IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2013-03-17

Estel_thanks a lot, as I'm clueless here00:04
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sixwheeledbeastr.m.o down, was trying to install mplayer00:04
Estel_try from mirrors, maybe?00:04
Estel_I used merlin's ones00:05
Estel_free non-free00:05
Estel_maybe it's related?00:05
sixwheeledbeastpossibly, do you have new worldclock?00:06
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Estel_0_p lemme check if on that device00:10
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Estel_vanilla, forget about it00:10
Estel_no, sorry00:11
Estel_it is replacement00:11
Estel_damn, kerio made it so good i got mistaken00:11
Estel_how is worldclock related?00:11
sixwheeledbeastok I have clock-ui in usr/share/doc, don't you mean adek?00:11
Estel_no clok-ui in /us4/share/doc, despite having replacement clock00:13
infobotEstel_ meant: no clok-ui in /usr/share/doc, despite having replacement clock00:13
sixwheeledbeasthmm what triggers the purge of usr/share/doc?00:14
Estel_kerio, ^00:14
Estel_optifying is called from postinst scripts (which should be written the way that fucks installation, when such unimportant things as doc fails...)00:15
kerioa dpkg trigger of some sort00:15
Estel_but it's first time I've heard about maemo purging it00:15
keriouser@kerio900:~$ cat /usr/share/doc/README00:16
kerioPurged by docpurge00:16
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sixwheeledbeastEstel_: sh in /usr/sbin/docpurge called by dpkg00:19
Estel_but, why it's fatal for my dpkg, and isn't for others?00:19
Estel_in my case, failure to do optification of /usr/share/doc, result in errors that I've quoted, and "subprocess post-instalation script returned exit code 1"00:21
sixwheeledbeastfapman, :P00:21
Estel_returned exit error code 100:21
Estel_from terminal00:21
Estel_*not* used for cssu00:21
Estel_in that device00:21
kerioare you sure it's that?00:21
keriothere's plenty of postinst triggers00:21
Estel_definitely, wait, I'll pastebin output00:21
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Estel_kerio, sixwheeledbeast ^00:30
Estel_sorry it took to long00:30
Estel_got problems to paste it from 2nd device00:30
keriothere's nothing in stock maemo or cssu that *optifies* /usr/share/doc00:30
kerio/usr/share/doc is deleted the fuck away from the device00:31
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Estel_but it seems that those packages have smth optifying it in doc?00:33
Estel_or MohammadAG package man-db does that?  doubt it, I think i have it on 1st device too00:33
Estel_this one is funny too00:34
Estel_no idea wtf that means00:34
kerioi'm not entirely sure of what you did to your n90000:34
Estel_not wget what meansp but it's error00:34
Estel_nothing ;)00:34
Estel_just installed things like in dozens before00:34
Estel_I *do* recall having to touch fake docs in 2 or 3 packages in my 1st device, long time ago - blamed it on errors in packaging that things00:35
MohammadAGmaemo-optify does indeed optify /usr/share/doc files in a package00:35
kerioEstel_: is maemo-optify installed?00:35
kerioand why?00:35
MohammadAGThen docpurge purges them, yay00:35
Estel_MohammadAG,  but /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/99-docpurge deletes them before00:36
MohammadAGmaemo-optify is something usrd on a deb00:36
MohammadAGNo, after00:36
Estel_in my case, it seems to do it before00:36
MohammadAGThats why users often end up with postinst errors00:36
Estel_so maemo-optify cries - pretending to be subprocess postinst script - that have nothing to optify in doc, and dpkg uses that as excuse to leave package not configured00:36
MohammadAGOh wait00:37
Estel_MohammadAG,  but why it affect my 2nd device, and 1*st device seems not affected, and other people don't feel it too?00:37
MohammadAGHave an easy fix00:37
Estel_touch /usr/share/doc/fubar? ;)00:37
keriodpkg -P maemo-optify00:37
MohammadAGapt-get --reinstall install mplayer00:37
kerioliterally *nothing* except pkg-kde-tools depends on it00:37
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keriowhat the fuck00:37
MohammadAGkerio: no use00:37
keriowhy do you have it installed and why does it exist00:38
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kerioMohammadAG: -P removes config files too00:38
MohammadAGIts not installed00:38
MohammadAGIts something a dev runs on their deb00:38
* Estel_ goes to start drinking while investigating it00:38
keriowell, mplayer doesn't do that for me when i install it00:38
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RST38hHi MohammadAG00:39
RST38hHow is suffering nowadays?00:39
MohammadAGHey RST38h00:39
MohammadAGMore expensive I guess :P00:39
Estel_MohammadAG,  maybe that mess is something cssu could fix? optifying smth then purging it is super-fun00:39
Estel_microsoft would be proud00:39
MohammadAGEstel_: a fix is to update maemo-optify so it adds a -f check00:40
* Estel_ nods00:40
MohammadAGIf a file doesnt exist dont fucking move it00:40
* Estel_ nods00:40
MohammadAGBut that would require all devs to rebuild packages00:40
Estel_'m glad my humble case may help maemo science and improve cssu. But why the fuck I'm affected, and other aren't?00:40
MohammadAGkerio: check your postinst00:40
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MohammadAGEstel_: installation failed the first time00:41
* Estel_ goes try reinstalling00:41
MohammadAGOr you were installing mplayer with a package that failed00:41
Estel_one need to reinstall one by one, or bunch of offending packages is ok?00:41
MohammadAGIf reinstalling with apt doesnt work simply dpkg -I the package from /var/cache/apt/archives00:41
MohammadAGThe whole bunch should work00:41
MohammadAGI've had this bug so many times00:42
MohammadAGIf apt doesnt work, again, use dpkg00:42
kerio...also, wtf, shouldn't the postinst happen before docpurge?00:43
Estel_hm, reinstalling bunch doesnt work here00:44
Estel_trying one by one...00:44
sixwheeledbeastso /usr/share/doc should contain only "README", correct?00:44
sixwheeledbeastWell I have clock-ui package in there00:45
Estel_MohammadAG,  lame question, I know00:45
Estel_where apt cache downloaded packages?00:45
Estel_apt-get install --reinstall one by one doesn't help00:45
Estel_trying dpkg00:45
sixwheeledbeastwell not the whole package but changelog.gz00:45
Estel_so, where the f apt cache were?00:46
MohammadAGFuck android00:46
Estel_btw when I install -reinstall, obviously, apt tries to configure all other packages too00:46
MohammadAG. /var/cache/apt/archives00:46
Estel_as they were unconfigured00:46
sixwheeledbeastmmm, thing is not a problem on other devices00:46
MohammadAGThird type I've typed it00:46
Estel_Time :)00:46
Estel_android sucks, I know00:46
MohammadAGEstel_: you could also try dpkg -force-all --configure -a00:47
Estel_that was thing I was going to do if normal holy wail fails00:47
Estel_use the force, luck00:47
Estel_Luke, even00:47
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Estel_anyway, the question remains - why the fuck, despite it being fubar, it doesn't affect other people's installations? at least not as much?00:48
Estel_erm even after reinstalling, my /var/cache/apt/archives contains only empty "partial" directory00:49
Estel_needed to clean some minutes ago, though, as I was getting ful home00:50
Estel_(1.5 GB downloaded packages)00:50
* Estel_ goes to searcg for that commands forcing apt to re-download00:50
kerioapt-get clean?00:50
MohammadAGapt-get --reinstall -d install00:51
MohammadAGJust force configuration00:51
MohammadAG Really no harm froma failed mv00:51
MohammadAGIt does affect users00:52
MohammadAGI've seen it on my device a lot00:52
MohammadAGAnd I've seen it on tmo00:52
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Estel_I see00:52
Estel_well, I mean that when I asked now people to try it, no one got affected, and I had hundreds of packages today00:53
Estel_spend hours touching /usr/share/doc/<package name> like idiot00:53
Estel_instead of forcing it from very beginning00:53
Estel_I was just curious wtf causes it00:53
MohammadAGA failed postinst00:55
MohammadAGOf one package00:55
MohammadAGUnrelated note00:55
Estel_MohammadAG,  will you post it somewhere on cssu channels? maybe someone will be interested in fixing this shit00:55
Estel_as you've said, fix should be easy00:55
Estel_benefits huge ;)00:56
MohammadAGMy iPad has been on for 29 days00:56
Estel_rotten apples? ;)00:56
MohammadAGEstel_: the problem is this is a dev package00:56
Estel_ah, yes00:56
MohammadAGDevs would need to rebuild00:56
Estel_well, at least future packages would be unaffected00:56
MohammadAGIt needs to go in extras00:56
Estel_and devs carrying would just rebuild, for example, with new version release00:56
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Estel_so, the sooner we start with it fixed, the sooner af after few years - most packages will be unaffected, at least maintained ones00:57
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MohammadAGWas the builder fixed?00:58
Estel_after --reinstall -d, my /var/cache/apt/archives is still empty00:58
Estel_although, I have /var/cache/apt/pkgcache.bin00:58
Estel_yea, builder work(ed), until repos went down again00:59
kerioor /home/user/.apt-archive-cache00:59
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Estel_oh, right, my brain isn't exactly functioning the usual $PATH way for messing with this maemofication, today :)01:02
sixwheeledbeastMohammadAG: builder, for some yes. but my package has been in the queue for nearly 12hrs01:02
MohammadAGkerio: that's for HAM01:03
Estel_hm, no packages there01:03
MohammadAGnot plain apt01:03
Estel_so wtf with my apt, why it doesn't save packages01:03
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Estel_/var/cache/apt/pkgcache.bin, which is 4.2 MB in my case, dopesn't have anything to do with it?01:05
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Estel_psswitcher package doesnt want to configure even with --force-all01:14
Estel_and doesn't want to get purged either01:14
Estel_without even telling why, just pre-removal script failure01:15
Estel_dpkg --force-all -r psswitcher doesnt work too, for same reason01:15
Estel_MohammadAG,  sorry for bothering, what you propose in that situation? :P01:16
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Estel_it's funny package that enables speakers during conversation, when keyboard is slided out01:18
Estel_it works on all my devices01:18
Estel_but here it spits more serious (than missing doc) error about postinst script: "can't stat '/tmp/psswitcherd'01:19
Estel_~rape apt01:19
* infobot takes apt behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams01:19
Estel_~rape dpkg01:19
* infobot takes dpkg behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams01:19
sixwheeledbeastah ...01:20
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sixwheeledbeastdpkg doesn't purge the /usr/share/doc01:21
kerioEstel_: reflash01:21
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Estel_kerio, don't be silly, reflash is for sissies. btw I bet I would run into same problem back again ;)01:21
Estel_how one would get rid of package that doesn't want to either configure itself or purge? I haven5 had to do it in years01:21
Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  hm?01:22
sixwheeledbeastthis is why clock-ui bits are still in /usr/share/doc01:22
kerioEstel_: i still have scrollbars in Conversations and i have no faintest clue why01:22
Estel_I see01:22
kerioi tried reflashing01:22
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kerioi got upset by the different, stock screen vibration feedback01:22
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kerioand restored my backup01:22
Estel_lol :)01:23
Estel_well, I have those scrollbars that disappear after a while, there01:23
Estel_anyway, my question about how to wipe from existence a stuck package, that doesn't want to either install properly or purge itself, still remains01:23
Estel_dpkg --force-all -r still gives postinst script errors01:24
keriodpkg -P?01:24
Estel_pre-removal script returned error exit status 101:24
Estel_erros were encountered during...01:24
Estel_I though, that those fckin force options were to help in such case01:25
kerioeven with --force-all?01:25
Estel_dpkg --force-all -r or -P = dpkg bitching about pre-removal script being ugly01:25
kerioEstel_: rm /var/lib/dpkg/info/<packagename>.*rm01:25
Estel_so it can't proceed01:25
* Estel_ madly goes to execute that01:25
Estel_just after removing everything from dpkg -L packagename01:26
Estel_anyone got handy a sh magic to rm result of dpkg -L?01:26
Estel_some grep or whatsnot?01:26
keriodon't do that01:26
kerioalthough... eeeh01:27
kerioEstel_: just rm `dpkg -L packagename`01:27
Estel_why shouldn't I do that?01:27
Estel_shit, I don't have ` mapped to hw keyboard01:27
sixwheeledbeastmmm ... psswitcher is non-free too IIRC01:27
Estel_wut? I got non-free package without knowing it?01:28
sixwheeledbeastcan't check source01:28
Estel_isn't it it freee section?01:28
sixwheeledbeastnon-free = no source01:29
sixwheeledbeasthence "free non-free" in HAM01:29
sixwheeledbeastI wanted to check the source a good while ago and couldn't IIRC01:30
Estel_btw, it have 0 files 0_o01:30
Estel_maybe due to being unconfigured01:30
Estel_dpkg -L show files, but none of them exist01:31
Estel_what the fuckin fuck01:31
Estel_I wonder what an idiot made such simple package non-free01:31
sixwheeledbeast"Jay Pangmi"01:32
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sixwheeledbeastaka jaeezzy @ TMO01:33
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Estel_never heard of that guy01:34
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sixwheeledbeastsudo dpkg -r psswitcher01:35
Estel_no way01:35
Estel_doesnt work01:35
Estel_due to pre-removal script01:35
Estel_dpkg bitching about it even when --force-all, don't even mention trying it without force01:36
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Estel_oh great, now I've lost all icons on device01:36
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Estel_yoiu know what? going to restore backup01:37
Estel_shouldn't execute commands when tired01:37
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Estel_rm `dpkg -L psswitcher01:37
Estel_it wasn't rm -r, so it should only rm matching files01:37
Estel_but somehow, it screwed all icons01:37
sixwheeledbeastI have suspicions about psswitcher being broken, hence why I wanted to check source a while ago.01:38
Estel_it definitelly works ok when installed long time ago01:38
Estel_I have it in main device, 0 problems ever01:38
Estel_maybe it lost compatibility01:38
keriowhat's psswitcher?01:38
Estel_due to some changes01:38
Estel_program that automagically turn speakers on when keyo,board is slided out01:39
Estel_or proximity uncovered01:39
Estel_or what you configure01:39
sixwheeledbeastOh I am not saying it doesn't work I use it, but that doesn't mean it's not a problem01:39
Estel_had no idea it is closed source shitte01:39
sixwheeledbeastEstel_ remove non-free from applcation catalogues01:39
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Estel_I bet it's main usage - speaker on when keyboard slided out - could be rewritten in 30 min01:40
Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  fact. Sometimes I don't mean closed source - like fckin flash plugin01:40
Estel_just missed it about that one01:40
Estel_it was one of first things I've installed as N900 newbie01:40
Estel_and never touched it since that01:40
Estel_in any way01:40
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sixwheeledbeastmmm kerio: it's a pkg in extras for routing phone to loudspeaker etc etc01:42
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sixwheeledbeastEstel_: psswitcher uses "watch cat /sys/bus/platform/devices/proximity/state"01:47
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sixwheeledbeastyum, poll h/w every 2 secs01:48
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sixwheeledbeastEstel_:"cp /etc/event.d/psswitcherd /tmp/ && sudo apt-get install --reinstall psswitcher"01:54
sixwheeledbeastif you haven't restored backup yet?01:54
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Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  haven't had /etc/event.d/psswitcherd either, as it ultimately failed to install on first place02:02
Estel_btw it polls proximity every 2 sec only if you have this option enabled02:02
Estel_otherwise it reacts on keyboard slided out02:02
Estel_via dbus?02:02
Estel_anyway, I need to restore backup, as that rm command got ultimately wrong, somehow02:02
Estel_half things on device doesn't work02:02
Estel_backup isn't old, so it's not a big deal02:03
sixwheeledbeastI gathered that for proxy02:03
Estel_just before today's batch of programs02:03
sixwheeledbeastpolling while in call to be exact02:03
Estel_polling even, when only slide is used?02:06
Estel_lame method, honestly02:06
Estel_btw even proximity sensor have irq for that02:06
Estel_so one can avoid polling02:06
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sixwheeledbeastmy point exactly ^02:07
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Estel_I would get it out of my main device, although I'm quite afraid to use purge :P02:09
Estel_joking, should work here02:09
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sixwheeledbeastI have prerm postrm postinst script open hence ^ with tmp file02:10
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Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  hm02:36
Estel_so prerm script is borked?02:36
sixwheeledbeasterr, not sure.02:36
Estel_but even with something in /tmp/psswitcher, script fails during install or purge, later, without giving reason (failed on that device)02:36
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sixwheeledbeastEstel_ well there's not much to prerm script tbh02:38
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sixwheeledbeastif  -f /etc/event.d/psswitcherd then rm fi02:40
sixwheeledbeastelse echo "postrm called with unknown argument"02:40
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* sixwheeledbeast yawns02:47
Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  hm, I wonder how it could fail, then02:47
Estel_goodnight ;)02:48
Estel_I have long night of reinstalling 1.5 GB of packages, ffs02:48
sixwheeledbeastyes ... bed is lucking good now02:48
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sixwheeledbeastlets hope r.m.o and garage are up in the morning :)02:49
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CreteilDoes someone have any informations about '' ???05:00
CreteilIt is a pain trying to build something since migration ...05:00
CreteilAny help we can provide ?05:00
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DocScrutinizer05Creteil: please elaborate05:04
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, For example :05:07
Creteil- I do not receive mail anymore with status 'OK' or 'FAILED' since migration.05:07
Creteil- Also actually I can't access anymore :
DocScrutinizer05migration happened 2 days ago, since yesterday we're looking into fixing builder05:08
CreteilWhat can I do to help ?05:09
DocScrutinizer05linger on here and listen what's getting done, test builder and report here, preferably to jacekowski05:13
DocScrutinizer05read chanlog of this afternoon (~12..15h ago, particularly posts by jacekowski)05:14
CreteilDoes jacekowski is up or does he sleep right now ?05:15
DocScrutinizer05also posts by sixwheeledbeast and m4rtink05:15
DocScrutinizer05he probably sleeps right now05:15
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DocScrutinizer05but generally builder should work since ~2 days05:16
DocScrutinizer05at least for some users and some methods of upload, witha bit of luck05:17
CreteilBy 'What can I do to help ?' I mean maybe I can help on the box managing the 'auto-builder', since I have some experience in systems management ...05:17
DocScrutinizer05we'd need experience with midgard and with autobuilder05:17
DocScrutinizer05both are basically opensource05:18
DocScrutinizer05and jacekowski built his own local autobuilder some years ago, so he knows a bit about ours05:19
DocScrutinizer05if you feel you would like to accept a maintainer role and responsibility for parts of infra, talk to me05:20
CreteilIn open source, even you didn't have experience of a dedicated subject (midgard & autobuilder), sometime, just login on system, and just looking everywhere, you can help to find things ...05:21
DocScrutinizer05we're a small but smart team right now, and would welcome additional manpower05:21
DocScrutinizer05Creteil: alas i'm not allowed to grant such access05:22 is not exactly public domain05:22
DocScrutinizer05HiFo appointed me to grant access only to those guys that got accepted by both council and HiFo BoD05:23
DocScrutinizer05we have assets to protect for 40000 users05:24
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, I have no problems with this rules, I gonna wait some more days to be able to push new/updated packages ...05:25
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CreteilDocScrutinizer05, does is related ?05:29
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, Just forget, I have the answer ...
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CreteilMy last build of movgrab FAILED because of dependencies not satisfied on the autobuilder box ...05:48
CreteilThis is what I remind, because even the log cannot be accessed actually ...05:48
jacekowskiyes it can05:50
Creteiljacekowski, ???05:50
CreteilI'm trying to access but I can't ...05:51
jacekowskiwait a second05:51
jacekowskiit looks like a repository VM went down again05:53
CreteilAny clue about why the VM goes down ?05:54
jacekowskiVM is still running but xen disconnects the network05:56
DocScrutinizer05jacekowski: ohnoes05:56
CreteilLeave ZEN with XEN :-)05:56
DocScrutinizer05jacekowski: I'll give machine a reboot, ok?05:57
jacekowskijust check if it's the same thing as last tiem05:57
DocScrutinizer05too late05:57
DocScrutinizer05already triggered reboot05:58
CreteilWasn't these box are supervised in terms of connectivity ?05:58
DocScrutinizer05yes, but mail to *me* fails due to err, spamfiltering05:58
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CreteilHow long does it take to resurrect from a reboot approx ?06:00
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CreteilAlso, maybe a Nagios where we put all servers to survey can be a good start to be in touch with the architecture health ...06:02
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jacekowskiwe have icinga06:03
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Estel_Hm, I've restored backup on tht 2nd device and everything went back to normal and works like a charm... EXCEPT for advanced-interface-switcher06:10
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Estel_it just disappeared from hildon-status-menu06:11
Estel_tried --reinstall, tried killing hildon-status-menu, tried purging advisw and all it's dependencies...06:11
Estel_still no luck. Every other status menu applet works like charm.06:11
Estel_advisw works when I call it manually via it's scripts06:12
Estel_just no fuckin applet in menu06:12
Estel_wtf I ask, wtf?06:12
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CreteilEstel_, ???06:13
Estel_yea, quite my reaction, too06:13
thedead1440Estel_: imagine you are having so much problems restoring; what would happen to $user if he ran into troubles06:15
CreteilEstel_, no, I mean what are you talking about, because here I'm talking since 4am about autobuilder was down, and then you come and look like you talk about probably your N900 device troubles ... ;-)06:15
Estel_Creteil,  se irc logs from todays evening06:15
Estel_thedead1440,  yea06:16
Estel_I just wanted to avoid vanilla reflash and installing from scratch to save time06:16
Estel_it seems, that it would be faster, ffs06:16
Estel_my optfs backup was borked somehow - all things got backuped except for basic maemo graphics, so I had desktops and icons but no buttons and pink status menu background...06:17
Estel_restored from ages old optfs06:17
Estel_that I'm sure had nothing removed after, just things add06:17
Estel_over-extracted that "lackingn optfs backup over it06:17
Estel_every single bit works like charm, except for advisw, which anyway, reside on root, LOL!06:18
Estel_even freakin brightness applet works, just no advisw, trying to purge hildon-status-menu and it's dependencies, now...06:18
Estel_me wanna apt-get install --reinstall --purge $EVERYTHING command06:19
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thedead1440Estel_: if you could once everything is resolved document maybe on a thread on TMO your problems and solutions; it may help people who are advised always to flash even though there are ways to manually fix things up and also show not only $users get into shit situations but even the greatest find themselves in shit at times :D06:20
Estel_sure, as I'm one of greaest ;)06:24
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Estel_anyway, why not...06:24
Estel_for sure I will document case with optification and pre/post/inst scripts06:24
Estel_as it seems to ocassionaly confuse other users to oblivion, too06:24
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thedead1440yup; thanks!06:25
Estel_I would love to document how my kernel got restored to omap1 on this device yesterday...06:25
Estel_but I have no freakin idea06:25
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thedead1440hehe maybe a thread "Estel and his adventures" :p06:25
Estel_as it was clearly due to accidentally dpkg -i kernel-power packages, but nowhere in the code is anything that could d that omap1 isn't even backuped anywhere06:25
Estel_voodo programming06:26
Estel_and to add icing on the top, today usb port started to move and break connection on this device06:26
Estel_after week of using it (device), just while my soldering iron is out of service for a week (or it would be soldered down already, before problems)06:26
thedead1440it can't go wrong further (or can it?) so it becomes the ultimate guide :D06:26
Estel_it reminds me that I might need to invest time reading 0xFFFF, as I may be not able to flash from pc soon ;)06:27
Estel_or I'm not already without knowing it06:27
Estel_or I'm not already without knowing it06:28
Estel_(it's not my main device with such adventures)06:28
Estel_worst part - device need to be ready till tomorrow evening, as it goes with my son for week long trip and voip is predefined there for contact06:28
Estel_maybe I will put it into kitchen oven for reflow, that would be a guide06:29
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Estel_just raped hildon-status-menu and it's dependencies, alongside few cssu packages, time for reboot and reinstalling them...06:30
Estel_I could imagine $SOMESHIT conflicting from my old opt and actual opt, but I can't get why such thing lives through purging advisw and reinstalling it06:31
Estel_it's strange and unlikely, but maybe somewhere deeper smth is screwd - although, other status menu applets works just fine06:32
DocScrutinizer05Creteil: sorry, repo is down again. xen problems06:34
Estel_ugh, device lived through getting rid of hildon-status-menu and friends, but purging status-area-applet-battery and clock-ui made it reboot instantly06:38
Estel_love how maemo prioritizes critical packages06:38
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Estel_yea, bootloop!06:46
Estel_it seems that deinstalling battery applet was critical mistake06:46
Estel_it shutdowns just after I input lock code06:47
thedead1440boot it with rd-mode enabled?06:47
thedead1440i think flasher-3.5 --enable-rd-mode --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset should allow it to bootup06:49
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, look like you also need a XEN skilled guy ...06:49
DocScrutinizer05we got at least one, but yes06:49
DocScrutinizer05last bug we ironed out, basically we contributed the patch to xen upstream06:50
Estel_thedead1440,  no usb, remember? ;) anyway, it looks like something shut it down thinking that it don't have power in battery? It had bme replacement, maybe it's allergic to touching applet06:50
thedead1440Estel_: hehe; maybe its allergic to you :p06:51
DocScrutinizer05Creteil: if you're such experienced xen expert, please don't hesitate to /query me and negotiate details. As already mentioned we're still looking for new members for our team06:52
Estel___|_ it, I'm reverting from backupmenu backup again06:52
Estel_...which of course means doing it via terminal, as, for some reason, backupmenu doesn't like that sd card06:53
thedead1440is that the ring finger Estel_? Just like school-kids getting around the ban from using the middle finger :p :D06:53
Estel_and doesn't want to mount it, as it is /dev/mmcblk106:53
Estel_and backupmenu expects /dev/mmcblk1p106:54
thedead1440oh can't backupmenu's scripts allow you to change it?06:54
Estel_nope, need to get into recovery shell06:54
Estel_and don't say "ban" in DocScrutinizer05 victinity, I'm sure he now reads through chanlogs...06:55 see how you got offended :P06:55
thedead1440wtf lol06:56
Estel_especially, estel and ban in one sentence may work like red carpet for him06:56
thedead1440see my school-kids analogy was apt ;)06:56
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, I'm using vmWare on our side ...06:57
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, what is the brand XEN running on ?06:57
Estel_;) he shouldn't be able to see it, as he presumably put ignore on my nick06:57
Estel_if he is now scavenging through chanlog anyway, it is his own fault :P06:58
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DocScrutinizer05yeah, we'd be better off with vmWare or any other virtualization, but for hysteric raisins we had to go for xen first step of our migration#206:58
Estel_see? a serious, responsible, technical man06:58
DocScrutinizer05Creteil: please rephrase your last post06:59
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, What hardware XEN running on ? HP, IBM (IBM blade ???)06:59
Estel_it's lovely, when he ignores me - all that demonic madness goes away from his virtual x-eyes06:59
DocScrutinizer05Creteil: see
DocScrutinizer05it has a whole wealth of info07:00
DocScrutinizer05incl pointer to supermicro server07:00
DocScrutinizer05with 4 blades, of which 2 are populated right now07:00
CreteilDocScrutinizer05, any other channel we can talk about infra ?07:01
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Estel_oho, troubles ahead07:01
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Estel_oh, sure07:10
Estel_After so many hours debugging it I just mixed gtar -x with gtar -c07:10
Estel_replacing my backup :P07:10
Estel_good that I have backup of backup of backup of backup file with backup07:10
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DocScrutinizer05>>for a defamation it's irrelevant if/that it is a lie. It's just sufficient to tell it constantly and frequently to make the masses believe in it<<08:43
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DocScrutinizer05all in line with Woody14619's fundamental codex of fighting such defamation each single time it gets told. If only he wouldn't fall for similar telling incorrect statements about me...08:44
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Sicelokerio: thanks man. finally found that trick to 'skip' connecting to dummy network, etc09:12
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kerioSicelo: yay10:23
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DocScrutinizer05lol, closing FF to free up 1.2GB(!) of RAM12:11
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keriowhy would you run other programs, anyway?12:14
keriofirefox does everything you need!12:14
keriogive him all your ram!12:14
keriothis is something i quite like about java programs, in fact12:15
kerioyou can (must?) specify hard limits for ram usage12:15
DocScrutinizer05sounds like MacOS12:15
* Macer is still an opera fan12:16
kerioDocScrutinizer05: you mean classic?12:16
Maceralthough opera is supposed to swap over to wk12:16
Macerso it will be just another webkit browser :) no more presto12:16
Macerwhat a shame. it's like when apple gave up on ppc12:16
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kerioit's not that apple "gave up" on ppc12:18
* DocScrutinizer05 gives the finger and heads out for some walk in the sun. 58h of shock and awe are enough12:18
Macerwhat's wrong with
DocScrutinizer05when something goes down - DON'T RINg ME!12:19
kerioit's just that apparently nobody was able to make a dualcore G5 that didn't burn a hole in your pants because of heat12:19
Macerdoesn't ibm still use ppc?12:19
Macerx86 seems to burn a hole in your pants too without a ridiculous array of heatsinking and fans :)12:20
Maceri'm still a bit shocked the world hasn't started using arm based laptops12:20
keriono windows for ARM12:20
Macerwell... windows RT nowadays12:20
kerioand moving to a different architecture is only possible if you can recompile the source :)12:20
Macernot sure how well that works tho.. never tried it12:20
DocScrutinizer05Macer: what's wrong? ? ???? watch e.g.
thedead1440DocScrutinizer05: you said you are leaving12:23
thedead1440can someone (anyone) kick Doc out for his own sanity12:24
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Maceris this supposed to be moving or something?12:27
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Macerwhat's with that load avg in the middle ? lol12:28
Macerthat sure doesn't seem normal.. i sure hope the y axis isn't seconds12:29
DocScrutinizer05load is load12:30
DocScrutinizer05you usually have loads <112:30
Maceryou had a 500 load ? :)12:31
DocScrutinizer05<N for N-core systems12:31
Macerwell... 425 or so12:31
Macerwell... i'm sure that slowed things down to a crawl12:31
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Macerany idea what caused it?12:31
Macerbroken build bot? :)12:31
* DocScrutinizer05 makes some strange noise12:31
Macerprobably the same noise the server made12:32
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Macerthat sure is a steady trend too12:32
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Macerlook at the brighter side... it stopped doing it for a while :)12:33
Macermaybe someone is superseeding 5000 torrents from your box haha12:33
cityLightscan I flash maemo/meego on any current cellular . like nexus4?12:34
cityLights2. when will joola release their phone?12:34
DocScrutinizer051: no, 2: ask in #jollamobile12:35
cityLightsdid you write Proximous?12:35
Macerwow .. nice graphing heh12:37
Macerwww seems fickle12:37
Macerthat wiki is being mean as well12:37
Macerusing mysql are you? :)12:38
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Macerit looks fine other than the web server12:39
Macerwith its peaking at 40 heh12:39
Macerwhat's with that gap in graph data in the day view? reboot?12:42
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Maceryou don't require a swap for the webserver?12:44
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MacerSwap: Using 0.0 of 0.0 MB swap.12:51
MacerCPU Utilization:78.2 8.9 11.212:54
Macerwow and that's 4 dedicated cores?12:55
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freemangordonssvb_: ping14:44
ssvb_freemangordon: pong14:45
freemangordonssvb_: re pixman - what are your concerncs, stock is 0.16.2 and there is no ABI breakeage between that and 0.28.214:46
ssvb_freemangordon: pixman 0.22 dropped a workaround for buggy old x servers, and looks like maemo is using such old x server14:48
ssvb_the workaround mentioned in comment 23 from
povbotBug 22484: was not found.14:50
freemangordonssvb_: hmm, lemme google a bit14:51
freemangordonssvb_: though, shouldn't we have segfault already if that was the case?14:52
ssvb_maemo x server based on 1.7 pre-release is almost there, it is just missing the patch from
povbotBug 22484: was not found.14:52
ssvb_that bug was originally about just some icons not being displayed, but you can surely wait for a real segfault to be encountered by somebody before taking some action14:54
ssvb_freemangordon: it may be a good idea to check whether the x server has any maemo specific changes and try to upgrade it to the latest stable upstream 1.7.x release (applying maemo modifications if necessary)14:57
ssvb_or cherry pick the patches which address this particular issue14:57
freemangordonssvb_: by looking at the code, that patch is there14:57
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ssvb_freemangordon: which code?14:58
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freemangordonssvb_: no git repo, you need to get tar.gz. or wait a minute, I'll pastebin it14:59
freemangordonssvb_: I can;t find the second patched functio15:01
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freemangordonssvb_: copy_drawable that is15:01
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freemangordonssvb: no copy_drawable function in maemo xserver sources15:06
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freemangordonssvb: still here?15:12
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ssvbfreemangordon: yes, here is the log of changes to this file on 1.7 branch -
ssvbthe copy_drawable function had been introduced in "Fix clipping when windows are used as sources" patch15:16
freemangordonssvb: and reverted here
ssvbright, that's a good catch15:18
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ssvbI'm trying to identify the exact upstream version or commit for fbpict.c from maemo15:21
freemangordonssvb: me too15:22
freemangordonssvb: I guess it is
freemangordonwill diff15:24
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freemangordondammit, how to get it plain for a speceific commit?15:33
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freemangordonssvb: I am almost sure we're here
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freemangordonssvb: so you think there is a problem?15:46
ssvblooks like it is the state exactly before the source clipping fixes got applied to xserver 1.7, hence it should behave like 1.6 and new pixman versions dropped support for this in version 0.2215:50
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ssvbthough I'm not sure if it would be easy or even possible to reproduce any serious problems on maemo15:53
freemangordonssvb: hmm? elaborate please, I still don;t get what the problem would be. Going to run all the pixman tests in the meanwhile15:55
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ssvbfreemangordon: was about invisible notification area icons in gnome15:59
povbotBug 22484: was not found.15:59
freemangordonssvb: but stock pixman is 16.02, the bug is for 0.15.12+16:01
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freemangordonssvb: ooh, i see16:02
freemangordonthat workaround was removed in 22.216:02
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freemangordonssvb: I guess I can re-introduce it, just to be on the safe side16:04
freemangordonssvb: thanks, I think I finally grok it :D16:05
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ssvbfreemangordon: you are welcome :)16:09
divVerentfyi, I had asked for a problem with fcam-drivers some days ago...16:09
divVerentthe issue is that extras' fcam-drivers does NOT work with extras' kernel-power16:09
divVerentbut extras-devel's fcam-drivers work with extras' kernel-power16:09
freemangordondivVerent: install fcam drivers from extras-devel16:09
divVerentso, blessn900 now works fine for me :)16:09
divVerentyes, just said I did that16:09
divVerentand that it fixed it16:09
freemangordonssvb: I guess reintroducng the workaround will fix any posibble issues, agree?16:10
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ssvbfreemangordon: yes, though admittedly I'm not quite sure how to test it16:11
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freemangordonssvb: I'll try to find a way, there is a removed test here
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freemangordonssvb: also I have a bug report for some broken widgets, so I guess I'll be able to test it16:18
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cityLightsis there any other cellular except the N900 that is able to run maemo/meego?16:26
Sicelomaemo, none16:27
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DocScrutinizer05[2013-03-17 11:34:40] <cityLights> can I flash maemo/meego on any current cellular . like nexus4?16:54
DocScrutinizer05[2013-03-17 11:34:55] <cityLights> 2. when will joola release their phone?16:54
DocScrutinizer05[2013-03-17 11:35:20] <DocScrutinizer05> 1: no, 2: ask in #jollamobile16:54
cityLightsok, sorry man16:55
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freemangordonssvb: kudos :)17:18
freemangordonphew :D17:18
freemangordonthe reported bug is fixed too17:18
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thedead1440freemangordon: just upgraded libpixman and libxml; during installation i got a message saying the timestamp for the postrm, control etc are 5793s in the future. Shouldn't affect the system right since the installation seems to have gone fine?18:00
freemangordonthedead1440: no such messages here, are you sure your ctime is correct?18:01
thedead1440freemangordon: yup;
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sixwheeledbeastno issue here either however installed them separatly18:03
thedead1440hmm maybe something is borked on my device :D18:03
freemangordonthedead1440: looks like18:03
thedead1440anyway it installed fine so i don't think it should be an issue18:03
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thedead1440it could be a dpkg bug:
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sixwheeledbeastthedead1440: patched in version 1.16.1 it seems.18:14
thedead1440sixwheeledbeast: yup on the n900 its 1.1418:14
sixwheeledbeasthowever it just ignores the timestamp18:14
thedead1440yeah its a trivial thing18:15
sixwheeledbeastyer, 1.14.2518:15
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NeutrinoPowerdoes the repository "extras-testing" work?19:54
NeutrinoPowerand "extras-devel"?19:54
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sixwheeledbeastNeutrinoPower: what do you mean by work?19:56
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NeutrinoPowerfor weeks I cannot install package from extras-testing19:58
sixwheeledbeastrepos are up now, which pkg?19:58
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NeutrinoPowerI upgraded manually, now I could install mediainfo and pykake20:22
NeutrinoPowerbut I want to install flexo and it isn't listed in fast package manager
sixwheeledbeastFAM and HAM have separate app lists, have you been using mirrors?20:25
sixwheeledbeastyou could just click on your link in N900 browser20:25
clownishhey. is there a20:27
clownishCSSU-thumb toolchain setup for madde?20:27
NeutrinoPoweroh, the problem is "flexo" is already installed20:28
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Estel_ssvb,  IDK who you are, but I definitely like people like you20:33
Estel_(bug report and the way, that conversation was technical orgasm)20:34
Estel_very educational to read those reports and commits you guys both submitted20:34
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Estel_BTW, if anyone is interested (which i doubt), it turned out that my optfs backup on 2nd device was "borked" due to being done on desktop linux...20:35
Estel_so tar there adds some things that maemo tars doesnt understand, and silenty dies in middle of extracting, without giving reports20:35
Estel_it extract positively some things, then die20:36
Estel_gnu-tar on N900 was more talkative and reported unknown headers, but also dropped extracting after some files20:36
Estel_will extract it from desktop to mmcblk0p2, as soon as I fix that fuckin usb port, which decided to fall off just yesterday20:36
Estel_cleanly, fortunatelly, pads are perfectly intact, even solder on it - legs on usb got broken20:37
Estel_(on usb port)20:37
sixwheeledbeastclownish: only seen instructions for scratchbox
* Estel_ scavenges some copper things to do make-shift thing tip for electric soldering iron, due to his gas one being out of service)20:38
clownishsixwheeledbeast: i know, put i hoped i can avoide scratchbox somehow20:38
* sixwheeledbeast shrugs20:39
sixwheeledbeastEstel_ : I find gas irons aren't great for PCB's20:41
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Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  why?20:51
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Estel_I feel them super great - no cables to mess with, no impendance issue (no electricity flowing nearby soldering tip)20:52
Estel_just heat, tip, and me20:52
sixwheeledbeasttemperatures not as stable and the exhaust is a PITA20:52
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Estel_mhm, depends on mode20:52
sixwheeledbeastI have both, gas for site work and electric on the bench20:52
Estel_pen gas irons are good just for very quick jobs, as indeed gas pressure drops and temperature changes20:53
Estel_I see20:53
sixwheeledbeastplus it costs a bit in butune20:53
sixwheeledbeaston a large project anywho20:53
Estel_well, my gas one (the one malfunctioning) have big capacity, and keeps stable temperature for a hour of constant work20:53
Estel_as for butine, I found it ~ equal in cost as electricity, When used in iron20:54
Estel_exhasut can be problematic, tho, you're right here20:54
sixwheeledbeastAs the tank gets emptier the temperature can change a bit20:54
Estel_I just remember to keep it upward, away from pcb20:54
Estel_depends on tank size, of course you're right, but with big tank temperature change is veeeery slow and shouldn't happen to noticeable levels before 1/4 tank left20:55
Estel_smallest tanks suffer more20:55
Estel_my tank get ~120 ml at once IIRC20:55
Estel_brb, trying to scavenge usb port from dead motherboard20:56
Estel_already bought 4 new, too impatient to wait for arrival :P20:56
sixwheeledbeastI think the fact electricity is readily available, kills the argument that gas is more efficient.20:57
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sixwheeledbeast~120ml is a fair size gas iron,21:01
infobotokay, sixwheeledbeast21:01
infobotit has been said that 120ml is a fair size gas iron,21:01
sixwheeledbeastinfobot: forget 120ml21:02
infoboti forgot 120ml, sixwheeledbeast21:02
eccerr0rI guess I deal with the cord when mains power is fine, better temperature control mainly, and mains power is cheap for soldering purposes...21:03
sixwheeledbeasteccerr0r: exactly, on the bench it will sit at the right temp with no refilling21:04
eccerr0rgas for cooking, heating water, heating houses, drying clothes, etc. however...21:04
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sixwheeledbeastoff gas here so all electric21:05
db9jis there anyone who can help me setup my n900 so I can use it over my vpn21:06
db9jor point me to a link21:06
eccerr0rI use my n900 with openvpn, it works just fine "out of the box"21:06
db9jI have a VPN running in my router but the n900 wont work over it21:07
eccerr0r"out of the box" as in, installing the client :\21:07
db9jI have tried tun and tap21:07
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db9jI have a VPN running in my router but the n900 wont work over itvpn21:08
db9jI have a VPN running in my router but the n900 wont work over the vpn21:08
sixwheeledbeastthere's a parrot in here? ;)21:08
db9jie it does not connect to free switch21:09
db9jmaybe I am not explaining myself well21:09
Sicelowhat type of vpn you have?21:09
Estel_sixwheeledbeast,  why made infobit forget, it was actually great ;)21:09
eccerr0rthe thing is I know my vpn works (my vpn server is my server box, not my router) so I don't have two variables to deal with...21:09
Estel_better than half maemo factoids21:10
Estel_anyway, grrr, it's awesome how hard it may be to get usb port from N90021:10
db9jI have at the moment a tap vpn running inside my router21:10
Estel_when it isn't supposed to stay21:10
Estel_this one on dead motherboard looks like could survive spinning around head, hanging on cable21:10
Estel_even bashing someone with it, afterwards21:11
Estel_haven't even moved half milimeter, despite my efforts21:11
db9jbut the n900 will not connect to the freeswitch inside the vpn21:11
* Estel_ is going back for another try21:11
infobotVirtual Private Network package for Linux. URL:
sixwheeledbeastno useful21:11
Sicelodb9j: you other devices can connect?21:13
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db9jI can connect a few softphones the the freeswitch running in this netbook without a problem21:14
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db9j/s/the/ ruuning21:14
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db9jgrrr running21:14
db9jthis is a very small keyboard I make mistakes on it21:15
db9jI can use the n900 to connect to the freeswitch without vpn21:16
Sicelowell.. i still didn't hear what type of vpn you have.. anyway, you most likely need to install pppd for one21:16
db9jbut when vpn is running in the n900 it wont connect21:16
db9jSicelo, I said it was a tap21:17
db9jbut I have also tried tun21:17
db9junless you mean something else21:17
eccerr0rtap/tun is the kernel providing a fake interface21:17
eccerr0rit's not vpn21:18
eccerr0rit's also used for virtual machines, so that's what's confusing us21:18
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db9jwell as far as understood there is either a tap or a tun type vpn21:19
eccerr0rwell, virtual machines can also use a tap type or tun type network interface to access the network and they don't need vpn.21:19
db9jbut neither allow the n900 to connect to the sip21:19
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db9jeccerr0r, but I wanted to ask about the vpn problem I have21:20
eccerr0rvpn needs software, the tun/tap is how the software provides a seamless interface to the network.21:20
Estel_just tried to get this port by plugging i cable, and, while heating, bend it so much to get port off21:21
eccerr0rI use OpenVPN.  It uses the tun interface.  There are other VPN softwares out there that use other methods of networking, that's why we're confused of what you're doing.21:21
db9jis there anyone here who connects to sip when in a vpn on the n900?21:22
eccerr0ragain what VPN are you using? pptp? openvpn? cisco?21:22
Estel_guess what, pcb bend, cable plug bend permanently...21:22
Estel_usb port on N900's motherboard still stays where it stayed21:22
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Estel_who said nokia haven't made those ports robust?21:24
Sicelono one21:25
sixwheeledbeastwho said nokia made them ports?21:25
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Estel_yea, it's kesingston lock21:27
Estel_finally have it - took it out with 3 layers of pcb sticked to it21:27
Estel_idk, maybe someone glued it, too, before soldering21:27
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Sicelodb9j: find out what vpn your outer uses.. telnetting into it might help you find that.. or google.. noly then will you know how to connect N900 to it. i can say that your N900 is very likely to work with whatever is in there21:29
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db9jI already know that because i compiled all the firmware21:30
db9jits openvpn21:30
Siceloformware for what?21:30
db9jthe vpn works ok21:30
db9jI compiled the firmware and flashed my router21:31
db9jand setup the vpn21:31
db9jwhich works very well21:31
db9jbut the n900 will not connect to the sip when its running in the vpn21:32
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Siceloso N900 connects to the VPN for 'general connectivity'?21:32
db9jthe freeswitch is running in another dockstar which I have also flashed with new firmware21:32
db9jyes the vpn works for most things and interestingly I can ping the LAN on the dockstar from my n900 when the vpn is running21:34
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db9jbut its just this problem of the sip not being able to connect21:34
db9jif I connect the n900 without vpn to my own wifi then it all works21:35
sixwheeledbeastand only the N900 doesn't work?21:36
db9jI have set up freeswitch so if I dial a local number on my landline it gets sent over wifi to my n90021:36
db9jin a sip call21:37
sixwheeledbeastyeah, mm21:37
db9jit all works except for whenI want to use a vpn21:37
db9jyou can get free pots numbers in the uk and elsewhere21:38
db9janyway it sounds like no one here has done this21:38
db9jI leave it for now and go and do some more fiddling about with it21:39
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clownishcan somebody briefly explain to me why it is not possible to update the kernel of the n900 to a more recent version > 2.6.28?22:08
RST38hbecause the n900 kernel has been customized for n900 specific power management and many other system parts depend on it?22:09
Estel_clownish,  it's nit like it's 2.6.28 anymore, if you're using KP22:11
Estel_considering how many patches were backported, it's hard to call it 2.6.2822:11
Estel_btw, it is possible to use 3+ kernel on N900, arch project does that22:12
Estel_but it is not for maemo (but for N900)22:12
Estel_wish me luck, starting to try re-soldering usb port22:12
Estel_no matter how many times one did it, it's always hard22:13
Estel_and risky22:13
clownishEstel_: so there are closed-source kernel-modules which can not be recompiled for newer kernels, and thats why one is forced to stay with 2.6.28?22:14
Estel_not modules, afaik22:16
Estel_ask kernel specialists, but as I get it it's about blobs - firmwares for hardware...22:17
Estel_dmce and friends22:17
clownishEstel_: thanks for your answers, is there some more documentation on this topic somewhere?22:24
sixwheeledbeastalopex looks interesting, hope to try it in the near-future, when it won't rape my rootfs.22:26
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: do you have SB?22:27
freemangordonwget xulrunner .deb there and execute maemo-optify-deb against it22:28
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: that way your rootfs will remain virgin22:28
sixwheeledbeastmmm, I may try that.22:29
qwazix_sixwheeledbeast, or you can wait and I'll upload an optified one22:37
sixwheeledbeastk that sound like a good idea, as I was going to ask how to "run maemo-optify-deb" :o22:39
qwazix_sixwheeledbeast, ready, new package is now optified22:40
sixwheeledbeastsame location?22:40
qwazix_only xulrunner, but that's the bulk of it. Next upload I'll optify the app too.22:40
qwazix_same location, new name22:40
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keriowhat's alopex?22:43
sixwheeledbeastembedlite qml browser for thumb22:43
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sixwheeledbeastinfobot: alopex is
infobotsixwheeledbeast: okay22:44
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keriowill this use browserd for rendering?22:48
kerioaw fuck it's qt isn't it22:51
kerioit's something that ignores xkb for text input22:52
freemangordonkerio: well, UI is Qt22:52
freemangordonbut the engine is not22:52
kerioit scrolls smoothly22:54
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sixwheeledbeastcan't seem to get alopex swipe bits working, stuck on splash page.23:06
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: yep it is tricky23:07
freemangordonuse your nail23:08
sixwheeledbeastnope sigfault23:08
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: are you on cssu-thumb?23:09
freemangordonwith latest Qt from the repo installed?23:09
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sixwheeledbeastXPCOMGlueload error back again, yep this is the Devel+Thumb device23:09
freemangordonsixwheeledbeast: well, report it to qwazix23:10
sixwheeledbeastqwazix ^^^23:12
qwazix_noted, not that I am sure I can reproduce, but I'll try23:12
sixwheeledbeastI maybe missing a dependency had this with fennec IIRC23:13
qwazix_Time to walk steadily away from pc.23:14
* qwazix_ waves23:14
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sixwheeledbeastreinstalled xulrunner-opt no problems now.23:22
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* sixwheeledbeast slowly masters the fingernail swipe action.23:30
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Maceranybody try the newer ubuntu interface?23:36
Macerwas wondering if it was lame?23:36
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sixwheeledbeastMacer: UI?23:38
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Maceri know they ditched gnome23:50
Macerin favor of something else?23:50
Macerforgot the name.. i haven't kept up much23:51
Maceryeah there it is23:51
Macerdon't know it looked kind of neat in the videos :)23:51
sixwheeledbeastafter a week of both unity and then gnome 3, I did gnome-fallback, not keen23:53
Maceri usually just use kde23:56
sixwheeledbeastgave them both a try no the last LTS23:56
Macerbut i was going to try to get some conformity going on now that i have scannr that works with sane23:56
Macerthe need for windows was only because of my lumia 900 and my scanning needs23:56
Macerother than that windows is worthless.. now that i have an e7 and a supported scanner23:56
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