IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2010-05-27

josephnexusat least that's what mine did00:00
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marexEnter PIN00:00
marexinvitation ... wtf00:01
xorAxAxruskie: so what do i need to modify in my scripts for 1.2?00:01
marexdunno ... there were two buttons00:01
dmj726is there a 64 bit version of flasher?00:01
marexTerm and whatever (didn't read that far) and Continue00:01
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marex*Terms of use maybe00:01
jogaI don't recall such00:01
jogabut might have been there00:01
jogaheh, no one reads those ;P00:02
marexthis is europe ... free continent :b00:02
lcukxorAxAx, what kinds of scripts00:02
jogalike ads on the internet...even if you don't have adblock, your brain skips them00:02
marexMAEMO 5 ... 10.2010.19-100:02
ruskiemarex, there is some thing called My Nokia in settings now00:02
marexover dist-upgrade :)00:02
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xorAxAxruskie: do the old sed commands work?00:03
pupnik_is there any saving script for us dist-upgraders?00:03
ruskiexorAxAx, no scripts changed00:03
marexruskie, what's that for ... worthless00:03
ruskiemarex, no clue... some sms service or something00:03
xorAxAxruskie: hmm? the update doesnt revert the scripts?00:03
xorAxAxruskie: then why did it get you stuck in a loop00:03
joga"When you have registered to My Nokia, free tips and support will be sent regularly via SMS to your Nokia." ... lol, if I was really lonely I might even subscribe to that00:03
ruskiexorAxAx, no clue00:03
marexruskie, the description says "I'm useless, you don't want to use me" ... ok00:04
ruskiejoga, hmm it's saying I'm subscribed but I'm 100% sure I never subscribed00:04
* xorAxAx found the reason for the OTA problems: "apt-get dist-upgrade" may not remove a single package, otherwise HAM bails out00:04
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xorAxAxruskie: so i can update to pr 1.2 and dont need to run anything afterwards?00:04
josephnexusis there a changelog for 1.2?00:04
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jogaruskie: seems gray for me too, and unsubscribe seems selectable00:05
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xorAxAxjosephnexus: yes, in the wiki00:05
xorAxAxjosephnexus: see RC00:05
* joga presses unsubscribe00:05
jogait's still the same00:05
MohammadAG_Gotta run peeops00:05
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MohammadAG_Night #maemo00:05
josephnexussee ya00:05
Dr_Cainso uh, update OTA or via cable?00:05
* MohammadAG_ slaps noobmonk3y and throws him at frals00:05
jogaLOL now I got an SMS "Attempt to unsubscribe has failed. Go to 'My Nokia' in Settings to try again. Visit www. blalbalbbal"00:05
Dr_Cainit's telling me I need to plug it in and run through nokia software update00:05
jogago nokia :)00:05
lcukgnite MohammadAG_00:05
fralsnn MohammadAG_00:05
MohammadAG_joga, I couldn't unsubscribe too00:06
dmj726xorAxAx: What was making it bail?00:06
jogamaybe they just highlighted the wrong buttons00:06
MohammadAG_joga, you paid to see that message btw ;)00:06
xorAxAxunsubscribe from what?00:06
marexruskie, well thanks for the support ... time to fight OE again :-(00:06
MohammadAG_Night lcuk, night frals00:06
xorAxAxdmj726: libqt4-qt3support00:06
jogaan outrage! :-p00:06
MohammadAG_yes you paid for it00:06
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dmj726xorAxAx: is anything using that?00:06
xorAxAxdmj726: nope00:06
jogaxorAxAx: from the my nokia thing00:06
lcukxorAxAx, rcs late was modified00:07
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lcukopt is a mountbind now00:07
xorAxAxlcuk: ah00:07
xorAxAxhmm, OTA failed for me00:08
dmj726so that wasn't it?00:08
lcukwell you have done some pretty invasive mods00:08
xorAxAxwell, it said "failed" in the middle of processing00:08
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jogaxorAxAx: did it keep going or stop?00:09
xorAxAxit stopped working and rebootet00:09
jogak :(00:09
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dougt_is thumb supported in the 1.2 rom?  I have looked at two device (cat /proc/cpuinfo) and do not see thumb listed as a feature.  But I do have one person saying that it was supported in the 1.1 ROM.00:09
jogaif you have shortcutd running and press the cam key while it's updating you probably get "Operation failed" notification at some point but it doesn't matter00:09
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jogadougt_: thumb?00:10
* MohammadAG 's shadow slaps frals again00:10
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* frals chucks a whale at moh00:10
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ShapeshifterToday I walked past the guy who wrote vim00:11
ShapeshifterDidn't get the chance to shake hands...00:12
spinningcompassShapeshifter: You forgot the key combo, right? :) !shake: (switch to entry mode) $$$shake.00:13
dmj726where do I get the image to flash my n900 with00:13
marexjoga, arm has two instruction sets ever since like v400:13
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dmj726I do not want to delete everything, just get pr1.200:13
marexjoga, and those two can interwork00:13
Shapeshifterspinningcompass: :P00:13
slonopotamusdougt_: thumb is supported by cpu. it has nothing to do with firmware00:13
jogamarex, oh, ok, I don't know the arm architecture all that well00:14
Aranelslonopotamus: now I got 53.8 but It says I should use NSU. Do you know why?00:14
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DocScrutinizersee /topic00:15
GAN900Aranel, that warning is because it has conflicting packages that it doesn't know how to deal with.00:16
GAN900Aranel, so check with apt.00:16
Aranelalready. thanks for the link :)00:18
GAN900DocScrutinizer, lol00:18
dmj726where are the firmware images00:18
jogabtw, do you guys have weird behavior when entering tilde? like you need to press it twice00:18
jogathe other keys like [ need only one click (haven't tried them all)00:19
lcukAranel, im just finishing PR2.000:19
jogaoh and this is a finnish layout00:19
Shapeshifterjoga: that's not weird, that's normal00:19
jogaoh, I see00:19
Shapeshifterjoga: it's a deadkey for õñã etc.00:19
jogaso you can ã?00:19
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Aranellcuk: lol, but I have the enough space now. This isnt fair. :P00:20
Shapeshifterjoga: same with ^00:20
lcuki tried to tell you00:20
lcukall the faffing and removing and mucking around isnt good for anything00:20
* Shapeshifter is thinking about writing a better mail client00:20
lcukif you are spending hours trying to find the space requirement you are easier backing up and cleanly flashing and restoring00:20
marexslonopotamus, careful, you need userland that supports interworking !00:21
lcukAranel, what happens if you try using command line and apt-get to perform the update00:21
lcukdoes that actually tell you why its not possible (cant remember)00:21
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SpeedEvilShapeshifter: pine00:22
Aranellcuk: now I tried, it says "need to get 121MB of archives. After this operation, 21.1MB of additional disk space will be used. E: You don't have enough free space in /var/cache/apt/archives"00:23
TheFaiolinewbie question: to start writing an application for maemo, is it best to use the GNU build system or the Qt Creator?00:23
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lcukdoh yeah i forgot about that, ham uses a different place for it atm, ok nm00:23
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Aranellcuk: so now what, 53M is not enough for it? It wants more?00:24
lcukTheFaioli, it depends on what you want to achieve00:24
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ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: huh. pine is very old00:24
lcukAranel, it is conflicted did you read the message and page docs linked00:24
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dmj726what url is the nokia pr1.2 update located at00:25
Aranellcuk: yes I did and it was noted under "Not Enough Free Space" with a link to "free up rootfs space"00:25
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Shapeshifterdmj726: or
Dr_Cainhow much rootfs do you need?00:25
Dr_CainI have 42 MB now, is that enough?00:25
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TheFaiolilcuk: I am not sure I follow. What is the advantage of one over the other? Let's say I want to write a client to sync my contacts a web service.00:25
chadi!seen noobmonk3y00:25
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lcukTheFaioli, well if its a gui app its recommended you use qt to start.  but you will have to check if you have all the qt classes to access what you need00:26
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DrGrovHi guys and girls00:26
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TheFaiolilcuk: So as a rule, Qt is better for GUI (and beginners?) and GNU is better for c dev like libs and such? (very rough rule of thumb)00:28
dmj726the emmc image is gereally unnecesay right?00:28
Arkenoiqt sucks today00:28
TomaszDit is essential for PR1.2 dmj72600:28
simoneb_seems like updating to 1.2 broke something on my n900... it boots, but every letter is displayed as a small square, it lacks some themes, etc00:28
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Arkenoiif it takes 3-5 seconds for application to launch it is showstopper00:29
Dr_Cainapt-get clean freed up some rootfs space00:29
lcukTheFaioli, comparing Qt to GNU is not the same00:29
Arkenoii hoped pr1.2 will change that as qt was expected to be preloaded00:29
Dr_Cainstupid partition design from the beginning tbh00:29
Arkenoibut no00:29
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lcukpeople normally do qt vs gtk+gobject00:29
TomaszDdmj726, basically, if you follow instructions it's going to be OK, if you don't you'll end up in deep shit and you subsequently write a thread about how nokia sucks00:29
lcukGNU build system stuff can be used for qt or gtk or many other things00:29
TheFaiolilcuk: Because both are UI... gotcha.00:29
DrGrovsimoneb_: any problems while upgrading to PR 1.2? How did you upgrade? Flashing or OTA?00:29
lcukyup TheFaioli00:30
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Arkenoisomething is wrong with media tracker, i do not see any files in player00:30
strcpyHi everybody. I`m downloading firmware update 1.2 . has anybody checked if this update resolve previous depencency hell mainly caused by Qt ?00:30
Arkenoiafter update00:30
simoneb_DrGrov: no, no problems, i just attached it to the wire and let it go... OTA00:30
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lcukso anyway, qt has a lower barrier of entry for new developers if everything flows smoothly00:30
Dr_Cainstrcpy: you updating via the app manager ?00:30
TheFaiolilcuk: So I can basically use them interchangeably if I develop for Qt....00:30
Dr_Cainor apt?00:30
DrGrovsimoneb_: attach it to the wire? OTA doesn't require any wire as fair as I know...00:30
DrGrovsimoneb_: but yes, OTA it is.00:30
lcuk? use what interchangably?00:30
strcpyno. through nokia-software-update (forgot to mention N900)00:31
simoneb_DrGrov: yea, i mean the battery charger00:31
Dr_Caindamnit, it really wants to use the damn nokia updater :|00:31
Dr_CainI want to flash OTA!00:31
DrGrovsimoneb_: the bootup is going smooth?00:31
spinningcompassI've created a Bluetooth PAN & now I can interact with the Nokia N810's screen via VNC on my Mac. Is there a way to run a program on the Nokia 810 *from the Mac*, feed the program from the Mac to the Nokia, and then watch the result on the Mac's screen?00:31
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dmj726so I can't update to pr 1.2 without killing my home?00:31
GAN900dmj726, huh?00:31
TheFaiolilcuk: I can use Qt Creator but basically the source can be compiled either way (suppose I send it to someone who does not use Qt Creator).00:31
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simoneb_DrGrov: it boots, (the intro video is not showing up but oh well ...) then in the desktop i can't see many things, i see letters as squares, etc00:32
strcpyDr_Cain, I did just bricked my n900, it was due to updating to latest kernel-power dev release, I believe. and found it a good chance to upgrade to 1.2 too :)00:32
dmj726isn't the emmc image for the 32 gb?00:32
Dr_Cainoops :D00:32
TomaszDdmj726, that seems to be the case, so back up and move the back up off the phone00:32
Dr_Cainyeah bad idea X)00:32
Dr_Cainthough you can get it back with the flasher , right?00:32
jjmarinwhat the hell is this: dpkg: serious warning: files list file for package `maemo-optify-runonce' missing, assuming package has no files currently installed.00:32
simoneb_DrGrov: for example i had some bookmarks on that desktop which i don't see... i see the foreca widget's outline, its icons (sun, clouds...) but not much else00:32
DrGrovsimoneb_: i put a PM for you.00:33
dmj726this is painful compared to ubuntu00:33
Arkenoino videos/no music/no photos00:33
strcpyDr_Cain, I already reflashed it to latest maemo .bin , to be able to use nokia-soft-up and just noticed 1.2 release :)00:33
TomaszDdmj726, no, flashing is not the preferred option, you are supposed to update OTA00:33
DrGrovsimoneb_: sound like you have some serious issues with the installation of the firmware00:33
Arkenoiwhat can be the reason?00:33
Arkenoireboot does not help00:33
simoneb_DrGrov: thank you... a pm to who?00:33
strcpyjust be warned about trying kernel-power dev releases. in my case it leaded to constant reboots00:33
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DrGrovsimoneb_: it didn't go as planned it seems00:33
dmj726OTA refuses to work00:33
dmj726I've spent 4 hours trying that00:34
DrGrovsimoneb_: i wrote you a private message, but nevermind. we talk here, perhaps someone else can help out as well.00:34
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TomaszDso flash both FIASCO and eMMC dmj726, but first move your backup off the phone00:34
TomaszDyou'll lose everything if you don't00:34
simoneb_DrGrov: oh, ok. anyway i don't mean the nokia logo, i can't see the small clip after that, the hands (which i changed into something else)00:34
dmj726yeah...I copied off my MyDocs...took half an hour just to copy that00:34
DrGrovsimoneb_: when you updated you waited long enough to see the initial big lettered NOKIA screen with a progress bar?00:34
TomaszDand don't reboot between FIASCO and eMMC flash00:35
ruskiePurging configuration files for nokiamaps-navigation-provider ...00:35
ruskiermdir: unrecognized option `--ignore-fail-on-non-empty'00:35
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ruskieso nicely broken00:35
DrGrovsimoneb_: ah okay, you changed it.00:35
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DrGrovsimoneb_: did you do a backup before you upgraded?00:35
simoneb_DrGrov: uhm, i think i waited too much because i didn't see the progress bar. i left the mobile on the table and came back after an hour or so.00:36
simoneb_DrGrov: yes i did00:36
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DrGrovsimoneb_: you should have seen a blue lettered "NOKIA" appearing after the installation which had a progress bar. Did you see whether the phone told you that the software has been updated?00:36
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Arkenoiis there a way to force tracker to rescan manually?00:36
DrGrovsimoneb_: is there any way you can try to restore your latest backup?00:37
simoneb_DrGrov: ssh?00:37
DrGrovsimoneb_: can you access any menus at all?00:37
simoneb_DrGrov: i can, but i can't read anything00:37
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TomaszDArkenoi, tracker-processes -r00:38
DrGrovsimoneb_: ok, that makes it a bit hard yes.00:38
TomaszDas a normal user00:38
DrGrovanyone know how to help simoneb_ with his firmware problem? :) kindly appreciated I think.00:38
simoneb_DrGrov: i remember i did a apt-get autoremove which removed libguile... is that bad?00:38
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DrGrovI have run out of ideas00:38
simoneb_yea very kindly appreciated, i confirm that00:38
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DrGrovsimoneb_: no idea actually, i don't use apt-get autoremove at all since it might cause serious problems. not sure about libguile though if it is connected to your current problem.00:39
* anonuk is so close to a working maemo, yet so far :(00:39
spinningcompassIs there a way to run NFS over a Bluetooth PAN between a Nokia N810 and a Macbook?00:39
simoneb_is there any way to restore a backup via ssh?00:39
jjmarinAnyone has success with apt-get -o dir::cache=/home/user/MyDocs/apt-archive-cache dist-upgrade00:39
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jjmarinfor PR1.2 upgrade00:40
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josephnexusis there a way to have the calendar have a recurring event every 2nd and 4th friday of the month?00:40
obcecadohi, how can i make a video call thru skype ?00:40
obcecadoi cant seem to find any menus00:40
obcecadopr 1.200:41
josephnexusobcecado you make the call00:41
josephnexusand then after they answer00:41
josephnexusthere is a button that appears to enable video00:41
TomaszDnot really, there is an option to video call directly as well00:41
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obcecadowhere ?00:42
* Aranel *yay! yay! It's downloading the update! teeworlds was the conflicting package. thanks to lcuk, slonopotamus, DocScrutinizer and other guys who helped me =) 00:42
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TomaszDwell, in the call menu00:42
Arkenoidid not help00:42
Arkenoiany other troubleshooting ideas?00:42
TomaszDtroubleshooting for what00:43
obcecadoi really cant find it00:43
obcecadoim doing a call now, and i cant find the icon00:43
ArkenoiTomaszD, no media files are indexed00:43
TomaszDobcecado, open the keyboard to enter landscape mode00:43
dmj726why is the fiasco image 19 and the emmc 13?00:43
TomaszDdmj726, it doesn't matter, it's OK00:44
TomaszDArkenoi, what is your situation, fresh flash?00:44
ArkenoiTomaszD, yep00:44
TomaszDemmc too?00:44
obcecadoTomaszD: same options00:44
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lcukAranel, sure no problem, btw, pr4.7 was released :P00:44
Arkenoino, just fiasco image00:44
simoneb_DrGrov: i think i got it ... my /opt has not been mounted. how could it be?00:45
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TomaszDobcecado, update the desktop client00:45
jjmarinPR1.2 is a shit !!!!00:45
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Aranellcuk: damn.. I was freeing up some space for PR1.3.. I'll never get it done before pr7.0 :(00:45
TomaszDArkenoi, see, that's where you failed :)00:45
threshyeah flash emmc and lose all your data00:45
lcukwell done anyway :) as much as i moaned you persevered00:45
threshnice choice :S00:45
TomaszDlose data? maybe back your data up and move it off the phone00:46
TomaszDit's easy...00:46
threshnot really00:46
SpeedEvilAlways back up.00:46
SpeedEvilYou can't easily drop your server down the toilet.00:46
threshmy nokla has more space than my every computer00:46
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TomaszDyes it is. You use the backup app, then move the backup folder to your desktop00:46
TomaszDmove your pics and videos too00:46
josephnexusSpeedEvil: is that a challange?00:46
threshbackup app didnt back up all my music ;)00:46
SpeedEviljosephnexus: yes.00:47
SpeedEviljosephnexus: pics plz.00:47
lcukin soviet russia, toilet drops on server00:47
simoneb_can anybody please tell me how the "/opt" line in /etc/fstab should look like?00:47
TomaszDthresh, sure but where did it say that it would00:47
josephnexuslcuk, pics or it didn't happen00:47
Arkenoiand volume buttons do not work in video player anymore00:47
dmj726why would I want the emmc image?00:47
threshTomaszD: sure. still a FAIL to update.00:47
lcukjosephnexus, theres stories on dailywtf about server rooms inside toilets00:47
lcukand floods00:47
lcukso, sure00:47 phone just booted fine after flashing the other one00:48
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TomaszDArkenoi, don't waste your time, backup, move backup and data, flash FIASCO, flash eMMC00:48
dmj726Am I missing something?00:48
lcuksimoneb_, how do you know /opt isnt mounted00:48
lcukhave oyu got far enough to get a ssh session?00:48
simoneb_lcuk: "find /opt" yields almost nothing00:48
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lcukhow are you typing "find /opt"00:48
lcukon device itself?00:48
simoneb_lcuk: make that "-type f", and it's really nothing00:48
TomaszDdmj726, yes, you are not supposed to reboot the phone after flashing fiasco (-R flag)00:48
simoneb_yes, via ssh, as root00:48
lcukor ssh session?00:49
ArkenoiTomaszD, do you imagine what it takes to do on a phone heavy loaded with stuff? it probably takes several hours of my time and i probably forget something00:49
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lcukis the device functioning? ie booted visibly ok?00:49
TomaszDdmj726, re-flash without the flag, then flash emmc with the -R flag00:49
Arkenoizillion application settings etc00:49
TomaszDArkenoi, no right to complain if something fails if you can't take the time00:49
simoneb_lcuk: no, it isn't working well, it boots, i see the nokia logo, i don't see the welcoming video, i get to home screen but don't see letters (i see them as squares), etc.00:49
Arkenoiit should not fail, should it?00:49
lcuk:( simoneb_ sure, that does sound like /opt corruption00:50
Arkenoithe phone is not supposed to behave such way or to require *hours* to be spent on fixing things that should not break00:50
TomaszD...if you flash fiasco without the -R flag, then eMMC with the -R flag it will work fine00:50
simoneb_lcuk: well as a start i could try to mount it by hand00:50
TomaszDArkenoi, I'm just trying to help you00:50
lcuksince you have booted, could you pastebin the log of .... to me please00:51
TomaszDif you don't want to be helped then fine00:51
lcukjust finding file00:51
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lcuksimoneb_, just mounting it may not do you much good, im just finidng the log filename now - unforuntately if its run over what i think it has but then something has gone wrong you will need to flash most likely00:52
lcukfirst/ ceck /home/opt00:52
lcukdoes it have contents00:52
simoneb_uhm, yes, /home/opt has stuff in it00:52
Dr_Cainoh hey, nokia software updater started working, just after I downloaded the image manually from tablets-dev >_>00:52
* Dr_Cain downloads again00:52
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lcukcan you pastebin a recursive ls (private if you like)00:53
lcukand the contents of /var/log/maemo-optify-boottime.log as well please00:53
dmj726why must the battery be fully charged to flash the mmc?00:54
Dr_Cainbecause it will be running off battery power during flashing00:54
TomaszDthat's a dumb question, it's failsafe for dumb users00:54
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Dr_Cainneeds to be atleast 50%00:55
lcukand simoneb_ one more thing, does /var/lib/maemo-optify-firstboot-do-not-clean-home-opt exist00:55
dmj726Okay, I wanted to make sure it wasn't something to do with calibrating the battery software00:55
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simoneb_lcuk: exists, at 0 bytes00:55
lcukok ta00:56
pupnik_i got no such file00:56
lcukpupnik_, did you update to 1.2?00:56
pupnik_yeah upgraded00:57
pupnik_no reboot yet00:57
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pupnik_ham didnt have an upgrade00:57
lcukhow did you not reboot?00:57
Dr_Cainah there we go, updated00:57
lcukham closes most things so you cannot continue ?00:58
pupnik_kept running out of space and restarting00:58
pupnik_there was and is no pr1.2 upgrade visible in ham today00:58
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pupnik_but the packages are there00:59
pupnik_so apt-get upgrade installs them00:59
Ikaruspupnik_: not recommended though01:00
GAN900pupnik_, did you nuke the metapackage or something?01:00
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pupnik_i never found out the metapackage - what is it called01:02
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lcuknot recommended at all infact01:03
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pupnik_there was no OTA in ham for me.  probably took the spooks too long to trojan01:05
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arachnisti've got 1.201:07
jjmarinPls Help: My N900 reboots trying upgrade PR1.2 with "apt-get -o dir::cache=/home/user/MyDocs/apt-archive-cache dist-upgrade".   This is the message I've got before rebooting: Do you want to continue [Y/n]? Y | Selecting previously deselected package maemo-optify-runonce. | (Reading database ... 22923 files and directories currently installed.) | Unpacking maemo-optify-runonce (from .../maemo-optify-runonce_0.10-32+0m5_all.deb) ... | dokil01:07
arachnistvia ham01:07
jjmarinI use "apt-get -o dir::cache=/home/user/MyDocs/apt-archive-cache dist-upgrade" from
jjmarinjjmarin: any idea. I'm trying to upgrade the hole day. Using the UI I've got "operation failed"01:09
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bobbydI just flashed my n900 to PR 1.2 UK clean and I now I can't work out how to get the calendar widget back01:14
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bobbyda, maybe Ive got to download it :)01:14
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arachnistbarisione: did you make a backup before reflashing the device?01:15
arachnistbarisione: was it a full backup?01:15
bobbydarachnist: if you're talking to me, yes I did01:15
b-man    hehehe01:15
bobbydI know it stores all installed apps, but I wanted to start clean01:15
arachnistbobbyd: well, there should be an option in the backup app to restore the applications01:16
bobbyd(apart from contacts) I've installed a crazy amount of stuff on this01:16
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bobbydI'll have a look through the list anyway01:17
bobbydthanks for reminding me01:17
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bleetergrrr, OTA won't work (insufficient space) and NSU keeps throwing a wobbly :/ lol01:19
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hardakerbleeter: how much did it tell you that it needed total?01:19
javispedrothe new tmo -- you cannot even point users to bugzilla because they go there and write "MORONS!!!"01:19
hardaker(I didn't even try; I flashed as I knew it wouldn't ever have enough since 1.1.1 needed 90M and I had about 10)01:19
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jjmarinFor reference: my problem was related with the package maemo-optify-runonce and I resolved with rm -rf /opt/* . Now it is installing :)01:20
* javispedro wonders what are you doing01:21
javispedroif you just did that, well, backup and reflash, because all your apps are gone.01:21
bobbydnope, can't find it anywhere01:21
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bobbydis it part of the default install for you guys, under widgets on the desktop?01:22
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javispedrob-man: quite a smart guy. now start the countdown to him selling a firewall/antivirus system for an embedded OS whose in the wild virus count is 0 :)01:23
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Arkenoihow do i change volume keys function? now they are tied to zoom function01:27
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Arkenoiso i cannot change volume at all01:27
shinkamuilooks likke my break in opengles was due to having a half installed pr1.2 upgrade01:28
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javispedroArkenoi: which application?01:28
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Arkenoiall of them01:28
shinkamuijavispedro, thanks for the poke there01:29
ioanhi. any idea where the proxy settings for each connection are kept?01:29
Arkenoiif i press volume buttons in media player just nothing happens01:29
shinkamuiI didn't think to make sure my packages were up to date01:29
Arkenoifor terminal i get font size change01:29
shinkamuijust assumed the update worked01:29
javispedroshinkamui: actually, I wanted you to update package listings, if app mgr left you with a broken system then complain about it01:29
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javispedro(but not on that bug report ofc :P )01:29
javispedroArkenoi: and on the desktop?01:30
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hawai`iOkay who wants to solve my new problem?01:31
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hawai`iHalted on boot at Nokia logo, R&D mod does not force continuation.01:31
Arkenoion the desktop no effect as well01:32
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javispedroArkenoi: reboot01:33
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javispedro oh, I'd wish.01:33
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Arkenoijavispedro, no effect01:36
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hawai`iNobody feels like diagnosing this with me?01:37
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Arkenoiwell, if *THIS* thing was delayed to clean up bugs..01:43
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hawai`iWhy the fuck doesn't it boot when R&D mode is enabled?01:45
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Ikarus[N900]hmmm, video jabber calls aren't allowed ? or is it actually checking if the other end supports it ?01:46
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Robot101Ikarus[N900]: it checks that the other end supports it, yeah01:47
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javispedroRobot101: btw, do you know if I could potentially call another resource of my own Jabber ID with the Maemo client? (off the top of your head, don't look it up, just an experiment I want to do)01:53
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Robot101javispedro: it's hardcoded out in telepathy at the moment, not for any very good reason but nobody really thought it through yet01:54
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javispedroah, nevermind then :)01:55
DocScrutinizerRobot101: o/01:55
bleeterhardaker: it didn't01:56
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opdf2anyone else holding out on 1.2?01:58
DocScrutinizereeeew 1.201:59
javispedroah... final user vs bugzilla interaction guys are going to have quite a lot of work02:00
* anonuk fixed the hildon theme by copying /usr/share/themers/Default to /usr/share/themes/default! 90 back to working again :)02:00
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* DocScrutinizer waits for 1.2.1 :-P02:01
Ikarus[N900]hrm search in app installer is missing in 1.2 ?02:01
DocScrutinizertype searkstring02:02
wolf^Ikarus, select "all categories" and type to match02:02
javispedroremoving the menu item wasn't a good idea.02:02
DocScrutinizernot at all02:02
Ikarus[N900]wolf^: not working02:02
DocScrutinizerincredibly obscure02:02
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Ikarus[N900]9h just slow02:02
javispedroalso I have to check if they still search into descriptions02:03
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javispedrobecause it seemed too fast to be searching in descriptions02:03
Ikarus[N900]also only package name not description it seems...02:03
DocScrutinizerand you can't select anymore descr/name02:03
javispedrobad, bad idea.02:03
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: now that would be a bummer! :-((02:03
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: yeah, but now it meets the gui design rules :-P02:04
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javispedrodunno -- seems like non-discoverable to me.02:04
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Ikarus[N900]dockane: while all other annoying 30 page scroll lists still lack search on type02:05
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zaheermlike email :)02:05
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: "type anywhere to search/match" paradigma02:05
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javispedrosee Ikarus point :)02:05
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DocScrutinizeraah EHIGHLIGHT02:06
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Ikarus[N900]yeah ENOTAB :P02:06
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javispedroyou're right.02:08
Ikarus[N900]hrm, also anyone know a better app to manage the applications menu, other then catorise I know none02:09
lcukIkarus[N900], on pr1.2 you can arrange single items02:09
BCMMIkarus[N900]: have you updated to pr1.2 ?02:09
lcukbut not the kind of grouping02:09
BCMMrearranging is built it, but not subfolders02:09
lcukyou can move any item up to where you want it02:09
BCMMalso, lcuk is faster than me02:09
lcukjust tap and hold on an icon02:09
BCMMmaybe it's daytime in his timezone or something02:09
DocScrutinizerIkarus[N900]: heard 1.202:10
DocScrutinizersubfolders are a must though. So just another fail for 1.202:10
jattdoes vertical mode work with the latest maemo update02:11
Ikarus[N900]rearranging is nice and all but not ideal02:11
Ikarus[N900]guess I'll pick apart catorise02:11
jattvertical in the maemo browser?02:11
BCMMjatt: portrait mode?02:11
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BCMMjatt: if you mean portrait mode, it worked before, and in pr1.2 there is a GUI for it02:12
DocScrutinizercatorize and relatives all miss a simple way for user to arrange (even on a basis like which folder an app should go to) - and the categories of HAM/whatever are braindamages&useless02:12
jattwhat is this gui? is there a virtual keyboard for the portrait mode?02:12
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jjmarinFinally, PR1.2 bricked my N900. Well done Nokia !!!!02:14
DocScrutinizerwho needs a kbd for browsing? XP02:14
anonukjjmarin: mine too , but i managed to fix it as there was a boot menu installed02:15
jatte.g. to write search terms in google02:15
anonukjjmarin: did it reboot in the middle of the update?02:15
jjmarinanonuk: no02:15
DocScrutinizerjatt:just klick the right add ;-P02:15
jattwhich is the biggest improvement in the new version? i haven't decided to upgrade yet02:16
DocScrutinizerjatt: congrats02:16
* DocScrutinizer neither02:16
brikwhy not?02:17
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* DocScrutinizer waits for 1.2.1 :-P02:17
jjmarinTomorrow I'll bring it to the local Nokia care point02:17
DocScrutinizer1.2 eats your children and pets02:17
brikgood I don't have children or pets then02:17
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jattI am not sure if it pays off. I was expectimg a virtual kbd in portrait mode :)02:18
DocScrutinizerI don't have now, so I don't know how to feed it02:18
javispedroDocScrutinizer: it doesn't eat them, it just lets other people eat them! remember pr1.2 fixes world hunger!!02:18
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DocScrutinizeraaah, how tricky02:18
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jjmarinjjmarin: right it restart continouly, it show the keyboard menu no-hildonized and without any letter and the reboots.... :(02:18
jattwill be a new version for bugfixes?02:19
DocScrutinizerthough probably with usual dely it'll be 201902:19
mc_teois there a nice python sound library available for n90002:19
javispedroafter all, as I predicted, PR1.2 was released in 201302:20
* BCMM is waiting for the next "get kicked for asking about" version02:20
javispedrowhen is PR1.3 going to be released?02:20
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jattafter duke nukem forever is relaunched02:20
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DocScrutinizer= v2.002:21
javispedroeither way, you really should upgrade to PR1.2 as we plan to replace all pr1.0 applications from repositories with viruses.02:21
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DocScrutinizerhasn't that been accomplished yet? WTF! another delay02:22
javispedrowe found it was the best fix for the entire qt4.6experimental debacle02:22
mc_teois there a nice python sound library available for n90002:22
javispedroDocScrutinizer: your help with the exploding battery part of the virus is really appreciated.02:22
javispedromc_teo: what do you mean for sound library?02:23
DocScrutinizeralways a joy to contribute in a creative manner02:23
javispedroplain sound output?02:23
javispedrosound manipulation?02:23
javispedrodecoding of mp3/aac files?02:23
mc_teosound output mostly02:23
javispedroyou can use pygame02:23
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jjmarinMaemo challenge: Build a cool 1.2 wall with N900 bricks !!!!02:24
mc_teois that included with qtdev? javispedro02:24
DocScrutinizerdid that with Freeruners ;-P02:24
javispedromc_teo: oh, I think not.. :(02:24
javispedromc_teo: are you using pyside/pyqt? I'm sure Qt will have some sane class for sound output.02:25
mc_teoi hope so02:25
mc_teodoes gcc/g++ use much app space?02:26
mc_teoor should i stick to cross compiling on scratchbox?02:26
javispedrofor on-device development? it's much more convenient to use a chroot.02:26
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DocScrutinizermc_teo: ask speedevil / N900evil02:27
cure`so eh, people not really liking 1.2 yet or so?02:27
lcuki liek it02:27
cure`havent reflashed/upgraded myself yet02:27
* javispedro likes it too02:27
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javispedrowell, had a battery-dead-in-the-morning problem this morning, but as usual I tend to blame me...02:28
* lcuk lieks chocolate milk too02:28
shinkamuioh lord02:28
shinkamuianyone know how to fix the not enough space error in app manager when root has 82% in use, and I have over 90% on opt?02:28
mc_teoN900evil: hi02:28
DocScrutinizerI *might* *possibly* consider to give it a try, if I could go back to 1.102:28
javispedroOne more reason to love chocolate milk and hate Apple.02:28
shinkamuiits not a total disaster, can install from the console, but i like to peruse the new apps..02:28
xorAxAxshinkamui: delete random files and pray02:28
xorAxAx"russian file roulette"02:29
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DocScrutinizerbut a one-way ticket to doom isn't that appealing to me yet02:29
xorAxAxshinkamui: how many MB do you have available?02:29
shinkamui39.2m on root02:29
shinkamui170 on opt02:29
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xorAxAxthats a bit too few on root02:29
xorAxAxremove a few packages02:30
shinkamuidude, pre the upgrade, I was normally around 96% on root02:30
xorAxAxah, you did the upgrade already?02:30
shinkamuianyway, I removed nokia maps to free up even that much space02:30
shinkamuiand no help02:30
xorAxAxthen i dont know02:30
shinkamuixorAxAx, yea, I upgraded02:30
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shinkamuithis is trying to install a 41k app02:30
xorAxAxmaybe you need to pay the HAM fee on ovi02:30
shinkamuiits clearly just a problem with app manager02:30
xorAxAx"HAM+    10 EUR"02:31
opdf2how's 1.2 and erminig? This is my most important app02:31
shinkamuiwhy do I have to pay ovi to use shit from extras02:31
shinkamuithose douchers are charging me 15$ for nothing?02:31
xorAxAxyou get a better HAM!02:31
grishnavdamnit dammnit damnit!02:31
shinkamuiI dont get the joke02:31
grishnavi forgot to save my upstart script for openvpn before I flashed02:31
* grishnav funes02:31
shinkamuiif its a joek02:31
DocScrutinizerxorAxAx: you're kidding!02:32
shinkamuiif its legit, Im really confused02:32
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tghm, this upgrade is really slow for me 60% in 3h02:32
* shinkamui starts seeing stars02:32
xorAxAxDocScrutinizer: i am one of those who would also sell the "i'm rich" applications :)02:32
DocScrutinizersure, thought that HAM+ is your idea02:32
xorAxAxi should apply for a position at nokia to increase revenue :)02:33
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DocScrutinizernah, my idea to send the device in for service by flushing it down the toilet beats your HAM+ with hands tied back02:34
* javispedro runs to patent office02:34
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MilhouseSeems like there might be a post PR1.2 release according to bug 6876, which is bloody good news.02:37
povbot`Bug Birthday appears in the day before02:37
javispedroMilhouse: oh, do not trust. we never got to see some the update containing some of the late bug fixes for diablo02:37
javispedrobut more updates are to be expected.02:38
* javispedro goes get a dyslexic shirt.02:38
DocScrutinizerintroducing more nice lovely regressions02:38
pigeonhmm, weird, for some reasons my extras-devel repo url has become fremantle-1.2 (which doesn't exist) instead of fremantle, is that normal?02:38
* DocScrutinizer starts to sell "3" patches for all those "fixed in 1.2" shirts out there02:39
MilhouseWould be nice if they just hit the annoying, apparently trivial bugs... something for the summer intern to work on.02:39
javispedropigeon: no.02:39
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pigeoni see there is fremantle-1.2 for extras, but not extras-devel02:39
javispedroMilhouse: that one isn't trivial..02:39
Milhousewhich one, bug 6876? Showing a birth date on the right day? Righto... ;)02:40
* javispedro hates date manipulation02:40
MilhouseWouldn't surprise me if the calendar has a cocked up leap year algorithm.02:40
DocScrutinizerMilhouse: you're not the first one suspecting this02:41
MilhouseBUT, the biggest failing is that this bug, which appears trivial, but even if not it's criminal for a calendar app to contain and not be picked up in testing, was opened in Dec 09... WTF?02:42
javispedroah, time to repeat my story with eduroam02:42
MilhouseMakes you wonder how the prioritisation system works at Nokia - a browser that can't browse, SHIP IT!!!02:42
javispedrowake me up when the bug is two-three years old.02:42
javispedroas that is my personal record :)02:43
pwnguinMilhouse: well, they did fix USSD02:43
pwnguinwhich is kinda nice02:43
Milhousewas that just it's age, or how long it took to fix - reckon I can best that easy! :)02:43
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Milhousepwnguin: yeah, seemed pretty necessary though in for people to use the device... then again showing dates in a calendar? Hmm... /rubs chin02:44
pwnguinits just birthdays, no?02:44
MilhouseI guess, although I somewhat distrust anything with such a basic failing so would be disinclined to trust Calendar with anything more important.02:46
pwnguinits not a failing, its a feature02:46
pwnguinthey give you 24 hours to find a last minute present02:46
javispedroyou TRUST calendar???02:47
javispedrooh god.02:47
pwnguini trust exchange which syncs the calendar02:47
javispedrodidn't you get the "all appointments shown in the widget are pretty much randomly selected" issue02:47
DocScrutinizerpwnguin: fine, they obviously had to reflash the modem fw for that. Seems they introduced a bug this way, which kills the contacts app on certain contact specifics stored on the sim02:47
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Milhousejavispedro: yeah I know, what WAS I thinking! :)02:47
tuliobaarsHello, people!02:48
javispedroI really loved knowing that I would go on holiday on july. Of course I really hated missing my next final exam!!02:48
Milhousejavispedro: i did get some that showed up on the right date, but it was a bit random as to when they disappeared.02:48
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Milhousejavispedro: don't expried tasks now remain on the current day (was that a fix in this release or an outstanding issue?) must admit I've stopped using it because it's, well, sh1t.02:49
DocScrutinizerbut MAJOR FAIL is: you can not go back to pr1.1 (or has that been fixed?)02:49
Milhousedocscrutinizer: think that's because of the radio isn't it? or something like that. probably should be allowed to regress though.02:49
javispedroDocScrutinizer: no. either way, I can only think of one reason to want to go back: keyboard and/or categorise, and all of them should be easy to overwrite.02:49
infobotMilhouse meant: docscrutinizer: think that's because of the radio isn't it? or something like that. probably should be allowed to revert though.02:50
javispedroso make that two reasons :P02:50
pwnguini have to ask: how long ago was USSD introduced?02:50
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DocScrutinizerMilhouse: it IS because of modem FW. And it CAN NOT be reverted02:50
Milhousepwnguin: in general or on the n900? about 24 hours ago for the latter, probably since the dawn of GSM for the former.02:50
pwnguinthey seemed kinda surprised at the thought that people might use it02:50
javispedropwnguin: you surprised? PAP stands for Plain Authentication Protocol. Yep -- the most simple of the protocols. Two years.02:51
DocScrutinizerMilhouse: as Nokia decided to integrate a bullshit nto the modem fw not allowing to downgrade02:51
Milhousepwnguin: can't believe they're that stupid, so think that was just a cover for the lack of developent time/resources prior to launch.02:51
javispedroso One year for USSD codes which are way more complex is neat. Consider yourself lucky!02:51
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pwnguinim not sure what PAP is02:52
pwnguinor if ive ever used it =/02:52
MilhouseUSSD codes have been around a lot longer than 1-2 years, surely02:52
javispedroaka the eduroam bug.02:52
pwnguinbut im pretty sure that encryption is waaaaaaay harder than you're making it sound02:52
MilhouseUSSD is all for PAYG stuff, right?02:52
javispedroencryption? authentication.02:52
lcukbarkeep, i'd like a tall glass of your strongest whiskey please.02:52
lcukand leave me the rest of the barrel02:53
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: IIRC it's been found it's possible to reflash the modem IIRC02:53
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jaskacask-strength by the pint02:53
* javispedro gives lcuk some and invites him to the party02:53
DocScrutinizerUSSD ?? you're kidding? it's part of 1980 GSM specs02:53
lcukjavispedro, which party02:53
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javispedrothe complain party, of course! :)02:53
pwnguinMilhouse: USSD is used for more than PAYG. i saw a guy talk about his translation service that ran over USSD02:53
pwnguinDocScrutinizer: which is why i wonder, how do you find a modem that doesn't support it?02:54
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Milhousepwnguin: right, just querying it's age - PAYG has been around for many years.02:54
DocScrutinizerUSSD and its relative are used for controlling services since the beginning of (GSM) times02:54
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MilhouseDoc: Thought so.02:54
lcukjavispedro well its been interesting to see just how different people have made their filesystems since we last updated02:55
DocScrutinizerpwnguin: becuase it's a modem and not a phone?02:55
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DocScrutinizerwho needs call redirect on busy, for a modem? :-o02:56
pwnguinDocScrutinizer: i guess that makes some amount of sense02:56
MilhouseQuestion: Anyone using Google Mail with Nokia Messaging here?02:56
Milhouse(on the N900, obviously!)02:56
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pwnguinNokia Messaging == telepathy?02:56
pwnguinor the email app?02:56
MilhouseWith Nokia Messaging you get push email from Google02:57
pwnguini was using gmail by way of IMAP but for the last few months its refused to authenticate02:57
pwnguinprobably in part because i changed my password last month02:57
MilhouseHmmm... just wondering how many spam notifications you are getting on the device?02:57
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Milhouseor were02:57
MilhouseShit, I get loads02:57
pwnguinare you using the exchange like tool?02:58
javispedrolcuk: but you know this, the more you keep a system without updating it, the more customized and hard to update it gets :)02:58
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pwnguinthere's an MfE app that lets you set up which folders to care about02:58
MilhouseIt seems that Nokia Messaging is monitoring "All Mail" rather than Inbox, so when spam arrives and is labeled as SPAM, I still get a new mail notification - and when you go to read it, it's not there (as it's been re-labeled)02:58
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Milhousepwnguin: No, I'm using Nokia Messaging and have configured it with one Google Mail account/IMAP02:59
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pwnguinmfe ties into nokia messaging?02:59
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pwnguinie, i have gmail and exchange in the mail app02:59
Milhousepwnguin - maybe, not sure why I need MfE though02:59
MilhouseSee above :)03:00
pwnguinmine works fine03:00
lcuksure javispedro03:00
MilhouseMaybe when Calendar can handle dates better I'll revisit that. :)03:00
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pwnguinby dates you mean one niggling feature within contacts03:00
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Milhousepwnguin: I'm saying it's a suspect app that falls down at it's most basic task03:01
DocScrutinizerbtw push "thanks"on an arbitrary tmo post of DocScrutinizer if you like USSD, as without me asking konttori about it here in IRC it probably would have failed to get into 1.2 even03:01
pwnguini just don't buy this "if its not visibly bug free i cant be sure that's all the bugs there are!"03:01
SpeedEvilOh - USSD is in by default? Nice03:01
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SpeedEvilWell - if trivially obvious bugs are visible - it raises the question of the quality of the code, and the code review.03:02
Milhousepwnguin: truth is I don't *need* to use it (Calendar) so won't make the effort when it's broken at such a basic level - obviously Nokia didn't make any effort to test it either03:02
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: full ack03:02
pwnguinobviously nokia focused all their effort on microsoft exchange support03:02
pwnguinwhich is nice, because i have it at work03:02
xorAxAxjehovas witnesses infiltrated nokia and reprogrammed the calendar03:03
MilhouseWhereas nobody has birthdays :)03:03
pwnguinnot on my phone they dont03:03
MilhouseMeanie :)03:03
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xorAxAxyes, no witness witnesses birthdays, and moving them by one day does effectively that :)03:03
DocScrutinizerxorAxAx: "apocalypse is always one day nearer than you think it is!" ?? ;-P03:04
pwnguinanyways, im surprisd that i actually got to OTA update this time03:04
javispedrothey removed the left/right swipe to go to next month in calendar!!!!03:04
javispedrothat's it!! I'm buying an iPhone.03:04
tuliobaarsHello people! Is the n810 dead?03:05
Mouseylong live the n810!03:05
xorAxAxtuliobaars: yes, it doesnt have an atom cpu03:05
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GAN900Howdy, Milhouse.03:05
derfI still use my N810 more than my N900.03:05
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: 1.2 fanboy's penalty ;-P03:06
pwnguindoes the n900 pair with BT keyboards?03:06
DocScrutinizeranyway it's absolutely amazing how the number of regressions seems way larger than the number of fixed bugs03:07
ManoftheSeapwnguin: it can03:07
DocScrutinizerwhich btw I seen happening in a similar way for OM SHR distro03:08
javispedroDocScrutinizer: interestingly enough they also kept changing Gtk<->Qt<->Enlightment didn't them? :)03:08
xorAxAxpwnguin: yes, except those sold by nokia (not kidding!)03:08
SpeedEviljavispedro: With not enough communication with community.03:08
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xorAxAxBTDT, failed miserably03:09
Termanagood morning03:09
DocScrutinizerxorAxAx: WTF?!03:09
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xorAxAxi have a SU-8W lying here and it was unusable03:09
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* DocScrutinizer wanders off, sobbing03:10
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tuliobaarsa old history: wayfinder error in n810?03:11
tuliobaarsany answer?03:11
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lcuk2javispedro, just spent sometime with user who did full complete ssu but ended up with boxes on bootup - he had no /opt mountbind at all!  tho everything else had happened03:12
lcuk2turned out his rcS-late and system-services package hadnt been updated because he had modified it (and its a conf file)03:12
lcuk2still dont know whether hes reflashing03:13
lcuk2think he might be ok actually03:13
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: (SHR) nota bene SHR is somewhat like OM's mer03:13
tuliobaarsdo yoo know? when i'm goin to get a 7day trial it happens a network error! every tiem! why?03:13
lcuk2tuliobaars, a 7 day trial of what?03:13
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DocScrutinizerwhile OM2008.xx OM2009.xx were like PRx.y03:14
b-man*sigh* i wish people on would use the wiki more often :P03:14
javispedrolcuk2: some moments ago was someone here who said that "rm -r /opt" fixed his system =) I wonder what will happen when he tries to run any app.03:14
tuliobaarswayfinder, sorryu]03:14
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javispedro(well, no need to guess)03:14
lcukjavispedro, :O03:14
javispedrotuliobaars: ah, wayfinder is dead :(03:14
lcuktuliobaars, the servers are offline :(03:14
lcukmy tracy misses Todd also03:14
javispedrotuliobaars: if you didn't download the maps previously you're gonna have a hard time..03:15
lcuk"at the traffic circle"03:15
lcukits not the maps javispedro03:15
lcukits the license03:15
tuliobaarsi know, but i don't know how to use maemo mapper...but i still have the maps03:15
javispedromy license is still up to 201103:15
lcukcant enter nav mode unlicense03:15
tuliobaarsi need a 7 day trial, so I crack it even 7 day I need03:15
javispedrooh, so I won't be able to retrieve license file if I flash the n8x0.03:16
* javispedro backups it.03:16
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DocScrutinizerforget online licence shit03:17
DocScrutinizersee where it gets you03:17
pigeonhmm, does anyone know the diff with account-plugin-haze and telepathy-extras?03:17
pigeonah, never mind... found the diff, telepathy-extras is a meta package.03:18
DocScrutinizerdate limited lincences for a software are criminal and insane03:18
tuliobaarsi need that license or a good gps app03:18
DocScrutinizerlocking down software to a hardware is exactly as criminal03:19
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SpeedEvilDate limited licenses - that are not explicitly sold as such are criminal.03:19
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SpeedEvilI have much less problem with explicitly sold stuff.03:20
tuliobaarssorry, i didn't understand03:20
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DocScrutinizerI pay for it - you give me the whole cake. I don't care watermarks, but licence for a limited time, or a particular device? NO THANKS03:20
tuliobaarscrack it is a criminal action?03:20
tuliobaarsokok, i just wanna resolve how can I activate the 7-day trial on Way finder!03:21
tuliobaarslicense failed: network error, pls try again later03:22
tuliobaarsunknown error03:22
joganice that the url clicking problem (when hw keyb is closed) in the terminal is fixed03:23
DocScrutinizerurl clicking in terminal?? o.O03:23
* njsf_ is doing the restore after the 1.2 reflash03:23
tuliobaarsno, on the MAP app on app list?!03:24
SpeedEvilyou can click on URLs in osso-xterm03:24
tuliobaarsbut it doesn't give me any URL's03:24
b-manit's stupid to have a limited-time license for something you payed for :P03:24
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: INCREEEDIBLE03:24
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tuliobaarsI Agree03:25
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* SpeedEvil has no 8810, so has little clue.03:25
DocScrutinizerb-man: see my rant above03:25
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tuliobaarsso, how can i resolve this???03:26
tuliobaarsediting any .conf ???03:26
jogaI see maps has 3D now03:26
javispedroSpeedEvil: yea they sould three-year licenses.03:26
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DocScrutinizerb-man: if they revoke my right to use their software, can I then revoke my money I paid for it? :-P03:27
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SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: In some cases, yes.03:27
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: will vary depednign on the jurisdiction.03:27
joga...except it doesn't work with night mode03:28
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tuliobaarssorry, but yoo dunnot answer my question! (sorry, i'm dying tuse that GPS)03:29
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: fsck jurisdiction, that's clearly a case to be settled by LART03:29
SpeedEvilOh yeah - that reminds me - I haven't tried maps since boot.03:29
SpeedEviltuliobaars: Well - sorry - we're not being paid to do this.03:29
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b-manDocScrutinizer: revoking your rights to use that software for no real reason when you payed for it is very unreasonable - i'd complain03:30
SpeedEviltuliobaars: And seemingly nobody that's awake and active - maybe a dozen people - knows the answer.03:30
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pigeonhmm, for msn there are like 3 plugins, haze, butterfly, and pecan, anyone knows their diff?03:30
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tuliobaarsok, i wait. And, is there any Maemo 4 or N810 or OS2008 irc channel?03:31
SpeedEvil DocScrutinizer is interesting.03:31
SpeedEviltuliobaars: Unfortunately not.03:31
SpeedEviltuliobaars:   It would have made sense to create one - perhaps back in september - but nobody did.03:31
javispedrotuliobaars: there's a forum though.
tuliobaarshow can I create an IRC channel?03:32
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tuliobaarsok, bybye03:33
tuliobaarssee you later03:33
jogaSpeedEvil: maps is more usable now, slowly getting somewhere..03:33
SpeedEvilOooh. Did it have a 'satellite view' before?03:33
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jogaor uh, yeah03:34
jogabut no 3D or night03:34
javispedroit had 3d.03:34
* SpeedEvil finds another bug to file.03:34
jogaand route search is a bit better (but why pink?)03:34
SpeedEvilI guess it's using yahoo tiles.03:34
javispedroprobably nokia's own tileserver03:35
pigeonhmm funny, now i have two "Facebook" account types...03:35
SpeedEviljavispedro: probably03:35 iirc03:35
SpeedEviljavispedro: But the dataset looks very like landsat03:35
SpeedEviljavispedro: here - which is 15m resolution - as used by yahoo here03:35
SpeedEvilAnd zooming in simply endlessly says 'downloading'03:36
javispedroin this country everyone uses the same tileset03:36
jogamaep is a nice program, it's simple and fast to use and you can select from many maps, I noticed it also knows the public transport routes03:36
javispedrowas provided by government for free iirc, also not satellite imaginary03:36
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: (red sky) heya, the future of FOSS is bright :-)03:37
jogaif I need to check where I am, it's a lot faster than maps but more useful than the location widget :)03:37
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: don't sell a product, just sell a service03:37
Pavlovanyone know about the variant repository/key stuff on maemo?03:37
SpeedEviljoga: I use osm2go - but...03:38
* DocScrutinizer sets up lawsuit against nokia, failing to deliver bugfree 1.2 ;-P03:38
DocScrutinizerhey guys - just kidding. Don't hush :-D03:41
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* ljp grumbles03:41
javispedrofriendly note: "Users joining DocScrutinizet's class action will be kicked and permanently banned from #maemo"03:42
javispedroargh, sorry for the typo.03:42
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* DocScrutinizer kicks javispedro for typo03:43
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DocScrutinizerljp: things going wrong?03:43
DocScrutinizerbtw to keep you:
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ljpjust.. if maemo5 was built on Qt, it'd have no bugs :)03:46
jebbathere anyway to use the "main" camera for google video calls instead of the "small" one?03:46
DocScrutinizeractually it seems it's an unbearable risk to sell software *products* at all03:46
djcastonljp, how is qt a part of 1.2? cause i know it plays a pretty big part03:46
DocScrutinizerjebba: given it's probably just a "1" vs a "0" somewhere in a strin like "...video0", I'd say you for sure could patch it03:47
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jebbaheh. DocScrutinizer ya for sure like that somehow... But if there was a normal way to do it....03:47
DocScrutinizera lil more normal would be to swap the device names03:48
DocScrutinizerin /dev/* or whatever03:48
jebbathat might lead to other problems though, like opening the cover would trigger for wrong device.03:48
DocScrutinizersane method would be a decent GUI to select on video input03:49
jebbaya exactly. :)03:49
DocScrutinizerjebba: (other problems) exactly03:49
DocScrutinizernice catch to open the cam cover and then take a shot of your own face XP03:50
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DocScrutinizerjebba: synthesis: patch that to "2" in telepahty/whatever, and use a symlink you easily can change to whatever meets your needs03:51
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jebbaperhaps just a dbus command will do it03:52
javispedroI kinda remember a config file for choosing the camera03:52
javispedrobut that was camera-ui iirc03:52
DocScrutinizerdamn, so the mirror shot cam is no fictive joke? \o/03:53
* DocScrutinizer mumbles gconftool + another few similarly nasty swearwords03:53
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opdf2If I don't have enough rootfs space for OTA, will it prevent me from DL in the beginning, or after a long download?03:55
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SpeedEvilHmm. Why might tcpdump say:03:57
SpeedEviltcpdump -i wlan0 dst 8003:57
SpeedEviltcpdump: WARNING: can't create rx ring on packet socket 3: 92-Protocol not available03:57
shinkamuiyou're better off than I am03:57
shinkamuiI have plenty of space03:57
shinkamuibut appmanager wont let me download even a 41k app03:57
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shinkamuievery freeking ota update leads to some stupid little problem, usually one thats not big enough to warrant a reflash03:58
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javispedrooh.. aisleriot solitaire with clutter/3D vista-like animations! port port port !03:59
DocScrutinizer51SpeedEvil: strange03:59
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opdf2anyone else get a quick error message during OTA?04:00
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jebba1DocScrutinizer i dont see anything in gconf that is relevant04:04
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opdf2k looks like downloading started with ~47 mb free rootfs04:08
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DocScrutinizerjebba1: was just a blind guess04:24
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* ShadowJK ponders how long to delay updating04:26
SpeedEvilShadowJK: Worked for me with no problems.04:27
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spinningcompassWhat's the /dev entry for the SHDC external memory card of the Nokia N810?04:31
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SpeedEvilHow can I get the media player to output through the video adaptor to an audio device?04:53
SpeedEvilThat is - the L and R stereo are plugged in04:53
SpeedEvilit stays in speaker mode04:53
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DocScrutinizer51short the yellow rca jack04:56
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opdf2cool 1.2 installed05:00
opdf2backup app makes it so easy to reinstall apps05:01
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DocScrutinizer51though I have to admit I don't understand why it doesn't recognize the AV cable as just that, an AV cable - and switches to AV mode delivering audio and video to the 3.5mm receptacle05:02
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MNX1024Anyone tried meego out yet?05:03
microliththat reminds me05:03
* microlith fires up the aspire one05:04
DocScrutinizer51anyway shorting the video/mic ring to gnd (yellow RCA) should signal a plain headphone05:04
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: yeah - I remembered the schematic, and did that.05:04
LiraNunawoot PR1.205:05
LiraNunaanyone noticed they have revised the touch interface?05:06
LiraNunayou can no longer swipe to open top panels :(05:06
LiraNunamust be a tap05:06
microlithtop panels?05:07
LiraNunaapplication dropdown panel05:07
LiraNunaand global one05:07
microlithdidn't know it responded like that05:08
microlithI've always just tapped05:08
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* microlith shoves meego into his ubuntu VM05:08
skynetsDocScrutinizer, what? class action lawsuit?05:08
LiraNunaI liked swiping, it felt more natural05:08
LiraNunaas if you "pull" the menu down05:08
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microlithLiraNuna: yeah, I can see that. Seems like it would be more useful with a capacitive screen though05:09
DocScrutinizer51skynets: don't take everything you read for a true fact05:09
LiraNunait used to work fine, they "fixed" it, it seems05:09
skynetsok so its only small claims?05:09
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LiraNunaany more 'secret fixes' on PR1.2?05:12
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skynetsim still getting wrong times05:13
skynetswhen i recieve smses05:13
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opdf2anyone also getting problems with shortcutd in 1.2?05:36
pigeonhmm since i upgraded to 1.2, i started getting smses from this "My Nokia" thing... anyone knows if that will cost me? :)05:37
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pupnik_2 euro and i tell u the answer05:38
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pigeonright... silly me, it's mentioned in the terms and conditions of My Nokia...05:40
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opdf2hmmm are there updated repos?05:52
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rockyddanyone is using maemo mapper? I have a problem to use google maps06:03
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hardakermy qt mail checking application is much nicer under 1.2, but they screwed up the highlight font.06:34
hardakerit's now dark on dark06:34
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greenflyhmmm CPU constantly pegged (xorg and rtcom-message-ui) after PR1.2 update06:50
dougt_is thumb code still supported w/ the 1.2 ROM on the n900s?06:52
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Ikarushrm, no one yet wrote a little nagios desktop applet for the N900 ?07:12
asjIkarus: have you tried magios?07:12
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Ikarusyou mean maegios07:13
Ikarusdoesn't quit seem to embrace the style I want07:13
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asjwhy do people ask "Is there an app for X in maemo" when they want to say "I've tried app X and I [don't like it|it doesn't do what I want|it looks ugly] is there anything else?"07:14
Ikarusasj: no, I just found it and looked at it :)07:14
iPeter-how to put video on skype call?07:14
Ikarusasj: up to that point I believed maegios was just a teaser as the google result implied07:15
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asjIkarus: I'm not picking on your alone, it's just happended a couple times in the last few days07:15
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iPeter-I found, nothing anymore07:16
Ikarusah well, got to run, work and all, meh07:17
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ZogG_N900so meego core for N900 is ready )07:25
ZogG_N900hope some test UI is comming soon07:25
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iPeter-Hey, i found "an-droid theme for n900" from "AppWatch" ther was repository history and downloaded it from that way. Now i cant find it from anywhere to give it to my friend07:35
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opdf2finally I can delete new emails07:35
iPeter-Is there any way to refresh mediaplayer, it doesnt regonize my vids or music07:39
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MiXu-iPeter-: It'll take a few minutes07:46
iPeter-booted phone and removed battery, worked.07:47
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* RST38h yawns08:14
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TermanaRST38h, HELLO ROBOT08:15
Termanasudo make me a sandwich08:15
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TermanaCy8aer, heh :P I hadn't seen that one08:18
* tekojo tickles RST38h with a feather08:21
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RST38hOMG, it has been 8 hours and POP3 account still works08:29
Stskeepsmodest was fixed?08:29
Stskeepsscary shit08:29
RST38hStskeeps: hush, don't scare it off =)08:29
Xisdibikmorning Stskeeps08:29
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RST38hStskeeps: keyboard language switch still broken though =08:30
Stskeepsi'd say hack it but that part isn't oss..08:30
RST38hActually, it is easily hackable08:30
Xisdibiknot sure if this was with the update, or just a fluke or something i changed long ago, but forgot now,   When i reply to an email in Modest, it has the original message and the cursor is on the front part of it.   and I dont want that.08:31
RST38hI have found the gconf value that sets the hw keyboard layout08:31
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RST38hchanging it from "en" to "ru" and back does the trick08:31
XisdibikStskeeps: do you know if there is a way to disable including the original message in a reply email in modest?08:31
RST38hNow only need to find a way to listen to keyboard events, globally08:31
StskeepsXisdibik: no idea, my general opinion is that modest is too broke to fix08:31
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XisdibikStskeeps: lol08:32
RST38hAnyways, work.08:32
Xisdibikanyone else know if that can be disabled in modest?08:32
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* lucent eyeballs Maemo 5 10.2010.19-1.002 update @ 113.6MB08:35
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Corsacok, video call between empathy and n900 fails with “codec negotiation failed”08:42
Corsactoo bad08:42
tybolltyou need to call in a mediator08:42
tybolltnegotiate a truce08:43
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tybolltCorsac: anyway if you install extras codec - does that help?08:43
CorsacI have them installed, it doesn't seem to work08:44
Corsacafaiui it uses farsight on the n900 side?08:45
tybolltI have no idea  sorry08:45
TermanaCorsac, thats your problem08:45
Termanayou need normalsight08:45
Termanaotherwise its unseeable08:46
tybolltfarTsight... gets rather smelly too08:46
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tybolltok this is silly :)08:46
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Stskeepswhat did you expect, theora? ;)08:51
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CorsacStskeeps: yes08:53
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StskeepsCorsac: was it you who was into xfce4 on moblin?08:54
Corsac seems to say that it's h264 only08:54
CorsacStskeeps: yes08:54
Corsacdepends on what you mean by “into”08:54
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Stskeepswell, there was someone who was maintaining packages of xfce4 somewhere :P08:55
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Corsachhm, then it might be sofar08:56
CorsacI maintain Xfce packages in Debian, but didn't do anything for moblin08:56
Stskeepshad to put it in context :)08:56
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pigeonCorsac: oh, thanks.08:57
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Corsacfor? h264 stuff?08:57
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pigeonCorsac: for maintaining xfce :)08:57
Corsacha :)08:57
StskeepsCorsac: preparing my n810 port of meego with xfce4 atm for first public .ks release :P08:57
pigeoni use debian and xfce :)08:58
CorsacStskeeps: woot08:58
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Stskeepsstill some way to go to M0 but stil..08:58
CorsacStskeeps: I plan to look at the 1.0 meego core to put on the touchbook, too, so that'll mean Xfce until there's a way to do GL stuff on it08:58
Corsacso I guess you ks might be helpful too :)08:59
tybolltbop @ Stskeeps08:59
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tybolltStskeeps: KDE ftw!!!!111108:59
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StskeepsCorsac: managed to ask to get 'extra' built for ARMv5 and ARMv7 so08:59
lucentI haven't completed an update of my N900 to PR1.2 yet, was there an improvement to the quality of front web cam capture?08:59
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microlithlucent: well, they enabled skype video call support so I hope they did09:00
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Corsachmmh, not really sure09:01
CorsacI didn't really see a difference, tbh09:01
CorsacStskeeps: thanks :)09:01
lucentI hope this upgrade works with HAM, hardly any free space on my N900 rootfs, after following the advice to free up space09:02
Corsacdid you disable the extras repositories?09:03
Corsacgrmbl, I don't see why telepathy framework can't use any of the available gstreamer codecs09:03
lucentCorsac: ^_^ yes I did09:04
lucentit won't bother me too much if this operation fails09:04
lucentmy last resort is familiar to me, I will re-flash09:04
lucentsomehow I hoped the upgrades would be less than 40MB09:05
Corsacit's 110M09:05
Corsacbut the total occupied space is much less than that09:06
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lucentHAM did not complain when I confirmed that I want to attempt the upgrade, does that imply it has enough space to store the downloaded upgrade?09:06
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lucenti.e. I have say 40MB free on rootfs, using HAM the upgrade will be 110M as you say09:07
lucentwhere ... does the information go if not to rootfs?09:07
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microliththe root space is mostly a buffer, all the packages and whatnot are stored on the eMMC where there's plenty of space -if- you use HAM09:09
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microlithusing apt-get will hurt quick09:10
tybolltthe location of a package is - of course -not mandated by what installer you use09:10
tybolltthat's silly09:10
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microlithHAM is aware of the eMMC partitions, and uses them09:11
microlithapt-get acts like it does on any Linux system09:11
microlithit'll pull the packages down into /var/cache/apt/archive09:11
tybolltit's in the package itself where it'll get installed09:11
microlithand eat your rootfs space09:12
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microliththis has nothing to do with -install- time09:12
microlithit's all the download before install09:12
* microlith breaks networkmanager09:13
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TuukkaAnyone using mobile hotspot app? Does it work well?09:21
bleeterFunny thing about trying to use NSU under Win7 64bit, trying to get it working gave me the time to remove enough packages to get the update OTA going :)09:21
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lucentTuukka: I'm wary of changing kernels09:21
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TuukkaWhat about Joiku spot it doesn't need a modified kernel, does it?09:22
tybolltit does not09:23
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tybolltbleeter: it plain does NOT work in Windows 64 bit09:24
TuukkaDoes bluetooth tethering work phone to phone?09:25
bleetertybollt: I kinda figured that. The giveaway was iirc 'option 3' in the  Win7 64bit tips and tricks doc page.09:27
bleeterbut felt the need to give it one shot just the same :P09:27
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aboyeris there a package that i can install in scratchbox that will give me the OMAP Graphics SDK devel files?09:32
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aboyeri'm refering to this thing:
Stskeepswell, what file specifically do you eed?09:34
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aboyeri'm trying to compile the bc-cat kernel module to perform opengl texture streaming09:35
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aboyerand this bc-cat module depends on OMAP Graphics SDK and OMAP Linux PSP09:35
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Stskeepsaboyer: don't think we have it.. any path associated?09:37
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Stskeepsit might be in kernel itself09:38
aboyerStskeeps: drm/mrst/pvr/services4/include/kernelbuffer.h09:38
aboyerif it was in the kernel then there would be 10 devices /dev/bc-cat0 - /dev/bc-cat909:39
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aboyerand those are not present on pr 1.1.109:39
aboyerare they there on pr1.2 perhaps?09:39
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aboyer* actually the devices should be /dev/bccat0-909:40
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Stskeepsaboyer: check kernel source, it would be in drivers/gpu/pvr09:40
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aboyerit's not there.. checked already, that is why i'm asking09:41
aboyerall i have in there are Kconfig, Makefile and a tools directory09:41
Stskeepseh :P09:41
aboyercan you tell me what package i need to install to get that?09:43
Stskeepsgrab the kernel source package from
aboyerok, and then dump it in /usr/src in scratchbox?09:44
* aboyer is new to kernel hacking09:44
Stskeepswiki documentation should help09:44
aboyerok, thx for your help09:44
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Corsachmhm, when taking pictures with ctrl+shift+P, where are the png stored?10:00
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Corsacha, MyDocs/.images/Screenshots10:02
Khertanif i remember well10:02
KhertanHi All !10:02
Corsacyeha thanks :)10:02
Khertana bit late :)10:02
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parimis it possible to mount a windows file share on maemo 4?10:03
Appiahis there samba support? then yes10:04
Appiahoh wait10:04
* pupnik still surviving after dist-upgrade10:05
pupnikwhat is the OTA metapackage name for pr1.210:05
Appiah parim10:05
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ruskiepupnik, same as for the rest... fremantle-generic-pr or something like that10:06
ruskiehmm seems like I'll be rolling my own kernel10:07
johan_why ruskie10:07
ruskiebecause jebba isn't rolling his anymore and the power-kernel is worthless to me10:08
parimthanks so much Appiah10:08
pupnikhmm that installs addnl packages over dist-upgrade10:08
pupnikhow do i delete all those -eses -fifi -esmx etc packages?10:08
ruskieI don't need overclocking and all the rest... I just want the same kernel with the extra stuff enabled10:08
ruskiepupnik, you can't10:09
ruskiepupnik, they are always installed10:09
ruskieand have been since forewer10:09
ruskieerm forever10:09
pupnikah ok10:09
ruskieit would require package modification to get rid of all the language packs10:09
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ruskiejohan_, basically I want fbcon NAT, ppp, pptp and a few other things on it10:10
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tybolltehr there - that's better :)10:12
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tybolltruskie: isn't there an "advanced user kernel" in the repo's for that olready?10:12
ruskietybollt, yeah the power kernel that has way to many features(overclocking being one of them)10:13
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pupnikruskie: and is rather flaky talking to X10:15
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ruskiepupnik, fun... basically I just want a basic kernel with extra modules that most people might find usable maybe I'll roll a few kernels... atleast a fbcon and non-fbcon ones for sure10:19
* tybollt FACEDESK10:19
ruskietybollt, agreed10:20
Stskeepsand kexec10:20
ruskiekexec isn't a bad idea if it works10:20
pupnikhow bout hacking a console or single-user runmode ruskie10:20
ruskiepupnik, already have that ;)10:20
pupnikso i can get a shell when i reboot10:20
tybolltsingle mode runmode?10:20
pupnikdo want!10:20
tybolltjust boot w/ init=/bin/bash ;P10:21
ruskieboot with open keyboard10:21
ruskieand it will start that10:21
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ruskieI have a basic one there10:21
pupnikmm?  ty i install bootmenu10:21
ruskiestarts up dsme and ssh and exec /bin/sh10:21
ruskiepupnik, it's my own creation not the bootmenu from the repos10:21
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ruskieI need to update it and refine it...10:22
ruskieI guess I can post it to my wiki page10:22
pupnikok. very important utility10:22
pupniki am getting many "Internal error. Application XYz closed" atm10:23
pupnikSIM gone, web gone, conversations, phone, applets gone10:23
pupnikbut terminal survives :)10:24
pupnikso if i reboot without console i will have to flash via usb, which is dodgy/damaged :)10:24
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pupnikahh good web restarts10:25
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ruskiepupnik, well does require fbcon in my case10:26
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pupniki have titans kernel atm10:27
ruskieyou probably do want to modify and update for your own device10:27
ruskieit's currently very hackish to my own device10:27
defraggeris it easy to port debian packages to maemo? and is there a good detailed howto about that?10:27
pupnikright. ty10:27
ruskiedefragger, generally use etch repos for deb-src in sdk then just apt-get source package10:27
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ruskiepupnik, the only problem is that the kernel lacks a good keyboard map for the keyboard10:28
ruskiepupnik, so sym keys don't work10:28
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ruskiepupnik, basically that is hacked from existing init/event scripts ;)10:28
pupnikvery interesting. ty10:29
defraggerruskie: ive done that, and what do i have to do with the source top build a package for maemo?10:29
ruskiedefragger, dpkg-buildpackage10:29
ruskiemore or less10:29
defraggerruskie: i see, i will try that thx :)10:30
ruskiepupnik, also not sure if I have a usable network connection on that10:30
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ruskiefrankly haven't given much thought to it so far10:31
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ruskieI did use it a few times but the lack of sym keys is more than annoying10:31
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ghostcubemorning, anyone maybe got the link for the moverootfs script?10:31
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ghostcubeif not i will search on :D10:31
pupnikmhm.  work to do...10:32
skyscraperive a question10:32
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defraggerruskie: what is meant by that: dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: debhelper (>= 7) flex texi2html?10:32
skyscraperi have read its possible to connect external mic to n900 via yellow plug from videocable?! can i use it to for auxillary in like from cd player line out?10:33
Stskeepsfor those interested in MeeGo on N810,
ruskiedefragger, it wants debhelper v7 or above, flex and texi2html10:33
defraggeri see10:34
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ruskiedefragger, you sure you're using the etch sources?10:34
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lucentpost-PR1.2 my N900 is endlessly rebooting10:35
skyscraperno one knows?!10:36
tybolltlucent: flash it bro10:36
* lucent facepalms10:36
tybolltdon't fucking facepalm - just flash your device :)10:36
lucentha yeah okay.10:37
defraggeruhm i dont know, i need to take a look, installed the system yesterday10:37
tybolltlucent: I believe flashing is there for these types of situations10:37
pupniki believe console mode is10:37
skyscraperlol my n900 reboots too, sometimes - after pr12l10:37
lucentI mean post-install, directly after10:38
lucentI've flashed before but I wish I could avoid it if possible10:38
skyscraperhm. ota or nsu?10:38
tybolltskyscraper: by any chance ... cause you typed reboot?10:38
lucentOTA here10:38
defraggerruskie: where can i see the source list? /etc/apt/sources.list??10:38
zlimvosweird i just enabled again extras-devel and i got an error  "IP not found"10:39
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skyscraperno @tybolt - testing some media player and screen rotation and then blackscreen white led. restarted without asking for my pin again10:39
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ruskiedefragger, should be10:39
skyscraperdoes no one know anything about audio line in10:40
defraggerruskie: uhm there are only maemo sources ...10:40
defraggeri had to add these:10:40
defraggerdeb  etch main non-free contrib10:40
defraggerdeb-src etch main non-free contrib10:40
skyscraperhm :(10:41
skyscraperneed to test it myself?!10:41
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skyscrapercan i destroy anything when connecting a mp3player or stl to yellow plug from video cable?10:42
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ruskiedefragger, just deb-src10:42
ruskiedefragger, you don't want deb10:42
tybolltthat's an audio out innit - not in?10:42
defraggeri see10:42
skyscraperthats in, too - the standard headphone has microphone too?10:43
ghostcubehmmm skype video call with mac doesnt work damn10:43
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tybolltskyscraper: that's a  big doco10:46
tybolltanyway does it say in there the thing can be used for audio in too?10:46
skyscraper is the same for n90010:47
skyscraperyes the document says 'mono line in'10:48
RST38hAnyone knows if I should change Extras-Testing and Extras-Devel from fremantle to fremantle-1.2?10:48
hrwRST38h: only extras exists in two forms10:48
RST38hhrw: Ah, ok10:48
hrwRST38h: testing and devel are for latest10:48
RST38hgood to know10:48
infobothmm... pr1.2 is available since early Tuesday morning. More information at -- see ~flashing for how to update10:49
lucenttybollt: could use a refresher, my memory not so good... what is the eMMC?   I'm looking at the firmware images page and am confused about whether I *must* flash the eMMC or not?10:49
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tybolltlucent: emmc is where you have you pr0n10:50
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tybolltlucent: nand is where the OS is10:50
tybolltlucent: flash the nand10:50
tybolltnot the emmc10:50
tybolltthat way you don't lose the pr0n10:50
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elstupidoslol i love that explanation10:51
skyscraperhave to write "klausur" now.... afk, maybe off when connection times out10:51
tybollta mustached german named "klaus" is very typical for pr0n movies10:52
skyscraperlater back!10:52
skyscraperklausur is at school, lol10:52
Scelttybollt: I guess it is also mustached german Klaus in the band named The Scorpions10:53
defraggerruskie: do i have to use apt-get source on x86 or ARMEL?10:53
ruskiedefragger, you are doing everything on armel... atleast I do it10:53
defraggerruskie: i see, last question whats that: GPG error: etch Release: Couldn't access keyring: 'No such file or directory'10:53
tybolltRST38h. hrw: Funny how this 1.2 thing for fremantle is not mentioned on, don't you think? :-|10:54
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ruskiedefragger, add the relevant keys using apt-key iirc10:55
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ghostcubewoah what is the latest europe firmware file again )10:57
* johnsu01 wonders what it would take to rearrange the keys on the on-screen keyboard10:57
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johnsu01why on earth are the backspace and enter keys lower than the rest10:57
ghostcube  ??10:58
CLaX0Hi all, a quick question concerning the fremantle sdk10:58
CLaX0They seem to have changed the address of it in the repo10:58
lucentghostcube: you too?10:58
CLaX0So I get a 404 when installing10:58
CLaX0How do I change the repo address? It's not a in the python script I got10:58
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bistonGood morning. I've been reading lately in so many places that the MeeGo project dropped support for the N900 device. But looking at, where the images for N900 are supposed to be, we can notice that the images have been updated to v1.0 on May 25th. Did anyone try these images? do they include an interface ?10:59
lucentghostcube: you can be sure following the process at
CLaX0I mean no the repo address, but rather the resource within it10:59
ghostcubedam i removed some files, and have killed my themes10:59
lucentbiston: who what now?10:59
bistoni mean, im confused, it seems that N900 are still supported10:59
lucenttry #meego ?10:59
Stskeepsbiston: it isn't a nokia product, it is a thing11:00
bistonyea :p good point11:00
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bistoni didn't know the chan existed11:00
Stskeepsbiston: n900 support isn't going anywhere, n900 is the reference platform for ARM on meego11:00
Stskeepssupport as in 'something that makes it work'11:00
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bistoni'll see what they have to say about this on #meego11:01
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Stskeepsbiston: explains a little more about our wor11:02
defraggerruskie: what options do i have to use with that apt-key? i hate debian :D11:03
tybolltStskeeps: how 'free' is meego though? Will there ever be like ... 'snapshots' etc?11:03
tybollt(I can't see how that'd be sustainable granted nokia and intel wanting to make money out of this :)11:04
Stskeepstybollt: there's supposed to be weekly or daily snapshots of Trunk, depending on who you ask11:04
tybolltoh? o_O11:04
Stskeepsit isn't android, you know11:04
ruskiedefragger, me too... searc hfor debian import key apt-key11:04
Milo-do I get charged for anything if I press the "send to mobile" button on the ovi store site? (given that the application is free)11:05
ruskietybollt, from my understanding MeeGo core is completly open no clue about the stuff on top11:05
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ruskiewhich reminds me... need to try the netbook release on my 70111:06
tybolltStskeeps: No of course not11:06
tybolltStskeeps: My point is...11:06
tybolltAt some point you'll be pulling in closed source binaries - how/when is that?11:07
Stskeepstybollt: right. in our hardware adaptation we try to minimize closed source binaries. if you own a n900, you can get the repo URL for them and the kickstart file for generating our closed image.11:07
Stskeepsthis is entirely on hardware basis.11:07
Stskeepsat some point, a vendor might add differentiation.11:08
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Stskeepsthat core on top of the open and portable meego core and ux.11:08
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Stskeepsso instead of 43% we have like 97% :P11:08
* ruskie hopes that the announcement that MeeGo 1.1 will support touchscreen phones and that it'll be around somewhere in october iirc will come true11:09
timeless_mbp!seen andre11:09
tybolltStskeeps: Right so a _fairly_ vendor agnostic process then... makes sense I suppose11:09
lejonettimeless_mbp: still is ~ not ! ;)11:09
lejonet~seen andre11:09
infobotandre is currently on #meego (8d 23h 25m 59s), last said: 'postmanPechkin: const char* is not a class, it has no nested types'.11:09
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asj_hmm, I wonder if I can change left-right audio output balance on the n90011:10
timeless_mbptybollt: so… you're looking at platform costs wrong11:10
Stskeepstybollt: i think it could be a lot worse. if you have hardware that supports a fully open hardware adaptation you can build open differentiation on top11:10
timeless_mbpa platform is a sustainable expense because it's a substitute for an existing expense11:10
tybollttimeless_mbp: My missus always said I don't handle/understand "costs", so yeah - probably.11:10
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timeless_mbpand it enables costs savings through cost sharing11:10
timeless_mbptybollt: so, look at it this way..11:10
timeless_mbpi don't have a missus, so i have to pay for my own apt11:11
timeless_mbpimagine someday i meet a nice lady, who also has to pay for her own apt11:11
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timeless_mbpwe could share a place, and our base cost for housing would go down11:11
timeless_mbpsure it might be a bigger place and seem to cost more11:11
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timeless_mbpbut if you compare how much each of us put in before to how much we put in after, our individual costs will drop11:11
timeless_mbpwe might even be able to do more things11:11
timeless_mbpand that's w/ just two of us11:12
timeless_mbpimagine if i moved from Finland (where neighbors are imaginary)11:12
timeless_mbpto a place where we had friendly neighbors who'd help out once in a while11:12
tybolltyou entirely lost me now - but ok :)11:12
timeless_mbpthat community adds value and reduces cost11:12
timeless_mbpwhich part?11:12
timeless_mbpimagine an apt for one in HEL costs 200kEUR11:13
timeless_mbpwhich isn't too far off11:13
timeless_mbpimagine if another person in the same city is also paying 200kEUR for an apt11:13
timeless_mbptotal cost for 2 individuals = 400kEUR11:13
timeless_mbpimagine if they "merged"11:13
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timeless_mbpthey could live in a 300kEUR apt together11:13
timeless_mbpthey each save 50kEUR11:13
timeless_mbpif their old apt was say 50m^2, they might upgrade to an 80m^2 place11:14
timeless_mbptheir place to them looks bigger, and to you as a visitor it also looks bigger11:14
* ruskie is used to cast sharing paying for half of the costs for living at home11:14
timeless_mbptybollt: does the first part make sense?11:15
ruskieerm cost even11:15
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defraggerruskie: finally its compiling the package11:15
groovehi, i have been told there has been a new release for the n900 this week but my phone is not showing up the update, any ideas why?11:15
ruskiegroove, maybe it hasn't updated yet11:15
timeless_mbpgroove: it doesn't poll every minute11:15
grooveis there a way to force a poll?11:15
tybolltgroove: sure there is11:15
timeless_mbpfor some reason someone thought that might be expensive :)11:15
lucenttybollt: Thanks for the help, I like your description of the eMMC ^_^11:15
tybolltgo into HAM and press refresh11:15
Lazy^Helli, is there MMS option for N900. I know there isn't one from Nokia but repos ?11:15
groovetybollt: what is HAM?11:16
timeless_mbpLazy^: fMMS11:16
timeless_mbpgroove:  'App. Manager'11:16
Lazy^Can i find it from repos ?11:16
timeless_mbpor 'App manager' or 'Add/Remove' (if you use my localization)11:16
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timeless_mbpLazy^: sure, it should be in extras11:16
groovetimeless_mbp: i already tried an "update" (as opposed to "download") from the app manager11:16
timeless_mbptybollt: so, did the basic cost sharing stuff make sense?11:16
groovei'm not sure if it comes from the standard repos11:16
ruskiegah... hate that More... was removed11:16
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tybolltwho is the head honcho in charge of website / doco? That's dneary yeah?11:17
timeless_mbpgroove: the update is from a standard repo11:17
grooveok, maybe my repos are messed up11:17
timeless_mbptybollt: file a bug ;-)11:17
tybollttimeless_mbp: I'm not sure still what you are trying to convince me of.11:17
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timeless_mbptybollt: you were wondering how meego could be sustainable11:17
tybollttimeless_mbp: I'd really just want a mail where I can submit a bug.11:17
lucentgroove: I had to flash PR1.2 anyways, because of troubles upgrading11:17
tybollttimeless_mbp: I'd really just want a mail where I can submit a diff11:17
lucentgroove: it might make sense to just flash11:17
timeless_mbptybollt: bugzilla supports that :)11:17
KhertanHi !11:17
tybollttimeless_mbp: jajaja Ok, very well then11:17
timeless_mbpthere's a website product and you can attach patches11:17
Khertanhum ... meego 1.0 ... interesting11:17
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timeless_mbptybollt: anyway, both intel and nokia had to pay for building an os (moblin, maemo)11:18
grooveok, i'll try flashing it if the update doesn't show up in the next week11:18
groovemany thanks11:18
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tybollttimeless_mbp: jajaja now stop mocking me11:18
defraggerruskie: did you ever upload any of your created packages to the maemo repository?11:19
ruskiedefragger, all my stuff is in my own repo11:19
defraggerah i see11:19
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Scelthei boys, where was the article about N900 ovi store update?11:20
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Khertanruskie ... :)11:21
timeless_mbpScelt: afaik nokia didn't actually promise that11:21
KhertanScelt ... maybe in rumors ... or archives 2009 sections11:21
timeless_mbpit might be hoped, but afaik we didn't make that promise11:21
timeless_mbpi think the hope is to get it rolled out asap11:21
timeless_mbpbut please don't treat it as a promise11:21
SceltI thought they said something about this day, thursday 27th11:22
* ruskie is happy living an Ovi-less life11:22
SceltI saw somewhere11:22
timeless_mbpScelt: you're welcome to think that11:22
timeless_mbpand there were third parties who made that claim11:22
timeless_mbpi'm speaking as a nokian having read mail where internals asked if the claim was accurate11:23
Sceltmay be so, but I want to find that arcticle anyway11:23
timeless_mbpthe response i saw indicated the claim was not11:23
timeless_mbpoh, the article's easy to find11:23
timeless_mbpbut who cares? it's a third party article11:23
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Scelt"I want to find a Volvo repair shop. Please help." "Lol! Drive BMW!!1"11:24
timeless_mbpmore like "I need help finding, because I have an apple and want to know if apple announced its next product"11:24
pupniksecond pot of tea is sooo smooth11:25
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pillar_I thought that what was promised for today was new games to ovi store11:25
Sceltnah. I want to find that article because of interest, not because of believing anyone blogging anything11:25
tybolltpupnik needs himself some coffe11:25
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* Khertan didn't see why the sauerkraut is cold11:25
lucentI wish there were a "No to all" setting in "Version conflict" dialog for Backup/Restore11:25
* ruskie needs vast amounts of sleep this week... am so sleep deprived it's not funny11:26
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timeless_mbp says ...11:26
tybolltKhertan: do you fancy those little cheese cubes? you know w/ a red cow on them? :)11:26
timeless_mbplucent: i filed a bug for that feature years ago11:26
timeless_mbpthe backup team ui designers insist on being annoying11:26
lucenttimeless_mbp: ha, yeah11:26
timeless_mbp>  First up – new games join the veritable arcade already on offer in Ovi Store. Jurassic 3D Rollercoaster, Zen-bound, Angry Birds (level pack), Sygic, Kroll, Weatherbug, and GoGadget are all available to keep you entertained. Important to note though that Ovi Store will do a full switchover this week Thursday, May 27, so these games and other for-purchase apps will show up then.11:26
Khertantybollt, the laughting cow ?11:27
SceltThanks! tjust that I was looking for11:27
Scelttimeless_mbp: isn't that an official channel?11:27
timeless_mbpScelt: dunno11:27
lucentAngry Birds game is brilliant, it is catching on at the Apple iPhone apps store, one of the most popular games... and I played it first on N900 :)  though unrelated to maemo11:27
timeless_mbpthe place i read earlier was maemo<something>11:28
timeless_mbpwhich definitely wasn't11:28
Sceltwell, gotta believe the official Nokia blog11:28
timeless_mbpScelt: bad idea ;-)11:28
* timeless_mbp goes to send an email11:29
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tybolltKhertan: oui justement11:29
ZogG_N900bad day for me11:29
ZogG_N900damn fml11:29
Stskeepspr1.2 ate your lunch?11:30
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Khertantybollt, i'm not a fan :)  prefer cashew nut with my vodka11:31
ZogG_N900today i would waste myself i think11:31
Khertantybollt, but right now it 10h30 ... un peu tôt pour l'apéritif11:31
timeless_mbp> We are not committed to open Store for PR1.2 on Thu May 27. We naturally hope we can do this.11:31
timeless_mbpthat's an email i received internally11:31
Khertantybollt, but right now it 10h30 ... a little early for a drink11:31
timeless_mbpit was sent tuesday morning11:31
tybolltKhertan: is it ever - for a frog? :)11:32
Khertantybollt, haha11:32
ZogG_N900timeless_mbp, i don't believe anyone anymore11:32
Khertantybollt, in fact not :)11:32
odin_ok I finally did the PR1.2 deed today (OneNAND + eMMC reflash), my WinXP PC was acting up yesterday11:32
ZogG_N900it's all lies around11:32
lucentodin_: why reflash eMMC?11:32
Scelttimeless_mbp: not really a surprise that nobody knows what's going on11:33
Khertanlol Surfa ... it s here the right channel :)11:33
odin_well its got bugger all data on it (as its not my main phone), and I wanted to the full Nokia device experience11:33
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SurfaKhertan, i have plenty of right channels :)11:33
Surfaproblem is to talk about right thing on them :)11:34
lucentI'm still wondering what flashing the eMMC does to add to the "experience"11:34
ZogG_N900why not. that's cool to reflash.11:34
KhertanSurfa, exactly11:34
ZogG_N900you know i was in army11:34
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timeless_mbpScelt: glad to hear you're appropriately jaded11:34
timeless_mbpand sorry about that :(11:34
ZogG_N900and even ordaniry soldier perfore better if he knows reasons11:35
odin_it ensures all config files are reset and the correct formats, plus I get to pick my language and locale again on first boot!11:35
lucentconfig files? hm11:35
ZogG_N900lucent, that are in /home/user11:35
lucentoh okay11:35
odin_wow the Terms and Conditions would take a whole day to read !11:35
timeless_mbpDeputy Editor, Nokia Conversations 079 8305 549511:35
* timeless_mbp grumbles11:35
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vanad1sgood morning11:36
vanad1sare the nokia update servers currently down?11:36
ZogG_N900timeless_mbp, you want him to get spamed? not a good idea to put data here11:36
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Scelttimeless_mbp: well, not talking about Nokia only. Big firms just are what they are.11:36
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lucentpost PR1.2 my SIM is not registered11:36
ZogG_N900Scelt, not true11:36
lucentthat's bad...11:36
PhonicUKhey all11:36
pupnikcheck that the cellmo module loaded maybe lucent11:37
timeless_mbpZogG: i got that person's contact info from google11:37
PhonicUKanyone tried the meego release on their n900?11:37
timeless_mbpand i fully intend to place a phone call to that person <now>11:37
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ZogG_N900Scelt, there are 2 options. or keep ur clients happy with support or inform11:37
odin_Hmm... "SMS - Nokia", "You are already registered to My Nokia.  You will nopw start receiving Tips from your new Nokia."  hmm...11:37
DocScrutinizer51lucent: oops11:37
* odin_ thinks ET Phone Home11:37
lucentDocScrutinizer51: is this known bug?11:37
Stskeepsodin_: that is really a wtf11:37
ZogG_N900timeless_mbp, update me with results11:38
ruskieit says I'm subscribed as well even though I never subscribed11:38
ZogG_N900lucent, do you have it?11:38
Stskeepsyeah, same11:38
ruskieit also doesn't let me unsubscribe11:38
* timeless_mbp nods11:38
ZogG_N900it's gentoo port time11:38
lucentZogG_N900: the SIM-with-crossout-line icon is displayed now, and no cell connectivity11:38
lucentthat's bad. what do I do11:39
ZogG_N900lucent, have u took it out?11:39
timeless_mbpanonymous voicemail :(11:39
lucentZogG_N900: I've tried re-seating it11:39
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ZogG_N900i mean before. try to take out and place it back11:39
DocScrutinizer51lucent: somebody had his contacts app act up until I recommended to ersase all SIM contacts11:39
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Lazy^Hello on fMMMS instructions it says: -Enter your phone number at last (without dash) <- Where i should put my phonenumber ?11:39
tybollttimeless_mbp: few things agravate me to the extent anon voicemail does when I REALLY need to get a hold of someone :-S11:39
ZogG_N900lucent, try to reflash and try another sim as well11:39
timeless_mbptybollt: *shrug*11:40
lucentis there some commandline kung-fu I should do?11:40
timeless_mbpthe british version is better than the finnish version11:40
ZogG_N900who is the head of nokia and responsible for n900 ? )11:40
timeless_mbpthe british version doesn't make any claim about who owns the mailbox11:40
ZogG_N900lucent, i don.t think so11:40
SceltLazy^: configuration11:40
timeless_mbpthe finnish version says something like "the person you are trying to reach ..."11:40
timeless_mbpbut since it's an anonymous box, how does it know it *is* the person i'm trying to reach?11:41
Lazy^Scelt: yes but where in there, i cant find any place for phonenumber11:41
ZogG_N900timeless_mbp, are u calling from n900?11:41
timeless_mbp*i* don't know that!11:41
timeless_mbpZogG: w/ SIP.11:41
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tybollttimeless_mbp: :P:P11:41
timeless_mbpi don't have other phones, just n900s11:41
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ZogG_N900cause that your phone in ignore list11:41
SceltLazy^: seems that it's unnecessary anymore. I didn't find it either11:42
ZogG_N900Lazy^, check the thread at tmo or ask frals11:42
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SceltLazy^: so skip it11:42
ZogG_N900i failed test today11:42
asj_well that's lame, there's no good n900 mixer control11:43
Lazy^ok skipped it11:43
lucentDocScrutinizer: I think I've got a handle on the issue11:43
ZogG_N900i want to get drunk. right now. it's hard to be russian11:43
threshnot really11:43
lucentDocScrutinizer: PR1.2 contains info that gets flashed, and is not downgraded when you get back to 1.1, which I think is what I manually flashed to my N90011:43
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lucentso it's not going to work until I get PR1.2 going again? that's the theory11:43
ZogG_N900lucent, true11:44
ZogG_N900everything goes wrong11:44
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lucentthe strange thing is I thought I'd installed PR1.2 when I manually flashed11:45
lucentexact command line was "sudo flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.42-11.002_PR_COMBINED_002_ARM.bin -f -R"11:45
ZogG_N900lucent, check in setting - about11:45
lucentis that not PR1.2?11:45
ZogG_N900it's not11:45
lucentZogG_N900: settings->about says "Version: 1.2009.42-11.002"11:46
marmouteWhy are the 1.2 package not authenticate on my N900 ? (when I try apt-get dist-upgrade ?11:46
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odin_the "Device Lock -> Lock Code" should be clearer, it should indicate it does not have a device lock code set on first use, not ask you for a code (and accept anything, this is confusing)11:46
* timeless_mbp cries11:46
timeless_mbpi reached a colleague of rhiain's11:47
timeless_mbpbut my sip audio quality was bad11:47
odin_there should also be a mechanism to remove the device lock code, to its "unset" again11:47
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timeless_mbpodin_: so...11:47
timeless_mbpthere's always a device lock code11:47
ZogG_N900timeless_mbp, try out video call on them )11:47
timeless_mbpthe default is 1234511:47
odin_nope it accepted my new code, as the existing code (which I take to mean, it accepts ANY CODE)11:47
timeless_mbpodin_: the key is whether the device is actively <locked>11:47
odin_I entered my new code 3 times11:48
ZogG_N900odin_, so what's the point in lock?11:48
odin_my code is not 1234511:48
ZogG_N900someone forgot microsoft pen in the bus11:48
ZogG_N900odin_, it is )11:48
ZogG_N900i wanna be happy again11:49
timeless_mbpZogG: fwiw
RST38hZogG: There is plenty of medications for that11:49
timeless_mbpand she's a she :)11:49
odin_hmm I click the power button and "Lock screen and keys" doesn't appear to do anything (but activate backlight off)11:49
marmouteNo idea Why those pacage are not recognised as unauthenticated by my phone ?11:49
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tybolltRST38h: :-D11:49
ZogG_N900RST38h, they are too expensive11:49
odin_hmm I click "Secure Device" and it ASKS me for a code, to secure it, if I click out of it, I get desktop back, Doh!11:50
lucentoh... wow11:50
timeless_mbpodin_: that's the idea...11:50
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asj_well at least alsamixer works, but poo11:50
lucentI just realized that I flashed the oldest version of firmware to my N90011:50
timeless_mbpyou don't want to accidentally lock yourself out, do you?11:50
ZogG_N900odin_, u jailbroke it11:50
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ghostcubelucent: hehe11:50
ghostcubethats what i was asking for the package a bit earlier11:50
lucentI thought the newest would be at the top of the page!  I'm enraged at my stupidity11:50
ghostcubelucent: its in the middle the latest thingies11:51
odin_I presume and hope you are being sarcastic timeless_mbp11:51
lucentghostcube: thanks mate11:51
odin_not sure on the jailbreaking, this is an eMMC+OneNAND reflash, my first action is to set and test device locking so far it has either failed or doesn't work like any other phone11:52
timeless_mbpdon't be presumptuous ;-b11:52
timeless_mbpodin_: i tend to be serious first11:52
pupnikwhere is kernel with fbcon now11:52
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marmouteodin_: I assume they ask the code you *WILL* need to type again to unlock the phone11:53
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timeless_mbpmarmoute is correct, as usual11:53
odin_I don't get this "Enter lock code to lock device" that is crazy, and if its meant to be a real feature needs a mechanism to turn it off11:53
timeless_mbpodin_: it doesn't lock the phone unless you lock the phone...11:53
timeless_mbpif you unlock the phone, it's unlocked11:53
timeless_mbpit's quite simple11:53
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timeless_mbpyes the design was by finns and is hardly brilliant, and the English text is disastrous11:54
odin_marmoute, I have already setup the code, I don't want to setup a unique code on the move (this is not a hotel with safe) its too easy to forget the number or type it incorrectly for that to be good UK11:54
infobotodin_ meant: marmoute, I have already setup the code, I don't want to setup a unique code on the move (this is not a hotel with safe) its too easy to forget the number or type it incorrectly for that to be good UI11:54
timeless_mbpbut… it's still quite simple11:54
timeless_mbpodin_: again11:54
timeless_mbpthe default code is 1234511:54
timeless_mbpif you don't enter the right code when you try to lock the phone, it won't let you lock it11:54
odin_I entered something else which was accepted, not 1234511:55
timeless_mbpif you change the lock code, then you will have to use <your> code to unlock it11:55
tybollthmm funny buig11:55
tybolltafter -> 1.211:55
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odin_I entered something else which was accepted, in the 1st step to changing the lock code11:55
* timeless_mbp sighs11:55
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timeless_mbpthe error messages are bad there11:55
* timeless_mbp goes for a rewrite11:55
tybolltit seems the device no longer attaches the phone book name of an incomming sms number11:55
tybolltthat is just super weird11:56
timeless_mbptybollt: the number is probably in multiple contacts11:56
tybolltI shall check that11:56
tybolltthan ks11:56
timeless_mbpsadly, checking that is hardly easy11:56
timeless_mbpif you find an app for that, please let me know, thanks :)11:56
odin_when the device is "Secured" it doesn't clearly state across the top "This Device Is Secured" then "Enter unlock code to release" its like the page doesn't change11:57
ZogGback here11:58
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odin_ok "Lock Screen and Keys" what is that meant to be doing.... the "Secure Device" looks like more major operation11:58
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timeless_mbpodin_: my translation has "Lock" and "Disable input"11:59
timeless_mbpor in your order "Disable input" and "Lock"11:59
timeless_mbpdoes that help?11:59
* timeless_mbp considers "Prevent input" instead of "Disable input"11:59
odin_Lock Screen and Keys - for me, just deactivates the screen backlight, the right hand button reactivates the backlight (with no sign of any "lock")11:59
timeless_mbpodin_: right, don't think about the nokia strings, think about mine :)12:00
alteregoOh, sweet, meego v1.0 anyone used it yet?12:00
timeless_mbpthe nokia strings are bad of course :)12:00
lucentthe difference between "lock controls" and "lock with a password" are difficult in English perhaps?12:00
odin_well "Secure Device" is an ok label in my UK one12:00
timeless_mbplucent: the problem is that it was designed in finnish12:00
timeless_mbpand the finns did the translation into english12:00
odin_ok thinking about yours.... you should have one "Turn Off Backlight"12:00
timeless_mbpw/o considering related items12:00
odin_that is what my "Lock screen and keys" does12:01
timeless_mbpodin_: not quite true12:01
lucentit's not surprising, but your observation does ring true :)12:01
timeless_mbpthe screen can dim w/o preventing input12:01
alteregoOh, is it still reference UI-less ...12:01
odin_but I also have a button for blacklight on right hand side, the non-latching slider12:01
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timeless_mbpodin_: again, it's not controlling the backlight12:02
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odin_I bet the DRM system works 100% (sarcasm)12:02
timeless_mbpit mostly prevents the screen from accepting input12:02
odin_what about _MY_ security12:02
timeless_mbpit happens of course to generally mean that the screen is off12:03
ruskiewhat DRM system?12:03
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timeless_mbpbut if you get a phone call, the screen won't stay off12:03
* odin_ looks on ebay for a lead box, that will keep it secure12:03
odin_ruskie, sorry it was a sarcastic reference to the Maemo Security teams current work for Maemo6/MeeGo1.x in relation to "Trusted Execution" and application licensing / application secure storage (which DRM can be built on top of)12:04
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odin_ruskie, the sarcasm is due to glaring issues with personal/data security that exist in Maemo512:05
ruskiethat'll be part of MeeGo?12:05
odin_I believe so12:05
timeless_mbpodin_: maemo didn't promise drm12:05
tybollttimeless_mbp: thank bob for that12:05
timeless_mbptybollt: yeah well12:06
odin_these new features are a good thing, I just wish the usual security stuff I have on my Symbian handsets was also in Maemo/MeeGo12:06
timeless_mbpbob's planning on taking a vacation12:06
alteregoDoes the new search feature in the applications manager only search by application name?12:06
odin_timeless_mbp sure sure... well it was announced for Maemo6 but whatever that turns into for the next hardware device release, is then the promise is made for, so until that comes out, its still work-in-progress12:06
alteregoI think I prefered the old search system ...12:06
ruskieodin_, what security stuff on symbian?12:07
pupnikruskie: which fbcon module / kernel are you using? homemade?12:07
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timeless_mbpalterego: iirc it searches the one line descriptions too12:08
ruskiepupnik, I used jebbas but with PR1.2 I'll need to roll my own12:08
odin_well my E72 (which is my primary phone), has working SIM locking, working device locking, working MMC encryption (but no idea how secure it really is!)12:08
odin_Im not so fussed about MMC encrpytion the community can deal with that but the other points are really something Nokia should be addressing12:08
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lucentis it unwise to restore my application list from Restore when doing an upgrade PR1.1.1 -> PR1.2 ?12:09
odin_since they impact too much potentially close-source items and/or low level hardware, for which they are in the best position to address12:09
lucentany reason not to Restore the app list?12:09
ruskiedevice locking and sim locking? what's broken?12:09
RST38hlucent: PR1.2 install has not removed any of my apps12:09
odin_the device doesn't lock!12:09
redeemanargh, is there any way to get the onscreen keyboard back to how it was in 1.1?12:09
lucentRST38h: okay, good feedback thanks12:10
alteregotimeless_mbp: thanks, I suppose that's not a complete set back. I'm going to try searching for "<up to 40 characters for description>" then :D12:10
ghostcuberedeeman: yeah the keyboard sux12:10
ruskieodin_, does here12:10
redeemanseriously this is insane, the old one worked so well12:10
redeemanand this one is useless12:10
ghostcubeyou cant hide it again by any key as you could in 1.1.112:10
MaikBtimeless_mbp, hello.  Yesterday u suggested using microb for google buzz.  Well, after waiting a minute for gmail's web interface to load, it takes another minute when I've hit the buzz text enter widget.  Just FYI12:10
* odin_ clicks Power Button, then he selects "Lock screen and keys", the backlight goes out, now he slides the right hand slider up and desktop some back (nothing was locked), it should STILL require me to "Slide the slider"12:11
timeless_mbpMaikB: yeah, but it lets you pick pictures from URLs12:11
timeless_mbpjust like the real thing, since it is the real thing :)12:11
timeless_mbpmy desktop is probably 10x as fast as my phone12:11
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lucentredeeman: I haven't got to playing with PR1.2 yet12:11
timeless_mbpMaikB: were you using WiFi, 3.5, 3G, or GPRS?12:11
odin_ruskie, how do I enable the handset to _REQUIRE_ an unlock boot on bootup ?12:12
alteregotimeless_mbp: is that all? :P12:12
pupnikimagine n900 with 4-row 14 column keybd :)12:12
redeemanlucent: well i don't recommend you upgrade now, atleast not if you didn't have some major issue you know is fixed12:12
MaikBtimeless_mbp, 10MBit via wireless12:12
lucentredeeman: video calling12:12
ruskieodin_, in settings device lock12:12
odin_ruskie, how do I set SIM locking, set PIN, activate, deactivate ?12:12
MaikBtimeless_mbp, I guess its because of a ton of javascript that is executed12:12
redeemanvideo calling is not worth not being able to type12:12
timeless_mbpodin_: if you set Device Lock in control panel to some time interval12:12
ruskieodin_, sim locking under settings phone iirc12:12
lucentthat, and I already attempted to install PR1.2 which caused endless rebooting, going back to PR1.1.1 causes my SIM to not be detected, so... stuck upgrading one way or another to PR1.212:13
timeless_mbpand then walk away, it'll prompt you for you password after that time12:13
odin_ruskie, no I can see "Autolock" and "Change lock code", I want it to require code on power up12:13
timeless_mbpif you don't enter the password12:13
timeless_mbpthen you are asked if you want to turn off the phone12:13
ruskieodin_, it does here12:13
lucentredeeman: I think the on screen keyboard is easily modified though12:13
timeless_mbpwhen you turn it on again, it asks for the password12:13
ruskieodin_, lemme dig it up12:13
timeless_mbpthe SIM Lock stuff is unrelated and is optional12:13
odin_ruskie, nope.. under phone I can't require device unlock code on SIM change ?12:14
timeless_mbpodin_: you can't12:14
ruskieon sim change???12:14
timeless_mbpbut why is that interesting?12:14
odin_ruskie, yes Symbian phones do it,12:14
odin_its interesting to make my handset WORTHLESS when stolen12:14
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odin_you cant have the data, you can't resell it12:14
timeless_mbpodin_: not true :)12:14
pigeonis there a way to reset the accelerometer on the n900 without rebooting?12:14
pigeonit seems to be stuck on one side12:14
timeless_mbpodin_: i highly doubt that the symbian phones encrypt their entire memory12:15
ruskiehmm last I checked my N95 didn't require any codes to switch SIMs as well12:15
ruskiehad to install an extra app for that12:15
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timeless_mbpodin_: as such, it's merely smoke and mirrors12:15
timeless_mbpwhich we're missing12:15
timeless_mbpso you have one less useless feature to complain about12:15
timeless_mbpis that a bad thing?12:15
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ruskieodin_, yeah it locks for me... maybe you need to set an autolock timeout12:15
ruskieit asks me for lock code AND SIM code when I bootup the thing12:16
timeless_mbpreal criminal groups can easily wipe the device12:16
alteregoWow, Apple are now worth more than Microsoft.12:16
alteregoBeing closed really does pay off!12:16
timeless_mbpand you can also probe the device for its data w/o loading the os12:16
timeless_mbpalterego: eh?12:16
odin_timeless_mbp, in my E72 I have menu items. Control Panel -> Settings -> Security -> Phone and SIM card (PINcode, PIN2code, Keypad autolock, Phone autolock, Lock code, Lock if SIM card changed, Remote phone lockingClosed user group, Confirm SIM services)12:16
timeless_mbpone closed company is worth more than another closed company?12:16
ruskieneed food bbl12:16
timeless_mbpalterego: i know12:17
MaikBtimeless_mbp, did you ever test buzz with microb?12:17
timeless_mbpit made bbc-wn-tv12:17
MaikBJust wondering12:17
timeless_mbpMaikB: i buzzed w/ it, yes12:17
skyscraperyo i'm back12:17
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alteregotimeless_mbp: well, Apple are a new kind of evil realy.12:17
timeless_mbpit worked well enough for my purposes12:17
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lucenttimeless_mbp: "Freedom from Pornography"12:17
odin_timeless_mbp, in my E72 I have menu items. Control Panel -> Settings -> Phone -> Encryption -> (Phone memory on/off, Memory card on/off)12:17
alteregoThey've gone way past Microsoft in screwing over FOSS.12:17
timeless_mbpalterego: nah, they're the same company, just more successful12:17
redeemanwell this is a disappointment, i wonder wtf the people that created the new onscreen keyboard were thinking, obviously they're on some new designer drugs12:17
skyscraperanyone NOW here knows anything about n900 audio in?12:17
MaikBtimeless_mbp, I've hit publish, and it says "in progress.." for over a minute now12:17
alteregoredeeman: I think it's in preparation for multi-touch and probably portrait mode.12:18
lucentredeeman: relax, I said it, and the on screen keyboard is easily modified12:18
odin_so those are the features and the things that N900/Maemo/MeeGo should aim for12:18
alteregoIs the new kbd in Qt?12:18
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timeless_mbpsounds like the e72 crypto just gives people headaches12:18
timeless_mbpalterego: no12:18
alteregoOh well.12:18
timeless_mbpthe keyboard is still hildon12:18
redeemanalterego: well multitouch isn't on this device :)12:18
chadiis there a way to make the menu scroll in PR1.2 faster?12:18
alteregoredeeman: well, if it's not in Qt like timeless_mbp states, then I doubt what I said is the case ;) Maybe it's for a possible portrait implementation ;)12:19
odin_maybe, but as I stated somewhere above... I am not too fussed about eMMC/bulk encryption but all the other things are important ( I see the community as able to make bulk crypto good)12:19
* lucent cheers \o/ at the return of a working N900 phone with PR1.2 successfully installed12:19
skyscraperoskeybd is sh** - watch the keyb from opera 10 for n900 very nice12:19
Corsacthe fact that it's done badly in e72 doesn't mean it couldn't be useful doing correctly on n900 :)12:19
redeemani like the old onscreen keyboard12:19
odin_^^^ indeed12:19
odin_Take "Keypad autolock" and "Phone autolock" one is automatic activation of "Lock screen and keys" and the other is automatic activation of "Secure Device"12:20
pupnike72 design is great for portrait users12:20
skyscraperi like that from opera. useful und iphone like12:20
odin_but the Secure Device might want to have additional options about how to handle data connections, like WLAN/3G/USB and also indepenant firewall setting, like you might secure it by barring incoming connections but allow all outgoing, etc..12:21
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odin_I can't wait for MeeGo in E72 format mono-block :)  then I will have 2 MeeGo handset s:)12:21
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lucentodin_: you've got to be kidding, about data connections.12:21
ZogGredeeman, me too12:22
* timeless_mbp ponders12:22
skyscraperso. now trying to search a "media markt" near to me with ovi maps xD12:22
timeless_mbpthe e72 claims to use AES12:22
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ZogGdoes e72 get mego?12:22
odin_lucent, why ? one known hack of N900 security is that you can attack/access MMC via USB even when locked, maybe its fixed now, but I see it that the USER should be able to control this12:22
* timeless_mbp sighs12:22
* timeless_mbp hates nokia web content12:23
timeless_mbptotally useless12:23
* timeless_mbp can't figure out what the e72 actually uses12:23
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lucentodin_: it's not a core OS feature in so far as I am concerned12:23
lucentyou do the work, write the code, upload an app12:23
timeless_mbpodin_: you can read the file system w/ special hardware12:24
timeless_mbpjust as you can for symbian phones12:24
timeless_mbpand you can reset the phone12:24
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odin_lucent, indeed!12:24
timeless_mbpyour phones are not going to protect you from true evil12:24
timeless_mbptrue evil w/ time will win12:24
odin_my BeagleBoard clone is in the van outside my door, yippee!  I went for IGEPv212:24
ZogGhildon is part of maemo right?12:25
TheGermanis "apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade" ok to install then new firmware without flashing?12:25
ZogGand maemo is prop. right?12:25
timeless_mbpwell, maemo 5 and older :)12:25
timeless_mbpTheGerman: you don't want other repos enabled if you do that12:25
timeless_mbpand officially you should use app manager12:25
odin_lucent, my BeagleBoard thingy should help me address these "security" matters12:25
timeless_mbpi don't think apt-get will say "hey, you don't have enough power not to fry me if you try this"12:26
ZogGtimeless_mbp binaries only, you can't take UI out that's what i mean12:26
timeless_mbp(not certain)12:26
timeless_mbpZogG: hildon is open source12:26
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ZogGi was thinking to get maemo UIX on meego12:26
IkarusTheGerman: I wouldn't recommend it, I dropped my N900 into a reboot loop12:26
pupnikno fbcon in .37 kernel-power12:26
ZogGtimeless_mbp can i get it run on meego?12:26
timeless_mbpZogG: um12:27
TheGermanZogG : orginal or poweruser kernel?12:27
timeless_mbpmeego is a collection of bits12:27
timeless_mbpa linux kernel, and a userland12:27
timeless_mbpit doesn't include hardware12:27
timeless_mbpbut nothing about meego is so special that it would prevent other libraries from running on it12:27
lucentIkarus: ditto, reboot loop here when I tried installing PR1.2 OTA12:27
timeless_mbp*unlike* android12:27
timeless_mbpwhich has a special libc12:27
timeless_mbpand special kernel12:27
ZogGtimeless_mbp it does as i understand part of them12:28
TheGermanZogG : have u installed the poweruser kernel before upgrade?12:28
timeless_mbpStskeeps: is that finnish in the background?12:28
ZogGTheGerman, nope, why would i?12:28
TheGermanmaybe this was the problem12:28
defraggeris it possible to add extras-devel to application manager?12:28
timeless_mbpyeah, it is12:29
Stskeepstimeless_mbp: no idea12:29
ZogGTheGerman, what problem?12:29
* timeless_mbp heard "noni"12:29
TheGermanreboot loop12:29
ZogGdefragger, yes12:29
ZogGTheGerman, i don't have one =)12:29
defraggerZogG: what link?12:29
Scelttimeless_mbp: "joku viis vastausta"12:29
TheGermanaww, sorry i mean Ikarus :D12:29
Aranelhow can I edit the new menu on PR1.2?12:29
ZogGdefragger ?12:29
Scelttimeless_mbp: it's Finnish12:29
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ghostcubeAranel: touch the icons for 2 seconds12:30
* ZogG is confused12:30
defraggerZogG: what do i have to add to my application manager to get to extras devel?12:30
Aranelghostcube: thanks =)12:30
ZogGdefragger, oh, just write it by hand12:30
SceltAranel: push icon on menu for 2 secs12:30
TheGermanIkarus : same question :D12:30
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ZogGdefragger, catalogues, new, and than fill the info12:30
defraggeroh cool thanks :)12:31
Appiahcheck on the bottom of that page12:31
timeless_mbpScelt: the spec page is useless12:31
Appiahand read the warning on the top defragger :)12:31
timeless_mbpsure it provides crypto apis to java12:31
IkarusTheGerman: no, using standard kernel12:31
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* timeless_mbp hates nokia web content12:31
ZogGso who gonna leak nokia's drivers =)12:31
Araneldo I have some missing icons? Like wifi icons? On PR1.2, there's no "signal strength icon" on the left on connection dialog, right?12:31
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timeless_mbpthere should be signal strength icons12:32
timeless_mbpdo you have a bad theme?12:32
timeless_mbpsomeone else reported a theme which hurt the OSK12:33
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Araneltimeless_mbp: using the default n-series theme. But I also have some other themes.12:33
TheGermanhmh, ill make a backup and try it :D12:33
Araneltimeless_mbp: I didnt have any problem before the upgrade.12:33
ghostcubeAranel: update through repos?12:33
Aranelghostcube: yes12:33
ghostcubefrom terminal?12:34
ZogGAranel no you do TADA12:34
timeless_mbpAranel: there are 3 rings above the circle for wifi12:34
TheGermanif it's in booting loop, i'll flash it with meego and then with pr1.2 :D12:34
Aranelghostcube: no. from HAM12:34
timeless_mbpyou can have 0, 1, 2, or 3 rings white12:34
timeless_mbpi'm using digital nature12:34
timeless_mbpwhich is the "other theme"12:34
ZogGTheGerman, go with win6.512:34
timeless_mbpnseries is ****12:34
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ghostcubemaybe try if the xterm apt-get update && apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade brings in some packages12:34
TheGermani just want try meego :D12:34
ZogGtimeless_mbp it's nice, but there thing with too much colours12:35
Araneltimeless_mbp: Reflect, Digital Nature, Nokia NSeries.12:35
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TheGermani hate rpm, but i am curious12:35
ruskieI've modified digital nature to be well green12:35
ghostcuberpm sux12:35
corecodeso is it true?12:35
Araneltimeless_mbp: I also had maemo-org and marina, removed before the upgrade.12:35
corecodethere is 1.2?12:35
TheGermanyep, its loading^^12:35
ghostcubei killed my 1.2 already lol12:36
ghostcubeno maemo12:36
corecodeis there a preview available?12:36
ghostcubeof what?12:36
* timeless_mbp can't open themes12:36
timeless_mbpTrizt: ping, can you open 'themes'?12:36
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* timeless_mbp crashes themes12:37
* timeless_mbp sighs12:37
timeless_mbpsp3000: corematic's cert expired 12 days ago12:37
RST38h (check the Join Dates)12:39
SWFu64Does anyone know i the monitor mode patch is in PR 1.2?12:39
timeless_mbpSWFu64: eh?12:40
SWFu64Wireless monior mode patch12:40
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DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: (lock) I suggest "dim & lock touchscreen"  and "security device lock"12:41
timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: 99% certain those don't fit12:41
DocScrutinizeryeah, always the problem12:42
timeless_mbp"Close application" is my widest string12:42
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timeless_mbpyou can have about 4 'n's longer than that string12:42
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DocScrutinizermake that "screen lock"12:42
timeless_mbpand it's a proportionally spaced font12:42
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DocScrutinizerand "SECURE LOCK"12:42
DocScrutinizer(capitals on purpose)12:43
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timeless_mbpway too similar12:43
timeless_mbpi'm considering "Lock" and "Prevent input"12:43
timeless_mbpmaybe "Pocket mode"12:43
DocScrutinizerpocket mode is quite nice12:44
timeless_mbpobjections to Pocket mode?12:44
timeless_mbpit goes nicely w/ Flight mode and Tablet mode12:44
DocScrutinizerfull acl12:44
Stskeepshow about purse mode?12:44
DocScrutinizerack even12:44
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timeless_mbpStskeeps: i don't think it'll fit into you average male's wallet :)12:45
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: blargh, I'd expect it is like pw wallet12:45
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timeless_mbpi think Pocket mode is a winner12:45
timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: btw, are you using my strings? :)12:46
timeless_mbpok, last thing12:46
timeless_mbp"Device Lock" the item in Settings12:46
timeless_mbpi *believe* that label is shared between the icon and the dialog <bug>12:46
timeless_mbpit has two items "Autolock after" <interval>12:46
Stskeepsi'm really wondering if most n900 owners are emo kids, they certainly seem so..12:46
TomaszDzaheerm, around?12:46
timeless_mbpand "Change code"12:46
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* TomaszD cuts himself12:47
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: dunno12:47
timeless_mbpdunno which? :)12:47
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: I'm not actively using any string12:47
timeless_mbpyou'd know it if you were using mine :)12:47
corecode"not enough memory in target location"?12:47
corecodewhat does it mean by that?12:48
timeless_mbpcorecode: is this from App manager?12:48
timeless_mbpgimme a minute to get a translation?12:48
zaheermTomaszD, yep12:49
ZogGtimeless_mbp, in which language?12:49
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timeless_mbpZogG: well, i generally translate from Fingrish into English12:51
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timeless_mbpbut i can translate from Fingrish into nl-FI if you prefer12:51
ZogGi prefer russian12:52
timeless_mbpru-FI is also available12:52
AranelIt reverts back to default after pressing "Done" on menu customization. Why is that?12:52
timeless_mbpAranel: did you tap an item and tap a new location for the item?12:52
Araneltimeless_mbp: yes, after that I pressed "Done" and it didnt save.12:52
timeless_mbpAranel: are you using catorise?12:53
Araneltimeless_mbp: no12:53
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* timeless_mbp shrugs12:53
timeless_mbpcatorize (en-US locale display name) isn't compatible w/ that feature, so i don't use it12:54
ShapeshifterPSX4All vs. PCSX - Which to choose?12:54
timeless_mbpcorecode: so, you probably hit sfil_ni_not_enough_memory12:54
timeless_mbpwhich is a generic message :)12:54
Araneltimeless_mbp: but I dont use Catorise or MyMenu12:55
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MaikBtimeless_mbp, I gave microb 20 minutes to buzz a message, it just stuck at the "in progress.."12:55
timeless_mbpMaikB: hrm12:55
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timeless_mbpcorecode: what it probably means is that your root file system is too full to enable you to install the update12:56
timeless_mbp(and that the people who did ham were too lazy to get their own error messages)12:56
timeless_mbp# Information note presented when there is not enough memory to do the operation12:56
timeless_mbpmsgid "sfil_ni_not_enough_memory"12:56
timeless_mbpmsgstr "Not enough space in target location"12:56
* timeless_mbp pokes mxr12:57
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DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: s/memory/storage/G12:59
MaikBtimeless_mbp, speaking of error messages... I had to flash 1.2 onto my N900. The update dialog told me so without giving me the reason.  I tried to find a log file that contains the relevant infos, but I didn't found one.  Is there one?12:59
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: memory == RAM on most parts of the educated world13:00
vanad1scorecode, "not enough memory in target location" -> got this error too13:00
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timeless_mbpMaikB: i think the answer is that there isn't really13:01
DocScrutinizerfingrish->English: "not enough free storage space on target drive"13:01
timeless_mbpif you use apt-get you can find out what's conflicting (in theory)13:01
vanad1scurrently trying to free as much space as possible13:01
timeless_mbpvanad1s + corecode: keep in mind that you need to free space from the root file system13:01
MaikBtimeless_mbp, i c13:02
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timeless_mbpwhich is not reported in "Storage" in Settings13:02
vanad1stimeless_mbp: but how much does it need? And how do i check, how much i have?13:02
timeless_mbpvanad1s: i think 60mb is enough (don't you dare quote me!)13:02
timeless_mbpand df -h /13:02
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timeless_mbpvanad1s + corecode: the simplest way to free space is to disable all the repositories you don't need13:03
timeless_mbpesp "extras" and "extras-devel"13:03
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timeless_mbpthere's a wiki faq page for this, DocScrutinizer++13:03
DocScrutinizerplease see /topic13:03
vanad1soh great, thx13:03
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BugBluedear f**** nokia, I already have PR1.2 I don't need to surf to your website just after the update13:04
timeless_mbpBugBlue: eh?13:04
timeless_mbpwhat did it do?!13:04
BugBlueI just got an SMS from nokia that there is 'new software with nice features at or so'13:05
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BugBlueafter I upgraded I got an SMS 'welcome back to OVI'13:05
timeless_mbpBugBlue: you must have opted in for 'My Nokia'13:05
BugBlueseems that my phone does send some information to nokia13:05
timeless_mbpwelcome to cherry13:05
BugBluetime to opt-out13:05
timeless_mbpit's a mandatory feature for all nokia products13:05
timeless_mbpit's in Settings near 'About'13:06
timeless_mbpOops. Lost?13:06
timeless_mbpDon't worry, it's not serious, but it looks like the page you've requested isn't available.13:06
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timeless_mbpBugBlue: what was the exact url?13:06
Ikarustimeless_mbp: clicking outside the box is appaerently also opt-in then....13:07
DocScrutinizerLOL13:07 without a /13:07
BugBlueIkarus: like thinking outside the box? :P13:07
Ikarusand clicking unsubscribe doesn't seem to unsubscribe13:07
ghostcubewow flashing is fast13:07
IkarusBugBlue: :)13:07
timeless_mbpBugBlue: thanks, wow, they're clever13:08
ghostcubeif i knew this yesterday i had done it direct :D13:08
DocScrutinizer"activate MyNokia?" [yes] [ok] [go ahead] [continue]13:08
IkarusI don't need more spam13:08
BugBluelet me see how much this charges me on my phone bill later this week13:08
DocScrutinizer"deactivate MyNokia?" [no] [abort] [back] [exit]13:09
IkarusBugBlue: if they are premium I am demanding money back from Nokia :P13:09
BugBlue21 cents... seems to be normal SMS costs13:10
Ikarusyeah, looks like it13:10
BugBluewhich means I lost 42 cents for this joke13:10
timeless_mbpit costs you 21c for 1 sms?13:10
BugBluetimeless_mbp: yes, I have no SMS plan13:10
BugBlueI *never* sms13:10
BugBluetimeless_mbp: I pay for roaming internet in the EU only 5 EUR/Day flat fee13:11
DocScrutinizerBugBlue: here in Germany some reseller sold Nokia smartphones with SIM contract with NO dataplan (means you pay by the KB), phone did a update and user had to pay 450EUR ;-P13:11
Ikarustimeless_mbp: I have unlimited HSDPA, why would I want SMS (although mine are only 17 cents)13:11
IkarusDocScrutinizer: youch13:11
ShapeshifterBugBlue: that is quite awesome13:11
timeless_mbpBugBlue: um13:11
IkarusShapeshifter: it's called T-mobile13:11
BugBlueShapeshifter: Ikarus has the same plan I presume :-)13:11
timeless_mbp5 EUR/day flat sounds amazing13:11
timeless_mbpdoes that include data?13:11
IkarusBugBlue: yup13:11
Ikarustimeless_mbp: ofcourse13:11
BugBluetimeless_mbp: that's data roaming .. call roaming costs a lot more13:11
Shapeshifterwho needs calls13:11
timeless_mbpi want your provider13:11
BugBluetimeless_mbp: that's why I call via SIP when abroad13:11
BugBlueShapeshifter: I do... with SIP via 3G :P13:12
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timeless_mbpif i roam for a week in Europe, i typically hit 1000EUR13:12
BugBlueif I roam for a week in europe I do hit about 35 EUR13:12
timeless_mbp(two phones)13:12
BugBluemy E51 uses my N900 for uplink13:12
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timeless_mbpactually maybe it's closer to two weeks13:13
* timeless_mbp tries to calculate if 11 days is closer to 1 or 2 weeks :)13:13
timeless_mbpBugBlue: wifi sharing?13:13
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: ever considered Iridium or Suraya? They can't be any more expensive :-P13:13
IkarusPAN I assmume13:13
timeless_mbpIkarus: n900 doesn't have pan out of the box..13:14
* timeless_mbp isn't even sure if s60 has pan support13:14
Ikarustimeless_mbp: it has13:14
BugBluetimeless_mbp: wifi... but I now do have to upgrade the kernel again13:14
Ikarustimeless_mbp: my laptop was just connected via bluetooth PAN13:14
Ikarustimeless_mbp: what the N900 doesn't have is PAN client mode13:14
* BugBlue off to lunch13:14
Ikarustimeless_mbp: but it works as a gateway13:14
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DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: aiui both do even CSD data, suraya at an incredible price per minute of <0.3$ iirc13:15
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* timeless_mbp ponders13:15
Ikarusit's what my fight with DBus is all about, getting my laptop to log on via PAN without using NetworkManager13:15
timeless_mbpwhat would that get me at 1.22USD = 1EUR for 1000EUR?13:15
timeless_mbpthat's 3 days continuous use13:16
vanad1sf***, i guess i'm just gonna reflash the device13:16
timeless_mbpif i got my math right13:16
timeless_mbpthat's about a week or so13:16
Ikarustimeless_mbp: *shudder*13:16
IkarusI am glad with my 5 euro a day limited plan13:17
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timeless_mbpIkarus: as long as i don't go over 1000eur, it doesn't matter13:17
Ikaruseven if I do have to call when they kick me down to dial up rates after some time13:17
DocScrutinizerIkarus: not via satellite though :-P13:17
Ikarustimeless_mbp: your boss must be awesome13:17
IkarusDocScrutinizer: heh13:17
Trewasdata roaming can be somewhat expensive, for example upgrade to pr1.2 while roaming with finnish SIM in russia is about 1400 euros13:17
IkarusTrewas: ...13:17
IkarusTrewas: you haven't tried that right13:17
TrewasIkarus: of course not, but I am going to visit there for a couple of days and checked the prices... now I know to be careful :)13:18
IkarusTrewas: Russia is dead expensive roaming13:18
Ikarus3 euro/minute stuff13:18
DocScrutinizerIkarus: in Russia the few stupid have to pay for all the hacked phones to keep the service up and running :-P13:19
IkarusDocScrutinizer: heheh13:19
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ghostcubewow the flashing killed my sd card with all my backups on it13:19
Trewas11 euros per megabyte in russia with DNA as operator, and it is not that much cheaper even in EU countries13:19
Ikarusghostcube: then you did it WRONG13:20
IkarusTrewas: uh, as said, BugBlue and me have 5 euro a day max unlimited EU roaming13:20
IkarusTrewas: from T-mobile13:20
ghostcubeIkarus why should i ?13:20
Ikarusghostcube: normally flashing doesn't touch your SD card or the /home and MyDocs sections13:20
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ghostcubeyeah my sd is killed13:21
* DocScrutinizer considers to put BIG FAT WARNING to wiki, to remove SIM and uSD(!!!) before updating13:21
ghostcubeits damaged i think its becaus of taken out the batterie13:21
arachnistDocScrutinizer: why remove sim?13:21
DocScrutinizerghostcube: you're not the first one reporting such issue13:21
Ikarusghostcube: that is just bizarre13:21
ghostcubeyep ... but it happened13:21
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DocScrutinizerarachnist: just to be on the safe side13:21
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pupnikmy sim icon is dead. but i havent rebooted13:22
DocScrutinizerarachnist: there was a case yesterday where the contacts app crashed 2s after start, until all SIM borne contacts were deleted13:22
loufoque_maemois it normal i'm still not offered OTA ?13:22
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DocScrutinizerarachnist: for obvious reasons I guess the erase was done on another phone13:23
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ghostcubeok, i need a new sd its broken13:24
ghostcubecant get access to it13:24
Ikarusbut erm, reformatting the SD not sufficient ?13:24
IkarusDocScrutinizer: is there a bug up on the N900 killing uSD and SIM cards ?13:24
ghostcube40 euros for the trash13:24
Ikarusghostcube: call Nokia13:24
Shapeshiftermhh. I installed openttd, openttd-data and openttd-opengfx and still, if I launch it, I get "Error: Cannot open file ''". Do i really need to get the file manually from somewhere and place it somewhere else? I can't remember having done that when I installed openttd on PR1.1.1...13:25
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Ikarus(although they can argue that their EULA exempts them from this, most EU countries have laws banning such exclusions)13:25
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noobmonk3yhmmmmm has the ovi update happenned? Suggests there is more content, cant see it at all though13:27
DocScrutinizerIkarus: no, SIM contacts kill contacts app ocasionally. Also there were at least 2 reports about corrupted uSD now13:27
visznoobmonk3y, it's all lies13:27
noobmonk3yas per usual :P13:27
IkarusDocScrutinizer: yes, but corrupt I get, but unable to recover even with formatting13:28
IkarusI can't imagine how13:28
DocScrutinizernah, not seen yet. Either card is borked from beginning, or a new partitioning and mkfs should recover it13:28
DocScrutinizeryet to see a SD card being eaten by a device completely13:29
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ShapeshifterMh. My desktops are kinda empty. there really aren't too many good widgets. any favourites?13:32
* noobmonk3y laughs13:32
DocScrutinizerghostcube: if the card's MBR is corrupt, it might not be mounted at all, and this resulting in FM doesn't show it13:32
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ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: yep seems so13:33
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ghostcubei calling nokia at the moment13:33
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DocScrutinizerI never tested how N900 handles uSD with corrupt MBR. Anyway I suggest you do a complete fresh format of the card on your PC13:34
ghostcubenokia told me, so i have used the maeomo flasing tool13:34
ghostcubethey dont care if its borked13:34
ghostcubeits not recommended13:35
Stskeepswell, the official way is NSU13:35
* noobmonk3y throws a B0rked trout @ frals 13:35
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noobmonk3yStskeeps: the official borked way? :)13:35
* frals throws a whale at noobmonk3y13:35
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noobmonk3yfrals: interesting13:35
* DocScrutinizer trows a galaxy at noobmonk3y and frals13:36
* noobmonk3y throws frals at a whale13:36
* noobmonk3y eats the galaxy13:36
ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: i cant tell more they just told me dont use the flashing tool o maemo.org13:36
* noobmonk3y farts13:36
* tybollt throws a noobmonk3y at the whale13:36
* noobmonk3y giggles in mid air13:36
StskeepsThis software is work-in-progress and use of this software requires special skills and knowledge. The software and the instructions provided herein or with the software may not be complete. Improper use or installation of this software may harm the device you are installing it into, or the device you are using it with. By accepting the following License Agreement you also agree to use this software at your own risk and accept that ...13:36
Stskeeps... Nokia assumes no liability and does not provide any warranties, support or services related to the software.13:36
DocScrutinizerghostcube: I can't comment on that. I don't understand that13:36
noobmonk3ylmfao my n900 is jhonny 513:37
tybolltjhonny 5?13:37
noobmonk3yi'm watching it sit flat on a desk swapping between portrait and landscape on it's own13:37
noobmonk3yjohnny5* alive!13:37
timeless_mbpStskeeps: which is that?13:37
noobmonk3y(80's film)13:37
ghostcubenumber 5 lives13:38
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: OVI self destructor app13:38
tybolltStskeeps: Everytime I read those disclaimers and what not I am thinking to myself they could just replace the text w/ "Hi customer - FUCK YOU! bye..."13:38
timeless_mbpthanks,, i think i'll pass :)13:38
timeless_mbptybollt =~ s/customer/sucker/13:39
ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: best is i told the guy on the phon eoTA crashed and i need the flasing utility cause your nsu sux13:39
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ghostcubehe told me he cant do anything for me13:39
SpeedEviltybollt: I'm astounded that they don't get people to actually read them.13:39
noobmonk3ytybollt:  i think they would phrase it differently "Oh shit we have a customer.... what shall we do, run , run for the hillllllllllls!"13:39
tybollttimeless_mbp: customer == sucker >:)13:39
DocScrutinizerghostcube: I hope he answered RTFW13:39
tybolltrun tio the hills run for your liiiiiife....13:39
IkarusStskeeps: guess what, those terms don't survive in most European courts13:39
tybolltaaah the nostalgia >:)13:39
povbot`Bug 10261: Terms and conditions of use displayed on PR1.2 upgrade are incorrect.13:39
timeless_mbpSpeedEvil: awesome13:40
noobmonk3ybug 1026113:40
povbot`Bug Terms and conditions of use displayed on PR1.2 upgrade are incorrect.13:40
DocScrutinizer~tell ghostcube about flashing13:40
noobmonk3ybot's are on form today13:40
noobmonk3y~tell frals where to stick his trouts13:40
tybollt~tell tybollt to fuck off13:40
ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: i did it this way upadte worked fine13:40
ghostcubeonly sd get killed13:41
noobmonk3y[11:40] <infobot>  No, noobmonk3y, I won't. (target invalid?)13:41
DocScrutinizerghostcube: so please REFORMAT your SD13:41
SpeedEvilghostcube: Killed - or erased?13:41
* noobmonk3y throws bacon at lcuk 13:41
DocScrutinizerghostcube: bitching about flasher tool won't help recover it13:41
ghostcubemust check dont have an real card reader for usd13:41
timeless_mbpsomeone please send ian stirling a box of candies for me?13:42
timeless_mbpi'll send money to pay for the candy13:42
ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: iam not bitchin about flaher tool nokia does lol13:42
tybollttimeless_mbp: why?13:42
timeless_mbptybollt: the bug above ^^13:42
tybollttimeless_mbp: and knowing you diss terva leijona - those candy are probably pretty icky tasty :P13:42
timeless_mbpthat he actually read the license and spent the time to explain why it was totally broken13:42
DocScrutinizerghostcube: FWIW I added a warning to the wiki page13:43
timeless_mbptybollt: i'd hope they'd send him candy he'd appreciate13:43
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timeless_mbpi'm not going to pay someone to send him poison!13:43
ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: yeah thats good !13:43
tybollttimeless_mbp: :-D13:43
IkarusDocScrutinizer: do link to relevant bugs13:43
IkarusDocScrutinizer: warnings without clear explaination are a scourge13:43
DocScrutinizerIkarus: I don't even know if there are13:43
Ikarusheh, ask the affected uses13:43
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Ikarusthat is you ghostcube13:43
corecodeapt-get clean was sufficient13:44
corecodedunno why that is on root13:44
DocScrutinizercorecode: because apt isn't optified?13:46
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timeless_mbpcorecode: we improved the stuff users should officially use13:46
infobotwell, optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs13:46
timeless_mbpnot the stuff that happens to be there but isn't for general use13:46
timeless_mbpif we hack the underlying levels13:47
timeless_mbpthen experts will complain that we messed with it13:47
corecodesilly experts :)13:47
corecodethanks anyhow13:47
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DocScrutinizercreate a decent dedicated partition on eMMC for /usr and /var, and nuke optification13:47
RST38hDoc: and then the whole system becomes even slower13:48
timeless_mbpand it might not boot13:48
timeless_mbpif it needs stuff from /usr before /usr is available13:48
DocScrutinizerRST38h: possible, but not inevitably13:48
DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: that's a simple matter of doing the init right13:49
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DocScrutinizertimeless_mbp: of course /usr is supposed to be mounted before init scripts access stuff from there13:49
DocScrutinizerbtw that's the whole rationale of /usr13:50
DocScrutinizeralways been13:50
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DocScrutinizer/usr per definitionem holds the stuff not needed for booting13:51
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RST38h"Symbian^3 to launch on non-Nokia handset, courtesy of 'Asian vendor'"13:51
* RST38h suspects there is an internal war going on at Nokia13:52
DocScrutinizerinit -s MUST succeed with a completely borked or even removed /usr drive13:52
asj_RST38h: Nokla go go! ;)13:52
DocScrutinizersame for /home, and /var13:52
RST38hThe only possible explanation for this part of news13:52
DocScrutinizerthat's btw the reason ~root is on /13:52
DocScrutinizerand not on /home13:53
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SpeedEviltimeless: As it happens - nokia is sending me money. But for a study on usability, and just the once. :)13:53
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SpeedEvilAlso - anyone that can - substiting the candy for broken n900s :)13:54
Stskeepsdneary: thanks for the book recommendations, managed to get producing oss and art of community.. getting peopleware some other time13:55
dnearyStskeeps, Cool13:55
dnearyGlad to help13:55
Stskeepsis good to put words on experiences13:55
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DocScrutinizerRST38h: if you need to faststart a particular app that resides on /usr, you are free to symlink it back to /MyFaststartUsrAux/fastapp.a on NAND13:57
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DocScrutinizeror simply move it from /usr/bin to /bin13:57
ShapeshifterIs there someway of telling where stuff will get installed to when doing an apt-get install? As in, I want to do apt-get install gstreamer0.10-plugins* but I want to see if everything will go to opt, first.13:57
SpeedEvilshould libraries be optified?13:58
ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: why not13:58
SpeedEvilI noticed a couple of packages in extras-testing that pulled in perhaps 10 meg of libraries onto / as dependancies13:58
Shapeshifteroptified and symlinked13:58
fralsheh, i like going from 21170 function calls (20851 primitive calls) in 13.204 CPU seconds to 20391 function calls (20072 primitive calls) in 3.848 CPU seconds13:58
tybolltSpeedEvil: the sheer fact you have to  ask saddens me... what a total catastrophe this optification is :-|13:58
tybolltfrals: ? what's that13:59
fralsimproved code :-)13:59
noobmonk3ySpeedEvil: Healthcheck pulls in 40mb now ;)13:59
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: exactly. Though pymaemo-optify doesn't use symlinks, it uses bindmounts instead13:59
SpeedEviltybollt: I mean - is libraries it pulls in being non-optified a reason for QA fail?13:59
asj_SpeedEvil: if there is an option to fix the library I would say yes14:00
DocScrutinizer~tell tybollt about optification14:00
* corecode waits for update14:00
corecodeDocScrutinizer: how is the usb host mode going?14:01
achipaSpeedEvil: depends on the lib. If they are your libs -> fail. Nokia's libs -> sigh and wave along14:01
SpeedEvilcorecode: slow progress.14:01
DocScrutinizersleeping for 2 days14:01
SpeedEvilachipa: I mean from a random app I go to install from testing - to evaluate for extras14:02
tybolltDocScrutinizer: what are you on about?14:02
tybolltDocScrutinizer: I know that14:02
DocScrutinizerwe got 2 new hackers to the club, which will need some time to catch up14:02
tybolltthat doesn't change the fact :)14:02
DocScrutinizertybollt: just felt like... :-D sorry14:02
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Shapeshifterso. awesome. I did apt-get install gstreamer0.10-plugins* and after it unpacked most of the stuff it says "Errors were encountered while processing: /var/cache/apt/archives/gstreamer0.10-pplugins-ulgy_0.10.10.2-1maemo2_armel.deb E: Sub-process /usr7Bin/dpkg retuned an error code (1)". Oh why do people think that apt is awesome again? Can never hear enough of it. Just look at this highly descriptive error message... In any case, free ...14:02
Shapeshifter... space on rootfs dropped from 90 to 81mb. apt-get clean doesn't change that fact. But apt didn't even install anything.14:03
pvanhoofWhen I click "Maemo5" in the application manager's update list, it tells me to use some software on my PC instead. What is this about?14:03
achipaSpeedEvil: that's what I say. If the libs are from Nokia, it's not a fail. If they are community libs, it's a fail (unless there is a very good reason/precedent why the given lib is not optified)14:03
DocScrutinizerand javispedro was a little busy the last few days14:03
Shapeshifterpvanhoof: conflicting packages or not enough space on rootfs14:03
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pvanhoofShapeshifter, can I figure out which packages conflict?14:04
achipaSpeedEvil: for example most Qt libs are not optified, but it's not a QA fail to write Qt apps14:04
Shapeshifterand where the hell are the apt logs?14:04
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SpeedEvilachipa: yeah - it's just a hell of a pain to work out library ownership.14:05
* asj_ grumbles, I wonder if I can get Nokai Messaging working again14:06
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pvanhoofShapeshifter, apt-get upgrade doesn't give me conflicts14:06
pvanhoofShapeshifter, can I safely answer Y ?14:06
pvanhoofno worries, i didn't14:06
Shapeshifterpvanhoof: meh there's lots of room for failure. Just backup, then use flasher.14:07
ShapeshifterBut seriously, how do I clean up this mess apt just made14:07
DocScrutinizerplease see /topic14:07
ShapeshifterI fucking HATE apt. it's so broken.14:07
zaheermpvanhoof, the biggest culprit seems to be libgles1-sgx-img14:07
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Shapeshifterapt-get autoremove: "the following packages have unmet dependencies: gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly-dbg Depends gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly blablabla14:08
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: install find-utils (I *HATE* BUSYBOX!), the remove all files and drawers newer than xy14:08
pvanhoofzaheerm, aha brainparty14:08
pvanhoofthat used that14:08
pvanhoofand tuxrace14:08
viszevopedia on n900 serves only one wiki-page. needs to be restarted for another14:08
pvanhoofok, getting rid of those14:08
zaheermpvanhoof, yep i had those 2 installed also :)14:08
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vanad1sso, i gonna reflash my n90014:09
ShapeshifterDocScrutinizer: I doubt that'll work. I'd probably delete a couple of temp files from some hildon stuff or whatever and apt would be confused as to why the files are gone but still in the db and so on14:09
vanad1show do i give it more space on rootfs?14:09
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: maybe14:10
Shapeshifterand where's the log file, anyway...14:10
Shapeshiftercan't find it.14:10
DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: but isn't apt already confused to hell14:10
Shapeshifternah. it just failed while "unpacking"14:10
Shapeshifterand yeah it's confused. that's because it sucks14:10
Shapeshifterbut I guess that's normal14:10
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ShapeshifterDon't tell me apt doesn't have a log file on maemo5...14:11
pvanhoofzaheerm, my new hero, that did it :)14:11
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DocScrutinizerShapeshifter: sure, it's stored in /dev/null/apt/14:11
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pvanhoofnow the app manager accepts the update14:11
ShapeshifterDocScrutinizer: xD14:12
corecodewow slow update14:12
Shapeshifternah this is a joke isn't it14:12
Shapeshifterno log file?14:12
Shapeshifterhow is anyone supposed to know what's going on then14:12
DocScrutinizersorry, just kidding. No idea14:12
zaheermpvanhoof, enjoy the update :)14:12
pvanhoofthanks for the support zaheerm14:13
pvanhoofyou should blog this :)14:13
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zaheermpvanhoof, lol it is in some thread, should be enough i think...i have blogged enough this past week14:14
DocScrutinizerpvanhoof: no, you should add it to
Shapeshifteroh god how stupid is this. unbelievable that there is a single person standing up for this rubbish package management system14:14
TermanaDocScrutinizer, is it alright to pm you?14:15
DocScrutinizerTermana: go ahead14:15
zaheermdockane, surely you want OTA-to_PR1.2_troubleshooting page created14:15
DocScrutinizerbut don't sell me a new washing machine :-P14:15
DocScrutinizerzaheerm: I guess that's ETAB14:16
vanad1sreflashing finished, works perfectly14:16
pvanhoofdocscrutinizer, will do14:16
alteregoWhen's this Ovi update occuring any one know?14:16
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zaheermalterego, depends if you believe nokia conversations blog14:17
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DocScrutinizerzaheerm: sure a new page would be better, but then otoh I think the 1.1 version just needs little update and a change of the title14:17
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alteregozaheerm: don't see anything on the blog?14:17
hrwsygic landed in ovi store14:18
alteregoI heard it was today ..14:18
pvanhoofupdate is installing14:19
pvanhoofnice :)14:19
zaheermalterego, it said today.....but timeless says it isn't14:19
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sivangis PR1.2 out already? ;)14:19
alteregozaheerm: ah, cool. Well, I'm not too bothered, would have been nice to try out some of those new games though.14:19
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zaheermsivang, the topic says it all14:20
sivangI hoped to try some of the OVI app wizard apps on N900, but the site said it is uncompatible14:20
sivangzaheerm: o :)14:20
ghostcubei recognized the programms have an own backup list?14:21
ghostcubecool  less work for damaged backup owners14:21
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ghostcubeo the only thing i lost now with the sd formating by what ever it was are my settings14:22
sivanghow do I check my PR version again?14:22
ghostcubehmmm this is ok so far14:22
ghostcubemenu systeminfo?14:22
corecodeboot progress bar?14:22
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SpeedEvilsivang: settings - about product14:22
sivangSpeedEvil: 3.2010.02-814:23
* sivang wonders if he can cat /etc/lsb-release14:23
SpeedEvilsivang: that's 1.214:23
SpeedEvili mean 1.1.1 I think14:23
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* SpeedEvil becomes confused.14:23
sivangSpeedEvil: so we need a translation table somewhere14:23
sivanghey timeless_mbp14:23
sivangtimeless_mbp: How do you know what PR you have on the device?14:24
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lardman|gone10.2010.19-1 is PR1.214:24
SpeedEvil1.2 is 10.2010.1914:24
lardman|goneor at least the legacy version I flashed14:24
corecode\o/ updated14:24
sivangso I have to the OTA flasher if so?14:25
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sivangand can go onw tih the instructions ?14:25
timeless_mbpsivang: in "About" or "About Product" in Settings it'll tell you the version14:25
sivangtimeless_mbp: yes, it just says a what is for me (and an iphoner) a cryptic version number :)14:25
timeless_mbpsivang: bugzilla has a table14:26
sivanglardman|gone: so the pR will be out in october?14:26
timeless_mbpi used to maintain a table in my blogs14:26
timeless_mbpand there was a wiki page14:26
lardman|gonesivang: ? It's out now14:26
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sivanglardman|gone: right, so even a "guess" at this cryptic version number yields nonsesne:)14:27
sivangis P1.2 makes the device at least a bit faster?14:27
SpeedEvilsivang: Seemingly, in some aspects.14:27
sivangSpeedEvil: nice to hear, and the a fix for something I reported should be there, so I wanna test :)14:28
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sivangtimeless_mbp: thanks dude14:29
viszextended call log app doesn't seem to work with 1.214:29
ghostcubethis programm reinstall tool is fine folks :)14:30
ghostcubei have all back again14:30
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timeless_mbpvisz: eh14:32
timeless_mbpiirc it did stuff for me14:32
* tybollt hates at nookla14:32
timeless_mbpvisz: yeah, extended call log works fine here14:33
ivan4thFYI: I've managed to upgrade repartitioned N900 with /usr on eMMC (it was done long ago on PR1.0 according to ruskie's instructions). the command was apt-get install mp-fremantle-generic-pr=10.2010.19-1 osso-wlan=3.0.17+0m5 Before rebooting, I've merged changes in /etc/init.d/rcS and kept /etc/event.d/rcS-late that was before upgrade14:33
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ivan4thchanges in /etc/event.d/rcS-late in PR1.2 seem to be related to optification which I don't need14:34
Shapeshifterivan4th: aint that awfully slow at times?14:34
ivan4thShapeshifter: mostly during reboots, but I don't reboot often14:35
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timeless_mbpvisz: what version of extended call log are you using?14:37
timeless_mbpi have 0.414:37
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Stskeepsmm, i need some kind of very simple wiki hosting place, ideally without signup, just some14:38
Stskeepsfor one page14:38
Stskeepsany recommendations?14:38
alteregowikipedia? :)14:39
alteregoStskeeps: what's the nature of the pagE?14:39
WolfieStskeeps: github?14:40
Stskeepsalterego: semi-private temporary collaboration, text14:40
smokuivan4th: what is the advantage of this setup?14:40
smokuStskeeps: ?14:40
alteregoStskeeps: google docs?14:40
alteregoI'm not talking out of experience though, I personally don't use any google services.14:40
alteregoBut I've heard people use things like docs and other services I think they even have a whiteboard of some sorts.14:41
Wolfiei guess google wave should work well for collaboration14:41
tybolltAt least googlers provides OTA calendar14:41
tybollt¤)%&!¤"#(%"#= nokia doesn't :-|14:41
Shapeshiftermh. since PR1.2 something keeps resetting my xkbmap to something like en_US I'm guessing. I want "ch". I use the same minor modifications to rx-51 as with PR1.1.1 and I'm 100% sure that they're not the problem.14:42
tybolltMohammadAG: yes!?14:42
Shapeshifteranyone else experiencing this?14:42
MohammadAGtybollt, &!&&#+€$, in short, yes14:42
* tybollt dips MohammadAG in chocolate and throws him to the lesbians...14:42
MohammadAGShapeshifter, haven't changed them14:42
tybolltMohammadAG: ah sorry, yes14:42
MohammadAGtybollt, sorry for what?14:43
tybollthehe :)14:43
corecodeanybody found out what the "join chat room" thing does in conversations?14:43
timeless_mbpcorecode: it should work if you use skype14:44
corecodeno skype14:44
timeless_mbpto let you join a skype group chat14:44
corecodenow it is twiddling14:45
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tybollt"join chat room" -> first step to being arrested by FBI on grouns of misconduct w/ children >:)14:45
MohammadAGi'm really not sure who crippled the convos app14:45
MohammadAGit scrolls up on its own and / commands don't work14:46
noobmonk3yOooooooooooooOOooo one new app on ovi store - go Nokia :P lol14:46
timeless_mbpGAN900: can you verify bug 6141 for me? :)14:47
povbot`Bug "Maemo Software" should be "Maemo Devices"14:47
tybolltnoobmonk3y: seriously? that's it? "new and improved ovi store" = one new app?14:47
noobmonk3ytybollt: pretty sure they havnt actually done anything yet14:47
tybolltbug 66614:47
povbot`Bug Problems with Javascript setTimeout function14:47
noobmonk3yor if they even are lol14:48
noobmonk3ybug 114:48
povbot`Bug test - ignore it14:48
tybolltbug 9999999999914:48
povbot`Bug was not found.14:48
noobmonk3ythe bug was not found or the device was not found?14:48
Corsacbug -114:48
kehnaGuys I can't seem to back up my n900 or install new applications, Is there a way to back up stuff manually such as my contacts list?14:48
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tybollt*** povbot` connection reset by peer14:49
timeless_mbpkehna: technically, yes14:49
noobmonk3ykehna - how good are you at leaching sql db's?14:49
SpeedEvilkehna: Do you have a SD card?14:49
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tybolltbug 114:49
timeless_mbpkehna: do you have a usb cable attached?14:49
kehnaI have the usb cable14:49
timeless_mbpis it attached?14:49
tybolltCorsac: I think you killed povbot =)14:49
timeless_mbpbecause it's hard to back up data when you have no volumes available14:49
tybolltbug 312714:49
povbot`Bug * goes to repository.maemo.org14:49
tybolltargh :)14:49
plastunhello! what is the best: making symbolic link to /opt/... using debina/rules or opstins script?14:49
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timeless_mbpand volumes typically are exported to your pc when you use the usb cable14:49
Shapeshiftermh. how do I initiate a skype video call? I only see "skype call" in the contact, and if I do that I can't enable the camera14:50
kehnathrough pc suite?14:50
timeless_mbpShapeshifter: if you're in a skype call you can tap the title area to try to start video14:50
MohammadAGShapeshifter, the other party needs to have a vid cam14:50
timeless_mbpbut normally you'd want to find someone who advertises a video camera14:50
timeless_mbpin which case you'd see a 3rd item14:50
ShapeshifterI can't see "skype IM" either14:50
MohammadAG(well for the option to show in there)14:50
timeless_mbpnote that you can't advertise camera when you aren't online14:50
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MohammadAGShapeshifter, the person hates you14:50
Shapeshiftershe uses skype for linux14:51
timeless_mbpi know, it's stupid, you can't leave video voicemail via skype14:51
MohammadAGShapeshifter, she hates you :P14:51
timeless_mbpShapeshifter: get her wine-skype or windows :)14:51
Shapeshifteroh noes14:51
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ivan4th smoku: I did it when I needed some SDK packages to be able to use gcc etc. on device itself. The main advantage is no problem with running out of rootfs space14:52
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noobmonk3yi think there is confusion on the ovi update - as May 27 last year Ovi store was updated, i bet you someone is regurgitating last years news without reading the date14:53
ruskiehmm I guess I don't know how to use feeding it14:53
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SpeedEvilivan4th: I cheated14:55
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SpeedEvilivan4th: cp -ax / /home/user/data/chroot14:55
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visztimeless_mbp, ah, i have version 0.314:56
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timeless_mbpvisz: should you perhaps check for updates? :)14:58
timeless_mbpor maybe i need to vote to promote it out14:58
visz0.3 is the version on maemo-extras14:59
MohammadAGlcuk, how many MBs did build-essential use up?14:59
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visztimeless_mbp, 0.4 seems to be working15:05
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timeless_mbpvisz: =)15:06
timeless_mbpvisz: so 0.4 isn't promoted?15:07
timeless_mbplet's fix that! :)15:07
timeless_mbphelp, how do we promote something? :)15:07
viszextras-devel also had working conversations inbox desktop widget15:07
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visz1.1.1 vs. 1.0.4 in extras15:09
viszlatter one didn't run on PR 1.215:09
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timeless_mbphelp, how does one get promoted?15:10
timeless_mbpdo we have to beg the maintainer?15:10
noobmonk3yAngry birds description on ovi says - "Each of the 21 levels requires logic, skill, and brute force " - am i right in assume thats bollocks, and there is only 3 levels?15:10
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MohammadAG21 levels15:10
tybollt3 levels15:10
tybolltthen YOU PAY15:10
MohammadAG21 without paying here15:11
Wolfieno, there's 21 levels, then you can (eventually, i hope) buy two level packs more15:11
noobmonk3yomfg - i need to re-dload back later!15:11
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Wolfiewell, it's just one level pack, but there's 2x21 levels in that15:11
MohammadAG kinda stupid, they could've made them linked to an .install file to update15:12
SpeedEvilAnd 63 levels is not enough!15:12
SpeedEvilI was at the point of trying to beat my high-scores of ***'d levels.15:13
MohammadAGthere are 2 more packs afaik15:13
noobmonk3yhas bounce got better yet? hehe15:13
noobmonk3yhmmm no update for me :|15:13
MohammadAGyeah, it bounces a bit higher now15:13
noobmonk3yunless they mean pr1.2?15:13
MohammadAGnah, my user agent is borked15:13
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pigeonoh, new ovi store out already?15:15
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tybolltthey said day after 1.2 release15:16
timeless_mbpthey lie :)15:16
Wolfiei just wish someone would get off their asses and re-re-put the angry birds pack back online15:16
pigeoni'm looking forward to that roller coaster game too15:17
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MohammadAGnot sure if i'll actually play it, but the graphics chip is kinda wasted15:18
nidOim still really happy with spb brain evolution that showed up on ovi a week or two ago15:18
tybollt"I'm still happy there is now an (one!) app on ovi store"15:18
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NetrumHi all :)15:24
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noobmonk3yI r Angry Birding lol15:25
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* MohammadAG does them andry bird sounds15:26
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Netrumi installed ubuntu to flash my phone. and i havent touched windows since. starting to like this more and more :)15:27
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Netrumis there a ovi suite type of program for linux?15:33
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GAN900DocScrutinizer, ping?15:33
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tybolltMohammadAG: "andry bird sounds"?  android bird sounds???15:34
MohammadAGangry :)15:34
Netrumyou guys bored or something ?15:34
MohammadAGjust got home from an epic MW2 game15:34
MohammadAGgot a nuke15:34
Netrumnever played that game online :)15:35
MohammadAGtbh i never played any cod game online, then someone invited me into a game and now i'm at lvl 70 :)15:36
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Netrumi havent played anything online since eve in may last year.15:37
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Netrumand recently the only game i've played is mahjong on the n90015:38
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* SpeedEvil wonders why anything accessing /home/ is deadlocking.15:38
SpeedEvilThe processes show as 'D' in ps15:38
SpeedEvilAnd nothing in dmesg15:39
* jaska overclocks the 7700 running wiki.maemo.org15:40
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auenfNetrum, why not play tetris, its in portrait mode ;)15:44
auenfit is (was?) in portrait mode on n810 also15:44
adeusyeah Mahjong15:45
adeusI'm hooked playing it15:45
Sceltis anyone else having problem with power management that opening up keyboard opens properly the screen but putting it back again doesn't lock the screen as it used?15:45
auenfisnt that by design?15:46
timeless_mbpScelt: at least for my basic test, that works15:47
timeless_mbpsteps: 1. close keyboard. 2. use hardware slider to lock screen. 3. open keyboard. 4. close keyboard15:47
timeless_mbpactual result: screen is off15:47
TheGermanyay, boot loop :D15:47
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auenfbut if you do something, it doesnt lock, which iirc is by design15:47
MohammadAGtimeless_mbp, that's the expected result15:48
Scelttimeless_mbp: seems to work now :> don't know what happened. I tested it like dozen times15:48
MohammadAGit prevents accidental slides15:48
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auenfif you (start closed): lock device, open slider, tap dashboard, close slider15:49
TheGermanwow, it comes up, after upgrading without flashing, but it shows strange effects :D15:49
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auenfit doesnt turn the screen off, which afaik is by design15:50
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KMFDManyone able to help me troubleshoot an issue with the NSU15:50
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zogg_laptoptimeless_mbp, have you talked to him?15:51
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Shapeshiftermh. I can't un-capitalise letters at the beginning of a sentence anymore. shift+letter or shift, pause, letter don't make it lower case anymore since PR1.215:52
ShapeshifterI have to do something like Oo-left-backspace to get "o"15:52
ShapeshifterOo-left-backspace-right actually15:52
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SceltShapeshifter: reported bug15:52
MohammadAGShapeshifter, I use space, noticed that too15:52
Sceltbug 1031015:53
povbot`Bug can't write a lower case letter after a dot even if you'd do it with shift15:53
Shapeshifterfunny that they didn't notice this in 3 months of testing15:53
Sceltyea :(15:53
MohammadAGi noticed it with the sdk packages a month ago15:54
KMFDMmy nokia software updater refuses to finish downloading hte new firmware15:54
MohammadAGbut thought it might not be final :/15:54
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KMFDMeven with another phone it tries to resume a download at 33.6megs and then fails15:54
KMFDMif i knew where it temporarily saves firmware images15:54
KMFDMi assume i could delete the failed download and get it to work15:54
KMFDMbut it doesn't save the temporary download in a standard location15:55
KMFDMand it fails to resume it15:55
KMFDMeven with a different phone15:55
KMFDM(also an n900)15:55
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KMFDMit attempts to resume the same failed download15:55
MohammadAGwhich OS?15:55
KMFDMnokia software updater15:55
KMFDMsp3 32bit15:55
MohammadAGit's in common data afaik15:55
KMFDMcommon data?15:56
KMFDMwhee is that?15:56
pigeonhmm, the new HAM has no sort?15:56
MohammadAGnot sure on xp15:56
KMFDMthis is the nokia software updater15:56
DisconnectI learned the hard way not to trust the backup app. for some unknown reason the n900 saved a bunch of the photos (an entire bachelor/wedding trips worth of candids in fact) to the main storage. then didn't back them up (cuz, you know, who wants anything as useless as PICTURES?)15:56
KMFDMthere isn't one for linux15:56
MohammadAGKMFDM, look up a how to hack a 580015:56
Disconnectjust a warning for anyone else doing an upgrade..15:56
MohammadAGit should tell you where the files are15:57
MohammadAGor use flasher-3.5 on linux15:57
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zogg_laptopwho tried meego on n900?15:57
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MohammadAGnot interested enough15:58
zogg_laptopi want to see screenies of twm15:58
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MohammadAGisn't it only an X server now?15:59
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, nope as i understand16:00
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KMFDMMohammadAG, the image is not on the phone yet16:00
KMFDMits on my computer16:00
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infobotit has been said that flashing is
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zogg_laptopKMFDM, it should be on the computer ^ read what bot said16:01
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infobotwell, pr1.2 is available since early Tuesday morning. More information at -- see ~flashing for how to update16:01
infobotnokia is, like, a cellphone company from Finland.16:01
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KMFDMive read through all that 30 times16:01
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KMFDMit does not tell me where the nokia sofware updater saves its temporary firmware downloa16:01
KMFDMwhich is where my issue is16:01
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GAN900KMFDM, why is that your issue?16:02
sx0n ~kumisaapas16:02
infobotfinland is probably some bloody scandinavian icicle, or nice place to live in :}16:02
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KMFDMGAN900, the NSU attempts to resume a failed download at 33.6mb complete teach time16:02
KMFDMthen throws a failed download error16:02
KMFDMand does this teach time16:02
KMFDMb/c the server went down when it was attempting the first download16:02
zogg_laptopKMFDM, you get img, you run flasher with command from wiki, you connect phone and do what it said on wiki, voullla16:03
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tybolltmaybe I should install meego tonight?16:03
* noobmonk3y prods frals 16:03
* noobmonk3y pokes MohammadAG 16:03
GAN900KMFDM, then don't use NSU?16:03
GAN900KMFDM, why not update on device?16:03
KMFDMthat fails16:03
KMFDMi have too much crap installed16:03
GAN900KMFDM, or use the flasher if that doesn't work.16:03
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KMFDMand can't tell what is optified and what isn't16:03
GAN900NSU sucks16:03
zogg_laptopkmfdm, just wait for pr1.316:04
tybolltIs there a way to turn off16:04
infobotrumour has it, flasher is
Sceltsx0n: The text featured on a PowerPoint presentation at Motorola some years ago bluntly described how America's top cell phone maker lost global leadership in the 1990s: "So, what happened? A little known rubber-boot company from Finland kicked our butt."16:04
GAN900Follow the instructions for the commandline flasher.16:04
GAN900Scelt, now Nokia is a joke in the US.16:04
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SceltGAN900: sure. thanks to apple and google. motorola should be dead already16:05
MohammadAGwhat's motorolalala?16:05
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ghostcubeKMFDM: take out your sd card before you flash the device16:05
ghostcubeit can be killed liek mine and nokia says we dont care16:06
MohammadAGcause it's not because of flasher16:06
MohammadAGor flashing16:06
ghostcubeit is16:06
MohammadAGdon't blame it on flasher16:06
MohammadAGgot proof of that?16:06
ghostcubei flashed and my sd card was clean like a baby popo16:06
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ghostcubeyeah it worked before the flashing with ota update16:07
tybolltMohammadAG: s/canada/flasher/?16:07
MohammadAGand how did you deduce it's because of the update?16:07
zogg_laptoptybollt, dnot nice16:07
ghostcubethe same happened for 1.1.116:07
MohammadAGhardware defect then16:07
ghostcubebut there i could change the card at amazon16:07
ghostcubenope new card guy16:07
zogg_laptopghostcube, yu should call ghostbusters16:08
MohammadAGN900 hw defect...16:08
tybolltzogg_laptop: You from .ca? :)16:08
ghostcubenope n900 works fine16:08
zogg_laptoptybollt, thank's g-d no16:08
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MohammadAGghostcube, no one had your problem16:08
KMFDMha i found the failed download by searching for rx5116:08
ghostcubethtas incorrect16:08
KMFDMit was in G:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Nokia\Nokia Service Layer\A\nsl_service_module_00001\vpls\\Products\rx-5116:08
zogg_laptoptybollt, same place as MohammadAG, different country =))16:08
KMFDMdeleting the failed download did indeed fix the issue16:09
KMFDMmy phone is upgrading16:09
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ghostcubeDocScrutinizer: ping16:09
MohammadAGNSU is kinda... stupidj16:09
zogg_laptopKMFDM, format c: and than get ubuntu live cd16:09
wazdhello people :)16:09
wazdStskeeps: around? :)16:09
ghostcubeMohammadAG: btw there is an announce on the flöasher page for this what happened to me16:09
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, how would he burn the disc w/o windows?16:09
zogg_laptopwazd 'uuuuup?16:09
ghostcubetake out sd card !16:09
wazdzogg: o/16:09
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, with laser eyes16:09
zogg_laptopwazd, so let's make habrapp for maemo =)16:10
MohammadAGghostcube, i've never had problems with my SD card in while updating16:10
MohammadAGor flashing16:10
ghostcubeiam not the only one.. so something must be a problem16:10
zogg_laptopi don't have sd card16:10
MohammadAGand I've flashed more than 35 times now16:10
KMFDMzogg_laptop, i also run ubuntu on this computer, but NSU is easier16:10
zogg_laptopKMFDM, flash took 3 mins16:11
zogg_laptopevn less16:11
wazdzogg: I thought they have pretty pathetic API16:11
zogg_laptopno windows anywhere16:11
wazdzogg: no commenting and stuff16:11
zogg_laptopwazd, highlight here, desktop in other room would be pissed off if it knows i'm using laptop16:11
zogg_laptopwazd, it was joke, just can't stand it anymore, al these droid news all over it, damn habrahabr16:12
zogg_laptopwazd r u from ua or ru?16:12
wazdzogg_laptop: moscow :)16:13
* pupnik hopes he never has to reboot16:13
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zogg_laptop2d ui for n900?16:15
zogg_laptopor maybe not =)16:15
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hrwzogg_laptop: it is more for 1024x600+ resolutions16:17
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MohammadAGhrw, nope, should work on the N90016:21
threshdoh metromap is painfully slow16:22
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hrwMohammadAG: I know that it can work. I saw it on 800x480 screen already16:23
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fiferboyftrvxmtrx: Hi16:27
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, hi16:27
fiferboyDid I fix all the tabs in my patch?16:28
ftrvxmtrxno, but I fixed them in git rebase -i :)16:28
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fiferboyOops.  I really should have changed that in VIM before starting on the code16:29
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ftrvxmtrxbtw, help message box doesn't rotate even if created with parent set16:30
ftrvxmtrxI think it's because the string is too long16:30
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fiferboyHmm, it worked for me.  Both with the win message and lose message16:30
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fiferboyIn English, that is.16:30
tybolltoh that is just lovely16:31
tybolltyou can "merge" contacts on your mobile16:31
ftrvxmtrxyes, this box work fine, but another one, which shows help message, doesn't16:31
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: You could change it to a QMaemo5InformationBox and see if that works in portrait and landscape16:31
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fiferboyAh, the help message one.  I didn't look at that.16:31
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, yep, QMaemo5InformationBox rotates as it should, but it doesn't show whole string, only part of it16:32
ftrvxmtrxI will investigate it later16:32
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MohammadAGtybollt, watch your fscking language16:35
MohammadAGwe have kids in here *points at noobmonk3y*16:35
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tybolltMohammadAG: :-( I am crying now16:38
tybolltMohammadAG: kplzthks?!16:38
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zogg_laptoptybollt, that makes me feel good16:38
MohammadAGtybollt, lies16:38
zogg_laptopat least someone feels terrible as me16:38
tybolltzogg_laptop: what's up?16:38
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, stfu, you don't understand the meaning of life16:38
zogg_laptoptybollt, terrible, everything is terrible16:39
* tybollt tried leveling w/ mohammad - or else he'd throw frals at me... :P16:39
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MohammadAGthere is no life, we're all in one huge matrix16:39
tybolltzogg_laptop: why what happened?16:39
* MohammadAG nontheless throws frals at tybollt 16:39
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MohammadAGin all seriousness, zogg_laptop what's wrong?16:40
zogg_laptoptybollt, exams, army, some shit i need to do, driver test failure, work, don't have time to finish something(so wouldn't get 1k$)16:40
tybolltzogg_laptop: :-/ Army? Where you at?16:40
MohammadAGdriver test failure, I'm not surprised, a friend got it @ 6th try16:40
MohammadAGIL sucks :)16:40
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, i have reserve army at the time of the exams of colledge16:40
tybolltah IL16:40
tybolltgeneral draft in IL is pretty menacing16:41
tybolltfrom what I heard you can't easily get out of the draft in .il by faking madness or faking gayness or such?16:41
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, aren't you 27-ish?16:41
zogg_laptopMohamemadAG, it was fine first 3 times (they just need one not to pass) b, but this time it was really my mistake16:41
zogg_laptopoh and i need to find new appartment and don't have time and money to move there16:41
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, 24 this month16:42
MohammadAGoh that life, nope i'm still 16 :/16:42
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, stay like that16:42
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, doesn't the army crap finish @ 20?16:42
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, are you going t army? i suppose ....16:42
MohammadAGwell, forced army, or w/e it's called16:42
MohammadAGnot that i know of16:42
MohammadAGdon't have an IL passport16:43
MohammadAGso I'll stay as an amateur terrorist for the time16:43
zogg_laptopthe situation between our nation sucks16:43
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: Patch sent :)16:43
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, haha =)16:43
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, get a match and throw it at the local nuke armory16:43
tybollt7nick mossad16:43
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, i would joke, but probably mossad are watching us, and they wouldn't understand =)16:44
MohammadAGthere are logs, and they're public16:44
MohammadAG(hi mossad) :)16:44
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MohammadAGzogg_laptop, scratch that idea, i wouldn't see PR1.316:45 ~ cat maemo.log |grep terrorist |grep Mohammad16:45
pupniki wonder what the problem with fbcon and pr1.2 is16:45
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, i'll bring it to you to the prison ... in my arse16:45
ghostcubegrml pokerth is devel grml16:45
pupnikpokerth is what16:46
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, there wouldn't be a prison if you match the armory16:46
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zogg_laptoplike that watch from pulp fiction16:46
ghostcubein extras devel16:46
MohammadAGpupnik, what problem?16:46
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, anyway u don't miss anything16:46
MohammadAGpupnik, fbcon works here - with about 3 reboots16:46
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, so it's not like cod eh?16:46
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, but do you have green or whatever colour ID?16:46
MohammadAGnope, blue16:46
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MohammadAGbut i don't have the passport16:47
pupnikwhose kernel MohammadAG16:47
MohammadAGpupnik, my own kernel16:47
MohammadAGpupnik, it crashes a couple of times, but then it boots16:47
ghostcubeis pokerth not ready for normal extras-testing?16:47
pupnikk, did you have to patch fbcon module?16:47
MohammadAGand that's been happening since 1.116:47
ghostcubei never had any problem with it :)16:47
MohammadAGpupnik, I just enabled it in the .config file16:48
MohammadAGi don't do modules - yet16:48
pupnikokay ty16:48
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, you don't need passport - if you have blue you are citizen16:48
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MohammadAGzogg_laptop, so... should i say "oh crap" anytime soon?16:48
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, afaik you don't force arabs to join the army16:49
zogg_laptopi'm not sure if u have to serve anyway16:49
MohammadAGno idea, but i highly doubt it16:49
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, tapping 'Help' button while in portrait mode makes whole screen rotate to landscape and then it shows the message box :(16:49
MohammadAGftrvxmtrx, where?16:50
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ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, and doesn't rotate back to portrait when closed16:50
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: Really?  It works for me with the new patch16:50
ftrvxmtrxwow, that's strange16:50
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, i know you don't like each other but i served with some druzim in army16:50
fiferboyIt shows the help message in portrait when in portrait with proper line wrapping16:50
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MohammadAGzogg_laptop, tbh I'm not that into politics and all, I don't mind israelis in here, as long as it's stable16:51
MohammadAGby the looks of it, it is right now16:51
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, it wouldn't be stable. the tops want money and power. and we — common people suffer16:51
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, right now it is (:16:52
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: If I show the help message while in landscape and then rotate to portrait, the message box and application rotate too16:52
fiferboyAnd vice versa16:52
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ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, and if you show it while in portrait?16:53
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: It shows fine portrait and will rotate to landscape if I turn the device16:53
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, if i was you i would go to Saudi and marry some rich guy's daughter, even 20 =)16:53
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, interesting idea :P16:53
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zogg_laptopftrvxmtrx, fiferboy , what are you talking about?16:54
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fiferboyzogg_laptop: colorflood16:54
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zogg_laptopsay what16:54
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FIQcan i customize the toolbar in the browser?16:54
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, ok, I'll apply the patch16:55
supertrampmaemo 1.2 update complete ruined my n900 :)16:55
supertrampperfect job16:55
FIQor in other place?16:55
ruskiehmm recaller stopped working with pr1.216:55
FIQnot mine. :)16:55
zogg_laptopamericans are so... americans, i have colour marked as mistake while color is alright. damn you x-chat16:55
FIQwould be useful16:55
* MohammadAG wonders if PR1.2 broke more apps than it fixed :)16:55
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FauxFauxStop it stop it stop it.16:55
* FauxFaux is simply too lazy to update. :p16:55
zogg_laptopruskie, it started for me, at least it sends some notify while calling16:55
ruskiezogg_laptop, hmm didn't happen for me16:56
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zogg_laptopftrvxmtrx, what patch are you talking about?16:56
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zogg_laptopruskie, i didn;t even known of this app before16:56
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ftrvxmtrxzogg_laptop, the patch fiferboy sent me to fix help message box rotation issue16:57
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zogg_laptopwhat box. i didn't get where is this help msg?16:58
zogg_laptopandrei_, privet andrei, kak dela? =))16:58
the_lordHi! does anybody here knows if it's true that skype has video call in pr 1.216:58
threshговорите по-русски уже, транслит не нужен16:58
SWFu64Yes it does16:59
ftrvxmtrxyep, it's true16:59
SWFu64I've not tried it out yet though16:59
MohammadAGoh, new SDK update16:59
ftrvxmtrxтранслит makes our eyes bleed17:00
GAN900Yo, fiferboy.17:00
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: I'm fiferboy on github now if that helps anything17:00
fiferboyHi GAN90017:00
the_lordthresh, I tried calling and it didn't show me anything of video17:00
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threshthe_lord: cant help ya. never tried.17:00
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fiferboyGAN900: Are the Rays going to run away with the East?17:01
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GAN900fiferboy, probably17:01
GAN900fiferboy, although the offense is in a slump17:01
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GAN900and the Red Sox have the umps in their pocket17:03
GAN900I can't believe how fast they ejected Crawford.17:03
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fiferboyYanks and Red Sox always get the benefit of the calls17:04
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supertrampwhy I lost all my sms / contacts and calendar after the update? :)17:07
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Appiahyou did? good thing you made a backup first!17:08
supertrampwell ... no17:09
the_lordthresh, yes, it works17:09
supertrampok - let's see the calendardb :)17:10
supertrampall data are in it17:10
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, I've added you as a collaborator17:10
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: Thanks!17:10
ftrvxmtrxn/p :)17:10
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supertrampok - I see the problem now17:11
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supertramppermissions :)17:12
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GAN900fiferboy, I was at the game and it was clearly outside.17:12
GAN900fiferboy, Fox Trax said about 6 inches17:13
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fiferboyGAN900: Did you let them have whatfor?17:13
GAN900fiferboy, and that was only one call of at least a dozen.17:13
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GAN900fiferboy, Madden got out there and gave him hell17:13
GAN900Half the stadium booed nearly every strike call after that.17:13
GAN900Other half were Red Sox fans of course. :rolleyes:17:14
fiferboyGAN900: What's attendance like these days?17:14
GAN900fiferboy, better than usual17:14
GAN900Averaging around 20k, I think.17:14
rm_youso my device started reboot-looping at the loading dots right after the nokia hands like a week ago....17:15
GAN900But the Northerners still insist we don't deserve a team.17:15
GAN900rm_you, and you haven't flashed it?17:15
rm_youi figured i'd wait and just reflash when PR1.2 came out17:15
rm_youso i did, and it has17:15
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rm_youbut it's not entering flash mode, it just flashes the usb icon and continues to the dots and the reboot loop T_T17:15
rm_yousupposed to just hold down the "u" key, right?17:16
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oscillikfrals: you should be a Nokia employee for making MMS work on my N90017:18
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oscillikthank you17:18
plastunafter installation my app it not appears in menu. What the matter?17:18
fralsthank you ;)17:18
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MohammadAG.desktop files aren't autocreated17:19
GAN900oscillik, don't say that.17:19
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GAN900They he'd have specs to follow, it would only be released for Harmattan and we'd never hear from him again. ;)17:20
CorsacGAN900: any intent to integrate fmms in contacts? (not sure if it's possible though)17:20
MohammadAGGAN900, why? I wouldn't mind a trout in future Nokia phone boxes17:20
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GAN900Corsac, apparently the plugin interface sucks.17:20
fralsMohammadAG: be careful what you wish for :D17:20
* oscillik is confused17:20
rm_youI'm holding down the "u" key as hard as I can, no luck. <_<17:21
GAN900rm_you, unplug USB, pop battery, replace battery, hold u, plug in USB.17:21
mortalwhich maemo phones are out there?17:21
rm_youdone it about 10 times, doing it again for funsies17:22
GAN900rm_you, odd.17:22
MohammadAGrm_you, or unplug USB, remove the battery, connect the USB, execute the command and connect the battery17:22
MohammadAGsome OSs like to be bi***y17:22
GAN900rm_you, sure there's nothing wrong with your cable, your keyboard or your fingers?17:22
lcukrm_you, remove battery, connect usb cable, start flasher, when it says "no device detected", put battery in17:22
lcukno key presses and works :)17:22
MohammadAGor bacon in my N950 package :P17:22
fiferboyftrvxmtrx: Latest git works perfectly for me17:24
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rm_younope, does the same thing17:26
MohammadAGandre___, what's with the keywords? :)17:26
andre___MohammadAG, hmm?17:26
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andre___MohammadAG, "moreinfo": workaround waiting for new Bugzilla version that introduces "NEEDINFO" state17:27
MohammadAGandre___, "moreinfo"17:27
rm_youcomputer says "detected usb device" in the taskbar, flickers a bit (the n900 has the usb icon in the corner for right around 1 second) then the beeping that means "usb device connected" followed by "usb device disconnected" happens a little bit, and the device continues to try to boot, but reboots during the dots17:27
andre___MohammadAG, only used "against" the reporter17:27
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rm_youis there a way besides holding "u" to force a flash? because it doesn't seem to be forcing anything17:28
rm_youor to force-reset / wipe the device?17:28
rm_youdo I need to have a SIM or a microSD in the n900?17:28
MohammadAGandre___, oh, I see17:28
lcukrm_you, try alternative usb port/computer potentially something is screwing your usb stack17:28
rm_youtried two computers so far17:29
lcukeither that or your battery may be rlyrlyrly flat17:29
rm_youtried two batteries17:29
MohammadAGtry a proper OS :)17:29
rm_youwill attempt to charge them both again in n810 and then try again17:29
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MohammadAGrm_you, try using a linux live cd17:30
MohammadAGDSL aka Damn Small Linux is... damn small :)17:30
ftrvxmtrxfiferboy, great, maybe I should promote it then17:30
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fiferboyftrvxmtrx: I'd go for it17:32
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, haha loser you have n950, i have n950i17:32
MohammadAGNokia-NXX:~# uname17:34
MohammadAGMac OS X17:34
rm_youaha, so i left it doing that little loop on my laptop on the other side of the room just now while i scoured forums for answers17:34
MohammadAGwho's the loser now :)17:34
rm_youthe beeping stopped so i went to look.... it started taking the flash after about the 40th reboot17:35
rm_youwatched it finish flashing...17:35
rm_younow i try to turn it on and it turns off after the dots17:35
rm_youso, basically the same as before >_<17:35
GAN900rm_you, low batt?17:35
rm_youattempting to charge the battery again in the n81017:35
rm_youas when i plug the n900 into power, it attemps to turn on, then reboot-loops17:36
rm_youinstead of charging17:36
zogg_laptopNokia-N950:~ uname17:37
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, you are17:37
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, fake!!!!11!17:37
zogg_laptoprm_you, give it a time17:37
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zogg_laptoprm_you, sometimes the screen goes off for me while turning on instead of dots17:38
zogg_laptopand after flash turning on takes a while17:38
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rm_youthis is what happens when i plug it into power when it is off.17:39
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rm_youone second delay. NOKIA in blue letters on white. the loading dots for about two to three seconds, they are moving as normal. screen dims. still see dots, but they are frozen, lasts for two to three seconds. screen goes entire dark. goto beginning and repeat.17:40
zogg_laptopMohammadAG, my cosmorabbit sends you huge17:40
rm_yousorry no, dots are still moving while screen is dim, continue moving until reboot17:41
mortaldoes the n900 have many known hardware bugs or severe software limitations? how usable is it currently?17:43
SpeedEvilmortal: It is rather slow.17:43
SpeedEvilmortal: It takes around 3 hours to compile a kernel.17:43
zogg_laptopmortal, don't buy it17:43
SpeedEvilThough the UI is surprisingly responsive during this.17:43
mortaleh, 3 hours17:43
mortalthat is fast17:44
zogg_laptopand it makes coffee17:44
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mortalI am using n810 + e90 combo atm17:44
mortalthe only thing I lack is the 900 MHz 3g17:44
zogg_laptopwait for meego device17:44
SpeedEvilmortal: The biggest hardware issue I have is that teh cheap bastards only included one stylus.17:44
zogg_laptop900mhz is overclocking17:44
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SpeedEvilerr - no17:45
SpeedEvil900MHz is also a cellular band17:45
jaska2100MHz 3g must be real bad overclocking then17:45
ghostcubehmmm, i just noticed the kayboard has no & sign i mean the hw keyboard17:45
Shapeshifterbiggest hardware issue is emmc IO17:45
zogg_laptop900mhz is aso frequency17:45
SpeedEvilghostcube: Mine does - blue-k17:46
ghostcubehmm, am i so blind today17:46
timeless_mbpTrizt, et al: help17:46
zogg_laptopghostcube, you can change other leeter for it17:46
zogg_laptopmine have it17:46
GAN900timeless_mbp, there any way to make that clickable with strings?17:47
zogg_laptopwhat i miss is | and —17:47
jaskai replaced euro and sterling with | and & etc, then added <> {} () ` % as shift-fn combos17:47
timeless_mbpGAN900: not afaict17:47
ZuccaIs there a way to start terminal (in Maemo 5) in ISO locale?17:47
SpeedEvil? is shift-:17:47
BCMMSpeedEvil: where is that a cellular band?17:47
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ghostcubehmm i only have the & in terminal with fn and sym key :)17:47
SpeedEvilBCMM: here - though it's not 3G17:47
jaskaoops, not () but []17:47
ghostcubeyeah the pipe is a missing one too17:47
timeless_mbpGAN900: the word wrapping of the url was also helpful17:47
zogg_laptopат фты ынь лун вщтэе цщкл ащк ьу17:47
timeless_mbpfwiw the missing space after the period near the bottom is my fault17:47
timeless_mbpi'll fix that17:48
timeless_mbpcould i get a shorter url?17:48
timeless_mbpnote that afaict, i can't even make the url selectable17:48
zogg_laptopfn+sym doesn't work for me at all17:48
timeless_mbpwhich means people will have to hand retype it ! :(17:48
ghostcubeis there any way to get back the old software keyboard17:48
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SpeedEvilzogg: It's stupid17:48
timeless_mbpi claim it's still better than what is normally presented17:48
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MohammadAGMight check on that soon17:48
MohammadAGi want the old menu back17:48
timeless_mbpi might be able to buy some space by changing 'Open backup' to 'Backup'17:49
jaskaalso longpress is kinda wacky when you do press shift and then longpress a key :) atleast in terminal17:49
dotblankhmm video call over javver says there is mismatched video codecs..17:49
ghostcubei want the old keyboard back btw the old menu was cool too17:49
timeless_mbpbut that's kinda stupid :(17:49
dotblankwhat codec does the n900 use for video call?17:49
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ghostcubefull ack MohammadAG17:49
SpeedEvilzogg: You need to press and hold blue, press function, release function, release blue17:49
SpeedEvilzogg: any other combination doesn't work17:49
ghostcubeyeah i have my pokerth back (yeah)17:50
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ghostcubewth apt-get update && apt-get upgrade arent working17:51
zogg_laptopSpeedEvil, what is stupid? i think it worked before i updated (pr1.1.1) i even don't remember what it did. after that it's nt working17:51
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plastundoes anybody install MeeGo to N900?17:51
ghostcubeyou cant combine commands by && in busybox?17:51
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, try hildon-im-recache as root17:51
MohammadAGghostcube, you can17:51
SpeedEvilzogg: at least for me - the other way round - press symbol - hold symbol - press blue - release blue - does not work.17:51
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SpeedEvilzogg: nor does pressing them at the same time17:51
* timeless_mbp looks for other people who could offer help17:52
ghostcubeMohammadAG: hmmm my apt-get doesnt like it here ;(17:52
SpeedEvilIs everyone else not seeing this - or is it just me / my hardware?17:52
zogg_laptopSpeedEvil, all blue keys are working except Sym17:52
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zogg_laptopwhat does it do?17:52
SpeedEvilzogg: this is to start the symbol overlay17:52
ghostcubeif you open an terminal and do fn+sym it should bring up a special sign table17:53
SpeedEvilzogg: of the hardware keyboard17:53
timeless_mbpzogg_laptop: does sym-eur give you a PIPE instead of a EUR?17:53
jaskapress fn, release fn, press sym, release sym works for me17:53
zogg_laptoptimeless_mbp, yes17:53
SpeedEvilghostcube: Oh - that works too17:53
timeless_mbpZogG: you have some keyboard layout installed, e.g. hebrew17:53
BCMMhas anybody benchmarked the various browsers available for Maemo?17:53
SpeedEviljaska: I mean17:53
timeless_mbpwhich breaks that stuff17:53
BCMM(and is it possible to change the default?)17:53
dotblankugh takes like 20 mins to install extra decoders17:54
ghostcubeanyone can confirm that apt-get update && apt-get upgrade dont work if you work in rootshell o.O17:54
TomaszDdon't fret, I'm preparing a new version dotblank17:54
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TomaszDbut it does pull in many deps17:54
dotblankTomaszD, :)17:54
jaskanow i need to refiddle with the layout to get 4 arrows while keeping the a and o umlauts17:55
TomaszDshould be a bit faster to install17:55
mortalcould it be possible to use the e90 keyboard as a bluetooth keyboard for an n80017:55
SpeedEvilmortal: I've really not found the n900 keyb bad.17:56
dotblankDoes video calling require extra decoders/17:56
SpeedEvilmortal: My laptop died for a week. I got up to ~30wpm17:56
nidOhe said n80017:56
nidOand the e90's keyboard blows the n900's away anyway :p17:56
jaskai liked my jornada 720s kbd :|17:58
zogg_laptop i went to uninstall the hebrew keyboard and it says - no apps installed17:58
timeless_mbpzogg_laptop: is it wrong?17:59
zogg_laptopre-opened appmanager solved it17:59
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dotblankcan anyone test video calling with me. just put pr 1.2 on18:02
rm_youwould if i could get my phone to boot18:03
BCMMdotblank: skype really needs a video version of echo12318:03
rm_youi thought they had one18:03
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dotblankBCMM, Skype test call works with video?18:04
BCMMdotblank: no, but it should18:04
dotblankah.. im getting abunch of cedec mismatch errors.. with video calling18:04
dotblankover gtalk18:04
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MohammadAG<BCMM> dotblank: skype really needs a video version of echo123 indeed18:07
timeless_mbpGAN900: right, so do we have a wiki page/18:07
MohammadAG<zogg_laptop>  i went to uninstall the hebrew keyboard and it says - no apps installed18:08
MohammadAGopen app manager and type killall apt-worker as root, you'll get the same effect :)18:08
rm_youcharged battery seems to have the same effect... noted that when it is not plugged in, it just immediately turns off during the moving dots.18:09
rm_youis my n900 just fucked again?18:09
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rm_youseriously doubt quim is going to send me ANOTHER one <_<18:09
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Aranelwhats the difference between USA and Global release?18:11
luke-jrI think it's more like USA vs UK vs Finland vs ...18:11
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luke-jrvaried keyboards or such18:12
MohammadAGnope, keyboards are the same18:12
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zogg_laptopMohammadAG, nope, they are not18:16
zogg_laptoprussian keyboard is different18:16
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zogg_laptopbuttons are placed different18:16
MohammadAGzogg_laptop, the fw has the same files afaik, it's determined by something else18:17
GAN900timeless_mbp, for?18:17
MohammadAGjust like the FMTX18:17
threshlong live the author of gps data logger widget.18:18
E0xso know i can try the nokia qt sdk just fine , i mean test the app create on it in the n900 without do anything special ?18:19
threshand, of course, curse nokia for stupid ovi maps.18:19
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rm_youalright well, I booted up my other (broken USB) n900 with this battery, it starts up fine and reports well over half battery left. in my "not broken" (at least, physically) n900, it is still just immediately turning off after the NOKIA text and three seconds of the loading dots. T_T18:20
E0xhmm i was using mapper in pr1.1 and was very fine , why is not yet in extra ?18:20
timeless_mbpGAN900: sorry, which question18:20
E0xsome bugs ?18:20
timeless_mbpGAN900: a) is there a wiki url explaining to people how to deal w/ OTA failure18:21
rm_youtimeless_mbp: i may have to ask Quim whether he feels like shipping me ANOTHER n900. this time i'll ship him TWO broken ones back! <_<18:21
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MohammadAGrm_you, it could be your fault you know :)18:23
MohammadAGI'm still on 1 N90018:23
rm_youlol i did nothing this time :P18:23
timeless_mbpMohammadAG: i'm on n900s 4 and 518:23
MohammadAGthen how did it brick18:23
rm_younot that i did anything last time either, besides normal plugging and unplugging of USB18:23
MohammadAGtimeless_mbp, what happened to 1 2 and 3?18:23
rm_youi was listening to pandora one day and it just turned off18:23
rm_youand since then it won't turn on18:23
MohammadAGbad luck18:24
rm_youwhich was about two weeks after Quim sent it to me <_<18:24
MohammadAGthe very definition of it18:24
timeless_mbpMohammadAG: one of them was dropped and had a bad encounter with a tile floor18:24
rm_youI'm just glad I hadn't actually BOUGHT one18:24
timeless_mbpone of them decided that charging wasn't important18:24
timeless_mbpone's on permanent loan to an end user18:24
timeless_mbp(and despite him trying to drown it, it's doing quite well)18:24
rm_youthe failure rate seems to be like... 75%18:24
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rm_youthen again, people with problems are louder than people without18:25
rm_youso it must not be THAT bad... it must just coincidentally happen repeatedly to people I know :P18:25
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timeless_mbpGAN900: so, i'm considering taking
RurouniJonesHmm, how do you switch input with mscim on the N900?18:26
RurouniJonesI accidentally did it but then it switched back18:26
RurouniJonesAnd I cannot find the key combo to enable the Japanese input again18:26
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MohammadAGctrl space18:26
RurouniJonesNuts, thta is what I thought, tried that and it didn't work18:27
GAN900timeless_mbp, I think there's already a page18:27
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RurouniJonesAnd now it worked again, cheers MohammadAG, think I need to do some more experimentation18:27
timeless_mbpGAN900: there's
timeless_mbpbut it's too long to make someone type!18:28
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RurouniJonesWooo! Jagged alliance 2 on the N900? Fantabulous18:29
* RurouniJones goes and diggs out CD18:30
supertrampcannot remember when I had thigs soooooo screwed up18:30
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RinsmasterI have 120MB free in /home, but the application manager is complaining about free application space.. Also apt-get works fine.. :/18:31
MohammadAGwhat about /?18:31
MohammadAGand MyDocs18:31
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RinsmasterMohammadAG, 60MB free in / and 4GB free in MyDocs, which all should be enough, especially for a 200kb app -.-18:32
RinsmasterIt happened while restoring applications from my backup ( I just flashed to PR1.2)18:32
MohammadAGRinsmaster, what do the logs say?18:32
RinsmasterI'll check them out, good idea18:33
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tripzeroso uh... OTA should work if you have the free space?18:34
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zogg_laptopoh, i know the secret18:34
SpeedEvilErr - my store does not apparantly contain 'new Ovi Store content like 3D Rollercoaster, QuickPanorama Pro, Angry  Birds Level Pack, Sygic Mobile Maps and more. '18:34
SpeedEvilDoes anyone elses?18:34
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zogg_laptopSpeedEvil, that's what was my secret18:35
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zogg_laptopthe new ovi store...18:35
zogg_laptopwait for it18:35
zogg_laptop... is old one \o/18:35
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