IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2010-03-24

brodyand type?00:00
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alteregojoker_891: wrong channel00:00
C-S-B-N900err... thats the chipset....i think.00:00
C-S-B-N900try lspci.00:00
joker_891i see00:01
brodywhen i run airmon-ng it says chipset: "unknown"00:01
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C-S-B-N900there is nio lspci. ignore me.00:01
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yigalmodified cellwriter on the n900?00:02
C-S-B-N900wl12xx is the chipset.00:02
yigalsimilar to n8x0 functionality but it actually works nicely00:02
brodyyeah, but wl12xx doesn't work...00:03
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C-S-B-N900why is there lsusb but not lspci?00:03
yigalthat is funny00:04
C-S-B-N900where can i list the hw?00:04
microlithC-S-B-N900: because there is no PCI/PCIe bus in the N90000:04
alteregoC-S-B-N900: there's a simple aznswer to that, there is no pci interface00:04
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alteregoPeople need to stop taking the "mobile computer" label too literally ^.^ or, expand their perception of computing ..00:05
Milo-has anyone figured out how to make an alarm to go off 2 hours before event?00:05
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Milo-(n900's default calendar)00:05
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C-S-B-N900alterego: i am retarded. Ill think next time...00:06
alteregoC-S-B-N900: :)00:06
microliththere is a utility called lshw,but it is not present on the N90000:07
C-S-B-N900yeah i tried that.00:07
microlithmost of the N900's hardware isn't attached over any real BUS, so much as via direct connections to the CPU00:08
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microlithor to the handful of (I'm guessing) nokia-proprietary chips (gaia, some other.)00:09
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acidjazzdregin: ive been in here00:10
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lcukcehteh, :) hand drawn strokes are important to me00:12
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ds3hmm anyone else finding the N900 to be a mixed bag?00:23
Shapeshifterds3: everyone00:23
Ken-Youngds3 I'm very happy with it.00:24
dmj726_n900mixed bag of awesome00:24
alteregoMixed bag of awesome and more awesome :)00:24
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SpeedEvilds3: I have very few issues with it.00:25
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ds3SpeedEvil: so you are not seeing regressions relative to the N800?00:26
dmj726_n900most deficiencies are niggling issues with nokia's binaries00:27
ds3claws is not very usable on the 900 :(00:27
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ds3garnet vm is broq on the 90000:27
SpeedEvilds3: mail me a n800 to try00:27
ds3SpeedEvil: oh... you weren't an upgrader?00:27
SpeedEvilWell - yes.00:27
SpeedEvilFrom a 331000:27
ds3for the few apps that it came with, the N900 is the screen but the way it interacts with older apps is irritating/unusable00:28
SpeedEvilWhat do you mean?00:28
SpeedEvilThe fact that the window manager isn't really functional if the app is fullscreen, and there isn't a way back00:29
ds3take claws for example... if you ask it for a network log, it gives you a solid window with almost no way to get out00:29
ds3my hack righ tnow is to open the camera door, and use the camera app as a way to get back and switch around00:29
dmj726_n900ctrl bksp?00:30
SpeedEvilds3: camkeyd00:30
ds3SPeedEvil: is that a software package or?00:30
SpeedEvilds3: a half-press on the cam button takes up to the ass-switcher00:30
V13control - backspace00:30
alteregoSpeedEvil: CTRL+BACKSPACE00:30
dmj726_n900ctrl+backspace is easy00:30
ds3dmj726_n900: that means popping out the keyboard00:30
SpeedEvilor ctrl-backspace if you have hte keyboard open.00:30
dmj726_n900brings you to the dashboard00:30
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ds3I prefer to not have a keyboard (remember, I said N800...not N810)00:31
ds3let me find camkey in the app manager00:31
SpeedEvilerr - yes - I meant dashboard00:31
SpeedEvilnot app switcher00:31
dmj726_n900I like my keyboard.00:31
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alteregoI found that the camkey daemon was a pain in the ass.00:31
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SpeedEvilalterego: why?00:32
alteregoIt went all crapo when using the camera.00:32
SpeedEvilworks for me.00:32
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SpeedEvilNo issues at all00:32
ds3I don't like holding it with the keyboard open00:32
SpeedEvilWell - unless you press the button too hard - but I nevber found that an issue00:32
alteregoMight be because I didn't realise it was a half press, so it openned the camera app actually ;)00:32
ds3the charger cable gets in the way00:33
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alteregoMight download it again and use it with my new found knowledge ;)00:33
SpeedEvilWho would be interested in a right-angle USB - with the USB protruding maybe 5mm?00:33
SpeedEvilFor $1500:33
javispedroUSB host?00:33
SpeedEviljavispedro: no00:34
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SpeedEviljavispedro: just a regular USB cable.00:34
alteregoSpeedEvil: sounds good.00:34
SpeedEviljavispedro: but that doesn't get in the way when using while charging00:34
ds3SpeedEvil: rt angle which way?00:34
SpeedEvilds3: I was thinking towards the lanyard hole.00:34
ds3oh along the long direction00:35
alteregoYeah, down whilst holding it in portrait face towards you would be good.l00:35
ds3SpeedEvil: what about a J peice that folds on to the back?00:35
ds3instead of just a single rt angle, it'd flex00:35
SpeedEvilds3: hmm00:35
alteregods3: would be annoying.00:35
SpeedEvilds3: interesting idea - I need to do some more working out of possibilities.00:36
ds3alterego: I have the full size USB version and it is quite useful00:36
alteregoIf the cable flowed down the side it wouldn't get in the way and it'd feel pretty sturdy I reckon.00:36
ds3SpeedEvil: have you seen the full size USB one?00:36
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SpeedEvilds3: ?00:36
ds3oh the battery life is also another irritating factor :?00:36
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ds3SpeedEvil: let me find a picture00:37
alteregoRecently I've not found the battery life that bad, I think it's because I've gotten over the itch to be constantly playing with it all day.00:37
C-S-B-N900i have not.00:37
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ds3I am not playing with it all day00:38
C-S-B-N900im on my 3rd unit and so happy its all working!00:38
C-S-B-N900ds3 you must have a gf.00:38
SpeedEvilC-S-B: :)00:38
ds3C-S-B-N900: :P00:38
ds3like that but for MicroUSB00:39
SpeedEvilds3: way too complex mechanically. I think I can do right-angle.00:40
sevardwhy would you wan tthat crap?00:40
ds3I would like to have 1.5-2 full days of power with the unit sitting in my pocket00:40
ds3right now, I barely get 12-14 hours00:40
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alteregoDoes anyone else find all the D-THEME entries annoying?00:40
ds3SpeedEvil: but those things are handy00:41
SpeedEvilalterego: yes00:41
alteregoI think themes shouldn't be allowed in the _application_ manager00:41
microliththey should have their own category00:41
jacekowskibtw. i have problem upgrading00:41
SpeedEvilds3: indeed. I can't make and sell itm and make it reliable however.00:41
jacekowskii get space error00:41
ds3SpeedEvil: oh you are making htem...thought you found a source to import00:41
alteregoI don't think they should be in there at all, there should be a theme downloader. Themes shouldn't adhere to the same rules as software.00:42
SpeedEvilds3: pondering00:42
nidOthere badly needs to be a theme category, at the moment theyre spread all over the place00:42
sevardyou rich people and your n900s00:42
ds3SpeedEvil: in that case, can you make it flimsy enough so it breaks instead of the jack?00:42
microlithrich nothing00:42
alteregoI think I'd be less bothered if all the theme entires had decent previews :)00:42
nidOalterego that'd be very complex to implement though. just adding a new category for themes would be infinitely easier and more realistic00:42
SpeedEvilsevard: I've currently got teh heating off - it's however a balmy 10.5C in here.00:43
alteregonidO: infinnitely complex to who?00:43
SpeedEvilsevard: It's been 5 a month ago.00:43
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microlithalterego: if I install anything on my system, I want the package manager to do it00:43
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microliththat's what it is there for00:43
alteregoIt'd be piss easy to write a theme installer ..00:43
nidOso write one00:43
sevard10.5 c is like 50 F00:43
sevardmy house is 40F always00:43
nidOand submit it00:43
sevardthat's 4.44 c00:43
sevardi don't know why you'd want it any hotter.00:43
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nidOwe arent all polar bears?00:44
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SpeedEvilPersonally, I'd like ~18.00:44
sevardyou're killing me00:44
jacekowskii keep it at around 20C during day when i'm at home00:44
jacekowskiand little bit lower at night00:44
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sevard20 c!00:44
crashanddiesevard: I call BS00:44
sevardno wonder we have an energy crysis.00:44
yigalcan maemo mapper search for street addresses or just gps locations - n800 question00:44
jacekowskisevard: i have gas heating00:45
nidOmy apartment's about 20c during the day00:45
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nidOi moved in last july00:45
nidOin total my heating has run precisely never00:45
crashanddiesevard: nobody can live in 4C day-in day-out00:45
ds3speaking of maps, is there a way to get the map app to save the settings?00:45
nidOthats energy conservation.00:45
sevardcrashanddie: wtf.  come over here and look at my thermostat.00:45
crashanddiesevard: even prisons are at 19C minimum00:45
jacekowskicrashanddie: to warm for them00:45
sevardprisoners also get three squares00:45
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nidOsevard thermostats dont even go down to 4c so what good would looking at it do?00:45
sevardhow many complete meals did you have today?00:46
jacekowskicrashanddie: criminals don't deserve that00:46
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crashanddiesevard: my flat is at 32 at the moment :)00:46
V13jacekowski: prisons are not for torturing...00:46
SpeedEvilcrashanddie: K?00:46
sevard32c or f00:46
crashanddiejacekowski: sure they do, they're humans. They have done stupid or misinformed stuff, doesn't mean we are entitled to make them suffer needlessly00:46
crashanddiesevard: 32C :)00:46
sevardthat's the problem here00:46
lcuk19deg is suffering to some people00:46
sevardyou think you live in the tropics.00:46
lcuksame as 32 is to others00:47
crashanddiesevard: I live in the tropics you numbnuts00:47
lcuksome folks are happy sitting in living room being able to see their breath00:47
jacekowskicrashanddie: no00:47
crashanddiesevard: there's no heating on, if anything, it's airconditioning that I'm abusing00:47
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jacekowskicrashanddie: vision of going to prison should be scary00:47
sevardmy 40f is just fine.00:47
jacekowskicrashanddie: not a warm place with tv and xbox00:47
crashanddiejacekowski: and it is00:47
jacekowskiwell, not british prison00:47
jacekowskithey even get xboxes there00:48
V13jacekowski: it is...00:48
jacekowskibtw. i'm trying to upgrade maemo00:48
crashanddiejacekowski: it's not like that at all. All your privacy is stripped away, your power of choice, you don't have many liberties in prison, any anyone who thinks prisoners have liberties needs to buy a brain00:48
jacekowskiand i get error00:48
V13jacekowski: prison is supposed to make people become better. not make them want revenge.00:48
lcukinternal room temp range for nice 1 bedroom appartment:  -7 to 16deg :
jacekowskinot enough memory in target location00:48
crashanddiejacekowski: A very good friend of mine is a forensic psychologist, he works with inmates that have received life sentences mainly, trust me, they're not living in a spa00:49
V13crashanddie: just like army :)00:49
jacekowskiV13: but they can do fuck all day long and we have to pay for it00:49
V13jacekowski: you don't know about this thing eh?00:49
crashanddieV13: except that the army you choose to enter it, and you have potential to leave it00:49
V13jacekowski: what's the rationale behind laws and prisons00:49
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V13crashanddie: just joking:)00:49
crashanddieV13: sure :)00:49
jacekowskiV13: i've been in prison couple times ( not as an inmate though )00:49
V13crashanddie: and no... here it is mandatory.00:50
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jacekowskiV13: and i've seen how does it look there00:50
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SpeedEvil - current temp00:50
jacekowskiV13: they even have aircon in there in case it gets to warm in summer00:50
crashanddiejacekowski: and you honestly believe that a couple of hours gives you insight on their condition for multiple years at a time?00:50
V13jacekowski: well.. many prion guards are also there but they don't  understand why things are as-is00:50
lcukeach country has different standards of prisons and different regimes and methodoligies00:50
SpeedEvilIncluding fish00:50
lcukso some places you will be smashing rocks00:50
jacekowskibut anyways it's maemo channel00:50
lcukothers you will be playing ps00:50
jacekowskiand i have mamo problem00:50
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jacekowskiwhen i'm trying to upgrade i get  not enough memory in target location00:51
SpeedEvilThis could be on-topic if you have reiserfs.00:51
crashanddiejacekowski: too many inmates in your prison?00:51
lcukjacekowski, free some space, remove additional repositories etc00:51
lcuktheres a guide online about updating and space00:51
V13jacekowski: prisons and the whole law system is supposed to be "correctional"... not "punishment"...00:51
jacekowskii mean how much i need00:52
jacekowskiV13: correctional function doesn't work00:52
lcukwell what are you updating specifically00:52
jacekowskiV13: most people return there anyways00:52
lcukthose were general hints00:52
V13jacekowski: or else you turn to throwing stones, cutting body parts and killing people00:52
javispedrotmo: "opensource application that may allow us to run windows applications on the n900" the real thing: a qt gui over qemu.00:52
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jacekowskilcuk: Maemo 500:52
V13jacekowski: I'd like to see the stats behind your claims00:52
ds3has anyone tried the extended battery that makes the 900 thicker?00:52
crashanddiejacekowski: I don't think anyone here said that the penal system works, but claiming that people have a good life in there is just stupid.00:52
lcukjacekowski, that tells me much, from what to what00:53
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lcuk1.0 1.1 1.1.100:53
jacekowskilcuk: V13
C-S-B-N900ds3 make it thicker are you insane?00:53
* SpeedEvil points his insanometer at ds3.00:53
* SpeedEvil leaps away from the smoking wreck.00:53
jacekowskilcuk: i'm upgrading using 19.6 MB update to verision 3.2010.02-8.203.100:53
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jacekowskiV13: About 47 percent of prisoners released in 1994 were convicted of a new crime, and 52 percent returned to prison or jail.00:54
ds3That one00:54
ds3makes it almost 1 full inch00:54
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crashanddiejacekowski: comparing UK prisons with US stats is ridiculous00:54
jacekowskiOver 80 percent of those under age 18 were re-arrested, compared to 45.3 percent of those 45 or older.00:54
lcukjacekowski, go look in the maemo wiki for ssu00:54
jacekowskicrashanddie: Men were more likely to be re-arrested (68 percent) than women (57 percent). Blacks (73 percent) were more likely to be rearrested than whites (63 percent).00:54
jacekowskilcuk: ssu?00:55
crashanddiejacekowski: US stats00:55
V13jacekowski: in which country and where is the poll?00:55
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lcukand i think theres a link there taking you to upgrade considerations and ways of making space00:55
crashanddieV13: US gov stats00:55
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lcukssu == seamless software update - what you are attempting to do00:55
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lcuksince you are mostly offtopic tho im sleeping again :)00:55
jacekowskiSome 49 per cent of inmates commit new offences within 12 months of their release from jail - up from 47 per cent the previous year. It is the second year in a row that reoffending have risen.00:55
nidOUK govt statistics show around 40-45% of criminals re-offend00:56
tybolltjacekowski: On topic post of the day?00:56
jacekowskiin UK prisons00:56
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javispedroclearly, someone here is planning to send all t.m.o members to jail00:57
javispedrowithout passing go, and without collecting $200, of course.00:57
tybolltjavispedro: why?00:57
jacekowskilcuk: there is no details on wiki page00:57
Ken-YoungWell, we already get quarantined.00:57
javispedrotybollt: the previous discussion' topic :)00:58
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tybolltthere no small big batt avail yet?00:59
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tybolltsmall form factor big power00:59
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C-S-B-N900they should have kinetic charging. with a flash enabled browser, porn works great.01:03
ds3so that extended life battery is just too big for folks here?01:03
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nidOpersonally i see no point in it01:03
C-S-B-N900yes. the device is big enough,lets not make iphoners more smug.01:03
ds3nid0: it can double the battery life if the numbers hold01:03
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hoxzerI would love to have a battery with life-time of 3 days even if it would double the size of my phone01:04
ds3the iphone is a completely useless peice of crap so there is no point in comparing it01:04
C-S-B-N900its last a day, i can charge as i sleep.01:04
nidOan external emergency battery can hold 2000mah - 6000mah01:04
jacekowskihoxzer: mine lasts 3 days01:04
nidOand doesnt increase the device size01:04
ds3C-S-B-N900: some of us want to use it while traveling01:04
hoxzerjacekowski: good for you. apparently my usage is more power consuming01:04
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jacekowskihoxzer: i'm using it a lot01:05
C-S-B-N900and you cant take the charger01:05
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Shapeshifterjacekowski: riight.01:05
jacekowskihoxzer: but i pretty much i've got nothing in background01:05
hoxzerjacekowski: Dude, It wont last for 3 days if you're using it in 3G+ listening to music and surfing01:05
ShapeshifterI always wonder what people are doing with their "mobile" devices claiming they get 3 days out of it.01:05
ds3hoxzer: I am not even surfing or playing music (just email) and I barely get a 101:05
jacekowskids3: skype?01:06
ds3jacekowski: nope01:06
ds3no voice, just pure data01:06
jacekowskidisabling skype almost doubled my batterly life01:06
ShapeshifterMine makes it well through 1 day with maybe 10 minutes of 3g, only 2g, no phoning at all, 1sms, a little bit of wlan, and IM online most of the time.01:06
hoxzerOke, not gonna do that01:06
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noobmonk3yi think i get about 18-20 hours doing not much on mine....... but then not much has emails being pushed etc......01:06
Shapeshifterjacekowski: you mean, skype chat eats battery?01:06
DocScrutinizerjacekowski: not much of a surprise, honestly01:06
HoxzerSkype is the future of cell phones. I will teach my parents to use it and they will eb able to reach me from almost everywhere :)01:06
jacekowskiShapeshifter: connected skype01:06
ds3skype does bad things to your network01:06
ShapeshifterHoxzer: no. don't teach anyone how to use skype01:07
ds3if I do voip, I'd just do sip01:07
ShapeshifterHoxzer: tell everyone that skype is the devil and if you use it you'll burn in hell.01:07
jacekowskids3: jingle over jabber01:07
pupnik_show me who created and protocols skype connections01:07
pupnik_show me who created and protocols skype connections01:07
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jacekowskiShapeshifter: i had phone playing music today for 15h and sending using fmtx and i still have 1/3 of battery left01:08
jacekowskiShapeshifter: and jabber online01:08
ds3jacekowski: how old is your unit?01:09
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ds3Hmmm I wonder if the battery improves a lot with age then01:09
*** jpe has quit IRC01:09 good read on the crap skype protocol01:09
SpeedEvilds3: It will imporove a bit over the first dozen cycles.01:09
jacekowskitreat it well for couple weeks01:09
jacekowskiand it will last longer01:09
Shapeshifterjacekowski: I'll try not using skype tomorrow01:09
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ds3SpeedEvil: how much is a bit... 50% longer?01:10
jacekowskids3: depends01:10
jacekowskids3: worst case scenario and best it could be 50%01:10
C-S-B-N900why does power management drop connectios...01:10
SpeedEvilC-S-B: some APs don't support PM well01:10
SpeedEvilds3: 10%01:11
ds3Hmmm okay01:11
C-S-B-N900speed i see this!01:11
SpeedEvilbased on other bats01:11
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SpeedEvilC-S-B: I get >24h battery life ssh'd into the device, and able to get OK interactive performance (~.5s)01:11
ds3I wonder if the CPU load monitor is preventing sleeps01:12
SpeedEvilds3: powertop01:12
ds3is powertop in the repo?01:12
C-S-B-N900SpeedEvil: with pm off?01:12
lcukpyqt dudez, can you knock up a simple example of opening a couple of windows on n900 ?01:12
SpeedEvilC-S-B: no - with it on full01:12
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noobmonk3yhow come when i ask that i get punched lol01:13
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lcuktheres still time for me lol01:13
noobmonk3y~hug lcuk01:13
* infobot jumps into lcuk's lap and huggles and *hugs* lcuk 01:13
noobmonk3yclose enough01:13
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* lcuk hopes infobot is a fem01:14
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noobmonk3ylcuk, info can be whatever you want it/him/she/her to be01:14
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: me and my father bought n900 about same time01:14
javispedrowow, that's $120001:14
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: and when we went skiing to france and we had only one charger01:15
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: mine was charged after we finished skiing01:15
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: and my fathers one over night01:15
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* SpeedEvil charges his lazuh.01:15
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: and after we finished skiing mine had still over 3/4 left01:15
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SpeedEvilIt will mostly charge in 2 hours01:16
jacekowskiand my father's one ( it finished charging later ) only had 2/301:16
C-S-B-N900jacekowski: your dad was looking at porn over the 3g.01:16
SpeedEvilOr maybe less01:16
SpeedEvilFrm USB01:16
SpeedEvilfrom the wallcharger01:16
ds3the rapid charge is nice01:16
trip0that's what she said01:16
ds3but the insistance at popping up a USB device selection option is annoying01:16
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jacekowskiso i would say there is a huge difference between batteries01:17
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ds3with Maemo-mapper running, the USB charger doesn't seem to be able to keep up (network usage + gps)01:17
V13I'd guess other factors like bluetooth.01:17
jacekowskiV13: no01:17
jacekowskiV13: same01:17
C-S-B-N900where is the pm option for wlan001:18
SpeedEviljacekowski: try swapping bats01:18
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V13jacekowski: I've my own n900 which sometimes discharges much much faster.01:19
V13sometimes bluetooth stucks for me01:20
jacekowskihow much space on / i need to upgrade01:20
pupnik_i have a product idea01:21
pupnik_usb cable with no metal lead01:21
pupnik_avoid ripping out connectors01:22
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SpeedEvilpupnik_: no metal lead?01:22
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SpeedEvilpupnik_: it's kinda required.01:22
SpeedEvilpupnik_: Otherwise you have what is known as a socket cap.01:23
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pupnik_SpeedEvil: i see it.  i can draw it.  i can design it01:24
SpeedEvilpupnik_: however - you fail in describing it.01:25
SpeedEvilpupnik_: What do you mean 'with no metal lead'01:26
pupnik_imagine a cable that bends01:26
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SpeedEvilThat's what I was meaning above about right-angle.01:26
SpeedEvilWith a stick-out of ~5mm, with the cable mostly flush01:27
pupnik_no right angle01:27
SpeedEvilThat's damn hard to do, as that measn the cable gets a lot more than normal flexing01:27
pupnik_only metal goes in usb socket01:27
SpeedEvilit will snap01:27
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pupnik_no cable bends01:28
pupnik_no, the cable bends01:28
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pupnik_it is flexible01:28
pupnik_that is the point01:28
SpeedEvilSaying 'the cable is flexible' doesn't magically make it so.01:28
SpeedEvilTake a USB cable. Now, bend it round a 1mm radius repeatedly.01:28
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SpeedEvilIt will fail in some dozens of cycles.01:29
SpeedEvilSorry - I'm unusually argumentative tonight.01:30
pupnik_is ok01:30
pupnik_i see your point01:30
SpeedEvilBut cable and connector design is annoyingly hard.01:30
pupnik_fiber coat01:30
ds3SpeedEvil: I wonder if the right angle is doable in a manner that will work at USB HS, and not overheat when chargin01:30
SpeedEvilIf it was as simple as leaving off the strain relief and making the cable 'flexible' - then everyone would be doing it.01:30
SpeedEvilds3: Should be.01:31
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ds3SpeedEvil: that's a lot of cabling to stuff  in01:31
SpeedEvilpupnik_: The fundamental issue is that copper cables have a pretty fundamental minimum bend radius.01:31
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ds3not really01:31
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ds3copper is very flexible01:32
SpeedEvilpupnik_: This is set by the properties of copper, and the thickness of the individual wires making up the cable.01:32
SpeedEvilds3: Copper is very flexible - initially.01:32
pupnik_and that can be strainrelieved without 20 mm of metal+plastic01:32
SpeedEvilds3: After a few dozen cycles, it work-hardens remarkably.01:32
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ds3SpeedEvil: just pop it into an oven after x cycles and it'll be good as new01:32
ds3if that's the only problem... there is gold ;)01:32
SpeedEvilds3: That will tend to melt the cable.01:32
SpeedEvilds3: yes - gold is a solution I've proposed for this before.01:33
ds3SpeedEvil: maybe... silicone might be able to tolerate the annealing temps01:33
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SpeedEvilds3: From memory it will cost around $500 for a gold cable.01:33
ds3I am more concerned with the resultant cable characteristics01:33
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SpeedEvilds3: silicone can't really. The high temp stuff isn't really robust, at all.01:33
ds3SpeedEvil: what's the annealing temp for copper?01:34
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SpeedEvilds3: It's ~300C if I remember right.01:34
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ds3silicone should be able to tolerate that briefly01:34
ds3and copper can be quenched unlike steel01:35
SpeedEvilSilicone of the grade that can cope with that is very weak mechanically.01:35
SpeedEvilIt is not suitable.01:35
lcukthe nokia charging cable for my n810 was uber flexible01:35
SpeedEvilAnyway - silly conversation is silly.01:35
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ds3I mean ordinary silicone, not the high temp stuff...the ratings are, IIRC, for continous serivce01:35
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SpeedEvillcuk: USB raises issues.01:35
lcukyeah ofc01:36
lcukits like ide cables01:36
SpeedEvillcuk: it's a lot easier to make a two conductor cable flexy, than a 4 conductor controlled impedence cable. :/01:36
lcukdifferent requirements01:36
* lcuk nods01:36
ds3IIRC, it is also sheilded01:36
SpeedEvilAnyway. I am going to attempt to go to sleep, so you will all dissapear for a bit into the void.01:36
C-S-B-N900SpeedEvil: sleep well.01:37
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lcukim just reading hamilton book, the dreaming void01:37
lcukgnite SpeedEvil01:37
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jacekowskiwhy partitions on n900 are so fucked up01:39
C-S-B-N900i wonder we could format and reset up fstab?01:40
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jacekowskiresizing is possible01:40
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jacekowskibut why just don't join / and /home01:40
nidOor rather, you wont overcome rootfs problems as it's physically limited by the nand chip size01:40
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C-S-B-N900is root on a seperate chip?01:41
nidOyes, its a nand chip that's much much faster than the emmc01:41
nidOonly way round it, theoretically, would be storing rootfs data on the emmc instead of the nand01:42
nidOwhich would make the device cripplingly slow01:42
GAN900jacekowski, so you can put media on a bigger storage device01:42
jacekowskijavispedro: NO01:42
GAN900jacekowski, it's not a laptop01:42
javispedrojacekowski: if you're going to try to make a point, please do so quickly. else, I'll say you're wrong.01:42
GAN900rootfs is on the OneNAND01:42
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GAN900eMMC has home and MyDocs01:43
javispedrothat page is oooooooooooutdated.01:44
C-S-B-N900well MyDocs should have been ext3...01:44
C-S-B-N900why is it vfat?01:44
nidOso that windows machines can see it.01:44
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lcukgnite everyone anyway \o01:44
javispedrognite lcuk!01:45
pupnik_i am the ceiling cat01:45
C-S-B-N900well there are ext3 drivers. thanks windows users for that.01:45
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pupnik_god damnm windows for all time01:45
* javispedro confesses he prefers VFAT.01:45
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javispedrosimpler, doesn't have extra unneeded semantics I don't really need, and the performance difference is probably moot01:46
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C-S-B-N900for a hacker phone, they sure do convience windows01:46
nidOi'm a windows user, as far as my workstation goes. most users arent going to want to install an additional driver just to get the device visible to their pc. besides, im sure nokia do vaguely plan to add ovi suite support sometime, having an ext3 fs would probably complicate that01:46
jacekowskiC-S-B-N900: there is no windows ext3 driver01:46
C-S-B-N900and the hidden files in MyDocs, whys?01:47
pupnik_given mfin windows, vfat is the right choice01:47
javispedroC-S-B: that's a stupid thing indeed, probably done to workaround some hildonfm limitation.01:48
pupnik_dot filename01:48
javispedroyes, I mean that01:48
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C-S-B-N900nidO: i expected better from you!01:48
javispedroyou can rename the folders by editing the hildon-fm source, but I'm sure that if you do chaos would ensue01:48
javispedroprobably would appear twice or the like01:48
C-S-B-N900im sure.01:48
nidOwhy, i'm not a retard fanboy one way or the other, I use what's most productive for me - for a workstation, that's win701:49
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jacekowskiC-S-B-N900: windows "ext3" driver is just ext2 driver that can open ext3 in non journaled mode and fuck up your fs if it's not cleanly unmounted01:49
nidOfor my home file/media server that also happens to be win701:49
* javispedro 's file server is the n900 :)01:50
nidOmy fileserver kinda has 1.4Tb of data on it atm though01:50
nidOhard to squeeze that onto a microsd01:50
C-S-B-N900i see your point but unless you game, linux is just better.01:50
javispedrowinlin flamewar tonight!01:50
C-S-B-N900especially as a server.01:50
nidOnot for me on my workstation or file/media server it isnt01:51
C-S-B-N900im not flaming...01:51
C-S-B-N900javispedro: n900 file server? really...01:51
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javispedrowhy not?01:51
javispedroit has a builtin sai; it's fast enough; it consumes little power; it's up more time than my router...01:51
C-S-B-N900no usb host mode?01:51
nidOwhy would a fileserver need usb?01:52
C-S-B-N900for mass storage.01:52
javispedroprobably to connect a 1.5TiB, but I don't have anything that large to store.01:52
pupnik_nidO: if you had lived through msdos 1.0 to today, as i did, you might be in the "never forgive" camp01:52
jacekowskiusb mass storage on file server?01:52
jacekowskimy file servers handle 20T01:52
nidOpupnik_ I'm not quite that ancient but i'm not far short01:52
jacekowskiusb would be too slow anyways01:53
C-S-B-N900javispedro: are you nfs/smb or ssh to get your files...01:53
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C-S-B-N900javispedro: does that come standard?01:53
javispedrokernel modules do iirc; utils no01:54
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pupnik_I will go with peace, into a night01:54
pupnik_where no-one is brighter or dumber01:54
C-S-B-N900do you need the utils?01:54
pupnik_where beauty does not fall to blight01:55
jacekowskiat least mount.nfs and portmap01:55
javispedroyes, without a portmapper it's going to be difficult.01:55
pupnik_and Microsoft has not one customer01:55
jacekowskibut i think you can do it without portmap01:55
javispedronfsv4, maybe01:55
jacekowskimount just timeouts on trying to contact portmap01:55
jacekowskiand does it over default ports01:55
C-S-B-N900javispedro: did you compile the tools or are they in the repo.01:55
javispedronot for statd, lockd, etc.01:55
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javispedromount.nfs probably fallbacks to nfsv2 iirc01:56
javispedrothe busybox one doesn't01:56
jacekowskii don't think so01:56
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jacekowskii had lot of fun with that01:56
jacekowskii mean portmap was dead01:56
jacekowskiit was taking a lot to mount01:56
jacekowskibut it was mounting it over v401:57
C-S-B-N900and xfer speed are you getting?01:57
jacekowskinetwork speed01:57
javispedroi'd say "nfsv4 maybe"01:57
tremnite all, sweet dreams01:57
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javispedros/i'd say/i said01:57
jacekowskimy has defaulted to factory settings01:57
C-S-B-N900sftp in nautilus is doing ok at the mo.01:58
jacekowskior no01:58
C-S-B-N900but i might static ip this badboy and map it on my comp.01:58
jacekowskisftp is too slow for me01:59
C-S-B-N900is there a guide to getting the n900 nfs ready?02:00
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jacekowskithere are some modules in maemo-extras02:00
jacekowskiand utils02:01
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C-S-B-N900then i may well have them. i know i have the cifs pack.02:02
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Ken-YoungHas the promotion of packages from Extras-devel to Extras-testing been disabled?02:05
javispedromight be02:06
javispedrofrom today on iirc they will be built for fremantle-1.202:06
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nidOnot unless it happened very recently, last package was promoted like 2 hours ago02:06
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javispedroyeah well Wednesday arrived just 2 hours ago (UTC) :)02:07
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pupnik  lol02:07
nidO7 minutes ago* :p02:07
Ken-YoungnidO, I just uploaded a package, the build succeeded, but there is no "Promote Package" link.02:07
Ken-YoungnidO, My build completed more than 7 minutes ago.02:08
javispedronidO: touché02:08
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nidOwell, no clue - if today (weds) is when it's disabled for the current repo then they might have shut down promotion in the past couple of hours02:08
nidObut the last package to go to testing hit at 21:45, 2 hours 25 mins ago02:09
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Ken-YoungnidO, Rats - Will it now be impossible to promote packages until whenever pr1.2 appears?02:09
javispedroI want to propose to switch the fremantle autobuilder to use the PR1.2 SDK coming Wednesday March 24th, 12:00 UTC.02:09
javispedroso, dunno.02:09
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Ken-Youngjavispedro, Not much of a warning interval.02:09
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Ken-Youngjavispedro, Not that I'm blaming *you*.02:10
nidO12:00 utc is 12 hours from now02:10
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javispedroi said "dunno"02:10
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jacekowskinidO: it was 12h ago02:10
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noobmonk3yhmm anyone know how to get the button label text on a QtGui.QPushButton ?02:11
jacekowskiand 36h ago02:11
noobmonk3y.setText to set it02:11
nidO12:00 utc weds 24th is in 11 hours 49 minutes time02:11
noobmonk3ybut not sure how to retrieve it in pymaemo02:11
jacekowskior in 365 days and 11h 48 minutes02:12
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jacekowskigood night02:13
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noobmonk3yanyone? :D - how to get a buttons text (QtGui.QPushButton) using pyqt? - just trying to see what the current button text is?02:23
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DocScrutinizerin 365 days and 11h 48 minutes definitely isn't wednesday 24h02:26
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noobmonk3ymeh - no panic, sorted, used a global var :D02:26
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DocScrutinizer24th even02:30
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frals_noobmonk3y: try print dir(yourobject), should list a set of methods on it02:30
frals_(not sure if it made it through the last time before i got dc'd)02:30
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pronto  Take action to keep Sarah Palin, aerial wolf-killer, off Discovery02:31
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cityLights2I am an idiot - can anyone tell me where I can get /etc/init.d/icd2 , I just rm it by mistake02:50
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pupnikpastbin ok cityLights2 ?02:53
javispedroor just doing something like apt-get install --reinstall icd202:54
cityLights2I tried it - doesnt work02:55
javispedroyou tried it with this syntax and it failed how?02:55
cityLights2yes this syntax - file is still missing02:56
javispedroah I see, they made icd2.initd a conffile02:56
cityLights2thanks mate02:57
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cityLights2I am seeking the IAP ID03:01
cityLights2so I ran gconftool -R  /system/osso/connectivity/IAP |more03:01
cityLights2but how can I tell which is the ID?03:02
cityLights2I mean , I search for gprs03:03
cityLights2then how can I find the ID?03:03
cityLights2only number I see under /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/Internet@32@3G: is sim_imsi number03:04
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* noobmonk3y is off to bed, night alls03:05
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SudhirMathanehi, could someone help me find how do i get opengles-sgx-img-common and opengles-sgx-img-common packages?03:07
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luke-jrSudhirMathane: you probably don't.03:08
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SudhirMathaneluke-jr: Are these packages missing in repositories?03:09
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Andrewfblackany idea when I first install php server and lighttpd on n900 it works fine I restart and start lighttpd but php stops working03:09
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amstanhey guys, i heard there's a maemo gsoc chan, where is that?03:10
amstannvm, found it03:10
luke-jrSudhirMathane: they're not redistributable, afaik03:10
SudhirMathaneluke-jr: thanks for your help. One last questions --> are these covered under than NOKIA binaries under EULA?03:11
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crashanddieSudhirMathane: if they are in the Nokia repositories, they are not redistributable. If they are in the Maemo repository, they are redistributable (and in the free category)03:17
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SudhirMathanecrashanddie: thanks03:18
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crashanddieThey should have licences coming with them anyhoo03:23
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C-S-B-N900whats the intermediate power option like?04:42
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cehtehmhm i wondering if i should a very long lasting (30min for example) vibration alarm with very short pulses (little more than the screen tap vibr) and long pause (15-30 sec) for notification .. xchat for example05:07
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cehteheventually one notice it when the device twitches05:07
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cehteh.. note: no thats not good05:19
yigalfor diablo users: has anyone here been succesful in using stereo headphones via a2dp ?05:20
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yigalor stereo over bt in general in diablo?05:21
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yigalI see this so I imagine it works, or at least it worked on diablo05:23
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|R_anyone has a browserd -s 1234 -n browserui poping up randomly and actually waking the screen up ? (i get my pin asked because it's been long enough)05:58
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* disco_stu convirtiendo flvs a mp406:02
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LiraNunax86_64 is /still/ not supported in maemo sdk?07:05
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Milo-I have no issues with x86_6407:13
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ptl516 nicks in #maemo vs. 322 nicks in android.07:26
ptlI mean #android07:26
ptl96 nicks in #iphone07:26
infobotrumour has it, plonk is the sound that a name makes when hitting the ignore list or killfile07:33
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crashanddieptl: IRC activity is hardly any kind of pointer of popularity07:34
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crashanddieptl: Android and iPhoneOS blow Maemo out of the water in terms of numbers, they just target less nerdy types of users07:34
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Stskeepsirc activity on freenode, too07:36
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crashanddieI'm guessing Freenode is one of the more popular networks these days07:36
crashanddieI hardly hear of Quakenet, undernet or Efnet anymore these days07:37
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LiraNunaI installed the maemo5 SDK07:57
LiraNunanow what? :D07:57
ankurI have installed maemo5 too07:58
LiraNunadocs show /scratchbox/ but I don't have it in /07:58
ankurRegarding application testing is Emulator tool avalibale08:01
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ptlcrashanddie: don't get me at me for pointing that! :)08:03
ptlcrashanddie: the activity in is also much greater than any of the android forums I've visited so far.08:03
ptl*crashanddie: don't get mad at me08:03
ptlyeah, but the same kind (and percentage) of noise that appears in other forums, so it cancels08:04
crashanddieptl: you're trying to imply the number of Maemo users is greater than the number of Android users?08:05
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crashanddieI mean, I love the platform, but seriously, we have to be realistic08:05
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ptlnot really08:07
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ptlI am just trying to irritate someone enough so that the irritated person thinks that I think the world is nerdy08:07
ptlsomething like that08:07
ptlnevertheless android also has a nerd side08:08
LiraNunawhy can't I find anything that indicates where the maemo sdk was installed to?08:08
slonopotamuswhat does (nc) in bugzilla mean?08:09
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LiraNunano content08:09
ankuranyone having little time please tell regarding emulator08:11
MiXu-ankur: There's scratchbox08:11
ankurok thnx sir ,08:14
ankurRegarding GSoc i need to dicuss over EBook reader project08:14
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LiraNunadoes the N900's ARM CPU support NEON?08:32
crashanddieLiraNuna: no08:34
crashanddieLiraNuna: NEON is only available on Cortex IIRC08:34
LiraNunauhm, isn't N900 Cortex A8...08:34
Summeliyeah, so it's supported08:34
Summelihave fun ^^08:34
LiraNunaawesome, I wanted to have fun with NEON for so long08:35
* crashanddie is sleepy08:35
crashanddiesorry 'bout that08:35
StskeepsLiraNuna: yes, there's NEON patches in libjpeg for instance08:36
LiraNunaI wanted to play with NEON for so long08:36
LiraNunagonna have fun with a lame google map app08:36
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Passeliit seems that in N900 i cannot anymore install local packages by application manager09:15
Passeliis the only way to install xterm + rootsh ?09:15
Passeliso that it is possible to install local packages?09:16
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MatrosHi all!09:20
rmrfchikPasseli: dpkg -i file.deb09:22
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Passelirmrfchik: yeah but in order to do that i need to install xterm+rootsh09:33
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Passelii'm asking confirmation that there is no other way to do local packages install09:34
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Passeliwhat does following error mean: Warning: This package does not have the required bugtracker link specified! ?09:48
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Passelifind it, it seems that i'm missing bugtracker address at control file09:53
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LiraNunahow come I can't set +x on files?10:16
LiraNunaon the N900's terminal10:16
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fragmentLiraNuna: which partition?10:16
fragmentthat is FAT3210:16
mortalwhat is the best chess app for n800?10:17
LiraNunahow do I execute from FAT3210:17
Stskeepsmortal: comes with one that's kinda difficult10:17
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mortalStskeeps: what is it based on? gnuchess?10:18
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LiraNuna/home/user is ext310:20
LiraNunaI took the OpenVG examples from TI10:20
Sampppa_LiraNuna, put your files under /opt for example10:20
LiraNunait says 'Warning! Using the SOFTWARE renderer'10:20
mortalI wish I could get a recent crafty and some good ui10:20
LiraNunathere's no OpenVG support for N900?10:21
mortalcould it be possible to get some debian package of crafty and install it? or would it break things10:21
StskeepsLiraNuna: not sure, there is for n8x0 :P10:22
LiraNunawhy does it fallback to the software renderer? :(10:22
noobmonk3ymeh... tmo down10:23
mikhasmortal, last time I tried to compile crafty it came up with a lot of warnings ... havent tried to compile it for arm10:23
ptlagain! :/10:23
noobmonk3yjust as i was pressing submit on a post :(10:23
LiraNunaeven the OGL demos says10:24
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LiraNuna'Warning! Using the SOFTWARE renderer'10:24
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noobmonk3yGrrrrrr to tmo, got to goto work in a mo10:25
ptlit's back10:26
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LiraNunaI'm not the only one10:31
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* noobmonk3y w000000ps10:34
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ruskie <-- hmm can haz 64gb in a n900 ;)10:39
mortalis there any directory based mp3 player available for n80010:40
pupnikxmms, mplayer10:41
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noobmonk3y£133 eeeeeeeek10:43
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* noobmonk3y blames lcuk for the price of the world.......10:44
noobmonk3yright off to work, have a gd day alls10:44
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amengHi, anybody can help to tell me how to build a deb package from source (automake based)?10:45
amengin scratchbox10:46
Stskeepsdpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot10:46
noobmonk3ypy2deb/py2packager on the devcie :D10:46
noobmonk3yfrom python anyway10:46
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amengStskeeps: dpkg-parsechangelog: error: cannot open debian/changelog to find format: No such file or directory10:47
amengdpkg-buildpackage: unable to determine source package is10:47
Stskeepsok, you want to package a automake based software, or build a pre-existing package?10:47
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amengStskeeps: package a automake based software10:48
Stskeepsameng: ok, then go read the nearest packaging guides for debian or contact our debmaster, jeremiah10:48
Stskeepshe's hired to help with questions and such regarding things10:48
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amengStskeeps: thanks , where can i find jeremiah?10:50
Stskeepsameng: jeremiah.foster@pelagicore.com10:50
Stskeepsnot sure why he's not hanging out here anymore though10:51
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amengStskeeps: oh10:51
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KhertanHi !10:51
irygehey stskeeps, do you plan on updating your example theme to use hildon-theme-layout-5  0.15.0-1? i don't know how to easily fork nokia's example theme...10:51
Stskeepsiryge: yes, it's a matter of pulling down the updated variant example, i will do this later tody10:52
TigerTaelWish they'd hurry up with 1.2 already.10:53
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irygestskeeps: yeah i actually tried your script with the new variant example, and it gave some error, which i've already forgotten10:54
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irygeand their script still requires confml, whatever that is.10:54
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fluemohmm, it seems 1.2 is already out via pc updater?11:08
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TigerTaelfluemo, is it?11:11
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nidOit isnt11:13
nidOplease read more than the first post in that thread11:13
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tybolltnidO: no, I like me reading the first few post and then making premature assumptions about everything said in there, kthxplz11:15
nidOno u :(11:15
Khertanfluemo: it s pr1.1.111:16
ptltmo down again...11:17
fluemoyea, i see now, lol.. i didnt even see the thread about it yet11:17
ptlwell, just ask that guy if he can reorder the menu items. if he can't, it' PR
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ptlNokia is taking so long with PR 1.2 that it must be rock stable now.11:20
ptlI was comparing my N900 to a friend's Motorola backflip11:20
ptlhe had to turn it in to the seller 2 times... It's the third device he gets11:20
nidOwell, it is a ginormous patch if the monster list of bugfixes is even remotely accurate11:20
ptlit just keeps rebooting11:20
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ptland with all my tinkering I have the N900 for almost two months and have had only one freeze.11:21
ptlno random reboots.11:21
Khertan <<--- still no 1.2 ... so no ... pr1.2 is definitively not available11:21
gouverneurptl: you come from windows?11:21
ptlgouverneur: don't offende me! :P I use solely Linux as my SO since 2001.11:21
gouverneurptl: I had no freeze yet11:21
FIQi've no freeze at all. :D11:21
ptl*as my OS11:21
nidOwindows doesnt freeze..11:21
gouverneurptl: because you talk like one11:22
FIQSE P1i was a nice phone (my previous phone) but it freezed one time a day11:22
gouverneurwindows just hangsup11:22
nidOit really doesnt11:22
FIQjust because of that, it takes me just 10secs to take off and insert the battery in it lol11:23
FIQwindows, not freezing?11:23
nidOrabid linux fanboys have such a distorted view of windows its laughable11:23
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ptlgouverneur: it hang just after I installed Appwatch11:23
ptlgouverneur: I talk like one? How it is like?11:24
tybolltptl: OTOH - there are quite a few common build quality issues.11:24
ptl*How is it like11:24
FIQwell, it rarely makes a completly freeze (but it happens!) but it tend to require rebooting to solve many strange problems11:24
tybolltwith the n90011:24
FIQI've never understand why.11:24
gouverneurnidO: it is not called fanboys... its called idealists11:24
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ptlgouverneur: maybe that's because I am a non-native english speaker. Some of my words might seem not so... unixy?11:24
gouverneurptl: "that it must be rock stable now"11:24
nidOno, its fanboys. idealists would have no reason to incorrectly bash an operating system they know dick all about11:24
FIQI would prefer Linux, but windows isn't *that* bad11:24
tybolltFFS noobs11:25
gouverneurnidO: I know both and still dont like windows... or microsoft at all11:25
FIQlove you too, tybollt. :311:25
tybolltit is "fanboi" :)11:25
tybolltnow call me by the CORRECT derogatory name, will you please?11:25
gouverneurFIQ: have I to remind of Win ME?11:25
gouverneuror XP6411:26
FIQno lol11:26
gouverneuror vista11:26
nidOi've been using win7 for a year and a half on my workstation, the *only* times its been shutdown or rebooted are when i moved house last july and once every couple of months when the patch tuesday requires a reboot11:26
FIQi have vista11:26
ptlwhat's FFS?11:26
gouverneurnidO: so they fixed the constantly rebooting issue?11:26
FIQi hate UAC on it, but the unstableness of it, i havent seen anything of11:26
nidOprior to that I used xp for perhaps 5 years on my workstations, I dont even know what the xp bsod screen looks like11:26
tybollt(what nid forgets to mention are the 12 or so botnet that silently pwns his Win 7 w/out him knowing it)11:27
nidOgouverneur I used the beta, rc1, and now final and i've never seen any constantly rebooting or crashing or anything issues11:27
FIQwindows xp logo, loading bar with blue squares going11:27
ptlfor fuck's sake?11:27
FIQcorrect, ptl11:27
tybolltptl: correct yes11:27
gouverneurnidO: no I mean that you have to reboot once a day because of some freaking upgrade, my gamingcomputer got windows xp with turned of upgrades to prevent it from rebooting11:28
FIQrebooting cycle is usually caused of a firmware brick11:28
nidOwin7 updates require reboots perhaps every 2nd/3rd timer11:28
ptlI am windows free and I intend to keep that way. Ok, my previous phone was a windows mobile, I confess, but that's it. :)11:28
nidOwhich equates to once every 2-3 months11:28
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FIQgoverneur, you really shouldn't turn it off11:28
nidOless often than a well maintained nix system would need reboots for kernel updates11:28
gouverneurnidO: so it is still there...11:28
FIQand, btw11:29
FIQi use vista SP211:29
FIQworks fine11:29
tybolltWell I use linux, openbsd, windows etc... daily. They are all OSes, they suck in their own very special little way. I love my Windows 7 for what it excels att11:29
gouverneurnidO: let it become the primary win on the market and you will reboot at least every two days... like any other windwos11:29
gouverneurFIQ: turn what off?11:30
nidOwhy would I? and I never did so with xp for 5 years11:30
ptlShoot me, but I use Linux mainly for ethical reasons.11:30
FIQwindows updates11:30
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ptlfree software philosophy and the such.11:30
tybolltptl: I love the people that use Linux for "ethical" reasons then they put the latest binary blob from Nvidia on their computer and think they are all ethical and such... what a bunc of crock...11:30
nidOhell I used win2000 server back in the day on my workstation machine, I had an uptime of 8 months on that at once point11:31
gouverneurnidO: then you dont work with it and you do not do security upgrades11:31
nidOread my point re kernels, it seems the same applies to you.11:31
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gouverneurmy office windows has nearly a constant yellowish shield in systray to tell me to reboot11:31
ptltybollt: there's a compromise to that, I try to keep my non-free-software to the minimum. I use free drivers from intel and such...11:31
FIQhere's what I think: Windows is not über bad (if you don't count ME/Vista without any SP), but it has disadventages. I prefer Linux because it's free, virus free, easy to upgrade, and i love the package manager idea11:32
ptltybollt: but you can't really blame them for trying. nvidia blobs are bad, but a whole closed SO is worse.11:32
lupine_85so on my N900, what format should I be transcoding video /to/, in order to get acceptable playback?11:32
infobotptl meant: tybollt: but you can't really blame them for trying. nvidia blobs are bad, but a whole closed OS is worse.11:32
nidOi'd think perhaps you're doing something wrong then gouverneur. windows update on average updates your machine once a month, thats just a fact.11:32
FIQbut i wouldn't count me as a "Linux fanboy"11:32
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gouverneurlupine_85: raw?11:32
tybolltptl: then all respect to you... I am too lazy... my TV computer is Win 7 because I couldn't be arsed to tinker for two years before starting to use it :)11:32
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FIQnid0, it sends fixes every tuesday iirc11:33
lupine_85has it got the I/O throughput for that?11:33
nidOits one tuesday a month.11:33
FIQexcept major security holes11:33
FIQhm, ok11:33
nidOexcept for enormously urgent fixes, yes11:33
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lupine_85surely, there must be /one/ codec that "just works"11:33
nidOwhich doesnt happen often11:33
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FIQi will buy a 16GB sd card soon11:34
ptltybollt: one of the main reasons for me to switch to N900 was to keep my closed software to the minimum. I don't mind paying extra for freedom. I even tried to import the freerunner a while ago but couldn't. And I bought my previous phone, with windows mobile, thinking it would be able to run android (there was a video of a very early beta android running on it on youtube).11:34
FIQso i can play easily with alternate OSes for N90011:35
gouverneurlupine_85: just anything you like! the format as long as not propriitary does not matter the size should fit the screen so there is no need to scale11:35
FIQhm, btw11:35
tybolltptl: I do not agree... The point is that graphics has direct access to memory and by that notion it can do whatever the hell it wants to your system, effectively a bug in your graphics driver can expose you to any number of root's. So in that sense - putting custom Nvidia blobs in your linux is about as bad as running Windows... you have NO IDEA what goes on with your machines (oh - same goes for N900 of course :)11:35
lupine_85gouverneur: you miss my point. I get about 5-10fps with h.26411:35
FIQabout the bootloader for N90011:35
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FIQwouldn't it be theoretical possible to boot from live sessions with it?11:36
lupine_85it's lovely that it tries, but I'd rather have the video and audio in sync, and at the correct speed11:36
FIQfor example, from a sd card11:36
gouverneurlupine_85: I get about 29.8 fps...11:36
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lupine_85with h.264? what resolution?11:36
ptltybollt: yes, there's many points to it, technically-wise and such. I do consider them also, of course. But I do really matter about freedom and such. There's no use of having a device (computer, mobile phone or whatever) if it doesn't work at all.11:36
gouverneurlupine_85: 800x42011:36
Mecewhat doesn't work now?11:37
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gouverneurptl: what is it with you? reflash your damn thing and stop installing devel apps!11:37
tybolltptl: agreed :)11:37
ptlgouverneur: ???11:37
tybolltmece: discussing OSes.11:38
ptlgouverneur: what does this have to do with devel apps?11:38
FIQwhy does the pacman take years to load?11:38
gouverneurptl: have I overread something and yelling on the wrong guy?11:38
FIQtoo many enabled repositories?11:38
ptlgouverneur: I think so!11:38
tybollthehe poor ptl - everyone's dumping on him =)11:38
FIQeverytime i install something, the cache update takes more time than the install itself11:39
gouverneurptl: yeah some things do not work out that well for sure, I can easily crash my hildon-desktop with installing OMweather....11:39
tybolltomweather is a biatch...11:39
lupine_85ho de hum11:39
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tybollt"please promise to reboot your machine after instal"11:40
tybolltwhat the ...?11:40
ptlgouverneur: but i was not saying that my apps or my device don't work, I was talking about a hypothetical generic case... My N900 is very stable indeed.11:40
FIQlol :P11:40
gouverneurFIQ: yes, and If you run out of / space you may deavtivate them and clean cache...11:40
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gouverneurptl: ah generic... ok11:40
gouverneurptl: sry11:40
FIQi clean the cache often...11:41
FIQjust for preventing rootfs being full11:41
gouverneurFIQ: does not matter... the listings stay11:41
gouverneurdisabling all unneeded repos frees up space you may need if your upgrade is stuck at some point11:42
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FIQrootfs                  227.9M    192.9M     30.8M  86% /11:42
FIQnot that little space free11:43
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gouverneurI tried to optify themes and stuff but somethings wrong with the setup there, even with all files moved I get another stby slider or background after reboot11:43
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gouverneurFIQ: PR1.0 needed +50MB afaik to install11:44
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FIQthen the PR1.2 update will fail for now (when it get released)11:45
MeceFIQ, disabling extras, testing, and devel gives me about 19Mb11:46
gouverneurFIQ: you just disable the repos, update database and you should be fine (give it a try and have a look what happens with your free space if you disable all but nokias needed)11:46
gouverneurMece: thats what I am talking about11:46
FIQok, i will try11:47
lcukFIQ, go into ham manager and disable extras devel and testing and see how much extra space you gain instantly11:47
Meceis there an update out?11:47
lcuknot that i know of :D11:47
gouverneurMece: nope11:47
FIQi have devel11:48
FIQbut not testing11:48
gouverneurbut it keeps me showing one in ham with old version number and after apt-get upgrade (nothing installed or upgraded) it is gone11:48
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FIQrootfs                  227.9M    176.8M     46.9M  79% /11:49
gouverneurhere we go!11:49
FIQwhen i disable extras, joikuspot, amsn, mozilla, devel11:49
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gouverneuramsn mozilla?11:49
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FIQamsn for... well, aMSN11:50
FIQmozilla for fennec, i guess11:50
gouverneurcause thats all in the normal repos (well not amsn but the plugins for it)11:51
gouverneurwill skype get the cam inout?11:53
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* lupine_85 installs the Qt SDK for a play12:14
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KelloggsFrostieshi folks. is this the right place to ask a question concerning programming qt ui for maemo (n900)?12:17
mikhasbut #qt-maemo might be12:19
KelloggsFrostiesmikhas: thanks a lot!12:19
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tybolltmmmh frosties12:24
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corecode_i didn't find joikuspot12:49
corecode_does it exist for maemo5?12:49
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tybolltcorecode_: you have to look it up at joikusofts own homepage, it's not ina maemo repos12:51
ccookeMorning, all12:52
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corecode_free or $$?12:54
tybolltfree for now but it is still beta (and the quality is quite beta indeed12:54
corecode_i see12:55
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KhertanHi all !12:57
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* Arif_ yawns13:00
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D-IivilSomeone here who can see what's wrong with extras-devel -repo not putting builded .debs to the pool?13:14
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Sampppa_D-Iivil, it will take some time?13:14
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StskeepsD-Iivil: look at the -developers list, there was a announcement re PR1.213:15
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D-IivilSammpa_: yeah, but now it's taking more than usually. Usually debs are appearing here almost as soon as the build is success.13:15
D-IivilStskeeps, where to look?13:15
JaffaX-Fade: ping13:15
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Stskeeps2- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use13:16
Stskeepsdistribution: fremantle-1.213:16
Stskeeps- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle13:16
Stskeeps- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion will13:16
Stskeepsonly happen to fremantle-1.213:16
StskeepsThis will effectively mean that the 'old' Extras will not get any updates.13:16
hrw~curse badly venomrush for being #@%$@%@ - bug 693313:16
povbotBug Alarm times are shown wrong13:16
JaffaD-Iivil: Ah, hang on this is similar to what I wanted to ask X-Fade about: I've promoted something from -testing to Extras this morning and it's not moved anywhere yet13:16
infobotMay the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, badly venomrush for being #@%$@%@ - bug 6933 !13:16
hrwcan someone with a bit of free time look at bug 6933 and check it on device?13:17
Jaffahrw: One bit of information which *may* be relevant is N900 timezone...13:18
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Jaffahrw: But "TRIGGER;VALUE=DURATION:-PT1H45M" in the vcs seems fairly clear.13:18
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Jaffahrw: What's the date of the event in the ICS? I just imported it and it showed me *no* alarm info at all13:21
Ken-YoungStskeeps, I checked a new version of my app (orrery) into Extras-testing last night, but of course I can't promote it to Extras without getting votes and sitting through quaraantine.   Will I be able to promote it to Extras for 1.1, or is it already too late for that?13:22
Stskeepsno idea, ask X-Fade13:22
D-IivilSo at the moment it's not worth to upload anything to extras devel?13:22
hrwJaffa: have to check it13:23
Jaffahrw: found it - 2010-01-1513:23
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hrwshit. in PR1.2 calendar I cannot find 'import'13:25
X-FadeKen-Young: You are just in time if you hit promote now ;)13:25
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X-FadeD-Iivil: Sure it is.13:26
X-FadeJaffa: Which package?13:26
JaffaX-Fade: Catorise. 0.7.4 in Extras; promoted 0.8.0 from -Testing this morning, but repo hasn't changed (and so neither has /downloads/)13:27
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D-IivilX-Fade: But packages aren't going to be imported to the pool at the moment?13:28
Ken-YoungX-Fade, THanks - I hit promote last night, so it went from Devel to Testing, but of course I can't promote out of Testing until I go through QA and quarantine.13:28
X-FadeKen-Young: That doesn't matter. Time of entry matters.13:28
X-FadeD-Iivil: They should. Nothing changed there.13:28
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Ken-YoungX-Fade, Good.   I've got some bug fixes in the new version, and I'd hate to have the 1.1 Extras version frozen with bugs.13:29
D-IivilX-Fade: can you check what's wrong with these packages: d-theme-bright-blue, d-theme-bright-green, d-theme-bright-orange, d-theme-bright-pink13:29
X-FadeAh, wait something is holding up the queue.13:29
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D-IivilThey got built just fine, but won't appear on extras-devel pool.13:29
X-Fadepython-beautifulsoup promotion fails.13:30
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pupnik  NILFS filesystem for solid state drives.  logs, versions, rollbackss13:30
hrwJaffa: looks like I need to create test event for 2015 so it will be still ok before nokia decided to fix13:31
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X-FadeHmm again an app which has different version number on the filename from the one in control file.13:31
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Jaffahrw: ;-)13:32
D-IivilBtw does someone know if can update my SDK to 1.2 somehow easily?13:33
D-IivilWould be nice to test out what needs to be changes with themes for PR1.213:33
JaffaD-Iivil: apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade works according to the release notes13:33
hrwD-Iivil: apt-get update/upgrade13:33
JaffaD-Iivil: Obviously, they need to be fakeroot'ed.13:34
Sampppa_with fakeroot13:34
D-IivilShall give it a try :)13:34
* Jaffa did it this morning and Catorise doesn't die horribly with the new menu-reordering code13:34
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X-FadeJaffa: No, I've been using it for a while. Works fine.13:34
StskeepsD-Iivil: i will need to upgrade the theme template on gitorious, i may have time tonight for doing it13:34
Chikulinu__does PR1.2 released?13:34
JaffaChikulinu__: SDK is.13:34
* Jaffa wonders if anyone's taken the ARMEL packages from the SDK and run them on device yet ;-)13:35
Sampppa_i guess some people did already :)13:35
nidOMohammedAG tried at least13:35
D-IivilOh.. what file did I have to edit inside scratchbox to manually enter new network settings (ip, gateway etc)?13:35
hrwJaffa: I did - had to reflash13:35
Chikulinu__about the flash file?13:35
D-IivilWe got new router today and gateway changed and my scratchbox won't go online anymore :P13:35
Chikulinu__I want to reflash my n90013:36
Stskeeps /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf , D-Iivil13:36
D-IivilStskeeps, thanks!13:36
X-FadeJaffa: catorise got through now.13:36
JaffaX-Fade: Cool, ta13:36
hrwJaffa: catorise 0.8.0 breaks pr1.2 sdk13:36
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Jaffahrw: Not IME13:36
Jaffahrw: I tested this morning, reproduction instructions welcome on ;-)13:36
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hrwJaffa: so far I just removed it from sdk - no time for more tests now13:37
JaffaX-Fade: How long does it take for /downloads/ to get updated from the repo?13:37
Jaffahrw: Can you define "break" a bit more then?13:37
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nidOX-Fade: any idea what happened to libmikmod2, there's a bit of mud slinging going on in the gltron qa comments about it13:37
Jaffahrw: I didn't have Catorise installed before upgrading...13:37
X-FadeJaffa: up to 2x 30 mins.13:37
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hrwJaffa: press tasks to get to list of categories, select 'all'13:38
X-FadenidO: libmikmod2 is violating the packaging policy.13:38
JaffaX-Fade: Right. These lags make releasing software really tedious btw, since updating changelog/screenshots has an indeterminate lag.13:38
X-FadenidO: The files are named libmikmod and the control file talks about libmikmod2.13:38
Jaffahrw: What happened?13:38
hrwJaffa: hildon-desktop crashed13:38
* hrw wants maemo to use lintian...13:38
Chikulinu__the PR1.2 .bin file will enabled to download after or as time PR1.2 wil be released?13:39
Jaffahrw: Ah.13:39
hrw~curse nokia so called developers13:39
Jaffahrw: What apps have you got installed in the SDK?13:39
infobotMay the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, nokia so called developers !13:39
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hrwJaffa: different, strange etc ones13:39
hrwJaffa: will pastebin dpkg -l13:39
Jaffahrw: ta13:39
X-FadeJaffa: There isn't much I can do, the package has to be visible to the world first.13:40
X-FadeJaffa: Otherwise people will try to download the app and get an older version.13:40
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Shapeshiftermh. has someone developed a desktop widget using python qt bindings before? I see an example qt desktop widget with some stuff in C++ needed to run it. are there even bindings for that stuff?13:40
Jaffahrw: ta13:41
X-Fadequick lunch before switching sdk on builder.13:41
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JaffaX-Fade: Indeed, but one could imagine stuff happening not in a background, scheduled, 30-mins process ;-)13:42
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hrwJaffa: bug 6933 updated - can you check and confirm?13:48
povbotBug Alarm times are shown wrong13:48
Jaffahrw: Will do13:48
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hrw15th January 2015 - nokia maemo5 calendar will still be affected by #6933 and I will have to dig in drawer of obsoleted devices just to update example event13:50
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D-IivilAnyone knows how can I pop out the virtual keyboard on SDK PR1.2?13:51
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Jaffahrw: Confirmed.13:52
D-IivilNevermind, found the settings :)13:52
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hrwgracias Jaffa13:53
Jaffahrw: np13:54
* Jaffa is in touting-for-votes mode ;-)13:54
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hrwJaffa: votes where?13:56
N900evilwith your delicious cakes?13:56
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D-IivilSome spammer has made it to
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D-IivilX-Fade: ping14:02
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hrwJaffa: already voted14:06
hrwJaffa: you were one of 3 people for which I voted14:06
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* Stskeeps votes14:07
X-FadeD-Iivil: pong14:07
D-IivilX-Fade: did you get that extras-devel queue sorted out?14:08
Jaffahrw: ta :)14:09
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* Stskeeps has no idea what he has done to his Boxee but is pretty satisfied that it mutes the sound on hulu advertisements14:10
Arif_adblock? :D14:12
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X-FadeD-Iivil: Should be ok now.14:14
D-IivilX-Fade: so it seems, thanks :)14:14
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odin_whois is and what is his/her role ?14:18
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hrwgood question14:20
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hrw~seen venomrush14:22
infobotvenomrush <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 14d 13h 20m 53s ago, saying: 'to select the other mode'.14:22
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Arif_D-Iivil, are you the one making those livilsteel themes?14:23
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D-IivilArit_ yes14:25
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X-FadeOk, builder switched to PR1.2 SDK.14:25
hrwnow half year for pr1.2 on devices14:26
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X-FadeNah, it won't be that long.14:26
* D-Iivil just voted :) Now it's a cigarette time!14:27
hrwno one knows14:27
hrwX-Fade: and do not say 'next week' - konttori told that 2 months ago14:29
lcukwhats the subject of the voting open email for the election14:30
X-FadeThe only thing I can say is that SDK and firmware image versions tend to match, draw conclusions from that ;)14:30
odin_is there a good 2 months round up on the state of Maemo ?14:30
hrwlcuk: Maemo Community Council election Q1 201014:30
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Arif_D-Iivil, cool..I really like those themes :D14:30
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lcukthanks hrw14:31
lcukthe title on the actual page that requests the token is slightly different14:31
D-IivilArif_: :) I though you were gonna give some bad feedback :D Glad you like 'em.14:31
lcukand gmail didnt find it \@14:31
Arif_D-Iivil, I don't ALWAYS complain.....just mostly :P14:32
tybollt~seen infobot14:32
infobottybollt: i haven't seen 'infobot'14:32
D-IivilArif_: good attitude ;)14:32
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* RST38h moos evilly14:34
RST38hX-Fade: Judging from the SDK screenshots there have not been many visible changes...True?14:35
* Arif_ throws milk at RST38h14:35
hrwRST38h: yep14:35
X-FadeRST38h: No comment ;)14:35
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rmrfchikas new sdk5 came out, i downloaded vmdk. And know what? It's the same old sdk. damn, 1.6 gig of crap.14:36
* Arif_ already has an enhancement bug report when pr1.2 comes out :D14:36
RST38hX-Fade: At least tell me if the device still lights up when you plug it into the charger14:36
D-Iivilrmrfchik: run apt-get update / upgrade14:36
RST38h(which is damn annoying)14:36
D-Iivilinside the scratchbox14:36
* rmrfchik full of enchancements14:36
MiXu-RST38h: Why is it annoying?14:36
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D-Iivilrmrfchik: with fakeroot first14:37
RST38hMiXu: Because when I have the device locked (with the switch) I expect it to REMAIN locked.14:37
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MiXu-oh, that14:37
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RST38hMiXu: It should not unlock on its own when plugged in14:37
X-FadeRST38h: unlocks14:37
RST38hX-Fade: <sigh> :(14:38
Arif_it does14:38
Arif_apparently they haven't done anything to the media player ={14:38
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MiXu-What's wrong with the Media Player? :D14:38
nidOthe upnp bug is apparently sorted, thats by *far* the biggest one for me14:38
X-FadeArif_: How would you know?14:38
D-IivilDon't really like the new virtual keyboard layout, but it's nice not to need skin the vkeyboard anymore since it seems to use stylus button style :)14:39
RST38hMiXu: Is there something that is RIGHT about it?14:39
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Arif_X-Fade, MohammadAG's thread?14:39
RST38hArif: Well they should have at least enabled the "Remove from playlist" option in the context menu14:39
RST38hArif: If it is still not there.... mhm14:39
MiXu-I've been fooling around with it so long that maybe I'm blinded by it already14:39
X-FadeArif_: Mediaplayer is not in SDK?14:39
RST38hMiXu: Try removing a song from the playlist.14:39
Arif_X-Fade, no? I didn't know that14:40
RST38hMiXu: ONCE song14:40
MiXu-I don't use playlists :)14:40
* Arif_ gets hope again :)14:40
RST38hMiXu: Try playing a random file (as opposed to whatever Tracker lets you play)14:40
* Arif_ wants a "search" button in the top menu14:40
RST38hMiXu: try invoking the UI while watching a long (>15min) video14:40
RST38hMiXU: Try using the desktop media player applet, see if it works after a few days of uptime14:41
MiXu-none of the desktop things work after a few days :)14:41
RST38hFunny thing is, I can actually continue with these =)14:41
hrwtry to play album in normal (not random) order14:41
hrwetc etc etc14:41
MiXu-Even the shortcuts don't work. Or at least there's a horrible latency.14:41
Arif_try repeating one item14:41
MiXu-Why would i want to :)14:41
Arif_no idea =D14:42
Arif_oh and you can't send anything in the media player either14:42
hrwbecause chick which lies with you in bed asked you for it?14:42
MiXu-hrw: Then I can just replay it manually :)14:42
MiXu-If it's a 3 minute song, it'll be long enough. ;)14:43
hrwand agan and again?14:43
hrweasier to select one song to play in repeat14:43
* hrw -> food14:43
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rmrfchikhmm, how to open virtual keyboard in "emulator"?14:47
D-Iivilrmrfchik: you first need to go to settings and enable it.14:48
D-IivilI was wondering the same thing earlier :)14:48
rmrfchikI have only app manager14:48
D-Iivilrmrfchik: open menu, then settings and so on.14:49
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rmrfchikhmm... no network settings14:49
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ptlI wonder if yakuake or guake would compile and run in the N900?15:16
ptlHow would they behave?15:16
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Sho_yakuake would probably compile and run at this point, whether the window manager works well with it is another question though15:17
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hrwrather not15:20
madduckwhat is up with not being able to send contact cards? whether email, sms, or bluetooth, after I get asked about sending the avatar, *nothing* happens15:20
madduck(this is with the n900)15:20
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hrwmb-wm2 runs all windows as fullscreen ones15:20
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trembyhey folks. has anyone tried running MPD (Music Player Daemon) on Maemo? i have an N900. Google searches just turn up a bunch of posts about people having problems getting their N900s from what i assume is a shop or company called MPD...15:21
bleaderyou mean a mpd client or the real deamon ?15:22
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trembythe daemon15:22
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trembyi'm hating the music player which comes with it15:23
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bleaderI haven't tried, just using the n900 with cutempc to control mpd at home15:23
thptremby: grab the debian source package and try to compile it in scratchbox15:24
trembythp: any idea how much effort that'll be? to get dependencies and everything15:24
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madduckhow else could i extract a contact from the n900?15:25
wizkoderhy everybody15:26
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wizkoderwhen I use libcrypto++ is there a way to get it running on the N900? Read the lib exists for arm architechture too but I can't find it with apt-get there15:27
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thptremby: don't know - try it out. with some dependencies you can simply choose to disable the feature that depends on it. for other dependencies, you can simply grab them from debian again and recurse15:28
trembyyeah it's the recursing that i'm worried about -- i haven't done this before and it sounds like it could be a rabbit hole...15:29
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trembybut if i have a spare few hours later maybe i'll give it a go15:29
trembyis there a guide somewhere for building things in scratchbox?15:30
X-Fadethp: You should now be able to use the sharing-dialogs etc on the builder.15:30
tybolltmmmmh rabbit, glazed w/ honey and butter... grilled to perfection in a preheated oven... *drools*15:30
thplooking at "apt-cache depends mpd" it does not look so bad. simply disable faad/flac/jack/mikmod/...15:30
thpX-Fade: awesome! thanks :)15:30
trembythp: ok, i'll give it a go. thanks.15:32
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D-IivilAnyone having problems with SDK 1.2 browser crashing after typing the address and pressing enter?15:35
Stskeepsthat's a problem in Xephyr i think..15:36
D-IivilActually it seems to crash even when clicking any of the default bookmark.15:36
Stskeepsor Xorg15:36
D-IivilWould be nice to see how browser is changed and so on.15:36
D-IivilApp manager also won't find anything to install after upgrading the sdk.15:36
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thpX-Fade: so the pre-1.2 fremantle autobuilder has already been deactivated, right?15:38
D-Iivilthp: not deactivated, it's activated I suppose.15:38
X-Fadethp: Yes, it only builds against PR1.2 (update5) now.15:39
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TigerTaelD-Iivil, I don't get this problem.15:40
hrwX-Fade: apps which are in extras will get rebuilt and will get version bumped?15:40
X-Fadehrw: No.15:40
D-IivilTigerTael: Damn... even restarting the Xephyr didn't fix it for me.15:40
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hrwX-Fade: so expect apps which do not work in 1.215:41
D-IivilX-Fade: but apps in extras are still installable from there?15:41
X-Fadehrw: Basically everything runs when going from 1.1 to 1.215:41
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hrwX-Fade: qt4.5 ones too?15:41
D-IivilX-Fade:  I mean what will happen to "old" extras -repo?15:41
X-Fadehrw: Yes.15:41
tekojohrw yes15:41
tekojohrw we have tried a bunch of those15:41
X-FadeQuite a lot actually ;)15:41
X-FadeD-Iivil: It will remain there, but static.15:42
hrwI had to uninstall many apps when tried to upgrade n900 to 1.2/sdk packages but I have testing+devel apps15:42
D-IivilX-Fade: okay, so it will be visible for end users as it has been now and all the apps etc can be seen via app manager? Cool then :)15:42
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X-FadeD-Iivil: yes, only from the point we switch of the promotion for it, it will remain as it is at that point in time.15:43
X-FadeWe can safely allow promotions for another 9 days ;)15:44
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MohammadAG<D-Iivil> Actually it seems to crash even when clicking any of the default bookmark.15:44
MohammadAGapt-get dist-upgrade15:44
madduckthis really sucks, I cannot get a contact off my device.15:44
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MohammadAGfakeroot apt-get dist-upgrade *15:44
Arif_madduck, export and send with petrovich?15:45
D-IivilMohammadAG: thanks, will try it :)15:45
madduckhow do i export?15:45
madduckArif_: ^15:45
MohammadAGtap menu bar15:45
MohammadAGtitle bar*15:45
MohammadAGand export15:45
Arif_should be an option to export contacts15:45
madduckoh, all contats15:45
Arif_when you poke the top15:45
madduckfound it15:45
madduckthanks for the pointer15:46
redeemanmy N900 just shut off15:47
Arif_turn it back on15:47
hd1mine just spontaneously rebooted as well15:47
* hd1 wonders if something more sinister is going on15:47
Arif_mine says 14:4915:47
redeemanit won't turn on - it shows the logo, the thingie to progress, then off15:48
Arif_you bricked it15:48
MohammadAGmine rebooted now15:48
redeemanby reading an email?15:48
hd1yay, redeeman! :)15:48
MohammadAG(just stirring up a Y2K rumor, ignore that :P)15:48
Arif_redeeman, gotta love Nokia software :D15:48
hrwMohammadAG: 1.1.1 or manually forced to 1.2/sdk?15:48
redeemanhd1: did yours really reboot?15:49
hd1MohammadAG: oh, no... I was stirring up an evil-eu theory15:49
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hd1redeeman: aye15:49
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hd1but, to be perfectly honest, I did force the issue15:49
redeemanwhen it turns off, it fades the led15:49
Arif_has anyone noticed that when the phone turns off the led is less blue then when it turns on?15:50
MohammadAGhrw, jk, but I'm on PR1.1.115:50
MohammadAGArif_, cause it's white15:50
Arif_thats not white15:51
Arif_looks like blue ....15:51
GuySofthi all, is there a way to get SIP going on a nokia n810? whats the best client?15:52
MohammadAGPatternPowerOff=10;3;0;rgb;9d80400001ff43ff7f007f00c000;9d800000 Arif_15:52
hrwGuySoft: internal one is enough15:52
Arif_Nokia has a weird sense of white then15:52
* hd1 pops the battery out15:52
hrwGuySoft: run controlpanel -> accounts and add SIP there15:52
GuySofthrw, i can't seem to get it to make calls15:52
hd1wtf man... now, the bloody thing won't turn on?!? :)15:52
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hrwGuySoft: I have same problem with one operator15:53
KhertanHello again15:53
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TigerTaelhrw, haha, yeah, I remember when I took the battery out with the USB plugged in.15:53
Arif_yeah,but white doesn't look like white on the N900 LED15:53
redeemanhd1: i made mien turn on now15:53
hrwTigerTael: ?15:53
redeemanby inserting to charger15:54
redeemanthen waited ~4 min15:54
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hd1haha redeeman15:54
redeemanbut it was not out of power15:54
TigerTaelhrw, soz I meant hd1.15:54
redeemani had just recharged it this morning15:54
hd1oh i thought it was out of power sorry15:54
redeemanwell in case it was, it would have used the power in a few hours, and the indicator would have been broken15:55
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hd1Tiger: I'm just a right git, what can i say?15:55
GuySofthrw, nevermind, got it :)15:55
TigerTaelah ;/15:55
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hd1serious query, though, seeing much grumblings about maemo 6, is this a reality yet?15:56
TigerTaelThe grumblings sure are a reality...15:57
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hd1Tiger: to be sure, but is maemo 6?15:59
TigerTaelmaemo 6 will be an iteration of Meego.15:59
TigerTaelAnd not actually called Maemo 6.15:59
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tigerthey thp16:07
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X-Fadet-tan: fiasco-gen only for armel?16:09
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* MohammadAG is upgrading to Ubuntu 10.04 beta16:09
t-tanX-Fade: I guess I'll make all packages armel-only.16:10
* Arif_ runs windows update16:11 updates ;(16:11
* MarcusM wonders when Linux Mint will have 10.0416:11
X-Fadet-tan: Does it actually make sense to make an i386 version?16:11
t-tanX-Fade: I don't think so. if someone wants to build kernel modules they can use the Nokia kernel headers16:12
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X-Fadet-tan: Yeah, but anyway, device specific modules won't run on i386.16:12
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t-tanX-Fade: yep. If at all i386 kernel-headers would only be for convenience, which true kernel hackers don't need...16:14
* MohammadAG just found out why Joikuspot didn't work for him, custom linux kernel16:16
MohammadAGit uses some bouncer.ko file16:16
hrwGuySoft: what was wrong?16:16
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t-tanMohammadAG: is it some proprietary binary module?16:19
X-Fadet-tan: no, source is on their site.16:20
MohammadAGkernel module, seems like it16:20
MohammadAGX-Fade, where?16:20
firestormi love the n900, got mine on monday and it's brillant :D mates the g1 look crap16:20
MohammadAGX-Fade, thanks16:21
MarcusMfirestorm: Good to hear that. I'm trying to save up for one. Probably got it within the next month.16:21
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t-tanX-Fade: did I just build the first PR1.2 extras package?16:26
X-Fadet-tan: Looks like it.16:26
N900evilfirestorm, yes.16:26
t-tancool. it's always good to start with essential things.. :)16:27
MohammadAGt-tan, are you titan?16:27
firestormquick question, installing a file from whats best way of installing it on my phone via x term or via the app manager?16:27
t-tanMohammadAG: yes16:27
MohammadAGt-tan, tsk tsk, looks like I don't need to tell you about joikuspot in the thread16:28
MohammadAGstopped writing the reply lol16:28
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GuySofthrw, some proxy setting on the sip16:32
t-tanMohammadAG: does it work if you copy the module to the custom modules directory?16:33
MohammadAGt-tan, I'll check, reflashed my N900 yesterday and was looking for what Joikuspot installs16:33
firestormany one?16:33
MohammadAGthen found the .ko file16:33
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MohammadAGinstalling the kernel now16:33
t-tanMohammadAG: I could add it to the kernel in the next version...16:34
N900evilfirefox on device with all-in-one mousegestures works ok.16:34
N900evilwell - using the device as a displ616:35
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MohammadAGt-tan, I'll check in a bit, this 18.4kB/s 2min0s isn't helping16:36
MohammadAGget about 600 from the Ubuntu repos, not sure why16:36
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MohammadAGt-tan, rebooting16:43
firestormcan u download a .install file from command line pakg?16:43
MohammadAGt-tan, may I ask why the kernel is in non-free?16:43
MohammadAGfirestorm, you can use wget to download files in terminal16:43
MohammadAGcat to see the contents16:44
MohammadAGnano or vi to add the repo, and apt-get to install it16:44
firestormtrying to download  rootsh throguh app manager and not happening16:44
t-tanMohammadAG: it was till today because it depends on non-free sd-fiasco-gen, which was missing on autobuilder16:44
firestormgot the .install file on the phone allready16:44
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MohammadAGt-tan, so it's in free now?16:45
X-Fadet-tan: Shall I remove the non-fre one now?16:45
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t-tanX-Fade: please keep it for the < PR1.2 people16:46
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X-Fadet-tan: I think it will work on < 1.2 too?16:46
t-tanMohammadAG: the latest version 17 is in free, it's the same as version 14 in non-free16:47
X-Fadet-tan: fiasco gen was in 1.1 already?16:47
firestormor does it nto work like that MohammadAG ?16:47
t-tanX-Fade: yes, it already works. but if it's only in fremantle1.2 some people can't install it, correct?16:47
MohammadAGfirestorm, what fw you on?16:48
X-Fadet-tan: No, extras-devel and testing have no specific repo.16:48
X-Fadet-tan: only extras will have one.16:48
firestormlatest one :p let me check16:48
t-tanX-Fade: but autobuilder was PR1.0, you should know :)16:48
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nidOsrsly. whats the chance of getting a themes category back for the repos? :<16:49
MohammadAGthat's not the latest one16:49
X-Fadet-tan: Yes, but extras-devel is considered unstable anyway.16:49
t-tanX-Fade: ok, I see. then please remove it as soon as the free one is imported16:49
firestormah, the phone did a massive update when i connected to net etc.16:49
X-Fadet-tan: free one is already visible in packages.16:50
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t-tanX-Fade: ok, I was just checking the webpage16:50
tybolltgod damn mother f*****16:50
firestormwere can i et latest one from?16:50
tybolltOOo ate itself after editing a long doco and it managed to corrupt the saved copy16:51
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mgedminversion control too16:52
tybolltja, really, every emacs, LeX and vim user should dance on my grave right now - I deserve it :)16:53
firestormwere can i get latest firmware from then16:53
* andrewfblack thinks some theme designers need to learn Quality over Quantity16:54
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MohammadAGt-tan, the JoikuSpot_Bouncer.ko file is in /usr/bin16:55
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MohammadAGor use HAM (app manager) to update16:58
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firestorm RX-51_2009SE_3.2010.02-8.203.1_PR_COMBINED_203_ARM.bin 171136705 PR 1.1.1 version 3.2010.02-8 Latest Maemo 5 UK variant for Nokia N90017:00
firestormi guess that the latest version?17:00
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MohammadAGumm sorry, meant to highlight firestorm17:01
firestormlets run the good old ap manager n see what it comes up with17:01
madduckis it not possible to associate an existing contact with My Information on the n900?17:01
MohammadAGthat will remove everything except MyDocs17:01
MohammadAGbe sure to backup17:01
firestormthere is nothing on it lol i've not got that far setting it up :p17:01
firestormgutted it don't sync with the ovi website either, would been so easier importnating contacts from g117:02
MohammadAGthis is new17:02
MohammadAGNOTE: Always flash the FIASCO image first, then the eMMC image immediately after that. Never boot up the device between flashing the FIASCO image and the eMMC image!17:02
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andrewfblackdoes it make me an A Hole or a Prick for not sharing Bug Fixes for theme with theme designers I don't like?17:03
Khertannope :=)17:03
Khertanand not also to publish your theme on your own repository instead of maemo extras17:04
Khertanbut noone will like you here17:04
andrewfblackKhertan: you hiding stuff in your own repo now?17:04
hrwflashing eMMC is only for those who got their n900 in amsterdam17:05
firestormhmm intresting, over wireless it can't find no update but over 3g it does17:05
Khertanandrewfblack: yes ... i've created my own repository ...17:05
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madduckoh nokia, your N900 cannot sync with the E7117:05
Khertanandrewfblack: i'm just waiting that all my packages are remove from the maemo one17:05
firestorm£not enough battery power to install Maemo update. start charingw not and try again" yet i've got half batterty17:05
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Khertanas ham ignore application that are in extras ... even if version is newer in external repository17:06
madduckall contacts always get copied both ways, leading to exponential growth of your address book17:06
slackmagicMohammadAG: ever came across someone purchasing a n900 in the USA and where the fm transmitter didn't work? No matter what I have done, it simply appears it's working but it's not transmitting. Anyways, the n900 is going back for a replacement, hopefully that will fix it but was just wondering :)17:06
andrewfblackKhertan: bad Khertan lol how are you getting them removed from extras?17:06
MohammadAGslackmagic, I got it from the US17:06
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slackmagicMohammadAG: and your fm transmitter is working right?17:07
Khertanandrewfblack: but i ll finish to implement syntax hilighting theme in pygtkeditor ... but i think i ll stop maemo development after that17:07
MohammadAGFMTX works, but even frequencies are blocked (xx.2/4/6/8/0)17:07
MohammadAGslackmagic, is it disabled?17:07
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andrewfblackWait you getting out of Maemo development?!!!17:07
andrewfblackI thought you were just moving stuff to new repo?17:07
slackmagicMohammadAG: that's what I was wondering, but even if it stated it was in enabled mode, it still wouldn't work17:08
Khertanandrewfblack: ask to the mailing list ... be blamed for that many and many times .... then ask again ...17:08
Khertanthen delete your garage account ... as some guys say ... yes but it s a lot of work ... and if you upload package again to extras ?17:08
* slackmagic wonders on a sidenote what kind of screen protector/case protector to get when the replacement n900 arrives. He might as well just protect it from the get-go17:08
Khertanandrewfblack: i don't know yet ... but to be honest ... this story pissing me of ... so i ll probably do development for me17:09
MohammadAGslackmagic, I mean disabled from the software side, as in not allowed in your country/state17:09
firestormthere was a nice case on the fourms slackmagic lookd nice n leather!!! from china 40 od $17:09
Khertanandrewfblack: but don't know yet if i ll do it available ...17:09
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andrewfblackKhertan: Some of your things like py2deb have meant alot to me17:10
Khertanandrewfblack: thx17:10
slackmagicMohammadAG: i read about that, but I flashed, I reflashed, still wasn't working, and since I've read of so many that it should be working when purchased in the US, I figured it's probably just my phone17:10
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Khertanandrewfblack: it ll still be available on my own repository ... but there ll be no evolution17:11
MohammadAGwell if the new one doesn't work download and install fmtx-faker, should enable disabled ones and enable all frequencies for US ones17:11
slackmagicfirestorm: yes there are some that are really nice. I'm more like interested in those that you put onto your phone like the zagg invisshield, heard good and bad things about it though...perhaps someone might have found a better solution in regards to that17:11
MohammadAGhopefully it comes working out of the box :)17:11
Khertanandrewfblack: can i suggest you to use pypackager ... this one is still maintained17:11
slackmagicMohammadAG: yep, hoping for that. Will ship it off today and go back playing on my G1 rofl17:11
Khertanand have some feature that py2deb didn't have17:11
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andrewfblackKhertan: ok17:12
Khertanthere isn't many change to migrate script to use pypackager instead of py2deb ...17:12
Khertanbut i must write a tutorial ... :)17:13
Khertani ll try to found some motivation to do it soon17:13
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firestormyer i'm scared of  dropping it or denting it n cracking casing!!!!! in my line of work not the best phone17:13
tybolltfirestorm: you work as ..?17:14
firestormwell i'm in i.t17:14
andrewfblackI'm about to go back to using pypackager again because I'm am not happy with having extra building my themes for me,  I would rather just upload the already prepared theme.17:14
firestormbut i do banger racing so playing with cars all the time etc. etc.17:14
firestormalso cracked G1 screen on the go kart track i work at!!!!17:14
nidOtip 1: dont take your delicate expensive phone with you when you're banger racing.17:14
nidOtip 2: if you have to ignore 1, buy a moto droid17:15
tybolltthe moto droid is a sturdy piece then?17:15
nidOthe screen's made of gorilla glass17:15
firestormit's not that normally put it on roof of car on in the van etc17:15
tybolltnidO: gorilla? :S17:15
nidOyou could utterly destroy the rest of the device before even scratching the screen17:15
firestormwill just have to be carefull it's insured :p17:16
nidOits essentially indestructable unscratchable glass made by Corning17:16
tybolltgod knows the N900 glass is not indistructable... I know first hand :D17:16
N900evilwhat did you do?17:17
nidOworth a look17:17
Khertanandrewfblack: pypackager can do in his last version create the debian package, create the source package ... or the both :)17:17
andrewfblackKhertan: nice17:18
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[Anti]hi there17:18
tybolltN900evil: oh I slipped on an iceptch w/ the device in my hand. My hand took the bulk of the blow but there was a major scratch on the glass of the phone - though right next to the speaker on the black shitz so not really visible17:18
[Anti]what can i do, if ./configure and compilation "freezing" some times in SDK?17:19
dmj726_n9001it is plastic actually17:19
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firestormyaya firmware updated!!17:20
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spectre-joikuspot is so awesome17:20
spectre-totally worth $1017:20
Arif_isnt it 20$17:21
tybolltdmj726_n9001: no, the screen is glass17:21
MarcusM [Anti] Does CTRL+C work? (It should end it)17:21
MohammadAGArif_, 7 euros (when I bought it)17:21
[Anti]MarcusM, yes17:21
[Anti]but i need to finish it ;)17:21
[Anti]and i want to know reason of freezing ;)17:22
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MarcusMBTW: In general, how is the battery life of the n900 compared to other modern smartphones/normal phones.17:23
cehtehis wesnoth useable on the n900?17:23
Arif_below average17:23
nidOcompared to highend smartphones, reasonably comparable ish17:23
MohammadAGMarcusM, one word? crap17:23
nidOcompared to normal phones, utterly woeful17:23
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KMFDMit depends on use17:23
tybolltMarcusM: can't compare... but battery life is about a full day, you always charge it overnight, sometimes even intraday.17:23
MohammadAGcompared to the 5800, not so much17:24
cehtehMarcusM: you can suck all juice out in 4 hours .. or it can last 1 week when idle17:24
KMFDMif you are on 3g17:24
MohammadAGbut yeah, ti depends on use17:24
KMFDM7 hours max17:24
dmj726_n9001it's about average as far as smartphones, but way shorter thana dumbphone17:24
nidOwish I could see a week :<17:24
KMFDMif you are only on wireless network17:24
MarcusMcehteh: While idle, would that be with sms? (:17:24
dmj726_n90016+ hours here17:24
cehtehcommon is anything inbetwen .. means you get a workday of moderate use17:24
KMFDMthen a day17:24
MarcusMDoesn't the battery get ruined by all that charging?17:24
* MohammadAG wonders when he'll see nuclear batteries17:24
Arif_the battery is hit and miss for me17:24
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Arif_sometimes it lasts 3 days17:24
Arif_sometimes 10 hours17:24
MarcusMHah :p17:24
tybolltdid anyone actually ge that extended battery?17:24
MohammadAGit lasts me a school day with 3G on17:25
cehtehmy battery still does well despite a lot recharges, and the batteries are not that expensive17:25
tybolltthe silly one w/out the cam door?17:25
MohammadAGschool day + another 4 hours with 3G off17:25
nidOthe device really should have a 1500mah battery minimum :<17:25
pupnika non-backlit screen and a 2000mah battery please please nokia17:25
KMFDMMohammadAG, i have to charge at school or my battery dies ont he way home17:25
cehtehbut i'd really liked a battery with 50% more17:25
MarcusMKMFDM: So what do you use your phone for?17:25
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tybolltcehteh: there is that mugen batt, tried it?17:25
cehtehpupnik: yeah turning backlight completely off should be an option17:25
cehtehtybollt: nah i want standard size17:26
Arif_the N900 already is a brick17:26
KMFDMMarcusM, during the day at school my normal use is idling on irc17:26
Arif_Muge doesn't do it any good :D17:26
pupniki was hoping some form of oled with 1/2 the drain cehteh17:26
MohammadAGpull the backlight ribbon17:26
cehtehthe mugen is way too big and expensive, no cam slider, and so on17:26
KMFDMand reading powerpoint presentations and pdfs17:26
KMFDMfrom instructors during class17:26
cehtehpupnik: oled is crap17:26
MarcusMKMFDM: And only that makes it drain the life energy? Hmm.17:26
KMFDMMarcusM, yes because im connected to 3g17:26
KMFDMthe phone doesn't like my school's network17:26
MarcusMWhat if you used Wifi only?17:26
MohammadAGI'm not worried about the slider or the price, but camkeyd won't work with the mugen bat17:26
pupnikcehteh: the only problem i know is lifespan17:27
tybolltcehteh: so do I, guess we will continue dreamin then ;D17:27
MarcusMDoes that make a difference?17:27
cehtehpupnik: since oled must be active and overshine sun and other bright light it means you waste a lot energy17:27
KMFDMMarcusM, yes a huge one17:27
MarcusMOh I see.17:27
KMFDMbattery lasts AT LEAST 3 times as long on wifi17:27
KMFDMassuming you don't watch video17:27
KMFDMmultimedia use drains it pretty quickly too17:27
cehtehwhile the n900 display is transreflexive and works pretty well in sunlight without backlight17:27
cehtehgps draws too17:27
MohammadAGWfif lasts me 12 hours17:27
Arif_listening to internet radio lasts quite long suprisingly though17:27
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Arif_over 3G that is..17:28
Hoxzer_:) I prefer fm17:28
Arif_the connection drops an awful lot though, they should fix that17:28
cehtehMarcusM: you cant get good estimates, the powersaving works pretty well, and the cpu is quite powerfull when running it extremely much depends on your use17:28
firestormMohammadAG: firmware done now :)17:28
tybollthmmm gorilla glass -nice there :)17:28
Arif_Hoxzer_, no Turkish FM channels in .nl17:29
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MarcusMcehteh: I just guess it's gonna make a _huge_ difference compared to my current w810i which can last a week.17:29
tybolltthey had me at the guy wearing a mustache and a set of protective goggles :D17:29
tybolltlooked real scientistish :D17:29
Arif_MarcusM, worst case scenerio is 6 hours17:29
MohammadAGwith little/moderate use17:29
MohammadAGonce I forgot overnight, connected to all IM servers with wifi17:29
MohammadAGforgot it*17:29
MohammadAGand it had 25% or so when I woke up17:29
Arif_the best is a working day17:29
Hoxzer_i wish they would improve the fm radio by making it ablr to automatically look for new channrl when old one dies17:29
cehtehMarcusM: i keep mine plugged in at home to have it charged when i leave the house17:29
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ShadowJKtybollt, my extended battery for n900 arrived just now17:30
cehtehand when i really do a lot with it it lasts less than 5 hours17:30
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tybolltShadowJK: mugen?17:30
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Arif_Hoxzer_, its called RDS?17:30
ShadowJKtybollt, yeah17:30
Hoxzer_Arif_: dunnno what's that called17:30
cehtehits really not optimal but barely ok17:30
tybolltShadowJK: pics!17:30
ShadowJKtybollt, there's a youtube video you know?17:30
tybolltShadowJK:  (not of the missus - the phone/batt)17:30
Arif_if the same channel is on a different frequency17:30
Arif_RDS automagically switches to that17:30
cehtehyou just have to recharge whenever possible17:31
MarcusMcehteh: And how much does a battery cost these days?17:31
Arif_original or Chinese?17:31
pupnikso is there any superior display technology available now/soon cehteh ?  i see many articles on alternatives17:31
MarcusMoriginal :P17:31
firestormne other ways to install rootsh ? as don't wanna install via app manager17:31
cehtehthere are cheap and crap china batteries for 3Euros .. dont use them they have half the capacity :P17:31
tybolltShadowJK: of the mugen? No I did not, care to link me?17:31
Arif_about 15euro here17:31
MarcusMHmm, could be manageable.17:31
cehtehyeah at 15-20 euro you prolly get a reasonable good battery17:31
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cehtehwell i didnt buyed a 2nd one yet17:32
Arif_firestorm, apt-get? :p17:32
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cehtehand there is battery eye you can watch how much its weared out and how well it behaves17:32
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nidOgod I cant stand that video17:32
nidOher nails just make me want to punch her in the face17:33
MarcusMcehteh: On the original as well?17:33
nidOno idea why.17:33
MarcusMnid0: Hah ;)17:33
firestormapt-get rootsh?17:33
Arif_aww, nidO is in love17:33
cehtehi have some hopes that someone releases a 1800mah standard sized battery .. that would be a buy17:33
Arif_apt-get install rootsh17:33
Arif_I guess17:33
MohammadAG<firestorm> ne other ways to install rootsh ? as don't wanna install via app manager ?17:33
MohammadAGArif_, that won't work without rootsh...17:33
Arif_you can't do that as user?17:34
nidOtbh I dont see why a 1500-1800mah battery the same size shouldnt be doable17:34
MarcusMdamn that extended one makes it look like a brick :p17:34
Arif_it already is a brick17:34
ShadowJKnidO, you can get any label on the battery you want, even "9000mAh"17:34
cehtehnidO: i think too17:34
X-Fadecehteh: Then Nokia would have put it in anyway. They use high qualitiy lipos, there is just nothing better.17:34
ShadowJK(if you order in quantity)17:34
cehtehShadowJK: well the n900 can measure it .. :P17:34
nidOgoing by volume at least, the bp-4l is almost identical to the n900's battery17:34
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nidOand thats 1) 4 years old and 2) 1500mah17:34
cehtehbut basically you can balance size, capacity, endurance ...17:35
ShadowJKcehteh, the design_capacity value can be faked :)17:35
cehtehnope this are not smart batteries17:35
cehtehthe counter is in the device17:35
ShadowJKyeah but design_capacity isn't a counter17:35
ShadowJKthird pin on the battery is a resistor that signals design_capacity17:36
Arif_if the indicator stays at full and the phone suddenly dies you know its fake17:36
ShadowJKchange the resistor and another value will show up17:36
ShadowJKArif_, or that you have an old battery :-)17:36
cehtehShadowJK: if someone makes a slightly more expensive, more capacity battery which lasts lets say 30% less it would be doable and quite ok for me17:36
pupnikn900 is a seriously useful device.  that is why i churn through battery so much17:36
ShadowJKthe battery seems surprisingly light17:36
furunk3lwow, the extended battery cover is huge.17:36
Arif_pupnik, orly17:36
spectre-i do like 6 things on it at once17:36
cehtehShadowJK: i thing the 3rd pin is a thermistor17:37
furunk3lif you fit it under a car, you can change the tires, holy moly17:37
ShadowJKcehteh, I think that's on-device..17:37
spectre-3g connectivity, xchat, joikuspot occasionally, shoutcast radio, etc17:37
ShadowJKthere's one near the battery anyway17:37
firestormMohammadAG: don't know it just comes up and says failed17:37
cehtehwell i dont really know17:37
spectre-how much extra life do you get outta the extendo model battery?17:37
spectre-or supposedly get?17:37
pupnikspectre - wish shoutcast client would let me filter by bitrate17:37
MohammadAGfirestorm, well there's only one way to do it without HAM, you sure you want to do that?17:37
nidOtheoretically itll almost double battery life17:38
cehtehbut it should be doable to do a higher capacity battery with the same sizes and less charge cycles17:38
furunk3li just bought a second battery plus an external charger. if one battery is down, i exchange the batteries and load the empty battery in the external charger.17:38
nidOfrankly though I see absolutely no benefit whatsoever in the mugen battery17:38
ShadowJKnidO, the "1800mAh" extended battery for N800 turned out to be 1200mAh :)17:38
firestormMohammadAG:  yer i wanna be nosy and have root and look about lol17:38
spectre-yeah amen pupnik17:38
nidOShadowJK: I assume hes referring to the 2400mah mugen17:38
furunk3lthe battery was like 5 euros on amazon and the charger like 6 euros.17:38
tybolltI'll take a heavier battery, not a bulkier17:38
furunk3l*15 euros for the battery17:38
tybolltfurunk3l: ??? charger? the mugen requires a separate charger?17:38
MohammadAGfirestorm, ok, follow the instructions you used to flash the device until you have it in flashing mode (don't type any commands)17:39
ShadowJKtybollt, furunk3l is not talking about mugen17:39
* cehteh considers to build a external battery connected through the micro usb17:39
nidOI don't see any point whatsoever in the mugen that makes the device bigger though, just buy a powermonkey external battery or similar, they come in powers from 2000-6000mah, cost less, and you can choose to leave them at home when you want something ligher17:39
cehtehprolly worse efficiency .. but easy to do17:39
spectre-haha sounds like you'll need a backpack or sling to carry it around17:39
cehtehcan put that in the backpack and charge the device there17:39
MohammadAGI wonder why Mugen didn't make a same size extended battery, like with the N9717:39
pupnikspectre-: is there an easy way to add current station to favorites?   i get mostly broken stations when going through shoutcast/xiph lists17:40
MohammadAGthey made a same size 1800mAh one, and a 3600mAh extended one17:40
Hoxzer_has anybody managed to get ganyremote to work with maemo5?17:40
RurouniJonesAnyone got the .deb for the freebie (I assume) airport touch game that was on the ovi store?17:40
cehtehMohammadAG: well people told that the 1800mah one was crap and didnt last more than the standard one17:40
* MohammadAG mods his car battery into a backpack with a USB port17:40
spectre-not sure, i've manually added all my favs17:40
* Arif_ blinks17:41
MohammadAGcehteh, it did last more, but the difference was hours17:41
MohammadAG(2-5 hours)17:41
firestormMohammadAG:  is it worth it though?17:41
MohammadAGArif_, sign up on twitter, things like that are better said there ;)17:41
furunk3lsomeone should invent shoes, that recharge the phone while walking. the pressure on the soles produce energy, that while be converted into electricity.17:41
MohammadAGfirestorm, just do it17:41
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cehtehwell .. i'll go to get a 2.5mm plug .. matching the charge adapter which is in the package17:42
nidOnokia are working on something similar already.17:42
spectre-i'd really like a bitrate filter though17:42
spectre-cause i'm on shit gprs at the moment17:42
cehtehand then connect 5 AA batteries to that, done17:42
MohammadAGYour weight in mAh17:42
ShadowJKnidO, yeah I think I would have used external batteries too if N900 has 2mm charging plug.. but with the musb, it's so difficult to plug it in without looking :/17:42
* Arif_ doesn't follow that kind of things on his phone17:42
cehtehcharging them in another external charger17:42
pupnikspectre-: then it is just as easy for me to add a mplayer alias to my .profile, which is what i do.  streamtuner just has too much crap to wade through17:42
tybolltsjk: agree agree AGREE17:42
tybolltdamn I hate the usb-plug :)17:42
spectre-good idea17:43
MohammadAGsame, it killed USB OTG (at least officially)17:43
spectre-i'm gonna try that17:43
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tybolltsjk: OTOH it's actually EU fault we have the usb plugs :P17:43
spectre-what do you use for browsing the shoutcast directory?17:43
nidOpersonally i'm looking forward to getting a powermat battery so I wont have to piss about with the goddamn usb plug any more to charge the thing17:43
pupniki just have a few stations i found over the years17:43
RurouniJonesUSB OTG?17:43
MohammadAGspectre-, I use tunewiki-community17:43
ShadowJKWell, N900 battery measures 100kOhm, N810 battery 120kOhm, N900 mugen 2.4Ah measures 170kOhm.. so atleast it's signaling higher cap :-)17:43
RurouniJonesWhat is the OTG bit? Acting as a usb host?17:43
cehtehi was thinking about routing vcc and gnd out and add some charge contacts to the case17:44
MohammadAGUSB On The Go17:44
MohammadAGRurouniJones, yes17:44
cehtehbuilding a simple charge cradle17:44
spectre-i'll check that out, thx mohammad17:44
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RurouniJonesSonova, charging via the USB is what killed that?!17:44
cehtehbut the pcb contacts are only accessible when you disassemble the device17:44
MohammadAGRurouniJones, at least that's what Nokia said17:44
* RurouniJones mutters darkly17:45
Arif_is there a way to easilly add the PS3 gamepad support?17:45
Arif_I'm not too keen on adding kernel modules and whatnot....17:45
ShadowJKbad news: I see no magnet on the extended cover... memory card functionality might be bad17:45
nidOits a shame really, its good that the mobile industry is standardising charging, but it's a shame they had to pick such a consumer unfriendly connector for it17:45
pupnikserious congratulations are in order to Nokia for dropping durability!17:45
RurouniJonesUSB - The only connector that required 3 rotations to get right when insterting17:45
Gadgetoid_mbppupnik: I think Nokia have made the N900 really easy to drop17:45
ShadowJK3.86V shipping charge17:45
MohammadAGArif_, install SIXAXIS(TM) Support (which adds the modules for you)17:46
Gadgetoid_mbpI've dropped it more times than I've ever dropped all of my other phones combined...17:46
MarcusMGadgetoid_mbp: Why is that? :P17:46
spectre-i've dropped mine from 5ft to concrete17:46
Gadgetoid_mbpApart from the Sonim XP3, which I dropped on purpose17:46
spectre-barely a scratch17:46
Arif_MohammadAG, oo. just that?17:46
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spectre-and it landed on a corner17:46
* Arif_ opens extras17:46
pupniksame spectre-17:46
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pupnikout of my shirt pocket17:46
N900evilRurouniJones, feel for the logo on the top17:46
tybolltGadgetoid_mbp: ooooh you have the sonim?17:46
* tybollt PM17:46
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* MarcusM messes with Python and some textfile output17:47
MohammadAGArif_, yes, but you'll have to pair using GlovePIE on windows or sth else on linux (not sure)17:47
Gadgetoid_mbptybollt: Yeah, it's fun!17:47
RurouniJonesSo, no one got the airport touch deb? Why the hell did Nokia remove it from the ovi store...and why did they leave it on the maemo select site taunting me....feckers17:47
Arif_as long as I don't hav eto mess too much with things...17:47
* Arif_ thinks of buying a sixaxis17:47
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ShadowJKI see no reflector for the camcover detection either :)17:47
pupniklets make an OpenStreetMap racing game :P17:48
Arif_RurouniJones, its boring anyway17:48
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RurouniJonesN900evil: Not so easy when some connectors have embossed logos on both sides (Granted they are different but still annoying for us non-brail readers ;)17:48
RurouniJonesArif_: I played the iPhone version in a shop, twas quite fun for train game I thought17:48
MarcusMpupnik: Pretty nice idea TBH :P17:48
MohammadAGArif_, I have 5, you want one?17:49 = 1195 :o17:49
MohammadAG100 bucks without shipping or tax17:49
pupniki heard someone was making such a thing for symbian MarcusM17:49
ShadowJKoh, camera works17:49
MohammadAGShadowJK, you got the battery?17:49
Arif_MohammadAG, yeah sure thats way cheaper than buying a new one =P17:49
ShadowJKbut flashlight doesn't work17:49
pupnikhow do you start camera with the mugen ShadowJK ?17:49
MohammadAGdoes shortcutd work?17:49
MohammadAGpupnik, press the camera button17:50
ShadowJKpupnik, press camera button?17:50
MohammadAG(remove the original battery cover and press the camera button, it works)17:50
ShadowJKor camera from the menu17:50
cehtehcamera button is configureable17:51
cehtehbut i rather wonder if mounting the microsd works17:51
MohammadAGthat would be a blocker if it doesn't17:51
MohammadAGyou'll be getting rid of: the kickstand, the lens cover, and microSD functionality17:52
ShadowJKmicrosd doesn't work17:52
MohammadAGas well as shortcutd17:52
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MohammadAGthey overlooked it :/17:52
Arif_and it wont' fit in your pocket17:52
* cehteh just watches at battery eye .. my battery shows no signs of wear, it even improved slightly17:52
MohammadAGArif_, it would, but yours pants wouldn't be on you17:52
* ShadowJK goes eat dinner17:53
ShadowJKcehteh, I wouldn't trust the measurements anyway :-D17:53
cehtehShadowJK: i really feared that17:53
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Arif_N900 is already like 500g17:53
cehtehShadowJK: well from usage its still as bad as it always was :P17:53
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MohammadAGcehteh, imo, + soldered USB extender would be a better option17:54
MohammadAGit's 99 bucks, but it's 6000mAh17:54
* cehteh needs some charging otg ... bike hub dynamo, battery pack and so on17:54
Arif_cehteh, solar charging!17:55
cehtehbetter option than what?17:55
cehtehArif_: solar charging sux17:55
MohammadAGthan the mugen17:55
nidOI have a solar external battery + charger17:55
cehtehyou need a huge panel and a lot of dependable light17:55
Arif_or one of those 3500mAh packs that you can plug the N900 into17:55
nidO2000mah battery, can charge it via usb as well if needed, works pretty well17:55
X-FadeMohammadAG: Just buy this and change the cells to serial.'d need to charge those too17:55
cehtehnidO: and pure solar charings takes days or?17:56
X-Fade8x 5800Mah for $100 :)17:56
cehtehbuying a handfull AA costs 10 euros, actually i have some laying around17:56
Arif_the easiest way is just to take a few spares with you I guess17:56
cehteh50 cents for the 2.5mm connector17:56
nidOyeah fully charging it takes days, but it's more than perfect to just charge on usb then leave somewhere in sunlight to ensure it stays charged, or at a pinch to solar charge a bit extra when out and about for a long time17:56
cehtehsmall box for one eur17:56
X-Fade46400mAh lipo, sweet ;)17:57
cehtehso i get a 2000mah pack for 11.50Eur ..17:57
MohammadAGX-Fade, I actually DO mind carrying 1262g with me17:57
MohammadAGand that's without the N90017:57
Arif_you need to rebuy batteries though!17:57
cehtehnimh rechargeables17:57
Arif_that could work17:58
cehtehthat will work17:58
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cehtehwell and i consider buying:
* Arif_ ponders on getting one of those when going on vacation17:58
cehtehprolly because i am to lazy to solder such a thing by myself17:59
cehteh(and its not easy to reach that efficency, i am not an EE like DocScrutinizer)17:59
Arif_are the Nokia USB car chargers any good?17:59
cehtehonly bike here, no car :P18:00
Arif_I can't use either18:00
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* MohammadAG wonders18:01
MohammadAGwhat if I put the dynamo on the car wheels18:01
ShadowJKArif_, I use the bigger one.. DC-10 I think18:01
ShadowJKit's good18:01
ShadowJKBut it has the annoying blue-led syndrome18:01
cehtehMohammadAG: hub dynamo? :)18:01
cehtehShadowJK: eww :P18:01
* cehteh configures all blue away from the notification led18:02
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Arif_blue led syndrome?18:02
cehtehwell purple is cool18:02
MohammadAGcehteh, yeah, thinking about connecting it to a car and putting it on those test things18:02
MohammadAGthe ones that you drive on but keep the car still18:02
ShadowJKArif_, it has a ring of blue shine18:02
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Arif_my 3.5mm charger has a green led18:03
lcukblue leds are like evil alien technologies, they exist outside the visual spectrum, always just a tiny bit out of focus18:03
Arif_I mean this one18:04
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DrGrovGood evening everybody18:07
Arif_oh hai thur18:08
ShadowJKdc-6 is a weaker car charger18:08
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DrGrovhow is it going in here? :)18:08
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DrGrovany news on the much anticipated PR 1.2? :)18:08
Arif_its not out yet ;)18:08
Arif_15 euro vs 35 euro18:09
* Arif_ ponders18:09
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Arif_oh well18:09
Arif_I have too much money anyway =D18:09
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MohammadAGArif_, can I have some? :p18:10
nidOyou know, you could buy a 15 euro charger for both of us18:10
firestormi'llh have some money aswell if ur offering.18:10
Arif_what makes you think I'm a nice person ?18:10
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b0unc3hey guys, I can update to the new SDK via apt ? is it safe ?18:11
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nidOyes, yes18:11
DocScrutinizerX-Fade: 145A discharge cont. I, nice :-D18:12
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DocScrutinizerX-Fade: ...for a 99bucks pack18:12
MohammadAGb0unc3, it's the only way to update it18:12
MohammadAGfakeroot apt-get dist-upgrade18:13
b0unc3MohammadAG, ah ok , thank you18:13
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ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, what pack is that..18:21
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DocScrutinizerShadowJK: [2010-03-24 16:55:57] <X-Fade> MohammadAG: Just buy this and change the cells to serial.
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DocScrutinizerConfiguration: 8S1P / 29.6v / 8Cell18:22
DocScrutinizerConstant Discharge: 25C18:22
* ShadowJK sends mail to mugen telling them about the back cover sensor and the camera door sensor..18:22
firestorm     '#'''#]18:23
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cehtehDocScrutinizer: how expensive would the development of something like the bumm E-Werk like? .. high efficent current and voltage regulator with little loss and proper handling of undervoltage etc18:24
DocScrutinizerand weather resistant case18:24
cehtehguess you would need a uC for that, and some clever electronics18:24
DocScrutinizercehteh: just buy one of those18:25
DrGrovdamn i get stress of nothing being able to get a invisible shield closer to home... just gotta order one, damn!18:25
* ShadowJK has vikuiti now18:25
cehtehweather resistant isnt really a problem .. last thing i build (simple electronics) is just sealed in hot glue :P18:25
JaffaAnyone know how to integrate HildonLiveSearch into an existing (Python) application?18:26
cehtehShadowJK: they redesigned the back-cover already once .. fail :P18:26
ShadowJKshould have maybe emailed them earlier :D18:27
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cehtehDocScrutinizer: making a community project for such, maybe selling self made pcbs and kits ... but developing it would prolly need some effort18:27
DrGrovtybollt: vittu? :D lol... that is a profanity in Finnish18:28
tybolltja jag vet18:28
DocScrutinizercehteh: development is easy from a EE POV. marketing and MP isn't18:28
DrGrovtybollt: aha, du är svensk. då talar vi samma språk även om jag är från Finland.18:28
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DocScrutinizeras is ID/mech/case18:29
cehtehnah just small open project, no MP and marketing, make a website with all schemantics and code (avr?), pices list and mostly done, ... people will ask about kits and preproduces pcbs or maybe about assembled device and then do that on a per-order or in little batches as long its fun and they pay some bucks18:30
cehtehi am not interested in making a big business from that18:31
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DocScrutinizerI'm not interested in making any business from that - can't afford, too expensive :-P18:31
cehtehhehe ok18:31
cehtehwell maybe i just buy the e-werk .. while i think its really overpriced :P18:32
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DocScrutinizerit's reaonably priced for a low-volume MP device18:32
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DocScrutinizercehteh: see, a mould for a plastic case costs some 50k18:33
cehtehDocScrutinizer: hey .. pcb, hotglue, shrinkwrap18:34
cehtehah you mean the bumm thing yeah18:34
DocScrutinizerfor volumes like 50..200 plastic cases built to order you pay ~100 bucks/unit18:34
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cehtehi bet they'll rather sell 50k units18:35
cehteh(over time)18:35
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N900evilshagways can be an alternative for one or two.18:36
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ccookeshapeways are good, yeah18:37
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fluxmohammadag, camkeyd works with mugen battery cover18:37
N900evilexpensive for all but the smallest vases.18:37
N900evilthough vases too.18:38
ShadowJKhm, mugen must've spent a lot of money on the N900 back door already with two redesigns18:38
DocScrutinizerN900evil: :-D18:38
ShadowJKand then the battery itself..18:38
ShadowJKI wouldn't want to be them :D18:38
fluxactually, now that I think of it, it might not. but it does work with shortcutd. I don't know if they had a different principle in enabling/detecting the camera key.18:38
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DocScrutinizeractually it's not uncommon for a company to sell first batch of hw at a "dumping price" where they *pay*/lose hundereds of $$ per device sold - just to get the momentum18:41
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timeless_mbpDocScrutinizer: you mean companies who know what they're doing? :)18:42
tybolltthose does not exist18:43
fluxbut indeed sd doesn't seem to be mounted :). I guess a workaround must exist..18:44
DocScrutinizersome have better crystal ball than others18:44
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DocScrutinizerflux: workaround for pragmatics is a small magnet and a piece of doublesided sticky18:45
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fluxdocscrutinizer, I meant a software-workaround18:45
fluxI don't really hotswap my sd-card a lot. infact, I've never taken it out so far :)18:46
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cehtehflux: throw the ke-recv daemon into the trashbin, write a proper fstab, prevent the startup scripts overwriting the fstab18:47
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cehtehmount it manually18:47
DocScrutinizerthis doesn't change the fact mugen did a pertty poor engineering when specifying their replacement cover18:47
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cehtehdoes ke-recv do anything else except mounting?18:47
DocScrutinizernuke it and learn :-P18:48
cehtehi did once .. nothing bad happend18:48
fluxcehteh, what's the /dev entry for the external sd? I guess udevfs removed it as well when I changed the cover..18:49
cehtehbut i didnt nuked it completely and rebooted yet :P18:49
cehtehflux: its nokia, they do everything differently18:49
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fluxI think it was /dev/mmcblk1, as I have mmcblk0p1 for ~user/MyDocs.18:50
cehtehthe ke-recv daemon is responsible for that crap .. i just dont know if it does anything important else18:50
fluxI guess I could just try mknodin the device and mounting it. or just look what the world looks like with the real cover :)18:50
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cehtehi mount all my partitions manually from fstab18:50
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cehtehbut it still unmounts it when removing the cover18:51
cehteh(i didnt turned that off, fearing to brick the device when the daemon does anything else which might be vital)18:51
fluxthe description in the init script of ke-recv says 'HAL-based automatic mounting etc.'18:52
fluxsounds like it is its main function18:52
cehtehyeah .. and whats 'etc' ?18:52
fluxunmounting :)18:52
fluxloading/unloading related drivers etc18:52
cehtehok you try .. remove it from the startup, reboot your device and report to me if it still works18:53
fluxoh and performing critical flash maintenance, which makes the flash last for longer than a day :P18:53
cehtehif yes, i owe you a beer, if not you have to reflash/restore by yourself :P18:53
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fluxfirst step would be to just /etc/init.d/krecv stop18:53
fluxke-recv even18:53
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cehtehyes that works18:53
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cehtehtried that .. i just didnt tried the final step removing it so that it doesnt start at reboot18:54
fluxso it still unmounts stuff even if it's stopped?18:54
cehtehprolly its safe .. but i just reflashed my device when i played that stuff and restored all and didnt wanted to brick it again18:54
cehtehnot it doesnt to anything when stopped18:55
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cehtehi just wasnt sure if it spreads some fairy dust somewhere else .. manages usb connections and so on18:55
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cehtehits *very likely* safe to remove .. but i wanted zero risk18:56
DocScrutinizerthe joy of a missing recovery system18:59
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cehtehon a 32GB device ...19:00
cehtehi mean if it had 256MB flash at all .. then i could understand that19:01
cehtehbut being a fully capable computer with an almost debian like ok .. nokia tried really hard to make it uncomfortable19:01
cehtehi hope meego will fix that19:01
DocScrutinizerI'd hope a better NOLO would fix that eventually19:02
Arif_oh my19:02
* cehteh could make a safe boot and rescue system in a few days ... but there is no point in that since its incompatible with any nokia firmware update19:03
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cehtehwell let kernel rescue aside -- just userspace rescue would be a huge improvement19:04
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DocScrutinizernolo bootmenu for multiboot would be really nice19:04
cehtehyes sure19:04
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: do a bug for NOLO source? ;)19:04
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DocScrutinizer"bootmenu" as in "hold '2' for 2nd partiton boot"19:04
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cehtehthere is a rescue boot package in some repo (devel?)19:05
cehtehbut i dont know what it does19:05
cehtehhaving a minimal kernel and kexec would work too19:05
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cehtehanything else would be better than the current cruft19:06
fluxcool. does it work?-)19:06
mgedminX-Fade, any idea why doesn't show who uploaded that package?19:06
cehtehwell no bugtracker doesnt nag me .. but no doc what it actually does nags me19:07
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DocScrutinizernidO: freat description of the whole pkg over there :-S19:08
DocScrutinizerGreat even19:08
nidOpackage is nothing to do with me :>19:08
DocScrutinizerI lknow19:08
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DocScrutinizeror at least I'd not suppose anything else19:08
MohammadAGUbuntu 10.04 moves the X button (and the rest of the bunch) to the left :/19:09
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DocScrutinizerwell, me away for enjoying some nice weather and dinner19:09
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DocScrutinizertzz >>Description: Implement rescue boot method.<<19:15
cehtehheh ...19:15
cehtehi just got the source ..19:15
cehtehthere is something missing19:16
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cehteh.. and i think its something vital :)19:16
ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, do yo know about
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ShadowJKI mean, are you aware of it? :-)19:16
DocScrutinizerthe much appreciated new hook Nokia implemented into their system crankup19:17
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cehtehinstead this "missing bugtracker link" insanity there should be a rule "package has to be alive else it will be purged"19:18
ShadowJKyeah it's nice19:18
ShadowJKit's pretty early too19:18
cehtehalive as in either updates every 2 months at least or positive user feedback19:18
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: not entirely clear what exactly can be done at that point19:18
ShadowJKnot even mmc drivers are loaded :)19:19
ShadowJKor maybe just udev isn't running so there are no /dev nodes for it :D19:19
DocScrutinizerhmm cool19:19
DocScrutinizeranyway, I'm afk19:19
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JaffaWow, YoDude seems to have gone into full-blown "I'm the only sane one around here" mode whilst making *no* sense whatsoever.19:23
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pupniklink Jaffa ?19:24
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Jaffapupnik: hang on19:27
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Jaffapupnik: About half-way down when starts quoting GAN90019:28
Myrttiwell, I didn't vote for him anyway19:28
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GAN900Myrtti, somebody bought you with chocolate, didn't they? ;)19:29
MyrttiGAN900: you did, hunny19:29
pupnikwow, so much... talk19:29
Myrttisugar and sweet talkin'19:30
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GAN900Myrtti, crap, I'm on the hook for a lot aren't I? :D19:30
GAN900pupnik, hey, at least he uses newlines.19:30
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hormDCC SEND 0 0 019:31
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prontosomone ban horm19:32
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Lumpio-too late19:32
pupnikgoing forward maemo should look at what is enabling community software, and what makes it difficult19:32
pupnika lot of the talk* is just irrelevant19:33
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GAN900Ah, yes, my secrit plan to administer Talk.19:34
* w00t got bad vibes about him from day one really19:35
JaffaGAN900: I was going to say "actively involved like any other community member", but thought I'd ignore that part of his inane ranting.19:35
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* Arif_ sneezes19:39
GAN900w00t, peace, love, and a knife in the kidney19:39
GAN900Platform seems to be "Everything should happen on the forum, and forum people should get more say"19:39
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GAN900". . . members must go outside this forum to independent blogs and whatnot. Why is that?"19:40
GAN900Boggle inducing.19:40
w00tGAN900: i'm all for more connection between the different parts of the community, i'm not happy for giving say to people who aren't willing to work to make things happen19:40
w00tand yes, that made me laugh, a great deal19:40
javispedroIn the forum we trust.19:40
w00t..given that it was posted there when it happened19:41
Jaffajavispedro: One forum to rule us. One forum to bind us19:41
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w00tdon't make it versus the forum, though19:41
w00tI'd rather see it versus someone who is clearly out of their mind19:41
Jaffaw00t: Oh, indeed.19:42
Jaffaw00t: As I've pointed out, all of the candidates this time starting contributing on the forum before going anywhere else and are still enormously active there.19:42
Jaffaw00t: Which is why the "I'm the pro-forum candidate" pisses me off.19:42
w00tJaffa: mhm19:43
ali1234well maybe that speaks more about the role of counccil members than it does about the forum19:43
w00tI just look at texrat's post count and laugh when I see that19:43
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GAN900Mr. Hyperactive19:44
KhertanHi again,19:44
GAN900He had double the postcount of the next closest post last time I checked.19:44
Jaffaali1234: Sorry, the "that" is?19:44
w00tI need to start posting again19:44
w00tI was hyperactive for a few months and then I got a life again..19:45
ali1234Jaffa: the facct that all people who are standing for council spend so much time posting on the forums19:45
Khertani ve a question about device loaned device given at summit ... someone can scan me the contract for the return adress ?19:45
Khertani didnt found mine19:45
w00tali1234: I spend a great deal of my working life on IRC - are you going to say that implies something about me? :P19:45
ali1234w00t: yes, but that has nothing to do with what i am saying19:46
Jaffaali1234: Ah, OK. I still don't understand your point ;-)19:46
w00tin which case, I concur with Jaffa19:46
w00tI thought you were trying to imply that council candidates were too busy with making forum posts rather than getting things done19:46
javispedrouh oh, the Summit loan endings are soon?19:46
ali1234Jaffa: someone who doesn't post on forums is probably not interested in the community, therefore they will not run for council19:46
luke-jrali1234: bad logic19:46
luke-jrforums != community19:47
Khertanjavispedro : don t know but i ll not use mine19:47
ali1234yes, forums does = community19:47
w00tali1234: not exclusively so19:47
DocScrutinizer51luke-jr: yeah19:47
luke-jrali1234: forums are just stupid in general; IRC is real community19:47
ali1234it doesn't matter, it is by far the largest part19:47
Jaffajavispedro: Supposedly mid/end-April IIRC19:47
ali1234if IRC is the community then the ommunity only has 500 people19:48
javispedronice, I forgot about the return address too :)19:48
w00tactually, 572 of them, at this point in time19:48
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w00tcompared with 383 members online on TMO now19:48
w00tso, your point?19:48
Jaffaali1234: There are more accounts (used for Downloads, News and Garage) than there are active tmo accounts (using terms like "largest" is a bit woolly for my tastes)19:48
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ali1234my point is that tmo represents the community19:48
Jaffaali1234: Or that size matters19:48
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ali1234irc represents a very small and vocal elite of the community19:49
w00tno one thing can represent the community19:49
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Khertanali1234: exactly tmo represent the community ... a full of whining people19:49
ali1234isn't that what the council is supposed to do? represent the community?19:49
Khertanwhich complain for everythings19:49
DocScrutinizer51ali1234: I like to disagree19:49
ali1234if the community is full of whiners, then the council should be full of whiners too19:50
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ali1234otherwise it is not representative19:50
Khertanali1234: one advice : the community is dead19:50
w00tthen the way forward is clear19:50
* javispedro smells a pandora box opening19:50
w00tGAN900 for council19:50
luke-jrw00t's point stands.19:50
* w00t grins19:50
luke-jrIRC has more active users than TMO19:50
Khertanthere isn t no more community just people wanting things free ... fast and quickly19:51
luke-jr500 people cannot be a minority of 300 ;)19:51
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* GAN900 smells Khertan's burnout.19:51
DocScrutinizer51Khertan: not all are like that19:51
w00tKhertan: I think you need a break19:51
Khertanso noone have anymore the contract of the loan device ?19:52
lcukKhertan, whats your next tech purchase gona be?19:52
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* DocScrutinizer51 hugs Khertan 19:52
javispedroChaos reigns within. Reflect, repent, and reboot. Order shall return.19:52
ali1234Khertan: i've got mine19:52
GAN900Khertan, don't worry, it's my favorite fragrance!19:52
ali1234what do you need?19:52
Khertanlcuk : don t know yet ... probably none ...19:52
luke-jrmy next tech purchase is going to be a handheld that meets my minimum requirements, regardless of what company makes it or what OS it ships ;p19:52
luke-jrso far no such device has been announced by any company19:52
Khertanali1234: i need the return adress19:53
lcuk:) thn enjoy the time with your mrs khertan.  and the apps you have written are good.19:53
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javispedroluke-jr: so you were in the same situation as me until I decided to call it a day and buy the n810.19:53
Khertancould send me a scan of the contract pls ?19:53
Khertanlcuk: i enjoy it too ...19:53
luke-jrjavispedro: except the N810 was the worst tech purchase I have ever made :)19:53
Khertanali1234: khertan@khertan.net19:53
lcukluke-jr, buying things which dont meet your requiremenets is just folly and will make you a grumpy old man19:53
* Jaffa wonders how many people have posted to more than 3 threads in the last 3 months on tmo19:54
ali1234Khertan: Terhi Nousu P.O. Box 225 FIN-00045 NOKIA GROUP19:54
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lcukKhertan how will people know where to find pygtkeditor?19:54
Khertanmy requirement is quite simple for me ... something i can play with to made application and development onboard19:54
javispedrothat doesn't ring a bell, for some reason.19:54
lcukhas anyone offered to become a new maintainer19:54
lcukyou do it well!19:54
Khertanlcuk : i ll try to made some ads for my repository19:55
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Jaffalcuk: Khertan said the download will point to his repo. Khertan have you checked with X-Fade that /downloads/ isn't *entirely* driven by Extras?19:55
Khertanlcuk : download point to my repository19:55
* luke-jr wants at least 4"-6" display, 512 MB RAM, and usable keyboard :p19:55
lcukhow does that work tho?19:55
lcukithought all your accounts had been closed on your wishes?19:55
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Khertanjaffa: you can actually set an install file link19:56
Khertanjaffa: but i ven t check for link with extras19:56
Khertanlcuk: nope just garage currently19:56
* lcuk has never browsed downloads fro mdevice19:57
Khertanbecause xfade fear that it work hard for removing apps and i publish it again just after to extras19:57
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* javispedro is wary of going back to multiple repos again19:58
Khertanbut to be clear i didn t complain against x-fade19:58
lcukello rm_you :)19:58
Khertanjust that there is now need anymore of that account19:59
JaffaKhertan: Yeah, in the earlier OSes you could override it. But things like description get overwritten now by Extras and so I wonder if you can have an entry there which isn't backed by an Extras package.19:59
DocScrutinizer51Khertan: maybe just take a day off, to chill?19:59
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KhertanDocScrutinizer51 : i ve already take two weeks off20:00
Khertanit s not hot reaction20:01
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rm_youlcuk: how goes things? been out of the loop since n900 died20:01
Khertani ve setted my own bts20:01
rm_yous/n900/*my* n900/20:01
infobotrm_you meant: lcuk: how goes things? been out of the loop since *my* n900 died20:01
lcukKhertan, did you write vectormine in pygame?20:01
Khertanlcuk: yep20:01
lcukrm_you, i have been excessively busy20:01
lcuktheres some great examples there Khertan20:01
lcuksome more fodder for playing20:02
Khertanlcuk: why ?20:02
rm_youi've been looking for something to do, maybe will write a game for n900 using pygame :P20:02
rm_youbeen meaning to learn pygame anyway20:02
lcukbecause you might not like maemo, but you still have 3 hours a day on a train20:02
lcukand will get bored20:02
Khertanlcuk: :)20:02
Khertancurrently i m trying to made a package python apps for android20:03
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lcukdoes python run on android?20:03
lcuki thought it was java20:03
Khertanbut it s a bit difficult to made 'standart apps'20:03
lcukwhich device have you got?20:04
Khertannone yet20:04
Khertanjust the emulator on my netbook20:04
Khertani ll try soon to install nitdroid on the n90020:04
rm_youI have a G1 if you need testing20:04
lcuklol rm_you20:04
lcuk@ pygame enthusiasm20:04
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rm_youbetter than what i've BEEN doing with 100% of my time20:05
rm_youwhich is, playing L4D220:05
lcukKhertan, is there a code editor on the android?20:05
dmj726_n900isn't the android python somewhatm limited?20:05
ptlKhertan: you are Benoît, right?20:05
ptlI've read and responded your email on the mailing list.20:06
ptlIt's really a pity that you're androidizing.20:07
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GAN900rm_you, L4D2 sucks20:07
ptlbut, well... Hope PyGTKEditor survives!20:07
GAN900rm_you, they out took all of the soul and enjoyability of 1.20:07
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hrwhave  a nice rest of day20:08
Khertanlcuk: nope i didnt see any code editor20:08
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DocScrutinizer51so, on unrelated topic: anything remarkable happened 7h ago? (i.e. wed 12:00 UTC) ? XP20:08
lcukKhertan, would you now just use your netbook then?20:08
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N900evilare there SD to sata converters?20:09
Khertanptl: currently i m just looking arround me and playing a bit with android pkg nothing more20:09
lcukDocScrutinizer, that would be 13:07 my time, and i was just walking to the toilet20:09
N900evilNot the other way round20:09
lcukim not sure i need to go into finer detail20:09
javispedroDocScrutinizer: see the -devel mailing list20:09
N900evilto p.lug a hd into a sd slot20:09
Khertanlcuk : no the netbook is a pain to use in the metro20:09
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lcukso whatwill you use? n900->android?20:09
lcukthat would be amusing :D20:09
Khertancurrently i don t know20:10
Khertanstudying possibilities20:10
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lcuki think it should be more than feasible to make a qt based micro ide20:10
lcukfor on device dev20:10
lcukpyqteditor :D20:11
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Khertan_so android device could be one solution20:12
javispedroqteditor :)20:12
thopiekarhey I saw somebody using a N900 in the Regional Bahn 13 from Düsseldorf to Hamm I think playing  doom20:12
thopiekarare you here?20:12
pronto:o nice, i havent seen another n900 in public yet20:12
Khertan_running android on n900 an other20:12
prontoonly mine20:12
Khertan_but i found that the n900 is a great device for doing onboard dev20:12
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lcukKhertan, im not talking about running, im talking about editing20:12
thopiekarpronto: :P20:12
* ShadowJK hasn't seen android in public yet :)20:12
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javispedroI've seen two n900s already20:13
lcukisaw a robot in the rain20:13
prontoreally?, i've seen loads of andriods20:13
javispedro... but a lot of android phones20:13
lcuk:( it was all ruted20:13
Khertan_but i think i ll do the dev on the n900 ...20:13
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prontobut never a single n900 xD20:13
ShadowJKseen lots of winmob though20:13
lcukKhertan, you will need an editor20:13
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prontoi'm seeing less and elss win mo20:13
thopiekarI would say that he was one of ours, I mean IRC user :P20:13
Khertan_probably with pygtkeditor20:14
Khertan_never seen any mameo device ... or n90020:14
Khertan_i see many many many iphone in train in france20:14
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Khertan_or droid device20:14
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* ShadowJK has never seen an iphone in real life either20:15
ShadowJKa few ipods though20:15
Khertan_lcuk: yep i think the first thing will to made an editor :)20:15
Khertan_lcuk: yep i think the first thing will be to made an editor :)20:15
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javispedroShadowJK: where do you live? in Cupertino? :)20:15
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Khertan_ouch right now i can count 15 iphone user in the wagon20:15
Khertan_about 40 people20:15
ShadowJKsaw a Samsung non-android touchscreen20:15
DocScrutinizer51heard eyephone is illegal there XP20:15
Khertan_lcuk: there are nice pygame snippet in the repository20:17
Khertan_well written20:17
lcukwhich ones, the one i pasted or elsewhere?20:17
Khertan_the one you paste20:17
lcukyeah i know i had a look20:18
lcukwhat would happen if you signed up for ovi using your employer as company? :)20:18
Khertan_i ve my own company20:19
javispedroblack helicopters would unleash ninjas20:19
Khertan_but you can sign20:19
Khertan_but cannot still publish for maemo20:19
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lcukjavispedro, i mean after the ninjas have left20:19
Khertan_lcuk: ovi store is still not really open20:20
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Khertan_this is why i ve made my own registration scheme20:21
rm_youGAN900: nah, it's better by quite a buit20:21
Khertan_but vectornine have no success ... too geek i think20:21
Khertan_3 sell20:22
Khertan_and 2 from the same person which register it for two device20:22
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GAN900rm_you, dunno, I can't stand it.20:22
GAN900rm_you, and we played hours and hours of 120:22
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GAN900rm_you, it's so bad I went back to Halo Wars. :P20:23
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b0unc3guys, how I can set a key shortcut to my application ? (also in code)20:23
lcukall apps have a key combination, just press shift+ctrl+x+name of app+enter20:24
lcuksimplicity itself!20:24
fralsassuming the binary is in PATH, right? ;)20:25
lcukb0unc3, i dunno how to do it20:25
lcukisnt there some .desktop magic?20:25
Khertan_uHHHH ! send email from mfe with a google account is now working !!! GREAT !20:26
b0unc3lcuk, boh :)20:26
javispedrowe need a strong council candidate that will bring us a FINAL FANTASY THEME!!20:28
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javispedrodoes no one think of the children^Wfinal fantasy fans?20:28
GAN900javispedro, no! Hello Kitty!20:28
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Khertan_ah hem in fact not the email was sent because now smtp is allowed by my mobile isp20:29
javispedrolet democracy do its job! hello kitty vs final fantasy theme20:29
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GAN900There can only be one!20:30
Khertan_gan900 : none will be better20:31
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javispedrothere can only be none, then20:31
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Khertan_connection will drop soon20:32
Khertan_bye everyone20:32
javispedrocya Khertan_20:32
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Khertan_and if someone are looking for a python dev in paris ... i m open to any proposition ...20:32
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wazdso, who's gonna be tomorrow@fruct? :)20:34
lcukwazd, is it in moscow?20:36
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Khertan_hum   ... i think PyGTKEditor will got a new name .... so avoid that HAM stupid repository priority20:37
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wazdlcuk: yep20:37
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lcuki think theres someone i was speaking to today whos goin20:37
lcukare you goin?20:38
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Khertan_maybe also a new open source licence the Khertan OSS licence which forbidden to upload it to maemo repository :)20:38
wazdlcuk: yep20:38
wazdlcuk: at least it's gonna be fun :)20:39
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Khertan_hum ... i'm far from any cities ... and still not lost 3G connection20:39
javispedroKhertan_: you're evil.20:39
lcukyeah - theres a qt overview/training stuff there too isnt there20:39
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javispedrobtw lcuk, I have to say that I hadn't yet tried liqflow with "gravity" yet20:42
lcukwhat do you mean20:42
javispedrothe one with accelerometer input20:43
lcukohhh you had an 810 last time20:43
javispedroit's pretty nice20:43
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javispedroI think it adds "the missing touch" that makes liqflow quite entertaining20:43
* javispedro says that after spending a few minutes glazing at it20:44
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ptlKhertan's connections died, it seems20:44
lcuklol javispedro i have been too busy to finish the changes i want with it20:44
madduckwhy are there applications for which i cannot add a shortcut to the desktop?20:44
lcuktho suffice to say it works with sketches and selectable stuff20:44
madducke.g. wireshark20:45
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madduckand is there no way to switch desktops while arranging icons and widgets?20:46
javispedromadduck: you can actually drag a widget to a corner20:47
ptlyes, there is20:47
ptlif you drag it to the corner it changes desktops20:47
madduckjavispedro: yeah bugt then i cannot go back20:47
javispedrodrag to the opposite corner :)20:47
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madduckso moving 10 to another desktop is PAIN20:48
javispedroit works here20:48
javispedroyou have to drag from the outside of the screen20:48
madduckmove, exit, switch, enter, move, …20:48
madduckthat works20:49
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madducknow how do i add a shortcut for wireshark?20:49
javispedroask wireshark maintainer20:49
javispedroprobably bad desktop file or the like20:49
madduckoh dear20:49
madducki thought maemo is debian-based20:50
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lcukit is, just like we are likely "ape-based"20:50
madduckbut debian is known for it just working ;)20:50
lcukdoesnt mean i swing from trees every day20:50
madducklcuk: hehe20:50
javispedrodebian is known for just working O.o?20:50
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* lcuk goes making some code mods20:51
DocScrutinizer51foreca once 'bricked' my devicce when trying to drag widget to anothher desktop20:51
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DocScrutinizer51infinite reboot20:52
ShadowJKhow do they manage that :)20:52
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lcukschrodingers widget20:53
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lcukits both active and not active, but you cannot tell until you get to desktop20:53
DocScrutinizer51lcuk: 'bricked'20:53
lcuki know20:53
lcukdid you file a bug?20:53
lcukif not, how do i reproduce it20:54
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lcuki can test it now20:54
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DocScrutinizer51Though I know better, I seem to slowly adopt the common usage pattern for that term20:55
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javispedrono! first you start misusing 'bricked', then you end up complaining about pr1.2 not having mms!20:56
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javispedroit's the road to tmoness.20:56
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* w00t bricks DocScrutinizer 20:57
GAN900DocScrutinizer51, it doesn't lack for inertia. ;)20:58
GAN900I dunno, fMMS was damn easy to get working.20:58
lcukfmms ftw20:58
ShadowJKLet's call it "barefoot" instead. unbootable, barefoot, get it20:58
wizkoderWhat do I do if I need libcrypt++ on the N900 for ma program?20:58
lcukget libcript++ on your n900?20:59
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wizkoderlcuk: Can't find it with apt-cache. Should it be there?21:00
lcuki dunno21:00
lcuklook for yourself21:00
lcukand if not, you may have to port it21:00
DocScrutinizerok, my device went barefoot on simply dragging the foreca widget from screen1 rightside to screen2. Instant reboot, and bootloop21:00
wizkoderlcuk: Its not there then. But the debian page states that an arm version exists.21:01
* javispedro does one time offer: a pair of shoes for barefoot n900, only $99!!!21:01
DocScrutinizerbtw, on a sidenote, I have to state 3G is severely borked on constantly losing connection while cell-handover21:02
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ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, last time mine borked was in january :-)21:03
DocScrutinizerbroken ever since, or what? ;-P21:04
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MarcusMWhat is mostly used for watching vids on the n900? mp4?21:06
Stskeepsi use avi without transcoding :P21:06
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MarcusMAnd why that, and not the others? (:21:07
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MarcusMHigher quality or?21:07
nidOdyou mean container, or codec?21:08
MarcusMUhm, both I guess :P21:08
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DocScrutinizerlet me put it this way: I click on the file or on the title in mediaplayer. Usually it plays and I don't care about format or codec21:09
nidOI have a whole range of media formats, mostly ffmpeg mp4's, xvid mp4's and avi, and h.264 mp4's21:09
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DocScrutinizerprobably h.264 should be somewhat better supported, aiui, as it has hw acceleration via DSP21:10
MarcusMneat :p21:11
nidOh.264 can be unreliable actually iirc21:11
nidOI dont remember the details but I found a few of my media files wouldnt play, from what I remember theyre all h.264 encoded but I cant remember what was different about them compared to the rest of mine that dont work21:12
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nidOi'm yet to come across any divx/xvid/ffmeg mp4/avi's that dont play though21:12
DocScrutinizermight choke the DSP and need reboot to recover from broken video playback . that kind of unrelaiable?21:12
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nidOno, just a few that blankly give an "unsupported media format" error21:13
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nidOthey might have been in an mkv container for all I remember, ill check later21:13
LuciusMare - i guess this is not exactly wanted and expected behaviour...21:13
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* MarcusM loves
LuciusMareI have manually installed libgtkhtml12-0, though it still fails21:17
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DocScrutinizerghtml2 vs  libgtkhtml12. maybe 12 vs 2 doen't cut it? dunno21:20
* RST38h moos at the moon21:20
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konttorimadduck: in pr1.2 you can swipe and it'll pan also in edit mode.21:23
LuciusMareI misread it21:23
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LuciusMareyeah, i have "gtkhtml2"21:23
LuciusMareNobody here uses anki? :<21:24
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w00tkonttori: awwwwwesome.21:24
konttoriwell, doesn't really matter much imho. It's such a small pain that that fixes.21:26
konttoriwe should probably not even bothered to fix it.21:26
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w00tit's a pain, and that means that fixing it is good :p21:26
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w00tsometimes it's the small annoyances that get noticed21:27
w00tand that is one that I have noticed a lot21:27
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lcukactually konttori thats quite a nice fix21:28
pillaryeah, I agree21:29
konttorimeh. I setup my widgets / contacts / bookmarks once, then I don't touch them almost at all anymore.21:29
* konttori has been working on theming improvements and noticed that image-viewer and calendar have the ugliest-ever hardcodings in their gtkrc files.21:30
lcuki thought you werent working!21:31
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RST38hkonttori: unless the media widget stops working, then you remove it, then you readd it, then all the other widgets crash, then you add them one by one21:32
* RST38h hides promptly =)21:32
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javispedrokonttori: in pr1.1 you can also swipe, but only if you start the gesture from outside the screen (much like the browser cursor gesture)21:34
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LuciusMareSo i tried the qt version of anki21:35
LuciusMareImportError: No module named QtGui21:35
konttorijavispedro: ah, so, that's the same in 1.2 as well. I get lost in which we had implemented for which release21:35
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* javispedro can see it21:36
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javispedroI predict something will happen that will make me have to leave when the meego meeting starts21:37
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MarcusMnoobish question: How do I know if my sim card got 3g? Or isn't it regardless, as it depends on the phone?21:37
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Myrttiit's more about the subscription plan attached to that sim card than the sim card itself21:38
MarcusMBut I would still be able to use the phone _even_ if I was unlucky enough not to have 3g?21:39
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lcukkonttori, have you come up with any ways to solve those hard coded issues, or is it just something you are pondering21:39
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MyrttiMarcusM: probably21:39
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javispedroharcoding things are the norm in maemo :)21:40
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konttorilcuk: I added to theme maker themes to postinst rm <imageviewer gtkrc>.21:40
mikkovjavispedro: have you tried new version of sgx drivers from sdk on device?21:40
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javispedromikkov: nope. is that even sane? I would have though they would be shims.21:41
konttoriI haven't yet come up with perfect plan how to 'fix' calendar, but I think I'll just manually create sane gtkrc for it and then add postinst to replace existing one with that. Evil, but what can you do?21:41
mikkovI don't know. That's why asked you? :)21:41
javispedrothen no, I didn't :)21:41
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konttoriI also worked on the messaging css and html files and fixed those views to support portrait mode.21:42
andrewfblackkonttori: I'm getting some reports from some people working on themes that their themes are failing due to [2010-03-24 21:30:49] Unable to satisfy build-deps: hildon-theme-layout-5 (< 0.14.0) is that because hildon-theme-layout-5 got updated to 0.15.0-1+0m5 yesterday?21:42
konttoriit was only a matter of dropping some width settings and changing some widths to max-widths.21:42
* Arif_ wants a DSi XL21:43
pupnikcan we block from overwriting the url in microb ???21:43
konttoriandrewfblack: probably. No idea though.21:43
Arif_but the colors suck!21:43
Kegetysargh, is there some way to intercept the IM sound+vibration event and drop it for certain chats? chatter on a skype group chat constantly beeping and whirring the N900 is getting really really annoying21:43
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lcukkonttori, nice :)21:45
LuciusMareI wonder why is the anki in repos, while it can't even start21:46
lcukwhich repository is it in?21:46
lcukand what does it do21:46
lcukor meant to do21:46
LuciusMarelcuk: a flashcard software21:46
konttoriLuciusMare: by repos, do you mean devel?21:47
LuciusMare(i know)21:47
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LuciusMareBut one would kinda expect a little problems21:47
lcukthen, its sole purpose is being there is to give oyu incentive to fix it21:47
lcuki expect a patch by morning :p21:47
lcukcan it accept custom card sets?21:48
LuciusMareit even can download them from the net21:49
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lcukdo you need a "how to fix broken apps" flashcard set?21:49
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lcuk#meego-meeting starting in 12minutes21:49
* LuciusMare can't fix any apps21:49
lcukLuciusMare, but you could contact the developer and report it21:50
lcukhaving users interested in his packages might give incentive for him to cure21:50
LuciusMarehm, I will21:50
LuciusMareAt least it's python21:51
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LuciusMaregeeze, just the dependencies take 6% of rootfs21:53
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LuciusMareIt looks like a job for... /opt !21:53
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LuciusMarelcuk: yeah, sorry, I didn't notice i didnt turn off the devel21:54
LuciusMarei thought it is in "standard" extras21:55
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lcukLuciusMare, no need to apologise :)21:55
lcukjust contact the app dev anyway21:55
lcuksame reason applies21:55
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lcukim goin concentrating on #meego-meeting for a bit anyway21:56
LuciusMareyes, but installing an app from -devel and moaning on irc that it does not work is...21:56
LuciusMarelcuk: what's going to happen there?21:57
Arif_the app manager is awfully slow lately :(21:58
Arif_it needs a rewrite!21:58
ptlit keeps spinning, isn't it?21:58
LuciusMareArif_: go ahead21:58
ptlit needs to stop spinning, only that21:58
Arif_it takes 5 minutes to open the category list21:58
Arif_and another 20 to open the list of apps21:58
jacekowskiit's related to it updating package list every time21:59
jacekowskiand that's what takes a time21:59
Arif_maybe I should disable devel21:59
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LuciusMareArif_: i recommend, it is a breeze22:00
Arif_but all the fun apps that don't work are there ;(22:00
ptlis it written in python?22:00
LuciusMareWell, yes. The drawback of it is that you lose access to the non-functional apps22:01
Arif_I only added it for drnoksnes anyway22:01
LuciusMareptl: i assume22:01
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javispedroArif_: yes no need to remind me the damage I done.22:02
LuciusMareoh, SNES22:02
javispedrofortunately drnoksnes is now on -testing, so disable -devel ALREADY!22:02
Arif_but now picodrive is in devel!22:02
Arif_oh and maybe qtirrecco will be fixed someday22:02
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LuciusMaresomeday, you will enable it again22:03
* Arif_ doubts it22:03
ptlrecode it in C++ and it will be faster if the algorithm is the same.22:03
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Arif_maybe my IR is broken22:03
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LuciusMareohai speed22:04
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Arif_drnoksnes needs one more vote22:05
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* LuciusMare is not voting22:05
Arif_why not22:05
LuciusMareFirst, i have no idea what voting are you talking about ;p22:05
LuciusMareto get there?22:06
lcukwho is imadsousou22:06
LuciusMareand, it's a snes emulator? And is it good?22:06
Arif_yes and yes22:06
Arif_only thing bad about it is the keyboard is too crappy to play properly :P22:07
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LuciusMarebuy a wiimote :)22:07
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ptlI voted for drnoksnes22:09
ptl10 votes22:09
ptlI use it regularly and it's pretty stable22:09
* RST38h just read it as "dorksnes". Oh shit.22:09
ptlyeah, the name is weird22:10
javispedroit has quite a story behind it22:10
javispedrowell, not.22:10
ptlI often change the letter order22:10
ptlbut it's doctor Nok SNES22:10
ptlso, dr. nok snes22:10
LuciusMare"Dork's NES" ?22:10
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javispedrocomes from mixing drpocketsnes and nokiasnes22:11
ptlI don't know who is doctor Nok. Is he better than Gregory House? Is he a pediatrician? A neurologist?22:11
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LuciusMareptl: no way better than drwho22:11
javispedroAnd I didn't made any of the those two names :)22:11
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RST38hDr Nok is the Nokia founder22:11
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Arif_ptl, its Alan Harper in disguise!22:12
RST38hHe used the first Nokian tire to catch the Fish, as shown at the first Nokia logo22:12
Arif_oh btw22:12
Arif_the Wiimote doesn't have enough buttons to use as SNES controller22:12
Arif_unless you can use the classic controller, which I doubt ;922:12
ptlImagine if Dr. Nok had married the debian founder. Instead of deb + ian we'd have Nokian GNU/Linux.22:12
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* ptl detects obscure reference to first Nokia logo and will google for it22:14
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LuciusMareWasn't nokia first a tire making company?22:15
ptlNokia sold rubber bands?22:15
RST38hRubber products22:15
RST38hTires, boots, condoms22:15
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lpotteractually timber22:15
LuciusMare"connecting people"22:15
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RST38hWhich kinda makes me wonder why they can't produce a decent body protector...22:15
ptlcondoms really do connect people22:15
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LuciusMareyeah, more like separate22:15
ptlthey isolate, but they help connecting without dire consequences22:16
ptlso they help connecting22:16
ptlthe pope complains about that all the time22:16
* LuciusMare puts a condom on his ethernet cable going to the internet22:16
RST38hptl: He has probably got spines and needles all over, so he cannot use condoms22:17
RST38hHence complaints.22:17
Arif_they made paper too, right?22:17
RST38hreally gnight now22:17
Arif_LuciusMare, it only protects %99 of all attacks!22:17
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* Arif_ sends LuciusMare N900 PR1.2 3.2010.09-9 EURO.bin.exe22:19
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* condom filters out the attack22:19
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* Arif_ turns DMZ on in LuciusMare's router22:21
ptlthat recalled me of a bug report I opened in ubuntu when my firefox tried to run a virus from a webpage through wine.22:21
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lcuki still dont know who valhalla and imadsousou are22:21
Stskeepsthe two dictators of meego22:22
lcukor even which channel im on22:22
ptlthat was one of the supidest bugs ever. And they were not finding where to fix it. A simple change in mailcap would do it...22:22
ptlwell, I'm curious22:22
ptllet's see what happened to this bug report22:22
LuciusMareptl: why didnt you tell them?22:22
ptli did22:23
Arif_I reported one bug and I'm still waiting for a fix22:23
LuciusMareI once reported a bug22:23
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LuciusMarewith a patch22:24
LuciusMaretook them two months22:24
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ptlhmm... didn't find22:25
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* Arif_ yawns at Moomo 522:26
ptl -- I opened it 18 dec. 200822:27
ptlnot resolved yet22:27
Hoxzer_anybody has a lirc configs for irreco?22:28
ptlfix was committed.22:28
ptlthere was a duplicate... which has a higher number?22:29
ptlHoxzer_: you have to search the lirc configuration page22:29
LuciusMarethe later one22:29
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ptlLuciusMare: yes, and how can my ticket be a duplicate of a later one? isn't it the opposite?22:30
ptloh well22:30
ptllet it be22:30
ptlthe bug is fixed anway22:30
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Arif_yay for opensource with community input!22:34
LuciusMareyay for.22:34
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* Shapeshifter is looking forward to the pyside release22:41
LuciusMareOh, and any progress with usb host/serial communication?22:42
ptlwhy the name pyside anyway?22:42
ptlit doesn't remind me of qt22:42
Shapeshifterptl: ask #pyside?22:42
ptllet's see22:42
ptlno response22:44
Shapeshifterptl: It's a relatively quiet place22:44
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Shapeshifterptl: AND you got an answer just now22:44
Arif_I crave roasted sunflower seeds...22:45
LuciusMareso, ptl?22:45
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Shapeshifter21:44 <         baraujo > ptl, Py for Python and "Side" is the finnish word for "binding", IIRC22:45
mortalis it possible to automatically form a radio station list on n800?22:45
Shapeshifterwhich makes sense, because part of the pyside project is general C++ binding generation for python, not just Qt.22:46
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LuciusMareany progress with usb host/serial communication?22:46
acidjazzi think maemo shoudl get an award for people contributing the most useless apps ever in the history of cell phones22:47
acidjazzMRAWviewer is an image viewer for RAW image file formats as those produced by modern DSLRs.22:47
acidjazzyea cuz we all need that on our cell phones22:47
LuciusMareacidjazz: yeah, it also ran through my mind when seeing such as "daddyhelper" "girlperiodwatch"22:47
javispedroyes yes! we need more fart apps!22:47
achipaacidjazz: cuz fart apps are overrated22:47
Shapeshifteracidjazz: the point is, if one persone needs it, he can just write it in any language they want, and offer it. if only one other person also uses it, it's already win.22:48
LuciusMarewell, raw viewer is at least reasonable22:48
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ptlis there at least one fart app for the N900?22:48
achipaptl: moobox22:48
GeneralAntillesacidjazz: yeah, not iPhone and it's 1001 farts apps or anything.22:48
Shapeshifterptl: cat /usr/share/icons/*/*/* > /dev/dsp?22:48
GeneralAntillesacidjazz: just because YOU can't envision a usage for it, doesn't mean other people wont.22:48
javispedroand if there isnt i will send you boxed farts by free22:48
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acidjazzGeneralAntilles: the iphone also has apps that are useful as all hell22:48
GeneralAntillesHey, so does Maemo!22:49
* GeneralAntilles uses FBReader every day.22:49
ptlShapeshifter: lol22:49
acidjazzsure it does22:49
ptlShapeshifter: why not vmlinuz? the kernel song!22:49
Shapeshiftermh. no /dev/dsp :o22:49
GeneralAntillesacidjazz: so your point is, nothing?22:49
Shapeshifterptl: icons music usually has great rythms22:50
Shapeshifterbut some farts as well.22:50
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Shapeshifterbtw, some dude in here was right yesterday. turning off skype (just IM, never called anyone) increased my battery life at least 2h over a day.22:51
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* LuciusMare never turns on im unless he want to contact someone22:51
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javispedrodont you measure your battery life in weeks then22:52
LuciusMareno, i use my n900 as a lightbulb22:52
acidjazzGeneralAntilles: we _Dont_ have those useful apps22:52
GeneralAntillesacidjazz: bullshit.22:52
ptlShapeshifter: activate SmartReflex!!! :P22:52
acidjazzGeneralAntilles: show me shazam .. pandora .. fucking google maps.22:52
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acidjazzGeneralAntilles: show me one app we have thats a top 20 or top 50 appf or iphone or android22:53
GeneralAntillesWe have a browser that doesn't suck which eliminates 90% of the crap you're going to pull up.22:53
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acidjazzthats not an app22:53
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GeneralAntillesRight, because having a browser that can actually do stuff means you don't need dedicated applications to do Google searches. . . .22:54
acidjazzyou're getting off topic22:54
acidjazzand you're also wrong22:54
Shapeshifterptl: any downsides? I read there "might" be crashes and stuff22:54
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GeneralAntillesacidjazz: clearly.22:54
GeneralAntillesacidjazz: troll elsewhere.22:54
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ptlShapeshifter: I didn't use it, I have no issues with the somewhat short battery life. Everywhere I go there's an outlet.22:55
ptl*I don't use it22:55
LuciusMareif we dont have them, go ahead and write them22:55
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ptlbut it seems that your mileage may vary wildly22:55
LuciusMaremileage ^^22:55
ptlsome people on the bug report page report all kinds of reboots and problem... other people report no issues at all22:55
javispedroi enabled smartreflex this morning22:56
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javispedroit seems there is a bit of an improvement when not in idle22:56
javispedrobut none at all in idle time22:56
javispedro(speculation only for now)22:56
GeneralAntillesjavispedro: wasn't there a stability issue?22:57
ptlI translated the recipe to portuguese and posted in a couple brazilian sites.22:57
konttorilcuk: I just sent you nuvo 1.08 to your gmail. Have a go while talking on the meego-meeting22:57
GeneralAntillesSeems like Igor had something to say about it on -developers. . .22:57
ptlwith a big red warning, of course...22:57
javispedroGeneralAntilles: yes I backed up stuff. no problems so far though.22:57
ptlshake your phone, see if it reboots.22:58
* javispedro does22:58
javispedrono reboots.22:58
LuciusMarewhat is smartreflex?22:59
povbotBug 7633: Enable SmartReflex on N900 by default22:59
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SpeedEvilvarying supply volts22:59
ptlLuciusMare: a hidden feature of the N900 processor that helps extend battery life22:59
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ptlnot really hidden22:59
ptlbut not advertised22:59
* GeneralAntilles was just typing that22:59
ptland no enabled by default22:59
GeneralAntillesWell, TI advertises it.22:59
SpeedEvilso hidden that there are several hundred pages in the datasheet about it.23:00
javispedronot really hidden and doesnt improve much :)23:00
Shapeshifterwhat a random mixed bag of experiences with enabling this...23:00
ptlyeah, I figured the same.23:01
ptlno pattern there23:01
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LuciusMareconfirming, i will not enable it till someone finds the pattern23:01
javispedrobecause nobody does formal testing23:01
GeneralAntillesShapeshifter: seems a popular trait for OMAP3 features.23:01
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ptlwhat is better: fcron, alarmed or system event scheduler?23:03
Shapeshifterptl: alarmed, because I wrote it :P23:03
Shapeshifterptl: I haven't actually tried the others ;) fcron seems nice though. alarmed as a gui.23:03
LuciusMarei got a call, it ended... but the portrait mode stood23:03
ptlIs it stable? I've read in the very beginning that it had some issues (and congrats for theapp)23:03
* LuciusMare is typing sideways23:03
javispedrosystem, because you can count on it existing23:03
ShapeshifterWhat's this "system event scheduler"?23:04
javispedroand it will even power on the handheld for you :)23:04
ptlhuh? no, system event scheduler is a new app23:04
javispedrowithout the e23:04
Shapeshifterjavispedro: alarmed is a frontend I wrote for alarmd.23:04
ptlit's in extras-devel23:04
Shapeshifterso it uses alarmd.23:04
javispedroah, good job then23:04
LuciusMarewait, how can it turn on the handheld?23:04
javispedroit calls a zombie23:05
javispedrowhich does it for you23:05
LuciusMareright, but... nevermind23:05
ptla cron-like daemon that works when the device is off? That would be terrific, lol23:05
javispedroit does it like your average pc98 does23:05
Shapeshifterptl: seems like that's something similar to alarmed. but I know that mine got quite a nice set of features including specifying your own commands.23:05
javispedrowith an rtc and a good power supply.23:05
LuciusMarenever figured out how does it do that23:06
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MarcusMIs it possible to disable _all_ kind of mobile internet and only allow wifi? Curious (:23:06
ds3has anyone tried creating a Maemo4 chroot environment on a N900?23:06
Shapeshifterptl: also, alarmd (and as such the alarmed frontend) does turn the device on indeed. And I can't even implement an option to turn that behavior off because it's missing from the pymaemo bindings -.-23:06
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MarcusMon n900 that is.23:07
Shapeshifterthe pymaemo bindings are crippled. and once I reported a bug including fix (very obvious bug that completely brakes dbus event scheduling) and it's not fixed to this day.23:07
asj_hey that's my program, lol23:07
LuciusMaredefine: once23:07
Arif_MarcusM, offline mode? :P23:07
LuciusMareArif_: wifi at offline mode, indeed23:07
MarcusMArif_: That wouldn't exactly allow incoming calls/sms, would it? :P23:07
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MarcusMI only meant data etc.23:07
Arif_its hard to allow sms/calls when the network is disabled23:08
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nidOhow about just delete your mobile internet apn?23:08
MarcusMI mean the web network etc :P All the expensive part (:23:08
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Arif_get a web only sim :P23:08
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Arif_I never notice incoming SMS messages23:09
Arif_the sound is so quiet....23:09
dnearyVDVsx, Ping?23:09
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Arif_and doesn't play when you're listening to music23:09
MarcusMI'm being misunderstood (: I want to temporary only allow the n900 to do calls & sms via my sim. No auto-connect to mobile network.23:09
VDVsxdneary, pong23:09
nidOjust turn auto connect off...23:10
Arif_MarcusM, disabled auto connect to internet23:10
dnearyVDVsx, I don't know if you saw jacktanner's request on "ask the council" - I sent him on to you because the situation is kind of delicate23:10
Arif_it'll always ask, though :P23:10
MarcusMnid0: I do not have a n900 yet, so I wouldn't be able to mess with that yet ;)23:10
asj_LuciusMare: the alarm server can turn on the phone if you ask it to.  So if you have an alarm set like "time to get dressed" the phone can turn on and give you the alarm23:10
MarcusMArif_: Ah, god.23:10
Arif_but that really annoyed me after 10 minutes23:10
ptlShapeshifter: I misunderstood it, when you said it turned the device on I thought that you meant that it was really off -- powered off, not screen-off.23:10
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Arif_now to implement auto disconnect and Nokia's done23:10
dnearyHe missed the account creation date window by 2 weeks for election eligibility, but he's been doing stuff in Maemoi since Christmas.23:10
dnearyIt's a grey zone23:10
Shapeshifterptl: yeah, "really off".23:10
user__i'm on n900 with xchat, what i can do to view the user list? sorry for my english i'm italian.23:11
Shapeshifterptl: btw, cpython is "the" python. the usual python interpreter everyone uses.23:11
ptlShapeshifter: oh23:11
Shapeshifterptl: if you run python, you run cpython (in almost every case).23:11
dnearySo I told him he's not eligible according to the rules, but perhaps you might allow him to vote based on his activity23:11
ptlinstead of jython, is it?23:11
VDVsxdneary, no, I'm with limited Internet these days(mobile only), only saw some mails and I'm attending the meeting now23:11
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dnearyI'm easy either way, but since the rules were established to prevent ballot-stuffing, and this is clearly not ballot stuffing, I'd personally (if the decision were mine) tend towards including him23:12
ptlShapeshifter: there is no way to turn the device on if no software is running... it's powered off! That's what I understood...23:12
VDVsxdneary, don't know nothing about him or his activities, but fine by me23:12
Shapeshifterptl: python is just a language, so there are some other interpreters but they're slower and have less features. cpython is the usual one. yeah jython is also another interpreter23:12
dnearyVDVsx, It's in the "Ask the council" thread on Talk that he made the request23:12
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Shapeshifterptl: no, there's something in the "BIOS" so to speak that can turn the device on23:12
Shapeshifteronly taking out the battery will completely make it dead23:13
ptlShapeshifter: at a given, programmed time?23:13
Shapeshifterptl: yeah.23:13
ptlhmmm, wow. How to do this?23:13
Shapeshifterptl: you can do that with most modern PCs btw in bios. on the n900? well alarmd/libalarm provides that functionality.23:13
Jaffadneary: If we took the "" account to mean any account on (which we do for, then counts similarly, surely?23:13
nidOptl it's worth noting almost all mobile phones since the dawn of time have been able to do this23:13
nidOalong with all pc's23:13
VDVsxdneary, will try to check later, but ok from my side, better send him to council at maemo dot org, if there's need for a more formal clearance23:13
Jaffadneary: AIUI, his account is older23:13
ptlnidO: I didn't know that, I've never seen a phone turn on by itself after I have turned it off.23:14
nidOin most cases it's just used for the alarms in phones23:14
jacekowskiptl: RTC23:14
Shapeshifterptl: until now most of them just did that for alarms23:14
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nidOset an alarm, turn the phone off23:14
jacekowskiptl: in bios settings23:14
dnearyJaffa, By 3 weeks, yes23:14
nidOtime gets reached, phone switches itself on, alarm goes off23:14
jacekowskiptl: you can tell it to wake up pc at specified time23:14
dnearyJaffa, Which is why it's a grey area :)23:14
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jacekowskiptl: because pc never shut's down really23:15
jacekowskiat least not atx pc23:15
dnearyVDVsx, He chose to do it in the open, on Talk. <shrug>23:15
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Jaffadneary: But does his account creation date preceded the deadline? If so, it doesn't seem *very* grey to _me_23:15
VDVsxdneary, can't promise anything, but you know my answer now (stupid ISP grrrr)23:16
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MarcusMptl: I almost shitted myself when my phone suddenly started alarming while it was turned off. Now I know why. Rofl23:16
ptlMarcusM: I've never seen that happen, I'd be alarmed too, I live alone and my cats don't know how to turn on my devices :P23:17
dnearyJaffa, Rules is rules23:18
ptlVDVsx: you only have to promise PR1.2 gets released now!23:18
Jaffadneary: Indeed, but we parse " account" to mean "any account on"; including Garage, Talk and - by extension - Bugs. Better to have the discussion than not, of course23:18
VDVsxptl, will be released until the end of the year, my dog promises that :P23:19
* GeneralAntilles is with Jaffa.23:19
ptlVDVsx: THIS year?23:20
VDVsxptl, let me ask23:21
ptlwell, something's better than nothing23:21
VDVsxI'm joking of course, I don't know nothing about that, neither have a dog :P23:21
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ptloh :(23:22
dnearyJaffa, And by "we" you mean "I"?23:22
VDVsxptl, sorry :P23:22
dnearyJaffa, I parse it by "date of account creation in the Midgard dump I get sent when I ask for it"23:22
VDVsxptl, better ask a Nokian about that :P23:22
dnearyAnd to figure out more, I need to go digging - spent half an hour looking to see what Mr. Tanner did to get his karma, and when, this morning23:23
Jaffadneary: And by "we" I mean "we, the community, that you do"23:23
Jaffadneary: The last election definitely, explicitly, included tmo accounts cos I worked with Reggie to give you a list of ones which were 3 weeks or older23:23
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ptlI thought you were a nokian, VDVsx. Indeed, I thought you were "the" nokian, something like a leader.23:24
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VDVsxptl, lolol, nop only Maemo Community council member for a few more days ;)23:25
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javispedroyou're planning a coup detat, evil chairman!23:26
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VDVsxtrip to vegas with the imaginary council money :P23:26
dnearyJaffa, I also included talk accounts this election (got the cut-off date for talk IDs & there were 6 or 7 who had previously existing Talk accounts who made the karma requirement)23:27
dnearyBut for (for example) wikibedia edits or bugzilla bug reports, it's trickier23:28
dnearyVDVsx, Enjoy your imaginary winnings !23:28
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Jaffadneary: Wikipedia edits, to be signed, require a garage account don't they?23:28
GeneralAntillesVDVsx: lol.23:28
infobotJaffa meant: dneary: wiki edits, to be signed, require a garage account don't they?23:29
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GeneralAntillesVDVsx: welcome to the "I thought you were a Nokian" club. :P23:29
SpeedEvilWow. It's amazing how much better sandpapering my touchscreen made it.23:29
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SpeedEvil(blocks is bad)23:29
GeneralAntillesSpeedEvil: SANDPAPER?23:29
SpeedEvil(it was 2um sandpaper)23:30
VDVsxGeneralAntilles, ehehe, but everybody knows that you're a undercover Nokian :p23:30
GeneralAntillesSpeedEvil: texture change?23:30
SpeedEvilleaves stuff shiny.23:30
SpeedEvilGeneralAntilles, naah - lots of scratches around the block origin point.23:31
GeneralAntillesAh, I see.23:31
jacekowskithey could have used capacitive touch screen23:32
jacekowskiwith glass23:32
SpeedEviland pockets with sand in.23:32
jacekowskimuch more resilient23:32
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: you are carrying sand in your pockets?23:32
GeneralAntillesjacekowski: pfft23:32
Shapeshifterjacekowski: pants made of sandpaper23:32
GeneralAntillesMuch more useless, too.23:32
SpeedEviljacekowski, gardening.23:33
Shapeshifterfirefox is pretty awesome. but it's extremely lame that it's in ovi.23:33
dnearyJaffa, Well spotted23:33
dnearyThe tricky ones are blog karma, bugs activity, talk23:33
SpeedEviljacekowski, listening to mp3 doing above.23:33
jacekowskii lost my headphones23:34
jacekowskiwhere i can get a replacement?23:34
* SpeedEvil was playing with desktop ff using n900 as display23:34
SpeedEvilall-in-one gestures.23:35
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GeneralAntillesShapeshifter: too lazy to fix their packaging.23:35
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ShapeshifterGeneralAntilles: well ff generally should fix their whole directory structure and everything23:36
GeneralAntillesEmphasis on the everything23:36
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Guest71122hello. what sw can i use to backup my n900? ovi suite 2 tells me that my n900 is not supported23:39
nidOtry the backup tool on the device named "Backup" in it's menu23:39
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ds3alright... guess I'll try it and see what happens then23:40
Guest71122hm.... i've installed a really old version of the pc suite which supports my phone. i cant believe the n900 isn't supported by ovi23:41
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GeneralAntillesds3: how was week one with the N900, by the way?23:45
ds3GA: mixed... too many apps I couldn't use... short battery life; the pluses are the screen is great... the supplied apps work great with the new UI but they lack features... and I still need to learn about widgets23:47
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GeneralAntillesds3: how short of a battery life?23:49
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ds3GA: barely a day (email only)23:51
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ds3the N800 did much better with tethering23:51
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GeneralAntillesds3: yeah, cellular is rather killer23:54
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GeneralAntillesds3: signal strength can be a big one, too23:54
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GeneralAntillesI get about 10 hours at my parents house thanks to the faraday cage that is plaster and lead paint23:54
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ds3*nod* I'm in low coverage areas a lot23:54
GeneralAntillesand about 16 at my apartment23:54
GeneralAntillesds3: carry a second battery and call it a day, I guess.23:54
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ds3that or I am thinking of that high cap battery but that turns the N900 into a 1" slab23:55
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ProteousI turn off 3g when I am not webbrowsing and that drasticly increased the battery life23:56
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ds3I can probally learn to live with the horrible battery life... it is the apps that is killing me23:56
GeneralAntillesds3: Mugen should be making one.23:56
ds3claws is choking more then it should... GarnetVM is choking23:56
Proteousthere is a nice 2g/3g toggle app for the pop up control menu23:56
ds3GA: that's the one I am looking at23:56
ds3Proteous: I have that installed.... it is on my list of things to try23:57
ShapeshifterGeneralAntilles: mugen has made one.23:57
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ds3Shapeshifter: has anyone used it?23:57
Shapeshifterds3: the lady in the presentation video xD23:57
nidOsome people have bought the battery23:57
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nidOthe back case is horribly designed23:58
ds3nid0: in what way?23:58
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nidOthere're no magnets for camera cover or back cover on/off primarily, so various things dont work properly23:58
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nidOsd card mounting being a biggie23:59
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