| RST38h | ZogG; See above | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| ZogG | i saw | 00:00 |
| ZogG | saw wha is this modularity is about? | 00:00 |
| ZogG | that you have several files or what? | 00:00 |
| RST38h | ZogG: They create a package, with all the updates. They test it (or so they say). They release it. | 00:00 |
| KongfuPanda | ZogG, that doesn't work. Windows 7, Adobe Acrobat 9 Pro. | 00:00 |
| RST38h | ZogG; Inside the package, things are still pretty modular | 00:00 |
| ZogG | KongfuPanda, second link? | 00:00 |
| KongfuPanda | It doesn't split pages | 00:00 |
| KongfuPanda | they give same advice | 00:01 |
| ZogG | RST38h, no sense =) | 00:01 |
| RST38h | ZogG: But they have to get released in a huge lump because that is how Nokia's release process works | 00:01 |
| KongfuPanda | Document>Pages>E tract pages. But nothing happens | 00:01 |
| ZogG | KongfuPanda, there programs for that as well | 00:01 |
| RST38h | (and yes, it does make certain perverse sense in Symbian) | 00:01 |
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| ZogG | RST38h, tht's how Nokia fails you mean? | 00:01 |
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| RST38h | ZogG: They think it is vital | 00:01 |
| ZogG | i don't care about symbian ) | 00:02 |
| RST38h | ZogG: A lot of Nokia engineers privately agree that it is bullshit | 00:02 |
| ZogG | RST38h, they just don't care as something doesn't work, they care if the whole picture is fine, and it's wrong as handset is something different for others | 00:02 |
| KongfuPanda | ZogG, which ones? | 00:02 |
| RST38h | But the engineers do not decide what and when to release | 00:02 |
| ZogG | for example i don't care about certain things but need to wait whole update only for things i care | 00:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: support is the crux | 00:03 |
| RST38h | Doc: I seriously doubt this argument. | 00:03 |
| ZogG | RST38h, it's an old war. the programmers against the market stuff | 00:03 |
| RST38h | Doc: You can release updates to packages into a separate unsupported "testing" repo | 00:03 |
| RST38h | ZogG: The funny part is that the "market" people often resemble blind goats leading their sheep into the abyss | 00:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: helpdesk dude:"which version are you running?" user:"ok, I updated from 1.1.1 to a new desktop manager, added the t-tan kernal, and.... what? No support??? FSCKYOU!" | 00:04 |
| ZogG | RST38h even better, as they make update test it inside and don't touch it anyway | 00:04 |
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| ZogG | so it can go straigfht to repo and if something wrong people would complain | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Doc: "Where have you added it? -- From the beta testers repo. -- Reflash to the latest supported version and test again" | 00:05 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer how does ubuntu works? | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Doc: Believe me, there ARE ways to quickly resolve these issues in support | 00:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: I fully agree, but not the management drones at Nokia I guess | 00:05 |
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| RST38h | Doc: I mean, your local IT department probably solves such issues daily | 00:05 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer, so you decide what version of core and than the version of specific program, as well you can advise to make update - so you would know the versions =) | 00:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ZogG: and what is a 1st level helpdesk robot supposed to do with such info? | 00:07 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer, okay, now i have pr1.2 and my widget still doesn't work properly, so how do they resolve it in support? | 00:07 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer, they don't anyway | 00:07 |
| ZogG | so at least they would work at bugs | 00:07 |
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| ZogG | i don't care about buggy soft as i see some work is done to resolve it | 00:07 |
| ZogG | here i don't even know if someone work on it | 00:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | nota bene, that's not MY opinion, that's what I suspect Nokia management thinks about that issue | 00:08 |
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| ZogG | maybe they didn't update it - just said it's fixed and that's all =) | 00:08 |
| RST38h | Doc: Actually, the 1st level reporting should be done with an on-device program that reports all the necessary data (including list of installed packages) to the support | 00:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: ack, full ack | 00:08 |
| RST38h | Doc: And the server side script should analyze this data and mark suspicious lines in red for the support guy | 00:08 |
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| ZogG | RST38h, too much | 00:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | the callcenter doing 1st level probably can't handle that | 00:09 |
| RST38h | ZogG: Not really. You are letting computer do what computers do best: analyze long lists of data | 00:09 |
| RST38h | Doc: Drone's instructions just say "You see red lines? ---> Ask what he installed and where from." | 00:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I know some callcenters, they pay zillions on a crappy CRM+phone-sw controlling the PBX | 00:10 |
| MOUD | does anyone know if those "Flex" keyboards work with n900? | 00:10 |
| ZogG | RST38h, yes, but people don't care about it, as programist or familiuar with computers you understand that calls are stupid and bug reports are important | 00:10 |
| ZogG | but person want to get answer at the moument he calles | 00:11 |
| RST38h | ZogG: And he will get one | 00:11 |
| ZogG | so he wants to talk to other person and get aswer | 00:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | and then that software doesn't even work. they never are prepared for such a nice innovative concept | 00:11 |
| ZogG | RST38h like what? bug 1234556 ? | 00:11 |
| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1234556 was not found. | 00:11 |
| RST38h | here is your answer :) | 00:11 |
| ZogG | RST38h we can use povbot` as support desk =) | 00:11 |
| RST38h | ZogG: Guy calls support. The drone can either start asking him about stuff, OR he can ask the guy to click on the "Support" icon and enter a certian number (case ID) into the input field | 00:12 |
| RST38h | ZogG: the second choice may actually be faster and easier than asking a lot of involved questions | 00:13 |
| ZogG | but he want straight answer | 00:13 |
| ZogG | the program doesn't know to give it straight | 00:13 |
| RST38h | Everybody wants straight answer | 00:13 |
| RST38h | The program will not give him answer | 00:13 |
| ZogG | that's the point | 00:14 |
| RST38h | The program will report his setup to the call center where server side script will analyze it and show the drone a list of most likely bugs | 00:14 |
| * DocScrutinizer waves | 00:14 | |
| ZogG | if person on support don't give you aswer but talk to you and give info (that actually not usefull) it will come you dawn | 00:14 |
| ZogG | calm down* | 00:14 |
| RST38h | Starting with non standard combination of system packages and ending with 'this bluez package has a known issue" | 00:14 |
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| ZogG | RST38h you have to understand common user, they don';t think logicly | 00:15 |
| RST38h | ZogG: That is psychiatric support, not IT | 00:15 |
| ZogG | heh | 00:15 |
| * RST38h is talking about IT/technology support | 00:15 | |
| ZogG | what is marketing and phone support on companies? | 00:15 |
| * lbt recalls, whilst working at BT a few years ago, that the cost per support call was ~ £11 | 00:16 | |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: this is not IT | 00:16 |
| RST38h | I thik it classifies as IT/technology | 00:16 |
| ZogG | why they ask you - have you restarted it and other stupid questions? | 00:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: maemo is hiding the real filesystem hirachy from *THE USER* | 00:16 |
| RST38h | lbt: that is kinda high | 00:16 |
| ZogG | cause for them you have 0 knowledge | 00:16 |
| ZogG | they wouldn't give you quiz to understand your knowledge | 00:16 |
| RST38h | Doc: Pretty irrelevant, 95% of callers won't know how to use it | 00:16 |
| lbt | RST38h: probably fully costed for a particular (retail) product | 00:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: that should tell you what Nokia expects about expertise of their average support callling *user* | 00:17 |
| ZogG | RST38h, here, you answered yourself | 00:17 |
| RST38h | lbt: You average Indian drone is getting $3-$7 per hour | 00:17 |
| RST38h | lbt: So, 11 pounds is a lot | 00:17 |
| * RST38h sighs and hits the bed | 00:18 | |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: 1st level _always_ is psychological treatment rather than IT support | 00:18 |
| lbt | yup...... which is why a) that was a few yrs ago and b) we know use indian drones | 00:18 |
| ZogG | RST38h most of support guys on phone are noobs themselfs | 00:18 |
| lbt | now | 00:18 |
| ZogG | and just like monkeys push the certain buttons | 00:18 |
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| RST38h | ZogG: Most of support guys on the phone are not even human | 00:18 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer that's what i say | 00:18 |
| ZogG | RST38h maybe on moon | 00:18 |
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| * lbt goes back to his workflow integration with speech simulation and voice recognition.... | 00:19 | |
| RST38h | ZogG: If you assume that being human is defined by adequate reaction to arbitrary verbal input | 00:19 |
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| RST38h | ZogG: i.e. drones do not even pass a Turing test | 00:19 |
| ZogG | i'm not english native speaker =) | 00:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | lbt: voice recog??? o.O | 00:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | gimmegimmegimme | 00:19 |
| lbt | pardon | 00:19 |
| ZogG | lbt too late | 00:20 |
| lbt | please say that again madam | 00:20 |
| * ZogG xmms2> Dusk + Blackdown - Kuri Pataka (The Firecracker Girl) ft. Teji and Farrah ["Margin's Music" 2008] | 00:20 | |
| RST38h | Doc: the adequate response to this string is "fuckoff." | 00:20 |
| RST38h | =) | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | lol, I'll obey | 00:20 |
| RST38h | no, definitely sleep now. | 00:20 |
| lbt | me too | 00:20 |
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| lbt | o/ | 00:20 |
| ZogG | DocScrutinizer, he lost =) | 00:20 |
| ZogG | again | 00:20 |
| ZogG | citory is our | 00:20 |
| ZogG | victory | 00:21 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, finished the GUI? | 00:21 |
| ZogG | GUI for what | 00:21 |
| astruasdh | please, guys... I was reading the easy debian scripts, and noticed that for each app intended to run in the debian a chroot is created... so it is 1 chroot per app ran on Debian. am i right? | 00:22 |
| Macer | hm | 00:23 |
| ZogG | i found someone with froyo =) | 00:23 |
| Macer | wonder if there is smbmount for maemo | 00:23 |
| MohammadAG | if you're using the debbie command then i think it creates a bew chroot for each app | 00:23 |
| ZogG | where is flash lib in maemo? | 00:24 |
| astruasdh | hmmm the script that is ran to exec Debian's app is qchroot? | 00:24 |
| MOUD | has anyone tried this kind of keyboard? http://gadizmo.com/duraflex-flexible-keyboard.php | 00:25 |
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| MohammadAG | astruasdh, yes | 00:26 |
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| MohammadAG | qole chroot i think | 00:26 |
| Macer | MOUD: that looks pretty cool | 00:26 |
| Macer | wish they had a bt ver | 00:26 |
| MOUD | Macer: yeah, i saw one in the supermarket today, was like $20,00 | 00:27 |
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| MohammadAG | afaik there are other q* command | 00:27 |
| MohammadAG | s | 00:27 |
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| MohammadAG | qmount is one | 00:27 |
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| Macer | and that maemo had good bt keyboard support | 00:27 |
| MOUD | is it now possible to dual boot the n900? | 00:28 |
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| pupnik | good q | 00:29 |
| ZogG | MOUD probably | 00:29 |
| astruasdh | tyvm | 00:29 |
| MOUD | how many MB is the GPU? | 00:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | MohammadAG: yeah, atm working on version 7 | 00:31 |
| ZogG | I GOT FLASH 10 !!! | 00:31 |
| MOUD | GRATZ | 00:31 |
| ZogG | but didn't check if it works =))) | 00:31 |
| MOUD | -.- | 00:32 |
| ZogG | ibflashlite.so | 00:32 |
| ZogG | libflashsnddec.so | 00:32 |
| ZogG | libflashplayerlib.so | 00:32 |
| MOUD | any word about java support? | 00:32 |
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| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer51, windows 7? | 00:32 |
| ZogG | meh | 00:32 |
| ZogG | win7 is so old | 00:33 |
| ZogG | win 98 is better | 00:33 |
| ZogG | 98 > 7 | 00:33 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nah the 7th version for the 14th mio sold apps | 00:33 |
| Rabidus | ME > 98+7 | 00:33 |
| ZogG | Rabidus 311 | 00:33 |
| MohammadAG | 1/0 rules all | 00:33 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG, i'm getting flash libs from android =))))))) | 00:34 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, right... | 00:34 |
| MOUD | i wish i could dual boot win 98, mainly for games | 00:34 |
| MohammadAG | you expect that to work? | 00:34 |
| MohammadAG | well | 00:34 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG meh, it;s old flash =( | 00:34 |
| MohammadAG | you expect it to work with microb? | 00:34 |
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| ZogG | MohammadAG i expect mirracle | 00:35 |
| pupnik | i saw a win98 emulator written in flash :) | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, flash 10 on fryo is mainly flash 9 + some fixes + a version bump | 00:35 |
| MOUD | it would be nice playing DotA with it :P | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | it doesn't have HW acceleration | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | yet | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG, mirracles don't happen nowadays | 00:35 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG, how do you know? | 00:35 |
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| ZogG | you are jealous | 00:36 |
| MohammadAG | google it :) | 00:36 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | pupnik: bsod? | 00:36 |
| ZogG | MohammadAG google is evil | 00:36 |
| MohammadAG | bing it | 00:36 |
| MohammadAG | Bing | 00:36 |
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| MohammadAG | infobot, you're supposed to Bong back | 00:36 |
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| MOUD | lol | 00:36 |
| MOUD | maybe lunch time? :P | 00:36 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~bing | 00:37 |
| infobot | from memory, bing is an Empirical stochastic bandwidth tester | 00:37 |
| MohammadAG | lol | 00:37 |
| MOUD | lol | 00:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~ding | 00:37 |
| infobot | dong | 00:37 |
| MOUD | ~ping | 00:37 |
| infobot | ~pong | 00:37 |
| MOUD | XD | 00:37 |
| MOUD | ~hey | 00:38 |
| infobot | hey is, like, almost for horses | 00:38 |
| MOUD | WT... | 00:38 |
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| ZogG | ~ping | 00:39 |
| infobot | ~pong | 00:39 |
| ZogG | ~pong | 00:39 |
| infobot | ~ping | 00:39 |
| MOUD | ~bye | 00:39 |
| infobot | l8tr | 00:39 |
| MOUD | ~l8tr | 00:39 |
| Shapeshifter | ~stupid | 00:40 |
| infobot | stupid is probably http://fun.drno.de/pics/english/bart.gif | 00:40 |
| * MohammadAG suggests switching to PM | 00:40 | |
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| MohammadAG | lol | 00:40 |
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| MOUD | lol | 00:40 |
| MOUD | ~PM | 00:40 |
| infobot | hmm... pm is project manager, or private message, or perl mongers, or pathetic moron: when you see someone say pm, they're asking if you think that they're a pathetic moron, or something you don't do without asking permission | 00:40 |
| hcm | infobot: pm? | 00:41 |
| infobot | somebody said pm was project manager, or private message, or perl mongers, or pathetic moron: when you see someone say pm, they're asking if you think that they're a pathetic moron, or something you don't do without asking permission | 00:41 |
| hcm | duh.. | 00:41 |
| MohammadAG | #maemo is logged, that ^ spams the logs :) | 00:41 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~query | 00:42 |
| infobot | talk dirty to me! Preferably, do so after you have typed "/query apt" which should open a new window/tab/whatever with most irc clients. You can talk to me all you like and don't annoy other people with endless queries. Be aware that the stuff you write is logged, so don't get too 1337 :) | 00:42 |
| MOUD | MohammadAG: just having some fun :) | 00:43 |
| MohammadAG | I'm not an op, but we don't want to make DocScrutinizer51 angry do we :) | 00:43 |
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| MOUD | we have 5 docs on :P | 00:44 |
| MOUD | is there a way to partition n900? if so, would it be possible to create a FAT32 partition and install win98 in it? | 00:46 |
| ZogG | night | 00:47 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yes | 00:47 |
| MOUD | gn ZogG | 00:48 |
| MOUD | DocScrutinizer51: have you seen something like that? | 00:48 |
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| luke-jr | wow, infobot is retarded | 00:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | i think someone made win run under bochs | 00:49 |
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| MOUD | is it a program? | 00:50 |
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| pupnik | lol DocScrutinizer51 | 00:52 |
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| pupnik | you can also install CP/M on a n900 partition! | 00:53 |
| SwedeMike | MOUD: do you have win98 for ARM processors? | 00:53 |
| Dassu | anybody here tried video streaming from mediatomb? | 00:53 |
| MOUD | SwedeMike: no | 00:53 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | that's what bochs and qemu are for | 00:54 |
| SwedeMike | then I don't see the need for a separate partition? | 00:54 |
| MOUD | i was thinking about dual boot win98 for max performance but didnt think that win98 is incompatible with ARM processors | 00:55 |
| MOUD | where do i get qemu | 00:57 |
| Shapeshifter | MOUD: on the internet | 00:57 |
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| pupnik | what is the "Charging" sound effect called | 00:58 |
| MOUD | ok, tks | 00:58 |
| MohammadAG | ui-charging maybe? | 00:58 |
| MohammadAG | sec | 00:58 |
| pupnik | moud talk.maemo.org has a thread about it | 00:58 |
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| MOUD | pupnik: tks, i'll check it now | 00:59 |
| pupnik | but almost nobody does it - too slow | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | close | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | /usr/share/sounds/ui-charging_started.wav | 00:59 |
| pupnik | thanks much MohammadAG | 00:59 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | sorry, scratch bochs. prolly was false | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | np | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | scratchbochs sucks | 00:59 |
| pupnik | MohammadAG: sucks when the usb connector is flaky and the charging sound comes on 50 times a minute | 01:01 |
| MohammadAG | machine gun sound | 01:01 |
| pupnik | MOUD: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=42195 | 01:02 |
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| pupnik | i should run win95 on here too | 01:03 |
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| Myrtti | wohoo! it's dead, jim! | 01:04 |
| MOUD | pupnik: tks for the link :) | 01:04 |
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| pupnik | is that where the cast of star-trek work out Myrtti ? | 01:05 |
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| Myrtti | pupnik: intranet, xmpp and email just bite the dust for a moment... not that I was working or anything at this ungodly hour, but... | 01:05 |
| Myrtti | probably electric problems :-( | 01:06 |
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| pupnik | sorry to hear it Myrtti. interesting this xmpp thing... | 01:11 |
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| MOUD | i installed bochs but i cant find the icon to run it | 01:18 |
| luke-jr | why on Earth would anyone use bochs? | 01:21 |
| MOUD | to try it out? :P | 01:21 |
| MOUD | so... how can i run it? | 01:22 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | i'm not sure if bochs is maybe a console emulator | 01:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | arcade console | 01:23 |
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| Flandry | chirp chirp | 01:24 |
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| pigeon | so... what happened to the new ovi store? | 01:30 |
| midas_ | it broke | 01:30 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | was there any? | 01:31 |
| luke-jr | DocScrutinizer51: no, it's a pre-qemu x86 emulator | 01:31 |
| midas_ | it should be released/was released briefly | 01:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | I'd be much more interested in szncing ovi contacts | 01:32 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | syncing even | 01:32 |
| MOUD | night all | 01:33 |
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| jacekowski | 51? | 01:33 |
| MOUD | /quit | 01:33 |
| midas_ | id like to have ovi maps finally doing turn by turn navigation on my n900 :) | 01:33 |
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| jacekowski | midas_: use sygic | 01:34 |
| midas_ | is it free? | 01:34 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ovi store was such a disgusting experience, I couldn't be bothered to revisit it any time soon | 01:34 |
| jacekowski | midas_: on torrents | 01:35 |
| midas_ | hehe | 01:35 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | luke-jr: heh so I was right | 01:35 |
| jacekowski | but really | 01:36 |
| jacekowski | you don't want turn by turn on n900 | 01:36 |
| jacekowski | it drains battery too fast | 01:36 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | damn lags. and then 20 post at once | 01:36 |
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| budfive | jacekowski: if you're in a car, it can be plugged in | 01:36 |
| midas_ | yep indeed | 01:36 |
| jacekowski | well, you need holder for it | 01:36 |
| jacekowski | better speaker | 01:36 |
| jacekowski | you might as well buy proper sat nav | 01:37 |
| midas_ | and my brodit active holder has that budfive :) | 01:37 |
| jacekowski | with bigger screen, and better gps | 01:37 |
| midas_ | http://www.brodit.com/productinformation.jsp?anr=512099&sortiment=null | 01:37 |
| SpeedEvil | composite out is probably fine for the screen actually | 01:37 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer51, that's psm for ya :) | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | bah | 01:37 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | for a bandaid it'd be great | 01:38 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer51, other channel | 01:38 |
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| Flandry | I've got a repo/dependencies problem. Anyone here a wiz? | 01:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | MohammadAG: thanks | 01:42 |
| MohammadAG | just ask | 01:42 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer51, np :) | 01:43 |
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| Flandry | I'm using libpoppler with the qt bindings and the package http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/libpoppler-qt4-dev/0.12.2-2maemo0/ | 01:44 |
| Flandry | claims to have a missing dependency, but only in armel target | 01:44 |
| Flandry | http://maemo.org/packages/view/libqt4-dev/ | 01:45 |
| Flandry | It actually exists and i'm not sure why it says it's unmet | 01:45 |
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| jacekowski | maybe it needs specific version or somethign | 01:45 |
| Flandry | It shows version requirements in the package page | 01:47 |
| Flandry | it doesn't have any | 01:47 |
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| Flandry | plus that doesn't really explain why it is happy on x86 target | 01:47 |
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| Flandry | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_i386/libpoppler-qt4-dev/0.12.2-2maemo0/ | 01:48 |
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| opdf2 | midas_: I love that holder. If you pair it with their car specific mount, it is such a clean look | 01:51 |
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| astruasdh | please, guys. I would like to backup the whole original disk to recover it in case of some mistake | 01:57 |
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| astruasdh | how can I do this? Is it possible to open n900 eh put the disk in a normal pc? | 01:57 |
| astruasdh | s/eh/and | 01:57 |
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| MohammadAG | / ? | 01:58 |
| jacekowski | no | 01:58 |
| Flandry | em disk? | 01:58 |
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| MohammadAG | the 32GB MMC can be easily backed up | 01:58 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: you can always restore it | 01:58 |
| MohammadAG | just plug the usb port in | 01:58 |
| MohammadAG | and /opt can be copied to an ext2/3 card | 01:59 |
| MohammadAG | useless if you erase / | 01:59 |
| Flandry | Also the backup app handles app data | 01:59 |
| jacekowski | besides, have they fixed non vfat card support? | 01:59 |
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| jacekowski | or is it still hardcoded to vfat? | 01:59 |
| astruasdh | I wanna backup the maemo itself, in order to restore the whole / | 01:59 |
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| astruasdh | dd if=/dev/disk of=backup | 01:59 |
| astruasdh | something like this | 01:59 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: go to tablets-dev | 01:59 |
| MohammadAG | not possible, easily | 02:00 |
| jacekowski | http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/ | 02:00 |
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| MohammadAG | jacekowski, he wants a full rootfs backup, that doesn't help | 02:00 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: and type your imei | 02:00 |
| Flandry | easier to backup data and reflash if needed | 02:00 |
| MohammadAG | actually | 02:00 |
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| MohammadAG | dd worked for me | 02:00 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: it will give you all images required for it | 02:00 |
| MohammadAG | but the image was f'd up | 02:00 |
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| MohammadAG | so it stopped at 50 percent or so | 02:00 |
| cure` | don't forget to backup contacts, cause i have, it was painfull | 02:00 |
| MohammadAG | you'll need to do it outside maemo | 02:01 |
| astruasdh | there is also another problem: to recover | 02:01 |
| MohammadAG | using another OS | 02:01 |
| jacekowski | MohammadAG: never use dd on rw mounted fs | 02:01 |
| MohammadAG | flasher-3.5 -r imageyoumadeusingdd -f | 02:01 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, you didn't see what i wrote | 02:01 |
| astruasdh | if you dd inside a running maemo, and the crash makes you unable to boot maemo, it will be impossible to recover | 02:01 |
| MohammadAG | I said you have to use another os | 02:01 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: that's why you have flasher | 02:01 |
| MohammadAG | /dev/mtd5 can be recovered | 02:02 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: and you flash it using original os images over usb | 02:02 |
| astruasdh | and how i will recover? | 02:02 |
| astruasdh | through usb? | 02:02 |
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| jacekowski | yes | 02:02 |
| MohammadAG | ~flashing | 02:02 |
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| infobot | somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 02:02 |
| astruasdh | usb give me full access to the disk!?!?!? | 02:02 |
| MohammadAG | no... | 02:02 |
| astruasdh | so usb does not solve my problem | 02:02 |
| MohammadAG | I said you need to use dd outside of maemo for that | 02:02 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: yes | 02:02 |
| Flandry | lol | 02:02 |
| MohammadAG | install fedora or something | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | ya | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | of course | 02:03 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: usb will give you full access to disk | 02:03 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, he can't backup rootfs over usb | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | dd outside maemo | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | gor it | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | but how can I acccess the n900's disk outside maaemo? | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | that is my question | 02:03 |
| MohammadAG | fedora | 02:03 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: from bootloader | 02:03 |
| astruasdh | if I can plut the flash in my notebook, I can easily backup | 02:03 |
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| MohammadAG | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/Fedora | 02:03 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: you don't have to back it up | 02:03 |
| MohammadAG | if i remembered the url correctly | 02:03 |
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| jacekowski | astruasdh: everything required to recover completly wiped phones is on tablets-dev website | 02:04 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, some people find redownloading + restoring one pain in the arse | 02:04 |
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| MohammadAG | dd'ing /dev/mtd5 to some image would be easier & faster | 02:04 |
| astruasdh | jacekowski, why not??? if I wanna remove all the / and install my own linux distro, for example... I need to recover it later in case of some trouble | 02:04 |
| astruasdh | I want /dev/mtd is it possible? | 02:05 |
| MohammadAG | you can't install a distro to / afaik | 02:05 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: then you do it using flasher | 02:05 |
| astruasdh | to backup yes... but how do recover? | 02:05 |
| MohammadAG | no.. | 02:05 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: flasher | 02:05 |
| astruasdh | I can damage even the bootloader | 02:05 |
| MohammadAG | to resotre you use flasher | 02:05 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: you can't | 02:05 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, you're missing something | 02:05 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: bootloader can't be broken | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | he can erase /dev/mtd0 and f up his device | 02:06 |
| astruasdh | dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mtd bs=512 count=1 | 02:06 |
| astruasdh | this will erase the bootloader | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | excuse my spam | 02:06 |
| astruasdh | and now? how to recover in such a scenario? | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | dev: size erasesize name | 02:06 |
| jacekowski | flasher | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd0: 00020000 00020000 "bootloader" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd1: 00060000 00020000 "config" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd2: 00040000 00020000 "log" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd3: 00200000 00020000 "kernel" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd4: 00200000 00020000 "initfs" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | mtd5: 0fb40000 00020000 "rootfs" | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | erase mtd0, and you're f'd | 02:06 |
| jacekowski | is it writable? | 02:06 |
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| MohammadAG | why wouldn't it be | 02:06 |
| MohammadAG | anyways i don't have experience with serial ports or jTag | 02:07 |
| MohammadAG | so I'm not going to try it | 02:07 |
| MohammadAG | and flasher can't backup | 02:07 |
| MohammadAG | it can only restore | 02:07 |
| jacekowski | according to google | 02:09 |
| astruasdh | i understood nothing hehe. my question is: can I plug the flash directly in my notebook to dd if=/dev/nokia_flash of=backup? | 02:09 |
| jacekowski | you can't fuck up bootloader | 02:09 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yeah, how to RRALLY brick N900 | 02:09 |
| astruasdh | why not? is it a read only memory? | 02:09 |
| jacekowski | it's in mask rom of cpu | 02:09 |
| MohammadAG | b-man fucked up his bootloader | 02:09 |
| MohammadAG | on the N800 | 02:10 |
| astruasdh | if it was a writable memory, it is easy to fuck bootloader with dd hehe | 02:10 |
| MohammadAG | i doubt it was 'fixed' in the N900 | 02:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | jacekowski: uh? why not? | 02:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | jacekowski: for sure not | 02:10 |
| jacekowski | hmm | 02:11 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer51: accorging to google messing up with mtd0 will not brick device | 02:11 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, dd if/dev/0 (change it) of=/evd/mdt0 | 02:11 |
| jacekowski | you can reflash it after that | 02:11 |
| MohammadAG | i crippled the command | 02:11 |
| jacekowski | but | 02:11 |
| jacekowski | mtd1 will brick it | 02:11 |
| astruasdh | I will install my own Debian through the same easy-chroot technique... and I'm afraid to fuck something | 02:11 |
| MohammadAG | on purpose | 02:11 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | jacekowski: maybe no sure ther is a mini bootloader to work over TTY(!) | 02:12 |
| MohammadAG | my point stands, the N900 is brickable | 02:12 |
| jacekowski | hmm | 02:12 |
| jacekowski | how evil would that be | 02:13 |
| MohammadAG | if you erase the bootloader i doubt you can even tty | 02:13 |
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| jacekowski | i could just add some bricking code to chromium package | 02:13 |
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| MohammadAG | flashing using serial should work though | 02:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | MohammadAG: YOU can't - *I* can | 02:13 |
| jacekowski | before it would get taken down at least 100s of phones would be bricked | 02:13 |
| MohammadAG | jacekowski, you need R&D mode afaik | 02:13 |
| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: no, you don't - just to be root | 02:13 |
| SpeedEvil | dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mtd0 is the nice way | 02:14 |
| MohammadAG | err | 02:14 |
| MohammadAG | i recall DocScrutinizer51 telling me NOT to post commands like that here | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | moo SpeedEvil | 02:14 |
| SpeedEvil | well - probably a bad idea | 02:14 |
| SpeedEvil | don't do that | 02:14 |
| jacekowski | hmm, i can create small package called Brick with description - this will brick your device | 02:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yep | 02:14 |
| MohammadAG | see above, where i crippled the command :) | 02:14 |
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| SpeedEvil | You can also set the battery voltage to 4.44V - which probably won't make it explode. | 02:15 |
| astruasdh | with dd is easy to fuck what you need and is writable | 02:15 |
| SpeedEvil | And instantly kill stuff by overvoltaging it | 02:15 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | please create no c+p fatality option | 02:15 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah | 02:15 |
| * SpeedEvil erases the above line with dd. | 02:16 | |
| * SpeedEvil passes round the tippex. | 02:16 | |
| jacekowski | c+p? | 02:16 |
| jacekowski | child + porn? | 02:16 |
| SpeedEvil | No. | 02:16 |
| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 02:16 | |
| MohammadAG | copy and paste you perv :P | 02:16 |
| astruasdh | haha | 02:16 |
| * SpeedEvil hits jacekowski with 4chan. | 02:16 | |
| pigeon | is msn butterfly or haze better? | 02:17 |
| astruasdh | fbi will jail all of u hehe | 02:17 |
| jacekowski | my experience with internet tells me to assume the worst | 02:17 |
| pigeon | been using butterfly, and seems there is a bug where my own messages not showing up in the ui are being sent | 02:17 |
| pigeon | seems to happen if the message is quite short | 02:18 |
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| jacekowski | astruasdh: i'm not under fbi jurisdiction | 02:18 |
| astruasdh | neither do i hehe. so we can talk safely about c+p "dark" meaning :P | 02:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | jacekowski: happy awakening when the black heli lands in your garden :-P | 02:20 |
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| jacekowski | shit | 02:20 |
| jacekowski | since when i have garden? | 02:20 |
| astruasdh | haha | 02:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | they will bring one | 02:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | and drop it prior to landing | 02:21 |
| jacekowski | i can hide under it | 02:21 |
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| jacekowski | solution! | 02:21 |
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| smoku | Damn... Playing Dune2 on N900 is addictive... I rally should go to sleep :/ | 02:36 |
| pigeon | hmm | 02:37 |
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| Macer | ok seriously | 02:48 |
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| Macer | is there some other devel repo i should be using with 1.2? | 02:48 |
| Macer | the one on repositories.maemo.org isnt working | 02:48 |
| cehteh | isnt working means? | 02:48 |
| astruasdh | hey guys. I'm trying debootstrap to install a new arm debian in my x86 notebook. The idea is to put such an image in the n900 to use the easy-chroot | 02:48 |
| cehteh | (works for me) | 02:48 |
| Macer | means 404 not found | 02:48 |
| astruasdh | have any of u done that? | 02:49 |
| Macer | cehteh: you just chose install from repositories.maemo.org and it works? | 02:49 |
| cehteh | astruasdh: you want some emulator (like the scratchbox based sdk) | 02:49 |
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| cehteh | Macer: i have it registered since ages | 02:49 |
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| Macer | i keep getting 404 errors from app manager | 02:50 |
| cehteh | Nokia-N900:~# grep extras-devel /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 02:50 |
| cehteh | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel fremantle free non-free | 02:50 |
| astruasdh | ceesco, with debootstrap, as I read, it is possible to install a cross-platform debian | 02:51 |
| Macer | Err http://repository.maemo.org fremantle-1.2/non-free Packages 404 Not Found [IP: 198.63.203.27 80] | 02:51 |
| astruasdh | I'm trying it now | 02:51 |
| cehteh | maybe its down now? | 02:51 |
| cehteh | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras/ fremantle-1.2 free non-free | 02:51 |
| Macer | for 2 days? | 02:51 |
| Macer | ;) | 02:51 |
| cehteh | whats the line in your sources.list file? | 02:51 |
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| cehteh | see the grep above | 02:52 |
| Macer | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ fremantle-1.2 free non-free | 02:53 |
| Macer | hm | 02:53 |
| Macer | -1.2 | 02:53 |
| MohammadAG51 | remove it | 02:53 |
| w00t_ | (very) long shot, I can't find anything at all on this.. but does anyone know how to change the virtual keyboard plugin used, relating to hildon-input-method? | 02:53 |
| MohammadAG51 | devel has no -1.2 specific dir | 02:53 |
| Macer | it doesnt have that in app manager as a component | 02:54 |
| MohammadAG51 | w00t_, check the pre-PR1.1 hack to see which files it uses | 02:54 |
| Macer | i can do it manually i suppose | 02:54 |
| w00t_ | MohammadAG51: this is news to me, so :P | 02:54 |
| cehteh | Macer: i read something that the / at the end makes a difference | 02:54 |
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| SpeedEvil | w00t_: htere was a thread on tmo as of about a week ago that diddn't have positive resulyts yet | 02:54 |
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| w00t_ | SpeedEvil: mind digging it up for me? | 02:55 |
| cehteh | all my repos work | 02:55 |
| w00t_ | (if it's not possible, ignore) | 02:55 |
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| SpeedEvil | umm | 02:56 |
| * SpeedEvil ponders the awesomeba | 02:56 | |
| SpeedEvil | r | 02:56 |
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| w00t_ | hmm.. | 02:57 |
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| w00t_ | there is a gconf key, /apps/osso/inputmethod/input_method_plugin.. | 02:57 |
| w00t_ | but apparantly that's for stylus stuff, on googling further | 02:57 |
| SpeedEvil | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=40619&page=2 | 02:58 |
| w00t_ | (because that name of course makes me think it's stylus related.) | 02:58 |
| * MohammadAG wonders if his reply to w00t_ went through | 02:58 | |
| MohammadAG | battery went dry | 02:58 |
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| w00t_ | MohammadAG51: you mentioned an old hack, i said i didn't know of it | 02:58 |
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| Macer | cehteh: no.it keeps adding -1.2 to it | 02:58 |
| MohammadAG51 | power search | 02:58 |
| Macer | in application manager | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~botsnack | 02:58 |
| infobot | thanks, DocScrutinizer51 | 02:58 |
| MohammadAG51 | and use hildon-im-recache | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | hahh | 02:58 |
| cehteh | Macer: i saied the / .. the -1.2 here works for me | 02:59 |
| Macer | where does application manager get its sources.list? | 02:59 |
| cehteh | i updated half an hour ago or so, lemme try now | 02:59 |
| Macer | the trailing / ? | 02:59 |
| summel | there is a regression in the application manager :O | 03:00 |
| Macer | http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ | 03:00 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~nuke | 03:00 |
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| infobot | Cockroach. I win. | 03:00 |
| summel | in 1.1 you could change how the apps get sortet in 1.2 you cant oO | 03:00 |
| Macer | that is what i have for the address | 03:00 |
| cehteh | ah mine has no -1.2 for the extras-devel | 03:00 |
| summel | i want the apps get ordered by name again ;_; | 03:00 |
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| cehteh | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel fremantle free non-free | 03:00 |
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| cehteh | exactly like that works for me | 03:00 |
| Macer | cehteh: well. application manager is getting it from somewhere | 03:00 |
| cehteh | yeah i added mine long ago | 03:01 |
| Macer | Nokia-N900:/etc/apt# cat sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 03:01 |
| Macer | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ fremantle-1.2 free non-free | 03:01 |
| cehteh | dont paste that all here :) | 03:01 |
| vi_emacs | someone else mentioned app manager sorting order being inverted. it should be investigated | 03:01 |
| cehteh | want my list? | 03:01 |
| vi_emacs | damn nick | 03:01 |
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| Macer | i dont know why the 1.2 keeps coming back | 03:01 |
| Macer | i tried to remove it manually | 03:02 |
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| Macer | with vi | 03:02 |
| cehteh | no idea :) | 03:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | church of vim | 03:02 |
| cehteh | prolly the app-manager keeps it in gconf or somewhere else too | 03:02 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | worse than scientology | 03:02 |
| cehteh | hail emacs | 03:03 |
| lcuk | indeed doc | 03:03 |
| w00t_ | aha! | 03:03 |
| w00t_ | /apps/osso/inputmethod/default-plugins/ looks useful | 03:03 |
| Macer | gconf? | 03:03 |
| Macer | wtf | 03:03 |
| * w00t_ toys | 03:03 | |
| Macer | :) | 03:03 |
| Macer | let me add it manually | 03:03 |
| cehteh | just a guess :) | 03:03 |
| jaska | hail vim \o/ | 03:04 |
| Flandry | all over the place are we | 03:04 |
| lcuk | cehteh what order is it in | 03:04 |
| cure` | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=692718#post692718 :(( | 03:05 |
| lcuk | and did you used to mess with the sort order in previous 1.1 system | 03:05 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | well I heard there are guys who say all raytracers are evil and they prefer coding RGB for each voxel by hand ;-P | 03:05 |
| Macer | hm | 03:06 |
| cehteh | http://lumiera.pastebin.ca/1875129 | 03:06 |
| cehteh | that works for me | 03:06 |
| Macer | adding it manually seems to have worked | 03:06 |
| w00t_ | how very intuitive, it ignored the setting for 'finger', 'stylus' seems to have worked | 03:06 |
| w00t_ | now.. why is my vkb not working | 03:06 |
| Macer | someone needs to fix the install link on maemo.org maybe? | 03:07 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | becauseof leading V? | 03:07 |
| lcuk | cure did you reboot after dwapping folder | 03:07 |
| cure` | yes | 03:07 |
| cure` | every time | 03:07 |
| lcuk | mm | 03:07 |
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| * w00t_ headdesks | 03:08 | |
| w00t_ | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4730 | 03:08 |
| povbot` | Bug 4730: hildon_im_ui_button_set_active() undefined. | 03:08 |
| w00t_ | now why do I have old example code. | 03:08 |
| Hamoor | hi everyone....i just bought my n900 3 days ago...i want to know how can i add a contact to the desktop | 03:08 |
| lcuk | cos its bank holiday monday w00t | 03:08 |
| cure` | it just doesnt seem to eat the 1.1 db | 03:08 |
| w00t_ | no, it is now tuesday | 03:08 |
| w00t_ | and I wasn't on holiday anyway, saving it for later :-P | 03:08 |
| lcuk | hamoor click the edit desktop nobble then click the menu and select add contact | 03:09 |
| * lcuk is on holiday | 03:09 | |
| lcuk | but i cant sleep | 03:09 |
| Macer | awesome | 03:10 |
| Macer | devel is working again | 03:10 |
| astruasdh | cehteh, done. with debootstrap I installed a fresh Debian in an image for arm arch. Now I need to chroot in such an image in the arm machine (n900) and run /debootstrap/debootstrap --seconnd-strage to finish the instalation | 03:10 |
| Macer | now i can get openarena going again heh | 03:10 |
| Hamoor | lol that was too easy....thanks lcuk :D | 03:10 |
| astruasdh | cehteh, this way I have my own Debian image to use with easy-chroot | 03:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | damn, we got the better TV (PAL) we got the better 2G (GSM GPRS) and for 3G we adopt the battery eating BS from the losers | 03:11 |
| lcuk | \o hamoor if only all issues were as simple. hope you are enjoying device | 03:11 |
| Macer | DocScrutinizer: huh? | 03:11 |
| cehteh | i have ext3 everywhere also considering to chroot the easy-debian instead using this file image, but currently i dont even have it installed | 03:11 |
| Macer | better tv? haha | 03:11 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | WCDMA | 03:11 |
| Macer | isnt the difference between ntsc and pal like... 2 scanlines? | 03:11 |
| Macer | :) | 03:12 |
| Hamoor | yep very much :) | 03:12 |
| cehteh | hah | 03:12 |
| lcuk | w00t_ can you open a pm window i cant see how using keyboard only | 03:12 |
| w00t_ | sure | 03:12 |
| cehteh | no there are major diferences | 03:12 |
| cehteh | completely different color signals | 03:12 |
| SpeedEvil | Macer: no, it's fairly major | 03:12 |
| SpeedEvil | Macer: The colour subcarrier is completely different | 03:12 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Macer: nah. gues why NTSC means 'never twice same color" | 03:12 |
| Macer | lcuk: code bt keyboard support into the settings app | 03:12 |
| cehteh | other framerate .. and different resolution | 03:12 |
| SpeedEvil | Macer: the bandwidths are similar | 03:12 |
| astruasdh | cehteh, I have a brand new n900. I installed just 1 app: the flash light | 03:12 |
| SpeedEvil | I installed catorise. | 03:13 |
| Macer | not a major difference in frame rate either i thought | 03:13 |
| SpeedEvil | I have filled the /opt | 03:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Macer: 50 vs 60 half-frames | 03:13 |
| SpeedEvil | /s | 03:13 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | btw even the scanlines are +100 | 03:13 |
| lcuk | macer 900 and not knowing irc doesnt matter often enough | 03:13 |
| cehteh | pal is 50 fields per second, ntsc is almost (by a odd margin) 60 | 03:14 |
| Macer | lcuk: huh? | 03:14 |
| Macer | i need it for openoffice :) | 03:14 |
| cehteh | (not exactly 60 because of historic rasins) | 03:14 |
| Macer | and build a cups pkg while youre at it | 03:14 |
| * Macer finishes his list to santa lcuk | 03:14 | |
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| cehteh | color subsampling in ntsc and pal are also different | 03:15 |
| Macer | i dont count interlaced as 60 | 03:15 |
| Macer | 60 half frames is misleading | 03:16 |
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| astruasdh | I'm really a bit afraid of having malwares in extra softwares, like the flashlight. what do u think? | 03:16 |
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| Macer | the led flashlight is great | 03:16 |
| Macer | heh | 03:16 |
| lcuk | lolmacer | 03:16 |
| Macer | :) | 03:17 |
| Macer | well.. it is | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Macer: I suggest wikipedia | 03:17 |
| Macer | it is bright as hell and not just some white screen | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | 60 half frames / s is absolutely correct for ntsc | 03:18 |
| lcuk | macer sure but it doesnt work on my 810 ;) | 03:18 |
| astruasdh | ya, it is very nice! I don't know if it can, in some way, fuck the leds that ware concepted to be used sometimes as a flash | 03:18 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: no, it's not | 03:18 |
| Macer | lcuk: you dont have an n900? | 03:18 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: it's 59.9998 or something | 03:18 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: there is led controller that limits current | 03:18 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | okokokok | 03:18 |
| SpeedEvil | It's to make the colour subcarrier lineup or something | 03:18 |
| Macer | haha | 03:18 |
| lcuk | i have more than 1 device liqbase was born on my 810 and initially optimised for it | 03:18 |
| astruasdh | jacekowski, so can I safely use the flashlightr? | 03:19 |
| Macer | lcuk: make glesliqbase :-P | 03:19 |
| Macer | quit clinging onto the past | 03:19 |
| lcuk | would be slower | 03:19 |
| Macer | liar! | 03:19 |
| Macer | :) | 03:19 |
| lcuk | no i aint | 03:19 |
| Macer | then ditch liqbase | 03:19 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: yes | 03:19 |
| Macer | and make hw accdelerated stuff | 03:20 |
| Macer | like normal people | 03:20 |
| astruasdh | jacekowski, can I get flashlight code somewhere? | 03:20 |
| lcuk | what do you think ive been doing for last few months. working directly on fremantle | 03:20 |
| Macer | :) | 03:20 |
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| Macer | oh | 03:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | now totally screwed crap | 03:20 |
| Macer | ok.. my bad :) | 03:20 |
| lcuk | :) | 03:20 |
| SpeedEvil | astruasdh: you can setup the 'extras' repository, and install lots of stuff. | 03:20 |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: 60000/1001 Hz :) | 03:20 |
| SpeedEvil | astruasdh: and yes, it's safe | 03:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | omfg | 03:21 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | us nerds | 03:21 |
| Macer | then make a 3D portrait stretching to landscape with scaling icons desktop! | 03:21 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: yes | 03:21 |
| jacekowski | astruasdh: repository | 03:21 |
| * Macer hides | 03:21 | |
| Macer | with compositing | 03:21 |
| cehteh | important when you program video software :P | 03:21 |
| Macer | :) | 03:21 |
| cehteh | you dont want to drift your fames out of time | 03:22 |
| lcuk | macer you mean like my beyond portait but in something else? | 03:22 |
| astruasdh | are extra apps verified by maemo team? | 03:22 |
| Macer | beyond portrait? | 03:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | yes | 03:22 |
| jacekowski | no | 03:22 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | so WHY T* F* we adopted UMTS wich is that loserms stuff of wcdma? | 03:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | 10 times, QA team | 03:22 |
| lcuk | if maemo team == community, then yeah | 03:22 |
| Macer | whats that? | 03:22 |
| lcuk | which we are the maemo team | 03:22 |
| jacekowski | lcuk: nobody found anything in chromium so far | 03:23 |
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| jacekowski | lcuk: so i wouldn't leave QA to community | 03:23 |
| Macer | lcuk: whats beyond portrait? the rotating liq based thing ? | 03:23 |
| cehteh | When NTSC color was introduced in 1953, the older rate of 60 fields per second was reduced by a factor of 1000/1001 to avoid interference between the chroma subcarrier and the broadcast sound carrier. | 03:23 |
| lcuk | yeah | 03:23 |
| Macer | that was pretty neat | 03:23 |
| astruasdh | I'm asking this because, if anyone can put apps in extra, it will be easy to have some malwares there | 03:23 |
| cehteh | :) | 03:23 |
| SpeedEvil | extras apps are usually open-source. | 03:23 |
| Macer | you working on making it the new maemo desktop? | 03:23 |
| lcuk | jace then test it and find problems | 03:24 |
| summel | oh... i just lost "the game" | 03:24 |
| jacekowski | cehteh: but ntsc uses something strange like 23.9something fps | 03:24 |
| Macer | that would be so awesome | 03:24 |
| SpeedEvil | They have to be checked by 10 people for functionality and stuff, then there has to be a 10 day delay, and then they go into extras. | 03:24 |
| SpeedEvil | There is however no formal code review. | 03:24 |
| Macer | rotating icons that always stay upright | 03:24 |
| cehteh | jacekowski: nope that what i saied above 60000/1001 | 03:24 |
| * lcuk sleeps anyway | 03:24 | |
| SpeedEvil | So if someone chooses to put malware in, they can. | 03:24 |
| SpeedEvil | much like with apple, or android. | 03:24 |
| lcuk | i only wanted to idle rly | 03:24 |
| Macer | haha | 03:24 |
| lcuk | gnite | 03:24 |
| astruasdh | hmmm | 03:24 |
| Macer | good night lcuk | 03:24 |
| Macer | although | 03:24 |
| SpeedEvil | night. | 03:25 |
| Macer | sleep is a crutch | 03:25 |
| Macer | :) | 03:25 |
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| astruasdh | SpeedEvil, should I avoid installing extra apps because of malwares? | 03:25 |
| * SpeedEvil grabs his crutch. | 03:25 | |
| Macer | haha | 03:25 |
| MohammadAG51 | malwares in the main repo? | 03:25 |
| Macer | it is 7pm here | 03:25 |
| SpeedEvil | astruasdh: I have never had any issues with any malware - nor as far as I'm aware has anyone. | 03:25 |
| cehteh | MohammadAG51: non-intentional malware :) .. looking at how much things there dont work :) | 03:26 |
| MohammadAG51 | the apps pass a 10 vote QA and a 10 day quarintine, which frals thinks should be longer | 03:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~hail cehteh | 03:26 |
| * infobot bows down to cehteh and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!" | 03:26 | |
| SpeedEvil | Oh - cehteh. | 03:26 |
| SpeedEvil | That reminds me. | 03:26 |
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| SpeedEvil | how do I get my xchat hildon banners back | 03:26 |
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| cehteh | huh? | 03:26 |
| cehteh | how did you lost them? | 03:27 |
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| Macer | dosbox? haha | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | I upgraded I think | 03:27 |
| cehteh | i mean i reflashed my device and still have them | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | or reinstalled | 03:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: was that a ETAB, meant to rst38 ? | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | hmm | 03:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | hildon banners? | 03:27 |
| * SpeedEvil ponders | 03:27 | |
| Macer | do people still use actual ms-dos? | 03:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | top bar? | 03:27 |
| astruasdh | ty, guys :) | 03:27 |
| MohammadAG51 | ctrl enter | 03:27 |
| jacekowski | Macer: yes | 03:27 |
| Macer | other than the win "shell" ? | 03:27 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: cehteh made a hildon-banner thing that works with xchat | 03:27 |
| jacekowski | Macer: i encountered some PLCs that run dos | 03:27 |
| Macer | wow | 03:27 |
| jacekowski | Macer: and some of these are not so old | 03:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | ooh, my fault | 03:27 |
| cehteh | SpeedEvil: cat /home/user/.xchat2/maemo_notify.conf | 03:27 |
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| MohammadAG51 | oh | 03:28 |
| Macer | jacekowski: that is amazing | 03:28 |
| MohammadAG51 | those banners | 03:28 |
| cehteh | VIBRA_PATTERN PatternIRCMessage | 03:28 |
| cehteh | NOTIFY_MODE +bvld | 03:28 |
| cehteh | DIALOG_THROTTLE 2 1800 | 03:28 |
| jacekowski | Macer: well, it's same reason why space shuttle flies on 40years old operating system and 40yo computer | 03:28 |
| cehteh | pick what you want from there :) | 03:28 |
| Macer | jacekowski: why is that? | 03:28 |
| jacekowski | Macer: because it's been tested and every fault has been fixed | 03:28 |
| Macer | ah | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | cat: can't open '/home/user/.xchat2/maemo_notify.conf': No such file or directory | 03:28 |
| astruasdh | cya | 03:28 |
| Macer | fair enough | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | that'll do it | 03:28 |
| jacekowski | Macer: new platform == repeating all QA process | 03:28 |
| astruasdh | ty all | 03:28 |
| Macer | jacekowski: i am sure a software bug on a space shuttle would be a little bit of a big deal | 03:29 |
| SpeedEvil | Macer: There are 5 computers - and 2 different software stacks. | 03:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~/.xchat2 $ ls -l notify.sh | 03:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | -rwxr--r-- 1 user users 180 Dec 18 15:42 notify.sh | 03:29 |
| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: not on space shuttle | 03:29 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: For the flight-control - yes | 03:30 |
| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: there is one computer and one software | 03:30 |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: still using your old stuff? | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~/.xchat2 $ cat notify.sh | 03:30 |
| cehteh | mine is in upstream since ages | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | #!/bin/sh | 03:30 |
| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: aircrafts do it like that | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | play-sound $1 | 03:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dbus-send --print-reply --system --dest=com.nokia.mce /com/nokia/mce/request com.nokia.mce.request.req_vibrator_pattern_activate string:PatternChatAndEmail | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | you bet I do | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | it JUST WORKS | 03:30 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: There are multiple redundant flight control computers. And in use they have actually failed in flight, and done the redundancy thing. | 03:30 |
| cehteh | well it had isses :) | 03:30 |
| SpeedEvil | http://klabs.org/DEI/Processor/shuttle/ | 03:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | AND I bet it's smaller than calling any friggin libs and whatnot natively | 03:31 |
| cehteh | SpeedEvil: i posted some kindof documentation ages ago on tmo | 03:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | what's tmo ? ;-P | 03:32 |
| jacekowski | t-mobile | 03:32 |
| jacekowski | or talk.maemo.org | 03:32 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: | 03:32 |
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| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: 11.5k well :) .. guess its not optimized for size anymore, i had it smaller once | 03:33 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: yeah - 5 computers - one quad redundant, and a backup | 03:33 |
| SpeedEvil | http://klabs.org/images/shuttle/shuttle_board_kevin.jpg | 03:34 |
| SpeedEvil | oldskool | 03:34 |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: but when you didnt disabled it explicitly its loaded in your xchat too since its default for quite some time now :P | 03:34 |
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| Macer | why is dosbox under games? | 03:35 |
| Macer | heh | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: that's why I don't do any more updates to xchat. Don't want my precious ram crammed with useless shit (no offense) | 03:35 |
| cehteh | haha | 03:35 |
| cehteh | really i was very careful to make it small | 03:36 |
| cehteh | starting your script will require far more memory | 03:36 |
| cehteh | (and resources/cpu in general) | 03:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | for the moment it's executed - granted you're right it takes quite some ram | 03:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | but that ram is freed after 0.5s | 03:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | while your addon adds 11k of resident ram usage | 03:38 |
| * cehteh doesnt think 11k are really a problem .. | 03:38 | |
| SpeedEvil | 11k... | 03:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Look at the stupid clock | 03:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I don't see the advantage when I already got that notify.sh file. | 03:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | if I had to invent it, I'd say "so what?" | 03:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's just 11k | 03:39 |
| MohammadAG51 | Night | 03:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | but I stopped updating xchat when there was that crap of every highlight popping up a notification I had to click to make it vanish - that's actually mega BS | 03:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I liked that | 03:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | now I'm so happy with what I have on xchat, and I couldn't bother less to update, given all the 'goodies' it would buy me | 03:41 |
| cehteh | haha you can disable it in the config | 03:41 |
| * SpeedEvil wonders why DSME is using _7_ meg | 03:41 | |
| SpeedEvil | Does it do more than be a simple watchdog? | 03:41 |
| cehteh | i just turned on all bells and whistles by default to make users available of the features | 03:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: why should I? just won't update | 03:42 |
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| DocScrutinizer | 5 clocks less | 03:42 |
| cehteh | yeah be happy | 03:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | clicks even | 03:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: sounds insane | 03:43 |
| SpeedEvil | wfm | 03:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~wtf wfm | 03:43 |
| infobot | WFM: works for me | 03:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | ugh | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | 7MB wfm?? o.O | 03:44 |
| SpeedEvil | ? | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil wonders why DSME is using _7_ meg | 03:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | Oh | 03:45 |
| SpeedEvil | I thought (01:43:12 AM) DocScrutinizer: SpeedEvil: sounds insane was WRT the notification | 03:46 |
| cehteh | SpeedEvil: does the notify work now? .. not that when you want vibration and copied my config you have to configure PatternIRCMessage (by default it uses some standard vibra pattern) | 03:46 |
| SpeedEvil | cehteh: I missed that - no I haven't done - what config? | 03:47 |
| cehteh | what i pasted above | 03:48 |
| SpeedEvil | ah - sorry - missed it | 03:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | the all capitals stuff I refused to look at, I guess | 03:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | [2010-06-01 02:27:57] <cehteh> SpeedEvil: cat /home/user/.xchat2/maemo_notify.conf | 03:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | [2010-06-01 02:28:13] <cehteh> VIBRA_PATTERN PatternIRCMessage | 03:49 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - I saw that now | 03:49 |
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| * SpeedEvil pokes N900evil | 03:50 | |
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| cehteh | http://lumiera.pastebin.ca/1875149 in lack of doc, read the source | 03:50 |
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| SpeedEvil | :) | 03:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Thanks | 03:51 |
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| cehteh | the first 6 are actually commands you can use from scripts if you care (i just used them for testing) | 03:51 |
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| * DocScrutinizer edits notify.sh slightly, and selects im_notify.wav%sppedevil for audio to playback on a certain event, to get a different VIBRA_PATTERN whenever he likes :-P | 03:52 | |
| cehteh | haha | 03:53 |
| * cehteh was thinking about regex on events but i want to keep it small | 03:54 | |
| DocScrutinizer | takes me 2 minutes and a smile | 03:54 |
| cehteh | and another megabyte :P | 03:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | lol, never | 03:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer | maybe 200bytes | 03:55 |
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| cehteh | yet alone the .wav is biggier | 03:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy#Mike_Gancarz:_The_UNIX_Philosophy | 03:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | and the .wav is there anyway | 03:58 |
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| cehteh | how about writing some shell script around telnet to make an irc client instead xchat? :) | 04:07 |
| cehteh | actually i have a irc client in shell somewhere | 04:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: I bet you're too late with your idea | 04:09 |
| cehteh | yeah i fetched it somewhere from the internet | 04:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | but I prefer xchat, for the GUI | 04:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer | and as I suppose your notifications are nicely integrated into xchat's settings, it is a perfectly sensible approach | 04:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer | it would be rather insane to try and edit the notify.sh to meet the settings in xchat | 04:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | and probably even take more prgram text to implement it | 04:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yet if the code was segmented and would load the needed segment containing the notification bits just in case you selected any of the notify stuff in xchat setup, that would even more please me | 04:13 |
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| matthew- | hmmm | 04:20 |
| matthew- | do you think it's possible to use the n900 as a camera | 04:20 |
| Termana | good morning | 04:20 |
| matthew- | i mean video camera connected to my mac | 04:20 |
| matthew- | ? | 04:20 |
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| PHiZiK | as a webcam? | 04:22 |
| matthew- | yeah | 04:22 |
| PHiZiK | yeah i dunno | 04:22 |
| Hydroxide | hi... is there an IRC channel where I can contact someone about evopedia? I would like to use evopedia to view an offline copy of another mediawiki wiki that isn't a wikipedia language. (actually it's from jimmy wales's wikia site) | 04:23 |
| Hydroxide | asking here since evopedia.info seems like it's maemo-focused | 04:23 |
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| DocScrutinizer | matthew-: N900 uses quite standard means to handle video streams (v4l...) So the questions is just "can your mac use the N900's cam?" | 04:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | I bet vlc on mac can use the camera on N900 easily | 04:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | but I dunno if there's such a thing like vlc on mac | 04:30 |
| matthew- | DocScrutinizer: there is VLC | 04:30 |
| matthew- | but i mean, how to connect it? via usb? and then i would have to install the drivers somehow ? | 04:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | you don't need any drivers, if you use e.g gstreamer | 04:31 |
| matthew- | No I dont, but I can | 04:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | the drivers are inside N900 already. N900 is a fullsize linux system | 04:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | think of N900 as a ethernet camera, not a usb webcam | 04:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Or someone could write a USB gadget driver | 04:33 |
| SpeedEvil | so it would look like a USB webcam | 04:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, but how ugly and useless that effort | 04:33 |
| matthew- | DocScrutinizer: Ok, so the question is, how | 04:34 |
| SpeedEvil | Or 'how would you stream a random linux boxes webcam to your mac' | 04:35 |
| matthew- | Yes | 04:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe the most simple way would be to have a NFS mount to N900 /dev | 04:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Doesn't work at all | 04:36 |
| SpeedEvil | the device nodes are local | 04:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | was a shoot from the hip | 04:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | gstreamer thru ssh | 04:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | RTP stream | 04:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | socat | 04:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | no idea, really. depends on the client app | 04:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess | 04:37 |
| matthew- | ok | 04:37 |
| matthew- | well the quality is far from what I want, so.. Just ignore it guys ;d | 04:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer | damn, the quality of the 5Mp cam is far from what you want. I bet that's true :-P | 04:38 |
| matthew- | DocScrutinizer: Well i jsut recorded something and emailed it to myself | 04:39 |
| matthew- | to check the quality | 04:39 |
| Macer | blah | 04:39 |
| asj | DocScrutinizer51: try mounting the N900 / to your system then to mke2fs /n900/here/dev/hda3 and see what happends ;) | 04:39 |
| pigeon | hmm, does anyone know which site has an rss feed of latest updated package? i remember seeing a list on the right hand side of a website, but i forgot what site it was? | 04:40 |
| matthew- | DocScrutinizer: and it's not about the Mps' i've got a panasonic hdc hs300eb-k with 3MP and well, it records in 1080i | 04:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | asj: I gues I won't do that | 04:40 |
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| asj | DocScrutinizer: it's a learning experiance ;) | 04:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | asj: I stopped learning for this week | 04:41 |
| * DocScrutinizer mumbles "remote scsii" | 04:42 | |
| DocScrutinizer | hey guys it's 3:42 AM here | 04:42 |
| luke-jr | prove it | 04:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | pigeon: sorry | 04:44 |
| pigeon | for what? | 04:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | no ideA | 04:44 |
| pigeon | DocScrutinizer: apology accepted then :) | 04:44 |
| luke-jr | matthew-: that *is* about MPs | 04:45 |
| * DocScrutinizer muses about luke-jr's general mindset. smells like nazi | 04:45 | |
| * pigeon is still waiting for the ovi store... | 04:46 | |
| luke-jr | matthew-: 1080i is never [much] more than 2 MP | 04:47 |
| luke-jr | so 5 MP should always be more than sufficient for 1080i (or 1080p for that matter) | 04:47 |
| luke-jr | though I have to wonder if N900's cam can really do 5 MP video | 04:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope it can't | 04:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | or it doesn't | 04:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess there's a bottleneck somewhere | 04:48 |
| luke-jr | "It is capable of video recording at up to 848 × 480 pixels at 25 fps." | 04:49 |
| luke-jr | mgiht as well use the front-side one | 04:50 |
| matthew- | well it looks crap ;d | 04:50 |
| matthew- | my mac web-cam records it better ;d | 04:50 |
| luke-jr | what's the difference between upstart and initng | 04:50 |
| luke-jr | I mean, besides the implementation | 04:50 |
| luke-jr | or is this just a case of Canonical not-invented-here syndrom? | 04:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | upstart is event driven | 04:51 |
| luke-jr | and initng isn't? | 04:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | or it should be, though the way it's usually used today doesn't put that property to purpose very much | 04:51 |
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| luke-jr | they look like they serve the same purpose, except initng remains compatible with existing init scripts to a degree | 04:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | initng just runs scripts one after the other | 04:52 |
| luke-jr | initng runs as much parallel as possible | 04:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | aiui | 04:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, but it doesn't handle dependencies | 04:52 |
| luke-jr | yes it does | 04:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | not like upstart does | 04:53 |
| luke-jr | no? | 04:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | I dunno initng any better than I know init-v | 04:54 |
| luke-jr | initng supports ServiceA being before/after/need/use ServiceB for dependency | 04:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | but init-v doesn't know about dependencies of one service finishing before you can start another, in the way upstart does | 04:54 |
| luke-jr | sysv != initng | 04:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | anyway the way upstart is usually used it doesn't really perform up to its best | 04:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's usually used as a replacement for init | 04:56 |
| luke-jr | and cron, apparently | 04:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | whatever. I remember upstart has a quite nice project homesite | 04:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I found it worth reading | 04:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer | hope it hasn't changed to the worse since I looked at it some 1..2 years ago | 04:59 |
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| pigeon | hmm, i'm using maemo-sdk-install-wizard_5.0.py to install the sdk, and for custom installation, why is the list of users for the sdk install doesn't include the one i want? | 05:01 |
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| pigeon | ah, great, it only shows >=1000 uid users. .. | 05:06 |
| pigeon | and i'm 500 | 05:06 |
| pigeon | ah, it uses /etc/adduser.conf, nice. | 05:10 |
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| microlith | can someone please go scorched earth on TMO? | 05:15 |
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| luke-jr | isn't that a 3D game? | 05:15 |
| microlith | no, it's a civil war tactic where everything was burnt to the ground | 05:16 |
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| mysoogals | hello guys, i have nokia 95, is there theora support for this mobile ? | 05:21 |
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| SpeedEvil | No. | 05:28 |
| SpeedEvil | Oh | 05:28 |
| SpeedEvil | I have no idea. | 05:28 |
| mysoogals | no support :( | 05:28 |
| SpeedEvil | I skipped the end of the question, as I was assuming youwere asking f you could maemo it. | 05:29 |
| mysoogals | i have real player in n95, why its not streaming 3gp video ? only asking to save | 05:29 |
| mysoogals | :( all these media players for mobiles asking to save video so sad | 05:29 |
| SpeedEvil | Sorry - this isn't really a sybian channel. | 05:29 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't know if anyone happens to know. | 05:30 |
| mysoogals | er ok thanks | 05:30 |
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| Gh0sty | is there any app to convert things like meter in inches and degrees celcius in fahrenheit? :/ | 05:33 |
| Gh0sty | been googling a bit but could not really find anything | 05:33 |
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| asj | Gh0sty: gonvert | 05:35 |
| Gh0sty | ha good, strange why that did not show up in the search results | 05:36 |
| Gh0sty | thx | 05:36 |
| doc|home | so, I'm in canuckistan. Wind are coming to vancouver this week and I'm considering switching. It seems like the n900 should be supported on its network but nokia don't sell/support the n900 here. If you were in my position would you wait for the next phone? | 05:38 |
| asj | which next phone? | 05:38 |
| PHiZiK | next maemo phone? | 05:38 |
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| doc|home | well, whatever follows the n900 I suppose | 05:39 |
| doc|home | be it meego or whatever | 05:39 |
| wazd | doc|home: it can be Nokia 1100 successor :D | 05:39 |
| PHiZiK | i don't think this will be anytime soon | 05:39 |
| asj | doc|home: how does wind make a difference? are they a real operator of an mvno? | 05:39 |
| doc|home | asj: they have their own network. They're not piggy backing anyone. | 05:40 |
| doc|home | wazd: you lost me :) | 05:40 |
| asj | doc|home: the n900 is 900mhz, 2100mhz (ignoring the tmobile crap), does that match up with Wind? Rogers is 850 I thought so no luck there | 05:41 |
| doc|home | it's kinda crappy that I can't even buy the thing here and expect to have support, and even if I did, it might become a dead end when meego properly comes along | 05:41 |
| doc|home | asj: they're aws | 05:41 |
| asj | doc|home: ah ok, well it's a dead end product as you state | 05:42 |
| * doc|home nods | 05:42 | |
| asj | but it's a pretty fun phone if you want linux in your pocket | 05:42 |
| doc|home | just wondering how long a person might expect to wait for its replacement | 05:42 |
| doc|home | I bought an openmoko freerunner about two years and still can't use the damn thing | 05:42 |
| doc|home | *two years ago | 05:42 |
| PHiZiK | I'd say long | 05:42 |
| doc|home | : | 05:43 |
| doc|home | :/ | 05:43 |
| PHiZiK | yeah 2 years probably | 05:43 |
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| PHiZiK | or more | 05:43 |
| doc|home | shame | 05:43 |
| doc|home | it's almost like nokia wants to not capitalise on the good thing they have | 05:43 |
| doc|home | anyway, thanks for the replies | 05:44 |
| asj | doc|home: the n900 is a trial balloon I think | 05:44 |
| PHiZiK | ^ i agree | 05:44 |
| doc|home | seems kinda an odd way to run it | 05:44 |
| doc|home | "you can't buy it here, and you also won't have any OS upgrade route" :/ | 05:44 |
| doc|home | here = canada | 05:45 |
| wazd | asus came uber-close to my tablet idea, bastards | 05:45 |
| asj | doc|home: what phone ever went through a real os upgrade? even the iphone 2g was dropped | 05:45 |
| wazd | buuut, since it's asus, they don't have enough brain to think out of the boundaries :) | 05:45 |
| wazd | http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/31/asus-eee-tablet-preview/ | 05:46 |
| doc|home | asj: yep, but still, doing it about 6 months after you start selling the phone, with no replacement in sight seems a bit odd | 05:46 |
| PHiZiK | ewww that thing looks fugly | 05:47 |
| asj | doc|home: not really if you think about it, we knew there would be maemo6, no one expected it to run on the n900, why would we expect meego to as well? The n810 doesn't run maemo5... | 05:47 |
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| doc|home | asj: yep, but some of the tablets did go through multiple OS versions | 05:48 |
| asj | doc|home: the tablets were way more niche than the n900 after all | 05:48 |
| * doc|home nods | 05:48 | |
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| doc|home | obviously I'm not expecting all the same functionality, or speed advances, but some should be transferable I'd have thought | 05:49 |
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| asj | doc|home: even if the next device were only a year away, do you want to run it on 2 year old hardware? (assuming the n900 was finalized 6mo before mass production) | 05:50 |
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| doc|home | asj: sure, if it's usable | 05:51 |
| doc|home | it won't be much slower than the piece of junk I use now :) | 05:51 |
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| asj | doc|home: the market isn't about "useable" it must perform great, at least as good as the original if not better, otherwise imagin the reviews. This also retricts the new OS to 256 meg / and do you want to limit that? | 05:52 |
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| asj | and potentially keeps the current /opt -> /home/opt mess | 05:52 |
| doc|home | asj: I know things progress, but like I said, the tablets did a reasonable job of handling OS advances, so a person can hope | 05:53 |
| asj | doc|home: there's always community support ;) anyways I enjoy the n900 and had the option a couple of weeks ago of getting one to last the next 2 years and chose the n900 | 05:54 |
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| doc|home | asj: yeah, community support is what I was relying on for the openmoko freerunner :( | 05:55 |
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| doc|home | asj: I still haven't ruled out a n900. Just not sure yet either way. | 05:55 |
| asj | doc|home: not enough of a community, I wonder how many openmoko's were made? | 05:55 |
| doc|home | asj: I don't know if the number was ever said | 05:56 |
| asj | "This would give programmers as well as users complete freedom. Up to now the manufacturer has produced two models, the first has sold 3,000 units and the second one 10,000" | 05:57 |
| doc|home | the first one really was a dev machine though | 05:57 |
| asj | I wonder how those numbers compare to a nokia proto run ;) | 05:57 |
| doc|home | hah, they don't :) | 05:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | The n900 has sold 100K in the first 5 weeks reportedly. | 06:00 |
| asj | reuters would disagree, but I can't find anything else | 06:01 |
| asj | but considering nokia doesn't promote the n900 <shrug> | 06:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Well. fmms looks to have at least 10000 users. | 06:02 |
| asj | fmms? | 06:02 |
| SpeedEvil | I think that a very large number of users are simply not installing anything, or enabling any other than the default repos. | 06:03 |
| SpeedEvil | Third-party mms add-on. | 06:03 |
| asj | I would agree with the lack of knowledge about maemo.org repo | 06:03 |
| asj | otherwise we wouldn't see the "there's no n900 apps" | 06:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | Exactly | 06:04 |
| SpeedEvil | it's not too hard to just think that ovi store must be it. | 06:04 |
| SpeedEvil | And the selection there is underwhelming | 06:04 |
| asj | heh, that's an understatement | 06:05 |
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| Robot101 | vodafone have discontinued n900 in the UK :( | 06:07 |
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| Robot101 | the guy in the shop said "oh it has linux or something, its not very popular" | 06:07 |
| asj | Robot101: any other carrier deals? | 06:07 |
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| Tobarja_n810 | my media player keeps forgetting about the 100 mp3's i have. is there a replacement that's easy on the resources? n810(if you didn't notice) | 06:11 |
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| Termana | Tobarja_n810, Canola? | 06:24 |
| Termana | Not sure how easy it is on the resources, but its great all the same | 06:24 |
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| jaem | 'Evening all. | 06:32 |
| jaem | My friend just got an N900 in Vancouver, BC, where a new carrier is about to launch. He's wondering if there's an app that gives channel/signal info, etc. for cell sites in the area. | 06:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | Not for nonauthenticated cells | 06:46 |
| SpeedEvil | As I understand it anyway | 06:47 |
| jaem | SpeedEvil, Okay, thanks. | 06:48 |
| jaem | Gah, some part of either my chair or laptop stand keeps making clicking noises that sound like the N900's IM alert. :/ | 06:48 |
| jaem | Given how attuned I am to those sorts of noises, it keeps distracting me. heh. | 06:48 |
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| jaem | On a different note, the beta SDK is telling me it can't find a header on compilation, despite the header being in the include path that it quotes in the compiler output log. | 06:49 |
| jaem | It builds fine from the command line. Can I build with the MADDE framework outside of Qt Creator? | 06:50 |
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| dracflamloc | hello | 07:06 |
| dracflamloc | i need help... just updated n900 to 1.2 | 07:06 |
| dracflamloc | app manager shows no catalogs | 07:06 |
| dracflamloc | and i cannot manually add any | 07:06 |
| dracflamloc | i hit new, and save, but nothing shows | 07:06 |
| asj | try reflashing the emmc? | 07:07 |
| dracflamloc | can you restate that for a non-techie? | 07:07 |
| jaem | dracflamloc, When you say "nothing shows", do you mean that the one you added isn't then on the list? | 07:07 |
| jaem | dracflamloc, the eMMC is your main storage, where your documents and a few other things go. | 07:07 |
| dracflamloc | correct jaem, the one i add doesnt show | 07:07 |
| dracflamloc | and none of the defaults are in there either | 07:08 |
| jaem | If the appropriate (non-personal-files) parts of the eMMC don't get cleared during the upgrade, it might cause problems. | 07:08 |
| dracflamloc | i used the nokia software updater, btw | 07:08 |
| jaem | asj was suggesting that you could try flashing the eMMC as well, to fully wipe/reflash the phone. I don't think there's a pointy-clicky way to do that, though, unless the NSU does it automatically. | 07:09 |
| jaem | Be warned that if you do do that, it will wipe all your files and settings, so you'd want to back up. | 07:09 |
| dracflamloc | ok. i have a backup already from before 1.2 udpate | 07:09 |
| jaem | dracflamloc, Do you feel comfortable checking something in the terminal if I give you the commands to type in? | 07:09 |
| jaem | It might save some time. | 07:10 |
| dracflamloc | so, my question is, how do i do the emmc thing | 07:10 |
| dracflamloc | yea sure | 07:10 |
| jaem | dracflamloc, okay, let me know when you have XTerm open. | 07:10 |
| dracflamloc | open | 07:10 |
| dracflamloc | ? | 07:11 |
| jaem | Type the following, and (if you can), copy the result into http://pastebin.ca, and send me the link | 07:11 |
| dracflamloc | ok | 07:11 |
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| jaem | cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 07:11 |
| jaem | "cat" in this case just spits out the contents of the text file to the screen. | 07:12 |
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| jaem | dracflamloc, Paste is on the XTerm menu, FYI | 07:13 |
| jaem | sorry, Copy | 07:13 |
| dracflamloc | k | 07:13 |
| dracflamloc | pastebin.ca/1875214 | 07:13 |
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| jaem | dracflamloc, Okay, that part looks good. Was Extras/"maemo.org" the repository you tried to manually add just now? | 07:15 |
| dracflamloc | um, i tried adding that one, and a few others that were just 'test' in every field | 07:16 |
| dracflamloc | nothing showed int he list at all | 07:16 |
| jaem | Alright. | 07:16 |
| jaem | Did you ever install root access with the rootsh package? | 07:16 |
| dracflamloc | probably, i had that debian thing on here | 07:17 |
| jaem | Okay, that makes things a bit easier, hopefully. | 07:17 |
| jaem | You'll need root access for this, so run "root" (no quotes) | 07:18 |
| jaem | Also, in general, if someone tells you to do something as root, be suspicious - some people are jerks, although usually not in #maemo. | 07:18 |
| jaem | Feel free to check what I'm telling you | 07:18 |
| dracflamloc | root is a command? | 07:18 |
| jaem | yes. | 07:18 |
| dracflamloc | says not found | 07:18 |
| jaem | Ah, okay then. | 07:19 |
| dracflamloc | it removed everything prior to the update i think | 07:19 |
| jaem | Did you try refreshing the lists from within Hildon Application Manager (HAM)? | 07:19 |
| jaem | e.g. from the Menu, or by hitting Update. | 07:19 |
| dracflamloc | hildon application manager? | 07:20 |
| dracflamloc | you mean what shows int he menu as 'app. manager'? | 07:20 |
| jaem | Yeah. | 07:20 |
| jaem | Hildon is the Maemo desktop interface, but the name isn't really used as branding. | 07:20 |
| dracflamloc | well thats where i was trying to add the new catalogs | 07:21 |
| dracflamloc | woh | 07:21 |
| jaem | Yes. Sometimes if it glitches, refreshing the app lists will give it a kick in the proverbial butt. | 07:22 |
| jaem | ? | 07:22 |
| dracflamloc | all the sources just showed up | 07:22 |
| jaem | \o/ | 07:22 |
| jaem | Heh, I should have thought of that in the first place. | 07:22 |
| * dracflamloc smacks himself | 07:22 | |
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| dracflamloc | i swear i did that 3 times | 07:22 |
| dracflamloc | and nothing happened | 07:22 |
| dracflamloc | now poof | 07:22 |
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| jaem | Don't worry, it /is/ caused by a bug or similar, so it wasn't your fault. | 07:22 |
| dracflamloc | k, now to restore all those programs. fun time! | 07:23 |
| dracflamloc | thanks for the help | 07:23 |
| jaem | You might want to double-check that there aren't duplicate Catalogue entries now, since it looks like there might be. | 07:23 |
| jaem | You're welcome, glad to be of assistance. | 07:23 |
| dracflamloc | hm | 07:23 |
| jaem | You might want to install rootsh, just in case you run into a bind in the future. | 07:23 |
| dracflamloc | ya | 07:23 |
| dracflamloc | ah there was a dupe | 07:24 |
| jaem | With sufficient knowledge, one can usually fix Linux systems even if they're really trashed, but you'll generally need root access. | 07:24 |
| jaem | Yep. | 07:24 |
| jaem | Probably not an issue, but certainly pointless. | 07:24 |
| dracflamloc | yea. i'm okay from a shell but no wizard. especially not on n900 | 07:25 |
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| luke-jr | Stskeeps: fwiw, gpsdriver fails epic silently if disk full | 08:01 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 08:01 |
| luke-jr | (not related to 2.6.33 issues) | 08:01 |
| jaem | luke-jr, context? | 08:01 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: most things do | 08:01 |
| luke-jr | jaem: I'm reverse engineering it; Stskeeps is revising it | 08:02 |
| luke-jr | Stskeeps: true enough :p | 08:02 |
| luke-jr | well, usually things crash and burn in my experience | 08:02 |
| luke-jr | but whatever | 08:02 |
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| jaem | luke-jr, refresh my memory about what gpsdriver's role is? | 08:02 |
| luke-jr | jaem: it is the GPS | 08:02 |
| Stskeeps | 'gps' 'driver' | 08:02 |
| jaem | >_< | 08:03 |
| jaem | epic fail on my part, sorry | 08:03 |
| jaem | Heh. | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | lol | 08:03 |
| jaem | Which layer of the stack, though? | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | GNOME Postscript driver | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | :p | 08:03 |
| jaem | luke-jr, gah! Get it away from me! | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | jaem: best I can tell, it does most of the GPS calculations | 08:03 |
| luke-jr | thankfully there's already some open source code for that | 08:04 |
| jaem | luke-jr, alrighty. I have to poke at GPS stuff at some point for work, but I haven't gotten there yet. | 08:04 |
| jaem | Nice. | 08:04 |
| luke-jr | I just need to build some glue | 08:04 |
| luke-jr | or rather, document enough for someoen else to build the glue | 08:04 |
| luke-jr | so it's clean-room | 08:04 |
| luke-jr | will probably make my own glue in the process, but not share that | 08:05 |
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| slonopotamus | luke-jr: | 08:13 |
| slonopotamus | err | 08:13 |
| slonopotamus | that was accidental | 08:13 |
| luke-jr | ... | 08:14 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: we're getting libcal? | 08:14 |
| Termana | SURE it was :P | 08:14 |
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| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: right, still in midst of being prepared for open sourcing but there's a 'go' on it | 08:14 |
| Stskeeps | should be coming out as part of the meego on n900 stuff hopefully | 08:15 |
| slonopotamus | okaaay | 08:15 |
| Stskeeps | next up: pigs flying | 08:15 |
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| luke-jr | why the heck are we getting libcal? | 08:16 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr: because we can? | 08:16 |
| luke-jr | I mean, why waste the effort when it's been replaced? | 08:16 |
| Stskeeps | it hasn't, just for read mode | 08:16 |
| luke-jr | effort that could be put toward gpsdriver or BME or NOLO | 08:16 |
| Stskeeps | cos it's a closed source dependancy to libdsme? | 08:17 |
| Termana | luke-jr, why not? How is it a problem that something is being opened? | 08:17 |
| Stskeeps | er, dsme | 08:17 |
| slonopotamus | meh | 08:17 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: i already have read mode. | 08:17 |
| luke-jr | Termana: there's much more important things | 08:17 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: what i meant was, write mode is in libcal | 08:17 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: so its value is smth about zero. | 08:17 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: and that part is going out too | 08:17 |
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| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: oh. you were not specific enough :) | 08:17 |
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| luke-jr | Stskeeps: btw, you know OMAP Tags is outright rejected from mainline? | 08:18 |
| luke-jr | which means we need either a guarantee all N8x0 have the same tag content, or NOLO opened | 08:18 |
| Termana | luke-jr, I'm not sure that this is going to take so much time that its unprioritised open sourcing of other components. | 08:18 |
| luke-jr | Termana: needs legal to review it, etc... | 08:19 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: yes, i know that | 08:19 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: i have a userspace atags decoder at least | 08:20 |
| luke-jr | me too | 08:20 |
| luke-jr | it converts to XML | 08:20 |
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| luke-jr | including decomposing GPIO OMAP Tags | 08:20 |
| luke-jr | :p; | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | nolo can't be replaced anyway, it's signed by a nokia key | 08:21 |
| Stskeeps | so no good reason for it to be released | 08:21 |
| luke-jr | ... | 08:22 |
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| Stskeeps | at least on n900 | 08:22 |
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| Stskeeps | (what use is open source if you can't recompile and replace it in the area it's in?) | 08:23 |
| Termana | Just as a sort of related side note - I saw on tmo someone completely bricked their n800. | 08:23 |
| Stskeeps | did they dd /dev/mtd? :P | 08:23 |
| Termana | Stskeeps, right, they erased the bootloader partition :P | 08:23 |
| Stskeeps | silly people | 08:23 |
| * slonopotamus half-broke /dev/mtd1 on his n800 :/ | 08:24 | |
| slonopotamus | *some* entries are not readable now :) | 08:24 |
| Stskeeps | well, with libcal you'll be able to debug what's wrong :P | 08:25 |
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| slonopotamus | i know what's wrong, my write algorithm | 08:27 |
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| jaem | slonopotamus, but how could a right algorithm be wrong? | 08:34 |
| * jaem ducks | 08:34 | |
| slonopotamus | jaem: ... | 08:37 |
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| slonopotamus | do ducks duck? | 08:40 |
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| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: ping | 08:49 |
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| Stskeeps | plonk | 08:53 |
| timeless_mbp | what do you think of my button label? | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, interesting | 08:55 |
| Stskeeps | since there's no auto focus, backup would be the normal choice | 08:55 |
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| * timeless_mbp chuckles | 08:57 | |
| timeless_mbp | that reminds me | 08:57 |
| Dassu | wwwwwwwwwwwww | 08:57 |
| timeless_mbp | i need to fix the sim dialog | 08:57 |
| timeless_mbp | right now it has 'skip' and 'done' | 08:57 |
| timeless_mbp | but if you try calling someone and the sim dialog appears | 08:57 |
| Dassu | Anybody here here experienced with mediatomb or with UpNp+n900 in general? | 08:57 |
| timeless_mbp | you might try clicking skip a number of times | 08:57 |
| timeless_mbp | since it's the natural button | 08:57 |
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| ruskie | Dassu, works for me if you you consider that experienced | 08:59 |
| timeless_mbp | oh brother | 08:59 |
| timeless_mbp | *idiots* | 08:59 |
| timeless_mbp | Skip and Done seem to come from distinct domains | 08:59 |
| timeless_mbp | and Done seems to be a generic domain string | 08:59 |
| timeless_mbp | remind me to shoot someone | 08:59 |
| Dassu | ruskie: Okies. What codec are you using? | 08:59 |
| ruskie | Dassu, I don't transcode | 09:00 |
| Dassu | ruskie: are you using the default player or something else. And why? | 09:00 |
| ruskie | mplayer and djmount | 09:00 |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: so... | 09:00 |
| Dassu | ruskie: dude, the files still have a codec | 09:00 |
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| timeless_mbp | i *really* want help | 09:00 |
| ruskie | simply because I prefer mplayer | 09:00 |
| timeless_mbp | i want to rewrite how glib's gettext works | 09:00 |
| Dassu | ruskie: Oh, okies. well, ... that most likely has the best codec support | 09:00 |
| ruskie | Dassu, various codecs | 09:00 |
| Dassu | Yeah | 09:01 |
| timeless_mbp | i need to change it so that it can do evil things based on the name of the running app | 09:01 |
| ruskie | :) | 09:01 |
| timeless_mbp | because these running apps are incredibly stupid | 09:01 |
| Dassu | Atm. I'm trying to setup MythTV+mediatomb streaming setup that would work with default player by doing on-fly-endcoding to either h264, h263 or to the mpeg4 | 09:01 |
| Dassu | but definately a pain in the ass. | 09:02 |
| Dassu | a) Huge CPU load on the server b) Huge delay c) Sometimes I manage to get some picture but it is all messed up. | 09:02 |
| ruskie | I used dvd quality for streaming to the ps3 and the n900 myself when I did transcoding | 09:02 |
| ruskie | gave up on that since had issues with mythtv playing that upnp stream | 09:03 |
| Dassu | yeah... | 09:04 |
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| Dassu | One way would be to install mythfrontend on the N900. | 09:05 |
| * timeless_mbp grins | 09:05 | |
| timeless_mbp | i finally found a team at nokia that i like | 09:05 |
| timeless_mbp | too bad i don't think end users will ever meet them :( | 09:06 |
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| ruskie | timeless_mbp, how so? | 09:06 |
| Dassu | Some people are lucky. | 09:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | ruskie: the team works on an internal product :( | 09:08 |
| timeless_mbp | but the team does things that seem unbelievable to me... | 09:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | they respond to suggestions! | 09:09 |
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| jaem | Woah! | 09:09 |
| jaem | :P | 09:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | yeah i know… unbelievable | 09:10 |
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| jaem | Hehehe... | 09:14 |
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| jaem | I love how much Intel's markety-speak for this sounds like people advertising "amazing" 10-year old computers for four times their value: http://syndication.intel.com/DistributeModule.aspx?ppc_cid=WTM_02105071701 | 09:14 |
| timeless_mbp | hey | 09:15 |
| timeless_mbp | playing games on i486 sucked at a certain point | 09:15 |
| jaem | ...and it still does now | 09:16 |
| timeless_mbp | and surfing the web w/ it instead of a pentium was depressing | 09:16 |
| jaem | Yeah, I just am amused at how even Intel can't really find anything good to say about their low-end processors. | 09:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | the i486s at my high school library still depress me | 09:16 |
| timeless_mbp | we only had a couple of pentiums | 09:16 |
| jaem | They still have them? | 09:16 |
| jaem | Oh. | 09:16 |
| jaem | You had me worried. | 09:16 |
| timeless_mbp | dunno, i haven't been back in ages | 09:17 |
| timeless_mbp | i sure hope not | 09:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | in other news, i met an infected laptop last night | 09:17 |
| Appiah | they are upgraded to PIII I bet | 09:17 |
| Appiah | :) | 09:17 |
| timeless_mbp | and i think i managed to clean it w/o reinstalling the world | 09:17 |
| timeless_mbp | it was fun actually | 09:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | jaem: what do you think of: http://www.webwizardry.net/~timeless/n900/screenshots/Screenshot-20100601-024250.png | 09:18 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, looks good to me, but I forget what it originally looked like. | 09:18 |
| jaem | Heh. | 09:18 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: um, hrm | 09:19 |
| timeless_mbp | yeah, i suppose i need a before/after shot | 09:19 |
| jaem | I only have one N900 with me right now, and I don't want to mess with it to see. :P | 09:19 |
| timeless_mbp | lemme switch locales | 09:19 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, sure. | 09:19 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, you wouldn't happen to know anyone involved in the beta SDK who I could poke about something, do you? I've hung up on a weird issue, and wondering if the "Beta" label has anything to do with it. | 09:20 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 09:20 |
| timeless_mbp | which beta sdk is this? | 09:20 |
| jaem | the new Qt SDK, from April 27 | 09:20 |
| jaem | ish | 09:20 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm, no? | 09:21 |
| timeless_mbp | there's a #qt-maemo right? | 09:21 |
| jaem | A g++ command line that should be fine is bailing on a missing header, which is exactly where it's looking. | 09:21 |
| jaem | Is there? | 09:21 |
| jaem | ahah | 09:21 |
| jaem | aha* | 09:21 |
| jaem | I just went and explained it at length in #qt, to no reply. | 09:22 |
| jaem | I'm hesitant to just paste it all over to another channel | 09:22 |
| * jaem frowns | 09:22 | |
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| jaem | I think it's an environmental issue in MADDE | 09:23 |
| Stskeeps | oil leak? | 09:23 |
| asj | timeless_mbp: and #qt-labs too | 09:24 |
| jaem | Stskeeps, I'm not sure... there are a lot of variables to consider. | 09:24 |
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| jaem | -snerk- | 09:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://www.webwizardry.net/~timeless/n900/screenshots/Screenshot-20100601-092429.png | 09:25 |
| timeless_mbp | is a "before" shot | 09:25 |
| jaem | Stskeeps, naw, it's just that the build works fine natively, and the headers are where they should be, but somehow when I run an (apparently) equivalent build inside Qt Creator, it can't find the header, in (apparently) the same place it could before. | 09:25 |
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| jaem | Hence, I'm guessing it's an environment issue, or something else to do with MADDE's voodoo | 09:25 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, yes, that looks much better than before. | 09:26 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: what amuses me is the button label | 09:27 |
| jaem | The arrow on the button is a nice touch, and the text has been compressed while /gaining/ clarity, IMO | 09:27 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, is this your work? | 09:27 |
| timeless_mbp | i did this if that's what you mean | 09:27 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, yes | 09:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | jaem: minor warning, i'm making random updates to my locale so things aren't always perfect | 09:28 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, sure | 09:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | are you running 1.1.1 or 1.2? | 09:30 |
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| * timeless_mbp has one 1.1.1- string to fix still | 09:31 | |
| jaem | 1.2 | 09:31 |
| timeless_mbp | it's my favorite string: | 09:31 |
| timeless_mbp | msgstr "XXX How did you get here?" | 09:31 |
| jaem | I'd be happy to help you with strings later, but I can't right now. | 09:31 |
| jaem | Ha! | 09:31 |
| jaem | Where's that one from? | 09:31 |
| timeless_mbp | i wrote that because in 1.2 the string doesn't happen | 09:31 |
| jaem | Ah... :D | 09:31 |
| timeless_mbp | it took me visiting a friend w/ my strings running 1.1.1 to finally spot it | 09:31 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you're using 1.2, you'll never see it :) | 09:32 |
| zeke | does maemo5 support 64bit yet? | 09:32 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, I think you'll appreciate this, which I found the other day. | 09:32 |
| zeke | the sdk | 09:32 |
| timeless_mbp | zeke: "the sdk: | 09:32 |
| jaem | zeke, Yeah, my 64-bit N900... | 09:32 |
| jaem | aw, darn | 09:32 |
| timeless_mbp | that sounds monolithic | 09:32 |
| jaem | zeke, you're too quick | 09:32 |
| zeke | :P | 09:32 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, link: http://imagebin.ca/view/MQc2TA.html | 09:32 |
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| zeke | because I have to use a 64bit OS, and last time it bitched about me using 64bit | 09:33 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: nice | 09:33 |
| jaem | zeke, the beta SDK is fine on 64-bit Linux | 09:33 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, I thought so. | 09:33 |
| jaem | I discovered it while talking (in meatspace) with a Symbian guy. | 09:33 |
| timeless_mbp | zeke: so, depending on how new/old your kernel is, there's sometimes something that you have to tune | 09:33 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: is it limited to the perforce tab? | 09:33 |
| jaem | He agreed that I should mock it before reporting it. :P | 09:33 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, I think so, but I forgot to check. | 09:34 |
| zeke | timeless_mbp: I run Gentoo | 09:34 |
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| timeless_mbp | zeke: i don't care =) | 09:34 |
| zeke | so I always use the latest everything :) | 09:34 |
| jacekowski | i have normal scratchbox 1 and it works fine on | 09:34 |
| jacekowski | Linux jacekowski.org 2.6.32.2-xxxx-grs-ipv4-64 #1 SMP Tue Dec 29 14:41:12 UTC 2009 x86_64 GNU/Linux | 09:34 |
| *** cure` has quit IRC | 09:34 | |
| zeke | Linux narfxeon 2.6.33-gentoo-r2 #1 SMP Fri May 14 23:55:47 Local time zone must be set--see zic x86_64 Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU X3440 @ 2.53GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux | 09:34 |
| jaem | zeke, you remind me of the guy on #kde last release, who was bragging about how Slackware had their packages out 45 min after release. | 09:34 |
| jaem | I pointed out that Arch had theirs out >1hr before. :P | 09:35 |
| zeke | hahaha | 09:35 |
| * jaem high fives zeke | 09:35 | |
| * zeke high fives back and raises eyebrow | 09:35 | |
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| * timeless_mbp frowns | 09:35 | |
| timeless_mbp | what the heck is in post-build-checks ? | 09:35 |
| jacekowski | gentoo | 09:36 |
| timeless_mbp | other than stuff that makes my xref EEP a lot :( | 09:36 |
| jacekowski | such a waste of resources | 09:36 |
| zeke | jacekowski: well my machine whoops yours :P | 09:36 |
| zeke | XD | 09:36 |
| timeless_mbp | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/730051 | 09:36 |
| jacekowski | model name : Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU X3360 @ 2.83GHz | 09:36 |
| jacekowski | 4 core | 09:36 |
| jacekowski | and 8G of ram | 09:37 |
| jacekowski | are you sure? | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | jacekowski: well, mine makes a nice lap warmer | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | does yours weigh too much to fit comfortably on your lap? | 09:37 |
| zeke | Sysinfo for 'narfxeon': Linux 2.6.33-gentoo-r2 running KDE Development Platform 4.4.81 (KDE 4.4.81 (KDE 4.5 >= 20100527)), CPU: Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU X3440 @ 2.53GHz at 2534 MHz (5371 bogomips), HD: 112/458GB, RAM: 5046/5973MB, 232 proc's, 13.21h up | 09:37 |
| zeke | :) | 09:37 |
| jacekowski | it's mounted in rack | 09:37 |
| jacekowski | yeah, mine is better | 09:37 |
| zeke | please | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | yeah, ETOOHEAVY | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | and ETOOWIDE | 09:38 |
| timeless_mbp | definitely not a proper lap warmer | 09:38 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: fwiw, the XXX string above means: | 09:39 |
| timeless_mbp | msgstr "Select Status to Edit" | 09:39 |
| timeless_mbp | but that feels too long | 09:39 |
| jacekowski | http://fichtre.net/yop.html | 09:39 |
| jacekowski | open that | 09:39 |
| jacekowski | and press ctrl+a | 09:39 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, did I miss something, or are you commenting on the thing from a while back? | 09:40 |
| timeless_mbp | yeah | 09:40 |
| jacekowski | timeless_mbp: besides, it warms whole room instead of just lap | 09:41 |
| timeless_mbp | jacekowski: oh sure | 09:42 |
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| acidjazz | when is the maemo update for US n900's? | 09:43 |
| acidjazz | and where can i read what the update has | 09:43 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.2 ? | 09:45 |
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| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: afaik it should have been available ages ago | 09:47 |
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| acidjazz | ah i see it | 09:47 |
| acidjazz | sorry my n900 has been off for a while | 09:47 |
| acidjazz | whats in it? | 09:47 |
| jaem | acidjazz, Skype/Jabber video calling, for one thing. | 09:49 |
| jaem | Skype video seems to work quite well. | 09:49 |
| jaem | There's a list on the wiki. | 09:49 |
| acidjazz | url to wiki pls | 09:49 |
| acidjazz | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.2 ? | 09:49 |
| jaem | A few big things like that, a long list of bugfixes, and a fair amount of small changes and additions that you'll run into as you poke around the device. | 09:49 |
| jaem | For instance, overdue Tasks in calendar are now in Red text | 09:50 |
| jaem | Yeah, should be. | 09:50 |
| jaem | Sigh... maybe I should take a break from this stupid problem. | 09:50 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: interesting | 09:50 |
| * timeless_mbp never uses tasks | 09:50 | |
| jaem | It's driving me crazy. | 09:50 |
| jaem | exhibit A: I just almost put toothpaste on my razor | 09:51 |
| jaem | >_< | 09:51 |
| acidjazz | great | 09:51 |
| acidjazz | i dont have enough room for the update | 09:51 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, yeah, it's helpful, but I wish they'd taken my suggestion and added a "Postpone" button, like RememberTheMilk has | 09:51 |
| jaem | acidjazz, see topic | 09:51 |
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| acidjazz | lol | 09:55 |
| acidjazz | nic esolutions | 09:55 |
| acidjazz | maemfail | 09:55 |
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| Tuukka | What's the most stable/safest unzip app? | 09:57 |
| timeless_mbp | ?? | 09:57 |
| timeless_mbp | how dangerous should an unzip be? | 09:57 |
| jaem | Tuukka, unzip | 09:57 |
| jaem | which is command line | 09:57 |
| jaem | there is an unzip addon for the file manager, as well | 09:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | oh, that sounds dangerous | 09:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | :) | 09:58 |
| jaem | Tuukka, You can generally assume that anything in Extras is safe. | 09:58 |
| jaem | Of course, you can never be 100% sure of anything unless you've read every line of code and built the app yourself | 09:58 |
| Tuukka | jaem, by unzip you mean zip? | 09:58 |
| jaem | But I wouldn't worry about "safety" | 09:58 |
| jaem | Tuukka, the program is called unzip, but it does both. | 09:59 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: weren't zip and unzip in distinct packages? | 09:59 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, maybe? I can't remember. | 09:59 |
| jaem | I thought the unzip binary did both functions. | 09:59 |
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| timeless_mbp | from memory they're like the pkzip versions | 10:00 |
| timeless_mbp | incestuous | 10:00 |
| timeless_mbp | but distinct | 10:00 |
| acidjazz | nothing i uninstall is freeing up room on / | 10:00 |
| jaem | heh | 10:00 |
| acidjazz | this is retarded | 10:00 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, in regards to your question about the screenshot, the label doesn't seem to exist in the other tabs, so I assume it's limited to the Perforce tab. | 10:01 |
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| acidjazz | why doesnt the maemo update just use the 32gb of room? | 10:02 |
| acidjazz | the f | 10:02 |
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| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: you mean "why doesn't the maemo update eat all of my data, songs, music, videos, photos of my gf"? | 10:03 |
| timeless_mbp | let me think about that! | 10:03 |
| acidjazz | that doesnt make sense | 10:03 |
| acidjazz | why does uninstalling apps not show more room on ? | 10:04 |
| timeless_mbp | which part? | 10:04 |
| acidjazz | ? | 10:04 |
| acidjazz | => / | 10:04 |
| timeless_mbp | reboot | 10:04 |
| timeless_mbp | the file system doesn't work the way you think it works | 10:04 |
| timeless_mbp | so often you need to reboot to actually get space back | 10:05 |
| timeless_mbp | and this is fairly typical for file systems | 10:05 |
| acidjazz | whats the command to run things as root again | 10:05 |
| acidjazz | did you just tell me its fairly typpical that filesystems need to be rebooted to see current the current available room? | 10:06 |
| timeless_mbp | you don't reboot file systems | 10:06 |
| timeless_mbp | but basically | 10:06 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 10:06 | |
| jaem | "root" | 10:06 |
| jaem | @acidjazz | 10:06 |
| timeless_mbp | imagine you have a spot on the beech | 10:06 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm, beach | 10:06 |
| timeless_mbp | you build a nice sand castle and stick some plastic around the castle to protect it from the waves | 10:07 |
| timeless_mbp | you decide it's time to go home | 10:07 |
| timeless_mbp | so you take your plastic with you | 10:07 |
| acidjazz | ah gainroot | 10:07 |
| timeless_mbp | the castle doesn't magically disappear just because the plastic is gone | 10:07 |
| timeless_mbp | but the next kid who comes along can try to kick the castle | 10:08 |
| timeless_mbp | it might work, or it might be too hard | 10:08 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, you were that kid, weren't you? Jerk. :P | 10:08 |
| timeless_mbp | if you come back the next day after high tide | 10:08 |
| timeless_mbp | the waves will have wiped out your castle | 10:08 |
| timeless_mbp | that's kinda like the reboot step | 10:08 |
| jaem | That analogy is made of win. | 10:08 |
| timeless_mbp | things which are protected by plastic don't go away even when the waves come | 10:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | but things which aren't don't magically disappear unless waves or something else comes along | 10:09 |
| acidjazz | FAILMO | 10:09 |
| acidjazz | rebooted | 10:09 |
| acidjazz | .5mb freed up | 10:10 |
| tank-man | anyone here still using the PalmOS VM ? | 10:10 |
| acidjazz | 29.5mb free now | 10:10 |
| acidjazz | im gonna snap this phone in half | 10:10 |
| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: are you using 1.1.1? | 10:10 |
| hrw | morning | 10:10 |
| acidjazz | 1.1.1 of what | 10:10 |
| acidjazz | maemo 5 3.2010.02-8.002 | 10:11 |
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| timeless_mbp | eww | 10:11 |
| timeless_mbp | that's some regional variant | 10:11 |
| * timeless_mbp would back up and reflash w/ global | 10:12 | |
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| timeless_mbp | regional variants are disturbing | 10:12 |
| acidjazz | its whatever the thing came w/ | 10:12 |
| jaem | Gah... I finally figured it out. | 10:12 |
| acidjazz | im not listening to you after your creepy sandcastle story | 10:12 |
| acidjazz | whatd u figure out jaem | 10:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | hey, i wasn't the one who kicked the sand castle! | 10:12 |
| timeless_mbp | that was jaem! | 10:12 |
| jaem | acidjazz, the problem that was making me distracted enough to almost put toothpaste on my razor | 10:13 |
| * timeless_mbp points an accusatory yellow plastic shovel | 10:13 | |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, I made you a scapegoat first - read the scrollback - therefore your scapegoating of me is invalid | 10:13 |
| jaem | Ha | 10:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://base0.googlehosted.com/base_media?q=http://i20.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/05/6c/55cb_1.JPG%3Fset_id%3D800005007&size=18&dhm=4f4d2dcb&hl=en | 10:13 |
| jaem | acidjazz, timeless_mbp, it turns out that if I stick my headers in the MADDE target rootfs prefix, it all works nicely | 10:13 |
| * jaem grumbles | 10:14 | |
| jaem | Well, that was a lovely waste of - what? Four hours or so. | 10:14 |
| jaem | Not that I was doing that the whole time, but still | 10:14 |
| jaem | Gah. | 10:14 |
| acidjazz | whta ar eu working on jaem | 10:14 |
| jaem | acidjazz, currently? Trying to get a demo app for a university project to compile in the SDK. | 10:15 |
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| jaem | My prof needs it running on Symbian in short order, for some event he's going to | 10:15 |
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| acidjazz | what school is this | 10:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | how would a maemo sdk help you w/ a symbian problem? | 10:16 |
| acidjazz | a java class? | 10:16 |
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| jaem | acidjazz, Simon Fraser University, BC, Canada | 10:17 |
| jaem | and no, not Java (blech) | 10:17 |
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| jaem | It's C/C++/Qt | 10:17 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, Getting it building in the SDK at all was the first step, and the new SDK builds for both. (Well, Symbian isn't supported on a Linux host yet, but it will be in release) | 10:18 |
| * timeless_mbp frowns | 10:18 | |
| jaem | I just thought that trying to solve an SDK-specific problem would be easier if I kept the amount of things I wasn't familiar with down to one. | 10:18 |
| timeless_mbp | my gmailbox is 10% full | 10:18 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, so, it was happy finding and linking to a library in $randompath, but it couldn't find the headers for it anywhere but the cross-compiler's include prefix, despite the correct g++ -I switch. | 10:20 |
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| jaem | Would that count as an SDK bug, do you think? | 10:20 |
| timeless_mbp | i think we fought something like that in a previous sdk | 10:20 |
| timeless_mbp | we gave up | 10:20 |
| timeless_mbp | and decided the sdk people were stupid | 10:21 |
| acidjazz | is there a google maps app for maemo yet? | 10:21 |
| acidjazz | how do i reset the whole phone | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: there's maepero or something | 10:22 |
| acidjazz | and wipe everythign on this thing | 10:22 |
| frals | just open google maps in the browser? | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | which can use google maps | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | or you could just use the browser | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | in 1.2 the browser has integrated location suppor | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | t | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | (in 1.1.1 you had to install an extension) | 10:22 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, the app is called mappero, but the package itself hasn't transitioned, and is still called maemo-mapper | 10:24 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, Oh? Gah, how do I disable that? | 10:24 |
| jaem | It would have been nice if they'd mentioned that up-front. | 10:24 |
| jaem | I might end up using it at some point, but I like to *know* when those sorts of features are enabled. | 10:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | jaem: the browser asks permission! | 10:25 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, oh, good. | 10:25 |
| timeless_mbp | it doesn't go off and give away your location... | 10:25 |
| jaem | I presume that webapps can still detect the feature, though? | 10:25 |
| timeless_mbp | we're not quite *that* stupid | 10:25 |
| timeless_mbp | sure | 10:25 |
| jaem | Heh, no, I figured there would be an "off" switch, but I wasn't sure it if was opt-in on a per-site basis. | 10:25 |
| timeless_mbp | the clever people unfortunately didn't provide a good way to lie about position | 10:26 |
| timeless_mbp | which sucks | 10:26 |
| * timeless_mbp curses enthusiasts | 10:26 | |
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| mc_teo | so | 10:27 |
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| mc_teo | did maemo gets socks proxy support yet? | 10:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | mc_teo: eh? | 10:30 |
| timeless_mbp | the browser engine supports socks | 10:30 |
| timeless_mbp | the ui unfortunately doesn't prioritize socks | 10:30 |
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| timeless_mbp | i think you can use a PAC file | 10:31 |
| mc_teo | timeless: i never thought of that | 10:31 |
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| timeless_mbp | fwiw i didn't the last time you or someone else asked a day or two ago | 10:31 |
| timeless_mbp | but a google search for iphone socks proxy suggested it | 10:32 |
| mc_teo | i remembered there was someway to bookmark the about:config settings | 10:32 |
| timeless_mbp | that unfortunately doesn't work anymore | 10:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | it relied on code i had written for about:config | 10:32 |
| acidjazz | of all the strategies to free up 100mb on / for the update whats the most effective? | 10:32 |
| timeless_mbp | but we replaced that w/ the standard gecko about:config :( | 10:32 |
| timeless_mbp | … and well, we support PAC, so what's good for apple is good for us :) | 10:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: back up your applications and reflash :) | 10:33 |
| mc_teo | ah, so a PAC it is then | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | it'll save you time | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | mc_teo: http://snipplr.com/view.php?id=16563 fwiw | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: the backup can record the list of applications you've installed | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | and it will save your settings | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | so after you reflash you can restore your backup, and then restore your apps | 10:33 |
| timeless_mbp | it's going to be faster than freeing up 100mb of space | 10:34 |
| mc_teo | yeah, much faster | 10:34 |
| mc_teo | as often its conflicting packages too | 10:34 |
| mc_teo | i spent hours making rootfs smaller | 10:34 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm not saying it isn't possible to do it, i've done it for a few devices | 10:34 |
| timeless_mbp | but it can easily cost 4 hours | 10:34 |
| mc_teo | and then it still wouldnt update ota | 10:34 |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 10:35 |
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| LiraNuna | who made RDS Notify? | 10:40 |
| LiraNuna | or ported | 10:41 |
| Tuukka | LiraNuna, Maintainers: Fabrice Crohas | 10:42 |
| Tuukka | maybe? | 10:42 |
| Tuukka | http://maemo.org/packages/view/fmrdsnotify/ | 10:43 |
| LiraNuna | oooh | 10:43 |
| jaem | LiraNuna, technically maintainer doesn't necessarily == author | 10:43 |
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| LiraNuna | I understand | 10:43 |
| jaem | Although in the Maemo world, it quite often does. | 10:43 |
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| jaem | If you can't find the original author, they should be able to get you in touch, though, in any case | 10:44 |
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| LiraNuna | well, I'd like to offer improvements, and I don't know how to | 10:45 |
| thresh | mm, does media player support flac? | 10:45 |
| acidjazz | timeless_mbp: there a tutorial for this? | 10:45 |
| thresh | cause i'd like to listen to new trent's ep | 10:45 |
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| timeless_mbp | acidjazz: "how to create a backup"? | 10:46 |
| timeless_mbp | 1. open the task launcher | 10:46 |
| timeless_mbp | 2. open backup | 10:46 |
| timeless_mbp | 3. create backup | 10:46 |
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| timeless_mbp | 4. give it a name | 10:46 |
| timeless_mbp | 5. create backup (it should back up everything by default, w/o a password) | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 6. follow the flashing instructions in the wiki to just reflash the rootfs (*not* the eMMC) | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 7. turn on the n900 | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 8. open the task launcher | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 9. open backup | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 10. restore backup | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | 11. it will reboot | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | 12. open the task launcher | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | 13. open app manager | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | 14. tap the title area | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | 15. select restore applications | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | … it's something like that | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | actually in theory backup should offer to run app manager for you | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | so it's arguably simpler than that | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | none of this is complicated | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | it's designed for normal customers | 10:48 |
| acidjazz | okie | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | the labels while not perfect aren't terrible either | 10:49 |
| acidjazz | the flasher part is def ont for normal customers | 10:49 |
| acidjazz | nothign about this is for normal customers | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | oddly, it is | 10:49 |
| acidjazz | lol | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | we ship a windows application which does flashing | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | it might be http://betalabs.nokia.com/apps/nokia-software-updater | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | not certain | 10:49 |
| * timeless_mbp doesn't use it | 10:49 | |
| timeless_mbp | actually | 10:50 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 10:50 | |
| timeless_mbp | betalabs.nokia.com feels like an internal site i used recently | 10:50 |
| acidjazz | i dont even have a usb cable around right now | 10:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | well…. you could spend hours trying to free up space | 10:51 |
| timeless_mbp | or an hour getting a cable | 10:51 |
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| acidjazz | or i could turn it off | 10:53 |
| acidjazz | and put it back in my droor of useless gadgets | 10:53 |
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| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: ping | 10:56 |
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| lucent | acidjazz: flash is not mystical, it is a standard procedure | 11:05 |
| tybollt | flash (the kind from adobe) certainly is :P | 11:06 |
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| frals | timeless_mbp: is it summer in helsinki yet? | 11:07 |
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| lucent | adobe flash is "Internet herpes" | 11:07 |
| hrw | acidjazz: NSU is tool for normal users | 11:07 |
| mece | it's nice in Turku at least. | 11:07 |
| mece | I mean Åbo | 11:07 |
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| tybollt | lucent: >:D | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | frals: there's sun out today | 11:07 |
| tybollt | no | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | and i'm wearing shorts right now | 11:07 |
| tybollt | Turku - please | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | but i haven't gone outside yet | 11:07 |
| tybollt | not åbo | 11:07 |
| mece | it's Åbo. | 11:07 |
| tybollt | Turku | 11:08 |
| mece | Åbo | 11:08 |
| timeless_mbp | get a room | 11:08 |
| mece | LOL | 11:08 |
| tybollt | :D | 11:08 |
| acidjazz | the flasher i used before was a dos cli | 11:08 |
| frals | timeless_mbp: mkay | 11:08 |
| lucent | dos? | 11:08 |
| lucent | I used the Linux instructions | 11:09 |
| frals | uh, whats the language codethingy for czech? cz? | 11:09 |
| timeless_mbp | cs-CZ ? | 11:09 |
| frals | yeah, cs. doh, uploaded file to transifex as cz ;( | 11:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | file a bug asking transifex to warn :) | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | it's a common mistake | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | seriously | 11:10 |
| frals | the lack of ways to remove a translation from the transifex website is disturbing | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | file a bug for that too ;-) | 11:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cs-CZ+language | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | cs-CZ language — Czech | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | - FeedbackIs this accurate? Yes NoThank you for your feedback. | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | According to file-extensions.org, nabble.com, wikipedia.org and 6 others - | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | Show sources | 11:11 |
| lucent | why does the maemo port of keepassx not see the memory card on file open dialog? | 11:12 |
| lucent | Qt... | 11:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2794697160372660442# | 11:19 |
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| timeless_mbp | "no but i saw the movie" | 11:20 |
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| acidjazz | wat is this | 11:20 |
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| * timeless_mbp frowns | 11:30 | |
| timeless_mbp | ok, so not following symlinks would be bad | 11:30 |
| * timeless_mbp needs a better solution | 11:30 | |
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| smoku | pupnik: do you have the deb source for your warzone2100 port anywhere? | 11:31 |
| jacekowski | anybody with beagleboard here? | 11:31 |
| jacekowski | smoku: have you tried apt-get source? | 11:32 |
| jacekowski | mhm, chrome.pl? | 11:33 |
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| pupnik | unlikely | 11:33 |
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| smoku | i'll start with ubuntu debs then, as usuall :) | 11:34 |
| smoku | jacekowski: i'm on jabber-irc transport | 11:34 |
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| jacekowski | well, i think chrome.pl admin nick was "smoku" | 11:35 |
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| smoku | jacekowski: cause it is | 11:36 |
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| viliny_ | Hey guys | 11:36 |
| viliny_ | have some trouble with my phone | 11:37 |
| viliny_ | was running titans kernel and did a apt-get upgrade earlier today | 11:37 |
| viliny_ | lots of stuff got updated since i didn't know pr1.2 had come out | 11:37 |
| jacekowski | viliny_: everybody warned you that oc breaks phone | 11:37 |
| viliny_ | yeah, true | 11:37 |
| viliny_ | but my problem right now is that my apt-get is having trouble after it updated the phone partially and seems to have lost symlink for archives that someone here suggested i do earlier to be able to do apt-get upgrade in the first place | 11:38 |
| viliny_ | so i would need to set that up so that it works again, or failing that -> can i just reflash the device to a default state and move on forward from there? | 11:39 |
| viliny_ | the phone works but i have a load of updates that won't go through as it is right now | 11:39 |
| smoku | viliny_: PR1.2 brings new eMMC layout (lot of stuff was moved there), so if your upgrade was interrupted, I guess you're out of luck and need to reflash both the rootfs and eMMC | 11:40 |
| viliny_ | smoku: oh alright, does that mean the phone will be cleaned completely? | 11:41 |
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| viliny_ | i wouldn't mind starting over at this point | 11:41 |
| viliny_ | any nudge towards an up-to-date article about doing the reflash? | 11:42 |
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| ZogG_N900 | dneary, \o | 11:43 |
| pupnik | just upgrading packages worked here, after freeing up much space | 11:43 |
| pupnik | but not recommended! | 11:43 |
| viliny_ | pupnik: i suspect that would work for me too | 11:43 |
| viliny_ | but my apt get archives were symbolic linked earlier and now thats not in effect anymore and theres some directory troubles | 11:44 |
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| dneary | hi ZogG | 11:45 |
| dneary | Anyone know if there's an easy way in the graphical user interface to see how much rootfs space is left? | 11:46 |
| viliny_ | E: Archive directory /var/cache/apt/archives/partial is missing. #when doing apt-get update | 11:46 |
| dneary | df -h doesn't seem the most user friendly :) | 11:46 |
| jacekowski | dneary: storage usage | 11:46 |
| asj__ | dneary: three's something in the file manager | 11:46 |
| ZogG_N900 | dneary, conky ) | 11:46 |
| pupnik | viliny_: symlinking archives was the only way to get em all pulled-in | 11:47 |
| viliny_ | E: Could not open lock file /var/cache/apt/archives/lock - open (2 no such file or archive) | 11:47 |
| viliny_ | when upgrading | 11:47 |
| smoku | viliny_: do you have root access? you may try "mkdir -p /var/cache/apt/archives/partial" | 11:47 |
| viliny_ | one moment | 11:48 |
| viliny_ | whats does p do? | 11:48 |
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| asj__ | viliny_: parents | 11:48 |
| smoku | creates the whole path | 11:48 |
| smoku | with all needed subdirectories | 11:48 |
| viliny_ | cannot create directory '/var/cache/apt/archives/' No such file or directory | 11:49 |
| dneary | jacekowski, "memory for installable applications" lies though | 11:49 |
| dneary | reports 1.7GB free, df -h reports 77MB in rootfs | 11:50 |
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| ZogG_N900 | dneary, in memory in settings? | 11:50 |
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| smoku | viliny_: remove the dead symlink and try again :) | 11:50 |
| dneary | ZogG_N900, No - in file manager->Memory usage | 11:50 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: i don't think you can get info about rootfs from Maemo's UI | 11:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | dneary / ZogG: that's the same widget | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | just w/ two entrypoints | 11:51 |
| zlimvos_ | heya all. i was wondering, would it be possible to install this http://www.secdev.org/projects/ipv6world/ on n900? (if someone is knowlegable enough ofc) | 11:51 |
| viliny_ | smoku i guess it was done in the "default way" last time, how do i go about finding out where it is and what to do? | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: you need to use X Terminal | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | df -h / | 11:51 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, Someone created a bug saying "timeless isn't nice" | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: that was me | 11:51 |
| jaem | dneary, Lies! | 11:51 |
| jaem | oh... | 11:51 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, link? | 11:51 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, I think I should close it as "WORKSFORME" | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | the problem is the '-,' part | 11:51 |
| viliny_ | smoku: and the symlink target probably still exists so maybe i can re-link it there if it's just dropped the link between updates? | 11:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | dneary: i saw your comment | 11:51 |
| jaem | dneary, heh, yes. | 11:51 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, Ah, that wasn't clear to me, sorry :) | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: if you log in, you can see the reporter... | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | the complaint is that it doesn't let me hide my last name | 11:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | even though long ago i told it not to show my last name | 11:52 |
| jaem | ...found it | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: it's actually filed twice | 11:52 |
| jaem | Heh... | 11:53 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, I don't suppose you'd consider setting your last name to t, and your first name to imeless - that would almost solve it | 11:53 |
| timeless_mbp | because filing it the first time didn't work properly | 11:53 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: i'd rather do tim eless | 11:53 |
| ZogG_N900 | dneary, does file manager have details? | 11:53 |
| timeless_mbp | except, i recently met a guy... | 11:53 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, I mean, it wasn't clear to me that "-," was the problem | 11:53 |
| timeless_mbp | dneary: the bug itself wasn't clear? oh dear :( | 11:53 |
| dneary | timeless_mbp, I did actually notice that you were the reporter | 11:54 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, what is your name, anyway? | 11:54 |
| timeless_mbp | i like memorable bug summaries | 11:54 |
| BCMM | zlimvos_: don't see why not, presuming the source is available and it doesn't use any really odd libraries | 11:54 |
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| BCMM | zlimvos_: you'll need a custom kernel if it needs ipv6 support, but there is one in extras-something | 11:54 |
| smoku | viliny_: I guess you would need a fresh PR1.2 flashed N900 for comparison | 11:54 |
| frals | things to do next time in nokialand: find timeless office and see what name is on the door | 11:55 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zalndXdxriI time stamp 10s | 11:55 |
| BCMM | zlimvos_: just try building it according to it's instructions using the SDK | 11:55 |
| timeless_mbp | "that would be telling" | 11:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | frals: sadly the doors in our wing are unreliable | 11:55 |
| zlimvos_ | BCMM: yeap, i saw about that. was hoping it would be in pr1.2 (ipv6 support) put apparently not. i hope this kernel customization is only module changes. Thanx for the info! | 11:55 |
| timeless_mbp | sometimes they're missing people or have names on the wrong offices | 11:56 |
| timeless_mbp | heck my mailbox's label has been wrong for months | 11:56 |
| BCMM | zlimvos_: nah, it's a whole new kernel - don't worry, it probably won't eat your family | 11:56 |
| timeless_mbp | sp3000: is my name on the right door these days? | 11:56 |
| viliny_ | alright well i'll just flash the device again | 11:56 |
| BCMM | zlimvos_: it's nothing too strange really, just a slightly newer kernel with some extra options turned on | 11:56 |
| * timeless_mbp should walk to work just to check | 11:56 | |
| viliny_ | any tips? | 11:56 |
| sp3000 | not the last time I saw it ...last week? | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | frals: see? :) | 11:57 |
| viliny_ | im about to flash the fiasco image in but do i NEED to flash the emmc aswell? | 11:57 |
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| Stskeeps | no | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | viliny_: if you want to lose all your data, you can | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | if you don't want to lose your data, flashing the emmc would be a bad diea | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | s/diea/idea/ | 11:57 |
| infobot | timeless_mbp meant: if you don't want to lose your data, flashing the emmc would be a bad idea | 11:57 |
| frals | timeless_mbp: bah ;) | 11:57 |
| timeless_mbp | frals: thank … um... | 11:58 |
| timeless_mbp | sp3000: what's the name of that group? something resources? | 11:58 |
| timeless_mbp | facilities? | 11:58 |
| timeless_mbp | they're too busy knocking down walls to get the names on offices right | 11:58 |
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| viliny_ | timeless: im having some trouble pasting links to this virtual machine im ircing from but is the RX-51_2009SE_xxxxxx.bin the file i want to use as fiasco? | 11:59 |
| viliny_ | says pr1.2 global | 11:59 |
| frals | hehe timeless_mbp | 11:59 |
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| timeless_mbp | sounds right, but ask someone else, i don't flash regularly | 12:00 |
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| timeless_mbp | heck, i usually get my friends to do it for me :) | 12:00 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 12:00 | |
| timeless_mbp | actually, 2009? | 12:00 |
| timeless_mbp | sounds bad | 12:00 |
| * timeless_mbp grumbles | 12:00 | |
| frals | gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah | 12:00 |
| Psi | so has anyone burned out their n900 by overclocking yet? :P | 12:01 |
| frals | need bugzilla to customise the "comments" field for each product | 12:01 |
| timeless_mbp | which clever person made up the naming convention for those files? :( | 12:01 |
| timeless_mbp | frals: you mean the template? | 12:01 |
| frals | yeah | 12:01 |
| timeless_mbp | you can write your own template links | 12:01 |
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| frals | whereabouts would i do that in bugs.maemo.org? | 12:02 |
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| timeless_mbp | eww | 12:02 |
| timeless_mbp | maybe you can't in bugs.maemo.org | 12:02 |
| timeless_mbp | it looks like someone botched the template? | 12:02 |
| viliny_ | oh is the image supposed to be 180 megs? | 12:03 |
| timeless_mbp | yeh, you can't | 12:03 |
| frals | awesome. | 12:03 |
| timeless_mbp | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Webtools&version=0.9&component=Core&rep_platform=All&op_sys=Mer&priority=Low&bug_severity=enhancement&bug_status=NEW&alias=&bug_file_loc=http%3A%2F%2F&short_desc=[network-manager-applet]%20incorrect%20vpn%20settings%20message%20is%20in%20the%20past%20tense&comment=hi&keywords=&dependson=&blocked=&maketemplate=Remember%20values%20as%20bookmarkable%20template&form_name=enter_bug&assigned_to= | 12:03 |
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| * tybollt tells tim e less about bit.ly and such | 12:03 | |
| timeless_mbp | https://bugs.maemo.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mer&version=0.9&component=Core&rep_platform=All&op_sys=Mer&priority=Low&bug_severity=enhancement&bug_status=NEW&alias=&bug_file_loc=http%3A%2F%2F&short_desc=[network-manager-applet]%20incorrect%20vpn%20settings%20message%20is%20in%20the%20past%20tense&comment=hi&keywords=&dependson=&blocked=&maketemplate=Remember%20values%20as%20bookmarkable%20template&form_name=enter_bug&assigned_to=aklapper%40 | 12:03 |
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| timeless_mbp | tybollt: nah, that'd defeat the point of pasting them | 12:04 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't want people to click them, i want people to read them | 12:04 |
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| jaem | viliny_, the file I downloaded (and successfully flashed) on the 26th is called RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1.002_PR_COMBINED_002_ARM.bin | 12:04 |
| timeless_mbp | stay away from the 002 junk :) | 12:05 |
| jaem | That's either the US or Global one, I forget. | 12:05 |
| jaem | timeless, what is 002? | 12:05 |
| * timeless_mbp pondes | 12:05 | |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 12:05 | |
| jaem | ...I didn't mean philosophically | 12:05 |
| viliny_ | thats not the global one | 12:05 |
| timeless_mbp | stick to global :) | 12:05 |
| viliny_ | mines the global one and thats named differently | 12:05 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, any particular reason? I may anyway, but I'm curious. | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | the 10.2010.19 bit is important | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | jaem: they aren't what's used by the majority of testers | 12:06 |
| viliny_ | aight it's flashing | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | and engineers at nokia generally know very little about what's actually in them | 12:06 |
| viliny_ | hope i won't end up with a brick later today :) | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | or how they differ | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | which means you have something which is just "magically different" | 12:06 |
| timeless_mbp | that's never a good starting point | 12:06 |
| jaem | timeless_mbp, ah, good to know. | 12:07 |
| timeless_mbp | it isn't that we can't flash w/ it | 12:07 |
| timeless_mbp | or that they're entirely untested | 12:07 |
| jaem | Is the global firmware "generic", then, for those purposes? | 12:07 |
| jaem | No, I understand. | 12:07 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 12:07 |
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| jaem | It makes sense, and thanks. | 12:07 |
| timeless_mbp | this of course doesn't necessarily align w/ nokia's message | 12:07 |
| timeless_mbp | but i'm not nokia's messenger :) | 12:07 |
| jaem | Yeah, that caveat was implicit, as far as I'm concerned, but it's useful to know, from my end of things. | 12:08 |
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| vallhalla | good * all i need a hand removing a broken deb file install faild when installedwith dpkg -i kde-mmc.deb now i seem unable to remove it with dpkg -r kde-mmc.deb or with apt-get install -f | 12:09 |
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| tybollt | vallhalla: apt-get autoclean | 12:10 |
| tybollt | vallhalla: apt-get autoremove | 12:10 |
| tybollt | ? | 12:10 |
| vallhalla | tybollt: thank you for sugestion but i have tryed that also and to no avail | 12:10 |
| viliny_ | aight, reflashed and phone seems to be ok | 12:11 |
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| viliny_ | thanks guys :) | 12:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | vallhalla: dpkg -P ... | 12:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | but hopefully you learned a lesson: don't randomly install debs | 12:14 |
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| jaem | timeless_mbp, I agree. If you want to trash your system, you should plan it out very carefully. | 12:17 |
| jaem | :P | 12:17 |
| vallhalla | jelly: the comand i ran to install was dpkg -i kde-mmc.deb and the error was cannot remove /etc/nss_mdns.conf no such file or directory dpkg error while cleaning up error exit status 1 | 12:17 |
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| jaem | vallhalla, what is the deb in question? | 12:18 |
| Psi | he's probably trying to install wine :P | 12:19 |
| vallhalla | jaem: it was to insall kde on the device the file is called kde-3.5.8-mmc1.deb | 12:19 |
| vallhalla | Psi: tht would be silly | 12:20 |
| Psi | exactly :P | 12:20 |
| jaem | Psi, What?! You mean WINE *isn't* an emulator?! | 12:20 |
| jaem | hehe | 12:20 |
| Psi | hehe | 12:20 |
| vallhalla | tho it can be done with the use of qemu i would have no use for it | 12:21 |
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| jaem | Yeah... | 12:22 |
| jaem | I did at one point try running Windows 3.1 on my N810 | 12:22 |
| jaem | Microsoft sure did a pretty poor job with their power management subsystem. | 12:23 |
| Psi | there is a youtube of someone running win95 in dosbox on n900 | 12:23 |
| jaem | ...either that, or it was never meant to run emulated on a phone. | 12:23 |
| jaem | meh | 12:23 |
| jaem | :) | 12:23 |
| jaem | Psi, yes, I believe it takes about half an hour to boot. | 12:23 |
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| Psi | yeah | 12:24 |
| Psi | it was slow++ | 12:24 |
| jaem | *yawn* Goodnight, all. | 12:24 |
| jaem | Thanks for the help, $helpfulpeople | 12:25 |
| jaem | I'm too lazy to export that variable properly, so assume an appropriate value | 12:25 |
| jaem | :) | 12:25 |
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| timeless_mbp | lol | 12:28 |
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| chem|st | morning | 12:33 |
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| MohammadAG | morning | 12:33 |
| chem|st | has s/o a link ready for how "contacts" works? | 12:33 |
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| chem|st | like where/how are merges stored, I am looking at dbus atm | 12:34 |
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| pupnik | smoku: around? http://download.gna.org/warzone/releases/0.2 | 12:35 |
| chem|st | I still have the problem that the connections between contacts -> [calendar,chat] are messed up | 12:35 |
| pupnik | smoku: disable opengl, install many libraries, and if you get sound, ukki and i will buy you beer | 12:36 |
| jaska | i always read gna.org as gnaa.org :| | 12:36 |
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| ZogG_N900 | hoho | 12:38 |
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| ZogG_N900 | in video of "ew nokia research n900 has portrait mode | 12:38 |
| ZogG_N900 | for menu at list | 12:39 |
| ZogG_N900 | even with battery status and watch | 12:39 |
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| ZogG_N900 | ping | 12:40 |
| phellarv | MohammadAG: There? | 12:42 |
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| * MohammadAG hides | 12:43 | |
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| phellarv | MohammadAG: Hehe - Did you have a non-crippled apt lying around? | 12:43 |
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| phellarv | MohammadAG: No? | 12:46 |
| * frals throws a whale at MohammadAG | 12:47 | |
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| ZogG_N900 | MohammadAG, saw today beautiful arabic girl, wanted to give her your phone ) | 12:48 |
| MohammadAG | o.O | 12:48 |
| * MohammadAG throws a white whale at frals - have fun | 12:48 | |
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| MohammadAG | phellarv, I'm pretty sure sharing it is now illegal :) | 12:49 |
| MohammadAG | reviewing the points... | 12:49 |
| MohammadAG | 1. they took down that specific source | 12:49 |
| MohammadAG | 2. they made user/hidden installs fail | 12:49 |
| MohammadAG | 3. ovi store apps are in user/hidden | 12:49 |
| MohammadAG | and i'm not delaying the ovi store :) | 12:50 |
| phellarv | MohammadAG: Aha - That's why the link I found was gone with the wind. | 12:50 |
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| ZogG_N900 | MohammadAG, are u the one who hacked ovi? | 12:50 |
| MohammadAG | which link? | 12:50 |
| phellarv | On TMO | 12:50 |
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| MohammadAG | ZogG_N900, i never hacked it, actually i don't 'hack' sites, never read a how to about it | 12:50 |
| MohammadAG | phellarv, link me to the link | 12:51 |
| timeless_mbp | ZogG: typically people aren't languages | 12:51 |
| phellarv | MohammadAG: /q | 12:51 |
| phellarv | MohammadAG: /query | 12:51 |
| ScriptFanix | Hi there | 12:51 |
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| chem|st | Hilzu: | 12:52 |
| chem|st | damn | 12:52 |
| chem|st | wc | 12:52 |
| chem|st | so any idea on how to resurrect ossoAbook? | 12:53 |
| chem|st | its so weird | 12:53 |
| ScriptFanix | is there any package providing ionice for OS2008? I installed MPD on my N800, worked great until the device rebooted unepectedly. Since then, I'm having serious performance issues (i remove metalayer-crawler) | 12:53 |
| ZogG_N900 | MohammadAG is haxor | 12:53 |
| ZogG_N900 | hellhaxor | 12:53 |
| ZogG_N900 | o.0 | 12:54 |
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| TomaszD | zaheerm, ping.. | 12:55 |
| zaheerm | TomaszD, pong :) | 12:55 |
| chem|st | ScriptFanix: if its not in the repos I guess not | 12:55 |
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| ScriptFanix | what i do not understand is that MPD worked just fine until the reboot. as I purged metalayer-*, i don't understand which process(es) / daemon(s) are hogging the system (too many IOs) | 12:57 |
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| manjiri | Any idea how one can go about building a virtual keyboard that uses harmattan UI framework? | 13:00 |
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| SpeedEvil | ScriptFanix: strace? | 13:00 |
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| ScriptFanix | SpeedEvil: i don'ts see how this would be of any use. MPD does many ios because it needs to read files from the SD card, the problem is that some other process is making too many IO for MPD to read its files fast enough | 13:03 |
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| guille_ | hi there | 13:04 |
| ScriptFanix | (I'm using MPD because media-player and canola2 are unusable with a 7400+ file collection) | 13:05 |
| ShadowJK | Amusingly netstreaming has less skips | 13:06 |
| guille_ | do you know some good bus planner for london? | 13:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | ScriptFanix: Find which processes are at all active. | 13:08 |
| SpeedEvil | ScriptFanix: top - for example | 13:08 |
| SpeedEvil | ScriptFanix: then strace them to find out if they are doing lots of IO | 13:08 |
| ShadowJK | especially look for fsync() calls | 13:09 |
| ShadowJK | they can block other IO for several seconds | 13:09 |
| sp3000 | timeless: wr! | 13:09 |
| ShadowJK | and some apps do tons of them | 13:09 |
| sp3000 | timeless: also, fish | 13:10 |
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| ScriptFanix | SpeedEvil: thanks, i'm gonna do that as soon as i get wifi connectivity (i don't have strace installed :/ ) | 13:14 |
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| SpeedEvil | Swapping can be somethign that won't show up on strace | 13:21 |
| SpeedEvil | Also | 13:21 |
| SpeedEvil | SD cards can drop in performance as they age | 13:21 |
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| Khertan_ | Hi all ! | 13:21 |
| Dassu | ò_ó we don't take kindly people who "hi all!" | 13:22 |
| Khertan_ | gniagnia ! | 13:22 |
| Khertan_ | :) | 13:22 |
| ScriptFanix | SpeedEvil: the SD is 1 week old | 13:23 |
| Khertan_ | Is there any news about the Maemo OBS ? | 13:23 |
| SpeedEvil | k | 13:24 |
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| X-Fade | Khertan_: Still working on it, starting to look ok. | 13:26 |
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| X-Fade | It uncovered a problem we have with build-depends promotion, which I needed to fix first ;) | 13:27 |
| Khertan_ | X-Fade: thx for the information ... | 13:27 |
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| ghostcube | o/ | 13:27 |
| ghostcube | is there an flash update somewhere for fennec 1.01? | 13:27 |
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| pupnik | can we get a real serial console on jtag? | 13:27 |
| Khertan_ | X-Fade: did you got also any answer from people wanting to maintain the PyGTKEditor and PyPackager Package ? | 13:27 |
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| Khertan_ | X-Fade: i didn't got any request about that | 13:28 |
| jacekowski | pupnik: jtag isn't anywhere close to serial console | 13:28 |
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| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: do you have beagle board? | 13:28 |
| X-Fade | Khertan_: For pypackager the pymaemo guys were looking into hat. | 13:29 |
| X-Fade | *that | 13:29 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I do not. | 13:29 |
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| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I'm currently not having the heating on as an economy measure - the n900 was my sole extravagence in the last year | 13:29 |
| SpeedEvil | well - two | 13:30 |
| tybollt | ghostcube: go for fennec 1.2, it's teh shit!11 | 13:30 |
| tristan | worth it? | 13:30 |
| ghostcube | so still not working with youtube :D | 13:31 |
| jacekowski | hmmmmm | 13:31 |
| jacekowski | who owns beagle board here? | 13:31 |
| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: no heating? | 13:31 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: yes. | 13:31 |
| jacekowski | why? | 13:31 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: Because it costs money. | 13:32 |
| jacekowski | internet costs money | 13:32 |
| jacekowski | life costs money | 13:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Indeed. | 13:32 |
| jaska | dunno where you need heating this time of year, on northern hemisphere (unless in greenland) | 13:32 |
| phellarv | SpeedEvil: OC your N900 - New heat source - Problem solved. | 13:32 |
| SpeedEvil | But if it's a choice between wearing more jumpers. | 13:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | And no internets. | 13:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Scotland. | 13:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | And all winter. | 13:33 |
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| SpeedEvil | Not just now. | 13:33 |
| jacekowski | what about winder? | 13:33 |
| jacekowski | winter* | 13:33 |
| jacekowski | omfg | 13:33 |
| jaska | yeah, winter is different, no heating would mean death :) (.fi) | 13:33 |
| jacekowski | there was like -10 there | 13:33 |
| SpeedEvil | It only got to 5C inside, which was managable with an electric blanket. | 13:33 |
| jacekowski | do you know that you can squeeze some money from government if you can't afford to heat your house? | 13:34 |
| asj__ | wtf is it with people angle grinding themselves? | 13:34 |
| Khertan_ | X-Fade: thx | 13:34 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: Not if you are in my demographic. | 13:34 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: And I'm able. | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I just wouldn't have any internet. | 13:35 |
| ghostcube | https://www.mozilla.com/en-US/mobile/1.1b1/releasenotes/ | 13:35 |
| ghostcube | anyone testet it? | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | nope | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | You'll be the first. | 13:35 |
| Scelt | april 28th | 13:36 |
| ghostcube | nah ... If you installed Firefox 1.0 from the Ovi Store, you will not be able to upgrade to Firefox 1.1 Beta 1 (either from the N900 Application Manager or by downloading the software from Mozilla). | 13:36 |
| ghostcube | grml | 13:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Is there a nice way to go from a package name to its QA page? | 13:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Or alternatively, to get the QA list on one page | 13:38 |
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| Khertan_ | SpeedEvil: http://maemo.org/packages/view/packagenameyouwwanttosee/ | 13:40 |
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| pupnik | http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=meego_10_perf&num=1 meego performance vs ubuntu, moblin, fedora | 13:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | hmm | 13:47 |
| SpeedEvil | That would explain it - it wasn't in the QA queue :) | 13:47 |
| * SpeedEvil is having a 'submitting minor bugs' day. | 13:47 | |
| * MohammadAG marks all as duplicates | 13:49 | |
| SpeedEvil | I have a cunning way to avoid that. | 13:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Find programs with no bugs in their trackers. | 13:50 |
| jaska | haha | 13:50 |
| MohammadAG | lol | 13:51 |
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| mece | 'ello maemites | 13:52 |
| hrw | I love how maemo bugs are moved to brainstorm | 13:52 |
| mece | hrw, say what now? | 13:52 |
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| hrw | bug 6931 | 13:52 |
| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6931 After installation of software last icon in list has default icon instead of own one | 13:53 |
| Khertan_ | hrw: maybe better than fixed in hartman :) | 13:53 |
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| hrw | Khertan_: 'moved to brainstorm' other way of 'wontfix' | 13:53 |
| ghostcube | :D | 13:53 |
| hrw | hmm 6931 got reopened | 13:53 |
| ghostcube | like apple bug tracker | 13:53 |
| SpeedEvil | Is there an easy way to list all applications that appear in HAM's 'delete package' list? | 13:54 |
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| SpeedEvil | apt-cache can tell me all apps. | 13:54 |
| SpeedEvil | I want 'user-visible' ones that I can test. | 13:54 |
| hrw | bug 6933 will not be fixed | 13:54 |
| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6933 Alarm times are shown wrong | 13:54 |
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| Khertan_ | hrw: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6931#c33 << | 13:55 |
| povbot` | Bug 6931: After installation of software last icon in list has default icon instead of own one | 13:55 |
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| hrw | yep | 13:55 |
| Khertan_ | hum ... i ve still report on old version of PyGTKEditor ... should i say to user after installing my repository to open xterm and : 'sudo gainroot' then 'apt-get udpate && apt-get upgrade pygtkeditor' | 13:57 |
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| mece | Speedevil you want an "installed applications" list in xterm? | 14:00 |
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| SpeedEvil | something like that | 14:01 |
| mece | hmm.. | 14:01 |
| hrw | SpeedEvil: dpkg -l|awk '{print $2}' | 14:01 |
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| mece | awk ftw | 14:01 |
| SpeedEvil | No. | 14:01 |
| mece | awk sounde slike the sound some weird flightless bird makes. | 14:01 |
| hrw | one day I will learn it | 14:01 |
| SpeedEvil | I want a user-visible list of applications. | 14:01 |
| mece | what does user-visible list? | 14:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - awk '$0=$2' is shorter | 14:02 |
| mece | mean | 14:02 |
| SpeedEvil | I mean the list that shows up in HAM when I click 'delete' | 14:02 |
| mece | you mean the stuff that is listed in ham uninstall | 14:02 |
| mece | righty. | 14:02 |
| mece | hm | 14:02 |
| hrw | SpeedEvil: so you want list of packages from 'user/*' sections | 14:03 |
| MohammadAG | which are installed | 14:03 |
| hrw | for pkg in `dpkg -l | awk '$0=$2 | 14:03 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure - I haven't looked as to how the package manager works in detail | 14:03 |
| hrw | for pkg in `dpkg -l | awk '$0=$2';do [ ! -z `apt-cache show $pkg|grep '^Section: user/'` ] && echo $pkg;done | 14:04 |
| hrw | not tested | 14:04 |
| hrw | s/2'/2'`/ | 14:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | hmm | 14:10 |
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| SpeedEvil | That doesn't work - I do see now how to get the info out of dpkg -l and apt-cache with a little munging | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | thanks! | 14:10 |
| smoku | autobuilder is broken again... how cute... | 14:11 |
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| lardman | hmm, Nokia Point and Find looks nice | 14:13 |
| lardman | shame it's not for Maemo; sounds somewhat familiar | 14:13 |
| RST38bis | "Castrated EU telecommunications regulator BEREC has now been relocated to Riga, Latvia - a mere 900 miles from everyone else." | 14:13 |
| RST38bis | EHLO lardman, how is life treating you? | 14:14 |
| lardman | hey RST38bis | 14:14 |
| lardman | ok, very busy at work though | 14:14 |
| lardman | just need to get through the next couple of weeks | 14:15 |
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| RST38bis | same here, except there is no end in sight =( | 14:15 |
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| lardman | yeah, well 2 weeks isn't the end, but at least I'll have time to breath then ;) | 14:17 |
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| Macer | hm | 14:18 |
| Macer | nice day out. think i will go for a jog | 14:18 |
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| lardman | raining here | 14:19 |
| Macer | it was raining bad here yesterday | 14:19 |
| Macer | luckily it was a holiday otherwise driving would have been a pain | 14:19 |
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| Macer | i had to go through the west side too... so even more lucky that black people dont go outside when it is raining | 14:20 |
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| Milo- | how do you turn the gps on without opening ovi maps? | 14:21 |
| Milo- | can't find a button | 14:21 |
| Khertan_ | Hi again ! | 14:21 |
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| lardman | Milo-: start something that uses it | 14:21 |
| SwedeMike | Milo-: you also have the problem that your "im location" isn't updated unless you start maps? | 14:21 |
| Milo- | SwedeMike 'speedometer' doesn't update the speed | 14:21 |
| Milo- | so I figure it requires gps | 14:22 |
| lardman | SwedeMike: that's a good thing though, saves draining the battery | 14:22 |
| Milo- | but I don't want to start ovi maps each time I want to check my speed | 14:22 |
| lardman | Milo-: speedometer need to be changed then so that it keeps the gps open | 14:22 |
| Khertan_ | Milo-: personnaly for checking speed (and radars i use roadrunner) | 14:22 |
| Macer | i was expecting a ton of traffic when i drove through the west side because there are usually family reunions at a park there which makes traffic horrible | 14:23 |
| Macer | so the rain was kind of a blessing | 14:23 |
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| SwedeMike | lardman: well, I'd like it to at least look at the mobile network basestations etc and do a location conclusion, it doesn't have to actually start the satellite receiver. | 14:24 |
| lardman | SwedeMike: that's also provided by liblocation, depending on how you call it | 14:25 |
| Milo- | lardman but as far as I know, speedometer has no settings | 14:25 |
| SpeedEvil | SwedeMike: Location that way can be very inaccurate | 14:25 |
| SpeedEvil | as in multiple kilometers off | 14:25 |
| SwedeMike | SpeedEvil: I need city level accuracy, so it's fine. | 14:25 |
| SwedeMike | basically the location it sets in google talk and Skype isn't updated well enough continously. | 14:26 |
| SwedeMike | I usually have to start the ovi map application for that to work, sometimes even that doesn't help | 14:26 |
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| TomaszD | http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/01/meego-moorestown-powered-tablet-hands-on/ | 14:27 |
| Khertan_ | Someone know what class / attribute should i look in the Qt Documentation to display a throbber near the QMainWindow title ? | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: that does look sweet | 14:28 |
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| TomaszD | apart from viewing angles, yes | 14:29 |
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| frals | it looks really nice | 14:29 |
| TomaszD | that IPS panel apple put in the ipad is miles ahead, I hope this is just an engineering sample | 14:29 |
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| Khertan_ | Sweet ! i like the panel style ! | 14:30 |
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| TomaszD | Acer plans to run MeeGo on their netbooks and tablets | 14:31 |
| TomaszD | things are beginning to sound good | 14:31 |
| SwedeMike | wonder if MeeGo or Android will be the one to prefer on tablets like that | 14:31 |
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| Milo- | tablets are pointless | 14:32 |
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| Khertan_ | TomaszD: it s sound good ... but a bit slowly ... | 14:32 |
| tybollt | SwedeMike: Uhm there's going to be ChromeOS for netbooks | 14:32 |
| Khertan_ | :( | 14:32 |
| TomaszD | Milo-, thanks for your input on this | 14:33 |
| tybollt | android was designed for smartphones not netbooks | 14:33 |
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| SwedeMike | tybollt: good, then we have plenty of choices :) | 14:33 |
| Milo- | too big to be hand held, too small to do anything useful | 14:33 |
| TomaszD | I'd love to see all the major players on netbooks on tablets | 14:33 |
| tybollt | that's why I am a tad confused wrt meego | 14:33 |
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| tybollt | that sets out to work as fine ona phone as ona netbook not taking into account (obviously?) that the actual screen realestate varies ... by several orders of magnitude. | 14:34 |
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| lardman | re size I quite like the size of the Dell Streak | 14:43 |
| mJo_ | Any idea how one can go about building a virtual keyboard that uses harmattan UI framework? Also what event do I need to listen to in order to replace the current virtual keyboard with on of my own? | 14:43 |
| lardman | N800 replacement sort of thing | 14:43 |
| lardman | mJo_: there should be docs on the wiki about this | 14:43 |
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| mJo_ | lardman: I have been looking. Found one for Hildon not harmattan. | 14:44 |
| lardman | ah sorry | 14:44 |
| lardman | probably in git then, but I don't know | 14:44 |
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| mJo_ | git has very little info | 14:45 |
| lardman | no code? No idea then, sorry | 14:46 |
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| mJo_ | lardman: code is ofcourse there. No tutorial , or a how-to. | 14:47 |
| lardman | ah well, that's something different ;) | 14:47 |
| lardman | I imagine that will appear once harmattan is finalised | 14:47 |
| lardman | assuming it ever appears, as aren't we all moving to Meego now anyway (with or without N900 support)# | 14:48 |
| lardman | ? | 14:48 |
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| vallhalla | what is the best way to update my phone n900 on a linux system | 14:52 |
| lardman | OTA without a computer needed or reflash using flasher-3.4 | 14:52 |
| lardman | 3.5 | 14:52 |
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| vallhalla | ok using flasher i go to a link and there is a list of files it is not to clear what on is most revent | 14:53 |
| vallhalla | recent* | 14:53 |
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| lardman | is this the FIASCO image or the flasher? | 14:55 |
| vallhalla | the image | 14:55 |
| lardman | re the FIASCO image it should say something along the lines of *this is the latest one* | 14:55 |
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| lardman | what version numbers do you have? Sould be a 2010 one | 14:55 |
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| vallhalla | just looking for files now | 14:57 |
| mJo_ | I am guessing harmattan UI framework will be used in Meego | 14:57 |
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| lardman | I've no idea, I'd guess at least some of it would be, as Meego is the underlying system iirc and needs to be skinned | 14:58 |
| mJo_ | coz the duikeyboard is called m-keyboard for meego keyboard | 14:59 |
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| tybollt | vallhalla: you are Valteri Halla? | 15:00 |
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| Surfa | not likely | 15:01 |
| Stskeeps | doubt it, he only has one l | 15:01 |
| tybollt | roger | 15:01 |
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| vallhalla | ok found the latest | 15:02 |
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| vallhalla | next silly question what is the eMMC image used for? | 15:03 |
| tybollt | as I've said erarlier | 15:03 |
| ghostcube | if you have an old device thats needing an emmc flash | 15:04 |
| tybollt | eMMC image is for flashing the eMMC | 15:04 |
| tybollt | the eMMC is where your pr0n is | 15:04 |
| vallhalla | emmc bieng the internal storage? | 15:04 |
| vallhalla | tybollt: no sorry | 15:05 |
| vallhalla | not valteri | 15:05 |
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| DAREAPER | hi | 15:06 |
| auenf | hai | 15:07 |
| DAREAPER | on pressing ctrl+shift+r in an app we can rotate our screen but after it rotates , on clicking the area near the battery icon it dosent open | 15:08 |
| DAREAPER | it opens only in landscape mode | 15:08 |
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| DAREAPER | is that a bug ? | 15:09 |
| ghostcube | nope an feature | 15:09 |
| ghostcube | :D | 15:09 |
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| frals | ah, "My Nokia" at its finest, links to nokia.se/softwareupdate which is claiming latest fw is 2.2009.51.1 | 15:09 |
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| FauxFaux | Nokia SVERRRRRRRGEEEEEE. | 15:10 |
| Myrtti | er, right. | 15:10 |
| DAREAPER | but u didnt get wat i meant | 15:11 |
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| DAREAPER | while viewing a app in potrait mode the area where the battery icon is shown becomes unclickable | 15:12 |
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| RST38bis | You are not supposed to click Ctrl+Shift+R. It is an experimental mode. | 15:13 |
| tybollt | frals: I never figured how to opt out of that spam shitz :( | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | portrait mode is not supposed to work flawlessly | 15:13 |
| RST38bis | Once you enable it, all expectations become invalid | 15:13 |
| frals | tybollt: Settings -> 'My Nokia' -> unsubscribe | 15:13 |
| RST38bis | And hello, Myrtti | 15:13 |
| DAREAPER | oh ok its still buggy | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | frals: Which fails. | 15:13 |
| Myrtti | oahi. | 15:13 |
| SpeedEvil | frals: And seems to cost money | 15:13 |
| frals | SpeedEvil: WORKEDFORME :) | 15:13 |
| frals | probably charges you for an sms thou | 15:13 |
| tybollt | frals: <ångest> måste... komma ihåg... password... till... skiten... </ångest> | 15:14 |
| joga | what's this ctrl-shift-r thing? | 15:14 |
| frals | tybollt: dont need a password? O_o | 15:14 |
| tybollt | frals: this in your phone now? I thought you mean like www.nokia.se -> click "my Nokia" | 15:14 |
| frals | tybollt: in my phone yes ;) | 15:14 |
| tybollt | kollar | 15:15 |
| tybollt | nice :D | 15:15 |
| tybollt | thanks | 15:15 |
| tybollt | I had no idea it was there :) | 15:15 |
| ag0ny | Is there any chance to get Flash working with Opera on Maemo 5? | 15:15 |
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| Myrtti | ag0ny: very slim to nonexistant. | 15:15 |
| ghostcube | hmm i would be glad if flash would work with fennec on maemo :D | 15:15 |
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| ag0ny | That is sad. Opera is pretty quick | 15:16 |
| ghostcube | isnt there an chrome build in devel? | 15:16 |
| tybollt | frals: AHAHAHAHAHA... "attempt to unsubscribe has failed" | 15:16 |
| tybollt | frals: Epic NOOKLA win! | 15:17 |
| frals | tybollt: pwnd! | 15:17 |
| ghostcube | tybollt: so you havent been enabled :D | 15:17 |
| tybollt | frals: oh hell yes :D | 15:17 |
| DAREAPER | on trying to unsubscribe from nokia it sends an sms saying attempt to unsubscribe failed | 15:17 |
| DAREAPER | and it charges me for the sms too | 15:17 |
| ghostcube | hmm i send one and i quit it succesfull | 15:17 |
| pupnik | Google to ban windows PCs from corporation :) | 15:18 |
| ghostcube | woot? | 15:18 |
| ghostcube | link or it didnt happen | 15:18 |
| ghostcube | -.- | 15:18 |
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| ghostcube | heh | 15:19 |
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| phellarv | http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/d2f3f04e-6ccf-11df-91c8-00144feab49a.html | 15:20 |
| phellarv | http://www.tuaw.com/2010/05/31/google-to-employees-mac-or-linux-but-no-more-windows/ | 15:20 |
| phellarv | No windows at google | 15:20 |
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| RST38bis | How to make a lot of people pissed when the device gets released: http://mynokiablog.com/2010/05/29/video-meego-qa-with-alberto-torres-nokia-evp-meego-computers-at-openmobile/ | 15:21 |
| Noma | "MeeGo phone will be capacitive" :( | 15:23 |
| RST38bis | Whatever it will be, the expectation of gullible people will exceed it | 15:23 |
| tristan | experience beyond symbian eh | 15:23 |
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| Shapeshifter | There has been a change in how the gprs counter counts. Any clues? I had previously unset /system/osso/connectivity/network_type/GPRS/gprs_rx_bytes but that doesn't exist anymore. Which one is the correspondent in the new value set? gprs_home_rx_bytes? | 15:24 |
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| tybollt | nice | 15:24 |
| Shapeshifter | I mean, looking at gconftool-2 -R /system/osso/connectivity/network_type/GPRS the only ones counting bytes are these two gprs_home_tx_bytes and gprs_home_rx_bytes. What is the "home" about? home as in own provider? | 15:24 |
| tybollt | nokia have now sent me about 20 sms in the last two minutes w/ exact same message "Attempt to unsubscribe failed..." | 15:24 |
| Shapeshifter | as opposed to roaming? | 15:24 |
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| SpeedEvil | Shapeshifter: yes | 15:25 |
| SpeedEvil | Shapeshifter: personal-gprs-monitor got updated | 15:25 |
| SpeedEvil | tybollt: chargeable? | 15:25 |
| RST38bis | And yes, I would love to see how S60 bosses at Nokia react to his statement that the next flagman will NOT be running Symbian =) | 15:25 |
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| pupnik | nokia needs to indicate change and motion to investors | 15:26 |
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| tybollt | SpeedEvil: no I don't pay to receive texts :) | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | pupnik: liblocation | 15:27 |
| pupnik | nice :) | 15:27 |
| tybollt | do you? | 15:27 |
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| mece | ~seen smoku | 15:27 |
| infobot | smoku is currently on #maemo (1h 21m 50s) #meego (1h 21m 50s). Has said a total of 1 messages. Is idling for 1h 16m 6s, last said: 'autobuilder is broken again... how cute...'. | 15:27 |
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| mece | smoku, opendune is in devel now. | 15:28 |
| mece | smoku, thank you so much for that. I need that spice to liveeeeee!! | 15:28 |
| pupnik | is the engine working? | 15:28 |
| mece | which engine? | 15:28 |
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| vallhalla | is there a bot here | 15:29 |
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| Shapeshifter | SpeedEvil: but why's there nothing like, say "gprs_roaming_rx_bytes"? Is that because I never used roaming? | 15:30 |
| kirma | RST38bis: I sense slavic influence in the use of "flagman" for "flagship" | 15:30 |
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| Nadley | hi everybody | 15:31 |
| RST38bis | kirma: Yea, I have come by this abomination of an interview at a Russian news site. | 15:31 |
| vallhalla | hi dr nick | 15:32 |
| vallhalla | oo sory hehe | 15:32 |
| tybollt | hello dr nick! | 15:32 |
| tybollt | :D | 15:32 |
| kirma | I came across the term mostly on the side of a vodka bottle. :P | 15:32 |
| Nadley | I want to start my first application for maemo but I don't find documentation to start. The documentation I find is for the old version of maemo. Somebody can help me | 15:32 |
| ghostcube | hmm, so N900 wont get an meego if i understood this right eh? | 15:32 |
| * vallhalla hopes not for meego | 15:33 | |
| Shapeshifter | ghostcube: not officially, but it's kinda sure some version will run fine. | 15:33 |
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| kirma | ghostcube: everything strongly points to the direction that there will be nokia-supported commercial version | 15:33 |
| * ENTERANICK [W2I=000:u:0:000:] | 15:33 | |
| tybollt | ghostcube: not an OFFICIAL meego | 15:33 |
| ghostcube | hmm, oki thx guys | 15:33 |
| ghostcube | :) | 15:34 |
| frals | tybollt: hah, tele2.se got the N900 under "we recommend", not seen that anywhere before in .se :P | 15:34 |
| tybollt | ghostcube: but since in effect what the nokia meego team uses now is N900 to build meego - yes there will be SOME KIND of meego - be sure of that | 15:34 |
| kirma | there may be a functional version, though. how much it lacks in comparison to the next device with meego, hard to say... but probably there are notable omissions | 15:34 |
| ghostcube | i know the devs running N900 that was the point i didnt get it why no meego will be on N900 | 15:34 |
| tybollt | frals: that's pretty interesting considering the average sven svensson numbnut probably won't understand lots of things about maemo :) | 15:35 |
| frals | tybollt: even more interesting is it says "eletronic compass" under specification | 15:35 |
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| kirma | tybollt: but nobody has said that Meego devices would be based entirely on open source components... Nokia may and most probably is going to have central pieces of UX/applications only for their own installations | 15:35 |
| kirma | that's my speculation, but still | 15:36 |
| tybollt | ghostcube: My guess; Nokia will officially require all Meego devices to have capacitive touch screen | 15:36 |
| ghostcube | capacitive is bad ass ... | 15:36 |
| tybollt | ghostcube: and thus N900 is excluded | 15:36 |
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| kirma | multitouch-ness of the display is certainly something that is problematic to work around on a non-multitouch device | 15:36 |
| tybollt | frals: that's BS obviously :S | 15:36 |
| jaska | capacitive feels inaccurate, and you need a special stylus for it :) | 15:36 |
| Noma | resistive >>> capacitive | 15:37 |
| ZogG | heeey | 15:37 |
| mece | you can't really play freeciv sdl on capacitive. other than that it's fine. | 15:37 |
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| mece | I'd like some new tech for my next device. | 15:37 |
| kirma | I think there have been rumors/speculation of manufacturers, Nokia included, looking at hybrid resistive-capacitive touchscreens | 15:37 |
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| mece | sensitivity of cap and accuracy and stylus use of res | 15:38 |
| bbg | Hello, Does anybody know in what encoding E_CONTACT_SIP in N900? | 15:38 |
| mece | kirma, I've heard, but I don't think they are production ready any time soon. | 15:38 |
| bbg | itry to get in UTF8 but? but it is wrong | 15:39 |
| kirma | probably not on the timeframe Nokia optimistically would want the device on market... somehow I've noticed their wordings have changed in a way that the device, which was obviously targeted for christmas market earlier, is now spoken to be "announced" this year | 15:39 |
| kirma | fearing the fate of N97... | 15:39 |
| Nadley | I need documentation to start developping an app for Maemo5 with Esbox | 15:40 |
| mece | heey petermaemo responded to twitter widget problems. | 15:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, well, since they're now called MeeGo Devices. . . . *eg* | 15:41 |
| tybollt | GeneralAntilles: Source? | 15:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | tybollt, um, Ari's blog or something like that. | 15:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've seen the string once or twice. | 15:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | tybollt, fwiw, http://www.linux.com/news/featured-blogs/185:jennifer-cloer/300225:qa-with-nokias-ari-jaaksi-meego-revs-up | 15:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | First line. | 15:43 |
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| achipa | tybollt: MeeGo is input agnostic. The speficic UXes might not be. | 15:45 |
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| ZogG | i have a question about vkbrd | 15:48 |
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| ZogG | if it separete pckg | 15:48 |
| ZogG | why can't we change it to portrait? | 15:49 |
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| Mece | what's preferrable? symlink from /usr/bin to binary in opt, or .sh file in /usr/bin? | 15:55 |
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| SpeedEvil | I'd go with a symlink | 15:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | .sh file will launch an extra process | 15:57 |
| jacekowski | you can always exec at the end | 15:58 |
| SpeedEvil | It still loads it into RAM | 15:58 |
| jacekowski | well, bash is loaded all the time | 15:58 |
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| SpeedEvil | no it's not | 15:58 |
| SpeedEvil | And you mean busybox shell | 15:58 |
| SpeedEvil | There is a non-zero cost in launching it. | 15:58 |
| SpeedEvil | It's small. | 15:58 |
| SpeedEvil | But if it's an either-or choice - and there is no penalty - why? | 15:59 |
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| vallhalla | befor i updated my phone (n900) i could use the terminal to sudo apt-get update now when i try it askes for a password now i have installed rootsh is there one i am missing ?? or is there now a passwd? | 16:07 |
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| E0x | vallhalla: sudo gainroot | 16:08 |
| E0x | then apt-get.... | 16:08 |
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| vallhalla | E0x: i never had to do that before why has this changed | 16:09 |
| vallhalla | E0x: also if i sudo gainroot it askes for password | 16:10 |
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| crashanddie | interesting, one of my pictures has the following exif data: "Subject Distance: 2147483647 m" | 16:13 |
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| E0x | if you install rootsh not need asking about any password | 16:14 |
| jaska | thats rather... far | 16:14 |
| crashanddie | 2 million km range, and accurate metering... w00t | 16:14 |
| E0x | m | 16:14 |
| crashanddie | no, km | 16:14 |
| crashanddie | or it would be 2 trillion m | 16:14 |
| E0x | ok | 16:14 |
| Scelt | trillion? | 16:14 |
| Scelt | in what country | 16:14 |
| jaska | the NRO will be contacting you to acquire your camera soon. | 16:14 |
| Scelt | yankees say billion | 16:14 |
| Scelt | we say milliard | 16:15 |
| crashanddie | Scelt: ah, crap | 16:15 |
| jaska | or whatever govt organization does spy sats in your country :) | 16:15 |
| Scelt | what do brits say? billion? | 16:15 |
| jaska | brits use short scale these days i think | 16:15 |
| crashanddie | Scelt: I read the wikipedia article on this once, can't remember though | 16:15 |
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| Scelt | crashanddie: it's very confusing | 16:15 |
| Scelt | it's easier to say thousand millions | 16:16 |
| jaska | i use short scale in english, long scale in finnish :) | 16:16 |
| smoku | Scelt: brits convert to miles ;-) | 16:16 |
| crashanddie | Scelt: I think in short scale, I just used the wrong word there, for some reason | 16:16 |
| Scelt | smoku: ;D | 16:16 |
| Scelt | jaska: tuhat miljoonaa? | 16:16 |
| jaska | scelt: miljardi | 16:17 |
| Scelt | isn't that the short scale? | 16:17 |
| jaska | thats long scale | 16:17 |
| Scelt | don't get it | 16:17 |
| jaska | short scale would be to say 1000 million = billion | 16:17 |
| Scelt | "thousand millions" is longer than "milliard" | 16:17 |
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| crashanddie | jaska: yes, which is proper reasonning :) | 16:18 |
| crashanddie | jaska: it's the same as kilo before gram, meaning a thousand. | 16:18 |
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| sECuRE | how can i install a package in MADDE? seems like mad-admin does not have a command to install a debian-package. an application of mine is using json-glib and i want to compile it in MADDE | 16:19 |
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| crashanddie | so a kilo tonne is a thousand tonnes, not kilo * tonne. | 16:19 |
| crashanddie | and add the subsequent result to tonne. | 16:19 |
| Scelt | gigatonne | 16:20 |
| Scelt | gigamega | 16:20 |
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| TomaszD | kulve, ping | 16:21 |
| jacekowski | terratonne | 16:21 |
| jacekowski | petatonne | 16:21 |
| kulve | TomaszD: pong | 16:21 |
| TomaszD | kulve, msg > | 16:21 |
| jaska | tera, not terra :) | 16:21 |
| sx0n | übergiga | 16:21 |
| jaska | (a pet peeve) | 16:21 |
| Scelt | terracotta? | 16:22 |
| ZogG | infinitytonne | 16:22 |
| E0x | hmm my gps not getting fix sense the last saturday , i use all nigh for find a place | 16:22 |
| pigeon | does anyone notice rm from coreutils-gnu is broken with -i? | 16:22 |
| E0x | now is not working :( | 16:22 |
| ZogG | E0x, with out connection right? | 16:22 |
| E0x | ZogG: hmm ? | 16:23 |
| E0x | oh look now get fix | 16:23 |
| * GAN900 closes his troll-feeding reply for the bugzilla "security" thread. | 16:23 | |
| E0x | yooohooooo | 16:23 |
| ZogG | Mek, ping | 16:23 |
| ZogG | is Mek alive? does he ever talk? | 16:24 |
| tybollt | lovely | 16:24 |
| E0x | what mean the blue and the red pin | 16:24 |
| E0x | in mappero ? | 16:24 |
| tybollt | the fsf assholes are going to rewrite (?) parts of gcc in c++ | 16:24 |
| E0x | better , where i can find mappero doc ? | 16:24 |
| E0x | somethings i not sure how it work | 16:24 |
| tybollt | gcc just signed its own deathwarrant | 16:24 |
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| BCMM | tybollt: i thought it was more like "will now allow c++ to be used, where appropriate" | 16:24 |
| Appiah | how can you be so sure tybollt ? | 16:25 |
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| tybollt | hehe | 16:26 |
| ZogG | tybollt hey | 16:26 |
| Shapeshifter | tybollt: why does the language matter? | 16:26 |
| tybollt | nice there :) I thought I'd get arguments from people saying c++ is nice :) | 16:26 |
| tybollt | but no :) | 16:26 |
| Shapeshifter | tybollt: they could rewrite it in zsh, if the output is still the same, only speed is at a loss. i don't see the difference. | 16:26 |
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| ZogG | tybollt found plasma guy | 16:27 |
| tybollt | ZogG: oh, neat-o | 16:27 |
| tybollt | ZogG: is he sharing the code or? | 16:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: you fixed your ping-timeout? | 16:28 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, think so, forgot to notice when I got to work. | 16:28 |
| BCMM | Shapeshifter: i suspect the implication is that it would become unpredictable in some way. Seems more likely to me that the GCC people have a pretty good idea of how languages work. | 16:28 |
| tybollt | Shapeshifter: ... | 16:28 |
| Nadley | is it good to write application in python for maemo | 16:28 |
| ZogG | tybollt he is not answering, he is here =) | 16:28 |
| tybollt | ZogG: Booo... :) | 16:29 |
| ZogG | tybollt, Mek | 16:29 |
| SpeedEvil | It's more to do with 'languages people who might hack on compilers know'. | 16:29 |
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| ZogG | send him email as well | 16:29 |
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| SpeedEvil | ^people with a clue | 16:29 |
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| tybollt | SpeedEvil++ | 16:29 |
| ZogG | ZogG+++ | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: I tried with 90s and 120s, both earned me a spanking for repeated relogins even while not 'roaming', due to GPRS lags sometimes actually are that magnitude | 16:30 |
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| tybollt | ZogG: ssssssssh, until there is code in my inbox - sssssh :) | 16:30 |
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| ZogG | tybollt =( | 16:30 |
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| * ZogG cries | 16:30 | |
| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: with 240s it kinda 'works' | 16:30 |
| ZogG | so have you seen nokia video with portrait n900 ? =) | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: maybe 180s is worth a try | 16:30 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, set it to 120 | 16:31 |
| GAN900 | Got a proxy, so. | 16:31 |
| pupnik | what is the command to set that? | 16:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | pupnik: edit ping_timeout line in xchat.cfg | 16:36 |
| pupnik | oh i thought this was a modem setting for gprs timeout | 16:37 |
| pupnik | never found that | 16:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | ping timeout can't be meaningfully larger than 240ms with freenode anyway | 16:38 |
| SpeedEvil | 240s | 16:38 |
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| tristan | theres a damn efnet server set at 900. | 16:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | Odd. | 16:41 |
| * SpeedEvil just installed several updates - and now I have no applications. | 16:41 | |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 16:42 |
| crashanddie | man, I really hope silvermountain is coming to the summit | 16:42 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: still it seems to me default for xchat is like 12 minutes for ping timeout | 16:43 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - I mean that freenode has now gone to 240s timeout | 16:43 |
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| SpeedEvil | which is annoying - it used to be 10 min | 16:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: meaning xchat will reconnect to freenode only after 12 minutes no reply to a ping | 16:43 |
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| SpeedEvil | hmm | 16:44 |
| SpeedEvil | odd | 16:44 |
| SpeedEvil | uninstall catorise - bang | 16:44 |
| SpeedEvil | reboot | 16:44 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 16:44 |
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| SpeedEvil | I guess it will kill hildon-desktop | 16:44 |
| crashanddie | GAN900: The summit will be in London right? Will you be coming? If you are, I can have baseball bats, knives and a very quiet and isolated room where we can store Geneven and silvermountain's corpses after we beat them to fucking death. | 16:45 |
| SpeedEvil | And I may have already done that a couple of times, so watchdog hit | 16:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: what you're talking about are pings from freenet to irc client, and freenet considering a client offline when these don't pong after 240s. That's exactly inverse to what the xchat ping_timeout setting is all about | 16:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: I know. I was meaning that xchat having a ping_timeout set to >240 with freenode is not different from a timeout of infinity. | 16:46 |
| SpeedEvil | actually - yes it is. | 16:46 |
| SpeedEvil | Ignore me. | 16:46 |
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| sobczyk | anyone knows how to emulate in qt4 the behavoiur of the virtual keyboard? (focus changes when one slides the finger) similar is in the opera browser | 16:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: your point isn't moot. if xchat pin_timeout > freenode ping_timeout, then you don't need the /ns ghost voodoo in my loadscript | 16:47 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: yes. | 16:47 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: though it does affect the 'changed IP, or for some reason the connetion to the server died' timeout. | 16:48 |
| SpeedEvil | If there is actually a route to the server now | 16:48 |
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| tybollt | crashanddie: I'll back you up! Who are we beating and why? ;) (assuming these are numbnuts from TMO, yeah?) | 16:49 |
| crashanddie | tybollt: indeed | 16:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, as GAN900 noticed so educated, xchat should use that lib, err libcolon? ;-D, to detect when connection on N900 actually changed | 16:50 |
| tybollt | libcolon - for real? :) | 16:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | ;-D | 16:50 |
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| crashanddie | tybollt: kinda provides the same functionality as libcaca | 16:50 |
| tybollt | ;) | 16:50 |
| crashanddie | and libpoo | 16:50 |
| tybollt | crashanddie: :D | 16:51 |
| SpeedEvil | and libmicrosoft | 16:51 |
| crashanddie | boooo | 16:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | sorry I forgot the name | 16:51 |
| MohammadAG | I've spent hours talking to myself cause of that... | 16:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: that saved us a lot of pain ;-P | 16:52 |
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| * tybollt pats MohammadAG on the head demeaningly - there sonny - wear this white shirt and we will take gooooood care of you :) | 16:52 | |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: wb | 16:52 |
| b-man|laptop | lol | 16:52 |
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| MohammadAG | Does #maemo allow swear words? :) | 16:53 |
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| Stskeeps | i fucking hope so | 16:53 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:53 |
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| MohammadAG | Stskeeps, watch your fucking language | 16:53 |
| b-man|laptop | who the fuck cares? :D | 16:53 |
| * DocScrutinizer kicks MohammadAG for using a word starting with f | 16:54 | |
| MohammadAG | fsck /dev/mtd5 | 16:54 |
| MohammadAG | (answer n if anyone tries to do that :P) | 16:54 |
| tybollt | y | 16:54 |
| b-man|laptop | xD | 16:54 |
| MohammadAG | ~trout b-man|laptop | 16:55 |
| * infobot slaps b-man|laptop around a bit with a large trout! | 16:55 | |
| b-man|laptop | ~attack MohammadAG | 16:55 |
| * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing MohammadAG | 16:55 | |
| DocScrutinizer | will earn you that nice "...OR SOMe MORON (YOU?)..." msg at max | 16:55 |
| MohammadAG | GFX card replaced, ethernet port working again, now to fix scratchbox | 16:55 |
| sobczyk | anyone knows how to emulate behaviour of virtual keyboard buttons with qt4 QPushButtons? (focus changes, when finger slides) | 16:55 |
| MohammadAG | I tried to be a smartass and make the Ubuntu chroot as a new target but.... | 16:55 |
| MohammadAG | let's say it didn't go well | 16:55 |
| tybollt | ~frals MohammadAG | 16:56 |
| tybollt | what | 16:56 |
| tybollt | there no ~frals yet? ;P | 16:56 |
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| * GAN900 loves download pages with no download button | 16:58 | |
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| hpg101 | join #fey | 16:59 |
| tybollt | GAN: if you use firefox instead of lynx one will be rendered for you (/me runs and hides ;) | 16:59 |
| hpg101 | sorry.... | 17:00 |
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| GAN900 | crashanddie, doubt they'll come | 17:01 |
| GAN900 | crashanddie, in the US and NOT getting sponsored. | 17:01 |
| crashanddie | hmm | 17:01 |
| crashanddie | I guess I'll have to bring my fists to their faces then. | 17:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Does anyone prefer the rubbery USB charger lead? | 17:02 |
| MohammadAG | Uhmm, a Nintendo DS emu? | 17:02 |
| MohammadAG | wonder how that'll work.. | 17:02 |
| MohammadAG | I like the USB cable one more | 17:02 |
| SpeedEvil | I find it is much harder to detangle. | 17:02 |
| pigeon | badly, unless it can run the arm instruction somehow natively. | 17:03 |
| MohammadAG | SpeedEvil, and the charger's USB is harder to take out | 17:03 |
| tybollt | I actually like that the charge cable sticks there | 17:03 |
| MohammadAG | which kind of worries me, since the N900's USB isn't that good | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: not seen that | 17:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: you can remove the two little 'prongs' on the USB plug | 17:04 |
| MohammadAG | SpeedEvil, how? | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | With a teeny screwdriver | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | or a file | 17:04 |
| SpeedEvil | or a knife | 17:04 |
| tybollt | ehr | 17:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | ouch | 17:05 |
| tybollt | removing the prongs? wtf :S | 17:05 |
| SpeedEvil | tybollt: It makes the insertion/removal force _much_ lower | 17:05 |
| SpeedEvil | thereby easing concerns about USB connector. | 17:06 |
| tybollt | SpeedEvil: Mind I own a use cable that lacks prongs | 17:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | actually mine 'fixed itself' by careful use and quite some playing with retracting the jack 1mm and the reinserting it snugly | 17:06 |
| tybollt | I HATE IT | 17:06 |
| tybollt | the fucker literally _falls_ out on its bloody own (almost ;) | 17:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | tybollt: toldya | 17:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | don't mess with the prongs ;-) | 17:07 |
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| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: That's how the store bought cable came | 17:07 |
| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: I did shit to it. :) | 17:07 |
| tybollt | anyway | 17:07 |
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| GAN900 | tybollt, libconic | 17:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah, libcolon is much nicer | 17:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer | we should prod RST38bis to implement it to xchat | 17:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | (libcolon/libconic that is) | 17:11 |
| tybollt | that sounds absolutely libtastic, Doc. | 17:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehe | 17:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I also hate the thick clumsy cable | 17:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | also the micro-USB jacl should have a much smaller molding | 17:12 |
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| tybollt | http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/01/meego-moorestown-powered-tablet-hands-on/ | 17:16 |
| tybollt | why have you NOT ranted about this GAN? | 17:17 |
| tybollt | :) | 17:17 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, did, he didn't want to. | 17:18 |
| GAN900 | tybollt, what's to rant about? :P | 17:18 |
| tybollt | =) | 17:18 |
| GAN900 | tybollt, I vented my spleen in this weeks mwkn.net issue, so it'll take me a fews days to work up more ire. | 17:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: :-/ | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | i demand objectivity in the journalism made by mwkn.net | 17:19 |
| GAN900 | and, yes, I think x86-based mobile devices are retarded wastes of time, energy, and money. | 17:19 |
| tybollt | GAN900: :D | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:19 |
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| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, I think it's non-trivial. | 17:19 |
| crashanddie | better video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVIKYF7MOzU | 17:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer | GAN900: I bet you're right on that one | 17:20 |
| GAN900 | Stskeeps, hey, I'm objectively irrate! | 17:20 |
| Macer | watching hd avatar | 17:20 |
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| * b-man|laptop is going to scream is bison keeps erroring out with a '3 shift/reduce' notice no matter what he does to fix it | 17:22 | |
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| b-man|laptop | *if | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | b-man|laptop: ha-ha | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:22 |
| b-man|laptop | that wasn't meant to be funny :P | 17:22 |
| Macer | bison ftl | 17:23 |
| GAN900 | chippy fails at filming | 17:23 |
| b-man|laptop | i hate it :P | 17:23 |
| GAN900 | Also: that display sucks. | 17:23 |
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| ghostcube | http://www.google.com/crisisresponse/oilspill/ o.O | 17:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's really making my day the way https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7432#c36 completely fails to get any of my statements. Am I writing zuaheli, or what? | 17:26 |
| povbot` | Bug 7432: /opt and /home/user not cleared after firmware reflash | 17:26 |
| tybollt | "Qualcomm's Dual-Core Snapdragon 1.2GHz Chips?Seen In A Smartphone Near You Soon" | 17:27 |
| tybollt | wtf | 17:27 |
| tybollt | dual core ina phone? | 17:27 |
| tybollt | 'sat REALLY necesarry? | 17:27 |
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| pexi | very nice | 17:27 |
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| crashanddie | ghostcube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHmhxpQEGPo | 17:28 |
| crashanddie | GAN900: ^ | 17:28 |
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| GAN900 | tybollt, Cortex A9 | 17:28 |
| X-Fade | tybollt: There are already dualcore phones on the market. | 17:28 |
| GAN900 | OMAP4 | 17:28 |
| GAN900 | N96 is dual ARM9 | 17:28 |
| tybollt | I repeat | 17:28 |
| tybollt | 'sat REALLY necesarry? | 17:28 |
| GAN900 | tybollt, you can get higher battery saving out of a dual core | 17:28 |
| jacekowski | tybollt: n95 is a dualcore | 17:28 |
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| GAN900 | So, depending on your usage, it can be a better fit | 17:29 |
| tybollt | GAN900: o_O do explain sir | 17:29 |
| GAN900 | jacekowski, only sort of. | 17:29 |
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| GAN900 | tybollt, well, assuming good parallelization and non-linear voltage scaling a dual 500MHz would net you somewhere in the vicinity of 20-40% powersaving over a single 1GHz. | 17:30 |
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| GAN900 | also: race-to-idle | 17:30 |
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| tybollt | GAN900: aaah like that | 17:31 |
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| tybollt | GAN900: hmm still there's the overhead of dualcore... no? | 17:31 |
| tybollt | vs a single core which doesn't need the locking etc | 17:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yup, I bet it's not *that* simple | 17:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | too many unknowns in that equation | 17:34 |
| GAN900 | tybollt, yeah, a bit, so it's not simple | 17:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | first of all being "assuming good parallelization" | 17:35 |
| GAN900 | But, it does allow you to get a performance multiplier without putting your voltage through the roof. | 17:35 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, :P | 17:35 |
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| GAN900 | tybollt, DocScrutinizer is the expert you should be talking to. | 17:36 |
| GAN900 | The number of tasks running on a modern mobile device is going up. | 17:36 |
| SpeedEvil | You can get effectively similar savings with race-idle. | 17:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | nah, I deny any knowledge ;-P | 17:36 |
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| SpeedEvil | If you can ramp up and down the clock faster | 17:36 |
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| SpeedEvil | Where really interesting power savings might be would be with assymetric cores. | 17:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | async cores! | 17:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | clockless cores | 17:37 |
| jaska | amulet? | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | why did i read that as clockless whores? | 17:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer | errrm rings a bell, but can't recall which one | 17:38 |
| SpeedEvil | So that if you have - say - the accelerometer interrupting at 400Hz - instead of waking the CPU - the tiny CPU jams the result into a buffer, and does some sums on it. | 17:38 |
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| jaska | probably the ass-ymmetric part | 17:38 |
| alterego | Quite happy with my MAFW IM status updater :) | 17:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | maybe interrupts the CPU under specified conditions. | 17:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | The hardish part is making this second core binary compatible | 17:38 |
| SpeedEvil | The harder part is teaching programmers to use it. | 17:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: actually the gmeter should do that on his own, that's why it got a small core inside, after all | 17:39 |
| SpeedEvil | gmeter? | 17:39 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 17:39 |
| SpeedEvil | right | 17:39 |
| SpeedEvil | that was an example | 17:39 |
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| TomaszD | scuse me, does anyone have any performance comparisons between SU4100 and N450? | 17:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | yup, just felt like mentioning it | 17:40 |
| SpeedEvil | there are out there _much_ fancier ones that do gesture recognition in the accel itself. | 17:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Which is shiny | 17:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | darn! | 17:40 |
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| SpeedEvil | also - there are emerging accel+magnetometer - and magnetometer + gyro in one package | 17:40 |
| alterego | Is there a command line program that updates IM status? | 17:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't think anyones rolled all three into a cheap package yet - but a QFN IMU is not far away | 17:41 |
| zash | alterego: I guess you could do something with dbus-send | 17:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I'm waiting for first integrated laser gyro | 17:41 |
| alterego | zash: yeah, I'm just curious because I was planning on writing one for a project I'm working on. | 17:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: MEMs gyros are not actually bad. Laser gyros have issues. | 17:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: that would be awesome | 17:42 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: much better than accels. | 17:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: which issues? | 17:42 |
| * GAN900 likes this Ubuntu Humanity theme. | 17:42 | |
| jacekowski | 16:40 < popey> jacekowski: http://www.videolan.org/developers/vlc-branch/NEWS | 17:42 |
| jacekowski | 16:40 < popey> namely: * Support for HW accelerated video decoding on N900 | 17:42 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: they are inheretly hard to make small | 17:42 |
| X-Fade | MEMS gyros keep my helis level in the orientation I have set them, they do a good job ;) | 17:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't see that | 17:43 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer, don't be too hard on Milhouse. :P | 17:43 |
| X-Fade | And that is with quite a lof of vibration :) | 17:43 |
| GAN900 | X-Fade, I still need to find the money/time for RC helos. | 17:43 |
| X-Fade | GAN900: Yes you should ;) | 17:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer | quatrocopter | 17:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | ftw | 17:44 |
| X-Fade | Nah, my 3KW 1.3M dia heli is quite enough ;) | 17:45 |
| X-Fade | .... for now. | 17:45 |
| GAN900 | X-Fade, X-Plane FTW for poor college slobs, though. | 17:45 |
| GAN900 | I do have a nice CH Products setup. | 17:45 |
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| * SpeedEvil needs to get his UAV done. | 17:45 | |
| X-Fade | GAN900: Realflight for me. But I need Windows for that :( | 17:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | 500W in a 8" rotor. | 17:45 |
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| GAN900 | X-Fade, never tried Realflight | 17:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | are there nice 2-stroke_motor+generator e-power blocks already, for powering such drones? | 17:49 |
| X-Fade | DocScrutinizer: Just big lipos and electro motor? | 17:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | nah, the energy/weight density of fuel is much higher than the one of LiPo | 17:50 |
| X-Fade | http://bit.ly/b32xNn -> 10s 4000Ah | 17:50 |
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| X-Fade | 4000mAh ;) | 17:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | and 'recharging' is much faster ;-) | 17:51 |
| X-Fade | Well, I can charge them in 10 mins, but yes. | 17:52 |
| penguinbait | sweet chopper | 17:52 |
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| SpeedEvil | I really want $30000 to try to prototype my hoverboard. | 17:52 |
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| SpeedEvil | ~50Kg of small ducted fan units, ESCs, battery. | 17:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | so I gather that motor+generator concept isn't yet usual in that domain? | 17:53 |
| SpeedEvil | That you stand on. | 17:53 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: no - it adds inefficiency | 17:53 |
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| X-Fade | DocScrutinizer: The weight is prohibitive, I guess. | 17:53 |
| SpeedEvil | and power conversion in the several hundred watt range is not well understood by your average modelmaker | 17:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's what I'd like to have a look into | 17:54 |
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| * lardman hears mention of magnetometer and thinks about augmented reality... | 17:54 | |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: ack | 17:54 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=961876 - silly RC - 1/1000th (ish) the weight of the n900 | 17:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | lardman: hmm, what specifically? | 17:55 |
| * lardman also wonders why Airbus autopilot doesn't apparently handle the failure case of no airspeed reading | 17:55 | |
| lardman | docscrutinizer: just in general really, would be pretty cool | 17:55 |
| lardman | e.g. http://europe.nokia.com/services-and-apps/nokia-point-and-find | 17:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | are you the compass enthusiast missing such a capability in N900 ? | 17:56 |
| lardman | indeed | 17:56 |
| SpeedEvil | http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Risks/23.24.html#subj12 | 17:56 |
| lardman | Though I've not got any code written, but it would be cool | 17:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | lardman: USB-hostmode should save your day | 17:56 |
| SpeedEvil | Miswiring a modern fly-by-wire airliner, and nearly crashing it | 17:56 |
| lardman | SpeedEvil: oops! | 17:56 |
| lardman | docscrutinizer: that working now then? Cool | 17:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | lardman: kinda | 17:57 |
| * rosch wonders what the software update to flashlight is... | 17:57 | |
| DocScrutinizer | you should start to get a compas in a micro-usb dongle | 17:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/get/find | 17:58 |
| lardman | Someone mentioned X-plane earlier, if I have a spare 20min over the summer would be cool to write a MATLAB/Simulink/Stateflow autopilot to hook into the Ethernet link they provide | 17:58 |
| Ikarus | SpeedEvil: another case of NEVER replace plugs, always replace the complete wire (which has keyed connectors) | 17:58 |
| RST38bis | slow Slow SLOW | 17:58 |
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| RST38bis | Damn N900 has definitely become even more sluggish after the PR1.2 | 17:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | Ikarus: LOL | 17:59 |
| Venemo | RST38bis: not true | 17:59 |
| thresh | RST38bis: yes, that's right | 17:59 |
| RST38bis | Well, true here | 17:59 |
| Ikarus | DocScrutinizer: I have seen expensive equipment killed that way | 17:59 |
| RST38bis | Anyone tried experimenting with the swappiness controls? | 17:59 |
| Venemo | yes | 17:59 |
| Venemo | it worked in 1.1 | 17:59 |
| thresh | even when I use kernel-power, it's sluggish | 17:59 |
| SpeedEvil | Ikarus: You can't | 17:59 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: I have my N900 running compressed swap | 17:59 |
| RST38bis | Ikarus: Does it run faster? | 18:00 |
| Ikarus | but no objective tests | 18:00 |
| SpeedEvil | Ikarus: Tearing out the whole wire along a duct running along ducts in the plane is another major operation. | 18:00 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: it seems about the same | 18:00 |
| SpeedEvil | Ikarus: And the plugs probably won't fit through the ducts | 18:00 |
| RST38bis | Ok, so that won't work | 18:00 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: perhaps a tiny bit faster | 18:00 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: it might work with your usage patterns | 18:00 |
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| RST38bis | Ikarus: Could you test something like this: | 18:00 |
| SpeedEvil | I did some tests. | 18:00 |
| SpeedEvil | Make -j4 of the kernel | 18:01 |
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| SpeedEvil | with swap on the same or a different FS | 18:01 |
| RST38bis | Ikarus: 1) Run App Manager update and while it is updating try switching back to the desktop and running media player or XTerm | 18:01 |
| SpeedEvil | It made no difference to the runtime. | 18:01 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: I know that running app manager update has less impact then it did without compressed swap | 18:01 |
| RST38bis | Ikarus: 2) Run Fennec and try loading some pages, see if it is more sluggish or less | 18:01 |
| RST38bis | Ikarus: Ahha, coooool | 18:01 |
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| Ikarus | but that is hardly typical usage | 18:01 |
| SpeedEvil | Ikarus: Swap over nbd, and instrument it. :) | 18:02 |
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| Ikarus | SpeedEvil: heh :) | 18:02 |
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| Ikarus | SpeedEvil: I need to figure out a good test suite first | 18:02 |
| RST38bis | Ikarus: It is a good corner case | 18:02 |
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| RST38bis | How about swapping to the second MMC card? Does it make system faster? | 18:02 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38bis: no | 18:03 |
| Ikarus | RST38bis: SLOWER | 18:03 |
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| Ikarus | RST38bis: the eMMC is hooked up to a 8 bit MMC bus, the card is on a 4 bit bus | 18:03 |
| Ikarus | actually I need to see how much compression is done | 18:03 |
| Ikarus | perhaps I can swap to NAND :P (not a good idea, the cycle life of the NAND is far lower then of the eMMC) | 18:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry for the maybe silly question, but - is there a competent blog or whatever summarizing the regressions and workarounds of PR1.2 over PR1.1 ? | 18:04 |
| RST38bis | ok | 18:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Ikarus: The right way is a linear swap - I need to finish up my writeup on this. :/ | 18:05 |
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| Venemo | DocScrutinizer: there is a thread on TMO about it | 18:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | Venemo: got a link please? :-) | 18:07 |
| SpeedEvil | OMG! | 18:07 |
| SpeedEvil | xsnow in extras-devel | 18:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | *cugh* | 18:07 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer: I didn't check it out because I had no issues :P | 18:07 |
| derf | Just in time for Christmas in July. | 18:08 |
| Termana | DocScrutinizer, blog... competent... I didn't realise those two words went in the same sentence! :P Kidding | 18:08 |
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| pupnik | want to see a hi-res pic from n900? (bread rolls and flour) | 18:10 |
| * mgedmin hungry! | 18:11 | |
| MohammadAG | Paid app in the store? | 18:11 |
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| MohammadAG | OMG PAID APP | 18:12 |
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| pupnik | i used the oven door to brace the device so there are no shakes. individual flour specks visible | 18:12 |
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| MohammadAG | I wonder if no one believed me :) | 18:14 |
| Ikarus | SpeedEvil: the right way is to solder a 1 Gbyte ram chip on the N900 :P | 18:14 |
| Ikarus | but that would take quite the surgeon | 18:14 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't think you can | 18:15 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm pretty sure there are no compat chips | 18:15 |
| SpeedEvil | you'd need a compatibility PCB soldered on the POP, with the RAM on top. | 18:15 |
| MohammadAG | ask Sammy to make one for you | 18:15 |
| SpeedEvil | Which may be silly | 18:15 |
| MohammadAG | (Samsung) | 18:15 |
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| Ikarus | SpeedEvil: well, actually there are 256MB NAND + 1GB RAM (in 2x 512 dies) for OMAP platforms | 18:17 |
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| nidO | *finally* managed to get hold of the angry birds level pack \o/ | 18:19 |
| wao | lol | 18:20 |
| wao | :D | 18:20 |
| wao | angry birds is also for maemo? | 18:20 |
| wao | nidO: ^ | 18:20 |
| andre__ | wao: obviously yes? :) | 18:20 |
| nidO | yeah, the game itself is free from ovi and included on the device by default | 18:20 |
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| nidO | but the paid level pack has been in and out of ovi store for months as nokia keep trying to get their thumbs out their asses and make the payment system work | 18:21 |
| wao | hehe | 18:21 |
| wao | :) | 18:21 |
| nidO | and it just went back in | 18:21 |
| wao | ook. | 18:21 |
| wao | should be also for android | 18:21 |
| wao | :D | 18:21 |
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| Robot101 | \o/ http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-cellular/telepathy-ring | 18:23 |
| MohammadAG | Angry birds level pack! | 18:24 |
| MohammadAG | and morpho panorama app | 18:24 |
| tybollt | Robot101: \o/ | 18:24 |
| SpeedEvil | I wish there were more (than 63) levels | 18:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | I've ***'d them all, and am reduced to beating highscores | 18:25 |
| MohammadAG | on the iPhone there are 5 level packs | 18:25 |
| SpeedEvil | you mean 1*21 + 5*21? | 18:26 |
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| MohammadAG | 5*21 I think | 18:27 |
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| b-man|laptop | finally got bison working - i had to download a version from Debian SID and force depends install it - it looks like maemo's version is faulty | 18:29 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 18:30 |
| MohammadAG | you could've recompiled it so you don't break dependencies... | 18:30 |
| SpeedEvil | xsnow - running on all 4 desktops - keeps the CPU at 500MHz. | 18:30 |
| b-man|laptop | well, it didn't have broken dependencies but i did it just in case lol | 18:30 |
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| MohammadAG | rofl | 18:31 |
| b-man|laptop | now i have Google Go on my N900 xD | 18:31 |
| MohammadAG | what's google go? | 18:32 |
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| b-man|laptop | it's like a mashup with c and python | 18:32 |
| b-man|laptop | it's easy to use :) | 18:32 |
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| b-man|laptop | and it compiles to native binaries | 18:33 |
| b-man|laptop | (even has it's own toolchain) | 18:33 |
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| MohammadAG | b-man|laptop, the chroot stuff failed when I tried to install ubuntu-desktop | 18:35 |
| MohammadAG | at one point, an app failed then the whole card went corrupt | 18:35 |
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| MohammadAG | fsck moved all folders and renamed them in lost+found | 18:36 |
| b-man|laptop | ouch :( | 18:36 |
| b-man|laptop | how big is your card? | 18:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | X-Fade: could you find out about the GPIO names / SoC pin numbers / testpad names of any serial TTY boot console? | 18:38 |
| X-Fade | DocScrutinizer: Not likely. | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | X-Fade: whom to ask? | 18:39 |
| X-Fade | DocScrutinizer: Good one, no idea. | 18:40 |
| MohammadAG | b-man|laptop, 16GBs | 18:41 |
| MohammadAG | 6GB partition | 18:41 |
| b-man|laptop | hmm | 18:41 |
| b-man|laptop | did you bind mount /proc and /dev/pts? | 18:41 |
| MohammadAG | the latter no, isn't that for logs only? | 18:42 |
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| b-man|laptop | i believe so | 18:43 |
| b-man|laptop | but | 18:43 |
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| b-man|laptop | it wouldn't hurt to mount it | 18:43 |
| b-man|laptop | MohammadAG: what was the output when it failed? | 18:44 |
| MohammadAG | b-man|laptop, not sure right now, it's in the logs somewhere lol | 18:45 |
| MohammadAG | sec, I might find it | 18:45 |
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| * smoku just got latest PSX4ALL sources :D | 18:48 | |
| MohammadAG | smoku, with the plugin? | 18:49 |
| smoku | what plugin? PSX$ALL is not plugin based | 18:50 |
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| MohammadAG | smoku, the DSP plugin :) | 18:52 |
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| slonopotamus | <.< | 18:54 |
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| smoku | ??? PSX does not have DSP | 18:54 |
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| MohammadAG | err, ZodTTD's sources | 18:55 |
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| Summeli | smoku: is there some nice updates? | 18:56 |
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| alterego | Looks like when I update my IM status, maemo doesn't seem to recognise the change :/ | 18:58 |
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| alterego | Meaning, when I do it via dbus, it works, but if you check your availability settings it's not recognised, it's the same as the last time youc hanged it using the maemo ui | 19:01 |
| * microlith notices the media player updating while in the app switcher | 19:01 | |
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| Macer | whoa | 19:05 |
| Macer | finished watching avatar and the credits for the visual teams.. it took a whole small country to make it | 19:06 |
| PHiZiK | lol | 19:06 |
| n900-dk | a lot of blue men | 19:07 |
| b-man|laptop | lol | 19:07 |
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| * jacekowski just bought beagleboard | 19:10 | |
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| Shapeshifter | can't wait for when my warranty expires. I'll finally be able to optically improve the n900 | 19:22 |
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| mintux | is it possible to create wireless network? | 19:23 |
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| lardman | hmm, I wonder if the Nokia point and find barcode db and movie world image db are available for people to use...? | 19:28 |
| lardman | I imagine not | 19:28 |
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| MohammadAG | most probably | 19:30 |
| pupnik | maybe for n900 owners | 19:30 |
| lardman | well it's not that important really, there are other data sources | 19:31 |
| lardman | but the image recognition stuff for the movie posters is a nice idea | 19:31 |
| lardman | city info would be useful, but again there are other data sources | 19:31 |
| lardman | e-compass would be good though ;) | 19:31 |
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| trumee | is ovi store not updated for UK users? | 19:32 |
| trumee | if i browse to ovi store from my N900, i dont see the new apps. | 19:32 |
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| trumee | probably they havent settled on the payment system for UK. | 19:33 |
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| BCMM | they are serving different versions based on geoip? | 19:34 |
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| MohammadAG | The ovi store has always been like that | 19:35 |
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| MohammadAG | Setting up sudo (1.6.8p12-4osso22+0m5) ... | 19:40 |
| MohammadAG | Updating sudoers | 19:40 |
| MohammadAG | Setting up x11-xkb-utils (7.4+1-maemo2+0m5) ... | 19:40 |
| MohammadAG | FINALLY! | 19:40 |
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| nidO | trumee: angry birds level pack's been available from my uk connection since just after 4 at last | 19:42 |
| nidO | least* | 19:42 |
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| trumee | nidO: yup, i see it now. in the process of buying it :) | 19:50 |
| * lardman heads home | 19:50 | |
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| MohammadAG | trumee, do tell what 'system' it uses | 19:50 |
| MohammadAG | i.e does it use HAM | 19:51 |
| MohammadAG | (.install) | 19:51 |
| trumee | MohammadAG: yes it does | 19:51 |
| MohammadAG | or a .deb | 19:51 |
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| trumee | MohammadAG: it opened up HAM for me. | 19:51 |
| MohammadAG | hmm | 19:51 |
| MohammadAG | time to try a normal deb | 19:51 |
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| tobb | does anyone know if QTouchEvent is supported in nokias qt sdk, I never receive the event | 19:58 |
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| MohammadAG | trumee, it didn't ask to open/save? | 19:59 |
| tobb | I mean, is it supported on the n900 ? | 19:59 |
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| trumee | MohammadAG: no it straight-away opened HAM | 19:59 |
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| trumee | my browser on PR1.2 has been acting weird. Is there any way to extract /home/user/.mozilla from emmc image and copy to N900? | 20:02 |
| trumee | or can i simply delete .mozilla/microb folder to start afresh? | 20:03 |
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| hcm_ | trumee: try renaming it instead of deleting, but it should work | 20:03 |
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| trumee | hcm_: renaming .mozilla or .mozilla/microb? | 20:04 |
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| hcm_ | I'd start with microb.. if your problem isn't solved, you can also try .mozilla | 20:04 |
| jcrawford | omg i love the N900 :) | 20:04 |
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| jcrawford | hmm extras-testing repo down eh | 20:09 |
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| jcrawford | get a 404 not found on http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/freemantle/free/binary-armel/Packages | 20:09 |
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| jcrawford | haha my bad typo :) | 20:10 |
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| jcrawford | odd after adding the extras and extras-testing repositories i cannot seem to find Mobile HotSpot listed in the app manager | 20:15 |
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| trythil | hi all -- does anyone know if Fremantle logs XMPP connection attempts and errors? | 20:20 |
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| trythil | I'm trying to figure out why the Jabber client in PR 1.2 keeps blowing up when it attempts to connect to my server -- I suspect SSL certificate errors, but after importing the necessary certificates things are still going wrong and I have no information to work on | 20:21 |
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| FredrIQ | noes. :( | 20:26 |
| * FredrIQ was going to check what happened when passing 99999m in Bounce Evolution and ended up losing on 88244m because of major fail | 20:26 | |
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| SpeedEvil | :) | 20:27 |
| * SpeedEvil always falls off at 300m or so. | 20:27 | |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 20:27 |
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| jcrawford | so now where is a good place to start reading about maemo development? | 20:28 |
| FredrIQ | 300m? | 20:28 |
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| BCMM | The Internet. | 20:28 |
| FredrIQ | you mean at 1500m at the "fall of part for non-common player" | 20:28 |
| FredrIQ | i guess | 20:28 |
| BCMM | (actually, if somebody answers jcrawford, i'd be interested too) | 20:28 |
| SpeedEvil | Fred: probably | 20:28 |
| SpeedEvil | FredrIQ: I never played it much | 20:28 |
| SpeedEvil | FredrIQ: I got distracted by 'blocks' | 20:29 |
| jcrawford | i think i just found some training on maemo.org | 20:29 |
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| FredrIQ | heh | 20:29 |
| jcrawford | http://maemo.org/development/training/maemo_getting_started_content/ | 20:29 |
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| RST38h | test | 20:31 |
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| SpeedEvil | fail | 20:34 |
| RST38h | Test Failed. | 20:34 |
| RST38h | Initiating Self Destruct Sequence. | 20:35 |
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| RST38h | Self Destruct Sequence Initiated. | 20:35 |
| jacekowski | boom | 20:35 |
| RST38h | Self Destruct Will Commence in 4:49 | 20:35 |
| RST38h | <beep> <beep> | 20:35 |
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| brendans | Code zero zero zero. | 20:39 |
| brendans | Destruct. | 20:39 |
| brendans | Zero. | 20:39 |
| xDaReaperx | Hey | 20:39 |
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| zlimvos_ | i cant find any package with traceroute for n900, am i missing something..? | 20:40 |
| xDaReaperx | I kind of find something weird , the battery icon dosen't seem to update it self every time , after every reboot i get to see the actual results of the battery state | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | install traceroute | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Reading package lists... Done | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Building dependency tree | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Reading state information... Done | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | The following NEW packages will be installed: | 20:40 |
| xDaReaperx | i started to happen now | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | traceroute | 20:40 |
| SpeedEvil | zlimvos_: you need MOAR REPOS. | 20:41 |
| SpeedEvil | I think it's probably in tools | 20:41 |
| zlimvos_ | repo called 'tools' right? | 20:42 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - hangon | 20:42 |
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| brendans | fairly sure it is in tools | 20:42 |
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| SpeedEvil | Catalog name - fremantle tools | 20:43 |
| SpeedEvil | web address: http://repository.maemo.org/ | 20:43 |
| xDaReaperx | anyways , is there any way to unsubscribe from Nokia ? i tried it i got an SMS saying : Attempt to Unsubscribe Failed | 20:43 |
| mindfaq | it's in maemo developer tools | 20:43 |
| SpeedEvil | distrubition fremantle/tools | 20:43 |
| mindfaq | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5 | 20:43 |
| SpeedEvil | components free/non-free | 20:43 |
| SpeedEvil | in applicatoin manager - 'add repository' in settings | 20:43 |
| jcrawford | xDaReaperx, nope once we got ya we keep ya hahaha | 20:43 |
| jcrawford | seriously no idea :) | 20:44 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 20:44 |
| xDaReaperx | cause it charges me for the SMS's they send | 20:44 |
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| brendans | xDaReaperx, if nothing else you could probably call your carrier and have the number blocked | 20:45 |
| brendans | (not that that's the first thing to try, lol) | 20:45 |
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| xDaReaperx | hmmm , isn't there anyway i can block calls or SMS's ? | 20:45 |
| SpeedEvil | blocking SMSs will not stop you being charged for them | 20:46 |
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| xDaReaperx | that sucks | 20:47 |
| SpeedEvil | By the time you try to block them - they are already on your phone | 20:47 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 20:47 |
| xDaReaperx | so there's nothing i can do for now | 20:47 |
| SpeedEvil | SMSs are not delivered with a 'do you want this' first | 20:47 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah i know that | 20:48 |
| SpeedEvil | For me - the 'stop' worked - they diddn't send anymore after - though it said failed | 20:48 |
| brendans | obviously this is one of those things that varies between providers, but everybody around here has unlimited incoming SMS... still, I've definitely heard that if you call your carrier in many cases they can put a block on it at that end, and prevent them being transmitted to you | 20:48 |
| jacekowski | xDaReaperx: how you can be charged for incoming sms? | 20:48 |
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| xDaReaperx | berndans : i'll try to do that | 20:49 |
| brendans | jacekowski, it's one of those things that varies around the world (like how incoming long distance calls don't cost anything in Europe, but do in NA) | 20:49 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah you do get charged in different places | 20:49 |
| jacekowski | hmm | 20:49 |
| jacekowski | give me your number | 20:49 |
| jacekowski | and i'll make you bankrupt | 20:50 |
| SpeedEvil | not here. | 20:50 |
| SpeedEvil | (uk) | 20:50 |
| SpeedEvil | all inbound calls are free | 20:50 |
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| jacekowski | SpeedEvil: because we are civilised here | 20:50 |
| SpeedEvil | any SMSs that are chargeable are refundable if the provider has not complied to the terms of conduct. | 20:50 |
| mindfaq | once upon a time even outgoing sms were free here | 20:51 |
| xDaReaperx | jacekowski : if you send me sms's it wont charge me | 20:51 |
| xDaReaperx | xD | 20:51 |
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| mindfaq | then they realized they can charge people for that | 20:51 |
| xDaReaperx | it's hard to explain for me | 20:51 |
| brendans | yeah, it's really pretty frustrating here (Canada); incoming SMS are free, but incoming calls get charged long distance on cell networks | 20:51 |
| jacekowski | xDaReaperx: so why sms from nokia charges you? | 20:51 |
| xDaReaperx | that's why i am on this IRC ^ to know that | 20:51 |
| xDaReaperx | and to stop it | 20:52 |
| jacekowski | brendans: well, phone costs more in canada and US | 20:52 |
| jacekowski | brendans: at least from what i heard | 20:52 |
| brendans | (I mean, free incoming SMS is good - Caller ID is pretty key to avoid telemarketers though on a cell) | 20:52 |
| zlimvos_ | speedevil: i added the repo but i got " http://repository.maemo.org/ fremantle/tools/free/non-free/binary-armel/packages 404 not found [ip 92.122.217.171 80] :/ | 20:52 |
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| jacekowski | brendans: here there is something called tps | 20:52 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah i'm having that error too adding the extras repositories | 20:52 |
| jacekowski | brendans: if you are on tps list and somebody calls you | 20:52 |
| jacekowski | brendans: well, they just don't call you | 20:53 |
| brendans | jacekowski: yeah, generally bad locked-in plans too. Plus getting an unlocked phone is pretty much unheard of, people think of it as borderline gray market | 20:53 |
| xDaReaperx | zlimvos_ : yeah i'm having that error too adding the extras repositories , guys any solution for this ? | 20:53 |
| jacekowski | brendans: most phones sold here are unlocked | 20:53 |
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| jacekowski | brendans: ( you have to pay your contract anyways ) | 20:53 |
| brendans | jacekowski: yeah, I think there is a DNC registry in Canada now as well | 20:53 |
| PhonicUK | hey all | 20:53 |
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| yuizy_ | i got a new device from warranty. now i'm trying to charge the battery for the first time but there's only a red light blinking and it doesn't apparently charge at all | 20:54 |
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| PhonicUK | anyone know of a bluetooth auditing tool for maemo 5? | 20:54 |
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| yuizy_ | any ideas what might be the problem? | 20:54 |
| jacekowski | yuizy_: google | 20:54 |
| xDaReaperx | how did the battery die so fast ? | 20:54 |
| brendans | jacekowski: Yeah, the carriers here argue that there's no need for an unlocked phone, "Just buy our out-of-country long-distance package, and we won't charge $2/min..." | 20:54 |
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| jacekowski | brendans: well, roaming in EU is almost free | 20:55 |
| jacekowski | brendans: and it will be completly free in 2012 or somewhere around that | 20:56 |
| brendans | jacekowski: http://www.rogers.com/web/content/add-ons | 20:56 |
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| jacekowski | brendans: outside eu it costs a lot | 20:56 |
| jacekowski | brendans: it was something like 80p/minute in US | 20:56 |
| brendans | jacekowski: yeah, that would be nice... I know that even US roming on Rogers (one of Canada's networks) is $1.45/min | 20:56 |
| brendans | jacekowski: without a special package, that is | 20:56 |
| jcrawford | so why can i not find the mobile hotspot app? I added both extras and extras-testing to my repos | 20:56 |
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| Andrukas | Hi, Can any one tell what should I do to get my n900 upgraded to PR 1.2? apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade does not pick it up. | 20:57 |
| xDaReaperx | i added Maemo extras | 20:57 |
| xDaReaperx | but it says catalog failed to load | 20:57 |
| xDaReaperx | and dosent' show up | 20:57 |
| jacekowski | brendans: some carriers already stopped charging for roaming in EU at all | 20:57 |
| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: I'd use NSU on a computer, unless you got ~54MB free on rootfs you can't update OTA anyway | 20:58 |
| jacekowski | brendans: well, for calls, data still costs a lot | 20:58 |
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| brendans | jacekowski: about the best in Canada is a new carrier called Wind Mobile: http://www.windmobile.ca/ | 20:58 |
| Andrukas | ToJa92, I've got about 60mb free on rootfs, how do I initiate the upgrade? | 20:58 |
| jcrawford | i updated my N900 OTA the other day went just fine | 20:59 |
| brendans | jacekowski: (well, new to us, I think they exist in the UK if I'm not mistaken) | 20:59 |
| jacekowski | brendans: how much does n900 costs? | 20:59 |
| jacekowski | never heard of them | 20:59 |
| brendans | jacekowski: but they've only deployed in about 4 cities thus far | 20:59 |
| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: You should see it in application manager | 20:59 |
| jcrawford | though I used wifi and not the AT&T internet as it was tooo damn slow | 20:59 |
| ToJa92 | if you press update | 20:59 |
| ToJa92 | maybe you should try apt-get update ? | 20:59 |
| Andrukas | ToJa92, that's the thing, I can't see it there | 20:59 |
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| brendans | jacekowski: N900's not actually available in Canada, so I ordered it from the US. $600 CDN + tax (12%) | 21:00 |
| jacekowski | uuuuuuuuu | 21:00 |
| jacekowski | 1 CAD == 1USD? | 21:00 |
| brendans | jacekowski: Might be $50 less now... | 21:00 |
| xDaReaperx | i bought the N900 for just: 450 $ | 21:01 |
| jacekowski | i bought my n900 for £49 | 21:01 |
| xDaReaperx | locked ? | 21:01 |
| jacekowski | no | 21:01 |
| xDaReaperx | company ? | 21:01 |
| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: Do you have the Vodafone UK version? | 21:01 |
| jacekowski | uk carriers don't sell locked phones | 21:01 |
| brendans | jacekowski: about 0.95 USD right now; but I bought it outright without a plan | 21:01 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm k how so cheap ? | 21:01 |
| jacekowski | 24 months contract | 21:01 |
| jacekowski | £25/mo | 21:02 |
| brendans | wow | 21:02 |
| Andrukas | ToJa92, not sure, I bought it from ebay. I think it is a UK version | 21:02 |
| jacekowski | with 500 minutes, 500 texts, unlimited data | 21:02 |
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| jacekowski | so it works out at £650 over 2 years | 21:02 |
| brendans | that's ridiculous... even at the best rates available, that would run easily $75-$100 /mo here | 21:03 |
| xDaReaperx | oh cool | 21:03 |
| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: Oh, well if it's from vodafone then IIRC PR1.2 isn't released | 21:03 |
| ToJa92 | so you would need to flash the global release | 21:03 |
| Andrukas | ToJa92, is there a way a can check witch version I'm running? | 21:04 |
| jacekowski | iphone was like £100 for phone + 35/mo over 18 months with 600 minutes 600 texts and unlimited data | 21:04 |
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| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: I don't know, really | 21:04 |
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| ToJa92 | unless you got anything important on the device you should do a full flash anyway, so that you clean it up(unless you bought it new, that is) | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | anybody who can answer me why SSH key field on maemo.org account mgmt throws out the space between the leading "ssh-dss lksduadnhjk..." and the trailing "user@machine.dom" ? | 21:05 |
| crashanddie | jacekowski: they do sell locked phones. Blackberries for example don't work with vodaphone SIMs from other countries | 21:05 |
| jacekowski | well, iphone and blackberry is an exception | 21:06 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: you don't need that last part | 21:06 |
| xDaReaperx | A problem here , i can't add the extras repositories from http://repository.maemo.org/ , i did a apt-get update and go this : Err http://repository.maemo.org/ fermantile/freepackages - 404 not found [IP : 92.122.208.163 80] | 21:06 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: and from my experience dss keys don't work | 21:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | is the key supposed to have no user@machine.xx extension? | 21:07 |
| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: fremantile? | 21:07 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: it has to be rsa | 21:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | fsck | 21:07 |
| xDaReaperx | sorry femantle | 21:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | thanks anyway | 21:07 |
| xDaReaperx | i typed it down looking it from my N900 | 21:07 |
| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: no, "fremantle" | 21:07 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: so you just need ssh-rsa wqwefweirfwoierjfowejrfwoierfwejrfiwjrefiwerf | 21:07 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah okay | 21:07 |
| xDaReaperx | so whats the problem actually ? | 21:07 |
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| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: well, if you typed it wrong now, what says you didn't type it wrong on your n900? | 21:08 |
| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: it's a 404 not found, so you typed something wrong | 21:08 |
| jacekowski | who gives out @maemo cloaks to people? | 21:08 |
| xDaReaperx | no i didn't type it wrong , it shows the IP | 21:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: hmmm :-S (me going to create a pubkey just for friggin garage - maybe tomorrow) | 21:08 |
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| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: that's for the hostname, not the "fremantle" and "free" part | 21:08 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: X-Fade claims that it should work with dss key | 21:08 |
| crashanddie | jacekowski: on IRC? | 21:08 |
| xDaReaperx | ok can u tell me what to type in the add catalog menu ? | 21:09 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: so it might be problem with scratchbox ssh or something | 21:09 |
| jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: but i can log in with that key somewhere else | 21:09 |
| jacekowski | crashanddie: yeah | 21:09 |
| crashanddie | jacekowski: ask GAN, he will forward the request to X-Fade | 21:09 |
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| ToJa92 | [Andrukas]: You could check if you have the repository "Nokia system software updates" in application manager, if you don't have it for some reason it wont find pr 1.2 | 21:09 |
| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: it needs to be "free", not "freepackages" | 21:10 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah its : free non-free | 21:10 |
| * DocScrutinizer pokes X-Fade about garage project :-) | 21:10 | |
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| crashanddie | xDaReaperx: screenshot please | 21:10 |
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| xDaReaperx | ok | 21:10 |
| xDaReaperx | hold | 21:11 |
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| xDaReaperx | to take screen shot its : shft + ctrl + p ? | 21:11 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 21:13 |
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| xDaReaperx | okay here's the screen shot : http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/9943/screenshot2010060121110.png | 21:14 |
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| xDaReaperx | i save it , and it adds , but it dosent show up now | 21:16 |
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| xDaReaperx | wow so much silence | 21:18 |
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| Andrukas | does anyone know how to upgrade N900 to PR1.2 using apt-get? | 21:21 |
| Andrukas | which rep should be used? | 21:21 |
| mintux | fennec doesn't support flash player what shall i do? | 21:21 |
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| RST38h | you should kill yourself over it | 21:21 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 21:24 |
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| xDaReaperx | hi | 21:26 |
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| PhonicUK | lol netsplit | 21:27 |
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| xDaReaperx | really? | 21:27 |
| xDaReaperx | how did you find out? | 21:27 |
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| PhonicUK | ? | 21:27 |
| PhonicUK | its obvious when it happens :/ | 21:28 |
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| xDaReaperx | hmm k | 21:28 |
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| xDaReaperx | does overclocking your N900 reduce battery life ? | 21:28 |
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| microlith | xDaReaperx: shouldn't | 21:29 |
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| xDaReaperx | any benchmarking apps ? | 21:29 |
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| PhonicUK | overclocking will reduce battery life and device lifespan | 21:30 |
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| PhonicUK | and void your warranty | 21:30 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah thats what i thought | 21:30 |
| crashanddie | [citation needed] | 21:30 |
| PhonicUK | it by definion needs more power | 21:31 |
| PhonicUK | since power increases with the square of the frequency | 21:31 |
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| xDaReaperx | hey is there a FTP client for N900 ? | 21:32 |
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| crashanddie | PhonicUK: I was more talking about the device lifespan | 21:32 |
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| PhonicUK | same again, you're switching the silicon more frequently | 21:33 |
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| xDaReaperx | so there's no FTP client for N900 | 21:34 |
| PhonicUK | and transistors have a fixed lifespan if terms of the number of switches they can do | 21:34 |
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| PhonicUK | gFTP | 21:34 |
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| PhonicUK | its in the app manager :/ | 21:34 |
| xDaReaperx | i cant find it | 21:34 |
| xDaReaperx | searched the app manager a lot | 21:34 |
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| mintux | i need a browser that it support socks proxy and flash palyer together. the FCKing microb ui can not support profile or keep about:config setting and fennec doesn't support flash player | 21:35 |
| PhonicUK | i went to All and searched for FTP | 21:35 |
| PhonicUK | first result | 21:35 |
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| PhonicUK | do you have the extras repo enabled? | 21:35 |
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| xDaReaperx | when i type : ftp nothing shows up :( | 21:36 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah thats the problem , i can't add the extras repo | 21:36 |
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| xDaReaperx | i added it actually , but it dosent show up | 21:36 |
| PhonicUK | find it on maemo.org then | 21:36 |
| PhonicUK | using the device | 21:36 |
| xDaReaperx | ok | 21:36 |
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| smoku | PhonicUK: "transistors have a fixed lifespan if terms of the number of switches they can do" where did you get that revelation? | 21:39 |
| xDaReaperx | so weird , i went to maemo 5 downloads section , and i type FTP on the search says nothing found | 21:39 |
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| PhonicUK | during my module in digital systems design at university | 21:40 |
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| PhonicUK | also, see wikipedia entry for overclocking | 21:40 |
| PhonicUK | brb getting off bus | 21:40 |
| PhonicUK | or not | 21:41 |
| PhonicUK | i hate the busses here | 21:41 |
| alterego | This is quite annoting, that the accounts system doesn't pick up on my presence updates :( | 21:42 |
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| mintux | no suggestion? | 21:42 |
| alterego | s/annoting/annoying | 21:42 |
| smoku | PhonicUK: overclocking damages hardware due to admixture migration because of heat | 21:42 |
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| smoku | but I can't see how transistor could wear by electrons flow | 21:43 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: They do. | 21:43 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: Wikipedia - electromigration | 21:43 |
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| smoku | SpeedEvil: that does not happen under normal conditions | 21:45 |
| smoku | ok. it happens so slow, that it takes a lifetime to notice | 21:46 |
| alterego | smoku: overclocking beyond spec is not "normal conditions" though is it :/ | 21:46 |
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| xDaReaperx | earthquake | 21:46 |
| SpeedEvil | smok: yes, it does. | 21:46 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: It has actually caused failures in real chips. | 21:46 |
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| SpeedEvil | smoku: The nokia graphics chip failures were due to this | 21:47 |
| SpeedEvil | err - nvidia | 21:47 |
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| smoku | these lacked proper cooling | 21:47 |
| SpeedEvil | They diddn't. | 21:47 |
| xDaReaperx | the n900 uses nvidia graqphics chips ? | 21:47 |
| b-man|laptop | no | 21:48 |
| SpeedEvil | They were adequately cooled to not fail. | 21:48 |
| b-man|laptop | PowerVR SGX | 21:48 |
| alterego | smoku: The N900 has no cooling :P | 21:48 |
| SpeedEvil | The failure was due to electromigration, not overheating | 21:48 |
| jacekowski | it has | 21:48 |
| jacekowski | passive cooling | 21:48 |
| alterego | Sure, but nothing active. | 21:48 |
| alterego | Which was obviously what I meant. | 21:48 |
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| alterego | There isn't even a heatsink. | 21:48 |
| ShadowJK | I thought nvidia graphics chip failures were due to heat and not due to electrical sissues | 21:49 |
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| alterego | Even though the A8's should handle high clock rates, the N900 is extremely compact. | 21:49 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: It was electromigration exacerbated by heat | 21:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | Also - the actual makers datasheet for the chipset actually says that it has a limited life when run at 600MHz | 21:50 |
| xDaReaperx | so the N900 is a fail ? | 21:51 |
| microlith | no | 21:51 |
| jacekowski | well, it's 2 years on 600MHz | 21:51 |
| jacekowski | instead of 500 years | 21:51 |
| xDaReaperx | actually only 15 months | 21:51 |
| microlith | that's assuming constant operation at 600MHz | 21:51 |
| xDaReaperx | the rest are only service | 21:51 |
| smoku | SpeedEvil: elecromigration caused by overheating ;P | 21:52 |
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| smoku | still, saying that transistors have a finite number of switches, is exageration at least... | 21:52 |
| jacekowski | they do | 21:53 |
| jacekowski | everything has finite lifetime | 21:53 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: It's not transistors. | 21:53 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: It's wires. | 21:53 |
| jhp | Hi everyone. I have a little problem. I had my "mail for exchange" configured and working but I had to restore my contacts due to some mixup out of an backup from before the last big upgrade. Now my "mail for exchange" won't configure anymore, I can configure it but it will never end in a situation where it stays activated and working. | 21:53 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: The wires actually 'flow' slightly due to the electrons flowing past them. | 21:54 |
| smoku | [20:34:46] <PhonicUK> and transistors have a fixed lifespan if terms of the number of switches they can do | 21:54 |
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| xDaReaperx | My mobile heats up on charging | 21:54 |
| SpeedEvil | Much? | 21:54 |
| SpeedEvil | from the charger? | 21:54 |
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| alterego | xDaReaperx: that's not really anything in comparison to the CPU and, it's not even in direct contact with it .. | 21:55 |
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| xDaReaperx | well i can feel it heating from below | 21:55 |
| xDaReaperx | not much but usually its cool | 21:55 |
| alterego | So, has anyone got any experience with telepathy on the N900? | 21:56 |
| xDaReaperx | no | 21:56 |
| xDaReaperx | whats that ? | 21:56 |
| alterego | N900/maemo as I guess this is to do with the platform. | 21:56 |
| xDaReaperx | i saw one app | 21:56 |
| jacekowski | xDaReaperx: IM | 21:56 |
| xDaReaperx | oh ok | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | ooohnoes, don't get me started again on OC | 21:57 |
| cgoncalves | how can I send a project from esbox to a n900? I already have it connected via usb and configured. | 21:57 |
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| xDaReaperx | yes now i can see gFTP | 21:57 |
| GAN900 | DocScrutinizer's powering up! | 21:58 |
| GAN900 | What if I were to overclock my N900? | 21:58 |
| xDaReaperx | i had to add the extras tesing and devel repository | 21:58 |
| GAN900 | Would it run iPhone then? | 21:58 |
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| GAN900 | How about Half Life 2? | 21:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: smoku: actually the most usual case is the 'wires' flow *into* the 'transistors' (it's actually FETs), such ruining the P/N dotation | 22:00 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah. | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | so the transistor loses his semiconductor properties | 22:01 |
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| smoku | SpeedEvil: nevertheless, it's unnoticable under normal conditions - like the glass flowing in windows. and if it is noticable - it's a design mistake. | 22:01 |
| haj | anyone know if I can somehow search for a street without searching for the city in Sygic? | 22:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | while OC isn't exactly 'normal conditions' | 22:01 |
| haj | OC works fine though.. | 22:02 |
| xDaReaperx | anyone dual booted their phones? | 22:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | haj: N2O for your motor also works 'fine' :-P | 22:03 |
| haj | I have been running my N900 at max 900MHz like a month.. just set it to max 1000MHz some days ago... no problems.. | 22:03 |
| smoku | DocScrutinizer: ok. I was learning on discrete elements. I guess it may happen faster in todays integrated chips, when one is actually counting single atoms. | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | smoku: exactly | 22:03 |
| xDaReaperx | how do you overclock the n900 anyway ? is it easy ? | 22:03 |
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| haj | DocScrutinizer: I have been overclocking CPU's since I had a 486 DX2 OC'ed to DX4... This is no different.. | 22:04 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: The maker of the chip says the chip has a limited life at 600MHz. This is designed to be completely adequate for the application it's in. | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | smoku: you got current densities of kA or even mA / mm^2 | 22:04 |
| haj | xDaReaperx: wiki.maemo.org/Overclocking or something like that | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: stfu | 22:04 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: If you overclock, then you may get lots less life | 22:04 |
| RST38h | also does not appear to be true | 22:04 |
| smoku | SpeedEvil: you don't have to convince me that overclocking damages hardware :) | 22:05 |
| alterego | haj: you're completely ignorant if you think that a desktop computer is at all the same as a mobile embedded SoC. | 22:05 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: No, I don't. | 22:05 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: why? It is no different. | 22:05 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: I'm pointing to a fact - the chip datasheet. Do you know the authors of this are lying? | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: apply somewhere else for basic lessons please | 22:05 |
| haj | alterego: I don't say that... But the N900 has safeguards that shuts it down if it overheats. | 22:05 |
| SpeedEvil | haj: No, it doesn't. | 22:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | or send $$$ to my paypal | 22:06 |
| alterego | haj: No, it doesn't. | 22:06 |
| SpeedEvil | haj: There is no CPU temperature sensor. | 22:06 |
| haj | Uhm.. I'm pretty sure I read that somewhere. | 22:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: stop telling BS | 22:06 |
| SpeedEvil | haj: At least no reliable one. There is a 'battery' temperature sensor | 22:06 |
| alterego | haj: Please, if you don't know what you're talking about, shut up and listen to those that do, or do some research. | 22:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | (which is not very close to the battery) | 22:06 |
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| haj | alterego: then I'll put it this way... How many people killed of a N900 by overclocking it? | 22:07 |
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| pexi | real world results are the ones that count :) | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: do you think anybody here can answer that question to you? | 22:07 |
| alterego | haj: Mobile processors like those that are in our beloved N900, are extremely tightly geared to give the best possible performance with a reasonible lifetime. You mess with that, it's a gamble. | 22:07 |
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| alterego | haj: when they start appearing in talk, why don't you keep a count. | 22:08 |
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| haj | DocScrutinizer: Did you hear about anyone frying a N900 by overclocking? | 22:08 |
| alterego | haj: considering the N900 hasn't even been out a year yet .. | 22:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: yes. so... now it's your turn | 22:08 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: Okay, I have heard about lots and lots that didn't have problems overclocking them. | 22:09 |
| smoku | SpeedEvil: so you're saying that Cortex was designed to fail after a destined lifetime? i didn't know that. much enlightening | 22:09 |
| alterego | Okay, so it's not even been around for a year, and DocScrutinizer says someone has already fried theirs, and I trust his words :P | 22:09 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: Cortex is not a CPU. | 22:09 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: Cortex is an architecture. | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: I heard about lots and lots of cat surviving a drop from 10th floor. Do you want to try? | 22:09 |
| alterego | smoku: they're not designed to fail, they're deisgned to last :P | 22:09 |
| haj | but hey.. We can stop discussing it, I don't really care :) | 22:09 |
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| alterego | smoku: but they can only make things last for so long. | 22:10 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: It is implemented by vendors taking the design, and putting it into a chip in the form of silicon. | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | smoku: and SpeedEvil is absolutely right on that | 22:10 |
| alterego | smoku: and it's a balance between performance and life expectancy. | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | (lifetime limits) | 22:10 |
| xDaReaperx | Hey is this a right benchmarking tool ? : http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=604899&postcount=7 | 22:10 |
| Mece | o.O fiery overclocking discussions :) (pun intended) | 22:12 |
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| haj | DocScrutinizer/alterego: I'll bet you a N900 that when my N900 stops working it'll not be because it runs 1000MHz... ;) | 22:12 |
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| smoku | SpeedEvil: if I would write "OMAP 3430" you would say that it's not a microprocessor, rigt? | 22:12 |
| alterego | smoku: OMAP is a processor manufactured by Texas Instruments using the ARM blueprints. | 22:13 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: It's SoC - a system on a chip. It contains a cortex A8 design on it - on one chip along with other stuff made by TI | 22:13 |
| SpeedEvil | The actual chip may also have stuff soldered to the top of the package | 22:14 |
| alterego | Well, SpeedEvil's description is much better. | 22:14 |
| alterego | I just rwanted to say it first :P | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: I actually believe you're right. It will probably stop working because you threw it to the wall, annoyed by the ever increasing segfaults in each and every app | 22:14 |
| alterego | DocScrutinizer: hahaha, :) | 22:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: you quite obviously have not the slightest idea about how OC, electromigration, and modern SoC work | 22:15 |
| smoku | SpeedEvil: so by "cortex" I meant the CPU core within that chip. do you have any better term? | 22:15 |
| smoku | (I'm not native english speaker and I am still learning) | 22:16 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: Not likely... Since I'm not an idiot I know that that isn't very likely to happen because of overclocking.. Thats more likely to happen if the device has a bad memory chip. | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: stfu | 22:17 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: why don't you stfu... | 22:18 |
| SpeedEvil | smoku: The term 'cpu' works | 22:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: because *I* know what I'm talking about, which you quite evidentally don't | 22:18 |
| smoku | "so you're saying that CPU was designed to fail"? weird | 22:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer | yep | 22:19 |
| alterego | haj: a lot of people in this channel are not idiots, and you're just showing your ignorance. So I would seriously back off. | 22:19 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 22:19 |
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| xDaReaperx | why dosen't anyone in the channel ever " lol " ? | 22:19 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: your use of sftu in discussions dosn't really suggest that you know shit about anything... | 22:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer | on 500MHz it'll fail after e.g 100.000h, on 600MHz it will fail after 10.000h, on 700MHz after 1000h... | 22:20 |
| alterego | haj: no, it doesn't, but DocScrutinizer knowledge on semiconductor design does, something that you quite obviously lack. | 22:20 |
| haj | alterego: I'm not ignorant at all... | 22:20 |
| alterego | haj: you certainly are in this field. | 22:20 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: So, now you are saying that you have already tested the N900's CPU at 700MHz for 1000h ? ;) | 22:20 |
| n900-dk | How often does HAM check for new updates, if you doesn't open the HAM manually? | 22:21 |
| * alterego gives up | 22:21 | |
| * alterego gets back to coding. | 22:21 | |
| DocScrutinizer | haj: if you refuse to carefully read my posts (here ">>e.g.<<") then you'll qualify for a kick acting this way | 22:21 |
| smoku | n900-dk: once a day | 22:22 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: people have been saying this always about clockspeeds.. The factory clock of a CPU, regardless of it being for a desktop or a mobile device will always be a compromise based on that the company that makes the device need it to be nice and stable, and with a mobile device that it can't use up too much power. | 22:23 |
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| n900-dk | smoku: Do you know the time? | 22:23 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: I don't care about being kicked if I'm not allowed to use my freedom of speech. | 22:24 |
| nidO | "freedom of speech"? | 22:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer | freedom of spamming the chan with BS | 22:24 |
| smoku | n900-dk: no. but experience shows that around midnight. | 22:24 |
| haj | DocScrutinizer: how about spamming the chan with FUD.. :) | 22:25 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 22:25 | |
| *** haj was kicked by DocScrutinizer (User terminated!) | 22:25 | |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 22:25 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 22:25 | |
| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer: you do realise you're kicking more than me these days | 22:26 |
| n900-dk | So crontabs is not in use on the N900, or am I wrong? | 22:27 |
| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer: if he PM's you, send him to me | 22:27 |
| brendans | honest question that's peripherally related: I know the new-rev beagleboards are running at 720 MHz, and my understanding is that the 3530 core is more or less the same as the 3430 core in a different package | 22:27 |
| RST38h | Shit, cannot install the old libpurple0 any more | 22:27 |
| brendans | does anyone know if this is a design lifetime decision, or just the fact that it has better cooling? | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie: must be the rainy spring causing an unforgiving mood | 22:27 |
| RST38h | and telepathy-haze won't work without it | 22:27 |
| crashanddie | probably | 22:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ...or me entering male's climacterium | 22:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | brendans: You can get different speeds | 22:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | a felt 17 people told haj to stop speading BS and think twice before he states he's expert for chip design | 22:30 |
| SpeedEvil | brendans: And exactly what the difference between the speedgrades is is a qustion | 22:30 |
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| SpeedEvil | brendans: All parts may in fact go at 720 without issue. Or some of the 600MHz parts may fail irretrievably after 3 hours. | 22:30 |
| SpeedEvil | You can't tell withjout more data | 22:30 |
| brendans | SpeedEvil: so a question of quality bins and thermal profiles, perhaps? | 22:31 |
| crashanddie | DocScrutinizer: not criticising your actions mate, just stating the obvious | 22:31 |
| joorin | quick repository question: is there often a delay between uploads of new package (to Extras-devel) and it showing up as the active package in the package view? my upload was done 12 hours ago and still no change. | 22:31 |
| SpeedEvil | And TI won't tell you, and nokia won't know. | 22:31 |
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| SpeedEvil | The only way to do this would be to take a few hundred chips, and overclock them, and observe the results | 22:31 |
| SpeedEvil | And this may be invalid as the parameter you're testing may change partway through a batch with new product | 22:31 |
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| brendans | SpeedEvil: Makes sense | 22:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | Or have the overclock kernel come with a $1 fee - which goes to the first person to break their n900. | 22:32 |
| brendans | SpeedEvil: I will say the 720 MHz on the beagleboard is nice... but it also didn't cost almost $700, so I'm less inclined to mess around with MTBF numbers on the n900 | 22:33 |
| brendans | SpeedEvil: Nice; like an endowment fund? | 22:33 |
| joorin | as it stands i have no idea if the package thats pushed to users is the one on the package view page or the one listed if i surf to the repository listing. | 22:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | just leaves to say: TI *did* that kind of OC tests to their chips, and that's what Nokia based their N900 clockspeed at | 22:34 |
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| Viliny__ | crashanddie: you here? | 22:34 |
| trythil | ah ha | 22:34 |
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| brendans | DocScrutinizer: Yeah, it goes without saying that if they could actually get stable performance at a higher clock, they'd have done it | 22:35 |
| crashanddie | I am | 22:35 |
| Viliny__ | may i pm you? | 22:35 |
| trythil | just a note -- if anyone else is having trouble with getting telepathy-gabble to do TLS, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9262 might be useful | 22:35 |
| povbot` | Bug 9262: Modest not able to validate server certificates | 22:35 |
| crashanddie | Viliny__: about to leave though | 22:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | brendans: exactly | 22:35 |
| brendans | DocScrutinizer: (consistently, at least) | 22:35 |
| Viliny__ | crashanddie: ah well then nvm | 22:35 |
| crashanddie | Viliny__: what's it about? | 22:35 |
| Viliny__ | expression simplifying | 22:35 |
| crashanddie | hah | 22:36 |
| brendans | DocScrutinizer: More than likely they want some maximum percentage of the phones to die within e.g. a three-year contract term. Say two or three standard deviations out. | 22:36 |
| crashanddie | Viliny__: ask DocScrutinizer | 22:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer | sorry, also leaving | 22:38 |
| brendans | cheers | 22:38 |
| brendans | heading out myself; bye all | 22:38 |
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| xDaReaperx | hey , i downloaded the file : http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/770/n900/nbench using xterminal , where will the file be saved ? | 22:42 |
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| Viliny__ | xDaReaperx: to the directory you had active at the time is my guess | 22:44 |
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| xDaReaperx | hmm i had no directory active | 22:45 |
| xDaReaperx | i downloaded using xterminal | 22:45 |
| Viliny__ | wget? | 22:45 |
| xDaReaperx | its a benchmarking app | 22:45 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah | 22:45 |
| xDaReaperx | wget | 22:45 |
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| Viliny__ | wget downloads to the directory you have active when you type it in unless you specify otherwise, i don't think you can actually have the terminal open and NOT have a directory active | 22:46 |
| Viliny__ | my 2 cents | 22:46 |
| alterego | Teeheehee, well, at least it works. My MAFW Telepathy status updater! :D | 22:46 |
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| alterego | I suppose I should write a little UI for it or something ... | 22:47 |
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| xDaReaperx | is it possible to browse the files in the root ? | 22:51 |
| xDaReaperx | like the bin , home etc | 22:51 |
| setz | cd / ? | 22:52 |
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| ShadowJK | Not with the default file manager, no. | 22:52 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm some other way | 22:52 |
| xDaReaperx | i tried gFTP , it shows the folders , but it wont open | 22:52 |
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| ToJa92 | [xDaReaperx]: Install midnight commander | 22:52 |
| xDaReaperx | is it available in app manager ? | 22:52 |
| ToJa92 | or if you just want to browse, open a browser and enter filer:/// as url | 22:52 |
| ToJa92 | file:/// * | 22:53 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm | 22:53 |
| ToJa92 | [xDaReaperx]: I think it's in extras-devel | 22:53 |
| xDaReaperx | ok | 22:53 |
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| xDaReaperx | wow my app manager takes forever to load | 22:54 |
| ToJa92 | well the download part of app manager takes some time | 22:55 |
| ToJa92 | if you got rootsh installed you could just apt-get install mc | 22:55 |
| ToJa92 | to install midnight commander | 22:55 |
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| xDaReaperx | yeah i'll do that | 22:55 |
| xDaReaperx | i did apt-get install mc | 22:56 |
| xDaReaperx | it says could not get lock /VAR/LIB/DGKB/LOCK | 22:56 |
| Khertan | /ctcp #Khertan_Migo | 22:56 |
| Khertan | oups | 22:56 |
| xDaReaperx | found it anyways | 22:56 |
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| ToJa92 | [xDaReaperx]: you must close app manager | 22:57 |
| xDaReaperx | yeah i figured it out | 22:58 |
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| xDaReaperx | ok i openend it | 22:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer | xDaReaperx: also from your desktop you can browse sftp://user@192.168.1.31/ quite conveniently | 22:59 |
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| xDaReaperx | using the browser ? | 23:00 |
| ShadowJK | probably want filezilla | 23:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | (of course depending on the particular browser you use) | 23:00 |
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| xDaReaperx | the normal one | 23:00 |
| ShadowJK | or something else that does sftp | 23:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | konqueror works fine | 23:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer | the gnope one allegedly also works | 23:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | gnome | 23:01 |
| xDaReaperx | how abt the firefox browser | 23:01 |
| ShadowJK | It doesn't know how | 23:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | works, but probably will not allow to just click a textfile to open it in e.g. kate/kwrite | 23:02 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm | 23:02 |
| andrius_ | hi, what will happen if i change apt source from "deb https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/205 ./" to "deb https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/203 ./ " in order to upgrade my n900 to PR.1.2 | 23:02 |
| xDaReaperx | i want to know where the files get installed from wget | 23:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | at least here with ssh pubkey passwordless login FF works | 23:03 |
| ShadowJK | dpkg -L wget | 23:03 |
| ShadowJK | shows the files associated with wget | 23:03 |
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| xDaReaperx | ok | 23:03 |
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| xDaReaperx | when i do a cd /home/user/MyDocs/Downloads/ it says can't cd to that | 23:05 |
| xDaReaperx | why ? | 23:05 |
| xDaReaperx | i want the wget to download the files there | 23:05 |
| rkbm | does it exist? | 23:06 |
| rkbm | (the directory) | 23:06 |
| ShadowJK | presumably you can't go there because it doesn't exist.. | 23:06 |
| xDaReaperx | thats waht i want to know | 23:06 |
| xDaReaperx | thats why i want to browse the root | 23:06 |
| rkbm | try creating it first - mkdir /home/user/MyDocs/Downloads | 23:06 |
| rkbm | o_O | 23:06 |
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| xDaReaperx | okay fine | 23:07 |
| xDaReaperx | now its fine | 23:07 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 23:07 |
| xDaReaperx | still new to the device | 23:07 |
| xDaReaperx | and maemo | 23:07 |
| ShadowJK | I'm not sure you want to follow any instructions involving wget and x-terminal :D | 23:08 |
| jaska | i do wonder how i managed to break osso-xterm not to use the spot where the scrollbar usually is again, *shakes fist at 79 colums* | 23:08 |
| xDaReaperx | well are there any instructions ? | 23:09 |
| xDaReaperx | i wanted to install the nbench app | 23:09 |
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| andrius_ | is here anyone still on older version than pr1.2? | 23:11 |
| xDaReaperx | nop | 23:11 |
| xDaReaperx | not me | 23:11 |
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| andrius_ | does anyone have "https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/205 " in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager ? | 23:13 |
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| microlith | isn't 205 the vodaphone branch? | 23:14 |
| xDaReaperx | can we copy paste in the x terminal ? | 23:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | andrius_: still on PR1.1.1 | 23:15 |
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| ShadowJK | tap the arrow icon, paint text, menu->copy | 23:15 |
| andrius_ | microlith, yea that's why I'm asking, i wondering what would happened if i change 205 vodafone to 203 uk generic | 23:16 |
| andrius_ | would i be able to upgrade my phone to pr1.2 | 23:16 |
| andrius_ | or would that break something | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope, won't break anything afaik | 23:16 |
| xDaReaperx | ok ty | 23:16 |
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| alterego | 'Listening to "Castaway" by "Jerry Cantrell" via Nokia N900' :D | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | andrius_: but then otoh you'd need to reflash to 203 PR1.1, so you could as well flash pr1.2 straight away | 23:17 |
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| ShadowJK | although you've probably got the wrong mp-fremantle-* (or something like that) package installed for it to do anything sensible with stuff it finds in uk repo, I'd think | 23:18 |
| * ShadowJK 'd also say no to variants crippled by operators :) | 23:18 | |
| andrius_ | DocScrutinizer, i'm trying to avoid flashing | 23:19 |
| ShadowJK | (and whine at vodafone and nokia care) | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | so how would you change from 205 to 203 then? | 23:19 |
| andrius_ | editing the apt source file | 23:19 |
| xDaReaperx | finally benchmarking | 23:19 |
| andrius_ | /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, dunno if that'll pan out | 23:20 |
| andrius_ | yea | 23:20 |
| andrius_ | not sure how different these repositories are | 23:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | probably marginal | 23:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | theming maybe | 23:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer | but also maybe diferent kernel version - just for the version string. But I never had a look into any of those non-global versions, so I can't even give an educated guess | 23:22 |
| alterego | Oh, that's interesting, it does update the "My Availability" dialog, just not the "global" one. | 23:22 |
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| xDaReaperx | anyone using aircrack-ng ? on the N900 ? | 23:25 |
| Ikarus | xDaReaperx: great way to waste battery power | 23:27 |
| MohammadAG | afaik the wireless card doens't support injection using the default kernel | 23:27 |
| xDaReaperx | well so it dosent work ? | 23:27 |
| MohammadAG | doesn't* | 23:27 |
| MohammadAG | was there even a typo... | 23:27 |
| MohammadAG | not yet I think | 23:27 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm then i'll remove it | 23:27 |
| xDaReaperx | MohammadAG , saw ur name in that Health check app | 23:28 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 23:28 |
| MohammadAG | yeah I really need a healthcheck, I'm in a queue | 23:28 |
| MohammadAG | :P | 23:28 |
| xDaReaperx | lol | 23:28 |
| xDaReaperx | btw my N900 is heating up badly | 23:28 |
| xDaReaperx | now | 23:28 |
| xDaReaperx | its warm | 23:29 |
| xDaReaperx | actually a bit above warm | 23:29 |
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| ShadowJK | ... are you runnih nbench? | 23:29 |
| xDaReaperx | i was | 23:30 |
| xDaReaperx | now its stopped | 23:30 |
| xDaReaperx | i closed x terminal | 23:30 |
| ShadowJK | well it would make it warm :) | 23:30 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm okay | 23:30 |
| MohammadAG | ~'s usually warm here too | 23:30 |
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| xDaReaperx | hey any way to clean the screen of N900 , to leave no marks | 23:33 |
| xDaReaperx | like the finger marks | 23:33 |
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| SpeedEvil | scrub it with a t-shirt | 23:34 |
| xDaReaperx | lol it will cause a scratch | 23:35 |
| xDaReaperx | i worry | 23:35 |
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| ShadowJK | this 3M microfibre cloth I bought along with Vikuiti screen protector is amazing | 23:35 |
| xDaReaperx | hmm the screen protector is not yet available in my country | 23:35 |
| ShadowJK | the nokia cloth mostly spreads it out, the 3M cloth needs like 2 swipes to lift it off | 23:35 |
| xDaReaperx | oh | 23:36 |
| ShadowJK | I ordered it from Germany, I didn't like any of the protectors available in my country | 23:36 |
| xDaReaperx | is chromium browser fast ? | 23:36 |
| xDaReaperx | or opera | 23:36 |
| xDaReaperx | or the normal firefox | 23:36 |
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| Saviq | hi all, anyone noticed problems with Salut / Bonjour account unable to connect in PR 1.2? | 23:41 |
| alterego | Saviq: I can't even install it properly :/ | 23:41 |
| Saviq | well, I couldn't wait and reflashed, so... | 23:41 |
| Saviq | had to use windows, mind you | 23:42 |
| Saviq | flasher had some problems | 23:42 |
| alterego | Seems there's a problem with avahi-daemon | 23:42 |
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| Saviq | right - the avahi daemons don't start | 23:49 |
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| MohammadAG | is it quit hour? | 23:53 |
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| ToJa92 | [MohammadAG]: I just installed Virtualbox, so my network connections were reset :P | 23:57 |
| luke-jr | lame excuse | 23:57 |
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| * Ikarus smiles @ the hacked Motorola Milestone nearly booting Maemo already | 23:58 | |
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| Stskeeps | scary people | 23:58 |
| Ikarus | Stskeeps: heh | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | screenshot? | 23:59 |
| luke-jr | Ikarus: too bad you can never distribute it? | 23:59 |
| Ikarus | luke-jr: sure we can | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | that too | 23:59 |
| Ikarus | just not binary parts from Nokia | 23:59 |
| luke-jr | Ikarus: nope | 23:59 |
| luke-jr | that's what makes it Maemo | 23:59 |
| Ikarus | luke-jr: most of Maemo is open | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | no it's not | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | 43% | 23:59 |
| luke-jr | most of Maemo is closed | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:59 |
| Ikarus | sufficient to make it interesting :) | 23:59 |
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