IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2012-11-28

DocScrutinizer05and does the work when called from xterm?00:00
DocScrutinizer05vi_: ^^^00:00
DocScrutinizer05then check xchat settings,00:01
DocScrutinizer05scroll down00:01
DocScrutinizer05umm sorry, not there00:02
DocScrutinizer05tab "sounds" (click on any other tab, then use cursor-right to scroll to "Sound" tab00:03
DocScrutinizer05"sound playing method" External program00:04
vi_it says the path to the notify script.00:05
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DocScrutinizer05that should work00:05
vi_it should.00:05
vi_i will fix it tomorrow.00:05
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DocScrutinizer05vi_: o/00:06
Drathirvi____: sad... irssi is the best of all...00:06
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vi_DocScrutinizer05: say hello00:27
* vi_ lol00:27
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DocScrutinizer05vi_: hello00:33
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RzR is Back01:50
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RzRteotwaki, hi check
teotwakiI'm not going to start the sync tonight01:56
teotwakiconsidering it's been online for just a few hours01:57
teotwakiwill setup the sync tomorrow or something01:57
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RzRteotwaki, i am making my personnal backup02:12
RzRwill tell you how big is it02:12
teotwakiRzR: I don't care about size, no worries02:12
RzRi care :)02:12
teotwakiRzR: and you're the kind of people why I'm not making the back up right now.02:13
RzRI guess it will here to stay02:13
RzRI mean stay as long as we can do that backup :)02:13
RzRanyway this is a good news02:14
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Paliping Skry10:42
PaliSkry, can you give me link for your n900 linux 3.x git tree?10:43
freemangordon_Pali: what are those MR for microb-engine on gitorious?10:43
Paliwhat is MR?10:44
freemangordon_merge request10:45
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Paliah, when I looked into all microb* repositories I rebased -engine history for better reading10:45
Paliit is only rebased10:46
freemangordon_whatever that means :D. ok.10:46
Paliclone both repos and look at git history10:46
Paliwith 'gitk'10:46
freemangordon_i think this is the kernel10:48
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freemangordon_Pali: you'll need
freemangordon_iirc I included the config file too10:48
Palifreemangordon, In that merge request I linearized commits10:49
freemangordon_Pali: aah, now I got it , ok, nice10:49
freemangordon_Pali: why not join #maemo-alternatives ?10:50
freemangordon_Skry is ususally active there10:50
Paliwhat is -alternatives?10:50
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freemangordon_ask skry for better explanation, but afaik it is because of ALARM10:51
Palifor microb-engine, see: and
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freemangordon_Pali: ok, I was just wondering10:52
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Palinote that merge to main repo is not possible, due to it does not have common ancestor10:53
Paliit is needed to push --force to overwrite it10:53
freemangordon_BTW I have the nasty feeling that gitorious upgrade has screwed up CSSU repo10:53
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tadzikfunny, how I'm told about some GMO government decisions in my country on talk.maemo.org10:56
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vi____Genetically modified organisms???11:01
tadzikyeah, it's about food I think11:03
tadzikhaha. Read in reverse GMO is OMG11:03
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jaskaobject management group11:13
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vi____how come the date command does not work?14:37
vi____Or more to the point wtf clock is hildon using that is not the 'real' clock?14:37
vi____Or what I really mean is, why does the 'date' command not update the clock immediatley?14:38
r00t|homei noticed that too... because my rtc backup battery is dead and i switch batteries regularly, and then set the time with ntpdate14:44
r00t|homei guess the clock app just caches the time...14:45
vi____it updates if you lock/unlock the screen.14:47
vi____What a POS.14:47
r00t|homeis that one opensource?14:47
vi____the clock?14:47
vi____I have the stock clock.14:47
vi____I have never found a compelling reason to switch to the OS alternative.14:48
r00t|homepackage name?14:48
vi____for the OS alternative clock?14:49
r00t|homewhatever you are using14:49
vi____I have literally no idea.  It is just the 'clock' program on the n900.14:49
r00t|homeah, so the default one...14:50
r00t|homemy question was if it's opensource, and thus if the behaviour could be fixed14:50
vi____In other news, I have replaced that utterly retarded 'osso startup wizard' dialogue that makes you swipe to set the date and time with a zenity dialogue that just allows you to enter a (MMDDhhmmYY) string of numbers.14:51
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r00t|homehow does one replace that screen? (i'd just remove it completely and put a hook for ntp/gps date setting somewhere instead)14:52
vi____r00t|home: It is not so easy to fix.  I believe the clock applet has to poll the hwclock.  To keep polls to a minimum, it is probably only updated once every 30s/unlock.14:53
r00t|homethere is no need to poll the _hw_ clock... you just poll the _os_ clock once per second, like any other clock app...14:53
vi____r00t|home: I though of that but that would require a net connection/gps cold start that would take forever.14:53
vi____r00t|home: I do not know how it works.14:53
r00t|homeis there any serious problem with just booting with the clock set wrong until you have a net connection? the only issue is if i receive text messages or calls before the clock is set, they will be logged with the wrong date14:54
vi____To replace startup wizard (SUW) edit /etc/X11/Xsession.d/30osso_startup_wizard14:54
vi____r00t|home: I do not think so, I removed SUW for a long time and just set the clock from the status menu for a while.  It seemed to work ok...14:55
vi____...Except that one time I forgot to do it and my morning alarm did not work.14:55
vi____Edit the above file, you will see it does some fiddling with locales then runs the SUW dialogue.14:56
vi____I just replaced the exec SUW  with /path/to/my/script.sh14:56
r00t|homeactually the main reason i dislike the startup dialog is that when i boot the phone and put it in my pocket because i don't have time to wait for it to boot, it keeps ending up in some funny locale...14:56
vi____        echo "date $(zenity --entry --title="Set the time/date"  --text="Enter the time/date (MMDDhhmmYY):")" | sudo gainroot14:57
r00t|homeshouldn't that be date -s ?14:57
vi____r00t|home: Well mine is set to eng_gb14:57
vi____r00t|home: maybe, it works as such anyway.14:58
vi____Crummy busybox date command.14:58
r00t|homethere is a locale setting in the startup dialog aswell, and it keeps getting changed because the touchscreen isn't locked14:58
vi____pocket language change.14:59
vi____Perhaps for you it would be better to apt-get remove SUW14:59
r00t|homedoesn't seem to be in a separate package...15:00
vi____then start a script from that will do your connect to the net/update via ntp etc.15:02
r00t|homei'll find out if the phone works without15:02
vi____r00t|home: It works.15:03
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vi____Or at least it worked for me!15:03
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vi____Just do not forget to set the time!15:03
r00t|homei'd rather use event.d for the date setting stuff15:03
vi____I will be interested to see what you come up with.15:04
r00t|homewhat would be nice would be a non-gui gps date setting program (aka not gpsrecorder)15:04
vi____I imagine there will be a way to do it from a python script.15:04
vi____r00t|home: bearing in mind though you will be starting the GPS from a cold start.15:05
r00t|homeproblem is you only get the data via location api, no easy to parse nmea15:05
vi____It could take forever/never getting the time.15:05
r00t|homei use an external gps most of the time, so that is not an issue15:05
vi____r00t|home: aah.15:05
vi____If only there was a simple way to get the time from the phone network.15:05
r00t|homewould be nice to try both ntp and gps, whatever works first15:05
r00t|homethere is, but nobody (no operator) supports it?15:06
vi____I do not know.15:06
vi____All I know SUW is a pain in the dick.15:06
r00t|home_every_ gsm phone has an option for it, but i've never ever seen it work15:06
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r00t|home"date and time" settings on n900 also has an "update automatically" checkbox15:07
vi____Do you know where thumbnailerd is started?15:07
r00t|homethat sure as hell doesn't work...15:08
r00t|homeno idea15:08
vi____r00t|home: yup.15:08
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r00t|homethe most fun thing i have is an event.d file that starts pppd on a bluetooth/rfcomm socket so i can dial in from my notebook like with any other phone (just that it connects to the phone as a router instead of the operator network directly)15:10
vi____r00t|home: please explain.15:11
r00t|homethe n900 by default does not give you anything to share it's internet connection?15:11
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r00t|homethere is some (payware) app to run a wlan AP (or one could set that up manually)15:12
r00t|homebut i prefer bluetooth15:12
vi____BT==much lower power.15:12
vi____Is there a nice wiki page explaining how to set this up?15:12
r00t|homei tried to register on the wiki months ago but it doesn't work15:12
r00t|home~ $ grep [a-z] /etc/event.d/btppp15:14
r00t|homedescription "ppp dialin via bt"15:14
r00t|homeauthor "r00t"15:14
r00t|homestart on MOUNTS_OK15:14
r00t|homestop on starting shutdown15:14
r00t|homeconsole none15:14
r00t|homeecho 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward15:14
r00t|home/usr/sbin/iptables -t nat -I POSTROUTING -o gprs0 -j MASQUERADE15:14
r00t|home/usr/bin/rfcomm watch rfcomm22 22 /usr/sbin/pppd {} noauth
r00t|homeend script15:14
r00t|homeand then on your notebook, you just setup an rfcomm link and connect pppd to it15:14
r00t|homethe only "problem" is that the rfcomm port is not recognized by windows and such as the correct dialup service, so it only works by manually specifying the port (22)15:15
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r00t|home(the service isn't registered with bluetooth service discovery (sdp))15:17
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r00t|homedo you know which script mounts the sdcard / where can i make it mount it as ext3 instead of msdos?15:44
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int_uaIs extras builder dying?
vi____The sd card is mounted irrespective of FS.16:02
vi____(as long as the FS is supported by your kernel)16:03
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r00t|homevi____: no, it just says displays a message, "card format not supported" when it tries to mount16:18
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rhn_mk0hi there - is there a way to fix/revert advanced power monitor update on Fremantle16:32
vi____r00t|home: I am not sure.16:34
vi____Have you looked at the scripts in /usr/sbin?16:35
DocScrutinizer06int_ua: autobuilder is out of order since quite some time it seems16:36
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vi____mmc-mount references 'vfat' and 'ntfs'16:36
vi____r00t|home: ^^16:36
vi____rhn_mk0: I have no idea, what happened?16:38
vi____Have you tried re-installing it?16:38
rhn_mk0vi____: the top shelf widget says "starting APMD" and displays empty battery16:39
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vi____I do not know16:39
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vi____I would try apt-get purge it.16:39
vi____THen install it.16:39
rhn_mk0I'll try16:39
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r00t|homevi____: thanks16:43
r00t|homevi____: replaced it with: exec mount "$1" "$2"  ;)16:43
rhn_mk0vi____: thanks, appears to have helped, somewhat16:45
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vi____If you learned something new, make a short post about it on TMO so others may benefit from your knowledge.16:50
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vi____FIQ: Did you get to the bottom of your sip issues?17:19
FIQdid I have any?17:19
FIQvi____: I don't even use sip17:19
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vi____Oh, I must be thinking of a different user.17:24
vi____...carry on.17:24
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vi____r00t|home: It seems SUW checks to see if you need the date to be set or not.17:40
vi____Then decides whether to run.17:40
vi____So you need a check to see if the date has been set to the default.17:40
vi____That is easy enough, just check to see if the year is 2009, if so, run your alternative.17:40
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DocScrutinizer05r00t|home: cssu-t supports ext3 partitions on uSD17:47
ShadowJKhm... Yesterday my local gsm mast was not working. Status said "repair in progress". Now it seems to work, but I also get 3g signal downstairs, at -70dBm.  wtf17:50
ShadowJKdid they upgrade it to 3g17:50
r00t|homevi____: i'd be doing the 2009 thing anyway17:51
ShadowJKThe operator has a google maps overlay of faults17:51
DocScrutinizer05aaah, nice17:51
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ShadowJKYesterday 4 cone shaped things radiated outwards from where I live, and in the center was "2g Services impaired for some customers, repairs in progress"17:52
ShadowJKby "some" I guess they mean the other transmitters in area doesn't cover everything the dead mast does17:52
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DocScrutinizer05now if we had a proper cmt with decent servicemode, you could've checked what they're doing17:54
ShadowJKhm well, 700kbyte/s downstairs in living room on 3g17:55
DocScrutinizer05for example there's a cell-bar flag, that disallows normal phones to connect to the BTS, service mode though can invert that flag's meaning so the phone associates to barred cells only17:55
ShadowJKnever seen that before17:55
* ShadowJK wonders how the hell they pipe that much bandwidth to the local tower17:56
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DocScrutinizer05directional microwave?17:56
DocScrutinizer05rather common method17:56
ShadowJKoh I didn't think they'd push that much over microwave17:57
DocScrutinizer05you can tell by the dish with diameter ~20..30cm on the mast17:57
ShadowJKthe other operator in the mast has 25km line of sight to their nearest mast with fibre17:58
ShadowJKdunno about the operator I'm using tho17:58
DocScrutinizer05hmm? why not? even 2.4GHz 802.11N does up to 100MB17:58
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DocScrutinizer05but actually I heard LTE is a big hoax since they don't have the bandwidth to backbone that they advertise for LTE over_the_air18:02
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DocScrutinizer05often usual ADSL18:03
DocScrutinizer05or SDSL18:03
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ShadowJKLuckily the telcos here have a competency gap18:04
DocScrutinizer05so the up to 100M LTE bandwidth are to a eNodeB that has a uplink of maybe 1M or 10M18:04
ShadowJKThey're too incompetent to use adsl18:04
ShadowJKThe former monopoly telco has fibreoptic lines hanging on telephone poles, but they have DAC-ADC boxes every kilometer, so the analog bandwidth gets squeezed to 5kbit/s or whatever :)18:06
ShadowJKthey can't even do dsl on them, it's hilarious18:06
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ShadowJKThe smallest cell operator has proper fibre running along main roads, and then microwave in towers 50km either side of the road18:08
DocScrutinizer05same problem here, no DSL with fibre. It's not exactly telcos' fault, it seems there are simply no DSL<->fibre units available on market18:10
DocScrutinizer05my friend lived in a large industrial bulding complex, and he couldn't get DSL since the whole block got fibre. They finally were smart enough to route a copper cable from outside the building to his flat18:11
ShadowJKWell here it's also that they installed that fibreoptic thing before dsl existed18:11
DocScrutinizer05yep, same here18:12
ShadowJKso it's voice bandwidth only18:12
DocScrutinizer05it's actually very ISDN centric18:12
ShadowJKfibre-vdsl / sdsl surely exists though?18:12
DocScrutinizer05so best you can get are 2*64kB18:13
DocScrutinizer05we got copper-VDSL18:13
DocScrutinizer05fibre-to-home is *very* rare here18:13
ShadowJKfibre - vdsl on copper?18:13
ShadowJKYeah we had to build our own fibre here ;p18:14
DocScrutinizer05yeah, they link the DSLAM in the switchbox next corner with optical fibre18:14
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DocScrutinizer05from there on it's VDSL on copper18:15
ShadowJKmaybe operator rented some of our dark fibre, though I didn't see any new patches couple weeks ago when I visited this area's central last time.. and I would have noticed the excavator18:15
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vi____Is there a mobile phone provider that does not compress images like O2?18:25
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DocScrutinizer05vi____: hmm?18:28
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vi____It would seem the O2 network intercept images(pictures) and re-compress them on the fly to save on bandwidth.18:29
DocScrutinizer05you got image compression on HTTP?18:29
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ShadowJKOh yeah, seems many operators in UK and USA intercept web traffic and recompress images to lower quality18:30
vi____Is that even legal?18:30
ShadowJKsome also insert javascript to produce context menus offering full quality pic18:30
ShadowJKif you want a single specific pic in original quality..18:30
DocScrutinizer05I guess if they do that's a service they offer to you, and most likely you can avoid that by using a different APN, or by setting up your account on some website they offer for that pupose18:30
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ShadowJKon one hand I'm kinda sad many sites are moving to https, because my squid proxy wont be caching much anymore, but then again hopefully it puts a stop to intercept-modify18:31
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DocScrutinizer05after all what's the benefit for operator in doing that? you're 'charged by the megabyte' usually18:32
ShadowJKAlthough, there are companies making transparent proxies capable of intercepting and decrypting https on the fly without browser's notifying the user (except google chrome, for specific google sites)18:32
vi____ShadowJK: A MITM attack?18:33
DocScrutinizer05ShadowJK: hardly possible18:33
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DocScrutinizer05well, they possibly can decrypt, but not alter content18:34
DocScrutinizer05vi____: simple solution: use a proxy on your own box18:35
DocScrutinizer05via https18:35
vi____DocScrutinizer05: ugh.18:36
vi____I have a limited upstream of 100kb/s on my home internet.18:36
vi____What an utter ballache.18:37
vi____Why is there something crippled on every network?18:37
vi____O2, obnoxious traffic manipulation.18:38
vi____Tmobile, SIP is blocked.18:38
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DocScrutinizer05vi____: maybe you can find somebody with a box with FAAAT backbone who'd be willing to offer you an account ;-D18:41
vi____DocScrutinizer05: do you have one?18:42
DocScrutinizer05guess what's
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vi____DocScrutinizer05: my new proxy?18:42
vi____credz pls.18:42
vi____adduser vi_ now plox.18:42
ShadowJKDocScrutinizer05; basically browsers don't check much18:43
ShadowJKso if you have a fancy enough cert with which to sign, browser accepts it, even if the signing key isn't the one the site is really supposed to be signed with18:44
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keriovi____: echo foo | sudo gainroot?19:13
kerioHELL NO19:13
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kguwhere to find changelog for 21.2011.38-1Tmaemo6?19:33
tadzikon tmo19:34
kgucan't find changelog for testing flavor..19:34
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tadzikit's in testing thread, merlin1991 posted it19:34
kguohh, no wiki page?19:35
keriothe wiki is kinda broken atm19:35
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kguok, thx19:37
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keriovi____: no, seriously, every time you echo something to sudo gainroot, god kills a kitten19:45
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Pali~seen X-Fade19:49
infobotx-fade is currently on #maemo #harmattan #meego #maemo-ssu, last said: 'ZogG_laptop: ?'.19:49
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DocScrutinizer05Pali: do you expect that to change?20:06
DocScrutinizer05Pali: might as well be a zombie irssi session on some forgotton server20:07
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RST38hDoc: By the way, have you encountered a CSSU bug where Opera crashes when started from the desktop?20:11
RST38hDoc: But works fine from xterm20:11
DocScrutinizer05not using opera20:11
DocScrutinizer05sounds weird though20:12
RST38hsimilar problem happened before with BrainBench (I think)20:12
Drathirhi all...20:13
DocScrutinizer05try redirecting stdin/out to dev/null, use run-standalone.sh20:13
DocScrutinizer05check dbus stuff20:14
tadzikRST38h: that's operabug, not maemobug20:14
* RST38h will wait for freemangordon and WHINE =)20:14
RST38htadzik: Sure about it? Opera worked fine before a few latest CSSU updates20:14
RST38htadzik: Still works fine from xterm20:15
DocScrutinizer05wut? cssu?20:15
Drathirim testing dillo looks nice, exclude no touch evry place scrolling only right scrollbar...20:15
tadzikalso, I thunk it fixed itself a while ago :)20:15
RST38hnot here20:15
DocScrutinizer05how's any of cssu patches going to change the way opera works?20:15
tadzikit's not a problem with opera the binary, but something related to browserjs it downloads from opera servers20:15
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RST38hany way to reset it?20:16
tadzikRST38h: does it work for you on wifi?20:16
RST38hdoes not matter what connection I am using20:16
tadzikweird then20:16
RST38hhow do I reset browserjs?20:17
tadzikyou don't reset it20:19
tadzikyou may try renaming your .opera or whatsitsname20:19
RST38hah ok20:20
tadziknot sure if that'd help tho20:20
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ShadowJKopera works fine from launcher now for me20:42
kerioworksforme too20:42
ShadowJKalso new stuff appeared in speed dial after it stopped crashing20:43
DocScrutinizer05which speed dial? which new stuff?20:43
DocScrutinizer05some opera specific thing?20:44
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* DocScrutinizer05 ponders launching opera. If it's maybe already installed20:45
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DocScrutinizer51opera 11.50.14 WFM20:48
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ShadowJKa grid of "bookmarks"20:49
ShadowJKiirc there was only opera and bbc news there by default before20:49
ShadowJKnow g+, gmail, google search, opera mobile store (android only lol), opera sports news, my opera, bbc news20:50
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RST38hMaybe I need to reinstall20:51
RST38hor delete .opera20:51
DocScrutinizer51ShadowJK: found '*1' etc speeddials20:53
ShadowJKtry delete the broser js20:53
ShadowJKoh hm, I dont have it anymore20:54
ShadowJKwas a 115-ish k file in .opera20:55 takes forever to render though, in opera20:57
ShadowJKfull of javascript to path buggy websites on the fly20:58
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RST38hSeems to work now21:14
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RST38hShadowJK: thanks!21:15
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Drathirhelium browser dont work for me goin to try others avaible....21:33
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keriohm, helium browser is cool22:24
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NeutrinoPowerworks Firefox 17 on Maemo?22:28
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SpeedEvilthe re is no prevuilt version, that I am aware of22:29
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kerioNeutrinoPower: it's basically unusable outside of cssu-thumb, it uses too much ram22:53
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amospallaeven with thumb its quite slow22:56
NeutrinoPowerand midori?22:56
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amospallaI've used debian's midori inside chroot, its a nice one, but not comfortable to use without keyboard and mouse22:57
amospallaI suggest opera22:57
kerioi just don't get what's wrong with microb22:58
amospallaI feel opera faster, loading and moving on websites22:58
amospallaalso, multitab works really well, and the zoom function is unique to it right now22:59
amospallaI use microb when need flash only22:59
amospallaAFAIK, latest opera works better with heavy js sites than microb23:00
amospallabut still, I would prefer using fennec.. :/23:01
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vi__well, we need to build a debian squeeze armhf chroot.23:08
vi__to eek the last power out of the n900.23:08
vi__I tried changing ed image to arch armhf.23:10
vi__It ruined everything.23:10
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Drathiramospalla: fennec works for you smoothly? O.o23:18
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keriovi____: EEEEEEEVERYTHING23:20
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amospallaDrathir: no23:38
amospallaI meant, I wish it could run23:39
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