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| GAN900 | Did we ever get an answer about where the Maemo awards money went for Calling All Innovators? | 00:24 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 00:24 |
| SpeedEvil | I forgot it thogh | 00:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Someone mentioned it last night I think | 00:24 |
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| markinfo | I have nokia n810, Diablo system. I would like to try to programming a bit. What should I download? Probably some SDK. this one? http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation | 00:56 |
| markinfo | on my Linux desktop. | 00:56 |
| SpeedEvil | maemo 5 is n900 only | 00:56 |
| SpeedEvil | so no | 00:56 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't know about the 810 | 00:56 |
| markinfo | but there is no: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_4_Final_SDK_Installation | 00:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | I don't know where it mght be, I do know that maemo 5 does not run on the n900, so that's unlikely to be helpful | 00:57 |
| SpeedEvil | It's unusually quiet tonight. | 00:58 |
| lcuk | *does not run on the N810 | 00:58 |
| SpeedEvil | err | 00:58 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 00:58 |
| SpeedEvil | that | 00:58 |
| lcuk | Maemo 5 runs extremely well on the N900 :D | 00:58 |
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| markinfo | maybe hier? http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo-4-1-diablo-sdk/ | 00:59 |
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| lcuk | markinfo, that sounds about right | 00:59 |
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| sandstorm|mobile | is it normal that xorg constantly uses average 6% cpu? | 01:55 |
| e-yes | This is to inform you that you have won £500,000.00 GBP in Nokia Online Lottery. Kindly contact us at office001@computermail.net for claims with the following information below; Full names, Address, Phone number, Age, Sex, Marital status, Occupation. | 01:55 |
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| FauxFaux | Half a million? You should probably adjust your ammounts for real currencies. | 01:56 |
| sandstorm|mobile | and also gbps what a prize | 01:56 |
| kfx | crap I only have one full name I'm not qualified | 01:57 |
| FauxFaux | Haha. | 01:57 |
| FauxFaux | Also, my marital status would probably get me arrested. | 01:57 |
| sandstorm|mobile | does xorg use 6 ,ercent of cpu in average? | 01:58 |
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| SpeedEvil | sandstorm|mobile: when active - it's not unexpected. | 02:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Some large portion of an apps drawing on screen is really done by X | 02:02 |
| SpeedEvil | If it's using thatr wehn blanked, ten it's a bug | 02:03 |
| sandstorm|mobile | only way I can understand that is to ssh while blanked right? | 02:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | yes | 02:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Generally doing anything on the device while trying to work out performance is fail. | 02:06 |
| SpeedEvil | htop is also probably more useful than the crippled top | 02:07 |
| sandstorm|mobile | ah I was using conky but I got htop as well thanks for the advice | 02:08 |
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| sandstorm|mobile | btw catorize removal made a huge difference on battery life | 02:11 |
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| kwtm | sandstorm|mobile: Wait, what? Catorize uses batteries? (or catorize saves batteries?) How? It's just software that runs when you try to use the launcher, no? | 02:13 |
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| sivang | hi all | 03:01 |
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| sivang | has the sms blocking option been added to pycallblocker or added somewhere? | 03:02 |
| sivang | else | 03:02 |
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| * sivang asks before trying to implement this himself. | 03:02 | |
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| DocScrutinizer | the notorious HDM scrolling/bouncing bug | 04:27 |
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| delt | gaahhh.... my n810 is bricked until i get a usb cord or adapter :( | 05:32 |
| delt | (why did they change from the good old standard mini usb connectors!???!?) | 05:32 |
| delt | like, wtf was wrong with those??? | 05:33 |
| kfx | your n810 came with a microusb cord | 05:33 |
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| dakilla | hi guys i kno this is a channel about maemo | 07:27 |
| dakilla | but i hav a n79 and i wanted to change the language pack on it | 07:28 |
| dakilla | its rm-350 | 07:28 |
| dakilla | and all the lang packs i found had rm-348 =/ | 07:28 |
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| Stskeeps | we don't know anything about symbian, sorry | 07:28 |
| psycho_oreos | there's symbian forum and websites dedicated to symbian | 07:28 |
| psycho_oreos | hint: firmware | 07:29 |
| dakilla | im trying to find some symbian ircs | 07:29 |
| dakilla | hey guys one more question | 07:31 |
| dakilla | do any of u hav the n900 | 07:31 |
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| *** user_ is now known as fredrinN900 | 07:32 | |
| psycho_oreos | I think you'll find there will be some/fair few n900 users :p | 07:33 |
| psycho_oreos | << has one | 07:33 |
| luke-jr | dakilla: … this is #maemo ; almost everyone has N900 :p | 07:33 |
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| dakilla | haha well i hav one | 07:34 |
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| dakilla | and i was wondering what is ur avg battery life | 07:34 |
| dakilla | cuz mine dies in like 8 hours | 07:34 |
| dakilla | 12 hours with very light useage | 07:34 |
| luke-jr | 8 hours is pretty long if it's online the whole time | 07:35 |
| fredrinN900 | nah | 07:35 |
| luke-jr | I think mine would last a week in Offline Mode | 07:35 |
| dakilla | lol | 07:35 |
| fredrinN900 | 24 hours | 07:35 |
| dakilla | i usually disconnect it from the internet and put it on 2g | 07:35 |
| luke-jr | about 4 hours if I've got it connected | 07:35 |
| luke-jr | fredrinN900: definitely moer than 24 hours | 07:36 |
| fredrinN900 | mine does that | 07:36 |
| luke-jr | fredrinN900: before I had a SIM card, I left it off the charger a few days | 07:36 |
| luke-jr | only got down to maybe 50% | 07:36 |
| fredrinN900 | k | 07:36 |
| dakilla | whaat cool things are there to do with the n900 | 07:36 |
| dakilla | i got transmission the bittorrent client | 07:37 |
| fredrinN900 | chat | 07:37 |
| luke-jr | … | 07:37 |
| Termana | You can throw it around the room | 07:37 |
| dakilla | haha its a damn brick | 07:37 |
| Termana | That's a fun thing to do with the N900 | 07:37 |
| dakilla | im afraid i might break some necks | 07:37 |
| psycho_oreos | throw it around the room if you are rich :p | 07:37 |
| luke-jr | dakilla: there's a game based on it! | 07:37 |
| luke-jr | N900fly IIRC | 07:37 |
| dakilla | which? i htink i hav it | 07:37 |
| fredrinN900 | play music over fm radio | 07:37 |
| luke-jr | score is based on how high you toss your N900 | 07:38 |
| dakilla | widelands? | 07:38 |
| luke-jr | it makes on OK flashlight | 07:38 |
| luke-jr | good for taking photos | 07:38 |
| luke-jr | just a few touches and it's on Facebook! | 07:38 |
| luke-jr | :p | 07:38 |
| psycho_oreos | do wireless pentesting on n900, do augmented reality, jailbreak ps3, etc etc | 07:38 |
| dakilla | what is wireless pentesting | 07:39 |
| visz | wardriving | 07:39 |
| dakilla | bout to google that | 07:39 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: none of that is actually possible tho | 07:39 |
| fredrinN900 | no clothes | 07:39 |
| luke-jr | visz: that's not possible right now either… | 07:39 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, quite the irony | 07:39 |
| * luke-jr uses his N810 for wardriving | 07:39 | |
| visz | it should be | 07:39 |
| * luke-jr ponders if he can get N810 and N900 to work together for even better wardriving experience | 07:39 | |
| visz | with power kernel | 07:40 |
| psycho_oreos | I've warbussed, wartrained, wardriven and warwalked with both me n95-1 as well as n900 | 07:40 |
| luke-jr | visz: no, GPS on N900 is basically not useful | 07:40 |
| psycho_oreos | there's kismet and aircrack-ng suite | 07:40 |
| dakilla | i wanna learn to use that aircrack tool | 07:40 |
| psycho_oreos | but its not like you can't war* stuff with it | 07:40 |
| dakilla | any1 kno of any good tuts | 07:40 |
| * fredrinN900 uses it for email, video recording, play music, chat all at the same time | 07:40 | |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: kismet supports Qt's crazy gpsd replacement? | 07:40 |
| visz | well it did lose the signal quite a lot last summer, when i was wardriving through germany and france | 07:40 |
| * dakilla uses it for music, email, and CALLS | 07:40 | |
| fredrinN900 | and sms | 07:41 |
| fredrinN900 | good at that | 07:41 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, I dunno, there's a person who ported kismet to n900 and uses /lib/ something | 07:41 |
| psycho_oreos | /lib/location | 07:41 |
| luke-jr | liblocation | 07:41 |
| fredrinN900 | sms/chat i dont know the difference any longer | 07:41 |
| luke-jr | oh well, N810 probably still does it better <.< | 07:41 |
| psycho_oreos | I use it for chatting/sms as well as music player, etc | 07:41 |
| luke-jr | maybe I should feed N900 GPS info to N810-2.6 | 07:41 |
| dakilla | which one has better processor n810 or n900 | 07:41 |
| luke-jr | then I can get PPI | 07:41 |
| luke-jr | dakilla: obviously N900 | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | 9 | 07:42 |
| dakilla | lol | 07:42 |
| dakilla | sorry | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | dah | 07:42 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: any idea if N900 has PPI? | 07:42 |
| dakilla | i hate the ovi maps | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | ppi? | 07:42 |
| dakilla | the navigation is USELESS | 07:42 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, no.. I dunno wtf is PPI to begin with | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | sucks | 07:42 |
| luke-jr | per-packet-info | 07:42 |
| luke-jr | signal strength on a per-packet basis | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | why cant we have tangogps? | 07:42 |
| fredrinN900 | worked nicely on freerunner | 07:42 |
| luke-jr | wtf is tangogps | 07:43 |
| psycho_oreos | that might be possible with kismet.. but that feature is highly dependent on the driver anyway.. in which this case is wl1251 | 07:43 |
| fredrinN900 | nice gps software | 07:43 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: exactly my question | 07:43 |
| dakilla | i want some garmin on the n900 | 07:43 |
| fredrinN900 | 07:43 | |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: kismet can't generate maps without PPI | 07:43 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, it won't be able to generate it without GPS support as well :p | 07:43 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: so? | 07:44 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: you just said someone ported it to liblocation | 07:44 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, point, it requires both and cannot live solely on PPI | 07:44 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, no I said some person ported kismet to n900 and uses /lib/location.. I didn't say someone ported it to liblocation | 07:44 |
| luke-jr | N810 can do PPI on a recent Linux, but not GPS | 07:45 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: there is no such thing as /lib/location | 07:45 |
| luke-jr | and it makes no sense to use liblocation and not port to it | 07:45 |
| fredrinN900 | jeje, nait | 07:45 |
| delt | 22:33 < kfx> your n810 came with a microusb cord | 07:45 |
| delt | maybe to the original owner, yeah it certainly did | 07:45 |
| luke-jr | heh | 07:45 |
| fredrinN900 | 0645 about time to get sleep | 07:45 |
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| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, I stand corrected but that's still GPS functionality no? | 07:46 |
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| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: what exactly are you asking? | 07:46 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, I'm not asking anything I'm saying that kismet does not solely depend on PPI, afaik with GPS it can plot out APs on the map, I didn't know that PPI was also a factor that needs to be considered :p | 07:47 |
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| delt | n810, any startup keys to see the boot loader status, or kernel startup....> | 07:47 |
| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: kismet requires a lot of things obviously | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | like a CPU | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | wireless radio | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | Monitor mode | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | GPS | 07:48 |
| delt | maintenance | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | and PPI | 07:48 |
| luke-jr | delt: with Maemo? doubt it | 07:48 |
| delt | jk | 07:48 |
| psycho_oreos | luke-jr, then again PPI is more or less an integral feature for wl1251 which is already standard on linux kernel | 07:49 |
| psycho_oreos | and the rest of the other information I did not need to know about.. GPS is optional but is handy :p CPU is obvious | 07:50 |
| luke-jr | GPS is obvious, too | 07:50 |
| luke-jr | and required for the discussed function (mapping | 07:50 |
| psycho_oreos | wireless radio comes with wireless chipset or chipset would not have any radio activity | 07:50 |
| psycho_oreos | monitor mode depends on the wl1251 driver | 07:50 |
| psycho_oreos | etc | 07:50 |
| psycho_oreos | etc | 07:50 |
| psycho_oreos | again, its not a necessity, kismet won't roll over and die if GPS isn't available like it used to when GPS was explicitly enabled but GPSd was not found | 07:51 |
| * luke-jr wonders if there's any tool to post-process a GPX log and tcpdump to yield maps | 07:52 | |
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| lolloo | is the an online game on N900? | 07:55 |
| lolloo | is there one? | 07:55 |
| lolloo | game of cards multiplayer? | 07:56 |
| lolloo | online multiplayer? | 07:56 |
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| Appiah | Well there's Quake right? | 07:58 |
| Appiah | and Teeworlds? | 07:58 |
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| RST38h | "The dead mice were laced with a common pain reliever about one quarter of a childs dose of acetaminophen each and dropped Wednesday from a helicopter into the jungle canopy around Naval Base Guam..." | 08:00 |
| RST38h | ...and good morning to you all. | 08:00 |
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| luke-jr | psycho_oreos: I don't think N900 kernel supports PPI | 08:02 |
| luke-jr | ☹ | 08:02 |
| slonopotamus | (n900 fonts do not have that symbol) | 08:03 |
| slonopotamus | morning, slackers | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | slonopotamus: report it for PR 1.3 | 08:03 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr: hell, they didn't fix missing caret symbol in russian layout that i reported against PR0. | 08:04 |
| slonopotamus | and that's much worse issue | 08:04 |
| RST38h | slono: that can fortunately be fixed at home | 08:04 |
| * RST38h even got a working cyrillic layout for a EURO1 N900 | 08:04 | |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr: btw, why you're not pingable in #gentoo-embedded? :P | 08:04 |
| luke-jr | slonopotamus: ? | 08:05 |
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| * luke-jr really would like to try GPX+pcap :/ | 08:05 | |
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| pigeon | can you tell the maemo sdk gui installation script not to redownload *.deb? | 08:08 |
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| lolloo | is there a card game for N900 to play with you guys online? | 08:38 |
| Termana | lolloo, Texas Hold Em has a multiplayer online mode IIRC | 08:43 |
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| lolloo | awesome | 09:00 |
| lolloo | but is there any card games for N900? | 09:01 |
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| Termana | lolloo, like I said, Texas Hold Em. Look it up in the repos. Unless you suck your finger, then no we don't have Go Fish. | 09:12 |
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| lolloo | but I have and did that a while ago! | 09:14 |
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| Phrearch | morning | 09:58 |
| Phrearch | im trying to setup my n900 as hotspot with mhs. somehow the webkey doesnt validate on my laptop. any idea what could be wromg with it? | 10:00 |
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| Phrearch | i cheched the obvious stuff like wep and key settings. all seem to be correct | 10:00 |
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| crashanddie | morning #maemo | 10:10 |
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| lcuk | morning crashanddie, #maemo o/ | 10:18 |
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| MNZ | morning lcuk crashanddie #maemo o/ | 10:21 |
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| * lcuk woke with headache | 10:24 | |
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| lcuk | mnz, how is the hacking on hw-eq going | 10:27 |
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| just_testing | FYI. Just testing connection to this IRC channel. No response required. | 10:29 |
| crashanddie | just_testing, how 'bout you piss off then? | 10:29 |
| * Termana doesn't respond | 10:29 | |
| MNZ | lcuk, that has kinda taken the back burner as I'm dreading doing a GUI :S In the meantime I'm doing some light hacking on PA/alsa/mafw | 10:30 |
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| lcuk | mnz cool, light hacking is always good | 10:31 |
| lcuk | theres a lot of interest in pa | 10:31 |
| MNZ | lcuk, my main interest in PA is replacing of it >.> | 10:32 |
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| MNZ | but really some brave soul just step up and do the UI for the EQ | 10:32 |
| kerio | \o/ | 10:32 |
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| kerio | less eq, more killall pulseaudiod | 10:33 |
| MNZ | kerio, I seriously wish it was that easy :/ | 10:33 |
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| MNZ | there's a whooole bunch of policy management with dbus signals flying around all over the place, moving that alone out of PA would take quite some work without any sources. | 10:34 |
| lcuk | just what is wrong with PA | 10:34 |
| kerio | it's a useless cpu hog | 10:35 |
| kerio | if you need more cpu to output audio than to decode an mp3, you're doing it wrong | 10:35 |
| lcuk | you are a useless irc hog, but at least some of it has to be required | 10:35 |
| lcuk | has anyone done analysis of just what part is wasteful | 10:36 |
| MNZ | TBH though, the savings of bypassing PA are about 2 hours only and it wouldn't be THAT much once you add in the required mixing and possible resampling in some cases | 10:36 |
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| MNZ | that's 2h of mp3 playback | 10:36 |
| kerio | MNZ: you don't get it | 10:37 |
| kerio | it's not about battery | 10:37 |
| kerio | it's about the fact that pulseaudio hogs the damn cpu | 10:37 |
| kerio | you know | 10:37 |
| kerio | the thing that lets you do stuff | 10:37 |
| mece | MohammadAG51, Wow, someone other than you got host mode working! Things are looking up :D:D:D | 10:37 |
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| MNZ | kerio, eh well anyhow I'm still messing around with it, but the more I uncover the less fun it becomes D: | 10:38 |
| kerio | i'm not sure the nokia things will ever work fine without pa | 10:38 |
| MNZ | just the other day DocScrutinizer pointed me at alsaped, a nokia daemon to do a whole bunch of alsa control management depending on dbus signals from PA | 10:39 |
| lcuk | kerio is it hogging the cpu at lowspeed? | 10:39 |
| lcuk | do we just notice it more because it hasnt moved to next speed band | 10:39 |
| lcuk | or is Xpercent at fastest speed | 10:40 |
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| kerio | lcuk: the browser is noticeably slower | 10:40 |
| kerio | not sure what's the reason | 10:40 |
| MNZ | lcuk, I haven't actually checked that but there's a very distinct ~10mAh drain because of PA | 10:42 |
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| lcuk | silly question, how well would something like vnc work on capacitive. asking because i have my stylus out and stuff | 10:56 |
| lcuk | and there has to be vnc clients for other devices | 10:56 |
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| johnx | lcuk, should work ok. might end up zooming more | 10:58 |
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| lcukn900 | johnx hm which devices have you used it on to k now how that feels | 11:03 |
| mece | mikkov_, ping | 11:03 |
| mece | oops | 11:03 |
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| johnx | lcukn900, I haven't used VNC specifically, but I use iPhones a lot at work in general | 11:04 |
| mece | s/oops/nevermind/ | 11:04 |
| infobot | mece meant: nevermind | 11:04 |
| johnx | seems reasonably precise | 11:04 |
| lcukn900 | rog | 11:04 |
| lcukn900 | well now i went and broke my n900 vnc :s | 11:04 |
| lcukn900 | i turned off the toolbar and cant get it back | 11:05 |
| lcukn900 | cos it reopened in fullscreen mode | 11:05 |
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| ghostcube | \o/ cups works again <3 | 11:08 |
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| ghostcube | btw the Kroll game is nice :) | 11:09 |
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| mece | ghostcube, perhaps not the best game ever, but very nice graphics | 11:09 |
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| ghostcube | mece: yeah to havefun its well done :) | 11:10 |
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| ghostcube | but this strange hamster thingy isnt cool :D | 11:10 |
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| th3hate | could someone help me with an ubuntu related error? people at #ubuntu are afking.. | 11:12 |
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| johnx | th3hate, what's up? | 11:12 |
| th3hate | johnx, check this: http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/3453/20100924002.jpg | 11:13 |
| johnx | looks good | 11:13 |
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| johnx | what's the question? | 11:13 |
| th3hate | johnx, have a closer look :P | 11:13 |
| ghostcube | scratchbox | 11:13 |
| ghostcube | ? | 11:13 |
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| th3hate | i get this when i try to boot ubuntu normally | 11:14 |
| th3hate | this comes instead | 11:14 |
| johnx | ah, X isn't starting | 11:14 |
| johnx | first reboot since upgrading to maverick *BETA* ? | 11:14 |
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| ghostcube | oh ok this is maverick | 11:14 |
| ghostcube | o.o | 11:14 |
| th3hate | upgraded to ubuntu 10.10 | 11:14 |
| th3hate | from 10.04 | 11:15 |
| ghostcube | so what grafic card are u running | 11:15 |
| th3hate | got this on first boot | 11:15 |
| ghostcube | and is the update complete? | 11:15 |
| th3hate | nvidia 8600Gt | 11:15 |
| th3hate | yep | 11:15 |
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| johnx | th3hate, how do you feel about the command line? | 11:15 |
| ghostcube | what does an startx at login terminal tell you | 11:15 |
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| th3hate | ghostcube, i'll try it now | 11:16 |
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| ghostcube | ok this killed his pc | 11:19 |
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| johnx | might have blown up his house from the looks of it | 11:20 |
| johnx | always a risk with X errors | 11:20 |
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| th3hate | startx gives: fatal server error: no screens found | 11:21 |
| johnx | alright. do you know how to use 'nano' (the command line text editor)? | 11:22 |
| ghostcube | johnx: yeah x is a beast | 11:22 |
| ghostcube | :D | 11:22 |
| th3hate | nano /dir | 11:22 |
| johnx | close enough | 11:22 |
| ghostcube | damn i always pin like in skype sorry ... | 11:22 |
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| johnx | let's try one thing first though | 11:23 |
| th3hate | there is a log at /var/log/Xirg.0.log | 11:23 |
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| ghostcube | maybe you can do nano /var/log/xorg.0.log | grep EE | 11:23 |
| johnx | th3hate, I have a gf 6600 and had almost exactly the same experience | 11:23 |
| ghostcube | *less | 11:23 |
| ghostcube | not nano | 11:23 |
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| johnx | before we spend a whole lot of time looking at this stuff, let's try one thing first: | 11:24 |
| th3hate | ok | 11:24 |
| johnx | sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf /etc/X11/xorg.conf.bak | 11:24 |
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| johnx | then type: sudo restart gdm | 11:25 |
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| ghostcube | ah a missconfiged xorg.conf :) maybe a good start | 11:25 |
| johnx | ghostcube, for us nvidia users the lucid -> mav beta doesn't seem to cope with the driver juggling properly | 11:26 |
| th3hate | gdm start/running, process 1709 | 11:26 |
| ghostcube | johnx: iam nvidia too, but havent updated till now :) | 11:26 |
| ghostcube | johnx: problem with open source 3d drivers maybe? | 11:26 |
| johnx | th3hate, it didn't magically all come up working? | 11:26 |
| th3hate | johnx, should i reboot first? | 11:27 |
| johnx | th3hate, nah | 11:27 |
| johnx | waste of time | 11:27 |
| th3hate | no then nothing happened | 11:27 |
| ghostcube | maybe pastebin the content of xorg.0.log | 11:27 |
| johnx | sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf.bak /etc/X11/xorg.conf | 11:27 |
| th3hate | johnx, i did that | 11:27 |
| johnx | nah, we're copying it *back* ;) | 11:27 |
| th3hate | LOL ok | 11:28 |
| ghostcube | no, that is the reverse command | 11:28 |
| johnx | then we'll do some quick editing | 11:28 |
| johnx | look for the line: | 11:28 |
| merlin1991 | ah 1 thing I wondered quite often already, easiest way to pastebin a log from commandline? | 11:28 |
| johnx | Driver "nvidia" | 11:28 |
| johnx | replace with: | 11:28 |
| johnx | Driver "nv" | 11:28 |
| johnx | so just delete the 'idia' | 11:28 |
| ghostcube | johnx: woah the oldschool method heh | 11:28 |
| Duckboot | perl gone from the repos? | 11:28 |
| johnx | merlin1991, pastebinit maybe? apt-cache search has some suggestions | 11:29 |
| rmrfchik | Driver "nvidia" FTW! | 11:29 |
| ghostcube | merlin1991: there is a pastebin tool to send from commandline | 11:29 |
| ghostcube | dont ask me how its called | 11:29 |
| johnx | ghostcube, oldschool is the only school I know | 11:29 |
| ghostcube | johnx: :) | 11:29 |
| johnx | rmrfchik, only when it has its kernel module happily installed. otherwise it's a PITA | 11:29 |
| th3hate | johnx, how to replace nvidia with nv? | 11:29 |
| johnx | th3hate, type: | 11:30 |
| ghostcube | sudo nano /etc/xorg.conf | 11:30 |
| johnx | sudo nano /etc/X11/xorg.conf | 11:30 |
| ghostcube | woah my fault | 11:30 |
| ghostcube | i need coffee to early here ... | 11:30 |
| johnx | then use the down arrow to page down until you see that line | 11:30 |
| th3hate | johnx, its empty | 11:30 |
| johnx | huh | 11:30 |
| johnx | well that's special | 11:30 |
| rmrfchik | johnx: m-a a-i nvidia | 11:30 |
| th3hate | xorg.conf is empty | 11:30 |
| th3hate | nothing in it | 11:31 |
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| rmrfchik | johnx: and dkms does the magic now | 11:31 |
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| johnx | rmrfchik, yeah. suppose so, unless it's not setup to track the right version of the nvidia drivers | 11:31 |
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| johnx | th3hate, thinking | 11:32 |
| Myrtti | how about asking in #ubuntu? | 11:32 |
| johnx | th3hate, head over to /etc/X11 and type ls | 11:32 |
| th3hate | Myrtti, they are all afk | 11:32 |
| th3hate | johnx, ok | 11:33 |
| johnx | th3hate, actually, yeah, I'll just join #ubuntu and we'll continue there. ok? | 11:33 |
| th3hate | how do i exit nano first? | 11:33 |
| th3hate | ok | 11:33 |
| Myrtti | ctrl-x | 11:33 |
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| Myrtti | aw, you broke illusion | 11:34 |
| Myrtti | they're not all AFK. | 11:34 |
| th3hate | /join #ubuntu | 11:34 |
| Myrtti | wow, I've not been removed from the access list yet | 11:36 |
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| lcuk | is iphone4 the fastest mobile device? | 11:51 |
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| kerio | you mean, like, when thrown? | 11:52 |
| johnx | nah, whatever phone they have in the ISS is probably fastest. | 11:52 |
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| Duckboot | lcuk: Nah - HTC Desire HD. | 11:53 |
| lcuk | Duckboot, so thats fastest cpu, or fastest everything? | 11:53 |
| johnx | kerio, the older ones looked more aerodynamic. and I think they legitimately had a decent aerofoil going there too | 11:53 |
| lcuk | ie, do graphics run smoother on it? | 11:53 |
| lcuk | lol johnx | 11:53 |
| johnx | lcuk, now that's a matter of software | 11:53 |
| Duckboot | lcuk: Same CPU as Nexus and Samsung - But hardcore tuned, so it feels lightning fast | 11:53 |
| kerio | "feels" | 11:54 |
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| lcuk | Duckboot, right, that part i understand | 11:54 |
| Duckboot | kerio: And it's benchmarked. | 11:54 |
| lcuk | so has anyone gotten real linux on the desire hd | 11:54 |
| kerio | time of kernel compile = best benchmark | 11:54 |
| lcuk | whats its screen resolution btw? | 11:54 |
| Duckboot | kerio: Lol | 11:54 |
| johnx | lcuk, huh. interesting thought | 11:55 |
| kerio | compiling a kernel requires a huge buttload of cpu and efficient caching | 11:55 |
| lcuk | johnx, you see where I am thinking | 11:55 |
| lcuk | tho this topic should really be in #meego | 11:55 |
| johnx | lcuk, getting faster hardware good? | 11:55 |
| lcuk | it might be | 11:55 |
| lcuk | i know I can make the n900 rocket along | 11:56 |
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| johnx | lcuk, you should talk to the meego-arm guy porting to ... some phone | 11:56 |
| johnx | forgot which one | 11:56 |
| lcuk | and on x86 it flies | 11:56 |
| lcuk | yeah | 11:56 |
| th3hate | johnx, arrow keys sometimes don't work in the grub bootmenu, any idea why? | 11:56 |
| lcuk | i actually want to see like for like on iphone hardware | 11:56 |
| johnx | th3hate, usb keyboard? | 11:56 |
| johnx | th3hate, anyways, that was all the helpfulness I have for today. I'm gonna go back to being a grumpy UNIX admin now :) | 11:57 |
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| Termana | Duckboot, you've be enveloped into marketing hype. The Desire HD is the same processor as the Nexus One, with a newer GPU. It has certainly not been "hardcore tuned" though | 12:04 |
| Duckboot | Termana: Well - When I use a phone - the GUI response is quite a large issue for me. | 12:05 |
| Duckboot | Termana: And you can call it whatever you want, but it has been benchmarked as faster. | 12:05 |
| Termana | If your talking about the boot time, I'm going to laugh in your face | 12:06 |
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| johnx | if you pay me enough money I can design a benchmark that shows anything | 12:06 |
| Duckboot | Termana: How often do you think your average Joe boots his phone? | 12:06 |
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| Termana | Duckboot, actually, I know a lot of average joes that think they should shut it down overnight | 12:07 |
| Termana | But anyway, I have no UI lag on my Desire, using it's stock ROM, the Desire HD ROM or AOSP. | 12:08 |
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| Duckboot | Termana: The question here wasn't lag or no lag. | 12:10 |
| lcuk | johnx, i might make a liqbench small light package | 12:10 |
| dRbiG | hmm, just got my brand new n900 and i wonder why, the frell, internet over wifi is not working... any ideas? the device connects to the network, gots proper address via dhcp, seems not to set dns, but pointing the browser to the ip of my lan server doesn't work too | 12:10 |
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| dRbiG | and yes, all the other devices on that network have no problems with internet, including my old palm tx | 12:11 |
| lcuk | hmm dRbiG | 12:14 |
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| merlin1991 | dRbiG, nslookup google in xterm? | 12:15 |
| dRbiG | ifconfig wlan0 shows the correct ip and i can ping the device from lan; resolv.conf has 127.0.0.1 as nameserver | 12:15 |
| johnx | that's right | 12:16 |
| johnx | it uses dnsmasq | 12:16 |
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| dRbiG | merlin1991: can't resolve | 12:17 |
| kerio | well, "google" doesn't exist | 12:17 |
| kerio | google.com does | 12:17 |
| dRbiG | even if i do nslookup google.com my_dns_addres it stil can't resolve | 12:17 |
| dRbiG | kerio: ha ha... | 12:17 |
| johnx | try passing it a public domain server | 12:17 |
| johnx | 8.8.8.8 is one I'm fond of | 12:17 |
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| dRbiG | johnx: i did't that to the same effect - can't resolve | 12:18 |
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| MNZ | can you ping other devices on your network from the N900? | 12:18 |
| johnx | do you have it plugged into your computer over usb or anything? | 12:18 |
| johnx | MNZ, he doesn't have root yet ... | 12:19 |
| dRbiG | johnx: only plugged the charger | 12:19 |
| dRbiG | and it is hmm stupid that i have to be root to ping ;) | 12:19 |
| johnx | dRbiG, ping is part of busybox | 12:20 |
| johnx | ping requires SUID root set to send an ICMP echo request | 12:20 |
| johnx | setting the SUID bit on busybox would make a whole heap of command line utilities SUID root as well | 12:20 |
| dRbiG | and we don't want to have suid busybox | 12:20 |
| MNZ | dRbiG, by all means, apt-get install rootsh already! you're gonna need it sooner or later | 12:21 |
| johnx | couple other thoughts, see if DHCP is actually setting route correctly ( though I know it wouldn't afect all the tests) | 12:21 |
| johnx | next, try reconnecting, then ... i dunno reboot it? | 12:21 |
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| johnx | MNZ, he has no network access :P | 12:21 |
| dRbiG | MNZ: ha ha... it won't work as there is no internet connection working ;P | 12:21 |
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| MNZ | oh right X-P | 12:21 |
| dRbiG | johnx: rebooting right now | 12:21 |
| merlin1991 | hm how does dnsmasq learn of the dns servers when using dhcp? | 12:22 |
| dRbiG | johnx: i think that it may exactly be a routing problem | 12:22 |
| johnx | wouldn't affect access to your LAN server | 12:23 |
| merlin1991 | or differently how can I pass dnsmasq a dns server to use when I'm doing crazy stuff on my n900 again | 12:23 |
| johnx | or DNS lookups with your local DNS server | 12:23 |
| MNZ | johnx, actually it would. If the routing table is not set up correctly no packets whatsoever can make it out AFAIK | 12:23 |
| dRbiG | true MNZ | 12:23 |
| dRbiG | and after reboot it still doesn't work | 12:24 |
| dRbiG | sad | 12:24 |
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| MNZ | route works without root, try it | 12:24 |
| johnx | packets that don't need to be routed, ie on the local net should be fine unless things are really screwed | 12:24 |
| johnx | /sbin/route -n | 12:24 |
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| Khertan_atWork | Hi ! | 12:24 |
| MNZ | johnx, they do need to be routed in the kernel itself to work out which packets go to which iface | 12:24 |
| dRbiG | right, gateway's not set properly | 12:25 |
| dRbiG | i think i know why though | 12:25 |
| johnx | weird DHCP server? | 12:25 |
| dRbiG | i have a pretty strange network setup here; that is wifi is on 10.0.0.0/24 and lan with the gateway is on 192.0.0.0/24 | 12:25 |
| dRbiG | most other stuff don't care if the gw is on the same netblock | 12:25 |
| johnx | uhm ... | 12:26 |
| dRbiG | 192.168.* | 12:26 |
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| johnx | that's the meaning of gateway, the thing that passes your packets between networks | 12:26 |
| MNZ | dRbiG, hrm dhcp server should take care of that AFAIK. | 12:26 |
| dRbiG | MNZ: on all other devices the gw is just set o 192.168.0.x and everything is fine even though the device addres is on 10.0.0.x | 12:27 |
| dRbiG | anyway | 12:27 |
| dRbiG | let me try to set the gateway manually | 12:27 |
| dRbiG | i hate route syntax | 12:27 |
| Papayawhip|lunch | aww this sucks -.- | 12:28 |
| Papayawhip|lunch | Err https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ libsdl-ttf2.0 2.0.9-1osso0+0m5 | 12:28 |
| Papayawhip|lunch | The requested URL returned error: 404 | 12:28 |
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| johnx | dRbiG, sounds like you made your own routing problems :) the route syntax is punishment for that | 12:28 |
| Duckboot | All your packets are belong to us | 12:28 |
| dRbiG | johnx: hehe sort'a | 12:28 |
| dRbiG | hmm | 12:29 |
| MNZ | Papayawhip, apt-get update | 12:29 |
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| * johnx trusts the "use WPA2 and watch for black vans with antennas sitting outside my house for weeks" approach to network security | 12:29 | |
| Papayawhip | bj-n900:~/# apt-get update --fix-missing | 12:30 |
| Papayawhip | dont teach me | 12:30 |
| MNZ | Papayawhip, eh I thought you were posting here for a reason :P | 12:30 |
| johnx | Papayawhip, that won't do what you think it will because you didn't read the help for it | 12:30 |
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| Papayawhip | what? | 12:31 |
| johnx | the thing you typed doesn't do what you think it does | 12:31 |
| MNZ | johnx, it actually doesn't matter with the update command, though you are right, a misnomer | 12:31 |
| Khertan_atWork | KhtEditor 0.0.9 available in the extras-devel repository | 12:32 |
| johnx | MNZ, yes, but the message describing what it does is *right next to it* | 12:32 |
| dRbiG | johnx: okey i fixed my own problems ;) | 12:32 |
| dRbiG | now all the devices should be happy | 12:32 |
| dRbiG | happy world for all devices! | 12:32 |
| johnx | dRbiG, finally merged them onto one subnet? | 12:32 |
| MNZ | dRbiG, heh gratz | 12:32 |
| dRbiG | johnx: nope, just gave the wifi super-sane gateway address of 10.0.0.1 | 12:32 |
| Papayawhip | the package list ist actual, it's just not available in the repository | 12:32 |
| dRbiG | johnx: i like to have a clear separation between wifi and lan here | 12:33 |
| dRbiG | eases the management | 12:33 |
| johnx | dRbiG, but then an open gateway between them? or some kind of crazy firewall? | 12:33 |
| dRbiG | johnx: simple bridge | 12:33 |
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| johnx | bridge is a layer 2 thing, that doesn't really answer how the packets get from 10.x.x.x to 192.168.x.x, but you know what, if you're happy, then I'm happy for you :D | 12:34 |
| tobis87 | Hi, has anyone seen the new perl package? Perl 5.8.3-3osso13+0m5, but installing it would break dependancy of the pr metapackage. So I assume there will be pr 1.3 in the near future. | 12:35 |
| johnx | that's a reasonable assumption | 12:36 |
| johnx | the only unreasonable thing would be trying to figure out what 'near' means in this context | 12:36 |
| MNZ | johnx dRbiG do you even need a bridge? Won't the router simply send packets happily on their way to the right interface? | 12:36 |
| tobis87 | How long before pr 1.2 was released, did they release the corresponding sdk packages? | 12:37 |
| dRbiG | MNZ: afaik i needed it; i did this setup like 5 years ago and it works just fine | 12:37 |
| Brik_ | when I get "The program 'mad' is currently not installed" (and it is installed), which folder do I need to add to PATH? | 12:37 |
| nidO | the 1.2 sdk was out for almost 2 months prior to the patch itself iirc | 12:37 |
| jacekowski | can n900 do edge? | 12:38 |
| johnx | Brik_, dpkg -L $pkg_name | 12:38 |
| dRbiG | MNZ: but in theory you're right, should work without a bridge if the policy is to forward whenever possible | 12:38 |
| nidO | jacekowski: yeh | 12:38 |
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| johnx | Brik_, that will tell you the files it installed and where they are | 12:38 |
| dRbiG | oky, so now i should be on my way to happy hacking my brand new toy | 12:38 |
| jacekowski | is edge enabled when i change phone to 2g mode | 12:39 |
| Brik_ | alright, thanks :) | 12:39 |
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| dRbiG | johnx & MNZ: thx for support :) | 12:39 |
| johnx | MNZ, I already hung my 'net admin' hat up for the day ;) | 12:39 |
| MNZ | dRbiG, happy hacking and stay safe :P | 12:39 |
| nidO | jacekowski: yeah - itll show 2.5g when it's using edge | 12:39 |
| ghostcube | damn now my cups is running but i cant add printers -.- | 12:39 |
| jacekowski | hmmm how likely is it that i have 3g 3.5g and 2g but not 2.5 | 12:40 |
| johnx | your carrier might not support it | 12:40 |
| nidO | are you actually transferring data and it's sticking at 2g? | 12:40 |
| jacekowski | yes | 12:41 |
| Papayawhip | hum... the package is now available -.- | 12:42 |
| nidO | no support at the tower then I would assume | 12:42 |
| dRbiG | oh one thing this time casual user stuff - can i somehow reverse the scrolling seetings? i mean if i slide down i want the scroll to move down, not up | 12:43 |
| tobis87 | I hope they will release a major kernel update, there are so many dma fixes for omap and wl125 does now support proper powersaving. Too bad that many fixes require a whole new kernel. | 12:44 |
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| johnx | tobis87, has Nokia ever released a totally new kernel for a shipped device? | 12:45 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: yes, meego | 12:46 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:46 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: and they did it on n800 too, afaik | 12:46 |
| psycho_oreos | there might be another way to alleviate that issue for the wireless module, the use of compat-wireless/wireless-testing | 12:46 |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, makes sense. the meego-launch device will be an OMAP3 as well, just like N800->N810 | 12:47 |
| johnx | my suggestion, tobis87: keep your hopes low and in the best case you'll be totally, pleasantly surprised ;) | 12:48 |
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| tobis87 | johnx: Don't know, the n900 was my first linux tablet. But the main problem seems to me, that many drivers for arm require huge changes to the kernel. | 12:50 |
| tobis87 | And I do not expect to much, meego might have a new kernel, but there will be not much programs at the beginning. | 12:50 |
| johnx | tobis87, my only real point being that Nokia (like a lot of other embedded linux vendors) really resists major kernel changes after hardware launch | 12:51 |
| johnx | hard to convince management it's worth the money a lot of the time | 12:51 |
| dRbiG | huh i guess i do have another question: anybody a good method to do a low-level backup in case i screw sth up rally bad? | 12:51 |
| johnx | but if they're already doing the kernel for meego, maybe they'll bring it over to maemo. that would be areally nice surprise :) | 12:51 |
| johnx | dRbiG, rsync? | 12:52 |
| dRbiG | johnx: had on mind something lower level | 12:52 |
| johnx | dd? but you couldn't flash that back to the device I think | 12:53 |
| Khertan_atWork | is there a way to understood why a n900 reboot suddently ? | 12:53 |
| Khertan_atWork | i got reboot sometime | 12:54 |
| dRbiG | yeah i'm thinking about that... does this device has something like a flas/room rescue-cd-like stuff? | 12:54 |
| Khertan_atWork | without any apparent reason | 12:54 |
| dRbiG | grr | 12:54 |
| dRbiG | flash/rom | 12:54 |
| johnx | Khertan_atWork, boot reason? | 12:54 |
| nidO | dRbiG: you can reflash the os to it at any time via flasher | 12:54 |
| dRbiG | cause i guess that booting this device of network or usb stick may be close to impossible | 12:55 |
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| dRbiG | nidO: but i have to be able to boot to a working system to use flasher - or not? | 12:55 |
| nidO | no | 12:55 |
| johnx | dRbiG, there's a way to boot from SD. | 12:55 |
| dRbiG | oh, forgot about that | 12:55 |
| dRbiG | great, that makes life easier | 12:55 |
| johnx | dRbiG, as long as the lowest level bootloader isn't totally screwed up, you can reflash or boot to sd | 12:55 |
| johnx | if you overwrite the lowest level bootloader, you're SoL | 12:56 |
| nidO | you have to really screw the system badly to fubar the bootloader and require a cold flash | 12:56 |
| johnx | you pretty much have to be trying | 12:56 |
| Khertan_atWork | johnx: how did i get it ? | 12:56 |
| johnx | or pop the battery out in maybe 10ms window while flashing | 12:57 |
| tobis87 | Yes, I hope that too. Since there were huge changes in the crypto api, backporting shash and ahash drivers are impossible. But I'm in general suprised how well drivers work on a whole different architecture. Even the unreleased skein hash algorithm and compcache compile and work just fine. | 12:57 |
| johnx | Khertan_atWork, let's see. cat /proc/bootreason | 12:57 |
| johnx | Khertan_atWork, for any interpretation you'll have to google, because that's as much as I know | 12:58 |
| dRbiG | okey, good; bootloader isn't on my hacking list so i should be safe | 12:58 |
| nidO | well bootreason only has like 3 normal reasons, almost certainly hes going to get sw_rst | 12:58 |
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| Khertan_atWork | johnx: sw_rst | 12:59 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 12:59 |
| Khertan_atWork | not so much information to google :) | 12:59 |
| tobis87 | What I really miss are assembler enhanced drivers for arm, I would like to see something like twofish_armv7l :-D | 12:59 |
| johnx | aaah, you're software needed a rest. you're too hard on it :P | 13:00 |
| johnx | s/you're/your/ (really, english is actually my first language ...) | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: dRbiG: according to jacekowski and Stskeeps there's no way to hose the lowest level bootloader - level0 rom BL can flash x-loader(1) and NOLO(2) via USB coldflash, on N900 | 13:03 |
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| johnx | DocScrutinizer, but I don't have a coldflashing rig. do you? | 13:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | via USB! | 13:03 |
| johnx | wait, really? | 13:04 |
| johnx | I thought cold flashing required a jig for some reason | 13:04 |
| johnx | can you give me an example of someone who's done it? | 13:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | for N8x0 that's correct | 13:04 |
| johnx | ah | 13:04 |
| johnx | my knowledge seems to be outdated :) | 13:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: claims he did | 13:04 |
| mece | wait, you can cold flash N900 via usb? | 13:04 |
| dRbiG | nice | 13:06 |
| dRbiG | i guess then the bootloader sits safe in some rom, very good choice | 13:06 |
| johnx | well, one of the 4 or so does ;) | 13:06 |
| dRbiG | the most important should :) | 13:07 |
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| dRbiG | mhm, nows the time to figure out a nice way for browsing windows networks | 13:10 |
| Khertan_atWork | johnx: hum ... strange | 13:11 |
| Khertan_atWork | ouch my n900 is hot | 13:11 |
| johnx | Khertan_atWork, I told you. I needed a SoftWare_ReST :D | 13:12 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 13:12 |
| johnx | s/I/It/ | 13:12 |
| infobot | johnx meant: Khertan_atWork, It told you. I needed a SoftWare_ReST :D | 13:12 |
| johnx | <- sed fail | 13:12 |
| Khertan_atWork | it was just idling without any apps | 13:12 |
| nidO | Khertan_atWork: checked /dev/mtd2? | 13:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Khertan_atWork: obviously not | 13:15 |
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| MNZ | dRbiG, when you've found the best way do tell me because I'm gonna need it soon | 13:16 |
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| merlin1991 | dRbiG, port samba client :D | 13:21 |
| tobis87 | dRbiG: My Network Places was one of the worst ideas Microsoft ever had, opening it will cause sending a broadcast in order to find the LMB (Local Master Browser) and if none is found, one will be choosen. But many of the clients will not notice immediatly know who the LMB is. The best way is still to type \\ip\nameofshare\ in the adress bar and for linux to mount the share with the cifs module. | 13:21 |
| Khertan_atWork | nidO: ouch full of unreadable characters | 13:24 |
| Khertan_atWork | DocScrutinizer: ;) | 13:24 |
| nidO | Khertan_atWork: nothing readable at the end? | 13:24 |
| tobis87 | Khertan_atWork: strings | 13:24 |
| Khertan_atWork | nidO: nothing readable at end ... | 13:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | but an Unable to handle kernel NULL pointer | 13:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | near the start | 13:25 |
| nidO | hm. whats the modified date of the file? | 13:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | process g | 13:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | pid 0 | 13:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | 4 January :) | 13:26 |
| nidO | not a kernel snafu then | 13:26 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 13:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Khertan_atWork: strange! My mtd2 has a whole book of funny kernel OOPS and Panic, arf to less -f /dev/mtd2 | 13:30 |
| Khertan_atWork | http://xkcd.com/ | 13:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | Khertan_atWork: well, maybe you *never* do nasty things to your device :-D | 13:30 |
| Khertan_atWork | DocScrutinizer: i use a real dev language | 13:31 |
| Khertan_atWork | python ! | 13:31 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 13:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | no problem, I'll tell you how to get nice kernel panics with python X-P | 13:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer | echo hartbeat >/sys/class/leds/lp5523:b/trigger | 13:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | no need for python even :-P | 13:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | or something along the line 'cat /dev/kmem >/dev/null' | 13:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/hartbeat/heartbeat/ | 13:35 |
| merlin1991 | what does /dev/kmem represent? | 13:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I'm not sure about either kmen being the one to cause kernel panic, not what exactly it represents. Gues kernel RAM memory | 13:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | s/not/nor | 13:36 |
| TiagoTiago | is the substitution thing still down? :/ | 13:37 |
| johnx | TiagoTiago, that's not a proper s expression | 13:37 |
| TiagoTiago | why? | 13:37 |
| merlin1991 | yeah TiagoTiago you have to say "thingy" at least | 13:37 |
| merlin1991 | :D | 13:38 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 13:38 |
| merlin1991 | nah Doc missed the ending / | 13:38 |
| johnx | s/expression/expression because he didn't terminate it with a forward slash/ | 13:38 |
| infobot | johnx meant: TiagoTiago, that's not a proper s expression because he didn't terminate it with a forward slash | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack | 13:38 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer: aw, gee | 13:38 |
| TiagoTiago | oh | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | merlin1991: I left it out on purpose | 13:38 |
| TiagoTiago | testing one two four | 13:38 |
| merlin1991 | s/ending/terminating/ | 13:38 |
| infobot | merlin1991 meant: nah Doc missed the terminating / | 13:38 |
| TiagoTiago | s/four/three/ | 13:38 |
| infobot | TiagoTiago meant: testing one two three | 13:38 |
| TiagoTiago | cool | 13:39 |
| johnx | s expressions are a gateway drug. soon enough you'll be writing perl regex's in a back alley somewhere | 13:39 |
| merlin1991 | btw what does s/ x / y / actually call? first I thought it's a regex search like in the perl syntax but it isn't :D | 13:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | johnx: but not for infobot, she's limited in s expressions, to plain ascii without any special chars | 13:40 |
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| TiagoTiago | why we don't have the infobot be triggered by (sp?) ? | 13:40 |
| johnx | it's an argument to 'sed' but a lot of other programs use the same (or maddeningly similar but not quite the same) syntax | 13:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/sions, /sion, / | 13:41 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer meant: johnx: but not for infobot, she's limited in s expression, to plain ascii without any special chars | 13:41 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, actually, I bet infobot doesn't handle escape characters either | 13:41 |
| johnx | or any separator except /, which makes things ... difficult | 13:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | well "," being about the most exotc char she can process | 13:41 |
| johnx | hence the statement about "maddeningly similar" above | 13:41 |
| merlin1991 | yeah he/she/it fails on ; | 13:41 |
| merlin1991 | s/;/see/ | 13:42 |
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| TiagoTiago | so we can't have a spellchecker for "(sp?)" (without quotes nut with the parenthesis) ? | 13:42 |
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| johnx | TiagoTiago, write one | 13:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~attack merlin for doubting her sex | 13:42 |
| xDaReaperx | Hi | 13:42 |
| * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing merlin for doubting her sex | 13:42 | |
| TiagoTiago | i have no idea how | 13:43 |
| johnx | anyways, what would it do, run aspell and always take the default? | 13:43 |
| johnx | that would just be annoying for names | 13:43 |
| xDaReaperx | guys look.. i've searched google for this but i couldnt find out how to do this ... I want to install NITDroid 0.0.8 but i dont have a Memory card , so is it possible to install it on my Phone memory .. and if it's possible please do link me to a detailed instruction on how to partition on the phone memory | 13:44 |
| * merlin1991 still doubts infobots sex | 13:44 | |
| TiagoTiago | check if the word imediatly before the tigger is spelled correctly, if yes says so, and if no suggest a best guess spelling | 13:44 |
| lcuk | xDaReaperx, IDK | 13:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | I bet infobot is based on Eliza | 13:44 |
| TiagoTiago | trigger* | 13:44 |
| johnx | xDaReaperx, how do you feel about having to reflash your phone if you screw up? | 13:44 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, (sp?) pondering, most operating systems have textbox level spell checkers built in now | 13:45 |
| merlin1991 | talking about bots, I remember a q3 server with alice in the chat :P | 13:45 |
| xDaReaperx | johnx: t's not really needed for you to know that | 13:46 |
| TiagoTiago | well, i'm chatting from xchat on my N900.... | 13:46 |
| johnx | xDaReaperx, it's not really needed for you to know how to install nitdroid | 13:46 |
| johnx | good night | 13:46 |
| xDaReaperx | you need not decide about that | 13:46 |
| TiagoTiago | no spellchecker and the autocomplete learns my typos | 13:47 |
| * merlin1991 hides around the corner | 13:47 | |
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| TiagoTiago | is there a way i can have the autocomplete only learn a word after i typed it myself at least N times? | 13:48 |
| xDaReaperx | lol i live in India and i have Skype included on my N900 :p | 13:49 |
| BCMM | TiagoTiago: that would be really, really good | 13:49 |
| TiagoTiago | why did they take it off? | 13:49 |
| BCMM | also, i fear it tends to choose the longest word, rather than the most common | 13:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | xDaReaperx: we do not have to know that | 13:50 |
| BCMM | meaning that silly hyphenated non-words i've used in the past tend to come up | 13:50 |
| xDaReaperx | I'm just saying :p | 13:50 |
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| TiagoTiago | i have the impression it does some sort of weighted choosing depending on the characters you already typed and some random formula, somtimes if you type one or more of the characters in the autoconmplete suggestion it will change the word to somthing else | 13:52 |
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| wazd | fucking gizmodo "analysts" really piss me off | 13:53 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 13:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | tbh autocompletion was such a offending futile thing, I disabled it on day 1 | 13:54 |
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| TiagoTiago | lol | 13:54 |
| wazd | http://gizmodo.com/5646781/will-nokia-jump-aboard-the-windows-phone-7-train | 13:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | a spellchecker highlighting incorrect words, with suggestions in context menu - that's be a really nice thing though | 13:56 |
| TiagoTiago | somthing like Firefox' spellchecker? | 13:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | wazd: WUT??? | 13:56 |
| wazd | DocScrutinizer: seriously, they're all stupid to the bones, now I'm sure | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: something like KDE spellchecker in text input boxes | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | wazd: ack - I don't even dare to click the link | 13:58 |
| lcuk | wazd to be fair, since we know that the n900 is perfectly capable of running multiple operating systems, why complain? | 13:58 |
| wazd | DocScrutinizer: well, the title describes all that US bullshit :) | 13:58 |
| merlin1991 | yeah | 13:59 |
| wazd | lcuk: the point is not in n900 or dual boot, the point is in all that pro-US point of view | 13:59 |
| lcuk | wazd, so? I didnt mean dual boot | 13:59 |
| lcuk | i meant the fact that its hardware and its capable | 13:59 |
| wazd | lcuk: everything that's outside the US is lame by default | 13:59 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 13:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | wazd: outside US?? o.O duh, don't scare us, we are sure there's no such thing | 14:00 |
| lcuk | well wazd, everything has localised favorites | 14:00 |
| wazd | lcuk: beleive me, I don't :D | 14:01 |
| lcuk | David Hasselhoff is a crap singer for 99% of the world, but is worshiped as a god in Germany | 14:01 |
| MNZ | I had ridiculously awesome autocomplete on my sony ericcson | 14:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | wazd: there are some remote US protectorates, but non-US parts of the world? impoooosible! | 14:02 |
| MNZ | on the N900 though, it can't really get much further away from the word I need even if it tried | 14:02 |
| wazd | DocScrutinizer: yep :) | 14:02 |
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| wazd | lcuk: he's a singer? :D | 14:03 |
| wazd | lcuk: I thought he's an actor :) | 14:03 |
| lcuk | wazd, the same applies | 14:04 |
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| lcuk | google for rest of world, baidu for China | 14:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | david hasenkopf? blarrgh! Nobody here seems to even know him | 14:04 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 14:05 |
| lcuk | wazd, what handset OS is most popular in China by the way? do you know? | 14:05 |
| Sadaathere | can anyone give me rough idea hw qt 4.7 will benefit normal n900 userz? | 14:05 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer, in austria we know him for the lols :D | 14:05 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: fix list view scrolling error (can be see in Khweeteur) | 14:05 |
| wazd | lcuk: MTK? :D | 14:06 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: fix some input error in qlineedit | 14:06 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: fix some copy / paste problem | 14:06 |
| Khertan_atWork | but there are many more bug fixed | 14:06 |
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| lcuk | Sadaathere, qt.47 is the combined efforts to allow a stable usable rock solid development environment and combines the on device framwork with a top notch sdk and IDE to allow seamless end to end cross platform development | 14:06 |
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| Khertan_atWork | cross platform development <<< haha ... :) | 14:06 |
| Khertan_atWork | we are still far from a real cross plateform ... but it s a good start | 14:07 |
| Khertan_atWork | a really good one | 14:07 |
| lcuk | why Khertan_atWork | 14:07 |
| Sadaathere | thanks for reply will it make maemo more friendly | 14:07 |
| lcuk | what did you have to step outside the walled garden to do | 14:07 |
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| lcuk | Sadaathere, it already has in many ways | 14:08 |
| lcuk | qt applications are growing steadily and people are making all sorts of things with it | 14:08 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: there is still many things which are specifics to some plateform :) | 14:08 |
| lcuk | Khertan_atWork, like.. | 14:08 |
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| TiagoTiago | are we ever gonna get "copile one run everywhere" ? | 14:08 |
| Khertan_atWork | qpixmap on n900 doesn't support gif :) | 14:08 |
| lcuk | nobody ever said that | 14:08 |
| TiagoTiago | s/one/once | 14:09 |
| TiagoTiago | s/one/once/ | 14:09 |
| infobot | TiagoTiago meant: s/once/once | 14:09 |
| TiagoTiago | gah | 14:09 |
| merlin1991 | hrhr | 14:09 |
| Sadaathere | i mean like y we aint gettin flash 10.1? | 14:09 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, thats not the aim | 14:09 |
| lcuk | code once | 14:09 |
| lcuk | you may have to build for different platforms | 14:09 |
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| lcuk | due to binary diffs etc | 14:09 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: and for respecting guidesline for some device (like n900) you need to use specifics class | 14:09 |
| Khertan_atWork | like QMaemo5ValueButton | 14:09 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 14:09 |
| lcuk | whats that look like? | 14:10 |
| Khertan_atWork | of course this class aren't available for other plateform | 14:10 |
| lcuk | and why isnt it possible to use a default qbutton | 14:10 |
| TiagoTiago | with some sort of vm bytecode it could be possible | 14:10 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: it s possible ... but require to inherits the widget and paint things yourself | 14:10 |
| Sadaathere | basically qt makes things easier for programmers right? | 14:10 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: basically, yes | 14:11 |
| lcuk | Sadaathere, depends | 14:11 |
| lcuk | for existing apps written in gtk, no | 14:11 |
| lcuk | its not simpler | 14:11 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: and basically, it s a really good framework | 14:11 |
| TiagoTiago | including for porting Symbian programs to Maemo/MeeGo | 14:11 |
| lcuk | but if you are making something new theres a lot of support available which is easier to integrate | 14:11 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: depends ... it s take me less time to rewrite PyGTKEditor written in pygtk with qt :) | 14:11 |
| Sadaathere | i see | 14:12 |
| lcuk | thats because you are a professional python developer now khertan | 14:12 |
| lcuk | :) | 14:12 |
| lcuk | and you arent hacking on a touchscreen only | 14:12 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: unfortunatly i'm still not a professional developper :) | 14:12 |
| lcuk | and a whole host of other things | 14:12 |
| lcuk | :) you undersell yourself Khertan_atWork | 14:12 |
| Sadaathere | and will meego 1.1 will be available for n900 | 14:12 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: ;) | 14:12 |
| lcuk | Sadaathere, go try it now | 14:13 |
| TiagoTiago | Harmatan will be avaiable but not officially supported i believe | 14:13 |
| * Khertan_atWork is still fighting with the community meego obs to build pyqt or pyside | 14:13 | |
| lcuk | it won't be officially supported by the looks of things, but its being built up in the open now | 14:13 |
| Sadaathere | so we can port it bt it aint be official? | 14:14 |
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| TiagoTiago | no need to port, it will be native | 14:14 |
| lcuk | well, you bought a maemo device that runs the maemo os, that is what Nokia supports | 14:15 |
| Sadaathere | by native u mean installing on emmc? | 14:15 |
| lcuk | yes he does | 14:15 |
| TiagoTiago | i mean it is like Maemo5 | 14:15 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, every machine you target with an OS needs porting work done | 14:15 |
| Sadaathere | oh got it | 14:15 |
| TiagoTiago | not if the OS was developed for that machine already | 14:16 |
| lcuk | the n900 is a capable machine and hence meego open development targeting it makes sense | 14:16 |
| Sadaathere | is it gonna be fully functional meego? | 14:16 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, meego is developed for many devices | 14:16 |
| TiagoTiago | but they are testing it on the N900 first | 14:16 |
| Sadaathere | i mean not buggy like nitdroid | 14:17 |
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| Sadaathere | is it gonna be fully functional meego? | 14:17 |
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| TiagoTiago | might not come with all the programs i think (things like phone, maps etc) | 14:19 |
| Sadaathere | so its not gonna be fully functional one then | 14:19 |
| Sadaathere | bt they are experimenting this os on n900 so y its nt gonna be ful functional | 14:21 |
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| TiagoTiago | the reasoning was that those programs would be added by the manufacturers, and since it's not the manufacturer installing it in your N900 the proprietary programs won't be there | 14:21 |
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| sandstorm | is the instruction set of N900 about its phone capabilities fully open to public? is there an API? can one go and develop its own phone app on Maemo or Meego ? | 14:22 |
| TiagoTiago | but i don't know the official stance from Nokia, this is all from memory of reading some comments by random people somewhere i don't remember whewre | 14:22 |
| sandstorm | s/its/his-her | 14:23 |
| Sadaathere | are we gonna get flash 10.1 on maemo 5? | 14:24 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: to be honest it s quite difficult to find an interesting python dev jobs in france | 14:24 |
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| Khertan_atWork | hum... just notice that i'm not the only one to run it s own repository for n900 ;) | 14:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | http://fuuko.libferris.com/maemo/n900/repository/ | 14:25 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 14:25 |
| psycho_oreos | there's a few.. matan also has his own | 14:26 |
| TiagoTiago | i asked in the forum but got no replies yet; is there a way to use dialup internet with the N900? | 14:26 |
| ShadowJK | sandst1, on meego they use ofono | 14:26 |
| ShadowJK | TiagoTiago, what do you mean by dialup internet? HSCSD? | 14:26 |
| sandstorm | sorry for my ignorance, what is ofono ? | 14:26 |
| Sadaathere | khertan_artWork , r we gonna get flash 10.1 on maemo 5? | 14:26 |
| TiagoTiago | like the old 56 modems, dial a number and they give you internet | 14:27 |
| Corsac | all Internet? | 14:27 |
| TiagoTiago | interenet access | 14:27 |
| Corsac | can I have an internet backup? | 14:27 |
| Corsac | just in case | 14:27 |
| ShadowJK | sandstorm, open api to telephony stuff.. | 14:27 |
| * Corsac calls google | 14:28 | |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: don't know only nokia can answer | 14:28 |
| ShadowJK | TiagoTiago, well, no. Not really | 14:28 |
| TiagoTiago | why not? | 14:28 |
| sandstorm | hmm, is that comply with Nokias infrastructure? | 14:28 |
| Sadaathere | is it possible khertan_artwork? | 14:28 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: everythings is possible | 14:28 |
| ShadowJK | TiagoTiago, because if you try to push the 56K modulation over a GSM voice channel, the voice codec is going to scramble it unrecognizable by the modem on the other end | 14:28 |
| Sadaathere | lol right | 14:28 |
| merlin1991 | wait | 14:29 |
| * merlin1991 greps the logs | 14:29 | |
| Surfa | csd :D | 14:29 |
| ShadowJK | TiagoTiago, it might work at very slow speeds... like 300 bits per second or something :) | 14:29 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: just a matter of times, and interests | 14:29 |
| merlin1991 | I remember someone developing exactly that | 14:29 |
| TiagoTiago | but i can set it up on reguar mobiles | 14:29 |
| kerio | TiagoTiago: that's a data call | 14:29 |
| kerio | and it costs much more than regular calls | 14:29 |
| ShadowJK | TiagoTiago, ok so now you're talking about (HS)CSD then and not 56K modems :) | 14:29 |
| TiagoTiago | like old wap connections | 14:29 |
| kerio | yup | 14:29 |
| Sadaathere | khertan_artwork : nokia not talking much interest in n900 | 14:29 |
| TiagoTiago | i would be calling a tollfree number | 14:30 |
| Sadaathere | taking* | 14:30 |
| kerio | yeah, we should have a way to connect to the internet with hscsd on the n900 | 14:30 |
| ShadowJK | I didn't think anyone used CSD after GPRS came :) | 14:30 |
| kerio | in case you're teleported to 1998 | 14:30 |
| TiagoTiago | well, it's free | 14:30 |
| kerio | (or maybe even before?) | 14:30 |
| kerio | TiagoTiago: it's probably really not free | 14:30 |
| TiagoTiago | it's a free toll number people use with landline connections | 14:31 |
| TiagoTiago | for free dialup internet | 14:31 |
| merlin1991 | http://pastebin.com/yGeqGGqm | 14:31 |
| kerio | then it won't work with hscsd | 14:31 |
| kerio | (probably) | 14:31 |
| ShadowJK | I don't think any modem that's connected to landline is going to be able to talk HSCSD... | 14:31 |
| TiagoTiago | the instructions i found on the internet says it's just like setting a wap connection | 14:32 |
| TiagoTiago | here http://www.tutomania.com.br/tutorial/internet-no-celular-gratis | 14:33 |
| Sadaathere | khertan_artwork : nokia was plaining to bring maemo 6 bt stopped the project cuz of meego n nw they r not bringing it official its unfair :'( | 14:33 |
| Khertan_atWork | Sadaathere: they will never bring maemo 6 officially anyway :) | 14:33 |
| TiagoTiago | lots of people are upset at them for that, join the club | 14:33 |
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| Sadaathere | khertan_artwork: yea bt they aint doing much for n900 when its capable of doing so many things | 14:34 |
| ShadowJK | Sadaathere, "was planning to bring maemo 6".. they had never announced Maemo 6 for N900. | 14:34 |
| lcuk | Sadaathere, ahem | 14:35 |
| lcuk | meego is open source | 14:35 |
| lcuk | get those apps on maemo | 14:35 |
| lcuk | if thats how you feel | 14:35 |
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| Sadaathere | 1cuk : and qt will make it possible to run meego apps on maemo right? | 14:36 |
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| lcuk | Sadaathere, thats the intent yes, however since qt does not restrict to the walled garden, its entirely possible and feasible that developers have shortcutted the process | 14:37 |
| lcuk | and have incompatible changes within the specific app itself | 14:37 |
| lcuk | as Khertan_atWork mentioned he had to do | 14:37 |
| ShadowJK | Though I don't think you can call it a Meego app then anymore | 14:38 |
| ShadowJK | not that that will stop people from complaining that non-Meego-app X runs on Meego but not Maemo :) | 14:38 |
| Sadaathere | oh got it | 14:38 |
| kerio | a QtMobility app | 14:38 |
| kerio | Sadaathere: porting apps between the two platforms should be easy | 14:38 |
| Sadaathere | so with qt we dont really need meego for n900 | 14:39 |
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| Sadaathere | cuz we r getting its apps | 14:39 |
| lcuk | we arent getting its apps | 14:39 |
| lcuk | but they can be ported | 14:40 |
| lcuk | give them patches | 14:40 |
| lcuk | :) | 14:40 |
| lcuk | (also, fix other bugs too :P) | 14:40 |
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| TiagoTiago | any idea how i can setup the connection like they describe in that site? | 14:40 |
| ShadowJK | You can't | 14:40 |
| lcuk | in what sire? | 14:41 |
| ShadowJK | And I seriously doubt it'd work on a normal GSM phone too | 14:41 |
| ShadowJK | lcuk, he wants to call a landline dialup modem | 14:41 |
| TiagoTiago | http://www.tutomania.com.br/tutorial/internet-no-celular-gratis | 14:41 |
| Sadaathere | thanks for info guys | 14:41 |
| sp3000 | timeless: waah, mxr.maemo search fatals | 14:41 |
| lcuk | sp3000, i think timeless is somewhere in Ireland atm | 14:41 |
| lcuk | fails and crashes? | 14:42 |
| sp3000 | lcuk, I kow, otherwise I'd kick him in the shins directly :) | 14:42 |
| sp3000 | know, too | 14:42 |
| lcuk | haha | 14:42 |
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| sp3000 | oh, mxr.moego search on fremantle works, even though its front page would direct you to mxr.maemo | 14:43 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG зштп | 14:43 |
| ZogG | ping | 14:43 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG where did you get mircousb - to usb for host mode? | 14:44 |
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| TiagoTiago | could you check the parameters it says there to setup and see if you can identify what type of conenction eit is exactly and whether it is possible to use that with a N900 please? | 14:48 |
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| TiagoTiago | lcuk? | 14:50 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, i cant even understand the page let alone work out what you want to do, so you test it | 14:50 |
| TiagoTiago | scroll down to the parameters | 14:51 |
| jpinx-eeepc | TiagoTiago: it's specific to Claro in Brazil | 14:51 |
| jpinx-eeepc | would not work with anyone else | 14:51 |
| TiagoTiago | but the parameters are generic to many devices | 14:51 |
| jpinx-eeepc | TiagoTiago: are you in Brazil? | 14:51 |
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| TiagoTiago | but you can't understand the parameters and identify what type of connection it is? | 14:52 |
| TiagoTiago | yes | 14:52 |
| jpinx-eeepc | it says ISDN , but I am not sure if that's right | 14:55 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, click on the link in the thread | 14:55 |
| TiagoTiago | :( | 14:56 |
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| jpinx-eeepc | TiagoTiago: better you read it in your own language and work it out - my portuguese is a bit rusty... | 14:56 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG amazon? | 14:56 |
| TiagoTiago | forget the text, pay attention to the parameters | 14:57 |
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| * TiagoTiago sighs | 15:01 | |
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| ShadowJK | N900 doesn't have any CSD support | 15:02 |
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| kerio | ShadowJK: and for a good reason! | 15:02 |
| ghostcube | why would a ceelphone support christopher street day | 15:02 |
| ghostcube | :D | 15:02 |
| ghostcube | ok its a bad one ... | 15:02 |
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| TiagoTiago | are you sure? why? | 15:03 |
| Appiah | :D | 15:03 |
| ShadowJK | kerio, well if they think MMS is dying and not worth the effort, then HSCSD is like a dinosaur that's been dead for a million years | 15:03 |
| kerio | MMS *is* not worth the effort | 15:03 |
| kerio | right frals? :P | 15:03 |
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| Scelt | MMS rocks! | 15:04 |
| TiagoTiago | what is the difference between this and using the N900 as a bluetooth dialup modem? | 15:04 |
| ShadowJK | N900 uses gprs | 15:04 |
| ShadowJK | packet data | 15:04 |
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| MohammadAG | ZogG, err, i said click the link in the thread | 15:05 |
| TiagoTiago | you can't use it for actual dialup? | 15:05 |
| ShadowJK | no | 15:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | noob question: can flasher-3.5 flash a plain bZimage kernel, or does it always need fiasco files? | 15:05 |
| TiagoTiago | so DUN profile is just a name? | 15:06 |
| ShadowJK | PCs don't talk any GSM/3G protocols, so in order for PCs to be able to use GPRS, N900 pretends to the PC that it is a modem, and it also pretends that another modem answers | 15:06 |
| jpinx | TiagoTiago: not as a stand alone device - but I daresay you could cobble togather some form of usb modem and plug it in | 15:06 |
| ShadowJK | DUN profile means that the device looks (to the PC) like a dialup modem | 15:06 |
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| jpinx | ShadowJK: it's all smoke and mirrors ;) | 15:07 |
| psycho_oreos | MohammadAG, I believe you have a copy of gcc 4.4 or latter? :) | 15:07 |
| TiagoTiago | what if you setup the connection in the pc using dialup parameters (like a real number to dial to) ? | 15:07 |
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| ShadowJK | That'd be an interesting experiment :) | 15:08 |
| jpinx-eeepc | heh | 15:08 |
| jpinx-eeepc | fill your boots TiagoTiago :) | 15:09 |
| SpeedEvil | It does not work. | 15:09 |
| TiagoTiago | what does that mean? | 15:09 |
| SpeedEvil | pnatd does not support 'atd' to random numbers | 15:09 |
| SpeedEvil | Annoyingly. | 15:09 |
| TiagoTiago | is that a software limitation? | 15:09 |
| SpeedEvil | Only the 'magic' atd*99# - or whatever the exact sequence is - to enable a ppp session | 15:10 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 15:10 |
| SpeedEvil | there is also the concept of circuit switched data | 15:10 |
| SpeedEvil | This is phone-phone fixed bandwidth pipes. | 15:10 |
| ghostcube | MohammadAG synaptic isnt going to be released with all dependencies or? | 15:11 |
| SpeedEvil | But most phones do not enable it. | 15:11 |
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| kerio | atd? | 15:11 |
| kerio | dial for data? | 15:12 |
| SpeedEvil | no | 15:12 |
| SpeedEvil | atd is the noral hayes 'dial a number' command | 15:12 |
| kerio | ooh | 15:12 |
| kerio | just that? | 15:12 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, he wants to dial a landline ISDN or landline analog modem... | 15:12 |
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| SpeedEvil | yes. | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | As i understand, if you enable CSD, you can dial IDSN | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | In principle | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | But I forget the details. | 15:13 |
| TiagoTiago | any idea how i can do that? | 15:13 |
| TiagoTiago | oh | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | CSD needs enabled on the cell provider side | 15:14 |
| TiagoTiago | oh | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | It's also 9600bits/sec only | 15:14 |
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| tobis87 | What is the difference between atd and atdt? | 15:14 |
| ShadowJK | t for tone dialing | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | one dials with loopdisconnect, the other with DTMF | 15:14 |
| TiagoTiago | if it gives me free internet i don't care about the speed | 15:14 |
| ShadowJK | entirely irrelevant on digital systems | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | TiagoTiago: It's expensive | 15:14 |
| SpeedEvil | TiagoTiago: It's typically more expensive than a call | 15:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | atdp probably also works :-P | 15:15 |
| TiagoTiago | but i would be dialing a tollfree number... | 15:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: that's possible | 15:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | if your carrier allows | 15:16 |
| tobis87 | ah ok, i have seen a way to emulate a 300 baud connction over tcp, with tcpser and vice... | 15:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: outbound CSD usually is enabled by default | 15:16 |
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| TiagoTiago | they would spy on the noise going thru the line? or does it use a completly different route? | 15:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's just inbound CSD that needs special care | 15:16 |
| SpeedEvil | different protocol | 15:16 |
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| SpeedEvil | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Switched_Data | 15:17 |
| TiagoTiago | so if i tried dialing my landline and picked the phone i wouldn't be hearing those oldschool internet noises? | 15:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: your voice is sent OTA as data. CSD is sending plain data, with a flag saying "ain't voice" | 15:18 |
| TiagoTiago | hm | 15:18 |
| crashanddie | lmao | 15:18 |
| tobis87 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkHwT6o6Jvw http://www.alice-dsl.net/lgoerke/tutorial.txt <- mailbox over tcp using turbo term | 15:19 |
| kerio | u can't has free internet | 15:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: yes, if the carrier has a CSD->PTS_modem gateway | 15:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | POTS* | 15:19 |
| crashanddie | kerio, but... but... www.free.fr? | 15:19 |
| TiagoTiago | no way to do it oldschool with data encoded as sounds? | 15:19 |
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| kerio | TiagoTiago: lol | 15:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: GSM codec can't possibly do anything better than 75bd | 15:20 |
| kerio | sure, with less bandwidth than you'd need for #maemo alone | 15:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: it's made for voice, not for modem/fax beeps | 15:21 |
| TiagoTiago | well, that would at least be somthing | 15:21 |
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| kerio | and you still have to pay for the call | 15:21 |
| TiagoTiago | would the modem on the other side handle such a low bw? | 15:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | usually yes | 15:21 |
| TiagoTiago | not if i call a tollfree number | 15:21 |
| kerio | the tollfree number pays | 15:22 |
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| TiagoTiago | that is their choice | 15:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: but, as mentioned above, afaik all carriers support outbound CSD and offer a CSD->POTS_modem gateway. This way you'd get 9600bd | 15:22 |
| TiagoTiago | but tey would charge me even though i' dialing a tollfree number? | 15:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kerio: depends. sometimes the even *get* money - so called termination fee | 15:23 |
| TiagoTiago | i'm* | 15:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: nope, the carrier usually doesn't charge on top of a normal call fee for CSD | 15:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: they charge for tollfree sometimes, nevertheless | 15:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | depends on your contract | 15:26 |
| TiagoTiago | i don't get charged when i call the tollfree number for the pizza delivery place | 15:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | so you also won't get charged when calling same number via GSM-fax (yes that's supported as well usually), or via GSM-data aka CSD | 15:27 |
| Surfa | :D | 15:27 |
| TiagoTiago | can i use GSM-fax or data wwith the N900? | 15:27 |
| Surfa | this discussion is like warping back 8 years in time | 15:27 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - freephone data services may have blocks for cellular | 15:27 |
| SpeedEvil | IIRC | 15:27 |
| TiagoTiago | some do, some don't | 15:27 |
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| SpeedEvil | as it can cost them money in some places | 15:27 |
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| TiagoTiago | yeah | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: usually they have, as they have to pay extra for cellphones calling in | 15:28 |
| TiagoTiago | the pizza place i get my piizzas from don't block cellphones | 15:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: does he have a fax? | 15:28 |
| TiagoTiago | the N900? | 15:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | the pizza place :-P | 15:29 |
| TiagoTiago | ah, dunno | 15:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | anyway, check how to set up CSD and/or fax connections on N900 pnatd | 15:30 |
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| TiagoTiago | is it on the wiki? | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | dunno what rapuyama/pnatd supports | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | nfc | 15:30 |
| TiagoTiago | oh :( | 15:30 |
| TiagoTiago | ~nfc | 15:30 |
| infobot | nfc is, like, No Fucking Clue | 15:30 |
| TiagoTiago | oh :( | 15:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I'm rather sure I heard BT PAN is using pnatd CSD | 15:31 |
| psycho_oreos | lol | 15:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer | err, not CSD, but usual data call establishing | 15:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | which is a superset of plain CSD | 15:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | on AT level | 15:32 |
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| Surfa | DocScrutinizer, why would bt pan use csd? | 15:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | probably rapuyama also supports HSCSD, which will give you a lot more than 9600bd, but is a completely different story, carrier_enabling side | 15:34 |
| Surfa | hw itself could support it, but whole different story is if the cellmo has it enabled or not | 15:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe it's been BT DUN, don't quote me on that | 15:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: start pnatd; type "ATD<your number with some modem hooked up><enter>"; wait what happens | 15:37 |
| SpeedEvil | it fails immediaterly | 15:38 |
| SpeedEvil | it does not support atd | 15:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | should answer with usual "RINGING; CARRIER 9600 DETECTED; Welcome to <mybox>" | 15:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-( | 15:39 |
| Surfa | I completely missed where this discussion started.. why are we talking about csd here? | 15:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~curse cellmo | 15:39 |
| infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, cellmo ! | 15:39 |
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| Surfa | and why would you like to use it? for.. anything? :) | 15:40 |
| Surfa | (this is just professional interest from me) | 15:40 |
| TiagoTiago | it says error :( | 15:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | Surfa: for point2point data connections? | 15:40 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG51, kinda missed it out | 15:40 |
| TiagoTiago | i wanna use a tollfree dialup internet connnection | 15:40 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer51+MohammadAG51 = 102? | 15:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: you want to use a dialup connection. period | 15:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | ZogG: hahaha | 15:41 |
| SpeedEvil | TiagoTiago: Where are you in the world? | 15:41 |
| Surfa | TiagoTiago, ehm, dialup and csd aren't really necessarily related.. :) | 15:41 |
| TiagoTiago | "but why use a dialup, its so slow blah blah blah" 'cause then i can have free internet dialing a tollfree number | 15:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | 42 + 4711 != the mellifluous answer to everything | 15:42 |
| TiagoTiago | Brazil | 15:42 |
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| ZogG | plantronics bluetooth backbeat - anyone tried this one? | 15:43 |
| kerio | i should watch Brazil | 15:43 |
| Surfa | TiagoTiago, ok so you really are talking about csd? DUN itself may have different meanings also for PDP DUN for example | 15:43 |
| RST38h | "They want to kill people with my software that doesn't work" | 15:43 |
| SpeedEvil | I should eat some brazil nuts. | 15:43 |
| RST38h | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/09/24/cia_netezza/ | 15:43 |
| RST38h | And moo ZogG | 15:43 |
| TiagoTiago | the instructions for other devices ssays it's the same number used by landline dial up modems | 15:43 |
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| Surfa | TiagoTiago, but I'm really affraid that no modern Nokia device (or any other vendor either) will provide you csd capability nowadays | 15:44 |
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| TiagoTiago | :( | 15:44 |
| Surfa | it's years since it was supported last time | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | Surfa: duh? not? | 15:44 |
| Surfa | DocScrutinizer, yes | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | I should think every decent AT modem implementation still supports it - alas we only got pnatd on N900 | 15:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | of course not every device nowadays has a AT modem interface at all | 15:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | but those who have should quite usually do CSD | 15:46 |
| Surfa | even that at modem is there, it doesn't mean that you would have csd capabilities | 15:46 |
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| Surfa | no no.. not really | 15:46 |
| summel | who postet that pic of the bat yesterday? :D | 15:47 |
| Surfa | this is something that I really should know :) | 15:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | screw the idiots | 15:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | deliberately 'optimizing out' the most basic AT command out of their AT interface | 15:48 |
| ZogG | RST38h kuuu | 15:49 |
| Surfa | well, maintaining masses of legacy functionality that practically no one uses may lead to some decisions | 15:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | bah | 15:49 |
| kerio | TiagoTiago = practically no one? | 15:49 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: supporting t would break the interface. | 15:49 |
| SpeedEvil | it | 15:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, why would it break the IF?? | 15:49 |
| SpeedEvil | As the phone could not then make/recieve calls | 15:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | obviously | 15:50 |
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| * DocScrutinizer shrugs | 15:50 | |
| Surfa | kerio, in this case yes :) this is the first time in years I've heard someone talking about csd | 15:50 |
| TiagoTiago | :( | 15:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | receive calls is outright impossible as long as MT-originated CSD call is established - far end will get no call progress | 15:51 |
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| summel | csd? :O | 15:51 |
| summel | cristopher street day? | 15:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | for make calls MT-orig it's quite easily handled along scheme of "no signal" | 15:52 |
| SpeedEvil | On packaging formats. http://xkcd.com/ | 15:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | so how's it breaking IF? | 15:52 |
| SpeedEvil | Are two ppp sessions at once supported? | 15:52 |
| SpeedEvil | I should try this. | 15:52 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm assuming it would break thespecification of the interface. | 15:53 |
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| SpeedEvil | Which means WONTFIX | 15:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | the spec which is? | 15:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | "a call MUST proceed, no matter what" | 15:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | ? | 15:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~2119 | 15:54 |
| infobot | The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in RFC 2119. | 15:54 |
| SpeedEvil | The magical perfct user-interface document written before the code, or anyones touched hardware. | 15:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: when trying to make a call while CSD connection established, the IF simply signals to userland either of "No signal" or "BTS busy" | 15:55 |
| TiagoTiago | the infobot explanation should come with a linlk to the rfc in question | 15:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | both MUST be inplemeted in any IF | 15:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer | so the IF specs can not break due to a simple CSD | 15:56 |
| SpeedEvil | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10354 | 15:56 |
| povbot | Bug 10354: Symbol virtual keyboard inconsistent to access from hardware keyboard. | 15:56 |
| SpeedEvil | For why mashing two buttons is wrong, and the user should alwys press them carefully. | 15:57 |
| SpeedEvil | Even though mashing them would have no negative impact on the UI, and make it easier for users. | 15:57 |
| SpeedEvil | And you're expecting logical resolutions? | 15:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry I can't help it, i'm not expecting anything, I'm siply in logical operation mode | 15:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | of course Nokia has messed it up once again, as they did so many times esp with cellmo. No surprise. I'm just delivering proof for the use of 20min of thinking about it | 16:00 |
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| TiagoTiago | I'm confused, how exactly do i repro that bug? | 16:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | and btw this is another depressing example of the devastating effects of "we don't need that" mindset | 16:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ..which gave us abominations like y2k issue, broken audio on OM devices etc etc pp | 16:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ... and now has left us fsckd wrt CSD | 16:03 |
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| TiagoTiago | hm, IMO pressing Control before pressing Fn not triggering the Symbols vk makes complete sense | 16:07 |
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| TiagoTiago | that bug report is like pressing the "a" key before pressing shift and expecting upper case A to come out | 16:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | btw CSD point2point connections are the only *working* way to implement cryped phonecalls on a standard cellphone like N900 | 16:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | real phonecalls | 16:09 |
| TiagoTiago | encrypted? | 16:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | not VoIP or similar things | 16:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer | encrypted, yes | 16:10 |
| TiagoTiago | is there such a thing as OTR for voice? | 16:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | OTR?? | 16:11 |
| TiagoTiago | that IM encryption protocol with plausible deniability etc | 16:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | BS, what's plausible deniability for a switched call? | 16:12 |
| MNZ | "Not my phone" | 16:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 16:12 |
| tobis87 | http://www.cypherpunks.ca/otr/otr-codecon.pdf , encrypted voip http://zfone.com/ | 16:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | not my phone - but I'll pay the bill nevertheless | 16:13 |
| TiagoTiago | you can decrypt the encrypted exchange to any plaintext you want, so no one can prove you really said what their decryptions says you said | 16:13 |
| MNZ | and there's presumably a way to decrypt it into what you really said, correct? | 16:14 |
| MNZ | because otherwise I don't see where the 'M' part of 'IM' is.... | 16:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's not related to 'plausible deniability" | 16:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | meh | 16:14 |
| TiagoTiago | someone says you said somthing, you can say they forged it, and that is completly plausible | 16:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's BS | 16:15 |
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| SpeedEvil | It's not with a one-time-pad. | 16:15 |
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| MNZ | why not just use strong encryption so they can't decrypt in the first place ??? Or am I missing something? | 16:16 |
| SpeedEvil | Any signal and any desired signal can be made with the right key | 16:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | definition of 'plausible deniability' is: "no there's never been any call/file/messgae/whatever" | 16:16 |
| TiagoTiago | yeah, there is some math juggling back and forth that lets the two participants decrypt each other without an eavesdropper figuring out how to do it | 16:16 |
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| TiagoTiago | perhaps i'm using the wrong expression | 16:16 |
| lindi- | TiagoTiago: yes I don't think you are explaining yourself very well here... | 16:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: google4ZRTP | 16:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | secure encryption of RTP media(voice) streams | 16:18 |
| TiagoTiago | https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Off-the-Record_Messaging | 16:18 |
| crashanddie | I'm working on low-latency RTP encryption | 16:19 |
| crashanddie | the interesting bit is that RTCP is completely inadapted for this scenario | 16:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | ZRTP | 16:19 |
| TiagoTiago | "Off-the-Record Messaging, commonly referred to as OTR, is a cryptographic protocol that provides strong encryption for instant messaging conversations. OTR uses a combination of the AES symmetric-key algorithm, the Diffie-Hellman key exchange, and the SHA-1 hash function. In addition to authentication and encryption, OTR provides perfect forward secrecy and malleable encryption." | 16:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | works since years | 16:20 |
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| crashanddie | docscrutinizer: aye, proprietary implementation though. | 16:20 |
| RST38h | OMG encryption it must be illegal | 16:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: so what? | 16:20 |
| * SpeedEvil stabs anyone that used 'perfect' in the sense of any encryption. | 16:20 | |
| kerio | SpeedEvil: one-time pads are perfect! | 16:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie: as proprietary and open as PGP/GPG | 16:20 |
| RST38h | s/in the sense of any encryption// | 16:20 |
| SpeedEvil | Somewhat perfect, yes. | 16:21 |
| crashanddie | docscrutinizer: talking about ours, don't care about ZRTP :P | 16:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | ooh | 16:21 |
| SpeedEvil | AES isn't - there are already attacks faster than bruteforce on subsets of the algorithm. | 16:21 |
| SpeedEvil | It still - appears - to be strong at full depth. | 16:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ~spank crashanddie | 16:21 |
| * infobot bends crashanddie over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on crashanddie's pasty white buttocks. | 16:21 | |
| crashanddie | :( | 16:22 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 16:22 |
| kerio | XORing with a one-time pad is as secure as it gets right? | 16:22 |
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| tobis87 | And AES-128 is securer than AES-256 | 16:22 |
| crashanddie | and here we go again | 16:22 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 16:22 |
| crashanddie | funny thing is, most people don't understand the impact of encryption | 16:23 |
| RST38h | most people do not care | 16:23 |
| RST38h | only evildoers care about encryption, "most people" have nothing to hide :) | 16:23 |
| Surfa | most people don't need to care | 16:23 |
| kerio | yeah | 16:23 |
| crashanddie | well, it's the interweb, so they go screaming "IT'S NOT SECURE ENOUGH, IT'S BROKEN" | 16:23 |
| kerio | why do you want encryption | 16:23 |
| kerio | are you a pedophile | 16:23 |
| kerio | or a terrorist | 16:23 |
| pexi | aes is as strong as your ability to absorb pain | 16:23 |
| crashanddie | the answer is, yes to both. | 16:23 |
| kerio | pexi: lol | 16:23 |
| marmoute | kerio: I have a bank account too | 16:24 |
| crashanddie | marmoute, congrats | 16:24 |
| marmoute | kerio: does it put me in the above categories ? | 16:24 |
| kerio | marmoute: a bank account that you use to buy CP and bombs? | 16:24 |
| crashanddie | marmoute, having a bank account doesn't require encryption | 16:24 |
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| TiagoTiago | OTR has perfect foward secrecy, which means not even you can decrypt old conversations | 16:25 |
| crashanddie | "perfect" only means something when you're writing the standard and rfc | 16:25 |
| lindi- | TiagoTiago: and the manufacturer of your monitor firmware :) | 16:25 |
| crashanddie | as soon as it's published, it's not perfect anymore | 16:25 |
| MNZ | TiagoTiago, you can _remember_ the conversations though, so it's still only as strong as your ability to absorb pain, as pexi noted | 16:25 |
| crashanddie | I'll be fucked if I remember this stupid conversation in 24h# | 16:26 |
| MNZ | but you could LIE and go to HELL for it >:| don't lie | 16:26 |
| TiagoTiago | then it's a good thing i got a weak memory for these type of things Xp | 16:26 |
| kerio | MNZ: only terrorists and pedophiles lie! | 16:26 |
| crashanddie | you just lied, kerio | 16:26 |
| TiagoTiago | politicians are both | 16:27 |
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| TiagoTiago | <.< | 16:30 |
| tobis87 | crashanddie: No, my point to not use aes-256 is not only becauses it is weaker than aes-128, but because it is slower and it does not improve anything. I still use aes if it is faster than twofish. | 16:30 |
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| TiagoTiago | why people insist in password safes instead olf using things like http://passwordmaker.org/ and not keepping their passwords stored anywhere? | 16:32 |
| TiagoTiago | s/olf/of/ | 16:33 |
| infobot | TiagoTiago meant: why people insist in password safes instead of using things like http://passwordmaker.org/ and not keepping their passwords stored anywhere? | 16:33 |
| kerio | TiagoTiago: cool | 16:34 |
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| crashanddie | TiagoTiago, personally, I use a password manager that I wrote myself on an encrypted usb dongle | 16:36 |
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| crashanddie | I just give it the application reference, and it gives me a password, I never even know the password | 16:37 |
| crashanddie | on windows, it fills in the passwords in firefox and IE automagically, so I don't even need to interact with it, on osx/linux, it's a manual process where I click on the app name, and it puts the password in clipboard | 16:37 |
| TiagoTiago | that doesn't sound very safe, keeping all your passwords stored in a single place..... | 16:38 |
| crashanddie | as opposed to using the same password for everything? | 16:38 |
| crashanddie | And everyone does that, anyway | 16:38 |
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| TiagoTiago | i don't do either of those, like i said, i use Password Maker, different passwords on each service and the passwords aren't stored anywhere | 16:39 |
| ieatlint | assuming the encryption on the dongle is secure, it's just as secure as using a hashing algorithm to just hash your password with a url as that passwordmaker.org seems to | 16:39 |
| ghostcube | my passwords are on printed paper in my desk | 16:39 |
| kerio | ghostcube: good job | 16:39 |
| ghostcube | :D better than any software shit | 16:39 |
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| ieatlint | i'm surprised no one has brought up again the fact that passwords stored on the n900 are all plaintext :P | 16:41 |
| Khertan_atWork | not all :) | 16:41 |
| Khertan_atWork | Khweeteur use oauth so no pass :) | 16:41 |
| TiagoTiago | there is still all the parameters to set the hashing, even if someone figures out my password they still gotta figure out all the other stuff, meanwhile i can remeber it all easilly | 16:41 |
| ZogG | WTF? ARE NOKIA STUPID? | 16:41 |
| Stskeeps | what did they do again? | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:42 |
| Khertan_atWork | ieatlint: many users use gainroot ... this is worse ;) | 16:42 |
| ZogG | from inside source (not mine) there is info they are considering using win7 as alternative os with symbian and meego | 16:42 |
| ZogG | Khertan_atWork btw i saw several bugs | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG: they run win7 on booklet ;p | 16:42 |
| TiagoTiago | i don't think that comes thru reliable sources | 16:42 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: there isn't bug :) | 16:43 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: oh which one , | 16:43 |
| Khertan_atWork | ? | 16:43 |
| crashanddie | yeah, and from inside source (not mine), the new CEO loves to kill puppies around lunchtime while he's doing his secretary from behind | 16:43 |
| ZogG | first of all scrolling is not smooth, sometimes small finger move scroll whole list, so it's hard to scroll only several twits | 16:43 |
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| ieatlint | crashanddie: can we send him puppies? | 16:43 |
| Stskeeps | crashanddie: if you got that kind of pay, could you blame him? | 16:43 |
| Khertan_atWork | crashanddie: hhum using secretary like this is french style... | 16:43 |
| crashanddie | Khertan_atWork, nope, that's international | 16:43 |
| Khertan_atWork | crashanddie: the international way is more the clinton way :) | 16:44 |
| crashanddie | the main difference is that with France, even mistresses have mistresses | 16:44 |
| ZogG | Khertan_atWork, as well, sometimes the timeline is moved up the window, so there is black line between it and text inbox, but after several seconds it comming back in the place | 16:44 |
| crashanddie | it comes** | 16:44 |
| ieatlint | zalgo | 16:44 |
| TiagoTiago | in soviet russia the secretary does you from behind | 16:44 |
| ZogG | crashanddie it's from mobile-review and if you consider they get all new prototypes to test from inside - i would consider it as the news | 16:45 |
| crashanddie | TiagoTiago, fail | 16:45 |
| ieatlint | TiagoTiago: that happens here too | 16:45 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 16:45 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: it s not a khweeteur bug, even if it look like it is ...it s not. This is a bug of your eyes signal not well interpreted by your brain. | 16:45 |
| ZogG | crashanddie i come | 16:45 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: seriously, it s a qt4.6 bug fixed in qt4.7 | 16:45 |
| ZogG | Khertan_atWork lol | 16:45 |
| crashanddie | TiagoTiago, the "in soviet russia..." meme should always end with "YOU" | 16:45 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: and a won't fix for 4.6 release ;( | 16:46 |
| ZogG | Khertan_atWork never saw it on any other app, which one of them btw you are talking about, black line or scrolling? | 16:46 |
| TiagoTiago | artistic licence | 16:46 |
| ZogG | Khertan_atWork anyway 4.7 is out | 16:46 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: 4.7 is out ... but not for maemo | 16:46 |
| crashanddie | ZogG, it's not gospell, they have it wrong quite a few times | 16:46 |
| crashanddie | Stskeeps, that kind of pay? He's not being paid *that* much... | 16:47 |
| ZogG | crashanddie will see it, but i wouldn't be surprised | 16:47 |
| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: i already see it in : KhtEditor and other qt apps using qlistview | 16:47 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint, he won't take puppies, but you can send secretaries | 16:47 |
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| ZogG | crashanddie nokia strategy is the best , chaos and absurd - it makes no sense - so you can't defeat them | 16:47 |
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| ieatlint | :( | 16:47 |
| TiagoTiago | do i install the new qt myself or does each maker of each program needs to recompile their stuff using the new thing? | 16:47 |
| crashanddie | because they defeat themselves? | 16:47 |
| ieatlint | i don't have any secretaries to send | 16:47 |
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| ieatlint | TiagoTiago: you mean in upgrading to qt 4.7? ... the dynamic linker should handle it, no need to recompile apps | 16:48 |
| ZogG | crashanddie it's also good point , kill ones of your own, so enemies would be affraid of you | 16:48 |
| ieatlint | they keep api compliance | 16:48 |
| ZogG | crashanddie do't you do it in france? | 16:48 |
| TiagoTiago | so i should install it myself? | 16:48 |
| ieatlint | on maemo? | 16:49 |
| Khertan_atWork | lcuk: an other meego qt diff : neither QT_SHARED nor QT_DLL is defined in the Meego Qt build | 16:49 |
| ieatlint | i would say definitely not, unless you know exactly what you're doing | 16:49 |
| ZogG | oh btw pr1.3 will bring some of meego features =) | 16:49 |
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| ZogG | and it's not gossip | 16:49 |
| TiagoTiago | 3x3 homescreens? | 16:49 |
| ieatlint | ZogG: here's to hoping it's the rpm feature they bring! | 16:50 |
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| ZogG | ieatlint don't really hope for that | 16:50 |
| ZogG | on one hand it's easier for meego apps to be ported (as i don't think all devs with closed source would make debs as well) | 16:51 |
| ZogG | but on other it can break a lot of stuff | 16:51 |
| ZogG | and from what i hear rpm sux =) | 16:51 |
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| Khertan_atWork | ZogG: yep i confirm that some rpm tools sucks | 16:51 |
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| Khertan_atWork | sending a sigterm to yum while updating or reading database will result in a broken rpmdb | 16:52 |
| Khertan_atWork | :) | 16:52 |
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| ZogG | hmmm, do they do it well? now as i'm lonely i'm considering to emerge one of those | 16:52 |
| TiagoTiago | are we ever gonna get the 3x3 homescreens? | 16:52 |
| Khertan_atWork | TiagoTiago: i hope not | 16:52 |
| TiagoTiago | why? | 16:52 |
| ZogG | TiagoTiago like in droid or what do you mean? | 16:52 |
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| TiagoTiago | 8-way swiping, toroidal topology, 3x3=9 homescreens, would rock big time | 16:53 |
| GAN900 | Harmattan has some sort of mockup like that from 2009 | 16:54 |
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| GAN900 | Dunno if it'll have anything to do with the real thing though. | 16:54 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 16:56 |
| TiagoTiago | http://mynokiablog.com/2009/12/24/video-9-homescreens-on-the-n900-all-accessable-in-one-swipe/ | 16:56 |
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| tobis87 | TiagoTiago: I wouldn't know what I should put on all these screens. | 16:58 |
| * RST38h feels like 4 home screens are too much, and you are offering 9! | 16:58 | |
| GAN900 | I never use more than 1. | 16:59 |
| GAN900 | Just isn't convenient. | 16:59 |
| Myrtti | you people are weird, I've got 5 on my N1 and two of them have pictures of tumbleweed on them. | 16:59 |
| GAN900 | Swiping is such a pain. | 16:59 |
| TiagoTiago | lol | 16:59 |
| tobis87 | I suppose you have to like widgets, to have the need for that. I also only use one. | 16:59 |
| ieatlint | agreed... i use 2, disabled the rest | 16:59 |
| RST38h | Nexus has buttons to access them though, no? | 16:59 |
| ieatlint | have one for apps, and one for actual phone stuff like the dialer | 16:59 |
| TiagoTiago | i could use a few more, don't like crowding them | 17:00 |
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| Myrtti | RST38h: I swype. | 17:00 |
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| TiagoTiago | that is not avaiable for the N900 yet either | 17:01 |
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| jo-erlend | can I use deb packages from Maemo in Ubuntu ARM? | 17:03 |
| lcuk | you can, but it likely wont work out too well | 17:03 |
| jo-erlend | ok? | 17:03 |
| jo-erlend | I was hoping I didn't have to compile and create packages manually. Thought I'd see if x2goclient would work well on my igepv2 board. | 17:04 |
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| lcuk | jo-erlend, yes you will usually have to rebuild packages | 17:06 |
| lcuk | and remember to send all your patches back upstream to maemo | 17:06 |
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| TiagoTiago | is there a physics toy that is a box with stuff inside that reacts to the accelerometers like it's a real box with loose stuff inside? | 17:09 |
| lcuk | TiagoTiago, theres a few, try liqflow for similar, gas balls has balls which touch the sides and fluid dynamics | 17:10 |
| TiagoTiago | the scale is off, and the whole fluid simulation makes things not move quite realistic | 17:11 |
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| lcuk | TiagoTiago, which scale? | 17:11 |
| TiagoTiago | i mean, it's realistic for liquid but not for air | 17:11 |
| lcuk | then make one | 17:12 |
| lcuk | box2d is around somewhere | 17:12 |
| TiagoTiago | either the time or the physical scale, it doesn't look real for the size on screen | 17:12 |
| lcuk | ok TiagoTiago which doesnt look real | 17:12 |
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| TiagoTiago | was that a question? | 17:14 |
| lcuk | yes, which application are you actually talking about? | 17:14 |
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| TiagoTiago | gas balls in some aspects and liqflow in others, and both in some as well | 17:15 |
| lcuk | I guess you just want to tweak and play around with stuff | 17:16 |
| TiagoTiago | yeah | 17:16 |
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| lcuk | :) understood entirely | 17:16 |
| lcuk | hey tekojo \o | 17:16 |
| tekojo | hi lcuk | 17:17 |
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| lcuk | tekojo, did you go to the meego night the other day? | 17:18 |
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| tekojo | lcuk: no, bad timing plus I was coming down with a flu | 17:18 |
| tekojo | err, cold that | 17:19 |
| tekojo | os | 17:19 |
| lcuk | eep, thats not good, I hope you stayed off IRC too | 17:19 |
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| TiagoTiago | brb | 17:19 |
| * lcuk updates his virus checker and then emails some tissues | 17:19 | |
| tekojo | thanks, getting better already :) | 17:19 |
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| lcuk | :O I've lost an n900 | 17:21 |
| * MohammadAG51 stole it | 17:21 | |
| lcuk | you bastard, give it back | 17:21 |
| MohammadAG51 | NEVAR!!! | 17:21 |
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| raster | i ate it | 17:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | I want 100kgs of bacon | 17:22 |
| lcuk | back in reality i found it again, it was hiding under my n810 | 17:22 |
| * MohammadAG51 finds PR1.4 on the N900 | 17:22 | |
| MohammadAG51 | I want 10000kgs of bacon!!! | 17:22 |
| Appiah | we all do | 17:22 |
| Appiah | share | 17:22 |
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| TiagoTiago | i gotta go, cya | 17:27 |
| lcuk | MohammadAG51, share the bacon | 17:28 |
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| n900-space | hi all | 17:31 |
| tobis87 | http://baconbaconbacon.tumblr.com/ | 17:31 |
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| h4waii | Who wants to get stabbed? | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | can i drink myself senseless first? | 17:37 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, that will then be messy | 17:38 |
| lcuk | the beer will leak out | 17:38 |
| * w00t considers alcohol | 17:39 | |
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| Stskeeps | w00t: or sleep | 17:41 |
| w00t_ | sleep is overrated | 17:41 |
| lcuk | w00t_, do sauna and booze, then you will sleep better | 17:41 |
| MohammadAG51 | agreed :p | 17:42 |
| * MohammadAG51 sleeps 5 hours now | 17:42 | |
| ZogG | MohammadAG51 but you don't drink | 17:42 |
| h4waii | He drinks C-Plus. Leave him alone. | 17:42 |
| MohammadAG51 | does it matter? | 17:43 |
| GAN900 | Sleep sounds really nice right now. | 17:44 |
| GAN900 | and it's only 1045 | 17:44 |
| OptX | Hi, did up a wrong pack to extras-devel, is there a way to remove it ? | 17:44 |
| lcuk | OptX, you have to physically go to the server. | 17:45 |
| ZogG | OptX re up the god pack | 17:45 |
| ZogG | or ask the admins | 17:45 |
| h4waii | Only I have access to "the God pack". | 17:46 |
| OptX | lol | 17:46 |
| h4waii | I require a banana cognac to fix your problem. | 17:46 |
| Khertan_atWork | hum ... God pack should depends on christianism ... i will vote thumb down | 17:46 |
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| Khertan_atWork | :) | 17:47 |
| RST38h | give him bacon! | 17:47 |
| OptX | cant re up the pack, the one i need has lower version :( | 17:47 |
| kerio | MORE BACON ON #maemo! | 17:47 |
| Khertan_atWork | ~bacon | 17:47 |
| infobot | somebody said bacon was a filling substance which will make you even fatter than you already are... Take my advice, bacon is a food for the gods or for underweight models such as that McBeal chick... | 17:47 |
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| lcuk | OptX, if the one you need is already on maemo you can coerce apt or dpkg to give older version | 17:48 |
| lcuk | mmmmm bacon | 17:48 |
| Khertan_atWork | God package should depends on bacon too ? | 17:48 |
| kerio | of course | 17:48 |
| kerio | everything should depend on bacon | 17:48 |
| lcuk | yes, but package bacon will not fit on the internal rootfs :( | 17:48 |
| lcuk | it needed optifying first | 17:48 |
| h4waii | burritos don't depend on bacon. | 17:48 |
| lcuk | which involved many sandwiches | 17:49 |
| OptX | lcuk this one i need is not there, looks like i have to as a admin ... | 17:49 |
| kerio | lcuk: bacon fits everywhere | 17:49 |
| OptX | but best im mouth | 17:49 |
| h4waii | That's what she said. | 17:50 |
| OptX | hrhr | 17:50 |
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| h4waii | hrhr is a racist term. | 17:50 |
| h4waii | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=62838 | 17:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | raster: was it tasty at least? :-D | 17:54 |
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| OptX | h4waii racist term ... did not know that :( | 17:58 |
| Khertan_atWork | Using BUILD_ROOT=/OBS.worker/root10/.mount Using BUILD_ARCH=i586:i486:i386 Doing xen build in /OBS.worker/root10/root wml0252 started "build python-qt4.spec" at Fri Sep 24 17:56:04 EEST 2010. Building python-qt4 for project 'home:khertan' repository 'MeeGo_1.0_Core' arch 'i586' srcmd5 'b4ac322a3e0376161192d26154d22715' processing specfile /OBS.worker/root10/.build-srcdir/python-qt4.spec ... running changelog2spec --target r | 17:59 |
| Khertan_atWork | oups sorry | 17:59 |
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| h4waii | OptX - just kidding dude :P | 18:00 |
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| jpinx-eeepc | h4waii: bs . how do you reckon hrhr is racist? | 18:04 |
| dRbiG | hmm, mount.cifs seems not to care about uid= and gid= options :S | 18:04 |
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| h4waii | jpinx-eeepc - I said I was kidding. Cool it, professor. | 18:07 |
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| ZogG | jpinx-eeepc it's bad word in african language | 18:08 |
| jpinx-eeepc | h4waii: yea - saw that as I hit return ;) no problem :) | 18:08 |
| daleglass | Hello! I'm trying to build modules for my N900. Is it possible to build a module that matches the currently running kernel? I'm using the "power" kernel currently. | 18:09 |
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| ZogG | daleglass i think so | 18:10 |
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| ZogG | why not | 18:10 |
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| dRbiG | anyone got a smb share mounted so that the user user can access it? | 18:15 |
| rainbird | does anyone know of an application menu alternative...something like a start menu the old maemo used to have... | 18:16 |
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| h4waii | rainbird, No. Try AppMeFo for some folder customization. | 18:17 |
| _jacktheripper | my n900 doesn't detect it's connected through USB (doesn't even start charging) until a reboot. any ideas ? :S | 18:17 |
| dRbiG | aaay, got it | 18:17 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: Just make sure /lib/modules/` uname -r`/build points to the corresponding kernel headers and add EXTRAVERSION=NAME, where NAME stands for the powerkernel version you use. | 18:17 |
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| rainbird | thanks h4waii, I already have that, thats the best I can get | 18:17 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: A very simple makefile, http://pastebin.com/2wSJxCwG | 18:18 |
| * DocScrutinizer mumbles "depmod" | 18:20 | |
| rainbird | anyone got GrimWepa? | 18:20 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, hmm and when it reboots, its able to detect that its connected to USB easily regardless if its going through a charger or another device capable of being USB host? | 18:20 |
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| h4waii | rainbird - it's on the google code page. | 18:21 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, yep | 18:21 |
| daleglass | tobis87: thanks, will give it a try | 18:21 |
| rainbird | :) | 18:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: you heard my mumbling? :-) | 18:21 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, and MyDocs isn't in-use. I just checked. | 18:21 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: Do you use scratchbox? Which module do you need? | 18:21 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, it might be an issue with lag, it could be that the CPU gets overloaded.. there could be various reasons for this | 18:22 |
| daleglass | tobis87: scratchbox, trying to build compcache | 18:22 |
| daleglass | DocScrutinizer: yeah, but don't see how would depmod do it | 18:22 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: I have got it compiled, I will paste the makefile | 18:22 |
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| DocScrutinizer | it won't 'do it', you'll just probably want to run depmod -a after copying your new module to N900 | 18:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: I always tend to forget about it, so that's why I mentioned it | 18:23 |
| daleglass | DocScrutinizer: that won't do it. The symbol versions in the module I got don't match with the kernel on the device (the version is the same) | 18:23 |
| psycho_oreos | so you'll need to compile the source with your preferred kernel | 18:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: I'm well aware of that issue you're facing. I didn't suggest depmod's a way to fix it | 18:24 |
| daleglass | DocScrutinizer: aha, misunderstood then | 18:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: modprobe --force might, though | 18:25 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: Not much difference to the original http://pastebin.com/kEc6cMEf , replace omap1 with the kernel name and strip the module after you compiled it (objcopy --strip-debug) | 18:25 |
| tobis87 | then copy it to /lib/modules/2.6.28-name/ and run as DocScrutinizer said depmod -ae | 18:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | umm, wasn't that called 'strip' simply, in former times? | 18:26 |
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| tobis87 | DocScrutinizer: Not for kernel modules, there is even a difference between strip-debug and strip-unneeded | 18:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer | tobis87: aah, I see | 18:28 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, CPU usage increases just a tiny little bit when I connect. Could I somehow make the device spit an error ? there's nothing in dmesg. | 18:29 |
| agi | qwerty | 18:30 |
| agi | oopps :) | 18:30 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, but in your current n900 you haven't rebooted and its meant to show where it doesn't get detected as charging right? | 18:30 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: And make sure you use the correct headers. You might have to extract the power kernel headers and create a link to it. So the module gets compiled with the correct headers. | 18:31 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, yes. right. | 18:31 |
| daleglass | tobis87: cool, thanks :-) I suppose that means you tried it then. Does it make a big difference? | 18:31 |
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| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, probably a hardware issue heh, running stock kernel? | 18:31 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, actually it starts charging when connected to the charger. But not when connected to my laptop. | 18:31 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, titan's | 18:32 |
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| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, it might be issue with negotiation with host between laptop and n900 | 18:32 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: No, I have compiled modules on the n900 and only with the stock kernel. But there shouldn't be a difference, you could also replace /lib/modules/$(shell uname -r)/build with /path/to/the/extracted/headers | 18:32 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, it probably is. :( | 18:33 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, ahh ok, yeah I think this is somewhat an issue for some of us whom use titan's kernel | 18:33 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, so it happened before ? | 18:33 |
| daleglass | tobis87: I mean performance with compcache installed | 18:34 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, I have a similar issue to that but only when I connect to the charger, sometimes it will receive power but other times it won't and I have to unplug + plug it back in again | 18:34 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, yes, that happens to me too. | 18:35 |
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| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, I haven't personally had issue with it plugging into my desktop, and my laptops are all currently usb1.1 which aren't handy for charging n900 | 18:36 |
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| dsg | Anyone currently running NFSv4 on n900? | 18:37 |
| dsg | I've got kernel support, but get "wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock ..." error when trying to mount with -t nfs4 | 18:38 |
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| daleglass | dsg: that usually means you're missing nfsutils or portmap, IIRC | 18:39 |
| dsg | I have both, but possibly not the right version I guess | 18:39 |
| dsg | hmm | 18:39 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, it's already plugged in and I plug it out, the screen lights up o.O | 18:40 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, yup that's what happens, but when that happened to me I plug it back onto charger and I get the banner that says its charging | 18:40 |
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| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, that happens to me with the laptop too. Except it doesn't get fixed if I plug out and in. | 18:41 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, I'll just restart and forget about it :S | 18:41 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: You will not gain much memory from it, but I consider it as a better choice than swapping everything to disk. My best experience is 32MB with the mmcblk0p3 as backing store. | 18:42 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: Using the drive as backingstore means that pages which can't be compressed are written to the disk. And since the n900 always swaps out, the first programs which run idle (browser) are still keept compressed in memory. | 18:42 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, I'd say if you are curious you can compile usb as driver and enable verbose outputting.. that plus sysklogd for example may help | 18:42 |
| _jacktheripper | and I was wondering why there was no output. | 18:43 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, can the module be replaced without a reboot ? | 18:43 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: And reduce the swapiness to 50 | 18:44 |
| _jacktheripper | psycho_oreos, I think I have to recompile the whole kernel. nvm | 18:45 |
| psycho_oreos | _jacktheripper, that I don't know lol, afaik the usb module was compiled into the kernel rather than compiled as a kernel loadable module.. and if it is, you can't simply put a compiled usb kernel object and load it when its already incorporated | 18:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | psycho_oreos: usb driver is monolithic. can't go module. | 18:48 |
| rainbird | does grimwepa work without aircrack etc installed or does it rely on it... | 18:49 |
| psycho_oreos | DocScrutinizer, bah oh well lol, thought it would be interesting if one could debug it | 18:49 |
| psycho_oreos | grimwepa depends on aircrack-ng | 18:49 |
| rainbird | thought so, thnks | 18:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | when no charging on USB host, you probably fail on ENUM, so the charger sw doesn't know how much current is available | 18:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | might be caused by broken cable, broken N900 USB receptacle, or any host side issue | 18:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | fastcharger detect also is via D+/- short of USB | 18:51 |
| psycho_oreos | hmm | 18:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | so if the receptacle has a broken pin on either D+ or D- it won't detect wallcharger as well | 18:52 |
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| * DocScrutinizer waves | 18:52 | |
| psycho_oreos | yeah I wouldn't suspect it would be receptacle that would be broken lol, it seems to be working on both jacktheripper as well as mine, it just needs to re-detect | 18:53 |
| jacktheripper | just tried umounting MyDocs | 18:53 |
| jacktheripper | 'device or resource busy' | 18:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | aiui jacktheripper has a persistent problem now, with both wallcharger and host | 18:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | jacktheripper: will your host show any logs in syslog, when plugging in the N900? | 18:54 |
| jacktheripper | and no, the wallcharger works and the laptop works connection works after a reboot | 18:54 |
| jacktheripper | it's windows :D | 18:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah, k. A reboot won't fix the receptacle :-P | 18:55 |
| jacktheripper | it did before :P | 18:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | cya | 18:55 |
| MohammadAG51 | But a reboot will always fix windows | 18:55 |
| jacktheripper | a reboot of the N900 | 18:55 |
| * MohammadAG51 looks at "Missing system file: hal.dll" | 18:55 | |
| MohammadAG51 | I fixed windows by removing a system file and rebooting :) | 18:56 |
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| jacktheripper | did it even boot without hal.dll ? :D | 18:56 |
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| jacktheripper | or that's how you *fixed* it ? | 18:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | ultimate fix for windoes is to remove everything from C: | 18:57 |
| jacktheripper | DocScrutinizer: it doesn't give you the chance to do so | 18:57 |
| jacktheripper | can I know what's preventing MyDocs from unmounting ? | 18:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | lsof|grep MyDocs | 18:58 |
| jacktheripper | nothing. While umount says "device or resource busy" | 18:58 |
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| jacktheripper | that's definitely why connecting to the laptop isn't working. | 18:59 |
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| jacktheripper | I can just force umount it and it'd work, but that'd ruin the crime scene :D | 19:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | hmm, not really. Just watch which processes will barf | 19:02 |
| jacktheripper | bme-rx51. Tried stopping and starting using upstart. Nothing changed. | 19:02 |
| tobis87 | jacktheripper: rd /s /q c:\ should be the same as rm -rf / , but have not tried it. | 19:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | jacktheripper: bme shouldn't interfere with MyDocs | 19:03 |
| jacktheripper | tobis87: windows would say "file in use" on most files in C:\Windows. Plus, it's not a windows problem. Cut the windows sarcasm :P It's not too bad. | 19:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer | anyway a 'stop bme' should do _something_ | 19:04 |
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| jacktheripper | well yes, it doesn't charge through the wallcharger. But after a start it works again. No net changes | 19:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | hmm, bme borks then. did you try 'stop bme; start bme' ? | 19:05 |
| jacktheripper | I did. | 19:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | I think powerkernel has some driver for bq27200 that kills bme | 19:06 |
| jacktheripper | hmm bme stays on after a 'start bme' | 19:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer | you need to modprobe -r it to make bme happy, iirc | 19:06 |
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| jacktheripper | I'll just try force umounting MyDocs now. | 19:06 |
| jacktheripper | ah | 19:06 |
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| jacktheripper | "umount: cannot forcibly umount /home/user/MyDocs: Device or resource busy" :/ | 19:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer | if bme is started before the bq27200 module gets modprobed, then it'll probably work | 19:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's why a reboot fixes things for you | 19:08 |
| jacktheripper | what's the module name ? | 19:09 |
| jacktheripper | bq27200 doesn't 'exist' here | 19:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | lsmod|grep 27 | 19:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | lsmod|grep bq | 19:09 |
| jacktheripper | no output | 19:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry, really have to leave now | 19:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | o/ | 19:09 |
| jacktheripper | okay, thanks for the help, c ya. | 19:10 |
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| kwtm | Hi, noticed the end of your conversation. | 19:12 |
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| kwtm | You are trying to umount MyDocs? | 19:12 |
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| jacktheripper | kwtm: yes | 19:13 |
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| kwtm | jacktheripper: Are you trying to figure out what process is keeping MyDocs open, or do you already know? | 19:13 |
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| kwtm | I'm just using my general Linux knowledge here; I'm a n900 noob, too. | 19:13 |
| jacktheripper | kwtm: I'm trying to figure it out, lsof outputs nothing, and MyDocs is 'busy'. | 19:14 |
| kwtm | jacktheripper: Are you using lsof as root? | 19:14 |
| jacktheripper | root ssh yes | 19:14 |
| kwtm | Okay, I'm out of ideas, then. :P Hmm... let this percolate for a while. | 19:15 |
| jacktheripper | haha | 19:15 |
| kwtm | Is it a showstopper? I mean, are you at the point where you're going to reflash? | 19:15 |
| jacktheripper | kwtm: no. The whole problem was in getting my windows box to recognize there's something connected to it. It happened before, and after a reboot it was fixed. Now I'm trying to figure out why it's not connecting. | 19:16 |
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| jacktheripper | (it doesn't even start charging) | 19:16 |
| jacktheripper | (while it does through the wallcharger) | 19:16 |
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| satmd | fuser | 19:19 |
| jacktheripper | doesn't work either | 19:21 |
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| pupnik | "By just pressing the magic AI button, you get a simple menu, letting you literally switch between several OS running at the same time on the same machine on a single processor. Instant-play, you can take the most of each OS, which means in our case: our AIOS, Android, and Ubuntu. Best of all, you can share your documents between those side-by-side instances." http://www.alwaysinnovating.com/products/aios.htm | 19:38 |
| pupnik | hmmmmm | 19:38 |
| jpinx-eeepc | yea- right - just use a chroot ;) | 19:40 |
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| kerio | heh | 19:41 |
| kerio | it's either that or xen | 19:42 |
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| jpinx-eeepc | I haven't tried xen on the n900 - will it work? | 19:42 |
| MNZ | "no performance loss" I don't think that's xen... | 19:42 |
| kerio | heh | 19:43 |
| wmarone | doesn't xen need hardware virtualization support? | 19:43 |
| kerio | running 5 kernels at the same time is l33t | 19:43 |
| kerio | wmarone: it does | 19:43 |
| kerio | no, wait | 19:43 |
| kerio | i'm not usre | 19:43 |
| kerio | sure | 19:43 |
| MNZ | kerio, one kernel | 19:43 |
| wmarone | cause I don't think I want to go back to pure software virtualization :) | 19:43 |
| MNZ | "All OS are running on the 2.6.32 Linux kernel, and got several optimizations to take benefits of the advanced instructions available in the chipset. | 19:44 |
| kerio | yeah, xen needs hw support *and* x86 | 19:44 |
| MNZ | " | 19:44 |
| kerio | MNZ: fancy wording for "it's just one kernel running that we supply with multiple chroots with mountbinds to access the same home" | 19:44 |
| wmarone | ah, if it requires x86 then that might explain the rise of KVM (assuming it isn't arch dependent.) | 19:44 |
| joga | hmm...I think you don't need vt for xen unless you want to run something like windows | 19:45 |
| MNZ | kerio, pretty much eh | 19:45 |
| joga | usually the guests are linux modified for xen | 19:45 |
| tobis87 | pupnik: Interesting, or some kind of hypervisitor. But a hypervisitor does not have hw accel on arm. And the video wouldn't be that smooth in software then. A chroot with ubuntu and android, which would than be the main system? Does android not need a modified kernel. | 19:45 |
| wmarone | hypervisor* | 19:45 |
| luke-jr | LXC/OpenVZ, n00bs | 19:45 |
| wmarone | ;) | 19:45 |
| kerio | tobis87: depends on the hardware, of course | 19:45 |
| kerio | but yeah, it's just a single kernel | 19:45 |
| wmarone | has ARM indicated future support for hardware virtualization? | 19:45 |
| MNZ | I think openvz as well | 19:46 |
| kerio | that runs on a personalized distro with huge fancy buttons to load the different chroots :) | 19:46 |
| MNZ | single kernel then it's prolly openvz | 19:46 |
| luke-jr | wmarone: KVM == hardware virtualization (x86) | 19:46 |
| tobis87 | The latest major step, I have read about is that arm will support more than 4gb ram. | 19:46 |
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| luke-jr | tobis87: why? they don't even have 2 GB RAM yet | 19:47 |
| jpinx-eeepc | tobis87: but where to plug it into the hardware ? | 19:47 |
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| tobis87 | but without 64-bit registers, i will look for the article... | 19:47 |
| cheriff | yeah a15 has a 48bit pae-like scheme going on | 19:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | many, many apps don't need 4G of data. | 19:52 |
| luke-jr | SpeedEvil: do any? really? | 19:52 |
| tobis87 | It also introduces a hypervisor extension http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&ie=UTF8&langpair=auto|en&u=http://www.heise.de/ct/meldung/ARM-knackt-die-4-GByte-Grenze-1066389.html | 19:52 |
| SpeedEvil | some large simulations. | 19:53 |
| SpeedEvil | databases. | 19:53 |
| lcuk | pupnik, there was a video playing before the switcharoo wasnt there? | 19:53 |
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| SpeedEvil | The number of apps that actually would be significantly complexified by multiple 2G address spaces if they do need >4G is much smaller still | 19:54 |
| pupnik | sorry lcuk i don't know what you refer-to | 19:54 |
| lcuk | the AI OS switching | 19:54 |
| pupnik | and there was a video playing before the switcharoo? | 19:55 |
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| Phrearch | hi | 20:16 |
| Phrearch | is there a good texteditor for maemo available? gui based? | 20:17 |
| MohammadAG51 | khteditor | 20:17 |
| lcuk | i think emacs works, and they got it outputing to the lcd screen nowadays | 20:17 |
| GAN900 | pygtkeditor | 20:17 |
| javispedro | a holy way! | 20:18 |
| Phrearch | aha | 20:18 |
| Phrearch | cool thanks | 20:18 |
| Phrearch | i prefer a qt based gui | 20:18 |
| javispedro | btw, who can remove my cloak? | 20:19 |
| javispedro | and congratulations to new council :) | 20:19 |
| lcuk | I prefer a functional UI | 20:19 |
| lcuk | whatever holy bible it comes from | 20:19 |
| Phrearch | true | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | javispedro: join #freenode and ask for cloak removal | 20:20 |
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| javispedro | DocScrutinizer, thanks | 20:21 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer51, its not removal, its transfer - x-fade has to dry clean it and pass it onto the new council | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lcuk: a cloak isn't transferable | 20:23 |
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| lcuk | like a light sabre then, i get you. | 20:23 |
| RST38h | HELO javispedro | 20:23 |
| javispedro | heya RST38h | 20:23 |
| RST38h | how is your suffering tonight? | 20:23 |
| javispedro | bank holiday today :) | 20:24 |
| RST38h | ah | 20:24 |
| RST38h | Who got elected to the council btw? | 20:24 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | now who's new council? fired my vote and forgot | 20:24 |
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| javispedro | repeating: attila, jaffa | 20:26 |
| lcuk | Congratulations to the all new #Maemo Council: @timsamoff @RevdKathy @andreagrandi @jaffa2 @achipa | 20:26 |
| javispedro | new entries: timsamoff, andy80, and revdkathy afaik | 20:26 |
| javispedro | thanks lcuk | 20:26 |
| RST38h | aha, thanks | 20:26 |
| pupnik | What are your thoughts on Peter Skillman's joining Nokia? | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | thanks :-) | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | cheers to new council | 20:28 |
| RST38h | pupnik: I would wait for 6 months | 20:29 |
| javispedro | let's hope he can bring in some of that "goodness" from palm's golden age. | 20:30 |
| javispedro | and not a 64 KB record limit =) | 20:30 |
| RST38h | pupnik: There is a good chance they will give him the holy cross of Symbian^n and tell him to carry it to his eventual Golgopha | 20:30 |
| pupnik | maemo /nokia is a big topic in 'the linux action show' | 20:31 |
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| javispedro | hey opdf2 | 20:33 |
| javispedro | er.. | 20:33 |
| javispedro | hey OptX | 20:33 |
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| javispedro | OptX: is the build-depends trick working? | 20:33 |
| pupnik | hmm windows phone 7 is quite a challenger it looks | 20:35 |
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| luke-jr | lcuk: does that mean I don't have to fear DocScrutinizer's anti-tonal anti-Gentoo tyranny⁇? | 20:36 |
| derf | Anti-tonal? | 20:37 |
| derf | He's against dominant harmony? | 20:37 |
| luke-jr | derf: Tonal number system | 20:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | a challenger to my tolerance and patience? | 20:37 |
| lcuk | luke-jr, hm? | 20:37 |
| luke-jr | lcuk: does DocScrutinizer lose ops? :P | 20:38 |
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| luke-jr | hm, not yet at least | 20:38 |
| javispedro | he's already warming up the ban hammer. | 20:39 |
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| * luke-jr wonders what happens if he sets username to fuchs and a RDNS to dns.kernelconcepts.de <.< | 20:40 | |
| satmd | what'd you expect? | 20:40 |
| luke-jr | dunno, ChanServ has that hostmask as +o | 20:40 |
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| Stskeeps | luke-jr: rdns has to resolve back to your ip | 20:42 |
| luke-jr | Stskeeps: does it? | 20:42 |
| luke-jr | I've seen some pretty weird RDNS on freenode | 20:42 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr: you still have to be registered to fuchs account | 20:42 |
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| luke-jr | DocScrutinizer51: username hostmask is not related to NickServ accounts | 20:43 |
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| pupnik | apt-get install android_player | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | but FreeNode abandoned the n= syntax, so maybe it's safe | 20:43 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr: chanserv doesn't op nonregistered users | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | DocScrutinizer51: well then I just use my present nick and identify | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | the +o hostmask doesn't care what nick/user | 20:44 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yep | 20:44 |
| javispedro | http://www.callingallinnovators.com/10M/ yet another flimsy app contest, this time it doesn't even have maemo/meego/n900 category | 20:44 |
| h4waii | flimsy? | 20:45 |
| nidO | why would it, the first words of the competition are "N8 Contest" | 20:45 |
| kerio | lol | 20:45 |
| kerio | if you can write a N8 emulator for the N900 i'm sure you could win the prize | 20:45 |
| lcuk | kerio, if you write a full complete N8 emulator I will hug you :) | 20:46 |
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| lcuk | "Yo dawg, I heard you liked nokias, so I put a nokia inside your nokia" | 20:46 |
| h4waii | roffle. | 20:46 |
| h4waii | That's what it was like when I was in a Nokia RV | 20:47 |
| kerio | lcuk: sure, i'll start working on the 12MPX camera emulator | 20:47 |
| lcuk | kerio, no need | 20:47 |
| lcuk | just has to work | 20:47 |
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| lcuk | whilst you are at it, emulate the older ones as well :P | 20:47 |
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| kerio | i wanna play Snake 2 | 20:48 |
| kerio | ;_; | 20:48 |
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| lcuk | kerio, original snake and b&w display emulated | 20:49 |
| kerio | where? | 20:49 |
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| lcuk | in my head at the moment, but I would prefer them on Ovi | 20:50 |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.20100830_nokia3210.png | 20:50 |
| kerio | lol | 20:50 |
| kerio | the 3310 is way better | 20:50 |
| luke-jr | pfft snake | 20:50 |
| kerio | er, the 3330 | 20:51 |
| luke-jr | why not port Armagetron? | 20:51 |
| wmarone | lcuk: I need that | 20:51 |
| njain | hey, hi | 20:51 |
| wmarone | that is the best smartphone interface I have seen | 20:51 |
| kerio | i want a port of sauerbraten | 20:51 |
| njain | i want to use telnet in n900 | 20:51 |
| kerio | njain: so install it | 20:51 |
| luke-jr | lol | 20:51 |
| luke-jr | no, don't. telnet is broken on N900 | 20:51 |
| njain | through app-manager? | 20:52 |
| kerio | huh? | 20:52 |
| wmarone | telnet is broken | 20:52 |
| luke-jr | there's no secure/sane way to use it | 20:52 |
| wmarone | don't use it | 20:52 |
| luke-jr | it was designed for a direct dialin connection | 20:52 |
| njain | why? | 20:52 |
| luke-jr | not a shared wireless/ethernet link | 20:52 |
| lcuk | wmarone, indeed - if nokia could open the back catalog of *working* simulated original phones it would be cool | 20:52 |
| lcuk | especially if you could dial and send SMSes etc with them as well | 20:52 |
| njain | i mean how come..? | 20:52 |
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| wmarone | njain: because SSH is superior in every way | 20:53 |
| lcuk | Meego OldSkool UX :D | 20:53 |
| luke-jr | njain: it was designed for 1960s, not 2010s | 20:53 |
| njain | what are my options? | 20:53 |
| luke-jr | njain: SSH | 20:53 |
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| njain | it shows ssh:ON but issuing ssh ip on terminal says ssh not installed.. | 20:55 |
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| luke-jr | … | 20:55 |
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| nidO | are you wanting to ssh in or out? | 20:55 |
| njain | ssh in that ip | 20:56 |
| luke-jr | wd making no sense | 20:56 |
| nidO | ill ask again | 20:56 |
| nidO | are you using the device to ssh out somewhere else, or trying to ssh from somewhere else into the device? | 20:56 |
| njain | i am on a mobile connection.. | 20:56 |
| njain | yes | 20:56 |
| luke-jr | LOL | 20:57 |
| luke-jr | fail | 20:57 |
| nidO | you cant answer an either/or question with "yes" | 20:57 |
| nidO | its one or the other. | 20:57 |
| njain | i am sshing out somewhere else | 20:57 |
| nidO | have you installed the ssh client then? | 20:57 |
| nidO | installing the openssh server wont help you | 20:57 |
| nidO | which it sounds like you've installed | 20:57 |
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| njain | yeah i realised either or later after sending yes.. | 20:58 |
| njain | so openssh server helps me to ssh in my device from somewhere else? | 20:58 |
| nidO | yes | 20:59 |
| njain | ok. | 20:59 |
| njain | and for ssh out? | 20:59 |
| nidO | you need the ssh client. | 20:59 |
| njain | yeah. | 20:59 |
| njain | what is this precisely? | 20:59 |
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| njain | btw, i am loving my n900 thanks to all the people who brought it together.. | 21:01 |
| njain | its just what I wanted.. | 21:01 |
| njain | things less could be developed! | 21:01 |
| njain | sshclient suggestions? | 21:03 |
| Khertan_Home | open-ssh :) | 21:04 |
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| MohammadAG | openssh-client :) | 21:05 |
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| njain | thanks. | 21:05 |
| Khertan_Home | MohammadAG, true | 21:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | njain: :-D | 21:06 |
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| MohammadAG | Khertan's here :D | 21:07 |
| MohammadAG | khteditor is awesome, but it fails to start for python files with no extension :) | 21:07 |
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| MNZ | any ideas on how I would go about running a certain action after the value of a GtkScale has stabilized (ie, it hasn't changed for say 1 second) without killing the resources too much? | 21:08 |
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| javispedro | you can create a timer than only fires once | 21:09 |
| MNZ | javispedro, create it when? | 21:10 |
| javispedro | everytime the user moves the slider | 21:10 |
| MNZ | problem is the only signal available is value-changed which fires several tens of times per second for small drag of the slider | 21:11 |
| MNZ | it will result in a whole bunch of create/destroy until user stops effing around | 21:11 |
| MNZ | bleh I can't think of another way, and #gtk+ suggested the same. nvm | 21:12 |
| javispedro | so, store tick count in some var when the event fires, create timer if not created yet | 21:12 |
| njain | now how do I ssh out to say an address 1.2.3.4 | 21:12 |
| javispedro | when timer fires, if last tick > threshold, do_hard_stuff() then delete timer | 21:12 |
| njain | : | 21:12 |
| javispedro | if last_tick < threshold, return TRUE so that timer fires again | 21:12 |
| njain | i installed the client. | 21:13 |
| MNZ | javispedro, thanks that sounds good enough. It would be optimal if there were start-drag/stop-drag signals but this will do | 21:13 |
| javispedro | MNZ: actually I was wondering I remember I saw that once -- but I've opened devhelp to check and can't find it right now | 21:14 |
| javispedro | so it might have been some other toolkit :P | 21:14 |
| javispedro | ah | 21:17 |
| javispedro | MNZ: http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/unstable/GtkRange.html#gtk-range-set-update-policy | 21:17 |
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| javispedro | found it :) ^^ | 21:17 |
| RST38h | back | 21:18 |
| MNZ | javispedro, thanks a lot! perfect :D | 21:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer | MNZ: I wonder how hard and expensive it'd be to update expiry time of an already instantiated timer | 21:19 |
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| javispedro | on glib quite, afaik. | 21:20 |
| MNZ | well I couldn't find a way to update expiry time | 21:21 |
| MNZ | where 'a way' = api and not some internals vodoo | 21:21 |
| javispedro | consider that the underlying implementation is probably using poll | 21:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | mmm, then prolly approach to wind up timer on very first change event, and just have a local var that holds timestamp of last event, and compare that var on timer expiry and act accordingly, is the better one | 21:22 |
| javispedro | after you've called poll with a large timeout (which would be the sane thing) | 21:22 |
| MNZ | DocScrutinizer, it's already solved with the update policy | 21:22 |
| MNZ | "GTK_UPDATE_DELAYED means that the value will be updated after a brief timeout where no slider motion occurs" just perfect | 21:22 |
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| pupnik | apparently apple actually sued because they have a patent that says only apple can multitask apps on a phone.... | 21:23 |
| javispedro | sued who? | 21:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | MNZ: :-D | 21:23 |
| evilsquelch | hello | 21:23 |
| RST38h | sued whom? | 21:23 |
| pupnik | dunno javispedro - watching the 'linux action show' javispedro | 21:23 |
| pupnik | maybe it's part of the HTC suit | 21:24 |
| pupnik | apparently palm has a multitasking patent too | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | pupnik: WTF - I thought apple is the only one that CAN NOT :-P | 21:24 |
| javispedro | pupnik: quite reasonable, as both palm and apple share a quite similar "multitasking" implementation :D | 21:25 |
| javispedro | (older palm, I mean. not the webos one) | 21:25 |
| RST38h | previous art. | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'll patent shitting X-P | 21:25 |
| RST38h | since nokia 7650 if not earlier | 21:25 |
| RST38h | Doc: there is prior art to that as well | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | art? LOL! | 21:26 |
| javispedro | there's always prior shit. | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | rotfl | 21:26 |
| pupnik | unbelievable | 21:27 |
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| javispedro | reading any patent tends to evoke that feeling | 21:28 |
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| pupnik | i'm happy htc countersued | 21:29 |
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| SpeedEvil | There are some actually inventive patents. | 21:29 |
| RST38h | wait until you see my patent on inflatable penguins | 21:29 |
| RevdKathy | RST38h I don't want to know where you blow to inflate them | 21:29 |
| SpeedEvil | But simply solving a problem you happen to be the first one to hit in the obvious way should never, ever be patentable. | 21:29 |
| RST38h | pupnik: a typical battle of wood with weevil | 21:29 |
| javispedro | heh | 21:30 |
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| RST38h | Revd: Should have asked about *applications* instead... | 21:30 |
| javispedro | hey RevdKathy, congrats! :) | 21:30 |
| RevdKathy | Thanks javispedro :) | 21:30 |
| * SpeedEvil for one welcomes our new overlordess. | 21:30 | |
| SpeedEvil | Overmistress? Overlady? | 21:31 |
| * SpeedEvil is confused. | 21:31 | |
| RevdKathy | I'm no-on's new overlord(ess) | 21:31 |
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| luke-jr__ | realisticly, Apple's "multitasking" is probably ideal for a handheld | 21:31 |
| luke-jr__ | prevents poorly designed apps from wasting battery | 21:31 |
| javispedro | luke-jr__: the weird part is | 21:32 |
| javispedro | that usually handheld OS implementing such multitasking "win" their generation' OS wars. | 21:32 |
| nidO | anyone would think the app store had some kind of draconian approval process that could weed out problems like that | 21:32 |
| MNZ | and it prevents properly designed apps from actually multitasking | 21:32 |
| luke-jr__ | but then again, I also consider Apple's "multitasking" to be obvious | 21:32 |
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| javispedro | see palmos vs winmo | 21:32 |
| javispedro | see iphone vs the rest | 21:32 |
| luke-jr__ | nidO: exactly | 21:32 |
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| luke-jr__ | javispedro: that's marketting, not quality | 21:32 |
| luke-jr__ | :p | 21:33 |
| javispedro | luke-jr__: palmos -- marketing?? O.o | 21:33 |
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| javispedro | after 8 years with it I've come to find its multitasking model quite tiresome. | 21:35 |
| * RST38h has not figured out how iphone multitasking works | 21:35 | |
| RST38h | how do I switch between apps anyway? | 21:35 |
| javispedro | RST38h: you used palmos? :) | 21:35 |
| RST38h | javispedro: thankfully, no. well, a bit | 21:35 |
| mgedmin | aaah, palmos... | 21:36 |
| MohammadAG | so... | 21:36 |
| mgedmin | best calendaring solution ever | 21:36 |
| javispedro | it works not unlike palmos5+a zlauncher look-alike. | 21:36 |
| MohammadAG | how do I add a key for apt to trust? | 21:36 |
| javispedro | MohammadAG: install apt-key, or use your desktop to try to understand what apt-key does? | 21:36 |
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| mgedmin | MohammadAG, in a very idiotic way | 21:36 |
| MohammadAG | apt-key is preinstalled | 21:37 |
| mgedmin | I made a note once, because it's impossible to remember: sudo apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys XXXXXXXX | 21:37 |
| MohammadAG | let me rephrase, what files do I need to use with apt-key? | 21:37 |
| RST38h | javispedro:so, when I start an app and want to go to the iphone's app menu without stopping the app, what do I do? | 21:37 |
| mgedmin | no files, if you trust the key servers | 21:37 |
| javispedro | RST38h: you can't. the app decides if it wants to stop or not. | 21:37 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: you just press the usual launcher hardkey and hope the app is smart enough. | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | mgedmin, and where do I get those? | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | this is for the community SSU | 21:38 |
| mgedmin | MohammadAG, do you have the key ID? | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | atm I get | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated! | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | mp-fremantle-generic-pr modest | 21:38 |
| mgedmin | usually apt tells you | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | I have a GPG key, the debs are signed, how do I get the key ID? | 21:39 |
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| FauxFaux | man apt-key | 21:39 |
| mgedmin | don't you see W: untrusted gpg key id XXXXX anywhere? | 21:39 |
| javispedro | you might see that when running apt-get update | 21:40 |
| MohammadAG | I see it, but not for my repo | 21:40 |
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| mgedmin | MohammadAG, you may want to package the repository key in a deb, like http://packages.medibuntu.org/lucid/medibuntu-keyring.html | 21:41 |
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| MohammadAG | err, that's the problem, I don't know how to get the key | 21:41 |
| MohammadAG | repo noob :) | 21:41 |
| mgedmin | more like gpg noob ;) | 21:41 |
| mgedmin | I'm not so hot on it myself... | 21:41 |
| mgedmin | have you got a .gpg file with the public key in it? | 21:42 |
| tobis87 | apt-key list | 21:42 |
| mgedmin | then you can sudo apt-key add my-keyring.gpg | 21:42 |
| MohammadAG | oh | 21:44 |
| MohammadAG | I'm assuming this is the public key? .gnupg/pubring.gpg | 21:44 |
| MohammadAG | (current dir would be ~) | 21:44 |
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| MohammadAG | nope, still says WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated! | 21:46 |
| MohammadAG | mp-fremantle-generic-pr modest | 21:46 |
| javispedro | iirc isn't that warning triggered because the repo Packages file wasn't signed? | 21:46 |
| javispedro | and not because of the actual package signature? | 21:46 |
| javispedro | what tool do you use to handle the repository, MohammadAG? reprepro? | 21:47 |
| tobis87 | So gpg has the key, but apt-key does not have the key? | 21:47 |
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| MohammadAG | javispedro, yeah | 21:48 |
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| javispedro | http://alioth.debian.org/scm/viewvc.php/*checkout*/mirrorer/docs/manual.html?revision=HEAD&root=mirrorer#signing | 21:48 |
| evilsquelch | what is the best 'share' for video from the N900? | 21:48 |
| evilsquelch | i just uploaded 2 to flickr | 21:49 |
| javispedro | check if reprepro is generating the Release.gpg file | 21:49 |
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| tobis87 | gpg --list-keys and then do gpg --export fingerprint | apt-key add - where fingerprint is the pub id of your key | 21:50 |
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| nox- | moin | 21:54 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: btw what is android_player? | 22:06 |
| MohammadAG | thanks javispedro :) | 22:08 |
| javispedro | thanks to you for the ssu :) | 22:08 |
| pupnik | RST38h: doesn't seem to be in the repository, or on the planet yet | 22:09 |
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| pupnik | what a crazy n900 year it's been! | 22:22 |
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| daleglass | tobis87: I finally figured out what I was doing wrong. D'oh! I wanted to build a module matching a kernel in the N900, so I did apt-get source kernel-power, built, and made a module against that. What I forgot is that debian packages may have a patch set in debian/ that wasn't getting applied. So of course it was a quite different kernel. | 22:23 |
| luke-jr__ | daleglass: and different compiler probably | 22:24 |
| daleglass | no, same compiler | 22:24 |
| daleglass | I did check the kernel and compiler version | 22:24 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: If you had just installed the kernel headers, you wouldn't had this problem, because the headers are packed after the kernel is compiled. | 22:29 |
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| mfaroukg | :) | 22:32 |
| daleglass | tobis87: tried that, it said linux/module.h was missing (and indeed it's not in the linux-power-headers package) | 22:33 |
| pupnik | http://live.gnome.org/Rygel/N900 uPnP media server for maemo.... "Rygel" | 22:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | ¼!!@#***&%&&!!!FsCK!!! how would I restart recaller? it again acts up notifying me about an ongoing recording since last call, which I can't stop by any means | 22:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | killall hildon-desktop brought back the red icon which previously been green, but notifications continue to pop up | 22:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | and I can't - for the life of mine - find any process to kill | 22:37 |
| MNZ | and the end all be all solution of rebooting does not help? | 22:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I did this 2 days ago. I'm not willing to reboot my phone every other day, just to make this fsckng recaler behave | 22:38 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: Ok, installing the kernel package also installes includes to /usr/include/linux, these were the files which were missing. | 22:39 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: No not the kernel package, but Linux-kernel-headers 2.6.28-20101501+0m5, this package provides the files from /usr/include | 22:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | >>Disable limbo if ready signals are not after home ready<< Pffft! | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | </quote alarmd --help> | 22:42 |
| kerio | huh? | 22:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | guess it's inuktitut via google translate | 22:44 |
| kerio | makes sense | 22:44 |
| daleglass | tobis87: aha, thanks :-) I looked on my ubuntu box, the files were in the normal kernel headers package, so that left me a bit puzzled | 22:44 |
| kerio | so arctic is the new elbonia? | 22:44 |
| ShadowJK | i think they call it Oulu | 22:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | recaller makes me want to kill N900 >:-( | 22:46 |
| sivang | hi all | 22:47 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: recaller? | 22:47 |
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| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, I have the perfect way to kill it | 22:47 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: you mean, the fact itdoes not recall automatically when it is buusy? | 22:47 |
| keesj | WTF http://www.nu.nl/gadgets/2341248/nokia-gaat-telefoons-uitrusten-met-windows-phone-7.html | 22:48 |
| sivang | people, I am trying to google for the PR1.2 upgrade guide for a while now, and google seems to have lost it-http://tinyurl.com/33u36g4 can anybody please send me the link? | 22:48 |
| sivang | I need to make room on the non opt filesystems et al | 22:49 |
| sivang | and etc :) | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://maemo.org/packages/view/recaller/ | 22:49 |
| ShadowJK | sivang, well depends what you mean with url | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: microwave? | 22:50 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, not quite | 22:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | 500KV | 22:50 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 22:50 |
| ShadowJK | that | 22:50 |
| keesj | ok no problem ... http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-09-24/nokia-says-not-planning-to-add-more-software-platforms.html?cmpid=yhoo | 22:50 |
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| ShadowJK | sivang, so there are two ways... clicking yes and hoping for hte best when app manager suggests you should upgrade... or flashing (which erases stuff) PR1.2 from tablets-dev.nokia.com | 22:51 |
| sivang | ShadowJK: I sort of recall that there was a wiki note somewhere to help hyou overcome "upgrade cannot be done" problem | 22:51 |
| ShadowJK | oh | 22:51 |
| sivang | ShadowJK: yes :) | 22:51 |
| sivang | ShadowJK: the former did not succed already :) | 22:51 |
| sivang | ah! I can find it in the bugreport | 22:51 |
| sivang | that I filed. | 22:51 |
| * sivang searches | 22:51 | |
| ShadowJK | http://wiki.maemo.org/OTA_to_PR1.1_troubleshooting | 22:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~flashing | 22:52 |
| infobot | methinks flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 22:52 |
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| sivang | DocScrutinizer, ShadowJK : rootfs and eerything that will be erased is on the eMMC? what's that eMMC anyway in contrast to there MYDocs and /opt is stored? | 22:55 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah, emmc = MyDocs, /home, /opt | 22:55 |
| ShadowJK | So basically, back up everything. | 22:55 |
| ShadowJK | to somewhere not N900 | 22:55 |
| sivang | ShadowJK: and ubifs is running on top of the ubi vol-manager on top of this eMMC? | 22:56 |
| ShadowJK | no | 22:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | errwut? flashing rootfs doesn't affect eMMC | 22:56 |
| ShadowJK | ubifs, rootfs, runs on a separate device | 22:57 |
| ShadowJK | rootfs is everything else except /home, /opt, MyDocs | 22:57 |
| * lcuk chews bubblegum | 22:57 | |
| daleglass | well, I made a surprising discovery. If you screw up the swap stuff during boot, the N900 will actually boot successfully with no swap at all, though it won't like it much | 22:58 |
| sivang | daleglass: and won't run too much :) | 22:58 |
| sivang | or wil it? | 22:58 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, hotswap worked again, ty! :D | 22:58 |
| sivang | sounds painfil to runwithout swap | 22:58 |
| daleglass | sivang: not a lot, but it lets me log in from ssh, which makes me VERY happy | 22:58 |
| sivang | true, true | 22:58 |
| kerio | i'd fix swap ASAP | 22:59 |
| sivang | I wonder if iphone would allow that when rnning *on* swap | 22:59 |
| daleglass | sivang: I'm adding the ramzswap module. Turns out /etc/fstab is autogenerated, so I "fixed" the script to add ramzswap in there. First try didn't go as well as I hoped. | 22:59 |
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| kerio | ramzswap? | 23:00 |
| daleglass | like a swap device that compresses stuff instead of swapping it out | 23:01 |
| kerio | cute | 23:01 |
| daleglass | I do stuff like loading 5 browser windows for reading on the underground. So 256MB feels a bit slow. | 23:02 |
| ShadowJK | I wouldn't even bother with fstab | 23:02 |
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| sivang | daleglass: allowing for better perfromance? | 23:03 |
| daleglass | sivang: I hope so | 23:03 |
| sivang | daleglass: share you experience | 23:03 |
| sivang | mameo-devel is for everything development? | 23:03 |
| kerio | wtf is mameo | 23:04 |
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| lcuk | daleglass, i dont know the answer, but people used to use offline readers for this sort of thing | 23:05 |
| daleglass | ShadowJK: problem is, the included swapon doesn't support setting swap priority. So if I add it while running it goes behind the flash swap and won't get used until full | 23:05 |
| lcuk | are there any website downloaders (easily configurable) that could get everything you need | 23:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: you can even do a swapoff during normal run, if no app started and eating too much memory | 23:05 |
| lcuk | and then present cached version | 23:05 |
| lcuk | whilst you have no net | 23:05 |
| lcuk | they never expected to keep whole everything in memory | 23:06 |
| lcuk | you kids have it easy :P | 23:06 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer: huh? surely you can do it anyway | 23:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I would prefer to fix this fstab madness for good | 23:07 |
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| kerio | particularly if you have another device after that | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | muhahaha | 23:08 |
| kerio | well, sure, some things may be closed | 23:08 |
| kerio | but if nothing will respawn them then they weren't worth much anyway | 23:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | daleglass: considered bringing decent swapon to maemo? | 23:09 |
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| * ShadowJK has a binary somewhere | 23:09 | |
| daleglass | DocScrutinizer: well, that's an idea. Something isn't working anyway. /etc/fstab now works, but swap still doesn't get turned on on boot. Though swapon -a works perfectly. Weird. | 23:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: isn't that website downloader called wget? | 23:10 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, nahh | 23:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | eh? | 23:11 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, too command line oriented | 23:11 |
| lcuk | i recall even outlook express had a newsreader built in :P | 23:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: queenbeecon FTW | 23:12 |
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| pupnik | hide yer wife, hide yer kids... | 23:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | though I also pondered how to implement 'addons' for microB, like creating an alarm from a time displayed at heavens-above.com, or here downloading a while (set of) pages and keep it for local browsing | 23:15 |
| tybollt | any news on n900 ng? | 23:15 |
| tybollt | will it be that thing that made jizmodo the other month? | 23:15 |
| MohammadAG | ng? | 23:16 |
| tybollt | next generation | 23:16 |
| tybollt | (whatever the next maemi/meego device will be called) | 23:16 |
| * MohammadAG gets confused | 23:16 | |
| luke-jr__ | so… N8? | 23:16 |
| pupnik | most people are calling it the n9 | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | N9? | 23:16 |
| luke-jr__ | N9 | 23:16 |
| luke-jr__ | whatever | 23:16 |
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| pupnik | n8 is symbian3, great media phone | 23:16 |
| tybollt | luke-jr__: N8 has maemo/meego - riiiiiiiight :) | 23:16 |
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| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: N9 is anonounced officially and all? | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | vaporware | 23:17 |
| luke-jr__ | tybollt: the leaked prototypes say N9 | 23:17 |
| tybollt | hence my question ... "any news ..." | 23:17 |
| lcuk | pupnik, have you got an n8? | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | no news | 23:17 |
| mece | N9 cometh Q1 2011. | 23:17 |
| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: thank you | 23:18 |
| luke-jr__ | blame Nokia for trying to blur the line between phone and handheld | 23:18 |
| pupnik | lcuk: i don't. doesn't have linux... | 23:18 |
| tybollt | mece: 'cometh'? Readeth ze bible areth weeth? | 23:18 |
| mece | well, it's a bit biblical | 23:18 |
| pupnik | lcuk: check out the n8 pictures and video - it's really nice | 23:19 |
| lcuk | pupnik, are you around Berlin to come to one of the mobile friday things next month | 23:19 |
| lcuk | pupnik, i totally know | 23:19 |
| lcuk | its awesome | 23:19 |
| pupnik | :) yeah i could drive down - what's up | 23:19 |
| daleglass | hmm, looking at the scripts is interesting. There's an ACT_DEAD var in /etc/event.d/rcS-late | 23:19 |
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| tybollt | mece: dude... Maemo was a great idea and I really liked my N900... but it's not god... you know ;) | 23:19 |
| lcuk | i wanna see if i can go :) I enjoy berlin | 23:19 |
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| mece | tybollt, no, hahah. | 23:20 |
| tybollt | anyway is it just me or do others think the time between the n900 and the N$next_device was a bit too long? | 23:20 |
| lcuk | why in the hell does twitter fsck with my browser | 23:21 |
| lcuk | i middle click on a link and it opens in same window | 23:21 |
| lcuk | when its not trying to load a stupid popup at same time that is | 23:21 |
| daleglass | tybollt: why too long? it's not that old, and IMO there's nothing particularly wrong with it either. I'd like more RAM, but that's about it. | 23:22 |
| sivang | lcuk: twitter is evil | 23:22 |
| sivang | daleglass++ | 23:22 |
| sivang | pupnik: I'd love to get an N8 | 23:22 |
| sivang | pupnik: best Qt supported Symbo | 23:22 |
| pupnik | Symbo? | 23:22 |
| sivang | Symbian | 23:23 |
| * sivang uses an LG latop | 23:23 | |
| lcuk | does Qt run on the Sybian? | 23:23 |
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| pupnik | yes | 23:23 |
| sivang | it has "auto-typo" features | 23:23 |
| h4waii | Hahaha. Everything runs on the "Sybian" | 23:23 |
| lcuk | read what I put pupnik, do not be hasty :P | 23:23 |
| kerio | on the sybian? | 23:23 |
| sivang | lcuk: with pride | 23:23 |
| lcuk | not everything is a typo | 23:23 |
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| sivang | lcuk: Sybian? | 23:24 |
| javispedro | Sybian? Symbo? Syrban? | 23:24 |
| johnsq | Hi | 23:24 |
| sivang | hehe | 23:24 |
| lcuk | I guess its a different kind of Qt | 23:24 |
| h4waii | Sryian sybian running Symbian | 23:24 |
| kerio | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sybian FYI | 23:24 |
| h4waii | a Qt chiq | 23:24 |
| javispedro | "Not to be confused with Symbian OS." -- well, thanks wikipedia. | 23:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Shyrkhan | 23:25 |
| kerio | QTes on a sybian... hot | 23:25 |
| mece | LOL | 23:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 23:26 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: I already found a way to use ramzswap on boot time, even with underlaying swap encryption... If you could package it, the modules are compiled for the stock, so you have to recompile them: http://pastebin.com/DQzG1WVJ http://rapidshare.com/files/417672221/crypto.tar.gz | 23:28 |
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| sivang | so eMMC is the built in storage, or what reports as "Nokia N900" when plugged into Ubuntu | 23:29 |
| sivang | and rootfs sits some other place? | 23:30 |
| tobis87 | daleglass: the package also includes diffs to the start scripts... | 23:30 |
| sivang | eMMC = 32GB built in | 23:30 |
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| daleglass | tobis87: aha, that must be what was wrong with mine. I added ramzswap to /etc/modules, but that probably gets loaded after swapon -a, which then chokes on the missing /dev/ramzswap0 | 23:32 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: /etc/modules does not work on the n900, you would have to add an entry to /etc/event.d, but since boot is highly parallelized, you can't be sure when it gets loaded, by loading it before swapon it will make sure that it always works. I also had to work out that the sleep 1 is needed. | 23:34 |
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| * sivang LOLs after reading about Sybian in wikipedia | 23:35 | |
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| mece | Life imitates porn imitates life | 23:36 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: and trying to use random instead of urandom was also a bad idea i had, since it had a boottime of 10 minutes. | 23:36 |
| daleglass | tobis87: hm, I seem to have screwed up something now | 23:37 |
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| tobis87 | how? if it does not want to use mmcblk0p3 as swap anymore, you could use mkswap to recreate the swap format. | 23:38 |
| daleglass | I just added a "modprobe ramzswap" and a "sleep 1" after "if [ $ACT_DEAD -eq 0 ]; then". Now gets stuck on a black screen after the nokia logo | 23:39 |
| crashanddie | why would you add the sleep 1? | 23:40 |
| crashanddie | modprobe should only return when the module is properly loaded | 23:40 |
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| daleglass | just copied it from tobis87 I guess, is there any reason why that'd kill it? | 23:41 |
| crashanddie | nope | 23:41 |
| tobis87 | crashanddie: yes it should, but module needs it | 23:41 |
| MohammadAG | the module needs a sleep 1? | 23:42 |
| tobis87 | you copied "modprobe ramzswap memlimit_kb=32768 backing_swap=/dev/mapper/swap" ? this will not work, since you it is adjusted for the encrypted swap in /dev/mapper | 23:43 |
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| daleglass | nah, just "modprobe ramzswap", I have module options in /etc | 23:43 |
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| tobis87 | where in /etc? | 23:45 |
| daleglass | in /etc/modprobe.d, in its own file | 23:45 |
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| tobis87 | MohammadAG: not the module, but the swapon will fail, if you don't issue sleep 1 after the module insertion. | 23:46 |
| MohammadAG | bummer | 23:47 |
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| tobis87 | daleglass: no idea, on the n900 you have to make sure it does exactly what you want. i have not even thought about adding it into modprobe.d. it is really more a windows 98... | 23:49 |
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| tobis87 | but ramzswap runs for me since several month rock solid, i have added the encryption only recently. | 23:50 |
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| MohammadAG | bbl, ping MohammadAG51 | 23:52 |
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| h4waii | ramzswap working on Fremantle?! | 23:57 |
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| daleglass | h4waii: it was working nicely until I did something and screwed up boot, yeah | 23:57 |
| h4waii | Where shall I send the cake? | 23:58 |
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