15:46
DocScrutinizer05header even15:46
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DocScrutinizer05this *is* *not* image15:46
eddyb0xffff is a flasher, so I don't see why it would do that :S15:46
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DocScrutinizer050xffff is an interface to NOLO resp to a software in maemo rootfs to create and populate eMMC15:47
DocScrutinizer05that's what I tried to explain to you above15:47
DocScrutinizer05NOLO is a flasher15:48
DocScrutinizer05in the way it actually writes stuff to NAND15:48
eddybI mean it's a tool used to flash, I just told it to extract a FIASCO image...15:49
DocScrutinizer050xffff and flasher-3.5 are just frontends talking to NOLO15:49
eddybso it's supposed to be a .layout and a .tgz?15:49
eddybis there anything in the vanilla homefs?15:50
eddybsomeone else used that name. I mean the /home partition15:51
DocScrutinizer05well, I dunno for sure if they copy $HOME content from the vanilla or they use the template that's on rootfs anyway15:51
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eddybif there isn't, can I just create a new clean ext3 partition for /home over the bootmenu usb interface for emmc (without touching the partition table) and then flash combined?15:52
DocScrutinizer05there's an option "reset to factory settings" OWTTE in settings menu, and it basically copies a template/skeletton from NAND rootfs to $HOME15:53
eddybyeah, but my /home is corrupted. like, the entire partition. CSSU-T having a 2008 fsck didn't help :P15:54
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DocScrutinizer05so what you're planning to do?15:54
Sicelomount it on pc then, and use recent fsck?15:54
DocScrutinizer05via flasher-3.5 you can't do anything special, you just can start the software tools on your rootfs that do the eMMC partitioning and populating for you15:55
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo: that's a good alternative, when the system has a means to mount /home via USB15:56
eddybbootmenu lets me access the raw emmc over USB15:56
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DocScrutinizer05this way many users succeeded in running PC fsck against their /home15:57
eddybI already dd the home partition and loop-mounted a copy of the copy (paranoid now) - some of the files are still there, some of the files are in lost+found15:57
DocScrutinizer05SOL then15:58
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eddyb(not sure if it's my PC fsck that did that or the broken maemo one. I have to mount the original copy again as read-only to find out)15:58
DocScrutinizer05then after restoring a working system incl /home, you can restore the existing files from your PC to N90015:59
eddybDocScrutinizer05: but I don't want to copy the 20GB of everything I have in MyDocs (potentially more than one time)...15:59
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DocScrutinizer05or rather, you should reflash and then restore from your BM backup you for sure must have since you're on CSU aiui16:00
eddybso I want to touch only the /home partition instead of flashing the entire vanilla16:00
DocScrutinizer05well, that's rather tricky16:00
eddybthe only thing I can restore is the config files that didn't end up in lost+found16:00
eddybDocScrutinizer05: if I had another N900, I would just flash vanilla on that and dd the entire partition from there16:01
eddybI just need to know what happens to /home when I flash vanilla, and it's not tricky anymore16:01
DocScrutinizer05mount the whole thing via USB, check partitioning if it's still OK, then mkfs.ext3 on USB-mounted /home partition and try "reset to factory"16:01
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DocScrutinizer05as mentioned above I'm not entirely sure what happens to /home on flashing VANILLA, my suspicion would be they copy the skeletton from /etc/$whatever over to /home and /home/user16:03
DocScrutinizer05but the problem is you lost /home/opt so you need to flash COMBINED anyway16:03
eddybI heard that happens when you first boot16:03
eddybsetting up /home and everything16:03
DocScrutinizer05quite psiible16:04
eddyb so I see how that goes16:04
DocScrutinizer05actually I heard every boot should recreate the needed structure in /home and /home/user/* when it got deleted16:05
DocScrutinizer05I guess it won't pan out though16:05
DocScrutinizer05what's absolutely clear is that optification creates /home/opt on first boot after flashing COMBINED aka rootfs16:06
DocScrutinizer05but that doesn't help you either16:06
DocScrutinizer05OTOH when /home got corrupted, odds are /home/user/MyDocs vfat partition got corrupted as well16:07
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DocScrutinizer05so you need to create a backup of whatever you still can get from your mass storage vfat partition, anyway16:08
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eddybI wanted to say, I'll backup anything in MyDocs that I don't already have a copy of somewhere else16:10
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eddybbut I updated CSSU-T (I know, I know, I'm a dumbass for disregarding the "you should backup" message), it rebooted as usual. then a few hours later, when I was using maybe too much RAM and CPU, it restarted itself, and then the 2008 fsck came into action and decided (perhaps wrongfully) that a lot of the fs was corrupted, and ended up with a very large log mentioning almost all inodes in there16:14
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eddybI had mounted MyDocs a few times on my laptop since then, I doubt it has any problems (yet)16:15
eddybDocScrutinizer05: 0xffff isn't doing anything funny there:
eddybapparently the .layout file is associated with the main image16:16
eddybDocScrutinizer05: in the msdos header: Nokia N900 FAT32   ..¾w|¬"Àt.V´.»..Í.^ëð2äÍ.Í.ëþThis is not a boot disk.  Remove, and press a key to reboot16:17
eddybthere's HTML in that image, lol16:19
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eddyband I found a FAT table (redundant I know) gotta love 8.316:21
kerioeddyb: fsck is a bad mistake, yeah16:22
kerioancient dosfsck on flash16:23
eddybDocScrutinizer05: this image looks like it's only for MyDocs16:23
eddybDocScrutinizer05: no_create makes me think the 250MB image contains the initial MyDocs FAT32 partition16:25
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* Win7Mac is open for improvements on the elections-banner, please share your ideas:
eddybWin7Mac: use less artifacts :P16:25
eddyband antialiasing is your friend16:26
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eddybbackup MyDocs, format the /home partition with ext3, flash combined. nothing can go wrong, right?16:31
Win7Maceddyb, not sure what you mean, it doesn't render correct on your side?16:32
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: please update
Win7MacI will16:32
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Lava_Crofteddyb: the artifacts are courtesy of imgur compression16:49
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eddybbut it's a .png :/16:50
eddybit's not big enough for imgur to compress it16:51
eddybWin7Mac: images don16:55
eddybtake 2:16:59
Win7MacI don't understand16:59
eddybWin7Mac: images don't really "render", for what you think happens to happen, libpng would need to be quite broken16:59
eddybthe image you made has annoyances17:00
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Win7Macwhat about this?:
eddybit has the exact same problems, now with added flashing17:11
eddybflashing image. lol17:11
eddybWin7Mac: Hildon Foundation is fuzzy, as if it was upscaled. seeks is fuzzy (excessive anti-aliasing or JPEG artifacts) and the straight lines used on the left are too crispy (no anti-aliasing)17:13
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eddybthe overall layout is good, but I tend to be picky with the details17:13
Win7Maccan't find aliasing in Photoshop17:14
Win7Mac...or anti-aliasing17:15
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: the flashing is awesome17:19
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DocScrutinizer05hey guys, how to specify output filename for curl?17:20
jon_yDocScrutinizer05: ^^17:22
DocScrutinizer05yep, thanks17:23
DocScrutinizer05curl -LJO -o BoDelection_banner.png17:24
DocScrutinizer05  % Total    % Received % Xferd  Average Speed   Time    Time     Time  Current17:24
DocScrutinizer05                                 Dload  Upload   Total   Spent    Left  Speed17:24
DocScrutinizer05100  8931  100  8931    0     0  72954      0 --:--:-- --:--:-- --:--:--  242k17:24
DocScrutinizer05curl: Saved to filename 'OKPpGeB.gif'17:24
DocScrutinizer05maybe the "O" should get nuked?17:25
jon_ymaybe -o needs to be specified first?17:25
jon_yprobabaly -O17:25
DocScrutinizer05-O, --remote-name   Write output to a file named as the remote file17:25
DocScrutinizer05*sigh* now it refuses since destination file exists17:26
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eddybwhy are you saving the .gif as a .png?17:27
eddybrecipe for fubar17:27
DocScrutinizer05since I didn't notice17:28
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: where's the .png?17:29
DocScrutinizer05eddyb: thanks for noticing it17:29
GeneralAntillesN900 is still the only mobile device I've ever used that I felt comfortable editing wikis on.17:30
DocScrutinizer05wait for phoeNIX17:32
DocScrutinizer05phoeN-IX00 ?17:32
Win7Macedited the FiFo-logo in the gif:
DocScrutinizer05sorry I've been told I may not use gif17:33
Win7Macthen no animation17:33
DocScrutinizer05*sigh* I guess I have to edit raw HTML now17:34
Win7Macat least I'm not aware of animation in other formats then gif17:35
eddyband maybe WebP17:36
eddybit's just two frames, very easy to do with JS or CSS3 animations17:37
DocScrutinizer05seems after editing href= in HTML to *.gif it works17:37
Win7Macseen it, nice!17:37
DocScrutinizer05now I need a shower - I touched raw HTML and even edited it17:39
Win7MacI can't seem to get animated png's out of Photoshop CS617:40
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Win7Macno WebP either17:40
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eddybn900/MyDocs.bkp> cp -a /var/run/media/eddy/Nokia\ N900/!(KDE|kde-install-temp|Dicto|Music) .17:43
eddybthat took a while, without the ~20GB used by .documents+Music17:44
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Win7Macchem|st, can you place it in tmo?:
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eddybecho /var/run/media/eddy/Nokia\ N900/.!(documents) | grep documents # gives me nothing. also ld -d with the same argument also shows no .documents17:53
eddybbut if I run cp -a, it copies docu..... aaaah17:54
eddybthat pattern includes . and .., heh17:54
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eddybso I end up with cp -a /var/run/media/eddy/Nokia\ N900/.!(documents||.) . # lol17:55
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DocScrutinizer05var/run/media/*  ?? that kinda sounds odd. Which distro/desktop is doing such stuff?18:04
eddybit was /media some time ago18:05
DocScrutinizer05which sounds better to me18:05
eddybI think it's a backend for kio in kde4 that decides which directory to use18:05
DocScrutinizer05must be a (||poettering)ism then18:06
DocScrutinizer05ugh kde4 / kio18:06
DocScrutinizer05terrible stuff18:06
eddybthere's probably a setting for it somewhere, but I cba to change it18:06
DocScrutinizer05I have to killall kio* every now and then18:06
eddybuhm, why?18:07
eddybwhy would you intentionally kill kio workers?18:07
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eddybit's like unloading kernel fs drivers :|18:07
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DocScrutinizer05e.g because pastebin applet freezes this k* process that's doing everything under KDE418:08
eddybmust be a broken pastebin applet18:08
DocScrutinizer05also always several kio-http tend to linger on forever18:08
eddybor too old of a kde4 version18:08
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* Win7Mac updated . But I can't edit the References18:09
eddybDocScrutinizer05: sounds like very large timeouts for http requests18:09
DocScrutinizer05well, they are larger than usual, but not THAT large18:09
DocScrutinizer05been the word I refused to recall18:10
DocScrutinizer05at least I think it been18:10
DocScrutinizer05yeah, dat shite18:10
DocScrutinizer05luckily it doesn't freeze alt-tab18:11
eddybalt+tab is handled by kwin418:11
DocScrutinizer05so I still can access my always-open system monitor18:11
DocScrutinizer05to kill all kio-file18:11
DocScrutinizer05and that magically recovers the pastebin applet18:11
eddybkio-file shouldn't ever cause a problem18:12
DocScrutinizer05and thus plasma18:12
eddybDocScrutinizer05: plasma-desktop -v18:12
DocScrutinizer05shouldn't yeah, you're absolutely right it *should not*18:12
eddybwhat versions does it show?18:13
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DocScrutinizer05Qt: 4.8.118:13
DocScrutinizer05KDE Development Platform: 4.8.5 (4.8.5) "release 2"18:13
DocScrutinizer05Plasma Desktop Shell: 0.418:13
eddybhmm, that's just two versions behind, never had problems back then18:14
eddybwhere did you get the pastebin applet?18:14
DocScrutinizer05err, from that friggin "menu" to pick applets?18:14
DocScrutinizer05"add widgets"18:14
eddyb"KWin and Path to Wayland—Intial experimental support for Wayland was added to KWin. KWin also got many OpenGL improvements including support being added for creating an OpenGL 3.1 core context and robustness from using the new functionality provided by the GL_ARB_robustness extension."18:15
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eddybDocScrutinizer05: ok, let me check it out18:15
eddybnope, I don't have it18:15
DocScrutinizer05it only occasionally locks up, particularly when pastebining screenshots from clipboard18:15
eddybhow can you pastebin a screenshot?18:16
eddybI ctrl+v on imgur.com18:16
DocScrutinizer05or rather, probably when far end refuses paste and doesn't answer in the way thispastebin thingie expects18:16
eddybthat was my first thought, bad logic in the applet18:17
DocScrutinizer05I take a screenshot with the screenshot tool, select "copy" and then "paste" in pastebin widget18:17
DocScrutinizer05bad logic in kplasma to let a widget freeze the whole session18:18
eddybit's not kplasma :P18:18
DocScrutinizer05that's as nasty and braindamaged as in Hildon desktop, just that on maemo I understand *why* they implemented it that way18:18
eddybdoes anything other than plasma (the other applets) freeze?18:19
DocScrutinizer05actually plasma-desktop, yeah18:19
DocScrutinizer05that's what I need to restart via alt-F2 when it segfaulted once more18:20
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eddybwhat distro are you even on?18:20
eddyband why don't you have 4.10?18:20
eddybI'm also on suse and I can't find any pastebin applet18:21
eddybDocScrutinizer05: sudo zypper se -s pastebin18:21
DocScrutinizer05widget, not apllet18:21
DocScrutinizer05  | perl-WWW-Pastebin-PastebinCom-Create | Paket | 0.003-2.1.1 | x86_64 | openSUSE-12.2-1.618:23
eddyblast release is 12.3 btw. and I found the pastebin thing, damn translations18:23
eddybDocScrutinizer05: in the settings for the pastebin thing, which servers does it use?18:24
DocScrutinizer05privatepaste and wstaw.org18:25
eddybdoes it hang for text, images or both?18:25
DocScrutinizer05usually for images, but I think I have seen it hanging for text as well18:26
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eddybtry change it to imgur for images18:26
eddyb(as a temporary fix)18:26
DocScrutinizer05I kinda hate imgur18:26
eddyblol, why?18:26
DocScrutinizer05dunno, wrong color maybe18:27
DocScrutinizer05too many cookies?18:27
eddybyou should update anyway18:29
DocScrutinizer05I probably got better things to do than to update every 3 months18:29
eddyb(start yast, edit all repos urls to use 12.3 instead of 12.2, then run sudo zypper dup)18:29
eddybDocScrutinizer05: 3? it's almost an year :P18:29
eddybit takes like 5 minutes, then you just have to let it do its job18:30
DocScrutinizer05too bad, then it's almost a year I feel pissed about kmail7akonadi crap now, and fsckd up update by downgrading to a supposedly pre-akonadi kdepim version which turned out still isn't akonadi free18:31
DocScrutinizer05nuked my complete mail settings 3 times this year already18:32
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eddyblol, you hate akonadi so much18:32
DocScrutinizer05yes, it's such a stinking POS18:32
eddybthe worst that happened to me was shutting down in the middle of a distro upgrade, all I had to do is run sudo zypper dup from the console18:33
Win7Machow can I edit the References here?:
eddyb"Akonadi provides unique desktop-wide object identification and retrieval.[4] It functions as an extensible data storage for all PIM applications. In KDE 3 each PIM application had different data storage and handling methods, which led to several implementations of essentially the same features. Besides data storage, Akonadi has several other components including search, and a library (cache) for easy access and notification of data changes."18:33
eddybI don't see how you can downgrade from that :P18:33
DocScrutinizer05oooh and kio-pop3, kio-imap \o/ :-S18:34
DocScrutinizer05yeah F U kde418:34
eddybwhat's wrong with anything you said :P?18:35
DocScrutinizer05let me give you a simple example: every now and then my kmail froze at random on writing new mails18:35
eddybfirst of all, the reason kio has workers is to prevent such things18:36
DocScrutinizer05it turned out it been akonadi which in background tried to find the contacts or whatever to any mailaddr I wrote18:36
eddybI can use kwrite while it's saving the file via sftp18:36
eddybDocScrutinizer05: do you have nepomuk enabled?18:36
eddybthe search index thingie18:36
DocScrutinizer05and it froze since the resource been gone, probably due to sth fekkering mysql18:36
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eddyboh, that's cool, it can index source code. then again, I have grep and I don't care about speed18:37
DocScrutinizer05anyway I learned I only need to restart akonadi (once I found out how to actually DO that), but now I have a console that's basically infested since ever since akonadiserver restart that console sees lots of bogus random diagnostic output18:38
eddyb2> /dev/null or something18:38
eddybor use alt+f2 to do it18:38
DocScrutinizer05dude, the command returned18:38
eddybstdio is inherited18:39
DocScrutinizer05fuck akonadi18:39
DocScrutinizer05when I have a mail client then I want my mail to get handled inside the client, not by some cruft in daemonized mode in background18:40
DocScrutinizer05kmail1 been awesome18:40
eddybakonadi just handles contacts, doesn't it?18:40
DocScrutinizer05kmail2 is a PITA18:40
eddybmaybe you should just update, with all those weirdly specific problems18:41
eddybthe phone sure takes its sweet time to charge after that backup18:42
DocScrutinizer05no, it obviously also does extensive checking of text you write to editor of a new mail, it also does indexing of all avalable mails (which been a few 100k of them on my old system, which made akonadi/kmail works for THREE days on importing them into kmail2, only to fiish with ZILCH mails imported)18:42
eddybnepomuk does mail indexing18:43
DocScrutinizer05meh an akonadi frntend18:43
eddybI generally have it disabled, I have too much crap around and I don't care about searching18:43
DocScrutinizer05same here18:44
DocScrutinizer05I *DO NOT WANT* akonadi, but you can't get rid of it18:44
DocScrutinizer05it's like KDE4's fsckng glibc18:44
eddybno, that would be Qt (and it's meta compiler, I guess)18:46
DocScrutinizer05I meant for the ubiquity18:47
DocScrutinizer05you simply can't get KDE4 without akonadi18:47
DocScrutinizer05since everything is based or at least linked against it18:48
eddybyou can, but you can't use things like contacts without it18:48
eddybDocScrutinizer05: if I disable the LED flashing during charging in maemo, does it apply when I charge without booting up?18:48
eddybif I rm akonadi, these are going to be removed: akonadi kaddressbook kdepim4 kmail kontact korganizer18:49
DocScrutinizer05"without booting up" means "booting to ACT_DEAD" aka initlevel_$dunnowhat18:49
eddybI hate weird stuff like that18:50
eddyband the whole 7 levels of bootloaders18:50
DocScrutinizer05you basically can't avoid booting when charging18:50
eddybit's okay, I'll wait for it to finish charging, again18:50
DocScrutinizer05eddyb: exactly18:50
DocScrutinizer05(remove akonadi)18:50
DocScrutinizer05which is what I did18:50
eddyblibakonadi4 does seem to be used by virtually everything, but I think it's just the client18:51
DocScrutinizer05then I installed an older supposedly akonadi-free version of kdepim18:51
DocScrutinizer05and since then of course no more updates18:51
eddybI think you hate akonadi for related bugs18:52
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DocScrutinizer05no, basicaly I hate it for the concept18:52
DocScrutinizer05but also for using mysql18:52
eddybso you prefer the code in akonadi to be duplicated in kaddressbook kmail kontact korganizer?18:52
DocScrutinizer05and for bringing my system down on its knees18:53
eddybDocScrutinizer05: you can use MySQL, SQLite or PostgreSQL18:53
DocScrutinizer05in kde3 kpim1 those 4 apps were nicely integrated and had no need for friggin akonadi18:54
DocScrutinizer05and it doesn't make a difference to me which friggin sql-db my mailer needs to run, I expect it to work without *any* such cruft18:54
eddybthen how do you want it to save contacts, mails, and whatnot?18:55
DocScrutinizer05in vcards, like it's been done since ages?18:55
DocScrutinizer05and in maildirs, for the mails18:55
eddyboh. I think akonadi automatically imports vcards and maildirs18:55
DocScrutinizer05fsckoff akonadi, I don't need you18:56
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eddybit's really just a convenience thing, for some reason it's broken for you :/18:56
DocScrutinizer05google for it, it's broken for 40% of this globe18:56
eddybI couldn't find anything newer than kde4.518:57
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DocScrutinizer05akonadi shit had its first chance end of last year, and 2nd chance in january (iirc), it made me lose all my mails 2 times, all my some60 filter rules, and kicked me out of business for days or even weeks, when I was absolutely depending on my mail archive to manage council and infra migration19:01
eddybhow the heck did you manage that?19:02
DocScrutinizer05no go get lost and die in a corner where nobody notices!19:02
eddybI had this laptop up for ~36h, and mysqld (the one used by akonadi) has 38 seconds of runtime and only 20MB used19:02
DocScrutinizer05well, maybe you don't have a mail archive with 300+ k of mails19:03
DocScrutinizer05I mean mails, not bytes19:03
eddybanyway... it charged. I think I'll use yast's fs tool to format the home partition19:04
DocScrutinizer05and no, this doesn't include the spam folder19:04
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eddybI hope default format settings work for N90019:10
DocScrutinizer05eddyb: I tried to import my maildir into kdepim/kmail2, it was stupid enough to spamcheck (I guess) each imported mail which prought it down to a rate of 2..8 mails/s import speed. Go figue how I felt watching this with the knowledge that there are 300,000 mails to go19:11
eddybstop it, clean up, do it again with better settings19:12
infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: eddyb: I tried to import my maildir into kdepim/kmail2, it was stupid enough to spamcheck (I guess) each imported mail which brought it down to a rate of 2..8 mails/s import speed. Go figue how I felt watching this with the knowledge that there are 300,00...19:12
DocScrutinizer05better settings?19:13
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eddybyou said you enabled spamcheck for emails not in your original spam box19:14
DocScrutinizer05no, I didn't enable anything19:14
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eddybah, it not I19:14
DocScrutinizer05there's nothing you could en/dis-able during import19:14
eddybthere's no way mysql can be that slow19:14
eddybthe deed is done, time to flash combined19:15
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chem|stWin7Mac: done19:24
DocScrutinizer05chem|st: \o/19:25
Win7MacAw... great!19:25
DocScrutinizer05where is it? tmo default theme right side?19:26
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Win7Macthe voting site it leads to says "Starting 2013-06-20 23:59:59 UTC" - wrong, it's 2013-06-2119:28
Win7MacDocS, yep19:28
Win7MacWoody14619, please correct the date on voting page19:31
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eddybflashing, it's going smooth :D19:34
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eddybbooting into maemo19:36
eddybIIRC it takes a while19:37
eddybI forgot it vibrates on touch and it makes sounds :)))19:38
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DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: hmm?19:40
eddybDocScrutinizer05: thanks for the help :D19:40
eddybit looks like my empty /home partition worked19:40
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: are you here?19:41
eddybI have all the default applets and crap19:41
sixwheeledbeastwiki question what do you want to do?19:41
iDontDocScrutinizer05, >>oooh, while bashing messybox: just occurs to me that messybox-power most likely will come with additional new conflicts to stuff that sane people already installed on their system from clean core utils. So including messybox-power will break update-ability of CSSU for all those who have stuff like find-utils or swapon or whatever installed in their system<< for this and some other reasons, busybox-power creates it's symlinks in19:41
iDontpostinst. All created symlinks are written out to a file. Upon prerm, busybox-power iterates through this list, checks whether they're still symlinks. If they are _and_ still point to /bin/busybox, they will get cleaned up.19:41
iDontJust wanted to clear that up :)19:42
iDontalso see:;a=blob;f=debian/busybox-power.postinst;h=da84ce5739f60791e90aa3f354c7daae6f442b5a;hb=HEAD#l11319:42
Win7Macsixwheeledbeast, I can't edit References on
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DocScrutinizer05iDont: that doesn't help for busybox not installing, due to conflicts, when something other than busybox provides swapon or whatever, right?19:44
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: you can19:44
sixwheeledbeastyou just need to be told how :)19:45
Win7Macah, I seem to get an idea...19:45
iDontDocScrutinizer05: well, since the symlinks are created in postinst, dpkg won't know they belong to busybox-power and will happily overwrite them when installing core utils19:45
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: this is a reference markup19:45
Win7Macjust realized it19:46
DocScrutinizer05errr, so busybox-power doesn't 'PROVIDE' any of the extended capabilities it gets installed for?19:46
sixwheeledbeastso <ref>[http://link linkname]</ref> in the top part and it will automatically add the reference at the bottom.19:46
DocScrutinizer05iDont: and if it doesn't, then how does it work?19:47
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: I have just done Jaffa's link19:47
Win7Macsixwheeledbeast, you finished editing, so I can put my ref?19:47
sixwheeledbeastyep, also need to find fw's. have you send yours to ML?19:48
iDontDocScrutinizer05, AFAICR it should work, but I could double check if you want?19:48
DocScrutinizer05iDont: and when it actually *does* 'provide' then apt/dpkg should either remove the other already installed package that also provides same capability, or rather installation of busybox-power will fail due to conflicts19:48
Win7Macsixwheeledbeast, yes. Please see
iDontDocScrutinizer05: busybox-power explicitly doesn't 'provide' anything at all, as that would indeed break quite some stuff19:50
DocScrutinizer05iDont: look, to install proper procps I already have to accept it breaks my system in a way that forbids further updates, since procps conflicts with normal busybox19:50
iDontbusybox-power doesn't worsen anything at all, as it: 1) doesn't 'provide' anything, 2) only creates symlinks to missing utils, and 3) only cleans those up if they're still valid19:52
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: what's that stuff with wrong date of elections?19:53
iDontyou can mix: installing core utils, remove core utils, install busybox-power, and remove busybox-power in any way possible19:53
iDontwithout breaking your system19:53
iDont(that is, if you haven't introduces any boot-time dependency on busybox-power yourself ofcourse :-)19:53
DocScrutinizer05that sounds nice19:54
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DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: mhm19:54
Win7Macall times 23:59 UTC19:55
Win7Macbanner says 22-28...19:55
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: that's all ok19:55
DocScrutinizer05>>All deadlines are set at 23:59 UTC.<<19:56
DocScrutinizer05chem|st decided to move some deadlines 1min into the future19:56
Win7Macbut voting page says Starting 2013-06-20 23:59:59 UTC:
DocScrutinizer05which makes 21.6. 23:59 -> 22.6. 00:0019:57
Win7MacI know19:57
DocScrutinizer05sigh, then point me to the page that's incorrect, instead letting me check the correct pages, eh?19:57
Win7MacI did:
DocScrutinizer05yeah, now19:58
iDontDocScrutinizer05: I know you don't like busybox-power and that's absolutely fine by me. As I've said to you before, I do my very best to make the package as safe as possible. Please do not hesitate to let me know of any concerns you might have about it. But until some valid problem arises, me reading some of your statements regarding busybox-power on IRC really disheartens me20:00
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iDontAnyway, just wanted to get that off my chest. I got to go now, saturday :)20:00
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DocScrutinizer05c'mon do you think I gonna fix stuff on while following some chanlog link you post here??20:02
Win7Macerr, no. Sorry.20:03
Win7MacI thought "the voting page" would be clear20:03
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DocScrutinizer05iDont: (for the chanlog) I think your recent explanation makes me like busybox power a whole lot more. Sorry for any bad feeling my ranting might cause at your side, it's for sure not meant to discourage you or to cause bad feelings. I'm just concerned about Joe Average user and his maemo device. Seems B-P approaching a state where any concerns against including it to CSSU-T need a re-evaluation20:05
DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: no, it's a pretty fuzzy term20:06
Win7Macok, then sorry again20:06
DocScrutinizer05I have ~15 "voting pages2 open on my desktop right now20:07
divVerentDocScrutinizer05: german layout detected :)20:09
divVerent18:52:31             iDont | busybox-power doesn't worsen anything at all, as it: 1) doesn't 'provide' anything, 2) only creates symlinks to missing utils, and 3) only cleans those up if they're still valid20:10
divVerentvery small issue:20:10
divVerent1. install busybox-power20:11
divVerent2. install swapon20:11
divVerent3. remove swapon20:11
divVerentwhere does /sbin/swapon point to? :)20:11
divVerentbasically this means that even if CSSU included busybox-power, I'd be somewhat tending towards NOT depending on it for boot process20:11
divVerent(or always calling these extra tools like "busybox swapon ..."|20:12
sixwheeledbeastWin7Mac: fixed but IMO they should be linking to mailing list.20:17
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DocScrutinizer05Win7Mac: fixed "voting page"20:22
Win7Macthanks sixwheeledbeast! thanks DocScrutinizer05!20:22
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DocScrutinizer05(soembody needs to add the other 5 candidates before 21st)20:22
Win7Maci can't. 5?20:23
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DocScrutinizer05woody already added himself20:34
DocScrutinizer05when he created that vote20:34
DocScrutinizer05err election?20:34
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Win7Macah ok20:40
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ron0062000how can i upgrade to pr 1.3 with new n90022:50
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freemangordonron0062000: you'd better flash23:10
ron0062000is that the only way ?23:10
infobotrumour has it, maemo-flashing is
freemangordonron0062000: no, but it is better IMO23:10
ron0062000i wish i know how23:11
freemangordonron0062000: the other option is to set the device clock to something like... Jauary 201123:12
freemangordonron0062000: see wiki ^^^23:12
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ron0062000Negri has new N90023:14
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