IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2010-10-04

MohammadAGJaffa, no, but they install side by side00:00
MohammadAGmodified-hildon-desktop is a different package00:00
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MohammadAGdpkg -i it, it won't replace your hd package, it'll just replace the binary in /usr/bin00:00
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DocScrutinizerJaffa: or just visit my tools page, and c&p :-D00:01
JaffaI see.00:01
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tobis87 :-D , a penis would be the least to worry about.00:29
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johnxwith a description like that how can I avoid clicking the link? (Pretty easily it turns out ...)00:34
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tobis87everybody should make their own mind up and not rely on recommendations, not that I would show hardcore pornographie to childrens, but I don't think children get "damaged" by watching controversial movies.00:37
pupnik_i do if the movie shows actual evil from the protagonist side00:37
pupnik_so a horror slasher that revels in cutting people up is actually sickening media00:38
crashanddieno, but their parents sure hate it when you bring them back after introducing the kids to freddie kruger, and then the parents bitch "we can't sleep anymore, they keep having nightmares, bla bla bla"00:38
johnxtobis87, neither do I. and I never said otherwise :) Just my own comments on why I'm not too likely to follow that link ...00:38
Freak5do you know if there is a chance for working ovi-maps navigation with speech support when using maemo?00:39
crashanddiejohnx: you seem to have a solid case of misunderstanding00:39
MohammadAGhow do I add a scheduled shutdown on ubuntu?00:40
johnxcrashanddie, likely caused by apathy. it's a real problem00:40
MohammadAGnvm, I'll just use a sleep 10800; halt00:40
pupnik_MohammadAG: "man shutdown" maybe00:40
johnxshutdown -something-that-i-forgot -h00:41
johnxmaybe -t?00:41
tobis87pupnik_:  Which is really ridiculas, if you have watched Braindead from Peter Jackson. It is so overdone, you will laugh at every splasher if you watched this movie...00:41
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pupnik_tobis87: ok noted00:42
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pupnik_i guess it's not easy to convince someone of something that isn't seen physically00:44
pupnik_what flows through us individuals as common culture is sometimes difficult to percieve - without an external vantage point of some sort00:45
DocScrutinizer51shutdown -h "tomorrow at teatime"00:45
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kerioshutdown -h "tonight... you"00:47
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DocScrutinizerthat's for sure beyond what date(1) syntax allows00:48
kerioyou have to install glibc-memes00:49
DocScrutinizerThe --date=STRING is a mostly free format human readable date string such as "Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:21:42 -0800"  or       "2004-02-29  16:21:42" or even "next Thursday".00:50
tobis87pupnik_: it is not blood, which makes people fear, but the subtile... watching psycho is the best example, what will happen next? and "all quiet on the western front" is subtile in a way, because it shows how senseless war really is.00:50
crashanddielol... i misread that as "subtitle", not "subtile"00:51
crashanddiewondering wtf you were on about00:51
crashanddiethough, tobis87, that's way off topic and has been for a while00:51
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tobis87crashanddie: Well, I was just referring to MohammadAG: crashanddie, can't see anything "wrong" here , which is ridiculas if you compare it to the parental guide to the movie all quiet on the western front.00:56
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crashanddie"Hey, why the hell did you shoot that black dude?" "Well, mr officer, I was just trying to make a point from a conversation we had earlier on"00:57
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ieatlintthat's it, no more bacon for you01:00
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tobis87crashanddie: I had to make my comment, because comparing "Parents should know this movie contains very graphic violence" to a "a penis is shown" in an anti-war movie is just hilarious.01:02
crashanddieyou didn't have to do anything, now just please let this topic die out01:03
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johnxcrashanddie, quit being the topic enforcer :P01:05
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tobis87ok, but bacon is not much more intellectual, I really don't want to argue, but right now there doesn't seem to be much maemo related talk going on. just to make life less boring...01:08
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crashanddiewas I just insulted of being as intellectual as bacon?01:13
keriobeing compared to bacon is *never* an insult01:13
keriowhatever the comparison is01:13
ieatlintagreed, it's high praise01:13
ieatlintthere should be bacon awards01:13
Chanitobis87: oy, I was seeing "subtitle" as well. the word you're looking for is "subtle" :)01:15
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ieatlinti need to find a bar that serves bacon01:16
tobis87Chani: Yes, I know should not use google for translation, that much. :-D01:17
johnxin US English at least I think it's 'subtle' not 'subtile'. Is it different in other English variants?01:17
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Chanijohnx: no, it is always "subtle"01:18
Chani"subtile" sounds like something a window manager might do, but it's not a real english word anywhere ;)01:19
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tobis87In german it is "subtil".01:19
johnxwell, in the dictionary here it says that 'subtile' is 'Now rare' whateverTF that means01:19
Chanitobis87: ah, cool :)01:19
ieatlintarchaic probably01:19
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Chaniwatch out for those downloaded dictionaries... I have a german->english one on my n900 that frequently gives me words so obscure I'm pretty sure a few of them never existed at all01:20
johnxanyways, I vote we just change the English and German spelling to subtile. No point in having them differ by only one letter01:21
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Chanidamnit, now I want bacon :P01:23
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tobis87I once had the problem, that instead of the ordinary dictonary, ubuntu had installed a dictonary for OpenOffice, which enforced academic speak. :-D01:25
johnxdid it highlight "don't" as a misspelling?01:25
crashanddieChani: how can a word never have existed if it exists in a dictionary on your n90001:26
tobis87Wanted to complicate every word... :-D Nah, don't remember, was just on my netbook, fixed it quickly.01:26
tobis87But, I think it was Ubuntu 8.10 Intrepid Ibex01:27
johnxcrashanddie, just because someone gives you a book full of letters and calls it a dictionary, doesn't mean that those collections of letters are words01:27
crashanddiejohnx: actually, as soon as a word is used, it exists01:27
johnxit means "no, that's crap."01:27
crashanddiebeing in a dictionary does not define a word's existance.01:28
ieatlinthe has a point... english's lack of a governing body means you can't disprove anything about english01:28
johnxieatlint, sdlfhsfs01:28
ieatlintit also means i can decide that alot is proper01:28
johnxalot is great01:29
ieatlinthehe, yeah, i love that01:30
ieatlintwas thinking of the alot when saying that :)01:30
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b-man` :)01:31
ieatlintwhat's wrong with that? it's not turned on...01:31
ieatlintalso, go isa and simms01:31
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crashanddiejohnx: this woman always cuts off the butt of the ham before putting it in the pan, but one day she wonders why. It's a tasty piece, soft and yummy, so why throw it away? Because her mom did. So she calls her mum, and asks why she did it. "I don't know, that's how my mother used to do it", the mother replies, so the woman calls her grandmother, and asks why she threw away the butt of the ham. She replies that she didn't have a01:32
crashanddiejohnx: the dictionary is just like the pan. It's not big enough. It can't hold the wealth of words that are available. A word can't be a "real word", as much as it can't be a "non-existent word". If you like a word, use it, it really doesn't matter whether it's in a dictionary or not.01:33
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SpeedEvilInfilipostulantly correct.01:34
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johnxcrashanddie, sdlfhsfs01:34
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crashanddieyou do realise what you're doing, yes?01:35
johnxcrashanddie, yes. that's why it amuses me01:35
Chanicrashanddie: you got cut off.01:35
Chani"she didn't have a01:35
crashanddieChani: "she didn't have a pan big enough!"01:35
crashanddieMrs X's little boy has grown up to go "sdlfhshfs" in a room full of adults trying to have a decent conversation.01:36
Chani"If you like a word, use it" <-- but if you like to be understood, think twice about that :)01:36
Chanicrashanddie: conversation? at this time of night? ;)01:36
johnxmy point being that it takes consensus for a word to be useful01:36
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crashanddieChani: "night" is a very geographically subjective term :)01:37
Chanioh right that01:37
crashanddiedo you really think that the guy who invented "LOL" waited for consensus?01:37
johnxand that languages might not have 'rules' but they have 'guidelines' about what words are 'acceptable'01:37
* Chani is now in europe, and is enjoying being in the same timezone as 80% of kde01:37
SpeedEviljohnx: Unless you're in france.01:37
johnxcrashanddie, which is why it wasn't a useful word at first, it was just annoying01:37
crashanddieyet, it's one heck of a popular word in the world01:37
SpeedEviljohnx: Where there is a committee.01:37
crashanddieSpeedEvil: do you know how the people who are part of the "Academie Francaise" are called?01:38
crashanddie"The Immortals"01:38
crashanddieThis weekend, they voted in favour of a rule of the Academie Francaise that would limit new Immortals to be 75 max.01:39
crashanddieReasoning was: "We need more young blood"01:39
crashanddieAnyone thinking of vampires at this stage?01:39
SpeedEvilI was actually thinking of Highlander.01:40
SpeedEvilBut that doesn't work ell with a comittee.01:40
crashanddieOh come on, immortals, "we need more young blood"?01:40
crashanddieand their costumes are even more ridicule01:40
crashanddiethis guy almost smells of dracula himself01:41
crashanddieanyway, I'm out, later all01:43
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tobis87If you ever will try to read Hegel, you will forget about languages...01:51
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tobis87This is what I would call "geschwurbel", there might be some readable passages and interesting stuff, but most of it is hidden behind a huge construction of letters which don't mean anything to the normal person.01:51
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tobis87Was this hegel's world spirit, or just a dsl reconnect? :-D01:54
DocScrutinizer51err, server down?01:56
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dsgCan anyone explain the purpose of these files: ?03:10
dsgIt's a SSL CA key and certificate, but it's installed under /etc/certs/trusted and the same everywhere.03:10
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dsgSpeedEvil: I know what a root certificate is. I want to know what this one is used for.03:11
dsgIt's the same for all phones, and the private key is public. I don't see the point.03:11
dsgBut it's clearly loaded from some maemo crypto libraries03:11
dsgIt also happens to be expired since ~2009...03:12
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TermanaDesireGood morning03:15
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SpeedEvilOk - it's hard to guage technical knowledge sometimes.03:16
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GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer, ping?04:56
GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer51, what the hell is your username? joerg_rw?04:56
GeneralAntillesI'm experiencing another episode of Moments in Competence here.04:57
GeneralAntillesOK, thanks.04:57
DocScrutinizer51whatever episode that might be, seems I'm missing some meanings of words05:00
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GeneralAntillesAnybody know how the E.F.F. script works?06:11
GeneralAntillesI mean, to save me from having to download it and read the source. :P06:12
GeneralAntillesAh, guess it's not the hardware feature.06:13
GeneralAntillesHo hum06:13
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SpeedEvil :)06:33
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MohammadAG51who knows gconf, C, and hildon06:38
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foowafflewhat phones have meego on it?08:18
slonopotamusfoowaffle: -> #meego08:20
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slonopotamusyou can run meego on n900, but it ain't for daily use08:21
foowafflewoops sorry didnt notice the drifferent08:22
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Termanaslonopotamus, is up08:57
Termanaslonopotamus, for future use :p08:57
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rantomAnd yet again, we see the quality of the talk.maemo.org10:42
rantom reply :)10:42
rantomGranted, I got some good laughs from that, not a bad way to start a new day10:43
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jacekowskiInvalid Post specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator10:47
rantomDarn it10:47
rantomThey removed it10:47
jacekowskican you paste content10:47
rantomNo, unfortunately not10:47
jacekowskior say what was it about10:47
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rantomNah, I was just being quite politely clear about the fact, that how annoying it is to get "i think hes dead" with bad English to your inbox, since it's not helping at all on the development10:48
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rantomAnd the response was purely cursing and bad English10:49
rantomAnd some kind of note for me to get a life. Wonder what that is though...10:49
jacekowskiand that "i think hes dead" was related to what?10:49
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rantomTo the developer10:50
rantom's activity*10:50
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jacekowskiis he?10:50
rantomHe had not kept his promises and I defended hi10:50
jacekowskideveloper of what?10:50
rantomMohammadAG of Kinetic Scrolling for PR 1.210:51
jacekowskiwell, yeah, that's a problem with most open sources communities10:51
Termanaheh, he's definitely not dead ;p10:51
jacekowskiyou can't say anything because it will be taken against you10:51
rantomFunniest part here was that the MohammadAG and four other users Thanked! me for that post :D10:52
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jacekowskiwhen i do something i just announce it when it's done10:53
rantomThat's the way it should be10:53
rantomDo NOT frustrate the developer10:53
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rantomAha, and I got an infraction worth of 20 points10:55
rantomYay :D10:56
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rantom "Infraction and Banning"10:58
rantomNot that big of a deal to me though, I'll let them ban if they see it fit10:59
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rantomYou mean the mods?11:04
rantom(or moderators, which one you prefer)11:05
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rantomIn any case, if you did mean the mods, I woulnd't blame them. It's my fault, since my attack was indeed too direct, I should've written instead "Would you mind to stop the spamming" more or less non-personal "attack"11:07
rantomOh well, what's done is done11:08
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jacekowskiwell, all of them really11:10
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n900-spacehi all11:56
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n900-spaceI cant set madde target, can anyone help?11:56
n900-spacei have installed the latest nokia qt sdk11:56
n900-spaceTargets: fremantle-1030     (installable) maemo412-1         (installable)  Runtimes: qemu-n900-pr12  (installable)11:56
n900-spacebut when i do a "mad set fremantle-1030" it doesnt work11:57
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timeless_mbpdoesn't installable imply you haven't installed it?11:57
n900-spacesays "Target 'fremantle-1030' does not exist"11:57
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n900-spacehow do i install it11:58
n900-spacei installed the complete nokia sdk11:58
timeless_mbpum, i just woke up, and haven't touched that ui in about 6-12 weeks11:58
n900-spaceyou mean the madde console11:58
timeless_mbp(i touched it precisely once, producing 50-100 items of feedback for the madde team)11:58
timeless_mbpoh, and i was using the GUI version not the CLI :)11:59
timeless_mbpif you're new here, i'd suggest you consider trying the GUI first11:59
alteregoThere's a GUI11:59
alteregoAre you talking about Qt Creator?11:59
n900-spaceplus there is one more problem :( ... the QT Creator I launch, says the examples are not installed (but i can find them in the directories), plus no help is available, the index comes emtpy, I dont know whats wrong,12:00
n900-spacei have uninstalled and installed the whole sdk several times but same results.12:00
timeless_mbpbtw, it's Qt, not QT12:00
timeless_mbpQT is QuickTime12:00
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n900-spaceNo I was talking about madde, when I said the "mad set fremantle-1030" is not working ..12:00
n900-spaceok about QT :)12:01
n900-spaceQt is what i'm talking about.12:01
n900-spaceThis has been frustrating.12:01
timeless_mbpuse the GUI. iirc it's MADE (as opposed to madde, the number of D's matter. gah)12:01
n900-spaceBtw I'm in windows 7. So i rebooted to fedora 12, Installed the Nokia Qt SDK there also. But I dont know how to access madde there on console.12:02
n900-spaceno its "madde", with double D12:02
Venemon900-space: sorry, I'm a bit late to the party. what's your issue?12:02
n900-spacehi Venemo12:02
alteregoNot tried with Windows 7, might do today actually, would be nice to have a series 60 compilation environment.12:03
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Venemon900-space: MADDE and Nokia Qt SDK works for me on Windows 7, so what's your problem?12:03
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n900-spaceSeveral: First: I installed the latest Nokia Qt Sdk. Launched qt creator, it says examples not installed. But I can find them in the directories (maybe some configurations problem), also qt creator doesnt show any help12:04
n900-spaceHelp index comes up blank.12:04
timeless_mbpfile bugs to Nokia Qt SDK team :)12:05
Venemon900-space: yes, that is happening for me too12:05
Venemon900-space: the guys in #qt may be of better help for issues like this12:05
n900-spaceok then Venemo tell me this, during the installation, did u get any errors like "qmake.exe is already busy" with Ignore/Retry button options?12:06
Venemon900-space: no, I didn't12:06
n900-spaceok about madde.12:07
jarkkomI had all kinds of issues with Qt SDK on windows until I installed it in default location at C:\NokiaQtSDK12:07
n900-spaceI'm getting problem doing "mad set"12:07
jarkkomafter that, it works fine on win7 64bit12:07
n900-spaceTargets: fremantle-1030     (installable) maemo412-1         (installable)  Runtimes: qemu-n900-pr12  (installable)12:07
n900-spacejarkkom: I'm also installing it on the default location.12:08
n900-spaceVenemo: when i do a "mad set fremantle-1030", it says target is not installed.12:08
n900-spaceSo how do i install it?12:08
Venemon900-space: I'm not sure what that command does12:09
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Venemon900-space: for me, it simply works after installation12:09
n900-spaceor, how do you set target? Or when you do "mad list" do you get any target that is set to "default"12:09
n900-spaceyes it used to work seemlessly with the 1.0 nokia sdk, but now it doesnt12:10
Venemomad-list says that "fremantle-pr12" is the default for me12:10
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n900-spaceWhy dont they give a proper help for madde?12:11
Venemon900-space: they do12:11
n900-spaceI mean is there a proper help page with all commands completely listed?12:11
Venemon900-space: what does "mad list" say to you?12:11
n900-spaceI know one, but it only works if your "default" is already set, then everything is fine.12:11
n900-spacewell my mad list is this12:12
n900-spacefremantle-1030     (installable)12:12
n900-spacemaemo412-1         (installable)12:12
n900-spaceqemu-n900-pr12  (installable)12:12
Venemoso it is screwed up, hm.12:12
n900-spaceis it?12:12
VenemoI dunno.12:12
Venemomine says:12:12
Venemofremantle-pr12     (default)12:13
Venemomaemo412-1         (installable)12:13
Venemorx51-fremantle-pr12  (default)12:13
n900-spacewhere is the proper madde documentation?12:13
alteregoThere's documentation?12:13
n900-spacemadde documentation :)12:13
n900-spaceis there ?12:13
n900-spacethis page is no help .. so basic12:15
Venemon900-space: you may also want to download MADDE itself from tablets-dev12:16
n900-spacethanks Venemo12:16
n900-spaceyes but then how does it work, i mean there is going to be one installed with the nokia sdk and one downloaded seperately. Its confusing for me12:17
n900-spaceI have a whole huge folder of madde inside nokia sdk12:17
TermanaDesiren900-space: stop spamming the room. I can scroll up and see two screens of basically you on seperate lines. Join sentences to one line and pastebin code, errors etc. Thanks :)12:18
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n900-spaceoh sorry ...12:19
Venemon900-space: yeah. you can either uninstall that completely, or just use the one that you can install separately12:19
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n900-spaceokk tell me one thing.12:20
Venemon900-space: I for one will uninstall the Nokia Qt SDK completely. Since I use a newer Qt Creator nightly along with the separately downloadable MADDE...12:21
n900-spaceSay I download the source code of xchat from repositories, and now i want to compile it.12:21
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n900-spaceWill I somehow open it in qt creator, or just compile and build and deploy from the madde console? How do people do it?12:21
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alteregoOooo, mobility 1.1.012:24
Venemon900-space: XChat is not Qt-based.12:25
Venemon900-space: so Qt Creator may not be able to do that job for you12:25
n900-spacemeans a lot of time online for all this :)12:27
n900-spacethank you guys :)12:28
Venemon900-space: it might (I for one successfully used it for some Gtk stuff), but I dunno12:28
n900-spaceVenemo: that madde help page is helpful thanks, I can finally *install* a new target I think :)12:28
Venemon900-space: I'm happy I could help12:28
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lcukVenemo, you are MADDE using mad to build all extra stuff, but that sort of experimentation is awesome12:38
n900-spaceplease explain lcuk12:39
lcukn900-space, Venemo knows exactly what I mean, I think hes awesome for pushing what MADDE can do inside it12:40
alteregoWell, if you plan on uplkoading to extras, scratchbox is somewhat better suited as it's the same environment the autobuilder uses.12:40
Chanioh boy.12:40
lcukalterego, sure12:40
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timeless_mbpalterego: eh?12:40
alteregoBut madde is fun12:40
* Chani was thinking of trying out madde next12:40
timeless_mbpdoesn't MADDE use scratchbox?12:40
Venemolcuk: yeah, as the application's name suggests, I am a "mad developer" :D12:41
alteregotimeless_mbp: erm, no12:41
Venemotimeless_mbp: nope.12:41
mecekubuntu mobile.. could be sweet12:41
alteregotimeless_mbp: madde is it's own toolchain and root image.12:41
alteregoDoesn't use chroot12:41
timeless_mbpso it's classic cross compile?12:41
alteregotimeless_mbp: yeah12:41
alteregoNot as much wacky magick12:41
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* timeless_mbp grumbles12:43
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sivangor rather morning12:53
Venemosivang: good morning12:53
sivangtimeless_mbp: back at mbp12:53
sivangmorning Venemo12:54
timeless_mbpphone's dead12:54
timeless_mbpit forgot to get a charger12:55
timeless_mbphome sweet starving12:55
sivangno food at home?12:55
timeless_mbpno charger plugged into the power strip for the phone12:55
timeless_mbpmy mac was unhappy when i came back, i had left the strip unplugged so the mac starved while i was away12:55
sivangah, I see12:56
* timeless_mbp goes to feed phone12:56
VenemoI'd like to install the latest fennec nightly, but I get "E: Handler silently failed" from apt-get12:56
sivangI hate when it happens. Sometimes it makes the battery die12:56
lcuktimeless_mbp, did any of the UK accents make you giggle more than others?12:56
Venemowhat can I do about this?12:56
timeless_mbplcuk: some were really hard to understand12:56
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timeless_mbplike N.I. (bus driver) having just gotten off the boat12:56
timeless_mbp(from Scotland)12:56
lcukheads up display showing subtitles might be good for future generations! :D12:57
jacekowskiwelsh is hard to understand12:58
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timeless_mbpignoring the bus driver...12:59
timeless_mbpi think i had more trouble w/ accents of women than men12:59
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timeless_mbpthat might be because the women were often talking to eachother or other locals13:02
timeless_mbpwhereas i was generally speaking directly with individual men13:02
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Khertan_Hi !13:12
Venemohey Khertan_ !13:12
Khertan_Does ovi store is wronking for you ?13:13
Khertan_i ll like to test Kroll13:13
Khertan_but ovistore said there is no content in all category13:13
VenemoKhertan_: weird13:13
Khertan_hi Venemo13:14
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* Khertan_ hate ovistore ... why they didn't put Kroll on the maemo repository !13:36
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timeless_mbpsp3000:  you @lunch?13:44
* timeless_mbp didn't quite wake up properly13:44
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sp3000lunched already13:45
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timeless_mbpdid you make it to 9am?13:46
timeless_mbphrm, picasa said copying 205 of 204 files...13:46
janiwas there anything interesting in the 9am meeting ?13:47
timeless_mbpi wasn't there13:48
timeless_mbpbut it shouldn't be discussed here13:48
timeless_mbpmaybe i can invite people to an afternoon tea :)13:48
* timeless_mbp goes back to coughing13:49
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tybollttimeless_mbp: will there be cookies?13:51
timeless_mbpi didn't pick up any on this trip ;(13:52
timeless_mbpbut yeah, i can probably spring for some13:52
Termanatimeless, and Nigerian Dog Attacks?13:52
timeless_mbpdo i want to know?13:53
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Termanatimeless, are you bringing some NDAs to your little tea party?13:56
timeless_mbptea would be served on the ground floor13:57
timeless_mbpso technically any visitor is able to visit13:57
timeless_mbpbut you're supposed to have a host and a guest badge13:57
timeless_mbpsince i don't know anything, someone else would have to bring the other stuff13:57
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janiground floor calling, i need a doze of freshly burned nicotine..14:00
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timeless_mbphrm, i'm 15mins away14:02
timeless_mbp(not counting time to import my photo album)14:03
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janibtw, is creating merge requests always *slow* in gitorious ?14:03
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Venemojani, gitorious is always slow14:03
timeless_mbpjani: i don't really know what gitorious merge requests *do*14:04
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janiomg. i just started to hate gitorious.  i need that break right now.14:06
timeless_mbpwell, i've imported another 1/2gb of photos14:07
timeless_mbpi guess i could visit the tea center14:07
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Venemo"apt-get install fennec" -> "E: Handler silently failed" :(((14:08
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Venemowtf is this error message?14:08
timeless_mbptry dpkg -i w/ partial/archives?14:09
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Venemotimeless_mbp: I'm sorry?14:10
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Khertan_Nokia-N900:~# apt-get install kroll Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done E: Handler silently failed15:26
Khertan_lol any idea ?15:26
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crashanddieKhertan_, try with apt-get -v install kroll15:30
crashanddieor -V15:30
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Khertan_crashanddie: thx i'll try once apt-get update finish his job :)15:34
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crashanddieits job :)15:34
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Khertan_crashanddie: but it didn't do its job well15:35
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jacktherippercan't I choose a file (or filesystem) on the N900 to expose instead of MyDocs when connected to a computer through USB ?15:37
jacktheripperno as in impossible, or no as in complicated ?15:38
mgedminalmost nothing is impossible in software15:38
jacktheripperthat's what I think.15:38
jacktheripperand that's also why I'm checking ke-recv's source.15:39
mgedminwhat problem are you trying to solve?15:39
jacktherippera linux rescue livecd that's stored on my phone and that can boot whatever computer.15:40
mgedminshould be15:40
crashanddiejacktheripper, i guess you could mount something else to /home/user/MyDocs15:40
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crashanddiejust mount an iso instead15:40
jacktheripperI'll try that15:41
crashanddieroot; umount /home/user/MyDocs; mount -o loop myfile.iso /home/user/MyDocs15:41
mgedminI used this recipe to make a bootable USB flash drive that boots an ISO image from a file in it:
crashanddiedon't know what the behaviour will be though.15:41
mgedmincrashanddie, won't work15:41
mgedminI'm 85% sure15:41
jacktherippermgedmin, that's probably possible, but the boot files right on MyDocs would look dirty I think. That would be my final resort. I'm trying to have the choice to choose any ISO to mount and expose to a computer.15:42
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jacktheripperor any filesystem image.15:43
mgedminjacktheripper, do you have a spare USB flash drive?15:43
mgedmincan you try dd'ing the ISO image into it and booting from it?15:43
mgedminthis needs special support from the ISO image, AFAIU15:43
mgedmine.g. Fedora's ISOs can be booted that way, Ubuntu's can't15:43
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jacktheripperI remember that :/15:44
mgedminso, if you've got an ISO image that can be booted directly, I suppose it should be possible to have a n900 map its USB mass storage device blocks directly to a file15:44
mgedminI wonder how that's done ...15:44
mgedminif the kernel needs a block device to export, you could always create a temporary loopback15:44
jaskachange the usb module to claim its an usb cd/dvd drive?:)15:45
jacktheripperand it'd be even better to fool a computer into thinking it's a usb optical drive15:45
jacktheripperbut to complicated15:45
mgedminshould be a fun project if you have a couple of months free time15:46
jacktheripperI tried changing the dev file in the shell scripts that are responsible for USB Mass Storage. It fails, saying device in use.15:46
jaskaor do something like what qemu does with vfat hd emulation to export a directory as a vfat hd15:46
jacktheripperI'd say it fails during mounting a loopback with vfat options.15:46
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mgedminjaska, ooooh15:53
mgedminbut that still wouldn't let two OSes use the same directory at the same time15:53
Khertan_crashanddie: lol no apt didn't find package kroll15:53
Khertan_ovi store is a major failure !15:53
jaskamgedmin, sortof.. perhaps if the vfat device pretends its removable so the "other" device using it doesnt write cache15:53
jaskanot sure how windows etc. react to a filesystem they think is a block device changes underneath them :)15:53
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* jaska shivers at the thought of doing the vfat emulator in kernelspace15:55
jacktheripperbah I'll just use unetbootin with an ubuntu image on MyDocs, I have explored the sources for too long.15:55
jaskai guess bioses cant boot from usb-cdc network device yet?:)15:56
mgedminis that the one that extracts the contents of the live CD all over your VFAT?15:56
mgedminthat sort of clutter is why I started figuring out how to convince grub to chain-boot an ISO image15:56
MohammadAG51using squashfs?15:56
jaskahmm... booting from a n900 over usb networking would be interesting15:57
MohammadAG51just use vfat15:57
MohammadAG51it's not really interesting :P15:57
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jaskawell, for certain values of interesting15:58
jaskai doubt any bios supports it15:58
jacktheripperis the MMC's lifetime only decreased by writes ?15:58
hrwwho remember my 2009.51 system-updates repository?15:59
Arkenoiwhat is recommended os for 770 now? i found 2007he to be best fit two years ago (2008 was unstable due to lack of resources), did anything change since then?15:59
hrwArkenoi: I would say os200615:59
hrwnever liked 2007he on 770 - it was hard to fit it in 64MB ram16:00
hrwSetting up mp-fremantle-generic-pr (10.2010.19-1.hrw1) ...16:00
hrwnow I can produce updates ;D16:00
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RST38hYou too, Brutus? =)16:01
Arkenoihrw: 2007he appears reasonably stable for me16:01
hrwArkenoi: without swap?16:01
Arkenoiwith some swap on mmc16:01
MohammadAG51i want 2009HE16:01
hrwArkenoi: I still have only that 64MB rs-mmc which was added16:01
hrwMeeGo 2.0 '770' edition16:02
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_trinehas anyone any idea why my petrovich wont open the folder when I start it,, it appears to attempt to start then just falls back to the n900 desktop and does nothing16:19
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crashanddieplay with it, stroke it, feed it.16:20
pupnikwhat's the simple, transparent way to send audio from laptop to stereo system?16:21
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crashanddiepupnik, a cable16:22
MohammadAG51a transparent one16:22
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pupnikthat's what i'm using now.  i like the latency16:22
crashanddielatency should be near nill16:22
crashanddieunless your soundcard was built in the 60s16:22
MohammadAG51what's the best way to route mic audio to speakers16:23
Termanacrashanddie has plenty of those, that's how he knows16:23
MohammadAG51other than calling echo123 using skype16:23
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xkr47MohammadAG51, sox I guess16:23
MohammadAG51i thought those were for xmas16:23
pupnikif you had a 770 hooked to stereo aux-in, how would you route laptop audio to it?16:24
xkr47sox is season-agnostic16:24
TermanaMohammadAG51, I have a much better solution than xkr4716:24
Termanaxkr47 solution is wimpy16:24
MohammadAG51Termana, oh boy16:24
TermanaHere's what you need to do16:24
* MohammadAG51 expects trolling16:24
* xkr47 pulls sox on his head and hides16:24
TermanaGet 2 N900s16:25
TermanaThen you need to call one of those N900s16:25
MohammadAG51sometimes... i wish i had +o16:25
Termanafrom the other one16:25
* MohammadAG51 kicks Termana in the nuts16:25
Termanaplug a double ended cable from the speaker hole on one of them into your microphone jack16:25
MohammadAG51there isn't a mic jack16:26
crashanddiesure there is16:26
TermanaFine, just put it on speaker16:26
TermanaSo your microphone picks the sound up16:26
* MohammadAG51 takes a flamethrower a shoves it in Termana's bum16:26
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* MohammadAG51 opens fire16:26
TermanaMohammadAG51, anyway, aren't you suppose to be dead?16:27
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TermanaSomeone on t.m.o said you were dead16:27
MohammadAG51yeah, seen it16:27
MohammadAG51i'm a zombie process16:27
xkr47t.m.o = trackmania original16:27
xkr47also, MohammadAG51 do you play team fortress 2 ? ;)16:28
MohammadAG51or too much orgy, oops16:28
MohammadAG51xkr47, nope, it looks childish :P16:28
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crashanddiebtw, MohammadAG51 any new replies on the faux-kernel-driver-hacker thread?16:28
MohammadAG51not that i've noticed16:28
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MohammadAG51xkr47, cod on the other hand...16:29
xkr47what are your favourite sites for browsing maemo5 apps ?16:30
crashanddiexkr47, IRC16:30
TermanaMaemo 5 apps?16:30
TermanaI didn't know there was any16:30
Sceltxkr47: http://nokian900applications.com16:30
crashanddiethere were16:30
Termanacrashanddie, until the repos stopped working at least16:31
xkr4716:30:54 Ignoring ALL from Termana16:31
crashanddieTermana, "there were any"16:31
MohammadAG51crashanddie, i can haz op?16:31
xkr47Scelt, thx16:31
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o MohammadAG5116:31
Termanacrashanddie, thanks, at least I know I always have you to correct my sentences16:31
TermanaHere we go16:31
* Termana gets ready to feel the pain of the kickhammer16:31
*** Termana was kicked by MohammadAG51 (I've been wanting to do this for a long, long time :P)16:31
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MohammadAG51/kick crashanddie backstab!16:32
*** MohammadAG51 sets mode: -o MohammadAG5116:32
xkr47bet someone could make a censored cartoon of this event16:32
* Khertan_ have finally found a work around to download kroll from this bugged ovistore16:32
TermanaThat has satisfied your needs for the day I suppose MohammadAG51? ;p16:32
Vertig0Is Ovistore accessable in MeeGo at this point?16:32
MohammadAG51Termana, nah, a month or 4 i'd say16:32
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MohammadAG51i wonder what crashanddie would've done if i kicked him16:33
Khertan_Vertig0: yep if the browser works but it ll be useless :)16:33
crashanddieadd a "veto MohammadAG51 becoming an op process" to my todo list.16:33
Vertig0Ok :)16:33
RST38hMohammadAG: Badmouth you, threaten your health, then ban you?16:33
_trineno matter what I seem to try petrovich refuses to do anything ,, any ideas anyone?16:34
MohammadAG51he wouldn't ban me, he'd lose his op if he did :P16:34
StskeepsMohammadAG51: x-fade's on vacation16:34
crashanddieI would lose a pain in the but16:34
TermanaRST38h, I was thinking more like secure him, being a security expert and all16:34
MohammadAG51why use petrovich when you can use the file manager16:34
MohammadAG51Stskeeps, err, f*ck16:34
* MohammadAG51 runs16:35
MohammadAG51crashanddie, i'd expect someone like you to know the difference between buts and butts16:35
crashanddienow I wrote butt to my manager16:36
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_trineMohammadAG51, well it was working and now it isnt ,, it may be something to do with the large amount of files I copied to the phone last night ,, perhaps I have a file stsem problem16:36
crashanddieIt's a good thing he doesn't understand english...16:36
Termanacrashanddie, At least you told him the truth - "I like big butts and I cannot lie!"16:36
MohammadAG51butt = mouth16:36
crashanddieI don't actually16:36
MohammadAG51then ask him to invite his wife for dinner16:36
MohammadAG51I got big booty bitches, big booty bitches16:37
MohammadAG51damn that song's epic16:37
crashanddiemate, this may be France, but I don't think inviting someone else's wife out for dinner is considered a nice thing to do between colleagues...16:37
MohammadAG51crashanddie, I didn't say you'd have to be with them16:37
MohammadAG51just tell him that butt = mouth, he'll do the rest of the fun stuff xD16:38
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crashanddieYou do realise I have to pay the bills and stuff16:39
crashanddieMohammadAG51, I'm not living the student life anymore, where electricity is included in the rent16:39
MohammadAG51electricity isn't included in rent here :P16:39
crashanddieso you pay electricity at home?16:40
MohammadAG51i was referring to student life :P16:41
MohammadAG51though i'm not living in a rent house16:41
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_trinehow can I check the integrity of Mydocs folder16:43
MohammadAG51umount /home/user/MyDocs16:43
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lcukleave a file containing $5000 on the root and see if Mydocs folder steals it16:44
MohammadAG51fsck.vfat -a /dev/mmcblk0p116:44
MohammadAG51lol lcuk16:44
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_trinestill no luck I have checked the FS reinstalled petrovich and rebooted but still it does not open the files and start16:51
_trineI cant think of anything else to check16:52
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_trineIs it possible to reinstall the blue tooth drives on the n90016:52
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crashanddieMohammadAG51, You utter PILLOCK16:55
* MohammadAG51 opens up google translate16:55
crashanddieMohammadAG51, you bloody trigger happy clot16:55
Khertan_someone know what it s the timezone of QA Quarantine ends: ENDED 2010-10-04 13:4516:55
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crashanddiewrong ubtton16:56
MohammadAG51hmm, shit16:56
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_trinecrashanddie, if you are not going to behave yourself you should be kicked16:56
crashanddieMohammadAG51, you fecking idiot, you couldn't even open up the .rar file to see if it even included the injection driver?16:56
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crashanddie_trine, oh right, sorry16:56
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MohammadAG51Noun for Idiot, fool. Originally a slang term for the penis but fairly inoffensive now its this meaning has been forgotten. Derog. ref British Slang Dictionary16:57
MohammadAG51that's a new word16:57
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MohammadAG51crashanddie, the rar has an install file that points to a repo16:57
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MohammadAG51which doesn't have any source, i don't care about injection drivers, he's breaking the gpl unless he upps a source16:58
TermanaI think I'm going to call the Cyber Police17:00
crashanddieMohammadAG51, I have his phone number :D17:00
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crashanddieand address17:01
MohammadAG51mine is in the maemo irc logs, somewhere17:01 claims PR1.3 coming in October17:01
MohammadAG51it is17:01
MohammadAG51October 201017:02
GAN900RST38h, it is or it's never coming.17:02
RST38hGAN: Why?17:02
MohammadAG51can someone at nokia please a trolololo boot screen?17:02
RST38hAre they closing down all Maemo development in October?17:02
RST38hMohammad: Better make a trololo tmo skin17:02
MohammadAG51or a "We Are Maemo, and we pronouce it like this, THE END"17:03
MohammadAG51"We Are Maemo, and we pronouce PR1.3 like this, THE END"17:03
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pupnikthey need that happy 60's orchestra sound for meego ads17:04 should go down on the 1st of April with a page that says "Shutdown forever" and then redirect in 5 seconds to a trololololo video17:04
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crashanddieTermana, or rather... an ironic "Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down..."17:05
Termanalol :p17:05
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sivangwhat's theat Trololololo video?17:09
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Termanasivang, I am disappoint17:09
sivangTermana: I apologize, been having a bad day17:09
Termanasivang, my favourite version: - the sing along! But I am disappointed because you have missed out on the whole internet meme17:11
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RST38hHmm, N8 seems to be having problems focusing17:13
Termanasivang, also, don't apologise, I was kidding ;P - I just don't have a life :P17:13
TermanaRST38h, it already had a problem before that17:13
RST38h*Or* Eldar Murtazin is shaking every time he holds this piece-of-shit-nokia-product in his puffy hands17:13
StskeepsRST38h: he's wanking at the same time17:14
TermanaStskeeps, lol17:14
RST38hStskeeps: I am almost inclined to believe it17:14
pupniki'm not sure eldar is qualified to review a camera at all17:14
RST38hpupnik: Well, he made photos and put them up for comparison17:14
MohammadAG51Stskeeps, I believe the word wanking doesn't nelong here, take it to the fapman thread17:14
Termanapupnik, I'm not sure Eldar is qualified to review anything17:14
StskeepsMohammadAG51: not helping17:15
RST38hpupnik: His commentary is kinda worthless, but the samples are of some interest of course17:15
sivangTermana: Not that I do :)  I occasionally do miss the whole internet meme - Not sure how I manage to do that, but after being told about something I go and read about it and use it after everybody else already forgot about it and then considered old-school :-p </teens-of-the-eighties>17:15
MohammadAG51eldar is only qualified to bitch about thigs17:15
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MohammadAG51i remember he said the N97 was awesome, it was shit17:15
MohammadAG51N900 was shit, it was awesome17:15
pupnikmy first high tech portable was a casette walkman17:15
MohammadAG51mine was an atari :p17:16
RST38hAnyways, samples here:
sivangmine was a spectra video and an atari17:16
RST38hiPhone 4 is postprocessing like crazy, BTW17:16
sivangatari for playing games, spectra video for BASIC programming17:16
pupnikyes it is17:16
MohammadAG51RST38h, indeed17:16
RST38hThe MSX-comparible SVI or their own design?17:17
MohammadAG51i've tried one, the effects are irreversible17:17
pupnikRST38h: the n8 is almost unique in the amount of dynamic range it preserves in photos - i don't know another phone that comes close17:17
sivangTermana: they guy in the video is Frankenstein?17:17
RST38hpupnik: I have not found anything unique in the samepls I have seen17:17
Termanasivang, no, what made you say that? :p17:17
RST38hpupnik: It isn't bad though, for a phone. Apparently has problem focusing.17:17
pupniklook for blown highlights and loss of shadow detail in competitors RST38h17:18
sivangTermana: he's horrific17:18
sivangRST38h: you bought one?17:18
crashanddiefuck me, the n8 makes horrible low-light pictures17:18
Termanasivang, watch out his last name is Khil. He'll Khill you17:18
sivangRST38h: these some niftly looking photos17:18
RST38hpupnik: Probably has other typical problems (low optical resolution, going pinkish in cloudy weather, going grayish in low light, etc)17:18
jaskakhil phil17:19
RST38hsivang: me? no.17:19
pupnikRST38h: i don't think the n8 focuses at all17:19
RST38hpupnik: That would be weird17:19
MohammadAG51pupnik, it does focus17:19
sivangRST38h: you wrote this russian article?17:19
RST38hsivang: No.17:19
crashanddiepupnik & RST38h: I'm thinking Eldar has parkinson's, he shakes all over the place17:19
pupnikoh i'm wrong17:19
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MohammadAG51OMG RST38h IS ELDAR17:19
pupnikit's the e7 with fixed focus17:19
sivangthat's eldar?17:19
sivangwho's eldar?17:19
* RST38h sighs17:19
* sivang misses yet another interenet meme17:20
RST38hsivang: Google, for Tentacled's sake...17:20
* sivang googes17:20
MohammadAG51a guy who gets all nokias early17:20
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MohammadAG51and makes them look like shit17:20
MohammadAG51just for the heck of it17:20
MohammadAG51i wonder if he has a job17:20
RST38hpupnik: I would not believe anything at :)17:20
_trinehas no one any idea about how i can get petrovich working again on my n90017:20
MohammadAG51use filebox17:21
RST38hpupnik: nor would I, of course, believe mobile-review, for obvious reasons17:21
* MohammadAG51 wouldn't believe Apple.com17:21
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pupnikyou can believe the published specs of a released phone.  stfu17:22
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RST38hpupnik: Wouldn't believe even that17:22
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RST38hpupnik: They usually omit important stuff ;)17:22
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crashanddiecrap, again.17:22
RST38hpupnik: Like N900 optics having worse resolution than its sensor17:23
sivangwhat's the deal with the video?17:23
sivangwhy is it an interenet meme?17:23
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pupnikgood point RST38h17:24
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crashanddieRST38h, that's actually quite common17:24
lcukRST38h, huh? optics being analog lens17:24
lcukthat has no concept of resolution or pixels?17:25
crashanddielcuk, sure they do17:25
RST38hlcuk: oh you can make a lens in many different ways ;)17:25
RST38hlcuk: But for the purpose of experiment, do this:17:25
pupniki forgot how the lens limits resolution17:25
RST38hlcuk: Walk outside, focus your N900 on some far-away building with a lot of detail (appartment blocks will do) and make a shot17:26
RST38hlcuk: Choose the best available weather (have you still got sun there? :))17:26
RST38hlcuk: Once you make the shot, zoom all the way in and see what the details of those buildings look like17:26
sivangTermana: ^^17:26
RST38hlcuk: I can almost bet you will not see any detail at all, just spots17:26
crashanddieRST38h, not really an accurate description of MTF, but well...17:26
RST38hcrashanddie: Well, I am going for a practical test17:27
lcukRST38h, its digital zoom and camera sensors are noisy since they are small.  thats known anyway?17:27
lcukbut not related to the lens optics17:27
crashanddieRST38h, plus, that test can be buggered by weird ISO and poor processing on the N900's part.17:27
RST38hlcuk: Do not use digital zoom. Use the best available weather.17:27
sivangis there a video of Murtazin somewhere?17:27
RST38hlcuk: So, no digizoom. No noise to speak about (hell, configure FCamera to use smallest ISO)17:27
RST38hlcuk: You will STILL get garbage. Try it.17:28
pupnikgood camera lenses need more depth than people are willing to pocket in a cell phone17:28
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Termanasivang, - you may need to bookmark knowyourmeme ;) :p17:28
sivangnokia published in the official blog that he has unlawufully obtained Nokia devices17:28
RST38hlcuk: Please note that even our little family Casio (whose main selling feature was "makes Youtube videos") will pass this test quite nicely17:28
sivangTermana: great! Now I will never miss a meme again17:28
lcukhubble takes amazing pixtures with its 1mpixel sensor17:28
_trineMohammadAG51, I have just tried to install filebox and the n900 refused ,, it said some application packages required for the installation are missing17:29
lcukbecause it has pels about 4 metres each :D17:29
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lcukRST38h, i dont know what I am looking for17:29
lcukjoin in with the crowds and post a blog17:29
lcukshowing the issue17:29
RST38hlcuk: You know what I think of blogs. I will get you an image of this though.17:30
crashanddielcuk, MTF describes how much of the subject brightness (which varies tremendously) is being sent through to the sensor. More info at:
lcukand get one that doesnt show it from your other camera17:30
pupniki want to see a camera mfgr ballsy enough to do another side-oriented camera that can have a 2-3cm deep zoom optics17:30
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lcukto be honest tho, i just use the camera and take happy shots17:30
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sivangTermana: very nice, I'll RSS17:31
lcuklots of photos and not noticed anything that makes me go "arghhh"17:31
crashanddielcuk, look at my latest tweet to Jussi17:31
RST38hlcuk: A lot of people are incapable of being permanently happy17:32
pupnikHave any of you seen the n8 video?  How is it for tearing/wobblies?17:32
RST38hlcuk: In fact, I would call permanent unconditional happiness a psychological deviation :)17:32
lcukRST38h, I didnt mean like that17:32
crashanddiepupnik, just like most sensors, it sucks at fast panning17:32
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lcukcrashanddie, post link i cant find anything in my twitter stream17:33
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pupnikcrashanddie: it's depressing how meaningless "720p" video is today, to describe video quality, with this range we have17:33
crashanddielcuk, yeah, and the fuzziness around everything 9bricks in the wall facing left, red noise in the grass all over, etc) makes that picture OK-ish in 30% reduction, and nearly unusable in 100% crop17:33
lcuknearly unusable?17:34
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crashanddiein 100% crop.17:34
crashanddie(photo geek term for original size, showing every pixel)17:34
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SpeedEvilOriginal size? 1/5th of an inch?17:35
crashanddieSpeedEvil, no, displaying every pixel for what it is, without reducing the total size of the image17:35
sivangso nokiaqtsdk is stuck at 76%17:35
sivangand not progressing further17:35
crashanddieeven if it means panning/scrolling.17:35
sivanganybody an idea?17:35
RST38hlcuk: Here it is:
SpeedEvilYeah - I've said that for a long time17:36
RST38hlcuk: Zoom in, look at the skyline17:36
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sx0ni am glad that i am just regular photographer17:36
RST38hlcuk: Notice the perfect shooting conditions17:36
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* sivang gives up and fetches the offline version17:37
SpeedEvilThat's not quite right17:37
SpeedEvilthe whites are blown out17:37
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SpeedEvilIf you corrected the exposure, it'd look a bit better17:37
lcuk"blown out"?17:37
crashanddielcuk, notice how fuzzy the right-hand wall gets after about 2 meters from the camera? Even immediately to the right, the "white" is noisy. Everywhere you look, it's noisy17:37
lcuki think it looks pretty RST38h17:38
RST38hSpeed: I tried several different exposures17:38
RST38hSpeed: Same shit with the skyline17:38
lcukcrashanddie, not really its going over a whole range of focus depths17:38
lcukso its expected?17:38
crashanddienot at all17:38
crashanddieyou should expect bokeh, not noise.17:38
SpeedEvilYou do realise that focus depth with a 1.6mm lens loses all meaning over a couple of meters?17:39
RST38hSpeed: Yes17:39
lcukbut i fail to see a problem with the images i have17:39
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RST38hSpeed: But any other camera will still focus on "infinity" in this picture17:39
SpeedEvilThey are not bad, for a phone.17:39
lcuksince they are 100x better than they used to be17:39
lcuknow i learnt how to stop moving17:39
lcukas much as possible17:39
lcuktracy is great at taking photos17:39
* MohammadAG51 needs training17:39
RST38hlcuk: Taxidermy!17:39
MohammadAG51the N86 shoots photos in less than half a second17:40
MohammadAG51the N900 needs a second or two17:40
sx0n4000*3000 takes some time to capture17:40
lcukprefocused and flash17:41
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lcuktake time too17:41
MohammadAG51the N900 takes more time to capture the image, from half press to full press, the N86 beats it hands down17:41
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MohammadAG51the N86's flash is brighter17:41
lcukfair enough17:41
MohammadAG51even though it's dual LED17:42
MohammadAG51looking at the flash on the N86 isn't pleasant17:42
sx0ni have managed to get some red eye pictures with n8, should there be some kind of dual flash etc to remove that?17:42
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crashanddielcuk, notice the difference in fuzziness around the colour edges compared with a 100% crop of a n900 picture?17:44
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lcukcrashanddie, ? taken with a dslr?17:46
crashanddieyeah, with a 5dmkii17:47
* lcuk likes
dnearyI'm right in thinking that the Maemo 5 messaging application is not free software, amn't I?17:47
dnearyOr is it just Empathy on speed?17:47
crashanddieyou am17:47
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crashanddieor you amn't, depends on how you look at it.17:47
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pupniki thought the n900 camera was pretty awesome tbh, but then again i was coming from the n81017:48
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sivangI hink it is awesome indeed17:48
sivangI saw iphone's produce and it's far inferior in my taste17:48
crashanddiestop frigging comparing everything with the iphone, for f's sake.17:48
crashanddiefor a day-to-day, don't-give-a-crap-about-picture-quality-and-just-want-to-immortalize-a-day-out-with-the-family, the n900 is fine17:49
sivangcrashanddie: I was just thinking, "but quim said on the goals for meego that beating iphone cannot be a goal per se"17:49
pupnikIt has the best linux-phone camera, at least :)17:49
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lcukdneary, i think its mostly closed.17:49
lcukpupnik, past tense? the n900 camera is still awesome17:49
lcukand seriously outclasses the old family digital camera17:50
pupnikthen that camera sucked17:50
lcukespecially now with us having 2 of them, we get sets of comparable photos17:50
lcukpupnik, possibly17:50
fluxfcamera is nice as well. is there a way to replace the builtin camera app with that?17:50
lcukbut it was what we knew and used it17:50
lcuksivang, making something as XYZ beater never realistically gets you anywhere17:51
pupnikanyway n900 camera is plenty good enough for me.  i wouldn't want to pay a lot more for a better one tbh17:51
lcukfor years people were wanting to make a better walkman than sony17:51
dnearylcuk, Thought so17:51
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dnearyJust watched Sintel - pretty amazing17:51
lcukpupnik, the n8 camera is obviously good too17:51
dnearyThose guys get better with every film17:52
dnearyAs you'd expect, I suppose...17:52
crashanddiedneary, I was a bit disappointed by the Sintel scenario17:52
pupnikyeah lcuk i got to see side by side n8 vs n900 pics.  the n900 doesn't do too bad, but n8 has the edge17:52
sivanglcuk: true17:52
sivangenough with all this beating!17:52
crashanddiedneary, I mean, I understood the whole "oh crap, I've been doing this for 30 years" instant, but I really felt like crap that she killed her dragon.17:52
lcuksivang, bring out the bacon fat and make your own path17:53
dnearycrashanddie, That's the point17:53
sivangso the sdk installer downloades stuff at 1M per 2 seconds from a92-122-135-154.deploy.akamaitechnologies.com17:53
kerio BACON!11111111111117:53
pupniki really liked n8's auto-white balance too. plus combined with that black screen.. it's just so fun .. argh.17:53
dnearycrashanddie, But then the continuity of the baby dragon following her (after she'd just killed their daddy, no less) was nice17:53
lcukbtw, this fire dragon only made flames for ~0.5second17:53
* sivang thinks to open a bug report to qt people about adding special progress for the MADDE download17:53
lcukme and tracy were stood there with cameras poised waiting to catch it17:54
crashanddiedneary, if I want to feel like shit, I'll watch Requiem for a Dream, I want shortfilms to make me think, or laugh...17:54
sivangsince it is much larger and takes much more time17:54
dnearycrashanddie, But then, maybe we shouldn't be spoiling the plot for everyone who hasn't seen it, no?17:54
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crashanddiedneary, they had it coming if they didn't watch it yet.17:54
dnearycrashanddie, /me never seen req for dream17:54
dnearycrashanddie, I only just watched it for the first time today17:54
dnearycrashanddie, At a conference all last week when it came out17:54
crashanddieI'm playing the world's smallest violin, just for you :)17:55
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crashanddiesx0n, red eye is really not something you can remove accurately, no matter the camera17:57
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lindi-whoops :)17:57
RST38hcrashanddie: actually, just remove bright red :)17:57
crashanddiehow is that helping anything?17:57
crashanddieWhat if you're taking a photo of santa?17:57
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crashanddieHE'LL BE GREY!!!17:57
crashanddiecase $loc: s/GREY/GRAY/;17:58
dnearycrashanddie, Sure you can - accurate selection tools & apply curves or levels to the red channel17:58
dnearyIt'll be perfectly acceptably realistic17:59
crashanddiedneary, that's post processing :)17:59
dnearyNeed to be careful not to put a cyan tint on the whites of the eyes...17:59
crashanddieanyone able to call international for free?17:59
dnearycrashanddie, Sure17:59
crashanddiedneary, call: +34 620 379 905, and tell him that he's a dick for violating GPL :P18:00
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Termanacrashanddie, have you done so?18:02
crashanddiehe's not answering18:02
TermanaHe knows18:02
TermanaHe must be watching us18:02
TermanaAnd in that case I have one thing to say:18:03
TermanaFuck you18:03
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crashanddieTermana, I had a couple of people ask me to ban you because of your rude behaviour.18:03
Termanacrashanddie, heh, really? Couple of people being MohammadAG51? :p18:04
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GAN900Ban ban ban!18:04
TermanaHit me with your best shot!18:04
crashanddieI simply replied saying they were fucking idiots.18:04
Stskeepsand people have been pissed about your behaviour too, crashanddie - so how about we all just fight in person after getting hammered on tequila?18:04
crashanddiewho the hell did I piss off lately?18:05
crashanddieI've been seriously nice and making efforts and all for the past few months18:05
Stskeepsnote on 'have'18:05
crashanddiewell, yeah, but what can I say, I was under a lot of stress?18:06
crashanddieI promise honey, it'll be different now?18:06
MilhouseI've just been banned from engadget :) Pointed out a sight that highlighted how biased they were in their N8 vs iPhone4 camera comparison - wasn't at all sweary, just posted a link to the debunking web site and suggested they might want to post a retraction - instead they wiped my post and banned me. Unbelievable! :)18:06
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Stskeepsdon't call me honey, you know it makes me blush18:06
Milhousesight => site18:06
MilhouseBlog Nazis... gits.18:07
sivangStskeeps: lol18:07
crashanddieMilhouse, not necessarily :)18:07
StskeepsMilhouse: so there's worse places than tmo ;)18:07
Milhousecrashanddie: Not nazis, gits or they didn't wipe my post and ban me?18:07
MilhouseStskeeps: Oh yes, much worse! :)18:08
crashanddieMilhouse, sight/site18:08
GAN900Milhouse, links are spam.18:08
Milhousecrashannie: aha...18:08
GAN900Milhouse, spammer.18:08
MilhouseGAN900: Not all, only those that show engadget to be a bunch of biased hacks18:08
GAN900Either way, your first mistake was posting on Engadget. *g*18:08
MilhouseGAN900: Clearly... will have to register with a new account now! :)18:08
GAN900It's link when a friend of mine got baited into arguing on YouTube.18:09
MilhouseGAN900: Some of the anti-Nokia, anti-MeeGo shite they post is incredible18:09
GAN900Much like newspapers, it's all editorial.18:09
MilhouseGAN900: I wonder how much financial harm some of the non-journalists cause, considerable when their posts go unchallenged and treated as fact18:10
GAN900A bit, I'd say18:10
GAN900But what can you do?18:10
crashanddieMilhouse, to quote the title of a song by Skunk Anansie: "Yes It's fucking Political"18:11
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MilhouseNokia do seem to be a magnet for bad press whether it's justified or not - it seems to be a popular sport these days. That Russian buffoon is leading the charge as usual.18:11
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GAN900Nokia hasn't done itself many favors.18:15
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crashanddieEvery company is a magnet for bad press18:15
crashanddieIt really just depends of the websites you look at18:15
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nidOthe bias on "popular" sites against nokia is just incredible though18:16
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nidOI couldnt help but laugh all the way through the iphone vs blackberry vs n8 usability test on gizmodo the other day18:17
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kerionidO: link pls18:19
MilhouseI prefer to avoid sites that are pro-Nokia in an attempt to get a more unbiased opinion, but most of the "popular" tech web sites seem to pleasure in taking pot shots at Nokia, as if it's some kind of new sport.18:19
Milhousenid0: that was shocking18:19
nidOits like... fast typer with months of using an iphone, vs fast typer with months of using a blackberry, vs arthritic cripple with 20 seconds of looking at an n818:19
nidO"zomg n8 sux!"18:20
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Milhousenid0: here's a video "reply" to Gizmodo:
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nidOyar i saw it, says a lot18:21
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MilhouseWhat *is* interesting about these engadget and Gizmodo hatchet jobs, is that an awful lot of people are seeing through it and in many cases bigging up the N8, which is heatening - Nokia really do need it to succeed.18:23
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* DocScrutinizer2 moos at GAN900 and shows crashanddie how to properly remove a red eye. Using small spoon helps a lot18:23
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_trineDocScrutinizer2, would you have any idea why petrovich on my N900 has stopped working18:25
_trineit no longer opens the folder as it once did18:26
_trineI see others on the net have had the same problem but there does not appear to be a solution I can find18:26
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DocScrutinizer_trine: not really, but I as well had lots of issues with petrovich, and cuteexplorer (or somesuch) comes with BT file sending as one of many useful options18:27
nidOhas petrovich even been updated to work with 1.2? it's been kinda pointless since then18:27
_trineit used to work ok until yesterday and its still working on my wifes N90018:28
_trineand both phones are on 1.218:28
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DocScrutinizernevermind petrovich, use cute explorer18:28
_trinecan cute explorer send vis BT18:29
nidOyou can send files via bt using the built-in file manager18:29
_trinenidO, whats the builtin file manager called18:30
nidOwell in your app list, "File manager".18:30
DocScrutinizeryes, even HFM can 'publish' 'over BT'18:30
_trinepetrovich was so easy to use18:31
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DocScrutinizerbut CuteExplorer can access *whole* filesystem, not only the crippled version holding 2 folders "MyDocs" and "media/mmc1" that Nokia thinks are sufficient for users to have access to them18:32
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nidOwell, nokia are right. enthusiast device or not, giving whole filesystem access via a ui file manager out of the box is asking for problems18:33
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nidOofc, an option to enable access to the rest of the fs woulda been nice to have.18:33
DocScrutinizerhmm, hiding 2/3 of the fs is asking just for different problems18:33
nidOyes, but those problems are "bah, i have to use shell / install another filemanager" rather than "waaa i borked my phone".18:34
nidOI can easily imagine which nokia prefers.18:34
jdhaving full access to the fs through alternative file managers and shell is good enough for me18:34
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jdthere isn't any real lock anywhere18:34
DocScrutinizernidO: my words since 12 months: have a textedit field to enter arbitrary current directories (without restrictions) like on OSX finder18:34
jdi wish they had made / bigger though18:34
jd256mb is tight18:35
jdother than that i have no issues with anything18:35
jdi just made symlinks to fix some stuff and it works fine now i guess18:35
lcukGAN900, "But what can you do?"    <<< we can try to do as Nokia should do: innovate18:36
DocScrutinizernidO: that's nonsense (borked my phone), you got permissions for that, which reliably keep restricted user from "borking phone"18:36
_trineit seems really odd that petrovich can no longer open the file system18:36
lcukget off haunches and actually make something revolutionary :)18:36
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DocScrutinizernidO: if you got a proper complete pathname in your filemanager, and can cd up and down like on any usual unix, that doesn't mean user can erase or modify arbitrary files. It just means display isn't artificially messed up so even experienced users need to think each time about "wtf was 'Documents' now?? :-/"18:39
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DocScrutinizerhonestly, a filemanager that doesn't allow user to even *read* own $HOME, that's completely insane18:40
jdi've had a n900 for a few months now18:41
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jdand so far it's the best phone i've ever had18:41
jdthe battery life isnt even that bad compared to other phones i had before, it lasts me 2 days or so on a charge with regular use18:41
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keriothe n900 is ridiculously great18:44
TomaszDhas tmo gone to the grave permanently?18:44
kerioshame it has some really, really stupid flaws :(18:44
nidODocScrutinizer: it's effectively a neverending argument though. If the default filesystem could read the entire fs, someone would complain that it should run as root, afterall its not a file "manager" if you cant manage the files because the user filemanager cant touch root-owned files. a middle ground between having users borking phones and making the filesystem inaccessible has to be found,18:44
nidOand as I said, having an *option* to access the full fs would be nice, I can fully see why it doesnt allow it as standard18:44
nidOdefault filesystem = default filemanager*18:44
kerionidO: why the hell would you want to change files as root from a graphical filemanager18:44
crashanddieMy Blackberry 9700 holds a week with daily usage18:44
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nidOkerio: I wouldnt. but then, im happy making changes via shell anyway, lack of graphical filesystem to access above docs doesnt much bother me18:45
kerionow, having the browser inable to choose arbitrary files... that's bad18:45
DocScrutinizer51nidO: which desktop linux has such rationale? was the fact none (except mac) has ever a problem?18:46
kerioDocScrutinizer: the Finder has options to show hidden&system files18:47
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DocScrutinizer51kerio: I know, I mentioned that above18:47
kerioand you can just tell it to go to /bin/ or whatever18:47
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kerioreally, how is one supposed to upload a file in... /home/user/ to a website18:50
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DocScrutinizerit's always the same, someone has a good concept to hide complex functions from default MMI and streamline UX, and then epigons implement the same basic simplified UX but completely leave out the extended functions that originally only were hidden18:50
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DocScrutinizerthen 3rd party jumps in to the void and offers complementary means to cope with the missing 'advanced functions' in that crippled UI, and so the whole originally nice concept is turned into an awfull mess18:54
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DocScrutinizerand everybody claim " *I* did the _right_ thing!"18:55
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kerioDocScrutinizer: is the file manager opensource?18:57
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kerioso patch it :)18:57
DocScrutinizerit needs patching of the underlying or whatever. Or why do you think pertovic did same shit like HFM?18:58
DocScrutinizerit's the file selector widget that is completely fscked up18:58
DocScrutinizernot HFM18:59
timeless_xchatjaffa, i got "Location not detected"18:59
DocScrutinizertbh I'd not even say a word about HFM implementing that. It's the fact the whole system is built to force app devels into same shit19:00
_trineDocScrutinizer, what could have changed on my N900 to stop petrovich from picking up the files?19:01
DocScrutinizersorry, no idea19:02
yaccAny quick way to make the N900 reconnect the chat services?19:02
yaccWithout going "online" => "offline" => "online"?19:03
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_trinepetrovich is only 1 file in /user/bin and I have reinstalled it and it still does not work so it must be something else that has changed somewhere19:05
DocScrutinizerkerio: see tickets about "HFM doesn't display file extensions", "HFM doesn't show full patchname" and the idiocy you can't tell apart 2 file of same basename in backup app, even when one of the files is on uSD and the other stored on the phone. WTF!19:05
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timeless_xchatyacc: you can create profiles that are subsets of offline19:06
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yacctimeless_xchat, ?19:07
infobottimeless_xchat meant: yacc: you can create profiles that are subsets of online19:07
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timeless_xchatand switch from online to a subset that excludes the account you want to kick19:07
timeless_xchatand then switch back to online19:07
yacctimeless_xchat, how do I do that?19:09
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yaccAh well, yes, I meant anyway not "offline" (flight mode), but "offline" (IM presence).19:09
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yaccI was thinking more along the line of one button to click to make it refresh it's connections.19:10
MohammadAG51<Termana> crashanddie, heh, really? Couple of people being MohammadAG51? :p19:10
MohammadAG51i don't usually report people19:11
MohammadAG51-1 for you19:11
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MohammadAG51meh, he's offline19:11
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timeless_xchatyacc: i'm talking about presence19:23
timeless_xchatwe don't have a ui to create phone profiles19:24
timeless_xchatonly im status profiles19:24
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MohammadAG51what's the dev node for a mic?19:43
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DocScrutinizerdev node for mic? don't think there's such a thing19:57
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: there's /dev/snd/* holding device nodes for the ADCs & DACs available in the system20:03
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: and there's */controlC0 as lowest level access to mixer, aiui. Mic has no own device node, as it's not a distinct device20:04
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_trinefrom wht I can see of it all these blue tooth apps only send 1 file at a time,, is this correct?20:16
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Goliath23hi. qtcreator offers me to update from qt 4.6 to qt 4.7 .. can I still target pr 1.2 after that?20:45
Goliath23(on the n900 I mean)20:45
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lcukGoliath23, qt4.7 is at present in -devel20:49
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mecelcuk, qt4.7 final?20:51
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lcukmece, not sure if its been updated since the final came out20:52
lcukhave a look on packages though20:52
mecelcuk, don't think so.20:52
lcuk do know qt4.7 is wriggling around other places though20:52
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* MohammadAG51 wants Frets on Fire20:54
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Goliath23lcuk: where can I search through the repo contents? is there something like
timeless_mbpsp3000: oh21:06
lcukyes Goliath23
timeless_mbpi think i know why my mac is starting to slow down!21:06
Goliath23lcuk: thanks21:06
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timeless_mbpi only have 10gb of disk space left on my mac21:07
lcuktimeless_mbp, you added a tinfoil hat?21:07
timeless_mbplcuk: kinda21:07
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timeless_mbplcuk: basically every time my system tries to write to disk, i think it has to think harder about finding space21:09
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Venemowhat's the difference between 'su' and 'su -' ?21:12
FauxFauxOne destroys the environment more.21:13
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VenemoFauxFaux: ?21:13
FauxFauxVenemo: ?21:13
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VenemoFauxFaux: what do you mean by "destroys the environment", and how much "more"?21:14
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RST38hmoo all21:14
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FauxFauxVenemo: Try it and find out?  Observe the current directory etc.21:14
VenemoFauxFaux: well, I haven't noticed anything different yet, but someone once told me that 'su -' is "better" - he didn't explain why though21:15
lcuktimeless_mbp, sounds like many things21:15
lcukhaving a good cleanup and reorganisation should do you good :P21:15
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timeless_mbplcuk: i don't have that much data..21:19
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timeless_mbpi mean, sure, 175gb of vm's :)21:20
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ZogGis TMO down?21:27
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Venemohm... when launching the Maemo 5 SDK, Xephyr displays only a blank black window... what can be the issue?21:28
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Venemoit was working previously21:29
sp3000man my microwave is dumb21:29
sp3000noo I can't add 10s to the time after it's started. or 10min for that matter21:29
sp3000I can add 1min, but not with the button labeled 1min21:29
sp3000but the start button21:29
* timeless_mbp rotfl21:30
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Stskeepssp3000: fixed release schedule microwave21:30
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timeless_mbpStskeeps: upgrades available for 150EUR21:31
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timeless_mbpoh, and upgrades don't include a warranty21:31
* timeless_mbp is almost done reading spam21:32
timeless_mbpit's sad, but reading spam is so much faster than reading mail21:32
Venemohere is the error message: Could not create server lock file: /tmp/.X2-lock21:33
RST38hyou have got another Xephyr running21:33
Venemono I haven't21:33
RST38hdo ls -l /21:33
RST38hand paste the "tmp" line21:34
sp3000timeless_mbp: you'd wish all mail was spam! ...oh, wait21:34
VenemoRST38h: drwxrwxrwt.  28 root root 12288 Oct  4 20:33 tmp21:34
RST38hDO ls -l /tmp/.X*21:35
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wmaroneTMO is toast21:36
Venemohow so?21:36
Venemowhat happened to it?21:36
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wmaronevbulletin database error21:36
Corsacthe n770 has frozen?21:36
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VenemoRST38h: should I delete the folder it is trying to access from /tmp ?21:36
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VenemoCorsac: lol!21:36
RST38hVenemo: rm -rf /tmp/.X2-lock21:37
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MohammadAG51fucking router21:37
VenemoRST38h: rm: cannot remove `/tmp/.X2-lock': Operation not permitted21:37
* RST38h sighs: some people are really better off with Windows21:38
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Venemo'su -c 'rm -rf /tmp/.X2-lock'' did the trick21:38
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MohammadAG51Nokia's devs? :P21:38
MohammadAG51Oh noes21:39
VenemoFatal server error:21:39
MohammadAG51tmo database error21:39
VenemoCannot establish any listening sockets - Make sure an X server isn't already running21:39
Venemothis is what it says21:39
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timeless_mbphrm, i guess i could get some space back by deleting a 50gb vm image :)22:00
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jukwhere is radio list located by default from vanila image ?22:06
jukone the best things I get from bying N90022:06
juklearn some deutch also22:07
jukand finish :D22:07
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juksorry Finnish22:08
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jukFinnish Phone :D22:09
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jukwhere is radio list located by default from vanila image ?22:10
MohammadAG51what radio list22:10
MohammadAG51all N900s have the same radios22:11
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jukMohammadAG51: I mean internet radio, music22:11
MohammadAG51oh, idk22:12
jukMohammadAG51: I listed for xml, html, txt, list nothing22:12
jukMohammadAG51: they did some modifications I guess22:13
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jukMohammadAG51: idk, thats it?22:14
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RST38hFun fun fun, make note of the AknUi usage :)))22:19
jukMohammadAG51: ok i'll try to decrypt what idk meant, see ya22:20
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MohammadAG51infobot, wtf idk22:20
infobotGee...  I don't know what idk means...22:20
MohammadAG51idk = that22:20
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pupnikhow is the latency through that gateway n900evil ?22:31
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Venemohey guys22:46
Venemothis is what Xephyr keeps saying to me22:46
Venemocould anyone please help?22:46
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larsemilanyone knows if there is any new phone coming with maemo on it? n900 is starting to get bit old?22:47
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Venemolarsemil: the next release will probably have new hardware. there are rumours but nothing is announced yet22:48
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larsemilno other vendors picking it up?22:48
larsweyi miss my N900 :(22:48
larsweydidnt stand 2 hours under salt water22:48
pupnikimagine n900 with bigger screen and more keys22:49
pupnikthat would make my gumdrops burst with flavor22:49
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Venemopupnik: what happened?22:50
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pupnikpicture stretching n900 screen a couple centimeters each direction to get 1024x600 or somth22:51
GAN900pupnik, I want more DPI.22:52
pupnikdiminishing returns GAN900 - where does it end?22:52
Venemopupnik: "i miss my N900 :("... what happened to it?22:54
pupnikwater splashed onto keyboard22:54
pupnikbut it's beyond the loan date now anyway22:55
DocScrutinizerseem infobot has grammatical problems, correct wording is "Gee...  I don't know IS what idk means..." X-P22:55
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GAN900pupnik, when I can't see pixels with a magnifying glass.22:55
n900evilwhat gateway?22:55
pupniktor n900evil22:55
n900evilthis is not a pipe.22:56
ds3not being able to see pixels is a good thing22:56
pupnikn900 is too high dpi for old eyes22:56
GAN900We're damn close with the N900.22:56
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GAN900pupnik, that's a software problem.22:56
pupniki'd like to see more AI now.  pixels don't excite22:57
DocScrutinizerthere's no such thing like "too high DPI", at least for user experience. Too high DPI just *could* really mean "too weak GFX engine"22:58
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pupnikDocScrutinizer: - i think all factors must be in balance22:58
Arkenoiwell, i guess 300-350 dpi could be kinda enough :-)22:59
n900evilToo high dpi is under 60nm dot pitch22:59
DocScrutinizerpupnik: why?22:59
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pupnikDocScrutinizer: engineering and economic trade-offs22:59
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DocScrutinizern900evil: yep, when the DPI actually starts creating optically active structures, then that's for sure too high DPI23:00
DocScrutinizerpupnik: that's not "too high DPI", rather that's "too expensive display" then23:00
n900evilMore seriously, I am unconvinced by arguments for over 250dpi23:00
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DocScrutinizern900evil: >>250 DPI come in just handy, for HMDs ;-)23:01
pupnikok thanks DocScrutinizer - i see your point now23:01
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n900evilHMD sure.23:02
n900evilfor that you want 2500023:02
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VenemoScratchbox and Xephyr keep screwing me up23:03
Venemohere is what it says:
Venemocould anyone please help me?23:03
poghello, does it harm, to reformat the FAT32 space to FAT32 and ext? Because I prefer some space for a linux installation.23:05
pogI talk from the N90023:05
lcukVenemo, tried rebooting?23:05
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Venemolcuk, yes23:07
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lcukoooer Venemo23:08
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lcuki dont normally use xephyr myself so havent seen this23:08
lcukDocScrutinizer, what ppi is the CCD on the n900?23:08
Venemoand Scratchbox login tells me, "Session setup problem, abort."23:08
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DocScrutinizerdamn, I installed a few apps yesterday for testing them (e.g flashlight-extra, tower cell info...) and it seems something is causing considerable hickups of whole system now :-/23:09
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, flashlight-extra23:09
MohammadAGsee dmesg, it gave a shitload of kernel errors23:09
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: yup, I as well suspect that one23:09
MohammadAGUnable to start flashlight-extra23:09
MohammadAGdsme: respawning23:09
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MohammadAGlemme try and find eit23:10
DocScrutinizerlcuk: the math is easy, no?23:10
MohammadAGSep 22 23:48:37 Nokia-N900 init: flashlight-extra main process ended, respawning23:10
lcukDocScrutinizer, sure if the variables are known, I don't know the sensor dimensions23:10
MohammadAGSep 22 23:48:52 Nokia-N900 init: flashlight-extra main process ended, respawning23:11
DocScrutinizerlcuk: sensor?23:11
lcukccd sensor23:11
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DocScrutinizerlcuk: according to my tools used this very minute the display is 78mm wide23:11
DocScrutinizerand has 800 as we all know23:11
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DocScrutinizerso DPI is 800 / (78 / 25.4) if I'm not completely wrong23:12
VenemoI'll try to reboot again23:12
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lcukDocScrutinizer, CCD23:12
lcukthe camera sensor23:13
lcuknot the screen display23:13
DocScrutinizerooh, ccd. I guess we don't have any CCD on N90023:13
DocScrutinizeryeah, camera is cmos23:13
DocScrutinizeranyway, idk23:13
MohammadAGso, the back sensor is IR23:13
MohammadAGit detects colour, so I'm assuming it detects how much the IR is reflected23:13
lcukcos thats at the sort of resolution n900evil needs for an eyeball one :P23:14
MohammadAGsadly, both the front proximity sensor and the back sensor flash at a very high rate23:14
lcukand ahhh i thought all cameras were CCD :$23:14
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MohammadAGwhich imo, would save a lot of battery if they didn't23:14
* lcuk never needed to dig deeper23:14
MohammadAGwhy didn't they go the N95-way23:14
MohammadAGa mechanical switch for camera, and a menu item to unmount the card23:15
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what are you after??23:15
MohammadAGNokia's hardware designer's head23:15
DocScrutinizerhmm, lemme reprase23:15
MohammadAG"I deleted boot, please help" nice thread title23:16
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what's the problem, what's the topic?23:16
lcuka mechanical button being used on a removable/movable piece wears easily23:16
lcuk(speaking of the reasoning for the camera slide detection23:16
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, why the hell does the proximity sensor not turn off23:16
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MohammadAGwhy doesn't it stay off until needed23:16
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: because somebody keeps the device node open23:17
MohammadAGlcuk, my N95's been working fine for 3 years, or a bit more23:17
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lcukMohammadAG, idk then23:17
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, that wastes battery life23:18
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MohammadAGnot by a lot, but it does waste battery life23:18
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: the sensors are amazingly humble on power23:18
MohammadAGso they can't be exploited as a mug warmer, DAMN IT23:19
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MohammadAGtracker is on my PC23:23
Stskeepskill it with fire!23:23
MohammadAGthank you canonical, that's all I needed to rape my CPU23:23
MohammadAG 1961 mohammad  20   0 88740  14m 3924 S   75  0.4  22:08.62 tracker-store23:23
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MohammadAGyay, 80C23:23
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MohammadAGThe following packages will be REMOVED:23:25
MohammadAGhmm, doesn't look right23:25
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MohammadAGah, forgot --purge23:25
kerioyou forgot --kill-it-with-fire23:25
keriois there a way to tell apt to shred the files instead?23:26
MohammadAGnah, it has supercow powers23:26
MohammadAGit'll shred them on its own23:26
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yaccI wondered if there is a tool that auto-adjusts the brightness?23:28
yaccConsidering that there seems to be a sensor even on the front to sense how bright the environment is, ...23:29
MohammadAGafaik brightness is adjusted by default23:29
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Venemoyacc: it is called an ambient light sensor, and it does auto-adjust the brightness23:32
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yaccVenemo, yeah, but the N900 seems not to adjust the brightness, ...23:36
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Venemoyacc, it does23:37
Venemoyacc, bring it to a bright room, then to darkness23:37
yaccVenemo, now for the G1 for example which does not such a sensor somebody wrote a tool that uses the camera (won't work on the N900 because of the slider) to decide the brightness, not all the time, but some time, ...23:37
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yaccVenemo, you mean the brightness slider just sets the "effect" that I want to have, and the N900 has been busy giving me the brillant image quality all the time on it's own?23:38
MohammadAGyacc, if you restart mce it's broken until the next reboot23:38
MohammadAGalso, I think qwerty12's applet breaks it sometimes23:38
infobotMCE = Machine Check Exception23:40
MohammadAG~mce is also Mode Control Entity23:41
infobotMohammadAG: okay23:41
piggzis there a libqt4-qt3support package for maemo that is uptodate with the current libqt4?23:41
MohammadAGI hate that bot sometimes23:41
infobotMCE = Machine Check Exception.  Mode Control Entity23:41
MohammadAGyacc, it's what controls most lights in the system23:41
MohammadAGvibration is a light23:41
Venemoyacc, it won't affect the brightness slider23:41
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yaccWhen we are at the topic, anyway to see what process caused some light/vibration/sound event?23:44
VenemoMohammadAG: it also controls the screen orientation23:45
yaccI've got the N900 just last week, and it has this tendency to give off all kinds of sounds, but when I check the display there is nothing marked (the left top corner icon is just blue, no yellow marking for a message for example).23:45
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Venemowhat sort of sounds?23:46
MohammadAGyeah, it polls the accelerometer and reports orientation, sometimes crashes under the tension of life23:46
Venemoyacc, perhaps you installed something that messes things up.23:46
yaccYeah, but how do I figure what messes things up?23:46
Venemoyacc, difficult to answer23:47
Venemoyacc, perhaps if you would explain in more detail, the guys here could help you more23:47
yaccYeah, that's why I ask ;)23:47
yaccE.g. yesterday I had it play everytime I've turned the screen off or on.23:47
yaccToday it does not do this, ...23:47
yaccVenemo, luckily for me I had no time yet to fool around myself, ... :)23:48
pupnikyacc: your problem description is hard to understand.  perhaps you can youtube upload a video of the problem23:48
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dRbiGhmm, just wondering, proper way to pronounce maemo is like ma-emo or does ae stands for something more fancy here? :)23:49
yaccpupnik, well, the issue is that it's not doing it today.23:50
yaccGenerally speaking not being able to figure out what process has played a sound, vibrated or activated leds is bad, ...23:50
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Venemowell, it usually plays a sound when you receive an e-mail/sms, and stuff23:51
Venemoyou can also set what events you want the LED to turn on fo23:51
Venemoyou can also set what events you want the LED to turn on for in the Settings application23:51
yaccpupnik, it would be perhaps different with a stupid device, but with a device that is so "extensible", ....23:51
yaccVenemo, yeah, but if an app plays a sound, while not giving a visible cue, it's hard to figure out what's happening.23:52
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pupnikusers learn which sound means what after a few days23:53
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