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| * Sicelo wonders what would happen if he completely disabled all trackerd options in tracker.cfg | 00:09 | |
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| plate | Photos wont see new stuff you took, Media Player will report 0 music files, etc | 00:12 |
|---|---|---|
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| plate | you can even apt-get remove trackerd | 00:12 |
| plate | as long as you can navitage to ~/DCIM on your own and use mplaye ror something its fine | 00:12 |
| plate | i do notice it likes to chew 100% CPU scanning files i could care less about being indexed, so removed it long ago | 00:12 |
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| SpeedEvil | you can configure it to be _much_ less aggressive, so it doesn't scan media you don't want it to | 00:19 |
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| poro | id3 tags are empty in 50% of files anyway. and wrong in about 25% of the rest | 00:21 |
| Sicelo | yeah.. that's what i've just done. for example, i don't see why in the world it indexes MyDocs/.documents/ | 00:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ~jrtools | 01:33 |
| infobot | it has been said that jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools | 01:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | sed -i -e "s/Throttle=0/Throttle=10/" /home/user/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg | 01:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Sicelo: tracker is linux' spotlight | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | alas there's not a single app I know of that'd actually *use* all that "index all my `PC` please" functions of tracker | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | if there'd be such an app, you should be able to find all mp3, all videos, all pictures, pdf, plain files that have "foobar" *somewhere* in title, name, body, or - with right pluging - even in audio songtext (/me idly wonders if tracker project already has a speech2text indexer plugin) | 01:39 |
| merlin1991 | as far as I see it tracker actually needs only 1 fix to work proper on maemo | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | webpages, I forgot | 01:40 |
| merlin1991 | realize that vfat got unmounted and not all files are gone | 01:40 |
| merlin1991 | in other words don't remove umounted media but flag as currently not avaiable | 01:40 |
| merlin1991 | which would solve the silly I'm gonna rescan and reextract all your media NAO cuz you plugged out the usb cable | 01:41 |
| * DocScrutinizer can't think of *any* fix that would make tracker "work proper" | 01:41 | |
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| DocScrutinizer | merlin1991: "stop trackerd" in ke-recv umount /media/card" script | 01:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | sounds like a patch for CSSU | 01:43 |
| merlin1991 | Imo tracker works perfect as long as its database grows when you contiounsly add media to it | 01:44 |
| merlin1991 | as soon as it wipes its database due to a umount it's ofc a huge mess | 01:45 |
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| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: I thought more along the lines of making tracker recognize fs | 01:45 |
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| merlin1991 | ofc on maemo5 we can simply stop tracker and start again upon remount since we don't index anything else, but in gereral I think it makes more sense to have tracker assign media not only to a path but also to mountpoint and realize when a mount is missing | 01:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | errr | 01:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | have fun! | 01:47 |
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| merlin1991 | shut up ;) | 01:47 |
| * DocScrutinizer mumbles "bindmount" and "empty mountpoint dirs", and "fake fstab" | 01:48 | |
| merlin1991 | hehe | 01:48 |
| merlin1991 | but yeah since we're going to ship improved ke-recv anyway we could add the stop trackerd option | 01:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | x act ly | 01:48 |
| * merlin1991 needs to investigate upon the proper way to pause tracker | 01:49 | |
| * merlin1991 darkly remembers something about tracker-processes having proper flags | 01:49 | |
| javispedro | hm? | 01:49 |
| javispedro | <merlin1991> as soon as it wipes its database due to a umount it's ofc a huge mess | 01:49 |
| javispedro | tracker doesn't know what you did while the fs was unmounted | 01:50 |
| merlin1991 | yes but it could realize "this mount point is gone, data could be temporarily unavaiable" | 01:50 |
| merlin1991 | instead of just wiping everything from it's database that was there | 01:50 |
| merlin1991 | and reindexding upon remount | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | it will reindex anyway, upon mount | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | it has to | 01:51 |
| javispedro | because it does not know what you did while it was unmounted | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | it could skip known files though | 01:51 |
| javispedro | it would have to md5 them | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | assuming they didn'T change meta content | 01:52 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: just let me ask you what does tracker do when you reboot? | 01:52 |
| javispedro | or do some other kind of check, so it would be as slow if not actually slower than just parsing metadata again | 01:52 |
| merlin1991 | it remembers it has files and it remembers timestamps | 01:52 |
| merlin1991 | you can force tracker to reindex files by simply touching them | 01:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | javispedro: MEH | 01:52 |
| merlin1991 | so it compares timestamps on files | 01:53 |
| javispedro | merlin1991, timestamps are not realiable when you put windows in the equation | 01:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | tracker *should* already store full pathname, it also could store size, and inode nr, and ctime/mtime | 01:53 |
| merlin1991 | it could do just that upon remount and only reindex what is nerwer | 01:53 |
| merlin1991 | fsckd windows | 01:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | a 2 stat() is always faster than a id3tag-grep | 01:54 |
| merlin1991 | what doc said :) | 01:54 |
| javispedro | I am quite happy with tracker performance on the n900 btw, I have around ~20GiB of m4as and it tackes around 2:30 | 01:54 |
| javispedro | (minutes, not hours :) ) | 01:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | or the synonym on pdf files, for "all words >3 chars, that are not on blacklist" | 01:54 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer, I was thinking about md5, not stat(9 | 01:54 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: I've noticed tracker indexes music quite fast | 01:54 |
| merlin1991 | it really sucks extracting video shots | 01:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | BWAHAHA | 01:55 |
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| merlin1991 | whenever I remove my video collection from the n900 reindexing is ultrafast | 01:55 |
| merlin1991 | but if I readd it tracker is busy for 10 mins min | 01:55 |
| merlin1991 | and I'm not talking about 200 movies but like 10 episodes of some series | 01:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | When I copied ~25GB of mp3 to my eMMC, trackerd amused me with a ETA guestimate that incresed from "ca. 5 min" to "ca 30 min" over time | 01:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | in the end it was more than 30 | 01:56 |
| javispedro | hm | 01:56 |
| javispedro | it doesn't reindex anything at all when using usb mass storage here | 01:57 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: it always does for me | 01:57 |
| merlin1991 | also it depends on what tags you have | 01:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | *NOW* it also doesn't here ;-P | 01:57 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer, your evilness :) | 01:57 |
| merlin1991 | for example album art in your mp3s can kill it if the size exceeds some smaller values | 01:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | n8 folks | 01:58 |
| javispedro | embedded album art is the devil | 01:58 |
| javispedro | frigging touchpad wants it | 01:58 |
| merlin1991 | on the other hand how do you get tracker to add proper album art to songs? | 01:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | tracker too | 01:58 |
| merlin1991 | so far I only was successfull with embedded album art | 01:58 |
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| javispedro | folder.jpg, album.jpg | 01:58 |
| merlin1991 | tracker hapily ignored ANY kind of .jpg in the folder | 01:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | haha | 01:59 |
| merlin1991 | but instantly extracted embedded art to .mediaartlocal :P | 01:59 |
| javispedro | I thought my patches for this had gotten into the CSSU? | 01:59 |
| * merlin1991 doesn't remember those patches | 01:59 | |
| merlin1991 | and we never patched tracker | 01:59 |
| javispedro | http://depot.javispedro.com/nit/tracker/ | 01:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | duh | 01:59 |
| javispedro | that is PR1.3 tracker packages, and the patches | 01:59 |
| * DocScrutinizer grabs the whip | 02:00 | |
| DocScrutinizer | ;-D | 02:00 |
| merlin1991 | it seems loads of patches have been missed over time | 02:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | mooooooooohammmmmad | 02:00 |
| merlin1991 | I've been collecting random patches from all over to throw at mag when he shows up again | 02:00 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: thanks will add them to my todo | 02:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | thumbs up | 02:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | merlin1991 for imperator | 02:01 |
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| javispedro | konttori once being optimistic and saying that they planned to backport the harmattan tracker to fremantle just came to mind | 02:02 |
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| * javispedro goes find the "Times have changed" song from Watchmen | 02:03 | |
| DocScrutinizer | we got a strange lil kingdom - javispedro is our merlin, merlin1991 is our knight, and the youngsters are the evil old emperors that block every progress | 02:03 |
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| javispedro | and our local Doctor :) | 02:04 |
| javispedro | actually the fault is mine, I said on february 2011 that I'd merge them into the cssu... | 02:06 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: would you prefer todo your own git commits to push to http://gitorious.org/community-ssu or should I just slap the patches into a commit each and push? | 02:06 |
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| merlin1991 | also I'm not really sure what the realignore.patch does :P | 02:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | ignore reality? ;-P | 02:08 |
| merlin1991 | could be usefull, but I don't think that is what it is :P | 02:08 |
| javispedro | tracker didn't ignore folders from "removable media" even if you added it to the config file | 02:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | indeed | 02:09 |
| javispedro | I couldn't make it ignore my SDK dir when I mounted it from the SDK for ex. | 02:09 |
| javispedro | *from the SD | 02:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | tracker is stinking can of worms | 02:09 |
| javispedro | fremantle one was rushed | 02:10 |
| javispedro | the bugs fixed by the above patches are absolutely trivial and all of the issues were fixed in harmattan by the time I made them | 02:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, the concept got invented by a 10 year old on LSD & Jaegermeister | 02:11 |
| javispedro | in fact I'm quite sure konttori must still have the backported tracker version somewhere, but it never got released because of the usual burocracy things | 02:11 |
| javispedro | *bureaucracy | 02:11 |
| javispedro | like the n800 bme :( | 02:11 |
| merlin1991 | well | 02:11 |
| merlin1991 | if he can set the code to the wild, cssu is always happy about poper codedumps ;) | 02:12 |
| javispedro | oh, you have quite a large codedump... | 02:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | a nice thought to go to sleep - some apocalypse got forestalled by buerocracy | 02:12 |
| javispedro | it's called harmattan, or maemo6 | 02:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | g'nite | 02:13 |
| javispedro | gnite dockane_ | 02:13 |
| javispedro | oops | 02:13 |
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| merlin1991 | well javispedro that codedump isn't exactly easy to use ;) | 02:13 |
| javispedro | merlin1991, yeah =) | 02:13 |
| merlin1991 | on the other hand already backported code that just lies somewhere can always be easily included in cssu :D | 02:14 |
| javispedro | but it's an example that certain "codedumps" might very well be useless for certain purposes like this one | 02:14 |
| javispedro | (that woody guy on TMO is going to kill me for this) | 02:14 |
| merlin1991 | oh that woody guy who currently joined the flamewar vs mag? | 02:15 |
| * DocScrutinizer trows a few nice forkbombs and GPIO-shortcircuit collisions' codedrops on merlin1991 | 02:15 | |
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| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: you said gn8, get autta here ;) | 02:15 |
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| javispedro | he never sleeps | 02:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer | wistleblower! | 02:16 |
| merlin1991 | gotta love it how the "why people don't use cssu" got far more posts in short time than the actual cssu topics :D | 02:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | ohnoes, a tmo trollthread? XP | 02:17 |
| merlin1991 | it's more of a general missinformation thread | 02:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | aka trolling | 02:18 |
| merlin1991 | but I don't think adding my 2 cent there with proper info will have any chance vs all the other "cssu is THE EVIL" posts | 02:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | not *good* trolling | 02:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | just post the URL on e.g 4chan, so the email addr got properly harvested by spam spiders | 02:19 |
| javispedro | 4chan quality trolling? | 02:19 |
| merlin1991 | nah | 02:19 |
| javispedro | saying that IS trolling | 02:19 |
| merlin1991 | it's above 4chan quality trolling, they still use full sentences | 02:19 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: any other patch you might have written that never made it into cssu? :P | 02:20 |
| javispedro | my memory is limited | 02:20 |
| javispedro | I don't think so | 02:20 |
| javispedro | probably some to SDL but I don't remember any from the top of my head | 02:20 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: just checked, connected n900 in mass storage, unplugged and tracker-indexer had its fun | 02:26 |
| * merlin1991 wonders though why it was that fast | 02:27 | |
| merlin1991 | I do have 15 gb in .sounds | 02:27 |
| merlin1991 | maybe because I have swap on the sdcard? | 02:28 |
| merlin1991 | javispedro: what does tracker prioritice? folder.jpg or embedded art? | 02:29 |
| javispedro | don't remember | 02:30 |
| javispedro | probably embedded | 02:30 |
| javispedro | I do know that it priorizes .mediaartlocal and whatever is on XDG cache dir though | 02:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | merlin1991: maybe it already checks mtime of dirs | 02:32 |
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| merlin1991 | epic fail thread: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1149263 | 06:14 |
| merlin1991 | a thread that links to a blog post which in turn links back to another thread on tmo | 06:14 |
| merlin1991 | lulz? | 06:14 |
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| Macer | hello | 10:07 |
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| infobot | Hi there, see: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1148886&postcount=668. Is the proposition of sponsoring server for few months still actual? | 10:43 |
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| crashanddie | merry christmas, happy new year, and jolly easter | 11:37 |
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| TimmyT | i have installed vlc on debian chroot, because i needed better sound and graphic equalizer, but it seems vlc cant connect to the output device to play the sound. how can i solve this issue? | 11:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | crashanddie: HEYA! | 12:43 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | WTF?! whom I need to set on infobot's ignorelist??? | 12:45 |
| * DocScrutinizer51 glares at estel | 12:45 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | "hi there" what a nice greeting ?-/ | 12:46 |
| jaska | haha | 12:49 |
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| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer, what's up :) | 12:54 |
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| Shapeshifter | what's the best way of cloning an existing maemo installation to a new n900? | 13:31 |
| Shapeshifter | my current one is dying | 13:32 |
| Shapeshifter | quite a few config tweaks and stuff. would be best if I could just flash it in one go, dd style | 13:33 |
| dm8tbr | I remember hearing about a backup tool that gets you almost everything | 13:36 |
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| Sicelo | BackupMenu | 13:59 |
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| Sicelo | as long as u take care to flash/install same kernel | 15:05 |
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| npm | is there an app where we can use our old broken-screen n950's as a remote door video intercom ( streaming video from camera over http to webserver running on desktop,and maybe using deskltop mic throuh html5 to send voice to n900 loudspeakers to "talk back" ??) | 17:39 |
| npm | oops i mean n900's | 17:39 |
| npm | the n950 is sitting in front of me, screen unbroken (knock gorrilla glass) | 17:39 |
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| SpeedEvil | npm: :/ | 17:40 |
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| SpeedEvil | does skype do video? | 17:40 |
| npm | hmm yeah, that would do it too. | 17:40 |
| npm | yes it does | 17:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | Also - there are lots of leetle video screens you could plug into the composite port | 17:41 |
| npm | i guess i could setup a separate skype account on it... right now it's my downstairs skype/gmail ringer | 17:41 |
| npm | the n900 | 17:41 |
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| npm | SpeedEvil: yeah i plugged my tv in back when it was working reliablu | 17:42 |
| npm | y | 17:42 |
| npm | i'm phasing out tv | 17:42 |
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| npm | but yeah i guess an existing voip solution would do it | 17:43 |
| SpeedEvil | I do not have a working TV at the moment | 17:43 |
| npm | i been playing w/ html5 being served off the handfset to a browser | 17:43 |
| SpeedEvil | In principle I could find the digibox, or my dttv adaptor, manufacture an ariel... | 17:44 |
| SpeedEvil | And get the TV out of the attic | 17:44 |
| npm | now that i can stream from gstreamer over the web, i was thinking to stream from the camera | 17:44 |
| SpeedEvil | but get_iplayer works for me | 17:44 |
| npm | i have two analog and two digital video encoders as pci/pci-e on my desktop | 17:45 |
| SpeedEvil | http://dx.com/4-3-lcd-monitor-visual-reversing-vehicles-reverse-camera-ntsc-pal-dc12v-67482 | 17:45 |
| SpeedEvil | I was meaning | 17:45 |
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| RST38h | "Metro will drive the new magic across all of our user experiences. Metro means that 1+1 really does equal 3." | 17:46 |
| npm | hmm that's an interesting side-use, as i wanted a small crt to hook it to as it is currently located in the kitchen w/ loudspeakers | 17:46 |
| RST38h | -- Steve Ballmer | 17:46 |
| npm | that's the kind of math they use in their pointer arithmetic | 17:47 |
| RST38h | "Somebody call Eddie Murphy and Arsenio Hall. Nokia Lumia is Coming to America and it's fit for a prince." | 17:47 |
| RST38h | (whatever he meant by that) | 17:47 |
| npm | the worst part about the lumia is the freakin browser that can't actually view half the websites and is totally html5 incapable | 17:47 |
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| RST38h | npm: Oh, don't remind me | 17:48 |
| npm | when will firefox/fennec be available :-) | 17:48 |
| RST38h | npm: Have been setting it up yesterday and still feel like an inanimate object has raped me | 17:48 |
| RST38h | WinCE version of IE...bleah | 17:48 |
| npm | i'm using it as my main phone to save my precious from wear and tear and crackage | 17:48 |
| RST38h | npm: Just get a Symbian phone, they are more functional and pleasant to use | 17:49 |
| npm | i will at some point, for my qt ambassador project, except i have to take a bunch of screenshots/videos first and i'm in the middle of developing | 17:49 |
| npm | (for http://code.google.com/p/voicetogoog/ ) | 17:50 |
| RST38h | No USB storage. No video playback. No applications in the store. No decent web browser. No way to configure that prime color square hell of home screen. | 17:50 |
| npm | i figure if i wait a little bit longer the c7 will have belle on it | 17:50 |
| RST38h | No decent games, for Tentacled's sake! | 17:50 |
| RST38h | npm: Anna is fine | 17:50 |
| npm | actually the square colors can be configured | 17:51 |
| RST38h | npm: Shit, old ^3 is fine in comparison | 17:51 |
| npm | i can't remember how because i don't care | 17:51 |
| RST38h | npm: Yes. you get to select from 16 tear-my-eyes-out colors. | 17:51 |
| RST38h | npm: But it is a progress: they are now offering the whole EGA palette rather than CGA! | 17:51 |
| npm | there are some useful apps, and it rounds out the n950 functionality nicely | 17:52 |
| RST38h | Have I forgotten "no ebook reader"? =) | 17:52 |
| npm | which is why i wish there was a vmware solution (like on those new android announces) to swithc between mango and meego | 17:52 |
| npm | best of both worlds | 17:52 |
| RST38h | npm: What is missing from n950 that this abomination has? | 17:52 |
| npm | plus you could run mango on an 1g ram phone :-) | 17:53 |
| npm | netflix? | 17:53 |
| RST38h | Why do you need netflix, anyway? | 17:53 |
| RST38h | There is torrent. | 17:53 |
| npm | various drm'd media distrubutions | 17:53 |
| RST38h | Again, torrent. | 17:53 |
| npm | well that's what the n950 can do | 17:53 |
| npm | but i didn't have my heart sink when i dropped the lumia this morning... i was like... "that's what you're here for" | 17:54 |
| RST38h | it is still a very nicely built device | 17:54 |
| npm | and works very well as my daily phone on a phone-only sim | 17:55 |
| RST38h | but it basically has no platform. you can't call this bluish square menu a platform. | 17:55 |
| RST38h | can't even develop for it in any language used by normal people! | 17:55 |
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| npm | gotta run... | 17:57 |
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| Estel_ | NIN101, You've deleted Your page about cryptsetup and truecrypt tricks, so I'm unable to check it - which module isn't included in kp, Serpent? | 19:49 |
| Estel_ | AFAIK AES is compiled in kernel natively, Twofish via module, and Serpent isn't XTS at all? | 19:50 |
| NIN101 | XTS is just a block cipher mode, AES is compiled into the kernel =y, Twofish as a module =M, and Serpent isn't in power kernel. | 19:50 |
| Estel_ | thanks. Hm, I've found Your post in kp thread | 19:51 |
| Estel_ | that for kp47 You've compiled module for Serpent | 19:51 |
| Estel_ | wasn't it included? | 19:52 |
| NIN101 | as I said, Serpent isn't in powerkernel, and never was. | 19:52 |
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| Estel_ | ok, I got it, but why? | 19:52 |
| Estel_ | if You've prepared it? | 19:52 |
| NIN101 | prepared? | 19:53 |
| Estel_ | any ratoonale given vs including, or just Your post got bloated by other posts? | 19:53 |
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| NIN101 | compiled, nothing prepared, ask Pali to include it. | 19:53 |
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| Estel_ | NIN101 - I've compiled modules for the serpent cipher and the block cipher mode XTS | 19:53 |
| Estel_ | ok | 19:53 |
| Estel_ | thanks | 19:53 |
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| NIN101 | xts was more important for truecrypt than serpent. | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | yea I know what xts is | 19:54 |
| NIN101 | also it is known to be slower than AES.... | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | true | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | the funny thing is that while benchmarking speed in truecrypt | 19:54 |
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| NIN101 | I know... :-) | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | using it's option to benchmark | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | Serpent got higher. Bug? | 19:54 |
| Estel_ | affected by XTS working for aes or twofish? | 19:55 |
| Estel_ | or it's really faster on our device? :P | 19:55 |
| Estel_ | BTW, You may be sure that Your swap encrypted all the time isn't affecting speed in any way, most of situations | 19:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | Lava_Croft: bonus points for gibberish private wuery to ask for -q | 19:56 |
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| Estel_ | 200 mhz processor have higher flowthrough with AES than our flash storage can handle | 19:56 |
| Estel_ | so, overclocked or not, encryption on the fly doesn't affect our read/write speed at all | 19:56 |
| Estel_ | *unless* device is on 100% CPU usage | 19:57 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~seen Lava_Croft | 19:57 |
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| Estel_ | cause encrypting uses CPU, obviously, so fully occupied starts to encrypt/decrypt slower | 19:57 |
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| infobot | lava_croft is currently on #maemo (2h 14m 40s), last said: 'flasher works fine on windows'. | 19:57 |
| freemangordon | Estel_, doesn't omap have cryptographic HW? | 19:58 |
| NIN101 | omap_aes would be interesting indeed | 19:58 |
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| Estel_ | freemangordon, no idea, You tell me? If yes, any access to it? | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | Does it have kernel-support? | 19:58 |
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| freemangordon | Hmm, will google these days | 19:59 |
| Estel_ | yea, trying already | 19:59 |
| Estel_ | the problem is that even it if have it, I have no idea how we can use it | 19:59 |
| Estel_ | probably through some kernel module? | 19:59 |
| Estel_ | here my guessworking potential ends :P | 19:59 |
| freemangordon | :D, ok, will check what is there and what not | 20:00 |
| NIN101 | http://maemo.org/community/maemo-developers/n900_aes_and_sha1-md5_hw_acceleration_drivers/ | 20:00 |
| Estel_ | thanks freemangordon ;) | 20:00 |
| Lava_Croft | DocScrutinizer51: i just go to the source | 20:00 |
| Lava_Croft | :) | 20:00 |
| Lava_Croft | thanks | 20:00 |
| freemangordon | NIN101, someone tried those? | 20:01 |
| NIN101 | yes, read the thread ;) | 20:03 |
| Estel_ | would be nice to include it in KP | 20:04 |
| freemangordon | :D yeah, end the conclusion is that those slower that SW | 20:04 |
| Estel_ | lol | 20:04 |
| freemangordon | *those are | 20:04 |
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| Estel_ | lovely | 20:04 |
| NIN101 | anyway, I don't care too much about it, it's fast anyway. | 20:04 |
| Estel_ | we always need to care, if it can be faster ;) | 20:04 |
| Estel_ | but, it seems it won't be in this case | 20:04 |
| freemangordon | Well, it is not only about speed, I need to read a bit about what exactly security is there in omap, because if we can securely store keys, it is another kind of beer | 20:06 |
| Estel_ | true | 20:06 |
| Estel_ | also, maybe there is a bug in backporting? | 20:06 |
| Estel_ | there was no conclusion on *why* it's slower | 20:06 |
| freemangordon | could be | 20:06 |
| Estel_ | see NIN101, how much benefits come from simply scp'ing something into -devel. A chain of events ;P | 20:07 |
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| Estel_ | BTW, freemangordon, have Your read yesterday's log of CSSU thread? | 20:07 |
| Estel_ | it seem that merlin19* is happy about cooperatiown with X-Fade, sic | 20:08 |
| Estel_ | not that his request was solved | 20:08 |
| Estel_ | he just doesn't seem to be blacklisted by X-Fade as rest of #maemo and X-fade actually responds to him | 20:08 |
| Estel_ | wedll, some people doesn't need much to be happy... | 20:09 |
| Estel_ | anyway, merlin19* doesn't understand why we wqant to move repos out from Nokia's protecting wings, which left me quite... confused? ;) | 20:09 |
| Estel_ | anyway, process it still ongoing | 20:09 |
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| freemangordon | Estel_, TBH I would prefer to stay with Nokia if possible, moving away will fragment the community even more | 20:11 |
| freemangordon | Will read logs later | 20:11 |
| freemangordon | so merlin1991 will become CSSU-T maintainer too? | 20:11 |
| merlin1991 | Estel_: the thing is nokia is providing the infrastructure and some manpower + the official "maemo" sign on top | 20:13 |
| plate | well wheres MAemo6/harmattan for my n900 then | 20:13 |
| plate | sounds like they aint doing much :P | 20:13 |
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| Lava_Croft | if it aint really broken, do not try to fix it until its time | 20:13 |
| Lava_Croft | and its not the end of 2012, yet | 20:13 |
| merlin1991 | obviously things could be better, but that can be worked one without jumping to a completely new system | 20:14 |
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| merlin1991 | Lava_Croft: it's also been stated that the cobs / apps.formeego.com stuff might move into maemo.org | 20:14 |
| merlin1991 | which in turn would most probably end up in nokia funding beyond end of 2012 | 20:14 |
| Lava_Croft | merlin1991: yeah, but i talk from current reality, not possibility:) | 20:16 |
| freemangordon | (nod) | 20:16 |
| Lava_Croft | afaik they only stated for real funding stops at the end of 2012 | 20:16 |
| Lava_Croft | of course more things are happening in the background | 20:16 |
| merlin1991 | Lava_Croft: even that isn't the full reality | 20:16 |
| merlin1991 | what was stated is that funding till end of 2012 is there | 20:16 |
| merlin1991 | futher stuff has to be decided | 20:17 |
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| * DocScrutinizer51 still is amazed about thebig word "funding", given you can get decent root servers for less than 100 bucks per month | 20:18 | |
| freemangordon | Lava_Croft, I is better to have "maemo" on top of what we are doing. And really, if apps.meego.com (or whatever the name is) becomes a part of maemo.org, that means funding will be prolonged fot at least 3 more years | 20:19 |
| plate | a single draemhost VPS should handle all the maemo users still left anyways | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | incl gigabit backbone with unlimited traffic | 20:19 |
| freemangordon | yeah | 20:19 |
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| Tofe | Hello ! | 20:19 |
| Estel_ | I would "trade" maemo name for properly contactable repos maintaioner every day | 20:20 |
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| Estel_ | being tied with ZNokia ikn *any* way always = | 20:20 |
| freemangordon | That could be solved without going out of maemo.org | 20:20 |
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| Estel_ | 1) Council without any tools to do anything alone, yet being community representative | 20:20 |
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| freemangordon | Lets wait for council meeting, hopefuly some decisions will be made (looking at agenda) | 20:21 |
| Estel_ | 2) Nokia replying to everything that their lack manpower due to laid offs | 20:21 |
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| Estel_ | 3) waiting for every crucial response for at least month, from Nokia | 20:21 |
| Estel_ | 4) Nokia paying for service guys for maemo.org + Nokia not controlling it = service guys got us in ass | 20:22 |
| Tofe | Does someone has ever had problems with the MfE parameters being not saved ? Especially, the parameter which says "I want to sync my calendar"... The checkbox always goes back to uncheck after having synchronized the calendar... | 20:22 |
| Estel_ | I'll stop here, as counting like that is sadening | 20:22 |
| freemangordon | Tofe, never (not using it) | 20:22 |
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| freemangordon | Estel_, still there is a chance, lets decide after council meeting | 20:23 |
| Estel_ | of course, I'm not calling for arms and cutlasses ;) | 20:23 |
| freemangordon | And our current problem is only partially with Nokia | 20:24 |
| Estel_ | if Nokia can change way they're supervising support for maemo infrastructure, who knows | 20:24 |
| Lava_Croft | Tofe: it works fine here, but im not using the feature you describe:< | 20:24 |
| Estel_ | yet, as DocScrutinizer correctly stated, hosting for such small community is cheap | 20:24 |
| freemangordon | yeah | 20:24 |
| Tofe | I guess MfE settings are stored in the .qmf/qmailstore.db, I could try to look into that... | 20:24 |
| freemangordon | bbl | 20:24 |
| Estel_ | we lose much because deciding people aren't part of community and aren't interested either | 20:24 |
| Estel_ | we gain... 100 bucks for hosting? | 20:25 |
| * merlin1991 wouldn't be able to set up a maemo extras like system with a -devel and stable repo and all the voting and other stuff | 20:26 | |
| Estel_ | merlin1991, see "Ask the Council" thread | 20:26 |
| Estel_ | many propositions there | 20:26 |
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| Estel_ | btw, thats why it'*s said to mirror infrastructure first | 20:26 |
| plate | my maemo is so frankenstein about 80% of it is from sid. eventualy i''l eliminate the other 20% | 20:26 |
| Estel_ | bleeding edge people would use new one | 20:26 |
| Macer | hm | 20:26 |
| Macer | i'm trying out tmux | 20:27 |
| Estel_ | and possibly fall back to old if encounter problems, until hammered | 20:27 |
| merlin1991 | realisticly someone will show up todo all this, realize 3 months laters that it is work after all and we're back to square 1 | 20:27 |
| Estel_ | IMO it's worth the work | 20:27 |
| Estel_ | well, we can always just sit apatheticaly and die | 20:28 |
| Estel_ | due to developers frustration (see problems with kp and repos, + CSSU testing now) | 20:28 |
| Estel_ | due to Nokia taking plug without preparations from our side | 20:28 |
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| Estel_ | etc. | 20:28 |
| Estel_ | Have You seen any project that doesn't require work? | 20:29 |
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| Estel_ | it would be sin in any religion and philosophy to waste our community potential. | 20:29 |
| Lava_Croft | plate: someone should write some script to sid-ify the n900 | 20:29 |
| Macer | tmux is interesting | 20:29 |
| merlin1991 | Estel_: *if* nokia pulls the plug we can depend on a notice about 3 months earlier | 20:29 |
| Estel_ | yea, so why we can't prepare earlier? | 20:29 |
| Estel_ | in case of relatkions with Nokia going bad, we can switch not waiting for their plug | 20:30 |
| Estel_ | also, 3 months isn't so long | 20:30 |
| Estel_ | for hardening bugs of infrastructure swap | 20:30 |
| Estel_ | also, community is more motivated if *we* take initiative and do something, not because someone pulled the plug above our heads | 20:30 |
| Estel_ | LibreOffice was created because Oracle was bitchy, not because they pulled plug. Yea, it's different scale of userbase etc, but main things are similar | 20:31 |
| Estel_ | except for fact that Oracle was plain hostile, and Nokia is plain unexisting, at least in our universe | 20:31 |
| Estel_ | "ecosystem" ;P | 20:32 |
| merlin1991 | as you stated earlier I'm quite happy with the infrastructure, if the situation with the maemo.org maintainer gets better then I see no point at all to move | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | "ecosystem" ;P | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | ask Pali if he's also happy | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | probably like hell. | 20:32 |
| Estel_ | IMO ideas about jumping to Debian infrastructure (they would not notice our resource usage, to be honest - a scale) | 20:33 |
| Estel_ | aren't stupid | 20:33 |
| Estel_ | well, there is no other working alternative to non-FOSS android | 20:33 |
| Estel_ | Mer is still infant. Older, but infant | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | webOS - hahaha! | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | it's just that sticking with semi-working, yet comfortable - due to others (Nokia) doing paper work - things is quite a potential waste | 20:34 |
| Estel_ | anyway, I'm really of now | 20:35 |
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| ruskie | http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Tizen-alpha-released/ | 20:55 |
| Estel_ | someone remember how much time we have to council meeting? | 20:55 |
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| Estel_ | can't check myself now - browser port blocked and I don't have time to tunnel it :P | 20:56 |
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| RST38h | ...Dear Tentacled One, may Your sleep be eternal and Your wrath terminal! Please, hunt down all GNOME3 developers and devour them in the most painful way possible! While you are at it, swallow Lennart, just as an appetizer. Thanks. | 21:46 |
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| mgedmin | I sense some bitterness in you ;) | 21:47 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: I have been forced to upgrade from Lucid to Precise Pangolin | 21:47 |
| mgedmin | who forced you? | 21:48 |
| javispedro | before the tentacled one eats them, let me whip them for a while | 21:48 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: So, instead of Gnome2, I now have a choice between Unity and GNOME3. | 21:48 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: QEmu did | 21:48 |
| mgedmin | that must be fun | 21:48 |
| mgedmin | I tried both on oneiric | 21:48 |
| mgedmin | QtSDK forced me to use Unity ;) | 21:48 |
| mgedmin | (when the buggy Qt theme or whatever eats all the memory with huge pixmaps, Mutter crashes. Compiz copes.) | 21:49 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: About as much fun as choosing between dog shit and cat shit for your breakfast | 21:49 |
| javispedro | this new year gentoo scared the hell out of me by putting a news item saying that gnome3 was unmasked | 21:49 |
| mgedmin | "would you rather type with your left hand chopped off or your right hand chopped off?" | 21:49 |
| javispedro | fortunately, it is still not in stable so I'm happy =) | 21:49 |
| RST38h | To polish things up, i got acquainted with Lumia 800. | 21:50 |
| mgedmin | unity is bearable, just... buggy... | 21:50 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: both are incredible shit. I have got Xfce now, but it is not fully integrated with Ubuntu | 21:50 |
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| javispedro | in the meanwhile, MS already collecting royalties for 70% of android shipments in the US | 22:06 |
| javispedro | when will they just drop WP7 (and Nokia) and instead call themselves "The Android Company" | 22:06 |
| fredddd | What gives them the right to collect royalties regarding 70% of Android base mobile devices within the US? | 22:07 |
| fredddd | And who made that claim? | 22:07 |
| fredddd | And what makes that other 30% special enough to not fall under the same jurisdiction? | 22:08 |
| javispedro | the source is MS itself: http://www.microsoft.com/Presspass/press/2012/jan12/01-12LGPR.mspx | 22:08 |
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| javispedro | basically, since all of the current andridiot manufacturers did deals with the devil in the past (all of them made winmob devices at some stage), the devil is now coming back and grabbing them all by the balls | 22:10 |
| fredddd | In short, how does this Microsoft LG deal influence Google's Android operating system regarding royalties? | 22:10 |
| fredddd | As far as I am concerned, LG has shit to say over something Google has created. | 22:11 |
| javispedro | .oO( ? ) | 22:11 |
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| javispedro | read the press release. it's plain extortion -- but they're trying to do it to everyone | 22:13 |
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| fredddd | I can not really tell anything from this agreement, for all I care this was done voluntarily to maximise profits, if this news is not presented from a neutral source, and not the source being party held within the news article, there is little I can judge over. | 22:14 |
| fredddd | Receiving coverage over a patent portfolio. | 22:15 |
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| fredddd | Meaning, you can use the patents the company holds, which has its portfolio covering you, to sue other companies in violation of it? | 22:15 |
| fredddd | Or what does this mean? | 22:15 |
| mgedmin | it means the patent system is broken | 22:15 |
| mgedmin | and lets large companies extort other large companies over trivial patents | 22:16 |
| fredddd | I need not an explanation on the patent system. | 22:16 |
| fredddd | I need an explanation on this. | 22:16 |
| fredddd | To me this just means that Samsung, LG, etc... have made deals with Microsoft, so that they can sue other companies that are in violation of Microsoft's patents, within their own products. | 22:16 |
| javispedro | noi | 22:17 |
| fredddd | Then what does it mean? | 22:17 |
| javispedro | "coverage under Microsoft's patent portfolio for tablets, mobile phones and other consumer devices running the Android or Chrome OS platform" | 22:18 |
| fredddd | Having made a deal with a company so that your product is covered by their patent portfolio. | 22:18 |
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| javispedro | meaning, licenses for all the patents MS believes are in any way related to any of those | 22:18 |
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| fredddd | That last line of yours is confusing. | 22:19 |
| fredddd | Still do not get. | 22:19 |
| javispedro | great because I do not get what's the problem :) | 22:19 |
| fredddd | I still think it just means you are allowed to use Microsoft patents upon your own devices and sue those who violate within your own products. | 22:19 |
| fredddd | Well, knowing that. | 22:20 |
| fredddd | How can you tell Microsoft is receiving royalty rights? The news article does not specify anything besides a cryptic "mutually beneficial agreement". | 22:20 |
| fredddd | From that, how were you able to tell Microsoft was receiving royalty rights? | 22:20 |
| javispedro | what other kind of agreement can be done? | 22:21 |
| fredddd | Many. | 22:21 |
| fredddd | Patents for patents. | 22:21 |
| javispedro | crosslicensing | 22:21 |
| fredddd | Microsoft trying to exhort psychological effect on the market with a certain idea. | 22:21 |
| javispedro | but what's the difference? | 22:21 |
| fredddd | Royalty fees = you just cash in money per sold product. | 22:22 |
| fredddd | Patents for patents = sell patents or give permission to use. | 22:22 |
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| javispedro | the problem as we usually see it is ms collecting anything on trivial stuff | 22:22 |
| javispedro | payment being in physical money, forced crosslicensing or in human souls is not important | 22:23 |
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| fredddd | Now you are just taking prejudices and general hate towards the patent system, in this deal, to come to extreme conclusions. | 22:23 |
| fredddd | I do not like the patent system and would just as well like to see it pretty much gone too. | 22:24 |
| fredddd | But you can not just judge like that. | 22:24 |
| * javispedro gtg | 22:24 | |
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| fredddd | All this article says is "these companies can now use Microsoft patents to cover on their own Android based devices, gathered within a mutually beneficial deal". | 22:24 |
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| RST38h | Ehehehe http://gizmodo.com/5875563/these-should-be-the-real-logos-of-nokia-starbucks-playboy-apple-and-dunkin-donuts | 22:28 |
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| Macer | lol!! | 22:32 |
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| Macer | mcdiabetes | 22:32 |
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| Minos | Hello | 23:11 |
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| Minos | I’m having troubles with my N900: the file copying speed between the SD card and the internal memory is incredibly slow (less than 1 MiB/s), is that normal? | 23:13 |
| plate | ive seen articles citing payments on a per-handsebasis to MS | 23:13 |
| plate | it may be in their SEC filing quarterlies, who knows | 23:13 |
| plate | theres definitely extortion going on :) | 23:13 |
| plate | with teh full backing of the glorious patent system, courtes, etc | 23:13 |
| * plate always has extremely slow flash performance on n900. emmc internal flash. never tried a SD card | 23:14 | |
| plate | ive seen pages that claim SD cards might be faster | 23:14 |
| plate | im lucky if i get 500K/second over usb storage, with stalls now and then | 23:14 |
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| Minos | ok, I guess I’ll have to be patient then… | 23:15 |
| plate | try SD card if you have one | 23:17 |
| plate | also, try 2.6.37 kernel from rescueOS, perhaps it performs better | 23:17 |
| plate | not sure what is at fault, bus bandwidth, mem controllers, old kernels.. | 23:18 |
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| NIN101 | plate: eh what? | 23:20 |
| NIN101 | rescueOS kernel won't work with maemo. end of story. | 23:20 |
| plate | i didnt say maaemo | 23:20 |
| plate | boot into rescueOS, do your copying | 23:20 |
| plate | if the kernel performs any better than that ancient 2.6.28 | 23:21 |
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| NIN101 | yeah well.... | 23:21 |
| plate | if youre transferring 30gb worth of stuff onto myDocs it might be worth a reboot to do if its 10x teh speed :) | 23:21 |
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| plate | i mean the 'stalls are suspect to me. it will stoip writing anything for 5 secconds | 23:22 |
| plate | then write 50 or 100K, then stall again | 23:22 |
| plate | then it will write 1MB/second continuous for 30 seconds. so random | 23:22 |
| mgedmin | what files are those? | 23:22 |
| plate | mp3s | 23:23 |
| plate | theyre not a ton of 4 K files | 23:23 |
| plate | almost all of them are 5MB a piece | 23:23 |
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| mgedmin | there's also the tracker indexer/thumbnailer that are busy eating all the CPU extracting id3 tags from your mp3es as they're being written | 23:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Minos: known effect - cp runs into swap hell where aggressive swapping out of mempages congests the bandwidth of same controller/interface trying to write same data to final destination on same eMMC chip. | 23:58 |
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