IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2010-06-10

mmarc__Maybe it is turned off due to licence violation?00:00
mmarc__I mean it appears it is not personal...00:00
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: less noise, less noobs, much more time to do *real* work00:01
mmarc__well, 4 google pages with same token00:01
lcukmmarc__, get a new token then, not end of world00:01
lcukif thats your hunch, follow it00:01
ShapeshifterDocScrutinizer: ^^00:01
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: (except for me, as I need to moderate the ML now ;-P)00:02
mmarc__sure, but could it be the reason of package lookup fail?00:02
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lcukmmarc__, dunno right now, but id rather you stopped worrying about it and got on with you coding00:03
DocScrutinizerbut honestly, the recent "hype" and noise about hostmode didn't exactly help00:03
lcukso if you feel a new key might be the reason, change it00:03
mmarc__lcuk: I'd love to go on, but I need gles development headers :)00:03
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mmarc__My worries are completely about getting the binaries repo working.00:04
lcukso grab a new token and try again00:04
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lcukdoes apt-cache not come back with anything00:05
lcukat all00:05
mmarc__lcuk: you gonna laugh, but gives exactly the same token00:06
mmarc__5 times same, non-dependent on input numbers00:07
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lucentmight it be your browser cache?00:08
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mmarc__so I'm guessing it should not be an issue eigher it is an issue for everybody00:08
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lucenti.e. check cookies etc.00:08
mmarc__lucent: heh, no, tried both chrome and firefox -  same token always00:09
lucentmmarc__: well that's the process. You can wade through the repos manually to get the deb you need, I have done it but right now I don't feel as though I could remember what I did to share with you00:10
mmarc__thanks, lucent, I appreciate your help anyway00:11
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lucentwhen I'm viewing package details from search say... "keepass" -> GO  ;  is there a link back to garage to file a bug ticket?00:12
lucentI am not seeing any00:12
lucent   is where I'm at00:12
SpeedEvilStuff in devel does not need a bugtracker00:13
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SpeedEvilonly if it's promoted to testing00:13
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SpeedEvil(and it's a blocker if it's not got one from going into extras)00:14
SpeedEvilObserve! An email address.00:14
SpeedEvilAlso - was it you that was asking about old versions00:14
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lucentSpeedEvil: yes00:16
lucentwell, no00:16
lucentbut I could be if that is helpful :)00:17
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SpeedEvillucent: naah. I was just going to point out the earlier version links on that page00:18
SpeedEvilOr not, as it happens00:19
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lucentSpeedEvil: earlier version was usable, if dated00:22
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lucentI know and understand the state of development, now,  looks like the port dev is waiting on upstream00:22
mmarc__aggrrrrr, evil vim! I wonder ho you guys live without mc00:22
SpeedEvilthere was someone else in here earlier looking to revert the version of keepasx00:22
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BCMM_mmarc__: amazingly, i am too sleepy for an editor war on IRC00:25
BCMM_perhaps i am ill00:25
mmarc__BCMM_ :-P00:25
* BCMM_ hugs vim00:25
* mmarc__ worst nightmares: 1) vim 2) nano00:26
* SpeedEvil has been scrwing with the mixers.00:26
SpeedEvilMy n900 is now emitting a quiet tick.00:26
SpeedEvilFor no reason I can ascertain.00:26
lucentthat's not good00:26
lucentmixers can be set such that it fries your N900's electronics00:26
lucentbe careful!00:26
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BCMM_SpeedEvil: perhaps it is that noise that plays over FM when the transmitter is on but nothing is playing00:28
BCMM_SpeedEvil: and you've caused it to come out of the speakers too00:28
BCMM_i can't remember if that is a tick or a beep00:28
BCMM_i presume it exists to help you tune a radio to it00:28
BCMM_lucent: you can kill the phone with alsamixer?00:29
BCMM_talking of mixers, is there a graphical application to allow audio to come out of the headphones port and the phone speakers at teh same time?00:29
lucentBCMM_: yes.00:29
MohammadAGlucent, SpeedEvil knows his sh*t :)00:29
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BCMM_i have found it is possible with alsamixer00:29
MohammadAGBCMM_, how?00:30
BCMM_but am disinclined to fry anything00:30
BCMM_lucent: that is kind of bad...00:30
lucentBCMM_: I wrote a script to flip between external and internal audio00:30
BCMM_MohammadAG: i can't remember exactly, and now i've heard that alsamixer is dangerous, i don't think i'll try to reproduce it00:30
lucentmy wording is wrong there, but it does what you say00:30
BCMM_MohammadAG: it is not entirely simple00:30
MohammadAGBCMM_, I doubt it's dangerous...00:31
BCMM_MohammadAG: there are various switches and multiple mixers00:31
BCMM_MohammadAG: well, i kinda poked stuff till it worked00:31
MohammadAGyes I know what alsamixer is00:31
BCMM_lucent: may i have it please? :)00:31
BCMM_MohammadAG: no, i mean various mixers and switches need to be changed00:31
lucentI need to find it00:31
MohammadAGBCMM_, ah, k00:31
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BCMM_MohammadAG: but basically i looked at alsamixer with something plugged in, then looked at it without something plugged in, then plugged something in again and turn on/up everything that was on/up without something plugged in00:32
lucentBCMM_: do you know any GUI programming that works on N900? I would like this to be a graphical app so we can run it and modify the volume levels etc00:32
BCMM_lucent: what do you mean by that?00:32
lucentwell, an app00:32
BCMM_lucent: GTK and Qt work if that's what you mean00:32
mmarc__why apt-key add is not working with ? Says "gpg: no valid OpenPGP data found."00:32
MohammadAGignore it00:32
MohammadAGhttps is disabled in the SDK00:33
lucentBCMM_: yes I don't know how to program those and am not a very good coder, I want this app though, can you code it if you find this interesting?00:33
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BCMM_lucent: i'm afraid i don't actually know GTK or Qt00:33
BCMM_lucent: i plan to learn Qt after my exam though00:33
MohammadAGGTK here :)00:33
BCMM_actually, that's pretty much teh sort of project i might try00:33
MohammadAGBCMM_, how old are you?00:33
lucentBCMM_: great!00:34
BCMM_MohammadAG: 21, studying for BSc physics00:34
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BCMM_lucent: you can't get past a certain level in a language without a project, know what i mean?00:35
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MohammadAGyeah, you keep going in a loop :P00:35
BCMM_well, it's like that for me, anyway00:35
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MohammadAGI stopped reading my C++ book a year ago00:35
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MohammadAGat page 5000:35
MohammadAGgot bored with it00:35
BCMM_at a certain point, exercises are dull and one needs an itch to scratch00:35
lucenthow do I see my /home/user when N900 is mounted as storage device on host system?00:36
lucentI don't remember how everything is mapped00:36
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BCMM_lucent: i don't believe you can00:36
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lucentoh okay so copy to MyDocs and get to it by .documents then?00:36
BCMM_lucent: /home/user/MyDocs is a seperate partition, and that is what gets mounted by the USB host00:37
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BCMM_lucent: is your PC a linux box?00:37
lucentyes it is00:37
BCMM_lucent: ssh may be easiest00:37
lucentoh...  man this is confusing, I hardly ever do this00:37
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BCMM_lucent: do you by any chance have kde or gnome?00:37
lucentUbuntu so yes gnome00:37
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BCMM_lucent: konqueror can treat an ssh server as a filesystem using fish://<user>@<ip address>/path00:38
BCMM_lucent: i think gnome has something that does that too00:38
SplasPood'lo all.   Question:   Did the fremantle SDK vmware images move somewhere?  All the links seem to point to a place lacking the actual images..00:38
mmarc__I see freeglut in extras repos on web, fortunately I have eyes, while apt repos seems to be blind. I'm a happy N900 owner, but really upset that config is so buggy :(00:38
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lucentthanks BCMM_  I'll post the script as a nopaste shortly00:39
BCMM_lucent: i'll take a look at it about a week00:40
BCMM_does maemo come with Qt now, or does it get pulled in when you first install a Qt app?00:41
lucentPR1.2 includes Qt00:41
lucentI *think*00:41
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lucentanyhow you would want to check out the Maemo5 developer guide and Qt00:42
lucentthe future is with Qt and PR1.2 maemo, or even meego00:42
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BCMM_the other reason i want to learn Qt is that i use KDE00:42
BCMM_of course, i'll need to know c++...00:43
BCMM_i presume knowing some C is a start00:43
lucentthe concepts in C++ that use additional keywording are more cerebral than anything00:44
lucentI mean by that, there's no novel use of brackets or what until C++0x00:44
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lucentit's just like C, except you get to do some funny things to make the compiler do your work for you00:44
lucentadditionally there's concepts you can implement which were not reasonable to do with straight C9900:45
t_s_oi once encountered a statement saying that the majority of C++ coders wrote C code00:45
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lucentthat's probably the 1990's mentality of C++, I am guessing00:46
BCMM_t_s_o: as in, also wrote C code, or were writing C++ code that didnt' actually need to be C++?00:46
lucentwrite C, use // comments == c++00:46
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t_s_oBCMM_: wrote code that didnt make use of what C++ added to C, iirc00:46
BCMM_i already use //, gcc doesn't mind00:46
timeless_mbpisn't // valid in c99?00:46
johnsqits c9900:47
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BCMM_timeless_mbp: that might be why gcc doesn't mind00:47
timeless_mbpBCMM_: no00:47
timeless_mbpgcc doesn't mind because it's gcc00:47
lucentc99 is not fully implemented00:47
BCMM_i might've had to tell it not to mind00:47
lucentI mean c99 is not fully implemented by gcc00:47
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BCMM_t_s_o: that sort of code can be made into C quite trivially, right?00:48
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BCMM_t_s_o: or do you mean using classes, but ineffectively?00:48
t_s_oBCMM_: probably, been a while and i dont think the statement was expanded upon much00:48
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lucentagh, stuff it, just going to use a web browser from my N900 to post this script00:49
lucentN900 does not "-o bind" the exported volumes to host laptop00:50
lucentso I've been copying files to unmounted mount points00:50
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lucentthat'd be why they don't appear!00:50
lcukits hard to take an app written in a functional language and convert it to full object oriented tree whilst retaining original form and utility00:50
BCMM_lucent: afaik, the n900 quite simply unmounts MyDocs, and then allows the host to mount it using MSC00:51
lcukso lots of apps just brute force the syntax of whatever and make an app that doesnt care whether its written in c c++ visual basic or python or something00:51
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lucentBCMM_: yep I missed that initially.00:51
BCMM_lucent: MSC doesn't allow clever stuff like that, it literally presents a block device to the host00:51
timeless_mbplucent: so..00:52
BCMM_lucent: for something the size of a script, just scp it00:52
pigeonhmm has chromium disappeared from the repo?00:52
timeless_mbpmass storage is such that the owner of the storage can perform arbitrary writes/reads00:52
timeless_mbpyou can't have two systems trying to read / write to a filesystem where both think they own it00:52
BCMM_offtopic: i have here a little USB gadget that horribly abuses USB MSC00:53
lucentcurious how "Safely Remove Drive" from Ubuntu on the N900 results in an error message always00:53
SpeedEvilchromium  5.0.369.2-maemo4Fremantle Extras-devel free armelPackage  has been removedNiels  Breet2010-06-07 09:40 UTC00:53
BCMM_lucent: what errors?00:53
BCMM_i have a problem with that on KDE actually00:53
lucent1 sec00:53
lucent"Unable to stop Nokia N900"00:54
pigeonSpeedEvil: oh...00:54
SpeedEvilxfade killed it for some reason.00:54
BCMM_kio_thumbnail (which generates thumbnails for kde file managers) starts reading the n900, then dies (on a movie i think)00:54
BCMM_always have to manually kill it to unmount00:54
BCMM_lucent: probably something still trying to read it00:54
lucent"Error detaching: helper exited with exit code 1: Detaching device /dev/sdc" / "USB device: /sys/devices/blah/blah/blah/usb2/2-3)" / "SYNCHRONIZE CACHE: OK" / "STOP UNIT: FAILED: No such file or directory"00:54
lcukisnt that a bit storage hostile?00:54
BCMM_lucent: do you have a shell open that is cd'd to the n900?00:54
BCMM_lucent: fuser -m /media/Nokia\ N90000:55
lcukffs left side of mouth hurtsa00:55
BCMM_lcuk: isn't what storage hostile?00:55
pigeonSpeedEvil: where did you find that information btw? is that a repo log or something?00:55
lucentBCMM_: only happens with Nokia N900, never a usb stick00:55
BCMM_lucent: does fuser show anything?00:56
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* SplasPood gives up looking for the vmware SDK images00:57
lucentBCMM_: the telltale sign is that "Unmount" works while "Safetly Remove Device" triggers the error message00:58
BCMM_lucent: what is the difference?00:58
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lucentS.R.D. powers off most usb storage devices after unmounting00:58
lucentI think00:58
lcukBCMM_, hard scanning large media files on insertion00:58
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BCMM_lcuk: and what do you mean by "storage-hostile"?00:59
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BCMM_lcuk: oh, strictly it may only have happened when i've opened .videos01:00
lcukBCMM_, you said it might be getting stuck on a video01:00
BCMM_lcuk: not stuck while still reading, just dead01:00
lcukubuntu only scans thumbnails for local files < 10mb01:01
lcukahhh borked reader01:01
BCMM_lcuk: in kde it's configurable, and i've set it high01:01
BCMM_lcuk: anyway, practically the only reason i connect as MSC is to move videos01:01
BCMM_for small files, fish is more convinient01:01
mmarc__guys, could you please help to locate the correct url for maemo sdk repo? I tried " fremantle sdk/free sdk/non-free" but it appears to be wrong. How can I produce correct paths myself? Any guides around or again guess, guess and guess yourself?..01:01
BCMM_although actually i haven't been able to use SSH keys since flashing 1.2. anybody know anything about that?01:02
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lucenton that topic of strange things after PR1.2 :01:03
lucentAdBlockPlus is installed but does not seem to work?01:03
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mmarc__lcuk, ok, and what? I'm looking for a correct sdk path repos to submit to apt/sources.list...01:03
lcukBCMM_, i have ssh keys working01:03
BCMM_lcuk: did 1.2 overwrite sshd_config?01:04
BCMM_perhaps i just missed something while checking it afterwards01:04
lcukmmarc__, learn to read :) they are listed even in the nice "deb ...." syntax01:04
timeless_mbpBCMM_: hrm01:04
lcukBCMM_, i dunnno i reflash quite often tho01:04
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BCMM_lcuk: how come?01:04
timeless_mbpBCMM_: works for me01:05
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timeless_mbpBCMM_: ssh -v -v -v should be your friend01:05
BCMM_well, i guess i've typod in the config file then01:05
lcukBCMM_, i dunno, i just shrug and use password once to copy key over01:05
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BCMM_timeless_mbp: thanks, didn't know it went quite taht verbose01:05
mmarc__lcuk: I've learned to read, also I hope I'm not completely stupid, and you don't think I am.  I'm specifying "deb fremantle sdk/free sdk/non-free" for apt sources list, but it says it's wrong: Couldn't stat source package list freemantle/sdk/non-free Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/repository.maemo.org_dists_freemantle_sdk_non-free_binary-i386_Packages) - stat (2 No such file or directory01:07
mmarc__And extras, BCMM_ is fine, my question is about the SDK repo01:07
BCMM_mmarc__: oh, sorry01:07
timeless_mbpmmarc__: did you do apt-get update ?01:07
timeless_mbp(and are you root?)01:07
lcukmmarc__, did you go to the page i offered and read the contents01:07
mmarc__yep, this error is exactly fro aptt-get update01:07
timeless_mbpis non-free real?01:07
lcukbecause theres a big section called:01:08
lcukRepositories for Maemo SDKs01:08
lcukThese repositories are meant to be used with apt-get only within the SDK environment.01:08
lcukand it lists them01:08
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mmarc__lcuk: so, am I understanding correctly that there is no sdk repository for Maemo 5.0 Fremantle?01:09
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timeless_mbpthere's definitely a repository01:10
mmarc__then, where is it on that page, lcuk?01:10
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mmarc__listed only for diablo and older01:10
* timeless_mbp was supposed to try indexing pr1.201:10
lcukmmarc__, im sorry, i cant help you unless you learn to read.01:11
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* lcuk spits out blood01:11
mmarc__lcuk: sorry, what I suppose to read?01:11
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SpeedEvilI also did not find the sdk repository when looking on that page01:11
mmarc__this repo was working on my phone directly, and I remember it01:11
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mmarc__lcuk, could you please be so kind to tell, what to read...01:12
timeless_mbpSpeedEvil: what do you mean by didn't find?01:12
lcuk>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<01:12
lcukyou blind gits01:12
lcukthat gives the correct urls01:12
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mmarc__Have you learned to click your mouse?01:12
lcukbecause the ones you are trying is wrong01:12
mmarc__the question is that there is no sdk repo for freemantle there :)01:13
SplasPoodok, now tell me what to read to find the vmware SDK images ;)01:13
SplasPoodmmarc__: err.. I see em there01:13
mmarc__deb diablo sdk/free sdk/non-free tools/free tools/non-free01:13
SplasPoodMaemo 5.0 Fremantle (browse)01:13
SplasPooddeb fremantle/sdk free non-free01:13
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mmarc__so, that's exactly what I was typing to apt before01:15
* MohammadAG facepalms01:15
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mmarc__lcuk: thanks, I was wrong, and thanks for teaching me to read!01:16
SplasPoodAwesome... now... does anyone know wtf happened to the SDK vmware images? ;)  (promise, that'll be the last time I repeat)01:17
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lcukSplasPood, i believe theres a whole new set of them01:17
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lcuki saw something listing them very recently01:17
lcukpr1.2 ones too01:17
SplasPoodlcuk: the links are there, but the listing they then show doesn't contain any of em01:17
SplasPoodfor example01:18
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mmarc__hm: no libglew on freemantle?01:20
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SplasPoodlcuk: see what I mean?01:20
SplasPoodlcuk: that was linked to from
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BCMM_lcuk: did you get a tooth pulled or something?01:22
pigeonhmm what's the command to launch microb, maybe giving a url as well, from the command line?01:23
lcukSplasPood, just went hunting and you are right, the new one isnt there01:24
SplasPoodlcuk: well, glad to know I'm not crazy, thanks for looking01:24
lcukthe announce said it was, and i didnt follow it, it just said a new one for 1.201:24
lcukbut only there is the older one in the older releases link01:24
SplasPoodyea, looks like they ditched the old one and forgot to cp the new one in ;)01:24
lcukyes BCMM_01:24
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BCMM_lcuk: gah, no fun at all01:24
lcukand i cant concentrate on anything or go read a book or lie down or anything i want to do01:25
SpeedEvillcuk: Find a source of 5-10VAC, around 10-50Hz. Wrap two stainless spoon-handles mostly with cling-film, and connect to source of power. Apply across sore gum area.01:25
SpeedEvillcuk: This works really well.01:25
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lcukive got a tens machine01:25
BCMM_i don't think that's a good idea, but i can't think why01:25
lcukbut not for mouth01:25
lcukBCMM_, it might be fun for a bit01:25
BCMM_meh, from having had mains shocks, 50Hz feels weird01:26
SpeedEvillcuk: It's used in dentistry, and works really well.01:26
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lcukyeah SpeedEvil i know how well tens works01:26
BCMM_(not enough of a shock to cause pain, must've been a fair bit of resistance other than me in the circuit)01:26
SpeedEvillcuk: I went from 'ow - these painkillers are not touching it' to 'hmm - gum feels odd.'01:26
lcuktho first time i ever used one, i was left for a couple of hours01:26
lcukand i couldnt feel my feet for a while lol01:27
lcukits not sore, it just gets me if i laugh01:27
lcuki darent move it also ;)01:27
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BCMM_what does tens do? just confuse nerves into being quiet?01:27
SpeedEvilBCMM_: basically01:28
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mmarc__Scratchbox won't start GUI and forward it to Xephyr display, here's the message log: "" - are the invocation command correct there?01:33
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mmarc__I used the sequence: export DISPLAY=:2 and start01:34
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BBaxterIs there a way to edit the autocomplete dictionary?01:36
pigeonhas anyone tried to install pelota-widget?01:36
mmarc__Also "Xephyr :2 -host-cursor -screen 800x480x16 -dpi 96 -ac -kb &" complains about "Unrecognized option: -kb" - Could it be a 10.04 issue?01:38
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BBaxterhmmm I can't access "Complete Browsing History". Pressing it does nothing.01:54
asjdamn in pr1.2 it still looks like skype is a huge battery hog, started skype at 1pm, phone was drained by 11pm. idle phone, wifi only01:54
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asjodd though, light battery drain from 1pm->6pm, then it's like someone flushed the toilet and the phone went from 75% to 0% from 6pm->1101:55
Aariskype is a god damn battey01:56
Aariskype is a god dam battery hog01:56
asjwhich is too bad01:57
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BBaxterAnd I have a fresh flash of both fiasco & emmc 1.2 too01:58
AariJaaksireflash the phone01:58
asjBBaxter: do you have any browsing history?01:59
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BBaxteryeah I clicked 5 consecutive links01:59
AariJaaksithat's strange02:00
crashanddieAariJaaksi: please change your name02:00
lcukAariJaaksi, please do not impersonate individuals02:00
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lcuklol crashanddie02:00
BBaxterIs there a way to reinstall MicroB?02:01
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AariJaaksii am not impersonating....why so serious?02:01
BBaxterI don't really use Complete Browsing History, but it's annoying that it's a problem after a reflash02:01
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vldcnstnow the real Aari can't join.02:03
* lcuk tries to think what i was going to do02:03
crashanddielcuk: sleep02:03
lcukvldcnst, sure he can02:03
lcukhis name is ari02:03
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crashanddieno, that's his first name02:03
lcukcant crashanddie02:03
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lcuki tried lying down before02:04
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N900boymy battery went down fast today02:10
N900boywondering why02:11
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satmdfor me too, but here it was login problems with skype02:11
satmdit connected but timed out eventually... in a loop02:12
asjsatmd: oh was there skype issues yesterday?02:12
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satmdI dunno the reason for it02:12
N900boyall this talk about battery better in 1.2 is bullshit talk02:12
asjN900boy: it's not02:12
satmdI just happened to sit in my coworkers office and trying to test video phoning02:12
N900boy1.2 did fuck all to my battery life02:12
satmdI was being displayed as offline/online switching all the time02:12
asjN900boy: run less crap02:12
microlithN900boy: what were you expecting, exactly?02:13
lucent"fucking magnets, how do they work?"02:13
N900boyasj: I'm not runnin crap02:13
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* microlith finds a baseball bat to beat lucent with02:13
crashanddieyou're talking it, though.02:13
* satmd suggests powertop02:13
lucentmicrolith: a pelican ate your baseball bat, yo, it ran away02:13
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mmarc__oookay, my opengl apps are working in emulator thanks to sdk and great help of people here. Many of you are gone sleeping, but still thank you very much for helping me with numerous stupid issues! :)02:19
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lucentmmarc__: glad it's working for you now02:24
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mmarc__thanks, now I'm looking for correct command to login into arm sandbox. /scratchbox/login by default places me into x8602:25
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mmarc__sb-conf se FREEMANTLE_ARMEL says sb-conf: No such target: FREEMANTLE_ARMEL02:27
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mmarc__aha! sb-menu seems to do this job!02:31
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crashanddiemmarc__: because it's fremantle, not freemantle?02:32
lucentbollocks, I spaced out and forgot to send the script for speaker enable/disable02:32
lucentlawl @ freemantle -  I've done that same thing02:33
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mmarc__lucent: heh, thanks, my bad habit too :)02:35
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N900evilhence the note on the wiki02:35
mmarc__but it now says "sb-conf: You must close your other Scratchbox sessions first" while this is definitely the only one session02:35
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luke-jrStskeeps: after BME forces Gentoo to shutdown, I booted Maemo-- full battery02:37
mmarc__aha, used killall from sb-menu, and it's gone02:37
luke-jrStskeeps: therefore, I assign high probability to BME thinking Gentoo is "charge-only mode"02:37
crashanddiemmarc__: every single question you're asking has been answered a gazillion times, please use google.02:37
mmarc__crashanddie, ok-ok, I'm using02:38
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jacekowskiluke-jr: bme + gentoo?02:40
jacekowskiluke-jr: and bme itself as far as i know doesn't shutdown anything02:41
mmarc__Is there an equvalent of _FPU_SINGLE/_FPU_DOUBLE on arm?02:41
jacekowskiluke-jr: it sends info to dsme02:41
SpeedEvilmmarc__: neon?02:41
* SpeedEvil has little clue.02:41
mmarc__what is neon?02:41
MohammadAGa gas02:41
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jacekowskiMohammadAG: rtfm02:41
jacekowskinot you02:41
jacekowskimmarc__: rtfm02:41
jacekowskimmarc__: but on arm it's done differently anyways02:42
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mmarc__could you please give more exact description?02:43
jacekowskiread the fucking manual02:43
vldcnstoh oh, the f word02:43
mmarc__ok, but where? neon is too common word02:43
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jacekowskibut you want vfp not neon02:44
vldcnstsorry, mr. russian, couldn't help myself.02:44
jacekowskimaemo is LE or BE?02:44
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* nextime don't want meego...02:47
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SpeedEvilGoogle is annoying.02:48
jacekowskisleep time02:48
SpeedEvilTry to search for - for example - "at+cops=?"02:48
jperez26It can also be your friend :p02:48
mmarc__google is producing too much CO2 ;)02:49
mmarc__So, do I need -mfpu=neon ?02:49
mmarc__for gcc02:49
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jperez26This sucks.  XChat hates me >:/02:50
jperez26Using Pidgin since XChat isn't playing nice02:50
* lucent fails02:50
jacekowskimmarc__: you need vfp not neon02:50
jacekowskimmarc__: neon is simd02:50
jacekowskimmarc__: vfp is for maths02:51
jacekowskimmarc__: and floating points02:51
mmarc__well, I got a similar feeling...02:51
MohammadAG51terminal isn't starting02:52
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jacekowskiMohammadAG: you fucked it up02:52
mmarc__cool, and can you simply state if vfp is available on maemo?02:52
jacekowskimmarc__: it is02:52
MohammadAG51jacekowski, how...02:52
jacekowskimmarc__: it's procesor feature02:52
jacekowskiMohammadAG51: well, you did it02:52
MohammadAG51jacekowski, it's osso-xterm right?02:52
mmarc__cool, but I need some headers :)02:52
jacekowskiMohammadAG51: so why you are asking me?02:52
jacekowskiMohammadAG51: yes02:52
mmarc__to organize that evil FPU config02:52
jacekowskiMohammadAG51: how are you starting it?02:52
MohammadAG51jacekowski, hmm, idk, to annoy you maybe02:53
MohammadAG51jacekowski, xterm icon02:53
* MohammadAG51 starts it using xchat02:53
MohammadAG51k, it doesn't say anything02:53
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jacekowskiwell, i was thinking that you might be trying to start it over ssh or something02:53
MohammadAG51calls for a reboot, brb02:53
MohammadAG51it works over ssh02:53
* MohammadAG51 reboots02:54
jacekowskii'm going to sleep02:54
mmarc__I thought _FPU_* stuff comes with gcc on x8602:54
mmarc__so, it appears on maemo's gcc it does not?02:54
mmarc__e.g. fpu_control.h02:55
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jacekowskithere is no fpu on arm02:55
jacekowskithere is vfp02:55
mmarc__right, but is it comming with gcc or separately?02:56
vldcnstwill this ever end?02:56
lucentvldcnst: is end available in maemo?02:57
vldcnstlucent: exactly my point.02:57
jacekowskigcc doesn't support generating vfp code yet02:57
jacekowskiwell, it can generate it from inline assembly02:57
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mmarc__vldcnst: my stupidness is endless :-D02:57
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mmarc__hmm, jacekowski, it sound pretty unportable :(02:58
jacekowskigcc -mfpu=vfp -mfloat-abi=softfp02:58
jacekowskithat would do the job02:58
jacekowskibut FPU thingies are x86 specific02:59
jacekowskiand don't exist on other platforms02:59
mmarc__and what's about _FPU_* equivalents? I guess I have to rewrite them somehow02:59
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jacekowskidepends on _FPU thingy you ask for02:59
jacekowskimmarc__: what do you need03:01
luke-jrjacekowski: I don't know/care *how* BME shuts down, but BME is what triggers it...03:01
luke-jrjacekowski: vfp *is* a fpu03:02
jacekowskibut it's not a same FPU as x86 fpu03:02
jacekowskiit's like a lorry and a car03:02
jacekowskiboth have 4 wheels and engine03:02
luke-jrjacekowski: if GCC can't handle it, what is -mfp=vfp ?03:02
luke-jrx86 fpu != fpu03:03
jacekowskiluke-jr: support for vfp instructions in assembly03:03
luke-jrGCC doesn't do assembly03:03
mmarc__jacekowski, well, I need to implement switching precision modes to 24, 53, 64, and rounding modes: chop, up, now and near. Also a switch to turn on/off FPU exceptions03:03
jacekowskiit does03:03
luke-jrno, as does assembly03:04
MohammadAG51oi, go to bed03:04
mmarc__right, fpu also is simply some assembly03:04
luke-jrand doesn't require options to enable support for vfp03:04
jacekowskiluke-jr: it does03:04
jacekowskiluke-jr: otherwise it will do it in software03:04
luke-jrjacekowski: 'man as' lists no such options03:04
luke-jronly 'man gcc'03:05
luke-jrand gcc doesn't do assembly, 'as' does03:05
jacekowskiinline assembly03:05
jacekowskiand gcc will fail if you have "unsupported" instructions in it03:05
jacekowskimmarc__: there is FPEXC register for exceptions03:06
mmarc__Any examples? I'm going to find some after some sleeeeep...03:06
jacekowskiARM programmers manual03:06
mmarc__:) ok03:07
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mmarc__hmm, also there is a wierd thing: "Error: bad instruction `int $3'" that comes from random source files without explicit assembly code...03:16
mmarc__- a gcc error03:16
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mmarc__That's probably produced by assert, I think03:17
mmarc__int 3 is interrupt03:17
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MOUDHey all03:48
MOUDIs it possible to run BB services on n900?03:48
MohammadAG51closed protocol, no03:48
N900boydont think so03:48
MOUDso those r rumors then03:49
N900boywhere did you see that?03:49
MOUDsomeone from work said that03:50
MOUDwhat exactly is the problem for the BB services to run on n900?03:50
asjMOUD: RIM doesn't publish the protocol03:50
MOUDasj: I see03:51
asjMOUD: iow, they don't tell you how to talk to the BB server, BB client, nothing, for all we know it's BB Server <-- magic --> Phone03:51
asjMOUD: and that's how they sell phones, want the service buy the phone03:52
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MOUDasj: aham03:52
nextimein theory remain possibile with reverse eng., but considering how rim mail push work, it is better if noone porte it :)03:52
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asjnextime: I thought that involved an sms or something odd like that03:53
lucentwell...  KeePassX bug was closed as WONTFIX03:53
nextimeasj: probably03:53
lucentI don't have the resources to fix the UI for Maemo503:54
nextimeasj: it is also relatively simple to do something like that, the main problem is that to be convenient need operators support03:54
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MOUDbut... what is it that makes BB so popular and unique from other phones? (except the free msg to and from BBs)03:54
asjnextime: "back in the day" I'm guessing the bw savings vs real time performance made them jump all over it though03:55
lucentasj: I think the Zimbra project implements a BB server03:55
nextimeasj: anyway, i was referring to the privacy complicance on put your email on a third party server if you can't pay for a rim-enabled private one03:55
lucentprotocol info might be published, or might not03:55
nextimelucent : it implement it, but only in the non-open source part and with an agreement with rim03:55
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lucentMOUD: in the US it is often the case that Sprint as a carrier markets BB devices and plans to Businesses with lowest group rates03:56
MOUDlucent: I mean worldwide03:56
lucentyeah that I don't know03:56
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nextimeMOUD : i can just say that here (italy) bb is popular couse is the only very cheap from long time way to have email on mobile03:57
nextimei also have a bb, but i'm trying to find a good rate to sobstitute it with my n900 and/or my android device...03:59
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MOUDnextime: aham04:00
lucentI suspect it's chicken-and-egg04:00
lucentcarriers push BB to businesses04:00
lucentlater in time, businesses know that other businesses use BB, that's what they want too04:00
lucentcarriers keep using BB because all businesses want it04:01
nextimelucent : chickend and egg is more simple. Evolution say that the egg is born before.04:01
lucentnextime: not in southern USA04:01
nextimelucent : creationists?04:02
nextimelucent : the answer is that creationists are in the evolution road before also the egg.04:02
lucentin the "Derp Souf" a vote passed to replace education text books with published accounts that are more favorable to creationism and the idea of National um... how do I say it without making it sound like Adolf Hitler?   USA supremacy04:03
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nextimelucent : sadly i can't translate a phrase that the old people say here...04:03
lucenthmm... try04:04
nextimesomething like "the mother of the idiots is ever pregnant"04:04
lucenteven a literal translation, it would be interesting to me?04:04
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lucentha! yeah04:04
lucentthat would be, the WHOLE united states right there04:04
* nextime finally has compiled the new kernel!04:05
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nextimeis there any light office application for maemo?04:09
nextime( a free one )04:09
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ptlI never understood something from Hildon Application Manager04:11
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ptlwhen it is up to update a bunch of packages, it asks for permission ("I understand" etc.) only for the first package04:11
ptlthen proceeds updating every package, even the ones for which you didn't explicitly mark as Ok04:12
ptlIANAL but I think this way they cannot enforce any agreement on the user.04:12
SpeedEvilI submitted a bug for that04:12
SpeedEvilit was WONTFIXED04:13
ptlwhat was the justification?04:13
pigeonwhen does modest download attachments in e-mails?04:13
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SpeedEvil'meh - too hard'04:13
SpeedEvilOr something04:13
nextimeptl: i don't know the hildon app manager, but i suspect that it is a mere frontend on apt, so, on update, it is just like do an "apt-get upgrade"04:13
nextimeso, it ask only one time for the whole upgrade04:13
ptlnextime: Yes, I know, but the point is about agreeing to the terms of the software package04:13
SpeedEvilMore likley 'conforms to internal style guide' or something04:14
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nextimeouch, 3:14am here. Night guys.04:14
ptlgood night04:14
ptl22:14 here04:14
MohammadAG514:15 :P04:15
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MohammadAG51night nextime04:15
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GAN900nextime, not quite.04:15
GAN900nextime, its update logic is a little different.04:16
SpeedEvilbug 1026204:16
povbotBug Installing multiple apps at once - the disclaimer title is incorrect.04:16
GAN900nextime, so, no, it doesn't behave exactly like apt.04:16
GAN900SpeedEvil, "UI specifications" is the evil word you're looking for.04:17
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SpeedEvilyes, that04:17
SpeedEvilAre these public?04:17
SpeedEvilI assume not04:17
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GAN900They're, like, thousands of pages long and really stupid apparently04:19
GAN900So it's probably just as well.04:19
GAN900I'm so fscking tired of hearing it as a justification04:19
GAN900"Well then it's a bug in the spec!!"04:19
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tgalalHey I'm having a presentation tomorrow and would like to use something like BlueMaemo for slide transition. BlueMaemo is good but because right and left button are on the touchscreen, it's hard to press without having to look on the phone. Is there a way to use the volume keys for traversing presentation slides ???04:20
* SpeedEvil ponders submitting a bug. 'One or more UI specification writers is clinically insane'.04:20
SpeedEvilDUPL, or WONTFIX?04:21
GAN900SpeedEvil, I think management is more to blame.04:21
GAN900They'll just ignore it04:21
SpeedEvilYou can't sanely write a spec with no itneraction with users or coders.04:22
GAN900Or somebody will mark it INVALID04:22
SpeedEvilIt needs to be a back and forth thing.04:22
GAN900Yes you can04:22
GAN900It's Nokia04:22
* GAN900 cries04:22
SpeedEvilWell - there's always mer.04:23
SpeedEvilOr is it meego this week. :)04:23
GAN900Not really04:23
GAN900MeeGo, ugh.04:23
SpeedEvilIt's a shame that more of what is actually open wasn't signposted early on.04:23
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SpeedEvilIt's easy to assume without thinking hard - and I did - that hildon must be closed.04:24
GAN900Nokia sucks at advertising their own strengths.04:24
SpeedEvilAnd some bits of it are - true04:24
SpeedEvilBut much isn't04:24
SpeedEvilAnd modest, ... isn't.04:24
GAN900and so many of us have been around so long we've lost perspective04:24
GAN900Easy to assume04:24
SpeedEvilEven microb isn't - though I can't seem to find sources for that.04:25
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GAN900The browser-ui was supposed to be open initially04:25
GAN900But that didn't pan out04:25
GAN900then it was supposed to be open with Fremantle04:25
GAN900But wasn't04:25
GAN900It's on Garage04:25
* jpinx-eeepc lurks in here while searching for a 2nd hand n90004:26
SpeedEvilA seemingly old version is on garage. I'm not sure if that's current code.04:26
SpeedEvilbrowser-ui is the stuff that does zoom/pan?04:26
SpeedEvilmicrob is the bit that merely renders to an image?04:26
SpeedEvil(well - of course - that's the hard bit)04:27
SpeedEviljpinx-eeepc: I supect any coming up on ebay will go quite fast.04:28
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SpeedEvilI note that the price has gone down a bit int he UK04:28
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: I'm in Thailand ;)04:28
SpeedEvilIs there ebay in thailand?04:28
jpinx-eeepclooking in the markets here - there are some.....04:28
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SpeedEvilThere are lots of 'nokla n900' around.04:29
jpinx-eeepchow much of my limited debian knowledge will transfer be useful in maemo?04:29
SpeedEvilCheck it's not advertising dual-sim :)04:29
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SpeedEvilMaemo is - pretty much - a desktop linux system running on a phone.04:30
SpeedEvilTo the extent that you can with a stock 1.2 install, with about 6 commands be rebuilding the kernel on the device04:30
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: I have seen some good-looking non nokia n900's ;)04:31
SpeedEvilecho sdkrepodetails >/etc/apt/whererver04:31
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SpeedEvilapt-get install build-essentials, ...04:31
SpeedEvilDual SIM would be a handy feature04:31
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: cool - it's an apt based install system?04:31
SpeedEviljpinx-eeepc: yes04:32
SpeedEvilThe stock application manager is a wrapper round apt.04:32
jpinx-eeepcare there genuine n900s with dual sim?04:32
jpinx-eeepcthought not....04:32
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SpeedEvilHmm - looks like they are going for 250 quid or so on ebay04:33
ohwhymethe n900?04:33
jpinx-eeepcI'll be in a different market today and will see what's aaround04:33
ohwhymethat is sooo cheap04:33
jpinx-eeepcI got offered a N86 8Mb for US$235 a couple of days ago, but it's symbian04:34
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Termanagood morning04:34
jpinx-eeepcI'll let you know what prices I get offered n900s at if I find any04:35
ohwhymecan u even unlock the n900 by urself?04:35
ohwhymea lot of them are locked to a provider on ebay04:35
SpeedEvilohwhyme: it's not usually locked04:35
SpeedEvilI know some are 'locked' to coda - but I'm not sure what that involves04:36
jpinx-eeepcover here nothing is locked04:36
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jpinx-eeepcthere is an IMEI-based code that allows you to unlock most mobiles, not sure about n900s specifically though04:37
ohwhymeso how is the usb otg project going?04:40
SpeedEvil says the voda ones are not in fact locked.04:40
SpeedEvilyou can flash04:40
SpeedEvilohwhyme: progressing slowly04:40
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SpeedEvil - says 'photo editor on device'04:49
SpeedEvilOh - I suppose you can crop them.04:49
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ponyofdeathhi guys how do i add an irc channel to the my n900 i have the server set up but dont see where i set up an channel04:51
SpeedEvilYou mean int he conversations app?04:51
ponyofdeathSpeedEvil: yeah04:51
ponyofdeathSpeedEvil: do i have to add contact that is #channelname ?04:52
SpeedEvilI just use xchat - the conversations app is very broken04:52
SpeedEvilFor IRC04:52
SpeedEvilI tried it once, and it diddn't basically work at all for channels for me.04:52
ponyofdeathwell i have irssi as well but it would be nice to get the conversations one04:52
SpeedEvilIt might have gotten better.04:52
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: is it possible to run irssi/bitlbee in a screen session?04:53
SpeedEvilSorry - not played with it04:53
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* SpeedEvil points at ponyofdeath.04:53
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jpinx-eeepciirc xchat is not too good04:53
luke-jrneither is irssi04:54
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jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: what's the deal between maemo and meego ?04:54
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: Maemo is dead. MeeGo is RPM.04:55
luke-jrthey both suck.04:55
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: not getting into an irc-client war, but I've been using irssi with bitlbee for years without a hiccup04:55
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SpeedEvilMeego is an intel/nokia collaboration to make a etter platform.04:55
SpeedEvilIt's not officially coming to the n90004:55
ponyofdeathjpinx-eeepc: whats bitlbee?04:55
SpeedEvilluke-jr: yeah - well - that's what they're saying04:55
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jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: is it open source - apart from the nokia drivers I suppose?04:56
infobotit has been said that closed is
SpeedEvilsee that04:56
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: drivers are all that matter04:56
jpinx-eeepcponyofdeath: see - it's a way to connect any messenger to an irc client04:56
SpeedEvilDrivers are all that matters - if you're willing to reinvent the whole software stack.04:56
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: have you written any drivers for nokia hardware?04:57
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: sure04:57
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luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: more like ported, actually04:57
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: the closed ones cannot be replaced, however04:58
jpinx-eeepcit would be good to get an open-scource OS onto the n90004:58
luke-jrsince Nokia/etc refuse to release the specs needed to write them04:58
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: probably will never happen04:58
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: :(04:58
SpeedEvil ...04:58
luke-jreven if Nokia stopped being a jerk, there's still the PowerVR company04:58
ponyofdeathjpinx-eeepc: thx04:58
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jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: fairysnuff - I'm only starting to get to know the setup between nokia and it's hardware supplies and driver writers...04:59
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: I'm trying to get Linux to run on N81005:00
jpinx-eeepcas you can see I'm on an eeepc (with debian) and want to get more portable05:00
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jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: one requirement for me is a reasonable camera so I don't have to carry 2 bits of kit. I'd love to get a N86 8Mb, but it runs symbian05:02
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: I'm still looking for a device that meets my requirements05:02
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luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: I want basically an updated Sharp Zaurus SL-C76005:02
* jpinx-eeepc googles05:03
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: that's the same size as my eeepc05:04
luke-jrit is?05:04
luke-jrC760 fits comfortably in my pocket05:04
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* jpinx-eeepc looks again...05:05
SpeedEvilThe camera on the n900 isn't bad for a phone camera.05:06
lucentit's farking great05:06
SpeedEvilIt's around 2-3MP in reality.05:06
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luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: the side card slot is CompactFlash, not PCMCIA/CardBus/etc05:06
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lucentugh CompactFail05:07
lucentI had the wifi CF card and all that05:08
luke-jrI concur, my 802.11b CF is broken I think05:08
SpeedEvillucent: Being able to take a pic, and flickr it in a couple of clicks is nice.05:08
luke-jrbut for $20, not too bad05:08
* SpeedEvil needs to work out what these flowers are.05:08
SpeedEvilThat's a quite acceptable shot that stands up well at 1024x768 even.05:09
SpeedEvilAnd I basically took that off-hand.05:09
luke-jr1024x768 is crap for photos05:09
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: cool device...05:10
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luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: yeah, for 2003 :p05:10
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luke-jr64 MB RAM, 128 or 256 MB storage, no builtin wifi, etc05:10
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: I have a digicam that is almost permanently set for 1Mb filesize and I get excellent photos05:11
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: I'd like one with 512+ MB RAM, some GB of internal storage, builtin 802.11n and 3G/4G, etc :)05:11
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: I see what you mean about needing it updated..05:11
SpeedEviljpinx-eeepc: even a 2MP camera that can do 3* optical zoom - say05:12
lucentluke-jr: so, you want an iPhone 405:12
luke-jrlucent: no, iPhone sucks05:12
lucentit's fantastic05:12
luke-jrthe only thing worse than a bad keyboard is no keyboard05:12
luke-jrcuriously, Nokia made a N810 with 4G support, but N900 only has 3G ;p05:12
jpinx-eeepcdoes a n900 accept and external keyboard?05:12
lucentluke-jr: you're referring to WiMax?05:13
luke-jrlucent: yeah05:13
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: Bluetooth05:13
lucentI live in one of the only places nationally (USA) that you can get a WiMax service plan05:13
luke-jrlucent: one of many, now that Sprint and various others are deploying it05:13
lucentit's the most awful deployment of a technology I've ever seen05:13
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: cool that'll make life easier - what about an external monitor?05:13
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: don't think so05:14
SpeedEviljpinx-eeepc: Not officially.05:14
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: honestly, N900 is too small among many other issues I have with it05:14
lucentslow... not mobile, you can't just walk around with it05:14
SpeedEvilWith USB host, it may be possible to use displaylink adaptors05:14
jpinx-eeepcI plug my eeepc into external kbd and screen and it acts as a desktop05:14
lucentcosts $50/mo more than comparable other plans05:14
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jpinx-eeepcit'd be cool to get the n900 to do the same05:15
luke-jrI'd also like one of those new Snapdragons :p05:15
luke-jrthe 1.5 GHz dual core would work well05:15
lucentjpinx-eeepc: might happen when N900 Host USB mode gets filled out more05:15
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: too small as in kbd/screen?05:15
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: yes05:15
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: I have been holding off the n900 because of big hands/bad eyesight too ;)05:16
SpeedEvilI am divided about the size.05:16
jpinx-eeepcbut an external kbd will help a lot05:16
luke-jrN810 is too small IMO05:16
luke-jrlet alone N90005:16
SpeedEvilThe screen covering more of the bezel is a no-brainer05:16
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SpeedEvilHowever - that buys you maybe 900*480 at best05:17
jpinx-eeepcand if the usbhost-thingy project gets working it'll be very good05:17
luke-jrI wonder if IS01 specs are more announced...05:17
SpeedEvilFor me - the size is just about right.05:17
lucentjpinx-eeepc: If you get a N900, I'm going to guess you'd use the stylus often05:18
jpinx-eeepclucent: or a sharp stick ;)05:18
lucentPRO-TIP, don't use the built-in stylus, it's too expensive to replace05:18
luke-jrlucent: if you don't use it, it doesn't matter what the replacement cost is...05:19
SpeedEvilI have actually got a sharp stick that I use as a stylus.05:19
SpeedEvilI mislaid the old one, so I whittled a new one.05:19
jpinx-eeepcI'm sure a toothpick will suffice05:19
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lucentSpeedEvil: was that yours out of a chopstick on the forums?05:19
lucentit was gold, whoever that was05:19
SpeedEvilI used some wood from a japanese maple.05:19
* lucent ^_^05:19
lucentI actually did misplace my original and ordered a set of 3 replacements, 25euro shipped to the US05:20
jpinx-eeepcSpeedEvil: Arty-crafty ec0-friendly stylus - nice :)05:20
SpeedEvil - this one specifically.05:20
lucentugh, Flickr requires login05:21
lucentI tried, too bad, not going to05:21
SpeedEvillucent: retry - I made it public05:21
luke-jrIS01 is a mere 256 MB RAM05:21
lucentI've missed an hour of "Avatar", I could bicycle to the theater, there's still another 2 hours of it05:25
TermanaHmm 6 minute oral presentation on an important issue05:26
TermanaFree software anyone?05:26
SpeedEvilTermana: To who?05:26
TermanaSpeedEvil, English teacher05:26
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TermanaShe might be bored to death if i make it about free software though, so I don't think thats a great topic to do05:27
SpeedEvilI suggest - updated as related to life in the inner city.05:27
SpeedEvilSignificant changes were observed in foxes in as little as 20 generations.05:28
SpeedEvilHumans have been living in cities for well over 500 years.05:28
SpeedEvilThis is plenty of time for some evoluion of resident populations to occur.05:28
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TermanaSpeedEvil, but whats the issue. There has to be a central issue that has to be talked about in the oral. Some example we've been given: Euthanasia, Gambling, Alcohol, Homelessness, Gun control, Enviroment, "the drug debate", Consumer rights, Sexuality05:39
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TermanaFox evolution doesn't seem like an issue... :P05:39
SpeedEvilAs we're practicing it05:40
SpeedEvilWe are selecting for certain behaviours - especially in some inner cities with low generation times.05:40
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: the kbd on that sharp looks almost useable...05:41
lucentSpeedEvil: fatness, laziness, absurd wealth, willingness of wives to accept surgical implants05:41
luke-jrjpinx-eeepc: the C760's sure was05:41
lucentoh again don't mind me I'm a Yank05:41
jpinx-eeepcluke-jr: I going to see about a n900 and a bluetooth kbd - there is no way I can cope with that little slide out jobbie05:42
SpeedEvilI'm surprised. I'm up to around 30wpm on it05:43
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lucentwas 2 week period of awkwardness05:43
jpinx-eeepcyou haven't seen my hands ;)05:43
jpinx-eeepceven the eeepc kbd is a challenge05:44
lucentworst thing is trying to type in dollar amounts with US notation $N,NNN,NNN.NN05:44
Termanaluke-jr, The C760 just looks like almost a netbook size. Why not just get a netbook05:44
luke-jrTermana: cuz netbooks don't fit in my pocket05:44
jpinx-eeepcTermana: it's a lot smaller05:44
lucentmakes me crazy05:44
SpeedEvilwell - with 1.2 - that can be just hold-keys05:45
lucenthold keys makes me crazy on the terminal05:45
Termanajpinx-eeepc, luke-jr - hmm, maybe the picture just makes it look big05:45
SpeedEvillucent: I would love to trim the hold time to around 2/3 of what it is05:45
SpeedEvilmaybe 1/205:45
lucentit just seems as though my N900 is aiming for my institutionalization in a psychiatric ward05:46
jpinx-eeepcTermana: it does - look here -
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* ENTERANICK [W2I=000:u:0:000:]06:16
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ENTERANICK482 users idling huh06:20
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DocScrutinizer51SpeedEvil: hold_keys? omg. that takes even longer than the Fn dance06:33
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DocScrutinizer51is the keyboard driver OSS?06:34
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sx0n|homedifficult to believe that ^06:39
sx0n|home..but, why not.06:39
luke-jrSnapdragon easily beats anything TI has06:40
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sx0n|homeluke-jr: they said it in the article, there has been law issues.06:41
sx0n|homeluke-jr: ti's multicore arm is not bad either.06:41
luke-jryou mean the one that doesn't exist?06:42
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sx0n|homei have read about it at least06:43
GeneralAntillesluke-jr, mind citing that? :)06:45
GeneralAntillesSnapdragon has less cache and fewer integrated pieces.06:45
GeneralAntillesSo that claim is pretty much bunk.06:46
GeneralAntillesThey're basically on par.06:46
luke-jrfewer integrated pieces? like GSM, 802.11, GPS, etc? :p06:46
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luke-jranyhow, I haven't seen any real TI offering to compete with 1.5 GHz x206:47
GeneralAntillesLike DSP and GPU06:47
GeneralAntillesEr, yeah.06:47
GeneralAntillesBecause that's actually shipping in something.06:47
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DocScrutinizer51fsck MHz. Use decent performance tests06:52
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GeneralAntillesHooray Google Alerts06:55
GeneralAntillesI get to see weird people use me to justify weird positions on -users.06:55
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dr34msomebody got a working fish encryption module for xchat for maemo already ?07:55
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Stskeepsmorn tekojo08:25
DocScrutinizer51Shapeshifter: delete event fails in alarmed08:25
DocScrutinizer51Shapeshifter: sorting of menus is weird - like "second, day, hour, week"08:26
DocScrutinizer51presets are great08:27
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DocScrutinizer51a funny idea I had for command to execute: completion based on ~/*sh.history08:30
DocScrutinizer51note to self: check if xterm can force shell to save history on focus-lost08:32
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LiraNunaoooh, mBarcode works nicely08:36
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LiraNunatoo bad it starts the camera+flash even if the door is closed :|08:37
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LiraNunaand it still opens the camera app if i open it while it's on08:39
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DocScrutinizer51camera-gui is greedy, nasty, and a general PITA.08:41
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pigeondoes anyone know where i can find the list of tweaks with the n900 screen rotation, like speed and smoothness stuff like that?09:30
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mikki-kunpigeon: do you mean transition control?09:37
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pigeoni'm not sure to be honest, i just remember reading a page about things you can tweak, and those numbers are in gconf somewhere09:41
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nextimequestion: in your opinion, will maemo in any way ( a fork? ) developed anyway in the future even with the event of meego adopted as primary platform from nokia?09:44
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Stskeepsnextime: community SSU, maybe, but forking a closed source OS is difficult09:45
nextimeStskeeps : closed? which things are closed in maemo?09:46
nextimei need to rtfm something more about it... anyway, i'm sad about the lose of the "debian based" thing on meego09:47
Stskeepsmeh, spend some time with the rpm tools and packaging and it's actually nicer09:47
nextimeStskeeps : yes, but as a long time debian user ( from when debian exists ) on all my pc/servers09:47
nextimei prefer to have a debian based system even on my phone :)09:48
nextimeStskeeps : consider that the "debian based" os is the primary reason on my choice for nokia n900...09:48
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JaffaMorning, all10:19
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meceJaffa, morning.10:25
meceAnyone want to test my modified libhildonfm2?10:25
Dassuwhat type of media player plugin does  Mobile firefox have?10:25
Appiahmece: modified for what10:26
DassuI see it most likely has none :/10:27
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DassuDefinitately need for a gecko mediaplayer is great10:27
meceAppiah, to show filename extensions10:28
Appiahbut I'd bet thats for PR1.210:29
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Appiah(still not updated)10:29
meceAppiah, well, you need some updated hildon libs for it to run, so I guess so.10:29
meceAppiah, so update.10:29
redwhy cant i delete all the connections10:29
mecered, internet connections?10:30
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redi mean, ihave connection A set as default, yet it always connects to B which doesnt work10:30
Appiahmece: not yet :)10:30
redboth have the delete option grayed out10:30
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mecered, fAPN problem?10:31
redi think the other one came when i tried the fmms app (its called MMS)10:31
mecered, uninstall fAPN10:31
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redfmms isnt installed and cant see fapn in the list10:31
redill see what apt-get says10:32
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mecered, perhaps fapn is included in fmms these days? I forget how it works. Havent used it lately.10:32
redfapn not installed10:33
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redwonder in where the connections are stored if i could delete it manually10:33
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mecered, well first remove fmms.10:50
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MiXu-You can remove the non working APNs using gconf-tool210:53
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solrize   new nokia phone roadmap?10:56
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mecefrals, ping11:04
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crashanddiesolrize: old news11:11
solrizeis there any more info11:11
crashanddieit's a rumour11:12
solrizewell ok, that presentation seems to be new though11:12
solrizenot that it says anything interesting11:12
crashanddiewell, for all we know, it could be an economy bachelor's end-of-studies project11:13
crashanddiecertainly looks like it11:13
crashanddieNo Nokia branding, no copyright notice11:13
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solrize  more of the same11:14
TermanaYou would be deeply wrong to think that it says nothing.11:14
TermanaIf you actually look11:14
TermanaIt shows, Nokia is building an unstable house11:14
crashanddieTermana: what's even worse, they know there's problems with it. "Faible" is french for "weak"11:15
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crashanddiealso, there's no way that chimney is going to stay put11:15
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LiraNunawhat's Harmattan? "PR2.0" or MeeGo?11:18
DuckbootLiraNuna: Maemo 611:18
LiraNunaI thought there will be no Maemo 611:18
DuckbootLiraNuna: Correct11:19
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* LiraNuna confused11:19
meceLiraLuna, harmattan is Maemo 6. It's called MeeGo for some reason, eventhough it's not really meego.11:19
DuckbootHarmattan was planned before the Nokia-Intel marriage11:19
LiraNunabut there's no MeeGo support for N90011:19
LiraNunadoes it mean a new device?11:19
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DuckbootLiraNuna: Nokia N9 presumably11:20
TermanaLiraNuna, There IS MeeGo support for N90011:20
MohammadAG51MeeGo = full open source shit11:20
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MohammadAG51Maemo 6 = closed shit11:20
TermanaBut yes, there is a new device11:20
LiraNunanon official*11:20
DuckbootNo commercial support for N90011:20
MohammadAG51so basically...11:20
Termanaand Maemo 6 is not really MeeGo underneath11:20
MohammadAG51MeeGo is kind of like the android we have11:20
* LiraNuna is even more confused now11:20
MohammadAG51(except it's working)11:20
meceMohammadAG51, except it's proper linux, afaict.11:21
TermanaDuckboot, no commercial support as in, you can't call them up. They are providing people to work on it.11:21
MohammadAG51Maemo 6 would be like Android on google devices (app store etc..)11:21
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LiraNunaoh, THAT what "commercial support" means?11:21
DuckbootTermana: Mmmm - Think so.11:21
MohammadAG51mece, yes, I was using android as a reference11:21
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MohammadAG51hopefully ovi will be closed shit and we won't have it11:22
MohammadAG51anyways, i'm sticking to M511:22
TermanaMore like, know so. The whole N900 MeeGo team is Nokia employees/contractors11:22
TermanaTheres like 10 of them11:22
LiraNunaMohammadAG51, M5?11:22
TermanaLiraNuna, Maemo 5...11:22
MohammadAG51Maemo 5, wasn't it obvious?11:22
meceLiraLuna, read that. It's an excellent thread if you ignore the whine.11:23
LiraNunawell, there was N9, N8, etc11:23
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LiraNunaso MeeGo is going to be 'more open' than Maemo5?11:24
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Scelt_MohammadAG51: have you something to do with usb on-the-go?11:24
TermanaAlso, Nokia are willing to license Maemo 6 for N900 if the community can get it working. So you will probably see Maemo 6 on N900 as well11:24
AppiahMaemo 6?huh11:24
meceJaffa, cheers for new hermes!11:24
MohammadAG51Scelt_, it's not OTG....11:25
MohammadAG51mece, new hermes? OMG11:25
Scelt_MohammadAG51: what then?11:25
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meceScelt_, usb host11:25
TermanaAppiah, Maemo 6 - Harmattan/MeeGo11:25
AppiahDidnt know Maemo 6 = MeeGo11:26
Sceltjust one day I thought about that kind of thing, to be able to attach a external hdd to my n90011:26
TermanaSeriously, this is troublesome. How is it not easy to understand the Harmattan naming situation11:26
MohammadAG51for an HDD you need external power11:26
TermanaAppiah, Maemo 6 != MeeGo. Only in branding.11:26
MohammadAG51unless it's an SSD11:26
meceI'd very much like to dual boot that though.11:26
TermanaDie in fire11:26
* Appiah dies11:27
SceltMohammadAG51: yeye, that's not a problem11:27
* MohammadAG51 sings Still Alive (portal)11:27
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meceok soo.. anyone with pr1.2 wanna test the modified libhildonfm2? I've only tested it on my own phone so far. Works for me. MohammadAG51? DocScrutinizer?11:30
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MohammadAG51why us?11:30
psycho_oreosprobably due to experience ;)11:30
MohammadAG51it's a conspiracy I tell ya11:30
meceMohammadAG51, because you want it?11:31
MohammadAG51mece, sure11:31
mmarc__what can we replace asm "int $3" on arm with?11:31
TermanaMohammadAG51, you have nothing better to do anyway, what are you complaining about? :P11:31
meceMohammadAG51, hold on, I'll put the deb somewhere.11:31
MohammadAG51Termana, I do have something better to do, but I'm not sure how to do it xP11:31
* psycho_oreos has pr1.2 running but the phone is busy repacking all the pre-installed deb files11:31
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MohammadAG51~curse closed source11:34
meceI should tell you that there is one annoying sideeffect with switching to the new filemanager. The stupid pr1.2 will come as an update again.11:34
infobotMay you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, closed source !11:34
MohammadAG51mece, raise the time stamp in the changelog11:35
meceMohammadAG51, hmm I don't think that's the problem. It is listed as newer than the one in pr1.2 anyway.11:36
meceMohammadAG51, if I were to make it the same version I'm sure that wouldn't happen, but that would be just wrong.11:36
MohammadAG51mece, don't change the version number11:36
MohammadAG51i think mp-fremantle-generic-pr depends on it11:37
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meceMohammadAG51, it does, but I wanted to point out that it's different. Oh well. I'll make another later. wanna try this one? you can undo it by installing the original from anyway11:38
MohammadAG51or just apt-get install it :)11:39
MohammadAG51mece  libhildonfm2 (= 1:2.28.18+0m5)11:39
meceMohammadAG51, it wasn't in my repos11:39
MohammadAG51I know, I was referring to the original one11:39
meceMohammadAG51, for some reason I couldn't install it with apt.11:39
meceMohammadAG51, anyway here:
mecemy build environment is a bit sketchy, so if it bombs, it's probly due to that and not the modifications.11:41
mecesince they were tiny and simple.11:41
meceyou'll need to restart something or reboot too..11:43
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chem|stTermana: "only in branding"? Maemo6 !=MeeGo in packaging as well11:44
mecechem|st, Termana meant  that Maemo6 == MeeGo only in branding.11:45
chem|stah that way around...11:45
chem|stguess its not only branding11:45
chem|stmece: what was libhildonfm2 for?11:45
mecechem|st, file manager and file picker/chooser11:45
chem|stand your patch does what?11:46
mecechem|st, modded to show filename extensions.11:46
mecechem|st, :) yes, I'm quite happy with it. I'm wondering what other mods would be nice.11:46
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meceMaking the descriptive bit under the filename a smaller font perhaps.11:47
chem|steverytime I finish a Qt gui someoneelse has the full blown program uploaded to garage, quiet disappointing11:47
chem|stI should go to maintain libs!11:47
mecechem|st, lol11:47
mecechem|st, like what?11:47
chem|stfourier transformation I found handy ;)11:47
mecehow can I see the depends of a deb? particularly mp-fremantle-generic-pr?11:48
chem|stor go back to the roots and try some hardware abstraction11:48
chem|stapt-cache show mp....11:48
chem|stbut dpkg can list that aswell11:49
mecechem|st, but how do I see the control file?11:49
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mece(should be huge)11:49
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mecechem|st, if I ever needed to do fourier transfers, and app would be nice :D Luckily I've already done the maths courses and will not touch that again.11:51
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hrwyay! garnetVM for n90011:51
meceMohammadAG51, did it work or is your phone now a smoking crater?11:53
MohammadAG51it just imploded11:54
Maceryeah.. conservative vs. ondemand showed me that ondemand is better11:54
MohammadAG51do I have to reboot? I don't see a difference11:54
meceMohammadAG51, or restart some hildon stuff. reboot is what I did.11:54
Macerconservative makes the n900 2x slower and doesnt really save any battery life11:54
chem|stmece: I need it for signal handling but the program isnt compiling atm11:55
Macerfor the power governor11:55
MohammadAG51mece, change the version number to the original one, pleeease :P11:55
meceMohammadAG51, so it works?11:56
Macerdoes the enhanced kernel have nfs?11:57
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Maceror sshfs? :)11:57
Tachikomabtw. what is the deal with this smartarray stuff. IT worked fine befoe PR1.2 and does not work anymore for me now. I know it's not supposed to work but i wondered if there are hints what one could try. It nearly doubled my runtime ...11:57
meceso.. anyone? how do I see a list of depends from a package?11:58
TachikomaMacer: nfs was already shipped with the device, so I'd assume that it is in the power kernel as well11:58
Ikarus[N900]hrm, when I try to get DUN working, I get unable to open host for /dev/rfcomm011:58
meceMohammadAG51, was hoping to make it work somehow with a better version number, or whatnot.11:58
Ikarus[N900]obex works fine though11:58
MohammadAG51mece change mp-fremantle then :P11:58
TachikomaMacer: yes, it comes with nfs11:58
MohammadAG51or make it a separate package that installs somewhere else11:59
Ikarus[N900]erm I get host is down that is for /dev/rfcomm011:59
meceMohammadAG51, I could just rename the package. dpkg won't know what hit it!11:59
TachikomaMacer: for sshfs afaik you need no support on the kernel level at all, just a working ssh server11:59
infobotmece meant: MohammadAG51, I could just rename the package. HAM won't know what hit it!11:59
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meceI mean it would still overwrite the lib file like we want12:00
meceI'll try that.12:00
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MacerTachikoma: ive never tried it12:01
Macerit would be nie to use12:01
Macerusing sftp kind of sucks.. i would love to stream vs. xfer files12:01
hrwStskeeps: basically it is n810 version but with proper portrait direction12:01
meceStskeeps, is that an official release?12:01
Stskeepswhat is?12:02
Maceronly problem with nfs tho is that you are stuck with "user"12:02
mecethe website looks so shiny..12:02
meceStskeeps, garnet12:02
Macermaemo needs logins with uid/gid stuff :)12:02
Stskeepsmece: no cluie12:02
Macermece: just run n900 meego12:04
* Macer hides12:04
meceMacer, I don't really want to run Garnet. I was just curious.12:04
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hrwmece: I am using garnet only for Metro ;d12:05
mecehrw, what's metro?12:06
chem|sthrw: is it up-side-down for you?12:07
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chem|stStskeeps: you are a nokia right?12:08
Stskeepsno, i'm not a nokian12:08
chem|stnokian I mean12:08
chem|stI need s/o to slap some other for me...12:08
hrwchem|st: n900 version has proper portrait. n810 was up-down12:08
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chem|sthrw: I have the n900 version and the bottom is at the usb connector side!12:09
hrwchem|st: here it is fine12:10
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RST38hmoo all12:10
ShapeshifterDocScrutinizer51: do you have 0.2.0-1 or -2 ?12:11
MohammadAG51mece, it worked12:11
MohammadAG51and crashed X somehow12:11
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TigerTaelUmm, can anyone tell me where chromium went?12:12
meceMohammadAG51, crashed?12:13
Stskeepssomeone sent a cease and desist letter, afaik12:13
MohammadAG51mece, yeah, I'll blame you for the time being12:13
MohammadAG51till I found out what actually caused it12:13
meceMohammadAG51, I got a crash the first time I ran it, and nothing after that.12:13
MohammadAG51Stskeeps, for what? chromium?12:14
meceMohammadAG51, I opened filemanager, scrolled down really fast, and then it rebooted.12:14
RST38hMohammad: Yes12:14
MohammadAG51RST38h, why12:14
RST38hMohammad: There is some patent troll on the lose, trying to make money on Chrome12:14
meceMohammadAG51, if you find the cause, let me know.12:14
MohammadAG51mece, kind of did the same, but it didn't reboot now12:14
MohammadAG51err, -now12:14
MohammadAG51i had to reboot manually12:14
TigerTaelStskeeps, oh...12:14
MohammadAG51RST38h, it's open source12:15
MohammadAG51well, chromium is12:15
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meceMohammadAG51, my actual mod is so small that I don't think it is the problem. Might be some bugs in the build though. It sorta felt like it was indexing or whatnot and I stressed it.12:15
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meceto change the name of a package, is it enough to modify the control file?12:16
MohammadAG51mece, now can you please change the number12:16
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MohammadAG51lol no12:16
MohammadAG51well yes, but you'll have to adjust debian/rules12:17
meceok. will check that.12:17
MohammadAG51unless it's packaged well12:17
meceMohammadAG51, well it's packaged by nokia...12:17
meceI guess.12:18
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Jaffamece: A couple of minor bugs to fix - testing today appreciated12:20
meceI've got dh_makeshlibs -plibhildonfm2 -V"libhildonfm2 (>= 1:2.28+0m5)"12:21
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RST38hMohammad: This does not prevent patent trolls from attacking it12:22
meceI get some "compatibility levels before 4 are deprecated"12:24
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mmarc__How to run apt-get from the arm freemantle scratchbox? It required CPU transparecny mode to be set. Not clear what does it mean. Should I run apt-get from qemu-arm? And if so, how to find the corresponding apt-get app from the outside of the fakeroot? Its /usr/ folder seems to be symlinking elsewhere...12:30
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mecemmarc__, apt-get works fine in arm...12:31
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mecemmarc__, just switch to target arm and apt-get all you want.12:31
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mmarc__mece, I've switched or what do you mean?12:33
mecemmarc__, what is the problem exactly?12:34
mmarc__Could you please help me to understand: in FREMANTLE ARM root on 32-bit host the gcc acts as a cross-compiler to arm, correct? Then how apt-get works? Logically, it should be also x86-compiled to get it working.12:35
mecemmarc__, no idea. it just works.12:35
mmarc__Basically, I need to install some development libs on ARM root, but apt-get says "/scratchbox/tools/bin/misc_runner: SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD not set"12:36
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mecemmarc__, never had that issue.12:36
mmarc__It also just works for me under i486 root12:36
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mecemmarc__, so your prompt looks like "[sbox-FREMANTLE_ARM: ~] > " and you type "apt-get install <whatever>" and you get that error?12:37
mmarc__yeah, exactly!12:38
mecehow curious.12:38
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mecemmarc__, here's something:
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meceMohammadAG51, so did it crash again or is it working now?12:42
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mmarc__mece, thanks, the difference with other users' experiences is that sb-menu CPU transparency menu has only "none" option12:44
Massimiliano< Un SaLuTo a TuTto il chan #maemo >12:44
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mmarc__on irc log there is also scratchbox-devkit-cputrans package mentioned12:45
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DuckbootGarnetVM is AWESOME.12:46
chem|stand up side down12:46
solrizethat's to run old palm apps?  who wants to do that?12:47
haltdef_yea that takes me back a bit :P12:47
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Duckbootsolrize: For the sheer joy of beeing back in PalmOS days12:48
solrizeanyone know how fast the n900 bluetooth is?12:49
mmarc__guys, could you please state what options do you have in sb-menu cpu transparency option that is deeper in setup menu? I really wonder why I have none.12:49
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solrizeoh hah, it looks like high speed bluetooth actually moves the data by wifi ;)12:51
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RST38hAnyone knows if there is a bug report for the annoying phone app glitch?12:57
RST38hWhen it shows up and then does acribatics for a few seconds?12:57
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MohammadAG51mece, N900's still working12:59
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Tachikomadid i already mention how awesome the n900 is? :)13:00
Tachikomamh, vllt pass east india trading company ja besser als piraten :)13:01
fluxis there a way to make the maemo backup activate itself periodically?13:01
fluxwhile I'm using backuppc now, the official backup might be easier to restore should the software side die again some day..13:01
Tachikomai just got an sms from nokia telling me there is an update for my n900 and i should enter some URL on my PC13:03
Tachikomano, the url is valid and says the same13:07
Jaffamece: Hermes 0.8.0 should be in Extras-devel. Testing welcome; but take a backup of your contacts Just In Case[TM] ;-)13:07
kpelgot the sms too13:08
kpelit doesn't make sense. why do i have to use a pc to update an internet enabled device running linux?13:09 is the url btw13:09
Tachikomatotally generic13:09
Tachikomajust checking with apt13:09
kpelthis is getting too much like apple and itunes13:10
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Tachikomawith the difference that with apple and itunes this stuff actually works ;)13:10
kpeleverything has to happen through an application controlled by the vendor.13:10
Tachikomai mean, i get an sms with an generic url asking me to select my phone. From apple i'd expect some url fitting my device13:11
kpeltachikoma: correct13:11
Tachikomai guess this might be ovi store related :)13:11
Tachikomaat least that would be the only thing I'd understand them to actively notify people as i would not go there anymore wuithout a heads up that it finally is ready13:12
Tachikomabut the I'd expect at least a little hint what this update is about ...13:12
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kpelovi in general gave me more grief and downtime in a year than yahoo gave me in ten years.13:12
Tachikomaok, no updates available via apt, guess this sms is total bogus13:13
Tachikomaas the webpage states one could install the update using the app installer as well13:13
Tachikomai personally don;t care about ovi anymore, i do not believe this will ever fly for  maemo5. For meego/maemo6 maybe but i don;t belive that this is even of big interest for nokia with maemo5 ...13:15
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Jaffadneary: ping13:20
dnearyJaffa, pong13:20
dnearyJaffa, What can I do you for?13:20
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Jaffadneary: Example of the problems programmers face finding API docs. I want to set an input field (HildonEntry) to be numeric only. This probably involves setting the hildon-input-mode property to some flags (I've done it elsewhere, but not with numbers). So I google for one of the fixed values: HILDON_GTK_INPUT_MODE_FULL - and the only definitive Maemo reference manual entry is to diablo at position #3 :-(13:21
TachikomaI have the suspicion  that this sms for a system update was only supposed for symbian users. the webpage talks about 'Go on your device into menu and select "programs->update".'13:22
Tachikomathat does not exist on my device...13:22
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dnearyJaffa, You googled for HILDON_GTK_INPUT_MODE_FULL directly?13:23
hrwheh... gtk stock icons got killed in pr1.213:23
dnearyNot "HildonEntry numeric input" or something?13:23
hrwbug 1035113:23
povbotBug Icons at bottom broken since PR1.213:23
Jaffadneary: yup -
dnearyJaffa, So do you think that we're not linking enough to specific API docs from code samples & the reference docs, or...?13:25
hrwwhen nokia will stop breaking 3rdparty apps with system updates?13:25
Jaffadneary: Dunno - I'd hoped that the Dev Center think would contain enough centralised resource that I wouldn't go to Google and its search would be definitive; but since Nokia have refused to include major third party APIs/platforms like Python, I don't use it.13:27
Duckboothrw: With an Open OS like Maemo you cannot hope to not break anything.13:27
hrwDuckboot: there should be some stability and migration plans13:28
Duckboothrw: All major players on Linux recognize that simple fact. That's why there exists a thing called Compability Matrix.13:29
Jaffadneary: Searching for HILDON_GTK_INPUT_MODE_FULL or "numeric entry" on are both useful. What about cloning it, making the header less intrusive and including Python/hilonmm etc :)13:29
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MohammadAG51hmm, I wonder if uploading a modified closed source package is allowed13:30
MohammadAG51oh well, already uploaded13:30
chem|stMohammadAG51: as long as its free to distribute...13:31
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MohammadAG51chem|st, well, yeah, but the package is borked (overwrites a file from another package)13:31
zaheermoffice live 2010 editing works nicely on n900
Duckboothrw: For example, if you come to Oracle with an contaminated system with loads of 3rd party libs, they just wave you goodbye.13:32
MohammadAG51so I removed the file and edited the control file, then repackaged it13:32
Duckboothrw: Or give you the Compability Matrix, and tell you to reinstall13:32
mmarc__Ok, I've found export SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD is just a shell symbol to set13:33
mmarc__And I set it to "export SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD=/scratchbox/devkits/qemu/bin/qemu-arm-sb"13:33
mmarc__Now apt-get in working, but just partially, it now won't do apt-get update13:33
mmarc__E: Method http has died unexpectedly!13:34
MohammadAG51dude, reinstall scratchbox13:34
MohammadAG51and the whole sdk13:34
MohammadAG51you shouldn't be getting all that sh*t13:34
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mmarc__well, I did nothing stange :) just used pythin installer...13:34
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marcusHeya guys, I could use a little guidance regarding creating .debs for the maemo platform13:38
marcusI have a little game created using SDL and SDL_image13:38
marcusShould I put anything specific in, on CONFIG?13:38
marcusCONFIG      -= qt13:38
marcusCONFIG      += debug13:38
marcusinstead of that.13:38
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marcusOn the GTK_Example on the MADDE website, they put link_pkgconfig, because it is a python+GTK example.13:39
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dnearyJaffa, Here's your problem:
dnearyJaffa, It seems like there's no sitemap for Google to trawl & index pages in lmnc13:41
Jaffadneary: Indeed. No results for "numeric entry" at *all*13:41
dnearyOpening a bug13:41
Jaffadneary: Thanks13:41
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dnearyJaffa, It's not straightforward to get direct links to help pages either13:55
dnearyI had to dig around to get
meceuff. that was an epic lunch.13:57
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Saviqhi all, any idea if it's possible to send SMS from a script / console / python on the N900?14:02
meceSaviq, yes.14:02
Saviqmece: can you point me to some docs?14:02
MohammadAG51vertsms source14:02
Saviqcool thanks14:02
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meceyes, I channeled my thoughts through MohammadAG51's keyboard :D14:03
meceMohammadAG51, testing a renamed package for libhildonfm2 now. Let's see if the update bug doesn't annoy.14:05
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marcusMohammedAG51: Do you know anything about this problem I have14:09
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SpeedEvilYou're accessing
SpeedEvilI'm not sure that's curable.14:11
marcusAm I doomed then?14:11
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SpeedEvilThe libs+= line looks a likely cndidate14:12
Stskeepsmarcus: MADDE isn't good for SDL, i think14:12
Stskeepsi might be wrong though14:12
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marcusSpeedEvil: I thought so as well, but the output got errors, and it looked like it tried to find the libraries _inside_ the folders of the deb pkg.14:13
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marcusOooh, pretty. I think it managed out fine.14:17
marcusJust needed the - in front of lSDL & lSDL_image14:17
marcusSo I guess I just put the .deb file onto my n900, and install it?14:18
marcusAnyone mind giving me the command again? :)14:18
SpeedEvildpkg -i foo.deb?14:18
marcusI need root, aye?14:19
nidOdpkg -i or just open it in file manager and ham should install it14:19
marcusHaven't used dpkg much, using Arch here.14:19
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crashanddiedpkg won't install dependencies14:21
hrwJaffa: hermes is your app - right?14:21
crashanddieit is14:21
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Saviqmece: VertSMS doesn't seem to work for me - it does put the sms into the rtcomm database, but no sms came through :/14:21
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marcusa question though: the binary is then located in /usr/bin/foo, what about img files then? Where should they be located?14:22
marcusCurrently, it should be reading them from the place the binary is, but that is just stupid to put them in /usr/bin .314:23
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hrwbug 8369 got update14:25
povbotBug "Something went wrong" error when browser switchboard is installed14:25
hrwError org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name was not provided by any .service files14:26
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TigerTaelHow the hell did I get a game installed on my N900 called 'them bloody ducks'?14:36
TigerTaelAll I did was uninstall opera mobile14:36
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StskeepsTigerTael: i think TomaszD ran into that too, that it installed an random app when uninstalling one or something14:38
lcukmornin Stskeeps croppa14:39
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lcukcroppa, sorry, was aiming for crashanddie14:39
BCMMcan the14:39
BCMMemail client display source and headers?14:40
TigerTaelStskeeps, yeah, I was trying to uninstall it and I saw that it said downloading about 500kb's...14:40
TigerTaelI was like, downloading?14:40
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meceMohammadAG51, damn that dpkg is a wimp.14:44
meceMohammadAG51, didn't even want to overwrite a file, just because it was also in another package.14:44
meceMohammadAG51, --force-overwrite did the trick though.14:45
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meceabout the crash, I wonder if it's something cached that is incompatible with the new version of that needs to recache before you launch the app.14:46
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mmarc__I need libgl-dev, that is removed from 5 sdk final. is there an alternative place to get it or could you please share, if you have it?14:50
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meceI remember there being some log of what happened when a device crash. Where is that thing?14:52
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flailingmonkeythere is "boot_reason" but there could also be more logs that are created14:52
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* noobmonk3y wohooooooooooooo's14:56
SpeedEviloopses are stored on a seperate partition14:57
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meceflailingmonkey, where is boot_reason then?14:57
SpeedEvil /proc14:57
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mecehahha pwr_key14:58
meceok so.. renamed the package so it no longer messes with firmware stuff.14:59
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meceHowever, I don't think this would ever be installable through ham for example, since it overwrites a file that belongs to another package.15:00
noobmonk3ymece: ?15:00
noobmonk3yHealthcheck is the most popular utility software on Maemo5 :) - yay15:00
mecethe modified file manager chooser picker thingamabob15:00
mecenoobmonk3y, LIES! I don't have it, so it can't be the most popular!15:01
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* noobmonk3y slaps mece around a bit with healthcheck15:01
nidOI do have it, so it must be15:01
nidOcant say I use it though!15:01
* noobmonk3y agrees with nidO 15:01
noobmonk3ynidO:  lol ;)15:01
kaiewill flashing the n810 securely erase all previous bits stored in /home/user ?15:01
cehtehnoobmonk3y: lol .. yeah we all use it daily :P15:01
noobmonk3yits an app that needs to be used after you've screwed up your n900 normally15:01
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nidOdamn I hate nationwide.15:02
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* lcuk smashes a frozen trout over noobmonk3y's head15:03
lcukoooops, i thought it had thawed15:03
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mmarc__how to become root in scratchbox?15:04
kwtmHello.  With what software can I transfer files from my laptop (running K/Ubuntu) onto my N900?  Am I stuck with "scp" or is there a better file manager?15:04
mmarc__or howto set ui to 0?15:04
mmarc__kwtm: nautilus?15:05
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mmarc__kwtm: the file manager15:05
mmarc__kwtm: or dolphin - default for KDE15:05
kwtmmmarc__: Are you referring to the file manager on Kubuntu on my laptop?  Or file manager on N900 (which I don't think is Nautilus)?15:06
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kwtmmmarc__: Yeah, right now I am on a hotel network where I can't SSH into my N900.  However, I can ssh FROM my N900 into a remote server (outside the hotel network).15:07
mmarc__I mean you could just plugin your n900 select USB storage mode on its screen, and then Ubuntu/Kubuntu will automatically notify you the storage device is added and you can then browse it with standard file manager15:07
kwtmmmarc__: Yes, that's what I did: plugged into USB and selected USB storage mode.  Something weird happened:15:07
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kwtmon my laptop, I see files and directories.  But these are not the same files and directories I see on my N900 on File Manager (or in the shell)!15:08
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mmarc__kwtm: yeah, it's normal15:08
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meceif anyone dares, you can try this now:
RST38hmece: What has been changed?15:08
meceyou need to install with dpkg -i --force-overwrite15:08
kwtmI suspect either the directories visible on my laptop are in a subdirectory on the N900, or (less likely) the directory structure on the N900 is contained in a subdirectory of what I see on the laptop.15:09
meceRST38h, just lists filename extensions15:09
meceto uninstall you need to dpkg -r and then install the original from here:
meceusing dpkg, not ham.15:09
kwtmmmarc__: I haven't been able to figure out how the two directory structures are related.15:09
mmarc__kwtm: but after you copy something on device and unplug it, you can then see your files with device file manager15:09
RST38hmece: Not enough to be worth testing it =)15:10
kwtmI tried creating a directory with a unique name on the laptop... couldn't find it.15:10
kwtmmmarc__: Oh, I have to unplug it first?  I already unmounted.  WIll try unplugging.15:10
meceRST38h :)15:10
RST38hmece: but if you shrink the time to scan large directories (100+ files) I will be the first in line to test it =)15:10
mmarc__kwtm: are you trying to find it _after_ unplugging your device ?15:10
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meceRST38h, heee.. perhaps I could. we'll see. I'm off.15:11
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mmarc__kwtm: from ssh view all files are placed to ~/MyDocs15:11
kwtmmmarc__: Okay, unplugged now.  So, for example, I put something in the /MountPointForN900/.documents directory (as seen from the laptop)... Ah, I see.  Will try ~/MyDocs15:12
kwtmAhhh.... I see, it's only after unplugging that the files show up... strange, but I guess I will get used to it.15:12
flailingmonkeysay mece, what if you15:12
mmarc__kwtm: yeah, just unplug, and it will appear15:13
SpeedEvilkwtm: It's basically (logically) unplugging a virtual disk from the desktop, and plugging it into the phone again15:13
flailingmonkeyhad a script which backed up the original filemanager on install and replaced it on uninstall15:13
SpeedEvilkwtm: Bad stuff happens if two boxes try to share disks15:13
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mmarc__SpeedEvil: not really. To my belief this way is due to n900 performs some kind of indexing15:14
kwtmSpeedEvil: Really?  I thought it would be like fish:// or smb:// where the N900 allows a controlled write to the disk.15:14
flailingmonkeymece, would that make it possible to package it up for extras?15:14
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mmarc__I.e. n900 has some media indexing daemons, that could be trashed if volume is shared15:14
flailingmonkeynope, it literally unmounts the fat32 filesystem and then exports it15:14
_abhishekhow to get glx.h on maemo15:15
SpeedEvilmmarc__: you'd be wrong15:15
kwtmmmarc__: Ahh... right, the indexing daemons.  That makes sense.15:15
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SpeedEvilmmarc__: Mydocs is a VFAT filesystem.15:15
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Appiahi think its called tracker?15:15
Appiahthe indexer15:15
SpeedEvilmmarc__: With any filesystem, if you mount it from two places at once - bad stuff happens.15:15
SpeedEvilmmarc__: It is exported not as a list of files - but as a block device.15:16
kwtmSpeedEvil: I also didn't realize that umounting was not enough, and that the n900 had to be unplugged.15:16
mmarc__not sure, how it called, but I have succesfully corrupted it once. Terrible idea, IMO.15:16
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mmarc__*Terrible mechanism.15:16
SpeedEvilmmarc__: So - if the PC does 'rm foo' - the n900 does not get 'rm foo', but 'write block 45,6996,28485.28895' with this data15:16
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SpeedEvilIt then has to remount the filesystem when the PC is finished with it15:16
mmarc__SpeedEvil: and what's about vfat flash card?15:17
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X-FadeJust type 'sync' and be done :)15:17
SpeedEvilsame idea15:17
kwtmThanks guys!15:17
X-FadeIt is just write back cache.15:17
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kwtmIt looks like the n900 comes with "PC Suite" software which can be installed on the PC.  Does this work on Linux?  If not, how do you import contacts from your existing contact list --does it support standard Vcard format?15:18
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mmarc__SpeedEvil: oh, yeah, sync makes sense in any case. But there are also additional things on n90015:18
SpeedEvilmmarc__: The tracker is _completely_ irrelevant to this.15:18
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SpeedEvilmmarc__: The reason it's unmounted is because you cannot have two computers sharing one block device, and both trying to access its filesystem at once.15:19
mmarc__kwtm: PC suite works only for Windows. IMO, that's terrible shit for kitchen women.15:19
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SpeedEvilmmarc__: Bad stuff - like massive filesystem corruption - happens regularly.15:19
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SpeedEvils/regularly/everytime one writes a file/15:19
infobotSpeedEvil meant: mmarc__: Bad stuff - like massive filesystem corruption - happens everytime one writes a file.15:19
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nextimekwtm : gammu/wammu should work on n90015:19
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mmarc__SpeedEvil: ok, got it, simply the restriction is the block volume cannot be shared between >1 active OSes.15:20
SpeedEvilmmarc__: Attempts to get round that are basically horribly complex hacks that will work at best sometimes.15:20
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dnearybergie, ping?15:20
nextimemmarc__ : you can share it IF the second only 1 os mount it in rw mode and others in read only15:20
mmarc___abhishek: I'm trying to figure out where to get those headers too right now.15:21
nextimebut you can expect strange things in the read only side15:21
nextimeif you write something on the rw side15:21
dnearybergie, There's some weirdish PHP caching going on with Mediawiki - I'm changing PHP files and nothing is changing.15:21
mmarc___abhishek: the problem is that some wise people removed libgl-dev from arm packages15:21
dnearyCan you explain to me how this stuff works? (stepping out for a minute, but later)?15:21
bergiedneary: you *may* have to restart the web server, depends on php bytecode cache config15:22
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_abhishekmmarc__: that's really bad well I just got something might help you
TigerTaelcalendar.exe exited with code -107374151115:22
dnearybergie, I don't think wiki users would like that15:22
dnearyJust for a php file edit?15:22
nextimedneary : isn't only web browser cache issue? have you tryed to just press f5 to reload?15:22
TigerTaelWhy do I always get this with the Qt Creator simulator? ;/15:22
dnearyAny way to invalidate the cache instead & force a reload?15:22
mmarc___abhishek: one way I see is to compile libgl-dev from sources for arm, but I need to know how to become su in scratchbox.15:22
bergiedepends what level the cache is on15:23
dnearynextime, Thanks for the suggestion, but no, it's not a web browser cache15:23
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bergiedneary: if it is PHP bytecode cache you indeed have to restart Apache15:23
dnearybergie, When I change message files, for example, the effects are instantaneous15:23
_abhishekmmarc__: well can you tell me where I will get libgl-dev source15:23
dnearyBut module fines don't change anything15:23
bergiedneary: but to be honest I don't know how the wiki is configured15:23
dnearyFunny thing is, changing LocalSettings did.15:23
dnearySo some of the PHP is cached, and some isn't15:24
mmarc___abhishek: apt-get source libgl-dev15:24
dnearyWhat configuration files are used to cache byte code?15:24
_abhishekon scratchbox ?15:24
dnearyI could just turn it off (and slow things down temporarily) while debugging15:24
_abhishekand about su I think you can try fakeroot15:24
_abhishekmmarc__: and about su I think you can try fakeroot15:24
mmarc___abhishek: yeah, do it under x86 scratchbox mode, and then switch onto arm mode, and compile from there. That's my idea.15:25
_abhishekmmarc__: hummm will check that thanks15:25
dnearyThis seems to be at fault: $nt = Title::makeTitleSafe( NS_USER, $target );15:25
kwtmThanks for your very essential help, guys.  The #n900 channel is dead, and I would be stuck without some of your guidance.  (TOok me 7 days to figure out that there was a user guide contained in my n900)15:26
SpeedEvilDeeply stupid that.15:26
SpeedEvilIt should be in _huge_letters_ on the front of the leaflet in the box15:26
* Duckboot didn't know that - User Guide - Bah.15:26
SpeedEvilAlso as a HUGE FLASHING LINK after the 'getting started' video15:27
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mmarc__I really HATE such corporate stupidness: WHY THE HELL nokia stuff removed libgl-dev? WHY THE HELL they make me do again the work that was previous done? Is it just to make me use GL|ES? Forcing is bad nature.15:27
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SpeedEvilHaving multiple libraries on the device that do the same stuff is bad practice.15:28
Jaffahrw: Yeah15:28
SpeedEvilHowever - this should be clearly signosted in adcance.15:28
mmarc__SpeedEvil: IMO, BS. For example, >4 MPI implementations coexist in different distros.15:29
* SpeedEvil tries to predict the top tmo thread.15:29
SpeedEvilchromium being pulled?15:29
SpeedEvilmmarc__: On a device with 256M of RAM, it's more important15:29
Stskeepsmmarc__: libgl-dev doesn't exist on a N900? :P15:29
Stskeepsie, the chip only supports GLES v1 and v215:29
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mmarc__Stskeeps: libgl-dev was removed from repos, while libgl ittself exists!15:30
Stskeepsin fact, you'd be hard pressed to find a ARM device that does full opengl15:30
Stskeepsmmarc__: libgl is only in use on the X86 side15:30
mmarc__Stskeeps: they both were there previously15:30
X-Fademmarc__: That doesn't make it right ;)15:30
X-Fademmarc__: on x86 you use your own graphics card's GL, on device your use SGX gles.15:31
mmarc__Stskeeps: [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/mesa-7.1~RC3-0maemo1] > apt-cache search libgl15:31
mmarc__libgl1 - GL library using AIGLX15:31
mmarc__Stskeeps: so, it's there, for arm15:31
Stskeepsthat's just mesa compiled for arm, which is software rendering15:31
mmarc__Stskeeps: true, and it's what I need!15:32
mmarc__I don't need ES at this point15:32
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Stskeepsthen install the lib yourself, it doesn't make sense out of the box / in a ssu repo15:32
mmarc__But some stupid assh**es removed mesa15:32
Stskeepsi would rather say it was sane, as who'd want to use sw rendering? :P15:33
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mmarc__Stskeeps: software rendering makes sense for testing. I'd likely see the working ported softwere FISRT, and then consider optimozattions. Isn't that the good way?15:33
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X-Fademmarc__: Testing on device?15:34
mmarc__X-Fade: yes15:34
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crashanddiewhy is everything so quiet today?15:42
E0xhello ppl15:42
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hrwJaffa: bug 8369 - can I help more?15:43
povbotBug "Something went wrong" error when browser switchboard is installed15:43
bergiedneary: the config should be in /etc/php/conf.d/apc.ini15:43
dnearyOK, thanks15:44
TigerTaelJust so I get this out there, the My Nokia button in settings just crashes....15:44
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SpeedEvilTigerTael: Crashes, in what manner?15:45
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TigerTaelHold on, let me try it now15:46
TigerTaelYou click My Nokia, it brings up a page for about a second and then closes, Internal Error, Application "settings" closed.15:46
TigerTaelI did a fresh flash btw...15:47
SpeedEvilMy nokia has problems.15:47
TigerTaelI didn't even know what 'My Nokia' was... and still don't. :P15:47
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TigerTaelIt may be the fact that my simcard does not know my cellphone number.15:47
TigerTaelOr something else.15:48
pupnikcan  a maemo package install an older version of a library for itself?15:49
Jaffahrw: There must be other apps which open web pages. Do they have problems? e.g. a "Donate" button in gPodder's About dialogue?15:49
povbotBug 10366: MyNokia SMS sent after update without any action from the user15:49
SpeedEvilfor example15:49
pupnikand make it shared15:49
pupnikneed older libsdl-ttf for angband15:50
pupnikdpmg for me15:50
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TigerTaelSpeedEvil, yeah, i read about the SMS thing... and I never knew what My Nokia was until i saw it now.15:50
TigerTaelMine still just crashes straight away. :P15:51
hrwJaffa: witter works fine15:51
th3hateWhat does this command do? cat /dev/zero > /dev/mtd015:51
zaheermth3hate, doesn't look safe :)15:51
SpeedEvilCrashes with, or without costing you money.15:52
SpeedEvilth3hate: probably irrecoverably bricks your device.15:52
SpeedEvilth3hate: try it, and let us know.15:52
th3hateWell someone told me to try it, so i thought its better to ask for i do15:53
hrwJaffa: 'donate' button in currency converter also works15:53
TigerTaelSo I guess I should be happy that 'My Nokia' just crashes and burns for me. :P15:53
TigerTaelSpeedEvil, I don't think it's costing me money... although I should check.15:53
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SpeedEvilth3hate: From where?15:53
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TigerTaelOkay, i just tried it again and it didn't use any money. Let me reboot and try again.15:54
E0xwhen playing music  pulseaudio and mafw-dbus-something , eat the 40% of the cpu15:55
E0xthis is normal ?15:55
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th3hateSpeedEvil: I heard to formats the device15:55
achipathe funny thing is it didn't ask me to sign up for MyNokia, and I was able to back out when I clicked on it from settings...15:55
achipa(I flashed to PR1.2)15:55
Dr0axGuys, question: Have someone got ettercap and aircrack-ng working on N900?15:55
SpeedEvilth3hate: not strictly accurate15:55
TigerTaellol, my N900 doesn't want to turn on now.15:55
th3hateSpeedEvil: what is it for then?15:56
SpeedEvilth3hate: It wipes only the bootloader partition. So all your data is still there - it just won't boot without the attention of nokia wiwht a special programming adaptor.15:56
dnearybergie, Nothing there15:56
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dnearybergie, Anywhere else I might find it? /etc/apache2/modules.enables/mediawiki maybe?15:56
TigerTaelOkay, I had to take the battery out and in to turn on my phone.15:56
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mmarc___abhishek: I've successfully compiled libgl-dev for armel. Can't promise you good performance, but at least OpenGL-based apps (without ES!) could be compiled for maemo using the following stuff: freeglut3, freeglut3-dev, libgl1 and libgl-dev15:57
bergiedneary: maybe regular php.ini15:57
dnearyor conf.d/mediawiki.conf15:57
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loufoque_maemois there a way to completely mute the audio, so that flash videos don't play sound while in silent mode?15:58
dneary$wgMainCacheType = CACHE_MEMCACHED;15:58
Jaffahrw: Thanks. I'll have a look at witter15:58
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TigerTaelHoly crap, now all of a sudden after weeks and weeks, the My Nokia thing isn't crashing.15:58
jacekowskimmarc__: how you solved problem with non existing primitives?15:58
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dnearyThere doesn't appear to be any APC15:59
TigerTaelSo now, the My Nokia app doesn't crash... but I can't click anything either.15:59
TigerTaelWait, this may be related to regional settings...16:00
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TigerTaelBecause it changed my region to United Kingdom.16:00
TigerTaelChanged it and rebooting again.16:00
_abhishekmmarc__: well I am trying to get the source but not able to download apt-get source libgl-dev won't work16:00
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mmarc__jacekowski: don't know, they probably are not used, best thing is to check the app. Why when I execute it from X Terminal it says permission denied?16:01
loufoque_maemothere is a my nokia app? isn't it just a web link?16:01
TigerTaelOkay, it's definitely region related.16:01
mmarc___abhishek: check repos are turned on, and then do apt-get update16:01
TigerTaelloufoque_maemo, it's a section in the settings app actually.16:01
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TigerTaelIf I change my region to 'South Africa', reboot, start My Nokia, it just crashes.16:02
TigerTaelThankfully, no money lost. :D16:02
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jacekowskimmarc__: thing is that if it will send non existing primitives to graphic chip16:03
jacekowskimmarc__: shit will happen16:03
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crashanddieTigerTael: Nokia isn't sponsoring the 2010 world cup, so no support for SA this year.16:03
mmarc__jacekowski: that's logical! But do you know how to run the app?16:03
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Jaffahrw: Can you try, in X Terminal (or over SSH), as user: dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest="" --print-reply /com/nokia/osso_browser/request string:"http:/"16:03
jacekowskichmod it16:04
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jacekowskichmod 755 app16:04
jacekowskiand then ./app16:04
_abhishekmmarc__: yeah doing the same16:04
TigerTaelcrashanddie, haha.16:04
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dnearybergie, Do you know how to invalidate a memcached cache?16:04
dnearyIt appears to be that16:04
X-Fadedneary: Just restart memcached16:05
jacekowski_abhishek: wait for it to be imported16:05
jacekowski_abhishek: and i think you can't get sources of libgl-dev16:05
mmarc__jacekowski: sure, I've done chmod +x, but access is still denied, and I wonder what does it mean...16:05
jacekowski_abhishek: it would have to be just libgl16:05
dnearyI think I'd better get a hold of Niels16:06
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dnearyAh - there he is :)16:06
dnearyX-Fade, Didn't do the job16:06
_abhishekjacekowski: yeah thanks16:06
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mmarc___abhishek: are you getting the source from x86 freemantle, not from arm?16:06
hrwJaffa: Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name was not provided by any .service files16:06
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dnearyX-Fade, When I've been making small changes to php files in /usr/share/mediawiki/includes, they have not been taking effect16:06
_abhishekmmarc__: I am doing it on x8616:06
mmarc___abhishek: the trick is to get source from x86 and compile from arm16:06
X-Fadedneary: restart apache16:07
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Jaffahrw: And what about: dbus-send --system --type=method_call /com/nokia/osso_browser string:"http:/"16:07
jacekowskiX-Fade: what are you using for caching?16:07
dnearyChanges to LocalSettings, or in messages (a test - superficial change), went through straight away - I just needed to reload16:07
dnearyBut for stuff in includes, no16:07
_abhishekmmarc__: is it apt-get source libgl1 ?16:07
X-Fadeprobably apc with stat=off ?16:07
jacekowskithat's evil16:08
X-FadeChanges happen once every few months.16:08
X-FadeSaves a lot ;)16:08
dnearyX-Fade, where's apc?16:08
mmarc___abhishek: ok, then check you have the similar list of /etc/apt/sources.list:
X-Fadedneary: It is a php cache.16:08
mmarc___abhishek: no-no-no, libgl1-dev16:08
dnearyX-Fade, There's no /etc/php/conf.d/apc16:09
jacekowskiX-Fade: so you get like 100% hitrate?16:09
hrwJaffa: nothing16:09
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mmarc___abhishek: there is libgl1 binaries for arm already, they've just wasted headers...16:09
Jaffahrw: doesn't error, but doesn't open the browser either?16:09
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hrwJaffa: exactly16:09
_abhishekmmarc__: ok thanks16:09
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hrwMDBUS2> /com/nokia/osso_browser
hrw[ERR]: Unknown object path /com/nokia/osso_browser for
lcukJaffa, isnt there something about being as root - are you testing as regular user16:10
dnearyI haven't had lunch yet16:10
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_abhishekmmarc__: can you send me you sources.list16:10
MohammadAG51dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest="" --print-reply /com/nokia/osso_browser/request string:"URL"16:11
Jaffalcuk: I'm testing as a regular user.16:11
lcukok jaffa just making sure16:11
_abhishekwhen I do apt-get source libgl1-dev it says E: Unable to find a source package for libgl1-dev16:11
* lcuk gets similar oddities16:11
JaffaMohammadAG51: That doesn't work with Browser Switchboard:
povbotBug 8369: "Something went wrong" error when browser switchboard is installed16:11
MohammadAG51Jaffa, oh, solved that yesterday16:11
mmarc___abhishek: import repos from my list and then do a apt-get update16:11
MohammadAG51hermes right?16:11
JaffaMohammadAG51: Yeah16:12
MohammadAG51I don't have browser switchboard installed though16:12
_abhishekmmarc__: yeah thanks16:12
MohammadAG51it tries to create /dev/null16:12
MohammadAG51and gets permission denied16:12
JaffaMohammadAG51: What does?16:12
MohammadAG51running as root, authenticating, then rerunning as user solves it16:12
MohammadAG51Jaffa, hermes16:12
X-FadeOh ffs, why does google put a full screen background image on their search frontpage. How can I turn that off ;)16:12
MohammadAG51it says /dev/null: permission denied16:13
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JaffaMohammadAG51: When?16:13
MohammadAG51when it tries to open facebook16:13
MohammadAG51when it send the auth key16:13
MohammadAG51after that16:13
SpeedEvilX-Fade: igoogle?16:13
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MohammadAG51X-Fade, did you get my earlier request? :)16:14
_abhishekmmarc__: W: GPG error: fremantle Release: Couldn't access keyring: 'No such file or directory'16:14
lcukX-Fade, after you have finished advertising for them16:14
_abhishekmmarc__: while doing apt-get update16:14
lcukit goes away after you told 10 people about it16:14
X-FadeMohammadAG51: no16:14
JaffaMohammadAG51: OK. Then it (python-facebook) does which uses the command in gconf to launch a browser. The problem is the one which works with the default browser doesn't work with the DBUS interface provided by Browser Switchboard16:14
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MohammadAG51Jaffa, but i don't have browser s. :)16:15
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JaffaMohammadAG51: What do you think you solved? What do you mean by "solved"? How did you solve it?16:15
achipaX-Fade: did you import the hoopsfrenzy stuff, was that an automation accident, or was it a user upload/promotion ?16:15
MohammadAG51X-Fade, the USBcontrol package is useless, and it caused a lot of speculation, can you take it out of fremantle's repo?16:16
JaffaMohammadAG51: The dbus-send command you pasted is the same one as in hermes.postinst, so it should have been using it already16:16
mmarc___abhishek: that's a warning, not an error16:16
mmarc___abhishek: I have it too16:16
MohammadAG51Jaffa, i ran it as root, authenticated, then ran it as user16:16
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X-Fadeachipa: I think it was not cleaned properly and got reimported.16:16
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JaffaMohammadAG51: But apart from seeing /dev/null, permission denied what was the problem running it as user?16:16
MohammadAG51it just said something went wrong16:17
JaffaSo there *was* a problem?16:17
MohammadAG51Jaffa, how do I clear authentication?16:17
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JaffaMohammadAG51: You use 0.8.0 in Extras-devel, or delete some gconf keys in 0.2.x16:17
MohammadAG51i'm upgrading it right now16:18
X-FadeMohammadAG51: killing16:18
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MohammadAG51thanks X-Fade16:19
Jaffahrw: can you use mdbus2 to monitor what DBus stuff happens when you click on a link in witter?16:19
MohammadAG51Jaffa, no problems with the new version16:19
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JaffaMohammadAG51: Cool16:20
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MohammadAG51Jaffa, only difference on my side is a reboot from yesterday16:20
achipaX-Fade: ok, can you re-remove it ?16:21
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X-Fadeachipa: done16:21
_abhishekmmarc__: but still fakeroot apt-get source libgl1-dev Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree... Done E: Unable to find a source package for libgl1-dev16:21
hrwJaffa: moment16:21
Jaffahrw: thanks16:21
_abhishekmmarc__: can you send me libgl1-dev source package on mail ?16:22
mmarc___abhishek: what apt-cache search libgl shows?16:22
mmarc__"apt-cache search libgl"16:22
achipaX-Fade: thanks. Are you OK with the rest of the points in my email regarding QA stuff ?16:23
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X-Fadeachipa: Will reply to that.16:23
achipaX-Fade: ok16:23
X-Fadeachipa: But generally, yes.16:23
mmarc___abhishek: so, that's it here: libgl-dev - GL library development files16:24
mmarc__without 116:24
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hrwmethod call sender=:1.225 -> serial=53 path=/com/nokia/osso_browser;; member=open_new_window string ""16:25
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_abhishekmmarc__: mesa_7.1~RC3-0maemo1-recomp1.tar.gz ?16:25
hrwmethod return sender=:1.99 -> dest=:1.225 reply_serial=5316:25
mmarc___abhishek: no16:25
mmarc__step into folder mesa-...16:25
hrwJaffa: thats what dbus-monitor --session --monitor said16:25
_abhishekmmarc__: ok16:25
hrwJaffa: mdbus2 listening code needs work16:25
Jaffahrw: fair enough. So WTF doesn't that work from dbus-send?16:26
mmarc__cd mesa-7.1~RC3-0maemo1/16:26
mmarc__dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc16:26
mmarc__pardon, fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc16:26
_abhishekmmarc__: wait well one more thing where its download the source package16:26
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MohammadAG51why are you building mesa16:28
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mmarc__MohammadAG51: there are no dev headers on arm16:28
mmarc__someone removed them16:28
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MohammadAG51does mesa even work on the PowerVGX16:28
MohammadAG51or whatever it's called16:28
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flailingmonkeyhe wants to run OpenGL (non-ES) with software rendering on device, for testing i believe16:29
mmarc__MohammadAG51: I've compiled my opengl stuff on ARM (not on X86) under scratchbox, and it could be executed on xephyr. Quiet slow, but it runs well.16:31
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_abhishekmmarc__: compiling thanks :)16:32
mmarc__MohammadAG51: the problem is that exactly same executable on n900 says "permission denied". Is nokia detecting OpenGL apps and preventing them from running? ;) Seriously, I really wonder why is it happenning. Whatever error could be, but not this one.16:32
MohammadAG51chmod +x...16:32
X-FadeMohammadAG51: That is because home is mounded noexec.16:33
mmarc__MohammadAG51: I did it 1000+ times. It's something else...16:33
X-FadeDamn, what is whith my typing today ;)16:33
flailingmonkeyyou can strace the start of that call16:33
MohammadAG51see X-Fade's comment16:33
MohammadAG51X-Fade, check the nick before you hit enter :P16:33
X-Fademmarc__: Copy the file somewhere else ;)16:33
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mmarc__MohammadAG51: wait a minute, noexec? I.e. chmod +x would have no effect?16:33
MohammadAG51home can be executed from16:33
MohammadAG51MyDocs can't16:33
flailingmonkeywhat arm platform did you run this on before?16:33
MohammadAG51in MyDocs, no16:33
mmarc__MohammadAG51: aha, let me try:16:34
flailingmonkeyits fat32, so you can't set permissions at all16:34
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mmarc__sure sure, my fault16:34
flailingmonkeythe filesystem doesn't support them16:34
flailingmonkeyhows it going now16:35
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flailingmonkeydid N900 meego hardware adaptation meeting already happen today?16:37
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lcukyes at about 530am16:38
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mmarc__MohammadAG51: thanks agian for the hint, placement outside of MyDocs makes sense...16:40
Stskeepsflailingmonkey: minutes are published to mailing list16:41
flailingmonkeyUS east coast is in a bad timezone for those meetings :(16:41
flailingmonkey1 am wednesdays, i believe16:42
MohammadAG51Mece, ?16:42
MohammadAG51lcuk, what timezone?16:43
lcukMohammadAG51, that was metaphorical16:43
lcuk"early" is the best guess16:43
lcukeven for europeans16:43
MohammadAG51so what timezone again?16:43
lcuk7am uk time16:43
MohammadAG51oh, 5AM my time16:44
lcukas i said :P early16:44
_abhishekmmarc__: wow its compiled installed thanks a lot man :)16:45
MohammadAG51i could've lurked16:45
flailingmonkeyso 2am for me actually16:45
MohammadAG51X-Fade, thanks, it's down (usbcontrol)16:45
mmarc___abhishek: welcome, I just learned this today too :)16:46
_abhishekmmarc__: :)16:46
mmarc___abhishek: do not forget to bring both freeglut3 and libgl1 on device too, if you are going to test on device16:46
mmarc___abhishek: and to place apps outside MyDocs16:46
lcukStskeeps, would it be an idea to try alternative times to see if others want to be involved16:46
_abhishekmmarc__: yeah sure thanks16:47
Stskeepslcuk: dunno, it has to be in 9-17 finnish time ideally16:47
lcuksure but as you see flailingmonkey had an interest and i'd lke to see more of the discussion rather than reading scrollback16:48
GAN900Screw the Finns16:48
StskeepsGAN900: when 90% of the team is in finland, it's hard to16:48
GAN900They so rarely attend meetings anymore anyway. :P16:48
* lcuk hits GAN900 on the head16:48
SceltGAN900: are you from some other nordic country?16:48
lcukStskeeps, you just gave a big wide time swath that could be acceptible16:49
_abhishekmmarc__: well I got freeglut3-dev.deb for arml but not installing16:49
lcuki speak to finns all day16:49
mmarc___abhishek: are you installing with dpkg -i ?16:49
_abhishekmmarc__: yes16:49
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SceltI've found it very annoying that swedes, norwegians and danes have to have a meeting about everything. An hour meeting seems to be mandatory even the matter could be solved in the phone in 5 minutes or by few emails.16:49
lcukScelt, openness16:50
mmarc___abhishek: use dpkg, since apt-get will fail due some stupid dependencies. IMO, this is totally stupid that dev (!) package has dependencies :)16:50
jacekowskilcuk: timewasting16:50
lcukan hour long coordination meeting in the open is better than a 5 minute private phonecall16:50
flailingmonkeyit seems that later in the finnish work day would be better, but I understand the difficulties of coordinating global meetings16:50
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jacekowskilcuk: sometimes it's better to just fix the problem16:50
jacekowskilcuk: and then talk about it16:50
Sceltlcuk: it still annoys me16:50
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SceltI'm a Finn. I like to drink, not to chat16:51
lcuksure jacekowski and that happens but sometimes planning and organising requires collaboration16:51
lcukand coordination16:51
viszScelt, our views about this seem to differ. i suggest a meeting for further discussion16:51
SpeedEvilvisz: You need to come to a compromise that Scelt can live with.16:51
lcukScelt, let it annoy you, but Stskeeps and the qt people and a lot of the meego work is open and accessible to all (timezones not withstanding)_16:51
SpeedEvilvisz: I suggest a meeting with lots of drink.16:51
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* RST38h moos at lcook16:52
* lcuk cooks a trout for rstr16:52
* lcuk cooks a trout for RST38h 16:52
flailingmonkeyperhaps I'll add detailed stuff to the agenda, if there are things I'd like discussed but can't attend16:52
flailingmonkeyobviously it would have to explain the question well16:53
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lcukflailingmonkey, when things are on the agenda, the meetings like to have a representative to champion it16:53
lcukin the meeting itself16:53
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lcukotherwise people wtf at the first point and dont get past it16:53
flailingmonkeyyeah, i understand16:54
Sceltvisz: I'm very relieved that I can answer you no. There was a time when a norwegian boss told me to and I had to obey16:54
Funnyfacedid someone here try easy debian? did the sound work out for you in the latest image? I can't seem to find any info about it, which makes me wonder if it is only me..16:54
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mmarc___abhishek: with dpkg -i -f freeglut should install anyway, but it will still complain about missing dependencies. Currently I dont have better solution, but this one works.16:55
Sceltlcuk: ye, I just let my thinkings out loud. I agree to disagree16:56
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lcukScelt, disagree all you like,but openness requires more open coordination even if that requires more work16:56
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lcukand Stskeeps is doing a great job at it16:57
Sceltlcuk: sure. I didn't talk about maemo, meego or anything. I was just talking about annoying scandinavian habbits16:57
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mmarc__anybody compiled midnight commander for maemo?16:57
mmarc__any issues with it?16:57
mmarc__or simply compiles from source?16:58
_abhishekmmarc__: thanks16:58
achipammarc__: it's in Extras :)16:58
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mmarc__achipa: great news! thanks17:03
lcukScelt, i think we should take up SpeedEvil's suggestion of a meetign to clarify your objectives17:04
mmarc__YAY! My OpenGL sample executes on device, one thing: the keyboard is not working17:05
achipaX-Fade: that hoops thing is really stubborn - it's back again :)17:06
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flailingmonkeya keyboard focus issue?17:06
mmarc__flailingmonkey: sorry, I don't know. Original OpenGL apps were using straight keyboard callbacks17:07
Sceltlcuk: I think it was visz17:07
lcukmmarc__, sure if you arent using gtk or qt the keyboard focusing doesnt hold17:07
lcukScelt, sure but you can come too17:07
mmarc__flailingmonkey: hmm, but yes, the symbols I'm typing are echoed on the underlying X terminal I'm starting from17:08
mmarc__flailingmonkey: and no gtk, no qt17:08
flailingmonkeyScelt, otherwise the meeting wouldn't represent all view points17:08
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mmarc__flailingmonkey: you mean I need some extra circuit to get keyboard focus in my app?17:08
Sceltlcuk: ;NO! I've flown too many times for no real reason. It has to end17:09
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rlinfatihi, how i can disable the software updater on maemo5 ?17:09
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flailingmonkeyrlinfati, I suppose you could go into app manager and disable every repository17:10
jaskayou can change the update interval17:10
flailingmonkeyi don't know what controls the schedule of update checks though17:10
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mmarc__OMG, why so black font in mc??17:11
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mmarc__are you going to hurt your eyes?..17:11
jaskaat Disabling Auto Updates Check17:11
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mmarc__ah, the black font is for hidden files17:12
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rlinfatijaska, thanks !!17:12
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X-Fadeachipa: Ah crap, nice bug.17:23
MohammadAG51Zoutube broke grrr17:23
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MohammadAG51is the zoutube download function broken for anyone?17:37
vldcnstyes, hasn't worked for days17:37
zaheermwhich version?17:38
zaheermthe one in extras-devel or extras?17:38
MohammadAG51the extras one is just borked17:39
MohammadAG51the -devel one can't download17:39
zaheermwill fix the download and push another one into -devel today17:40
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, oh you're the dev?17:41
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th3hatetried to download zoutube yesterday, it's broken for me too17:42
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MohammadAG51cutributeError: YoutubeWithMediaPlayer instance has no attribute 'current_format'17:43
MohammadAG51missed the first two letters17:43
zaheermMohammadAG51, thx you saw that on console when doing what?17:43
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, as a quick fix, what are these variables17:44
MohammadAG51%s is the video 'ID' right17:45
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zaheermwhat line number do you see that error?17:45
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zaheermMohammadAG51, k found the bug, fixing now and packaging it up17:46
MohammadAG51cool, thanks :)17:46
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, 15 minutes till the importer runs17:47
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zaheermMohammadAG51, well building local package first17:48
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, I'm just saying, you have ten mins to upload if you want it there asap :P17:50
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zaheermMohammadAG51, lol pushed it to autobuilder17:51
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, cool, then it should be there at :517:52
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fralsMece: pong17:52
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zaheermMohammadAG51, ok it was successful in autobuilder17:53
MohammadAG51well, it's a python app :P17:53
Mecefrals, I forget what I pinged you about :P17:54
th3hateIs there a way to check if the vibrator is dead? like a terminal command17:54
Appiahis good for checking everything17:55
celestehmy syncing to google has been screwed up since around the time of the last OS upgrade17:55
MohammadAG51i think17:55
th3hateMaybe something like: # ls /sys/class/leds/twl4030:vibrator/ ?17:55
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chem|stAppiah: turn on touchscreen vibration17:56
Appiahchem|st: ?17:56
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MohammadAG51it's very rare for the whole vibration controller to break17:56
MohammadAG51Appiah, he pinged the wrong guy :P17:56
chem|stAppiah: settings > display >touch screen vibration17:56
* Appiah is slow17:56
chem|stAppiah: no its me sry17:57
MohammadAG51chem|st, he never asked for it lol17:57
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* MohammadAG51 slaps crashanddie 17:57
chem|stMohammadAG51: jeah overread it... was the guy above17:57
chem|stth3hate: read it?17:57
dnearyStill stuch17:57
dnearyI've added a bunch of wfDebugs in there now, and nothing gives17:58
dnearyX-Fade, When you do this kind of thing, how do you do the debugging?17:58
zaheermMohammadAG51, yes makes it a quick build too :)17:59
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th3hatechem|st: Vibrator only vibrator stops working after 10 mins of uptime,  but works first 10 mins17:59
th3hatewhat do you think the problem is?18:00
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, did the old app use the DSP?18:01
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MohammadAG51the old version allowed videos in the background18:02
zaheermMohammadAG51, yes for h264 decoding18:02
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, oh, so why did you switch to the media player?18:02
zaheermcorrect, it allowed videos in i shifted responsibility to the media player18:02
zaheermMohammadAG51, because its video widget is better18:03
DrGrovHow is there no themes in extras repositories now? Just the an-DROID theme?18:03
zaheermand i haven't had time to improve the one in zoutube much, so until i do i will leave it to media player18:03
DrGrovNo other ones? Is it really this slow development in themes?18:03
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StskeepsDrGrov: people don't test themes, it seems18:03
MohammadAG51I don't18:04
DrGrovStskeeps: yes it does seem like that. there seems to be many themes in the devel repositories18:04
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Meceis carbon in testing? awesome theme!18:04
SpeedEvilMohammadAG51: the motor breaking is not uncommon18:05
DrGrovThemes are generally considered "safe" to install without any major complications?18:05
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MeceDrGrov, there are no guarantees with devel stuff though.18:05
SpeedEvilthough in some cases themes can mean you can't see hte screen18:05
SpeedEvilso to be safe - stick with extras18:06
DrGrovMece: ok, so better to stay away then?18:07
DrGrovSpeedEvil: ah, then it is definitely that I stay away LOL18:07
Tachikomathe problem with devel and testing at least for me is that once i see all the stuff available I want to try it out :)18:07
Mecedrgrov, wouldn't say that. it could be a good idea to check tmo for comments on said theme before installing.18:07
DrGrovMece: yes, I will try them if comments are positive. There is the beautiful Nuvofre theme I would love to test.18:08
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TachikomaAre all themes in testing/devel optified yet? I would not assume that18:08
Mecetachikoma, no idea.18:08
TachikomaDrGrov: where do you know from how the theme looks like?18:08
SpeedEvilTachikoma: It's not unreasonable to do so - also - look at the app page - to see if there are any 'this app ate my kitten' reports.18:08
SpeedEvilAnd any thumbs-down18:08
Mecetachikoma, announce thread on tmo18:09
DrGrovTachikoma: i have seen screenshots18:09
TachikomaMece: I just relized the nokia shipped themes are eating up quite some spae on / - so i would not be surprised if others do that as well18:09
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SpeedEvilFor example.18:09
SpeedEvilThe top item on that list has karma 15 - rapier.18:09
TachikomaDrGrov: yes - where - i always look for screenshots - already started to make my own so i can better compare18:09
SpeedEvilThat may mean that 15 more people voted it up than voted it down18:09
Mecethanks speedevil, I was just about to ask for a link to the queue18:09
* ZogG is back (gone 106:29:48)18:09
DrGrovTachikoma: ok, let me find it for you18:10
SpeedEvilso it's probably safe to install.18:10
SpeedEvilThen you click on the version page -
TachikomaDrGrov: thanks, bookmarked18:10
DrGrovThis Nuvofre theme is something that definitely should get into extras hopefully fast as possible18:11
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, looks like it got imported - checking18:11
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SpeedEvilAnd you see that the GUI probably isn't very pretty - and it sticks a hundred k in / - but nobody making any 'broke my device' comments18:11
zaheermMohammadAG51, thx18:11
SpeedEvil(this of course doesn't mean it won't break your device)18:11
DrGrovTachikoma: you are welcome18:12
TachikomaSpeedEvil: what do you mean? I have a script to install from testing and extras that does basically record disk space, powertop oputput and some other things, then installs a package and then recoords the values again - then some awk/diff and i usually have a pretty good impression about the optification and so on18:13
SpeedEvilTachikoma: that would be a good thing to polish a little, and share.18:13
TachikomaSpeedEvil: i believe so, I was a bit active in the beginnig of the Qa discussion but soon got bored18:14
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SpeedEvilyou know about sync?18:14
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SpeedEvilEven just jam it up on
SpeedEvilas a link saying 'work in progress, please fix'18:14
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Tachikomaright now i don;t have it, i reflashed when 1.2 came out to factory state, no backups - but will redo that soon18:15
TachikomaAnd my personal experience with testing and devel is that there are only very few really broken packages.18:16
Tachikomait's more issues like wronf screen resolution and such things18:16
zaheermTachikoma, devel is straight from autobuilder so definitely will be quite a few broken ones!18:16
Tachikomazaheerm: i di only hit a few yet18:16
Tachikomabut also installed only based on my needs, so mostly games ;)18:16
Mecehey nice. I have 214 more karma than last time I checked :D18:16
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, yep, you fixed it, thanks :)18:16
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MohammadAG51zaheerm, why don't you push it into extras-testing?18:17
MohammadAG51the one in extras is borked18:17
zaheermMohammadAG51, yah will do18:17
Tachikomabut with the whole meego/harmattan stuff going on I do not actively ork on anything related to n900 at the moment18:17
SpeedEvilMine too.18:17
TachikomaI don;t even know anymore what the current devel system is, i assume that scratchbox got replaced?18:17
SpeedEvilWorst thing I've seen with extras-devel is apps that can't be exited18:17
TachikomaSpeedEvil: ssh into the box18:18
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SpeedEvilTachikoma: or power-button/camera button to get to a menu18:18
Tachikomaand then ctrl/backspace goes to taskmanager screen where i can kill18:18
SpeedEvilcamera is probably more reliable - ctrl-backspace doesn't work sometimes for me18:18
SpeedEvildunno why18:18
Tachikomawhat annoys much more are the non adopted apps that assume that every keyboard in the world has an up, down, left and right key :)18:19
hrwJaffa: I updated bug 836918:19
povbotBug "Something went wrong" error when browser switchboard is installed18:19
Tachikomawell - the german keyboard layout does not really have an own button for each of these directions ...18:19
fluxtachikoma, well, to be fair, it's not that bad assumption :)18:19
Tachikomathere the up and down key is shift combined with the left and right key ...18:20
SpeedEvilA bit more requirements might be nice.18:20
Tachikomaflux: i'm not really complaining here ;)18:20
flux(grumble grumble, would one extra row of keys have killed them..)18:20
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SpeedEvil'Your app if it's a statusbar widget, or may be invisible to the user when running must appear in settings'18:20
Tachikomaas long as i can switch to us layout, which i now try to memorize so i don;t have to use german anymore at all18:20
SpeedEvilFor example.18:20
TachikomaSpeedEvil: you mean the descriptions?18:21
SpeedEvilTachikoma: I mean - for example - I ahve 'lens cover reminder' installed.18:22
SpeedEvilWithout the entry in the 'settings' application - it would be much harder to work out what I have installed.18:22
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Tachikomawell, currently i only have the powerkernel and the mobilehotspot stuff from devel/testing, nothing else - system is still clean18:23
SpeedEvilBasically 'stuff that runs with no user interaction and does not appear in the applications list must have some way for the user to discover it's running' or something similar18:23
fralstimeless_mbp: got any recommended places for takeout around NRC?18:23
TachikomaSpeedEvil: i can't follow - you don't know what you have installed?18:24
timeless_mbpwhat do you want?18:24
Tachikomai check with dpk -l | grep ii18:24
timeless_mbpthere's a pizza place across the street18:24
Tachikomadpkg -l | grep ii18:24
timeless_mbpand a chinese place18:24
fralswhats available in a short walk except mcd and subway?18:24
timeless_mbpthere's a subway down the end18:24
timeless_mbpthere are a few places around the corner from the metro18:24
SpeedEvilTachikoma: I mean for normal users.18:24
fralsim at holiday inn atm18:24
Tachikomadpkg -l to my knowledge shows every installed package18:24
SpeedEvilTachikoma: I just read hex-dumps of the filesystem.18:24
fralsthe chinese any good?18:25
TachikomaSpeedEvil: oh, ok18:25
timeless_mbpi'm quite happy w/ it18:25
Tachikomadidn't get that18:25
timeless_mbpnote this is the one across from nokia18:25
Jaffahrw: Cool. I think 0.8.1's postinst sets that command (now in -devel). Testing welcome.18:25
timeless_mbpthe one closer to you costs more at night18:25
timeless_mbp(it's a good deal during lunch hour where it's an all you can eat buffet)18:25
fralswell it takes like 5min to go to NRC from here so18:25
Tachikomayeha, i would not recommend testing / devel to normal users despite my not too bad experience up to now18:25
timeless_mbpbut definitely check out the shops to the right of the metro18:25
timeless_mbpNokia | McD's | Metro | Food places | <random stuff> | You18:26
timeless_mbpNokia and You are on the wrong side of the street, but18:26
* timeless_mbp has to run18:26
fralsalright, cheers18:26
timeless_mbpApt meeting18:26
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fralshave fun o/18:26
Jaffahrw: Nope, it'll be in 0.8.2 which'll go out this evening18:26
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timeless_mbpif you can wait an hour18:27
timeless_mbpsp3000 and myself could do dinner w/ ya18:27
Mecehey how should one approach uninstallation of something that replaces a part of the firmware?18:27
SpeedEvilput it back?18:27
SpeedEvili don't see another solution.18:27
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Mecespeedevil, yeah, but how?18:27
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MeceI'm talking about how one could automate it..18:28
SpeedEvilcopy it in preinstall, put it back in uninstall?18:28
hrwJaffa: ok, will try it on monday18:28
* SpeedEvil isn't sure how this packaging stuff works.18:28
Mecespeedevil, sure.. postinst and preinst scripts.18:28
Mecei mean preinst and postrm18:29
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flailingmonkeywouldn't you just copy original somewhere in preinst, and copy it back in postrm? or is the problem that it would be inus18:35
flailingmonkeyhow do I make infobot fix my mistakes?18:36
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hcmflailingmonkey: use a trailing slash18:36
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infobothcm meant: flailingmonkey: use a trailed slash18:38
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DocScrutinizer51he knows even global substtitution when he's told so18:38
fralstimeless_mbp: im about to die from starvation, but some other evening :)18:38
DocScrutinizer51s/he /she /g18:39
infobotDocScrutinizer51 meant: she knows even global substtitution when he's told so18:39
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DocScrutinizer51tzzz, or not18:39
hcmis there a autokick on some forbidden words? then you could kick infobot using this substitution feature ;)18:39
DocScrutinizer51he knows even global substtitution when he is told so18:39
Meceflailingmonkey, that probly would work.18:39
DocScrutinizer51s/he /she /g18:39
infobotDocScrutinizer51 meant: she knows even global substtitution when she is told so18:39
crashanddiehcm: autokick is lame18:40
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hcmcrashanddie: yes, but it would be fun tu kick infobot :P18:40
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jacekowskiDocScrutinizer51: whe?18:40
marmoutedoes she know about regexp ?18:40
jacekowskiDocScrutinizer51: she?18:40
DocScrutinizer51~attack jacekowski18:41
* infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing jacekowski18:41
SpeedEvilDCC SE18:41
Mecedocscrutinizer, did you ever get that modded filemanager?18:41
SpeedEvils/SE/SEND startk/18:41
infobotSpeedEvil meant: DCC SEND startk18:41
DocScrutinizer51Mece: 1.1.1 here18:41
jacekowskihmm, bot on #amarok has ~confess18:41
jacekowski17:41 < jacekowski> ~confess18:42
jacekowski17:41 <@insanity> i am going out with the guy its been almost a year. i dont love him at all but i dont have the guts to break up with him because he is head over heals for me and it will completely break him. it hurts be to be with him because i want to be with other people. But i cant18:42
jacekowski                  just hurt him that bad. I dont know what to do.18:42
Mecedocscrutinizer, ah. probly wont work then. what do you get on dpkg -l libhildonfm218:42
jacekowskithere used to be two bots on that channel18:42
dnearyX-Fade, Restarting both memcached and apache doesn't appear to have the desired effect18:42
flailingmonkeythe problem you run into is if the file gets changed by another update. but that fortunately takes forever with Maemo 5 :P18:42
dnearyI'm starting to wonder if it's picking up the includes somewhere else...18:42
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X-Fadedneary: Then you need to trace if that happens.18:43
dnearySo, that's the problem18:43
Meceflailingmonkey, well that would only need a reinstallation. besides the program would prevent ota update.18:43
dnearyI asked how you did your tracing before18:43
hcmcrashanddie: yes I know that one ;)18:43
dnearyBecause all the wfDebug() calls I'm putting in never get logged18:43
X-Fadedneary: Just printing.18:43
dnearyAnd a simple print will go into Apache's logs?18:44
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X-Fadedneary: No, the page itself.18:44
dnearyX-Fade, I've been avoiding that because it's quite disruptive18:45
X-Fadedneary: Print it inside html comments then?18:45
X-Fadedneary: <!-- -->18:45
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dnearyX-Fade, I know what HTML comments look like18:48
dnearyX-Fade, I also know that mediawiki uses some kind of weird templating system to allow for internationalisation and all that jazz...18:48
dnearyI'll figure something out.18:48
X-Fadedneary: Write it out to file then?18:49
dnearyI still don't get how you see this happening18:49
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X-Fadedneary: debugging is a bit of a black art.18:50
dnearyI say "I've made a bunch of changes to files to log things, but nothing is getting logged, I think the files might be getting picked up from somewhere else"18:50
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dnearyand you say "add traces then"18:50
dnearyHave you ever hacked around with mediawiki?18:50
dnearyI am missing something...18:51
dnearyAnyway - like I said, I'll figure it out eventually18:51
X-Fadedneary: Sure I have. It is just php.18:51
Mecewhat's our policy on stuff that replaces bits of firmware? will stuff like that ever make it to extras?18:51
X-FadeMece: If it breaks SSU, probably not.18:51
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Mecex-fade, ok.18:52
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alteregowhat's the problem with chromium?18:53
X-FadeMece: Although you could start thinking about a community SSU like we have for Diablo.18:53
alteregowhy has it been removed?18:53
alteregoIs google being ghey?18:53
X-FadeNo, not google.18:54
X-FadeSome company having issues with google.18:54
alteregooh, then who?18:54
alteregooh, weird18:54
SpeedEvilNokias lawyers.18:54
Mecex-fade, that would be sweet.18:54
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X-FadeRed Bend18:54
crashanddieGod I'm so frigging bored18:54
SpeedEvilSeem to be worried about a cease and desist order from some company that alledge chromium is using their technology.18:54
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dnearypartial result18:55
SpeedEvilThe version of chromium in the repo had those bits ripped out. But the lawyers were still reportedly unhappy.18:55
dnearyBroke something18:55
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ptlMohammadAG51: are you there?18:59
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Mecei'm off. toodles.18:59
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ptlMohammadAG51: I've read a post by you where you compiled a non-crippled version of apt for the N900 -- - but the URL does not work. Do you still have it?19:00
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fralso/ VDVsx19:11
Stskeepsmoo frals, vdvsx19:11
fralsehlo Stskeeps19:11
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* Stskeeps is really not happy about it being 31 C outside19:12
flailingmonkeyouch, where are you19:12
dnearyX-Fade, Found it19:12
dnearyX-Fade, Evil evil stuff19:12
fralsStskeeps: send it over here... summer in finland means its clear blue sky but you can still wear a jacket without breaking a sweat :|19:13
dnearyX-Fade, There was an out-of-date includes directory in /var/lib/mediawiki, and a different, modified, also out-of-date one in /usr/share§mediawiki19:13
dneary works now19:13
X-Fadedneary: Hmm, not good.19:14
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X-Fadedneary: Symlink gone bad?19:14
dnearyAnd I am going to do what has been done for every other directory and make /var/lib/includes a symlink19:14
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dnearyJust no symlink at all19:14
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dnearyIt's a messy set-up19:14
dnearySo I was right about not being in the right place19:15
X-FadeHmm I guess it is a copy of the old server, where symlinks got converted to dirs.19:15
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dnearyI think it's a relic from when I put everything in svn19:15
dnearyferenc probably just did an svn co of the includes in both places19:15
dnearyAnd the "wrong" one was getting picked up19:16
dnearyThe funny thing was, includes/Wiki.php was getting taken from /usr/share/mediawiki, but all of the rest of the includes were getting picked up from /var/lib/mediawiki - not sure how that happened19:17
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BCMMhow can i clear my dns cache?19:23
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mmarc__hi, guys, could you please suggest a best set of optimization options for gcc on n900?19:29
mmarc__cmon, how about mtune?19:31
derfAll of that should be set correctly by default in the SDK.19:31
mmarc__really? It assumes some optimization defaults when running "gcc" ?19:32
wolf^especially when you're calling gcc from makefile...19:32
mmarc__-mfpu=vfp ?19:32
derfIt assumes some architecture defaults, because, you know, the people who put the SDK together knew what architecture you'd be targeting.19:32
wolf^mmarc__, I use -O3 -march=armv7-a -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfpu=neon -mfloat-abi=softfp -ftree-vectorize -ffast-math -fsingle-precision-constant19:33
mmarc__that's what I need! Thanks much, wolf^19:33
derfYay for placebos, I guess.19:33
wolf^yes, your guessing is much better than my benchmarks19:34
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BCMMO3 - questionable19:35
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wolf^some tight blitter loops were faster with it iirc19:36
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BCMManyway, how does one restart a service?19:39
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SpeedEvilstart foo19:39
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SpeedEvilor restart19:39
dnearyI can't believe I spent nearly 2 days chasing down a fucking ghost19:40
jcrawfordis there a website anywhere that explains the different icons you see in the status area near the clock>19:40
dnearyAnd I still don't understand how that happened19:40
jcrawfordi see an odd icon that looks like a tilted 8 with a red ! in it but don't see it when I click on the status area and the window appears19:40
nas_maybe is from a widget / application you installed ? ?19:41
jcrawfordSpeedEvil, if i knew how to take a screen shot on the device i would lol19:41
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jcrawfordSpeedEvil, that does not seem to do it for me :(19:43
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jcrawfordat-least they don't show up under pictures19:43
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trumeeanybody using sip on n900?19:46
jcrawfordah hell i dont have my computer cable with me, just the charger19:46
DocScrutinizer51sip, sure19:46
trumeeSurfa, my voice gets minced after 2 minutes of usage19:46
Surfatrumee, ok, haven't talked for 2 minutes (probably(19:47
trumeei am running my own * server with g72919:47
nextimetrumee: try to use another codec19:47
nextimeif you are on local LAN mayne just Alaw or Ulaw are ok19:47
trumeenextime: i have used PCMU19:48
nextimetrumee : try A-law19:48
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luke-jrnextime: now you're just running him through useless hoops19:48
luke-jrtrying g729 and ulaw means it isn't a codec-related issue19:49
trumeenextime: Bug 6936 is what i am facing19:49
povbotBug Caller voice gets minced after some time when taking call via SIP19:49
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trumeethe devs think it is fixed but it is not19:49
nextimeluke-jr : depend if on the asterisk side it is doing transcoding or not19:49
nextimeusually the ppstn use a-law19:49
trumeei have to use n95 to make sip calls now :(19:49
DocScrutinizer51I'm quite sure a audio problem showing up after 120s won't depend on codec used19:49
nextimeso, using another codec, even u-law, can make the call problematic19:49
jcrawfordwhere are the photos taken with the camera stored? I want to copy the screenshot there from term so that i can email it to post :)19:49
luke-jrnextime: err, usually not in my experience19:50
luke-jrbasically every ITSP I've seen supports ulaw19:50
luke-jrI've never seen anyone use alw19:50
trumeei am running my own * server. the extensions are remote though. the calls doesnt go over pstn at all.19:50
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nextimeluke-jr : at least here both BRI and PRI ISDN are default on alaw19:51
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trumeedoesnt n900 use sofia sip stack. why is this opensource implementation buggy.19:51
nextimeanyway, this was why i was saying "try alaw"19:52
luke-jrnextime: of course, ISDN doesn't exist in the real world... :p19:52
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nextimeluke-jr : uh?19:52
RST38hall right19:52
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RST38hwhat is cooking?19:52
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Stskeepsluke-jr: i've had isdn at home :P19:52
trumeeanybody here actually uses sip over wifi a lot? i am interested to know what codec they use.19:52
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MOUDHey all19:52
luke-jrStskeeps: you're in Poland, not the real world19:52
nextimeluke-jr : i don't know where you live, but here isdn is very common19:52
nextimeevery home line is ISDN19:52
Stskeepsluke-jr: was in denmark19:52
RST38hISDN? Eh....19:53
nextimeluke-jr : i'm in europe :)19:53
nextimehere isdn is very common19:53
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trumeeso any recommendations for codec from real sip users?19:53
MOUDHow can I use my 3G internet to my laptop via wireless?19:54
luke-jrnextime: ISDN is basically non-existent in the Americas19:54
microlithISDN had its day19:54
nextimeluke-jr : true, but america is only about 8% of the population of the world :)19:54
microlithlong sinc epassed19:54
nextimeamerica -> usa19:55
trumeeDocScrutinizer: you maintain twinkle too?19:55
luke-jrnextime: and Europe is what? 5%?19:55
DocScrutinizer51trumee: a little bit19:55
nextimeluke-jr : not so many less than america19:55
luke-jrnextime: America is more than USA19:55
Tachikomamh, in germany you can not get anything but a isdn line for pots19:55
RST38hluke: It is USA and Colonies19:55
Tachikomai mean i wanted analog but that was simply not available anymoe19:56
trumeeDocScrutinizer: how can i get decent log from * for the devs19:56
* RST38h ducks19:56
luke-jrTachikoma: sure, but of all the countries I know anything about, Germany is the most screwed up19:56
DocScrutinizer51trumee: no idea19:56
nextimeluke-jr : as google there are more people in europe than in us :)19:56
DocScrutinizer51jcrawford: you found DCIM?19:56
luke-jrnextime: my point was that China easily trivializes both19:56
Tachikomawell, that won't make isdn go away any time soon there19:57
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nextimeluke-jr : right, and china has isdn too!19:57
trumeethis sip issue is real frustrating for me.19:57
RST38hdoes it?19:57
jcrawfordyes i found it copied it there and am trying to email it now but seems to keep failing to send grrrr19:57
trumeemakes the tablet unusable19:57
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nextimetrumee : anyway, try to debug the call on the * side19:57
luke-jrnextime: no, China has MIW19:57
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* luke-jr is someone.19:58
trumeenextime: is there any test sip number i can call?19:58
* SpeedEvil is everyone.19:58
luke-jrSpeedEvil: liar19:58
DocScrutinizer51trumee: probably blame pulse audio for it19:58
nextimetrumee: wait just a second19:58
MOUDHow can I use my 3G internet to my laptop via wireless?19:59
nextimei will put online a sip number with an Echo()19:59
trumeeDocScrutinizer: so it is not sip stack issue, rather than pulse audio?19:59
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luke-jrMOUD: that's called tethering, and is usually against your provider's ToS19:59
DocScrutinizer51trumee: not sure19:59
trumeenextime: you use alaw codec?19:59
MOUDluke-jr: but is it possible with n900?19:59
luke-jrMOUD: yes.19:59
jcrawfordDocScrutinizer, OviShare does not want to seem to upload the 500kb image either grr19:59
DocScrutinizer51trumee: just PA is known to be crap. I frequently blame it for all unclear issues20:00
Tachikomaluke-jr: in germany it's not against every providers Tos anymore, mine allows it by now if i read it right ...20:00
MOUDgonna give a try. Does it need any special configuration?20:00
Tachikomabut then again i also have a contract that was so early they did not yet think of putting that restirction in :)20:01
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luke-jrTachikoma: yeah right. it's illegal to run an open AP in Germany20:01
trumeeDocScrutinizer: the * debug log wont help if it is a PA problem?20:01
luke-jrMOUD: of course20:01
luke-jrMOUD: might even need to recompile your kernel20:01
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MOUDluke-jr: :S ok, tks for the info :)20:02
nextimetrumee : try to call 123456@skylive.astronomix.org20:02
nextimecorecode seve620:02
trumeenextime: thanks20:02
DocScrutinizer51trumee: first: what kind of problem are you facing?20:02
luke-jrMOUD: you might need to use ad-hoc wifi mode, too20:02
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luke-jrnot sure if N900 supports AP mode20:02
Tachikomaluke-jr: yeah - an open one. It's not illegal to run a encrypted one. In fact it's not even legal to run an encrypted one where the random number that was printed on the access point and is the preconfigured passphrase has not been changed after setting it up the first time ...20:02
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jcrawfordfinally got it on ovishare but now to actually remove it from being private lol20:03
luke-jrTachikoma: yeah, exactly. Germany is insane.20:03
trumeeDocScrutinizer: remote voice gets muffled after 2 minutes20:03
microlithluke-jr: wasn't it said that the wifi firmware explicitly disables that mode?20:03
Tachikomaluke-jr: nope - germ,any is freaking old20:03
luke-jrTachikoma: and senile/insane20:03
Tachikomajust look at the average age, its something like 4220:03
DocScrutinizer51trumee: that's strange20:03
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flailingmonkeyfor sharing over wifi, joikuspot?20:04
MOUDluke-jr: I'll try with default settings. If it doesn't work i'll try playing with it later20:04
StskeepsRST38h: you know, if it was a omap3 and with n810 design..20:04
Tachikomaso the people in charge here have not the slightest clue about what they are doing when it comes to technology, also expleins the extremely rapid growth of the pirate party here20:04
trumeeDocScrutinizer: Bug 693620:04
povbotBug Caller voice gets minced after some time when taking call via SIP20:04
jcrawfordDocScrutinizer, what is your email i will share with you :)20:04
jcrawfordwhomever can tell me what this icon is haha20:04
jcrawfordwait i will just upload to image service20:04
DocScrutinizer51jcrawford: share what?20:04
RST38hStskeeps: Actually, N810 is kinda flimsy when compared to n900, and the keyboard is worse...20:04
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Tachikomaat kleast germany forbitd google to take pictures of public streets :)20:05
fralsbah why have ppl thumbed down the statement that chromium was pulled20:05
luke-jrTachikoma: I am anti-piracy of course20:05
luke-jrTachikoma: yeah, more insanity there20:05
Tachikomaluke-jr: pirate party is that as well, most people do not understand that.20:05
jcrawfordDocScrutinizer, this screenshot :)20:05
RST38hWhat is wrong with taking pictures of public streets btw?20:05
luke-jrTachikoma: then why call themselves piracy?20:05
luke-jrRST38h: nothing, just Germany being retarded20:05
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Tachikomanobody calls themself piracy20:06
DocScrutinizer51jcrawford: I don't need that20:06
crashanddiepirate party are a bunch of idiots who hide behind "we're against piracy", when really they just want to download shit, without caring of copyright20:06
Tachikomaits pirates20:06
Surfacrashanddie, since when are they officially against piracy?20:06
luke-jrcrashanddie: so?20:06
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Surfaat least in finland i've never seen such statement20:06
luke-jrpiracy and copyright are two completely unrelated political issues20:06
luke-jrpiracy is raiding ships at high seas20:07
xkr47-DIAm I missing something.. how do I create an account for the wiki ?20:07
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luke-jrcopyright is a monopoly over informaton20:07
Tachikomacrashanddie: that depends on the country, in germany many people joined pirate party as the governement was about to implement censorship technology for the internet and was about to store the last 5 years or so connection data of every internet user20:07
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jcrawfordi need to know what the icon is 2nd from the right in the top row20:07
xkr47-DII went to the and clicked "log in / create account"20:07
xkr47-DIbut on the page I see no possibility to create an account20:07
Tachikomain sweden the piracy topic is much more viviid, german pirates are more aginats surveillance and censorship20:07
xkr47-DIand trying to log in just gives errors20:07
Surfaluke-jr, copyright has nothing to do with current understanding of information20:07
xkr47-DIcan anybody help ?20:07
trumeenextime: cant call your number?20:07
jcrawfordanyone know?20:07
nextimein italy google can shot public streets, but they have to cover things that can be bad for privacy like registration numbers of cars ( i don't know the right word in english) and so on20:08
jcrawfordnextime, censoring20:08
nextimetrumee: uhmm i don't see anything coming from outside20:08 ?20:08
nextimejcrawford : no, i mean the registration numbers of the cars20:08
trumeenextime: ?20:08
nextimetrumee : yep20:08
jcrawfordcan anyone tell me what the 2nd icon from the right in the top row of the status area is?
Tachikomaluke-jr: i can only recommend this page to you:
nextimei'm in the asterisk cli with verbose set to 620:09
nextimeand i don't see any call coming20:09
Tachikomait will veru strongly improve your view that germany is insane20:09
jcrawfordnextime, in the use we call them license plates20:09
nextime( no firewalling on 5060 udp )20:09
jcrawfordplate number :)20:09
Tachikomaand you'll have a  good laugh :)20:09
nextimejcrawford : yep, plate number is ok :D20:09
Tachikomabasicvally its some american guy explainung germany :)20:09
crashanddieluke-jr & jcrawford & Tachikoma & nextime: Could we take it to an off-topic channel?20:10
Tachikomacrashanddie: already leaving20:10
lcukdneary, \o thanks20:10
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SpeedEviljcrawford: Don't recognise it.20:10
dnearylcuk, Thanks fer what?20:10
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SpeedEviln900fly active?20:10
jcrawfordSpeedEvil, yea nor do i but sometimes it is a green circle with that ssideways 8 icon20:10
lcukbug 10573 following up and rectifying :D20:11
povbotBug Searching for wiki contributions by username yields no results20:11
jcrawfordlunch be back20:11
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nextimetrumee : just tryed from my office to call the * server, it work20:11
DocScrutinizer51jcrawford: never seen20:12
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MOUDare the extras catalogs offline?20:14
trumeenextime: some problem with my * config20:14
trumeenextime: it is not accepting sip addresses ony telephone numbers20:15
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nextimetrumee : can't you bypass your asterisk registration and directly call from the phone?20:16
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* nextime need to find the more rapid way to transfer a LOT of contact from the blackberry to the n90020:17
trumeenextime: how would i do that?20:17
trumeenextime: disable * register?20:17
nextimetrumee : just calling without any registration would do20:17
MOUDIs JoikuSpot worth the money?20:17
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DocScrutinizerdneary: thanks for fixing 19573 :-)20:18
dnearyDocScrutinizer: 10573? No problem :) Was painful20:18
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: how's charging coming along?20:18
trumeenextime: should i disable sip account?20:19
nextimetrumee : ok, the default voip client in maemo doesn't let you call by voip without an account20:19
jacekowskinextime: why you want voip?20:19
nextimeat leas as i can see looking at the config20:19
nextimejacekowski : my voip is working, it is trumee that has issues20:19
SpeedEvildneary: People can now see what I've been editing! Oh noes! :)20:20
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: not on top of my todo list. To verify any concept I'd need the devel device which I'm waiting to arrive every day now20:20
nextimejacekowski : i use it so i can redirect my office number to my mobile :D20:20
trumeenextime: what codec do you use?20:20
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jacekowskinextime: just setup a call forwarding20:20
nextimetrumee : g729...20:21
nextimejacekowski : why i have to pay for a call forward when i can do it gratis?20:21
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: anyway SpeedEvil, ShadowJK and me have successfully charged, using a one-liner20:21
trumeenextime: and it works fine for long duration over wifi?20:21
nextimetrumee : never tryed over wifi20:21
trumeenextime: ah!20:21
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: a crude concept, but for anything more sophisticated ... see above about device to test20:22
trumeenextime: i have found it working ok over 3g but not on wifi20:22
nextimetrumee : so, i will try20:22
ptlMOUD: you guess it is, because it's cheap. But it also uses too much CPU, I'd rather use something like mobilehotspot even though it requires a custom kernel (you can use the opportunity to go overclock, though)20:22
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MOUDi see20:23
ptlMOUD: the rationale being, if you use your mobile as a hotspot, you want it for the longest time possible, and mobilehotspot allows you that because it uses much less CPU than joikuspot20:23
nextimemy wife is calling me for dinner, seeya guys.20:23
MOUDptl: I see, but does it work right?20:24
ptlMOUD: both do.20:24
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MOUDwhat about using n900 as a repeater?20:24
MOUDn900 as a Wifi Repeater. (To increase a wireless signal)20:25
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ptlNo idea about that, but I don't think it will fit this purpose. mobile phone wifi power is small.20:26
SpeedEvilptl: it's not actually20:26
ptlI stand corrected, then. :)20:26
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SpeedEvilBut I'm not sure that the firmware supports acting as a client and a master at the same time20:27
SpeedEvilin principle, that might work with ad-hoc.20:27
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flailingmonkeyits tricky business20:34
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: well, it's more about hardware20:35
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: as you can't do 2 channels at the same time20:35
flailingmonkeymajor usb-hostmode use case for myself: usb-ethernet stick to share wifi/3g with wired devices20:35
SpeedEvilThat too, yes.20:36
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jacekowskiand to make it just repeat all you need is access to raw mode20:36
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DocScrutinizerjacekowski: yep20:36
jacekowskirecieve everything with interesting SSID and resend20:36
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jacekowskin900 wifi can do raw mode?20:37
ptlwhat temperature do your n900s show? Mine is usually within 30 to 40 ⁰C20:37
jacekowskiptl: 3220:37
ptlcurrently 3320:37
flailingmonkeyit needs to send on different channel perhaps? how would client handle seeing the same packets twice20:37
LuciusMareWhere do i check? -_-20:37
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th3hate Is it right that N8 has a broadcom GPU?20:38
ptlLuciusMare: you need custom kernel (kernel-power), then you need to load the bq27x00_battery kernel module, then you do cat /sys/class/power_supply/bq27200-0/temp20:39
Surfath3hate, why do you think so20:39
th3haterumors say so20:39
th3hateJust wanna make sure20:39
LuciusMareptl: okay, thanks :)20:39
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th3hateor is it PowerVR SGX530?20:40
ptlLuciusMare: kernel-power it titan's kernel, a ready-for-overclocking kernel with loads of stuff, like ipv6 support, NAT/masquerading support (for mobilehotspot) and other goodies, it's worth the money you pay for it20:40
flailingmonkeyth3hate, I see no reason to expect such a bizarre change20:40
vldcnstwhat money?20:41
ptlit's worth it.20:41
th3hateThen i guess it's not broadcom like rumors say?20:41
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microlithit's something weird, an ARM11 chip with OpenGL ES 2.0 support20:42
microlithI wonder if it's something custom from TI20:43
th3hateThe UI is gpu accelerated with Broadcom  BCM2727 GPU20:43
th3hatei guess20:43
flailingmonkeynvm, I keep forgetting its ARM11 platform20:44
dnearySpeedEvil, Fixed user links in Recentchanges too20:44
th3hateARM11 is based on ARMv6?20:44
microlithbroadcom's site is terrible :/20:45
GAN900Stskeeps, man up. :P20:46
GAN900Oops, stuck in scrollback.20:47
GAN900th3hate, ARM11 is the CPU type, armv6 is the instruction set.20:47
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th3hateI mean n8's CPU is the based on the same cpu used in n81020:48
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th3hateboth are ARM-1120:48
GAN900th3hate, not exactly.20:48
Surfath3hate, quite again.. where did you get the idea? :)20:48
th3hateIt says the CPU is ARM11 in nokia's site20:49
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th3hateAnd it says the same about n810's cpu both are arm1120:49
th3hateBut GPU being broadcom is just a rumor20:50
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* timeless_mbp sighs20:50
microlithwell, the "gpu" being broadcom is unlikely unless the whole SoC is broadcom20:51
microlithwe'll know soon enough, in any case20:52
th3hateThat's what i thought too, i think it's PowerVR SGX53020:52
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flailingmonkeymuch more liekly20:55
flailingmonkeyIRC/forums must be pretty amusing for people who know internal details. or depressing20:57
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* ENTERANICK [W2I=000:u:0:000:]21:07
jacekowskistupid web2irc script21:07
DocScrutinizerI bet, otherwise where's THAT lame nick from21:08
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DocScrutinizerGAN900: no news yet. 'overnight' was a guess of you, right?21:10
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tripzerodoes anyone else have this weird hypnotic response to spinning the desktops on their phone?21:15
tripzerofun for my 3yr old and for me21:15
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DocScrutinizernah, I won't say it...21:18
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Stskeepsflailingmonkey: my vote is on depressing if you have a open source mindset21:19
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: has charging gained some points on meego importance rating?21:20
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: just asking why you're asking :-)21:21
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: curiousity and i wish we had a open bme (personally)21:21
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: so I might re-arrange my ToDo21:21
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: I wait for response from hah and err, what's his name?21:22
GAN900DocScrutinizer, yeah.21:23
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: marquiz i guess21:24
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Stskeepson a random sidenote, if a meego team is meeting in person and there's only nokians/subcontractors in it, - what's best way to maintain 'openness'? publish minutes afterwards and postpone actual decisions until next online meeting?21:25
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: you noticed (yet quite empty) jrbme.garage ?21:25
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Stskeepsyeah, i noticed it21:26
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: good question21:26
ljsdofuynsdfufuhokay, bought that n90021:26
Stskeepsbecause even in open teams there might be BoF's in person, on a random conference21:26
ljsdofuynsdfufuhthought the touchscreen would be better21:26
ljsdofuynsdfufuhdid they ever get multitouch to work on it?21:27
mikki-kunljsdofuynsdfufuh: hardware-side not possible21:27
mikki-kunbut with some nasty software-hacks it emulates that...21:27
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: probably yes. depends on nature of the decisions. If you easily can revert, then no need to postpone, just mention them in minutes and encourage public debate21:28
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhmikki-kun, which softare hacks are these?21:29
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: after all it's always one person who says 'so now that's it, let's see if it pans out" - so you can decide based on prior discussion, or you decide based on own notion and discuss later21:30
mikki-kunto my knowledge none have been really distributed widely as these hacks are really basic and implementation can and surely is very difficult21:30
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: :nod:21:30
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DocScrutinizerljsdofuynsdfufuh: you can not implement true mt on this type of touchscreen, without at least minor hw mods21:32
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mikki-kunDocScrutinizer: minor hw hacks?! replacing the touchscreen and the controller is for me a major hack...21:32
GAN900Stskeeps, we should fly you to all of them. :P21:33
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Stskeepsmeh, i hate travelling too much21:33
Stskeepsvisiting two countries this month21:34
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DocScrutinizermikki-kun: that's not how r-ts mt works, though21:34
ljsdofuynsdfufuhwill the n900 work with maemo 6?21:35
DocScrutinizermikki-kun: basically it'd need really minor modifications to the driver hw for a 4wire r-ts21:35
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhthis n900 seems to have maemo 5: 10.2010.19-1.00221:35
ljsdofuynsdfufuhis this optimal?21:35
mikki-kunisn't that pr1.2?21:35
mikki-kunif so, then you are up to date..21:35
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dreginDoes anyone know of a workaround to get the email widget working with nokia messaging?21:36
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mikki-kunDocScrutinizer: hm, i didn't know that you can hack a rt-st-ts to a multi-touch...21:37
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mikki-kunmaybe i should take a look there...21:38
DocScrutinizermikki-kun: well, dual touch21:38
mikki-kunisn't that enough?21:38
DocScrutinizerfor me even single is enough21:38
mikki-kunif we could have triple-touch then we'd beat the iphone4 :D ^^21:38
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DocScrutinizernot sure about that. iPhone c-ts probably supports virtual "unlimited" number of conurrent touchpoints21:39
GAN9009 or 1021:40
GAN9001st gen may be less21:40
mikki-kuntry putting 10 of you fingers on the 3.5" screen21:40
satmdor even 11!21:40
mikki-kunit's pretty full after that21:40
GAN900I can't eve put two without awkwardness.21:40
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mikki-kunsometimes dual-touch would be cool, but single-touch is easier in usage :)21:41
DocScrutinizererr \o21:41
crashanddieGAN900: play tap tap21:41
crashanddieGAN900: you'll learn to use three fingers without any problem21:42
DocScrutinizer§and next week we show you how to unknot your fingers..."21:42
crashanddieand that sentence taken out of context can be so damning21:42
mikki-kunapple could bring "twister for fingers" out...21:42
sx0n|homeit's too easy to leave evidences on touch screen.21:42
crashanddienot apple, apple doesn't write apps21:43
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crashanddieor very little21:43
mikki-kunthat would top 1 app in all stores21:43
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DocScrutinizeranyway twister for fingers was exactly what I had in mind21:43
mikki-kunDocScrutinizer: you ever played heavy rain?21:43
mikki-kunat one point you have to use 8 of your fingers to hold down specific buttons...21:44
mikki-kunthat is really twister21:44
ljsdofuynsdfufuhcouldn't the screen on the n900 be replaced or something?21:44
ljsdofuynsdfufuhthere seem to be screws on the back21:44
ljsdofuynsdfufuhput on a capacitive one21:44
DocScrutinizerljsdofuynsdfufuh: forget it21:44
ljsdofuynsdfufuhI mean, it doesn't seem that hard to do - just saying21:45
mikki-kunljsdofuynsdfufuh: have fun writing the drivers ;)21:46
sx0n|homei dont think that resistive and capacitive screens are electronically compatible21:46
DocScrutinizerhave fun finding a mechanically matching part, first instance21:46
ljsdofuynsdfufuhwell the whole screen part would have to be replaced, I guess21:46
ljsdofuynsdfufuhof course, nokia would probably have to manufacture it21:46
greenflyseems like a lot of work just to pinch to zoom21:46
sx0n|homeljsdofuynsdfufuh: not bad idea.21:47
ljsdofuynsdfufuhwell, I've never had a phone with it, but I heard there is a lot more one cna do with it21:47
DocScrutinizerinsane idea21:47
ljsdofuynsdfufuhgood ideas are insane21:47
ljsdofuynsdfufuhminus the atomic bomb21:47
sx0n|homemodularity is good m'kay?21:47
DocScrutinizern900 isn't 'modular'21:47
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greenflypresumably n900+1 will have a capacitive screen21:48
sx0n|homethat why phones have (normally) changeable batteries21:48
DocScrutinizertrust me, I know what I'm talking about21:48
ljsdofuynsdfufuhshare your knowledge21:48
sx0n|homewell i dont :)21:48
DocScrutinizergreenfly: ack21:48
ljsdofuynsdfufuhanyone have problems connecting to certain APs with the n900?21:48
DocScrutinizergreenfly: and no hw kbd21:49
ljsdofuynsdfufuhyou guys talking about the n920?21:49
greenflyDocScrutinizer: at least from what I've read APIs are being written to support it21:49
ljsdofuynsdfufuhthought that was fake21:49
greenflyDocScrutinizer: hadn't heard about the hw kbd21:49
greenflythat's a pretty important feature for me21:49
DocScrutinizergrep your config files for RX-7121:50
greenflyinteractive shell sessions are painful w/ pure touchscreen21:50
GAN900ljsdofuynsdfufuh, versatility wise resistive is better21:50
DocScrutinizeror maybe s/config/git tree/21:50
sx0n|homen900 kbd is not very comfortable either, too small for my taste21:51
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhGAN900, why so one can use that stick thingy?21:51
sx0n|homefour rows would be great21:51
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greenflyeh, I just tend to get used to whatever thumb keyboard21:51
ljsdofuynsdfufuhwell, let's try to be optimistic about it since I literally just bought one21:51
greenflynone of them are ideal (since the ideal would be a full-sized keyboard)21:51
ljsdofuynsdfufuh*everyone make ljsdofuynsdfufuh feel good about his purchase*21:52
sx0n|homegreenfly: and no qwerty. it was only invented to slow down typing21:52
greenflyljsdofuynsdfufuh: the n900 is great as long as you aren't trying to turn it into some other phone21:52
ljsdofuynsdfufuhActually, I wonder if anyone has hooked up full sized keyboards using bluetooth21:52
greenflysx0n|home: oh here we go with that old yarn...21:52
greenflyljsdofuynsdfufuh: some have, it's hit or miss, depends on the keyboard type and you have to do a bit of work to get it to work21:53
sx0n|homegreenfly: well yes :)21:53
ljsdofuynsdfufuhit was invented to slow down typing in one way, but actually it ends up not doing so much anymore21:53
ljsdofuynsdfufuh(researched that one for a while)21:53
greenflythe end result of all of it is that people who are properly trained to type are faster than people who aren't21:53
DocScrutinizerljsdofuynsdfufuh: it's the best device I ever had, and I don't want it to be elementarily different21:53
ljsdofuynsdfufuhcurrently having problem connecting to wifi21:54
sx0n|homen900 is really a good device.21:54
ljsdofuynsdfufuhthinks wep pass is wrong or something21:54
ljsdofuynsdfufuhfirst thing I did was install nmap21:54
sx0n|homeeven farmville works with oc kernel and pr1.2. it does not work well even on most desktops21:55
ljsdofuynsdfufuhoh what a plus21:55
sx0n|homeyeah, zynga ceo was second speaker in ios4 presentation.21:55
sx0n|homeand millions of users. incl me ;)21:56
sx0n|homei just do little "research" about online games.21:57
konfoopeople actually play farmville?21:57
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhyes depending upon your definition of 'people'21:57
sx0n|homei would not call it playing..21:57
konfooright, sorry, the great unwashed21:57
sx0n|homeim on level 62 btw :)21:58
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhhow do you show a wep key you entered in previously?21:59
sx0n|homeyou cant i suppose21:59
sx0n|homesecurity issue21:59
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sx0n|homebut it was just guess21:59
xDaReaperxfor installing Wine should i donwload the .deb package ?22:00
xDaReaperxcause there are other packages available22:00
xDaReaperxthis is the binary list :
xDaReaperxi don't know which one to choose22:00
sx0n|homewine? for what?22:01
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xDaReaperxdont tell me its not yet out22:01
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DocScrutinizeryou're aware we got no x86 cpu, are you?22:01
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xDaReaperxwell how did some ppl run Wine on their N90022:02
sx0n|homexDaReaperx: are you trying to use spotify?22:02
sx0n|homethere is different client22:02
xDaReaperxhmm couldnt find one22:02
DocScrutinizersomeone even made OSX run on N900, using bochs22:03
DocScrutinizertime to first boot message: ~3h22:03
DocScrutinizerwindows also "works" using this way22:04
DocScrutinizerso why shouldn't wine work as well?22:04
sx0n|homethere might be better threads, but that came up first22:04
xDaReaperxhmm ok ty22:04
xDaReaperxya i thought wine should be working alone22:05
DocScrutinizerbochs hosting x86-linux, running wine, running a windows app22:06
DocScrutinizersounds sane ;-D22:06
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xDaReaperxdont we have DoxBox as another PC emulator ?22:07
xDaReaperxDosBox *22:07
styleIs there way to make n900 give internet connection to laptop via bluetooth?22:07
FauxFauxO_O at all the data disappearing when you go into mass storage mode.22:07
xDaReaperxBluetooth DUN22:07
style(with obex (or something like that))22:08
DocScrutinizeryes, you can s/bochs/dosbox|qemu/22:08
xDaReaperxhmm ok22:08
stylexDaReaperx: ty22:09
xDaReaperxur welcome22:09
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flailingmonkeyit is just unusably slow22:10
flailingmonkeywep keys are stored in a file somewhere, not encrypted. off the top of my head I don't know where22:11
FauxFauxgconftool-2 -R /system/osso/connectivity/IAP22:11
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flailingmonkeyFauxFaux, thanks, works for me.22:14
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhany of you have problems with wep on n90022:14
flailingmonkeyljsdofuynsdfufuh, use the command FauxFaux gave in the Terminal22:14
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flailingmonkeynone of the APs I use have WEP, its worse than nothing :-\22:15
ljsdofuynsdfufuhanyway, I'm trying to connect to a WEP AP22:15
ljsdofuynsdfufuhI have the key and everything, was just curious if maemo was storing it everytime i entered it22:16
ljsdofuynsdfufuhit wont connect though - and ive read some forum posts where people have had problems with wep and the n90022:16
ljsdofuynsdfufuhno fixes I've seen so far22:16
ljsdofuynsdfufuhnot sure why it isn't working22:16
flailingmonkeyWEP with pre-shared key is a broken scheme, gives a false sense of security, and small performance penalty22:16
Fredrik1994Can i be connected for myself and my computer through my phone at the same time22:17
ljsdofuynsdfufuhyeah, but a lot of people have it22:17
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhand I would like to be able to connect to any AP with my n90022:17
vldcnstFredrik1994: can you rephrase that?22:17
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ljsdofuynsdfufuhtalk on phone and use internet simultaneously?22:17
flailingmonkeyyou can share a GPRS data connection to a computer over bluetooth, and also use the internet on your phone22:18
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Fredrik1994Same connection? (and, you said GPRS but guess it would work on 3G/3.5G as well)?22:18
Fredrik1994and btw, when it comes to WEP keys, it's better than nothing i guess?22:20
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Fredrik1994things like consoles, NDS, doesn't support WPA22:20
ljsdofuynsdfufuhI no wep is crap, I just want to be able to connect to wep enabled APs22:20
ljsdofuynsdfufuhknow** (wow?!)22:22
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TuukkaJust had a wow moment with my N900. Downloaded easy debian with max speeds of a bit over 1 Mb/s over 3G :DD22:28
xDaReaperxcool ^22:28
xDaReaperxanyone has 3.5 G ?22:29
_llll_in the uk, when signal allows22:29
_llll_never had that much bandwidth though22:29
Tuukkaactually it was 3.5G22:29
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tripzeroStskeeps, open bme?22:34
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Stskeepssomeone's playing with that, i guess22:35
tripzerowhat's a bme?22:35
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ioanI want to figure out what ports skype uses and I need help. How do I run netstat to show the application?22:38
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flailingmonkeynetstat has a -p flag, but the version shipped on the N900 is missing it22:42
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ioanI googled it, "lsof -i" seems like workd22:45
flailingmonkeynice, I'll remember that oe :-)22:46
infobotflailingmonkey meant: nice, I'll remember that one :-)22:46
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trumeeanybody knows what is the default ptime in N900 for G729?22:53
trumeeS60 uses ptime of 20ms. Any idea what N900 uses?22:53
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DocScrutinizertrumee: use wireshark to trace the SIP datasteam, and you'll able to tell a lot of that23:00
flailingmonkeysounds like a question for a Nokian, as the SIP code is closed-source (would be nice if it was open)23:00
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trumeeDocScrutinizer: i need wireshark on N900? or can i simply log *23:01
DocScrutinizerthought it's bee some lib though23:01
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DocScrutinizertrumee: wireshark is nice, but you also cam use tcpdump and analize later by loading the file to ws23:02
trumeeDocScrutinizer: thanks23:02
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MohammadAG51wireshark reveals the IP of the person you're talking to on skype23:02
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zaheerm-lpthe sip code is sofia-sip which should be free software23:07
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crashanddieMohammadAG51: are you sure of that?23:11
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crashanddieMohammadAG51: I thought skype worked through p2p23:11
MohammadAG51crashanddie, pretty sure23:11
MohammadAG51idk how/why23:12
tripzerocrashanddie, no, it uses some p2p tech to get around firewalls... but that's not really p2p23:12
MohammadAG51but I got 5 of my friends' IPs23:12
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alteregoskype initiates a direct connection between clients, but it initiates the connection via a central service.23:14
alteregoIt's actually really clever how it tricks routers to do it.23:15
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timeless_mbpfrals: ping23:16
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timeless_mbpfrals: please fix your file picker to have a parent23:16
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alteregoMohammadAG51: have you managed to get the IM status updater to work yet? :P23:17
alteregoI wanna promote it gad damnit! :P23:17
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DocScrutinizer51crashanddie: skype is p2p with some central support relays used whenever needed23:18
crashanddiealterego: it is clever, but it doesn't work all the time23:18
alteregocrashanddie: under what conditions? It's been working flawlessly for me ..23:19
crashanddiealterego: very complicated corporate network with vpn'ing and international routing, trying to dial out to people behind NAT'd home networks23:19
flailingmonkeydoes Andre Klapper lurk IRC?23:20
timeless_mbphe's andre__23:20
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flailingmonkey~seen andre__23:20
alteregocrashanddie: oh, you're talking about skype and not my app :P23:21
crashanddiealterego: :)23:21
alteregoI thought you were having issues with my app :P23:21
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infobotandre__ is currently on #maemo (12h 11m 36s) #meego (12h 11m 36s), last said: 'FauxFaux, ?'.23:21
trumeeHow can i use tcpdump to capture sip packets only?23:21
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DocScrutinizer51crashanddie: skype? it fails when both ends are symmetric NAT and no media relay server available23:22
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DocScrutinizer51crashanddie: same as SIP :-P23:22
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crashanddietrumee: use filters23:23
trumeecrashanddie: tcpdump -n -w sip.pcap -s 1500 -i wlan0 ?23:23
trumeecrashanddie: is that sufficient?23:23
andre__flailingmonkey, eh?23:23
DocScrutinizer51looks good23:24
flailingmonkeyandre__, for feature bug jars, the wiki doesn't have links to the bugzilla?23:24
flailingmonkeyah, they are pipermail links23:24
andre__flailingmonkey, pipermail23:25
DocScrutinizer51trumee: filter later, using wireshark :-)23:25
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: do i need to enable sip debug as well?23:25
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: TPSIP_DEBUG=all and TPORT_LOG=1 ?23:25
DocScrutinizer51never heard of, no idea23:25
flailingmonkeymy bad. but without bug # either, harder to check them out23:25
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: i need to restart telepathy with the above logs, or is tcpdump sufficient?23:26
andre__flailingmonkey, yeah :-/23:26
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andre__not cool, true23:26
DocScrutinizer51tcpdump works autonomously23:26
flailingmonkeyandre__, is the original mail html?23:26
flailingmonkey(html mail on mailing lists is usually a no no i guess)23:27
zashflailingmonkey: sending html email to mailing lists is punishable by death! ;)23:27
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andre__flailingmonkey, yes23:29
andre__well, I normally don't send HTML. but in this special case it makes sense23:29
andre__having the URL clutter in there is not cool for some managers23:30
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flailingmonkeyI hope someone magics you that HTML-to-t.m.o forum syntax converter you need23:31
DocScrutinizer51trumee: apt-get install wireshark23:31
DocScrutinizer51much more fun :-D23:31
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DocScrutinizer51html mail on ML is often either discarded or converted to plain text23:33
lcukmail clients send out flattext + original html dont they?23:33
lcukat least polite ones23:33
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flailingmonkeykiller app for N900: interactive "computer interface" animations from movies/tv shows23:33
lcukflailingmonkey, eh? why not just have real apps using nicer interfaces23:34
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flailingmonkeybecause movie/tv interfaces aren't actually usable, but "pretty" which seems to be the killer app consumers want :-P23:35
SpeedEvilMost shows rarely had a consistent widget-set.23:35
trumeeDocScrutinizer: hmm, tcpdump kicks the network out.23:35
trumeeDocScrutinizer: it kills the sip connection23:35
SpeedEviltrumee: i noticed that the version of tcpdump I had installed was broken, and would do that23:35
SpeedEvilremoving and apt-get tcpdumping again made it work23:36
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trumeeSpeedEvil: apt-get remove tcpdump, apt-get install tcdump?23:36
DocScrutinizer51trumee: apt-get install wireshark23:36
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DocScrutinizer51much more fun :-D23:37
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: cant install wireshark, it is my missus N900. Wireshark will frighten her out :)23:37
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DocScrutinizer51tcpdump no better23:37
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: tcpdump only needs ctrl+c :)23:38
DocScrutinizer51hmm wireshark as well23:38
flailingmonkeyactually, it might be fun to make some app that did nothing, but simulated familiar interfaces, if it also had sound clips23:39
DocScrutinizer51but ok, I never checked ws on hildon. maybe it's even crap23:40
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: do i need devel for wireshark?23:41
DocScrutinizer51for sure23:41
flailingmonkeyws got my laptop hacked :-( Taught me to capture and not view live, (AND not to use ws on a windows laptop at HOPE)23:41
trumeetcpdump kicks my sip connection. guess i need to install wireshark23:42
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DocScrutinizer51nah they both use libpcap23:42
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DocScrutinizer51just ws is much more bloated and cpu hog23:43
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DocScrutinizer51but zI don't see how tcpdump ever could kick your SIP23:46
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: i had to disable wifi and then re-enable, otherwise sip wouldnt connect23:47
DocScrutinizer51that should be unrelated to tcpdump23:48
DocScrutinizer51except if tcpdump ate all your cpu23:49
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alteregoHmmm, what to write next ..23:49
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: crap wireshark also kicks the sip connection23:49
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trumeeDocScrutinizer51: time to un-install wireshark. Both tcpdump and wireshark failed me23:50
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DocScrutinizer51of course ssh into n900 over wlan and then have tcpdump log wlan traffic to that remote shell would be a nice kind of self feeding growth in traffic23:51
DocScrutinizer51aka deadlock23:52
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: nope, i dont have ssh server installed on N90023:52
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: i only have ssh client installed23:52
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: i had an xterm open in N90023:52
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DocScrutinizer51remote file for storing the dump would serve same purpose ;-D23:53
trumeeDocScrutinizer51: i am going to reboot N900 and try tcpdump again in a shell23:54
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DrGrovIt is lucky that my nerves are being cooled by one of the greatest beers out there since my patience with the N900 is finishing slowly but certainly....23:54
trumeeDocScrutinizer: libpcap was installed from dev-tools rather than extras-devel23:55
trumeeDocScrutinizer: could that be the reason?23:55
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joker_89any pys60 programmer?23:56
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MohammadAG51Try #pys60?23:56
joker_89are sleeping23:59
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