IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2011-05-05

DocScrutinizerwam: so tun is a proxy based thing like e.g. VPN?00:00
wamtun is a tunneling device00:01
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wamjust a network device00:01
DocScrutinizeryeah, but tunneling ipv6 thru ipv4 needs a server that 'untunnels', no?00:01
wamall automatic00:01
wamapt-get install miredo00:02
kwtm~seen kwtm00:02
infobotkwtm is currently on #maemo (13h 36m). Has said a total of 4 messages. Is idling for 6s, last said: '~seen kwtm'.00:02
wamand add /etc/miredo.conf00:02
kwtmNo one has seen me?  Oh, ok.00:02
wamInterfaceName   teredo00:02
wamServerAddress   teredo-debian.remlab.net00:02
DocScrutinizerkwtm: fol, you're still here, so there's no sense in "was last seen..."00:03
DocScrutinizerwam: ok, zhink that'S exactly what I meant00:03
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wamDocScrutinizer: the bad thing is that the default browser doesn't do ipv4.00:04
wamDocScrutinizer: you can test with
DocScrutinizerwam: (default browser) aka microB. That's why I asked where's timeless00:06
DocScrutinizerwam: btw IPv6 I guess00:06
DocScrutinizerI think microB does IPv400:07
wammodern browsers do *00:07
DocScrutinizer>>...default browser doesn't do ipv4.00:08
DocScrutinizernot right?00:08
wamyou are rig00:08
wamdefault browser doesn't do ipv6.00:08
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DocScrutinizerand I'd like to ask timeless why it doesn't00:09
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wamit just says "Server nicht gefunden" which means: "Server not found" for, where ff4 shows the page.00:10
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pupnikheroic dneary, greetings00:11
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pupnikor greetings to dneary's client then00:12
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dnearypupnik, There is such a thing as "doing something else" :)00:12
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pupniklooks like the world of linux portables will remain boutique00:14
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dnearyGreetings pupnik :)00:15
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GAN900"All of those children's book say 'Printed in China'. Do I need to be worried about lead paint?"00:26
pupnikomg, scroll down for some awesome fantasy monster art...
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wazdpupnik: awesome contest :)00:28
wazdThough they are mostly just a combitation of existing animals :)00:30
mtnbkrGAN900: probably.00:30
wazdoh no, I judged too early :D00:31
FIQ|n900~seen timeless00:32
infobottimeless <d4d5ddfe@firefox/developer/timeless> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 1d 5h 39m 33s ago, saying: 'hi'.00:32
wamboy, I didn't know that there are that many _different_ monsters.00:32
* pupnik is overloaded00:34
SpeedEvilpupnik: you now also function as a small concrete bridge in germany?00:35
pupniktoo matsch monsters00:36
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GAN900OK, now Windows 7 has spontaneously uninstalled the UltraNav driver.01:18
GAN900A question to all PC users of the world: How do you live like this?! *g*01:18
ShadowJKWhat's "ultranav driver"?01:19
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ShadowJKIn general when using windows I have 3 rules: 1) Don't install any drivers. 2) Don't install any programs. 3) Don't forget 1 and 201:20
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GAN900Trackpad driver for Lenovo trackpoint/trackpad devices.01:21
GAN900ShadowJK, problem is, Ubuntu wont resume from sleep.01:21
GAN900So I'm stuck with MS crap for the time being if I want to use it.01:21
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MohammadAGGAN900, which Ubuntu?01:23
MohammadAGI had problems with Ubuntu 10.10 with Natty's kernel01:23
mtnbkrGAN900: I am a PC user, but my OS is Gentoo Linux (and I don't "deal with that type of stuff" ;)01:23
MohammadAGbut both Ubuntu 10.10 and 11.04 (Natty) resume fine from sleep01:23
MohammadAGso you could try different kernels01:23
jrayhawkWhoa, a Lenovo user that actually *wants* a trackpad?01:24
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ShadowJKThis is why I haven't upgraded my fedora install for years. I have older kernel than N900-Maemo5. :-)01:24
* mtnbkr is just being pedantic again... after all the mac users he knows always interchanging the word windows with PC 01:24
ShadowJKThere's always something that breaks :-(01:24
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GeneralAntillesMohammadAG: 11.0402:21
GeneralAntillesjrayhawk: it's the driver for both the trackpad and the touchpoint. :)02:21
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jrayhawkoh okay02:21
GeneralAntillesmtnbkr: not interchanging. :)02:23
GeneralAntillesmtnbkr: I'm including Linux with the bullshit pile.02:23
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rtylerhilfe! somehow the "Select Connection" dialog won't dismiss!02:26
DocScrutinizerdamn, heard that just a few days ago02:26
rtylertime bomb!02:26
rtylerI think my n900 figured out I work on Android <_<02:27
rtylerDocScrutinizer: did the previous victim figure out a workaround, or just rebooted the sucker02:27
DocScrutinizerthe sucker rebooted ;-P02:28
DocScrutinizerwhich is a pity as we couldn't investigate on it any further02:28
rtylerwell, consider me a guinea pig for the next few minutes02:28
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DocScrutinizerifconfig, route, ping, cat /etc/resolv.conf, cat /var/run/resolv.conf.*02:30
rtyleron the device?02:31
DocScrutinizerdmesg|tail -n 3002:31
rtylerI can't get to anything, the dialog keeps popping into the way02:31
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DocScrutinizercan you open the applauncher despite the dialog?02:32
MohammadAGmodal dialogs suck in Maemo 502:32
MohammadAGif a dialog hangs, the only way to kill it is to reboot02:33
MohammadAG(or ssh and kill it)02:33
DocScrutinizerpowerbutton, kill current task02:33
MohammadAGbut I can think of a nasty way to counter it02:33
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, doesn't work for dialogs02:33
MohammadAGsimply kills the window "behind" it02:33
rtylerI'm not fast enough to get a terminal open to spite it02:33
DocScrutinizergreat! :-/02:33
MohammadAGanyway, I have a nasty method02:33
MohammadAGcan you use flasher?02:33
MohammadAGand no, I don't want you to reflash02:34
MohammadAGif you can...02:35
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what do you have in mind02:35
MohammadAGflasher-3.5 --enable-rd-mode --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset02:35
DocScrutinizermeh, what's on your mind02:35
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: hmmmm02:35
MohammadAGuse android or any other OS to move/remove /usr/bin/hildon-status-menu02:35
DocScrutinizerhow would that change anything?02:36
MohammadAGfix shit, reinstall it02:36
MohammadAG(hildon-status-menu that is)02:36
DocScrutinizerreboot help as well02:36
rtylerMohammadAG: that's gross02:36
MohammadAGrtyler, better than flashing :)02:36
rtylerlooks like there's no means of working around this without a reboot, damnits02:36
DocScrutinizerbut it'd be interesting to have a forensic research02:37
rtylerstupid maemo02:37
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MohammadAGit'd be interesting to have a fucking X button02:37
rtyler[Fucking X]02:37
DocScrutinizermight be a bug in some DHCP server02:37
MohammadAGI heard Maemo 4 had one02:37
DocScrutinizerthat causes route or sth to fckup02:37
rtylerI can get the menu from the power button, which shows up above the connection dialog02:38
MohammadAGan X button = click it = App isn't responding = you can kill it02:38
MohammadAGwhen the status menu hangs, you can kill it by clicking outside02:39
MohammadAGthe same doesn't happen for dialogs02:39
DocScrutinizerthere's sth desparately trying to get connectivity, and you have set up to "always ask", and the DHCP/DNS blows chunks02:39
rtyleralright, went into offline mode02:39
rtylerthat killed the dialog02:39
MohammadAGmind you, this is an easily reproduceable UI problem02:39
DocScrutinizerhey :-D02:39
rtylerreconnecting, w00t02:39
rtylerI AM TEH CLEVER02:39
MohammadAGmake a quick QDialog, override QCloseEvent(), ignore the event02:40
DocScrutinizerif it's what I think, it will restart popping dialogs in a short while02:40
MohammadAGadd that dialog to init.d, and you ruined an N90002:40
DocScrutinizerreflash and nothing is ruined02:41
MohammadAGsome people hate to reflash02:41
DocScrutinizerrtyler: could you check dmesg / syslog now?02:41
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: hey, ninstall messybox, much simpler to 'ruin N900'02:42
DocScrutinizereven better, nuke NOLO02:42
MohammadAGrm /sbin/preinit02:42
DocScrutinizeror that02:42
MohammadAG(don't do that @ everyone)02:42
DocScrutinizerbut nuking nolo is much more evil >:-)02:43
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DocScrutinizerdarn, those were the times... when this channel had 500+ users02:44
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, nah you can coldflash02:46
DocScrutinizer*me* can02:46
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Juozapashi can u recommend some mail client for n900? i'm using gmail02:54
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mvaJuozapas: why you don't want to use default one? :)03:07
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Juozapasmva: some problems with fonts03:12
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GAN900OK, this is serious idiocy.04:49
GAN900Three comouters, none of them will resume from suspend04:49
GAN900Debuging doesn't come up with any hardware at fault. . . .04:49
GAN900How do you release shit like this and call it ready?04:50
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Lorissehelp: my app manager won't list down available apps for download. It says "operation failed"06:27
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pupnikflash sucks10:00
pupnikadobe sucks10:00
pupnikspending a whole minute of my life trying to stop a flash video10:00
pupnikwhich took 45 seconds to start10:01
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RST38hMoo all11:03
abmoo RST38h11:05
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DocScrutinizeryo, moo12:28
DocScrutinizerchem|st: how's life?12:28
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: as bad as always12:37
chem|stBUT my sailing trainer just called for this month sport boat license training12:38
DocScrutinizerheh, that sounds like fun12:39
chem|stso hopefully I have the license next month and am able to do the followup in july12:39
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ruskiefollowup being sink???12:42
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edheldilfollowup being 2.2?12:45
chem|stfollowup being sport coast skipper license12:46
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Mecekhertan, ping12:56
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psychologehello i install nessus on easy debian,but when i update the plugins ,it suggest Could not write to all-2.0.tar.gz - No space left on device....can some one help me?14:16
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psycho_oreosprobably the easy debian chroot image is already full?14:18
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psychologei don't know ,i had't install any program on easy debian before14:20
psycho_oreosyou've installed nessus, you do realise even without installing nessus, easy debian could fill up the space it was allocated with initially?14:21
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psycho_oreosDocScrutinizer, ping14:29
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psycho_oreosI recall you were saying that you can charge the N900 whilst its running USB hostmode? if so how do you go about charging?14:32
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psycho_oreospossibly something like going through a hub14:32
ruskieand a cable properly setup I guess14:33
psycho_oreosI was thinking of having N900 plugged into the hub and then have something like microUSB female to USB male going into one of the hub's ports?14:33
psycho_oreosyeah that's the tricky part :) I know h-e-n stops BME which won't show one the status of the battery on hildon-status iirc14:34
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DocScrutinizerpsycho_oreos: I did it by using a very commonly used Y-cable as comes with external drives14:35
infobotit has been said that hostmode-powered is
psycho_oreosDocScrutinizer, ahh those used on 2.5" ones14:36
* psycho_oreos checks out the link14:36
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reenignEesreveRsomeone nearby setup a fake gsm base station. My n900 got connected with it. While all other phones are working fine. Is there an implementation flaw in n900's authentication or what?14:37
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reenignEesreveRscary for me!14:37
ruskieif the base station is outputing all the right stuff don't see why there would be14:38
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reenignEesreveRi received this SMS: Welcome to OpenBTS! AGPLv3 Your IMSI is IMSI: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx14:38
ruskiethe implementation flaw is in the gsm encryption in general though iirc14:38
SpeedEvilThere is generally no authentication on thephone.14:38
SpeedEvilThe phon e is quite happy to connect to any tower with the correct broadcast ID.14:38
reenignEesreveRbut there should be authentication of the bts via the sim14:38
SpeedEvilThere isn't.14:38
SpeedEvilIt's the other way round.14:38
reenignEesreveRthen why other phones with same network provider aren't getting connected?14:38
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SpeedEvilThe phone authenticates to the tower, not the tower to the phone.14:39
ruskiebecause they set the network manually?14:39
SpeedEvilPerhaps your phone supports a band that they do not.14:39
reenignEesreveRso if someone sets up a fake tower, everyone can get connected to it?14:39
SpeedEvilreenignEesreveR: yes.14:39
reenignEesreveRthats a pretty simple MIM!14:39
SpeedEvilOr rather14:41
SpeedEvilIt's not quite MIM14:41
SpeedEvilAs inbound calls don't work.14:41
SpeedEvilI think it's also possible to fake your phone, with additional stuff.14:41
DocScrutinizerreenignEesreveR: LOOOOL14:42
SpeedEvilYou (as the tower) ask the phone to authenticate with a cipher you can crack.14:42
SpeedEvilThis gives you the secret keys from the SIM14:42
reenignEesreveRyou really don't need that, do you?14:42
SpeedEvilThis enables you to then use those secret keys to authenticate as a phone to the real network14:42
psycho_oreosDocScrutinizer, thanks for the link. Very interesting setup, though it looks like I may have to go buy at least an adapter (mUSB female -> USB male) + Y splitter. Seems a little complicated but its still interesting nonetheless14:43
SpeedEvilAnd you then proxy inbound calls to the phone, and inbound texts14:43
SpeedEvilreenignEesreveR: If you want a proper MITM, yes.14:43
SpeedEvilreenignEesreveR: Otherwise you just get a phone not connected to anything but you.14:43
SpeedEvilAnyway - see the youtube link - 'practical cellphone spying'14:44
lolcatIf I backup to a memorycard, will it be in a readable format for things that are not N900?14:45
SpeedEvilGSM wasn't really designed with security in mind - from the POV of people pretending to be cellphone towers.14:45
DocScrutinizerpsycho_oreos: it's not complicated at all. Get shadowjk's charger script, then do bostoff;; ^C (you probably want to rename the to something more snae, like I did)14:45
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DocScrutinizeryeah, GSM has security for protecting the network from rogue users, not to preotect users from rogue networks14:46
SpeedEvilreenignEesreveR: Also - wherre ar eyou?14:47
SpeedEvilAns why do you think you're connected to a rogue towerr?14:47
DocScrutinizerwe had that demonstrated on CCC 3(?) years ago, by Harald Welte14:47
psycho_oreosDocScrutinizer, ahh ok thanks14:48
merlin1991Lolcat backups without a pw are just plain zip files14:49
merlin1991But you have an option to encrypt the backups with a pass14:50
lolcatmerlin1991: Cool14:50
lolcatI don't want it to be difficult14:50
lolcatBut today I am returning my phone14:50
lolcatBecause I need money for my vacation14:50
lolcatBuying one for approximatly haf the price14:50
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lolcatBut I need some help14:52
lolcatWhat features in the N900 is only found in the new Symbian phones?14:52
lolcatI really want a keyboard and I don't want android14:52
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* RST38h remembers something14:55
RST38hHere. Quiet now.14:55
pupnikgood day DocScrutinizer, RST38h14:55
* DocScrutinizer imagines vacations without N900 and starts to cry14:56
DocScrutinizerlo pupnik14:56
lolcatDocScrutinizer: I love the N900 for vacations, I can use all the computer features and have it awesome!14:56
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merlin1991N900 > some vacation money ;)14:56
lolcatmerlin1991: I will buy a new N90014:57
lolcatBut for WAY cheaper14:57
DocScrutinizernow that's just too weird14:57
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DocScrutinizercan I do that too, maybe 10 times a day??14:57
lolcatDocScrutinizer: They fixed the charger port, and then it came loose again. 3rd repair == refund14:58
DocScrutinizerduh, aah14:58
lolcatThe fun thing is that the next phone probably has the same issues (pretty sure it is from the same batch)14:58
lolcatSo I will probably get the money back for it too after about a year14:58
DocScrutinizeryou might consider not using USB port anymore14:58
* DocScrutinizer still loosely following his project to have a charging cradle14:59
RST38hhey apupnik14:59
lolcatHow will that work?15:00
onion_funny, a friends N900 usb porting getting loose was fixed by him getting a N8 instead. "No N900 available anymore" was the answer to the obvious question.15:00
DocScrutinizerprobably by drilling two small holes into battery cover15:00
DocScrutinizerplus some small "hardware" inside15:00
SpeedEvilI was wondering about connecting up Vbus, gnd, and D+ and D- from under the battery to outside.15:01
SpeedEvilThrough protector15:01
DocScrutinizerI considered revamping pre's inductive charger, but it's too expensive for a poor EE15:01
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lolcatInductive charging? How much would that be? How long distances?15:02
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: exactly, but Vbus still unclear15:02
SpeedEvilOther than solder, yes.15:03
DocScrutinizerlolcat: direct contact (like cradle) but without electrical contacts. Think of your electric toothbrush15:03
Cor-AiIf I'd like to alter the funktion of some of the HW buttons on my n900, how should i do that? :)15:03
lolcatDocScrutinizer: My toothbrush is manual15:03
DocScrutinizerthe pre inductive option is not exactly spare money15:03
pupnikpossible great port candidate for maemo "Desktop Dungeons" - quick minimalistic roguelike
DocScrutinizer...and probably I'd trash a few until proper rework paper for everybody *might* be finished15:04
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ruskiepupnik, what's wrong with plain 'ol nethack exactly?15:05
lolcatHow much in terms of numbers?15:05
DocScrutinizerso I'm not going to do this, no business model in it, just expense, lots of expense15:05
merlin1991I knew it all along, Doc is just a corporate spy ;)15:06
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pupnikruskie: i don't know15:07
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robbiethe1stIsn't inductive charging slightly dangerous? I mean... you're subjecting the bits of the device to a very hefty magnetic field, and any antennas /will/ develop a charge...15:11
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DocScrutinizerinductive charging is in the kHz range, no threat for the antennae. And the 'bits' are immune to that magnetic field, whatever you exactly meant by 'bits'15:20
DocScrutinizermost concern for me would be the magnets in device getting demagnetized ;-D That won't happen though, as the magnet field is too high freq and too weak15:21
DocScrutinizeranyway, as mentioned above, that's too expensive for me, so I'll go for a way simpler solution15:22
ruskie <-- seriously???15:22
DocScrutinizeralong pogopins15:22
pupnikdog poppins15:22
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DocScrutinizer~seen venemo15:24
infobotvenemo <> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 14h 52m 32s ago, saying: 'at all'.15:24
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: I meant there's no clear indication for any testpoint exposing Vbus yet15:26
DocScrutinizerwhich would be a major obstake for a simple rework15:27
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DocScrutinizer~spell obstacle15:27
infobot'obstacle' may be spelled correctly15:27
crashanddie~spell DocScrutinizer15:28
infobotpossible spellings for DocScrutinizer: Scrutinize Scrutinies Scrutineers Scrutineer's Scrutiny's15:28
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DocScrutinizerwill take a while until I make it into meriam-websters or Duden15:31
DocScrutinizerDocScrutinizer: Some Electronics Engineer most known for his contributions to famous epic fail Openmoko and his frequent ranting on several design details of maemo and meego. Allegedly died some years later while banging his head on desk15:33
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DocScrutinizer~ DocScrutinizer15:35
infobotyou are probably jOERG, a HW-developer and engineer of Openmoko15:35
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DocScrutinizer~ crashanddie15:37
infobothmm... crashanddie is OMG!!!15:37
DocScrutinizeralso OK :-P15:37
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crashanddie~ crashanddie15:53
infobotwell, crashanddie is OMG!!!15:53
crashanddie~ infobot15:53
infobotinfobot is, like, in need of training, can someone train me?15:53
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chem|st~ chem|st16:05
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Meceshould I be able to use qtmobility 1.2 with maemo cssu?16:06
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Meceis libqt4-dev optified?16:14
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psychologehello everyone,i need some help ,i replace with some network video ,i can't player .so can some one send me ,it in /usr/lib/browser/plugins/libflashplayer.so16:16
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MeceRST38h, funny and sad16:19
psychologewho can send me this file /usr/lib/browser/plugins/ .thanks16:20
MeceRST38h, ses the guy at a QtQuick seminar...16:20
infobotMece meant: RST38h, says the guy at a QtQuick seminar...16:20
psychologehello infobot16:21
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psychologecan you help me16:22
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DocScrutinizerpsychologe:  -- fool! ;-D16:23
DocScrutinizerwakit til upload finished16:23
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psychologeOH thanks but Not Found16:25
DocScrutinizerwait til upload finished16:26
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psychologeok thank you very very much!!!you are good man16:30
DocScrutinizeryw, if ou do a backup next time, prior to deleting/replacing stuff ;-D16:30
DocScrutinizercp ~user/
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: there's obviously no simple way to contact Vbus :-((16:34
DocScrutinizermost easy point probably C5300 outer side16:35
DocScrutinizerinside can though16:35
DocScrutinizerand behind fuse, which isn't that bad as we could get our own fuse16:36
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crashanddiepsychologe, you're Chinese or Indian, are you not?16:37
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psychologesorry my bad english16:38
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: nevermind what I said about Vbus16:41
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: have to investigate further16:41
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: \o/ J2000:6 is Vbus internal (i.e. after all the filtering, inner end of L5300)16:47
DocScrutinizerso connecting this TP to a filter chain similar to the one around *5300 components, then route it to a gold plated copper/brass pad under a 1.2mm hole drilled into backside battery cover... DONE16:49
pupnik    Guantanamo Bay Detainees: Name, ISN, Nationality, Code, ArrivalDate, Reason for transfer, Capture details16:50
pupniksecret no-more |:P16:50
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* DocScrutinizer stares at BL-5J, pondering how much 'empty' space is in there, to place some 1005 and 0603, 0402 there16:58
VenemoDocScrutinizer, what are 1005, 0603, and 0402?16:59
DocScrutinizer0.10*0.05" components, rsp .06*.03 and .04*.0216:59
DocScrutinizer0402 is standard size for most small capacitors and all resistors on N90017:00
DocScrutinizerVenemo: btw ->[2011-05-05 13:04:55] <DocScrutinizer> Stskeeps: May 05 10:26:59 <larsc> DocScrutinizer: .... May 05 11:03:09 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, I have more interest in lis302dl    ---   in
Venemowill check it out17:02
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, interesting discussion17:33
DocScrutinizerwell, alas to the point of no result17:34
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iluminator101hey guys whats the best app to record a live phone call?17:35
Venemoiluminator101, there is an app for that in the repo, but I can't recall its name17:35
DocScrutinizerVenemo: the kernel gurus aren't interested in it, and the distro maintainers aren't interested in it either as that's not their domain17:35
DocScrutinizerrecall (-er?)17:35
DocScrutinizerREcord ALL17:36
iluminator101have you used it, is it reliable17:36
VenemoDocScrutinizer, well, there is an old proverb. "if you want something done properly, do it yourself". it is unfortunate that neither of us are kernel hackers.17:36
DocScrutinizeracted up on me some time back17:36
Venemoiluminator101, it's called "recaller" I think. never tried.17:36
DocScrutinizerit didn't stop recording at end of call, maybe it got fixed meanwhile, or I messed it up. It was nice as long as it behaved17:37
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, could we make OM's driver to be API or ABI compatible with the upstream junk?17:38
DocScrutinizerno way17:38
Venemowhy not?17:38
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DocScrutinizerthe API is what's botked17:38
Venemopolling at 20Hz is what's borked17:38
DocScrutinizerwell, that too17:38
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Venemohaving a non-polling driver with a "borked" API is still better than not having it at all.17:39
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Venemoanyway, is there an IRC channel for kernel devs?17:39
DocScrutinizerOM lis302 driver has a nice sane /dev/inputX interface aka API17:39
DocScrutinizerVenemo: you noticed the roaring silence from stskeeps when I posted that note to him in #meego?17:41
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, nope, I wasn't around then17:42
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: I'm really fed up with that shit, as obviously *nobody* cares, of all the dudes who actually ought17:42
VenemoDocScrutinizer, I think alterego may also be able to help or at least add his voice. remember, he promised to do something about it if we can prove that MeeGo is affected.17:43
DocScrutinizerif #meego-arm folks are ignorant about problems in their distro that are "upstream", then why should I grow a headache?17:43
Venemoisn't there an IRC channel for kernel hackers/developers?17:44
DocScrutinizeralterego already asked about that stuff on #meego-arm and as well got no interest17:44
Venemoso at the end, we'll need to do it ourselves.17:45
Venemoor just convince Sts to use the better driver in the N900 adaptation and forget about the rest.17:45
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DocScrutinizerseems there are two policies: either write your own accelerometer driver and keep it local in the branch specific to your device/distro, or simply use "upstream" however crappy it might be - meego chosen 2nd approach, OM first one17:46
DocScrutinizerneither of both cares about "upstream", as long as it is about getting something fixed there17:48
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Venemoso, we should crap on MeeGo and take this issue to upstream ourselves17:48
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DocScrutinizerI'm not going to do this as the frontman. I might join in helping, as I'd get flamed about my ignorance regarding "best practice" at "upstream kernel development" which I really don't get the point of17:51
VenemoI'll open a bug about this on kernel.org17:52
DocScrutinizerseems like every fool can push a crappy piece of shit driver upstream, and nobody ever will care about a proper solution after that17:52
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DocScrutinizermy idea of sw development and system architecture been fundamentally different17:53
DocScrutinizerhell, not even Harald Welte - the original author of the OM driver and also a known kernel hacker (netfilters et al) - bothered to push this driver upstream17:54
DocScrutinizerthere's definitely sth fishy, either in the driver, or in the way upstream kernel maintenance is done17:55
Venemoafter a quick search of lis302 on bugzilla, I get "Zarro Boogs found. "17:55
Sicelo_just a quick question: cat /proc/cpuinfo needs root access on N900?17:56
DocScrutinizerwell, the upstream driver isn't buggy - it's just braindamaged crap17:56
Venemobeing braindamaged crap fits into "buggy"17:56
DocScrutinizerIroN900:~# ll /proc/cpuinfo17:57
DocScrutinizer-r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 2011-05-05 16:56 /proc/cpuinfo17:57
DocScrutinizerSicelo_: the answer is "NO"17:57
VenemoDocScrutinizer, is the chip called "lis302"?17:57
infobotsomebody said iirc was "if I recall correctly"17:58
Venemogoogle doesn't find anything either on "lis302dl" site:
DocScrutinizerdon't forget to mention me ;-D17:58
Venemooh, okay :P17:59
Sicelo_ty DocScrutinizer :)17:59
DocScrutinizerthought you're going to open a ticket17:59
Venemoyes, I think I'm going to17:59
DocScrutinizerVenemo: what's your problem with google? first hit here is the datasheet18:00
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, I was specifically looking for any possibly extisting bugreport. so I added site: to my search query18:01
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Venemoyou know, maybe someone has noticed this before?18:01
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Venemono bugs at anyway, nor any "upstream" places as I can see18:04
DocScrutinizercheck lis3lv02, iirc that's the name of the braindead upsteam driver18:04
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Venemolis3lv02 seems to be a totally different chip18:05
Venemoor I dunno, but it sounds differently18:06
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DocScrutinizeryeah, actually it sounds a little bit different18:08
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Venemomaybe lis3lv02 doesn't even support the stuff that lis302dl does? so actually maybe the braindamaged driver isn't that braindamaged after all?18:08
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: the register mapping seems to mach 1:1 on a fast scan18:14
Venemothen what's the difference?18:14
VenemoI also don't understand how can this stuff be used for joysticks too?18:15
DocScrutinizerupper sample freq for lis302dl=400 , for lis3lv02 aiui 64018:15
DocScrutinizerrange lis302dl +-8g, lis3lv02 +-6g18:15
DocScrutinizer(joysticks) freehand18:16
DocScrutinizernot mounted to a desk18:17
DocScrutinizera stick with a cable on it18:17
SpeedEvilThe lv partt has a bit less noise, and no doubleclcikc18:17
Venemoahh, that kind of joystick18:17
DocScrutinizerVenemo: maemo driver is named lis302dl18:17
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DocScrutinizerso you could argue meego is even using the WRONG driver18:18
Venemowhat if we pretended we don't know anything about the crappy "lis3lv02" driver and would just submit the lis302dl driver to upstream.18:18
DocScrutinizerand larsc can't say there's already a driver upstream18:18
Venemoexactly my thinking :)18:19
DocScrutinizerI'll ask larsc18:19
Venemowho is larsc?18:19
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Venemoso the braindamaged driver could still be used on the lis3lv02 chips, and the lis302dl from OM would be used for the lis302dl. then everyone would be happy.18:23
VenemoDocScrutinizer, whatdooyouthink?18:24
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DocScrutinizerchating with larsc18:24
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shanttuany ideas why video recording lags? just flashed cssu away, tried with and without oc (voltage default)18:40
VenemoDocScrutinizer, the braindamaged crap claims to "support" the lis302dl too...;a=blob;f=Documentation/misc-devices/lis3lv02d18:44
DocScrutinizerVenemo: I still think it is crap, and claiming it supports lis302dl doesn't change that. But meh, it makes things difficult of course18:48
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, obviously it's crap. "But meh, it makes things difficult of course" <--- this is what I'm concerned about.18:51
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Sazpaimondoes anyone have a fix for the silent alarm>19:15
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Sazpaimonoccasionally my alarm will simply not emit any sound19:17
Sazpaimonit almost always happens when you leave it ringing19:17
Sazpaimonit'll eventually stop, but it won't ring again19:17
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Sazpaimonon every other nokia phone that I've ever used in the past 10 years, it'll automatically snooze the alarm19:18
Sazpaimonoccasionally however, the alarm will neglect to make any sound during normal operation19:18
Sazpaimonthats what really bugs me19:18
Sazpaimonthe alarm screen will come up, but it wont make any sound19:19
Sazpaimonits as if the alarm keeps ringing but the phone just won't emit any sound19:19
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lolcatDo I have to install backup-whatever to take a full backup?19:38
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merlin1991the inbuild back up should take care of backing up contacts / sms / calendar and a few system settings19:45
psychologehas someone install nessus in easy debian19:47
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merlin1991X-Fade: ping20:04
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DocScrutinizerSazpaimon: indeed the maemo alarm in calendar is absolutely useless, and the alarm in clock is quite errr "better use a real alarm clock"20:29
DocScrutinizerSazpaimon: fix would be to use another alarm app20:30
DocScrutinizerI gave up on it more or less, and I'm using N810 alarm which is really way better in my opinion20:31
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ShadowJKN810 alarm has been much less reliable for me20:34
Tobawhat kind of consumer are you? buy the newest gadget, which will surely work better20:34
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pupnikwhen i was a kid, high-tech was a digital clock radio by my bedside20:39
pupnika different world...20:39
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DocScrutinizerwhen I was a child "digital clocks" had mechanical latches falling down every minute to show the new digit21:10
gn00byou're as old as i am21:10
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mceplI have N900 with the latest Community SSU constantly rebooting after second or so of booting up, so it never completes boot. I cannot find this recorded on bugzilla. Anybody seen this? Is there any work around it?21:35
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Wizzupis there an easy way to add additional mounts to my startup? fstab is auto generated, I just want a bind mount21:38
mcepllooks like but it doesn't seem to have much workaround.21:39
povbotBug 12017: N900 stuck in boot loop21:39
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DocScrutinizermcepl: hmm, multiboot? nitdroid?21:41
mceplno, plain Maemo (w/Community SSU repo though)21:41
mcepland advanced kernel (if it still matters in CSSU age)21:42
DocScrutinizerhmmm, rootfs filled up?21:43
mceplhmm, no idea ... cannot check when I am not able to boot :(21:46
DocScrutinizerWizzup: add a file to etc/init.d/* and link it to etc/rcX.d/S*21:49
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mceplDocScrutinizer: do you think there is anything else to do than Reflash?21:52
DocScrutinizermcepl: boot to another system (e.g. meego, rescue-initrd), mount the maemo rootfs, and check and clean21:54
WizzupDocScrutinizer: thanks, I suppose I have to be really careful?21:55
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DocScrutinizercan't do much harm21:55
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Wizzuplast time I tried to edit it I bricked my device21:56
DocScrutinizerjust avoid to mount the wrong partition21:56
mceplDocScrutinizer: do you have any URL how to do it (rescue-initrd)?21:56
Wizzupoh, but it's a -o bind21:56
WizzupSo it doesn't involve partitions :)21:56
DocScrutinizermixed you two guys up21:57
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DocScrutinizerWizzup: there can't be much problems in what I suggested to you21:57
DocScrutinizermcepl: mompls21:58
WizzupSo, if I understand this correctly: rcX.d/S* is automatically launched?21:59
Wizzupeverything in it21:59
DocScrutinizerS99* I suggest. Yes all starting with S are autolaunched21:59
Wizzupok, ty21:59
DocScrutinizerI'm not sure about the correct runlevel22:00
DocScrutinizerthe X in rcX.d22:00
DocScrutinizerchecj etc/inittab22:00
DocScrutinizeras maemo is somewhat nonstandard here22:00
DocScrutinizerI think it's 222:00
DocScrutinizerit's 2, yes22:02
DocScrutinizerIroN900:~# runlevel22:02
DocScrutinizerN 222:02
mceplDocScrutinizer: thanks, will try22:02
Wizzupok, thx22:02
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DocScrutinizerWizzup: just use the shortest other file there as a pattern22:04
WizzupWhat do you mean? I think it works now22:04
* Wizzup just rebooted22:04
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WizzupI wonder... since the mount -o bind uses the /media/mmc1 partition, am I not called it too early?22:06
DocScrutinizerwell, I just suggested you have a look at e.g. /etc/init.d/hwclock and copy&edit for your own file22:06
Wizzupo, sorry.22:06
DocScrutinizerS99 is last one to get caled22:06
DocScrutinizerthere are cmdline tools that check the lengthy comment for info about dependencies, and create the correct symlink from /etc/init.d/XX to /etc/rcM.d/SNN-XX22:08
DocScrutinizerbut for your own system you probably get away with not bothering about anything of that22:09
WizzupI didn't see any deps in hwclock22:09
WizzupBut perhaps that's why you suggested it22:09
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DocScrutinizeractually it has no requered-start:22:10
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DocScrutinizerlook at hal22:10
DocScrutinizer. /lib/lsb/init-functions22:11
DocScrutinizeris kinda notable22:12
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DocScrutinizeras is the22:12
DocScrutinizercase "$1" in22:12
DocScrutinizer  start)22:12
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WizzupI don't follow, why exactly is that notable?22:13
DocScrutinizerfriggin maemo, other distros have a init.d/skel22:13
WizzupYeha, I've written some gentoo init scripts before22:13
DocScrutinizerthe case "$1" is mandatory for the way init calls those scripts in rcX.d22:14
DocScrutinizerthe source /lib/lsb/init-functions includes some common notification function and other auxiliary helpers used by init22:15
DocScrutinizeryou probably don't need it if you have absolutely none of them22:15
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WizzupI really just have a mount command in start and unmount in stop, and the case "$1" in stuff from hwclock22:16
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DocScrutinizersufficient then22:17
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WizzupAlso, now that I'm here... Any suggestion for a folder based music player?22:18
WizzupI found someplayer to be a bit uneasy22:19
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WizzupDocScrutinizer: It doesn't seem to be started on boot yet, any idea?
WizzupStarting it manually works22:23
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jrayhawkI've noticed mplayer tends to just stop abruptly in the face of various system events, such as the GPIO phone slide or any message alerts; is that the sort of uneasiness you're talking about?22:29
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DocScrutinizeryou made a link from the file to /etc/rc2.d/S99-bindmount-user ?22:30
DocScrutinizeryou set it to executable?22:30
Wizzup# ls -l S99mount_wizzup22:31
Wizzuplrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           24 May  5 21:02 S99mount_wizzup -> /etc/init.d/mount_wizzup22:31
Wizzup# ls -l /etc/init.d/mount_wizzup22:31
Wizzup-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root         1496 May  5 21:17 /etc/init.d/mount_wizzup22:31
Wizzup( I hope that wasn't too much paste :) )22:31
DocScrutinizerand the S99 is in /etc/rc2.d/ ?22:32
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DocScrutinizerweird, should get started22:32
DocScrutinizermaybe it gets started but your cmd fails?22:32
WizzupI was a bit unsure about the levels that you give in the file22:32
WizzupWell, it works when I run it manually22:32
Wizzup eg /etc/init.d/mount_wizzup start22:32
DocScrutinizeryeah, never assume $PATH to be set to anything, in scripts22:33
WizzupDon't think I use it22:33
DocScrutinizerwhat's your command?22:33
WizzupDid you see the paste? I don't understand otherwise22:34
WizzupIt's a mount call with absolute paths22:34
DocScrutinizeroops, npo22:34
DocScrutinizercall mount with full path22:34
WizzupGood idea22:34
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Wizzupdang, it's still not called22:37
* Wizzup will add a touch /somefile to see if it's actually called22:37
DocScrutinizerinsert `touch /root/test`22:38
Wizzupyeh, was going to use /tmp22:38
Wizzuproot is a better idea22:38
DocScrutinizerthis wasn't an answer22:38
DocScrutinizerjust a race22:38
DocScrutinizeractually "echo one >>/root/testlog"  ... "echo two, three, exit >>/root/testlog"22:40
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Wizzupnothing in /root/22:41
DocScrutinizer/sbin/mount -o bind,foo,bar X Y >>/root/testlog22:41
WizzupIsn't it /bin/ ?22:41
compengihello.. after i rebooted n900, the virtual keyboard stopped working. maybe the process is still up somewhere? or how do i know what's wrong?22:42
WizzupDocScrutinizer: perhaps the Default-Start is wrong22:42
WizzupI think it needs an S22:42
Wizzuphwclock has it, and I think hal doesn't because it's a dep of others22:43
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DocScrutinizerWizzup: that'S only for adding a symlink to rcS.d which isn't what you want I guess22:43
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DocScrutinizerand only if tools like insserv deal with installing that file22:44
compengiby stopped working i mean, stopped popping out22:44
DocScrutinizercompengi: check your settings22:44
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compengiDocScrutinizer, i did that, it's enabled there22:44
DocScrutinizerso I have to admit I have no idea22:46
WizzupDocScrutinizer: Shall I just add every runlevel to it?22:47
* Wizzup is out of ideas22:47
DocScrutinizershould work on 222:47
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WizzupI see not every init scripts has all that parseable info22:47
Wizzupssh doesn't have it22:48
Wizzupnvm, it's probably not in rcX.d22:48
compengiDocScrutinizer, i clicked the turn off button and then accidentally clicked on lock device button, it asked me to insert the code so i tapped on the outside region, then it asked me if i want to turn off the device, i clicked on yes. i started the device again, inserted the unlock code and the sim code, maemo loaded then i noticed that the virtual keyboard doesn't work22:48
DocScrutinizerthat info isn't used on maemo I think22:48
DocScrutinizerWizzup: add it to 2,3,4,522:48
DocScrutinizeras your INIT INFO says22:49
WizzupPerhaps touch didn't work, because I didn't use the complete path...?22:49
WizzupDocScrutinizer: ah, ok22:49
WizzupI could also remove 3,4,5? Don't know if that matters22:50
WizzupBetter to add to multiple I suppose22:50
Sicelo_ ~wut22:51
infobotrumour has it, wut is a lamer way of saying what22:51
compengiDocScrutinizer, maybe the virtual keyboard process is running, do you know the process's name?22:51
DocScrutinizermaybe it's runing, maybe not. who cares? Didn't say you rebooted?22:51
Wizzupreboot kills all processes22:52
DocScrutinizerthere's no such process I guess, well not exactly and always at least22:52
DocScrutinizercompengi: you're aware you have to click to set focus, so the vkbd pops up?22:53
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compengiDocScrutinizer, of course.. i actually use it more than the hardware keyboard. i tried to tap with my finger and with the stylus in several applications, nothing happened22:55
WizzupDocScrutinizer: no dice :(22:56
DocScrutinizermake sure your links in /etc/rc2|3|4.d look like lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 20 2009-10-30 12:40 S99zzinitdone -> ../init.d/zzinitdone22:56
DocScrutinizer-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root  992 2009-10-26 08:41 /etc/init.d/zzinitdone22:57
Wizzupyeah, I used ln -s22:57
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WizzupThe *only* difference is that my ln is an absolute path22:58
WizzupWhereas theirs is relative22:58
DocScrutinizeryeah, noticed that22:58
WizzupAnd that can't be it. If that's it, I'll eat something close to me, don't know what yet22:58
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WizzupCould I use event.d?22:59
compengiDocScrutinizer, ah.. it works again after reboot23:01
DocScrutinizerwell, you could, but I always felt it's more clumsy23:01
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DocScrutinizerreally, I don't get it. You have a link in /etc/rc2.d/S99whatever that points to /etc/init.d/foobar which is set 755 and has shebang and yet your file isn't executed at all, not even first line after shebang when you add a `echo xxx >>/root/test` there?23:03
Wizzupno, I added the touch to start()23:04
DocScrutinizeradd it before23:04
DocScrutinizerto ""main""23:05
Wizzupevent.d seems to work, back to the other method23:05
DocScrutinizeralso make sure you got that link in rc2.d, rc3.d, and rc4.d23:05
Wizzupgive me a sec23:05
Wizzupand rc5.d23:05
DocScrutinizerumm, nope prolly not23:05
Wizzuphm, but I have the number 5 in there too?23:06
DocScrutinizerafaik rc5 is act_dea aka charging23:06
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DocScrutinizerwon't hurt to keep your stuff mounted there, but actually I'd discourrage to add it there23:07
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Wizzupyeah, I removed it23:07
DocScrutinizerdarn, this works for a virtually unlimited number of other apps23:08
DocScrutinizeryou made your call look like /bin/mount ..... ?23:08
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DocScrutinizerI'm puzzled23:09
WizzupLet's see if it works now23:09
Wizzup:/ no dice23:10
DocScrutinizerplease use echo, not /bin/touch23:11
WizzupHm, perhaps because I don't have a force-reload command? Just wondering, perhaps there's some ``syntax error''23:11
DocScrutinizerthere's no parameter check in init23:11
DocScrutinizerit simply calls all S* with parameter start23:12
Wizzupchanged to echo "HI" >> /root/wizzup23:12
DocScrutinizerand all K* with parameter stop23:12
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WizzupI've turned it into an echo. Do I need to use /bin/echo or just echo?23:14
DocScrutinizerjust echo, it's a busybox builtin for all I understand23:15
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DocScrutinizercase "$1" in23:15
DocScrutinizer  start)23:15
DocScrutinizer        if [ ! -e /tmp/first-boot-flag-tmp ]; then23:15
DocScrutinizer            echo -n "Starting $DESC: "23:15
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WizzupI simply don't know anymore23:17
Wizzupevent.d worked, so I suppose I could put it in there :/23:17
DocScrutinizerall I can see is the usuall exit 0  missing at very end of your file23:19
DocScrutinizereally don't get it23:20
DocScrutinizerwell, bbl23:20
Wizzupthx for the help23:20
DocScrutinizernot for that23:20
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DocScrutinizerand of course your symlink been absolute rather than relative. If init runs in a chroot or pivotroot (aka initrd), but I think in never did on maemo5... .oO(???)23:23
compengiare there any packages to change the slider type screen unlock to a pattern type?23:24
DocScrutinizerI seem to recall somebody hacked sth23:24
DocScrutinizernot sure about pattern, but differnet backgrounds, and maybe also different widgets23:25
compengiaha.. can you point it out for me please?23:26
DocScrutinizersorry, no clue23:26
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DocScrutinizer[1][property]=name&org_maemo_packages_search[1][constraint]=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search[1][value]=lock&org_maemo_packages_search[2][property]=title&org_maemo_packages_search[2][constraint]=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search[2][value]=same soory for al the blocks and clocks23:30
DocScrutinizerdon't think there's really anything23:30
DocScrutinizerbut check for yourself23:31
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DocScrutinizeractually changing slider lock to pattern lock doesn't make much sense23:31
DocScrutinizerat least to me right now23:32
compenginope.. nothing :/23:33
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DocScrutinizerwhy do you need that?23:34
DocScrutinizerwhat's wrong with slider?23:34
compengibecause it's a higher security than a slider and a more confusing and more styler than a code lock23:36
mceplDocScrutinizer: any idea how to find free space on drive when the image you suggested doesn't have df?23:37
mceplsomewhere in /proc I guess ...23:38
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DocScrutinizercompengi: you're aware that he slider unlock as well unlocks with lockslider switch on right side of device?23:39
DocScrutinizermcepl: ooof23:39
infobotfrom memory, nfc is No Fucking Clue23:40
evilbulgariananyone have issues with multiboot-kernel-power and the recent upgrade?23:40
DocScrutinizermcepl: you're lost on intrd?23:40
mcepllost? I have booted from the image/initrd you suggested, but it is so plain, that its busybox doesn't have even df23:41
mcepland I am too lazy to look for another image :( but I probably will have to.23:41
DocScrutinizersuggested method is to first mount some other fs where some proper tools can get started from23:42
DocScrutinizerI never had a look into it, maybe somebody else here can help23:42
DocScrutinizerthere are other gotchas as well, with e.g. missing keys on kbd, like / etc23:43
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: ping23:43
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: can you help out?23:43
mceplwhat's R&D mode?23:43
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DocScrutinizerit enables root, and also allows you to stop some watchdogs23:44
DocScrutinizerswitches on tty console interface on testpoints under bat23:44
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mceplok, let's try that ... it cannot be much more useless than this23:45
DocScrutinizerdoesn't help most probably23:45
mceplMohammadAG was suggesting it in #maemo-ssu ...23:46
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DocScrutinizerhmm, ok23:46
DocScrutinizertry it23:46
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DocScrutinizerbut actually it won't help in itself, maybe one of the watchdog options I always forget their name23:47
compengiDocScrutinizer, of course it use that too.. but i was thinking of something nicer and more secured23:48
DocScrutinizermcepl: mount -t ubifs /dev/mtd4?? /some/local/dir23:49
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DocScrutinizerto access the original busybox of maemo, plus other tools23:50
Kukahello, I have some noob questions about CSSU and v47, will someone help me by pm?23:50
mceplBTW, the result in R&D mode is the same, except no shaking on bootup23:51
DocScrutinizeryeah, plus other funny gimmiks23:51
mceplKuka: not by PM, ask here23:51
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KukaOk, promise me not to have fun with me. :P23:51
DocScrutinizermcepl: try flasher --help and chose that R&D flag that says sth like --no-restart-on-foobar23:52
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mceplI don't see it here23:53
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DocScrutinizerumm --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset23:53
mceplthat I had there23:53
KukaAs I read, CSSU is a cool project, which is pure member work. It has things like portraid mode which I need badly, so planning to update to CSSU now. But it was unstable at the beggining. Is it stable now?23:53
mceplKuka: it was very stable to me ... until now ;)23:54
DocScrutinizerKuka: kinda23:54
KukaO_o why until now?23:54
DocScrutinizerbecause he filled up his / probably, and got a bootloop23:54
mceplI have now some troubles (might be unrelated to Community SSU image and given by something else)23:54
DocScrutinizermcepl: you got backups?23:55
Kukahm.. I am walking on a rope, I will fall to one side but dunno which :) DocS' uncertain answer was strong enough though. Now need some couragement for update to CSSU :S23:56
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Kukaok, now v47. Same question for that too, I see it has some probs like battery widget is not properly working, and some sms issues. What is con's for v47? Better responsiveness, more coverage area for wifi (was something like that) and?23:59

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