IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2011-07-21

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vi__is there a magical gconf that indicates if you are connected to the net or not?00:57
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vi__or perhaps A dbus call?00:59
vi__basically is there a foolproof way of determining if I am connected to the net from the cli?01:00
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villagerconnection is the ICD's (Internet Connectivity Daemon) responsibility... you could probably communicate with it over dbus01:09
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keriovi__: wget
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fdskjfsdlplease, guys. is it possible to only download new emails using the mail client with imap (n900 cellphone)?03:47
cehtehmodest should do that, sans bugs03:48
fdskjfsdlhmmm I configures my gmail account but i downloaded everything03:48
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cehtehwell modest is a pile of compressed bugs03:49
cehtehi gave up with email on my n900, its useless03:49
fdskjfsdlhaha... is there another client? but a nice one :P03:50
cehtehno idle support, no subscription management, notifies for each and every spam03:50
cehtehthere is claws which somewhat works ..03:50
cehtehbut its not optimized for a smal device03:50
fdskjfsdlhmmm will I need to keep using webmail and looking in the n900 every 15 min?03:50
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fdskjfsdlhmmm got it03:50
cehtehand there is trojta or similar (forgot the name) which tries to be imap only, but it has no much features either03:51
cehtehimap is just broken with the n900 and modest03:51
fdskjfsdland using pop? do you think modest can solve my problem?03:51
fdskjfsdlall I need is to download the new emails03:51
cehtehtry it03:52
fdskjfsdlty :)03:52
cehtehits rather optimized for some push service (ovi?) .. but hey i dont want to give anyone else access to my mail03:52
MohammadAGwhoever does the next fm radio app, add a timeshift feature03:52
MohammadAGNokia Messaging, I don't mind them having my password03:53
cehtehyes exactly03:53
cehtehi dont want that03:53
MohammadAGit's not like they give a shit about my facebook notifications03:53
MohammadAGor my paypal notifications03:53
MohammadAGor emails from friends03:53
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cehtehwell they may become hacked too03:54
MohammadAGno worries, PSN already handled that03:54
cehtehanyways .. no working/useable imap mail on the n90003:55
MohammadAGa viagra ad email from my address to my whole contact was a nice way to get in touch with old friends03:55
cehtehif you have only one folder and receive less than 5 mails per day, then maybe ok03:55
MohammadAGhad to apologize to a lot of people :/03:55
MohammadAGespecially school03:56
cehtehyou read that hotmail has this new "my friend got hacked" button? :)03:56
MohammadAGgmail ftw :P03:56
MohammadAGbut no, what does that do?03:57
cehtehif you receive spam which appears to be from a friend then you can tag that as 'his account probably got compromised'03:57
cehtehdunno what they then do, prolly some automatic notification and password renewal03:57
cehtehi dont use hotmail .. my mail server sits about 4meter from me under the window  :P03:58
cehtehmhm wondering if installing a full blown mail server (and imap server) on the n900 itself, and fetchmail could fix the issues :P03:59
cehtehbut ew .. i dont want to go that far03:59
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FIQ|n900quick logical question04:03
FIQ|n900XNOR is the same as "is equal to"?04:03
FIQ|n900or well, it is like it04:03
FIQ|n900works too04:07
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n900can anyone tell me a command for n900 to check disk?04:10
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cehtehinstall backupmenu, it can fsck at bootup (boot with keyboard slide out)04:17
cehtehotherwise, you have to install the rootsh, unmount the partition in question and run fsck on it04:18
cehtehthe kernel power tools can also force a fsck on boot04:18
Guest79433i have root sh04:20
Guest79433how i unmount the partition?04:20
Guest79433and how i mount  back?04:21
Guest79433and if i install backup menu it's any posibilyty to break my device?04:21
cehtehuhm you are linux noob? ... then better uninstall rootsh :P04:22
Guest79433i use root sh for some stuff04:23
cehtehwell in theory backup menu can break it .. but in practice you can prolly do worse when you dont know what you are doing :P04:23
Guest79433i know some stuff04:23
cehtehwhich partition do you want to check?04:23
Guest79433but i whant to learn04:23
cehtehthere are more than 2 :P04:24
Guest79433i don't whant to check the boot partition04:24
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cehtehcat /proc/partitions04:24
cehtehwell the 'MyDocs' and the µSD i suspect?04:25
Guest79433i don't have usd04:25
Guest79433i whant to check system04:25
Guest79433and MyDocs04:25
cehtehsystem as in /home .. thats a bit hard to check at runtime as it is in use and cant ne unmounted04:26
cehteh(same for root)04:26
cehtehmydocs is easy04:26
Guest79433if i flash a fiasco image will be ok?04:26
cehtehhow does that relate to fsck?04:26
Guest79433this wil solve all my problems?04:27
cehtehwhen you flash something then it overwrites the contents04:27
Guest79433fiasco image?04:27
cehtehi dont know what problems you have04:27
cehtehbut usually flashing will erase anything whats there, for most people that will cause problems :P04:27
cehtehdo you want to erase your device?04:28
Guest79433how i check mydocs?04:28
cehtehin the simplest case you just plug in USB04:28
Guest79433i have transmission04:28
Guest79433and i try to download from torrent04:28
cehtehor .. no bad idea .. i always forget this crappy automounters04:28
Guest79433when i open a torrent file the phone stuck04:28
cehtehso back .. do NOT plugin usb04:28
cehtehopen root shell04:28
cehtehumount /home/user/MyDocs04:29
cehteh(close all apps!)04:29
Guest79433i have unmonted04:29
cehtehgives a list of all mounted partitions, double check that the MyDocs is not there and unmounted04:29
cehteh /dev/mmcblk0p1 on /home/user/MyDocs type ext4 (rw,noatime,errors=continue,commit=600,data=writeback)04:30
cehteh... you have prolly a vfat filesystem?04:30
Guest79433i don't know04:30
cehtehif you dont changed anything then its vfat04:30
cehtehso are you absolutely sure its unmounted?04:31
cehtehno errors .. not listed in the mount output?04:31
Guest79433is unmounted04:31
Guest79433what i do next?04:31
cehtehfsck.vfat /dev/mmcblk0p104:32
cehtehwhat problems did you have anyways?04:33
Guest79433i have a error04:34
Guest79433leaving file system unchanged04:34
cehtehyes that was only the check without repairing04:34
cehtehdo you have a backup?04:35
cehtehjust in case you loose some data04:35
Guest79433no i don't have04:35
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Guest79433tell me04:35
Guest79433what's next04:35
cehtehso what where your problems? and do you have a linux box?04:35
Guest79433linux box?04:36
cehtehif yes then its prolly a good idea to make a backup now04:36
cehtehcomputer running linux04:36
Guest79433i have unbuntu04:36
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Guest79433but now i'm on windows04:36
cehtehwell i recommend to make a backup .. dont blame me if you dont do and loose data04:36
Guest79433i will not blame you04:37
Guest79433i have copy after contacts04:37
Guest79433what's next?04:37
cehtehso fsck.vfat -a /dev/mmcblk0p104:37
cehtehwill try to fix it04:37
cehteh(or may fatally go wrong)04:37
Guest79433is ok now04:38
cehtehfsck.vfat -h  gives some help about other options04:38
cehtehok lucky you04:38
Guest79433now how i mount back?04:38
fdskjfsdlhey, tell me something, please. dows n900 maemo's email client plays a sound when a new email arrive?04:38
cehtehfdskjfsdl: sound, notification dialog, blinking LED and whats not04:39
cehtehGuest79433: mount -t vfat /dev/mmcblk0p1 /home/user/MyDocs04:40
Guest79433i mount vfat?04:40
fdskjfsdlcehteh: nice, because I'm fighting to put my pop to work, it would be disappointing if such behavirourdid not happen hehe04:40
cehtehis there a lost+found dir? /home/user/MyDocs/lost+found  ?04:40
cehtehif yes, is it empty? (i dont know if vfat fsck creates one)04:40
fdskjfsdland I am manually configring the account... am I supposed to use gmail's pre-configuration or can I continue manually?04:41
cehtehfdskjfsdl: well its annoying because it doesnt work04:41
cehtehno idea04:41
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fdskjfsdlhahaha heelllll, i am praying for the pop to work04:41
fdskjfsdlhey, a telnet can do the job... what is the difficulty in the client to only telling me new emails?04:41
cehtehGuest79433: if all works, check for your content there and so on .. then you are fine, maybe this manual mounting left some mount options out (i dont know the default mount options the n900 uses for vfat)04:42
Guest79433internal error aplication manager closed04:42
cehtehso if all is ok now, then do a reboot soon04:42
cehtehthe application manager doesnt use the MyDocs partition04:42
Guest79433this is my second n90004:43
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cehtehwas that your problem earlier? hey i asked many times whats your problem04:43
Guest79433my firstone dowsn't recognize the internal memory04:43
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Guest79433and i have all the time a error04:43
merlin1991did you drop it?04:43
Guest79433application calendar closed04:43
cehtehwell maybe just reflash it ... but be aware that you should make a backup first04:44
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merlin1991my first n900 had a broken chick for the /home partition04:44
cehtehwell and do a reboot04:44
Guest79433i try to reflash04:44
Termanagood morning04:44
infobotmerlin1991 meant: my first n900 had a broken chip for the /home partition04:44
Guest79433then i had another problem04:44
merlin1991I guess that was wishfull thinking on my side :P04:44
cehtehdid you overclock your device?04:44
Guest79433the phone reboot all the tme04:44
Guest79433i didn't overclock it04:44
cehtehthat was an bug before pr1.204:45
merlin1991Guest79433: after a reboot check /proc/bootreason04:45
cehtehget the pr1.3 images to flash04:45
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Guest79433that was my old n90004:45
Guest79433thx to warranty i have a new phone04:45
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cehtehheh nokia still has spares?04:46
merlin1991cehteh: that bug was awesome especially combined with the rebot about 10 times, get stuck on boot bug :D04:46
cehtehi know04:46
merlin1991I had that the first day when I got my n900 :/04:46
Guest79433the bad part04:46
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Guest79433is that i have a spanish keyboard04:46
Guest79433no up arrow04:46
Guest79433no down arrow04:47
cehtehsame here .. german keyboard04:47
Guest79433and other symbols04:47
Guest79433if i request a english keyboar?04:47
Guest79433the can change it?04:47
Guest79433they can change it?04:48
cehtehits only the keyboard mat04:48
cehtehyou have to open your device, that voids warranty04:48
cehtehand you should know if you are able to exchange it04:48
cehtehnormally its not a user serviceable part, but its trivial to exchange04:48
Guest79433cehteh is a n900 version with 64 Gb memory??04:49
cehtehonly 32GB04:49
Guest79433it's just 32?04:49
cehtehadd a uSD04:50
Guest79433it's bad with uSD04:50
cehtehhow that?04:50
cehtehi try to place as much data on the uSD04:50
Guest79433phone wil work slowly04:50
Guest79433phone will work slowly04:50
cehtehnot really .. mine is ok04:51
Guest79433low procesor04:51
strohhalmjust store your porn somewhere other?04:51
cehtehwhat does the processor speed do with that?04:51
cehtehsome uSD are slow .. slower than emmc04:51
cehtehbut that hardly matters much and anyways, get a quality uSD04:51
cehtehi dont have a very fast one and it still works fine04:52
ShadowJKusd does not make phone slower04:52
Guest79433even if it's almost full?04:52
fdskjfsdlahhh why i cannot send email using gmail's pop!04:52
wblazelook for class-12 <304:52
cehtehany filesystem sux when its almost full04:53
Guest79433not realy04:53
cehtehwell and vfat isnt really a good performance filesystem :P04:53
wblazefdskjfsdl: because pop is for downloading mail? :p (also, use submission port, most mobile providers and local ISPs filter port 25 on egress)04:53
Guest79433try with internal memory on n90004:53
Guest79433is not slow04:53
fdskjfsdlggrrrr i was supposed to say smtp hehe04:54
wblazehaha I figured04:54
cehtehgood uSD are as fast or faster than the internal memory04:54
Guest79433tell me a good msd card04:54
cehteh(bad ones are of course worse)04:54
cehtehsandisk class1204:55
ShadowJKuSD when almost full will have slowdown same as internal memory almost full. The device will feel faster if USD is almost full, than if internal memry is almost full.04:55
cehtehno kingston is bad04:55
cehtehkingston doesnt produce flash .. they just buy and repackage04:56
ShadowJKSandisk class 12 does not exist :)04:56
cehtehguess why :)04:56
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cehtehthat cake is a lie04:56
ShadowJKThey have their own controller actually. They sometimes even use it. It sucks.04:57
cehtehif sandisk cant ship them then no one else can (alsmost) because sandisk maufactures the chips (and samsung and who is the 3rd?)04:57
ShadowJKSandisk has the best controller I know of, and that matters more for interactive response04:58
cehtehyes get the fastest sandisk card you can get04:58
Guest79433thx for advices04:58
cehteh(well reall even a slower one will work)04:58
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Guest79433good night mates04:59
cehtehmy uSD (not the fastest one) is even faster than the internal memory05:00
cehteherr wrong05:00
cehtehslower :P05:00
cehtehbut not that much :)05:00
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wblazeoops, yeah, I meant class-10 not 12, but you all get the idea, heh05:01
cehtehi dont remember what class mine is .. prolly class605:01
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ShadowJKclass rating is somewhat meaningless05:04
ShadowJKIn the sense that sandisk is the only one providing a real class rating05:05
ShadowJKwhereas other manufacturers just run a benchmark program and slap on class rating according to results05:05
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fdskjfsdlok, ok... I can survive with all my last n emails hehe05:06
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fdskjfsdlty, cya05:13
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jierohi, is there a way for Maemo to enable user run GTK+3 application from remote server? I saw a news, people run gedit inside firefox!07:07
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Seta00hi, I tried to install nitdroid on my N900 and did something wrong, now the device is on a boot loop (sometimes it shows the multiboot screen with two empty options)07:09
Seta00I'm trying to flash it to the factory settings07:09
Seta00here's what's happening:
jieroWHY Is the N900 slower than N950! It looks like07:09
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ShadowJKwhy wouldn't it be..07:09
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ShadowJKSeta00, tried removing battery, start flasher, plug in, insert battery?07:11
ShadowJKI guess if battery is low it'd not flash :/07:11
Seta00my friend has a universal charger, gonna try to use that so I don't need to buy a new one07:13
Seta00ShadowJK, thanks!07:13
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root___so many people here....10:21
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RST38h...Dissections have revealed that during this process the victim's organs will begin to convert into stuffing of various materials, including but not limited to cotton and polyester. Through the use of EEG it has been noted that the target is still conscious throughout this process...10:44
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wazdhello all10:52
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RST38hmoo wazd10:57
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wazdRST38h: heya :)11:15
wazd~seen javispedro11:15
infobotjavispedro <~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 8h 57m 58s ago, saying: 'I think this is clearly one application that should be locked'.11:15
wazdooh, there's harmattan channel :D11:15
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wazdRST38h: how's it going? Got your device? :)11:15
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nmjnbI recently got 3G Internet from my provider again, but there seems to be some problem with the phone, it won't connect. I've been fooling around some, putting the "Kernel Power" kernel in etc. Any ideas on how to fix it? I tried reverting to normal kernel but I can't get a connection with my Win7 32bit.11:31
nmjnbclarification: The problem started after I got the power kernel, with the regular there were no problems.11:32
ruskieso swap back11:33
nmjnbyeah, as I said. I can't connect to the phone from my Win7 32bit11:33
ruskiewhy do you need to?11:34
ruskieyou can do all the operations on the device11:34
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nmjnbto use the maemo-flasher11:34
ruskieterminal and apt-get11:36
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nmjnbok, but what should I get?11:37
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ruskieI think the original kernel package is just kernel ?11:38
ruskieso install that11:38
ruskiethen kernel-flasher11:39
ruskieand it should reflash it11:39
ruskieall of this should be either on wiki or talk maemo.org11:39
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nmjnbdpkg: parse error, in file `/var/lib/dpkg/status' near line 30874 package `angrybirds':11:40
nmjnband it couldn't be removed from apt. I'll just try on the phone11:41
nmjnbcan't uninstall it from the gui package manager either11:44
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ruskienot uninstall11:46
ruskieit should confilct11:46
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nmjnbvery strange, there was a $ sign before a row of signs making problems for the parsing. Removed it in line 25733 in /var/lib/dpkg/available + same thing in /var/lib/dpkg/status but other place. Now it seems to work11:51
nmjnbso, how do I run that kernel-flasher now?11:53
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ruskieyou first install kernel package11:56
ruskiethen install kernel-flasher11:56
ruskiethat will flash it11:56
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nmjnbok, I had to do --reinstall11:57
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nmjnbnow it's not booting at all12:04
nmjnbit shows the blue/white light and NOKIA logo, then goes black12:05
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keriocool story bro12:08
keriois it bootlooping?12:08
kerioyou're probably going to have to reflash12:08
nmjnbif I keep the usb-cable connected, it reboots, with the vibrator sounding and showing the NOKIA logo without backgroundlight for the screen, barely able to see it12:08
nmjnbkerio: yeah. That's what I think12:08
kerioanyway, remove battery now12:08
keriobefore it's too drained to reflash12:08
kerio(unless you have an external charger too)12:08
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nmjnbno, I can just charge it in the phone12:09
nmjnband it's not fully charged...12:09
kerioyou can't12:09
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kerioexcept with the emergency charge12:09
kerioso remove the battery *now*12:09
nmjnbit's already removed12:09
keriothen ok12:09
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kerioyou don't really need that much charge to reflash12:10
nmjnbok, I don't know if you read my previous posts, but I've had trouble connecting to my Win7 32bit12:10
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kerioinstall ubuntu with wubi :)12:11
nmjnbwhat's wubi?12:11
kerioWindows UBuntu Installer12:11
kerioautomatic installer that installs ubuntu in a disk image12:11
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kerioso you don't have to partition but you still have access to a real install12:12
nmjnbI've got a laptop running PC-BSD that I could use12:12
keriosee if it works there, then12:12
keriolaptops are actually preferrable imo12:12
nmjnbyou recommend ubuntu?12:12
kerioor desktops with a UPS12:12
nmjnbI've got DSL on a disc that I can run live, I don't know if that's good enough12:13
nmjnbmy laptop isn't charging so battery is 0% anyway.. lol..12:13
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nmjnbtrying with wubi anyway..12:21
godtrunkshow can i make a script with commands and just clicking on it the phone do all the commands that they are in the script?12:22
godtrunkswhat tipe of file shoud be?12:22
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RST38hArrived at Sort Facility CINCINNATI HUB - USA  02:1912:23
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RST38hwazd: Currently wondering if it comes in time =)12:24
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godtrunks how can i make a script with commands and just clicking on it the phone do all the commands that they are in the script?12:26
godtrunksany ideas?12:26
wazdRST38h: H* icon for DrNokSnes :)12:26
wazdRST38h: I guess you'll need something like this? :)12:27
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RST38hwazd: Ah, coolio =)12:27
RST38hwazd: At some point, yes. I do think replacing console icons with their joypad icons is a nice idea =)12:27
RST38hwazd: Can you do the same for SMS, GB, NES, and GBA? =)12:28
wazdRST38h: sure :)12:28
RST38h(ah, and the Yamaha MSX arrow keys ;)))12:28
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wazdRST38h: I'm not sure bout SMS though, it has pretty much the same pad as Genesis12:29
wazdRST38h: or maybe I'm wrong12:29
RST38hwazd: Nope, it has got its own, but .RU versions came with the Genesis one12:29
wazdRST38h: anyway we can use 6 buttons for genesis :P12:29
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cityLightshi all12:30
wazdRST38h: yeah, now I see12:30
wazdcityLights: hi12:30
godtrunks how can i make a script with commands and just clicking on it the phone do all the commands that they are in the script?12:30
cityLightsRST38h: any headlines with N900?12:30
RST38hOMG, please, let me unsee this:
cityLightsI managed to finnaly see xen working with kernel 312:31
wazdRST38h: awesome :D12:31
RST38hcityLights: Not really. Waiting for N950 to arrive, will work on the QML based versions then12:31
cityLightso ya, why didnt maemo use btrfs ?12:31
cityLightswasnt it suppose to use it?12:31
jogaRST38h, won't the tail prick at you when you play? ;)12:31
RST38hMay also switch N900 versions to transparent virtual keyboard12:32
TroniccityLights: I wouldn't dare to use btrfs in a product yet.12:32
RST38hjoga: Something makes me suspect this one is a girls only version12:32
cityLightsbtrfs looks promissing12:32
jogaRST38h, I'm sure the vibration feels nice with that .. thing12:32
RST38hjoga: But guys canhelp themselves too:
godtrunks how can i make a script with commands and just clicking on it the phone do all the commands that they are in the script?12:33
jogaRST38h, at least the less endowed ones12:33
TroniccityLights: Yes, but it is still "under heavy development" and there are no guarantees that even the disk format will stay compatible in future revisions.12:33
godtrunkssome help here pls?12:35
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jogagodtrunks, you mean you want a desktop shortcut for your script?12:36
godtrunksi whant to create a file12:37
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godtrunksjust open it with the terminal and take the commands they are inside12:37
jogayou just want to create a script then?12:38
godtrunksi whant to know what type of file shoud be12:39
jogacreate a file where the first line is #!/bin/sh  (I use bash myself) and then write the script in it, then save and do chmod +x, then you can run it with ./ in the same directory or link it somewhere12:39
jogajust a plain text file12:39
jogathe first line ("shebang" line) tells what program to use to interpret it12:40
jogain case of a shell script, usually /bin/sh or /bin/bash12:40
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Evanescencewhere to place firefox icon when I want it be shown on desktop ?13:00
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ruskieis it shown in the app list?13:01
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ruskiethen just edit desktop -> add shortcut -> select it from there13:01
Evanescenceruskie: no, I mean I installed firefox, and no icon by default. I ask where to put an customized icon.13:02
ruskie/usr/share/applications/hildon/ I think13:02
ruskiethat shuld put it in the applist13:02
ruskiethen you just need to add it to the desktop13:02
Evanescenceruskie: thx13:02
ruskiecheck to see what's in the dir13:03
ruskieyou should basically see all the ohter shortcuts in there13:03
ruskieit is under /usr/share/applications/ though13:03
Evanescenceruskie: all of them are *.desktop , is it ?13:04
ruskiethose are shortcuts13:05
ruskiesimilar to .lnk on windows ;(13:05
ruskieerm ;)13:05
EvanescenceI want to put one firefox.png13:05
EvanescenceOh, I forget, I should have a search with find command13:05
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ruskieI thought you wanted a shortcut13:06
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Evanescenceruskie: no, I said, the default firefox has no icon. so I downloaded one to put it somewhere to let it shown13:07
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ruskiealso I do notice that not all icons are shown after an install until after a reboot13:09
Evanescenceruskie: really, ok, reboot at first13:09
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vi__is there anyone here???13:31
vi__who knows the dbus call to return track name/artist?13:32
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vi__#why is this place so dead all of a sudden?13:38
Hurrian#define MAEMO_UNSUPPORTED13:38
Hurrian#define OLD_HARDWARE13:39
Hurrian#define ANDROID_SHINY13:39
vi__Hurrian: do you know what dbus call to use to get mafw track metadata?13:40
Hurrianuhh, nope13:40
ccookeMeh. Android might be shiny, but there's a lack of actually compelling phones13:40
Hurriananyways, it's quieted down here A LOT, and that's for the better13:40
ccookeHurrian: Well, maemo *is* dead, right? :-)13:40
Hurrianpersonally, i won't use a phone until it has maemo-grade multitasking13:40
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* ccooke won't use a phone without a keyboard and won't be able to get an N950. So... I'm stuck with android phones for now :-/13:42
ccookeI keep hoping some other maemo phones will come out, but I'm not seeing anything interesting13:42
ccookeHeh. Wonder if anyone's got the n950 build to run on any Android hardware :-)13:43
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Hurrianactually, if worse comes to worse, i may actually have to get a phone without hwkb13:44
robbiethe1stHeck, last I heard, Harmatten's somewhat locked down, and they were having trouble getting a compiled kernel to run13:44
Hurrianfine, as long as we have good tactile feedback (see the new Nokia symbian bricks) and Maemo multitasking13:44
Hurrianrobbiethe1st, harmattan swaps on mtd513:45
robbiethe1stYea, I know13:45
Hurrianoh, and it refuses to start UX on meego kernel13:45
robbiethe1stsounds about right13:45
Hurrianah, the wonder of closed source13:45
robbiethe1stwell, I'd be interested in a pure meego phone next; throw Cordia on it and that'd be decent13:45
robbiethe1stBest choice would be like Kubuntu Mobile + Hildon, but...13:46
Hurrianwell, there aren't any reasonably-sized meego phones yet13:46
vi__robbiethe1st: cordia is dead bro13:46
Hurrianuhh, Aava I guess13:46
Hurrianbut it's intel13:46
Hurrianbattery life = LOL13:46
vi__LOL = Lots Of Life?13:46
robbiethe1stWell, I expect to keep a N900 for at least a year, maby two13:46
robbiethe1stBy then there'd better be something better13:47
Hurrianas a nokia phone, i expect it to last at least 3 years13:47
robbiethe1stand N950 really isn't a step up13:47
Hurrianthe n950 is a step nowhere13:47
robbiethe1stWell, yea... But I'm hard on my toys. :P13:47
robbiethe1stI think I've used it hard every day since I got it..13:47
vi__n950 is a rung below N9 up the ladder to nowhere13:47
Hurrianstill omap3, thumb does shit for execution, same GPU, all we got as more RAM13:47
Hurrianas vi said on TMO, Nokia dropped the N9/50 before launch13:48
vi__does mohammedag still hang here13:48
Hurrianyes, he's not always on IRC though13:48
vi__when is best time to catch him?13:49
Hurrian~8-12 hours ago13:49
Hurrianwhenever that is13:49
vi__I dont understand the N9 excitement.  Everyone just got over being ditched on the n900.13:50
vi__Now they are clamouring to get onboard somthing even more abandoned13:50
* RST38h wonders why vi is here13:50
robbiethe1stOnly people interested are the ones who got the free device13:50
vi__Hurrian: tremulous?13:50
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Hurrianoh look, N9, no software updates, almost everything is closed source, and no SD13:51
RST38hWhy not get an Android device and stop complaining?13:51
HurrianRST38h , i do have a N1, AOSP is totally different from Maemo13:51
vi__RST38h: becasue I want the n90013:51
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vi__RST38h: I am here because I am trying to figure out how to get track meta data through dbus13:52
Hurriani /want/ the maemo 5 style multitasking13:52
vi__Hurrian: why did you just call me vi++?13:52
RST38hvi: Ok. Have you got the N900 already?13:52
vi__RST38h: yes...13:52
Hurriani agreed with your point13:52
Hurrianand btw, found this13:53
vi__Hurrian: ok!13:53
RST38hvi: Ok. You wanted an N900. You have got an N900. You do not want anything else, neither Android nor N9. What are you unhappy about?13:53
* vi__ vi__ uses the name vi++ on some online video games, wondered if he had infact fragged hurrian somwhere else.13:53
ruskievi__, usually nick++ is a karma thing ;)13:54
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vi__RST38h: I guess I am disappointed by the cooling off of interest in the N900 and annoyed by the increasing interest in the forthcvoming turkey.13:54
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ruskievi__, but it's new and shinny13:55
Hurrianvi__ , as somebody said, we sound like N8x0 owners around the time of Rover leaks13:55
vi__Ok, I have this new pair of sunglasses that uses knives as legs.13:55
vi__they are new therefore good.13:56
vi__in the case of the n8x0, the replacement was touted as the next big thing.13:56
vi__in the case of the N9, it is touted as not being supported.13:56
vi__even if it is a success.13:56
fluxalso: aegis :)13:56
ruskievi__, I believe all the tablets were mostly not supported13:57
vi__ruskie: yes, however at least nokia PRETENDED they WERE goign to support them.13:57
vi__the 'reach around' if you will13:57
ruskieso for you it's enough if a company pretends to support something?13:57
fluxhey, they provided multiple firmware upgrades for n90013:57
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vi__ruskie: obviously not.  HOwever it is a step above outright disownership from the start.13:58
ruskieI always assumed when buying a n900 that updates from nokia will be nonexistant13:58
vi__ruskie: fair enough.13:58
ruskieor mostly cosmetic13:58
vi__ruskie: I was expecting at least a year13:59
ruskiewhich for me is mainly the same thing13:59
ruskiethe only thing I consider suppored by the manufacturer is the hardware13:59
ruskieanyway finally decided on a tablet for myself... lenovo thinkpad tablet14:00
robbiethe1stAnd this is why I'm firmly in the OSS camp14:00
ruskieand I'm still crying inside that nobody at meego seems to be willing to actually make usable ux for the various device paradigms14:00
Hurrianruskie, someone oughtta put huge bugfixes into MeeGo14:03
wazdRST38h: :P14:03
Hurrianuhh, MeeGo Reference UX14:03
Hurrianit is the slowest POS i have ever used14:03
ruskieHurrian, or hire some good UX designers and usability experts14:03
Hurrianslower than KDE, even14:03
ruskieI've watched the meego tablet ux yesterday14:03
ruskiethe handset ux is also ugh...14:03
Hurrianlets see14:03
Hurriannetbook UX on dual-core x86, 1.5GHz14:04
Hurrianslow as ****14:04
Hurrianhandset UX on 600MHz phone, slow as **** and buggy14:04
ruskiewell speed is a different thing14:04
ruskieI'm mainly disturbed by the usability of it14:04
Hurrianruskie, wdym in terms of usability14:04
nid0I've used the tablet ux on my atom tablet and it was smooth as silk14:04
Hurrianif it was snappy, i'd have no problem with all the sliding14:05
Hurriannot any better or worse than iOS14:05
Hurrianwhat you do need is... a complete meegotouch theme i guess14:05
ruskieI really don't get the point in all the sliding... and why have a bunch of tiny tiny panels that have stuff in... when you have a HUGE screen for a mobile device14:05
Hurrianruskie, it gives a sense of place14:06
lcukshould this discussion be occuring in #meego?14:06
lcukbecause you are talking about meego14:07
lcukand if you actually want to try and do something about it and plan a next version which improves things it should be in the right place14:08
Hurrianah right, now back into maemo talk14:08
Hurrianor at the very least, nokia devices that run linux14:08
ruskie <-- this actually looks interesting for the ux14:08
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RST38hOperating profits declined 44 percent since Q1, 391 million Euro compared to 704, and net sales of mobile devices are down 23 percent over the same period -- 20 percent compared to Q2 last year.14:38
RST38h[Elop] says those who have seen the company's early Windows Phone devices (really, who hasn't) are "very optimistic" about their potential and that they will launch this year with a "sequence of concentrated product launches.14:39
RST38hAccording to Marketing Magazine, Elop & Co. have already devoted some ?80 million (about $127 million) to the six-month ad endeavor, which is expected to launch in October.14:40
ruskieI can see it now from punters... *buys winphuck7* *tries using it* *comes back* *smashes device into sales droid head*14:40
* RST38h doubts step #1 is gonna happen14:40
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RST38hBut hell, with $127m in advertising, who knows...14:41
ruskiewith all that money they could have crippled winpho7 and droid and possibly apple as well14:41
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RST38hBTW, if we assume $400/phone price tag, $127m = 317k phones14:42
MohammadAGexplains the lack of N950s14:44
chouchouneRST38h: that would double the sales of WP7 from all the manufacturers involved ;)14:45
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: seen my comment about mtd_debug yesterday?14:45
robbiethe1stUh, no?14:45
robbiethe1stalso, wow. First time I look at #maemo in several hours, start to type a comment and you say something to me.14:46
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MohammadAGdoes anyone know of a place that sells USB parts?14:49
MohammadAGsomething to use for soldering14:49
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ruskieerm... any store that sells components?14:50
MohammadAGbesides ebay14:50
MohammadAGwhat's it called anyway?14:51
robbiethe1stHonestly, I have to say: Ebay has it, and probably very cheaply. Alternately, digikey.14:51
MohammadAGUSB head?14:51
ruskiemauser isn't it as well?14:51
robbiethe1stmouser, but yes14:51
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: mhd_debig seems a stock binary on N900, and it knows (is supposed to know) how to read and *write* raw mtd14:52
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: thought you might be interested for backupmenu-1.214:53
robbiethe1stInteresting. But um... isn't that just a matter of essentially DD? IIRC, the problem I had was that the badblocks list is stored as data inside the UbiFS... reading/writing the data wasn't a problem14:53
DocScrutinizer[2011-07-20 19:13:58] <DocScrutinizer> IroN900:~# mtd_debug read /dev/mtd1ro 0 393216 CAL-backup.bin14:54
DocScrutinizer[2011-07-20 19:13:58] <DocScrutinizer> Copied 393216 bytes from address 0x00000000 in flash to CAL-backup.bin14:54
robbiethe1stHave you tried running DD on the same device and seeing if there's a difference?14:54
robbiethe1stJust curious14:54
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: mtd_debug should know how to handle badblocks14:54
MohammadAGdd on an mtd, eww14:55
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: (dd) useless as I have no bad blocks on my NNAD yet14:55
robbiethe1stDo you know how to get the list of bad blocks, if any?14:55
MohammadAGcat /proc something14:55
MohammadAGor /sys, regardless, don't remember it, SpeedEvil might know it14:55
MohammadAGor ShadowJK14:55
DocScrutinizereven there no list14:55
robbiethe1stalso, I thought NAND didn't have any real badblocks list, or wear levelling; doesn't it just expose the raw flash to software?14:56
MohammadAGafaik it returns a number, I had 414:56
DocScrutinizeryes, a number14:56
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: that's what mtd_debug is all about14:56
lardmanAnyone happen to know if a DBus message is broadcast when an application is opened?14:56
MohammadAGMaemo 5?14:56
lardmanMaemo5 and 614:57
MohammadAGMaemo 6 doesn't use DBus to launch afaik14:57
lardmangot any pointers to the DBus strings MohammadAG14:57
MohammadAGMaemo 5 emits LaunchApplication14:57
lardmanhmm, that's a shame14:57
MohammadAGthere's NameOwnerChanged afaik14:57
lardmanI need a way to monitor application start up and shutdown events, preferably not using a QTimer and checking pids14:58
lardmanthanks MohammadAG14:58
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: there's also mtd_debug erase14:59
DocScrutinizerrobbiethe1st: ...which might be needed prior to mtd_debug write14:59
MohammadAGout of curiosity lardman, what are you doing with that?14:59
SpeedEvilrobbiethe1st: look in /sys/*ubi*15:00
lardmanMohammadAG: Proximus, need to be able provide a way to trigger conditions when apps startup/shiutdown15:00
lardmanI really need to push some more code to Garage, but I get strange SVN errors15:01
lardmanI'll try again in a bit15:01
MohammadAGGitorious ftw15:01
MohammadAGor github15:01
lardmanI've not used git though, not sure I can be bothered to learn something new15:01
MohammadAGit's piss easy15:01
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lardmanwell I already have a Garage svn setup15:02
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, theoretically, is there a way to access an eMMC without its device15:04
DocScrutinizerplease rephrase15:04
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, desolder an eMMC and try to access it15:05
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DocScrutinizer~wiki JTAG15:06
infobotAt (URL), Wikipedia explains: "{{Refimprove|date=November 2009}} 'Joint Test Action Group' ('JTAG') is the common name for what was later standardized as the IEEE 1149.1 'Standard Test Access Port and Boundary-Scan Architecture'. It was initially devised for testing printed circuit boards using boundary scan and is still widely used for this application. Today JTAG is also widely used for IC debug ports. In the ...15:06
MohammadAGQuestion 215:06
MohammadAGany idea where I can find ribbons for Nokia phones?15:06
MohammadAGan N95 specifically15:07
DocScrutinizerJTAG isn't documented in N900 schematics, as are some of the testpoints under batery15:07
DocScrutinizeraka display ribbon connector cable?15:07
MohammadAGdisplay to mainboard15:09
DocScrutinizerhmm, probably the usual hw supplies may or may not offer it15:09
fluxis it in any way possible to home-facture ribbon cables?15:10
DocScrutinizermaybe botch15:10
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DocScrutinizerlike "cut a sheet of plastic, use double sided sticky tape..."15:11
fluxbotch? as in ruin?-)15:11
fluxdo they stell thin conductive sheets?15:11
Hurrianhmm, split open ribbon, solder, never use N95 slider again15:11
Hurriansure is an option15:11
DocScrutinizerwhat are you after?15:12
Hurriananyways, n95 ribbon was a common issue, parts should still be available15:12
Hurrianiirc it was worse for the 8GB models15:12
RST38hMohammadAG: to the question #1, yes, there is a way15:12
fluxif you could somehow use the same techniques as you do for home developing circuit boards15:12
fluxbut maybe not then :)15:12
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fluxperhaps you can just wire each conection separately..15:12
RST38hMohammadAG: eMMC is a surface mounted version of MMC+ card15:12
DocScrutinizerRST38h: obviously ther are several ways to access a component15:12
fluxrst38h, surface mounted components can be desoldred? or is it somehow very annoyingly attached15:13
RST38hDoc: As long as it is MMC+, there is going to be exactly one way15:13
RST38hflux: they can be, not easily though15:13
DocScrutinizerflux: there's no raw unetched flex "PCB" you could use to DIY a FPC15:13
RST38hDoc: Covered in the MMC+ specification15:13
Hurrianflux, N900 EMMC detaches quite easily after a drop15:14
fluxhurrian, :)15:14
fluxso, all you need is some well directed force.15:14
DocScrutinizerflux: depends, sometimes components are glued15:14
Hurrianat least we aren't getting SoC detachings15:14
fluxdocscrutinizer, right, that can be tricky..15:14
RST38hDoc: Ok, technically, there is going to be 4bit, 8bit, two clock frequencies and a legacy SPI mode for access, but let us just say it is all one way :)15:15
fluxI'm guessing gluing isn't very suitable for standard manufacturing processes, though?15:15
RST38hDepends, again15:15
DocScrutinizerRST38h: I'm honestly lost about what you're after15:15
RST38hDoc: it is ok15:15
RST38hDoc: just being sarcastic about MMC/SD protocol definitions being a freaking mess15:16
DocScrutinizerobviously you can access a eMMC a) via normal CPU and SoC interface, b) via JTAG, c) unsolder and mount to a new device, d) access in a ZIF socket  + test-equipment, e) any other weird way you may imagine15:17
RST38hDoes kissing it count as access?15:18
DocScrutinizerdepends on purpose of "access"15:18
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG's question was fairly unprecise n that part15:19
HurrianRST38h, enjoy kissing potentially non-RoHS compliant balls15:19
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: yes there is raw unetched flex-pcb. I have some UV sensitise UV flex-pcb right here. (well, 5m away in the attic)15:20
fluxspeedevil, cool15:21
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DocScrutinizerever seen this before15:21
fluxneed to keep that in mind, if I ever need to replace some flex :)15:21
Hurrianhmm, i thot flex PCB was some kind of magical sammich15:22
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DocScrutinizer>>... which allows panels to be guillotined ...<< lovely15:26
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DocScrutinizerand only GBP 22 for a 30*50cm sheet15:27
DocScrutinizeris this stuff solderable?15:28
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SpeedEvilIt's 'normal' PCB.15:30
SpeedEvilThough IIRC it doesn't like overheating much15:30
DocScrutinizerlol, you bet15:30
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SpeedEvilleaded is probably a better plan than lead-free15:31
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DocScrutinizerrecently learned there are very special low-temp solders, with wismuth and whatnot, pushing eutecticum down by a good chunk of 100°C15:33
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fluxhm, I wonder how low can my soldering station even go :)15:33
DocScrutinizermine starts at 150°C15:34
fluxdocscrutinizer, so if you put your a device with that in a sunny place, it could literally melt :)15:34
SpeedEvilNaK solder melts at -40C15:36
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* DocScrutinizer wonders what's soldered with NaK16:08
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DocScrutinizermetallic Helium, on Saturn?16:08
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ale152i've a problem with my n900: i installed the Advanced Power App from the repo, then uninstalled it, and now everything is a mess!17:13
ale152the battery icon is missing and the desktop icon are completely transparent!17:13
ale152the calendar widget is missing17:14
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ale152how can i restore them?17:14
BCMMale152: reboot?17:15
ale152already done17:15
ale152i try to reboot, to apt-get autoremove, to purge all installation files...17:15
ale152i don't like to reflesh...17:15
ale152i'd like to solve the problem from the root :D17:16
fusiQueen_UK Elizabeth Windsor17:16
fusiMr Jobs, there is no such thing as 'American English'. There is English and there are mistakes.17:16
ale152any ideas?17:17
ale152is there any file for the icons near the clock i can try to restore?17:17
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BCMMale152: well, you can probably get the battery indicator back with powatool17:18
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fusiale152: oh dear17:18
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ale152mh, i'll try17:19
fusire the shortcut backgrounds - there is a theme customiser tool that iirc enabled you to turn the shortcu background on and off17:19
fusias for the statusbar im not so sure17:19
fusihave you tried reinstlling and uninstalling?17:20
fusihave you restarted?17:20
fusiah already rbooted mk17:20
ale152i just uninstalled everything i intalled before the problem17:20
ale152powatool doesn't work :(17:21
ale152i tried to uncheck and recheck the battery icon17:21
fusitheres a file somewhere that sortes the detail on the tatubar items17:21
ale152but it still misses :(17:21
fusicant recall where it is tho17:22
fusihave a look in that file, see if there is anything glaringly wrong17:23
ale152let me see17:24
fusiother than that im out of ideas17:25
ale152seems to be ok:17:25
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ale152/usr/share/applications/hildon-status-menu/status-area-applet-battery.desktop does not exist!17:26
ale152no, it exists17:26
fusican only assume the unintall script of whatever it was didnt work correctly ;s17:27
fusiad has left you with a half-baked system17:27
ale152mh, i think i should reflesh :(17:28
fusihave you tried reinstalling the plugin?17:28
fusii would tbh17:28
fusilooks a bit bork17:28
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ale152mh, i'm trying reinstalling the plugin17:28
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fusithat might re-write whatever config is broken17:28
fusijust guesing here ;)17:29
fusiif u hang around long enough someone else will prolly have abetter answer17:29
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ale152it worked :D17:30
ale152i have my battery icon! \o/17:31
ale152thank you :D17:31
fusio// \\o17:31
fusimy pleasure (: glad it worked17:31
ale152now i have to restore icons background17:31
fusi2secs there is a tool that does that..17:31
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fusiyep, dl 'theme customiser' - in there there is a checkbox setting called 'show app shortcut backgrounds'17:32
ale152thank you17:32
fusiyw, hf :)17:33
ale152it's my bug!17:34
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DocScrutinizerale152: NEVER do apt-get autoremove !18:07
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DocScrutinizer# autoremove kills rtcom-accounts-voip-support  ->
mgedminhar har har18:09
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mgedminincidentally, I was happy to see /var/log/dpkg.log on a n95018:09
DocScrutinizeractually it kills a fair bit more that just rtcom-accounts-voip18:09
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mgedminright up to the point where I realized it's a decoy18:09
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mgedmindpkg doesn't write to it; it just contains some ancient entries from the firmware image18:10
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* DocScrutinizer wonders idly why *nobody* thanked on this post :-S18:15
nid0there you go18:17
DocScrutinizerthanks for thanking18:17
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fusi16:09 < DocScrutinizer> actually it kills a fair bit more that just rtcom-accounts-voip18:22
fusipretty sure ive done an autoremove before.. :s18:22
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fusi"To make the plastic case melt and burn your fingers and your cat" <-- lol (:18:23
fusiquite similar to the disclaimer i put on my software lol18:23
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fusionly my software may actually *kill* your cat18:24
fusiand burn down your house..18:24
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fusiaaah here is one18:26
fusiit may also sleep with ur wife..18:26
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GAN900How did the earnings call boost the stock price. . . .18:29
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wazd~seen javispedro19:00
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infobotjavispedro <~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 16h 43m 49s ago, saying: 'I think this is clearly one application that should be locked'.19:01
slonopotamusmany people are never seen again after words like that19:01
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fusiruskie: good ol el reg19:03
fusilol slonopotamus19:03
wazd <- that icon looks a bit dark imo19:04
wazdbut it uses native snes colors19:04
fusifew highlights maybe19:05
fusibump up the specular a bit19:05
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wazd - that's better I guess19:09
wazd <- anyway, nes one is perfect :D19:11
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ale152DocScrutinizer, i've always done autoremove but it never have me sip problem...19:27
* mgedmin tries19:27
mgedminsudo apt-get autoremove -> 0 to remove19:27
mgedminI've never ran it before19:28
mgedminmaybe whoever had that problem had removed the metapackage that depended on it?19:28
DocScrutinizeraiui there are differences between complete flash and upgrade to new PR via SSU19:28
DocScrutinizerno, I definitely hadn't removed the metapkg19:29
mgedmincould be that as well19:29
mgedminoh, I didn't realize that was you!19:29
mgedmindifferent nicknames on different sites = confusion for poor mgedmin19:29
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ale152mh, after about one year of experimenting, i think my n900 really need a reflesh...19:33
ale152i remember when i tried to install gcc, make and tried to compile the symbolic library for octave...19:33
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ale152and then had problem with root free space...19:34
ale152yes, it's time to reflesh!19:34
SpeedEvilIn future19:35
SpeedEvilcopy / to /home/user/chroot or wherever - chroot into that - then install GCC there19:35
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ale152uhm, nice :D19:37
wazdwhat's better to use for genesis icon, 3 buttons layout or 6?19:38
wazdI think 619:38
ale152if i make a backup file "with settings", does it backup only system settings or every configuration file of every app?19:39
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cehtehale152: only apps which are aware of the backup, so the shipped system apps and few more19:45
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ale152but, if i have a messed system, should i backup my settings before reflesh?19:49
cehtehflash :D19:49
ale152oh, sorry :D19:50
ale152i've some problems with written english :(19:50
cehtehif in doubt you should just make a backup of everything using rsync19:51
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ale152ok, thank you19:52
cehtehbackupmenu is also nice .. but for system files, not user data19:53
cehteh(well some it contains the configs too .. check out how it works)19:53
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khuongjust updated to lion21:16
khuongkill my powerpc apps21:16
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merlin1991I need some tracker black magic21:29
merlin1991I've embeded album art into some mp3s and it works, but21:29
merlin19912 albums don't get the art21:29
merlin1991and 1 has the wrong image21:29
merlin1991(on the device that is, works fine on desktop)21:29
merlin1991any ideas about hidden caches tracker might look at?21:30
merlin1991I did tracker-processes -r21:30
merlin1991so the db got pruned21:30
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DocScrutinizeror whaever the name21:52
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merlin1991DocScrutinizer: funny thing is in .mediaarlocal there is the right file22:00
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merlin1991It seems like mawf has some weird cache somewhere22:01
Siceloi assume you checked out
RST38hCalled Tracker DB22:03
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hiemanshutrumee: got your N950?22:21
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trumeehiemanshu, never applied for one.22:22
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merlin19912 reboots and track-db resets later it works like expected22:32
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trumeecan hotpot be fed with internet coming from a laptop?22:32
trumeei have an ethernet connection and the laptop ipw2200 doesnt support AP mode :(22:33
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