IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2011-04-21

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SpydemonI'm trying to build an apps on my computer for my N900, so I use sbox, it is configured on FREMANTLE_X86, it is good, isn't it ?00:04
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merlin1991Spydemon: FREMANTLE_X86 means you can test it on the pc, but that won't run on the device00:05
SpydemonI ask because gcc make me ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), wich aren't the binary used by the N900's processor :-(00:05
Spydemonahhh ok ^^00:05
MohammadAGsb-conf select FREMANTLE_ARMEL00:05
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merlin1991FREMANTLE_ARMEL or however it's called00:05
merlin1991hehe MohammadAG you did beat me :P00:06
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MohammadAGmerlin1991, crack your knuckles, you might have to write a changelog tonight or tomorrow00:06
lcuk\o MohammadAG00:06
MohammadAGhi lcuk00:06
MohammadAGmerlin1991, :P00:06
merlin1991and o hi lcuk :D00:06
MohammadAGit's o hai, not o hi00:07
* MohammadAG sends merlin1991 a cheezburger for dummies book00:07
merlin1991hai == shark == evil00:07
merlin1991--> hi00:07
merlin1991(at least in finnish and german)00:07
merlin1991can I haz noodlez?00:08
MohammadAGmethinks merlin1991 should haz moar eggsamples00:09
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* DocScrutinizer starts eggsell00:29
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MohammadAGSegmentation Fault00:31
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merlin1991SWKOTOR segfaults all the time for me atm00:33
Spydemonprintf() doesn't work on N900 ? I test a Hello world, the program seems to be well executed, but text isn't print into the terminal00:34
nox-tried running it from xterm?00:35
nox-forgot to include stdio.h?00:38
Spydemonnope, library is included00:38
nox-that's in C?00:39
Spydemonyes, compiled by gcc00:39
MohammadAGnope, printf works fine00:39
nox-Spydemon, crosscompiled?00:40
Spydemoni use FREEMANTLE_ARMEL00:40
nox-ah might be something wrong there...00:40
Spydemonwith cs2007q3-glibc2.5-arm700:41
Spydemonyes may be00:41
Spydemonbut the app seem to be good executed00:42
nox-so other lib fns work just not stdio?00:42
DocScrutinizerstrace hello-world00:42
Spydemonnox-, I have just tested stdio ^^00:44
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nox-so what do you mean by executed well?00:44
nox-but yeah try the strace00:45
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Spydemonwhen I execute the app in xterm, I have no error during execution00:45
SpydemonDocScrutinizer, Sorry, I must learn how work strace before I'm able to use this command :-\00:46
nox-that just will print the syscalls00:46
nox-so you'll see if write() ever gets called etc00:47
DocScrutinizerinstall strace - then do >>strace path/to/hello-world00:47
DocScrutinizeryou'll see for sure if the prog gets executed or not00:48
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Spydemontsss, I'm updating my depots, and it isn't fast -__-"00:56
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DocScrutinizerstrace is in tools repo00:58
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Spydemonok thanks, i must add Fremantle SDK tools free armel to my depot list first01:04
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Sazpaimonis it possible to modify RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin to boot in qemu01:14
Sazpaimoni dont want to download the entire QT sdk to get the maemo nand image01:14
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DocScrutinizerflasher can extract parts from RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin01:24
MohammadAGand you can mount rootfs.jffs201:24
MohammadAGthat'll probably take more time to figure out than downloading the sDK01:25
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Spydemonupdating depots are for you also so long ? :-\01:25
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Spydemonthe update take ten minutes :x01:26
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DocScrutinizeryes, sometimes01:28
DocScrutinizerusually 501:28
Spydemonit's bad ^^01:28
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Spydemonso, i've strace installed, but it wasn't in tools repo01:29
Spydemoneven with your script01:29
Spydemonso I installed the apt-get version01:29
Spydemonbut this version seems to work different01:30
Spydemon"strace hw" return : strace hw command not found01:31
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SazpaimonDocScrutinizer, yeah i ran unpack on the bin and it gave me a bunch of files01:36
Sazpaimonnothing looks like anything qemu likes01:36
DocScrutinizerI don't think you could run a armel kernel under qemu01:37
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Sazpaimonare you sure about that?01:38
jacekowskiwhy not?01:38
DocScrutinizerat least not *this* kernel01:38
Sazpaimonim pretty sure you could01:38
jacekowskikernel isn't a problem01:38
jacekowskiqemu emulaton of N900 is quite decent01:38
jacekowskiyou need special nolo01:38
Sazpaimoni extracted everything in the bin, but I cant figure out what the mtdblock would be01:40
jacekowskii just read back that stuff01:40
jacekowskithat's not going to work01:40
jacekowskiunless you spend lot of time making qemu friendly image first01:41
Sazpaimonso I *need* to download the entire qt sdk just to get the n900 nand image?01:41
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jacekowskiyou can unpack that01:41
Sazpaimonso why cant i boot that in qemu?01:41
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jacekowskibecause NOLO will not boot in qemu01:41
jacekowskibecause qemu can't emulate features that N900 NOLO requires01:41
DocScrutinizerthat's what I meant by "*this* kernel"01:42
Sazpaimoni thought that was added recently01:42
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jacekowskiwell, kernel would boot01:42
jacekowskiif you can convince nolo to boot it01:42
Sazpaimonmy qemu 0.14.50 does have an N900 device setting, I see references to nolo in the source01:43
jacekowskithere is special modified version of nolo01:44
jacekowskithat runs in qemu01:44
Sazpaimonand i take it it isn't supported by the N900 image01:44
DocScrutinizerI seem to recall some meego guys made NOLO run in qemu?01:44
jacekowskinokia did01:44
jacekowskithere is ready made meego image01:44
jacekowskiwith modified nolo and everything you need01:44
jacekowskiit has big part of cmt support stripped out01:45
jacekowskiand some other things01:45
jacekowskibut it is quite a lot smaller01:45
timeless_w7ipwe've defintely had system-qemu01:45
timeless_w7ipbut the performance is quite painful01:45
timeless_w7ipso i wouldn't01:46
jacekowskithere is image for that01:46
Sazpaimonso like, what in this image do I need to feed to qemu01:46
jacekowskibut it's slightly different than image to run on phone01:46
jacekowskii'm not sure about powervr emulation01:46
jacekowskiand if maemo requires it01:46
MohammadAGSazpaimon, what do you want to do actually01:46
SpydemonDocScrutinizer, strace says that I've a Exec format error01:46
Sazpaimon here's basically everything I extracted from the image01:47
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Spydemonso, it's still an error ^^01:47
jacekowskiSpydemon: really, if you don't know what to do then just download qt sdk01:47
MohammadAGyou want the Maemo SDK with the "emulator"?01:47
jacekowskiMohammadAG: no01:47
MohammadAGthe Qt SDK doesn't use qemu jacekowski01:47
jacekowskiMohammadAG: he want just the emulator without sdk01:47
MohammadAGso I'm not sure what he wants01:47
SazpaimonMohammadAG, there are some programs I'm trying to compile that wont work on the userland qemu01:47
MohammadAGthe Qt SDK has a "simulator", a shitty x86 target with a device wrapping the app window01:47
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Sazpaimonqemu just dies during compilation no matter what01:48
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MohammadAGand some options that can fake gps position etc01:48
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Sazpaimonso i figure I'll try it with the system qemu and see if it works01:48
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jacekowskiSazpaimon: well, as MohammadAG said, no option for system-qemu for maemo01:48
Spydemonjacekowski, i want juste exec a hello world program for the moment, not create a awesome program with GUI xD01:48
Sazpaimonjacekowski, seriously? so my only other option is compile on the device?01:48
MohammadAGthen get scratchbox01:48
infobotmethinks maemosdk is
jacekowskiSpydemon: ehh, that wasn't for you01:49
jacekowskiSpydemon: what is the problem you have?01:49
MohammadAGYou don't need the QtSDK for a C app01:49
Sazpaimonjacekowski, like I said, qemu isn't working01:49
MohammadAGyou don't even need nokia-binaries01:49
Sazpaimonduring compilation in scratchbox, qemu dies01:49
jacekowskiSazpaimon: as in what error message01:50
jacekowskiSpydemon: hmm, do you have binformat misc support?01:50
Sazpaimoni reported it to the qemu guys, they already know about it01:50
Sazpaimon[13:38] <pm215> Sazpaimon: that is an old-style cp15 data barrier, which qemu appears to not support in user mode01:50
Spydemoni dont know that jacekowski, i'll check01:50
Sazpaimoni also attempted it with qemu 0.14.50 in scratchbox, same deal01:51
jacekowskiSazpaimon: paste bit more context01:51
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Sazpaimonhold on then, let me re run make01:52
Sazpaimonso i need to patch and rebuild qemu01:52
Sazpaimonokay, I can do that01:52
Sazpaimonhopefully this works on 0.14.5001:52
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Sazpaimonno wait, i can't patch that version, it doesnt work with scratchbox01:53
jacekowskii'm going to sleep01:53
jacekowskii have to go to london village tomorrow01:53
Sazpaimonwhere is scratchbox's hacked up qemu source01:53
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DocScrutinizerSpydemon: you probably got a wrong target? do >>file path/to/hello-world01:59
SpydemonDocScrutinizer, yes, i do strace hl, instead of strace ./hl02:00
Spydemonnow it's good02:00
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SpydemonDocScrutinizer, it's working now :p02:06
Spydemonin sbox, i've just choose to "install files on to the target" :-\02:07
Spydemoni'll go to bed, it's late now in France :p02:17
Spydemonthanks DocScrutinizer and jacekowski for your help :-)02:18
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pupnik_mubarak arrested :)04:25
pupnik_and his sons :D04:25
pupnik_thanks to bradley manning04:25
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pupnik_the blue on the n900 is stunningly deep06:01
pupnik_something is unusual about it06:02
pupnik_i have to reduce saturation on blue to match my laptop06:02
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TiagoTiagoi had to reflash my N900, and now i don't remember what was the secret to keeping enough space in rootfs after installing all my there a progam that will scan my rootfs and gimme a list of all files i can safelly symlink to somewhere outside that cramped little closet?06:47
TiagoTiagoi already moved out most of the big files and folders i identifyied as belonging to installed programs or that aren't system files06:49
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ds3is there a way to get the rss reader widget to show only feeds I want on the widget and not all of them?06:51
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Sazpaimonis it possible to use gcc 4.4 in scratchbox?07:29
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RST38hWell. Moo all.08:08
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RST38hheya derf08:08
derfWhat's shakin'?08:11
* infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass08:11
derf ___________08:14
derf< MooOOOoo? >08:14
derf -----------08:14
derf        \   ^__^08:14
derf         \  (oo)\_______08:14
derf            (__)\       )\/\08:14
derf                ||--WWW |08:14
derf                ||     ||08:14
RST38hderf: Not much. Lots of work, no fun08:16
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derfYeah, I know what you mean.08:17
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psychologecan somebody run MDK3 on N900?09:35
psychologei want try to crack hide essid wep.09:37
psychologecan somebody give some suggest?how to ?09:39
lollooah MDK09:42
psychologelolloo.ya,wireless ddos crack hide wep09:43
lollooI have no experience but sound good09:44
psychologecan somebody interest it ?? and complie it to N90009:45
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psychologeyes i agree,i want too,but now i can't do it,09:50
psychologei study python,new to linux09:50
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mecepsychologe, you can try to compile it directly first. perhaps it works :)09:58
psychologeok,do it myself.10:03
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Khertan11337 pourcent of Pi == 4211:41
Khertan1Morning !11:42
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userKhertan1: pourcent?11:44
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Khertan11337 * Pi / 10011:44
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jhb1Hi *, the status light is very dim (e.g yellow or green). When freshly booted, it sometimes starts of normal, but right now its very hard so see it all. Any ideas?12:16
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Venemogood morning12:31
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mrAlmondHi all12:41
mrAlmondJust a question..does maemo use an Xserver + egl ?12:42
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VenemomrAlmond, afaik Maemo uses Xorg12:45
VenemomrAlmond, not sure about egl12:46
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mrAlmondI'm asking this because I'm doing something similar for an embedded device that has egl support12:47
mrAlmondon framebuffer everything is smooth12:47
mrAlmondbut on xorg it's very slow12:47
mrAlmondAs test application I'm using this one from maemo :
VenemomrAlmond, well, I dunno what you mean by "something similar"12:48
mrAlmondI'm talking about the graphic stack12:48
mrAlmondso qt + xorg + egl12:49
Venemowell, Maemo supports OpenGL ES12:49
VenemoI don't know what egl is12:49
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mrAlmondthis example uses egl :
VenemoI'm sure someone knowledgeable will answer your question. maybe ask DocScrutinizer12:51
VenemoI have to leave now.12:51
mrAlmondok tnx!!12:51
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mrAlmondDocScrutinizer: Hi12:52
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cityLightshi all12:56
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chem|stmrAlmond: yes13:18
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mrAlmondtnx but I've already read that page13:20
mrAlmondI'm trying to understand how maemo can have good performances using xorg and egl13:21
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chem|stthere is no "good performance" in "xorg"13:23
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mrAlmondchem|st : So you mean that at the moment xorg + egl in maemo is not running smooth?13:29
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DocScrutinizerI'm the wrong one to ask on that topic, dunno why Venemo pinged me :-D13:30
mrAlmondDocScrutinizer : :-D13:30
DocScrutinizerlcuk might know13:30
mrAlmondlcuk : Hey, are you the right one to ask about? :-)13:31
BCMMwhat's the right way to make a native-looking text edit box in Qt?13:31
BCMMwhen i just use a QTextEdit, it looks wrong. the highlighting is buggy, and i can't scroll with a finger13:32
BCMMthe qt-maemo-example app has the same problem... surely there is a way to do this?13:32
BCMM(specifically, i can't select text with the touchscreen either, and if i select with the keyboard, there is no highlight colour, the text i've selected looks normal, and the rest of the line vanishes)13:33
chem|stmrAlmond: the drivers are outdated afaik and so are the libs...13:33
BCMMi'm trying to get behaviour similar to the Notes app13:34
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DocScrutinizerBCMM: notes is not qt I think :-P13:35
BCMMi know13:35
BCMMoh hang on. didn't see before; i'll see if that does what i think it should13:35
DocScrutinizerqt is kinda mindboggling fsckdup13:35
BCMMit is rather (on maemo)13:35
DocScrutinizeryeah on maemo, of course13:36
BCMMi know notes is GTK, but i would've thought one could at least to pretty text-selection in Qt...13:36
DocScrutinizerask MohammadAG13:36
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trxBCMM use style sheets for that13:36
trx(to make stuff pretty )13:36
BCMMi'm impressed that an official example of a simple maemo text editor doesn't even work...13:36
DocScrutinizeryeah, very impressive ;-P13:37
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BCMMthough i don't know if qt-maemo-example is different from in any way
trxdamn mapped keys13:37
lcukmrAlmond, sorry, IDK what you are talking about.  I am looking over there <<<< at stuff atm, what do you want to achieve13:37
trxdoes anyone know how sys sends those keys to focused edit box?13:37
BCMMtrx: i've never used stylesheets in qt, can they make the text highlighting look the way it should?13:38
BCMM(by which i mean, the way it looks in GTK, and teh way the same Qt code looks on a linux PC)13:38
trxBCMM you can do pretty much anything with them13:38
DocScrutinizerlcuk: topic been egl13:38
trxnever styled a text edit before tho13:38
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mrAlmondlcuk : I'm trying to have good performances on an embedded device running qt + xorg + egl...I'm asking here because maemo has a very similar architecture13:41
lcukhow well does your app work on Maemo? :)13:41
DocScrutinizertrx: fool speaking "isn't that via X events?"13:41
kwtm_Hi! Is there a maemo app that syncs decently with google calendar?  Or even if it's some command-line thing that imports it into a vCal file or something...13:41
trxBCMM check this page13:41
Cor-Aikwtm_: mail for exchange13:42
trxDocScrutinizer probably, but the wierd thing is, X Term, Notes, etc (GTK?) are recieving them properly, while Qt apps do not13:42
DocScrutinizerlcuk: I love your approach13:42
mrAlmondlcuk : Do you know which kind of xorg server version is running on maemo...and if it's using some sort of hw accelerations?13:42
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lcukDocScrutinizer, lol13:43
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trxQt apps just recieve standard keys, which is frustrating :/13:43
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lcukmrAlmond, a good one, lots of people put incredible amount of effort to ensure it ran well13:43
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lcukbut if you have the device, check with dpkg-* functions to see the versions13:44
BCMMjust built , and it scrolls13:44
mrAlmondlcuk : So it's not an easy can I obtain the maemo rootfs ?13:44
BCMMbut hte selection stuff is the same13:44
BCMMno selection by finger, and keyboard selection is unusably wrong13:44
DocScrutinizermrAlmond: see13:44
infobotflashing is, like,
lcukmrAlmond, go to store, purchase n900?13:45
kwtmtesting ... am I "kwtm" again?13:45
trxBCMM : try to add : "selection-background-color: lightgray;"13:45
lcukuse code to download firmware13:45
trxBCMM (not tested)13:45
kwtmCor-Ai: Sorry, mail for exchange ... is that a package, or are you asking me to send email to the maemo mailing list to find the answer to my question?13:45
BCMMtrx: yeah, going to try that13:45
DocScrutinizeryou'll need an arbitrary IMEI like 35693803095430013:45
BCMMbut then it'll be ignoring theme colours...13:45
trxyeah :/13:46
Cor-Aikwtm: its the name on the app :p google it and you will see!13:46
mrAlmondlcuk : clever, very clever13:46
BCMMthis is kinda ridiculous...13:46
BCMMMohammadAG: around?13:47
lcukmrAlmond, you could also use the maemo package tool to see versions13:47
DocScrutinizermrAlmond: stop bitching, say thanks to DocScrutinizer5113:47
lcukuse the search here
BCMMMohammadAG: doc suggested I ask you about Qt...13:48
DocScrutinizermrAlmond: flasher can extract the rootfs image from fiasco.bin13:48
kwtmCor-Ai: Thanks for the info.  Wow, that's a huge thread to read through ...13:48
BCMMMohammadAG: is it possible to create something like a QTextEdit, but looking correct?13:48
mrAlmondDocScrutinizer : Yes I'm looking at that, thak you13:48
BCMM(specifically, selection is all wrong in several ways in a regular QTextEdit)13:48
MohammadAGBCMM, why not use QStyleSheets?13:49
BCMMMohammadAG: isn't that for overriding native colours and so on?13:49
MohammadAGwhat's wrong with it?13:50
MohammadAGselection that is13:50
BCMMMohammadAG: i'm trying to use the system's selection colour for the background of selected text...13:50
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BCMMat present, selected text looks like normal text, but the rest of the line looks invisible (white on white?)13:51
DocScrutinizerbug in qt13:51
MohammadAGQt 4.7.2 bug13:51
BCMMoh, is that a known bug?13:52
DocScrutinizerno, we heard it first time now ;-P13:52
trxhow does something like that go unnoticed? :/13:52
BCMMsorry, for some reason i was assuming I had to do something to properly port the application13:52
BCMMlike some sort of QSpecialMaemoTextEditThing13:52
DocScrutinizeryeah, purge qt4.7.213:53
BCMMDocScrutinizer: sorry, debian newbie - are you talking about downgrading to the previous Qt version?13:53
chem|stkwtm: MfE is pre installed13:53
BCMM(and how does one do that)13:53
trxdamn i hate rx-5113:53
BCMM(i mean, i am a debian newbie)13:53
DocScrutinizerBCMM: same here, but yes, 4.7.2 is borked it seems13:53
trxis there any documentation about how it works?13:53
trx(not the file format)13:54
kwtmchem|st: Yes, I'm reading about it now.  Fascinating.  So, then, the google calendar would be sunc (sync'd) to the built-in N900 calendar app?  That's not too bad.13:54
DocScrutinizerBCMM: ask moh13:54
chem|stkwtm: as I don't give google anything I don't know13:54
BCMMMohammadAG: sorry to bother you again... how can i downgrade qt, and will everything break?13:54
trxBCMM do you have any mapped keys?13:54
MohammadAGno, the point of Qt is to write code once13:54
BCMMtrx: not quite sure what you mean13:54
trxlike Shift + Fn + b = "{"13:55
BCMMtrx: no, why?13:55
chem|stkwtm: if the world is a RTS game, google is the techy and we left it alone for too long already13:55
trxi wanted to ask you to test it on that text edit while you're at it13:55
BCMMMohammadAG: oh, and what about finger-selection, like in the notes app? is that possible?13:55
trxbecause they dont work on my controls13:55
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BCMMtrx: apt-get install qt-maemo-example if you want to play with a plain QTextEdit13:56
kwtmchem|st: Actually, I only ended up giving Google anything because I didn't feel I had a usable calendar option on the N900.  I can't remember what exactly the problem was ... I think I had trouble importing my calendar stuff from the Treo?  Or was it the GUI that wasn't so good?  Can't remember.13:56
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DocScrutinizeractually the calendar app is the least integrated closed app of the whole bunch, should be easy and painless to replace with anything better13:58
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chem|stkwtm: I just use the build in calendar for now, a sync to some online (free open at best at my servers) calendar would be nice but there is no caldav webdav support I know about13:59
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: yeah but I don't know any "good" calendar apps neither13:59
BCMMDocScrutinizer: so what's the current status of Qt for maemo? do you think there will be updates, or will bug reports just make Nokia laugh?14:00
DocScrutinizerfrankly me neither, except maybe Kontact14:00
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chem|ston desktop I use orage or something14:00
kwtmDocScrutinizer: What do you think of GPE calendar?  Seems decent, except I wasn't sure if I wanted to "leave GPE summary running in the background so it can give me alarms", as the warning message said.  This was when I was first fiddling with the N900, so maybe I should take another look.14:00
DocScrutinizerBCMM: the 2nd half for sure, no idea about first half. Ask MohammadAG14:01
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: not sure i understood...14:01
DocScrutinizerI have no idea about state of Qt, but I'm sure bug reports make Nokia laugh14:02
MohammadAGBCMM, current status is community supported14:02
BCMMMohammadAG: ah, ok14:02
BCMMhmm, trying to google for how to do this keeps giving me instructions for aptitude...14:02
MohammadAGif someone could point me to where the selection happens in the source code, I might be able to fix it14:02
BCMMhow can one block a specific version of a package?14:02
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BCMMlike using gentoo's package.mask; such that automatic update to future versions is permitted14:03
DocScrutinizerhow sneaked 4.7.2 into your system?14:03
BCMMactually, i don't even know how to view available versions of a package on debian14:03
kwtmHey question about --I still have to pore over the wiki, but just to get some live feedback here --any stability issues or known issues with performance?  If I upgrade to it (currently on PR 1.3), it's a firmware flash just like when I upgraded from PR1.2 to PR1.3?14:03
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: libqt4-core              4.7.2~git20110302-0maemo -- don't know how14:04
BCMMDocScrutinizer: maybe installing freoffice?14:04
BCMMmaybe due to having used apt-get upgrade in the past14:04
DocScrutinizerkwtm: BCMM: ask MohammadAG - I'm not sure if CSSU introduces fsckdup 4.7.214:04
DocScrutinizerBCMM: that's for sure evil14:05
kwtmok thx.14:05
BCMMis this easilly fixable? or should i just reflash/install CSSU?14:05
MohammadAGyes, CSSU introduced 4.7.214:06
BCMMbut having 4.7.2~git20110302-0maemo is presumably still not normal?14:07
mikki-kunou, wow, the new cssu did apparently make the inbuilt cam go awesome :)14:09
mikki-kunmore fun options to choose from...14:09
SpeedEvilIn what way?14:11
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mikki-kunchoosable color options as it seems, a small button which makes a shot when you touch it (on the interface) and also a timer-function (i didn't see that one before)14:13
mikki-kunand when focused it does kinda calculate how far the object is away from you... which was... well, let's just say my room got enourmously bigger :D14:14
DocScrutinizerthat's the community cam-ui replacement14:14
trxMohammadAG do you have any custom mapped keys on your n900? (if so, do they work on your Qt apps?)14:14
mikki-kunhm... must have been part of the cssu14:14
mikki-kuni didn't install to my knowledge a community cam-ui replacement...14:14
BCMMyeah, for me it appeared after a CSSU update14:15
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BCMMeither i don't know how to work it, or it has a couple of proble14:15
trxprobleM$ :)14:16
DocScrutinizerI refused recent CSSU update, and I'm pondering to completely abandon it and go back to my private way to cherrypick fixes14:16
DocScrutinizerCSSU is way too much experimental and has no stability policy whatsoever14:17
ruskieso basically like a ton of projects out there14:17
DocScrutinizerit seems focused on bleeding edge, and that's not what I want14:17
ruskieagreed sadly14:17
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Robot101if it's broken, it's not very seamless is it? :D14:17
Robot101it should be called CSU14:17
ruskiemaybe you should setup your own repo for all those cherry picks..14:18
DocScrutinizerI suggested to have a stable and a devel CSSU, but no response14:18
ruskiewould be nice14:18
mikki-kunwell, if cssu does something i don't want it to and it freezes my device i am just too happy to flash it and restart from zero again... i've tried a bunch of stuff and i have some unneeded folders due to that... just to lazy to handpick them and kill them...14:19
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DocScrutinizerfact is CSSU introduces more new bugs than it fixes old ones, right now14:21
ruskiewhat actually breaks?14:22
DocScrutinizerI honestly don't see how cam-ui by nicolai metts the matra of CSSU "don't include things that can get shipped via normal repo"14:22
DocScrutinizermeets the mantra*14:23
DocScrutinizerand inclusion of qt4.7.2 also seems a *bad* step14:23
nealHow do I best detect when there is no cellular reception?  If there is an ongoing GPRS call, I can watch for, "No coverage"), but that doesn't work if there is no on going GPRS call.14:24
mikki-kunphone-control from mohammadAG does have a command which tells you about your cell-reception iirc14:25
mikki-kunbut that basically is as well some sort of dbus-command if my mind serves me right14:25
DocScrutinizerdbus signal14:25
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nealDocScrutinizer: sure, but which one.14:26
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DocScrutinizersignal sender=:1.21 -> dest=(null destination) serial=7039 path=/com/nokia/phone/net; interface=Phone.Net; member=signal_strength_change14:29
DocScrutinizer   byte 10014:29
DocScrutinizer   byte 8914:29
DocScrutinizerdbus-monitor --system14:30
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trxDocScrutinizer do you by any chance have custom mapped keys in rx-51 ?14:30
nealDocScrutinizer: are you implying that 100/89 means no reception?14:31
trxlooks like no qt app can recieve those keys14:31
DocScrutinizerneal: of course not14:31
nealthat makes no sense according to my understanding of the function the first is normalized signal strength and the second is negative dbm14:31
DocScrutinizerI have good reception here14:31
nealI saw this:14:32
nealsignal sender=:1.19 -> dest=(null destination) serial=5536 path=/com/nokia/phone/net; interface=Phone.Net; member=signal_strength_change14:32
neal   byte 8314:32
neal   byte 8714:32
nealsignal sender=:1.19 -> dest=(null destination) serial=5537 path=/com/nokia/csd/gprs;; member=Suspended14:32
neal   uint32 514:32
neal   string "No coverage"14:32
DocScrutinizeryeah, I see all sorts of those14:32
nealso it is not clear that no coverage is easily implied from the signal_strength_change signal14:32
DocScrutinizernot the 'no coverage' though14:33
DocScrutinizerwell, GPRS no coverage may happen unrelated to signal strength14:33
nealso, that's just an aside, I guess14:33
nealI also saw on the phone no reception14:33
nealor rather no network operator displayed14:34
DocScrutinizerthat's more like a too low signal14:34
DocScrutinizeranyway, define >><neal> How do I best detect when there is no cellular reception?<<14:35
DocScrutinizerin my book >>no cellular reception?<< means signal too low14:35
nealHere's my revision: how can I detect when the cell phone is no longer connected to a cellular tower.14:36
DocScrutinizerif you are interested in a different property of the complex OTA interface of GSM, you need to put different question14:36
DocScrutinizerthere's no simple definition of "connected to"14:36
DocScrutinizeryou got status "associated to a service cell"14:37
DocScrutinizerand you got status "signal is 'good enough'"14:37
nealgood point14:38
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DocScrutinizeryou got a T3212 timer that makes the MT (phone) renew its association (aka registration, login) every 60..600min, depending on carrier parameters set14:42
DocScrutinizeryou got C1,C2 critera (basically a treshold) for MT initiating a handover to a servicing cell with better signal14:43
nealDocScrutinizer: Doesn't the phone also listen on the signal channel for pages, etc. and can measure the reception that way?14:43
DocScrutinizerit does all the time14:43
DocScrutinizerthat's where your signal strength is from14:43
nealDocScrutinizer: In that case, I'd suspect that it would know pretty quickly what the link quality is14:44
DocScrutinizerneal: that's also a common source of WTF? - the signal strength is a mere metric for downlink. Uplink may be totally different14:45
* SpeedEvil has some reservations as to the above prediction.14:46
ruskieof course they are only limiting the perdictions on smartphones14:46
ruskieI look at all cell phones14:46
SpeedEvilSmartphones are going crashing dwn the price-scale14:47
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ruskieI hope that S40 will keep on chugging14:48
ruskiefor when the n900 won't be able to anymore14:48
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trxanyone arround with custom mapped key (in rx-51)?15:08
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chem|sttrx: been there done that...15:10
chem|stcurrently std map15:10
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chem|stactualy I customized the xterm buttons to my needs15:10
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trxchem|st i have noticed that additional keys like eg Shift + Fn + B = "{"15:11
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trxdo not work on Qt apps15:11
Venemo_N900trx: I have a custom keymay, yes15:11
trxbut work fine in GTK15:11
Venemo_N900it doesn't work well in Qt15:11
trxcan you confirm this?15:11
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chem|stknown issue15:11
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trxare there any workarrounds/ fixes for that?15:12
Venemo_N900I told this to the Qt guys last year15:12
Venemo_N900they say that custom keymaps are not supported.15:12
chem|stbad habbit afair15:13
chem|sttrx: you have to use one of the maps known to Qt or it breaks15:14
Venemo_N900yeah, or fix Qt...15:14
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Venemo_N900the guy pointed me to a thousands of lines long cpp file15:15
chem|stwhy they did it that way remains mistery as idk WTH would want fixed maps15:15
trxthat sucks15:15
Venemo_N900they implemented the long-press blue symbols thingy in Qt15:15
chem|stqt is another "not an island"15:15
Venemo_N900and that probably broke this somehow...15:16
jaskaid rather rip out the long-press stuff than use a std map15:16
chem|stjaska: i++15:17
Venemo_N900I was planning on reverting it and compiling Qt for myself, but haven't had the time yet15:17
trxdoes qt even send anything or just ignores those combinations?15:17
chem|stI already prepared a foil for a new map....15:17
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chem|stbut then I recognized that the kbd backlight isn't strong enough (or the foil not RET 10) and I came along not working keys15:18
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chem|stwhere do you need custom keys apart of xterm anyway?15:18
trxin my App, TxPad15:19
trxsome users use them15:19
chem|stwhat is this for?15:19
trxcode editor15:19
chem|stah ok15:19
jaskaeverywhere i want to input stuff they didnt add, i dont like the popup input methods for special symbols15:19
chem|stsure or a code editor...15:19
jaska<>{}[] | etc15:19
trxi made pop-up button bar with those buttons15:19
trxbut it would be nice if it could support custom keys too15:20
chem|stback to GTK+ then15:20
trxcustom key maps*15:20
Venemo_N900chem|st: why do I need custom keys? I need óőúéáűíöü15:20
chem|stVenemo_N900: so you need some ´`~ iteration15:21
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trxwell, i guess they will have to use that bar instead.. (it pops if prox sensor is covered)15:21
chem|stthat is borked aswell15:21
chem|stthat is something I'd love for mappero15:21
chem|stbe fullscreen and turn windowed with buttons on prox-sensor15:22
trxbtw, has anyone tried TxPad here?15:22
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trxi would love your input15:22
Venemo_N900chem|st: nope. I need exactly those accented letters. for my daily communication.15:22
chem|stVenemo_N900: I know I mean the button kombination ´ followed by a char15:23
ZogGbtw still no portrait keyboard on n90015:23
ZogG =(15:23
Venemo_N900chem|st: nope, I'm not interested in the ´ char at all. anyway, I simply just set up a custom keymap. problem is that it is borked in Qt apps15:24
chem|stZogG: and no swype and no speech to text, no voice dial...15:24
* ruskie really doesn't care about portrait mode... it's a landscape device...15:24
ZogGvoice dial? meh15:24
chem|stVenemo_N900: if I presse ` and a I get à15:24
ZogGchem|st, swype would be nice but at least portrait15:24
Venemo_N900chem|st: sure but I have no ´ on my keyboard either.15:25
ruskieand no if you do need to operate it one handed then you really shouldn't be using the device in the first place it means you're doing something else as well...15:25
ZogGchem|st check if you can get compose key on n90015:25
chem|stVenemo_N900: that is what I meant15:25
ZogGruskie it would be nice though, on bus e.g.15:25
chem|struskie: smoking, holding a beer, dining a woman15:26
ZogGruskie, i found the way to make RDS, but my n900 is dead15:26
ZogGVenemo_N900, btw did you play with dbus from C or C++?15:26
chem|stor holding the sealing bar in a bus...15:26
ruskieZogG, took it to nokia repair yet?15:27
Venemo_N900ZogG: yes, I've used QtDBus15:27
Venemo_N900it's pretty simple15:27
ZogGruskie i never tried it, but as i understand i just need to send to dbus message with song15:27
ZogGfound program with src but don't understand all of it15:27
ruskiechem|st, so really nothing important where the device is actually required15:27
ZogGruskie, no repairs here in israel, waiting for part for manual one15:27
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ruskieand you contacted the local nokia corporate?15:28
chem|stbeer smoke and bus-handle is important we can talk about the wife! ;)15:28
ZogGVenemo_N900, ok as i get it back you'll help me15:28
ZogGruskie no local nokia here15:28
ZogGonly thru other company who represent them15:28
ZogGand they said as no n900 officially in your country — no go15:28
DocScrutinizersee? Qt is rotten to the bones15:28
ruskieZogG, contact the closet nokia corporate15:29
chem|stDocScrutinizer: nothing new is it?15:29
ZogGruskie ^15:29
DocScrutinizeractually the only new thing is some incredibly wise guys want to force us on Qt and thus ruin maemo15:29
ZogGDocScrutinizer lol15:31
DibblahQT is great - If you're lacking a framework.15:31
Dibblahie you need everything from process dispatching to a bubblesort.15:31
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DibblahAdmittedly, it does pretty much everything it does poorly - But it does do useful stuff.15:32
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Venemo_N900DocScrutinizer: this is a maemo-specific qt bug btw.15:36
DocScrutinizerI'm allergic to Qt-maemo only15:37
DocScrutinizerwell, also to Qt-meego I think15:37
DocScrutinizerand to Qtmoko15:37
Venemo_N900well, qt-meego should be a lot better. not sure about the moko one.15:38
DocScrutinizerwhy should qt-meego be any better? Did the use their chances to mess up the system more thoroughly?15:39
Venemo_N900qt4-maemo5 is an overrated hack, made by poorly paid unqualified guys in a rushed timeframe15:40
DocScrutinizerexactly what it feels like15:40
ruskieso like most of todays software15:41
Venemo_N900meego is different because there qt is actually developed and kept up-to-date15:41
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ruskieNokia's global mobile phone market share significantly fell below 30 per cent for the first time in 10 years during the company's first quarter <-- fun...15:43
DocScrutinizerI'm honestly afraid there'll evetually be a PR1.4 maemo meego-mockup hybrid Qt-fsck based "official" release for N90015:43
DocScrutinizeraka harmatten15:44
DocScrutinizeraka harmattan15:44
DocScrutinizerthen everybody going "WTF?!!! nothing works, the device is useless now!" A: <nokia> "wait for next meego update"15:46
E0xDocScrutinizer: i hope that tech god dont listen you15:47
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DocScrutinizersomebody of council might want to write a blog post "why you should NOT use Qt on maemo"15:54
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DocScrutinizerwhen that insane maemo-moblin merger got propagated (buzzword "how I learned to love the bomb"), Qt been the denominated golden bridge migration path from maemo to meego. Now we're left behind with a fsckdup Qt on maemo, and a rather unattractive perspective regarding meego at large on mobile phones. So WTF use a borked Qt anyway?15:58
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lcukDocScrutinizer, you might be surprised about MeeGo N900 DE - it looks quite classy now and is having many issues ironed out16:00
DocScrutinizerI thought CSSU been the path to a sane up to date bugfixed *MAEMO*, not introducing a even more buggy Qt4.7.2 "migration path" BS to a meego that'll never come16:00
lcukit has huge improvements in performance over recent months16:00
DocScrutinizerlcuk: so how is it ANY better than maemo?16:01
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Dibblahlcuk: Does it properly return to landscape after it's rotated now?16:01
lcukDibblah, seems to, yeah16:02
DibblahIs whatever window / compositing manager functional?16:02
DibblahDoes the keyboard work?16:02
lcukDocScrutinizer, I can run MeeGo handset builds on my big device16:02
Dibblah(I tried the MeeGo sneak peak install. Was not terribly impressed)16:02
DibblahPress space - Get [pppppppp until you press another key. Yay?16:03
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DibblahRotate to portrait - Back to landscape - Screen is left rotated by a couple of degrees.16:03
Venemo_N900well the main problem with the "big merge" is that it isn't a merge at all.16:03
Venemo_N900for example, MeeGo kernel doesn't have OMAP power management16:04
Venemo_N900I asked, okay, why not apply the Maemo patches?16:04
DibblahUsing an xterm, the screen "sometimes" stops updating. All in all... Not impressed.16:04
Venemo_N900and the answer was some whining that they can't use maemo kernel because idunno.16:05
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Venemo_N900so as I see it, they haven't reused anything from maemo at all16:07
Venemo_N900they even re-wrote the desktop from scratch, with no real reason...16:07
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Venemo_N900anyway, let's just hope that after some time, meego will get it right eventually16:08
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Venemo_N900DocScrutinizer: have you started to write that daemon yet?16:10
DocScrutinizerVenemo_N900: sorry, no idea what daemon you're talking bout. but no. And regarding morons that piss me about my allegedly spamming 50% of #maemo with whining about meego, I'm really more inclined to take lessons from crashanddie about BOFH16:12
Venemo_N900I was talking about the daemon which checks for accelerometer readings through some kernel events (instead of polling)16:13
DocScrutinizeraaah, you mean a PoC that prints all kevents instead of only those related to e.g udev device add/change16:14
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crashanddieI'm a BOFH?16:14
DocScrutinizersure :-D16:14
DocScrutinizermy favourite one16:15
Venemo_N900DocScrutinizer: nope, only print kevents from the accelerometer16:15
DocScrutinizeryou'd inplement that via usual standard unix means like |grep then16:16
Venemo_N900problem is, I know nothing about kernel events16:16
DocScrutinizeranyway this is just a PoC, as exactly this would have to go into QtMob16:16
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DocScrutinizerI.E. QtMob needs to open a NETLNK socket, register with kernel to receive kevents, then filter if the event is relevant for QtMob, and act accordingly16:17
DocScrutinizerno need for any daemon16:17
Venemo_N900DocScrutinizer: right.16:18
SpeedEvilBut what puts it onto dbus?16:18
SpeedEvilEverything has to go through dbus!16:18
DocScrutinizererr now?16:18
Venemo_N900no need to expose it in dbus16:18
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DocScrutinizerumm, for several kevents this is done via ke-recv->hal right now, aiui16:19
Venemo_N900anyway DocScrutinizer, if you can give me such a poc, I can make a patch to QtM that uses this approach16:19
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DocScrutinizeralas ke-recv doesn't bother about accelerometer kevents16:19
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Venemo_N900are you even sure that the accelerometer events are exposed via kernel events?16:22
DocScrutinizeralso compare source of udevadm monitor16:22
DocScrutinizerVenemo_N900: not really, but I'm sure they *could*16:23
Venemo_N900okay, but how?16:23
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DocScrutinizerif they aren't then it's a bug in lis302.ko that can get fixed at very least in PK16:23
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DocScrutinizerI.E on CSSU16:24
Venemo_N900the code you linked kinda speaks for itself16:26
Venemo_N900however, I'm not sure how to filter only the accelerometer the events16:27
DocScrutinizerVenemo_N900: btw the lis3lv02.ko they use at meego-arm for SURE does NOT support kevents. It not even supports lis302 hw IRQ16:27
DocScrutinizerso if QtMob is based on meego, then it's obvious why they fail epically on that16:28
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Venemo_N900Venemo: ^16:30
Venemo_N900DocScrutinizer: what's this btw?16:33
Venemo_N900will the same stuff work on n900?16:33
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ZogGhey guys16:39
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ZogGi look at you and i cry =)))16:39
ZogGi want my n900 back16:39
DocScrutinizerVenemo_N900: it's supposed to work on N900, at least with SHR distro based on FSO16:39
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DocScrutinizerSHR/FSO is using OE kernel16:40
Venemo_N900hm, I need to leave the unviersity, so disconnecting the wifi16:42
Venemo_N900will be back later16:42
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DocScrutinizerso not the "proprietary" Nokia maemo kernel, though I guess for N900 they added quite some of the Nokia patches16:52
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DocScrutinizerI guess I meant it's a 'normal' kernel, no less normal than meego and maemo one16:53
DocScrutinizerthe lis302dl.ko driver might be OpenMoko based16:54
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DocScrutinizerbut the Nokia driver is nice too, and I'd be surprised if it wouldn't support kevents16:55
DocScrutinizerthe meego "upstream" lis3lv02.ko OTOH... :-S16:55
DocScrutinizerjoystick driver16:55
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Venemo_N900hey DocScrutinizer :)16:58
Venemo_N900what language is the code that you linked me in?16:59
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DocScrutinizerrather c'ish16:59
Venemo_N900can I do this stuff in c++ too?16:59
Venemo_N900I mean, sure I can, but what libs/includes do I need?17:00
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DocScrutinizerFSO1 even been written in python ;-D17:00
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DocScrutinizerFSO2 is a re-implementation in vala17:00
DocScrutinizerVenemo_N900: /join #openmoko-cdevel, ask mickeyl the author17:01
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Venemo_N900btw, didn't you say that om went out of business?17:02
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Sazpaimonis it possible to use gcc 4.4 in scratchbox?17:08
Venemo_N900I'm not sure17:08
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SazpaimonI'm trying to build php but it uses a function that's broken in arm gcc 4.217:08
Venemo_N900Sazpaimon: maybe you could compile the newer gcc too?17:09
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SazpaimonVenemo_N900, wouldn't I need to compile an x86 multiarch gcc for scratchbox to use?17:11
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Sazpaimoni dont think i could use a native ARM gcc from within scratchbox17:11
Venemo_N900Sazpaimon: i have no idea17:11
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MohammadAGhow do I use libraries from a dir instead of those from $PATH?17:32
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* Khertan1 smell qt test ... !=17:34
E0xMohammadAG: whatevery you are using need have the option of specific lib path17:35
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MohammadAGfrals, still loads Qt 4.7.317:38
* MohammadAG needs to test 4.7.217:38
fralshm, usually works for me17:39
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fralssetting RPATH when linking should do it17:41
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DocScrutinizerok, lis302dl.ko driver of maemo kernel definitely should support kevents on sysfs17:46
DocScrutinizerso no more excuse to use polling17:47
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Khertan1MohammadAG: any progress in the "qt text selection bug" ?17:48
DocScrutinizerexample implementation of how to use kevents there ->;a=blob;f=libfsobasics/fsobasics/kobjectnotifier.vala;h=69b643cba72f89d847a04fed01dada72081ca2dc;hb=06c3855c111dfeb44873a54c2d59cbbfebfc9c5417:48
DocScrutinizervala, but meh17:48
DocScrutinizersimple enough17:48
DocScrutinizerQtMob needs to do same thing on maemo17:49
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DocScrutinizernext one bashing me with "don't bitch, apply patches to Qt" will get kicked! Definitely!17:50
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Venemohey DocScrutinizer, you are not bitching currently.17:51
VenemoDocScrutinizer, you are now actually making some progress.17:51
MohammadAGKhertan, looking into it atm actually17:51
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DocScrutinizeralso nota bene this lis302 kernel driver supports kevents, but afaik the one used at meego does NOT17:58
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, so, let's look at the meego implementation of QtM and let's have a laugh at it too17:58
DocScrutinizerit's "upstream" nevertheless, to compensate for that deficit ;-P17:58
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psychologecrs welcome18:01
DocScrutinizerbtw, just in case some meegans lurking - the meego lislv302 driver is here afaik:
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DocScrutinizer59  * The sensor can also generate interrupts (DRDY) but it's pretty pointless...  MUHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAA18:04
DocScrutinizerit's pretty pointless to give brilliant hardware to fools that have no clue18:04
DocScrutinizerohmy, joystick driver, seems I said that before18:06
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DocScrutinizersowhat? it's upstream and has lis302 in the name, it MUST be ok for meego18:07
DocScrutinizer*sigh* bitching mode again...18:09
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DocScrutinizerhey I'm only bitching to make you aware about *real* state of meego development, and why it will take looong time until it reaches a productive level regarding power management etc18:11
DocScrutinizerthose dudes always tell me "we'll care about that later - first get a working system" THIS WON't FLY18:12
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, you made me laugh with these comments.18:16
VenemoDocScrutinizer, now I'm curious about the MeeGo version of QtM18:17
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Khertan1MohammadAG: i ask because i m still looking where it could be18:22
VenemoDocScrutinizer, hmmm...18:22
VenemoDocScrutinizer, have you actually read those sources? "it's pretty pointless because they are generated even if the data do not change"18:22
VenemoDocScrutinizer, what the hell does this mean? the accelerometer polls itself?18:22
DocScrutinizeryeah, this dude wasn't capable to read and UNDERSTAND the lis302dl datasheet18:23
Venemocare to enlighten me?18:24
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, what is it that he failed to understand?18:25
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DocScrutinizer51the whole point of IRQ threshold engines in lis30218:26
MohammadAGKhertan1, I built the same source for my PC, but can't figure out how to use the libs18:26
DocScrutinizer51Venemo: I frankly admit you have to change thresholds prior to resetting IRQ, or it might fire again immediately18:28
DocScrutinizer51(if you're not using highpass)18:28
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VenemoI have no idea what highpass is...18:30
Venemoanyway, I trust the guys who wrote the N900 kernel on Maemo did their job well18:31
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Khertan1MohammadAG: how ... i build them in scratchbox and i ve install them in scratchbox18:33
Khertan1never try on real desktop18:33
JaffaX-Fade: ping18:33
DocScrutinizerVenemo: in LIS302 the highpass is a "DC offset filter", a way to get a signal that's 0 if input signal is steady18:34
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: yes, the N900 Nokia lis302 driver is rather decent. It only is missing a few capabilities, like enabling highpass via sysfs node18:35
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, so, what is the frequency at which lis302 sends interrupts?18:35
DocScrutinizerVenemo: so if on LIS302 you trigger IRQ in output of highpass !=0 you get a convenient motion detector18:36
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: it sends an interupt whenever the IRQ generator sees an event (like highpass out !=0). You (the user) configure the parameters of the events18:37
Venemosounds pretty decent18:37
DocScrutinizerusually there's no "frequency", an IRQ signals something really happened - I.E the orientation changed18:37
Venemowell, currently I'm not talking about orientation, but raw accelerometer data. in that case, what does "something really happened" mean?18:38
DocScrutinizeryou got TWO of those engines18:38
DocScrutinizernothing. You can read data any time you want18:39
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DocScrutinizerLIS302 can create a data ready strobe IRQ whenever a new sample is available18:39
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DocScrutinizerfor POLL18:39
MohammadAGKhertan, ./configure with the same parameters, make, make install18:41
DocScrutinizeryou use this operation mode for high data rates (maybe vibration recording, earthquake detectors, whatnot) to avois aliasing between LIS302 internal clock and the driver reading each sample18:42
Sazpaimonokay, so it seems the best way I'm going to get gcc 4.4 working is to actually backport it on hardware18:42
DocScrutinizerusually you don't want this mode for mobile devices18:42
VenemoDocScrutinizer, so what mode do I want?18:42
MohammadAGKhertan1, can't reproduce on my PC either18:42
DocScrutinizerevent triggered mode18:42
Sazpaimoni downloaded the QT SDK last night, and it seems like it comes with a NAND image for maemo 5 pr 1.3 that boots in qemu18:42
Sazpaimoni guess I can use that18:42
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, and what is considered an "event" in that mode?18:43
DocScrutinizerVenemo: enable highpass, set IRQ to fire if any of X' Y' Z' is !=0 (it *changed*), then read out the new absolute values nad reset IRQ18:44
VenemoDocScrutinizer, ahh, that makes sense18:44
Sazpaimonanyone know about this nand image that comes with the qt sdk? is it basically the stock PR 1.3 image found in the FIASCO image?18:45
DocScrutinizeras if ever my posts would make sense ;-P18:45
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, however, pieces in puzzle-master should continue drifting even if nothing changes. so at the end, I still end up doing something N times per second.18:45
Sazpaimonuname -a reports "Linux Nokia-N900 2.6.28-omap1 #1 PREEMPT Fri Aug 6 11:50:00 EEST 2010 armv7l unkown"18:45
VenemoSazpaimon, that is no news18:46
SazpaimonVenemo, I'm aware, I'm wondering if this is the same nand image found on the fiasco image18:46
Venemodunno, I have PK18:46
Sazpaimonif so I think this may be better development environment than scratchbox18:47
DocScrutinizerVenemo: it's no problem to poll coords of acceleormeter if you're doing anything anyway. It's *BAD* to poll them just for deciding "nothing changed, should have stayed asleep..."18:47
VenemoDocScrutinizer, but that's the whole point. QtM doesn't poll and see if it's changed or not.18:47
VenemoDocScrutinizer, it polls and sends the results of the poll always.18:47
Venemobut I may be wrong in this.18:47
VenemoDocScrutinizer, anyway according to their docs, it should work the way you described18:48
DocScrutinizersee, if you have a app waiting for an orientation change, then you don't want your app or QtM poll the g-meter constantly18:48
GeneralAntillesFecking bad aim.18:49
DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: eh?18:49
GeneralAntillesCmd-v keeps turning into Opt-v.18:50
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: maemo lis302 kernel driver supports kevents on IRQ from lis302 threshold trigger engines. Reading from /sys/*/coords means the raw data is fetched from chip - this is polling, and this is what QtM does based on a QTimer all the time aiui18:53
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RST38hThe 20-year-old son of Kaspersky Lab's CEO has reportedly gone missing, with kidnappers said to be demanding 3m for his release!18:55
DocScrutinizerVenemo: mce is handling the threshold settings (echo 754 >/sys/*/threshold) and also is listening to kevents afaik, to detect orientation changes. QtM does NOT18:55
* RST38h wonders if he should laugh satanically at this point18:56
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DocScrutinizerVenemo: NB atm the maemo lis302.ko has no way to enable highpass18:58
VenemoDocScrutinizer, so, at the end of the day, we would gain nothing even if we changed QtM.18:59
DocScrutinizerso mce probably is dynamically adapting the thresholds and trigger config at large, to get next kevent when the device is changed to other than recent orientation19:00
Venemoso, does it still have a point to bother with this?19:00
DocScrutinizerno matter what mce does, there MUST not be two concurrent handlers for accelerometer19:00
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Venemoin the meantime, I was looking at the MeeGo implementation19:01
Venemoof QtM19:01
DocScrutinizerwell, QtM can still listen(!) to kevents and only read /sys/*/coords if something is happening19:01
Venemoit seems to be a lot more robust than the maemo one19:02
DocScrutinizerhmm, the lis3lv02.ko of meego definitly is braindead19:02
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Venemomaybe so, but the QtM of meego is not. or seems not to be19:03
DocScrutinizerbut honestly I'm not too much interested in meego (anymore)19:03
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DocScrutinizerQtM accelero of meego *can not* work properly, with this kernel driver meego is using19:04
DocScrutinizerthat's why we see this filesensor polling shit19:04
DocScrutinizerI guess19:04
Venemono filesensor polling shit in meego accelerometer implementation19:04
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DocScrutinizerso they leave polling to app level?19:05
Venemothey use some stuff called "sensord"19:05
DocScrutinizerhah, so this one is doing the polling then19:05
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, I'm not sure what it's doing, but I see no code for polling19:07
Venemoif we could find "accelerometersensor_i.h" and its cpp file, then we could have the answer19:07
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Venemogod, it's still not it19:08
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DocScrutinizerlook at
Venemoyes, you showed it to me already19:09
DocScrutinizer>>The values are updated at 40Hz (at the lowest frequency), but as it can be pretty time consuming on some low processor, ***we poll the sensor only at 20Hz...*** enough for the joystick<<19:10
Venemoyep, that is what the driver is doing19:10
DocScrutinizer20 times / second read out coord data from chip, FOR NUTTIN19:11
DocScrutinizeryou can't cure that on any higher level19:11
Venemoindeed, but I want to find out whether the higher level is any better or not19:12
DocScrutinizerit can't as the driver doesn't support any sane (I.E. IRQdriven kevents) concept19:13
Venemosure, but I'm wondering if it _would_ be any good if the driver _supported_ it.19:14
DocScrutinizerthat's why meego is fsckdup regarding power management. And QtM must be fsckdup as it's basing on that19:14
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DocScrutinizerNB this is only one of several dozen peripherals. No idea why meego should be more sane on any of the other ones19:15
DocScrutinizerwondering about what QtM COULD be like, if only meego wasn't fsckdup is moot19:16
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, actually, I think MeeGo's QtM does the right thing.19:16
DocScrutinizeri CAN NOT19:16
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DocScrutinizeraiui the lis3lv02 driver doesn't support kevents or any other sane event driven concept19:17
VenemoI understand that19:17
Venemohowever, its QtM reads stuff from some socket as far as I see - which is exactly what we want to implement in Maemo's QtM19:17
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DocScrutinizerwell, nice if it tries to use kevents on a NETLINK socket19:18
DocScrutinizerand it would actually work if only kernel was sane19:18
DocScrutinizermaybe, if they also would care about setiing up lis302 chip trigger engines correctly19:19
DocScrutinizerprolly duty of sensord19:19
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DocScrutinizeranyway all that is meego BS and I gave up on explaining them about it long ago19:20
VenemoI still am not 100% sure what sensord does exactly19:20
DocScrutinizerso o/19:20
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, is there a channel for shr?19:29
VenemoDocScrutinizer, I'm curious what DE does shr use19:29
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Venemoin what manner is shr related to om?19:29
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DocScrutinizerSHR is a distro founded on a 'merger' between OM2008 distro and dunno QtMoko?19:35
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VenemoDocScrutinizer, aaah, so SHR is a continuation of OM19:37
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DocScrutinizerFSO has SHR as reference "platform"19:40
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DocScrutinizerthough FSO is a platform/distro independent middleware19:41
Venemowhy don't they co-operate with the meego project?19:41
DocScrutinizermeego wasn't interested19:43
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DocScrutinizerI asked about using FSO which for sure is the superior alternative to QtM, but the answer was "wait til system is working, then you can supply patches" (SIC!)19:44
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Venemovery nice19:45
DocScrutinizerofono attributed FSO as "simple stupid AT interface to modem", so meego is using ofono instead FSO19:45
DocScrutinizerNIH syndrome, all over the place19:46
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Venemoah. yeah DocScrutinizer - MeeGo stinks from NIH20:09
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Sazpaimonwell i installed the power kernel in the N900 qemu image and that makes it not go into a gui20:13
Sazpaimonyay things20:14
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Sazpaimoni can still access the console though20:15
Sazpaimonso whatever20:15
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citylightscan anyone pls help me with dbus and python?20:37
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citylightsI mean why does mdbus2 is empty?20:40
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citylightshow should I print
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pupnik_battery idle drain is 35-46 mA20:57
pupnik_10 times too high20:57
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pupnik_hildon-desktop maenotify20:58
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pupnik_ok maenotify gone21:00
pupnik_hildon desktop is where my trojan is eh21:00
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MohammadAGcitylights, what do you want to do?21:06
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Sazpaimonanyone know how to write a proper NAND image using the mtdblocks of my device21:22
Sazpaimondo i just combine all 6 together?21:22
DocScrutinizercitylights: you're aware of 'mdbus2 -i' mode, and tab expansion21:25
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pupnik_  merit badges for nerds +++21:32
derfThis has already happened to me once this week.21:34
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pupnik_it's funny ad copy21:40
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pupnik_   (Bert from Sesame Street)21:53
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uhsfis it possible to download maps to the n900 and use them without Internet access?21:56
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uhsfI tried placing map files in ~/.nokia-maps but it doesn't work22:03
uhsfI tried a maps package I found with 0-9,a-f directories22:06
uhsfdoes it need to be placed in another directory?22:06
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pupnik_uhsf: don't place large files in your home directory22:08
uhsfit's only 13% full22:10
uhsfdo you know a page with instructions for maps on n900?22:11
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pupnik_uhsf: only what google tells me22:28
uhsfi don't know what nokia was thinking when they made the maps application, it's so incredibly crappy, the gps doesn't even work where i live22:30
chxmove to a place where the sky is visible.22:33
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compengihello, i type alot on virtual keyboard and i encountered a few problems with it when i try to edit some text in it. after i leave the virtual keyboard mode, the text sometimes seems to be messy22:35
ruskie <-- you're joking right???22:36
compengii experience something similar to this
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nox-ruskie, software patents ftl22:47
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pupnik_nox-: did you log into daimonin yesterday??22:50
nox-what?  i dont even know what that is... :)22:50
pupnik_ok someone named Nox did22:50
nox-ah ok, some game i presume?22:50
nox-yeah was not me22:50
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