IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2010-05-26

Dima202	and done im @ 1.2 woot	00:00
wollop	then came to this way	00:00
ManoftheSea	thunderfest: wouldn't that be the computer half of it?	00:00
InstantGoogle	huh	00:00
thunderfest	more or less...a slightly less powerful computer	00:00
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frals	InstantGoogle: hmm, probably not... :p	00:01
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frals	dont have the device with the code on here and cba to checkout teh code again on the phone i have here :(	00:02
GAN900	Is the PR1.2 distro up for Extras-devel yet?	00:02
X-Fade	GAN900: No, it is just fremantle.	00:02
SpeedEvil	A while back lcuk alluded to installing build essentials on the device from the sdk repo. Apparantly I'm too stupid to work this out - I've spent some time with google - and not foind anything helpgul.	00:02
SpeedEvil	Pointers?	00:02
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anotnac	lol gerbick is worlds worst complainer hes making lot of noise on t.m.o about no official meego on n900 yet he dont own a n900, hes trolling is becoming like orangebox recently so bored of reading is shit	00:04
MohammadAG	frals, diff it against the new one then, it's a pain to do it manually :)	00:04
MohammadAG	I got lost, it seems he changed the buttons = part	00:04
frals	i changed it there because i could stand having 170 lines when it could be done in ~20	00:05
frals	hmm	00:05
frals	that diff got weird	00:05
DocScrutinizer51	anotnac: request ban	00:05
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GAN900	anotnac, he's always been a troll.	00:06
Dima202	after installing emmc vanilla thing at boot the top sidebar is purple and characters are different kinds of square and rectrangle shapes?	00:06
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, the mod would be reported	00:06
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ToJa92	[Dima202]: Tried rebooting?	00:06
Dima202	uhuh	00:06
anotnac	i would'nt go that far is a long term member but hes becoming so destructive in every thread he posts he needs a warning	00:07
Dima202	i re-flashed the new firmware again and all is fine	00:07
Dima202	i can access my sd card just fine, so do i need to flash emmc again?	00:07
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ToJa92	well to flash eMMC you need to first flash the fiasco image and then flash eMMC without reboot	00:08
ToJa92	read this http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Flashing_the_eMMC_in_the_N900	00:08
Dima202	but it reboots automatically	00:08
DocScrutinizer51	Dima202: eMMC flash always needs to go hand in hand with flashing rootfs	00:08
ToJa92	yeah you're supposed to remove the -R parameter at the end	00:08
DocScrutinizer51	Dima202: remove -R	00:08
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: emmc == /home?	00:09
Dima202	ooh got ya	00:09
Dima202	ok thanks	00:09
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: there isn't anything important there	00:09
Dima202	but pr 1.2 is faster from the 2 minutes i've ran it :)	00:09
DocScrutinizer51	jacekowski: home is on emmc, yes	00:09
puzzled	DocScrutinizer: contrary to what most docs say. I've seen a ton of docs that said flash image -R and then the eMMC with -R	00:09
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jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: well, so when n900 comes out of factory emmc is empty	00:10
DocScrutinizer51	puzzled: which is wrong	00:10
DocScrutinizer51	jacekowski: nonsense	00:10
puzzled	I omitted the -R during flashing of the image as told in the wiki section with the big "I" and it worked fine	00:10
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: what's on there	00:10
tybollt_	ok	00:10
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jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: just basic directory structure	00:10
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer51: some apps	00:11
tybollt_	so I do see the device connected in window device manager	00:11
tybollt_	the device is there	00:11
tybollt_	yet still the flasher will not find it	00:11
tybollt_	fucked up	00:11
phellarv	Blargh wmo is sloooow	00:11
tybollt_	google (TMO) has -> "I basically plugge/unpluggde my cable ERANGE time and WFM!111	00:11
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DocScrutinizer51	jacekowski: mine had a few videos and whatnot	00:12
ToJa92	[tybollt_]: What OS do you use?	00:12
Arkenoi	so how much free root space required for OTA?	00:13
tybollt_	d'oh	00:13
DocScrutinizer51	jacekowski: nota bene emmc >> $HOME	00:13
tybollt_	"It appears that Windows 7 64 bit doesn't handle USB in the same manner, and"	00:13
tybollt_	fuck me	00:13
tybollt_	I've 64bit windows	00:13
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DocScrutinizer51	tybollt_: when device manager noticed N900 you already are busted	00:14
jaem	'afternoon	00:15
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tybollt_	DocScrutinizer51: fair enough	00:15
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jaem	(Linux) flasher-3.5 is giving me "No such file or directory" when run on a 64-bit distro (yeah, I know... 64-bit... :/). The permissions are fine - what am I missing?	00:16
thresh	32bit libc	00:16
jaem	thresh, aha! Thanks.	00:16
jaem	Heh... I'm used to Arch, where it just nicely installs 32-bit stuff for you... silly *buntu doesn't	00:17
jaem	...that wasn't criticism - just grumbling.	00:17
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thresh	biarch is bad mmkay	00:18
DocScrutinizer51	fsck ubuntu	00:18
jaem	thresh, well, it is if you can avoid it, but sometimes you can't.	00:18
thresh	true	00:18
Dima202	oh crap my backups are gone	00:18
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jaem	I just liked distros that handle it nicely when needed, rather than having to force-install it.	00:18
cure`	wow dennis fong is in here	00:18
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jaem	cure`, ?	00:18
thresh	he's Thresh	00:19
* satmd wants a pure 64bit os, without 32bit legacy		00:19
MohammadAG	Why oh why does PSM ruin ssh	00:19
satmd	so people have different targets	00:19
satmd	and once you know it does /does not install everything, you can at least fix it	00:19
thresh	and yeah I kinda admired the guy	00:19
cure`	:P	00:19
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GAN900	I love the sticky arrow keys in MicroB	00:21
GAN900	"Guess how much we'll scroll this time."	00:21
lardman\|home	GAN900: any improvements to Maps?	00:21
jaem	GAN900, I give up. How much?	00:21
jaem	Or was that a joke?	00:22
jaem	:P	00:22
GAN900	lardman\|home, it's slower.	00:22
lardman\|home	lol	00:22
GAN900	jaem, you can never tell	00:22
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GAN900	sometimes it's none, sometimes it sticks	00:22
* javispedro failed to notice those sticky keys		00:23
MohammadAG	so, I'm without a hildon-desktop, and the N900 appears to have put Wi-Fi to sleep	00:23
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MohammadAG	any way to wake it up?	00:23
Dima202	Is PR 1.2 still using hidden direcotries for My Documents etc..? didn't check before restoring from backup	00:24
javispedro	what kind of sleep?	00:24
javispedro	Dima202: that will never change	00:24
MohammadAG	javispedro, PSM	00:24
MohammadAG	ssh doesn't respond	00:24
javispedro	MohammadAG: PSM is independent of hildon-desktop	00:24
GAN900	Dima202, of course.	00:24
MohammadAG	javispedro, I know, but I have no way of waking up ssh	00:24
GAN900	Dima202, i18n	00:24
* ptl will NOT upgrade to PR1.2 just to be a rebel		00:24
MohammadAG	err	00:24
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: page-up (shift-space), home and end are missing	00:24
javispedro	MohammadAG: PSM shouldn't cause it not to respond O.o	00:24
MohammadAG	javispedro, well it is...	00:24
MohammadAG	and it always does	00:24
MohammadAG	unless I'm online	00:24
javispedro	broken router	00:25
ZogG	ptl port symbian 40 to n900	00:25
MohammadAG	I wouldn't be surprised...	00:25
GAN900	DocScrutinizer, try the arrows.	00:25
MohammadAG	ZogG, there's been one limitation on symbian devices	00:25
MohammadAG	the screen res	00:25
MohammadAG	no symbian devices scales up the old S60v3 except the E90	00:25
ZogG	it's ok	00:25
ZogG	the screen is smaller	00:25
ptl	ZogG: Symbian S40? No way, if there's a Symbian that's work porting, it's Symbian S90! (Nokia 7710)	00:25
ZogG	the resolution i mean	00:26
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ZogG	ptl win mobile FTW	00:26
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skynets	PR1.2 ftl	00:26
skynets	:D	00:26
Appiah	huh	00:26
Appiah	what now	00:26
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* MohammadAG wonders if dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest="com.nokia.osso_browser" --print-reply /com/nokia/osso_browser/request com.nokia.osso_browser.load_url string:"google.com" would wake it up		00:26
skynets	question for u guys	00:26
DocScrutinizer51	javispedro: you've noticed sarahn on hm-thread?.	00:27
* MohammadAG realizes there's no ssh to do that command		00:27
skynets	whats the falsher 3.5 command to fully erase the phone memory while reflashing with PR 1.2 final?	00:27
ZogG	i tottaly forgot to watch how i met your mother and big bang theory today =(	00:27
ZogG	all because of pr1.2	00:27
MohammadAG	skynets, you need the eMMC image	00:27
skynets	really?	00:27
javispedro	DocScrutinizer: done now.	00:28
skynets	so i get that and what's the command to reflash?	00:28
ZogG	skynets but be carefull	00:28
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MohammadAG	~flashing	00:28
infobot	hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	00:28
MohammadAG	~factinfo flashing	00:28
infobot	flashing -- created by GeneralAntilles <n=GeneralA@pdpc/supporter/active/generalantilles> at Tue Jul 1 17:47:33 2008 (693 days); last modified at Thu Nov 13 03:55:42 2008 by GAN800!n=ryan@pdpc/supporter/active/generalantilles; it has been requested 151 times, last by MohammadAG, 14s ago.	00:28
DocScrutinizer51	javispedro: you definitely should chat with him/her	00:28
ZogG	skynets, can briknk if you do it wrong - read the thread and wiki before	00:28
MohammadAG	151 times, 50 of which were today	00:28
jaem	thresh, I installed the ia32-libs package, and it's still bailing. I'd just flash it on Windows, but the Windows flasher makes me cry.	00:29
skynets	:S i have windows x64	00:29
ZogG	MohammadAG so how was fedora?	00:29
DocScrutinizer51	MohammadAG: the counters are BS	00:29
thresh	jaem: still the same error?	00:29
jaem	thresh, yes.	00:29
ZogG	i saw someone posted screnshots of netbook meego with xfce4	00:29
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ZogG	is it true?	00:29
MohammadAG	ZogG, I'm dumping it	00:29
DocScrutinizer51	MohammadAG: expect all of the 151 be of today	00:29
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, true	00:30
jaem	thresh, I've done this before, but I haven't used *buntu in ages.	00:30
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lardman\|home	Can anyone confirm whether the FIASCO images correctly flash pre-summit devices?	00:30
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lardman\|home	I guess it's about time to do some flashing	00:30
MohammadAG	not me	00:30
GAN900	lardman\|home, no.	00:30
MohammadAG	You need legacy images	00:30
lardman\|home	ah, in which case not time to do some flashing then	00:30
MohammadAG	whatever those are	00:30
user_	fuck you Nokia, fuck you to hell	00:30
ZogG	user_ цфеср еру дфтпгфпу	00:31
heffer	can someone tell me why i get all those "Missing Image" messages after flashing the latest eMMC image?	00:31
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, ping	00:31
javispedro	hello baron.	00:31
ZogG	watch the language	00:31
DocScrutinizer51	user_: fuckoff	00:31
thresh	jaem: are you sure there is /lib/libc.so.6 or whatever?	00:31
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, I recall that you wanted to ban him last week	00:31
MohammadAG	or at least kick him	00:31
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MohammadAG	a ban would be a lot for the nick user__ (since xchat uses it by default)	00:32
phellarv	irssi and /kickban	00:32
jaem	thresh, hmm, maybe this is my problem	00:32
ZogG	or punch him in the face	00:32
jaem	somehow both /lib and /lib64 contain 64-bit libc's :S	00:32
thresh	jaem: well, proper 32 bit libc should contain something like that	00:32
thresh	that is weird indeed.	00:32
Milhouse	were any bugs actually fixed in PR1.2? ffs! :(	00:33
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thunderfest	javispedro: can you help me get open gl es working again since the pr1.2 upgrade	00:33
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jaem	thresh, I'm trying an install --reinstall	00:33
javispedro	thunderfest: not really, as it will leave your local package db in a broken state and I don't want to be responsible for that..	00:34
ZogG	DocScrutinizer, maybe ip ban would be better?	00:34
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MohammadAG	ZogG, most users have dynamic IPs	00:34
* javispedro hides		00:34
GeneralAntilles	Milhouse, yes, there were also a lot of new bugs and regressions, though.	00:34
GeneralAntilles	Milhouse, MicroB can actually zoom somewhat usably now.	00:34
MohammadAG	it doesn't help, plus IP bans are controlled by IRcops, which would mean we need freenode staff to do it	00:34
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javispedro	apple-like font rendering!!!	00:35
tybollt_	zOMG javis	00:35
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tybollt_	zOMG!1111	00:35
Milhouse	GA: just going through basic bugs opened months ago, none seem to have been tackled. really depressing.	00:35
GeneralAntilles	Milhouse, yeah, Nokia sucks.	00:35
javispedro	months ago?	00:35
thunderfest	javispedro: Well I was in the middle of using your excellent library to build some apps	00:35
Milhouse	javidspedro: well, Dec 09	00:35
RST38h	hehehe	00:36
DocScrutinizer51	MohammadAG: nope I can do IP ban	00:36
DocScrutinizer51	just it's nonsense	00:36
RST38h	Milhouse: there are older bugs that have not been tackled	00:36
Milhouse	browser still fucking opens links at the same zoom level as the previous page - kraaaaap! ;)	00:36
* javispedro points to years old eduroam bug		00:36
ZogG	DocScrutinizer51 you can add some options to bot, autoban on certain phrase	00:36
jaem	Milhouse, gah	00:36
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MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, forgot freenode was cloak-less	00:36
tybollt_	awesome :D	00:36
jaem	javispedro, I thought the eduroam bug was (mostly) fixed	00:36
tybollt_	I installed "Global"	00:36
MohammadAG	our server sets mode +x on all users	00:36
Milhouse	RST38h - i'm sure there are, but i'm just going through some of the really simple cosmetic bugs that have been open since Maemo5 and they got no love.	00:37
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tybollt_	and now I've all boxes :)	00:37
DocScrutinizer51	got user_ IP fwiw	00:37
thresh	how?!	00:37
jaem	javispedro, if you're referring to TTLS-PAP support, that is	00:37
GAN900	Milhouse, no staff left	00:37
Milhouse	RST38h: Just kinda makes you wonder... "Why do I bother?" :)	00:37
javispedro	jaem: yes well they added the 30-line protocol support in the daemon, they didn't certificate it nor code the UI	00:37
dhd	is there any known problem with gstreamer not being able to find user-compiled plugins on diablo (or specifically the INdT vmware image?)	00:37
GAN900	Milhouse, they're all focused on the MeeGo we wont be getting.	00:37
Milhouse	GAN900: Yep, same old Nokia - when will they ever learn?	00:37
ZogG	DocScrutinizer51 just get his adress and punch him in the face	00:37
jaem	javispedro, blech. Okay, I see. But if I'm using pw auth, I can still set it up manually, right?	00:37
ZogG	address*	00:38
Milhouse	Seriously... we need our heads seeing to.	00:38
* RST38h does not know. He does not bother any more.		00:38
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DocScrutinizer51	Milhouse: that's a questionable feature indeed	00:38
GAN900	Milhouse, don't think they will	00:38
javispedro	jaem: "pw auth"? manually?	00:38
GAN900	Milhouse, as far as I can tell, MeeGo's no improvement	00:38
GAN900	They're just hypocrits now.	00:38
PhonicUK	hey all	00:38
SWFu	Anyone know when the monitor mode patches will be aplied to pr 1.2?	00:38
tybollt_	gan: improvement how?	00:38
PhonicUK	has anyone else noticed that they cant search in the app manager since PR 1.2?	00:39
SWFu	Missing having Kismet already	00:39
jaem	javispedro, as in, I use a password rather than a cert to authenticate, and I thought someone was saying that you could fiddle around in GConf to set it up.	00:39
jaem	PhonicUK, you can, just type	00:39
GAN900	tybollt_, openness, reliable device support, generally not abusing their customers and community.	00:39
thunderfest	javispedro: if I want to continue doing sdl + opengles development do you suggest I switch back to pr1.1 until the opengles-sgx-img-common 0.20091104.34+0m5 package conflicts are worked out	00:39
javispedro	jaem: yes, that's the only way you can use the new support in the daemon.	00:39
ZogG	it's so stupid that there browser opens in full screen and in portrait you can't even close page without going to landscape =(	00:39
PhonicUK	jaem, but what if I dont know the category?	00:39
jaem	PhonicUK, "All"?	00:39
thunderfest	Or what can I do to help speed this along?	00:39
PhonicUK	ah	00:39
javispedro	thunderfest: well, I'd would, but I know it's a pain.	00:39
PhonicUK	lol	00:39
Milhouse	GAN: Yep, and there's nothing we can do - just watch them die and pick up their P45s	00:39
PhonicUK	ok got it :)	00:39
PhonicUK	I didn't restore "rootsh" xD	00:40
jaem	javispedro, I agree that it's annoying as all get out that they didn't do it fully, but I'll be happy if it works at all.	00:40
javispedro	thunderfest: and hopefully since the bug's been filled we can hope for a fast response (wishful thinking)	00:40
jaem	...for now, anyway	00:40
Milhouse	"them die" being the company, of course	00:40
ZogG	it would be have tabs in microb like in fennec but instead of moving browser aside to use swipe out of screen like for mouse mode	00:40
PhonicUK	87MB on rootfs, much better	00:40
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PhonicUK	<3 PR 1.2	00:41
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PhonicUK	shame theres no proper landscape support yet	00:41
Milhouse	Yet?	00:41
MohammadAG	LOL What	00:41
tybollt_	GAN900: I agree	00:41
ZogG	thunderfest what conflict do you talk about?	00:41
MohammadAG	landscape is what we have	00:42
PhonicUK	eeeeh	00:42
* MohammadAG waits for the other DocScrutinizer to come back		00:42
PhonicUK	i meant portrait xD	00:42
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ZogG	and would never have it =)))	00:42
ptl	Does Ctrl-Shift-R still work?	00:42
thunderfest	javispedro: it does look like someone is working on it...that packages have changed since I first complained about it 10 or so hours ago	00:42
acidjazz	n900 update eh?	00:42
ZogG	PhonicUK, though you can turn it in some apps - but it's ugly (CTRL+SHIFT+R)	00:42
PhonicUK	cool	00:43
ZogG	ptl, yes, even in calendar	00:43
ZogG	but it's ugly	00:43
javispedro	thunderfest: so, as for now, just install whatever libgles1-sgx-img package you can get your hands on then ensure to remove it later	00:43
ptl	thanks, ZogG	00:43
ZogG	though conversation is readable	00:43
MohammadAG	contacts too	00:43
PhonicUK	aah thats much better	00:43
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MohammadAG	from what I see contacts should have portrait support	00:43
PhonicUK	does that enable it globaly?	00:43
PhonicUK	or is it per-application?	00:43
MohammadAG	it's a hildon-desktop switch	00:44
MohammadAG	so afaik it's global	00:44
ZogG	ptl, the problem that some programs just turn WM portrait but not content itself	00:44
PhonicUK	cool	00:44
MohammadAG	but it's annoying sometimes	00:44
ZogG	PhonicUK per app and you can turn it off	00:44
ptl	I know... lol	00:44
PhonicUK	it switches to landscape for the keyboard though :(	00:44
ZogG	MohammadAG, per app	00:44
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ZogG	afaik per app	00:44
cure`	fedora 13 and maemo 1.2 on the same day, and i use both fedora and maemo, what about that?	00:45
wolf^	yes, it's per app	00:45
cure`	should keep me busy for the weekend	00:45
PhonicUK	the file manager works :D	00:45
ZogG	cure`, both oses are not the best =)	00:45
MohammadAG	well how about that	00:45
cure`	nothing is the best	00:45
ZogG	photomanager also but it's ugly =(	00:45
ZogG	it's like pictures are one on the other	00:45
ZogG	cure` Plan9 FTW	00:46
PhonicUK	plan9 is a weird OS	00:46
thresh	if you're from outer space	00:46
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ZogG	~Plan9 is the best operation system in the world. comming to N900 soon.	00:46
infobot	...but plan9 is already something else...	00:46
ZogG	~plan9	00:46
infobot	well, plan9 is the plan9 operating systen from bell labs I will not be using Plan 9 in the creation of weapons of mass destruction to be used by nations other than the US. and http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/plan9dist/	00:46
PhonicUK	Plan9 from Bell Labs?	00:46
PhonicUK	lol	00:47
ZogG	~haiku	00:47
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infobot	here in this channel / we write very bad haiku / readers all go mad	00:47
PhonicUK	haiku OS is cool	00:47
PhonicUK	as is AROS	00:47
PhonicUK	AROS is scarily quick on real hardware	00:47
ZogG	i heard haiku runs on really really low performance hw	00:47
ZogG	it would fly on n900 i assume	00:48
bleeter	lol plan 9	00:48
javispedro	I heard Haiku runs.	00:48
bleeter	you guys should ctcp version me ><	00:48
PhonicUK	I also tried BeOS 5 Personal Edition on real hardware	00:48
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PhonicUK	350MHz AMD K6-2	00:48
ZogG	bleeter, are you kidding? plan9?	00:48
PhonicUK	it was really quick	00:48
bleeter	ctcp_version_reply = "mIRC on C= Vic20 running Plan9";	00:48
ptl	[18:48:54] CTCP VERSION reply from bleader [~bleader@teenapping.lalooz.com]: irssi v0.8.14 - running on NetBSD i386	00:49
bleeter	ZogG: No, completely serious! ;)	00:49
ptl	random ctcp	00:49
ZogG	liar	00:49
skynets	guys is there a way to replace the n900 body	00:49
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skynets	and the screen without the lcd	00:49
* bleeter goes back to trying to sort out his app manager mess		00:49
ZogG	skynets, only M.D. House can do that	00:49
skynets	i dropped it and it slid down a hill for 20 minutes	00:49
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skynets	it looks like darkman	00:50
MohammadAG	ouch	00:50
skynets	M.D. house?	00:50
skynets	medical doctor?	00:50
bleeter	so when they say 1.2 on Wednesday, I guess they don't mean in Australia? :P	00:50
* bleeter now goes back to sleep		00:50
MohammadAG	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_%28TV_series%29	00:50
MohammadAG	skynets, Mad Doctor would be more precise for him	00:51
skynets	does that mean no :/	00:51
MohammadAG	you can replace the faceplate	00:51
MohammadAG	it's just a pain in the *** to do	00:51
MohammadAG	unless you have the screws	00:51
MohammadAG	then it should be easy	00:51
MohammadAG	just be careful not to f up the USB port when removing the mobo	00:52
MohammadAG	the service manuals should also help, http://rapidshare.com/files/314266032/Nokia_N900_RX-51_Service_Manual_Service_Level_1_2.pdf	00:52
skynets	where can i find one for cheap?	00:53
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ZogG	skynets check the ebay	00:53
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ptl	skynets: there are some messages on talk.maemo.org about it	00:53
skynets	http://cgi.ebay.ca/New-For-Nokia-N900-Full-Housing-Fascia-Facia-pearlBlack_W0QQitemZ270582749425QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPDA_Accessories?hash=item3efffd18f1	00:53
ptl	skynets: search the forums and you'll find some good advices	00:54
MohammadAG	http://www.klc.fi/fin/tuotteet/Nokia-Varaosat-N900	00:54
skynets	alright thanks	00:54
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MohammadAG	full housing for 8 bucks?!	00:54
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skynets	yeah	00:55
MohammadAG	that's either an epic price, or a fake	00:55
skynets	im seeing others for 20	00:55
skynets	http://shop.ebay.ca/?_from=R40&_trksid=p3907.m570.l1313&_nkw=n900+housing&_sacat=See-All-Categories	00:55
skynets	check here	00:55
skynets	there are tons for under 30 bucks	00:55
skynets	even white ones	00:55
skynets	like the full set	00:55
DocScrutinizer51	strongly discourraged by M.D. Scrutinizer (who's done that)	00:56
heffer	i used to work in a nokia repair shop here in germany. the spare parts prices directly from nokias distributors are around 4-13€ for a full housing	00:56
heffer	dunno what the price on a n900 housing would be though	00:56
MohammadAG	listen to DocScrutinizer51, he knows his **** :P	00:57
ptl	A white N900 seems like a doctor wearing all black, it's just wrong	00:57
Khertan	hum does there is particular thing to do skype video call ?	00:57
javispedro	well, you can also use a white theme and call it n900 angelical edition or something	00:57
Khertan	i didn't see anything about it	00:57
ptl	I do use iStyle Lightphone :)	00:57
* javispedro has seen jingle video call at least		00:57
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javispedro	er..	00:57
ohwhyme	my n900 just died on me :o	00:58
javispedro	s/jingle/google talk	00:58
MohammadAG	lol what a typo	00:58
ZogG	New Housing Fascias Cover For Nokia N900 Black+Pen+TL	00:58
ZogG	Location: Hong Kong	00:58
ZogG		00:58
ZogG	Feedback: 7,947 \| 99.5%	00:58
ZogG	C $10.59+C $7.41	00:58
ZogG	oooops	00:58
heffer	ohwhyme, things happen	00:58
* javispedro ponders trying n8x0 <-> n900 video call.... hm... can I video call a specific JID resource?		00:58
DocScrutinizer51	heffer: you'd accept orders?	00:58
skynets	i hope the n900 isnt as crazy to open as the iphone :/	00:58
ohwhyme	true i have no warranty so im not sure what to do	00:58
MohammadAG	no, the N900 actually has screws	00:58
heffer	DocScrutinizer51, i can't as i stopped working there around 2005	00:58
DocScrutinizer51	err like in 'I order a stylus'	00:58
Milhouse	ohwhyme: I wonder who would get another N900 if theirs were to die right now.	00:59
MohammadAG	however waits for DocScrutinizer51 to say something about the ribbon	00:59
Milhouse	ohwhyme: Android 2.2 looks nice.	00:59
ohwhyme	haha well theres no screen but tv out works	00:59
MohammadAG	ohwhyme, how did it die...	00:59
MohammadAG	oh	00:59
MohammadAG	Could be the ribbon	00:59
ohwhyme	well it lights up with two horizontal lines in the middle	00:59
ptl	Milhouse: I think I'd do it :/	00:59
ptl	and I am not proud about it	00:59
Milhouse	ptl: lol. not sure I would - too much grief.	01:00
ohwhyme	tried to clean the ribbon and reseat it but still nothing	01:00
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ptl	but once I got used to a Linux phone, sorry, there's no turning back, even if it is to be treated like Nokia treats their customers.	01:00
* DocScrutinizer51 just says "don't mess with your N900 mechanically unless your're prepared to o major repair"		01:00
Milhouse	ptl: you're new round here, right? ;)	01:00
* Arkenoi played with milestone a bit. i wish n900 present such solid feeling :-(		01:00
ZogG	NOKIA BH-505 STEREO BLUETOOTH HEADSET looks nice	01:00
ptl	Milhouse: no, and I think I've been flaming here and on tmo long enough...	01:01
Milhouse	ptl: Nokia will knock it out of you in the end	01:01
ptl	ZogG: that's because it's in all caps, if it were in lowercase it would look much worse	01:01
ohwhyme	anyone know if the n900 ribbon is replacable?	01:01
SpeedEvil	ohwhyme: Spray it with wd40.	01:01
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer51, most probably	01:01
Milhouse	ohwyme: which cable, the once connected to the LCD panel? probably need to replace the panel.	01:01
ptl	Milhouse: I long for Meego devices from other manufacturers.	01:02
SpeedEvil	ohwhyme: It will temporarily restore the black, though you may get the paper a bit greasy.	01:02
PhonicUK	there is no tetris game! :O	01:02
PhonicUK	i must make one	01:02
MohammadAG	PhonicUK, but there is	01:02
MohammadAG	gtk tetris	01:02
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MohammadAG	noobmonk3y, requested it	01:02
MohammadAG	I couldn't be ****d to fix it	01:02
PhonicUK	i cant find it in "games" searching for tetris	01:02
PhonicUK	lol	01:02
MohammadAG	but it works	01:02
PhonicUK	i want to make a tetris game using SDL	01:03
MohammadAG	gtkTetris	01:03
ohwhyme	bah do i need a touchscreen or the panel? People sell it separately. The touchscreen works fine when I use it on tv out?	01:03
ZogG	ptl )	01:03
ZogG	night	01:03
MohammadAG	ZogG, how much?	01:03
SpeedEvil	PhonicUK: http://www.firstpersontetris.com/ - driven by the accel	01:03
MohammadAG	(BH-505)	01:03
ZogG	MohammadAG about 60 $	01:03
ZogG	but they look cool	01:03
MohammadAG	in IL?	01:03
ptl	what is this "Eve" stuff?	01:04
ZogG	nope - ebay	01:04
PhonicUK	awesome	01:04
MohammadAG	bah	01:04
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ZogG	MohammadAG go to dimphone and ask what you can order	01:04
DocScrutinizer51	ptl: lol ++	01:04
MohammadAG	ZogG, it has a bit of a disadvantage though	01:04
MohammadAG	you can't carry it in a pocket	01:05
Milhouse	ptl: Me too, the Nokia apps let down the devices.	01:05
ZogG	i'm not gonna but anything for now	01:05
ZogG	MohammadAG you carry it on neck	01:05
MohammadAG	ZogG, looks kind of weird at school don't you think	01:05
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javispedro	eta 72s	01:06
* javispedro counts µs		01:06
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DocScrutinizer	[2010-05-25 23:32:33] <user_> go suck a cock fanboi	01:07
MohammadAG	err	01:08
ptl	how do I get this instant community app for the N900?	01:08
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javispedro	"instant community app"?	01:08
SpeedEvil	apt-get install community	01:08
javispedro	you add a bookmark to the 5 most idiot tmo topic	01:08
javispedro	s.	01:08
ptl	jabis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6bHggX6TD0	01:08
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javispedro	ah, yet another MANET reinvention	01:09
MohammadAG	do as SpeedEvil said	01:09
ptl	SpeedEvil: no such package	01:09
MohammadAG	then just add water	01:09
DocScrutinizer	[2010-05-26 00:08:34] [314] user_ ~user 64.134.237.3 * Unknown Unknown	01:09
DocScrutinizer	[2010-05-26 00:08:34] [Whois] user_ ist auf dem Server verne.freenode.net (Tue May 25 22:07:28 2010).	01:09
DocScrutinizer	[2010-05-26 00:08:34] [314] user_ ~user 64.134.237.3 * Unknown Unknown	01:09
DocScrutinizer	[2010-05-26 00:08:34] [Whois] user_ ist auf dem Server anthony.freenode.net (Tue May 25 21:35:03 2010).	01:09
ZogG_N900	just logged in to say. b&w theme is scewed for ukbrd and i hate default theme 'cause of yellow notifications	01:09
SpeedEvil	ptl: That's been the problem all the time.	01:09
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MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, from the US	01:10
ptl	btw, is there a widget that does lyrics in a capable way on the N900? Tunewiki just doesn't and it is closed-source.	01:10
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asj	ptl: yes	01:11
DocScrutinizer	happy nmaping	01:11
ptl	asj: which one?	01:11
DocScrutinizer	:-P	01:11
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ptl	I'd like to read lyrics as I drive	01:11
thunderfest	javispedro: well I have my apt good and mangled I can install and run neheGLES and my own gles code but I have a feeling that if I power down the device it will not come back on ... as I had to remove a bunch of new qt stuff	01:11
asj	ptl: and text at the same time?	01:11
asj	while talking on the phone?	01:11
* asj ducks		01:11
ptl	asj: lol, if I am going to die, I want to die while having fun	01:11
javispedro	thunderfest: I know what you did. Your device will come back, but when the stuff is officially released you might need to reflash.	01:12
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asj	ptl: there's something, try google ;)	01:12
javispedro	thunderfest: either way backup.	01:12
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thunderfest	can you give me a link to where the bug report was filed so I can follow its progress	01:12
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javispedro	bug #6816	01:13
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6816 OpenGL ES 1.1 should be supported	01:13
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thunderfest	thanks	01:13
ptl	asj: I was kidding, I tried google, really, and also tmo, found nothing that I recall now	01:14
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ptl	asj: GPE audio player is not a widget and it didn't work well here	01:14
asj	ptl: huh, I thought I saw something, maybe one of the media players had it, or some widget	01:14
ptl	asj: the widget was tunewiki, I guess	01:14
ptl	which is closed-source, that I try to avoid, and also is not thatr good.	01:15
MohammadAG	tunewiki-smp?	01:15
ptl	I don't think that adding Simultaneous Multiprocessing to tunewiki would make it better	01:15
ptl	[user@n900 user]% apt-cache search tunewiki tunewiki-community - Tunewiki media player tunewiki-applet - Watch lyrics on your device desktop while listening to music.	01:15
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asj	lol, I have to many n900s =)	01:17
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* asj tries to make sure they are all in silent mode		01:17
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thunderfest	javispedro: your right it did reboot...but now some pr1.2 changes are missing i.e. "more" button is back...browser rotate still seems to be working fine	01:19
louigiverona	guysoft42, is there a way to auto align or tie shortcuts to grid on N900 desktop?	01:21
louigiverona	guysoft42, is there a way to auto align or tie shortcuts to grid on N900 desktop?	01:21
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alterego	louigiverona: they already do, it's jus tthe grid is small.	01:21
ptl	louigiverona: use the tweakr application	01:21
louigiverona	alterego thx	01:22
guysoft42	louigiverona, i JUST walked in to my room, after not being in it all day, to hear a 'ding' from my X-chat client	01:22
guysoft42	but er - i dont have a N900, only a N810.. would like one, but dont have the money	01:22
louigiverona	guysoft42 i actually wrote 'guys'	01:22
guysoft42	louigiverona, you must have added a tap :)	01:22
guysoft42	dab*	01:22
guysoft42	tab*..	01:22
louigiverona	nope	01:22
louigiverona	i rechecked	01:23
ptl	louigiverona: tweakr allows you a larger grid	01:23
louigiverona	that's why there was a double post	01:23
SpeedEvil	so does vi	01:23
louigiverona	ptl thx is it in the repos?	01:23
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ptl	louigiverona: yes, it is :)	01:23
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louigiverona	thx a lot, will try it out	01:24
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lardman\|home	bbiam	01:24
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louigiverona	how to press Tab in XChat btw?	01:24
thunderfest	it seems stupid for nokia to release a major os update during the last few weeks of its annual major development contest.	01:25
louigiverona	uncoordinated	01:25
louigiverona	one team did that, the other this	01:25
SpeedEvil	louigiverona: IIRC the default setting is shift space.	01:26
SpeedEvil	louigiverona: I prefer shift-rightarrow	01:26
louigiverona	SpeedEvil, thx space worked	01:26
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ljp	thunderfest: thats what happens when releases are delayed	01:29
ptl	is titan's kernel compatible with PR1.2?	01:30
Funnyfacemob	is it officially out?	01:31
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javispedro	noooooooooooo now you've delayed it one extra week.	01:31
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thunderfest	well I've been busy making some sweet new games for the ovi store but until OpenGL ES 1.1 is fixed on pr1.2 they will have to be pr1.1 only	01:32
javispedro	thunderfest: indeed in this case I suggest you to downgrande	01:32
javispedro	thunderfest: vote for the bug (hit the "vote for this bug" link)	01:32
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ptl	Funnyfacemob: it is out, it's all around the place, didn't you see the N900 blogs?	01:34
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ptl	Funnyfacemob: OTA updates for the global and US firmware will be released tomorrow though	01:35
Funnyfacemob	ptl: not yet, :P	01:35
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ptl	Funnyfacemob: but you can upgrade using flasher already	01:35
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javispedro	well it's on this channel's topic...	01:35
DocScrutinizer	tomorrow which TZ, btw?	01:35
Funnyfacemob	well, I haven't checked the news today so :P	01:36
DocScrutinizer	0:00 Akamei	01:36
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Funnyfacemob	will see what happens tomorrow then	01:36
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PhonicUK	is the perl package optified?	01:37
lardman\|home	~curse SMB1 problems that prevent my Linux system from booting	01:37
infobot	May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, SMB1 problems that prevent my Linux system from booting !	01:37
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DocScrutinizer	just because it's so funny	01:37
DocScrutinizer	~pr1.2	01:37
infobot	extra, extra, read all about it, pr1.2 is available since early Tuesday morning. More information at http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ -- see ~flashing for how to update	01:37
ptl	~flashing	01:38
infobot	methinks flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	01:38
ptl	~42	01:38
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infobot	well, 42 is the answer to life the universe and everything, see also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/the_answer_to_life,_the_universe,_and_everything	01:38
ptl	PR1.2 == 42	01:38
* lardman\|home goes to try again		01:38
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PhonicUK	~deadbeef	01:38
infobot	moooooo!	01:38
PhonicUK	lol	01:38
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PhonicUK	has anyone installed frozen bubble?	01:39
SpeedEvil	yes	01:40
Funnyfacemob	"video in skype and google talk" yay :D	01:40
SpeedEvil	It diddn't work	01:40
SpeedEvil	actually	01:40
SpeedEvil	it did	01:40
SpeedEvil	but it was a bit jerky	01:40
SpeedEvil	and the controls were meh.	01:40
Funnyfacemob	I wonder which camera it uses :>	01:40
DocScrutinizer	Funnyfacemob: but skype still doesn't support stuttering	01:41
PhonicUK	i tried it in a debian chroot	01:41
PhonicUK	worked really well	01:41
DocScrutinizer	Funnyfacemob: or was it like it actually does ? ;-P	01:41
PhonicUK	but not outside of that	01:41
DocScrutinizer	now I got it, skype transmits stuttering	01:42
DocScrutinizer	so everything fine XP	01:42
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pwnguin	so here's a grim question: is there going to be a 1.3?	01:51
javispedro	when is pr 1.3 going to be released?	01:51
pwnguin	jinx	01:52
lbt	javispedro: well, that's +2 days	01:52
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happyblob	offtopic but just curious as to what anyone here makes of this- http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/17/zte-packs-3g-maemo-into-its-v7-mid/ Is that fremantle or older?	01:57
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pwnguin	kinda looks like maemo5	01:59
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happyblob	looks slightly tempting if it actually is.. and if it comes out at a reasonable price	02:01
pwnguin	oh dont worry	02:01
pwnguin	i doubt it will ever leave china	02:01
SpeedEvil	Wow! How can I live without the calendar app.	02:01
happyblob	licensing? or just.. plain too weird?	02:01
pwnguin	licensing	02:01
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pwnguin	i can buy all kinds of plain too wierd stuff from dealextreme	02:03
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SpeedEvil	pwnguin: DX sell a n900 too.	02:03
pwnguin	heh	02:03
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Ikarus	SpeedEvil: that dual SIM one ? :P	02:03
pwnguin	i just looked at it	02:03
SpeedEvil	yes	02:03
pwnguin	they sell iFhones	02:03
SpeedEvil	Dual SIM is actually a feature I might like.	02:03
pigeon	dual sim n900?	02:03
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Ikarus	pigeon: it's a chinese copy of the N900	02:04
pigeon	ah	02:04
thunderfest	javispedro: scratchbox wants to update some of its lib (like libgles1-sgx-img-dev) ... do you think updating scratchbox and then recompiling any opengl es 1..1 app will solve the problem ...or do you think that if I update my scratchbox right now I will then not be able to produce opengles 1 binaries for nigher pr1.1 or pr1.2	02:04
Ikarus	pigeon: including fake Nokia logo, wrong battery and wrong OS ofcourse	02:04
pwnguin	http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.33953	02:04
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pwnguin	completely bogus	02:04
jaem	Heyo... has anyone fiddled with the wlantool package from here: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1635#c107 ?	02:04
povbot`	Bug 1635: Eduroam (EAP-TTLS+PAP) WiFi auth	02:04
pigeon	you just made me jumped a bit :)	02:04
Ikarus	pwnguin: there is a better one	02:04
pigeon	ah, not maemo then?	02:05
ptl	aw :\| still no LEAP support	02:05
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javispedro	thunderfest: upgrading your scratchbox shoouldn't break anything nor fix anything...	02:05
pwnguin	speaking of wifi and roaming	02:05
pwnguin	is it possible to set up a campus wifi network so that you can seamlessly wander without dropping connections?	02:05
Ikarus	pwnguin: yes	02:05
pigeon	nice price too	02:06
Ikarus	pwnguin: just setup the same ESSID on all the APs	02:06
Ikarus	pwnguin: though if you are using WPA2 you need some extras, else hand offs take quite long	02:06
thunderfest	seems like at least part of the problem is that libgles1-sgx-img has its dependencies hard coded	02:06
pwnguin	Ikarus: seems like every time i wander between APs here, it drops me and asks for my username/password again	02:06
Ikarus	pwnguin: yes, then they didn't setup proper WPA2 roaming	02:06
Ikarus	pwnguin: the APs need to share crypto session information for that to work	02:06
bleeter	pwnguin: you might want to look in to WDS	02:07
Ikarus	bleeter: uh, no	02:07
javispedro	thunderfest: no, the issue is that they forgot to update it. has happened in the past. possibly didn't even pass certification.	02:07
bleeter	Ikarus: i must've misunderstood. damn my lack of coffee!	02:07
pwnguin	well then	02:07
Ikarus	bleeter: WDS is absolutely shit for heavy used networks	02:07
pwnguin	next networking question	02:07
Ikarus	bleeter: any campus network can use a fixed ethernet backbone	02:07
pwnguin	we have some goofy cisco sign in page that authenticates people against LDAP	02:08
Ikarus	pwnguin: shudder WHY	02:08
thunderfest	ah well I hope its update before pr1.3	02:08
Ikarus	they could do that with WPA2	02:08
pwnguin	not all devices support wpa2	02:08
Ikarus	pwnguin: their problem	02:08
Dima202	I can't believe it I made a backup using n900 backup util. after saving backup to pic	02:08
pwnguin	yes, it is the college's problem	02:08
bleeter	Ikarus: campus here is cheap as shit, that's why they're using WDS I guess	02:08
Ikarus	older security systems are broken anyway	02:08
Dima202	pc*	02:08
Ikarus	you might aswell use full open wifi if you can't use WPA2	02:09
pwnguin	i think there are some advantages	02:09
pwnguin	we have fewer wifi leeches	02:09
tank-man	windows without bars on houses are useless too? :)	02:09
pwnguin	but im just wondering, the captive gateway is 1.1.1.1	02:09
pwnguin	and it has a self signed cert	02:10
Ikarus	tank-man: they are if the neighbours all have bars and you have delicious cookies on the table	02:10
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pwnguin	im wondering if there's a way to get it signed so that passwords might not be stolen	02:11
pwnguin	but it sounds like the answer is wpa2	02:11
tank-man	heh	02:11
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pwnguin	Ikarus: there's plenty of free wifi in town	02:11
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pwnguin	librarys, sandwich shops, starbucks	02:11
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* noobmonk3y waves gn'ite		02:17
* noobmonk3y kicks frals in the shins n runs out		02:18
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jaem	When are the council elections closing?	02:31
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DocScrutinizer	anybody knows sarahn on IRC?	02:33
Dima202	!seen sarahn	02:34
DocScrutinizer	~seen sarahn	02:34
Dima202	no bots here?	02:34
infobot	DocScrutinizer: i haven't seen 'sarahn'	02:34
DocScrutinizer	shrug	02:34
DocScrutinizer	infobot: relax	02:34
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Dima202	I recently found tron in one of the repos.. that game is narly	02:35
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Dima202	gnarly*	02:36
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odin_	where is the Quake (1 2 or 3) download for N900 ?	02:36
Dima202	extras testing i think	02:36
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Dima202	not sure if they ported quake 3 yet	02:37
MohammadAG	ioquake3	02:37
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Dima202	wow that's sick	02:39
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Alpha	Hello	02:45
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Alpha	i have some questions about maemo	02:45
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csc`	'lo	02:53
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*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer		02:55
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- NO PR1.2 YET, askers will get kicked http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=638289#post638289 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk :-)"		02:55
*** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer		02:55
DocScrutinizer	oops	02:55
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer		02:56
csc`	is it possible to switch the default user 'user' to something else in maemo without extensive configuration changes or random things breaking?	02:56
luke-jr	no	02:56
csc`	didnt think so, but id assume because maemo is debian based, i can create new users, correct?	02:57
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 out, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk :-)"		02:57
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DantonicN900	In mappero is there a way to keep the map zoom at the previous level? So that the map view is actually bigger, and the street names are more readable? I know that was possible on the N800 but haven't figured it out on this.	03:03
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lipe	help on n900/maemo5 is here?	03:04
DocScrutinizer	sometimes	03:05
DantonicN900	sometimes	03:05
DantonicN900	lol	03:05
lipe	(sorry for my english) after reboot my n900 only appears calc icon on up/left screen	03:05
lipe	when i tap the screen, its vibre	03:06
lipe	the icon changes color on tap	03:06
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lipe	but, no more action	03:07
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DocScrutinizer	that's odd	03:08
lipe	what's odd?	03:08
DocScrutinizer	the whole issue	03:08
DocScrutinizer	rebooted again?	03:08
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lipe	many times	03:08
DocScrutinizer	ouch	03:09
lipe	during boot/reboot the nokia handshake appears, the nokia sound plays, the load animation (whitch litle balls) appears	03:09
DocScrutinizer	and there's what? no black bar on top left? no double windowframe icon in the very upper left?	03:09
lipe	nothing	03:09
lipe	just calc icon	03:10
lipe	on upper/left	03:10
DocScrutinizer	pretty bad	03:10
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lipe	oh oh	03:10
lipe	:)	03:10
DocScrutinizer	nah, nothing that can't be fixed	03:10
DocScrutinizer	but maybe you actually need to reflash	03:11
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DocScrutinizer	what firmware/os version?	03:11
DocScrutinizer	did you update today?	03:11
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lipe	i think i win a new paperweight	03:11
lipe	:)	03:11
lipe	today i'm not update the os	03:12
DocScrutinizer	so you're using 1.1.1	03:12
lipe	just install some games	03:12
ptl	I did activate ssh by default, this way I can always get to the command line if anything goes wrong and I have network access.	03:12
DocScrutinizer	good!	03:12
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lipe	great ideia ptl	03:13
DocScrutinizer	ooh, thought that's been you lipe	03:13
lipe	reflash is a best solution?	03:13
DocScrutinizer	if you can't get a shell...	03:13
DocScrutinizer	what happens if you press ctrl+backspace?	03:13
lipe	nothing	03:14
DocScrutinizer	powerbutton... is there a 'stop current task' button in the menu?	03:14
lipe	powerbutton only work if i press to shutting down	03:15
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xorAxAx	hmm, i wonder whether its out in .de already	03:15
DocScrutinizer	lipe: shift+ctrl+X	03:16
lipe	nothing too	03:16
MohammadAG	OMG http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/25/world-spends-4-82-million-hours-playing-google-pac-man-on-launch/	03:16
DocScrutinizer	lipe: then probably you're out of luck. Reflash	03:17
DocScrutinizer	or hang on a while here, asking every 30 minutes	03:17
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lipe	DocScrutinizer: i will try... thank you a lot	03:17
xorAxAx	DocScrutinizer: is PR 1.2 out already?	03:17
DocScrutinizer	quite possible someone with better advice may vome along eventually	03:18
DocScrutinizer	xorAxAx: not here	03:18
xorAxAx	ok	03:18
DocScrutinizer	except for the fiasco of course	03:18
DocScrutinizer	global version	03:18
DocScrutinizer	OTA, no	03:19
xorAxAx	ah	03:19
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MohammadAG	it's already tomorrow	03:20
MohammadAG	what gives	03:20
DocScrutinizer	btw though I know the original italian (latin?) meaning, I nevertheless alway feel uncomfortable with that name	03:20
xorAxAx	3:20 in finnland	03:20
MohammadAG	Oh hey, it's crashanddie's bday	03:20
DocScrutinizer	yep	03:20
MohammadAG	calls for a topic change :P	03:20
* DocScrutinizer calls for a ban :-P		03:20
* MohammadAG gets freenode staff		03:21
MohammadAG	second thoughts? :P	03:21
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DocScrutinizer	give him a patched hosts.conf and a nice special pr1.2	03:21
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MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, shall I edit the optification script to run rm -rf?	03:22
luke-jr	DocScrutinizer: topic says 1.2 is out	03:22
DocScrutinizer	he was so excited about 1.2 on his bd, we can't ship the plain vanilla stock to him :-P	03:22
DocScrutinizer	luke-jr: mega-out :-P	03:22
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer		03:24
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 shipping, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk :-)"		03:24
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DocScrutinizer	lcuk: pr7.7 is IN	03:26
DocScrutinizer	lcuk: bashing Nokia for not shipping meego with dancing hookers for N900 is IN	03:27
DocScrutinizer	lcuk: pr1.2 definitely is soooooo OUT, toatlly MEGA-OUT	03:27
b-man	lol	03:27
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roquetto	does anyone know to which package kde4-config belongs, or where i could grab the source? ( i need to build it on maemo)	03:28
DocScrutinizer	since amost 18h	03:28
DocScrutinizer	almost*	03:28
DocScrutinizer	ooops, s/lcuk/luke-jr/g	03:29
DocScrutinizer	lcuk: sorry for highlight, ETAB	03:29
luke-jr	...	03:29
asj	I wonder if we can skip music tracks now without having to wake the device up, say using the headset dongle	03:29
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openstandards	Hi all	03:30
DocScrutinizer	asj: nope	03:30
b-man	hi openstandards :)	03:30
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asj	DocScrutinizer: hmpf, nothing in /sys to tell us switch status?	03:31
DocScrutinizer	not without additional cruft to detect long press of HOLD-button	03:31
Kegetys	would be nice if the volume keys would change tracks when on the unlock slider screen, then you could press the power button once and then cycle tracks with the volume keys	03:31
openstandards	how much free space does a n900 have its rootfs as standard if you don't mind me asking	03:31
asj	Kegetys: I like that one, or maybe just a long press of volume keys?	03:31
SpeedEvil	~80M I think	03:31
DocScrutinizer	openstandards: 77M downto some 10M	03:32
SpeedEvil	It does not - and this is a DEALBREAKER - have enough space to install build-essentials on /.	03:32
SpeedEvil	:)	03:32
DocScrutinizer	hehe	03:32
openstandards	damn the new update is 119mb and its bitching about having to be upgraded via pc :(	03:32
DocScrutinizer	no native gentoo	03:32
* asj shoots SpeedEvil, dealbreaker		03:32
DocScrutinizer	openstandards: you shalt update via App Manager!	03:33
DocScrutinizer	and if there are problems, then probably it's fine to have a look at wikipage	03:34
DocScrutinizer	~flashing	03:34
infobot	from memory, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	03:34
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b-man	oh dear.. 119mb. - that means that i need to do a complete system restore of all of my stuff once i upgrade to 1.2 :( - gonna take several hours	03:35
DocScrutinizer	Kegetys: sounds quite sensible	03:35
MohammadAG	b-man, use apt-get, it helps	03:35
openstandards	DocScrutinizer, atm its moaning and giving me the maemo up message	03:35
MohammadAG	took about 30 minutes to restore all my apps	03:35
openstandards	b-man, i was wrong its 113 mb	03:36
MohammadAG	(I had the .debs though)	03:36
lcuk	rootfs space after a clean pr1.2 build is over 100mb	03:36
b-man	MohammadAG: i may just temporally reroute /var/cache/apt/archives to /opt	03:36
b-man	it worked when i installed quake3	03:36
lcuk	i have 103 at the moment	03:36
MohammadAG	b-man, it's 'rerouted' to /media/mmc1 here	03:36
MohammadAG	500MBs	03:36
b-man	well, symlink if you want to be specific xD	03:37
b-man	;)	03:37
MohammadAG	:P	03:37
MohammadAG	lcuk, max I could reach on 1.1.1 was 115MBs	03:38
DocScrutinizer	please everybody check http://wiki.maemo.org/OTA_to_PR1.1_troubleshooting	03:38
MohammadAG	but I didn't move /usr/share/include	03:38
MohammadAG	lcuk, isn't it past your bed time? XP	03:38
b-man	MohammadAG: any luck with debootstrap btw?	03:38
lcuk	sure, DocScrutinizer pinged	03:38
MohammadAG	b-man, was restoring apps	03:38
MohammadAG	and now it's restoring convos	03:38
MohammadAG	a hefty 58MBs of them	03:39
b-man	heh	03:39
DocScrutinizer	lcuk: sorry for that	03:39
MohammadAG	I should use my PC for chat more often	03:39
SpeedEvil	I had maybe too many apps installed.	03:39
SpeedEvil	It wanted to download 600M.	03:39
MohammadAG	that's nothing	03:39
MohammadAG	HAM wanted to download 1.2GBs	03:39
SpeedEvil	That was HAM - for me.	03:40
MohammadAG	(HAM duplicates dependencies apparently)	03:40
SpeedEvil	ah	03:40
b-man	MohammadAG: i use to use my N800 almost exclusively for all development.. until i got a laptop lol	03:40
MohammadAG	b-man, LOL	03:40
b-man	xD	03:40
MohammadAG	b-man, I might install debootstrap in scratchbox	03:40
MohammadAG	on an i5	03:40
MohammadAG	deb unpacking would be so much easier	03:40
b-man	yeah	03:40
MohammadAG	especially when locked at 2.80	03:41
MohammadAG	or overclocked to 3.20	03:41
MohammadAG	possibly more, I'll just run a hose with water in there	03:41
b-man	lol	03:41
* b-man was tempted to overclock his device		03:41
SpeedEvil	People have tried watercooling their n900s.	03:41
SpeedEvil	Generally down the toilet.	03:42
MohammadAG	SpeedEvil, yeah I heard a lot of them dropped the N900s in toilets too	03:42
MohammadAG	XD	03:42
b-man	hahaha	03:42
yuizy_	:D	03:42
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* SpeedEvil sighs.		03:42
* MohammadAG laughs hard		03:42
SpeedEvil	My 3G connection is going 10* faster than my DSL	03:43
* b-man laughs harder		03:43
* b-man wished he had a data plan		03:43
MohammadAG	get one :P	03:43
* MohammadAG has 5GBs each month		03:44
* SpeedEvil is about to buy another 6 months of internet.		03:44
b-man	don't have the money atm	03:44
SpeedEvil	For 20 quid.	03:44
SpeedEvil	Only 1G/mo - but meh	03:44
MohammadAG	no 1G option	03:44
MohammadAG	otherwise I'd go for it	03:44
SpeedEvil	t-mobile - uk	03:44
MohammadAG	it's either 30, 150, 5000, or 20000 (no idea who does the maths here)	03:44
DocScrutinizer	MohammadAG: you better don't ask	03:45
* b-man is a highschool student without a job due to the lousy econimy - i have no money for such a plan lol		03:45
SpeedEvil	They do careful studies, to make sure that there are four seperate classes of users that typically use 40, 180, 6000 or 25000.	03:45
MohammadAG	lol	03:46
DocScrutinizer	mehehe	03:46
MohammadAG	b-man, the media makes the US look cheaper it seems :)	03:46
MohammadAG	how much is 1GB a month	03:46
DocScrutinizer	enough	03:46
SpeedEvil	MohammadAG: $5(us) equivalent/mo	03:47
b-man	in some places up to $50/month	03:47
SpeedEvil	MohammadAG: But I pay absolutely nothing else for the mobile service.	03:47
SpeedEvil	(well - unless I make calls)	03:47
MohammadAG	don't make calls tbh	03:47
b-man	phone carriers suck here :(	03:47
MohammadAG	I have 5GBs, so I got my friends to join skype	03:47
MohammadAG	problem solved	03:47
SpeedEvil	I made one call.	03:47
MohammadAG	to check your voicemail? :P	03:48
DocScrutinizer	~lart MohammadAG for recommending skype	03:48
* infobot keeps mailing MohammadAG free America Online CDs until he drowns for recommending skype		03:48
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b-man	LOL	03:48
MohammadAG	wtf lol	03:48
b-man	xDD	03:48
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, why, skype rules!	03:48
* MohammadAG hides		03:48
b-man	~lart MohammadAG for hiding	03:49
* infobot chops MohammadAG in half with a free Solaris 7 CD for hiding		03:49
SpeedEvil	MohammadAG: no - to get the number of my mobile on my landline, so I can ring it back and see if the modem wakes the device from suspend-RAM.	03:49
b-man	infobot has a lot of CDs :D	03:49
SpeedEvil	It does actually - but what also wakes it is signal strength reports. Which is a pity.	03:49
SpeedEvil	(as they are about every 5-30 seconds usually)	03:50
MohammadAG	LOL SpeedEvil	03:50
MohammadAG	b-man, someone lart'd here before	03:50
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DocScrutinizer	b-man: you bet. She's collecting all my crap since I know her	03:52
b-man	lol	03:52
MohammadAG	hmm	03:52
MohammadAG	can I send her some?	03:53
MohammadAG	a year ago I burned an iso of Ubuntu every time I needed one	03:53
MohammadAG	I have about 15-20	03:53
MohammadAG	(same version - ironically)	03:53
b-man	i use to get useless AOL CDs in the mail all the time	03:53
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MohammadAG	b-man, I never got AOL CDs, haha!	03:54
DocScrutinizer	SpeedEvil: what??? the don't disable unsol msgs from celmo??	03:54
SpeedEvil	DocScrutinizer: Well - suspend-RAM isn't normally done AIUI	03:54
SpeedEvil	It doesn't save _that_ much power.	03:54
b-man	MohammadAG: i did get a free Linux magazine with ubuntu xD	03:55
SpeedEvil	But I think it goes with cellmo active - from somewhere like 4 days standby to 6	03:55
DocScrutinizer	SpeedEvil: still I'd expect the cellmo unsol get disabled whenever signal meter is hidden	03:55
SpeedEvil	There are also things that might be listening to signal strength on dbus	03:55
DocScrutinizer	well, except inbound signalling	03:56
DocScrutinizer	if that's group unsol at all	03:56
SpeedEvil	It's signal strength reports that's waking it	03:56
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DocScrutinizer	epic fail	03:56
* b-man needs to turn on the air - got up to 88F today		03:56
SpeedEvil	at least - I assume so - there are no broadcast messages on UK nets AIUI	03:56
DocScrutinizer	and you'd need to explicitly enable those afaik	03:57
SpeedEvil	yes	03:58
DocScrutinizer	btw WHEN will we get CB on N900?? NOKIA!!	03:58
MohammadAG	CB?	03:58
MohammadAG	coffee break?	03:58
DocScrutinizer	cell broadcast	03:58
SpeedEvil	I don't think the FMTX will go down to 27MHz	03:59
DocScrutinizer	muhaha, knew somebody's going to say that :-P	03:59
* SpeedEvil envisions a n900 with a 1/4 wave 27MHz antenna out the top.		03:59
DocScrutinizer	5/8	04:00
DocScrutinizer	groundplane	04:00
DocScrutinizer	saves you from porting an umbrella with you	04:00
DocScrutinizer	as you might have guessed I'm highly interested in CB:221	04:02
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DocScrutinizer	http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-June/002987.html	04:02
SpeedEvil	\	04:02
DocScrutinizer	btw, anybody reported back on the Engineering mode thingy meanwhile?	04:03
DocScrutinizer	(as of konttori_work's request from err 1? week ago)	04:04
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DocScrutinizer	darn, I even forgot the nick... :-/	04:04
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DocScrutinizer	SpeedEvil: you seen anything?	04:06
DocScrutinizer	or remember anything?	04:06
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SpeedEvil	nope, sorry	04:06
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DocScrutinizer	~seen onen_openbmap	04:07
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infobot	i haven't seen 'onen_openbmap', DocScrutinizer	04:08
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microlith	whoa	04:10
microlith	phone went from thin green line on the battery to red-outline battery and shut off	04:10
microlith	wtf	04:10
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DocScrutinizer	better than if it explodes, no?	04:11
DocScrutinizer	lart braindamaged bme for that!	04:12
SpeedEvil	microlith: Have you been soldering on the battery contacts?	04:12
DocScrutinizer	maybe hald-addon-bme	04:12
DocScrutinizer	lol	04:13
DocScrutinizer	btw I always wondered if the red color is worth anything for the few pixels left over for empty bat icon	04:14
DocScrutinizer	what are they called? GUI-designers?	04:15
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skynets	wait	04:16
skynets	so i cant upgrade maemo with windows 7 x64	04:16
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skynets	:/	04:16
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hcarrega	any news for OTA?	04:16
hcarrega	its today?	04:17
DocScrutinizer	nope	04:17
DocScrutinizer	yep	04:17
DocScrutinizer	supposedly	04:17
hcarrega	i will w8	04:17
hcarrega	:)	04:17
haltdef	uk :D	04:17
DocScrutinizer	well, the nick konttori_work makes me wonder... :-D	04:18
hcarrega	i dont want flash method:	04:18
hcarrega	haltdef	04:18
hcarrega	in uk OTA is start rolling?	04:18
hcarrega	or only via flash?	04:18
haltdef	OTA	04:18
hcarrega	:P	04:18
hcarrega	envy	04:18
SpeedEvil	hcarrega: OTA'd at about midday here.	04:18
hcarrega	i w8	04:18
hcarrega	im in same GMT of london	04:19
SpeedEvil	The new virtual keyboard is annoying.	04:19
hcarrega	;)	04:19
DocScrutinizer	then you finally get OTA and realize you have to flash anyway, as it won't work. Then you'll start to shout :-P	04:19
hcarrega	DocScrutinizer: i have done all OTA	04:19
DocScrutinizer	me too	04:19
SpeedEvil	I mean - sure - the keyboard now follows the consistent UI to dismiss a child window.	04:19
* DocScrutinizer waiting patiently		04:19
hcarrega	w8	04:19
hcarrega	:)	04:20
SpeedEvil	But... That was not worth losing 1/8th of the display for.	04:20
DocScrutinizer	see topic	04:20
DocScrutinizer	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk	04:20
hcarrega	load ""	04:20
hcarrega	:)	04:20
hcarrega	lol	04:20
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hcarrega	maybe by 12	04:22
hcarrega	;)	04:22
hcarrega	right now is 2:22	04:22
hcarrega	lol	04:22
MohammadAG	<SpeedEvil> The new virtual keyboard is annoying.	04:22
MohammadAG	you can always go back :)	04:23
DocScrutinizer	beer?	04:23
MohammadAG	lol	04:23
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, he can go back	04:23
MohammadAG	betting on this will cost you a beer	04:24
SpeedEvil	MohammadAG: I know - I want to figure on how to do that	04:24
DocScrutinizer	nah, that should cost HIM a beer	04:24
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, you suggested it	04:24
MohammadAG	I ruined my rootfs cause of you	04:24
DocScrutinizer	lol	04:24
MohammadAG	it had so many mods	04:24
DocScrutinizer	PLUS you owe me a beer for that :-P	04:25
DocScrutinizer	that must hurt	04:25
DocScrutinizer	don't cry, Nokia nuked my rootfs, and for icing on top they broke my powerswitch	04:27
b-man	DocScrutinizer: oh sure, kick a man while he's down xD	04:27
DocScrutinizer	meanwhile he's up and well again	04:27
MohammadAG	DocScrutinizer, I gave you that beer	04:28
DocScrutinizer	aah I remember that strange scp, yeah	04:28
MohammadAG	lol	04:28
MohammadAG	that was to dd /dev/mtd0, but it didn't work	04:28
MohammadAG	some process called mousetweaks had my CPU on 100%	04:29
MohammadAG	(PC)	04:29
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DocScrutinizer	wtf?	04:29
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DocScrutinizer	must've been windoze	04:29
MohammadAG	packages restored in 30 minutes	04:30
DocScrutinizer	prolly a virus	04:30
MohammadAG	yeah...	04:30
MohammadAG	oh nope	04:30
MohammadAG	I checked bugzilla	04:30
MohammadAG	it should be fixed in 1.3	04:30
DocScrutinizer	damn, what will all those dudes do with their "fixed in 1.2" t-shirts? o.O	04:31
DocScrutinizer	probably patch XP	04:31
MohammadAG	MeeGo 1.2 will be announced some time	04:31
MohammadAG	so they'll just wear them again when that happens	04:31
b-man	lol	04:32
* DocScrutinizer starts shipping "3" patches		04:32
DocScrutinizer	plus the killer: "^this is a patch!"	04:33
DocScrutinizer	patches	04:33
lipe	DocScrutinizer: i was reflashed my n900 and... it's work	04:37
lipe	one more time, thank you	04:38
DocScrutinizer	lipe: \o/	04:38
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DocScrutinizer	lipe: not for this, you did it all yourself	04:38
lipe	let's crash it again (install some apps)	04:39
lipe	:)	04:39
lipe	good by	04:39
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roquetto	was anyone able to build kdepimlibs to maemo? has anyone even tried?	04:43
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matthew-	HMMM	04:46
matthew-	it tells me i need to connect my n900	04:46
matthew-	to a PC to upgrade, is it cause of lack of space?	04:46
DocScrutinizer	zzzZZZzzz	04:47
MohammadAG	o/ DocScrutinizer	04:47
matthew-	it says to update to this version bla bla you must use nokia software update aplication on your PC	04:47
matthew-	bla bla bla	04:47
matthew-	is that normal?	04:47
hcarrega	yes	04:47
matthew-	ok, can I _somehow_ update it OTA?	04:48
matthew-	(	04:48
matthew-	(or get a mac version of said software)	04:48
hcarrega	disable some repos	04:48
hcarrega	reboot	04:48
hcarrega	and voila	04:48
MohammadAG	umm	04:48
matthew-	hcarrega: So how much space do I need?	04:48
hcarrega	extra-devel etc	04:48
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matthew-	yeah did it	04:48
matthew-	ive got over 50mb free	04:48
matthew-	got 54MB free memory	04:50
matthew-	and i left only the software upgrade repo	04:51
DocScrutinizer51	I think last OTA (1.1.1) needed 57MB	04:51
matthew-	dunno how to free more space	04:52
matthew-	moved most of the unneeded shit anyway	04:52
DocScrutinizer51	blame nokia for shooting their own foot with	04:52
matthew-	dont have amny things installed	04:52
DocScrutinizer51	~optification	04:52
infobot	optification is probably a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs	04:52
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: what do you mean?	04:53
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DocScrutinizer51	they broke their SSU by cramming the rootfs with /var /usr etc	04:54
matthew-	eyah	04:54
matthew-	true	04:54
MohammadAG	night	04:54
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matthew-	ok but how can i reclaim some rootfs space	04:55
DocScrutinizer51	rm /var/cache/*	04:59
SpeedEvil	Turn off extras* repos	04:59
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ohwhyme	baaaaaah	05:07
espringe	When trying to install libtpsession, I get "libqt4-core (>= 4.6.2~git20100401) but 4.6.2~git20100310-0maemo1+0m5" as a dependcy error	05:08
espringe	is it possible somehow make it be ignored	05:08
matthew-	SpeedEvil: turned off all repos	05:08
matthew-	moved themes	05:08
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matthew-	ive got 65MB free	05:11
matthew-	and still not possible	05:11
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hcarrega	wierdo	05:16
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: was that a genuine advice?	05:16
matthew-	cause i think it broke my device...	05:17
matthew-	yay now there's nothing on my screen	05:17
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MNX1024	Anyone flashed to PR1.2 yet?	05:18
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: That was being a prick.	05:19
matthew-	thanks a lo.	05:19
matthew-	lot*	05:20
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MNX1024	Well, I'm currently having an issue right after I flashed to PR1.2	05:20
MNX1024	I was wondering if someone can help me out here.	05:21
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MNX1024	Here's the problem I'm having	05:22
MNX1024	http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/3936/img2356dh.jpg	05:22
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DocScrutinizer51	matthew-: sorry for that. But honestly there shouldn't be anything in /var/cache that isn't rebuilt on next boot afaik	05:27
DocScrutinizer51	especially I can't see why it would cause an empty screen	05:27
MNX1024	Anyone nice enough to help me out?	05:28
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: well	05:28
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: I just did it, and screen is blank	05:29
matthew-	blanc(	05:29
matthew-	just black underlit	05:29
matthew-	and that's it	05:29
matthew-	so have to reflash the device to be ready for my 8am work.	05:29
matthew-	great.	05:29
matthew-	the awesome thing being the fact that i've got no idea how to do it.	05:29
matthew-	So, thanks for making me learn useless thing at 3:30am.	05:30
skynets	dont hate the player, hate maemo	05:30
skynets	:P	05:30
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matthew-	if not the fact that it's the only phone that runs bloomberg	05:31
matthew-	i would flush it down the toilet long time ago	05:31
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matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: I would've hit you if you were here. Honestly.	05:32
matthew-	which flasher works with mac and n900???	05:33
Scifi_	MNX1024: I had that problem before PR1.2, I had to reflash and install all apps one by one	05:33
matthew-	A GUI interface for upgrading the firmware of Nokia 770, N800 and N810 devices from Mac OS X.	05:33
matthew-	is there a one for n900?	05:33
DocScrutinizer51	matthew-: there's exactly one file except apt cache in /var/cache - I guess you could restore that one file if it really casues trouble when removed	05:34
DocScrutinizer51	but I will leave now, not to get beaten	05:34
matthew-	DocScrutinizer51: there were 7 catalogues	05:34
matthew-	i removed them, tried to update, it said operation failed	05:34
matthew-	i restarted the device and cant get it back up sonce.	05:35
matthew-	since*	05:35
matthew-	awesome that i know what to do now.	05:36
matthew-	seriously, congrats on putting another person off maemo and it's support	05:37
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MNX1024	Concerning my Problem, I get this error from a freshly flashed N900.	05:37
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MNX1024	I just can't open "Contacts" without it closing in 2 seconds.	05:38
Scifi_	MNX1024: I had that problem before PR1.2, I had to reflash and install all apps one by one and it solved it	05:38
MNX1024	Anyway, how did you fix your issue anyway?	05:38
Scifi_	I don't know what caused it though. Reflash but do not restore the apps from your backup	05:38
Scifi_	Install one by one	05:38
MNX1024	My problem has nothing to do with apps.	05:38
Scifi_	That solved it for me	05:38
MNX1024	My problem is that "Contacts" is closing on it's own.	05:39
MNX1024	And I just flashed my N900.	05:39
asj	MNX1024: it's crashing	05:39
asj	MNX1024: worst case, reflash the device and the eMMC	05:39
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asj	and remove any sd cards (who knows)	05:39
Scifi_	Yep	05:40
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MNX1024	I actually reflashed with eMMC without anything in it.	05:40
Scifi_	MNX1024: Other than default Nokia/Maemo apps, which apps do you have?	05:40
MNX1024	Nothing!!!	05:40
MNX1024	I just freshly flashed my phone.	05:40
MNX1024	Basically it's a clean slate	05:40
Scifi_	Which image did you use? US/Global/UK?	05:40
asj	MNX1024: emmc is internal storage, there's a separate image for it	05:40
MNX1024	I've used US and Global, same issue.	05:41
MNX1024	And my N900 is US	05:41
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Scifi_	Tried reflashing eMMC as well?	05:41
Scifi_	There is a Vanilla image for that.	05:41
Scifi_	Just in case?	05:41
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MNX1024	I did flash with the Vanilla image.	05:42
MNX1024	Then I flashed with PR1.2	05:42
MNX1024	And whola, that is the issue I got.	05:42
asj	try redoing the pr1.2 again? maybe it didn't complete right the first time?	05:43
Scifi_	I thought you need to flash kernel first and then eMMC.	05:43
asj	and do you have any contacts on the phone btw?	05:43
MNX1024	I backed that up	05:43
Scifi_	asj: The correct order is PR1.2 first and then eMMC right?	05:44
MNX1024	No, correct order is vanilla, then pr	05:44
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MNX1024	Looks like I'm just going to go back to the older firmware	05:51
Scifi_	MNX1024: I am sure I read somewhere it is firmware first and then eMMC	05:51
Scifi_	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=41143	05:51
Scifi_	someone had the same problem	05:51
Scifi_	why not give a try PR1.2 first and then immediately eMMC	05:51
Scifi_	just as a last attempt	05:51
Scifi_	make sure you have taken necessary backups	05:52
Scifi_	and do not reboot between flashes	05:52
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MNX1024	Thanks for the tip up	05:52
MNX1024	It turns out I misread the wiki, lol	05:53
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ShadowJK	it's probably important not to reboot in between	05:54
ShadowJK	or boot	05:54
\|R	anyone manage not to flash the eMMC and still upgrade like previous release?	05:54
Scifi_	\|R: Not sure i got it. But I just flashed the FW and left eMMC as is	05:55
Scifi_	worked fine	05:55
Scifi_	I had lot file songs etc on eMMC so didn't flash it	05:56
Scifi_	it is not necessary to flash eMMC but a backup is needed before flashing FW	05:56
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puzzled	MNX1024: if you are going to redo it, flash with PR 1.2 first, do not reboot (so omit -R) and immediately flash the vanilla eMMC stuff next	05:57
MNX1024	Oh, ok than.	05:58
puzzled	do not reboot	05:58
Scifi_	MNX1024: Ever :)	05:58
puzzled	well, after the eMMC you can :)	05:58
Scifi_	puzzled: Just kidding	05:59
MNX1024	Thanks a lot guys	05:59
\|R	what is the new eMMC supposed to contain?	05:59
puzzled	no problem. good luck	05:59
Scifi_	MNX1024: Let us know how it goes	05:59
MNX1024	I hope this works, because it's seriously giving a lot of trouble	05:59
Scifi_	It may help others hopefully	05:59
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puzzled	\|R: think it's just basic files, same as when you got the N900 but in sync with PR 1.2	06:00
MNX1024	Out of curiosity, what is the difference between Global and Us?	06:00
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puzzled	I flashed the eMMc too just to get a totally clean install	06:00
\|R	puzzled: marketing crap? not Qt and all?	06:00
Scifi_	I guess date format changes, some language changes may be	06:00
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MNX1024	Guess I'll try using the global, lol	06:01
asj	\|R: qt is part of the main image	06:01
\|R	oki :)	06:01
puzzled	\|R: iirc there's Qt 4.6 preview in there	06:01
\|R	eMMC plays with dpkg ?	06:01
asj	how big is the US one and how big is Global?	06:02
\|R	that sounds awkward... or it's just a binary? and thus someone will post it i guess :)	06:02
puzzled	\|R you can download the eMMC image from the same place as the PR 1.2 image	06:02
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Ken-Young	Any reports of an OTA pr1.2 update other than in the UK?	06:02
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\|R	puzzled: i know, but i don't want to delete all i have on that partition	06:03
puzzled	then back it up :)	06:03
\|R	also what's up with the holding 'u' ... didn't need that for earlier releases :)	06:03
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Scifi_	\|R: Make sure you backup the "Backups" folder from eMMC before flashing	06:04
\|R	puzzled: but if it's to get it emptied and filled by crap marketing garbage...	06:04
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Scifi_	\|R: Before PR1.2 Vanilla eMMC had couple of Nokia videos (yes marketing), some ring tones and wall papers	06:05
puzzled	\|R: afaik you need the eMMC image installed or your N900 won't work	06:05
Scifi_	not sure about the updated image	06:05
puzzled	it's 250MB	06:06
DocScrutinizer	\|R: the 'u' is supposedly not needed if flasher is catching the right moment of NOLO bootloader checking the USB. If you hold the 'u' then NOLO is supposed not to boot but instead stay in ready-to-flash state	06:06
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MNX1024	Just to make sure once again. I should flash PR1.2 first, without the -R. Then I flash the eMMC right?	06:06
MNX1024	without unplugging the cable?	06:06
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\|R	DocScrutinizer: ok, i just used to plug it after starting flasher-3.5	06:07
puzzled	MNX1024: yes	06:07
DocScrutinizer	MNX1024: as long as you do not reboot, sequence is irrelevant. If you happen to boot between, it's probably less problem to flash eMMC first	06:07
DocScrutinizer	as rootfs on first-boot will alter the eMMC data	06:08
DocScrutinizer	then when you flash eMMC after that, these edits are lost	06:08
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puzzled	was reading the story about broken usb connectors on tmo. anyone have a similar experience?	06:09
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\|R	eMMC = /home ?	06:13
MNX1024	For some reason, flasing the PR1.2 first and then trying to flash the eMMC does not seem to work	06:15
MNX1024	I can't seem to get eMMC to flash right after PR1,2	06:15
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skynets	question: would diamond polish work on the n900 screen?	06:18
skynets	to remove scratches	06:18
Ken-Young	skynets, I think that would be more apt to introduce more scratches.	06:19
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ohwhyme	bah	06:23
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DocScrutinizer51	I'm not sure any pollishing will work on touchscreens. tried with real paste and engine (dremel), on a OMNIA. result was scratch less but large dull spot	06:28
skynets	:S	06:29
skynets	so you've got scratches on your current screen?	06:29
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ohwhyme	anyone know how hard it is to replace a screen?	06:29
skynets	not sure but its only the digitizer	06:29
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skynets	60 bucks	06:30
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skynets	fuck	06:30
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skynets	not sure if i should get it for 2 small scratches	06:30
skynets	it gets annoying	06:30
Scifi_	MNX1024: Any error message?	06:31
Ken-Young	skynets, THere are products made that make scratches on eyeglasses less noticable. They might help, and are less apt than a polishing compound to make things worse (I think).	06:32
MNX1024	Well, yes, still have the error message.	06:32
Scifi_	Contacts app crashing?	06:32
MNX1024	Yep	06:32
Scifi_	Well that sux, I guess you have to wait for OTA then. Unless anyone has a suggestion	06:33
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MNX1024	Doubt OTa works	06:33
MNX1024	I've finally narrowed down to the issue	06:33
MNX1024	It's actually my sim card that is causing a conflict somehow	06:34
MNX1024	And I don't know how to get T-Mobile to replace my sim card for free, lol	06:34
MNX1024	And without noticing that I'm using their T-Zone plan with my N900	06:34
Scifi_	So if you use a different SIM card it works fine?	06:34
MNX1024	yea	06:34
\|R	can't you flash without a SIM ?	06:35
MNX1024	That's not the problem	06:35
skynets	yeah	06:35
Scifi_	Yes he can but the problem reappears after inserting SIM	06:35
Scifi_	if i got it right	06:35
MNX1024	Yep	06:35
skynets	ill check it out	06:36
MNX1024	The problem occures only with "my" sim card	06:36
MNX1024	Well, it is pretty old and busted up	06:36
MNX1024	Now I have another Problem, my phone is not reading my microsd....	06:36
MNX1024	wtf....	06:36
thunderfest	I flashed from pr1.1 to 1.2 and back to 1.1 today and I connot for the life of me get my n900 to recognize my sim anymore	06:36
MNX1024	PR1.2 just gave me so many problems.	06:36
thunderfest	me too	06:37
DocScrutinizer51	MNX1024: delete contacts from your sim	06:37
MNX1024	If the N900 wasn't such a great phone and does the things I need, I would've trashed it by now.	06:37
MNX1024	Try this here	06:37
MNX1024	http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=640267&postcount=365	06:37
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DocScrutinizer51	thunderfest: flashing back to 1.1 from 1.2 renders whole modem nonfunct	06:38
DocScrutinizer51	known 'issue'	06:39
MNX1024	You can fix that by flashing only the pr1.2's modem driver	06:39
DocScrutinizer51	as 1.2 updates modem firmware	06:39
DocScrutinizer51	yep	06:39
DocScrutinizer51	probably	06:39
GeneralAntilles	Can somebody check a string for me?	06:39
thunderfest	wow what a mess this all is	06:40
GeneralAntilles	I need to know what the first checkbox in the Browser options window where the cache, hardware key and other stuff is is called.	06:40
GeneralAntilles	"Automatically focus address bar" or something like that.	06:40
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shinkamui	yay!	06:41
shinkamui	pr1.2 today?	06:41
GeneralAntilles	and can somebody tell me which button in options brings that dialog up?	06:41
ohwhyme	yes shinkamui	06:42
DocScrutinizer51	GeneralAntilles: sorry no 1.2 here	06:42
shinkamui	anyone who has it know if it fixes the missing 3D libs and some of the broken widgets in gtk apps?	06:43
MNX1024	Doc, your tip really saved my butt!!!	06:43
MNX1024	Deleting the contacts from my sim actually worked!!!!!	06:43
shinkamui	my leaked 1.2 has been perfect other than those	06:43
\|R	MNX1024: woohoo!	06:43
\|R	MNX1024: everything is fixed?	06:44
MNX1024	Now my only problem is that I can't read my microsd anymore....	06:44
MNX1024	Not everything	06:44
\|R	doh	06:44
MNX1024	microsd problem.	06:44
MNX1024	lol	06:44
MNX1024	one problem is fix, next comes up	06:44
MNX1024	I don't think I like PR1.2	06:44
\|R	you can't mount it manually either?	06:44
thunderfest	so my choices are....use pr1.2 and have gms abilities but no gles 1 (which I am currently using to make a game) ....or downgrade to pr1.1 which will render me gms unusable...or use pr 1.2 force the gles 1 which will create dependency problems...or downgrade to pr1.1 and use the gsm libs from the leaked pr 1.2 to create a "frankenbuild"	06:44
MNX1024	What do you mean by mount it manually?	06:44
\|R	MNX1024: well from a shell with the mount command	06:45
Scifi_	GeneralAntilles: Open any webpage, Menu --> Options -->Settings	06:45
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shinkamui	thunderfest, woah, so gles is still broken in 1.2?	06:45
MNX1024	franken build it is for you	06:45
shinkamui	nooooo!	06:45
MNX1024	R: you might want to instruct me on that	06:45
* shinkamui is dissapointed, he really wants descent on his n900 :(		06:45
thunderfest	shinkamui: yes gles is still broken in pr1.2	06:45
\|R	MNX1024: gimmie a sec :)	06:45
shinkamui	pardon my french, but that is fucking GAY.	06:45
MNX1024	But the fact that I can't use my microsd just by going to file manager or through my other app is a no no	06:46
shinkamui	so I guess bounce evo doesn't work on 1.2 either	06:46
\|R	MNX1024: in the shell, typing : df do you see anything saying mmcblk1p1 ?	06:46
shinkamui	not that it matters, but thats silly, nokia best be fixin it	06:46
MNX1024	I have mmcblk0p1	06:46
MNX1024	lol	06:46
MNX1024	and mmcblk0p2	06:47
\|R	yeah that's MyDocs	06:47
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\|R	and /home	06:47
MNX1024	well, I have /home/opt	06:47
thunderfest	shinkamui: we filed the bug report earlier (https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6816) please vote on it and maybe we can get this issue fixed	06:47
povbot`	Bug 6816: OpenGL ES 1.1 should be supported	06:47
\|R	MNX1024: yes but what you want is /media/mmc1 which would be your microSD	06:48
MNX1024	Let me reflash one "last" time and hope it would work	06:49
MNX1024	if not, I'll come back and bother you in 5 minutes, lol	06:49
\|R	yeah maybe that's it	06:49
\|R	:)	06:49
Scifi_	MNX1024: Good luck again	06:49
Scifi_	this time try eMMC first and FW next?	06:49
\|R	I'm waiting for my backup to finish before trying to flash... a friend just flashed his with only the root (not eMMC) and it seems to work...	06:49
Scifi_	as DocScrutinizer said	06:49
MNX1024	sci: that's what I've been doing, lol	06:49
Scifi_	:)	06:49
shinkamui	thunderfest, voting as we speak	06:50
thunderfest	thanks	06:50
MNX1024	when i did the opposite, like you guys told me, flashing eMMC in the end never seems to flash	06:50
MNX1024	lol	06:50
Scifi_	thunderfest: done	06:50
\|R	weird	06:50
DocScrutinizer51	sure, you don't need to flash eMMC when updating to 1.2	06:51
MNX1024	if you're talking about me, then my reason for it was because I did too much stupid stuff on the phone and I need a clean install. :D	06:52
\|R	DocScrutinizer51: there is nothing of value to the system, you're sure? anyone seen a list of files around? (diff between eMMCs)	06:52
DocScrutinizer51	but who told you to flash eMMC last?	06:52
\|R	i've read that somewhere too	06:52
\|R	(eMMC flash)	06:52
Scifi_	DocScutinizer51: thats me	06:52
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MNX1024	After rereading the wiki, I've realize, I was right in the first place. You have to flash eMMC first. lol	06:53
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microlith	....	06:53
microlith	why is flasher-3.5 forcibly rebooting my device when I tell it to flash the eMMC	06:53
DocScrutinizer51	MNX1024: yes. as I told you	06:53
MNX1024	What confused me was scifi told me to flash the fw first, and the new red message in the wiki	06:53
Scifi_	Few weeks ago I followed this blog blindly http://maemocentral.com/2010/02/05/how-to-hard-reset-the-n900-to-the-factory-state/	06:54
Scifi_	It said FW first and eMMC next	06:54
Scifi_	it worked for me anyway	06:54
\|R	hehe	06:54
Scifi_	But what u said made sense	06:54
microlith	which is what I'm doing	06:54
Scifi_	microlith: Then don't do it :)	06:54
microlith	and instead it reboots the device into a non-working state	06:54
microlith	rather than actually flashing the N900	06:55
DocScrutinizer51	simple rule: flashing eMMC will break your system. So you need to flash rootfs after that	06:55
MNX1024	scifi: well, this wiki here said you have to flash the eMMC first: https://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware	06:55
microlith	there we go	06:56
Scifi_	Yes thats the official source :)	06:56
\|R	the question is...	06:56
\|R	why do you have to flash the eMMC ...	06:56
microlith	DocScrutinizer51: if that's the case then Nokia needs to fix their site	06:56
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MNX1024	but you confused me with the whole flashing fw first, lol	06:56
Scifi_	MNX1024: Sorry, hope your N900 is back to usable state soon :)	06:57
MNX1024	I do hope so, lol	06:57
MNX1024	at least I got the contacts part fix	06:57
DocScrutinizer51	microlith: it's obvious as eMMC flash kills /homeVopt	06:57
MNX1024	now I just hope this reflash would save my memory card	06:57
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DocScrutinizer51	I doubt	06:57
DocScrutinizer51	sorry	06:58
microlith	DocScrutinizer51: realizing that now, however Nokia's own site describes the exact reverse	06:58
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DocScrutinizer51	anyway as long as you don't boot the freshly flashed rootfs nothing bad will happen if you flash 'wrong' sequence	07:00
MNX1024	I give up, the phone still can't read my memory card	07:00
DocScrutinizer51	toldya	07:00
MNX1024	Looks like I'll send my phone in for a replacement once I get a new phone, lol.	07:01
DocScrutinizer51	reformat the card	07:01
microlith	except trying to flash in the wrong order -will- break your device, as trying to flash the eMMC forces a reboot	07:01
DocScrutinizer51	probably the MBR got corrupted	07:01
MNX1024	MBR?	07:01
espringe	master boot record	07:01
espringe	Does anyone know why scratchbox would have a different version of Qt than my n900? :/	07:02
MNX1024	I need some elaboration.	07:02
DocScrutinizer51	MNX1024: in your desktop linux call cfdisk for the uSD	07:03
DocScrutinizer51	delete all partitions, create one VFAT partition	07:04
DocScrutinizer51	then mkfs.vfat a fs on the card	07:04
DocScrutinizer51	take care not to accidentaly nuke your harddisk	07:04
MNX1024	I have no idea what you just said to me, lol	07:04
MNX1024	But all I can say is, thanks a lot for helping me.	07:05
espringe	MNX1024, have you formatted your card?	07:05
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MNX1024	just did	07:05
espringe	how did you do it?	07:05
MNX1024	right click, format	07:05
MNX1024	restore to default	07:06
espringe	not sure how it varies, but you might want to try what docScrutinzer suggested	07:06
espringe	if you have linux installed	07:06
espringe	You can google 'cfdisk' which is a partion manager program thingy	07:07
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GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, anything specific holding you back?	07:08
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MNX1024	Looks like reformating my card made it fine.	07:08
DocScrutinizer51	no OTA	07:08
DocScrutinizer51	MNX1024: woohoo	07:08
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MNX1024	Did not think 1.2 would give me this much trouble.....	07:09
MNX1024	The previous firmware was a breeze...	07:09
DocScrutinizer51	MNX1024: the uSD issue probably was unrelated	07:09
MNX1024	it was?	07:10
MNX1024	It was working fine before	07:10
MNX1024	but the heck with it. It's fine now, so no point in pondering.	07:10
MNX1024	Thanks a lot though!!!	07:10
asj	MNX1024: fat has no error checking so really the satement should be "I knew of no errors"	07:10
DocScrutinizer51	sure a point in pondering	07:11
asj	MNX1024: it could have been very broken for a very long time. Wife's sd cards always seem messed up one way or anothen	07:11
DocScrutinizer51	wiki needs a recommendation to remove uSD prior to flashing	07:11
MNX1024	Not as of now. Got to head to bed and wake up early, then go on my 50 mile bike ride.	07:11
DocScrutinizer51	remove battery - WTF! sure this can kill the uSD	07:11
MNX1024	I was suppose to be in bed at an hour ago...	07:12
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Scifi_	MNX1024: So ur issues fixed?	07:12
MNX1024	yep	07:12
MNX1024	everything is fine	07:12
Scifi_	cool	07:12
GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, ah, right, somehow UK got it first.	07:12
MNX1024	once I'm done with installing all my ap, I gotta sleep	07:12
Scifi_	Good night	07:12
MNX1024	night	07:12
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* DocScrutinizer51 firing up HAM just another time :-S		07:14
microlith	there, ticking again	07:14
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MNX1024	Anyone know of a bike dashboard for the N900?	07:14
MNX1024	I've been looking for one so I can attach it to my bike.	07:14
DocScrutinizer51	nope, sorry	07:16
asj	MNX1024: someone made one and won an awards	07:18
asj	don't know if they ever released the code	07:18
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* RST38h yawns, watching just the right selection of tmo posters bitch about pr1.2 not being available in the US yet		07:19
asj	wfm, like I care about the US ;)	07:20
GAN900	RST38h, who cares? Buggy as shit anyway.	07:20
* DocScrutinizer yawns sympathizing		07:20
RST38h	GAN: anything really bad I should look out for?	07:21
* DocScrutinizer ponders to postpone update for another week :-P		07:21
GAN900	rsalveti,	07:21
DocScrutinizer	just in case	07:21
GAN900	er	07:21
GAN900	RST38h, haven't found anything nasty	07:21
GAN900	Just a whole lot of sloppy rough edges and regressions	07:22
GAN900	DocScrutinizer, wont help	07:22
GAN900	B	07:22
DocScrutinizer	cool, regressions - I love it	07:22
GAN900	Nothing'll be different in a wekk.	07:22
pupnik_	nice vague insinuation	07:22
GAN900	Maybe my typing will be worse.	07:22
DocScrutinizer	GAN900: workarounds for problems yet to find will be known in a week	07:22
GAN900	Got two bugs out tonight	07:23
asj	I haven't seen any major problems with 19-1	07:23
GAN900	Gonna try to do the more involved ones tomorrow evening.	07:23
RST38h	ah	07:23
RST38h	WW19 is pretty fresh stuff btw	07:24
DocScrutinizer	e.g who'd have known you possibly need to erase all contacts from SIM, not to cause contacts app to crash in a second	07:24
asj	well it's -1, so I assume wk18 probably has a million builds ;)	07:24
MNX1024	The dashboard I meant means the mount for it, lol	07:24
GAN900	I love that it was delayed forever and still sucks	07:24
DocScrutinizer	GAN900: a very nice bug btw	07:25
RST38h	GAN: That has been fully expected though	07:25
GAN900	RST38h, true enough	07:26
DocScrutinizer	GAN900: probably caused by new modem FW	07:26
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Scifi_	MNX1024: Seems like u r not the only one with crashing issues	07:26
GAN900	RST38h, it's amazing that no matter how much I manage to lower my expectations, Nokia still slips under the bar	07:26
Scifi_	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=677799#post677799	07:26
RST38h	Bth psychologically (too long wait time inflating expectations) and testing-wise (I do not believe they really test)	07:26
GAN900	DocScrutinizer, SIM contacts are ugly anyway. :P	07:26
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GAN900	RST38h, nor I	07:26
DocScrutinizer	lol, agreed	07:27
MNX1024	lol, looks like I wasn't the only unlucky fella	07:27
GAN900	It's amazing what slips through the cracks	07:27
Scifi_	Yep	07:27
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GAN900	It's like the nazi-checklist against their stupid specks	07:27
MNX1024	I'm almost done with my apps, and bed I will head to afterwards.	07:27
GAN900	and test for certifications	07:27
GAN900	and call it a day	07:27
RST38h	more or less	07:27
* asj smells the wiff of whinning		07:27
GAN900	s/specks/specs	07:28
RST38h	but then, such a complex UI is a bitch to test	07:28
asj	I think it would be beneficial to release a small number of more frequent small updates than large ones though	07:28
RST38h	cannot test it well with the unit tests (which are overrated anyway)	07:29
GAN900	asj, I'm filing bugs, so your nose is miscalibrated. :)	07:29
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thunderfest	but then stuff would break all the time instead of all at once	07:29
RST38h	they could have done it by releasing a beta to the community and addressing community bug reports	07:29
GAN900	asj, Nokia's processes are completely incapable of working like that.	07:29
RST38h	but no, that is apparently not how nokia works	07:29
microlith	RST38h: iirc, they ignored most input from the 300 they released last september, no?	07:30
asj	GAN900: you must know them better than me	07:30
GAN900	RST38h, well, certification takes to long	07:30
RST38h	microlith: Not ignored, they are still fixing bugs reported by those 300 people	07:30
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GAN900	If you get a beta out a month ahead of release then only critical data-eating bugs can be fixed.	07:30
dmj726	I would be fine with their slow updates if they at least had open beta processes	07:30
RST38h	GAN: You only have to recertify when you change cellmo and power management	07:30
GAN900	RST38h, Flash, too.	07:31
opdf2	so what apps can I uninstall for free up for OTA?	07:31
RST38h	GAN: Changes to desktop or pa do not require that	07:31
wall[e]	hi, anyone on virtual keyboard know a way to just enter text rather type enter character?	07:31
wall[e]	w/o sliding hwkb out	07:31
asj	I suspect you would shocked at how small the n900 team is now	07:31
GAN900	and they have their own inhouse bullshit, too.	07:31
GAN900	asj, not at all	07:31
dmj726	...then I could have proper updates and testing while keeping Mom on the stable release	07:31
wall[e]	eg. on skype chat i enter, and it types enter, not enter the text for me	07:31
RST38h	They should just hire some Android process management guy	07:31
wall[e]	oh i forget to click outside	07:32
GAN900	asj, I'm just sick and tired of Nokia screwing over this platform.	07:32
asj	GAN900: by your comments I could beg to differ	07:32
GAN900	asj, meh.	07:32
GAN900	asj, been here for 5 years.	07:32
GAN900	asj, I know all of the excuses	07:32
RST38h	asj: A lot of people at #maemo have got sort of a history with Maemo devices	07:32
GAN900	I just don't think they're acceptable.	07:33
RST38h	asj: We have heard all of this before	07:33
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asj	RST38h: what's your point? It's a dead end device with fw that's dead end in maintainance mode	07:33
RST38h	asj: My point is that the manufacturer should not declare device dead 3 months after manufacture	07:34
GAN900	Which justifies a bit of bitching when you've poured as much of your time into it as we have.	07:34
wall[e]	ok, dumbass	07:34
wall[e]	just click outside you insensitive clod	07:34
wall[e]	bah	07:34
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GAN900	wall[e], virtual input hasn't been tested by Nokia since the N810.	07:34
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ShadowJK	Since the N810 came out, right	07:35
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GAN900	The PR1.2 vkb is a fucking joke	07:35
RST38h	asj: My other point is that non-critical stuff (no certification) should be updated often, both to show that Nokia cares and to collect bug reports	07:35
GAN900	"Let's make it more useful by making the keys IMPOSSIBLE to hit!"	07:35
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RST38h	GAN: BTW, Opera keyboard is quite nice	07:36
* RST38h would not be averse to having that everywhere		07:36
GAN900	RST38h, problem is, they don't care and they don't want bug reports. ;)	07:36
GAN900	WTF we're they thinking?	07:36
RST38h	GAN: Correct. Or such is the impression, anyway	07:36
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opdf2	anyone try this to quickly gain OTA space? http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Tanner#Safely_free_some_space_on_rootfs	07:36
RST38h	They are thinking of selling you the NEXT device? :)	07:36
GAN900	Let's use space for this vkb as inefficiently as possible.	07:36
asj	RST38h: we agree there, I think it would be better to release more frequently	07:36
GAN900	Idiocy	07:37
RST38h	...and that next device often becomes an Android device lately	07:37
GAN900	60 wpm on the N800	07:37
asj	RST38h: but there seem to be release maturity issues within the mameo group	07:37
RST38h	asj: Please use English	07:37
GAN900	down to about 40 wpm on PR1.0	07:37
Stskeeps	morn	07:37
RST38h	moo Sts	07:37
GAN900	down to about 35 on PR1.1	07:37
RST38h	Ah, GAN, you will learn :)))	07:38
GAN900	down to less than 30 on PR1.2	07:38
GAN900	Something isn't right here.	07:38
* GAN900 sleeps.		07:38
RST38h	your touchscreen is losing sensitivity maybe? =)	07:38
GAN900	RST38h, no, the software is trending towards "fucking useless"	07:38
pupnik_	there shouldnt even be a vkb	07:39
DocScrutinizer	moo Stskeeps	07:39
asj	RST38h: hmm? big projects stopping cleanly releasing, continuing work and merging changes upstream as work continues is something that takes time to learn how to do well	07:39
* \|R flashed, restoring 940MB :P		07:39
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* Stskeeps notes things didn't calm down overnight		07:39
Scifi_	Lot of ppl are facing issues with eMMC flashing. Here is the bug link	07:40
DocScrutinizer	GAN900: you're getting old and get artrosis	07:40
Scifi_	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10264	07:40
povbot`	Bug 10264: Unable to flash emmc RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin on newly released PR 1.2 Iindian variant)	07:40
wall[e]	pupnik_, help with global warming due to less energy used to get a character.	07:40
* ShadowJK missed all the excitement		07:41
RST38h	asj: This is not a software project	07:41
GAN900	docsc	07:41
ShadowJK	But I'm guessing people discover that despite 5 months in the works it's not the holy grail	07:41
GAN900	DocScrutinizer, clearly.	07:41
RST38h	asj: This is a hardware support project. makes it different.	07:41
RST38h	But still...	07:41
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asj	RST38h: not in the least	07:41
RST38h	ShadowJK: No shit, Sherlock...	07:41
* GAN900 really sleeps		07:41
* ShadowJK wonders if there's a way to get kernel to tell you the total amount of locked memory		07:42
RST38h	ShadowJK: And that has not started yet. The moment OTA hits the US, we will all have to close t.m.o and wait for a week, until lemmings calm down	07:42
ShadowJK	would be interesting to compare 1.1.1 and 1.2	07:42
DocScrutinizer	ehlo ShadowJK	07:42
ShadowJK	hello	07:43
DocScrutinizer	RST38h: ack :-)	07:44
pupnik_	i hear 1.2 feels faster	07:44
asj	RST38h: just because it runs on a phone doesn't make it hardware, maemo is a huge software project. Treating it as anything but is the road to failure.	07:44
DocScrutinizer	i hear 1.2 falls faster	07:44
ShadowJK	I just have to reboot 1.1.1 and it feels faster ;-)	07:44
RST38h	asj: it has got certain specifics	07:44
RST38h	asj: consider this	07:44
RST38h	ShadowJK: oh yesss	07:45
pupnik_	i think asj has a good point	07:45
RST38h	asj: Your random open-source software project is a piece of free software that comes with no expectations attached	07:45
pupnik_	calling 1.2 "firmware" doesnt make it so	07:45
pronto	is the 1.2 going to show up in thhe applicatoin manager?	07:45
\|R	libgles is screwed up apparently...	07:45
RST38h	asj: People who do not like it may switch to different software or modify it to their needs	07:45
asj	RST38h: I disagree with that, but continue	07:46
RST38h	asj: Maemo isn't just software. 100% of its user base have plunked n*$100 to buy devices that run nothing but Maemo	07:46
DocScrutinizer	actually calling it firmware is braindamaged	07:46
DocScrutinizer	~dict firmware	07:46
infobot	Dictionary 'firmware' (1 of 3): /ferm'weir/ n. Embedded software contained in EPROM or flash memory. It isn't quite hardware, but at least doesn't have to be loaded from a disk like regular software. Hacker usage differs from straight techspeak in that hackers don't normally apply it to stuff that you can't possibly get at, such as the program that runs a pocket calculator. Instead, it implies that the firmware could be changed, even if doing so ...	07:46
pupnik_	ty DocScrutinizer	07:47
RST38h	asj: Nor can people fix all Maemo problems by themselves	07:47
asj	RST38h: if I buy MS Word (vista, windows 7, etc) I'm not buying hardware, I'm buying closed source software	07:47
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thunderfest	\|R: yes gles is screwed up ... gles2 works but not gles1.1	07:48
asj	what's a retail full price copy of Office these days? it's well over $500, and it contains bugs like any other, and has no offical bug filling method to boot ;)	07:48
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microlith	and office 2007 has some pretty harsh regressions, too :)	07:49
DocScrutinizer	evidence: there's a folder with firmware inside maemo rootfs. So you might argue the rest of it obviously isn't firmware then	07:49
* wall[e] kept googling for maego related info and wonder why there was no result.		07:50
* ShadowJK wonders if 1.2 fixes the occasional need to cycle device offline for 60s to regain cellular		07:50
pupnik_	that dict link ecplains it	07:50
DocScrutinizer	also fw generally isn't edited/configured by the user	07:50
\|R	python-gobject also missing ...	07:51
RST38h	asj: Office cost me $10, or I would never buy it.	07:51
RST38h	asj: Even at $10, I seriously doubt the usefullness of this purchase.	07:52
pupnik_	heh	07:52
RST38h	But Office is patched way more frequently than Maemo	07:52
asj	RST38h: anyways, you can make the same argument against any commercial software, and it seems as the price increase so do the bugs...I could tell you horror stories about $15k software packages	07:52
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thunderfest	ok all I have a workaround for gles1.1 on pr 1.2	07:53
RST38h	asj: I can tell you horror stories about $1b software packages :)	07:53
RST38h	thunder: What is wrong with gles1.1 there?	07:53
\|R	arf a bunch of widget requires pyhton-gobject :/	07:53
thunderfest	nokia forgot to build the libs for it	07:53
opdf2	is a backup from 1.1.1 restorable in 1.2?	07:54
\|R	yep	07:54
RST38h	thunderfest: OMFG...	07:54
opdf2	okay so I could just do a backup, uninstall all my apps for rootfs space, then restore safely	07:54
pupnik_	thunderfest: got a prog that uses gles 1.1 yet?	07:55
thunderfest	opdf2: yes except some some apps that depend on opengles 1.1 will not reinstall (brainparty GLtron nehe ect)	07:55
pupnik_	tty	07:55
opdf2	thunderfest: okay thanks for the heads up	07:56
DocScrutinizer	ShadowJK: rarely seen here (60s offline)	07:56
ZogG_N900	damn. never had widget play button bug til pr1.2	07:56
opdf2	that's still a bug in 1.2?	07:56
thunderfest	pupnik: yes I can run the nehe demos and my own opengles apps	07:56
ZogG_N900	it just doesn't work	07:56
Wolfie	aww, no pr1.2 yet	07:56
ZogG_N900	i didn't have it before though	07:56
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ZogG_N900	and it works as i change theme. the weirdest thing ever	07:57
ZogG_N900	as well sometimes ukbrd doesn't appear till reboot	07:57
ZogG_N900	i hope wouldn't wait another 5 months for fixes )	07:58
DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: I gather you found the bug meanwhile in google? :-D	07:58
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RST38h	ZogG: Caused by other applets (OMWeather, RSS, USSD)	07:59
RST38h	remove them	07:59
ShadowJK	It'd be funny if there was a typo in some tiny script somewhere that completely killed, for example, microsd, and we'd have to wait until November :D	07:59
ZogG_N900	how do i check libraries and packeges in maemo. if they allright. like revdep-rebuild	07:59
RST38h	ShadowJK: Lack of gles1.1 is a huge problem for me	07:59
RST38h	Almost like that typo	07:59
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ZogG_N900	RST38h, still it's bug.	07:59
DocScrutinizer	Wolfie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk	08:00
ShadowJK	start filing bugreports :D	08:00
RST38h	ZogG: It has been filed.	08:00
Wolfie	DocScrutinizer: :D, nah, i'll wait. Just somehow thought for it to be available at midnight	08:01
RST38h	And even researched, a little bit	08:01
thunderfest	yes everyone please vote on the opengl es 1.1 bug (https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6816)	08:01
povbot`	Bug 6816: OpenGL ES 1.1 should be supported	08:01
thunderfest	but the workaround is working I just installed brainparty and it works	08:01
RST38h	what is the workarond? Use the old library?	08:02
thunderfest	yeah force the old library to install...its not a real solution cause if ans when the real lib come out you'll have dependency all over the place	08:03
DocScrutinizer	dman, too late, but anyway:	08:04
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DocScrutinizer	HAPPY 5TH BIRTHDAY #MAEMO	08:04
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pupnik_	suddenly the blue fn key only works when held down	08:06
pupnik_	:(	08:06
ZogG_N900	RST38h, yep. but reboot brings it back	08:06
ZogG_N900	damn	08:06
DocScrutinizer	pupnik_: WAHT?	08:06
pupnik_	expected result: hit blue fn key once to get blue-key symbols (e.g. numbers)	08:07
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DocScrutinizer	yes	08:07
thunderfest	but as long as you remember to remove the old lib when the fix come out you'll be fine...and the work around will let you use opengl es 1.1 now....I would not really recommend this for the average user .. but if you are a deveopler who is actively developing with opengl es 1.1 this will get you going on pr1.2	08:07
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DocScrutinizer	I guess they 'fixed' that with the idiotic "holding a key gets the symbol" kickprovement	08:08
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DocScrutinizer	or kinkprovement	08:08
RST38h	yea, the keyboard (physical and virtual) is definitely suffering from overabundance of "UX designers"	08:09
tybollt_	\o/	08:09
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DocScrutinizer	RST38h: ack, and not only the kbd	08:10
Stskeeps	meh, you people would be happy with emacs as a UX ;)	08:10
ZogG_N900	so how do i check if the packages are not broken?	08:10
ZogG_N900	so maemo still reminds to be as one update instead seperate packages	08:11
DocScrutinizer	pupnik: there's a fix for the 'symbols without blue' shit (some gconf voodoo) - maybe it fixes the blue button itself as well	08:11
RST38h	Sts: You know I am deeply suspicious of anything using AI language for scripting...	08:11
ZogG_N900	and next bugfixes never comming	08:11
RST38h	Sts: But at the moment, EMACS does not look like a worse choice	08:12
ZogG_N900	i would use vim if i needed	08:12
Stskeeps	RST38h: i'm starting to wonder if RMS's erractic behaviour is from that he actually uploaded himself into emacs ..	08:12
microlith	Stskeeps: so RMS himself has become a LISP program?	08:13
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DocScrutinizer	probably he's always been ;-)	08:14
DocScrutinizer	the ghost in the machine, born in Bell labs, and finally freeing himself by founding party of GNU	08:15
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ZogG_N900	RST38h, is it other widgets break it or it's mediad widget bug?	08:15
RST38h	Sts: no, it is from the Tentacled One sucking his brain out early in his career	08:16
tybollt_	Stskeeps: sorry, there is already maemo/meego, we do not need another OS (emacs). :P	08:16
RST38h	ZogG: It is some DBUs bug	08:16
RST38h	ZogG: Complicated by the fact that all widgets are running in the same process	08:16
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tybollt_	is there an app that displays the date right in the status bar?	08:17
RST38h	yes	08:17
tybollt_	I seem to recall there was one but can't find it :-\|	08:17
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RST38h	there is a few calendar widgets	08:17
RST38h	you can even have it displayed in arabic	08:17
tybollt_	ja but I mean right up there next to the clock in the status bar? Not on the desktop	08:17
RST38h	oh, no	08:18
tybollt_	sigh... ok I understand.	08:18
ZogG_N900	RST38h, but shouldn't be fixed in pr1.2. never had that problem before	08:18
DocScrutinizer	status bar is missing quite a few configuration options	08:18
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DocScrutinizer	rsp the applets in there	08:19
RST38h	ZogG: it depends on other applets you have	08:19
RST38h	moo tekojo	08:19
ZogG_N900	same as before	08:19
ZogG_N900	conversation and player	08:19
RST38h	which ones?	08:19
RST38h	remove conversation	08:19
RST38h	I can almost bet the player will work	08:19
tekojo	morning	08:20
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ZogG_N900	RST38h, it works. but i need conversations	08:20
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RST38h	tough	08:20
tybollt_	DocScrutinizer: Well then we agree, MOAR POWER to the staus bar :)	08:20
tybollt_	s/staus/status/	08:21
infobot	tybollt_ meant: DocScrutinizer: Well then we agree, MOAR POWER to the status bar :)	08:21
DocScrutinizer	:-D	08:21
RST38h	moar power to the straus bar	08:21
* DocScrutinizer googles for next straus bar		08:21
DocScrutinizer	http://twitter.com/DionneSouth/status/1431764269 and the strauss bar in Zurich is closed because of drug dealing XP	08:24
wall[e]	DocScrutinizer, hehe, just typo	08:24
ZogG_N900	does anyone know how next fixes would work. per package or in update?	08:24
tybollt_	:(	08:24
wall[e]	rushing works or i'd get fire	08:24
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tybollt_	Im not a drug dealer	08:24
RST38h	really?	08:24
tybollt_	come now, I'a zit faced nerd w/ greasy hair and bad breath - who the hell would buyy drugs from me?	08:25
tybollt_	:)	08:25
RST38h	good cover	08:25
RST38h	and I am sure you do not have a pirate ship, too?	08:25
tybollt_	I am from sweden so...	08:25
ZogG_N900	sweden girls. mmmmm	08:26
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DocScrutinizer	~xyawn	08:27
DocScrutinizer	infobot: wake up!	08:27
infobot	rumour has it, xyawn is nap	08:27
* infobot throws a barrel-full of ice water on up! and shouts "GOOD MORNING!!!!"		08:27
* microlith hits hildon-desktop with a stick, show the xchat icon!		08:28
DocScrutinizer	now you got me upset, try again	08:28
DocScrutinizer	~xyawn	08:28
infobot	methinks xyawn is nap	08:28
DocScrutinizer	bah	08:28
* DocScrutinizer overrides silly infobot and heads out for a coffee		08:29
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wall[e]	me too	08:31
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tybollt_	uhm	08:34
tybollt_	says sygic is free in ovi store	08:34
tybollt_	can't be, can it?	08:34
RST38h	it can	08:35
RST38h	maps will cost you though	08:35
tybollt_	heh :)	08:35
tybollt_	walk right into that one didn't I? :)	08:35
Trizt	tybollt_; 7day trial now in OVI store [http://www.sygic.com/]	08:35
DocScrutinizer	finally I tought her... ;-D	08:36
DocScrutinizer	~xyawn	08:36
infobot	xyawn is, like, strong coffee	08:36
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tybollt_	did someone around here try sygic?	08:36
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RST38h	yes, what would you like to know?	08:37
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tybollt_	really just overall - does it deliver?	08:37
RST38h	depends on what you need	08:37
RST38h	for a car driver it does, for a pedestrian do not bother	08:38
tybollt_	ah ok	08:38
tybollt_	this would be pedestrian	08:38
tybollt_	I have a separate unit in my car	08:38
RST38h	Maep for pedestrians, free in Extras	08:38
tybollt_	RST38h: so it's the lack of compass that ruins it for pedestrian or?	08:38
tybollt_	ah ok	08:38
RST38h	If you want offline maps, Ovi Maps wil do the job	08:38
tybollt_	sure	08:38
tybollt_	thanks	08:39
RST38h	tybollt: No, the map lacks detail needed for pedestrian use	08:39
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Trizt	RST38h; but you need an infected machine to get offline maps	08:39
tybollt_	'infected'?	08:40
RST38h	tybollt: That is, of course, Russian map. Your mileage may vary	08:40
RST38h	Trizt: No, you do not need Ovi Suite to get aps	08:40
RST38h	Trizt: Can just download and copy them	08:40
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Trizt	RST38h; how do you download the offline maps?	08:41
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RST38h	Trizt: google.	08:42
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ToJa92	Wow, maep is extremely accurate	08:43
wall[e]	can you use n900 in space?	08:44
wall[e]	like no air	08:44
wall[e]	with bt headset in helmet	08:44
RST38h	wall[e]: you should tr	08:45
RST38h	y	08:45
wall[e]	yeh	08:45
Trizt	not likely, your blood will boil	08:45
wall[e]	no, i'm in space suite	08:45
RST38h	wall[e]: You are in your space suite...like...right now?	08:46
DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: probably yes	08:46
wall[e]	kind of	08:46
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RST38h	I guess this makes the standard "What are you wearing?" question pointless.	08:46
Trizt	then you have to shoult quite a lot and as the space outside lacks medium to transport the sound, your voice wouldn't reach the phone	08:47
Corsac	wall[e]: only in pr1.2	08:47
DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: you easily can test by putting the N900 into a vacuum chamber	08:48
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DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: but I guess it will not like the hard radiation out in space	08:48
RST38h	http://pics.livejournal.com/texconten/pic/00064gee	08:49
wall[e]	DocScrutinizer, thanks	08:49
Corsac	at what time was the uk pr 1.2 available ota yesterday?	08:49
DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: for the vacuum major issues come from touchscreen, LCD, and cell	08:49
wall[e]	i only concern like solar activities	08:49
wall[e]	RST38h, http://www.flickr.com/photos/id34/4640706951/	08:50
wall[e]	while coding I dress like that	08:50
DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: the type of chip used in OMAP reacts extremely unforgiving to xray and ion radiation	08:50
wall[e]	ah	08:51
wazd1	hello humanity	08:51
RST38h	wall[e]: Does it give you superpowers, or simply prevents the management from crawling from behind and hitting you on the head while screaming "AND DON'T YOU EVER USE STL LIKE THAT"?	08:51
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wall[e]	my gf gave me, at least	08:52
wall[e]	i wear it just to make her happy	08:52
RST38h	Ah	08:52
* wall[e] clears screen.		08:52
RST38h	Hello wazd the 1st	08:52
Strobeflux	I cannot send PMs on the site, It says that im not having sufficient privileges or that my accoun't hasnt been activated. But it is activated.	08:52
wall[e]	but.. i like the part that, you can press buttons on the side and auto close the mask and with beeps beeps etc voices and noises.	08:53
* RST38h doubts Doc has ever tried using his OMAP in xray/radiation rich environment		08:53
wall[e]	DocScrutinizer, someone x-rays the device right?	08:53
wall[e]	but that is different coz it's off?	08:54
wazd1	RST38h: moo :)	08:54
* RST38h off to work		08:54
wazd1	anybody knows where to get PR 1.2 theme template?	08:54
wall[e]	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=634108	08:54
wall[e]	for those who wonders	08:54
* RST38h hopes corporate wifi will have to suffer an OTA download today		08:54
DocScrutinizer	RST38h: yu're right, but I know about the design principles for xray-hardened chips used in spacecraft etc, and I can tell OMAP chip is exactly the opposite	08:54
RST38h	Doc: Yes and no	08:54
Corsac	RST38h: I don't have corporate wifi, so I'd rather like if it was available _before_ I leave :)	08:55
RST38h	Doc: IBM Thinkpads have been successfully used on ISS for years	08:55
DocScrutinizer	inside ISS	08:55
wall[e]	do they use it outside the iss?	08:55
RST38h	Doc: But yes, you basically want a fault tolerant design	08:55
DocScrutinizer	and those have no OMAP, right?	08:56
RST38h	Doc: It is not like you cannot shield a cell phone, especially if you can shield the huge garbage can the ISS is	08:56
wall[e]	reminds me i wouldn't want digital compass if i were in space	08:56
RST38h	Doc: They have got Intel chips, with the same or higher integration scale than OMAP	08:56
DocScrutinizer	RST38h: with larger structures and higher currents, so a single ionization doesn't flip the bit or fry the totem pole gate	08:57
RST38h	Doc: Not really sure about it	08:57
wall[e]	ah	08:57
RST38h	Doc: This gets into details that I have no firm understanding of	08:57
RST38h	Doc: But if you want fault tolerant, LEON (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LEON) is actually being used in a lot of low cost Chinese DVD players	08:58
wall[e]	i used to read years ago you can break some hw security like atm with some kind of radiation	08:58
wall[e]	on /.	08:58
Funnyface	is the audio supposed to work out of the box with the lastest easy debian image? I can't get it working, but I still can't find any discussions about it anywhere.. which leads me to think this might be a problem only I have :p	08:58
wall[e]	can't remember the details	08:58
Surfa	sounds like very random approach :)	08:58
RST38h	Not every thing you read on Slashdot is true :)	08:59
wall[e]	i know :)	08:59
RST38h	==> WORK	08:59
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mece	how are things going maemites?	09:03
Stskeeps	i'd steer clear of t.m.o if you haven't already	09:04
Stskeeps	:P	09:04
mece	how so?	09:04
Stskeeps	toxic environment	09:04
mece	haa :D	09:04
mece	the best cind	09:04
mece	kind	09:04
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DocScrutinizer	wall[e]: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=678046#post678046	09:17
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tybollt_	actually	09:17
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wall[e]	DocScrutinizer, thanks!	09:18
wall[e]	45 mins to the dead line	09:19
wall[e]	hahaha	09:19
wall[e]	damn	09:19
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Funnyface	hmm "Ad-hoc wifi leaks kernel memory, puts N900 into unusable swap hell" listed as fixed bugs in 1.2, hopefully joikuspot should be usable for longer than ~45 mins then	09:24
lejonet	Hmmm, when doing an backup of user stuff and the app list, what directories do I have to save? MyDocs and ??	09:25
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lejonet	on the N900, forgot to add that	09:25
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Tuukka	lejonet, just use the N900's backup app and you don't need to worry about directories	09:27
DocScrutinizer	Funnyface: no, after 45 minutes the case begins to melt down. ;-P	09:28
Funnyface	lol	09:28
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Funnyface	well, the latest version of joikuspot didn't seem to use as much CPU as the first one	09:29
lejonet	Tuukka: I never looked to see if it had a native backup app lol, I just used grsync and synced the relevant dirs (that I thought :P)	09:30
lejonet	Tuukka: Now I feel a bit sheepish :P	09:30
Tuukka	:D	09:30
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lejonet	That went fast and painless lol :P	09:31
lejonet	well, time to flash the N900 to PR1.2 ^^	09:32
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Hukka	Does anyone know what kind of 3G speeds N900 supports? There's a discount for an unlimited dataplan, and am thinking of upgrading from 384kbps	09:32
Surfa	lejonet, ota promised today doesn't suit you?	09:32
Funnyface	hehe I am still waiting like an impatient kid for the update to show up in the app manager :P	09:32
lejonet	Hukka: I have 7.2Mbps 3G, I havent really tested to see how much of that I get, but it is atleast 2Mbps down	09:33
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lejonet	Surfa: Well I heard that some rekommend a flash anyway, besides that would clean up the mess I created too :P	09:33
lejonet	recommend*	09:33
Tuukka	Yeah me too I don't feel like doing all those adblock and rootfs space tweaks again...	09:33
Hukka	lejonet: That's quite bad, compared to the specified 10Mbps downlink...	09:33
Funnyface	"Nokia doesn’t have plans for a full scale commercial MeeGo upgrade on the Nokia N900. The reason? It’s really about ensuring that you have the best possible experience designed for the features on your Nokia N900 device." sounds like something steve jobs could have said	09:33
Surfa	lejonet, recommend is quite strong word to use, but if you like to	09:34
Funnyface	just that I think nokia fans won't accept that in the same way as apple fans would accept it from apple :P	09:34
tybollt_	well IIRC apple actually offered the fanbois to pay for OS upgrade	09:35
lejonet	Hukka: Well I havent really been in the places with the best coverage either :P	09:35
Surfa	Hukka, how about this site http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/devices/nokia-n900/specifications	09:35
Surfa	Hukka, suprisingly it might contain information you need	09:35
Hukka	Surfa: Yeah, that says the 10Mbps downlink (or the usa version did)	09:35
Hukka	Surfa: Do you trust broadband numbers as announced?	09:35
Surfa	by operators?	09:36
Surfa	no	09:36
Hukka	Surfa: Surprisignly, there's inflation	09:36
Hukka	By modem providers	09:36
tybollt_	and seriously - the usual argument "OS X.y.z is not designed for $HARDWARE - yo have to buy $NEW_HARDWARE to use it" can't possibly fly seeing as stskeeps is developing the OS on this very device... :S	09:36
Hukka	That's the same as buying any 10 dollar mobile usb stick and wondering why you aren't getting the whole 7.2Mbps	09:36
Funnyface	haha	09:36
Stskeeps	tybollt_: i never claimed to understand that argument	09:36
timeless_mbp	!seen andre__	09:36
Surfa	Hukka, i happen to know that network is in 99% cases the bottle neck	09:36
Surfa	don't worry about your device capabilities	09:36
lejonet	timeless_mbp: I think its ~seen here	09:37
timeless_mbp	~seen andre__	09:37
tybollt_	Stskeeps: pure speculation on my part - but I guess it is logical enough...	09:37
infobot	andre__ <~andre@Maemo/community/bugmaster/andre> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 21h 52m 56s ago, saying: 'mece, looks okay from a quick view. also see http://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Adding_Extra_products'.	09:37
Hukka	Surfa: The network has been verified to deliver with HSPA+ sticks, so don't worry about what I'm not asking	09:37
timeless_mbp	~summon andre__	09:37
infobot	apt takes out 20 clean, identical-looking phones, some extra hands, and pretends to be a telemarketer for a large corporation, so he gets delivered a phonelist containing andre__'s coordinates	09:37
Surfa	Hukka, so nothing to worry about	09:38
Tuukka	Just tested my speed in peedtest.net 3.14Mb/s out and 0.78 Mb/s in. In 3G network almost full strenght using 15Mb/s dataplan	09:38
Hukka	Tuukka: Which operator?	09:38
Surfa	Tuukka, well, there are plenty of things that affect throughputs in addition to signal strength	09:39
Tuukka	Saunalahti, you propably ain't aware of it I'm from Finland	09:39
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Surfa	Tuukka, and hukka wouldn't be from finland? :)	09:39
Funnyface	the HSDPA providers here support "7.2Mbit" HSDPA, but still say "0.5 to 1.5Mbit" as "realistic speeds"	09:39
Funnyface	however, I don't really think the speed is the problem with HSDPA	09:40
Tuukka	Judging from his nick maybe.. :D	09:40
Corsac	tybollt_: imho the very problem about commercial meego on n900 is the upgrade path	09:40
Hukka	Or whoissing me...	09:41
Surfa	Hukka, but anyway, i'm pretty sure that n900 won't be the bottleneck in your data transfers anyway	09:41
Hukka	Tuukka: Which city?	09:41
Tuukka	Hukka, Turku	09:41
Hukka	Ah, ok. Don't know about there	09:41
Hukka	I know the speeds can exceed 10Mbps in Oulu and Helsinki	09:41
Surfa	public networks have that much changing conditions that they are the ones limiting the throughputs before the device	09:41
tybollt_	corsac: <Nookla> Hi Guys! Maemo fs layout was seriously FAIL! Here's how it should've worked from the begining - backup your device - wipe it and flash it - easy huh?	09:41
Tuukka	Quite happy with my dataplan it's fast, unlimited and pretty affordable ~15e/motnh	09:41
pupnik	Must Hear. Marc Faber speech on economic outlook: http://mises.org/media/4980 (mp3, 67:32)	09:41
Corsac	tybollt_: OTA seems not really doable, flashing could work but if it messes deeply that means user settings might not be conserved, backups won't apply etc. which might not be really commercialy fine :)	09:42
Tuukka	Hukka, well technically i'm not in Turku atm. At work in Kaarina	09:42
*** mikki-kun\|sleep is now known as mikki-kun		09:43
timeless_mbp	tybollt_: where was he planning to back up his device?	09:43
Surfa	Hukka, constant speeds? in live networks? :) i highly doubt that... peaks may of course be near to that, but constant i believe when i see	09:43
Hukka	Tuukka: 13,90 a month ;)	09:43
Surfa	saunalahti has those offers until end of month?	09:43
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Tuukka	Yep =)	09:43
Funnyface	with my data plan, I can transfer as much as I want for about 1 euro per day, but at 200MB I get dropped to EDGE until the next day. problem is that each MB is still like half an euro per MB until that limit is reached, so for occasional use the plan sucks	09:44
tybollt_	~buy box of leijona tar candies for timeless_mbp	09:44
* infobot goes to S-Mart and gets a dozen of leijona tar candies for timeless_mbps for box		09:44
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Funnyface	I'd really love some sort of combined plan for say 1GB per month, while also having the ability to use the network a lot on specific days :p	09:44
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tybollt_	timeless_mbp: well backup inside the device and copy it to $SAFE_PLACE	09:45
timeless_mbp	tybollt_: do i not want that candy?	09:45
tybollt_	you tell me	09:45
Tuukka	Surfa, but the price stays for the whole to year contract	09:45
timeless_mbp	"tar" sounds bad	09:46
tybollt_	timeless_mbp: seriously have no idea what candy I am talking about? :)	09:46
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Corsac	don't take a candy from a stranger	09:46
Wolfie	leijona tar is awesome	09:46
timeless_mbp	thankfully, i believe that's correct	09:46
Hukka	Tuukka: Yeah, the think is it's only 4 euros more, but on the downside I would be stuck with it for two years	09:46
Surfa	Tuukka, i know i know	09:47
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Surfa	Hukka, it's not 2 years contract	09:47
tybollt_	timeless_mbp: terva leijona it's a friggin classic	09:47
Surfa	Hukka, you may get rid of it any time you want	09:47
Surfa	only the price is fixed for 2 years	09:47
Hukka	Surfa: Then you have different offers from me	09:47
timeless_mbp	tybollt_: i'll pass?	09:47
timeless_mbp	https://defect.opensolaris.org/bz/show_bug.cgi?id=14223	09:47
povbot`	Bug 14223: was not found.	09:47
timeless_mbp	4 months to get rid of one space	09:48
timeless_mbp	...	09:48
Surfa	Hukka, nope http://saunalahti.fi/gsm/mobiililaajakaista.php	09:48
Wolfie	hm... isn't leijona a salmiac candy? don't see it in salmiyuck.com's (crappy) title photo	09:48
Surfa	Hukka, "Sopimus ei ole määräaikainen."	09:48
Hukka	"Määräaikainen sopimus 24 kk"	09:48
Wolfie	:D	09:49
tybollt_	<Mr T> I pity the fool</Mr T>	09:49
Hukka	Ok, that one is a different deal	09:49
mece	hey, damn missed the 3g speed discussion	09:49
Hukka	Hm... so it looks like the defined contract includes a usb stick but otherwise is the same	09:49
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mece	I have the cheapest data with sauna for my N900 from saunalahti. 384kbps.	09:50
Hukka	mece: Same	09:50
Tuukka	Who needs a usb stick :D You can use your N900 to tether	09:50
Hukka	Tuukka: Yeah, I know, but I only saw the adverts for the packet	09:50
Surfa	Tuukka, if you have lack of electricity the usb-stick is more useful	09:50
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mece	but, here in my office in ICT I sometimes get speeds of around 1Mbps for some reason. Only here though.	09:51
Surfa	and you don't need your phone and can use it for other purposes elsewhere	09:51
Hukka	Surfa: You can buy a separate stick, though	09:51
Hukka	Surfa: Does the free contract include multi-SIM?	09:51
Funnyface	mece: perhaps the tower there doesn't allow plain UMTS	09:51
mece	perhaps.	09:51
sivang	Greetings from Nokia Developer Workshop in TLV :)	09:51
Lynoure	I think I have one old stick to spare, if someone needs one.	09:51
Lynoure	Assuming the new one works, when it arrives.	09:51
Surfa	Hukka, i don't know :) i've never been interested in multi sims	09:52
Lynoure	They push them as extras, annoyingly	09:52
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tybollt_	timeless_mbp: OpenSolaris - the project that after 5 years still is not open. :)	09:56
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tybollt_	you can't compile osolaris w/out massive amounts of binaries	09:56
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Corsac	that reminds me of something else	09:57
lejonet	Cool, I must say I like the improved bootup time so far in PR1.2 :P	09:57
timeless_mbp	tybollt_: it's more open than maemo :)	09:59
timeless_mbp	tybollt_: and that one character fix is still better than some of my symbian patches :)	10:00
timeless_mbp	Trizt: i think i might have finally fixed it!	10:01
timeless_mbp	please say you haven't updated to 1.2 yet :)	10:01
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thunderfest	Here I did a wrtie up on the state of opengles under pr1.2 and detail some workarounds to get it going http://jacobpennock.com/blog/?p=42	10:03
pupnik	bamboo for crash reporting?	10:04
pupnik	could volunteers run debug builds of pr release candidates, for crash reporting?	10:04
pupnik	sorry, bad keying	10:04
sivang	timeless_mbp: in the developer workshop :)	10:06
sivang	timeless_mbp: how's you?	10:06
timeless_mbp	?	10:06
* timeless_mbp is in a 2 hour meeting		10:07
sivang	timeless_mbp: ohhh	10:07
sivang	timeless_mbp: been quite lately, had to take real life prpjects for bills paying,got a free day at last to attend the event	10:07
sivang	timeless_mbp: *quiet	10:07
phellarv	Moin'	10:07
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noobmonk3y	hmmm just me or is the custom operator widget now doing nothing?	10:10
noobmonk3y	i wonder if i shout bacon loud enoughm will people amazingly wake up? :D :D :D	10:12
noobmonk3y	enough*	10:12
bleeter	mmmm bcaon	10:13
noobmonk3y	lol :P	10:13
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noobmonk3y	wow.... bacon made tekojo quit ;) - Shocker	10:13
phellarv	mmmmm - snus	10:14
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* mece has a craving for a footlong subway		10:15
* mece blames noobmonk3y		10:16
Funnyface	http://cgi.ebay.com/1930mAh-BL-5J-HIGH-CAPACITY-BATTERY-NOKIA-5800-N900-/200471742882?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_MobilePhones_MobilePhoneAccessories_MobilePhoneBatteries&hash=item2ead0c09a2 I wonder if this battery truely is 1930mA as stated.. probably not	10:16
noobmonk3y	lol mece :P	10:16
noobmonk3y	no is the answer to that	10:16
noobmonk3y	Funnyface, same size, same shape, yet more juice ;) - the seller is praying on dumbasses	10:16
Funnyface	probably	10:17
Funnyface	and the battery doesn't have the capacity printed on it, meaning they can type in any capacity they want.. :P	10:17
noobmonk3y	:) yup	10:17
noobmonk3y	anyway, chances are very unlikely at that price	10:18
* frals slaps noobmonk3y around a bit with a large trout		10:18
* noobmonk3y blinks		10:18
* frals slaps noobmonk3y with a bunch of waffles		10:18
noobmonk3y	ooo yayness!	10:18
noobmonk3y	inventive frals! i likie	10:19
* tybollt_ slaps frals around a bit w/ an automatic apn/mms setting sms parser which he must integrate in FMMS		10:19
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noobmonk3y	^winzor	10:19
frals	tybollt_: feel free to do it!	10:19
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tybollt_	I would but I think fMMS is closed source so I can't... visslar	10:20
frals	haha	10:20
tybollt_	;)	10:20
mece	LOL	10:20
frals	actually a sms parsers wouldnt need to be included in fmms in anyway ;)	10:20
tybollt_	right	10:20
tybollt_	well	10:20
tybollt_	you still need to configure fmms right?	10:21
noobmonk3y	frals does however porn all trout porn pics sent via mms, and forward them to himself :P	10:21
noobmonk3y	tybollt_, yes :(	10:21
mece	hey has anyone had problems answering the phone with pr1.2? I had a strange issue just now..	10:21
noobmonk3y	mece, nope :)	10:21
timeless_mbp	mece: we don't receive calls in .fi :)	10:21
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frals	tybollt_: id just revert to making it shwo a list of configured apn's, would take 5minutes ;)	10:22
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mece	well luckily the one calling was a telemarketer (according to google) so It was nice that I failed to answer.	10:22
* noobmonk3y deleted his mms apn		10:22
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noobmonk3y	phone kept bloody connecting to it and pissed me off	10:23
frals	lol	10:23
frals	not my fault :(	10:23
noobmonk3y	true, i blame lcuk	10:23
frals	you should have set fmms to havoc! ;)	10:23
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tybollt_	frals: to be perfectly honest - that's what I don't get - why doesn't it just offer you the apn-list when you click configure :)	10:23
tybollt_	I like that	10:23
frals	tybollt_: because users are stupid	10:23
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noobmonk3y	that would be a hell of alot easier :P	10:23
frals	tybollt_: and with pr1.2 the autoconfig should be better	10:23
hrw	morning	10:23
* noobmonk3y agrees <--------------- I r Stup1d		10:23
tybollt_	frals: got that right! Missus calls me "bloody stupid" even	10:24
frals	tybollt_: ^^	10:24
mece	anyway the issue was this, the phone thingamabob popped up as usually, but just when I tapped answer, the screen changed into 4 buttons instead of 2, and the answer/reject ones were on the bottom row, so I clicked one of the top row ones instead by mistake.	10:24
mece	i think it was send sms. Anyway after that I couldn't get back to the phone app to answer.	10:25
tybollt_	yonkers - did you praps turn the mobile somehow - hence triggering the accel-o-meter?	10:25
furunk3l	yes hellau	10:26
mece	I've set it to portrait, as in not auto, so it shouldn't be affected by that.	10:26
tybollt_	true	10:26
tybollt_	furunk3l: why is there hell in .au? :S	10:26
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furunk3l	just cause	10:27
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furunk3l	ask TheAppleMan	10:27
furunk3l	i bet he knows why	10:27
TheAppleMan	Woah! Don't drag me into this.	10:29
MaikB	Speaking of the Phone task, is there an dbus message that broadcasts if the user gets a call? Running processes should react to this message by putting their CPU intensive parts on hold.	10:29
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* tybollt_ blames TheAppleMan - indeed		10:30
tybollt_	:)	10:30
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MaikB	Or is this issue dealt with via the `nice' value?	10:30
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* noobmonk3y meh's		10:32
noobmonk3y	i really should goto work	10:33
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PhonicUK	pr 1.2 swapped around the Back and Bookmarks buttons in the browser :s	10:36
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timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: yeah	10:38
timeless_mbp	minor changes happen :)	10:38
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: i'm actually relatively happy w/ those changes	10:38
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MaikB	Since I'm to lazy to flash my N900 I wonder at which time today 1.2 will be pushed in Germany.	10:40
timeless_mbp	MaikB: no one here knows	10:40
timeless_mbp	just be patient, your n900 will tell you when it's ready	10:40
tybollt_	all the nokians here knows but enjoys laughing sinisterly at us when we're asking... >:)	10:40
tybollt_	;)	10:41
* timeless_mbp is a nokian		10:41
* timeless_mbp has absolutely no idea		10:41
timeless_mbp	the way i'll know it's available in .de is when a customer from .de says it was offered	10:41
FIQ	hmm	10:41
FIQ	I told you yesterday that i somehow lost all my repositories	10:42
FIQ	My battery died then, so i didn't see any answers	10:42
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MaikB	Does someone know how this works? Does the repository server see where I'm from and hold back the upgrade, or is there different Server for the UK?	10:42
FIQ	Can i get some help with resetting it?	10:42
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FIQ	Because, i have _no_ repositories at all	10:42
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* MaikB takes a look at the /etc/apt/sources.list		10:43
timeless_mbp	MaikB: you want /etc/apt/sources.list.d/*	10:43
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timeless_mbp	the repository server isn't one server	10:43
timeless_mbp	it's one address at many locations	10:43
timeless_mbp	and dns generally controls which server you reach	10:43
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timeless_mbp	dns can work any way it likes, but generally dns for magic addresses tries to pick a server that is "close" to you and "fast" to you	10:44
MaikB	timeless_mbp, I see	10:44
MaikB	timeless_mbp, thanks	10:44
timeless_mbp	i believe we're using akamai...	10:45
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MaikB	I guess the repo at the Server I am forwarded to just has to be populated with 1.2 then	10:45
timeless_mbp	roughly	10:46
MaikB	And this is done by the Admins running it	10:46
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timeless_mbp	no	10:46
FIQ	Hey	10:47
timeless_mbp	admins don't really "run" these boxes like that	10:47
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FIQ	Seems as i have some repos in hildon-application-manager.list	10:47
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FIQ	But why does the application manager not recognize anything now?	10:48
MaikB	timeless_mbp, What I mean is this: The guys who manage the repo for the UK and those who manage the one for the rest of Europe are different people	10:48
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MaikB	is this statement correct?	10:48
MaikB	:)	10:48
timeless_mbp	MaikB: it doesn't work like that	10:48
timeless_mbp	at least, not generally	10:48
FIQ	sources.list seems to be empty	10:48
FIQ	is that why?	10:48
timeless_mbp	FIQ: souces.list is a legacy file	10:48
timeless_mbp	for you to **** with	10:48
FIQ	ah	10:48
FIQ	but why don't i have any repos in appmanager then?	10:48
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timeless_mbp	apt honors it and sources.list.d/*.list	10:49
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MaikB	FIQ: this is the location on my device /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list	10:49
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FIQ	Yes, it contains things	10:49
timeless_mbp	but my mac is out of power	10:49
timeless_mbp	so i'm going offline	10:49
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MaikB	timeless_mbp, cya	10:49
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FIQ	but when i take up the menu and look up "Program Catalogues", the list is empty	10:49
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midas_	well, it wasnt that timeless then :P	10:50
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LiraNuna	there was an update to Power Kernel today	10:51
LiraNuna	it wrecked my wifi	10:52
LiraNuna	anyone having the same problem?	10:52
midas_	hey yeah!	10:52
midas_	i cant connect via wifi to my phone anymore	10:52
midas_	it says it has a ip tho	10:52
LiraNuna	and I can't restore stock kernel :\|	10:52
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midas_	oh well, just a reflash	10:53
LiraNuna	I don't feel like a backup	10:53
midas_	hm mine is working again	10:53
midas_	wifiswitches + powerkernel issue	10:53
LiraNuna	wifiswitches?	10:53
midas_	just restarted wifiswitcher	10:53
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hrw	LiraNuna: flash only kernel then	10:54
phellarv	wifiswitcher - Switch wifi off and on, and you're all good!	10:55
midas_	putty + n900 :)	10:55
phellarv	Why putty?	10:55
midas_	because i dont have a linuxbox on my desk right now	10:56
phellarv	midas_: Oooh - Kk - I thought you where using putty on your N900?	10:56
LiraNuna	how do I use wifiswitcher?	10:57
midas_	haha no no :P	10:57
LiraNuna	do I need to download it?	10:57
midas_	if you dont have it yet, yes but probably you have a different problem than i had	10:57
Tuukka	Seems like the ota is around the edge here in finland. Some packages been updated in repos.	10:57
LiraNuna	I don't have an internet connection anymore	10:57
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phellarv	LiraNuna: Did you go from one wifi hotspot to another?	10:58
LiraNuna	nope	10:58
LiraNuna	was at home	10:58
phellarv	And?	10:59
LiraNuna	updated the power kernel as I saw it popped up	10:59
LiraNuna	then left the phone	10:59
LiraNuna	came back later and I see wifi tries to connect forever	10:59
phellarv	Uhm - you must reboot after a kernel update.	10:59
LiraNuna	I know	10:59
LiraNuna	I did	10:59
Tuukka	Hukka, Surfa, OTA is here =))	11:00
midas_	over the air is everywere Tuukka ;)	11:00
LiraNuna	damnit, 1.8MB on EDGE	11:00
LiraNuna	:\|	11:00
phellarv	LiraNuna: Kill the saved wifi-connection.	11:00
LiraNuna	kill == erase?	11:00
Surfa	Tuukka, hooray.. must install it right away	11:00
phellarv	LiraNuna: Mmm	11:00
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midas_	ah after a shell apt-get update and upgrade, i have it in my app manager :P	11:01
DocScrutinizer	maemo5 OTA in Germany	11:01
LiraNuna	phellarv, no go	11:01
MaikB	wow, just did a apt-get update && apt-get upgrade to see how many packages being hold back. A ton!	11:01
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LiraNuna	fails to connect	11:01
MaikB	cool beans	11:01
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matthew-	Hey, any1 available for help? trying to reflash my n900 under mac and im getting	11:02
matthew-	flasher-3.5: invalid option -- P	11:02
thresh	no OTA in Russia still	11:02
thresh	:(	11:02
phellarv	LiraNuna: Get wifiswitcher - turn wifi on and off - helped for me	11:02
Wolfie	yay, go finland	11:02
LiraNuna	how can I get wifiswitcher	11:02
phellarv	HAM	11:02
LiraNuna	I am on retarded EDGE that barely works	11:02
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timeless	matthew: why do you want to use flasher?	11:02
matthew-	timeless: cause my device doesnt switch on ?	11:02
matthew-	:<	11:02
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Wolfie	over 100mb of updates... that's not a little...	11:03
Wolfie	over 3g :)	11:03
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA and fiasco shipping, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lM"		11:03
midas_	Wolfie: nope it isnt	11:03
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MaikB	I get 100MByte updates for my Arch Linux installation every week :P	11:03
midas_	DocScrutinizer: youtoob link is broken	11:03
matthew-	I'm using http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Console_with_Flasher-3.5 guide.	11:04
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Wolfie	MaikB: but hardly over cellular network...	11:04
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matthew-	and then RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.42-11.203.2_PR_F5_203_ARM.bin	11:04
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA and fiasco shipping, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/"		11:04
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MaikB	Wolfie, nope	11:04
timeless	matthew: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_Flasher-3.5 doesn't list -P	11:04
LiraNuna	could it be that the new kernel expect something in PR1.2?	11:04
phellarv	LiraNuna: Seems strange.	11:05
LiraNuna	wifi just died after I upgraded+rebooted	11:05
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Wolfie	does 1.2 add more authentication protocols to wifi, by happenstance? haven't seen any advertisement about that, but I hope I missed something :)	11:06
timeless	fwiw, it's typical for nokia doing a uk based launch to GO @9am London time	11:06
matthew-	timeless: yeah but the guide does..	11:07
timeless	which was 7mins ago	11:07
midas_	stupid thing, i dont want to backup	11:07
phellarv	LiraNuna: try "ifconfig wlan0 down && ifconfig wlan0 up"	11:07
timeless	matthew: well that sounds stupid	11:07
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Corsac	how large is the SSU update?	11:07
matthew-	timeless: and look at this:	11:07
matthew-	To flash just a part of the whole FIASCO image (for example, only rootfs) run $ flasher-3.5 -F <FIASCO image> --flash-only=rootfs -f	11:07
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LiraNuna	phellarv, already restored stock kernel	11:07
Wolfie	Corsac: 110 and a bit	11:07
Wolfie	megabytes	11:07
matthew-	ON the wiki page u gave me	11:07
Corsac	hmh	11:07
phellarv	LiraNuna: Did it help?	11:07
Corsac	might bit a bit too large over 3g :)	11:08
LiraNuna	rebooting now	11:08
timeless	was the guide on *.maemo.org? it ran off my screen because of someone's topic change	11:08
Wolfie	Corsac: nah, i'm currently doing that. I have the whole workday to spend, so...	11:08
visz	ahha	11:08
Wolfie	doesn't matter whether it takes an hour or five	11:08
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visz	OTA available in finland	11:08
timeless	matthew: sure,	11:08
timeless	is there a problem w/ that?	11:09
matthew-	timeless: So i've got no clue what to do now	11:09
LiraNuna	is OTA available in US?	11:09
matthew-	well there is no '-P'	11:09
matthew-	so there kinda is :D	11:09
timeless	matthew: did you download an image?	11:09
matthew-	sudo /usr/bin/flasher-3.5 -F <firmware-image> -f -R	11:09
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matthew-	that's what it says	11:09
X-Fade	I see the global SSU now too.	11:09
Corsac	Wolfie: yeah but I kind-of have a 1G limit on my unlimited dataplan so... :)	11:09
matthew-	yes	11:09
midas_	okay, why does my phone want to be hooked up to a pc?	11:09
matthew-	so im doing mbp:Downloads Matt$ sudo /usr/bin/flasher-3.5 RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1.203.1_PR_COMBINED_203_ARM.bin -f -R	11:09
LiraNuna	phellarv, yep, restoring the stock kernel worked ...	11:10
timeless	sure	11:10
matthew-	and it gives me flasher-3.5: invalid option -- P	11:10
matthew-	Usage: flasher [OPTIONS]	11:10
matthew-	Options:	11:10
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timeless	and then you turn on your already attached n900	11:10
matthew-	timeless: yeah, but nothing happens	11:10
timeless	hrm	11:10
matthew-	http://pastebin.com/ag7EKLEr	11:11
matthew-	and it doesnt specify what the P is	11:11
timeless	rename that file to "fiasco"	11:11
LiraNuna	also, did anyone notice the recent Opera updates?	11:11
LiraNuna	there's no changelog :(	11:11
timeless	i think you're missing the -F before the image name	11:11
matthew-	timeless: it doesn't make the difference if its .fiasco .bin or .tranny	11:12
timeless	lira: why the heck do you neeed a changelog for your web browser?	11:12
n900-dk_	What should be backed up before OTA update?	11:12
matthew-	well, at lest it shouldnt, should it?	11:12
timeless	matthew: no no no no	11:12
timeless	rename ther entire file to uust fiasco	11:12
timeless	the fewer charaadters the easier it is for you not to screw up	11:12
matthew-	JUST fiasco ?	11:12
timeless	yes	11:12
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timeless	the app doesn't care, but your commandline looked wrong	11:13
timeless	and i'm typing on my n900	11:13
MaikB	matthew-, the filename and extension doesn't matter. timeless wants to make command you have to enter shorter	11:13
timeless	so i don't want to have to type ouy something long	11:13
matthew-	yeah	11:13
MaikB	thats all	11:13
mece	damn this bug is annoying: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10273	11:13
povbot`	Bug 10273: Auto-capitalization somewhat broken	11:13
timeless	maikb++	11:13
matthew-	timeless: ok, well im only following wiki	11:14
timeless	mbp:Downloads Matt$ sudo /usr/bin/flasher-3.5 -P	11:14
timeless	there's a P there	11:14
matthew-	ok	11:14
matthew-	flashing.	11:14
matthew-	timeless: yeah	11:14
timeless	it should have been an F	11:14
matthew-	i changed -P with -F	11:14
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matthew-	timeless: sorry there is -F not -P in wiki	11:15
matthew-	i just dont have my glasses on ;d	11:15
timeless	miakb: please ask guide author to improve the font for that line	11:15
timeless	matthew: perfectly reasonable problem	11:15
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midas_	quick question, why does my n900 need to be hooked up to my pc for a ota update?	11:16
mece	midas_, it does not	11:16
timeless	midas: it shouldn't	11:16
matthew-	timeless: will do, thanks.	11:16
timeless	who said otherwise?	11:16
midas_	mece: / timeless but it does :P	11:16
midas_	the installer told me	11:16
crashanddie	midas_: it doesn't	11:16
mece	midas_, you have experimental qt libs perhaps?	11:17
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midas_	it says backup, did that, now i want to continue and it cant	11:17
midas_	nope	11:17
crashanddie	mate, what installer told you that?	11:17
crashanddie	xxxporn.bin?	11:17
mece	midas_, what exactly does it say?	11:17
petteri	it asks if you wan't to do backup before upgrading	11:17
crashanddie	wan't?	11:17
midas_	it does, correct	11:17
crashanddie	interesting spelling	11:18
midas_	and then, i cant continue even after backing up	11:18
petteri	sorry about that :P	11:18
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mece	midas_, what does it say?	11:18
crashanddie	midas_: installer on the N900 or on your computer?	11:18
midas_	just a second, starting it again :P	11:18
midas_	crashanddie: n900	11:18
DocScrutinizer	crashanddie: my condolences :-)	11:19
timeless	midas: if the n900 doesn't like it config	11:19
timeless	it can suggest using the computer to reflash	11:19
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timeless	that is an available message	11:19
midas_	just a quick translation, to upgrade your device to this version you need the program for upgrading, hook your phone to the pc and start the program	11:19
timeless	midas: don't translate	11:19
timeless	but you got the path i just described	11:20
midas_	oh well, just a reflash	11:20
mece	midas_, that means you have something incompatible on the phone.	11:20
timeless	your n900 doesn't have space or it has a conflict	11:20
hrw	ok, my n900 is upgrading	11:20
midas_	timeless: you want it in dutch? :P	11:20
hrw	LR1.2 -> PR1.2	11:20
crashanddie	midas_: waarom niet?	11:20
timeless	mias: yes	11:20
mece	timeless, if it doesn't have space, it tells you it doesn't have space.	11:20
midas_	ja voor jou is het geen probleem :p	11:20
timeless	i have the strings for all locals	11:20
mece	:D	11:20
timeless	so i can reverse	11:20
midas_	ah ok timeless	11:20
timeless	i can't handle free translations	11:21
n900-dk_	damn space.. or missing space :)	11:21
timeless	because you're going FI .. GB .. NL .. US	11:21
timeless	a bad game of telephone	11:21
timeless	anyway, it's basically a conflict	11:21
ruskie	hmm finally got the update...	11:21
MaikB	I got: rootfs 227.9M 198.6M 25.1M 89% /	11:21
ruskie	now to see if I can break the system or not	11:21
hrw	looks like LR1.2 was nearly final.	11:21
MaikB	is this ok?	11:21
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timeless	and the message is asking you to use a pc based flasher	11:21
mece	MaikB, too little for ota upgrade I'd guess.	11:22
MaikB	meh	11:22
mece	MaikB, if that's what you're asking	11:22
MaikB	mece, yes, thx	11:22
mece	MaikB, disable extras, testing and devel	11:22
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mece	gives you 20mb, could be enough	11:22
MaikB	mece, Stupid me, of course	11:23
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pupnik	anyone else agree with GAN that 1.2 is buggy?	11:23
ruskie	define buggy	11:23
MaikB	here we go, OTA in germany	11:23
pupnik	like, we must be upset about it	11:23
mece	pupnik, no. But the stupid autocapitalization bug is annoying.	11:24
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lardman\|home	morning	11:24
MaikB	but i disable devel and testing repos first	11:24
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mece	lardman\|home, mornin	11:25
lardman\|home	hi mece	11:25
pupnik	looks like in dosbox 3000 cycles are doable @ 600mhz without sound. 5k @ 900	11:26
MaikB	mece, hm, symlinked the apt stuff to /home, so there is no space issue with to many active repos :)	11:26
MaikB	mece, and thus no gain	11:26
lardman\|home	albanc, barisione: re lat/lon data for contacts, do you know if this is something that could be added - iirc I added a bug requesting this. It would be cool to get decent contacts/map integration, but that would probably need a decent maps app too of course ;)	11:26
MaikB	I just wipe the Qt stuff	11:26
MaikB	should be enough	11:26
Bluewind	how much free space on / is needed for pr 1.2?	11:27
ruskie	hmm I should look at redefining the rest of the apt files to a diff dir... cache I already set through the config	11:27
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pupnik	MaikB: i see no OTA here (de)	11:28
MaikB	pupnik, I got it 3 minutes ago	11:28
lbt	mrs lbt is upgrading.... I'm scared	11:28
MacDrunk	how do i know if i have ota here in mi country	11:28
pupnik	then maybe i dont install it. ty MaikB	11:29
DocScrutinizer	MaikB: [2010-05-26 10:01:21] <DocScrutinizer> maemo5 OTA in Germany	11:29
pupnik	i just ran apt-get update	11:29
n900-dk_	and available in Denmark	11:30
Nitial	Bluewind: apt-cache show mp-fremantle-generic-pr says 42000 for required free space, so I guess 42 MB should be enough	11:30
Bluewind	k thx	11:30
lardman\|home	interesting how we now have the opposite problem to before, some of the extras-devel apps explicitly want QT 4.5, at a 40Mb download	11:31
* MaikB keeps removing stuff ..		11:31
ruskie	Nitial, hmm mine states: Maemo-Required-Free-Space: 35840	11:31
MaikB	ruskie, thx for this info!	11:31
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n900-dk_	It is a little like Christmas, right :)	11:32
MaikB	n900-dk_, indeed!	11:32
MaikB	:)	11:32
MohammadAG	crashanddie, happy birthday you (insert word not suitable for channel) :P	11:33
crashanddie	thanks mate	11:33
n900-dk_	Is all this just for crashanddie?	11:34
lardman\|home	crashanddie: birthday?!	11:34
crashanddie	aye	11:34
lardman\|home	ah, finally they'll let you into bars! ;)	11:34
lardman\|home	happy birthday mate :)	11:34
lardman\|home	mine is next week fwiw	11:35
MaikB	crashanddie, happy bday	11:35
lardman\|home	I think	11:35
hrw	upgrade from LR1.2 → PR1.2 worked fine	11:35
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lbt	available: 41.1M	11:36
lbt	humph	11:36
crashanddie	lardman\|home: I know yours is next week	11:36
ruskie	well apt-get dist-upgrade that 14MB will be freed up after installation	11:36
MaikB	Is someone using Catorise?	11:36
crashanddie	MaikB: aye	11:36
MaikB	and knows if it will work with 1.2	11:36
crashanddie	yes	11:36
MaikB	crashanddie, thx!	11:36
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MaikB	awesome	11:37
crashanddie	it's a bit weird, because there's a bit of panning now	11:37
crashanddie	nothing troubling though	11:37
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MaikB	crashanddie, are you involved in catorise?	11:37
lardman\|home	hmm, so has this been fixed then?: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2962	11:37
povbot`	Bug 2962: Not able to open Maps application with contacts location as a search string	11:37
lardman\|home	says it has in the http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.2 page	11:38
lardman\|home	but I can't see how	11:38
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Tuukka	Nice your able to change theme without the wallpapers getting change aswell in 1.2 =)	11:40
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thresh	you bastards	11:41
thresh	don't tease us OTA-impaired	11:41
MaikB	I changed the start video, I hope this doesn't cause issues with 1.2	11:41
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MaikB	well, if the upgrade just overwrites my changes its all fine	11:42
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lbt	so my wife reports "operation failed" .... no more clues	11:44
lardman\|home	crashanddie: is your N900 on? Could you broadcast your location so I can see if it appears in the Maps app?	11:44
lardman\|home	lbt: sounds like a standard female error report hey? ;)	11:44
lbt	:)	11:44
lbt	and her device has hung	11:44
lardman\|home	oops, hope I didn't offend any females, just going by the standard of my wife's telling me what's wrong with a PC	11:45
lbt	I've found ctrl... where's alt+delete...	11:45
lardman\|home	switch off a plug, seems easier :)	11:45
lbt	ah... it popped up "operation failed"	11:46
lardman\|home	might have more info in the app manager log	11:46
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lbt	and then...at the bottom says "Updating Maemo 5"	11:46
Tuukka	Airport touch has a update lol :D	11:46
lbt	so it hasn't totally failed...	11:46
Corsac	lbt: I had the “operation failed” too, it seems that it's when the device is forced to offline mode	11:47
Corsac	lbt: then it goes to a locked UI where you can't do much thing	11:47
lbt	correct	11:47
Corsac	I have the Maemo 5 update on top, and a progress bar “Updating Maemo 5" on bottom	11:47
Corsac	which progresses slowly	11:47
lbt	and then the screen goes off and you're wondering wtf is happening	11:47
Corsac	lbt: just open the keyboard or unlock with the right button?	11:48
lbt	and don't want to hit "cancel" when you touch the screen to wake it up	11:48
Corsac	(I plugged it so the screen doesn't shut down)	11:48
lbt	it is plugged in...	11:48
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lbt	I guess she didn't have that setting	11:48
Corsac	yeah, it might not be a default	11:49
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Corsac	anyway, just pull the little right button won't mess with the cancel stuff	11:49
Corsac	well, it's called “stop” here and is greyed out anyway	11:49
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lardman\|home	GAN900: you about at this time of the morning?	11:50
lbt	nod .... fair comment	11:50
lardman\|home	hmm, is Ovi Store working yet? I'm being told to upgrade my PR1.2 N900 to make it work by the placeholder webpage	11:51
MohammadAG	27th of may i think	11:52
lardman\|home	ok thanks	11:52
Surfa	anyone faced the situation where pr1.2 ota installation forces you to use nsu?	11:52
MohammadAG	many users afaik	11:53
midas_	yes, if you used devel or not enough space :p	11:53
Surfa	haven't used devel	11:53
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Surfa	wonder how much is enough space	11:54
midas_	i think <80 or 70% on rootfs	11:54
Milo-	640 kilobytes should be enough for everyone	11:54
bleeter	more than enough	11:54
MaikB	Surfa, ruskie> Nitial, hmm mine states: Maemo-Required-Free-Space: 35840	11:54
Surfa	hmm.. 54MiB free	11:54
Surfa	on rootfs	11:55
lardman\|home	mmm, I see "Maemo 6 Tech Preview" as a classification in the bugtracker	11:55
bleeter	2.1TB plenty	11:55
Milo-	this update requires windows?	11:55
thunderfest	no	11:55
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MohammadAG	lardman\|home, what about it	11:55
lbt	I had 42.5Mb free and it seems to have started	11:55
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defragger	hi	11:56
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Scelt	Surfa: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	11:56
defragger	is it possible to find out my maemo version on n900?	11:56
Stskeeps	in about product	11:56
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lardman\|home	MohammadAG: well I was wondering whether we'd ever see anything of it basically ;)	11:57
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MohammadAG	lardman\|home, it's already in devel	11:57
Scelt	Surfa: I removed tuxrace and I'm able to OTA now	11:57
ZogG_N900	RST38h, hey. fixed play button just deleted record widget but left conversation - works	11:57
lardman\|home	MohammadAG: really? Oh right	11:58
ZogG_N900	what in devel i wanna test	11:58
ZogG_N900	it's in my blood )	11:58
ZogG_N900	MohammadAG, don't u have exam today?	11:58
Surfa	Scelt, let me try that one too..	11:58
Scelt	I accidentally first started the update with apt-get full-upgrade as I'm used to since App. manager is so slow to use. hopefully it haven't screwed up anything, OTA is going in now	11:59
Surfa	Scelt, i actually have tux racer installed also	11:59
MohammadAG	ZogG_N900, not that i recall :)	11:59
Milo-	"This maemo update requires the nokia software update application on your pc for installation."	11:59
Scelt	Surfa: that's a reason at least	11:59
ZogG_N900	today is nokia thing right?	11:59
Milo-	so it requires windows? ._·	11:59
thunderfest	yeah there are some open gles 1.1 problems with pr1.2 ....so things that depend on it will not reinstall currently (tuxrace, brainpart , nehetutorials, ect)	12:00
defragger	do i have to install the new firmware with another pc, or is it possible to update to maemo 5 1.2 with apt?	12:00
Corsac	use HAM	12:00
ZogG_N900	Milo-, just reflash it	12:00
ZogG_N900	Milo-, but backup first	12:00
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Milo-	ZogG_N900 http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_Flasher-3.5 with this?	12:01
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Surfa	Scelt, no luck..	12:01
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sivang	so , is 1.2 released already?	12:01
MohammadAG	yesterday	12:02
MohammadAG	Surfa, uninstall all games and ioquake3	12:02
n900-dk_	hmm, where is the smileys on the new virtual keyboard..	12:02
hrw	ah.. I have to remove smileys again	12:02
defragger	what version is 3.2010.02-8?	12:02
Scelt	Surfa: how much space on rootfs? check out the list of the apps on that post	12:02
Scelt	Surfa: there's more than tuxrace	12:02
Surfa	Scelt, proceeding on that :)	12:03
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thresh	oh yea	12:04
thresh	ota in .ru	12:04
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summel	i thought 1.2 was an ota update?	12:05
Scelt	it is	12:05
hrw	summel: I did over ota	12:05
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Scelt	I'm doing over ota	12:06
Scelt	over over the air	12:06
hrw	defragger: 1.1.1	12:06
summel	No the update program tells me to use a pc usb thingy	12:06
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Scelt	summel: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	12:06
MaikB	I wonder whats so special about OTA? Its just an updated deb repo, right?	12:06
summel	but i dont have a pc	12:06
thresh	MaikB: kinda	12:06
thunderfest	you guys now updating to pr 1.2 if your interested, I did a write up about the current problems around opengles support in pr1.2 (including current workarounds) ...http://jacobpennock.com/blog/?p=42	12:06
hrw	MaikB: ota saves time due to not need for reflashing	12:07
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MaikB	hrw, My impression is, that OTA is something special for non linux distro based Hansets	12:08
MaikB	I never owned an smartphone before the N900	12:08
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MaikB	So I'm a bit confused by the term OTA :P	12:08
Wolfie	"Over The Air"	12:08
MaikB	its a glorified apt-get upgrade	12:08
MaikB	Wolfie, I know	12:09
Surfa	Scelt, brain party removal helped	12:09
Surfa	Scelt, thanks a lot	12:09
Scelt	Surfa: np :)	12:09
Wolfie	MaikB: i guess it's a nokia term for tech that has been around before wifi and linux was common in smartphones	12:09
n900-dk_	Is the conversation widget gone?	12:09
Wolfie	i remember it being discussed as something new and supported only by one phone in the UK back in... um... 2004, i think	12:10
MohammadAG	ugh i want to set all messages as read	12:10
summel	Omg	12:10
MohammadAG	why can't that be so easy	12:10
Wolfie	and it was a S60 phone, iirc. So thus you couldn't just call it "apt get"	12:10
Milo-	MohammadAG I agree	12:10
summel	I have 46GB... that should be more then enough space	12:11
crashanddie	lardman\|home: location switches off automatically, don't know why	12:11
summel	Garrrrrr	12:11
MaikB	Wolfie, I guess are are right	12:11
Milo-	I can't use the email client since I have 2000 '	12:11
Milo-	2000 emails there	12:11
summel	64	12:11
Milo-	and they are all 'unread'	12:11
crashanddie	lardman\|home: when I select anything else than "do not show", and hit save, the GPS icon flashes once and then disappears, location reverts to "do not show"	12:11
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summel	And now it relly hurts that i cant uninstall multiple applications at once	12:12
Wolfie	hm, my theme, or parts of it, seems to be updated	12:12
Wolfie	i previously had orange icons, now they're blue	12:12
Shapeshifter	ehm.	12:12
Scelt	summel: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	12:12
Shapeshifter	"Internal error. applicaiton 'Conversations' closed"	12:13
Wolfie	updated, or reverted.	12:13
Shapeshifter	awesome	12:13
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hrw	Wolfie: check /usr/share/themes/default symlink	12:13
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Wolfie	hrw: it's linked to "alpha"	12:14
summel	Scellt: could you summarize that in a sentence? opening links from irc on the n900 is a bit painfull atm :D	12:14
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Arkenoi	Err https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ libqt4-xmlpatterns 4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo6+0m5	12:14
Arkenoi	The requested URL returned error: 404	12:14
Arkenoi	Failed to fetch https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/003/./libqt4-xmlpatterns_4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo6+0m5_armel.deb The requested URL returned error: 404	12:14
Arkenoi	E: Unable to fetch some archives, maybe run apt-get update or try with --fix-missing?	12:14
hrw	Wolfie: link to beta and restart	12:14
Arkenoi	wtf?	12:14
MaikB	meh, the program manager dialog tells me to flash the device	12:14
Shapeshifter	MaikB: not enough space on /	12:14
MaikB	I guess there are conflicts caused by installed software	12:14
Wolfie	hrw: thanks	12:14
MaikB	Shapeshifter, hmmmm I guess the program manager doesn't know that I symlinked the apt cache to /home	12:15
MaikB	:P	12:15
lardman\|home	crashanddie: odd, I'm broadcasting my location now	12:15
MaikB	rootfs 227.9M 182.4M 41.3M 82% /	12:15
MohammadAG	MaikB, it uses MyDocs anyways	12:15
Scelt	summel: there is a list of packages that are blocking OTA installation, including tuxrace and brain party etc.	12:15
MaikB	not enough?	12:15
Shapeshifter	MaikB: I think the last one needed 45	12:15
hrw	hmm.. after update I have only 75MB free on / :(	12:16
Arkenoi	what should i do?	12:16
MaikB	Shapeshifter, apt-get dist-upgrade doesn't complain... however, how to get more details on why the OTA doesn't? (i.e. a log file)	12:16
hrw	Arkenoi: apt-get update?	12:17
thresh	Arkenoi: why would you want to install 4.5.3 anyway	12:17
goody	hello guys, is global release of 1.2 out now?	12:17
thresh	yes	12:17
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MaikB	softupd.log	12:18
MaikB	??	12:18
summel	Scelt: omg thats even more fail	12:18
Arkenoi	hrw: does not help	12:18
Arkenoi	thresh: i just do apt-get dist-upgrade	12:18
thresh	Arkenoi: remove google latitude?	12:18
thresh	or whatever wants that package	12:18
Scelt	booting	12:18
Scelt	not yet	12:19
Scelt	hrw: how long did it stay in black screen after progress bar went to 100 %?	12:19
RST38h	Could somebody please tell me the maemo5 package name?	12:19
Corsac	after progress bar goes to 100%, the device just says it'll reboot, and reboots	12:20
Scelt	mine stays in application manager	12:20
Corsac	Scelt: check the screen didn't just blank because of power management	12:20
hrw	Scelt: I did not used hildon-application-manager for update	12:20
Stskeeps	sigh..	12:20
Stskeeps	:P	12:20
RST38h	hrw: What is the name of the pr1.2 umbrella package? (also cannot use HAM)	12:20
hrw	RST38h: mp-fremantle-generic-pr	12:20
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Scelt	Corsac: title still displayed	12:20
Scelt	hrw: okay	12:20
RST38h	hrw: thanks =)	12:20
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RST38h	Says I do not have enough space	12:21
* MaikB doesn't find a log file on what blocks OTA and keeps uninstalling stuff		12:21
RST38h	And HAM cannot update it too	12:21
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hrw	RST38h: Maemo-Required-Free-Space: 35840	12:22
Corsac	MaikB: already disabled extra and extra-devel repositories?	12:22
Corsac	or is it not needed now?	12:22
RST38h	got 57	12:22
hrw	RST38h: use apt-get?	12:22
Corsac	(I didn't really check disk space before upgrading, just disabled repositories, and it worked just fine)	12:22
Corsac	(hurgh, the reindexing after final reboot takes quite some time)	12:23
Surfa	MaikB, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=677105&postcount=12	12:23
Arkenoi	Package libqt4-xmlpatterns is not installed, so not removed	12:23
Surfa	that list is worth checking	12:23
ruskie	hmm fun... managed to get into an endless loop cycle	12:23
MaikB	Corsac, I did. I don't like guessing, I want to see the reasons why it want me to use the flasher	12:23
Scelt	Corsac: does not respond to any inputs. only power managements blanks the screen after while	12:23
MaikB	in a log file on the device	12:23
ruskie	I love how crappy the whole system is wrt to upgrades using normal tools to do so	12:23
Surfa	MaikB, removing brainparty and tux racer worked for me	12:23
MaikB	summel, thx, I had gltron installed	12:23
MaikB	trying again..	12:23
MaikB	but still, I don't like guessign	12:24
hrw	brainparty is in extras-1.2 so you will be able to install it after update	12:24
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MaikB	there must be an log file somewhere	12:24
ruskie	well atleast the rescue console still works	12:24
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MaikB	meh	12:25
MaikB	no luck	12:25
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thresh	fffuuu	12:26
MaikB	hm, I installed opengles manually...	12:27
Surfa	MaikB, are you sure that you don't have any other on the list?	12:27
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summel	ok i uninstalled all games and everything that could probably need opengl but i still cant update -_-	12:27
MaikB	Surfa, yes, but this not the issue I have. I will find the reason eventually	12:27
goody	is there any particular reason why the hildon manager shows no updates? is there another way to 1.2?	12:27
Scelt	I shutdown from power key. Seems to continue the update process just like last time. Nokia screen and little green progress bar	12:28
thresh	ran out of space in the middle of apt-get	12:28
MaikB	Surfa, what bugs me is not knowing where to look at ( log file )	12:28
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djkrikke	Hi Guys, what can be the reason the OTA update asks to connect to the pc?	12:29
Scelt	djkrikke: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	12:29
djkrikke	ok, couldn't find it that easy, thanks Scelt	12:29
Scelt	np	12:29
goody	how about when OTA shows no updates at all?	12:29
Corsac	just wait	12:30
hrw	/t Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA and fiasco shipping, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ \| N900 tells "use PC for update" - http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	12:30
hrw	can someone with @?	12:30
RST38h	hrw: Apt-get complains there is not enough space in archives/	12:30
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hrw	RST38h: symlink it to /opt/?	12:30
defragger	is it save to make a firmware upgrade?	12:31
furunk3l	defragger, worked for me like a charm.	12:31
thresh	is it safe to symlink /var/lib/dpkg to /opt ?	12:31
Arkenoi	thresh: i did remove latitude, did not help	12:32
MaikB	There is no way I will do a PC firmware update	12:32
MaikB	its stupid	12:32
defragger	is there a good howto?	12:32
MaikB	I want to know where to look for the reason why it fails	12:32
MaikB	damn..	12:32
thresh	Arkenoi: apt-cache depends / rdepends to find out the cause	12:32
MohammadAG	thresh, yes	12:32
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RST38h	hrw: Is it safe?	12:33
defragger	furunk3l: is there a howto you worked woth to upgrade?	12:33
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furunk3l	defragger, i just use the "over the Air" upgrade	12:33
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defragger	furunk3l: and how can i do that?	12:34
Arkenoi	thresh: does not look like i hae any installed	12:34
furunk3l	defragger, just connect to a wifi and after some time you will see a small yellow icon in the upper status bar.	12:34
hrw	RST38h: I have many dirs moved from /	12:34
furunk3l	defragger, click on the statusbar and then on the yellow icon	12:34
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hrw	RST38h: /var/cache/apt /var/lib/apt are safest	12:35
furunk3l	defragger, this will start the upgrade. be sure to have your battery fully loaded.	12:35
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Wolfie	if the yellow icon hasn't appeared, go to app manager and press update	12:35
Wolfie	it'll show up there	12:35
defragger	furunk3l: i see, i will try that now, thanks :)	12:35
furunk3l	defragger, you are welcome.	12:36
hrw	RST38h: but I have /usr/share/{fonts,locale,hildon-welcome,icons,maemoblocks,osso-lmarbles,pixmaps,sounds,themes} moved to /opt	12:36
hrw	RST38h: and this way I have 77.5MB free on /	12:36
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Arkenoi	thresh: no luck. what should i do next?	12:38
Mobsan	how do I make a google talk (video) call? can't see any options for this in my contact list...	12:38
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* lardman\|home heads for work		12:39
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MohammadAG	any ideas when the opengl libraries will be put back	12:41
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goody	is anyone getting no updates?	12:42
Arkenoi	funny, if i disable extra repositiories dist-upgrade says there is nothing to upgrade	12:42
ruskie	goody, it takes a while to propagate around	12:42
goody	thank you ruskie	12:42
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stranger__	any clear idea of the future of maemo after Nokia's last announcement?	12:43
vanadismobile	hai	12:44
vanadismobile	will pr1.2 install itself by wifi?	12:44
Stskeeps	stranger__: it would wonder me a lot if pr1.2 is last SSU.	12:44
stranger__	Stskeeps, it looks like it	12:44
Stskeeps	looks like last SSU?	12:45
frals	bah, i dont want to update my other device, 23days of uptime :(	12:45
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* MohammadAG halts frals' device		12:45
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stranger__	it seems there will be almost no Nokia involvement in N900 after the final release of meego	12:46
Stskeeps	erm.	12:46
Stskeeps	:P	12:46
Stskeeps	that's wrong on a lot of levels :)	12:46
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Stskeeps	first off, there has been talk in bug reports of a fremantle PE1, which means this isn't the last update we'll see.	12:47
MaikB	I just issued `apt-get move libqt4-opengl' which causes a ton of upgrades	12:48
djdm	Stskeeps: Mind if I jump in and ask what PE stands for?	12:48
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Stskeeps	djdm: honestly, i don't know	12:48
MaikB	I'll see how it works out	12:48
Stskeeps	second, there is a team working on hardware adaptation for MeeGo on N900 (meego the rpm system), with a bunch of nokians too. N900 is ARM reference device and it has to be kept in good shape	12:49
stranger__	maybe just a driver update here or there, but that is it	12:49
Robot101	djdm: we've worked on some PE releases in the past, and we have no idea either :P	12:49
MaikB	I hate try and error	12:49
Stskeeps	third, nokia care still answers your phonecalls :P	12:49
djdm	Stskeeps: Fair enough - cheers :)	12:49
Robot101	Post-release Engineering? Product Enhancement?	12:49
MaikB	especially if its not needed, I'm sure of it	12:49
Stskeeps	Robot101: Programmers Escaping?	12:49
djdm	Pink Elephant?	12:49
stranger__	and soon, 'most' of the developers will move to meego,	12:49
Robot101	stranger__: most of the developers are working on maemo 6 atm, not meego, so, this is manifestly untrue.	12:50
MaikB	stranger__, meego is just another distro	12:50
defragger	furunk3l: how long does it take, to get this update info?	12:50
* djdm will assume it's Pink Elephant, actually - I like that ;)		12:50
Robot101	djdm: me too :)	12:50
Stskeeps	stranger__: situation isn't perfect, but there's -plenty- of life in my n900 yet	12:50
MaikB	whats the matter?	12:50
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Stskeeps	stranger__: but to say nokia is dropping n900 on the floor and not caring about it at all, is a far stretch from the truth :)	12:51
biertie	is it possible to update to pr 1.2 without flashing the system? :s	12:51
stranger__	Stskeeps, now... but I am talking about after the release of meego.	12:51
Stskeeps	stranger__: meego 1.0's out this month. next one is october	12:51
Stskeeps	also, if you actually mean harmattan, please denote it meego-harmattan	12:51
Arkenoi	thresh: any further ideas what can i do to get the update? and why i do not see anything to upgrade if i remove extra repositiries?	12:51
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furunk3l	defragger, some time. check this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=At9tJHmgnrE this shold help you get the upgrade.	12:52
Robot101	Stskeeps: srsly...? :P	12:52
stranger__	Stskeeps, well, actually I meant after the first Nokia mobile based on meego	12:52
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Stskeeps	Robot101: srsly what? :P	12:52
Robot101	Stskeeps: meego-harmattan :P	12:52
Lazy^	Hello, since now nokia release 2.1 patch for N900. How i can choose videocall. Do i need to use some client or ?	12:53
Robot101	Lazy^: press the video call button in the address book, it will show for Google Talk and Skype contacts who have video support	12:53
noobmonk3y	2.1 lol	12:53
Stskeeps	Robot101: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=677849#post677849	12:53
Tuukka	Is carbon theme working as it should with pr1.2?	12:53
noobmonk3y	Lazy^: videocall on PR1.2 is available for skype/google etc	12:53
noobmonk3y	i think it is under the contact options.... (Just checking)	12:54
furunk3l	defragger, you can also check the application manager. and update manually by clicking on "Update" after you started the application manager.	12:54
pupnik	i suspect apt-get upgrade maymbe dangerous	12:54
Robot101	Stskeeps: is this not a violation of the meego trademark policy? :P	12:54
phellarv	Hrmf - No search in HAM after flashing to PR1.2.	12:54
noobmonk3y	yeah tis under contact options :P	12:54
Lazy^	noobmonk3y: so i need to use skype/google...	12:54
noobmonk3y	phellarv: yes there is	12:54
X-Fade	phellarv: just start typing.	12:54
sECuRE	Lazy^: you can also do SIP video calls	12:55
Stskeeps	Robot101: i think calling harmattan meego is bad enough :P	12:55
noobmonk3y	yup - there is no video calling for the normal phone function	12:55
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phellarv	X-Fade: Aha - Thanks.	12:55
defragger	yayyy got it, thank you very much furunk3l :)	12:55
Stskeeps	stranger__: there's multiple threads of development happening. one of the community backport of harmattan, another is 'real' meego on n900, and then there's the updates to fremantle	12:55
furunk3l	np, yw.	12:55
Stskeeps	stranger__: on top of that, synchronised APIs in form of Qt, so you won't miss out on apps	12:55
Lazy^	But there is no videocalls on normal phone funtion...	12:55
* phellarv is oldschool - I like clear instructions, and less dark magic.		12:55
Stskeeps	stranger__: the situation could be a hell lot worse.	12:55
noobmonk3y	phellarv: :D :D i agree	12:55
sECuRE	Lazy^: if you have configured a SIP account, there is (for SIP calls)	12:56
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portraitm	hello	12:56
X-Fade	phellarv: Oh, then you need to try start typing at more places :)	12:56
phellarv	noobmonk3y: That's why I mostly use apt-*	12:56
noobmonk3y	lol	12:56
X-Fade	phellarv: For instance on the desktop itself.	12:56
* noobmonk3y grumbles		12:56
portraitm	guys, i've flashed my n900 to the newest firmware, but i can not get portrait mode working now, any clues way ?	12:57
portraitm	p.s it's UK version	12:57
Lazy^	sECuRE: erm (stupid question) where i can get SIP account	12:57
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hrw	PR 1.2 lacks one thing which was in PR1.2 SDK packages	12:57
noobmonk3y	X-Fade: stop being so gosh darn clever - you are making the rest of us look bad!	12:57
noobmonk3y	hrw: ?	12:57
hrw	status area is not available in portrait	12:57
sECuRE	Lazy^: sipgate.de for example	12:57
Corsac	not exactly sure which apps got a portrait mode	12:57
stranger__	Stskeeps, maybe for an owner of N900, but what about those who plan to buy one soon? most will just think it is better to wait and the meego based one,	12:57
phellarv	X-Fade: If I start typing at more place, I probably would be charged for doing grafitti.	12:57
hrw	Corsac: run app, press shift-control-r and rotate device with keyboard closed	12:57
noobmonk3y	stranger__: but you dont know if meego is better or worse so to speak yet? lol	12:57
Stskeeps	stranger__: even my n800 is still useful.	12:58
sECuRE	Lazy^: but your video call partner would need to use SIP too, i think	12:58
* noobmonk3y lols - healthcheck in portrait mode is rather hysterical		12:58
Stskeeps	stranger__: everyone always wants the next thing, not knowing wtf it's about	12:58
Stskeeps	:P	12:58
Lazy^	ahh kk =)	12:58
Lazy^	maybe skype then...	12:58
Corsac	hrw: I was asking about which ones	12:58
Corsac	(since it seems not all of them do)	12:58
Robot101	Stskeeps: exactly	12:58
hrw	Corsac: with this trick any will rotate	12:58
hrw	Corsac: some will just do not look good	12:58
lcuk	Stskeeps, hold on "community backport of harmattan" ?? !! how can community backport whats not even out!	12:59
Stskeeps	lcuk: beats me, but we started talking about it	12:59
lcuk	where?	12:59
Corsac	hrw: hmmh ok it has to be done for each and every app	12:59
Corsac	well, each and every one you want	12:59
noobmonk3y	lcuk: i want windows 2012 with added bacon and i want it yesterday - i also want it to be open source lol	12:59
hrw	Corsac: yep - this is debug option which did not got removed	12:59
tybollt_	lcuk: O_o	13:00
tybollt_	lcuk: where?	13:00
tybollt_	Stskeeps: this harmattan package that was/is in dev extras (right?) what's its name?	13:00
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hrw	portraitm: basically nearly no apps with real portrait mode	13:00
noobmonk3y	hrw: thats cos some of us couldnt test it until yesterday	13:00
* lcuk rotates hrw		13:00
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portraitm	guys, i've flashed my n900 to the newest firmware, but i can not get portrait mode working now in the browser, any clues ?	13:00
* noobmonk3y is figuring out how to do it this week		13:00
portraitm	yeah, but with 1,1 it was working with the browser	13:01
portraitm	but now it does not	13:01
hrw	portraitm: go to settngs of browser?	13:01
noobmonk3y	portraitm: there is an option in options	13:01
noobmonk3y	or settings lol	13:01
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hrw	noobmonk3y: any Qt based can be autorotating by one line in code. no idea of gtk	13:01
portraitm	oh, and i had to enalbe rotation, yeah ?	13:02
tybollt_	well	13:02
portraitm	silly me..	13:02
noobmonk3y	hrw - got healthcheck installed?	13:02
tybollt_	qt based apps in repositories are ... surprisingly bad	13:02
tybollt_	if entire meego will be that quality I fret, big time	13:02
hrw	noobmonk3y: no	13:02
* noobmonk3y slaps tybollt_ with a horde of sloppy wet trouts		13:02
cehteh	wargs .. it doesnt update automatically	13:02
tybollt_	Stskeeps: will it?	13:02
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* tybollt_ blocks noobmonkey slap w/ MohammadAG		13:03
tybollt_	:)	13:03
Corsac	hmhm, weren't the bug about SMS to land lines supposed to be fixed in pr1.2?	13:03
hrw	noobmonk3y: instaling	13:03
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djdm	Corsac: There's an option in the Settings	13:03
hrw	Corsac: it is in settings	13:03
Arkenoi	actually there are landlines that do support SMS	13:03
lcuk	Corsac, ? what bug against landlines?	13:03
tybollt_	Corsac: it is	13:03
bigon	mmm my n900 is stuck in reboot loop :'(	13:03
tybollt_	Corsac: there's an option to only text mobiles	13:03
portraitm	hrw is it possible to open a virtual keyboard on screen when writing a sms in this firmware ?	13:03
noobmonk3y	hrw - the code has been in it for a while - but it has not had any thought put into it on my behalf	13:03
lcuk	BT are cool, if you SMS home phone, they call you and robot speak your message	13:03
noobmonk3y	you literally get half the app :P	13:03
hrw	portraitm: no idea	13:03
Corsac	thanks people :)	13:03
tybollt_	Corsac: but technically texting landlines is possib le (I have this service) so it is not off by default	13:04
* noobmonk3y 's landline supports sms		13:04
tybollt_	so it's not a bug, it's a feature added for 1.2	13:04
cehteh	i used that too	13:04
tybollt_	noobmonk3y: I have it on my home phone =)	13:04
noobmonk3y	:D	13:04
* satmd fails		13:04
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satmd	I installed 1.1 yesterday	13:05
tybollt_	FAIL	13:05
cehteh	wtf .. cant install 1.2 with the application manager	13:05
hrw	noobmonk3y: you wrote healthcheck?	13:05
noobmonk3y	satmd: you retro mo fo!	13:05
lcuk	SMS to house phone isnt something that the mobile can do anything about?	13:05
noobmonk3y	hrw: supposedly	13:05
hrw	noobmonk3y: it is UGLY	13:05
noobmonk3y	from scratch lol	13:05
noobmonk3y	hrw my first ever foray into linux, python, maemo and qt	13:05
lcuk	Stskeeps, come on, dont go quiet :p	13:05
* cehteh kicks nokia		13:05
satmd	noobmonk3y: the firmware on n900 site at nokia said pr1.2, but it was not 1.2 -- or I took the wrong local file but I doubt the latter option	13:05
hrw	noobmonk3y: so learn about making normal buttons and using dialogs?	13:05
tybollt_	lcuk: what do you mean?	13:05
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noobmonk3y	satmd: i think you took the wrong file :P	13:06
MaikB	I give up and do the flashing	13:06
MaikB	what a PITA	13:06
Stskeeps	lcuk: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=678699	13:06
tybollt_	lcuk: there's an option (added in 1.2) to block texting option to landlines - that's it. I am pointing out this is a _feature_ and that texting landlines is perfectly possible	13:06
Robot101	bigon: there used to be a bug with reboot loops which you could fix by putting it into R&D mode with flasher, and then booting it, and then rebooting it into the flasher to turn R&D mode off	13:06
MaikB	is RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin the right image?	13:06
RST38h	hrw: How do I determine why Maemo5 update does not install without actually downloading the files?	13:06
anonuk	need some major help ppl. upgraded the n900 and it rebooted during the upgrade and now is stuck in a reboot loop. No usb port for flashing, i have a bootmenu i installed so i should be able to boot mer from sd but it freezes on TSLIB calibration utility	13:07
anonuk	and ideas?	13:07
portraitm	guys anyone knows is it now possible to get the virtual keyboard when sending sms ?	13:07
*** Guest41782 is now known as dazo		13:07
Stskeeps	In some countries in West Africa, the heavy amount of dust in the air can severely limit visibility and block the sun for several days,[2] comparable to a heavy fog. The effect caused by the dust and sand stirred by these winds is known as the Harmattan haze, and costs airlines millions of dollars in cancelled and diverted flights each year.[citation needed] The interaction of the Harmattan with monsoon winds can cause tornadoes.	13:07
Stskeeps	brilliant name for a os ;)	13:07
noobmonk3y	hrw: what version of healthcheck you loading btw?	13:07
hrw	noobmonk3y: 1.2.0-1	13:08
Robot101	Stskeeps: you mean it's just a load of hot air? :)	13:08
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noobmonk3y	ahhh ok - i thought that was the better looking version :P	13:08
pillar_	argh, same thing againa - the OTA update complains that the update has to be done through USB .. last time it was Quake causing it - wonder what it is now	13:08
Stskeeps	Robot101: it was more along the lines of 'costing airlines millions of dollars' and 'causing tornadoes'	13:08
tybollt_	Robot101: being the head honcho of that project - I believe that is EXACTLY what he means :D	13:08
Stskeeps	;)	13:08
MohammadAG	Robot101, hot air might be vaporware	13:08
n900-dk_	portraitm: double tap on the white textspace to get virtual keyb.	13:08
tybollt_	MohammadAG: .'might be','is',	13:09
MohammadAG	tybollt_, not always :P	13:09
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bigon	Robot101: thx	13:10
djdm	Quick Q to anyone who may know: The apps in App Manager now seem to be sorted in a random (and not consistent - it keeps changing) order - any way to fix that?	13:10
lardman	re	13:10
MohammadAG	djdm, maybe you changed the arrangement?	13:10
MohammadAG	by size	13:10
Arkenoi	is dist-upgrade really safe alternative to app manager update?	13:11
anonuk	arkenoi: i did that just now and now stuck in reboot loop	13:11
thresh	+1	13:11
anonuk	arkenoi: so id say no	13:11
thresh	though I had no space on /	13:11
djdm	MohammadAG: How do you change it under PR1.2?	13:11
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MohammadAG	wasn't it under the title menu?	13:11
djdm	It doesn't seem to be now	13:11
MohammadAG	unless they f'd up and removed it	13:12
MohammadAG	One step forward two steps back	13:12
djdm	They're now in reverse alphabetical order, until you install something, in which case they seem to be random-ish	13:12
hrw	noobmonk3y: code is awful	13:12
anonuk	can anyone share their /lib/firmware files with me? im trying to boot mer and have no access to the n900 rootfs anymore as the 1.2 upgrade messed up and its stuck in a reboot loop	13:12
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MohammadAG	hrw, improve it :)	13:12
MohammadAG	anonuk, it's against ToS afaik	13:13
hrw	MohammadAG: you mean "rewrite"?	13:13
MohammadAG	anonuk, you should be able to mount ubi0:rootfs and get the files	13:13
anonuk	MohammadAG: I know its against ToS :( ive got no way to mount anything - usb port gone and cant load main OS	13:13
anonuk	MohammadAG: ive got bootmenu installed so was trying to load something else to try chroot and recover	13:14
SpeedEvil	you can also now adjust the order	13:14
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anonuk	MohammadAG: but nothing will boot without /lib/firmware	13:14
MohammadAG	anonuk, why can't you chroot?	13:14
MohammadAG	oh?	13:14
anonuk	MohammadAG: from where?	13:14
SpeedEvil	long-click on somewhere that's not an application on the application manager. Then you click an app, and move it where you want it	13:14
MohammadAG	nvm	13:14
anonuk	MohammadAG: no access to any OS on the device	13:14
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DrGrov	MohammadAG, hi there again.	13:14
hrw	noobmonk3y: rewrite your app to use .ui file for UI definition instead of making ui in code. then stop making own buttons. then stop assuming screen size	13:15
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MohammadAG	hey DrGrov	13:15
DrGrov	MohammadAG, how did you say I should update to PR 1.2? From the device yes but how about the right type of backup? Just contacts and settings is needed as backup since I lose the apps?	13:15
MohammadAG	if you update ota you shouldn't lose anything	13:16
djdm	My conversations disappeared, actually (but I wasn't that bothered)	13:16
djdm	So do back them up :)	13:16
sECuRE	my conversations did not disappear	13:16
sECuRE	(i ticked all checkboxes in the backup app)	13:16
djdm	So did I :)	13:16
sECuRE	strange	13:16
MohammadAG	neither did mine	13:16
MohammadAG	pr1.2 changed the db name	13:17
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MohammadAG	no idea why	13:17
djdm	I tried restoring it but it seemed to have some trouble so I killed it (stuck for ages on 99%)	13:17
djdm	Could probably get them back if I was desperate	13:17
Milo-	is there still no free .doc/.xls reader/writer for n900?	13:17
style	hmm, is it true that PR1.2 application manager doesn't have search anymore o_O	13:17
Stskeeps	use live search	13:17
Stskeeps	type first letter ..	13:17
djdm	style: Start typing the app name	13:17
style	aaah	13:17
style	thanls	13:17
style	thanks*	13:17
noobmonk3y	hrw: meh........ i got so annoyed with the qt designer and steps involved i did it all manually - i agree i should do it properly, but it requires time :(	13:18
portraitm	guys, i've tried crtl+shift+R in the blocks game	13:18
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portraitm	it rotated the screen, but when i pressed start a game	13:18
portraitm	app stucked...	13:18
djdm	Milo: DocsToGo will read	13:18
Milo-	djdm it's not free	13:18
djdm	Oh, hang on, that's 30-day trial	13:18
djdm	Sorry	13:18
portraitm	i just shut off my phone and turned on, but now i doesnt rotate blocks app, how can i get it rotate again ?	13:18
Milo-	portraitm reboot	13:18
Milo-	portraitm your accelerometer died	13:19
Milo-	it happens	13:19
portraitm	so i have to take off my baterie you mean ?	13:19
Milo-	no	13:19
Milo-	just reboot	13:19
portraitm	kk	13:19
portraitm	trying	13:19
Milo-	turn off your device and then turn it back up	13:19
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Milo-	should do the trick	13:19
portraitm	Milo- it rotates in the browser, but doesn't rotate app	13:21
portraitm	shall i try ctrl+shift+r again ?	13:21
satmd	Stskeeps: doesn't the new search in application manager effectively disable the use of the virtual keyboard?	13:22
Milo-	oh	13:22
Milo-	which app?	13:22
DrGrov	MohammadAG, ok so just update as OTA and good to go? How about applications as OTA update? I need to get them?	13:22
portraitm	blocks	13:22
portraitm	game	13:22
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Stskeeps	satmd: no lcue	13:22
Milo-	oh	13:22
Milo-	has it rotated before?	13:22
hrw	portraitm: what did we told?	13:22
andres	Is there a trick to make the modest widget monitor different folders?	13:22
Milo-	not all applications support rotation	13:22
MohammadAG	DrGrov, check out the flashing page, it has a paragraph about SSU afaik	13:22
portraitm	but it rotated me fist time :)	13:22
satmd	Stskeeps: well, hard to use it if you have no text box to tap. That's how it is enabled usually	13:22
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MohammadAG	infobot, flashing	13:22
Milo-	portraitm okay	13:22
infobot	well, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	13:22
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hrw	portraitm: shift+ctrl+r is debug thing	13:23
Stskeeps	neat, flawless pr1.2 update	13:23
DrGrov	MohammadAG, ok. Will do, checking now as we speak. I try to get some good background info first before I go berserk with my beloved N900 lol	13:23
portraitm	hrw can you tell me any app which supports rotation ?	13:23
hrw	no, I cant	13:24
LoCusF	do I need the eMMC image from tablets-dev or do I just need the FIASCO image?	13:24
sECuRE	LoCusF: fiaso is enough	13:24
pupnik	"photos" portraitm	13:24
LoCusF	RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin <- ?	13:24
lcuk	Stskeeps, im surprised you werent doing testing on pr1.2 before today!	13:25
LoCusF	hmm thats it, since I'm in Europe	13:25
sECuRE	LoCusF: yep	13:25
portraitm	and i have probably the last question, i want to get the virtual keyboard out when sending sms	13:25
lardman	zaheerm,	13:25
portraitm	but can not..	13:25
zaheerm	lardman, yes?	13:26
lardman	zaheerm: oops, sorry I didn't reply to your question re libchamplain	13:26
zaheerm	lardman, its ok i fixed it :)	13:26
lardman	cool, not sureI had that problem anyway	13:26
Stskeeps	LoCusF: emmc is only needed if you have problems or want to erase your emmc	13:26
zaheerm	some -dev package had an m4 installed that referred to an undefined macro	13:26
lcuk	heya lardman \o	13:26
Stskeeps	lcuk: i'm not a tester	13:26
DrGrov	MohammadAG, seems like not too different than the update to PR 1.1	13:27
DrGrov	MohammadAG, I will backup the whole freaking thing and get it over with right now :)	13:27
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alterego	Why is Qt OpenGL support missing for maemo5 in the SD?	13:27
alterego	~SDK	13:27
loufoque	isn't the seamless update there yet?	13:27
infobot	The Palm SDK is now public, and can be downloaded from http://developer.palm.com	13:27
DrGrov	MohammadAG, perhaps I am too concerned always when there is something new out there :)	13:27
bleeter	only had the n900 a week, how can I fill / so quickly? hehe	13:27
lcuk	Stskeeps, no you are a distmaster :P	13:27
Stskeeps	lcuk: i thought that was just about being punching bag for community	13:28
portraitm	maybe i should download something to get the virtual keyboard ?	13:28
LoCusF	Stskeeps: figured as much	13:28
lardman	hi lcuk	13:28
satmd	oooh	13:28
DrGrov	Where can I find a changelog for PR 1.2? What does it bring to the table compared to PR 1.1?	13:28
* satmd gives sts a bag of cookies		13:29
alterego	I quite like the contact menu extension interface ..	13:29
lardman	does Mardy (i.e. mappero maintainer/dev) hang out on irc?	13:29
loufoque	bleeter: installing tons of crap	13:29
DrGrov	alterego, how is it looking? how is it extended?	13:30
loufoque	DrGrov: portrait web browser	13:30
alterego	DrGrov: http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/libosso-abook/OssoABookMenuExtension.html	13:30
sECuRE	hm, still no custom groups in addressbook, it seems? or am i overlooking sth?	13:30
DrGrov	loufoque, ah that is a good addition.	13:31
loufoque	pupnik: you can see photos in portrait mode now?	13:31
DrGrov	alterego, thank you	13:31
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alterego	sECuRE: no, no custom groups, but with that interface we can implement it ourselves :)	13:31
tybollt_	lcuk: ,distmaster,head honcho, ,distmaster,big kahuna,	13:31
loufoque	DrGrov: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.2	13:31
sECuRE	alterego: ah, i see	13:32
DrGrov	loufoque, thanks. reading now. had a bit of problems to find it first.	13:32
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DrGrov	ah this is good	13:34
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DrGrov	what are the new applications in PR 1.2?	13:35
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DrGrov	can't seem to read anything about those in the wiki	13:35
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: new email desktop widget :D	13:36
alterego	New "Help" application .. If you can call it that ^.^	13:37
alterego	I noticed some more settings in settings under the phone, I think, but they may have been there before ..	13:37
Milo-	I kind of liked the two level menu	13:38
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Milo-	now I keep clicking "settings" each time I want to access any of the additional applications	13:38
sECuRE	is there a way to remove icons from the program menu? i could only move their position so far	13:38
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timeless_mbp	Trizt: ping :)	13:38
timeless_mbp	(ttl: 3min)	13:39
pupnik	loufoque: yes for a while	13:39
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, oooh! that's some fancy shit! :) lol	13:39
loufoque	pupnik: how?	13:39
noobmonk3y	hehehe ;) - doesnt work too great with nokia messaging accounts tho :(	13:39
alterego	Oh well, no Qt OpenGL for me then :(	13:39
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, my fiancee tried to wake me up in the morning to do the update but i was sleeping. so she went to work and kindly reminded me again before she left to update the phone :) how sweet isn't that? :)	13:40
noobmonk3y	awwwwwwwwwww! thats lovely - its a geeky romance! love it	13:40
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DrGrov	noobmonk3y, yes it is :) lol	13:41
loufoque	is there a trick to move to portrait mode?	13:41
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DrGrov	noobmonk3y, she must seriously love me for my geeky attributes :)	13:41
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SpeedEvil	A keeper!	13:42
SpeedEvil	:)	13:42
DrGrov	SpeedEvil, yes most certainly a keeper :)	13:42
an0therb0x	update error - not enough space in target ... where is the target ?	13:42
Milo-	DrGrov how much?	13:42
noobmonk3y	my missus lets me and my n900 just continue our relationship - as long as i tell her she looks beautiful every so often, works for me	13:42
* SpeedEvil sighs.		13:42
Milo-	I'll buy her right now	13:42
SpeedEvil	noobmonk3y: Does the n900 respond when you tell it that?	13:42
Stskeeps	wtf is this 'my nokia' thing.	13:42
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: the target s your root lol	13:42
noobmonk3y	SpeedEvil: it reb00ts :(	13:43
SpeedEvil	Stskeeps: It's apparantly to SMS spam you.	13:43
DrGrov	SpeedEvil, though I wonder how she likes my extremely long sleeping sessions and making noise like an idiot while sleeping :)	13:43
noobmonk3y	Stskeeps: evil nokia sms text spam	13:43
inz	noobmonk3y, by 'her', did you refer to your missus or your n900?	13:43
DrGrov	Milo-, you pimp ;) she is not up for sales	13:43
noobmonk3y	inz: both :P	13:43
Milo-	DrGrov dang!	13:43
Myrtti	"buy her..." sigh	13:43
loufoque	pupnik: ctrl+shift+O doesn't do anything in the image viewer	13:43
tybollt_	Stskeeps: it's basically Nokia sms-spamming you "tips'n'tricks" and in the long run they will probably start sending comercial messages as well (I get some of those)	13:43
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, you have a sort of a dirty relationship with your N900. That's the way I like it ah ah ah :)	13:43
pupnik	loufoque: dunno, sometimes works here	13:43
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DrGrov	noobmonk3y, but nice to hear you don't forget the "real" missus :)	13:44
hrw	mynokia smses? crap tricks	13:44
Stskeeps	tybollt_: ah, corporate evil	13:44
RST38h	Ok. Cannot update using HAM. Cannot update using apt-get	13:44
SpeedEvil	RST38h: Time to break out the butterfly.	13:44
DrGrov	Milo-, you don't got yourself a nice missus eh? :(	13:44
hrw	RST38h: but you got update info at all?	13:44
portraitm	and i have probably the last question, i want to get the virtual keyboard out when sending sms	13:44
RST38h	hrw: Yep, it shows the package	13:44
Milo-	DrGrov no, haven't been able to find one that would appreciate my geeky habbits	13:44
* MaikB is in the progress of installing the packages that are listed in the backup		13:44
RST38h	hrw: Is there any way to check for conflicts without really installing?	13:44
Stskeeps	"Attempt to unsubscribe has failed"	13:44
Stskeeps	wtf.	13:44
Stskeeps	:P	13:45
Milo-	habits*	13:45
cehteh	RST38h: same here	13:45
MaikB	it is confusing not to have the cpu monitor to look at	13:45
MaikB	:)	13:45
SpeedEvil	Stskeeps: I'm not sure - I think it sent a - chargeable - SMS to unsubscribe	13:45
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: nothing to remove under rootfs its all system files	13:45
timeless_mbp	RST38h: apt-get has a dry run flag	13:45
tybollt_	-n yeah?	13:45
DrGrov	Milo-, trust me. you will find one some day. you will be enlightened i am sure.	13:45
MaikB	fortunately ssh is one of the first things thet got installed	13:45
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: real? whats real? - i have a picture of the other missus on my n900 - thats as real as things get? - oh damn i need to get a life	13:45
MaikB	top ftw	13:45
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: lol - lets start from the beginning, you are trying an over the air PR1.2 upgrade i assume?	13:46
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: correct	13:46
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, yes perhaps it is time to upgrade yourself a bit eh lol ;)	13:46
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, nah, you just make sweet love to the N900.	13:46
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, it will as you've seen say NO to anything you do with it....	13:46
tybollt_	put on some Barry White and go down on it	13:46
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, god damn!	13:46
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: and you have not got enough room it is saying? can you tell me how much room you have in your root free please?	13:47
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, i mean it will never say no like a real missus would do	13:47
noobmonk3y	lol DrGrov	13:47
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: puter says nooooooooo	13:47
tybollt_	hell yes din grove fan :)	13:47
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, god damn i am becoming insane here	13:47
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: i work in mental health - so does revKathy lol	13:47
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: rootfs 227.8M 200.8M 22.7M 90% /	13:47
tybollt_	DrGrov: s,becoming,are, ;)	13:47
noobmonk3y	ok... you need space....	13:47
*** lardman is now known as lardman\|afk		13:48
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: can you disable all repo's bar the one needed for the update (specifically extras devel and testing please) - just disable do not delete	13:48
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, you got some space there for a loner like me? rofl	13:48
noobmonk3y	then let me know the space	13:48
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: system says 18 spare beds atm	13:48
noobmonk3y	could get a double, for you and the n900 ;)	13:48
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, damn. that is a lot	13:48
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, oh. a double you say you dirty little bastard :)	13:49
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: in 14 buildings, not a lot lol	13:49
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, damn you. make 18 spare beds in one building and we got a deal :) lol	13:49
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noobmonk3y	haha - how many phones are you in a relationship with!!! lol	13:50
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, let me count actually....	13:50
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MaikB	Means knowing one phone knowing them all?	13:50
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: i disabled all catalogs except for nokia applications and nokia system software updates	13:50
noobmonk3y	how much root free now?	13:51
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, i do have a Nokia 3120 Classic, a Nokia N73, a Samsung S5600, a Nokia N97 which the missus has, a Nokia N900, a Nokia 2680 something for a work phone	13:51
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, so i count my private phones to 4 or 5 about...	13:51
noobmonk3y	lol you phone'enizer!	13:51
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: and the woman still loves you! - she's a keeper!	13:51
noobmonk3y	(or a zoo keeper lol)	13:51
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, of course she is not too happy though about me getting a new phone once in a while but she starts to understand my craving for phones and geeky stuff	13:52
noobmonk3y	does that means she gets your sloppy seconds so to speak?	13:52
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DrGrov	noobmonk3y, my next phone will be a Nokia 9500i i think	13:52
MaikB	device is restored.. phew	13:52
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, no. i keep all my phones dearly like a flower on the palm	13:52
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: how much rootfs free now?	13:53
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noobmonk3y	congrats MaikB	13:53
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: looks like its not going to be possible i am at 89% capacity with 25.0M available	13:53
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: n9500i?	13:53
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noobmonk3y	hmmm it's always possible :p	13:53
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, no. the Communicator 9500i or 9300i	13:54
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noobmonk3y	NSU or flashing is one way - but there are things to do to help :D	13:54
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, or what the name was again. can't remember lol	13:54
an0therb0x	noobmonk3y: it needs 113.6M on a file system with a total size of 227.8M	13:54
noobmonk3y	an0therb0x: PM me (On web irc atm, so can't initiate easily)	13:54
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MohammadAG	noobmonk3y, just type /query nick	13:56
MaikB	yay, removing entries from the current play list..	13:56
MaikB	finally	13:56
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lcuk	an0therb0x, do simple things, disable your -devel -testing and other misc repositories and see how much space	13:57
lcuk	afaik you dont need to start with >100mb even through the update is 119mb :)	13:58
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chadi	do you guys expect PR 1.2.1?	13:58
lcuk	(first thing it does is reshuffles and makes tonnes more space)	13:58
MaikB	rootfs 227.9M 132.5M 91.1M 59% /	13:58
MaikB	nice	13:58
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chadi	there seems to be a lot of threads about PR 1.2 bugs	13:58
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MohammadAG	morning lcuk	13:59
RST38h	Hmmmm... apt-get dry run works	13:59
RST38h	apt-get install needs more space in archives/	13:59
RST38h	HAM just plain fails	13:59
MohammadAG	is it me or does facebook try to download the home.php page now	14:00
lcuk	RST38h, if you are using apt-get then why are you moaning about HAM	14:00
lcuk	morning MohammadAG	14:00
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toresbe	hey guys	14:01
toresbe	I'm trying to install PR1.2 but I'm having some trouble	14:01
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toresbe	specifically	14:03
toresbe	E: You don't have enough free space in /var/cache/apt/archives/.	14:03
MohammadAG	move it	14:03
tybollt_	7xdcc get meego-rel1-unofficial.bin Stskeeps	14:04
tybollt_	;)	14:04
Stskeeps	tybollt_: it's an xterm, not sure why you'd fake that ;p	14:04
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hrw	did someone used kexec to boot own kernel on n900?	14:05
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tybollt_	Stskeeps: ;)	14:05
Stskeeps	hrw: yes, but there's a reinitialisation problem in omapdss2	14:05
RST38h	lcuk: I have tried both apt-get and HAM, neither works	14:05
tybollt_	Stskeeps: just moaning... want unoptified (meego) noooooow =)	14:05
RST38h	lcuk: apt-get says there is not enough space. HAM just fails.	14:05
tybollt_	Stskeeps: are you allowed to talk about what you think of the looks and "shinyness" of QT gui vs current gnome-ish?	14:06
lcuk	then backup and reflash	14:06
MohammadAG	RST38h, move it!	14:06
hrw	Stskeeps: so no screen	14:06
MohammadAG	umm wait	14:06
MohammadAG	HAM fails?	14:06
RST38h	yes	14:06
Stskeeps	hrw: no, just a lot of output to console	14:06
RST38h	"You should use Ovi Suite for update"	14:06
Stskeeps	hrw: screen works fine ;)	14:06
tybollt_	RST38h: uhm itäs not released yet!?	14:07
RST38h	whatever, PC Suite or somethign	14:07
MohammadAG	RST38h, what does apt-get fail with?	14:07
RST38h	not enough space in archives/	14:07
noobmonk3y	http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space -> Move apt cache outside of rootfs -maybe? :D	14:07
hrw	RST38h: symlink it...	14:08
RST38h	a'ok...	14:08
BCMM	having pr1.2 frees up a lot of rootfs	14:08
noobmonk3y	BCMM - you owe lcuk a bacon sandwhich i feel	14:08
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noobmonk3y	sandwich even	14:08
noobmonk3y	or just a plate of bacon, screw the bread	14:09
BCMM	noobmonk3y: was it him that told me that yesterday?	14:09
noobmonk3y	he always needs bacon the more bacon he gets the more free rootfs space we seem to get	14:09
BCMM	anyway, was very true on my device, so i'll repeat it :)	14:09
noobmonk3y	hehehe :D	14:09
toresbe	MohammadAG: that's fairly obvious, in hindsight - thanks	14:09
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lcuk	i have had no bacon for a while now :( i am unable to eat it for at least another 2 months	14:10
noobmonk3y	wtf?!?!	14:10
noobmonk3y	:\| 2 months?!?!	14:10
lcuk	thats when i may finally have a working mouth	14:10
tybollt_	until you've converted out of islam/judaism?	14:10
tybollt_	ouch?	14:10
lcuk	yup	14:10
noobmonk3y	omg and ouch	14:10
tybollt_	what happened?	14:11
lcuk	so i oculd suck on bacon lollies	14:11
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lcuk	but the experience isnt the same, i <3 crunchy bacon	14:11
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Ken-Young	Has OTA pr1.2 shown up anywhere besides the UK yet?	14:11
Shapeshifter	uhm	14:11
Shapeshifter	wtf	14:11
* SpeedEvil passes lcuk a bacon enema bag.		14:11
lcuk	tybollt_, just having some dental reworking done and dont want to rock the boat	14:11
Shapeshifter	I just flashed the new firmware an now all my settings have been reset	14:11
ptl	what is the name of the PR1.2 update package? I can't get it on HAM.	14:11
Shapeshifter	my mails are gone etc	14:11
Shapeshifter	and the apps I had installed	14:11
iPeter-	hei	14:12
Shapeshifter	I did not flash the emmc	14:12
ptl	Ken-Young: according to some people on tmo, yes	14:12
tybollt_	lcuk: fair enough	14:12
Stskeeps	Shapeshifter: if you reflashed, of course a lot of things go bad..	14:12
Stskeeps	Shapeshifter: not all settings are on emmc	14:12
Shapeshifter	so I should have made a backup	14:12
Shapeshifter	xD	14:12
Robot101	Shapeshifter: doing a backup and restoring it is a normal part of the backup process...	14:12
Stskeeps	if you wanted to keep things, you should have OTA'ed	14:12
Stskeeps	:P	14:12
Shapeshifter	fail	14:12
lcuk	Shapeshifter, "you flashed new firmware" ok, so use the restore tool to restore your settings and data	14:12
Robot101	er, reflash process	14:12
Ken-Young	ptl Thanks	14:12
ptl	Ken-Young: but I can't get the update to show	14:13
Shapeshifter	lcuk: I assume it did not make a backup automatically.	14:13
iPeter-	i dled new update and i understood i could dl rollecoaster game from somewher but i cant find it from ovistore or app manager	14:13
Ken-Young	ptl Me neither. I'm in the US.	14:13
lcuk	Shapeshifter, :) why ever would you assume that?	14:13
ptl	apt-get dist-upgrade shows 111 Mb of packages	14:14
lcuk	everywhere tells you to backup	14:14
lcuk	EVERYWHERE	14:14
Shapeshifter	lcuk: well.	14:14
lcuk	iPeter-, isnt ovi on its way through	14:14
Shapeshifter	I went here http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware and like... hit "linux" and read on from there	14:14
lcuk	didnt i see a post saying thursday?	14:14
Shapeshifter	meh	14:14
tybollt_	clearly this is what you need lcuk´; http://www.kavli.se/wps/wcm/connect/se/Produkter/Bredbar+ost/Baconost	14:15
tybollt_	ost == cheese	14:15
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Shapeshifter	still it's kinda weird. when booted up now, I still saw my own background wallpaper. then it disappeared and was replaced by the blue one. and "cannot do operation, internal error" or something like that popped up twice	14:15
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lcuk	Shapeshifter, any computer upgrades and especially a reformat require proper backing up :'(	14:15
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Shapeshifter	yeah I should have thought of that	14:16
lcuk	mmmm baconarom	14:16
Shapeshifter	would have been nice if the flasher would do a backup automatically though ;)	14:16
lcuk	ahem, linux console does not dick around or mollycoddle the user	14:16
RST38h	apt-get installing...	14:17
Shapeshifter	yeah ;)	14:17
lcuk	the ham explicitely tells you to	14:17
* RST38h holds fingers crossed		14:17
aboyer	i am looking into the possibility of compiling the bc-cat kernel module for maemo/n900. this modules allows for opengl texture streaming and depends on the SGX sdk. has anyone done this already? is there a package or binary available somewhere?	14:17
SpeedEvil	it's designed for arm?	14:18
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aboyer	SpeedEvil: it should be, it supports omap3x and sgx	14:19
aboyer	http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/OpenGLES_Texture_Streaming_-_bc-cat_User_Guide	14:19
tybollt_	RST38h: na z'dorovje	14:19
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ptl	what should I do for the update to PR1.2 appear?	14:20
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ptl	I never reflashed my N900, I never used overclocked kernel	14:20
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ptl	but I refresh from HAM and the update does not appear.	14:20
ptl	I deactivated extras-devel	14:21
anonuk	just a heads up for people, apt-get dist-upgrade broke my device	14:21
anonuk	sent it into a reboot loop	14:21
Corsac	ptl: just wait	14:21
anonuk	(and ive no usb port to flash again :( )	14:21
tybollt_	anonuk: FLASH for you.	14:21
anonuk	tybollt_: no usb port so thats not a possibility	14:21
ptl	Corsac: but there are people who managed to do it	14:21
SpeedEvil	what do you mean no USB port?	14:21
anonuk	SpeedEvil: broke out	14:22
SpeedEvil	anonuk: So return for service	14:22
tybollt_	anonuk: SOL mate	14:22
anonuk	SpeedEvil: some 'friend' dropped it	14:22
jaska	now to replace my libvte with the darkgrey and border fixes :\|	14:22
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anonuk	SpeedEvil: was secondhand dunno if i can get service on it	14:22
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SpeedEvil	ah	14:22
Corsac	ptl: yes, in .eu, for us you might need to wait	14:22
SpeedEvil	I would phone and ask.	14:23
Corsac	ptl: all updates aren't pushed at the same time	14:23
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anonuk	SpeedEvil: im hoping maybe i can fix it by booting off SD to a different OS, as bootmenu is installed	14:23
ptl	Corsac: no, the update for north america	14:24
ptl	Corsac: people in the US say they did it	14:24
frals	afternoon everyone o/	14:24
lcuk	\o	14:24
frals	hows you lcuk?	14:24
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chadi	hey fMMS	14:25
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EsbenH	Just updated my n900 firmware with the app manager, and device seems to reboot itself in a loop :-((	14:25
Appiah	ouch	14:26
RST38h	time to use PC Suite then	14:26
RST38h	or flasher	14:26
an0therb0x	i am stuck in a rebooting loop, i may have hosed my n900	14:26
EsbenH	where do I find doc on that?	14:26
thresh	flasher works fine for me	14:26
chadi	what's wrong with infinite loops today?	14:26
thresh	after a reboot loop ;-)	14:26
RST38h	tybollt: not until it installs ;)	14:26
anonuk	an0therb0x: same with me :(	14:26
RST38h	inifinite loops will be fixed in pr1.3	14:26
thresh	:)	14:26
kehna	any solutions to an n900 refusing to install apps?	14:26
thresh	kehna: tell it in harsh voice to do so.	14:26
RST38h	file a bug report, contact nokia care, discuss it in brainstorm	14:26
kehna	i'll try	14:27
Appiah	kehna: depends on which app and why	14:27
Appiah	what errors do you get?	14:27
RST38h	it is a serious bug though, probably unfixable unless you make a human sacrifice to the Tentacled One	14:27
RST38h	(no, rabbits won't do this time though)	14:27
EsbenH	when it (tries to) boot I get wush sound, a themes background, a pink box in top left corner, and a bar underneath with 0000000 in it.	14:28
EsbenH	anybody else having the same problem?	14:29
ptl	no	14:29
ptl	I didn't even get the update to show up on HAM	14:29
xorAxAx	is 1.2 already out in .de?	14:29
EsbenH	it is in .dk, and now my n900 is dead :-(	14:29
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tybollt_	RST38h: :) fine, but I'm sure it'll be fine though.	14:30
mece	hey what's the standard separator object called in pygtk? I remember using something like that, but forget where. like <hr> in html.	14:30
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RST38h	tybollt: it is a proto device	14:30
tybollt_	Oh ok	14:30
RST38h	tybollt: which means a at least a couple of things may go wrong	14:30
tybollt_	ja, I understand	14:31
lcuk	posts like this remind me why i like maemo so much: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=679015&postcount=40 :)	14:31
an0therb0x	update just killed my n900, nokia has finally convinced me to switch ... XPERIA X10 here i come	14:32
thresh	ok thanks for telling us that!	14:32
an0therb0x	no problem	14:32
ptl	you waited so much for PR1.2 and will switch just because the update failed?	14:32
mece	an0therb0x, LOOOOOOOOL	14:32
mece	lcuk, ftw!	14:32
ptl	I just wanted PR1.2	14:32
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toresbe	Errors were encountered while processing: /var/cache/apt/archives/adobe-flashplayer_3.0.0.82+0m5_armel.deb	14:33
Stskeeps	an0therb0x: just flash it with the right fiasco image and you should be a happy boy. did you backup as being told to?	14:33
toresbe	E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)	14:33
toresbe	hmh	14:33
pigeon	ahha! i see pr1.2 from my app manager...	14:33
toresbe	sh: getcwd: No such file or directory	14:33
ptl	and as soon as I get it, even if I brick my device, I'll be satisfied (I'll unbrick it with the firmware images, no problem)	14:33
RST38h	an0therb0x: Very good idea, switch to Xperia immediately	14:33
sivang	s somebody responded to me here, and the backlog was lost	14:33
RST38h	an0therb0x: You are making a perfect choice	14:33
sivang	please retype )	14:33
ptl	pigeon: what is the secret?	14:33
Ken-Young	OTA pr1.2 just showed up on my tablet in the US. Wasn't there 15 minutes ago.	14:33
ptl	why can't I get it?	14:33
pigeon	the secret was i waited almost a day...	14:34
mece	hey the gtk separator is called... wait for it... gtk.separator! OMG!	14:34
toresbe	works on reinstall.	14:34
ptl	oh	14:34
thresh	damn	14:34
ptl	I don't have mp-fremantle-002-pr	14:34
an0therb0x	RST38h: will do, thank you sir	14:34
thresh	i need to connect nookla via usb to get the packages from backup back. the problem is I don't have a root.	14:34
thresh	meh.	14:35
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* noobmonk3y blinks		14:35
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, so if I update now I just do a backup with the own N900 software?	14:35
thresh	and no libicd-network-usb in PR12 preinstalled :-(	14:35
MohammadAG_	yes	14:35
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, will I lose my settings and contacts?	14:35
MohammadAG_	OTA - no	14:35
MohammadAG_	reflash - yes, only settings	14:36
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: the n900 backup worked fine for me, device was as-was when i restored ;)	14:36
MohammadAG_	(and apps - but you didn't ask about them)	14:36
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, good :) I will do a backup just in case something goes horribly wrong	14:36
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, I hate to do all settings again :)	14:36
MohammadAG_	shit happens	14:36
MohammadAG_	:)	14:36
EsbenH	DrGrov: better remember the backup, PR1.2 seems to brick devices :-(	14:36
noobmonk3y	but you can select what you want to restore	14:36
noobmonk3y	ie contacts / apps etc	14:36
chadi	do you guys have any idea why "My Nokia" is crashing my Settings application?	14:36
MohammadAG_	EsbenH, no bricks here	14:36
DrGrov	EsbenH, it bricks devices?	14:36
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thresh	it doesnt brick it	14:36
noobmonk3y	chadi: because it is nokias version of spam'a'lot?	14:36
thresh	just a new feature of reboot loops	14:36
EsbenH	2 or 3 here already reported it, including me.	14:37
chadi	no bricks here	14:37
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, any need to backup applications?	14:37
MohammadAG_	how did you upgrade?	14:37
noobmonk3y	EsbenH: hmmmmmm any update has a chance of doing that?!	14:37
ptl	dang	14:37
chadi	noobmonk3y, but I like spam	14:37
noobmonk3y	lol!	14:37
MohammadAG_	DrGrov, you can't backup applications, you can back up application lists	14:37
EsbenH	did anyone have success with OTA PR1.2 update, or did all you lucky guys use flasher?	14:37
chadi	Im curious to know what it is about	14:37
ptl	if I try to install mp-fremantle-002-pr it tries to download 110 MB of extra packages	14:37
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, ah okay. Just settings and contacts then.	14:37
chadi	no seriously, does anyone else have this problem?	14:37
ptl	EsbenH: I am trying to make it appear here	14:37
thresh	I had an infinite-loop after apt-get dist-upgrade, then i reflashed ;-)	14:37
MohammadAG_	DrGrov, do a full backup	14:37
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, ok. will do a full backup	14:38
Stskeeps	sigh	14:38
ptl	should I do apt-get install mp-fremantle-002-pr?	14:38
Stskeeps	dist-upgrade failing is your own darn faults	14:38
MohammadAG_	apt-get dist-upgrade causes problems	14:38
Stskeeps	:P	14:38
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, what should I do if something goes wrong? Just apply the latest full backup?	14:38
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MohammadAG_	which can be circumvented using dirty methods	14:38
noobmonk3y	hmmm probably obvious question....	14:38
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, will my 32GB storage be intact without losing any stuff from there?	14:38
MohammadAG_	yes	14:38
noobmonk3y	we can currently screenshot the device, anything around to record the device? (Other then doing it from a pc?)	14:39
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, so no lost information ? :)	14:39
DrGrov	God damn!	14:39
ptl	MohammadAG_: do you know if there is any way of me installing mp-fremantle-002-pr safely and then upgrading via HAM?	14:39
DrGrov	Now I will just do this before my fiancee gets irritated :) LOL	14:39
noobmonk3y	DrGrov: it doesnt make you a cup of tea though :(	14:39
MohammadAG_	DrGrov, you're a bit overreacting lol	14:39
noobmonk3y	you need the fiancee to do that!	14:39
RST38h	Gasson surgically implanted an RFID chip infected by malware into his hand. He claimed claim this made him the first human to become "infected with a computer virus".	14:39
MohammadAG_	ptl, apt-get install it?	14:39
RST38h	British scientists...	14:39
MohammadAG_	-scientists	14:39
noobmonk3y	i am quite parcial to getting a massage from the gf at the same time as updating... lol	14:39
MohammadAG_	:P	14:39
ptl	MohammadAG_: If I do it, it tries to push 119 MB of extra packages	14:40
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MohammadAG_	ptl, duh.. that's the update	14:40
DrGrov	noobmonk3y, yes. my fiancee will do my PR 1.2 update :)	14:40
MohammadAG_	umm	14:40
MohammadAG_	sec	14:40
ptl	MohammadAG_: I know, but I don't want to do it via apt-get because people here says it's failing.	14:40
MohammadAG_	ptl, you need to install the old version	14:40
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MohammadAG_	hmm	14:41
pigeon	DrGrov: you have a lot of confident in your relationship ;)	14:41
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pigeon	confidence even	14:41
MohammadAG_	3.2010.02-8 AFAIK	14:41
ptl	MohammadAG_: yes. How?	14:41
ptl	MohammadAG_: apt-cache policy does not show it.	14:41
ptl	:(	14:41
MohammadAG_	apt-get install mp-fremantle-generic-pr=3.2010.02-8	14:41
tybollt_	noobmonk3y: you mimicing that scene in "Swordfish"? :P	14:42
ptl	E: Couldn't find package mp-fremantle-generic-pr	14:42
MohammadAG_	umm	14:42
MohammadAG_	replace generic with your code	14:42
ptl	also, for -002	14:42
ptl	E: Version '3.2010.02-8' for 'mp-fremantle-002-pr' was not found	14:42
ptl	only 10.2010.19-1.002 0	14:43
noobmonk3y	lol tybollt_	14:43
ptl	no previous version	14:43
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MohammadAG_	ptl, you can always fabricate it :)	14:43
MohammadAG_	(or ask someone with the old firmware to repack it	14:43
ptl	how?	14:43
MohammadAG_	)	14:43
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ptl	can someone with the older firmware from north america repack here for me?	14:43
loufoque	what does OTA stand for?	14:44
MohammadAG_	Over The Air	14:44
EsbenH	And specifically, I meant using App Manager	14:44
loufoque	MohammadAG_: wasn't that called SSU or something?	14:45
Lazy^	Hey, i have install tar-gnu package to N900. Now i'm trying to extract .tar.gz packa with option tar xzf but i get an error tar: invalid tar magic	14:45
MohammadAG_	SSU = Seamless Software Update	14:45
MohammadAG_	OTA = Over The Air	14:45
Lazy^	am i missing a package or	14:45
* frals trouts MohammadAG_		14:45
phellarv	Lazy^: tar -xvzf ?	14:45
loufoque	MohammadAG_: SSU is OTA	14:45
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phellarv	All this is PITA	14:46
Milo-	how did I disable the annoying startup video? (the dang hands)	14:46
MohammadAG_	loufoque, your point?	14:46
* tybollt_ hands frals a whale - there, trout him w/ that =)		14:46
* MohammadAG_ throws a noobmonk3y at frals		14:46
* noobmonk3y giggles in mid-flight		14:46
loufoque	MohammadAG_: using tons of acronyms for the same thing is confusing	14:46
* frals throws a whale at noobmonk3y		14:46
* noobmonk3y eats the whale and farts		14:46
jaska	edit /etc/hildon-welcome.d/default.conf then comment out the filename= line with a #	14:47
jaska	gets rid of the wiggling hands and noise	14:47
tybollt_	hehe	14:47
MohammadAG_	loufoque, it's the interwebz, get used to it :P	14:47
tybollt_	so nibbler/futurama	14:47
SpeedEvil	Or replace it with rickroll.	14:47
Milo-	jaska thanks :)	14:47
Shapeshifter	where's ifconfig?	14:47
MohammadAG_	on the device	14:47
MohammadAG_	not in user's path though	14:47
loufoque	Shapeshifter: /sbin	14:47
Shapeshifter	loufoque: thanks!	14:47
DrGrov	pigeon, damn straight I have confidence in our relationship :)	14:47
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, now it is getting the firmware	14:48
sx0n	whereis ifconfig	14:48
SpeedEvil	<panto>	14:48
SpeedEvil	sx0n: Right behind you!	14:48
DrGrov	god damn!	14:48
DrGrov	i am excited!	14:48
SpeedEvil	</panto>	14:48
jaska	yay, dark grey works now \o/	14:48
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DrGrov	god damn!	14:49
DrGrov	it seems like it halted....	14:49
DrGrov	freaking things these updates	14:49
MohammadAG_	told ya	14:49
DrGrov	my fiancee will kill me soon she said!	14:50
DrGrov	LOL	14:50
DrGrov	i am being paranoid about this update according to her	14:50
MohammadAG_	<MohammadAG_> shit happens	14:50
sivang	DrGrov: she using the phone ? :)	14:50
ptl	dang, I just needed old mp-fremantle-002-pr... Could I get it from a previous FIASCO image?	14:50
DrGrov	sivang, yes. she is using the phone	14:50
pigeon	is there anything i should do before upgrading to 1.2 OTA?	14:50
sivang	DrGrov: hehe, tell her that's the thing in dog fooding.	14:50
pigeon	apart from backups, that is. is there something i should uninstall or disable first	14:50
pvanhoof	hmm	14:51
jaska	also, anyone else run into trouble trying to run the desktop environment in sbox when in fremantle_armel target?	14:51
DrGrov	sivang, trust me. you don't want to keep messing around when she is angry lol	14:51
pvanhoof	this new update tells me to use some piece of software on my PC	14:51
pvanhoof	what is this about? what software?	14:51
sivang	DrGrov: oh dear.I h one likethis, she's gone now :)	14:51
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, will the update still keep my ringtone?	14:51
MohammadAG_	LOL seriously mate	14:52
Appiah	:D	14:52
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, what!?	14:52
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DrGrov	MohammadAG_, LOL	14:52
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MohammadAG_	yes it will lol	14:52
sivang	DrGrov: actualy there afix there for the ring tone slector on a crash I reported :)	14:52
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sivang	heheh	14:52
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, perhaps I will revert back to a old god damn Nokia that has absolutely nothing?	14:52
DrGrov	WTF? Action failed.... Seriously	14:53
MohammadAG_	It's called Operation not action	14:53
DrGrov	But still updating...	14:53
MohammadAG_	Operation Failed	14:53
MohammadAG_	your device will now reboot	14:53
DrGrov	Damn you Nooooookia1	14:53
DrGrov	!	14:53
DrGrov	lol	14:53
frals	and kabooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooom	14:53
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MohammadAG_	lcuk, explodes!	14:53
zokier	so pr1.2 is out. is version "10.2010.19-1" pr1.2?	14:53
* shiny_____ dutifully explodes		14:53
pigeon	hmm now i get that "you must use the nokia software update application on your pc"...	14:53
Surfa	pigeon, that's solvable	14:54
DrGrov	god damn autolock	14:54
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DrGrov	autolock can still be active without problems?	14:54
Surfa	pigeon, most likely you have certain applications there that would create dependency problems	14:54
zokier	this feels bit buggy so i was wondering if i accidentally installed some beta or something	14:54
Surfa	pigeon, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=677105&postcount=12 check for those applications	14:54
DrGrov	should i just ignore the autolock and let the device work as normal?	14:54
Surfa	MohammadAG_, it appears to print that error message once or twice during update, don't know why, but upgrade seems to work anyway	14:55
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DrGrov	god damn this upgrade is slooow	14:56
ivan4th	did anyone try to install PR1.2 on repartitioned N900?	14:57
DrGrov	any need to add new repositories after the PR 1.2 update?	14:57
SpeedEvil	ivan4th: I have reparttitioned my mydocs to 5G size, and added a 'data' partition of 25G	14:58
SpeedEvil	ivan4th: no issues	14:58
SpeedEvil	DrGrov: I added the SDK ones.	14:58
SpeedEvil	But that's because I'm wierd.	14:58
DrGrov	SpeedEvil, ok. lol :)	14:58
ivan4th	I have /usr on eMMC	14:58
SpeedEvil	ivan4th: I would expect that to much more likely have problems.	14:59
SpeedEvil	ivan4th: Back up, and prepare to reflash	14:59
ivan4th	My device survived PR1.0.1 and PR1.1 upgrades (though it needed some intervention)	14:59
DrGrov	will be interesting to see what is new in PR 1.2	14:59
SpeedEvil	DrGrov: Annoyingly, my three top bugs were not addressed.	14:59
DrGrov	SpeedEvil, what were those 3 bugs?	14:59
SpeedEvil	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6584	14:59
povbot`	Bug 6584: GPS geotagged pictures truncate precision of GPS reading (0 decimal places)	14:59
zokier	so far 1.2 has been a disappointment here	15:00
kirma	huh?	15:00
DrGrov	zokier, nothing new and nice then? :(	15:00
SpeedEvil	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9827	15:00
povbot`	Bug 9827: Blocks should have highscore	15:00
SpeedEvil	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9826	15:00
povbot`	Bug 9826: Blocks collision detection bug	15:00
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zokier	DrGrov, yet to see anything nice, but have been using just few hours for now	15:01
DrGrov	zokier, ok.	15:01
* noobmonk3y expected free porn with 1.2 oh well..........		15:01
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noobmonk3y	ooo lunchtime............	15:02
SpeedEvil	noobmonk3y: It has MrHands.	15:02
DrGrov	MohammadAG_, how can I be sure that there will be no probolems?	15:02
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DrGrov	MohammadAG_, *problems	15:02
noobmonk3y_afk	lol SpeedEvil	15:02
SpeedEvil	It worked just fine for me - the over-the-air	15:02
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DrGrov	SpeedEvil, no problems with contacts being separated in two different names ?	15:02
SpeedEvil	Umm...	15:03
SpeedEvil	I have about 8 contacts.	15:03
SpeedEvil	They all look OK	15:03
DrGrov	SpeedEvil, i have 2 numbers for many people but kept as one contact.	15:03
SpeedEvil	I do not make heavy use of the calling features of the phone	15:03
SpeedEvil	and none have 2 numbers	15:03
Lazy^	Hello, i'm trying to chmod +x chroot.sh as root	15:03
DrGrov	ok. i do make since it is impossible not too because of my work	15:03
Lazy^	but it doesn't give +x right for it	15:03
chadi	I flashed, but didn't even loose the msn-pecan merging. That's great	15:04
SpeedEvil	Lazy^: you cannot make anything execute on the MyDocs partition, as it is vfat.	15:04
Lazy^	ahh	15:04
SpeedEvil	/home should work	15:04
alterego	Okay, maybe I spoke too soon, I can actually see all the GLES includes and libs in the sysroot, so I should be able to develop using the Nokia Qt SDK ..	15:04
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DrGrov	god damn this update is slow	15:04
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DrGrov	i think i will go down to 1 workspace.	15:05
DrGrov	how about keeping my encrypted WLAN settings? that is possible?	15:06
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kirma	ehm. I don't see geotags at all on my n900 photos after PR1.2 upgrade...	15:07
Appiah	is it enabled?	15:08
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Appiah	I remeber disabling this when I was asked..	15:08
Trewas	OTA update started with "Operation failed" here too, but it still seems to be going on...	15:08
Appiah	dunno where to enable it	15:08
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RST38h	Aha, it just killed my cell connection	15:09
RST38h	Must be upgrading cellmo!	15:09
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ptl	p-p-pleaaaaaaaaaaaaase	15:12
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ptl	anyone has mp-fremantle-002-pr from PR1.1.1?	15:12
X-Fade	ptl: just flash your device?	15:13
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ptl	X-Fade: I want the safest way	15:13
X-Fade	ptl: That is the safest way :)	15:13
Corsac	Trewas: “operation failed” seems to be spit when going to offline mode	15:13
ptl	Why didn't Nokia let the older version stay there?	15:13
X-Fade	ptl: it does.	15:13
Talus_Laptop	greetings	15:14
ptl	where? can I download it somewhere?	15:14
SpeedEvil	ptl: get the old image, extract it with flasher, ...	15:14
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Talus_Laptop	anyone here from esbox project?	15:14
X-Fade	ptl: Flashing takes 10 seconds, why bother?	15:14
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cehteh	whats the package name that provides the pr1.2 update in apt?	15:14
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ptl	cehteh: if you use global, mp-fremantle-generic-pr and if you use US mp-fremantle-002-pr	15:16
cehteh	thanks	15:16
ptl	X-Fade: flasher-3.5 -u RX-51_2009SE_3.2010.02-8.002_PR_COMBINED_002_ARM.bin ? is that how I extract the PR1.1.1 image?	15:17
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MohammadAG	ptl, no	15:18
MohammadAG	flasher-3.5 -F image.bin -u	15:18
MohammadAG	you forgot the -f	15:19
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MohammadAG	-F*	15:19
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F66F	hi	15:19
F66F	is there an way to geht 1.2 without an PC?	15:19
ptl	I did it... no .deb's, only rootfs and such	15:19
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SpeedEvil	It should update automatically F66F	15:20
Wolfie	wifi or 3g on the device itself works well	15:20
ptl	it will take some time :/	15:20
SpeedEvil	ptl: you get a ~100M or so ubifs image misnamed as a jffs that you need to mount	15:20
F66F	the device Asced 4 an cp connection	15:20
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kevloral	Hi all	15:20
Scelt	F66F: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	15:20
F66F	thx	15:21
Scelt	np	15:21
Scelt	12:30:23 < hrw> /t Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror:	15:21
Scelt	http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA an fiasco shipping, http://conversations.nokia.com/2010/05/25/nokia-n900-software-update-release-1-2/ \| N900 tells "use PC for updat e" - http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	15:21
Scelt	12:30:29 < hrw> can someone with @?	15:21
pigeon	hmm is talk.maemo.org down for anyone?	15:21
Scelt	yes	15:21
Scelt	seems so	15:21
Corsac	same here	15:22
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pigeon	or really really slow...	15:22
Appiah	what's "OTA" ?	15:22
Corsac	maybe they are upgrading it to pr1.2	15:22
Corsac	Appiah: “over the air”	15:22
X-Fade	~ota	15:22
infobot	hmm... ota is ssu	15:22
Wolfie	:D	15:22
Appiah	~ssu	15:22
X-Fade	;)	15:22
infobot	i guess ssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/SSU	15:22
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fraggeln	Is there anyway to resize / on a n900?	15:22
Talus_Laptop	greetings	15:23
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X-Fade	fraggeln: Yes, but only smaller.	15:23
fraggeln	I only have like 33mb left on /. its a bit hard to patch to the latest maemo then :/	15:23
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X-Fade	fraggeln: As it is the size of the physical chip.	15:23
Talus_Laptop	anyone here using esbox ide ?	15:23
X-Fade	fraggeln: disable extras and extras-devel, should save enough.	15:23
fraggeln	X-Fade: my / is only 256mb, and the update is 136mb	15:23
phellarv	fraggeln: Do a reflash = Problem solved	15:24
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MohammadAG	is there any way to use sudo in the SDK?	15:24
SpeedEvil	fraggeln: wfm with 50M free	15:24
X-Fade	fraggeln: That doesn't matter, it needs a bit under 50MB to work with.	15:24
fraggeln	phellarv: reflash?	15:24
MohammadAG	(or chroot)	15:24
ptl	[root@ubuntola ~]# mount -o loop,ro -t ubifs /dados/n900/x/rootfs.jffs2 /mnt/tmp	15:24
ptl	mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/loop0,	15:24
SpeedEvil	ptl: it's not that simple	15:24
Stskeeps	ptl: ubifs only works in a mtd environment	15:24
ptl	so... how would I mount it?	15:24
MohammadAG	ptl, see X86's post	15:25
SpeedEvil	Bets on how long compiling the kernel will take on the phone?	15:25
SpeedEvil	Started 13:22	15:25
ptl	MohammadAG: which one? which url?	15:25
phellarv	fraggeln: http://wiki.maemo.org/Flashing	15:25
MohammadAG	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35554	15:25
MohammadAG	btw tmo seems down	15:26
pigeon	Surfa: hmm, that didn't help... maybe i need to uninstall some package that is not listed there...	15:26
Surfa	libgles1-img-sgx	15:27
Surfa	maybe?	15:27
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F66F	apt tells me about 1080 not upgraded packages Oo	15:27
fraggeln	annoying. I cant upgrade using the Nokia Software Updater.	15:27
fraggeln	nor using the application manager in the device	15:28
F66F	fraggeln: y?	15:28
cehteh	bah .. drat .. ota update still doesnt work	15:28
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ptl	X-Fade: I gave up, I'm flashing it	15:32
ptl	only combined image	15:32
ptl	do I need to take the battery out?	15:32
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GeneralAntilles	lardman\|afk, pong?	15:33
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MohammadAG	ptl, follow the instructions	15:34
Funnyface	yay the update is available in the reposies now :P	15:34
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Ikarus[N900]	huh, the pr1.2 update wants me to hook the phone to a pc ?	15:35
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fraggeln	anyone wanna buy a n900? Im starting to hate it more and more.	15:35
Funnyface	fraggeln: what's wrong with it? :>	15:35
Funnyface	<Ikarus[N900]>huh, the pr1.2 update wants me to hook the phone to a pc ?	15:36
Funnyface	uhm.. apparently, it just wanted me to do the same thing -_-	15:36
cehteh	here too	15:36
fraggeln	Funnyface: lack of features, and now, impossible to upgrade to the latest maemo.	15:36
cehteh	thats caused by some dependencies of installed software	15:36
xorAxAx	hmm, apt-get upgrade doesnt work with PR 1.2 :-(	15:36
Scelt	fraggeln Funnyface Ikarus[N900]: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	15:36
X-Fade	xorAxAx: It isn't supposed to.	15:37
cehteh	i am now surgically upgrading it with apt and some hacks	15:37
Bluewind	xorAxAx: what doesn't?	15:37
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Bluewind	so far apt-get works here	15:37
xorAxAx	Bluewind: it reboots the device directly	15:37
X-Fade	If you upgrade with apt,you will have less space on your root when done.	15:37
cehteh	xorAxAx: when?	15:37
xorAxAx	cehteh: after downloading	15:37
Bluewind	well how else should I do it?	15:37
cehteh	ah	15:37
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xorAxAx	at least it did for me, watchdogs got active	15:38
Bluewind	ham doesn't want to	15:38
cehteh	HAM ... but well its broken	15:38
RST38h	epic fail	15:38
RST38h	root fs all used up, installation crashed	15:38
Bluewind	and for nsu: I don't have windows machines here	15:38
Trewas	damn updated nokia maps in pr1.2 still does not have option to lock direction of north (to prevent it from spinning randomly) and the old fix does not work anymore	15:38
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* cehteh deinstalled some conflicting packages and symlinked the dpkg archive to /home to have some space and now apt-get upgrading		15:39
defragger	is there a goog howto, to port a debian package to maemo?	15:39
cehteh	25 secs remaining for download ...	15:39
RST38h	cehteh: I do not see any normal N900 user doing that	15:39
cehteh	lets see	15:39
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Funnyface	hmm I thought the update would be installed the same way as the previous one	15:40
cehteh	RST38h: yes thats pain	15:40
* RST38h doing apt-get install -f now		15:40
Funnyface	oh well I guess it is time for a fresh start anyway	15:40
Funnyface	haven't flashed the device since I got it :P	15:40
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thresh	RST38h: haha, failed for me.	15:40
cehteh	blame nokia (again)	15:40
cehteh	well 1.2 is likely the last thing i take from nokia i plan to divert anyways ..	15:40
RST38h	thresh: Well, I moved the apt-get cache to MyDocs	15:40
RST38h	thresh: still managed to fill / though	15:41
pupnik	same here RST38h	15:41
Bluewind	then move some more stuff	15:41
thresh	yup	15:41
fraggeln	yay! its upgrading.. :D	15:41
Shapeshifter	ham is still the same lame, slow garbage thing it was before though	15:41
thresh	nokia fails :(	15:41
fraggeln	any year now :)	15:41
RST38h	pupnik,thresh: install -f folks	15:41
cehteh	RST38h: HAM does some more tricks to prevent roof fs fill up	15:41
RST38h	cehteh: HAL fails installing this for me point blank	15:41
thresh	RST38h: yes, and it fills up FS. and then infinite loop of reboots.	15:41
cehteh	hehe	15:41
RST38h	thresh: no reboots for me yet	15:41
thresh	RST38h: wait and you will have those =)	15:42
MohammadAG	cehteh, the fact that it repropulates the whole list after each install sucks	15:42
pupnik	all done here it seems and no reboot	15:42
zokier	luckily i decided to flash the device instead	15:42
pigeon	Surfa: good catch, that's it, thanks, now i'm moving onto the not enough memory in target problem :)	15:42
MohammadAG	repopulates*	15:42
Bluewind	apt-get dist-upgrade currently running fine	15:42
cehteh	for me neither, but the download just completed and the optify runonce is installing	15:42
Surfa	pigeon, hehe :) good luck on that.. i don't have much experience there	15:42
Bluewind	locales take ages to install though :(	15:42
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cehteh	mhm forgot to rip out the uSD card with the backup .. i hope it wont touch it :P	15:43
Smokers	hey there, anyone from germany here?!	15:43
satmd	it wont	15:43
Bluewind	Smokers: nope but Austria	15:43
satmd	lol, german in austria here	15:44
skynets	N900 is dead	15:44
Smokers	mhh dont know if you can help me ;-)	15:44
skynets	nokia let it go	15:44
skynets	like other phones in the past	15:44
skynets	and people dont care	15:44
Smokers	i just tryed to update my n900 but it seems that the european / german update server from nokia are dead...	15:44
skynets	this time it was too early	15:44
Smokers	is that possible?!	15:44
pupnik	too many languages	15:44
GeneralAntilles	skynets, people care.	15:44
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X-Fade	Smokers: no	15:44
GeneralAntilles	Problem is, too few people are left around because Nokia keeps abusing them.	15:45
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Smokers	mhh any suggestions about the problem X-Fade	15:45
Smokers	?	15:45
cehteh	yeah .. i give a shit about nokia, 1.2 hopefully got a lot firmware and necessary fixes now, thanks nokia, now i part away doing my own stuff with the device	15:45
Bluewind	Smokers: what's the error?	15:45
zomg	Mine updated for 1.2 quite fine just a while ago	15:45
cehteh	Smokers: i just downloaded from the servers in germany	15:46
Smokers	Mhh The Nokia Software updater tried more than 3 times to reach the server	15:46
cehteh	well they use akamai, so that tells nothing	15:46
Smokers	or download. Maybe there is a error while establishing connection .. etc	15:46
Bluewind	ah guis not having usefull error messages right?	15:46
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* GeneralAntilles finds it interesting there's no discussion of the Harmattan/N900 issue on Planet.		15:46
satmd	where would I look for rtcom logs?	15:47
Smokers	i can paste it in german ;P "Nokia Software Updater hat mehr als drei mal versucht , Ihre Software herunterzuladen. Möglicherweise ist ihre momentane Internetverbindung nicht stabil genug. Das Problem kann jedoch auch an unseren Servern liegen."	15:47
satmd	"network error" isn't helping me	15:47
Bluewind	anyone knows how to blacklist/remove/whatever the unused locales? there are some metapackages which prevent me from just uninstalling and I'm not used to apt	15:47
Stskeeps	GeneralAntilles: i think it's because people aren't update starved	15:48
satmd	versuch n pc neustart oder später nochmal, das kann auch einfach n routing oder dns-problem sein	15:48
cehteh	Bluewind: no localepurge package?	15:48
Stskeeps	GeneralAntilles: with Diablo, it had been dead for a fair bit when it got announced n8x0 was hosed	15:48
MohammadAG	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10291 wasn't this fixed? (I can't reproduce it)	15:48
povbot`	Bug 10291: Media widget play button doesn't work	15:48
Smokers	satmd ich versuchs seit 4 h,.. immer der gleiche error... okay kein neustart seitdem aber .. mh	15:48
Bluewind	cehteh: actually I want to prevent apt from wasting it's time	15:48
Smokers	satmd ich werd mal n reboot testen, danke.. die info das es an mir liegt is ja schonmal was	15:48
Bluewind	installing 20 locales takes ~ 1 min	15:48
fraggeln	anyone got a changelog for the latest update?	15:49
Bluewind	that multiplied by ~200 packages = ages	15:49
cehteh	Configuration file `/etc/init.d/rcS'	15:49
cehteh	==> Modified (by you or by a script) since installation.	15:49
cehteh	==> Package distributor has shipped an updated version.	15:49
cehteh	haha nice :P	15:49
crs	Hi, anyone is having doubled contacts on the contacts list due to facebook?	15:49
Funnyface	oh so the reason I can't do the update is that the installer doesn't have enough space on the device?	15:49
Scelt	crs: everyone I think	15:49
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cehteh	only 'd' for diff doesnt work since it has no diff installed by default .. bah	15:49
crs	I tried to resolve it by using facebook contacts merger by Marco, but it says all is OK.	15:49
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crs	Scelt: But only foir me that app is not working. ;/	15:51
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ZogG	\o	15:51
Ikarus[N900]	hmz, manual apt-get dist-upgrade doing the trick	15:51
Bluewind	dist-upgrade install ~20 new packages	15:52
Bluewind	only upgrade wouldn't do that	15:52
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Funnyface	whoever came up with the partitioning ideas of the N900 did a horrible job	15:53
Funnyface	:o	15:53
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RST38h	cehteh,thresh: I updated	15:53
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cehteh	still running here, but seems fine so far	15:53
Bluewind	is that flash they use for / really faster than the one used for /home?	15:53
RST38h	cehteh,thresh:definitely not "painless"	15:53
cehteh	Bluewind: yes	15:53
Ikarus[N900]	Funnyface: it's due to the older webtablet's legacy really	15:53
Bluewind	how much? any numbers?	15:53
Ikarus[N900]	Bluewind: yes	15:54
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RST38h	More like "our plane is going to crash, take proper positions, shut up and pray"	15:54
Funnyface	well they should have allocated less space for MyDocs and more for the system partitions :P	15:54
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* Ikarus[N900] hacks a little script to see what packages use most space on /		15:55
* Scelt advices Ikarus[N900] just to use Storage Usage app		15:55
Bluewind	cd /; du -shx *; excludes symlinks but not bind mounts	15:55
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Bluewind	or actually mounts	15:56
ghostcube	OTA worked fine yeah	15:56
Bluewind	i.e. /home will show up as used space	15:56
thresh	RST38h: you lucky guy	15:56
lcuk	i wonder why theres a whole bunch of people who say theres better formatting and layout methods yet have not managed to come up with a convincing plan of action to migrate ;)	15:56
Shapeshifter	gah	15:56
Bluewind	ota?	15:57
fraggeln	yay! upgrade complete :)	15:57
thresh	because they shouldnt and nokia shouldve though about it in the first place?	15:57
ghostcube	repo update without flashing	15:57
Shapeshifter	They changed something on the desktop widgets, now the settings button is lower than before. Now I can't move around very small desktop command execution widgets	15:57
jaska	aah, looks like i can remove the HildonPanninArea indicator in my xterm and reclaim valuable spaaaccee	15:57
Bluewind	k	15:57
ghostcube	:)	15:57
jaska	s/annin/anning/	15:57
infobot	jaska meant: aah, looks like i can remove the HildonPanningArea indicator in my xterm and reclaim valuable spaaaccee	15:57
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Shapeshifter	Is there a config file for the positions of widgets?	15:59
Shapeshifter	I need to edit it by hand	15:59
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Bluewind	probably they use gconf	15:59
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MohammadAG	frals, some users aren't happy :P http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53806	16:00
tybollt_	will 'users' ever be happy?	16:00
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cehteh	rootfs 227.8M 216.2M 7.4M 97% /	16:01
cehteh	... cross fingers	16:01
adeus	tybollt_: http://www.moosegoods.com/Images/products/Clothing/13040-Beatings-Navy.jpg	16:02
Funnyface	aah stupid me, I was copying stuff from my home directory to a backup folder on my PC, then half way through I forgot I was doing and decided to "aah, let me switch on the phone that I just turned off" and messed up the copying process -_-	16:02
Funnyface	have to start over now with several GBs :p	16:02
Funnyface	(instead of turning the phone on, I turned it off, thinking it was already off)	16:03
crs	Funnyface: Use rsync.	16:03
Funnyface	I don't trust automatic backup tools :P	16:03
frosty`	rsync is not just a backup tool..	16:03
GAN900	Stskeeps, maybe once they realize how flaky the update is.	16:03
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* RST38h did not even have to reinstall applications		16:04
Shapeshifter	GAN900: what issue?	16:04
Shapeshifter	GAN900: "no official meego for n900"?	16:04
GAN900	Shapeshifter, regression city.	16:05
Shapeshifter	ah	16:05
GAN900	Shapeshifter, oh, yeah, that.	16:05
crs	Hmm, noone had any problems with facebook merger?	16:05
Shapeshifter	GAN900: I mean what you said earlier	16:05
ptl	bah :/ restoring lots of stuff now	16:05
cehteh	hehe prolly coming for me too	16:06
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ptl	at least I saved my settings using the backup app	16:06
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cehteh	ok update done	16:08
mece	What the shit? is there no function to replace or remove an item in a hildon.TouchSelector?	16:08
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cehteh	reboot ...	16:09
Smokers	satmd noch da? leider keinen erfolg	16:09
Surfa	keinen erfolg bei was?	16:09
Smokers	reboot, neuinstallation nokia software updater	16:10
Smokers	und anschließendem versuch neue firmware zu laden	16:10
defragger	is there a good howto, for porting debian packages to maemo?	16:10
cehteh	Smokers: you have to tell a precise error, just telling "doesnt work" wont help	16:10
ghostcube	Smokers: OTA update geht nich?	16:10
mgedmin	this is probably a FAQ, but what's the deal with extras-devel for fremantle-1.2?	16:10
Surfa	Smokers, was sagt app manager?	16:10
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DrGrov	Does anyone with PR 1.2 think it boots up faster than with PR 1.1?	16:11
cehteh	just boots here ... doesnt look faster yet	16:11
DrGrov	MohammadAG, seems like the settings were okay. No worries there	16:11
cehteh	well first flashed the kernel	16:11
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DrGrov	It seems like the "bootup" bar goes a bit faster. Not just from left to right but simultaneously right and left.	16:11
Smokers	Ich mach ma englisch... The exact error is :" Updatedownload was failed - NSU tryied more than 3 times to download the update. Maybe your internet connection is not stable. Please try again later"	16:11
ghostcube	if you backup settings and after ota clean up device its fine here	16:12
DrGrov	Be back later, gotta run.	16:12
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passeli\|w	anyone knows what is the gps device name in N900 ?	16:12
cehteh	wee .. somethnig gone horrible wrong	16:12
mgedmin	ok, apparently Distribution is supposed to be 'fremantle' not 'fremantle-1.2'	16:12
Smokers	Is there a difference between updateing from nokia software updater and from the app manager?!	16:12
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ham5	yup	16:13
Smokers	wich one ;-)?!	16:13
cehteh	the pin screen looks like a completely unthemed gtk with no font (all boxes)	16:13
ham5	figured ud ask that	16:13
ham5	shouold of in the first place	16:13
mgedmin	Smokers, you mean, firmware update? yes, update from NSU will wipe your device clean; update from app manager will preserve all apps and data	16:13
cehteh	bah .. bricked it ..	16:14
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Ikarus	well, looks like I broke it	16:14
Smokers	okay,.. thx mgedmin. i would like to have a clear device, so a update from NSU would be great,.. but seems that will be a hard trip	16:14
Ikarus	meh	16:14
ham5	godda 'login' to your n900 when it 'boots'?	16:14
Ikarus	and ofcourse no USB A -> micro B cable handy	16:14
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Ikarus	mine hits the desktop	16:15
Ikarus	then spontaneously reboots	16:15
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X-Fade	Smokers: You can also try flashing without nsu.	16:15
X-Fade	Smokers: Check the planet for an article on how to do that.	16:15
Smokers	mh okay,.. that will be much harder right ?! -.- i could be so easy.... T_T	16:16
Ikarus	guess I'll have to reinstall everything	16:16
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RST38h	Ok, physical keyboard STILL does not switch the layout when pressing Ctrl+Enter	16:16
ghostcube	ok, question: do i need to set extra and extra devel to fremantle-1.2?	16:17
ghostcube	manually?	16:17
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X-Fade	ghostcube: Only extras has fremantle-1.2	16:18
ZogG	BBT is great	16:18
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ghostcube	X-Fade: thx a lot	16:19
cehteh	grr .. what was the page to get the flash images? ...	16:19
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jacekowski	just google it	16:20
andrewfblack	according to this guy http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2364160,00.asp?kc=PCRSS03079TX1K0000585 the Dell Mini 5 and he might as well said Nokia 770 and N8x0 are not tablets. Because they are smaller then an ipad and have a mic and speakers. I just lose the little repect I had for PCmag	16:20
Stskeeps	..	16:20
Stskeeps	wtf does mic and speakers have to do with it	16:20
Stskeeps	reality distortion field indeed	16:20
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andrewfblack	Stskeeps: They are calling anything smaller then a ipad or Hp Slate with a mic and speaker a phone not a tablet. Doesn't matter if it has Cell Voice on it or not	16:23
Stskeeps	heh	16:23
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MohammadAG	anyone on fedora and using gnome?	16:23
Dassu	hmm, any ideas when is the 1.2 gonna be released in Finland?	16:23
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noobmonk3y	Dassu: today supposedly	16:23
Dassu	yeah, I know that but at what time?	16:24
noobmonk3y	at some point :P	16:24
Dassu	:(	16:24
noobmonk3y	Dassu: really think they give times out? lol	16:24
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Dassu	I hope they fix the wlan bug	16:24
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noobmonk3y	MohammadAG: no but there's a gnome in left4dead 2 thats quite cool	16:24
noobmonk3y	whats the wlan bug?	16:25
noobmonk3y	there is a full list of fixes though	16:25
Bluewind	Dassu: IÄm from Austria, but my device also installs Finnish locales so I guess it's out	16:25
MohammadAG	lolwtf	16:25
RST38h	Anyone knows how I switch to portrait mode in PR1.2 apps?	16:25
Trewas	Dassu: it was released about at noon as OTA	16:25
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noobmonk3y	Bluewind / Dassu - there are multiple servers / locations - all depends when they are updated to roll out	16:25
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MohammadAG	17831 1 user S 5988 2.4 58.2 /usr/libexec/hildon-thumbnailerd <-- what exactly is this for	16:26
cehteh	whats new on the emmc image btw?	16:26
MohammadAG	User guides!!!	16:26
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MohammadAG	:)	16:26
achipa	RST38h: crt-shift-r ?	16:26
Dassu	omagod. It found it :o	16:26
achipa	(if you mean the forced switch)	16:26
MohammadAG	ignore my question above, whatever that process was, no longer is	16:26
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ZogG	MohammadAG now try photo apps	16:27
Ikarus	right, it's stuck in a reboot loop...	16:27
Ikarus	meh	16:27
RST38h	achipa: testing	16:27
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ZogG	Ikarus reflashing?	16:27
RST38h	fuck it works	16:28
achipa	:)	16:28
* Ikarus goes to the local shop for a new USB-A micro-B cable		16:28
noobmonk3y	Dassu: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.2	16:28
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ghostcube	ok i think it was asked before, but is skype video call supported?	16:28
achipa	depends on the app, really	16:28
ZogG	RST38h, what works?	16:28
noobmonk3y	ghostcube: yes	16:28
ghostcube	cool	16:28
noobmonk3y	i think	16:28
achipa	ZogG: forced universal portrait	16:28
ZogG	Ikarus, you don't have one?	16:28
MohammadAG	RST38h, watch your language, it's a fscking family channel	16:28
ZogG	achipa, screenies?	16:28
noobmonk3y	ghostcube: PR1.2 update - first on the list - Skype video call (with PC and other skype video capable clients)	16:28
ZogG	achipa, or it's CTRL+SHIFT+R	16:29
achipa	ctrl-shift-r	16:29
Ikarus	ZogG: yeah, tactically misplaced it :P	16:29
ZogG	achipa, meh	16:29
Ikarus	ZogG: stupid cables are pretty under used	16:29
Ikarus	even though technically superior	16:29
achipa	for some stuff it's perfect, some (like nokia default apps ;) ) it's pretty bad	16:29
ZogG	=(	16:29
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Ikarus	so I'm off shopping in a bit	16:29
ghostcube	noobmonk3y: thx :)	16:30
ZogG	MohammadAG, so try to open photo thing	16:30
ZogG	or file folder	16:30
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noobmonk3y	ghostcube: no probs at all :)	16:30
MohammadAG	ZogG, it works	16:31
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ghostcube	noobmonk3y: ota worked fine backupped all before cleaned up the dvice after	16:31
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ghostcube	restored backup works fine here	16:31
Shapeshifter	how to configure the new menu?	16:32
kaie	am I the first who semi-bricked his n900 with today's maemo5 update? it constantly reboots, and brings up some weird grey dialog for 2 seconds	16:32
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ghostcube	wah sshd applet is gone ;(	16:32
Scelt	Shapeshifter: push hard	16:32
Shapeshifter	Scelt: thanks	16:32
Scelt	Shapeshifter: for 2-3 secs. it asks then where you want to move that icon	16:32
Scelt	np :]	16:32
ghostcube	hmmm the best way is to use xterm and apt for an ota update	16:32
noobmonk3y	wohoooooooooo	16:33
noobmonk3y	good to hear ghostcube	16:33
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* MohammadAG votes for a ban, who seconds that http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53813		16:33
kaie	I used over the air update	16:33
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noobmonk3y	MohammadAG: i vote for a slap round the chops with a trout	16:33
cehteh	kaie: no you are not ..	16:33
cehteh	mine didnt reboot but other thnigs are broken, i am going to reflash now	16:34
Scelt	http://www.josefrichter.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/Perhaps-the-best-legal-typo-of-all-time.jpg :-D	16:34
ZogG	MohammadAG, wierd	16:34
kaie	will flashing erase all contents of the internal 32gb storage?	16:34
ghostcube	not home	16:34
kaie	ok that's good	16:35
ZogG	kaie no. but you should do backup for contacts and calendar	16:35
thresh	Scelt: lol	16:35
noobmonk3y	Scelt: legal typo?	16:35
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noobmonk3y	am i blind?	16:36
kaie	ZogG, I did a backup prior to attempting the over-the-air-update, which semi-bricked it	16:36
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cehteh	kaie: do not flash emmc ..	16:36
ZogG	kaie until it's not eMMC flash	16:36
Scelt	noobmonk3y: in the middle chapter	16:36
noobmonk3y	hahaha	16:36
ZogG	kaie have you turned off all the extra repos?	16:36
kaie	ok. /me starts to read http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	16:36
noobmonk3y	ok seen it!	16:36
kaie	ZogG, I had extras-devel enabled when I attempted the update	16:37
cehteh	i turned them off still broken	16:37
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cehteh	well possibly because of other changes i did	16:38
ZogG	kaie any error?	16:38
ZogG	kaie, can you turn it on?	16:38
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cehteh	dont let the battery run empty btw .. you want some charge for flashing	16:38
kaie	ZogG, yeah, I said it above. The device no longer works. It is constantly rebooting, showing nokia text, then bringing up a grey broken dialog (might be the enter pin dialog), but after 2 seconds, before I can do anything else, it reboots again	16:39
ZogG	kaie flash it	16:39
kaie	The usb cable will provide charge	16:39
kaie	yes	16:39
ZogG	kaie, d oyou have at least half battery?	16:40
ZogG	my turtle driving me crazy	16:40
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ZogG	HIMYM FTW!!!!	16:41
kaie	my battery was full when I started the upgrade. but now, how would I know? :-)	16:41
Ikarus	hrm, there is no way to access the MyDocs partition when it's stuck in a reboot loop right ?, I can only hope that just flash root will allow me to access it ? (just spotted a few files missing in my backup)	16:41
ZogG	kaie go for it	16:41
noobmonk3y	Ikarus: it shouldn't touch the mydocs :P so should be fine	16:41
noobmonk3y	i think	16:41
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cehteh	yesterday was towel day .. today is flash your n900 day :)	16:43
* cehteh just flashed it		16:43
ham5	dont forget to bring a towel	16:43
MohammadAG	now he's pushing it http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53802	16:43
* satmd is unable to use icq/y!/aim since today		16:44
noobmonk3y	MohammadAG: have you taken up troll-hunting as a new hobby?	16:44
satmd	"extended settings" come up empty	16:44
Ikarus	satmd: yeah, some other users reported that the extra protocol handlers had some issues	16:44
satmd	do have any pointers for me?	16:45
cehteh	mhm .. how long is it supposed to stick with the oooOo dots when booting?	16:45
noobmonk3y	5 secs'ish	16:45
thresh	it stuck for me and i had to reboot	16:45
cehteh	ok was 50 secs here	16:45
noobmonk3y	lol	16:45
MohammadAG	noobmonk3y, yeah, the damn bastards tricked me, it doesn't come with a shotgun	16:45
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noobmonk3y	hahaha	16:45
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cehteh	next question: can pr1.2 mount ext3 emmc and uSD now? .. i bet not	16:46
MohammadAG	you won the bet	16:46
MohammadAG	just edit rcS-late	16:46
cehteh	yes i did .. before	16:47
cehteh	now i flashed :)	16:47
MohammadAG	just edit rcS-late again	16:48
MohammadAG	PR 1.2 music not showing up <-- was music updated?	16:48
ZogG	MohammadAG say what?	16:48
MohammadAG	nvm	16:48
ZogG	MohammadAG, sometimes happens - just restart	16:48
cehteh	bah great .. i flashed 1.1.1 .. fail :P	16:49
SpeedEvil	cehteh: lol	16:49
MohammadAG	nah, was making fun of the thread title	16:49
noobmonk3y	failboat express toot toooooot	16:49
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* MohammadAG hopes MeeGo gets released soon		16:50
MohammadAG	we can offload the trolls to the other forums :P	16:50
* cehteh gets used to flashing :)		16:51
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satmd	oh btw pr1.2 ota worked fine here	16:52
ZogG	MohammadAG tomorrow	16:52
kaie	wow, lots of choices for the firmware image. I'm in Germany, so I guess I want the "Latest Global", PR 1.2 version 10.2010.19-1	16:52
satmd	yes	16:52
ZogG	MohammadAG, you gonna stick to maemo?	16:52
cehteh	is there a tool to backup the whole device image (nand and emmc) as a flashable imagee? would be a nice backup because its fast	16:52
MohammadAG	yes	16:52
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ZogG	cehteh connect it and backup it	16:53
cehteh	kaie: yes and not 3.2010 .. :)	16:53
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fiferboy	X-Fade: ping?	16:55
X-Fade	fiferboy: here	16:55
fiferboy	X-Fade: If I put a new package in the autobuilder now, is it still available in the non-PR1.2 repos?	16:55
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X-Fade	Only once it reaches Extras, it is separated.	16:56
X-Fade	The cutoff for Extras will have to happen soon(ish)	16:56
fiferboy	X-Fade: Ok. I need to put a package upgrade in extras-devel but it won't work on non-PR1.2 devices	16:57
fiferboy	I guess my best bet is to make it work for both? Or is PR<1.2 going to be dropped soon?	16:57
X-Fade	extras-devel is considered trunk at this point ;)	16:57
X-Fade	So if you want to run apps from there, you need to run latest released.	16:58
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fiferboy	Ok. I am changing personal-gprs-mon to use the two separate data counters so it will no longer work for PR1.1	16:58
X-Fade	fiferboy: You can depend on a PR1.2 version or higher of a certain lib to make sure it doesn't run on 1.1.	16:59
kaie	ZogG, cehteh, it's back to life. question, is this PR1.2 a stable release, or did not originate from extras-devel?	17:00
fiferboy	X-Fade: But it will still show up as an update in PR1.1 extras-devel?	17:00
X-Fade	fiferboy: Yes	17:00
fiferboy	It just won't be able to be installed	17:00
thresh	ugly :(	17:00
X-Fade	Yes	17:00
X-Fade	But I didn't design AM :)	17:00
fiferboy	X-Fade: Can you take the version of personal-gprs-mon 0.6-2 out of the autobuilder?	17:00
kaie	... typo... s/not/it/	17:00
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cehteh	kaie: thats an offical nokia update extras is community based	17:01
fiferboy	X-Fade: I want to make a change in 0.6-2 so it won't screw up PR1.1 data counters	17:01
kaie	cehteh, k thanks. /me tries restore from backup	17:01
satmd	Ikarus: thanks, got it by removing those accounts, reinstalling the protocols and setting up them again	17:02
X-Fade	fiferboy: Just increase the version?	17:02
ZogG	X-Fade fiferboy that's the time for ugly own repos =)	17:02
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fiferboy	X-Fade: As long as nobody installs 0.6-2 while I am preparing 0.6-3 :)	17:02
ZogG	haha	17:02
ZogG	fiferboy i gonna install it	17:02
X-Fade	fiferboy: Hurry up then ;)	17:02
ZogG	no bugs were closed	17:03
RST38h	wow, filemanager goes portrait now	17:03
ZogG	already got 3 bugs that were marked as closed	17:03
ZogG	RST38h, ut it's ugly	17:03
RST38h	ZogG: Cyrillic keyboard still does not work	17:03
Shapeshifter	wtf. since when is pkill hildon-desktop a reason for rebooting -.-	17:03
ZogG	RST38h, where?	17:04
RST38h	ZogG: Add Russian as the second language and click Ctrl+Space on the physical keyboard	17:04
RST38h	it will report the switch but will not let you type letters	17:04
ZogG	anyway pr1.2 is making me sad, i hoped for bugfixes, and main ones i eeded to be fixed are still here	17:04
ZogG	RST38h oh, i don't use russian on hw	17:05
ptl	which ones?	17:05
lcuk	ZogG, psssst the bug trackers have been updated as bugs get fixed, which ones did you hope to be fixed	17:05
ZogG	the keymap is ugly	17:05
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X-Fade	RST38h: Did you try xterm? :)	17:05
fiferboy	X-Fade: Okay, now both 0.6-2 and 0.6-3 are in the queue together :)	17:06
RST38h	X-Fade: yes	17:06
ZogG	lcuk there are 2 that are not fixed	17:06
ZogG	lcuk, the play button on widget	17:06
ZogG	and the music plays after call	17:06
ZogG	the first can be fixed by delting recall widget	17:07
X-Fade	fiferboy: Ok, killing 0.6-2 once it reaches the repo ;)	17:07
ZogG	second one is no exuce. i had this in the middle of test	17:07
fiferboy	X-Fade: Thanks	17:07
ZogG	no i need to turn sound off when i select silent mode as well =(	17:07
ZogG	lcuk, do you have permission to re-open bugs?	17:08
lcuk	i just asked what they were, you still havent shown me	17:09
lcuk	bug 1234 format is good ;)	17:09
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1234 close-buttons on home menu are too small	17:09
ZogG	lcuk okay	17:09
E0x	look like the widget data plan	17:10
E0x	not work	17:10
E0x	in pr1.2	17:10
ZogG	bug 6907	17:10
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6907 Media Player widget suddenly starts music after Phone call ends	17:10
ZogG	bug 5894	17:11
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5894 Play track button doesn't work	17:11
X-Fade	fiferboy: killed	17:11
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fiferboy	X-Fade: Thanks. I just got the email that it built	17:11
noobmonk3y	bug 666	17:11
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=666 Problems with Javascript setTimeout function	17:11
noobmonk3y	the bug of the devil muhahahahaha	17:11
X-Fade	yeah, removed it in import queue ;)	17:11
noobmonk3y	trust Java to be in there	17:11
jaska	:D	17:11
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ZogG	lcuk ^	17:12
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kaie	I'm very pleased with the automatic restoring of application. Only the manually downloaded ussd-applet won't be included automatically, but at least it tells me what I had in addition, that's very nice	17:12
MohammadAG	<noobmonk3y> trust Java to be in there lol	17:12
MohammadAG	bug 1337	17:13
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1337 Menu item News -> garage news is broken	17:13
MohammadAG	not so leet after all	17:13
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noobmonk3y	lol MohammadAG !!	17:13
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pronto	trying to do that maemo update, but it keeps compaling about i need to connnect to a computer and launce the application...please tell me the aplication works with linux, and is there anyway around that so i dont have to use my computer?	17:14
noobmonk3y	~slap bug 1337	17:14
kaie	it's not possible to install microb-engine-common-ext, do you want to proceed with installation?	17:14
* infobot slaps bug 1337, keep your grubby fingers to yourself!		17:14
MohammadAG	~flashing	17:14
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infobot	flashing is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	17:14
kaie	I'll go for "yes", assuming "do you want to proceed" means "do you want to proceed with the other packages"	17:14
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ZogG	lcuk, ?	17:17
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pronto	so is there a way?	17:19
ZogG	pronto flash it	17:19
pronto	"restore to factory defaults" umm , no	17:19
pronto	i can't just have it update via the app manager? :\|	17:20
Scelt	pronto: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	17:20
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pronto	didnt the pr1.1 just update right on the phone itself	17:20
Scelt	Why can't any of you ops put that link to the topic? This is the 10th time today I've pasted that link already	17:20
ZogG	Scelt cause you are here =)	17:21
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Noma	is there already a bug report that you can't write a lower case letter after a dot even if you'd do it with shift?	17:21
pronto	and that NSU is windoiws only/	17:21
Scelt	ZogG: I'm not here 24/7 and it'd be nice if users would still get answer	17:21
pronto	?	17:21
Scelt	Noma: I have the same problem	17:21
ToJa92	[pronto]: You probably need to free up space in your rootfs to update, it should be about 60MB free	17:21
Scelt	pronto: check the link I pasted	17:21
ZogG	pronto linux also	17:21
Scelt	pronto: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	17:21
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Noma	Scelt: i know three people that have the same problem	17:22
ZogG	~flashing pronto	17:22
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Scelt	Noma: kewl. please check the bug tracker	17:22
ZogG	~flashing	17:22
infobot	from memory, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	17:22
Noma	i tried to search but didn't find it	17:22
ZogG	pronto, ^	17:22
Scelt	Noma: maybe you should post it then?	17:23
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ZogG	Noma have you disabled auto cap latters?	17:23
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Noma	ZogG: then it works - but it should also work if I press shift+letter after a dot	17:23
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Scelt	ZogG: I have the same problem. It's a bug	17:23
ZogG	it's not a bug - it's a feature	17:24
cehteh	great nokia ... now mounted my MyDocs as /home :)	17:24
Noma	it worked in pr1.1	17:24
Noma	and it works in symbian and android etc	17:24
pronto	talk.maemo.org is down	17:24
ZogG	oh nooo	17:24
auenf	too many posts complaining about P1.3?	17:25
auenf	+R	17:25
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ZogG	PR1.2*	17:25
auenf	s/P1.3/PR1.3/	17:25
E0x	lol	17:25
auenf	PR1.2 is out, theres nothing to complain about ;)	17:26
ZogG	auenf, cause Nokia should release it before and now release bugfixes for it	17:26
ZogG	some bugs are not closed at all and there too many new	17:26
auenf	except whats going to be fixed in PR1.3 and why it isnt already out ;)	17:26
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ZogG	i don't think bugfix release should be merged with new features release	17:26
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* auenf decides not to download the 113mb update on 3g		17:27
Stskeeps	wuss	17:27
Stskeeps	:P	17:27
ZogG	auenf, the complaining are about things from pr1.1.1 that still in pr1.2 and new uppseting bugs	17:27
Bluewind	downloading is faster than installing ;)	17:27
Bluewind	think it's running for 2h now	17:27
ZogG	i flashed so can't say anything =)	17:27
ZogG	it was several minutes	17:28
auenf	it'd cost me AU$1.70 to download it over 3g ;)	17:28
E0x	i flash fromn windows and was fast	17:28
auenf	im not in that much or a rush to install it	17:28
E0x	take more time downloading the image	17:28
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ZogG	i use linux FTW	17:28
* ZogG sys Linux 2.6.33-gentoo [965P-S3; x86_64 Desktop]		17:28
Bluewind	after flashing I'd have to reinstall all apps and that also take ages	17:28
Bluewind	old kernel...	17:29
E0x	if you do backup	17:29
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E0x	the restore will install all app	17:29
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Bluewind	doesn't change apt's slowness	17:29
Bluewind	installing one locale package takes ~10 sec	17:30
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lauri	hey guys	17:31
Smokers	okay guys,.. i want to flash over mflasher, but the flasher wont find my device,...	17:31
SpeedEvil	hey	17:31
lauri	Where can I browse Maemo builtin apps source code?	17:31
lauri	for example phone boo	17:31
lauri	*book	17:31
Smokers	drivers are installed, 64 bit problem is known and windows is startet in secure / driver mode	17:31
Smokers	but still : Suitable USB device not found, waiting.	17:32
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auenf	isnt xp mode suggested when running 64-bit windows?	17:32
ZogG	Smokers turn it off	17:33
ZogG	turn on while pressing "u" key	17:33
ZogG	oops	17:33
ZogG	connect while pressing	17:33
Smokers	option 1 is using special boot mode for windows auenf	17:33
ZogG	don't turn on	17:33
Smokers	jop ZogG is done	17:33
Smokers	but nothing happend	17:33
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ZogG	Smokers did nokia turned on and there was usb symbol in the coner?	17:35
Smokers	yes ,.. it is all like the manual says	17:35
Smokers	except that there will happen anything after that command o.O	17:35
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Smokers	in first, windows said, installtig driver faild... i de-installed all drivers for n900 in the device manager, than boot in secure driver mode, and installed them again, everything okay...	17:36
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Smokers	than again starting flasher, but nothing happend =/	17:37
ZogG	wazd privet	17:37
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Smokers	?	17:38
Arkenoi	ah. now i see update but it won't install. what applications are known to block it?	17:38
ZogG	Smokers get the ubuntu livecd and you can flash	17:39
Noma	Scelt: i posted the bug	17:39
Scelt	Noma: id?	17:39
Noma	10310	17:39
Scelt	bug 10310	17:39
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10310 can't write a lower case letter after a dot even if you'd do it with shift	17:40
Scelt	Noma: thx!	17:40
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ZogG	buggy bug	17:40
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Smokers	did i need some hdd in live ubuntu? because i only have 3 ntfs partitions	17:40
Smokers	ZogG	17:40
ZogG	nope	17:41
Scelt	Noma: actually you need to put space after dot to reproduce the bug	17:41
Smokers	okay, thanks	17:41
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Noma	Scelt: oh, okay	17:41
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Scelt	Noma: writing right after the dot it's still lowercase	17:42
ZogG	cause it thinks it's the same word	17:42
Noma	so it seems	17:42
Scelt	yeah	17:43
ZogG	i just don't use Cap letters on phone at least	17:43
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jef91	Can I upgrade to pr 1.2 from nix?	17:44
ZogG	transmission 2.00b1 released ? how had i missed?	17:44
ZogG	jef91 linux?	17:44
jef91	ZogG Yea	17:44
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Bluewind	I'm running apt-get dist-upgrade and so for no problems	17:44
ZogG	jef91 yes, you can flash	17:44
Bluewind	just takes like ages	17:44
ZogG	Bluewind clear upgrade is always better imo	17:44
Bluewind	yeah gonna do that once I have more time ;)	17:45
jef91	ZogG got the link offhand to the rom?	17:45
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ZogG	jef91 you mean the pr1.2 bin?	17:46
jef91	Yes ZogG	17:46
ZogG	jef91, i don't but i think there is one in the topic	17:46
thresh	meh ussd widget doesnt work cleanly in 1.2	17:46
ZogG	pr1.2 works faster and has qt but nothig fixed actually, ah?	17:47
jef91	ZogG sounds like Nokia	17:48
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ZogG	jef91, i hope everything would be fine	17:49
ZogG	i just angry of none of communication with us =)	17:49
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hrw	heh... just tested video skypecall	17:50
GAN900	thresh, doesn't PR1.2 have USSD support?	17:50
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GAN900	ZogG, browser actually zooms OK.	17:51
hrw	n900 -> fring/s60, n900 -> skype/win32 and in both combos video from me was not sent	17:51
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KMFDM	are the servers hosting pr 1.2 down?	17:51
KMFDM	software updater keeps failing to download the update for me	17:51
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skynxnex	KMFDM: I just successfulyl downloaded it (through t-mobile) about 30 minutes ago	17:52
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skynxnex	KMFDM: but it took two attempts; luckily it resumed	17:52
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ZogG	GAN900 it was fine also before for me 9 i don't know any zoom problems) but there still several bugs that were marked as closed but they are not	17:53
KMFDM	i have something (or multiple) apps installed blocking update over air	17:53
KMFDM	so i have to do it through software updater	17:54
KMFDM	only it's download screwed up	17:54
KMFDM	presuably server went offline	17:54
ZogG	GAN900, bug 6907 and 5894 for example	17:54
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6907 Media Player widget suddenly starts music after Phone call ends	17:54
skynxnex	KMFDM: it still does it through the software updater.	17:54
KMFDM	but now it fails to resume it	17:54
KMFDM	can't restart it at all	17:54
KMFDM	i see it has 36.3megs dled	17:54
ZogG	btw gps takes hours to get any data from sats	17:54
KMFDM	and then it throws the error	17:54
marmoute	grmlm I don't have enought freespace to dist-upgrade. wtf	17:54
KMFDM	been trying for 3 hours	17:54
jef91	"OS 2009 version 1.2009.42-11" thats pr 1.2 right?	17:54
Bluewind	no	17:54
ZogG	jef91 no	17:54
ZogG	jef91, 2010	17:55
Bluewind	1.2 ist 2010.x	17:55
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jef91	oh shoot I found it	17:55
jef91	was lower down on the list	17:55
jaska	i wonder what uses swi-prolog in maemo :D	17:56
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jaska	ohm i suppose	17:56
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ZogG	jef91 use only pr1.2 not eMMC	17:57
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jef91	yep yep, thanks ZogG	17:58
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cehteh	jaska: device management :)	18:01
Tuukka	Does the receiving end need a webcam to get skype video call working?	18:02
cehteh	no	18:02
cehteh	well dunno for skype, but in sip it can be one-way and i expect that for skype too	18:02
Corsac	hmhm, fMMS isn't integrated to contacts :(	18:02
GAN900	hrw, I think you need the lastest win32 client.	18:02
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GAN900	ZogG, you didn't notice the horrifying text rendering issues with zooming?	18:03
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hrw	I checked list of my bugs in bugs.maemo.org... option "mass update all selected bugs" would be nice	18:04
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jacekowski	hannesw_: blow job would be nice as well	18:06
E0x	installing the extra decoders support, is taking to much time , almost 5 minutes already and not finish yet	18:06
E0x	oh , it finish now	18:06
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skynxnex	wow, text zooming is a lot better in microb now.	18:08
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kaie	reflashed n900 and restored back and all applications. 1 gb of downloads, installing and power cycle later... trying to use n900 again... microb no longer works. window starts up, then quits	18:10
kaie	trying terminal, "microb", runs for 10 seconds, then quits, no window coming up	18:11
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kaie	fennec works	18:12
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tgalal	can't restore the FREAKIN CONVERSATIONS :@ !!!!	18:12
pinheiro	heeerrrr phonnne prt of the n900 gone after flashig to 1.2	18:12
FredrIQ	PR1.2 :D	18:12
Stskeeps	pinheiro: did you use the leaked pr 1.2 before? :P	18:12
* FredrIQ is updating atm		18:13
pinheiro	Stskeeps: nope	18:13
Stskeeps	pinheiro: do a full reflash i guess, emmc and all	18:13
pinheiro	tried to update via the regular way but it tollme to flash it instead	18:14
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pinheiro	Stskeeps: how does one do that ?	18:14
Stskeeps	~flashing	18:14
infobot	rumour has it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	18:14
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pinheiro	"./flasher-3.5 -F *.bin -f -R"	18:16
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chadi	*.bin ?	18:17
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GAN900	DocScrutinizer / SpeedEvil, finally emailed Quim.	18:17
lardman	re	18:17
chadi	what if more than one image were present?	18:17
GAN900	Yo, lardman.	18:17
GAN900	lardman, re-pong?	18:18
pinheiro	just have 1 :D	18:18
lardman	hey GAN900	18:18
lardman	GAN900: fire away, I've been out most of the day	18:18
joga	err...is there deborphan for n900?	18:18
Stskeeps	GAN900: what'd you complain about this time? :P	18:18
lardman	ah, I was wondering about location information	18:18
joga	I've uninstalled heaps and only got a few megs back ;)	18:18
xorAxAx	hmm, PR 1.2 doesnt want to install itself over HAM, what could be the reason?	18:18
* lardman feels better after filing a couple of bugs		18:19
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lardman	mardi: hey	18:20
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lardman	or is it the wrong mardi/y?	18:21
pinheiro	RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.42-11_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin the one i should be using right?	18:21
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Stskeeps	pinheiro: grab a newer one	18:22
Stskeeps	there should be a 2010 one	18:22
pinheiro	Stskeeps: were ?	18:22
Stskeeps	on tablets-dev.nokia.com ? :P	18:22
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cehteh	pinheiro: no	18:24
cehteh	there are 2 2010 ones dont be fooled :P	18:24
pinheiro	iiiiiiiiii seeeeeeeee	18:25
pinheiro	:)	18:25
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ZogG	cehteh there are more	18:25
* cehteh flashed the wrong one earlier too		18:25
ZogG	depend on country	18:25
cehteh	10.2010...	18:25
ZogG	cehteh where did you get 2?	18:25
pinheiro	cehteh: confusing website	18:25
joga	great, I uninstalled firefox and lost half a meg of space :)	18:25
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cehteh	ZogG: i just used the last one in the ls here sorted	18:26
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joga	is this package thing fixed in 1.2?	18:26
cehteh	but 3.2010 is higher than 10.2010 ... duh :)	18:26
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cehteh	wow 100M free on root now :P	18:27
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SpeedEvil	GAN900: err - re what - I forget?	18:27
slonopotamus	-.-	18:27
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joga	I've uninstalled tens of megs and gained only a couple back, a bit frustrating	18:28
joga	I guess it leaves all the dependencies	18:28
C-S-B-N900	arrgh, cant wait to get home and upgrade...	18:28
ZogG	PR 1.2 version 10.2010.19-1Latest Maemo 5	18:28
GAN900	SpeedEvil, device queue and broken loaners.	18:28
C-S-B-N900	no probelms with it?	18:28
slonopotamus	cehteh: not enough for porn	18:28
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SpeedEvil	GAN900: Ah - right.	18:29
SpeedEvil	GAN900: I should have done that myself.	18:29
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C-S-B-N900	cant do ota, seems not to work, no doubt due to 4pmb rootfs	18:29
hrw	bug 10312	18:29
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10312 Video calls with Skype does not work	18:29
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cehteh	lol	18:30
hrw	during week it will be wontfix or ignored	18:30
joga	how can I free the space taken by the packages I've installed and then uninstalled?	18:30
C-S-B-N900	skype video isnt working?	18:30
cehteh	fail	18:30
kaie	ok, browser-switchboard was responsible for the failing microb startup. although it said microb is the default, I confirmed that setting, switched from "faster startup" to "lower mem usage", now microb starts up fine	18:30
joga	I mean, isn't this something the package manager ought to be doing automatically	18:30
slonopotamus	joga: apt-get dependency cleaning is just broken. it leaves stuff around under certain circumstances	18:30
cehteh	well i suspect a user error	18:30
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joga	slonopotamus: so aptitude then?	18:30
joga	probably not now but anyway :)	18:30
cehteh	nokia should have enough time to test video calls	18:30
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* ShadowJK wonders if skype video is even "supposed" to be working		18:31
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C-S-B-N900	so use flasher to install, restore backup and i should be where i started?	18:31
ShadowJK	or if it's just gtalk video that's supposed to work	18:31
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StyleWarz	morning	18:31
StyleWarz	anyone got a repository where i could find a cfdisk package for my n800?	18:31
pinheiro	RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM this one right?	18:31
cehteh	yes	18:31
pinheiro	falashing now	18:31
pinheiro	flashing	18:32
slonopotamus	joga: dunno if it properly works. either reflash or read through dpkg -l output, find stuff you don't need, try to remove it, if it doesn't pull away fremantle stuff, remove :)	18:32
slonopotamus	StyleWarz: it's in sdk repo afair	18:32
Arkenoi	it damn sucks that OTA updates are that tricky	18:32
C-S-B-N900	why do these things comeout when i cant install them :(	18:32
StyleWarz	slonopotamus: hm you got an url? ;)	18:32
slonopotamus	Arkenoi: it's nokia :)	18:33
Arkenoi	previous one required enormous free space on root fs	18:33
Arkenoi	and this one just does not work and i do not know what is blocking	18:33
pinheiro	think the phone in snot working	18:33
Arkenoi	because there is no sane diagnostics	18:33
pinheiro	didnt propmt me for the pin code	18:33
slonopotamus	Arkenoi: hi, btw. no, sflphone isn't there. X-Fade doesn't fix autocleaner	18:33
slonopotamus	StyleWarz: repository.maemo.org, somewhere on that page	18:33
pinheiro	and takes for ever to boot	18:34
Arkenoi	is there a faq on most common applications that may block ota update?	18:34
pinheiro	haaaaa	18:34
StyleWarz	slonopotamus: it isn't extras-devel searching	18:34
pinheiro	pin code	18:34
joga	slonopotamus: to me it sounds like a big mistake to have left it that way...the average joe will install apps and basically needs to reflash their phone to get the space back	18:34
pinheiro	:)	18:34
C-S-B-N900	right, im off. need to keep battery for flash later.	18:34
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X-Fade	slonopotamus: Just committed a fix for it (hope it works)	18:35
Arkenoi	how much free space is required, after all?	18:35
slonopotamus	(did i say extras-devel?)	18:35
joga	now I just ran apt-get autoremove because it suggested that at some point, it claimed to free 8MB of space, but I got nothing back	18:35
SpeedEvil	joga: UBIFS lies.	18:35
joga	or maybe they were optified	18:35
SpeedEvil	You need to sync	18:35
joga	just with plain sync?	18:36
SpeedEvil	after removing files, or it won't immediately recover them	18:36
SpeedEvil	yes	18:36
joga	(did that)	18:36
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SpeedEvil	ah - ok	18:36
jef91	grr flashing pr 1.2 reset my theme :-/	18:36
slonopotamus	X-Fade: one-more-fix-that'll-fix-it-for-sure? :) how the hell it decided to remove?	18:36
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jef91	and all my widgets	18:36
jef91	gah	18:36
ZogG	jef91 do the restore thing	18:36
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StyleWarz	slonopotamus: i didn't find anything	18:36
ZogG	jef91 and than you get everything back	18:36
jef91	really? it reset applications as well?	18:37
jef91	wtf	18:37
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slonopotamus	StyleWarz: did you search anything?	18:38
Arkenoi	it damn sucks if i need to reflash from pc. any hints how to avoid that?	18:38
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jef91	will it need to re-download my installed applications?	18:38
StyleWarz	slonopotamus: i went through the repositories packages-files	18:38
slonopotamus	StyleWarz: i gave you an url. i gave you a keyword. what else do you need?	18:38
StyleWarz	slonopotamus: at least anything that sounded like sdk for diablo	18:38
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StyleWarz	oh didn't see that	18:38
slonopotamus	StyleWarz: http://repository.maemo.org/#sdk_repositories	18:38
ZogG	jef91 yes	18:38
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ZogG	jef91, restore from backup	18:39
slonopotamus	StyleWarz: i strongly suggest disabling it back after you install cfdisk (other nasty stuff can sneak in accidentally)	18:39
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StyleWarz	slonopotamus: what nasty stuff might happen with cfdisk?	18:40
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StyleWarz	i've never had troubles in all those years ;)	18:40
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slonopotamus	(having different versions on device/in sdk is the most insane thing you could do with sdk)	18:40
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StyleWarz	slonopotamus: ok it ain't there. ;)	18:42
cehteh	did the frontcam quality improve with 1.2?	18:42
Lazy^	Hello how i can make skype-video calls on n900 ?	18:44
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brik	by starting a skype call and clicking the video button	18:44
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Lazy^	brik: where should that video button be ?	18:45
cehteh	in coversations	18:45
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StyleWarz	so there is no partitioning tool other than sfdisk left on the n800?	18:45
cehteh	contacts	18:45
davhotel	Lazy^: Are you calling a mac? I have trouble with that	18:45
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brik	Lazy^: when you've started the call it gives you an option to show your camera	18:46
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Arkenoi	is there less dangerous way than dist-upgrade and at the same time more verbose than app manager?	18:46
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StyleWarz	slonopotamus_: the package isn't there	18:46
Lazy^	brik: i choose contact from contact list, start skypecall. There isnt any option for videocall	18:46
X-Fade	Arkenoi: Flashing?	18:46
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Arkenoi	x-fade: OTA :-)	18:46
Lazy^	brik: should i enable it first =	18:46
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X-Fade	Arkenoi: Use AM only then.	18:47
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Lazy^	davhotel: i'm calling to n900 -> mac	18:47
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X-Fade	Arkenoi: Make sure you have > 48MB free on roo	18:47
davhotel	Lazy^: probably wont work	18:47
roquetto	who does the qt4 packaging for maemo?	18:47
Arkenoi	x-fade: it does not work, saying i should flash from pc and i do not even know what does it want -- free root space? removal of some blocking app?	18:47
Lazy^	davhotel: do you know the reason ?	18:47
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X-Fade	Arkenoi: And remove brainparty/tuxracer if installed.	18:48
davhotel	Lazy^: I don't think the mac client is currently supporting the codec or res, or doesnt see the video flag	18:48
Arkenoi	ah. i have 45, it is probably too low. should remove something big	18:48
X-Fade	Arkenoi: disable extras*	18:48
anonuk	MohammadAG: still there?	18:49
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Arkenoi	x-fade, already done	18:49
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Lazy^	davhotel: yes i see no support for h264	18:50
Bluewind	hm funny that dots during boot are way too fast	18:50
X-Fade	Arkenoi: Reboot can sometimes help as GC runs on boot.	18:50
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Arkenoi	x-fade: tried that, still not enough	18:50
plastun	wtf? using apt-get or App manager on N900 my app is not copying files to python2.5/site-packages directory. Using dpkg -i deb-file everything is OK	18:51
davhotel	Lazy^: skype video was too good to be true :)	18:51
X-Fade	apt-get clean, remove libqt4-maemo5*	18:51
FredrIQ	..	18:51
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X-Fade	libqt4-maemo5-* even.	18:51
Lazy^	davhotel: seems so :/	18:51
f66f	i last jear my gandpa died now i have a Aquarium ... and dunno what to do with it ....	18:51
FredrIQ	i got a prompt about modified file since installation when runned an upgrade	18:51
FredrIQ	i wanted to check what were different with D	18:52
FredrIQ	"diff: not found"	18:52
FredrIQ	very helpful indeed	18:52
slonopotamus	FredrIQ: they call it "user-frendly"	18:53
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FredrIQ	indeed	18:53
FredrIQ	will it be fine ignoring with Y and continue upgrade?	18:53
FredrIQ	the file in question:	18:54
FredrIQ	Configuration file `/etc/powervr.ini'	18:54
FredrIQ	what is that file anyway	18:54
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slonopotamus	FredrIQ: i think yes	18:54
FredrIQ	ok	18:54
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* satmd found out where the setting for enabling video calls is hidden		18:55
satmd	within contacts	18:55
plastun	can anybody help me with testing my app? just install it, please	18:55
FredrIQ	lol	18:55
FredrIQ	nice place	18:55
FredrIQ	...and it's not enabled by default?	18:55
Bluewind	here it is	18:56
FredrIQ	ah	18:56
FredrIQ	not installed 1.2 yet	18:56
FredrIQ	and not using videocalls	18:56
Aranel	"Move apt cache outside of rootfs"	18:56
Aranel	Is this a good way to update? I only have 24 megabytes of rootfs space :/	18:56
joga	I've deleted every big program besiedes vim and mplayer and have only gotten like 10MB back	18:57
joga	if even that	18:57
FredrIQ	joga: devel enabled?	18:57
joga	FredrIQ: nope, but testing is	18:57
redeeman	i have 56MB and it won't update	18:57
cehteh	Aranel: make backup, reflash, restore .. i had to do that anyways since installing it ota borked the device	18:57
FredrIQ	turn it off, refresh the lists	18:57
Bluewind	I moved like 50 things from /usr to /opt and used apt-get dist-upgrade	18:57
Bluewind	worked though	18:57
davhotel	live oil spill rover cam feed works in media player	18:58
joga	FredrIQ: you mean the repos?	18:58
FredrIQ	and you will end up with some space	18:58
Bluewind	and took 3-4h I think	18:58
FredrIQ	:)	18:58
slonopotamus	ouch	18:58
FredrIQ	yeah, the big ones	18:58
joga	the problem here isn't that I don't get 'some' space, rather it's that I should get A LOT more space than that	18:58
slonopotamus	/home/user/.local is 10 megs	18:58
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chadi	can I lower the vibration level?	18:58
tripzero	are the rumors true? 1.2 is alive?	18:58
Aranel	cehteh: I've upgraded from PR1.0 to PR1.1 and PR1.1.1 later. It always worked, making backup and restoring is not a %100 guaranteed way to restore every data.	18:58
FredrIQ	tripzero: updating atm. :)	18:58
cehteh	chadi: /etc/mce/mce.ini	18:58
tripzero	w00t	18:58
cehteh	be careful :)	18:59
slonopotamus	/home/user/.local/share/sounds, to be more exact	18:59
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chadi	cehteh: oh so it can be done? that's great; I'm asuming under the LED patterns?	18:59
joga	I've probably removed about 100M worth but I guess they're still there, somewhere	18:59
joga	rebooting didn't have an effect earlier at least	18:59
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FredrIQ	joga: if the packages is optified, they don't fill up root space	19:00
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Corsac	is it just me or one can't search anymore in HAM?	19:00
joga	FredrIQ: so what does then? are libraries optified, in general?	19:00
Corsac	while it was possible before	19:00
cehteh	Aranel: the 1.1 things worked for me too, but considering for how many people (admitly the ones who fiddled with the device) its broken	19:00
greenfly	is there a consensus on how much free space you need on / for an OTR update?	19:00
Aranel	is it possible to get a list of non-optified packages?	19:00
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X-Fade	Corsac: It is you.	19:00
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X-Fade	Corsac: Just start typing.	19:01
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* slonopotamus wonders why he has qt installed		19:01
joga	Aranel: I thought about it, I guess it is since you can get a listing of package contents with dpkg -L and so on, but there should be an easier way	19:01
slonopotamus	arachnist: no	19:01
slonopotamus	err, missed	19:01
slonopotamus	Aranel: no	19:01
FredrIQ	w00t	19:01
FredrIQ	i think the update is done	19:01
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teilzeitstudent	I installed 1.2 manually using the flasher, including a new emmc. Now I seem to have filesystem problems; it keeps telling me that a directory called "music" exists, but it is not there. Also, 246mb are already used (probably by default?). Are there any tools to check filesystem integrity?	19:01
FredrIQ	hmm	19:02
FredrIQ	interesting that some of the features actually works without reboot	19:02
tripzero	fsck it	19:02
tripzero	FredrIQ, not surprized	19:02
tripzero	that's linux ;)	19:02
teilzeitstudent	tripzero, which means I have to unmount it?	19:02
teilzeitstudent	The MyDocs~	19:02
FredrIQ	yeah	19:02
FredrIQ	:p	19:02
tripzero	teilzeitstudent, yep, umount it and fsck it	19:03
Aranel	joga: doesnt seem hard to do, maybe someone with basic Python knowledge can do that and save the day :)	19:03
FredrIQ	but as 50 percent, including Sym doesn't work.. brb reboot	19:03
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GAN900	SpeedEvil, meh, supposedly that's what I'm here for. ;)	19:03
Arkenoi	49972 free, still does not let me update :-/ that sucks!	19:03
joga	Aranel: yeah, shouldn't be all that hard	19:03
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Aranel	joga: dpkg -L is misleading :/ Tried it on amsn package, it showed LOTS of files on rootfs, removed it and yay, 0.9 freed :(	19:04
joga	Aranel: yeah but are they big files ;)	19:04
joga	for some reason I think deborphan is needed	19:04
Aranel	joga: It does not print sizes to screen :/	19:04
joga	Aranel: the app manager can sort by size	19:05
joga	but doesn't tell if it's opt :)	19:05
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Aranel	joga: app manager says its 24 Megabytes, and dpkg -L shows them all as non-optified.	19:05
joga	(I suppose optification can be seen from the package itself?)	19:06
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slonopotamus	fmradioplayer is 2.6mb o_O	19:06
Aranel	oops, it seems terminal history was not enough for entire output. Now I'm not sure :/	19:07
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joga	Aranel: I think the app manager has some rough estimate of the size...maybe including libs	19:07
joga	so it just deletes the prog and leaves all the deps hanging there	19:08
joga	but I dunno	19:08
greenfly	Arkenoi: remove any applications that might use opengl	19:08
root____	guys what is the situation with the whole meego/maemo nonsense, i was preparing to get the n900 and sold off my old phone but i just found out that meego is not going to come out on the n900 which means not many people will be using maemo anymore and not enough market for potential developers to sell apps for. Is that reasonable concern?	19:09
Arkenoi	greenfly, ah, again. ok	19:09
greenfly	Arkenoi: yeah, I freed up to like 60Mb by using all the tricks and still nothing. removed things like duke nukem and then it worked shrug	19:09
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Arkenoi	ok, byebye descent	19:10
Arkenoi	and fuck stupid idiot who thing that detailed diagnostics is confusing and user should not see it or ever understand what happens	19:11
Arkenoi	s/thing/think/	19:11
infobot	Arkenoi meant: and fuck stupid idiot who think that detailed diagnostics is confusing and user should not see it or ever understand what happens	19:11
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timeless_mbp	t0or: maemo isn't going to die tomorrow	19:12
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FredrIQ	hm	19:12
timeless_mbp	and there should be additional service releases	19:12
tripzero	what's a good way to find my wifi mac addy? ifconfig doesnt exist in the busybox :\|	19:12
timeless_mbp	Nokia is trying to encourage people to develop applications using Qt	19:12
timeless_mbp	Qt should work on both Maemo5 and MeeGo	19:12
aSIMULAtor	i have a question..someone i know who has a device from the maemo summit wants to know what he shoudl flash his device with	19:13
timeless_mbp	so, if an app dev tries to write for the future and picks Qt, they should be able to provide a Maemo binary too	19:13
FredrIQ	and symbian^3 and onwards	19:13
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t0or	timeless_mbp: yes i agree infact i doubt that it'll die at all but the more important point was because the client base for devs.	19:13
FredrIQ	shouldn't texting in the menu start a search?	19:13
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: same thing as anyone else	19:13
aSIMULAtor	supposidly there's like 5 different types	19:13
aSIMULAtor	uk, global, blah balh albah	19:13
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: ignore uk	19:13
Arkenoi	did not help. fuck!	19:13
aSIMULAtor	global?	19:13
timeless_mbp	yeah, i'd pick global	19:13
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t0or	FredrIQ, timeless_mbp: i see	19:14
aSIMULAtor	this is interesting though everyone i know who has an n900 is having friggin trouble with pr1.2	19:14
Corsac	works for me	19:14
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: i'm not :)	19:14
aSIMULAtor	i didnt' have problems either	19:14
marmoute	timeless_mbp: you have it for month :-)	19:14
timeless_mbp	i mean, minus a bug which two people found in the browser earlier this week...	19:14
aSIMULAtor	i was able to update over hte air	19:14
timeless_mbp	marmoute: yeah well	19:14
timeless_mbp	i mean, it isn't perfect, but… actually	19:15
timeless_mbp	i have 2 devices	19:15
* timeless_mbp ponders		19:15
SpeedEvil	AstralStorm: Worked first time flawlessly for me	19:15
timeless_mbp	no, iirc they're both running pr1.2 official	19:15
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timeless_mbp	one was running a pre for a bit, but i think it got updated last week	19:15
SpeedEvil	Also - yay - back is now back.	19:15
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* timeless_mbp installs some random app		19:15
SpeedEvil	np: Sir Mix-A-Lot - Baby Got Back.	19:15
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Corsac	hmmh, is there a status.net (ex identi.ca) app?	19:16
Arkenoi	sucks. other suggestions?	19:17
* Arkenoi 'd torture the asshole who made such shamanic practices required the way he deserves if i could get my hands on him		19:18
tripzero	i can has wifi mac addy?	19:18
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Trizt	how much free do you need on the / to be able to update? I have now 42.1 and it don't seem to be enough	19:20
oilgame_	http://pastebin.org/283577 Have I done something or should rootfs really be just 227.5MB?	19:21
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oilgame_	I cant even update to PR1.2, because it requires over 100MB free space.	19:22
SpeedEvil	oilgame: No, it dordn't	19:22
johnsu01	do I actually need to reflash in order to update to 1.2?	19:22
SpeedEvil	oilgame: I had about 55.	19:22
timeless_mbp	johnsu01: 'no'	19:22
FredrIQ	hmm	19:22
johnsu01	(as the updater is telling me I have to use the nokia pc application)	19:22
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timeless_mbp	johnsu01: you probably have a conflict… do you have rootsh installed?	19:23
Bluewind	anyone else has issues with the chat history not showing up?	19:23
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timeless_mbp	actually	19:23
johnsu01	timeless_mbp: yes	19:23
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* timeless_mbp wonders if the hildon-application-manager log feature is useful		19:23
Arkenoi	fuck! it was kernel-module-joydev!	19:23
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oilgame_	SpeedEvi: When I try to update it only says that I dont have enaught free space..	19:23
timeless_mbp	before you run to the console, try tapping application manager's title area and selecting 'log'	19:23
timeless_mbp	you should be able to tap 'save as'	19:24
timeless_mbp	(this assumes your current session has a failed install attempt)	19:24
timeless_mbp	save the log, and stick it somewhere	19:24
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timeless_mbp	if we're lucky, the log explains why ham refused to update your system :)	19:24
a-saint	hello guys am unable to download the new N900 maemo update "Not enough memory in target location"	19:24
timeless_mbp	does someone have a nice faq url for a-saint? (there is one)	19:24
MiXu-	a-saint, oilgame_: http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space	19:25
Arkenoi	should i change any repository information after update to get correct 1.2 versions of packages?	19:25
a-saint	MiXu- thanks a lot	19:25
MiXu-	Arkenoi: not necessary	19:25
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timeless_mbp	Arkenoi: ideally everything should magically DoTheRightThing ™ :)	19:25
oilgame_	MiXu-: ty	19:26
MohammadAG_	but hey, BadThingsHappen™	19:26
MohammadAG_	:P	19:26
MiXu-	np	19:27
Bluewind	where's the chat history saved in pr 1.2?	19:27
blizzow	anyone got an idea how long the update should take?	19:27
Bluewind	blizzow: took 3h or something like that here	19:27
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Bluewind	though that was OTA	19:27
timeless_mbp	Bluewind: same place it is before? it's in a sqlite db	19:27
blizzow	three hours??!	19:28
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Bluewind	timeless_mbp: where?	19:28
MiXu-	Took me about 30 minutes iirc	19:28
timeless_mbp	Bluewind: there's a wiki page which covers this stuff :)	19:28
PhonicUK	hey all, is there a way to view alt text in the browser?	19:28
blizzow	Was that in the download or the actual upgrade?	19:28
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: in 1.2 view-source:<url>	19:28
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johnsu01	timeless_mbp: only error seems to be a gpg error from the mozilla repa	19:28
johnsu01	repo	19:28
tgalal	how do I launch the Conversations app from terminal ??? It's not reading the restored db file and I need to debug it	19:28
PhonicUK	lol	19:28
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: or turn off downloading images	19:28
timeless_mbp	(in adjust view)	19:29
timeless_mbp	johnsu01: darn	19:29
timeless_mbp	time to use XTerminal :)	19:29
Bluewind	timeless_mbp: it's not that I wouldn't google before asking	19:29
Corsac	grmnl, tmo search only gives the thread, not the post or the page	19:30
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timeless_mbp	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=45221 the last comment on the first page lists the relevant directory (.rtcom-eventlogger)	19:30
PhonicUK	thats annoying	19:30
PhonicUK	ah well	19:30
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: why?	19:30
timeless_mbp	what do you need them for?	19:30
Bluewind	timeless_mbp: thx	19:31
PhonicUK	xkcd	19:31
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timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: xkcd is broken	19:31
timeless_mbp	tell them to fix their site	19:31
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PhonicUK	? seems fine to me	19:31
timeless_mbp	alt is ALTERNATE text	19:31
timeless_mbp	it is not "magic secret text"	19:31
timeless_mbp	it's supposed to be equivalent to the picture	19:31
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PhonicUK	hes actually using the title tag	19:32
timeless_mbp	oh	19:32
timeless_mbp	that's not the same as ALT	19:32
timeless_mbp	if you mean TITLE, say TITLE	19:32
* timeless_mbp hates users		19:32
PhonicUK	which is legit	19:32
timeless_mbp	if you're a user, please say "i want to see something when I hover over the picture"	19:32
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PhonicUK	lol	19:32
timeless_mbp	you want to use Mouse Mode	19:32
timeless_mbp	or Interactive Mode, however you want to call it	19:32
PhonicUK	im a dev :p	19:32
timeless_mbp	which was supported in the original sales release	19:32
timeless_mbp	you're a bad dev, please go back to pretending to be a user.	19:33
PhonicUK	lol	19:33
timeless_mbp	… and is documented all over, including in the maemo.nokia.com page	19:33
PhonicUK	i didnt realise he was using label instead of alt until i looked at the code	19:33
timeless_mbp	http://www.youtube.com/user/Maemo5UITeam	19:33
timeless_mbp	you should watch their videos	19:33
timeless_mbp	see, view-source: saved the day!	19:33
timeless_mbp	a pr1.2 feature :)	19:33
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timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: where's the browser howto? i can't find it in that youtube page	19:34
* RST38h wonders how to make portrait mode stick in some applications		19:34
PhonicUK	i dislike that the bookmarks and history buttons swapped places	19:34
* timeless_mbp shrugs		19:34
PhonicUK	and the new OSK	19:34
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timeless_mbp	the new osk is /mostly/ better than the old one	19:35
SpeedEvil	I hate the new osk	19:35
timeless_mbp	sadly they regressed some 1.1 features :(	19:35
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SpeedEvil	In what ways is it better?	19:35
PhonicUK	the text keeps changing size as i type :/	19:35
timeless_mbp	including a community negotiated feature :(	19:35
PhonicUK	really annoying	19:35
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timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: eh?	19:35
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PhonicUK	use the OSK to type a long message.	19:35
defragger	why is the rootfs that small?	19:36
SpeedEvil	defragger: Because the / device is 256M	19:36
PhonicUK	after the 1st line, it changes size every time you type a char	19:36
w00t_	timeless_mbp: do you know how to use OSK to type a \| character since 1.2 btw? I can't figure that out for the life of me..	19:36
PhonicUK	pause typing and it changes again	19:36
defragger	ah ok i see	19:36
defragger	thx	19:36
w00t_	ah	19:36
w00t_	and i just found out how..	19:36
w00t_	(a bit nonobvious that symbols change when you hit shift)	19:37
PhonicUK	found it too	19:37
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PhonicUK	thats annoying too	19:37
pillar	hey where is the skype video calling available at?	19:37
timeless_mbp	w00t_: installing hebrew breaks the hardware keyboard, so i press fn-EUR and get \|	19:37
SpeedEvil	In some ways I hate all the little 'obvious' ways of doing stuff.	19:37
timeless_mbp	:)	19:37
PhonicUK	pillar, contacts list	19:37
pillar	I just installed PR1.2 and wanted to try it	19:37
timeless_mbp	pillar: normal contacts	19:37
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timeless_mbp	it depends on whether skype "thinks" the other party is video enabled	19:37
SpeedEvil	I would love in many cases a popup the first time I use a feature explainind stuff.	19:37
PhonicUK	you have to be logged into skype for the option to show	19:38
SpeedEvil	For exampl - click application manager - 'Hey - do you know you can rearrange these icons by...'	19:38
timeless_mbp	SpeedEvil: way too logical	19:38
PhonicUK	i made that mistake	19:38
timeless_mbp	SpeedEvil: you mean the app launcher not application manager :)	19:38
SpeedEvil	Rather than randomly spastically clicking on bits of decoration.	19:38
SpeedEvil	timeless: indeed.	19:38
pillar	ok, skype is showing that my friends status is offline so that's maybe why	19:38
timeless_mbp	SpeedEvil: we've asked for that repeatedly	19:39
Aranel	files located @ /home/user/.something counts as rootfs or optified?	19:39
timeless_mbp	pillar: yeah, you can't make video calls to people who aren't online :)	19:39
cehteh	pillar: yes no video chat selection for offline people	19:39
SpeedEvil	Aranel: /home/ is a different filesystem	19:39
pillar	they are online for sure though, I just talked normal skype call	19:39
SpeedEvil	Aranel: As is MyDocs	19:39
timeless_mbp	pillar: are they invisible or something?	19:39
pillar	it's just that the status hasn't updated	19:39
Aranel	SpeedEvil: so everything stored under /home/ is not gonna help me for freeing up rootfs space, isnt it?	19:39
MaikB	Hi folks. Am I imagining it, or is 1.2 quite a bit snappier?	19:40
SpeedEvil	Aranel: Not at all.	19:40
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rSDf2IkmLs	19:40
Aranel	SpeedEvil: thanks =)	19:40
SpeedEvil	MaikB: In some ways.	19:40
SpeedEvil	MaikB: I still get occasional music stalls when compiling a kernel.	19:40
timeless_mbp	< Nokia N900: How to use Mouse Mode >	19:40
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MaikB	SpeedEvil, you compile kernels on device?	19:41
joga	does anyone know what the sizes reported by app manager are actually?	19:41
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MaikB	awesome lol	19:41
SpeedEvil	MaikB: I'm just trying it.	19:41
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SpeedEvil	MaikB: It's at net/packet after a couple of hours	19:41
PhonicUK	i know about mouse mode :p	19:42
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Aranel	any good apps for graphical disk usage? DiskUsage shows lots of /home/ folders, even If I ask for rootfs space :/	19:42
PhonicUK	wtf, they moved backspace to the BOTTOM of the OSK?!?!	19:42
PhonicUK	retards!	19:42
Bluewind	ok ~/.rtcom-eventlogger/el.db ist still here and ok, but the gui doesn't show the logs	19:43
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joga	PhonicUK: maybe you can use ukeyboard to make it better? I haven't tried it though	19:43
ShadowJK	Just let some schoolchildren play scrabble, then take the OSK layout from the result	19:43
PhonicUK	Aranel, storage usage is good	19:43
Bluewind	permissions also seem ok	19:43
PhonicUK	it shows by filesystem instead of by tree	19:43
MaikB	SpeedEvil, I didn't build my own kernel since my gentoo days :)	19:43
PhonicUK	conky is a must have too	19:43
timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: yeah well, the people who designed the new OSK aren't the brightest	19:44
Aranel	PhonicUK: thanks, trying it now =)	19:44
PhonicUK	no kidding	19:44
timeless_mbp	in general, their changes weren't so bad	19:44
aSIMULAtor	hrm	19:44
timeless_mbp	but yeah, the backspace should have been top right	19:44
Bluewind	ah http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53762	19:44
timeless_mbp	that's unfortunate	19:44
aSIMULAtor	yeah and how are you going to put it at hte top right	19:44
aSIMULAtor	if it's a friggin dialog now	19:44
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: ?	19:44
PhonicUK	theres more stuff i hate in 1.2 than i like	19:44
aSIMULAtor	i'm talking about the backspace	19:45
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aSIMULAtor	add another row?	19:45
a-saint	MiXu- isn't there a way to increase the root space	19:45
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: the OSK has 4 rows	19:45
lardman	~lart Ubuntu updates for breaking things	19:45
* infobot cuts off Ubuntu updates's head with a halberd that could have been a little bit sharper for breaking things		19:45
timeless_mbp	take the backspace key from row 4 and move it to row 1, move rows 1..3 to 2..4	19:45
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timeless_mbp	i.e. "top right of the OSK"	19:45
PhonicUK	the osk should have stayed full screen	19:46
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timeless_mbp	PhonicUK: the full screen keyboard was moderately painful	19:46
timeless_mbp	and problematic	19:46
xorAxAx	what could be the reason for this apt problem? http://paste.pocoo.org/show/218573/	19:46
PhonicUK	better than this imo	19:46
xorAxAx	anybody seen that?	19:46
pillar	it's annoying that the Call with skype to the cell number is visible right away, but the actual skype call one has to scroll for..	19:46
aSIMULAtor	from what i remember, the reason why the backspace key was added to hte lowest row is cause it's right next to your thumb	19:47
PhonicUK	using it now on the bus	19:47
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: interesting	19:47
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aSIMULAtor	enter, backspace, blah blah	19:47
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: it would be nice if people published their explanations	19:47
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PhonicUK	but my thumbs are in the middle, not at the bottom	19:47
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: personally, having just been a user experience guinea pig for a future OSK	19:47
aSIMULAtor	are your thumbs retarded	19:47
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: it's easier for me to hit the top right of the OSK than the bottom right	19:48
timeless_mbp	because it's a radial sweep away from the bottom right corner of the device	19:48
aSIMULAtor	i would have prefered it not to be a dialog	19:48
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aSIMULAtor	but yeah as you said, problems with it being full screen	19:48
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timeless_mbp	xorAxAx: why do you think that apt-cache output indicates a problem?	19:49
aSIMULAtor	though also, i think that hte on screen keyboard is somewhat supposed to look like how a regular kb looks like which i think it does	19:49
SpeedEvil	Deal with it by making the 'return' icon look like close	19:49
aSIMULAtor	backspace would have been good at hte top	19:49
aSIMULAtor	but	19:49
aSIMULAtor	what about hte other languages?	19:49
SpeedEvil	space is too large now	19:49
GNU\caust1c	hi! is there a way to update the n900 without the nokia software?	19:50
Stskeeps	GNU\caust1c: yes, flasher-3.	19:50
Stskeeps	5	19:50
timeless_mbp	GNU\caust1c: eh?	19:50
timeless_mbp	you can use SSU, Flasher, or NSU	19:50
MohammadAG_	~flashing	19:50
zaheerm	TomaszD, ping	19:50
infobot	extra, extra, read all about it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	19:50
Bluewind	GNU\caust1c: apt-get dist-upgrade but takes ages	19:50
timeless_mbp	all of that is nokia software	19:50
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TomaszD	zaheerm, pong	19:50
timeless_mbp	aSIMULAtor: you're around these days, right?	19:51
PhonicUK	the osk should match a real one as close as possible imo	19:51
PhonicUK	same here	19:51
PhonicUK	and you need backspace a lot in the osk	19:51
MohammadAG_	MeeGo 1.0 out?	19:51
TomaszD	zaheerm, is it that time again?	19:51
aSIMULAtor	in the office?	19:51
timeless_mbp	yeah	19:51
aSIMULAtor	yep same place	19:51
zaheerm	TomaszD, i created gstreamer plugin packages so we can get webm support in, any chance you can add it to extra decoders	19:51
aSIMULAtor	timeless	19:51
zaheerm	TomaszD, and add the tracker-register-mimetype stuff for video/webm	19:51
* aSIMULAtor batts her eyelashes at timeless		19:51
GNU\caust1c	hmk	19:51
aSIMULAtor	my friend is having problems with pr1.2	19:51
TomaszD	zaheerm, sure, I was kind of thinking if we need any updates for the other gstreamer packages	19:52
timeless_mbp	come visit me some time	19:52
blizzow	so fmms is in extras once I install 1.2?	19:52
timeless_mbp	what's wrong? :)	19:52
blizzow	and will work?	19:52
aSIMULAtor	what flor	19:52
aSIMULAtor	same?	19:52
timeless_mbp	e3	19:52
aSIMULAtor	k	19:52
timeless_mbp	yep	19:52
zaheerm	TomaszD, no need for updates, tho we could use the opportunity to push new versions of plugins in	19:52
timeless_mbp	in now fwiw	19:52
MiXu-	a-saint: no, there's no way to increase rootfs size since it's on a separate chip.	19:52
aSIMULAtor	i haven't been on this irc in a long time	19:53
TomaszD	zaheerm, yeah, mkv, musepack and others	19:53
Arkenoi	now watching NOKIA logo for several minutes	19:53
zaheerm	TomaszD, well i already did mkv	19:53
Arkenoi	is that ok?	19:53
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: it should merge all versions to one	19:53
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: it thinks that it needs to update that and other packages	19:53
KMFDM	nokia software updator keeps failign for me	19:53
zaheerm	TomaszD, needed for webm support	19:53
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: after update, it still thinks so	19:53
TomaszD	zaheerm, ok so we could do musepack and rm then	19:53
KMFDM	with downloading update failed	19:53
KMFDM	it keeps trying to resume a download it seems	19:53
KMFDM	as it always jumps to 33.6MB done	19:53
KMFDM	then fials	19:53
KMFDM	fails	19:53
TomaszD	and then push out new decoders-support with updated dependencies	19:54
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zaheerm	TomaszD, yah good idea	19:54
MohammadAG_	MeeGo 1.0 out*	19:54
Arkenoi	it would suck if i will be finally forced to pc reflash	19:54
timeless_mbp	xorAxAx: hrm	19:54
aSIMULAtor	timeless: meet kmfdm my friend out of the other many who are having problems	19:54
TomaszD	zaheerm, I need the mimetypes for webm	19:54
Arkenoi	but there is no progress, just nokia logo	19:54
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timeless_mbp	so, you don't really want to use 'policy'	19:54
KMFDM	my problem seems to be nokia software updater	19:55
zaheerm	TomaszD, video/webm	19:55
TomaszD	k	19:55
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timeless_mbp	xorAxAx: policy is basically saying " you have 3 repositories configured with the same host which claim to offer the same version"	19:55
MiXu-	KMFDM: Do you have the latest NSU?	19:55
KMFDM	yes	19:55
zaheerm	TomaszD, and it needs to pick up latest gstreamer0.10-mkv package plus gstreamer0.10-vp8	19:55
timeless_mbp	they might not be the same package version :)	19:55
KMFDM	i installed the update today	19:55
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timeless_mbp	hi KMFDM	19:55
KMFDM	hi timeless	19:55
TomaszD	zaheerm, how about moving registering mimetypes to the metapackage like we planned	19:55
TomaszD	was there a good plan for this?	19:55
aSIMULAtor	no email app shortcut for desktop?	19:56
johnsu01	timeless_mbp: it looks like my problem might just be space after all..	19:56
TomaszD	I can't think of one that doesn't break things	19:56
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: no, it has to look like this:	19:56
zaheerm	TomaszD, which mimetypes need to move to the metapackage?	19:56
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TomaszD	let me see	19:56
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/218576	19:57
timeless_mbp	xorAxAx: try apt-cache showpkg … instead of policy ...	19:57
blizzow	wow meego uses btrfs.	19:57
xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: 4 provides lines :-(	19:58
PhonicUK	i did a reflash, ota install died on me	19:58
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Arkenoi	phonic: how it died?	19:58
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MohammadAG_	Arkenoi, I said 1.0	19:59
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MohammadAG_	not 0.1	19:59
* Arkenoi tries to figure out if it died or just stuck for a while		19:59
MohammadAG_	anyways, i'll reflash it soon, not	19:59
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xorAxAx	timeless_mbp: brb, this issue seems to block also the pr 1.2 upgrade	19:59
timeless_mbp	xorAxAx: pastebin the showpkg output?	19:59
PhonicUK	lol ptl	19:59
Arkenoi	10 minutes of blue NOKIA logo	19:59
TomaszD	zaheerm, decoders-support only registers matroska and mpeg2 transport stream	20:00
Arkenoi	is it too much? should i turn it off until it drained battery completely?	20:00
PhonicUK	mine took 5 mins to boot, rootfs was full, nothing worked	20:00
blizzow	Arkenoi: I thought mine died, I had to hold in the power button for a few seconds and then it went to a nokia screen and said it's "installing software update"	20:00
PhonicUK	so i reflahed with maemo flashed	20:00
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PhonicUK	~flashing	20:00
infobot	methinks flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	20:00
zaheerm	TomaszD, so realmedia one needs to be done, what else	20:00
blizzow	~flashing	20:01
TomaszD	and musepack	20:01
infobot	i guess flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	20:01
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TomaszD	zaheerm, ^	20:01
blizzow	~bj	20:01
infobot	well, bj is Benin	20:01
PhonicUK	~42	20:01
infobot	42 is, like, the answer to life the universe and everything, see also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/the_answer_to_life,_the_universe,_and_everything	20:01
* Arkenoi will wait 5 more minutes and then will try to restart it either way		20:01
PhonicUK	~phonicuk	20:01
PhonicUK	aw	20:01
blizzow	~infobot	20:02
infobot	well, infobot is the most helpful and smartest of all the bots	20:02
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blizzow	~meego	20:02
infobot	rumour has it, meego is http://meego.com an opensource distribution for netbooks and mobile devices	20:02
PhonicUK	~cheese	20:02
blizzow	~maemo	20:02
infobot	i heard cheese is pure awesomesause. I love cheese.	20:02
infobot	somebody said maemo was http://maemo.nokia.com/ http://maemo.org/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Device_Platforms/Maemo.xhtml	20:02
blizzow	~btrfs	20:02
PhonicUK	~n910	20:02
papo	hello	20:02
blizzow	~BP	20:02
infobot	i heard bp is pb backwards	20:02
PhonicUK	~n920	20:02
PhonicUK	~n900	20:02
infobot	i heard n900 is a wooden box with stained cans inside	20:03
TomaszD	zaheerm, what would be the solution, push everything at once?	20:03
blizzow	~British Petroleum	20:03
TomaszD	could you two stop doing this?	20:03
PhonicUK	~google	20:03
infobot	google is probably http://lmgtfy.com/?q=google	20:03
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PhonicUK	lol	20:03
blizzow	Sorry TomaszD, I'll private message infobot with this.	20:03
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TomaszD	zaheerm, or push the updated metapackage first, it won't be installable, then push the decoders	20:04
papo	I'm flashing my N900 and am wondering about the following things: 1. what exactly does the MMC image contain? wiki sais that I don't need it but some other bogs etc. want me to flash it. 2) what is not contained in the backup done by the backup utility?	20:04
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Stskeeps	papo: it overwrites your 32gb storage	20:04
Arkenoi	well, power button does not respond either	20:04
Arkenoi	will wait a little more and remove accumulator	20:04
PhonicUK	take the battery out	20:04
timeless_mbp	sorry, irc client crashed, time for an update :)	20:04
papo	Stskeeps: Hm ok but what would one to flash that storage in the first place? Isn't it more or less empty?	20:05
papo	I mean when you first get the device	20:05
Stskeeps	papo: it's the same thing that's flashed initialyl to the device	20:05
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Arkenoi	got Nokia logo	20:05
Arkenoi	then bubbles running	20:06
Arkenoi	then nokia logo again	20:06
papo	Stskeeps: to be honest I have no idea what was in there initially	20:06
Arkenoi	bubbles running again	20:06
Arkenoi	and it powered itself off	20:06
papo	Stskeeps: so if I don't flash the MMC I will keep my home with all the podcasts and dot files/directories etc.?	20:06
Stskeeps	papo: right. but i would just do OTA update	20:06
Arkenoi	then on, nokia logo again	20:07
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papo	Stskeeps: this doesn't work for me for some reasons	20:07
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MiXu-	Arkenoi: How long since you started the update?	20:07
Arkenoi	i guess it is a loop and it is dead	20:07
papo	Stskeeps: I just never get the message of a pending OS upgrade. I get notifications for programs, though	20:07
SpeedEvil	Arkenoi: bubbles?	20:07
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Arkenoi	MiXu-, half and hour	20:08
joga	is 45MB enough?	20:08
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MiXu-	Arkenoi: Ok. I don't recall it powering off that much while upgrading.	20:08
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Arkenoi	looks quite like a reboot loop, it boots up to different stages (i've seen a desktop wallpaper once even) and then reboots again	20:08
Khertan_n900	Hi !	20:08
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joga	Arkenoi: on charger?	20:08
Arkenoi	joga: nope, should i?	20:09
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joga	Arkenoi: I dunno. I've had such loops when I was using a charger that didn't actually have the muscle to charge the device	20:09
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papo	Stskeeps: I don't even understand how this is supposed to work... I read reports like "1.2 available in UK today" and stuff like that, how can this be rolled out country by country anyway?	20:09
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joga	in the package details it says "Updating 'Maemo 5' requires 20,0 MB of device memory"..	20:10
microlith	papo: the repositories are marked off by region	20:10
joga	meh, quite confusing	20:10
papo	microlith: oh ok	20:11
marmoute	joga: it will download much more. Then upgrade. then remove download.	20:11
Arkenoi	damn if i knew i will be forced to PC reflash anyways i'd installed leakware the first week it appeared	20:11
marmoute	20 more Mo will remain after that	20:11
joga	marmoute: won't it download them to the flash card?	20:11
marmoute	joga: how are you tring to upgrade ?	20:11
joga	marmoute: from the app manager	20:11
joga	I suppose it's possible even though it says it will use 113,1MB in the package view, and I don't think you have that much free rootfs even with a vanilla device?	20:12
* timeless_mbp files bug reports against a software platform using the n900 :o		20:13
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Aranel	is it ok to remove /var/cache/apt/*.bin ? they took 3.9 megabytes.	20:13
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zaheerm	TomaszD, push the decoders then the metapackage in v ery close succession	20:14
Trizt	not enough space on rootfs when having 45.4MB free (4.2 more if purged some tempfiles)	20:15
joga	hey, it started updating, complained about putting the charger in and told me to try again, but it didn't stop and just continued after I put it on charge and clicked the notification away	20:15
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joga	I wonder if it now did all the proper disk space checks etc ;P	20:15
* microlith boggles as he taps a mail notification and the mail window pops up faster than ever		20:15
PhonicUK	i have 85MB free on rootfs since the update :)	20:15
Arkenoi	Malfunction -- device shutdown in 10s	20:15
PhonicUK	a lot of stuff is faster now	20:16
tripzero	oh noes	20:16
joga	Arkenoi :/	20:16
tripzero	self destruct sequence initiated	20:16
* joga hoping for the best		20:16
PhonicUK	lol	20:16
PhonicUK	reflash :p	20:16
wazd	my update thru NSU took about 30 seconds or so	20:16
joga	reflashing is wrong because it can be fixed! :p	20:16
Trizt	anyone know how much free space you need before update?	20:17
timeless_mbp	Trizt: hey, did my package finally update properly? :)	20:17
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PhonicUK	reflashing gets rid of loads of junk	20:17
joga	Trizt: I just started the update with 45MB, but it's not done yet	20:17
timeless_mbp	i think at least in .1 the package should work. i hope.	20:17
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Trizt	timeless_mbp; yes, it seemed to work now	20:17
* timeless_mbp hasn't deployed it officially yet, but will once Trizt confirms		20:17
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timeless_mbp	woohoo!	20:17
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* timeless_mbp goes to flip the switch		20:17
skynets	wtf	20:17
skynets	turned off the phone 2 hours after updating	20:17
skynets	it wont turn on anymore	20:17
PhonicUK	battery flat?	20:18
Arkenoi	so which file do i need?	20:18
Trizt	at least I'm back on having your excelent translation instead of the default english and the buttons seems to be as they should	20:18
joga	battery is the first thing I'd check	20:18
skynets	battery full	20:18
skynets	wow reseated battery twice and it works now	20:18
PhonicUK	remove it, wait, put it back	20:18
joga	skynets: does the led light up when you try?	20:18
joga	heh	20:18
Trizt	joga; each time I try it says I have to flash instead of OTA	20:18
skynets	first time this happens	20:18
Trizt	soon uninstalled everything	20:18
joga	Trizt: how much free rootfs space do you have?	20:18
joga	Trizt: yeah, I did that too, but most of it was optified I guess and took away a lot without getting much rootfs back	20:19
a-saint	isn't there a way to increase the root space on N900	20:19
* GAN900 reads the MeeGo/N900 thread.		20:19
fragment	Trizt: do you have gles1 libs or games installed?	20:19
Trizt	joga; 45.4	20:20
chadi	is anybody having a problem with qtirreco?	20:20
joga	a-saint: there are of course ways, but I guess not all of them are something everyone agrees on	20:20
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joga	chadi: what sort you have?	20:20
chadi	I can't download a remote	20:20
Trizt	fragment; I think I now have just the default games gles1 I don't know	20:20
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skynets	1.2 is so buggy	20:20
chadi	in the download remote section, i have nothing	20:20
a-saint	joga can't install the new update because of root space	20:21
joga	skynets: how?	20:21
skynets	its freezing right now	20:21
skynets	really slow	20:21
skynets	lagging	20:21
aquatix	hm, is there a known issue about the backup app on n900 not wanting to backup?	20:21
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aquatix	as in, stuck on 0%	20:21
joga	skynets: if there's something more important going on than then gui, things will lag	20:21
joga	*than the	20:21
timeless_mbp	aquatix: i know of a case if you have symlink mazes	20:21
timeless_mbp	beyond that, no	20:21
joga	a dual core would help ;)	20:21
aquatix	odd	20:21
PhonicUK	aquatix, mine did that	20:21
skynets	now screen is blank	20:22
timeless_mbp	aquatix: you should be able to look at the backup app using sshd and the procfs	20:22
aquatix	timeless_mbp: it's a default used install	20:22
skynets	black	20:22
PhonicUK	jumped to 100 after a few mins	20:22
timeless_mbp	or strace	20:22
timeless_mbp	aquatix: no evil stuff?	20:22
aquatix	PhonicUK: oh	20:22
skynets	still lagging	20:22
aquatix	timeless_mbp: no, it's my girl's phone	20:22
PhonicUK	just takes a while	20:22
aquatix	nothing weird	20:22
timeless_mbp	aquatix: i've done ~5 backups w/ pr12	20:22
microlith	skynets: sounds like my device occasionally, back on PR1.1.1	20:22
timeless_mbp	plus a couple of restores w/o noticing anything annoying	20:22
joga	skynets: I like to have the cpu tray applet, then I can always see when something's going on and if there's a reason it's lagging	20:22
timeless_mbp	the only annoying thing is that OTA disables BT	20:22
aquatix	timeless_mbp: this is right before updating to 1.2	20:23
timeless_mbp	aquatix: oh, um. i haven't used 1.1.1's backup in ages	20:23
joga	lol	20:23
a-saint	joga can't install the new update because of low root space	20:23
joga	got "operation failed"	20:23
joga	it downloaded it but didn't get to install	20:23
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timeless_mbp	but from memory they haven't been particularly active about fixing bugs :)	20:23
Trizt	what was the command to purge pdkg not needed by dependencies?	20:23
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joga	Trizt: hehe...yeah.	20:23
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joga	Trizt: it would be deborphan to list them, but apt-get doesn't handle it without it	20:24
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DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: moo	20:24
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timeless_mbp	Trizt: apt-get autoremove ?	20:24
GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, yo.	20:24
a-saint	joga no didn't download it said no free space target destination	20:24
ShadowJK	OTA disables BT?	20:24
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: you pinged me?	20:24
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GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, I poked Quim about the device queue	20:25
joga	a-saint: yeah, but for me it did	20:25
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joga	hmm	20:25
joga	it actually seems to be updating	20:25
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: nice	20:25
Trizt	timeless_mbp; thanks	20:25
joga	there's a progress bar going slowly	20:25
chadi	joga: I get this: http://talk.maemo.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8502&stc=1&d=1269885831	20:25
timeless_mbp	Trizt: that's really sp 3000	20:25
timeless_mbp	i'm just an audio irc proxy	20:25
joga	but I wonder, what was that operation failed...oh, maybe it was when I pressed camkey	20:25
GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, I'll let you know what something comes back.	20:26
a-saint	joga i see the update can't download	20:26
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joga	a-saint: then I'm afraid you need to free up some space or reflash it if you want it fast	20:26
johnsu01	hm I think I may be in a reboot loop here, maybe dist-upgrade wasn't so wise	20:26
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: thanks	20:26
a-saint	joga i tried and freed some space but it wasn't enough	20:27
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: btw my excuse not to use 1.2 has changed now :)	20:27
chadi	johnsu01: a lot of people were reporting problems with dist-upgrade	20:27
joga	if I restore a backup, are my /home configuration files gone?	20:27
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joga	a-saint: yeah, then keep on doing it :)	20:27
GAN900	DocScrutinizer51, I hear it may eat your children.	20:27
a-saint	joga i got 47.9 free space in /	20:27
johnsu01	chadi: yeah, it's rebooting right after it loads the desktop wallpaper	20:27
joga	a-saint: I got less and it was enough	20:27
joga	a-saint: try rebooting it and try again or somtehing	20:27
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: exactly	20:27
a-saint	really	20:27
joga	a-saint: though my update is not done yet, so hold on!	20:28
joga	let's see if it works ;P	20:28
a-saint	joga ok	20:28
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: and I got none to sacrifice	20:28
joga	it's at about 20%	20:28
a-saint	joga yeah it's a big update	20:28
a-saint	joga but there must be a way to increase space	20:28
DocScrutinizer51	GAN900: so I might wait until cat of the neighbour is enough to feed it	20:29
chadi	johnsu01 but I have no idea and no experience to help you :) someone else might be able to help	20:29
joga	a-saint: there are risks involved in radically reorganizing things from the way they are now, but there are some tips in the wiki http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space	20:30
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a-saint	joga am trying to free all unused app lets see where it gets	20:32
chadi	a-saint: be aware that using the script on that page may brick your device..	20:32
a-saint	chadi thanks for the warnning	20:32
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chadi	a-saint: it happened to mine, that's why I'd like to warn people. it may not necessarily apply to you :)	20:33
chadi	I don't like the fact that they used the word "safely"	20:33
a-saint	chadi well i will try and not use any script	20:34
chadi	heh, good luck	20:34
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a-saint	chadi thanks	20:35
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joga	at ~60%...	20:36
a-saint	joga i got this link earlier	20:36
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joga	ok	20:36
a-saint	joga worked according to it	20:37
joga	this is almost done..	20:38
a-saint	joga and still removing app lol	20:38
joga	yeah I know, I got rid of everything big and most of the averages :)	20:38
lcuk	a-saint, how much space have you got? and have you already disabled -devel and -testing	20:39
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lcuk	space on / and also /home	20:39
MohammadAG_	bah, meego is a raw file	20:39
MohammadAG_	assuming it needs reflashing	20:39
a-saint	lcuk yeah done the disable repos	20:39
MohammadAG_	it took half an hour to reinstall my apps, i'm not wasting that time again	20:40
joga	rebooting...	20:40
lcuk	MohammadAG_, ?	20:40
MohammadAG_	lcuk, meego.com	20:40
lcuk	reinstall apps where on meego or back onto maemo	20:40
MohammadAG_	maemo	20:41
MohammadAG_	when i upgraded to PR1.2	20:41
lcuk	from 1.1.9 or whatever you had :D	20:42
blizzow	Anyone know how to start a video call with a gmail account?	20:42
MaikB	My N900 performs much better since I upgraded to 1.2	20:43
MaikB	I'm very happy so far	20:43
MiXu-	I'm trying to upload my app to extras-devel but I get this error: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/dgscores_0.3/armel.build.log.FAILED.txt	20:43
MiXu-	Any ideas what's wrong?	20:43
joga	seems like the update worked, it's rebooted and now I have 68MB on rootfs (45MB when I started)	20:44
a-saint	joga I will try and redownload again now	20:44
X-Fade	MiXu-: Do you have the proper Build-Depends specified?	20:44
E0x	MiXu-: qmake	20:44
a-saint	joga congratulations :D	20:44
E0x	is not found	20:44
joga	a-saint, thx :)	20:45
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MiXu-	X-Fade: Hmm. Probably not.	20:45
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MiXu-	E0x: I can see that it's not found :D	20:45
E0x	well , that is the problem	20:45
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E0x	you asking what is wrong	20:45
E0x	that is wrong	20:45
MohammadAG_	tmo down	20:46
dmj726	reflashing doesn't remove all your documents and settings, does it?	20:46
joga	the first improvement I see is that the "Update all" is no longer in the menu and instead a button above the updates	20:46
MohammadAG_	back up	20:46
MaikB	janyone here uses dgiatscene?	20:46
FIQ	Wasn't texting in the menu going to start a search?	20:46
microlith	hmm	20:46
FIQ	texting in menu does nothing for me	20:46
MaikB	*anyone	20:46
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microlith	that touchscreen click sound interacts badly with music playing	20:46
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a-saint	joga finger crossed for me hopefully it work I freed as much as i could and kept the good needed ones	20:47
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Arkenoi	btw did leakware updated to pr1.2 ota well?	20:47
MaikB	its an youtube app and it always shows "This video has been removed", no matter which video i select and try to play	20:47
E0x	what need happen for a package get promote to extra ?	20:48
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joga	MaikB: haven't tried that, but zoutube works pretty ok	20:48
joga	it's quite simple though	20:48
MaikB	joga, thx, trying that	20:48
a-saint	joga backing up	20:49
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a-saint	joga and it's updating :D	20:51
joga	a-saint: nice. hope it works	20:51
odin_	here goes me and PR1.2 then	20:51
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a-saint	joga I believe it will now that it's updating	20:52
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joga	a-saint: that's what you'd expect, at least ;)	20:52
a-saint	joga lets keep the spirit up	20:53
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Otacon22	is it possible to update my n900 from linux?	20:53
Otacon22	it asks for nokia software updater app	20:53
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Aranel	damn, still need 16 mbyte more space to upgrade :/ Any rootfs-filler apps you know?	20:54
lcuk	Otacon22, you can reflash from linux - after a backupflash/restore it will be cleaner anyway	20:54
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lcuk	Aranel, -devel -testing repository disable	20:54
MaikB	joga, zoutube is slow...	20:55
MaikB	meh	20:55
Aranel	lcuk: already diabled.	20:55
Aranel	s/diabled/disabled	20:55
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midas_	so	20:56
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MaikB	unusable	20:56
joga	MaikB: yeah, but still more comfy to use than youtube in the browser, albeit slow	20:56
joga	or, well, depends on drunkedness :)	20:57
C-S-B	Otacon22, http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Linux	20:57
MaikB	I wonder how it can spend some much time on parsing some meta data	20:57
C-S-B	so anything really wrong with this update?	20:57
joga	where's vim??	20:57
skynets	the phone is lagging so much i cant instaqll shit	20:57
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skynets	wtf	20:58
lcuk	Aranel, how much space do you actually have now? du -s /usr/share/*\|sort -n	20:58
C-S-B	also, for the record, you can force the architecture for 64bit linux users	20:58
lcuk	also, du command for seeing specifics	20:58
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skynets	i just disabled the fucking wifi and it works ok now	20:59
evilrob	does the app manager "restore applications" work well?	20:59
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Aranel	lcuk: lots of output. want me to paste?	20:59
joga	hmm...oh, I still have vim, thought I got rid of it temporarily	20:59
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DrGrov	Finally PR 1.2 installed and settings back like they should	21:00
DrGrov	MohammadAG, I was a bit too worked up there today, eh? ;)	21:00
MaikB	chromium??	21:01
dmj726	how much space is needed for pr 1.2?	21:01
MaikB	When did this happen?	21:01
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joga	is there a video call testing service for skype? ;p	21:02
timeless_mbp	joga: good question	21:02
joga	some loopback thing	21:02
DrGrov	Anyone else see something like a SMS icon or missed call icon when the screen is locked and something has happened?	21:02
DrGrov	A missed event so to speak	21:02
timeless_mbp	videoecho123	21:02
joga	timeless_mbp: it is?	21:02
DrGrov	Anyone else know if there is a way to get the old "virtual keyboard" of PR 1.1 back? I hate to take out the physical keyboard each freaking time I want to write a SMS	21:03
Aranel	lcuk: http://pastebin.com/cXw6P9D1	21:03
timeless_mbp	http://forum.skype.com/topic/54864-video-test-echo123-from-tapur/	21:03
DrGrov	The new virtual keyboard of PR 1.2 is freaking disgusting and non working	21:03
lcuk	Aranel, paste df result too please	21:03
DrGrov	Can't even get big letters for some reason....	21:04
DrGrov	Big disappointment it seems...	21:04
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: you can't go back :)	21:04
kamui	man, even flaming in the comments of bugzilla	21:04
kamui	jesus	21:04
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: what problems are you actually having w/ it?	21:04
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, no problem.	21:04
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kamui	this community can certainly be unforgiving :-D	21:04
timeless_mbp	what do you mean by "big letters"?	21:04
Aranel	lcuk: http://pastebin.com/mefdetnc	21:04
timeless_mbp	there's a shift in the lower left corner for uppercase...	21:04
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, i am having the big problem of the virtual keyboard. i can't put a big A for ex. "A nice day today"	21:05
DrGrov	A shift? I don't see no damn shift...	21:05
GAN900	kamui, who could blame them, though?	21:05
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: the up arrow in the bottom left isn't working?	21:05
GAN900	timeless_mbp, been through the new browser bugs?	21:05
joga	timeless_mbp: "Maintenance of videoecho123 was difficult technically, and I decided to finish this service" :/	21:05
timeless_mbp	GAN900: i think so, depends	21:05
GAN900	See ctrl-l is tied to that automatic focus setting now.	21:05
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, i tried to press the arrow in the bottom left but it just changes the letters for numbers and other signs....	21:05
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* GAN900 wonders if that's a spec change or a regression.		21:06
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, so i need to keep it pressed in and then a for a big A?	21:06
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timeless_mbp	DrGrov: hrm	21:06
timeless_mbp	there's an up arrow to the left of 'Z' in my English OSK	21:06
timeless_mbp	is that not what you're pressing?	21:06
timeless_mbp	GAN900: regression	21:06
MaikB	well, chromium started and looked up the whole system	21:07
MaikB	to bad	21:07
timeless_mbp	we discovered it the day pr1.2 shipped	21:07
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DrGrov	timeless_mbp, i have pressed that several times.	21:07
microlith	hmm	21:07
timeless_mbp	GAN900: the bigger problem is that the feature you're using doesn't persist across browser launches	21:07
microlith	that is quite terrible	21:07
timeless_mbp	which makes it hard for people to reliably use it	21:07
microlith	no key touch indication	21:07
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timeless_mbp	sp3000 was only dogfooding defaults until recently hence the miss for him	21:07
microlith	no obvious boundaries between keys, either	21:07
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, i will just use the physical keyboard. tomorrow i will test more. have too much stress atm to get into this persistent keyboard issue.	21:07
timeless_mbp	i don't use ctrl-l myself	21:08
DrGrov	yet again though some positive comments timeless_mbp	21:08
joga	isn't there anymore skype availability icons for contacts?	21:08
joga	or, any account or whatever the green dot thingy is	21:08
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: so, the up arrow definitely works for me	21:08
timeless_mbp	joga: it's still there	21:08
joga	timeless_mbp: not seeing it :(	21:09
joga	I'll try to relogin to the account..	21:09
timeless_mbp	joga: stupid question… are you connected? :)	21:09
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joga	yes	21:09
joga	:)	21:09
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, ok. you see upon boot that the both "dotted" lines tend to move from right to left simultaneously and not only left to right?	21:09
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lcuk	Aranel, which liqbase stuff have you got :D	21:09
lcuk	tho it wont tip you off the top	21:09
aquatix	hah, it finished backing up now	21:09
timeless_mbp	aquatix: good to hear :)	21:09
joga	timeless_mbp: ok now they came back when I set it to offline and available again	21:10
aquatix	with a big leap from 0 to 100	21:10
Aranel	lcuk: I dont even know anything about liqbase. what is it? :)	21:10
aquatix	timeless_mbp: yeah :)	21:10
lcuk	Aranel, its installed	21:10
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: i don't pay much attn to the splash stuff	21:10
lcuk	ell components may be	21:10
ghostcube_maemo	hmmm 1.2 is cool	21:10
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ghostcube_maemo	heh	21:10
timeless_mbp	other than my maemo splash video	21:10
lcuk	its too small to be everything	21:10
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, ok :) no worries	21:11
Aranel	lcuk: how to remove it? apt-get remove liqbase doesnt do the trick.	21:11
joga	the front cam is really dark	21:11
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, i am now looking at a youtube video to see the conversations virtual keyboard.	21:11
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, trying to figure out whether something i have missed out on :)	21:11
lcuk	Aranel, i dunno what you have installed, i just see the top level folder in your du report :P	21:11
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joga	the image quality seems a lot less grainy though!	21:12
Aranel	lcuk: If I manage to remove it, how much free space I'll get?	21:12
lcuk	go into HAM and read up the du report you shown me and remove things which match if you need so much space	21:12
joga	it's just so dark and lacks contrast, maybe good in daylight	21:12
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, yes I see that arrow in the left corner. I will try my phone now to see if it really works. God admn!	21:12
lcuk	well thats the general numbers on the left	21:12
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timeless_mbp	GAN900: can you reproduce bug 10313? i can't, even at http://www.google.fi/	21:13
povbot`	Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10313 Browser fullscreen virtual keyboard closes when turning from portrait to landscape	21:13
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timeless_mbp	joga: we have a night mode in camera now :)	21:13
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joga	and more resolutions	21:14
MiXu-	X-Fade: It was simply build-deps issue. Thanks :)	21:15
MiXu-	Works now.	21:15
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GAN900	timeless_mbp, reproduced first time on that page.	21:15
timeless_mbp	GAN900: hrm...	21:16
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Aranel	lcuk: I think I didnt understand what to do :/ How can I know them if they match or not?	21:16
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GAN900	timeless_mbp, open site, go into portrait, tap text field, watching vkb open, move device into landscape, watch keyboard closes.	21:16
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lcuk	Aranel, http://pastebin.com/cXw6P9D1 this paste you put in	21:17
lcuk	each line consists of a line number, folder size, folder name /usr/share/SOMETHING	21:18
Aranel	lcuk: cant I send you the list of installed packages or something? I really don't have any idea how I did fill that much space. There was much more space a month ago :/	21:18
lcuk	the sizes get bigger towards the bottom	21:18
Aranel	lcuk: yes but they're system files, mostly?	21:18
joga	hehe, can I somehow press backspace with the osk without using ctrl with it or hw keyb?	21:18
Aranel	lcuk: like micro-b, locales, themes, icons, nokia maps..	21:18
lcuk	so look up the list whilst you have app manager open and see hwat you can remove	21:18
joga	or, well, ctrl doesn't work either since it opens a text input field where it acts and not the terminal	21:19
lcuk	sure Aranel you cant wipe those im not asking you to, im just trying to help you find out whats taking up space	21:19
DrGrov	timeless_mbp, my theme was blocking the arrow key and space key. LOL	21:19
timeless_mbp	....	21:19
timeless_mbp	DrGrov: please file a bug	21:19
lcuk	Aranel, looks like you just have a lot of smallish apps on	21:20
* DocScrutinizer wonders whether to call the coach and medic care, to prepare for meego meeting madness during the remaining 40 minutes		21:20
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Aranel	lcuk: can't I simply upgrade to PR1.2, without reflashing, or freeing up space? Like moving the apt cache?	21:20
timeless_mbp	GAN900: ok, hit it	21:20
Arkenoi	..and qt does not start any faster	21:20
timeless_mbp	i think that google is changing its page layout	21:20
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timeless_mbp	GAN900: can you reproduce w/ data:text/html,<input><textarea> ?	21:21
DocScrutinizer	is there some confirmed figure now how much free rootspace 1.2 OTA will require?	21:21
lcuk	Aranel, backup and reflash	21:21
lcuk	and restore afterwards	21:21
DocScrutinizer	moo lcuk	21:21
lcuk	if you havent got the space and arent comfortable finding out how to make it/rectify issue the only thing left is reflash	21:22
timeless_mbp	DocScrutinizer: no :)	21:22
lcuk	hey DocScrutinizer	21:22
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DocScrutinizer	timeless_mbp: great. Thanks anyway :-D	21:22
MaikB	is there something to use google's buzz ?	21:23
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Aranel	DocScrutinizer: heard that It needs 48 megabytes.	21:23
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timeless_mbp	MaikB: the browser works w/ buzz :)	21:24
lcuk	thats about right Aranel	21:24
timeless_mbp	dinner time.	21:24
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: sounds somewhat reasonable (though not exactly sane), as 1.1.1 required about same	21:24
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* Trizt ended up with flashing, managde to f**k it up by removing packages		21:24
MaikB	timeless_mbp, I know	21:24
timeless_mbp	people often forget that	21:25
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FredrIQ	Can i compile things same way as on a computer on N900?	21:25
Aranel	lcuk: If I just do rm -rf /usr/share/liqbase. How much space I'll gain?	21:25
DocScrutinizer	somebody spanked crashanddie? :-P	21:25
timeless_mbp	they paid for a good browser, got a good browser, and then forgot that it worked	21:25
FredrIQ	and place it in the 2G partition	21:25
MaikB	timeless_mbp, I thought about adding (which is not the browser) but assumed...	21:25
MaikB	nevermind	21:25
lcuk	about 680k	21:25
lcuk	from the looks of df	21:25
timeless_mbp	MaikB: i've been working on microb here @nokia for 4 years	21:25
timeless_mbp	so it annoys me when people go looking for other solutions which tend to be inferior :)	21:26
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Aranel	lcuk: aww :( so I'll still need 17.4 megabytes to upgrade :P	21:26
thresh	do you know the man who worked on ham?	21:26
MaikB	timeless_mbp, it is IMHO _the_ feature of the N900	21:26
thresh	oh	21:26
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MaikB	timeless_mbp, thank you!	21:26
thresh	so we could kill him.	21:26
lcuk	yes so its thousand papercuts	21:26
johnsu01	will flashing the emmc image overwrite the backup I made before bricking?	21:26
ghostcube_maemo	hmmm i cant get skype to do vid call grml	21:26
DocScrutinizer	~spank crashanddie s/ibot/happy bd/	21:26
lcuk	really, save hassle and backup/flash	21:26
* infobot bends crashanddie s/ibot/happy bd/ over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on crashanddie s/ibot/happy bd/'s pasty white buttocks.		21:26
lcuk	your system will be cleaner and you can tick select the apps to reinstall afterwards	21:26
blizzow	anyone have trouble logging into AIM accounts? I set up my client and click connect, it just continues to say "not signed in"	21:27
FredrIQ	hmm	21:27
Aranel	lcuk: I'd hate to reflash :/ I'm kind of.. weird, when it comes to reflashing, see: I've installed Ubuntu 7.04 like 3 yrs ago, now its 10.04 and I'm still using it. :)	21:27
DocScrutinizer	johnsu01: depends on where you stored the backup, no?	21:27
Aranel	lcuk: what about moving the whole microb-engine to opt, then symlink it?	21:27
MaikB	timeless_mbp, but I don't think any general purpose browser can compete in terms of energy efficiency with an dedicated app for an low volume task like twitter or buzz.	21:28
Aranel	lcuk: I can move it to same location after upgrade.	21:28
MaikB	timeless_mbp, disagree?	21:28
johnsu01	DocScrutinizer: Yes, and I think the answer to my question is yes, judging by the warning in bold at http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	21:28
lcuk	Aranel, dont	21:28
lcuk	it will just cause more upsets	21:28
DocScrutinizer	johnsu01: anyway flashing eMMC isn't considered mandatory for debricking	21:28
joga	Aranel: how much space do you have free now?	21:29
DrGrov	timeless, sorry what did you say?	21:29
Aranel	joga: 32 megabytes.	21:29
DocScrutinizer	the only real nasty pathological case would be some rogue content of ~user/	21:29
joga	Aranel: 45 was enough for me to update	21:29
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Aranel	lcuk: It seems there's 100megabytes of data which APT doesnt know anything about.	21:29
DocScrutinizer	as it seems there is no other way to clean/edit ~user/* than reflashing the whole eMMC	21:30
Aranel	joga: hmm, so I need 13 more, but I can't find any app to remove, they just give me 50~100kb, nothing more.	21:30
joga	I don't think the sizes reported by the app manager are even nearly accurate, if they're static, since programs share the libraries	21:30
lcuk	Aranel, but then when the install occurs it does all sorts of things beyond your cleaning up	21:30
joga	and I assume it includes the libraries in the estimate	21:30
joga	(otherwise it wouldn't be very useful at all) :)	21:31
dmj726	Aranel: what message does it give you?	21:31
Aranel	dmj726: It says I have to use NSU to upgrade.	21:31
dmj726	same here	21:31
Aranel	dmj726: which I resist :P	21:32
dmj726	I don't want to deal with that.	21:32
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: look into python libs	21:32
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Arkenoi	so qt still sucks and it likely will continue to suck :-(	21:32
josephnexus	hi everyone!	21:32
joga	hmm...what Attitude needs is the camera finder view to overlay the pitch meter on instead of the dull horizon	21:32
josephnexus	i'm wanting to update to the latest version of maemo	21:32
joga	would be even useful then :)	21:32
josephnexus	but I don't have a windows machine	21:32
josephnexus	how would I go about updating?	21:32
Aranel	DocScrutinizer: where to look exactly?	21:33
dmj726	...how about a linux machine?	21:33
DocScrutinizer	josephnexus: feel happy, windows is a virus	21:33
josephnexus	i have a linux box	21:33
josephnexus	but I thought we could update this over the air	21:33
dmj726	you can flash with that	21:33
DocScrutinizer	that's MUCH better	21:33
dmj726	...hopefully we can	21:33
Aranel	lcuk: so it is normal thing to see that APT doesn't know about 100 megabytes of file?	21:33
dmj726	some are having issues with ota	21:33
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josephnexus	so how do i do the update?	21:34
Aranel	lcuk: I'm just suspicious about "unwanted files", maybe some package installed lots of things which APT is not even aware of.	21:34
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dmj726	go to update in the app manager	21:34
josephnexus	and it will do it's thing?	21:34
josephnexus	cuz it was telling me to have it plugged into a PC and update that way	21:34
josephnexus	which isn't possible for me	21:34
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: no expert here. But I found python libs eating some 50MB of my rootspace a few months ago. Some package called python-optify or similar cured that	21:34
dmj726	it will give a maemo 5 package in the update list	21:35
MaikB	oops, I broke stackoverflow.com	21:35
dmj726	tap that to install	21:35
MaikB	I'm sorry	21:35
MaikB	:P	21:35
FredrIQ	qt4-qmake libqt4-dev libsdl1.2-dev libsdl-net1.2-dev libsdl-mixer1.2-dev libsdl-image1.2-dev libsdl-ttf2.0-dev liblua5.1-dev fpc - is everything available somewhere?	21:35
josephnexus	since it is reflashing and such, is my data at risk?	21:35
Aranel	DocScrutinizer: is it pymaemo-optify?	21:35
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: mount should show you a few python bindmounts, otherwise you have to get that optification	21:35
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: yes	21:36
josephnexus	(i know you should always have a backup, this is more out of curiosity)	21:36
Aranel	DocScrutinizer: It's already installed.	21:36
DrGrov	anyone found any HD quality videos about PR 1.2?	21:36
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: sorry	21:36
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Arkenoi	the most disappointing part is qt	21:37
Arkenoi	i did really hope qt application will start fast	21:37
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DocScrutinizer	Aranel: anyway, regarding space freed by app deinstall - it's lieing as it doesn't count the dependencies	21:37
Arkenoi	and modest	21:38
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Arkenoi	modest is still the same disaster	21:38
Arkenoi	all numerous usability bug reports were ignored	21:38
DocScrutinizer	Aranel: app-a (100k) depends lib-x (10MB), app-b (150k) depends lib-x (10MB), you never will see the 10MB freed figure that you get on deinstalling app-a AND app-b	21:39
Shapeshifter	does modest now save sent mails on the imap server as well or is that still missing?	21:39
josephnexus	hmm	21:39
josephnexus	my phone is telling me the following	21:39
DrGrov	SMS in portrait mode?	21:40
josephnexus	"To update your device to this version of the operating system you must use the Nokia software update application on your PC. Connect the device to your pc via a USB cable and launch the application."	21:40
RST38h	Arkenoi: At least there is hope it can now access POP3 accounts	21:40
DrGrov	Haven't had the time to test yet....	21:40
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josephnexus	the only button I have is a "Create Backup" button	21:40
Ikarus	josephnexus: it means your root filesystem is too full	21:40
josephnexus	so uninstall some stuff?	21:41
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josephnexus	is there any way to have a larger root fs?	21:41
RST38h	Arkenoi: but the upgrade process has been...mmmhmm...eventful	21:41
DocScrutinizer	or conflicts stop the upgrade	21:41
Ikarus	josephnexus: nope	21:41
Ikarus	josephnexus: but you can clean it with some luck	21:41
Aranel	there should be some other way to upgrade without reflashing, or freeing up space.	21:41
Ikarus	also don't try to use apt directly (to get a different package dir)	21:41
Ikarus	my N900 ended up in a reboot loop that way	21:41
josephnexus	i have only used the app manager	21:42
Arkenoi	josephnexus, author of that diagnostic string deserves to get his shit beaten out of him	21:42
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DocScrutinizer	Arkenoi: ack	21:42
joga	josephnexus: do you have a network connection? :)	21:42
Ikarus	Arkenoi: yes he does	21:42
josephnexus	i am removing unused apps	21:42
josephnexus	hopefully that will free up some space	21:43
josephnexus	how much space do I need?	21:43
Aranel	heard that you need 48, joga said that 45 megabytes is enough.	21:43
xorAxAx	timeless: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/218609/	21:43
joga	I had 45.x MB when I started it	21:43
Aranel	also I heard Brain Party conflicts with update. Is it true?	21:44
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Aranel	damn. removed Firefox. It didnt even give me 0.1 megabyte :/	21:45
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Scelt	because it's on emmc	21:45
joga	btw...does firefox on maemo make its caches on rootfs?	21:45
joga	or microb	21:45
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Scelt	Aranel: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	21:46
joga	I was thinking if clearing cache from the browsers would help	21:46
joga	(or is it just memory cache?)	21:46
Scelt	12:09:14 < Surfa> Scelt, brain party removal helped	21:46
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Scelt	Aranel: 12:09:14 < Surfa> Scelt, brain party removal helped	21:46
bennypr0fane	Hi, is it possible to make n900 show me a list of all installed applications that are from devel or testing repos? If yes, how do i do that?	21:47
Aranel	removed brain party, didnt even free up 0.1 megabyte	21:48
lcuk	Aranel, what are you testing freespace with?	21:48
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Aranel	lcuk: Free Rootfs widget from DECW	21:48
josephnexus	conky is good to have	21:49
lcuk	have you thought that perhaps the widget isnt refreshing? open a terminal and check "df"	21:49
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Aranel	lcuk: did that too. 32.0 Available.	21:49
Aranel	lcuk: and I'm sure it's refresing, because I manually refresh it.	21:50
lcuk	what does your widget show then now	21:50
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lcuk	does it match with df	21:50
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josephnexus	df -h	21:51
Aranel	lcuk: yes, it matches exactly as df. df says 32.0 Available, Free Rootfs: 32.0MB	21:51
josephnexus	might be more useful	21:51
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Aranel	damn I'm uninstalling everything, but It still doesn't free up any reasonable space :/	21:52
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dmj726	heh...25.6 free on rootfs isn't enough, right?	21:54
lcuk	sure Aranel DocScrutinizer told you why	21:54
josephnexus	aranel, a flash might be in store for you	21:54
plastun	my apps files installs to /opt/maemo/usr/,,,,/python2.5/site-packeges. So, import MODULENAME can't import module, because /opt/... path is not incuded to PYTHON_PATH. Hot to fixe this best?	21:54
plastun	*how	21:55
Aranel	lcuk: isnt it possible to remove a whole library? with all applications depend on it?	21:55
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lcuk	Aranel, its your device, you can remove what you like! just expect to have to reflash if you get it wrong	21:56
lcuk	its just like your 4 year old linux desktop	21:56
DocScrutinizer51	make a backup, then uninstall 'all' apps, upgrade, restore apps from backup	21:56
MohammadAG_	anyone on 1.1.1?	21:56
MohammadAG_	:)	21:56
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lcuk	DocScrutinizer51, if hes doing that he would be easier just reflashing	21:56
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lcuk	infact, had he done that, he would be up and running again now	21:57
Aranel	lcuk: I can boot my linux desktop with a live-cd. and It doesnt end up with reboot loops If some important app -like Xorg- crashes :)	21:57
DocScrutinizer51	lcuk: not really	21:57
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frals	he, the new firmware update brought along a few fmms downloads... 9686 in a day :D	21:57
josephnexus	fmms?	21:57
josephnexus	what's that?	21:57
MohammadAG_	Aranel, kill the watchdog with a shotgun	21:57
frals	fMMS, application for sending/receiving MMS	21:57
lcuk	that doesnt help moh	21:57
MohammadAG_	not with Xorg	21:58
MohammadAG_	but the rest, yes	21:58
bennypr0fane	hey frals, is that you, the guy who made fmms?	21:58
MohammadAG_	I killed hildon-desktop using killall -sigstop and it stayed dead	21:58
frals	that be me	21:58
bennypr0fane	you're awesome, man	21:58
BCMM	frals: ^	21:58
* MohammadAG_ points to the Donate button on frals' blog		21:58
lcuk	:D heh frals is blushing now!	21:58
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Aranel	I wonder why reflashing is always preferred. I hated it on Symbian too :/	21:59
frals	well thank you :) this community is awesome, wouldnt have done it by myself	21:59
* MohammadAG_ suggests using trouts as a currency		21:59
bennypr0fane	:-)	21:59
DocScrutinizer	lol	21:59
BCMM	(although i'm not yet sure if i know anybody else with an MMS phone...)	21:59
lcuk	Aranel, because its SIMPLER and gets the job done	21:59
bennypr0fane	thanks a lot!	21:59
BCMM	MohammadAG_: IIRC, trout handle international shipping just fine	21:59
lcuk	if you are comfortable tho please continue, i however have to make some tea and put some packages in the oven	21:59
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bennypr0fane	trouts are quite tasty indeed	22:00
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DrGrov	MohammadAG, it worked out wonderfully the update to 1.2 :) Sorry for being a bit overreacting there earlier	22:00
frals	lcuk: you are suppose to upload packages to the repos, not put them in the oven!	22:01
DocScrutinizer	DrGrov: seems you're the lucky ONE	22:01
MohammadAG_	DrGrov, oh it worked? damn	22:01
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bennypr0fane	has anyone read my earlier question?	22:01
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bennypr0fane	i''d like to install pr 1.2, but need to make room first	22:02
* anonuk somehow got maemo to boot again but now all the colors and fonts are wrong (unhildonized)		22:02
bennypr0fane	i'd like to do it by removing most of the apps from devel and testing	22:02
ag0ny	Just updated to PR1.2. What happend to the search function in the program manager?	22:02
lcuk	ag0ny, just type	22:03
bennypr0fane	ag0ny you just type what yu're looking for	22:03
lcuk	on the main list	22:03
an0therb0x	help please can someone please direct me to instructions on how to "re-flash" my n900 ... i did something wrong installing the 1.2 firmware	22:03
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bennypr0fane	like in contacts	22:03
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Bluewind	~flash	22:03
infobot	methinks flash is the same as ~flashing	22:03
Bluewind	~flashing	22:03
infobot	well, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	22:03
MohammadAG_	DocScrutinizer51, still on 1.1.1?	22:03
ag0ny	lcuk, bennypr0fane: thanks	22:03
DocScrutinizer	yup	22:03
MohammadAG_	Can you check which version of hildon-desktop is installed?	22:04
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* pupnik is running a partially updated system :)		22:04
DocScrutinizer	tell me what you want me to do	22:04
MohammadAG_	I hate the face that kinetic scrolling was partially killed, so I'm comparing sources	22:04
MohammadAG_	dpkg -l hildon-desktop	22:04
DocScrutinizer	k, mompls	22:04
MohammadAG_	remember, -l, not -r, we don't want you to go into a boot loop :P	22:04
ag0ny	Just typing does not work? Do I just start typing in the download section?	22:05
DocScrutinizer	ii hildon-desktop 1:2.2.120-4+0m5 Hildon desktop for Fremantle	22:05
pupnik	ii hildon-desktop 1:2.2.138-1+0m Hildon desktop for Fremantle	22:05
MohammadAG_	Thanks :)	22:05
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MohammadAG_	pupnik, that's 1.2 right?	22:05
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pupnik	i guess. i havent rebooted into upgrade hell yet	22:05
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pupnik	was hoping to fix the upgrade with proper 1.2 metapackage	22:06
an0therb0x	anybody else have the infinite loop issue ?	22:06
pupnik	what is the right thing to install for ota upgrade?	22:06
DocScrutinizer	infobot: no, flash is <reply>see flashing	22:07
infobot	okay, DocScrutinizer	22:07
pupnik	i probably will if i reboot now	22:07
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DocScrutinizer	~flash	22:07
infobot	flashing is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	22:07
Aranel	/usr/lib/locale/locale-archive can somebody explain that why I need this?	22:08
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DocScrutinizer	infobot: flash is also a plugin eating your left leg	22:09
* infobot starts a firmware update on is also a plugin eating your left leg, then pulls the plug halfway through		22:09
Aranel	It's one of "List of big and rarely used files" and 28 megabytes of data.	22:09
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frals	wow crash reporter... "14 stored reports" and only button i can activate is "Select all", cant send/delete or deselect any of them \o/	22:09
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lcuk	frals, select all, delete	22:10
lcuk	you cant send/delete until you have selected what	22:10
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frals	i had all selected, but delete was still "disabled"	22:10
frals	but it worked clicking it anyway \o/	22:11
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frals	i think my phone is fubar thou, might need a reboot	22:11
DocScrutinizer	~flash <self>	22:11
Arkenoi	well, just about 10mb more with pr1.2 than with moveroot.sh script	22:11
* infobot starts a firmware update on <self>, then pulls the plug halfway through		22:11
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anonuk	an0therb0x: i had infinite reboot issue	22:11
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frals	whenever i scroll desktop it scrolls half of it then stops animation, and wont update until i tap on it	22:11
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* DocScrutinizer thinks infobot has done that before		22:12
josephnexus	what's the best way to free up things from my rootfs?	22:12
DocScrutinizer	probably doing that every day	22:12
bennypr0fane	some of the themes for n900 are supposed to slow down the device. Would that be from the moment i install them them or only if i actually use them?	22:12
an0therb0x	anonuk: how did you fix it ?	22:12
Gadgetoid_iMac	Weird, the search option seems to have taken a leave of absence from HAM	22:12
MohammadAG_	lcuk, since you're a C expert, do you know what this means?	22:12
MohammadAG_	if (priv->transition)	22:12
MohammadAG_	- priv->transition = (g_object_unref(priv->transition), NULL);	22:12
MohammadAG_	+ hd_launcher_page_transition_stop (HD_LAUNCHER_PAGE (gobject));	22:12
frals	so err	22:13
frals	[91847.421813] HWRecoveryResetSGX: SGX Hardware Recovery triggered	22:13
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frals	getting this every second in dmesg, good/bad?	22:13
MohammadAG_	bad?	22:13
anonuk	an0therb0x: long long story... i had a boot menu installed already so i could boot to mer... got a firmware copy, and completed the apt-get upgrade / reinstalled packages inside mer	22:13
anonuk	an0therb0x: but my maemo is still broken, everything is grey and pink	22:13
anonuk	an0therb0x: no idea how to fix that and the fonts are tiny	22:14
lcuk	MohammadAG_, yeah - the call which originally was just a gobject unref was replaced by a specific function method to cleanly stop the transition - by the looks of it	22:14
bennypr0fane	"josephnexus what's the best way to free up things from my rootfs?" that is actually the question i probably should have asked in the first place	22:14
josephnexus	any good answer?	22:14
an0therb0x	anonuk: sounds like i am going to have to send it back to nokia ... that sucks	22:14
lcuk	so dig into the hd_launcher_page_transition_stop method and see what it does	22:14
lcuk	frals, :O	22:15
frals	any ideas how to debug it?	22:15
anonuk	can anyone give me a pointer how to get my maemo hildonized again? im getting everything in grey and unhildonized after upgrading	22:15
frals	needless to say, the display is pretty fubar	22:15
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer		22:15
josephnexus	i've got 43.77 available, need to free up a smidgen more	22:16
josephnexus	any ideas?	22:16
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA and fiasco shipping, http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space http://wiki.maemo.org/OTA_to_PR1.1_troubleshooting#Not_Enough_Free_Space http://"		22:16
josephnexus	yay for the wiki	22:16
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FIQ	too long topic	22:17
Ikarus	PR 1.2 is RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin right ?	22:17
frals	lcuk: any ideas or should i just reboot and pray? ;)	22:17
bennypr0fane	josephnexus for the last update, i uninstalled some apps from devel and rebooted	22:17
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bennypr0fane	the worked nicely	22:17
lcuk	frals, was this during the upgrade? or had you already done that earlier	22:17
lcuk	and yes reboot	22:17
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* josephnexus doesn't have any devel apps		22:17
lcuk	theres not much more you can do	22:17
frals	tis was after phone rebooted after upgrading	22:17
*** DocScrutinizer changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo \| http://maemo.org/ \| http://maemo.nokia.com/ \| Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council \| http://mxr.maemo.org/ \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ --- PR1.2 OTA shipping, http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space http://wiki.maemo.org/OTA_to_PR1.1_troubleshooting#Not_Enough_Free_Space ~flashing"		22:18
josephnexus	i'm suspecting an apt-get clean will do the trick	22:18
MohammadAG_	lcuk, so changing it back should stop the transition from being stopped?	22:18
josephnexus	how do I switch to root?	22:18
*** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer		22:18
frals	ok shutting down, was just curious if i could debug it in anyway :)	22:18
DocScrutinizer	root	22:18
lcuk	MohammadAG_, you have to ask why it was changed	22:18
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lcuk	gimme the gitorious commit url	22:18
bennypr0fane	josephnexus sudo gainroot	22:18
DocScrutinizer	josephnexus: though you need to install rootsh first	22:18
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MohammadAG_	lcuk, PR1.2 doesn't scroll through the menu as quick as 1.1.1 for some reason	22:18
josephnexus	it says	22:19
MohammadAG_	lcuk, I used apt-get source hildon-desktop=version	22:19
josephnexus	Enable RD mode if you want to break your device	22:19
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MohammadAG_	install rootsh	22:19
DocScrutinizer	bennypr0fane: that's quite obsolete, 'root' will do	22:19
bennypr0fane	oh, good to know	22:19
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anonuk	if my maemo (1.2) doesnt look hildonized, which packages should i try to reinstall?	22:20
Ikarus	anonuk: try reselectiny your theme	22:20
josephnexus	i have 45 mb free now	22:21
DrGrov	Kind of like using themes from D-Iivil which are not PR 1.2 compatible	22:21
DrGrov	Kind of nice having a few buttons missing here and there :)	22:21
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anonuk	Ikarus: problem is that control panel doesnt have real names for things only pers_ti_personalization and names like that.. is there a manual way?	22:21
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johnsq	Hi	22:21
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anonuk	Ikarus: half upgraded i guess some bits are missing....	22:21
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Ikarus	anonuk: I guess you'll have to reflash to be sure to catch everything	22:22
anonuk	Ikarus: cant reflash, no usb port	22:22
bennypr0fane	DrGrov all the d-themes don't work with pr 1.2?	22:22
anonuk	Ikarus: or id have flashed it already	22:22
LiraNuna	is PR1.2 OTA for US released?	22:22
DrGrov	bennypr0fane, they work but they have something missing like ex. the virtual keyboard the Shift arrow besides z on the left side	22:23
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blizzow	Anyone seeing network errors with MSN and Yahoo IM connections?	22:24
blizzow	I wish I could see more error message than that.	22:24
Ikarus	right, restoring backups	22:24
Ikarus	let's see if that works	22:24
Ikarus	backup application == dumb	22:25
Ikarus	tells me files conflict	22:25
Ikarus	without telling me the name	22:25
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Ikarus	and only offering the options rename and no	22:26
Gadgetoid_iMac	Sheesh, I'm getting spammed with calls from dodgy numbers... need a default-deny call blocking script methinks	22:26
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Ikarus	I can't see which files conflict, etc	22:27
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anonuk	anyone know which packages the original background image and other images like the start button etc are? my n900 starts but has images missing all over the OS	22:28
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Ikarus	anyone know what happens if you hit rename ?	22:29
Ikarus	ie, how can I find the renamed files	22:29
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josephnexus	i'm doing all I can to free up space	22:31
josephnexus	and rootfs is only at 44.1 available	22:31
Arkenoi	oops. ussd widget is now broken - pr1.2 intercepts ussd responses. that sucks!	22:31
pupnik	need an irc plugin for sharing from camera	22:31
Ikarus	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7265 that is :(	22:32
povbot`	Bug 7265: Backup/Restore Version Conflict dialog needs to be more verbose	22:32
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josephnexus	yay, up to 44.2	22:33
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josephnexus	how hard is it just to reflash the device from linux?	22:34
odin_	depends if you have a USB cable :)	22:35
Ikarus	josephnexus: easy :)	22:35
josephnexus	i have the USB cable	22:35
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josephnexus	that's usually how I charge it	22:35
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E0x	meego 1.0 release	22:36
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chadi	Guys. I was playing a movie; I paused for one minute, then clicked pause again, it stopped and said media file not supported. now it doesn't restart and no other video can play. What happened?	22:38
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chadi	That's PR 1.2. Add this to the buglist	22:39
chadi	:/	22:39
chupy35	hello, does someone now how to update to the pr 1.2 over the air?	22:39
josephnexus	the same way you install anything	22:39
josephnexus	if it says something otherwise, you don't have enough space in rootfs	22:39
chupy35	how can i make more space on rootfs¡	22:40
chupy35	?	22:40
thresh	rm -rf /	22:40
thresh	sorry	22:40
Ikarus	...	22:40
* Ikarus thwaps thresh		22:40
chupy35	i am not so stupid	22:40
josephnexus	thresh, not everyone understands that's a job=ke	22:40
thresh	sorry #2	22:41
chupy35	i understand it luckily :)	22:41
josephnexus	i order 10,000 floggings with a wet noodle!	22:41
Rabidus	how much space that needs 'bout @ rootfs	22:41
josephnexus	some say 45	22:41
josephnexus	some say 48	22:41
josephnexus	mb	22:41
* MohammadAG_ votes for a #maemo-flashing/#maemo-pr12 channel		22:42
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* josephnexus votes to end all voting.		22:42
* SpeedEvil flashes the channel.		22:42
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red	Is there any way to force teh tracker to ignore certain folders?	22:43
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SpeedEvil	yes	22:43
red	I don't want my podcasts to appear in the music player since I use gpodder + mplayer to view em	22:43
SpeedEvil	vi ~/.config/tracker/tracker.conf	22:43
SpeedEvil	I've got it ignoring /home/user/data	22:43
Rabidus	i have 56Mb free, and can't update from application manager	22:44
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johnsu01	hm, well, got the update flashed on, but now browser won't start...	22:44
johnsu01	or rather, starts and dies	22:44
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chupy35	i have 711.3 mb for applications and i cant install PR 1.2 over the air	22:46
josephnexus	you have enough space (mine just start with about 48MB) you must have some conflicting software installed	22:46
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marex	hi, makes me curious, can I just apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade the PR1.2 into my N900 ?	22:47
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marex	the built-in app manager tells me to install over PC	22:47
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josephnexus	marex, it lies	22:47
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chupy35	the app manager tells me the same and i have 713 mb free for install apps	22:48
lcuk	chupy35, its rootfs space you need	22:48
josephnexus	open up the terminal	22:48
marex	josephnexus, so dist-upgrade is fine ?	22:48
josephnexus	and run	22:48
josephnexus	df -h /	22:48
lcuk	which i can say for certain is not 713mb	22:48
marex	df -h	22:48
* lcuk wishes it was		22:48
josephnexus	that will tell you how much space is available in the applicable partition	22:48
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marex	josephnexus, I moved the apt-cache, that's fine ... but it won't screw up the system, right ?	22:49
Rabidus	i have 56mb and can't install with application manager :(	22:49
* josephnexus wouldn't suggest changing core settings		22:49
red	Rabidus: have you disabled the testing and devel repositories?	22:49
josephnexus	rabidus, you may have a conflicting app installed	22:49
red	try setting them to disabled + rebooting	22:49
red	should free up some space	22:49
Rabidus	ok, i'll try	22:50
mintux	do we have vlc for maemo ? not play stream it can be install on n900 . I would like to see my move with put subtitle on bottom of it	22:50
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red	mintux: its not finished	22:50
mintux	hmm	22:50
red	but there are source files somewhere	22:50
red	they are working on it	22:50
red	so if u can compile yourself u can give the unfinished one a go	22:50
mintux	kmplayer support subtitle ? I can put subtitle with mplayer but problem is I can stop moviye or pause or forward an backward	22:51
marex	josephnexus, what core settings ... the app manager that's in maemo should be built on top of apt ... so tell me, will dist-upgrade screw the thing ?	22:51
chupy35	how can i free space on rootfs?	22:51
Thomas_Zahreddin	hi, i have a vanilla N810 and the volume is so low - any solution for this? (system and app volume is to the max - still to low)	22:51
lcuk	clean your ears out	22:52
ioeee	80,6mb :D	22:52
lcuk	Thomas_Zahreddin, also, too low at what point, in a specific app, with a specific media file?	22:52
C-S-B	with the patches in the titan kernel, can I assume that except injection, aircrack works?	22:52
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Arkenoi	so we can rearrange application icon positions now, but there are no folders? that sucks, i'm going back to mymenu -- does it work with pr1.2?	22:53
thresh	yes it does	22:53
Rabidus	still application manager whines about pc connection.. :(	22:53
mintux	I plu my n900 to pc but it doesn't mount kust see the icons	22:54
Thomas_Zahreddin	lcuk: ;-) did this without any luck, any app (mplayer, …) any audio file (used different - but did not use mp3gain - what i will definititly) - any other ideas?	22:54
Rabidus	removed unnecessary cataloques and booted	22:54
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lcuk	Rabidus, its not whinging, backup,reflash,restore.	22:54
Rabidus	cable is missing, that's why i'm whining :)	22:55
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lcuk	or have a go at clearing space, but read the topic first it has ideas	22:55
Corsac	grmbl, seems that transfering pcap files makes the wlan0 freezes	22:55
josephnexus	Rabidus, visit me here in southeast idaho, united states, I'll lend you my cable	22:55
josephnexus	:-p	22:55
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mintux	it says device storage in use . but I don't use any file of storage	22:56
Rabidus	ok.. it's about... too far away :)	22:57
Rabidus	nearly other side of world	22:57
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mintux	how can I know what app is using storage	22:57
slonopotamus	mintux: who cares what you use... you device uses it!	22:57
ruskie	hmm interesting... they added a fsck for home	22:57
slonopotamus	mintux: lsof. no idea if it is available in maemo	22:58
Macer	haha	22:58
marex	Rabidus, europe ?	22:58
Rabidus	yeah, finland	22:58
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Macer	uhm	22:58
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marex	Rabidus, try console -- sudo gainroot ... apt-get update ; apt-get dist-upgrade	22:59
Macer	whats with the maemo update needing a windows pc?	22:59
Macer	:)	22:59
ruskie	Macer, it doesn't	22:59
Macer	ruskie: it keeps telling me it does in app manager	22:59
josephnexus	macer, it lies	22:59
ruskie	could also probably use flasher	22:59
marex	heck ... can I do that dist-upgrade or will it fsck it up ?	22:59
microlith	dist-upgrade is probably a bad idea	23:00
ruskie	marex, depends	23:00
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ruskie	for me it fscked up	23:00
Rabidus	what :O	23:00
slonopotamus	Macer: and... it doesn't suggest to download a windows pc?	23:00
xorAxAx	hmmm, which reasons are known why OTA for PR 1.2 fails?	23:00
marex	ruskie, in what way ?	23:00
xorAxAx	i have 53 MB free	23:00
ruskie	I'm currently cleaning up the stuff I don't need	23:00
thresh	xorAxAx: nokia is the main reason	23:00
ruskie	marex, I had customizations	23:00
Rabidus	"you dont have enough free space in /var/cache/apt/archives	23:00
xorAxAx	thresh: yes, that as well	23:00
ruskie	though frankly it shouldn't happen sadly	23:00
microlith	xorAxAx: made any modification to the filesystem layout, full eMMC	23:00
marex	ruskie, I only have stuff from the official feeds and extra	23:00
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xorAxAx	microlith: yes, i did	23:01
marex	ruskie, was it recoverable ?	23:01
microlith	xorAxAx: what'd you do?	23:01
ruskie	marex, not for me... went into a reboot cycle	23:01
Arkenoi	barriosqare does not install anymore -- python2.5-qt4-gui conflict	23:01
xorAxAx	microlith: the ruskie script	23:01
ruskie	had to reflash	23:01
microlith	moved stuff off rootfs?	23:01
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xorAxAx	microlith: yes	23:01
pupnik_	can we fix a 1.2 apt-get upgrade?	23:01
ruskie	xorAxAx, different changes for 1.2	23:01
microlith	yeah, the upgrade process won't like that at all	23:01
ruskie	and apparently some other stuff as well	23:01
xorAxAx	ruskie: well, the OTA doesnt want to run	23:02
marex	ruskie, that can be done over the usual cable supplied with N900, right ...	23:02
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ruskie	marex, yup	23:02
xorAxAx	ruskie: it instructs me to use the flasher	23:02
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marex	ruskie, so no risk of bricking the device ?	23:02
microlith	if you've made changes to your rootfs, yes, use the flasher	23:02
ruskie	xorAxAx, well I used apt-get dist-upgrade	23:02
pupnik_	any luck with that ruskie	23:02
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ruskie	pupnik_, it crapped for some reason	23:02
xorAxAx	ruskie: that activated the watchdogs because an optify-runonce program killed stuff	23:02
mintux	is it possible to select text in pdf reader?	23:02
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arachnist	i updated with the "gui"	23:03
ruskie	for some reason the device started rebooting	23:03
pupnik_	here i kept deleting stuff and resuming install	23:03
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ruskie	ehh I just reflashed rootfs and am currently purging all the crap on my removelist	23:03
xorAxAx	ruskie: so dist-upgrade isnt safe?	23:03
ruskie	xorAxAx, apparently not	23:03
microlith	I do like that my rootfs now has more than 50% free	23:03
ruskie	I'd really like for dist-upgrade to actually work	23:03
pupnik_	same	23:03
ruskie	but I'm amazed that there's a fsck for /home now	23:04
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ruskie	though apparently it'll only get run on massive failures	23:04
ruskie	i.e. fs mounted as ro	23:04
marex	ruskie, what modifications have you had ?	23:04
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ruskie	marex, init script changes... emmc is spread out to: /home /home/user/MyDocs /opt and swap	23:05
* RST38h moos evilly		23:05
* pupnik_ decides to avoid reboot for a few weeks		23:06
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marex	ruskie, so you changed fstab	23:07
marex	?	23:07
ruskie	marex, yup	23:07
ruskie	marex, you can see most of the changes on User:Ruskie wiki page	23:07
marex	ruskie, wasn't that the case why it crapped /	23:07
marex	?	23:07
ruskie	marex, it shouldn't	23:07
* josephnexus needs faster internet		23:07
josephnexus	on have 1.5mbps here	23:07
josephnexus	er... only have	23:07
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ruskie	marex, it should stop the update and allow me to diff changes and select which ones I want	23:08
lbt	My OTA worked fine with 41.5Mb free .... just FYI	23:08
marex	josephnexus, 10gbps here :b	23:08
ruskie	you know... like normal distros	23:08
josephnexus	marex, share the wealth dude	23:08
marex	ruskie, like normal dpkg ... yea	23:08
josephnexus	:-p	23:08
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josephnexus	ur sucking up all of the internets	23:08
josephnexus	:-P	23:08
* frals throws a whale in MohammadAGs general direction		23:08
ruskie	marex, sadly in my case something triggered a reboot before that happened	23:08
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ruskie	and crap ensued	23:08
marex	josephnexus, don't worry, that's only on the server in the basement	23:08
ruskie	UPDATES SHOULD NEVER TRIGGER REBOOTS	23:08
marex	oh jeez	23:09
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marex	what the heck :-/	23:09
ruskie	atleast not without user permission	23:09
marex	ruskie, right	23:09
Rabidus	hey, is it safe to link a cache to somewhere else?	23:09
ruskie	should be	23:09
marex	Rabidus, should be fine	23:09
Rabidus	should :)	23:10
Rabidus	sounds promising :)	23:10
marex	Rabidus, you can adjust the apt config	23:10
slonopotamus	ruskie: they also should not trigger disabling wifi and locking screen. but who listens?	23:10
ruskie	Rabidus, search apt-get howto change cache location	23:10
ruskie	slonopotamus, don't forget 3g	23:10
Rabidus	yeah, i know how to change	23:10
Macer	ok	23:10
Rabidus	i was just thinking is it safe	23:10
ruskie	Rabidus, I meant without symlinking :)	23:10
Macer	im all ears	23:10
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Macer	can i dist update this to work without the windows pc?	23:10
Rabidus	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=511870	23:10
Rabidus	i was looking this thread	23:11
Stskeeps	Macer: use the application manager	23:11
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Rabidus	user "b666m"	23:11
Stskeeps	if you can't, something's wrong with your setup	23:11
asj_	bugger, Nokia messaging has stopped working	23:11
Macer	Stskeeps: it keeps telling me i need a pc and to connect the usb	23:11
mintux	it'sintresting nothing use my storage but it said device is busy . I got lsof also	23:11
Macer	wtf?	23:11
Macer	:)	23:11
Macer	and my only option is to create a backup	23:11
Stskeeps	Macer: hrm, ok. what previous version were you on?	23:11
Macer	you mean still on? :) one sec..	23:12
ruskie	Rabidus, I have a /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/02cache with: Dir::Cache::archives "/home/user/MyDocs/.apt-archive-cache/";	23:12
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Macer	3.2010.02-8.002	23:13
Macer	that is what i am using now	23:13
* Arkenoi bets next ota won't go smooth either		23:13
anonuk	sorry to repeat but can anyone tell me how i can get icons back, all my icons and graphics disappeared after updating to 1.2 . cant find which package they are in.....	23:13
ruskie	anonuk, you mean you get squares instead of text and widgets etc?	23:14
frals	Macer: do you get the details for the update? it should list whats conflicting there	23:14
MohammadAG_	anonuk, I'm assuming the image worked?	23:14
anonuk	ruskie: pink squares and blue squares. and some "missing image" images on bootup	23:14
MohammadAG_	sorry haven't been to my other PC	23:14
anonuk	MohammadAG: i managed to chroot with mer	23:14
ruskie	anonuk, hmm sounds like /opt is missing	23:14
ruskie	can you check	23:15
MohammadAG_	heh	23:15
anonuk	MohammadAG: took ages but now im missing all the graphics in maemo	23:15
MohammadAG_	anonuk, graphics?	23:15
anonuk	MohammadAG: and also the icons and hildon theme	23:15
ruskie	yeah that's /opt	23:15
frals	MohammadAG_: bah, thought you were on the other client, you have pm there!	23:15
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anonuk	pink squares and 'missing image' icons everywhere	23:15
MohammadAG_	frals, paste again :P	23:15
anonuk	ruskie: how do i check /opt	23:15
frals	and now you have it on both!	23:15
ruskie	some stuff gets moved to /opt with the update	23:15
anonuk	ruskie: and where should i mount it to?	23:15
anonuk	ruskie: i mean what do i mount? MyDocs/opt?	23:16
anonuk	is there a way to manually copy stuff to there or reset it? cant flash no usb port	23:16
ruskie	/home/opt is where it should exist primarily and be bind mounted to /opt	23:16
Macer	This Maemo update requires the Nokia software update application...	23:16
Macer	wtf?	23:16
Stskeeps	or flasher	23:17
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Macer	so i will have to manually download an image and flash it.	23:17
Macer	?	23:17
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Stskeeps	right	23:17
Macer	update fail	23:17
Stskeeps	or NSU handles it	23:17
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* Macer adds this to the no list next to "portrait"		23:18
Macer	:)	23:18
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Scelt	Macer: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53626	23:19
anonuk	ruskie: sorry irc client was acting up... is there a way to reset/copy over the icons and images into /opt	23:19
ruskie	/home/opt is where it should exist primarily and be bind mounted to /opt	23:19
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anonuk	it is	23:20
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anonuk	but somehow still not finding the icons/images	23:20
MarLawN	hello everyone	23:20
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anonuk	wondering how i can reinstall them manually (or by force)	23:20
MarLawN	flashing fest today ? :)	23:20
ruskie	anonuk, and I take it you tried rebooting?	23:20
Macer	Scelt: oh i am sure i can figure out how to do it and get it going	23:20
anonuk	ruskie: yep	23:20
Macer	but it is still fail heh	23:20
anonuk	ruskie: and reinstalling all the packages in the apt archive	23:20
anonuk	ruskie: from the update	23:21
Macer	not really an end user device for the masses it seems	23:21
anonuk	ruskie: and flashing is not an option on this machine	23:21
Aranel	I've moved the locale-archive to /home/ and symlinked it, but I still have the same rootfs space. How its possible?	23:21
ruskie	Aranel, iirc ubifs does some compression as well	23:22
Macer	i honestly shouldnt have to go through all these steps for an ota update :)	23:22
slonopotamus	arachnist: /home is on rootfs, surprise :)	23:22
microlith	wow	23:22
* xorAxAx straces apt-worker		23:22
microlith	the calculator breaks in spectacular fashion when put into portait mode	23:22
MarLawN	well I don't see why I should lose all my data cause I'm reinstalling the OS - I always put home on a different partition	23:23
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* slonopotamus straces strace		23:23
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timeless_mbp	slonopotamus: eep, why?	23:23
Macer	freeing up rootfs.. using a pc... manually downloading an image? seriously? just for a phone update. put one in the android column for and v maemo	23:23
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slonopotamus	timeless_mbp: because i can!	23:23
Macer	:)	23:23
Aranel	slonopotamus: really? /home/ is rootfs, too?	23:23
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slonopotamus	arachnist: df -h will tell you everything you want to know about partition layout :)	23:24
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ruskie	slonopotamus, having completion issues?	23:24
arachnist	slonopotamus: it didn't change here	23:24
slonopotamus	hmm	23:24
Macer	anyways. have to get my son.. i will do this lame ass windows pc required update or flashing manually update later i suppose	23:25
slonopotamus	ruskie: kinda	23:25
slonopotamus	Aranel: okay, i was wrong :)	23:25
arachnist	as in, my ~/ is still on a 2G partition	23:25
Aranel	slonopotamus: so where do I have to move it? /home/opt?	23:25
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ruskie	/dev/mmcblk0p2 20.2G /home /dev/mmcblk0p4 3.6G /home/opt /dev/mmcblk0p1 4.8G /home/user/MyDocs	23:26
Aranel	hmm. so It doesnt explain why I didnt gain even a little free space after moving :/	23:26
MarLawN	I was looking in the documentation about flashing and holding the 'u' key but I can't find out why and I can still flash without holding - do you know what does it actually do ? i.e. Press and hold down the 'u' key but no reason	23:26
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ruskie	for me this works well ;)	23:26
ruskie	MarLawN, it can be needed at times to get the device into the right usb mode	23:26
slonopotamus	Aranel: apt-get purge python2.5-minimal :)	23:26
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slonopotamus	Aranel: i managed to free 30 megs that way here	23:26
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slonopotamus	Aranel: you can reinstall removed apps after upgrade	23:27
anonuk	ruskie: no ideas what package those icons and images are in?	23:27
Aranel	slonopotamus: isnt is dangerous to purge python2.5?	23:27
ruskie	anonuk, lemme find it out	23:27
MarLawN	ruskie, this at times seems very ugly to me. Anyway, thanks. I've installed yesterday the leaked version, and then debian - going to do it again tonight with the UK version - btw, any particular difference in the various builds ?	23:27
slonopotamus	Aranel: no, it isn't bundled with os	23:28
anonuk	ruskie: thx	23:28
ruskie	anonuk, hildon-theme-alpha and hildon-theme-beta	23:28
ruskie	anonuk, try that	23:28
slonopotamus	Aranel: however it is very likely that some of apps you installed need it (and so they will be removed too)	23:28
Rinsmaster	I have a quick question: I'm trying to update to PR1.2, and the update manager says I have to launch the "Nokia software update application" on my computer. Do they mean the flasher with that? Does that mean I'll lose my data if I don't back-up?	23:28
xorAxAx	yes, yes	23:29
ruskie	Rinsmaster, the data should be on the eMMC and the flasher will only touch the rootfs	23:29
MarLawN	Rinsmaster, I backed all up but I flashed and it was all there, just some settings gone	23:29
Rinsmaster	Oh, great, thanks guys!	23:29
johnsu01	Rinsmaster: I just had that as well, and I'm pretty sure it was just because I lacked space on rootfs	23:29
MarLawN	I suggest you backup anyway	23:29
anonuk	ruskie: done that already, didnt work	23:29
johnsu01	Rinsmaster: but anyway I ran a backup, then used the flasher	23:29
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ruskie	anonuk, that's really the only thing...	23:29
johnsu01	Rinsmaster: then restored the backup, and all seems good	23:29
Rinsmaster	I will definately back-up, I was just wondering :)	23:29
ruskie	anonuk, not sure about anything else	23:29
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MarLawN	Rinsmaster, what version are you installing ? USA ? UK ?	23:30
Rinsmaster	MarLawN, Not sure? I'm in the Netherlands	23:30
Rinsmaster	Global I guess?	23:30
marex	ruskie, doing dist-upgrade ... we'll see	23:30
MarLawN	I guess since you've got it in the update that it would be the you bought it from	23:30
anonuk	ruskie: surely those icons and things must be in one of the packages?	23:30
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Rinsmaster	Or can I choose?	23:30
MarLawN	from the site you can choose, from the mobile I don't know	23:30
MarLawN	I flashed it	23:30
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ruskie	anonuk, I'm guessing something is bad with the optification	23:31
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Aranel	slonopotamus: ok, doing it now.. prays	23:31
anonuk	anonuk: yes thats probably it, but is there a way to trace it and fix it	23:31
Rinsmaster	MarLawN, oh, so it can be done without a computer too?	23:31
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Aranel	slonopotamus: I'm running remove instead of purge, any difference?	23:31
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slonopotamus	Aranel: almost none :)	23:31
valdyn	Aranel: purge removes configuration aswell	23:31
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slonopotamus	Aranel: you'd better read what it is removing so you know what apps you installed got eradicated	23:32
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Aranel	slonopotamus: already did that, noted them =)	23:33
slonopotamus	k	23:33
slonopotamus	Aranel: tell us how much space you get :)	23:33
* slonopotamus wonders why maemo pulls in qt		23:34
Rinsmaster	Also, guys, what does "OTA" mean? I can't find it anywhere, I feel such a noob... :/	23:35
ruskie	slonopotamus, because it's now part of the basesystem	23:35
ruskie	Rinsmaster, Over The Air	23:35
josephnexus	OTA = over the air	23:35
slonopotamus	ruskie: but why? base system has no apps using it	23:35
marex	slonopotamus, to pull in developers ;-)	23:35
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ruskie	slonopotamus, the next one will have it as the primary toolkit	23:35
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* josephnexus crosses his fingers as his phone finishes installing and is now installing the maemo update		23:35
slonopotamus	ruskie: sooo?	23:36
Aranel	0_0	23:36
Aranel	I didnt get any free space	23:36
Aranel	I lost 3 megabytes.	23:36
slonopotamus	marex: it could happily sit in repo, like python does	23:36
josephnexus	finishes downloading	23:36
Aranel	how it can be possible??	23:36
slonopotamus	Aranel: how you're checking it? df -h / ?	23:36
Aranel	df -h	23:36
joga	Aranel: did you remove the pkgcache thingy?	23:36
joga	(it regenerated it?)	23:37
Aranel	Available 29.7	23:37
Rinsmaster	ruskie, oh, so I _can_ update it without the flasher? My update manager says I have to use a computer..	23:37
slonopotamus	Aranel: and what it says for / ?	23:37
Aranel	pkgcache thing?	23:37
joga	Aranel: in /var/cache/apt	23:37
Aranel	29.8M	23:37
slonopotamus	Aranel: did apt-get clean already?	23:37
Aranel	no I did not remove pkgcache	23:37
joga	Aranel: referring to (2013 Aranel) is it ok to remove /var/cache/apt/*.bin ? they took 3.9 megabytes.	23:37
slonopotamus	(you can't lose space by deinstalling stuff)	23:37
joga	ok	23:38
joga	sure you can if something uses it while doing the uninstall ;)	23:38
Aranel	did apt-get clean	23:38
joga	or, it's reporting it falsely	23:38
joga	tried rebooting?	23:38
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Aranel	still 29.8	23:38
slonopotamus	(we're not in windows)	23:38
emillo	hi all I have updated the firmware but now the image in "mirror " is very dark almost black	23:38
slonopotamus	emillo: mirror is broken	23:38
Aranel	it should be a curse.	23:38
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emillo	yesterday it was working	23:39
dmj726	how is mirror broken?	23:39
Aranel	I really cant understand how can I lose space when I remove lots of package.	23:39
joga	emillo: now it has better image quality	23:39
slonopotamus	emillo: i got much worse picture with it than with other things using front camera	23:39
Aranel	how can I run fsck on n900?	23:39
joga	even though it's unusably dark and grey	23:39
dmj726	slonopotamus: what other things used the front camera?	23:39
timeless_mbp	Aranel: why?	23:39
joga	maybe in direct sunlight it's okayish	23:39
timeless_mbp	you'd run it as root from a shell	23:39
timeless_mbp	just like you would anywhere else...	23:39
dmj726	...mirror also gets bad picture quality with the back camera for some reason.	23:40
Aranel	timeless_mbp: I've lost space after uninstalling lots of stuff -including python2.5-	23:40
joga	but the quality has significantly become better I think :)	23:40
timeless_mbp	Aranel: did you reboot?	23:40
slonopotamus	dmj726: you can convince mplayer to play what front camera sees. don't remember exact command.	23:40
timeless_mbp	Aranel: running fsck isn't going to give you space	23:40
joga	Aranel: have you rebooted?	23:40
Aranel	timeless_mbp: now I did and regained some of the space. 42.0M =)	23:40
joga	:)	23:40
Aranel	damn, it was really weird.	23:41
joga	it's not really, that's how it kinda works	23:41
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joga	if something still has the old stuff in memory, it won't be 'really' gone until the process stops	23:41
Aranel	timeless_mbp: doing regular filesystem checks is a old habit, comes from Win98 :P It also worked on some cases on ext3. If your filesystem fills up even if you remove something, it is good to check.	23:42
emillo	joga: so it's a regression or a new feature?	23:42
slonopotamus	dmj726: and the fact that pr1.2 ships video skype and gtalk makes me think that they managed to make front camera produce usable picture	23:42
joga	emillo: I suspect it's mirror's problem, but the camera has gotten better, but I haven't yet tried anything but mirror with it	23:42
Aranel	now I have 42.0M, can I upgrade to PR1.2? I'm trying to do it for hours :/	23:42
marex	ruskie, did the dist-upgrade finish for you ?	23:42
emillo	joga: I tried skype and was dark as well	23:42
marex	ruskie, or it rebooted in the middle	23:42
slonopotamus	Aranel: try :)	23:42
ruskie	marex, no clue... when I checked on it it was rebooting	23:42
dmj726	...take a look at what mirror produces for /dev/video0 and you'll see	23:42
timeless_mbp	Aranel: that's not how this file system works	23:42
joga	emillo: heh, turn on flashlight and reflect it with a paper or something	23:42
ruskie	so I'm assuming in the middle	23:42
joga	;)	23:43
timeless_mbp	here it's garbage collected	23:43
marex	ruskie, d-u still in progress	23:43
Rinsmaster	Can anyone tell me why I can't do an OTA update? Updating the "Maemo 5" package tells me I have to use the flasher on a computer..	23:43
ruskie	Rinsmaster, out of space?	23:43
joga	out of internets?	23:43
lcuk	see the channel topic	23:43
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slonopotamus	Rinsmaster: didn't pay checks?	23:44
DocScrutinizer51	Rinsmaster: see /topic	23:44
Rinsmaster	WiFi is connected, and I have about 30M free on rootfs	23:44
slonopotamus	Rinsmaster: make it more about 40mb	23:44
noobmonk3y	could i ask a favour of some lovely people in here please :D - in about 5 mins (New version of healthcheck will be in extras devel), want a few people with different firmware variants (PR1.2) to update and check what comes out in the firmware version pleeeeease. IE usa variant should say ... PR1.2 - USA Version	23:44
Rinsmaster	oh, I'll flash it then	23:44
Rinsmaster	thanks	23:44
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Aranel	slonopotamus: It seems I still can't.	23:45
lcuk	noobmonk3y, hardware revision?	23:45
noobmonk3y	wohooo healthcheck update in devel if anyone is able to help me out - muchos appreciation	23:45
noobmonk3y	lcuk, firmware revision	23:45
Aranel	slonopotamus: any good libraries to remove? :P	23:45
noobmonk3y	and goooood evening :)	23:46
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lcuk	Aranel, i believe i have already backed up, downloaded pr1.2, installed it, restored apps and am now onto getting changes for a later PR in place whilst you are still not giving up with finding a way round it	23:47
lcuk	how much space have you got now?	23:47
Aranel	42.0	23:47
Aranel	after removing the python.	23:47
noobmonk3y	'the python' w000p	23:47
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noobmonk3y	the freeing up rootfs guide on the wiki is the way - ie sorting the downloads location archive bit out works fine	23:48
lcuk	you are aware that this method you are wiping out stuff via may still not be enough	23:48
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slonopotamus	Aranel: fire up app manager, open removal list, sort by size and see what's on top :)	23:48
pupnik_	how can i remove unneeded l10n-*	23:48
noobmonk3y	lol	23:48
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slonopotamus	Aranel: fmradioplayer freed about 3 megs	23:48
noobmonk3y	soooo... any lovely healthcheck testers? :D	23:49
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slonopotamus	Aranel: fbreader is smth like that too	23:49
MohammadAG_	oh look, there's a monkey on the channel	23:49
Aranel	It seems like I'll even remove the linux kernel and updater will still not be happy :\|	23:49
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noobmonk3y	lol	23:50
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noobmonk3y	he Mo ;)	23:50
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noobmonk3y	hey*	23:50
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noobmonk3y	he-mo the offspring of he man and mo-mowlam?	23:50
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ruskie	wtf	23:50
noobmonk3y	chadi, evening	23:50
ruskie	Could not resolve 'repository.maemo.org'	23:50
Aranel	lcuk: why do you think that it may still not be enough? Isnt 45.0~ ok for update?	23:50
noobmonk3y	frals, evening	23:50
frals	evening noobmonk3y o/	23:50
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noobmonk3y	Aranel, seems to be random atm somewhere between 43 and 60 does it	23:51
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GAN900	sp3000, thanks for being quick on the bug response.	23:51
noobmonk3y	flashing is just so much easier then faffing lol	23:51
Aranel	60.	23:51
Aranel	60.	23:51
Aranel	60?	23:51
frals	bah should head to bed soon, wouldve wanted to fix fmms a bit :(	23:51
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noobmonk3y	awwwwww	23:51
frals	what you upto noobmonk3y?	23:51
noobmonk3y	just fixing baby bugs in h/c	23:51
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lcuk	:(	23:51
noobmonk3y	and erm preparing for my travels	23:52
* noobmonk3y is gonna be 1/2 way towards lcuk by saturday lol		23:52
frals	where you going? :)	23:52
strohi	it is possible to resize the / partition?	23:52
* lcuk is gonna be in dorset on monday		23:52
noobmonk3y	borrowing my bros funky ickle sporty car and visiting mates on my way to my best mates 30th - go karting wooooop	23:52
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* frals have no idea where hes going to be on monday		23:52
ruskie	strohi, reduce it that's all	23:52
lcuk	and tue,wed,thu,fri	23:52
lcuk	no internet	23:52
noobmonk3y	i'll be back in worthing on monday lol	23:52
lcuk	a full itiniary	23:52
frals	no internet for a week? wow!	23:53
strohi	ruskie, the partition? i think maximize would be better	23:53
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lcuk	frals sure	23:53
ruskie	strohi, it's 256 flash on the chip	23:53
noobmonk3y	frals, very doable when you spend all day on a pc	23:53
lcuk	i rarely use internet when i travel	23:53
strohi	hm k	23:53
lcuk	but with family its even less	23:53
slonopotamus	Aranel: i have 80 free after updating to pr1.2 :)	23:53
noobmonk3y	had no pc at home most of last year	23:53
ruskie	strohi, the rest of the storage is an internal MMC	23:53
MohammadAG_	<frals> no internet for a week? wow!	23:53
MohammadAG_	Bad Sulzangen (?) wasn't any better	23:53
lcuk	slonopotamus, 80 is reasonable, its over 100mb for a clean flash	23:53
strohi	ruskie, i can't upgrade using the update manager .. oh i didn't know that	23:53
frals	i knew you were isolated on your little island but bloody hell i expected there to be some kind of network built ;)	23:54
lcuk	frals, its purely functional	23:54
frals	:)	23:54
Aranel	slonopotamus: removed fbreader. fmradioplayer is not installed.	23:54
noobmonk3y	lol frals	23:54
lcuk	i just dont see why i travel XYZ miles to sit on bum infront of a screen	23:54
Shapeshifter	Has someone written a tool to pre-render and scale map data for maep, mapper etc.?	23:54
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slonopotamus	Aranel: how much? :)	23:55
* noobmonk3y whinges		23:55
MohammadAG_	yeah lcuk there's VNC for that	23:55
Shapeshifter	like, so that someone can let the whole of europe through to be cached so that it's available "offline"?	23:55
noobmonk3y	i want healthcheck testers lol....	23:55
Aranel	slonopotamus: cant say before reboot :\| It doesnt give me any free space. weird.	23:55
* noobmonk3y goes and storms tmo..... gotta be some bored trolls		23:55
frals	lcuk: good point, i however dont need to sit infront of a screen the whole time even though i do have net access ;)	23:55
MohammadAG_	he wants a healthcheck for healthcheck	23:55
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* noobmonk3y thinks Mo is talking the truth, innit		23:55
lcuk	frals i have phone with me and that has emergency access and i can keep updated in read only mode if required	23:56
joga	Aranel: you've checked that there's nothing big in /home/user or so?	23:56
MohammadAG_	nah, I was just pointing out the obvious irony	23:56
lcuk	ie n900 awesomeness :D	23:56
Aranel	joga: isnt /home/user is another partition? apart from rootfs?	23:56
MohammadAG_	lol [extras-builds] [fremantle]: grr 0.0.4 FAILED Maemo Extras Builder	23:56
* noobmonk3y will be honing his go-karting skills in a fiesta RS w0000p		23:56
Zucca	Aye!	23:56
joga	Aranel: /home/user/MyDocs is	23:57
noobmonk3y	no phone for much of this wkend :P	23:57
joga	/home/user is still on rootfs	23:57
frals	lcuk: if you got your n900 with network access you cant claim to be going off without net :D	23:57
Zucca	Now Maemo 5 terminal works with tmux. \o/	23:57
joga	oh, no sorry, it isn't	23:57
joga	missed one line in mount that says /home	23:57
ruskie	hmm how can one specify a specific version of a packaget to install using apt-get ?	23:57
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frals	package=version?	23:57
lcuk	frals, indeed i can	23:57
lcuk	phone is phone	23:57
joga	but mydocs and home are on separate partitions	23:58
lcuk	i will not be sat here like htis	23:58
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frals	fair enough	23:58
marex	ruskie, ok, reboot	23:58
marex	ruskie, but dist-upgrade finished	23:58
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strohi	the only way to upgrade is to flash the device?	23:58
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joga	strohi, I did it OTA	23:59
marex	ruskie, I see NOKIA logo and a progress bar	23:59
josephnexus	marex, it's updating	23:59
marex	updating what ?	23:59
josephnexus	your OS	23:59

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