| szopin | wait, let me google a bit | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| jacekowski | x86 phone sounds like power hog | 00:00 |
| RST38h | szopin: looks and feels like a regular Android 2.x phone | 00:00 |
| szopin | but at least t x86 phones were produced | 00:00 |
| kerio | your init is emacs, your shell is emacs, your terminal is emacs, your window manager is emacs, your userland is emacs | 00:00 |
| RST38h | szopin: kind of ugly and outdated, but not terminally so | 00:00 |
| szopin | one with android | 00:00 |
| ds3 | but you get a free hand warmer with every x86 phone | 00:00 |
| szopin | at least two* | 00:00 |
| RST38h | szopin: it does warm up, no, it does not burn your fingers | 00:00 |
| qwazix | Bad thing with x86 phones is they don't have desktop graphics | 00:00 |
| qwazix | So can't just install debian on them | 00:00 |
| RST38h | Price for an Intel-based ZTE phone in Russia was like $500, and it ran Android 2.x | 00:00 |
| qwazix | still need blob drivers | 00:01 |
| RST38h | So, you can probably imagine the level of enthusiasm | 00:01 |
| szopin | but x86 so you could run anything on it without worrying about arm recompilation | 00:01 |
| RST38h | run what on it? | 00:01 |
| RST38h | every android package iscompiled for arm | 00:01 |
| szopin | even if they lasted 4h | 00:01 |
| jacekowski | RST38h: android packages are dalvik | 00:01 |
| jacekowski | RST38h: platform independed | 00:02 |
| jacekowski | independent* | 00:02 |
| szopin | android has i386 version of repo like maemo I believe | 00:02 |
| RST38h | jacekowski: ok, every android package containing native code is compiled for arm | 00:02 |
| ds3 | except for those with native code | 00:02 |
| RST38h | which are the only interesting ones to be honest | 00:02 |
| APTX | is there some working japanese ime for n900? | 00:03 |
| szopin | is it possible to get x86 maemo running on one of those? | 00:03 |
| ds3 | would be interesting to have an ARM tablet with a slave x86 processor | 00:03 |
| RST38h | szopin: No point | 00:03 |
| szopin | a lot of points | 00:03 |
| RST38h | ds3: also no point | 00:03 |
| szopin | have another platform to continue | 00:03 |
| RST38h | continue what? | 00:03 |
| ds3 | RST38h: why would you argue that? | 00:04 |
| szopin | development | 00:04 |
| *** npm_ is now known as npm | 00:04 | |
| RST38h | what development?there is no x86-based native development for android | 00:04 |
| szopin | there has to be | 00:04 |
| ds3 | the x86 slave would be for running legacy apps | 00:04 |
| RST38h | ds3: Modern ARMs handle things just fine | 00:04 |
| szopin | or else x86 android phone would be nonexistant | 00:04 |
| szopin | yet it does exist | 00:04 |
| RST38h | ds3: There are nolegacy x86 apps for Android | 00:04 |
| ds3 | RST38h: you mean emulation of x86? | 00:05 |
| szopin | The thing is soon batteries will make arm/x86 distinction irrelevant | 00:05 |
| RST38h | ds3: I mean that there is no place for x86 on Android | 00:05 |
| ds3 | not Android apps... just legacy x86 apps...say DOS based..a faster, lower power version of dosbox | 00:05 |
| szopin | there is x86 android | 00:05 |
| RST38h | ds3: If you think there is a place, you should provide a bit better argument than "run MSDOS" | 00:05 |
| ds3 | Android lacks useful apps. | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Because nobody needs to run MSDOS any more | 00:05 |
| szopin | indeed | 00:05 |
| ds3 | to make an Android device useable, you have to shoe horn in a real Linux userland | 00:06 |
| RST38h | and that requires x86 why? | 00:06 |
| ds3 | @;2R#$@!#$@$#@!$!#@ binary only apps | 00:06 |
| szopin | they cherish the fact that for music dev they use 20 apps! Yay, we have 20 apps, does anyone using x86 need to run 20 slimware apps? | 00:06 |
| szopin | No, they use 2-3 full featured apps | 00:06 |
| RST38h | ds3: what binary only apps? name a few | 00:06 |
| szopin | Which is going to kill arm as soon as batteries allow x86 code execution for 24( a day | 00:07 |
| ds3 | let see... | 00:07 |
| ds3 | the few CAD ports to Linux for one | 00:07 |
| RST38h | And you want to run commercial binary-only Linux CAD on your Android phone? | 00:07 |
| ds3 | windows apps via Wine is another entire class | 00:07 |
| ds3 | yes.. as a viewer mostly | 00:07 |
| szopin | wine on arm is bs | 00:07 |
| RST38h | You do understand that phone x86s are kinda weak? | 00:07 |
| qwazix | RST38h, there's a big point IMO. If we get intel graphics it's just a pc in the pocket, do whatever you want with it, not struggling with a bunch of undocumented, non-free blobs | 00:07 |
| ds3 | i.e. eagle | 00:07 |
| RST38h | qwazix: You really WANT IGD? | 00:08 |
| szopin | qemu would be great, but only cmd line text only apps run | 00:08 |
| ds3 | the goal is not to run it fast. the goal is to be able to look at documents when you are on the move | 00:08 |
| RST38h | qwazix: Are you aware that many Intel SoCs use PowerVR for graphics? ;) | 00:08 |
| ds3 | and weak is relative | 00:08 |
| ds3 | x86 phones are at the least faster then any 286 PC systems for example | 00:08 |
| RST38h | Anyway, gentlemen, continue coming up with good ideas | 00:09 |
| qwazix | RST38h, I'm sitting right now on a i915 3~4yo laptop and linux graphics performance is better than my ati 4870 desktop | 00:09 |
| ds3 | faster then a 386SX system if you insist on Linux as a base line | 00:09 |
| ds3 | the point of a slave x86 there is it can be frozen/shutdown when not needed | 00:09 |
| qwazix | (I suppose due to drivers, what else can it be) | 00:09 |
| * RST38h weeps | 00:09 | |
| RST38h | If you only knew... | 00:09 |
| qwazix | regarding powervr that's why I said *if* we get intel graphics | 00:09 |
| szopin | MS aims for exactly that, android market is impressive with fart apps. Once tech gets to support x86 apps, who's going to remember their "remove red color from eyes" app when you can use full photoshop | 00:10 |
| qwazix | RST38h, what is that I should know? | 00:10 |
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| szopin | http://www.extremetech.com/computing/127347-going-xolo-x900-intels-first-x86-medfield-smartphone-reviewed | 00:12 |
| M4rtinK | any success with the autobuilder ? :) | 00:13 |
| szopin | As long as android/iOS market is going to provide half-assed apps (forever even with octo-core) win is going to have a comeback | 00:13 |
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| szopin | and linux while we're at it | 00:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | M4rtinK: should work | 00:14 |
| M4rtinK | DocScrutinizer05: SSH or Web interface ? | 00:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dunno | 00:16 |
| M4rtinK | DocScrutinizer05: still getting key error on SSH | 00:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | umm, that's fixable | 00:16 |
| M4rtinK | will try Web next | 00:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | usually users add the machine@domain ending to their ssh key | 00:17 |
| M4rtinK | (I was getting that key error even before migration when others reported it was working for them) | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which breaks stuff for sftp iirc | 00:17 |
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| M4rtinK | I've checked for that :) | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I had same problem back when. x-fade fixed it | 00:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I heard same problem reports from many other users | 00:19 |
| M4rtinK | so a stuck key ? | 00:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | must depend on type of key, or on the way it gets entered first time | 00:19 |
| M4rtinK | yeah, if it gets broken if you depend a wrong key first time | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, afaik it's a very standard unix account, and sysops can fix it for users | 00:20 |
| M4rtinK | that would be possible | 00:20 |
| M4rtinK | not sure anymore what I've entered first | 00:20 |
| M4rtinK | so who should I ping about it ? | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mompls | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what's your username? | 00:21 |
| M4rtinK | Login Name: martink | 00:21 |
| M4rtinK | is that it ? | 00:21 |
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| szopin | hunter2 | 00:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | M4rtinK: see /query | 00:25 |
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| szopin | aap: please tell if you need testers, compilers, whatevs. Freemantle is the goal | 00:58 |
| szopin | btw did anyone try latestg eglibc with marmistrz's developments? | 01:02 |
| szopin | assuming all (with locale) is working some harmattan only apps could work without crying libglibc incompatibility | 01:03 |
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| szopin | AapoRantalainen: garbage collectors are important | 01:09 |
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| szopin | I hope AapoRantalainen is going to join us very soon, he's definitely here with his heart | 01:18 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ping: M4rtinK | 01:19 |
| M4rtinK | sixwheeledbeast: yep ? :) | 01:19 |
| sixwheeledbeast | autobuilder? | 01:19 |
| M4rtinK | yeah | 01:19 |
| sixwheeledbeast | you got it working, web or scp? | 01:20 |
| szopin | scp | 01:20 |
| sixwheeledbeast | scp key error for me | 01:20 |
| szopin | web then | 01:20 |
| M4rtinK | web interface seems to just swallow packages without trace | 01:20 |
| sixwheeledbeast | nothing on web | 01:20 |
| szopin | scp?? | 01:21 |
| M4rtinK | and I'm trying to debug the key error with Doc right now | 01:21 |
| sixwheeledbeast | M4rtinK: agreed | 01:21 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | kk cool | 01:21 |
| M4rtinK | but no luck so far :) | 01:21 |
| sixwheeledbeast | oh | 01:21 |
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| szopin | would web rebuilt make sense? | 01:23 |
| M4rtinK | what do you mean ? | 01:23 |
| sixwheeledbeast | szopin: eh? | 01:23 |
| szopin | web swallows without trave - end quote | 01:24 |
| szopin | v*c | 01:24 |
| sixwheeledbeast | web iface is broken due to new python was assume - reported 6 months ago | 01:25 |
| szopin | python? | 01:25 |
| sixwheeledbeast | s/was/I/ | 01:25 |
| infobot | sixwheeledbeast meant: web iface is broken due to new python I assume - reported 6 months ago | 01:25 |
| szopin | what has it go to do with it??? | 01:25 |
| sixwheeledbeast | szopin: script to run builder | 01:26 |
| sixwheeledbeast | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1293858&postcount=17 | 01:26 |
| szopin | You mean like deb to build debs? Already done in maemo :D | 01:27 |
| szopin | We have everything needed | 01:27 |
| szopin | Maemo is fully full really full distro | 01:27 |
| szopin | just check the number of *-dev, crazy | 01:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | pali has record in drop://etc/passwd, sixwheeledbeast and M4rtinK have none | 01:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | errrr, drop==vcs | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if that helps for anything | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | while drop!=garage | 01:33 |
| sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: what about ade and Marxian? | 01:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | user account names? | 01:33 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | adek and marxian me thinks | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | adek ack | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | marxian ack | 01:35 |
| sixwheeledbeast | mmm they both can upload no probs | 01:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry guys I got nfc how user accounts get created on drop/vcs | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | total 108 | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwxr-xr-x 8 pali users 4096 Mar 12 23:12 ./ | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwxr-xr-x 3156 www-data rambo 69632 Mar 14 21:30 ../ | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | -rw------- 1 pali rambo 259 Mar 12 23:13 .bash_history | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 3 pali rambo 4096 Mar 12 23:11 .cache/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 3 pali rambo 4096 Mar 12 23:11 .config/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 3 pali rambo 4096 Mar 12 23:11 .local/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 2 www-data www-data 4096 Mar 31 2010 private/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 2 pali users 4096 May 14 2010 .ssh/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | drwx------ 2 www-data www-data 4096 Mar 31 2010 www/ | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | -rw------- 1 pali gforge 59 Jan 24 13:13 .Xauthority | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | . | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | o.O | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there's quite obviously more to it than a simple useradd | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | pali:x:1701:1004::/var/www/homedirs/users/p/pali:/usr/local/bin/svngitsh.pl | 01:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if that give someone thoughts | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | particularly svngitsh.pl | 01:39 |
| M4rtinK | does it work for pali BTW ? | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I think it does | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | he uploaded KP | 01:39 |
| M4rtinK | OK | 01:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I never created a git account on maemo | 01:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | maybe there's ajob called by rambo doing all that foo for garage, vcs, whatnot else | 01:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | when your application as developer gets accepted | 01:41 |
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| M4rtinK | IIRC there indeed was some delay between registering | 01:42 |
| M4rtinK | and actually getting the account | 01:42 |
| sixwheeledbeast | yep 24-48 hours IIRC | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry guys I'm out. I'm admin coordinator, not garage admin. Lack of knowhow | 01:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'll ask rambo how nemein did it, tomorrow | 01:43 |
| sixwheeledbeast | k, np, thanks for trying. | 01:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure thing | 01:43 |
| M4rtinK | thanks ! :) | 01:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | at least we know the culprit now | 01:44 |
| M4rtinK | I'm just glade things are moving :) | 01:44 |
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| M4rtinK | yep | 01:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | please check http://vcs.maemo.org/homedirs/users/ if you got a proper account (or at least a homedir) on vcs/drop or not | 01:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://vcs.maemo.org/homedirs/users/p/pali/ | 01:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what been the recommended SOP to ask for a developer account on maemo? | 02:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wasn't there a web frontend or sth? | 02:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | M4rtinK: ^^^ | 02:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: ^^^ | 02:02 |
| sixwheeledbeast | https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php?target=invitation_request | 02:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ta | 02:02 |
| sixwheeledbeast | was looking for page ;) | 02:03 |
| sixwheeledbeast | http://wiki.maemo.org/Uploading_to_Extras-devel | 02:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | yep, garagre. As expected | 02:04 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I have a homedir and so does "martink" | 02:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | [x] "I am a spammer" | 02:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | LOL | 02:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | theheck | 02:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | now you got even a very unique homedir ;-) | 02:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | beats me how you can have a homedir but no record in passwd | 02:13 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | "greeting from your ..." lol | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but hey, maybe you don't even need a record in etc/passwd? | 02:14 |
| sixwheeledbeast | but all that can upload seem to have one, no? | 02:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | -rw------- 1 11063 users 448 Mar 16 00:15 authorized_keys2 | 02:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | root@vcs:/var/www/homedirs/users/m/martink/.ssh# | 02:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | yep | 02:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I guess sshd isn't happy without | 02:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | guess what? I brute force create an entry for you now | 02:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ntp:x:105:108::/home/ntp:/bin/false | 02:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast:x:30404:1004:,,,:/var/www/homedirs/users/s/sixwheeledbeast:/usr/local/bin/svngitsh.pl | 02:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (END) | 02:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | retry please! | 02:22 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Permission denied (publickey). | 02:23 |
| sixwheeledbeast | lost connection | 02:23 |
| sixwheeledbeast | do I need a new key? | 02:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: also make a fat huge postit-note saying "joerg hacked etc/passwd on vcs!" | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: sorry, user numID not matching | 02:27 |
| sixwheeledbeast | k | 02:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mompls | 02:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | -rw------- 1 11430 users 448 Mar 16 00:15 authorized_keys2 | 02:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast:x:30404:1004: | 02:27 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 now wonders who will be user 11430 in passwd | 02:28 | |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast:x:11430:1004:,,,:/var/www/homedirs/users/s/sixwheeledbeast:/usr/local/bin/svngitsh.pl | 02:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | retry please! | 02:30 |
| sixwheeledbeast | :) | 02:30 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I think it worked | 02:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) | 02:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nothing can withstand brute force | 02:30 |
| sixwheeledbeast | a few perl warnings | 02:31 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | can't set locale, please check locale | 02:32 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | M4rtinK: ^^^ :) | 02:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | martink:x:11063:1004:,,,:/var/www/homedirs/users/m/martink:/usr/local/bin/svngitsh.pl | 02:33 |
| M4rtinK | nice ! I'll try it out | 02:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | seen the "can't set locale, please check locale" in succeding builds as well | 02:35 |
| sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: is it a problme? | 02:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | \_o_/ | 02:36 |
| sixwheeledbeast | s/problme?/problem?/ | 02:36 |
| infobot | sixwheeledbeast meant: DocScrutinizer05: is it a problem? | 02:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | is it? | 02:36 |
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| * sixwheeledbeast shrugs | 02:37 | |
| * sixwheeledbeast stares at the builder queue in hope | 02:40 | |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | builder gets started once per hour, or so | 02:49 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ok, thanks all lot Joerg. | 02:51 |
| sixwheeledbeast | alot* | 02:51 |
| sixwheeledbeast | will check it out in the morning | 02:52 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | gn | 02:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | night sixwheeledbeast | 02:56 |
| sixwheeledbeast | :) thanks again | 02:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-15 18:17:10] <jacekowski> anyways | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-15 18:17:13] <jacekowski> time go finish crons | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-15 20:15:33] <jacekowski> starting cron on www | 02:58 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, sorry for bothering - I have unusual question, what does *not* work re maemo infra? | 03:23 |
| Estel_ | I think we hit time, that it is easier to list what does not work (less), than what does work (morej :) | 03:24 |
| Estel_ | s/(morej/more/ | 03:24 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: I think we hit time, that it is easier to list what does not work (less), than what does work more :) | 03:24 |
| Estel_ | (more) even | 03:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | login on maemo.org/* is broken | 03:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | user history on wiki is defect | 03:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | karma doesn't calculate correctly | 03:27 |
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| Estel_ | + no latest cssu in new repos as opposed to mirrors, but that is not infra problem. That pretty sums it up? | 03:35 |
| Estel_ | what about karma re upcoming council election? | 03:35 |
| Estel_ | i.e. any plans, eta, or we just count on someone from nemein? | 03:36 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski, szopin, exact same question (why we need two bodies). I don't buy Woody14619's explanation, IMO without at least head of tech staff being part of Board (to have impact on decisions from someone knowledgeable, but also to share legal consequences), we will always have powerz wars | 03:37 |
| Estel_ | Having Council becoming automagically board could work too, but even having one (technical) representant from Vouncil in board should help a lot | 03:38 |
| Estel_ | IMHO, of course, with mark on "Humble" | 03:38 |
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| Estel_ | hm, so I think it's time to switch from mirrors to repos, except for CSSU... *fanfares* | 03:42 |
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| wxcafe | hi | 05:21 |
| wxcafe | i'm having a problem on my nokia n900 | 05:21 |
| wxcafe | i'd like to get a recovery shell. or at least be able to mount the rootfs | 05:22 |
| wxcafe | it there a way to do that while on "usb recovery mode"? | 05:22 |
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| jon_y | wxcafe: try rescueOS | 06:15 |
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| Estel_ | wxcafe, define usb recovery mode | 06:47 |
| Estel_ | as for recovery shell, there is such package for kernel-power (or any kernel with fbcon), there is Mentalist Traceur's recovery shell (preffered, as it works with all boots on earth - bootmenu, multiboot, backupmenu, whatever) | 06:52 |
| Estel_ | there is recovery shell bundled inside backupmenu | 06:53 |
| Estel_ | for example, for "regular" recovery purposes, I use backupmenu's recovery shell, as more things are mounted and defined at that time | 06:54 |
| Estel_ | in case of failure that doesn't even allow to boot into backupmenu, I still have mentalist's method, that invoke shell from beginning of preinit | 06:55 |
| Estel_ | (I modified it to have 1 sec timeframe for pressing any key during boot, so it doesn't slow down regular booting, but still allow getting into shell by bashing whatever at beginning of boot, if we want to get it) | 06:56 |
| Estel_ | there is also usb networking and ssh and usb console from backupmenu (require external desktop), but it is broken since a 1.5 year or so | 06:57 |
| Estel_ | ~spank robbiethe1st | 06:57 |
| * infobot bends robbiethe1st over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on robbiethe1st's pasty white buttocks. | 06:57 | |
| Estel_ | so none of those 3 backupmenu functions actually work | 06:58 |
| Estel_ | s | 06:58 |
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| Psi__ | is there any more info on overclocking failure rates now that ppl have had their phones for many years? | 07:14 |
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| Psi__ | i sometimes run mine at 850 but it does tend to get quite warm if at 100% cpu | 07:15 |
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| Creteil | Hi all | 07:23 |
| Psi__ | warning, unknown user detected in channel | 07:24 |
| Psi__ | lol | 07:24 |
| Psi__ | sorry, ive had too much sugar | 07:25 |
| Psi__ | i will go away | 07:25 |
| Creteil | Is there someone here know why many of my packages can't be build under the new maemo-builder ? | 07:25 |
| Creteil | Is it the right channel to ask this question ? | 07:27 |
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| thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: infobot dead ;) | 07:35 |
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| dima` | Does anybody have a copy of the flasher utility for debian that I can get? Nokia's site is down apparently | 07:39 |
| thedead1440 | dima`: skeiron.org/tablets-dev is the replica | 07:41 |
| dima` | thedead1440: aha. thanks very much. | 07:42 |
| thedead1440 | np | 07:42 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | moaning | 09:08 |
| thedead1440 | good moaning to you too :p | 09:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~status | 09:12 |
| ibot | Since Tue Mar 12 09:21:00 2013, there have been 6 modifications, 159 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 85 commands. I have been awake for 3d 21h 51m 5s this session, and currently reference 118992 factoids. I'm using about 24072 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 1099.62/20.2 child 0/0 | 09:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~die | 09:12 |
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| infobot | DocScrutinizer: infobot joined! | 09:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~chaninfo | 09:13 |
| infobot | 110/124 channels, 4495 users, 3280 unique: #debian/1230, #kde/380, #maemo/251, #gsoc/228, #asterisk/186, #wowuidev/136, #meego/128, #oe/124, #arm-netbook/123, #harmattan/122, #wowace/108, #cubieboard/101, #utah/78, #openmoko/77, #bzflag/68, #openmoko-cdevel/67, #tomcat/62, #edev/55, #maemo-ssu/53, #uclibc/51, #asterisk-dev/46, #sc2mapster/43, #htc-linux/43, #/42, #n9/41, #curseforge/39, #slug/35, #gllug/33, #uphpu/32, #elinux/29, ##kierra/28, ... | 09:13 |
| luf | DocScrutinizer05: you're so cruel :D | 09:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~chaninfo | 09:15 |
| infobot | 124/124 channels, 4734 users, 3399 unique: #debian/1230, #kde/380, #maemo/251, #gsoc/228, #asterisk/186, #wowuidev/136, #meego/128, #oe/124, #arm-netbook/123, #harmattan/122, #wowace/108, #cubieboard/101, #wowhead/86, #webos-internals/85, #utah/78, #openmoko/77, #bzflag/68, #openmoko-cdevel/67, #tomcat/62, #edev/55, #maemo-ssu/53, #uclibc/51, #asterisk-dev/46, #sc2mapster/43, #htc-linux/43, #/42, #n9/41, #curseforge/39, #slug/35, #gllug/33, ... | 09:15 |
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| dima` | A question. My N900 wasn't booting, so I reflashed it after everything else failed. The device boots. I see nothing in /dev/mmc*. 'dmesg' doesn't say anything, but I suspect its history is too short. Anybody know how to see if the NAND is dead? Any easy ways to boost the dmesg buffer? | 10:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | if the NAND was dead, it wouldn't boot. I guess you're worried about eMMC | 10:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | system wouldn't come up properly without eMMC either, since no swap and no /home(/opt) | 10:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what do you mean by "I see nothing in /dev/mmc*" ? | 10:17 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 smells pebkac | 10:17 | |
| sixwheeledbeast | :( no packages | 10:21 |
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| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: it boots, but there's /home | 10:26 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: /home is simply a subdirectory of /, which isn't on the eMMC | 10:27 |
| dima` | the /etc/fstab has just the rootfs entry | 10:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mount | 10:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fstab is moot | 10:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or df -h | 10:27 |
| dima` | Sure. mount doesn't list /home or /opt | 10:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's not nice | 10:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | reflash full | 10:28 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: This is a new reflash | 10:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | incl eMMC/VANILLA | 10:28 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: No, just the COMBINED | 10:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | eh? | 10:29 |
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| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: are you asking about what got reflashed? | 10:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I suggest something, you answer "No"? | 10:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | oh, no this wasn't a question | 10:30 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: Oh, that's wasn't a question. Got it | 10:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it was an advice | 10:30 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: Does it make sense to you that reflashing the eMMC would fix it? The kernel isn't seeing any device nodes in /dev/, so reflashing the data those nodes would refer to shouldn't matter, right? | 10:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, yes and no | 10:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, your rationale has a point for sure. And no, since you got no other options | 10:32 |
| dima` | DocScrutinizer05: Fair enough. Thanks | 10:33 |
| kerio | reflashing emmc without flashing the rootfs will make things asplode | 10:33 |
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| dima` | OK. Good to know, thanks | 10:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: nobody suggested to do so | 10:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~flashing | 10:33 |
| infobot | maemo-flashing is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 10:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | and, for tools and images: | 10:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~skeiron | 10:34 |
| infobot | it has been said that skeiron is the semi-official backup and emergency standin for all internet borne maemo resources: http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/ http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1315143#post1315143 | 10:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | M4rtinK: checked builder stuff? | 12:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-16 10:52:27] <jacekowski> stopping cron for a moment | 12:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-16 10:55:03] <jacekowski> i've moved all those fetch-extras* jobs into one job and added some locking | 12:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-16 10:55:19] <jacekowski> so in total you get one run per hour in worst case | 12:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://monitor.maemo.org/ganglia/graph_all_periods.php?h=www&m=load_one&r=4hr&s=by%20name&hc=4&mc=2&st=1363428044&g=mem_report&z=large&c=maemo | 12:46 |
| sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: my two packages are being swallowed up still :( | 12:48 |
| sixwheeledbeast | uploaded twice now | 12:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jacekowski: ^^^ could you have a look? | 12:48 |
| sixwheeledbeast | thank you | 12:48 |
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| jacekowski | sixwheeledbeast: what is the package name? | 12:58 |
| sixwheeledbeast | jacekowski: "flopswap" "tenminutecore" | 12:58 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | tenminutecore is a new version 0.0.7 flopswap is a new pkg completely | 12:59 |
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| jacekowski | KeyError'>: 'getpwuid(): uid not found: 11430' | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fuuuuu*k | 13:00 |
| sixwheeledbeast | that sounds like my uid from last night? | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, it is | 13:01 |
| jacekowski | what's your username? | 13:01 |
| sixwheeledbeast | sixwheeledbeast | 13:01 |
| jacekowski | sixwheeledbeast:x:11430:1004:,,,:/var/www/homedirs/users/s/sixwheeledbeast:/usr/local/bin/svngitsh.pl | 13:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jacekowski: sixwheeledbeast and M4rtinK had no record in vcs//etc/passwd | 13:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I added that brute force last night | 13:02 |
| jacekowski | that could explain some things | 13:02 |
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| sardini | hello there | 13:18 |
| sixwheeledbeast | o/ | 13:23 |
| wxcafe | hmm, i'm back | 13:26 |
| wxcafe | sorry if i missed something | 13:26 |
| wxcafe | so, anyone having a clue how to access a rescue shell or the filesystem? | 13:27 |
| kerio | be more specific | 13:29 |
| M4rtinK | DocScrutinizer05: the modRana package I submitted through SCP last night seems to have been built :) | 13:30 |
| wxcafe | well, i'd like to get something like a shell on the device | 13:30 |
| wxcafe | or being able to mount the rootfs on my desktop | 13:31 |
| Hurrian | wxcafe: did you brick your device? | 13:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 13:31 |
| kerio | mounting the rootfs on your desktop is kinda impossible, except via network mounts | 13:31 |
| kerio | because it's a mtd, and you can't export that | 13:31 |
| wxcafe | Hurrian: it boots to the "usb recovery" thing | 13:31 |
| kerio | ~rescueOS | 13:31 |
| infobot | from memory, rescue-os is http://206.253.166.96/N900/rescueOS/ | 13:31 |
| wxcafe | hmm, i don't get networking. | 13:31 |
| wxcafe | the thing doesn't boot | 13:31 |
| kerio | wxcafe: load rescueOS from ram via the flasher | 13:32 |
| kerio | it's pretty much what you want | 13:32 |
| kerio | it gives you a shell on-device | 13:32 |
| kerio | with usb networking, telnet and ftp if you want | 13:32 |
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| kerio | or mass storage, but mass storage only works for the eMMC | 13:32 |
| wxcafe | kerio: so i do a flasher -F rescueos.img -f and then i just boot? | 13:32 |
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| kerio | wxcafe: read the documentation | 13:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 13:32 |
| kerio | and most definetely not -f | 13:33 |
| wxcafe | oh yeah, right, it's in there | 13:33 |
| wxcafe | thanks! | 13:33 |
| kerio | it's loaded from ram | 13:33 |
| wxcafe | well i don't quite master the flasher tool uet | 13:33 |
| wxcafe | yet* | 13:33 |
| kerio | you can also load it from uboot | 13:33 |
| wxcafe | to tell you everything, i got the phone 3 days ago | 13:34 |
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| Hurrian | wxcafe: just place the files somewhere, run the flasher with the specified command line, and it'll boot straight into a shell. | 13:34 |
| kerio | so... why do you care? just reflash | 13:34 |
| wxcafe | kerio: because i don't like to get beaten by a phone | 13:34 |
| kerio | 3 days! | 13:34 |
| wxcafe | kerio: and i know what's wrong | 13:34 |
| kerio | ah, then ok | 13:34 |
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| wxcafe | well, i caused the problem :P | 13:35 |
| kerio | once your phone is back up and working, install backupmenu | 13:35 |
| kerio | it's good | 13:35 |
| wxcafe | i'll look into that | 13:35 |
| wxcafe | oh, btw | 13:35 |
| kerio | makes tarball of the full system | 13:35 |
| kerio | *tarballs | 13:35 |
| wxcafe | i get this key expired error on apt updates | 13:35 |
| kerio | and can restore them | 13:35 |
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| Hurrian | wxcafe: there should be a directory on / called RescueOS, you'd want to run "mount_maemo_root.sh". | 13:35 |
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| kerio | wxcafe: ignore it | 13:35 |
| kerio | it's not harmful and there's nothing you can do | 13:35 |
| wxcafe | kerio: oh, so there's no community-driven repo? | 13:36 |
| wxcafe | :/ | 13:36 |
| kerio | of course there is | 13:36 |
| kerio | but the key is expired on dmnc | 13:36 |
| wxcafe | hmm | 13:36 |
| kerio | oh and btw, install cssu-stable or cssu-testing at least | 13:36 |
| kerio | dmnc=downloads.maemo.nokia.com | 13:36 |
| wxcafe | there's that too | 13:36 |
| kerio | notice the second level domain | 13:36 |
| wxcafe | yeah i meant that there could be a copy of that repo, driven by the community | 13:37 |
| wxcafe | anyway | 13:37 |
| wxcafe | i also get this problem with qt | 13:37 |
| wxcafe | which won't install, because most apps ask for version 4.7git or something | 13:38 |
| kerio | have you installed cssu? | 13:38 |
| wxcafe | and the repo only has 4.5 or something | 13:38 |
| wxcafe | i can't, as it's asking for qt | 13:38 |
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| kerio | hm | 13:38 |
| kerio | i think you're lying, cssu-testing has libqt 1:4.7.4~git20110505+cssu7 | 13:39 |
| kerio | have you followed the cssu installation instructions? | 13:40 |
| wxcafe | alright, let me get my phone to boot again | 13:40 |
| wxcafe | and then we'll deal with the 'me lying about qt installation' part | 13:40 |
| wxcafe | if you don't mind :) | 13:40 |
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| wxcafe | but thanks for your help, all | 13:42 |
| Hurrian | wxcafe: there's a software update made by the Maemo community, which your device probably isn't running | 13:42 |
| wxcafe | it definitely isn't | 13:42 |
| Hurrian | well, lots of community-developed software packages are running on the assumption that you're using that update, so it might be best if you installed it once you get it up and running. | 13:43 |
| wxcafe | alright | 13:44 |
| wxcafe | yeah, i really have got to look into this more carefully | 13:44 |
| M4rtinK | yep, the PR 1.3 Qt is pretty broken | 13:44 |
| M4rtinK | for example, Qt Components don't work very well with it | 13:45 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | best solution for cleaning slide-tray, pre-main ribbon installation? | 13:48 |
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| jacekowski | sixwheeledbeast: did you get confirmation email from garage? | 13:49 |
| sixwheeledbeast | jacekowski: no nothing for months | 13:49 |
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| jacekowski | that sixwheeledbeast is a new account? | 13:50 |
| sixwheeledbeast | wait, do you mean ages ago | 13:50 |
| jacekowski | no | 13:50 |
| jacekowski | when you created that sixwheeledbeast account | 13:51 |
| Hurrian | sixwheeledbeast: canned air? | 13:51 |
| sixwheeledbeast | yes I asked for invitation to extras, waited 48 hours and confirmed email this was over 6 months ago | 13:51 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Hurrian: sticky adhesive | 13:52 |
| Hurrian | sixwheeledbeast: careful with plain clear tape though, it might make the surface itself sticky. | 13:52 |
| Hurrian | masking tape's a pretty safe option. | 13:53 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, I also have problem with autobuilder | 13:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | was hoping because nothing electrical and only alu, a rinse under tap would do | 13:53 |
| Estel_ | yesterday I uploaded new version of bnf, it seems to got uploaded via scp (no errors after asking for key) | 13:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | don't think there's grease in the slide mech. | 13:53 |
| Estel_ | yet, no sign of package anywhere | 13:53 |
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| Estel_ | i have checked packages.maemo.org, and no info about it in latest build, either failed or succeed | 13:54 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Estel_: same issue here. | 13:54 |
| Estel_ | just like it vanished | 13:54 |
| Estel_ | sixwheeledbeast, so your key wasnmt rejected, and failed silently? | 13:54 |
| Estel_ | i.e. scp succeed, but autobuilder rejected package without even trying to build? | 13:55 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | Doc fixed the key via brute force last night for both me and martink | 13:55 |
| Estel_ | I know | 13:55 |
| sixwheeledbeast | key works now | 13:55 |
| Estel_ | thats why I tyink if your same problem is about key (so my key could be wrong), or you mean problem now | 13:55 |
| M4rtinK | I SCPed modRana yesterday and today in the morning the package was build | 13:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | seems I did an incomplete job though | 13:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ask jacekowski | 13:55 |
| Estel_ | so, if I got no errors on scp, it may mean that my key is ok? | 13:56 |
| M4rtinK | IIRC, the autobuilder currently runs from a cronjob, not on demand | 13:56 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I think he's looking in to it | 13:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, autobuilder only runs via cronjob | 13:56 |
| Estel_ | M4rtinK, btw, why on repos there is newer version of modrana than in modrana cobs? :P | 13:56 |
| Estel_ | also, will migration of obs from meego.pub to mer cobs affect modrana cosb? | 13:56 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, ok, but how often cronjob runs? | 13:57 |
| M4rtinK | hmm, it should be the same | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ask jacekowski | 13:57 |
| Estel_ | won't it choke due to many packages at once? | 13:57 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski ^ | 13:57 |
| M4rtinK | Estel_: I will continue to use both (at least as long as COBS itself stays up) | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's a question that's not bothering users | 13:58 |
| Estel_ | they warned about meego.pub getting freezed soon | 13:58 |
| Estel_ | due to migration to mer.pub | 13:58 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, you lost me on that one | 13:58 |
| M4rtinK | Estel_: with COBS being something like a testing repo before pushing the package to Extras | 13:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if builder chokes, we'll take care | 13:58 |
| Estel_ | how many days should uploader wait for package to build, currently, before raising alarm that something is wrong? | 13:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | one | 13:59 |
| M4rtinK | Estel_: btw, any timeline for the COBS shutdown ? | 13:59 |
| Estel_ | well, it was question about rationale for running from cronjob vs on demand | 13:59 |
| Estel_ | M4rtinK, it was sent in mer mailing list, deleted that mail :/ | 13:59 |
| Estel_ | but all dates were there | 13:59 |
| Estel_ | and it's not shutdown as i understand it | 13:59 |
| M4rtinK | ok, I'll check out the archives | 13:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on demand it would run more often than via cronjob | 14:00 |
| jacekowski | sixwheeledbeast: https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php | 14:00 |
| jacekowski | sixwheeledbeast: when you go there, what does it say | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | we can't have concurrent builder jobs running | 14:00 |
| M4rtinK | still won't help much as I don't think the Mer OBS has the Harmattan target (which I'm using to build the Fremantle packages in COBS :) )? | 14:00 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, hm, on-demand + one package at once? | 14:00 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski, when cronjob runs autobuilder? | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, doesn't bother user | 14:01 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | jacekowski: you are logged in as sixwheeledbeast | 14:01 |
| Estel_ | I've uploaded package yesterday and no sign of it, either failure or succeed | 14:01 |
| sixwheeledbeast | jacekowski: move to step 2 | 14:01 |
| jacekowski | Estel_: every minute | 14:01 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, sure, but since when maemo technicals become top secret? :P | 14:01 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski, w00t? | 14:01 |
| M4rtinK | jacekowski: that should be fine | 14:01 |
| M4rtinK | jacekowski: that's basically on-demand :) | 14:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no secret, just no explainer-entertainer | 14:02 |
| wxcafe | hmm | 14:02 |
| wxcafe | battery is empty | 14:02 |
| wxcafe | it's going to take a bit longer than i expected | 14:02 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski, so should I already report to you that autobuilder doesn't work for me? sixwheeledbeast have same problem :P | 14:02 |
| wxcafe | (i'm charging it via my arduino) | 14:02 |
| Estel_ | M4rtinK, +1 | 14:02 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, you seem to talk like that when you have no clue about rationale :P *teasing* | 14:03 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Estel_: get it the queue :P | 14:03 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | s/it/in/ | 14:03 |
| infobot | sixwheeledbeast meant: Estel_: get in the queue :P | 14:03 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, you're becoming boring, get a life :P | 14:04 |
| Estel_ | sixwheeledbeast, don't mix it with autobuilder queye :P | 14:04 |
| Estel_ | s/queye/queue/ | 14:05 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: sixwheeledbeast, don't mix it with autobuilder queue :P | 14:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | congrats, you made it on my ignore list again | 14:06 |
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| Estel_ | I'm positively shaken and I don't know how I will live with it :( | 14:06 |
| Estel_ | jacekowski, so, going back into track, is it normal that there is no sign of package since yesterday, or should I be pestering you about it already? | 14:07 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ah .. packages in the build queue | 14:11 |
| sixwheeledbeast | my packages to be exact | 14:11 |
| Estel_ | hm | 14:11 |
| Estel_ | where have you checked it? | 14:11 |
| Estel_ | maybe I'm using wrong thing to monitor | 14:11 |
| sixwheeledbeast | https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php? | 14:12 |
| sixwheeledbeast | over on the right from 9 o clock this morning | 14:12 |
| Estel_ | thanks | 14:12 |
| sixwheeledbeast | they weren't there an hour ago | 14:12 |
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| bennypr0fane | Hello, I was wondering if I can install U-Boot and keep my power kernel 51 + CSSU Thumb! Does anyone have this setup? | 14:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you can't boot a thumbified system (userland and system programs) under a non-thombified kernel. So uBoot is mostly useless for you | 14:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | unless you want to boot into auxiliary system on eMMC or uSD, then the answer is yes, this works | 14:36 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, it will work for you | 14:37 |
| Estel_ | kp51 contain thumb patches | 14:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | however you need to install KP51 for your default system, and never boot it with default kernel that ships with uBoot | 14:37 |
| Estel_ | you just need to set uBoot to have kp as default kernel, problem solved | 14:38 |
| bennypr0fane | I never intend to boot the U-Boot attached stock kernel | 14:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | however you need to install KP51 uBoot kernelimage for your default system, and never boot it with default kernel that ships with uBoot | 14:38 |
| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05, I think he means Pali's u-boot+bootmenu. | 14:38 |
| bennypr0fane | hurrian yes, that | 14:38 |
| * Estel_ nods | 14:38 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: yes, sure. So? | 14:39 |
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| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05, doesn't it pull in kernel-power-bootimg if u-boot is installed? | 14:39 |
| Estel_ | so follow carefully instructions, and you will be fine. There is *no* scenario that can't work with U-boot, including other os'es... | 14:39 |
| bennypr0fane | I want to dual boot between kp51 from eMMC and Debian from SD card | 14:39 |
| Estel_ | ...so thumb is least of a problem here | 14:39 |
| Estel_ | why not | 14:39 |
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| Estel_ | not to mention that easy debian would make your life easier, but if you want non-chroot'ed one, why not | 14:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | unless Pali bundles KP51 to uBoot now, he will need to boot to kp51.img for NAND system | 14:40 |
| bennypr0fane | so there is a thumb compiled version of kp51r1? | 14:40 |
| Hurrian | kp51r1 includes Thumb support. | 14:40 |
| Estel_ | kp51r1 is thumb | 14:40 |
| Estel_ | there is *no* non-thumb version of kp51 | 14:40 |
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| Estel_ | or any future KP | 14:40 |
| bennypr0fane | oh | 14:40 |
| Estel_ | btw | 14:41 |
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| Estel_ | install kp52 from opening post of kp51 thread | 14:41 |
| Estel_ | KP52 would be in repos ages ago, if repos wouldn't be fubar | 14:41 |
| Estel_ | now, Pali wait in queue to upload it :P | 14:41 |
| Estel_ | so you can save yourself re-made of kp +u-boot image | 14:41 |
| Estel_ | and do it with kp52 already | 14:42 |
| bennypr0fane | the previous - non-thumb - way of doing this was 1. install u-boot, which would flash to stock kernel, then to install the kp bootimg | 14:42 |
| bennypr0fane | aha so 52 not developer-only material anymore... | 14:42 |
| Hurrian | Estel_, IIRC on newer versions of u-boot+bootmenu, you can simply set KP as default entry | 14:42 |
| bennypr0fane | glad to hear it | 14:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: exactly same | 14:42 |
| Estel_ | if you want hassle freee setup, and you're going to use maemo more often than debian... | 14:42 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, yea | 14:42 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, my strange habit would be to still get kp52 + u-boot flashed into nand | 14:43 |
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| bennypr0fane | also it used to be not posibble to boot kp with the keyboard closed. has this been changed? | 14:43 |
| Estel_ | as basic one, working in every bizzare condition | 14:43 |
| Hurrian | bennypr0fane, yes it has. | 14:43 |
| Estel_ | then boot whatever from u-boot | 14:43 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, how it's achieved technically (default entry) | 14:44 |
| Hurrian | Estel_, you could just stick a boot.scr on sdcard though | 14:44 |
| Estel_ | it just mix itself with U-boot and flashes to nand? | 14:44 |
| Estel_ | hm | 14:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: that's never been true. It's just not supported by this luser-wizard that creates uBoot menucfg for you, from bootmenu entries | 14:44 |
| bennypr0fane | Doc well I'm that kind of luser wizard-user I'm afraid | 14:45 |
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| Estel_ | s/It's/it was/ -i DocScrutinizer05 | 14:45 |
| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: actually, it was a bug I was bringing up with Pali since the first testing versions, although I had some trouble explaining it to him in English | 14:45 |
| Hurrian | It's fixed now, though | 14:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: fine | 14:45 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, don't worry, this luser-wizard is good way to go... | 14:46 |
| Estel_ | as typos in editing it manually are most likely case to get "brick" | 14:46 |
| Estel_ | if you don't need to edit it manually, do it via wizard, and I ensure you that even uber-duper pros do that. No reason to risk and make yourself more work, when not necessary | 14:47 |
| Estel_ | and when no reasons, only lusers attempt the hard way (tm) | 14:47 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_ exactly my worst nightmare. I'm very prone to typos. so after I install thumb-kp will it be set as default boot option by default (haha), or another step required for that? | 14:47 |
| Estel_ | erm, installing kp, it just flashes itself. As for u-boot + kp, if you're using latest, you must set it yourself? ask Hurrian, I'm not u-boot user (yet) | 14:48 |
| Estel_ | I just follow up on it's development and mechanics | 14:48 |
| Hurrian | bennypr0fane, no need to worry about typos, if you do mess up, you can "--flash-only=kernel" and try again. | 14:48 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, good point | 14:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: only if bennypr0fane'S nand SYSTEM ISN'T A THOMBIFIED ONE | 14:49 |
| Estel_ | wrong, why so | 14:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dafaq, sorry capslock | 14:49 |
| Hurrian | Whoopsies. Harmattan indocrination. | 14:49 |
| Estel_ | ih he have kp installed, and kp modules/etc are in place, he can flash-only=kernel using kernel-power zimage | 14:50 |
| Estel_ | to get kernel-power zimage, either abuse kernel-power-bootimage, or dpkg-deb -x kernel-power main package... | 14:51 |
| bennypr0fane | So Hurrian, will the thumb-kp52 bootimg for U-boot set itself as default boot option in bottmenu? Maybe I should post a luser's step-by-step instruction (if someone hasn't already) | 14:51 |
| Hurrian | bennypr0fane: making .item files for u-boot is easy though, and after installing kernel-power-bootimg, you have a nice template to follow. | 14:51 |
| Estel_ | and take .fiasco file from it | 14:51 |
| bennypr0fane | whoah, getting a bit overwhelmed there with instructions | 14:51 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, btw, as you know what you're talking about - I'm quite funny here, as I have multiboot installed, but never actually use it | 14:51 |
| Hurrian | bennypr0fane: you may have to link KP52's .item file to /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 14:51 |
| Estel_ | I planned to migrate into U-boot, for ages | 14:51 |
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| Estel_ | never had time to investigate as much as needed, how to migrate | 14:52 |
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| bennypr0fane | quick question: is Nand the same thing as eMMC? | 14:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no, exactly not | 14:52 |
| Estel_ | could you analyze my case :p and explain me how to properly migrate= without getting guru meditation? | 14:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | NAND is the 256MB where your default system lives on | 14:52 |
| wxcafe | and i got this phone booting again | 14:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | eMMC is where /home and MyDocs live | 14:53 |
| Hurrian | Estel_: Step 1, uninstall multiboot, and make sure preinit is stock. | 14:53 |
| wxcafe | so, i was asking myself a question | 14:53 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, as long as it concerns you, it is the same. Technically not, NAND is 256 MB for root + 256 MB RAM | 14:53 |
| Estel_ | eMMC is 32GB flash | 14:53 |
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| Estel_ | Hurrian, it is only one thing to worry after getting rid of multiboot? | 14:53 |
| wxcafe | is it possible to make /usr a symlink to /home/opt/use? | 14:53 |
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| Estel_ | i.e. orphaned .item files won't confuse u-boot? | 14:54 |
| wxcafe | because, obviously, /home mounts after / | 14:54 |
| bennypr0fane | so NAND is one specific part (partition) of the eMMC? | 14:54 |
| Hurrian | IIRC the item files are placed in /etc/bootmenu, not /etc/multiboot | 14:54 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, no | 14:54 |
| Estel_ | physically, different chips | 14:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wxcafe: nope | 14:54 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, ok | 14:54 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: :/ | 14:54 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: why not? | 14:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wxcafe: that's what we got optification for | 14:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~optification | 14:55 |
| infobot | optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the systeminit *and* partitioning is FUBAR, http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish they looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 dot3" | 14:55 |
| Estel_ | so, getting rid of multibot is first step, ensure that /etc/bootmenu is clean and preinit is stock | 14:55 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: i don't know of this magic | 14:55 |
| bennypr0fane | eMMC is a name for this physical chip, yes? and NAND resides on a different one - the RAM chip? | 14:55 |
| Hurrian | Estel_: exactly, then after that, do a plain install of u-boot and kp-bootimg. | 14:55 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, NAND use faster and more robust technology than eMMC, and lack hardware wear-leveling | 14:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: exactly | 14:56 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, I have kp-bootimage already, as it's required for multiboot. Should i reinstall it after u-boot installation? | 14:56 |
| Estel_ | lot of noob questions, I know | 14:56 |
| Hurrian | Estel_: check if it has an item file in /etc/bootmenu.d | 14:56 |
| Hurrian | if it has one, then it should be fine. | 14:56 |
| Estel_ | it will be my first contact with U-boot in practice, from theory only | 14:56 |
| Hurrian | Estel_: for convenience's sake, you may want to link kp's .item to /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 14:57 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, in fact it is RAM sitting on NAND chip :P | 14:57 |
| Estel_ | in fact, it's cpu chip | 14:57 |
| Estel_ | SoC - system on a chip | 14:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: or simply put, in linux sysop speak: NAND is /dev/mtd while eMMC is /dev/mmcblk | 14:57 |
| Estel_ | cpu, nand and ram on one chip | 14:58 |
| Estel_ | and dsp and more things | 14:58 |
| Estel_ | eMMC is "addition" to have space | 14:58 |
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| wxcafe | hmm | 14:58 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, wait wait, which kp's.item? | 14:58 |
| wxcafe | it says here i need to have version >20.2010.36 | 14:58 |
| wxcafe | http://wiki.maemo.org/Cssu | 14:59 |
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| Estel_ | item from /etc/bootmenu? | 14:59 |
| Estel_ | /etc/bootmenu.d even | 14:59 |
| Hurrian | Estel_, yes | 14:59 |
| wxcafe | my version is 1.2009.42-11 | 14:59 |
| Hurrian | wxcafe: reflash to newest version. | 14:59 |
| Estel_ | /etc/default/bootmenu.item should become symlink to /etc/bootmenu.d, not the other way around? | 14:59 |
| Hurrian | $DEITY that's an old firmware version. | 14:59 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_: thanks for not leaving me as the only one to ask a lot of noob questions. Whoa, the cpu chip has the RAM residing on it? I'm having troubel telling apart designations of physical devices vs. "logical" units... However, I never (consciously) made any changes to NAND or eMMC, nothing that would require changing default settings of this core system components | 14:59 |
| wxcafe | Hurrian: as seen on skeiron.org? | 14:59 |
| Hurrian | wxcafe: yes | 15:00 |
| wxcafe | alright | 15:00 |
| Hurrian | Estel_: real file /etc/bootmenu.d/$KPname.item -> lrw-r--r-- /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 15:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wxcafe: use: | 15:01 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian, thanks | 15:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~pr1.3.1 | 15:01 |
| infobot | i heard combined is the rootfs fiasco image of maemo. For N900 latest (PR1.3.1) see http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/fiasco+co/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin or http://nds2.fds-fire.nokia.com/fdp/interface/FiRe/2011/9/--FID--A0A22MVWFVFAM/--LID--FiRe1317015685654/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin | 15:01 |
| thedead1440 | Doc how about emmc? Shouldn't the factoid have the link for latest emmc too? I'll get the direct nokia link | 15:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's so new.... it almost doesn't exist yet ;-P | 15:02 |
| bennypr0fane | I didn't think SoC meant literally having everything on one chip...? The Raspberry Pi e.g. is a Soc where the several chips are permanently soldered into the board | 15:02 |
| thedead1440 | hehe | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | dockane_: there's no ~1.3.1 | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | fu | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: there's no ~1.3.1 | 15:02 |
| ShadowJK | nand+ram is actually a separate chip from the soc, but it's soldered to the soc, ontop of the soc | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: only 1.3 | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | DocScrutinizer05: so i'll use that | 15:02 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, no, raspberry pi also have SoC inside | 15:02 |
| Estel_ | that got dsp and cpu | 15:02 |
| Estel_ | and some more shitte on it | 15:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wxcafe: what do you think the link above is about then? | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | oh | 15:02 |
| Estel_ | but, SoC is marketing term, it may mean whole Pi to | 15:02 |
| wxcafe | sorry, i was looking at skeiron.org | 15:03 |
| Estel_ | it's just same chip for conveinence of production | 15:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: basically yes | 15:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (SoC) | 15:03 |
| Estel_ | (N900's SoC) | 15:03 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, right, I always mess it up | 15:03 |
| Estel_ | and on top of ram is eMMC | 15:04 |
| Estel_ | sandwitched between SoC and eMMC is RAM, though | 15:04 |
| ShadowJK | no I think that's a separate chip | 15:04 |
| Estel_ | s/though/so/ | 15:04 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: sandwitched between SoC and eMMC is RAM, so | 15:04 |
| Estel_ | hm? | 15:04 |
| Estel_ | last time I checked everyone said it is 3 chips on each other | 15:04 |
| Estel_ | I may be wrong, though | 15:04 |
| ShadowJK | soc, ontop of soc a chip with ram and nand. Separately on board the emmc? | 15:05 |
| Estel_ | ah | 15:05 |
| Estel_ | right | 15:05 |
| Estel_ | as I said, I always mess it up | 15:05 |
| bennypr0fane | on board would mean *part of the SoC*, no? | 15:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | OMG why does infobot still pester me with this nonsense | 15:05 |
| Estel_ | no | 15:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: exactly | 15:05 |
| bennypr0fane | infobot you're not a bot, are you? I find that a bit misleading | 15:06 |
| infobot | no *you're* not a bot, are you? I find that a bit misleading | 15:06 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, there is SoC (CPU, dsp, other shitte), on top of it soldered RAM, on top of it soldered NAND | 15:06 |
| wxcafe | well of course he's not a bot | 15:06 |
| bennypr0fane | wxcafe I think IRC users shouldn't have bot-Nicks | 15:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | heh? | 15:07 |
| wxcafe | bennypr0fane: no you | 15:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~botsnack | 15:07 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer05: aw, gee | 15:07 |
| Estel_ | ~ping | 15:07 |
| infobot | ~pong | 15:07 |
| wxcafe | bennypr0fane: infobot is a bot | 15:07 |
| wxcafe | bennypr0fane: you're not | 15:07 |
| wxcafe | i was answering to infobot | 15:08 |
| bennypr0fane | ah | 15:08 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; no, just one "on top". the nand and ram are in one chip. | 15:08 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, ough | 15:08 |
| thedead1440 | ~spank bennypr0fane | 15:08 |
| * infobot bends bennypr0fane over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on bennypr0fane's pasty white buttocks. | 15:08 | |
| thedead1440 | bennypr0fane: ^^ that's infobot's revenge :p | 15:09 |
| bennypr0fane | so the bot can tell other people what user actually meant with what they said? quite the advanced AI we got there :-D | 15:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~attack thedead1440 | 15:09 |
| * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing thedead1440 | 15:09 | |
| thedead1440 | ~lart DocScrutinizer05 | 15:09 |
| * infobot teaches DocScrutinizer05 that M$ Access is a database. No, really, a database. A real live multi-user... well, ok, not multi-user, but a database. Yeah, that sounds right. | 15:09 | |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, because I used sed | 15:09 |
| bennypr0fane | infobot I'm not white dude! | 15:09 |
| Estel_ | s/I used/I abused/ | 15:09 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: bennypr0fane, because I abused sed | 15:09 |
| thedead1440 | wtf? wasn't it supposed to glue you | 15:09 |
| Estel_ | ~lart DocScrutinizer05 | 15:10 |
| * infobot follow's DocScrutinizer05 with a gauntlet and ... scratch ... HUMILIATION | 15:10 | |
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| Estel_ | multiple answer choice | 15:10 |
| wxcafe | infobot's a she? | 15:10 |
| thedead1440 | ah | 15:10 |
| Estel_ | it depends on her mood | 15:10 |
| Estel_ | ~gender | 15:10 |
| infobot | I'm gay | 15:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~gender | 15:10 |
| infobot | I'm sexless | 15:10 |
| Estel_ | ~gender | 15:10 |
| thedead1440 | lol | 15:10 |
| wxcafe | gay is not a gender | 15:10 |
| Estel_ | ~sexual-prefference | 15:11 |
| thedead1440 | ~sexual-preference | 15:11 |
| Estel_ | ~sex | 15:11 |
| infobot | [~sex] updatedb; locate; talk; date; cd; strip; look; touch; finger; unzip; uptime; gawk; head; emerge --oneshot condom; mount; fsck; gasp; more; yes; yes; yes; more; umount; emerge -C condom; make clean; sleep; | 15:11 |
| *** ian--- has quit IRC | 15:11 | |
| thedead1440 | this has become the ibot show :p | 15:11 |
| wxcafe | yep | 15:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~cookie | 15:11 |
| * infobot pulls out the cookie jar and finds zip 18508... Scranton Lackawanna PA | 15:11 | |
| bennypr0fane | thedead1440 nice performance | 15:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~cookie | 15:12 |
| infobot | Hey docscrutinizer05, oldtest sepharvaim is the two books; the two scribes | 15:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~cookie | 15:12 |
| infobot | Hey docscrutinizer05, port 748 is ris-cm - Russell Info Sci Calendar Manager | 15:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~cookie | 15:12 |
| infobot | Hey docscrutinizer05, rfc 1071 is Computing the Internet checksum. R.T. Braden, D.A. Borman, C. Partridge. Sep-01-1988. (Format: TXT=54941 bytes) (Updated by RFC1141) (Status: UNKNOWN) | 15:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~status | 15:12 |
| infobot | Since Sat Mar 16 07:12:23 2013, there have been 0 modifications, 14 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 3 commands. I have been awake for 6h 30s this session, and currently reference 118992 factoids. I'm using about 18884 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 52.87/1.21 child 0.01/0 | 15:12 |
| wxcafe | 0 morons? | 15:13 |
| xes | dd if=/dev/random > #maemo | 15:13 |
| thedead1440 | yeah the previous moron i think was kerio? | 15:13 |
| wxcafe | that doesn't sound right | 15:13 |
| wxcafe | ~dd if=/dev/random > #maemo | 15:13 |
| wxcafe | damn | 15:13 |
| xes | ;) | 15:14 |
| infobot | don't make me ponder doing nasty things to you! | 15:14 |
| thedead1440 | hehe | 15:14 |
| thedead1440 | infobot: go ahead and do them to Estel_ | 15:14 |
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| Estel_ | ~rape thedead1440 | 15:15 |
| * infobot takes thedead1440 behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams | 15:15 | |
| thedead1440 | haha | 15:15 |
| Estel_ | xes, hey, I managed to catch you | 15:15 |
| thedead1440 | i'm violated :p | 15:15 |
| Estel_ | you're involved in apkenv, aren't you? | 15:15 |
| wxcafe | o/ | 15:15 |
| xes | Estel_: uh? ...involved, not really, just some make & test | 15:16 |
| Estel_ | all threads about it are such a mess, that I can't find single thing about it that related to my interests | 15:16 |
| wxcafe | ~rape me | 15:16 |
| * infobot takes wxcafe behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams | 15:16 | |
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| wxcafe | o// | 15:16 |
| Estel_ | well, there are those openGLES games X-Plane, simulators | 15:16 |
| Estel_ | they were for WebOS, and works nicely using preenv | 15:16 |
| Estel_ | but, after webos hickup, remaining X-Plane slices were released as apk android things | 15:17 |
| Estel_ | technically, it's same thing, just adapted to pre env or androind env | 15:17 |
| bennypr0fane | so, to sum it up, 1.) I install U-Boot ver 2012.10-rc3-1 from extras (still on temp mirrors I think), 2.) then kp52 bootimg, which only exists as thumbified. 3.) then I have the option to make kp the default boot option (otherwise it is stock kernel), which will boot me straight to kp even if I leave the keyboard closed at power up. Correct so far? | 15:17 |
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| Estel_ | so, xes, it *should* work with apkenv? | 15:17 |
| Estel_ | I doubt it depends on fancy android shit | 15:17 |
| * bennypr0fane goes coffee-afk | 15:18 | |
| Estel_ | as said, same games were released for pre and android, just enviromental adapted | 15:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: it's a bit tricky, since your thumbified rootfs system will segfault on boot after installing uBoot | 15:18 |
| Estel_ | I would imagine that aptenv should work with such things (OpenGLES games) mainly? | 15:18 |
| kerio | not really :s | 15:18 |
| Estel_ | xes^ | 15:18 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, don't listen to doc :P | 15:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | bennypr0fane: so you basically need to install but NOT BOOT uBoot, then install KP bootimg | 15:19 |
| Estel_ | ok, you may listen to him a little | 15:19 |
| * kerio grabs the popcorn | 15:19 | |
| wxcafe | care to share? | 15:19 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ok so now you've all finish abusing infobot, any luck with autobuilder? | 15:20 |
| Estel_ | kerio, no popcorn time, after I've stepped on Doc's chanop authority last time, he pretent that he ignore me | 15:20 |
| Estel_ | which of course doesn't mean ignore command, as it doesn't match his psychomaniac profile :P | 15:20 |
| sixwheeledbeast | seems bb-power is in the queue now too | 15:20 |
| * kerio grabs more popcorn | 15:20 | |
| xes | Estel_: the problem with apkenv is the "missing" original developer (thp). He created an idea... but, probably many of us were waiting for him to increase the number of modules available | 15:20 |
| wxcafe | kerio: you won't share? | 15:21 |
| Estel_ | xes, noticed that. OTOH, he seem to rely on other people creating modules | 15:21 |
| kerio | wxcafe: i cba to send you popcorns one by one | 15:21 |
| kerio | and would you really eat popcorn out of a tarball? | 15:21 |
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| xes | Estel_: the problem with me is.... missing hours....to play, and to play with that ;) | 15:22 |
| wxcafe | kerio: out of a tar gziped, yeah | 15:22 |
| kerio | wxcafe: tar is not safe for ingestion :< | 15:22 |
| wxcafe | kerio: safe enough | 15:22 |
| kerio | (i'm not sure if you're getting the joke, btw) | 15:23 |
| wxcafe | (of course i am) | 15:23 |
| kerio | xes: are modules automatically used according to the .apk? | 15:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | humor is a tarpit | 15:23 |
| wxcafe | (i might not be a native english speaker, but i understand it well enough) | 15:23 |
| * bennypr0fane is here, never to return | 15:24 | |
| wxcafe | wow | 15:25 |
| xes | kerio: yep | 15:25 |
| wxcafe | when you kill xorg, the phone reboots? | 15:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 15:25 |
| wxcafe | wth? | 15:25 |
| kerio | wxcafe: it's the only way to interact with it | 15:25 |
| kerio | so to be safe, REBOOT ALL THE THINGS | 15:25 |
| wxcafe | kerio: well, it could just restart it automatically | 15:26 |
| kerio | it also reboots if you kill browserd more than $times times in a period of $time | 15:26 |
| bennypr0fane | I'm going in for the kill, wih me brick | 15:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it does, for hildon-desktop | 15:26 |
| kerio | besides, i'm not entirely sure that bringing up x and the whole session is much faster than rebooting :) | 15:26 |
| bennypr0fane | no, one more thing: is backupmenu included with U-boot? | 15:27 |
| kerio | there's also the maemo-invoker issue | 15:27 |
| kerio | bennypr0fane: no, backupmenu runs in fanoush's bootmenu | 15:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 15:27 |
| kerio | after the kernel has already been loaded | 15:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | completely unrelated | 15:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | one is before kernel loading, the other after | 15:27 |
| bennypr0fane | can I have backupmenu with U-Boot? | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | completely unrelated | 15:28 |
| bennypr0fane | awesome | 15:28 |
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| kerio | bennypr0fane: you won't have a uboot entry to load backupmenu, though | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | just practice to open/close kbd slider swiftly | 15:28 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: just leave it open :) you can boot the normal system from the menu | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ;-D | 15:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | oooh, BM can boot from menu now? | 15:29 |
| bennypr0fane | backupmenu allows for restoring a backup without booting to hildon desktop, right? | 15:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 15:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually BM should be thumb-safe | 15:29 |
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| bennypr0fane | hah, we're bringing out lots of useful info here | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I.E your system should be stable in BM, no matter what the kernel and rootfs (thumbified or not) | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but you can't restore kernels with BM | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well kernel images maybe | 15:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not the default kernel on NAND partiton 1 though | 15:31 |
| bennypr0fane | like the kp52 one for U-boot? | 15:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep | 15:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not feasible | 15:31 |
| bennypr0fane | powerful stuff there | 15:32 |
| bennypr0fane | oh you said no | 15:32 |
| bennypr0fane | that is a kernel zimage though | 15:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | if you messed up your thumbified system by booting up uBoot without prior installing and configurating the KP52 uBoot kernelimage, you need to flash a) KP52 --kernel-only, or reflash fiasco completely | 15:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | or you use rescuesystem | 15:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and fix your NAND rootfs | 15:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | by installing the missing configs and kernel images etc | 15:34 |
| bennypr0fane | I'll just try no to make that mistake in the first place | 15:34 |
| bennypr0fane | hello freemangordon! | 15:35 |
| bennypr0fane | how is the Fennec Qt-UI coming along? | 15:35 |
| Estel_ | kerio, is having /etc/default.bootmenu.item and /etc/bootmenu.d/kernel-power.item same and aproriate last step for installing u-boot? | 15:41 |
| Estel_ | if not, what should be done after? | 15:41 |
| kerio | hm, i think that /etc/default/bootmenu.item should be a symlink | 15:42 |
| Estel_ | Hurrian disappeared without finishing his ultra-ircable noob friendly tutorial | 15:42 |
| kerio | but i don't even do that | 15:42 |
| Estel_ | to real file in /etc/bootmenu.d/.item yes? | 15:42 |
| kerio | i have a modified u-boot-update-bootmenu (i already sent the patch to pali, he still hasn't looked at it) that only adds the attachboot entry if there's an attached kernel | 15:42 |
| kerio | Estel_: yeah | 15:42 |
| kerio | and i don't have an attached kernel in my uboot :) | 15:42 |
| kerio | so it just loads the first one by default | 15:43 |
| kerio | which is 20-kernel-power.item or whatever | 15:43 |
| Estel_ | ugh, so you have uboot only in nand? | 15:43 |
| Estel_ | no kernels? | 15:43 |
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| kerio | yeah, why bother? | 15:43 |
| Estel_ | someone could explain it to me finally - u-boot loads kernel from ram? | 15:43 |
| kerio | uboot loads kernels | 15:43 |
| Estel_ | so there is 2mb waste of ram using it? :P | 15:43 |
| kerio | from somewhere | 15:43 |
| Estel_ | to ram?* | 15:43 |
| kerio | the kernel *is* loaded in ram | 15:44 |
| kerio | all the time | 15:44 |
| kerio | because, you know | 15:44 |
| Estel_ | fact | 15:44 |
| kerio | it's the kernel | 15:44 |
| Estel_ | so nothing changes? | 15:44 |
| wxcafe | that's the point of running the kernel... | 15:44 |
| kerio | nothing changes, afaik | 15:44 |
| Estel_ | so what was the point of attaching u-boot to kernels | 15:44 |
| kerio | so that you have *something* to boot if everything else fails | 15:44 |
| Estel_ | unless you mess up attaching kernel to u-boot | 15:45 |
| kerio | you don't attach the kernel to uboot | 15:45 |
| Estel_ | which happens more often than everything else failing :P | 15:45 |
| kerio | it's already attached | 15:45 |
| Estel_ | I mean this one flashed to nand | 15:45 |
| bennypr0fane | Does anyone know about the temp repo mirrors going offline? | 15:45 |
| Estel_ | people used to have kernel+uboot in nand | 15:45 |
| Estel_ | it seemed to look tricky to do properly | 15:46 |
| kerio | Estel_: u-boot-flasher flashes u-boot+omap1 | 15:46 |
| Estel_ | kernel zimage (or <whateverletter>image) with u-boot attached | 15:46 |
| Estel_ | me don't wanna omap1 | 15:46 |
| Estel_ | thumb system | 15:46 |
| kerio | and it's kinda easy to attach whatever zimage you want | 15:46 |
| Estel_ | omap1 useless to tarzan | 15:46 |
| bennypr0fane | I think the kp52 in repos is not a U-Boot compatible Zimage, but just regular uncompressed | 15:46 |
| kerio | it's a zimage, not a uimage :) | 15:47 |
| kerio | u-boot-update-bootmenu puts uimages in MyDocs/bootmenu.d | 15:47 |
| Estel_ | kerio, kinda easy = how? | 15:47 |
| kerio | u-boot-gen-combined uboot.bin uImage combined.bin | 15:47 |
| kerio | you can get the uimage from MyDocs/bootmenu.d if it was converted, or convert it yourself with mkimage | 15:48 |
| kerio | check `grep mkimage /usr/bin/u-boot-update-bootmenu` for the correct parameters for mkimage | 15:48 |
| wxcafe | hmmm | 15:48 |
| wxcafe | http://repository.maemo.org/community/community-fremantle.install is down | 15:48 |
| kerio | it's totally easy! | 15:48 |
| Estel_ | so I *either* use u-boot-update-bootmenu *or* convert it myself using mkimage? | 15:48 |
| Estel_ | kerio, I see | 15:49 |
| kerio | no, this is to generate the combined uboot+whateverkernel | 15:49 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: rmo seems down | 15:49 |
| Estel_ | you mean u-boot-gen-combined, methinks | 15:49 |
| kerio | Estel_: no no | 15:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I know | 15:49 |
| kerio | u-boot-update-bootmenu creates uimages from zimages | 15:49 |
| Estel_ | oh shit, so I'm lost on it | 15:49 |
| wxcafe | well, then i can't install Cssu | 15:49 |
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| kerio | those are for the menu | 15:49 |
| kerio | wxcafe: well, wait until it's less down :) | 15:50 |
| wxcafe | less down? | 15:50 |
| wxcafe | :P | 15:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | just said byebye | 15:50 |
| kerio | like, up | 15:50 |
| wxcafe | like | 15:50 |
| wxcafe | for example | 15:50 |
| bennypr0fane | kerio hahaha | 15:50 |
| Estel_ | so, what u-boot-gen-combine does | 15:50 |
| Estel_ | if u-boot-update-bootmenu uses mkimage? | 15:51 |
| bennypr0fane | we should just replace the term up with less down. opposite of Newspeak | 15:51 |
| kerio | u-boot-gen-combined is a tool for internal use that can take the uboot.bin without any attached kernel, a uimage, and stitches them together | 15:51 |
| Estel_ | this u-boot thing keeps getting me lost | 15:51 |
| Estel_ | ok... | 15:51 |
| kerio | Estel_: just flash the uboot without kernels manually | 15:51 |
| kerio | and live happily without any more flashing | 15:51 |
| Estel_ | then one can flash to nand resulting thing? | 15:51 |
| kerio | Estel_: yep | 15:52 |
| kerio | and the attached kernel will be the one in the uImage | 15:52 |
| kerio | to do so, one needs a uImage | 15:52 |
| bennypr0fane | ...man, I thought repos were back to good old stable "less down" | 15:52 |
| kerio | you can make a uImage from a standard zImage with mkimage | 15:52 |
| Estel_ | ah | 15:52 |
| kerio | and some cryptic parameters | 15:52 |
| Estel_ | and that is what u-boot-update-bootmenu does? | 15:52 |
| kerio | yep | 15:53 |
| Estel_ | ok, thanks... so what creates menus? | 15:53 |
| kerio | so you can just abuse that and grab the resulting uimage | 15:53 |
| Estel_ | where those menu'es are? | 15:53 |
| kerio | u-boot-update-bootmenu creates the menu from the valid (for uboot) entries in /etc/bootmenu.d | 15:53 |
| kerio | and ubootfies the related files | 15:53 |
| Estel_ | and those menus are bundled into uimage? | 15:53 |
| kerio | creating the menu script in MyDocs/bootmenu.src and putting the files in MyDocs/bootmenu.d | 15:54 |
| kerio | well, the supporting code is in uboot already, but the uboot script and the configuration is in MyDocs | 15:54 |
| kerio | which has to be the first partition on the emmc, or uboot will say "screw you" | 15:54 |
| bennypr0fane | so, If I want kp52 with U-Boot, I first have to somehow download it (without installing) and then create a zimg from it? | 15:54 |
| kerio | bennypr0fane: if you want kp52 attached to uboot | 15:54 |
| kerio | but really, booting from emmc works perfectly too | 15:55 |
| bennypr0fane | I don't care if it's attached or not | 15:55 |
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| bennypr0fane | It just needs to boot by default | 15:55 |
| Estel_ | kerio, one can boot uimages from mydocs only? | 15:55 |
| Estel_ | or sd? | 15:55 |
| bennypr0fane | as opposed to the stock kernel that comes with uboot | 15:55 |
| kerio | bennypr0fane: apt-get install u-boot-flasher u-boot-tools && dpkg -i kernel-power-bootimg* && ln -s /etc/bootmenu.d/*power* /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 15:55 |
| Estel_ | (estel thinks about emmc failure) | 15:55 |
| kerio | Estel_: you need some manual intervention to boot from usd, but you can | 15:56 |
| kerio | boot with slider open, enter uboot console, do stuff from there | 15:56 |
| kerio | but if you put a uboot script in a specific place i don't know on the sd, it's just a "run sdboot" iirc | 15:56 |
| Estel_ | ok. No way to pre-define it somehow, if one would like to boot always from sd? | 15:56 |
| kerio | i *think* that uboot will only read configurations from the emmc | 15:57 |
| kerio | like, from the first partition on the emmc, formatted as vfat | 15:57 |
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| Estel_ | ooook... so last two questions: | 15:57 |
| bennypr0fane | kerio where can i download kernel-power-bootimg ver 52? (and why did you put an asterisk* behind it?) | 15:57 |
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| kerio | ~kp | 15:58 |
| infobot | from memory, kp is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85665 | 15:58 |
| Estel_ | 1. there are complete 0, even hyphotetical and bullshit'ish, drawbacks on performance or RAM usage or anything, from using u-boot only on nand, and booting kernels from images? | 15:58 |
| bennypr0fane | ah I got it: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1305042&postcount=288 | 15:58 |
| kerio | Estel_: afaik i don't think so | 15:58 |
| kerio | not even theoretical improvements that you could only do on nand, like execute-in-place | 15:58 |
| kerio | because the kernel is compressed anyway | 15:58 |
| Estel_ | kerio, and this way no flashing when new kp comes out = even less wear on nand | 15:58 |
| kerio | Estel_: yep | 15:58 |
| kerio | and with fiasco-do-update-ask you can keep kernel-power-flasher installed | 15:59 |
| kerio | and not flash | 15:59 |
| Estel_ | fiasco-do-update-ask = ? | 15:59 |
| kerio | another pali thing | 15:59 |
| bennypr0fane | "wear on nand"... the things we have to deal with, wanting to keep our precious N900s | 15:59 |
| Estel_ | package, or thing that gets run when flasher is installed? | 15:59 |
| kerio | package | 16:00 |
| kerio | and also thing that gets run when flasher is installed :) | 16:00 |
| kerio | thing that *every flasher* runs when installed | 16:00 |
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| kerio | that's why it's good | 16:00 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, wear to nand is purely theoretical, you would need tens of thousand flashes to even bother it... but, better safe if there is no reason for not being :P | 16:00 |
| Estel_ | kerio, so no need to manually install fiasco-ask? | 16:00 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_ you need to write a noob-friendly how-to. this discussion lost me a bit many lines ago | 16:00 |
| kerio | ah sorry, it's fiasco-image-update-ask | 16:01 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, it just sound complicated, as it seems, in practice it should be pretty straightforward from what I get | 16:01 |
| Estel_ | will write tutorial after messing with it myself | 16:01 |
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| bennypr0fane | Estel_ that would be awesoem lots of thankful users I hope | 16:01 |
| Estel_ | kerio, whatever name, is it now dependency of kp flasher, or should I install it manually? | 16:01 |
| kerio | Estel_: u-boot-flasher predepends on fiasco-image-update-ask | 16:02 |
| Estel_ | I see | 16:02 |
| Estel_ | nice | 16:02 |
| bennypr0fane | hopefully repos come back less down soon | 16:02 |
| kerio | but if you're going to flash your own uboot, you won't have that dependency | 16:02 |
| kerio | so install it manually | 16:02 |
| kerio | it's in extras-devel | 16:02 |
| kerio | it's also a Recommend from the latest kernel-power-bootimg | 16:02 |
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| Estel_ | kerio, can't flash own u-boot after installing u-boot-flasher, to satisfy apt? | 16:03 |
| kerio | nothing depends on u-boot-flasher, does it | 16:03 |
| Estel_ | I see | 16:03 |
| Estel_ | so, to flash own u-boot, one doesn't need any u-boot related packages? or u-boot, but not u-boot flasher? | 16:03 |
| kerio | to *flash* it, no | 16:04 |
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| kerio | flashing it from the device is kind of stupid though | 16:04 |
| Estel_ | and those generating scripts like u-boot-update-bootmenu? are they in flasher package? | 16:04 |
| kerio | you have to do the same that's done in the various -flasher postinsts | 16:04 |
| Estel_ | u-boot-flasger | 16:04 |
| kerio | they're in the u-boot-tools package | 16:04 |
| Estel_ | ah | 16:04 |
| kerio | flasher --local -k ubootcombined.bin -f | 16:05 |
| kerio | and you have to run softupd --standalone -sn or whatever in another terminal | 16:05 |
| Estel_ | now, where is your modified thingie that pali haven't had time to look at | 16:05 |
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| kerio | Estel_: i'm too ashamed of it :< | 16:05 |
| Estel_ | kerio, don't be silly | 16:05 |
| Estel_ | ~spank Pali | 16:05 |
| * infobot bends Pali over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on Pali's pasty white buttocks. | 16:05 | |
| Estel_ | Pali still haven't fixed bme replacement, so my every device that got it installed, get stupid problems if battery is out of device for some reason, and it gets decalibrated | 16:06 |
| Estel_ | as there is no fuckin way to calibrate it again | 16:06 |
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| kerio | Estel_: in /usr/bin/u-boot-update-bootmenu, look for # add entry for attached kernel | 16:06 |
| kerio | and put it within "if false; then" "fi" | 16:07 |
| Estel_ | modprobe -r of both bq27x00_battery *and* rc51_battery result in reboot after 30 sec | 16:07 |
| * ShadowJK almost hangs his N900 with a runaway awk script | 16:07 | |
| wxcafe | who's the maintainer of this repo? | 16:07 |
| kerio | or, meh | 16:07 |
| kerio | Estel_: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/2221309 | 16:08 |
| Estel_ | thanks :) | 16:08 |
| kerio | changes around line 81 | 16:08 |
| kerio | but you also need the ability to run those commands in sudo | 16:08 |
| *** arcean_ is now known as arcean | 16:08 | |
| Estel_ | now I only need to motivate Pali by starting to talk about "kerio's fork of u-boot-tools" | 16:08 |
| Estel_ | ;) | 16:08 |
| Estel_ | kerio, you just mean running u-boot-update as root, yep? | 16:08 |
| kerio | also, the way i check for the magic string is awful | 16:09 |
| kerio | Estel_: actually that wouldn't quite work | 16:09 |
| kerio | root can't run arbitrary commands with sudo, in stock fremantle | 16:09 |
| Estel_ | fork, or root? | 16:09 |
| Estel_ | ah, right | 16:09 |
| Estel_ | sudoers.d? | 16:09 |
| kerio | ITEM_USEATAG="" # Obsolated | 16:09 |
| kerio | hahahaha i missed that | 16:09 |
| Estel_ | huh? | 16:09 |
| kerio | pali's english makes me kinda lol | 16:10 |
| Estel_ | so I need to add user NOPASSWD for u-boot-update ? | 16:10 |
| Estel_ | :) | 16:10 |
| kerio | Estel_: you're fine i suppose | 16:10 |
| kerio | just remove the occurrences of /usr/bin/sudo there | 16:10 |
| Estel_ | kerio, today I've went again thorugh ereswap description | 16:10 |
| Estel_ | and lolled at some funny grammar erors | 16:10 |
| kerio | but u-boot-update-bootmenu can be run as a normal user too | 16:10 |
| Estel_ | description of package in repos | 16:10 |
| kerio | because all you're doing is writing to mydocs | 16:11 |
| Estel_ | so why the hell was it written with sudo | 16:11 |
| kerio | because it should also add a .sudoers file | 16:11 |
| kerio | :) | 16:11 |
| Estel_ | but why to use sudo when not required | 16:12 |
| kerio | it is required | 16:12 |
| kerio | that's the point | 16:12 |
| Estel_ | you just told me to remove it | 16:12 |
| kerio | ...and then run as root | 16:12 |
| Estel_ | ah :P | 16:12 |
| Estel_ | now I wonder if multiboot restores preinit properly upon deinstallation | 16:13 |
| Estel_ | and how to run fancy things like arch using u-boot | 16:13 |
| Estel_ | ah, last question | 16:13 |
| Estel_ | kerio, as backupmenu is not related to u-boot, running after kernel | 16:14 |
| Estel_ | how to get it | 16:14 |
| Estel_ | as it depends on keyboard slided out? | 16:14 |
| kerio | keep the keyboard slider open | 16:14 |
| Estel_ | won't i get u-boot console | 16:14 |
| kerio | yes | 16:14 |
| Estel_ | and all shitte? | 16:14 |
| kerio | and then you select "boot from kernel-power" (first entry) | 16:14 |
| kerio | while keeping the keyboard slider open | 16:14 |
| Estel_ | I see | 16:14 |
| kerio | or... idk, train yourself to open the slider quickly after the kernel has started booting | 16:15 |
| kerio | but it's kind of a solution in need of a problem, imo | 16:15 |
| Estel_ | now, this assumes that I have u-boot only flashed, which I will probably have | 16:15 |
| Estel_ | if, otoh, I would have kernel attached | 16:15 |
| Estel_ | to flashed uimage | 16:15 |
| Estel_ | o I need to have any "options" | 16:16 |
| Estel_ | in u-boot. | 16:16 |
| Estel_ | other than alternate things like arch kernel? | 16:16 |
| kerio | ...wat | 16:16 |
| Estel_ | (so, kp52 boots when keyboard slided in as it's attached, and to run other kernels, slide keyboard open) | 16:16 |
| Estel_ | messed it up? | 16:16 |
| kerio | i don't understand your question | 16:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [general notice] we need to reboot blade-a. this means the VMs "mail" "monitor" and "repo/stage" will go down | 16:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ( thedead1440: and scratchbox) | 16:18 |
| Estel_ | kerio, to make it easier - what, technically, happens if one have kernel attached to u-boot flashed to nand, and boot with keyboard open... | 16:18 |
| Estel_ | then choose entry for menu | 16:18 |
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| Estel_ | s/for/from/ | 16:18 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: then choose entry from menu | 16:18 |
| kerio | Estel_: there will be a menu entry for booting with the attached kernel | 16:18 |
| Estel_ | that appends to same kernel as is attached | 16:18 |
| Estel_ | ah | 16:18 |
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| Estel_ | so it won't be boot with zImage and ignoring attached kernel, unless you choose otherwise? | 16:19 |
| Estel_ | so, using u-boot flashed to nand only, you need to flash only, when new version of u-boot comes out? | 16:19 |
| Estel_ | sounds nice | 16:20 |
| kerio | Estel_: unless you have a different default entry | 16:20 |
| kerio | in which case, it'll boot from it | 16:20 |
| Estel_ | hm, technically, preinit runs after u-boot, yes? | 16:20 |
| kerio | yes | 16:20 |
| kerio | preinit is run as the first process by the kernel | 16:20 |
| Estel_ | u-boot console is... well, just u-boot console, no real terminal? | 16:20 |
| kerio | yep, it's an uboot thing | 16:20 |
| Estel_ | so recovery shell stuffed at beginning of preinit won't help with problems related to kernel files... hm, I wonder about unlikely situation me doing some idiot error, andp, lets say, rm all kernel imagees from mydocs | 16:21 |
| Estel_ | without having kernel attached to u-boot | 16:22 |
| kerio | Estel_: rescueOS will help with that, and it can run from uboot :) | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | running from sdcard, it would be trivial to fix | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | ough, how? | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | from sd? | 16:22 |
| kerio | from emmc too | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | ah, or just put your kernel on sd, boot from it manually, fix kernels on mydocs? | 16:22 |
| kerio | that, too | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | right | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | so really, no drawbacks for flashing u-boot only | 16:22 |
| Estel_ | me gonna do it | 16:23 |
| kerio | Estel_: it's unsupported | 16:23 |
| Estel_ | :P | 16:23 |
| Estel_ | yea, as I'm using supported things daily | 16:23 |
| Estel_ | ~fapman | 16:23 |
| infobot | i guess fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default. | 16:23 |
| Estel_ | ~cssu | 16:23 |
| infobot | somebody said cssu was http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU | 16:23 |
| kerio | i still don't know why you enjoy using a bad dpkg interface | 16:23 |
| kerio | just out of spite? | 16:23 |
| Estel_ | ~fapman+cssu | 16:24 |
| infobot | it has been said that fapman+cssu is Estel's way of installing CSSU without any problems and waiting 100 russian years until HAM finish operation | 16:24 |
| Estel_ | kerio, because fapman is more time-saving when browsing package's descriptions | 16:24 |
| Estel_ | etc | 16:25 |
| thedead1440 | wtf is russian years? Different than regular years? | 16:25 |
| Estel_ | and I don't see how it's bad | 16:25 |
| Estel_ | thedead1440, don't know that idiome? | 16:25 |
| wxcafe | they're years with vodka | 16:25 |
| Estel_ | no, it's about julian calendar | 16:25 |
| thedead1440 | ah sorry | 16:25 |
| Estel_ | "russian month" -> russian year | 16:25 |
| wxcafe | anyway | 16:25 |
| Estel_ | ~lmgtfy russian month | 16:25 |
| * infobot thinks you should look here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=russian month | 16:25 | |
| Estel_ | kerio, since bullshit about fapman acting differently than apt on postinst scripts have been busted, I don't see anything bad with it ;) | 16:26 |
| wxcafe | anyone knows when the repo will be back online? | 16:26 |
| Estel_ | but using HAM is more like russian ethernity | 16:26 |
| Estel_ | wxcafe, when warfare reboots it, probably | 16:27 |
| thedead1440 | wxcafe: blade is being rebootd wait a few mins for 100% operation level | 16:27 |
| wxcafe | >.> | 16:27 |
| wxcafe | a few "minutes"!? | 16:27 |
| Estel_ | blade runner, ffs | 16:27 |
| wxcafe | man, how comes your server takes minutes to reboot? | 16:27 |
| wxcafe | mine takes 39 secs | 16:27 |
| wxcafe | and it's a debian stable | 16:27 |
| Estel_ | wxcafe, sure, you've paid for premium service and you're insulted by it being out for mainteintance? :P | 16:27 |
| kerio | cool, so host RMO on it | 16:28 |
| kerio | or give us money to make the boot time faster | 16:28 |
| wxcafe | Estel_: no, i'm just saying it's a long time to get it to reboot | 16:28 |
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| kerio | also, your server doesn't host 6 VMs | 16:28 |
| Estel_ | now for such a cluster | 16:28 |
| thedead1440 | wxcafe: there was a bug due to why the reboot occurred; the tech team are investigating the bug and hence the reboot is not just about rebooting but also to see the trace of what is the real issue | 16:28 |
| wxcafe | oh, that's why | 16:28 |
| wxcafe | (the VMs, i mean) | 16:28 |
| Estel_ | + 6 virtual machines ;) | 16:28 |
| M4rtinK | wxcafe: if it was a CISCO router, the simple rule would work: the more expensive it is, the longer it boots :) | 16:29 |
| wxcafe | i was not saying it as a reproach | 16:29 |
| wxcafe | just curious about it taking so long | 16:29 |
| Estel_ | M4rtinK, :) | 16:29 |
| Estel_ | linksys > cisco | 16:29 |
| Estel_ | sadly, cisco ate linksys | 16:29 |
| Estel_ | what a unfair market :P | 16:29 |
| Estel_ | an, even | 16:29 |
| M4rtinK | IIRC, they dumped linksys recently ? | 16:30 |
| Estel_ | yep | 16:30 |
| Estel_ | at and defecated | 16:30 |
| Estel_ | ate and defecated* | 16:30 |
| wxcafe | that's cisco | 16:30 |
| * Estel_ looks with love at own modified wrt54gl | 16:30 | |
| Estel_ | and i screw fact that it doesn't have wireless N, aka "great neighbourhood wifi jammer" | 16:31 |
| thedead1440 | just for running commentary: the blade still hasn't come up yet and some head-scratching, whining and looking for possible solution(s) is going on too :D | 16:32 |
| Estel_ | thedead1440, where you have live broadcast on it? | 16:32 |
| thedead1440 | Estel_: in my kitchen :p | 16:32 |
| Estel_ | gimme ip | 16:32 |
| Estel_ | very funny | 16:32 |
| thedead1440 | Estel_: 127.0.0.1 | 16:32 |
| Estel_ | no, it is my vnc, bastard! | 16:33 |
| Estel_ | how you come to know it | 16:33 |
| thedead1440 | hehe | 16:33 |
| Estel_ | came, even | 16:33 |
| kerio | little did Estel_ know, the maemo.org infrastructure was actually running on his home computer | 16:33 |
| Estel_ | anyway, seriously, it's some tech # channel? | 16:33 |
| Estel_ | haha | 16:33 |
| thedead1440 | kerio: no wonder its not so reliable :p :p | 16:33 |
| thedead1440 | you never know when a switch is switched :p | 16:34 |
| wxcafe | my home comp is reliable | 16:34 |
| Estel_ | kerio, star wars episode IX produced by disney? | 16:34 |
| wxcafe | last time i rebooted, i had a 60 days uptime | 16:34 |
| Estel_ | "little does luke know, that empire started build another death st..." | 16:34 |
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| Estel_ | ~han-shot-first | 16:35 |
| M4rtinK | Estel_: this one ? https://twitter.com/M4rtinK/status/311505936105750528/photo/1 | 16:35 |
| Estel_ | infobot is utterly uneducated | 16:35 |
| Estel_ | M4rtinK, haha | 16:36 |
| Estel_ | wtf is that? :) | 16:36 |
| Estel_ | I red description | 16:36 |
| Estel_ | but what is that supposed to be ;) | 16:36 |
| kerio | surely, it's no moon | 16:36 |
| Estel_ | inside planetarium? | 16:36 |
| Estel_ | it's too big for a space station | 16:37 |
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| thedead1440 | hehe here in Singapore they added something like an UFO on the Supreme Court building; I wonder what these "architects" think of when coming up with stupid structures | 16:38 |
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| Estel_ | Supreme Court and ufo... I know this plot | 16:39 |
| thedead1440 | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Singapore_Supreme_Court_and_City_Hall_aerial_view.jpg | 16:39 |
| Estel_ | hey, from the different barrel (tm) - anyone experienced with SIP could explain me | 16:39 |
| Estel_ | while using voip on N900 to call another N900 that is sitting 1 meter above in same lan, video is very laggy | 16:40 |
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| Estel_ | but I use sip proxy (operator one). I though it's use only to initiate call and go around nats... | 16:40 |
| Estel_ | and that call itself is peer-to-peer | 16:41 |
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| Estel_ | aka audio and video streams | 16:41 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_ have you ever made any kind of video call on N900 with video not lagging? | 16:41 |
| Estel_ | could it be proxified too, somehow, or what the fuck? | 16:41 |
| thedead1440 | bennypr0fane: hehe true | 16:41 |
| Estel_ | bennypr0fane, trying to achieve that | 16:41 |
| Estel_ | and I mean really lagging | 16:41 |
| ShadowJK | it probably wont figure out lan-lan connectivity | 16:41 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, so video and audio data goes around globe to voip provider and back? | 16:42 |
| thedead1440 | indeed that's how it should be isn't it? | 16:42 |
| Estel_ | I hoped it's only about sip initiation of call | 16:42 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_ wow, you're ambitious. I mean consider that for any video call not to lag you usually need daylight, for one | 16:42 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, ok, LAN-LAN isn't problem, normally I will use it on different networks | 16:42 |
| thedead1440 | Estel_: even Skype2Skype video calls lag pretty much; its standard fare. Only voice calls are usually fine. | 16:43 |
| Estel_ | but, to get real peer-to-peer I should avoid using any providers? I was sure, from every description, that sip call data streams are actually peer-to-peer | 16:43 |
| bennypr0fane | I never get Skype to maintain a stable video signal on my desktop pc via LAN, to people in the same city | 16:43 |
| Estel_ | thedead1440, skype sucks in every way, so no surprise here | 16:43 |
| bennypr0fane | Estel_ exactly | 16:44 |
| * sixwheeledbeast has noticed extras-assistant page is down... and that the build queue disappeared before it died | 16:44 | |
| bennypr0fane | Skype just sucks balls | 16:44 |
| * thedead1440 uses skype calls on desktop without issues | 16:44 | |
| Estel_ | ~lmgtfy sivler needle in the skype | 16:44 |
| * infobot thinks you should look here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sivler needle in the skype | 16:44 | |
| Estel_ | ~lmgtfy silver needle in the skype | 16:44 |
| * infobot thinks you should look here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=silver needle in the skype | 16:44 | |
| Estel_ | actually | 16:44 |
| bennypr0fane | Sykpe video only works for me with daylight | 16:44 |
| Estel_ | anyway | 16:44 |
| thedead1440 | Estel_: maybe this explains it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer-to-peer_SIP | 16:45 |
| Estel_ | anyone is aware how to get direct lan sip calls in N900? I wasn't able to define identify as estel@local_IP | 16:45 |
| Estel_ | thedead1440, thanks, looking at it | 16:45 |
| Estel_ | N900's sofiasip require me to provide address and password | 16:45 |
| Estel_ | looks like hardcoded to sip providers | 16:46 |
| Sicelo | setup asterisk :-/ | 16:46 |
| Estel_ | so without PBX on N900 itself (or local lan), no direct lan calls? | 16:46 |
| Estel_ | yea | 16:46 |
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| Estel_ | but it's kinda stupid, that you can't use sip without proxy | 16:46 |
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| thedead1440 | on local lan i think you would still need a SIP server in the form of Kamailio etc | 16:47 |
| Estel_ | thedead1440, this link defines next generatikon sip (p2psip) | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | but even normal sip can be p2p | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | it's just hard for regular use due to nats etc | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | mobility | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | and so goes on | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | it's just that N900 client doesn't support it at all, it seems | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | is telepathy-sofiasip opensource? | 16:49 |
| Estel_ | Maybe it could be fixed | 16:49 |
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| Estel_ | thedead1440, I mean that in sip, provider (servers) are used only for pstn gateways, and easy of nomadic use (nats, diffrent ip's, etc) | 16:50 |
| Estel_ | sip in itself is designed as pure p2p thingie | 16:50 |
| thedead1440 | yup | 16:51 |
| Estel_ | as for sip proxies (voip providers), I HOPED that it proxify only sip, and then, using data gathered from proxy, audio and video streams are p2p using udp punching... | 16:51 |
| Estel_ | but after today's laggy video, I'm not sure | 16:51 |
| thedead1440 | i would blame the client too | 16:52 |
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| Estel_ | OTOH, free voip providers would bancrupt if they would proxify video and audio streams for thousands of users | 16:52 |
| Sicelo | is there a cool tool or way for N900 to auto-connect to certain defined APs, and switch to gsm in their absence. if already on gsm and you come into range of defined AP's switch. | 16:52 |
| Sicelo | ? | 16:52 |
| Estel_ | sure, keeping only certain ap's on profiles | 16:53 |
| Sicelo | i know Maemo kinda does this automatically, but there's no way to 'skip' certain APs | 16:53 |
| Estel_ | not so convenient, though | 16:53 |
| Sicelo | yeah Estel_ | 16:53 |
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| Sicelo | my problem is that i also have the 'dummy' networks (one used for Maps, and the other for usb networking). Maemo's auto-connect chooses one of these two :( | 16:54 |
| kerio | Sicelo: it's configurable | 16:55 |
| kerio | but not through the UI | 16:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2GHz+, multi-GB RAM, multi-core phones | 16:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Insane. | 16:56 |
| Sicelo | kerio: i'm listening with great anticipation :-) | 16:57 |
| kerio | instructions somewhere on the wiki | 16:57 |
| Sicelo | or reading, rather :P | 16:57 |
| Sicelo | ohk. i'll look. thanks | 16:57 |
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| Estel_ | hm, I'm right, sip just initiates as it should | 16:59 |
| Estel_ | and carry data about ports and adresses to use | 16:59 |
| Estel_ | sip proxies (voip providersj modify those carried data to match actual location of participating parties | 16:59 |
| Estel_ | but audio and video is p2p | 16:59 |
| Estel_ | so wtf it lags | 16:59 |
| Estel_ | on lan? | 17:00 |
| Estel_ | or even if not on lan, on 50 mbs down/10 Mbs up networks? | 17:00 |
| Estel_ | GeneralAntilles, talking about some device in particular? | 17:00 |
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| Estel_ | only insane thing about it is that they use stupid operating system | 17:01 |
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| Estel_ | gimme such one with maemo, arch, or even Mer, and I call it mobile computer with phone functionality | 17:01 |
| Estel_ | just don't forget keyboard, microsd slot, fmtx... | 17:01 |
| Estel_ | and add IR transmitter if want to please me | 17:01 |
| Estel_ | thanks in advance | 17:02 |
| Estel_ | ah, and resistive screen, instead of capacitive shitte | 17:02 |
| Estel_ | with drivers supporting pressure sensitivity like on N900, of course | 17:02 |
| Estel_ | unless that, those X GHZ and cores + gigabytes of ram are "kinda" wasted | 17:03 |
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| jacekowski | Estel_: capacitive is better if you add something like samsung did on note | 17:06 |
| jacekowski | Estel_: (s pen) | 17:06 |
| wxcafe | +1 | 17:07 |
| Estel_ | but, wasn't it something like 2 touch layers? | 17:09 |
| Estel_ | one for active pen, and one for capacitive? | 17:09 |
| wxcafe | dunno | 17:09 |
| Estel_ | if it was pressure sensitivep why not, but replacing pen or producing is more expensive on such hybrid | 17:09 |
| Estel_ | why bother if resistive is *just* that, without need for capacitive, or conductive gloves | 17:10 |
| Estel_ | resistive can have multitouch easily attached by driver, or even (less easily) software | 17:11 |
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| Estel_ | just no much reasons for capacitive, either that crapple did it once and everyone copy and paste | 17:11 |
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| thedead1440 | its the experience Estel_; n900 resistive is just not as smooth or easy to use as capacitive screens. I haven't used a proper multi-touch resistive yet so wouldn't know how great they actually are or are just proclaimed to be great due to being rare... I read once about costs being a factor in it too that prohibited multi-touch resistive vs capacitve | 17:13 |
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| * ShadowJK finds capacitive screens harder to use :/ | 17:20 | |
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| ShadowJK | I'm constantly accidentally activating things :/ | 17:20 |
| Sicelo | lol | 17:21 |
| Sicelo | kerio: can't find it.. guess i'm using bad keywords or something | 17:21 |
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| mlwane | Hello folks | 17:25 |
| mlwane | I have a problem with Pali's U-boot, it might be a really simple problem, I just don't know what I'm missing | 17:27 |
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| mlwane | Basically, I'm trying to boot Arch linux arm (Alarm), on an N900, but for some reason the device shuts down after the message "Starting kernel ..." | 17:28 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, worst in web browsers. | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | "I want to scroll, not sign up for your stupid mailing list!" | 17:33 |
| ShadowJK | GeneralAntilles; yes, accidentally zooming in/out is worst | 17:33 |
| ShadowJK | accidental double taps | 17:33 |
| ShadowJK | or octotaps | 17:34 |
| jon_y | mlwane: watchdog bit you? | 17:40 |
| bennypr0fane | kerio; why is there an asterisk in this command? apt-get install u-boot-flasher u-boot-tools && dpkg -i kernel-power-bootimg* && ln -s /etc/bootmenu.d/*power* /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 17:43 |
| bennypr0fane | or anyone else | 17:43 |
| bennypr0fane | the one after dpkg -i | 17:44 |
| bennypr0fane | kernel-power-bootimg | 17:44 |
| bennypr0fane | is the kernel-power-bootimg package automatically downloaded by installing u-boot-flsaher? | 17:44 |
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| mlwane | jon_y: Is that the notorious watchdog? | 17:46 |
| jon_y | maybe, did you turn it off? | 17:47 |
| jon_y | it's there to prevent lockups | 17:47 |
| jon_y | I'm not sure if your kernel kicks the dog periodically | 17:47 |
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| jon_y | heh, kicks the dog | 17:47 |
| mlwane | I don't have enough experience to turn it off, how would I go about that? | 17:48 |
| Skry | there's no need to turn it of, it's handled | 17:49 |
| jon_y | Skry: well, there is that debug mode to turn it off | 17:49 |
| Skry | yes, but there is no need to do that | 17:50 |
| jon_y | iirc that will make your keypad light up 24/7 though | 17:50 |
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| mlwane | Oh there you are Skry! | 17:50 |
| mlwane | I'm trying to boot into your version of Alarm | 17:51 |
| Skry | it's pretty much covered in the tmo thread | 17:54 |
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| mlwane | I have looked through the thread, but I don't know what is the problem exactly | 17:55 |
| mlwane | I have the rootfs extracted into an ext4 partition of my SDcard (5th partition), and I created the relevant bootmenu entry for it, but for some reason it doesn't boot | 17:55 |
| Skry | if you feel your trouble is not with u-boot, try booting with flasher, if it still does not boot, we'll return to subject | 17:56 |
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| mlwane | Does the fact that the partition is in an extended partition make any difference? | 17:57 |
| mlwane | u-boot works fine with, maemo 5, power-kernel 51, and android | 17:58 |
| mlwane | So I assumed the problem is just a misconfiguration of the bootmenu entry | 17:59 |
| thedead1440 | <warfare> everything back up again. | 18:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [general notice] we suffered kernel OOPS and reboot problems on blade-a. the relevant machines been down for some time and might recover now | 18:00 |
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| thedead1440 | oops; i thought you were afk :D | 18:00 |
| sardini_ | hey for the first time in 3 year maemo said to me No space left on device :-) | 18:01 |
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| * ShadowJK has 1.9g free :( | 18:03 | |
| bennypr0fane | what the freakin f*** is that: "user is not in the sudoers file. this inceident will be reported"? | 18:04 |
| kerio | i think it means that user is not in the sudoers file | 18:04 |
| kerio | and that that incident will be reported | 18:04 |
| bennypr0fane | kerio very funny. why am i not in the sudoers file. why did I not get the same message at the previous sudo command? | 18:06 |
| kerio | different command? | 18:07 |
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| bennypr0fane | apt-get | 18:07 |
| kerio | are you root now? | 18:07 |
| bennypr0fane | i dunno. with that msg apparently not | 18:08 |
| kerio | no, i mean | 18:08 |
| kerio | are you currently the root user | 18:08 |
| bennypr0fane | no | 18:08 |
| bennypr0fane | never am | 18:08 |
| bennypr0fane | shouldn't it work without that? | 18:09 |
| kerio | not necessarily | 18:09 |
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| bennypr0fane | well dpkg -i should, right? | 18:10 |
| kerio | yes | 18:10 |
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| bennypr0fane | aslo, there is just the one user, how can it not be in the sudoers file | 18:13 |
| bennypr0fane | Maemo never asks you to specify a user | 18:13 |
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| bennypr0fane | kerio: I'm trying to run the command you gave me earlier: dpkg -i kernel-power-bootimg* && ln -s /etc/bootmenu.d/*power* /etc/default/bootmenu.item BTW I downloaded kernel-power-bootimg from here: http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pali/kernel-power-bootimg_2.6.28-10power52_armel.deb are you sure this kernelimage won't destroy U-Boot? | 18:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | get rootsh | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sudo gainroot | 18:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | or, if you already isntalled it, do ssh root@127.0.0.1 | 18:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hey kerio, how about a system pkg that has nothing but conflicts with sudser, rootsh, and a few other BS pkgs? | 18:23 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: hm | 18:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | call it "secure maemo" | 18:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | or simply "seal" | 18:25 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: the problem is, those packages don't uninstall cleanly | 18:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, that's another problem. I was just concerned about someone installing them | 18:26 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: higher versions that do the best they can to uninstall cleanly the previous versions but otherwise do nothing? | 18:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | of course anybody could create a new pkg with same crap inside as rootsh | 18:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but at least for the known borked packages you could block them from getting installed | 18:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | for now the obvious flaw in proper root password like in ~jrtools is: any intruder can (re-)install rootsh and is in. with such a pkg that's not possible anymore | 18:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I honestly don't give a rat fart about uninstallation | 18:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | particularly not via such a seal pkg like I suggested above | 18:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | hey, call it rootsh-II and actually ship a proper sudoers file with it | 18:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you can't fix rootsh (since it would break stuff by changing the "API"), but you *can* ship a better alternative that even conflicts with the original rootsh | 18:35 |
| bennypr0fane | I have a dependency problem installing kernel-power-bootimg | 18:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which one | 18:36 |
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| bennypr0fane | there are 4 packages here: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1305042&postcount=288 which one do I need to install first? | 18:36 |
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| bennypr0fane | I have U-Boot installed now, not rebooted yet. | 18:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you only need bootimage and modules | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | iirc | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you definitely don't want to install flasher | 18:40 |
| bennypr0fane | now I tried to install kp-bootimg, it says it needs kp-modules first. modules won't install though: "package not compatible" | 18:40 |
| bennypr0fane | This is in HAM. should I try from terminal? (but he threatens to report me to admin) | 18:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 18:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | install rootsh in HAM | 18:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | then in terminal `root` | 18:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which is a short form for sudo gainroot | 18:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | then install via dpk -i | 18:42 |
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| bennypr0fane | I'd be flabberghasted if I didn't have rootsh already installed, but I'll check now | 18:43 |
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| bennypr0fane | like I thought I do have it installed | 18:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | then use apt-get or dpkg | 18:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | in a root shell | 18:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | err for kp52 probably dpkg | 18:46 |
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| bennypr0fane | uhm what? bootimg depends on modules, and modules depends on bootimg? | 18:50 |
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| bennypr0fane | http://pastie.org/6573876 | 18:53 |
| bennypr0fane | this is the whole session | 18:53 |
| bennypr0fane | ah, right. modules does not depend on kern-power-bootimg, but on kernel-power. but if I install that, U-Boot will take a torpedo hit | 18:55 |
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| merlin1991 | huh | 19:05 |
| merlin1991 | only if you install kernel-power-flasher u-boot goes down | 19:05 |
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| bennypr0fane | ok, can I install kernel-power without installin flasher? | 19:08 |
| bennypr0fane | I mean if I can just go and install the power kernel without further ado, then waht's the flasher for? | 19:12 |
| merlin1991 | kernel-power is just another package | 19:12 |
| merlin1991 | the flasher flashs it into the kernel area | 19:12 |
| merlin1991 | where your u-boot sits | 19:12 |
| merlin1991 | the kernel-power packge provides the kernel file to flash | 19:12 |
| merlin1991 | so just get the bootimg modules and kernel packge | 19:13 |
| merlin1991 | don't install the flasher | 19:13 |
| merlin1991 | and reboot | 19:13 |
| bennypr0fane | but I have to go 1. kernel 2. modules and 3. bootimg? | 19:14 |
| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: no, you need only bootimg and modules | 19:14 |
| freemangordon | iirc | 19:14 |
| bennypr0fane | freemangordon as mentioned above, bootimg depends on modules, and modules depends on kernel-power | 19:15 |
| freemangordon | hmm, could be, though I think modules depend on kernel-power|kernel-power-bootimg | 19:16 |
| bennypr0fane | I wonder: if modules did not depend on kp, there would be no need to install it becauser the kernel is "in" the bootimage anyway, right? | 19:16 |
| freemangordon | might be wrong though | 19:16 |
| freemangordon | however, don;t install -flasher | 19:16 |
| bennypr0fane | freemangordon see my paste above, maybe I read it wrong | 19:16 |
| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: it does not work like that, read what merlin1991 wrote about the -flasher thingie | 19:18 |
| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: but seems -modules depend on kp | 19:19 |
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| freemangordon | hmm, I'll ask pali what is the rationale of having -modules depend only on -kernel | 19:20 |
| freemangordon | but not on -kernel|-booting | 19:20 |
| bennypr0fane | i did read what merlin1991 wrote about the -flasher thingie. did you read what i wrote about the ohter thingies? | 19:23 |
| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: yep, seems you need to install those 3 packages | 19:23 |
| bennypr0fane | ...in that order | 19:25 |
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| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: call dpkg with those 3 packages on the command line, it will install them in the correct order | 19:26 |
| bennypr0fane | ha, good idea | 19:27 |
| bennypr0fane | regardless if I put them in the command in the wrong order? | 19:28 |
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| freemangordon | yep | 19:28 |
| bennypr0fane | anyways, I already managed now | 19:28 |
| bennypr0fane | do you know what I'm supposed to do with the *power* in this command: ln -s /etc/bootmenu.d/*power* /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 19:29 |
| freemangordon | where did you get that from? | 19:29 |
| kerio | ln -s /etc/bootmenu.d/20-Maemo5-kernel-power-2.6.28.10-power52.item /etc/default/bootmenu.item | 19:29 |
| freemangordon | aah, I see | 19:30 |
| bennypr0fane | kerio why a symlink instead of replacing? | 19:32 |
| bennypr0fane | bootmenu items are all symlinks? | 19:32 |
| kerio | because u-boot-update-bootmenu wants it to be so | 19:32 |
| bennypr0fane | do I need to sudo this? | 19:33 |
| bennypr0fane | apparently not | 19:33 |
| bennypr0fane | gonna go and reboot now | 19:33 |
| bennypr0fane | again, wish me brick | 19:33 |
| bennypr0fane | >_< /me is sweating | 19:34 |
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| bennypr0fane | the ln -s command is not supposed to generate output, is it? | 19:35 |
| kerio | oh for fuck's sake | 19:37 |
| kerio | playing around with the bootloader requires at least a minimal knowledge of how to operate a linux shell | 19:37 |
| bennypr0fane | haha | 19:37 |
| bennypr0fane | I like to make a bit of a drama - sorry about that | 19:39 |
| bennypr0fane | but you gotta admit that in the end you never know what's gonna happen | 19:39 |
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| bennypr0fane | how do i power off in the u-boot console? | 19:47 |
| freemangordon | you cant' | 19:47 |
| freemangordon | you can onle reboot | 19:47 |
| freemangordon | *onl | 19:47 |
| freemangordon | the fuck | 19:47 |
| freemangordon | *only | 19:48 |
| bennypr0fane | how? | 19:48 |
| freemangordon | try with "reset" or "reboot" | 19:48 |
| freemangordon | or type "help" ;) | 19:48 |
| bennypr0fane | ah, reset. there is no reboot | 19:48 |
| bennypr0fane | did type help. problem is, you only get to see the last few commands, they scroll down too quickly to read | 19:49 |
| bennypr0fane | reset works | 19:50 |
| sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: sorry for being dumb, but the new libpixman. What should I be looking for bug wise? have no issues AFAIK. | 19:50 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: AFAIK pixman is used in every .so that is touching the screen, including xorg. I don;t expect bugs, but ABI incompatibilities. | 19:52 |
| freemangordon | well, not expect, but afraid of | 19:52 |
| bennypr0fane | I got a boot failure | 19:53 |
| freemangordon | so, as long as everything works as before and there are no crashes, we are fine :) | 19:53 |
| bennypr0fane | it reboots twice and then stops | 19:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I see, well no obvious issues so far. I didn't mean bugs per-say ;) | 19:53 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: it is about 3 years newer :) | 19:54 |
| bennypr0fane | can go into u-boot console though | 19:54 |
| bennypr0fane | soth. must have gone wrong when i did reset | 19:55 |
| bennypr0fane | bcs before that, i booted alright | 19:55 |
| sixwheeledbeast | gd gd nice to see upstream fixes on our devices. I asked because I wasn't 100% what the package was. Even after searching about. | 19:55 |
| freemangordon | bennypr0fane: remove the battery while in u-boot console | 19:55 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: hmm, what is not clear? | 19:55 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: http://www.pixman.org/ | 19:56 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: "sock" version is pixman-0.16.2 | 19:56 |
| freemangordon | *stock | 19:57 |
| freemangordon | the one in cssu-devel is pixman-0.28.2 | 19:57 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ah thank you, no point testing something if you dunno what it does. If you see what I mean | 19:57 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: see here http://cgit.freedesktop.org/pixman/refs/tags | 19:57 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: well, not exactly | 19:57 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: I need regressions test. If everything works as before, then the test is passed :D | 19:58 |
| bennypr0fane | *whew* ok, it's booting again | 19:58 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Maybe "I" just like to "understand" what I install | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: sure. just google for pixman :P | 19:59 |
| bennypr0fane | but setting power kernel as default didn't work. it boots stock kernel | 19:59 |
| sixwheeledbeast | thanks :P ... I had been looking for libpixman but search not friendly to me obv. | 20:01 |
| sixwheeledbeast | anywho regression testing ok so far for me :) | 20:01 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: yep, the same here, I have it installed on my primary since yesterday | 20:01 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: I guess our (CSSU) ultimate goal is to be as close to upstream as possible, without breaking things | 20:02 |
| sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: I am fortunate enough to have three devices again now. a "Devel+Thumb", "Pkg testing" and "stable". | 20:03 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I agree well good CSSU team :) | 20:03 |
| freemangordon | in the upcoming update there will be 4-5 very important libs updated to the latest stable upstream version | 20:03 |
| sixwheeledbeast | s/good/done/ | 20:03 |
| infobot | sixwheeledbeast meant: I agree well done CSSU team :) | 20:03 |
| freemangordon | zlib, libxml, libpng and (hopefully) pixman | 20:04 |
| freemangordon | ddid I forget something? :) | 20:04 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: and if aapo manages to bring newer glibc, this will be perfect | 20:05 |
| sixwheeledbeast | hows QML web browser thingy going ;) | 20:05 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: there are 2 blocker bugs right now. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=851172 and https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=849555 | 20:07 |
| povbot | Bug 851172: was not found. | 20:07 |
| povbot | Bug 849555: was not found. | 20:07 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: ask qwazix for the UI ;) | 20:08 |
| sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: will there be a non-thumb and thumb version of it? | 20:09 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: only -thumb, I am not sure gxx 4.2.1 is able to compile it at all | 20:09 |
| freemangordon | *gcc | 20:09 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I see | 20:09 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: sorry, the only future I see is cssu-thumb. Just too much of a benefit :D | 20:10 |
| sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: long term I agree, but while it remains as a separate branch in testing, its only on my testing device. | 20:13 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: sure, I meant in long-term | 20:13 |
| sixwheeledbeast | :) | 20:13 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: though it is on my "production" device since the day one :) | 20:14 |
| freemangordon | for an year or so :P | 20:14 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | I am not knocking that it's stable (and great BTW), but most have non-thumb I prefer to test and report for that. | 20:15 |
| sixwheeledbeast | on pkg test device anywho | 20:15 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: it makes no difference, merging thumb and non-thumb packages is ok | 20:16 |
| freemangordon | that's the cherry, the ABI is not broke :D | 20:17 |
| freemangordon | *broken | 20:17 |
| sixwheeledbeast | I mean the CSSU i.e. testing the CSSU Stable metapackage on updates etc... | 20:17 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: right now I am runing latest -thumb with cssu-devel packages on top. on my everyday device ;) | 20:17 |
| sixwheeledbeast | Can't do that on Thumb at the moment | 20:18 |
| freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: aah, yes, for stable | 20:18 |
| sixwheeledbeast | as above I now have a CSSU-Devel device that I apt-get upgrade for the hell of it, to test the packages | 20:18 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | this has thumb also | 20:18 |
| freemangordon | however, I am waiting for migration chaos to finish and will start pushing for cssu-thumb-stable and thumb apps repo on rmo | 20:19 |
| sixwheeledbeast | \o/ then thumb builder ... maybe | 20:20 |
| freemangordon | yep | 20:20 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | all good stuff round the corner waiting for the dust to settle | 20:21 |
| freemangordon | but lets have the "ordinary" stuff stabilized first | 20:21 |
| freemangordon | :nod: | 20:21 |
| sixwheeledbeast | can't agree more | 20:21 |
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| ssvb_ | freemangordon, sixwheeledbeast: pixman is API and ABI compatible with the older versions, AFAIK there was only one pretty much unavoidable compatibility break which may affect users - http://cgit.freedesktop.org/pixman/commit/?id=9c19a85b0037d48fdd180a2c59ef05bdc4f46680 | 20:28 |
| tx0h | jo, i use eric with designer-qt4 but my forms look well on my desktop and on the n900 the fontsize didn't match well and the input fields are just way to small. is there a trick to wysiwyg? | 20:30 |
| ssvb_ | freemangordon, sixwheeledbeast: also have a look at http://upstream-tracker.org/versions/libpixman.html | 20:30 |
| sixwheeledbeast | what version x server is N900 | 20:31 |
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| ssvb_ | sixwheeledbeast: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/x/xorg-server/ | 20:41 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ah, 1.6.99 | 20:41 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | mmm, so there potentially could be an issue. new pixman is 0.28.2. | 20:45 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | the workaround is only supported to version 0.21.2, after that x server 1.7 fixes | 20:50 |
| ssvb_ | sixwheeledbeast: 1.6.99 versions are actually pre-releases of 1.7 - http://lwn.net/Articles/351456/ | 20:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | oh | 20:53 |
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| freemangordon | ssvb_: thanks a lot. By looking at those we should have no problems | 21:10 |
| ssvb_ | looks like the relevant bug is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22484 | 21:10 |
| povbot | Bug 22484: was not found. | 21:10 |
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| ssvb_ | and the fixes to 1.7 xserver are http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=e9aa61e9f0d663d5b34a397b943b4d1df44e873d and cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=e9aa61e9f0d663d5b34a397b943b4d1df44e873d | 21:11 |
| freemangordon | ssvb_: "stock" is .16.2, so it is way ahead of 0.15.x | 21:11 |
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| freemangordon | IIUC | 21:12 |
| freemangordon | ssvb_: agree that we are safe? | 21:13 |
| ssvb_ | not quite, I don't see these patches in http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/x/xorg-server/xorg-server_1.6.99.1-0osso20090208.108+0m5.tar.gz | 21:14 |
| ssvb_ | which version of xorg-server is going to be used with pixman-0.28.2? | 21:15 |
| freemangordon | ssvb_: stock | 21:15 |
| * freemangordon gtg, will chack later | 21:16 | |
| freemangordon | check even | 21:16 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | ~fixribbon | 21:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ~ribbon | 21:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | infobot: fixribbon is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1324171#post1324171 | 21:53 |
| infobot | okay, sixwheeledbeast | 21:53 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ~fixribbon | 21:53 |
| infobot | i guess fixribbon is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1324171#post1324171 | 21:53 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: Estel_: ^^^ all fixed thanks. | 21:56 |
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| Estel_ | sixwheeledbeast, you're welcome | 23:29 |
| Estel_ | freemangordon, I feel silly correcting you about KP :D but I may be wrong, so correct me again, then... | 23:30 |
| Estel_ | but imo, with kp, to have provided all things that kp provide, bootimg isn't enough for some time? | 23:30 |
| Estel_ | (for dependencies) | 23:30 |
| Estel_ | I think that you need to install package that asks before flashing anything | 23:30 |
| Estel_ | how was it called, Pali's recent thing | 23:31 |
| Estel_ | then, install flasher, and don't allow it to flash | 23:31 |
| Estel_ | so u-boot won't get proton torpedo hit | 23:31 |
| Estel_ | but dependencies will be satisfied, due to all things kernel-power-flasher provides | 23:31 |
| Estel_ | right or wrong? | 23:31 |
| kerio | right | 23:31 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | Estel_: thought it would help having pictures for future ref. I know uUSB pictures helped a lot on uUSB repair. | 23:34 |
| * Estel_ nods | 23:37 | |
| Estel_ | don't tell me about usb, usb on 2nd device just started to failing | 23:37 |
| Estel_ | it is in palcep, but moves a little and stops charging | 23:37 |
| Estel_ | it wasnt sodlered down, due to my sodlering iron being out of service for a while | 23:38 |
| Estel_ | my 1st device worked for a year or so without soldering down, and usb wasnt a problem, on this device here, just because my sodlering iron is damaged for a week, usb port started to fall out after a week of use | 23:38 |
| sixwheeledbeast | i had that on one fortunately the heat from reinforcing "reflowed" the connections ;) | 23:39 |
| Estel_ | I'm trying to scavenge smth to get my alternate, low-power electric soldering iron to get tiny tip | 23:39 |
| Estel_ | s/alternate/backup/ | 23:39 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: I'm trying to scavenge smth to get my backup, low-power electric soldering iron to get tiny tip | 23:39 |
| Estel_ | or should I put device into oven for pro hotair reflow? ;) | 23:40 |
| sixwheeledbeast | on modem error, possibly if your brave ;) | 23:40 |
| Estel_ | the problem is it have to be used by my son whole next week, to allow us voip communication | 23:40 |
| Estel_ | for modem error i would use springs under emi shield workaround, if that wouldn't help, i would definitely reflow in oven | 23:41 |
| Estel_ | sixwheeledbeast, as you're fabolous tester, could you look @ maemo-ssu and my problem there, and see if you have idea wtf? | 23:41 |
| sixwheeledbeast | yep seems a working solution | 23:42 |
| sixwheeledbeast | maemo-ssu? what's up | 23:42 |
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| Estel_ | basically, dpkg fails to configure shitload of packages after install, due to postscript being unable to optify /usr/doc/<application_name> | 23:42 |
| Estel_ | stock fremantle (I quote kerio here) delete /usr/doc | 23:42 |
| Estel_ | so postinst scripts doesnt have anything to optify there | 23:43 |
| Estel_ | so "mv: can't rename 'usr/share/doc/blabla': No such file or directory" | 23:43 |
| Estel_ | results in: | 23:43 |
| Estel_ | postinst script failure | 23:44 |
| Estel_ | and dpkg leaving package not configured | 23:44 |
| Estel_ | solved by "touch /usr/doc/<package name>" to give it smth to optify and shut it fuck up... | 23:44 |
| Estel_ | but when installing few tens of packages, it's PITA | 23:44 |
| Estel_ | to touch every one separately | 23:44 |
| Estel_ | I'm pretty sure it wasn't the case, when i installed same packages on 1st device, some time ago | 23:45 |
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| Estel_ | now, as 2nd device was prepared from scratch, I go through installing some of same packages on it, and get shitload of such errors | 23:45 |
| sixwheeledbeast | mmm, stock maemo? | 23:46 |
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| Estel_ | cssu-thumb | 23:47 |
| Estel_ | oh shit | 23:47 |
| Estel_ | look at this | 23:47 |
| sixwheeledbeast | ? | 23:47 |
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| Estel_ | mv: can't rename '/usr/share/doc/mplayer': No such file or directory | 23:47 |
| Estel_ | dpkg: error processing mplayer (--configure) | 23:48 |
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| Estel_ | I'm *sure* it wasn't the case with mplayer | 23:48 |
| Estel_ | absolutely sure | 23:48 |
| Estel_ | before "mv: can't..." | 23:48 |
| Estel_ | there is | 23:48 |
| Estel_ | Optifying usr/share/doc/mplayer -> /opt/maemo/usr/share/doc/mplayer | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | then, above errors | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | during instalaltion of mplayer, and hundreds other packages (but not all packages suffer from it) | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | wtf? | 23:49 |
| joga | is your filesystem ok? | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | it's just like some postinst scripts started to get interpreted differently, as dpkg blockers due to unimportant errors | 23:50 |
| Estel_ | joga, yes, filesystem perfectly ok | 23:50 |
| joga | ran fsck? | 23:50 |
| Estel_ | kerio thinks that fremantle deletes /usr/doc/ content, and that it's normal, but should result in dpkg failure | 23:50 |
| joga | just a guess, I don't recall seeing such a message | 23:50 |
| Estel_ | joga, 1st - fsck on flash is useless, it can only damage filesystem more 2. yes, I tried fsck.ext* -f -n | 23:51 |
| Estel_ | and no errors found | 23:51 |
| Estel_ | yea, I don't recall such messages a few months ago, too | 23:51 |
| Estel_ | it looks like unimportant things started to get used as dpkg's excuse to stop configuring package... | 23:52 |
| Estel_ | and I wonder what changed that | 23:52 |
| Estel_ | tried to blame cssu for it, but other cssu users don't experience such werido | 23:52 |
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| sixwheeledbeast | what's in your /usr/share/doc and /opt/maemo/usr/share/doc | 23:53 |
| * Estel_ returns to type hundreds of "touch" and pasting /usr/doc/blabla | 23:53 | |
| Estel_ | /usr/doc/ nothing | 23:53 |
| Estel_ | /usr/share/doc was typo of mine | 23:53 |
| Estel_ | no, it wasn't | 23:54 |
| Estel_ | sorry, got confused | 23:54 |
| Estel_ | /usr/share/doc/ -> only things i create by "touch" | 23:54 |
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| Estel_ | /opt/maemo/usr/share/doc/ -> only things I touched, that got copied there | 23:54 |
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| Estel_ | = empty files with names corresponding to packages that I installed by workarounding problem manually | 23:55 |
| Estel_ | no, sorry | 23:55 |
| Estel_ | actually, just one README file in /opt/maemo/usr/share/doc/ | 23:56 |
| Estel_ | it seems that those touched files just disappear | 23:56 |
| Estel_ | but somehow, dpkg is happy with just having some shitte in /usr/share/doc/ to "optify" by mv | 23:56 |
| * Estel_ is gazed a little by all this thing | 23:57 | |
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| Estel_ | /opt/maemo/usr/share/doc is -rw-r--r-- 1 root:root | 23:57 |
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| Estel_ | if that matters | 23:57 |
| * sixwheeledbeast is looking though file system | 23:59 | |
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