IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2011-12-18

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luke-jrso is anyone working on a proper N900 BME replacement?00:25
luke-jrie, something I can run as an init script00:25
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Paliluke-jr, I'm working on kernel module00:32
luke-jrPali: hmm!00:33
Paliwithout userspace daemon/program00:33
luke-jrgood idea00:33
PaliI sent last version to LKML:
Palibut it is still not complete and propably not working...00:34
jazedalWhy do we want BME?00:41
psycho_oreosproper control over charging of battery, maybe one can do fancy stuff with it00:42
jazedalIt doesn't sound too useful.00:42
psycho_oreosnokia's BME has been a pain in the neck for most cases anyway.. sometimes not reporting battery level correctly, no proper indication of how much battery power is left when hostmode is enabled, etc, etc, etc00:42
DocScrutinizerpsycho_oreos: you can't do fancy stuff with that00:43
jazedalpsycho_oreos: Ok00:43
luke-jrjazedal: we don't, that's the point of another charger00:43
DocScrutinizerluke-jr: rhere's a script since "years" that you could start from system init00:43
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: I have a script, but it's not very friendly for init00:43
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: and probably not power efficient00:44
DocScrutinizereeeh, power efficient?00:44
psycho_oreosDocScrutinizer, well I said maybe :) then again the standard BME is somewhat restrictive as it is00:44
jazedalYou're doing the browser right after, right?00:44
PaliDocScrutinizer, can be that script running always on background (when charger is not connected too)?00:45
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Palino side effect?00:45
DocScrutinizernot more than the known ones00:46
Paliand what is known?00:46
luke-jrother than executing i2c tools, printing, etc00:46
DocScrutinizerwhich are: no proper reporting of battery state to hal, etc00:46
Paliok, reporting to hal and is not big problem...00:47
luke-jrHAL is dead00:47
Paliyou are right!00:47
jazedalProblem building BookmarkBridge on the N900:  It requires libqt-dev; however, libqt4-dev has a problem with file /usr/bin/uic.  It fails when run contrary to its documented expected behavior.00:48
jazedal/usr/bin/uic: line 1: syntax error: "(" unexpected00:48
jazedaluic is a binary ELF file00:48
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DocScrutinizerwhy would you want bookmark-bridge on N900 anyway?00:49
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jazedalOriginally, the idea was to convert the xml file to firefox format before backup/sync00:49
jazedalYou just reminded me that the XML format is the ideal format, and it should be backed up the way it is.00:50
Paliluke-jr, I will look at it later...00:50
Palialso ping freemangordon about that patches00:50
jazedalI was in the middle of building it when I realized that, though, and it might have been nice to have it on the N900.00:51
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PaliDocScrutinizer, can swith charging from wallcharger to usb charger?00:52
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DocScrutinizerluke-jr: (power efficient) indeed it's useless to run the watchdog tickle for bq24150 4..6 times a minute, as you could stop this during times where no charger is attached. But then you'd need to watch for charger plug in and that will either require kevents monitor or polling of sysfs node. And the i2c cmd to tickle wd is utterly lightweight anyway00:53
jazedalI will not facepalm and yell at myself, though, it is a strange custom.00:53
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DocScrutinizerPali: no, it doesn't as of now00:53
DocScrutinizerit could get augmented to do this00:53
DocScrutinizerfor now it's somewhat mistreating USB hosts00:54
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DocScrutinizersame way your usual 3.5" external USB hardrive or UMTS stick does00:54
NIN101have read of stuff like risking frying pc usb ports when using, as it pulls more than 500 ma... BS?00:55
DocScrutinizerwell, it's somewhat correct, just it's one of legion of devices that do this00:55
DocScrutinizeryou could however easily change max USB current to always stay at 500mA, which would reduce charging speed on fastchargers but would basically comply with USB specs for hosts00:56
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luke-jrDocScrutinizer: assuming the kernel caches the i2c binaries etc00:57
luke-jrwhich might not always be true00:57
luke-jralso, kernel module is probably safer from swapping00:58
Paliok, so in kernel driver I need check if usb charger is connected and change max current00:58
DocScrutinizerluke-jr: when it doesn't then you got real problems with power usage that are not caused by that script ;-D00:58
DocScrutinizerPali: NO, you can't and don't want to do that00:58
luke-jranyhow, I've changed gears.00:58
luke-jrI have 75 minutes left to use TODAY, so I want to try to get voice calling working00:59
DocScrutinizerPali: you'll introduce layering problems by doing this00:59
PaliDocScrutinizer, what is correct way?00:59
DocScrutinizerthis switching depending on USB enum has to be done by a userland daemon01:00
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DocScrutinizerthe whole USB enum and deciding if that's ok for charging now, is way too complex to do all that in kernel space01:02
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DocScrutinizeryou want a userland daemon that waits for kevent signalling change in VBUS sysnode, indicating either a plugin or removal of any charger or USB host. Then that userland daemon checks what we want to do, according to what got actually plugged in, then it configures bq24150 via kenel module accordingly and sets the kernel module to auto, which relieves the duty of tickling watchdog from userland daemon. Then the daemon basically goes idle01:06
DocScrutinizeragain, waiting for next kevent on /sys/*/vbus01:06
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DocScrutinizeron removal you set USB-MAX-CURRENT to either 500mA or 100mA if you're *very* conservative and cautious. So charger chip will start charging at that rate immediately as soon as anything gets plugged in and delivers power01:10
DocScrutinizereventually USB Enum kicks in, eventually either fastcharger or max-current of 400mA (USB hub) or 500mA (direct host) got negotiated, and when that happened and got finished, the userland daemon can rconfigure the /sys/*/bq24150 accordingly01:12
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DocScrutinizeror you trust in all your equipment isn't the absolute crap and has proper 500mA USB power capabilities (otherwise you already had killed it by plugging in one of the above mentioned other "rogue" peripherals or even a USB-mugwarmer or USB-fan) and you don't bother too much about charging a completely empty battery takes 4:30 instead of 4:00 - so you set max USB current to 500mA and forget about all the userland daemon cruft and trust in01:17
DocScrutinizerbq24150 and bq24150.ko tickling the watchdog01:17
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DocScrutinizerthis will "just work" in 99.999% of cases, and may result in charging simply failing due to some windows PC getting upset on a peripheral drawing 500mA without ENUM in the rest of cases01:20
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DocScrutinizerI still have to check if bq24150 actually resumes charging when power gets applied, even without reconfiguring it (I.E. resetting "power lost" error), but basically that's no real reason for getting any overcomplicated detecting and whatnot in kernel or userland daemon - it can be done with each watchdog tickling in bq24150.ko as well as if actually needed01:28
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* javispedro feels the urge to remove all those screenshots of Android that someone has been adding to the Linux, ARM architecture, and several other Wikipedia pages01:29
DocScrutinizerwth?! today?01:30
javispedronah, been there for a while, prolly they'll argue they are "useful"01:30
DocScrutinizermeh, on wikipedia01:36
HyperSnyperhow dificult would it be to get RISC OS running on the n900....01:36
HyperSnyperknow theres afew emulators but not sure if nay are open source01:36
HyperSnyperRISC OS <301:37
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mavhcHyperSnyper: right and middle click might be tricky01:37
DocScrutinizerI'm recently cleaning out ~5 spam edits per day on average, on - pretty annoying though it earns me karma01:37
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mavhcHyperSnyper: risc os open has the source code01:38
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HyperSnyperi just want to play Hamters01:39
HyperSnyperone of the first games i ever played01:39
mavhcthe one with the giant mallet?01:39
HyperSnyperthats the one :D01:39
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HyperSnyperremeber Tom Cooper appearing couple of years ago saying he wanted to port it to Mobiles but not seen anything about it since01:40
mavhcyeah, it's on but games are always an issue because they're hacky01:40
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HyperSnypersome good memories looks through that arcon arcade list01:44
HyperSnyperspent far too many hours playing Phaeton01:44
mavhcnever got far with arc elite, not owning an arc at the time, got elite status on bbc elite. played cycloids quite a bit01:46
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jazedalThat's it.  It was 'osso-addressbook-backup' that I used in my backup scripts.01:50
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luke-jr>>> media-libs/libcmtspeechdata-2.1.1 merged.01:54
luke-jrjavispedro: Android isn't Linux. do it.01:54
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DocScrutinizeris somebody claim it was linux, on that wikipage?01:55
luke-jr"screenshots of Android that someone has been adding to the Linux,"01:56
luca_DocScrutinizer: FYI, you were right, it was something related to a package altering ringtones (ringtoned)01:57
luca_DocScrutinizer: it screwed up ~user/.sounds creating a broken symlink (I don't know how since I installed it ages ago and never used and never opdated)01:58
luca_DocScrutinizer: all sounds (even alarms) look for sounds there, so they couldn't find them and fail01:59
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luca_DocScrutinizer: for some reason when changing the settings, the sounds were reproduced OK01:59
luca_anyway, just wanted to let you know that I finally fixed it and what was the problem02:00
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DocScrutinizerI always wondered if the symlinking is the right method for the ringtone changing. I also wonder what would happen when you do a "cat new_ringtone.wav >cached_rintone.wav" while cached_rintone is currently played back by the errr whatever does this ringtone playback02:40
DocScrutinizerbarisione: ^^^02:40
luke-jrI definitely agree with symlink02:41
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DocScrutinizerluke-jr: you don't see the whole picture02:56
DocScrutinizerusing symlinks means we need to stop the ringtoneplayer change the symlink according to what we found from addrbook and then restart ringtoneplaying so it opens the new ringtone data file02:58
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DocScrutinizerthat's why for luca_ there was that weird behaviour that every alarm sound got stopped immediately after starting it, according to what he saw on dbus02:59
DocScrutinizerchanging raw data of the opened .wav would eliminate the need for all that03:00
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DocScrutinizerand also would guarantee we always have *some* audio data to playback, even when something goes awry on final ending ringtone playing where right now the (per-contact-)ringtoned has to change symlink to contact specific .wav back to default.wav03:02
DocScrutinizereven when copying new or default audio data halfway then segfaulting, all we got is a messed up ringtone data, not a dangling symlink03:03
DocScrutinizerOTOH probably buffering will render my idea moot03:06
DocScrutinizerthat's why I said "I also *wonder* what would happen..."03:08
DocScrutinizerdepending on more factors than I could list here, the result of this action may differ significantly03:09
DocScrutinizerbest probably was to rewrite the ringtoneplayer, whatever it is03:10
DocScrutinizertonegend or whatever03:10
DocScrutinizerI guess they won't use mafw for that03:10
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slobroumm, hello. I just got an used n900, and I was wondering that how I could find out what maemo and firmware version Im running?03:13
SpeedEvilsettings -> about03:13
SpeedEvilAlso - ~flashing03:13
infobotrumour has it, maemo-flashing is
psycho_oreosentering *#0000# still shows version03:15
merlin1991lmao just wanted to swipe to close on my n90003:16
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slobrohmm, version 21.2011.38-1, pretty new I guess03:17
DocScrutinizerdoesn't mean much03:17
merlin1991oh it does03:18
psycho_oreosyeah its the latest03:18
DocScrutinizerI guess you'll reflash it anyway, as soon as you get it03:18
psycho_oreosI wouldn't ;)03:19
merlin1991reflashing was the first thing I did when I got my 2nd n90003:19
psycho_oreosdd was the first thing when I got my second and subsequent N900, after that it was flashing03:20
merlin1991why dd?03:21
* psycho_oreos grins devilishly and says no more03:21
merlin1991I see03:22
* DocScrutinizer shrugs03:22
DocScrutinizerwhatever been the purpose, it's most likely not been to the point03:22
DocScrutinizera sane user has reflashed combined and vanilla anyway, prior to selling03:23
DocScrutinizera not so sane user has nothing I'd be interested in03:24
merlin1991my 2nd n900 is interesting though, it has a hardware fault so that the software detects that cellmo doesn't work, it does display a banner in the 3 dots load screen03:24
psycho_oreosyou meant 503:24
merlin1991but it doesn't go past it unless the banner is pressed03:24
merlin1991ooops :D03:24
merlin1991but I get the same banner again when h-d finishes loading :D03:25
psycho_oreosand I've actually found some interesting data however..03:25
DocScrutinizera user like me would leave some spyware in a deleted honeypot file for users like you, when selling03:28
psycho_oreosthe chances of you getting information out of that spyware from me would be unlikely :)03:29
psycho_oreoslet alone anyone03:30
DocScrutinizerhmm, let's try it ;-P03:31
psycho_oreosand what are you going to do even if I did dd your sold device? report me in for trying to reveal your secrecy?03:32
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DocScrutinizereh? nah, I'm going to use your secrit shit to do nonsense03:35
psycho_oreosi.e. personal vendetta just because you couldn't let go of your old device having your past secrets revealed? heh that's even worse than me dumping yer history out ;)03:36
DocScrutinizersure, I'm evil03:37
merlin1991yes you are, see:03:38
infobotit has been said that scrutinizing is what DocScrutinizer does after eating some datasheets for breakfast03:38
DocScrutinizerhowever I said *deleted* honeypot file, so you'd start the spyware only when trying to recover deleted shit from that device03:38
* psycho_oreos makes a mental note to not buy stuff from DocScrutinizer ;) though I gotta admit I'm still a sucker for N95003:38
luke-jrhow does telepathy-ring work without linking to libcmtspeechdata? :|03:39
luke-jrmerlin1991: does it let you use cellmo if you bypass the detect?03:40
DocScrutinizerbtw guess what's #1 on list of "always works" attack vectors to do industry spying - yep, you simply "forget" an USB stick next to the employee of that company03:41
merlin1991luke-jr: didn't try03:41
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jazedalDoes anyone have any experience getting gpg-agent to work on the N900?03:42
javispedroluke-jr: what the h is libcmtspeechdata and wouldn't pulseaudio be using it instead of tp-ring?03:44
jazedalgpg has trouble connecting to the agent03:44
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luke-jrjavispedro: libcmtspeechdata is apparently how to do audio with cellmo03:47
luke-jrI don't want PA03:47
javispedromore reason it'll link to a PA module instead of tp-ring03:48
javispedro(not on what you're building, of course).03:48
luke-jrevery other telepathy module does audio handling03:49
Robot101they pass the codec / network data "up" from the telepathy connection manager to the stream engine which has the RTP stack03:50
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Robot101telepathy-ring controls csd and pulseaudio just magics the audio into place03:50
Robot101doing the equivalent to voip isn't very useful to telepathy as you just have to have some higher-level component which understands a lower layer backend thing which has device-specific knowledge about audio routing03:51
Robot101if every internet backend in telepathy needed a different/custom streaming format (and not just rtp) they'd all do it inside the protocol backend too03:51
slobrohmm, should I just flash with the global firmware image, when the n900 has been bought in finland..03:58
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luke-jrso in plain English… there's no way to make voice calls work without PA blob crap?04:01
javispedroluke-jr: PA stuff no longer has blobs in meego04:01
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luke-jrjavispedro: slightly better.04:01
luke-jrwhere's the code? :P04:02
luke-jrif not under
javispedronow that I remember, there are still PA blobs,04:04
javispedrohow much annoying they are probably Sts knows.04:04
javispedro(seemingly related to audio processing iirc)04:05
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DocScrutinizerwell, on SHR we got cmtspeech anyway04:11
DocScrutinizerand we don't use PA ;-D04:11
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: link? :D04:11
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DocScrutinizeractually cmtspeech is utterly silly, it's just reading from one serial data interface and forwarding to another, and vice versa04:12
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luke-jrDocScrutinizer: link? :D04:16
DocScrutinizerauthor just asked me "cmtspeech like we do it? or like meego does it?"04:17
DocScrutinizer;a=tree;f=fsoaudiod/src/plugins/gsmvoice_alsa_cmtspeechdata;h=e288a6d7433aed7b70d792d4823486b9ace7f44b;hb=HEAD  here you go04:18
DocScrutinizerhope you like the brilliance of the simple architecture, it's designed by me04:18
luke-jrmeego uses PA; do not want04:18
DocScrutinizerme neither :-D04:18
luke-jrvala -.-04:18
* luke-jr wonders which is worse, vala or PA04:19
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luke-jr700 lines, can't be hard to port to C…04:20
DocScrutinizerprolly not04:21
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DocScrutinizeractually it's more easy in c04:21
DocScrutinizeras you can use direct ALSA pcm_xxx() calls rather than that vala stub cruft04:21
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* luke-jr wonders if he should be using FreeSmartPhone's telephony stack instead of ofono04:25
luke-jrofono needs glib-- is FSP's glib-free? ;)04:25
javispedroif it uses vala..04:26
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DocScrutinizeryou can tell for sure that I hate this detail: >> "plug:dsnoop", Alsa.PcmStream.CAPTURE );<< - hardcoded ALSA stack, OMFG04:27
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javispedroin the meanwhile, what you knew as the android kernel is now the linux kernel, as it seems that we got wakelocks :(04:30
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DocScrutinizerheard something like that, and I think I'm going to start a killing rage04:39
javispedronot involved04:40
DocScrutinizerso he has to wait now, will deal with him later04:40
DocScrutinizerfirst the fools who got this crap into clean nice linux04:41
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GeneralAntillesWE NEED MOAR DROID04:47
javispedroprobably also related to "the year of linux disappointments"04:48
javispedrowith nokia & contractors being pulled out of the kernel...04:49
javispedropreviously, you'd get someone arguing "hey, we're doing fine without wakelocks on our devices"04:49
GeneralAntillesThis is shaping up to be a messy decade.04:49
javispedronowadays it's just @android people04:49
GeneralAntillesReading the comments on the LWN summary of that article was depression.04:49
GeneralAntillesReminds me of LFCSSF 2009 when DiBona answered a question about Google not collaborating or releasing code04:51
GeneralAntillesand it was OK because none of their competitors did either04:51
javispedroeven more ...04:51
GeneralAntillesWhich of course Nokia made up half that conference.04:51
GeneralAntillesAnd they seemed to have very little trouble with their kernel code and collaboration.04:52
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GeneralAntillesHe didn't have much to say after that was pointed out to him.04:53
DocScrutinizerwell, nite all, got enough stuff for some pleasant dreams full of violence04:53
javispedrognite DocScrutinizer04:54
luke-jrjavispedro: actually, I found proprietary wakelocks in some Nokia code04:54
javispedroluke-jr: without agressive suspending, it's just cpuidle stuff, such as the one in musb04:56
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* javispedro fails to undestand why Google is using the fact that "Lennart is using Google+" to try to convince me to join Google+.05:33
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DocScrutinizerI might feel tempted05:36
DocScrutinizerI wonder if I could find that video again of last year's CCC where MrPoettering acted like an asshat entering the stage and arguing with a dude who tried to hold a lecture about why PA is getting too fat for "usual workstations"05:40
javispedrolol @ a discussion where "utter braindamage" is uttered right in the first reply05:40
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javispedroand of course, the guy is a N900 owner =)05:43
DocScrutinizerone of the most amusing arguments mr poettering used was "we need PA before user session gets started, otherwise we couldn't read the login screen for the visually impaired" - or sth along that line. Nothing against impaired persons and accessability, but for KDM??? c'mon!05:43
javispedroDocScrutinizer: don't worry, eventually, it'll be so coupled to Linux (and viceversa) that it'll get pushed into Android^W the kernel, and then we'll be back at stage one.05:45
* DocScrutinizer gasps05:45
javispedroCannot wait for the Reallly Advanced Linux Sound Architecture! (RALSA)05:45
DocScrutinizerI might consider switching to netBSD05:45
javispedroI still have some love for the GPL...05:46
DocScrutinizerthis whole linux land starts to become a mental home05:46
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luke-jrblah, why does audio have to be so complex?05:48
DocScrutinizerback in "the old days" (like 10some years ago) linux was for experts and only experts messed with things like kernel. Now each fool who grew out of scripting DoS thinks they can improve kernel, let alone KDE etc05:48
DocScrutinizeron a side note latest openSuse supports KDE3 again05:49
DocScrutinizerthe best KDE ever05:50
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: I recently fixed a bug in KDE where some guy "optimized" the IMAP protocol handler by removing parenthesis… which meant it omitted the message size when there were no flags, so it failed. -.-05:50
DocScrutinizeranother script kiddie05:50
javispedroI'm going to restore your faith into Linux05:51
luke-jrof course, nobody really noticed because KDE doesn't use *that* IMAP protocol handler… they use *a different* IMAP handler05:51
javispedrowords from the current linux scheduler maintainer: "Yes, this is why I loathe to update to a new distro, there's bound to05:51
javispedronew and improved *kit-daemon crap about which does random wakeups even05:51
javispedrothough you know you're not using any of it, and when you're trying to05:51
javispedrouninstall that junk it thinks it needs to uninstall the world"05:51
luke-jryes, KDE has 2 different IMAP implementations…05:51
luke-jrjavispedro: that's why I use Gentoo05:52
javispedro(sorry for the unintentional \ns)05:52
javispedroluke-jr: same05:52
luke-jrthough I was heavily tempted to give into *kit for KDE's power display stuff05:52
luke-jrbut eventually decided it wasn't worth it (I can use CLI)05:52
javispedroit wouldn't have worked either way05:52
luke-jrprobably not05:53
luke-jrsomeone needs to port KDE 3 to Qt4 and maintain it05:53
luke-jr(ie, not the Trinity idiots who think they're going to maintain Qt3 too)05:53
javispedrodunno what is going to be harder05:54
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javispedrokde is slightly more of a mess than qt305:54
javispedrowell, at least if you remove the multiplatform parts from qt3.05:55
javispedro(from a maintainer's PoV and in my short experience)05:55
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javispedrothis discussion is just great so if you have time, do read it :
javispedro(they're arguing about wakelocks, agressive suspend crap)05:56
DocScrutinizeromg gmane jow I hate that format06:05
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javispedrotime to go06:08
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* luke-jr writes an ALSA plugin to expose CMTSpeech as an ALSA device…06:22
luke-jrany reason *not* to do it that way? <.<06:23
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DocScrutinizerluke-jr: HIGHLY welcome06:34
luke-jrok, good :p06:34
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DocScrutinizeronly reason my similar suggestion wasn't picked up was missing experise in writing ALSA card drivers06:35
luke-jrmy first time touching ALSA code…06:35
DocScrutinizerand it had to become a card06:35
DocScrutinizerbecause it does what a card usually does06:35
luke-jrso why not just a regular PCM device?06:35
luke-jrI'm assuming by "card drivers" you mean something in-kernel?06:36
DocScrutinizerright, PCM device / card / whatever. sth like hw:0.0 or any other device that acts as an endpoint of a stack06:37
DocScrutinizeryep, probably06:37
luke-jrI'm doing a shared object that uses libcmtspeechdata06:38
luke-jrsimilar to dmix/dsnoop06:38
DocScrutinizerhmm, no obvious objections06:38
DocScrutinizerI probably don't really care06:39
DocScrutinizeras long as I can define my stacks as usual, incl hooks and all06:39
luke-jrany chance you have a magic "pipe these two ALSA device to each other" command I can test with? :p06:42
DocScrutinizernot really, except the age old arecord|aplay06:42
luke-jryeah, that's just one direction tho06:43
luke-jrI've got 15 mins left to write this… :P06:43
luke-jrotherwise, I'm *probably* moving on to something else for 3 weeks, so I don't use up my (very limited) minutes06:43
DocScrutinizerI think there's been some loopback pcm plugin, but it obviously has thee end and still needs one proper pcm_open()06:43
DocScrutinizer(one direction) use two of them ;-D06:44
DocScrutinizerloopback (my take on it)  arecord -D loopback:{input; output} /dev/null06:47
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DocScrutinizeror rather: arecord -D loopback:{input; plug:output} /dev/null06:48
DocScrutinizergstreamer prolly also works06:49
DocScrutinizerand avoids the extreme latency of the shell |pipe06:50
DocScrutinizerthough you prolly could fix that by giving arecord/aplay proper chunksize orders06:51
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luke-jrgstreamer is glib :P07:07
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merlin1991luke-jr: you won't get away without some libs :D07:29
luke-jrmerlin1991: ALSA is fine07:29
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beagleburttrying to find a working download for osso-xterm .. any ideas?10:41
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psycho_oreosbeagleburt, a working download? aren't they usually included in nokia's own repositories?12:10
psycho_oreosif you think about it, there are a few other probable ways without having to rely on nokia's repositories, combined/fiasco firmware would no doubt have it for instance, then a few people for various reasons would post tarballs (both in compressed as well as uncompressed forms) of rootfs which would have osso-xterm extracted but really you can always repack them up12:14
beagleburt<psycho_oreos>: only link I can find is dead. Also I am a compleate newbe & what you suggest is way beyond my skill level?12:25
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psycho_oreosbeagleburt, another question comes to mind is why do you specifically want osso-xterm? is it because you accidentally removed it?12:34
psycho_oreosI think things like fapman might also be able to do the job12:35
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beagleburtpsycho_oreos, I have 20x odd "770's" that had a buggy OS2006 on them. I flashed Hackers Edition 2007 & found that it had Osso x-term on it. I  also found that OS2007HE was very slow & sometimes had problems with WiFi connecting, so I have reflashed them all with the original OS2006 but several people would like to buy them off me WITH an x-term?12:41
beagleburtWhat is "fapman" please?12:42
psycho_oreosbeagleburt, ahh now its somewhat starting to make sense. You have 770 that you want the osso-xterm for.12:42
psycho_oreosfaster application manager, I don't think you'll find a program for that with 770, afaik it only appears under N90012:43
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beagleburtpsycho_oreos, ok ic12:44
Paliping X-Fade12:44
Pali~seen X-Fade12:44
infobotx-fade is currently on #maemo #harmattan #meego. Has said a total of 26 messages. Is idling for 3d 18h 49m 54s, last said: 'pawky: yes'.12:45
psycho_oreosbeagleburt, so x-term is not available in those tableteer repositories?12:45
beagleburtpsycho_oreos, have not found it so far12:46
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psycho_oreosbeagleburt, well I personally don't have 770 myself though if its possible to install OS2007HE on one of the 770, install maybe dpkg-dev and maybe even dpkg-repack.. and use dpkg-repack to repack osso-xterm. That might help12:47
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psycho_oreosits a really long shot.. hmm whilst you're at it, would the OS2008HE edition work better at any rate?12:49
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beagleburtpsycho_oreos, HMMM? I get the gist but beyond this newbe's  current skill level...OS2008 did not have an x-term..12:51
psycho_oreosbeagleburt, ahh bugger so only OS2007HE would be your best bet. Well I wouldn't know how to make it any simpler.. the real issue is that you have 770 and I don't think there are many 770 owners that are currently active12:53
ahollerthe owners or the n770?12:53
psycho_oreosmore like 770 rather than n77012:54
beagleburtpsycho_oreos, i may have to wait a few years & offer them up as 'Collectors items'12:54
* psycho_oreos thinks N900 is more valuable as a collector item but *shrugs*12:55
beagleburtpsycho_oreos, ha ha ha! I thought i was the only n770 owner left in the world you mean there's 769 others?12:56
nealI have two 770s in daily use12:56
psycho_oreosbeagleburt, I'm only referring to 770 owners that are currently active on this IRC session12:56
beagleburtpsycho_oreos, oh ic12:56
ahollerneal: beeing curious, what do you use them for?12:57
psycho_oreosaholler && neal, instead of saying you have 770 near you, why not put it into some good use and help beagleburt out?12:57
nealmpd clients12:57
nealremote controls12:57
beagleburtneal, pardon my ignorance but what is "mpd"?12:59
nealpsycho_oreos: I read some backlog and I didn't see a question12:59
nealbeagleburt: music player daemon12:59
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ShadowJK770s have this self-destruct habbit, kinda like N90012:59
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psycho_oreosself-destruct habbit?13:00
psycho_oreosneal, he wants a copy of osso-xterm13:00
* psycho_oreos has yet to see the self destruct habit on three of his N900 lol13:01
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nealaccording to my recollection it is in repository.maemo.org13:01
nealhe just needs to enable the right repository13:01
beagleburtneal link is dead i think13:01
nealI doubt it13:02
nealif so, talk to x-fade13:02
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nealthat was easy13:03
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beagleburtneal, thankyou will check it out13:06
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beagleburtneal, this is the link i followed to nowhere:
beagleburtneal, i have downloaded your link ok - but am unsure how to install it on my 770?13:24
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nealthen the 770 may not be for your13:27
infobotneal meant: then the 770 may not be for you13:27
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mgedminif you open with the browser on your 770, clicking the green Install arrow should (with a couple of confirmations) install that package13:33
beagleburtmgedmin, leads to dead-end (web-parking site)13:38 interesting/sad13:38
mgedminbut it works for me13:38
mgedmin has address
mgedminthis link was not in my backlog13:41
mgedminyeah, the upstream homepage is kaput13:42
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eichisomeone of you played sdlscavenger? called scavenger in maemo?15:36
eichiI cant finish level 12 and dont understand, how to to that ;)15:36
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valeriusstrange, xchat crashes on my nokia n900 -- moved the logs and scrollback directories and it ended to crash...16:49
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* RST38h moos evilly, prays to the Tentacled One in the Depths of the Sea17:54
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javispedromoo RST38h17:58
valeriusanybody alive?18:00
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* valerius installed subverfsion together with libapr and libaprutil -- it segfaults :(18:01
* valerius tried several older builds -- the same result18:01
RST38hjavispedro: And may I remind how badly Direct3D sucks?18:03
valeriusmaybeWTF, something is missing from its dependencies an it traps in a missing lib?18:03
javispedroRST38h: to me? No need.18:03
javispedrothe fun thing is that considering how far GL ES has gone, MS still wants to promote the even more retarded MobileD3D.18:04
RST38hjavispedro: Obviously18:06
wmarone_how else will they lock you into their platform?18:06
RST38hjavispedro: There are dozens of people at MS developing it and creating PP presentations showing how it is good for developers and MS domination18:07
javispedrowmarone_: with they own language .....18:07
RST38hjavispedro: The fact that nobody really needs it (except for all the above people) does not mean a thing18:07
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RST38h(It is not that GLES is free of sin though - once I have seen the mandatory shader declaration with #defines, I almost threw up)18:08
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valeriusppl, so, nobody uses a svn client on maemo5?18:14
nealuse git :)18:14
valeriusI need access to a svn rep :)18:15
valeriuswhat is interesting, some older version worked fine for me, but I updated it and it become broken. Tried to downgrade it, but it still segfaults18:17
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MacDrunkanyone here20:11
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Gh0stysorry we're not open today20:12
Gh0styyou can reach us by irc every working day between the hours of 8 and 12 and 13 till 17h20:13
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merlin1991Gh0sty: ++20:42
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psychologehas some body know how to multiboot :power-kernel,nitdroid,nemo,,,i see this thread, and do that ,but only can boot Nitdrod and Power-kernel21:39
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badcloud_how to close all apps?22:22
jazedalOne at a time.22:23
badcloud_jazedal: arg22:23
badcloud_there's gotta be some app that can do it22:24
jazedalIt might be possible to write a script to close the gui processes, but I don't see a straight forward way to do it.22:24
jazedalI've 10 or apps open at once, and I never thought it would be convenient to automatically close them all.22:25
jazedals/10 or/had 10 or so/22:25
infobotjazedal meant: I've had 10 or so apps open at once, and I never thought it would be convenient to automatically close them all.22:25
badcloud_you say tomato...22:25
jazedalIt never takes long to close them all, and I get to make sure I really want to close them.22:25
badcloud_it's just a finger/stylus hassle for something so basic22:26
jazedalI see.22:27
jazedalAsk someone else.22:27
badcloud_I'll scour the seven seas/google some more22:27
badcloud_jazedal: thanks though22:27
jazedalNo problem.22:27
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