IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2011-09-28

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ioanhi. does CSSU work with kernel power?01:11
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Macerwell... my buddy got what he believes is the proper port ... i didnt know these things were so specific02:02
Macerhe said he is going to try to reflow it on wednesday when the ports get there02:03
Macerfingers crossed02:03
SpeedEvilGood luck.02:03
Macerhope i get my n900 back and working soon02:03
Macerbecause there is no way i would ever get an n902:04
Macermaybe an n950 if nokia wasnt being stupid and not releasing it to the public02:04
Macern9 for almost 900 tho? no thanks02:05
Macerrip off .. no qwerty either? fail :-)02:05
Robot101I just got a Pre 302:06
Robot101pretty cool except my HP webOS profile is on a server which is broken, so I had to hack it to activate it. uh oh.02:06
Robot101but, I've got two phones because I'm an idiot, so I can have a Pre 3 for QWERTY and an N9 as the other02:06
MohammadAGN9's pretty good02:07
MohammadAGthe vkb is good02:07
javispedroRobot101: where did you get it?02:11
Robot101javispedro: ebay02:11
MohammadAGanyone used a Motorola Xoom?02:12
Robot101the keyboard is it's just a smidge bigger than the Pre2 which makes it typable on (at speed) for me02:13
Robot101I'm very used to the N900 keyboard and the Pre 2 was just too small for me02:13
Robot101e-mail just works, unlike Modest which just cries in the corner when it sees my mailboxes02:13
Robot101calendar and contacts sync seamlessly with gmail and facebook02:13
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paulyi miss my n90002:25
paulyi sold it and bought a n802:25
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javispedrothat was an error ;P02:26
Paul123i sold it because it was a constant pain but i miss always having to charge it and flash it all my n8 does is take pics02:28
chem|stPaul123: constant pain? I am running testing + devel things + cssu-testing and apart of no-sim error once every ~120 days I have no problem, last time I was force to flash was the PR upgrade02:33
Paul123mines always had problems02:34
chem|stI stopped using skype, that made a huge difference!02:34
Paul123having fcam and kernel power messed it up02:34
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Paul123i sold my n900 on ebay but now the guy got his money back because he says it dont work but that cant be possible so hopefully he'll send it back02:36
chem|stsince the cssu camui is fixed (or the bugs changed^^) I use that, for playing with the cam fcam was/is nice but there is no need02:36
chem|sthe should do that02:36
Paul123paypal send me half my money back02:37
chem|stso he got 50% back till he ships the device back to you?02:37
Paul123no he has 100%02:37
chem|stfor how long?02:37
chem|sthave you requested the device02:38
Paul123bacause i was too lazy to respond to paypal they beleived him02:38
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Paul123i doubt hes gonna send it lol02:39
Paul123i hope though02:39
chem|strequest it, and tell paypal, the money is frozen in his account for some days02:40
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Paul123i think it was removed02:40
chem|st"to lazy" is no excuse02:40
Paul123the hold02:40
Paul123i know my fault paypal gave me half out of their pocket02:40
Paul123not the buyers02:41
chem|stehrm so you got 50% and paypal refunded 100%?02:41
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Paul123ya he has all his cash back and paypal gave me 50% because paypal was nice02:42
Paul123hes in st lucia!02:42
Paul123i still have my n900 thats broke and a n8 so i might buy a n902:43
chem|stI would request the device, either way, if it is broken, I would tell paypal that it was fully functional when you sent it...02:43
Paul123i did02:43
chem|steven broken n900s sell on ebay...02:44
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chem|stand I am sure n8s do too02:44
Paul123i  want to fix my broken one02:44
Paul123mohammad said he might fix my screen and digitizer02:45
Paul123and still got to fix usb02:45
Paul123so hopefully ill get the good n900 back in the mail sell my n8, buy a n9 and ill be happy with a n900 and n9! :)02:47
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Termanagood morning03:36
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Macerwell. i love my n90004:47
Maceri miss it. stupid usb port04:47
GeneralAntillesStupid Nokia04:47
Macerwhat a pain04:47
sheepbatindeed, GeneralAntilles04:48
Macerwell... my buddy gets the new port in tomorrow. he said it was a lot easier to find it with the n900 there04:48
sheepbatI would be more inclined to go buy an N9 if I knew it'd actually do some good04:48
Macerso hopefully he can ship it out thursday04:48
GeneralAntillesYou can buy N9s? :P04:48
Maceri would get one if it had a qwerty04:48
GeneralAntillesWhere are you? Australia (Pff)04:48
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sheepbatI thought they were on sale now04:49
GeneralAntillesBut only in places like China and Australia04:50
GeneralAntillesNot actual real places where real people with money for Nokia products live.04:50
sheepbatI'd pay the shipping..04:51
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GeneralAntillesGray market N9s are probably gonna go for $800 USD04:52
sheepbat..yeah, i'd go for that04:52
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sheepbatmy n900's getting a bit old.. I'd be fine with $800 for an upgrade04:56
AndrewX192I wish I could fix my hildon-desktop crashes04:57
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SpeedEvilsheepbat: So would I.05:02
SpeedEvil(If I had the cash)05:02
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TermanaGeneralAntilles, oi, withdraw that comment05:55
TermanaAustralia is a real place with real people. And the last time I checked, our economy was going a whole lot better than yours buddy05:55
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ruskie <-- well one positive step so far08:33
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GAN900Jaffa, can you switch to iOS and kill that off for us? :P08:44
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fluxhmm, this may be relevant: - meego's dead, tizen is the new hotness?10:00
khertanhotness if you consider html and javascript hot10:01
fluxwelcome html5-apps-only-world :(10:01
wmaroneflux: watching the fires burn in #tizen10:01
fluxdidn't webos already try that thing anyway?10:01
fluxmaybe tizen would've made sense if they were able to continue the webos effort10:01
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pabs3wmarone: fires of #meego are fun too10:05
wmaroneoh yes10:05
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wmaronebut this is just a fresh dousing of gasoline10:05
wmaroneintel's done a bang up job at dropping the ball10:05
pabs3as have Nokia :)10:07
robbiethe1stSounds like someone ought to simply quit all this madness, and go back to a Maemo-clone, based on near-stock debian. create a PowerTablet and PowerPhone with the best multitasking and professional applications in the world10:13
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pabs3robbiethe1st: as a Debian developer, I could only advise removing the phrase near-stock10:15
pabs3robbiethe1st: although the pkg-maemo folks recently had hildon/etc removed from Debian, since they figured maemo was abandoned10:15
robbiethe1stWell, I'd /like/ stock debian, but that would be *very* unlikely.10:16
robbiethe1stSo decended from debian, like Ubuntu or Maemo would be my next choice.10:16
pabs3yeah, even the OpenMoko devices are still not supported by Debian years later, mainly due to lack of interest from the OpenMoko guys in upstreaming kernel patches10:17
* pabs3 still has hope10:18
pabs3especially since it contains the first GSM chip that runs on10:19
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JaffaMorning, all10:47
JaffaGAN900: Indeed; but at this rate you'll only be left with WinMob 710:47
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lbt_morning Jaffa10:59
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Arkenoianyone tried flash 10.2, is it more stable than development beta, does it use hw acceleration?11:14
ErwinJungeArkenoi: I thought flash 11 was the first with GLES2 accel?11:16
mecethere is flash 10.2?11:17
meceErwinJunge, 10 accelerates videos11:17
ErwinJungeOops, I mixed it up with the new lightspark thing, see
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fluxI think they restart the project under a different name always when it starts to see the day of light11:25
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khertanflux: they didn't restart it, they finish it11:28
ErwinJungeDocScrutinizer: I got the usb fixed and at the same time had the sim failure thing fixed. Phone still works, and so far (about 12 hours now) haven't had the sim go missing yet. Thanks for the info on how to fix it :)11:33
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doc|homeso, basically, meego's officially dead now?11:43
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ruskieit ever was alive?11:43
doc|homehence me putting "officially" in there :)11:43
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ruskieWe believe the future belongs to HTML5-based applications, outside of a relatively small percentage of apps, and we are firmly convinced that our investment needs to shift toward HTML5. <-- WTF11:45
jierohtml5 is the way since all else went to android...11:46
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khertanruskie: look like an attemp to kill open source os on mobile11:46
doc|homethere's still bada11:46
ruskiekhertan, it was ever alive?11:46
jierolet the GTK3.2 rule11:46
Jartzaruskie: yes. THEY believe, developer do not.11:46
jierorun gimp on browser11:46
* ruskie goes bash head against a few dozen walls11:46
pabs3how about GNOME 3 or KDE Plasma Active?11:47
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ruskie"Granted, this is a judgment on our part on which reasonable people could disagree, but that's the conclusion I came to." <-- so they actually accept that they might be totaly insane11:47
Jartza"hey! let's fuck up everything! I like the plan, go for it!"11:48
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Macerso is cssu all qt now? :)11:49
Macerthat would be nice11:49
pabs3what happened with the maemo council elections?11:49
Maceryeah.. meego is fail with that html5 stuff11:50
Maceri am surprised they didn't put "cloud" somewhere in there11:50
amiconn[10:46:47] <jiero> run gimp on browser <== Well there is this x86 emulation in javascript... ;)11:50
ruskieyou mean Tizen?11:50
Maceri am so sick of hearing the word cloud11:50
Shapeshifterlol meego11:50
ruskieMacer, well maybe they just didn't consider something like eyeos11:51
Macereyeos isn't too bad11:51
ruskieyeah frankly it isn't11:51
ruskieit's a nice idea11:51
Macerat least i thought it was11:51
Shapeshifternow "we believe the future belongs to HTML5-based applications". Well, it didn't take long... what's next?11:51
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ruskieand wtf is a html5 based applicatioN?11:52
Shapeshifterhow long until Tizen is binned?11:52
Macerruskie: something in the cloud11:52
ShapeshifterI give it 2 years.11:52
doc|homegoogle, youtube, gmail, etc11:52
doc|homeand html5 does offline storage11:52
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Macerso it stores the cloud? :)11:52
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ShapeshifterIt's so funny how they constantly start new projects and then bin them11:52
doc|homemakes it easier for them, they just need a browser11:52
Macerwell.. i'm sure they may need to throw a dialer in there somewhere11:53
Shapeshifterruskie: html5 + javascript + whatever server side software you want.11:53
ruskieShapeshifter, so basically a webapp/servlet11:53
doc|homeMacer: only on the phones11:53
Macerwell.. there is still cssu11:53
pabs3google wants to kill javascript anyway11:53
Macerholding out11:53
ruskiegoogle wants to kill everything11:53
Shapeshifterruskie: although I guess you could run them locally. Like the widgets in KDE for example.11:53
doc|homescrew google11:54
ruskiethey want to be the pipe, data, everything provider11:54
ruskieas far as I care google can go the way of the dinos along with m$11:54
ruskieShapeshifter, still same thing...11:54
Macermeh. google is fine11:54
ruskiea webserver on localhost:8080 is the same thing11:54
Shapeshifterruskie: yep11:54
doc|homeso, yeah, options now are android or something bada-based :(11:54
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Macerif anything there is one thing i can say about google ... at least they centralized android11:54
Shapeshifterdoc|home: you forgot about just keeping your n900.11:54
ruskiedoc|home, I'll stick to S40 devices while they exist11:54
doc|homeShapeshifter: will die eventually11:55
Shapeshifterbuy a spare11:55
ruskieand yeah... while the n900 lives11:55
doc|homeruskie: can't go from an n900 to a symbian machine :/11:55
ruskiedoc|home, s40 is sub-symbian ;)11:55
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ruskieit actually works11:55
ruskieunlike s6011:55
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ruskiesomeone needs to make an s40 style mobile linux device11:56
ruskiefor "developing" countries11:56
doc|homeI wonder what those openmoko guys are doing :D11:56
* doc|home sobs11:56
ruskieben note iirc11:56
Shapeshifter is this copy pasta from meego?11:56
meceruskie, I think that's coming11:56
Arkenoiruskie, motorola did iirc11:56
doc|homeI still have a freerunner I've no use for, waste of time11:56
Macerhonestly. an open os on a phone was unrealistic anyways11:57
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ruskieMacer, yeah due to legal limitations of tampering with the airways11:57
ArkenoiMacer, why? (if you screw US operator-dominated market as non-relevant)11:57
Maceramong other things11:57
ruskieArkenoi, they did? which one?11:57
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Maceropen os on a phone does not have a guarenteed yield11:58
Arkenoimacer: if you just do handsets and your business is handsets, not "service", you can11:58
Arkenoiactually nokia could if they understood this point more clearly11:58
doc|homewith a microsoft ceo what should be expected? :/11:59
Macerandroid only gives the facade of being an open os11:59
ruskieArkenoi, you mean motorola rokr em30? limo based?11:59
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Macerdoc|home: no business would ever chase after a truly open os on a phone12:00
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doc|homeMacer: there's no reason they couldn't other than the GSM legislation12:00
Macerthe decentralization and lack of control will always cause it to unwind12:01
Maceroh. i am sure they can do it.... but they wont12:01
* doc|home sleeps12:01
Maceryou will never see the phone counterpart to a linux base to make distros with12:02
Macerit will never happen12:02
ruskieI think to get to a properly open phone device you would need to start with non-phone devices12:02
Macerwhich would be near impossible as well12:02
Macerunless you make your own12:02
Maceropen on mobile devices is dragon chasing12:03
Macersorry to say it12:03
Arkenoidoc|home, ok, i agree to have closed GSM firmware (though i believe manufacturers may bypass it, like chinese guys do)12:03
ruskieMedia devices(portable and normal), Gaming devices(portable and normal) then once you are racking the money in based on those you start building the base for mobile devices12:03
Macercssu is probably the only thing even close12:03
meceMacer, MeeGo CE12:03
ArkenoiYou just certify the thing and then specs on internal programming "accidentally" leak out12:03
Arkenoiand you are hardly liable12:04
Macermece: only functional thing12:04
Arkenoiso GSM consortium may just fsck off12:04
meceI'm out. tata.12:04
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ruskiemaybe even specific devices like ben note, ebook readers would help as well... make a security model that doesn't screw the consumer but still provides some semblance of DRM like functionality for publishers12:06
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ruskieand get industrial designers and marketing departments working on it... along with getting ties to media producers12:11
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magnetophonis anyone else having problems reading wikipedia with microb? the first two columns are on top of each other for me12:35
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merlin1991wtf, tizen?12:41
merlin1991yet another "toolkit" as base?12:42
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* merlin1991 wonders what that will mean for meego ce and the community obs12:43
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fluxkhertan, they may not restart it, but when it went from maemo to meego, everything was rewritten in Qt. and not it seems that meego->tizen means everything will be rewritten with html5.12:49
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RST38hActually most of harmattan is sitll in MTF, not Qt or QMl12:50
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khertanflux: it s not a restart, it s just an attempt to kill open source os on mobile13:00
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pabs3what happened with the maemo council elections?13:33
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Estel_~seen freemangordon_13:38
infobotfreemangordon_ <~freemango@> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 20d 17h 13m 46s ago, saying: 'Did I understand correctly that you are not using latest CSSU'.13:38
Estel_~seen freemangordon__13:38
infobotfreemangordon__ <55bb2605@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 10d 1h 51m 35s ago, saying: 'simple captcha for registration would do the job'.13:38
Estel_~seen freemangordon13:38
infobotfreemangordon <55bb2605@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 20d 17h 42m 47s ago, saying: 'damn, my English gets worse and worse every day.'.13:38
Estel_~seen freemangordon___13:38
infobotfreemangordon___ <5cf71062@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 2h 55m 7s ago, saying: '~seen Pali'.13:38
Estel_it's a pity that infobot doesn't work as asnwering machine, forwardin message, when it sees recipent ;)13:39
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DocScrutinizeroh, it doesn't?13:39
DocScrutinizer~+help onjoin13:40
infobot   Desc: get/set OnJoin message (needs chan option +OnJoin)13:40
infobot  Usage: onjoin [#chan|_default] [-]<nick> [message]13:40
infobotExample: onjoin infobot Hey! It's another infobot!13:40
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: moo13:41
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ZogGToday, the Linux Foundation and LiMo* announced Tizen(TM), an open-source, standards-based software platform for multiple device categories, including smartphones, tablets, smart TVs, netbooks and in-vehicle infotainment systems.14:32
ZogGTizen builds upon MeeGo* and LiMo and will deliver an application framework built upon HTML5/WAC 2.0 standards to help developers reuse and extend their code across multiple OS's, app stores, and devices.14:32
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DocScrutinizerbwahahaha, another bait & switch BS promise to "help developers reuse and extend their code across multiple OS'"14:56
DocScrutinizerdamn, IF you'd follow their path, you had a complete bin and rewrite from scratch for the 5th or so time in the last 2 years, to keep your apps reusable and cross-platform14:58
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HyperSnyperDocScrutinizer it juts arrived14:59
HyperSnyperno USB cable though....14:59
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DocScrutinizerthat's pretty bad - a USB-AM<->micro-BM cable is mandatory, as is a genuine nokia fastcharger, and I'd also be not too happy when the AV cable was missing as it'S hard to get and expensive15:02
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HyperSnypergot everything apart from the "USB-AM<->micro-BM"15:06
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* Sicelo thinks u can use same cable as most other phones. eg, samsung. or am i mistaken?15:09
Corsachmh, so the n9 is announced but it's barely available anywhere?15:13
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acidspunkhi everyone15:19
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ruskieThis device uses a different GPU (which handles the camera) to the N8, and it isn't as good. <-- is this true???? the GPU handles the camera?15:24
acidspunkon the n900?15:24
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ruskieacidspunk, in general15:27
ruskiethough this is a comment on the N9 on elreg15:27
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acidspunkon the n900 I think it's the dsp15:28
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SpeedEvilruskie: It's not really15:44
SpeedEvilruskie: There is a seperate very limited core which does processing of the camera stream15:45
SpeedEvilThe reason the N8 camera si better is basically that the camera module is simply better.15:45
SpeedEvilThe processing has almost nothing to do with it.15:45
HyperSnyperwhats the best way to transfer music/video files to internall storage without USb cable people ?15:46
HyperSnyperwinscp ? install an ftp server ?15:46
HyperSnyper^ n90015:46
SpeedEvilI use rsync15:46
SpeedEviland sometimes sftp15:46
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: you can get those relatively cheap on ebay, google for CA-101 to get a genuine one, or pick any arbitrary cable. Anyway get such a cable, YOU'LL NEED IT!15:47
ruskiescp is the main way I trasnfer things15:47
HyperSnyperhave orderd already DocScrutinizer15:47
HyperSnyperbut 3 days eta15:47
HyperSnyperalso any vital apps ?15:47
HyperSnyperdone rootsh / and 3g/2g siwtcher so far15:47
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DocScrutinizerload applet, a must-have in my book15:48
HyperSnyperalso is there a way to search the app manager ?15:49
DocScrutinizeryes, just type15:49
SpeedEvilLoad applet is awesome.15:49
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HyperSnyperalso everytime i got app manager main screen it checks for update..15:50
HyperSnyperbit annoying15:50
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SpeedEvilopenssh client+server15:50
DocScrutinizerit's not exactly the best you could get, but suffices to tell when shit happens on your device15:50
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: (check fro updates) yeah some bug in HAM introduced with PR1.3 probably15:51
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DocScrutinizernobody bothered to look into it more deeply (except javispedro once)15:52
DocScrutinizerso it's not getting fixed :-/15:52
SpeedEvilxchat, recorder, firefox, khweetur, opera, wifieye15:52
acidspunkspeaking of camera and dsp did anyone ever figure how to get rid of the stutter while filming15:52
DocScrutinizernone here15:52
SpeedEvilSomeone mentioned earlier that locking the CPU to 600MHz worked for them15:52
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: video?15:52
SpeedEvilI don't get smooth video15:52
HyperSnyperit's got a prett low framerate hasn't it ?15:53
HyperSnyperprob dropping frames15:53
SpeedEvilyes, frame dropping.15:53
DocScrutinizerhmm, I did quite few videos, so I'll shut up15:53
SpeedEvilOh - and 'radio' - not fmradio15:53
HyperSnyperSpeedEvil is firefox of any use really ?15:53
HyperSnyperthought internal browser was built of FF15:53
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: tweakr!!!15:54
SpeedEvilHyperSnyper: firefox and opera are not any better (and in some ways worse than) mucrob15:54
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SpeedEvilBut, every browser has issues with some sites, and having alternatives is good.15:54
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HyperSnyperalso any things that save alota power i should disable/enable ?15:54
DocScrutinizerto get custom profiles, and whatnot else15:54
SpeedEvilAlso - opera has opera turbo, and configurable loading of images15:54
HyperSnyperalready got the 2g/3g dual15:54
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SpeedEvilThis can greatly reduce data use15:55
HyperSnyperopera turbo is nice15:55
HyperSnyperuse it on my s40 nokia15:55
acidspunkyeah fbreader is amazing15:55
DocScrutinizerTHE cron alternative15:55
HyperSnypercron <315:56
DocScrutinizerno cron on maemo15:56
acidspunkxarchiver for zip and rar files15:56
HyperSnyperdid alot fun stuff on the dreambox with cron and bash scripts15:56
HyperSnyperC FM Radio or FM Radio Player ?15:57
DocScrutinizeryou'll want to add a symlink from /opt/foo/bar/ (or whatever it's called) to /usr/bin15:57
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DocScrutinizermoo javispedro15:57
javispedroI would be crazy not to be here the day everything goes down the toilet =)15:58
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: say helo to tizon15:58
javispedroDocScrutinizer, I've been here already for a while.15:58
DocScrutinizerhi nevertheless :-)15:58
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HyperSnyperalso i rememer reading few days ago about enabling FM transmitter on all frequencies15:58
acidspunkwhat's happening today?15:58
HyperSnyperis that a simple app15:58
HyperSnyperor takes more editing15:58
DocScrutinizerthat's jacekowski's domain15:59
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* acidspunk is going to have lunch16:00
DocScrutinizerhe offers a pkg to replace the stock drivers with something that relieves some limitations afaik16:00
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: I might toss over a list of all pkgs I got installed, if you're interested16:01
HyperSnyperdeff would be16:01
DocScrutinizerit's way too long to be useful (dpkg -l)16:02
DocScrutinizeras it has all the stock stuff as well16:03
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DocScrutinizeryou might be able to do a diff to yours ;-)16:03
HyperSnyperwhat i was just thinking16:03
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DocScrutinizerwhich should reduce it to a few 100 lines16:03
HyperSnypergot an excel file with filterin macro's i use fo rwork16:03
HyperSnyperjust installed openssh server+client16:04
HyperSnyperasking for new root pass...16:04
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: here you are
HyperSnyperthxs DocScrutinizer, much appreciated16:05
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DocScrutinizermaybe something even better for you:
DocScrutinizerand my apt-get log from there (moment please)16:07
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HyperSnyperu suggest i install that backup app now and do backup, before going further ?16:08
DocScrutinizerget backupmenu and do a backup now (and every now and then) - YES16:09
DocScrutinizer^^ my installed-apps.sh16:10
DocScrutinizerthe apt-get log I implemented in
DocScrutinizerdoesn't contain all the apps installed via HAM16:11
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HyperSnyperbackupmenu not in the app manager ?16:11
DocScrutinizerand has some installs meant to fix things I (or CSSU ;-D) broke, so I don't recommend to run that list of stuff indiscriminately16:12
DocScrutinizerbackupmenu is in HAM16:12
HyperSnyperis it ok to install stuff diect from ?16:16
HyperSnyperor that not advised16:16
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Sicelou mean .debs?16:24
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HyperSnypere.g >
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HyperSnyperhas an install abutton16:26
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Sicelothat's fine16:27
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SiceloHAM takes care of that :)16:27
DocScrutinizerfor "normal clean" pkgs also an apt-get install  is fine16:29
DocScrutinizera tad hard to tell what's a normal pkg16:29
DocScrutinizere.g powerkernel isn't, i2ctools isn't16:30
DocScrutinizerCSSU isn't16:30
DocScrutinizerall those also won't install cleanly from this thing, errr... fapman16:30
DocScrutinizeraaah starhash-eanbler isn't, as well ;-P16:31
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DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: and you probably want to get *#-ena :-D16:32
DocScrutinizer(h-e-n for sure isn't a "clean" pkg, for installation via fapman ;-D)16:33
HyperSnyperhmm got an issue16:33
HyperSnypercan't get root16:33
HyperSnyperunknown pass16:33
DocScrutinizerit's a bit concerning that almost all pkgs I did or contributed aren't "clean" :-P16:33
DocScrutinizeruse cmd "root"16:34
DocScrutinizersudo doesn't work16:34
DocScrutinizerneither does su16:34
DocScrutinizerroot  == su -16:34
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DocScrutinizersudo gainroot == su16:35
DocScrutinizerof course you also could use ssh root@localhost16:36
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DocScrutinizerbut it's  a bit awkward, compared to "root" ;-)16:36
DocScrutinizeraah, and NEVER do apt-get autoremove!16:37
HyperSnypernearly killed my deb server doing bad things with that before16:37
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Ian---#j #tizen17:17
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HyperSnyperdoes the n900 mediaplayer not play albums in right order ?17:18
HyperSnyperseems to be sorting alphabetically by artist17:18
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e0xso meego is gone17:31
e0xbut the community will continue de work ?17:32
crashanddiede work?17:32
crashanddiegerman translations?17:32
e0xthe work *17:33
Pauly2i gather i should not buy an n9?17:33
SpeedEvilPauly2: this has almost nothing to do with that.17:33
Pauly2wait for samsung device17:33
SpeedEvilIt is unlikely this will change any of nokias plans for the n917:33
SpeedEvilnokia left meego _ages_ ago.17:34
SpeedEvilThis latest announcement is utterly irrelevant to it17:34
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e0xyes , n9 was not really a meego device17:34
Pauly2ah whatever lol17:35
e0xbut is the n9 hack friendly , i mean like n900 that in some way you could experiment installing other OS , etc17:35
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pabs3didn't they lock the bootloader?17:36
e0xnot sure , that is what i want know17:37
SpeedEvile0x: No.17:37
SpeedEvile0x: At least at the moment, it's looking not.17:37
SpeedEvilWait at least a week or three till n9s actually hit users hands, and we can see what the released software is.17:38
e0xnow with my n900 broken i feel empty and lost17:38
Pauly2yous excited about html5 :)17:38
e0xi need a new smartphone17:38
SpeedEvile0x: Where are you in the world?17:38
e0xthat let me "play" with it17:38
Pauly2im getting my n900 back in mail17:39
e0xSpeedEvil: dominican republic17:39
HyperSnypernother question where should i make a folder so it would show in root dir on tm600 file manager17:39
SpeedEviln9 allows - in the default config - a hell of a lot less play.17:39
SpeedEvilHow things will evolve over the next few weeks is another question.17:39
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e0xlet see what hapen17:40
Pauly2ill have my n900 that i sold back in 3-6 weeks from st lucia17:40
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DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: ~user/MyDocs/<myfolderinroot>17:40
e0xi get a old nokia 5230 meanwhile17:40
HyperSnyperthxs again DocScrutinizer17:41
Pauly2i have an n817:41
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e0xtoo expence if i hope buy another phone i could not buy a n8 or something like that17:41
DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: keep in mind this is a VFAT fs, no execution of binaries, no permissions17:41
HyperSnyperjust for roms and video at mo17:42
DocScrutinizerthat's the way to go then17:42
DocScrutinizerthat's what MyDocs is meant for17:42
Pauly2i sold my n900 on ebay to buy an n8 but now they guy i sold my n900  said it arrived broke is returning it he got his money back  so maybe ill have a working n900 again17:43
DocScrutinizerls -la ~user/MyDocs17:43
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DocScrutinizerPauly2: we already heard that story17:43
Pauly2i like to chat17:44
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HyperSnypergot another one for you DocScrutinizer, wheer can i change the auto lock time ?17:44
HyperSnyperfound time setting for lock with pin code17:44
HyperSnyperbut not the swipe one17:44
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* HyperSnyper hides17:45
DocScrutinizerif at all17:45
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DocScrutinizerthough I thought this timeout is pretty easy to set up via settings ->screen or sth like that17:48
HyperSnyperhmm might of missed it17:48
DocScrutinizer"dim after" or sth17:48
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DocScrutinizersettings -> display: first one after brightness "automatically dim screen after:... 10s...2min"17:51
DocScrutinizerother values might or might not be available thru direct editing of mce.ini17:52
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DocScrutinizerdang, mce.ini [TKLock] has no key for screen dim timeout, must get stored in gconf or what?17:59
HyperSnyperwhats the max local wifi speed you people get on transfers ?18:00
HyperSnypergetting about 500KB/s with winscp18:00
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strangri am trying to compile an app using qt creator that uses Gdigicam18:03
strangri got the package libgdigicam-dev18:04
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strangrand installed in madde runtime from remote shell18:04
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strangrthen i copied the relevant files from my runtime /usr/include and /usr/lib to the sysroot18:04
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strangrbut still not working18:05
strangri am not able to link the libraries18:05
strangrmy pro file is here18:05
strangrplz help18:06
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DocScrutinizerHyperSnyper: sounds about right18:33
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Sc0rpiusso MeeGo hasn't even been completely born and is dead already18:46
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BluesLeeSc0rpius: honestly, this is crazy18:50
Sc0rpiusit is18:50
BluesLeejust before n9 is hitting the market18:50
Sc0rpiusindeed, it's a disaster18:50
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BluesLeewe should be optimistic but those big companies like nokia, intel etc dont seem to care18:52
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BluesLeei need some frustration chocolate :-)18:54
wmaronefunny that people really care about the N9, considering the price and extremely constrained distribution18:55
* Cor-Ai gives BluesLee a bar of frustration chocolate18:55
BluesLeeCor-Ai: hehe18:55
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* Cor-Ai has got his drivers licens today so he is nice18:56
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BluesLeewmarone: the idea is to have a device which is more or less supported by a vendor and a good working community like this one, that would be sufficient for me18:57
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Sc0rpiusI'd get an N9 any day before an Android phone18:58
Sc0rpius(and I have an Android tablet)18:58
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* DocScrutinizer wonders why everybody thinks N9 is related to meego any way whatsoever19:01
Sc0rpiusHarmattan IS Meego19:01
Sc0rpiuswhy you guys differenciate them19:01
DocScrutinizerharmattan *is* maemo19:01
DocScrutinizerthough a terribly crippled maemo19:01
Sc0rpiusOS MeeGo OS, v1.2 Harmattan19:02
Sc0rpiusthat sounds like MeeGo to me19:02
Sc0rpiusthat's from the official specifications page19:02
DocScrutinizermv meego foobar19:02
Sc0rpiusCPU 1GHz Cortex A8 CPU, PowerVR SGX530 GPU, TI OMAP 3630 chipset19:02
Sc0rpiusoh another OMAP?19:02
Sc0rpiusit includes Angry Bird Magic :)19:03
DocScrutinizerthe only relation of N9 to meego is Intel kicked Nokia's balls by abandoning meego right in time to make Nokia look like a fool with their renaming of maemo6-harmattan to meego19:04
Sc0rpiusand now Intel is abandoning Meego19:04
DocScrutinizererr that's what I just said, yes19:05
Sc0rpiusI got it19:05
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Sc0rpiuswell if you see it that way, that's a nice revenge19:05
Sc0rpiusfrom Intel19:05
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DocScrutinizerNokia now was WAY BETTER off with N9 labeled "OS: maemo6 harmattan"19:06
DocScrutinizeras maemo excelled on 770, N8x0, N90019:07
wmaronenokia couldn't have come out on top, what with internal opposition to the thing19:07
DocScrutinizerwhile meego did what exactly?19:07
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Sc0rpiusthough I haven't seen the OS myself yet, if you say it's Maemo, they should have branded it that way19:07
TSCHAKeeeit IS Maemo19:08
Sc0rpiusMeeGo has done nothing19:08
TSCHAKeeewith the app layer done in Qt19:08
Sc0rpiusQt is great :)19:08
* pabs3 wonders if this will delay the N9 release, quickly s/MeeGo/Maemo/ everwhere and rebuild19:08
TSCHAKeeeso basically the last year was completely fucking wasted.19:08
wmaroneSc0rpius: I know, the MeeGo CE doesn't exist at all...19:08
Sc0rpiuspabs3, that would be the best Nokia could do19:08
DocScrutinizerpabs3: hahaha19:09
DocScrutinizertoo late, but then again that's Nokia19:09
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FIQso meego disappeared as well? D:20:23
RST38hFIQ: got you believing in it, didn't they?=)20:23
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FIQ"The Tizen application programming interfaces are based on HTML5 and other web standards, and we anticipate that the vast majority of Tizen application development will be based on these emerging standards." so an upgraded web OS, more or less?20:24
FIQ(allbeit more open)20:24
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kerioFIQ: [citation needed]20:27
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fluxkerio, you know, these days you can just google for quotes and be done with it :)20:35
keriono, i meant wrt the "albeit more open" part20:35
fluxI doubt such comparative statement would be given, but I guess Linux Foundation partnetship must mean something.. right? right?!20:36
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* DocScrutinizer officially declares 2011 "The Year Of Mobile Phone Market Madness"20:40
kerioDocScrutinizer: i blame openmoko20:40
kerioespecially YOU20:40
DocScrutinizer/kick kerio20:41
kerioreally though, what should i buy when my n900 dies?20:44
DocScrutinizerbtw, just in case you haven't noticed, OM the inc is "dead" since 2009, and I'm not a part of it just ~6 months longer - wish I could say I managed to resign just in time, but actually they convinced me to stay just to kick me out some 6 weeks later20:44
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kerioDocScrutinizer: your hostmask cloak says otherwise :>20:45
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DocScrutinizerthat's a community hostmask, not a corporate one20:45
RST38hDOc: sucket!20:45
DocScrutinizerkerio: as it stands now, I'd suggest you get another N900 when your N900 dies20:48
kerioheh :\20:48
kerio(i still haven't fixed the usb port, btw)20:48
kerio(it's been more than a year now)20:48
kerioi'm swapping between two batteries with an external charger20:48
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Hoxzerkerio: :-(20:57
keriois PR1.3/CSSU actually worth repairing my usb port?20:57
timeless> *Please give email address.20:58
timelessclearly nokia's grasp of the English language hasn't improved since my departure20:58
timeless=> sp300020:58
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RST38ha wikipedian20:58
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SpeedEvilkerio: It's technically possible without21:01
timelessanyone know if the n9 (sorry if it's offtopic, but it's really maemo6) is available for sale anywhere?21:02
SpeedEvilkerio: Install the bootloader app, boot mego from SD. flash from that.21:02
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DocScrutinizerhey timeless - long time no see21:03
timelesshey, just dropping by for a bit21:04
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timelesshow's life?21:04
keriomaemo6+aegis is hardly maemo :(21:04
* timeless is starting a new year tonight21:04
timelesskerio: yeah well21:04
DocScrutinizercongrats :-)21:04
SpeedEviltimeless: passling furiously after the ship just sank for the third time.21:04
* timeless notes that the nokia related groups are really terrible about branding21:05
timeless"SteelRat", really?21:05
DocScrutinizertimeless: (for sale) now this time for real google is your best friend21:05
timelessDocScrutinizer: froogle (google product search) only fouind one vendor, who claimed it was available for preorder21:06
DocScrutinizeryeah, shipping started like 2 days ago21:06
timelessand nokia's web site is hopeless (well, unchanged, and hopeless), so i can't use it to find a purchase link21:06
timelessbut who's selling it?21:06
timelessi want to link to a sale button21:06
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keriotimeless: buy it from ebay at a billion dollars21:06
DocScrutinizertimeless: dunno, amazon?21:07
timelessthe amazon front page is offering me a Kindle Fire21:07
timelessamazon offers me n9 gell covers, n8s, and e7s21:08
timelessplus some samsung t92921:08
keriotimeless: buy an openpandora21:10
kerioat least it has a physical keyboard21:10
timelesskerio: i'm quite happy w/ my Torch21:10
DocScrutinizerand no aegis ;-P21:10
timelessit has a slide out keyboard, and a decent osk21:10
kerioDocScrutinizer: and no aegis!21:11
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timelessthe ssh story isn't wonderful21:11
timelessbut for that, i'm relatively happy to use my PlayBook21:12
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* DocScrutinizer waves and heads out for a nice beer21:13
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* timeless likes how the list is :: namespaced except for `tcb` which isn't21:16
timelessalthough, call-ui::call-ui is nice21:16
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sp3000timeless: worksforme, it gives me an ok fi string in an otherwise en page21:17
timelesspicture or something?21:18
sp3000hmm ...cantbearsed :)21:18
timelessyeah, paste-to-the-web is nowhere near as easy as pastebin21:19
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timelesshow about a pastebin of the page (html or rendered) ?21:19
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petteriafter reading all this whining about aegis I am wondering what the developer mode in n9 setting does?21:20
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timelesspetteri: presumably develsh21:20
RST38hdoes n9 still have developer mode?21:20
SpeedEvilpetteri: I don't think there's been a report of what the actual released n9s have21:20
timelesswhich is all the things not listed in the page DocScrutinizer linked :)21:20
timelessSpeedEvil: has there been a report of a genuine n9 in the wild?21:21
SpeedEviltimeless: no.21:21
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petteriso the aegis stuff is just FUD?21:21
timelesspetteri: no21:22
timelessaegis is most definitely  a designed feature of the n921:22
timelessand it was designed partly based on requirements from certain nokia groups and presumably operators21:22
timelessthose groups and third parties are almost entirely irrelevant in the real world21:22
petterithat I know, but i thought there were dev mode to access stuff on n921:22
timelessbut management doesn't live in the real world21:22
SpeedEvilAegis is unimportant if all you want to do is develop simple user-mode apps that do not touch the hardware in any way, and sell them to users through ovi store.21:22
timelessand heck, they don't really live at all at this point :)21:22
timelessSpeedEvil: is the ovi store really going to even be there?21:23
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SpeedEvilFor anything outside that - it gets complex.21:23
timelessit certainly won't be there in 2015 :)21:23
SpeedEviltimeless: And yes, that's a big issue.21:23
* SpeedEvil points at ovi store for n900.21:23
timelessis that around?21:23
timelessi recently got errors trying to use HAM21:23
SpeedEvilIt was sorta- for a few months, but it died.21:23
timelessseems like certain nokia services got dropped21:23
SpeedEvilI note that you _still_ can't buy angry birds levels.21:24
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timelessa guy at a Toronto based book fair suggested i could download his group's app from the ovi store21:24
SpeedEvil(on n950 at least)21:24
* RST38h laughs satanically21:24
timelesshe clearly didn't realize the n900 wasn't compatible w/ symbian21:24
timelessthankfully i had my BlackBerry and was able to download his app from our App World21:24
timelessthe reward for the download was a free bag (which i needed for books i got at the fair)21:24
SpeedEvilClearly the opportunity for a community baser merbian.21:25
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timelesswell, iirc you were supposed to be able to Write a letter to Symbian Foundation asking for a Sources Repo on Disk21:25
* RST38h ponders how long RiM will stay in business, continues laughing satanically21:25
timelessbut that offer may have expired21:25
timelessRST38h: hey, we lasted longer than MeeGo and WebOS :)21:25
* vmlemon_ notes that the source is still available on SourceForge and Google Code :)21:26
timelessvmlemon_: really?21:26
petteriso nobody knows what the developer mode on n9 does?21:26
timelessdid someone actually hg push those?21:26
timelessvmlemon_: oh cool21:26
sp3000lol, it's a game of which ship sinks slowest ;)21:26
timelesssp3000: yes!21:26
* timeless wants to be on that ship21:26
vmlemon_ and
timelessWin XP is one of those ships too fwiw21:26
timelessvmlemon_: hrm21:27
timelessthat's a code drop21:27
timelessnot an hg clone21:27
timeless(at least the sf one)21:27
vmlemon_You can import the .hg files into Mercurial, and reconstitute the repository histories, somehow...21:27
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timelessvmlemon_: i doubt it21:28
timelessthe Hg content was considerably larger than 500mb21:28
* vmlemon_ believes that the SF stuff was lifted from the Foundation's FTP server, prior to its closure.21:28
SpeedEvilIs it me, or has most of the spam in ovi store been cleaned out?21:28
timelessunless someone was getting much better compression21:28
timelessthe former doesn't seem to have the MCL stuff21:28
timelesswhich is probably main-code-line21:28
vmlemon_If you really wanted it, you could register on, accept their NDA and access the latest core OS code under a weird Shared Source licence...21:28
* timeless never asked what it stood for21:28
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vmlemon_Master Code Line, Release Code Line, and Feature Code Line.21:29
timelessvmlemon_: you had the unfortunate experience of some actual involvement w/ symbian?21:29
timelessmy sympathies21:29
timelessoh right, we actually vaguely interacted when i poked symbian21:30
timeless(that was probably 2 years ago)21:30
vmlemon_It's not *that* bad, in comparison to some OSes...21:30
timelesswhich ones?21:30
timelessand which layers?21:30
timelessactually yes, some parts of symbian really didn't seem too bad21:30
vmlemon_As far as APIs and architecture are concerned, Bada comes to mind.21:30
vmlemon_I haven't been impressed by the Android APIs, during my current exploration of them, either.21:31
vmlemon_(Try populating a list widget from an XML-defined String array, or obtaining the number of contacts in the system DB from another class - without crashing your application at launch)...21:32
timelessi've had to deal w/ the contacts api21:32
timelessthere are at least 221:33
timelessthe old deprecated one21:33
timelessand the new replacement one21:33
* vmlemon_ notes that he's supposed to familiarise himself with that steaming turd for an upcoming contract.21:33
timelessmy sympathies21:33
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vmlemon_Last time that I checked, you had to override and subclass a ton of crap, and then chain various "Adapters" together to do anything - in the former scenario.21:35
vmlemon_Even just figuring out how to make a button work was a pain in the arse...21:36
vmlemon_(I eventually got 2 working, but never figured out how to make a checkbox enable or disable a given UI widget).21:36
* timeless is happy21:37
* timeless has a full screen youtube video running on the other display21:37
vmlemon_Given the choice, I'd rather work with Qt - but I guess that I can't be too choosy right now, if it brings much-needed income.21:37
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vmlemon_As for other nominations for "Worse than Symbian OS", I'd happily nominate Win32...21:40
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* timeless actually likes Win3221:40
vmlemon_(Or the Mac OS X Disc Recording APIs).21:40
vmlemon_Now those are evil.21:40
timelessthere's also the hodgepodge that is OS6-921:40
vmlemon_"Contexts", "Dissenters" and other fun, undocumented things...21:40
timelessor rather System 6..OS921:40
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vmlemon_I was positively shocked when I saw WinRT C++ example code for the first time - but that soon turned to disappointment, after reading that they're only useful for developing Metro crapps.21:42
vmlemon_(I've also played with the recent Windows 8 preview, and was very disappointed).21:42
timelessi actually like w821:42
timelessalthough i've triggered a number of panics on it21:43
timelessi'm also relatively impressed by their validator21:43
TSCHAKeeewe truly are in a clueless and stupid period of computer science21:43
timelessalthough, that too has crashed21:43
TSCHAKeeethe answer is always "abstract more"21:43
TSCHAKeeenot peel back and fix21:43
vmlemon_I immediately thought "Did they hire the designers of the Nintendo Wii UI?" and "Why would I want my laptop to work like a giant phone or games console?"21:43
TSCHAKeeevmlemon_: it's about getting the "other 40% who aren't constant computer users"21:44
TSCHAKeeevmlemon_: it turns out... apparently, they're idiots.21:44
vmlemon_TSCHAKeee: Makes sense, in retrospective.21:44
TSCHAKeeebasically, the answer always seems to have been21:45
TSCHAKeee"make bigger training wheels"21:45
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vmlemon_Even if it means that the power users and developers have to suffer the curse of interfaces inspired by Teletubby Land, and all kinds of arcane "features", erm restrictions.21:46
* vmlemon_ felt the same way about GNOME3, too.21:47
vmlemon_(I reckon that they'll eventually just turn it into a gigantic "Do Something" button).21:47
RST38hIt will be labelled "Worship Us!"21:48
vmlemon_I suppose that works, too.21:48
TSCHAKeeeI was always a fan of Engelbart's approach of trainable interfaces21:49
TSCHAKeeebut, heh. I am in a very small minority21:49
vmlemon_Or "Praise", since "real" users are obviously incapable of reading more than a single word.21:49
* TSCHAKeee has actually _used_ Augment.21:49
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vmlemon_Or it could just be neon green, and transform in colour when clicked.21:49
vmlemon_Bonus points if it pulsates; and plays sound effects when clicked, too.21:50
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vmlemon_Double-clicking will obviously just shut the machine down, without prior warning...21:52
RST38hEverything will be ok21:53
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RST38hGnome3 people, as well as Unity people will end up with what they want - a glorified media center for idiots21:54
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RST38hAnd the rest of us, using their computers for professional activities, will end up with Xfce, Linus style21:54
sp3000vmlemon_: would a Like button do21:55
vmlemon_I suppose so.21:55
sp3000I can't use xcfe, I can't ever remember which way around to put the f and c21:56
vmlemon_Maybe it should cause a synthesised Barbie-esque voice to say "I like you too!" ;)21:56
sp3000roses are red, violets are blue; math is, wait21:57
vmlemon_Or "Segmentation Fault"?21:59
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SpeedEvilRST38h: And eventially patent enforcement on UI will get so prevalant that the only remaining possible UI is xfce.22:03
SpeedEvilEveryone wins22:03
vmlemon_Either that, or we revert to punch cards.22:04
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RST38hibm has a patent on those22:05
vmlemon_"To successfully dial your number, please connect test points J3 and J4 on your handset's motherboard, now"22:05
derfI hope they don't have one filed in the last 26 years.22:06
RST38hderf: easy to extend, if you know the right people in dc22:06
derf26 years is the number even IBM views as "safe".22:07
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vmlemon_Just wait until your Microsoft Windows Phone 7 Series R2 SP1 phone crashes with the timeless BSOD...22:09
vmlemon_(There should probably also be a "Professional Edition" descriptor somewhere in there, too).22:10
ruskieSpeedEvil, you're forgeting fvwm ;)22:10
vmlemon_(And probably also "Nokia with")...22:11
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SpeedEvilruskie: naah22:12
merlin1991RST38h: xfce? awesome is the way to go22:12
SpeedEvilruskie: I had a patched version of fvwm95 as my main wm till maybe 200422:15
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Sicelo5/j #pkg-n90022:34
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NIN101#pkg-n900 is on oftc Sicelo :-).22:36
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smharso meego got the same maemo treatment?!22:59
smharit was just a matter of time22:59
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smhara more reason for me to love my N900 more :-)22:59
hiemanshunow it will have Maemo, MeeGo CE and Tizen, and Android :P23:00
hiemanshuQuad Boot :D23:00
TSCHAKeeethe world will not abide an open system23:00
TSCHAKeeetoo many greedy fucks out there23:00
smharbtw where did get this name from. and they were making fun of meego!23:01
hiemanshuwell Tizen is Lebanese means 'Two asses'23:01
hiemanshuso there you go23:01
* smhar remembers the days of Neo and OpenMoko23:01
smharTSCHAKeee, I am afraid you are correct. very very sadly23:02
TSCHAKeeei've become very heartbroken over the last 30 some odd years23:03
TSCHAKeeewatching amazing systems die23:03
TSCHAKeeebeing squashed by things just good enough to fool everyone23:03
* hiemanshu wasn't even alive back then23:03
TSCHAKeeewatching Atari collapse was my first...23:04
TSCHAKeeethen Amiga23:04
TSCHAKeeethen NeXT23:04
smharI am way too younger than you, but I've seen some very great systems die too, Delphi and the whole Borland..23:04
smharare they still alive somewhere?23:04
TSCHAKeeeNeXT swallowed Apple (reverse merger)23:05
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TSCHAKeeebut now, Apple has become the antichrist23:05
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* TSCHAKeee knows OS/2's history all too well23:05
ShadowJKfantastic name. TITS(en)23:06
TSCHAKeeeMicrosoft's second OS, (or third actually, not many people remember that Microsoft's first OS was a licensed version of UNIX... XENIX)23:06
smharI was so exited when I installed it for the first time23:06
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TSCHAKeeeMicrosoft partners with on OS/2... creates OS/2 2.0 NT.... IBM and Microsoft suffer clash of egos, Microsoft and IBM each take the codebase at that point... IBM makes OS/2 2.0... Microsoft creates Windows NT...23:07
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smharPalm and even better Visor23:08
DocScrutinizerpetteri: developer mode means you can download app_as_stupid_as_bread from your PC and not *only* from OVI. This however doesn't change the fact that on HARM root must NOT write files to /home/user/*23:08
* TSCHAKeee was a Palm _and_ a Newton user. I moved to Palm after Apple jettisoned Newton during the great clean-up of 1998.23:08
DocScrutinizerfor example23:08
smharwhich few people know what it actually stands for, most people think it stand for Windows Network :-)23:08
TSCHAKeeen-10, aka, the production chip number for the Intel i860.23:09
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ruskiehmm so samsung caved in to m$ "royalties" as well23:11
petteriDocScrutinizer: thanks for the info, I have to explore the system more when I get my n923:13
chem|stsmhar: for some reason delphi and borland are still alive and keep getting on my nerves23:13
* ShadowJK is waiting for open mode before putting in order for N923:14
DocScrutinizer51actually this 'root cant write to user home' is a prety good example how braindamaged the whole policy in fact is. As root may do a su -l user any time, and then write to user home whatever the malware wants to do23:16
ruskieohh fun23:16
smharchem|st, does delphi get any updates?!!23:16
DocScrutinizer51at the end of the day that restrition is just another brick on the road annoying devels while not adding an angstrom to user security23:18
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DocScrutinizer51instead of "mv .ssh/auth* ~user/.ssh/' I have to do brainjogging like 'cat .ssh/auth* | su -l user -c "cat >.ssh/authorized_keys'23:21
ShadowJKhow's SHR these days...23:21
DocScrutinizer51ask in #openmoko-cdevel23:21
chem|stsmhar: there is a 2011 version so I guess yes23:23
smharwow, did not expect to to live this long23:23
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DocScrutinizersmhar: so old? ;-P23:28
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smharDocScrutinizer, not really, but after MS took all major developers from Borland, I though that it will sink deep23:29
DocScrutinizerI don't expect to live 208023:29
smharDocScrutinizer, oh, and I meant Delphi living time, not mine :D23:29
smharI do wonder about mine sometimes though, being near death several times23:30
DocScrutinizerI wonder if I'll ever die or just migrate into the internets completely23:31
DocScrutinizerooops, forgot I'm skynet23:32
smhardepending on your OS, you might need to be formatted over and over again, every time with new life and personality, or you might live loong time23:33
DocScrutinizersometimes the human factor subroutines just get too good23:34
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smharremember DocScrutinizer you can not live with your kernel alone, you need GNU to live completely :D23:35
DocScrutinizerhaha RMS23:36
DocScrutinizerI'm not alive according to your metrics23:36
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* DocScrutinizer idly repositions one of the x-ray laser lead rods to target at logitech headquarters, as they dare to sell 90€ mice with switches not worth 3ct and breaking after just 5000 cycles23:38
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smharyou are wrong, you already contain lots of GNU , it is just not declared.23:40
DocScrutinizerteach me phenomenology! ;-)23:40
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DocScrutinizer(you know where that ended when that bomb refused to go back into the bay...)23:45
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smharlisten my son, you were created in OOP, with a basic class that is encapsulated and hidden, it contains lots of GPL code, then using inheritance and sometimes strange morphing events you and your kind were created.23:46
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smharsomeone please explain this to me: CodeGear Delphi For PHP 1.0 !!!23:47
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smharPascal environment for creating PHP applications?!23:48
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Sicelobtw DocScrutinizer, about pwer usage in ad-hoc vs wifi with apn, thanks. got myself CNet CWA-854, and with max PSM, standby power usage is less than 25mA23:54
Siceloour mobile operator introduced 3/3.5G this week, and seems that power usage is way too much :P23:55
Siceloanyway, i use 2/2.5G all the time, as i need reliability over speed.23:56
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