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| Arif_ | I'm not too keen on accelerometer controlling | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| ptl | indeed it just seems it was built for it | 00:00 |
| Noobmonk3y | arif, can lend you and iphone ;) | 00:00 |
| Arif_ | exactly | 00:01 |
| red | Shapeshifter: in 2010 and 2011 european SEPA countriies will start using a unified system for bank transactions | 00:01 |
| * Noobmonk3y apologises for swearing | 00:01 | |
| Arif_ | eyephone has some nice games | 00:01 |
| Shapeshifter | red: which is brilliant | 00:01 |
| Shapeshifter | red: I'm already using it and it's brilliant. | 00:01 |
| Arif_ | but ruined by accelerometer/touch | 00:01 |
| Arif_ | :( | 00:01 |
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| red | these get logged by a swiss corporation and CIA gets rights to view those logs | 00:01 |
| red | which i think is odd | 00:01 |
| Shapeshifter | red: I _am_ Swiss xD | 00:01 |
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| haltdef | what's wrong with it Arif_? | 00:02 |
| Shapeshifter | red: so, your source on this is? | 00:02 |
| red | I think ill start putting AL QAIDA -style messages into transaction text forms :D | 00:02 |
| Arif_ | dunno, it just annoys me =D | 00:02 |
| red | will be interesting to visit the states after a while then | 00:02 |
| red | Shapeshifter: followed some links from wikipedia | 00:02 |
| red | have an exam about SEPA tomorrow | 00:02 |
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| red | mainly the standard and the xml part of it | 00:02 |
| red | got a bit sidetracked reading :) | 00:02 |
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| Shapeshifter | red: yeah but, while I don't know anything about it, I don't think the cia has some "exclusive" rights to it, and "logging" isn't exactly a wrong thing to do with banking transaction. Actually, it's extremely important | 00:03 |
| red | it had something to do with the swiss company having their servers located at US for some legal reasoin | 00:04 |
| red | reason* | 00:04 |
| Shapeshifter | aha. | 00:04 |
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| humano | hello | 00:04 |
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| red | logging stuff is a good thing, but having pigs over the bay using the info at their own whim illegally is another thing | 00:04 |
| red | i for one dont trust that country and it's administration one bit, damn world police | 00:05 |
| Shapeshifter | red: ack | 00:05 |
| red | i dont like surveillance :p | 00:06 |
| humano | i need a howto tutorial to setup or configure the "IRC Protocol Plugin For Conversations And Contacts" for the n900 | 00:06 |
| * Noobmonk3y burps | 00:06 | |
| Jaffa | slonopotamus: pong | 00:07 |
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| Noobmonk3y | lol | 00:08 |
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| corecode | so how does that whole scratchbox thing work? | 00:19 |
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| pupnik_ | magic | 00:24 |
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| Shapeshifter | black magic to be more specific. | 00:26 |
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| kynky | there's this box, scratch and sniff | 00:27 |
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| hayalperest | hello | 00:48 |
| corecode | Connection failed [IP: 212.40.1.134 80] | 00:48 |
| corecode | :/ | 00:48 |
| hayalperest | can anybody help me with knots 2, i've done all of the steps | 00:48 |
| hayalperest | just hte last part doesn't work | 00:48 |
| hayalperest | is this the right channel to be in? | 00:49 |
| corecode | Running apt-get update on 'FREMANTLE_ARMEL'. | 00:49 |
| corecode | 0% [Waiting for headers] | 00:49 |
| corecode | :( | 00:49 |
| corecode | hayalperest: what's knots2 | 00:50 |
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| hayalperest | it's a program that lets you stream media off your desktop | 00:50 |
| hayalperest | can somebody please help? | 00:50 |
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| nidO | exactly what problem are you having with it | 00:52 |
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| wazd | HTC HD2 will not be upgraded to Windows Phone 7 series | 00:54 |
| wazd | fail :D | 00:54 |
| hayalperest | it works perfectly fine with ssl off on my 3g | 00:55 |
| hayalperest | but when i turn it on, i cannot connect to it | 00:55 |
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| hayalperest | it just says it can't connect | 00:55 |
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| corecode | anybody else have problems using repository.maemo.org via scratchbox? | 00:59 |
| corecode | it hangs | 00:59 |
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| pupnik_ | htc may have hired a decdent designer but they are no nokia | 01:00 |
| pupnik_ | and nobody in korea gets open-source | 01:00 |
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| pupnik_ | so really, screw them | 01:00 |
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| pupnik_ | corecode: browse archives for possible solutions | 01:02 |
| corecode | pupnik_: i am | 01:02 |
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| nidO | um. | 01:03 |
| nidO | just tried to download an app from ovi store | 01:03 |
| nidO | it failed | 01:03 |
| nidO | and now all my repos are gone :\ | 01:03 |
| corecode | pupnik_: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle | 01:04 |
| corecode | pupnik_: that link doesn't work in my browser either | 01:04 |
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| Shapeshifter | nidO: they've been gone for hours | 01:06 |
| Shapeshifter | again | 01:06 |
| nidO | no i meant | 01:06 |
| nidO | the actual list of repos on my device | 01:06 |
| corecode | Shapeshifter: the repos? | 01:06 |
| Shapeshifter | ah | 01:06 |
| Shapeshifter | corecode: yes | 01:06 |
| corecode | nidO: yea, i had the same | 01:06 |
| corecode | alright then | 01:06 |
| pupnik_ | Stskeeps: ping | 01:07 |
| corecode | modest doesn't want to be fixed | 01:07 |
| corecode | obviously | 01:07 |
| corecode | can't compile for gtk, can't set up scratchbox | 01:07 |
| corecode | poo | 01:07 |
| pupnik_ | how about we make someone who hangs out here sub-admin for maemo.org | 01:07 |
| * pupnik_ blinks sweetly | 01:07 | |
| nidO | I could do that nps, im slack enough to be here most of the time \o/ | 01:08 |
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| user___ | hi | 01:24 |
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| silferme | hmm, this seems to work fine | 01:26 |
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| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 01:33 | |
| SpeedEvil | I've removed the protector for the third time, trying for a clean install | 01:33 |
| silferme | does anyone have experience connecting vnc between vista and maemo? i just cant get it work on the windose side... | 01:34 |
| kynky | vnc server is running on what ? | 01:35 |
| silferme | vista | 01:35 |
| ml-maemo | what server are you using? | 01:36 |
| kynky | can you connect to isa vnc serverfrom anything else ? | 01:36 |
| kynky | i always choose tightvnc if i can | 01:37 |
| silferme | im using realvnc and trying to run the server on vista and connect with maemo | 01:37 |
| ml-maemo | only UltraVNV works on vista and up, IIRC | 01:37 |
| ml-maemo | UltraVNC* | 01:37 |
| ml-maemo | I never got RealVNC to work | 01:38 |
| silferme | ok, thanks | 01:38 |
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| silferme | i just keep on getting "not accepting incoming connections" no matter what i do | 01:39 |
| silferme | but i give ultravnc a shot | 01:39 |
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| trem | nite all, sweet dreams | 01:45 |
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| burchr | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=568579#post568579 # I wonder if I was a little too forthright | 01:48 |
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| wiretapped | awesome, my n900 just did that thing where it gets a call, drops it, starts playing music, and stops responding to input | 01:56 |
| wiretapped | so my officemates were just treated to over a minute of the music i was last listening to | 01:56 |
| pupnik_ | heh | 01:57 |
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| andre900 | the "stops responding to input" part is new to me | 01:58 |
| aakashd | anyone know where I can get the latest firmware image for the n900 (not UK) | 01:58 |
| aakashd | ? | 01:58 |
| * wiretapped is tickled pink that, though this is probably a bug in one of nokia's numerous proprietary components around the telephony functionality, it generally reflects poorly on linux/free software as a phone OS | 01:59 | |
| aakashd | I went to http://wiki.maemo.org/Upgrading_tablet_OS#Flashing_your_Nokia_tablet and the link to the image directs to an Error page | 01:59 |
| Vratha | just bought a ups for my n900 server | 01:59 |
| andre900 | aakashd: tablets-dev.nokia.com ? | 01:59 |
| Vratha | so my static web page server won't go down | 01:59 |
| Vratha | just kidding | 02:00 |
| andre900 | aakashd: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 02:00 |
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| aakashd | same thing unfortunately :( | 02:01 |
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| njsf_ | Hi all | 02:04 |
| njsf_ | Wanted to help with the testing marathon. Where can I find info about it? | 02:05 |
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| * RST38bis is fucked in Logan | 02:10 | |
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| toresbe | Hey, just got my N900 and _very_ happy with it, with a very few exceptions... chief amongst them, the alarm clock gives up before I've woken up | 02:35 |
| tank-man | thats what snooze is for | 02:36 |
| toresbe | ? | 02:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Heavy sleeper. . . . | 02:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Choose a louder alarm sound? | 02:37 |
| RST38bis | moo General | 02:37 |
| N900evil | volume at max? | 02:37 |
| N900evil | tried alter | 02:37 |
| N900evil | nate alarms? | 02:37 |
| toresbe | Doesn't matter how loud it is - I think there's something in that if I know it will stop after a short while I don't wake up. :P | 02:38 |
| pupnik_ | sleep 25000 && mplayer pig_halal_slaughter.mp3 | 02:38 |
| toresbe | That's what I used to do on my laptop | 02:38 |
| toresbe | Is mplayer in the repos? | 02:38 |
| pupnik_ | yup | 02:38 |
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| toresbe | Ah, excellent! Thanks. | 02:38 |
| toresbe | BTW, is there any particular reason why the ringtone only plays the first few seconds and loops that instead? | 02:39 |
| pupnik_ | i drink plenty of juice to ensure wakeup | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | toresbe: pupnik_: I suggest to replace the sleep 25000 by alarmed | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | app | 02:40 |
| pupnik_ | ahh? ty | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | very handy app | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hey, RST38bis. | 02:41 |
| pupnik_ | +1karma DocScrutinizer | 02:41 |
| toresbe | real shame screen isn't in the repo | 02:41 |
| xorAxAx | it is | 02:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | ^ | 02:42 |
| xorAxAx | in the tools repo or something like that | 02:42 |
| toresbe | oh! | 02:42 |
| toresbe | I like this channel. I think I'll stay here. ;) | 02:42 |
| toresbe | The ringtone thing is a bother, though. Do you think it warrants a bug report, or is there a reason it would become a WONTFIX? | 02:43 |
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| pupnik_ | toresbe: It is dangerous to go alone. Take this! http://ageofikon.info/packrat/index.php?Action=list&System=OS2008&Arg=screen&Section=&Repo=0 | 02:44 |
| xorAxAx | it should be configurable | 02:44 |
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| pupnik_ | oops | 02:44 |
| pupnik_ | wrong os | 02:44 |
| toresbe | spotted that. :) | 02:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer | toresbe: ringtone thing? contact specific ringtones? | 02:45 |
| toresbe | DocScrutinizer: No, ringtones loop at the first few seocnds | 02:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | err what? | 02:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | not seen here | 02:46 |
| toresbe | It happens with the alarm, too. It plays the first fair few seconds and loops there. | 02:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | ??? not here | 02:46 |
| corecode | :/ mails at night wake me up | 02:46 |
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| toresbe | If you have a long MP3, will it play the whole thing_ | 02:47 |
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| toresbe | ?* | 02:47 |
| corecode | i need something to inhibit mail vibrate at night | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, it actually does | 02:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | always makes me hesitant to pick up a call as I like the song so much ;-P | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | works like a charm | 02:48 |
| toresbe | hah | 02:48 |
| toresbe | I have the Internationale. :) | 02:48 |
| toresbe | it gets fun reactions from bitter old men on the tube. | 02:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | D.A.F Musolini :-P | 02:48 |
| toresbe | Ah, fun! I like that one. | 02:49 |
| njsf_ | Anyone knows if there is any additional app for custom ring tones per caller ? | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | njsf_: not *yet* - there's quite a number of projects tackling that though | 02:50 |
| njsf_ | Any one of them in extras-devel ? Or even too early for that ? | 02:51 |
| toresbe | I _really_ like my N900, btw. And not just for the geeky stuff like being able to freakin' SSH into my phone. SSH! | 02:51 |
| toresbe | I scp mp3s to it! it's brilliant! | 02:51 |
| njsf_ | I wouldn't mind be a guinea pig | 02:51 |
| toresbe | I ssh'd from my old symbian phone to my new phone! | 02:51 |
| RST38bis | you can ssh into android | 02:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | njsf_: none has reached an alpha state yet | 02:51 |
| toresbe | I know, but still fairly crazy. | 02:51 |
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| njsf_ | to me the best feature of the N900 is the python builtin | 02:52 |
| toresbe | To me it's the good UI | 02:52 |
| RST38bis | the truth is, maemo is no longer exclusive in its niche (: | 02:52 |
| toresbe | Maemo actually has a very good UI which I sort of didn't expect, because it's Linux. | 02:52 |
| njsf_ | well I have had some frequent "freezes" with PR1.1.1 so the UI I have mixed feelings. Pretty but not snappy :( | 02:53 |
| RST38bis | linux has nothing to do with ui | 02:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer | njsf_: the problem with caller specific ringtones is: dialer app is closed source, and nobody seems to know how to swap the ringtone 'on the fly' | 02:55 |
| njsf_ | DocScrutinizer: is any of the projects in garage? Maybe I could lend a hand? | 02:55 |
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| njsf_ | DocScrutinizer: yeah, I thought so. My guess is the only way is by having the file be a pipe and listen to the caller notif in D-Bus then feed the real data through the pipe | 02:56 |
| toresbe | RST38bis: Most "hey, it's got Linux"-marketed devices I've seen have had horrible UIs. | 02:56 |
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| njsf_ | that is if the dialer app does not check for the file not to be a pipe | 02:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't know about particular project names, just about couple of guys asking related questions here and discussing how to tackle the whole thing | 02:56 |
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| toresbe | I find myself wishing for a tinyhttpd on the N900 though. :) | 02:57 |
| njsf_ | ic, thanks anyway! | 02:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | njsf_: that's a good idea indeed | 02:57 |
| njsf_ | toresbe: I believe lighthttpd is in one of the extras | 02:57 |
| toresbe | Odd, I did search for httpd | 02:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | njsf_: catching the caller notif on dbus is a snap | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | no magic in that one | 02:58 |
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| njsf_ | yeah I might also have a go at it | 03:00 |
| njsf_ | fun first maemo project I guess :) | 03:00 |
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| * DocScrutinizer suggests mdbus2. "dbus never has been so much fun" :-) | 03:01 | |
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| johnx | mornin' all | 03:03 |
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| njsf_ | mornin | 03:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | moo | 03:06 |
| johnx | hey njsf_, Doc | 03:06 |
| johnx | anything interesting over the weekend? | 03:06 |
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| toresbe | Err http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/free Packages 504 Gateway Time-out [IP: 217.13.4.152 80] | 03:06 |
| toresbe | Is that somehow my fault, or is it a wider problem_ | 03:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | repos sometimes sloooow | 03:07 |
| toresbe | I'll say! | 03:07 |
| johnx | sometimes slow, sometimes b0rken, sometimes autobuilder is slow (or down) :) | 03:07 |
| johnx | Serious growing pains | 03:07 |
| johnx | yeah, I get an error in my browser visiting http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle | 03:08 |
| toresbe | That's a good thing, though... at least there's growth :) | 03:08 |
| johnx | yup | 03:08 |
| johnx | I would have been gone a long time ago if there wasn't :) | 03:08 |
| njsf_ | just tried an apt-get update and repository,maemo.org seems to be going, albeit slow | 03:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: (new) well, I found alarmed app for me - great :-D I guess that's no real news though | 03:10 |
| johnx | hmm, that reminds me: has anyone managed decent cron emulation with alarmd? | 03:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | on the way | 03:11 |
| johnx | nice! | 03:11 |
| njsf_ | Well I made a 1952 telephone ringtone from a sample online at a free sound project | 03:11 |
| johnx | every year or so I think about writing it, but haven't gotten around to it yet | 03:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | Shapeshifter promised he'll implement the cmdline interface to alarmed next, according to my request | 03:12 |
| johnx | njsf_, fun. I actually stole the ringtone from the new star trek movie :> | 03:12 |
| johnx | past and future I s'pose | 03:12 |
| RST38bis | moo johnx | 03:12 |
| johnx | m00f RST38bis. | 03:12 |
| RST38bis | johnx: what is new and exciting? =) | 03:13 |
| johnx | RST38bis, new? daylight savings time started (ended?) here | 03:13 |
| johnx | lost an hour of weekend | 03:13 |
| njsf_ | arg tell me about it... | 03:13 |
| RST38bis | johnx: I had a flight at 6:45 | 03:13 |
| njsf_ | and a crappy weekend at that | 03:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, you've got a CR-V, right? | 03:14 |
| RST38bis | johnx: so you can imagine my excitement... | 03:14 |
| RST38bis | General: yes | 03:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, how do you like it? | 03:14 |
| RST38bis | Gen: well, I have got the original 1997 one | 03:14 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, trading up? | 03:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, to a CR-V? God no. | 03:14 |
| RST38bis | Gen: it still runs like new | 03:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | My sister's looking for a saner college car than the Miata she's currently driving. ;) | 03:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, ah, I think this one's an '05. | 03:15 |
| johnx | Honda: It'll still be running long after you wish it weren't | 03:15 |
| timeless_mbp | how about a nice shiny bicycle? | 03:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, Honda: You paid too much. ;) | 03:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, in Florida? | 03:15 |
| RST38bis | Gen: It fits one college girl with her room, fridge, boyfriend and driver | 03:15 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, only if you bought it new :) | 03:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: not so shiny? | 03:15 |
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| GeneralAntilles | johnx, the used market is still ridiculously overpriced. | 03:15 |
| RST38bis | Gen: boyfriend will have to carry her on his laps though | 03:16 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, look back into the early '80s | 03:16 |
| johnx | there are some deals to be had | 03:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 03:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, we want newfangled things like sidecurtain airbags and whatnot. :P | 03:16 |
| johnx | ahahaha | 03:16 |
| johnx | ahaha...heh | 03:16 |
| johnx | *cough* | 03:16 |
| * GeneralAntilles is leaning more towards the Volvo S40. | 03:17 | |
| pupnik_ | n900 is really a laptop killer | 03:17 |
| RST38bis | Gen: generally does not care about pavement, although I would suggest against putting 3 or more wheels into deep water at high speed. | 03:17 |
| johnx | uhm, the funny thing about airbags in a used car is you really have no idea if they've already fired until you get into an accident when you needed them and they didn't fire | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | CR-V has to have the worst deadpedal on any car I've ever driven. | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, depends on where you're buying from, I guess. ;) | 03:17 |
| RST38bis | Gen: will drive over up to 30cm of snow | 03:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, no snow worries. ;) | 03:18 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, which explains why you think hondas are overpriced ;) | 03:18 |
| njsf_ | pupnik_: It is once you fix the kbd map so it accepts regular keystrokes from a portable BT keyboard :D | 03:18 |
| RST38bis | Gen: yes, it accelerates about as graceously as a trolley car, sorry | 03:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, ehehe. | 03:18 |
| njsf_ | I mean, to accept the numbers row, because out of the box it only accepts the alpha keys | 03:18 |
| RST38bis | Gen: it is no miata, more like a 4wd accord with a small shack installed on top | 03:18 |
| RST38bis | Gen: but as a shack, it is pretty damn good | 03:19 |
| johnx | RST38bis++ (though I think it's a civic motor) | 03:19 |
| RST38bis | johnx: nope, accord | 03:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Accord | 03:19 |
| johnx | shows what I know :) | 03:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's just an Accord with a different body. | 03:19 |
| RST38bis | johnx: hrv is civic, but us did not get hrv | 03:20 |
| RST38bis | General; well it uses 4wd transmission from civic wagovan | 03:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's FWD | 03:20 |
| johnx | gack | 03:20 |
| RST38bis | General: and they had to modify the engine | 03:20 |
| johnx | just get a station wagon | 03:20 |
| RST38bis | General: it is awd, not fwd | 03:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, she's not really interested in a V70 for some reason. | 03:21 |
| RST38bis | General: | 03:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, this one is FWD. | 03:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | AWD is an option | 03:21 |
| RST38bis | General: AVOID then | 03:21 |
| johnx | if you were looking back into the 90's I'd say impreza but for the love of all that is holy do not buy anything with the early 2.5L engine | 03:21 |
| RST38bis | General: crv without awd is useless | 03:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, worst it's going to see is rain. | 03:21 |
| RST38bis | General: you are buying it for space AND awd | 03:22 |
| johnx | then there's no point ... | 03:22 |
| RST38bis | General: awd saved my neck in heavy rain many times | 03:22 |
| johnx | <- AWD convert | 03:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, I was drooling over an '06 Volvo S40 AWD T5 with the 6-speed. | 03:24 |
| RST38bis | without awd it is just a really ugly accord that drives like a loaded hearse | 03:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Crappy front-bias AWD, though. | 03:24 |
| johnx | new cars weight too much | 03:25 |
| johnx | pesky airbags and stuff | 03:25 |
| inz | "A dog oversteers, which is more fun..." "...than an understeering hyena." "So, you want a Mazda MX-5 because it's a rear wheel drive." | 03:25 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Haldex, I think. | 03:25 |
| njsf_ | toresbe: sorry for the delay ligHTTPd is on extras-testing.. | 03:25 |
| johnx | njsf_, keen | 03:26 |
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| johnx | that'll be nice to have | 03:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Miata is no fun in auto | 03:26 |
| johnx | ugh | 03:26 |
| johnx | that's an abomination | 03:26 |
| * RST38bis almost smashed a miata once | 03:26 | |
| * GeneralAntilles is still trying his damndest to cure his family of auto-idiocy. | 03:26 | |
| RST38bis | with mazda mpv no less | 03:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | The late-90s MPVs were ridiculously fun minivans. | 03:27 |
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| RST38bis | whenn driving a van, you usually find out about miatas post factum, by the loud continuous signal =) | 03:27 |
| johnx | around here we'd call it mazda mating season | 03:28 |
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| * GeneralAntilles answers Jaffa's stupid questions. | 03:28 | |
| * RST38bis goes to watch the rain | 03:29 | |
| sheepbat | have you ever seen the rain? | 03:33 |
| johnx | Comin' down on a sunny day? | 03:35 |
| njsf_ | johnx: Have an awesome double rainbow picture taken with my beloved N900 down in Curitiba, Brazil earlier this year | 03:38 |
| njsf_ | that day was particularly funky. Almost 2 hours of rain with sun | 03:38 |
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| johnx | it's funny how in some places that kind of thing is a common occurrence and in other places it's quite rare | 03:40 |
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| RST38bis | heheh | 03:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | First touch of Florida summer is making itself felt. | 03:47 |
| johnx | and it'll be miserably cloudy and rainy again until late june | 03:47 |
| RST38bis | johnx: ferengi homeworld, indeed | 03:47 |
| * RST38bis wonders if bill gates has got those huge round ears | 03:47 | |
| njsf_ | RST38bis: I was down in south of Brazil during January and the whole month it rained like this weekend | 03:47 |
| njsf_ | every day there were ~10 flood deaths... | 03:47 |
| RST38bis | but that was brazil! =) | 03:47 |
| * GeneralAntilles fires off the email. . . . | 03:48 | |
| RST38bis | rainforest & stuff | 03:48 |
| johnx | we don't even get real east-coast rain. we just get this constant overcast sky with drizzle | 03:48 |
| njsf_ | RST38bis: South of Brazil is hardly rainforest :D | 03:49 |
| njsf_ | more like concrete forest | 03:49 |
| RST38bis | never been to south america, there be dragons =) | 03:49 |
| johnx | west of me is rain forest :) | 03:50 |
| njsf_ | just not tropical :D | 03:51 |
| RST38bis | h2o should be either up there in the clouds or down there as the snow, liquid h2o is bad =) | 03:51 |
| njsf_ | ohhh and off the roads too when as snow | 03:52 |
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| njsf_ | I can manage snow driving, but I can't vouch for the car behind .... | 03:53 |
| johnx | RST38bis, as a special exception, I also except liquid water when the temperature is above 30C and the liquid water arranged in a well maintained pool, lake or ocean | 03:53 |
| johnx | njsf_, they're all so fun aren't they? They just slow down by 15km/h then tailgate each other | 03:54 |
| RST38bis | ok, I guess you cant keep it as snow at 30oC | 03:54 |
| * RST38bis cackles | 03:54 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ooh, Attila's running too. | 04:03 |
| RST38bis | ok, as soon as they clean out the drool left by arriving passengers during landing... | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Damn liars at SmartHome. | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Backordered until 5/23/10" | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ships in 4 days. . . . | 04:04 |
| johnx | I think maybe I'm confused about this Atilla? | 04:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | achipa here, attila77 on Talk. | 04:05 |
| * Arkenoi wonders if there gonna be 3g video calls in pr1.2 | 04:05 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't get your hopes up. | 04:05 |
| johnx | In my sleep deprived state I actually misparsed that as "Atilla's coming" which I took to mean the leader of the Huns | 04:06 |
| johnx | what are you grabbing from smarthome? | 04:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Gonna do an Insteon install in my parent's house. | 04:07 |
| * GeneralAntilles is excited. | 04:07 | |
| GeneralAntilles | I've been trolling the internet for the past few weeks for home automation information. | 04:07 |
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| johnx | I'm just happy to have my TV under the control of my HTPC at this point...but the Apple remote is proving to not fit the XBMC interface all that perfectly | 04:08 |
| johnx | Sony Control-S is a neat trick... | 04:08 |
| johnx | I was thinking about an RFID door lock though | 04:08 |
| ds3 | GA: what do you want to automate with Insteon? | 04:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, mostly lighting. | 04:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hook into a security setup eventually. | 04:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, yeah, I'm gonna get some Morning Industries keypad/RF doorlocks. | 04:09 |
| johnx | I was going to take the hackaday approach I think | 04:10 |
| ds3 | GA: what was the tipping point for Insteon instead of the older stuff like X10? | 04:10 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ds3, mostly the improved protocol. | 04:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Seems to require less fiddling more reliable, less subject to interference. | 04:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Better looking devices. | 04:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | never go for anything else than a bidir protocol for home automation! | 04:11 |
| ds3 | isn't Insteon more expensive though? | 04:12 |
| johnx | In DocScrutinizer's house the lights remotely control you! | 04:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, a bit, but from everything I've read it seems to be worth it. | 04:12 |
| ds3 | I see | 04:12 |
| ds3 | and you're not willing to go for a wifi controlled power switch? :D | 04:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Does such a beast exist? | 04:13 |
| ds3 | indirectly | 04:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, are you planning on buying, or do you have experience in the area? | 04:13 |
| ds3 | you get a Ethernet to WiFi interface and a ethernet power switch | 04:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 04:13 |
| ds3 | GA: I have a hodgepodge system with a bit of several things | 04:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: nah, I'm just *sure* my door locked when I push the remote's button and the green light on remote flashed a second later | 04:13 |
| johnx | I just twist the doorknob and see | 04:14 |
| ds3 | I love the ethernet power switches but X10 isn't too horrible | 04:14 |
| johnx | but that might be the OCD | 04:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | My mother's salivating at the prospect of being able to make sure all the doors are shut and locked and the lights are off from in bed with her iPhone. | 04:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: also I know my lights are on or off, no matter if switched via local switch, remote, or central control unit | 04:14 |
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| ds3 | I donno if I'd trust locks | 04:14 |
| johnx | DocScrutinizer, that is pretty neat | 04:15 |
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| johnx | my apartment is so small that the lights aren't really a problem. Might be nice to have something for the blinds though and the front door | 04:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnx: the light (well power) actors even have a feedback sensing for broken consumer (bulb burnt out) | 04:16 |
| ds3 | FWIW, X10 controlling aquarium lights is way more reliable then light timers | 04:16 |
| johnx | cute | 04:16 |
| RST38bis | takeoff! | 04:18 |
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| DocScrutinizer | johnx: and as soon as you start using PIR motion sensors not for light only, but also for an integrated alarm system, you really want 2way communication with ACK/NAK and crypto | 04:18 |
| johnx | quite true | 04:18 |
| johnx | right now I'm just trying to figure out where to keep my bike ... | 04:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | burchr, don't take any of my posts for black-and-white. ;) | 04:19 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Tag trolling | 04:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | What fun | 04:22 |
| Arkenoi | X10 is great | 04:22 |
| Arkenoi | but it is actually US-only | 04:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | X10 is a dynosaur | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Vroom vroom | 04:23 |
| johnx | Dinosaurs are great | 04:23 |
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| Arkenoi | DocScrutinizer, it is cheap and widespread, thus there is no alternative: everything other is several times more expensive and provides less functionality due to lack of supported devices | 04:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: reallyu? | 04:24 |
| SpeedEvil | http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=x10+13a&_sacat=0&_trksid=p3286.m270.l1313&LH_BIN=1&_odkw=x10&_osacat=0 | 04:24 |
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| SpeedEvil | err - oops | 04:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Arkenoi, doesn't help if those devices never work reliably, though. ;) | 04:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | Arkenoi: the being widespread is also one of the biggest disadvantages | 04:25 |
| Arkenoi | SpeedEvil, it incredibly sucks in europe: 220V x10 is expensive and unreliable | 04:25 |
| SpeedEvil | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/X10-Plug-for-Lighting-Control_W0QQitemZ160364035747QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Burglar_Alarms?hash=item255670fea3 | 04:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't want my neighbour opening my garage door or switch on my electric heater | 04:25 |
| Arkenoi | SpeedEvil, 40 ukp, my ass! | 04:25 |
| Arkenoi | it is almost the same as does not exist | 04:26 |
| SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: I'm not sure I want to know that your ass costs 40 ukp. | 04:26 |
| SpeedEvil | And someone needs to make widespread cheap zigbee stuff. | 04:27 |
| * SpeedEvil is waiting. | 04:27 | |
| Arkenoi | there is difference in home automation approach in US and Europe | 04:27 |
| Arkenoi | for US it is just usual thing available for decades | 04:27 |
| Arkenoi | for europe it is expensive luxury stuff for geeky rich guys | 04:28 |
| Arkenoi | i talked to several companies who do home automation, they lose interest to you completely if you start complaining about price and technology and ask them why i need $800 remotes and $5K purpose-designed computer | 04:29 |
| Arkenoi | if you can do all that with pretty cheap generic things | 04:29 |
| Arkenoi | so fsck them | 04:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | fwiw - i'm using http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=313&no_cache=1 this-> http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=313&art_id=19439&L=0&x=45&y=2 for over a year now. Works like a charm | 04:34 |
| pupnik_ | correct Arkenoi | 04:35 |
| pupnik_ | there is also very little intderest in home alarm / automation | 04:36 |
| pupnik_ | or was in 2002-3 | 04:36 |
| Arkenoi | (and Russia is Europe at its worst) | 04:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | (purpose designed computer) http://www.homematic.com/index.php?id=produkt&artid=18983&L=1 is 400EUR, not 5K | 04:38 |
| pupnik_ | why a remote key? | 04:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | still way too much for such a friggin arm based uC | 04:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | pupnik_: ?? | 04:40 |
| pupnik_ | war is poor poeple fighting poor people, at the | 04:42 |
| pupnik_ | expense of the middle class people, for the bennefit of the | 04:42 |
| pupnik_ | ahh fuuu | 04:42 |
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| pupnik_ | http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=313&art_id=19439&L=0&x=45&y=2 | 04:43 |
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| pupnik_ | homematic is a .de company DocScrutinizer ? do they sell ok w/o certification? | 04:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | homematic is .de based. Production in mainland china. Sell ok? please rephrase | 04:46 |
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| pupnik_ | i wonder if many germans insist on cerfitied devices ... | 04:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | I dunno about any certification, maybe they got some certs of assurances assoc or somesuch | 04:47 |
| pupnik_ | i helped set up protection as a demo for a canadian company | 04:47 |
| pupnik_ | many arguments about how / whether to expand into .de | 04:48 |
| Arkenoi | pupnik_, i guess it has something to do with, say, fire insurance and stuff | 04:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, as has been mentioned above home automation isn't a big deal in europe yet | 04:49 |
| Arkenoi | DocScrutinizer, it made me wonder 10 years ago and it wonders me even more that situation did not change :-( | 04:50 |
| pupnik_ | it was a good lesson for me in how difficult it is to predict market acceptance | 04:50 |
| pupnik_ | yes Arkenoi :) but i have some answers from surveys i did | 04:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | see, if you have a X10mbased door locker, you won't see a penny of your burglary assurance when they clean out your flat. With this device of homematic there's no such issues as it uses a certified secure protocol | 04:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | also the smoke detectors are certified and accepted by assurances | 04:54 |
| pupnik_ | mhm | 04:55 |
| pupnik_ | not many home fires in .de either z:) | 04:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, *I* had one, exactly 2 years ago :-o | 04:55 |
| pupnik_ | from your geeky wires i bet | 04:56 |
| johnx | all I ever start are toaster oven fires ... | 04:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | prolly | 04:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | mini vacuum cleaner with NiMH and cheap charger | 04:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | is my major suspect | 04:57 |
| pupnik_ | i suspect an opportunity for better heating room controls using arm devices in .de DocScrutinizer | 05:00 |
| pupnik_ | i only find one company innovating there | 05:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | pupnik_: see http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=240&no_cache=1&L=0 | 05:01 |
| pupnik_ | but the central furnaces also now do some live adjusting based on estimated temps | 05:01 |
| pupnik_ | hmm | 05:01 |
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| Arkenoi | DocScrutinizer: (even if a burglar comes through the window ;-) | 05:01 |
| pupnik_ | ok two | 05:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Arkenoi: (even if a burglar comes through the window ;-) http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=26&L=0 | 05:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=236&no_cache=1 http://www.eq-3.de/index.php?id=236&art_id=12993&L=0&x=52&y=11 | 05:14 |
| Arkenoi | DocScrutinizer, what control channel does eq3 equipment use? | 05:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | 866MHz AES encrypted bidir | 05:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | or RS485 | 05:15 |
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| Arkenoi | well, it is much more expensive than generic 110V x10 i guess | 05:17 |
| Arkenoi | but it does not need control wires at least | 05:17 |
| Arkenoi | what about jamming resistance? how does it act if it accidentally loses signal from all sensors? | 05:18 |
| pupnik_ | looks nice DocScrutinizer - do you know people who sell / install in .de? | 05:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | Arkenoi: I guess that's configurable | 05:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | pupnik_: conrad.de sells (for instance). Installing probably done by your electrician, or DIY | 05:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | for the AES encryption, that's not entirely clear. Just found a flaming blog claiming it's not | 05:23 |
| Arkenoi | hmm conrad.de , iirc they are presented here in russia somehow. but last time i checked all that stuff was damn expensive. it was 5 years ago, though | 05:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.homematic.com/index.php?id=153#down12 | 05:24 |
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| KamuiN900 | evenin | 05:27 |
| KamuiN900 | whats new | 05:27 |
| KamuiN900 | pr1.2 i hope :) | 05:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | you tell us | 05:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | KamuiN900, probably soon-ish. | 05:29 |
| dmj7261 | KamuiN900: How's the wrapper going? | 05:29 |
| KamuiN900 | sup ga sup doc | 05:29 |
| KamuiN900 | not good | 05:29 |
| KamuiN900 | well im now studying opengl to figure out whats missing | 05:30 |
| KamuiN900 | i cant compile with pseudo code on the wrapper | 05:30 |
| KamuiN900 | and most of the funt mapping used in blender is complete | 05:30 |
| KamuiN900 | i have a ton of missing constants and vars | 05:31 |
| KamuiN900 | the lib is actually way more complex to wrap than just using the sdk | 05:31 |
| KamuiN900 | even more so than i anticipated | 05:31 |
| KamuiN900 | but i saw another gles lib that has missing opengl stuff wrapped | 05:32 |
| KamuiN900 | i asked in the forums for someone to try a build using it and aste the output | 05:32 |
| KamuiN900 | i might be doing double work at this point but am too far along to just scrap the env to see | 05:33 |
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| KamuiN900 | also im a douche and was working with the gl headers directly | 05:33 |
| KamuiN900 | so the build env isnt isolated | 05:33 |
| KamuiN900 | at least not in the sandbox | 05:33 |
| KamuiN900 | scratchbox even | 05:34 |
| dmj7261 | Sounds like it's turning into an even bigger task than you thought. | 05:34 |
| KamuiN900 | on a side note the last patches i made to the source yield under a half second of lag on the interface and primitives manip | 05:34 |
| dmj7261 | Right now I'm trying to find out how to access the components that dial the phone. | 05:35 |
| KamuiN900 | huge task dmj, but the result will be worth it | 05:35 |
| KamuiN900 | esp for the community | 05:35 |
| dmj7261 | Yeah. | 05:35 |
| dmj7261 | That's why I'm eagerly anticipating your wrapper. | 05:35 |
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| pupnik_ | man. just playing mp3s is hanging and sputterng.. 34.3 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-p | 05:37 |
| KamuiN900 | superman | 05:39 |
| njsf_ | pupnik_: I've seen that also on the first 20s or so of some MP3 | 05:39 |
| njsf_ | specially when mediaplayer is launched from gPodder | 05:40 |
| njsf_ | I believe there is a bug already on it | 05:40 |
| * DocScrutinizer thinks dialer app has to go opensource most urgently | 05:41 | |
| njsf_ | but the worst offender right now is the notification sound that either pauses or sutters during media playback | 05:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | and probably one of the least likely. | 05:41 |
| dmj7261 | DocScrutinizer: You mean the phone dialing app? | 05:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | GeneralAntilles: yeah, real PITA | 05:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | dmj7261: yep | 05:42 |
| dmj7261 | I agree. | 05:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, frozen-trout assisted arguments may speed things along. | 05:42 |
| njsf_ | DocScrutinizer: I think it is probably faster to reimplement a new one that to wait for Nokia to opensource it | 05:42 |
| dmj7261 | DocScrutinizer: Do you know what apis control the phone? | 05:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehehe | 05:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | dmj7261: only cloudy ideas | 05:42 |
| dmj7261 | I was thinking of writing a simple one. | 05:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | telepathy comes to mind | 05:43 |
| dmj7261 | does telepathy control the gsm calls too? | 05:43 |
| njsf_ | I believe that the drivers actually are d-bus accessible no? | 05:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | dmj7261, more or less. | 05:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | phonet is another buzzword | 05:44 |
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| dmj7261 | What I want to be able to do is dial a number and start a phone call in my own app. | 05:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer | that's easy I guess | 05:44 |
| njsf_ | dmj7261: I've seen the dbus command line for it | 05:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | there are dbus calls I seem to remember | 05:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | One thing I miss about Flash videos is that they didn't start playing in background tabs. | 05:45 |
| njsf_ | somewhere either on talk,maemo.org or on the wiki | 05:45 |
| dmj7261 | Could you look those up for me? | 05:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | all of those open up the nokia dialer app though | 05:45 |
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| dmj7261 | so the dialer app will come to the foreground? | 05:46 |
| njsf_ | Oh ic | 05:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/DBUS#dbus-send-call | 05:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | dmj7261: yup | 05:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I'm afraid even pnatd ATD911 does | 05:48 |
| dmj7261 | hmm | 05:48 |
| dmj7261 | That might be problematic | 05:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer | see, aiui dialer app really is a "daemon" listening to the modem all the time. As soon as it senses an ongoing call it opens dialöer screen to handle it | 05:49 |
| dmj7261 | perhaps there's a way to kill that | 05:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure there is | 05:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | don't ask me how | 05:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | but I'm rather sure that's a strongly discurraged way | 05:51 |
| dmj7261 | I'm thinking of a phone app that will allow people without any vision to dial the phone. | 05:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/discurraged/deprecated | 05:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | that makes a GREAT reasoning for a bug ticket to open up the Nokia dialer :) | 05:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | or at least comprehensively document the interfaces and operation modes | 05:53 |
| dmj7261 | Yep, I'd like to add a vision-impaired ui+tools to the n900, so it becomes an excellent (and affordable) accessiblity tool. | 05:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | file a bug | 05:54 |
| dmj7261 | yeah, the main reason the current one doesn't work, is the phone app can't speak, so the person would have to guess the numbers. | 05:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | dang, we all thought that's the very least we get with N900 lunix based 'open' OS: being able to implement such things | 05:55 |
| Openfree | is maemo repository server down, I can download packages there | 05:56 |
| Openfree | http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle | 05:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | [2010-03-16 01:55:05] <DocScrutinizer> njsf_: the problem with caller specific ringtones is: dialer app is closed source, and nobody seems to know how to swap the ringtone 'on the fly' | 05:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | repo seems borked atm. Some complaints in last few hours | 05:58 |
| dmj7261 | Perhaps I will file a bug, and then wait on implementing phone functions. | 05:59 |
| njsf_ | Well there are many basic issues with the phone app as it stands now IMO | 06:00 |
| njsf_ | most actually already bugs | 06:00 |
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| dmj7261 | I'd be glad to fix the bugs if I could. | 06:00 |
| njsf_ | like, Celular call an option even when celular network is not available (either for real / phone off/ or no sim) | 06:00 |
| njsf_ | dmj7261: me too | 06:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | dialer app is CRAP, and it's closed :-/ | 06:00 |
| dmj7261 | Actually most of the apps I complain about being crap in one way or another are closed. | 06:01 |
| njsf_ | Well contacts is actually not much better | 06:01 |
| dmj7261 | media player, camera app, dialer, ... | 06:01 |
| njsf_ | but the problem I have with contacts I may actually be able to fix once I get the time | 06:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 06:01 |
| njsf_ | because I have a contact that cannot be deleted | 06:01 |
| njsf_ | somehow the EDS record is locked | 06:02 |
| njsf_ | even accross reboots | 06:02 |
| njsf_ | no merge of contact, no edit ebook removal | 06:02 |
| dmj7261 | sounds like time for terminal fu | 06:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | great :-D | 06:02 |
| njsf_ | And the "delete the IM field removes it from the server list" is just attrocious, sometimes it is the right choice, but a mistake can be awkward | 06:03 |
| njsf_ | "why did you remove me from your contact list' | 06:03 |
| njsf_ | and it is not an option, just a warning, So if you merged wrongly, you're toast trying tto fix it | 06:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's all a POC at best | 06:03 |
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| njsf_ | Oh, and Ovi Suite actually synced contacts and calendar | 06:04 |
| njsf_ | but the lastest 'improvement update' just removed calendar sync for N900 and made contact crash (probably the lock triggered it) | 06:04 |
| njsf_ | Closed Nokia stuff is really in the way. Only cool thing there is the SIP+Skype integration | 06:05 |
| njsf_ | Conversations is dog slow to display... | 06:05 |
| dmj7261 | from what I hear, the skype thing is actually far better for us than the winmo/android users. | 06:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | even there are bugs | 06:06 |
| njsf_ | It takes me ~40s between a notification and a window to open for a contact that I have some history with... yay for javascript filling of the conversation window | 06:06 |
| dmj7261 | winmo users just lost their ability to get a skype app. | 06:06 |
| njsf_ | yes, skype and sip are the highlights, but everything else is pain | 06:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | inbound SIP calls are like "SIP:234556@mySIP.com" - no match with contacts numbers | 06:06 |
| njsf_ | nokia should just make the dbus interface for this, provide a default UI | 06:07 |
| njsf_ | and open the floodgates for community innovation | 06:08 |
| dmj7261 | agreed | 06:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | DOCUMENTATION | 06:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | friggin nokia dbus not even supports introspection | 06:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | well dialer probably closed for "dfferentiation reasons" - seems Nokia is determined to differentiate to the worse side :-P | 06:10 |
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| njsf_ | DocScrutinizer: Well that is why I say: open a dbus interface that does not call your UI. they can keep their crap differentiation :) | 06:12 |
| dmj7261 | If their ui is closed I don't care *that* much, unless the ui actually includes the system functionality, then it's a problem. | 06:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | "we promise you get world leading crap for dialer, with your Maemo phone" | 06:12 |
| njsf_ | and then they have something like Palm OS 5 *still does* where 3rd party devs emulate the cool dialer du jour | 06:12 |
| njsf_ | because they can actually interface with the phone api | 06:12 |
| njsf_ | without the UI in the middle | 06:13 |
| njsf_ | (at least the dialer, the on-call is also not overridable unfortunatelly) | 06:13 |
| njsf_ | oh well enough ranting... | 06:14 |
| njsf_ | I actually like the N900, its just though love... You want it to improve | 06:14 |
| njsf_ | cya all tomorrow! | 06:14 |
| njsf_ | or should I say later today :D | 06:15 |
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| ptl | yooohoooo | 06:33 |
| ptl | my Zephyr HxM is arriving today | 06:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | errrr | 06:33 |
| ptl | for ecockroach | 06:33 |
| ptl | I mean ecoach | 06:33 |
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| slackmagic | for some reason my damn fm transmitter isn't working. I'm in the USA and also bought it here. Firmware is updated to the latest US Version. I can't seem to get the fm transmitter to work. Anyway, I can test or check to see if it's even transmitting? everything appears to be working, it's just I don't get anything on ANY RADIO | 06:35 |
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| ptl | slackmagic: you are the guy from the mailing lists? | 06:36 |
| ptl | have you ever tried the simple fm widget? | 06:36 |
| slackmagic | ptl: don't think so, haven't signed up yet for a mailing list | 06:36 |
| slackmagic | ptl: yep, tried that, tried pretty much everything that's available for fm transmitting - to no avail | 06:37 |
| ptl | well, then you're not the only one with that problem | 06:37 |
| slackmagic | ptl: you're also having problems with yours? | 06:37 |
| ptl | no | 06:38 |
| ptl | two guys on the mailing list, I think | 06:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | slackmagic: you need a) a radio with whip antenna, *NO* antenna cable to some roof antenna, and b) enable FM-TX in media player forex, then turn the dial on your radio to spot the N900, while the N900 not more than 1m away from antenna whip | 06:38 |
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| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: yep, I tried that. As a matter of fact tried it today with a friend's car. I knew he uses a small fm transmitter to transmit his music - used same frequency, not working there either. | 06:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer | (used same freq) that's not the way it works, though. Your freq reading well may be off quite a bit from the one on other TX devices as well as the one on the radio | 06:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | you should scan at least +/- 1MHz | 06:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | I suggest you use a mobile radio for first tests, and place the N900 a few cm away from telescope antenna | 06:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | N900 TX is *extremely* weak. Max 2 meters or somesuch, under *optimum* conditions | 06:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | other TX devices may be 100 times more power and 10 times the max distance between antenna and device | 06:48 |
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| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: have a creative zen here in front of me with my n900, doing +/- 1Mhz and it's not picking up any signal from n900, they're sitting right next to each or on top of each other | 06:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer | then you got a real problem | 06:49 |
| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: yep, that's what I thought too | 06:49 |
| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: might have to call up nokia and perhaps see if I get it replaced, damn hassle.. | 06:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah :-/ | 06:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | at least if you actually used mediaplayer to playback some music, then selected FM-TX from mediaplayer's menu, enabled it, and speakers actually went mute | 06:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | and you had no wired headset pugged during this exercise | 06:54 |
| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: yep, speakers went mute, no cables/no charging, no cords whatsoever, no errors displayed on screen, all looks as if it's transmitting, ANY radio i throw at it, nothing..plain nothing | 06:55 |
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| loft | whell i finnaly dropped my n900 the other day... and it bounces nicely though took 20m to get the battery out from under a rack | 06:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | slackmagic: get replacement | 06:59 |
| slackmagic | DocScrutinizer: I will, thanks for the time listening to my rant though :D | 06:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | yw :-) | 07:00 |
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| slonopotamus | does apt-get update from extras-devel work for anyone? | 07:41 |
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| pupnik_ | sure would beat waiting thru ham | 07:49 |
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| Openfree | slonopotamus, seems that.. server is down | 07:57 |
| Stskeeps | goodmorning | 08:00 |
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| slonopotamus | Stskeeps: morning | 08:03 |
| * Stskeeps sighs over the meego on n900 thread | 08:06 | |
| Stskeeps | s | 08:06 |
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| Stskeeps | morn tekojo | 08:08 |
| tekojo | Morning Stskeeps! | 08:08 |
| TigerTael | Morning guys. | 08:08 |
| tekojo | morning | 08:10 |
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| Stskeeps | on the other hand, stuff like people spreading 'nokia n900 not upgradeable to meego' makes me happy i'm not in marketing | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 08:20 |
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| TigerTael | haha | 08:24 |
| tekojo | :) | 08:24 |
| TigerTael | You can write to the NAND... how can it not be upgradeable? | 08:25 |
| Stskeeps | upgrade-able obviously means live upgrade, like the SSU's :P | 08:25 |
| TigerTael | Stskeeps, that's what I'm thinking... | 08:25 |
| TigerTael | Which I don't actually care about. | 08:25 |
| TigerTael | I use to flash my android phone twice or more times a week. | 08:26 |
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| TigerTael | I personally believe that Nokia will introduce a Meego version for the N900. | 08:27 |
| Timpa88 | repo is down? | 08:27 |
| tekojo | Timpa88 something strange on stage | 08:28 |
| Timpa88 | when will it be up again? | 08:28 |
| tekojo | Need to bug someone with a login | 08:29 |
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| Stskeeps | TigerTael: well, there's going to be a meego arm reference impl for sure for n900 | 08:30 |
| TigerTael | I would like it if Nokia makes the effort to make a consumer grade meego distro for the N900... ;/ | 08:30 |
| Timpa88 | tekojo: espejo repo seems working =) | 08:31 |
| tekojo | also repository.maemo.org is ok | 08:31 |
| tekojo | it's just stage | 08:31 |
| Stskeeps | TigerTael: a meego by a vendor is just a meego base system plus hardware stuff plus differentiation | 08:32 |
| Timpa88 | maemo.org's repo doesnt work for me at all, get time out | 08:32 |
| TigerTael | Stskeeps, yes please. | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | TigerTael: first two is easy, third is too early to think about | 08:32 |
| TigerTael | Well, if Maemo 5 was more complete, I'd be more than happy. | 08:33 |
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| tekojo | Timpa and you are using repository.maemo.org? | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | there's still maemo5 life | 08:33 |
| Timpa88 | tekojo: only freemoe now, because repository.maemo.org for apt-get is down. | 08:34 |
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| Stskeeps | TigerTael: what error do you get? | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | err | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | Timpa88: | 08:34 |
| Timpa88 | Stskeeps: timeout | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | i'm starting to see the smart side of having meego as reference implementation, with everyone and their dog cutting backwards compatibility: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=47492 | 08:34 |
| Timpa88 | Stskeeps: "Waiting for headers" | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | Timpa88: what does repository.maemo.org resolve to? | 08:34 |
| Timpa88 | then timeout.... | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | tekojo: repo is being slow for me too and people in turku | 08:35 |
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| tekojo | Timpa88 not here, slow because stage is taking a break for some reason, but it does answer | 08:35 |
| Timpa88 | 92.33.33.136 | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | An error occurred while processing your request. | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | Reference #97.5dee9c3e.1268721332.145c0e46 | 08:35 |
| Timpa88 | Stskeeps: got same problem | 08:35 |
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| Timpa88 | Stskeeps: u know why? | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | Timpa88: i think it's being investigated now and right people poked :) | 08:38 |
| tekojo | Timpa88 stage seems to be down, so repository should give you a 20 second extra wait when trying to poll stage for files | 08:39 |
| Timpa88 | :P | 08:39 |
| tekojo | but it should not give an error (don't get one myself) | 08:39 |
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| Timpa88 | tekojo: what ip do u get when pinging repository.maemo.org? | 08:39 |
| tekojo | it should all be cached | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | tekojo: i'm getting an error at least on /pool/fremantle/ | 08:39 |
| tekojo | ping does not work on those machines | 08:39 |
| Timpa88 | I've got error too on /pool/fremantle. | 08:39 |
| Timpa88 | ping works :P | 08:40 |
| Timpa88 | apt-get install ping | 08:40 |
| Stskeeps | Timpa88: disabled in firewall probably :P | 08:40 |
| tekojo | that's not ping | 08:40 |
| tekojo | that's apt-get | 08:40 |
| Timpa88 | Stskeeps: hehe =) | 08:40 |
| tekojo | Anyway I get a 20 second wait and an ok | 08:40 |
| Timpa88 | 504 Gateway Time-out [IP: 92.33.33.136 80] | 08:41 |
| Stskeeps | i get a 20 second wait and an error occoured while processing (...etc) :P | 08:41 |
| Timpa88 | (: | 08:41 |
| * Stskeeps goes get his morning coffe. sunny day outside today | 08:41 | |
| tekojo | waiting for a response from the isp on reason for stage being down | 08:41 |
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| rmrfchik | re | 09:19 |
| Stskeeps | morn | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | wow, GA's running | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | hell must be freezing over | 09:20 |
| Timpa88 | GA ? | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | generalantilles | 09:22 |
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| Timpa88 | Rgr. | 09:25 |
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| timeless_mbp | ping | 10:10 |
| lcuk | pong | 10:10 |
| timeless_mbp | what options do you have in the browser's option page | 10:11 |
| timeless_mbp | the one that lets you default to full screen | 10:11 |
| Arkenoi | fucking thumbnailerd | 10:12 |
| Arkenoi | would'n it be reasonable to renice it by default and give it lowest io priority? | 10:12 |
| Arkenoi | as well as all other background shit | 10:12 |
| Arkenoi | and move to BFS finally | 10:12 |
| lcuk | timeless, not best person to ask, which version do you mean | 10:13 |
| Passeli | does N900 have Ovi Maps dev apis ? | 10:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | lcuk: n900 1.1.1? | 10:14 |
| timeless_mbp | bfs? | 10:15 |
| lcuk | lemme see what ive got flashed | 10:15 |
| timeless_mbp | Passeli: what in the world are those? | 10:15 |
| Arkenoi | timeless, brain fuck scheduler. the scheduler designed NOT for servers so it behaves much better for interactive applications | 10:15 |
| lcuk | not at present timeless | 10:15 |
| * lcuk searches for a 1.1.1 image | 10:16 | |
| Arkenoi | "background" applications are great PITA on the n900 because they are not really background, they consume cpu and io affecting UI usability too much | 10:17 |
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| Passeli | timeless_mbp: using Ovi maps but implementing your own custom funtionality to it, does it have any apis to add your own stuff to it | 10:17 |
| lcuk | Arkenoi, the thumbnailerd shouldnt be running all the time to really get in the way | 10:18 |
| lcuk | whats it scanning | 10:18 |
| lcuk | Passeli, is there dev apis for any platform? | 10:18 |
| Passeli | lcuk: you mean for Ovi maps? Don't know, that's why i am askin :) | 10:18 |
| Arkenoi | lcuk: well, i made some photos. then i decided to make more and fucking thumbnailerd woke up - "wow, we have new pictures, let's index them!" making further actions almost impossible | 10:19 |
| lcuk | Passeli, by your question it sounded like other platforms had dev apis too | 10:19 |
| Arkenoi | it is plain stupid behavior | 10:19 |
| lcuk | Arkenoi, "made pictures" | 10:20 |
| lcuk | you took photos with cam or generated 2000 20mpixel renders? | 10:20 |
| lcuk | (im not trying to trick oyu, im just trying to see why its noticable for you when normally its quite well behaved | 10:21 |
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| Arkenoi | with cam | 10:21 |
| Arkenoi | don't know why it went nuts suddenly | 10:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | Passeli: the way you asked the question is odd | 10:21 |
| lcuk | so its normally ok for you and just now it went bananas | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | it implied their existence | 10:22 |
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| TigerTael | Brain fuck scheduler is not very great in real practice. | 10:22 |
| Arkenoi | btw it is plain stupid to index ALL images on the mass storage including application data | 10:22 |
| timeless_mbp | Arkenoi: at some point in time did you use the usb port? | 10:22 |
| lcuk | Arkenoi, sure for you who knows - i think you can set your tracker configuration to be very specific | 10:22 |
| Arkenoi | thumbnail view is overloaded with buttons from qtirreco and others | 10:23 |
| Arkenoi | timeless, nope, i rarely use it | 10:23 |
| timeless_mbp | Arkenoi: out of the box, it shouldn't rescan the entire volume unless you cause the volume to be remounted, afaiu | 10:23 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you've installed lots of third party software that might be interfering, then well, don't blame it | 10:24 |
| Passeli | timeless_mbp: well that was not my purpose, i am just trying to find if it possible to embed ovi maps functionality to my own app | 10:24 |
| Arkenoi | timeless: i found UI became unresponsive, ssh'ed to the phone to see what happened and noticed that thumbnailerd does both heavy io and cpu load | 10:24 |
| timeless_mbp | Passeli: well, i think the simplest answer is 'no' | 10:25 |
| timeless_mbp | the more technical answer is 'well, it's all just javascript and they had maplets, so you could be evil' | 10:25 |
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| Passeli | timeless_mbp: hmm, so i should just look where those stuff is installed in n900 and hack away ? | 10:26 |
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| Passeli | oh, i mean "be evil" | 10:27 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 10:27 |
| timeless_mbp | well, if you choose to do so | 10:27 |
| timeless_mbp | make backups of course | 10:27 |
| timeless_mbp | and don't expect any stability between versions | 10:27 |
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| jaem | hello everyone | 10:38 |
| Stskeeps | morn jaem | 10:39 |
| lcuk | timeless, does mxr just scan the source folder of the repositories | 10:41 |
| lcuk | or can it be made to scan from generic giturls | 10:41 |
| lcuk | (and hence be able to setup an installation for internal components | 10:41 |
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| jaem | Stskeeps, hi. I'm just about to try out the Diablo Community SSU :) | 10:42 |
| jaem | my N810 is happy | 10:42 |
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| Stskeeps | hehe | 10:42 |
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| Stskeeps | let me know how it works | 10:42 |
| jaem | she's been feeling shunned since my shiny N900 showed up | 10:42 |
| jaem | :) | 10:42 |
| jaem | willdo | 10:42 |
| lcuk | jaem, the size difference is amazing isnt it | 10:42 |
| jaem | that is, if the ISP isn't being more incompetent than usual | 10:42 |
| jaem | ;) | 10:42 |
| jaem | apart from general problems, the Residence ISP has a link to the campus network at my uni, but it goes down periodically, and for some reason, they have the routes set up statically, so all the uni sites are inaccessible | 10:43 |
| jaem | heh | 10:43 |
| jaem | so, big to-do over that stupid CNET article, eh? *shakes head* | 10:44 |
| jaem | lcuk, to be honest, the N900 kind of makes the N810 look like a toy | 10:44 |
| jaem | but I remember how I felt when I first got the N810 | 10:44 |
| jaem | and it is still shiny | 10:44 |
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| timeless_mbp | lcuk: we have an internal mxr for fremantle | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | there's a file update-src.pl which is responsible for updating typical source repos | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | it isn't used for the fremantle/fremantle-sdk indices, but is used in general | 10:49 |
| lcuk | can you point me to it, it makes finding things easier | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: you have vpn? | 10:50 |
| lcuk | for a lot of the desktop stuff the public one is ok | 10:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | note that the fremantle/fremantle-sdk's index based on .deb's | 10:51 |
| lcuk | cool | 10:51 |
| lcuk | are you planning on (or is it already viable for) doing the same with obs rpms?/ | 10:51 |
| timeless_mbp | mxr.moego.org | 10:51 |
| timeless_mbp | already done for moblin2.1 | 10:52 |
| timeless_mbp | i need to find the person who owns dns and get mxr.meego.com's CNAME configured | 10:52 |
| timeless_mbp | we agreed at the last meego meeting | 10:52 |
| lcuk | great | 10:53 |
| jaem | Stskeeps, SSU installed flawlessly on a (nearly) new flash of the last Diablo release | 10:53 |
| jaem | woo | 10:53 |
| lcuk | :) @ community ssu | 10:54 |
| jaem | do you know what lma & co have planned for it, aside from pushing various patches that already exist? | 10:54 |
| jaem | I presume it's primarily for maintenance releases? | 10:54 |
| jaem | lcuk, :) | 10:54 |
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| Stskeeps | jaem: this is first test to see if things work | 10:57 |
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| jaem | Stskeeps, it seems to | 10:57 |
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| * jaem yawns | 11:03 | |
| jaem | g'night | 11:03 |
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| Shapeshifter | It's cute when people accidentally call extras-devel "extras-devil" | 11:10 |
| Stskeeps | we should call it that to warn people | 11:11 |
| lcuk | Shapeshifter, its also cure when people call the OS freemantle | 11:11 |
| Shapeshifter | ;) | 11:12 |
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| lcuk | cutest is seeing how riled GeneralAntilles gets about it ;) | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone here have 1.1.1? | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | ooh, extras-devil? where can i get that? | 11:12 |
| TigerTael | RX-51_2009SE_3.2010.02-8_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin | 11:12 |
| TigerTael | this? | 11:12 |
| Shapeshifter | timeless_mbp: in hell. | 11:12 |
| thresh | 1.1.1 as in PR1.1.1, yes | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | tigert: i think that's 1.1.0 | 11:13 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:13 |
| TigerTael | timeless, oh? | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | thresh: can you open browser and open the browser options section | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | the one that lets you control if it opens in full screen by default | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | TigerTael: or not | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | my memory of versions is bad :) | 11:14 |
| TigerTael | timeless, I'm not sure to be honest, that's what I'm using and I thought it was the latest. | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | TigerTael: it's quite possible it is… there's probably a wiki somewhere :) | 11:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | actually, i think it is | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | sorry... | 11:14 |
| * timeless_mbp doesn't like numbers | 11:15 | |
| TigerTael | I think it is 1.1.1 | 11:15 |
| TigerTael | Because I've seen that browser option to open fullscreen or not. | 11:15 |
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| lardman | morning | 11:15 |
| timeless_mbp | anyway…. i need to know what the other options are | 11:15 |
| timeless_mbp | start w/ the last option | 11:15 |
| timeless_mbp | (i probably only need that one) | 11:16 |
| lcuk | morning jaffa, lardman | 11:16 |
| lardman | hmm, have we had an image update? | 11:16 |
| lardman | morning lcuk, Jaffa | 11:16 |
| TigerTael | timeless_mbp, autofocus address field. | 11:16 |
| lcuk | n810 community ssu is being tested lardman | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | ok, before that? | 11:16 |
| TigerTael | > Open initially in full screen. | 11:16 |
| lcuk | last public for fremantle is 1.1.1 | 11:16 |
| TigerTael | > Allow Javascript pausing - in 30 seconds. | 11:17 |
| lardman | lcuk: cool, thanks | 11:17 |
| timeless_mbp | that's enough, thanks | 11:17 |
| TigerTael | np | 11:17 |
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| * lcuk likes the look of all the fixes we have for pr1.2 | 11:17 | |
| Stskeeps | "pr1.2 shows as intro video the ovi maps coders being tortured for their sins against navigation" | 11:18 |
| TigerTael | haha | 11:18 |
| lcuk | lol Stskeeps | 11:18 |
| Stskeeps | after having an argument an early morning in the middle of fucking nowhere with my wife over what ovi maps was showing us, i wouldn't mind seeing that in changelog | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 11:19 |
| lcuk | this has a list of the currently marked public fixes tagged pr1.2 :) http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=568334&postcount=253 | 11:19 |
| TigerTael | Stskeeps, oh? | 11:19 |
| lcuk | lol | 11:19 |
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| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: your wife didn't learn not to trust it? | 11:19 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: we didn't trust it, but when we needed some info, it was important to get the info | 11:20 |
| Stskeeps | from now on i use maep | 11:21 |
| timeless_mbp | wise decision | 11:21 |
| lcuk | take photos of paper maps around you | 11:21 |
| MiXu- | Stskeeps: Lol. I've had similar arguments with my wife :D | 11:21 |
| lcuk | as a backup plan | 11:21 |
| TigerTael | Stskeeps, what was the problem? | 11:21 |
| MiXu- | Something is badly wrong if navigation software causes fights. | 11:21 |
| lcuk | strange MiXu- ive had similar arguments with your wife too | 11:21 |
| MiXu- | lcuk: I don't really have a wife. | 11:21 |
| timeless_mbp | MiXu-: you have an imaginary one? | 11:22 |
| lcuk | :D | 11:22 |
| MiXu- | Yes | 11:22 |
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| MiXu- | The best kind | 11:22 |
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| X-Fade | achipa: depends on what you want where ;) | 11:23 |
| achipa | python2.5-qt4 from testing to extras proper | 11:24 |
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| X-Fade | achipa: Well, making progress with the maintainer part. But that is really only for non-user section things. | 11:25 |
| achipa | X-Fade: okay, just want to make sure we (I :)) don't oops our dependencies again | 11:26 |
| X-Fade | achipa: Yeah, let's wait for it to be imported so we can see. | 11:27 |
| achipa | X-Fade: ok | 11:27 |
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| X-Fade | achipa: It should pull in all strict dependencies. | 11:27 |
| X-Fade | achipa: Looking at the logs, things like python2.5-qt4-gl got promoted too. | 11:29 |
| achipa | X-Fade: in that case it should all be well (all non-system ones are strict) | 11:29 |
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| X-Fade | achipa: It looks like it pulled those in yes. | 11:30 |
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| hrw | ~curse shell icon | 11:37 |
| infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, shell icon ! | 11:37 |
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| heoa | bought 2nd-hand n810, can you charge it only with 2mm socket? | 11:41 |
| Elvaron_n900 | hmm, anyone tried writing a program for online banking? didnt see one so far. due to security risks? | 11:41 |
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| Appiah | what security risks? | 11:41 |
| Appiah | what kind of online banking program do you need? O_o | 11:41 |
| hrw | Elvaron_n900: I have accounts in 3 banks - each use different stuff | 11:41 |
| Elvaron_n900 | no idea, just seemed weird theres none :) | 11:42 |
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| X-Fade | achipa: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/python2.5-qt4/4.7-maemo7/ | 11:42 |
| Shrik3 | what kind of program for banking? | 11:42 |
| Appiah | well my bank dont require any software... | 11:42 |
| achipa | X-Fade: yay ! | 11:42 |
| heoa | Is that 2mm socker or 1mm socket to charge n810: http://www.flickr.com/photos/bitmaps/2227489106/in/set-72157603814848483/ | 11:42 |
| X-Fade | achipa: No red there ;) | 11:42 |
| Appiah | So I dont see what type of software you would need to do your banking | 11:43 |
| Elvaron_n900 | its not "required" it might simply be more convenient than throuth the browser | 11:43 |
| Appiah | you want a own written interface for specific banks? :) | 11:43 |
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| Elvaron_n900 | at least some of them should have common interface? i think they had such a tool on the apple zombiephone | 11:44 |
| Appiah | which banks? | 11:44 |
| Appiah | in what country? | 11:44 |
| hrw | heoa: 1mm | 11:44 |
| burchr | GeneralAntilles: hehe. | 11:45 |
| burchr | GeneralAntilles: I just wanted to put that $0.02 forward. | 11:45 |
| hrw | heoa: all tablets used 1mm, n900 uses microusb | 11:45 |
| Appiah | Here I've seen maybe 5 banks that you can access online , none of them have anything common when it comes to their websites | 11:45 |
| heoa | hrw: what is the 2mm socket for then? | 11:45 |
| Elvaron_n900 | germany in my case, but it was a general question abouth why there isnt one. not necessary suffices :) | 11:45 |
| Shrik3 | Elvaron_n900: not many banks have open interfaces for consumers | 11:45 |
| Elvaron_n900 | kay | 11:46 |
| Appiah | well tghe reason why there is none is that there is no common api/interface for banks | 11:46 |
| Shrik3 | you can get a standard-ish interface if you're a company, but that costs €€€ | 11:46 |
| alturiak | german banks mostly use HBCI | 11:46 |
| Shrik3 | so basically you'd have to use screen scraping | 11:46 |
| Appiah | all I seen so far that some banks have common here in sweden is a way to auth | 11:46 |
| Shrik3 | and get around the authentication somehow | 11:46 |
| hrw | heoa: moment | 11:46 |
| Appiah | but thats the auth only | 11:46 |
| Elvaron_n900 | yea i thought there was something, didnt remember the acro is hbci | 11:46 |
| alturiak | which seems to be used in germany only, though. but at least it's common (t)here - and pretty secure | 11:46 |
| Veggen | for personal banking, there's not any standardised interfaces, but there are some semi-standardised interfaces for transfer of bulk paiments, etc, for the corporate banking world. | 11:46 |
| Veggen | probably on national level only standardisation, though. | 11:47 |
| hrw | heoa: n810 has power and headphones (3.5mm) connectors on right side | 11:47 |
| Shrik3 | and an usb port | 11:48 |
| Shrik3 | it's some funky hybrid port | 11:48 |
| heoa | hrw: I see power plugs have an interier metal | 11:48 |
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| heoa | hrw: thank you. | 11:48 |
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| hrw | Shrik3: n810 has normal microusb not hybrid | 11:49 |
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| Shrik3 | nope, not a normal one, but a Micro-AB | 11:50 |
| Shrik3 | it swings both ways | 11:50 |
| Shrik3 | micro-B is the one on current nokia phones | 11:51 |
| Shrik3 | but the N810 can act as a usb host device and accepts micro-a plugs too | 11:51 |
| hrw | Shrik3: microAB is also normal microusb - standard defines microA/microB/microAB | 11:52 |
| Shrik3 | well, yes | 11:52 |
| Shrik3 | but micro-b is the one people refer to in most cases when talking about "micro usb" | 11:53 |
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| * timeless_mbp grumbles about namespace collisions | 11:55 | |
| * ptl grumbles about PR 1.2 not being out yet | 11:56 | |
| Shapeshifter | mh. dbus-send --print-reply --dest='com.nokia.profiled' /com/nokia/profiled com.nokia.profiled.set_profile string:general gives me "Failed to open connection to "session" message bus: (null) | 11:56 |
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| Shapeshifter | mhh nevermind | 11:57 |
| Shapeshifter | should run as user not as root. | 11:57 |
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| Shapeshifter | gah why does this not work -.- crap profile switching business | 12:00 |
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| Shapeshifter | ahhh | 12:04 |
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| * Shapeshifter found the problem | 12:04 | |
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| Shapeshifter | ham is such a piece of junk | 12:22 |
| Shapeshifter | "no applications installed" | 12:22 |
| Shapeshifter | well done, ham. | 12:22 |
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| Shapeshifter | "no catalogues in use". It's so damn easy to confuse it. | 12:24 |
| Elvaron_n900 | damn, why is it so hard to find a m.u.d.s. download for use with dosbox...? | 12:29 |
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| ptl | what's a muds? | 12:43 |
| ptl | Multi-User Dungoen? | 12:43 |
| ptl | *Dungeon | 12:43 |
| Appiah | hmm | 12:43 |
| Appiah | MUD's | 12:43 |
| TigerTael | hehe. | 12:44 |
| TigerTael | I love(d) MUD's. | 12:44 |
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| KrisC | hello | 12:44 |
| pupnik_ | muds were crack in 1989 | 12:45 |
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| Appiah | Go around playing muds on my N900 | 12:47 |
| Appiah | awesome idea | 12:47 |
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| SpeedEvil | There is a mud client in extras | 12:47 |
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| Elvaron_n900 | i was actually talking about m.u.d.s. ... | 12:47 |
| SpeedEvil | Coincidentally, I'm playing in mud today. | 12:48 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/ | 12:48 |
| Elvaron_n900 | mean ugly dirty sport | 12:48 |
| Appiah | wth is that | 12:48 |
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| silferme | ok guys, maybe im a complete idiot but maybe someome can help me... im using ultravnc to have connetion between vista and maemo and it works fine at home in local wireless but how the hell do i connect to it from outside? | 12:48 |
| Appiah | port forwarding | 12:48 |
| SpeedEvil | port forwarding. | 12:49 |
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| Appiah | check your router/firewall | 12:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Also dyndns - to point to your 'real' home address | 12:49 |
| Elvaron_n900 | appiah: an awesome dos game | 12:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Picking a good password is probably a good idea | 12:49 |
| SpeedEvil | I suggest 'PassworD' | 12:49 |
| silferme | port forwarding it is then, need to go home and fix the router | 12:50 |
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| Appiah | oh | 12:50 |
| Appiah | wait | 12:50 |
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| Appiah | I need scummvm on my device | 12:50 |
| arachnist | it is in repos | 12:50 |
| SpeedEvil | install it then. | 12:51 |
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| Appiah | indeed | 12:51 |
| Appiah | havent thought much of gaming.. | 12:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - 'blocks' - surprisingly addictive. | 12:51 |
| SpeedEvil | (5760) | 12:51 |
| silferme | is any of you running kismet or similar? | 12:52 |
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| pupnik_ | 770 silferme | 12:53 |
| silferme | ? | 12:53 |
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| Jaffa | Have I missed anyone? http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2010-March/004129.html | 12:54 |
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| pupnik_ | are we nearing deadline Jaffa ? | 12:55 |
| Jaffa | pupnik_: Tomorrow: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2010-March/004122.html | 12:55 |
| Appiah | Council | 12:55 |
| Appiah | wat | 12:56 |
| Jaffa | Appiah: http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | 12:56 |
| * Appiah reads up | 12:56 | |
| Appiah | neat | 12:57 |
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| rmrfchik | pick me | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | run for council | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:58 |
| Appiah | pick rmrfchik , he wrote pick me. | 12:58 |
| rmrfchik | doh | 12:59 |
| * rmrfchik is da best council | 12:59 | |
| pupnik_ | i like the candidates | 12:59 |
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| pupnik_ | Stskeeps: did you see the repo down last night? | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | repo maemo? yes, we spokea bout it this morning | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | i'm not in charge of repos though | 13:03 |
| pupnik_ | mhm | 13:03 |
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| GAN900 | Jaffa, what sort order is that? :P | 13:05 |
| SpeedEvil | height? | 13:07 |
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| Elvaron | has anyone tried out nitroid on n900? my brother is thinking about getting an n900, too, and he wants to know if it runs etc. but i don't want to dig so deep just to tell him "yes, works", since i see no need for that on my phone | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | define 'works' | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | and why you'd want it | 13:16 |
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| Elvaron | me: i dont. my brother: no idea. works: well, theres different states of "working", give me a description of how well it works and i'll pass it on | 13:16 |
| Elvaron | i dont see why there would be any android app that couldnt be written for maemo natively, so i see no need to have a second OS on my phone | 13:17 |
| iss | i think it is more like a proof of concept still | 13:17 |
| Elvaron | kay | 13:17 |
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| Elvaron | i think that sums it up enough | 13:18 |
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| Jaffa | GAN900: Now alphabetical | 13:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | mooo | 13:21 |
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| Khertan | Hi everybody ! | 13:21 |
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| jonas | Hi all. On my N900 I connect to a wlan, then im-plugin tries to connect and fails. then i log in at the web capture portal thing. then how do i reconnect my accounts? | 13:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | Shapeshifter: heh, update :-) | 13:22 |
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| lcuk | hi Khertan mgedmin | 13:23 |
| mgedmin | we're actually two unrelated people, you know | 13:23 |
| mgedmin | I'm not his last name | 13:23 |
| Khertan | hello lcuk | 13:23 |
| jonas | (clearly I'm "on the internet", since I'm here...) | 13:24 |
| lcuk | actually i was using mgedmin as a curse word towards Khertan :p | 13:24 |
| pupnik | CPU: 45.2% (pulseaudio + panucci @ 250mhz) | 13:25 |
| pupnik | that is an embarassment | 13:25 |
| Jaffa | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council/Candidate_declarations_for_March_2010 <-- should probably go in the topic | 13:25 |
| Khertan | lcuk: héhé | 13:25 |
| Khertan | pupnik: as it s running at 250mhz i didn't see problems | 13:26 |
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| pupnik | stuttering playback on opening a webpage. 6 times greater cpu use than necessary. | 13:27 |
| pupnik | stuttering on every application window switch | 13:27 |
| kynky | http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/16/nokia-meego-door-is-not-closed-on-n900/ | 13:28 |
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| Shrik3 | "please do not take this yet as a commitment to fully productise MeeGo on N900" | 13:30 |
| Khertan | Jaffa: hum ... just say "no but maybe yes" and "yes but maybe no" | 13:30 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, the spread of candidates for the council looks good | 13:30 |
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| Elvaron | hmm i need a widget to change my keyboard layout, did i miss something or is there none yet? | 13:32 |
| TomaszD | good day | 13:32 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: It does | 13:33 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Still time for you to change your mind ;-) | 13:33 |
| hrw | hi TomaszD | 13:33 |
| lcuk | i know :) i wrote up something earlier | 13:33 |
| lcuk | but then i wrote up counter to myself | 13:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, 18h with WLAN&SIP, GSM -> lshal says 75% bat | 13:34 |
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| TomaszD | you know what guys? From the limited tests I've performed, fennec trunk does render faster than microb, although scrolling is still slower | 13:34 |
| wazd | meego panic, again | 13:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | RUN, there's a meego | 13:34 |
| * lcuk is gonna try something soon | 13:34 | |
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| lcuk | not today but a software test | 13:35 |
| Elvaron | i got ignored :( | 13:36 |
| TigerTael | Is there a way (easy way) to log into an SSH session on my N900 over the USB cable? | 13:36 |
| TomaszD | Elvaron, there is something like that already, just look for it | 13:36 |
| Elvaron | there is? | 13:36 |
| Elvaron | i havent found something like that. | 13:36 |
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| Elvaron | theres a status icon for "current kb layout", but no switch widget | 13:37 |
| ponyofdeath | hi, i have the usa version of the n900 and i am currently in europ ( bulgaria ) when i try to use the phone i dont see any service with my sim card from bulgarian gsm network. do i have to reflash the device with the international version? | 13:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | isn't there ctrl-space? | 13:37 |
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| Elvaron | ctrl+space? | 13:37 |
| Elvaron | i know alt+shift from windows to change the layout, but n900 has no alt key and maemo!=windows :) | 13:38 |
| TomaszD | why repeat what people say, try it | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-P | 13:38 |
| Elvaron | i did, it didnt do anything | 13:38 |
| TigerTael | You have to set the other language first? | 13:38 |
| TomaszD | set the other language first, in text input settings | 13:39 |
| Elvaron | i have 1st language german, 2nd language english | 13:39 |
| Elvaron | ctrl+space doesnt do anything | 13:39 |
| pupnik | Elvaron: you can remap keys but you may need to reinstall system if you mess up | 13:39 |
| TomaszD | there's this http://qwerty12.qole.org/kb/ | 13:40 |
| Elvaron | also, when within an application a notification appears "Changed keyboard layout" but neither does it change, nor does the status icon change | 13:40 |
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| Khertan | Still no date announced for PR1.2 with Qt 4.6 ? | 13:40 |
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| TomaszD | Khertan, no date will be announced | 13:41 |
| hrw | Khertan: 2nd June 2010 - right after children day | 13:41 |
| pupnik | ty TomaszD | 13:41 |
| TomaszD | np | 13:41 |
| Khertan | thx ... i ask because they said they will announce it before to dev due to some recompilation needed for some apps | 13:42 |
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| Khertan | at least i think i ve understand that | 13:42 |
| Khertan | but i may be wrong ... due to low english understood | 13:42 |
| Khertan | hrw: what is children day ? | 13:43 |
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| hrw | Khertan: 1st June http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children%27s_Day | 13:44 |
| Khertan | yep ... i ask before looking to wikipedia | 13:44 |
| Khertan | thx :) | 13:44 |
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| Elvaron | TomaszD: thats exactly what i needed, thx. wonder why thats not in the app.manager catalogues o_O | 13:46 |
| TomaszD | no idea | 13:46 |
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| Elvaron | anyhow, thanks^^ | 13:46 |
| RichardP | wow, thats a lot more users than I thought there would be | 13:47 |
| TomaszD | np | 13:47 |
| RichardP | so, Im thinking of making the switch from the iPhone to the N900 - am i insane or is it worth it? | 13:48 |
| TomaszD | depends on your needs | 13:48 |
| Elvaron | now to find out how to make that into a widget... the .c source looks manageable | 13:48 |
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| Bactius | #iphone | 13:49 |
| TomaszD | if you want a phone, stick with the iPhone, if you want a pocketable computer with basic GSM capabilities, go with the n900 | 13:49 |
| LuciusMare | Hi, why there's no command "file" on fremantle? | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | install it? | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | nokia marketing is awesome | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | 'meego door is not closed on n900' | 13:49 |
| LuciusMare | oh. I thought it is a basic command | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | don't assume anything | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:50 |
| TomaszD | Stskeeps, link? | 13:50 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Ovi? :) | 13:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, stupid business idiots. | 13:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, one way or the other, either do it or don't. | 13:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't poison the community with the FUD. | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/16/nokia-meego-door-is-not-closed-on-n900/ | 13:51 |
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| TomaszD | heh | 13:52 |
| hrw | RichardP: and 'basic GSM' means basic indeed | 13:52 |
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| * GeneralAntilles doesn't see any real missing features. | 13:52 | |
| TomaszD | "real" | 13:52 |
| iss | I want to use the OVI calendar web frontend and it should sync with the N900 calendar app, does anybody know when this will become possible? | 13:53 |
| TomaszD | nice way of putting it | 13:53 |
| noobmonk3y | real issues depend on the users perspective :D | 13:53 |
| RichardP | hrw: Ive read that, but it really seems to be a point people are stressing, why? | 13:53 |
| noobmonk3y | oh and expectations (Valid or invalid at that) | 13:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Only thing I'm kind of missing is per-user ringtones | 13:53 |
| RichardP | hrw: i mainly use my iphone for web browsing and email, either over 3g or wifi | 13:53 |
| * nidO facepalms | 13:53 | |
| GeneralAntilles | but I was always too lazy to set those up anyway. | 13:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | GeneralAntilles: yeah | 13:53 |
| * noobmonk3y still has the standard ringtone :) | 13:53 | |
| RichardP | hrw: i have some apps, but i rarely use them | 13:53 |
| nidO | my phone makes phone calls, its all good | 13:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | RichardP, sounds like the N900 might be a good fit | 13:54 |
| nidO | it receives them, too! | 13:54 |
| TomaszD | RichardP, then you'll be blown away by the browser on the n900, and you should go for it | 13:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | At least for web it's best-in-class. | 13:54 |
| RichardP | hrw: i make a phone call perhaps twice a week | 13:54 |
| hrw | RichardP: you have: voicecalls and sms messaging. you do not have videocalls, mms require 3rdparty tool + configuring by hand | 13:54 |
| lupine_85 | eh. microb is ok | 13:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mail is another issue entirely. | 13:54 |
| noobmonk3y | lol - havn't actually made a phone call on mine in a week...the e71 still has the odd use :D | 13:54 |
| RichardP | sms about 20 times a week | 13:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's functional, but not particularly nice. | 13:54 |
| lupine_85 | thankfully, you get to have firefox too :) | 13:54 |
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| hrw | mail? mail app on n900 is disaster | 13:54 |
| * hrw -> food | 13:54 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, MicroB kicks Fennec's ass, quite truthfully. | 13:54 |
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| lupine_85 | no, I quite like the mail app | 13:54 |
| thresh | mutt ftw | 13:54 |
| nidO | thats not "thankfully", fennec is awful :< | 13:54 |
| noobmonk3y | have to agree with gen, microb for me is pretty amazing, but then i have never had a decent web phone or touch screen before | 13:54 |
| lupine_85 | GeneralAntilles, no, it doesn't. It's bugged to death. | 13:54 |
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| thresh | and i miss a working maps application | 13:55 |
| thresh | or a decent gps | 13:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, Maemo 4 or Maemo 5? :) | 13:55 |
| fluemo | for me too, firefox is slowwww | 13:55 |
| TomaszD | nidO, check fennect trunk daily build, it's much better | 13:55 |
| lupine_85 | microb :) | 13:55 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, that's not an answer. | 13:55 |
| TomaszD | *fennec | 13:55 |
| lupine_85 | firefox takes too long to start up for my liking, but once it's up, it's god | 13:55 |
| lupine_85 | good* | 13:55 |
| lupine_85 | microb on maemo 5 | 13:55 |
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| fluemo | yea, but mostly you need it fast :) | 13:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, then how do you mean "bugged"? :) | 13:55 |
| fluemo | so startup time is kinda important | 13:55 |
| lupine_85 | mostly, I need it standards compliant | 13:55 |
| * noobmonk3y needs to create a maemo bbs lol | 13:55 | |
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| RichardP | should i be concerned with the meego talk ive picked up on in here since i joined? :) is there a future for the N900 if i bought it now? | 13:55 |
| noobmonk3y | richard - yes | 13:56 |
| * GeneralAntilles sighs at that again. | 13:56 | |
| lupine_85 | RichardP, probably, but possibly not | 13:56 |
| * GeneralAntilles stabs Ari. | 13:56 | |
| noobmonk3y | lupine - yes there will be, but again done that convo to death :) | 13:56 |
| lupine_85 | bug #8362 | 13:56 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8362 Some combination of Maemo 5 + Nokia N900 results in improper onChange callbacks in the maemo browser | 13:56 |
| * noobmonk3y thinks GeneralAntilles has some pent up agression :D | 13:56 | |
| noobmonk3y | RichardP: sorry, yes to the future, not the concern | 13:56 |
| lupine_85 | MicroB exposed that particular issue after about 5 minutes of using it | 13:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I'm tired of Nokia constantly poisoning and hobbling every positive thing they do. | 13:57 |
| lupine_85 | leaves me concerned as to what else it does wrong, only less visibly | 13:57 |
| X-Fade | Nobody knows what MeeGo is, why would you want it on a perfectly working N900 :) | 13:57 |
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| noobmonk3y | X-Fade: good point.... but everyone wants the latest stuff - even if only to whinge ;) | 13:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, it's FIXED. | 13:57 |
| iss | FYI, the Meego main webpage has a picture of an N900 on it | 13:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | GeneralAntilles: would you mind to change chan topic to include Stskeeps' tmo post 'love the bomb' ? | 13:57 |
| lupine_85 | yes, because I spotted and reported it | 13:57 |
| X-Fade | Don't expect anything wroking from MeeGo for end-users in quite a while. | 13:57 |
| X-Fade | For developers, yes. | 13:58 |
| RichardP | X-Fade: well, the concern is if Nokia drop maemo and only go meego, then the upgrade route is uncertain. but then maemo version Y might not be N900 compat either i guess | 13:58 |
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| lupine_85 | point is, microb has far less users than fennec. so it gets more stuff wrong. | 13:58 |
| X-Fade | RichardP: That might be a year+. | 13:58 |
| noobmonk3y | RichardP: You need o ask how much input nokia have had recently :) - there is still a largggggge community for the n900 :D | 13:58 |
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| noobmonk3y | (ignoring bug fixing etc :) ) | 13:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | lupine_85, yeah, um, that's usually how bugs are fixed. | 13:58 |
| lupine_85 | indeedy | 13:59 |
| noobmonk3y | i agree with X-Fade gonna be a while, the n900 is still actually being tweaked and looked at | 13:59 |
| lcuk | RichardP, there is a dedicated team of developers as well as many many community people watching and helping with the current system | 13:59 |
| X-Fade | RichardP: And we still don't know what MeeGo will consists of. | 13:59 |
| achipa | RichardP: and to add to your confusion, Maemo 6 is also called Meego :) | 13:59 |
| noobmonk3y | omg lcuk is alive | 13:59 |
| * lcuk is working | 13:59 | |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, which is being decreased daily. | 13:59 |
| * noobmonk3y doesn't believe that! | 13:59 | |
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| iss | My guess is that Meego will be able to run all existing Maemo software | 13:59 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, then pick up an ide and get helping - theres tonnes of code on gitorious | 13:59 |
| noobmonk3y | iss - different beast not sure on that | 14:00 |
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| lcuk | ill help marry up maemo bugs iwth code bases | 14:00 |
| noobmonk3y | but all qt stuff maybe | 14:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, not my cup of tea. :) | 14:00 |
| lcuk | and let you try supply patches | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | X-Fade: GeneralAntilles: I suggest replacing "Can't talk? Register. Getting spammed? /mode YOURNICK +R" by http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=45213 , in chan topic | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | i'd like to make a bet that meego would probably run on n810 if they made the right choices | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:00 |
| * lupine_85 is quite irritated by the presence of internal repositories, actually | 14:00 | |
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| noobmonk3y | lol Stskeeps | 14:00 |
| TomaszD | http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Skype-publishes-SILK-audio-codec-source-code-955264.html | 14:00 |
| noobmonk3y | ooooooooooooo | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | lupine_85: give it time, a devel repository isn't pretty | 14:00 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, ill agree with that, but since its a phone it would be as impractical as android etc | 14:00 |
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| lupine_85 | yeah, that's fine by me | 14:01 |
| lcuk | the same argument is made for meeg on pentium M for instance | 14:01 |
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| lcuk | instead of silly "requires atom" | 14:01 |
| * noobmonk3y requires.......... a coffee | 14:01 | |
| iss | I want to use the OVI calendar web frontend and it should sync with the standard N900 calendar app, does anybody know when this will become possible? | 14:02 |
| lupine_85 | I think the N900 is about powerful enough for a 'real' firefox. although I do wish they'd doubled the RAM | 14:02 |
| lcuk | noobmonk3y, grab me one plz | 14:02 |
| * noobmonk3y thinks the postage of a coffe could be interesting... along with messy.... | 14:02 | |
| lcuk | email it then | 14:03 |
| lcuk | will arrive hot | 14:03 |
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| lupine_85 | just put the cup on the CD tray and close it? | 14:03 |
| noobmonk3y | lol | 14:03 |
| noobmonk3y | yay! | 14:03 |
| lupine_85 | presumably, it only works with the foam cups | 14:03 |
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| wazd | "I am not a developer, and don't know linux language." | 14:04 |
| * wazd facepalms | 14:05 | |
| nidO | I had a chuckle at that too | 14:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | oooooouuuuuch | 14:05 |
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| * noobmonk3y doesnt speak el linuxy..... is it like spanishy? | 14:05 | |
| Lumpio- | He only knows Windows language and God's language (English) | 14:05 |
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| Elvaron | meh i'm lost in the jungle of information, anyone got me a quick link that tells me the ~20 lines of code needed for a c source to get a widget (just a button with a string text on it would suffice) on the desktop? | 14:05 |
| * noobmonk3y blinkc, c whats that? :D | 14:06 | |
| * noobmonk3y blinks properly this time...... | 14:06 | |
| DocScrutinizer | Elvaron: there's a armel.deb on qwerty12.qule.xyz | 14:06 |
| Elvaron | or i could write it in py, then i could use sleeper's widget code but would have to rewrite keyboard-layout-applet's event | 14:07 |
| Elvaron | ? | 14:07 |
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| Elvaron | i'm trying to write my first program for maemo here, not just "get a package" :) | 14:07 |
| Elvaron | i should note that the use of the term "program" is misleading in the previous sentence | 14:08 |
| lupine_85 | it's just GTK | 14:08 |
| pupnik | download source for a program that you want to emulate Elvaron | 14:08 |
| lupine_85 | well, GTK + stuff | 14:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | Elvaron: http://qwerty12.qole.org/kb/Screenshot-20091230-134527.png and http://qwerty12.qole.org/kb/keyboard-layout-applet_0.1_armel.deb | 14:08 |
| Elvaron | you're not listening to what i say, doc | 14:08 |
| ynezz | Elvaron: https://vcs.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/hello-world-app/ | 14:09 |
| TigerTael | Uh, I know I am missing something, but how can I enable SSH connections from cellular data connections? | 14:09 |
| lupine_85 | TigerTael, it should all "just work" | 14:09 |
| Elvaron | thank you, ynezz | 14:09 |
| lupine_85 | if you're running an ssh server on the mobile, and are trying to get to it, you'll probably need to tunnel some real IPs | 14:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | Elvaron: I'm so busy getting info for you :-P | 14:09 |
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| TigerTael | lupine_85, do you think my SP is block it? | 14:09 |
| TigerTael | *blocking | 14:09 |
| lupine_85 | it's a possibility | 14:10 |
| TigerTael | I have a real IP. | 14:10 |
| Elvaron | ^^ thx, but i already have that app, now i want to try out and rewrite it as a desktop widget | 14:10 |
| lupine_85 | pop an ssh server on port 443 and try ssh to that | 14:10 |
| TigerTael | Okay, how do I do that? | 14:10 |
| lupine_85 | ssh "looks like" https traffic, so that's generally quite good | 14:10 |
| lupine_85 | man sshd_config | 14:10 |
| ynezz | Elvaron: https://vcs.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/example_desktop_widget/ | 14:10 |
| ynezz | Elvaron: do you know how to use google? | 14:10 |
| TigerTael | lupine_85, there is no man on the N900. ;] | 14:11 |
| lupine_85 | Add "Listen 443" to the file, I guess | 14:11 |
| Elvaron | yes, theres like a bazillion things to read, i just thought someone here would have a good idea on where to start, you know | 14:11 |
| TigerTael | okay | 14:11 |
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| * lupine_85 really hopes meego hacks less on layout | 14:11 | |
| Elvaron | its like saying "which is a good book for learning chinese?" "do you know what a library is?" :) | 14:11 |
| ynezz | Elvaron: yes, start here https://vcs.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/ | 14:11 |
| Elvaron | yes, i will | 14:12 |
| Elvaron | i mean, i am | 14:12 |
| Elvaron | just need to find my vmware o_O | 14:12 |
| Elvaron | anyhow, thx so far | 14:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | Elvaron: it's really like that. Everybody will recommend another book to you | 14:12 |
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| visz | Elvaron, mandarin on cantonese?-) | 14:12 |
| Elvaron | probably, but asking ppl who have more experience at least gives me some sort of filter | 14:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | please don't complain about *too much* response | 14:13 |
| Elvaron | visz: cantonese | 14:13 |
| Elvaron | i'm not complaining :) | 14:13 |
| Elvaron | i'm overly happy with what you all gave me | 14:13 |
| Elvaron | now i need to work on it^^ | 14:13 |
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| andrewfblack | Hello | 14:15 |
| TigerTael | woah, my keyboard input has gone all funky. | 14:15 |
| visz | Elvaron, can't go wrong with pimsleur | 14:16 |
| TigerTael | okay, it went back to normal now... that was very weird. | 14:17 |
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| ptl | cool, picodrive is finally out | 14:17 |
| ptl | :D | 14:17 |
| ptl | just downloaded it | 14:17 |
| Elvaron | pimsleur? well, i think i have enough info at the moment, i'm still at "Downloading VMware player" :) | 14:17 |
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| b0unc3 | hey guys, somebody know how to create a custom keyboard shortcut ? | 14:20 |
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| iss | Does anyone know about OVI calendar sync with N900? It's really the only thing that I am missing. Any alternatives you can suggest? | 14:21 |
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| * rmrfchik is missing google sync | 14:22 | |
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| MiXu- | Use SyncEvolution | 14:23 |
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| MiXu- | It works with any service that uses SyncML | 14:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | b0unc3: custom shortcuts seem to me like they're app specific and need support from particular app | 14:23 |
| arachnist | hmm | 14:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's a few global ones like ctrl-bs | 14:24 |
| rmrfchik | # apt-cache search synce |wc -l | 14:24 |
| rmrfchik | 0 | 14:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer | dunno how to add to these | 14:24 |
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| arachnist | "apt-cache search sync" and it returns anki and ankimaemi | 14:24 |
| MiXu- | SyncEvolution can be found from extras-devel at least | 14:25 |
| arachnist | i never really understood debian people and why are they so proud of apt* and dpkg | 14:25 |
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| iss | MiXu - thanks, SyncEvolution is a good idea | 14:25 |
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| mgedmin | arachnist, afaiu years ago apt worked much better than any alternative, hence the pride | 14:25 |
| MiXu- | It's a bit rough around the edges but does the trick, and has a decent ui. | 14:26 |
| mgedmin | I remember switching from redhat/mandrake to debian back in 2001(?) and loving apt | 14:26 |
| iss | you think it works with OVi calendar? or can you suggest a different one? I don't like Google | 14:26 |
| MiXu- | Don't know. Haven't tried. | 14:26 |
| mgedmin | although debian's biggest strength was always the large set of well-maintained packages rather than the tool | 14:26 |
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| lcuk | Myrtti, random: thank you | 14:27 |
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| rmrfchik | hmm.. according to "ps -ef", the most memory hog is... pulseaudio! | 14:47 |
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| rmrfchik | it beats modest, xorg, mafw (wtf?), browser | 14:47 |
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| X-Fade | rmrfchik: Doesn't say anything, really. | 14:49 |
| rmrfchik | yeah, sad there is no pmap utility | 14:49 |
| kamui | lol | 14:50 |
| kamui | so awesome | 14:50 |
| rmrfchik | I believe this is shared memory, but how can I know? ;) | 14:50 |
| kamui | pulseaudio is aweful | 14:50 |
| rmrfchik | Very interesting. There is a topic in pulseaudio maillist. "[pulseaudio-discuss] Hard-coded allocation of 64 MB of memory upfront too big in some scenarios | 14:51 |
| rmrfchik | Seems like they sbrk 64Mb just for case | 14:51 |
| ptl | 'ipcs' | 14:52 |
| ptl | 64 MB? | 14:53 |
| ptl | pulseaudio reserves 1/4 of the RAM of the device? | 14:53 |
| SpeedEvil | rmrfchik: look for smap | 14:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | rmrfchik, top? | 14:53 |
| rmrfchik | rss 10316 | 14:53 |
| rmrfchik | and vsz 83144 | 14:54 |
| * noobmonk3y returneth | 14:54 | |
| rmrfchik | 83MB!! facepalm | 14:54 |
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| SpeedEvil | top sycks | 14:54 |
| noobmonk3y | lot of facepalming going on today! | 14:54 |
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| mgedmin | vsz is irrelevant in most cases | 14:55 |
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| iss | my pulseaudio uses 2.15% | 14:55 |
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| kamui | random thought, has anyone tried running E16 or e17 in easydebian? | 14:55 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.selenic.com/smem/ | 14:56 |
| SpeedEvil | see that | 14:56 |
| kamui | and fyi, whoever created the queen bee widgets is a genius | 14:56 |
| kamui | I love them | 14:56 |
| visz | oh, is e17 usable? | 14:56 |
| kamui | no visz | 14:56 |
| kamui | not really :) | 14:56 |
| kamui | I think it looks cool though | 14:56 |
| visz | i stopped waiting for it in 1998 or so =) | 14:56 |
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| kamui | lols | 14:56 |
| SpeedEvil | python app that checks shared memory | 14:57 |
| SpeedEvil | pss | 14:57 |
| kamui | I haven't tried it since 2004ish | 14:57 |
| shahin | anyone know when the new meego os for netbooks will be released? | 14:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | shahin, try #meego. | 14:57 |
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| kamui | shahin: I hope sometime after the N900 branch is available | 14:57 |
| kamui | :) | 14:57 |
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| rmrfchik | shahin: if it will looks and feels like moblin it will sucks | 14:58 |
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| rmrfchik | shiny leeenux for grandpa | 14:58 |
| shahin | rmrfchik: ehm, why? i loved moblin :) | 14:58 |
| thresh | rmrfchik it too oldschool for that. | 14:59 |
| rmrfchik | it can't do anything. 3 applications, compiz (read WOW!!) | 14:59 |
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| shahin | rmrfchik: i can't youse more than 3 applications at the same time? | 15:00 |
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| SpeedEvil | rmrfchik: PID User Command Swap USS PSS RSS | 15:00 |
| SpeedEvil | 5658 pulse /usr/bin/pulseaudio --syste 424 3476 3564 4888 | 15:00 |
| SpeedEvil | that's playing audio | 15:00 |
| rmrfchik | shahin: $ xlsclients|wc -l | 15:00 |
| rmrfchik | 162 | 15:00 |
| SpeedEvil | pss is how much actual device RAM it's using | 15:00 |
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| shahin | rmrfchik: what? | 15:01 |
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| mgedmin | how is it calculated? | 15:02 |
| * noobmonk3y blinks... did someone ask the meego/mobilny n900 / maemo when question again? :D | 15:02 | |
| tybollt | \\o 2.1 | 15:02 |
| tybollt | ehr 1.2 :) | 15:03 |
| pupnik | just play an mp3 and look at cpumem applet, then keep playing mp3 and look at battery | 15:04 |
| TigerTael | Uh, is it normal for my phone not to connect to cellular data even though it's set to automatically connect? I mean, there is nothing on the phone actually trying to use it, but, if there's no cell-data connection, Nokia Messaging doesn't check for new mail... | 15:04 |
| TigerTael | Catch 22? | 15:04 |
| pupnik | i connect manually | 15:05 |
| TigerTael | Just wondering. | 15:06 |
| timeless_mbp | TigerTael: i had a problem like that | 15:07 |
| TigerTael | It happens after first booting... | 15:07 |
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| TigerTael | Doesn't bother to connect to cell-data because there's nothing that wants to use it and Nokia Messaging takes a passive role. | 15:07 |
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| lupine_85 | presumably it'll open a cellular connection when the messaging application tries to open a socket? | 15:09 |
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| TigerTael | Which it never does... | 15:09 |
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| lupine_85 | odd. why not? do you not have it set up to check every n minutes? | 15:09 |
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| TigerTael | lupine_85, yeah. | 15:09 |
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| * lupine_85 has sip and xmpp and smtp accounts and they all get connectivity when they ask for it | 15:10 | |
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| TigerTael | Let me do a more thorough test. | 15:11 |
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| Elvaron | hmm i dont seem to find a good example of code where the default widget box (96x96 pixels, beveled edge/dark-grey gradient style) is being drawn | 15:16 |
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| * Khertan just discover paste2.org | 15:34 | |
| * noobmonk3y blinks | 15:34 | |
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| * TigerTael waits for the 15 minute interval to come up to check mail automatically. | 15:47 | |
| tybollt | 1.2? | 15:48 |
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| TigerTael | Still hasn't kicked in yet. | 15:49 |
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| crashanddie | what hasn't kicked in yet? | 15:52 |
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| noobmonk3y | who's kicking who? :D | 15:53 |
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| lupine_85 | v-tech? | 15:53 |
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| TigerTael | Well, I have my cell-data set to automatically connect, but after a reboot, it doesn't bother to reconnect and Nokia Messaging is not initiating that connection either. | 15:53 |
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| TigerTael | So my phone is just sitting by itself, not checking mail like it's supposed to. ;/ | 15:53 |
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| noobmonk3y | hmmm my data connectiongs seem to have gone haywire after installing DCE recently tis a pain | 15:54 |
| TigerTael | Seems that Nokia Messaging is taking a passive role. | 15:54 |
| noobmonk3y | removed it and it was fine for a day then reset and didnt auto connect to anything | 15:54 |
| noobmonk3y | meh | 15:54 |
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| lupine_85 | wonder when they'll release PR1.2 | 15:55 |
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| noobmonk3y | at some point......... | 15:55 |
| TigerTael | I haven't read about this in any bugtracking... | 15:55 |
| Khertan | create a report so | 15:56 |
| TigerTael | And I think it'll be kinda annoying. | 15:56 |
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| noobmonk3y | meh | 15:56 |
| noobmonk3y | meh meh meh | 15:56 |
| Khertan | it s difficult to fix unknow bugs for developpers | 15:56 |
| * noobmonk3y eats bugs for breakfast....... | 15:56 | |
| TigerTael | Khertan, understood, but I'm just wondering if it's me... or is this expected behaviour. | 15:56 |
| crashanddie | noobmonk3y: I take it you live in a trailerpark in east-USA? | 15:57 |
| * Khertan is currently studying a rumours ear at his office hotline ... and spent 4 hours this morning what is the bug | 15:57 | |
| noobmonk3y | ;) close enough :D | 15:57 |
| crashanddie | rumours ear? | 15:57 |
| crashanddie | a rumour's ear? | 15:57 |
| noobmonk3y | the ear of a rumour......... wow they have body parts? | 15:57 |
| noobmonk3y | or the ear of rumour's even | 15:57 |
| crashanddie | the ear of a rumour seven? | 15:57 |
| noobmonk3y | lol....... | 15:58 |
| noobmonk3y | riddle me this riddle me that...... khertan is high again ;) | 15:58 |
| crashanddie | nha, hee iz french and hee lovz to baffeul us wiz the poweur of his metafores! | 15:59 |
| noobmonk3y | awwwwwwwww | 15:59 |
| * noobmonk3y pats khertan on hiz head | 16:00 | |
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| TigerTael | Yeah, still no mail check. | 16:00 |
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| TigerTael | The way the settings are described, it sounds as if nokia messaging will only check if there's a connection present and will not try and initiate a connection... | 16:01 |
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| tybollt | guyes | 16:01 |
| TigerTael | And auto-connection only works if there's a connection attempt. | 16:01 |
| mne | Hi, is anyone familiar with the internals of the alsa-dsp IO plugin ? | 16:01 |
| tybollt | he's french | 16:01 |
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| ShadowJK | nokia messaging might be pushmail... | 16:01 |
| lupine_85 | crazy | 16:01 |
| tybollt | he's totally on a cheese high | 16:01 |
| tybollt | don't ruin his buzz ;) | 16:01 |
| ShadowJK | hm, I think auto connect works for me even if there's no connection attempt that maemo knows of | 16:01 |
| ShadowJK | for example if I'm at home on wlan, and then drive to work, phone loses wifi connection and automatically connects to cellular | 16:02 |
| mne | I don't think that the incrementing of the hardware pointer in implemented correctly in the maemon alsa IO plugin | 16:02 |
| Khertan | Hé ho ... yes i'm french ... :) | 16:02 |
| ShadowJK | mne, is this on N8x0? | 16:02 |
| crashanddie | tybollt: no cheese jokes | 16:02 |
| Khertan | i forgot the h | 16:03 |
| Khertan | :) | 16:03 |
| crashanddie | tybollt: I've been in france for just under 48 hours now, and I've had more and better cheese than 6 months in the UK/US/Australia | 16:03 |
| tybollt | crashanddie: | 16:03 |
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| tybollt | crashanddie: :D | 16:03 |
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| mne | ShadowJK, I have no idea. It just says "Alsa External plugin". project site is here: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/dsp-alsa/ | 16:03 |
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| ShadowJK | I guess that's on N800 and N810 then | 16:04 |
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| mne | "This plugin converts the ALSA API over PCM task nodes protocol. In this way, ALSA native applications can run over DSP Gateway and use DSP PCM task nodes. " | 16:05 |
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| mne | [https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/wiki/index.php?id=81&type=g] | 16:05 |
| TigerTael | ShadowJK, in my case, it's a cold start... no connections were forced or made... | 16:05 |
| TigerTael | And then Nokia Messaging just sits and does nothing because there's no connection. | 16:06 |
| TigerTael | And Maemo doesn't connect because nothing wants to connect. | 16:06 |
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| GAN900 | Comcast's daily connection kill | 16:10 |
| GAN900 | Gotta love it. | 16:10 |
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| n900Marco | hello everybody | 16:11 |
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| tybollt | hello dr nick! | 16:11 |
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| Khertan | hihi :) | 16:14 |
| Khertan | Hey I'm dr Nick ! | 16:15 |
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| * RST38h moos | 16:17 | |
| * thresh waves back | 16:18 | |
| arachnist | GAN900: the biggest isp in poland also does that | 16:18 |
| hrw | do what? | 16:18 |
| RST38h | thresh: how are things? going to the FRUCT? | 16:18 |
| arachnist | 151025 | GAN900 | Comcast's daily connection kill | 16:18 |
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| hrw | which means? | 16:19 |
| * RST38h suspects that the isp in poland does many more funny things as well =) | 16:19 | |
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| GAN900 | hrw, Comcast kills you internet connection at least once a day for 5-30 minutes | 16:19 |
| hrw | RST38h: we have many isps here | 16:19 |
| GAN900 | usually more often than that | 16:19 |
| arachnist | hrw: which means you get disconnected. it often changes your ip | 16:20 |
| hrw | GAN900: ouch. | 16:20 |
| hrw | I am using UPC now - never had such problem | 16:20 |
| arachnist | hrw: (mówię o neozdradowych zrywach połączeń) | 16:20 |
| GAN900 | They also shape traffic and physically abuse their customers. | 16:20 |
| thresh | RST38h: i'm alrite. I'm not sure I will attend it. | 16:20 |
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| thresh | I doubt my employer will send me there ;-) | 16:20 |
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| RST38h | thresh: isn't it on saturday? | 16:21 |
| thresh | 23-25 march, it says | 16:21 |
| GAN900 | They added a new service fee so if Comcast screws up your connection somehow they chargem you $30 to come out and fix it unless you have the $2.99/mo insurance | 16:21 |
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| thresh | i'd love to listen to ab speech, but meh | 16:21 |
| GAN900 | Considering that the Comcast techs manage to disconnect me at least once every two months. . . . | 16:22 |
| RST38h | thresh: shit, not good... | 16:22 |
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| thresh | ah the conference is on 25 march | 16:23 |
| thresh | but still it's thursday | 16:23 |
| RST38h | thresh: On the other hand, I guess it can be considered work related for me | 16:23 |
| hrw | arachnist: I have a luck to never had to use DSL or analog modems | 16:23 |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, interesting stuff at FRUCT ? :) | 16:24 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Interesting people | 16:24 |
| thresh | RST38h: not really related for me, though we do work with cellulars | 16:24 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: A few interesting technical topics | 16:24 |
| thresh | and the only interesting lecture would be Sasha's one, and probably New trends in Maemo security | 16:25 |
| arachnist | hrw: well, never did i, but many of my friends did | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, is there a English schedule somewhere ? | 16:25 |
| thresh | everything else, well no :-) | 16:25 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: A moment | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | got one in Russian (I think) in the other day | 16:25 |
| RST38h | Anyone who needs ZAGG discounts, let me know | 16:26 |
| TigerTael | Okay, I posted the bug. | 16:26 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Ok, I do not see the English one, but can translate quickly | 16:26 |
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| RST38h | Maemo Business Opportunities (guy from Forum Nokia EMEA) | 16:27 |
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| RST38h | Maemo Architecture and Mobile Multimedia Processing (abbra) | 16:27 |
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| RST38h | Object Oriented Approach to Mobile System Programming (Vitaly Repin, the guy responsible for Exchange stuff in Maemo) | 16:28 |
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| RST38h | Maemo Browser: Internet in Your Hands (Leonid Zolotarev, head of Browsing and Places apps) | 16:29 |
| RST38h | New Trends in Maemo Security | 16:29 |
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| RST38h | Using DBus in Maemo | 16:30 |
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| hrw | RST38h: where? | 16:30 |
| RST38h | Russian Maemo Community (some guy heading fruct.org whom NONE of us knows) | 16:30 |
| RST38h | hrw: Moscow, 25th March | 16:30 |
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| hrw | thx | 16:31 |
| RST38h | maemoworld.ru and maemos.ru presentations by respective site owners | 16:31 |
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| RST38h | Maemo5: View from outside (iXBT guy) | 16:31 |
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| RST38h | A few talks on Maemo labs in Russian universities | 16:31 |
| RST38h | Qt in Mobile Devices (guy heading FRUCT lab at some StPeterburg school) | 16:32 |
| tybollt | FRUCT? :) :) | 16:33 |
| RST38h | Implementation of Energy Aware Queue Management Algorithm (some FRUCT guy from SpB) | 16:33 |
| RST38h | OpenCV Performance in Maemo (FRUCT guy from Nizhnij Novgorod) | 16:33 |
| RST38h | ECG Measuring App on Maemo (another FRUCT guy) | 16:34 |
| RST38h | this is pretty much it, I skipped a few because they sounded irrelevant | 16:34 |
| hrw | nice subjects | 16:34 |
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| noobmonk3y | tybollt: finland russia universities something or other | 16:37 |
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| tybollt | noobmonk3y: translate.google.com, swedish, keyword: "frukt" :):) | 16:38 |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, thanks :) | 16:39 |
| VDVsx | isn't jeremiah giving a talk there ? | 16:40 |
| VDVsx | I think I read it somewhere o.0 | 16:40 |
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| RST38h | VDVsx: I do not see him | 16:43 |
| * noobmonk3y blinks | 16:43 | |
| * VDVsx checks | 16:44 | |
| * noobmonk3y smiles at the fruity goodness | 16:44 | |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, 1h MeeGo - operating everywhere, by Jeremiah Foster, Maemo | 16:45 |
| VDVsx | :p | 16:45 |
| VDVsx | http://www.fruct.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=48 | 16:45 |
| VDVsx | not sure if is a paper or a talk | 16:45 |
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| dneary | lcuk, Ping? | 16:47 |
| dneary | lcuk, Did I miss your declining your council nomination? | 16:47 |
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| thopiekar | Why are the colors mixed in the maemo5 sdk? | 16:48 |
| thopiekar | like red is blue, etc.. | 16:48 |
| * noobmonk3y thinks lcuk fell asleep after the nomination and hasn't woken up since ;) | 16:48 | |
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| * Stskeeps glares at jeremiah's email to maemo-community | 16:51 | |
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| lcuk | dneary, no i have things to consider :) | 16:52 |
| dneary | OK | 16:52 |
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| dneary | lcuk, Someone mentioned today that you'd declined, and I hadn't seen it, so I was wondering | 16:53 |
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| lcuk | somebody mentioned i am not sure its right | 16:53 |
| loufoque_ | should I buy a N900 now or should I wait for the next generation? | 16:53 |
| VDVsx | Stskeeps, indeed, lol | 16:53 |
| nidO | loufoque_ do you want a device now or in 6+ months? | 16:54 |
| nidO | the answer is always wait for the next generation if you can wait, but when you've waited for that one there'll be one after to wait for as well. | 16:54 |
| thopiekar | is there a terminal for maemo5? | 16:55 |
| nidO | ofc | 16:55 |
| * lcuk can see the grapevine works tho :D | 16:55 | |
| loufoque_ | nidO: I would prefer now, but not if it's going to end up being unsupported software when the new platform comes out | 16:55 |
| loufoque_ | will the N900 get meego? | 16:56 |
| lupine_85 | loufoque_, nobody's told you? | 16:56 |
| Stskeeps | loufoque_: n900 will be meego reference platform | 16:56 |
| lupine_85 | the government has outlawed N900s. They've got people going out confiscating them | 16:56 |
| lupine_85 | I had to hide mine where the sun doesn't shine :'( | 16:56 |
| lupine_85 | I really wish it was a slimmer form factor | 16:57 |
| lcuk | dneary, nice lineup so far tho isnt it | 16:57 |
| dneary | lcuk, Varied | 16:57 |
| dneary | Interesting | 16:57 |
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| loufoque_ | Stskeeps: where have you seen that? | 16:57 |
| dneary | Try to work out where the power base of each candidate is, and whether they'll mobilise the vote and/or split the electorate :) | 16:57 |
| ccooke | Afternoon, all | 16:58 |
| lcuk | can i use the n900 video as campaign material :D | 16:58 |
| lcuk | hiya charles | 16:58 |
| * GAN900 cackles. | 16:59 | |
| ccooke | loufoque_: n900 as meego reference platform has been said several times, now. | 16:59 |
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| hrw | meegoo, meepoo - what's difference? | 17:00 |
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| hrw | without code drops I can say anything | 17:00 |
| VDVsx | loufoque_, like here: http://meego.com/community/blogs/valhalla/2010/towards-day-one | 17:00 |
| KrisC | does nokia ever announce their updates for thr n900 ? | 17:00 |
| ccooke | hrw: Indeed, they are both rather poor misspellings :-) | 17:00 |
| VDVsx | KrisC, yes | 17:00 |
| VDVsx | in the same day that the update ships | 17:01 |
| ccooke | VDVsx: they're the same for updates to anything though, IIRC? | 17:01 |
| hrw | VDVsx: no, they also announce them months before shipping | 17:01 |
| hrw | "there will be PR1.2 update but we will not tell you will it be this month or next year" | 17:01 |
| KrisC | does anybody have an estimate of when the next one will be rolled out? | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | hrw, no officially, afaik | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | *not | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | ie, at *Nokia.com | 17:02 |
| ponyofdeath | hi, i have the usa version of the n900 and i am currently in europ ( bulgaria ) when i try to use the phone i dont see any service with my sim card from bulgarian gsm network. do i have to reflash the device with the international version? | 17:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | hrw, not officially | 17:02 |
| hrw | KrisC: 2nd June was rumoured | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | lol | 17:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia hardly does anything officially. | 17:02 |
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| ShadowJK | there's no difference except keyboards | 17:02 |
| KrisC | thats still a while. thnx | 17:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Basically, they fscking fail at communication | 17:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is hilarious for a communication company. | 17:02 |
| hrw | GeneralAntilles: sure, it is just visible in too many places and from mouths of many @nokia.com people | 17:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | hrw, sure, but not official. ;) | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | loufoque_: meego.com | 17:03 |
| hrw | "Nokia: connecting rumours" | 17:03 |
| VDVsx | KrisC, I doubt that date, but dunno also | 17:03 |
| TomaszD | ponyofdeath, do you have network roaming enabled for your operator (t-mobile I assume)? | 17:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | KrisC, certification apparently started the other week. | 17:03 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: actually, it's a trait of every single communications company I've ever seen the internals of (and most of my employers have been communications companies :-) | 17:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think cert usually takes about a month. | 17:03 |
| ponyofdeath | TomaszD: the n900 doesnt even detect the network | 17:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, then the whole industry is a joyfully plentiful source of irony, then, I guess. | 17:04 |
| ccooke | seriously, technology-based companies are almost universally terrible at communicating with people :-) | 17:04 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, where do you get your info from | 17:04 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: pretty much, yes. | 17:04 |
| ponyofdeath | TomaszD: i have an sim card here from the bulgarian operator not t-mobile | 17:04 |
| tybollt | pwny | 17:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | ponyofdeath, I had the same problem with an RX-51 and an AT&T SIM in BCN. | 17:04 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, probably from IRC, I heard the same | 17:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, konttori, other sources. | 17:04 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: I find learning to laugh at it (and all the train-wrecks it causes) to be a Good Thing for my health. | 17:04 |
| ponyofdeath | GeneralAntilles: how did u solve | 17:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | ponyofdeath, didn't. | 17:05 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: it is officially unofficial that pr1.2 has to fix another set of sim problems | 17:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | ponyofdeath, just tried to hang around other people with working cellphones. ;) | 17:05 |
| lcuk | so why in one breath do you say theres no communication, then in the other you are told | 17:05 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: grab real phone and insert sim into it | 17:05 |
| ShadowJK | ponyofdeath, try select network manually | 17:05 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: will work out-of-box probably | 17:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, having Nokia employees skirt NDAs in unofficial channels is not communication. :) | 17:05 |
| loufoque_ | what the hell, nokia plans to make meego DRM-locked with Microsoft technology | 17:05 |
| ponyofdeath | GeneralAntilles, hrw yes works in my free with sim card nokia but i porefer to use my n900 | 17:06 |
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| hrw | loufoque_: this is #maemo not #meego | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | loufoque_, kernel-locked is an option, too! | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | hrw, arguably Harmattan is a valid topic. | 17:06 |
| ponyofdeath | hrw: do u think that the international firmware will change anything | 17:06 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: nope | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | ponyofdeath, no. | 17:06 |
| loufoque_ | hrw: meego is the future of maemo | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, it's all hearsay, anyway. | 17:06 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: this is a problem with gsm modem firmware and this is update only by official releases | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, so, again, it's not communication. | 17:06 |
| loufoque_ | hrw: or do you prefer living in the past and not concerning yourself with the inevitable? | 17:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, official communication involves announcements on nokia.com | 17:07 |
| ponyofdeath | hrw: i see so i need to wait for an fix from nokia | 17:07 |
| Hydroxide | loufoque_: if what they said about maemo 6 is not being overridden by the meego transition, it will give the END-USER the DOCUMENTED option to choose between supporting Microsoft's PlayReady DRM or having full access to the device. I believe this was said on tmo in some official capacity by some nokian like qgil, but I may have misremembered the source | 17:07 |
| hrw | loufoque_: so far I ignore all meego things as so far it is only talk which is cheap. show me the code is what may change situation | 17:07 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, assuming they bought their device from Nokia. | 17:07 |
| ccooke | ponyofdeath: have you tried manually selecting a network? | 17:07 |
| ponyofdeath | hrw: as u mentioned pr1.2 is there an beta of that somewhere? :) | 17:07 |
| * lcuk nods in agreement | 17:08 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, anywhere else you may not have a choice. | 17:08 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: oh, you mean a carrier-branded device? good point | 17:08 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: sure - on 17th partition of my 65th harddrive. | 17:08 |
| slonopotamus | okay, i found what drained my battery in standby mode. it was cpumem-applet | 17:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody needs to force Nokia to GPLv3 | 17:08 |
| ponyofdeath | ccooke: how can i select manually i dont see the network at all | 17:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | They're pulling evil shit. | 17:08 |
| hrw | ponyofdeath: you need to be @nokia man to get it | 17:08 |
| ccooke | ponyofdeath: Menu -> Settings -> Phone -> Network | 17:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | MeeGo is backsliding in a lot of areas. | 17:09 |
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| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: though I do wonder if carrier-branded devices that have been legally unlocked will have any legal obstacles preventing them from flashing the unbranded Nokia firmware | 17:09 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: (or technical obstacles) | 17:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's unfortunate that Nokia is so hung up on their services malarkey that vendors and operators are going to be allowed to run rampant with differentiation. | 17:09 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: (curious) how do you know? | 17:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, which point? | 17:10 |
| ponyofdeath | ccooke: ok now i see it when i did manual | 17:10 |
| FIQ | i seems to have mksh installed. For some reason, I'm unable to install it. Why? | 17:10 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: sorry, that meego is backsliding. I've heard very little concrete about it. | 17:10 |
| ccooke | ponyofdeath: you have a network? | 17:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, look at the Harmattan security framework. | 17:10 |
| * VDVsx suspects that GeneralAntilles works for Nokia :P | 17:10 | |
| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, look at the lack of enforcement of platform-cohesiveness. | 17:10 |
| FIQ | eh | 17:11 |
| FIQ | uninstall* | 17:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, with Maemo 5 you at least didn't have to worry about signed kernels. | 17:11 |
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| ponyofdeath | Cook yes i see two one of which is the one i have an sim for | 17:12 |
| thopiekar | is there a xterm app for maemo5? | 17:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, hey, I'm not the one flying into HEL. | 17:12 |
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| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: according to the announcements at the summit, you don't have to. They committed at that point to allowing non-signed kernels. | 17:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, for Nokia unlocked devices. | 17:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | ccooke, that doesn't help people who buy from carriers or other vendors. | 17:12 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: and the other ones will depend on the carrier, yes. | 17:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | That makes community-sourced support that much more difficult to provide. | 17:13 |
| hrw | thopiekar: you have it on device already | 17:13 |
| sheepbat | people on verizon will be utterly screwed | 17:13 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: this goes back to my question about what legal or technical obstacles will stand in the way of applying unbranded software to legally unlocked devices | 17:13 |
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| Hydroxide | sheepbat: well, yeah, CMDA... | 17:13 |
| thopiekar | hrw: I don't have a device just a sdk.. | 17:13 |
| thopiekar | :) | 17:13 |
| sheepbat | that too | 17:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, well, it's all got to go through NOLO. | 17:13 |
| hrw | thopiekar: same | 17:13 |
| * thopiekar has just a N800 | 17:13 | |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: Support for custom kernels has always been terrible anyway, though. I don't see how people will really notice. | 17:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, so technical obstacles sit in the bootloader. | 17:14 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: But you can run any kernel in open mode. | 17:14 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: well, the bootloader can be replaced, too, right? | 17:14 |
| ccooke | Hydroxide: no | 17:14 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: even on carrier-branded devices? | 17:14 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: (after legally SIM-unlocking them) | 17:14 |
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| ccooke | Hydroxide: that one is a definite. The next device will not boot without a signed bootloader. Unsigned kernels are fine, but... | 17:14 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: After unlock they should be open. | 17:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't believe the bootloader can be replaced with Harmattan devices. | 17:15 |
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| GeneralAntilles | But I'm not sure | 17:15 |
| ccooke | GeneralAntilles: definitely not replacable. | 17:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not that there's a viable replacement available anyway. | 17:15 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Why would you want that. | 17:15 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: e.g. to use something more flexible like an ARM equivalent of grub2? | 17:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, as a technical workaround to lock-in signed kernels on carrier devices. | 17:15 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: In open mode you can use any kernel. | 17:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, not on a carrier device. | 17:16 |
| ccooke | Hydroxide: no need. If you can run an unsigned kernel, you can run a second bootloader as a kernel. | 17:16 |
| Hydroxide | ccooke: true... | 17:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | At least, the possibility is there for carrier devices to only load signed kernels. | 17:16 |
| ccooke | Hmm. | 17:16 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: If you buy a 'sponsored' carrier device, you know you are locked in anyway. | 17:16 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: That is only fair. | 17:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, unfortunately the vast majority of consumers don't understand that. | 17:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | and Nokia's wasting another opportunity to change the market. | 17:17 |
| ccooke | Of course, it's the law in quite a few places that carrier locks can be removed. That would pretty much have to cover installation of non-carrier firmware, too | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: They never have been able to do that on other devices either. | 17:17 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: have they documented officially whether Nokia will require people who have met whatever their country's or carrier's rule is about earning the right to legally SIM-unlock will then have full access to the device? | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: So really no news. | 17:17 |
| Hydroxide | ccooke: don't assume that. at least for Win-Mo phones, SIM-unlock and firmware-unlock are two different things | 17:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's backsliding from Maemo 5 | 17:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Signed kernels are bad juju. | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: That is between the carrier and you. | 17:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | TiVoization is inevitable. | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: That is where the contract is. | 17:17 |
| ponyofdeath | ccooke hrw GeneralAntilles hey guys that seemed to have fixed it not sure what i did tho maby the sim was not inserted properly | 17:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't trust Nokia here. | 17:17 |
| hrw | X-Fade: some operatotrs do not do sim locking anymore | 17:18 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: well there's also a contract between the carrier and nokia | 17:18 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Basically you just need to enter the unlock code and the device is opened. | 17:18 |
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| X-Fade | hrw: Power to them. | 17:18 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: on phones generally, SIM-unlocking does not imply being able to flash a custom firmware without another layer of unlocking | 17:18 |
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| Hydroxide | X-Fade: most carriers and most national laws don't address that second case | 17:18 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Simlock is usually not linked with firmware anyway ;) | 17:18 |
| hrw | nokia s40 (and older) phones are easy to unlock anyway | 17:19 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: They have to abide by local law. | 17:19 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Take them to court otherwise. | 17:19 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: right... I don't think I'm being clear | 17:19 |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: The unlock functionalty is there. If the carrier gives you the code, that is up to them. | 17:19 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: the "code" you are referring to is for sim-unlocking, I presume. is nokia going to ensure in their agreements with carriers selling branded n900 devices that once customers have met their obligation to sim-unlock they will also be able to replace the firmware or use open mode? | 17:20 |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: You can symlock your open device too ;) | 17:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, I'd doubt it. | 17:20 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: It is just basic functionality already there. | 17:20 |
| Hydroxide | or technically link sim-unlocking to firmware/openmode-unlocking | 17:20 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: me too | 17:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Differentiation fragmentation is going to be unfortunate. | 17:21 |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Your contract is not with Nokia. | 17:21 |
| Stskeeps | isn't it great how we can discuss this stuff instead of rpm vs deb or meego on n900? | 17:21 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: And a symlock is just a bit in some register anyway. | 17:21 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:21 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: I fully realize that. I can see that my question is still not clear to you, so I'll drop it - the odds of nokia doing what I want in this regard are small | 17:21 |
| * GeneralAntilles feels strongly like wading through Nokia's top execs with a large frozen trout. | 17:21 | |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Nokia won't do anything? | 17:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, Maemo 5 is a long-term dead-end and MeeGo doesn't exist. | 17:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, nice little vacuum for energy to go nowhere productive in. ;) | 17:22 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: why are you asking me? | 17:22 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: There is symlock functionality. Carrier can turn it on and off. | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: i kinda like this calm before the storm | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:22 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: right. that's irrelevant to what I wanted to know, except in terms of the relation to one's agreement with the carrier | 17:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, the "calm" is poisoning thing and resulting in a lot of atrophied enthusiasm. ;) | 17:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/thing/things/ | 17:23 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: Stskeeps, the "calm" is poisoning things and resulting in a lot of atrophied enthusiasm. ;) | 17:23 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Nokia won't do anything about the relationship between you and your carrier. | 17:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, is a "symlock" like a "symlink" but hardcoded into the bootloader? :P | 17:23 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: let me rephrase. will nokia allow branded n900 sellers to permanently deny you access to open mode even after you've gotten the carrier to sim-unlock the phone and you've completed your contract and paid back the subsidy? | 17:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, that's the part I find unfortunate. | 17:24 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Yeah, something like that ;) | 17:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, my bet is "yes". | 17:24 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: right, mine too, but I don't think I had communicated my question to X-Fade that clearly before | 17:24 |
| * GeneralAntilles doubts laws around this stuff have any clauses addressing software Freedom. ;) | 17:25 | |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Sellers can't deny you that. | 17:25 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: how not? | 17:25 |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Once simlock is gone, the device is just like any other open one. | 17:25 |
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| X-Fade | Hydroxide: So really if they let you unlock it, there is no difference. | 17:25 |
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| Hydroxide | X-Fade: so if simlock is gone you are able to switch into open mode and put on unbranded firmware and unsigned kernels (without DRM ability)? | 17:25 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: And Nokia is certainly not coming between the carrier and you to negotiate different tems ;) | 17:26 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: even if you get your phone from a carrier? | 17:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_security#Can_network_operators_restrict_you_switching_to_Open_mode.3F | 17:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think that answers the question. | 17:26 |
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| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: almost | 17:26 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Check the harmattan security framework presentation. With the bootloader diagram. | 17:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sort of side-steps it. | 17:26 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: it doesn't answer the question of what you can do with a device that used to be SIM-locked but is no longer SIM-locked | 17:27 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: If no simlock -> do whatever you like. | 17:27 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: ok, that DOES answer my question | 17:27 |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: As said. Remove simlock == Clean device without simlock. | 17:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, somehow I doubt it'll be that easy. | 17:28 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Simlocks are generally stored somewhere not in firmware ;) | 17:28 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: ok. some mobile phones have other restrictive locks in addition to the sim lock, which is why it took this long to understand what you were saying :) | 17:28 |
| ml-maemo | lolmilestone | 17:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | I doubt disabling simlock will also simultaneously disable bootloader kernel checks. | 17:29 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: No, it doesn't. | 17:29 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Check the diagram. | 17:29 |
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| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: If kernel is not signed, check if simlock is there. If not, continue in open mode. | 17:29 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: what's relevant really is whether disabling simlock will also simultaneously disable restrictions on the ABILITY to disable bootloader kernel checks | 17:30 |
| X-Fade | That will disable all your drm though. | 17:30 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, I doubt it. | 17:30 |
| X-Fade | Bootloader checks will probably never be disabled. | 17:31 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: X-Fade is saying that the answer is that you can use open mode even on a carrier-branded device if the simlock has been removed | 17:31 |
| X-Fade | As you need a secure path from the top. | 17:31 |
| Stskeeps | there's probably already bootloader checks (before kernel) on n900 | 17:31 |
| * GeneralAntilles can't wait for carrier-locked devices with locked signed kernels and locked signed firmwares whose operators are 3 versions behind from the latest. | 17:31 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Support's going to be a blast. | 17:31 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: if s/he's right I am pleasantly surprised | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, s/s\/he's/they're/g | 17:32 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: no, I was referring to X-Fade | 17:32 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: unless X-Fade is multiple people :) | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, http://maemo.org/profile/view/xfade/ | 17:33 |
| sheepbat | singular they? | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, are you a native English speaker? | 17:33 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: yes | 17:33 |
| X-Fade | This is what has been communicated at the summit and Fosdem too. | 17:33 |
| Hydroxide | I'm aware of singular they | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, so just a stickler on ugly PC pronouns. | 17:33 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: no | 17:33 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: it just seemed less clear in this case. I use singular they a lot | 17:33 |
| tybollt | does iphone and googlers phone come w/ such custom firmwares? | 17:34 |
| Hydroxide | GeneralAntilles: and I didn't want to assume that X-Fade was make | 17:34 |
| Hydroxide | *male | 17:34 |
| Hydroxide | but now that I've seen the profile, I will assume that about him :) | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | tybollt, iPhone doesn't belong in any such discussion. ;) | 17:34 |
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| * Hydroxide has no objection to singular they in general | 17:34 | |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: You sometimes can meet me in public ;) | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, Nokian's love to dance around using singular they and it irritates me to no end. ;) | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hydroxide, so I'm touchy about it. ;) | 17:35 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: the next FOSS event I'll be going to is DebConf10 in NYC in August. (I'm one of the organizers) | 17:35 |
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| Hydroxide | X-Fade: care to join us? :) | 17:35 |
| * Hydroxide nods at GeneralAntilles | 17:35 | |
| X-Fade | Hydroxide: Not sure if deb is still a hot topic for us ;) | 17:35 |
| Hydroxide | X-Fade: hahaha :) | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, at least, we can hope Nokia makes it not one. | 17:36 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: i would probably get showered with tomatoes if i tried to present MeeGo | 17:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, when life gives you tomatoes, you make pasta sauce. :P | 17:36 |
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| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: but they'd be DFSG-free tomatoes! you can modify then and reproduce them until you have enough to make ketchup! | 17:36 |
| Hydroxide | (or pasta sauce) | 17:37 |
| * thresh hopes nokia'll use jbj's rpm5. | 17:37 | |
| * tybollt prepares the ketchup canon and aims at stskeeps | 17:37 | |
| tybollt | I'm on to ya! | 17:37 |
| tybollt | ;) | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: please make sure the BoF room isn't above body temperature next time | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:37 |
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| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: we will be in the US - we pay more attention to temperature control than Extremadura :) | 17:37 |
| * GeneralAntilles hums the Ketchup Advisory Board tune in his head. | 17:37 | |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: we'll be hosted by Columbia University, fwiw | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | think i'm not going this time around :P | 17:38 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: ah well | 17:38 |
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| * Hydroxide still hopes to see some M*o people there beyond the DD crowd who's still involved in that stuff via companies like Collabora, ARM, Intel, and others | 17:38 | |
| sheepbat | catchup, GeneralAntilles | 17:39 |
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| * Myrtti tries to read the backlog | 17:40 | |
| * Stskeeps just hopes people are sane enough to see beyond packaging format and towards the abilities of the platform and tools instead | 17:40 | |
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| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: I'm definitely not giving up on MeeGo before enough information, code and/or devices are public to make an informed decision myself. and I do hope for the best. I can't carry on this conversation too much more in #maemo before people redirect me to #meego or /msg though :) | 17:42 |
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| Hydroxide | and I say that even as a DD, and even despite some disappointment about specific decisions and processes. | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | Hydroxide: i'm not worried as from my position and knowledge about it and i still have quite an activistic agenda regarding maemo/meego :P | 17:43 |
| achipa | Stskeeps: part of the problem is that the packaging format is announced/perceived as the action, and not as the consequence of platform/tools | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | achipa: yeah, i know | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | it was tried to be communicated a sane reasoning but it drowned | 17:44 |
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| achipa | this sanity thing always gets in the way... will have to do something about it | 17:45 |
| Stskeeps | i think the execution of the platform will be the proof point instead | 17:45 |
| * RST38h moos at Myrtti | 17:45 | |
| Stskeeps | and for the remaining issues, a good discussion that can lead to something will be good :P | 17:46 |
| X-Fade | It will be interesting for sure :) | 17:46 |
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| * RST38h yawns and notes that as far as he is concerned, switching from .deb to .rpm is like changing your diet from gray dried rats to brown dried rats | 17:46 | |
| Myrtti | mooo | 17:46 |
| Hydroxide | Stskeeps: nokia could also have done a better public job of explicitly addressing each of the advantages they were abandoning with this switch and saying why they were willing to give each of them up. they did address the issue of having to make compromises and the advantages of collaborating with intel, but they didn't address all the criticisms. again, this is a communication and community management comment, not any comment on the technical ... | 17:46 |
| achipa | yes, just hoping the day-one drop contains enough meat to actually be meaningful | 17:46 |
| Hydroxide | ... decision itself | 17:46 |
| GAN900 | RST38h, gray rats are clearly more flavorful and tender. | 17:47 |
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| RST38h | But do keep in mind, for example, that upgrading Python on Centos kill YUM dead. So, I would not be so optimistic about those mighty RedHat "tools" | 17:47 |
| X-Fade | achipa: Even after the code drop, there will be a lot to discuss. But at least there will be a base. | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: will be zypp, not yum | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:47 |
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| Stskeeps | (not python) | 17:47 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: I am sure it will be similarly made of shit and vapors | 17:47 |
| achipa | X-Fade: yeah, without it, it's 'my package format is bigger than yours' | 17:48 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Looks like a C app anyway. | 17:48 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: (not that etch is made of pure gold of course :)) | 17:48 |
| ShadowJK | achipa, even a size zero codedrop would be useful, since it marks the starting point of development in the open | 17:48 |
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| ebzzry | Hi! Is extras-testing relatively "safe" for daily use? | 17:48 |
| lcuk | RST38h, shortcut: the grass is always greener. | 17:48 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Yep. | 17:49 |
| lcuk | there will be problems in whichever method | 17:49 |
| lcuk | im just glad everyone is busy and working together to new problems | 17:49 |
| achipa | ShadowJK: git init | 17:49 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: They should have just used FreeBSD tools :) | 17:49 |
| achipa | ShadowJK: there :) | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, by the way, the FBReader rotation is in the opposite direction of the button graphic. | 17:49 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Which, strangely, DO work, and have worked for years | 17:49 |
| ShadowJK | ebzzry, well probably if you ask such a question, then the answer is probably not | 17:49 |
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| Myrtti | ebzzry: er, it's _testing_ so draw your own conclusions | 17:50 |
| RST38h | General: Well, the graphic is not mine, I am using the stock icon. But I can always rotate it the other way, if it is such a problem :) | 17:50 |
| ebzzry | Shadikka: OK | 17:50 |
| ebzzry | Myrtti: OK | 17:50 |
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| * Hydroxide decides not to help prolong this conversation since it seems to be going back into the now-moot substance details instead of the communication issues | 17:50 | |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, counter-clockwise is more useful than clockwise considering the device's button arrangement. | 17:51 |
| ebzzry | DAE here use Extra-Testing on a daily basis? | 17:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, but not having to ship your own icon is also a plus. | 17:51 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: I use testing every day and haven't had too much problems. | 17:52 |
| ebzzry | X-Fade: OK | 17:52 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: But it depends on what your knowledge in the platform is. | 17:53 |
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| ebzzry | The reason why I'm asking this is that I've been Debian Testing for quite some time now, and I haven't experienced show-stopping issues. Yes, I mentioned Debian, just for comparison purposes. | 17:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, the two aren't really comparable. | 17:53 |
| ebzzry | GeneralAntilles: Faster response than I expected | 17:53 |
| ebzzry | X-Fade: My primary concern is the likelihood of bricking my device. | 17:54 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: Well that hasn't happened to me. | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, well, Extras-testing is a one-step promotion process from Extras-devel. | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, so the only thing protecting you are the maintainers themselves. | 17:54 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: But keep backups handy anyway. | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, so it's not inconceivable that something bad could happen. | 17:54 |
| ebzzry | X-Fade: Hmm, OK. | 17:54 |
| ebzzry | GeneralAntilles: OK | 17:55 |
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| ebzzry | It's a matter of trust, too, then. | 17:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, it's unlikely, and I, personally, haven't had any issues. | 17:55 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, but if you're not really completely comfortable with things then I'd recommend ONLY grabbing packages that you need then disabling the repo. | 17:55 |
| ebzzry | GeneralAntilles: That's good. So if I decide to use Extras-Testing, is it wise to disable Extras? | 17:55 |
| Andrewfblack | what do you guys think of the first wallpaper for the star trek theme I'm working on http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2240466/Maemo/Screenshots/Wallpapper1.png | 17:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, no need. | 17:55 |
| ebzzry | GeneralAntilles: OK | 17:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, Testing will always supercede Extras-proper. | 17:56 |
| * RST38h transdickifies a spammer | 17:56 | |
| ebzzry | GeneralAntilles: Hmm, OK) | 17:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ebzzry, in other words, Extras is just a subset of Testing. | 17:56 |
| RST38h | Andrew: Will the boot picture show Quim as Borg? | 17:56 |
| ebzzry | What are your reasons for using Extras-Testing? | 17:56 |
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| ebzzry | I'm curious. | 17:57 |
| lcuk | Andrewfblack, complex! | 17:57 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: QA testing apps? | 17:57 |
| ebzzry | X-Fade: I got lost there a bit, what do you mean by that? | 17:57 |
| sheepbat | quality assurance | 17:58 |
| sheepbat | it allows people to test apps for stability and completeness | 17:58 |
| Andrewfblack | lcuk: good complex? | 17:58 |
| lcuk | Andrewfblack, tho this has mileage http://liqbase.net/star_wreck_keisari_ga.jpg | 17:58 |
| ebzzry | Hmm | 17:58 |
| ebzzry | How about for others? | 17:58 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing | 17:58 |
| lcuk | Andrewfblack, i dont like backgrounds that loow me to mix up widgets | 17:58 |
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| lcuk | too much background detail loses the foreground | 17:58 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: There is some documentation on that. Will probably answer all your questions. | 17:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, sadly I'm not particularly light-hearted about that image. | 17:58 |
| X-Fade | ebzzry: If not... it is a wiki :) | 17:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | It wasn't exactly intended in a spirit of humor and goodwill. :) | 17:59 |
| lcuk | why not GeneralAntilles - you are captian of a starship | 17:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Much like mullf's ever-so-mature troll photoshop. | 17:59 |
| ebzzry | Thanks, I've read that. Hmm. | 17:59 |
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| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, seems more a paint job than PS :D | 18:01 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, i cant even remember why i pasted it now | 18:01 |
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| lcuk | i think it was related to http://penguinbait.com/superhero.jpg | 18:02 |
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| VDVsx | why Jaffa isn't there^ :D | 18:03 |
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| * ShadowJK posts a few "mugen lies" posts in mugen's youtube video | 18:04 | |
| ShadowJK | I wonder if I'll get censored :D | 18:04 |
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| ShadowJK | though seriously... users suck | 18:05 |
| ShadowJK | expecting more capacity in the same volume | 18:05 |
| sheepbat | the battery doesn't work? | 18:07 |
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| ShadowJK | Ah no, people were posting "come on make a 1800mAh battery that fits in same door" | 18:07 |
| ShadowJK | and I said that anyone who claims to have made such a thing are liars, including mugen ;P | 18:07 |
| sheepbat | oh, hehe | 18:08 |
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| ShadowJK | They have a battery for N800/N810 that is physically just slightly smaller than the original, and is claimed to be 1800mAh (original is 1500mAh)... I ordered one | 18:08 |
| ShadowJK | tested out as 1200mAh :) | 18:08 |
| sheepbat | hah | 18:08 |
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| ShadowJK | Heck, the battery itself told my N800 that it's 1200mAh | 18:08 |
| SpeedEvil | how tested? | 18:09 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 18:09 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, second by second current measurement from full to empty, integrate | 18:09 |
| SpeedEvil | The best way to measure it is to weigh it full and empty, and compare weights. | 18:09 |
| ShadowJK | I didn't think the difference would be measurable.. | 18:09 |
| noobmonk3y | AGHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH | 18:10 |
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| ShadowJK | Selling replacement batteries with overstated capacity worked back when people bought batteries because they didn't get enough talk/standby time anymore | 18:11 |
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| ShadowJK | because then their phone was a year or two old, and a 1500mAh battery would have degraded to less than 1200mAh by then, and the increased internal resistance makes the battery meter behaviour "worse" | 18:12 |
| ShadowJK | so popping in a fresh 1200mAh battery in place of an aged battery would still be a big improvement | 18:13 |
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| noobmonk3y | lol my battery has never gone above 94% :D - hehe | 18:13 |
| ShadowJK | Overstating capacity doesn't work so well today when new dumbphones cost 20-30 bucks... people mostly buy batteries to try extend their new shiny powerhungry smartphones' batterylife | 18:13 |
| noobmonk3y | (and yes i know its based on loadsa factors) | 18:13 |
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| ShadowJK | The meter and charger don't cooperate very well I think ;) | 18:14 |
| thresh | how's ipv6 on n900? | 18:14 |
| ShadowJK | thresh, out of the box? nonexistant | 18:14 |
| thresh | :-( | 18:14 |
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| lupine_85 | thresh, it's ok | 18:16 |
| lupine_85 | there's a kernel package you can install that comes with ipv6 | 18:16 |
| lupine_85 | and the the userland has it compiled in | 18:17 |
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| *** nidO has joined #maemo | 18:17 | |
| * lupine_85 has permanent global unicast ipv6 via miredo | 18:17 | |
| *** slonopotamus has joined #maemo | 18:18 | |
| * noobmonk3y feels better after a bit of troll hunting.......... | 18:18 | |
| thresh | ah nice. | 18:18 |
| thresh | and i know someone who i can poke about miredo :-) | 18:18 |
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| slonopotamus | -.- | 18:18 |
| * VDVsx trolls noobmonk3y :P | 18:18 | |
| * noobmonk3y giggles like an ickle troll........ | 18:18 | |
| *** tg has joined #maemo | 18:18 | |
| noobmonk3y | theres something satisfying at the moment when i hear things like "Why are there not any games, or why havn't we got this app, game etc...." - it makes me go warm and fuzzy..... | 18:19 |
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| lupine_85 | :p | 18:20 |
| lupine_85 | thresh, my idea for what to do next was mobile IPv6 | 18:20 |
| lupine_85 | but I'm a bit stuck at the HA end | 18:20 |
| VDVsx | noobmonk3y, what about fart apps, no fart app so far, I'm a bit disappointed with that :D | 18:22 |
| thresh | lupine_85: well, i only care for wireless. | 18:22 |
| mece | How does a fart app work exactly? | 18:22 |
| noobmonk3y | Oh pants... sorry forgot about my next app "Pull my Finger" - will start development once healthcheck is a bit more tarted up :D | 18:22 |
| noobmonk3y | Pull my finger will be a vertical hand with a finger, drag it out... and depending on the speed it will releive itself........ :D | 18:22 |
| VDVsx | mece, press a button and a fart sound is emitted, (I think) | 18:23 |
| noobmonk3y | (or horizontal depending how you look at it) | 18:23 |
| noobmonk3y | VDVsx: expert on the old fart apps hey? you should become a Troll :D :D | 18:23 |
| VDVsx | lol | 18:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, any fart app must include samples from prominent Maemo Community members. | 18:23 |
| VDVsx | lolololol | 18:24 |
| noobmonk3y | GeneralAntilles: you scare me......... | 18:24 |
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| noobmonk3y | i never ever want to hear the right revrand Kathy trumping | 18:24 |
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| * noobmonk3y thinks that sentence should be framed and placed above the tmo mantlepiece | 18:24 | |
| VDVsx | please stop, ahah | 18:24 |
| * slonopotamus quickly open fart ringtones shop | 18:24 | |
| noobmonk3y | lol | 18:24 |
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| noobmonk3y | timmmmmmme for some fresh air , brb | 18:25 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, you should stand again | 18:25 |
| * noobmonk3y coughs | 18:25 | |
| lcuk | noobmonk3y, revdkathy is so petite if she did ever trump she would probably enter orbit | 18:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then we can cut you off at the knees! | 18:25 |
| noobmonk3y | VDVsx: Standing and styping can cause back problems, see a pysio first :D | 18:25 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, you're very active currently | 18:25 |
| noobmonk3y | lol lcuk !!!!! | 18:25 |
| noobmonk3y | physio* | 18:25 |
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| VDVsx | zaheerm, don't have time in the next month :(, otherwise probably will run again, but we already have a very good lineup | 18:26 |
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| zaheerm | VDVsx, will you consider standing next election, assuming there is another council? | 18:28 |
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| VDVsx | zaheerm, that probably will be the meego council :D, a lot can change till then | 18:29 |
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| VDVsx | noobmonk3y, ok got a solution ;D, open that in your n900 (it's flash): http://www.ebaumsworld.com/flash/play/658/ | 18:31 |
| * noobmonk3y finds his n900 | 18:31 | |
| noobmonk3y | ahhhh charging, where else would it be ;) | 18:31 |
| *** tbf has joined #maemo | 18:31 | |
| VDVsx | sorry for the less appropriated content in the pubs :D | 18:31 |
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| Arif_ | ohai thur | 18:32 |
| * noobmonk3y is loading the fart machine :D | 18:32 | |
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| noobmonk3y | hey Arif_ | 18:33 |
| Arif_ | sup =) | 18:33 |
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| noobmonk3y | Arif_: ctachup of the last 10 minutes = <lcuk> noobmonk3y, revdkathy is so petite if she did ever trump she would probably enter orbit | 18:33 |
| Arif_ | XD | 18:33 |
| noobmonk3y | done, all caught up :D hehehe | 18:33 |
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| Arif_ | great! | 18:34 |
| noobmonk3y | lol VDVsx - superb :D | 18:34 |
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| Arif_ | I can't dangle my phone around my neck anymore | 18:35 |
| Arif_ | :( | 18:35 |
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| noobmonk3y | lol you could, but with the size and weight you might be crawling ;) | 18:35 |
| * lcuk had n900 on lanyard for ages | 18:36 | |
| lcuk | ive even got a pendant app lol | 18:36 |
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| Arif_ | I lost the rope thingy :D | 18:36 |
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| Arif_ | soon I'll lose the phone itself probably | 18:36 |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.pendant.20091225_001.jpg | 18:36 |
| Arif_ | :( | 18:36 |
| noobmonk3y | lcuk: you scare me too | 18:37 |
| * noobmonk3y is slowly getting scared of everyone.... starting with VDVsx .... *shudders* | 18:37 | |
| VDVsx | noobmonk3y, no need I'm far from you, but lcuk .... | 18:38 |
| * Arif_ sends noobmonk3y some new firmware | 18:38 | |
| * noobmonk3y blinks... firmware whats that? | 18:38 | |
| * noobmonk3y throws firmware at Arif_ | 18:39 | |
| * Arif_ installs it | 18:39 | |
| * noobmonk3y thinks firmware and faeces aren't that far apart...... | 18:39 | |
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| joppu | so many bugs tagged "fixed in pr1.2" | 18:40 |
| joppu | release should be relatively soon | 18:41 |
| Arif_ | now they can work on actually adding features! | 18:41 |
| Arif_ | :P | 18:41 |
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| * lcuk slaps Arif_ | 18:41 | |
| * Arif_ throws bugs at lcuk | 18:42 | |
| * noobmonk3y eats the bugs and decides it's time to go home | 18:42 | |
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| slonopotamus | woops | 18:50 |
| slonopotamus | i accidentally clicked smth | 18:50 |
| Arif_ | and it exploded? | 18:50 |
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| slonopotamus | Arif_: and xchat closed | 18:51 |
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| Arif_ | awww | 18:51 |
| * Arif_ uses mIRC | 18:51 | |
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| pupnik | how do i filtedr out the GOD DAMN wd.share.this.com redirection? | 18:52 |
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| pupnik | ahah just disable f*** javascript | 18:54 |
| gouverneur | what is this 3.2010.02-8 needing the softwareupdate from PC connected? | 18:55 |
| zogg__ | what for? | 18:55 |
| Arif_ | aww | 18:55 |
| toggles_w | quit | 18:55 |
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| zogg__ | would be opera on maemo? =) | 18:55 |
| Arif_ | ovi store hasn't added anything yet | 18:55 |
| pupnik | who wants to get together and beat-up the people who developed javascript? | 18:55 |
| pupnik | i need a field trip | 18:56 |
| zogg__ | ovi should add as much as they can and not free till they switch to meego =( | 18:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | gouverneur, means you have conflicting packages installed. | 18:56 |
| inz | pupnik, if I supported violence, I would gladly support your cause. | 18:56 |
| Arif_ | pupnik, me me! | 18:57 |
| Arif_ | then lets go over to ovi management to beat them up | 18:57 |
| pupnik | me too >:( | 18:57 |
| * Arif_ has no problem beating people up :D | 18:58 | |
| zogg__ | -NickServ- You may not ghost ZogG. | 18:58 |
| zogg__ | haha | 18:58 |
| zogg__ | wtf? | 18:58 |
| Arif_ | lol | 18:58 |
| Arif_ | I forgot my password for my _ less nick | 18:58 |
| Arif_ | maybe its not even mine! | 18:58 |
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| zogg__ | -NickServ- ZogG has been ghosted. | 18:59 |
| zogg__ | -NickServ- ZogG is not online. | 18:59 |
| zogg__ | * ZogG :Nickname is already in use. | 18:59 |
| zogg__ | are they kidding me? | 18:59 |
| * Arif_ smirks | 19:00 | |
| Arif_ | they're playing with you :( | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | a reconnect | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | you can do a hold ghosting too i think | 19:00 |
| *** zogg__ is now known as ZogG | 19:00 | |
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| ZogG | \o/ | 19:00 |
| Arif_ | \o/ | 19:00 |
| ZogG | the force is on my side | 19:01 |
| furunk3l | |o_ | 19:01 |
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| Arif_ | what force :P | 19:01 |
| ZogG | anyway so we sucked up with n900 ah? | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | sucked up? :P | 19:01 |
| Arif_ | I got bored of mine already | 19:01 |
| Arif_ | :D | 19:01 |
| ZogG | sure dark side force | 19:01 |
| lupine_85 | I'm still <3ing mine | 19:01 |
| ZogG | anyway you don't get anything in being good | 19:01 |
| lupine_85 | I did a presentation on it yesterday | 19:01 |
| ZogG | nowdays it's hard to get | 19:01 |
| lupine_85 | literally, everything on it | 19:01 |
| ZogG | "thank you" | 19:02 |
| lupine_85 | plugged straight into the projector and everything | 19:02 |
| ZogG | yeah it's cool | 19:02 |
| ZogG | but it's not fully functioning | 19:02 |
| ZogG | like front cam and so on | 19:02 |
| ZogG | and i don't think nokia will spent money on it's development anymore =( | 19:03 |
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| Stskeeps | erm.. | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:03 |
| ZogG | is maemo totally open? | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | no, never was | 19:03 |
| lupine_85 | I guess they don't not develop features I'm not interested in | 19:03 |
| lupine_85 | if you know what I mean | 19:03 |
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| Stskeeps | ZogG: there's plenty of money getting spent in meego, maemo.org, and the PR releases for fremantle | 19:03 |
| ZogG | i'm just curious how hard is it to get specifications or all drivers of n900 to make your own os | 19:04 |
| Stskeeps | depends, are you ideological or practical? | 19:04 |
| ZogG | Stskeeps, for now | 19:04 |
| Stskeeps | (those two often conflict) | 19:04 |
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| Stskeeps | if you're practical, it's entirely possible to run your own os | 19:04 |
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| Stskeeps | i mean, check http://blip.tv/file/3209258 | 19:05 |
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| ZogG | Stskeeps, i'm not that good in these but thinking to port gentoo | 19:05 |
| Stskeeps | you can join the other guys :P | 19:05 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr and slonopotamus on n8x0 | 19:05 |
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| ZogG | as you can use already existing kernel and all the stuff | 19:05 |
| Stskeeps | right | 19:05 |
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| ZogG | source based linux developing is much easier imho | 19:06 |
| gouverneur | GeneralAntilles: should find the conflicts with apt... I try | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | until you try to build qt natively, yes | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:06 |
| TomaszD | Stskeeps, wearing a hoodie at home? ;) | 19:06 |
| slonopotamus | ZogG: gentoo on n900 is rather pointless until you have open telephony. | 19:06 |
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| GAN900 | Sith Lord! | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: mandatory wear for maemo.org masters | 19:06 |
| arachnist | slonopotamus: ofono? | 19:07 |
| GAN900 | Or maybe apprentice | 19:07 |
| TomaszD | oh, ok | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | ;) | 19:07 |
| * GAN900 bets on Quim being the master. | 19:07 | |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: the heating was absolutely shot that day | 19:07 |
| TomaszD | Stskeeps, would ofono just work on mer? | 19:07 |
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| ZogG | slonopotamus why so? | 19:07 |
| lupine_85 | anything's possible | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: jebba had it working on fedora, but there's some small pieces we need to work on getting opened | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | small utilities | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | (which is entirely possible0 | 19:07 |
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| TomaszD | so it's possible to get a Merphone | 19:08 |
| slonopotamus | arachnist: does it include gui? | 19:08 |
| TomaszD | brb | 19:08 |
| slonopotamus | ZogG: don't you want to be able to make calls? :) | 19:09 |
| slonopotamus | ~ping | 19:09 |
| infobot | ~pong | 19:09 |
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| gouverneur | this is just for noobs isnt it, I had that maemo 5 package visible and it asked me to use the pc software, after an apt-get upgrade it disappeared... | 19:09 |
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| slonopotamus | ZogG: you can get armv7 stage, unpack, chroot into it and have gentoo there :) | 19:10 |
| ZogG | slonopotamus and you can build all stuff to make calls as it's done in maemo | 19:10 |
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| ZogG | as e.g. i use nvidia official drivers and they are closed | 19:11 |
| ZogG | anyway i have to run to uni | 19:11 |
| slonopotamus | ZogG: only open stuff | 19:11 |
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| slonopotamus | ZogG: nvidia drivers do not link to loads of closed libs | 19:12 |
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| pupnik | i need flash / js disabled, but easily individually enable per-onject | 19:12 |
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| slonopotamus | pupnik: flashblock + smth unknown | 19:13 |
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| pupnik | not working for microb here | 19:14 |
| slonopotamus | hmm... i saw flashblock in extras | 19:14 |
| DrGrov | Good evening | 19:15 |
| * ShadowJK uses the adblock-css thing, comes with flashblock | 19:15 | |
| DrGrov | i found out that the Eevil"something" named theme was making my N900 reboot automatically when I installed it... that's a bit odd | 19:16 |
| slonopotamus | DrGrov: don't install it then :/ | 19:17 |
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| DrGrov | slonopotamus: but it doesn't do that anymore :) | 19:19 |
| DrGrov | slonopotamus: it might have been since it said that it would require a reboot... | 19:19 |
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| slonopotamus | DrGrov: you could try to uninstall and install it again. maybe it'll reboot again then. | 19:20 |
| slonopotamus | actually there are easier ways to perform a reboot :/ | 19:21 |
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| DrGrov | slonopotamus: i don't really care if it reboots since i didn't have anything running. | 19:21 |
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| slonopotamus | DrGrov: i'm totally lost... what's your question then? | 19:22 |
| DrGrov | slonopotamus: i was just a bit scared of loosing contact information or settings but nothing lost. or can anything be lost when it does a forced reboot? or perhaps i rebooted manually without seeing the button? anyone else had this problem with that theme? | 19:22 |
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| slonopotamus | DrGrov: reboot is unlikely to trigger data loss. pulling out battery is more dangerous :) | 19:25 |
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| andrei1089 | Hi, is there any dbus signal emitted when the phone is rebooted? | 19:35 |
| mgedmin | before or after? | 19:36 |
| corecode | i gues before :) | 19:38 |
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| corecode | i still need to import my sms | 19:38 |
| corecode | from my e51 | 19:38 |
| andrei1089 | mgedmin, I want my desktop widget to save some data before the reboot | 19:38 |
| andrei1089 | the unrealize event isn't called for the widget is the phone is rebooted | 19:39 |
| andrei1089 | any ideas? | 19:39 |
| mgedmin | andrei1089, check with dbus-monitor | 19:39 |
| corecode | andrei1089: no idea about the sdk (yet), but you could catch sigterm | 19:40 |
| corecode | andrei1089: and store info on sigterm | 19:40 |
| corecode | usually there should first be a sigterm, and then later a sigkill | 19:40 |
| arachnist | andrei1089: dunno about dbus signals, but i'm sure there are upstart signals emitted | 19:41 |
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| arachnist | andrei1089: i'd try leaving "initctl events > /somewhere" and reboot the device | 19:41 |
| arachnist | (using the UI) | 19:42 |
| * corecode eyes arachnist | 19:42 | |
| andrei1089 | corecode, all the widgets are running in the same process, I'm afraid some other problems may appear if I change some signals | 19:42 |
| arachnist | corecode: yes, i'm here | 19:42 |
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| corecode | arachnist: no webos? | 19:42 |
| arachnist | corecode: and i do have the n900, ever since it was available | 19:42 |
| arachnist | corecode: nope | 19:42 |
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| corecode | :) | 19:42 |
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| corecode | new webos update seemed to have helped with interactivity | 19:42 |
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| arachnist | i'm not a fan of Palm hardware | 19:43 |
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| corecode | andrei1089: yea, that's nasty. | 19:43 |
| corecode | really, all widgets run in one process? | 19:43 |
| corecode | interesting. | 19:43 |
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| andrei1089 | corecode, yes hildon-home | 19:43 |
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| mgedmin | does C have something like Python's atexit? | 19:44 |
| corecode | sure does | 19:44 |
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| corecode | but a sigterm usually is deadly and won't run atexit hooks | 19:44 |
| andrei1089 | mgedmin, my widget is written in python | 19:44 |
| mgedmin | didn't Python actually copy the design from the C function? | 19:44 |
| lizardo | mgedmin: it is called "atexit" :) | 19:44 |
| mgedmin | andrei1089, sigterm isn't deadly, sigkill is | 19:44 |
| corecode | sigterm is deadly if uncaught | 19:45 |
| mgedmin | you mean by default sigterm will not call functions registered with atexit? | 19:45 |
| corecode | if you don't ignore sigterm or have a signal handler, the process will die | 19:46 |
| mgedmin | duh :( | 19:46 |
| corecode | and not execute atexit hooks | 19:46 |
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| corecode | you'd have to catch sigterm and then call _exit(), but that doesn't run atexit, but you're not allowed to call exit(3) from a signal handler | 19:47 |
| corecode | all a mess | 19:47 |
| mgedmin | and hildon desktop widget api doesn't have any kind of termination callback? | 19:47 |
| mgedmin | what sort of data do you want to save? | 19:48 |
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| andrei1089 | if you close a widget the unrealize event is called | 19:49 |
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| andrei1089 | I'm developing the pedometerwidget, now the current steps are lost if the phone is rebooted | 19:50 |
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| andrei1089 | mgedmin, ^ | 19:51 |
| mgedmin | whoa | 19:51 |
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| mgedmin | use sqlite, like firefox! fsync() on every step! overwhelm the flash write cycle limit in weeks! | 19:52 |
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| MiXu- | :D | 19:52 |
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| mgedmin | dunno, a periodic write of data, say every 60 seconds (if the data has changed), shouldn't consume too much battery power, should it? | 19:52 |
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| mgedmin | you're probably waking up more often than that to poll the accelerometer, no? | 19:53 |
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| andrei1089 | yeah..I thought of this too. I'll probably do it this way.. but i'll try to see if atexit works | 19:55 |
| andrei1089 | mgedmin, thanks | 19:55 |
| mgedmin | andrei1089, consider also things like crashes and running out of battery power -- I doubt hildon-desktop gets shut down cleanly in those cases | 19:55 |
| mgedmin | and crashes happen, especially when you install a bunch of random 3rd-party widgets | 19:55 |
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| mgedmin | it would suck to lose a day's worth of data if some other widget crashed the desktop process | 19:56 |
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| andrei1089 | mgedmin, then it would be safer to save the data every minute or so.. | 19:57 |
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| corecode | or every 50 steps | 19:57 |
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| corecode | or so | 19:57 |
| corecode | every 1000 steps | 19:58 |
| andrei1089 | yeah.. | 19:58 |
| andrei1089 | :) | 19:58 |
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| TomaszD | http://ie.microsoft.com/testdrive/Default.html | 19:59 |
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| TomaszD | Stskeeps, interesting read (mer included) http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2010/03/04/mobile.html | 20:10 |
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| Stskeeps | 'how to kill a project'? :P | 20:11 |
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| TomaszD | ;) | 20:12 |
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| DrGrov | slonopotamus_: ok, that is great news then. thank you for the information :) i was just a bit scared about losing contacts, settings and messages. | 20:13 |
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| Stskeeps | TomaszD: good article | 20:14 |
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| DrGrov | slonopotamus: i recommend you to install that theme. it is stunning, it is a greyish theme with a beautiful yet elegant style. | 20:14 |
| TomaszD | Stskeeps, indeed it is | 20:14 |
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| jebba | this would be rad to have on n900 http://www.google.com/mobile/goggles | 20:16 |
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| Stskeeps | jebba: did you need ssc daemon on fedora too for ofono? | 20:16 |
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| DrGrov | the best thing to shut down the phone is to make sure that nothing is running in the background? | 20:17 |
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| Stskeeps | TomaszD: that i do believe meego is the way to go is another thing.. even though things look murky atm | 20:17 |
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| jebba | Stskeeps: i could build ofono for fedora and run it. I could turn on the device and poll it's state and such. I couldnt make a call ever though. | 20:20 |
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| Stskeeps | jebba: ok, ta | 20:20 |
| jebba | i wasn't running anything non-free to use ofono there | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 20:20 |
| jebba | SMS doesn't work yet (neither under fedora nor maemo) | 20:21 |
| Stskeeps | could you file a bug for phonet-utils pretty please? | 20:21 |
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| TomaszD | Stskeeps, btw, I've heard you had a broken freerunner laying around? | 20:21 |
| Stskeeps | think it is a slam dunk case for openening | 20:21 |
| jebba | a "please open up phonet-utils" bug? | 20:21 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: yes, broken usb connector | 20:21 |
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| Stskeeps | jebba: yes | 20:21 |
| TomaszD | ah, well, if you don't need the phone anymore, you know my address :P | 20:22 |
| jebba | ok, what about battery? Is there one open there? Where's the authoritative list right now, if you have it handy? | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | battey is in progress.. #9314 i think | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | search for bme | 20:22 |
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| Stskeeps | google for licensing change requests | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: if you think you can fix it you can have it | 20:23 |
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| gouverneur | bug 9314 | 20:23 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9314 relicense BME | 20:23 |
| Lumpio- | BME? o_O | 20:25 |
| Lumpio- | oh | 20:25 |
| gouverneur | Stskeeps: I would take any n900 in any condition for free | 20:25 |
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| ptl | I just used Zephyr HxM | 20:25 |
| ptl | it's nice | 20:25 |
| ptl | used it with eCoach | 20:26 |
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| ptl | have any of you seen smoku around? I'd like to thank him for PCSX | 20:27 |
| TomaszD | smoku doesn't hang around here | 20:27 |
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| ShadowJK | luke-jr, *sigh*, trickle charging a Li-Ion is insane. makes things go boom | 20:28 |
| luke-jr | ShadowJK: o rly? | 20:29 |
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| luke-jr | ShadowJK: maybe I'd better stay away from the charging algos :) | 20:29 |
| ShadowJK | "lithium-ion is unable to absorb overcharge. A continuous trickle charge above 4.05V/cell would causes plating of metallic lithium that could lead to instabilities and compromise safety. Instead, a brief topping charge is provided to compensate for the small self-discharge the battery and its protective circuit consume. Depending on the battery, a topping charge may be repeated once every 20 days. Typically, the charge kicks in when the open terminal volt | 20:29 |
| ShadowJK | age drops to 4.05V/cell and turns off at a high 4.20V/cell. | 20:29 |
| ShadowJK | " | 20:29 |
| TomaszD | gouverneur, we're talking about the freerunner, not the n900 :) | 20:29 |
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| ptl | ShadowJK: does that mean that I shouldn't be regularly recharging my n900 for hours? | 20:30 |
| ptl | Should I do a quick recharge then unplug? | 20:30 |
| ShadowJK | ptl, you're missing context | 20:30 |
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| ShadowJK | Nokia devices do not trickle-charge. Luke wanted to change bme so that they trickle charge. | 20:31 |
| * ptl doesn't know what is trickle-charge and will google for it now | 20:31 | |
| ShadowJK | ptl, trickle charge = keeping the battery constantly topped up | 20:31 |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, so basically Li-Ion has "easier" charging rules/algorithm than, say, Nickel Metalhydride (nimh), but Li-Ion is very intolerant of deviations from it | 20:33 |
| ptl | at the same level of self-discharging... just saw on wikipedia | 20:33 |
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| alturiak | heya. yesterday, I've been offered a choice wether I want my N900 to switch to 3G automatically or not. I can't find this option anywhere in the settings, would anyone be so kind as to give me a clue where to look for it or do I have to switch off my wifi-network to trigger the popup again? ;-) | 20:34 |
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| ShadowJK | luke-jr, overcharging causes plating of metallic lithium, and overdischarge causes copper shunts to form, which cause partial or total electric shorts. When you apply power across a short, it generates heat. There is a mechanical device connecting the battery to the battery terminals, that disconnects at a certain temperature. However, this doesn't work reliably when there's a localized short inside the battery that generates a very local thermal hotspot. | 20:37 |
| ShadowJK | It's like a spark that ignites it all, and Li-Ion goes into "thermal runaway" at pretty low temperatures.. | 20:37 |
| ShadowJK | alterego, Setup -> Phone, scroll down | 20:37 |
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| luke-jr | ShadowJK: I don't get what that has to do with trickle charging :p | 20:38 |
| ShadowJK | luke-jr, well you don't want metal inside the battery either ;-) | 20:39 |
| ShadowJK | But you said earlier you wanted to change battery low behaviour | 20:39 |
| ShadowJK | A batter goal would be to make bme handle old batteries better. As it is, when a battery is fully charged it assumes it has as much energy as the battery had as new. Then when it runs out (or comes to the battery low warning threshold), it comes as a total surprise to the meter (and the user).. | 20:41 |
| ShadowJK | better* | 20:41 |
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| ptl | what would be a good math package for the N900? Like an equation solver and plotter? | 20:44 |
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| DrGrov | Anyone know where to find news about Enlightenment 17 coming for Maemo? | 20:46 |
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| DrGrov | Would appreciate to find some information to see a timeline or something similar.. | 20:47 |
| gouverneur | TomaszD: ok keep it... could get some 4 free already... for a reason... | 20:49 |
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| ShadowJK | luke-jr, let's hope only lawyers read that bugzilla report ;) | 20:52 |
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| luke-jr | ShadowJK: don't see how it matters | 20:54 |
| luke-jr | ShadowJK: at least with code, I can avoid modifying the algorithms | 20:54 |
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| jebba | Stskeeps: ah you see sivan's recent message to -devel. Perhaps have him do the phonet-* ticket ;)( | 20:57 |
| Stskeeps | his is a bit higher up in layers though | 20:57 |
| FIQ | there's a category in the package manager named "Program" | 20:58 |
| FIQ | what excactly does that one contains? | 20:58 |
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| ShadowJK | do you have extras-testing or extras-devel active? | 20:58 |
| FIQ | isn't everything (except kernels, libs, etc) "programs" in repositories? | 20:59 |
| FIQ | yep | 20:59 |
| ShadowJK | I'd suspect your "Program" category goes away if you disabled extras-devel and extras-testing | 20:59 |
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| FIQ | well, it doesn't really annoy me, just wonder why. :P | 21:02 |
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| pupnik | i kind of like the NSA saving my words and clicks. it is a kind of immortality | 21:16 |
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| thopiekar | who of you said that under diablo the virtual package python-dev is available? | 21:19 |
| thopiekar | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/canola-twitter-plugin_0.0.1+git47f3f06101e738c53061549ea5e48ed3efff49c6~ppa0~lucid1/i386.root.log.FAILED.txt | 21:19 |
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| alturiak | ShadowJK: oh, thanks. (your completion misfired, so no highlight, hence the delay :) | 21:24 |
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| fkaostic | hello, how can i change the volume while using the webbrowser? | 21:29 |
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| kaie | will nokia keep n810 up to date by publishing a newer microb release for n810 ? | 21:29 |
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| kaie | for example, the release shipped with n900 backported to n810 ? | 21:30 |
| thresh | n810 is already not supported | 21:30 |
| lizardo | thopiekar: for diablo compatibility , you should use : Build-Depends: python-dev|python2.5-dev ... | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | kaie: not really likely, but mer^2 may bring something like it.. | 21:30 |
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| thopiekar | jep I should add that.. | 21:31 |
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| kaie | Stskeeps, what's mer^2 ? | 21:33 |
| * thopiekar added now canola-twitter | 21:33 | |
| Stskeeps | kaie: backport of fremantle to n8x0 | 21:33 |
| kaie | thresh, "already not supported", did nokia say that? | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/20100316_003.jpg , http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/20100316_002.jpg - fixable/not fixable with solder? | 21:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | mompls | 21:34 |
| SpeedEvil | Everything is fixable with solder. Sometimes you have to use a large bar to club the problems over the head though. | 21:35 |
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| SpeedEvil | And yes, looks easily fixable | 21:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: please join #openmoko :-) | 21:35 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, its smt would be easier with a jet solder unit | 21:35 |
| SpeedEvil | None of the pads have lifted off. | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: ok :P | 21:36 |
| SpeedEvil | hangon - that's not | 21:36 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 21:36 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, that's not a n900 | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:36 |
| SpeedEvil | That's no moon! | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: yes, but honestly I'd like to share this with other users on either #openmoko or #openmoko-cdevel | 21:37 |
| Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer: yes, of course | 21:37 |
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| kaie | maybe my thinking is unrealistic, but I'd have expected nokia to keep shipping updates of the primary software of an internet tablet (the browser) without requiring to wait for the community to backport newer OS releases | 21:39 |
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| MohammadAG | Hi | 21:40 |
| Wizzup | Does the n900 have a hard reset button? | 21:40 |
| kaie | a 2 year support period seems too short | 21:40 |
| Stskeeps | kaie: the amazing thing is that the thing still works :P | 21:40 |
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| lcuk | kaie, there are the first signs of community ssu happening :) | 21:40 |
| Stskeeps | oh | 21:40 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, community ssu is actually working | 21:40 |
| kaie | Stskeeps, why shouldn't it still work if I don't break it? | 21:41 |
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| Jaffa | Ev'ning, all | 21:42 |
| lcuk | kaie, open source, open community - as long as the trend to opening the code up continues you could theoretically still be getting updates in another 2 years | 21:42 |
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| Stskeeps | kaie: check out mwkn.net | 21:42 |
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| MohammadAG | Wizzup, no | 21:42 |
| lcuk | hi jaffa | 21:43 |
| Wizzup | It's stuck on 25 load | 21:43 |
| Wizzup | 20:41pm up 3:41, 0 users, load average: 27.40, 24.81, 17.27 | 21:43 |
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| kaie | Stskeeps, do you expect the nwkn project will build latest microb for installing on n810 ? | 21:44 |
| lcuk | which clients keep having to signin uncloaked, then change | 21:44 |
| lcuk | like crashanddie and i believe timelesses does it too | 21:44 |
| Stskeeps | kaie: it's a news site | 21:44 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:44 |
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| TomaszD | actually that's a damn good question, leaving out the nwkn bit | 21:46 |
| Stskeeps | TomaszD: it should technically be possible but probably needs alignment with UI. | 21:47 |
| TomaszD | that's what I was thinking | 21:48 |
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| Jaffa | kaie: Specifically http://www.mwkn.net/2010/11/front.html#front-1 is what Stskeeps was referring to, I think | 21:49 |
| * Noobmonk3y_ waves | 21:49 | |
| kaie | thanks, I now understand what nwkn.net and community ssu is about. making it actually possible to produce community builds that can overwrite the builtin software (e.g. microb). | 21:50 |
| timeless_mbp | hi kaie | 21:51 |
| kaie | still, someone would need to do the work to actually backport microb-n900 to n810 | 21:51 |
| cehteh | microb isnt open source or? | 21:51 |
| timeless_mbp | kaie: i think romaxa had a backport | 21:51 |
| timeless_mbp | cehteh: microb is sadly useless | 21:52 |
| timeless_mbp | because it's kinda like webkit | 21:52 |
| timeless_mbp | w/o a front end, you have nothing | 21:52 |
| Stskeeps | engine's oss | 21:52 |
| Stskeeps | ui not so much | 21:52 |
| timeless_mbp | the intention of the browser team was to open source the ui | 21:52 |
| timeless_mbp | however management made life incredibly painful | 21:52 |
| cehteh | the engine is gecko .. but no xul, but custom gtk frontend | 21:52 |
| timeless_mbp | in addition to the custom gtk frontend | 21:52 |
| cehteh | yeah | 21:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | there's a transport layer (neteal) which also was never opened | 21:53 |
| kaie | timeless_mbp, it would be good to have that backport published, but I may be misunderstanding. I'm worried you say, the backport won't be sufficient, because the matching UI will be missing | 21:53 |
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| * slonopotamus wonders how much n800 screen replace costs | 21:53 | |
| cehteh | prolly more than a used n800 on ebay | 21:53 |
| timeless_mbp | kaie: we had to evolve eal and browser-ui as we evolved microb to add stuff | 21:54 |
| timeless_mbp | which means an older browserui doesn't work | 21:54 |
| * slonopotamus doesn't veleive in local snail-mail, so ebay is a no-no | 21:54 | |
| slonopotamus | *b | 21:54 |
| kaie | timeless_mbp, I see, thanks. which probably means, a full OS upgrade (fremantle backport) is the only likely chance to benefit from most recent microb code | 21:54 |
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| timeless_mbp | well | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | it's fairly standalone | 21:55 |
| timeless_mbp | we use very little platform stuff | 21:55 |
| slonopotamus | kaie: i'd better add ui tweaks to chromium than messed with microb. | 21:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | and we have ifdefs so we can build on diablo | 21:55 |
| cehteh | fremantle on n800 ... how much memory does it have? | 21:55 |
| luke-jr | microb has its own engine now? O.o | 21:55 |
| Stskeeps | cehteh: 128m | 21:56 |
| timeless_mbp | we just need someone who can get tablet-browser* and neteal opened | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | well, or tried to rebuild it on diablo | 21:56 |
| cehteh | ah i thought 64 or even less ... 128 may barely work | 21:56 |
| slonopotamus | kaie: since chromium runs on n8x0 with reasonable speed and memory usage without any hacks. | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: i can probably play around with building stuff in the fremantle sdk | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | err | 21:57 |
| Stskeeps | diablo sdk | 21:57 |
| ptl | chromium? | 21:57 |
| ptl | is there a chromium port for maemo? | 21:57 |
| timeless_mbp | fwiw, i'm watching #airmozilla right now, so this is a bad time for me :) | 21:57 |
| kaie | timeless_mbp, you say it could be done, but you're forbidden to do it, because of non-coding decisions | 21:57 |
| slonopotamus | ptl: no hildonised one, however it shouldn't be hard to since chromium uses gtk. | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | kaie: roughly | 21:58 |
| Arkenklo | Linux is awesome because I can buy a bluetooth keyboard, create a custom ordinary X11 keymap with the (dvorak) map I want, write a scipts that associates that keymap with the keyboard upon connection, install firefox, install the vimperator firefox addon and then finally surf in my phone identically in every way (except screensize) to how I surf an my desktop. | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | forbidden isn't quite the right word | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | the code is owned by nokia, not us | 21:58 |
| Stskeeps | 'no resources' | 21:58 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | as such, we can't release it w/o approval from someone | 21:58 |
| timeless_mbp | getting that approval generally requires a business case | 21:58 |
| ptl | slonopotamus: but only maemo 4, right? | 21:59 |
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| ptl | I mean | 21:59 |
| ptl | the existing one is not for maemo 5 | 22:00 |
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| kaie | timeless_mbp, ok, if you need a business case, tell the managers: If Nokia puts internet tablet hardware to end of life, by no longer updating the included internet browser software, I won't buy more internet devices from nokia, because I want a longer lifetime than 2 years. | 22:00 |
| timeless_mbp | kaie: that case doesn't work well | 22:00 |
| timeless_mbp | imagine we sold 5 770s | 22:01 |
| timeless_mbp | imagine we sold 25 n800s | 22:01 |
| timeless_mbp | imagine we sold 100 n810s | 22:01 |
| timeless_mbp | imagine we sold 1000 n900s | 22:01 |
| * ptl imagined all this | 22:01 | |
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| timeless_mbp | losing 1% of our base from a smaller base | 22:01 |
| timeless_mbp | is sadly entirely uninteresting to our bean-counters | 22:01 |
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| kaie | it may be a small total number, but you lose the trust of the early adaptors | 22:01 |
| kaie | that may be of more interest to them | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | look, i'm not saying i disagree w/ your opinion | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | i am saying that we've internally raised this opinion | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | and they don't give a **** | 22:02 |
| kaie | yes, I totaly understand that you don't disagree :-) | 22:02 |
| kaie | thanks for having tried! | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | and sadly, from a bean-counting perspective, they aren't wrong | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | you're giving the wrong argument | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | better arguments include: | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | 1. lawsuits | 22:02 |
| timeless_mbp | 2. negative press | 22:03 |
| timeless_mbp | 3. negative word of mouth | 22:03 |
| timeless_mbp | 4. active boycotts | 22:03 |
| SpeedEvil | 5. throwing excrement at executives. | 22:03 |
| timeless_mbp | — i'm not endorsing any of the above :) | 22:03 |
| * microlith boggles as his N900 ceases responding to screen taps but continues to run | 22:04 | |
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| kaie | the missing updates for n810 have already driven me to go path 4, I'm not going to buy an n900 unless I can see update support | 22:05 |
| SpeedEvil | microlith: sshing in can be useful - see what top says | 22:05 |
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| microlith | SpeedEvil: can't do that at the moment, phone was on edge and not wifi | 22:06 |
| microlith | seems to have gotten over it | 22:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | cpu-meter is also useful | 22:07 |
| microlith | indeed | 22:07 |
| lcuk | the best case is by supporting and giving extremely POSITIVE reaction en-masse to the community ssu and by getting developers of current community n900 only apps to also backport their own titles | 22:07 |
| lcuk | and gain momentum that way | 22:07 |
| microlith | at the time it was in the task switcher | 22:07 |
| microlith | so the meter wasn't visible | 22:07 |
| lcuk | timeless_mbp, kaie ^^ | 22:08 |
| lcuk | offer backports to the open source components in our n900 - theres a lot of code in gitorious | 22:08 |
| lcuk | theres a lot that can be done without complaint and if you want to see something on your 8x0 then get involved | 22:09 |
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| kaie | lcuk, my point is simple, nokia still supports maemo, still supports microb. All I ask for is a software update of microb, which is the most important piece of software, and it's maintained by nokia, not by the community, so I expect action from nokia | 22:10 |
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| kaie | I don't think community momentum influences nokia's decision to backport microb or not | 22:11 |
| lcuk | kaie, timeless is correct in everything he has said, moving mountains just because of a few random irc comments gets us nowhere | 22:11 |
| lcuk | but if involvement in backporting is something because eeryone else is - then it becomes easier | 22:11 |
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| lcuk | in the past there have been similar efforts for getting later oses onto older devices - mostly undertaken by the developers themselves | 22:12 |
| pupnik | the correct irc comments arew correctr | 22:13 |
| lcuk | the hacker editions | 22:13 |
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| lcuk | kaie, getting mindshare into all the silent developers over there >>>>> and building momentum for it would be the only way and if those same developers all rolled up and said "actually we have with minimal changes managed to backport a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,j" can we release it to the community | 22:14 |
| lcuk | it becomes a bit better | 22:14 |
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| kaie | lcuk, you're talking about a thing that might happen or not. Why should I wait longer and hope? I don't understand why this would be necessary. I can use most software on n810 fine. It seems to work fine in most areas. I like the fact that a lot of software is available. The community appears to work. | 22:16 |
| kaie | It's just the primary software that doesn't get updates | 22:16 |
| kaie | if romaxa was able to backport microb already, nokia should simply allow to get it completed and publish it, that's it | 22:17 |
| lcuk | how do you get it to users? | 22:17 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: getting it to users is doable | 22:17 |
| timeless_mbp | there are dozens of ways to break the apt seal | 22:17 |
| timeless_mbp | the only obstacle is getting past lawyers | 22:18 |
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| lcuk | i na sustainable way | 22:18 |
| kaie | lcuk, I made a pidgin package once and made it available over http, and users found it, because usual maintainer was distracted | 22:18 |
| kaie | (luckily pidgin is maintained again) | 22:18 |
| ali12341 | getting it to users is trivial, you make a "backports" repository, job done | 22:18 |
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| * MohammadAG 's N900 screen makes a crackling sound | 22:18 | |
| kaie | lcuk, so I think these are 2 separate steps. get the software done, then find a way to distrubute. and I agree that the community ssu you mentioned is a good thing | 22:18 |
| lcuk | its being done - the first signs of community ssu are coming | 22:18 |
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| lcuk | and we can populate it with more | 22:19 |
| Vratha | what does "community ssu" mean | 22:21 |
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| lizardo | thopiekar: may I ask why did you upload python-central to diablo ? | 22:21 |
| Jaffa | Vratha: Updates to the OS, via the same mechanism Nokia used, to upgrade OS-provided packages like modest | 22:21 |
| Vratha | ah, thanks | 22:21 |
| thopiekar | lizardo: to build python-twitter | 22:21 |
| thopiekar | lizardo: was that not a good idea? | 22:22 |
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| lizardo | thopiekar: you could at least have checked in http://maemo.org/packages/view/python-central/ that the package is already in fremantle... | 22:23 |
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| lizardo | thopiekar: so you could have reused the same packaging (and dropped the "ubuntu" suffix) ... usually it would be nice if you have dropped an e-mail to the pymaemo-developers mailing list :) | 22:25 |
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| thopiekar | mailto: ? | 22:26 |
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| lizardo | thopiekar: it is a mailing list : https://garage.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/pymaemo-developers given that you touched a packaged already maintained by someone else (the PyMaemo team) it is polite to discuss there first before uploading the package... unfortunately the autobuilder does not check for "maintainership" | 22:27 |
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| thopiekar | ahh ok | 22:28 |
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| thopiekar | so what should I write there? sorry but I uploaded a package that you maintain on diablo? | 22:28 |
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| lizardo | thopiekar: "I need package xyz on Diablo, but it is only on fremantle ... any problem if I upload it to diablo too?" | 22:30 |
| thopiekar | lizardo: just happend :/ | 22:31 |
| Stskeeps | what'd you break now, thopiekar? | 22:31 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:31 |
| lizardo | thopiekar: yes, that is past now :) | 22:31 |
| thopiekar | nothing :D | 22:31 |
| thopiekar | just packaging plugins for canola and resolving it's deps.. | 22:32 |
| lizardo | thopiekar: the rule of thumb is : before attempting to upload package xyz to diablo, check if it not yet on fremantle, and kindly contact the current maintainer with regards to your plans to upload the package | 22:32 |
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| lizardo | just a tip anyway :) | 22:32 |
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| thopiekar | ok | 22:34 |
| pupnik | god DAMN it, where is the BEL char in N900 xterm?? | 22:34 |
| thopiekar | is there anyone of the pymaemo guys here.. don't wanna write the mail now ;) | 22:35 |
| lizardo | thopiekar: try #pymaemo ;) | 22:35 |
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| SpeedEvil | pupnik: ctrl-g? | 22:36 |
| pupnik | no bel | 22:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Oh noes! | 22:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Submit a bug. | 22:36 |
| pupnik | maybe i can fix.. stty -a is informative | 22:37 |
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| pupnik | /msg SpeedEvil beep ... NOT! | 22:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | pupnik: console-beep isn't very common to work ootb in non-console (aka xterm) shells | 22:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | probably maemo-xterm simply doesn't support it | 22:44 |
| Arkenklo | speaking of which, doesn't the n900 have regular consoles? | 22:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer | seen chvt | 22:44 |
| Arkenklo | really? it does? | 22:45 |
| Arkenklo | :D | 22:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | for sure it has at least *one* - via rs232 on debug testpoints under battery | 22:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | Or you could do console on BT-serial | 22:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | or on USB | 22:46 |
| * DocScrutinizer checks out chvt :-P | 22:47 | |
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| Arkenklo | nah, it sez can't open console | 22:47 |
| Arkenklo | not that suprised | 22:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | wooohooo | 22:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer | chvt 3 killed input :-P | 22:48 |
| Arkenklo | whoah, hang on. it hung | 22:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | let's see if I can recover via ssh :-D | 22:48 |
| Arkenklo | what tty is x on? it's not 7 | 22:49 |
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| ali12341 | 1 or 2 | 22:49 |
| Arkenklo | 2 indeed | 22:50 |
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| Arkenklo | I guess the kernel has got framebuffer disabled | 22:50 |
| ali12341 | yeah | 22:50 |
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| * Noobmonk3y_ feels refreshed | 22:53 | |
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| andre__ | <adv>maemo.org Bugday right now in #maemo-bugs . Feel free to join and say hello to the maemo.org Bugsquad.</adv> | 22:54 |
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| * shamus just found mclock and likes it but wishes that it had more features and liked not runign full screen better as when non fullscren lost of the text is clipped off screen | 22:56 | |
| shamus | would make a slick home screen aplet | 22:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | for a strange reason I had to switch to chvt 4,5,6,7,8 and then to 2. to revive it. switching between 1,2,3 only made screen go black for 2, but no input | 22:58 |
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| Funnyface | hmm I've had my N900 in my pocket today without any apps running, and without a data connection, but the battery drained just about as fast as it does when I have IM stuff up for an entire day. I am not connected to a wifi network, but it shows some bars to the right of the battery icon, would that mean the wifi adapter is turned on? | 23:02 |
| Funnyface | how can I make sure that wifi is actually turned completely off, rather than being just disconnected from an access point? | 23:03 |
| SpeedEvil | are they two little bars that vary in size? | 23:03 |
| Funnyface | yes | 23:03 |
| Arkenklo | Funnyface: is *all* data turned off? I've read 3g uses a lot of juice | 23:03 |
| SpeedEvil | cpu-applet? | 23:03 |
| mikhas | Funnyface, look at your i-net settings. I think it scans for wireless every * min by default | 23:03 |
| Funnyface | "Internet connection: Not connected" | 23:04 |
| mikhas | no, in the config screen | 23:04 |
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| Funnyface | ah | 23:04 |
| Funnyface | it's set to "never" :P | 23:04 |
| mikhas | and does it auto-connect to wifi? | 23:05 |
| Funnyface | nope, it's set to "always ask" | 23:05 |
| mikhas | well, then you'll have no extra batt drainage from that one, ok | 23:06 |
| Funnyface | could it be because I used the "wifieye" application? | 23:06 |
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| mikhas | I dont know this app, sorry | 23:06 |
| Arkenklo | Funnyface: try turning off 3g for a day | 23:06 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/ordnancesurveyconsultation - random. For those in the UK. Ordnance survey consultation on opening up some of their data. Closes tomorrow. | 23:06 |
| Funnyface | it's some app that displays wifi networks, their signal strength and which channels they are on | 23:07 |
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| Funnyface | I haven't run a 3G connection at all today | 23:07 |
| Arkenklo | alledgedly when it can't get a solid 3g connection it's constantly connecting and reconnecting | 23:07 |
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| Funnyface | or well, it sits there idle, not connected, just displaying the signal strength of 3G, but that's normal for all phones :P | 23:07 |
| SpeedEvil | wifieye I would suspect to cause that sort of problem | 23:08 |
| SpeedEvil | Or rather any wifi scanner, not uniquely that one | 23:08 |
| Arkenklo | nah, I think it automatically connects to 3g if available, even if there's no current data usage | 23:09 |
| Funnyface | yep. I am suspecting that the wifi is turned on, while not being connected to an access point | 23:09 |
| Arkenklo | Funnyface: you can always issue an "ifconfig wlan0 down" to manually disable it | 23:09 |
| Arkenklo | as root, of course | 23:10 |
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| Funnyface | I'll try connecting to my access point, then disconnect to see if that solves the problem :P | 23:10 |
| Funnyface | and I haven't bothered with root access yet | 23:10 |
| Funnyface | just had this device for 4 days or so | 23:10 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah - took me a while too. | 23:11 |
| SpeedEvil | It was a good 10 minutes for me. | 23:11 |
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| Funnyface | yes I checked some web page explaining how to do it, seems easy, just haven't bothered yet :P | 23:11 |
| Arkenklo | ? | 23:11 |
| Arkenklo | there's a package called "rootsh", you just install it and run the command "root" in xterm | 23:12 |
| Arkenklo | we are talking about the n900, right? | 23:12 |
| Funnyface | yes | 23:12 |
| Funnyface | well I guess I can go ahead and do it right away | 23:12 |
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| Arkenklo | well then, you only need to install that one package, iirc it's in extras | 23:13 |
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| mfinkle | I can use http://maemo.org/api_refs/4.0/libconic/coniciap_8h.html to find out if my current connection is wifi or not | 23:16 |
| mfinkle | but how do I check to see if I am "roaming" or not? | 23:16 |
| Arkenklo | mfinkle: do you mean connected via gsm/3g? | 23:16 |
| mfinkle | Arkenklo: yes, connected via gsm, but roaming outside my provider (so I get charged a lot more) | 23:17 |
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| Arkenklo | mfinkle: oh, no idea | 23:17 |
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| ds3 | ] | 23:21 |
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| Funnyface | oh well, my sorry adhoc network is acting shit today, so no rootsh today.. :\ | 23:23 |
| Funnyface | adhoc + vista ICS doesn't work well.. | 23:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | byebye wifieye | 23:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | btw: 28h now, *with* wifi, SIP, and email poll -- lshall says bat is at 44% | 23:26 |
| pupnik | and black screen right | 23:26 |
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| tools | hi all.. is it easy / possible to get a n900 with a quertz keyboard in germany? | 23:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | most of the time - yes of course | 23:27 |
| pupnik | tools: that is all you get afaik | 23:27 |
| tools | ah - cool :-) | 23:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: get one with a US qwetry and we'll swap and you get 50 bucks on top | 23:27 |
| pupnik | poor DocScrutinizer | 23:28 |
| tools | ouch - sorry - wrong way put | 23:28 |
| tools | I actuall _do_ want one with a qwerty keyboard | 23:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | poor tools | 23:29 |
| pupnik | can he order from .uk? | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | prolly he could | 23:29 |
| tools | technically yes - but | 23:29 |
| tools | actually my employer will get it and they prefer to buy from big, reputable german stores... | 23:30 |
| * pupnik sauft frankfurter appelwoi | 23:30 | |
| Funnyface | ifconfig wlan0 down, it disconnected me from the access point, but the bars are still displaying.. | 23:30 |
| Funnyface | grr | 23:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | which bars? | 23:30 |
| tools | anybody knows such a shop where the sell them with a qwerty keyboard? | 23:31 |
| pupnik | tell your employer you are the one who needs satisfactio here | 23:31 |
| pupnik | returns to nokia.uk are no problem | 23:31 |
| tools | I know and can - but don't want to push things too far.. | 23:31 |
| Funnyface | the wifi signal strength bars (or at least that's what I think they are) | 23:31 |
| * lupine_85 has a qwerty one | 23:31 | |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: maybe we can join efforts to get qwerty keycaps replacement | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's rather easy to replace | 23:32 |
| tools | you can get them from alternate for EUR 490,- afair - not sure what they cost in UK - but I would guess a lot more | 23:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | just not that easy to get | 23:32 |
| tools | DocScrutinizer: aha | 23:32 |
| * tools is interested.. | 23:32 | |
| pupnik | hey i was just in alternate store. bastards didny have one on display | 23:33 |
| * pupnik will visit again | 23:33 | |
| tools | pupnik: right - that's the other point | 23:33 |
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| tools | alternate and some other bigger shops don't have them in stock atm | 23:33 |
| pupnik | demand is high? | 23:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: www.klc.fi | 23:34 |
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| tools | any big shop in germany which likely has them in stock atm? | 23:34 |
| lupine_85 | tools: £460 | 23:35 |
| lupine_85 | with the current rate of the £, that's not so bad | 23:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: www.klc.fi/tuotteet/Nokia-Varaosat-N900 | 23:35 |
| dregin | O2 in Ireland are selling it sim free for €440 | 23:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | grr | 23:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.klc.fi/fin/tuotteet/Nokia-Varaosat-N900 | 23:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Wow. I think 'blocks' - is sponsored by screen protector makers | 23:37 |
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| tools | DocScrutinizer: okay - the hard part is probably speaking finish or so :-) | 23:37 |
| embedded | Hi all | 23:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: yep | 23:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | N900 QWERTY KEYMAT ENGLISH 265740 14€ | 23:38 |
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| tools | yup | 23:38 |
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| embedded | hey guys, who use Esbox to debug applications on N900 target? | 23:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | also N900 TOUCH WINDOW ASSY 2691V9 55€ :-) -- better than screen protector for 20€ | 23:39 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: indeed. Now all it needs is for some clever person to come up with a SAW diamond-fronted variant :) | 23:40 |
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| tools | hmm - won't order right now but will come back to you - or - in case you got news pm me | 23:40 |
| tools | DocScrutinizer: ^ | 23:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | k | 23:40 |
| tools | another question: when using the phone moderately (no gps, no wireless, no umts and let's say 30m of calls per day) - what battery life time do I get roughly? | 23:43 |
| tools | with all possible powersave modes in action? | 23:44 |
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| tools | of cause also no movies / music, etc | 23:44 |
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| embedded | tools: about 3 days | 23:44 |
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| tools | hmm - that's little.. any way to extend that? | 23:45 |
| tools | like in bigger battery | 23:45 |
| SpeedEvil | Why not charge at night? | 23:45 |
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| tools | possibly - but I don't like the idea of always having to care about the charger as soon as I leave the house for a (long) weekend | 23:46 |
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| embedded | yeah..or bought another battery for backup | 23:46 |
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| SpeedEvil | or just take a USB lead - if you're in range of computers. | 23:46 |
| tools | how much do they cost roughly and any idea if they are available in Germany? | 23:46 |
| tools | USB lead sounds good | 23:46 |
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| Arif_ | buy a 3rd battery! | 23:47 |
| SpeedEvil | USB lead doesn't charge very fast - but it's done after ~3h even with the display on | 23:47 |
| tools | :) | 23:47 |
| embedded | indeed I read somewhere that there is an asian battery manufacturer that will ship soon a battery for N900 of 2400 mAh :) | 23:47 |
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| embedded | that compared to the actual one is not so bad | 23:47 |
| Arif_ | embedded, yeah, it'll make your N900 twice the size ;D | 23:47 |
| Arif_ | you could beat someone up with it ! | 23:47 |
| embedded | eheh :> | 23:48 |
| tools | but you'll have to use a headset because otherwise the phone may blow-up in your face :-) | 23:48 |
| embedded | twice the weight | 23:48 |
| Arif_ | tools, why not juggle around with 6 batteries | 23:48 |
| ali12341 | if the n900 battery was twice as thick, the whole thing would be same size as my old phone (which lasted for 4 days on a 1250mah battery) | 23:48 |
| Arif_ | ? | 23:48 |
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| Arif_ | I managed to kill the N95 8GB's battery in 25 minutes | 23:49 |
| Arif_ | =} | 23:49 |
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| ds3 | Arif_: axe or hammer? :D | 23:49 |
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| tools | Arif_: did you use it to boil a cup of tea? :-) | 23:49 |
| Arif_ | coreplayer | 23:49 |
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| Arif_ | :P | 23:49 |
| Arif_ | I was streaming radio over 3G with equalizer on | 23:50 |
| Arif_ | that eq does some mad things to the phone :D | 23:50 |
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| thopiekar | could someone test the twitter plugin at diablo? | 23:50 |
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| lmoura | thopiekar, about python-gobject, no we won't put it in diablo because it's already there, but as python2.5-gobject | 23:51 |
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| lmoura | so, you'll need to change the dependencies | 23:51 |
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| thopiekar | ahh ok lmoura | 23:52 |
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| thopiekar | thanks | 23:52 |
| * Arif_ sneezes | 23:52 | |
| lmoura | thopiekar, all pymaemo packages in diablo starts with python2.5 | 23:52 |
| lmoura | due to the old packaging scheme | 23:52 |
| Arif_ | I let my phone fly through half the bus today | 23:52 |
| Arif_ | :( | 23:52 |
| thopiekar | k | 23:52 |
| marmoute | Arif_: I hope you did forget to run the game before ! | 23:53 |
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| moudmen | Good evening, I have an n900 and I'm having a little problem with incoming calls. Say I have an incoming call from contact X, and this contact X has a registered home phone number and a registered mobile phone number. The 'incoming call' screen does not let me know where this contact X is calling from (no icon for home phone/mobile phone or phone number are shown). Is there any known way that can help me with this issue? | 23:53 |
| Arif_ | :P | 23:53 |
| Arif_ | good thing someone caught it | 23:53 |
| thopiekar | so could someone test the plugin and give some feedback tomorrow at #canola? thank.. I have to leave again.. | 23:54 |
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| thopiekar | see ya | 23:54 |
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| red | moudmen: you could duplicate the contact if you really need to make a distinction between the two call numbers perhaps | 23:55 |
| moudmen | yes this is the only way i have found to solve this, but it's pretty unprofessional and annoying | 23:55 |
| red | name other Name (Gsm) and other Name (Home) and put numbers accordingly | 23:55 |
| moudmen | yup, true | 23:55 |
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| red | yeah unpractical | 23:55 |
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| red | but thats what you get for buying N900 | 23:56 |
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| red | :> | 23:56 |
| red | a whole lotta unpractical. | 23:56 |
| moudmen | i haven't done this in 9 years ever since contact cards didn't support more than 1 phone number | 23:56 |
| red | i still have my nokia ringo somewhere | 23:56 |
| red | could only store 9 numbers there | 23:56 |
| moudmen | haha | 23:57 |
| red | and it had 3 ringtones! | 23:57 |
| red | and and, it made phantom calls without gui lighting up, even with keypad locked | 23:57 |
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| red | got busted for drinking when underaage due that, called my sister and she ratted me out to parents :p | 23:57 |
| moudmen | i still have my old ericsson, somewhere too, forgot what model it was but it's a tank | 23:57 |
| pupnik | yaay yaaaay. javis ported picodrive! | 23:57 |
| red | hehe | 23:57 |
| moudmen | fell from the 3rd floor down to the streets, and just a tiny scratch | 23:58 |
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| moudmen | hahahaha, phantom calls? | 23:58 |
| moudmen | never heard of these | 23:58 |
| red | it just decided to randomly open a connection to any of the 9 contacts stored | 23:59 |
| red | at it's own whim | 23:59 |
| moudmen | lol | 23:59 |
| red | couldn't see it was calling | 23:59 |
| red | no indication | 23:59 |
| FredrIQ | afk | 23:59 |
| red | just suddenlly hear a person starting to talk | 23:59 |
| red | if the phone was near you on a table or something | 23:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | tools: shipping is cheap in klc.fi, and there's no minimum order value. So I'll go ordering a keymat and 2 stylii right now | 23:59 |
| moudmen | well, you can still do that, with n95 8gb, just without calling... you'll only get to the contacts when keypad is locked | 23:59 |
| moudmen | that's pretty weird too | 23:59 |
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