IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2010-12-20

comawhitewtf people run apache on the n900? :P00:02
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bernieSpeedEvil: yeah, it's pulseaudio. if I run it manually from the terminal I get audio back00:04
nox-heh there were times when ppl ran apaches on 486s...00:04
bernieSpeedEvil: but not in the mediaplayer. that's still wacked.00:04
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MohammadAGlet me guess, you have decoders-support installed?00:05
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Gh0stylol I got something funky00:08
Gh0styI reflashed my device today, restored everything from a backup00:08
Gh0stythe alarmed entries were not there I tought (when you open the app it's empty)00:08
SpeedEvilbernie: odd indeed00:09
Gh0stybut now I noticed that the entries should be somewhere because my phone just went into silent mode ... which fits with the previous profiles set :)00:09
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bernieSpeedEvil: there doesn't seem to be a log where I would find errors from the pulseaudio spawned by the system.00:14
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SpeedEvilI'm not bothering.00:15
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SpeedEvilI've just downloaded the pr1.4 global firmware, and am rsyncing the data off the phone00:16
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bernieSpeedEvil: where did you download that from?00:16
SpeedEvilOh no! I'm not supposed to say that!00:16
infobotrumour has it, sarcasm is a troll rolling on the stone00:16
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SpeedEvil(as it was a typo)00:16
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PhonicUKhey all, anyone know what the performance of psx4m is like?00:17
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ShadowJKthere's a pr1.4?00:17
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Pradeepis it possible to update firmware via usb LAN00:18
PhonicUKIf you have a Windows PC to hand, you can just update over USB00:19
berniePradeep: would updating from usb retain the settings and user data? I guess so...00:20
Pradeepcos i tried it00:20
bernieI updated with apt, and now I'm seeing some weird bugs with pulseaudio and gstreamer. maybe related, maybe not00:21
Pradeepit would always ask for preffered connection and it does show LAN00:21
Pradeeponly support wlan00:21
ShadowJKflashing via usb wipes settings and installed apps00:21
Pradeepapt does not update firmware00:21
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DocScrutinizerGh0sty: alarmed maybe doesn't backup his events, but obviously alarmd does00:42
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DocScrutinizerbernie: if you happen to have done a apt-get (dist-)upgrade; then you're lucky if your system still boots00:45
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tremnite all, sweet dreams00:49
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pupnik  Aubrey de Grey: Why we age and how we can avoid it01:26
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quanttromhello all, I have a question regarding the installation of QtRapids and it's dependencies01:34
quanttromanyways willing to help ? :D01:34
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comawhitequanttrom, why you need a bit torrent on a phone? :P01:38
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quanttromcomawhite: honest answer: for kicks. There really isn't a good reason01:39
quanttromit's kinda like "oh see what my phone can do"01:39
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quanttromand the typical answer : why not!?01:40
comawhiteah yes01:40
Venemoquanttrom: how is this related to a phone?01:40
comawhiteI want my app to work on the phone :(01:40
Venemooh, okay01:41
Venemowhat's the problem?01:41
quanttromin short01:41
comawhiteVenemo, me?01:41
quanttromoh yeah, who are u asking?01:41
MohammadAGis gitorious slow? :/01:41
MohammadAGReceiving objects:  16% (2710/16161), 1.04 MiB   1 KiB/s01:41
Venemocomawhite: so what's the problem?01:41
VenemoMohammadAG: it's been giving me 503s all day01:41
VenemoMohammadAG: at random occasions01:42
comawhiteVenemo, nothing expect it needs code to be written01:42
MohammadAGfatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly MiB   1 KiB/s01:42
MohammadAGfatal: early EOF01:42
Venemocomawhite: you said it was a dependency problem01:42
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Venemocomawhite: if it requires writing code, then write code01:44
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comawhiteVenemo, I am :) it's just taking a long time since I have to write the code for my desktop first then port it to the phone01:46
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comawhiteonly bad thing about having my desktop application in KDE, having to make two versions of it01:47
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Venemocomawhite: :)01:47
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Pradeepit would always ask me for my preffered connection and LAN was inclusive01:56
Pradeepeven when i did apt-get ugrade it did not update it01:56
Pradeepi connect my n900 via usb to my computer on a LAN01:56
Pradeepapt does not update firmware01:56
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yigalDoes anyone know if the "swirl to zoom" functionality of the N900 in Maemo could be ported to Ubuntu - not sure if "swirl to zoom" is the correct language but it's the ability to fluidly increase the zoom of the default browser by rotating (counter)clockwise etc.02:30
yigalThe above "?" was just a gramatical mark, not a remark about not being replied to in less than 10s.02:31
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yigalok 7 minutes I'll repeat, there's been a few new heads02:40
yigalDoes anyone know if the "swirl to zoom" functionality of the N900 in Maemo could be ported to Ubuntu - not sure if "swirl to zoom" is the correct language but it's the ability to fluidly increase the zoom of the default browser by rotating (counter)clockwise etc.?02:40
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ds3Bah, no one seems to make a tablet with stuff I want in it :(02:50
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yigalds3: what do you want in it, a pretty girl?02:58
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ds3yigal: no, I think what I want in it is pretty tame - 800x480; cap touch; wifi + bluetooth; non Android Linux; SD slot, USB OTG03:00
ds3as far as I can tell, most either fail at the bluetooth and/or are android03:00
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SpeedEvilSD - you ,ean fullsize?03:05
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ds3preferred but not a requirement03:07
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vampiræèâûå åñòü03:23
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yigalds3: so you want < 7"?03:27
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femtosecondhi guys03:29
yigaltoo fast for me man03:30
femtosecondis it possible to update to 20.2010.36-2 without reflashing?03:30
ds3yigal: No, 7" is preferable03:31
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yigalds3: do you know how the port of Ubuntu on the galexy tab is going?03:33
yigaltoo expensive?03:33
ds3yigal: I am trying to stick with what is preloaded so I don't spend eternity and more tweaking it to support all the stuff, esp. power management03:34
ds3there are some choices if I relinquish the non Android requirement03:34
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yigalI hate android03:36
yigaljust mo though03:36
ds3It is hard to tolerate after years of Maemo usage where things worked.03:37
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ds3i am trying to find a tablet to use; not to tinker with and it seems like no one makes one03:38
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yigalya they are all much larger03:38
yigalyou could get an iPad lol03:39
ds3I am willing to up all the way up to 10" if that helps03:39
ds3no, it must run Linux =)03:39
SpeedEvilTablets on android basically are not quite tehre yet.03:39
SpeedEvilTablets on other linuxes even less so typically03:39
SpeedEvilunless you're willing to run ubuntu or something.03:40
ds3SpeedEvil: I consider the N800/N900 there and ready. just need to add a few more details03:40
SpeedEvilIntel claim that tehre will be a few doxen atom tablets launching next year03:40
SpeedEvilBut tehre are no similar integrated tablet OSs that are linux based and not iOS or android03:41
ds3Intel isn't an option03:41
yigalI'm running Ubuntu on an Asus t91mt it's 8.9" weighs 2.1lbs it has multitouch zoom, pan, and what not but it's multitouch resistive it also has a keyboard which I like but others would most likely find that extra bulk in the way.03:41
SpeedEvilLEave it a year, and this may change03:41
ds3it isn't multitouch that I care for03:41
ds3I am willing to tolerate resistive if it is tweaked sufficiently like the N90003:42
yigalthe multitouch features are just coming into Ubuntu/rest of the open source community03:42
yigalzooming is the issue for me03:42
ds3a rocker would suffice for zooming, IMO03:43
yigalunlike the n900 with the twirl to zoom03:43
yigalds3: true03:43
yigalworked well enough in n8x003:43
ds3I can completely give up the volume keys and trade it for zooming (i.e. like the browser defaults)03:43
yigalspeak brother03:43
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ds3It really sucks to have to buy a peice of crap Android tablet and spend a few months to rework it (note that I have not nailed down a price point!)03:44
* SpeedEvil wonders about modding the n900 with a larger screen.03:44
yigalSpeedEvil: man I wish it had come out as a 7" device03:45
ds3the irritating thing with that is, there aren't any cheap ones that will meet what I want (most lack bluetooth)03:45
SpeedEvilA 8" or so screen, with the existing keyboard off the side.03:45
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ds3SpeedEvil: I can build one up with a 7" display but there are things you build and things you want to use now.03:46
yigalArchos 7003:46
SpeedEvilds3: I agree03:46
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ds3Archos 70 seems to be a europe only release?03:46
quanttrom PROMPT_COMMAND='pwd>&7;kill -STOP $$'03:46
yigalthough I'm just looking at umpcportal03:46
ds3last I checked (about month ago), no US seller is listing it03:47
yigalsorry a lot of venders there03:47
yigalNewegg etc.03:47
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SpeedEvilAnd at least archos seems to provice GPL of some form, though I haven't checked03:48
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ds3hmmm that wasn't there the last I looked03:48
yigalhopefully it's of use03:49
yigalthough I can't stomache purchasing an Android tablet unless maybe the Adam03:49
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ds3$270 + a man month of labor... that's $$$$03:50
yigaltime is $, $ is time03:50
yigaltrue that03:50
ds3and the Archos is still an inferior screen compared to the N900/N81003:51
yigalwell if you like the idea of a t91mt I show you how to easily get Ubuntu with touch on it, but I think you're looking for a slightly different device.03:52
ds3t91mt? /me looks03:53
yigalthe nice thing about the Archos 7 is it's really quite light03:53
yigalit's a netbook/tablet convertable03:53
yigalI use it for everything though03:54
ds3oh 5hour battery life? HAHAHAHAHAHA03:54
ds3that is funny03:54
yigalya, I have an external battery pack03:54
ds3I found a picture of it; looks like an overgrown clam shell Zaurus :D03:54
yigalyep, but the keyboard is large enough to actually use all 10 fingers03:54
yigalso to me that's a huge change03:55
ds3I see... but isn't that also true of the Toshiba AC100?03:55
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yigalis it a convertable?03:58
ds3think so03:58
ds3ARM based, not x8603:58
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yigalright, can't really say I think it's just a netbook04:00
ds3depends on how important is battery life04:00
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ds3also with an ARM based system, you have a slight chance of running existing maemo binaries04:02
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yigaltrue, no doubt but with an atom processor you have a good chance running all of Debian/Ubuntu binaries, it depends on what you want04:03
SpeedEvilDunno how the battery life of the new atom tablets will be.04:06
ds3yes, but most stock x86 binaries aren't designed for touch04:06
ds3the UI on those things really want you to have a mouse04:06
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femtosecondwhich is the best way to update to Maemo 5 PR1.3?04:11
SpeedEvilOver the air is simplest if you can04:11
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yigalds3: sure, but I find using a stylus it doesn't make too much difference, and I use a stylus04:13
ds3yigal: fair enough... what about charger, does that thing charge off USB?04:14
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yigalNope it's a netbook with a touchscreen that pivots into a tablet, I can't imagine too many people, other than myself will enjoy the idea :), but for me it's perfect04:15
femtosecondSpeedEvil: so no need to reflash?04:16
SpeedEvilIn principle no. But some peoples setups can'do that for various reasons04:17
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yigalwell other than the fact that of course I would like 24h of battery life and I get 4.04:18
ds3I am resisting that idea as I toyed with the early transmeta tablets04:18
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yigalhow many hours did they get, 1?04:19
yigalsorry that's an HP tablet of roughly the same specs04:20
ds3about an hour is right04:20
yigallol, ya the tc1100 came later but with roughly the same specs04:21
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ds3the 1100 is a celeron, IIRC..the 1000 is the transmeta I think04:22
yigalyes tc1100 is celeron, the way I look at it they weigh 3/2 as much as my laptop and have 1/3 1/4 the battery life as it04:22
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ds3heh, true... I much rather have an ARM instead04:23
yigalyou're looking for ~8 hours of battery life?04:23
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infoboti guess 12 is 104:23
infobotIt's TO, not '2'. This is not l33t3 sp34k nor is this AOL.04:23
ds324hour is the target; I'll tolerate N900 range battery life04:24
ds3that's why I would prefer USB charging; then I get one of those USB batteries to supplement04:25
* SpeedEvil sighs.04:25
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yigalya, I've grown used to a bit more power but you're right it's really all that's needed to get things done04:26
SpeedEvilI have a laptop that with a replacement battery gets 15 hours, and weighs 1.1Kg04:26
SpeedEvilUnfortunately, it's a PII/30004:26
yigaloh, lol04:26
SpeedEvilAnd has USB1.1 and no wifi04:26
SpeedEvil(I replaced the battery, and got 10h - but battery capacity has improved)04:26
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ds3PII/300 is sufficient04:31
ds3the ~2.5lbs is a bit annoying though04:31
xennoDoes the BTS send the cell-id to the mobile unit you're calling to? or is that information just stored in VLR? sorry for stupid question :(04:33
yigallaters, good food for thought04:34
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SpeedEvilds3: yes - it's just comparing the spec is fucking insane as you pretty much can't buy a comparable device.04:35
ds3SpeedEvil: *nod*04:35
SpeedEvilFor example, nice 10" netbook, with a trackpoint, and 12h battery life, and 1.1Kg - where?04:36
* ptl ducks04:36
ds3the AC100 comes close04:37
SpeedEvilipad lacks keyboard04:37
ds3it looks like the AC100 is not convertable04:38
SpeedEvilI'm not up to that.04:40
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ds3more of -
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SpeedEvilyeah - saw that04:46
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b-man|RX51xnt14: lies xD04:53
xnt14b-man|RX51: I'm kidding. :P04:54
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jukhey guys how to remove photo tag i made, for some pics i removed, but tag is still there04:56
juki thought i'll be able to remove as easly while tagging those pics05:00
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SpeedEviljuk: any picture tool that can do stuff with EXIF tags05:11
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jukSpeedEvil: nevermind
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disco_stui'm trying to monitor a room's temperature remotely with my n800, someone has some knowledge about precision of the measures ?05:59
tank-mann800 has the hardware to measure room temp?06:01
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tank-mani didn't know that06:01
disco_stutank-man, well.. it's not intended for that.. but i can be used if the tablet is not producing heat06:01
disco_stui'll be monitoring my datacenter's temp and ac power supply using my n80006:02
disco_stumaybe pinging some servers too :)06:02
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jacekowskidisco_stu: it's producing a lot of heat06:06
jacekowskidisco_stu: that sensor is in middle between battery cpu and everything06:06
jacekowskidisco_stu: and you will get 10C or more than real temperature06:07
disco_stujacekowski, i'll run tests  tomorrow and compare with my installed sensors06:07
disco_stunow its reading 33°C which i think is very accurate06:08
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* timeless_mbp frowns06:18
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jacekowskidisco_stu: it's more like -9 here06:26
jacekowskiand snow06:26
jacekowskimy thermocouple is all frozen06:26
disco_stujacekowski, lol.. where r u ?06:27
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rednoseHello, I just got my hands on a 2nd hand n900 and I want to flash it back to factory settings. Reading the Wiki it tells me I need to flash the eMMC and rootfs but one page(1) tells me to "always flash the eMMC/VANILLA image first, and then flash the FIASCO/Rootfs image" and the other one(2) tells me to flash FIASCO image first then the eMMC image. which one is right?07:10
rednose(1) (2)
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luke-jr_rednose: I'm not sure it really matters07:19
luke-jr_just don't boot in between07:19
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rednoseluke-jr_ Can you brick the n900 by getting the flashing wrong?07:24
luke-jr_rednose: if you try07:24
rednoseluke-jr_: bricked to the point of not being unbrickable?07:24
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luke-jr_you should be ok as long as you don't use -x, -s, -207:25
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rednoseDo I want the PR 1.3 version 20.2010.36-2 Global release for Nokia N900  for use in the UK?07:57
Necc.36-2 ?07:58
Neccwhat's the difference?07:59
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rednoseNecc: the was UK variant for PR 1.2 not anymore? And I do not know08:00
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rednoseWhy does Nokia hide the download behind a IMEI number login ? I sure that breaks the GPL08:02
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SpeedEvilrednose: It doesn't08:16
SpeedEvilrednose: That is the binary only08:16
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rednoseSpeedEvil: so the source (GPL source that is) is not locked down like that then?08:18
SpeedEvilthe binary contains non GPL components08:19
SpeedEvilthe source is available08:19
SpeedEvilOf the GPL components08:20
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ds3it is prefectly legit to put it behind a IMEI number login08:20
ds3GPL doesn't require more08:20
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SpeedEvilGPL requires absolutely nothng about the distribution of binaries if you make source available08:25
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DocScrutinizerrednose: (1) also tellsa you why to do it that way, and that it had different instructions in the past that were not appropriate08:27
ds3GPL only requires you to make source available to folks you have given binaries to. nothing more.08:29
ds3if you have the device, you have the binaries and thus you have the sources. so nothing wrong with an IMEI login08:29
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rednoseDocScrutinizer: tells me to do it the other way around.....08:30
DocScrutinizerwhile gives some rationale why you must flash rootfs as well when flashing eMMC, but has no word at all why eMMC must be flashed last08:30
DocScrutinizerrednose: nope, reread it08:30
DocScrutinizeractually IIRC has no special advice about the sequence08:31
slonopotamusanyone has example usage of HildonFileSelection?08:32
DocScrutinizerwhile both AND explain why it's bad to flash eMMC and then not flash rootfs (reread and look for "opt" keyword)08:34
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DocScrutinizerrednose: what of >>Rationale: on accidental booting in between the 2 flash processes, the sequence formerly suggested (rootfs first) will result in a broken system. The sequence "eMMC first, then rootfs" is checked back with Nokia affiliates and is proven to work<< made you worry?08:36
rednosefrom "Latest Vanilla version of the eMMC content for Nokia N90008:37
rednoseNOTE: Always flash the FIASCO image first, then the eMMC image immediately after that. Never boot up the device between flashing the FIASCO image and the eMMC image! When flashing eMMC always also flash FIASCO rootfs - NEVER boot the device between the two flashes."08:37
DocScrutinizerdamn, so they rolled back the notice there08:38
rednoseso FIASCO then eMMC then FIASCO ? eh?!08:38
DocScrutinizerthis page is *wrong*08:38
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DocScrutinizerX-Fade: please can you check and finally edit this advice for good, please08:39
rednoseDocScrutinizer: So do I take it that Nokia website is right?08:41
DocScrutinizerrednose: actually that sequene will always work, and is what a *lot* of people end up doing, as it's really hard to avoid booting after flashing rootfs / prior to e,,c flash08:41
DocScrutinizerrednose: I start to feel you're trolling, and I'm not interested in this08:42
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rednoseDocScrutinizer: I am a noob I just got my n900 3 days ago 2nd hand and I do not want to brick it08:43
DocScrutinizeryou CAN NOT brick it, whatever you do (except water, sledgehammers, and lightning stoke)08:43
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DocScrutinizerodds are you'll "brick" it when following the Nokia page advice, and will have to flash rootfs AFTER your eMMC flash08:44
rednoseDocScrutinizer: Thats very nice to hear!08:45
DocScrutinizer has been tested by hundereds of people, and it simply works08:45
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DocScrutinizerwhile Nokia's advice *might* be needed anytime in the future, if for example Nokia decides to change size of swap or sth like that. With recent eMMC img it's simply useless to "always flash rootfs first"08:48
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rednoseso RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin first then RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin just so i'm 100% right?08:50
NokiaGuruyou however should switch on the N900 while pointing it direction east *only*08:50
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rednosevery funny. I can see your name switch08:50
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DocScrutinizernow I'll watch how long it takes till 7 webpages quote that and everybody is concerned why there's no compass shipped with N900 :-P08:51
DocScrutinizerrednose: (so RX...) right08:51
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rednoseOk. Time to pray to god of flashing!08:52
rednoseif the is one....08:52
DocScrutinizeryou'll love it as once you got hte catch how to do it, it's an amazingly easy and convenient and fast procedure08:53
DocScrutinizerstart flasher cmd, wait for "no device found, waiting...", THEN plug in the powered down N900 while holding 'u'08:54
DocScrutinizerseems this procedure always works08:54
DocScrutinizerexcept if you have some problems with your PC, or your battery is empty. It is *REALLY* important to fully charge battery08:55
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tealbirdI trashed my partition table on the internal mmc but it hasn't unmounted the partitions so I'm doing a backup to an external card and then will try to restore the default partition table via sfdisk using an alternative to maemo, wish me luck09:00
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ds3tealbird: wonder if you can use /proc/partitions to read back the values and write them out?09:06
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tealbirdds3: the default partition table is posted on the wiki so I was going to use that09:09
DocScrutinizertealbird: crossing my fingers09:10
tealbirdthank you :)09:10
DocScrutinizeryou need any sfdisk printout or sth?09:11
DocScrutinizeralso a swapoff is probably a good idea09:12
tealbirdsfdisk printout wouldn't hurt though it's on the wiki09:12
tealbirdAt least, I hope thats accurate09:13
DocScrutinizertoss me the exact cmdline (no sfdisk expert here)09:13
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tealbirdsfdisk -l /dev/mmcblk0 should do it09:13
tealbirdwait a second, there's a better version09:14
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rednoseDocScrutinizer: Thanks I'm now running version 20.2010.36-2. that is the newest version?09:15
tealbirdthank you09:15
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DocScrutinizeryw :-)09:15
Pradeepapt does not update firmware09:16
Pradeepi connect my n900 via usb to my computer on a LAN09:16
Pradeepeven when i did apt-get ugrade it did not update it09:16
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rednoseDocScrutinizer: is "My Nokia subscription" opt in with PR 1.3?09:17
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DocScrutinizerPradeep: wasn't that you whom I told yesterday "do NOT do apt-get upgrade"?09:18
DocScrutinizerrednose: nope09:18
DocScrutinizerstill a cherry PITA09:19
ds3has there ever been an opt-in "My Nokia"?09:19
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DocScrutinizerthere's just been pkg notmynokia09:19
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ds3or the hack where you de-sim it, boot it, hack it up, flush sms, re-sim09:20
rednoseDocScrutinizer: Ok time to friendy with Xterminal I love Linux09:20
rednoseI run Gentoo on my main rig09:20
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Pradeepso i must use wireless to update09:21
tealbird DocScrutinizer: that does appear to match the wiki page09:23
PradeepDocScrutinizer then hw do i do it if i dont have a wireless09:23
DocScrutinizeryeah, this is from a rather unmangled device09:23
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DocScrutinizerPradeep: the use USB networking09:24
DocScrutinizerthe wiki has a howto09:25
bernieany idea what could be breaking gstreamer on fremantle 1.3?09:26
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Pradeepso how do i do it cos search the internet all tru yesterday on this09:28
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rednoseI have a entry in /var/spool/sms/regs_out.txt but nothing in /var/spool/sms/outgoing/ this phone has never seen a sim card09:34
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DocScrutinizerbernie: powerkernel?09:48
DocScrutinizerrednose: install notmynokia. AIUI it takes care about cleaning up09:49
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joppuStiil some more shameless self-advertizing, but if anyone would be willing to test this theme I would greatly appriciate it09:51
joppusince it's one vote from extras09:51
Pradeepplease someone should ans me09:51
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bernieDocScrutinizer: no, I have 2.6.28-omap109:53
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bernieDocScrutinizer: I have libgstreamer0.10-0_0.10.25-0maemo4+0m509:54
infobotextra, extra, read all about it, usb-networking is
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DocScrutinizerbernie: no idea09:55
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Pradeepok i would read that then10:02
Pradeepif not would look for windows system and install ovi suite then update my fone from there10:03
Pradeepcos i dont have any wireless network around me10:03
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bernieon my n900, this command line fails for mp3:10:07
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bernie gst-launch -v playbin uri='file:///home/user/MyDocs/Music/foobar.mp3'10:08
bernieworks for ogg vorbis10:08
RobbieThe1stMake sure you have the LAME mp3 plugin installed?10:08
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bernieRobbieThe1st: what's the deb name?10:10
RobbieThe1stI dunno10:10
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RobbieThe1sttry "-v playbin2" in the above command10:13
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bernieRobbieThe1st: here's the list of gstreamer packages I have:
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bernieRobbieThe1st: notice anything odd?10:14
RobbieThe1stJust try "-v playbin2" in the above command10:14
bernieRobbieThe1st: that worked!10:14
RobbieThe1stThat's what google turned up10:14
bernieRobbieThe1st:  now I need to figure out why it's not working in the media player application and when the phone rings.10:15
berniewhen the phone *should* ring10:15
RobbieThe1stI think the phone application takes control of the audio, IIRC10:15
RobbieThe1stDocScrutinizer would probably know more10:16
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DocScrutinizerthe phone app will not exactly take control of audio. Audio is controlled by alsaped AIUI10:19
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DocScrutinizerif somebody messed up one of the related files (e.g. that mediaplayer control via wired headset button might do that) then you might get into weird trouble with audio10:20
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DocScrutinizergenerally speaking you'll get proper audio only if the right policy is "enforced" by PA/ALSA Policy Enforcer Entity/Daemon/whatever10:23
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DocScrutinizerI guess the related file is /etc/pulse/xpolicy.conf, maybe others as well10:24
ds3for the firmware supplied on the N900, is master mode (for WiFi) supported?10:25
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fluxafaik not. otherwise I would imagine joikuspot etc would use it..10:25
DocScrutinizerprobably not. Othrwise you wouldn't need custom kernel for things like maemohotspot10:26
fluxdocscrutinizer, I think that's just because the standard kernel doesn't have nat etc10:26
ds3is maemo hotspot suppose to support master mode?10:26
meceds3, I think there is something in devel that makes it possible iirc.10:26
DocScrutinizerflux: good point10:26
meceds3, yeah I think it's that one. Don't know if it works though.10:26
meceds3, check tmo10:26
ds3I though it did but my experiments with that software suggests otherwise10:27
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DocScrutinizerI seem to have heard once that either hotspot or yoghurtsport is emulating an AP by exploiting Ad-Hoc modus10:29
DocScrutinizeralways was a bit obscure to me. Anyway I'll shut up as I never used any such package10:29
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alteregoDo we have iptables enough to setup nat forwarding on the N90010:30
ds3guess it is easier to hackup a cheap AP to run on batteries10:30
ds3I don't think the default kernel has any NAT10:30
DocScrutinizerit hasn't10:30
ds3heh, so my hacked up slirp isn't a complete waste10:31
fluxit's not a big deal to switch the kernel, though10:31
alteregoCan be compiled as a module at least I believe10:31
alteregoflux: speak for yourself :P10:31
fluxalterego, one can do it from the package manager..10:31
alteregoUntil I get a second N900 my current one has to have a uboot kernel.10:32
ds3not sure what NAT would be good for w/o a working master mode though10:32
ds3for BT, slirp seems to do a great job10:33
alteregoErm, routing through an adhoc connection?10:33
fluxwell, you could still use it with usb networking I suppose10:33
bernieRobbieThe1st: thanks for your help. eventually, I got everything to work by doing "start pulseaudio" from the terminal as root.10:33
RobbieThe1stAh, good.10:33
ds3alterego: there are many drawbacks to that10:33
alteregoUSB you can just use it as a modem10:33
bernieRobbieThe1st: now I need to determine why it's no longer starting at boot10:33
alteregods3: besides single client only, I can't see any.10:34
RobbieThe1stI'd guess that the starting point there would be to enable logging10:34
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ds3alterego: power, lack of support on some devices...10:34
Termanagood moring10:34
ds3no power save mode with ad hoc10:34
alteregoHey Termana10:34
alteregoOh, rigt10:35
Pradeepalterego, hi i did what you me and it worked just fine but the issue was that i could update my firmware using it10:35
alteregoFair points10:35
alteregoPradeep: oh dear :(10:35
ds3wish more things had bluetooth then it would be simple10:35
alteregoYeah appman woudln't work through usb silly me10:35
Pradeepyes it i did not but i could surf the internet10:36
alteregoI'd flash it, then use the setup I told you about to download packages.10:36
Pradeepso any clues10:37
alteregootoh, it might be possible to trick the device into using your connection via usb instead of 3g10:37
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alteregoMaybe by removing the ppp item from routes10:38
alteregoWell, gprs0 apparently10:39
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alteregoPradeep: Make sure the N900 is connected via cellular data, then connect with usb networking10:39
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Pradeepu mean gprs10:40
Pradeepcos did that but still did not work10:40
crashanddiePradeep, you probably mean to talk with real words10:41
alteregoThen as root, on the N900 run: route del -net gw gprs010:41
alteregoThen run: route -n and make sure your LAN settings are still present.10:41
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alteregoAnd appman should work10:42
Pradeepwould that affect my gprs setting when am not using my usb network10:42
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alteregoPradeep: nope10:42
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alteregoJust disconnect and reconnect when you're done and it should work fine10:43
Pradeepso when am on gprs i will have to re-route it again10:43
alteregoYeah, keeping the cell data connection active is to trick the N900s network manager into continuing to believe its' got a normal connection to the internet. So any apps (like app man) that use bearer services apis will hopefully continue to work.10:44
Pradeepthis sounds lame how do you refer to someone on xchat using the phone cos on PC i press tab button twice10:44
alteregoI use irssi10:45
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alteregoI should probably get out of bed and shower.10:45
alteregoIt's quarter to 9 ..10:45
Pradeepsame here10:46
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Pradeepwould try it and get back to you10:46
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DocScrutinizer[2010-12-20 08:55:23] <DocScrutinizer> Pradeep:10:53
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-20 08:55:29] <DocScrutinizer> ~usb-networking10:53
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-20 08:57:31] <DocScrutinizer> even
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TermanaIs the search box broken on tmo?10:56
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DocScrutinizerI toldya do not touch tmo10:57
* DocScrutinizer hits Termana with a pillow10:57
TermanaI'm just wondering - what reasonable explanation is there for SO MANY duplicate threads besides the search box being broken? :p10:58
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sivangmorning everybody11:24
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tealbirdHeh ... the n900 happily sees all of /dev/mmcblk0p1-3 after having rewritten the partition table using, and windows happily reads /dev/mmcblk0p1 as fat32, but ubuntu sees only an unpartitioned disk11:30
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DocScrutinizertealbird: oops11:30
DocScrutinizertealbird: check for that's not the uSD you see in ubuntu11:31
tealbirdI took out the uSD11:31
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tealbirdAs I said, windows sees the MyDocs partition just fine, so I'm guessing there's something "unexpected" but I dunno how to fix that exactly. I don't know very much about how the usb mass storage gadget driver does whatever it does.11:33
DocScrutinizercheck syslog, for usb-host msgs and udev et al. There should be sdX1, sdX2...11:33
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chem|stkhertan: morning!11:33
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DocScrutinizertealbird: for reference (syslog of PC)
DocScrutinizertealbird: maybe your primary FAT got destroyed, and ubuntu doesn't know how to use the secondary11:43
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DocScrutinizeryou might want to run a fsck.vfat on it11:44
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tealbirdI did that several times outside of maemo, but sure I could try it again11:46
tealbirdIt doesn't see any partition at all11:46
tealbirdMaybe later I'll try restoring the partition table again, but I don't want to do it until I have proper backups11:47
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tealbirdThe irony being I was prepping to set up nightly backups when this happened11:48
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JaffaMorning, all11:50
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crashanddiemorning ja12:19
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DocScrutinizerhi Jaffa12:25
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* pupnik sighs12:26
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crashanddieMohammadAG, how's the media player going?12:36
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MohammadAGI'm not sure which part I told you about last, but nicolai got the renderer working12:36
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MohammadAGit can play/stop songs, and skip/go back, it also updates metadata (but not albumart)12:37
MohammadAGmafw renderer12:37
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crashanddienative interface? Dbus? GObject?12:37
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MohammadAGQt wrapper he made12:38
crashanddiewhich calls?12:38
MohammadAGGObject code12:38
MohammadAGwhat's your email?12:38
crashanddieyou have it in your gmail12:39
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MohammadAGLOL @ your IRC realname12:39
crashanddieheh :)12:40
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DocScrutinizerI'm temped... mailto:firstname.lastname@gmail.com12:42
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crashanddiecrap firstname.lastname is not available, but the following usernames are12:43
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DangerMausseemed longer12:48
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* MohammadAG stabs gmail on the N90012:49
timeless_mbpMohammadAG: which gmail?12:50
timeless_mbp /x, /h, ?ui=2 ?12:50
timeless_mbpmfe? imap? pop?12:50
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timeless_mbpok, /x, /h, or ?ui=2 ?12:56
timeless_mbp ?12:56
timeless_mbp ?12:56
timeless_mbp ?12:57
MohammadAGoh nice, it got sent without a confirmation12:57
* MohammadAG clicks links12:57
MohammadAGx and ui=2 load the same page for me12:58
MohammadAG/h is fine12:59
MohammadAG/x is mobile, pass13:00
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timeless_mbpthere used to be a  ui=1, but google killed it :(13:03
MohammadAGcrashanddie, check your email13:07
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ptlthere are many people from europe here, right? sorry if that sounds offtopic, but is there a specific channel for switzerland and its whereabouts?13:13
lcukptl? I am sure therers many specific switzerland channels on irc, but what need is there specifically for maemo?13:14
* timeless_mbp suspects most of the awake people here atm are in europe...13:14
timeless_mbpswitzerland of course is composed of 4 language groups13:15
timeless_mbpwhich makes asking about it vaguely amusing13:15
ptllcuk: no need, I was just trying to see if there's one on freenode :)13:15
timeless_mbp(that doesn't count English...)13:15
lcukptl, so you meant a general swizz people channel, not just about maemo?13:15
ptlyes. Ok, offtopic13:15
lcukptl ahhh heh13:16
timeless_mbp perhaps13:16
lcukfreenode irc is mostly for open source projects13:16
ptlI know.13:16
ptlThere are a few channels like #australia though. I just wondered if there was one for switzerland.13:17
* lcuk giggles13:18
lcuktheres a #swissknife-router channel13:18
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lcukand #swisslinux chan13:18
lcukuse the channel search from your irc client13:18
ptlI did... found nothing of interest, and found swisslinux. But thanks :)13:20
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chem|sttimeless_mbp: 4 languages?13:37
timeless_mbpyea, french, german, italian, and one other13:37
timeless_mbpit's part of the trivia you pick up when you travel there13:37
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chem|sttimeless_mbp: the one other I'm curious13:38
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chem|stbut that does not really count..13:39
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DocScrutinizerI'd say it's as much german as netherlands is13:56
sig^dutch is actually very intelligible if you know German13:57
DocScrutinizerwell, this only proves a 50 years aren't enough to learn German then14:03
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* RST38h yawns14:15
chem|stmoaning RST38h14:16
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RST38hmoaning indeed14:18
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DocScrutinizerWAAAH, simple brightness applet doesn't anything on actual brightness control of screen, just a frontend to hildon/osso/whatever brighness management :-S I hoped I could patch it to better deal with ALS etc, but no...14:19
DocScrutinizeror am I wrong?14:19
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RST38hit is a frontend afaik14:20
DocScrutinizer-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 36952 2010-05-11 14:56 /usr/lib/mce/modules/libfilter-brightness-als.so14:21
DocScrutinizer-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 30772 2010-05-11 14:56 /usr/lib/mce/modules/libfilter-brightness-simple.so14:21
DocScrutinizerany source for that ?14:21
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DocScrutinizerlet me guess... err, maybe... just... NO WAY, it's fsckng mce >:-(14:24
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, I'll ask again, mce rewrite? :)14:28
DocScrutinizerMEH been there months ago - just forgot :-/
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: ^^^ that's also holding the answer for you, starting with ""Its interface with everything else..."14:30
RST38hDoc: Better times, when Matan was still sane!14:31
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, so? we can rewrite it14:31
DocScrutinizersure we *can*14:32
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DocScrutinizerjust I feel like punched in my face to learn I need to rewrite mce just to deal with a fubar function of converting ALS to a proper LCD BL level14:33
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MohammadAGyou know, rewriting it would be a contribution to MeeGo :P14:34
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DocScrutinizersure I could comment out and form mce/mce.ini, but then probably no automatic screenlock, no manual screenlock, no wakeup on inbound calls, etc etc etc14:35
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: oh, so I shouldn't talk about it. I don't feel like poaching in their woods. I bet they have some better idea, and as usual don't like to share it or at least ponder about mine14:36
chem|stpublic transports just quit for today...14:37
DocScrutinizeryeah :-/14:37
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, what if we rewrite it and make it work on M5 only, for the fun of it :P14:38
DocScrutinizernice idea14:38
MohammadAGthen add a nice ifdef Meego, return 1;14:38
DocScrutinizeror I could simply change to SHR completely, and implement it as a FSO plugin14:39
MohammadAGI wonder how lux is detected14:39
DocScrutinizerby ALS? what was the question?14:40
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trx"ifdef Meego, return 1;" hahahaah14:41
DocScrutinizerL3/4 has a very icky instruction on how to calibrate ALS, by writing some factors to CAL14:41
* MohammadAG stabs the shit out of cal14:42
crashanddieMohammadAG, nice14:42
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: I know this /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-2/2-0029/lux, but what was your question?14:44
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, I was asking about it14:45
VenemoDocScrutinizer: unrelated question, how the hell is it possible to deal with C code that casts back and forth between int and pointer types?14:45
VenemoDocScrutinizer: I've just realized that such code will never work on x86_6414:45
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ChoomVenemo: intptr_t / uintptr_t14:46
DocScrutinizerso that's the reason it is deprecated to cast if you don't know *exactly* what and why14:46
jacekowskiDocScrutinizer: what are you trying to do with als?14:46
crashanddieVenemo, why not?14:46
VenemoDocScrutinizer: tell this to the developers of libmatchbox214:46
jacekowskiVenemo: it will work if it's written properly14:47
DocScrutinizerjacekowski: I want a better backlight regulation, the current one is a major pita14:47
Venemocrashanddie: because what if the OS allocates you a piece of memory in an address that won't fit in a 32-bit integer?14:47
VenemoChoom: yeah, that should be it14:47
jacekowskiVenemo: nope14:47
lcukjacekowski, really?  is sizeof(int*) always == sizeof(int)14:47
jacekowskiVenemo: variables are allocated on stack by program itself14:47
Venemono lcuk14:47
Choomor to registers14:48
jacekowskiChoom: well, but you assume that it's stack14:48
Venemojacekowski: what if someone calls calloc? that isn't guaranteed to fit in the 32-bit boundary?14:48
DocScrutinizerjacekowski: lags like 20s, and has at best 4 levels and switching between them rather at random14:48
Venemolcuk: int is 32-bit, whereas int* is 64-bit on x86_6414:48
ChoomI can make no assumptions about stuff that standards don't define14:49
jacekowskiChoom: standards define that variables are allocated on stack14:49
lcukVenemo, the construct is common however (I have done it myself)14:49
Choomalthough I do make some, such as that the target system has a flat memory model14:49
lcukwith us using 32bit for so long lapses occur14:49
jacekowskiVenemo: well, are we talking about 64 bit program on 64 bit platform14:50
jacekowskiVenemo: or 32bit on 64 bit platform14:50
crashanddieVenemo, #if __LP64__14:50
Choomjacekowski: some architectures may not even have stacks14:50
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Choomjust like others don't have heaps14:50
lcukcrashanddie, ewww14:50
jacekowskiChoom: well, that's what C89 and C99 says14:51
lcukbetter to just actually define variables and memory correctly14:51
crashanddielcuk, I'm not the one casting from ints to pointers :P14:51
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Choomthough I do make certain assumptions14:51
TermanaAnyone here owned an OQO? :p14:51
TermanaOr owns14:51
Choomand don't really care about implementations where those don't work14:51
Choomall my code assumes that the target implementation has a flat memory model14:51
Choomall my code assums that the target implementation has a stack which is thread safe14:52
DocScrutinizerWHY would you want to cast a pointer to an int first instance??14:52
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VenemoI don't want to14:52
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jacekowskiChoom: hmm, hmm, ARM14:52
crashanddieDocScrutinizer, because he doesn't know you can do pointer++14:52
* Venemo sighs14:52
togglesthat works?14:52
crashanddietoggles, of course14:52
VenemoI'd like to compile libmatchbox214:53
Choomjacekowski: ARM validates both14:53
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Choomthe memory model is flat even if it can have holes14:53
jacekowskiChoom: well, i can't think of any other architecture that's popular and does both14:53
VenemoDocScrutinizer: I'd like to compile libmatchbox2, which is full of this. I'm not sure what are their reasons.14:53
DocScrutinizerno reasons, just gasheads14:53
jacekowskix86 is only emulating flat memory model14:53
Choomjacekowski: ia32, amd6414:53
crashanddietoggles, char * foo = "this is a string"; foo += 8; printf("5s\n", foo); // prints "a string"14:53
infobotcrashanddie meant: toggles, char * foo = "this is a string"; foo += 8; printf("%s\n", foo); // prints "a string"14:54
Venemocrashanddie: yes, I know pointer arithmetics14:54
crashanddieVenemo, I'm sure you do, I was just going for the funnies14:54
Venemocrashanddie: see line 34 in
lcukVenemo, thats inverse casting and the function expects a pointer so it gets one14:56
jacekowskipass by reference14:56
Venemothat's just one place of many.14:56
Choomanyway, regarding the question why anyone would cast a pointer to an int14:56
lcukjacekowski, thats not by ref though14:56
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lcukthats casted to void*14:56
jacekowskiwell, pointer14:56
lcukChoom, because the api might only have int parameters14:57
jacekowskilet me just take a look at that code14:57
lcukand "it works" on many platforms for the last 15 years14:57
Choompersonally I do it quite often in pthread_create(), pthread_cleanup_push(), and pthread_exit() when the only thing I want to pass is an integer (such as a file descriptor)14:57
jacekowskilcuk: btw. have you ever written off a car?14:57
jacekowskilcuk: dvla is chasing me for road tax + fines for car i don't have anymore14:58
crashanddieVenemo, what does flags contain?14:58
Venemocrashanddie: I've no idea14:58
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lcukthen perhaps you should have filled in your SORN declaration14:58
jacekowskilcuk: i can't SORN it if i don't own it14:58
lcukno, I haven't though, I tend to trade in14:58
crashanddieVenemo, you probably just want to pass (void *) &flags14:58
lcukyou should have when you had it14:58
lcukChoom, c&d is right14:59
Venemocrashanddie: I don't think so.14:59
jacekowskilcuk: when i had it it still had valid tax14:59
crashanddieVenemo, why not?14:59
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lcukjacekowski, so?  it went off the road, you should have declared it, pay up.14:59
* lcuk shrugs14:59
Venemocrashanddie: remember that this code is working on your N900. if they had made such a big mistake, it wouldn't work14:59
VenemoI rather think this is some "clever" hack...14:59
jacekowskilcuk: sorn is only valid for a year15:00
crashanddieVenemo, oh, right, sorry, thought this was your code15:00
jacekowskilcuk: so i would have to keep declaring it sorn every 12 months15:00
Choomlcuk: it doesn't really work on implementations where sizeof(int) < sizeof(void *)15:00
Venemocrashanddie: as I said, I just want to compile this shit on x86_64.15:00
lcukjacekowski, well you know more than me now so you can follow those rules better, i am not here to discuss cars anyway15:00
* lardman sees more snow15:00
Choomyou need to rely on intptr_t on thise systems, if available15:00
crashanddieVenemo, just compile and run as 32bit mate15:00
Choomand that's not as uncommon as you might think15:00
Venemocrashanddie: hehe... :D15:01
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Choomby default, sizeof(int) is 4 on gcc whereas sizeof(void *) is 8 on amd6415:01
lcukChoom, if you pass a variable using address of as a pointer, then the size of the data is not important15:01
Venemocrashanddie: how can I tell make to compile for 32bit?15:01
chem|stlardman: just dug out my car to do it in about 45mins again!15:01
lcukthe only fsck up is if you try to pass a pointer into a variable that is only an int15:01
lardmanharsh, no chance I can even get my car out15:01
lcukas already reiterated many times15:01
crashanddieVenemo, -m3215:01
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Choomlcuk: yes but that defeats the point of passing an integer as a pointer, which provides you with thread safety, among other things15:02
Venemocrashanddie, thx15:02
crashanddieVenemo, though that means you'll need all the 32 bit libraries and headers15:02
VenemoChoom: seems that it doesn't recognize intptr_t15:02
lcukChoom, ? huh15:02
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Choomi.e.: you can change the original value without worrying about the function that you just passed it to15:02
crashanddieVenemo, it's probably easier to build a quick dchroot in 32bit, takes about 100MB to get a full debian etch 32-bit15:02
RST38hDoc: Either Eldar is talking out of his glory hole (more likely) or Elop is mad (less likely)15:03
Robot101Choom: just because somebody else is changing the value from a different thread doesn't make it "safe"15:03
crashanddieVenemo, I use dchroot daily to build 64-bit and 32-bit versions of my server, plus I get the added bonus that I use "older" libs so it's compatible with nearly every version of linux running at our customer's site15:03
lcukVenemo, make a patch fixing the 32/64bitness15:03
Choomit's one way to avoid unnecessary memory alocations when the function expects a void *15:03
lcuki had to do it when kot was building liqbase onto his 64b system15:03
ChoomRobot101: doesn't even need to be from a different thread, the value can be changed locally15:03
Venemocrashanddie, nice :)15:03
Choomsee pthread_cleanup_push() / pthread_cleanup_pop() as an example15:04
Venemowell I think I'll just change int to long for this delegate type, that shoul solve it15:04
Venemoalthough I dunno how it'll compile on x86 then...15:04
Venemoprobably it won't15:04
ChoomVenemo: use intptr_t / uintptr_t if available from <stddef.h>15:04
VenemoChoom: ok, will try15:04
Choomor was it <stdint.h>?15:04
Choomcan't recall :P15:04
Choomit's the latter15:05
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VenemoChoom: the problem is, that this shit is defined as typedef void (*MBWMClientStackMethod) (MBWindowManagerClient *client, int flags);15:06
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Choomit doesn't really matter what it's defined to15:06
Choomit's an integer15:06
Choomand you can safely store void * into it15:06
VenemoChoom: instances of this type get assigned from all over the code with functions that also accept an int, so I'll have to change those too15:06
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Choomcan't you use the proprocessor to make magic happen?15:07
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VenemoChoom: hm, maybe...15:09
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lcuklots of apps need patching to handle differences in 32/64bit building.  hows and complexity change depending on the codebase.15:09
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RST38hMexican surveillance drone crashed in the US =)15:10
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lcukRST38h, chili beans scattered over a wide area?15:11
RST38hlcuk: DHS is not disclosing information about the weaponry =)15:12
VenemoChoom: no, I can't use the preprocessor for this15:12
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jacekowskihow do you make screenshot on n9015:15
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DocScrutinizerRST38h: that's been to me, about eldar and elop?15:17
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RST38hDoc: yes15:21
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DocScrutinizersorry, no highlight anymore on doc:15:21
DocScrutinizeralso nfc what you're talking about15:21
* RST38h has not got any highlights at all15:22
RST38hDoc: About this: <MohammadAG> RST38h,
RST38hI can now see it has come from MohammadAG though, ,so sorry :)15:22
Venemonah, after changing the stuff to intptr_t, it is now able to compile :)15:22
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Venemothx Choom for the idea15:26
VenemoI make install'd this shit15:27
Venemoand it installed itself to /usr/local/lib instead of /usr/lib6415:28
Choomit's usually a symbolic link15:29
Choomand if it uses autoconf, a --prefix=/usr should solve it15:29
Venemobut it is not in /usr/lib64 at all.15:29
Venemowhich means, pkg-config can't find it15:29
Choom./configure --prefix=/usr15:29
Choomif it's an autotools setup15:30
Venemoit is15:30
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Choomautoconf defaults to /usr/local15:30
Venemofor some reason, ./configure screws up the makefile15:31
VenemoI have to manually edit a line and put a tab instead of spaces...15:31
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Venemonow it went to /usr/lib, still not /usr/lib6415:32
Choomon my system it's a symbolic link15:32
Choom/usr/lib links to /usr/lib6415:33
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Choomwhich should be the case everywhere15:33
Venemowell in here it seems that /usr/lib64 contains the 64-bit libs and /usr/lib the 32-bit ones15:33
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Venemois there a command to clean up all the garbage generated by autotools?16:09
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Venemolcuk: :)16:14
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roadiany 'destructive' ideas why my bluetooth headset has lots of stuttering when i make calls. the same headset works fin on a nokia 6300.16:33
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crashanddieroadi, the n900 sucks at bluetooth17:01
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khertancrashanddie, it doesn't suck just give a low priority to it17:08
roadithat sounds hard.17:08
roadiconnecting with other devices works very well.17:08
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GAN900Etherpad apparently hates GPRS this morning.17:29
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xennoguys how do you capture the cell-id sent from the BTS??17:35
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xennoI need a way to see that info :/17:37
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SpeedEvilxenno: umm17:51
SpeedEvilxenno: netmon17:51
SpeedEvilthe amount of data available is very limited17:52
SpeedEvil Displays Signal Strength in dBm, Cell ID, LAC, RNC, Network Code, etc.17:52
xennoThank u so much :D17:53
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xennothis will probably not capture the cell-id from the other mobile device :/17:59
SpeedEvilWhat other mobile device17:59
SpeedEvilIt certainly will not capture any info about other mobiles, no.17:59
xennoI mean for incoming calls17:59
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SpeedEvilwhat do you mean by cell-id18:00
xennothe cell-id is used for location18:00
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xennoI want to know where the person is calling from :/18:01
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rm_workyeah that would be... not necessary to send, and a privacy violation :P18:02
SpeedEvilThat will never be available even over the air18:02
SpeedEvilIf you snooped it.18:02
SpeedEvilThe cell network has no reason to send it to you, and as I understand it, doesn't/.18:03
xennoyeah it's probably stored in the visitor location register :/18:04
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SpeedEvilAnyway - this is all irrelevant for the n90018:04
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SpeedEvilyou have only access to the very small amount of info the modem hands out.18:05
SpeedEvilYou get no 'raw' access to the signal at all, and the modem is closed-source18:05
* MohammadAG wonders what could happen if it was OSS18:05
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SpeedEvilMohammadAG: Various unfortunate things.18:05
Choomit would never be approved by the FCC/CE/etc.18:06
SpeedEvilMohammadAG: The GSM netwok was not really designed to be secure from hackers.18:06
SpeedEvilI mean - sure - the call setup and billing parts and authorisation parts are encrypted18:06
SpeedEvilbut the signalling isn't.18:07
SpeedEvilAlso - you have the fun possibility of users deciding to do 'direct' free calls between phones, for data.18:07
SpeedEvilThis can wipe out emergency calls in progress on that channel over a radius of 15km18:07
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xennoshows that it's actually possible to get the cell-id18:09
SpeedEvilxenno: No.18:09
SpeedEvilxenno: It shows it's possible to get teh cell-id if you are plugged into the wired-side of the mobile network.18:10
SpeedEvilNot the wireless side18:10
xennoI can't find where it says that this only works on wired connections??18:14
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SpeedEvilpage 2, 3, para 218:15
SpeedEvil... signalling board18:15
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SpeedEvilAlso - the n900 is useless - due to not having raw interfaces, you'd need something like or
SpeedEvilneither of which will do what you want either18:19
SpeedEvilwithout connecting to the wired side18:20
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xennoWell it was worth a shot :/18:22
xennoBut I did learn very much18:22
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xennoNow I actually know how a gsm network interface looks like XD18:23
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xennoit actually all started because someone was calling with a hidden number :/18:25
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lcukVenemo, not my topic18:27
Venemook lcuk18:27
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peetahoops, sorry, I thought I was in vim ...18:53
Choomdon't they say that irc is just a multiplayer notepad?18:54
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khertanany volunters to package correctly git on fremantle for n900 ?18:59
pupniki ended up hand-archiving .debs :/19:00
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DocScrutinizerhmm, CLIP/CLIR is managed in last exchange, prior to last mile to end user (in GSM that would be OTA and last exchange the BTS of callee). I honestly wonder if there's not any secret code you could send to your BTS, to override the BTS suppressing the caller's ID19:23
DocScrutinizerwell, maybe I'm also wrong with my notion about what is 'last exchange' in context of a cellular network19:24
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khertanHi ... i got a problem with the autobuilder for diablo target :19:28
khertandpkg-buildpackage: maemo-optify-deb not found, not optifying.19:28
khertanparsechangelog/debian: error: badly formatted trailer line, at file debian/changelog line 519:28
khertandpkg-buildpackage: unable to determine source package is19:28
khertanfunny is that it s work for fremantle19:29
DocScrutinizerahh no sorry. Now I recall. It seems all interchange standards define a true caller ID plus an effective caller ID comparable to display name of mails or SIP. While the true caller ID isn't usually forwarded to terminating user equipment (except for authorities like police), the display name always is, but can be any arbitrary crap like "*unknown*" or even ascii or "911"19:29
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crashanddieGAN900, still haven't received the thingy19:38
crashanddieGAN900, ONLY 4 BLOODY DAYS TO GO :(19:38
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lardmancrashanddie: what are you waiting for?19:43
crashanddiekindle, gift for the gf19:43
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lardmanah, so Amazon are having troubles over there too19:44
crashanddieno, GAN sent it for me19:44
lardmanoh right19:44
crashanddiecuz Amazon only sent kindles worldwide starting january19:44
SpeedEvilcrashanddie: Many people are really anoying their local small bookstores by going in and asking for kindles.19:44
crashanddiethey kept the stock for US-americans19:44
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SpeedEvil(the few remaining)19:44
lardmanoh, I've seen them for sale here for ages, are they not shipping till Jan then?19:44
crashanddieSpeedEvil, GAN works at a bookstore, he keeps getting asked about the Kindle :P19:44
DocScrutinizerWTF?! 19:45
crashanddielardman, UK yes19:45
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crashanddielardman, but UK doesn't ship the kindle to Europea19:45
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lardmannor does it ship people to anywhere via Heathrow it appears ;)19:45
crashanddieso: sends Kindle to UK only; takes orders worldwide but shows "ships early jan" for worldwide orders; takes orders for US and shows "shipped within 24h" for US IP addresses19:46
crashanddieand redirects to amazon.com19:46
lardmanI like the idea of the Kindle, but can't bring myself to pay full whack for books when I can buy them 2nd hand19:46
crashanddie(for the kindle)19:46
crashanddielardman, most classics are free on Kindle19:46
SpeedEvilI have a kindle19:46
SpeedEvilA gift from someone.19:47
SpeedEvilI use it less than I'd expected for books19:47
lardmanre shipping world-wide, that's just for the Kindle is it?19:47
SpeedEvilI use the n900 more19:47
crashanddielardman, yeah19:47
SpeedEvilat least for fgiction19:47
SpeedEvilsimply as with the n900 I don't have to worry about ambient lighting - and getting it right to read19:47 is rather cheap compared to
*** ArGGu^^ has joined #maemo19:47 would be committing economic suicide if they stopped shipping worldwide this time of year19:47
crashanddielardman, import tax can be hefty though, depending on the item19:47
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lardmanI don't think it will let me buy stuff actually19:48
lardmanI get re-directed iirc19:48
SpeedEvilAlso - I have another objection to the kindle - why would I want another device that can do only one thing19:48
crashanddieyou can buy no problem19:48
lardmanbut can't ship to outside the USA?19:48
crashanddielardman, I used to buy from .com from Oz and UK no problem19:48
lardmanoh right19:48
crashanddiedepends on the seller19:48
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crashanddiesometimes the seller/item only allows for US-sales, but Amazon's private sales are usually pretty open about that19:49
lardmankindle would be good when going on holiday, but not sure how well it would withstand the sand, sun and sunscreen treatement19:49
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lardmancrashanddie: I'll have to rekindle my US account then19:49
crashanddiesun shouldn't be a problem19:49
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crashanddiesunscreen and sand on the other hand...19:49
crashanddienot a good mix19:50
crashanddieand salty water19:50
lardmannext step, waterproof kindle for beach use :)19:50
crashanddiewell, there's a waterproof bag for it19:50
lardmanunderwater reading19:50
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crashanddieI wonder if whispernet works underwater... you could wikipedia the fish you see in real time19:50
crashanddiebasically, I bought the kindle for my gf because she spends about $100 on books every month19:51
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crashanddieAnd she has a bag filled with books with her constantly19:52
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lardmancrashanddie: not in salty water, hf is not happy19:52
lardmanhigh frequency19:52
crashanddieif GAN comes back, tell him I'm commuting home19:52
lardmanthat's impressive, tell her to go to the 2nd hand markets19:53
DocScrutinizer apple ##conspiracy19:53
crashanddieshe can't19:53
lardmanwhy not?19:53
crashanddielardman, she's doing a masters in English Lit, not many English books in 2nd hand shops in the area19:53
lardmanah, that could be a problem19:53
lardmanwell we could establish parcels to Europe ;0]19:54
lardmanhmm, not sure what that smiley means, typo19:54
crashanddieAnd her memoire is about the relation between Biological Decoding and Heterologies... not the kind of stuff you find in 2nd hand bookstores anyway19:54
lardmanamazon marketplace?19:54
crashanddieso we come back to Amazon, so Kindle :)19:54
SpeedEvillardman: Is that where you go to buy half-busty ladies?19:55
crashanddietold you, my logic is foolproof19:55
lardmanyeah but market place is ~ £2.50 shipping + £0.01 for the book, vs £6.99+ brand new19:55
SpeedEvilWell - not all books are available on kindle alas.19:55
crashanddielardman, again, most classics are free on Kindle19:55
lcukcrashanddie, so, now instead of a couple of books she can throw in a bag and not worry about19:55
lardmancrashanddie: ok, so we've come full circle :)19:56
lardmanSpeedEvil: only half-busty?!19:56
lcukshe has to keep a couple of books (cos not everything is digital) as well as electronic thing19:56
lardman+ charger19:56
crashanddielardman, 1month battery, no need for charger ;)19:56
lardmanthough they last a long while don't they?19:56
lcukSpeedEvil, half busty?  would that be horizontal or vertical halving?19:56
crashanddielcuk, well, instead of a good dozen books in her bag, she can take a couple books plus a very small book (I got her the leather casing for the kindle)19:56
lcukwhere does need to carry a dozen books to all the time?19:57
lardmanfor text books it might be useful19:57
DocScrutinizerlcuk: you'd hope you can scan in any paperbook to pdf and use that in a ebook-reader19:57
crashanddielcuk, so it's really not bigger than a paperback, and a lot thinner + added advantage of PDF support19:57
lcukDocScrutinizer, if you have to do that mannually yourself and open eery page19:58
lcukyou are kinda dfeating purpose19:58
lardmanbreak the binding and use page feeder19:58
lardmanbut then your book is dead19:58
crashanddieAnyway, if she doesn't use the Kindle, I'll nick it.19:58
DocScrutinizermeh, 400p = 200 scans = 50min19:58
DocScrutinizerworth it in my book, for my books19:58
lardmanI'd pay someone a fiver so I didnt' have to do that19:59
crashanddieDocScrutinizer, 15 seconds per scan? That's optimistic19:59
crashanddiewith my scanner it is :D19:59
lardmanyeah last book I scanned took probably 20s/page19:59
crashanddiemore like 45s with my scanner :D19:59
lcuki got it to 18.5s/page19:59
lardmanexponential slow down towards the end of the book19:59
SpeedEvilBut you can watch TV at the same time as scaning20:00
luke-jrwhy on earth would you scan a book?20:00
crashanddietell GAN i'll be back online in a bit if he comes back20:00
lardmancrashanddie: yep I'll tell him, enjoy the trip home20:00
lcuksame reason I print out irc20:00
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lardmanluke-jr: because the British Library will only lend it to you once and you've not finished using it?20:00
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luke-jrlardman: wtf?20:01
lardmanlcuk: do you have a tickertape feed going so you can read irc? ;)20:01
DocScrutinizerbecause of g and higgs?20:01
lcuklardman, :D20:01
lardmanfeed some punch cards back in, quick!20:01
lcuki put initials and scribble on it occasionally too20:01
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lcukand tear it off to make a point about something20:01
lardmanlike "Wow"20:02
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javispedrothat is so appropriate (PSNR and all that) :)20:02
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Jaffa /me really should find some motivation to finsih yesterday's MWKN after all the work done by GAN90020:03
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DocScrutinizer~nuke modest20:06
* infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at modest ... B☢☢M!20:06
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DocScrutinizerwould you believe there's not even an *option* in this shitty mailreader to never show html mails rendered?20:07
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DocScrutinizerprobably will even load embedded flash videos20:08
* lardman realises he left off the exclamation mark20:09
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DocScrutinizerwhich dwarf has coded modest?20:11
lardmanor perhaps grumpy20:12
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mikki-kuncan anybody lend me a hand why my  n900 is silent? i can't switch volume anymore20:13
lardmancheck the Profile20:14
DocScrutinizerthis seems to become increasingly contagious20:14
mikki-kunit is explicitly on loud20:14
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mikki-kunand i am having my sounds on loud20:15
DocScrutinizerhooray for 1.320:15
mikki-kuni mean the volume being at 100%20:15
luke-jrpfft 1.320:15
* luke-jr is already using 1.420:15
mikki-kunyet it is silent as a dead man20:15
lardmanin fact I've had no problems20:15
mikki-kunit just came up recently20:15
mikki-kunand it's so goddamn annoying20:15
* DocScrutinizer throws 1.5 at luke-jr20:15
mikki-kuni can't tell where the problem lies20:15
lardmanI can understand that20:15
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DocScrutinizermikki-kun: try plug&unplug headphone20:16
mikki-kuni am rebooting the phone Ö.ö20:16
mikki-kunthe 6th time in under 15 mins20:16
DocScrutinizerand ? "sound restored 17%. ETA 5:49"?20:17
mikki-kunand in music player "cannot play media, media format not supported"20:17
mikki-kunthe story just goes this is an mp3 which it played before without any problems20:17
lardmanfor stuff that used to work too?20:18
lardmanthat's odd20:18
DocScrutinizersearch chanlog for similar wordings. Seems we got a "virus" somewhere in repo20:18
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil has no sound, dunno who else20:18
DocScrutinizerseveral posts here OWTTE20:18
mikki-kunit is annoying as i use the n900 as well as a phone >.<20:19
javispedrowell, until someone with enough free time reproduces the problem...20:19
DocScrutinizerI'd ping council about the issue. Really seems to spread20:20
lardmantest gst pipeline, test the mixer20:20
mikki-kunand whoever wrote sudo gainroot, get that damn autoscript generation off -.-20:20
mikki-kuni annoys me as i am still used to "sudo -i"20:20
DocScrutinizererr WUT?20:20
DocScrutinizerautoscript generation?20:21
mikki-kunsudo -i "cannot execute /bin/sh as user"20:21
mikki-kunsudo gainroot works20:21
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javispedromikki-kun: you can get sudo -s and sudo -i to work, just add your $SHELL to sudoers20:21
DocScrutinizermikki-kun: that's messybox20:21
mikki-kunit generates /etc/sudoers itself?!20:21
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DocScrutinizermikki-kun: what's the problem with creating a proper entry to /etc/sudoers.d/*20:22
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mikki-kuni thought only /etc/sudoers is for that20:23
javispedroif you add stuff to /etc/sudoers it won't be overwritten btw20:24
DocScrutinizerno, only /etc/sudoers.d/* is for that20:24
mikki-kunjavispedro: it will be overwritten to some degree20:24
mikki-kuneven after reboots it remembers it20:24
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javispedromikki-kun: put it outside of the ---- ----- blocks20:24
DocScrutinizerfix that idiocy called upate-sudoers!20:24
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DocScrutinizerget recent version of sudo that supports include20:25
* javispedro would say that the issue is the system abusing something that is clearly designed for interactive use (sudo)20:25
javispedroand the fix would be policykit or yet another trendy *kit project20:25
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DocScrutinizerthat too20:25
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DocScrutinizerprobably somebody heard suid id evil :-P20:26
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ioando you guys hear a "thump" you your head when watching this:
DocScrutinizerwell, maemo maintainers always excelled on creative usage of *nix standard tools and procedures20:28
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ioan*in your20:29
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mikki-kunwhat is the process for pulse named?20:29
mikki-kunit isn't running20:30
javispedrothen it's probably the same failure lardman got20:30
DocScrutinizer"use messybox, it's cute! what? no su anymore? so what, let's mess up sudo for it. Ok we also need a script let's call it gainroot... Now what is next to mess up?"20:30
lardmannot me20:30
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javispedrolardman: did you fix it or I'm confusing things (again)?20:30
lardmanI was just suggesting what to look at20:31
lardmanI've not had the problem though20:31
mikki-kuni freaking hate pulse -.-20:31
mikki-kunwhy not alsa?!20:31
javispedrosomeone was having a problem with pulseaudio not starting20:31
DocScrutinizercheck that flac lib20:31
DocScrutinizerhell, check all audio codec libs20:31
BCMMjavispedro: i had that problem...20:31
BCMMmanually unoptifying libflac did indeed help20:32
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG had it, a whole classroom full of people had it or still has it20:32
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BCMMi talked to the libflac package maintainer about it, btw20:32
DocScrutinizerit's contagious20:32
mikki-kunBCMM: wanna guide me through the tutorial?20:32
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DocScrutinizerls -l /usr/lib/*FLAC*20:33
BCMMmikki-kun: can't remember exactly, but copy (or something like that) from opt to the main partition20:33
DocScrutinizeror sth like that20:33
mikki-kunfrom /opt/usr/lib/ to /usr/lib ?20:33
DocScrutinizerit mustn't be a symlink20:33
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javispedro/opt/maemo/usr/lib if it was automatically optified20:34
javispedro(and it probably was, considering what is failing)20:34
DocScrutinizerls -l /usr/lib/*flac* will tell20:34
javispedromy mind still doesn't understand how FLAC could cause pa to crash20:35
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BCMMi talked the the guy that maintains the package, and we came to the conclusion that it was due to having upgraded to an unofficial version of something pulse links against20:35
DocScrutinizerif it's a symlink then move the file over the symlink location20:35
BCMMthe official version doesn't link to libflac, the unofficial one does20:35
BCMMand it happened due to upgrading with apt-get, and thus being allowed to use non-nokia versions of stuff20:35
javispedrolibsndfile maybe20:35
BCMMjavispedro: i think so, yes20:35
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: pa starts, tries to load libs, fails, segfaults20:35
BCMMif somebody could remind me if the path to the pulseaudio binary so i can run ldd on it, i could find out again20:36
BCMMbut i believe it was libsndfile20:36
javispedro/usr/bin/pulseaudio ..20:36
DocScrutinizerhaha for apt-get upgrade20:36
javispedromy desktop pulse seems to link with it too20:36
javispedroand =)20:37
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-20 19:33:21] <DocScrutinizer> ls -l /usr/lib/*FLAC*20:37
mikki-kunseems it isn't even installed!20:37
BCMMyeah, pretty sure it was sndfile20:38
BCMMjavispedro: ah, got confused because of it having no execute permission for user20:38
DocScrutinizer[2010-12-20 19:31:44] <DocScrutinizer> hell, check all audio codec libs20:38
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BCMMjavispedro: it links to sndfile, which links to flac20:38
BCMMjavispedro: in the default install, sndfile and PA don't link to libflac, which is a good thing because libflac isn't installed20:39
BCMM(the libflac package guy checked ldd pulseaudio on his device)20:40
DocScrutinizer~lart maintainer for breaking dependencies20:40
* infobot breaks out the Hoover and sucks up maintainer for breaking dependencies20:40
* javispedro goes lookup who is the author of the upgraded libsndfile20:40
BCMMwell, i asked the guy because i was going to file a bug, but now i haven't a clue who's fault it is20:40
BCMMapart from mine for upgrading with apt-get20:40
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BCMMand ofc the fault of whoever invented the weirdo partitioning scheme20:41
infobotfrom memory, optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence320:41
javispedrooh, aapo.20:41
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DocScrutinizeris this a political party?20:42
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javispedronope, a nickname20:42
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javispedrobut I don't want to scold him, as he did a great job with the initial openttd porting20:42
javispedrook, this is weird20:43
DocScrutinizerit's probably auto-optification which is just contraindicated here, as Nokia in their eternal wisdom decided to use PA prior to mounting /opt20:43
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javispedrosee, AB rejected package on grounds that it overwrites a Nokia base firmware package20:44
javispedrothe package is on the repos20:44
mikki-kunplease, why not just give some people the sources so they can actually make a really good maemo device for us?20:44
mikki-kuni mean in this community we have like a dozen really amazing programmers20:44
BCMMat this point they are probably frightened of the n900 being better than their next big thing by the time they release it20:44
fralsham is open and lots of people complaining and nothing has really happend with it mikki-kun20:45
BCMMi mean, they were surely keeping USB host mode back as a reason for people to upgrade, right?20:45
DocScrutinizeronly a dozen??20:45
javispedroX-Fade: there?20:45
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mikki-kunseems there are way more working in the background20:46
DocScrutinizerBCMM: (hostmode) nope, that's been fault of USB.cert zealots20:46
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: sorry, don't know what usb.cert zealots are20:47
DocScrutinizerthe USB cerification consortium blockheads20:47
* MohammadAG considers deoptifying the libflac8 package himself20:48
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DocScrutinizerNokia wasn't allowed to sell a device with OTG half-done20:48
dotblankAnyone have a working sbox environment?20:48
javispedroMohammadAG: we need to remove the libsndfile1 package from -devel, it's broken20:48
BCMMDocScrutinizer: i thought OTG was a different thing from proper host mode?20:48
dotblankmine must be broken20:48
MohammadAG# Added by maemo-optify, with apologies. | you got that right20:48
DocScrutinizerbut Nokia always planned to do proper OTG, and then they said "let's screw it"20:49
BCMMdotblank: my scratchbox worked last time i checked, though i haven't updated it in a while20:49
MohammadAGjavispedro, I noticed it20:49
dotblankWell im getting segfaults from my output program :(20:49
mikki-kuni can't find flac installed in /opt...20:49
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javispedromikki-kun: do you have root?20:50
DocScrutinizerBCMM: then they realized they managed to get a nasty hw bug in there that even stops hostmode (they thought, and hell they almost were right)20:50
mikki-kuni am running root on it via ssh20:50
javispedromikki-kun: and do you have PR1.3?20:50
MohammadAGjavispedro, ping X-Fade20:50
BCMMMohammadAG: is OTG a seperate sort of USB, or just a word for anything that can use the same port as either a host or a slave?20:50
javispedromikki-kun: then run, as root apt-get install libsndfile1=1.0.20-0maemo1+0m520:50
dotblankWell i'm trying to download the latest vm image and the site
javispedroMohammadAG: already did, few lines above :)20:51
dotblankis unresponsive20:51
MohammadAGBCMM, seeing the N8 (and of course, the long sessions of DocScrutinizer explaining it to me), OTG needs a different type of portt20:51
DocScrutinizerBCMM: #2 plus a bit fancy stuff on top20:51
* MohammadAG suggests buying X-Fade a hotline or something :P20:51
BCMMMohammadAG: different sorta port, or different wiring behind it to allow it to switch modes?20:51
MohammadAGBCMM, both20:52
MohammadAGit's squarish20:52
BCMMMohammadAG: oh, usb micro A?20:52
MohammadAGthe OTG plug doesn't go in the N90020:52
MohammadAGidk, I hate USB port naming schemes20:52
MohammadAGI think it's the same as the N800's20:53
DocScrutinizerBCMM: Nokia changed the receptacle from AB (OTG compliant) to B (periph only) and also changed a few 'little' things during that, one of which actually breaks both OTG and simple hostmode20:53
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DocScrutinizermeh, why don't you ask MohammadAG :-P20:54
BCMMMohammadAG: this cable i have that I posted about on the hostmode thread; is it advertised wrongly then?20:54
MohammadAGIf only they left the pin connected20:54
MohammadAGBCMM, link?20:54
BCMM"Micro USB Host Cable OTG on the go for N810 and TG01" - it has the same plug as the cables taht come with the n90020:54
BCMMMohammadAG: (ebay links are stupidly long)20:55
DocScrutinizerI didn't know I made it on BCMM 's ignore lists on IRC *and* tmo20:55
MohammadAGjust to be sure, <DocScrutinizer> I didn't know I made it on BCMM 's ignore lists on IRC *and* tmo20:55
BCMMDocScrutinizer: i've missed something obv. again, right?20:55
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MohammadAGdidn't the N810 lack OTG without a kernel hack anyways?20:56
GAN900Jaffa, if not, I can finish up tonight.20:56
BCMMalso, tell me when my newbie questions about USB-related stuff are boring20:56
GAN900Jaffa, retail crush week is wearing me down, too.20:57
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mikki-kunI heard a sound :D20:57
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mikki-kunYAY \o/20:57
BCMMDocScrutinizer: i'm not ignoring you, but I am confused now...20:57
mikki-kunTHANKS javispedro :D20:57
rm_workGAN900: retail crush week? sup20:58
javispedromikki-kun: bug filled,
povbotBug 11709: Autobuilder allowed a Nokia-conflicting binary package to enter extras-devel (libsndfile1)20:58
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: ah, i forgot the thing about ports that accept A and B - sorry20:59
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mikki-kunhm, just how can autobuilder say it wasn't conflicting?21:00
MohammadAGit can21:00
javispedroMohammadAG: -- it detected sndfile-programs21:00
mikki-kuni mean, isn't it from nokia the autobuilder?21:00
MohammadAGbut why should it21:00
javispedrobut failed to detect libsndfile121:00
BCMMso extras-devel isn't supposed to have "upgrades" to nokia apackages?21:00
MohammadAGi upped apt once21:01
MohammadAGBCMM, no21:01
javispedroBCMM: nope, that's what an SSU repo would be for.21:01
infobotwell, ssu is
BCMMjavispedro: thanks for filing a bug; couldn't get my head round who's bug it was21:02
rm_workyeah but a "community upgrade" wouldn't ever fall into a SSU21:02
mikki-kuni can't access those by default, have to use nameserver to access them21:02
MohammadAGrm_work, why's that?21:03
RST38hMoo, rm_me21:03
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MohammadAGalterego, what happened to Columbus?21:04
rm_workyo RST38h21:04
rm_workMohammadAG: because when would Nokia push community fixes? :P21:04
rm_worklike xorg for n800 that supports xrandr for example21:04
rm_workthey wouldn't put that in a SSU because it's a community thing not a nokia thing <_<21:05
rm_workbut it's an "upgrade" to a nokia base package21:05
javispedrorm_work: there's this entire "community SSU" thing, you know...21:05
RST38hrm_me: How has life been treating you lately? Anything Maemo/Meego-related? =)21:05
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MohammadAGrm_work, I found Nokia-pushed fixes a bit... "unfixing"21:05
rm_workjavispedro: ah, is there? then maybe i have been out of the loop for too long to really comment accurately21:05
* javispedro looks at MohammadAG 21:06
rm_workand also, maybe I need to figure out how to load those on my n900? :)21:06
rm_workRST38h: not really, working long weeks for a soul-crushing corporation21:06
DocScrutinizerrm_work: NIH they said21:06
rm_workjust managed to bypass their byzantine firewall last week21:06
RST38hrm_you: Ah, howfamiliar21:07
rm_workkeep installing maemo SDK and then running out of time to actually do anything21:07
rm_worktook a look at ABL beta for fremantle again...21:07
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rm_workrealized I violated like 100% of their UI guideline21:08
rm_workand that at this point no one cares21:08
* MohammadAG stares at javispedro 21:08
MohammadAG*cough* #maemo-ssu *cough*21:08
RST38hUi guidelines...feh21:09
rm_workthough I should probably look at doing more abstraction around the hardware control layer (like, supporting HAL) so it would work on more devices, since meego will run not only on one device now :P21:09
DocScrutinizer*cough* 14 *cough*21:09
javispedroHAL's been killed too21:09
RST38hAnd Hildon too21:09
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RST38hIs gconf still around?21:09
javispedroI think not, gnome guys talking about dconf already21:09
rm_workcomplete rewrite time...21:09
* DocScrutinizer kills gconf21:09
RST38hrm_you: But do not get dismayed, PulseAUdio and Tracker are still there21:10
* rm_work facepalms21:10
DocScrutinizerPA is now knows as polypaudio21:10
javispedroDocScrutinizer: you're going to love Gnome's plans. The "new" GSettings API maps nicely to the Windows Registry, up to the point that on Windows it will actually use the Registry as backend.21:10
RST38hYou surely cannot deprecate such important, well designed frameworks.21:10
rm_workcan load it in regedit as a hive? :P21:10
RST38hThat would be aking to wasting effort.21:10
RST38hOn the other hand, Clutter is [apparently] out, replaced by a Qt clone of itself21:11
rm_workI don't mind dumping old stuff that was either poorly designed or is just really outdated... I'll put in some extra effort to port software if there is significantly less cruft21:11
rm_workbut it needs to be replaced by something BETTER21:11
DocScrutinizerI dare to suspect gconf lead devel was this guy of avahi and PA21:12
RST38hNo, it needs to be replaced by something better accepted by the current management21:12
javispedroDocScrutinizer: guess what too? that guy is also going to replace init now =)21:12
RST38hAnd the current gospel is QT21:12
rm_workso, someone get me up to date really quick. I know there is a meego SDK out, right?21:12
DocScrutinizerlennart was the name, YES21:12
rm_workdid they or did they not announce a new handset at the summit or after?21:13
RST38hrm_you: "Meego SDK" is basically a Moblin image for netbooks21:13
* DocScrutinizer starts to write a lennart-virus21:13
RST38hThey did not21:13
RST38hGave away a bunch of Samsung netbooks instead21:13
* javispedro waits for the harmattan sbox sdk :)21:13
rm_worki mean, admittedly those look neat?21:13
RST38hrm_work: They look like Samsung netbooks.21:13
rm_worktouch netbooks...21:14
javispedroawfully underpowered (but it is my first crapbook so take it with a grain of salt)21:14
RST38hWouldn't matter even if they had penis receptacles21:14
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infobotjavispedro meant: awfully underpowered (but it is my first netbook so take it with a grain of salt)21:14
rm_worklcukn900: how did you manage?! HOW!?21:14
RST38hThat is not what everyone has been waiting for (i.e. either a phone or a tablet)21:15
rm_worklcukn900: (having a full time job and still managing to do anything outside of work)21:15
rm_workso still no announcement (official) of new phone?21:15
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DocScrutinizerrm_work: rumours21:15
rm_worksomeone was telling me they'd seen one, must have been... yeah, rumor21:16
GeneralAntillesHey, rm_work.21:16
GeneralAntillescrashanddie, dunno.21:16
RST38hrm_work: Google for Nokia N921:16
javispedroprobably the real thing, imho.21:16
RST38hrm_work: Apparently a Harmattan device, photos out, look very close to Nokia E7 (also not out yet)21:16
rm_workheh, thx21:17
rm_workGeneralAntilles: sup21:17
GeneralAntillesrm_work: insanity week.21:17
rm_workGeneralAntilles: retail crush week? referring to your job?21:17
rm_workwhere you working now?21:17
RST38hAnd, before you ask, it is *not* cut out from a used MacBook keyboard =)21:17
GeneralAntillesrm_work: local new/used bookstore.21:18
* DocScrutinizer waves and goes for aspirin21:18
GeneralAntillesI keep thinking about working somewhere else for a change, and they keep raising my pay. . . .21:18
rm_workGeneralAntilles: lol21:18
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rm_workGeneralAntilles: and this is crazy rush week? because everyone wants books for xmas? :P21:18
rm_workyeah, actually I went to HPB yesterday...21:18
GeneralAntillesThe used part.21:19
GeneralAntillesFirst editions, leather bounds, collectors items, etc.21:19
rm_worksold like $300 of textbooks for $15 because i'm lazy as @$&* now that i have so little time outside of work21:19
rm_workand i just needed to get them off my shelf to make room21:19
GeneralAntillesTextbook market is silly.21:19
* RST38h keeping most valuable textbooks21:19
rm_workyeah, these ones were "Theater Production and Management" and a bunch of russian novels21:20
RST38hOh, the theater thing...I remember :) Did it go well at the end?21:20
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rm_workpity pass21:21
rm_workbut all is well, i've been graduated for a full year now21:21
rm_workand selling my soul to the oal&gas industry21:21
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RST38hrm_work: I heard they pay well and let you go places21:22
infobotrm_work meant: and selling my soul to the oil&gas industry21:22
rm_workpay DAMN well21:22
DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: (increase pay) good plan, I should try this as well: CONSULTANT FOR HIRE!21:22
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RST38hrm_work: does the work-in-the-north / work-in-the-middle-east / go-back-to-hq career path apply to you, or is it for managers only?21:24
rm_workwell, as a programmer in their IT/Security department, they pretty much keep me at HQ21:24
DocScrutinizerrm_work: please ask if they still need somebody21:25
rm_workyou looking for a job?21:25
rm_worksend me your resume :)21:25
* javispedro needs to learn perl in 5 minutes21:26
javispedroaha a21:26
rm_worklol javispedro21:26
lcukn900rm_work deploying your software direct on a rig is required experience!21:26
* rm_work wishes we lived in a world where no one needed to learn perl at all21:26
rm_worklcukn900: my software to... provision AD priviliges to new employees? :P21:27
RST38hjavispedro: You need ot know one thing only: Any combination of words and punctuation marks (ESPECIALLY punctuation marks) makes sense in perl21:27
lcukn900 ore so21:27
rm_workalso, my company does not to production/exploration21:27
rm_workonline refining and shipping21:27
lcukn900unprovisioned people on rigs is bad21:27
rm_work*does not do21:27
RST38hThere are worse things in the world than PERL. Hell, you might have to learn PYTHON!21:27
rm_work*only refining21:27
javispedroa years old perl script parsing a web page and filling some html form just broke21:27
rm_workit's like i've got horrible autocomplete today, but it's just my brain T_T21:28
lcukn900that means that everyone on the rig is unprovisioned then?21:28
rm_worklcukn900: my company does not do drilling :) we receive crude from other companies and refine it, and then transport and sell it in our gas stations21:28
rm_workand to other companies again21:28
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timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: fwiw...21:30
timeless_mbpmodest was designed by nokia user interface designers21:30
timeless_mbpall bugs in the ui are not faults of the engineers, but of the ui designers21:30
DocScrutinizerdwarfs, I knew it :-P21:30
timeless_mbpwho got crappy requirements and wrote a ui to accommodate only those requirements21:30
timeless_mbpplease don't insult dwarfs21:30
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: same old story all ver again21:30
rm_worksup timeless21:31
timeless_mbprm_work: <busy> NOW21:31
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* javispedro notes modest isn't horribly bad when compared to some other propietary platforms' clients21:31
RST38hAnd, the main Modest problems are with the backend,not with the UI21:31
RST38hStill takes40-60 seconds to show aPOP3  inbox21:31
rm_worksorry to miss you at Dublin (assuming you made it)21:31
timeless_mbpRST38h: the backend was designed more or less to satisfy requirements of the ui designers21:31
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timeless_mbpi did21:31
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: indeed, outlook express is worse XP21:31
* timeless_mbp is gone21:31
RST38hActually, Modest uses Camel, which has not been designed for Modest at the first place21:32
javispedroRST38h: have you updated to pr1.3 and read  '21:32
povbotBug 11139: Long delays in email interface21:32
DocScrutinizeruse a webmailer, noobs! :-P21:33
* DocScrutinizer hides21:33
RST38hjavispedro: Not using exchange, fortunately. But I am getting the same problem with POP321:33
javispedroDocScrutinizer: the worst part is that probably outlook express has an order of magnitude larger market share than modest =)21:33
lcukn900email is one of those things where one group of people can use it happily forever and others will have problems21:33
RST38hjavispedro:Emails openinstantly btw, but the POP3 inbox takes a longwhile21:33
javispedroRST38h: not necessarily MfE, happened to me with plain POP321:33
RST38hlcuk: Wrong21:34
rm_workannoyed that while n900 supports exchange, no exchange admin will ever let your device use their server unless it is android or iPhoneOS21:34
lcukn900right actually21:34
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javispedroRST38h: mine took nearly two minutes to open until I cleaned that key21:34
BCMMjavispedro: the worst part is probably outlook express21:34
RST38hlcuk: Email is a thing that can be accessed in a bunch of different ways and if you do not test or do not implement these methods, users will complain21:34
BCMM(of email)21:34
RST38hjavis: Key? Hmm, ok, checking the rest of that bug report21:35
DocScrutinizertelnet for the winners21:35
RST38hlcuk: And if you do not take time properly testing and fixing, then you may start complaining about users being "bad" on you, indeed21:35
javispedroRST38h: see last comment, has a snippet (I used gconf-editor instead though)21:36
* DocScrutinizer is quite sure telnet wouldn't load html mail embedded URLs :-P21:37
javispedroit should be fixed in pr1.3, but who knows...21:37
RST38hI do not think it is fixed21:37
lcukn900rst38h so which mobile mail clients are to your satisfaction?21:37
javispedroit can be a different bug21:37
javispedroah, perl.21:37
* javispedro goes on to read more about it21:38
RST38hlcuk: Pine via ssh works21:38
RST38hlcuk: So does Claws21:38
DocScrutinizeryeah, what's wring with cmdline mailers?21:38
RST38hlcuk: Google GMail Mobile works21:38
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lcukn900rst38h which do you use?21:39
* nox- mutt via ssh too21:39
lcukn900and pine/ssh is not an end user thing21:39
* lcukn900 cannot recall claws21:40
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RST38hjavispedro: the command line command given in the last comment does not work.21:40
rm_workyeah, i use mutt for mail periodically21:40
RST38hlcuk: I use PINE most often21:40
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nox-as they say, `all muas suck, mutt sucks less' :)21:41
RST38hlcuk: It is known to work, with all known email delivery methods21:41
javispedroRST38h: and easy way to test if it's that issue is deleting/recreating the account21:41
lcukn900rst38h can realpeople use it tho?21:41
javispedrowell, "easy".21:41
RST38hPine/Mutt preference mainly dependson how your mail agent is delivering your mail21:41
rm_workwith mutt, you should know how to use VIM... so, no21:41
lcukn900and what would you suggest for those people21:41
RST38hlcuk; Yes, PINE is dead simple21:41
javispedroon TMO They're rediscovering powervr.ini21:42
rm_workand pine is pico, no?21:42
RST38hlcuk: Not shiny, but easy to use21:42
javispedrocue cuestions about "is it possible To OMG OVERCLOCK the GPU using that file"21:42
RST38hjavispedro: Yes, I have seen. The incredible undead lemmings.21:42
rm_workI hate forums...21:42
RST38hbetter than mailing lists21:42
rm_workyes, i hate mailing lists more21:43
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rm_workIRC with properly searchable logs is the best way to go IMO21:43
RST38hWe need an evil, elitist, merit-based forum.21:43
* nox- still prefers a decent nntp client over any webforum :)21:43
MohammadAGjavispedro, dd if=$thatfile into some mtd block21:43
DocScrutinizerrm_work: here I ACK21:43
* javispedro agrees with nox-21:43
RST38hPreferably one that requires you towrite a program to get posting privileges21:43
rm_workbut IRC is not a SYN!21:44
* rm_work dies from pun21:44
* javispedro ponders warning TMOers against changing their WSEGL plugin21:44
javispedroas it will cause insta-brick21:44
MohammadAGRST38h, does a hello world count?21:44
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RST38hMohammad: Yes, as long as it is done via DBUS :)21:44
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DocScrutinizerdoes dbus-send count?21:45
JaffaGAN900: Ta. I'll try and find time, but I think I'm coming down with something21:45
RST38hprolly, but only once21:45
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: linky?21:46
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javispedronote that the author of that is "my old friend" from the preenv thread.21:46
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MohammadAGjavispedro, old?21:48
javispedroMohammadAG: remember the bullshit speaking guy?21:49
* RST38h does not understand why anyone cares how exactly a bunch of lemmings brick their N900s21:49
javispedroRST38h: less market share for your $50 "I am rich!" application!21:50
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javispedroaha, the Eldar rumour about WP7 and Nokia is already on TMO!21:51
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asj__javispedro: WP7?21:52
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javispedrowindows phone 721:52
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RST38hjavispedro: are rodents getting properly wound up about it21:53
RST38hjavispedro: Any posts, in all caps, "I HATE YOU NOKIA SWITCHING ANDROID"?21:53
javispedrothey smell something21:53
javispedroso no, not yet.21:54
iDontjavispedro: If i may ask: how exactly does the WSEGL setting cause devices to be bricked? Out of curiosity :)21:54
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RST38hWill be fun if the wp7 rumor is really true :)21:54
crashand1ie_GAN900: ping21:54
crashand1ie_MohammadAG: ping21:55
javispedroiDont: (let's bring something techie finally to the conversation) WSEGL is the one that actually decides where the color buffer is to be positioned/rendered21:55
javispedroNokia ships a few ones (iirc) but from these only one takes care that our platform is a not simple fbdev based one but rather that we use Xorg21:55
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javispedrothe rest will probably fail, either by writing somewhere that does not have the real framebuffer or by crashing21:56
javispedroas they're only useful when Xorg is not controlling fb021:56
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javispedroso, change it, and at best, you get black screen after hildon-desktop boot. (Well, at best, it might not do nothing because the alternative plugins will not be present in the final fw, don't really remember)21:57
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crashand1ie_in the Qt SDK, can you use things such as the MAFW framework without having an N900?21:59
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iDontjavispedro: thanks for the explanation. Do you have any clue why I read several positive comments from people at TMO who have changed this setting if it will give you a blank screen at best?21:59
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RST38hcrash: In MADDE you mean? No21:59
RST38hiDont: You can find all kinds of comments on TMO.22:00
jacekowskiiDont: well, i made not working version of my modified fmtxd for 1.322:00
jacekowskiiDont: and some people claimed that it's working22:00
javispedroiDont: I don't want to know.22:00
RST38hiDont: Most are not indicative of anything. Either check who is commenting, or see how many people are commenting22:00
javispedroheh, lag :)22:00
rm_workanyone know if the FM Boost app still works? :P i still run it religiously every time i turn on my FMT but it seems to have stopped making an immediately obvious difference22:00
RST38hFM Boost does not work for me22:01
jacekowskirm_work: it's not working on 1.322:01
RST38hYou can check the FM transmit power, it stays the same here22:01
rm_work:( sad22:01
jacekowskihere is a fix for it22:01
rm_workTHAT is one thing that needs to be fixed :P22:01
iDonthehe, could have though of such a response :P Well, I'll leave the setting alone then. I used to overclock as well, but DocScrutinizer changed my mind (and for good reasons :)22:01
iDontAnd  i thank him for that22:01
javispedroiDont: also, as hildon-desktop is the only one that actually touches the framebuffer, a restart is required for the setting to take effect22:02
iDontjavispedro: i see22:02
* RST38h touches the framebuffer, with extreme prejudice22:02
crashand1ie_RST38h: yeah, in Madde, I guess22:02
jacekowskirm_work: it will change power to 120 and change frequency limit to region 422:02
jacekowskirm_work: so you can use it at highest power at all possible frequencies22:02
crashand1ie_RST38h: so basically, anything that is maemo-specific can't be tested through the SDK?22:02
javispedroRST38h: but not via the sgx or pvr2d :)22:02
jacekowskirm_work: with charger plugged in22:03
RST38hcrash: MADDE is just cross-compilation environment22:03
jacekowskirm_work: or usb cable22:03
rm_workjacekowski: i see it says "installation procedure is same as prev version" but i originally installed it via apt, so..? :P22:03
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RST38hcrash: They have promised a full-scale qemu-based emulator as part of madde, but it is not there yet (there appear to be betas though, ask stskeeps)22:03
jacekowskiit's not fm boost22:03
jacekowskiit's different thing22:03
rm_workso i should remove fmboost app22:03
rm_workthis is full time then? don't have to run it every time i start FM transmitter?22:04
jacekowskihere is instruction22:04
jacekowskirm_work: it's full time22:04
jacekowskirm_work: that instruction is for 1.222:04
jacekowskirm_work: but if you download 1.3 files it's pretty much the same22:04
crashand1ie_RST38h: any options to test some code I'd like to contribute without an N900?22:04
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jacekowskicrashand1ie_: nokia has some remote thing22:04
jacekowskiso you can access real n900 via internet22:05
jacekowskicrashanddie_: or you can use qemu with full device emulation22:05
rm_workjacekowski: ok, still need to also install fmtx-fake?22:05
crashanddie_jacekowski: so through scratchbox?22:05
jacekowskirm_work: no22:05
jacekowskirm_work: depends22:05
crashanddie_jacekowski: link to that nokia remote-n900 thingie?22:05
GAN900Jaffa, no worries, I can handle it tonight.22:06
jacekowskirm_work: if you had to use fmtx-faker before you will have to use it now22:06
DocScrutinizerjacekowski: where are those? last time I checked (~18months ago) the N900 wasn't available22:06
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GAN900Jaffa, I'll take care of publishing if you want to send me a little how-to.22:06
rm_workhrm k22:06
rm_worki already have fmtx-faker installed, can leave it alone?22:06
crashanddie_Jaffa: need help?22:06
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jacekowskiDocScrutinizer: i never used it22:07
jacekowskii'm just repating what i heard here22:07
jacekowskior read on nokia website22:07
jacekowskirm_work: yes22:07
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jacekowskirm_work: if it doesn't work then you will have to reinstall it22:07
DocScrutinizeryeah, it was a funny idea to operate on real devices, with little robot fingers to press keys etc22:07
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SpeedEvilcrashanddie: What sort of things do you want to do on the device?22:08
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javispedroah, they're going to copy the webos2 sgx drivers, not realizing that it's not even the same sgx model!22:09
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crashanddie_SpeedEvil: integrate the MAFW wrapper code that someone provided to MohammadAG with MohammadAG's media player interface22:09
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SpeedEvilcrashanddie: What would you need - just ssh?22:10
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crashanddie_SpeedEvil: nha, VNC as well most likely22:11
Choomhow does someone without an N900 gain interest in writing code for it?22:11
crashanddie_hang on, I found the RDA -- remote device access22:12
javispedroChoom: you usually write for desktop Linux22:12
crashanddie_it provides access to the N90022:12
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Choomyesh, but since you're not personally benefiting from it, what's the point?22:13
Choomwhen I write a piece of software I'm its target audience, and so are my needs its target needs22:14
Choomif it can be useful to others, great, but I'd never write something that I woul not benefit from22:14
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Choomwas just wondering, nothing wrong with it :)22:15
crashanddie_holy shit22:15
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crashanddie_it actually works22:15
crashanddie_I have access to an N900, lol22:15
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SpeedEvilcrashanddie: Woo!22:16
jacekowskicrashanddie_: try to brick it22:16
crashanddie_rm -rf /*22:16
jacekowskii'm just wondering how does it work22:16
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, it's kinda old22:17
ChoomI'd be very careful about providing access to my phone to strangers22:17
crashanddie_MohammadAG: does it work?22:17
javispedroit used to..22:17
* MohammadAG used it in October 09 :P22:17
Choomwith all the sensors in it I wouldn't like to have a backdoor here22:17
MohammadAGmost strings had !! before them22:17
MohammadAGjacekowski, vnc-like thing22:18
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MohammadAGdeveloped by Digia22:18
crashanddie_screen doesn't seem responsive22:18
SpeedEvilchroom for me the issue would be that I'd have to setup segregation and arrange a untrusted interior network partition22:18
MohammadAGcrashanddie, blame your interwebz22:18
jacekowskiMohammadAG: is it running on real phone?22:18
javispedroSpeedEvil: some of the phones actually have real SIMs22:18
MohammadAGalso, install ssh and post an IP22:19
MohammadAGjacekowski, yes22:19
crashanddie_doesn't detect my mouse clicks apparently22:19
MohammadAGjacekowski, go into a 5800 and start the camera22:19
Choomtell MohammadAG to go punch the screen22:19
MohammadAGyou'll see wires22:19
keriocrashanddie_: wait, what?22:21
mececrashanddie_, what are you using?22:21
jacekowskiwhat about older phones22:22
crashanddie_there's a few hundred phones available22:22
MohammadAGmost phones are on there22:22
crashanddie_kerio & mece: RDA22:22
MohammadAG4 N900s afaik22:22
MohammadAG2 N8s22:22
MohammadAG(You need a Forum Nokia account)22:22
mece"The credentials you provided cannot be determined to be authentic."22:23
MohammadAGjacekowski, I shouldn't this here I guess, but oh well22:23
MohammadAGI hacked a 5800 on there once and tested a mod of mine22:23
MohammadAGit resulted in a bootloop22:23
jacekowskiMohammadAG: i don't see anything on 5800 camera22:25
crashanddie_MohammadAG: I'm going to dev on the media player22:25
MohammadAGjacekowski, capture the image22:25
crashanddie_MohammadAG: can you give me a sitrep of what's to do?22:25
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MohammadAGget mafw source working with it22:26
MohammadAGI'm rewriting the FMTX dialog in Qt22:26
MohammadAGcause the current one can't be parented in Qt22:27
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javispedrothat makes no sense, can you elaborate?22:28
MohammadAGosso_exec_cp whatever expects a gpointer22:28
rm_workjacekowski: cool, works, painless, not even a reboot required. thanks :)22:28
MohammadAGif I pass this, it'll obviously fail22:29
MohammadAG(since "this" is a QMainWindow)22:29
MohammadAGactually, it won't fail, it just won't have a parent22:29
MohammadAGmeaning if the player was in portrait mode, it'll flip into landscape mode22:29
javispedro"The GTK top-level widget. It is needed so that the widgets created by the plugin can be made a child of the main application that utilizes the plugin. Type is a gpointer so that the plugin does not need to depend on GTK (in which case it should ignore the parameter). "22:30
* javispedro jiggles22:30
MohammadAGthe rewrite has to be part of the mediaplayer's code too22:31
MohammadAGsince starting any Qt related app in portrait mode causes a segfault22:31
javispedrodo you link with Gtk+ already?22:31
MohammadAGso I can't call it externally22:31
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MohammadAGNot sure what you mean by that, so assume that I don't22:32
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javispedro(reading Qt source)22:33
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javispedrothey probably link with Gtk+ already to get all the Hildon stuff22:33
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crashanddie_MohammadAG: so the Qt simulator wouldn't allow me to test against the GObject code, right?22:34
javispedrowhat I mean is that the MaemoQt calls Hildon stuffs, that means it uses tricks that I guess allow it to get GtkWidgets from QWidgets (probably using externals)22:34
pupnikhildon, we hardly knew ye22:34
javispedro*gdk externals22:34
crashanddie_javispedro: yeah, we'll be talking to MAFW, so we'll have link against GObject stuff22:35
crashanddie_javispedro: so not too far a stretch to link against GtkWidgets22:35
jacekowskiMohammadAG: gps is working there as well22:35
MohammadAGjacekowski, finland :p22:35
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, probably not22:36
jacekowskiyeah i found nokia top secret headquater22:36
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, get your device back22:36
crashanddie_MohammadAG: actually, I might just go hit some kid down the road who bought an N900 a couple months back22:36
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, that... might work too22:36
javispedropoor kid.22:37
javispedro(cause he bought a n900 =) )22:37
DocScrutinizercrashanddie_: I wonder if you can test custom kernels on those devices :-D22:37
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, you can erase the bootloader22:38
MohammadAGdoes that answer your question? :P22:38
javispedroyou can even use it to break their wifis22:38
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javispedrowhen I used it there was a long list of APs :922:38
jacekowskiMohammadAG: have you tried?22:38
MohammadAGjacekowski, I bricked a 580022:39
MohammadAGand that's not an open device22:39
* javispedro curses gitorious22:39
DocScrutinizerso where's the KVM to initialize a coldflash?22:39
JaffaGAN900: Publishing's the easy bit.22:39
Jaffacrashanddie_: Feel free to get stuck in, link sent directly.22:39
MohammadAGNokia's definition of push email, you get all emails as a digest in one push22:39
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, you have 4 devices on it, have fun22:40
DocScrutinizerdoesn't work for me, no way to plug in USB peripherals :-P22:40
DocScrutinizernot even a simple eMMC repartitioning flashing will be feasible22:41
MohammadAGall devices are on charge22:42
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MohammadAGfeel free to stop bme22:42
javispedrowhat do you plan to do? hack those n900 so that when the guy that probably flashes them every night gets to them finds they're now self conscious and debating whether to kill all the employees or just post in TMO?22:43
DocScrutinizerwhat for?22:43
jacekowskijavispedro: well, it doesn't look like it's flashed every night22:43
crashanddie_ok, I have an N90022:43
MohammadAGjavispedro, they're flashed on each update22:43
jacekowskijavispedro: lot of old crap still there22:43
DocScrutinizerWe could demonstrate you can NOT explode the battery XD22:44
* MohammadAG found some java porn apps on a 580022:44
ioananyone knows how to configure Brekeke SIP server to work with N900?22:44
MohammadAGi'm surprised you guys didn't know about RDA22:44
crashanddie_MohammadAG: now how do I setup Qt Creator to run on the device?22:45
javispedrothere was a tmo thread about it even, back before I had my n90022:45
DocScrutinizerI know from a time where there were no N90022:45
javispedroargh ARGH ARGGGGGGGGGGGH22:45
* javispedro watches the qt-maemo guys do horrible hack22:45
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, projects, click the + sign, add maemo, edit the run part22:45
javispedroeven worser than the one I was looking for22:45
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MohammadAGwhere did you get the device crashanddie_ ?22:46
DocScrutinizerok, now that's long enough just coffee. See you22:47
crashanddie_MohammadAG: kid at the end of the street22:47
javispedroMohammadAG: basically, to set "parent" (in Qt language; transient for hint in X11 language) they just create the window then set the transient hint of whatever the active window is22:47
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crashanddie_MohammadAG: it's PR1.2, problem?22:47
javispedroMohammadAG: that is easily replicable but looks so hackish (even to me) than yes, keep on creating the replacement dialog =22:47
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MohammadAGcrashanddie_, what did you do? o_O22:49
MohammadAGand maybe, you might need the old sysroot, which I have no idea where to get22:49
MohammadAGor add the sdk repos and update libqt4-*22:49
crashanddie_old sysroot?22:49
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Venemojavispedro: what replacement dialog?22:51
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javispedrofmtx applet22:51
javispedrofor the qtmediaplayer menu22:51
Venemooh, yeah :)22:52
VenemoX11 transient hint might be a way to go22:52
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, just add the sdk repos to the device and upgrade libqt4*22:53
MohammadAGVenemo, said that works22:53
Venemook MohammadAG :)22:53
MohammadAGjacekowski, any idea in where to get the supported FMTX range?22:54
Venemohm btw jacekowski, is your fmtxd replacement OSS?22:54
jacekowskiVenemo: no22:54
jacekowskiVenemo: it's binary patch of original fmtxd22:54
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jacekowskivery illegal22:54
jacekowskiand breaking couple copyright laws22:54
jacekowskiMohammadAG: you mean frequency range?22:55
Venemojacekowski: how did you manage to do that? :O22:55
styleHi, does anyone know any tricks to make physical keyboard work with bluemaemo in n900?22:55
jacekowskiVenemo: with hex editor22:55
Venemojacekowski: nice :D22:55
jacekowskistyle: get ri of bluemaemo22:55
MohammadAGjacekowski, yeah, the current GUI populates only the range that can be enabled22:55
jacekowskistyle: it has nothing to do with it22:55
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jacekowskiMohammadAG: dbug22:55
* MohammadAG points Venemo to hex and a decompiler22:56
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MohammadAGjacekowski, hmm?22:56
jacekowskiMohammadAG: fmtxd gets that from /sys/somewhere22:56
jacekowskiMohammadAG: but original applet pulls it from fmtxd22:56
stylejacekowski: is there any alternatives then? it works perfectly in other ways22:57
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jacekowskistyle: yes22:57
stylejacekowski: could you say the name of the app? :)22:57
jacekowskistyle: /etc/bluetooth/main.conf22:57
crashanddie_/usr/lib/mad-developer/devrootsh: not found22:57
crashanddie_MohammadAG: seen that before?22:57
jacekowskistyle: and there is a line22:58
jacekowskistyle: DisablePlugins = network,input,hal22:58
jacekowskistyle: remove input from that list22:58
jacekowskistyle: and restart bluetooth services/reboot phone22:58
crashanddie_MohammadAG: I told the kid I wouldn't tell on him smoking to his parents, and gave him a pack of fags22:58
jacekowskistyle: after that keyboard should just work22:58
Venemocrashanddie_: really?22:58
stylejacekowski: cool, but then there is no way to control mouse or is there?22:59
jacekowskistyle: there is if it's bluetooth mouse22:59 I see22:59
jacekowskistyle: but n900 bluetooth support only one connection22:59
stylejacekowski: I mean using n900 touchscreen :/22:59
jacekowskistyle: so it's either keyboard or mouse22:59
jacekowskiMohammadAG: yes22:59
styleye, but in bluemaemo it was nice to switch23:00
jacekowskiMohammadAG: it's somewhere in developer manual23:00
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jacekowskiVenemo: why lol?23:00
jacekowskibtw. does anybody want to give me 3k euro?23:01
MohammadAGcrashanddie, install madde23:01
MohammadAGI could, if you gave me 4k23:01
luke-jrjacekowski: love to, if I had 3k euro to spare23:01
luke-jrjacekowski: get someone to give me 4+k and I'd be glad to23:01
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jacekowskii'm planning to rob a bank23:02
jacekowskii have a plan how to get in23:02
jacekowskii'm not sure about getting out yet23:02
DocScrutinizerme stares at 1300NTD23:02
MohammadAGjacekowski, can I improve the plan?23:03
jacekowskido you have a helicopter?23:03
MohammadAGStep 0: don't talk about it on a logged channel23:03
GAN900Scrollback generating spammers.23:04
jacekowskihmm, last day of holiday tomorrow23:04
javispedrothis, or a #meego-like silence :)23:04
jacekowskiand then i go back to work for 3 days23:05
jacekowskiand then christmas23:05
crashanddie_jacekowski: what do you do?23:05
jacekowskiat the moment23:05
crashanddie_for work, I meant23:05
jacekowskisame thing23:05
jacekowskimost of the day23:05
jacekowskiand when i'm not ircing i'm playing with any devices that have transistors in them23:07
crashanddie_so basically any electronic device produced in the last 30 years23:07
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jacekowskipretty much yes23:07
crashanddie_well, any electric device in the last 20 years23:07
jacekowskiexcept PIC based stuff23:08
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jacekowskii avoid that23:08
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javispedrowho designed the perl grammar?23:10
crashanddie_Larry Wall?23:10
javispedrofscking genius.23:10
javispedroI hope he forced someone else to implement the parser for it.23:11
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crashanddie_MohammadAG: madde, from which repo?23:11
crashanddie_Venemo: yeah23:11
jacekowskicrashanddie_: but i generally do electronic related stuff23:11
jacekowskicrashanddie_: +other things people ask me to23:12
jacekowskibecause apparently i'm only person that knows how every single machine works23:12
RST38hLarry Wall is a linguist, not a programmer23:12
RST38hAnd he has his own ideas about what programming language should look like and do23:13
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crashanddie_well, for a linguist, he did a pretty good job I'd say23:13
RST38hHaving said that, PERL is still ways more useful than Python23:13
crashanddie_RST38h: is then Christiansen who did most of Perl?23:13
* RST38h isn't an expert on christiansens23:14
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MohammadAGcrashanddie, my bad,
BCMMah! finally found a cheap, nasty USB stick that doesn't work with h-e-n23:17
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crashanddie_MohammadAG: didn't need to update Qt23:22
crashanddie_works OOTB23:22
crashanddie_MohammadAG: I'll integrate Nicolai's code now23:22
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DocScrutinizerBCMM: \o/?23:28
BCMMIs there any way I can be useful with it?23:28
DocScrutinizerumm, provide syslog23:28
BCMMdo you mean dmesg or syslog? i don't have a syslog23:29
DocScrutinizertest if it actually doesn't work with any speed, and also if it doesn't start working on replugging it23:29
DocScrutinizerdmesg will probably do23:29
BCMMso you can install a syslogd? does that kill battery life in normal usage?23:30
DocScrutinizernot afaik23:30
DocScrutinizerworks nicely here23:30
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DocScrutinizerThough I'm not really happy with it logging to /var/log/syslog23:30
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil changed the config of his to use eMMC (i.e. ~ iirc)23:31
ioanwhat could be the reason if the sip account on n900 connects, if I call the SIP number the N900 rings, but there is no voice going in any direction?23:31
DocScrutinizerbut that causes syslogd to break on boot and need a sighup later on after mounting that ~ partition23:32
DocScrutinizerioan: usually NAT problems23:32
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DocScrutinizer(log) ...which mostly nullifies one major use of ksyslogd: have a proper non-truncated log of boot23:34
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lardman|homenight all23:37
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_keis there anyone using syncevolution with a n900 device on fedora 14 and got it to work without the "ObexTransprotAgent: Underlying transport error" error?23:47
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* MohammadAG sighs

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