| sambo7 | @Doc...cool pic on google+ | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, could You remind me name of charging chip inside N900? | 00:15 |
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| ShadowJK | bq24150 | 00:17 |
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| Estel_ | thanks a lot | 00:17 |
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| Estel_ | I though about asking You, but wouldn't dare to ping You out of blue sky | 00:17 |
| Estel_ | google was answering with bq2415x family ;) | 00:18 |
| * ShadowJK just finished rewiring and rebooting after an ups failure | 00:20 | |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | UPS significantly *increases* the likelihood of complete failure due to power outage, in my book | 00:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | unless you use true redundancy design, means tower with two PSU etc | 00:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | the sort of stuff that costs 10 times as much as a comparable standard PC | 00:28 |
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| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: good UPSes have bypass contactor | 00:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, and it's exactly that one that usually fails | 00:31 |
| ShadowJK | It had been working nicely for bridging 1-2s power gaps that I get, but then it seems like it failed during self test this morning, and all attached equipment lost power "instantly", for duration of self test | 00:31 |
| jacekowski | well, chances of UPS failing and bypass contactor failing are unlikely | 00:31 |
| jacekowski | and besides, dual PSU | 00:31 |
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| ShadowJK | The main switches for our ISP has dual UPS and dual PSU. Unfortunately using qualified electricians seems to counter this, and the dual PSUs in the switch are fed from a single 24VPSU fed by a single UPS | 00:33 |
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| qwazix | anybody used qtm proximity sensor on maemo? does it work? I just re-did something that works on harmattan on maemo but the slot is never triggered | 00:45 |
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| Estel_ | ShadowJK, lol | 01:03 |
| Estel_ | does anyone know if regular polycarbonate foils would work in capacitive screens? | 01:04 |
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| Estel_ | following wikipedika explanation of capacitive (transparent conductive material on top) it shouldn't work good, but something tells me that wikipedia article isn't entiurely precise here | 01:04 |
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| beford | [citation needed] | 01:05 |
| Estel_ | basically, I located cheap good quality foild for N9, which should fit for N950 too, but I'm concerned about capacitive sh*t | 01:05 |
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| * ShadowJK vaguely remembers some nokian commenting that the capacitive touch sensor is already borderline with the curved glass shenanigans | 01:06 | |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, yea, but N950 doesn't have curved-glass | 01:06 |
| Estel_ | if I understood correctly what You mean | 01:06 |
| ShadowJK | ah | 01:06 |
| Estel_ | my favorite "mark" of foils works well for N900 screen - i.e. 0 sensitivity loss - but resistive is resistive, and capacitive is irritating shit... | 01:07 |
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| Estel_ | I always try my bets to keep screens in ideal state, and considering N950 unreplaceable (non purchaseable) digitizer, It's even double | 01:08 |
| Estel_ | I also wonder about best material for doing as-thin-as-possible capacitive stylus, gog damn capacitive screens... It will probably turn out to be fubar anyway, due to lower limit of area required for touch detection | 01:09 |
| Estel_ | I just wonder if true conductive thing like conductive foam is required, as, after all, my figners are not made of metal too... other material with comparable or better conductivity than human body, yet, not necessary mettalic, should work too | 01:10 |
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| Estel_ | I'll answer myself - yes, it works with screen protector (tested it with putting one on it, without sticking) | 01:14 |
| Estel_ | (i.e. via 2 more layers of foils that protect protector foil, yet, screen still worked) | 01:15 |
| Estel_ | now I wonder what kind of resistivity stylus needs really, if 3 layers of foil are no problem | 01:15 |
| * ShadowJK suspects it's about distance | 01:16 | |
| Estel_ | but metal styluses works from huge distance (tested it with broken telescopic antenna) | 01:16 |
| Estel_ | this capacitive shit is still kinda mystery for me, other than it just suxx in practice | 01:17 |
| Estel_ | it's probably some kind of distance and resistance plot | 01:17 |
| ShadowJK | I suspect if the foil was conductive, you'd have problems | 01:18 |
| Estel_ | of course foil isn't | 01:19 |
| Estel_ | yea | 01:19 |
| Estel_ | I would have 100% screen touch detected | 01:19 |
| Estel_ | aka palm on screen | 01:19 |
| Estel_ | still, fingers - much less conductive than metal - works even through many layers of foil, so I wonder what else than conductive foam could be used | 01:20 |
| Estel_ | for a stylus tip | 01:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sausage | 01:20 |
| Estel_ | ;P | 01:20 |
| Estel_ | someone's else finger | 01:20 |
| Estel_ | more cool | 01:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-S | 01:21 |
| Estel_ | female I would take metallic stylus, rip off plastic tip, and replace it with said material, neutral for screen (and much bigger in diameter than oriuginal tip, to fulfill bitchy requiments for touch area) | 01:21 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, female finger with nice long tips | 01:21 |
| Estel_ | time for hunting! | 01:22 |
| Estel_ | *after quick check* index finger should be sufficient | 01:23 |
| Estel_ | where is my toolbox | 01:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/13/Wiener_Wuerstchen_fcm.jpg/220px-Wiener_Wuerstchen_fcm.jpg&imgrefurl=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiener_W%25C3%25BCrstchen&h=168&w=220&sz=12&tbnid=GJUyhF2aBx1xlM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=119&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dwiener%2Bwuerstchen%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=wiener+wuerstchen&usg=__OVLuGJJLYpJXSOKe1lqM-YjbVxo=&docid=oOuBnl2QXvcjEM&sa=X&ei=ghQTUNm- | 01:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | LOTP4QTy9IHQBQ&ved=0CF4Q9QEwAQ&dur=2890 economy pack of stylii. Don't forget to integrate mustard dispenser in your N9 custom case | 01:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dafaq those URLs | 01:23 |
| Estel_ | wut a epic link? | 01:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-( | 01:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiener_Würstchen | 01:24 |
| Estel_ | well, I still insist on using female index fingers | 01:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fsck google | 01:24 |
| Estel_ | most likely, of Nokia's management staff origin | 01:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I heard they don't taste with mustard | 01:24 |
| Estel_ | a way of saying "Thank You" for capacitive screen | 01:24 |
| Estel_ | sure | 01:24 |
| Estel_ | we can prepare them in spiritus | 01:25 |
| Estel_ | like lenin's brain | 01:25 |
| Estel_ | I wonder how marinating in spiritus affect's finger's conductivity | 01:25 |
| SpeedEvil | I've been wondering about that. | 01:25 |
| SpeedEvil | Conductive clear silicone rubber. | 01:25 |
| Estel_ | separated fingers, or capacitive styli? | 01:26 |
| Estel_ | wtf, something like that even exist? it must be damn expensive | 01:26 |
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| qwazix | Estel_, have you seen the SU-39 stylus? | 02:38 |
| Estel_ | this one? : http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Su-39 | 02:39 |
| Estel_ | to huge for a styli | 02:39 |
| qwazix | hahaha, yeah | 02:40 |
| Estel_ | but seriouslky, I've found it, nokia one... Well, thanks a lot, will check how it's made | 02:40 |
| qwazix | http://images.e-shop.gr/images/TEL/BIG/TEL.006793.jpg | 02:40 |
| Estel_ | I'm quite late as per TMO events, how Your great efforts of providing fremantle for harmattan are going? | 02:40 |
| Estel_ | s/fremantle/hildon/ | 02:40 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: I'm quite late as per TMO events, how Your great efforts of providing hildon for harmattan are going? | 02:40 |
| Estel_ | I've said fremantle, because it's albo about other programs, not only hildon-ui | 02:41 |
| qwazix | I got one but doesn't work for any of high end nokias | 02:41 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, so it doesn't work for N950/N9? | 02:41 |
| qwazix | I don't know if it's defective or it only works for C6 | 02:41 |
| qwazix | no, you have to touch it in weird angles to work | 02:41 |
| Estel_ | how it's made? i.e. tip, and rest, what material is it? | 02:41 |
| qwazix | so that more area touches | 02:42 |
| qwazix | seems like plastic | 02:42 |
| Estel_ | probably it's about detection area required by screen's driver | 02:42 |
| qwazix | probably | 02:42 |
| Estel_ | well, so in C6 they used brain and made required detection area smaller, eh? | 02:42 |
| qwazix | it's not only the tip that's capacitive, but the whole thing | 02:42 |
| Estel_ | it's pity that brain vanished from them later | 02:42 |
| Estel_ | and capacitive stylus can't be defective, it's just material of set conductivity | 02:42 |
| qwazix | if you touch the side it also registers a touch (with a bit of effort) | 02:43 |
| Estel_ | I wonder what it is, no metal, but not regular plastic too | 02:43 |
| Estel_ | something more conductive for sure | 02:43 |
| * Estel_ nods | 02:43 | |
| qwazix | I wonder what will happen if I file the tip down to make it wider | 02:43 |
| Estel_ | if Yuo can make it 15 mm in diameter, it will work :P | 02:43 |
| Estel_ | wlel, maybe 10mm will suffice | 02:43 |
| qwazix | About fremantle->harmattan I stalled because I want to finish rawcam for the coding competition | 02:44 |
| Estel_ | in any way, it is too much for comfortable use in real things :( but it's capacitive screen design fail, at least in this unit (and most available on market) | 02:44 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, I see | 02:44 |
| qwazix | but I've got some useful pointers from cordia team, I just probably need to start over... | 02:44 |
| Estel_ | well, fremantle for harmattan would surely win all categories in CC :D | 02:44 |
| Estel_ | nice | 02:44 |
| qwazix | yeah, but I don't think I would have anything end-user friendly before the deadline | 02:45 |
| qwazix | By the way wacom over capacitive as on the Galaxy Note wins everything | 02:46 |
| qwazix | hands down | 02:46 |
| qwazix | then comes a good resistive (N810, N900, 5800) | 02:46 |
| Estel_ | wacom on capacitive have pressure sensitivity? | 02:46 |
| Estel_ | like for mypaint? | 02:46 |
| qwazix | then a good capacitive iPhone, N9, then crappy resistive (C6-00, craplets, vodafone joy), then crappy capacitive (Original samsung galaxy i5700) | 02:47 |
| Estel_ | well, I preffer good resistive, and when they add multitouch (which is very effective, as many vedors proved), I don't see any technical reasons for capacitive digitizers to exist, other than annoy by need of special PITA styluses, huge detection area, and problems for usage with gloves | 02:47 |
| qwazix | yep, very nice pressure sensitivity, pity that mypaint doesn't run on android | 02:48 |
| Estel_ | well, pity that samsung galaxy runs android :D | 02:48 |
| Estel_ | shame on them, decent hardware is wasting | 02:48 |
| qwazix | Yeah, and although plastic, quality is very good | 02:49 |
| Estel_ | hm, so wacom created something usable out of capacitive screens? sounds nice. What about touch area detected? Is it comfortable to hit ultra-mini buttons, like on N900 and Easy debian, for example? | 02:49 |
| Estel_ | as in my book, main con of capacitive screens is lack of precision when you need to hit small thing... | 02:50 |
| Estel_ | then pressure sensitivity | 02:50 |
| qwazix | With stylus yes, with fingers, the usual. It also supports hover (yay) with cursor, and when stylus is hovering over screen finger touches are ignored | 02:50 |
| Estel_ | btw in point 1 i also include lack of proper styluses | 02:50 |
| Estel_ | well, decent application, at least | 02:51 |
| Estel_ | so it's kinda touch screen/touchpad/tablet (as in painting) combo? | 02:51 |
| Estel_ | hats off, really. Pity that others don't try to do something like that... Or in fact instead of spending much $$$ on expensive wacom, just use good resistive with multitouch :P | 02:51 |
| Estel_ | (but I agree, that this wacom thing sounds neat) | 02:51 |
| qwazix | it's just like having a wacom tablet over your phone. My regular wacom pen works fine on the Note | 02:52 |
| Estel_ | so stylus for this wacom thing doesn't need to have huge tip, i.e. can be very small? eh, I beg for this on n950 | 02:52 |
| qwazix | with button support on the pen and all | 02:52 |
| Estel_ | ouh, so it require special pen? | 02:52 |
| Estel_ | I see | 02:52 |
| qwazix | yeah | 02:52 |
| qwazix | it has one included, the tip is small as a bic pen | 02:53 |
| Estel_ | well, this way, I preffer good resistive that allows me to use any pen I lke, but, well,m it still sounds better than capacitive hell we have on N950/N9 | 02:53 |
| Estel_ | yea, because pressure sensitivity/touch is detected via touch resistor in pen | 02:53 |
| Estel_ | so it's, in fact, capacitive-resistive combo, but resistive part is in pen :P | 02:53 |
| qwazix | you've got to try it first | 02:53 |
| Estel_ | I got wacom painting tablet | 02:53 |
| Estel_ | so I can imagine experience of capacitive/wacom combo | 02:54 |
| Estel_ | I wonder how it is about power usage when in wacom mode, though | 02:54 |
| qwazix | mm, I cant really say, the note is a power sucker by itself anyway | 02:54 |
| Estel_ | yea, but wacom things are, in fact, active digitizers, so I bet that it sucks at least as much as whole N900 under middle usage | 02:55 |
| Estel_ | moderate* | 02:55 |
| Estel_ | well, small usage with screen on | 02:55 |
| Estel_ | talking about that, bad design decisions can, actually, screw even best design, like resistive screens, so i'm glad that they did it right on galaxy | 02:56 |
| Estel_ | if it's so power-sucker, it remind me of samsung q1-somethjing, from origami project | 02:56 |
| Estel_ | it got ncie linux support | 02:56 |
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| Estel_ | x86 mobile computer, sized as thicker tablet, with resistive screen | 02:56 |
| qwazix | I'm googling every other day to check if somebody ported any proper linux on it but nothing | 02:56 |
| Estel_ | would be kinda great, if not that suckers made this resistive screen driver totally prone to pressure sensitivity | 02:56 |
| Estel_ | it's either "clicked" or not as in mouse | 02:56 |
| Estel_ | idiots | 02:57 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, won't happen, 'm afraid, would require hardware adaptation of Mer | 02:57 |
| Estel_ | well, lets see what Jolla havfe for us | 02:57 |
| Estel_ | after all, we have our N900, no matter what :) | 02:57 |
| qwazix | I have a remote hope that maybe a tizen adaptation shows up | 02:57 |
| Estel_ | I've just ordered parts for usb to serial adaptor, and i'll make Ir receiver dongle for it, so it will learn signals from remotes | 02:58 |
| Estel_ | I wouldn't count on tizen | 02:58 |
| Estel_ | if Harmattan wasn't thing that fulfil Your dreams, You can be sure that tizen will be even more locked and overall badass | 02:58 |
| qwazix | I liked harmattan at first, but the fact that it has serious bugs bothers me | 02:59 |
| qwazix | I always used the N900 as mobile computer, never as a phone. I use it very heavily so I can never rely on it to have power at any given time. | 03:01 |
| qwazix | I prefer a slab or T9 for my primary phone, so that was N95->i8910->N9 | 03:02 |
| qwazix | and the N9 even without being what I dreamt as a N900 successor filled a hole in my usage pattern. A phone that I like to code for in a dumbed down form-factor and looking good which has a true linux as a (huge) bonus | 03:04 |
| qwazix | by the way I just made an app that shows the time when you pull the N900 out of your pocket | 03:06 |
| qwazix | I don't know how much power it sucks yet but it shouldn't be much unless polling the proximity sensor is power-hungry | 03:06 |
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| merlin1991 | qwazix: it'd check if there is an api in place that you don't have to poll the sensor but instead get a notification on change | 03:41 |
| merlin1991 | s/it'd/I'd/ | 03:41 |
| infobot | merlin1991 meant: qwazix: I'd check if there is an api in place that you don't have to poll the sensor but instead get a notification on change | 03:41 |
| qwazix | merlin1991, I tried with qtm but it didn't seem to fire the signal | 03:42 |
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| qwazix | google doesn't give any useful results for N900 proximity sensor, so I just stole some code from another app in extras-something | 03:43 |
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| qwazix | qtm as in "code I wrote for harmattan and works" | 03:45 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, as I've asked in TMO thread- what about CPu updating screen on 60hz? | 03:53 |
| Estel_ | You overcame it by some trick of one-per-minute snapshot frozen or screen, or it's still issue? | 03:54 |
| qwazix | No, I overcame it with showing the clock for only 6 seconds after the proximity sensor gets uncovered | 03:54 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, as for N900 as mobile computer, I also use it as that mainly, to the point that I don't take notebook while travelling, just N900, portable usb keyboard and bluetooth mouse | 03:55 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, ah | 03:55 |
| Estel_ | so it's not showing clock all the time? | 03:55 |
| qwazix | So even if you pull the N900 out of your pocket every five minutes the total time shouldn't be too much for all day | 03:55 |
| Estel_ | kinda equivalent for clicking power button yourself, +, without backlight, it probably uses less power than lockscreen showing | 03:55 |
| qwazix | No, I couldn't think of a better solution. | 03:55 |
| Estel_ | sure, power usage should be minimal | 03:56 |
| * Estel_ nods | 03:56 | |
| Estel_ | sounds sane, good work | 03:56 |
| Estel_ | it's a pity that You can't force screen to show something and stop refreshing :P | 03:56 |
| Estel_ | (until order given) | 03:56 |
| Estel_ | refreshing it once per minute would suffice, then (with updated time) and it could stay without backlight all the time | 03:56 |
| Estel_ | quite impossible, though, I suppose | 03:57 |
| qwazix | But I was thinking about my usecase of the N9 idle screen. Most of the times I just pull it out glance at the time and put it back. Also if the N900 is on the table, it's far easier to hover your finger over the proximity sensor than press the power button | 03:57 |
| Estel_ | BTW, I can confirm, that for "dissapearing leds" bug, power-cycle is a proper solution | 03:57 |
| qwazix | (which has a bug and needs two clicks most of the time) | 03:57 |
| Estel_ | I mean this thing, where sudden of nothing, both notification led and backlight ledf refuses to work, and live through power down and booting again | 03:57 |
| Estel_ | I got just hit by it today, and removing battery for 30 seconds fixed it | 03:57 |
| qwazix | Yeah, happened to me yesterday | 03:58 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, sure, Your clock is best we can achiueve, I suppose | 03:58 |
| Estel_ | achieve* | 03:58 |
| qwazix | Annoying, I wanted to test if it had powered down properly so that I could swap batteries | 03:58 |
| Estel_ | after installation, one can actyivate and deactivate it on demand, without uninstalling? | 03:58 |
| Estel_ | via config file, control panel thing or whatever? | 03:58 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, yea :P | 03:59 |
| qwazix | no, there isn't such a feature right now | 03:59 |
| Estel_ | but You know what? | 03:59 |
| Estel_ | when You're testing it, and led goes on for a while | 03:59 |
| Estel_ | You again need to wait few seconds for it to shut down totally | 03:59 |
| Estel_ | I used to do such test, buit it's poiuntless, better to wait a short while after powering down | 03:59 |
| qwazix | yeah, I was pressing the power instantly to see if it starts to light up | 04:00 |
| Estel_ | BTW, as said, I also use it as mobile computer, but as primary (and only one, to be honest) phone. I overcame battery things with dual-scud and mugen cover | 04:00 |
| Estel_ | + another dual-scud sitting in pocket | 04:00 |
| qwazix | and it booted again, so I had to wait for shutdown again | 04:00 |
| Estel_ | soon, it will be even less of an issue, with 6800 mAh dual-18650 | 04:00 |
| Estel_ | in custom body | 04:00 |
| * ShadowJK 's N900 is primary phone (secondary phone is another N900) | 04:00 | |
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| Estel_ | I wonder why led driver freaksd out like that... fortunately, it's not anything dangerous, i.e. it dissapear after cycle without any problems in months, many times | 04:01 |
| qwazix | I just carry an extra japod most of the time | 04:01 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, haha | 04:01 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, it's no joke :) | 04:01 |
| qwazix | I didn't go for mugen for the lack of camera cover | 04:01 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I know :) | 04:01 |
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| Estel_ | I would do the same, if not for fact, that my secondary N900's are in constant move, i.e. sold to someone or given to family members | 04:01 |
| ShadowJK | And I don't use mugen* anymore, heh | 04:01 |
| Estel_ | so usually I have few N900 in house, but only one "mine" forever ;) | 04:02 |
| qwazix | ShadowJK, I also had that configuration for about a month or two, and then the N9 came out so I had to get one :) | 04:02 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, wtf? I've posted tutorial how to add camera lens cover for muygen cover ages agfo | 04:02 |
| Estel_ | ago* | 04:02 |
| Estel_ | in battery's thread | 04:02 |
| Estel_ | it's also in my signature | 04:02 |
| Estel_ | I wouldn't accept lack of camera lens cover, too | 04:02 |
| qwazix | really? I never noticed that... | 04:03 |
| Estel_ | see my signature on TMO :P | 04:03 |
| ShadowJK | I'm quite pleased, battery lasts for more than a shift at work while I'm online on irc and constantly listening to podcasts | 04:03 |
| Estel_ | it's no-cost solution | 04:03 |
| ShadowJK | over bluetooth | 04:03 |
| Estel_ | and works like a charm | 04:03 |
| qwazix | And I thought, I followed all interesting things on tmo | 04:03 |
| * RST38h moos | 04:03 | |
| * ShadowJK follows nothing on tmo | 04:03 | |
| Estel_ | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1038196&postcount=799 | 04:03 |
| RST38h | What's new and exciting? | 04:03 |
| Estel_ | moo RST38h | 04:04 |
| DocAvalanche | >><Estel_> I've just ordered parts for usb to serial adaptor, and i'll make Ir receiver dongle for it, so it will learn signals from remotes<< lame :-P | 04:04 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Still using N900? | 04:04 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, yes, absolutely | 04:04 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, why so?:) | 04:04 |
| * RST38h switched to the Note lately | 04:04 | |
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| qwazix | I think it's even more important on the N900 because as it came with one, maybe the glass isn't as scratch resistant as on phones where no cover exists | 04:04 |
| qwazix | I fear the N950 camera glass very much as it's flush with the body | 04:05 |
| RST38h | [but would really wish he didn't] | 04:05 |
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| Estel_ | qwazix, the truth is that thing covering it is always plastic, and every is propne to scratches | 04:05 |
| ShadowJK | tmo is too high traffic / too high noise for me to follow | 04:05 |
| Estel_ | camera lens cover is genious thing for N900 | 04:05 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, same here, I actually cut polycarbonate protector foil and sticked it to N950 | 04:05 |
| ShadowJK | I wish I could get an N900 with more RAM and more cpu, but mostly more ram | 04:05 |
| qwazix | yes but couldn't they make the back flat? | 04:05 |
| RST38h | tmo is probably full by eager but dumb fanatics by now | 04:05 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, exactly my thoughts | 04:05 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: N9. | 04:05 |
| DocAvalanche | nifty IR learning tool consists of two components: a 3.5mm jack and a phototransistor | 04:06 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, N9 is so much effort to make usable? | 04:06 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: The only app that manages to strain it is Firefox Mobile | 04:06 |
| Estel_ | it's You who traced down same chips with 1GB of ram, impossible to solder without mega equipment, though | 04:06 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: nah, it is ok, we have got one in the family | 04:06 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, serial one is more powerful ;) | 04:06 |
| ShadowJK | Atleast on android there's a VPN api, so I have a remote chance of being able to read my email | 04:06 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: not as evil as free software people like to describe it, just quirky | 04:06 |
| Estel_ | + have added benefit of possibility to act as IRda for legacy devices | 04:06 |
| ShadowJK | reading email on the move, which I thought was a major progress with the arrival of N900 :-) | 04:07 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, nevertheless, any software for utilizing jack signal input as IR one for N900 exist? | 04:07 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: If you need VPN toread email, then maybe you do not need to read that email =) | 04:07 |
| DocAvalanche | arecord ;-) | 04:07 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, i also need it for irc and webs :-\ | 04:07 |
| RST38h | VPN? Why? | 04:07 |
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| Estel_ | locked ports, probably, intranet | 04:08 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, arecord? will check it | 04:08 |
| ShadowJK | Without openvpn I'd be disconnecting and reconnecting every 45 seconds or something, lol | 04:08 |
| Estel_ | RST38h, don't make me lsit all fails of N9 as a mobile computer :P | 04:08 |
| Estel_ | like capacitive screen | 04:08 |
| Estel_ | or lack of you-know-what or even lack of-second-thing-you-know-about | 04:09 |
| ShadowJK | openvpn is that which bridges the gap when my actual public IP isn't public or changes rapidly :) | 04:09 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: You are not using cellular IP? | 04:09 |
| ShadowJK | I've got an android tablet on the way to me anyways, let's see if I can make do with that | 04:09 |
| RST38h | Or your cellular service likes changing your IP address every minute? | 04:09 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, what is "cellular IP"? | 04:09 |
| RST38h | Like, GPRS/3G/etc as opposed to Wifi | 04:09 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, how You want to transfer audio wave to good quality Ir signals understandable by other programs? | 04:10 |
| * RST38h had no problem running IRC/SSH/etc via GPRS and UMTS | 04:10 | |
| RST38h | Even on the move | 04:10 |
| Estel_ | cellular connection have manyh cons, though :) | 04:11 |
| Estel_ | coverage, price, transfer limits, ping | 04:11 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: afaik you could get IRQ driven input from random GPIO by using some sysfs or proc or dev GPIO interface | 04:11 |
| ShadowJK | At home I get 3g upstairs and 2g downstairs, wifi AP1 west end of house and wifi AP2 east end of house. Mostly only east AP when outside. openvpn makes it all perfectly seamless. :-) | 04:11 |
| Estel_ | no wifi repeater mode, though? | 04:12 |
| RST38h | You live in a castle? =) | 04:12 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, I do not | 04:12 |
| ShadowJK | it's made out of wood | 04:12 |
| RST38h | and that too - a few repeaters would probably solve the problem | 04:12 |
| Estel_ | so it's a fort | 04:12 |
| Estel_ | seriously though, it's not uncommon | 04:12 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: >8cm of wood? | 04:12 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, yes | 04:12 |
| DocAvalanche | Estel_: maybe by a 5-liner checking for absolute value maximum of a window of samples covering 1/40kHz | 04:12 |
| ShadowJK | There's not enough free spectrum for a repeater | 04:12 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Sounds serious | 04:13 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, sure, but who will code that, if one can put serial adaptor via hostmode :P | 04:13 |
| qwazix | DocAvalanche, ehm I'd say that's greek to me but as I am Greek this wouldn't give the right message. | 04:13 |
| ShadowJK | not on 2.4Ghz atleast | 04:13 |
| DocAvalanche | lol | 04:13 |
| Estel_ | I know theory, I asked about ready to use tools | 04:13 |
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| * RST38h lived at the end of a 20m concrete funnel from the AP, and it was still ok | 04:13 | |
| ShadowJK | Neighbour has one AP, so that leaves 2 frequencies available, and those are the frequencies used by the APs installed at either end of the house. | 04:13 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, he mean that proximity sensor is GPIO | 04:13 |
| Estel_ | (general purpose input-ouput) | 04:13 |
| Estel_ | and that you could read it from sysfs or proc | 04:14 |
| Estel_ | or GPIO interface | 04:14 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Switch to 802.11n, get one AP with many antennas | 04:14 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Will need a new phone though =( | 04:14 |
| Estel_ | as for IRQ driven input, he would explain it better | 04:14 |
| Estel_ | RST38h, 802.11n sucks | 04:14 |
| Estel_ | it's good only for jamming neighbourns wifi | 04:14 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: I think I heard the *wrt guys talking about it | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, AIUI, proper repeater repeats on same frequency? | 04:15 |
| ShadowJK | One of the APs have 11n with 3 antennas. It has shorter range than the WRT54GL with tomato firmware... | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | also, the thing about total of 3 non-interlapping frequencies is true, but little overexagerrated | 04:15 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, and halves bandwidth for every repeat? | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | m,y neighbourns use all possible channels | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | and I still have perfectly working wifi on high speeds and wide coverage | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, no idea, never played with repeaters in real life ;) | 04:15 |
| Estel_ | instead, I have wrt54gl with DIY antennas | 04:16 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: it's like "cd /sysfoo/hw/buttons; echo GPIO56 >enable; cat gpio56" | 04:16 |
| Estel_ | could connect to it from next multi-house block | 04:16 |
| ShadowJK | mine has the 9dBm antennas | 04:16 |
| ShadowJK | or whatever, iirc 3 or 6dB over stock | 04:16 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, they have 9dB in producent dreams, trust me on that (tm) | 04:17 |
| qwazix | DocAvalanche, and how do I get a signal that the value has changed? | 04:17 |
| ShadowJK | It's pretty spotty outside though. I can connect with phone at 50m if I stand in the right place, but there's no "universal" coverage even at 20m outside (transmitter is indoors) | 04:17 |
| Estel_ | You either tunnel rango into shape that suits Your need, or you have flat one, only one gain possible via antennas is spectrum shaping | 04:17 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: on cursory read I think you wanna know this: http://www.acmesystems.it/gpio_sysfs | 04:18 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, because those 9dB antennas have stupid spectrum shape, probably | 04:18 |
| Estel_ | it's quite possible, that they emit msot power straight up | 04:18 |
| Estel_ | most* | 04:18 |
| Estel_ | in extreme case | 04:18 |
| ShadowJK | The unmodified 11n AP with original 3 antennas in place does worse :-) | 04:19 |
| Estel_ | I suspect good DIY fractal is something that would make you King of the Hill, aka Your neighbourns would need to worry about free frequencies :P | 04:19 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, sure, as 802.11n sucks | 04:19 |
| Estel_ | it's good for having high bandwidth in 5 meters between router and desk | 04:19 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: still polling :-/ | 04:19 |
| Estel_ | + in some models to jam surrounding g networks | 04:20 |
| ShadowJK | If I put fractal antenna on first floor, there'll only be one single neighbour within the radio horizon to worry about. | 04:20 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: ...but I *think* I've seen a way to attach a 'callback' | 04:20 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I was rather about fractal of correwct shape and turned correctly, to shape radio spectrum to your needs | 04:20 |
| Estel_ | i.e. solid coverage where You need it | 04:21 |
| Estel_ | and no free wifi for birds | 04:21 |
| Estel_ | or passing helis | 04:21 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: https://www.ridgerun.com/developer/wiki/inde >>Configure GPIO an an interrupt source<< | 04:21 |
| Estel_ | for example, simple sierpinski gasket fractal antenna - few minutes of work - is able to provide 1000 meter reliable link between two wrt54gl. But, it's spectrum is VERY wide, very directional | 04:22 |
| DocAvalanche | dafaq | 04:22 |
| DocAvalanche | https://www.ridgerun.com/developer/wiki/index.php/How_to_use_GPIO_signals | 04:22 |
| Estel_ | antennas are all abotu resoning to required frequency (I hope that producent of those 9dB haven't screwed that) and shaping spectrum, no other magic gain possible | 04:22 |
| ShadowJK | nomatter what I do, there will be disconnects though | 04:22 |
| Estel_ | it's gain in some aprt of spectrum's shape, and loss in another | 04:22 |
| ShadowJK | which is the original topic | 04:22 |
| Estel_ | with one router covering house and garden? | 04:22 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: >>If you have a GPIO that is an input, and you have an application you want to block waiting for the GPIO to change level, you can configure the GPIO as an interrupt source. You also need to configure if the interrupt occurs when the GPIO signal has a rising edge, a falling edge, or interrupts on both rising and falling edges. Once configured as an interrupt, your application can read the value file and the read will block until the | 04:23 |
| DocAvalanche | interrupt occurs, then your application will return from the read system call and continue running.<< | 04:23 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, the range is finite | 04:23 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, instead of reinventing whell, why won't You just use shortcutd daemon? | 04:23 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, You've said You don't live in castle ;) | 04:23 |
| Estel_ | sure, I'm not insisting, it's Your wifi after all | 04:23 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, the range is still finite | 04:23 |
| Estel_ | but I nyet have to see single-family house, that can't be covered byt single, properly configured and "antenna'ed" wrt54GL | 04:24 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: now say "thank you, doc!" ;-P | 04:24 |
| Estel_ | well, one of them, set up by me, is providing access for 100+ people in multi-family block house | 04:24 |
| Estel_ | SINGLE unit | 04:24 |
| ShadowJK | The living house is wood, but the buildings outside are brick or concrete or more wood | 04:24 |
| Estel_ | wait, how far away from home You want wifi to exist? | 04:24 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, no that's wrong question, I want connectivity to exist seamlessly everywhere | 04:25 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, again, I think that there is already daemon used by shortcutd thing, for power-save savvy polling of proxim | 04:25 |
| qwazix | DocAvalanche, thanks I'm still trying to fit all these new concepts around my head | 04:25 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, inside those concrete or brick buildings too? | 04:26 |
| Estel_ | asking seriously, no irony | 04:26 |
| Estel_ | I though You want to have reliable wifi in wooden house, and it's garden | 04:26 |
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| Estel_ | which IMO and from my experience, is easily possiuble with single used wrt54GL with openWRT on board, and DIY antennas | 04:27 |
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| Estel_ | even more than that | 04:27 |
| ShadowJK | With N800, N810 and N900 currently running openvpn, it doesn't matter if I'm at home inside, or outside checking up on the potatos, being shaded from wifi by hte concrete barn, or 100km away on a shopping trip, openvpn makes it all seamless across wifis and cellular | 04:27 |
| Estel_ | of course, if You have special needs like wifi in some bujildings outside, more aps may be necessary | 04:27 |
| Estel_ | yea | 04:27 |
| Estel_ | as for cellular, it's true | 04:27 |
| Estel_ | kinda conveinent | 04:27 |
| Estel_ | well, I think everyone have own usage pattern, and N900 is wonderful to allow so much flexibility | 04:28 |
| Estel_ | well, it's real mobile computer, after all | 04:28 |
| Estel_ | this more RAM would make us all happy :) | 04:28 |
| ShadowJK | My home lan has 3 different paths to internet, there's an openvpn server on the lan that automatically picks another connection if the current internet connection isn't working :-) | 04:29 |
| Estel_ | failsafe solution, neat | 04:29 |
| Estel_ | I hope You know that I wasn't trying to insist You change Your net layout ;) i'm just "wifi freak" doing this strange things like wifi link over harbour or whatever | 04:29 |
| ShadowJK | speeds are 100M, 2M, 5k :-) | 04:30 |
| Estel_ | using chinese dishesh etc | 04:30 |
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| qwazix | Estel_, seems that shortcutd uses dbus, I didn't know there was a dbus interface for proximity sensor | 04:30 |
| ShadowJK | Usually when I get home everything is running on the 5k which has superior reliability | 04:31 |
| Estel_ | that's why I've suggested it :) | 04:31 |
| Estel_ | it isn't switching back to faster one, when available? | 04:31 |
| qwazix | or I'm just dizzy from all the info Doc gave me and it's 5AM | 04:31 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, benefit of shortcutd is that it's already ready, available in repos and written ;) | 04:31 |
| Estel_ | Other things, Yolu would need to create from scratch, mostly | 04:32 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, while we have You here, small unrelated question, if You don't mind. It's only me, or Pr 1.2 on N950 made charging white-led notification-less? | 04:32 |
| qwazix | That's what I tried to do, copy a written program, but it seems I chose the wrong one... | 04:32 |
| Estel_ | i.e. before update,. while charging with screen of, it was breathing, like N900 | 04:32 |
| Estel_ | now it isn't | 04:32 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, for shortcutd, you don't even need to copy it | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | it consist of two packages | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | daemon, and shortcutd we all use | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | the latter depends on the former | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | but the former can be polled by any othyer program | 04:33 |
| qwazix | aha, so I could just depend on it | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | yea and use it's functions | 04:33 |
| qwazix | so that's why it uses dbus | 04:33 |
| ShadowJK | um | 04:33 |
| Estel_ | tfor sure they're documented on garage, or inside daemon prompt itself, or... | 04:33 |
| qwazix | it just communicates with the daemon | 04:34 |
| Estel_ | shadeslayer, it fuckin irritates me, as I never know if N950 is charged or not, without unclocking it | 04:34 |
| qwazix | I was checking source of the latter | 04:34 |
| Estel_ | yea :) | 04:34 |
| DocAvalanche | now our council could jump in and say "waaaaait! does our kernel even support /sys/class/gpio ?", check that, and possibly pester pali to include it to next KP if missing | 04:34 |
| Estel_ | suuuure | 04:35 |
| Estel_ | don't you know that Council is made for "higher" and "bigger" things? ;) | 04:35 |
| Estel_ | or at least that is how I will remember them, unfortunately, but it's unrelated topic which I don't want to go into | 04:36 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, as far as I'm concerned, N950 does not exist for normal people, and the fact that you are asking questions about it implies that you have one, which makes me extremely jelous. Go away with your N950 and your other extremely fortunate and extremely rich buddies into #harmattan or something? | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | t900:/sys/class# ls -l gpio/ | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | --w------- 1 root root 4096 Jul 28 03:44 export | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 0 Jul 28 03:44 gpiochip0 | 04:36 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, sorry, I was sure You have one too? | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 0 Jul 28 03:44 gpiochip128 | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | ... | 04:36 |
| DocAvalanche | t900:/sys/class# uname -a | 04:37 |
| DocAvalanche | Linux t900 2.6.28.10power46 #1 PREEMPT Sun Dec 12 03:11:24 EET 2010 armv7l unknown | 04:37 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, don't be jealous, it's ncie device at one side, but leaves You with sad feeling or wasted potential and idiotic design decisions in other side | 04:37 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, I'm not part of the millionaire's club, sorry. I apologize if my humble appearance is similar to someone else you saw on the exclusive VIP club luxury sailing boat yacht meet. | 04:37 |
| Estel_ | BTW, DocScrutinizer also have one :P | 04:37 |
| Estel_ | sure ;) | 04:37 |
| Estel_ | Why haven't You submitted for CA? | 04:37 |
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| Estel_ | you would get one in instant | 04:38 |
| Estel_ | breath | 04:38 |
| qwazix | Estel_, DocAvalanche, proximityd of shortcutd also polls the proximity sensor, about the same that I'm doing | 04:38 |
| Estel_ | as for millionaire's club, You're just joking around, or You share my feeling, that after some years it will be quite expensive collector's device? | 04:39 |
| qwazix | so we can safely assume that it doesn't suck up too much battery ;) | 04:39 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, but with proximityd You don't have two things polling it, if someone is using shortcutd | 04:39 |
| Estel_ | and already written and tested solution | 04:39 |
| Estel_ | but yes, it shouldn't | 04:39 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: polling (as in reading on a time pace) *always* sucks | 04:39 |
| Estel_ | still, I think modularity is great thing, and if we have daemon for that in repos, we should use it | 04:39 |
| DocAvalanche | both battery and in general | 04:40 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, in practice it's neglible | 04:40 |
| DocAvalanche | and in reaction time | 04:40 |
| Estel_ | bbut if better solution exist, it could be used for updating proximityd to use better method ;) | 04:40 |
| DocAvalanche | Estel_: depends on polling frequency | 04:40 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, sure | 04:40 |
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| Estel_ | qwazix, another advantage of using proximityd is that You could have co-existing usage of proximity sensor when phone is unlocked, for shortcutd, and for Your timenow when it's locked | 04:41 |
| Estel_ | otherwise, you have conflicts | 04:41 |
| Estel_ | and, of course, when someone use both, 2 things will poll same sensor unnecessary | 04:41 |
| qwazix | Estel_, agreed, and it seems that proximityd also does some cleverer polling by adjusting the frequency | 04:41 |
| Estel_ | sucking 2x power | 04:41 |
| * Estel_ nods | 04:41 | |
| DocAvalanche | OUCH | 04:42 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, but seriously, whyt haven't you applied for CA, you would get N950 without questions asked, I suppose | 04:42 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: will proximityd read my mind to know when to ramp up polling frequency? ;-) | 04:42 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, sure | 04:42 |
| ShadowJK | wtf is CA? | 04:42 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, what WAS CA | 04:43 |
| Estel_ | was* | 04:43 |
| Estel_ | it was Community Awards | 04:43 |
| DocAvalanche | ShadowJK: that 'awards' madness | 04:43 |
| Estel_ | 25 devices from Nokia, including 10 N950 and 15 N9, that were meant to be awarded NOT for developers only, but for community Contributors | 04:43 |
| Estel_ | with 3 week's time for sending applications, and anothyer week for Council to debate about winners | 04:43 |
| ShadowJK | I'd seriously hope there'd be 25 more qualified than myself | 04:43 |
| Estel_ | freemangordon, Pali, and such guys got it, for example | 04:44 |
| DocAvalanche | ShadowJK: hardly | 04:44 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, you wouldn't belive some people that submitted | 04:44 |
| Estel_ | and I agree with DocAvalanche | 04:44 |
| Estel_ | sure, merlin1991, freemangordon, Pali, etc are very active and would be higher than You, but You would still get one without problems | 04:44 |
| ShadowJK | It would be a clever tactic from elop anyway, offering harmattan devices to fremantle people? Fragment it further? | 04:44 |
| Estel_ | trust me on that (tm) I was part of jury ;)9 | 04:44 |
| qwazix | DocAvalanche, no I just suppose, the application using it can request polling frequency by usage case, didn't read all of the code, I just saw some frequency adjusting code. For example when device is unlocked timenow doesn't need to poll the sensor | 04:44 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, this time, no | 04:45 |
| DocAvalanche | ShadowJK: all your stuff is top notch, regarding contributions to community asset | 04:45 |
| Estel_ | rather it was Qgil who liked to forward devices to0 community instead of trash bin | 04:45 |
| ShadowJK | I would've applied if they'd offered N900s | 04:45 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, BTw, people that are doing most work for fremantle, especially increased lately, also received devices | 04:45 |
| Estel_ | they don't think about switching to harmattan | 04:45 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: fair enough, almost as stupid as QTM sensors then | 04:46 |
| Estel_ | alternatively, despite 100 devices (25 was jsut for Ca, other 75 devices were handled for "developers"), #harmattan channel is rather filled with rats shit | 04:46 |
| Estel_ | like ZogG's writing | 04:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ad hominem. | 04:47 |
| Estel_ | not something like conversations on Maemo. today I had 831 lines to read, all of them discussion between freemangordon, Pali, merlin1991, etc, about actual things they write for Maemo | 04:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Last warning. | 04:47 |
| Estel_ | GeneralAntilles, had no idea you're around ;p | 04:47 |
| Estel_ | forgive me | 04:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Keep things positive. :) | 04:47 |
| ShadowJK | GeneralAntilles, I'm sorry I promise I wont do it again? | 04:47 |
| Estel_ | haha | 04:47 |
| DocAvalanche | GeneralAntilles and me are *always* around | 04:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, yeah, yeah. :P | 04:48 |
| Estel_ | Ok, #harmattan channel is filled with flower scent, where we're on industrially productive mood here on #maemo | 04:48 |
| qwazix | Estel_, did you have a N810 before N900 | 04:48 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_, please don't laugh at man being opressed by the authority :-( | 04:48 |
| Estel_ | nope. If one day i'll be a "millionare club" like in ShadowJK jokes, I wil lbuy one for collection | 04:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Some watery tart threw me a sword. | 04:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, nyaaaaaaa | 04:49 |
| * ShadowJK sighs | 04:49 | |
| Estel_ | qwazix, why asking? | 04:49 |
| qwazix | I just got one, and I realized that if I had one when the N900 got out I would be totally pissed with the direction fremantle went | 04:49 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, having mobile network and phone funcionality doesn't hurt ;) | 04:49 |
| Estel_ | while lack of camera lens cover, microSd slot, and capacitive screen does :( | 04:50 |
| Estel_ | sure, 810 had better kickstand, but it is fixable | 04:50 |
| qwazix | That's why I didn't get one when it was fresh | 04:50 |
| Estel_ | if only via replacement body project | 04:50 |
| qwazix | But the screen seems huge compared to the N900, | 04:50 |
| Estel_ | You won't add missing microSd slot or replace digitizer, though :( on N950/N9 | 04:50 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, yea, but resolution is same | 04:50 |
| qwazix | the applications available were pc-grade while on the N900 for the first six months we couldnt open a zip file | 04:51 |
| Estel_ | but it's true, that many people felt this way then | 04:51 |
| DocAvalanche | qwazix: in very old chanlogs you can read me ranting about fremantle GUI's retardedness compared to diablo | 04:51 |
| Estel_ | still, I'm afraid N9/50 flaws are more serious and less possible to fix | 04:51 |
| qwazix | res is the same, but the huge thumbable buttons eat a great deal of the real estate | 04:51 |
| Estel_ | I though open kernel kilols aegis... | 04:51 |
| qwazix | and the digitizer is much more sensitive | 04:52 |
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| Estel_ | yet, yesterday, MohammadAG told me that they can't drop-in things from Pr 1.3 to N950, because of aegis and file itnegrity checks | 04:52 |
| Estel_ | harmattan sounds like fckd in head unfixable (I hope it isn't ad hominem:P ) | 04:52 |
| qwazix | It's like I have a laptop in my pocket. Anyway, today the N810 is almost useless due to lack of RAM, it bogs down even on tmo, not to mention heavy websites | 04:52 |
| Estel_ | it would be no problem if Mer hardware adaptation for N950 and N9 would be finished, but it isn't and probably never will | 04:53 |
| DocAvalanche | YEAAAAH! thunder! \o/ | 04:53 |
| DocAvalanche | ~weather eddn | 04:53 |
| infobot | Nuernberg, Germany; (EDDN) 49-30N 011-03E 318M; last updated: 2012.07.28 0120 UTC; Dew Point: 60 F (16 C); Pressure (altimeter): 29.80 in. Hg (1009 hPa); Relative Humidity: 60%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Weather: 75 F (24 C); Wind: from the N (010 degrees) at 10 MPH (9 KT) (direction variable) | 04:53 |
| Estel_ | Riders of the Storm | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | DocAvalanche, you hate change just as much as me, don't you? :P | 04:54 |
| qwazix | yet today Fremantle is all a geek would need, so I don't give up hopes on harmattan yet | 04:54 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, before I make the same mistake again - you own N950 or N9? | 04:54 |
| qwazix | both | 04:54 |
| Estel_ | god bless You. you know, for someone jumping few days ago, N950 landing page on wiki have only few details... Could You Pm me, on TMo, in free moment, links to essential threads (about essential things) for Harm? | 04:55 |
| qwazix | USB host mode for example was deemed unfixable for the N900, it was stated so many times that it was impossible that when I saw announce thread I was sure it was a hoax | 04:55 |
| Estel_ | searching for it on TMO, for someone who haven't followed harmatytan thing sicne last few days, iks kinda... | 04:55 |
| Estel_ | I would liek to bring N950 to some usable stage | 04:55 |
| Estel_ | Kinda crazy week, I have to install thumb on N900, play with N950, and play with two raspberry Pi's lying on my desk | 04:56 |
| ShadowJK | There's still, afaik, no comprehensive page available that tells you how to fix the N9 braindamage | 04:56 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, exactly | 04:56 |
| ShadowJK | Main reasons why I've not bought one. | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anybody else pitch in on the MetaWatch kickstarter? | 04:56 |
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| Estel_ | qwazix is quite fluent in TMO, that's why I asked him for lsit of most improtant topics, that he for sure have subscribed :P | 04:56 |
| qwazix | Estel_, will do, probably set up a wiki page. But now it's too late. Tomorrow if I find some time | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/metawatch/metawatch-strata-the-smartwatch-for-the-iphone-4s | 04:56 |
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| DocAvalanche | GeneralAntilles: indeed (hate change) | 04:57 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, sure, thanks a lot | 04:57 |
| ShadowJK | And instead ordered an android tablet as a first step to figure out how to migrate and make the android environment usable and interoperable | 04:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fuck change!!! | 04:57 |
| Estel_ | just ping me with it when you will have time and do it, ok? so I won't miss it | 04:57 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, making android usable is even more PITa than with harmattan | 04:57 |
| qwazix | ShadowJK, on the other hand I do think that android is unfixable | 04:57 |
| Estel_ | better stick to N900 ;) | 04:57 |
| * ShadowJK has a few N900 halflifes of time to figure it out | 04:57 | |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, mission impossible | 04:58 |
| Estel_ | android is jsut brainfucked in head even more | 04:58 |
| Estel_ | You could expect jolla and Mer sooner ;) | 04:58 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah :) | 04:58 |
| ShadowJK | Or a X emulator on android | 04:58 |
| qwazix | Android has too much of windows philosophy. | 04:58 |
| ShadowJK | where X is anything that can run linux | 04:58 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, emulator? Thats why you need those 3254623656432 cores on tablet? | 04:59 |
| ShadowJK | sure | 04:59 |
| Estel_ | I though just to allow them spying on You and encrypting content on the fly, + shedule it with legit traffic | 04:59 |
| ShadowJK | half of them to run javascript | 04:59 |
| Estel_ | ;) | 04:59 |
| FIQ|n900 | android is unlinuxized linux | 04:59 |
| FIQ|n900 | also | 04:59 |
| Estel_ | well, windows mobile is also based on linux, after all | 04:59 |
| Estel_ | why not android | 04:59 |
| ShadowJK | Problem is obviously that there's no maemo tablet | 05:00 |
| FIQ|n900 | I think that android can't handle multicore properly | 05:00 |
| qwazix | windows mobile based on linux?? | 05:00 |
| ShadowJK | Not anything newer than 2008 anyway | 05:00 |
| FIQ|n900 | [04:00:15] <Estel_> well, windows mobile is also based on linux, after all | 05:00 |
| FIQ|n900 | ? | 05:00 |
| FIQ|n900 | that doesn't make sense | 05:00 |
| Estel_ | don't know about current versions, but 6 had more common with linux than windows on desktop, of course, being idiotically closed | 05:01 |
| qwazix | Pitchforks and GPL at hand and to the microsoft offices | 05:01 |
| Estel_ | I'm reffering to Android "openess" philosophy | 05:01 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, haha | 05:01 |
| qwazix | by the way some guys here attacked the MS offices with stones and molotovs... | 05:01 |
| Estel_ | well, Android is as Open as google doesn't do evil | 05:01 |
| ShadowJK | ... | 05:01 |
| Estel_ | qwazix, they didn't liekd leaked windows 8 betas?>;) | 05:02 |
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| Estel_ | liked* | 05:02 |
| Estel_ | but seriously, why so? | 05:02 |
| qwazix | hahaha... don't know really? activists of a kind? | 05:02 |
| ShadowJK | google abandoned the "do no evil" policy like half a decade ago? | 05:02 |
| Estel_ | kinda bitchy way of activity, to attack low-rank microsoft workers | 05:02 |
| qwazix | s/?/ / | 05:02 |
| infobot | qwazix meant: hahaha... don't know really activists of a kind? | 05:02 |
| ShadowJK | When they figured out that they could redefine evil | 05:02 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, Android was also open source half decadce ago ;P | 05:03 |
| FIQ|n900 | lol | 05:03 |
| Estel_ | but jokes aside - everyone is free to invest own money whenever want, but in case of lacking good devices | 05:03 |
| Estel_ | I wouldn't support bad ones via my money | 05:03 |
| Estel_ | I'm using what I like, no one will force me to me3ss with fckin android | 05:04 |
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| ShadowJK | For me the choice seems to be between W7 and android | 05:04 |
| ShadowJK | heh | 05:04 |
| Estel_ | if Jolla will provide, that's great. If not, well, IO have N900, and hope for community-driven hardware :) | 05:04 |
| FIQ|n900 | ShadowJK: fun choice | 05:04 |
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| Estel_ | ShadowJK, Vivaldi? | 05:04 |
| FIQ|n900 | do android | 05:04 |
| ShadowJK | What is vivaldi? | 05:04 |
| Estel_ | it have to arrive some day :P | 05:04 |
| FIQ|n900 | wp7 is a living dead | 05:04 |
| ShadowJK | I did not say WP7, I said W7 | 05:05 |
| FIQ|n900 | oh | 05:05 |
| FIQ|n900 | misread | 05:05 |
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| Estel_ | http://opentablets.org/ | 05:05 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, ^ | 05:05 |
| qwazix | Bye guys, I'm off to bed | 05:05 |
| ShadowJK | I have a W7 netbook. The performance is great. The display pisses me off. The touchpad pisses me off. The keyboard is great. | 05:06 |
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| Estel_ | the system doesn't piss You off?:P | 05:06 |
| Estel_ | see ya qwazix | 05:06 |
| ShadowJK | it's down on my list of things | 05:06 |
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| DocAvalanche | goldelico will (probably) produce a 7" or larger version of GTA04 | 05:07 |
| ShadowJK | below screen and pointing device | 05:07 |
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| DocAvalanche | and also a device with OMAP4 is planned | 05:07 |
| Estel_ | DocAvalanche, it will still cost moar $$$$$ for 256 Mb RAM? | 05:07 |
| ShadowJK | omap3 with 1gig ram would be sufficient | 05:07 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, and what are your thoughts about vivaldi thing? | 05:08 |
| ShadowJK | in any formfactor >=3.5" :-) | 05:08 |
| ShadowJK | What is vivaldi? | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | sure, capacitive screen sucks, but other than that... | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | Mer and plasma active | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | http://opentablets.org/ | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | pasted it already ;) | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | few lines above | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | do you see links? | 05:08 |
| Estel_ | or irc obscured them, somehow? | 05:08 |
| DocAvalanche | not unusual | 05:08 |
| ShadowJK | it says internal storage is 8g instead of 4g | 05:09 |
| ShadowJK | for more info click this | 05:09 |
| * ShadowJK clicks | 05:09 | |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, screw that, it contains sd slot | 05:09 |
| Estel_ | 1Gb RAM | 05:09 |
| ShadowJK | and I get to "ideas to build content stores on" | 05:09 |
| Estel_ | screw that too | 05:09 |
| Estel_ | based on Mer | 05:09 |
| Estel_ | with open UI as plasma active | 05:09 |
| DocAvalanche | STORAGE?? 8 jig? dafaq | 05:09 |
| Estel_ | and upstream kernel | 05:09 |
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| Estel_ | acceptable hardware specs | 05:09 |
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| Estel_ | storage is least olf concern with slot for full-sized sd cards | 05:10 |
| FIQ|n900 | DocAvalanche: more isn't needed | 05:10 |
| ShadowJK | DocAvalanche, does 7" mean they managed to find someone with a 3D printer or similar? or is it still caseless? | 05:10 |
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| DocAvalanche | there's already a 3D printed GTA02 case | 05:10 |
| ShadowJK | oh | 05:10 |
| DocAvalanche | in white ;-D | 05:11 |
| ShadowJK | Last time I checked you needed a freerunner case | 05:11 |
| DocAvalanche | translucent | 05:11 |
| DocAvalanche | nope, you *can* get a complete device as well, afaik | 05:11 |
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| DocAvalanche | incl case and LCM | 05:12 |
| FIQ|n900 | hi ZogG_laptop | 05:12 |
| ShadowJK | Anyway, re W7, it's pretty amazing how my netbook with atom processor is more than enough in performance to run W7, but it's paired with such a shit screen that it makes me rage looking at it, and a touchpad that is not only small, but has no tactile feedback of where it starts and where it ends, and of course, no touch layer on the screen. | 05:13 |
| FIQ|n900 | w7 with atom...? | 05:13 |
| ShadowJK | If you want proper screen, proper pointing device (touchpad/touchlayer), all that's left are i5/i7 monsters that cost ludicrous amounts of money | 05:14 |
| ShadowJK | FIQ|n900, sure | 05:14 |
| DocAvalanche | ShadowJK: epic fail in design, I'd say | 05:14 |
| FIQ|n900 | argh wasps.. | 05:15 |
| DocAvalanche | ShadowJK: get a PanaTB CF-29 ;-D - comes even with kinda working touchscreen | 05:15 |
| ShadowJK | So if there had been a netbook available, with an IPS or better screen, a touchscreen and touchpad (for when you have to mess with precise crap) (as touchpad wouldn't be primary pointing device, I'd accept lack of tactile borders here), and same cpu/ram specs as existing notebooks, I'd been sold | 05:15 |
| ShadowJK | and ordered that instead of an android | 05:16 |
| DocAvalanche | or get the CF-19 | 05:16 |
| ShadowJK | What's a CF-19? | 05:16 |
| DocAvalanche | convertable, though a tad smaller | 05:16 |
| DocAvalanche | than the CF-29 | 05:16 |
| DocAvalanche | exactly size of a proper netbook | 05:17 |
| ShadowJK | What are those | 05:17 |
| DocAvalanche | panasomic toughbook | 05:17 |
| ShadowJK | lol | 05:17 |
| FIQ|n900 | \topic #maemo | 05:18 |
| FIQ|n900 | uhh | 05:18 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah so my netbook cost me 300 for 10 hours battery life, dual core atom, 2 g ram, 10" SHIT screen | 05:18 |
| ShadowJK | tablet is 600 for quad+1 core cpu, 1 g ram, decent screen | 05:18 |
| ShadowJK | and android handicap | 05:18 |
| ShadowJK | panasonic toughbook is like 3k+? | 05:19 |
| DocAvalanche | 300 | 05:19 |
| DocAvalanche | used | 05:19 |
| DocAvalanche | good condition | 05:19 |
| ShadowJK | I might as well spend that on ebay N950 ;-) | 05:19 |
| DocAvalanche | well, if you can find a N950 for 300 | 05:19 |
| DocAvalanche | still the pana TB has a *hw* kbd | 05:20 |
| DocAvalanche | http://compare.ebay.de/like/320924902974?var=lv<yp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar | 05:21 |
| ShadowJK | It's somewhat messed up that I prefer N900 for most surfing compared to netbook | 05:21 |
| ShadowJK | Because hte touchpad is such a crippling factor | 05:21 |
| DocAvalanche | TB come with touch*screen* | 05:22 |
| ShadowJK | Probably if the netbook had same shit screen but with a touch layer, it'd be much more usable | 05:22 |
| DocAvalanche | the touchpad is actually tiny crap | 05:22 |
| ShadowJK | or if it came with a not-shit touchpad | 05:22 |
| ShadowJK | Biggest issue is that it's seamlessly integrated into the case | 05:23 |
| ShadowJK | So you don't know where it begins and where it ends | 05:23 |
| DocAvalanche | :-S | 05:23 |
| * ShadowJK has been cursin and swearing while tapping harder and harder, only to realize he was tapping outside the touch area | 05:24 | |
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| FIQ|n900 | wut | 05:24 |
| DocAvalanche | apply stickytape? | 05:24 |
| FIQ|n900 | what idiot came up with that design solution? | 05:24 |
| ShadowJK | I dunno, but I bet his/her title had "designer" in it | 05:30 |
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| ShadowJK | tape idea is nice, I'll try that | 05:30 |
| DocAvalanche | http://adiz0r.soup.io/post/193593866/Developers-designers-project-managers-QA-and-sysadmins | 05:31 |
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| DocAvalanche | the rightmost col is the best ;-D | 05:32 |
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| sidusnare | anyone have sugested reading for bootstraping maemo on other devices? I have some WinCE devices I would like to refalsh, preferable not have to chain load | 06:46 |
| jacekowski | easy, if you can get the drivers | 07:09 |
| sidusnare | I can roll a kernel, its looks like common enough hardware, its the bootstraper I need really, and how to get it in there, I have a bus pirate, logic analyser, and a hand hull of teensys, so I should be able to do something | 07:11 |
| jonwil | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_dbus | 07:11 |
| sidusnare | its a PXA255 in a symbol hand scanner | 07:11 |
| jacekowski | sidusnare: it depends on device | 07:12 |
| sidusnare | Symbol MC9000w | 07:13 |
| Hurrian | sidusnare, start with a debian bringup | 07:19 |
| sidusnare | "debian bringup" ? | 07:19 |
| Hurrian | kernel + debian rootfs | 07:20 |
| Hurrian | fremantle-hildon-desktop and company are buildable from the gitorious | 07:20 |
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| ensoe | Hello. I'm in a big dilemma. My n900 no longer wants to boot up. When I hook up the USB cable, it just seems to boot up and boot up in a loop. At this point I don't even mind to flash, but as long as I can save my data/contacts/sms/etc... anyone can point me to the right direction? | 08:49 |
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| jonwil | Try this | 10:04 |
| jonwil | Remove the battery | 10:04 |
| jonwil | Plug the USB cable in | 10:04 |
| jonwil | open the slide of the phone | 10:04 |
| jonwil | Insert the battery and hold down the U key at the same time | 10:04 |
| jonwil | see what happens with the USB enumeration | 10:04 |
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| jonwil | hi | 11:53 |
| jonwil | Pali: ping | 11:53 |
| kerio | 'lo | 11:53 |
| Pali | jonwil, pong | 11:53 |
| jonwil | I saw your email | 11:53 |
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| jonwil | I haven't identified where most of those interfaces come from yet | 11:54 |
| Pali | ok | 11:55 |
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| user___ | freemangordon: ping | 11:58 |
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| freemangordon | pong | 11:59 |
| freemangordon | vi_: ^^^ | 11:59 |
| vi_ | good morning squire. | 11:59 |
| freemangordon | good morning | 11:59 |
| vi_ | you wanted some stats wrt memory useage of thumb vs non-thumb. | 11:59 |
| freemangordon | yep | 11:59 |
| freemangordon | (if such possible) | 12:00 |
| vi_ | can you suggest exactly what it is you want? | 12:00 |
| vi_ | for example, | 12:00 |
| vi_ | a person can: pmap <browserd pid> | 12:00 |
| vi_ | is that the kind of thing you want? | 12:01 |
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| freemangordon | TBH not sure, that is why I am not doing it by myself | 12:02 |
| freemangordon | but pmap might do dthe job | 12:02 |
| freemangordon | on the other hand RSS should do the job too. And I have NFC what is better | 12:03 |
| freemangordon | vi_: ^^^ | 12:04 |
| vi_ | http://cxg.de/_c161dc.htm | 12:04 |
| vi_ | have a look at that. | 12:04 |
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| freemangordon | vi_: hmm, scratch that | 12:07 |
| freemangordon | this is too complicated to be used | 12:07 |
| freemangordon | in genereal, what is good to be seens is the difference in RAM usage of the whole system | 12:07 |
| freemangordon | as 2-3 MB less usage from browserd means nothing (general speaking) | 12:08 |
| freemangordon | or even 4-5 | 12:08 |
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| kerio | i thought that one of the big things was the less time that takes to bring less data in and out of swap | 12:10 |
| freemangordon | vi__: maybe get free RAM and swap usage after reboot, when device has settled down (for 10 mins lets say), open TMO and measure RAM/swap usage | 12:10 |
| freemangordon | do the same with thumb-compiled system | 12:11 |
| freemangordon | kerio: yes, but how much | 12:11 |
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| vi_ | ...back | 12:11 |
| vi_ | ...back | 12:11 |
| vi_ | ...stupid wifi. | 12:11 |
| freemangordon | vi_: check the backscroll | 12:11 |
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| vi_ | I cannot, I was disconnected. unless there is somthing I do not know about irc? | 12:12 |
| freemangordon | ok, i'll paste it for you | 12:12 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> vi_: hmm, scratch that | 12:12 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> this is too complicated to be used | 12:12 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> in genereal, what is good to be seens is the difference in RAM usage of the whole system | 12:12 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> vi__: maybe get free RAM and swap usage after reboot, when device has settled down (for 10 mins lets say), open TMO and measure RAM/swap usage | 12:13 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> do the same with thumb-compiled system | 12:13 |
| freemangordon | vi_: ok now? | 12:13 |
| vi_ | yeah. | 12:13 |
| freemangordon | that one too: | 12:14 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> as 2-3 MB less usage from browserd means nothing (general speaking) | 12:14 |
| freemangordon | <freemangordon> or even 4-5 | 12:14 |
| freemangordon | vi_: here? | 12:16 |
| vi_ | ok. As far as I can tell you have uploaded an update to the the thumb repo (version 12?). I will hold off updating (I ams till V11) till I can do as you have suggested above and put the results on the TMO thread. | 12:17 |
| freemangordon | vi_: the comparison should be between thumified and non-thumbified system | 12:18 |
| vi_ | I will try and get someone running non thumbmto do the same. | 12:18 |
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| freemangordon | you can boldly upgrade to v12 as it free about 1200KiB | 12:18 |
| freemangordon | *frees | 12:18 |
| vi_ | w00t! | 12:18 |
| freemangordon | yeap, using newer toolchain saves even more space | 12:19 |
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| vi_ | freemangordon: I have a lot of stuff not starting on boot. modest, addressbook, web etc. | 12:19 |
| freemangordon | vi_: again, the test should be made on a freshly flashed device | 12:20 |
| vi_ | that helps save some ram. | 12:20 |
| freemangordon | install cssu-testing, measure RAM/swap | 12:20 |
| freemangordon | install -thumb | 12:20 |
| freemangordon | measure RAM/swap | 12:20 |
| freemangordon | comapre the abovce values ;) | 12:21 |
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| vi_ | freemangordon: well we can put the call out for someone on TMO who has a spare device to flash + record results. | 12:21 |
| freemangordon | yep | 12:21 |
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| freemangordon | or even better: flash, restore your applications, install cssu-testing, measure | 12:21 |
| freemangordon | install -thumb, measure | 12:21 |
| freemangordon | you got the idea | 12:22 |
| vi_ | hell, I will put a bounty on it. 1 pizza. | 12:22 |
| freemangordon | :D | 12:22 |
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| freemangordon | vi_: right now i have some family duties, so won't be able to do anything before late afternoon | 12:23 |
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| LaoLang_cool | Hi, how to share pc networking via usb? | 12:39 |
| LaoLang_cool | Is is possible? | 12:39 |
| LaoLang_cool | s/is/it/ | 12:40 |
| infobot | LaoLang_cool meant: Is it possible? | 12:40 |
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| jonwil | Pali: You said before that replacing wl1251-cal and bluetooth-cal would allow the replacement of various non-standard kernel interfaces with standard ones, is that correct? | 12:46 |
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| jonwil | damn, pali must have left :( | 13:24 |
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| Pali | ping DocScrutinizer | 15:56 |
| kerio | ohai Pali | 15:57 |
| kerio | Pali: usbmode gui feature request: manual speed choice and manual enumeration | 15:59 |
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| ensoe | Hello. My phone almost died on me. I managed to flash it and I tried to only flash the kernel. Is there any way to retrieve the data back after it's actually already gone? | 16:02 |
| kerio | ensoe: you what to do what? | 16:03 |
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| ensoe | I was on the phone for hours, i had it charged via the usb cord. I guess the phone didn't like that (I need to add that it's an overclocked, only at 800 but still oced). Suddenly the phone ran out of battery - I had just shortly plugged in the usb cable to recharge it when it notified me that the battery was running out | 16:04 |
| ensoe | result: phone turned itself off. When it turned it back on, it would keep looping and looping by itself - then i tried to use boot menu to restore an image i just backed up recently - well, battery died right in between...now i was stuck with a phone that would barely turn on - I had trouble flashing but wanted to flash only the kernel. i'm currently presented with a newly flashed n900 i suppose - I'm trying to get my files back that w | 16:05 |
| kerio | why didn't you wait for a full charge, dammit | 16:06 |
| ensoe | panic - pure panic | 16:06 |
| kerio | what did you flash? | 16:06 |
| ensoe | i didn't know either | 16:06 |
| kerio | also doesn't that mean that you have backups? | 16:06 |
| ensoe | i did the combined first, it rebooted and gave me the whole region setup welcome screen but said MISSING IMAGE everywhere ...I read and searched on google | 16:06 |
| kerio | you half restored a backup | 16:07 |
| ensoe | turned out I needed to do eMMC first, then not boot, and flash the combined afterwards. I went ahead and did that..but well, now I lost all my files. | 16:07 |
| kerio | ...you flashed eMMC | 16:07 |
| kerio | you restored the n900 to factory conditions | 16:07 |
| ensoe | I'm afraid i did that | 16:07 |
| kerio | you may try to undelete stuff in MyDocs, but apart from that, your files are hosed | 16:07 |
| ensoe | how do I undelete? | 16:07 |
| RiD | i always flash it the fastest way....but now i forgot | 16:07 |
| Pali | ~rescueos | 16:08 |
| kerio | Pali: too little too late | 16:08 |
| RiD | is it emmc first or root? | 16:08 |
| kerio | he flashed everything | 16:08 |
| Pali | ~rescue-os | 16:08 |
| infobot | methinks rescue-os is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Nin101/N900_Rescue_OS, or http://nin101.uni.cx/N900/rescueOS/documentation.txt, or http://206.253.166.96/N900/rescueOS/ | 16:08 |
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| ensoe | I did PR 1.3 first, | 16:08 |
| kerio | RiD: both at the same time, order doesn't matter - it's safer if you flash root first, because flashing emmc first and then booting is Bad | 16:08 |
| ensoe | then it booted up with MISSING IMAGE | 16:08 |
| kerio | but if you flash root first you have to powercycle because you just flashed NOLO | 16:08 |
| ensoe | so I read and did eMMC first (kernel only) and then I did COMBINED again | 16:08 |
| kerio | flashing emmc and then, without rebooting, flashing root is the fastest | 16:09 |
| ensoe | yes Nolo was flashed it told me | 16:09 |
| kerio | ensoe: wasn't talking to you | 16:09 |
| ensoe | k | 16:09 |
| kerio | ensoe: try any vfat undeleting utility | 16:09 |
| ensoe | so what's this rescue-os? | 16:09 |
| kerio | is the n900 on right now? | 16:09 |
| ensoe | kerio: yes it's on right now | 16:09 |
| ensoe | i'm using testdisk to go in and see | 16:09 |
| qwazix | how much time does it take for garage to update ssh keys? It keeps rejecting me... | 16:10 |
| ensoe | but it's not showing much except for the factory default directories/files | 16:10 |
| kerio | yeah but you're supposed to stay the fuck away from any disk you want to undelete files from | 16:10 |
| kerio | using one... is bad | 16:10 |
| ensoe | kerio: i could kill myself right now. what are my options from here? | 16:11 |
| ensoe | this rescue-os ..is that something i can look into? | 16:11 |
| kerio | there's no "magic", you just have to hope you haven't overwritten a lot of your files | 16:11 |
| kerio | the stuff on your rootfs is as good as dead | 16:11 |
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| kerio | the stuff on the eMMC optfs is probably dead too, the stuff on the eMMC vfat (MyDocs) could be saved in a tiny part | 16:12 |
| kerio | plug in to a computer in mass storage mode, make sure you don't mount it, or mount it read-only | 16:12 |
| kerio | undelete from there | 16:12 |
| ensoe | kerio: i'll try..how do i undelete though? | 16:13 |
| kerio | testdisk's photorec maybe | 16:13 |
| kerio | "Important: As soon as a pic or file is accidentally deleted, or you discover any missing, do NOT save any more pics or files to that memory device or hard disk drive; otherwise you may overwrite your lost data." | 16:14 |
| kerio | what do you want to recover? | 16:14 |
| kerio | also, didn't you say you have a backupmenu backup? | 16:14 |
| RiD | his pr9n collection | 16:15 |
| jacekowski | undelete on fat is pretty easy | 16:15 |
| jacekowski | files are not deleted on fat as such | 16:15 |
| ensoe | photos,videos, contacts, conversations for the most part, all the other crap i can get back again ..mainly stuff that can never be retrieved again unless i have the file | 16:15 |
| jacekowski | just marked as deleted | 16:15 |
| ensoe | kerio: i saved it all to eMMC | 16:15 |
| kerio | jacekowski: that's true for Almost Every fs | 16:15 |
| RiD | conversations? that's not on emmc... :/ | 16:15 |
| ensoe | i knew i should have done that to sdcard | 16:15 |
| kerio | and yeah, conversations is gone | 16:15 |
| RiD | unless you have a backup? | 16:15 |
| kerio | RiD: he had one... on the emmc | 16:15 |
| jacekowski | conversations are on emmc | 16:16 |
| jacekowski | just not on mydocs | 16:16 |
| kerio | jacekowski: in mydocs? | 16:16 |
| kerio | oh | 16:16 |
| kerio | heh | 16:16 |
| ensoe | so use photorec correct? | 16:16 |
| kerio | ext...3? undelete is kinda harder | 16:16 |
| kerio | ensoe: hell, you should probably make an image of the mydocs partition | 16:16 |
| RiD | oh, if the backup can still be recovered then your conversations are there | 16:16 |
| RiD | unless if you didn't select to back that up | 16:16 |
| kerio | i still don't get what people mean by "backup" | 16:16 |
| kerio | the backup application? | 16:17 |
| kerio | :s | 16:17 |
| RiD | yes | 16:17 |
| ensoe | kerio: well i went through the backup menu options - did both rootfs and the other part (as recommended) | 16:17 |
| kerio | oh you used backupmenu | 16:17 |
| kerio | (say that, otherwise people could be confused with the internal "Backup" application) | 16:17 |
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| kerio | ensoe: *right now* connect in mass storage and use dd to make a full image of MyDocs | 16:18 |
| kerio | if you manage to recover your backupmenu backup then you're saved | 16:18 |
| ensoe | so don't mount it and just dd full partition over | 16:19 |
| kerio | yep | 16:19 |
| kerio | the more you use the partition, the less chances you have of recovering your files | 16:19 |
| kerio | i wonder... are backupmenu backups tagged in some way? | 16:19 |
| ensoe | i havne't done anything yet, mainly just set region, i'm at the main screen after it's done setting the basic things on my n900 | 16:19 |
| ensoe | what's a good dd command (with parameters etc) | 16:20 |
| kerio | i assume you have a unixy OS on the host | 16:21 |
| ensoe | kerio: yep, i've got it now. it's working on the dd | 16:21 |
| qwazix | something special I have to do to upload via scp to extras? I've got upload rights, updated garage profile with my public keys but I keep getting rejected | 16:21 |
| kerio | dd if=/dev/yourpartitiondevice of=mydumbimage.img bs=1m | 16:21 |
| ensoe | kerio: if I get to get my files back, I'mma buy you a 24 pack of beer today! | 16:21 |
| kerio | the default block size sucks | 16:21 |
| kerio | ensoe: if you get your files back, make a donation to robbiethe1st | 16:22 |
| kerio | (for backupmenu) | 16:22 |
| kerio | i don't even drink | 16:22 |
| RiD | wait | 16:22 |
| RiD | ops, wrong channel | 16:22 |
| kerio | haha | 16:22 |
| ensoe | i definitely will do. so should i cancel with default block size now and go with the 1m? | 16:22 |
| kerio | yeah | 16:22 |
| ensoe | or just let it do it's thing? | 16:22 |
| kerio | nah, the default block size is ridiculous | 16:22 |
| kerio | 512 bytes | 16:22 |
| kerio | you'll never get to the end, really | 16:23 |
| kerio | (you can SIGINFO or SIGUSR1 your dd process to make it output stats to stderr, check your man page for details) | 16:23 |
| qwazix | nvm, I got it. Deleted the space between key type and key and added it again... Probably it was another type of html char or something | 16:24 |
| ensoe | i guess dd=if of= bs=1024 should work eh? | 16:24 |
| ensoe | it takes it as bytes i think?..so i should really do 1024*1024 ? | 16:24 |
| kerio | ensoe: 1m should work, or 1M | 16:25 |
| ensoe | nvm, 1M | 16:25 |
| ensoe | yeah 1k, 1M, etc.. | 16:25 |
| ensoe | now i just tried photorec, but it's not giving me much yet..so i'll try with the iso from dd | 16:26 |
| ensoe | when it's done | 16:26 |
| ensoe | i wish i had just waited with the whole flashing, was doing it late night too, but asked and I suppose everyone was sleeping..damnit | 16:27 |
| kerio | ensoe: backups are only as good as their storage and their restore procedure | 16:27 |
| ensoe | kerio: yeah, i realize that. it just never occurred to me in a million years that everything that can go bad, goes bad in one night | 16:28 |
| ensoe | on the phone for 3+ hours, battery running out, phone already hot, I plug in usb cable to recharge, phone still dies, loop mode, i panic, flash wrong..and voila | 16:28 |
| kerio | hehe | 16:28 |
| kerio | the only minor fuckup i had was restoring a BM backup with the wrong kernel | 16:29 |
| ensoe | yeah, at this point i don't even care about the conversations, as long as i can get my hands on that last backup - from like 3-4 days ago really | 16:29 |
| kerio | ensoe: don't expect to actually recover it | 16:30 |
| kerio | the chances are slim | 16:30 |
| ensoe | kerio: can you give me run down as to what to do next once i've got the dd iso ? | 16:30 |
| ensoe | loop mount it, use photorec on it and see if it can find anything i assume? | 16:31 |
| kerio | i don't know if photorec needs a mounted system | 16:31 |
| kerio | anyway, that's the idea | 16:31 |
| ensoe | ok | 16:31 |
| ensoe | should i backup the iso someplace else in case it gets "modified" in any way? | 16:31 |
| kerio | sure, why not | 16:31 |
| ensoe | k | 16:31 |
| ensoe | well i'll be here, just going to be running some chores outside - i'll keep you updated or most likely ask for more advise the way i see it | 16:33 |
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| kerio | hrmpf why does fapman feel the need to keep his own dpkg database | 16:46 |
| kerio | meh, DocScrutinizer was right all along | 16:48 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer51: I WILL NEVER DOUBT YOU DOCKY | 16:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: pong | 17:49 |
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| kerio | ensoe: ping | 17:52 |
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| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, which jack is used on n900 left or right? https://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/840/dscn1895customthumb.jpg/ | 17:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | right | 18:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | left is brainfucked apple patent | 18:01 |
| Pali | ok, thanks. n950 is also right? | 18:01 |
| kerio | hm, somebody here mentioned a french server hosting, some days ago | 18:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | should | 18:02 |
| kerio | with insane specs | 18:02 |
| user___ | what is right?? | 18:04 |
| user___ | what has insane specs?? | 18:04 |
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| kerio | lots of ram, lots of disk space, 18€/month | 18:06 |
| Lava_Croft | DocScrutinizer05: apple headphones are wtf | 18:06 |
| RiD | lol | 18:07 |
| RiD | i had one of these (didn't buy) | 18:07 |
| RiD | cheapest thing you could find. It didn't even had the bass right - it would distort always a bit. this on an apple ipod | 18:08 |
| RiD | And it lacked mids as hell. Not sure if they're still like that | 18:08 |
| RiD | it was just some treble. As bad as those cheap laptop speakers | 18:08 |
| Estel_ | freemangordon, but whole system RAM usage is kinda useless, unless it's N900 just reflashed and with thumb things installed | 18:10 |
| Estel_ | for example, every person will have different widgets installed, so overall system usage will wary easily ~20 MB | 18:10 |
| Estel_ | jsut because stupid or less stupid widgets | 18:10 |
| Estel_ | it kinda defeat purpose of "system" test | 18:10 |
| Estel_ | BTW, why can't we just get list of thumb2-compiled packages from thumb repo, and purpose their footprint in memory when working, one by one? | 18:11 |
| vi_ | Estel_: you can. | 18:11 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, charge21.sh assumes 132 mOhm resistance between charger and battery. where this number come from? Pure guessworking, or someone tested it? | 18:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | guesswork | 18:12 |
| Estel_ | Am I wrong, that thing like connection quality between springs in battery and socket in N900 can affect this by orders of magnitude? | 18:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | right | 18:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 18:12 |
| Estel_ | erm, so when it becomes 232 mOhm, for example, due to worse springs, our measurement are off by 50%? 0_o? | 18:13 |
| Estel_ | (~) | 18:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's why I never thought this is a useful fancy to calculate things this way | 18:13 |
| Estel_ | any other way to do it? | 18:13 |
| Estel_ | vi_, sure, but freemangordon requested whole system usage | 18:14 |
| teotwaki | smoking an electronic cigarette | 18:14 |
| teotwaki | interesting stuff | 18:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | take raw values from bq27200.sh and the rest is just left to user guessing | 18:14 |
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| Estel_ | teotwaki, sure, but it damages itself 70% chance in 3 months | 18:14 |
| jonwil | hmmm, tommorow I might finally be able to work on some N900 coding :) | 18:14 |
| jonwil | specifically wl1251-cal and bluetooth-cal | 18:14 |
| vi_ | teotwaki: gets you held up at gunpoint by the olympic terror squad. | 18:14 |
| Estel_ | at least ones with under-pressure ON switch (when you pull air, it's activate) | 18:14 |
| teotwaki | Estel_: not an issue, even if I have to buy a new set every 2 months, it's a lot cheaper than regular fags | 18:15 |
| teotwaki | vi_: how so? | 18:15 |
| vi_ | jonwil: w00t | 18:15 |
| vi_ | teotwaki: did you not see the news story some weeks ago? | 18:15 |
| Estel_ | teotwaki, sure. And it's definitelly friendly for non-smoking surrounding | 18:15 |
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| jonwil | although that depends on whether I use "working on n900 stuff" as an excuse to procrastinate regarding cleaning up all the mess in my apartment :) | 18:15 |
| vi_ | a man in the UK was using one on a bus. | 18:15 |
| teotwaki | and hopefully safer, health-wise. | 18:16 |
| teotwaki | vi_: nope | 18:16 |
| Estel_ | vi_, haha, remember that | 18:16 |
| vi_ | some people became suspicious. | 18:16 |
| teotwaki | suspicious of what? | 18:16 |
| Estel_ | Well, antiterrorist banged at him, bus eas stopped, 25 kilometer line of cars started | 18:16 |
| Estel_ | s/started/appeared/ | 18:16 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: Well, antiterrorist banged at him, bus eas stopped, 25 kilometer line of cars appeared | 18:16 |
| Estel_ | chemical terrorism squad arrived | 18:16 |
| vi_ | next thing you know they are being held at gunpoint by the bombsquad for 6 hours at the side of the road. | 18:16 |
| teotwaki | wtf | 18:16 |
| teotwaki | haha | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | teotwaki, suspicious that he is mixing components of chemical weapon | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | due to "smoke" (water) | 18:17 |
| teotwaki | "HE'S GOT SMOKE COMING OUT OF HIS MOUTH AFTER PUTTING IT IN HIS MOUTH" | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | not exactly, they were afraid | 18:17 |
| vi_ | teotwaki: BOOOOOOMB!!!! | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | probably, he refilled it with nicotine liquid | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | so paranoid started that he is mixing chemical weapon | 18:17 |
| teotwaki | oh lol | 18:17 |
| Lava_Croft | where there is smoke, there is fire | 18:17 |
| Estel_ | then he started to use it and "smoke" appeared... | 18:17 |
| Lava_Croft | fire is used by terrorists | 18:17 |
| Lava_Croft | case closed | 18:17 |
| kerio | don't they, like, LOOK like cigarettes too? | 18:18 |
| Estel_ | kerio, sure | 18:18 |
| Estel_ | but terorist can disguise bombs as cigarretes! | 18:18 |
| vi_ | kerio: nice try, terrorist. | 18:18 |
| Lava_Croft | they were a hype over here for about 2 months | 18:18 |
| Estel_ | or as milk for infants | 18:18 |
| Lava_Croft | but electric cigs are like non-alcoholic beer | 18:18 |
| Lava_Croft | in the end, you just aint going to do it | 18:18 |
| vi_ | Lava_Croft: not really. | 18:19 |
| Estel_ | I must say UK is an idiot when it comes to security - remember, when parents were supposed to drink a little from bootle of milk for infants, before boarding plane? | 18:19 |
| Estel_ | sure, suicude terrorist wouldn't take a small bit of chemical liquid, to prove that it's milk | 18:19 |
| Estel_ | they care about their health, after all | 18:19 |
| teotwaki | Lava_Croft: well, 3 guys at my office have been smoking exclusively that for over 5 months | 18:19 |
| teotwaki | Lava_Croft: I started tuesday | 18:19 |
| vi_ | Estel_: but what if it is like you know...boob milk? | 18:19 |
| Estel_ | vi_, well, that's why no security drinked it | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: most nitro-explosives are extremely toxic | 18:20 |
| teotwaki | they'd have you puking in seconds | 18:20 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, sure, but to bring plane down, you don't need nitro | 18:20 |
| Estel_ | in fact, simple depressurization via a small hole is enough, on high attitudes | 18:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dunno about APEX | 18:21 |
| teotwaki | it's not, actually. | 18:21 |
| vi_ | e-cigs relieve nicotine withdrawals just like cigs. | 18:21 |
| Estel_ | teotwaki, 10x10 cm hole in hull, where it can't be auto-closed, on 10 000m is enough to rip it in 20 seconds | 18:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but apex would explode when you swallow it X-P | 18:21 |
| teotwaki | Estel_: rip what, exactly? | 18:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | due to friction | 18:22 |
| Estel_ | teotwaki, due to pressure difference, 10x10 cm hole will rip itself to much bigger in 5 seconds, You know the rest | 18:22 |
| teotwaki | it wouldn't | 18:22 |
| Estel_ | In passenger plane? It would. | 18:22 |
| vi_ | teotwaki: e-cigs are expensive. A cheaper more readily available form of nicotine is purchaseable in the form of cigarettes | 18:22 |
| teotwaki | you're not travelling at -2000m | 18:22 |
| teotwaki | vi_: e-cigs are cheaper than cigs | 18:23 |
| Estel_ | teotwaki, sure, intercontinentals are travelling at 10 000 m ;) | 18:23 |
| teotwaki | vi_: e-cigs will cost me 1600 euros less a year than normal cigs | 18:23 |
| jonwil | Aloha Airlines Flight 243 would serve as a counter to the argument that a small hole in an airplane is automatically fatal | 18:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: ++ | 18:24 |
| Estel_ | jonwil, sure, it depends on attitude | 18:24 |
| teotwaki | Estel_: 10km? Seriously? | 18:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | teotwaki: more like 11km | 18:24 |
| teotwaki | well, 12 even | 18:25 |
| teotwaki | I'm just saying, pressurization of the cabin is only done for human comfort | 18:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep | 18:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and several experiments shown that a small bomb is not instantly teearing apart a plane | 18:26 |
| teotwaki | What movie is it, alien? Where the alien gets sucked through a tiny little hole in a piece of glass? | 18:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | to "bring down a airplane" it's sufficient to go "*cough*allah*coughcough*bomb*cough*" | 18:27 |
| teotwaki | So the alien got ripped to shreds thanks to 1 atmosphere worth of pressure... | 18:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | alien-4? | 18:28 |
| teotwaki | God forbid it ever came to earth. | 18:28 |
| RiD | extraterrestial beings | 18:28 |
| RiD | ay-lee-en | 18:28 |
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| teotwaki | next we're going to hear about people's heads popping when they get in a 0 gravity environment | 18:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | LOL | 18:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I don't need any special environment for that - feels like mine going 'plopp' in a second | 18:29 |
| teotwaki | that's because you forgot to go to the loo earlier | 18:30 |
| RiD | you know what also does 'plopp'? | 18:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | probably because I thought it's a good idea to close windows in the morning, when it been 25°C outside and inside. when I woke up 1h ago, it still had 25° outside but 29° inside :-o | 18:31 |
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| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, is there some detailed n900 hw spec (I found only L1L2, L3L3 & pdf hw spec) | 18:32 |
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| Pali | something more detailed | 18:33 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 ponders about AirCon and about servo motors to open/close windows | 18:33 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: spec like what? | 18:33 |
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| Pali | full spec of all chips... | 18:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | component names? | 18:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wiki/hw | 18:34 |
| Pali | ok on maemo wiki Category:N900_Hardware is some info | 18:35 |
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| Pali | I tried to find some more info about twl madc which is on n900 | 18:36 |
| Pali | what is where connected | 18:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Nokia_N900_Mobile_Phone-whatsinside_text-90.aspx | 18:37 |
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| Pali | DocScrutinizer, only adcin0, adcin2 and adcin4 is written in Nokia_N900_RX-51_Schematics.pdf | 18:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: that kind of info you get from schematics | 18:37 |
| Pali | in Schematics is more adcin* missing | 18:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: not all ADCINn are used, and several are internally connected | 18:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: what's *really* missing in schematics are details about JTAG | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | UART3 etc | 18:39 |
| Pali | yes, it really missing | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | all the testpads under battery | 18:39 |
| RST38h | EHLO DOC | 18:39 |
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| Pali | it was not released or nokia do not have it? | 18:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | -EHEADACHE | 18:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: my understanding is: the 'leaked' schematics are "for educational purpose". Nokia edited them to remove some stuff they didn't think was relevant to 'educate' | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> Pali, ping | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> Pali, could I request some small thing for KP charging modules? my early (few weeks) testes show, that charging bigger batteries with 1250 charging current works well. Could it be possible, to have charging current adjustable, even if by some geeky sysfs entry? | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> (like with disabling red led for camera) | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | oh damn | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | connection dropped | 18:41 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> DocScrutinizer, any idea, why when executing charge.sh one need to ctrl^c it and do it again... | 18:42 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> due to "charging error"? | 18:42 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> coming from Maemo? | 18:42 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> I used to *not* being affected by this, but since few weeks, I always must do it twice, or it doesn't charge. Afterwards, it works great | 18:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: Pali: you should re-read my bq24150 API specs | 18:42 |
| Pali | Estel_, already implemented via /sys/class/power_supply/bq2415**/<entry> | 18:43 |
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| Estel_ | <teotwaki> Estel_: 10km? Seriously? | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> teotwaki, at least when I've last travelled intercont. | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> we joked that we're almsot astronauts | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> almost* | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> (only 90km left to be real astronauts :P ) | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> but, anyway, this thing with nitro and puking makes it a little more justified (drinking milk) | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> I still insist, that there is 343543534 combinations of explosive liquid, that doesn't necessary required spazms when drinked, at least not instantly... | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> but whatever, security uber allez | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> I'm absolutely sure, that denial of bringing liquids on board have, hoever, served onboards "bar" very well | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | <Estel_> 200 ml bootle of mineral water for 5 pounds is something | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | Pali, oh, sorry and thanks :) | 18:44 |
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| Estel_ | is it documented somewhere? | 18:44 |
| Pali | Estel_, charging led can be disabled too | 18:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: stop spamming! | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, just pasted what was dropped out due to connection drop :) | 18:44 |
| Estel_ | would it be better if I re-write it line by line, eh? | 18:45 |
| FIQ|n900 | Estel_: oh god | 18:45 |
| Estel_ | Pali, nice. I would liek to read mroe about it (i.e what and where is configurable, what values are correct and correspond to what results), thus question about documentation | 18:45 |
| FIQ|n900 | ever heard of pastebins? | 18:45 |
| Estel_ | FIQ, without connection drop, IKRC would anyway present is as line by line... | 18:46 |
| Estel_ | whatever | 18:46 |
| FIQ|n900 | it's frowned upon in IRC to paste more than 3 lines a row | 18:46 |
| Estel_ | IRC* | 18:46 |
| Estel_ | sure | 18:46 |
| Pali | Estel_, no documentation yet (some old has DocScrutinizer05), but you can see current sysfs entires in source code: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/ggit/browse.php/?p=kernel-power;a=blob;f=kernel-power-2.6.28/debian/patches/bq2415x_charger.patch;hb=HEAD#l1319 | 18:46 |
| Estel_ | that's why we're doing it all the time, but I'm not going to argue :) | 18:46 |
| Estel_ | Pali, thanks a lot | 18:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: original idea can be found in http://maemo.cloud-7.de/bq24150-sysnode.spec.txt | 18:49 |
| * Estel_ say thanks | 18:50 | |
| Estel_ | says* | 18:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I dunno how closely Pali followed on it | 18:50 |
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| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I can't seem to find any mention of this 132 mOhm resistance between charger and battery in bq27200.sh, may it be why charge21.sh result (Rate) is ~100 mA off from what bq27200.sh reports? | 19:01 |
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| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, left is used also on Lumia... https://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/840/dscn1895customthumb.jpg/ | 19:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | strongest evidence how much Flop assraped Nokia on all aspects | 19:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | also another reason why Apple should die | 19:20 |
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| SpeedEvil | . | 19:21 |
| SpeedEvil | Hah. | 19:22 |
| SpeedEvil | New android tablet. | 19:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, putting the most delicate sensible line (mic(!) input) on the sleeve(!)-ring of connector, a design that inevitably explodes right into your face when using decent plugs with metal housing. *I*N*S*A*N*E* | 19:22 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm currently being really annoyed by the media daemon constantly indexing and draining my battery. | 19:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | LOL, the return of killer tracker | 19:23 |
| SpeedEvil | And this time there is no tracker config file. | 19:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sounds like a lame movie sequel | 19:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (mic on sleeve) and I really feel deeply depressed for Nikolaus of Goldelico adopted that very brainfuck for GTA04 | 19:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.erodov.com/forums/help-4pin-3-5mm-seperate-mic-audio-out/21039.html (<- this is a sane design). http://www.nuforce.com/hp/products/ne700mx/index.php <- this is FSCKUP apple-must-die-for-this design, that breaks with plugs like the gold plated one in http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/489436645/3_5mm_4_pin_power_plug.html | 19:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer | http://www.omtp.org/OMTP_Local_Connectivity_Wired_Analogue_Audio_v1_0.pdf | 19:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: ^^^ | 19:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Nokia once stated that ALL their devices will follow this spec | 19:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | until Flop came and shot in their forehead | 19:40 |
| Venemo_N9 | lol | 19:41 |
| Venemo_N9 | hey | 19:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | of course "1.2 Business Rationale" as in that paper doesn't apply to Apple, rather the contrary | 19:41 |
| Venemo_N9 | anyone with an N900 around? | 19:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 19:41 |
| Venemo_N9 | I'm looking for an app tester who would test something on an N900 | 19:42 |
| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, ok | 19:42 |
| Gh0sty | Venemo_N9: what app? | 19:42 |
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| Gh0sty | and how badly will it trash the n900? :p | 19:43 |
| Venemo_N9 | Gh0sty, puzzle master 2's fremantle backport | 19:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | oooooh puzzle master | 19:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Gh0sty: you should give this one a try | 19:48 |
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| Venemo_N9 | thx DocScrutinizer05 :) | 19:50 |
| Lava_Croft | i wonder if anybody ever ported OpenGlad | 19:50 |
| Lava_Croft | http://snowstorm.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/site.cgi?page=openglad | 19:51 |
| Venemo_N9 | obviously the multitouch features don't work on the N900, but the rest works very fine on Maemo 5 | 19:51 |
| * Lava_Croft winks suggestively | 19:51 | |
| Gh0sty | puzzle master | 19:51 |
| Gh0sty | wtf? :p | 19:51 |
| Venemo_N9 | Lava_Croft, what's that? | 19:52 |
| Gh0sty | i guess he/she wants it! :p | 19:52 |
| Venemo_N9 | Gh0sty, I can give you a deb or you can compile for yourself if you prefer | 19:53 |
| Gh0sty | pff not really interested | 19:53 |
| Gh0sty | never game on it :p | 19:53 |
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| Venemo_N9 | ok | 19:54 |
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| Venemo_N9 | well then, I'm still looking for a tester | 19:54 |
| Venemo_N9 | :) | 19:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Venemo_N9: asking for users to ask for a 'sekrit' download link to give sth a test - this never has panned out | 19:54 |
| RST38h | Sooo, what is new and exciting? | 19:55 |
| Venemo_N9 | DocScrutinizer05, what do you recommend? | 19:55 |
| RST38h | Are we dead yet? | 19:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | post a URL pointing to .deb here | 19:55 |
| Venemo_N9 | ok | 19:55 |
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| Venemo_N9 | DocScrutinizer05, all right, as soon as I get home | 19:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry if I sound grumpy, got headache | 19:56 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 afk | 19:56 | |
| Gh0sty | you need a headache to sound grumpy? :p | 19:58 |
| Venemo_N9 | no problem | 19:58 |
| RiD | Gh0sty: LOL | 19:58 |
| Venemo_N9 | anyway, ttyl | 19:59 |
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| ShadowJK | Estel_; it only matters for the sys/ch estimates | 20:01 |
| Estel_ | wait, I think I still don't get something. "Charge" is always 1250 for me, static, it doesn't change in any conditijons | 20:02 |
| Estel_ | "Rate" ios thing that should be same as current in bq27200.sh, yes? | 20:02 |
| Estel_ | and "system" is estimate | 20:02 |
| Estel_ | now, i updated bq27200.sh to have 21 mOhm value for sense chip resistance, yet, "Rate" is still *much* off from what charge21.sh reports | 20:03 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 20:03 |
| Estel_ | and, mind You, bq27200.sh results seems more like real-life ones | 20:03 |
| ShadowJK | that's weird.. | 20:03 |
| Estel_ | yea | 20:03 |
| Estel_ | can't find out why it's like that | 20:04 |
| Estel_ | have you tried running it in your device? results are same? | 20:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the root of doom and epic failure: http://pinouts.ru/PortableDevices/ipod_shuffle_pinout.shtml | 20:04 |
| Estel_ | (with 950 mAh charging) | 20:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | >>When charging is needed from anything other than the stock base, ground pin 3 and apply Vcc to pins 1, 2, and 4.<< | 20:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-O EEEEK! WAAAAAH!!!! | 20:04 |
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| Estel_ | 0_o | 20:05 |
| Estel_ | epic | 20:05 |
| ShadowJK | atleast on my system bq27200.sh and charge21.sh seem to show same rate when not charging | 20:05 |
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| Estel_ | and while charging? | 20:05 |
| * Estel_ checks how it is while not charging | 20:05 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://pinoutsguide.com/Home/av_jack_pinout.shtml <-nice one | 20:08 |
| * SpeedEvil wises he could find the nexus pogo pin pinouts. | 20:12 | |
| SpeedEvil | I'm sort of tempted to open it up, pop the cans off, and see what I can measure | 20:12 |
| Estel_ | oh, god, i though only apple is so stupid | 20:12 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, when idle, it seems to be almsot the same | 20:12 |
| Estel_ | almost* | 20:12 |
| Gh0sty | stupidity is everywhere | 20:13 |
| Gh0sty | its all around us ! | 20:13 |
| Estel_ | ionteresting fact - whith charge.sh only and screen on, power usage is ~100 mA, when bq27200.sh 5 is added, it increase to ~110 mA | 20:13 |
| ShadowJK | should be indentical, though ./bq27200 5 has 5s refresh and charge21.sh defaults to 5 at startup, 5 during charge, and 15 after charge | 20:13 |
| Estel_ | yea, additional 10mA is jsutified by 3x more often refresh | 20:14 |
| Estel_ | it can be considered identical | 20:14 |
| Estel_ | while not charging | 20:14 |
| Estel_ | but when I connect charger... | 20:14 |
| Estel_ | ...nothing happens, as I need to restart charge21.sh... :P | 20:15 |
| ShadowJK | Weird | 20:16 |
| Estel_ | hm, why? It doesn't aujtodetect charger connections,a nd never did? | 20:16 |
| Estel_ | (on 3 devices I have tested it on) | 20:16 |
| Estel_ | i.e. if You charge with it, unplug cable, it goes into "standby" mode. Then, conencting charger again, doesn't result in anything, need to ctrl^c it and start again | 20:17 |
| Estel_ | hm, charging current is now capped to 712, and mysteriously, now readings of both charge21.sh and bq27200.sh are same | 20:18 |
| Estel_ | identical | 20:18 |
| Estel_ | and by identical I mean completely identical | 20:19 |
| Estel_ | it seems to freak out only in higher currents | 20:19 |
| Estel_ | considering this, "System" is also accurate now | 20:19 |
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| ShadowJK | http://pastebin.com/5FXxzAaw has some timestamps too. I plug in charger between 35 and 50s. | 20:23 |
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| Estel_ | ShadowJK, thanks. Very strange, autodetecting charger being plugged in *never* worked for me on any device | 20:29 |
| Estel_ | also, there is additional thing, that seems to affect more people to - initially, when IU stgart charge21.sh, it starts charging, then, Maemos banner "charging error" appear, and it's stop charging, actually | 20:30 |
| Estel_ | I need to ctrl^c it, start again, and then it charges OK for time being | 20:30 |
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| Estel_ | oddly enough, if I stop charging, and start it again in short timeframe, this thing doesn't re-appear | 20:31 |
| Estel_ | it appear only, when charging initially, with long time since last charging attempt | 20:31 |
| Estel_ | mind You, I plug cable first (so bme starts charging),. then start charge21.sh, may it be related? | 20:31 |
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| ShadowJK | if maemo banner comes up, it suggests you're running bme too | 20:32 |
| * Estel_ nods | 20:32 | |
| ShadowJK | bme would shut down charger chip | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | charge21.sh part that stops bme is commented out in charge21.sh by default | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | yes, but after ctrl^c and starting again, it doesn't shut it down | 20:33 |
| ShadowJK | I keep charger on | 20:33 |
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| Estel_ | may it be why auto-detection of charger plugged in doesn't work? | 20:33 |
| ShadowJK | So if running bme simultaneously with charge21, I would expect charge to not resume again | 20:33 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 20:33 |
| Estel_ | but You know what? Now I re-did Your tets with putting charger more than 30 seconds after starting charge21.sh... | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | with bme running... | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | and it *does* detect charger plugged in, and started charging | 20:34 |
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| Estel_ | it seems that it need to be run for some time | 20:34 |
| ShadowJK | until next update | 20:34 |
| ShadowJK | which is like 15s | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | lets see what happen if I unplug and plug back again | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | no | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | it's charging without problem | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | for 6 updates already | 20:35 |
| Estel_ | without disabling bme | 20:35 |
| Estel_ | wtf? :) | 20:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | running bme in parallel to charger*.sh is insane BS | 20:35 |
| Estel_ | bme shutting down chip happens only initially | 20:35 |
| ShadowJK | Having bme running at same time is silly anyway, bme will/might/could override 1250 or anything | 20:35 |
| ShadowJK | yeah what DocScrutinizer said :P | 20:35 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, sure, I don't need bme for that, but nevertheless, fact is that it worked for me for year or so ;) | 20:35 |
| Estel_ | OK | 20:36 |
| Estel_ | this may be reason why device doesn't want to charge with full current | 20:36 |
| Estel_ | so I need to get stressed again and re-test it properly with bme shut down, for another month, eh? ;) | 20:36 |
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| ShadowJK | sure :) | 20:36 |
| Estel_ | stressed as in "if Nokia put good components to accomodate charging chip, that won't desolder themselves on 1250" | 20:37 |
| ShadowJK | Also as you can see from my paste, I was at 75% charged approx, and charge rate was below 950 already | 20:37 |
| Estel_ | yea | 20:37 |
| Estel_ | same here | 20:37 |
| Estel_ | testing 1250 must wait for next charging cycle | 20:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's like pulling the horses of a carriage with a ferrari | 20:38 |
| Estel_ | why so, you've said that there is no way to screw anything with charging via software ;) | 20:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there isn't | 20:39 |
| Estel_ | but seriously, I just want to check if component there is high quality, and won't come into saturation | 20:39 |
| Estel_ | = if there is possibility for little time gain, when charging big batteries like 3000 mah with 1250 instead of 950 | 20:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nevertheless using charge.sh on a system with active BME is about silliest thing I could think of | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | (with much regret, that it doesn't allow charging with more) | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | ah, of course | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | I stopped bme ;) | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | I though You're talking about whole concept of 1250 charging | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | wioth that horses and carriage | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | with* | 20:40 |
| Estel_ | well, need to disassemble unit again, and put temperature sensor on this small black thing near charging chip again | 20:41 |
| Estel_ | how was it called? choke? | 20:41 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, any reason why to have stopping bme commented out in charge21.sh? | 20:41 |
| Estel_ | (and starting it back again on exit) | 20:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | nfc, probably because you never have started bme on a system where you want to use charge.sh | 20:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mind you, charge.sh is _alternative_ to bme | 20:43 |
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| Estel_ | sure | 20:43 |
| Estel_ | but lets be practical, until we have replacement implemented - like now and all years before - we use bme normally, and want to sue charge21.sh for charging | 20:44 |
| Estel_ | s/sue/use/ | 20:44 |
| infobot | Estel_ meant: but lets be practical, until we have replacement implemented - like now and all years before - we use bme normally, and want to use charge21.sh for charging | 20:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so rather than stopping bme in charge.sh, you _start_ charge.sh in initscripts where usually bme gets started | 20:44 |
| Estel_ | also, charge21.sh have code to stop bme, but commented out by default, I wonder why | 20:44 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; probaby a remnant from the original, where script exited at full charge and restarted bme | 20:45 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I see | 20:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wtf would you need bme for DIScharging? | 20:45 |
| ShadowJK | To restart battery meter and low batt dong | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | charge.sh is meant to run on a bme-free system | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually it got invented to allow charging of systems that got bme removed | 20:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: sure, fair enough | 20:47 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, this, + charging from PC | 20:48 |
| Estel_ | charge21.sh is going to make USB on Pc berseker at best, or blow it's fuse at worst, depending on motherboard | 20:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: you *could* augment your charger script to try and stop bme, and only start it on exit when it been running on entry | 20:48 |
| ShadowJK | well my script now never exits | 20:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I had some concept for that in booston | 20:49 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, It do, when I invoke ctrl^c ;) | 20:49 |
| ShadowJK | should probably add a warning and/or exit at start | 20:49 |
| Estel_ | it coulkd restart bme then | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dunno if I commented it out, or never finished it | 20:49 |
| ShadowJK | I have too many versions around, one version on each n900, one on enivax, one on pc, and then meegocharge version and... | 20:50 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, you know that I would love to run bme free system, and this time is going closer and closer thanks to kernel implementation... :) | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: nah! `stop bme` will throw error on bme not running, no? | 20:50 |
| Estel_ | but for now, it needs to co-exist (not njecessary at exact same time) | 20:50 |
| Estel_ | sorry for typos, writing from small keyboard | 20:51 |
| ShadowJK | I should make a "psleep" command that looks at sysnodes to catch charger (un)plug events immediately | 20:51 |
| ShadowJK | but that requires working sb or something so meh | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ok, no return code, but | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | t900:/sys/class# stop bme | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | stop: Job not changed: bme | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on STDERR | 20:52 |
| * ShadowJK has spare n900 Streaming audio over 3g, screen max brightness, and gps recorder keeping screen on.. should have empty battery for testing soon! :-) | 20:52 | |
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| Estel_ | :) | 20:52 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, see this: | 20:54 |
| Estel_ | <Pali> | 20:54 |
| Estel_ | Estel, this is same implementation of usb host mode as in hen. Only battery charging & boost is implemented in kernel and musb export speed of connected usb device to sysfs. | 20:54 |
| Estel_ | so it indeed detects speed via guessworking on turning it on and off? | 20:54 |
| Estel_ | I wonder if it could be made faster via database of PID&ID's, with corresponding speed attached | 20:55 |
| Estel_ | then it would require only one ON and, in some situations, OFF and ON again on correct speed | 20:55 |
| Estel_ | PID&VId even | 20:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | stop bme 2>&1|grep -q "Job not changed" && echo "bme not running!" && restartbme=false | 20:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: vendor/device-id only via ENUM. ENUM only after proper speed setting | 20:58 |
| Estel_ | but some devices works both in high-speed and full-speed | 20:58 |
| ShadowJK | time to fetch food | 20:59 |
| Estel_ | user could set them in database to start on high-speed only (or full-speed, if desired to) | 20:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | we don't ENUM on a device that already signalled different speed than we used | 20:59 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, as for stop bme, will it work on devices with system language changed? | 20:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 20:59 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 20:59 |
| Estel_ | :) | 21:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | to make sure you can prepend "LANG=C" | 21:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | LANG=C stop bme 2>&1|grep -q "Job not changed" && echo "bme not running!" && restartbme=false | 21:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: good point nevertheless | 21:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually you *always* should do LANG=C prior to parsing any stdout/stderr in a script | 21:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | t900:/sys/class# echo $LANG | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | de_DE | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | t900:/sys/class# start bme | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | start: Job not changed: bme | 21:05 |
| * Estel_ nods | 21:06 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | after all eventually start (aka initctl) might change to obey LANG/LOCALE setting | 21:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (of course it might also change the STDERR msg any time, since that's not a specified property of the program) | 21:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so a really decent design would do `start bme` twice, store output of second invocation to the grep pattern to use later on | 21:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | but that obviously would defeat the purpose of learning whether bme been started or not, first instance | 21:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | could be done in postinstall | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and then we'd also need a hook to initctl to rerun that charge.sh_postinstall whenever initctl gets updated or re-installed | 21:13 |
| kerio | pali's script checks for /etc/bme-disabled | 21:13 |
| kerio | it sounds easier | 21:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, iirc my script checks for environment var RESTART-BME, but either way somebody has to set it accordingly | 21:14 |
| kerio | yeah but pali's future rx51-bme-replacement package will touch that file | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | BUUUUG! | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no program should set this type of temporary 'var' in /etc | 21:15 |
| Estel_ | hmmm? | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there's /var for that | 21:15 |
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| Estel_ | well, write about it to Pali, then :) | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 21:16 |
| Estel_ | BTw I wonder if Pali's kernel charging thing acts nicely with charging from PC | 21:16 |
| Estel_ | it could be achieved easily, just cap max charging current to less than 500 mA | 21:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | btw pali's kernel charging thing is mutually exclusive to charge.sh ;-P | 21:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | like bme is | 21:17 |
| Estel_ | I know | 21:17 |
| Estel_ | Which doesn't mean You can't use charge21.sh with it :D | 21:17 |
| Estel_ | as for now, it requires modprobing | 21:17 |
| Estel_ | of course, after 100% replacing bme, no real need for doing that | 21:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes, it means exactly that: you can't use charge21.sh when that kernel bme replacement got loaded and active | 21:17 |
| Estel_ | "you cant" as in "it's silly do so, like with bme and charge21.sh" or "you can't cause it wil leat Your brain"? | 21:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it probably won't work | 21:19 |
| Estel_ | same thoughts here, as it using similar method | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and it's for sure an absolutely silly thing to do, like running charge.sh and bme concurrently | 21:19 |
| Estel_ | BTW, what IMIN stands for, in context of charging? | 21:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I(min) | 21:19 |
| Estel_ | I understood it as "charging current has been capped, as charging approach toward end" | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | minimum Current | 21:20 |
| Estel_ | yea | 21:20 |
| Estel_ | but this flag never turns to 1 in my case, despite charging working correctly | 21:20 |
| Estel_ | i.e. bq27200.sh never reports imin at 1, even if I'm 30 seconds from charging end | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's caused by system eating too much power for the threshold you've set | 21:20 |
| Estel_ | current is capped properly, just IMIN appear to be 0 | 21:21 |
| Estel_ | I've set 100 mA threeshold and my idle system eats max 10 mA | 21:21 |
| Estel_ | (100 mA, due to 2 cells) | 21:21 |
| Estel_ | (in fact 100% idle eats 3-4 mA, with gsm/wifi it's 8mA) | 21:21 |
| Estel_ | (with screen off, obviously) | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | 100mA is completely ok'ish for charge_termination_threshold, due to system usually eating more than 40mA | 21:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | with some kernels, the musb-core stays active and cpu locked to 500MHz when anything plugged to USB, which will make the system eat sth like 80mA minimum | 21:23 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, sure, with stock kernel | 21:23 |
| Estel_ | kernel-power fixed that ages ago | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | with screen on in fact your charging never has the slightest chance to terminate by hitting threshold | 21:24 |
| Estel_ | yep. | 21:24 |
| Estel_ | my mA with screen on, current draw is exactly 100 mA | 21:24 |
| Estel_ | (fluctuates between 99 and 103 mA) | 21:24 |
| Estel_ | (with GSM on) | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but for a last safety measure there's some timeout in charging that kicks in after 3 or some hours | 21:24 |
| Estel_ | sounds sane | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | read bq24150 datasheet for exact time value of that 'watchdog' | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | probably bme will kill that safety watchdog function as well | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | since bme is so retarded it thinks it knows everything better than anybody else | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but maybe I should just STFU and enjoy my migraine. Seems it throttles my wetware to an unbearably reduced performance | 21:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm starting to think I maybe just made up that whole charge termination timer thing | 21:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway the rationale of charging never terminating with screen on (plus the idea that even LEDs might age and wear out) recently made me disable "keep screen backlight on while charging" setting | 21:31 |
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| ShadowJK | Yeah I also think you made it up :P | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: (my mA with screen on, current draw is exactly 100 mA) until you switch on light in that room | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ...or close the curtains | 21:49 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, no, I just use relatively low ammount of backlight (3/5) | 21:50 |
| Estel_ | and condolences about migraine | 21:50 |
| Estel_ | it's really nasty thing to experience | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: how is that justifying a "no, ..." at beginning of your sentence? | 21:51 |
| Estel_ | I'm free from all such thing, and even "light" headache is very irritating, so... | 21:51 |
| Estel_ | <DocScrutinizer05> Estel_: (my mA with screen on, current draw is exactly 100 mA) until you switch on light in that room | 21:51 |
| Estel_ | "no" as in "no", light was on in this room | 21:51 |
| Estel_ | and ambient sensor reported "Light" | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mhm | 21:51 |
| Estel_ | my system is quite power-saving :) | 21:52 |
| Estel_ | one warning - don't touch screen, doing so results in power usage jumping higher by 40 mA ;) | 21:52 |
| ShadowJK | heh | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | my point however been you never shall assume any particular power consumption of backlight, unless it's set to either absolute max or real 0 | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (power usage on touching screen) sounds correct, touching screen activates X/Y evaluation of touchpoint which in turn means you enable current flow across the resistive planes in touchpanel | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | those are like a few 100 Ohms and voltage is several Volt | 21:55 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, sure, + wakes CPU | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep, that too | 21:55 |
| Estel_ | (more than refreshing screen itself) | 21:55 |
| Estel_ | and as for current of backlight, sure, I'm aware of that. some people disable ambient light sensing > screen brightness, but I like this feature | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | btw that's why you got a hw switch/button to unlock screen | 21:56 |
| Estel_ | ...which I love. | 21:57 |
| Estel_ | And hate, that on N950,. they did literally 3 buttons on whole device (exluding keyboard) | 21:57 |
| Estel_ | volume +, -, and "multi-purpose" | 21:57 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, btw, have You noticed that after PR 1.2, N950 doesn't indicate charging by it's white led? Or is it just me? | 21:58 |
| Estel_ | before upgrade (with developer version of software that was pre-installed) it was "breathing" similarly to n900 | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no, I didn't notice since I refuse to update ;-) | 21:58 |
| Estel_ | ;) | 21:59 |
| Estel_ | why so? | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | irreversable | 21:59 |
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| Estel_ | sure, but beta2 is bugged as hell | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I don't care | 21:59 |
| Estel_ | BTW someone need nice kick in balls for those "file itnegrity checks" | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | probably my N950 is the only device on this planet that still has original PR | 22:00 |
| Estel_ | well, you framed N950 and put it on the wall? :) | 22:00 |
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| Estel_ | want to sell it for 2 millions after 20 years, eh, for collectors? | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | in 6 months, yeah | 22:00 |
| Estel_ | I doubt that PR will matter much, it's about hardware ;) | 22:00 |
| Estel_ | no, in 6 months it will be still no more than 1000 pounds | 22:01 |
| Estel_ | twisted plan - prepare some miracle app for N950 that does many nice things... And have, well obfuscated, malicious code that destroyes hardware on set date | 22:02 |
| Estel_ | then profit from having one of few remaining ones | 22:02 |
| Estel_ | oho, it seems, that DocScrutinizer went for some coding ;) | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on N950 that seems simple enough to implement, thanks to all that MSSF/Aegis crap | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually thanks to full fledged TrustZone implementation | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | NOLO will do it for us | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (brick the device) | 22:05 |
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| Estel_ | brick is too low, we need full hardware burnout ;) | 22:06 |
| Estel_ | something via i2c? | 22:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | the `touch /var/MALF` exploit to nuke all user data with the help of Aegis that's meant to *protect* user data been published by me ;-) | 22:07 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, this trustzone implementation that bricks device, is it reversible with USB and flashing? | 22:08 |
| Estel_ | and aegis is meant to protect user data only in marketting bullshit | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | trustzone is the whole hw side of truste computing aka MSSF aka Aegis, in SoC | 22:09 |
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| Estel_ | it's flawed attempt to protect IP property of third parties (and fails to do so, too) | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | exactly | 22:09 |
| Estel_ | trusted computing is bitch itself enough | 22:09 |
| Estel_ | no freaking way to get rid of it on N950 for good, by any means? | 22:10 |
| Estel_ | i.e. putting hardware parts responsible for it to sleep? | 22:10 |
| Estel_ | eternal one, for example? | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | means are: get a free NOLO with signature, so it will get started by ROMBL | 22:10 |
| Estel_ | god, if Jolla will make anything even slightly ressembling this approach, I'm going to hate them | 22:11 |
| Estel_ | officially | 22:11 |
| Estel_ | so thats why open kernel doesn't fix every problem with aegis? | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | N900 has 'free' NOLO, HARM devices don't | 22:11 |
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| ShadowJK | 13% on spare n900 | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (open kernel) yes, it already encounters a system where stuff been locked down by NOLO | 22:12 |
| Estel_ | and people are still crazy about n9 greatness? seriously? | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: e.g. the CAL partition been locked down so you can't change system lockcode | 22:13 |
| Estel_ | ah so, that's why some people prefer inception over open kernel | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | this lockdown of hardware is part of TrusZone[TM] | 22:14 |
| Estel_ | I was wondering what's the all fuss about broken password funcionality | 22:14 |
| Estel_ | TrustMyAss[TM] I wonder who got bright idea of incorporating this shit | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ARM afaik | 22:14 |
| Estel_ | it's obligatory, so even willing to avoid it, nokia couldn't? | 22:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the concept of normal/secure duality is in every of ARM's IP blocks afaict | 22:15 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: when we were discussing kernel ABI compatibility, it was fcam that we didn't know if it works, was it? | 22:15 |
| Estel_ | well, good reason to stop using ARM chips | 22:15 |
| Estel_ | fcam? It works fine | 22:15 |
| Estel_ | IK'm using it every day | 22:16 |
| freemangordon | Estel_: we have ad "deal" with doc | 22:16 |
| Estel_ | AFAIK it was about purely "hyphotetical" closed source 3rd party application that might not work | 22:17 |
| Estel_ | I know | 22:17 |
| Estel_ | remember it ;) | 22:17 |
| Estel_ | was here when deal was made | 22:17 |
| Estel_ | still, it's kinda hard to fight against hyphotetical, non existing program concept | 22:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: I can't recall. Esp since it's not been me who picked a particular app/.ko. My point always been we don't know how many such custom .ko are out there, so we need a generic solution that is suuposed to work with arbitrary such .ko | 22:17 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: :nod: | 22:17 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: so far it seems all known applications wotk | 22:18 |
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| freemangordon | because noone knows anything besides joikushit and fcam | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the deal been: demonstrate you new kernel can load arbitrary .ko built for stock kernel | 22:19 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: are fcam drivers applicable for that? | 22:20 |
| qwazix | freemangordon, fcam is supposed to work? which version of cssu-thumb? | 22:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | any arbitrary .ko is applicable for that | 22:20 |
| freemangordon | qwazix: just installed fcam from repos and it works like charm | 22:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as long as it's built for stock kernel, not a patched version compiled against your new kernel | 22:21 |
| freemangordon | on my development device, freshly flashed and -thumb installed on top of that | 22:21 |
| freemangordon | qwazix: ^^^ | 22:21 |
| qwazix | freemangordon, doesn't work for me but I still have the initial cssu-thumb. Not sure it's thumb related as neither camera-ui works | 22:21 |
| freemangordon | qwazix: it is not thumb related, see ^^^ | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | basically your new kernel needs to work when flashed to device with stock kernel, even when no kernel-modules are replaced to match your new kernel | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's the deal | 22:22 |
| qwazix | ok thanks for the info, will reflash | 22:22 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: exactly what I did | 22:22 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: ^^^ | 22:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | sound great | 22:23 |
| freemangordon | this device has never seen any KP on it | 22:23 |
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| freemangordon | now, I suspect we need a confirmation from another user | 22:23 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: ^^^ ? | 22:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | not today, I'm all but fit for such demanding taks | 22:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | tasks | 22:24 |
| freemangordon | yeah, but maybe tomorrow? :P | 22:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but you bet I'll check your 100% ABI compatible kernel thoroughly eventually ;-D | 22:24 |
| freemangordon | yes, that was my idea too. Take one of your spare devices, flash PR1.3 on it, enable -thumb repo (as it is the place where you can get the kernel), upgrade, install fcam | 22:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | pick one of my "virgin" N900, do flasher --kernel-only -f -F <fmg-kernel.img> | 22:26 |
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| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: you must be kidding | 22:26 |
| freemangordon | where are kernel modules? | 22:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on device | 22:26 |
| freemangordon | omap1? | 22:26 |
| freemangordon | come on | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2012-07-28 21:22:34] <DocScrutinizer05> basically your new kernel needs to work when flashed to device with stock kernel, even when no kernel-modules are replaced to match your new kernel | 22:27 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: you are kidding me, right? | 22:27 |
| freemangordon | the device won;t bott, so skip that | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not at all, that's what ABI compatibility means | 22:27 |
| freemangordon | no, it is not | 22:27 |
| freemangordon | .ko is supposed to be loaded in the running kernel, right? | 22:28 |
| freemangordon | we are talking about any 3rd party .ko | 22:28 |
| freemangordon | kernel modules koming with -omap1 are not third party | 22:29 |
| freemangordon | *coming | 22:29 |
| freemangordon | anyway, I gtg now, will continue tomorrow on that | 22:30 |
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| Estel_ | well, it looks like DocScrutinizer mean "every possible .ko", which means, that such ABI compatible kernel would need to be direct copy of stock kernel. Which of course is impossible scenario, so I feel thjat fork is imminent | 22:32 |
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| ShadowJK | it would be nice if atleast package management refused to install such .ko | 22:32 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, but any 3rd party .ko works. DocScrutinizer demans now compatibility with omap1 kernel modules pre-loaded | 22:33 |
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| Estel_ | during boot time | 22:33 |
| Estel_ | which is impossible scenario | 22:33 |
| Estel_ | You can't flasher --kernel-only -f -F without modules, and expect it to work | 22:33 |
| Estel_ | unless you're flashing same kernel | 22:34 |
| kerio | or an ABI-compatible one | 22:34 |
| kerio | that's the point | 22:34 |
| Estel_ | bullshit, kerio | 22:34 |
| Estel_ | there is difference between clone and ABI compatibility | 22:34 |
| kerio | i suppose doc can allow you to change the directory name in /lib/modules | 22:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2012-07-28 21:17:41] <DocScrutinizer05> freemangordon: I can't recall. Esp since it's not been me who picked a particular app/.ko. My point always been we don't know how many such custom .ko are out there, so we need a generic solution that is suuposed to work with arbitrary such .ko | 22:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2012-07-28 21:17:58] <freemangordon> DocScrutinizer51: :nod: | 22:34 |
| kerio | >:D | 22:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~dict arbitrary | 22:34 |
| infobot | Dictionary 'arbitrary' (1 of 4): based on or subject to individual discretion or preference or sometimes impulse or caprice; "an arbitrary decision"; "the arbitrary rule of a dictator"; "an arbitrary penalty"; "of arbitrary size and shape"; "an arbitrary choice"; "arbitrary division of the group into halves" . | 22:34 |
| Estel_ | "arbitrary rule of dictator" fits best here | 22:35 |
| Estel_ | such requiments is as good as saying "no because no" | 22:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's nonsense | 22:35 |
| Estel_ | even goddamnit update to stock kernel would require it's modules | 22:35 |
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| Estel_ | in my book, comaptibility with arbitraty .ko is when You can load any 3rd party .ko during runtime | 22:36 |
| Estel_ | You know as good as I, that compatibility with omap1 modules required for boot will be never achieved, ans shouldn't | 22:36 |
| Estel_ | as it doesn't mirror any real life situation | 22:36 |
| RiD | mirror mirror can you tell | 22:36 |
| RiD | who is more handsome than me | 22:37 |
| Estel_ | kernel-power is ;) | 22:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon agreed to the rationale of a kernel needing ABI compatibilty as long as he thought he can cheat for a particular randomly picked .ko like fcam. True ABI compatibility however means ... well *compatible*, without any preconditions like 23rd party" | 22:37 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; oh hey I noticed I forgot to change one 950 to 1250, why sys and ch made no sense | 22:37 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: not allowing the kernel's own modules is bullshit, and you know it too | 22:37 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, I would not use word "cheat". It's jsut liek You both see this "deal" as different things. Now when it's fixed, I still think that fork is unavoidable ;) | 22:38 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, huh? | 22:38 |
| kerio | for instance, there could be the need for a module that loads other modules in a wrapper | 22:38 |
| Estel_ | thansk a lot for looking into it. Where to fix it, which line? | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: I always told I don't see this ABI compatible kernel ever happening | 22:38 |
| Estel_ | the point is that no one ever see need for such interpretation of ABI compatibility | 22:39 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; in calculate_system_use there are two places with 950, both should be changed to 1250 for charging at 1250 | 22:39 |
| Estel_ | it's rather demanding for sake of demanding | 22:39 |
| ShadowJK | those two numbers should be same as the configured charge rate | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but don't tell me now I would tell BS, when it turns out you made false implicit assumptions about how to achieve ABI compatibility | 22:39 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, I haven't made any assumption, just explaining missunderstanding between You and freemangordon | 22:40 |
| Estel_ | it's not my problem (directly), after all | 22:40 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, my copy have 1250 there?... | 22:40 |
| Estel_ | SYSTEM_USE=$((1250-RATE)) | 22:41 |
| Estel_ | this one, for example? Is it this? | 22:41 |
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| ShadowJK | oh | 22:41 |
| Estel_ | It is it* | 22:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | after all, if you can't make your "ABI compatibe" kernel work even with known stock .ko, how would you *guarantee* it will work for any random custom .ko you didn't know about right now? | 22:42 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: with that restriction, the only possible things are very minor patches, if anything | 22:42 |
| ShadowJK | also the if -gt 950 line above | 22:42 |
| Estel_ | yea, it's 1250 by default in file You've linked me last time | 22:42 |
| ShadowJK | oh | 22:42 |
| Estel_ | Still thanks :) | 22:43 |
| kerio | which could be fine, i suppose - the thumb2 errata workaround isn't that invasive, after all | 22:43 |
| Estel_ | should I upload it for You, to avoid need for rewriting already written thing? | 22:43 |
| ShadowJK | lol nah | 22:43 |
| ShadowJK | i think I'll rebase a new charge22 off of charge3 experimental branch | 22:44 |
| freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: go read some definition of WTF running kernel is, it is not "the stuff flashed on /dev/mtdN" | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: that's not completely correct. Any such ABI compatible kernel could still install *additional* .ko, and/or replace one or two or even 5 .ko with bugfixed versions _*as long as the stock kernel would work with those fixed .ko*_ as well | 22:44 |
| freemangordon | the kernel definition includes .ko files compiled for that kernel | 22:44 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, nice, whatever it means ;) | 22:44 |
| freemangordon | if you don;t know that, well, go lerna it | 22:44 |
| freemangordon | *learn | 22:44 |
| freemangordon | bb, i am out | 22:45 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; the differences between "stable" charge2* branch and my private branch are messing with my head | 22:45 |
| Estel_ | gentlemans, peace, no need for arguing (Am I saying that?). Fork is always proven way to resolve unresolveable conflicts of dogmatic values ;) | 22:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: so your definition of ABI compatibility is "it's using .ko compiled for that kernel version"? sure! | 22:46 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I would gladly be tester of it | 22:46 |
| * ShadowJK noticed charge21 doesnt blink leds | 22:46 | |
| Estel_ | unfortunately, it doesn't :D | 22:46 |
| Estel_ | is new version using charging pattern from mce? | 22:47 |
| Estel_ | mce.ini | 22:47 |
| ShadowJK | ya | 22:47 |
| Estel_ | sounds nice. I wonder if Pali based kernel implementation in new version | 22:47 |
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| Estel_ | or outdated one | 22:47 |
| ShadowJK | i dont think it'd be sane to use either | 22:48 |
| ShadowJK | 18% and still charging at 1250-ish | 22:48 |
| ShadowJK | oops now main n900 is out of batt | 22:49 |
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| kerio | freemangordon_: your hostmask is ~freemango@... | 22:51 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, and it's providing *real* 1250 of power? | 22:51 |
| kerio | i want a free mango | 22:51 |
| japh | estel_, re: {,b}ash: I wholeheartly disagree, now I find it hell trying to adapt to bash and I do think that on the phone a helpful context-aware shell is of even more use than on your real machine. | 22:51 |
| ShadowJK | Close to it, 1100 rate into battery | 22:51 |
| Estel_ | japh, but I don't protest against ash :) | 22:52 |
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| ShadowJK | 23 percent charge now, and rate is dropping | 22:52 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I thinkit will work for me to, it was jsut silly me to use it without stopping bme | 22:52 |
| Estel_ | temperature? | 22:52 |
| ShadowJK | 41 | 22:53 |
| Estel_ | nice. DocScrutinizer, what is normal temeprature of choke accomodating chip? | 22:53 |
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| Estel_ | should be similar to one of chip measuring temperature? | 22:53 |
| ShadowJK | Heh, I took out spare wallcharger from box, but the plug was so tight I didn't dare push it in | 22:53 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, with N950 they did it even worse - plug was so tight that I almsot had to rip it off to take it out | 22:54 |
| Estel_ | and push with hammer | 22:54 |
| Estel_ | needed quitew a lot of work to make it normal | 22:54 |
| freemangordon_ | kerio: that's my n900 connected through my mobile provider ;-) | 22:54 |
| kerio | free mango r don | 22:54 |
| ShadowJK | 26%, 1000mA into battery | 22:54 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, shoudl rate drop so early? | 22:54 |
| Estel_ | should* | 22:54 |
| ShadowJK | more or less | 22:54 |
| ShadowJK | It'd stay higher for longer with a japod | 22:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: sorry, please rephrase | 22:55 |
| ShadowJK | spare n900 has nokia bl-5j | 22:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: try pencil | 22:55 |
| ShadowJK | hm? | 22:56 |
| ShadowJK | oh | 22:56 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, I'm asking about normal temperature, that choke accomodating charging chip should have | 22:56 |
| * ShadowJK is charging main n900 from an "emergency charger" thing now | 22:56 | |
| Estel_ | from AA battery?;) | 22:56 |
| ShadowJK | yes, 4 AA batteries | 22:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: by 'normal' you mean what's a still tolerable temperature for the choke? | 22:56 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, I wonder what temperature would be "regular" one | 22:57 |
| Estel_ | i.e. which one should warn about something going on bad | 22:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I dunno | 22:57 |
| Estel_ | to stop it on time | 22:57 |
| ShadowJK | 30% 990 mA | 22:57 |
| RiD | i wouldn't mind carrying 1kg of battery power to feed this hungry phone, but the wires would be the issue | 22:57 |
| Estel_ | RiD, why 1G, You just need dual-scud | 22:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | aha, well, warning level starts at maybe 150°C | 22:57 |
| kerio | triple-scud! | 22:57 |
| RiD | not enough, Estel_ | 22:58 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, uh | 22:58 |
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| * ShadowJK copes with single japod | 22:58 | |
| kerio | Estel_: make an otterbox with enough space for three batteries plskthx | 22:58 |
| Estel_ | RiD, so you may feel tasty project of bvringing 2x 18650 which total in 6,800 mAh | 22:58 |
| RiD | yes I do. | 22:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: but usually it won't get hot at all | 22:58 |
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| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, I see, well I would like to ensure that it's not stressed more than it should at all | 22:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | unless it runs into saturation where it rises temperature extremely sharp | 22:59 |
| Estel_ | so I suspect it shouldn't be considerably hotter than battery cell | 22:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as a rule of thumb if your burn your thumb on it, sth is wrong | 22:59 |
| Estel_ | RiD, search for my [Pre pre pre] annoucement of black alu body | 22:59 |
| Estel_ | You can even pre-order :) | 22:59 |
| RiD | I already saw it. Too bad I won't preorder | 23:00 |
| Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, hehe | 23:00 |
| Estel_ | RiD, no problem | 23:00 |
| Estel_ | BTw I wonder why nanowire LiIon's concept is so stalled | 23:00 |
| ShadowJK | 35%, rate 964 sys -66 ch 1030 | 23:01 |
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| Estel_ | sys -66? with screen on? | 23:02 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; basically all battery techs you hear about are 10 years out from being comercial, and even then the patents will make it unobtainable for another 5-10? | 23:02 |
| ShadowJK | off | 23:02 |
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| Estel_ | ShadowJK, sounds sane | 23:02 |
| ShadowJK | it gets closer to truth once battery gets a bit fuller | 23:02 |
| Estel_ | Guys, I get real problem. Since month or more, no matter, what, I can't make mafw to play my .ogg music and theora videos | 23:04 |
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| Estel_ | filetypes are registered with tracker. as for .ogg files, it even KNOW playtime of file | 23:04 |
| Estel_ | yet, it refuses to play | 23:04 |
| Estel_ | it started with CSSU update to something tracker related | 23:04 |
| Estel_ | I tried rebuilding 5tracker database countless of times | 23:04 |
| Estel_ | interesingly, .flac works well | 23:05 |
| Estel_ | my music collection is entirely in .ogg... | 23:05 |
| kerio | Estel_: are you using OMP? | 23:05 |
| vi_ | lol. FOSS fail. | 23:05 |
| Estel_ | kerio, sure, but it shouldn't matter, as it's playing through mafw | 23:05 |
| Estel_ | for other openmediaplayer users, .ogg works | 23:06 |
| kerio | i don't have an .ogg to test | 23:06 |
| kerio | :s | 23:06 |
| vi_ | so you chose music through OMP, it opens, tells you track length but does not actually play? | 23:07 |
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| Estel_ | vi_, yes | 23:09 |
| Estel_ | If I have playlsit of .ogg files, it shows correct play time of them all, then, correct play time of individual song when i start playing... | 23:09 |
| Estel_ | but jsut cycles through all songs | 23:09 |
| Estel_ | i.e. tries to play any of it | 23:09 |
| Estel_ | if I would have, lets say, fuckin mp3 in playlist, it would start playing it normally, after cycling through .ogg earlier on playlist | 23:10 |
| Estel_ | then, it would stil lfail on next .ogg | 23:10 |
| Estel_ | well, tracker even properly catalogs albums from those .ogg files | 23:10 |
| kerio | i have a song that's not indexed properly :( | 23:11 |
| Estel_ | kerio, http://lorienart.pl/Blood-Roses.ogg | 23:12 |
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| ShadowJK | 1890 Seconds, 50% charged, rate: 840, sys: -53, ch: 893, voltage 4.082 | 23:14 |
| ShadowJK | 6 - 50% in half an hour | 23:14 |
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| Estel_ | well, sounds sane, consideringf 1250 charge | 23:14 |
| Estel_ | 625 is half of it | 23:14 |
| Estel_ | which is close to being half of Your battery | 23:14 |
| ShadowJK | 2 hours or so left to reach full :P | 23:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: those numbers puzzle hell outa me | 23:15 |
| Estel_ | saturation charge ;) | 23:15 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, You may just settle with "fast charge" i.e. 80% or so | 23:15 |
| Estel_ | stop doing it when current reaches 50% of set one | 23:15 |
| Estel_ | healthy for battery, and quick on charging time | 23:15 |
| kerio | oh ok, touching the file and killing tracker solved it | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: probably my idea of meaning of "rate" "sys" and "charge" is not in line with yours ;-) | 23:16 |
| ShadowJK | If your commute is half hour long, and you have a decent car charger in yor car, you get half your battery charged when driving home from work, if you used up most of it at work :) | 23:16 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, so there is completely no sue of assumed 132 mOhm resistance between charger and battery, in bq27200.sh? | 23:16 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer; rate is rate as reported by bq27200, the rest are made up | 23:17 |
| Estel_ | but charge is not entirely made up, as it read from limits | 23:17 |
| ShadowJK | Estel_; it doesnt make any difference for bq27200 | 23:17 |
| Estel_ | i.e it was made up when i was trying to charge with 1250 with bme on (due to 950 limit), but without it, it limits current to 900 in later parts of charge, etc | 23:17 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I see | 23:18 |
| Estel_ | so what is exactly affected by it in charge21.sh? | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, for me that reads like rate is what bq24150 is set to, sys is delivering(!) 53mA to result in a total charge to battery of 893 | 23:18 |
| Estel_ | nah. | 23:18 |
| kerio | did anyone try a boxwave external case for the n900? | 23:18 |
| ShadowJK | bq24150 outputs 4.2V, but there's voltage drop due to the current flowing through narrow pcb traces, so less than 4.2V arrives at battery | 23:19 |
| Estel_ | vi_, no ideas about my .ogg problem with mafw? | 23:19 |
| Estel_ | kerio, tried file I've linked You? | 23:19 |
| kerio | oh, sorry, not yet | 23:19 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, I see | 23:19 |
| Estel_ | kerio, if You could download it and check if it plays ok for You... CSSU-T and openmediaplayer, yep? | 23:19 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer; net rate into battery is 840, system consumes 53 (estimated), charger is providing 893 (estimated) | 23:20 |
| kerio | Estel_: huh, i can't download it anymore | 23:20 |
| ShadowJK | Real actual system use is at or below 20mA | 23:20 |
| kerio | no, nvm | 23:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: :nod: - just the naming and display is confusing to me | 23:20 |
| ShadowJK | or should be around that in offline mode screen off and 5sec charge21.sh loop | 23:21 |
| Estel_ | klerio, http://lorienart.pl/Blood-Roses.ogg | 23:21 |
| Estel_ | kerio* | 23:21 |
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| ShadowJK | I mostly added the ch column to see the point at which the charger isn't outputting full current anymore, point at which it enters CV portion of charge | 23:22 |
| Estel_ | and it's very usefull | 23:22 |
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| ShadowJK | 2450s, 4.093V, 60%, net rate 754, system use 56, charger current 810 | 23:23 |
| StyXman_ | since a few days my n900 does not answer to ping and all ports appear as filtered. iptables -L shows no rules at all. what can be wrong? | 23:23 |
| ShadowJK | wifi ap powersaving fail | 23:23 |
| * ShadowJK recalls his Diablo era awk script where he called "rate" balance | 23:25 | |
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| kerio | did anyone try a boxwave and/or otterbox case for the n900? | 23:27 |
| vi_ | Estel_: plays fine here. | 23:27 |
| vi_ | kerio: I have an otterbox. | 23:28 |
| kerio | is it worth it? | 23:28 |
| vi_ | makes the tank like n900 EVEN MOR TANK LIKE. | 23:28 |
| vi_ | I think so. | 23:28 |
| kerio | AWESOEM | 23:28 |
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| vi_ | my one is getting pretty fucked. | 23:29 |
| kerio | D: | 23:29 |
| kerio | so it breaks? | 23:29 |
| vi_ | no, it can take it. | 23:29 |
| kerio | k | 23:29 |
| vi_ | I just goes to show how much abuse my n900 has been saved from. | 23:29 |
| vi_ | big gouges and shit out of it. | 23:29 |
| Estel_ | vi_, well, for me it doesn't and I have no diea what else could i purge and reinstall | 23:29 |
| Estel_ | but it's really irritating | 23:30 |
| vi_ | Estel_: I have not idea, sorry. | 23:30 |
| vi_ | Estel_: reflash! | 23:30 |
| Estel_ | sure, thanks ;P | 23:30 |
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| Estel_ | it's on top list of my dreams | 23:30 |
| vi_ | Estel_: does it work with stock media player? | 23:30 |
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| Estel_ | good question. Now I need only to find again this value, that I edited ages ago, to replace opening with openmediaplayer with openmediaplayer | 23:31 |
| Estel_ | some dbus call or what? | 23:31 |
| vi_ | kerio: be warned, it makes the massive n900 SUPERMASSIVE. | 23:31 |
| vi_ | men will mock it, women will fear it. | 23:31 |
| kerio | Estel_: plays fine here | 23:31 |
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| vi_ | it is written on the OMP wiki entry. | 23:32 |
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| vi_ | Estel_: have you tried 'clearing' the OMP playlist? | 23:33 |
| ShadowJK | wtf, dealextreme is selling Nokia N9 | 23:34 |
| Estel_ | vi_, as for playlist, sure | 23:34 |
| Estel_ | thanks, will check on wiki | 23:34 |
| Estel_ | ShadowJK, fake? | 23:34 |
| ShadowJK | at the price it better be real | 23:34 |
| vi_ | dealextreme are a hoax. | 23:34 |
| Estel_ | lately I seen fake N900's with similarly looking keyboard and screen (camera placement etc) | 23:34 |
| Venemo_N9 | lol | 23:35 |
| Estel_ | vi_, for theora it's even more strange | 23:35 |
| Estel_ | http://lorienart.pl/theora.png | 23:35 |
| Estel_ | it says "Failed to open file. Failed to find coded:" | 23:35 |
| Estel_ | rest is in english | 23:35 |
| Estel_ | wtf it means is a mystery to me, what appendx | 23:35 |
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| vi_ | hey do not carry half their stuff in stock. Then they will hold your entire order back for months while they wait for whatever shithole human rights abuse factory to make more. | 23:36 |
| Estel_ | of course it also know theora file playtime properly | 23:36 |
| vi_ | theora.png? | 23:36 |
| Estel_ | screenshot | 23:36 |
| Estel_ | of error message | 23:36 |
| Estel_ | ]it worked well before | 23:36 |
| Estel_ | anmd i'm sure it will work for You too | 23:36 |
| vi_ | fuck theora. | 23:37 |
| vi_ | fuck ogg. | 23:37 |
| vi_ | Estel_: reinstall MAFW? | 23:38 |
| ShadowJK | vi_; they dont have even 1% in stock | 23:38 |
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| ShadowJK | at the bottom of each page you can see the name of the real seller of the product | 23:38 |
| vi_ | ShadowJK: they have some wierd shit as well, like placenta extract. | 23:39 |
| ShadowJK | They've been pretty good at splitting orders for me | 23:39 |
| ShadowJK | vi_; well it's almost like ebay, chinese supplier gets user/pass to the site and starts listing random crap :P | 23:39 |
| kerio | yay, bought an otterbox | 23:40 |
| Estel_ | vi_, maybe, but I doubt it will fix it :P | 23:40 |
| Estel_ | it's something retardish related to tracker I'm afraid | 23:40 |
| vi_ | Estel_: I doubt it. | 23:41 |
| Estel_ | hm, will check stock player first... | 23:41 |
| Estel_ | but x-annodex-decoder plugin? | 23:42 |
| vi_ | Estel_: reinstalling mafw will run mafw post inst scripts. they might contain some magic. | 23:42 |
| Estel_ | wtf? | 23:42 |
| Estel_ | true | 23:42 |
| Estel_ | will; try that immediately after trying stock player | 23:42 |
| ZogG_laptop | extra-decoders? | 23:42 |
| ShadowJK | 1 hour, 4.125V, 937mAh, 76%, rate 523, sys -45, ch 568 | 23:42 |
| vi_ | kerio: You will need to loosen your belt to fix that massive thing in your pants. | 23:43 |
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| kerio | vi_: i have big pants | 23:43 |
| vi_ | s/fix/fit/ | 23:43 |
| infobot | vi_ meant: kerio: You will need to loosen your belt to fit that massive thing in your pants. | 23:43 |
| kerio | should i also buy some screen protectors? | 23:43 |
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| Estel_ | lmao, I've created this wiki page for OMP | 23:43 |
| Estel_ | and now I forget that it existed | 23:43 |
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| Estel_ | as for extra-decoders, of course I've reinstalled them plentora of times, to no avail | 23:44 |
| *** real-dev is now known as dev | 23:44 | |
| Estel_ | vi_, stock mediaplayer just says it can't open file due to lack of codec | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | for .ogg it says audio codec, for theora video codec | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | of course, it also knows exact playtime and tags from it | 23:49 |
| Estel_ | going to reinstall mafw | 23:49 |
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| ShadowJK | 1 hour 10 minutes: 83%, 421mA into batt, 41 system use, charger outputting 462 | 23:52 |
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| kerio | i repeat my question: should i buy some screen protectors? | 23:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | dafaq, KDE + apps gets more INstable the older it grows | 23:54 |
| * ShadowJK likes screen protector | 23:55 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ^q in a konversation-tab: insta-segfault | 23:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | \o/ reproduceable | 23:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~lart KDE4 | 23:56 |
| * infobot turns KDE4 into a lifesized tux doll | 23:56 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sure thing >:-(((( | 23:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [KCrash Handler] | 23:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | #6 0x00007fd69b3d3cc7 in Phonon::PulseSupport::PulseSupport() () from /usr/lib64/libphonon.so.4 | 23:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | FSCK PA! | 23:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fsck phonon | 23:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | seems I said that before | 23:58 |
| kerio | yo dawg i heard you like audio daemons so we put a daemon in yo daemon so you can audio while you crash | 23:59 |
| vi_ | kerio: lol | 23:59 |
| vi_ | also, yes. buy the best screen protector you can get. | 23:59 |
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