| ShadowJK | lupine_85, I mean there's no reliable way to enumerate devices on a i2c bus | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| pH5 | javispedro: do you also see a lot of errors like this: "PVR_K:(Error): Failed to find offset struct (KVAddress=c89bd000)" (from mmap.c) in dmesg? | 00:00 |
| pH5 | hm, and I wonder where to connect for blizzard display refresh - OMAPLCD IRQ reqeuests fail, but I guess that is natural. | 00:01 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: what is the size of the HAM icon embedded into control file, again? | 00:01 |
| Stskeeps | pH5: did you remember adjusting DMA size stuff? | 00:01 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ShadowJK: in this case we got the I2C bus to probe (from BME kernel stuff) and we know there shall be two devices at least | 00:01 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, 48x48 | 00:01 |
| pH5 | Stskeeps: I flashed the provided kernel. Where do I find the DMA size patch? | 00:02 |
| Stskeeps | pH5: sec | 00:02 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Ack | 00:02 |
| Stskeeps | pH5: if you flashed kernel that should be there | 00:02 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: and Maemo4 is 26x26? | 00:02 |
| VDVsx | exactly | 00:03 |
| pH5 | Stskeeps: just in case I build my own. but I guess I can find this info in one of the >50 talk thead pages sometime? | 00:03 |
| lupine_85 | ah, yes | 00:03 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil: you said you had a look. Found anything noteworthy? | 00:03 |
| Stskeeps | pH5: yes, trying to find it for you :) | 00:03 |
| pH5 | this thing is huge :) | 00:03 |
| lupine_85 | turns out it was GPIO, not I2C, anyway | 00:03 |
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| lupine_85 | 'though I'm extremely fuzzy when it comes to these things | 00:03 |
| Stskeeps | pH5: CONFIG_FB_OMAP_CONSISTENT_DMA_SIZE=8 | 00:04 |
| pH5 | Stskeeps: thanks! | 00:04 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: I've been reading random bits of datasheets. | 00:04 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: not got up the energy to do systematic investigation. | 00:04 |
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| * lupine_85 has built the default kernel, yay | 00:05 | |
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| SpeedEvil | lupine_85: did it boot? | 00:05 |
| lupine_85 | I have no idea yet | 00:05 |
| RST38h | "A furious lesbian who broke her [deep breath] lover's ex-husband's sister's boyfriend's legs by deliberately mowing him down in a car was jailed on Tuesday" | 00:05 |
| RST38h | eek | 00:05 |
| lupine_85 | haven't got that far ;) | 00:06 |
| SpeedEvil | That's a lot of levels of indirection to get angry through | 00:07 |
| lcuk | RST38h, that sounds like something kevin bacon would tell people | 00:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: wacky | 00:08 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: that's ... | 00:08 |
| RST38h | http://news.stv.tv/scotland/east-central/162387-deliberate-car-attack-lesbian-sent-to-womens-prison/ | 00:08 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: 5 miles away? | 00:08 |
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| * RST38h can see SpeedEvil silently going over the list of his friends/relatives, just in case | 00:09 | |
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| javispedro | pH5: I get that message often, usually when creating/deleting egl contexts | 00:10 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I do know a henderson family | 00:10 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure if they're related to the defendant | 00:10 |
| RST38h | oh. | 00:10 |
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| SpeedEvil | It's unlikely. | 00:11 |
| SpeedEvil | (there are ~60000 people in kirkcaldy) | 00:11 |
| lupine_85 | RST38h: I'm guessing the "furious lesbian" broke up with the lover to go out with the lover's ex-husband's sister, who then went straight and got a boyfriend | 00:11 |
| lupine_85 | amirite? | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | lupine: I am kinda afraid to guess | 00:12 |
| lupine_85 | sounds like the kind of thing that might happen | 00:12 |
| RST38h | the headline alone has been enough, really... | 00:12 |
| * lupine_85 belatedly discovers a custom kernel is extras that has ipv6 | 00:13 | |
| lupine_85 | let's give that a try... | 00:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | I know the victim's mother's sister's ex-lover's son's university room mate | 00:13 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I'm really unhappy about a 3 year 9 month sentance - which may result in under 2 years of time served - if she behaves | 00:13 |
| Stskeeps | can't we add bacon to this discussion tomorrow? :P | 00:14 |
| SpeedEvil | For what was basically attempted murder | 00:14 |
| Stskeeps | er, too | 00:14 |
| SpeedEvil | I got a large online shop delivered today. | 00:14 |
| pupnik | to | 00:14 |
| SpeedEvil | They diddn't deliver my bacon, though charging me for it. | 00:14 |
| lupine_85 | no substitutions? | 00:15 |
| pupnik | i confuse das and dass occasionally | 00:15 |
| lupine_85 | zomg, it works | 00:15 |
| lupine_85 | although, it seems to not want to pick up a global ip | 00:15 |
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| SpeedEvil | lupine_85: I complained - and they're refunding my card - but... | 00:17 |
| lupine_85 | herh | 00:17 |
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| lupine_85 | ah, radvd is no longer running for whatever reason | 00:18 |
| lupine_85 | wonder if I should try to get dhcp6 working instead | 00:18 |
| lupine_85 | nah, sac is... well... easier :D | 00:20 |
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| lardman|away | pupnik: that's understandable | 00:21 |
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| lardman|home | no double-entendre intended ;) | 00:22 |
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| pupnik | wonder how ADs tron game would run on N900 | 00:23 |
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| * Arif_ wonders if the Unreal engine will be ported to the N900... | 00:25 | |
| trip0 | lol | 00:26 |
| pupnik | lardman|home: do you find n810 keybd unpleasant now? | 00:26 |
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| pupnik | feels like poking a puppy in the eye to me | 00:26 |
| RST38h | oh shit, the mime types data files are still out of date | 00:26 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: is poking puppies in the eyes pleasant or not? | 00:27 |
| Vratha | it is not pleasant | 00:27 |
| Vratha | dogs are for rubs and hugs and love only | 00:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | to the puppy for sure it's not :-P | 00:28 |
| lardman|home | pupnik: I don't use it much nowadays, but there's certainly less feel | 00:28 |
| Vratha | and also for picking up their poop and things | 00:28 |
| lardman|home | no puppies involves! | 00:28 |
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| lardman|home | s/s/d | 00:28 |
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| pupnik | it is refreshing going back to the larger screen, but irc isnt so fun | 00:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer | muhaha snow on Mallorca | 00:30 |
| pupnik | looks like n900 board has some free space above it for cooling | 00:30 |
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| SpeedEvil | doubtful | 00:32 |
| SpeedEvil | most cooling happens by conduction typically | 00:32 |
| trip0 | i also happen by conduction | 00:32 |
| * lardman|home wonders where the thermal transfer talk has come from... | 00:33 | |
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| SpeedEvil | http://www.dansdata.com/goop.htm - I happen to have in my pastebuffer | 00:34 |
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| lardman|home | mmm vegemite :) | 00:35 |
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| * pH5 gets tired of restarting mbxdaemon | 00:39 | |
| pH5 | good night | 00:39 |
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| javispedro | now he understand why everybody gets tired of it after playing for a few minutes with it :) | 00:39 |
| SpeedEvil | Vegemite is a terrible idea. | 00:39 |
| SpeedEvil | Clearly marmite is the right way to go. | 00:39 |
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| lardman|home | pah | 00:40 |
| RST38h | how do they compare in terms of heat transfer? | 00:40 |
| lardman|home | well that's true, eat the vegemite, spread marmite somewhere | 00:40 |
| lardman|home | marmite is runnier, so probably better in the short term | 00:40 |
| lardman|home | at least compared to the vegemite I can get over here | 00:40 |
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| RST38h | "Now they're saying I groped a male staffer. Yeah, I did. Not only did I grope him, I tickled him until he couldn't breathe and four guys jumped on top of me." -- Eric Massa (D-NY) | 00:42 |
| Hydroxide | RST38h: not that I don't find that a fascinating debacle (I do), but this is probably not the right channel :) if you're on OFTC as well I created #usa for such blather a couple of days ago - hopefully it will catch on at some point | 00:43 |
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| * lupine_85 hides from *mite | 00:44 | |
| GAN900 | RST38h, not that I've ever noticed. | 00:45 |
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| GAN900 | RST38h, my heirarchy of WiFi reliability is Maemo > Mac OS X > Linux > Windows | 00:45 |
| RST38h | Hydroxide: Sorry, it was way to weird to avoid pasting it =) | 00:46 |
| RST38h | s/to/too | 00:46 |
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| Hydroxide | RST38h: quite weird indeed :) I *did* say I find it fascinating and I wasn't being sarcastic... :) | 00:46 |
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| Hydroxide | RST38h: next time he runs I won't give him any money | 00:46 |
| RST38h | GAN900: Very strange then: this poor MacOSX machine has never seen reliable wifi (with two different APs and all the patches) | 00:47 |
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| Hydroxide | (I did, once, to thank him for something I've forgotten now) | 00:47 |
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| lupine_85 | ok, docs-to-go is a fail | 00:51 |
| RST38h | slow? or incompatble? | 00:51 |
| javispedro | if it 's anything like the palm version, it will be both :) | 00:52 |
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| javispedro | but at least works ... | 00:52 |
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| lupine_85 | slow, incompatible, non-free, has an eula, and requires registration | 00:52 |
| * RST38h wonders why they have not implemented document editing. iPhone version apparently has that. | 00:52 | |
| lupine_85 | srsly d00d wtf? | 00:53 |
| lupine_85 | etc | 00:53 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: nearly all of their versions have editing support. | 00:53 |
| lupine_85 | so I get a choice of koffice, abiword, or evubce | 00:54 |
| lupine_85 | evince* | 00:54 |
| lupine_85 | I don't mind exporting as PDF... | 00:54 |
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| * lardman|home considers playing COD4 | 00:54 | |
| lardman|home | or rather MW2 | 00:55 |
| * noobmonk3y_ waves | 00:55 | |
| Karlosos | halo 3 is better | 00:55 |
| lardman|home | PC | 00:55 |
| noobmonk3y_ | w000p finally got my other laptop up and working on ubuntu :D | 00:55 |
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| lardman|home | and actually I wasn't too fond of Halo when I played it on my cousins' XBox | 00:55 |
| lupine_85 | dull game was dull :/ | 00:55 |
| Karlosos | i love it | 00:56 |
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| lardman|home | multiplayer I guess is the appeal? | 00:56 |
| lardman|home | in which case new AvP looks cool | 00:56 |
| lardman|home | I prefer coop | 00:56 |
| lupine_85 | I do love being randomly cursed at by americans :) | 00:56 |
| noobmonk3y_ | avp is a bit fraky lol | 00:56 |
| noobmonk3y_ | freaky* | 00:56 |
| noobmonk3y_ | gave me the jitters | 00:56 |
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| lardman|home | noobmonk3y: ideal! :) | 00:57 |
| Karlosos | hey noob | 00:57 |
| * javis900 finds worlds slowest installer application... made in java and starving all other x11 clients | 00:57 | |
| noobmonk3y_ | w00p | 00:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | hey Karlosos | 00:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | lo lardman :D | 00:57 |
| lardman|home | we used to play long into the night at Uni, was pretty freaky leaving after that - dark quiet and large buildings | 00:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | .me is playing with his Karmic Koala ;) | 00:57 |
| Karlosos | how do u private message | 00:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | wtf | 00:58 |
| noobmonk3y_ | did i say all of those names in my msg? lol | 00:58 |
| noobmonk3y_ | oh no | 00:58 |
| noobmonk3y_ | just xchat being odd | 00:58 |
| lardman|home | :) | 00:58 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | sorry - will stop talking to myself, promise ;) | 00:59 |
| lardman|home | ok chaps, will log off and play some MW2 sp, see you tomorrow | 00:59 |
| Karlosos | i managed to flash my phone noob but i wasnt doing it wrong you need to do something differemt with vista | 00:59 |
| noobmonk3y_ | have a good eve :D | 00:59 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | lol - good old vista ;) | 00:59 |
| noobmonk3y_ | but all is good in the land of the vista flashed n900? :D | 00:59 |
| Karlosos | yeah wont accept above 40 characters in name | 00:59 |
| noobmonk3y_ | ha! :P | 01:00 |
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| Karlosos | there is a thread on maemo chat got me flashing fine | 01:01 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | yay to tmo! :D | 01:01 |
| trem | nite all, sweet dreams | 01:01 |
| noobmonk3y_ | nites | 01:01 |
| Karlosos | nite | 01:01 |
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| * RST38h just gave his n900 extra 16GB of storage, as a present to his preciousssss =) | 01:05 | |
| noobmonk3y_ | yay!!!!!! | 01:05 |
| noobmonk3y_ | mine still only has 8gb :( | 01:05 |
| trip0 | ? | 01:05 |
| trip0 | how did you add 8 more gigs? | 01:05 |
| noobmonk3y_ | it needs some more loving i feel | 01:05 |
| noobmonk3y_ | card? lol | 01:05 |
| trip0 | oh | 01:06 |
| noobmonk3y_ | :D | 01:06 |
| RST38h | Ironically, I can now keep ALL of my data in a cell phone. If you can still call it a cell phone | 01:06 |
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| trip0 | lol | 01:06 |
| noobmonk3y_ | smart-cell-puter-phone | 01:06 |
| derf | I can't even come close. | 01:06 |
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| Arif_ | mine has an empty SD slot! | 01:09 |
| trip0 | mine too | 01:09 |
| Arif_ | though I need one | 01:09 |
| Arif_ | I have 500MB free ;D | 01:09 |
| * SpeedEvil has a lowly 1G card in. | 01:09 | |
| Arif_ | :O | 01:09 |
| trip0 | n900 is micro or mini sd? | 01:10 |
| Arif_ | micro | 01:10 |
| SpeedEvil | Though I am currently looking at the IO lines it uses with speculation. | 01:10 |
| Arif_ | why would you even bother with a 1G card :D | 01:10 |
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| SpeedEvil | Arif_: it was spare. | 01:10 |
| SpeedEvil | Arif_: and it's enough for backups | 01:10 |
| lupine_85 | hmm, (how) can I change the password for 'user' ? | 01:10 |
| trip0 | looks like 32 is the biggest you can get | 01:10 |
| Arif_ | I have a lot of 2GB cards laying around for no reason | 01:10 |
| SpeedEvil | passwd | 01:10 |
| SpeedEvil | -> lupine_85 | 01:10 |
| Arif_ | trip0, those are pricey :( | 01:11 |
| SpeedEvil | trip0: yup - and expesnive ATM | 01:11 |
| lupine_85 | "the password for user can't be changed" | 01:11 |
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| RST38h | trip0: 32GB cards are also very slow | 01:12 |
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| RST38h | The 16GB class6 A-Data felt like a logical choice | 01:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | lupine_85: root; passwd user | 01:13 |
| trip0 | yeah | 01:13 |
| trip0 | oh, where on the filesystem are the user folders like Music/ Video? | 01:13 |
| trip0 | i had a quick look in xterm but didn't find it in /home/usr | 01:13 |
| trip0 | /home/user* | 01:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer | /home/user/MyDocs/.music | 01:14 |
| lupine_85 | will that break anything? :) | 01:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope | 01:14 |
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| lupine_85 | well, done :) | 01:15 |
| lupine_85 | ta | 01:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | but also won't fix anything | 01:15 |
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| lupine_85 | it's quite annoying that I can't be lupine on my phone | 01:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, you can ssh to user | 01:16 |
| lupine_85 | maybe I should create a second user in /etc/passwd as lupine | 01:16 |
| lupine_85 | same uid/gid as user | 01:16 |
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| lupine_85 | and $HOME | 01:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmmm | 01:16 |
| * lupine_85 does | 01:17 | |
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| lupine_85 | ooh, no /etc/shadow | 01:18 |
| lupine_85 | haxx! | 01:18 |
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| lupine_85 | hmm, it all seems good... | 01:20 |
| lupine_85 | yep. now I can log in without specifying the username :) | 01:21 |
| lupine_85 | ooh, wow, and it's bash 2.0 | 01:22 |
| lupine_85 | well, 2.05b | 01:22 |
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| Klowner | I asked earlier and nobody knew, buuuuuut, does anyone know of any examples or documentation which might lead me in the right direction to create a small daemon app which has a custom config section in the system config app? | 01:24 |
| Klowner | I've found a good example for the config part, but from what I can tell those are only loaded momentarily and then unloaded when the settings app is closed | 01:24 |
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| dregin | I assume the config widgets are just modifying system config files? | 01:25 |
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| dregin | why do you need a daemon to run? | 01:25 |
| RST38h | By the way, gentlemen and ladies: http://www.google.com/reader/play/ | 01:25 |
| Klowner | dregin: attempting to make a decent google latitude updater, I've got the guts of it written and I just need to maemoify it | 01:25 |
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| Klowner | so, a small app which listens to GPS fix events and then sends them to google, and a config frontend so the user can set their update interval and login creds | 01:26 |
| javispedro | is the "system settings app" the "hildon control panel"? | 01:27 |
| Klowner | err, yes | 01:27 |
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| Klowner | "Settings", the thing that pops up when you hit the little wrench icon | 01:27 |
| javispedro | i'd make the control panel applet toggle gconf settings, | 01:27 |
| javispedro | and the daemon listen to those settings. | 01:27 |
| Klowner | that sounds like a good idea | 01:28 |
| Klowner | so all I need to determine now is how to start/stop the daemon | 01:28 |
| javispedro | most probably it needs a status bar applet | 01:29 |
| Klowner | oh that's an idea too | 01:29 |
| javispedro | since it doesn't do much work the daemon could probably be entirely contained in a status bar applet / hildon-home process. | 01:29 |
| dregin | check other init.d scripts to see how they run their services? | 01:30 |
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| lupine_85 | dude, all my XMPP is going over IPv6 now! | 01:32 |
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| RST38h | Ok, this Reader Play thing really hates vertical layout | 01:32 |
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| javispedro | this reader play thing doesn't load here =) | 01:33 |
| RST38h | loads fine here | 01:34 |
| javispedro | I need a more ... uh, liberal browser. | 01:34 |
| RST38h | MicroB? | 01:36 |
| lupine_85 | fennec? | 01:36 |
| lupine_85 | actually | 01:37 |
| RST38h | nooooooo | 01:37 |
| javispedro | no, maxton. | 01:37 |
| lupine_85 | Is there a page that talks about reducing memory usage on this thing? | 01:37 |
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| dregin | define:"this thing" | 01:38 |
| mikkov | javispedro: did you try tuxracer? | 01:39 |
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| javispedro | mikkov: yeah, the interface rendering seems broken, but the game plays fine :) | 01:39 |
| javispedro | thanks! | 01:39 |
| mikkov | would you be interested in fixing it? ;) | 01:40 |
| javispedro | heh :) | 01:40 |
| mikkov | there's another gl game I have no tomatoes (and gltron) | 01:41 |
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| RST38h | mikkov: btw, pupnik has found a really cool space battle game, that reguires gl | 01:42 |
| javispedro | I cannot imagine what can cause this broken layout :) | 01:42 |
| RST38h | mikkov: Would you be interested to look at it? | 01:42 |
| Lumpio- | Wait a minute, how does that google reader thing work | 01:43 |
| RST38h | Actually there are several (http://freegamer.blogspot.com/2006/06/open-source-3d-space-games.html) but No Gravity is the one pupnik has found | 01:43 |
| Lumpio- | Where is it getting its data from o_O | 01:43 |
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| shinkamui | hey | 01:45 |
| shinkamui | can anyone tell me if nas-central.org is down | 01:45 |
| shinkamui | or is it just a routing problem here | 01:45 |
| burchr | http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/nas-central.org | 01:45 |
| shinkamui | thanmks burchr didn't know about that | 01:46 |
| shinkamui | quite handy :) | 01:46 |
| burchr | :) | 01:46 |
| mikkov | RST38h: I'll take a look, but the screenshot looks too complex already :) | 01:46 |
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| RST38h | mikkov: Well, pupnik sweared they made that thing work on iPhone | 01:48 |
| uhsf | is there a Maemo version for x86 processors? or any way to run Maemo on a PC? | 01:48 |
| RST38h | mikkov: Oolite is written in ObjectiveC, so it is kinda no-go, but the rest might work | 01:49 |
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| RST38h | uhsf: Why? | 01:49 |
| mikkov | RST38h: http://www.nogravitythegame.com/ doesn't look like open source | 01:50 |
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| uhsf | RST38h: because i have a micropc and i would like to use maemo on it | 01:50 |
| RST38h | uhsf: Try Moblin. Or Ubuntu mobile edition. | 01:50 |
| dotblank3_ | 9.10 UNR is a fine distro | 01:51 |
| uhsf | i could've thought of this myself any other suggestions? | 01:51 |
| mikkov | http://sourceforge.net/projects/nogravity/ look better | 01:52 |
| RST38h | mikkov: http://www.nogravitythegame.com/classic/linux.html | 01:52 |
| uhsf | i don't like ubunutu and moblin never really caught on that's why it gets merged with maemo | 01:52 |
| RST38h | they list a cvs url | 01:52 |
| RST38h | uhsf <-- apparently somewhat confused | 01:52 |
| * javispedro watches a set of SCREEN_HEIGHT = 480 defines in tuxrace | 01:52 | |
| uhsf | RST38h: confused how? | 01:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lupine_85: http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space | 01:54 |
| ptl | is there any way to tell Hildon Application Manager to update all things that need updating? | 01:54 |
| burchr | yes | 01:55 |
| lupine_85 | DocScrutinizer: I'm more interested in RAM than rootfs | 01:55 |
| burchr | click title bar when it's listing updates | 01:55 |
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| burchr | 'update all' | 01:55 |
| ptl | how? | 01:55 |
| ptl | oh, thanks | 01:55 |
| burchr | :) | 01:55 |
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| josephnexus | hi everyone | 02:13 |
| josephnexus | i've got my n900 now | 02:13 |
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| josephnexus | just finished running all of the updates | 02:13 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:13 |
| josephnexus | i love over the air updates | 02:13 |
| josephnexus | makes life easy for me | 02:13 |
| josephnexus | any hints on getting my gps to be happy though? | 02:14 |
| josephnexus | it doesn't seem to be connecting... | 02:14 |
| raster | josephnexus: i hope you have an unlimited data plan then :) | 02:14 |
| josephnexus | i'm on my wifi right now | 02:14 |
| josephnexus | and i will have an unlimited data plan when I get my sim card | 02:15 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:15 |
| josephnexus | right now it's just wifi though | 02:15 |
| josephnexus | but it doesn't seem to be finding the gps | 02:15 |
| raster | aaaah not sure "ota" .... is used for wifi based updates. - as a term | 02:15 |
| raster | though technically... it is "over the air" (no wires) | 02:15 |
| josephnexus | it tries for a while and then says it couldn't find it | 02:15 |
| josephnexus | :-p | 02:15 |
| raster | ota has been used primarily for updates via the phone network itself :) | 02:15 |
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| josephnexus | oh well | 02:16 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:16 |
| josephnexus | either way... it says no gps signal | 02:16 |
| josephnexus | am I missing something? | 02:16 |
| raster | for gps - go outside | 02:16 |
| josephnexus | or is my house (all wood) some sort of barrier for gps? | 02:16 |
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| raster | and dont be next to tall buildings ( > 2 storeys) | 02:16 |
| raster | yes | 02:16 |
| raster | it can be a barrier | 02:16 |
| raster | you need a clear view of the sky | 02:16 |
| josephnexus | should I be concerned when i'm in my car? | 02:17 |
| raster | gps signal is very weak | 02:17 |
| * josephnexus wants to use the gps for car navigation... | 02:17 | |
| josephnexus | is that possible? | 02:17 |
| raster | thats why peole put them on the dashboard under the front windshield | 02:17 |
| raster | but yes - if you stick it on the back seat | 02:17 |
| raster | or next to the gearbox gps will suffer or maybe drop out completely | 02:17 |
| raster | also rememebr "getting a gps lock" requires "better signal" than continues operation | 02:18 |
| raster | basically your gps unit is trying to download a chunk of data htat ius beamed very weakly, and slowly by all satellites | 02:18 |
| josephnexus | ah, so getting the lock is more difficult than maintaining it yes? | 02:18 |
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| josephnexus | doesn't this have agps? | 02:18 |
| raster | it has to piece this all together to know what to do | 02:18 |
| josephnexus | which helps with that? | 02:18 |
| raster | as such the data is sent in a loop - it may take a few minutes to loop around | 02:19 |
| raster | if you "miss sections" u cant ask for a re-transmit | 02:19 |
| raster | u have to wait until the next loop around | 02:19 |
| raster | so having any interruption in signal while gettign a lock is going to cause trouble and it may take many minutes or even hours to get a lock | 02:19 |
| josephnexus | hmm | 02:19 |
| josephnexus | but once it has it? | 02:19 |
| raster | i dont know if it has agps | 02:19 |
| raster | once it has a lock - it works better | 02:20 |
| raster | indoors you'll likely ifnd your accuracy drops - or gps singal drosp too if far enough inside | 02:20 |
| josephnexus | ok | 02:20 |
| raster | the worse the signal (fewer satellites) the less accurate gps gets | 02:20 |
| josephnexus | but outside or on my car dash it should be ok? | 02:20 |
| josephnexus | i know that | 02:20 |
| josephnexus | :-p | 02:20 |
| raster | eg it may then only be able to give a location within 500m | 02:20 |
| raster | car dash should be ok | 02:21 |
| raster | i guess | 02:21 |
| josephnexus | ok | 02:21 |
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| lupine_85 | speaking of which - is there anything (OSM-based?) I can replace Ovi Maps with? | 02:21 |
| raster | btw - ovi maps on the n90 download maps as u go | 02:21 |
| raster | just like google maps | 02:21 |
| raster | so u'll need a working data connection for it | 02:22 |
| raster | and a big enough data quota :) | 02:22 |
| lupine_85 | ovi maps almost got me lost in london | 02:24 |
| lupine_85 | "this way to your hotel!" | 02:24 |
| lupine_85 | lying thing | 02:24 |
| lupine_85 | well, let's see if it can direct me to my *yawn* bed | 02:24 |
| trip0 | lupine_85, navit? | 02:25 |
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| ptl | na'vit is the navigator from the movie Avatar | 02:30 |
| ptl | they used to locate these giant smurfs | 02:30 |
| ptl | and their GPS-blocking tree | 02:31 |
| * ml-mobile gets the ELC2010 announcement e-mail | 02:31 | |
| ml-mobile | but I really want to attend the collaboration summit | 02:32 |
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| josephnexus | i've got unlimited | 02:39 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:39 |
| josephnexus | so data shouldn't be a prolem | 02:39 |
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| josephnexus | my only concern is that i'll mostly be on EDGE | 02:49 |
| pupnik | nice of us military to share gps | 02:49 |
| josephnexus | :-( | 02:49 |
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| josephnexus | so i get to go at a mighty 12KBps | 02:50 |
| ptl | If I got a good 3G coverage I'd also get unlimited | 02:50 |
| uhsf | i'd like to have meegoo now it sucks that maemo only runs on arm and not x86 | 02:50 |
| josephnexus | my son has hijacked my phone and is watching the wiggles on youtube | 02:51 |
| josephnexus | (he's almost 3) | 02:51 |
| trip0 | lol | 02:51 |
| ptl | uhsf: with intel taking part on this, it'll surely run on x86 shortly | 02:51 |
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| josephnexus | he thinks the touch interface is nice | 02:51 |
| josephnexus | and better than a mouse | 02:51 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:51 |
| ptl | uhsf: specially considering that meego will inherit the base part (kernel, base infrastructure) more from moblin than maemo | 02:52 |
| raster | resistive touch tho is pretty horrible | 02:52 |
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| ptl | josephnexus: doesn't he have dirty fingers? 3 years old use to have | 02:52 |
| josephnexus | yes, but it comes with a clothe | 02:52 |
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| trip0 | heh | 02:52 |
| josephnexus | and i'm getting a protective, alex proof, coating | 02:52 |
| ptl | and I have oily skin which makes me have greasy fingers, I don't like touch interface that much -- I tend to use the stylus | 02:53 |
| trip0 | ptl, agreed | 02:53 |
| trip0 | i also do the same | 02:53 |
| trip0 | when i can... | 02:53 |
| josephnexus | shhh.... my son doesn't know about the stylus | 02:54 |
| ptl | lol | 02:54 |
| josephnexus | and i don't want to have it lost within 4 hrs of having the phone | 02:54 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 02:54 |
| trip0 | josephnexus, i'm more afraid he'll get used to the sylus and grab a pen to start drawing on the screen | 02:54 |
| trip0 | my son is also almost 3 | 02:54 |
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| josephnexus | another good reason for the coting | 02:54 |
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| josephnexus | :-P | 02:54 |
| trip0 | coating? | 02:54 |
| trip0 | where can one get this? | 02:54 |
| josephnexus | we have a few wacom tablets, so he's learned better than to use actual pens | 02:55 |
| ptl | pdair.com and other places | 02:55 |
| ptl | ebay.com | 02:55 |
| josephnexus | they are like 5 dollars from amazon.com | 02:55 |
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| josephnexus | and i'll be getting the rubberized shell too | 02:55 |
| ptl | I ordered that | 02:55 |
| corecode | so could the n900 usb port play serial port and connect this to a ttyUSB? | 02:55 |
| ptl | but it takes a long time to get here in Brazil | 02:55 |
| trip0 | coating == clear overlay? | 02:55 |
| josephnexus | yes | 02:55 |
| ptl | trip0: I ordered the rubber coating and the screen protector, but they are different things | 02:55 |
| raster | josephnexus: bah. referring to the sensitivity - being able to drag things without using your fingernail | 02:56 |
| josephnexus | i haeven't had a problem thus far | 02:56 |
| josephnexus | but maybe i have exceptionally pointy fingers | 02:56 |
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| raster | josephnexus: have you use capacitive based devices much? | 02:56 |
| josephnexus | like the iPod and such? | 02:56 |
| raster | ipod touch - for example. yes | 02:57 |
| josephnexus | yeah... it's different | 02:57 |
| trip0 | raster, yes, and capacitive based devices get greasy too fast | 02:57 |
| josephnexus | and it was nice... but i'm not seeing a usability difference here | 02:57 |
| raster | trip0: as to resistive ones - if you use figners too. | 02:57 |
| trip0 | yes, but i can use my finger nail | 02:57 |
| raster | at least ic ant lose the stylus for a capacitive device | 02:57 |
| trip0 | and/or a stylus | 02:57 |
| ml-mobile | raster: yes you can | 02:57 |
| ptl | raster: but at least with resistive screen you have other options - like fingernails or stylus | 02:58 |
| trip0 | it's hard to lose your finger nail | 02:58 |
| ml-mobile | not as easily, but you can | 02:58 |
| raster | and frankly - i have had both - capacitive is day vs night compared to resistive | 02:58 |
| ptl | it might be for you | 02:58 |
| ptl | but that's not universal | 02:58 |
| trip0 | and when you do lose your finger nail, it's usually painful enough that you won't do it again | 02:58 |
| raster | with resistive i have to remember to /lock/turn off screenbefore putting it in my pocket | 02:58 |
| ptl | for me, resistive is much better than capacitive | 02:58 |
| corecode | yea | 02:58 |
| raster | i HAVE to use fingernail (or stylus) - stylus is just a pain to get out all the time - so it's moot | 02:59 |
| corecode | can use it with gloves | 02:59 |
| corecode | <3 at -2C | 02:59 |
| raster | and even with fingernail i need to keep pressure on | 02:59 |
| ml-mobile | raster: I wouldn't be able to use the rather tiny UI elements in Xchat :( | 02:59 |
| trip0 | lol | 02:59 |
| trip0 | so true | 02:59 |
| raster | ml-mobile: thats a xchat ui issue :) | 02:59 |
| trip0 | also true | 02:59 |
| trip0 | links in web pages | 02:59 |
| ptl | some people's asses are more finger-friendly than xchat | 02:59 |
| raster | a stylus while on a bus bumping down a rough road is not going to work with that ui either | 03:00 |
| ml-mobile | I'd rather have tiny elements and more display space than a capacitative screen though | 03:00 |
| trip0 | to each their own | 03:00 |
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| ml-mobile | sorta, but most vendors don't release multiple models | 03:02 |
| josephnexus | they all have pros and cons | 03:02 |
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| raster | i'd stick with the capacitivie cons | 03:03 |
| raster | just the whole pocket-pressing is insanely annoying | 03:03 |
| raster | capacitive fixes that baby | 03:03 |
| raster | and for things liek scrolling around with a drag - its a world of difference | 03:03 |
| trip0 | i've never had to worry about the n900 in my pocket | 03:04 |
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| trip0 | i've never had an issue tapping the on/off button a few times to lock it either. | 03:05 |
| ptl | me too | 03:05 |
| trip0 | my nexus on the other hand, will never stay clean | 03:05 |
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| trip0 | and swipe gestures seem "sticky" on my nexus | 03:06 |
| raster | trip0: having to actually lock it is the issue | 03:06 |
| raster | as opposed to just "shove it into pocket" | 03:06 |
| trip0 | well, i hate having to unlock it as well | 03:07 |
| trip0 | but almost all capacitive phones have that issue as well | 03:07 |
| raster | sticky? | 03:07 |
| trip0 | oily fingers don't move as smoothly on the screen | 03:07 |
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| trip0 | as say, a stylus | 03:08 |
| trip0 | or you fingernail | 03:08 |
| raster | odd | 03:08 |
| raster | my fingers slide like a baby's bottom over this screen | 03:08 |
| raster | and my skin is always super-oily | 03:08 |
| trip0 | it's a simple thing to prove. wed your finger, dry it slightly, go drag it on a dry window | 03:08 |
| trip0 | s/wed/wet* | 03:08 |
| trip0 | now take another really dry finger, drag it on the window | 03:09 |
| trip0 | which one has more resistance? | 03:09 |
| raster | so not oily | 03:09 |
| raster | u mean dry? | 03:09 |
| trip0 | in my experience, if both surfaces are dry, they move better | 03:10 |
| raster | doesnt matter to my finger | 03:10 |
| trip0 | what phone do you have? | 03:10 |
| Lumpio- | Stop dipping your finger into butter | 03:10 |
| raster | wet, dry, oily - all slides like a babies bottom | 03:10 |
| Lumpio- | It's not healthy | 03:10 |
| trip0 | Lumpio-, i love my french fries | 03:10 |
| raster | Lumpio-: hahahah | 03:10 |
| raster | and yes - a findernail hs less resistance | 03:11 |
| raster | by no stickiness issue | 03:11 |
| trip0 | raster, it could just be the nexus' screen that i have issues with | 03:11 |
| raster | maybe | 03:11 |
| trip0 | if it was resistive though, i could work around it | 03:11 |
| raster | this is some other phone device that doesnt have a name | 03:11 |
| trip0 | i don't seem to have the stickiness issue doing the same thing on this n900 | 03:11 |
| trip0 | feels smoother | 03:12 |
| raster | maybe the nexus1 surface is just odd | 03:12 |
| trip0 | raster, are you testing somethign secret? | 03:12 |
| raster | i'm not testing - developing directly for it | 03:13 |
| trip0 | oooOoo | 03:13 |
| raster | for/on | 03:13 |
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| raster | ie not just taking pre-made thing and slapping something orthogonal/separate on top | 03:13 |
| raster | working on its core | 03:13 |
| ml-mobile | Bada? | 03:14 |
| * raster sighs | 03:14 | |
| trip0 | lol | 03:14 |
| raster | no | 03:14 |
| trip0 | Bada is the n900+1? | 03:14 |
| raster | i'm getting bored of explaining it | 03:14 |
| raster | bada is not linux | 03:14 |
| raster | it is not even an os - it is middleware on top of nucleus (an RTOS) | 03:14 |
| raster | it has nothing to do with linux, x11, or enlightenment | 03:14 |
| raster | and nothng to do with me | 03:14 |
| ml-mobile | Oh, so it's even more worthy of being ignored :) | 03:15 |
| raster | yes | 03:15 |
| trip0 | anyone have a bh-905? | 03:15 |
| raster | people who come up with whatever crap that says enlightenment or linux is involved are clueless rumor-mongers who happily invent fiction of their own for their amusement. | 03:16 |
| raster | stuff i work on sits on a normal linux - with glibc, xserver and so on. :) | 03:16 |
| ds3 | but rumors make life so much more interesting | 03:17 |
| raster | the n900 is an interesting device in that it is pretty much a "rough and slow prototype" to me - but something i can have out in public :) | 03:17 |
| ml-mobile | raster: what, the Freerunner not unsightly enough for you? | 03:18 |
| ml-mobile | lol | 03:18 |
| raster | ml-mobile: n900 is unsightly enough thanks :) (no offence! it is better than a freerunner...) | 03:18 |
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| * ml-mobile waves at qgilN900 | 03:19 | |
| raster | but the n900 is rather bulky. i'm a bit baffled why the screen didnt slide up further for kbd access/size.. but hey... it is what it is :) | 03:19 |
| haltdef | meh, smaller than a htc universal | 03:20 |
| haltdef | not bulky :> | 03:20 |
| ml-mobile | raster: structural integrity of the slide mechanism was my first thought, the TyTN II and touch pro 2 scare me | 03:20 |
| raster | software-wise it needs some polishing still - the gl-es side is still rather rough i'd say. | 03:20 |
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| josephnexus | yeah... the software could use some polishing, but it's good | 03:21 |
| raster | ml-mobile: sure - though i think it could slide up more... but hey - i am sure there are arguments on why it can't etc. etc. and in the end its a tradeoff -f giving mroe kbd space vs structural solidity. i'd lean to more space... but hey... :) a good mt-capable capacitive screen means a vkbd is more than doable | 03:22 |
| raster | haltdef: bulky is all relative... and in my world of relatives... it's bulky . :) | 03:22 |
| ml-mobile | virtual keyboards are another issue entirely :) | 03:22 |
| raster | sure. compared to: http://www.oaktreeent.com/web_photos/Telephones/SouthWestern_Bell_Motorola_Brick_Cell_phone_web.jpg ..... it's not bulky :) | 03:23 |
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| raster | ml-mobile: sure. vkbd's need to be more than just a dumb array of buttons u press on a screen. but u need mt to be able to do them properly to begin with | 03:23 |
| raster | as reality is that youy end up pressing 21 keys at once | 03:23 |
| raster | ie next key is pressed before previous is released | 03:24 |
| raster | (unless u type very slowly and deliberately or with just 1 finger) | 03:24 |
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| ml-mobile | my problem is that they occupy screen space period, a hardware keyboard was one of the big selling points for the N900 to me | 03:25 |
| raster | in addition unless the screen is massive - u need some kind of guessing/correction going on - and that has to now make assumptions on input - eg that u are typing i n english (and thus use a dictionary lookup) etc. | 03:25 |
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| pupnik | id like a 5" screen | 03:26 |
| ptl | I had a 5" screen | 03:26 |
| ptl | On my HTC Athena | 03:26 |
| ptl | I used it as a cellphone during 2 years. | 03:27 |
| pupnik | good? | 03:27 |
| ptl | Had to buy pants with extra large pockets | 03:27 |
| ptl | well | 03:27 |
| ptl | not really. Though it was good for reading ebooks. | 03:27 |
| raster | the htc hd2 is probably about as good as it gets there with 4.3" | 03:27 |
| raster | these days | 03:27 |
| raster | bhtat baby is not a small device | 03:27 |
| raster | :) | 03:27 |
| * raster wouldnt mind a 4-5" super amoled screen | 03:28 | |
| raster | super amoled absolutely poops all over any lcd i have seen. | 03:28 |
| raster | they are massively thinner in construction | 03:28 |
| raster | brigher.. and black is... BLACK | 03:28 |
| raster | at all angles | 03:28 |
| raster | u actually have no idea the screen is on | 03:29 |
| raster | no backlight to come on - ever | 03:29 |
| ml-mobile | yup | 03:29 |
| raster | u run x - u have to check ps to make sure its runniong as otherwise my screen just doesnt change | 03:29 |
| ml-mobile | well | 03:29 |
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| raster | anyway | 03:29 |
| raster | gorgeous screen tech. | 03:29 |
| raster | u go back to lcd and you go "aaaagh ... nasty" | 03:30 |
| ml-mobile | what's the difference between the AMOLED in the Nexus One and super amoled? | 03:30 |
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| raster | amoled is better | 03:30 |
| raster | hmm | 03:30 |
| raster | samsung has a good set of examples | 03:30 |
| pupnik | lower power use ? | 03:30 |
| josephnexus | it's not letting my change my lock code | 03:31 |
| josephnexus | is there a default on the n900? | 03:31 |
| raster | no | 03:31 |
| raster | just amoled done better | 03:31 |
| raster | http://www.unwiredview.com/2010/02/14/display-wars-samsung-wave-super-amoled-vs-google-nexus-one-nokia-x6-samsung-s8000/ | 03:31 |
| raster | there | 03:31 |
| raster | nexus one vs super amoled | 03:31 |
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| raster | the pics speak for themselves | 03:32 |
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| raster | http://tamsblackberry.tamoggemon.com/content/2010/February/thasuperamoled/samsung-super-amoled.jpg | 03:37 |
| raster | that image also nicely shows... black is black | 03:37 |
| raster | and with lcd.. ymmv depending on angle :) | 03:37 |
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| pupnik | wow | 03:39 |
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| raster | pupnik: oh yeah. oled will also suck much less power - especially if u stick to blacks :) | 03:45 |
| pupnik | that would be fun with xterm | 03:46 |
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| shinkamui | I dont get the joke raster | 03:48 |
| shinkamui | oh | 03:48 |
| shinkamui | blacks as in black colors | 03:48 |
| pupnik | how about a lynx webpage previewerr in irssi? would save me battery | 03:48 |
| raster | shinkamui: it wasnt a joke. and yes. we are talking about color here... on a screen. not race. :) | 03:49 |
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| raster | man i hate political correctness - look what it's doing. it means u cant have a conversation about screens and colors without it being taken as something racial because you talk about black. :/ | 03:49 |
| raster | :) | 03:49 |
| shinkamui | sorry raster, didn't mean to come off like a jerk | 03:50 |
| raster | what has the world come to :) | 03:50 |
| shinkamui | I live in Louisiana right now | 03:50 |
| raster | shinkamui: nah - u didnt. i'm more mumbling about the general state of things | 03:50 |
| shinkamui | and its been a wake up call from my nice sheltered life in Massachusetts | 03:50 |
| pupnik | i want darker blacks | 03:50 |
| raster | where saying "stick to blacks" and that it even CAN be taken as something other than its actual literal meaning | 03:50 |
| raster | anyway | 03:51 |
| raster | u didnt come off as a jerk - dont worry... i | 03:51 |
| raster | i'm just sighing at the general situation - that's all. :) | 03:52 |
| raster | talking about screens here... so no need to worry about racism :) | 03:52 |
| shinkamui | lols | 03:52 |
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| shinkamui | well | 03:53 |
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| pupnik | tbh n810 and n900 colors seem quite nice to me | 03:53 |
| shinkamui | speaking of black | 03:53 |
| shinkamui | my N900 is treating me bad | 03:53 |
| raster | screens have whites, blacks and colors. ... yellows too... :) | 03:53 |
| shinkamui | I go treally frustrated a week ago and pulled out my iphone | 03:53 |
| shinkamui | after 5 days I almost smashed it | 03:54 |
| shinkamui | god the iphone sucks | 03:54 |
| shinkamui | so Im reflashing, but I was hoping to wait out the meego or pr 1.2 release | 03:54 |
| raster | pupnik: compared to super amoled... no comparison. super amoled wipes the floor clean. and then kicks the lcds on the n8/9xx while they are still knocked out | 03:54 |
| raster | in real life next to eachother... | 03:54 |
| haltdef | shinkamui! | 03:54 |
| shinkamui | hey brudda | 03:54 |
| shinkamui | what are you doing here :) | 03:54 |
| shinkamui | did you get an N900? | 03:55 |
| haltdef | end of the month :P | 03:55 |
| shinkamui | sweet | 03:55 |
| shinkamui | you can help me test my apps :) | 03:55 |
| haltdef | what apps | 03:55 |
| shinkamui | blender | 03:56 |
| shinkamui | and kamuIRC | 03:56 |
| shinkamui | right now | 03:56 |
| haltdef | I'm a bit concerned about the battery life | 03:56 |
| haltdef | might be worth getting the 2400mah extended battery | 03:56 |
| shinkamui | yea | 03:57 |
| haltdef | make the device as thick as my htc universal :P | 03:57 |
| shinkamui | I want that battery | 03:57 |
| shinkamui | but I can make it through the day easily with the standard battery | 03:57 |
| shinkamui | with moderate -> heavy use | 03:57 |
| haltdef | that's good | 03:57 |
| shinkamui | and thats moderate to heavy | 03:59 |
| shinkamui | not heavye | 03:59 |
| shinkamui | heavy | 03:59 |
| shinkamui | also depends on if you keep pushmail active | 03:59 |
| shinkamui | that worked my battery down quite a bit | 03:59 |
| haltdef | I don't use that :p | 03:59 |
| shinkamui | battery life with wifi always on and connected is way better than the iBone 3gs with wifi turning off every time the device sleeps | 04:00 |
| shinkamui | if that helps guage it | 04:00 |
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| haltdef | my x1 struggled today, 6 hours of mp3 playing solid killed it | 04:01 |
| haltdef | 3G was on though | 04:01 |
| shinkamui | haha | 04:01 |
| haltdef | will disable cellular entirely tomorrow | 04:01 |
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| crashanddie | don't allow the battery to drain | 04:23 |
| crashanddie | if you allow it to drain you kill it | 04:24 |
| pupnik | mmh how low crashanddie | 04:27 |
| crashanddie | dunno | 04:27 |
| crashanddie | I usually make sure it doesn't shut down | 04:27 |
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| GAN900 | crashanddie, face better yet? ;) | 04:30 |
| crashanddie | GAN900: both eyes are open :) | 04:30 |
| hflak | can madde be used to compile kernel modules? | 04:31 |
| pupnik | what happened crashanddie | 04:32 |
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| crashanddie | pupnik: read the logs, can't be bothered to explain again | 04:33 |
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| pupnik | get well soon crashanddie | 04:43 |
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| hflak | starting from scratch, what is the fastest way to get a kernel module compiled for n900 kernel? | 05:04 |
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| ml-mobile | Maemo SDK | 05:05 |
| ml-mobile | grab the VM that is ready to go | 05:05 |
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| ml-mobile | apt-get the kernel source | 05:05 |
| ml-mobile | copy in the RX-51 config | 05:06 |
| ml-mobile | enable the module you want, then | 05:06 |
| ml-mobile | make modules | 05:06 |
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| hflak | ml-mobile: thanks | 05:08 |
| hflak | I'm currently d/ling Nathans vpc image | 05:09 |
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| hflak | after its booted up I know I hafta run some scripts that will pull in the sdk binaries | 05:13 |
| hflak | but how do I go about apt-getting the kernel source | 05:14 |
| hflak | and what does it mean to copy in the RX-51 config and enable the module | 05:15 |
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| hflak | this is what I want to compile: http://compcache.googlecode.com/files/compcache-0.6.2.tar.gz | 05:16 |
| hflak | I was thinking that all I need to do is extract it into the SDK, and then just run make | 05:16 |
| hflak | is there more to it? | 05:16 |
| crashanddie | hflak: yes, we know any code on the interwebs by heart | 05:18 |
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| crashanddie | hflak: feel free to use our brain as your on-demand debugger | 05:18 |
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| luke-jr | hflak: haha. no. | 05:19 |
| * hflak needs major helpage | 05:20 | |
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| luke-jr | hflak: hope you at least have N900 | 05:23 |
| hflak | i do | 05:24 |
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| hflak | I wanted to install build-essential on the device, but it was gonna take up 75 megs | 05:25 |
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| ml-mobile | that's nothing compared to a kernel build | 05:32 |
| Klowner | yay, lil' latitude daemon works | 05:34 |
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| ptl | what about using masquerading on the N900? | 05:43 |
| ptl | from wifi to the 3G connection | 05:43 |
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| tripzero | anyone know what the app is called for the ovi maps? | 05:46 |
| tripzero | trying to see if I can x11 forward it over ssh | 05:46 |
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| GAN900 | tripzero, it's rendered by Gecko. | 05:59 |
| shinkamui | anyone have weave working properly? | 06:00 |
| shinkamui | for me it constantly wont stay connected | 06:01 |
| tripzero | GAN900, how do i launch it via the terminal? | 06:01 |
| GAN900 | nokia-maps | 06:02 |
| tripzero | kk | 06:03 |
| tripzero | will try | 06:03 |
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| tripzero | oh hmm | 06:04 |
| tripzero | didn't forward it over ssh... | 06:04 |
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| tripzero | i wonder if they force it onto DISPLAY :0.0 | 06:07 |
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| sulx | hmm would it be possible to create eg. script which checks if device is connected to specific WLAN and mounts nfs share according to it? =) | 06:37 |
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| Andrewfblack | blwthompson, you around | 06:38 |
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| lcuk | sulx, nice :) im pondering something similar at the moment for knowing my device is "home" or at "work" :) | 06:45 |
| lcuk | or other places with beacons | 06:45 |
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| josephnexus | hi everyone | 07:10 |
| josephnexus | i think I may have found an interesting bug | 07:10 |
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| josephnexus | i go to my mail (an IMAP server) | 07:10 |
| josephnexus | and my messages show | 07:10 |
| josephnexus | i tap the message | 07:10 |
| josephnexus | it slides over, says updating, and then slides back without ever showing me the message | 07:11 |
| josephnexus | anyone else experience this? | 07:11 |
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| josephnexus | no message or reason given | 07:19 |
| josephnexus | any ideas? | 07:19 |
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| lcuk | josephnexus, is it only specific folders or messages that do this | 07:36 |
| lcuk | or is it with everything | 07:36 |
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| lcuk | and has it only just started to do this, or is this the first time you are trying it and it failed | 07:37 |
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| Klowner | hrmm, all I have left to do is put text inputs and a checkbox into this hildon config plugin | 07:40 |
| lcuk | yeah, what things does it configure? | 07:41 |
| Klowner | user/pass, update interval, and 'make updates' checkbox | 07:41 |
| lcuk | so you want to enter users on startup of your phone? | 07:42 |
| Klowner | er, no, just a thing to add your google account credentials in the settings area | 07:43 |
| Klowner | then plop the values into gconf and I'm all set | 07:43 |
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| josephnexus | lcuk: seems to be everything that isn't my sent items | 07:51 |
| josephnexus | and it has only started doing this | 07:51 |
| josephnexus | i was using the mail just fine for a few hrs | 07:51 |
| lcuk | perhaps this time you could just try rebooting, my evolution on desktop sometimes does similar | 07:52 |
| lcuk | it gets its knickers in a twist with the server | 07:53 |
| lcuk | i just meh and restart | 07:53 |
| lcuk | it seems to come back | 07:53 |
| josephnexus | i powered up and then powered on the phone | 07:54 |
| josephnexus | same thing | 07:54 |
| josephnexus | i think i found the issue though | 07:54 |
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| josephnexus | it appears my quota had been reached, so I have increased my quota (i forgot i had set a 200 MB limit, and 3GB of mail won't fit in that) | 07:54 |
| josephnexus | since I was using pop, but am now using imap | 07:54 |
| josephnexus | :-p | 07:54 |
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| josephnexus | so maybe it was trying to do a temp thing or my server was throwing fits because no space was left and my desktop was still trying to force feed it | 07:56 |
| josephnexus | :-P | 07:56 |
| josephnexus | anyways... talk w/ you all later | 07:56 |
| josephnexus | loving the device so far | 07:56 |
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| Klowner | bleh, I should sleep, at least I found dialog->vbox, now just have to determine what widgets are of the fancy text input sort | 08:12 |
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| Klowner | woo, 13KB deb file | 08:30 |
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| Stskeeps | morning | 09:14 |
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| Flyser | Hi, The N900 scans for images in my music directory and shows all my cover art in the Photos application. is there anything I can do to prevent this? | 09:35 |
| asj- | Flyser: chmod 000 all the jpgs? | 09:36 |
| Flyser | but then the music player wont show them? | 09:36 |
| asj- | yeah more than likely, why not just add them as coverart to the id3 tags? | 09:37 |
| Stskeeps | jebba: ping | 09:37 |
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| ShadowJK | The use of "just" there :) | 09:42 |
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| Flyser | sorry, I got disconnected. Did anyone answer` | 09:51 |
| Flyser | asj-: ↑ | 09:51 |
| asj- | yeah more than likely, why not just add them as coverart to the id3 tags? | 09:51 |
| Flyser | because my desktop player doesn't support that | 09:51 |
| Flyser | desktop player = music player on my desktop | 09:52 |
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| asj- | but your desktop player supports jpgs? then add them, and remove the jpgs on the n900. Kinda lame but <sigh> | 09:52 |
| Flyser | really lame ... | 09:53 |
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| Flyser | Isnt it possible to tell tracker to index some directory only for music? | 09:54 |
| asj- | or you can fix the desktop client ;) | 09:54 |
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| asj- | Flyser: don't get me started on tracker | 09:54 |
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| LiraNuna | how come I can't enter a capital letter as the first letter? | 10:05 |
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| ShadowJK | Do you have autocap on and thus by pressing shift cancel caps on first letter? | 10:08 |
| LiraNuna | hmm | 10:09 |
| LiraNuna | yeah, that's it | 10:09 |
| LiraNuna | meh; | 10:09 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:18 |
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| X-Fade | Morning | 10:20 |
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| jebba | Stskeeps: pong | 10:29 |
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| Stskeeps | jebba: you just used fbdev in your fedora stuff right? | 10:36 |
| Stskeeps | as in, xorg driver | 10:36 |
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| jebba | uh, yes? | 10:38 |
| Stskeeps | k | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | just checking :P | 10:39 |
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| Coke | Hello. What is the default text editor? | 10:49 |
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| Coke | I cannot find vi, emacs, nano or the one called leafpad anywhere | 10:49 |
| dregin | there's a graphical one | 10:50 |
| Coke | ok. | 10:50 |
| dregin | not sure if there's any CLI | 10:50 |
| Coke | any names I can search for? | 10:50 |
| Coke | it doesnt have to be, as long as I can start it from my terminal | 10:50 |
| dregin | apt-get install vim | 10:50 |
| dregin | :) | 10:50 |
| dregin | one sec | 10:50 |
| ShadowJK | vi is preinstalled atleast, and vim in the repos | 10:50 |
| Coke | I've looked in the app manager it does not have vim | 10:50 |
| dregin | open the terminal and try running it? | 10:51 |
| ShadowJK | do you have maemo.org repository enabled? | 10:51 |
| Coke | oh yeah, vi is | 10:51 |
| dregin | I'm sure only a fraction of the apps running on the phone are actually listed in the app manager | 10:51 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: no, what is it and why isnt it enabled by default? it sounds good. | 10:51 |
| ShadowJK | I think it's enabled by default in firmware 1.1.1 | 10:52 |
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| Coke | Yeah it is | 10:52 |
| Coke | Just found it | 10:52 |
| Coke | "fremantle" | 10:52 |
| ShadowJK | right | 10:52 |
| Coke | so, where can I get this leafpad? | 10:52 |
| Coke | vi is cool and all, but it's difficult to use with the small keyboard | 10:52 |
| dregin | I've gotten used to using vim with it quite well | 10:53 |
| dregin | it's really just a matter of getting used to the keyboard | 10:53 |
| Coke | WIERD | 10:53 |
| dregin | WEIRD* | 10:53 |
| Coke | if I search for "leaf" it finds it, but not "editor" | 10:53 |
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| Coke | OH, it only search on title? | 10:53 |
| dregin | you can choose what it searches in | 10:54 |
| dregin | I think.... | 10:54 |
| Coke | i dunno | 10:54 |
| dregin | hmmm | 10:54 |
| dregin | well | 10:54 |
| dregin | i'm fashionably late for work | 10:54 |
| dregin | back in a bit :) | 10:55 |
| Coke | how come sudo doesn't work properly? is it a busybox issue? | 10:55 |
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| Coke | I dont like the sudo gainroot command at all | 10:55 |
| Coke | rather have edit sudoers to restrict what user can do with sudo | 10:56 |
| ShadowJK | not busybox specific I think | 10:56 |
| Coke | Ok. maemo specific? | 10:56 |
| Coke | I cannot even su - to root | 10:57 |
| X-Fade | Coke: It isn't designed to be a multiuser environment. | 10:57 |
| Coke | X-Fade: does it run in single user mode? | 10:57 |
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| ShadowJK | rootsh probably favors not editing system files in case a future update changes them :) | 10:57 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: apt shouldnt overwrite altered cofnigs | 10:58 |
| Coke | configs | 10:58 |
| ShadowJK | exactly | 10:58 |
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| ShadowJK | Not sure how big a role apt has in doing the updates anyway | 10:59 |
| Coke | I would pressume they use only apt | 10:59 |
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| Coke | why would they use another method? apt has worked for 10+ different operating systems since the late 90's to update and upgrade systems | 11:00 |
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| ShadowJK | lol | 11:00 |
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| ShadowJK | I guess you haven't discovered maemo yet ;) | 11:01 |
| Coke | no, got it like a week ago and I didnt even unpack it until last night | 11:01 |
| Coke | but apt seems to be used for everything else | 11:01 |
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| Coke | I would be very surprised if they would go like "yeah, apt works 100% of the time, is exactly designed for this, but let's reinvent the wheel, write a new apt-like software, but that will mess the apt installs up badly enough for the user to lose all data" | 11:02 |
| TigerTael | haha | 11:02 |
| ShadowJK | h-a-m shuts down much of the system for upgrade, so that the number of files in use would be minimal, so that disk space doesn't run out.. when you update via apt, I dont think it does that | 11:03 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: actually, my firmware update looked exactly like when I install applicatinos | 11:03 |
| Coke | the only difference was that after it was done it rebooted automatically | 11:03 |
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| Coke | Considering that apt has upgraded systems on 12+ different architectures for nearly 2 decades I would be very surprised if maemo devs didnt find it satisfying | 11:04 |
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| ShadowJK | have you discovered the dependency package yet? :D | 11:04 |
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| Coke | What is it? | 11:05 |
| Coke | I could ofcourse be dead wrong. | 11:05 |
| mece | Oolite! | 11:05 |
| Coke | Because, as I see all the time when developing for WinCE and Win32; programmers are stupid animals | 11:06 |
| ShadowJK | mp-pr-fremantle-geneirc or something like that.. depends on specific versions on all the packages in the base system | 11:06 |
| Coke | if somehow the microsoft stupid animal programmer is working at nokia they might indeed have reinvented the wheel, only made it square | 11:06 |
| ShadowJK | if you for example replace busybox with gnu tools it gets uninstalled and you get no more firmware upgrades :) | 11:06 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: ofcourse not | 11:06 |
| Coke | that's a dependency thing and not at all surprising | 11:07 |
| Coke | The packages are conflicting | 11:07 |
| Coke | The firmware update requires busybox to be installed. It's the same in all apt-based dists | 11:07 |
| Coke | Can't have the cake and eat it, my friend. | 11:07 |
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| Coke | poorly designed "all-in-one" dists (like ubuntu) do that all the time with stuff like pulseaudio, HAL, etc | 11:08 |
| Cervajz | Hi guys | 11:08 |
| Cervajz | I have problem with video recording on my N900. Movies doesn't have a proper "end". VLC shows me some length of video, but when I change position close to end, the vido playing ends | 11:10 |
| Coke | Cervajz: some videos have intervals | 11:11 |
| Cervajz | Sry for my English | 11:11 |
| fcrozat | nokia UI guy who chose comobox for selecting a specific date in calendar application should be shot | 11:11 |
| Coke | Cervajz: is it like this with all videos? | 11:11 |
| Coke | fcrozat: indeed | 11:11 |
| Coke | when I was opted to update time and date upon starting the phone for the first time I was like "if this continues like this I'll go brazil and shoot them myself. it will be for a good cause" | 11:11 |
| ShadowJK | in Maemo4 there was a calendar for selecting date :/ | 11:11 |
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| fcrozat | Coke: it is probably the first calendar application not using a calendar to choose a date.. You don't have any way to know which day of the week it is.. | 11:12 |
| fcrozat | ShadowJK: inded :( | 11:12 |
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| Coke | fcrozat: however, keep this in mind | 11:12 |
| Coke | THe guys who designed the maemo UI are not UI designers | 11:12 |
| Coke | They are programmers. | 11:12 |
| ShadowJK | It's the hype, swishing and swooshing is all the rage | 11:12 |
| Coke | Have you seen some of the stuff programmers have done for linux lately? | 11:12 |
| fcrozat | Coke: I doubt that.. | 11:12 |
| ShadowJK | Coke: actually there were actual UI designers involved | 11:12 |
| Coke | Aside from compiz, most WM's are pretty fucking horrible from a normal user's perspective | 11:13 |
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| Coke | ShadowJK: I dont think so | 11:13 |
| ShadowJK | and when the Programmers tried to make it sane, the UI designers said NO | 11:13 |
| Coke | Because not only is the UI 1/1000 of what android and iphone provides, but the actual design of the phone itself is flawed | 11:13 |
| Coke | Ok, lemme rephrase, when I say UI designer I mean like the ones who designed Android and iPhone | 11:13 |
| Coke | the ones who are good at what they do and actually research human behavior when interfacing technology | 11:14 |
| Coke | It's also the fault of the testers. If I would have tested this I would have filed it as "broken/bug" | 11:14 |
| ShadowJK | if you look at the bugzilla there are many bugs that can't be fixed because fixing it would break the UI Spec, and the UI Designers don't read bugzilla :( | 11:14 |
| Coke | All that is going to be history when meego replaces maemo | 11:14 |
| Coke | Like, the list of design problems and errors made in maemo is HUGE. | 11:15 |
| Coke | might as well restart. | 11:15 |
| Coke | but it's still a linux phone with a fudging terminal..... mmmm... terminal! | 11:15 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: for a consumer it matters little who's to blame, really | 11:15 |
| Coke | All they'll see is this barely usable, buggy phone. My mom isn't easily convinced by terminals and remote X capability. | 11:16 |
| ShadowJK | atleast now they brought the people tha design the phone, and the people that make the software, into the same division instead of being separate :) | 11:16 |
| Coke | i dunno | 11:16 |
| Coke | normally UI designers should be kept as far away from programmers as possible, IMO | 11:16 |
| ShadowJK | I meant the hw and sw people | 11:17 |
| Coke | if they are good, they should know as little about the code behind and just set the requirements from a user's perspective | 11:17 |
| Coke | ah | 11:17 |
| Coke | Yeah. | 11:17 |
| Coke | the HW is outstanding | 11:17 |
| lcuk | actually, no you are wrong Coke. ui/ux designers must be involved with the developers - its no use UX outlining certain unrealistic technically prohibitive goals, and the designers can learn to find what comes easily and naturally on a device | 11:18 |
| Cervajz | Coke: Hm, it looks like problem with VLC. Everything is OK in QuickTime player | 11:18 |
| Cervajz | Sorry for that | 11:18 |
| ShadowJK | the UI designers who said the proper way to switch away from a fullscreen app is to open the camera lid, and close the camera program that autostarts... | 11:18 |
| Coke | lcuk: i disagree. if the UI isn't technically sound it probably isn't sound from a user's perspective either | 11:18 |
| Coke | lcuk: look at Apple | 11:18 |
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| Coke | their UI designers didn't give a shit "what was possible" they said "this is the most efficient way to solve it for the user" | 11:18 |
| ShadowJK | luckily they conceded to have ctrl-backspace, or then it was snuck in :) | 11:18 |
| Coke | then it's up to the development team to make those UI specs without compromising tech quality. sometimes things get rejected. | 11:19 |
| lcuk | Coke :) you think that only applies to apple | 11:19 |
| Coke | lcuk: it certainly doesnt apply to Nokia, Microsoft, etc | 11:19 |
| Coke | Well, google might have actually hired in some good guys for android | 11:19 |
| lcuk | :) | 11:19 |
| Coke | lcuk: yeah, theres a good example | 11:19 |
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| ShadowJK | Coke: wanna bet even if MeeGo is made sane and usable, companies will "differentiate" it to unsane and silly for their devices? :) | 11:23 |
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| Coke | Damn split | 11:24 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: no, i dont think so | 11:25 |
| Coke | I'm hoping it will be even more "linuxy" | 11:25 |
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| Coke | like, a complete linux system that just happens to run a DE adapted for each type of phone hw | 11:25 |
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| ShadowJK | Yeah but corporations and operators just can't resist to "improve" things by letting a grizzly with friggin lasers run over it atleast once :) | 11:27 |
| ShadowJK | Like all those different android UIs, and the mess of some devices having store, some not having the android store, etc | 11:28 |
| tybollt | argh | 11:28 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: it's ok | 11:28 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: you can still always replace the default DE | 11:28 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: android is uber locked | 11:29 |
| tybollt | is there a way to prevent the phone from going to "pick language, region etc" when I change sim cards in my n900? | 11:29 |
| Coke | Meego will always be freeeee! | 11:29 |
| tybollt | Atleast so for "known" (prior used) ones? | 11:29 |
| ShadowJK | Let's hope there'll be many untivoized devices :) | 11:29 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: what is that? | 11:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: huh? they joined SW devels and EE department? | 11:29 |
| ShadowJK | docscrutinizer: It's "Maemo Devices" now | 11:31 |
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| khertan | Hi ! | 11:31 |
| * DocScrutinizer should definitely move his lazy arse and write an application then | 11:31 | |
| DocScrutinizer | so next device won't end up with a flawed USB port or similar annoyance | 11:32 |
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| ShadowJK | Well.. afaiu they either had to have working otg from start, or no otg, and working otg depended on lots of kernel work due to omap errata, and they didn't want to miss christmas | 11:34 |
| tybollt | ShadowJK: boo | 11:35 |
| tybollt | ShadowJK: Meego devices! | 11:35 |
| Coke | DocScrutinizer: what is wrong with the USB? | 11:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | all appreciated. Still you probably could have done better at least wrt errata | 11:35 |
| ShadowJK | but it's hard to know, people talk about otg and get otg replies... when in fact all that (99%) care about is usb host mode | 11:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | exactly | 11:36 |
| TigerTael | Hrm, why can't I find the pixelpipe plugin in the app manager? | 11:36 |
| Coke | The only complaint I might have with the USB is that it could be bigger | 11:36 |
| * ShadowJK has never used OTG on N810, but often used host mode :) | 11:36 | |
| Coke | the micro USB sockets tend to get damaged easily | 11:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: aiui N810 has no OTG at all | 11:36 |
| ShadowJK | the sockets themselves are more durable than miniusb, but it turns out the weakest link is at the pcb :) | 11:37 |
| Coke | and unlike iPhone users I don't consider my phone a deity to which I pledge my homage | 11:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | ack | 11:37 |
| ShadowJK | docscrutinizer: oh? I thought it automagically switched with the right cable | 11:37 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: what's a pcb? | 11:37 |
| ShadowJK | circuit board | 11:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: still no full OTG | 11:37 |
| TigerTael | Oh, OVI store | 11:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | tbh I dunno | 11:38 |
| ShadowJK | cables are impossible to find anyway... | 11:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep :-( | 11:38 |
| ShadowJK | but female-female usb adapters are plentiful | 11:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | missing ID pin | 11:39 |
| ShadowJK | wtf is up with that, what would people use them for | 11:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | no idea | 11:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | x-modem host? | 11:40 |
| tybollt | ShadowJK: lesian usb adapters, now we're talking... | 11:40 |
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| Coke | Is it OK to modify the symlinks in rcN.d directories to change the startup daemons? | 11:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer | you'll learn on next boot :-P | 11:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | please report :-) | 11:42 |
| ShadowJK | we're awaiting your results eagerly :) | 11:43 |
| Coke | I meant more like "does Easy debian use some magic tool to alter services?" | 11:43 |
| * DocScrutinizer feels like getting a second device, for messing around (aka development) | 11:44 | |
| Coke | does it ever run in other runlevels than 2? | 11:44 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: "" | 11:44 |
| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: but zero cash. | 11:45 |
| ShadowJK | I tried that with N8x0, didn't work | 11:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | same here :-/ | 11:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | duh, why? | 11:45 |
| ShadowJK | Somehow I was using both so much I still didnt dare mess around | 11:46 |
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| tybollt | is there an app/plugin/widget that gets me the date displayed in the bar where the clock is displayed? | 11:46 |
| SpeedEvil | Coke: easy debian does nothing - AFAIK - it simply runs it in a chroot | 11:46 |
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| * DocScrutinizer makes notice to upgrade his spare N810 before the public infra is vanishing :-P | 11:47 | |
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| ShadowJK | I saw a bunch of 404 and timeouts a few weeks ago already :) | 11:47 |
| Coke | Does easy debian use tcpwrappers for allow and disallow? | 11:48 |
| Coke | SpeedEvil: what do you mean? | 11:48 |
| Coke | The sysv crap have all these symlinks in rc.d-dirs | 11:48 |
| Coke | actually its not sysv, but thats the way debian does it | 11:49 |
| Coke | in the olden age the only way to change startup was to symlink and rm your way through 6 runlevels | 11:49 |
| Coke | later some dists added the "service" command to manage this horrible mess | 11:49 |
| Coke | others, like the grand fantastic archlinux, use just one textfile to manage runlevels | 11:49 |
| Coke | I did rm /etc/rc2.d/S55ssh manually just now | 11:50 |
| Coke | wondering if there's an easier way | 11:50 |
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| lupine_85 | argh. Being a teredo relay requires me to run BGP | 11:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: well I guess a dd from one to the other should do mostly | 11:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Coke: chroot is a method of running programs in an alternate filesystem root. | 11:52 |
| SpeedEvil | Coke: easy debian as far as I understand does this. It does not touch the original root filesystem. | 11:53 |
| ShadowJK | i think it has some extra stuff going on | 11:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | Coke: there are cmdline dedicated tools to manage services in init.d | 11:53 |
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| Coke | DocScrutinizer: which are.... | 11:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | forgot the name | 11:54 |
| Coke | because that was my question: what to use for managing the services | 11:54 |
| ShadowJK | debian has update-rc.d or something like that.. | 11:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's insserv, but I guess it's not applicable for maemo | 11:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | for centos there are other service manager tools, which I used 2 weeks ago... forgot :-P | 11:55 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: and what file does it read from in order to know how to update it? | 11:56 |
| ShadowJK | no idea | 11:56 |
| Coke | Hello!!! Don't you guys even use for your phones? :) | 11:56 |
| * Coke haven't actually used his n900 as a phone yet | 11:56 | |
| * DocScrutinizer sighs | 11:56 | |
| ShadowJK | I did conside making openvpn start automatically, got to the point you're at and thought "meh, only start it once a month anyway I can do that manually" | 11:57 |
| * ShadowJK is lazy | 11:57 | |
| Coke | ShadowJK: normally managing services is easy | 11:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer | RSA host key for 192.168.1.30 has changed and you have requested strict checking. ½€“n¶↓ ¶€¬””¬³ł½¼²¼²@@@!! :-((( | 11:58 |
| ShadowJK | there was a controlpanel addon in maemo4, but I never tried it there either :) | 11:58 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: meeh | 11:59 |
| tybollt | 1.2 | 11:59 |
| tybollt | PR | 11:59 |
| tybollt | lalala | 11:59 |
| Coke | Why not simply have the services command available? | 11:59 |
| Coke | Also, Debian have some weird naming and packaging policies | 11:59 |
| lupine_85 | weird? | 11:59 |
| Coke | apache, python etc | 12:00 |
| Coke | The rationale being "I was high on crack when I came up with this sh*t" | 12:00 |
| * DocScrutinizer yawns on 43th update of flashlight | 12:00 | |
| * ShadowJK nominates Coke to port "services" or an equivalent :P | 12:00 | |
| Coke | ShadowJK: it sort of sucked. | 12:00 |
| Coke | Also, I'm pretty sure easy debian has some way of doing it | 12:01 |
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| lcuk | coke, you seem very eager to find fault, whats your background if i might ask? (ie are you a win developer, hacker, manager etc) | 12:02 |
| ShadowJK | update-rc.d [-n] name start|stop NN runlevel [runlevel]... . start|stop NN runlevel | 12:02 |
| Coke | lcuk: hacker | 12:02 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: yay | 12:02 |
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| Coke | lcuk: basically, when I run linux I install about 50M worth of software as "default" | 12:03 |
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| Coke | After that I install every package with great selectivity, configure it manually by editing files and then setup my system | 12:03 |
| lupine_85 | the only debianisms that I find weird are grub2 and exim | 12:03 |
| Coke | lupine_85: apache too | 12:03 |
| Coke | and Python | 12:03 |
| lupine_85 | what's wrong with them? | 12:03 |
| Coke | lupine_85: overly complex for no gain | 12:04 |
| Coke | and there's no rationale as to why they should be that complex | 12:04 |
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| ShadowJK | are there no manpages in easy-debian? | 12:04 |
| Coke | I can fit the Python packaging policy of archlinux on ONE line | 12:04 |
| * ShadowJK has never tried easydebian :P | 12:04 | |
| Coke | The debian policy is like 10+ pages | 12:04 |
| lupine_85 | can't comment on python particularly, but the apache stuff is handy enough | 12:04 |
| Coke | lupine_85: no it's not. :) | 12:04 |
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| Coke | the upstream method is better | 12:04 |
| * lupine_85 senses a difference of opinion | 12:04 | |
| Coke | lupine_85: indeed. | 12:04 |
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| Coke | I can live with exim4 being fudged in debian, but not Python | 12:05 |
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| Coke | our platform here is Python running on multiple types of linux | 12:05 |
| lupine_85 | you should see what they've done to rubygems ;) | 12:05 |
| lupine_85 | although that's fair enough. rubygems are evil to begin with | 12:05 |
| Coke | lupine_85: fudged up too? | 12:05 |
| Coke | ok. | 12:05 |
| lupine_85 | they're not where the upstream puts them | 12:05 |
| lupine_85 | but upstream do weird stuff | 12:05 |
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| Coke | the Python upstream module policy is this: all importable modules and their support libraries go into $PREFIX/python$VERSION/site-packages/ | 12:06 |
| Coke | done | 12:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | wtf? flasher ON MAEMO native? o.O | 12:06 |
| Coke | one line. | 12:06 |
| Coke | now read http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ | 12:06 |
| Coke | and weep | 12:06 |
| ShadowJK | Docscrutinizer: and people brave/innocent enough to use it! | 12:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 12:06 |
| Coke | Why have they done this you may ask? To save a few k's of data to avoid multiple installs of the same python module | 12:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: recursion: ->see recursion | 12:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | [dict entry] :-P | 12:07 |
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| ShadowJK | I think the most useful it can do is flash new kernel | 12:08 |
| * lupine_85 reads | 12:08 | |
| Coke | lupine_85: here's what the maintainer responded in my written complaint "if you're on a embedded system and you have multiple versions of Python those kilobytes of data are precious" | 12:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | actually I humbly dare to doubt it even can do that | 12:08 |
| ShadowJK | Coke: so maemo bind-mounts /usr/python* into /opt ;D | 12:09 |
| ShadowJK | docscrutinizer: but there are a few alternative kernels in extras-devel! | 12:09 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: the problem is not where Python and it's modules are, the problem is that Debian employs a HUGE extra library with installation checks, version comparison functionality etc | 12:09 |
| Coke | ShadowJK: and it spread out the libraries and over 20+ directories instead of 1 | 12:09 |
| lupine_85 | *shrug* a lot of those pages are declaring how the python packages interact with apt | 12:09 |
| Coke | lupine_85: no | 12:10 |
| Coke | check out the module section | 12:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | great, and now how am I supposed to use flasher ON MAEMO to flash a kernel to the device named maemo is running on? | 12:10 |
| Coke | lupine_85: it's such a mess that I had to replace ALL my Debian servers with Slackware | 12:10 |
| lupine_85 | chapter 2? | 12:10 |
| Coke | And I've been a debian-only user sinec 97 | 12:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | USB loopback? virtual NOLO? | 12:11 |
| ShadowJK | docscrutinizer: magic! | 12:11 |
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| ShadowJK | i think it needs fiasco images instead of z or uImages.. | 12:12 |
| Coke | lupine_85: check out python-support and python-central | 12:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | honestly now - is flasher able to flash NAND directly rather than via USB? | 12:12 |
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| Coke | In any case, they add python-support and python-central modules in case someone with limited space (yet insisting on bloating with multiple versions of Python) would want to save a few kilobytes to NOT install the same module twice | 12:13 |
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| Coke | lupine_85: and, we use 3 different versions of Python for our full platform and it's a fudging nightmare to manage it on Debian | 12:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | directly here menas: let's write to /dev/xyz | 12:13 |
| Coke | lupine_85: keep it simple does not exist on Debian any more. in fact, I think it's part of the policy to make things as complex as possible | 12:14 |
| Coke | lupine_85: the best response I've ever gotten from a Debian devel was "the guy makes a valid point" | 12:15 |
| Coke | lupine_85: but a geek may never admit to being wrong, so there we are | 12:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~ $ flasher --query-rd-mode | 12:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | flasher v2.8.2 (Jan 18 2010) | 12:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | Suitable USB device not found, waiting. | 12:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrfffffffffffffffffffffttttttttzzzzzzz | 12:16 |
| lupine_85 | heh. like I say, python's not exactly my area of expertisze | 12:16 |
| lupine_85 | I should probably change that | 12:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~ $ uname -a | 12:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | Linux IroN900 2.6.28-omap1 #1 PREEMPT Thu Dec 17 09:40:52 EET 2009 armv7l unknown | 12:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | muhahahahaha | 12:17 |
| Veggen | DocScrutinizer: don't remember all the details, but follow the procedure *exactly* when flashing. Down to "when to be plugged in", when to start flasher, etc. | 12:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | and then they save 64k on kernel msg buffer | 12:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | Veggen: Idoupt I will achieve to plug my N900 to itself | 12:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | I doubt | 12:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | due to missing hostmode for USB, I even doubt I could flash *another* N900 by using flashor on mine | 12:20 |
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| lupine_85 | does flasher use a file of some sort (/dev/*?) to write the data? | 12:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | [2010-03-11 11:12:36] <DocScrutinizer> honestly now - is flasher able to flash NAND directly rather than via USB | 12:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer | [2010-03-11 11:16:05] <DocScrutinizer> Suitable USB device not found, waiting. | 12:21 |
| satmd | well, given the fact that you can do upgrades ota | 12:22 |
| satmd | yes? | 12:22 |
| asj- | lupine_85: no, it uses libusb or something similar which is /proc/bus/usb | 12:22 |
| lupine_85 | fair enough | 12:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | asj-: seems herd to access the own device's NOLO bootloader this way | 12:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | hard* | 12:24 |
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| asj- | DocScrutinizer: <shrug> | 12:25 |
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| jaafar | has anyone tried to import a .vcs file into the calendar app? I tried simply renaming it to .ics - no luck (error message was not informative) | 12:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~ $ ls -l `which flasher` | 12:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 66036 Jan 18 16:07 /usr/bin/flasher | 12:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~ $ file `which flasher` | 12:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | /usr/bin/flasher: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, ARM, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.14, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), stripped | 12:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer | 66k not even optified useless crap - no? | 12:27 |
| asj- | DocScrutinizer: you're trying to have the n900 flash itself? | 12:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | I doubt that's possible | 12:28 |
| asj- | DocScrutinizer: it isn't... | 12:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | still I wonder what that flasher executable might be for | 12:28 |
| lcuk | doesnt the kernel update require self flashing | 12:29 |
| asj- | oh you found it | 12:29 |
| asj- | probably what lcuk said? | 12:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: yep, but *is* flasher used for that? and if so: how? | 12:30 |
| burchr | fwiw, I fixed my problem with my three sim | 12:30 |
| burchr | it was a case of stupid user error | 12:30 |
| burchr | I had the 3g/2g switcher app installed before flashing | 12:30 |
| asj- | burchr: you get a read mobile provider/ ;) | 12:30 |
| burchr | I had switched my phone to 2g.. | 12:30 |
| asj- | sorry j/k | 12:30 |
| burchr | and it stayed that way after reflash | 12:30 |
| burchr | and three sims don't work with 2g mode/phones, so! | 12:30 |
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| ShadowJK | docscrutinizer: well the kernel .deb's must contain scripts for self-flashing.. | 12:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: that's about as far as my thinking got right now. But I'm no .deb wizard | 12:33 |
| asj- | DocScrutinizer: ar | 12:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer | well, I'm hoping for somebody else looking into that :-P As I first had to even find where and how to dl a kernel.deb | 12:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer | basically I'd at best file a bug "flasher has borked useless --help on maemo" | 12:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | as I stubled over it while looking for something completely different | 12:37 |
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| tybollt | kernel.deb? | 12:43 |
| tybollt | wtf? | 12:43 |
| tybollt | are you mad? | 12:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | # Command to used to obtain list of FIASCO image contents | 12:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | CMD_FLASHER_LIST="/usr/bin/flasher -F" | 12:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | /sbin/fiasco-image-update | 12:44 |
| * lupine_85 builds miredo for maemo | 12:45 | |
| DocScrutinizer | # Command to actually flash images | 12:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | CMD_DO_FLASH="/usr/bin/flasher --local -f -F" | 12:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | --local is the magic word :-D | 12:46 |
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| lupine_85 | :) | 12:46 |
| satmd | :P | 12:46 |
| lupine_85 | woo, it compiles. ship it! | 12:46 |
| ptl | what's miredo? | 12:47 |
| lupine_85 | teredo tunnel client | 12:47 |
| lupine_85 | once that's installed, I should have IPv6 over Voda's 3G network | 12:47 |
| lupine_85 | then my phone will always have IPv6 available | 12:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehe | 12:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~ $ flasher --local --query-rd-mode | 12:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | flasher v2.8.2 (Jan 18 2010) | 12:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | Could not connect to '127.0.0.1' | 12:48 |
| lupine_85 | /then/ I can run mobile IPv6 on it and it'll always have the same IP | 12:48 |
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| ptl | oh | 12:48 |
| ptl | nice | 12:48 |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: having fun? :) | 12:48 |
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| ptl | miredo - Teredo IPv6 tunneling through NATs | 12:48 |
| ptl | miredo-server - Teredo IPv6 tunneling server | 12:48 |
| lupine_85 | furthermore, it'll be a globally-routable unicast IP | 12:48 |
| lupine_85 | good for openssh-server ;) | 12:49 |
| cehteh | lupine_85: do you have flatrate? | 12:49 |
| lupine_85 | I don't really know | 12:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: actually yes :-) | 12:49 |
| cehteh | i mean ping6 -f your phone could be costly :) | 12:49 |
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| lupine_85 | I think it comes with some GB included with the contract | 12:49 |
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| lupine_85 | and given how miredo and mobile IPv6 works, I can easily block abusive peers at the ipv6 server | 12:50 |
| * cehteh just openvpn's to the home network, v4 still, | 12:50 | |
| * DocScrutinizer considers testing of rootfs flashing --local :-P | 12:50 | |
| lupine_85 | cehteh, the problem with that is when you switch from, say, wlan to 3g, all your TCP connections get broken | 12:50 |
| cehteh | not here | 12:51 |
| pupnik | ?? | 12:51 |
| lupine_85 | I'd love to know how you do that | 12:51 |
| cehteh | openvpn .. with improved setup, the default setup sux | 12:51 |
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| cehteh | handover time from wlan to mobile and back is about 10 secs or so | 12:52 |
| * ShadowJK uses openvpn to his server for seamless wlan/3g/2g switching | 12:52 | |
| cehteh | ShadowJK: with the stock setup? .. that never worked for me | 12:52 |
| lupine_85 | do you have your config up anywhere? | 12:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | mind publishing the related config files, dude? | 12:52 |
| ShadowJK | no not stock | 12:52 |
| lupine_85 | snap ;) | 12:52 |
| cehteh | hehe | 12:53 |
| cehteh | well there are some more hacks .. ifup scripts, dnsmasq stuff and so on | 12:53 |
| lupine_85 | yum, "hacks" | 12:53 |
| lupine_85 | :) | 12:53 |
| ShadowJK | and hacks on the serverside... | 12:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | even better reason to drop it on the wiki | 12:54 |
| cehteh | not really | 12:54 |
| cehteh | well dont make a too small keepalive timeout, that kills i learned :P | 12:54 |
| ShadowJK | my setup isn't full in that only irc and http go through vpn, rest breaks | 12:54 |
| lupine_85 | yeah, mobile ipv6 actually works transparently | 12:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | booo | 12:54 |
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| ShadowJK | I'm missing the ifup hacks :) | 12:55 |
| cehteh | i dont gateway normal traffic only traffic directed to my home network .. hey i dont want to stuff all through my 384k upstream dsl | 12:55 |
| cehteh | i am considering to setup a 2nd vpn endpoint on my server for gating web traffic | 12:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, why not? | 12:56 |
| cehteh | but no need so far | 12:56 |
| ShadowJK | I'd need thingy to replace default gateway to go through vpn, and full nat on the server | 12:56 |
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| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: haah .. dont forget it has to pass that twice | 12:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | I got a server box, fat connection | 12:56 |
| cehteh | yeah i have a biggier server | 12:56 |
| ShadowJK | yeh, mine's at leaseweb.. | 12:56 |
| cehteh | but dont really need it | 12:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | PUBLISH! | 12:57 |
| cehteh | lol | 12:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | bugger | 12:57 |
| lupine_85 | if you like, I'll publish my IPv6 setup once it's finished | 12:57 |
| lupine_85 | all it'll need is a server somewhere with IPv6 | 12:57 |
| ShadowJK | as far as openvpn goes, I'm using the "static-home.conf" example from their website :P | 12:58 |
| ShadowJK | squid and irssi on server listening on vpn ip | 12:58 |
| lupine_85 | mm, that's not good enough for me :) | 12:58 |
| lupine_85 | I use lots of XMPP, for example | 12:58 |
| * cehteh send a bug report (improvement) to the openvpn package about using dnsmasq, but they rejected it because if security reasons, which is partially true, but i dont care much if a dns query goes outside the vpn | 12:58 | |
| DocScrutinizer | lupine_85: hmm, I actually never checked if mine is IPv6 | 12:58 |
| lupine_85 | most 'real' ISPs will have IPv6 connectivity as an option, at least | 12:59 |
| * lupine_85 works for one of them ;) | 12:59 | |
| cehteh | sometime next i think about setting up a dns tunnel (tcp in dns) .. and establish openvpn over that | 12:59 |
| cehteh | that should go thrugh almost any wifi hotspot :) | 12:59 |
| flux | how about simply setting up openvpn over udp in the dns port? | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehehe | 13:00 |
| ShadowJK | I originally set it up just to get seamless irc.. :) | 13:00 |
| flux | heard it works pretty decently as well | 13:00 |
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| ShadowJK | on my n810 | 13:00 |
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| cehteh | ShadowJK: i'm using bip as proxy now .. that makes irc extremely seamless .. xchat on laptop and n900 connected to the same session | 13:00 |
| ShadowJK | what's bip? | 13:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: you fixed the backlog timestamp issue for bip? | 13:01 |
| cehteh | an irc bouncer which allows this 2 clients on one connection thing | 13:01 |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: i dont have backlog enabled | 13:02 |
| tybollt | muahaha | 13:02 |
| tybollt | ircbouncers | 13:02 |
| * tybollt gets nostalgia flashbacks :D | 13:02 | |
| DocScrutinizer | tybollt: huh? | 13:02 |
| cehteh | since my irc clients always run, and i do normal logging no real need | 13:02 |
| tybollt | doc: ^^^^^ | 13:02 |
| cehteh | tybollt: rather useful tools | 13:02 |
| tybollt | yes | 13:03 |
| tybollt | I remember having to use those before :) | 13:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: how's your N900 irc client supposed to *always* have connectivity? | 13:03 |
| tybollt | you run your irssi in a shell someplace | 13:03 |
| tybollt | bada-bing | 13:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | bah | 13:03 |
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| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: why not, really? | 13:04 |
| cehteh | i dont like irssi (because of perl only extensibility) | 13:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | xchat here | 13:04 |
| wazd | just checked new symbin ^3 demo. boooring :( | 13:04 |
| tybollt | DocScrutinizer: oh... then that's a whole other issue ;) | 13:04 |
| nid0 | boring but usable and works | 13:04 |
| tybollt | wazd: is the UI anywhere close to Hildon? | 13:04 |
| * ShadowJK runs irssi on server, irssiproxy module loaded making irssi double as bouncer, xchat on * connected to thst | 13:04 | |
| cehteh | DocScrutinizer: wlan or mobile network .. and congestion/reconnects will be buffered by openvpn to some extent | 13:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | cehteh: PUBLISH! | 13:05 |
| cehteh | whats there to publish? .. thats just the normal way it works :P | 13:05 |
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| cehteh | thats the main reason i set up openvpn for .. for secure things i use ssh anyways .. | 13:06 |
| cehteh | but yet alone getting peristent tcp connections is priceless | 13:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | what to publish? a "VPN mini howto" | 13:07 |
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| ptl | aaaaah | 13:07 |
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| ptl | ending my work today | 13:07 |
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| ptl | going home. | 13:07 |
| ptl | feels good! | 13:08 |
| cehteh | uhm .. the openvpn website and its manual is all you need :P | 13:08 |
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| lupine_85 | znc is a pretty good irc bouncer | 13:11 |
| mtd | is anyone with an n900 has 30 seconds and feels generous enough to confirm the (minor) bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7834 , please could they open an Xterm and run: | 13:12 |
| povbot | Bug 7834: modest dbus interface does not support SendReceive method call | 13:12 |
| cehteh | i used dircproxy before .. but it didnt had this dual client feature | 13:12 |
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| mtd | dbus-monitor --session& ; dbus-send --print-reply --dest=com.nokia.modest /com/nokia/modest | 13:12 |
| mtd | com.nokia.modest.SendReceive | 13:12 |
| mtd | ...and confirm they see "error_name=org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.UnknownMethod" ? | 13:12 |
| cehteh | modest has bug .. i'm shocked :) | 13:12 |
| mtd | cehteh: <shrug> :) | 13:12 |
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| lupine_85 | haha, ipv6 on my phone must be working. SIP just stopped connecting | 13:15 |
| lupine_85 | (asterisk doesn't support sip on ipv6 for some reason) | 13:15 |
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| crashanddie | omfg | 13:23 |
| * crashanddie falls in love with xcode | 13:23 | |
| khertan | haha | 13:24 |
| khertan | it s well designed code editor isn't it | 13:24 |
| khertan | i love it too | 13:24 |
| khertan | and the designer is awesome ! | 13:24 |
| lcuk | crashanddie, i almost misread that as you fell in love iwth X-Fade :D | 13:25 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: yeah, maybe not :P | 13:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer | mtd: [ERR]: No introspection data at object /com/nokia | 13:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | with mdbus2 | 13:36 |
| *** hrw|gone is now known as hrw | 13:38 | |
| hrw | morning | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | moo | 13:38 |
| hrw | DocScrutinizer: lot of nokia objects do not have introspection | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~lart nokia objects | 13:39 |
| * infobot whips out his power stapler and staples nokia objects's foot to the floor | 13:39 | |
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| Karlosos | hey people | 13:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | hey | 13:45 |
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| Karlosos | hey speedevil | 13:48 |
| spectre- | @ digital africa summit | 13:48 |
| spectre- | thanked a few of the nokia execs for the n900 | 13:48 |
| Karlosos | does anyone know how to change language to english on maemoit.org its all foreign | 13:49 |
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| sobczyk | hi is there a reason why microB resolves addresses much longer than fennec? | 13:53 |
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| cehteh | you found one thing where fennec is faster then microb? :) | 13:54 |
| xorAxAx | currently microb doesnt work for me at all | 13:54 |
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| xorAxAx | so i have to use fennec | 13:54 |
| xorAxAx | might change after next reboot | 13:54 |
| cehteh | browserd crashed? | 13:55 |
| xorAxAx | so fennec is infinitely much faster than microb | 13:55 |
| xorAxAx | no idea | 13:55 |
| sobczyk | and autorotate ceased working in photo browsing and microB :( | 13:55 |
| SpeedEvil | fennec is significantly faster for me | 13:56 |
| SpeedEvil | for much. | 13:56 |
| sobczyk | though is lacks rotate and text copy | 13:56 |
| SpeedEvil | you can turn off browserd's auto-restart | 13:56 |
| cehteh | shouldv free some ram | 13:57 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 13:57 |
| tybollt | xorAxAx: How do you deduct fennec is faster than microb? | 13:57 |
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| MiXu- | Fennec is a lot slower for me O_o | 13:58 |
| MiXu- | Painfully slow to tell the truth | 13:58 |
| vesa | anyone know if there's an opengl 2.0 shader designer? | 13:58 |
| pupnik_ | on n810 maemo-launcher looks to have many processes taking 40%-100% memory... are those really the programs im running? | 13:58 |
| vesa | i've tried amds rendermonkey but i've got a nvidia 8600gts and that | 13:58 |
| vesa | doesn't really work with rendermonkey even with nvemulate =/ | 13:58 |
| pupnik_ | opengl es? | 13:59 |
| vesa | yeah preferably | 13:59 |
| xorAxAx | tybollt: read what i wrote :) | 13:59 |
| xorAxAx | tybollt: the page loading times are infinitely long for microb | 14:00 |
| vesa | opengl shader designer (typhoon labs) won't even start =/ | 14:00 |
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| lupine_85 | so, n900 with miredo and openssh-server running seems to have pretty good battery life still | 14:46 |
| SpeedEvil | ssh server running should be quite irrelevant | 14:46 |
| SpeedEvil | it will never do anything unless connected to | 14:46 |
| tybollt | lupine_85: Want to drain battery? Set up MFE :D | 14:49 |
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| F6F | hi guys | 14:55 |
| tybollt | hi girls | 14:55 |
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| ido-- | hello! anyone had mic issues with their n900 ? | 14:55 |
| Myrtti | tybollt: ♥ | 14:56 |
| tybollt | ido--: sound comes and goes when making phonecalls? | 14:56 |
| F66F | can some one link me the smothest way syncing my N900 with an Collaboration System? | 14:56 |
| TigerTael | ido--, I've not actually had a telephone conversation just yet, but my skype test sounded fine. | 14:56 |
| ido-- | urg! | 14:56 |
| lupine_85 | tybollt, MFE? | 14:56 |
| ido-- | i just got mine (from ebay), it looks new, but the mic doesnt work anywhere | 14:56 |
| tybollt | ido--: describe your problem | 14:56 |
| tybollt | ido--: _at all_? | 14:56 |
| F66F | ido--: sounds bad | 14:57 |
| F66F | *G* | 14:57 |
| TigerTael | fyl | 14:57 |
| ido-- | the mic just doenst record, not anyone can hear me when in a call | 14:57 |
| ido-- | the headphones mic does work however | 14:57 |
| tybollt | lupine_85: Mail For Exchange | 14:58 |
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| MiXu- | ido--: So the hardware is broken. Return it. | 14:58 |
| lupine_85 | :S | 14:58 |
| tybollt | Myrtti: Sorry I don't speak finnish. | 14:58 |
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| ido-- | is it 100% a hw problem ? | 14:58 |
| tybollt | ido--: I would reflash the phone before I sent it to repair - to make doubly sure it is not related to software | 14:59 |
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| ido-- | i did reflash it | 14:59 |
| ido-- | using NSU | 15:00 |
| TigerTael | ;/ | 15:00 |
| tybollt | ido--: still problematic? Yeah then go to your nokia shop and have it services | 15:00 |
| tybollt | serviced* | 15:00 |
| Myrtti | tybollt: tis ok, I speak English and I'm already taken | 15:02 |
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| tybollt | Myrtti: ORLY? | 15:03 |
| Myrtti | yarly | 15:05 |
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| alterego | I'm writing a program where I want to use gestures, I'm wondering, whether I could actually implement these gestures into X somehow, so maybe, map the browser circle gestures to emulate a scroll wheel on a mouse .. | 15:17 |
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| alterego | Thought it might benifit a lot of people if I could do that :) | 15:17 |
| alterego | ~benefit .. | 15:17 |
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| Coke | alterego: that sounds like a neet feature for any touch screen developer | 15:21 |
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| alterego | Coke: that's what I was thinking, though, I'm sure it's not trivial, I've never actually looked into X programming directly ... | 15:22 |
| TigerTael | Linear Matrix algebra will help you fit arcs. | 15:23 |
| TigerTael | 4x4 matrix | 15:23 |
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| Coke | alterego: it would be cool to have an Xorg input driver that would recognize configured gestures and emit X input events. | 15:24 |
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| Robot101 | you can do that in a client | 15:24 |
| Coke | alterego: all I could find on the web is http://blogs.gnome.org/carlosg/2010/01/29/multi-touch-support-in-linuxxorggtk/ | 15:24 |
| Robot101 | much easier than faffing around configuring a driver inside the X server | 15:24 |
| Coke | Robot101: only it would only work for that client | 15:25 |
| Coke | Robot101: an X input driver would work with all apps in X | 15:25 |
| alterego | Robot101: agreed, thanks for the heads-up. I'll look into it this weekend :) | 15:25 |
| Robot101 | well no, you could have one client recieve events and synthesize others | 15:25 |
| Robot101 | but generally, X should just deliver the actual events and let the X clients sort it | 15:25 |
| Robot101 | most gesture stuff is done at the widget set level | 15:25 |
| Robot101 | well, should be / will be | 15:25 |
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| Coke | Robot101: makes sense | 15:26 |
| alterego | Robot101: well, I want this to be available to multiple applications. I want to properly emulate the input driver, so the application would work the same on a desktop system. | 15:26 |
| Coke | alterego: with Robot101's idea each application must use gestures | 15:27 |
| Robot101 | alterego: even so, one client can send emulated input events | 15:27 |
| alterego | Yes, | 15:27 |
| Robot101 | (also; if your widget set implements gestures, the app still doesn't need to care) | 15:27 |
| alterego | Yeah, | 15:27 |
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| Coke | Robot101: would those gestures be picked up if I use the mouse pointer in X? | 15:28 |
| andre__ | is it possible in Maemo5 to receive audio over Bluetooth via SCO and route to the speakers or headset? | 15:29 |
| * andre__ never tried | 15:29 | |
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| alterego | andre__: gstreamer should be able to do most of that if not all. | 15:39 |
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| sylarpowa | hi all | 15:40 |
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| Funnyface | my N900 has arrived :) | 15:48 |
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| haltdef | nice | 15:48 |
| Funnyface | now to figure out how to open the battery cover without breaking it.. hmm.. lol | 15:52 |
| TigerTael | You just have to put your finger inside the notch and lift away. | 15:52 |
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| TigerTael | There's no catch. | 15:52 |
| burchr | Funnyface: it is a little odd, but it doesn't break | 15:52 |
| TigerTael | It's quite firm. | 15:53 |
| burchr | (I had the same worry the first time I opened mine) | 15:53 |
| TigerTael | I was worried about breaking mine. | 15:53 |
| TigerTael | Lol | 15:53 |
| Funnyface | hehe got it now | 15:53 |
| TigerTael | I didn't want to break any plastic hook/finger. | 15:53 |
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| lupine_85 | will maemo act as I'd expect (throw up a pointer on its screen?) if I associated a bluetooth mouse? | 15:55 |
| TigerTael | I have nfc, but I'm interested to know. | 15:56 |
| lupine_85 | heh. yes, the battery cover is an insane piece of engineerinh | 15:56 |
| mtnbkr | speaking of breaking battery covers, I dropped my N900 on the pavement yesterday :( | 15:57 |
| TigerTael | ouch | 15:57 |
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| burchr | mtnbkr: better the cover breaks than the n900 | 15:57 |
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| burchr | :P | 15:57 |
| Vratha | morning all | 15:57 |
| mtnbkr | all I saw were parts and dollar signs flying everwhere | 15:57 |
| pupnik_ | mwaha | 15:57 |
| TigerTael | I need a pouch/case/cover. | 15:58 |
| mtnbkr | well, it slightly cracked the corner where a wrist strap should be, and broke all the tiny clips on the back cover, but the back cover still snapped back on just not as snugly | 15:58 |
| TigerTael | :( | 15:59 |
| lupine_85 | insurance? | 15:59 |
| mtnbkr | burchr: that's for sure... sadly I had just changed from my winder jacket to my spring jacket and it jut flew out of my pcoket.. :( | 15:59 |
| TigerTael | Maybe I should consider a wrist strap. | 15:59 |
| mtnbkr | no insurance (yet) lol Need to find out where to buy spare back cover though | 16:00 |
| mtnbkr | I WISH they shipped a wrist strap with it. That was on my "to buy" list, but prolly wouldn't have helped me yesterday | 16:00 |
| lupine_85 | mine came with a wrist strap | 16:00 |
| lupine_85 | I couldn't work out how to attach it | 16:01 |
| TigerTael | Oh? | 16:01 |
| TigerTael | Oh well, I'll just have to be very careful with my phone for a while. | 16:01 |
| KMFDM | i have mine in a cheap chinese plastic rubber protector thing | 16:01 |
| TigerTael | But I need a silicone case or something. | 16:01 |
| KMFDM | which will absorb any drops | 16:01 |
| KMFDM | and they sent me a wrist strap with it for free | 16:01 |
| lupine_85 | aha, a bug report | 16:01 |
| lupine_85 | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9389 | 16:02 |
| povbot | Bug 9389: Bluetooth HID mouse support | 16:02 |
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| * mtnbkr re-checks his N900 box for the elusive wrist strap.... | 16:04 | |
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| Vratha | hmm | 16:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Table 15-40. OTG_CTRL :: Address Offset 0x0A :: bit5 DRVVBUS :: Signals the internal charge pump to drive 5 V on VBUS 0b: Do not drive VBUS. 1b: Drive 5 V on VBUS. | 16:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | is there a cmdline way to directly read/set I2C connected chips' registers? | 16:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: ^^^ | 16:14 |
| SpeedEvil | interesting. | 16:14 |
| SpeedEvil | Don't know - haven't lookes | 16:14 |
| SpeedEvil | there is an i2c* package in the repo | 16:14 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't know what it does | 16:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: thanks anyway | 16:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer | hmm, i2c-tiny-usb is all I can spot here | 16:18 |
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| SpeedEvil | yes, that's what I was thinking of | 16:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: guess it could be possible to go /sys* ? | 16:20 |
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| jensp | Hey there, can someone tell me how to reach the addon settings in firefox mobile? I can't figure it out :( | 16:22 |
| VDVsx | swipe to the right, IIRC, last time I used it | 16:23 |
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| jensp | ahh thanks, haven't been using the n900 or smartphones in general much yet, still not quite used to it :) | 16:25 |
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| bilboed-tp | anyone knows if/where oprofile is available for the n900 ? | 16:37 |
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| amigadave | bilboed-tp: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5/oprofile ? | 16:39 |
| bilboed-tp | I can't find the "tools" repository | 16:39 |
| amigadave | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5#Installation ? | 16:39 |
| bilboed-tp | yay for not having links for the obvious ? | 16:40 |
| noobmonk3y_ | yeah :( | 16:41 |
| noobmonk3y_ | some things do need to be easier to find | 16:41 |
| noobmonk3y_ | to get to the packages list i seem to have remembered a 5/6 click method :( | 16:41 |
| amigadave | how about a template for the devtools pages, with a link to installation instructions? | 16:42 |
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| karlosos | hey guys | 16:44 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | hey karlosos | 16:46 |
| noobmonk3y_ | having a good day? | 16:46 |
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| karlosos | noobmonkey how do u private message cause i cant find instructions someone showed me yesterday but i forgot lol | 16:47 |
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| satmd | /msg nick text | 16:47 |
| karlosos | yeah today is good and you | 16:47 |
| satmd | or /query nick | 16:47 |
| karlosos | thanks satmd | 16:48 |
| karlosos | i am bored need a new app to try any good ones to try out | 16:49 |
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| Vratha | intrnet | 16:50 |
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| Vratha | try that | 16:50 |
| Vratha | good web 2.0'ey things on it | 16:50 |
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| visz | you can learn about punctuation from internet | 16:50 |
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| karlosos | ok will take a look | 16:50 |
| Vratha | lol | 16:51 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | lol | 16:53 |
| noobmonk3y_ | sorry at work | 16:53 |
| noobmonk3y_ | only look every few mins | 16:53 |
| karlosos | ahh no probs mate] | 16:53 |
| noobmonk3y_ | w000p my app is only 6 days from maemo repo :D | 16:53 |
| noobmonk3y_ | 17/10 votes in so far :D | 16:53 |
| karlosos | can you say what it does yet or do i have to wait till its been oked | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | lol it's in extras-testing you are welcome to download it if you have the repo enabled :D | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | it is Healthcheck | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=45453 | 16:54 |
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| pupnik_ | what for | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | screenshots and functions on that talk thread | 16:54 |
| pupnik_ | ah | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | for the n900 lol | 16:54 |
| noobmonk3y_ | tis my very first app :D - so lots of help from qwerty, lcuk etc | 16:55 |
| karlosos | how come you cant go straight to a link on here | 16:55 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | you should be able to depends on what you are connecting to irc on | 16:55 |
| karlosos | ok right click and open in new browser just found it | 16:55 |
| noobmonk3y_ | w000p | 16:56 |
| karlosos | a phone reboot tool that would be very handy | 16:56 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | its just a button in the app - it is possible to add it to your top menu status area - not sure how though | 16:56 |
| noobmonk3y_ | does give me a message to confirm you are sure though - as before hand people hit it by accident, lol - at least it worked :D | 16:56 |
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| karlosos | to say you were new youve done pretty weel making the app | 16:57 |
| pupnik_ | shutoff device works | 16:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | hehe cheers :D - never done python, qt or linux before :D | 16:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | started this at the end of january - in which time my linux experience is this phone since december :D | 16:58 |
| noobmonk3y_ | Shows how much you can learn just from the talk forums :D | 16:58 |
| pupnik_ | yup | 16:58 |
| karlosos | i have never done any programming so i wouldnt even know where to start other than reading c++ which is hard to understand unless you have someone there to help you lol | 16:58 |
| pupnik_ | noobmonk3y_: a great example for people to follow | 16:59 |
| karlosos | yeah | 16:59 |
| pupnik_ | some structured learning is needed imo | 16:59 |
| karlosos | most definately | 17:00 |
| karlosos | theres a lot i need to learn | 17:00 |
| noobmonk3y_ | brb 2 mins | 17:00 |
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| karlosos | if i am shown i take things in a lot better but reading is def not my forte | 17:00 |
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| karlosos | i hate reading lol | 17:01 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | sorry boss is back in the office - and sits behind me! | 17:02 |
| karlosos | no probs dont get sacked lol | 17:02 |
| noobmonk3y_ | hehe - i have some experience in VB, pascal, ada, flash etc... so the basics i hope are there... but python and qt was pretty much starting over again :D | 17:02 |
| noobmonk3y_ | the pain is the starting step to actually trying to get it on the device, once i did it... it was just a case of change code, test, change code test | 17:03 |
| noobmonk3y_ | karlosos: - i'm going to try and do a very simple first timers guide to pyqt linking to examples etc - but will take some time to write | 17:03 |
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| villager | I don't suppose anyone knows how to disable those annoying IM presence sounds, they were introduced in pr1.1 and keeps making noise when the phone switches internet connection and skype reconnects | 17:05 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | hmm no idea - but i have no sounds on mine, turned em all off | 17:05 |
| noobmonk3y_ | :D - apart form the ring tome and sms tone | 17:05 |
| karlosos | i got rid of skype cause it knackered ma phone up saying can not recieve messages | 17:06 |
| karlosos | and wouldnt recieve even sms messages | 17:06 |
| amigadave | villager: Settings → Profiles → Sytem sounds → off, i think | 17:07 |
| amigadave | but that also disables useful sounds like battery low | 17:07 |
| villager | yeah I don't want to disable battery warnings | 17:07 |
| villager | hmm | 17:07 |
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| karlosos | i turn anything off with sounds apart from sms and calls cause gives me an extra 3 hours of battery | 17:08 |
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| karlosos | and its amazing how much your battery goes down when wifi is on so that wifi switch was a good app to get | 17:09 |
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| rmrfchik | E: You don't have enough free space in /var/cache/apt/archives | 17:11 |
| hrw | move it to MyDocs? | 17:12 |
| rmrfchik | ln? | 17:13 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | me to karlosos - a quiet phone is a well behaved phone :D | 17:14 |
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| rmrfchik | damn... it's rebooted during apt-get | 17:16 |
| rmrfchik | hope, it ddint' briked | 17:17 |
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| RST38h | " | 17:37 |
| RST38h | According to AppleInsider sources, iPhone firmware 4.0 will bring multitasking to the platform this summer." | 17:37 |
| bilboed-tp | FEAR | 17:38 |
| RST38h | OMG in just a few months Steve Jobs will invent multitasking! | 17:38 |
| inz | Isn't that, like, confusing to the user? | 17:38 |
| bilboed-tp | nonono, now you'll be able to quadruple-click on the home button to switch application | 17:38 |
| bilboed-tp | usability ftw | 17:39 |
| bilboed-tp | and then they'll claim they invented the Nintendo-thumb syndrom | 17:39 |
| kirma | I bet it'll be "limited multitasking" in a way or another, and still it's a thing to praise like it's best invention ever | 17:40 |
| * RST38h is sure this will become a huge selling point for iPhone over products from *other* manufacturers | 17:40 | |
| RST38h | I mean, it will be the first iPhone to offer multitasking! | 17:41 |
| inz | Other manufacturers of iPhone? | 17:41 |
| kirma | if it's not limited through magical restriction X, iphone may cough under memory/cpu load and user experience may erode! | 17:41 |
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| RST38h | kirma: Isn't this a reason to kick another few thousand apps from the app store though? | 17:41 |
| kirma | and user experience is more important than what the customer would actually want, maybe compromising even that UX | 17:42 |
| lovelyboy | hi, i got an interesting question here: if i connect a projector with n900 using tv out cable, is it possible to have the device showing screen 1 and the projector showing screen 2? | 17:43 |
| zaheerm | lovelyboy, no | 17:43 |
| RST38h | lovely: theoretically yes, practically no | 17:43 |
| kirma | without new hardware, even the latest iphone probably lacks memory to keep transitions and such bullshit nice with three arbitary apps running together | 17:44 |
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| RST38h | well the hardware is similar to N900 | 17:44 |
| RST38h | And N900 handles things relatively well (albeit not perfectly) | 17:44 |
| * noobmonk3y_ blinks | 17:44 | |
| kirma | most likely approaches could be technically limited background processing capabilities or a certification process that enforces publishers to write programs according to steve's wishes. | 17:45 |
| kirma | "relatively well" isn't good enough for jobs | 17:45 |
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| kirma | it might turn so that one can run only multitasking-approved applications up to some magical limit on the device, and one traditional iphone app. or something like that... | 17:46 |
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| kirma | I wonder what kind of UI they'd provide for application switching, though. | 17:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: (practically no) why? | 17:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: any system reasons, or just missing app to do that correctly? | 17:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | I mean, it basically does show two different screens for LCD and AV-connector right now (the AV has no user interface superimposed) | 17:55 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | ohhhhhh my god .... its the day of stupid people calling me..... | 17:56 |
| noobmonk3y_ | a staff member logged a job with our IT peoples to transfer a blackberry... response back was... i'm sorry sir, we do not support blackberries... so i sent him the 150 page SLA, and said... i'm sorry sir yes you do.... is response was.... I don't know what that document is!!!! omfg!!! | 17:57 |
| noobmonk3y_ | also 10 mins ago, my boss got nominated for team of the year at an awards do..... odd as i'm the only other one in his team and i'm not nominated :D | 17:57 |
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| noobmonk3y_ | a day with no stupidity would be a boring one though :D | 17:58 |
| MohammadAG | does anyone know if http://tomch.com/maemaps.html uses cached maps? | 17:58 |
| lovelyboy | DocScrutinizer:do you have any links demonstrating what you mean by different screens for lcd and av, am really interested at this | 17:59 |
| * noobmonk3y_ blames lcuk for general ignorance in the world......... :D hehe | 17:59 | |
| RST38h | Mohammad: it does not | 17:59 |
| * noobmonk3y_ will brb - another joyouse phone call ;D | 17:59 | |
| ShadowJK | when you connect it to tv and play a movie you get the UI only on the device's screen | 18:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | lovelyboy: nope, but it's as simple as "mediaplayer coninues to show an unmangled video to AV output, while on LCD it pops up the reverse, pause, forward etc buttons same time" | 18:01 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, maps for israel don't show, but they're on maps.google.com | 18:01 |
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| lovelyboy | ic :D | 18:01 |
| ShadowJK | the video is probably a different device like on older PC graphics cards :) | 18:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: yep | 18:02 |
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| Thom86 | hi | 18:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer | if mediaplayer wasn't braindamaged in almost all respects, it probably would even allow to switch to another task for LCD screen, while video playback to AV continues in background | 18:04 |
| zap | Anybody knows about a port of ImageMagick to Maemo? | 18:05 |
| nid0 | tbh if media player could do that, the entire device should be able to effectively handle two independant outputs | 18:05 |
| ShadowJK | well, one rgb framebuffer and one yuv framebuffer... | 18:06 |
| VDVsx | zap, http://maemo.org/packages/view/imagemagick/ | 18:06 |
| zap | good, but I need for maemo4 | 18:07 |
| ShadowJK | dss specs are open anyway I think :) | 18:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | nid0: well, kinda. One of the two probably is direct video output from dsp | 18:08 |
| VDVsx | zap, dunno if there's one, but you can compile it from the source, I did that a while ago and works well in diablo | 18:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | nid0: so it's a little err.. difficult to use it for normal fb style rendering | 18:09 |
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| * _Lucretia_ assumes it's ok to run the maemo-scratchbox install script with -U to upgrade? | 18:25 | |
| _Lucretia_ | it seems to be working | 18:25 |
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| Otacon22Uni | I'm a victim of this bug: | 18:29 |
| Otacon22Uni | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7764 | 18:29 |
| povbot | Bug 7764: WPA-EAP authentication fails with *any* expired certificate | 18:29 |
| Otacon22Uni | When this will be FIXED?! | 18:29 |
| RST38h | Like...never? | 18:29 |
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| Otacon22Uni | It's a very important bug | 18:29 |
| thresh | expired certificate is more of a bug itself | 18:30 |
| hrw | Otacon22Uni: in 2046 | 18:30 |
| Otacon22Uni | I can't connect to any wpa-eap tls network | 18:30 |
| Otacon22Uni | no no | 18:30 |
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| Otacon22Uni | the bug name is wrong | 18:30 |
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| Otacon22Uni | maybe i should open another ticket | 18:30 |
| Otacon22Uni | that bug name is wrong | 18:30 |
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| Otacon22Uni | the wifi connection on N900 does not work with ANY wpa-eap tls network. | 18:30 |
| inz | Otacon, I use my N900 at our uni's WPA2/PEAP/MSCHAPv2 -wi-fi | 18:31 |
| andre__ | Otacon22Uni, totally different bug then. | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | in my uni does not work | 18:32 |
| andre__ | so is your certificate expired or not? | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | and not only just for me | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | but also for a my firend | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | it is not a network problem | 18:32 |
| andre__ | Otacon22Uni, is your certificate expired or not? | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | because with laptops it works | 18:32 |
| Otacon22Uni | not expired | 18:32 |
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| * achipa scoffs at loosing 25MB root space by just enabling extras-devel and testing | 18:32 | |
| inz | Otacon, and you've set the manual username in advanced network properties? | 18:32 |
| andre__ | then you're obviously not a victom of that bug. full stop. | 18:32 |
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| andre__ | Otacon22Uni, so what *exact* wireless type do you have? | 18:33 |
| Otacon22Uni | yes, i've setted all | 18:33 |
| Otacon22Uni | WPA-EAP TLS | 18:33 |
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| Otacon22Uni | wait, i can nopaste the wpa_supplicant file of my laptop. | 18:33 |
| andre__ | Otacon22Uni, PAP? | 18:34 |
| andre__ | might be https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1635 | 18:34 |
| povbot | Bug 1635: Eduroam (EAP-TTLS+PAP) WiFi auth | 18:34 |
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| andre__ | fixed in the next release. | 18:34 |
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| Otacon22Uni | this is the wpa_supplicant conf file in my laptop: | 18:36 |
| Otacon22Uni | http://pastebin.com/kqEqB1US | 18:36 |
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| Otacon22Uni | on the N900 i think to have setted all correctly | 18:37 |
| Otacon22Uni | i've copied the .p12 cert file | 18:37 |
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| Otacon22Uni | then i've generated from it the .cer | 18:38 |
| Otacon22Uni | and i've setted the connection to the network in wpa-eap mode , TLS, then i've selected the cert file | 18:38 |
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| Otacon22Uni | but when i try to connect it says "Autentication failed" | 18:40 |
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| jebba | Otacon22 you see this thread? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=563867 | 18:46 |
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| Otacon22Uni | why? | 18:49 |
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| jebba | ah, because it's wpa_supplicant n900 info. Thought it might be relevant for you. | 18:49 |
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| user_ | from N900 :) | 18:50 |
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| Otacon22Uni | i want to have it working from the N900 gui, not from wpa_supplicant | 18:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | jebba: do you know if there's a I"CTools package somewhere? | 19:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I2C even | 19:01 |
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| Otacon22Uni | i will come again here later to discuss about wpa eap | 19:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer; easy-debian - there are several i2c packages | 19:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: thanks | 19:13 |
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| sylarpowa | any news about neighbour cells? | 19:13 |
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| sylarpowa | and what about cell broadcast messages? | 19:14 |
| tybollt | easydebian package work well? | 19:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I tried "debian-etch built for maemo" - fail | 19:14 |
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| SpeedEvil | tybollt: yes. It's a massive chroot - but otherwise fine | 19:15 |
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| jebba | DocScrutinizer I see this in extras-devel i2c-tiny-usb | 19:19 |
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| jebba | I don't see a package matching *i2c* in etch | 19:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | jebba: I | 19:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | 'i'd need http://www.lm-sensors.org/wiki/I2CTools | 19:33 |
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| khertan_ | ~ping | 19:37 |
| infobot | ~pong | 19:37 |
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| Khertan_Try4 | Please heelp me to push VectorMine in Extras test it and vote for it : http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_non-free_armel/vectormine/1.0.6-2/ | 19:41 |
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| uhsf | these wrist straps seem great to avoid losing the stylus, but it just sucks to order a wrist strap from sweden http://www.triforce.se/ | 19:43 |
| RST38h | uhsf: Order in bulk | 19:44 |
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| tybollt | uhsf: give me a pic of that thing? :S | 19:45 |
| tybollt | ~ding | 19:45 |
| infobot | dong | 19:45 |
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| uhsf | tybollt: http://shop.triforce.se/ | 19:47 |
| tybollt | ja | 19:48 |
| tybollt | googlers images found it for me | 19:48 |
| tybollt | looks bloody awkward. | 19:48 |
| tybollt | praps that's why it's so good? | 19:48 |
| uhsf | i mean http://www.triforce.se/galleries.html | 19:48 |
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| slonopotamus | what is the proper way to handle incorrect args passed to GObject constructor? ideally, i'd like to report GError and prevent object creation. | 19:57 |
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| noobmonk3y__ | ooo two of me | 19:59 |
| noobmonk3y__ | musta left my work connection on lol | 19:59 |
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| noobmonk3y__ | lol | 20:11 |
| noobmonk3y__ | still here, both of me | 20:11 |
| noobmonk3y__ | any admins on to boot the other me off? :D | 20:11 |
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| noobmonk3y__ | ahaaaaaaaa | 20:12 |
| noobmonk3y__ | was logged in on my laptop lol!!! | 20:13 |
| noobmonk3y__ | (Other one!) | 20:13 |
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| rryk | hello | 20:13 |
| noobmonk3y | heya | 20:13 |
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| lupine_85 | she builds! | 20:40 |
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| admiral0 | hi | 20:43 |
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| admiral0 | guys i have trouble with wifi GUI on N900 | 20:44 |
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| admiral0 | it doesn't authenticate on a WPA enterprise network | 20:44 |
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| arachnist | admiral0: oh, known bug. there's a workaround | 20:48 |
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| admiral0 | arachnist: link or it didn't happen XD | 20:49 |
| arachnist | admiral0: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2051#c26 | 20:49 |
| povbot | Bug 2051: Unable to connect to EAP PEAP MSCHAPV2 without certificates | 20:49 |
| arachnist | admiral0: it works for me (heck, i wrote that comment) | 20:50 |
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| admiral0 | arachnist: :D thanks :) | 20:54 |
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| shadikka | Well, that's curious. | 20:58 |
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| Shadikka | Hermes gets a BadStatusLine error :P | 20:58 |
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| The_Tall1 | Hi. For my report I would like to measure my programs power consumption. Is there any other possibility than let it run with battery completely charged, till the N810 goes down? | 21:02 |
| ScribbleJ | OMG, iPhone 4.0 might -- MIGHT -- include multitasking. WOW. Imagine a phone that can do two things at once. | 21:02 |
| The_Tall1 | ;) | 21:02 |
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| Trizt | ScribbleJ; two different things at the same time? or will it use multitasking ála ms-win3.1? | 21:14 |
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| Vratha | ScribbleJ: ss | 21:16 |
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| GMsoft | hi | 21:17 |
| Vratha | er | 21:17 |
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| Vratha | ScribbleJ: where did you get that info? | 21:17 |
| Vratha | n/m. found the info | 21:18 |
| GMsoft | I'm trying to understand how bootmenu works, you can't actually boot another kernel, can you ? | 21:18 |
| GMsoft | as I understand you need to flash your new kernel and use that one to boot whatever partition you want to boot | 21:18 |
| jebba | GMsoft: that's how i understand it as well. | 21:19 |
| GMsoft | damn that sux :-/ | 21:19 |
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| GMsoft | is there another way to boot another kernel ? maybe by configuring nolo or so ? | 21:42 |
| GMsoft | can't find much about that | 21:42 |
| GMsoft | on a n900 I mean | 21:42 |
| ds3 | anyone know if the HSP/HFP bluetooth stuff is routed through software on the N900 so things like SIP can benefit from those mono bluetooth ear peices? | 21:42 |
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| wazd1 | who wants to win 50 grands for "best designed meego app"? :D | 21:51 |
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| wazd1 | seriously :) | 21:53 |
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| ds3 | the problem is the definition of best designed ;) | 21:59 |
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| star314 | Hi! | 22:07 |
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| * lupine_85 wonders if he can get his N900 to push GPS coordinates somewhere every hour or so | 22:15 | |
| tank-man | sounds possible | 22:16 |
| tank-man | stalking ex gf ;) | 22:16 |
| lupine_85 | yeah, $some lines of perl/python if nothing else | 22:16 |
| tank-man | ? | 22:16 |
| lupine_85 | hah, no. it's my N900 | 22:16 |
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| lupine_85 | I like google latitude-y stuff, but I'd rather not let google know my whereabouts | 22:17 |
| lupine_85 | so dump it to a private database and frontend it as I please sounds good | 22:17 |
| asj- | tank-man: she's stalking him.... | 22:17 |
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| asj- | wait, he's a geek...like he has a gf ;) | 22:17 |
| * asj- runs | 22:17 | |
| lupine_85 | :po | 22:17 |
| dregin | O2 had a servic like that here about 7 years ago | 22:18 |
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| dregin | you could add your friends numbers to a list on their site | 22:18 |
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| dregin | obviously the friend had to accept the addition by replying to a text message or something | 22:18 |
| lupine_85 | I work at an ISP and got a support ticket recently which ended "(yeah, I said GF. Cool, eh?)" | 22:18 |
| asj- | lupine_85: but don't you know where you are? :) | 22:18 |
| dregin | for th cost of a text message O2 gave you a map pin pointing your friend's locations | 22:18 |
| lupine_85 | so I popped onto the accounts system, got his address and travelled down with a cluebat | 22:18 |
| tank-man | "You are here" | 22:18 |
| dregin | one of my mate's did that to his girlfriend when she was supposed to be at home sick | 22:18 |
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| dregin | turned out she was at her ex-boyfriend's house | 22:19 |
| dregin | invastion_of_privacy++; | 22:19 |
| lupine_85 | probably some degree of illegality there | 22:19 |
| dregin | nah | 22:19 |
| lupine_85 | computer misuse act, perhaps | 22:19 |
| dregin | they accepted it like | 22:19 |
| dregin | when you added your friend, O2 sent them a text which they had to reply to with "yes" or something in order for you to be able to track them. | 22:19 |
| lupine_85 | ahh | 22:20 |
| asj- | lupine_85: I could see it being really on a road trip, send them out once an hour, plot them on google maps for friends | 22:20 |
| dregin | she just forgot about it ;) | 22:20 |
| asj- | if there's no cell coverage, store it till you get some | 22:20 |
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| lupine_85 | asj-: well, indeed. i'd probably log to a local sqlite database then replicate that regularly | 22:21 |
| lupine_85 | would I expect it to have a serious impact on battery life? | 22:21 |
| dregin | a friend of mine tracked a month long trip around europe using a GPS dongle that hung around his neck and daved data which he transferred to his computer all night | 22:21 |
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| dregin | when he got home he was able to generate a zig-zag line across a map which tracked his every move for that month | 22:21 |
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| SpeedEvil | openstreetmap.org - upload it! | 22:22 |
| asj- | lupine_85: with the gps on it has 3-4 hours of battery life, assume 5 mins on each hour....so every 12 hour you use 1 hour of GPS time, so 1/2 your bat/day for the GPS. Probaqbly would not make it through the day without a charge | 22:23 |
| lupine_85 | it already has trouble with that ;) | 22:23 |
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| SpeedEvil | Not 5 mins | 22:24 |
| lupine_85 | yeah, OSM rocks | 22:24 |
| SpeedEvil | If you're in a GPS signal area, you get a lock within under 15s | 22:24 |
| SpeedEvil | so 15s/hour is more like it | 22:24 |
| lupine_85 | wonder if I could get location data from the radio - presumably that's available at no extra cost? | 22:25 |
| asj- | SpeedEvil: most people aren't though, and 15s is pretty good for a hot lock, this isn't hot. | 22:25 |
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| lupine_85 | (power cost) | 22:25 |
| lupine_85 | that gives accuracy to $some metres | 22:25 |
| asj- | lupine_85: you just need to push the cell id to the data server and wait for an answer | 22:25 |
| lupine_85 | hundred or so? | 22:25 |
| SpeedEvil | asj-: it's warm if you're turning it on every hour or so | 22:26 |
| asj- | lupine_85: about 5000 where I used to live | 22:26 |
| SpeedEvil | asj-: 30 - certainly - if not 15 | 22:26 |
| asj- | SpeedEvil: ok | 22:26 |
| lupine_85 | I guess it depends on how big the area the cell covers | 22:26 |
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| asj- | rural cell cites can be very large and if you only have one tower you can't get any better info | 22:27 |
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| SpeedEvil | you get an segment of a circle | 22:28 |
| SpeedEvil | Even rural cells typically are zoned. | 22:28 |
| SpeedEvil | so you get an octant - say. | 22:28 |
| dregin | GPS signal area??? there are areas that don't get GPS signal? | 22:28 |
| SpeedEvil | And you're somewhere on that octant 3km from the tower - say. | 22:29 |
| SpeedEvil | dregin: caves, buildings, ... | 22:29 |
| dregin | ah | 22:29 |
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| dregin | more commonly known as "inside" :p | 22:29 |
| tank-man | lol | 22:29 |
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| asj- | SpeedEvil: none of the mapping software indicated they used the info if they got it | 22:30 |
| SpeedEvil | IIRC some bits of the grand canyon you can't see any GPS sats | 22:31 |
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| SpeedEvil | And it's not inside. | 22:31 |
| dregin | sux2b in the grand canyon, so. | 22:31 |
| SpeedEvil | asj-: ? | 22:31 |
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| asj- | SpeedEvil: nm | 22:32 |
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| ShadowJK | heh, on 3G the network positioning puts me about 3-5km from my actual location :-) | 22:37 |
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| mtnbkr | ShadowJK: it's safer that way :) | 22:38 |
| ShadowJK | hm? | 22:38 |
| mtnbkr | especially when you're on the run | 22:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Unless it puts yolu at the murder location. | 22:38 |
| mtnbkr | lol | 22:38 |
| ShadowJK | did konttori appear today, or did the cellmo people kill him for asking about neighbour cells? :) | 22:39 |
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| SpeedEvil | !seen konttori | 22:39 |
| SpeedEvil | popped in beirflym and then legft | 22:40 |
| cehteh | maybe they killed the bot too :P | 22:40 |
| cehteh | SpeedEvil: you need to improve your n900 keyboard typing skills :P | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Naah. | 22:41 |
| SpeedEvil | Not n900. | 22:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | This is a full-sized clicky keyboard. | 22:41 |
| SpeedEvil | But it's under the covers, and the blankets are getting in the way. | 22:41 |
| cehteh | lol | 22:41 |
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| asj- | and one handed typing is hard right SpeedEvil? ;) | 22:48 |
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| SpeedEvil | I have no heating other than electric blanket ATM. | 22:49 |
| SpeedEvil | It's 6C in here. | 22:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Hence - keyboard is under covers. | 22:50 |
| asj- | SpeedEvil: where are you? | 22:50 |
| dregin | Anyone know of a decent tutorial to get a simple hello world running in esbox? | 22:50 |
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| SpeedEvil | asj-: scotland. | 22:52 |
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| asj- | SpeedEvil: ah ok | 23:01 |
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| pupnik | right so i have guests over. showing them a tv-out movie with n900. after 15 minutes screen goes black and i cant get it back | 23:03 |
| pupnik | no sale :( | 23:03 |
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| cehteh | lol | 23:04 |
| cehteh | what player? | 23:04 |
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| pupnik | default. withy broken codec pack upgrade | 23:04 |
| cehteh | hmm | 23:04 |
| pupnik | battery power | 23:04 |
| cehteh | ah | 23:05 |
| cehteh | well be happy it was not a bluescreen or kernel oops :P | 23:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~~ | 23:05 |
| infobot | ~ is probably the key | 23:06 |
| pupnik | also ok, they were a little upset by Croenenbeerg's Naked Lunch | 23:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~seen konttori | 23:06 |
| infobot | konttori <~konttori@Maemo/OS/konttori> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 2h 14m 7s ago, saying: 'now: mass effect time (just finished 1 for the second time, about to start 2 for the second time)'. | 23:06 |
| pupnik | now i gotta file a bug report eh | 23:07 |
| pupnik | joke. naked lunch. bug report... | 23:07 |
| aquatix | hm, what N900 screen protector works best? the Zagg one looks nice, as does Brando's ultra-clear | 23:08 |
| ShadowJK | i heard zagg's is sticky | 23:08 |
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| pupnik | or take a pic of the scratches and use it for police ID if it gets stolen | 23:09 |
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| cehteh | i first had a rubbery Durasec HighTec which was pretty bad, protected well but was not comfortable to use | 23:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer | pupnik: I noticed today N900 said "charging" the moment I retracted the AV after playback of a 30min movie :-O | 23:10 |
| cehteh | now i have a virkuti anti-glare which works much better, but the outer thin anti dirt coating starts to disintegrate looks very little speckled by that but is still good useable | 23:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | makes me think it stopped charging during playback | 23:11 |
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| ShadowJK | maybe it's just the USB port that's halfway detached ;-) | 23:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, I definitely haven't changed the usb. Was snuggly settled all the time | 23:12 |
| ShadowJK | was it "full" when you started playback? | 23:13 |
| pupnik | my batt was full | 23:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I'd say yes. Was on charger for >16h | 23:14 |
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| ShadowJK | Oh it probably just canceled the "Full" state then | 23:14 |
| pronto | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxJTaJ3YJOI kitties! (appently recorded with the n900) | 23:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | never seen (and heard!) it doing that before | 23:15 |
| ShadowJK | I've seen it occasionally on n810 | 23:15 |
| ShadowJK | It was a positive surprise, my previous nokias would happily drift down to 3.5V while on charger and heavy consumption and still claim "Full" until I disconnected charger :D | 23:16 |
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| ShadowJK | N900 is a different beast though.. it has an actual charger chip.. | 23:17 |
| asj- | sad that's like one litter of kittens | 23:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, me away for recovering from first shocking encounter with scratchbox | 23:17 |
| ShadowJK | Hope you used the VM, that seems scary enough, I wouldn't want to try install it :P | 23:19 |
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| burchr | I successfully evaded scratchbox again today | 23:19 |
| burchr | compiled a library+app with MADDE instead :P | 23:19 |
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| dregin | Has anyone run the maemo5hildonwidgets project from esbox? | 23:26 |
| triplezero | boo! att only supports 2.5G with the n900? | 23:29 |
| Stskeeps | triplezero: n900 only supports certain frequencies | 23:29 |
| Stskeeps | for 3g | 23:29 |
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| cehteh | .. when quadband is not enough :) | 23:31 |
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| * Stskeeps yawns and collapses on the corner of his hotel room couch | 23:31 | |
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| cehteh | anyone of you will be at the Chemnitzer Linux Tage (germany) this weekend? | 23:32 |
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| aquatix | ShadowJK: sticky as in sticking quite firmly on the screen? | 23:36 |
| aquatix | i have that too with boxwave ones | 23:36 |
| aquatix | doesn't really bother me | 23:36 |
| aquatix | if the thing works fine | 23:36 |
| aquatix | or sticky as in resisting your finger nails a bit | 23:37 |
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| ShadowJK | resisting | 23:39 |
| aquatix | ok | 23:39 |
| aquatix | badly? | 23:39 |
| aquatix | depends on taste i guess too | 23:39 |
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| aquatix | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkSlw9lLp_4 <- is he using water to place it? | 23:46 |
| aquatix | never thought about doing that like that | 23:46 |
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| RST38h | http://gizmodo.com/5491325/first-peek-at-the-joojoo-tablets-guts <=== Notice...ummm...the fan | 23:48 |
| aquatix | fail :/ | 23:48 |
| aquatix | ah, atom | 23:48 |
| * aquatix wants a Notion Ink Adam | 23:49 | |
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| ShadowJK | Zagg thingy comes with a liquid for the application | 23:50 |
| RST38h | Still hell to apply | 23:50 |
| * RST38h just applied one to Canon G11 | 23:51 | |
| aquatix | yeah, seems to be refillable with water | 23:51 |
| aquatix | RST38h: thinking about only getting the screen protector | 23:51 |
| RST38h | And it never seems to apply perfectly =( | 23:51 |
| aquatix | hm | 23:51 |
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| * aquatix wonders how well the screen without protection will put up with finger nails | 23:53 | |
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| RST38h | micro scratches | 23:54 |
| RST38h | you will get a characteristic vertical spot where you scroll web pages (multiple scratches there) | 23:54 |
| cehteh | aquarius-: finger nails are no problem unless you have sand or other abrasive things | 23:54 |
| range | I have no visible scratches on my display. | 23:55 |
| RST38h | + you will definitely get a few huge (but barely noticeable) scratches when playing Angry Birds ;) | 23:55 |
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| cehteh | if you are careful you can operate the device without protector, i'm not so i have a protector :) | 23:55 |
| aquatix | RST38h: :) | 23:55 |
| aquatix | cehteh: yeah, same here | 23:56 |
| aquatix | cehteh: which did you get? | 23:56 |
| cehteh | scroll up i answered long ago :P | 23:56 |
| aquatix | ah yes, sorry | 23:56 |
| Klowner | woo latitude updater daemon appears to be working | 23:56 |
| cehteh | so far the virkuti is good, but not perfect | 23:56 |
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| aquatix | virkuti anti-glare indeed | 23:57 |
| cehteh | at least good enough that i will use it as long as possible | 23:57 |
| * Arif_ yawns | 23:57 | |
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| aquatix | cehteh: http://www.protectionfilms24.com/article/vikuiti-armr200-screen-protector-nokia-n900-27604.html ? | 23:57 |
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| cehteh | the durasec was bit strange to apply ... lots of bubbled, but after a few days it settled like a 2nd skin | 23:58 |
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| cehteh | but the wrinky rubbery surface was not comfortable | 23:58 |
| aquatix | yeah, it needs to stay smooth | 23:58 |
| cehteh | yes exactly that one | 23:58 |
| aquatix | otherwise you will get multiple taps instead of a slide | 23:58 |
| * ptl installing tuxrace on the N900 | 23:58 | |
| Arif_ | tuxrace? | 23:59 |
| Arif_ | is it made of win? | 23:59 |
| Hydroxide | tuxracer, presumably | 23:59 |
| Hydroxide | and yes it is fun | 23:59 |
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| Hydroxide | (if you like racing games and penguins) | 23:59 |
| Arif_ | is it in devel/testing? | 23:59 |
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