IRC log of #maemo for Friday, 2012-10-19

MrPinguOr edit the emmc image file ;)00:00
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*** ChanServ sets mode: +o teotwaki01:32
*** teotwaki sets mode: -b *!*Estel@*Maemo/Community/council/Estel-01:33
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teotwakiI kinda forgot I had that there.01:33
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DocScrutinizer05vi_: BS, better edit VANILLA image *before* flashing01:48
DocScrutinizer05btw you need to increase /home01:49
infobotfrom memory, jrtools is
DocScrutinizer05ooh, mrpingu already said that :-)01:50
DocScrutinizer05teotwaki: we too ;-P01:50
teotwakithe silence was amazing, though.01:51
teotwakiAnd the wrath of the Council did not hammer our position.01:51
DocScrutinizer05nobody been missing anything01:51
teotwakiis Estel still on the council?01:51
DocScrutinizer05time to remove the cloak01:52
Woody14619aHasen't been for months.01:52
aklsI was asking about keyboard layouts here01:52
DocScrutinizer05so what?01:52
aklsand somebody told me to set my hardware layout to russian01:52
aklsand it worked01:52
DocScrutinizer05so what?01:53
aklsbut now it doesn't work01:53
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aklswell, it works01:53
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aklsbut when I switch back to Latin01:53
aklsmy arrow keys are screwed01:53
aklsso the left arrow is russian б for some reason01:53
aklsand down arrow is left arrow O_o01:53
aklsso, just like in russian layout01:53
teotwakiDocScrutinizer05: who gives the cloaks?01:53
DocScrutinizer05freenode, by request of GC01:53
DocScrutinizer05read: X-Fade01:54
DocScrutinizer05GC == Group contact iirc01:55
aklsI was on cssu stable, now I'm on cssu testing01:55
aklsbut wtf..01:55
DocScrutinizer05that's no diff for you01:55
DocScrutinizer05CSSU doesn't mess with key layout01:56
DocScrutinizer05(basically, module NK-enter)01:56
DocScrutinizer05I never seen a Russian kbd, I could figure they look as weird as the German ones, with only 2 combi-arrow keys01:57
Woody14619aFWIW: Council will all change over in a couple weeks reguardless, and cloaks can nuke and be set one last time.01:57
Woody14619aSpeaking of, there is only about an hour left to vote for Board....01:57
DocScrutinizer05VOTE FOR BOARD!!!!!01:58
teotwakiI didn't get mah tokens01:58
DocScrutinizer05we *will* find out if you don't :-o01:58
teotwakiI didn't get my tokens01:58
teotwakican't vote01:58
teotwakididn't get any email regarding it01:58
DocScrutinizer05teotwaki: that's no excuse, this time yoiu can re-order them 500 times01:58
DocScrutinizer05Woody14619a: what's the URL?01:59
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aklsso, I'll try to make it clear. Hardware keyboard: English, Nederlands - everything works correctly. If I press left arrow I get the functionality of the left arrow. now I want to add russian layout! I set hardware keyboard layout to russian. Now it's russian layout and I can type in russian. Great. If I press left arrow, I get "б" letter. that's correct! OK! Now I want to switch back to english. I press ctrl+space, it says "Keyboard layout swit02:00
aklsched to Latin". Ok. I press Z - english Z is typed. But if I press left arrow then russian б is typed. WHAT THE FFFF?02:00
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aklslol, did you try to reproduce it?02:01
DocScrutinizer05no kidding: reboot02:01
Woody14619adocscrutinizer05: yup, that's the url.02:01
DocScrutinizer05o.O O.o  o.o   O.O  @.@02:02
aklsDocScrutinizer05, it was working correctly before reflashing02:02
aklsdid that already02:02
aklsI'll reboot again tho02:02
DocScrutinizer05then reflash02:02
aklsagain? wtf?02:02
DocScrutinizer05sometimes flashing partially fails02:03
DocScrutinizer05rarely but not unheard02:03
teotwakitoken was in spam?02:03
DocScrutinizer05I don't think it's caused by failed flash, but anyway a fresh flash gives you opportunity to check what you did just before problem starts02:04
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aklsDocScrutinizer05, I did nothing02:04
DocScrutinizer05sure, Nokia always sent spam ;-P02:04
aklsit's a fresh reflash02:04
aklswell, I have installed Faster Application Manager02:04
aklsthat's all I've done02:05
DocScrutinizer05you also used it?02:05
aklshmmm, updated catalogs02:05
aklsnothing else02:05
DocScrutinizer05there's ZERO support for fapman from CSSU, since it's *evil*02:05
DocScrutinizer05fapman is known to do things it better wouldn't do02:06
DocScrutinizer05and not ding things it ought02:06
aklscan't believe it screwed the keyboard02:06
DocScrutinizer05me neither02:06
aklscould you try to reproduce the keyboard thing?02:06
aklsor you already did?02:06
DocScrutinizer05but *something* obviously did02:06
DocScrutinizer05sorry, I have no russian kbd, even if i'd like to (which I don't)02:07
DocScrutinizer05wait for our Russian hackers (we got several here)02:07
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aklsDocScrutinizer05, what do you mean by "I have no russian kbd"?02:08
aklsit's there by default02:08
DocScrutinizer05my kbd mapping is not exactly standard anymore02:08
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aklsDocScrutinizer05, where is the file describing hardware layouts?02:10
aklsif it's even there02:10
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DocScrutinizer05see wiki: customizing maemo02:43
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reenignEesreveRso i bought my friend's spare n90002:46
reenignEesreveRbut he doesn't remember its lock code02:46
reenignEesreveRi've tried the default ones02:46
reenignEesreveR12345, 00000, 54321 ... didn't work02:46
reenignEesreveRwhat should i do? send it to nokia alongwith purchase receipt?02:46
teotwakireenignEesreveR: do that, and you'll never get it back again.02:47
reenignEesreveR:( why?02:47
teotwakiWell, it's what happened to a lot of people who sent their N900 in for repair02:48
teotwakithey got an N8 back02:48
reenignEesreveRif they can send me back an N9, i might willingly send it ;)02:51
reenignEesreveRso whatshould i do about lock?02:51
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infobotsomebody said lockcode was
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DocScrutinizer05echo root:$(grep -A 13 lock_code /dev/mtd1|tail -1):02:56
DocScrutinizer05then have fun with john the ripper02:57
reenignEesreveRi dont have the shell02:59
reenignEesreveRi cant open anything else besides emergency call02:59
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teotwakireenignEesreveR: reflash your device03:00
teotwakireenignEesreveR: that should get you back in03:00
reenignEesreveRcan i reflash w/o booting?03:01
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DocScrutinizer05err nope03:08
DocScrutinizer05btw since 1.2(?) you actually need to do a full reflash03:09
DocScrutinizer05incl vanilla/emmc03:09
DocScrutinizer05but maybe you better use rescue-os to get into phone, and then do the echo&john thing03:11
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DocScrutinizer05maybe the term "booting" is a tad fuzzy here03:20
infobotwell, maemo-flashing is
reenignEesreveRi really dont understand which files i need to download03:24
reenignEesreveRthere is a huge list03:24
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reenignEesreveRim using mac os lion03:27
robbiethe1stGet the flasher for osx03:29
robbiethe1stand the PR1.3 rootfs image03:30
reenignEesreveRand the flasher would install but won't show up anywhere in the path03:30
GeneralAntillesWho turned my beautiful how to page into an engineer's mess. D:03:30
* GeneralAntilles glares at DocScrutinizer05.03:30
GeneralAntillesThe section links don't even work correctly anymore.03:31
GeneralAntillesThis needs to be split into separate articles, probably.03:32
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ManoftheSeaHello.  I'm trying to recover a password for an online account on my n900.  I have root access, and know about /home/user/.rtcom-accounts04:12
ManoftheSeaHowever, it seems passwords are stored elsewhere.  Would anyone know where that is?04:13
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robbiethe1st Give me karma04:55
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Woody14619aTHANK ALL THINGS HOLY! :)05:08
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Woody14619aManoftheSea: I'll give you a hint.  You're best way to see your old passwords, it so not have a keyboard...05:09
ManoftheSeaWoody14619a: your hint is obscure.05:10
Woody14619aIt is. :)05:10
Woody14619ayou could say, it's *virtual*05:10
* ManoftheSea is not a virtual adept. He has no arete.05:10
* ManoftheSea will attempt that then.05:11
Woody14619aYour answer lies in the stars. ;)  Happy hunting. I'm off to celebrate being a loser. (No, really...)05:12
ManoftheSeaok, wow, I forgot this thing had an on-screen keyboard.05:12
ManoftheSeaHowever, yeah, I still only have asterisks.05:12
ManoftheSeaI don't have a backspace in the on-screen kbd05:13
Woody14619aYou don't need one.05:13
Woody14619aopen, select, close.05:13
ManoftheSeaselect?  Copy-paste?  It's grayed out.05:13
Woody14619aperhapse select is wrong... tap. :)05:14
Woody14619agrayed out you say?  Hmm... Then it may not work.05:15
Woody14619aMine are not grey?05:15
Woody14619aGood luck!05:16
ManoftheSeaUm, thanks.05:16
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Woody14619aI'm a loser baby...05:18
ManoftheSeaalso, why doesn't the OS-kbd have a backspace?05:18
ManoftheSeaAre N900 users perfect?05:18
ManoftheSeaso, I can highlight the stars, but not cut nor copy.  Oddly, I can paste.05:19
ManoftheSeaalternate:  Where are backups stored?05:19
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ManoftheSeaseriously, I can't find the .zip from osso-backup.05:37
ManoftheSeaoh, yeah, it's because I'm an idiot.05:39
ManoftheSeaOk, got it.05:39
andre__ManoftheSea, it is stored where you defined it. It's really up to you.05:39
ManoftheSeaandre__: it's because I forgot the "external card" is NOT MyDocs05:40
ManoftheSeaherpin the derp, here.05:40
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archlhi, all, my n900 is partly broken - autolock is not working07:04
archlthe keyboard is always open; so I cannot use  on-screen virtual keyboard07:05
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DocScrutinizer05hmmmm, obviously archl been in a hurry08:54
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jaskathink i need to make my own scv layout so i can move almost-useless chars there11:15
jaskato make room for a 4-arrow finnish layout with most of the unix-related chars with fn-something or fn-shift-something11:15
vi_jaska: ~vi-kbd11:16
vi_jaska: ~vi-kb11:16
vi_jaska: ~vi_kbd11:17
vi_~listkeys vi11:17
infobotFactoid search of 'vi' by key (16 of 1074): "nvidia's cg compiler ;; airport vid ;; biffview ;; dont be evil ;; favicons ;; ftp logview ;; kvncviewer ;; linux device list, ;; linux virus ;; name service browser ;; nvidia ;; old_viper ;; oldtest hivites ;; openview ;; pogovina ;; problem with the victim doing the decision.11:17
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vi_~listkeys vi-11:17
infobotFactoid search of 'vi-' by key (3): vi-kbd ;; vi-is-better ;; poor man's vi-mode.11:17
jaska i think has the compiler.. if wiki is to believe11:17
vi_jaska: oh wait, you are talking about virtual keybopards?11:18
jaskai mean the special symbol panel you get when you press ctrl-sym11:18
jaskaso i can move useless stuff like å, eur sign, gbp sign etc there11:18
vi_jaska: That panel sucks.11:18
jaskaand reuse those for meaningful stuff11:18
vi_Does the swedish board use the 4th row?11:19
vi_4th level eve,11:19
vi_4th level even.11:19
jaskabut some keys on the hardware keyboard dont work with shift-fn11:19
jaskalike z, x, maybe j and k11:19
vi_jaska: I know.11:19
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jaskaotherwise it would have been easy :)11:19
vi_But that still leaves like 25 other free keys to use.11:20
zeq1Hi everybody, hopefully I'm going to have some time to get Maemo hacking again soon, I've been using up my free time trying to get my skiing back up to scratch to pass an instructor test (on Sunday).  That along with trying to learn Dutch, and Linux admin work...11:20
vi_zeq1: Hey buddy!11:21
vi_You earned your R&R, enjoy it!11:21
zeq1hi vi_ :)11:21
vi_jaska: you know about editing the hardware keymap right?11:21
jaskayou mean xkb?11:22
jaskayeah i have a customized one11:22
vi_jaska: And STILL not enough space?!11:22
jaskayeah :|11:22
jaskaneed more room to map out 4-arrow keypad11:22
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vi_I have almost every key from a normal english keyboard.11:23
jaskawhich means moving atleast 2 buttons of mappings somewhere else.. and fixing the stuff i mapped behind z and x11:23
vi_How many characters is in the swedish aplphabet?11:23
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vi_only 2 more than english!11:23
jaskaah, swedish is 2911:23
jaskafinnish is 2811:24
vi_wtf are you using these keys on?11:24
jaskabut å is just used in names so im not going to keep it on a hw key11:24
vi_You can use the Z+X bug slightly to your advantage.11:25
jaskaif you like backspacing stuff you typed :)11:25
vi_If you map z=[ and x=]11:25
vi_when you use 4th level z you will get []11:26
vi_when do you ever use a [11:26
vi_and not a ]11:26
jaskanot often11:26
vi_so save time and bring both up at once!11:26
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jaskaj and k are another broken pair11:26
vi_also works with () and {} and <>11:26
vi_jaska: Yup, I have () on them.11:27
zeq1do we know why they are broken?11:27
zeq1hw issue?11:27
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vi_it is to do with el-cheapo, poorly thought out hardware design.11:27
vi_joerg wrote a good explanation of it on the wiki some where.11:28
jaskaoh how i wish it had a 4-row pad11:28
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jaskai dont know how bad the n950 kbd is11:28
vi_do you mean 4 arrow keys.11:28
vi_do you mean 4 arrow keys?11:28
jaska4 rows of keys and 4-arrows :)11:28
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vi_ah yes.11:28
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vi_also the n950 kb is shit.11:29
jaskayeah ive heard rumors of such11:29
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jaskanot going to pay 1k for a beta phone :)11:29
vi_jaska: more like alpha.11:30
vi_and I do not mean alpha male.11:30
vi_unless doing thibgs the hard way is alpha male, in which case I do.11:30
vi_jaska: so swedish KB has the funny 2 arrow design?11:31
jaskafi/se layout is the same11:31
zeq1how did they come up with that?11:31
vi_why not just change rx-51 to use the 4 arrow design instead of the 2?11:31
jaskathat would displace some needed letters11:32
vi_zeq1: you have to press blue+left to go up.11:32
jaskai am trying to find room to make it 4-arrow :)11:32
zeq1so intuitive11:32
jaskaalso having to press fn-left to go up makes it hard to map page-up11:32
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jaskabecause if you map it to fn-shift it will not show as pgup but shift-pgup11:32
vi_jaska: I literally do not understand how you can have run out of letters when your alphabet has only 3 more characters than mine.11:32
jaskavi: because i can!11:33
jaskaalso various f-keys behind shift-fn-toprow11:33
vi_I have gone as far as mapping stuff like |, ~, %, ^, and ` because there is so much space.11:33
jaskaescape is fn-backspace11:33
jaskatoggle fullscreen is shift-fn-backspace11:33
vi_jaska: same here.11:33
vi_jaska: fn-space.11:34
infobotrumour has it, vi-kbd is
jaskafn-space is @11:34
vi_jaska: then how do you type in a space when you have fn locked???11:34
jaskai never lock fn?11:34
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jaskaalso i use ctrl-i for tab :)11:35
vi_You mean you let go of fn to make a space when you are typing in all numbers.11:35
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jaskaor a dot11:35
vi_jaska: illogical and filthy.11:35
jaskaso what11:35
vi_ctrl-i is for ctrl-i11:35
jaskawell, ctrl-i works in a terminal for tab so its ok with me11:35
vi_jaska: I am just making jokes.11:35
vi_I have tab on fn-enter11:36
vi_. on fn-fullstop11:36
vi_this lets you type in IP adresses without letting go of fn.11:37
jaskayeah :(11:37
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freemangordonvi_: hi11:39
zeq1hi freemangordon11:39
freemangordonzeq1: are you alive? :P11:40
zeq1just about :)11:40
freemangordonot it is some bot here11:40
zeq1definitely me... I think11:40
freemangordonwhere you've been, long time no see11:40
zeq1see above11:41
zeq1I've just been really busy11:41
zeq1not had time to be on IRC at all11:41
freemangordonhmm, that is good news I hope11:42
zeq1what's been going on here? anything new?11:43
freemangordonwell, depends.11:43
freemangordonlets say nothing new11:44
ivgalvezthe usual disputes here and there11:44
freemangordonzeq1: so now you have free time?11:44
freemangordonzeq1: BTW i found a bug in gcc4.7.2.11:45
freemangordontried 2012.09, the same11:45
zeq1is it in the known bug list for linaro?11:46
freemangordoncouldn't find it11:46
zeq1gcc bugzilla?11:46
zeq1what is the bug?11:47
freemangordondidn;t search. the problem is that gcc issues FPU 64(or 128) bit VFP load instruction on non-aligned data11:47
zeq1and fails or is slow?11:47
freemangordonkernel traps :D11:48
zeq1it requires alignment11:48
zeq1does the kernel handle it?11:48
zeq1I'll have a look in the gcc bugzilla11:48
freemangordonnaah, don;t waste your time for that11:49
zeq1the trouble is gcc is, umm..., rather complex to debug...11:49
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freemangordonzeq1: and it appears only on -O311:49
freemangordonwith -mfpu=neon11:50
freemangordoni.e. tree-vectorizer11:50
zeq1that should make it easier to find11:50
zeq1some constraint not applied I guess11:50
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freemangordonwell, if you are full of energy wating to be spend on maemo, you'd better make glibc auto-detect kernel pselect() suport :P11:51
zeq1that's waiting on me still? :O11:51
freemangordonyeah :(11:51
freemangordonseems I am the only one beside you who dare to touch glibc, but I was busy doing other stuff11:52
freemangordonat least noone volunteered :)11:53
zeq1Okay, I'll put it to the top of my Maemo TODO11:53
freemangordonzeq1: hmm, something that happened: romaxa joned maemo-ssu :D11:53
freemangordonthe fuck11:53
freemangordonvi_: here?11:54
zeq1that's got to be good!11:54
freemangordonit is11:54
freemangordonunfortunately he no longer works for Nokia11:55
zeq1romaxa is a top drawer hacker IMO11:55
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vi_freemangordon: You summoned.11:55
freemangordonzeq1: deffinitely11:56
zeq1working for Nokia nowadays probably would be too comfortable11:56
freemangordonvi_: any results for mplayer?11:56
freemangordonvi_: I am really curious11:56
freemangordonzeq1: well, depends, if you are good with c#, why not :D11:56
freemangordonzeq1: BTW did you receive my mail?11:57
vi_freemangordon: Not yet, although I have found there are some weird iisues wrt to the keyboard.11:57
zeq1when did you send it? I had a prolonger server outage11:57
vi_when playing something with mplayer there are keys for skip forward/back fullscreen etc.11:58
freemangordon3-4 weeks ago. I asked for your ng-crosstool scripts11:58
freemangordonvi_: yes11:58
vi_these sometimes work, sometimes not.11:58
zeq1I had a WD Velociraptor start throwing IO errors in my array11:59
vi_sometimes if they are working, then you use volume keys to alter volume they no longer work after that.11:59
freemangordonvi_: how is the performance?11:59
zeq1(turned out to be a firmware bug!)11:59
vi_I suspect it is something to do with window focusing, although I am not sure.11:59
freemangordonI mean does it worth the effort?11:59
freemangordonzeq1: bad11:59
freemangordonvi_: btw there is still configure script --enable-maemo :D12:00
vi_freemangordon: I think so, I 'feel' so.  But I do not have real numerical proof.12:00
freemangordon'feel' how?12:00
freemangordonnaah, forget about numerical12:00
freemangordonwe don;t have such for -thumb too12:01
zeq1freemangordon: I have to confess, I never actually scripted the toolchain build, I have a chroot I use specifically for it, and just rely on bash history(!)12:01
vi_I tried to play an mkv file of 'zombie flesh eaters 2'.12:01
vi_Mplayer cannot play it, it is too much.12:01
vi_so the video progressivly lags the audio.12:01
freemangordonyeah, DSP is still the winner12:02
vi_unless you use frameskip.12:02
freemangordonzeq1: well, I finished doing the same12:02
vi_I got the impression it was skipping less frames with the new one than with the old one.12:02
vi_i.e. less jumpiness.12:02
freemangordonzeq1: though this time I put command lines in a file and saved them :D12:02
freemangordonvi_: yeah, I see12:02
vi_In addition to that it is a lot more stable.12:03
vi_Old mplayer would just crap out on audio streams.12:03
freemangordonthe one in extras is unstable?12:03
freemangordonaah, i see12:03
vi_and sit there doing nothing.12:03
vi_so you had to ctrl+c to quit and start again.12:04
vi_It bugged the piss out of me.12:04
vi_this one does not.12:04
freemangordonvi_: any chance to tell kmplayer what to pass to mplayer?12:04
vi_I do not know.  I have never actually used kmplayer beyond seeing that it worked.12:04
vi_I do not even know what it is written in.12:05
vi_it could be tcl/tk12:05
vi_with 'wish' gui extension for what I know.12:05
freemangordonvi_: the more important queston: can you define how backing swap is supposed to behave?12:05
vi_(although I do know it is not that!)12:05
vi_freemangordon: not slow as shit.12:05
freemangordonnaah, try harder12:06
vi_correction, frozen shit in an igloo.12:06
vi_ramzswap works.12:06
vi_if it had backing swap it would be great.12:06
vi_But as soon as you enable BS it just stalls.12:06
freemangordonI mean, if I am to be on it, I want to do it in a proper way12:06
zeq1especially if it correctly handled the flash erase block alignment12:06
freemangordonzeq1: that one is easy12:07
freemangordoni can perform runtime test in module load to find block size and partition misalignement12:07
zeq1freemangordon: but it isn't done now afaik12:08
freemangordonthe problem comes after that, i.e. when to write?12:08
freemangordonzeq1: deffinitely12:08
freemangordonbut it seems to me to be really easy12:08
freemangordonI still remember the days of NDD and interleave factors :D:D:D12:09
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zeq1I guess you write when you have a full erase block to dispatch12:09
freemangordonsounds sane12:09
freemangordonvi_: any thoughts on that12:09
DocScrutinizer51vi_: if you're interested in kbd matrix flaws: I wrote this lil essay in hw:components iirc12:09
freemangordonI guess ShadowJK can help here too12:09
zeq1there was a kernel patch (RFC)  for it a couple of years ago12:10
freemangordon(if I am not mistaken)12:10
freemangordonzeq1: for mtd or compcache?12:10
freemangordonhmm, not mtd12:10
freemangordonflash is not handles by mtd12:10
zeq1intelligent handling of swap on flash12:10
DocScrutinizer51zeq1: souns friggin useful12:11
freemangordonbut that is what Nokia does12:11
zeq1I don't think it ever went mainstream because *most* people use SSDs now, and the firmware is pretty good at handling it12:11
freemangordonuntil swap becomes fragmented12:11
zeq1freemangordon: it shouldn't become fragmented if the blocks are never misaligned12:12
zeq1it doesn't matter if they are not sequential12:13
vi_DocScrutinizer51: zeq1 was asking, I pointed him to your marvellous article.12:13
freemangordonI know12:13
freemangordonbut I still thing some background defragmentation should take place12:14
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freemangordonhmm, maybe it will come naturally when I start to play with it12:14
freemangordonusually it happns that way12:15
zeq1it would be really good to have decent swap performance12:15
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zeq1plus less flash wear12:16
freemangordonthe other option would be to use...ummm.. how was that called12:16
freemangordonMM that fennec/firefox uses12:16
vi_zeq1: flash wear is a myth.12:16
freemangordonaah, yes, jmalloc12:17
vi_on devices that have a controller that takes care of wear levelling.12:17
freemangordonwhat do you think? about jmalloc type of algorithm12:18
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freemangordonBTW I am not sure how exactly backing swap works now12:20
freemangordondoes it try to compress and write as soon as there is a page request?12:20
freemangordonvi_: any clue?12:21
DocScrutinizer51vi_: (a myth) not anymore nowadays, with multilevel cells12:26
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raccoon_hey everyone. i just got myself an N900 and would like to know whats going on in the community today. where is a good place to look for current software/distributions if you want to hack it? i am an experienced linux and bsd user but the maemo platform is new grounds :)12:33
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freemangordonraccoon_: you may want to install CSSU on it12:36
infoboti heard cssu is
freemangordonand if you are bold enough, go for12:37
infoboti heard cssu-thumb is <DocScrutinizer05> [thumb2 microb] indeed seems to render like mad, subjectively, or
freemangordonraccoon_: but it really depends what you want to exactly "hack"12:38
raccoon_freemangordon: i'm unsure at the moment, so i'd like to see what the community is up to12:38
raccoon_but i'll take a look at CSSU, thanks12:38
vi_raccoon_: CSSU is the community firmware release.12:39
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raccoon_vi_: allright12:39
vi_raccoon_: Think of it being like cyanogenmod but on hyper-steroids and not wearing a back to the future tee-shirt.12:40
raccoon_actually, cyanogen came to mind when thinking if there were any similar community projects12:40
raccoon_but thanks for updating me about the no-frills approach12:40
raccoon_i also find cyanogen a little too flashy12:41
vi_freemangordon: BS is used when a page cannot be compressed by a certain percentage.12:41
vi_This way, uncompressed pages will not eat up your precious ramdisk.12:42
freemangordonaah, yes12:43
vi_raccoon_: Then you are in luck!  The n900 is anything but flashy!12:43
freemangordonsounds ineffective12:43
raccoon_vi_: sounds like my cup of tea :-D12:43
raccoon_still live in the terminal most of my wake hours...12:44
vi_then you will never want another device after this one.12:44
freemangordonvi_: i would rather write everything to flash (compressed) while keeping it (compressed) in ram too, until the point RAM is filled12:44
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freemangordonthen if i have to store a new page, i'll evict the older in RAM and use it.12:45
freemangordonhmm, i'll have to recall how was that working12:48
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vi_raccoon_: The most important thing you want to learn is how to reflash the firmware.12:49
DocScrutinizer51raccoon_: better come here asking for first 2 weeks. Maemo has some pretty unintuitive idiosyncrasies, e.g. you should be a bit careful with usual install methods like you know from other linux: apt-get etc12:49
infobotit has been said that maemo-flashing is
jaskahmm, the wlan is pretty damn laggy with the new access points at work12:49
jaskai wonder if its some power saving stuff, sshing into the phone is.. icky12:49
vi_jaska: Yes, it is.12:49
jaskathe old ap was crap otherwise but it wouldnt do this :D12:50
vi_jaska: You have 2 choices.12:50
freemangordonvi_: 3 :P12:50
vi_1. Turn off wifi powersaving when at work.12:50
jaskacan i disable powersaving on the n900-end12:50
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jaskai dont want to change the config of the wlan aps12:50
vi_2. fiddle with the access points settings.12:50
raccoon_DocScrutinizer51: oh, ok, thanks for the heads up12:50
jaskaeven if i am the person who sets them up :)12:50
vi_jaska: w00t!12:51
infobotmethinks jrtools is
vi_DocScrutinizer51: You figured out how to trick the powersaving with beecons or something right?12:51
jaskaat home everything is fine and it doesnt eat up the bat12:51
freemangordonjaska: you have 3 options on n900 re wlan power savings12:51
DocScrutinizer51vi_: dtim=1 on AP12:52
DocScrutinizer51and beacons = 10Hz12:52
vi_jaska: ^ what he said.12:52
DocScrutinizer51all you can do12:52
jaskatrying to figure out how to do it on the n900-side12:52
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freemangordonDocScrutinizer05: I suspect this means beacon interbal of 100 ms?12:53
DocScrutinizer51on N900: PSM=none12:53
DocScrutinizer51freemangordon: ywep12:53
freemangordonDocScrutinizer51: what?12:53
freemangordonPSM=none will burn my battery at home for 6 hours with the above settings12:54
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freemangordonmy cheapo comes with exactly the same values12:54
vi_here is a crazy solution...12:54
DocScrutinizer51all you can do on N90012:54
vi_Use a bluetooth access point?12:54
jaskanot sure if the ap can support multiple power saving schemes on virtual ssids12:54
jaskais there any diff betgween on (max) and on (intermediate)?:)12:55
freemangordonbut disabling PSM will burn the battery in no time12:55
freemangordonjaska: 500ms/200ms for something12:55
freemangordonor 500/10012:55
jaskaat home the wrt54gl with alternative firmware seems to be fine hmm12:56
DocScrutinizer51yep, here too12:57
jaskaderp.. changed powersave to intermediate and it wont connect :)12:57
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freemangordonvi_: are you sure BT is less power hungry than wifi?12:58
jaskaarf, theres no fise.def for scv13:00
jaskaguess ill have to do from scratch13:00
DocScrutinizer51freemangordon: I'm13:05
DocScrutinizer51freemangordon: for some reason WLAN RX eats battery like candy, while BT needs some humble 2mA13:06
DocScrutinizer51my BT been enabled invisible for last 8 months - yeah I know I'm a moron ;-P13:07
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DocScrutinizer51yust too convenient to simply power up BT heaset and done. While standby time didn't change any noticeably13:09
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jaskayeah, this is pretty hungry with psm off13:10
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DocScrutinizer51are the "100mW" ERP or peak?13:11
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DocScrutinizer51iirc for GSM it's ERP, averaged over TDMA13:12
jaskaprolly erp13:12
jaskai could probably live with 10mW, the ap isnt many meters away13:13
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DocScrutinizer5110mW redcommended13:13
jaskaon anything bigger than a phone 100mW is a non-issue :)13:13
DocScrutinizer51the diff is marginal though, consumption wise13:14
GGoni want an e713:14
GGonwhy are they still so expensive13:14
GGone7 shod cost $99 by now heh13:14
jaskahmm i see. oh well, guess ill have to live with the power nomnom13:15
jaskaat home i can leave psm on max and itll be fine :)13:16
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DocScrutinizer51jaska: others did a ping per second, dunno if it's more economic than PSM=013:19
jaskatried, didnt help13:20
jaskathe ping would just stall13:20
jaskaand then continue in bursts13:20
jaskadtim is 1, beacon interval is 100ms on the aps hmm13:22
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jaskai wonder if short guard interval etc do anything13:23
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jaskaa-mpdu aggregatin shouldnt touch 802.11g stations13:24
vi_freemangordon: Yeah, I even linked to a paper on the subject some 2 weeks ago.13:25
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jaskathe effects do feel like something a-mpdu would cause tho13:25
freemangordonvi_: ok13:25
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vi_here is a really good paper on power use in phones:13:30
vi_it compares G1, N1 and freerunner13:30
vi_Our CPU micro-benchmarks show that dynamic volt-age and frequency scaling (DVFS) can significantly re-duce the power consumption of the CPU. However,13:32
vi_this does not imply reduced energy overall, because the13:32
vi_run-time of the workload also increases. Our results13:32
vi_show (Table 3) that only highly memory-bound work-loads (namely mcf) exhibit a net reduction in CPU/RAM13:32
deepyis there a one summary of how they all are related to each other?13:32
deepyI wish I could read all of it, but kinda cramped at work :p13:32
vi_deepy: save it for later, this is a good paper.13:33
deepyI will13:33
vi_Good as in a good read, I cannot comment on their scientific method yet!13:33
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deepyIt loooked very interesting from the brief part I read and the description13:42
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vi_hey, do you think if I painted the camera LEDs with some phosphorus gunk, they would produce white light instead?13:52
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jaskaalso, i wonder why its preferring the access point which is the other side of the office instead of the nearer one :)14:14
jaskawonder if its that it looks at channel 3 before 914:14
raccoon_different channels mean different bandwidth in the spectrum right14:15
raccoon_or how one should put it (not exactly my comfortable terms)14:15
jaskadifferent frequency14:15
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Skryvi_: since you've done keyboard remapping, do you have any idea how to use Multi_key as, lets say, Mod4 ?14:17
jaskaits constantly throwing wlan0: driver reports beacon loss from AP xxxxx - sending probe request inth kernel message buffer14:18
vi_Skry: Not exactly, however...14:20
vi_brb, dumping rx-51 to psatebin.14:20
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vi_Skry: look at lines 459-47614:23
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vi_this is where multikey is defined.14:23
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vi_I do not really understand xkb14:23
vi_it is witchcraft sent back in time from the year 500.14:24
Skryi agree14:24
vi_However on line 471 we can see the assignments for the 'multi' key.14:24
vi_on the first level it is control.14:24
vi_on level 2, that is shift+multi it is also control.14:25
vi_on levels 3+4 it becomes multi-key.14:25
vi_level 3 is fn+multi key14:26
vi_sorry, wrong14:26
vi_level 4 is fn+multi key14:26
vi_level 3 is shift+multi key14:26
* jaska hits the wlan chipset with a herring14:26
vi_no, that is also wrong.14:26
Skryhmm, so i guess i could just use level 2 as super_l or whatever14:27
vi_wl2170 chipset only responds to fresh water fish.14:27
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vi_skry I think level 2 is shift+ctrl14:28
vi_I tried to turn it into left alt once.14:28
jaskanormal, shift, fn, fn+shift14:28
vi_I did not get very far.14:28
DocScrutinizer51jaska: lost beacon usually means AP is sending them too infrequently, or it is using an insane N mixedmode setup14:28
vi_jaska: yeah14:28
vi_DocScrutinizer51: Is N even a ratified standard yet?14:28
DocScrutinizer51or you have 2 AP on channels close together14:29
jaskadoc: yeah, its in 802.11n 2 antennas in and out14:29
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jaskawith 40MHz channels etc.. think my phone is the only thing here that doesnt do 802.11n :)14:29
Skryvi_: yeah, thats about what I'm also trying, I find it somewhat challenging to use tiling wm without extra modifier14:29
jaska11n is no longer draft14:29
DocScrutinizer51keep in mind WLAN occupies 2 chan up and down from the center chan14:30
HurrianYou just finished moving to 11n? 11ac is coming very soon - Asus has yet another spec buff router that does ac.14:30
jaskain 40MHz mode its a bit more14:30
HurrianI think I'll be getting a USB network card for my N900 - probably a USB everything else, too.14:32
jaskayeah, usb ethernet is starting to sound good :)14:32
DocScrutinizer51jaska: so a close AP may spoil your 'home' AP's beacons14:32
jaskanothing on the same channel14:32
HurrianI'm thinking of placing my N900 semi-permanently in a flasher dealie, with USB hooked up to a hub that feeds it with power, ethernet, full size keyboard and mouse.14:32
jaskaor neighboring channels14:32
jaskaits not affecting anything else.14:33
jaskajust the n90014:33
vi_Skry: well, theoretically if you made the first instance of 'multi_key' on line 471 into the modifier you wanted...It SHOULD work.14:33
jaskaand the old access point worked with it.. those were total garbage that needed daily reboots sometimes14:33
vi_However I do not think you could have ctrl+alt combinations.14:33
vi_jaska: belkin 54g?14:34
jaskavi: hp v-m20014:34
jaskautter shit.14:34
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Hurrianjaska, usb ethernet indeed - scp over G-wifi is garbage.14:34
* vi_ shudders14:34
jaskathey pretend to be business aps :)14:34
Skryvi_: yeah, well, have to figure something out, thanks14:34
jaskathey randomly stop accepting associations14:34
jaskapsm=0 it works just fine tho :)14:35
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vi_jaska: You could put a script in /etc/network/if-up.d to detect if you are connecting to your work wifi and switch psm on/off.14:40
jaskavi: psm is per-network so thats handled by the user interface14:40
vi_jaska: Oh yes, so it is.14:41
vi_Lets all celebrate, something in ICD that was a good idea.14:41
vi_celebrate good times c'mon!14:41
infobotI'm Sexy and I know it! Yea!14:42
vi_lol wut. winphone7, you cannot set a static IP.14:43
Lava_CroftwindowsCE7 you mean! :)14:43
jaskai dont think its wince7 yet :)14:44
vi_~define wince14:44
deepyvi_: I recall being unable to do that in Android too14:44
infobotUse ~dict for definitions.14:44
vi_~dict wince14:44
infobotDictionary 'wince' (1 of 8): \Wince\, n. The act of one who winces. [1913 Webster].14:44
Lava_Crofti hope Asus fixes our Nexus7 for free:<14:44
Lava_CroftShoddy quality screen14:44
vi_~dict winces14:44
infobotcould not find definition for winces14:44
deepyAnd then I noticed that I can't connect my Android to AD-HOC networks14:44
vi_worst dictionary ever.14:44
HurrianWP7 doesn't do static IP? If true, that's a major oversight.14:44
Lava_CroftHurrian: wp7 is a pile of major oversights14:45
vi_Hurrian: no shit.14:45
jaskaooh, wince is at 7.. guess they synced the numbers14:45
HurrianEverything else has been able to do that since forever.14:45
Hurriandeepy, it's for "security" reasons14:45
vi_it is unbelieveable.14:45
vi_Relying on DHCP for security reasons?14:45
deepyvi_: no, ad-hoc14:45
Hurrianno, I was referring to ad-hoc14:45
jaska"security"... emphasis on the ""14:45
Hurrianunfortunately, they think users cannot discern between the icon for ad-hoc and AP-mode wifi14:45
vi_I still do not get it.14:46
vi_If I was going to steal your passwords and inject goatse images into all your web pages I would set up a fake AP, not use and ad-hoc connection.14:46
Hurrianwell, uhh, you see, very few Android devices can do true AP mode, even then they need special firmware provided by the device manufacturer because their WiFi chip is a special star revision14:47
vi_I would'nt use an android phone to launch SSL MITM attacks.14:48
vi_Id use an n900 XD14:48
deepyI would14:49
Hurrianmost people are stuck with ad-hoc wifi mode, and thus google's concern that attacks from rooted crap phones would pwn other idiots' phones.14:49
Hurrianvi_, I wouldn't use an android to do anything that requires a lot of CPU power in a glibc userland14:49
vi_Hurrian: How well can they chroot?14:49
Hurrianeverything is simply ridiculously slow, even in a chroot.14:49
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Hurriana Debian chroot on my SGS2 is /slower/ on XFCE than my N900 is chrooting the same image14:50
vi_I want a phone I can hook up to my computer monitor, chroot into debian, hook up my KB+mouse and then do some real shit.14:50
vi_like pr0n14:50
Hurrianthe N900?14:50
vi_Hurrian: How to hook it up to the monitor?14:51
Hurrianit does, uhh, tv-out and bluetooth HID14:51
Lava_Croftno RCA plugs on your monitor?14:51
deepyiirc ubuntu is working on something like that for android14:51
deepybut I don't trust it14:51
vi_no and I want more than a 640x480 resolution.14:51
Hurrianvi_, shitty RCA to VGA dongles14:51
Hurrianit's disappointing how few phones have any form of TV out nowadays.14:51
vi_Hurrian: I dont even have a TV.14:52
Hurriandeepy, it's been vaporware >1 year now14:52
vi_[JOKE] How do you know if someone does not have a TV?14:52
vi_[PUNCHLINE] They tell you.14:52
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keriovi_: [LAUGH] lol14:55
fizzieI thought miniHDMI or that MHL thing wasn't that rare these days.14:55
keriovi_: also use a usb vga adapter14:55
vi_kerio: kernel modules.14:55
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keriouse a usb vga adapter and compile the kernel module for it14:56
vi_kerio: I have no computer right now.14:56
keriovi_: buy a computer14:56
vi_NO U14:57
Hurrianvi_, how's that N950 working out for you?14:57
vi_Hurrian: It is not.14:58
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vi_I cannot use it for fear of hamfisting it into a million pieces.14:58
ShadowJKfreemangordon; re erase blocks etc.. you dont have to wait until you have an entire block to write (well except with kingston, but that's such a pathetically slow device it's pretty hopeless)14:58
deepyfizzie: I have MHL supposedly14:58
vi_Also I hate swipe/harmattan.14:58
deepyBut I don't have a TV to try it with :p14:58
vi_worst interface ever.14:59
ShadowJKfreemangordon; on the good sandisk you can almost write as much as you want, in any random order, inside one specific writeblock14:59
vi_an interfeaces if you will.14:59
Hurrianvi_, autorotate a PITA?14:59
vi_Hurrian: autorotate?15:00
Hurrianyeah, autorotate on the homescreen.15:00
ShadowJKfreemangordon; all the issues start when you touch many erase blocks with writes. At that point the card may read/write a 4M block (last sandisk I bought had 4M blocks) for every request15:00
HurrianI'd imagine it'd be gobs more useful on the N950 than N9 though15:00
vi_oh god, I hate autorotate.15:00
Hurrianpersonally, I find myself using my N9 more as a phone.15:01
vi_It always goes sideways when I dont want it to, then I have to wait ~ 1sec for it to come back.15:01
keriovi_: the n900 can do that too! :D15:01
Hurrianholy gawd that, especially when browsing in bed.15:01
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Hurrianif you tend to roll around a lot, prepare for lots of orientation twists.15:02
ShadowJKfreemangordon; some cards can only have one "open" erase block, some cards can even do 4 (and 4 is about the minimum you need before ext* starts running ok-ish with a single active process writing)15:02
kerioShadowJK: sandisk is good, right?15:03
kerioi've got a sandisk C4 which is probably an old C215:03
Hurriankerio, 32GB?15:03
ShadowJKfreemangordon; what fremantle's default swap algorithm does is: find largest free block in swap, write all new swapout sequentially into that block, when end of block is reached: repeat15:04
Hurrianthey're advertised as C4, and do 4MB/s seq writes, but drop to 2MB/s random15:04
kerioi know15:04
kerioit's still fairly good, tho15:04
freemangordonShadowJK: thanks15:04
kerioalso hahahaha no15:04
ShadowJKfreemangordon; if there's minimal other activity on the card (like if you use uSD) it then doesn't even matter if it's written 4k at a time15:04
kerio2MB/s random is not even close15:04
Hurrian~600KB-1MB/s, actually.15:05
ShadowJKYou treat it when writing as if it was a tape drive :)15:05
HurrianI think.15:05
freemangordonShadowJK: but I wan't to make it better than Nokia's algo, if possible15:05
freemangordonShadowJK: are you sure it wouldn't be better is I wait until I have a whole erase block to write?15:06
infobotfreemangordon meant: ShadowJK: are you sure it wouldn't be better if I wait until I have a whole erase block to write?15:06
keriofreemangordon: wtf is an erase block15:06
kerioeMMC and uSD are both perfect block devices, they do their own thing15:06
ShadowJKfreemangordon; it's better when there's alot of other activity on the card, like filesystems15:06
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freemangordonShadowJK: yeah, my thoughts exactly. If i write data aligned to and having sizeof eraseblock, underlying block driver wuould not interleave my request with fs system requests15:08
ShadowJKkerio; yes they do their own thing, and that means worst case behaviour becomes read-modify-write 4M for every write you send. Take a class 4 card, 4M/s write speed, if you trigger a 4 megabyte read-modify-write with a 4kilobyte write repeatedly, the speed has now dropped to 4kilobytes/sec instead of 4M15:08
keriothat's ungood15:09
ShadowJKthere's a reason SSDs have half a gig of ram and dualcore arm cpus, they need oomph to work around flash speed issues :)15:10
freemangordonShadowJK: I suspect i can get eraseblock size foe uSD/eMMC somehow programaticaly? or I should benchmark to find it15:10
kerioShadowJK: build me a ram uSD15:10
keriofreemangordon: 4MB15:10
freemangordonkerio: no15:10
freemangordondepends on the card/manifacturer,etc15:11
kerioyeah but multiples are fine too15:11
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Hurriankerio, if only we had DIMMs addressable as mmc block device, we would've solved the N900's memory problem by now15:11
jaskaor some sort of psram15:11
ShadowJKfreemangordon; with newer cards and newer kernels, and when you use a non-usb card reader, it appears as preferred_erase_size or something like that in /sys/mmcblk*/, possibly in the queue subdir15:11
MrPinguGuys, when packaging an executable15:12
MrPingudo I need to include some kind of license?15:12
jaskawet dreams of 32GB psram usd :D15:12
freemangordonShadowJK: so I have to benchmark after all. at least to find the begining of the first block15:12
keriojaska: 1GB would be plenty15:12
MrPinguNote: it's not my executable, I only compiled and now I am trying to get it packaged + optified for maemo15:13
jaskayeah itd be fine for swap15:13
ShadowJKfreemangordon; I'd use 4M alignment15:13
HurrianMrPingu, include it in the debian description15:13
ShadowJKand partitions 4M aligned too15:13
Hurrianno need to include the GPL/whatever license, just say it's licensed under x license15:13
Hurrian(and include link back to author/source website)15:14
freemangordonShadowJK: sy, you propose to get the size of the whole block device, to find the first 4M aligned sector that is part of my swap partition and to mark it as first secto to use?15:15
freemangordonsounds sane15:16
keriodo swap partitions have a header?15:16
ShadowJKYou don't even need to know the size of the block device15:16
freemangordonShadowJK: I think I need to know it15:16
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ShadowJKBut if partition is not aligned to 4M, you need to add an offset I think15:16
freemangordonas noone knows what alignment my swap partition has15:16
freemangordonotherwise I should deal with partition table, but that looks more complcated to me15:17
MrPinguIn the source package I have a /doc/ folder with some txt files: README.txt and CREDITS.txt15:18
freemangordonthough block size and alignment deffinitely should be passed to driver as module parameters15:18
ShadowJKFor use on "dedicated" uSD, the nokia algorithm could be improved by adding garbage collection to consolidate the small pieces of data that's left all over the device15:18
MrPinguDo I need them to include in opt/usr/share/doc/ in the package or something?15:19
MrPinguI am just trying to do it right and hopefully I will be able to upload it to extras-devel in the end15:19
freemangordonShadowJK: Nokia algo in swap is like spaghetti, I would prefer to reimplement a better algo in compcache15:20
kerioShadowJK: btw, how do i make sure my partitions are aligned to some sector size?15:20
freemangordonget your starting cluster from partition table15:20
ShadowJKkerio, fdisk -u gives you units of 512 bytes instead of whatever the default is.. all fdisk tinkering is destructive, so beware15:20
ShadowJKI did an experiment a few years ago, I recorded every write by kswapd and plotted it, the "sector number" on Y:
ShadowJKY represents 0 to 768Megabyte or whatever on emmc15:21
kerioShadowJK: ah crap D:15:22
kerioShadowJK: they're not aligned15:22
kerionot even close15:22
freemangordonhmm, I still fail to see why is there no enough free space once we hit 768MB15:23
freemangordonaaah, yes15:23
ShadowJKThere's free space, but in small chunks15:23
kerioShadowJK: is it worth it to make my partitions 4M-aligned on a uSD?15:24
ShadowJKkerio, sure15:24
kerioeven the swap partitions?15:24
keriodon't they have some kind of header?15:24
freemangordonShadowJK: naah, the space is free, but swap driver is unaware of it15:24
MrPinguam I getting ignored? This question isn't too hard for you guys ^^15:24
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freemangordonI had to port/implement swapfree notifications in our kernel15:24
ShadowJKfreemangordon, consider that it wrote over a gigabyte, but the amount of swap in use at any time never exceeded 140M15:24
freemangordonyes, I know that15:25
freemangordonbut a swap sekto is not "freed" until a new request for the same sector comes15:25
ShadowJKThe normal algorithm, if a swap sector is freed, goes back to that, if it's the "closest" one15:25
freemangordonwhich makes sense15:26
freemangordonto some extent15:27
freemangordonShadowJK: do you know what eMMC eraseblock size is?15:27
ShadowJKSo like, if a gig is written, but, let's say 100M of that is "permanent" in swap, and let's assume that permanent stuff is spread evenly with every write (write 400k, 4k is never modified again), doesn't that result over time in maximum free blocks of 400-4k?15:27
ShadowJKmmm, not sure, it's hard to benchmark properly.15:28
freemangordonI see15:28
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freemangordonbut then reading/writing 4M at a time will still be slower than that15:29
freemangordonhopefully I have big enough cache space15:29
freemangordonShadowJK: what do you think:15:30
ShadowJKSo, if over time the average free block size converges towards 400kbyte, it's easy to see why the writes start to jump all over the place with time15:30
freemangordonkeep compressed pages in RAM(for fast access if needed) and in the same time keep them on disk, uncompressed15:31
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freemangordonwrite back to disk in a work queue, not in real-time15:31
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freemangordonwhen RAM is full, decompress/write the last used pieces to disk, and free the RAM15:32
freemangordonor something like that15:32
freemangordonthat way fragmrntation would not have any effect, as I'll buffer in compressed RAM15:33
ShadowJKYeah if you write out in 4M chunks fragmentation stops being an issue15:33
freemangordoneven if I have to write a page at a time, as it is backed by compressed RAM15:33
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freemangordoni.e. all flash access (except for reading a page not in compressed RAM) will be done via a work queue15:35
ShadowJKThen you'll have issues when a 4k subsection of something htat's already in swap gets modified by a process :)15:35
freemangordonthough 4M seems to much to me15:35
freemangordonshould not matter15:36
keriohm, it appears that i *do* have my partitions 4M-aligned15:36
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kerio16 sectors is 8M, right?15:36
keriono wait15:36
kerioi'm an idiot lol15:36
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freemangordonShadowJK: if something modified in RAM gets modified and needs to be swapped after that, will lead to freeing of the chunk in compressed RAM and allocation of another wone15:38
ShadowJKI've benchmarked many cards, but most of my benchmarks don't go far enough to put a number of block size :/15:38
freemangordonI wont put the contents of what needs to be in flash as some buffer assigned to the work queue15:39
ShadowJKfreemangordon, yeah I just mean that it ends up in the same situation as with the nokia version, except with the difference that you don't take as much penalty from other simultaneous filesystem activity15:39
freemangordonwell, stage 2 will be GC15:40
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freemangordonbut I will have ti find eraseblock size, otherwise the underlying block device driver will mess the things15:41
freemangordonor find a way to tell him to not put my "write" requests in the queue15:41
ShadowJKHm, most the cards I've tested I've only tested with block sizes of up to 512k15:42
ShadowJKbut recently I've started testing to 4M15:42
ShadowJKSo if I throw random reads at the device, the throughput should reach a plateau once the correct erase block size is used15:43
freemangordonouch, we have a penalty for unaligned reads?15:43
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ShadowJKSorry I meant writes.15:44
freemangordonaah, ok :D15:44
kerioShadowJK: do you reckon writing zeros to a partition on a uSD speed up the first writes you do to it afterwards?15:44
kerioi mean, are the controllers smart enough to keep the block erased instead of writing zeros to it?15:44
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ShadowJKSandisk microsd 32g class 4:    16K: 22.49 kbyte/s,  128k: 127.77 kbyte/s, 1024: 977, 2048: 1854, 4096: 4133 kbyte/s15:45
freemangordonShadowJK: assuming your partition is eraseblock aligned15:45
ShadowJKYes I test on entire device without partition table15:45
freemangordonaah, ok15:45
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ShadowJKkerio, I think erased blocks are 0xFF actually, all 1s15:45
ShadowJKNow for that sandisk card, each doubling of block size doubled throughput.. I bet, that if I had tested it at 8M, it wouldn't have gone much faster than that approx 4Megabyte/s...15:46
kerioShadowJK: but... there's no /dev/one :(15:46
ShadowJKnot in use15:47
freemangordonhmm, if I write 4M a time, I would block fs access to the filesystem15:48
ShadowJKhm, old sandisk 16 gigabyte USB flash drive, 1M:2M, 2M:4M, 4M:4.5M, my guess is 2M block size for that drive :)15:48
freemangordons/filesystem/block device/15:48
infobotfreemangordon meant: hmm, if I write 4M a time, I would block fs access to the block device15:48
kerioShadowJK: how big is the swap partition header?15:48
keriowon't that mess up the alignment? :(15:49
freemangordonkerio: good pint15:49
freemangordonyes, it will15:49
ShadowJKfreemangordon, well in theory with 4M erase blocks, in a heavy-write situation, a 4k write is going to be as expensive as a 4M write. The only things that are "free" are reads :)15:49
keriohrmpf, should i move my partitions back one sector?15:50
SpeedEvilreads are not fire15:50
SpeedEviljust cheap15:50
freemangordonwell, that 4k write can be combined with other stuff by block driver15:50
freemangordonwhile nothing can stop my 4M write request15:51
ShadowJKI think one could get away with writing .5M of that 4M block, allow some reads to go through, then write another .5M, let some reads through, etc.. but interleaving other filesystem writes with swap writes is just going to make things slower most of the time15:51
ShadowJKYeah so ideally we'd want a new disk scheduler too..15:51
ShadowJKThat better understands the costs15:51
freemangordonShadowJK: the write itself will be slower, but swap responce not15:51
RST38hAre you trying to push ramzswap into Maemo5 or what?15:51
freemangordonas it is cached in compressed ram15:52
SpeedEvilsurprisingly expensive15:52
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freemangordonRST38h: it is there for ages, but backing swap does not work ok15:52
ShadowJKfreemangordon, I mean throughput on filesystem will be slower too15:52
SpeedEvila linear swapper would be nice too15:52
freemangordonyeah, but we can do nithing in that regard15:52
kerioSpeedEvil: it's already linear15:52
SpeedEvilkerio: for the first pass15:52
RST38hfreemangordon: I have seen people doing it, but it is definitely not there out of the box15:52
ShadowJKSpeedEvil, it needs garbage collection to become linear second time round15:53
SpeedEvilkerio: keeping it non fragmented gets more complex15:53
RST38hfreemangordon: Nokians themselves say N900 has too small RAM for ramzswap15:53
SpeedEvilnokians said USB host mode was impossible15:53
freemangordonof course it is not in Nokia kernel, but is in KP for more than an year15:53
SpeedEvil(by implication)15:53
RST38hstill too messy to bepractical =)15:54
ShadowJKI'd be interested in using a compressed buffer, to read in the "least occupied 4M block of swap", while device is idle, and idly collect together swap15:54
freemangordonRST38h: and if you keep dedicated RAM to a reasonable value, it helps sometimes15:54
freemangordonsometines not15:54
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ShadowJKI find it challenging to get "hot" data in ramzswap and "stale" data in emmc swap15:54
SpeedEvilShadowJK: basically a circular pointer, with the next written to block being the least occupied block, and you read before write to compress it15:55
ShadowJKObviously the idea of backing swap, but backing swap as it is now is dead slow15:55
SpeedEvilShadowJK: or similar15:55
freemangordonShadowJK: we don;t need compressed data in backing swap15:55
SpeedEvilwhere block = 1m or whatever15:55
ShadowJKSpeedEvil, it's something like that right now, once it runs off the end, it sets its pointer to start of largest unoccupied area afaik15:56
ShadowJKit's just that those areas are ludicrously tiny15:56
SpeedEvilShadowJK: yeah' but the lack of integral defragmentation screws it15:56
ShadowJKBtw, I've sene situations where something unexpected (like accidentally opening a gigantic image in the browser) has pushed lots of stuff into swap, but after the browser was closed, there was a huge contiguous chunk free in swap, and on that swap graph it has then drawn a straight line through that freed block :)15:57
kerioShadowJK: so... should my swap partitions be aligned to 4M - size of swap header?15:58
freemangordonguys, my idea is to have compressed RAM similar to L1 cache, and backing device similar to main memory15:58
ShadowJKkerio, I don't know what it does with the header15:58
ShadowJKfreemangordon, yes15:58
SpeedEvilfreemangordon: yeah, it's questionable what swap compression gets you. sure t can boost swap bandwidth from 12m to 30m (say)15:59
freemangordonwith a L1 written back to the main memory in the background15:59
SpeedEvilbut is that going to help much15:59
freemangordonSpeedEvil: naah, it is much more15:59
freemangordonsomething like half of the bandwith of the RAM itself16:00
freemangordonor similar16:00
ShadowJKYou know, I'd want to run an entire mmc behind some translation layer+gc ;)16:00
ShadowJKthat'd solve alot16:00
SpeedEvilShadowJK: or a punch through to the raw band16:00
ShadowJKThen you'd still need a ftl in software ontop of that :)16:01
SpeedEvilplus a gig of ram on the SD card16:01
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freemangordonwell, I think I got enough info for the start, thanks a lot16:02
kerioSpeedEvil: you mean a 1GB SD card made of ram16:02
kerioit would be good, tho16:02
SpeedEvilcurrent microsds are 9chips laminated together16:03
SpeedEvilif you make 2 of the 8 storage ram.16:03
SpeedEvil48g ROM/2g ram16:03
MrPinguSo I just did my first announce thread: :D16:04
SpeedEvildoes it understand streams?16:05
SpeedEvilI mean will it understand16:05
MrPinguIt should16:07
SpeedEvilif fragmented and out of order?16:08
MrPingunever used it before, though. I saw a guy asking for it on IRC so I saw it as oppurtunity to learn and serve the community16:08
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SpeedEvilI use a TCP logger for that sort of thing.16:11
SpeedEvilI've fortpgotten the name16:12
SpeedEvilinteresting alternative though16:12
MrPinguSpeedEvil: TCPdump? :P16:12
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SpeedEvilit reassembles TCP streams matching certain properties and saves them to disk16:12
MrPinguActually, I also compiled a newer TCPdump, libpcap, hamster and ferret too16:13
MrPingujust needs packaging16:13
MrPinguand testing...16:13
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kerioShadowJK: should i also repartition the eMMC to align the data to 4M?16:18
kerioi mean, is it worth it?16:19
ShadowJK4k align is extremely important16:20
kerioalso wtf, partition 2 does not end on cylinder boundary?16:21
ShadowJK4m is exta bonus16:21
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keriothe end of the eMMC is not on a boundary?16:21
keriooh balls16:21
kerioit ends one sector before the end, for some reason16:22
ShadowJKcylinders are obsolete16:22
kerioyeah but i'm wasting 512 bytes on my optfs16:22
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keriojaska: i paid for those 512 bytes!16:37
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DocScrutinizer51no, those were a free gift on top16:47
kerioi'd repartition the eMMC, but... eeeeeh16:48
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kerioPali: can i move bootmenu.scr and bootmenu.img.d from MyDocs to the uSD?16:49
Paliuboot loading only bootmenu.scr from MyDocs16:50
kerioPali: that's some BS, what if there's no MyDocs?16:50
Palithen fallbacking to default menu entry16:50
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keriomeh, i suppose that's fair16:51
Palibut first eMMC parition is needed for maemo (and is FAT32)16:51
kerioPali: is there a way to load a config file from the uboot command line?16:51
Paliand uboot use it16:51
Palikerio, it is not config file, but uboot hush script16:51
Paliand yes, you can do it16:51
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keriook, so it's not really a big deal16:51
Palifirst need to learn uboot hush scripting16:52
Paliboot from sd card also trying to run script 'boot.scr' from any sd card paritition (fat, ext2/3/4)16:52
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keriois bootmenu something implemented in the .scr, or is that just a config file for it?16:54
kerioit could be neat to load a submenu from the uSD16:57
keriothat's only configured there16:57
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kerio~seen robbiethe1st17:19
infobotrobbiethe1st <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 12h 24m 14s ago, saying: ' Give me karma'.17:19
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Palikerio, bootmenu is uboot command17:26
Paliand bootmenu.scr is only uboot hush script which set some env and run bootmenu17:26
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entitledmy second n900 booted up with "dead" display17:38
entitledsound, keyboard light etc worked fine17:38
entitledshutdown, removal of battery fixed it17:39
entitledit has been sitting on my shelf and is hardly used, almost in mint condition.17:39
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vi_entitled: accidental act-dead?17:51
entitlednow idea what happened17:52
vi_neither do I17:52
entitledit's also nearly clean install17:52
entitledrootsh, openssh client+server, FAM, that's all17:53
entitledjust about to reflash it again and install thumb217:56
kerioyay thumb2 ^_^18:01
* entitled has three n900 with me now18:02
entitledthird one is friend's, it got wet and won't boot anymore, was erratic for a while (screen flashing etc)18:03
entitledi'll try drying it up and if that won't help, then dismantle it and see if there is any rust to be removed18:04
kerioentitled: when did you get it?18:04
entitledthe damage happened months ago18:07
entitledrain water18:07
entitledso it might not be that bad18:07
entitledwith tap water it would be way more corroded18:08
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entitledreflashing is always bit nerving18:16
entitledforgot to remove the battery after the EMMC18:16
entitledso did it all again just in case18:17
DocScrutinizer51not much hope for your rain-dancer18:17
DocScrutinizer51electrolytic corrosion18:18
entitledwe'll see18:20
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kerioDocScrutinizer51: what's the procedure for water damage again?18:20
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keriowith a non-empty bupbat18:20
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DocScrutinizer51rinse with even more water, then with distilled water, then 99%ethanol18:21
entitleddistilled water and IPA was n my plans18:21
entitledno chance for anhydrous alcohol18:22
DocScrutinizer51or did you mean the 'remove battery *immediately*'18:22
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kerioDocScrutinizer51: there are two batteries in the n90018:22
entitledanhydrous acetic acid yeah but no, no alcohol :D18:22
kerioand only one is easily removable :)18:22
keriodo you have to remove both?18:22
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entitledbtw, is there need to unplug and unplug the usb cable between any rootfs/emmc/emmc flashing?18:23
DocScrutinizer51you cant remove bupbat18:23
SpeedEvilI did the above with an entire laptop (not diaplay) a couple of months at18:23
kerioDocScrutinizer51: :o18:24
SpeedEvilpulled ram, HD, washed it all.18:24
DocScrutinizer51and damage from bupbat possibly limited18:24
entitledit booted up (to some point, can't remember) when I plugged the cable again, after emmc and no battery removing18:24
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SpeedEvil(it had drunk a lot of coffee)18:24
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kerioentitled: flash combined with -R, and keep holding u, then flash vanilla without -R and then combined with18:25
kerio-R is for reboot18:25
entitledyeah I know18:25
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entitledwhy reboot at the FIRST rootfs flash?18:26
keriobecause the first flash is to ensure your system isn't too fucked up to flash vanilla18:26
kerioyou need a working rootfs to flash vanilla, but after flashing vanilla you MUST flash rootfs18:27
kerioor at least make sure you never booted from it18:27
entitleddidn't know it's recommended  to reboot it once after the first rootfs flash18:28
kerionote: if you have a somewhat working fremantle install, you can skip the first or the last combined flash18:30
kerioif you don't care about restoring factory conditions for MyDocs, you can skip the flashing of vanilla18:31
kerioMyDocs and the rest of eMMC, actually, but still18:31
entitledI could have probably skipped the eMMC with this as it was so clean to begin with18:32
entitledbut I do it just in case if there's any dirt in there18:33
kerioi wonder if there's a way to "garbage collect" CAL18:33
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kerioa proper cleanup would be "dump current CAL data, flash_eraseall /dev/mtd*, write CAL data back, write zeros to eMMC, flash COMBINED/VANILLA/COMBINED"18:35
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GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer05, did you get the scroll wheel to work properly on the Bluetooth MX Revolution?18:49
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kerioPali: hm, what's the garbage at the beginning of bootmenu.scr? :o18:50
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Palikerio, signature18:51
Paliit is also mkimage generated18:51
Paliuboot can load only mkimage files (scripts, kernels, initrd, ...)18:51
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keriouboot is really demanding! :c18:51
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aklsAnybody using russian keyboard layout?18:56
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DocScrutinizer05GeneralAntilles: the nice thing: it's sticky in mouse-mpu18:59
GeneralAntillesThe Bluetooth version doesn't work with any of the OS X mouse drivers.19:01
GeneralAntillesSo I'm using it on the laptop, but I hadn't been able to get it figured out so far.19:01
GeneralAntillesThe RF version works out-of-the-box with Linux Mint, though. Which was cool.19:02
DocScrutinizer05I got both here now19:03
GeneralAntillesThanks, I'll take a look at this tonight.19:03
GeneralAntillesI broke down and ordered a used NIB MX Revolution (RF) from Amazon this morning.19:03
GeneralAntillesWish I had thought to stock up on them when they were on sale being discontinued.19:03
GeneralAntillesWell, it's basically the perfect mouse19:04
GeneralAntillesI get about 3-4 years out of them.19:04
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DocScrutinizer05though my MMB again fsckd19:04
DocScrutinizer05well, not again, since I never changed that critter (SMT)19:05
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DocScrutinizer05the new one is at office now, and guess what - our sysadm refuses to install the friggin trackpoint.exe or what's the name, for me. So the whole mouse is in default mode, and not even 7-button19:07
DocScrutinizer05TWO real and two mousewhell-buttons19:07
DocScrutinizer05so even worse than the crappy dell mouse I had to use before19:07
DocScrutinizer05modulo the revolution wheel19:07
DocScrutinizer05I guess I have to quit this job, they're mobbing me out with such BS19:08
DocScrutinizer05(no horizontal scrolling in winXP)19:08
DocScrutinizer05not even outlook (which was evil enough), but lotus domino webmailer OMFG19:10
DocScrutinizer05rationale: "we need to keep up productivity - imagine every of our 300 employees comes with *own* mouse"19:11
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DocScrutinizer05what the F**K is with MY productivity???19:11
RST38hSo, what is wrong about that?19:11
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RST38hDoc: Your next email request should contain your manager and that bozo's manager in the CC: field19:12
aklsDocScrutinizer05, sure? who?19:13
Snafu777WHo did what?19:13
aklswho is using russian keyboard layout?19:13
RST38hDoc: And contain a clear explanation about whose productivity you would like to keep up, as a comment to the quoted statement from the bozo19:13
RST38hDoc: And yes, even although he will be in the To: field, he is not the one you are sending it to =)19:14
entitledum, I only see 5 items in community ssu (thumb) and (testing-thumb)?19:15
RST38h(and, if the it bozo were really smart, he would have framed it as a question about who can guarantee that trackpad.exe is not a security risk)19:15
DocScrutinizer51my manager is boss of that company, and I'm not sure he really cares19:17
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DocScrutinizer51akls: ??19:18
Snafu777Want me to make a phone call?  I'll ask for bozo and launch explain.bat19:18
aklsDocScrutinizer05, Anybody using russian keyboard layout?19:19
aklsI mean.. is there any person here to help me setting it up19:19
GeneralAntillesIt's tough using non-optimal inputs.19:19
DocScrutinizer51and that lotus domino webmailer is DA FAQ19:21
DocScrutinizer51I mean, so fsck it doesn't work at all under FF19:21
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freemangordonakls: still fighting with it?19:53
aklsfreemangordon, yes19:53
freemangordontry ukeyboard19:53
freemangordonakls: ^^^19:53
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aklson screen layouts?19:53
aklsI have no problems with virtual keyboard19:54
aklsI want a hardware russian keyboard19:54
aklsit's there, but if I enable it then it breaks latin layout19:54
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freemangordonakls: try it19:56
freemangordonit comes with its own vkb files19:57
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freemangordondid you try to change languages order?19:58
aklsfreemangordon, is it going to help me with my HARDWARE keyboard?19:58
aklsi mean the realy physical keyboard19:58
aklsfreemangordon, that's a good idea!19:58
aklslet me try it..19:58
freemangordonakls: I amn not that stupid, thanks. I understand your question pretty well ;)19:58
freemangordonakls: you may also try extkbd if changing order and uleyboard does not help20:00
freemangordonextkbd comes with newer kbd data for RX-5120:00
aklschanging order didn't help20:01
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keriofreemangordon: wait, what?20:01
aklsI'll try ukeyboard now20:01
kerionew kbd data for rx-51? :O20:01
kerioi thought it was a generic xkb update20:01
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freemangordonyes, it is20:01
freemangordonnewer version of xkb-data20:02
freemangordonkerio: I have NFC whether someone didn;t messed with akls' xkb-data20:02
aklsI've tried reflashing, it didn't help20:03
freemangordonaah, ok20:03
freemangordonextkbd won't help then20:03
aklsso, when switching to latin keyboard somehow it doesn't update arrow keys20:04
freemangordonakls: ukeyboard remap not only VKB, but HW kbd too. At least it does that for bulgarian :)20:04
aklsis there any file describing latin keyboard layout?20:04
freemangordonakls: I think we were wrong yesterday when we told you to set HW layout to russion20:04
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freemangordonyou should keep englis(finland or whatever)20:05
aklsok, but how can I use russian then?20:05
freemangordonctrl-space should work. install ukeyboard and try it20:05
freemangordonthough I can swear russion should work without ukeyboard20:06
freemangordonint_ua: ping20:06
aklsfreemangordon, maybe I'm doing something completely wrong?20:07
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aklsfreemangordon, current setup: hardware layout: English, Nederlands20:08
akls1st language English (USA)20:08
akls2nd language Русский20:08
freemangordonakls: hmm, my second device don't have ukeyboard, lemme see how it behaves20:08
RST38hClick on the secondlanguage20:08
RST38hSelect Russian20:08
freemangordonRST38h: ^^^20:08
aklsyep, now if I type something I'll get english letters20:08
freemangordonhe already did that20:08
RST38hBe aware that it sucks, misses the soft sign and I think "yu"20:08
aklsthen I press ctrl+space20:08
aklsit says that now it's changed to RUSSIAN20:09
aklssounds good, but it's still english20:09
* RST38h seems to remember this problem20:09
RST38hAh, I remember now20:09
freemangordonRST38h: ukeyboard?20:09
RST38hfuck ukeyboard20:09
RST38hIt is a bug in the Maemo5 firmware that only switches virtual keyboard but not the physical one20:10
freemangordonI have bulgarian phonetic thanks to it, so long live ukeyboard20:10
RST38hThe switch actually DOES work, if you have got a device built for the Russian market20:10
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RST38hThis problem is fixable by swapping a few layout files on the device.20:10
aklsI have Global thing installed20:11
freemangordonakls: try ukeyboard20:11
aklsmaybe I should have installed something else20:11
aklsfreemangordon, already! Nothing has changed20:11
freemangordonhmm, lemme try here20:11
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aklsI can set hw layout to russian20:11
aklsand it's going to work PARTIALLY20:11
aklsso when I change back to Latin, arrows keys are still russian20:12
aklsmaybe there's any way to fix that? Any file describing Latin layout?20:12
freemangordonakls: WFM20:12
RST38hakls: Read here: there is a layout file for that20:12
aklsRST38h, where?20:12
freemangordonRST38h: wait a minute, it works here20:13
RST38ha moment20:13
freemangordonwithout messing with .vkb files20:13
aklsfreemangordon, and what is wfm20:13
infobotmethinks wfm is (Wired For Management Baseline) This is an Intel hardware specification that is designed to allow for compliance with easier management of desktop PCs in a networked environment. The specification calls for computers to be compatible with a pre-boot protocol that can be used to update the system or perform other management options. Also, the computer must be compatible with network/desktop management applications..  Works For Me20:13
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freemangordonworks for me20:13
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freemangordonukeyboard has "Русский - Phonetic" layout20:15
freemangordonthou it does not work :D20:16
RST38hbuilt in kbd firmware works20:16
RST38hjust needs a file20:16
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RST38hother folks (israelis, greeks, bulgarians, georgians) are in a way worse position than russians though, no built in layout for them20:17
* RST38h boots up his n900, will have layout file in a moment20:17
freemangordonstrangely "Български - phonetic" with second language "Русский" works ok :D:D:D20:18
RST38hphonetic is for wussies20:18
RST38hreal men (tm) remember their JCUKENG by touch20:18
aklsinteresting thing. /usr/bin/osso-product-info says that OSSO_PRODUCT_KEYBOARD='German'20:18
RST38hakls: got AZERTY?20:19
aklsit is qwerty20:19
RST38hweird indeed20:19
aklslooks like us keyboard20:19
aklsdunno, maybe it was changed20:19
RST38hthat is actually Netherlands :)20:19
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RST38hThat is their default eu keyboard20:19
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RST38hThere is also crooked russian (no arrows) and normal russian (arrows)20:20
aklsso? :\20:23
aklsI'm reading stuff from these links20:23
aklsbut I can't find a fix20:24
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aklsoh, by the way20:24
aklsthis thing WAS WORKING for a little while20:24
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aklsDate format and decimal separator are defined by device language20:30
aklsnot by regional settings20:30
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RST38hakls: the whole ui thing has been dictated by some "user experience specialists" who had absolutely no idea about the real user experience20:32
RST38hso, do not judge it too harshly20:32
RST38hwell, it is kinda academic now, with Nokia basically dead20:32
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RST38hakls: start with /etc/X11/xkb/base.xml20:34
RST38hNow, go to  /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr20:36
RST38hYou will see file called rx-51 there. You will have to replace it with a file I email you (please give your email address)20:36
aklsanything I should do in /etc/X11/xkb/base.xml?20:38
RST38hnot fornow20:39
RST38hopera-mobile got updated on maemo5 =)20:39
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RST38hthose opera folks are so damn nice20:39
vi__orhn is king of the bro s20:40
vi__He is supporting a dead platform for nothing but the lulz20:40
vi__what have I missed?20:41
vi__Skry: did you solve the super modifier issue?20:41
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aklsRST38h, the file is replaced20:51
aklsnow what? reboot?20:51
aklsand which settings should I use now?20:51
RST38henable russian as 2nd language and reboot20:52
aklsand for hardware layout I should set Enlgish, Nederlands or what?20:53
RST38has I have said - set it to English and Russian20:53
aklsin Text input settings20:53
aklsthere's "Hardware keyboard layout"20:53
aklsand "1st language" and "2nd language"20:53
RST38hset 2nd to russian20:54
aklsand hardware keyboard layout to english?20:54
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aklsholy shit20:56
aklsdesktop in portrait mode20:56
RST38hnon penis canina, yes20:56
aklsIt's a first time I saw it working after upgrading :O20:56
RST38hthat is cssu for you20:57
RST38hwhat? the keyboard finally works?20:58
aklsyes! :)20:58
aklsRST38h, thank you!20:58
aklsjust to make it clear20:58
aklsRST38h, is that a file that describes the Latin layout?20:58
RST38hit is a file that describes all keyboard layouts20:58
RST38hit contains the "correct" definition of the russian keyoard20:59
RST38has opposed to the crooked one with no arrows20:59
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aklscan it be added to the next upgrade so I wont need to do that again after reflashing?20:59
aklsRST38h, it even has all other characters in right positions!21:03
aklsdamn it! You're awesome!21:03
RST38hit still misses YU21:03
aklsand how am I supposed to type then?21:04
RST38hI usually open virtual keyboard21:04
RST38hor put IO :)21:04
RST38hWell, N97 keyboard missed B, if this makes you feel better21:05
aklsis it possible to set down arrow as ю?21:05
RST38hyou have got the file. you have got the text editor. you know what to do.21:05
aklsbut not today21:06
aklsit's too late21:06
aklsanyway, thank you very much!21:06
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Skryvi_: not yet at least, was distracted of the matter22:31
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raccoon_is it possible to RMA an n900 for broken usb connector even though i don't have any receipt for it?22:33
raccoon_can i just send it to nokia or do i have to go through a retailer22:33
SpeedEvilwhen did you buy it?22:33
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SpeedEvilif under 2 years ago, possibly. where are you?22:34
SpeedEviland you aren't the person who bought a n900 off eBay a few hours agowi no USB?22:34
raccoon_yeah i bought it second hand this spring, was a christmast present that didnt come to use22:34
SpeedEvilI mean, if it was originally purchased under 2 years ago22:35
raccoon_no i have had since then but the usb connector broke instantly and i got a bit depressed over it22:35
raccoon_yeah it was probably bought in december 201122:35
raccoon_or very close to it22:35
SpeedEvilyou will not get a n900 back, even if yo can.22:35
raccoon_but i want this one ....22:35
raccoon_better get someone else to fix it though22:35
SpeedEvillast year this time, people were getting other phones22:36
raccoon_my nerves are not good enough for the precision soldering of that connector22:36
raccoon_ah, aight... wont send it to nokia then22:36
raccoon_i have an external charger and an extra battery, so it's usable22:37
raccoon_and i really like what i see... but i have to reset the clock each night to charge the battery, and can't use usb for file transfer/modem22:38
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SpeedEvilit is annoying, yes.22:42
aklsnow I'm a bit annoyed22:42
aklsI want to change vfat partition to ext322:42
aklsand there is no good tutorial...22:43
aklsthis one is nice, gives 8 ways, none of them are really usable22:43
aklsfor my case22:43
aklsor I'm dumb22:43
SpeedEvilfrom memory, I tarred up everything g from mydocs to home, deleted mydocs, made a new 4g partition with same ids, and fat, then a ext3 partition filling the rest of the space22:46
SpeedEvilthen a hacky script, run through 'queen beecon' to mount it when the ui came up22:46
raccoon_has anyone seen a thread on the maemo boards that mentions any members that might have voulentereed to fix broken usb connectors? for payment of course22:59
raccoon_i see a thread that mentions people that can help with pre-fail fixes but mine is already loose23:00
ShadowJKpostfail depends on whether the connector fell off, or if the part of circuitboard it was attached to tore off23:01
aklsso I can't change my vfat partition to ext3?23:01
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aklsor can I?23:01
raccoon_ShadowJK: the connector fell off, the pads are still there23:02
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raccoon_i tried soldering it back and it worked for a while but fell of again23:03
raccoon_so i need to get hold of someone with better precision soldering skills23:03
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Skryraccoon_: bit more solder and enough heat, you can do it :)23:23
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DocScrutinizer05raccoon_: any good repair shop will fix it23:28
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DocScrutinizer05probably even those "frenchise" " Nokia (et al)" phoneshops23:29
DocScrutinizer05raccoon_: where you're located?23:30
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Skryi think he said sweden23:31
raccoon_DocScrutinizer05: sweden23:31
raccoon_Skry: yeah i think i'll begin with ordering a few of those ports and maybe at least give it one more shot23:31
DocScrutinizer05in Sweden there should be similar 'free' phoneshops like here in Germany23:32
raccoon_yeah theres a few23:32
raccoon_i recently fixed my macbook lcd at a place, could go there and ask about the phone23:32
DocScrutinizer05I honestly suggest you either let some professional do the job, or you find a few old 5EUR mobile phones to practice on them23:33
DocScrutinizer05one advice nevertheless: for the huge solder blobs at left and right of USB you need a rather heavy iron, some 50, maybe 70W23:34
ShadowJKI've seen a "Elgigantten" shop in Finland that had oscilloscopes and irons in their repair section, that looked confidence inspiring enough23:34
* RST38h suddenly notices that he has never yet sacrificed a racoon to the Tentacled One23:34
DocScrutinizer05the ground planes are huge and take a lot of heat away23:34
DocScrutinizer05for the contacst you need mor like a 5..7W needle23:35
DocScrutinizer05ShadowJK: sounds good, yeah23:36
Skryyeah, Gigantti, like the last place anyone should ever take anything :)23:37
RST38hWhat is it? A Nordic Radioshack?23:40
raccoon_ShadowJK: yeah we have elgiganten here in town too, could ask the mtoo23:42
raccoon_*them too23:42
raccoon_thanks for all the advice people23:42
ShadowJKSkry, it all depends on finding the one guy that can operate that repair equipment. I've almost never seen anyone use that equipment though23:44
SkryShadowJK: yeah, at least in this town, those guys over there probably have never even seen an iron before, and generally try to avoid customers if in any way possible.23:47
DocScrutinizer05ooh, they found their final professional destiny then23:47
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aklsis there any skype client or only that integrated thing?23:50
ShadowJKintegrated thing23:50
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