IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2012-05-16

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infobotFIQ meant: f&a04:13
FIQoh well04:13
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bjvis there some trick that must be done to get MicroB to request an html cache manifest?05:27
bjvi visit in microB, i am able to connect to a no-internet network and successfully use mr. finkle's js demo offline05:28
bjvif i download his .zip and host the same demo myself,   my server does not receive a GET request for todo.manifest from microB05:28
bjvif i request the same locally hosted demo from Opera mobile 10, the server _does correctly register the GET request's for todo.manifest05:31
bjvanyone have experience with html5 and any tricks necessary to get microB to play nice with your host?05:32
bjvi have no better luck with a minimal document:   <html manifest="test.manifest"><h1>Hello World!</h1></html>05:33
bjvand a 3 line manifest05:34
bjv# v105:34
DocScrutinizercheck your mail05:47
* DocScrutinizer wishes good luck to the 7 candidates and hands out two lollies for the two who won't make it05:54
DocScrutinizermy condolences current council wasn't even capable to give the other five of next council a proper legitimate start05:55
DocScrutinizershame on you, current council05:56
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DocScrutinizeror shame on those consultants whol failed to explain to you what's the actual duties you took when accepting your election for council members06:04
* DocScrutinizer idly wonders who might be those consultants06:05
* robbiethe1st votes DocS for council06:06
DocScrutinizerto late :-P06:07
DocScrutinizerhi robbiethe1st06:07
DocScrutinizeryou been rare, last few weeks06:08
ieatlintbah, voting is for losers06:11
ieatlintcivilization has classically thrived through authoritarian regimes06:12
ieatlintand it won't let me write "stephen elop" in for the council election :(06:13
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robbiethe1stWeeks? Last few months more like06:19
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DocScrutinizerso welcome back then? :-D07:12
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DocScrutinizer[general notice] voting for council election opened! Check your email! You should already have received your ballot (if you're eligible to vote, see )07:33
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DocScrutinizeralso see  and
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DocScrutinizerif you think you're eligible to vote for council, and you're missing the mail with your ballot, please IMMEDIATELY contact X-Fade (user in this channel) aka Niels Breet07:38
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Sc0rpiusI got the mail07:56
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ieatlintis there a good voting guide here?08:01
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ieatlintthere, i voted08:03
ieatlinttwice today now... voted in gov elections earlier08:03
DocScrutinizerin my book I got "none of the candidates shows up on IRC regularly, as supposed by"08:05
ieatlintyeah, i voted for the names i recognized08:07
DocScrutinizergiven the purpose of council primarily is to "know about what's going on in community", I don't think any of the candidates is currently in a position to deliver on this duty, since all (mostly) ignore this channel08:09
ieatlinti'm barely in here really anymore myself :/08:10
ieatlintthis employment thing is oddly time consuming08:11
DocScrutinizer~seen ivgalvez08:12
infobotivgalvez <598c718a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 4d 18h 14m 13s ago, saying: 'amiconn: It's nice for gaming'.08:12
DocScrutinizer~seen estel08:12
infoboti haven't seen 'estel', DocScrutinizer08:12
DocScrutinizer~seen jcharpak08:13
infobotjcharpak <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 285d 23h 31m 20s ago, saying: 'good luck'.08:13
DocScrutinizer~seen woody1461908:13
infoboti haven't seen 'woody14619', DocScrutinizer08:13
DocScrutinizer~seen Aries08:13
infobotaries <~aries@> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 490d 18h 9m 4s ago, saying: ':)'.08:13
Sc0rpiusisn't Arie ?08:13
DocScrutinizer~seen NielDK08:13
infobotDocScrutinizer: i haven't seen 'nieldk'08:13
ieatlintoh god, it's been that long since aries was around?08:13
Sc0rpius~seen Arie08:14
infobotarie <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 1d 9h 52m 44s ago, saying: 'i'm gonna go guys thank you for the informative talk'.08:14
Sc0rpiusthat's yout guy08:14
DocScrutinizer~seen SD6908:14
infobotsd69 <ae64f0d8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 23d 14h 30m 58s ago, saying: 'any thoughts on cOBS from cssu pov?'.08:14
Sc0rpiusI was going to vote for him08:14
ieatlintah, that makes a lot more sense... i thought i'd seem him recently08:14
Sc0rpiusbut then lazyness came08:14
ieatlintas i recall, voting in this election is strongly encouraged to give a good showing08:14
Sc0rpiusI'm pretty sure he's gonna win anyway08:15
ieatlintthe turnout is as important as the result08:15
DocScrutinizerwhere's the link from aries to Arie?08:15
ieatlinthard to claim a council represents a community unless the community comes out to vote08:15
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Sc0rpius<Arie> freemangordon: I'm no good in that, have the N9 in my hand at work, I'm more interested in listening since I'm running for the council, I want to be aware and helpful to the maemo community if I get elected.08:18
Sc0rpiusthat was during the cssu meeting08:18
Sc0rpiusand you were there :S08:18
DocScrutinizerso what?08:18
Sc0rpiusyou didn't read it :( so he says he's running for the council, so he's the guy right08:19
DocScrutinizeris Arie stating there he's aries aka Arie Mark ?08:19
DocScrutinizerindeed, I didn't read08:19
DocScrutinizerand I can't recall when he last time showed up *here* in *this* channel08:19
Sc0rpiusI think he is08:20
Sc0rpiusno, I haven't seen him in this channel either.08:20
Sc0rpiusjust in #maemo-ssu and actually, just today.08:20
Sc0rpiusor yesterday for some people08:20
DocScrutinizer>>Finally, Council members are usually present over IRC at and are always happy to chat with you.<<08:20
DocScrutinizer(from )08:21
Sc0rpiusthey never come08:21
ieatlinti should clearly have run08:21
DocScrutinizerso neither current council nor any candidate of future council is a true representative of the IRC part of community08:22
DocScrutinizerieatlint: indeed, I'd happily vote for you08:22
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ieatlinti've a history of doing well by running on a platform of embezzlement and bribery.. does the council have any such opportunities?08:22
ieatlintthen damn... next time perhaps08:23
Sc0rpiusbut when Jaffa was the council it was great08:23
Sc0rpiusor GeneralAntilles08:24
Sc0rpiusbut those times will never return08:24
ieatlintor when nokia had employees working on it..08:24
DocScrutinizernokia employees in council???08:24
ieatlintno, i mean in maemo08:25
Sc0rpiusI know this is not #symbian but my gf got a Nokia 500 running Belle and it's unstable as hell08:27
Sc0rpiusit reboots just for the sake of it08:27
Sc0rpiuswhat a crap, Nokia used to be decent08:27
Sc0rpiusthis saddens me08:27
ieatlinthuh, i've used a few belle devices and not had issues08:27
ieatlintwell, not outside of the normal crappy symbian reality08:28
ieatlinthad a nokia 700 for dev for six months... seemed like a decent device overall08:28
DocScrutinizerSc0rpius: Nokia always had maybe 5% of RMA, on all devices (except N900 where this rate probably been way higher)08:29
DocScrutinizerquite usual in whole industry08:29
Sc0rpiussomebody should make a 100% mobile linux OS 100% open 100% multitasking and NO VM crap like Android08:30
Sc0rpiusand it seems nobody is interested08:30
ieatlintclearly you haven't heard of tizen yet08:30
* ieatlint tries to withhold laughter08:30
Sc0rpiusand TIzen was my last hope but it seems applications have to be some HTML5 crap and no native executable support.08:30
ieatlintuh, no, there's native08:31
ieatlintEFL based primarily08:31
Sc0rpiusthey already said "developers can't build native executables" or so I heard08:31
DocScrutinizerSc0rpius: maybe since if you do, you get 100% defective hardware fried by idiotas coming up with "ACME OC", "superduper indicator-LED LAZOR" and other shite deliberately frying your hw08:31
Sc0rpiusanyway I saw that video with the Samsung device running some version of Tizen08:31
Sc0rpiusdidn't look bad.08:32
Sc0rpiusheh DocScrutinizer08:32
Sc0rpius"« Do as we say, not as we do »: Tizen devs use the EFL libraries for everything, but for app devs it's the « HTML5, HTML5 » mantra"08:32
Sc0rpius(that's from a blog)08:33
Sc0rpiushow can you write Angry Birds in HTML5? it'll be very slow08:33
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Sc0rpiuspoor OS hasn't been officially released and it's already doomed08:34
ieatlintSc0rpius, efl apps are supported08:36
ieatlintopengl apps are supported08:36
ieatlintangry birds will be opengl, and considering rovio was a sponsor of the tizen conference, i'm betting there'll be angry birds on it08:37
ieatlinti've got the dev device here on my desk... it's pretty meh, the base system is very very basic08:37
Sc0rpiuswe'll see about that08:37
DocScrutinizer"with great power comes great responsibility" - all those devels never wrapped their head around that very true saying, not even when they seen it on doing "su -" on their device08:37
ieatlintand the dev environment only works in 32bit linux and 32bit windows08:37
ieatlintso i haven't tried anything08:37
Sc0rpiusthere's virtualbox/vmware for that08:38
ieatlintbut from what i recall of efl from the openmoko days... heh08:38
ieatlintit's not bad08:38
DocScrutinizerso all the commercial OS developers (those working for hw manufs) decided NOT to give that much power to devels08:38
Sc0rpiusI guess you develop in C++ for that08:38
ieatlintit's like qml, but no logic in the declarative (similar to xaml in some ways)08:38
ieatlintbut it's much more restricted in gui elements08:38
Sc0rpiusI'll miss Qt when I get rid of my N90008:38
Sc0rpiusand I'll miss it a lot.08:38
ieatlintC for tizen08:38
Sc0rpiusI see08:39
ieatlintand yeah, qt is nice08:39
ieatlintnot glib c, but efl c... ecore and einas modules, which provide a main loop and basic data structure implementations and such08:39
Sc0rpiusGlib needs to die08:39
DocScrutinizerJaffa: hey! thanks for comment on ticket :-D08:39
ieatlinti like glib fine for c :P08:40
Sc0rpiusI'll wait for Tizen then, maybe it'll be fun08:42
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ieatlintgood luck08:43
ieatlinti'll believe it's a real product when there's a consumer device on the market and all the major partners are still present (that second qualifier being a meego/nokia inspired one)08:44
Sc0rpiusyeah it's real08:44
Sc0rpiusbut will it satisfy power users?08:44
Sc0rpius(I know they could care less about power users)08:45
ieatlintyeah, because they wouldn't have a conference if it were going to fail before even launching08:45
DocScrutinizerieatlint: hey, the election is fundamentally flawed anyway, you should have good chances to petition for a re-run where you run for election08:45
DocScrutinizerif the new council had any sense for PC, this anyway was the first and only thing they'd do: organize immediate properly organized new elections08:47
ieatlintthe council election is ominously close to my city council election, which consists of 40 names i've never heard of and instructions to "choose 10"08:49
DocScrutinizer*if* I were elected in such a flawed process, I'd accept the appointment for this sole purpose, and I'd hope for getting a better more legit mandate in the new election08:49
ieatlintexcept i recognized names in the maemo council election08:49
DocScrutinizerwell, recognizing names doesn't automatically qualify them for being a community representative08:50
ieatlintyeah, but not recognizing them doesn't count for more08:50
DocScrutinizerquite possibly the opposite08:51
DocScrutinizernot recognizing a name rules them out I'd say08:51
DocScrutinizerbut I'd recognize abill_uk immediately ;-P Doesn't mean I'd vote for him08:52
ieatlintsimilarly the one name on the city council candidates i recognize i also wouldn't vote for.. good times08:53
DocScrutinizerwhich city?08:58
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ieatlintsan francisco08:59
* DocScrutinizer idly wonders what would be the outcome of US democratic procedures competing with maemo council statutes and the way they are executed, for a ranking on a metrics of "proper democracy"09:01
DocScrutinizerheck, I need another coffe. Seems I'm in a delusional state of mind09:02
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ieatlinthey, i vote for president the same way09:05
ieatlinti pick a name at random09:05
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luke-jrDocScrutinizer: can I write you in the Maemo vote thing?09:21
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DocScrutinizerluke-jr: ??? sorry please rephrase09:30
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DocScrutinizerwrite me in the vote thing?09:31
luke-jr"The election of the Maemo Community Council is now open, … The candidates for election are: …"09:31
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luke-jryeah, write-in "DocScrutinizer"09:31
DocScrutinizerif you mean whether you can put my name on the vote ballot: I dunno but for sure I'm not running09:31
luke-jrnevermind the candidates09:31
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DocScrutinizerluke-jr: I definitely don't qualify for a community representative, since I notoriously and persitently ignore the "better" half of what's going on in community, over at tmo09:37
DocScrutinizerI probably could stand competition as it's now, but I don't like to run for council anyway09:39
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Sicelobesides, looks like that stage is over and done with .. seems we can now only vote within the current candidates10:33
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DocScrutinizermy personal recommendation for a good read, for both voters and candidates:
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Estel_Hello Maemo.11:38
DocScrutinizerEstel_: !!! :-)11:39
Estel_As You may be already aware, election for Council is running already, from 16th to 23th may. Every registered Maemo member (, not necessary that got account older than 3 months and karma of at least 10, is egligble to vote. You should receive invitation + voting token on Your mail address associated with If You feel that You shoulbe eglibe to vote, but haven't received invitation/token, please contact X-Fade,11:41
Estel_ and/or seek help on:
DocScrutinizerI'm already sold to your unremitting dedication to maemo :-D11:41
Estel_wow, DocScrutinizer, thanks for such cheerfull welcome11:41
Estel_:) thanks a lot11:42
Estel_regarding election: links worth checking:11:42
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Estel_DocScrutinizer,  thanks for inviting Council candidates here, I hoe others will come as well11:45
Estel_Ok, now kind of shameless advert ;)11:46
DocScrutinizerwell, such invitation shouldn't be nexessary :-)11:46
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Estel_don't get it wrong way, but at least 2 candidates weren't aware of maemo irc at all ;)11:46
DocScrutinizeranyway YW and welcome here, hope you're here to stay11:46
Estel_exactly, thats why I would have few irc-noobish questions to You after a while11:47
Estel_now, kinda shameless advert:11:47
DocScrutinizernp, just ask11:47
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DocScrutinizerthat's why we got chanops11:47
Estel_I'm running for Council, and I invite everyone to see (linked before) Council candidate's declarations, where You will find mine as well11:48
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Estel_I'm also going to stay here for at least a hour focused, and later, responding to pings, if anyone would like to talk with me about plans, ask question, criticize or overall communicate ;)11:48
Estel_I'm open for any question11:48
Estel_that's said, now my noobish questions to joerg :P11:49
Estel_if I got elected, I would like to be semi-always available on IRC, so people could ping me anytime just like You11:49
Estel_what would You recommend as a best technical way to achieve it conveniently?11:50
Estel_i.e. some lightweight irc client on my home's router?11:50
Estel_+ auto information when someone pings me or something similar to my nick?11:50
Estel_You know, to easily filter out direct questions from other IRC chat content, when asked while I'm out yet logged on IRC11:51
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HRH_H_CrabEstel_: if not a router something like a nslu2 or plug computer thingy.11:51
DocScrutinizerwell, the straight approach is to use any irc client and keep it running on your main machine11:51
Estel_up to now, I was just connecting from time to time, now I would like to make it permanen like in Council page "are usually on #maemo and happy to talk with You"11:52
HRH_H_Crabyeah unless you want to leave a proper machine on 24/711:52
Estel_the thing is that I *can't* leave my mine machine 24/7, due to various reasons11:53
DocScrutinizerif you don't want to keep a local machine running 24/7, then there's proxies like ZNC, to run them on any (linux) server11:53
HRH_H_Crabor get a cheap host somewhere.11:53
HRH_H_Crab(or even free)11:53 of them being that it's a notebook without proper way to reboot after power down etc + WOL works only from standby :/11:53
DocScrutinizerEstel_: I could even offer a ZNC account at my host11:53
Estel_on the other hand I got very reliable router, Linksys wrt54G running Tomato now - may switch to OpenWRT11:54
HRH_H_CrabEstel_: i doubt you will fit a client on wrt54g11:54
HRH_H_Crabiirc i maxed mine out just adding gkrellmd to it ;/11:54
Estel_I see, many interesting ways of achieving it11:54
DocScrutinizerEstel_: (my host) see DocScrutinizer5111:54
Estel_DocScrutinizer,  thanks. BTW, I must google first those things like ZNC, I mostly IRC moderate-newbie, sadly11:55
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Estel_HRH_H_Crab,  so wrt54g client isn't a option, understood11:56
HRH_H_Crabit might be11:56
DocScrutinizerit's simply you don't connect to freenode directly but rather to my server, where you may get an account11:56
HRH_H_Crabbut if im thinking of the same thing, there is very little free space left in the flash after youve got tomato / openwrt installed.11:56
Estel_space constrains,? I could solderf flash card slot to it11:56
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HRH_H_Crabwell, if you are going to go down that route, the worlds your lobster.11:57
HRH_H_Crabif you can even get 4GB on that thing you could run a whole debian mips install11:57
HRH_H_Crabin which case id use irssi in screen!11:57
Estel_DocScrutinizer,  so Your server connect on my behalf, and I connect to it. But, what are directly IRC-related benefits of ZNC proxy? intelligent searching etc?11:58
Estel_HRH_H_Crab,  yea, but RAM is a constraing11:58
HRH_H_Crabyou dont need much ram for irssi and screen.11:58
HRH_H_Crabim using an nslu2 for this chat.11:58
HRH_H_Crabits got 28MB of ram...11:58
DocScrutinizersimply buffering anything for you, automatic playback of buffer on reconnect, and of course 'you' always present on IRC11:58
Estel_I see.11:59
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HRH_H_CrabEstel_: the problem with the wrt54g is that the actual root filesystem is so small.11:59
Estel_DocScrutinizer,  nice.11:59
DocScrutinizerthe downside: *theoretically* I could sniff all your actions on IRC12:00
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Estel_of course, as with all proxy it's matter of trust. Well, my ISP could do it too :P12:00
DocScrutinizerso if you trust me less than your normal internet provider or freenode admins, you shouldn't accept my offer12:01
Estel_HRH_H_Crab,  it's true. But still, this little router is a beast12:01
Estel_before Pi it was best platform for many crazy projects, like flying wardriving copters or whatsnot12:01
HRH_H_CrabEstel_: i bought a wrt54gl and i was a bit "underwhelmed"12:01
Corsac(well, except that freenode admins and isp don't exactly know who Estel_ is and what interesting stuff he has to hide in his irc logs :)12:02
Estel_I trust You more than my internet provider(s), so I accept offer with great appreciation :)12:02
HRH_H_Crabthe limited flash and the limited bootloader annoyed me a bit.12:02
HRH_H_Crabinfact mine is currently in kind of a "bricked" state which is very annoying.12:02
Estel_hm, I see. You would need to flash via jtag, probably?12:03
HRH_H_Crabmy main experience with "misusing" stuff in that way is based around nslu212:03
HRH_H_Crabthey have a lot more potential than the linksys routers.12:03
Estel_Still, for 30 USD and wide availability, it was good piece of hardware12:03
HRH_H_Crabwhat they lack is a nice little built in 4 port switch! ;P12:03
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HRH_H_CrabEstel_: i'll show you something cool which would do what you want:12:04
Estel_need to google this nslu2 thing12:04
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HRH_H_Crabforget nslu212:04
Estel_DocScrutinizer,  just to be sure it got into proper address, Iaccept offer with much appreciation :)12:04
HRH_H_Crabits too old now.12:04
HRH_H_Crabthat thing i just linked...12:04
HRH_H_Crab256MB ram12:04
HRH_H_Crabnot a bad processor12:04
HRH_H_Crabcf flash card and usb.12:05
HRH_H_Crabbuilt in 3 port switch12:05
DocScrutinizerEstel_: I already sent a /query12:05
DocScrutinizercheck your other IRC window12:05
HRH_H_Crabthose guys ship them with bsd based "appliance" firewall software, but im seriously thinking of grabbing one and sticking debian and shorewall / shorewall6 on it.12:05
HRH_H_CrabEstel_: but, having said that, if you are even half serious about breaking out your soldering iron, and are happy using jtag (im not) you could build something much more fun with the wrt54g12:07
JaffaEstel_: Thanks for your work in actually organising things, and pushing for comms and transparency.12:11
JaffaEstel_: SD69's been making his best efforts at being on a mostly absent council, but I don't think he should be picking and choosing over the boring - but important - bits.12:11
JaffaBeing on the council isn't all going to Nokia World to represent the community at the launch of the N900, y'know12:12
Estel_Of course, I understand that.12:15
Estel_I agree, that there were things that could be done better, although, I take this 1 person out-of-5 work being quite exhausting12:15
Estel_so it's understandable to me, that at the end, everything started to collapse12:15
JaffaEstel_: It wasn't much better at the start, TBH12:16
JaffaEstel_: And if it's that much of a chore, hold the elections as soon as possible - or *ask* for help12:16
Estel_Here is don't agree completely, - despite fact that momcilo and jeremiah dissapeared just after election (sic!), communication was quite fluent, although, not all possible channels were used - here I agree12:17
Estel_as for help, I remember that I've opted for a way to delay with absent Council members problem12:18
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Estel_but there wasn't a will to push it further, overall12:18
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Estel_I'm sure one of many important things for new Council to do, will be fixing statute. Maybe not most important thing, yet, necessary12:20
Estel_we like to avoid such situation as with voting start now, + transparent way to replace absent Council members with new ones12:20
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Estel_it should be less of a problem now, as current candidates are very active, but still.12:20
Estel_BTW, it seems that crizises are motivating, sometimes ;)12:21
Estel_One thing I'm afraid of, is too slow pace of getting used to Council tools via new Council members - judging by candidates - me included - no matter what, most people will be 1st tiimers @ Council12:22
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Estel_after all, 6 months isn't very much time. We - or they - will need to unify some "tutorial" about Council tools. It may be used by new Counciles as well12:23
Estel_for example, see Council blog. Most people - honestly, me included - were not aware of it's existence at all, cause it wasnt used :P12:24
Estel_mixing it with Qgil pro-active stance, new Council will have *much* work to do12:24
Estel_which is good news ;)12:25
DocScrutinizerhi chem|st12:26
chem|stcandidates monologue^^12:29
Estel_erm, kinda12:29
Estel_candidate*, honestly ;)12:29
chem|stdoc you are not on the list and me neither... what happened to "us for presidents"12:29
Estel_but it was about Jaffa question/statement12:29
chem|stEstel_: I know, councelors or candidates in here is not a usual view in my window12:30
Estel_honestly, someone should kick DocScrutinizer in butt for not standing as candidate12:30
Estel_hehe. We will try to change that, although I hope for less monologues in future12:31
chem|stglad you are here... the important maemo stuff happens on IRC... like grillparties... fishing trips and the most important talk about relevance12:31
chem|stto much sarcasm?12:32
Estel_:P agree. Yet, talking seriously, TMO got strong position to, and I'm not talking about "future of maemo" threads :P12:32
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Estel_for example, the thing about CSSU - if it should mess with things not doable via extras, or provide FOSS replacement for closed bits too12:37
Estel_almost no one of interested people was able to attend irc meeting12:39
Estel_about it, yet, talking in TMO thread went very meritocraticly. Well, sad to use names, but usual "trolls" (joerg will know who I mean) seems to avoid developer threads12:40
JaffaEstel_: None of those "interested" people on TMO are capable of commenting sensibly, or - if they are - can do so via the mailing list.12:48
JaffaEstel_: "I wants haz my CSSU betterz!!11!" is not very useful.12:48
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ieatlintbut it is sensible12:56
Estel_Jaffa, have You read comment I'm reffering to?12:57
Estel_I don't think ivgalgvez or freemangordon are "I want haz better CSSU" people12:57
Estel_BTW, thing about "if CSSU should provide available FOSS replacements for closed bits, or be only a way to deliver things not suitable for extras" is rather about philosophy, not exact technical problems12:58
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JaffaEstel_: And they were both in the meeting. And no, without a URL I didn't know what you were referring to.12:59
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Estel_Strange, as ivgalvez have writtwen that hes sorry he couldn't attent irc meeting13:01
Estel_I think You're reffering to free talk that resulted in announced meeting later13:01
Estel_...which proves that communication problems also happen on IRC ;)13:01
JaffaEstel_: No, I misread the nick. freemangordon was there.13:03
JaffaBut I'm not sure how this related to the current council being ineffective in their most base responsibilities.13:04
Estel_not at all?it was related to what chem|st said13:06
Estel_and we were not arguing ;)13:06
Estel_I agree that most important "hot" development things happen on irc13:06
Estel_yet, I noticed that TMO is more conveinent for *some* things13:07
Estel_for obvious reasons (irc being mostly real-time etc)13:07
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Estel_I commented on Your statements quite a while ago, then, we moved to other topics13:10
Estel_BTW, I don't think we're thinking opposite here - it's just that we differ a little about view on reasons.13:11
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Estel_If anyone want to ask me a questions or generally chat about Council things, it's getting close to end real-time availability for now. Of course, I'll drop at later time13:17
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HurrianEstel_, has tmo gone crazy over the elections?13:20
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Estel_OK, see You later people!13:59
DocScrutinizercya Estel_13:59
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DocScrutinizerchem|st: sticky?14:19
DocScrutinizer(just a question, or rather suggestion)14:19
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DocScrutinizer[notice] Council votes already opened. Please check your mail, you should've received your token/ballot14:24
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fluxso, who should we vote?-P14:25
flux(and why)14:26
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Hurrianflux: your choice, who do you think has enough motivation to lead well into the next 6 months?14:29
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DocScrutinizerHurrian: flux: actually the council is not leading14:37
DocScrutinizerjust saying14:37
DocScrutinizerbasically the council doesn't decide anything14:37
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: re sticky I'd say no14:38
merlin1991-stable and -testing threads aren't stickies either14:38
DocScrutinizer(except such stuff like funding for speakers on maemo summit, device queue...)14:38
DocScrutinizermerlin1991: ok14:38
DocScrutinizermerlin1991: do you agree with freemangordon about too harsh wording of my post there? (keep in mind it's meant to be harsh, to *maybe* scare a few % of noobs. And that's for sure all it will do, if anything)14:40
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merlin1991I'd replace half baked with new and the THERE IS NO SUPPORT to something along the lines of SUPPORT ONLY HAPPENS IN HERE / IRC14:41
merlin1991and ofc the whole post is redundant except for the irc part ;)14:42
DocScrutinizersure thing14:45
DocScrutinizerI'm just scared we eventually end with another extras-devel14:46
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trxhm, i wasn't paying much attention to the candidates and elections14:50
trxgot any recommendations about who should i vote for? :)14:51
trxor NOT vote for14:51
trxthats easier :)14:51
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StyXmantrx: do NOT vote romney :-P14:53
StyXmanor zarkozy, but he already lost14:54
StyXmanor berlusconi, but the coward is not running again14:54
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trxgood suggestions, i'll take you advice :)14:55
trxi guess i'll randomize();14:56
StyXmanwell, if you don't know their platformes, then I htink it's better no t to vote14:57
trxthen i will read the wiki page first :/14:58
StyXmanyes, randomize() is not serious14:59
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: instead of stickieing devel I should make battery patch disappear^^15:23
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DocScrutinizerseems arie and estel got noticed by me for being somewhat active15:25
DocScrutinizerStyXman: trx: ^^^15:26
trxyeap, i noticed that too15:26
DocScrutinizermaybe checking tmo posts and #maemo* irclogs is more enlightenng than just reading the profiles on that wikipage15:27
* DocScrutinizer hides15:28
DocScrutinizerwell, I'm not running, I'm not supposed to keep tack of all available channels. I am allowed to ignore ML and tmo15:29
DocScrutinizera proper candidate shouldn't ignore any though15:29
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DocScrutinizerestel just an hour ago made sure he'll be available and monitoring this very channel15:30
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chem|stcannot remember back when there were councelors or candidates in here apart from myself, and I had no single minute in the 2 weeks of election, as I was occupied with an exhibition and a sailing turn15:32
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StyXmanDocScrutinizer: I'm not vote worthy, but thanks for the heads up anyways15:32
internetishardHow do you backup all the downloaded email?15:32
chem|stthough I had 100% time for counceling the day after election^^15:32
chem|stinternetishard: which downloaded emails?15:33
internetishardThe default email app. Where does it store everything?15:33
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chem|stsomewhere in /home/user lmc15:34
DocScrutinizerI bet in a backup.tgz you'll find all your mails15:34
internetishardI hope :P15:35
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chem|stin /home/user/.modest which should be in your backup15:37
internetishardOk, was suspicious  because there are only 4 checkboxes in the backup program15:37
chem|stI think you arent able to not to backup it15:38
chem|stso are your contacts15:38
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chem|stcreate a new backup and look yourself ;)15:40
internetishardjust checking. thanks mamn15:40
DocScrutinizerinternetishard: sftp://root@iron900/home/user/MyDocs/backups/BackupCSSU-1stUpdate/com_and_cal.zip15:41
chem|stDocScrutinizer: so it is bound to one of the hooks15:41
DocScrutinizererr tar.gz15:42
internetishardok ok15:45
internetishardhaha thanks15:45
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JaffaGeneralAntilles: ping18:18
GeneralAntillesJaffa, pong?18:18
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DocScrutinizer[general notice] voting for council election opened! Check your email! You should already have received your ballot (if you're eligible to vote, see ). also see  and
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DocScrutinizerdamn, I'm stupid. I don't understand how exactly the vote counting works :-S Could someone explain to me what's the meaning of e.g. >> Your vote will be counted for your first choice candidate as long as he is still in the race, and when he is eliminated, your vote will transfer to the next preference candidate still in the race.<<23:55
DocScrutinizerWTF will "eliminate" a candidate?23:56
Cor-Aihaha fight to the death!23:56
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Sicelomaybe getting few votes? :\23:56
DocScrutinizerSicelo: you're starting the counting with *all* candidates got "few" votes23:57
Woody14619My understanding is that it's a run-off model election.  So, you can vote for all 7 in the order you want them.23:57
DocScrutinizerto be precise: zarro23:58
DocScrutinizerWoody14619: yes, but counting is obscure to me23:58
Siceloseems to me the statement refers to what will happen at the end ... so that if your first preferred candidate got few votes, your next prefered has a better chance, etc23:58
DocScrutinizeryes, I get that, I can read23:59
DocScrutinizerand that's what they say. What I don't get is the exact way votes are counted23:59

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