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| `Francesca_Lucch | humm solarwolf game dont work can anyone help me? | 00:02 |
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| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, they tested this? | 00:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | they published an app that used those IR commands directed to CMOS cam chip. Alas I think it was the mag issue of end of March, 1st of April ;-D | 00:12 |
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| nox- | moin DocScrutinizer | 00:28 |
| * GAN900 is out of cookies. :( | 00:29 | |
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| MNZ51 | evening folks | 00:30 |
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| heyya | DocScrutinizer, lol I just read all of that, and then april 1st tagline bologne! | 00:35 |
| heyya | haha | 00:35 |
| heyya | or punchline, rather | 00:35 |
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| crashanddie | what the fuck are you on about? | 00:50 |
| MNZ51 | does it matter? | 00:51 |
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| felipec | is there a tool to measure the battery drain? | 01:05 |
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| Stskeeps | felipec: FTD, possibly | 01:07 |
| Stskeeps | well, or the community tools for battery graphing | 01:07 |
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| felipec | Stskeeps: right, but I don't need graphing, just measure the drain in say one minute (or a configurable period of time) | 01:08 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 01:09 |
| Stskeeps | i would cook up something with libbmeipc personally | 01:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I wouldn't give a sh... about bme lies and rather use values from bq27200 directly | 01:16 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: but that module is only available in special kernels, right? | 01:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope, you can read out via I2Ctools | 01:17 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: yeah, that's another method | 01:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_software_power_management#Powerscript | 01:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | felipe: that does 5s, as the hardware is 5s period | 01:19 |
| SpeedEvil | It seems to idle at around 6mA load - if you redirect to a file | 01:20 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | hi, | 01:20 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | I've the lastest kernel source and it still does that: | 01:20 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | http://pastebin.com/6dFgLE9f | 01:20 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | with the rx51 maemo defconfig | 01:21 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | kernel was from http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/k/kernel/ | 01:21 |
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| felipec | DocScrutinizer: SpeedEvil: yeap, that seems to be what I want | 01:23 |
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| itsME | hello everyone | 01:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: there's also ShadowJK's script that reads out a lot more from bq27200 chip. Not just actual current but also precise elapsed mAh discharge (relative reading_new - reading_old) | 01:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer | felipec: alas I seem to lack any pointer to that script | 01:28 |
| itsME | has anybody managed to successfully use gtk eventbox in c? | 01:29 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: but I need a special kernel | 01:29 |
| ShadowJK | no | 01:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | why? | 01:29 |
| itsME | great thanks | 01:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | all you need is I2Ctools | 01:30 |
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| ShadowJK | itsME, sorry i wasn't replying to you | 01:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: where to download or otherwise get your script? isn't it on any wiki page yet? | 01:31 |
| itsME | well i dont even know if its the right place, maybe theres some other channel for developerrs | 01:31 |
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| ShadowJK | Well I've only ever offered it to people who ask for it in irc | 01:32 |
| ShadowJK | iirc http://enivax.net/jk/n900/bq.tar | 01:32 |
| ShadowJK | maybe | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: can't you add at least a link to it, to http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Charge_Meter | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | ? | 01:32 |
| ShadowJK | I'd rather not | 01:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | Or I do if you don't mind | 01:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, why? | 01:33 |
| ShadowJK | I think I'd want to expand SpeedEvil's script to include network packets :) | 01:33 |
| MNZ51 | there's also SpeedEvil's power drain script | 01:33 |
| ShadowJK | then it'd be like 10X more useful for power debugging | 01:34 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I have a sort of proto-script that tries tocap _everything_ | 01:34 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: But it's not finished. | 01:34 |
| SpeedEvil | And meh. | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, nice. But a plain script to read out FULL info from bq27200 and nothing else, would be nice as well | 01:34 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | DocScrutinizer, does that ring a bell: http://pastebin.com/6dFgLE9f ? | 01:35 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | hi btw | 01:35 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | the kernel doesn't compile | 01:35 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, also if it's not published anywhere public I don't need to finish it ;D | 01:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | GNUtoo|laptop: sorry, but no | 01:35 |
| ShadowJK | but go ahead if you want to | 01:36 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ok | 01:36 |
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| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: which kernel triggered that? | 01:37 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | the official one I bet: | 01:37 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/k/kernel/ | 01:37 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | the last one | 01:37 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | and a previous one too | 01:37 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: weird, I've compiled the internal kernel many times | 01:38 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ah ok | 01:38 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | maybe wrong defconfig | 01:38 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | I took the rx51 one in arm/defconfig | 01:38 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: can I just take kernel_2.6.28.orig.tar.gz or do I need to do something else? | 01:39 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | you need the maemo patches | 01:39 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | maybe I'll try manually | 01:39 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: kernel_2.6.28-20101501+0m5.diff.gz ? | 01:40 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | yes | 01:40 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, here's my unfinished always-running charge script conversion, filled with dead code and pointless crap, haven't cleaned it up yet after converting it to always-on: http://pastebin.com/m4uMMRgm | 01:41 |
| ShadowJK | There's some lines of SpeedEvil and you surviving in there still ;p | 01:41 |
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| ShadowJK | I guess I should make it query bq27200 directly too instead of examining the logfile of my bq27200 script ;D | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: is enivax.net down? | 01:42 |
| ShadowJK | nope, but the dns likes to die | 01:42 |
| ShadowJK | my current bq27200 script, taken right off of my device just now http://pastebin.com/bPiqjzVa | 01:43 |
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| felipec | whoa... I just want to calculate battery drain to compare different codecs | 01:44 |
| ShadowJK | lol | 01:45 |
| SpeedEvil | The one from the power page is probably sanest for that felipec :) | 01:47 |
| MNZ51 | felipec, you are talking about gstreamer codecs right? | 01:48 |
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| ShadowJK | Although for long term comparison you might want to compare NAC | 01:49 |
| felipec | MNZ51: more like FFmpeg codecs through GStreamer API :) | 01:49 |
| felipec | what does i2cget -y 2 0x55 0x14 w do? | 01:49 |
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| ShadowJK | It sends a request on i2cbus 2, to address 0x55, requesting to read the Word size register 0x14 | 01:50 |
| ShadowJK | .. which is the average current register | 01:50 |
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| ShadowJK | 0x55 on i2c bus 2 is the battery meter | 01:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | aka bq27200 | 01:50 |
| felipec | ok, so it doesn't matter how often you use it | 01:50 |
| MNZ51 | felipec, you will find that most codecs will drain much less power through the default gstreamer pipeline | 01:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope, not for anything important. Though each run will use a bit of power | 01:51 |
| MNZ51 | except for ogg | 01:51 |
| ShadowJK | there are no registers with side effects in bq27200 | 01:51 |
| MNZ51 | and potentially mp3 might be better on ffmpeg. | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: It only updates evety 5.12s | 01:52 |
| felipec | MNZ51: I locked the frequence, and top showed significantly better performance... but what do you mean by "default pipeline"? | 01:53 |
| ShadowJK | offline mode and screen off is almost a requirement to do accurate measurements since ambient light conditions and the contents on the screen will affect backlight power level... | 01:53 |
| ShadowJK | I wouldn't find it inplausible if ffmp3 was better than the default mp3 decoder :) | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | https://datatype.helixcommunity.org/Mp3dec | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | also | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: top lies. | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: It doesn't know about cpufreq | 01:54 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, he said he locked frequency ;) | 01:54 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: 10%@600MHz may use more power than 50%@250MHz | 01:54 |
| ShadowJK | cpuidle effects are probably interesting too... | 01:55 |
| MNZ51 | felipec, most video decoding is done on the DSP (separate processor) | 01:55 |
| felipec | SpeedEvil: I'm aware of that :) I work in Nokia and I've done many CPU measurements | 01:55 |
| SpeedEvil | k | 01:55 |
| SpeedEvil | Threre are all sorts of wackos here. :) | 01:56 |
| ShadowJK | hm, I should convert my script to use "i2cget" instead of "./i2cget" | 01:56 |
| felipec | MNZ51: yeah, I know, I wrote gst-dsp :) | 01:56 |
| felipec | but I'm working on gst-av now, to get decent audio decoding with FFmpeg | 01:56 |
| MNZ51 | !! | 01:56 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 01:56 |
| SpeedEvil | Awesome. | 01:56 |
| MNZ51 | maemo is not abandoned!! | 01:56 |
| ShadowJK | felipec, I take it you saw tkulve's vorbis vs mp3 battery benchmarks? :-) | 01:57 |
| ShadowJK | (they're ancient) | 01:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | but still interesting | 01:57 |
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| felipec | ShadowJK: yes, I helped him a bit... gst-av is mentioned there | 01:58 |
| Stskeeps | MNZ51: gst-dsp is a pretty universal omap3 component, even on angstrom or other linux OS'es. | 01:58 |
| felipec | he said he wanted to switch to it, but apparently he's been to busy lately | 01:58 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure if the DMA unit is smart enough and lower power than the CPU core that it can decode 1s@600MHz say, then drop it to the codec with the CPU off | 01:58 |
| ShadowJK | not sure if I've ever seen C4 during audio playback, but I've atleast seen C3, iirc.. | 01:59 |
| MNZ51 | stskeeps I was unaware of that | 01:59 |
| Stskeeps | MNZ51: we naturally have it in meego/n900 too (but not yet active for various legal reasons) | 01:59 |
| lcuk | "<MNZ51> maemo is not abandoned!!" << you have been helping yourself, of course its not! | 02:00 |
| MNZ51 | have you guys seen/tested gstreamer_ti?? | 02:01 |
| felipec | ShadowJK: but I want to measure libvorbis vs ffvorbis, libflac vs ffflac, and nokiamp3dec vs ffmp3: I definitely don't want to run the tests until the device runs out of battery =/ | 02:01 |
| MNZ51 | lcuk indeed :) | 02:01 |
| lcuk | MNZ51, speaking of which, how is the hardware EQ looking? | 02:01 |
| MNZ51 | lcuk I just got all the kernel parts working right today morning | 02:02 |
| ShadowJK | felipec, ok check if you can get repeatable and sensible results with SpeedEvil's script.. If not, we'll have to read the NAC register instead | 02:02 |
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| lcuk | awesome! | 02:02 |
| felipec | Shadikka: you mean the Powerscript? | 02:02 |
| MNZ51 | lcuk now need to dig into ways of integrating into the UI | 02:03 |
| ShadowJK | bq27200 integrates current-in and current-out measurements into NAC, so it's better suited for longer than 5 second measurements :P | 02:03 |
| ShadowJK | felipec, yeah the one on the wiki | 02:03 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: the script I wrote above I've never seen it give measurements that seem inaccurate. | 02:03 |
| SpeedEvil | I need to put a scope on the battery, but it seems consistent. | 02:03 |
| lcuk | MNZ51, of course! | 02:03 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, no I mean current consumption varies alot for me as-is, that it might be difficult to see the "big picture" from several 5 second readings | 02:04 |
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| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: I'm seeing the same compiler error... let me diff with the internal repo | 02:05 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | felipec, ok thanks a lot !!! | 02:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: why should it be inconsistent? It's just not appropriate for long time average evaluations | 02:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Charge_Meter#Software | 02:06 |
| SpeedEvil | I just postprocess it. | 02:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | has pointer to ShadowJK script now, which also offers long term NAC mAh values from bq27200 | 02:07 |
| SpeedEvil | awk to average over 30s, 60s, ... | 02:07 |
| SpeedEvil | NAC is in rartehr big units | 02:07 |
| SpeedEvil | It's hard to get equivalent accuracy to simply adding the instant readings unless you have a long baseline. | 02:08 |
| MNZ | felipec, have you evaluated TI's own gstreamer plugin for decoding over the DSP before? | 02:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I'd rather say postprocessing introduces an ever rising error, while NAC is always quite accurate | 02:09 |
| ShadowJK | but more granular.. nothing is perfect :) | 02:10 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: Sure. | 02:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | of course within limits of resolution | 02:10 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: the absolute error in the NAC reading is quite high though | 02:10 |
| felipec | ShadowJK: well, I'm running an ffmp3 test, and it seems to revolve around 60mA, however, when I go to offline mode it bumps to 200mA | 02:10 |
| felipec | I think that's the bug Igor was talking about | 02:10 |
| ShadowJK | is that without sim? | 02:10 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: it's unplugged from the charger? | 02:11 |
| ShadowJK | (and usb) | 02:11 |
| felipec | MNZ: I really dislike that software stack: gst-ti -> codec-engine -> dmai -> dsp-link | 02:11 |
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| felipec | MNZ: plus dsp-link needs *a lot* of reorganization that already happened in dsp-bridge | 02:12 |
| felipec | I think I tried to compile it once... I gave up | 02:12 |
| MNZ | felipec, same here | 02:12 |
| MNZ | after a 1.6gb download and 2 wasted days | 02:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | the only correct way to get precise values is having a local logfile, device not connected to USB, not registered to GSM and WLAN, and issueing an initial sleep 120, during which you need to switch off screen | 02:13 |
| felipec | MNZ: gst-dsp -> dsp-bridge, that's way easier, plus dsp-bridge is now upstream (on staging), and TI has a small package for the binaries, just put them on /lib/dsp, and you are good to go :) | 02:14 |
| pigeon | anyone knows which tweeter client is supposed to work now? | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | then playback same media file for some 10min, and stop and read out bq27200 NAC | 02:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer | make sure you have volume set to 1 step above mute, and preferably wired headset plugged in | 02:15 |
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| felipec | pigeon: you want to post messages only, or see your friend updates and so on? | 02:16 |
| pigeon | both, just that both witter and tweego won't login anymore. | 02:17 |
| pigeon | you know, those oauth changes and stuff. | 02:17 |
| lcuk | pigeon, for now I believe Khweeteur | 02:18 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: yes, I know all those tricks to get good measurements, except that I was using the Nokia internal tool | 02:18 |
| lcuk | but its very -dev | 02:18 |
| lcuk | Khertan_ has been developing it | 02:18 |
| lcuk | and it works with the oauth stuff | 02:18 |
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| felipec | DocScrutinizer: so how do I read the NAC? | 02:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | Stupid internets. | 02:19 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: but here GSM off actually seems to affect negatively | 02:19 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: I missed the answer - you are unplugged? | 02:19 |
| SpeedEvil | Because that's very odd. | 02:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | felipec: (read NAC) see bottom of http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Charge_Meter#Software. (GSM off negative) that's REALLY odd | 02:20 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: it seems some files are missing | 02:21 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ah ok | 02:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: (GSM) what exactly means "GSM off"? | 02:22 |
| MNZ | quick question, is there any particular reason why we can't run audio decoding algorithms on the DSP? | 02:22 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: not in offline mode | 02:22 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: The DSP is a seperate functional unit. | 02:22 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: Waking it up is not free. | 02:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: so what else if not in offline mode? | 02:22 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: by not GSM do you mean locked to 3g? | 02:23 |
| felipec | MNZ: it _can_ be done... it's just that NEON is good enough | 02:23 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | felipec, will there be a new release? | 02:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: actually offline mode is mandatory | 02:23 |
| MNZ | SpeedEvil, sp decoding, say, a 4 minute mp3 file is not really worth the hassle? | 02:23 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: because 3G uses stupid power | 02:23 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | of the kernel sources | 02:23 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: I would say that in principle working out how to fastest possible decode - say - 1M of audio to raw is a net win. Then you go to sleep, and just throw that out via DMA | 02:24 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: I'm unsure. | 02:24 |
| felipec | MNZ: it might be that just passing audio buffers around consumes more CPU than the whole decoding on NEON, it's hard to tell, maybe not if it's properly implemented, but at least the numbers I saw with OpenMAX IL were pretty bad | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: nota bene a missing SIM does *not* mean cellmo is off. Au contraire it eats probably vast amounts of power searching for all available carriers to possibly issue a 911 call | 02:25 |
| SpeedEvil | If you're simply dribbling data out at a low rate from the DSP it's probably a clear lose. | 02:25 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: well, you should file a bug, but I can provide the files to you... just let me try and see if they really fix the problem | 02:25 |
| SpeedEvil | It's only a win if you're decoding 'massive' chunks of data at once. | 02:25 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | felipec, ok thanks | 02:25 |
| SpeedEvil | There is also the question if the DMA unit can be awake with the sound serial unit, with the rest of the CPU asleep. | 02:27 |
| SpeedEvil | I think it can - but I need to read the datasheet a bit more. | 02:27 |
| felipec | SpeedEvil: I'm not sure what you mean by DMA unit, but I think the biggest factor is the fact that audio data must come back to ARM side in order for pulseaudio to process it | 02:28 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: I'm ignoring pulseaudio for the moment. | 02:28 |
| MNZ | felipec, speaking of pulseaudio....... | 02:28 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm considering what the absolute minimum power to play mp3 is that the hardware can do. | 02:29 |
| MNZ | AIUI the DSP can be programmed to pipe data directly to the codec chip for output..? | 02:29 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: I don't think that's quite how it works. | 02:29 |
| MNZ | with the right connections in the HW of course, unless I'm missing something else | 02:30 |
| felipec | SpeedEvil: MNZ: yes, the DSP can output audio directly | 02:30 |
| SpeedEvil | Ah - K. | 02:30 |
| SpeedEvil | I've not read it in detail. | 02:30 |
| felipec | but that doesn't fit Maemo architecture | 02:30 |
| pigeon | ah, wait, i spoke too soon, witter works, i just need to blow away my old config, and configure oauth stuff in the settings. | 02:30 |
| lcuk | no volume control etc? | 02:30 |
| MNZ | felipec, I kinda want to bypass the whole PA fiasco | 02:30 |
| MNZ | lcuk, volume control can be done by the audio codec | 02:31 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | about audio and pulseaudio etc...I bet the pulse plugin does something special to get rid of the buffer underruns | 02:31 |
| lcuk | MNZ, but that opens up whole ball of other stuff | 02:31 |
| MNZ | yeah, like stopping playback when a call comes in... | 02:31 |
| lcuk | doesnt the audio have to have channels managed and switch to higher priority tasks etc | 02:31 |
| * lcuk nods | 02:31 | |
| SpeedEvil | At least in principle, pulseaudio is open. So you can find out the calls it makes simply. | 02:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | However - pulling out pulseaudio will break calls | 02:32 |
| lcuk | thats an awful lot | 02:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Unless I'm confused. | 02:32 |
| SpeedEvil | That is phonecalls. | 02:32 |
| lcuk | the dsp improvement would have to be pretty drastic at this point | 02:32 |
| felipec | lcuk: no cheap speakers exploding protection :) | 02:32 |
| * ShadowJK discovered today that stopping ohmd makes calls come through speakers instead of earphone :D | 02:32 | |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: there is a IIR filter in the codec | 02:32 |
| MNZ | felipec, I'm kinda working on a solution to that :D | 02:32 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: that works fine. | 02:32 |
| lcuk | felipec, yeah, that too | 02:33 |
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| * lcuk has exploded ears atm | 02:33 | |
| MNZ | there are two filters actually | 02:33 |
| * lcuk would like to use dsp as a blitter one day :P | 02:33 | |
| MNZ | hehe | 02:33 |
| lcuk | especially on 8x0 | 02:33 |
| felipec | MNZ: the hardware supports it... but I'm not sure how maemo sw might interfere | 02:33 |
| pigeon | and i'll try Khweeteur too | 02:33 |
| lcuk | pigeon, as I said Khertan_ is working hard and responding to things | 02:34 |
| lcuk | so if you do try it, discuss with him and help improve it with him | 02:34 |
| MNZ | felipec, I'm improving the audio codec's driver right now, and I've got the IIR filter and 3D effects working so far. | 02:34 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 02:34 |
| MNZ | any hints on where to look if we are to pass data from dsp to audio codec directly? | 02:34 |
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| lcuk | give it to PA :D | 02:35 |
| felipec | MNZ: you mean from the DSP side? | 02:35 |
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| felipec | MNZ: I'm not sure, TI calls that DASF | 02:36 |
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| MNZ | felipec, yeah. I would have to mess with the code that's sent to the dsp right? I'm just not sure what kind of messing around is needed | 02:37 |
| pigeon | lcuk: sure | 02:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK:(charging script) nice :-). Would you like me to edit a few things? | 02:37 |
| SpeedEvil | MNZ: yes - you'd need to code stuff on the DSP | 02:37 |
| MNZ | SpeedEvil, the question is more like do I have to reimplement the codec driver? | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | dunno | 02:38 |
| felipec | MNZ: I haven't touched much DSP side code =/ | 02:38 |
| lcuk | mnz, the dsp is scary and few who venture into it ever come out alive! | 02:38 |
| lcuk | it changes them. | 02:38 |
| MNZ | lcuk, I know that now :/ | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't know if you can do 'pipes' onthe DSP | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | that is - redirect the 'normal' output and do stuff with it | 02:39 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, my TODO list is something like: move low battery detection and warning from bq27200.sh to charge.sh, add the LED notification back in, handle error codes, check parameters after error codes | 02:39 |
| felipec | SpeedEvil: yes, it's possible | 02:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: (exploded ears) testing codecs via headset? or your son screaming? | 02:39 |
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| SpeedEvil | Interesting. | 02:39 |
| MNZ | so any pointers on where I should start reading would be greatly appreciated :D | 02:40 |
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| felipec | MNZ: I think you should ask in #linux-omap, or the mailing list | 02:40 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, burst eardrum a few weeks ago. i yawned and it (re)ruptured it. | 02:40 |
| felipec | or #beagle | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: yes, along that line. Also a few flws are there I'd like to fix | 02:40 |
| lcuk | (had an infection in 2006) | 02:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I vaguely remember someone here was playing with DSP | 02:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: FSCK! :-/ | 02:40 |
| lcuk | thats what I said | 02:40 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, like? | 02:41 |
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| lcuk | along with many other strong words | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | sleep 28 | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | is too long | 02:41 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, lardman | 02:41 |
| SpeedEvil | possibly | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | has to become sleep 15 | 02:41 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 02:41 |
| lcuk | doing the bluetooth stuff on 8x0 | 02:41 |
| ShadowJK | Apart from programming it for mugen2400 and ignoring USB cable to host PC scenario entirely | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | ovewrtemp throttle has some niche cases where it actually is doing worse than better | 02:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | also seems to me you're reading out bq27200 die temp rather than battery cell thermistor | 02:42 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah I don't know how to read it yet | 02:42 |
| SpeedEvil | there is no thermistor | 02:42 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 02:42 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - on the mugen there is | 02:43 |
| ShadowJK | there's one near the battery, in N900 | 02:43 |
| SpeedEvil | but... | 02:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | there is | 02:43 |
| SpeedEvil | There is? | 02:43 |
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| ShadowJK | yeah it's connected to gaia madc iirc | 02:43 |
| SpeedEvil | hmm | 02:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | search schematics, next to twl4030 | 02:43 |
| SpeedEvil | I thought that was mislabeled | 02:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadSEC: EXACTLY | 02:43 |
| ShadowJK | tab tab tab tab... | 02:43 |
| SpeedEvil | And it was actually the capacirty indication wire on the battery | 02:43 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, there are two | 02:44 |
| SpeedEvil | Ah. | 02:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry capsmock | 02:44 |
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| ShadowJK | two battery related things (well, atleast 2) connected to madc.. BSI to capacity indication thingy inside battery, and another to some thermistor that's close to the battery | 02:44 |
| SpeedEvil | Hmm. | 02:45 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: actually, no, the files are not missing... I'm getting the same error on the internal repo =/ | 02:45 |
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| ShadowJK | i think the thermistor is one of the exposed components in the battery bay.. | 02:45 |
| ShadowJK | i looked up the exact location once but I forget.. | 02:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | I had no luck locating it | 02:45 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | felipec, ah ok, so how come the kernel shipped compiled? | 02:45 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | is there some workarround? | 02:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | but I guess it shall be in thermal junction to the metallic bay | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | Is it exposed? | 02:46 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: it probably depends on the compiler, I remember someone from Google fixed that... let me look for the patch | 02:46 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ok thanks a lot!!! | 02:46 |
| SpeedEvil | lshal doesn't say anyrthing obvious on temp. | 02:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps once asked my what to ask Nokia about charging, and a told him (among other things) we need to know what values we expect to read from bat temp ADC, when to sgut down for overtemp. Alas no results of all that yet | 02:47 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, It looked like a surface mounted rectangle like any other to me ;P | 02:48 |
| SpeedEvil | how much further is bq* ? | 02:49 |
| ShadowJK | madc has open source driver though, and we can empirically figure out what the numbers mean, right? | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: but maybe it has a level or spring touching it, from metal bat bay | 02:49 |
| ShadowJK | hm | 02:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Is bq27200 round the back off the contacts - I forget | 02:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | btemp R1310, twl4030 ADCIN0 | 02:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | Battery temperature sensor | 02:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Hmm. | 02:52 |
| SpeedEvil | BME was polling madc wasn't it | 02:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | yup | 02:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | afaik | 02:52 |
| felipec | GNUtoo|laptop: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ports.arm.omap/28461 | 02:52 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | thanks a lot | 02:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: anyway when battery signals overtemp during *actually* DIScharging (according to bq27200), you MUST NOT throttle charger | 02:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~2119 | 02:54 |
| infobot | The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in RFC 2119. | 02:54 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, yeah I just added it for my own use case | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: seems bme is wrong on that detail as well | 02:55 |
| SpeedEvil | Or possibly just power off | 02:55 |
| ShadowJK | Where dropping to 550 brings current as reported by bq27200 to around 0 | 02:56 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: yeah, but I notice that when I go to offline mode, the consumption goes up to 200mA | 02:56 |
| ShadowJK | felipec, is that with a sim card or without? Is wlan0 interface up? There's a bug that leaves it up occasionally, eating about 200 or so.. | 02:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | bq24150 charging + bq27200 DIScharging = high system load, "Not enough power for charging!". DO NOT switch off charging, not even on high temp. On critical overtemp start to throttle system load instead | 02:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | felipec: that's really freakin weird | 02:57 |
| ShadowJK | You know, with the charger chip's 70-90% efficiency, and the 130-ish mOhm of resistance between charger and battery, and the mugen battery's lower internal resistance, there might be less heat generation with charger fully off :P | 02:58 |
| felipec | ShadowJK: with a sim card; normal mode, 3G, wlan + audio playback I get ~60mA. offline mode + audio playback, I get 200mA | 02:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: nonono, you need to throttle system load. Then system power consumption will drop, and temperature will drop, and battery will resume to charge as bq24150 is delivering sufficient power to supply systen *and* charge battery. If temp still too high then, your normal charge trottling will kick in as now battery is not DIScharging any more. Charge trottling will cause battery to discharge again, causing further system load throttling. | 03:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | .. this continues until temperature is going down to a reasonable level | 03:04 |
| MNZ | felipec, do you have any insider information on PA? Is it only needed for speaker protection and audio prioritizing (calls mute other audio, etc) ? or is there more to it? | 03:09 |
| MNZ | (insider information that can be shared, ie :) | 03:09 |
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| felipec | MNZ: I don't think there's anything internal about it, Jyri Sarha did a presentation about it | 03:11 |
| felipec | http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2009/slides/Jyri-Sarha-audio_miniconf_slides.pdf | 03:11 |
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| MNZ | felipec, yes, I've seen the slides and they're rather vague. And if there's nothing internal... why no sources? | 03:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: for this to work properly, you should differentiate the temperature reading, ans also delay the charge throttling by some 30..60s, so when you throttle system load, you give cell temp some 30s time to idicate it "plans to drop", and not start charge throttling if temp is on its way down | 03:12 |
| felipec | MNZ: pulseaudio is used for many reasons, good latency control, protection of the speakers, audio policy, mixing | 03:13 |
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| felipec | volume | 03:13 |
| ShadowJK | people hate it though when it eats 30% CPU and they could be using that for something else :) | 03:14 |
| MNZ | felipec, all that can be managed without PA. It's only the audio policy that might be tricky, but DocScrutinizer says he's got an answer in the form of an alsa plugin :D | 03:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer | mixing: ALSA dmix. latency control: we don't need that, and actually latency with PA is usually even higher than with mere ALSA. Protection of speakers: could have been implemented as a ALSA plugin as well. Audio policy: well I elaborated on that some 23h ago, in this chan. | 03:15 |
| ShadowJK | oh dear god, alsa plugins.. I thought they invented pulseaudio just because alsa plugins were undebugable and unfixable ;P | 03:15 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: I don't recall the issues with ALSA dmix, but there certainly were | 03:16 |
| ShadowJK | I've never seen dmix working yet :/ | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | mhm, not here. I got severe issues with PA mixing instead | 03:17 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: and no, the algorithms are proprietary from Nokia, the couldn't be implemented as ALSA plugins without violating the licence, or something like that | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I've never seen it failing | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 03:17 |
| MNZ | ShadowJK, alsa on most systems is running dmix by default as they can't do multiple streams natively, AIUI | 03:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | so we use PA as Nokia doesn't like the licence of ALSA, and also doesn't think it could disclose the code of those 'magic' plugins. Now that's what I call reasonable | 03:18 |
| ShadowJK | MNZ, i think they moved to having pulse open alsa hw direct because dmix was too buggy? ;p | 03:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dmix never was buggy, as long as I know about it | 03:19 |
| MNZ | ShadowJK, I'm on debian right now and they have a deep rooted hate for PA. Audio works like a charm. I can actually do mp3 at close to 1% cpu on my core 2 duo | 03:19 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: what do you expect? Nokia to spend a huge amount of money rewriting some internal code that is considered a competitive advantage into something open-source friendly? | 03:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, maybe? | 03:21 |
| MNZ | ok so there IS some internal stuff, felipec ? | 03:21 |
| felipec | DocScrutinizer: we would be releasing the N900 right now if everything had to be perfect | 03:21 |
| ShadowJK | :) | 03:21 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: can you elaborate on what the closed code is for in the audio chain? | 03:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry, but that's no argument | 03:22 |
| MNZ | just how much of a competitive advantage though :/ I mean audio mixing and policy?? | 03:22 |
| felipec | SpeedEvil: you mean in PA chain? | 03:22 |
| derf | I suspect they more mean acoustic echo cancellation and speech pre/post processing. | 03:22 |
| SpeedEvil | felipe: yes | 03:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry, nothing personal, but I feel I'm building up a mood to argue. So I prefer to part this convo for a while, chilling... | 03:23 |
| MNZ | haha cheers doc :) | 03:24 |
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| felipec | SpeedEvil: I don't recall all the details, but there were quite a lot; echo cancellation, equalizer, speaker protection | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | hmm. The PDF I saw on the PA phone interface strongly implied that the phone module did all of that. | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | the echo that is. | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | Thanks. | 03:28 |
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| felipec | SpeedEvil: no, the phone chip is doing some stuff, but I don't recall exactly what | 03:29 |
| felipec | fortunately PA seems to have it's own echo cancellation nowadays :) | 03:30 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah. | 03:30 |
| derf | Whose code is that? | 03:30 |
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| felipec | derf: I don't know, I've seem some patches from Wim Tayman, from GStreamer/Collabora | 03:32 |
| derf | Just wondering if they're based on the Speex one, or something else. | 03:33 |
| SpeedEvil | Hmm. I wonder if the echo cancellation is for skype | 03:33 |
| SpeedEvil | /sip | 03:33 |
| derf | Skype does their own. | 03:33 |
| MNZ | so it seems it will not be possible to rip out PA completely because of the closed source stuff depending on it (ie, phone functionality). But for media purposes it looks quite possible to replace PA completely (as far as the info we have goes...) | 03:34 |
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| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure. | 03:35 |
| derf | Yes, PA is using the Speex one. | 03:35 |
| derf | Found the patch. | 03:35 |
| SpeedEvil | I think it's possible. | 03:35 |
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| MNZ | AFAICT everything's pretty much covered. Anywho, I'll find that out soon enough :D | 03:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Great work MNZ | 03:37 |
| MNZ | :) | 03:38 |
| MNZ | Which reminds me... anyone willing to do a quick parametric EQ UI for maemo :/ ??? pretty please? | 03:39 |
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| lcuk | MNZ, you have to give more info about the available data :) | 03:42 |
| felipec | the NAC says 10mAh are consumed each 10min | 03:42 |
| lcuk | ie format, frequency etc | 03:42 |
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| ShadowJK | felipec, so that's 60mA | 03:43 |
| ShadowJK | But like, the precision is only good enough for +- 10% :) | 03:43 |
| MNZ | lcuk, I just want an empty shell really... sliders for bandwidth and center frequency and gain, and a selector for filter type. The difficult part (I think) is in figuring out how to integrate this into hildon the Right Way(tm) | 03:44 |
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| lcuk | you can use kitchen scales to accurately determine the weight of a single penny | 03:44 |
| lcuk | if you do enough samples with multiples of them :P | 03:45 |
| felipec | ShadowJK: well, that matches the AI Average | 03:45 |
| lcuk | MNZ, right so you want the input side of it | 03:45 |
| lcuk | not the graphical output | 03:45 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: Or you are a geek. And your kitchen scales weigh to 0.1g | 03:45 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.17483 | 03:46 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, i actually meant bathroom scales | 03:46 |
| * lcuk is tired | 03:46 | |
| smhar | greetings | 03:46 |
| MNZ | lcuk, heck if you can graph the curves then all the better :P but yeah the plan was just to have a basic UI as opposed to no ui at all | 03:46 |
| lcuk | and I once did it using a lovely pile of pennies | 03:46 |
| SpeedEvil | I have contemplated refitting my bathroom scales with 18 bit ADCs | 03:46 |
| lcuk | MNZ, specifically different ends of the spectrum literally | 03:46 |
| lcuk | but something that it would have to do is like a real eq | 03:47 |
| lcuk | a single swipe across all the inputs should set the levels of each | 03:47 |
| MNZ | lcuk, I'm afraid you lost me | 03:48 |
| ShadowJK | felipec, getting any usable comparison data btw? | 03:48 |
| lcuk | well if you have a 10 bar EQ - 10 sliders. you dont want to need to click change each | 03:48 |
| lcuk | you want to be able to run finger horizontally across all | 03:48 |
| lcuk | in one swipe | 03:48 |
| smhar | I have a small home network. I can connect to it wirelessly using the N900 and I can access the internet to read emails/browse/install applications ..etc . the problem is: although I can ping my router -and browse its admin page- from N900, I can not ping or access my dreambox . any tips? | 03:49 |
| lcuk | what is your dreambox? | 03:49 |
| SpeedEvil | I guess it's like a dreamcatcher. | 03:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Is it made by indians? | 03:49 |
| ShadowJK | There's like a PMP/DVR thingy called "dreambox". | 03:49 |
| ShadowJK | i think | 03:50 |
| MNZ | lcuk, thing is, it's not a graphical EQ really, mostly because I haven't figured out how to (if it's possible) go from a graphical eq to parameters for a parametric eq (which is closer to what we have) | 03:50 |
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| nox- | ShadowJK is right (i have one too :) | 03:50 |
| smhar | oh... sorry. dreambox is my TV satellite receiver -linux based- which is connected to my router using LAN | 03:51 |
| lcuk | smhar, can other devices on your network happily ping or access it? | 03:51 |
| lcuk | on your wifi network | 03:51 |
| nox- | can you ping other boxen on your lan from n900? | 03:51 |
| felipec | ShadowJK: not yet, now that I know I can get some relatively good number I'll start gathering data for gst-av, and then the alternatives | 03:52 |
| ShadowJK | ok :) | 03:52 |
| smhar | the N900 is the only device accessing the network through wifi, the rest all all in LAN using ethernet | 03:52 |
| SpeedEvil | smhar: you should look at your router config | 03:52 |
| smhar | an I can ping/telnet to DB from all the other computers. | 03:52 |
| lcuk | smhar, then I would suggest trying something else on the wifi | 03:52 |
| lcuk | and look towards problem being router config | 03:53 |
| ShadowJK | can you ping your other devices, not counting router? | 03:53 |
| SpeedEvil | smhar: the router is probably not setup to bridge the two nets | 03:53 |
| MNZ | I must get some eye shut time... good night #maemo! | 03:53 |
| lcuk | nn MNZ \o | 03:53 |
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| smhar | yes. I can ping my other computers from N900 | 03:54 |
| nox- | huh | 03:54 |
| ShadowJK | :/ | 03:54 |
| nox- | checked packet filter rules on the router? | 03:55 |
| smhar | no, will try that | 03:57 |
| smhar | ok, I tried something else: I pinged N900 from other computers: it worked. I tried pinging DB from other computers: it failed !! | 03:58 |
| smhar | probably the DB does not accept pinging | 03:59 |
| smhar | ? | 03:59 |
| nox- | oh | 03:59 |
| nox- | can the n900 get to the dreambox' httpd? | 03:59 |
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| nox- | (and btw mine doesnt block pings tho its also an old one, dm7000) | 04:00 |
| smhar | nox-, mine is dm7000 :-) | 04:01 |
| nox- | hm | 04:01 |
| nox- | which firmware do you use? | 04:01 |
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| nox- | anyway try pointing a browser at it | 04:01 |
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| smhar | I do not remember.. its been a while since I last updated it, it uses the gemini | 04:02 |
| nox- | ah | 04:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | k, 9h on WLAN with xchat on 7 chan: bq27k says bat=85%, lshal aka bme says 75% | 04:06 |
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| smhar | stupid me . the network cable to the DB was disconnected, probably my 1yr old son :-) I can ping DB from N900 now | 04:10 |
| nox- | aah :) | 04:10 |
| nox- | now you can try dreamremote :) | 04:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | first level help desk rules: 1. question - is your device plugged into mains? | 04:11 |
| nox- | hehe | 04:12 |
| SpeedEvil | 2. Should it be? | 04:13 |
| SpeedEvil | 3. Has it burst into flames? | 04:13 |
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| smhar | nox-, did you try DreamRemote? is it working with your DB7000? | 04:14 |
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| nox- | no my firmware is too old... | 04:15 |
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| smhar | nox-, why not updating it?! | 04:17 |
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| nox- | you know the old saying `if it aint broke dont fix it'? :) | 04:18 |
| sevard | uf it ain't broke it needs more custom feature patches | 04:19 |
| nox- | (actually i read about `boot problems' on dm7000 with newer fw...) | 04:19 |
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| nox- | ..and then i just dont felt like messing with it :) | 04:19 |
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| ShadSEC | Anyone knows what else is playing with wlan connections besides wlancond? | 04:23 |
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| SpeedEvil | icd | 04:24 |
| SpeedEvil | icd2 even | 04:24 |
| ShadSEC | and why I can connect to a wlan from commandline but not doing the same when wlancond is stopped, that is whats driving me crazy | 04:24 |
| SpeedEvil | The closedpartrs are really annoying in this case. | 04:26 |
| ShadSEC | SpeedEvil, you say to me? | 04:26 |
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| SpeedEvil | yes | 04:27 |
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| SpeedEvil | The interactions of icd and wlancond are not transparent | 04:27 |
| ShadSEC | never heard about icd2, doing some reasing thanks :) | 04:27 |
| SpeedEvil | And inmany cases get inthe way | 04:28 |
| bef0rd | Hey, is it possible to restore Nokia files from the built in emmc? I formatted it by accident :P | 04:28 |
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| ShadSEC | and is there any steps to free wlan from their interaction while I am managing it? | 04:28 |
| ShadSEC | i mean, any steps already documented i could follow, i dont seem to find anything about it | 04:28 |
| SpeedEvil | No public way | 04:28 |
| SpeedEvil | It's a closed sourcethingy | 04:29 |
| ShadSEC | urgh | 04:29 |
| SpeedEvil | I want to tether over wifi. | 04:29 |
| ShadSEC | So, basically, i cant FREELY manage wlan without some process messing it? | 04:29 |
| SpeedEvil | And it gets in the way trhere. | 04:29 |
| SpeedEvil | As I understand it, yes, you can't. | 04:29 |
| ShadSEC | madness :S | 04:30 |
| SpeedEvil | You can kill wlancond and icd - but obvious problems then happen | 04:30 |
| ShadSEC | wlancondd i thought everything was ok, until i noticed then something is missing for everything to work alright | 04:30 |
| ShadSEC | gezz, i lost all past night thinking it was my fault | 04:31 |
| SpeedEvil | What are you trying to do? | 04:32 |
| ShadSEC | at this time, i am porting one program i made some years ago for running on openwrt | 04:32 |
| ShadSEC | similar to airoscript | 04:33 |
| SpeedEvil | what's it do? | 04:33 |
| ShadSEC | do you know airoscript? | 04:34 |
| SpeedEvil | No. | 04:35 |
| ShadSEC | oh ok, anyway, its not the same... | 04:36 |
| ShadSEC | its the part where i need to setup a regular connection to an ap where it is giving trouble | 04:36 |
| ShadSEC | it only associates if wlancond is running | 04:37 |
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| ShadSEC | but then it just steps into when it feels like | 04:37 |
| ShadSEC | wlancond or whatever is messing with my setup | 04:37 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah. :/ | 04:37 |
| SpeedEvil | you have iwconfig? | 04:38 |
| SpeedEvil | and friends | 04:38 |
| ShadSEC | yep | 04:38 |
| ShadSEC | its what i am using to setup it up | 04:38 |
| ShadSEC | the problem is whatever is messing with my connection afterwards | 04:38 |
| ShadSEC | sometimes sooner, sometimes later | 04:38 |
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| ShadSEC | well, if I wlancond is the main offender i guess its time to strace it till death :) | 04:45 |
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| nox- | this any help? http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control#Networking | 04:48 |
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| ShadSEC | mmm, the disconnect internet d-bus call is interesting | 04:55 |
| lolloo | is there a program for n900 that lets me copy text from it and then paste it on the pc? | 04:55 |
| ShadSEC | i supposse theer are many more dbus calls not documented there, righ? | 04:56 |
| nox- | lolloo, you could use sshd + screen i guess... | 04:57 |
| ShadSEC | how have people get to know about all those dbus calls? maybe there is some source for all of them or just reverse engineering? | 04:57 |
| ShadSEC | source i mean, documentation or something | 04:58 |
| SpeedEvil | reverse engineering | 04:58 |
| SpeedEvil | AIUI | 04:58 |
| SpeedEvil | ceck the authorr | 04:58 |
| ShadSEC | or a standard.. i never heard about those dbus calls before n900 | 04:58 |
| SpeedEvil | of the wiki | 04:58 |
| ShadSEC | i see, so then that main source that there is for now | 04:59 |
| ShadSEC | thats | 04:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | introspection | 04:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | though lots of the Nokia specific systems don't support dbus introspection | 05:00 |
| lolloo | nox- , ssh? what is it? | 05:00 |
| nox- | oh is that like apple blocking tracing of itunes on osx? | 05:01 |
| nox- | lolloo, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openssh | 05:01 |
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| lolloo | nox- , thanks | 05:02 |
| ShadSEC | interesting | 05:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | mdbus2 might come in handy | 05:02 |
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| ShadSEC | lolloo, there is no simple way to do that that i know of | 05:03 |
| nox- | well screen should support copy/paste but yes its not `that' simple :) | 05:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | >> mdbus2 -i drops you into a shell mode, where you can interactively explore services and call methods using readline command line completion and history. | 05:04 |
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| lolloo | if there was a website link on my n900, and I wanted to send it to the pc.. mmm maybe I need notepad? | 05:08 |
| SpeedEvil | pastebinit | 05:10 |
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| zokier | or use some url shortener | 05:20 |
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| ShadSEC | wlancond is NOT stepping into my setup... now lets see if it is just something missing or is it another program.... | 05:28 |
| ShadSEC | I guess this is another of the ways ppl is using to document dbus calls: | 05:30 |
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| ShadSEC | read(4, "l\1\0\1\0\0\0\0\357\5\0\0\216\0\0\0\1\1o\0\33\0\0\0/com/nokia/wlancond/request\0\0\0\0\0\6\1s\0\22\0\0\0com.nokia.wlancond\0\0\0\0\0\0\2\1s\0\32\0\0\0com.nokia.wlancond.request\0\0\0\0\0\0\3\1s\0\6\0\0\0status\0\0\7\1s\0\5\0\0\0:1.89\0\0\0", | 05:30 |
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| ShadSEC | hahaha | 05:37 |
| ShadSEC | here it is :) | 05:37 |
| ShadSEC | read(4, "l\1\0\1@\0\0\0M\6\0\0\266\0\0\0\1\1o\0\33\0\0\0/com/nokia/wlancond/request\0\0\0\0\0\6\1s\0\22\0\0\0com.nokia.wlancond\0\0\0\0\0\0\2\1s\0\32\0\0\0com.nokia.wlancond.request\0\0\0\0\0\0\3\1s\0\24\0\0\0settings_and_connect\0\0\0\0\10\1g\0\17iayiiayayayayiu\0\0\0\0\7\1s\0\5\0\0\0:1.89\0\0\0\10\0\0\0\10\0\0\0fon2200\0\1\0\0\0 \0\0\0\r\0\0\0\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\372\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\1\0\0\0 | 05:37 |
| ShadSEC | strace is yer friend :P | 05:38 |
| ShadSEC | thats the dbus call for setting up a wlan | 05:38 |
| ShadSEC | 372/372/372... etc is the WEP key fon2200 the essid etc... | 05:39 |
| zokier | http://dbus.freedesktop.org/doc/dbus-monitor.1.html might be easier than strace :) | 05:43 |
| ShadSEC | oh | 05:44 |
| ShadSEC | thx, i guess i need to read a lot more about that dbus thing :P | 05:45 |
| ShadSEC | wow,this is awesome | 05:50 |
| ShadSEC | so the "right" way to do things on n900 is through dbus? | 05:50 |
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| zr0 | is there a decent facebook client for the n900 besides the web browser? | 05:56 |
| ShadSEC | zokier, this this dbus-monitor adds another dimension but... it is not showing any of wlancond dbus calls i got using strace | 05:59 |
| ShadSEC | maybe there are calls that aren't shown or maybe i am doing anything wrong? | 05:59 |
| zokier | have you monitored both session and system bus? | 06:01 |
| ShadSEC | no i just did dbus-monitor > | 06:02 |
| ShadSEC | thx :) | 06:02 |
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| ShadSEC | zokier, definitely not showing up... there are some dbus calls of wlancond on --system, but not the setup wlan one... | 06:11 |
| ShadSEC | does this show both requests and replys? I mean... is it all the conversation going on dbus? | 06:12 |
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| Bobbe | interesting | 06:15 |
| Bobbe | NSU is allowing to re-install 1.2 | 06:15 |
| Bobbe | have you guys been experiencing the same? | 06:15 |
| zokier | i think it shows replies too | 06:16 |
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| Bobbe | ?? | 06:16 |
| ShadSEC | and is it possible some calls are made to no show up? | 06:17 |
| zokier | i'm not sure... it can be possible that it uses some other bus for internal calls | 06:18 |
| zokier | eg the wlan daemon or something runs as some different user, and it uses that users session bus | 06:19 |
| zokier | just guessing here | 06:19 |
| ShadSEC | but it follows the same dbus format... Ill try to see what happens if I send that dbus call... when I read how to do that ... | 06:19 |
| ShadSEC | in the straced call it identifies and wlancond | 06:20 |
| ShadSEC | as wlancond | 06:20 |
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| ShadSEC | just the same as other that are showing up, but the two most interesting calls arent | 06:21 |
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| RST38bis | Doc: here? | 07:49 |
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| RST38bis | Anyway, once any of swap-interested parties awaken, check out this: http://lwn.net/Articles/334649/ | 07:53 |
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| lolloo | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hYV-JSjpyU&feature=related | 07:54 |
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| TermanaN900 | yello | 08:07 |
| pupnik_ | hi | 08:11 |
| pupnik_ | http://pics.nase-bohren.de/dearapple.jpg Apple fans respond to the Ipad (nice tagline at bottom) | 08:14 |
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| ilius | [sbox-: ~] > sb-conf select SDK_ARMEL | 08:44 |
| ilius | sb-conf: No such target: SDK_ARMEL | 08:44 |
| ilius | i don't understand this | 08:44 |
| ilius | plz help | 08:45 |
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| Texrat | hey th0br0 | 09:19 |
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| shadsec2 | is 8 the maximun in <key>wlan_tx_power</key>? | 10:14 |
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| pupnik_ | Cell phone gang wars http://pics.nase-bohren.de/android-rowdies.png | 10:32 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | hey guys | 10:35 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | question any of you know whrere i can change opera download path? | 10:36 |
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| pupnik_ | dunno | 10:36 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | i want to set a default parth | 10:37 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | parth | 10:37 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | ... | 10:37 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | path | 10:37 |
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| pupnik_ | a path a path! | 10:50 |
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| plastun | hello! Can anybody vote for Mnemosyne package? I need only one vote for promote it to extras ) | 11:04 |
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| bef0rd | what is it | 11:05 |
| plastun | This is mobile version of Mnemosyne software | 11:05 |
| plastun | It resembles a traditional flash-card program to help you | 11:05 |
| plastun | memorise question/answer pairs | 11:05 |
| plastun | I have version for N800 and N810 in extras, and the current version for N900 | 11:06 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | isnt it an anime? | 11:06 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=5530 | 11:10 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | >.> | 11:11 |
| psycho_oreos | the name maybe related to anime but it isn't necessarily anime itself, plus the guy who wanted to promote that stuff has got his connection reset by peer :p | 11:11 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | i think he took the name of the anime | 11:12 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | but ok | 11:12 |
| bef0rd | peer is evil | 11:13 |
| psycho_oreos | he may or may not have but its irrelevant.. the name isn't trademarked or registered | 11:13 |
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| bef0rd | i was going to vote, not sure where I had to | 11:13 |
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| psycho_oreos | he probably meant this: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/mnemosyne/2.0.0~beta13~rc1/ | 11:16 |
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| plastun | oh, yes, this is right link | 11:18 |
| bef0rd | done | 11:18 |
| psycho_oreos | o.O he's back heh | 11:18 |
| plastun | yes, I was disconnected ( | 11:18 |
| psycho_oreos | we saw | 11:18 |
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| psycho_oreos | and `Francesca_Lucch had a trivial question for you in regards to the name of the app | 11:19 |
| plastun | thank you for voting. And I have a question, if my main packet depends on addtition library, writen myself, shoul I promote this library too? | 11:19 |
| bef0rd | what's the library about? | 11:20 |
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| plastun | it is main mnemosyne library, called libmnemosyne | 11:20 |
| plastun | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/python-libmnemosyne/2.0.0-16~rc7/ | 11:20 |
| bef0rd | oh, not sure, it's the first time I'm voting, I suppose it will get promoted to extras too, as a dependency | 11:21 |
| achipa | bef0rd: plastun: no manual lib promotion - it will get pulled in | 11:21 |
| plastun | cool! | 11:21 |
| achipa | (unless someone put it in the user/* section, but that is a different story) | 11:21 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | humm where do i get python | 11:24 |
| kerio | python.org? | 11:25 |
| kerio | oh, you mean in the repos | 11:25 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | one for maemo | 11:25 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | N900 | 11:25 |
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| psycho_oreos | I saw it was available in extras-testing or maybe extras-devel | 11:26 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | humm | 11:26 |
| psycho_oreos | http://maemo.org/packages/search/?org_maemo_packages_search[1][property]=name&org_maemo_packages_search[1][constraint]=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search[1][value]=python&org_maemo_packages_search[2][property]=title&org_maemo_packages_search[2][constraint]=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search[2][value]=same | 11:27 |
| psycho_oreos | lol | 11:27 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | o.o | 11:30 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | wonder what one is for maemo5 | 11:30 |
| psycho_oreos | depends on which one you need I suppose | 11:31 |
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| psycho_oreos | anyone played with kernel compiling? trying to custom compile titan's kernel with a specific version string but dpkg-buildpackage isn't doing the whole thing right | 11:32 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | the complete pack like as on sayp | 11:32 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | s60 | 11:32 |
| kerio | `Francesca_Lucch: doesn't work like that | 11:33 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | o? | 11:33 |
| kerio | also please refrain from using weird characters as the beginning of your nick, it makes it harder to tab-complete | 11:33 |
| kerio | "the complete pack" for python probably includes some GBs of libraries | 11:33 |
| kerio | there's no "complete pack" | 11:34 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | so | 11:34 |
| dr34m | morn | 11:34 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | symbian-freak.com/downloads/freeware/cat_s60_3rd/descriptions/python/python_for_s60.htm | 11:36 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | that | 11:36 |
| kerio | yeah, doesn't work like that | 11:36 |
| kerio | just install "python" | 11:37 |
| kerio | and then install the libraries you need | 11:37 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | i see | 11:37 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | oh yeah how come solarwolf game dont run | 11:38 |
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| `Francesca_Lucch | humm only rtill maemo4 | 11:40 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | till* | 11:40 |
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| trumee | anybody using a blueetooth mouse with N900. I need a recommendation on what mouse to buy? | 11:44 |
| kerio | a bluetooth one | 11:44 |
| trumee | kerio: yes | 11:46 |
| kerio | no, that's my recommendation | 11:46 |
| trumee | kerio: all bt mouse work with N900? | 11:46 |
| kerio | i don't see why not | 11:46 |
| `Francesca_Lucch | lol | 11:46 |
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| psycho_oreos | problem is why would you want a bt mouse? do you want RSI/CTS? :) | 12:01 |
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| felipec | kulve: I got vorbis, flac and mp3 working on gst-av, and fixed oggdemux and flacparse to work with tagreadbin, I'm trying to measure the power usage | 12:04 |
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| trumee | psycho_oreos: whats wrong with bt mouse? | 12:09 |
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| trumee | i was going to travel soon and did not want to carry laptop with me. | 12:09 |
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| psycho_oreos | trumee, that issue is not related to bt mouse but mouse in general | 12:10 |
| trumee | I have a bt keyboard and wanted a mouse to accompany that | 12:10 |
| trumee | seems on tmo people are reporting problems pairing bt mouse. | 12:11 |
| psycho_oreos | N900 has touch screen | 12:11 |
| trumee | psycho_oreos: yes, but bt mouse is little better to handle | 12:11 |
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| trumee | cheapest i have found http://www.ebuyer.com/product/169790 | 12:12 |
| trumee | not sure it would pair with N900 or not. | 12:12 |
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| MohammadAG51 | Any mouse would pair, as long as it has a pair code i guess | 12:14 |
| psycho_oreos | trumee, better to handle till you get RSI/CTS but whatever | 12:14 |
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| kulve | felipec: ok. Let me know about the results :) | 12:28 |
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| felipec | kulve: so far it seems to be: nokiamp3=72mAh, libvorbis=114mAh, libflac=66mAh, ffmp3/ffvorbis/ffflac=66mAh | 12:31 |
| kulve | felipec: nice numbers (both the fact that vorbis is taking so little and the useful mAh measurements) | 12:33 |
| kulve | felipec: uhm, why mAh? What does it mean actually..? | 12:34 |
| felipec | sorry, I meant mA | 12:35 |
| kulve | felipec: ah, ok :) | 12:35 |
| felipec | kulve: here's the script I used: http://pastie.org/1153444 | 12:35 |
| kulve | I wonder how accurate that is.. Have you tried to reproduce those multiple times? | 12:36 |
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| shadsec2 | Anyone knows the full com.nokia.wlancond methods description? | 12:37 |
| felipec | kulve: yes, I'm trying that now with vorbis | 12:38 |
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| felipec | those numbers I just posted is by running 10min, so the accuracy is +-6mA, and I did run a few times, and they seemed to match, but not in a controlled way | 12:39 |
| trumee | felipec: how can i use ffvorbis on N900? | 12:39 |
| trumee | felipec: i am presently using Mediabox which uses libvorbis i think. | 12:40 |
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| felipec | trumee: does mediabox use GStreamer? | 12:40 |
| trumee | felipec: yes it does. but presently i am using mplayer backend with it. | 12:41 |
| felipec | kulve: at least the mp3 measurement seems to match yours: 18.3 hours | 12:41 |
| felipec | trumee: mplayer uses ffmpeg as a backend, so it's only a matter of compiling ffmpeg with vorbis support | 12:42 |
| trumee | felipec: Media Player (mafw?) takes too much cpu power. Mediabox (With mplayer) uses considerable less. | 12:42 |
| trumee | felipec: is there any compiled binary which i can use? | 12:42 |
| felipec | trumee: yes, that mostly GStreamer's fault | 12:43 |
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| felipec | trumee: although mafw can use different backends, so somebody could write an mplayer backend | 12:43 |
| felipec | trumee: I can give you binaries to try for Media Player, and it might help quite a bit, but still it cannot match mplayer | 12:44 |
| trumee | felipec: i am happy to use mplayer. are there any binaries for that? | 12:45 |
| felipec | trumee: no | 12:46 |
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| felipec | if you are happy with mplayer then you should suggest to the one packaging that stuff to use ffmpeg's vorbis, although my guess would be that they are already doing that | 12:46 |
| trumee | felipec: are you using mafw with ffvorbis? | 12:46 |
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| felipec | trumee: yes, mafw -> gstreamer -> gst-av -> ffmpeg-vorbis | 12:47 |
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| trumee | felipec: "although my guess would be that they are already doing that", is there a way to find that out? | 12:48 |
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| felipec | trumee: ask the guys that package mplayer? | 12:52 |
| trumee | felipec: will do that that. can you please point where the binaries for gstreamer with ffvorbis are? | 12:53 |
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| dridk | Hi, I want to use gst-launch from gstreamer. What Do I need to install ? | 12:56 |
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| felipec | trumee: http://people.freedesktop.org/~felipec/maemo/ | 12:57 |
| felipec | trumee: copy libgstav.so and libgstogg.so to /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10, but that would conflict with ogg vorbis support (libgstogg.so) | 12:57 |
| felipec | dr34m: gstreamer0.10-tools | 12:58 |
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| trumee | felipec: so libgstogg.so should be overwritten. thanks for these. | 13:01 |
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| felipec | trumee: they might not work, it depends if you have libavcodec | 13:02 |
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| trumee | felipec: cheers. i will check that. | 13:03 |
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| Zombie3 | SwedeMike: did you ever get IPv6 working? Found in a channel log that you had trouble with neighbour discovery, and I have the same... | 13:05 |
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| SwedeMike | Zombie3: it's working well now anyway.. a friend of mine had problems as well, they ended up faultfinding his NIC driver for multicast related problems | 13:08 |
| SwedeMike | oh | 13:08 |
| SwedeMike | bah, N900 | 13:08 |
| SwedeMike | Zombie3: no, I still don't have it working on my N900 on wifi | 13:08 |
| Zombie3 | yikes | 13:08 |
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| SwedeMike | Zombie3: we got it working on 2G/3G though. | 13:09 |
| Zombie3 | it's not even responding to ND | 13:09 |
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| Zombie3 | multicast eh... I can check if that works on IPv4 | 13:09 |
| SwedeMike | Zombie3: no, as far as I can see, the packets are somehow not ending up in the kernel for processing, at least no response can be seen | 13:09 |
| Zombie3 | that's what I see too | 13:09 |
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| SwedeMike | Zombie3: my initial response was regarding general ipv6 problems in linux, not N900 related | 13:10 |
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| Zombie3 | oic. I remember discovering DLNA DMS's, so multicast would have worked. That's before I installed the power kernel though | 13:11 |
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| Zombie3 | SwedeMike: it's odd that everybody seems to report that it works out of the box, and the two of us have trouble | 13:14 |
| SwedeMike | Zombie3: yeah. | 13:14 |
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| Zombie3 | tcpdump sees the RA | 13:15 |
| Zombie3 | and neighbour sollicications when I ping its LLA | 13:17 |
| Zombie3 | yet, no response | 13:17 |
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| Zombie3 | I compiled iproute2 for the n900, btw | 13:18 |
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| Corsac_ | Zombie3: it's in extra-devel | 13:22 |
| Corsac_ | I never bothered to make it go to testing though | 13:22 |
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| Zombie3 | Corsac: it's a must-have for any networking geek. It would be useful | 13:25 |
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| Shapeshifter | ruskie: Hey there. I'm a bit confused about how you packaged urxvt. I want to improve its handling on the n900, and for that I'd need to add some perl scripts. Usually they go into /usr/lib/urxvt/perl/ on a normal system, but it seems like you've put urxvt (the binary) into /opt/maemo/usr/bin/ but there is no /opt/maemo/usr/lib/urxvt, so where do the perl scripts go? | 13:44 |
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| alterego | Shapeshifter: /opt/maemo/usr/lib/urxvt is fine | 13:49 |
| alterego | If it doesn't exist just create it :P | 13:49 |
| Shapeshifter | alterego: mhhh. not yet working as I imagine it. :| I'm trying to do this: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/rxvt-unicode-hacking-800818/page2.html#post4013717 | 13:54 |
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| alterego | Maybe urxvt needs to be compiled with perl support or something? | 13:57 |
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| Meldiuz | hi | 13:58 |
| Shapeshifter | alterego: mhhh. yeah seems like ruskie didn't compile it with perl support. or at least it's not in the deps. | 13:58 |
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| Shapeshifter | how sad. I assume there still isn't any other terminal than X-Terminal? | 13:59 |
| alterego | Well, I've not needed anything other than xterm so I've not really looked. | 13:59 |
| Shapeshifter | it's not even xterm. | 14:00 |
| alterego | I know | 14:00 |
| Meldiuz | Has anyone tried to install lighttpd on the n900? | 14:00 |
| Corsac | considering it's in extra-? I guess so | 14:01 |
| alterego | Heh | 14:01 |
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| Shapeshifter | w00t my scratchbox install still works. | 14:05 |
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| alterego | Heh# | 14:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer | just to let you know :-) http://wiki.freesmartphone.org/index.php/Hardware/N900/Installation | 14:20 |
| Shapeshifter | DocScrutinizer: what can FSO do, and what can't it do? Does it do GSM/3G? | 14:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | not yet | 14:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | this is just one week old I'd guess | 14:22 |
| Shapeshifter | ;) | 14:23 |
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| alterego | Hrm, an RC for the Qt SDK | 14:31 |
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| IcanCU | i want to make an application that will switch off 3g when the screen baclight times out | 14:40 |
| IcanCU | does such an app already exist? | 14:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | Shapeshifter: but FSO has a holistic approach, integrating ALL subsystems into a nice middleware (eventually, when finished). So no more eleventy different APIs for e.g. liblocation, WLAN mgmnt, phonecalls, mce blinkenlights, screendimming... | 14:40 |
| psycho_oreos | sorta, its called autodisconnect | 14:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer | IcanCU: although such an app is vastly useless | 14:41 |
| pigeon_ | is there a way to disable the power kernel and use the normal one without uninstalling it? | 14:42 |
| IcanCU | why would it be DocScrutinizer | 14:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | you usually do NOT want to "switch off 3G", as it's very expensive to switch on again, and almost for free to keep it established | 14:42 |
| IcanCU | expensive in terms of battery? | 14:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | you maybe want to tear down local routing, so no more outbound packets go to 3G | 14:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep, in terms of battery | 14:43 |
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| IcanCU | ah i see | 14:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer | it's not 3G that sucks battery, it's actual data over 3G that does | 14:44 |
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| kerio | yeah but having an open connection will lead to exchanged data | 14:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | of course if you got a criminal dataplan that's billed by time, you maybe want to do such thing nevertheless | 14:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: that depends on your local management of apps | 14:45 |
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| kerio | the facebook widget will refresh once in a while | 14:45 |
| SwedeMike | what one wants to have is to have all apps sync so they communicate at the same time | 14:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | kerio: if you can't teach your apps to behave, then it's a stupid approach to tear down whole 3G instead | 14:46 |
| SwedeMike | once every five minutes, wake up the 3G from idle and do their things, then go down in idle again. | 14:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kerio: it shouldn't. It only should do this when screen unblanked, and facebook applet visible | 14:46 |
| kerio | oh, makes sense | 14:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | generally you can't fix a broken-by-design app by changing the way connectivity works. At least not when you take such a brute-force approach | 14:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | if facebook app actually does behave like that, it never must go into extras, it needs downvote for that | 14:49 |
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| alterego | So quiet today. | 14:52 |
| alterego | Probably because the weather is so very nice outside :) | 14:52 |
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| PontusOhman | Anyone tried dual sim with success? | 15:27 |
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| lcuk | PontusOhman, hmm | 15:32 |
| lcuk | do dual sims even fit? | 15:32 |
| kerio | if you shove them in, sure | 15:33 |
| BluesLee | hey | 15:33 |
| BluesLee | i bought one yesterday | 15:33 |
| kerio | i bet you can fit like 7 | 15:34 |
| BluesLee | lcuk: this one for the beloved iphone fits perfectly http://www.eurodualsim.com/site/ | 15:34 |
| BluesLee | lcuk: its a no cut version | 15:34 |
| BluesLee | the second sim sits between the battery and the cover | 15:34 |
| lcuk | then try it and see | 15:34 |
| SpeedEvil | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/nokia-N900-FAULTY-/130430754963?pt=UK_MobilePhones_MobilePhones&hash=item1e5e476093 Oops. | 15:35 |
| SpeedEvil | (not mine) | 15:35 |
| PontusOhman | Yeah, but I want to check if there will be a menu to use for it :) | 15:35 |
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| BluesLee | PontusOhman: there is no stk menu | 15:35 |
| kerio | SpeedEvil: awesome | 15:35 |
| PontusOhman | BluesLee: Okey =/ | 15:36 |
| BluesLee | PontusOhman: you should use an older phone which has an stk menu | 15:36 |
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| BluesLee | PontusOhman: then you activate 007 mode | 15:36 |
| BluesLee | PontusOhman: an then you should switch between the sims with 001+call resp 002.call | 15:36 |
| BluesLee | PontusOhman: unfortunately, it does not work:-) | 15:37 |
| BluesLee | PontusOhman: i may post a thread on talk with screenshots | 15:37 |
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| lcuk | the lovely yellow hildon banners | 15:40 |
| lcuk | should be tintable | 15:40 |
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| lcuk | when a process goes well, they should be tinted green | 15:40 |
| lcuk | and when its an error banner it should be tined red | 15:40 |
| trumee | BluesLee: what do you mean it does not work? | 15:41 |
| lcuk | seeing yellow all hte time means you have to read the banner itself to understand its contents - even if you were expecting it | 15:41 |
| lcuk | (and apps have the worst way of describing things) | 15:41 |
| trumee | BluesLee: You are not able to use the adaptor as it is intended? | 15:42 |
| BluesLee | trumee: right | 15:44 |
| Khertan_Home | 15:44 | |
| BluesLee | trumee: it works with stk mode in other mobiles | 15:44 |
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| trumee | BluesLee: i am not interested in other mobile. So the verdict is it is useless for N900. No dual sim support. :( | 15:45 |
| BluesLee | trumee: in 007 mode (=using code+call) it generates powercycles | 15:45 |
| BluesLee | trumee: this holds only for the version i mentioned | 15:45 |
| trumee | BluesLee: you mean it reboots the phone? | 15:45 |
| BluesLee | trumee: no, it "reboots" the sim | 15:46 |
| kerio | i bet cellmo won't like that anyway | 15:46 |
| trumee | BluesLee: ah, i see. | 15:46 |
| BluesLee | trumee: it asks for your pin every 30 s | 15:46 |
| BluesLee | there are cut versions which work | 15:47 |
| trumee | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=770311&postcount=12 this guys post suggests it works | 15:47 |
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| trumee | how can i refresh hal in N900? | 15:59 |
| trumee | /etc/init.d/hal force-reload did the trick. | 16:02 |
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| Chibi-Taiga | hey guys whats this wget ? | 16:03 |
| SpeedEvil | wget is a command line tool to get web and other files | 16:04 |
| Chibi-Taiga | http://jdownloader.org/download/index | 16:04 |
| Chibi-Taiga | i wanna install this | 16:05 |
| Chibi-Taiga | but i need wget probaly | 16:05 |
| Chibi-Taiga | for n900 | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Well - ask them for a n900 version | 16:05 |
| FauxFaux | Getting Java to work isn't amazingly trivial, so that's probably not a great idea. | 16:05 |
| lcuk | hmm oauth fails if you open 2 auth requests from different apps o_O | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Oh | 16:05 |
| lcuk | potentially | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | No java | 16:05 |
| SpeedEvil | so find another downloader | 16:06 |
| FauxFaux | There is Java. | 16:06 |
| SpeedEvil | It's not like there is a shortage | 16:06 |
| FauxFaux | But Chibi obviously not has the slightest idea what it's doing. | 16:06 |
| Chibi-Taiga | jdownloader is an java application | 16:06 |
| Chibi-Taiga | its pretty neat for downloading from links | 16:07 |
| Chibi-Taiga | and dlc | 16:07 |
| lcuk | Khertan_Home, just because I have my keyboard closed does not mean I need to be in portrait mode :$ | 16:09 |
| * lcuk often wiggles keyboard in/out | 16:09 | |
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| tgalal | hey my N900 absolutely stop scanning for new media. This includes new pictures by the camera, music, videos, everything.. Any idea what's wrong ? | 16:13 |
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| SpeedEvil | Tracker database is possibly corrupt | 16:14 |
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| SpeedEvil | Blow away /home/user/.cache/tracker/file* | 16:16 |
| SpeedEvil | you may want to back them up first, just in case | 16:16 |
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| * Noobmonk3y waves | 16:32 | |
| Noobmonk3y | has anyone else been suffering from the nokia messaging pain in the ass - where it keeps on asking for the password? been happenning for about 5 days now | 16:33 |
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| tgalal | SpeedEvil: removed it, restarted the phone, and it did query for new media. However, only 20 songs of about 400 were found! And same pictures showed up again, didn't get the new ones too.. | 16:35 |
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| FireFly | Hm.. what was the name of the file that runs on USB mass storage connection & disconnection? | 16:40 |
| FireFly | s/file/shell script/ | 16:40 |
| infobot | FireFly meant: Hm.. what was the name of the shell script that runs on USB mass storage connection & disconnection? | 16:40 |
| FireFly | Err, yes, I did | 16:40 |
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| SpeedEvil | tgalal: you know that if you plug in USB and select mass storage - that the media on it is inaccessible? | 16:42 |
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| tgalal | SpeedEvil: it is accesible normally via mass storage | 16:46 |
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| tgalal | SpeedEvil: is there a way I could track the process of creating the databases so I'd know where it gets stuck | 16:50 |
| SpeedEvil | umm | 16:52 |
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| SpeedEvil | /home/user/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg - thedebug liog verbosity | 16:53 |
| SpeedEvil | also - installing syslogd | 16:53 |
| tgalal | SpeedEvil: i changed the verbosity to debug. Where does it show up? | 16:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | syslog I think | 17:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | (/home/user/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg) you can nice trackerd there, strongly recommended | 17:11 |
| RST38h | Doc: Here? | 17:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | # Sets the indexing speed (0->20, where 20=slowest speed) | 17:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | #Throttle=0 | 17:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | Throttle=10 | 17:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | actually means niceness of tracked process | 17:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: wazzup? | 17:13 |
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| trumee | Anybody used two sixaxis controllers at the same time? | 17:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: ?? | 17:20 |
| RST38h | Doc: Back to out chat about swap fragmentation | 17:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah | 17:20 |
| RST38h | Doc: I have been looking for a Linux utility that would defragment swap in place | 17:20 |
| trumee | If both are used together N900 loses its touchscreen functionality. | 17:20 |
| RST38h | Doc: Which seems logical, even for HDs | 17:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yo | 17:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | guess there's no such thing though | 17:21 |
| RST38h | Doc: Have not found any. What I found though is even curioser | 17:21 |
| trumee | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=814133#post814133 heres partly my solution. | 17:21 |
| RST38h | Doc: http://lwn.net/Articles/334649/ | 17:21 |
| RST38h | Doc: Enjoy | 17:21 |
| RST38h | Doc: And if you feel like trying it, please do | 17:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | I think somebody did already | 17:22 |
| RST38h | URL? | 17:22 |
| trumee | Crap, dont know its bash3 fault, but if i do a 'wq' or 'x' in vi as root, it freezes the xterm | 17:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | some few days ago, along with crypto | 17:22 |
| trumee | although 'q' works ok. | 17:22 |
| RST38h | Ah: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32105 | 17:23 |
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| SpeedEvil | http://pastebin.ca/1938872 RST38h - on defragging swap | 17:24 |
| SpeedEvil | ell - not fragging | 17:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-09-07.log.html#t2010-09-07T20:42:55 | 17:24 |
| SpeedEvil | an email tro a mailing list that's not gone through | 17:24 |
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| RST38h | Speed: Too complicated, won't ever be implemented, need a ready-made solution =( | 17:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: rsp http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/search?q=compcache | 17:26 |
| SpeedEvil | it's a few dozens of lines of C to implement a simple nbd client | 17:26 |
| * RST38h wonders how plain compcache will fare on the N900, with the disk swap off | 17:27 | |
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| RST38h | Doc: Ironically, the search result mostly contains questions like mine, we it does look like we have to hunt down and interrogate tobis87 =) | 17:28 |
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| jedlhl | hi all, it is possible to get the very latest meego env (i.e. daily trunk builds) for n900's nowadays isn't it? | 17:30 |
| jedlhl | One just has to be prepared to build an img from that daily trunk right? | 17:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | jedlhl: /join #meego-arm | 17:31 |
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| jedlhl | thanks im in meego atm but i'll also try meego-arm | 17:32 |
| Jaffa | jedlhl: Weekly, AIUI. But last week's wasn't buildable. | 17:32 |
| jedlhl | yeah apparently: some exceptions if they updated closed blobs (published weekly) but usually latest weeklys work | 17:33 |
| * Jaffa saw you ask it on #meego and Stskeeps' reply | 17:33 | |
| * Jaffa goes to bastardise a USB cable. | 17:33 | |
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| jedlhl | yeah noticed, my bad | 17:34 |
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| BluesLee | can i call a chosen contact which is saved on my sim memory via dbus? | 17:41 |
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| alterego | QMaemo5ListPickSelector is quite a crappy class really .. | 17:53 |
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| lcuk | alterego, propose a better one | 17:55 |
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| alterego | Actually, looking at it it goes deeper. | 17:55 |
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| alterego | I wish C++ had closures | 17:57 |
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| * alterego ponrders on what to have for dinner. | 18:27 | |
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| * Noobmonk3y is going out for dinner, yay! no pondering needed.... | 18:28 | |
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| * Noobmonk3y ponders what to wear.... darnnit | 18:28 | |
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| alterego | Well, until you get there :P | 18:30 |
| alterego | Then you'll have to choose from a menu obviously :P | 18:31 |
| Noobmonk3y | lol :P | 18:31 |
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| lcuk | hey Noobmonk3y | 18:33 |
| Noobmonk3y | hey hey luck :) | 18:33 |
| lcuk | did you break the transitions on my machine | 18:33 |
| Noobmonk3y | Nope, not for lack of trying, but nope lol | 18:33 |
| lcuk | :D | 18:33 |
| Noobmonk3y | i'm multitasking :P wooohooo go me! | 18:33 |
| lcuk | heh | 18:33 |
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| alterego | Think I'll have some toast and then maybe order a pizza later. | 18:33 |
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| Noobmonk3y | Playing with Nitdroid - v impressed, whilst configuring exchange in a vmware environment :) | 18:33 |
| alterego | My gf has gone away for a week, so I can take this opportunity to chill out have a few beers and do some coding ^.^ | 18:33 |
| lcuk | alterego, just throw some cheese and tomato and misc fridge fodder onto some toast | 18:34 |
| Noobmonk3y | lcuk, remember how annoyed i was about lack of ide's and pyqt programming.... | 18:34 |
| * lcuk made pizza last night | 18:34 | |
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| Noobmonk3y | Managed to get a simple app working on nitdroid in under an hour, meh....... | 18:34 |
| lcuk | potentially | 18:34 |
| lcuk | yes its easy to get simple apps working | 18:35 |
| Noobmonk3y | well not on maemo :P | 18:35 |
| alterego | lcuk: I would, but I have literally nothing in the fridge, we cleaned it out last night before she left. | 18:35 |
| Noobmonk3y | hehe | 18:35 |
| alterego | Well, everything except a little pasta sauce. | 18:35 |
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| alterego | So I could use that, BBQ :) | 18:35 |
| lcuk | Noobmonk3y, can you develop android apps on the android device? | 18:36 |
| lcuk | like you pretty much did with healthcheck? | 18:36 |
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| Noobmonk3y | ahhh good point, probably not, but wouldnt be doing that most of the time :P | 18:36 |
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| Noobmonk3y | lcuk, i only did it a bit on h/c - mainly as i had no pc, but realistically was too cumbersome, allthough good that i could | 18:37 |
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| lcuk | Noobmonk3y, for python, if there was a nice simple ide that talked it would work well | 18:37 |
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| Noobmonk3y | yup i agree entirely :) | 18:37 |
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| Noobmonk3y | eclipse is getting there with python, just not quite there yet | 18:38 |
| lcuk | eclipse is like some monster itself | 18:38 |
| Noobmonk3y | yeah hehe | 18:38 |
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| lcuk | it hardly comes into the simple category | 18:38 |
| Noobmonk3y | but one thing an ide does dtart doing - is standardising in a way, it means people can visually see and adapt quickly, might be a monster, but does help quick development | 18:38 |
| Noobmonk3y | after the year of configuring it :P | 18:39 |
| lcuk | exclipse, picking up where the emacs as OS left off | 18:39 |
| Noobmonk3y | haha | 18:39 |
| lcuk | -x | 18:39 |
| Corsac | as if emacs had left of :/ | 18:43 |
| Corsac | s/of// | 18:43 |
| infobot | Corsac meant: as if emacs had left :/ | 18:43 |
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| lcuk | Noobmonk3y, so are you pushing your hardco errr H/C to different platform then | 19:09 |
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| Noobmonk3y | naaaaaa, was just testing the waters :P - staying with mameo :P | 19:10 |
| * lcuk thought your app ran on maemo, what is this mameo you speak of :p | 19:12 | |
| Adeon | mameo must be the new secret nokia mobile OS that can brew coffee | 19:13 |
| lcuk | mobile coffee brewing is so old hat | 19:13 |
| lcuk | the next generation mobiles will run on fuelcells | 19:14 |
| lcuk | and can share vodka with you | 19:14 |
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| Noobmonk3y | lol | 19:22 |
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| Chibi-Taiga | since n900 is a linux based phone does it support wine ? | 19:25 |
| SpeedEvil | No. | 19:25 |
| SpeedEvil | Wine is not an emulator. | 19:25 |
| sheepbat | that would require an x86 CPU | 19:25 |
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| Chibi-Taiga | i see | 19:25 |
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| kerio | qemu! | 19:28 |
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| Venemo_N900 | Hi Maemo people | 19:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kerio: bochs + win NT | 19:39 |
| kerio | heh | 19:39 |
| kerio | how about NO | 19:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | bacon nfused vodka | 19:42 |
| kerio | i want qemu | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | infused (darn, need to boot and vacuum my kbd) | 19:43 |
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| kerio | your kbd has an OS? | 19:44 |
| kerio | yeah, you better turn it on | 19:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | cons of a laptop: low profile keyboard (no space for bread crumbs), and can't unplug kbd to clean with vacuum | 19:45 |
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| lcuk | turn upside down and bash repeatedly | 19:45 |
| lcuk | scoop crumbs into a pile and nibble for the rest of the afternoon | 19:46 |
| kerio | lol | 19:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | doesn't help as gap between keys is too small so crumbs will only come out when pressing keys to open up sufficient gap | 19:46 |
| kerio | i have a gap between keys :D | 19:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | even then crumbs will stay where they are: inside key caps | 19:48 |
| Venemo_N900 | Advantage of N900 keyboard: the gap between keys is too small for any dirt to get in there | 19:48 |
| Venemo_N900 | but lcuk, that was lol | 19:48 |
| lcuk | the n810 keyboard was crumbsafe | 19:49 |
| lcuk | but the 810 and 900 have a different issue | 19:49 |
| lcuk | sand in the slider! | 19:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | eeeeeek | 19:50 |
| lcuk | it makes a god awful noise when you get it | 19:50 |
| Venemo_N900 | I finally saw an N810 live on the mobile linux applications course, and it looked very good | 19:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, actually N900 is anti-ruggedized | 19:50 |
| shadeslayer | any ideas if nokia will release a N900 with a capacitive screen? | 19:50 |
| kerio | shadeslayer: go away | 19:50 |
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| shadeslayer | kerio: :P | 19:50 |
| Venemo_N900 | actually, I would prefer an N900 with the N810's colors and design | 19:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | no way | 19:50 |
| shadeslayer | why? | 19:51 |
| shadeslayer | arent capacitive screens the norm now? | 19:51 |
| kerio | for dickphones | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | fsck crappy c-ts. No stylus, no resolution | 19:51 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: capactive screens are crap | 19:51 |
| shadeslayer | why? | 19:52 |
| kerio | *serious* lack of precision | 19:52 |
| lcuk | like a good cake: | 19:52 |
| kerio | i mean, it's ridiculous | 19:52 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: because they are inaccurate and unusable with anything but bare fingers | 19:52 |
| lcuk | single layer capacitive screens are good, but dual layered mixed mode are better. | 19:52 |
| shadeslayer | oic | 19:53 |
| Venemo_N900 | resistive ones are better IMO | 19:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | <3 n900 r-ts | 19:54 |
| Venemo_N900 | DocScrutinizer: "r-ts" = ? | 19:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | resistive touch-screen? | 19:55 |
| Venemo_N900 | K | 19:55 |
| shadeslayer | i really do want a n900... just cant afford it right now :P | 19:56 |
| shadeslayer | also... is there a SDK or developer channel for maemo ? | 19:56 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: wait for the next model, then the N900's price will sink down | 19:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I honestly doubt that | 19:57 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: yes, #maemo-devel and #qt-maemo | 19:57 |
| shadeslayer | Venemo_N900: next model of N900? haha :P | 19:57 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: next model will be called N9 afaik | 19:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | most probably next device is crap by spec. like c-ts, no hw-kbd and whatnot | 19:58 |
| shadeslayer | oic | 19:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | or it's N9 | 19:58 |
| Venemo_N900 | Well, noone knows for sure | 19:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | anyway don't hold your breath for considerably lower prices of N900 | 19:59 |
| Dhraak[n900] | lcuk: so you can do multitouch ungloved but still use the stylu for precision or cold weather? | 19:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | N810 still is ~240EUR | 19:59 |
| lcuk | Dhraak[n900], yes | 19:59 |
| lcuk | i write a lot | 20:00 |
| lcuk | and its impossible with a frozen sausage | 20:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | you can do mt on r-ts! | 20:00 |
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| shadeslayer | Venemo_N900: http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n9-3398.php << OS : Symbian^3 .. lol | 20:00 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, sure | 20:00 |
| lcuk | i showed it on my 810 | 20:01 |
| lcuk | and its an embedded standard part of liqbase :P | 20:01 |
| Dhraak[n900] | I got my n900 off ebay last month for $354 or so with all retail-box accessories and several screen protectors | 20:01 |
| shadeslayer | looks sweet | 20:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess that's fake mt though, as neither N810 nor N900 have the hw for true mt | 20:01 |
| shadeslayer | specially the screen tilting | 20:01 |
| Venemo_N900 | shadeslayer: not announced yet officially, so as I said, noone knows | 20:01 |
| shadeslayer | Venemo_N900: ok... | 20:02 |
| Dhraak[n900] | fake mt? | 20:02 |
| lcuk | Dhraak[n900], sure | 20:02 |
| Dhraak[n900] | how's that work? | 20:02 |
| lcuk | on the n800 | 20:02 |
| lcuk | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJWvvn_cePM | 20:02 |
| lcuk | see for yourself | 20:02 |
| lcuk | install liqbase on it | 20:02 |
| lcuk | try it out even :P | 20:03 |
| Dhraak[n900] | I know my laptop's touchpad can emulate multifinger taps | 20:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | on fake mt the driver will detect 2 touchpoints as one touchpoint that moves very fast to a new pos, and increases area/pressure | 20:04 |
| lcuk | (oh, your n900 still doesn't have complete liqbase rebuild | 20:04 |
| * Dhraak[n900] needs to actually look into changing default apps | 20:04 | |
| * lcuk hmmms and ponders releasing it again | 20:04 | |
| Dhraak[n900] | had to cp/paste that url into fennec | 20:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | so basically what fake mt does is gesture recog rather than true mt | 20:05 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, it has finger recognisers and works out when you break the laws of physics | 20:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | ok, fair enough | 20:06 |
| lcuk | so that "oh look, you couldnt have possibly moved that far in one step, its a second finger" | 20:06 |
| Dhraak[n900] | ...and, evil as it may be, perhaps get flash working in fennec | 20:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: true mt on r-ts works with such simple methods like probing current flowing thru the gradient plane. or - even better - on true 5 wire r-ts you get mt basically for free | 20:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | though you can do a "sequential fake 5 wire" on a genuine 4 wire r-ts, if your driver hw isn't too braindamaged | 20:12 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, with 5 wire you cannot do pixel by pixel MT addressing | 20:12 |
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| lcuk | you need to implement the sort of 4 element per pixel thing that the statum device uses | 20:13 |
| Dhraak[n900] | could I get that mt youtube link again? | 20:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess there's not a single technology for ts that does MT on a pixel resolution | 20:13 |
| lcuk | <lcuk> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJWvvn_cePM | 20:13 |
| Dhraak[n900] | thanks | 20:13 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, Stantum MT resistive http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv3X5y-ajtc | 20:14 |
| * Dhraak[n900] burned some battery on a reboot | 20:14 | |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah those buggers stolen my ideas :-P | 20:14 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: SAW will. | 20:15 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, homemade LED arrays | 20:15 |
| lcuk | can do output and per pixel input | 20:15 |
| lcuk | by measuing the current drop as the LED absorbs some of the reflected light from neighbours | 20:15 |
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| lcuk | LED array with touch input: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ2v4-QvGuU | 20:16 |
| * Dhraak[n900] wonders how hard it'd be to change the okuda theme to TNG LCARS colors | 20:17 | |
| crashanddie | ok, my gmail account has been sending massive amounts of spam | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: optical touchscreens largely incapable to work with stylus | 20:19 |
| crashanddie | steps to figure it out? | 20:19 |
| lcuk | sure | 20:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: yep, saw is a nice technology | 20:20 |
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| * lcuk is just showing there is a lot of thought already gone into this and similar fields | 20:20 | |
| lcuk | crashanddie, "sending"? | 20:20 |
| lcuk | I once got joejobbed | 20:20 |
| lcuk | and had ~20k bounces in a day | 20:20 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: I have about 300 emails in my "sent" directory | 20:20 |
| crashanddie | with about 100 bounces | 20:21 |
| lcuk | then stop sending them | 20:21 |
| crashanddie | well, I didn't | 20:21 |
| crashanddie | it's a phishing email for World of Warcraft | 20:21 |
| lcuk | or look on the bottom of the screen for the ip addresses of people connected | 20:21 |
| crashanddie | yeah, nothing | 20:21 |
| lcuk | you still play wow :P | 20:21 |
| crashanddie | nope | 20:21 |
| crashanddie | I've never played with that account | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I gather Stantum is 5wire r-ts | 20:22 |
| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, no | 20:22 |
| lcuk | you cant do that with only 5 wires | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | uh, so what else? | 20:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | 'multi-wire'? | 20:23 |
| lcuk | its the only feasible way for true mt | 20:23 |
| lcuk | you saw the video | 20:23 |
| lcuk | there has to be a grid | 20:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, for 4touch, yes possibly amount of generic data from 5wire is too low | 20:24 |
| crashanddie | Thing is, my computer has been off all day | 20:25 |
| crashanddie | and it's been sending spam all afternoon | 20:25 |
| crashanddie | I've changed the password, crap. | 20:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | so you add points all over the sensing plane area, not only probing the 4 corners | 20:25 |
| pronto | where does the n900 keep recorded videos | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | as long as there are no more tha 2 touchpoints inside area of the square built by 4 sensing points, you're fine | 20:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | pronto: either on uSD, or on /home/user/MyDocs/DCIM | 20:29 |
| RST38h | back | 20:30 |
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| * Dhraak[n900] wonders how best to (and whether he wants to) get flash in fennec | 20:37 | |
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| Dhraak[n900] | think I'll leave that taint isolated in microB | 20:38 |
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| Chibi-Taiga | is there something like emule for n900 ? | 20:41 |
| Shapeshifter | good grief HAM is a disgrace. | 20:42 |
| Shapeshifter | ._. | 20:42 |
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| Dhraak[n900] | HAM? | 20:43 |
| Shapeshifter | harmattan fuckin' application manager | 20:44 |
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| Dhraak[n900] | ah | 20:44 |
| lcuk | Shapeshifter, err | 20:45 |
| lcuk | "hildon application manager"? | 20:45 |
| Shapeshifter | oops | 20:45 |
| lcuk | and disable -devel and -testing | 20:45 |
| Shapeshifter | indeed | 20:45 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: and end up with what? | 20:45 |
| lcuk | and push devs to get their apps in shape without needing them | 20:45 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: are you suggesting that it's reasonable that HAM can only cope with a limited, small number of applications? | 20:46 |
| lcuk | you are trying to load in every version of every app developed and constantly refreshing them | 20:46 |
| frals | lcuk: well, they kinda need to pass -devel and -testing to get to extras.. :p | 20:46 |
| lcuk | frals, sure | 20:46 |
| frals | hence people need them active ;-) | 20:46 |
| lcuk | I would rather find an alternative :P | 20:46 |
| lcuk | and they only need -testing to be fair | 20:47 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: I usually don't make this lame comparison, but look at the iphone... or android. people browsing applications don't want to wait 3 minutes for the index to load. and there really aren't many applications for the N900, even including -testing and -devel. | 20:47 |
| Shapeshifter | it's an overviewable list you can even browse through by hand in about 15 minutes | 20:47 |
| Shapeshifter | it's simply a disgrace. | 20:47 |
| lcuk | Shapeshifter, download assistance works on the web in a similar manner to those other devices | 20:47 |
| lcuk | and Shapeshifter the guy who wrote fapman tried it | 20:48 |
| lcuk | so you grab that | 20:48 |
| RST38h | fapman is alsoslowupdatingindices | 20:49 |
| lcuk | indeed | 20:49 |
| RST38h | May I once again suggest reanimating PackRat? | 20:49 |
| lcuk | latest version is slower than other | 20:49 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: so you disagree that the whole package management through app with the inane HAM as its frontend is a horrible solution for the n900? | 20:49 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: you can't be seriously suggesting that HAM is "good" | 20:50 |
| RST38h | Because it will do exactly what you all want - fast server-side package browsing | 20:50 |
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| lcuk | Shapeshifter, i think there is no viable alternative solution at this point | 20:50 |
| RST38h | lcuk: There is | 20:50 |
| VenemoN900 | Hey again | 20:50 |
| lcuk | but with some work, some others may present themselves | 20:50 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: Open this in MicroB on your tablet: http://ageofikon.info/packrat/ | 20:51 |
| lcuk | RST38h, server side in what regard | 20:51 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: Check the url | 20:52 |
| lcuk | i am | 20:52 |
| RST38h | lcuk: You can browse one or more repositories this way, installing stuff by clicking on install | 20:52 |
| Shapeshifter | RST38h: did you make this? | 20:52 |
| Plektra | ohoi | 20:52 |
| RST38h | lcuk: It works instantly (the app lists being kept at the server) and roughly corresponds to Ovi | 20:52 |
| lcuk | but that still has its issues | 20:53 |
| RST38h | Shapeshifter: yes | 20:53 |
| VenemoN900 | Hm... what is the file that contains the repositories' data? | 20:53 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Of course it does. A few you will have to live with, others can be fixed trivially | 20:53 |
| Shapeshifter | RST38h: I'm probably stupid but I cannot see how to "browse" and not search this... | 20:53 |
| RST38h | Shapeshifter: That is one thing that has to be fixed | 20:53 |
| lcuk | RST38h, the main one being the "apt-get update" and huge local package lists | 20:53 |
| lcuk | which is exactly the same as fapman | 20:53 |
| RST38h | Shapeshifter: A separate page has to be added to browse by category | 20:53 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: well, you can serve a package directly in .deb form via http | 20:54 |
| lcuk | dependencies | 20:54 |
| RST38h | lcuk: create a personalized repo where the web site loads user's packages | 20:55 |
| Shapeshifter | lcuk: what about them. you can pull those as well. | 20:55 |
| RST38h | and their dependencies | 20:55 |
| trumee | is there any software on N900 which allows to rate music. | 20:55 |
| lcuk | and you are at the PPA stage | 20:55 |
| lcuk | :) | 20:55 |
| trumee | I want a way to rate music and then generate playlist of rated music. | 20:55 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, for normal humans and path of least resistence - pushing as many apps onto extras itself is a benefit | 20:57 |
| lcuk | because then the need to use -devel by default can be sidestepped as much as possible | 20:57 |
| RST38h | lcuk: obviously, powers that set extras promotion policies are not normal humans | 20:58 |
| Xaphania | HellOlAloHallOhayo.. I HI.. | 20:58 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Most normal humans have understood this by now and simply enabled -testing and -devel | 20:58 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, no | 20:58 |
| RST38h | yes, lcuk, unfortunately | 20:58 |
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| trumee | hmm. amarok has that feature but have never used it. | 21:00 |
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| ponyofdeath | hi, when i select usb mode my linux does only see my emc as sdb and not my mmc memory card does not seem to be exported anyone know why? | 21:27 |
| lcuk | heh nice, SHR on n900, open embedded variant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywkWbb_BetI looks fast and has lots of compatability with existing things (shows numpty working :D) | 21:28 |
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| lcuk | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=62152 thread on it | 21:29 |
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| ShadowJK | ponyofdeath, there's probably something running on the N900 that's using the emmc | 21:31 |
| ponyofdeath | ShadowJK: ahh let me check i think i installed lsof | 21:32 |
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| ponyofdeath | ShadowJK: does not look like it | 21:33 |
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| ShadowJK | lsof | grep MyDocs ? | 21:34 |
| ponyofdeath | ShadowJK: well no this is for /media/mmc1 | 21:35 |
| ponyofdeath | Mydocs shows up as sdb | 21:35 |
| ShadowJK | oh it was the reverse of what i thought it read | 21:35 |
| ponyofdeath | ShadowJK: but my addon sd card does not | 21:35 |
| ponyofdeath | ShadowJK: yeah not sure if it needs an separate usb module to get detected or what | 21:36 |
| Funnyface | lcuk: well, those openmoko devices are said to be really slow (haven't tested any myself) so no wonder those things will run well on the N900 :>! | 21:36 |
| lcuk | Funnyface, of course | 21:36 |
| lcuk | optimising for a lower spec device makes it looks really slick on faster | 21:36 |
| Funnyface | yeah | 21:37 |
| Funnyface | I just wish they'd do that for anything new :P | 21:37 |
| lcuk | its something I have tried to drill into many folks for a while :) | 21:37 |
| Funnyface | most progress in hardware is eaten by inefficient software | 21:37 |
| Funnyface | I'd really love to see something like windows 95 booted on a modern PC :P | 21:37 |
| lcuk | and designing software from comfort of your multi ghz machine | 21:37 |
| joga | I used transitioncontrol to pretty much make all transitions instant, it seems more slick that way | 21:37 |
| Shadikka | Funnyface: Shouldn't be that hard. :P | 21:38 |
| Shadikka | I remember somebody telling that he runs Win95 just for the speed. | 21:38 |
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| Funnyface | Shadikka: well, my win95 system used to boot just about as fast as my current win7 system does | 21:39 |
| Funnyface | :P | 21:39 |
| Funnyface | I wonder how microsoft can claim that every new version of windows is "faster and more efficient than ever before" | 21:39 |
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| lcuk | because you generally buy it on hardware that runs faster | 21:39 |
| Funnyface | exactly :P | 21:39 |
| Funnyface | if it is so much faster, maybe I should stick win7 on my old PC | 21:40 |
| Funnyface | just too bad it won't run on 32MB of RAM :P | 21:40 |
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| kynky | well he not running windows95 for the security | 21:41 |
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| lcuk | whats wrong with security on win95? | 21:42 |
| koala_man | they're talking about the user experience | 21:42 |
| Shadikka | Well, on the other hand, Win95 is so old that if there's anything still around that exploits it, it's slightly surprising. | 21:42 |
| Funnyface | ^^ | 21:43 |
| SpeedEvil | Shadikka: you're assuming that the current exploits don't work on 95 there. | 21:43 |
| Shadikka | true. | 21:44 |
| Funnyface | well it can't be that bad, run it behind NAT, and use modern software on it | 21:44 |
| lcuk | win95 had ping of death didnt it? | 21:46 |
| Funnyface | I think the early ones did | 21:46 |
| kynky | think so, but that got patched, if update applied or you had a service release of it i think | 21:46 |
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| Funnyface | they had something called Windows 95 "B" or something that had it fixed | 21:47 |
| kynky | yeah win95B had usb support too | 21:47 |
| kynky | but if using ie3 (think ie4 was with an update) then definately some browser exploits that would effect it | 21:48 |
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| lcuk | who booted widows on the n900? | 22:02 |
| lcuk | windows | 22:02 |
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| RST38h | 'Galileo Was Wrong' is an inaugural conference to discuss the 'detailed and comprehensive treatment of the scientific evidence supporting Geocentrism, the academic belief that the Earth is immobile in the center of the universe. | 22:15 |
| RST38h | 'Scientific evidence available to us within the last 100 years that was not available during Galileo's confrontation shows that the [Catholic] Church's position on the immobility of the Earth is not only scientifically supportable, but it is the most stable model of the universe and the one which best answers all the evidence we see in the cosmos.' | 22:16 |
| * RST38h read it as "100 metres" rather than "100 years" first, but anyway... | 22:16 | |
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| qwebirc19741 | hey | 22:20 |
| qwebirc19741 | can someone tell me, if i can use gfire pidgin plugin on my n900 somehow?!?! pls help!! :$ | 22:21 |
| RST38h | no. | 22:21 |
| qwebirc19741 | =( | 22:21 |
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| qwebirc19741 | so xfire is unable on n900? | 22:22 |
| SpeedEvil | qwebirc19741: In principle - it would need compiled. | 22:22 |
| qwebirc19741 | hm | 22:22 |
| RST38h | Speed: If he could recompile stuff he wouldn't be asking | 22:22 |
| qwebirc19741 | yeah =D tru | 22:22 |
| qwebirc19741 | as you see, im totally noob to these stuffs =( | 22:23 |
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| nox- | moin | 22:23 |
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| trumee | luke-jr: around? | 22:57 |
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| alterego | Half way season 2 of SG-1 .. | 23:15 |
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| alterego | It's been a good Sunday, got some nice coding done, had some pizza and a few beers. | 23:15 |
| lcuk | alterego, how is your app coming on? | 23:15 |
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| alterego | Pretty good. | 23:16 |
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| lcuk | screenies or updates? is it converted to qml yet? | 23:16 |
| alterego | Past few sessions I've been heavily refactoring the configuration areas. | 23:17 |
| alterego | Funny you should mention that, I've actually been working on porting some of my widgets to QML :) | 23:17 |
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| lbt | any debian packagers fancy packaging a tool to help me setup management around the meego community cluster? http://www.heiho.net/synctool/ | 23:17 |
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| alterego | Unfortunately, all my attempts to get a Qt 4.7 toolchain and madde working together have failed. | 23:18 |
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| alterego | So I'm kinda stuck waiting for Qt SDK 2 | 23:19 |
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| alterego | Downloaded the RC today, but it doesn't contain any maemo stuff :/ | 23:19 |
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| alterego | Also, qml-launcher has for some reason stopped working on my N900 :/ | 23:20 |
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| alterego | And I'm not really prepared to reflash just yet. | 23:20 |
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| lcuk | alterego, hmm | 23:41 |
| lcuk | you sound like you goosed it up slightly | 23:41 |
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| alterego | I don't see how :/ I do very little lower than app development. | 23:45 |
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| alterego | It just stopped working, around the time I installed an fcam update but I can't believe that actually had anything to do with it. | 23:46 |
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| RST38h | BTW, why are Modest people not updating their source code in git? | 23:57 |
| lcuk | where are you seeing commits being made? | 23:59 |
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