| *** lmoura has joined #maemo | 00:00 | |
| *** nox- has joined #maemo | 00:02 | |
| *** mfabiop has quit IRC | 00:02 | |
| nox- | moin | 00:04 |
|---|---|---|
| sivang | hey nox- | 00:04 |
| *** Pillum has joined #maemo | 00:05 | |
| sivang | nox-: mayeb you have an idea why forwardin works for my USB netowrk when I did not set it to '1' in the host PC? | 00:05 |
| sivang | and moins, btw | 00:05 |
| Pillum | hey there | 00:05 |
| Pillum | when i try to boot up meego with bootmenu | 00:05 |
| Pillum | the screen goes black | 00:05 |
| Pillum | but with flasher it is possible | 00:06 |
| Pillum | did the bootmenu code changed? | 00:06 |
| *** fecub has quit IRC | 00:06 | |
| Pillum | its a n900 btw | 00:07 |
| *** guardian has quit IRC | 00:07 | |
| nox- | sivang, you mean like ip forwarding? does the device get an ip in your host's subnet? | 00:08 |
| *** luke-jr__ has quit IRC | 00:08 | |
| *** luke-jr__ has joined #maemo | 00:09 | |
| *** luke-jr has quit IRC | 00:10 | |
| sivang | nox-: no | 00:10 |
| *** luke-jr has joined #maemo | 00:10 | |
| nox- | no to first or second q? :) | 00:11 |
| nox- | or to | 00:11 |
| sivang | nox-: 10.100.10.x's while my host subnet is 192.168.1.x, once I put the DNS server into /etc/resolv.conf, (192.168.1.1) the device has access to outside world as if it is using NAT/ip_forwarding | 00:11 |
| sivang | nox-: :) | 00:11 |
| kerio | are you sure it's not connected with something else too? | 00:11 |
| nox- | hm sounds as if the host is doing nat or even something like slirp... | 00:11 |
| *** Pillum has quit IRC | 00:12 | |
| sivang | kerio: hrm | 00:12 |
| * sivang palmfaces | 00:12 | |
| *** Pillum has joined #maemo | 00:12 | |
| sivang | kerio: damn thing connected to the wifi as well ! | 00:12 |
| mgedmin | heh | 00:12 |
| kerio | hahahaha i knew it | 00:12 |
| *** soltys has joined #maemo | 00:12 | |
| Pillum | is there a way to dualboot meego? | 00:12 |
| nox- | haha | 00:12 |
| sivang | Pillum: not in a safe way, the preferred way is to boot through a USB host with the image on a mSD | 00:13 |
| sivang | Pillum: this will be worked on though | 00:13 |
| *** marciom has quit IRC | 00:13 | |
| sivang | nox-: yes :) | 00:13 |
| Pillum | ok, thx sivang | 00:13 |
| sivang | Pillum: np :) | 00:13 |
| *** e-yes has quit IRC | 00:14 | |
| sivang | kerio: thanks for helping me sort that out, the phone is darkened so I did not see the wifi connection on :) | 00:15 |
| sivang | when in doubt , the simple explenations usually holds. | 00:16 |
| kerio | occam ftw | 00:18 |
| *** mikki-kun has quit IRC | 00:18 | |
| sivang | didn't know that's how it is called, but interesting read on wp nonetheless | 00:19 |
| *** Pillum has quit IRC | 00:20 | |
| *** Pillum has joined #maemo | 00:21 | |
| sivang | or who's named this rule | 00:21 |
| *** guardian has joined #maemo | 00:23 | |
| *** guardian has quit IRC | 00:24 | |
| DocScrutinizer | occam's razor? well known | 00:25 |
| *** jatt has joined #maemo | 00:25 | |
| *** e-yes has joined #maemo | 00:26 | |
| *** Rarok has quit IRC | 00:26 | |
| DocScrutinizer | think I even had to learn about it n school, physics lessons | 00:26 |
| *** mairas_ has quit IRC | 00:26 | |
| sivang | nobody taught me that and I studied a few semseters in Math and CS in uni | 00:27 |
| sivang | in economics probably it is well taught | 00:28 |
| nox- | it is well known, tho i dont remember if i learned it at school... | 00:29 |
| *** ghostcube has quit IRC | 00:32 | |
| jacktheripper | I'm getting this "checking for X... no | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | checking for XLIB... no | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | configure: error: "no (requires X development libraries)" | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | make: *** [config.status] Error 1 | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | dpkg-buildpackage: error: debian/rules build gave error exit status 2 | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | " when I try to upload my library package, there's no X in that environment !? | 00:32 |
| jacktheripper | Sorry for the flood | 00:32 |
| sivang | did anybody every experience the fonts getting enlarged suddenly with no apparent reason, or under high multitasking load? | 00:35 |
| sivang | for example, in modest | 00:35 |
| sivang | maybe this is localized to modest only, duonno | 00:35 |
| *** dneary has quit IRC | 00:35 | |
| *** choppa has joined #maemo | 00:36 | |
| *** jpe has quit IRC | 00:36 | |
| *** TheXception is now known as TheXception|off | 00:37 | |
| *** jatt has quit IRC | 00:38 | |
| *** ToJa92 has quit IRC | 00:40 | |
| jacktheripper | guys, I'm sure someone has an answer to this, some help, please ? | 00:41 |
| *** dvoid_ has quit IRC | 00:41 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 00:43 | |
| *** jerhum has quit IRC | 00:43 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has quit IRC | 00:44 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 00:44 | |
| *** rcg has quit IRC | 00:45 | |
| *** MohammadAG has quit IRC | 00:46 | |
| *** pablo2 has quit IRC | 00:47 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has quit IRC | 00:47 | |
| nox- | jacktheripper, i never uploaded any package but could this be just a missing dep? | 00:48 |
| *** geaaru_ has quit IRC | 00:52 | |
| *** yofel_ has joined #maemo | 00:55 | |
| sivang | nox-: I think he means the buildd, e.g. the server that rebuilds the package from source if it is like ubuntu where you never upload binary package | 00:56 |
| *** andre__ has quit IRC | 00:56 | |
| sivang | nox-: in debian, you used to I think | 00:56 |
| *** spinningcompass has quit IRC | 00:56 | |
| nox- | yeah but he'll have to specify the deps nevertheless (right?) | 00:56 |
| luke-jr__ | sivang: if he's missing the deps, the server won't necessarily provide them | 00:57 |
| luke-jr__ | build deps that is | 00:57 |
| jacktheripper | that was the case five minutes ago, but even after adding libx11-dev to the deps, it still doesn't build. | 00:57 |
| jacktheripper | I think I figured it out anyway | 00:57 |
| luke-jr__ | an ideal build farm would actually use a libc wrapper to pretend files not depended on don't exist ;) | 00:57 |
| *** BabelO_ has joined #maemo | 00:57 | |
| *** BabelO_ has quit IRC | 00:57 | |
| *** BabelO_ has joined #maemo | 00:57 | |
| *** yofel has quit IRC | 00:57 | |
| *** yofel_ is now known as yofel | 00:58 | |
| *** millenomi has quit IRC | 00:58 | |
| *** kwtm has joined #maemo | 00:58 | |
| *** disco_stu has quit IRC | 00:58 | |
| *** disco_stu has joined #maemo | 00:58 | |
| *** choppa_ has joined #maemo | 00:59 | |
| *** choppa_ has quit IRC | 00:59 | |
| *** BabelO has quit IRC | 00:59 | |
| sivang | luke-jr__: right | 01:00 |
| sivang | luke-jr__: and right :) | 01:00 |
| *** _0x47 has quit IRC | 01:02 | |
| *** SpeedEvil has quit IRC | 01:02 | |
| *** MadViking has quit IRC | 01:05 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: what was it? | 01:07 |
| *** MadViking has joined #maemo | 01:08 | |
| jacktheripper | sivang: I'm not yet sure I solved it, but my -dev package didn't have the deps (though I did do a rebuild after changing debian/controls). After another rebuild, it has it. Uploading now. | 01:08 |
| *** Vanadis has quit IRC | 01:08 | |
| *** msanchez has quit IRC | 01:10 | |
| *** eCo_maemo has joined #maemo | 01:11 | |
| *** rblank has quit IRC | 01:13 | |
| *** vanadismobile has joined #maemo | 01:15 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: i'll hold fingers for you | 01:15 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: do you dupload ? | 01:15 |
| *** jrocha has quit IRC | 01:15 | |
| jacktheripper | sivang: no, the web wizard. | 01:16 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: ah, don't know what's that- I used dupload when I worked on Ubuntu | 01:16 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: just got it now, same message.. | 01:16 |
| sivang | bah | 01:16 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: and it builds on your sb? | 01:17 |
| jacktheripper | I'm not specifying header packages for the binary package, could that be the problem ? | 01:17 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: yep | 01:17 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: no, you don't need headers for running the binary | 01:18 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: just a way for pkgconfig to return a sane asnwer when configure queries it | 01:18 |
| *** Pillum has quit IRC | 01:18 | |
| sivang | not sure what's going on there, wanna send me the source and I will try to build it on my sb? | 01:18 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: ^ | 01:18 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: I know, that's why I didn't add it. But I lost all the possible errors. | 01:18 |
| *** zap has quit IRC | 01:18 | |
| DocScrutinizer | oh shit, stuxnet - now it's becoming really nasty | 01:18 |
| *** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo | 01:18 | |
| *** TeringTuby has quit IRC | 01:18 | |
| jacktheripper | sivang: actually I'll try the tar.gz that gets built :) | 01:19 |
| *** yacc has quit IRC | 01:19 | |
| * sivang wondres if there's a way to apt-get build-dep $pkg where $pkg is your created pkg and not in the repo | 01:20 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: make sure subtvars et al not changing your control files for the build-deps | 01:21 |
| jacktheripper | btw guys, I was actually talking about the orig.tar.gz I send the server. That doesn't have any 'deps' does it ? | 01:21 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: that would be the prestine source no? | 01:22 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: e.g. without debian cruft | 01:22 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: yes. But the server uses it to build the debian package. | 01:22 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: and of course it didn't reach that stage yet. | 01:22 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: it's failing at the ./configure stage | 01:22 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: how does it know about build-deps then? | 01:22 |
| *** t_s_o has joined #maemo | 01:23 | |
| *** choppa has quit IRC | 01:23 | |
| jacktheripper | sivang: no idea, it's actually my first time getting into packaging :/ | 01:23 |
| *** CutMeOwnThroat has joined #maemo | 01:23 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: ah okay, where's the web interface can you toss me the link? | 01:24 |
| jacktheripper | https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php | 01:24 |
| *** wazd has quit IRC | 01:24 | |
| jacktheripper | but I send files before that, I'll check the deps there | 01:25 |
| jacktheripper | .dsc doesn't say any deps other than debhelper and autotools-dev, while they're there in debian/control. | 01:25 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: that do you have else then orig.tar.gz ? | 01:26 |
| jacktheripper | yes. The interface needs a .changes, a .dsc and a .diff.gz too | 01:26 |
| *** Ryback_ has quit IRC | 01:26 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: and does the .changes file represents the diff to the previous package version's control file? | 01:27 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: for example, the added build-deps | 01:27 |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 01:27 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: ah, it is in the diff actually | 01:27 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: never mind, forget what I said - no idea though, sorry | 01:27 |
| jacktheripper | np. There's no previous package anyway. | 01:28 |
| jacktheripper | I just got the source off some site, and I'm trying to package it | 01:28 |
| sivang | I'd try the dput way just to test, as I found here: http://extras-cauldron.garage.maemo.org/HOWTO.html#how-to-prepare-and-upload-source-packages-for-build | 01:29 |
| *** mikhas has quit IRC | 01:31 | |
| jacktheripper | I found that dpkg-source, which is called somewhere, doesn't take the control file I supply as input. And it generates the .dsc without it. | 01:32 |
| jacktheripper | I could either hack the .dsc, or do it the right way. | 01:32 |
| jacktheripper | I choose the right way :D | 01:32 |
| *** pH5 has quit IRC | 01:32 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: good | 01:33 |
| *** ZogG has quit IRC | 01:34 | |
| *** Handyspacko has joined #maemo | 01:35 | |
| *** ZogG has joined #maemo | 01:35 | |
| Handyspacko | hi? | 01:35 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: what control file does it take? how do you supply it? | 01:35 |
| *** hurbu has quit IRC | 01:35 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo | 01:36 | |
| jacktheripper | sivang: no idea, that's why doing the right way is usually hard. | 01:36 |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 01:38 | |
| Handyspacko | i can not get install libpcre3 from maemo extras devel, because it is not shown up there and in the xterminal with sudo gainroot.....apt-get install libpcre3 it says ist could be in a another repository CAN ANYONE PLEASE HELP ME i am on NOKIA N900 | 01:38 |
| *** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo | 01:39 | |
| *** BCMM has quit IRC | 01:40 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: it says in the man page that if a relative path is givne, it will add he root of the source tree to the path | 01:41 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: http://man.he.net/man1/dpkg-source search for -ccontorlfile | 01:41 |
| *** povbot` has joined #maemo | 01:45 | |
| -kornbluth.freenode.net- [freenode-info] please register your nickname...don't forget to auto-identify! http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup | 01:45 | |
| *** mgedmin has quit IRC | 01:45 | |
| sivang | jacktheripper: you can pass this option to dpkg-buildpackage and it will communicate it down to dpkg-source IIRC | 01:45 |
| jacktheripper | sivang: oh. thanks. | 01:46 |
| sivang | jacktheripper: anwyay, I'm bugging instead of helping, should get to sleep already. Good Luck! | 01:46 |
| *** mgedmin has joined #maemo | 01:46 | |
| sivang | and good night | 01:46 |
| *** FireFly has quit IRC | 01:46 | |
| jacktheripper | good night :) | 01:46 |
| Handyspacko | hey are you ignoring me | 01:46 |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: add the repo mentioned here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=821492 | 01:46 |
| *** FireFly|n900 has quit IRC | 01:46 | |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: and there's no 'ignoring' on IRC. | 01:46 |
| Handyspacko | mhh thx i am looking on it | 01:47 |
| *** SpeedEvil has quit IRC | 01:48 | |
| *** kwtm has quit IRC | 01:48 | |
| *** nuovodna has quit IRC | 01:50 | |
| Handyspacko | ok whhhhaaat? i dont get it | 01:50 |
| Handyspacko | what i have to do? | 01:50 |
| *** FireFly|n900 has joined #maemo | 01:50 | |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: did you add repositories before ? | 01:50 |
| Handyspacko | yes | 01:50 |
| *** johnsq has quit IRC | 01:50 | |
| Handyspacko | devel and testing | 01:50 |
| Handyspacko | in program manger | 01:51 |
| jacktheripper | do that | 01:51 |
| *** FireFly has joined #maemo | 01:51 | |
| jacktheripper | except, when specifying configuration, add the info mentioned in the second post of that link | 01:51 |
| Handyspacko | i want to instal kismet but it says i have to install missing package libpcre3 | 01:51 |
| Handyspacko | i searched the net and everyone says libpcre is in maemo devel an i have add the repo but nothing shown up there | 01:53 |
| *** pekuja has quit IRC | 01:53 | |
| Handyspacko | in terminal i have apt-get update and apt-get install libpcre3 and apt-get install -f libpcre3 but nothing | 01:54 |
| *** ZogG has quit IRC | 01:54 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 01:55 | |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: yes, add the repo in that link. It's in it. | 01:55 |
| *** benh has quit IRC | 01:55 | |
| Handyspacko | https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps this one??? | 01:56 |
| *** larsivi_ has quit IRC | 01:56 | |
| Handyspacko | sorry i am german | 01:56 |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: yes, and no problem. | 01:56 |
| Handyspacko | i try | 01:57 |
| Handyspacko | please be paciend | 01:57 |
| jacktheripper | sure. | 01:57 |
| *** ZogG has joined #maemo | 01:57 | |
| *** sar3th is now known as sar3th|away | 01:58 | |
| *** hardaker has quit IRC | 01:58 | |
| *** Bash1 has quit IRC | 02:00 | |
| *** felipe` has quit IRC | 02:01 | |
| Handyspacko | ok i have add it but did not shown up there in program manager | 02:01 |
| jacktheripper | libpcre3 ? | 02:02 |
| jacktheripper | apt-get install libpcre3 | 02:02 |
| Handyspacko | yes this file | 02:02 |
| Handyspacko | i try in console | 02:02 |
| jacktheripper | yes | 02:02 |
| *** sivang has quit IRC | 02:03 | |
| *** nuovodna has joined #maemo | 02:04 | |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko, worked ? | 02:05 |
| *** SWFu has quit IRC | 02:05 | |
| Handyspacko | failed to fetch https;// downloads........ | 02:05 |
| jacktheripper | what's the error ? | 02:06 |
| *** sivang has joined #maemo | 02:06 | |
| Handyspacko | ok i type sudo gainroot then apt-get install libpcre3 ... | 02:06 |
| Handyspacko | then | 02:06 |
| Handyspacko | i say yes | 02:07 |
| *** MSameerWork has quit IRC | 02:08 | |
| *** sar3th|away is now known as sar3th | 02:08 | |
| jacktheripper | just say the failed to fetch error, is it 404 ? | 02:08 |
| *** hannesw has quit IRC | 02:08 | |
| Handyspacko | and then err https://downoads.maemo........ could not resolve hoast | 02:08 |
| Handyspacko | mhhh | 02:08 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 02:08 | |
| Handyspacko | no error number | 02:08 |
| *** MSameerWork has joined #maemo | 02:09 | |
| jacktheripper | could you say the full link ? | 02:09 |
| jacktheripper | https://downloads.maemo then ? | 02:09 |
| Handyspacko | unable to fetch some arichves mabye run apt-get update i have do it but nothing | 02:09 |
| Handyspacko | yes please i am slow | 02:10 |
| jacktheripper | no problem | 02:10 |
| Handyspacko | https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/ .libpcre3_6.7-1osso1+r1_armel.deb | 02:12 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 02:12 | |
| *** zash has quit IRC | 02:12 | |
| Handyspacko | https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/.libpcre3_6.7-1osso1+r1_armel.deb | 02:12 |
| *** zash has joined #maemo | 02:12 | |
| *** S_WO has joined #maemo | 02:13 | |
| Handyspacko | i download it manually and i will instal it with dkpg i try | 02:13 |
| jacktheripper | it says Access Denied | 02:13 |
| jacktheripper | there is a problem with the repository | 02:13 |
| *** srw has quit IRC | 02:13 | |
| Handyspacko | yes but why it shows up in programm manger the ohter programms? | 02:14 |
| Handyspacko | ok i try give me please 2 minuts | 02:15 |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 02:15 | |
| *** frals has quit IRC | 02:16 | |
| *** niko has quit IRC | 02:17 | |
| Handyspacko | yes it worked i have found the file here http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_sdk_free_armel/libpcre3/6.7-1osso1+r1/ | 02:17 |
| Handyspacko | thx | 02:17 |
| Handyspacko | you helped me how to find the right deb file i whanted | 02:18 |
| Handyspacko | love irc extremmmm thx | 02:18 |
| Handyspacko | where do you come from? | 02:19 |
| Handyspacko | this problem has used maybe 9 hours | 02:20 |
| *** niko has joined #maemo | 02:20 | |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: egypt :D | 02:22 |
| Handyspacko | cool salam a leykum^^ | 02:22 |
| *** e-yes has quit IRC | 02:22 | |
| jacktheripper | haha | 02:22 |
| jacktheripper | glad to help. | 02:23 |
| Handyspacko | wow germany sucks it is so cold and all the germans are working or are so stubborn^^ | 02:23 |
| jacktheripper | I'm leaving, good night #maemo | 02:23 |
| jacktheripper | Handyspacko: xD | 02:24 |
| Handyspacko | ok thankyou very much good night | 02:24 |
| jacktheripper | welcome | 02:24 |
| *** jacktheripper has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** mhmh has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** flux has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** mairas has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** Corsac has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** jani has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** Passeli has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** thauta has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** jarkkom has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** cpt_nemo has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** Milo- has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** jhp has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** johnsu01 has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** tekonivel has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** inz has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** ruskie has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** shpaq` has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** cyborg-one has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** jannau has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** Jartza has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** derf has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** mreggen has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** chem|st has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** kirma has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** tobb has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** maswan has quit IRC | 02:24 | |
| *** diegohcg has quit IRC | 02:25 | |
| *** sivang has quit IRC | 02:25 | |
| *** laasonen has quit IRC | 02:25 | |
| *** frals has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** frals has quit IRC | 02:26 | |
| *** frals has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** laasonen has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** lcuk has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** BabelO_ has quit IRC | 02:26 | |
| *** lcuk has quit IRC | 02:26 | |
| *** lcuk has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** SpeedEvil has quit IRC | 02:26 | |
| *** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo | 02:26 | |
| *** Handyspacko has quit IRC | 02:26 | |
| *** benh has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| jacekowski | i probably know what's the problem | 02:28 |
| jacekowski | and error message in that problem states how to fix it | 02:28 |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** FireFly has quit IRC | 02:28 | |
| *** mhmh has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** flux has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** mairas has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** Corsac has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** jani has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** cpt_nemo has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** Passeli has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** thauta has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** jhp has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** jarkkom has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** Milo- has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** johnsu01 has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** tekonivel has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** inz has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** ruskie has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** jannau has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** shpaq` has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** cyborg-one has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** Jartza has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** derf has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** mreggen has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** chem|st has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** kirma has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** tobb has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** maswan has joined #maemo | 02:28 | |
| *** rcampbell_ has quit IRC | 02:29 | |
| *** rcampbell has joined #maemo | 02:29 | |
| *** crs has quit IRC | 02:30 | |
| *** mitsutaka has quit IRC | 02:32 | |
| *** incar has joined #maemo | 02:35 | |
| *** ferulo has quit IRC | 02:35 | |
| *** e-yes has joined #maemo | 02:36 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 02:39 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo | 02:39 | |
| *** kwtm has joined #maemo | 02:43 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 02:52 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 02:53 | |
| *** nuovodna has quit IRC | 02:56 | |
| *** mavhc has quit IRC | 03:03 | |
| *** the_lord has quit IRC | 03:04 | |
| *** Jucato has joined #maemo | 03:07 | |
| *** incar has quit IRC | 03:07 | |
| *** Termana has joined #maemo | 03:08 | |
| *** lauanana has joined #maemo | 03:09 | |
| *** fredrik__ has joined #maemo | 03:10 | |
| *** fredrik__ has quit IRC | 03:11 | |
| *** fredrin_ has joined #maemo | 03:11 | |
| *** Lopi has joined #maemo | 03:11 | |
| *** lauanana has quit IRC | 03:11 | |
| *** mlfoster has quit IRC | 03:14 | |
| *** florian has quit IRC | 03:17 | |
| *** willer_ has quit IRC | 03:19 | |
| *** Mousey has quit IRC | 03:26 | |
| *** LjL has quit IRC | 03:27 | |
| *** shinkamui has quit IRC | 03:29 | |
| ds3 | 9 | 03:29 |
| FauxFaux | 8 | 03:30 |
| Noma | 7 | 03:31 |
| *** bef0rd has joined #maemo | 03:32 | |
| pronto | 3 | 03:32 |
| fredrin | 2 | 03:33 |
| wmarone | fail | 03:33 |
| fredrin | -1 | 03:33 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 03:35 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 03:36 | |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 03:37 | |
| *** felipec has quit IRC | 03:39 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 03:41 | |
| b-man` | wooh! i almost have netbsd booting on my N900 :) | 03:41 |
| b-man` | just need to figure out how to resolve the undefined instruction errors | 03:42 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 03:43 | |
| luke-jr__ | … | 03:44 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 03:44 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 03:46 | |
| b-man` | displays boot information for about 10 seconds, and then dies with an "undefined instruction in kernel" error | 03:46 |
| b-man` | so it partially works | 03:47 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 03:47 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 03:48 | |
| *** darkschneider has quit IRC | 03:48 | |
| *** setanta has quit IRC | 03:49 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 03:49 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 03:49 | |
| fredrin | b-man`, why netbsd? | 03:57 |
| b-man` | for an experiment | 03:57 |
| fredrin | :) | 03:58 |
| nox- | undefined instruction... maybe wrong compiler flags? | 03:58 |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 03:58 | |
| b-man` | it's using a toolchain straight from the source tree | 04:00 |
| b-man` | hmm | 04:00 |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 04:07 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 04:08 | |
| *** mavhc has joined #maemo | 04:11 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 04:12 | |
| DocScrutinizer | shouldn't 'SIGILL' cause a kernel oops or panic that would yield some pointer on where in source to search for the illegal instruction? | 04:14 |
| nox- | true maybe he can put a kernel debugger in (that would be ddb on freebsd...) | 04:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | no kernel debuggers on arm :-/ | 04:15 |
| nox- | oh | 04:16 |
| *** C-S-B has quit IRC | 04:16 | |
| DocScrutinizer | I'd be more than pleased to stand corrected | 04:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | would be mad useful for hostmode :-D | 04:17 |
| nox- | hm freebsd /sys/conf/files.arm does have some optional ddb entries... | 04:17 |
| * DocScrutinizer starts hating printk() | 04:17 | |
| nox- | oh btw isnt there a qemu fork now that emulates n900? that should have a gdbstub too... | 04:18 |
| nox- | (which ofc is more useful than ddb :) | 04:18 |
| *** lsm5 has quit IRC | 04:19 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 04:19 | |
| * nox- remembers using that when debugging qemu's zaurus emu some time ago... | 04:19 | |
| nox- | qemu-system-arm -s ... | 04:20 |
| *** delt has joined #maemo | 04:20 | |
| delt | Hello | 04:20 |
| *** lsm5 has joined #maemo | 04:20 | |
| nox- | (gdb) target remote 127.1:1234 | 04:20 |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 04:20 | |
| *** doc|home has quit IRC | 04:21 | |
| *** Aranel has joined #maemo | 04:22 | |
| delt | i managed to get my n810 to talk to the PC via the USB port, now i can enable/disable "r&d mode" etc .... but how can i make it boot with an initrd as root filesystem? | 04:22 |
| delt | (without modifying the contents of the partitions on the n810) | 04:23 |
| delt | oh, and where would one find such initrd images? (and newest OS version etc...) | 04:23 |
| Aranel | Does Vanilla flashing re-write the kernel to original state? | 04:23 |
| Aranel | removing Host Mode, NITdroid and other hacks? | 04:24 |
| delt | um, i dont think that's the kernel, it would be config files on the root partition | 04:24 |
| delt | what would be practical is a way to "flash out" (extract) an image of the root fs FROM the device | 04:26 |
| delt | then mount it locally (on the pc) with -o loop | 04:26 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 04:26 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 04:26 | |
| *** panaggio has quit IRC | 04:27 | |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 04:27 | |
| *** crs has joined #maemo | 04:27 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 04:28 | |
| *** githogori has quit IRC | 04:28 | |
| b-man` | hmmm | 04:29 |
| *** doc|home has joined #maemo | 04:29 | |
| b-man` | me sees a lot of jvm_fault_* errors before the undefined instruction in kernel" errors | 04:30 |
| b-man` | gah, typefail :P | 04:31 |
| nox- | s/jvm/vm/ ? | 04:31 |
| b-man` | jvm_fault_<some address> | 04:32 |
| * b-man` needs to disable watchdogs to read them | 04:32 | |
| b-man` | otherwise it shuts down before i can lol | 04:32 |
| *** kthomas has joined #maemo | 04:33 | |
| nox- | or could you use the n900 qemu too? | 04:33 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 04:34 | |
| b-man` | yeah | 04:35 |
| b-man` | gah, screen is scrolling too fast :P | 04:36 |
| b-man` | hmm | 04:36 |
| *** hcm_ has joined #maemo | 04:39 | |
| *** Termana has quit IRC | 04:41 | |
| *** josemartins_ has joined #maemo | 04:41 | |
| *** pigeon has quit IRC | 04:43 | |
| *** pigeon has joined #maemo | 04:44 | |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 04:44 | |
| *** sar3th is now known as sar3th|away | 04:44 | |
| *** hcm has quit IRC | 04:45 | |
| *** sar3th|away is now known as sar3th | 04:47 | |
| nox- | hm http://fxr.watson.org/fxr/search?v=NETBSD&string=jvm_fault returns empty quickly and http://fxr.watson.org/fxr/search?v=NETBSD&string=vm_fault seems to find only(?) uvm_fault stuff... | 04:49 |
| delt | wuhh?? if the battery is empty (or there's no battery) you can't even plug the n810 on a usb port? | 04:51 |
| delt | does it charge the battery while it's rebooting and rebooting if its plugged into a charger? | 04:51 |
| delt | oh, and why can't you use the charger while connecting to USB port? that would suck if the battery is empty | 04:52 |
| b-man` | nox-: just took another look, seems to actually be uvm_fault | 04:53 |
| nox- | ah :) | 04:53 |
| *** Psi has quit IRC | 04:54 | |
| b-man` | so there might be a problem with the virtual memory system | 04:54 |
| b-man` | perhaps a bad address? | 04:54 |
| nox- | maybe... | 04:55 |
| delt | of course white screen with brightness to MAXIMUM.... does this use up the battery when plugged via USB? | 04:55 |
| nox- | i guess you want either the serial console or the n900 qemu (as long as the error happens there too...) | 04:56 |
| nox- | delt, i dont know about n810, can it charge via usb too? | 04:56 |
| SpeedEvil | delt: no | 04:56 |
| delt | ah ok.... but it DOES require the battery to be present to turn it on...>? | 04:57 |
| SpeedEvil | oh - don't know about the 810 | 04:57 |
| SpeedEvil | As far as I'm aware - yes - it requires a battery | 04:57 |
| delt | nox: i think it does (charge via usb) | 04:57 |
| nox- | thats also what i think | 04:57 |
| nox- | delt, ah ok then you should be fine | 04:57 |
| delt | iirc it says on the box, 2sec | 04:58 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 04:59 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 05:00 | |
| delt | hmm, seems like you can't charge over usb :( :( | 05:01 |
| nox- | oh | 05:01 |
| nox- | and the usb connector is to near to the charging one for both to be plugged in at the same time? | 05:02 |
| nox- | too near | 05:02 |
| delt | on the 810? no, there's a good 3 cm distance between | 05:03 |
| *** fredrin_ has quit IRC | 05:03 | |
| nox- | <delt> oh, and why can't you use the charger while connecting to USB port? that would suck if the battery is empty | 05:03 |
| *** Termana has joined #maemo | 05:03 | |
| *** fredrin has quit IRC | 05:03 | |
| delt | am just wondering why the docs say to NOT use the charger while flashing the rootfs | 05:04 |
| nox- | ooh while flashing... | 05:04 |
| nox- | i guess thats `special' then :) | 05:05 |
| delt | so, i guess the device's hardware does charge the battery by default, when it's rebooting constantly? | 05:05 |
| delt | if not, then nokia's engineers need to be shot. | 05:06 |
| Termana | Need to be shot anyhow. | 05:06 |
| Termana | :P | 05:06 |
| nox- | i think its more that charging needs at least `some' kernelsupport which is impossible during flashing | 05:07 |
| nox- | s/suppport/ support/ | 05:07 |
| Termana | nox-, more like, when not doing an emergency charge it needs BME (meaning, a working userspace) | 05:08 |
| nox- | ok | 05:08 |
| delt | i just checked, plugged to USB, and blue USB logo showing up in the upper right... take out battery (which is the only way to turn it off) ... shuts off | 05:08 |
| Termana | delt, yes, you didn't expect it to continue to work without the battery did you? | 05:08 |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 05:09 | |
| delt | Termana: there's a +5V pin on the usb port, yes or no? | 05:09 |
| Termana | delt, I don't know specifics, but I know that doesn't work (from previous work that's been displayed here) | 05:09 |
| Termana | Search t.m.o for DocScrutinizer's post on changing batteries while the device is still on | 05:10 |
| delt | well, i assumed (wrongly) that if some tablets can charge the battery through a usb port, then this one can at least run using power from it | 05:10 |
| SpeedEvil | It adds cost. | 05:11 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ | 05:11 |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 05:11 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 05:11 | |
| delt | ok... so i have the charger, usb cable, and the battery, but (let's say) the battery is dead. My n810 won't do anything but reboot constantly unless it's plugged on the USB port (and that needs a battery) ....what do i do? | 05:12 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it doesn't work | 05:12 |
| SpeedEvil | get a new batrtrery | 05:13 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | modem takes too much (worst case), usb connectors can't take that much current | 05:13 |
| delt | so for all i know the battery might be at 1% - and if i start flashing, this might brick the device permanently. | 05:13 |
| lcuk | did i see some random hack for some device involving jump leads | 05:13 |
| nox- | delt, charge first? or is that also broken? | 05:14 |
| delt | nox: how? | 05:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | what are jump leds? | 05:14 |
| delt | that's why i asked 22:06 < delt> so, i guess the device's hardware does charge the battery by default, when it's rebooting constantly? | 05:14 |
| nox- | leads | 05:14 |
| nox- | not leds :) | 05:15 |
| delt | cables soldered on the pcb? | 05:15 |
| nox- | thats what i understand it as | 05:15 |
| Termana | delt, hold on a second. Are you talking about an n810 or an n900? | 05:16 |
| Termana | Not that it really makes much difference either way | 05:16 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | basically none of NITs charges without proper userland working | 05:16 |
| delt | n810. anyway, i turn on the tablet. it does nothing but reboot (doesnt even show the blue progress bar at the bottom) | 05:16 |
| nox- | how does this `emergency chage' work? | 05:16 |
| nox- | could that help him? | 05:17 |
| *** SmilyOrg has quit IRC | 05:17 | |
| Termana | nox-, there is no emergency charge on the n810 | 05:17 |
| nox- | ooh | 05:17 |
| Termana | I thought he was talking about an n900 | 05:17 |
| *** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo | 05:17 | |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: but N810 can boot w/o battery | 05:17 |
| delt | just before rebooting, the brightness goes lower (i presume to what i set it to) and there's a 2cm x 1cm black rectangle on the LOWER LEFT and UPPER RIGHT corners for about 2 seconds. | 05:17 |
| luke-jr__ | and then run BME | 05:17 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, yeah, except he's userspace is screwed (or at least I think so), so he can't run BME | 05:18 |
| delt | yes, it works with a charger, but for some reason the docs say i can't use the charger when flashing the n810 | 05:18 |
| *** raster has joined #maemo | 05:19 | |
| delt | DocScrutinizer51: NIT == Nokia Internet Tablet? | 05:20 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: so flash whiel on AC power? | 05:20 |
| delt | (just a wild guess) | 05:20 |
| Termana | delt, yes, 770, N800, N810 and N900 | 05:20 |
| delt | luke-jr__: [ ... ] but for some reason the docs say i can't use the charger when flashing the n810 | 05:20 |
| Termana | delt, have you tried to do it, forgetting what the docs say? | 05:21 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: then build a charger kernel | 05:21 |
| delt | Termana: not yet, no | 05:21 |
| delt | luke-jr__: wuh?? | 05:21 |
| delt | a kernel that runs on the ac/dc adapter.... not following | 05:21 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: if you try Termana's idea, just be sure to NOT include NOLO in your flashin | 05:21 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: a self-encapsulated kernel+initramfs with BME on it to charge | 05:22 |
| delt | OH yeah that makes sense (being the boot loader) | 05:22 |
| luke-jr__ | flasher can then boot that kernel w/o flashing | 05:22 |
| delt | BME == ? | 05:22 |
| luke-jr__ | BME is the blob that charges the battery | 05:22 |
| delt | ah ok | 05:22 |
| delt | so how do i do that without a minisd card? | 05:22 |
| luke-jr__ | .. | 05:22 |
| luke-jr__ | with flasher | 05:22 |
| luke-jr__ | MiniSD wouldn't even be useful here | 05:22 |
| delt | and preferably without replacing the current content of the tablet? | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | with flasher | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | see -l option | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | (lowercase L) | 05:23 |
| johnx | flasher can load things as well as flash them | 05:23 |
| delt | -l, --load Only load all supplied images | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | yeah, as in, into RAM | 05:23 |
| nox- | oh so thats a bit like pxe? | 05:23 |
| Termana | The whole BME situation is a pain in the arse. I hope Nokia sees the light of day and forgets all about BME for future linux based devices. | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | nox-: except PXE is network | 05:23 |
| delt | wait a minute... load as in, EXTRACT FROM the device? | 05:23 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: LOL | 05:24 |
| nox- | yeah, usb instead of notwork | 05:24 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: Nokia's already come out and basically said they're going to pressure other MeeGo vendors to close their charging stuff too | 05:24 |
| luke-jr__ | :/ | 05:24 |
| Termana | :| | 05:24 |
| nox- | uh :( | 05:24 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: no, load the kernel file to RAM, for booting | 05:24 |
| delt | oh, on the tablet's ram | 05:24 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: see the BME bug | 05:24 |
| Termana | Nokia, I am disappoint | 05:24 |
| nox- | luke-jr__, whats the point of having closed charging stuff? | 05:25 |
| luke-jr__ | nox-: besides pissing people off? no clue :D | 05:25 |
| johnx | some kind of mumbling about people blowing up their battery | 05:25 |
| nox- | oh :( | 05:25 |
| luke-jr__ | johnx: which is unfounded | 05:25 |
| johnx | then some kind of mumbling about it costing money to open source | 05:26 |
| luke-jr__ | you're more likely to blow up your battery without code/docs, than with it | 05:26 |
| johnx | could be some kind of 3rd party intellectual property for all we know | 05:26 |
| delt | luke-jr__: so i suppose it would be possible "flasher -l" an initrd/initramfs that will let me tar up the whole contents of the n810, then i can erase them from the n810 | 05:26 |
| Termana | johnx, well, you know if they actually did charging properly, it wouldn't interfere with userspace and it would be fine. | 05:26 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: it only loads kernels. kernels can contain initramfs inside | 05:26 |
| nox- | johnx, i charging _that_ difficult? :) | 05:26 |
| delt | ah ok | 05:26 |
| luke-jr__ | nox-: no | 05:26 |
| nox- | s/i/is/ | 05:27 |
| infobot | nox- meant: johnx, is charging _that_ difficult? :) | 05:27 |
| johnx | Termana, yup. I remember the Zaurus as well :) | 05:27 |
| *** hcm has joined #maemo | 05:27 | |
| delt | luke-jr__: ah. so, where could i find such a "rescue" kernel image? | 05:27 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: actually, I like the idea of having the charger on the CPU somewhere :P | 05:27 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: afaik nobody has ever made it before. | 05:27 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: I'd prefer to tweak my device to lengthen the battery lifespan | 05:28 |
| delt | so i have to compile one. which involves a cross-compiler for ARM (at least) | 05:28 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: supposedly if you let it discharge more, before topping off, it lasts longer | 05:28 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: or a native one, sure | 05:28 |
| delt | native one running on what? | 05:28 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: so it'd be cool to tell my handheld what time I need to leave home, and have it plan its overnight charging routine to hit 100% right at that time | 05:29 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: another ARM system | 05:29 |
| delt | which i dont have :( | 05:29 |
| luke-jr__ | oh well | 05:29 |
| johnx | delt, google had this to say: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Using_Rescue_Initrd | 05:29 |
| *** spinningcompass has joined #maemo | 05:29 | |
| luke-jr__ | johnx: that's N900 | 05:29 |
| johnx | ah, crap | 05:29 |
| johnx | yeah | 05:29 |
| luke-jr__ | but might still be useful info on there | 05:30 |
| delt | johnx: tell dr.google "wrong patient" n810 here | 05:30 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, sounds good. But I personally just like to have it out of the way. Weather that be code hidden in the bootloader/radio code or hardware based. More reliable, and doesn't give you this crap. | 05:30 |
| johnx | the theory is probably sound at least | 05:30 |
| johnx | sorry delt | 05:30 |
| *** hcm_ has quit IRC | 05:30 | |
| johnx | why does he need a new kernel vs just a modified initrd? | 05:31 |
| delt | johnx: 22:28 < luke-jr__> delt: afaik nobody has ever made it before. | 05:31 |
| delt | i assume he was talking about a rescue-kernel image? | 05:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr__: citation needed. Nokia can't 'press other meego device manufs' | 05:31 |
| johnx | I mean, sure you could change the kernel, but modifying the initrd is easier | 05:32 |
| Termana | johnx, possibly to build in the initramfs (into the kernel) | 05:32 |
| johnx | and it's what we did to boot Mer from SD | 05:32 |
| *** doc|home has quit IRC | 05:32 | |
| johnx | you're just trying to get a rescue shell, right delt? | 05:32 |
| delt | johnx: that would be useful, if USB is supported | 05:32 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Termana: you're right about bme = PITA, but don't think an open solution would solve bootstrap problems | 05:32 |
| *** pcfe has quit IRC | 05:33 | |
| johnx | delt, it is of course | 05:33 |
| delt | im just trying to salvage the contents of the tablet before i flash it | 05:33 |
| johnx | great. let's see if I can find a ready-made initrd | 05:33 |
| johnx | otherwise you'll have to make one | 05:33 |
| delt | AND make sure the battery has enough power to perform such flash operation OR know if i can use a charger contrary to what the documentation says | 05:34 |
| nox- | if he just flashes kernel/rootfs wouldnt the user data still be alive? or is that only possible on n900? | 05:34 |
| *** pcfe has joined #maemo | 05:34 | |
| *** pcfe has quit IRC | 05:34 | |
| *** pcfe has joined #maemo | 05:34 | |
| johnx | even on the N900, you would lose parts of $HOME | 05:35 |
| nox- | hm ok | 05:35 |
| johnx | delt, you know how init works, right? if not i'll give the long explanation, but ... | 05:35 |
| delt | johnx: init on normal unix systems? yeah | 05:35 |
| delt | as in PID 1? | 05:35 |
| *** doc|home has joined #maemo | 05:36 | |
| delt | ie. with most linux boot loaders you can override the default /bin/init with kernel boot argument init=/whatever/else ...? am i thinking about the right "init" ? | 05:36 |
| johnx | yeah | 05:37 |
| johnx | right, so init is in initrd. to change which initrd gets mounted we could change the kernel image | 05:37 |
| Termana | DocScrutinizer51, Nah I didn't think an open solution would - like I said, Nokia should have had the foresight to do what other manufactures are doing - weather they are hiding the code in radio/bootloader or charging completely in hardware. | 05:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | uhuh | 05:37 |
| johnx | but that's a pain (cause we'd have to rebuild it). so in this case we substitute a modified initrd, and run a rescue shell from it | 05:37 |
| delt | ok, following so far, especially "that's a pain (cause we'd have to rebuild it)." | 05:38 |
| johnx | heh | 05:38 |
| johnx | right, so BME and DSME (device state monitor(?) entity) run out of initrd, so we're all good there | 05:38 |
| johnx | so all we really need to do is shoehorn a small telnetd into place and we're good | 05:38 |
| delt | initrd being initRAMDISK, right? ie. filesystem loaded in RAM and not physicall on disk (or flash mem) | 05:39 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Termana: I know about other devices with similar problems, but you're right NOLO could have a 'hold C for bat chrg' opton | 05:39 |
| johnx | delt, well, it's loaded from a flash partition | 05:39 |
| johnx | but it's not written back to flash | 05:40 |
| johnx | or at least not unless we 'flash' it back | 05:40 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Termana: but then a proper rescue system would've been even nicer | 05:40 |
| delt | why from a flash partition? | 05:40 |
| johnx | cause it's easy | 05:40 |
| delt | and how do i write it to a flash partition with the device in this state | 05:40 |
| delt | ? | 05:40 |
| johnx | no need to have a filesystem driver, just "load n bytes from m offset" | 05:40 |
| johnx | you use flasher to write it :) | 05:41 |
| johnx | you tell flasher "just replace my initrd" | 05:41 |
| delt | and overwrite the partition's allocation table? | 05:41 |
| johnx | but we're getting ahead of ourselves | 05:41 |
| johnx | just overwrite the contents of that flash partition | 05:41 |
| johnx | anyways, that's the easy part | 05:42 |
| johnx | first we need to make you a rescue initrd by hand | 05:42 |
| delt | so in 2-3 years, no one has EVER encountered a problem like this, and no one has EVER made a "minimal" kernel with a initrd that just lets you boot, charge, use usb, ....? | 05:42 |
| luke-jr__ | DocScrutinizer51: Maemo bug 9314 comment 12 (Quim Gil), suggesting that more vendors should close "charging systems"; contrast with the present situation where every vendor except Nokia that uses Linux for charging has an open charging system | 05:42 |
| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9314 Relicense BME | 05:43 |
| johnx | no room for an initramfs in the kernel partition and can't redistribute the initrd because of BME :) | 05:43 |
| luke-jr__ | johnx: BME is redistributable non-commerically | 05:43 |
| luke-jr__ | johnx: and flasher can presumably load kernels up to 128 MB :p | 05:43 |
| delt | kernel partition is NOT the / partition right? | 05:43 |
| johnx | delt, correct | 05:44 |
| johnx | luke-jr, dunno then | 05:44 |
| delt | ie. on PC, when you use lilo you're not writing to a filesystem | 05:44 |
| johnx | so the normal way to go is to 'create' a custom initrd on the device itself with automated scripts that pull the initrd out of that device, modify it (add telnetd, bootmenu) and write it back, all on a running device | 05:44 |
| delt | you're reading your kernel image FROM a filesystem and writing it to the first blocks of your hdd (or partition) | 05:44 |
| *** Dregs has joined #maemo | 05:44 | |
| *** Dregs has joined #maemo | 05:44 | |
| delt | uh wait a minute " | 05:45 |
| johnx | delt, actually, with LILO, aren't you just writing a list of kernels to the boot sector? | 05:45 |
| delt | uh wait a minute "pull the initrd out of that device" how do you do that? | 05:45 |
| johnx | on a running device? mount it read-only and cp -a | 05:45 |
| johnx | "pull a copy of it" | 05:46 |
| delt | ok, so constantly rebooting doesn't count as "running" device i suppose? | 05:46 |
| johnx | can you execute arbitrary code on it? | 05:46 |
| delt | well, the bootup code seems to behave pretty arbitrarily to me | 05:46 |
| delt | :/ | 05:47 |
| johnx | *rim shot* | 05:47 |
| johnx | anyways, it doesn't boot even with watchdog disabled, right? | 05:48 |
| delt | haven't tried that | 05:48 |
| johnx | please try that | 05:48 |
| delt | how do i disable watchdog timer? | 05:48 |
| delt | "rd mode" then a specific flag i think i read the other day? | 05:48 |
| johnx | http://carloseducesa.blogspot.com/2009/09/retu-watchdog-turning-off-n810.html | 05:48 |
| delt | oh yeah, i saw that page yesterday... doesnt he say NOT to try that? | 05:49 |
| johnx | huh | 05:50 |
| johnx | hasn't been my experience on an N800 | 05:50 |
| johnx | maybe it's a different command | 05:50 |
| delt | So, avoid to try to disable the watchdog on retu, or your N810 will be turned off by its watchdog :) | 05:50 |
| luke-jr__ | delt: … LILO is very obsolete :p | 05:50 |
| johnx | that's uhm, contrary to what I've experienced | 05:50 |
| delt | ok, plugging back the tablet to usb, enabling rd mode... | 05:50 |
| delt | luke-jr__: wgaff, it works | 05:51 |
| delt | besides, so is my brain | 05:51 |
| johnx | ah | 05:52 |
| johnx | right | 05:52 |
| johnx | 'no-lifeguard-reset' | 05:52 |
| delt | ok, so, flasher --enable-rd-mode now thsi little "control panel" thing appeared under the blue nokia logo | 05:52 |
| johnx | yeah | 05:52 |
| delt | --set-rd-flags right? | 05:53 |
| johnx | hang on | 05:53 |
| johnx | finding the right command | 05:53 |
| johnx | so you already ran 'enable-rd-mode' right? | 05:53 |
| johnx | now: flasher-3.0 --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset -R | 05:53 |
| delt | ah, now i get kernel output in green on top of the nokia startup screen | 05:54 |
| *** swc|666 has joined #maemo | 05:54 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr__: meh, have read that before, idn't make me cheer and dance. But honestly, Nokia is acting stupid here, bme is acting stupid, and the differentiation argument is stupid | 05:55 |
| delt | kernel 2.6.21-omap1, initfs 2008-43, nolo 1.1.16 | 05:55 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr__: but I haven't read anything about Nokia pressing other manufs to do anything. They simply can't | 05:56 |
| delt | stays stuck there (BUT i can turn it off with the power switch) | 05:56 |
| johnx | delt, did you see if plugging it into a computer gets you access to the internal card? | 05:57 |
| delt | ie. it should show up as a mass storage usb device? | 05:57 |
| delt | yep. sdb appears | 05:57 |
| delt | with one partition sdb1 | 05:58 |
| johnx | well, some of your stuff is there :) | 05:58 |
| *** KMFDM has quit IRC | 05:58 | |
| delt | aight! | 05:58 |
| johnx | uhm, what all did you want off of it? | 05:58 |
| delt | oh, can i now fdsik this piece of shit WINDOWZ partition into an ext2/3 ? | 05:59 |
| delt | (which is what caused this whole mess in the first place) | 05:59 |
| *** hardaker has joined #maemo | 06:00 | |
| johnx | uhm, you could try. make sure you get your stuff first | 06:00 |
| delt | /dev/sdb1 1962220 829396 1132824 43% /mnt | 06:00 |
| delt | ok.... | 06:00 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 06:00 | |
| *** dockane_ has joined #maemo | 06:00 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 06:00 | |
| delt | oh btw, "share" contains this: fonts/ games/ icons/ locale/ osso-help/ sounds/ | 06:01 |
| delt | would ANY OF THESE MISSING from /usr/share BEFORE mmc2 gets booted, cause the tablet to NOT boot properly? | 06:02 |
| delt | would ANY OF THESE MISSING from /usr/share BEFORE mmc2 gets mounted, cause the tablet to NOT boot properly? | 06:02 |
| delt | sorry | 06:02 |
| johnx | sure | 06:02 |
| johnx | icons | 06:02 |
| johnx | fonts | 06:02 |
| johnx | locale | 06:02 |
| johnx | sounds | 06:02 |
| delt | wtf????? | 06:02 |
| johnx | mmc2 gets mounted *after* the GUI is running, I believe | 06:03 |
| delt | you mean all those directories HAVE to be on the / fs ??? | 06:03 |
| johnx | or modify when mmc2 gets mounted *shrugs* | 06:03 |
| delt | wtf??? and that would be because nokia are fucking retards, or what??!?!?? | 06:03 |
| johnx | you're two years late to complain about this | 06:04 |
| delt | just got this tablet like 2 weeks ago | 06:04 |
| *** dockane has quit IRC | 06:04 | |
| johnx | meh. then you didn't do your research *and* you're two years late | 06:04 |
| lpotter_ | and not all nokians are retards | 06:05 |
| johnx | lpotter_++ | 06:05 |
| delt | *sigh* OK. so as i said the kernel is not the problem. now how do i edit files in /etc on the root fs? | 06:05 |
| johnx | sometimes devices are designed with an audience that's not joe random hacker | 06:05 |
| johnx | I always liked vi, but that's just me | 06:06 |
| luke-jr__ | DocScrutinizer51: can or can't, they want the situation to change for the worse | 06:06 |
| delt | <--- joe random-linux-user-for-the-past-15-years | 06:06 |
| johnx | great | 06:06 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yes, quite disqualifying for Nokia | 06:06 |
| delt | um let me rephrase that, how do i make /etc/ on the tablet's root fs accessible from the PC? | 06:06 |
| johnx | I was one of the guys hacking debian onto the N8x0, not one of the people complaining to Nokia | 06:07 |
| *** kwtm has quit IRC | 06:07 | |
| johnx | delt, get it booting, ssh in | 06:07 |
| johnx | the kernel is what makes the fs available over usb | 06:07 |
| delt | yeah, someone mentioned that earlier today | 06:08 |
| johnx | me | 06:08 |
| johnx | yesterday | 06:08 |
| * delt -> concentration--; | 06:09 | |
| johnx | heh :) | 06:09 |
| johnx | just don't complain like you're owed something and I won't get prickly :) | 06:09 |
| delt | really, i have serious nervous system and concentration issues | 06:09 |
| *** LinuxCode has quit IRC | 06:09 | |
| * lpotter_ thinks nokia owes him a beer | 06:10 | |
| johnx | I have serious attention problems, just don't rant/complain too much, ask smart questions and people will be helpful | 06:10 |
| delt | so now the "get it booting" part... | 06:11 |
| johnx | right. do you have all the files you wanted? | 06:11 |
| delt | ssh in would require a sshd, which i had installed on that partition | 06:11 |
| delt | yeah, thanks very much for that btw | 06:11 |
| johnx | great | 06:11 |
| johnx | reflash is the *easiest* way from here | 06:12 |
| delt | so now, probably simpler to just re-flash it | 06:12 |
| johnx | if you want to get into serious hacker mode you could probably get a rescue initrd setup but it's probably not worth it | 06:12 |
| delt | what's the latest (and relatively stable) version of maemo that will run reliably on n810? | 06:13 |
| johnx | uhm, whatever it says on tablets-dev.nokia.com | 06:13 |
| delt | my brother told me maemo 5 is for the n900 but semi-works on the 810 ...is that correct? | 06:13 |
| *** timoph|away is now known as timoph | 06:13 | |
| *** OptX has quit IRC | 06:13 | |
| johnx | that's ... kind of stretching the facts a bit | 06:13 |
| delt | i think he said some ppl have tried it and it's really buggy, or something like that | 06:14 |
| * johnx is also one of the guys who was working on backporting maemo 5 to the N8x0, but gave up once he was in the process of becoming a linux distro maintainer | 06:14 | |
| delt | heh, so you're one of the authors of maemo dist? | 06:15 |
| johnx | nope | 06:15 |
| delt | or at least the arm kernel? | 06:15 |
| johnx | errr....just some bored sys admin | 06:15 |
| timoph | :) | 06:15 |
| johnx | other people did a lot more of the work. I hacked some things and acted as cheer leader and 'proof of concept' guy | 06:16 |
| lpotter_ | researcher! | 06:16 |
| johnx | basically, we were trying to pull the open parts of maemo 5 and get them running happily on the N8x0 hardware | 06:16 |
| *** lpotter_ is now known as lpotter | 06:16 | |
| johnx | lpotter, research is a a very pretty word to call my hacks :) | 06:17 |
| delt | one thing i wanted to make sure of.... can i completely flush this windows partition and replace it with a ext3? | 06:17 |
| lpotter | I was being generous, then | 06:17 |
| johnx | lpotter, flattery is always appreciated :) | 06:18 |
| johnx | delt, uhm, maybe with a bit of work | 06:18 |
| delt | other than changing the entry in /etc/fstab and so on? | 06:18 |
| johnx | is it mounted from /etc/fstab? | 06:18 |
| johnx | anyways, reflash, then start hacking :) | 06:19 |
| delt | dunno... but if the 2gb partition "internal card" was... i'd guess wouldnt have any problems with the device right now. | 06:19 |
| delt | ok, my frontal lobe hurts im starting to have smoke coming out of my ears. gonna take a look at this tomorrow Thanks for the info all, especially johnx | 06:20 |
| *** githogori has joined #maemo | 06:20 | |
| *** rohanpm has joined #maemo | 06:21 | |
| johnx | delt, good luck :) take a breather and make a fresh start tomorrow | 06:21 |
| johnx | always easier to hack when you're not worried about your data | 06:21 |
| delt | oh another thing... if i had a minisd card, i could use it as "boot disk" kind of, right? | 06:21 |
| delt | i think yesterday someone mentioned booting from external SD (?) | 06:22 |
| johnx | delt, exactly | 06:23 |
| johnx | boot from sd | 06:23 |
| *** hardaker has quit IRC | 06:23 | |
| johnx | that's what we did with debian-on-n8x0 and the maemo5-backport (mer) | 06:23 |
| delt | so if i had a mini sd card (or a micro with an adapter) this whole thing would have been a lot easier? | 06:23 |
| delt | yeah, that is on my to-buy-soon list anyway.... | 06:24 |
| *** Xisdibik has joined #maemo | 06:24 | |
| johnx | but to boot from miniSD you need to have flashed an 'alternate' initrd that has 'bootmenu' in it | 06:24 |
| johnx | basically a little swtichboard that lets you pick a filesystem to pivot_root onto | 06:25 |
| johnx | and to generate that initrd you really need a running device or a lot of involved hacking | 06:25 |
| *** MadViking has quit IRC | 06:26 | |
| delt | johnx: kind of like lilo's boot-which-os menu? | 06:26 |
| johnx | to the user it looks similar | 06:27 |
| johnx | in practice it's very different | 06:27 |
| johnx | lilo is run before the kernel | 06:27 |
| delt | but wouldn't that be the boot loader's job, not the kernel? | 06:27 |
| johnx | n8x0 bootmenu is run by init | 06:27 |
| delt | whoa... ok...... | 06:28 |
| johnx | yeah, we had to do some kinda special hacks. | 06:28 |
| johnx | it works though, and it's really not that much of a problem | 06:28 |
| delt | which is because of how the arm processor is physically built, i presume? | 06:30 |
| delt | or its memory mapper, or whatever.... | 06:30 |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 06:30 | |
| johnx | nah, it's because we didn't want to mess with Nokia's closed source bootloaders | 06:30 |
| johnx | plus, we need to have BME running, and it already runs out of initrd | 06:31 |
| delt | wtf? and then they take maemo and ship it with a commercial product?? | 06:31 |
| johnx | they made maemo ... | 06:31 |
| Termana | johnx, not that you can anyway. Not entirely sure about the n810, but on the n900 the bootloader is signed | 06:31 |
| delt | oh... but maemo is open source | 06:31 |
| johnx | parts of it are | 06:31 |
| johnx | anyways, they're a lot more friendly to the open source community than Sharp or Tivo or Sony or HTC | 06:32 |
| delt | or microsoft | 06:32 |
| delt | sry, brain capacity is at 5% right now | 06:32 |
| johnx | :) | 06:32 |
| Termana | johnx, ouch. Depending on your viewpoint, I guess :P Not saying they are open source friendly though | 06:32 |
| Termana | aren't* | 06:33 |
| johnx | Termana, the saga of Sharp and the Zaurus is a long and painful tale | 06:33 |
| Termana | johnx, why do you keep thinking I'm talking about the Zaurus? :P I've never even owned one | 06:34 |
| johnx | ah, well that's my experience with Sharp | 06:34 |
| johnx | super cool hardware, totally awful to the community | 06:34 |
| delt | well, corporations are there to make money | 06:34 |
| delt | the opinion of 5% of its market who happen to be smart people doesn't affect their profit margins that much. | 06:34 |
| *** Gh0sty has quit IRC | 06:34 | |
| johnx | right. and I try to patronize the companies that will treat me the way I want to be treated | 06:35 |
| johnx | sometimes that even goes as far as recommending their products | 06:35 |
| *** Gh0sty has joined #maemo | 06:36 | |
| johnx | anyways, AFAIK, Nokia is currently one of the most (if not *the* most) open-source friendly phone maker right now | 06:36 |
| delt | like nvidia for 3d cards... which isnt saying much | 06:36 |
| delt | put out an open source driver so they can claim "Hey, we're open source!!" | 06:37 |
| wmarone | delt: don't you mean ATI? | 06:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: yeah, since OM not really *makes* phones any more | 06:37 |
| wmarone | nvidia hasn't put out anything, iirc | 06:37 |
| *** kthomas has quit IRC | 06:38 | |
| delt | ati's open source drivers are a joke. some 3rd party project tried to make some deceont ones iirc... havent been following that story for years | 06:38 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, yeah, I was careful to say 'currently'. I really hope to see either more from OM or another OM-like startup | 06:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | qi-hardware | 06:38 |
| *** Funnyface has quit IRC | 06:38 | |
| nox- | nvidia's drivers aren't open source either, just the `wrapper' parts are that link to a binary blob | 06:38 |
| delt | anyway, at least nv's open src drivers got better over the next few years | 06:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | OM is 'dead' | 06:39 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, mmmm...I *am* looking for good things out of them :) | 06:39 |
| johnx | delt, the story is a lot like it used to be when I bought an original Radeon | 06:39 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, aaah, it's super confusing to also have a company called pixel-qi that does small runs of hardware aimed at enthusiasts | 06:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm a bit of advertising can't hurt - /join #qi-hardware | 06:40 |
| delt | had my geforce 6600gt for like 6 or 7 years... havent been playing games much recently | 06:40 |
| delt | mainly because of my concentration issues getting worse these past few years | 06:41 |
| johnx | delt, 6600 here. :) might get a new video card early next year | 06:41 |
| delt | in first person shooters, by the time i get warmed up enough to play decently, my coordination skills are already going down fast, heh :/ | 06:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Main_Page | 06:42 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, yeah. the nanonote. I was actually looking at that, around the 4th or 5th time delays were announced in pandora production | 06:43 |
| johnx | 32MB RAM / 336MHz MIPS doesn't quite do it for me though :| | 06:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah it's really 'cheap' hardware | 06:44 |
| johnx | looks really pretty though | 06:44 |
| johnx | in comparison my pandora is a terrifying ugly thing | 06:44 |
| *** Funnyface has joined #maemo | 06:46 | |
| delt | ok, now i really need to sleep... thanks for the help everyone zZzZ | 06:46 |
| johnx | 'night delt | 06:46 |
| delt | nite | 06:46 |
| *** delt has left #maemo | 06:46 | |
| *** radic_ has quit IRC | 06:48 | |
| *** waite has joined #maemo | 06:49 | |
| CreamyG | jesus my 5 year old laptop had a 6600 | 06:52 |
| CreamyG | i think it could play far cry | 06:53 |
| wmarone | and not much more :) | 06:53 |
| wmarone | my old system had a 6600GT too, except it was an MSI whose fan stopped operating while the card was going full tilt :( | 06:54 |
| johnx | my 6600 is fanless | 06:54 |
| johnx | major selling point at the time. that and it was $50 from woot | 06:54 |
| wmarone | heh | 06:54 |
| wmarone | yeah the fanless designs were impressive but scary to me | 06:55 |
| wmarone | that and my case couldn't fit the massive heatsink on it | 06:55 |
| CreamyG | hey anyone got an idea on this? i am trying to build something with ESbox, its trying to chmod autogen.sh and says "Value too large for defined data type". that is only supposed to happen if you run 32-bit OS and throw it a 4GB file or something | 06:55 |
| johnx | wmarone, oh, mine is actually a single slot design. really compact actually, though it was one of the later 6600 cards I think | 06:55 |
| CreamyG | damn i had a fanless radeon 9700 | 06:56 |
| CreamyG | bought like this gigantic two slabs of aluminum and a big heatpipe to connect them | 06:56 |
| wmarone | johnx: must've, friend of mine had a fanless and it had a huge heatsink on both sides of the card | 06:57 |
| CreamyG | pretty sweet to have a high end card running silent | 06:57 |
| CreamyG | now i water cool. but that's a pain... | 06:57 |
| johnx | CreamyG, hmm, as to the problem. are you in ARMEL mode? | 06:57 |
| CreamyG | i tried both armel and x86 as build targets and it fails. if i do it manually from scratchbox it works (past that anyways) | 06:58 |
| CreamyG | its making an ssh connection and doing stuff using mounted remote shares or something f'ed up and confusing | 06:58 |
| CreamyG | but the funny thing is i just told it to "pakcage a deb" and it did that fine | 06:58 |
| johnx | ah, right, esbox | 06:59 |
| CreamyG | i really hate computers, and these damn tools they make to simplify things | 06:59 |
| CreamyG | it is like 3 days work to set up the build environment i swear | 06:59 |
| CreamyG | maybe i'm just dumb :P | 06:59 |
| johnx | nah | 07:00 |
| *** ALoGeNo has quit IRC | 07:00 | |
| johnx | I started my own linux distro rather than mess with scratchbox | 07:00 |
| CreamyG | yeah it helps if you know what you're doing to begin with. i keep learning new stuff that is probably really obvious. | 07:01 |
| CreamyG | oh well it's probably better use of my time than getting more gamerscore on my xbox | 07:01 |
| johnx | even given that you know how to use binfmt_misc to make qemu run foreign arch binaries for you, nothing scratchbox does is 'obvious' or 'intuitive' | 07:01 |
| johnx | do you really need esbox? or will plain scratchbox work? | 07:02 |
| *** radic has joined #maemo | 07:02 | |
| CreamyG | i already was using scratchbox, and then i thought, hey, i'd like to use eclipse instead of a normal text editor (ultraedit) | 07:02 |
| johnx | bet that normal text editor looks awfully nice right now | 07:03 |
| CreamyG | and the tutorial to set it up was for ESbox so i figured it might be cool if it can compile for me... | 07:03 |
| CreamyG | yeah | 07:03 |
| CreamyG | i wanted to do remote debugging and stuff if possible | 07:03 |
| CreamyG | that stuff never works for me | 07:03 |
| johnx | yeah, you have scratchbox working, even *that* never really worked 100% for me | 07:04 |
| johnx | is this for maemo 4 or maemo 5. BTW? | 07:04 |
| CreamyG | even microsoft, for visual studio, needs security certificts, domain names, all sorts of pain | 07:04 |
| CreamyG | maemo 5 | 07:04 |
| *** visz has quit IRC | 07:04 | |
| johnx | work in scratchbox, use scp to copy binaries to your N900, be happy | 07:05 |
| johnx | I think you can get strace for the N900, so there's that at least | 07:05 |
| CreamyG | yeah | 07:06 |
| CreamyG | at least i got some uhhh convenient mount points for my 3 days work | 07:06 |
| johnx | sshfs? | 07:07 |
| CreamyG | it made me set up all these samba shares so now i have a c:\maemo that goes into scratchbox | 07:07 |
| CreamyG | yayyyy | 07:07 |
| johnx | O_o; | 07:08 |
| CreamyG | for some reason drag and dropping files into vmware randomly fails... actually its pretty consistently failing. so i guess thats good | 07:08 |
| * johnx just uses vim | 07:08 | |
| * johnx makes some joke a bout 'back in my day ... ' | 07:08 | |
| CreamyG | haha well whatever works... better than wasting time with these fancy IDEs | 07:09 |
| CreamyG | who needs code completion anyways | 07:09 |
| * CreamyG cries | 07:09 | |
| *** visz has joined #maemo | 07:09 | |
| * wmarone wonders why fedora 12 hates virtualbox's 3D drivers | 07:10 | |
| johnx | vim has syntax hilighting, and code completion I think | 07:10 |
| wmarone | you can give it all that if you want | 07:10 |
| johnx | I *rely* on the syntax hilighting for sure | 07:10 |
| johnx | I also understand that it's not for everyone | 07:11 |
| CreamyG | cool i'll look into that i guess | 07:12 |
| johnx | uhm, if you've never used vim ... you might not like it all that much | 07:12 |
| *** ALoGeNo has joined #maemo | 07:12 | |
| johnx | something like gedit or even emacs might be more interesting for you | 07:12 |
| CreamyG | might as well see if i get get the .deb to spit out of ESbox though cuz that looks really close. | 07:14 |
| johnx | vim is for people who say things like "Gee, I'm really tired of typing letters and having them appear in a text file. I wish I had to position my cursor with the h, j, k, and l keys then switch into insert mode to do that." | 07:14 |
| CreamyG | haha i have used that before | 07:14 |
| visz | why should i have to move my right hand 10 centimeters to the right to be able to move the cursor? | 07:15 |
| visz | i'm too lazy for that | 07:15 |
| * johnx lives in vim :) | 07:15 | |
| visz | you have insert mode?-) | 07:16 |
| *** nox- has quit IRC | 07:16 | |
| *** waite has quit IRC | 07:16 | |
| johnx | visz, hmm? did I use the wrong term? | 07:16 |
| CreamyG | i remember my dad using edlin, i don't think i ever figured that out either | 07:19 |
| CreamyG | of course i would have been like 7 | 07:19 |
| johnx | my mom tried to teach me DOS at about that age :) | 07:19 |
| CreamyG | yeah my dad just had to show me how to play games... he made me all these batch files to load them. | 07:20 |
| CreamyG | i swear half the crap i know about computers is probably from figuring out how to play games | 07:20 |
| johnx | ahahaha | 07:21 |
| johnx | yup | 07:21 |
| johnx | it's a good bait and switch, isn't it? | 07:21 |
| *** ArtVandalae has joined #maemo | 07:23 | |
| CreamyG | yeah it's funny now i have to help my dad play games | 07:23 |
| CreamyG | so apparently i got about 20 more years to learn everything | 07:25 |
| johnx | ahahaha | 07:25 |
| johnx | yeah, good luck with that :) | 07:25 |
| *** felipe` has joined #maemo | 07:25 | |
| CreamyG | damn that isn't very long... yeah.. i better get this working tonight | 07:25 |
| johnx | I have met people who claim to know everything about linux or unix, but those are usually the people who know the least :) | 07:26 |
| *** sar3th is now known as sar3th|away | 07:26 | |
| Termana | You don't need to know everything about linux or unix to do interesting things anyhow ;) | 07:27 |
| johnx | for sure :) | 07:27 |
| *** MadViking has joined #maemo | 07:27 | |
| johnx | and not 'knowing' all the answers can often lead to creative approaches to problems | 07:28 |
| johnx | or a lot of pain and wasted time :) | 07:28 |
| Termana | :P | 07:28 |
| CreamyG | hah yeah | 07:28 |
| CreamyG | i wish i worked somewhere where more people used unix | 07:28 |
| *** fredrin has joined #maemo | 07:28 | |
| CreamyG | it's hard enough to find someone that knows c or c++ | 07:28 |
| johnx | send out some job apps :) | 07:28 |
| CreamyG | yeah i probably will in a few months, i'm a contractor so i gotta re-apply for my job anyways :| | 07:29 |
| raster | CreamyG: go to embedded | 07:29 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 07:29 | |
| raster | :) | 07:29 |
| Termana | Besides, it's not fun if you know EVERYTHING. Constantly learning is what keeps it fun ;) :P | 07:29 |
| raster | more linux there | 07:30 |
| raster | and more c :) | 07:30 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 07:30 | |
| johnx | or get a job as a junior linux sys admin. lots of learning from cranky old unix guys | 07:30 |
| CreamyG | haha just because i want to learn it doesn't mean i should try and get a job yet | 07:30 |
| CreamyG | i'd probably fail bad lol | 07:30 |
| johnx | do you learn quick? | 07:30 |
| raster | learning is a bit overrated | 07:30 |
| raster | makes u feel like you are moving fowradr | 07:31 |
| CreamyG | i only learn by doing | 07:31 |
| raster | but invariably accomplishes little for others | 07:31 |
| raster | its a very selfish thing | 07:31 |
| CreamyG | i can't learn much from reading | 07:31 |
| raster | more important is to actually PRODUCE something | 07:31 |
| johnx | raster, need to learn before you can teach or produce though :P | 07:31 |
| raster | u may or may not leanr a thing or 2 in the process | 07:31 |
| johnx | raster, it's like saying eating is selfish | 07:31 |
| *** Psi has joined #maemo | 07:31 | |
| raster | johnx: yes. i guess i'm referring to the poeple who leanr a new programming lang every year or 2 | 07:32 |
| raster | and contiunually change the langs they use | 07:32 |
| raster | or start new projetcs just to use a new lang | 07:32 |
| raster | in the end they cycle so much they accomplish little | 07:32 |
| raster | they know a little of many langs | 07:32 |
| raster | but they are masters of none of them | 07:32 |
| johnx | sounds like me | 07:32 |
| johnx | jack of all trades, master of none | 07:32 |
| raster | you should find 1 u like | 07:32 |
| raster | that also is practical | 07:32 |
| raster | and stick to it | 07:32 |
| raster | become a master of it | 07:33 |
| Termana | johnx, :D | 07:33 |
| johnx | raster, meh | 07:33 |
| raster | u accomplish much more | 07:33 |
| raster | in terms of actually producing something | 07:33 |
| johnx | my job dictates what I learn | 07:33 |
| *** DocScrutinizer has quit IRC | 07:33 | |
| *** DocScrutinizer has joined #maemo | 07:33 | |
| johnx | want me to tell my boss "I know all of our projects are in PHP, but I really want to become a master of ruby, so I'm writing my part in ruby." | 07:33 |
| johnx | yeah. that'd go over really well | 07:34 |
| raster | johnx: u took it the wrong way | 07:34 |
| raster | 1 u like that is ALSO practical | 07:34 |
| johnx | plus, too many people that only know one thing really well are missing the big picture | 07:34 |
| raster | what is practical for u then would be php | 07:34 |
| raster | so become a master at it | 07:35 |
| raster | onc eu are a master the lang ceases to become a barrier to anything | 07:35 |
| johnx | great, but if I want to hack someone else's code to do what I want, and that code is in C, rewriting it in PHP is less practical than learning a bit of C and makign a tweak | 07:35 |
| raster | u read code like u read "english" | 07:35 |
| raster | u dotn care about comments - the code has all u need. | 07:35 |
| johnx | it's all about having a lot of tools to choose from, not how you acquire those tools | 07:35 |
| raster | "if you want to" | 07:36 |
| johnx | everyone learns to become language agnostic differently | 07:36 |
| raster | but do you have to? | 07:36 |
| raster | is it part of your every day? | 07:36 |
| ds3 | johnx: You'd be surprised how well that goes over | 07:36 |
| johnx | ds3, hmm? | 07:36 |
| ds3 | johnx: I have cleaned up many projects where that is pretty much what happened | 07:37 |
| johnx | people becoming 'language agnostic' and writing python the way they learned to write C? :) | 07:37 |
| ds3 | no | 07:37 |
| johnx | ah, then I'm lost | 07:37 |
| ds3 | so called embedded systems with TCL, Python, bash, sh, and who knows what other scripting langauges | 07:38 |
| raster | neing langauge agnostic is like thinking u'll be .. language agnostic | 07:38 |
| raster | (as in human language) | 07:38 |
| raster | u never will be | 07:38 |
| ds3 | all apparently done cause someone thought it was interesting to do it that way | 07:38 |
| raster | or very very very very few will be | 07:38 |
| raster | everyone will have a preferred lang | 07:38 |
| raster | eg english | 07:38 |
| raster | or german | 07:38 |
| raster | or japanese | 07:38 |
| raster | etc. | 07:38 |
| raster | they have a native lang they learned first | 07:38 |
| raster | or one they simply know best | 07:38 |
| raster | very very very few master enough human langs to "be agnostic as to which one they speak/use for anything" | 07:39 |
| ds3 | johnx: so just because you ask that, don't assume it'd be rejected outright :D | 07:39 |
| johnx | ds3, sounds like most linux distros these days :) so I guess if I plan to use Linux and modify it to do what I want I should probably know a little of everything :D | 07:39 |
| raster | nothing wrong with learning a lot of things | 07:40 |
| raster | but learnig a lo9t just for the sake of it is not so useful | 07:40 |
| raster | and learning a whole lot of langs and not being master of any is not so good either | 07:40 |
| raster | at least be the master of 1 | 07:40 |
| raster | :) | 07:40 |
| johnx | fine. I've mastered bash | 07:40 |
| raster | hahahahaha | 07:41 |
| raster | :) | 07:41 |
| RST38h | g'mornin raster, johnx | 07:41 |
| raster | RST38h: booo! | 07:41 |
| johnx | RST38h, m00f | 07:41 |
| *** visz has quit IRC | 07:42 | |
| johnx | raster, I'm a sys admin. I hack where I need to, in whatever language is required. I don't have any big outside of work programming projects, so I mainly just use whatever programming language or technology I need to to get the job done | 07:42 |
| raster | johnx: i guess being an admin is different. | 07:43 |
| johnx | though, besides bash, I'm awfully fond of scheme. I'd love to do more scheme, but I'm not going to invent a project that calls for scheme just to use it | 07:43 |
| johnx | my interest is in accomplishing things, not learning programming for its own sake | 07:43 |
| * RST38h suggests that knowledge of a particular programming language does not make you a good software developer | 07:43 | |
| johnx | so I guess I can agree with your original point, but not your second one | 07:43 |
| raster | the guys designing/building the cars need much deeper knowledge than the mechanics fixing them up when they break - but the mechanics need to know about more than just the few cars they work on | 07:44 |
| raster | as they may get anything into the shop | 07:44 |
| *** doc|home has quit IRC | 07:44 | |
| RST38h | Knowledge of how to write good software and how to analyze it for faults does | 07:44 |
| johnx | raster, thank you! perfect analogy for how I think | 07:44 |
| raster | RST38h: lang plays a big part in that | 07:45 |
| *** visz has joined #maemo | 07:45 | |
| raster | as along with lang comes dev/debug env | 07:45 |
| raster | and tools | 07:45 |
| RST38h | raster:Some part, yes | 07:45 |
| raster | will u use gdb? or printf? | 07:45 |
| raster | if its python.. u arent going to use gdb | 07:45 |
| raster | what do u do? | 07:45 |
| raster | werll u can still "printf debug" there | 07:45 |
| raster | etc. etc. | 07:45 |
| RST38h | raster: printf() works pretty much everywhere | 07:45 |
| RST38h | in fact, when you say gdb, I think printf :) | 07:45 |
| raster | but in general debugging code well involves knowing the code weell | 07:45 |
| * johnx goes off to learn jquery and mongoDB for fun | 07:45 | |
| ds3 | printf don't work too well if you are just debugging the UART for the output of the printf ;) | 07:46 |
| RST38h | ds3: special case | 07:46 |
| * RST38h used LEDs. And a beeper. :) | 07:47 | |
| ds3 | RST38h: depends on your line of work.. some of us bring up boards where that is common | 07:47 |
| RST38h | yea, I do that from time to time | 07:48 |
| RST38h | but usually, you get *some* printfs :) | 07:49 |
| *** zutesmog has left #maemo | 07:50 | |
| *** zutesmog has joined #maemo | 07:50 | |
| *** TermanaDesire has joined #maemo | 07:50 | |
| ds3 | I wish I was that lucky... | 08:01 |
| ds3 | I'm happy to get random trash :D | 08:02 |
| *** trupheenix has joined #maemo | 08:05 | |
| RST38h | if you have got at least some video buffer, implementing printfs to it israther easy | 08:08 |
| *** Cy8aer has joined #maemo | 08:09 | |
| *** doc|home has joined #maemo | 08:11 | |
| *** doc|home has joined #maemo | 08:11 | |
| *** Peyman has joined #maemo | 08:12 | |
| *** visz has quit IRC | 08:13 | |
| ds3 | only problem is during those times, the timing of the video signals is uncertain nor is all the enables for it | 08:14 |
| *** visz has joined #maemo | 08:18 | |
| *** visz has quit IRC | 08:21 | |
| *** visz has joined #maemo | 08:21 | |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 08:21 | |
| *** Ordog_by has joined #maemo | 08:22 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 08:24 | |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 08:25 | |
| *** Khertan has joined #maemo | 08:28 | |
| *** arno0ob has quit IRC | 08:29 | |
| RST38h | http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2010/09/500x_cuban-tree-frog_3627_600x450.jpg | 08:30 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 08:30 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 08:32 | |
| asj | RST38h: lol | 08:36 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 08:37 | |
| *** tekojo has joined #maemo | 08:43 | |
| *** tekojo has joined #maemo | 08:43 | |
| *** mece has joined #maemo | 08:45 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 08:45 | |
| *** FireFly has joined #maemo | 08:45 | |
| jpinx-eeepc | where are the sms's stored in the filesystem? | 08:46 |
| asj | I presume in tracker | 08:46 |
| asj | (so looks for a sqllite file somewhere in the homedir I would guess) | 08:47 |
| *** fredrin has quit IRC | 08:48 | |
| jpinx-eeepc | I asssumed a sql in /home/user , but can't see anything obvious | 08:48 |
| *** TheJ has joined #maemo | 08:49 | |
| *** ALoGeNo has quit IRC | 08:51 | |
| *** ZZzzZzzz_ has quit IRC | 08:52 | |
| frals | jpinx-eeepc: el.db or similar in ~/.rtcom-eventlogger or something along those lines | 08:52 |
| *** MrPPS has joined #maemo | 08:52 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 08:53 | |
| MrPPS | hey - out of curiosity, does anyone know offhand if GNU screen has been ported to maemo? | 08:53 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 08:56 | |
| Khertan | Morning all ! | 08:56 |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 08:56 | |
| MrPPS | gday Khertan | 08:57 |
| Khertan | lbt, are you here ? | 08:57 |
| Khertan | hi MrPPS | 08:58 |
| *** Xisdibik has quit IRC | 08:58 | |
| *** tekojo has quit IRC | 08:58 | |
| *** lmoura has quit IRC | 09:00 | |
| *** tekojo has joined #maemo | 09:01 | |
| *** tekojo has quit IRC | 09:01 | |
| *** tekojo has joined #maemo | 09:01 | |
| *** avs has joined #maemo | 09:03 | |
| *** FireFly has quit IRC | 09:03 | |
| *** jrocha has joined #maemo | 09:03 | |
| *** ZZzzZzzz_ has joined #maemo | 09:04 | |
| *** ALoGeNo has joined #maemo | 09:05 | |
| *** MadViking has quit IRC | 09:05 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 09:06 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 09:06 | |
| *** vanadismobile has quit IRC | 09:09 | |
| *** C-S-B has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** toggles has joined #maemo | 09:11 | |
| *** spinningcompass has quit IRC | 09:11 | |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 09:12 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 09:12 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has quit IRC | 09:14 | |
| *** hannesw has joined #maemo | 09:15 | |
| *** sandst1|away is now known as sandst1 | 09:15 | |
| *** TheJ has quit IRC | 09:17 | |
| *** eCo_maemo has quit IRC | 09:22 | |
| *** schend has joined #maemo | 09:24 | |
| Peyman | I want to scrobble to my last.fm account, which player i shoud use? any suggestion? | 09:24 |
| *** MacDrunk has joined #maemo | 09:24 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has joined #maemo | 09:27 | |
| petteri | Peyman: default player works with last-fmscrobbler installed | 09:29 |
| *** vanadis has joined #maemo | 09:29 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has quit IRC | 09:30 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC | 09:31 | |
| Peyman | petteri, "E: couldnt find package last-fmscrobbler" | 09:35 |
| petteri | hmm.. | 09:36 |
| petteri | http://maemo.org/packages/view/mafw-lastfm | 09:36 |
| petteri | that one | 09:36 |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 09:38 | |
| *** e-yes has quit IRC | 09:39 | |
| * johnx is compiling a 'database server' that links against xulrunner, is worried slightly | 09:43 | |
| Stskeeps | like qt that links against gtk.. | 09:43 |
| johnx | but only so qt can dance around in gtk's skin and impersonate it | 09:44 |
| johnx | which is totally not creepy | 09:44 |
| Peyman | ow :) tnx petteri | 09:47 |
| *** nicu has joined #maemo | 09:47 | |
| *** ag0ny has joined #maemo | 09:51 | |
| *** murrayc has joined #maemo | 09:51 | |
| *** e-yes has joined #maemo | 09:52 | |
| *** amigadave has joined #maemo | 09:52 | |
| *** FIQ|n900 has quit IRC | 09:53 | |
| *** AdmiralSausage has joined #maemo | 09:53 | |
| *** lmoura has joined #maemo | 09:55 | |
| *** kwek has joined #maemo | 09:55 | |
| *** geaaru has joined #maemo | 09:57 | |
| *** jrocha has quit IRC | 09:59 | |
| *** gaveen has joined #maemo | 10:00 | |
| johnx | totally random question: does anyone have experience with MongoDB? | 10:01 |
| *** eocanha has joined #maemo | 10:03 | |
| pexi | with maemo? | 10:04 |
| johnx | just in general | 10:04 |
| johnx | off-topic question :) | 10:04 |
| pexi | not more than google :) | 10:04 |
| johnx | was just curious | 10:05 |
| johnx | I'm waiting for it to compile on my server reading the documentation thinking "this is too goo to be true ..." | 10:05 |
| pexi | well if u don't need the speed and scalability, it is good | 10:06 |
| *** hrw|gone is now known as hrw | 10:08 | |
| *** msanchez has joined #maemo | 10:09 | |
| johnx | heh. I just wish I knew how much speed and scalability I actually need | 10:10 |
| *** Wikier has joined #maemo | 10:10 | |
| johnx | and how much I'm just worrying about a future that will never come | 10:10 |
| *** FIQ|n900 has joined #maemo | 10:10 | |
| *** sergio__ has joined #maemo | 10:11 | |
| *** jrocha has joined #maemo | 10:11 | |
| *** cfreak200 has quit IRC | 10:12 | |
| *** ppenz has joined #maemo | 10:12 | |
| *** cfreak200 has joined #maemo | 10:14 | |
| *** polymar has joined #maemo | 10:14 | |
| *** suresh_ has joined #maemo | 10:14 | |
| *** schend has quit IRC | 10:15 | |
| *** schend has joined #maemo | 10:15 | |
| *** frade has joined #maemo | 10:15 | |
| *** merlin1991 has joined #maemo | 10:16 | |
| *** sx0n has quit IRC | 10:16 | |
| *** Papayawhip|maemo is now known as Papayawhip | 10:19 | |
| *** sx0n has joined #maemo | 10:20 | |
| *** TheXception|off is now known as TheXception | 10:20 | |
| *** Rhoruns has quit IRC | 10:21 | |
| *** flo_lap has joined #maemo | 10:23 | |
| *** eMHa_ has quit IRC | 10:24 | |
| *** githogori has quit IRC | 10:25 | |
| *** villev has joined #maemo | 10:28 | |
| *** SmilyOrg has quit IRC | 10:30 | |
| *** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo | 10:30 | |
| *** S_WO has quit IRC | 10:32 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo | 10:33 | |
| *** tackat has joined #maemo | 10:33 | |
| *** bef0rd has quit IRC | 10:34 | |
| *** bef0rd has joined #maemo | 10:36 | |
| *** bef0rd has quit IRC | 10:36 | |
| *** bef0rd has joined #maemo | 10:36 | |
| *** swo has joined #maemo | 10:37 | |
| *** flo_lap has quit IRC | 10:37 | |
| *** benh has quit IRC | 10:38 | |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 10:38 | |
| *** jpe has joined #maemo | 10:39 | |
| *** ptlo has joined #maemo | 10:40 | |
| *** ArtVandalae has quit IRC | 10:46 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has joined #maemo | 10:46 | |
| *** dvaske has joined #maemo | 10:46 | |
| *** timoph is now known as timoph|away | 10:48 | |
| *** SmilyOrg has quit IRC | 10:49 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC | 10:52 | |
| *** andrei1089 has joined #maemo | 10:52 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo | 10:54 | |
| *** Corsac has quit IRC | 10:55 | |
| *** cpt_nemo has quit IRC | 10:55 | |
| *** jhp has quit IRC | 10:55 | |
| *** inz has quit IRC | 10:55 | |
| *** shpaq` has quit IRC | 10:55 | |
| *** jani has quit IRC | 10:56 | |
| *** inz has joined #maemo | 10:56 | |
| *** jhp has joined #maemo | 10:57 | |
| *** Corsac has joined #maemo | 10:57 | |
| *** bef0rd has quit IRC | 10:57 | |
| *** _berto_ has joined #maemo | 10:59 | |
| *** eMHa_ has joined #maemo | 11:01 | |
| *** arno0ob has joined #maemo | 11:05 | |
| *** dvaske has quit IRC | 11:05 | |
| *** ArtVandalae has joined #maemo | 11:05 | |
| *** joppu has quit IRC | 11:06 | |
| *** smhar has joined #maemo | 11:07 | |
| *** dvoid_ has joined #maemo | 11:07 | |
| *** joppu has joined #maemo | 11:08 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 11:09 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 11:09 | |
| *** bef0rd has joined #maemo | 11:09 | |
| *** bef0rd has quit IRC | 11:09 | |
| *** bef0rd has joined #maemo | 11:09 | |
| *** florian_kc has joined #maemo | 11:11 | |
| *** florian_kc has quit IRC | 11:11 | |
| *** florian_kc has joined #maemo | 11:11 | |
| *** florian_kc is now known as florian | 11:12 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has quit IRC | 11:12 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has joined #maemo | 11:12 | |
| *** jani has joined #maemo | 11:13 | |
| *** jani is now known as Guest88927 | 11:14 | |
| *** bigbrovar has joined #maemo | 11:15 | |
| *** dvaske has joined #maemo | 11:15 | |
| *** andre__ has joined #maemo | 11:16 | |
| *** andre__ has quit IRC | 11:16 | |
| *** andre__ has joined #maemo | 11:16 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 11:17 | |
| *** mavhc has quit IRC | 11:17 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 11:17 | |
| *** Free_maN has joined #maemo | 11:18 | |
| *** Free_maN has joined #maemo | 11:18 | |
| *** shpaq` has joined #maemo | 11:18 | |
| *** mavhc has joined #maemo | 11:19 | |
| *** jacktheripper has joined #maemo | 11:25 | |
| *** Finnish has joined #maemo | 11:26 | |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:28 |
| florian | good morning | 11:29 |
| Myrtti | Jaffa: unping, I remember pinging you but I can't remember why anymore | 11:32 |
| Myrtti | I also fail in channels. | 11:32 |
| Myrtti | more coffee! | 11:32 |
| *** lbt is now known as a | 11:32 | |
| *** a is now known as lbt | 11:32 | |
| Jaffa | Myrtti: I appreciated feeling wanted, if nothing else ;-) | 11:33 |
| *** Termana has quit IRC | 11:33 | |
| *** slackmagic has joined #maemo | 11:35 | |
| *** villev_ has joined #maemo | 11:35 | |
| * RST38h moos thoughtfully | 11:38 | |
| *** ArtVandalae has quit IRC | 11:38 | |
| *** polymar has quit IRC | 11:40 | |
| johnx | RST38h, what do you ponder? | 11:43 |
| RST38h | johnx: The End. | 11:44 |
| RST38h | =) | 11:44 |
| johnx | the seattle radio station? | 11:44 |
| RST38h | ahha | 11:44 |
| johnx | not much to ponder there, though | 11:44 |
| RST38h | johnx: Does it broadcast appropriate content, or is it only the name? =) | 11:45 |
| johnx | uhm, it's mostly alternative stuff | 11:45 |
| johnx | but it's 107.7 so it's 'the end' of the dial | 11:45 |
| johnx | back when radios had dials | 11:45 |
| johnx | so no, they don't generally talk about how the world will end in december 2012 (right?) | 11:46 |
| * RST38h tries to remember if FM radios ever had dials...actually yes, they did =) | 11:46 | |
| kerio | this is the end... | 11:46 |
| kerio | my only friend, the end... | 11:46 |
| *** polymar has joined #maemo | 11:46 | |
| RST38h | Why wait until until december 2012 | 11:46 |
| merlin1991 | yeah 2012 will end then | 11:46 |
| merlin1991 | no chance avoiding that | 11:46 |
| *** bef0rd has quit IRC | 11:46 | |
| johnx | RST38h, I need a couple more years to figure out how to get off this rock if everyone's hell bent on things coming to a screeching halt ... | 11:47 |
| *** ALoGeNo has quit IRC | 11:48 | |
| RST38h | johnx: Once you get off, what are you gonna do? Outside is dark and cold and empty and may well be just a glorified wall of a fish tank | 11:49 |
| johnx | haven't gotten to planning that part yet | 11:50 |
| RST38h | johnx: planning switch from it to sw development, btw? | 11:55 |
| johnx | I already did kinda | 11:56 |
| johnx | I'm about half and half | 11:56 |
| johnx | webdev stuff. a lot of people here probably wouldn't consider it 'real' development :P | 11:56 |
| RST38h | naaah, not hard enough :) | 11:57 |
| johnx | XSL. I rest my case | 11:57 |
| johnx | I agree. it doesn't *need* to be hard, but we find a way *rolls eyes* | 11:57 |
| merlin1991 | hrhr | 11:59 |
| *** raster has quit IRC | 11:59 | |
| *** jrocha has quit IRC | 11:59 | |
| merlin1991 | well you could put webservices into "webdev" too, and depending on what you want to achieve it can be pretty hard | 11:59 |
| johnx | it's basically an internal scheduling/resource/time-tracking/CRM/sales app | 12:00 |
| *** ALoGeNo has joined #maemo | 12:00 | |
| *** jrocha has joined #maemo | 12:00 | |
| RST38h | johnx: *avoid* XSL | 12:01 |
| RST38h | johnx: No, really. It is the most useless time waste I have ever done | 12:01 |
| johnx | no kidding | 12:01 |
| johnx | luckily only one of our 'sites' uses it | 12:01 |
| johnx | unluckily that site is customer facing | 12:01 |
| johnx | ... and needs to be updated/revised sometimes | 12:02 |
| RST38h | johnx: Replace with PERL script asap | 12:02 |
| johnx | not an option. anyways, it's not *that* bad | 12:02 |
| johnx | just a bit ... weird | 12:02 |
| RST38h | (and yes, I am fully aware of how not ideal this solution is, but still better than XSL) | 12:02 |
| johnx | the PHP templating system they insist on using is almost as weird as XSL really | 12:02 |
| RST38h | Really? Must have taken them time to approach such a pinnacle... | 12:03 |
| johnx | http://ets.sourceforge.net/ | 12:04 |
| johnx | actually, it's unmaintained for 6 years :) | 12:04 |
| RST38h | johnx: mhm, kinda xmlish, but not as bad as xsl :) | 12:05 |
| johnx | just one more *&#$ing dead-end syntax to memorize | 12:06 |
| johnx | I don't mind weird syntax, but PHP is a *#&$#ing templating language. That's it's whole reason for existing | 12:08 |
| *** BCMM has joined #maemo | 12:08 | |
| *** TheXception is now known as TheXception|off | 12:10 | |
| *** Jucato has quit IRC | 12:12 | |
| RST38h | johnx: Yes, but there is no fun in that! :) | 12:13 |
| RST38h | [also see: build systems] | 12:13 |
| johnx | it's very fun. I write some things and they show up on the screen. I was kinda thinking this web dev stuff was kinda fun except for this useless (#*$&ing template system | 12:14 |
| * johnx had to start learning it in-depth today | 12:14 | |
| johnx | totally not bitter. not even a bit | 12:14 |
| *** visz has quit IRC | 12:14 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has joined #maemo | 12:15 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Anyone here having trouble reaching gmail w/ microb? | 12:16 |
| timeless_pidgin | Data Transfer Interrupted | 12:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | The connection to mail.google.com has terminated unexpectedly. Some data may have been transferred. | 12:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | The browser connected successfully, but the connection was interrupted while transferring information. Please try again. | 12:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | * Are you unable to browse other sites? Check the computer's network connection. | 12:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | * Still having trouble? Consult your network administrator or Internet provider for assistance. | 12:17 |
| *** TheXception|off is now known as TheXception | 12:17 | |
| johnx | timeless, works for me | 12:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | K | 12:17 |
| RST38h | So, have you consulted your network administrator? | 12:17 |
| johnx | spam :| | 12:18 |
| RST38h | I mean, before pasting it here... | 12:18 |
| johnx | hint: he doesn't mean me :) | 12:18 |
| *** gomiam has joined #maemo | 12:18 | |
| *** RevdKathy has joined #maemo | 12:19 | |
| RST38h | Mohammad has booted Ubuntu mobile edition on his N900 | 12:19 |
| johnx | I need a similar disclaimer to what lawyers use "I am a net admin. I'm not *your* net admin, therefore this doesn't constitute a recommended workaround ... " | 12:19 |
| *** RevdKathy has quit IRC | 12:19 | |
| johnx | RST38h, cool. working GLES? | 12:19 |
| RST38h | Looks pretty nice too | 12:19 |
| RST38h | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=58083 | 12:19 |
| *** gomiam has quit IRC | 12:19 | |
| RST38h | Dunno, do not think GLES will be a problem. BME and phone will be though | 12:19 |
| johnx | RAM usage as well :) | 12:20 |
| johnx | that's the 'netbook' interface | 12:20 |
| johnx | so full gnome | 12:20 |
| Stskeeps | BME isn't so much a problem if you have a linux glibc | 12:20 |
| johnx | it's mostly ok with 512MB of RAM | 12:20 |
| johnx | looks very pretty in screenshots though | 12:20 |
| * johnx is soooo glad he didn't wait for ubuntu to do their own 'handheld' interface | 12:21 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has quit IRC | 12:22 | |
| RST38h | johnx: Ubuntu netbook stuff looks ok to me | 12:23 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: GLES stuff is just a few libs that can be dropped in, right? | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | fairly easily to adapt | 12:24 |
| johnx | RST38h, it's ok that it will want to take 512MB of RAM to boot to the desktop? | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | but he has to be on 2.6.35 | 12:24 |
| johnx | on a device with 256MB of RAM ... | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | both for gles and bme | 12:24 |
| RST38h | johnx: Well I am not going to use it so it is ok :) | 12:25 |
| *** seif_ has joined #maemo | 12:25 | |
| johnx | RST38h, yeah. this is basically where I was with XFCE4 on the N8x0 3 (dear god it really is 3) years ago | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: have you regained your sanity yet? | 12:25 |
| RST38h | heh | 12:26 |
| johnx | dunno. I'm working on yet another forked distro it seems | 12:26 |
| johnx | not a good sign | 12:26 |
| johnx | :P | 12:26 |
| RST38h | Sts: He is doing XSL so it is arhetorical question | 12:26 |
| johnx | I'd like to think I'm relatively sane compared to other people who can hack around in XSL | 12:26 |
| johnx | that'd be a good point on my resume ... | 12:27 |
| *** jukey has joined #maemo | 12:28 | |
| *** swc|666 has quit IRC | 12:30 | |
| *** Cy8aer has quit IRC | 12:35 | |
| *** Cy8aer has joined #maemo | 12:35 | |
| *** t_s_o has quit IRC | 12:37 | |
| smhar | how to take a snap shot of the N900 screen? | 12:38 |
| *** seif_ has quit IRC | 12:42 | |
| *** Thierry_ has joined #maemo | 12:42 | |
| marmoute | smhar: use two mirror and the internal camera | 12:42 |
| Appiah | haha | 12:42 |
| Appiah | ctrl+shift+p | 12:43 |
| *** jrocha has quit IRC | 12:43 | |
| smhar | Appiah, very difficult combinations, I have big figures :-) | 12:44 |
| Appiah | not that hard | 12:44 |
| Appiah | Use both hands :) | 12:44 |
| Appiah | place it down , dont hold it ^^ | 12:45 |
| smhar | Appiah, managed, thanks | 12:47 |
| Appiah | well its a keycombo you dont do by accident | 12:47 |
| *** jrocha has joined #maemo | 12:50 | |
| Khertan | ~seen lbt | 12:57 |
| *** eMHa_ has quit IRC | 12:57 | |
| infobot | lbt is currently on #maemo (17h 53m 50s) #meego (17h 53m 50s). Has said a total of 2 messages. Is idling for 1h 24m 51s, last said: 'hey Jaffa'. | 12:57 |
| lbt | hey Khertan | 12:57 |
| Khertan | :) | 12:58 |
| Khertan | hi lbt | 12:58 |
| Khertan | i ve a question about the obs | 12:58 |
| Khertan | is it possible to create new target ? | 12:59 |
| Khertan | the qt version available in the meego current is still an preview 4.7 release | 12:59 |
| Khertan | and contain bugs that prevent me compiling pyside | 12:59 |
| lbt | ah, a fresh import? | 12:59 |
| lbt | nag me in ~8hrs (after work) :) | 13:00 |
| lbt | xfade is on hols so .... | 13:01 |
| Khertan | ah, a fresh import? <<< i didn't know how to do an import | 13:01 |
| Khertan | and if i can do it :) | 13:01 |
| lbt | no, OS level | 13:01 |
| Khertan | ok i ll bother you later ;) | 13:01 |
| Khertan | s/bother/borring | 13:01 |
| * lbt does not want to be borringed ! | 13:02 | |
| DocScrutinizer | Method: Fractional Transfer STV with Droop-Static-Whole threshold -- pfft, if I had known that 3 months before elections, I probably had managed to know what exactly I'm voting (guess it takes 3 months to wrap your head around it) | 13:05 |
| Khertan | :) | 13:05 |
| *** visz has joined #maemo | 13:07 | |
| DocScrutinizer | honestly, I live in Bavaria - check for all the election systems we got here. I know about situations where you have to vote for the one you basically don't want to see in your government | 13:08 |
| *** ColdFyre has quit IRC | 13:09 | |
| DocScrutinizer | I hope next council elections will get more lead time to inform people, to check candidates, to sort out token shipping (what if somebody is is holiday for 2 weeks?) | 13:12 |
| ieatlint | how bad can bavaria be? where i live, we vote on average 2 to 3 times a year, and typically there are 10-20+ things on the ballot | 13:13 |
| ieatlint | in 2008, there were 4 elections | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | c'mon 443 ballots total - that's a shame and you have to think about the why and how to improve | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: on some elections we could make 60+ checkmarks on the ballot | 13:14 |
| ieatlint | yeah, how about having candidates put together a short bio to actually read... i think only one candidate even said a word on a blog that was aggregated by planet.maemo.org | 13:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's caled "panachieren & kumulieren" | 13:15 |
| *** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo | 13:15 | |
| ieatlint | oh, check marks are different :P | 13:15 |
| ieatlint | the last election here, had things like "city council" where you're given a list of 30 names and asked to check 12 of them | 13:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | when you give candidate #5 of party A 4 votes, as the first 4 candidates will make it anyway | 13:16 |
| *** SmilybOrg has quit IRC | 13:19 | |
| DocScrutinizer | so e.g. a vote for jaffa might be wasted if you think he'll make it anyway into council, and you have to think about using your votes more specific than let them be redsitributed from jaffa to the other candidates by"Fractional Transfer STV with Droop-Static-Whole threshold" | 13:20 |
| RST38h | too complicated | 13:21 |
| RST38h | But I would like to see the "Against all candidates" option on the ballot | 13:21 |
| *** Jucato has joined #maemo | 13:21 | |
| *** Jucato has quit IRC | 13:21 | |
| *** Jucato has joined #maemo | 13:21 | |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: then speak up for another system to evaluate ballots | 13:21 |
| *** ColdFyre has joined #maemo | 13:21 | |
| * SpeedEvil is reminded of http://xkcd.com/429/ | 13:22 | |
| *** TermanaDesire has quit IRC | 13:22 | |
| *** TermanaN900 has joined #maemo | 13:24 | |
| *** sobczyk has joined #maemo | 13:24 | |
| sobczyk | hi, anyone knows what's th n900 wifi chip is? | 13:25 |
| Stskeeps | wl1251 | 13:25 |
| *** fecub has joined #maemo | 13:26 | |
| *** vanadismobile has joined #maemo | 13:26 | |
| *** tobis87 has joined #maemo | 13:27 | |
| RST38h | "Atheists, agnostics most knowledgeable about religion, survey says" | 13:28 |
| *** gnuton has joined #maemo | 13:28 | |
| ieatlint | heh, and coincidentally, atheists and agnostics most likely to be intelligent/educated | 13:29 |
| |187| | damn i love this phone - just sittin at a lake and havin a beer :) | 13:30 |
| *** TheNewAndy has joined #maemo | 13:31 | |
| merlin1991 | err |187| sittin @ a lake and havin a beer, sure, but stare into your phone there? | 13:32 |
| |187| | jup gotta mail some shit | 13:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: johnx: life could be easy if only I had access to the sourcecode | 13:33 |
| |187| | display could be one size bigger | 13:33 |
| |187| | :) | 13:33 |
| merlin1991 | doc, the sourcecode, the sourceode of life? ;) | 13:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure | 13:33 |
| |187| | + the damn battery drain.. | 13:34 |
| *** benh has joined #maemo | 13:34 | |
| DocScrutinizer | ??? | 13:34 |
| |187| | was readin about some pr 1.3 .. is that confirmed somewhere? | 13:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~pr1.3 | 13:35 |
| infobot | rumour has it, pr1.3 is a ban'able subject now..... | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | Alas, no. | 13:35 |
| |187| | ok | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | there are bits of updated code popping up in various repos | 13:35 |
| |187| | nevermind ?) | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | but nothing like a schedule | 13:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | there NEVER is a schedule, you know? | 13:36 |
| *** vanadismobile has quit IRC | 13:36 | |
| DocScrutinizer | Nokia isn't doing schedules - they dams sure know why | 13:36 |
| *** eMHa_ has joined #maemo | 13:36 | |
| SpeedEvil | because they want to be able to drop it if they decide not to release. | 13:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | for example | 13:37 |
| |187| | always lave the doors open to all sides | 13:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | other reasons might include "it's more work to estimate how long a task takes than to do the task" | 13:38 |
| *** ptlo has quit IRC | 13:38 | |
| DocScrutinizer | announced events tend to get spoiled by competitors | 13:38 |
| *** bilboed-tp has joined #maemo | 13:39 | |
| DocScrutinizer | nothing is worse than a bitching customer waiting for a scheduled date and then find himself on a delay | 13:39 |
| *** bilboed-tp has left #maemo | 13:40 | |
| DocScrutinizer | and other rationales | 13:40 |
| *** benh has quit IRC | 13:40 | |
| DocScrutinizer | what's the use of a schedule anyway? | 13:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | tbh I fail to see a single benefit | 13:42 |
| *** rmrfchik has quit IRC | 13:42 | |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: (want to be able) do you think if they published a schedule they would decide differently? They just get more flames when nevertheless dropping | 13:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | au contraire Nokia kicking off and participating in something like that tmo PR1.2 thread might actually cause delays in and maybe even drop of development | 13:47 |
| *** drizztbsd has joined #maemo | 13:47 | |
| *** lizardo has joined #maemo | 13:48 | |
| DocScrutinizer | the nice bonmot "don't ask! each time it gets asked about, they postpone it for another week" isn't complete nonsense ;-) | 13:49 |
| *** lindi- has quit IRC | 13:49 | |
| *** lindi- has joined #maemo | 13:49 | |
| tobis87 | Hi, I know it will take some time until source code will become availible of the injection driver. I don't have the binaries, but would there be a way to patch them to work with the default kernel? | 13:50 |
| tobis87 | Would changing vermagic be enough to load them or is there some integrity check in kernel modules? | 13:51 |
| jaska | hmm, something up wit repository.maemo.org extras repo, ham is whining about subprocess gzip returned an error code | 13:52 |
| tobis87 | And could they be used as drop-in replacement or do they have to be inserted manuelly? | 13:53 |
| *** ptlo has joined #maemo | 13:53 | |
| ShadowJK | jaska, I'm getting gzip error codes for sdk tools repo | 13:53 |
| jaska | gzip errors on extras repos for me :| | 13:53 |
| jaska | (on phone) | 13:54 |
| *** FIQ|n900 has quit IRC | 13:54 | |
| jaska | ;file Packages.gz | 13:55 |
| jaska | Packages.gz: HTML document text | 13:55 |
| jaska | hmm. | 13:55 |
| jaska | http://sprunge.us/DGXK | 13:56 |
| jaska | gives me that | 13:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | tobis87: if changing vermagic is enough, then you also could use modprobe --force | 13:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | instead | 13:57 |
| jaska | same with Packages.. but Packages.bz2 gives the "real" file | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | if they were insane enough to change the ABI in a non compatible way, then too bad | 13:58 |
| *** zs has joined #maemo | 13:58 | |
| *** Guest88927 is now known as jani | 13:59 | |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, mxr brken, repos broken. I wonder what's going on behind the scenes there | 13:59 |
| * jaska shakes fist :| | 13:59 | |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe a gift for new council, to make them feel welcome | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-P | 14:00 |
| *** gaveen has quit IRC | 14:00 | |
| *** villev has quit IRC | 14:01 | |
| *** villev_ has quit IRC | 14:01 | |
| tobis87 | DocScrutinizer: Does the modprobe on the n900 support it? Would you not have to load them manuell everytime? Yes, if the ABI is different I'm out of luck, but I don't have them yet I just ask in advance. | 14:01 |
| jaska | wouldnt have noticed but someone actually sent me an mms and the fmms i had was old and didnt work :) | 14:01 |
| *** villev has joined #maemo | 14:02 | |
| *** villev_ has joined #maemo | 14:02 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | sorry I can't answer in advance. But I asked exactly same thing to guys who own the binary | 14:02 |
| *** rmrfchik has joined #maemo | 14:05 | |
| *** zap has joined #maemo | 14:05 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 14:08 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 14:09 | |
| tobis87 | DocScrutinizer51: Ok, I will wait for the source then. But I would already be lucky to have what crashhandie suggested, the driver as source with the injection stuff as inline asm. Just out of curious if I overwrite the vermagic string 2.6.28.10power40-wl1 with 2.6.28-omap1, should I override the rest with 00's or delete the remaining characters? | 14:11 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | no idea | 14:12 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | usually overwriting end of string storage area with 0x00 is 'the right thing' | 14:13 |
| *** gaveen has joined #maemo | 14:14 | |
| *** FIQ|n900 has joined #maemo | 14:18 | |
| *** LjL has joined #maemo | 14:20 | |
| *** MNZ has joined #maemo | 14:20 | |
| DocScrutinizer | depends on the used string type. For C it's 0x00 terminated. But there are other implementations with length pointer word at head of string | 14:21 |
| satmd | there's languages that don't even have that | 14:21 |
| tobis87 | DocScrutinizer51: Ok, I will try to fiddle a bit with vermagic. I still remember that I had overwritten sv_cheats in Sof2.exe with 0x00's years ago. :) | 14:21 |
| * satmd remembers some sun with SAP's R3 language | 14:21 | |
| satmd | -sun+fun | 14:22 |
| satmd | fixed length strings that can overrun the buffer, overflowing into the next variable | 14:22 |
| jaska | repos do work if you pull the debs by hand so no biggie | 14:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | *cough* | 14:22 |
| satmd | (the story was about a string being to short 1 char, containing "wednesdaY"... the Y became the answer for the next Y/N question, f'cking up the accounting system if the 15th of a month was a wednesday) | 14:23 |
| *** FLspctrm has joined #maemo | 14:26 | |
| *** mirr0r has quit IRC | 14:26 | |
| *** mirr0r has joined #maemo | 14:26 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 14:28 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has joined #maemo | 14:28 | |
| *** sivang has joined #maemo | 14:31 | |
| sivang | so far for auto-upgrading kernels, 9.04 update-manager took me to a non-pae kernel after I specifically install one a couple of upgrades before | 14:32 |
| sivang | anyway, at least I can go back to tinkering with USB networking | 14:32 |
| sivang | g'afternoon | 14:32 |
| sivang | all | 14:32 |
| *** pablo2 has joined #maemo | 14:36 | |
| *** ag0ny has quit IRC | 14:36 | |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 14:37 |
| *** ag0ny has joined #maemo | 14:37 | |
| DocScrutinizer | satmd: really nice one | 14:37 |
| *** Ryback_ has joined #maemo | 14:38 | |
| *** Ryback_ has joined #maemo | 14:38 | |
| *** OptX has joined #maemo | 14:39 | |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: what did I miss? :) | 14:39 |
| *** gaveen has quit IRC | 14:39 | |
| DocScrutinizer | sivang: the link in topic to chanlogs? :-P | 14:39 |
| *** dvaske has quit IRC | 14:40 | |
| *** FLspctrm has quit IRC | 14:40 | |
| *** SWFu has joined #maemo | 14:40 | |
| DocScrutinizer | or this month's 15th? | 14:42 |
| *** vkvraju has joined #maemo | 14:43 | |
| vkvraju | hi | 14:43 |
| *** sivang has quit IRC | 14:45 | |
| Arkenoi | even blackberry playbook has flash 10. it is amazing how nokia managed to suck so ultimately. | 14:45 |
| Appiah | is it troll time? | 14:47 |
| *** spinningcompass has joined #maemo | 14:47 | |
| vkvraju | does blackberry playbook has terminal with root access? | 14:49 |
| vkvraju | does it dual-boot? | 14:49 |
| kerio | dual? | 14:51 |
| vkvraju | regarding flash, I am optimistic about it in the next firmware (PR 1.3) update. Even if not, I won't be that disappointed | 14:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmmpf | 14:51 |
| kerio | we have 4 working-ish OSes that can boot on the n900 | 14:51 |
| kerio | ~pr1.3 | 14:51 |
| vkvraju | yeah, I should have said multi-boot actually. my mistake | 14:51 |
| infobot | it has been said that pr1.3 is a ban'able subject now..... | 14:51 |
| vkvraju | btw, how abt the USB Host Mode thing. Did anyone try it out here? | 14:52 |
| *** OptX has quit IRC | 14:52 | |
| SpeedEvil | It works for some people. | 14:52 |
| SpeedEvil | With some devices. | 14:52 |
| SpeedEvil | It is a fundamentally unreliable method. | 14:52 |
| vkvraju | oh, so there is some progress on this front then. Thats amazig | 14:53 |
| *** mirr0r has quit IRC | 14:53 | |
| *** mirr0r has joined #maemo | 14:53 | |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 14:53 | |
| *** lindi- has joined #maemo | 14:54 | |
| *** zs has quit IRC | 14:55 | |
| *** zutesmog has quit IRC | 14:55 | |
| *** OptX has joined #maemo | 14:56 | |
| *** dvaske has joined #maemo | 14:59 | |
| *** trupheenix has quit IRC | 15:00 | |
| DocScrutinizer | there's ""always been progress"" :-P admittedly at a non measurable rate sometimes - like on geotectonics | 15:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | but the recent "progress" is just replay of the "great progress" that triggered "USB host mode (coming soon)" tmo thread, though on a wider 'user'-basis - which is exactly what leads directly to same headache we had when primary hostmode tmo thread was closed | 15:04 |
| merlin1991 | tmo is evil | 15:04 |
| *** Rarok has joined #maemo | 15:05 | |
| vkvraju | I wish to see a fully implemented host mode solution for the N900. I miss that feature from N800 | 15:07 |
| Duckboot | Har dere mista cookien? | 15:07 |
| vkvraju | copying stuff from pendrives on the go is really useful | 15:07 |
| Duckboot | Sorry #fail | 15:07 |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC | 15:07 | |
| *** Free_maN has quit IRC | 15:07 | |
| *** dvaske has quit IRC | 15:08 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo | 15:09 | |
| *** setanta has joined #maemo | 15:12 | |
| *** wazd has joined #maemo | 15:12 | |
| *** AdmiralSausage has quit IRC | 15:13 | |
| *** plq has joined #maemo | 15:13 | |
| *** zutesmog has joined #maemo | 15:14 | |
| *** nuovodna has joined #maemo | 15:16 | |
| nuovodna | hi, anyone buyed from this site http://nokia-n900.com/ ?? Is it safe? | 15:16 |
| Stskeeps | don't know, but i wouldn't buy stuff from a blog.. | 15:18 |
| joga | my rule of thumb concerning buying is that either they're well established or I know where they live | 15:20 |
| joga | :) | 15:20 |
| SpeedEvil | Are they actually selling? | 15:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | the current hype caused some real progress though: I finally accepted nobody but me seems to look into that magic spell that's echoing random commands to usb sysfs debug nodes while randomly wiggling with VBUS and bme. So, as I got logs of a successful session now, I had a look into it, learned it's absolutely not what we planned to do, learned it's actually proving feasibility of the fake-HNP fallback alternative, though it's done on mere | 15:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | cargo cult programming here, and finally took a new effort to implement proper hostmode poc via sane cmds to same sysfs nodes, which seems to succeed or at least showed quite encouraging results so far | 15:20 |
| SpeedEvil | you missed out 'know where they live, and can take them in a fight' | 15:20 |
| SpeedEvil | Woo! | 15:20 |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 15:20 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 15:21 | |
| *** TomaszD_ has joined #maemo | 15:21 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has quit IRC | 15:21 | |
| *** TomaszD has quit IRC | 15:22 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 15:22 | |
| *** sivang has joined #maemo | 15:22 | |
| sivang | hmm, so ubuntu keeps crashing :/ | 15:22 |
| *** jacktheripper has quit IRC | 15:22 | |
| DocScrutinizer | my big failure was to assume with that initial success back in may(? my part in the whole opeation would've been mostly done and others would take over now | 15:23 |
| *** woodong50_______ has quit IRC | 15:23 | |
| *** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo | 15:23 | |
| DocScrutinizer | this never happened though | 15:23 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: you mean, the maemo project? | 15:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | I mean hostmode h-e-n | 15:25 |
| sivang | ah,, that one. | 15:26 |
| *** TheNewAndy has quit IRC | 15:26 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has joined #maemo | 15:26 | |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 15:26 | |
| *** TermanaN900 has quit IRC | 15:27 | |
| *** norayr has quit IRC | 15:28 | |
| *** josemartins_ has quit IRC | 15:28 | |
| *** smhar has quit IRC | 15:28 | |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 15:28 | |
| *** SmilyOrg has quit IRC | 15:30 | |
| DocScrutinizer | my current guess is we're some 2..4 week from a really stable hostmode (basic function to kick N900 into host role) and then it's all a simple port-the-drivers after that, like on every other linux system | 15:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | but don't quote me on that | 15:31 |
| * SpeedEvil slashdots DocScrutinizer. | 15:31 | |
| DocScrutinizer | :-D | 15:31 |
| *** Free_maN has joined #maemo | 15:31 | |
| *** Free_maN has joined #maemo | 15:31 | |
| SpeedEvil | I hate the fact I've had no time to do stuff this year. | 15:31 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/5027602679/#/photos/14560445@N08/5027602679/lightbox/ | 15:32 |
| SpeedEvil | related pic is related. | 15:32 |
| kerio | woah wtf is that | 15:34 |
| marmoute | SpeedEvil: ho a bridge in a garden. Nice but useless | 15:34 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah - well - it wasn't my idea. | 15:34 |
| *** woodong50_______ has quit IRC | 15:34 | |
| SpeedEvil | kerio: I'm tidying up all the stuff below the tarp. | 15:35 |
| SpeedEvil | It got thrown in there. | 15:35 |
| *** lolloo has joined #maemo | 15:35 | |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: wow | 15:35 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: but that much less than what my dad has in his yard... | 15:35 |
| SpeedEvil | That is one tiny part. | 15:36 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: the grass is so green in the UK.. | 15:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Scotland. | 15:36 |
| SpeedEvil | We do rain well. | 15:36 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: ah, even better, | 15:36 |
| mece | SpeedEvil, is that your yard? | 15:37 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: you at least has grass, the ground in my father's yard is full of scrap metal and old jeep parts. | 15:37 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 15:37 |
| sivang | I would be in to come and help tidying , Edinburgh? | 15:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Naah - I'm actually mostly finished on the outside. | 15:37 |
| mece | SpeedEvil, wow the place looks amazing! | 15:38 |
| *** gnuton has quit IRC | 15:38 | |
| mece | SpeedEvil, well, except for the mess, but other than that. | 15:38 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: indeed. people don't appreciate the rain enough :) | 15:38 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: the grass looks tasty | 15:38 |
| *** marciom has joined #maemo | 15:38 | |
| SpeedEvil | Mum passed on last year, and I've been trying to get the garden into a sane state. It had been largely neglected other than major projects in the past few years. | 15:38 |
| SpeedEvil | All of the flowers I haven't touched. | 15:38 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't know what most are. | 15:38 |
| SpeedEvil | That's for next year. | 15:39 |
| sivang | SpeedEvil: oh, sorry to hear. | 15:39 |
| sivang | wow, http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/5028190910/lightbox/ | 15:39 |
| visz | hair cows | 15:39 |
| SpeedEvil | They are picturesque. Highland Cattle. | 15:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Not mine. | 15:40 |
| *** plq has quit IRC | 15:40 | |
| * sivang loves Scotland | 15:40 | |
| sivang | the airport is so cute and small | 15:40 |
| visz | http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs183.snc1/6088_1156482441944_1524226484_384066_4921771_n.jpg <- me feeding a hair cow | 15:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I hadn't really looked at that closely. | 15:40 |
| visz | in scotland | 15:41 |
| SpeedEvil | The lighting on the bull works quite well. | 15:41 |
| sivang | their hair cut is reminding me Rod Stewart | 15:41 |
| SpeedEvil | I suspect it's probably a steer not a bull, I diddn't closely inspect. | 15:42 |
| *** jacktheripper has joined #maemo | 15:44 | |
| *** delt has joined #maemo | 15:44 | |
| delt | Hello again | 15:44 |
| delt | hey, was wondering, on the n810 | 15:45 |
| delt | would it be possible to use the 2GB flash as root (ext2/3fs) and completely forget about the 256 "internal" partition? | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | yes, search for clone to sd | 15:46 |
| delt | problem i'm having is that the internal 2gb doesn't get mounted until the graphic interface shows up | 15:47 |
| delt | if it's a fixed, internal storage device, wtf? | 15:47 |
| delt | unless they just copied the same config files from the older one (n800?) and didnt bother to change the fstab & whatever | 15:48 |
| ShadowJK | Stskeeps, is gypsy-daemon closed or open? | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | open, afaik | 15:49 |
| * ShadowJK is trying to debug external gps | 15:49 | |
| delt | ...which would be possible, seeing that the internal 2gb is "mmc1" and the sd slot is "mmc2" | 15:49 |
| delt | s/possible/probable/ | 15:49 |
| infobot | delt meant: ...which would be probable, seeing that the internal 2gb is "mmc1" and the sd slot is "mmc2" | 15:49 |
| delt | oh yeah, the smart sed-bot =-) | 15:49 |
| delt | always corrects what we... sed :D | 15:50 |
| *** jonne|reconnecte has quit IRC | 15:50 | |
| MNZ | well sed delt! | 15:50 |
| delt | hehe | 15:52 |
| delt | yeah, was thinking about 08:46 < delt> [...] use the 2GB flash as root (ext2/3fs) and completely forget about the 256 "internal" partition | 15:52 |
| *** smhar has joined #maemo | 15:52 | |
| *** jonne has joined #maemo | 15:52 | |
| delt | mainly so that if some shit like this happens again, i can at least mount it and correct the problem without flashing the OS to the n810 again | 15:53 |
| delt | and erasing everything | 15:53 |
| delt | (mount it from the PC i mean) - i just learned yesterday that enabling "rd mode" makes the 2gb partition show up as a storage device through USB | 15:56 |
| * sivang notes clearly N900 is not built for filesystem intensive operations. | 15:57 | |
| *** kthomas has joined #maemo | 15:58 | |
| delt | sivang nice name... are you from Cambodia? | 16:00 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 16:00 | |
| delt | next guess, burma (birman) or laos | 16:00 |
| sivang | delt: actually no, Israel. Why nice? Some Indian people told me there's something close to that name there, and in japan they have "Shiban-san" | 16:01 |
| sivang | delt: the name of 5th month in the hebrew calander | 16:01 |
| delt | oh. nisan is which month? | 16:02 |
| delt | (i dont remember them) | 16:02 |
| *** villev_ has quit IRC | 16:02 | |
| *** villev has quit IRC | 16:02 | |
| *** chenca has joined #maemo | 16:02 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 16:03 | |
| *** kthomas has quit IRC | 16:03 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 16:03 | |
| delt | sivang resembles the name of a girl i knew in college, and in laos, family names that begin or end with "vong" (or sometimes vang but not often) are quite common | 16:03 |
| *** mgedmin has quit IRC | 16:03 | |
| *** mgedmin has joined #maemo | 16:03 | |
| delt | so, was just curious | 16:04 |
| sivang | delt: ah, well the 'g | 16:04 |
| sivang | delt: is actually for my surname | 16:04 |
| sivang | : | 16:04 |
| sivang | :) | 16:04 |
| *** Termana has joined #maemo | 16:04 | |
| *** sergio__ has quit IRC | 16:04 | |
| *** mece has quit IRC | 16:05 | |
| delt | ah i see. thats why google found like 2 matches for +"jewish calendar" +sivang +nisan | 16:06 |
| delt | s/sivang/sivan, and ---> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar | 16:07 |
| delt | / | 16:07 |
| delt | (so that the bot doesnt repeat after me, and a \ would have just looked retarded there) | 16:08 |
| sivang | delt: exaclty | 16:09 |
| delt | so sivan (or siwan) is the 3rd month in the ancient hebrew calendar | 16:10 |
| sivang | 3rd? | 16:10 |
| * ShadowJK wonders if search on mxr.maemo.org is broken | 16:10 | |
| sivang | okay, I don't recall correclty :) | 16:10 |
| sivang | how do I disable damn tracker? | 16:11 |
| sivang | it kills my rsync process | 16:11 |
| sivang | well, not kills, but makes it never eding | 16:11 |
| merlin1991 | killall -9 trackerd :D | 16:11 |
| sivang | merlin1991: it gets back on | 16:12 |
| sivang | thorogh the DSME? | 16:12 |
| delt | .... /etc/inittab? | 16:12 |
| *** cpt_nemo has joined #maemo | 16:12 | |
| delt | cpt_maemo | 16:12 |
| delt | went away..... 5 4 3 2 1 | 16:13 |
| MohammadAG51 | stop trackerd? | 16:13 |
| *** gnuton has joined #maemo | 16:13 | |
| delt | ok, gonna be back later today, i have some (non-nokia-tablet-related) stuff to prepare | 16:14 |
| *** smhar has quit IRC | 16:17 | |
| *** dailylinux has joined #maemo | 16:18 | |
| *** crashanddie has joined #maemo | 16:18 | |
| crashanddie | hey guys, what's the name of that app that calculates the worth of some source code again? | 16:19 |
| flux | sloccount | 16:20 |
| crashanddie | thanks | 16:20 |
| jacktheripper | I have a dependency for a library I'm packaging that's only in maemo rootfs. It's flagged as 'missing dependency' on the package page. Do I just remove it from the deps list ? | 16:20 |
| MohammadAG51 | i wonder if bme would make it say worthless | 16:21 |
| *** tekojo has quit IRC | 16:22 | |
| delt | anyway, gonna be idle for a while, at least until this afternoon (gotta prepare some stuff) | 16:25 |
| *** delt is now known as delt_zZzZ | 16:25 | |
| *** madduck has quit IRC | 16:26 | |
| *** madduck has joined #maemo | 16:27 | |
| *** merlin1991 has quit IRC | 16:28 | |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 16:29 | |
| tobis87 | If I want to change the vermagic in a module the proper way, how can I make objcopy to insert the section .modinfo, where it was located before? This is my command this far: "objcopy --remove-section=.modinfo --add-section .modinfo=TMP --set-section-flags .modinfo=contents,alloc,load,readonly,data MODULE.ko" But the new .modinfo section is always added to the end. | 16:34 |
| *** yacc has joined #maemo | 16:35 | |
| luke-jr__ | tobis87: … | 16:35 |
| yacc | Wondering, what is meant with up to 1GB of application memory? | 16:35 |
| luke-jr__ | that's self-contradicting | 16:35 |
| luke-jr__ | yacc: 256 MB RAM plus 768 MB swap | 16:36 |
| yacc | 1GB address space with 256MB RAM and 768MB that get swapped to flash? | 16:36 |
| Stskeeps | yacc: yeah | 16:36 |
| tobis87 | luke-jr__: ? | 16:36 |
| yacc | cheapskates ;) | 16:36 |
| luke-jr__ | tobis87: changing vermagic is inherently *not* proper | 16:36 |
| luke-jr__ | it's asking for trouble, and basically won't work | 16:37 |
| Stskeeps | yacc: advertisement and 512mb DDR blocks in ARM wasn't commonplace back then.. | 16:37 |
| korhojoa | i wish it'd had 1gb of real ram | 16:37 |
| korhojoa | that would have made it a beast | 16:37 |
| luke-jr__ | Stskeeps: yes it was <.< | 16:37 |
| tobis87 | luke-jr__: Yes, I know... Only way I think of to make the binary injection drivers to load on boot, without force... | 16:37 |
| luke-jr__ | just not back when Nokia started designing it | 16:37 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr__: i've only seen it on marvell | 16:38 |
| ShadowJK | forum.nokia still claims N900 has 768Mbyte NAND | 16:38 |
| luke-jr__ | Stskeeps: Nexus One, which came out like 3 months later, had a full 1 GB RAM | 16:38 |
| Termana | korhojoa, That's interesting, what is it you can't do with your N900 right now that having 1GB of RAM (no swap) would fix? | 16:38 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, lies | 16:38 |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: anything? | 16:38 |
| korhojoa | Termana, well, openoffice would definitely run better | 16:38 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, The Nexus One has 512mb of RAM, the Desire has 576mb. | 16:39 |
| korhojoa | also wireshark | 16:39 |
| *** avs has quit IRC | 16:39 | |
| luke-jr__ | o | 16:39 |
| ShadowJK | Mine runs much better after killing all python-based widgets, and qt. :) | 16:39 |
| korhojoa | wireshark is a pain in the ass to get to run well | 16:39 |
| *** Cy8aer has quit IRC | 16:39 | |
| * luke-jr__ notes Maemo5 requires swap from the start :/ | 16:39 | |
| tobis87 | luke-jr__: Do you know how I set where the new .section will get inserted? | 16:39 |
| *** timoph|away is now known as timoph | 16:39 | |
| luke-jr__ | tobis87: rtfm | 16:40 |
| *** diegohcg has joined #maemo | 16:40 | |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, mine works without | 16:40 |
| luke-jr__ | ShadowJK: I don't believe you. | 16:40 |
| luke-jr__ | swapoff -a # and tell me it doesn't crash | 16:40 |
| Termana | ShadowJK, are you a crazy mf? Booting Maemo 5 with no swap!? | 16:40 |
| Termana | :P | 16:40 |
| ShadowJK | it doesn't, I've done it a few times (swapoff) | 16:40 |
| luke-jr__ | … | 16:40 |
| korhojoa | swapoff is fun | 16:40 |
| korhojoa | until you run out of ram | 16:40 |
| korhojoa | then it's all OH LOL REBOOT | 16:41 |
| *** MadViking has joined #maemo | 16:41 | |
| ShadowJK | after booting with swap enabled, I can even open x-terminal and do cat /proc/swaps and see 0 use :) | 16:41 |
| *** KMFDM has joined #maemo | 16:41 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr__: it doesn't crash :-P | 16:41 |
| luke-jr__ | DocScrutinizer51: does for me ☹ | 16:41 |
| ShadowJK | it only takes a few minutes though before IO activity starts pushing things to swap | 16:41 |
| luke-jr__ | and what's REALLY annoying is that swapon my MicroSD also crashes eventually | 16:42 |
| *** Free_maN_ has joined #maemo | 16:42 | |
| ShadowJK | How does it crash? | 16:42 |
| korhojoa | why stick swap on a microsd? | 16:42 |
| *** olgagirl has joined #maemo | 16:42 | |
| Termana | korhojoa, to stop wear on the internal emmc | 16:42 |
| ShadowJK | It offloads the emmc | 16:42 |
| *** FIQ|n900 has quit IRC | 16:42 | |
| korhojoa | well. i guess, yeah. | 16:42 |
| luke-jr__ | ShadowJK: in that case, a kernel panic | 16:42 |
| *** baraujo has joined #maemo | 16:42 | |
| luke-jr__ | korhojoa: it's faster | 16:43 |
| korhojoa | ah. okay | 16:43 |
| ShadowJK | basically mmc/sd hates multitasking loads, and hates non-sequential access | 16:43 |
| *** Free_maN has quit IRC | 16:43 | |
| ShadowJK | putting swap on microsd makes emmc access patterns slightly less random | 16:43 |
| korhojoa | so what's the difference moving to the microsd? | 16:43 |
| korhojoa | ahh. | 16:43 |
| luke-jr__ | MicroSD is faster, and can be replaced if wears away | 16:43 |
| korhojoa | a class 8 card should be fast | 16:44 |
| *** olgagirl has quit IRC | 16:44 | |
| korhojoa | how fast is the controller? | 16:44 |
| korhojoa | i mean, does the performance increase after a class 6 card? | 16:44 |
| ShadowJK | well in the case of swap, it's really slow vs slower vs slowest :) | 16:44 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr__: uSD is WHAT? faster?? | 16:44 |
| luke-jr__ | DocScrutinizer51: according to dd | 16:44 |
| korhojoa | µsd? | 16:44 |
| korhojoa | not uSD | 16:44 |
| korhojoa | :P | 16:44 |
| luke-jr__ | obviously depends on the microSD card too | 16:45 |
| *** MohammadAG has joined #maemo | 16:45 | |
| *** zutesmog has quit IRC | 16:45 | |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, btw, if the microsd card is internally dual channel or similar, dd can show higher throughput but random access can be twice as slow relative to dd speed compared to a singlechannel device :)) | 16:45 |
| *** shpaq` has quit IRC | 16:45 | |
| *** dRbiG has quit IRC | 16:46 | |
| luke-jr__ | ShadowJK: my kernel is patched to always do swap writes sequentially | 16:46 |
| *** `0660_ has joined #maemo | 16:47 | |
| luke-jr__ | (no, not really) | 16:47 |
| * SpeedEvil stabs luke-jr with a mashed potato. | 16:47 | |
| luke-jr__ | lol | 16:48 |
| ShadowJK | it does that until it runs off the end of the swap device, at which point you have a randomly filled device and it does something like start at largest free chunk and fill it | 16:48 |
| ShadowJK | so it gets exponentially slower with time :) | 16:48 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I've wondered about an icky hack. | 16:48 |
| luke-jr__ | ShadowJK: assuming you keep it full | 16:48 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: involving multiple swap devices. | 16:48 |
| *** shpaq` has joined #maemo | 16:48 | |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: and swapoff when one is full, but fragmented. | 16:49 |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, no I am not assuming that | 16:49 |
| luke-jr__ | shpaq`: you use Gentoo on N900? :P | 16:49 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: Though I'm unsure if you can rate-limit the swapoff | 16:49 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, I do that already | 16:49 |
| ShadowJK | yeah it's a bit choppy when swapoff runs | 16:49 |
| luke-jr__ | you can't rate-limit *any* I/O on Maemo5 | 16:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil: isn't that 'commonly accepted concept' since months | 16:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ? | 16:49 |
| SpeedEvil | dunno. I've been suggesting it for ages. | 16:50 |
| luke-jr__ | meh | 16:50 |
| luke-jr__ | screw you all, I'm just going to get one of them RAM chips in a MicroSD form factor | 16:50 |
| ShadowJK | "full" being amount of writes in bytes since swapon exceeding swap device size, not when swap used is 768M or whatever | 16:50 |
| luke-jr__ | <.< | 16:50 |
| luke-jr__ | ShadowJK: if it isn't full, then all those earlier writes are now empty | 16:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ShadowJK: is there a ready method to get that writecount? | 16:51 |
| luke-jr__ | /available | 16:51 |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, no it's pretty random. Only stuff that's been freed will be free, and there will be stuff still in use, in swap, spread all across the swap device | 16:52 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, I use iostat | 16:52 |
| ShadowJK | iostat -m | 16:52 |
| *** ghostcube has joined #maemo | 16:52 | |
| ghostcube | hmmm, anyone using vlc remote? | 16:53 |
| jacktheripper | There's a dep for my library that's only in rootfs not in the repos. It's flagged as missing on the package page. Do I just remove it as a dep ? | 16:53 |
| *** jpe has quit IRC | 16:53 | |
| jacktheripper | what's the right thing to do ? | 16:53 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, Just because someone comes in and is a Gentoo user doesn't mean they are using Gentoo on their N900! :P | 16:53 |
| *** dRbiG has joined #maemo | 16:53 | |
| luke-jr__ | Termana: why not? ☹ | 16:53 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | iostat seems no standard pkg | 16:53 |
| ghostcube | vlc remote not working here -.- | 16:54 |
| luke-jr__ | … | 16:54 |
| Termana | luke-jr__, because not everyone has the time to be compiling for an embedded device as well as their desktop | 16:54 |
| ShadowJK | it's in sysstat | 16:54 |
| ghostcube | all apps for remote i try dont work | 16:54 |
| * luke-jr__ is tempted to tell DocScrutinizer51 to emerge iostat | 16:54 | |
| luke-jr__ | <.< | 16:54 |
| ShadowJK | just parses /proc/diskstat iirc | 16:54 |
| *** vasily_pupkin has joined #maemo | 16:54 | |
| *** carloscesa has joined #maemo | 16:54 | |
| vasily_pupkin | hi | 16:54 |
| vasily_pupkin | I have strange problems with maemo-mapper | 16:55 |
| vasily_pupkin | Looks like it show map with some offset | 16:55 |
| *** habmala has joined #maemo | 16:55 | |
| *** fecub has quit IRC | 16:55 | |
| vasily_pupkin | Does anybody have same problems? | 16:56 |
| ghostcube | what overlay driver is needed for smplayer | 16:56 |
| ghostcube | i cant get any picture -.- | 16:56 |
| ghostcube | woah all apps iam testing dont work lol | 16:56 |
| rmrfchik | ghostcube: stop it | 16:56 |
| rmrfchik | ghostcube: go test some windows apps. | 16:57 |
| ghostcube | :D | 16:57 |
| ghostcube | nice hint but not very helpful | 16:57 |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 16:58 | |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 16:58 | |
| shpaq | luke-jr__: nope, i'm not using n900 | 16:58 |
| SpeedEvil | vasily_pupkin: where. | 16:58 |
| *** fecub has joined #maemo | 16:58 | |
| SpeedEvil | vasily_pupkin: how much offset | 16:58 |
| shpaq | i have an old n770 ;) | 16:59 |
| vasily_pupkin | SpeedEvil: n810 2.6.2 version | 16:59 |
| *** dos1 has joined #maemo | 17:00 | |
| *** dos1 has quit IRC | 17:00 | |
| *** dos1 has joined #maemo | 17:00 | |
| ghostcube | so anyone a tip for smplayer? kmplayer works fine so far | 17:00 |
| *** MohammadAG has quit IRC | 17:01 | |
| kerio | is java working on the n900 as of now? | 17:01 |
| kerio | i want to play minecraft | 17:01 |
| ShadowJK | Depends if you want to run a j2se, j2ee, j2me or java web applet | 17:02 |
| *** sandst1 is now known as sandst1|away | 17:02 | |
| kerio | j2se | 17:02 |
| vasily_pupkin | SpeedEvil: http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/3446/gps.png | 17:03 |
| * ShadowJK would doubt applets work with anything | 17:03 | |
| vasily_pupkin | SpeedEvil: red - real track, yellow - map. same for all maps providers | 17:03 |
| SpeedEvil | have you got anywhere that has multiple tracks? | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Accuracy may be relevant | 17:04 |
| *** ToJa92 has joined #maemo | 17:04 | |
| SpeedEvil | In some cases OSM accuracy is poor, and in other places, people have traced from incorrect sources. | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Can you for example compare with ariel photos | 17:04 |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 17:05 | |
| vasily_pupkin | SpeedEvil: this is google maps, and on mapper application all ok | 17:05 |
| *** mfabiop has joined #maemo | 17:05 | |
| SpeedEvil | It looks like it is not a consistent amount off. | 17:06 |
| vasily_pupkin | thats why i thinks the problem is in the maemo-mapper algo of counting x/y/z (?) | 17:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Doubtful. | 17:06 |
| vasily_pupkin | consistent amount off? | 17:07 |
| RST38h | mappero (maemo mapper) sources are open | 17:07 |
| RST38h | so it should be easy to check | 17:07 |
| SpeedEvil | vasily_pupkin: The error is not constant - the red track does not simply align to any feature | 17:07 |
| vasily_pupkin | yeah, but i am not at homw just now :] | 17:07 |
| *** Jasonb10 has joined #maemo | 17:08 | |
| Jasonb10 | are there any mods or alternates to maemo5s hildon desktop which allow some kind of start menu? | 17:10 |
| *** jukey has quit IRC | 17:10 | |
| *** Xisdibik has joined #maemo | 17:10 | |
| *** vn238 has joined #maemo | 17:10 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has quit IRC | 17:12 | |
| vasily_pupkin | by the way | 17:13 |
| vasily_pupkin | is there any mappero ports to n810/diablo? | 17:13 |
| *** Xisdibik has quit IRC | 17:13 | |
| *** choppa has joined #maemo | 17:14 | |
| *** wazd has quit IRC | 17:14 | |
| *** sobczyk has quit IRC | 17:15 | |
| *** hannesw_ has joined #maemo | 17:16 | |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 17:16 | |
| flux | has anyone noticed MyContacts & the associated home screen applet exiting spuriously? | 17:16 |
| *** wazd has joined #maemo | 17:17 | |
| RST38h | heya wazd | 17:18 |
| *** hannesw has quit IRC | 17:19 | |
| wazd | RST38h: hey :) Sorry, I have to run now, but I'll be back in a couple hours | 17:19 |
| *** Amorphous_ has joined #maemo | 17:19 | |
| *** Flyser_ has joined #maemo | 17:20 | |
| ghostcube | yeah got vlc remote to work -.- | 17:20 |
| ghostcube | hrhr | 17:21 |
| *** Flyser has quit IRC | 17:21 | |
| *** willer_ has joined #maemo | 17:22 | |
| *** gnuton has quit IRC | 17:22 | |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 17:23 | |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 17:23 | |
| *** javispedro has joined #maemo | 17:23 | |
| *** mfabiop has quit IRC | 17:23 | |
| *** mfabiop has joined #maemo | 17:24 | |
| *** FireFly|n900 has joined #maemo | 17:24 | |
| *** habmala has quit IRC | 17:24 | |
| *** schend has quit IRC | 17:26 | |
| *** amigadave has quit IRC | 17:26 | |
| Amorphous_ | is it already known that http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle-1.2/free/binary-armel/Packages is broken? | 17:26 |
| javispedro | moo | 17:26 |
| *** wazd has quit IRC | 17:27 | |
| lcuk | Jasonb10, look in the Diablo patchset, it incorporated a startmenuish menu for app launching :) | 17:27 |
| sivang | hey javispedro , lcuk , MohammadAG51 | 17:28 |
| javispedro | hello sivang | 17:28 |
| *** msanchez has quit IRC | 17:28 | |
| Jasonb10 | lcuk it looks great but im not sure how i would start trying to get it working in maemo5 | 17:28 |
| *** mfabiop has quit IRC | 17:29 | |
| *** Peyman has quit IRC | 17:29 | |
| lcuk | technically you could try building the diablo hildon components and installing/replacing the ones on your development device | 17:29 |
| *** HarryS has joined #maemo | 17:29 | |
| Jasonb10 | uh huh... | 17:29 |
| Jasonb10 | good idea.. | 17:29 |
| lcuk | lots of people liked the diablo desktop :) and with telescope, it actually offers quite a nice experience without the powervr being involved | 17:30 |
| *** FireyFly has joined #maemo | 17:30 | |
| Jasonb10 | i never had diablo but it looks cool | 17:32 |
| tobis87 | I have read the manpage over and over again. I have no idea how I could make objcopy to rearange sections, but it shouldn't really matter, or does it? | 17:32 |
| *** jreznik has joined #maemo | 17:32 | |
| *** Ordog_by has quit IRC | 17:33 | |
| jacktheripper | am I not allowed to remove a package I uploaded to extras-devel ? | 17:33 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nope afaik | 17:33 |
| javispedro | X-Fade: there? | 17:33 |
| dRbiG | okey, who broke http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle-1.2/free/binary-armel/Packages.gz ? | 17:34 |
| jacktheripper | DocScrutinizer51, but what if I uploaded a broken package that can't be fixed ? does it just remain there ? | 17:37 |
| *** Jef91 has joined #maemo | 17:37 | |
| Jef91 | Did angry birds release on the N900 or iOS first? I tought it was N900 but wikipedia says differently | 17:38 |
| javispedro | iphone | 17:38 |
| *** ivan4th has joined #maemo | 17:38 | |
| *** Jef91 has quit IRC | 17:38 | |
| javispedro | jacktheripper: what did you do? can't you just bump version #? | 17:39 |
| jacktheripper | javispedro: it's libwnck, and it depends on libxres1 which has been removed in PR1.2 and moved to the tools repo. It's flagged as a missing dependency. Is there a better thing to do ? | 17:40 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 17:41 | |
| tobis87 | I have not tried this with a n900 module, but this should work as well. http://pastebin.com/td0QaNje | 17:41 |
| *** Peyman has joined #maemo | 17:42 | |
| *** nicu has quit IRC | 17:42 | |
| MohammadAG51 | hey sivang | 17:42 |
| javispedro | jacktheripper: nothing awful will happen by leaving it there =) | 17:42 |
| javispedro | tobis87: aw, looks like you're trying to make your kernel suicide | 17:43 |
| MohammadAG51 | cat /dev/kmem ftw | 17:43 |
| * MohammadAG51 thanks DocScrutinizer | 17:43 | |
| *** bigbrovar has quit IRC | 17:44 | |
| tobis87 | javispedro: This was only a test on my pc, I wanted to find out how to change the .modinfo section, so it is possible to use the injection driver with the normal kernel, without having to use force. | 17:44 |
| vasily_pupkin | hey | 17:46 |
| vasily_pupkin | i found shit in maemo-mapper | 17:46 |
| *** jpe has joined #maemo | 17:46 | |
| vkvraju | kernel panic | 17:46 |
| jacktheripper | javispedro, but it'd cause some confusion I think. | 17:46 |
| vasily_pupkin | can anybody give me proper /maps/maemo/maemo-mapper/map_correction_unitx? | 17:47 |
| vasily_pupkin | SpeedEvil: ? | 17:47 |
| *** britneypire has joined #maemo | 17:48 | |
| *** Jasonb10 has left #maemo | 17:48 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lcuk: eh? thanks for what? mentioning a way to cause kernel panic? | 17:49 |
| *** HarryS has quit IRC | 17:49 | |
| *** ZogG has quit IRC | 17:50 | |
| *** britneypire has quit IRC | 17:51 | |
| *** FireyFly is now known as FireFly | 17:51 | |
| *** ZogG has joined #maemo | 17:51 | |
| *** timoph is now known as timoph|away | 17:51 | |
| *** vasily_pupkin has quit IRC | 17:51 | |
| RST38h | ZogGGG | 17:52 |
| *** OptX has quit IRC | 17:53 | |
| *** OptX has joined #maemo | 17:53 | |
| *** Amorphous_ has left #maemo | 17:53 | |
| *** bigbrovar has joined #maemo | 17:54 | |
| *** vasily_pupkin has joined #maemo | 17:55 | |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 17:55 | |
| *** MSameerWork has quit IRC | 17:56 | |
| sivang | hi RST38h | 17:57 |
| *** mlfoster has joined #maemo | 17:57 | |
| *** Peyman has quit IRC | 17:59 | |
| *** ZogG has quit IRC | 17:59 | |
| *** SWFu has quit IRC | 18:02 | |
| *** merlin1991 has joined #maemo | 18:02 | |
| *** vasily_pupkin has quit IRC | 18:02 | |
| *** SWFu has joined #maemo | 18:03 | |
| *** valdyn has quit IRC | 18:04 | |
| dRbiG | hmm, can anyone give me ip for a515.g.akamai.net ? | 18:05 |
| dRbiG | i have some weird issues here, again :) | 18:05 |
| n900-dk | a515.g.akamai.net has address 195.215.37.65 | 18:05 |
| n900-dk | a515.g.akamai.net has address 195.215.37.63 | 18:05 |
| dRbiG | that's interesting, three different sources three diferent ip sets | 18:06 |
| dRbiG | n900-dk: and http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle-1.2/free/binary-armel/Packages.gz is a proper gzip file for you i assume? | 18:07 |
| dRbiG | i get here some wierd text output looking like a part of a config file | 18:07 |
| n900-dk | dRbiG: Yes it is | 18:08 |
| nidO | dRbiG: "three different sources three diferent ip sets" < thats basically the whole point of akamai | 18:08 |
| dRbiG | nidO: some kind of load-balancing/clustering stuff? | 18:09 |
| *** ppenz has quit IRC | 18:09 | |
| n900-dk | dRbiG: Yes, guess they have localized servers more places in the world | 18:09 |
| nidO | yes, its a worldwide network of load-balanced systems, that will always (usually) direct visitors to hosting nodes physically closest to themselves | 18:09 |
| dRbiG | okey, but why do i get this http://paste.org/pastebin/view/22936 instead of the gziped package list? | 18:10 |
| dRbiG | huh | 18:10 |
| *** ZogG has joined #maemo | 18:11 | |
| *** sergio__ has joined #maemo | 18:11 | |
| *** AcTiVaTe has joined #maemo | 18:12 | |
| n900-dk | That's a good question :) | 18:13 |
| sivang | hmm, so rsync -aHx /home to mSD took ages, I accidently disconnected from the USB cable, now ls on the mSD ext3 filesystem takes ages as well | 18:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | dRbiG: there's been other reports today bout repos gzip broken. For IP: akamai does load balancing | 18:14 |
| *** Jucato has quit IRC | 18:14 | |
| sivang | and it doesn't seem it is eating too much memory | 18:14 |
| sivang | is there a way to disable trackerd for a specific operation? | 18:15 |
| rmrfchik | hm, just read blogpost about nokia of former leader of the biggest mobile sellers in russia | 18:15 |
| rmrfchik | seems like nokia fucked up the market | 18:16 |
| sivang | what do you mean "f**cked" ? | 18:16 |
| sivang | I just took iPhone4 to my hands, it looks the same like the previous one, and no real multitasking yet. | 18:17 |
| rmrfchik | the ruined relations with dealers | 18:17 |
| *** vkvraju has quit IRC | 18:17 | |
| rmrfchik | *they | 18:17 |
| sivang | not to mention not being able to use flash and transmit streamed stuff frmo 3G over FM radio :) | 18:18 |
| *** muellisoft has quit IRC | 18:18 | |
| * sivang pets his N900 | 18:18 | |
| dRbiG | DocScrutinizer51: seems that some of these load-balancing backend servers have some problems, halting in the middle of a script or sth. on another box one time i get the proper .gz file other time i get this broken stuff | 18:18 |
| dRbiG | annoying | 18:18 |
| dRbiG | either work everytime or be broken everytime | 18:18 |
| *** TheXception is now known as TheXception|off | 18:18 | |
| *** Rarok has quit IRC | 18:19 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | dRbiG: I can easily suggest a 'fix' to you so it fails forver :-P | 18:19 |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 18:19 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | interested? | 18:20 |
| dRbiG | DocScrutinizer51: i assume it all to be broken ;p | 18:20 |
| dRbiG | no fuzzy logic approach here | 18:20 |
| *** merlin1991 has quit IRC | 18:21 | |
| *** zap has quit IRC | 18:22 | |
| *** merlin1991 has joined #maemo | 18:22 | |
| dRbiG | i wonder if this issue applies to other files not just package list | 18:23 |
| *** Free_maN_ has quit IRC | 18:24 | |
| dRbiG | anyway, i can bet this whole stuff was written in php ;) | 18:24 |
| dRbiG | it feels so bamboo raft | 18:25 |
| *** MacDrunk has quit IRC | 18:26 | |
| *** kwek has quit IRC | 18:26 | |
| *** Bash has joined #maemo | 18:26 | |
| yacc | Just out of curiosity, is there such a thing like a VNC server for the N900? | 18:29 |
| yacc | So that I can use the big screen and keyboard to use it while at home? | 18:29 |
| *** ZogG has quit IRC | 18:30 | |
| *** vanadis has quit IRC | 18:31 | |
| lcuk | yacc, sure there is - and you can also just plug into the video out ;) | 18:31 |
| *** rcg has joined #maemo | 18:31 | |
| *** muellisoft has joined #maemo | 18:32 | |
| yacc | lcuk, well, video out means no keyboard. | 18:32 |
| yacc | lcuk, but a VNC server means that I can just "remote" control the phone. | 18:32 |
| yacc | One of the things that I most missed on my G1. | 18:33 |
| *** slonopotamus has joined #maemo | 18:33 | |
| lcuk | yacc just type "vnc" into the search box here http://maemo.org/packages/ | 18:35 |
| lcuk | or into search box on HAM :) | 18:35 |
| *** igagis has joined #maemo | 18:36 | |
| *** ZogG has joined #maemo | 18:36 | |
| *** ghostcube has quit IRC | 18:37 | |
| yacc | Wondering, Maemo does run X11 or does it have it's own "display system" directly wired with Qt? | 18:37 |
| jaska | x11 | 18:37 |
| yacc | cool, so x11vnc is enough to remote control the UI :) | 18:37 |
| yacc | That's why I've been wanting to have a N900 for some time, ... | 18:38 |
| yacc | And if I believe a former friend, it's nearly unbrickable too :) | 18:38 |
| javispedro | yacc: here comes the surprising part: the core Maemo doesn't use Qt all, but Gtk+. | 18:40 |
| javispedro | *at all. | 18:40 |
| *** pH5 has joined #maemo | 18:40 | |
| *** slonopotamus_ has joined #maemo | 18:41 | |
| *** slonopotamus has quit IRC | 18:41 | |
| *** slonopotamus_ is now known as slonopotamus | 18:41 | |
| yacc | lol | 18:44 |
| sivang | yacc: maemo is actually of strong GTK+ legacy | 18:44 |
| yacc | But Qt is the new thing, right? | 18:44 |
| *** murrayc has quit IRC | 18:45 | |
| *** MohammadAG has joined #maemo | 18:45 | |
| AcTiVaTe | Depends on how you define new I guess | 18:45 |
| AcTiVaTe | Both Qt and Gtk+ have been around quite a while | 18:46 |
| sivang | yacc: mobile app development offering from Nokia now leans to Qt mostly. | 18:46 |
| sivang | yacc: and is the thick of the MeeGo SDK for example | 18:47 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: Can I stop trackerd? Also, I rsync'd some stuff to the mSD and the process broke in the middle, now the fs seems inaccessbiel as when ls'ing it it hangs for inordinate amount of time. | 18:47 |
| javispedro | tracker-processes -t | 18:48 |
| sivang | thanks javispedro | 18:49 |
| javispedro | starting media player will spawn it again | 18:49 |
| sivang | javispedro: I haven't , then again, there is a good chance my fs busy problem is not related to tracker | 18:49 |
| javispedro | there's a good chance it's just that io is slow :P | 18:50 |
| sivang | javispedro: right, and I forgot to disable the journal before the copy process ;/ | 18:50 |
| sivang | javispedro: tracker is defucnt, how can I have it cleaned? | 18:51 |
| h4waii | Blow away the DB. | 18:51 |
| javispedro | sivang: doesn't matter | 18:51 |
| *** hrw is now known as hrw|gone | 18:51 | |
| h4waii | tracker SUCKS. There is no real way to fix "it" | 18:51 |
| javispedro | defunct = No resources | 18:51 |
| slonopotamus | h4waii: just stop it :) | 18:52 |
| h4waii | and not have my media indexed? | 18:52 |
| *** SWFu has quit IRC | 18:52 | |
| *** TheXception|off is now known as TheXception | 18:52 | |
| *** juk has joined #maemo | 18:52 | |
| slonopotamus | well, you can still use file manager to navigate | 18:53 |
| *** ag0ny has quit IRC | 18:53 | |
| sivang | javispedro: right, it just hurt my eye to see it there still and starting the media player did not start it causing media player to report "no videos/songs" :) | 18:53 |
| h4waii | Pretty lame option, IMHO. | 18:53 |
| juk | hehey here where you are folks! | 18:53 |
| sivang | juk: ? | 18:53 |
| juk | everyone voted already? | 18:53 |
| *** frade has quit IRC | 18:53 | |
| slonopotamus | h4waii: another option is to fix tracker :) | 18:53 |
| juk | hi sivang | 18:54 |
| h4waii | The best option is to replace tracker. | 18:54 |
| *** zs has joined #maemo | 18:54 | |
| juk | did everyone voted here for n900? | 18:54 |
| sivang | hmm | 18:54 |
| sivang | hey juk :) I will be soon requiring voting myself , I plan to upload some apps soon | 18:54 |
| *** timeless_pidgin has joined #maemo | 18:54 | |
| javispedro | sivang: time to reboot =) | 18:55 |
| juk | sivang: great! | 18:55 |
| MohammadAG | no, most don't care what wins in some online competition | 18:55 |
| sivang | javispedro: yeah, as I see now, quite astonishingly that 3(!!) rsync processes are running toward the same target. | 18:55 |
| MohammadAG | the poll is really pointless | 18:55 |
| juk | javispedro: I know your nick :) and MohammadAG | 18:55 |
| timeless_pidgin | Can someone here please open ovi maps (i know) and try searching for: killarney, ireland | 18:55 |
| sivang | juk: none of them really stoped when I ctrl-c'd | 18:56 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: can it be done on the web instead of the device? | 18:56 |
| timeless_pidgin | ... Once it finds that, try a new search for: bus terminal, killarney | 18:56 |
| timeless_pidgin | Sivang : dunno | 18:56 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: okay, I'm doing it on the device | 18:56 |
| sivang | just a sec | 18:56 |
| sivang | bah | 18:56 |
| timeless_pidgin | I'd rather n900 since i want fidelity to version 1 stupidity | 18:56 |
| sivang | I have to reboot first, | 18:56 |
| sivang | straying rsync processes... | 18:57 |
| *** polymar has quit IRC | 18:57 | |
| sivang | hmm | 18:57 |
| sivang | reboot is not responding | 18:57 |
| sivang | odd | 18:57 |
| slonopotamus | :) | 18:57 |
| timeless_pidgin | sudo gainroot; reboot | 18:57 |
| slonopotamus | hdd failure? | 18:57 |
| *** RevdKathy has joined #maemo | 18:58 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: yes, that's what I did, through root though | 18:58 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: anyway, I switched on and off form the button menu | 18:58 |
| sivang | ooohh I think I made it angry | 18:58 |
| sivang | it has done the boot vibrate for like 3 times ina row now | 18:58 |
| * sivang hopes thigns are right inside there | 18:59 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: booting, just a sec | 18:59 |
| juk | sivang: what app are you developing? | 18:59 |
| *** davyg has joined #maemo | 18:59 | |
| sivang | juk: something to get events from rsyslog enabled servers into the device with alerts and stuff, mostly as an excersize | 19:00 |
| sivang | juk: for admins | 19:00 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: okay, it runs. killarney , ireland it is | 19:00 |
| *** diegohcg has quit IRC | 19:01 | |
| sivang | *exercise | 19:01 |
| *** diegohcg has joined #maemo | 19:02 | |
| sivang | juk: I want to create a suite of apps "for making administrators life good" as Borat would have said. | 19:02 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: ovi boots | 19:02 |
| juk | sivang: that's cool | 19:02 |
| *** timeless_pidgin1 has joined #maemo | 19:02 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has quit IRC | 19:03 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin1: how do I search it.. | 19:03 |
| *** timeless_pidgin1 is now known as timeless_pidgin | 19:03 | |
| timeless_pidgin | At the bottom right there's an un fullscreen | 19:03 |
| *** slonopotamus has quit IRC | 19:03 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: k, clicked it | 19:03 |
| timeless_pidgin | Tap. Then there's a search "button" in the "bar" | 19:03 |
| sivang | you mean places? | 19:04 |
| *** slonopotamus has joined #maemo | 19:04 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Hrm, no? | 19:04 |
| timeless_pidgin | Which maemo software do you have? | 19:04 |
| timeless_pidgin | (which do i have? :( ...) | 19:04 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: that's okay, I'm managing | 19:04 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: alreay got offered the airport through auto completiong, just a sec | 19:05 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: seems like the latest OVI maps but the device is at 1.1.1 orsomething | 19:05 |
| sivang | surely not 1.2 | 19:05 |
| timeless_pidgin | Take pictures as you go (ctrl-shift-p) ;) | 19:05 |
| timeless_pidgin | Iirc maps got a facelift for 1.2 | 19:05 |
| *** sleipnir has joined #maemo | 19:05 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: I think it seems like in 1.2 | 19:06 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: but I know for sure I am not using 1.2. | 19:06 |
| sivang | s/.// | 19:06 |
| infobot | sivang meant: timeless_pidgin: but I know for sure I am not using 12. | 19:06 |
| timeless_pidgin | s/2./2/ | 19:06 |
| *** msanchez has joined #maemo | 19:06 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: and what's next? the train station? | 19:06 |
| sivang | "Killerny train station"? | 19:07 |
| timeless_pidgin | Anyway, what does it give as results? | 19:07 |
| sivang | county, county roscommon | 19:07 |
| timeless_pidgin | For me it showed killarney and bus terminal as distinct map points. | 19:07 |
| sivang | county kerry | 19:07 |
| javispedro | Killarney Bus Station? | 19:07 |
| juk | sivang: I want to port busybox, original one, default in maemo is modified | 19:07 |
| sivang | oh dear...it set on US. | 19:08 |
| * sivang changes | 19:08 | |
| GAN900 | I wish rtcomm could actually manage to maintain connections for more then a day at a stretch. | 19:08 |
| timeless_pidgin | Which was "helpful", since the fact that i'm *in* killarney and am looking for a bus terminal means that i really want to know where killarney (map center) is! | 19:08 |
| javispedro | GAN900: it's all gone downhill since recently, I don't know what's going on | 19:08 |
| sivang | tht's bettter | 19:08 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: error on searc, retrying | 19:08 |
| timeless_pidgin | That's why i searched for killarney alone, oh wait, i didn't... | 19:08 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: okay, don't despair I'm massaging it | 19:09 |
| javispedro | it used to be able to keep gtalk/jabber open for more than a day, now I hear the usualy login/logout sounds every two or three hours :( | 19:09 |
| sivang | juk: nice, will be right back with you after I finish helping timeless_pidgin | 19:09 |
| timeless_pidgin | Have you asked the telepathy people about logging? | 19:09 |
| timeless_pidgin | Surely they'd want to investigate/improve... | 19:10 |
| * timeless_pidgin is on a bus to Cork | 19:10 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: okay, I found a Killarney bus station | 19:10 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: and centered upon it | 19:10 |
| timeless_pidgin | Sivang : the question isn't really can you find it | 19:11 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: what do you need from it? | 19:11 |
| timeless_pidgin | It's whether when you search for: bus terminal, killarney | 19:11 |
| *** Vanadis has joined #maemo | 19:11 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Does it show two results (bus terminal), (killarney) | 19:11 |
| *** deegee__ has joined #maemo | 19:11 | |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: I searched for "Killarney Bus Station" | 19:11 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: (1) | 19:11 |
| timeless_pidgin | Nah, "bus terminal, killarney" w/o quotes | 19:11 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: -> one hit | 19:12 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: same as before | 19:12 |
| sivang | "Killarney Bus Station" | 19:12 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: that's all what you need? no info from it? can I offer you some lonelyplanet recommendations? :-P | 19:13 |
| *** eocanha has quit IRC | 19:13 | |
| slonopotamus | who is Arney, btw? | 19:14 |
| sivang | timeless_pidgin: there's a phone number as well. | 19:14 |
| *** coffeecat has quit IRC | 19:14 | |
| sivang | juk: what's missing from Maemo's busybox? | 19:15 |
| h4waii | He's the guy who owns all of Ireland - slonopotamus | 19:15 |
| h4waii | Sort of the Illuminati | 19:15 |
| juk | sivang: some flags, like find's -exec | 19:16 |
| sivang | juk: ah, and it was disabled for security or leaness ? | 19:17 |
| *** timeless_pidgin has quit IRC | 19:17 | |
| *** E0x has quit IRC | 19:17 | |
| slonopotamus | sivang: because nokia didn't need them :) | 19:17 |
| slonopotamus | (oh, and don't ask how old is maemo busybox) | 19:17 |
| juk | sivang: i dont know, also ifconfig and ping are need to be run as sudo, weird | 19:18 |
| javispedro | isn't that normal? | 19:18 |
| Scelt | Stskeeps: where I can follow meego to N900 -development the best? | 19:18 |
| slonopotamus | javispedro: no | 19:18 |
| sivang | Scelt: meego-arm | 19:18 |
| javispedro | slonopotamus: you'd need a separate suid "Ping" binary | 19:18 |
| *** E0x has joined #maemo | 19:18 | |
| Scelt | sivang: :? | 19:18 |
| javispedro | or give suid (or ping caps) to the entiry busybox bnary | 19:19 |
| juk | javispedro: Im not unix expert, just saying out my some experience | 19:19 |
| kerio | "Bus Station, Killflanders" | 19:19 |
| *** merlin1991 has quit IRC | 19:19 | |
| sivang | Scelt: http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev | 19:19 |
| Scelt | sivang: thx | 19:19 |
| sivang | Scelt: or join #meego-arm | 19:20 |
| *** Termana has quit IRC | 19:20 | |
| slonopotamus | javispedro: and _normally_ ping is a separate binary | 19:21 |
| Scelt | sivang: I did | 19:21 |
| sivang | Scelt: subscribed? | 19:21 |
| javispedro | slonopotamus: on busybox? | 19:21 |
| Scelt | sivang: nah, just joined the channel | 19:21 |
| slonopotamus | javispedro: nope. but normally you don't use busybox | 19:22 |
| *** coffeecat has joined #maemo | 19:22 | |
| sivang | is there a simple example for a maemo app that uses gconf? (/me checks modest) | 19:23 |
| javispedro | slonopotamus: that's another point (a good one though =) ). | 19:23 |
| javispedro | sivang: any gnome app | 19:23 |
| MohammadAG | modest uses ~/.modest | 19:24 |
| MohammadAG | fMMS (python) uses gconf | 19:24 |
| *** Robotnixon has joined #maemo | 19:24 | |
| sivang | MohammadAG: thanks, what about hildon? I'm specifically after the usage pattern of GSettings | 19:25 |
| *** Robotnixon has quit IRC | 19:25 | |
| * sivang arghs at the -pae kernel that keeps hanging | 19:26 | |
| javispedro | sivang: GSettings is too new for Maemo, afaik you won't be able to use it at all | 19:27 |
| *** Andy80 has joined #maemo | 19:27 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo | 19:28 | |
| *** Wikier has quit IRC | 19:28 | |
| *** lupine_85 has quit IRC | 19:29 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 19:29 | |
| *** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo | 19:30 | |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC | 19:30 | |
| sivang | javispedro: I thought of first doing some review, to see how many and which applications we need to change as per - http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.meego.devel/5854 | 19:31 |
| javispedro | I've not followed that | 19:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nuke messybox | 19:32 |
| sivang | javispedro: so basically, Arjan said he would be happy to move to dconf, but first there need to be a coherent settings API that apps will use, where switching the backend won't change anything for them. | 19:32 |
| *** sergio__ has quit IRC | 19:32 | |
| *** hannesw_ has quit IRC | 19:32 | |
| sivang | javispedro: arr, Marius, not Arjan | 19:32 |
| sivang | javispedro: Arjan just said we need a plan, http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.meego.devel/5828 | 19:33 |
| sivang | javispedro: so I want to start preparing this plan. first step to research how many and which apps do use gconf, and it what way. | 19:33 |
| sivang | (IMHO) | 19:34 |
| Scelt | frals: where's new fmms? mms sending is still slow ;( | 19:34 |
| *** jsharper has quit IRC | 19:34 | |
| javispedro | sivang: ah well, I would be surprised if the figure wasn't anywhere near 100% of the applications | 19:34 |
| javispedro | and all of them using GConfClient. | 19:34 |
| javispedro | on Meego maybe some of them used the libmeego gconf client | 19:35 |
| javispedro | *libmeegotouch | 19:35 |
| sivang | javispedro: yes, inside meegotouch this is the same "abstraction" | 19:35 |
| sivang | javispedro: e.g. follwoing exactly same API | 19:35 |
| *** zap has joined #maemo | 19:35 | |
| sivang | javispedro: that's Marius's lib , reintroduced there. | 19:35 |
| sivang | javispedro: it seems the missing bit is to enable the qt wrappers to listen to changes AFAI understand it, but I may be terribly wrong. | 19:36 |
| *** hannesw_ has joined #maemo | 19:36 | |
| *** marcels has joined #maemo | 19:36 | |
| javispedro | iirc the one missing notifications is qsettings (the multiplatform qt one) | 19:37 |
| javispedro | (for obvious reasons... ) | 19:37 |
| sivang | javispedro: exactly | 19:37 |
| *** sergio has joined #maemo | 19:37 | |
| sivang | javispedro: what are the obvious reasons for lack of signaling? | 19:37 |
| sivang | err, notifications. | 19:37 |
| javispedro | sivang: that some platforms do not implement it. | 19:37 |
| sivang | javispedro: well, okay. It should just be defunct for platforms that do no implement it, it is also not the platform itself but the settings storage software installed there, so it is the "middleware" level | 19:38 |
| sivang | I should probably take this to qt-devel | 19:38 |
| * sivang contemplates | 19:38 | |
| *** Erod has joined #maemo | 19:41 | |
| *** ghostcube has joined #maemo | 19:42 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | honestly I don't see the rationale behind ANY windows registry mimicking configuration system, no amtter if you cal it gconf, *conf or foobar - it just gives me goosepimples | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | what the hell is wrong with good old unix defacto standard plain text config files? | 19:45 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer51: notifications =) | 19:45 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | eh? | 19:45 |
| javispedro | envision a hundred of apps getting notified by inotify when a .ini file changes, then all of them reparsing the entire .ini file and updating | 19:45 |
| javispedro | now envision a daemon telling each specific app listening for a specific setting sending a dbus message | 19:46 |
| javispedro | that setting X changed and its new value is Y | 19:46 |
| *** mikki-kun has joined #maemo | 19:47 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: umm, so what? | 19:47 |
| mgedmin | that was what sold me on gconf | 19:47 |
| mgedmin | instant settings update in all running apps | 19:47 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | don't buy that | 19:48 |
| liori | sane system of system-wide/user prefs, with optional blocking user changes? | 19:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | where's the overhead of 100 fopen();read() compared to 100 dbus-notify? esp if those 100 read() are to the same buffered file? | 19:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nonsense, systemwide killing off apps/processes when one central cruft system (gconfd) fails | 19:51 |
| lindi- | DocScrutinizer51: XML parsing is only done once | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | pfft | 19:51 |
| jacktheripper | MohammadAG, hey, I remember you told me yesterday that I should keep my -dev package in extras-devel. There's nothing wrong with having most of the dependencies flagged as 'missing' on the page, right ? | 19:52 |
| slonopotamus | lindi-: no reason to keep configs in xml | 19:52 |
| liori | having been lurking here for some time, I saw you bashing nokia so many times; please reassure me: n900 isn't that bad as you say so? :-) | 19:53 |
| sivang | mgedmin: how is gconf overcoming the performance problem with inotify and ini files ? | 19:53 |
| juk | what difference armeb and arm and armel ??? | 19:53 |
| juk | confusing stuff | 19:54 |
| *** timsamofflocal has joined #maemo | 19:54 | |
| satmd | big endian, little endian | 19:54 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | really a great achievement for those myriads of 2 system wide config changes per day, to set up some overcomplicated slow unmanageable system like gconfd | 19:54 |
| mgedmin | sivang, instead of 5 apps having to read, parse, and diff internally with old settings, there's a single notification from the app changing the setting to gconfd which redistributes the notification to those 4 of the 5 apps that expressed an interest in that particular setting | 19:54 |
| mgedmin | but I wasn't saying it was overcoming a performance problem, specifically | 19:54 |
| juk | satmd: so which one is n900 running | 19:54 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer51 has lots in what his saying. The amount of constant configuration is small on such a platform and happens mostly when user starts using the system for the first itme. | 19:54 |
| satmd | uname -a should tell you | 19:54 |
| sivang | mgedmin: but they still have to re-read the config no? | 19:55 |
| satmd | mh, doesnt | 19:55 |
| sivang | mgedmin: or do dbus sends them the changed valu? | 19:55 |
| mgedmin | sivang, no, gconf sends them the changed value | 19:55 |
| *** timsamofflocal is now known as timsamoff | 19:55 | |
| sivang | mgedmin: ah great. | 19:55 |
| mgedmin | gconf doesn't use dbus, I think | 19:55 |
| *** timsamoff has quit IRC | 19:55 | |
| *** timsamoff has joined #maemo | 19:55 | |
| mgedmin | that's what the upcoming gconf replacement dconf is all about | 19:55 |
| juk | satmd: it's better, armv71 unkown, which one is that one now? | 19:56 |
| sivang | mgedmin: about sending the changed values? you said said gconf does this as well :) | 19:56 |
| mgedmin | gconf is a nice framework with some serious implementation issues -- all those little .xml files scattered on disk are not good for performance | 19:56 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | great, even more overhead | 19:56 |
| mgedmin | sivang, yes, I just meant that currently gconf uses some kind of IPC that's not based on top of dbus | 19:56 |
| mgedmin | for those notifications | 19:56 |
| MohammadAG | jacktheripper, nope, some of the ones in the rootfs of Maemo 5 aren't detected by the packages page I think | 19:56 |
| satmd | juk: just trying to find out, I have one :p | 19:56 |
| *** timoph|away is now known as timoph | 19:56 | |
| sivang | liori: N900 is the best thing since sliced bread, and a good replacement for a girl friend | 19:57 |
| juk | satmd: you have what? | 19:57 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ahah! optimezed to a point where performance sucks - wait, why did we change to gconf? | 19:57 |
| RevdKathy | sivang - Must have been a lousy relationship | 19:57 |
| liori | sivang: ok, thanks, that's what I wanted to hear | 19:57 |
| sivang | RevdKathy: yes, long sotry :) | 19:57 |
| sivang | still, N900 keeps me company | 19:58 |
| * RevdKathy thinks of ways she could outclass an n900 | 19:58 | |
| sivang | the more I get from it, the more I want | 19:58 |
| javispedro | mgedmin: oh, it does use gconf, at least recent versions of it | 19:58 |
| mgedmin | javispedro, did you mean dconf? | 19:58 |
| juk | satmd: I donwloaded arm toolchain and shell says not found while executing | 19:58 |
| javispedro | mgedmin: err. I mean... gconf does use dbus. | 19:58 |
| lindi- | mgedmin: gconf uses CORBA currently afaik | 19:58 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | let's face it, gconf idea is an evil infection of mind you get by touching redmond crap | 19:58 |
| sivang | lindi-: ooo right | 19:58 |
| javispedro | i even have proof =) | 19:58 |
| javispedro | the tetris app on diablo and fremantle use dbus to talk with gconfd | 19:59 |
| juk | satmd: shall i get armv7 ? | 19:59 |
| mgedmin | I believe you | 19:59 |
| javispedro | directly, no client library in between | 19:59 |
| *** johnsq has joined #maemo | 19:59 | |
| sivang | RevdKathy: sky are also ISPing ? :) | 19:59 |
| * mgedmin updates his internal knowledge base and hopes he won't forget | 19:59 | |
| johnsq | Hi | 19:59 |
| lindi- | johnsq: but does it use CORBA over dbus there? | 19:59 |
| mgedmin | what's the point of dconf then? | 19:59 |
| RevdKathy | yes - have been for years | 19:59 |
| lindi- | javispedro: but does it use CORBA over dbus there? | 19:59 |
| javispedro | why it would do that?? | 20:00 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: do you have any alternatives which will have the same features as gconf? | 20:00 |
| javispedro | corba is a giant mess | 20:00 |
| mgedmin | ldd /usr/lib/.../gconfd-2 does link to both libORBit and to libdbus | 20:00 |
| lindi- | javispedro: because afaik dbus support was not there yet | 20:00 |
| *** jrocha has quit IRC | 20:00 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | what Fing *features* ??? | 20:00 |
| lindi- | javispedro: can you post output of dbus-monitor? | 20:00 |
| javispedro | lindi-: sigh. method call sender=:1.200 -> dest=org.gnome.GConf serial=2 path=/org/gnome/GConf; interface=org.gnome.GConf; member=GetIOR | 20:00 |
| javispedro | etc, etc, etc. | 20:00 |
| javispedro | and this is on a 2-3 year old gnome version.. | 20:01 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: not having to code file management, notification changes, and system-wide/user prefs | 20:01 |
| lindi- | javispedro: and then it transmits things like "IOR:010000001600000049444c3a436f6e666967536572766572323a312e30000000030000000054424f540000000101020005000000554e4958000000000a0000006c6f63616c686f73740000002a000000 | 20:01 |
| lindi- | javispedro: there? afaik that's orbit over dbus | 20:01 |
| lindi- | javispedro: there? afaik that's corba over dbus :) | 20:01 |
| satmd | dunn | 20:01 |
| satmd | +o | 20:01 |
| javispedro | lindi-: touché | 20:01 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | liori: sorry, not my problem if you don't like coding and dun't know how to use libs | 20:02 |
| mgedmin | and your tetris app deals with that? | 20:02 |
| mgedmin | wow | 20:02 |
| javispedro | no, letme look it up | 20:02 |
| *** Venemo has joined #maemo | 20:02 | |
| lindi- | javispedro: would be interesting if it did anything more complex with dbus | 20:02 |
| satmd | juk: wikipedia says... both ... but I dunno how thats implemented, if one can chose it per kernel or per application | 20:03 |
| *** hurbu has joined #maemo | 20:03 | |
| javispedro | lindi-: I see that there's a proper Dbus API | 20:03 |
| javispedro | lindi-: see interface org.gnome.GConf.Database | 20:03 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: i just don't want to spend time on details which should be solved by environment | 20:03 |
| satmd | iirc little endian | 20:03 |
| javispedro | lindi-: http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-games-wrapper-1.9.4/libhgw/hgw_conf.c#121 | 20:03 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lol | 20:03 |
| *** Mousey has joined #maemo | 20:04 | |
| juk | satmd: thanks for researching! | 20:04 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: and gconf has an additional feature that it abstracts how the settings are actually stored, so i don't care if it is XML or INI files... gconf can change that later | 20:04 |
| *** slonopotamus has quit IRC | 20:04 | |
| ZogG | Khertan, re | 20:04 |
| juk | satmd: im doing just verbosly :D | 20:05 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG, ping | 20:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | app config is "environment"?? and you honestly suggest using gconf and dbus is much simpler than using any of the multiple config file parsing libs available? | 20:05 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer51: definitely! because there's A LOT of them, and all of them implement their own syntax, their own quirks, etc. | 20:05 |
| mgedmin | depends if you want insta-apply or not | 20:05 |
| *** dvaske has joined #maemo | 20:05 | |
| mgedmin | I suppose | 20:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | liori: so maybe it also learns to smell like lemon. Would that also count as feature? | 20:06 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: if user wants his configuration to smell, why not? | 20:06 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: so what? you are not suggested to use all of them concurrently | 20:07 |
| *** arno0ob has quit IRC | 20:07 | |
| *** sivang has quit IRC | 20:07 | |
| Venemo | hi guys | 20:07 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, pong | 20:08 |
| Venemo | SpeedEvil: thanks for your help yesterday | 20:08 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer51: but apps will, and you'll have to learn them. | 20:08 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | user wants to not see "gconfd 20% cpu" - everything else is irrelevant. Nah wait, what's the analog to less .xchat2/xchat.conf? for gconf? | 20:08 |
| *** jacktheripper has quit IRC | 20:08 | |
| Venemo | SpeedEvil: I took my N900 to a Nokia service. The guy measured the battery voltage, it was 2.4 V... so he gave it a manual charge, and now my N900 can charge it, too | 20:08 |
| Khertan | ZogG, ? | 20:08 |
| Khertan | re | 20:08 |
| Khertan | :) | 20:08 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer51: gconftool -R /apps/gconf | 20:09 |
| javispedro | er.. | 20:09 |
| lindi- | javispedro: interesting | 20:09 |
| *** jcrawford has joined #maemo | 20:09 | |
| *** jcrawford has joined #maemo | 20:09 | |
| javispedro | /apps/xchat | 20:09 |
| *** dvaske has quit IRC | 20:09 | |
| Venemo | MohammadAG: thanks to you too | 20:09 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: uhuh, so you want to play benevolent dictator now? by pressing devels into just one quirky interface, instead of configs of their choice? | 20:09 |
| lindi- | javispedro: any idea where I can find the source of this "LookupExtended"? grep does not find it from the source of gconf 2.31.5 | 20:09 |
| *** lupine_85 has joined #maemo | 20:10 | |
| frals | Scelt: initial testing is showing imagemagick to be hell of a lot slower, but ive not checked all options yet :P | 20:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: I'm really eager to copy my xchat config from N810 to N900 this way | 20:10 |
| MohammadAG | Venemo, stopping bme shouldn't kill a battery, anyways, good to see it was resolved :) | 20:11 |
| *** Vanadis_ has joined #maemo | 20:11 | |
| Scelt | frals: I gave you the best quality option so not surprised :) try -scale | 20:11 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer51: if you want to code your own configuration code, do so; gconf is for those who only needs standard features... which will fit 95% of apps | 20:11 |
| Venemo | MohammadAG, now I see that bme is there for a reason :) | 20:11 |
| *** twouters has joined #maemo | 20:11 | |
| *** lupine_85 has quit IRC | 20:11 | |
| *** lupine_85 has joined #maemo | 20:11 | |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer51: ah, we've reached that point of the discussion again. Nobody is forcing anybody to use GConf (well, save gnome foundation for gnome core apps). The fact that I think it's a nice approach doesn't force anyone to use it. | 20:11 |
| *** fecub has quit IRC | 20:12 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it's a system architecture paradoxon (ouff maged to use any 4letter word) | 20:12 |
| *** millenomi has joined #maemo | 20:12 | |
| twouters | is something wrong with the maemo.org repositories or am I using wrong url's? http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle-1.2/free/binary-armel/Packages.gz doesn't seem valid to me. | 20:12 |
| *** vkvraju_ has joined #maemo | 20:13 | |
| vkvraju_ | Hi | 20:13 |
| vkvraju_ | anyone tried booting MeeGo on their N900 | 20:13 |
| Scelt | frals: for an example: resample took 0m2.778s, sample 0m0.090s and scale 0m0.113s | 20:13 |
| vkvraju_ | I tried just now. The process is easy | 20:13 |
| vkvraju_ | but the screen is mostly blank. Is this expected behaviour or did I do something wrong? | 20:13 |
| Scelt | frals: I think using resample was a bad idea. I forgot to do that test :( | 20:13 |
| frals | Scelt: im reading up on the different filters to see which produces acceptable images... it was this part i was hoping to not have to do ;D | 20:14 |
| *** lmoura has quit IRC | 20:15 | |
| *** Vanadis has quit IRC | 20:15 | |
| Venemo | vkvraju_: can MeeGo make phone calls yet? | 20:15 |
| *** lmoura has joined #maemo | 20:15 | |
| vkvraju_ | thats what I read and so tried booting today | 20:15 |
| vkvraju_ | people wre able to make and receive phone calls | 20:15 |
| vkvraju_ | and also receiev SMS too | 20:15 |
| vkvraju_ | read it in meego forums today | 20:15 |
| *** choppa has quit IRC | 20:15 | |
| Venemo | sounds good! :) | 20:16 |
| vkvraju_ | This was with the image that includes Nokia's closed components and stuff | 20:16 |
| vkvraju_ | yeah | 20:16 |
| Venemo | yeah, I thought so, but I don't have problems with that | 20:16 |
| Scelt | frals: yeah. I know I should have tested it better, sorry. but I'm pretty sure that one of those wrapper filters are fine. was it very slow with scale or sample too? or only with that resample? | 20:16 |
| Venemo | at least it's MeeGo on the N900!!! :) | 20:16 |
| vkvraju_ | I tried booting into it. The process was simple enough. But things are not clean after booting in. | 20:16 |
| *** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo | 20:16 | |
| *** geaaru has quit IRC | 20:17 | |
| ZogG | MohammadAG wanna make me russian localization for psfreedom and btw what about the version when you don't need disc inside? | 20:17 |
| frals | Scelt: im testing with resize to see what it does currently, so far everything has been slow ;D | 20:17 |
| ZogG | Khertan, bonjour | 20:17 |
| *** trbs has joined #maemo | 20:17 | |
| vkvraju_ | my screen is sitting blank now. If anyone has a way to get me to the meego menu, it would be great | 20:17 |
| Scelt | frals: have you tested -scale? | 20:17 |
| frals | not yet | 20:17 |
| Venemo | vkvraju_: perhaps the guys in #meego would be of more help to you | 20:17 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, well, I need to look at how to translate Qt apps first, as for the version, ask in #psfreedom, I only made the UI, not the kernel modules | 20:17 |
| ZogG | Khertan, wanted to make russian localization for khweeteur as well, or other your programs if you want, do you have .po files ? | 20:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | you started with the claim of gconf optimizing system performance, meanwhile we got the factoid it actually ntroduces performance *problems* and we never had any optimizing need in first instance. Then you claim gconf is easier to use, while there's quite obviously no difference to using any other arbitrary lib. Now you talk about abstraction of backend, so user has not to care about the file format. Great, I *love* to have a plain text | 20:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | file format of config files though, maybe even with comments. So what's next ? | 20:18 |
| vkvraju_ | I am currently at meego-arm too. No one seems to be interested to help there | 20:18 |
| ZogG | !google qt gui po translation | 20:18 |
| zgoldberg | Results for qt gui po translation on Google: | 20:18 |
| zgoldberg | -- | 20:18 |
| ZogG | hmm | 20:18 |
| Venemo | vkvraju_: I think Stskeeps could help you | 20:18 |
| Venemo | ~seen Stskeeps | 20:18 |
| infobot | stskeeps is currently on #maemo (2d 10h 58m 54s) #meego (2d 10h 58m 54s). Has said a total of 95 messages. Is idling for 3h 16m 48s, last said: 'die'. | 20:18 |
| vkvraju_ | yeah, he had helped before too. But looks like, he might be busy now | 20:18 |
| ZogG | !who zgoldberg | 20:18 |
| *** olebrom has quit IRC | 20:18 | |
| Venemo | ZogG: it is /whois | 20:19 |
| javispedro | lindi-: http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/source/gconf2/gconf/gconf-dbus-utils.h | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | my answer: kill -9 gconfd, and see what this architecture got you | 20:19 |
| ZogG | Venemo no there was bot command | 20:19 |
| Venemo | ZogG: those usually begin with ~ | 20:20 |
| Venemo | ~nuke ZogG | 20:20 |
| * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at ZogG ... B☢☢M! | 20:20 | |
| ZogG | oh right | 20:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | ...while I scp my xchat.conf file to a new machine, with evil grin | 20:20 |
| Scelt | frals: -sample seems to be crappy, -scale is better | 20:20 |
| ZogG | ~ZogG | 20:20 |
| infobot | you are, like, a awesome guy | 20:20 |
| ZogG | i am | 20:20 |
| Venemo | lol | 20:20 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: you will lose notifications but the daemon will selfrespawn as soon as the next application calls it | 20:20 |
| ZogG | this bot is AI, isn't it? | 20:20 |
| Venemo | ZogG: I don't think so | 20:21 |
| ZogG | ~MohammadAG | 20:21 |
| infobot | well, mohammadag is a package maintainer that would jump off a cliff if crashanddie asked him to | 20:21 |
| *** nuovodna has quit IRC | 20:21 | |
| *** Bash has quit IRC | 20:21 | |
| Venemo | ZogG: it just responds with a set of predefined answers | 20:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | pfff, so lemme suggest a more natural example: kill -SIGSTOP gconfd | 20:21 |
| ZogG | ~zgoldberg | 20:21 |
| ZogG | Venemo don't make me sad please | 20:21 |
| *** Bash has joined #maemo | 20:21 | |
| Venemo | ~Venemo | 20:21 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: rm -rf $HOME/.xchat* =) | 20:21 |
| *** Bash has quit IRC | 20:21 | |
| Venemo | ZogG: see? nothing | 20:21 |
| MohammadAG | LOLWUT | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | which is close enough to what you'll encounter on a slow system more often than you like | 20:22 |
| ZogG | ~zgoldberg is a fake bot with shitty google script that doesn't work :( | 20:22 |
| infobot | ZogG: please, watch your language. | 20:22 |
| MohammadAG | ~factinfo mohammadag | 20:22 |
| infobot | mohammadag -- created by TermanaN900 <~user@123-3-162-89.static.dsl.dodo.com.au> at Thu Aug 19 10:41:18 2010 (40 days); it has been requested 2 times, last by ZogG, 1m 3s ago. | 20:22 |
| *** Bash has joined #maemo | 20:22 | |
| *** olebrom has joined #maemo | 20:22 | |
| ZogG | Venemo cause you are nothing and i'm awesome, and you just jealous =) | 20:22 |
| Venemo | MohammadAG, lol | 20:22 |
| ZogG | ~factinfo ZogG | 20:22 |
| infobot | zogg -- created by DocScrutinizer <~jr@openmoko/engineers/joerg> at Mon May 10 13:53:31 2010 (141 days); it has been requested once, last by ZogG, 2m 18s ago. | 20:22 |
| Venemo | ZogG: lol at you too | 20:23 |
| MohammadAG | ~forget mohammadag | 20:23 |
| infobot | i forgot mohammadag, MohammadAG | 20:23 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer, =* | 20:23 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG cheater =( | 20:23 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG and how do i add | 20:23 |
| *** GAN900 has quit IRC | 20:23 | |
| DocScrutinizer | javispedro: the difference is my xchat file won't vanish out of itself, while your gconfd is known to eat up 30% of cpu for nothing, and brings systems to a grinding halt, even without somebody doing a kill -sigstop | 20:23 |
| *** GAN900 has joined #maemo | 20:23 | |
| satmd | doc has a point there | 20:24 |
| MohammadAG | just define one | 20:24 |
| MohammadAG | // ~foo is bar | 20:24 |
| *** crashanddie has quit IRC | 20:24 | |
| *** dvaske has joined #maemo | 20:24 | |
| ZogG | /~remember might work as well | 20:24 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: aren't you confusing gconfd with pulseaudio? =) | 20:24 |
| ZogG | ~zgoldberg | 20:25 |
| ZogG | ~zgoldberg | 20:25 |
| *** trbs has quit IRC | 20:25 | |
| DocScrutinizer | javispedro: positively not | 20:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | gconf is an abomination, system architecture wise | 20:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | invented by winheads | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | who think they're smart | 20:26 |
| vkvraju_ | gconf, dconf, QSettings --- ohhhhhhh | 20:27 |
| Venemo | well, gconf is just another library for storing configuration | 20:27 |
| ZogG | Khertan when you read my msg, pm me | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | Venemo: no, it's a centralized process, for no good reason | 20:27 |
| frals | Scelt: using PIL is still loads faster | 20:27 |
| Scelt | frals: how can it be :( | 20:28 |
| *** etrunko has quit IRC | 20:28 | |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, that's awful | 20:28 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: there's reasons. but you don't like them. | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, indeed | 20:28 |
| Scelt | frals: n900 can't be _that_ slow | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | javispedro: no, I proven them wrong in 10 min, see backscroll | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | there IS NO good reason to have a centralized config daemon | 20:29 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, agreed | 20:29 |
| *** etrunko has joined #maemo | 20:29 | |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: agreed :-) | 20:29 |
| *** lmoura_ has joined #maemo | 20:30 | |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: so what you'd do for notifications? | 20:30 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: also note that Windows "does not have a central daemon" btw (other than the kernel itself) | 20:30 |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 20:30 | |
| DocScrutinizer | why do we need any notifications beyond what inotify can do for everybody? | 20:30 |
| *** marciom_ has joined #maemo | 20:30 | |
| frals | Scelt: in real time PIL is 5x faster using my random picture from camera resized to 320 | 20:31 |
| *** lmoura has quit IRC | 20:31 | |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: to make it simpler for programmers | 20:31 |
| *** slonopotamus has joined #maemo | 20:31 | |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 20:31 | |
| DocScrutinizer | blabla | 20:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | wrap it into a lib, done you are | 20:31 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: i'd like to have notifications more granular than "something has changed in file X" | 20:31 |
| *** setanta has quit IRC | 20:31 | |
| DocScrutinizer | uhuh, why? | 20:31 |
| Scelt | frals: maybe then the image rescaling process isn't the real reason for mms sending to take so long | 20:32 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, afaik it *is* wrapped into a lib (at least I use it as a lib) | 20:32 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: so all your argument is that inotify+open+parsing xml file is faster than reading from a unix socket the changed setting? | 20:32 |
| GAN900 | WiFi is freaking useless. | 20:32 |
| frals | Scelt: no, its slow because in most cases it sets up a new gprs context and does a bunch of dns resolving | 20:32 |
| Venemo | GAN900: how so? | 20:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, my argument is against having a central PROCESS | 20:32 |
| *** marciom has quit IRC | 20:32 | |
| *** chenca has quit IRC | 20:32 | |
| Scelt | frals: I understand | 20:32 |
| *** juk has quit IRC | 20:32 | |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: it's a central process doing the parsing for many processes. | 20:33 |
| *** eMHa_ has quit IRC | 20:33 | |
| *** setanta has joined #maemo | 20:33 | |
| Scelt | frals: then I was wrong. sorry for wasting your time :P | 20:33 |
| javispedro | and caching, and notifications, and locking, ... | 20:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | the mustn't be bottlenecks when no need exists to implement them | 20:33 |
| frals | gprs context is something like 10 seconds, and if in havoc mode then dns is >30 secs usually | 20:33 |
| frals | Scelt: heh, no worries :) | 20:33 |
| *** florian has quit IRC | 20:33 | |
| Scelt | frals: why havoc takes over 30 secs? | 20:33 |
| frals | dns resolution and setting up routes | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | javispedro: great, so on a 16 core, how does friggin gconfd scale? | 20:34 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: you seem to like rewriting code every time, don't you? | 20:34 |
| Scelt | frals: okay | 20:34 |
| frals | Scelt: dont ask me why its that slow but it usually is on gprs | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | liori: you seem to ignore the concept of libs | 20:34 |
| GAN900 | Venemo, I've never used a WiFi device that approached anything resembling consistent reliability. | 20:34 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: as much as you want. | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | uhu, I see | 20:34 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: so give me a lib which has the same features I mentioned | 20:35 |
| Venemo | GAN900: hm, well the one in my laptop is okay, but the wi-fi in the N900 is quite unreliable indeed | 20:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | liori: so your point is, however shitty the concept of gconf, you'll use it just because it exists. Good point | 20:35 |
| Venemo | GAN900: fortunately, it works most of the time | 20:35 |
| Scelt | frals: yeah. I'm just thinking about S60 symbian mms sending and how fast it is compared to fmms. I know it's very different system but that's why I thought that image rescaling must be done some odd way but I guess it's just something more core that there is the difference | 20:35 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: no, we are telling: give us a sane alternate implementation. | 20:36 |
| *** slonopotamus has quit IRC | 20:36 | |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: yes, especially because its abstract api allows to change gconf internals... for example to make it faster; you're free to do so, it is open source | 20:36 |
| frals | Scelt: afaik its pretty darn slow there as well but it does it in the background after the user presses send | 20:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | liori: now you're getting completely silly | 20:36 |
| *** RevdKathy has quit IRC | 20:36 | |
| frals | Scelt: and it doesnt have to do the route shit since im pretty sure symbian can handle 2 networks | 20:36 |
| Scelt | frals: oh yes. it goes to "outbox" | 20:37 |
| Scelt | frals: then maybe fmms will have outbox feature too in the future :) | 20:37 |
| frals | Scelt: i doubt it ;) | 20:37 |
| *** vkvraju_ has quit IRC | 20:38 | |
| frals | Scelt: should be able to just switch application after pressing send ;) | 20:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | meh, fighting adopted nonsense always is a lost battle. I actually couldn't act more stupid than continuing this debate | 20:38 |
| Scelt | frals: that's true | 20:38 |
| visz | what the ef.. rim playbook netpad has a rear facing camera | 20:38 |
| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: just wait until you say "microkernels suck" =) | 20:39 |
| liori | DocScrutinizer: you could also make a completely new library with the same api as gconf, I'd be grateful | 20:39 |
| *** wazd has joined #maemo | 20:39 | |
| * DocScrutinizer shoots back with a HURD RULEZ | 20:39 | |
| javispedro | thank god :) | 20:40 |
| *** chenca has joined #maemo | 20:40 | |
| *** SWFu64 has joined #maemo | 20:42 | |
| DocScrutinizer | anyway, unix config files are plain text - first rule of OSI layer 11 | 20:42 |
| javispedro | lindi-: trying to get the entire story, seems that somewhere in early gconf history there was a fork where they implemented a sane dbus interface to the daemon. unfortunately, upstream went for the "corba over dbus" branch I just learn of its existence today. Maemo went with the dbus branch. | 20:43 |
| ShadowJK | hm, gconf bo longer stores stuff as plain text files? | 20:43 |
| javispedro | plain xml files =) | 20:43 |
| ShadowJK | ah | 20:43 |
| ShadowJK | it could be worse | 20:44 |
| *** vkvraju has joined #maemo | 20:44 | |
| ShadowJK | sqlite or something and we'd be waiting 10s for every bool true to bool false modification to be pushed out to emmc | 20:44 |
| Khertan | i prefer the qsetting api : | 20:45 |
| Khertan | :) | 20:45 |
| Venemo | Khertan: agreed | 20:45 |
| Khertan | previously i avoid gconf and use python configparser :) | 20:45 |
| *** timsamoff has quit IRC | 20:46 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has joined #maemo | 20:46 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | (10s) couldn't bother less. Who, when, why, and how often is going to do such change on a global config setting anyway | 20:46 |
| RST38h | And MOO to you all, dear geeks | 20:46 |
| Venemo | hey RST38h | 20:46 |
| javispedro | dear, dear. | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | dear deer | 20:47 |
| RST38h | javispedro: anything new and exciting (or horrible enough to be of notion)? | 20:47 |
| javispedro | not really | 20:47 |
| * timeless_pidgin is in cork ... | 20:49 | |
| *** ml-something has joined #maemo | 20:49 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: btw locking. F you got more than one process allowed to change same setting var, you quite surely did something wrong | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | If | 20:50 |
| Venemo | is there anyone here who lives in the USA? | 20:50 |
| * Khertan is waiting the new Diablo 2 ladder start | 20:50 | |
| *** wmarone has quit IRC | 20:50 | |
| *** timsamoff has joined #maemo | 20:51 | |
| * javispedro needs to go out | 20:51 | |
| javispedro | we'll continue the gconf flamewar latter =) | 20:51 |
| Venemo | I'd like to know if the new SGU episode is aired yet | 20:51 |
| vkvraju | Venemo: So, did U try installing MeeGo on Ur N900? | 20:51 |
| javispedro | *later | 20:51 |
| Venemo | vkvraju: I haven't... since it is my main phone, too, I would prefer a stable OS :) | 20:52 |
| *** timsamoff has quit IRC | 20:52 | |
| vkvraju | same here. But just was curious enough to give it a try | 20:52 |
| *** javispedro has quit IRC | 20:53 | |
| Venemo | vkvraju: I'm curious too, but I will resist temptation until it is declared to be stable | 20:54 |
| vkvraju | thats fine. | 20:54 |
| timeless_pidgin | Venemo: generally there are a few... | 20:54 |
| *** jreznik has quit IRC | 20:54 | |
| vkvraju | so, none here tried the latest meego image then :( | 20:55 |
| timeless_pidgin | Wouldn't that be #meego-n900 ? | 20:55 |
| ShadowJK | meego-arm maybe? | 20:55 |
| *** mece has joined #maemo | 20:55 | |
| Venemo | timeless_pidgin: there are a few what? | 20:55 |
| timeless_pidgin | Usa residents | 20:55 |
| *** achipa has joined #maemo | 20:56 | |
| *** achipa has joined #maemo | 20:56 | |
| vkvraju | no, that is meego-arm. But people seem to be damn busy over there. No one responded | 20:56 |
| timeless_pidgin | But why did you ask? | 20:56 |
| *** timsamoff has joined #maemo | 20:56 | |
| Venemo | X-Fade: ping | 20:57 |
| Venemo | ~seen X-Fade | 20:57 |
| vkvraju | I booted meego today but the screen went blank and never recovered back from that state | 20:57 |
| infobot | x-fade is currently on #maemo (1d 8h 29m 57s) #meego (1d 8h 29m 57s), last said: 'Morning'. | 20:57 |
| timeless_pidgin | Definitely #meego-arm ... | 20:57 |
| vkvraju | and people were reported succesful making and receiving calls and SMS's with this latest image | 20:57 |
| *** timsamoff has quit IRC | 20:58 | |
| Venemo | X-Fade: could you please help with this? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=63042 I'm also getting this issue | 20:58 |
| MohammadAG | someone take out the repository mirror from the topic | 20:58 |
| MohammadAG | it's dead | 20:58 |
| MohammadAG | X-Fade, you killed the repo | 21:01 |
| * MohammadAG kills X-Fade :P | 21:01 | |
| Venemo | ~burn X-Fade | 21:01 |
| * infobot pours gasoline all over X-Fade, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze | 21:01 | |
| vkvraju | ~seen Stskeeps | 21:02 |
| infobot | stskeeps is currently on #maemo (2d 11h 42m 12s) #meego (2d 11h 42m 12s). Has said a total of 99 messages. Is idling for 33m, last said: 'andre__: haxx0r'. | 21:02 |
| vkvraju | ~seen andre__ | 21:02 |
| infobot | andre__ is currently on #maemo (9h 46m 26s) #meego (9h 46m 26s). Has said a total of 12 messages. Is idling for 32m 50s, last said: 'Stskeeps, sorry, cannot resist to try default settings sometimes.'. | 21:02 |
| *** richieeee72 has joined #maemo | 21:04 | |
| *** eMHa_ has joined #maemo | 21:04 | |
| *** Adeon has left #maemo | 21:04 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has quit IRC | 21:06 | |
| *** richieeee72 has left #maemo | 21:07 | |
| *** temp has joined #maemo | 21:07 | |
| *** schend has joined #maemo | 21:07 | |
| *** Venemo has quit IRC | 21:07 | |
| *** dholbert has joined #maemo | 21:08 | |
| *** vkvraju has quit IRC | 21:08 | |
| *** PhonicUK has joined #maemo | 21:09 | |
| *** PhonicUK has joined #maemo | 21:09 | |
| *** githogori has joined #maemo | 21:09 | |
| *** sge has quit IRC | 21:09 | |
| *** tackat has quit IRC | 21:09 | |
| *** rblank has joined #maemo | 21:09 | |
| lindi- | josemartins: that explains why i did not find the code from debian | 21:11 |
| *** sge has joined #maemo | 21:11 | |
| *** Venemo has joined #maemo | 21:11 | |
| Venemo | re | 21:12 |
| Venemo | can I somehow persuade my charger to not make annoying noises? | 21:12 |
| kerio | give him a good spanking | 21:12 |
| dRbiG | akami does suck all the way | 21:13 |
| dRbiG | yhh | 21:13 |
| Venemo | kerio: lol | 21:13 |
| Venemo | :D | 21:13 |
| tobis87 | This doesn't look good: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle/free/binary-armel/Packages.gz | 21:14 |
| *** jrocha has joined #maemo | 21:14 | |
| dRbiG | tobis87: for some people it looks just right :) | 21:14 |
| *** digitalsurgeon has joined #maemo | 21:15 | |
| *** PhonicUK has quit IRC | 21:16 | |
| tobis87 | Did you try to open it in the browser? | 21:17 |
| dRbiG | tobis87: (it doesn't work at all for me here too) | 21:18 |
| RST38h | "Atheism is an effect of that knowledge, not a lack of knowledge. I gave a Bible to my daughter. That's how you make atheists." | 21:20 |
| RST38h | eeek. | 21:20 |
| *** trbs has joined #maemo | 21:21 | |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 21:23 | |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 21:24 | |
| *** _berto_ has quit IRC | 21:27 | |
| dRbiG | okey, where do the app manager keeps its sources list? | 21:28 |
| dRbiG | it seems i can't touch maemo.org repo in the gui | 21:28 |
| dRbiG | :S | 21:28 |
| dRbiG | crap! | 21:28 |
| tobis87 | dRbiG: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 21:29 |
| *** timeless_pidgin has joined #maemo | 21:30 | |
| tobis87 | Btw, there is no gnu version of awk availible? | 21:30 |
| timeless_pidgin | Ooh, cork airport has free wifi! | 21:31 |
| *** sergio has quit IRC | 21:31 | |
| *** dvaske has quit IRC | 21:31 | |
| tobis87 | Oh well, in the sdk repo... | 21:31 |
| SpeedEvil | At least that part of the world is not vulnerable to sea-level rise. | 21:31 |
| timeless_pidgin | Speedevil? Iirc there's a shortage of cork trees... | 21:32 |
| *** lsm5 has quit IRC | 21:34 | |
| dRbiG | hmm, i changed the path in the /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list but in the app manager i still se the old one with the error :S | 21:35 |
| timeless_pidgin | That file is generated | 21:35 |
| timeless_pidgin | You need to edit the original xml file... | 21:36 |
| dRbiG | and where is that? and what is the point of showing me repo details if i can't change them in the gui :/ | 21:36 |
| *** TomaszD_ is now known as TomaszD | 21:37 | |
| *** TomaszD has joined #maemo | 21:37 | |
| timeless_pidgin | You can edit most repos from the gui.. | 21:39 |
| timeless_pidgin | Iirc you can disable some of the others... | 21:40 |
| *** sge has quit IRC | 21:40 | |
| *** zommi has joined #maemo | 21:40 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Offhand, it sounds like you're missing something | 21:41 |
| timeless_pidgin | What repo is bothering you, and how. | 21:41 |
| dRbiG | the main maemo.org repo | 21:41 |
| *** sge has joined #maemo | 21:41 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 21:41 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 21:41 | |
| dRbiG | akami is broken and _here_ i don't have access to packages list etc. | 21:42 |
| *** SWFu64 has quit IRC | 21:42 | |
| dRbiG | timeless_pidgin: http://paste.org/pastebin/view/22936 this are the contents of http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/fremantle/free/binary-armel/Packages.gz | 21:43 |
| *** asedeno_work has quit IRC | 21:43 | |
| evilbulg1rian | hi, my n900 seems to get very sluggish after 3 days of uptime. can someone help me track what is cauzing this? | 21:43 |
| *** teilzeitstudent has joined #maemo | 21:44 | |
| kerio | evilbulg1rian: it's because you didn't reboot it in 3 days | 21:44 |
| lcuk | evilbulg1rian, record output of just afterbootup and then do same once you notice sluggishness | 21:44 |
| lcuk | then evaluate each app with extraudinary memory increases | 21:44 |
| mgedmin | output of what? | 21:45 |
| *** dholbert has quit IRC | 21:45 | |
| *** asedeno_work has joined #maemo | 21:45 | |
| *** florian has joined #maemo | 21:45 | |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 21:46 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 21:46 | |
| DocScrutinizer | ideally htop | 21:47 |
| evilbulg1rian | ok thanks | 21:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | seems difficult to redirect it to a file plaintext though | 21:47 |
| ShadowJK | the nokia guys talk about sp-endurance but I haven't looked at it | 21:48 |
| ShadowJK | btw, swap rollover slowdown is so noticeable for me I can usually tell exactly when it happens | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: hmm? | 21:49 |
| *** VDVsx has joined #maemo | 21:49 | |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, I was about to suggest a swap swap to evilbulgonerian | 21:49 |
| ShadowJK | some set of tools in the sdk tools repo for collecting long time memory use data | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah | 21:50 |
| kerio | swap swap? | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | top -n 1 >log.log | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: swapon $swap2; swapoff $swap1 | 21:50 |
| kerio | oh, i see | 21:50 |
| kerio | isn't swap a partition? | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | it is | 21:51 |
| kerio | oh, so you make a file, swapon it, swapoff the partition and then viceversa? | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | yup | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | takes some 3 minutes to complete, but really should do wonders | 21:51 |
| kerio | meh, i just reboot anyway | 21:52 |
| kerio | or rather, shutdown, change battery, boot | 21:52 |
| *** celesteh has joined #maemo | 21:52 | |
| *** celesteh has joined #maemo | 21:52 | |
| DocScrutinizer | hehehe | 21:52 |
| kerio | my usb port is still broken btw | 21:52 |
| kerio | can i file a bug for "The N900 doesn't repair itself"? | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | btw even though it's swap that causes the sluggish device after some days, for me it usually never reaches that state. Seems my swapping isn't that bad | 21:53 |
| *** mirr0r has quit IRC | 21:53 | |
| *** mirr0r has joined #maemo | 21:53 | |
| DocScrutinizer | got uptimes of >20days without noticing any problems in system performance | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | but then I'm rarely ever using any browser based applications | 21:54 |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 21:54 | |
| DocScrutinizer | also got no live wallpapers or other "funny" things, like twitter or skype | 21:54 |
| *** fab has quit IRC | 21:55 | |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has quit IRC | 21:55 | |
| *** jpinx has quit IRC | 21:56 | |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: the borg in it are infected by a virus telling them to rest | 21:58 |
| *** zs has quit IRC | 21:58 | |
| kerio | dammit | 21:59 |
| kerio | >.< | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: known bug, the borg never worked like expected, on N900 | 21:59 |
| *** lsm5 has joined #maemo | 21:59 | |
| *** celesteh has quit IRC | 22:01 | |
| *** tank-man has quit IRC | 22:02 | |
| DocScrutinizer | what's /usr/sbin/browserd -s 1443 -n RTComMessagingServer | 22:03 |
| *** jpinx has joined #maemo | 22:03 | |
| DocScrutinizer | it's using ~10% of my mem | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-S | 22:03 |
| *** jpinx-eeepc has joined #maemo | 22:03 | |
| kerio | huh... the messages? | 22:04 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 22:04 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Gah, ryanair is evil | 22:05 |
| timeless_pidgin | Not only do you have to check in online 4 hours in advance | 22:05 |
| timeless_pidgin | You actually have to *print* your boarding pass | 22:06 |
| kerio | nah, that's not true | 22:06 |
| kerio | you can carry the pdf on a cellphone or something | 22:06 |
| steinex | hmmmmm. how to add a preset to availability with e.g. busy and a custom text? | 22:06 |
| timeless_pidgin | No | 22:06 |
| kerio | they specifically require paper? | 22:06 |
| kerio | :( | 22:06 |
| kerio | poor trees | 22:06 |
| timeless_pidgin | As i'm not EU, they had to *stamp* my card as visa/passport checked | 22:07 |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 22:07 | |
| kerio | oh, you suck then | 22:07 |
| kerio | unless you're from switzerland | 22:07 |
| kerio | (and even then...) | 22:07 |
| jacekowski | you don't have to print it | 22:08 |
| timeless_pidgin | Thankfully the pdf was on my n900, so i scp'd it to a web server and used a kiosk for .20eu-ecent to download it. And someone else's .50eu-cent to print it | 22:08 |
| jacekowski | you can opt for airport check in | 22:08 |
| jacekowski | and then they print it | 22:08 |
| jacekowski | but it costs | 22:08 |
| timeless_pidgin | They charge 40 eur! | 22:08 |
| *** celesteh has joined #maemo | 22:08 | |
| dRbiG | hey, the point of ryan air is to be cheap, paper in mass quantities costs a lot | 22:08 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 22:09 | |
| dRbiG | not to mention toner/ink made of unicorn blood ;) | 22:09 |
| SpeedEvil | dRbiG: you mean they use ink that's cheaper than normal inkjet ink? | 22:10 |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 22:10 | |
| jacekowski | besides, where are you from? | 22:10 |
| visz | regular unicorn? | 22:11 |
| dRbiG | SpeedEvil: i mean that if you can run any company and limit the user of paper and printing technologies then you're going to save shitloads of money | 22:11 |
| jacekowski | dRbiG: point of ryanair is to make profit | 22:11 |
| jacekowski | dRbiG: they make profit on additional services | 22:12 |
| dRbiG | jacekowski: they also make profit cutting costs | 22:12 |
| timeless_pidgin | "additional" | 22:12 |
| timeless_pidgin | This is just an evil hidden fee | 22:12 |
| jacekowski | yeah, internet checkin is free | 22:12 |
| jacekowski | and most people are using internet check in | 22:12 |
| kerio | it's your fault for not being a EU citizen :) | 22:12 |
| timeless_pidgin | I *used* internet check in | 22:12 |
| kerio | EU is awesome | 22:12 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: where are you from? | 22:13 |
| RST38h | once again, avoid calling yourself "most people" | 22:13 |
| dRbiG | i mean, if you don't like printing your ticket then go for an airline that does that for you | 22:13 |
| timeless_pidgin | Kerio: you got me there. | 22:13 |
| *** Khertan has quit IRC | 22:13 | |
| kerio | RST38h: most people that fly ryanair *do* use internet checkin | 22:13 |
| kerio | because it's free :) | 22:13 |
| dRbiG | you'll pay more to get it printed by them, but it's your choice | 22:13 |
| timeless_pidgin | Not free here | 22:13 |
| *** Bash has quit IRC | 22:13 | |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: where are you from? | 22:13 |
| timeless_pidgin | It cost me .70eur | 22:13 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: you never answered that question | 22:14 |
| kerio | most people that fly ryanair are EU citizens | 22:14 |
| kerio | i mean, ryanair is european | 22:14 |
| timeless_pidgin | Jacekowksi: most people know the answer to that one... | 22:14 |
| kerio | hmm... 86.47.49.9... | 22:14 |
| jacekowski | well, i was thinking you live in IE | 22:14 |
| jacekowski | but IE is in EU | 22:14 |
| timeless_pidgin | Um, no | 22:14 |
| timeless_pidgin | I live in .fi | 22:15 |
| timeless_pidgin | I'm *currently* in .ie | 22:15 |
| kerio | your /whois says you're in ireland | 22:15 |
| kerio | yeah | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | but IE is in schengen | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | ehh | 22:15 |
| timeless_pidgin | And i'm flying to .uk | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | FI* | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | when and where? | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | and what for? | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | i'm in UK | 22:15 |
| timeless_pidgin | Oddly not everyone living in a country was born there... | 22:15 |
| jacekowski | and lcUK is n UK | 22:15 |
| dRbiG | huh, relying on /whois is a bad choice ;) | 22:15 |
| *** Bash has joined #maemo | 22:15 | |
| timeless_pidgin | I'm headed to liverpool for the weekend | 22:16 |
| *** jkyro has joined #maemo | 22:16 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Typically whois for timeless would say washington state iirc | 22:16 |
| timeless_pidgin | I've only been to SEA (airport) | 22:16 |
| * RST38h is probably in .8h, following the same principle | 22:16 | |
| kerio | whois for me says unaffiliated/kerio92 :) | 22:16 |
| timeless_pidgin | Oh, these days whois for timeless should probably say /mozilla something | 22:16 |
| kerio | timeless_pidgin: i wanted to ask you... why can't firefox just allow for codec plugins for <video>? | 22:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | Kerio it could | 22:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | But it's a terrible ide | 22:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | A | 22:17 |
| kerio | why? | 22:17 |
| timeless_pidgin | Are you familiar w/ codec malware? | 22:18 |
| kerio | rely on quicktime/directshow/gstreamer | 22:18 |
| kerio | even better, rely on vlc | 22:18 |
| timeless_pidgin | Grr | 22:18 |
| timeless_pidgin | Vlc is horribly crashy | 22:18 |
| timeless_pidgin | I'd sooner rely on cyanide | 22:18 |
| kerio | more than flash? | 22:18 |
| dRbiG | vlc? where? | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | http://www.google.com/m/search?client=ms-nokia-maemo&channel=unibox&q=codec+malware | 22:19 |
| kerio | also it never crashed here | 22:19 |
| kerio | timeless_pidgin: windows also has viruses | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | Kerio : you don't track plugin crashes for firefox / mozilla | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | I do | 22:19 |
| kerio | will you guys integrate a mandatory antivirus in gecko? | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | Please remember that | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | Kerio : we have support for system antivirus today | 22:19 |
| timeless_pidgin | And we have a default on antimalware / antiphishing system | 22:20 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: it's not so bad idea | 22:20 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: i mean, linux has something that can do trusted/secure computing | 22:20 |
| kerio | i just don't see why bother having your own video decoder | 22:20 |
| kerio | *why you bother | 22:20 |
| jacekowski | where program is limited to very small set of system calls | 22:20 |
| timeless_pidgin | You're missing key points | 22:20 |
| jacekowski | so if it would have like standard ABI | 22:21 |
| timeless_pidgin | Why not google a bit? | 22:21 |
| jacekowski | where it get's data in, data out | 22:21 |
| kerio | for "codec malware"? | 22:21 |
| kerio | yeah, i did | 22:21 |
| timeless_pidgin | http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roc/archives/2010/01/video_freedom_a.html | 22:21 |
| timeless_pidgin | http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roc/archives/2010/01/activex_all_ove.html | 22:21 |
| jacekowski | and it would run in sandbox that can't touch anything | 22:21 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: activex was normal app | 22:21 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: but if you would sandbox it | 22:22 |
| *** ioan has joined #maemo | 22:22 | |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: codec has no need for anything | 22:22 |
| jacekowski | data in, data out, some commands in | 22:22 |
| tobis87 | dRbiG: root -> echo "deb http://download.videolan.org/pub/videolan/maemo fremantle free" >> /etc/apt/sources.list; apt-get update && apt-get install vlc | 22:22 |
| jacekowski | if it tries to do anything else - kill it with fire | 22:23 |
| timeless_pidgin | Jacekowksi : the problem with codecs is the ability to have many codecs which all suck | 22:23 |
| kerio | jacekowski: or rather, kill it with 9 | 22:23 |
| timeless_pidgin | Instead of having one or two *standard* codecs which don't suck | 22:23 |
| timeless_pidgin | If each video provider can pick its own arcane codec | 22:24 |
| jacekowski | well, yeah, i was thinking more about CPU compatibility problem | 22:24 |
| kerio | i just hope firefox 4 is released soon so i can enable webm on youtube | 22:24 |
| timeless_pidgin | Then it can discriminate against all sorts of devices | 22:24 |
| derf | jacekowski: Codecs directly receive untrusted input. They are a _huge_ attack surface. | 22:24 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 22:24 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Oh, derf's here | 22:24 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_pidgin: if i was to diagnose a problem where javascript in mozilla/fennec is crashing so much that it doesn't want to start, which test cases would you recommend me to look into? | 22:24 |
| timeless_pidgin | I'll leave this with him:) | 22:24 |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 22:24 | |
| Stskeeps | timeless_pidgin: been stuck with this problem for five days now so :/ | 22:24 |
| jacekowski | derf: not if codec is sandboxed | 22:24 |
| *** andax has joined #maemo | 22:24 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Sandboxes are hackable | 22:25 |
| timeless_pidgin | Ask apple and google | 22:25 |
| kerio | sandboxing adds overhead | 22:25 |
| timeless_pidgin | Heck, ask vmware | 22:25 |
| kerio | *and* another attack vector | 22:25 |
| jacekowski | not really | 22:25 |
| jacekowski | i'm just saying sandbox as a general name | 22:25 |
| jacekowski | codec shouldn't call any system calls | 22:25 |
| kerio | so what happens when a buffer overflow lets an attacker run arbitrary code? | 22:25 |
| jacekowski | then he can do fuck all | 22:26 |
| *** josemartins has quit IRC | 22:26 | |
| jacekowski | codec can't call any syscalls | 22:26 |
| jacekowski | or very limited subset | 22:26 |
| jacekowski | like | 22:26 |
| *** josemartins has joined #maemo | 22:26 | |
| jacekowski | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seccomp | 22:26 |
| jacekowski | seccomp is a simple sandboxing mechanism for the Linux kernel. | 22:26 |
| jacekowski | It allows a process to make a one-way transition into a "secure" state where it cannot make any system calls except exit(), read() and write() to already-open file descriptors. Should it attempt any other system calls, the kernel will terminate the process. | 22:26 |
| timeless_pidgin | What happens if the codec sends bad data to the consumer process? | 22:27 |
| kerio | the consumer process goes "wtf are you sayin man" and kills the sandboxed codec? | 22:27 |
| timeless_pidgin | ... | 22:28 |
| *** teilzeitstudent_ has joined #maemo | 22:28 | |
| timeless_pidgin | You're assuming no bugs anywhere in the system | 22:28 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: what happens if you have one trusted codec | 22:28 |
| kerio | i just want youtube to not suck :( | 22:28 |
| timeless_pidgin | That isn't how codecs work | 22:28 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: and you open bad vide | 22:28 |
| *** _0x47 has joined #maemo | 22:28 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Jacekowksi fewer pieces of code to audit | 22:28 |
| jacekowski | video* | 22:28 |
| *** jacktheripper has joined #maemo | 22:28 | |
| jacekowski | you don't have to audit codec | 22:28 |
| jacekowski | codec is in safe sandbox | 22:29 |
| *** psycho_oreos has quit IRC | 22:29 | |
| jacekowski | whatever is it doing it can't do any harm | 22:29 |
| jacekowski | so you audit consumer proces instead | 22:29 |
| *** Khertan has joined #maemo | 22:31 | |
| derf | Keep in mind that read/write are _horrible_ ways to move uncompressed video between processes. | 22:31 |
| *** lolloo has quit IRC | 22:31 | |
| jacekowski | shm | 22:31 |
| jacekowski | loads of possible options | 22:31 |
| derf | You're asking for a lot of infrastructre that doesn't exist, is difficult to write and/or test, adds significant overhead to something that's already compute-bound, and _still_ doesn't solve the problem for most people. | 22:31 |
| derf | "Most people" being the 50% of the world that still runs XP. | 22:31 |
| *** teilzeitstudent has quit IRC | 22:32 | |
| jacekowski | i'm just proposing solution | 22:32 |
| jacekowski | it's not perfect one | 22:32 |
| timeless_pidgin | Not to mention the cost of yet another process | 22:32 |
| derf | Yes. Proposing solutions is easy. | 22:32 |
| jacekowski | but has advantage of not limiting user to one codec | 22:32 |
| timeless_pidgin | Using a simple thread is considerably cheaper | 22:32 |
| jacekowski | well, then you can use another thread | 22:33 |
| timeless_pidgin | How would you feel if you couldn't load video content? | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | Angry! | 22:33 |
| jacekowski | seccomp can sandbox one thread as well | 22:33 |
| timeless_pidgin | E.g. Flash10 video content on an n900 today | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | I would go and kill people! | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | brb, killing people. | 22:33 |
| timeless_pidgin | Allowing the web to have lots of codecs is *bad* _especially_ for minor platforms | 22:34 |
| SpeedEvil | mpeg1 | 22:34 |
| jacekowski | that would kinda suck | 22:34 |
| achipa | what do you mean "would" ? That's a "do" | 22:34 |
| SpeedEvil | Is all that is ever needed. | 22:34 |
| dRbiG | hmm, is there any cleaner way to set what stuff starts at the boot time than linking in /etc/rc.d ? | 22:34 |
| *** larsivi_ has joined #maemo | 22:34 | |
| andax | these 50% still are handled like a minority because more than 50% believes "newer = better" | 22:34 |
| achipa | (regarding flash10) | 22:34 |
| jacekowski | timeless_pidgin: but if you have very very simple abi then it's same binary that can run on different operating systems | 22:34 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 22:34 | |
| derf | jacekowski: Hahahaha. | 22:34 |
| kerio | some days i wonder... who thought flash was a good idea, seriously | 22:34 |
| jacekowski | with only problem being is different cpu | 22:34 |
| timeless_pidgin | Lemme give you a virus to go with that | 22:34 |
| achipa | only :) | 22:35 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: the portability problem can be solved by coding it in java. | 22:35 |
| achipa | kerio: why, macromedia/adobe, of course | 22:35 |
| jacekowski | java sucks | 22:35 |
| timeless_pidgin | Maybe a virus installer package which should in theory give you your codec | 22:35 |
| achipa | SpeedEvil: that's a 'hahaha' too :) | 22:35 |
| jacekowski | .net is better | 22:35 |
| derf | SpeedEvil: You mean like http://www.theora.org/cortado/ ? | 22:35 |
| achipa | Talk to some Java ME devs about portability, that stuff actually makes Symbian look good :) | 22:36 |
| timeless_pidgin | How about a nice .deb w/ a preinst file? | 22:36 |
| derf | SpeedEvil: http://img62.imageshack.us/i/bildschirmfoto1eh.png/ | 22:36 |
| *** tank-man has joined #maemo | 22:37 | |
| derf | It's actually pretty difficult to get something to run on a VM that old. | 22:37 |
| *** larsivi_ has quit IRC | 22:38 | |
| derf | Current javac output will not run correctly on a 1.1 VM. | 22:38 |
| *** andax_ has joined #maemo | 22:38 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 22:38 | |
| *** andax has quit IRC | 22:38 | |
| *** andax_ is now known as andax | 22:38 | |
| *** ghostcube has quit IRC | 22:38 | |
| achipa | for some reason all this stuff reminds me of http://www.gifsoup.com/view1/1180955/penalty-fail-o.gif | 22:39 |
| *** GNUton-BNC has joined #maemo | 22:40 | |
| *** marcels has quit IRC | 22:40 | |
| andax | did i already mention that "recent flash version seems to block some keyboard shortcuts..." (had a forced relog) | 22:41 |
| *** ioan has left #maemo | 22:41 | |
| *** slonopotamus has joined #maemo | 22:43 | |
| *** zommi has quit IRC | 22:43 | |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 22:45 | |
| * timeless_pidgin passes through airport security | 22:46 | |
| tobis87 | Could someone please check for me if there is a symlink called nawk to busybox in /usr/bin on the n900; i installed gawk from the sdk repo and it has overwriten the awk link to busybox, so I just want to make sure there are no missing links. | 22:47 |
| *** slonopotamus has quit IRC | 22:48 | |
| SpeedEvil | ls -l /usr/bin/*awk | 22:48 |
| SpeedEvil | lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 12 May 25 11:58 /usr/bin/awk -> /bin/busybox | 22:48 |
| tobis87 | Ok, thank you... | 22:49 |
| *** choppa has joined #maemo | 22:49 | |
| * ShadowJK is getting CMT resets | 22:49 | |
| DocScrutinizer | eeeeek | 22:49 |
| tobis87 | The default awk was good enough, so I removed it and then there was no awk left. | 22:50 |
| *** wazd has quit IRC | 22:51 | |
| dRbiG | hmm, is it possible somehow to get out of apt which packages have been installed? | 22:52 |
| Stskeeps | dpkg -l | 22:52 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:52 |
| *** t_s_o has joined #maemo | 22:52 | |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I'm 99.999% sure that my issues of that sort are SIM related. My SIM works sometimes. | 22:52 |
| ShadowJK | hm :/ | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | I need to phone the provider, and get a new ISM foolishly I called them last time on the affected SIM when it was working | 22:53 |
| dRbiG | Stskeeps: thx! | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | SIM | 22:53 |
| ShadowJK | maybe I should reseat the sim | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm waiting a couple of weeks | 22:53 |
| ShadowJK | I forget, is it behind battery? | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: rubbing it with a pencil rubber may help too | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 22:53 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 22:55 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 22:55 | |
| *** tank-man has quit IRC | 22:55 | |
| ShadowJK | arse | 22:57 |
| ShadowJK | it actually works a bit longer after going offline mode for a few minutes | 22:58 |
| *** dvoid_ has quit IRC | 22:59 | |
| *** msamour has joined #maemo | 22:59 | |
| msamour | hi guys | 22:59 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: "" | 23:00 |
| msamour | is anyone having the problem that the maemo.org repository | 23:00 |
| msamour | cant update? | 23:00 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: though moments sometimes work. | 23:00 |
| mgedmin | yeah, I gather the Packages file is corrupt again | 23:01 |
| *** chenca has quit IRC | 23:02 | |
| *** marciom_ has quit IRC | 23:02 | |
| *** lmoura_ has quit IRC | 23:02 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has quit IRC | 23:02 | |
| *** SmilybOrg has joined #maemo | 23:02 | |
| msamour | mgedmin: what file? | 23:02 |
| *** setanta has quit IRC | 23:03 | |
| mgedmin | for extras | 23:03 |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 23:03 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 23:03 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Msamour: implementation detail of how repositories work | 23:03 |
| msamour | is that on my phone or on the server? | 23:04 |
| timeless_pidgin | Basically one of the repositories has a broken index | 23:04 |
| * delt_zZzZ is now known as delt | 23:04 | |
| *** delt_zZzZ is now known as delt | 23:04 | |
| msamour | ok so is the server | 23:04 |
| timeless_pidgin | It'll be fixed (probably) the next time the index is rebuilt | 23:04 |
| delt | hello everyone | 23:04 |
| timeless_pidgin | Yeah, server | 23:04 |
| msamour | I was messing around with the source list and I thought I did something | 23:04 |
| msamour | timeless_pidgin, mgedmin thnks | 23:05 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 23:05 | |
| *** marciom_ has joined #maemo | 23:06 | |
| delt | ok.... so someone here yesterday mentioned that "maemo 5 'kind of' runs on n810 but its buggy" is "distorting the facts" | 23:06 |
| *** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Skype is INCLUDED in the N900. Unless you live in India, that is. | Also this is #maemo, NOT #nitdroid *** extras repository is temporarily defect, causing errors on update ***" | 23:06 | |
| delt | may i ask, in which way? | 23:06 |
| timeless_pidgin | The error message is unfortunate, i should try to improve my version... | 23:06 |
| *** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Skype is INCLUDED in the N900. Unless you live in India, that is. | Also this is #maemo, NOT #nitdroid | *** extras repository is temporarily defect, causing errors on update ***" | 23:06 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 23:06 | |
| *** lmoura_ has joined #maemo | 23:07 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Docscrutinizer : s/defect/broken/ | 23:07 |
| *** setanta has joined #maemo | 23:07 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 23:07 | |
| *** geaaru has joined #maemo | 23:07 | |
| *** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Skype is INCLUDED in the N900. Unless you live in India, that is. | Also this is #maemo, NOT #nitdroid | *** extras repository is temporarily broken, causing errors on update ***" | 23:07 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 23:07 | |
| *** geaaru has quit IRC | 23:07 | |
| timeless_pidgin | :) | 23:08 |
| delt | india has an anti-skype policy, or what....? | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | please ping me when it's fixed | 23:08 |
| *** geaaru has joined #maemo | 23:08 | |
| *** larsivi has quit IRC | 23:08 | |
| *** larsivi has joined #maemo | 23:08 | |
| delt | ok.... so someone here yesterday mentioned that "maemo 5 'kind of' runs on n810 but its buggy" is "distorting the facts" | 23:08 |
| delt | may i ask, in which way? | 23:08 |
| timeless_pidgin | Delt: there's probably a talk thread about it | 23:08 |
| *** ArGGu^^ has quit IRC | 23:09 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Delt: i'd suggest reading the logs and then directing your question to the someone | 23:09 |
| *** ArGGu^^ has joined #maemo | 23:09 | |
| delt | timeless_pidgin: well, who is the "someone" in particular isn't really relevant | 23:09 |
| *** drizztbsd_ has joined #maemo | 23:09 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Right, so of the .uk people, anyone in/around Liverpool? | 23:10 |
| timeless_pidgin | I'll be there by 11pm today through sometime Sunday. .. | 23:10 |
| delt | i just wanted to ask: what's the most recent STABLE (and overall recommended) version of maemo i should install on the n810? | 23:10 |
| *** drizztbsd has quit IRC | 23:10 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 23:10 | |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 23:10 | |
| timeless_pidgin | I personally would just use the last diablo build (probably the internal unshipped one...). And install a decent web browser | 23:11 |
| delt | (doing a search for that on the web will probably give me results that date from 2007) | 23:11 |
| timeless_pidgin | Probably the last Fennec that worked on Diablo | 23:11 |
| *** lardman has joined #maemo | 23:12 | |
| timeless_pidgin | * this isn't the last fennec build for diablo, the last couple didn't work :o | 23:12 |
| *** mirr0r has quit IRC | 23:12 | |
| timeless_pidgin | (someone used an updated toolchain in a *bad* way) | 23:12 |
| *** mirr0r has joined #maemo | 23:12 | |
| *** b0tz has quit IRC | 23:12 | |
| *** nox- has joined #maemo | 23:13 | |
| delt | heya nox- | 23:13 |
| *** ohwhyme has joined #maemo | 23:13 | |
| *** tank-man has joined #maemo | 23:14 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Some images can be run from an sd card, so you could try before you commit | 23:14 |
| delt | could if i had an sd card | 23:14 |
| timeless_pidgin | That said, for this trip I'm using a single n900 | 23:14 |
| timeless_pidgin | I actually bought a 2gb micro sd card for about 15gbp earlier on this trip | 23:14 |
| lardman | RST38h: you about? | 23:15 |
| timeless_pidgin | It didn't have a mini adapter, but... | 23:15 |
| lardman | evening all btw | 23:15 |
| nox- | moin delt, # | 23:15 |
| *** Finnish has quit IRC | 23:15 | |
| *** drizztbsd has joined #maemo | 23:15 | |
| *** drizztbsd_ has quit IRC | 23:16 | |
| delt | nox-: what would be the latest/stable/recommended version of maemo for n810 as of recently? | 23:16 |
| *** dos1 has quit IRC | 23:16 | |
| delt | and if RTFM, how would one go about finding out that information? =) | 23:17 |
| mgedmin | delt, http://tablets-dev.nokia.com | 23:17 |
| mgedmin | hmm | 23:17 |
| mgedmin | yes, look under Maemo releases | 23:18 |
| mgedmin | for the N810 | 23:18 |
| *** ohwhyme has quit IRC | 23:18 | |
| *** chenca has joined #maemo | 23:18 | |
| delt | ah thanks | 23:19 |
| mgedmin | you can find the product ID in the control panel (About Device), no need to turn it off and look under the battery | 23:20 |
| *** b0tz has joined #maemo | 23:20 | |
| * nox- just found a workaround for the less return key problem: -no-keypad :) | 23:20 | |
| mgedmin | oh, it actually says so, if I read the text instead of looking at the picture/checklist | 23:20 |
| delt | uh.... no need to... remove batterwhat? | 23:20 |
| * mgedmin is talking about http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N810.php | 23:20 | |
| * timeless_pidgin makes partial plans for liverpool :) | 23:20 | |
| *** norayr has joined #maemo | 23:20 | |
| *** setanta has quit IRC | 23:21 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Nox: ctrl-j? | 23:21 |
| delt | oh ok... misread at first ... right now its easier for me to look under the battery =) | 23:21 |
| *** lmoura_ has quit IRC | 23:22 | |
| *** Khertan has quit IRC | 23:22 | |
| nox- | timeless_pidgin, that works too but an alias for less is better i think... | 23:22 |
| delt | product id, that would be something like RX-44 ...? | 23:22 |
| delt | says model: n810, type: RX-44 | 23:22 |
| *** marciom_ has quit IRC | 23:23 | |
| *** chenca has quit IRC | 23:23 | |
| nox- | timeless_pidgin, and i also found a statusbar `applet' to turn repeat on/off for `regular' keys... :) | 23:23 |
| *** PhonicUK has joined #maemo | 23:23 | |
| *** MadViking has quit IRC | 23:24 | |
| *** Khertan has joined #maemo | 23:24 | |
| nox- | timeless_pidgin, so now i can eg scroll by holding down return (or j ofc) | 23:24 |
| timeless_pidgin | Is this n900? | 23:25 |
| nox- | yep | 23:25 |
| nox- | alias less='less -no-keypad' | 23:25 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has joined #maemo | 23:26 | |
| * timeless_pidgin updates fennec for the first time in over two weeks | 23:26 | |
| nox- | oh is there an update out for that? | 23:26 |
| timeless_pidgin | There's a nightly repository | 23:26 |
| delt | oh ok... the site asks me for the wlan mac-address | 23:26 |
| timeless_pidgin | You can update every day :) | 23:26 |
| nox- | ah ok | 23:26 |
| delt | mgedmin: is that what you meant by product ID? | 23:27 |
| nox- | link? :) | 23:27 |
| mgedmin | delt, that page tells you everything | 23:27 |
| nox- | and are the nightlies stable `enough'? | 23:27 |
| timeless_pidgin | Delt: that's the thing under the battery or in the control panel | 23:27 |
| mgedmin | WLAN MAC is used as the product code for the N810 | 23:27 |
| timeless_pidgin | Nox: i can't recall having problems with them... | 23:27 |
| *** ClaesBas has quit IRC | 23:27 | |
| mgedmin | s/product code/product id/ | 23:27 |
| infobot | mgedmin meant: WLAN MAC is used as the product id for the N810 | 23:27 |
| *** lolloo has joined #maemo | 23:27 | |
| mgedmin | thank you, infobot | 23:27 |
| nox- | hm that sound encouraging, do you happen to have the link? | 23:27 |
| nox- | timeless_pidgin | 23:28 |
| timeless_pidgin | Unique device id :) | 23:28 |
| *** kthomas_vh has quit IRC | 23:28 | |
| timeless_pidgin | Um, not offhand, the install file is definitely somewhere | 23:28 |
| delt | ok got it thanks | 23:28 |
| timeless_pidgin | Try mfinkle's blog or blassey or ask sp3000? | 23:29 |
| timeless_pidgin | My flight should be boarding now... | 23:29 |
| *** gomiam has joined #maemo | 23:30 | |
| *** kthomas has joined #maemo | 23:32 | |
| *** kW_ has joined #maemo | 23:32 | |
| delt | (assuming those "o" looking characters are zeroes.... cant copy/paste from a sticker heh) | 23:32 |
| delt | "can't grep dead trees" =) | 23:33 |
| *** kthomas_vh_ has quit IRC | 23:34 | |
| mgedmin | yes, they're zeros | 23:35 |
| mgedmin | it's a hex number, so just 0...9 A...F | 23:35 |
| Mousey | [0-9a-fA-F] | 23:35 |
| lolloo | Hello. how do I know through my N900 someone connected to my phone? | 23:36 |
| delt | oh duh *slaps forehead* .... so a 124mb .bin file, does that sound like what im looking for? | 23:37 |
| delt | i'd guess at least its for the right device, seeing that the filename starts with rx-44 | 23:37 |
| *** jacktheripper has quit IRC | 23:37 | |
| nox- | timeless_pidgin, godspeed :) (or do you say something else to someone going to fly?) | 23:39 |
| *** jd has quit IRC | 23:39 | |
| *** marciom has joined #maemo | 23:41 | |
| * ShadowJK wishes cmt would say why it's raising rst | 23:41 | |
| *** lmoura has joined #maemo | 23:42 | |
| *** timeless_pidgin has quit IRC | 23:43 | |
| *** Venemo has left #maemo | 23:44 | |
| *** VDVsx has quit IRC | 23:44 | |
| dRbiG | errm.. is there any shell trick command to rebuild the menu? | 23:45 |
| dRbiG | i uninstalled mymenu or sth like that and now i have like 14 icons ;) | 23:45 |
| dRbiG | oh great, shortcuts now don't work too | 23:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: talk to jacekowski - he might know about debugging implemented somehow in cellmo | 23:46 |
| *** jacktheripper has joined #maemo | 23:47 | |
| *** marciom has quit IRC | 23:47 | |
| *** lmoura has quit IRC | 23:47 | |
| *** jd has joined #maemo | 23:48 | |
| *** fecub has joined #maemo | 23:48 | |
| *** carloscesa has quit IRC | 23:48 | |
| *** Flipi is now known as Flipi|BNC | 23:48 | |
| *** fecub has quit IRC | 23:49 | |
| *** msanchez has quit IRC | 23:49 | |
| *** TeringTuby has joined #maemo | 23:50 | |
| *** teilzeitstudent_ has quit IRC | 23:50 | |
| *** schend has quit IRC | 23:51 | |
| *** lmoura has joined #maemo | 23:51 | |
| lolloo | how can I check if someone conneted to my N900 with SSH? | 23:52 |
| *** lizardo has quit IRC | 23:52 | |
| *** _trine has quit IRC | 23:52 | |
| delt | Flashed it. THERE!! SUCCESS!!!!@#%**&%( | 23:52 |
| dRbiG | yhh | 23:53 |
| *** lolloo has quit IRC | 23:53 | |
| MohammadAG | I got one weird error today | 23:54 |
| *** superchode has quit IRC | 23:54 | |
| MohammadAG | All telephony functions, including emergency errors, are disabled, you might have to reboot your device to recover | 23:55 |
| MohammadAG | or something along the lines of that | 23:55 |
| dRbiG | mhm, and i have now nothing in the menu for launching apps | 23:55 |
| dRbiG | great | 23:55 |
| *** marciom has joined #maemo | 23:55 | |
| MohammadAG | osso-connectivity-ui.mo:All telephony functions, including emergency calls, are disabled due to a communication error. To recover, you might have to reboot the device. | 23:55 |
| lardman | mohammadAG: nice :) | 23:56 |
| MohammadAG | why did I say emergency errors | 23:56 |
| * MohammadAG realizes he's a bit tired | 23:56 | |
| *** _trine has joined #maemo | 23:56 | |
| delt | damn, battery was almost empty when i flashed the new firmware!! ....charging now | 23:56 |
| *** marciom has quit IRC | 23:57 | |
| DocScrutinizer | nox-: I'd prefer to fix the F***NG broken CR key mapping on maemo, rather than to find a workarounf for each and every command that doesn't like NK-ENTER instead of CR | 23:57 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
