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| DocScrutinizer51 | diaeresis on vkbd IS a composite char | 00:14 |
|---|---|---|
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| DocScrutinizer51 | vkbd-¨ plus u is ü | 00:15 |
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| Jaffa | DocScrutinizer51: All the third row are composed chars. | 00:19 |
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| MohammadAG | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=835098#post835098 | 00:20 |
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| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: can you do a tweaked version. | 00:22 |
| MohammadAG | SpeedEvil, shoot | 00:22 |
| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: which when you open the shutter with the camera facing downward, simply calls flashlight. | 00:22 |
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| SpeedEvil | If it is not facing downwards, it runs the original camera. | 00:23 |
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| MohammadAG | hmm, that'd be a bit tricky, and a nice thing to have im | 00:23 |
| MohammadAG | imo* | 00:23 |
| MohammadAG | afk for a bit though | 00:23 |
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| smhar | I do not when or how it started, but I can not update or install anything in my N900, I always get this error: "Application list partially refreshed. Some catalogs unavailable." | 00:25 |
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| smhar | what is the problem with freenode, I keep getting disconnected every two minutes?!! | 00:34 |
| SpeedEvil | smhar: Works for me. | 00:34 |
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| SpeedEvil | And indeed all of the other 472 people here. | 00:34 |
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| SpeedEvil | Perhaps your problems are linked. | 00:35 |
| SpeedEvil | might you have a proxy of some form, or a firewall in teh way that's getting in the way of outbound connections. | 00:35 |
| smhar | strange, whenever I post my message I get disconnected ! | 00:35 |
| SpeedEvil | A long message? | 00:36 |
| smhar | SpeedEvil, I was not, not sure if my ISP is using a new setup | 00:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Pastebin it? | 00:36 |
| smhar | No, a short one: (((I do not when or how it started, but I can not update or install anything in my N900, I always get this error: "Application list partially refreshed. Some catalogs unavailable."))) | 00:36 |
| SpeedEvil | ummm... | 00:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | I think there is a details tab. | 00:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Click on it | 00:37 |
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| triantares | smhar: try opening a terminal and "sudo apt-get update". That way you'll see which repo's are not responding. | 00:48 |
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| dolp | mmm.. why is el-v1.db created | 00:51 |
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| yacc | Any idea how to make x11vnc handle "symbols" that are available on the N900 keyboard only via "Sym"? | 00:53 |
| yacc | E.g. & | 00:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: sure, that's been an example | 00:57 |
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| crashanddie | if anyone speaks stupid, please translate, I have a hard time understanding: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=834512&postcount=35 | 00:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: I' m convinced man is a thinking species | 00:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: if I give an example, everybody is able to extrapolate and find out about analogies | 00:59 |
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| triantares | crashanddie: there's a dictionary....too bad it's empty. ;) | 01:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer | (<SpeedEvil> If it is not facing downwards,...) great! | 01:00 |
| crashanddie | triantares: I'm sorry? | 01:00 |
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| triantares | crashanddie: I couldn't translate if it killed me . ;) | 01:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: (facing down) need help? | 01:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: actually should be fsckng simple | 01:03 |
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| crashanddie | right | 01:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: just read out current gmeter values fromn sysfs when camera slider open trigger goes off | 01:04 |
| MohammadAG51 | DocScrutinizer, in psudeo code, read accelerometer values from some file in /sys, if values = face down, do this, else, that | 01:05 |
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| MohammadAG51 | now say that in C/C++ :P | 01:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: exactly | 01:05 |
| MohammadAG51 | would be easy in python, but with 256MB ram... | 01:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: c'mon, I'll leave that to reader for exercise :-P | 01:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's really C basics | 01:06 |
| MohammadAG51 | lol | 01:06 |
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| MohammadAG51 | I skipped the basics when i learned the syntax | 01:07 |
| * MohammadAG51 looks at book | 01:07 | |
| MohammadAG51 | hello world | 01:08 |
| MohammadAG51 | 40 pages | 01:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | handle=fopen(path_to_gmeter_sysfsnode, rw); buffer=read(handle); x=sprintf(buffer, somenice%3D) | 01:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | ... | 01:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | I got nfc about C | 01:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lemme rephrase: I need to read K&R just like you need to do | 01:09 |
| MohammadAG51 | why did i google fopen | 01:09 |
| * MohammadAG51 uses man-db | 01:09 | |
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| DocScrutinizer | man fopen | 01:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, exactly | 01:10 |
| MohammadAG51 | yeah | 01:10 |
| MohammadAG51 | am i lagging? | 01:10 |
| MohammadAG51 | xchat says there's 19s lag | 01:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, me | 01:10 |
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| MohammadAG51 | oh | 01:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | brain says there's "TOO MUCH" lag :-D | 01:11 |
| luke-jr_ | DocScrutinizer: pretty sure your code = segfault | 01:11 |
| * MohammadAG51 prepares corrupt image to reflash router | 01:11 | |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: I bet | 01:11 |
| luke-jr_ | actually no, compile error | 01:11 |
| MohammadAG51 | nice, a segfaulting example | 01:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: also you need proper error handling on failing fopen() etc | 01:12 |
| MohammadAG51 | i got that from nokia once | 01:12 |
| luke-jr_ | DocScrutinizer: any quotes around "rw" | 01:12 |
| luke-jr_ | DocScrutinizer: and using fread, not read | 01:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | rw for sure is BS | 01:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes | 01:12 |
| luke-jr_ | and not assigning a buffer to a return value | 01:12 |
| luke-jr_ | and not using sprintf. | 01:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer | toldya it's completely nonsensical | 01:12 |
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| luke-jr_ | sprintf is almost always wrong | 01:13 |
| luke-jr_ | even when someone thinks it's right | 01:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | though, what's wrong with sprintf to dissect a string like "21 443 991" ? | 01:13 |
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| luke-jr_ | sprintf doesn't dissect strings. | 01:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, maybe | 01:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | was a shot from the hip, of a C senile | 01:14 |
| luke-jr_ | scanf perhaps? | 01:14 |
| SpeedEvil | for(x=0;x<10;x++){if(strcmp(sprintf... | 01:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | scanf sounds good, yes | 01:15 |
| luke-jr_ | SpeedEvil: that's wrong for sure | 01:15 |
| nox- | fscanf | 01:15 |
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| crashanddie | MohammadAG51: they took the repository offline | 01:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | i'm assuming this is the sysfile? /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord | 01:15 |
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| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer: CCnile? | 01:15 |
| luke-jr_ | strcmp expects a char* argument | 01:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | crashanddie, good enough for me | 01:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | someone mentioned atoi some days ago :-P | 01:15 |
| luke-jr_ | *printf never return char* | 01:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | nil-e | 01:16 |
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| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG51: yes | 01:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | ehh? repo offline?? | 01:16 |
| Venemo | kerio: ping | 01:16 |
| luke-jr_ | kerio: pin | 01:16 |
| luke-jr_ | g | 01:16 |
| kerio | huh? | 01:16 |
| kerio | pong | 01:17 |
| luke-jr_ | Venemo: pong | 01:17 |
| kerio | wtf did i do | 01:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | pingpong | 01:17 |
| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer: spanish dudes hosting ovi material and gpl-modified binaries without source code | 01:17 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: I know, it was not meant as sensible or even compilable code, but as a silly way to get sprintf to read strings. Sorta | 01:17 |
| * luke-jr_ performs MITM on Venemo and kerio | 01:17 | |
| DocScrutinizer | BURN IN HELL | 01:17 |
| kerio | FEAR NOT! FOR I HAVE SSH! | 01:17 |
| Mousey | >_> | 01:17 |
| * luke-jr_ presents Venemo with a phony key | 01:17 | |
| * MohammadAG51 kicks kerio in the nuts | 01:17 | |
| luke-jr_ | *can he tell teh difference⁇?* | 01:18 |
| * kerio thinks of MITM CPR | 01:18 | |
| DocScrutinizer | who's going to tear down that NAND killer backup-menu?? | 01:18 |
| luke-jr_ | Venemo: SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_5.3 | 01:18 |
| kerio | no, really, what did i do | 01:18 |
| MohammadAG51 | backupmenu is awesome, for stuff it wasn't made for | 01:18 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer: why? we allow n900fly on extras | 01:19 |
| MohammadAG51 | like preboot ssh, it rescued me from a reflash | 01:19 |
| luke-jr_ | lol | 01:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: see QA guidelines | 01:19 |
| kerio | and at least you get to keep your warranty with backupmenu :) | 01:19 |
| kerio | unlike n900fly | 01:19 |
| luke-jr_ | what's it do? | 01:19 |
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| kerio | "it's a software issue! it told me to throw the n900 as high as i could" | 01:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: backup? writes to NAND raw ifaik | 01:20 |
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| luke-jr_ | so? | 01:20 |
| Venemo | kerio: thanks for sharing with me eztv. :) this is all I wanted to say | 01:20 |
| MohammadAG51 | luke-jr_, oh nothing much | 01:20 |
| MohammadAG51 | let's just say it almost bricked my N900 permanently | 01:21 |
| luke-jr_ | fun. | 01:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | NAND has arbitrary bad blocks, writing raw is like dodging bird shot | 01:21 |
| kerio | OMG CALL THE **AA | 01:21 |
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| kerio | *shit | 01:21 |
| MohammadAG51 | i had to boot a modified kernel to boot from the microSD, then ran from ubuntu cat /dev/zero to /dev/mtd5 then used flash_erase | 01:21 |
| MohammadAG51 | then used flasher 6 times, till it worked | 01:21 |
| Venemo | lol | 01:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | what's the proc file for bad mtd blocks again? | 01:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | so again: | 01:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | who's going to tear down that NAND killer backup-menu?? | 01:22 |
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| * MohammadAG51 has it installed | 01:22 | |
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| MohammadAG51 | till someone provides a preboot ssh alternative | 01:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | tbh I don't really get it why it's so nasty. But it seems you can brick (SIC!) your N900 with it easily | 01:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | you'd think NOLO should know how to reformat a NAND and reflash a proper rootfs | 01:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG51: flash_erase probably is one of the tools that knows how to deal with and mark bad blocks in NAND | 01:25 |
| luke-jr_ | … | 01:26 |
| luke-jr_ | NOLO is part of NAND | 01:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: ??? | 01:26 |
| luke-jr_ | if it erases NAND, then it erases NOLO | 01:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: yes, we all know | 01:26 |
| luke-jr_ | and AFAIK, all badblock management is done by the ubi driver | 01:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes | 01:26 |
| MohammadAG51 | i used it on mtd5 | 01:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | though prolly not initial bb-markup on formatting | 01:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | which is the rootfs | 01:27 |
| lcuk | MohammadAG51, since pr1.1 theres a boot time hole on all devices | 01:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: if you hose the mtd which holds NOLO you got a different class of problem | 01:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | lcuk, yep, I know | 01:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | wtf is a boottime hole? | 01:28 |
| lcuk | isnt that the cleanest place to hook a rescue script to? | 01:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: bootmenu? sure | 01:29 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, a script stored on / is run on bootup if it exists and the keyboard is open | 01:29 |
| MohammadAG51 | true, but when dsme kills a device i can't hook a rescue script :) | 01:29 |
| lcuk | most people get into a boot loop | 01:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, but it MUST NOT write to mtd raw physical device | 01:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~2119 | 01:29 |
| infobot | The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in RFC 2119. | 01:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: unlike mmc the mtd NAND raw devices have no layer between system and bad blocks on silicon | 01:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | ubifs is dealing with that | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's why writing raw to mtd fails usually | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | it writes bad block marks to perfectly good blocks, and tries to use bad blocks like they were ok | 01:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | result: borked rootfs | 01:33 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, the issue you are mentioning isn't normally an issue but the rescue script principle itself has been highlighted forever | 01:33 |
| lcuk | isnt the mtd normally only written by flashing tool? | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry? please rephrase | 01:34 |
| lcuk | with its checksums and stuff? | 01:34 |
| MohammadAG51 | lcuk, backupmenu used dd | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | to mtd aiui | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | /dev/mtd? to be precise | 01:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | which sends ubifs out of the door | 01:35 |
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| lcuk | destructive confirmed high risk system halting app on -devel? | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | bricking app even | 01:37 |
| lcuk | and you don't just mean modern bricking I gather? | 01:37 |
| MohammadAG51 | /dev/mtd5 | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | and I know how to use "brick" | 01:37 |
| MohammadAG51 | writing to /dev/mtd would brick | 01:37 |
| MohammadAG51 | writing to mtd5 would semibrick | 01:37 |
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| MohammadAG51 | you just have to use awesome timing and flashing skills :p | 01:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | still I dunno why NOLO, on flashing rootfs, doesn't succeed to just fix the shit | 01:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | but obviously it doesn't, at least not that easily | 01:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | anyway dd if=foo of=/dev/mtd5 is a *BAD* thing, and I'm asking again: | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | who's going to tear down that NAND killer backup-menu?? | 01:40 |
| MohammadAG51 | nobody | 01:41 |
| MohammadAG51 | :P | 01:41 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, send a mail to X-Fade and the council, let it be discussed properly. | 01:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I never used backup-menu and I'm not temped to do in near future, so all I can contribute is mere handwaving | 01:42 |
| lcuk | :) sometimes hand waving is all thats needed. | 01:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, this here is as much handwaving as you'll see from my side | 01:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | obviously there are guys in better position to kick off this thing proper | 01:45 |
| lcuk | <DocScrutinizer> and I know how to use "brick" | 01:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: <DocScrutinizer> still I dunno why NOLO, on flashing rootfs, doesn't succeed to just fix the shit | 01:46 |
| lcuk | ffs, Jaffa if you read this in the morning, please review scrollback | 01:46 |
| lcuk | or X-Fade or any other council peeps | 01:47 |
| lcuk | can you see if there is reason to temporarily revoke this app from repository incase of a coding bug. | 01:47 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer believes its enough of a worry that it may brick brick devices | 01:48 |
| MohammadAG51 | night | 01:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | nigght moh | 01:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I've never looked into backup-menu app, and all my statements here are based on other factoids reported by MohammadAG51 nad others. I'm not feeling like doing a deep inspection if moh's "dd of=/dev/mtd5" is correct (and fatal), nor if any of the other assumptions is according to hard facts | 01:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | but if it rally is doing a dd to raw physical NAND, then there's obviously an issue as NAND has bad blocks that are dealt with in ubifs | 01:54 |
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| ShadowJK | writing to /dev/mtd* like it's a block device is just pure lunacy :/ | 02:04 |
| kerio | hmm... what if you just *read* from it? | 02:04 |
| ShadowJK | that might work | 02:05 |
| ShadowJK | "work" | 02:05 |
| ShadowJK | but it's not a block device, normal block device semantics don't apply | 02:05 |
| kerio | would an hypotetical dd if=/dev/mtd of=file; dd if=file of=/dev/mtd work? | 02:05 |
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| ShadowJK | I wouldn't trust it | 02:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | not always | 02:05 |
| kerio | on the same /dev/mtd of course | 02:05 |
| ShadowJK | The writing might just be a bitwise AND operation | 02:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | it fails as soon as you change device, or your NAND earns a new bad block | 02:06 |
| ShadowJK | because the kernel probably doesn't erase stuff for you, normal block device semantics don't apply | 02:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, that too | 02:06 |
| ShadowJK | There's a kernel module for when you want to treat it as a block device, or when you want to emulate mtd on a block device | 02:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | you need to earse first. That's all ubifs domain | 02:07 |
| ShadowJK | But whether using the block device emulation to do read/write actually results in the same data on the raw mtd is another question.. | 02:07 |
| kerio | ubifs <3 | 02:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer | FFS, writing dd to /dev/mtd is as *WRONG* as it can get, anyway | 02:08 |
| ShadowJK | ubifs also keeps track of erased/partially erased/not erased blocks, and if you write to every one of them in a "restore" operation, they all become non-erased behind ubifs' back | 02:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | and if that's what backup-menu does, then we need to tear it down | 02:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: true, but irrelevant in our case, as backup-menu is supposed to restore a whole rootfs prior to mandatory reboot | 02:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | aiui | 02:10 |
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| luke-jr_ | isn't an erased block just one with all 1s? | 02:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | or 0's | 02:11 |
| ShadowJK | you just dd'd crap to the entire device, even if you've done a read-image write-iamge cycle without anything in between, you've actually changed the state of the device as tracked by the filesystem inside the image | 02:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | depending on silicon technology | 02:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: yes | 02:11 |
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| * luke-jr_ wonders if there's any NAND counter app that just uses a single NAND block to efficiently count a number | 02:12 | |
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| luke-jr_ | eg, counting 11111111, 11111110, 11111100, 11111000, etc | 02:12 |
| asj | wtf is a "single NAND block" you can have a single gate, you can have an fpga cell, but what's a block? and if you mean an fpga cell who's and which version and are you sure it's nand? | 02:19 |
| asj | (and you can't store 8 bits in "a" anything, much less a 7400 ic...) | 02:20 |
| SpeedEvil | The individual bits are implemented as a NAND gate. | 02:21 |
| SpeedEvil | However, you can only erase ~128K at once | 02:21 |
| SpeedEvil | and write only ones. | 02:22 |
| asj | lol I should have read more than what luke-jr said | 02:22 |
| SpeedEvil | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory#NAND_flash | 02:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer | luke-jr_: you can flash 00000001, 00000011, 00000111..., as - like SpeedEvil says - you erase to zero, not to one, afaik | 02:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | in a much larger scale that's what NAND write optimization does (as found in ubifs) | 02:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's just not erasing a whole 128k block for each 512 byte sector write, but remembers which 'sectors' are 'erased' so can be written safely | 02:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ok, confirmed by 2 other guys who know a bit about that: you *can not* flash a raw image to NAND with dd. You need to erase the whole section you want to write before dd, and if there's any new bad block or the image was from completely different NAND hw chip, then you'll fail as well | 03:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer | <roh> ubifs does sw bb handling | 03:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack | 04:39 |
| infobot | :), DocScrutinizer | 04:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ~bark | 04:39 |
| * infobot barks, like a rabid dog. | 04:39 | |
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| DocScrutinizer | ~moo | 04:40 |
| * infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass | 04:40 | |
| DocScrutinizer | *yawn* n8 folks | 04:40 |
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| ebzzry | Hi! What is the default size (in pixels) of the icons in the desktop of Fremantle? | 06:53 |
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| johnx | if no one else has an idea , I think they're in /usr/share/icons/ | 06:55 |
| ebzzry | johnx: OK | 06:55 |
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| ebzzry | johnx: That, I think, doesn't answer the question since there are icons of multitude of sizes in that directory. | 06:56 |
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| johnx | hmm, I guess I was thinking you could view the icon on the device and see if it's the same size as the icons you're interested in | 06:57 |
| ebzzry | johnx: OK. | 06:58 |
| ebzzry | Nevertheless, I think it's 65px | 06:58 |
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| johnx | my guess would be 64px or 48px | 06:58 |
| johnx | 65px just seems a bit "weird" somehow | 06:58 |
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| ebzzry | Hmm. Anyway, what is the "proper" or community-advised way of opening URLs on the command line? | 07:02 |
| ebzzry | Open in the sense that it would load the default web browser | 07:03 |
| johnx | my bet would be dbus send | 07:04 |
| ebzzry | Is it documented somewhere? Are you referring to the one at http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control | 07:05 |
| johnx | that looks like a good reference :) | 07:06 |
| pupnik | so nice their terminal app launches urls now | 07:07 |
| johnx | if we had xdg-open like on a linux desktop, I think you might be able to use that, but since we don't have it the right answer is probably dbus-send | 07:07 |
| johnx | that gives people who want a different browser a chance to intercept it with browser-switchboard (or whatever it's called) and run their own browser when you send that dbus message | 07:07 |
| johnx | anyways, taking an early night | 07:08 |
| johnx | 'night all | 07:08 |
| pupnik | cy | 07:08 |
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| delt | Hello | 07:46 |
| delt | n810: successfully using the internal 2GB flash as root partition!! (and the 256mb as backup) | 07:46 |
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| delt | thanks to pb/pbeasy scripts by uh... pb =) | 07:50 |
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| slonopotamus | so... do we have working howto for uboot on n8x0? | 07:58 |
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| delt | slonopotamus: you're extinct since the cretaceous period. You're almost as obsolete as the N770 | 08:00 |
| slonopotamus | ... | 08:01 |
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| delt | uh.... hello bye welcomeback | 08:02 |
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| slonopotamus | swc|666: if we were on ##c, you would've been already autobanned for join flood. | 08:03 |
| * swc|666 shrugs | 08:03 | |
| delt | questions abot the boot loader: grey screen, black (pixelized) text BOOT MENU ... this is "nolo" right? | 08:03 |
| delt | s/abot/about/ | 08:03 |
| infobot | delt meant: questions about the boot loader: grey screen, black (pixelized) text BOOT MENU ... this is "nolo" right? | 08:03 |
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| delt | as in "nokia loader"? | 08:04 |
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| slonopotamus | wash your screen, that aint grey, it's white | 08:06 |
| delt | just before saying "BOOT MENU" it flashes something about holding the "menu" key for advanced boot menu. The menu key is the thick line with a bunch of thin, shorter lines below it, right? | 08:06 |
| delt | 4 shorter and thinner lines to be more exact | 08:07 |
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| slonopotamus_ | delt: like this? http://labs.vivi.eng.br/blog/images/dualbootmenuonN800-small.jpg | 08:08 |
| slonopotamus_ | it is (surprise!) bootmenu | 08:08 |
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| delt | something like that, yes, but with different boot partition names... + at the bottom (under Press UP/DOWN) it also says: "Press HOME key for USB network recovery mode" (even when usb is not connected) | 08:10 |
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| slonopotamus | that's bootmenu (shell hackish thing installable to initfs that allows to choose what partition to boot from + some nice features) | 08:12 |
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| delt | ah ok. thanks for that info =) | 08:14 |
| delt | btw sorry about the obsolete/dinosaur thing, was jk | 08:14 |
| slonopotamus | delt: np. living since cretaceous period allowed learning lots of stuff | 08:16 |
| delt | okie, so now that i have this boot menu, my first question (apart from holding menu key does nothing) .... how do i put the N810 in "USB mode" (which was previously done with holding the "home" key (2 overlapping squares on the n810) during boot | 08:16 |
| delt | hehe =) wisdom in person | 08:17 |
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| delt | oh, s/during boot/during boot with the USB cord plugged/ | 08:17 |
| delt | uh..... | 08:17 |
| delt | s/during boot/during boot with the USB cord plugged/ | 08:17 |
| delt | you/get/the/idea/ | 08:18 |
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| slonopotamus | that "hold menu thing" is needed because you could setup the thing to automatically boot from some partition _without_ showing boot choices _unless_ some activity from you (holding menu key) | 08:20 |
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| delt | oh, aforementioned "home key" thing puts up a telnet server with fixed address 192.168.10.1 ...... i'm looking for the normal "usb mode" with the nokia logo and the blue USB logo in the upper right corner | 08:20 |
| luke-jr_ | that's not a mode | 08:21 |
| luke-jr_ | it's the bootloader | 08:21 |
| slonopotamus | think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing ib 3 seconds" | 08:21 |
| slonopotamus | s/ ib / in / | 08:21 |
| delt | slonopotamus: that was my other question =) how do i change the delay before it auto-selects which partition to boot? | 08:21 |
| infobot | slonopotamus meant: think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing in 3 seconds" | 08:21 |
| delt | .... or turns off, which i noticed it does after a few minutes, which is cool so it won't hang there until the screen is burned | 08:22 |
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| delt | re | 08:22 |
| delt | did you get: 01:23 < delt> .... or turns off, which i noticed it does after a few minutes, which is cool so it won't hang there until the screen is burned | 08:22 |
| slonopotamus | meh, network issues | 08:22 |
| slonopotamus | that "hold menu thing" is needed because you could setup the thing to automatically boot from some partition _without_ showing boot choices _unless_ some activity from you (holding menu key) | 08:23 |
| slonopotamus | think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing in 3 seconds" | 08:23 |
| delt | ah, that was the last 2 lines you wrote before getting flushed =) | 08:23 |
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| delt | personally im more familiar with lilo | 08:23 |
| delt | than grub... | 08:23 |
| slonopotamus | strange | 08:23 |
| slonopotamus | and "usb mode"... actually i have no idea wtf it is :) | 08:23 |
| delt | so, shift or ctrl in lilo when the delay is set to zero, right? | 08:23 |
| luke-jr_ | LILO has been obsolete for years | 08:25 |
| luke-jr_ | :p | 08:25 |
| slonopotamus | or windoze F8 | 08:25 |
| delt | before changing boot stuff, connecting to the PC's usb port and holding "home" (2 squares in diagonal) would show the white screen w/ a blue nokia logo and a blue-grayish usb icon on the top right corner | 08:25 |
| delt | s/"home"/"home" while turning on the n810/ | 08:26 |
| infobot | delt meant: before changing boot stuff, connecting to the PC's usb port and holding "home" while turning on the n810 (2 squares in diagonal) would show the white screen w/ a blue nokia logo and a blue-grayish usb icon on the top right corner | 08:26 |
| delt | thanks, bot | 08:26 |
| slonopotamus | delt: _maybe_ that launches usb recovery mode (usb networking is set up on tablet and ssh damon is started so you can connect from pc and do some hackery if you broke os boot) | 08:27 |
| delt | or, any other way to access the 2GB internal flash over usb? | 08:27 |
| delt | slonopotamus: telnet here, but i read some versions/impl/options/whatever have a ssh server... | 08:28 |
| delt | and yeah, puts itself in usb-network with address 192.168.10.1 | 08:28 |
| delt | tcp/usb/ip heh. | 08:28 |
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| delt | luke-jr_: so lilo no longer works with my mobo and hdd partitions? =) (i don't remember buying that stuff from microsoft) | 08:30 |
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| luke-jr_ | delt: shrug | 08:30 |
| luke-jr_ | that's like asking if DOS runs on them | 08:30 |
| luke-jr_ | it might, but that doesn't make it any less obsolete | 08:30 |
| slonopotamus | or telnet. doesn't matter, some remote access thingie | 08:30 |
| delt | lilo works fine for me, just like it has for the past 15 years or so | 08:31 |
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| delt | slonopotamus: yeah.... the other week my n810 was bricked, had to reflash it (kept rebooting at the white nokia screen) | 08:32 |
| delt | only thing i could do is plug the USB and press "home" (2 squares overlapping in diagonal)... that made at least the internal 2gb accessible as usb storage device | 08:33 |
| delt | s/is/was/ | 08:33 |
| infobot | delt meant: only thing i could do was plug the USB and press "home" (2 squares overlapping in diagonal)... that made at least the internal 2gb accessible as usb storage device | 08:33 |
| delt | thanks again, smart bot -) | 08:34 |
| slonopotamus | usb network recovery is intended for cases when you know what exactly broke and can fix it but need access to rootfs contents for that | 08:34 |
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| delt | slonopotamus: ie. the thing where i press home on the BOOT MENU, that starts up a telnet server? | 08:35 |
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| slonopotamus | you just said yourself that it starts up usb network | 08:36 |
| slonopotamus | no point starting usb network if nothing is listening :P | 08:36 |
| delt | yes, tcp/ip over some weird "usb network" thing... then starts a telnet (or apparently ssh) server over that | 08:37 |
| delt | i just want the 2GB internal flash to be accessible to the PC as a storage device. | 08:37 |
| slonopotamus | it's just "tcp/ip over usb" | 08:37 |
| slonopotamus | afaik, undoable while os is running because it can't unmount it | 08:38 |
| delt | with the unmodified boot sequence, this was done simply by holding "home" and turning on the n810, while plugged to usb | 08:38 |
| delt | white screen with a blue nokia logo, and blue usb thing in the upper right corner. | 08:39 |
| delt | i know (or strongly suspect) that functionality is independent of whatever content of whatever flash/memory/whatever, internal or not | 08:39 |
| luke-jr_ | "weird" usb network? | 08:39 |
| slonopotamus | just setup sshd/samba/whatever in maemo and access _any_ partition over network | 08:40 |
| delt | luke-jr_: see slonopotamus's reply =) | 08:40 |
| luke-jr_ | delt: my point is that it's pretty standard | 08:40 |
| slonopotamus | delt: you said "weird", not me | 08:41 |
| delt | ah. havent been keeping up lately | 08:41 |
| luke-jr_ | delt: it's been standard for about 6+ years now | 08:41 |
| delt | indeed i did.... and by "lately" well.... thats relative :/ (health issues) | 08:41 |
| slonopotamus | :/ | 08:42 |
| slonopotamus | time travel troubles? | 08:43 |
| delt | just the other day a very good friend of mine told someone (about me) "this guy's a computer expert" or something.... i heard it and said "yeah, i was 10-15 years ago" | 08:43 |
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| slonopotamus_ | slonopotamus: ... | 08:46 |
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| delt | so, back to topic.... you know what i mean by "normal usb mode", ie. white "nokia" screen, blue USB logo in the upper right corner? | 08:46 |
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| slonopotamus | let's assume yes :) | 08:47 |
| luke-jr_ | I think so | 08:47 |
| luke-jr_ | AFAIK the only way to make that remain is flasher | 08:47 |
| delt | and internal 2gb showing up over USB as a storage device | 08:47 |
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| slonopotamus | agreed | 08:48 |
| luke-jr_ | possible, but I doubt anyone has noticed it | 08:48 |
| delt | heh i did =) | 08:48 |
| delt | i luv my little logger thing at the bottom of the screen :D | 08:49 |
| luke-jr_ | I've noticed lately that my N900 has at times shown up as Mass Storage even though I never tell it to | 08:49 |
| luke-jr_ | might be during boot | 08:49 |
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| delt | ok.... next possibility is to boot from the 256MB jffs2, which would normally let the 2GB memory (and all partitions on it) show up over USB? | 08:55 |
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| Pillum | hey | 08:55 |
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| Pillum | whats up with talk.maemo.org? | 08:56 |
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| luke-jr_ | Pillum: outrage ensued so Nokia shut it down permanently | 08:57 |
| luke-jr_ | the rest of maemo.org to follow since Maemo is dead | 08:57 |
| luke-jr_ | (no, not really) | 08:57 |
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| Pillum | :/ | 08:58 |
| Pillum | someone got a link to the latest EFF script? | 08:59 |
| luke-jr_ | Pillum: general practice here it to read TMO once a month | 08:59 |
| delt | right now, just booted from the 256MB jffs2, nothing on the n810 accessing any partition on the internal 2GB flash. i should normally be able to access it over USB? | 08:59 |
| luke-jr_ | delt: srsly, just buy a cheap USB drive… | 09:00 |
| delt | uh.... what for? | 09:00 |
| luke-jr_ | sounds like that's what you want | 09:01 |
| delt | umm no, i want to be able to access this linux (ext2) partition from the PC and fix it if some shit like 2 weeks ago ever happens again | 09:01 |
| delt | s/ext2/ext3/ | 09:02 |
| infobot | delt meant: umm no, i want to be able to access this linux (ext3) partition from the PC and fix it if some shit like 2 weeks ago ever happens again | 09:02 |
| delt | sorry | 09:02 |
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| luke-jr_ | s/ext3/ext2 | 09:03 |
| luke-jr_ | delt: so use flasher to lock the NOLO USB mode | 09:03 |
| delt | lock...? | 09:04 |
| luke-jr_ | yeah, unless you specify -b it leaves it in USB mode | 09:04 |
| luke-jr_ | so just do --get-rd-flags or smth | 09:04 |
| delt | yeah, i suspect bootmenu must pass some commandline args to the kernel (root=/dev/blah....?) | 09:05 |
| luke-jr_ | … | 09:06 |
| luke-jr_ | no | 09:06 |
| luke-jr_ | kernel runs bootmenu. not the other way. | 09:06 |
| luke-jr_ | bootmenu is just a bash script | 09:06 |
| luke-jr_ | the NOKIA logo and stuff before bootmenu is the real bootloader | 09:06 |
| luke-jr_ | but it's closed source and irreplacable | 09:07 |
| delt | ie. "nolo"? | 09:07 |
| luke-jr_ | yes | 09:07 |
| delt | so, "bootmenu.sh" is somewhere on the root filesystem or on an initrd image, then? | 09:08 |
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| luke-jr_ | N8x0 has an initrd partition | 09:08 |
| luke-jr_ | N900 just has it in the rootfs | 09:08 |
| delt | the 256mb one? | 09:08 |
| luke-jr_ | the 256 MB NAND has many partitions | 09:08 |
| delt | ok.... the main one (largest) being what is normally the rootfs | 09:09 |
| luke-jr_ | right | 09:09 |
| luke-jr_ | initfs is another one | 09:09 |
| delt | ah ok.... | 09:09 |
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| delt | so normally there is NO way to mount these as USB storage from a PC right? | 09:10 |
| luke-jr_ | nope, they're not block devices | 09:10 |
| luke-jr_ | USB storage is for block devices | 09:10 |
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| luke-jr_ | for contrast: | 09:11 |
| delt | ok..... so, when you boot with the 255.9999mb jffs partition as root, the 2gb internal chip is normally accessible through usb right? | 09:11 |
| luke-jr_ | block dev = read, write; bad block = defective | 09:11 |
| luke-jr_ | mtd dev = read, erase, write; bad block = normal | 09:12 |
| luke-jr_ | no idea. | 09:12 |
| luke-jr_ | haven't used Maemo on N8x0 in ages | 09:12 |
| delt | ok.... last question: how do i change the delay bootmenu waits before booting its default partition? | 09:13 |
| Pillum | someone got a link to the latest EFF script? | 09:13 |
| delt | im pretty sure i selected "1 second" in pb/pbeasy scripts, but now it just stays there for several minutes | 09:14 |
| delt | (if i dont touch anything) | 09:14 |
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| delt | you mentioned the kernel runs this.... someone told me that before on this channel, which i didn't (and still don't) understand...... | 09:15 |
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| delt | so if / isn't mounted yet (we are choosing WHAT to use as / )..... | 09:15 |
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| rmrfchik | ahaha.. just read (in russian) "while nokia developed n8, samsung anounces galaxy, sold 5'000'000 units and abandoned it | 09:17 |
| rmrfchik | " | 09:17 |
| rmrfchik | ;) | 09:17 |
| mece | are they unhappy about the lack of 2.2? | 09:17 |
| TheJ | hi. is talk.maemo.org down? i cant seem to connect.. | 09:18 |
| xkr47 | heh | 09:18 |
| Pillum | yay http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwDAIUyVP7g | 09:18 |
| Pillum | TheJ: it seems so, was looking for it too :/ | 09:18 |
| TheJ | ok. thanks :) so it wasnt just me :) | 09:19 |
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| luke-jr_ | delt: initfs is of course / until a real rootfs is chosen | 09:22 |
| delt | luke-jr_: ok, makes sense (so far) :3 | 09:27 |
| delt | tired need sleep | 09:27 |
| delt | be back sometime tomorrow | 09:27 |
| delt | once again, thanks for all the help & useful info everyone | 09:27 |
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| crashanddie | tmo down? | 10:22 |
| CreamyG | yes | 10:22 |
| crashanddie | yipee | 10:22 |
| CreamyG | yeah, just saved you 20 minutes | 10:22 |
| crashanddie | 20 minutes? MY WHOLE LIFE YOU MEAN! I am freeeeeeeeeee, FREEEEEEEEEEEE I TELL YOU | 10:23 |
| CreamyG | haha there's like a million other things to waste my time on | 10:23 |
| CreamyG | stupid internet | 10:23 |
| opdf2 | TheJ: yes cant reached either | 10:24 |
| Pillum | talk.maemo.org is online again...... | 10:25 |
| CreamyG | WHAT | 10:25 |
| Pillum | .......NOT | 10:25 |
| CreamyG | nooooooooooooooooooooooooo | 10:25 |
| Pillum | xD | 10:25 |
| CreamyG | i refuse to test | 10:25 |
| crashanddie | CreamyG, you don't have to: http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/ | 10:26 |
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| CreamyG | no i refuse to go there if its working | 10:26 |
| CreamyG | its like 1:30am | 10:26 |
| Pillum | lol :D | 10:26 |
| CreamyG | and i gotta work at 9am | 10:26 |
| CreamyG | so.... | 10:26 |
| Pillum | but why isnt it online= | 10:27 |
| Pillum | ? | 10:27 |
| Pillum | there was no warning or something like that | 10:27 |
| CreamyG | no idea, probably malfunction | 10:27 |
| Pillum | maybe nokia had no money to pay the server :/ | 10:27 |
| crashanddie | Yeah right | 10:28 |
| crashanddie | you do realise that most big companies run on massive credit lines, yeah? | 10:28 |
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| CreamyG | yeah big companies don't need money | 10:29 |
| CreamyG | just like the government | 10:29 |
| TermanaN900 | You do realise Nokia is worth more than you'll ever earn as well right? | 10:29 |
| TermanaN900 | You'll go bankrupt before Nokia | 10:29 |
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| CreamyG | hmmm i dunno, with the right patents, i could be worth more | 10:29 |
| Pillum | man you wouldnt recognise irony even if it would holding a sign reading "I am irony" | 10:30 |
| Pillum | :/ | 10:30 |
| Pillum | y'all suck | 10:30 |
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| TermanaN900 | I have been called much worse things than being told I suck, so. | 10:31 |
| Pillum | TermanaN900: where are u from? | 10:32 |
| crashanddie | TermanaN900, how terribly insulting, maybe I make $1790410 every day! | 10:32 |
| RST38h | Heya derf, all | 10:32 |
| crashanddie | TermanaN900, which, after 60 years, would make my net earnings around the same as Nokia's income. | 10:32 |
| crashanddie | err, s/income/worth/ | 10:32 |
| TermanaN900 | crashanddie, lol | 10:33 |
| TermanaN900 | morning RST38h | 10:33 |
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| CreamyG | well i'm going to bed, gnight :P | 10:36 |
| Pillum | gnight sweety | 10:36 |
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| achipa | why isn't the topic "yes, talk is dead, don't ask" ? | 10:44 |
| RST38h | because nobody cares? | 10:45 |
| achipa | touche | 10:45 |
| ieatlint | omg, talk is dead | 10:45 |
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| tybollt | OMG OMG OMG where can we troll now? :'( | 10:51 |
| Stskeeps | why is it dead? | 10:52 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:52 |
| tybollt | Stskeeps: the evil meego (hello!) people shut it down? | 10:52 |
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| Stskeeps | tybollt: i'm not evil :( | 10:53 |
| tybollt | which btw _is_ an interesting topic - seeing as things are what they are how long will nokia support maemo community? At some point they'll go all in Meego - right? | 10:53 |
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| Stskeeps | forum.meego.com is down too, fwiw | 10:54 |
| tybollt | heh ok. | 10:54 |
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| tybollt | Stskeeps: suppose you don't care to make a prediction, then? | 10:54 |
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| Stskeeps | tybollt: there's some chatter somewhere about the topic | 10:54 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:55 |
| kerio | nokia releases binary blobs for meego on n900, we all move to meego | 10:55 |
| kerio | "community edition" | 10:55 |
| Scelt | kerio: url? | 10:55 |
| kerio | it was just a hunch | 10:55 |
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| Scelt | :( | 10:55 |
| Scelt | no hunches here, only pure facts | 10:55 |
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| Stskeeps | kerio: we did already | 10:56 |
| tybollt | to some extent - meego may not be all binary blawbs | 10:56 |
| tybollt | that's what gpl is for | 10:56 |
| kerio | i'm not talking about harmattan + meegohandset | 10:56 |
| kerio | i'm talking meego | 10:56 |
| kerio | and all that rpm shit | 10:56 |
| tybollt | kerio: ? There will be a harmattan? | 10:56 |
| tybollt | wasn't that going to be essentially meego? Man I'm outdated... | 10:57 |
| kerio | there will be a harmattan, it'll probably have the meego ui | 10:58 |
| kerio | but it will be maemo, internally | 10:59 |
| kerio | ~messybox | 10:59 |
| infobot | messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils | 10:59 |
| ieatlint | i'm somehow expecting nokia to actually make a real (ie forceful) push for the maemo community to integrate into meego, and expecting a lot of sore feelings out of it | 11:02 |
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| kerio | is meego better than maemo, except for rpm? | 11:03 |
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| ieatlint | from what i've seen, i'd say that it can be better | 11:03 |
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| kerio | does it use pulseaudio? | 11:04 |
| ieatlint | the libmeegotouch solves a lot of bs, the UI itself seems more polished, and with an actual standard to guarantee what libs be present on the system, it's going to be better in theory | 11:05 |
| ieatlint | yeah, pulseaudio is still there :( | 11:05 |
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| ieatlint | but then, what can it be realistically replaced with? | 11:05 |
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| ieatlint | i've had the misfortune of dealing with the pulseaudio api, and i know exactly how ugly it is.. but it does get the job done with the least system resources | 11:06 |
| kerio | least system resources? | 11:06 |
| kerio | wtf am i reading | 11:06 |
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| ieatlint | versus other servers? unless you wanted to just run alsa with dmix :P | 11:06 |
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| flexxxv | hy, talk.maemo.org down? | 11:07 |
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| ieatlint | flexxxv: yes, and there's nothing but rumour as to why | 11:08 |
| flexxxv | ok thx. Just wanted to find out how to use wpa2 enterprise... | 11:09 |
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| crashanddie | Talk is up again | 11:18 |
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| maybeWTF | but for how long! | 11:21 |
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| ieatlint | i get a db error when i load it | 11:26 |
| ieatlint | "MySQL Error : Error writing file '/tmp/MYMjJjGj' (Errcode: 28)" | 11:26 |
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| ieatlint | haha, that means it's out of disk space | 11:28 |
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| mece | "Bondage Stories is now following you on Twitter!" <- I'm doing something right :D | 11:49 |
| crashanddie | ~grab mece | 11:50 |
| crashanddie | Crap, infobot, you need some features enhancements | 11:50 |
| mece | hahaha | 11:50 |
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| jacekowski | is there mono on n900? | 12:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | the mic is mono. | 12:34 |
| T-Co | :D | 12:34 |
| T-Co | I'm sure there is no mono on N900, but there might be mono for N900. | 12:35 |
| T-Co | (except for the mic) | 12:35 |
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| ieatlint | can mono even be compiled on arm? | 12:43 |
| jacekowski | yep | 12:43 |
| jacekowski | there is mono for n810 | 12:43 |
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| jacekowski | but no info about n900 | 12:44 |
| ieatlint | huh, interesting | 12:44 |
| ieatlint | well, it's not standard i'm sure | 12:44 |
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| jacekowski | http://www.mono-project.com/Maemo | 12:44 |
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| ieatlint | heh, i get a 403 when i try to hit the referenced http://go-mono.com/maemo/ url | 12:45 |
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| jacekowski | directory listing is probably forbidden | 12:46 |
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| ieatlint | ah, indeed | 12:48 |
| ieatlint | well, there is no fremantle dir just the same | 12:48 |
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| ieatlint | might be a deb floating around, or there are instructions there on how to compile | 12:49 |
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| RST38h | thp: Around? | 13:10 |
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| thp | RST38h: indeed | 13:14 |
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| Carneque | Hey all, can I write and compile C programs on N900? | 13:15 |
| flux | I guess in principle you could install the same tools used in scratchbox to N900? | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil | I have gcc on mine | 13:18 |
| SpeedEvil | though in a chroot | 13:18 |
| SpeedEvil | It can be installed on / - but that uses most of the free space | 13:18 |
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| Carneque | ah okay, thats another question, why is the application space so limited compared to the overall space? | 13:19 |
| SpeedEvil | because the root device is 256M - this is one limit | 13:19 |
| SpeedEvil | the other limit is due to the fact that the main part of the space must be VFAT to enable it to plug into things | 13:20 |
| SpeedEvil | From a consumer POV anyway | 13:20 |
| Carneque | so it's a power specification thing | 13:20 |
| SpeedEvil | ? | 13:20 |
| SpeedEvil | no - nothing to do with power | 13:20 |
| Carneque | VFAT to plug into things | 13:20 |
| Carneque | plug into power things? | 13:21 |
| SpeedEvil | no | 13:21 |
| Carneque | oh | 13:21 |
| SpeedEvil | printers to read and print photos, windows computers to drag on/off files | 13:21 |
| SpeedEvil | ... | 13:21 |
| Carneque | oh the usb thing | 13:21 |
| Carneque | okay cool | 13:21 |
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| TermanaDesire | Please don't write nor compile C code if you don't understand what SpeedEvil is talking about | 13:23 |
| Carneque | if you mean on the N900 you're protecting me from screwing things up, if you're talking about in general you're being not nice | 13:26 |
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| jacekowski | so? | 13:26 |
| Carneque | so thanks or no thanks? | 13:26 |
| jacekowski | you have no idea what are we talking about | 13:26 |
| jacekowski | and you want to write programs | 13:26 |
| Carneque | and what were you talking about? | 13:26 |
| Carneque | the only think I read you say was so | 13:27 |
| Carneque | goodbye | 13:27 |
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| Myrtti | ragequits </3 | 13:27 |
| jacekowski | and don't come back | 13:27 |
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| TermanaDesire | :p | 13:28 |
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| Pillum | u bad people :/ | 13:32 |
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| TermanaDesire | 2 down a whole forum to go | 13:32 |
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| TermanaDesire | Besides I did say please | 13:36 |
| TermanaDesire | :p | 13:36 |
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| tybollt | Myrtti: you emoquit! | 13:48 |
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| sivang | re all | 13:48 |
| tybollt | hmm | 13:49 |
| tybollt | is operators blockign SIP common practice? | 13:50 |
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| sivang | tybollt: some of them do, I heard | 13:52 |
| Robot101 | tybollt: vodafone in the uk do | 13:53 |
| jpinx-eeepc | tybollt: different providers block different things, here I can only use http and the phone | 13:56 |
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| ieatlint | that's unfortunate | 13:58 |
| ieatlint | my provider doesn't block it, but somehow i'll bet money they forbid it in their terms of service | 13:59 |
| jpinx-eeepc | ieatlint: I can do irc in feeenode on 8000 sometimes ;) | 13:59 |
| ieatlint | can you do 22? | 14:00 |
| cehteh | just change provider if they dont provide the service you need | 14:00 |
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| ieatlint | heh, not always an option | 14:00 |
| jpinx-eeepc | ieatlint: nope | 14:00 |
| jpinx-eeepc | no-one else here with coverage | 14:00 |
| ieatlint | jpinx-eeepc: that's pretty shitty | 14:00 |
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| jpinx-eeepc | cehteh: check my whois... | 14:01 |
| ieatlint | yeah, here i have my choice between just two carriers, and one of the two has an incompatible 3g network... so i have 1 choice if i want 3g | 14:01 |
| jpinx-eeepc | I gave up with 3g - it's just gprs here | 14:02 |
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| ieatlint | edge i hope | 14:02 |
| ieatlint | gprs is too painful... | 14:02 |
| jpinx-eeepc | I can possibly get 3g in the capitol, but not around the country | 14:02 |
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| ieatlint | my carrier claims there is 3g roaming there on "true move", but isn't clear on its map where it's 2g and where it's 3g | 14:06 |
| alterego | Hope PR1.3 comes with Qt Mobility 1.1 | 14:07 |
| RST38h | thp: Sorry for delay, got an idea | 14:08 |
| RST38h | thp: As you are hackinghildon-desktop anyway, would you consider adding launcher icons rotation by 90 degrees when in portrait orientation? | 14:08 |
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| RST38h | thp: (notice that it is not the full portrait mode, just rotated icons) | 14:09 |
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| RST38h | And there is a clear spot in the source code where this can be added | 14:09 |
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| tybollt | how do you guys solve the OTA contacts sync problem w/ your N900? | 14:13 |
| maybeWTF | by not having any contacts | 14:14 |
| * maybeWTF runs & hides | 14:14 | |
| alterego | tybollt: what issue? | 14:14 |
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| alterego | tybollt: got a link to a bug or something | 14:16 |
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| bigbrovar | hi guys, anyone having issues login to yahoo IM via conversation with the telepathy haze plugin? | 14:20 |
| bigbrovar | on the N900 of cause :p | 14:21 |
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| alterego | Might write a share via ssh service plugin, would be cool for uploading to webspace etc. | 14:24 |
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| ieatlint | alterego: i've heard others ask for a script based plugin for that ... for instance, you just have it execute a user-defined script with the files being the arguments | 14:26 |
| ieatlint | an scp script would be an easy feat, and the plugin could be more versatile .. just an idea :P | 14:27 |
| ieatlint | or i could finally get off my ass and implement that myself, heh | 14:27 |
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| alterego | Yeah, not a bad idea, might be even better to write a python based sharing plugin api | 14:28 |
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| alterego | More flexible and you can have full access to progress etc. | 14:29 |
| ieatlint | not a bad idea | 14:29 |
| alterego | Would be a nice sunday project | 14:30 |
| ieatlint | if you could find a way to work in a password prompt, it'd be even cooler | 14:30 |
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| ieatlint | might be able to throw up a modal dialogue without completely changing focus | 14:30 |
| ieatlint | hrm, i'm suddenly getting a rush of ideas, perhaps i should get off my ass and try to do something like this | 14:31 |
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| vkvraju | hi all, | 14:39 |
| vkvraju | anyone from France here? | 14:39 |
| vkvraju | need some local related info | 14:39 |
| vkvraju | can someone help me in that | 14:40 |
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| vkvraju | Khertan was the one from France here and now he isn't logged in | 14:41 |
| vkvraju | ~seen Khertan | 14:41 |
| infobot | khertan <507da5b5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.80.125.165.181> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 5d 18h 27m 38s ago, saying: 'RST38h, but yes it s possible has we have many electricals problem on the electrical network many out of power every day. And when i start electrical device i can see light blinking'. | 14:41 |
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| * timeless_mbp reaches 11 days ago! | 14:51 | |
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| mece1 | vkvraju, crashanddie is french I believe. | 14:53 |
| vkvraju | Oh ok, Thanks mecel | 14:54 |
| vkvraju | but looks like he is inactive now | 14:54 |
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| vkvraju | ~seen crashanddie | 14:54 |
| infobot | crashanddie is currently on #maemo (4h 58m 37s). Has said a total of 12 messages. Is idling for 3h 4m 2s, last said: 'Crap, infobot, you need some features enhancements'. | 14:54 |
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| alterego | All time low for tracker, seems to have indexed some images in my browser cache .. | 14:57 |
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| timeless_mbp | alterego: nice | 14:57 |
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| thp | RST38h: so just rotating each icon by 90 degrees, keeping their position? | 15:04 |
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| RST38h | thp: yep | 15:05 |
| RST38h | thp: it is basically one clutter call in the right place | 15:05 |
| n900-space | hi rooomies | 15:05 |
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| alterego | RST38h: neat | 15:06 |
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| timeless_xchat | hrm | 15:55 |
| timeless_xchat | "software updaed" or "update complete"? | 15:55 |
| timeless_xchat | s/ae/ate/ | 15:55 |
| infobot | timeless_xchat meant: "software updated" or "update complete"? | 15:55 |
| kerio | is the update complete? | 15:56 |
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| timeless_xchat | probably | 15:57 |
| kerio | the user may find upgrades for things that he wouldn't immediately recognize as software | 15:57 |
| merlin1991 | overkill software successfully updated! ;) | 15:57 |
| timeless_xchat | kerio : yeah | 15:57 |
| kerio | "update completed" tells the user that *something* has been updated | 15:57 |
| timeless_xchat | that's why i'm considering switching | 15:57 |
| timeless_xchat | since you understand, i think i will | 15:57 |
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| kerio | bonus points if you use a voice synthesizer to read it to the user | 15:58 |
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| timeless_xchat | ... | 15:58 |
| kerio | in a really robotic voice | 15:58 |
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| timeless_xchat | this is ham | 15:58 |
| kerio | good point, it's already bloated and slow enough | 15:58 |
| kerio | without adding the overhead of the synth *and* of pulseaudio | 15:58 |
| timeless_xchat | i'm not changing software | 15:58 |
| timeless_xchat | this update would fit into "update complete" but arguably not "software updated" | 15:59 |
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| * timeless_xchat eyes centos, linux | 16:00 | |
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| thp | RST38h: why not try it yourself? ;) | 16:00 |
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| Stskeeps | thp: thanks for the publicity btw :) | 16:01 |
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| thp | Stskeeps: np. thanks for the packages ;) | 16:01 |
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| timeless_xchat | woohoo | 16:03 |
| timeless_xchat | in a minute, i'll no longer need to take my passport with me to the bank | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | getting a citizens card? | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:04 |
| timeless_xchat | national id | 16:04 |
| sx0n | http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n8_vs_samsung_pixon12_vs_sony_dsc_hx5v-review-519.php | 16:04 |
| * SpeedEvil forgets where timeless is. | 16:04 | |
| SpeedEvil | .nl? | 16:04 |
| timeless_xchat | "good enough for government work" | 16:04 |
| |R | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/lugdulov/0.2.2-2/ <- can some of you vote for this? I've been using it for a while and it's a wonderful bike sharing app, it'd be great to see it in extra :-) | 16:04 |
| timeless_xchat | speedevil : when i'm on my n900 (as now), whois tends to give me away | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 16:06 |
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| timeless_xchat | ok, next: get approval to take pre funded trips in november | 16:07 |
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| timeless_xchat | anyone in town for a limited time only? | 16:08 |
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| timeless_xchat | free thursday is today | 16:09 |
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| toggles | aahhhhhhhhhhhhhh! engadget i hate you | 16:10 |
| timeless_xchat | heh, y? | 16:11 |
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| toggles | no meegos until next year | 16:11 |
| toggles | blah. | 16:11 |
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| Stskeeps | toggles: that's intel saying it | 16:12 |
| toggles | I guess i'll need to get a nexus one | 16:12 |
| toggles | Stskeeps: yeah yeah ;-) | 16:12 |
| * timeless_xchat chuckles | 16:12 | |
| Stskeeps | i mean, what would intel know? | 16:12 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:12 |
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| timeless_xchat | that just means you can't get MePad from Intel this ar :) | 16:13 |
| timeless_xchat | s/ar/year/ | 16:13 |
| infobot | timeless_xchat meant: that just means you can't get MePad from Intel this year :) | 16:13 |
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| jacktheripper | if it's not possible to upload packages to the SDK repos, and it's only possible to upload a library to extras-devel (which is only ARMEL), then how am I supposed to test my programs on scratchbox if the UI doesn't work on the ARMEL target ? | 16:17 |
| MohammadAG51 | err | 16:19 |
| MohammadAG51 | devel accepts both archs | 16:19 |
| MohammadAG51 | X86 and ARMEL | 16:19 |
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| jacktheripper | but then it doesn't support the same version of both targets if I had uploaded one already. Can I used dpkg-buildpackage to build both targets at the same time with a new version ? | 16:20 |
| MohammadAG51 | it supports archs of the same version | 16:21 |
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| jacktheripper | yes but I had already uploaded ARMEL before, I'm trying to upload i386 now and it's rejecting the package complaining that it already exists. | 16:22 |
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| frals | bump version number? | 16:23 |
| jacktheripper | would it be right to have different versions for different targets if it's exactly the same code ? | 16:24 |
| MohammadAG51 | jacktheripper, make the source build both armel and x86 | 16:24 |
| MohammadAG51 | build-dep: in debian/rules | 16:24 |
| MohammadAG51 | build-indep: for stuff like icons, changelogs, non arch dependant stuff | 16:25 |
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| MohammadAG51 | Architecture: all in debian/control | 16:25 |
| MohammadAG51 | read debian packaging documentation | 16:25 |
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| tybollt | alterego: like oh... say doing it _at all_ w/ the N900? | 16:30 |
| Termana | Isn't it just my lucky day! I can create a FREE :* account at a web cam site, because it's been offered to me because I am such a sweetie. The person who is offering it is magically able to change faces as well, displaying a new picture everytime I visit the same great sign up link | 16:34 |
| Termana | And ALL I need to do is add my information to the form, COMPLETELY FREE | 16:34 |
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| Termana | Just as long as I add my credit card information, which WONT be charged :* | 16:34 |
| RST38h | thp: I would (even located file and function) but I do not have time even to maintain my own stuff nowadays =( | 16:35 |
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| crashanddie | vkvraju, how can I help? | 16:38 |
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| RST38h | thp: And building hildon-desktop in SB2 is bound to be ..mm... fun | 16:39 |
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| crashanddie | lol: http://5z8.info/facebook-of-sex_o7y0n_IE-exploiter | 16:56 |
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| Venemo_N900 | alterego: ping | 17:33 |
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| timeless_mbp | oops | 17:34 |
| * timeless_mbp confuses weeks | 17:34 | |
| timeless_mbp | free thursday is next week :o | 17:34 |
| pupnik | eat your pea soup and get to work | 17:34 |
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| Venemo_N900 | Anyone knows when Qt 4.7 is coming to Maemo 5? | 17:35 |
| Stskeeps | hopefully | 17:35 |
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| crashanddie | Venemo_N900, I'm saying between today and today + 2^64 days. | 17:42 |
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| Venemo_N900 | crashanddie: haha! | 17:43 |
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| timeless_xchat | venemo_n900: qt4.7 is coming to meego, and nokia wants the n900 to be the dev platform for meego | 18:22 |
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| Corsac | does this mean they'll give n900s to people at meego summit? | 18:23 |
| Corsac | no wait :) | 18:23 |
| timeless_xchat | didn't they do that last time? | 18:23 |
| timeless_xchat | where's the originality in that? | 18:23 |
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| achipa | timeless_xchat: they're simply not going to appear there at all ! that's one thing that has never been done before... | 18:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcukn900: ping | 18:31 |
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| lardman | Quick question, is PyQwt available in one of the repos? | 18:39 |
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| Venemo_N900 | lardman: if you are referring to PyQt, then yes | 18:47 |
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| lardman | no, pyqwt | 18:47 |
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| lardman | i.e. http://qwt.sourceforge.net/ | 18:48 |
| lardman | oops, or even http://pyqwt.sourceforge.net/ | 18:48 |
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| lardman | hmm, seems not, nor even numpy | 18:51 |
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| vkvraju | sorry, I just went away | 18:59 |
| vkvraju | crashanddie: you there? | 18:59 |
| vkvraju | ~seen crashanddie | 19:00 |
| infobot | crashanddie is currently on #maemo (9h 4m 16s). Has said a total of 15 messages. Is idling for 1h 17m 14s, last said: 'Venemo_N900, I'm saying between today and today + 2^64 days.'. | 19:00 |
| GAN900 | Anybody see the story on Engadget? | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | which one? | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | 'not until 2011'? | 19:01 |
| GAN900 | Anybody want to bet the whole MeeGo-MeeGo/vendor-MeeGo doesn't make statements like that so much more complicated. | 19:01 |
| GAN900 | Yeah | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | i sense some VP got an angry call from another EVP | 19:01 |
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| Stskeeps | especially cos 'why the fuck is intel the one being all-knowing if there'll be a meego handset' | 19:02 |
| GAN900 | The Intel-handset/ARM-handset point makes it even more interesting | 19:03 |
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| lardman | yes, was a bit of a direct answer, I expected more dancing around | 19:09 |
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| pog | I read wine 1.3.4 has arm-support, does that mean it' doesn't need qemu anymore to emulate? | 19:16 |
| pog | http://www.winehq.org/announce/1.3.4 | 19:16 |
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| cehteh | pog: i doubt that | 19:18 |
| thp | RST38h: apt-get source hildon-desktop && apt-get build-dep hildon-desktop && cd hildon-desktop-* && dpkg-buildpackage -b isn't that hard ;) | 19:19 |
| cehteh | my guess is that you can recompile windows apps for arm now | 19:19 |
| juliank | pog: It means that wine can run WinCE applications now | 19:19 |
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| pog | WinCE... | 19:20 |
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| ghostcube | hi folks, i just read that flash 10.1 needs 800 mhz cpu minimum? is this the same for the mobile version cause then it wont be working on N900 or? | 19:22 |
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| wmarone | 10.1 is not on the N900 for other reasons | 19:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ghostcube: MHz mean nothing without mentioning exact cpu arch it's relating to | 19:23 |
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| ghostcube | i just read in ct and they were talking about an htc smartphone with 600 mhz android that wont run flash 10.1 | 19:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer | MAD MHz != Intel MHz, so guess how much it means for Arm MHz | 19:24 |
| ghostcube | dont know what arch is behind the htc | 19:24 |
| wmarone | chances are that's running a terrible ARM11 based CPU | 19:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | AMD* | 19:24 |
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| rodald | hi everyone do you know if theres any way to get a faster internet connection thru the n900 right now im conecting thru the nokia pcsuite on windows vista and its giving me a connection of 460 kbps | 19:28 |
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| n900-dk | Still no way to enable java in browser on n900? | 19:42 |
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| SpeedEvil | rodald: It would seem to be a problem with windows - I'm regularly getting >460K through USB. | 19:43 |
| SpeedEvil | tethering with 'pc suite' mode in linux. | 19:44 |
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| SpeedEvil | I vaguely remember there is a generic solution ot make it faster for all broadband modems | 19:44 |
| SpeedEvil | but I don't remember what it is, as I diddn't bother remembering | 19:44 |
| rodald | hmm too bad thank you any way | 19:45 |
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| Stskeeps | ghostcube: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835547&postcount=1292 | 19:49 |
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| BCMM | SpeedEvil: how does tethering with pc suite mode work? | 19:50 |
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| BCMM | SpeedEvil: how does tethering with pc suite mode work? | 19:51 |
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| BCMM | SpeedEvil: sorry for repeating, got confused from playing with network connections and thought i was offline | 19:51 |
| BCMM | i get the n900 appearing as a USB ethernet adaptor, but it doesn't seem to act as a gateway | 19:51 |
| ghostcube | Stskeeps: thx so it works heh | 19:52 |
| BCMM | (and i can't see how it could with the stock, netfilterless, kernel) | 19:52 |
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| * Stskeeps watches the lemmings go wild: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835556&postcount=1293 | 20:04 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | meh, gpsjinni update wants to install new libillumination 2.7MB - WTF? | 20:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | I feel like nuking gpsjinni, for such nonsense shoving down my throat without proper WARNING | 20:09 |
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| CutMeOwnThroat | sigh | 20:12 |
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| RST38h | Stskeeps: Meego on an x86 netbook? | 20:13 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: n900, meego | 20:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | meh hooray gpsjinni freezing when hitting "Diagrams" - cpu 100. sure I want a new 2.7MB lib to implement such great feature | 20:18 |
| * DocScrutinizer51 removes gpsjinni | 20:18 | |
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| RST38h | Stskeeps: Won't work on Maemo5, I assume? | 20:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | BCMM: I just setup pppd on the linux box, then pppd call t-mobile after pluggin in the phone, and clicking 'pc suite' mode | 20:29 |
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| BCMM | SpeedEvil: oh, i don't know anything about ppp | 20:29 |
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| BCMM | SpeedEvil: presumably, one could also use netfilter from kernel-power and a DHCP server on the device? | 20:30 |
| Stskeeps | it's ctrl-shift-p to take screenshots, right? | 20:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | yep | 20:32 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835588&postcount=1297 | 20:38 |
| nox- | moin | 20:38 |
| RST38h | stskeeps: wowowow | 20:38 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: no gpu acceleration though | 20:39 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: I doner if the lemmings will understand the significance of these screenshots :) | 20:39 |
| RST38h | Ah, screw gpu acceleration.... | 20:39 |
| RST38h | s/doner/wonder/ | 20:39 |
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| nox- | so all you did was replace the flashplayer .so? | 20:41 |
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| RST38h | all hedid was find or compile a new flashplayer.so ;) | 20:42 |
| Stskeeps | find | 20:42 |
| RST38h | now, where he got it, tht is a good question | 20:42 |
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| nox- | ah | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: it's referred further up in the thread | 20:43 |
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| RST38h | aha | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | cfh11's post | 20:43 |
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| * RST38h goes off to order a copy | 20:45 | |
| RST38h | U.S. Government export approval | 20:46 |
| RST38h | hmmm | 20:46 |
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| * wmarone wonders how long it will be until TI cuts off the ability to request it | 20:52 | |
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| yacc | I just realized that the N900 is still missing some toys, e.g. no DECT module builtin, ... | 20:55 |
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| dRbiG | k, i've just discovered that n900's headphones have a button on the microphone bit | 21:00 |
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| dRbiG | i wonder if it is possible to use it to pause the media player | 21:01 |
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| RST38h | I have just found the laser hidden behind the N900's "ir port" | 21:01 |
| RST38h | Wonder if I can use it to incribe obscenities on large buildings | 21:02 |
| dRbiG | uea, sure | 21:02 |
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| Corsac | or to blind plane pilots? | 21:02 |
| dRbiG | yea* | 21:02 |
| dRbiG | hmm | 21:02 |
| dRbiG | ir port you say? | 21:02 |
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| dRbiG | some tv remote emulator software out there? | 21:03 |
| opdf2 | Besides connecting sftp from PC, is there an app to view Owner/Group of files from N900? | 21:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | ls -l | 21:06 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 21:07 |
| nox- | dRbiG, there is qtirreco, tho i couldnt get it to work | 21:08 |
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| nox- | but maybe you have more luck :) | 21:11 |
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| RST38h | moo wazd | 21:14 |
| RST38h | how is life? | 21:14 |
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| nox- | ssdd | 21:16 |
| Goliath23 | hi | 21:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dRbiG: irreco | 21:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer | opdf2: mc | 21:19 |
| opdf2 | TY | 21:19 |
| dRbiG | thx Doc! | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | irreco works ok for me )(and my TV :-P ) | 21:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dunno about qtirreco | 21:20 |
| nox- | ah somehow i thought irreco was deprecated... | 21:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | qtirreco is meh | 21:24 |
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| RST38h | there is an irreco-based desktop widget that is relatively good | 21:27 |
| RST38h | Mohammad, are you going to use thp's patches? | 21:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | already did RST38h, see page 2 of his post | 21:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | using the single column one right now | 21:28 |
| RST38h | coooooooool | 21:28 |
| RST38h | is it configurable, anyway? | 21:28 |
| MohammadAG51 | sadly, nope | 21:28 |
| MohammadAG51 | have to read on gconf | 21:29 |
| MohammadAG51 | or read matan's sources | 21:29 |
| RST38h | oh | 21:29 |
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| nox- | is the widget all i need to install for irreco? | 21:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | you'll for sure need proper description file for a particular remote emu matching your TV | 21:31 |
| RST38h | the n900 ir ledis too weak anyway | 21:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | so I guess you'll want the full irreco suite | 21:31 |
| RST38h | well,the applet handles description fileloading | 21:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: I doubt that | 21:31 |
| RST38h | it does | 21:32 |
| RST38h | check it out | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | I more suspect it's using a wrong frequency | 21:32 |
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| RST38h | is it adjustable? :) | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | somewhere for sure | 21:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | hw is adjustable | 21:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dunno how lircd handles that | 21:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: the IR LED is driven via 55R series from VBAT | 21:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | doesn't exactly sound like a wimpy glowing | 21:38 |
| nox- | hm where do i find the widget once its installed? | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: in desktop-gear add widget menu? | 21:38 |
| nox- | hm didnt see it there, tho irreco-core wasnt installed so maybe ill get it after that | 21:40 |
| nox- | .oO(program manager really is slow...) | 21:40 |
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| laasonen | Isn't there a way to make password entry? http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/hildon/HildonEntry.html | 21:43 |
| nox- | hm nope | 21:44 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 21:44 | |
| timeless_mbp | can someone here please load http://www.nokia.com/about-nokia/contacts/nokia-offices | 21:45 |
| nox- | oh sorry that was to irreco | 21:45 |
| timeless_mbp | in select location, select United States of America | 21:45 |
| nox- | not to you laasonen | 21:45 |
| timeless_mbp | then look at the phone numbers | 21:45 |
| laasonen | nox-:ok | 21:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | Tel: 18 588 315 000 | 21:47 |
| SpeedEvil | Fax: 18 588 316 500 | 21:47 |
| SpeedEvil | looks unlikely | 21:47 |
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| gnat42 | is the author of the gstreamer camerabin element around? | 21:48 |
| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: the numbers do work | 21:49 |
| timeless_mbp | they're just idiots (as usual) | 21:49 |
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| nox- | 1-858? | 21:49 |
| nox- | haha | 21:49 |
| SpeedEvil | oh - right | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | timeless_mbp: aren't Americans always when it comes to sensible formats for commonly used values, like e.g. date? | 21:52 |
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| * DocScrutinizer really is amazed every time he runs ito brainfsckd mm-dd-yy or yy-dd-mm | 21:53 | |
| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer: i don't think i've ever seen yy-dd-mm | 21:53 |
| timeless_mbp | and i never hope to see it | 21:53 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm quite happy w/ mm/dd/yyyy | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | idiocy | 21:53 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer: it's a matter of Row Major v. Column Major | 21:54 |
| timeless_mbp | when you try to schedule events using a calendar | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | doesn't sort, doesn't read (except maybe in america), doesn't make any sense | 21:54 |
| timeless_mbp | do you sort things by day | 21:54 |
| timeless_mbp | so first you find the 31st | 21:54 |
| timeless_mbp | then you look at events from jan, mar, … ? | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm:ss,ccc | 21:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer: yeah, that's the proper sort | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | the way to think about mm/dd/yyyy is really: | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | (yyyy) mm/dd | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | since the yyyy is generally fixed | 21:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | it doesn't make sense to have it wasting valuable leading digits | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | it hurts scanning | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | exactly, mindboggling | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | so, …. instead, it's hidden 6 places later: | 21:56 |
| timeless_mbp | mm/dd[/yyyy] | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | FFS | 21:56 |
| timeless_mbp | that's why it's done, and it really does make sense | 21:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer | oh yes! date of posting 09-07-09 | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | or 10-07-09 | 21:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | HOORAY, fsckU! | 21:57 |
| timeless_mbp | us dates should really use /'s not -'s :) | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | doesn't fix the idiocy | 21:57 |
| timeless_mbp | and we wouldn't use a leading 0 | 21:57 |
| timeless_mbp | so you can pretty much assert that it wasn't a us date :) | 21:57 |
| timeless_mbp | thus, that must be some idiotic european date | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | muhahaha | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | 10, july, 09 | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | go tmo, enjoy, cry | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | we'd write 7/10/09 | 21:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | note that years are special and *do* get a leading zero | 21:59 |
| timeless_mbp | because they're only *part* of a year, not the whole number | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | Old 09-23-10, 12:15 PM | 21:59 |
| BCMM_ | timeless_mbp: corresponds to pronounciation, ofc | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | timeless_mbp: listen to what you're spreading here please. Don't hurt my brain! | 21:59 |
| Stskeeps | wow, a riot really -is- starting about this flash thing | 22:00 |
| BCMM_ | Stskeeps: what flash thing? | 22:01 |
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| Stskeeps | BCMM_: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=835547#post835547 and down | 22:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | meh | 22:02 |
| * DocScrutinizer wonders if he actually *wants* flash10 at all (if it weren't for fixing vulnerabilities, and I guess nobody even thought about that particular aspect, not to think about proper evaluation) | 22:03 | |
| DocScrutinizer | lemmings doing lemming things | 22:04 |
| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer: there are some sites that require flash10 | 22:05 |
| timeless_mbp | it gives some better codecs and stuff | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't give a flying F... | 22:05 |
| timeless_mbp | i'd suggest collecting it | 22:06 |
| timeless_mbp | because you might find yourself visiting sites which don't serve you w/o it | 22:06 |
| timeless_mbp | no requirement that you use it otherwise | 22:06 |
| timeless_mbp | just a tool to keep in case of emergencies | 22:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | ack | 22:06 |
| * timeless_mbp needed flash 10 last month | 22:06 | |
| * timeless_mbp grumbles | 22:06 | |
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| flux | if it had hw acceleration it might've been more interesting | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | timeless_mbp: but that'd mean I'd have to dig thru all that BS at tmo, to pick up the pieces | 22:11 |
| timeless_mbp | ? | 22:11 |
| timeless_mbp | there's a link to the registration form right there | 22:11 |
| * timeless_mbp just applied | 22:11 | |
| DocScrutinizer | WTF? registration form??? | 22:11 |
| * DocScrutinizer runs to bathroom, throwing up | 22:11 | |
| ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, it didnt work with tweak flash either? | 22:12 |
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| trumee | funny why the TI page needs a company name. Is the registration only for business users? | 22:14 |
| timeless_mbp | trumee: they're trying to sell stuff to companies | 22:14 |
| * Stskeeps actually does have a legal company so he could do it | 22:14 | |
| timeless_mbp | it isn't for end users to get a better product | 22:14 |
| BCMM_ | i wonder if pages that do that pay any attention to the information they collect | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | BS | 22:15 |
| BCMM_ | "hmm, about half the downloads were for the CIA...) | 22:15 |
| timeless_mbp | BCMM_: easy to find out | 22:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~lart TI | 22:15 |
| * infobot blasts TI with a huge firehose then strangles TI with it | 22:15 | |
| trumee | Stskeeps: does it any kind of approval from TI. garbage company name wont help? | 22:15 |
| Stskeeps | trumee: i have no idea what they check | 22:16 |
| Stskeeps | trumee: it took 1-2 days for me to get it | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | infobot, you forgot Adobe and flash | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~lart Adobe and fsckng flash | 22:16 |
| * infobot blasts Adobe and fsckng flash with a huge firehose then strangles Adobe and fsckng flash with it | 22:16 | |
| Stskeeps | trumee: and please read http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835663&postcount=1312 before dumping in garbage | 22:16 |
| ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, what are these better codecs? I thought it was aac+h264 already in 9? | 22:17 |
| trumee | Stskeeps: is that code by Adobe or by TI? | 22:17 |
| ShadowJK | Although maybe it was for 10 that they switched to CoreAVC instead of whatever they used before? That'd be pretty dog slow on ARM though I think.. | 22:17 |
| Stskeeps | trumee: adobe naturally, maybe with TI stuff on top | 22:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yay, back to the bathroom... | 22:18 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: too much indian food? | 22:19 |
| trumee | Stskeeps: any idea whether it will be support hardware accel ? | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | to much texas food | 22:19 |
| Stskeeps | trumee: no GPU acceleration as far as i could tell | 22:19 |
| ShadowJK | I think TI wants extra money for the full h264 accel? | 22:19 |
| ShadowJK | I mean in general, not specificly flash | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | \o/ | 22:19 |
| Stskeeps | ShadowJK: dunno, but the DSP codecs are downloadable | 22:19 |
| ShadowJK | The free ones like the ones on N900 only do h264 baseline though? | 22:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep, that's what I heard | 22:20 |
| Stskeeps | ShadowJK: dunno | 22:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | timeless_mbp should know exactly | 22:21 |
| ShadowJK | And since youtube >480p uses h264 main (or high?) profile instead of baseline, I imagine flash wants full h264 codecs | 22:21 |
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| ShadowJK | Well we already know that N900 codecs only does h264 baseline | 22:21 |
| nox- | ok got the widget after reboot, but it doesnt seem to know my pvr | 22:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: please don't quite me | 22:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: I suggest you go for irreco app first. Use widget when full app is correctly configured | 22:23 |
| timeless_mbp | i'd have to find someone who has publicly provided useful info | 22:23 |
| timeless_mbp | i think there's also the minor problem that even though 9.x already supports some stuff from 10 | 22:23 |
| timeless_mbp | some content producers just check for 10 | 22:24 |
| timeless_mbp | (content producers are stupid) | 22:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | and I'm not inclined to support stupidity | 22:24 |
| BCMM_ | stupid stupid flash detection scripts | 22:24 |
| BCMM_ | one popular one always declares konqueror to not support flash at all | 22:25 |
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| ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, afaik I did not quote you on anything | 22:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | send a semptex package! | 22:25 |
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| dRbiG | hmm, i don't see packages for netcat or telnet - am i missing something? | 22:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | apt-get install netcat? | 22:26 |
| dRbiG | E: Couldn't find package netcat | 22:27 |
| dRbiG | guess what ;) | 22:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: that's a preemptive request :) | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | IroN900:~# apt-cache search netcat | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | socat - multipurpose relay for bidirectional data transfer | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | netcat - TCP/IP swiss army knife | 22:27 |
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| BCMM_ | DocScrutinizer: works for telnet, no netcat | 22:27 |
| dRbiG | DocScrutinizer: you have devel repo added? | 22:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure | 22:28 |
| timeless_mbp | dRbiG: you probably don't have enough repos enabled... | 22:28 |
| timeless_mbp | can you explain why the default repo should have netcat? | 22:28 |
| BCMM_ | what's socat? | 22:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | and tools | 22:28 |
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| BCMM_ | it comes up for apt-cat search netcat | 22:28 |
| dRbiG | DocScrutinizer: 'and tools' - some other repo? | 22:28 |
| timeless_mbp | dRbiG: please keep in mind that large repositories seriously hurt HAM's ability to do anything | 22:28 |
| ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, I think the "tweak flash" crowd already discovered the thing about flash 9 working for most sites "requiring" 10 :) | 22:29 |
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| BCMM_ | i have extras-devel and extras-testing and no netcat | 22:29 |
| dRbiG | timeless_mbp: that's why i didn't add devel repo | 22:29 |
| timeless_mbp | tools is a relatively small repo | 22:29 |
| dRbiG | i usually just wget the .deb i want and install by hand | 22:29 |
| timeless_mbp | (but quite useful) | 22:29 |
| dRbiG | timeless_mbp: where can i find it? | 22:29 |
| dRbiG | :) | 22:29 |
| dRbiG | i may just build the debs myself but why waste time | 22:29 |
| timeless_mbp | dRbiG: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=maemo+5+tools | 22:30 |
| timeless_mbp | … why waste *my* time? | 22:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | :-ÜP | 22:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | err -Ü | 22:30 |
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| dRbiG | timeless_mbp: i mean, if someone actually did bild it for maemo and it's got its way to a repo then most probably it will be more suited for maemo than my own rough builds :) | 22:33 |
| dRbiG | hmm, like i see screen in the tools | 22:33 |
| dRbiG | so i basically wasted time compiling it | 22:34 |
| dRbiG | but i still haven't seen lftp | 22:34 |
| dRbiG | :) | 22:34 |
| BCMM_ | tools has screen! | 22:34 |
| nox- | hm `new button' always wants to replace the previous button... | 22:34 |
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| ShadowJK | screen in tools has some quirks | 22:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer | for your convenience: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5 | 22:35 |
| ShadowJK | you need to start it as root once per boot to make it work smoothly as user | 22:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | errmm | 22:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | weird | 22:35 |
| nox- | ah yeah bc it needs to create a dir in /var | 22:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: that's odd, it shouldn't fail on that, no? | 22:36 |
| nox- | well as user it does | 22:37 |
| nox- | bc the parent dir at least is owned by root | 22:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | to be precise the dir shouldn't vanish once it's created (preferably by postinstall script of screen) | 22:37 |
| nox- | oh right thats true ofc | 22:37 |
| nox- | i guess screen just wasnt made for boxen with `temporary' /var... | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehe | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | the temporary parts in /var should probably be world writable | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry, can't keep myself from... | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~optification | 22:39 |
| infobot | i heard optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence3 | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | applies for /var as well of course | 22:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~seen lcuk | 22:42 |
| infobot | lcuk <lcuk@Maemo/community/contributor/lcuk> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 19h 47m 9s ago, saying: 'to a degree'. | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | wtf is up with ibot? | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | laggy as hell | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack | 22:43 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer: aw, gee | 22:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk2: ping | 22:43 |
| * nox- still problems with irreco, can only add a single button, and using it gives `irreco backend error' | 22:44 | |
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| nox- | code 8 | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | /etc/init.d/irreco start | 22:45 |
| nox- | oh :) | 22:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | or boot | 22:45 |
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| lirtex | Hi, what is the right way to log messages from my C++ application in maemo? Is there some QT logger I should use? | 22:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | log to where? | 22:46 |
| lirtex | syslog preferably | 22:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess there's a well established standard c way to do that | 22:47 |
| dRbiG | got netcat, telnet and tcpdump, very good | 22:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | lirtex =~ s/QT/Qt/g | 22:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | man 3 syslog | 22:49 |
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| lirtex | timeless_mbp: won't happen again :) | 22:49 |
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| lirtex | DocScrutinizer: Thanks. | 22:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yw | 22:49 |
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| nox- | hm id be surprised if qt didnt have something for that too... | 22:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | nox-: why? just for the fun in it? | 22:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: it'd have to offer any improved functionality to qualify for a Qt function, no? | 22:53 |
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| nox- | a) bc it has `all kinds of stuff' b) bc it tries to be `cross-platform'? :) | 22:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe Qt offers a wrapper to use qstrings instead of const char * | 22:53 |
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| nox- | that too | 22:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer | nox-: x-platform is a point, yes | 22:54 |
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| * DocScrutinizer muses about windows system event log, and shudders | 22:55 | |
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| nox- | yeah | 22:55 |
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| nox- | irreco-for-n900 is the one to install? seems i didnt get an irreco init.d script... | 22:56 |
| lirtex | Qt has qDebug which is convenient, but I'm not sure if it's possible to redirect it's output to syslog. | 22:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: yep | 22:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lirtex: sorry, nfc. Not a real Qt-using developer here | 22:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | s/Qt-using// :-) | 22:57 |
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| Jaffa | Evening | 22:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | lo Jaffa | 22:59 |
| Stskeeps | evening jaffa | 22:59 |
| RevdKathy | Evening, Jaffa | 22:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: have you noticed lcuk's request as of yesterday evening? | 23:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: ...regarding backup-menu | 23:01 |
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| Stskeeps | is that in extras? | 23:02 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:02 |
| Jaffa | DocScrutinizer: I saw something but didn't have time to fully mine scrollback. Shock: email is better :-p | 23:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-D | 23:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: nope, it's killing N900s from devel | 23:02 |
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| * Jaffa would want a) documented proof; b) an email to maemo-developers or maemo-community and c) an answer to the question "what does the maintainer say?" | 23:03 | |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: it's trashing raw NAND and it's really bad. | 23:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: I won't deliver proof of it killing a N900 :-P | 23:03 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: MohammadAG has seen it's effect and it was only possible to rescue with nanderase from a initrd/second os | 23:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: I still feel puzzled why NOLO doesn't cope with that properly | 23:04 |
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| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: erase blocks | 23:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: isn't NOLO supposed to do a proper nanderase prior to flashing rootfs? | 23:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | Is there no nice dumpubifs/ | 23:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: the problem is the missing nice restoreubifs though | 23:06 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 23:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ugh | 23:06 |
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| dRbiG | any idea why chmod +x doesn't add executable flag to a file? | 23:07 |
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| lindi- | NOLO is non-free/non-oss I presume? | 23:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | dRbiG: maybe cos it's VFAT? | 23:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lindi-: exactly | 23:07 |
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| nox- | anyone remember which package the irreco init.d script is in? i wonder if it didnt get installed... | 23:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | wtf? | 23:08 |
| dRbiG | DocScrutinizer: yhh, yes, and not only - it also has noexec option | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | net.split :-( | 23:08 |
| nox- | stupid kids :( | 23:08 |
| nox- | (i guess) | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | :nod: | 23:08 |
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| nox- | ok have to charge now, looking at irreco later | 23:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: :-D | 23:10 |
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| nox- | DocScrutinizer, can you do a dpkg -S for the init.d script or what that command was? | 23:10 |
| dRbiG | okey, thttpd works, nice | 23:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: /etc/init.d/lirc | 23:11 |
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| nox- | hm that one i have... | 23:11 |
| nox- | wonder why it didnt start | 23:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer | pkg lirc | 23:12 |
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| nox- | yeah lirc i have running, iireco still fails | 23:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, weird. I remeber I had problems initially with it too. Maybe really just boot | 23:15 |
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| nox- | hmm hmm | 23:16 |
| nox- | (tho i already did that too... :) | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: lirc is controlled via a socket iirc. maybe this fails when you start up lirc 'too late' | 23:16 |
| nox- | well iireco config talks about using telnet... | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | err wut? | 23:17 |
| nox- | or at least it has a hostname and port | 23:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | whatever, you need to download some description file matching your appliance. You did? | 23:18 |
| nox- | i had to do the `new remote' thing and get an lirc definition file, the original menu didnt have my pvr | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | also I seem to have installed THREE irreco pkgs. Maybe not all of them needed | 23:19 |
| nox- | i also havent found out how to add more than one button yet... o_O | 23:19 |
| nox- | which ones you have | 23:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | with proper description file for a remo emu there shall be several buttons already | 23:20 |
| nox- | tho i think i now have all of them too... | 23:20 |
| nox- | yes as i said i have to config one myself | 23:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, you can not completely config by yourself, basically. The IR parameters / datapatterns need to be prerecorded on a different machine which has IR RX | 23:21 |
| nox- | yes i was able to have it download an lirc definition file from the net | 23:22 |
| nox- | only irreco's own config archive didnt have one | 23:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | irreco says "Irreco 0.8.11" | 23:24 |
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| nox- | yep here too | 23:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | irreco-backend-internal-lirc, irreco-core, irreco-for-n900 | 23:25 |
| nox- | have those too | 23:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, what else? | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | what means "still fails"? | 23:27 |
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| nox- | iireco backend error, code 8 | 23:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | weird | 23:29 |
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| nox- | http://irreco.garage.maemo.org/documentation.html#documentation | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | i'd guess you need to download a proper "Remote" | 23:29 |
| nox- | this docs dont even mention the internal ir led... | 23:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | sure, n800 doesn't have any | 23:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer | irreco on N800 and "PC with lirc" are the same device for N900 | 23:31 |
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| nox- | ooh | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | irreco talking to lirc@localhost | 23:32 |
| nox- | so i need to tell lirc to listen on the notwork :) | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | via a socket | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | notwork, yes :-) | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | 127.0.0.1 | 23:32 |
| nox- | yes | 23:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | but lirc on N900 does that ootb afaik | 23:33 |
| nox- | hm | 23:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I'm quite sure I haven't done any special edits to put the whole thing to work | 23:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | install, start up, ignore errors, load remote, boot(?), edit remote for size/number/type of buttons, save remote, enjoy | 23:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ome/user/.irreco/backend_lib_backend_internal_lirc_la_1.config: | 23:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | [internal_lirc] | 23:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | host=localhost | 23:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | port=8765 | 23:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | /home/user/.irreco/backends.conf: [instance-1] library=lib_backend_internal_lirc.la config=backend_lib_backend_internal_lirc_la_1.config name=Internal Lirc 1 | 23:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | -rw-r--r-- 1 user users 0 2010-10-07 22:23 lircd.conf | 23:40 |
| nox- | found the problem in the lirc log: `this remote config cannot be used to transmit'... | 23:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer | mhm | 23:41 |
| nox- | and btw lircd listens on *:8765 here by default | 23:43 |
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| nox- | guess ill have to look at the config | 23:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer | guess, you'll have to download a proper remote | 23:45 |
| nox- | 'cept there isnt one for my hw :) | 23:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | then use any similar one. In the end there's a limited number of (3..12) ir-control chips on this planet | 23:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | no matter what the buttons are labled and the brand name on the case, the chances there's the same chip inside is rather high | 23:47 |
| nox- | ok but the codes are all different, right? | 23:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope, a chip always uses same codes | 23:48 |
| nox- | oh? | 23:48 |
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| nox- | i thought there are a limited number of encoding (like rc5), but the actual codes are `configurable' and differ per device? | 23:49 |
| nox- | else there'd be confusion quickly when someone has more than a few remotes... | 23:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | you got like 32 different device addresses and 64 keycodes | 23:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | for example | 23:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | the device addr are assigned to appliance classes usually | 23:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | odds are you'll get a somewhat working config for your particular appliance when you download a remote file for any arbitrary appliance of same type and manufacturer | 23:53 |
| johnsq | and you find nice new functions of your tv | 23:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep, sometimes :-D | 23:53 |
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| nox- | well from this manuf there only is stuff in the lirc archive | 23:54 |
| nox- | not in irreco's own one | 23:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | then use another manuf, that's listed in same category in any arbitrary user manual of any arbitrary 'programmable universal IR remote' | 23:55 |
| nox- | hmm hmm | 23:56 |
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