IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2010-03-07

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heoajust wondering how easy it is to break n810 eg with nmap, experiences?00:01
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ShadowJKi dont think you need debian for nmap, screen and vim00:05
* ShadowJK has screen on n810 atleast00:05
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ShadowJKbindkey -d ^@ stuff ^?00:06
ShadowJKput that in ~/.screenrc00:06
ShadowJKmakes backspace work in screen00:06
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heoaShadowJK: you mean, you can really get a real shell, no .. emulation like on droids?00:08
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ShadowJKheoa, x-terminal comes installed by default00:08
ShadowJKit's a real terminal, although it's busybox sh00:09
ShadowJKOnce you add the extras repository, you can install "rootsh" from the Application Manager, after that you can type "sudo gainroot" to get rootshell. apt-get is installed.00:09
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ShadowJKI take it you don't have an N810? :-)00:10
ShadowJKI don't see mutt in the repository, but screen, nmap and vim is there00:11
ShadowJKThere's also a thing called "easy debian" which lets you run full debian in a chroot00:11
heoaShadowJK: nope but soon have cos many crontabs crawling the internet :P00:12
heoaShadowJK: looking for a cheap second hand phone but had to have some fun in automating it, too bored in using the online stores manually :)00:13
ShadowJKN810 doesn't have gsm/3g00:13
ptlscreen, nmap, vim and irssi are there00:13
ptlmutt... good point00:13
ptlheoa: N900 is a real linux, if you're used to Uuntu you'll feel at home00:14
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ShadowJKWell he was asking about N810 earlier :-)00:14
ptloh, sorry00:14
ShadowJK770, N800 and N810 have no GSM/3G. N900 is the newest and has gsm and 3g.00:15
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pupniki would still love the n810 but the pressure point and spacing on n900 keyboard is so much better00:15
ShadowJKYou can make SIP/VoIP and Skype calls on N810 though00:15
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heoaptl: "real linux"? Does it mean that n810 is some emulation hack or something else?00:18
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ShadowJKheoa, N810 is "real linux" too00:21
heoaptl: using Mutt in n810?00:22
heoaShadowJK: have to get it then quickly00:22
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ptlheoa: it means that it is linux, just compiled for ARM. Not like e.g. Android that is heavily modified, no X, no GTK+, no QT00:23
pupnikit uses an arm cpu so you dont run x86 distros...00:23
ShadowJKheoa, you know that N810 isn't a phone, right? :)00:23
ptlheoa: I am not using mutt right now, but it wouldn't be a bad idea :)00:23
ShadowJKN810 has X and GTK00:23
ptlN810 is a real linux00:23
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heoaptl: so you can get it just through apt-get?00:24
ShadowJKInstall rootsh from application manager to get root, open x-terminal, "sudo gainroot", apt-get install screen00:25
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heoaShadowJK: "apt-get install mutt" meant?00:26
ShadowJKmutt isn't in the repositories :/00:27
heoaShadowJK: well can you compile from sources?00:27
ShadowJKWell in theory you can install gcc, some have done this00:28
ShadowJKbut the root filesystem / is a bit small for it, so it's easier to do it with the SDK00:29
ptlheoa: yes00:31
ptlShadowJK: it should be easy to compile it00:31
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ptlhey, what's the best PC Suite replacement in linux?00:32
* Arkenoi never used pc suite00:32
Arkenoieven with symbian00:32
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heoaptl: $ apt-get source mutt; $ cd dirMutt; $ make ; ready?00:33
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ptlheoa: apt-get source mutt; cd dirMutt; dpkg-buildpackage ; cd .. ; maemo-optify-deb mutt-xxx-armel.deb. Ready00:34
ptlmaemo-optify-deb just moves some files around to better integrate in the maemo filesystem hierarchy00:34
ptlit's a 79-line shell script, not rocket science...00:35
heoaptl: ShadowJK Thank you.00:39
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ShadowJKmaemo-optify isn't relevant for N81000:41
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pupniknice - adding libavcodec and 52omap3430-dsp-libraries-ti broke media player mp3 playback00:42
Arkenoibtw there are "pidgin protocols for contacts and conversations" and "extra protocols for contacts and conversation" which seem to support similar protocol set. Is it safe to delete one of those, and which one?00:44
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lcukhey javispedro \o00:54
javispedrohello lcuk00:54
javispedroenjoying the gles book?00:55
lcuknot have a chance today00:55
lcuki hve the multi texture example running tho00:55
lcukneed to learn how it used shaders properly tho00:55
javispedroah, interesting00:55
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bnhwJust plunged into OpenGL ES 2 myself : )00:56
* lcuk wants to see how easy rgb yuv shader based conversion would work00:56
javispedroI've now seen it done more than once00:57
lcukyeah me too00:57
lcukwould be nice to see how quickly it can be done00:57
lcukand whether it will run on a 1.100:57
javispedroconsidering it would eat quite a bunch of bandwidth00:58
javispedro ... dunno.00:58
javispedrobut maybe you get tearfree rendering at least :)00:58
lcuki have it!00:58
javispedrowith xv, I know00:58
lcuki think00:58
javispedrothat's why I am saying that :)00:59
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lcukim thinking of taking the normal rgb framebuffer and squashing it through00:59
lcukits the job the IVA on the n810 should be used for00:59
javispedroah, the IVA :S00:59
lcukon 900 its less practical because the pvr is in use01:00
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lcukand would cause its own bottlenecks to render itself then also render rgb->yuv01:00
ShadowJKI think xvideo sneaks past the pvr01:00
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javispedroit does01:00
lcukjust a mind exercise but would like to see how much power is behind the shader calculators01:00
javispedroomapfb also does afaiu01:00
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ShadowJKis there more than one shader? :)01:01
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javispedrohm.. I never tried, but I wouldn't assume more than one.01:01
lcukShadowJK, graphics cards on larger machines have hundreds of shader cells, i dunno how many are on this chip actually01:01
javispedroanother texture unit...01:01
javispedrothe iphone had two iirc01:02
ShadowJKI think my graphics card in my desktop has 6401:02
javispedro(sorry I am talking from an API/logical PoV, dunno about the real hw)01:02
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lbtjebba: ping01:25
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jebbalbt: pong01:28
lbtyou were wondering about builders...01:28
lbtanything in particular?01:28
lbtyou have an OBS up and running iirc01:29
jebbaWell, i know it's OBS. What distro/release are they running it on? And can I have copies of the configs  :)01:29
jebbaAnd the current rootfs they are using  ;)01:29
lbtso I can talk about what I'm doing with OBS01:29
lbtwhich isn't quite meego01:29
lbtbut that should get clarified this week01:30
lbtit's all converging :)01:30
lbtbase distro is opensuse 11.201:30
jebbaperhaps writeup to list? Even a short status update about it would be most welcome by many, i assume.  :)01:30
jebbaoh noes, but ok.01:30
lbtyeah - so that would be an interesting place to look at porting...01:30
lbtand I was going to ask if you were doing anything around that?01:31
lbtthere's an ubuntu port of the worker01:31
pupniklbt finally something one can think about concretely01:32
jebbaoh, i dont feel like porting OBS to a .deb, if that's what you're asking.   If you mean porting things to OpenSUSE/rpm/thereabouts, i've started a bit already.01:32
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lbtI did mean that - it's a packaging job and would allow OBS to be easily run on more machines without an 11.2 VM install needed01:32
jebbaBut you have and OBS building arm .rpms at this point?01:32
lbtnot that many of us need that01:32
lbtI don't01:33
lbtI'm building x86 rpms and arm .debs01:33
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lbtthere is ARM work happening but I know nothing :)01:33
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jebbaya, so at this point i'm mostly in a holding pattern  :)01:34
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lbtpretty much - but you can rely on OBS 1.7 being the builder01:34
lbtand as soon as it appears you can see the prjconf01:35
lbtI personally don't see any of this yet internally01:35
jebbaok, thx nice to know :)01:35
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lbtI'm allowed to say I'm the obs architect for the maemo internal obs though01:36
lbtso we're developing things like LDAP integration, access control etc01:36
jebbaOBS + openid would be nice01:37
lbtsounds like a plan - I'm waiting for the SSO proposal01:37
lbtI'm still asking OBS people about the public obs too01:37
jebbai also think OBS+utility computing / cloud computing would be a great combo.01:37
lbt<grin> it's interesting01:37
lbtI wish I had time01:37
jebbagotta have public OBS.01:37
SpeedEvillbt: openntpd is in extras01:38
lbtyeah - I want policy on that01:38
lbteg if nokia have a closed api/lib01:38
lbtcan I build on the meego obs and link it01:38
lbtie is there a finnish quarter ;)01:38
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Arif_good evening!01:39
lbtI mentioned it in the meego meeting - the sub-area comments etc01:39
lbtnot heard a proper answer01:39
lbto/ Arif_01:39
Arif_sup \o01:40
GAN900lbt, probably isn't one. ;)01:42
lbttrue GAN90001:42
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GAN900lbt, which is half the problem of the whole damn thing, but oh well.01:45
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wizkoderUniTrans[14297]: GLIB CRITICAL ** Gtk - gtk_widget_set_sensitive: assertion `GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed01:52
wizkoderUniTrans[14297]: GLIB WARNING ** Gtk - Can't set a parent on a toplevel widget01:52
wizkoderUniTrans[14297]: GLIB WARNING ** Gtk - Can't set a parent on a toplevel widget01:52
wizkoderI get this in all my programs. Is it normal? (In scratchbox)01:52
bnhwwizkoder: are you prefixing it with ''?01:53
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wizkodermy hello world runs but gives out this messages too01:54
swc|666can someone pastebin their /etc/modprobe.d/maemo.conf  ? </favor>01:55
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bnhwswc|666: Uh, first line is missing an 'a' at the start01:57
swc|666bnhw, many thx!01:58
wizkoderwhen I try to run the "qt gui application" the qt creator always creates which does nothing except opening a window. I get. "/usr/bin/ line 11: 14952 Segmentation fault      (core dumped) "$@"01:58
wizkoderIsn't it crossplatform? Puzzled what could be wrong here02:01
wizkoderAre the installed qt libs wrong? What could I do next?02:02
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bnhwwizkoder: Maybe something's wrong with your scratchbox setup02:05
bnhwwizkoder: Wish I knew more about it :|02:05
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wizkoderbnhw: Okay. Time to try reading the setup document again02:07
bnhwwizkoder: Did you do a manual install?02:08
wizkoderbnhw: Installed it by hand yes02:08
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wizkoderbnhw: following the description on step by step. and changed nothing so far02:13
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bnhwwizkoder: Hmm, well, something must be up if example code is segfaulting02:16
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wizkoderbnhw: I would like to be sure that its that problem. Should the example code that qt creator spits out for a simple qt application run without changes?02:20
bnhwWant to send the code over and I'll check it out?02:20
bnhwTheoretically it's cross-platform02:20
bnhwOh, also, are you running in FREMANTLE_ARMEL or FREMANTLE_X86 environment?02:21
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wizkodershould it be ARMEL?02:25
bnhwNo, X86 for running in Xephyr02:25
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wizkoderJust created a new project. saying I want a qt application. Runs instantly on my desktop. But in scratchbox I get the segmentation fault02:26
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bnhwSorry, having to download qt4 dev stuff02:30
[Evan]Does anybody know how many applicants Maemo got last year for GSoC 2009?02:32
bnhwwizkoder: QT app ran fine over here02:33
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wizkoderbnhw: thats strange. So its my environment.02:36
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wizkoderinstalled the qt dev libs with: "fakeroot apt-get install libqt4-gui libqt4-dev"02:40
bnhwwizkoder: Sounds fine02:40
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l7what program do you typically use to backup a maemo install from your sd card?02:42
l7i'm wondering if tar would be sufficient02:42
swc|666the backup app?02:42
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l7not the data02:43
l7but a backup of the OS02:43
l7i try to keep my data and the OS seperate actually02:43
bnhwl7: you could use dd to get an image of the disk02:44
swc|666have u looked at the backup app? if not then something like rsync02:44
wizkoderbnhw: This was my tutorial:
wizkoderand the app there works02:44
swc|666or dd as bnhw saud02:44
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l7bnhw: yeah i was trying to do that before actually02:45
l7the install is 300mb on a 7gb partition though02:45
infobotswc|666 meant: or dd as bnhw said02:45
bnhwwizkoder: did you install by these guidelines?
l7and i only have a fat partition handy avaiable as a backup target right now02:46
l7next time i will keep my OS partition under a gig02:46
l7i guess i could give grsync a go02:47
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wizkoderbnhw: yes02:47
bnhwl7: If you don't want/can't have a byte-perfect copy then backup app is probably better. You can use it to backup your list of installed packages02:48
wizkoderbnhw: reading though again to see if I missed something02:48
bnhwwizkoder: Are you on a non-debian distro?02:49
wizkoderbnhw: kubuntu 9.1002:49
l7would "tar -cvpzf /tmp/backup.tar.gz -–exclude= --exclude=/proc --exclude=/lost+found --exclude=/sys --exclude=/mnt --exclude=/media /" be appropriate?02:49
l7it's  actually cribbed from ubuntu's backup page02:49
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l7tar -cvpzf /tmp/backup.tar.gz --exclude=/proc --exclude=/lost+found --exclude=/sys --exclude=/mnt --exclude=/media /02:50
bnhwwizkoder: Why not try the installer?02:51
bnhwwizkoder: It's possible that the manual instructions are broken02:52
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wizkoderbnhw: jts have seen that I forgot to add the extra repos. inserted that and updating. maybe I got an old version?02:53
bnhwwizkoder: Could be!02:54
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pupniknice to see conversation i cant begin to follow02:56
wizkoderbnhw: hrrrg. now my system is broken. I get now: "/targets/FREMANTLE_X86/usr/include/qt4/QtCore/qatomic_i386.h:132: error: impossible constraint in 'asm'"02:57
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bnhwwizkoder: That doesn't sound good02:59
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wizkoderbnhw: do you have that line in your sources.list: "deb fremantle free non-free"?03:04
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wizkoderinserted that. updated. and nothing works anymore :-(03:05
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bnhwwizkoder: Uh, no. Did you add this to the X86 environment?03:06
wizkoderbnhw: yes. I did03:06
bnhwwizkoder: Those are ARM binaries in the extras repository03:06
wizkoderdamn ;-)03:06
wizkoderIs there a way back?03:07
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bnhwwizkoder: Maybe with some apt/dpkg magic03:09
bnhwwizkoder: But I'm no magician :|03:10
bnhwwizkoder: I'm afraid I've gotta dash now. Going to a workshop with Mitch Altman tomorrow! Good luck with your scratchbox.03:11
wizkoderbnhw: guess will start all over tomorrow03:11
bnhwwizkoder: Try using the installer?03:11
bnhw: )03:11
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swc|666nice /scratchbox/login: line 237: 20537 Segmentation fault03:54
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crashanddiewho the fuck is mitch altman?04:22
tremnite all, sweet dreams04:23
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redeemanthe python packages, in extras, they are all optified and stuff right?04:44
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crashanddieit's a sad state of affairs when p2p is faster than youtube05:02
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dracflamloccrashanddie, i agree05:37
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ptlwhere do I get the battery level via commandline?06:36
ptlcat /proc/...?06:36
ptlI am searching on wiki.maemo.org06:38
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ShadowJKhal-device bme06:47
ShadowJKfor battery06:47
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ptlno /proc or /sys ?06:50
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Termana_n810Stskeeps - good morning07:29
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Stskeepsick, nothing to get you awake than a well-written phishing about your danish CC07:33
Stskeepswhen you're abroad and need the CC for your well-being :P07:33
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Termana_n810Stskeeps - ha ha. yes, i don't think that would turn out to well.07:34
ptlit had you startled, it seems. How did you notice it was a phishing scam?07:35
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Stskeepsptl: well, first off, there was no contact # number and no secure website to do it, and third, the card bureau in .dk doesn't know me on my uni email07:37
Stskeepsand second, downloaded html file and ran it through 'more' :P07:37
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Stskeepsand the fact they speak of accounts and not cards :)07:38
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LiraNunawhat screen protectors are you guys using07:47
LiraNunafor the N900, that is07:47
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lucentLiraNuna: Zagg InvisibleShield07:54
lucentI like it.07:54
lucentI've heard some other people say it was the worst screen protector they've ever used.07:55
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DocScrutinizermin Stskeeps07:55
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LiraNunalucent, hmm, I only read bad reviews on Zaag07:56
lucentwell I own it and use it, and I will NOT use another screen protector product07:56
lucentthe "grippy" feel is unique for the Zagg07:56
lucentI really like that.07:56
LiraNunagrippy feel?07:56
lucentit's not a simple static cling poly sheet07:57
lucenthmm... it's like a bit of clear elastic07:57
lucentthere's a kind of rubbery grip feeling for the Zagg07:57
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lucentLiraNuna: installing a Zagg is really the problem07:58
lucentonce it is installed -correctly- it will never come off without you trying like mad to peel it off07:58
lucentso you only need one, there's no sense installing a new screen protector or three every few weeks07:59
sulxtheres no sens installing any protector...07:59
lucentthe N900 screen scratches easily.07:59
sulxit does? Mine has none08:00
lucentit really does, for those of you who do not experience scratches on a naked N900 screen, I say you are taking pretty calm approach to a device that is portable08:00
LiraNunasulx, 550$ device, 10$ screen protector08:01
LiraNunayou do the math...08:01
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DocScrutinizer40$ replacement touchpanel08:01
sulxso you would buy new DEVICE if its just screen that has been scratched?08:01
sulxscreen usability suffers huge impact with protector08:02
sulxso not worth it08:02
lucentit's not so dramatic, sulx08:02
LiraNunathat's personal taste08:02
lucentI was annoyed for about 2 weeks and then I adapted08:02
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lucenteven with the "grippy" Zagg08:03
sulxI had zagg for about 2 weeks also...08:03
sulxkeeping it in a empty pocket helps a lot =)08:05
ShadowJKnot much difference in usability with durasec08:05
ShadowJKthough it scratches instantly :D08:06
sulxaah durasec!08:06
sulxthats what I had...not zagg08:06
lucentthere's a rather large difference between Zagg and most everything else I've seen and used08:06
lucentit's not like Zagg is better08:07
lucent...though, I prefer the Zagg08:07
uhsfi got the clarivue clear protector and it's very good but i couldn't stand small bubbles beneath it so i'm using raw screen carefully now08:09
lucentthe bubbles disappear with a Zagg, but the thing that bothers me even now are the dust particulates that were trapped between the screen protector film and the screen08:10
lucentwhen the backlight is off you'd never notice it08:10
lucentturn the back light on and all these little hair-like shadows are everywhere08:10
Vrathaso, i'm quite confused about this.  i can mount my vfat-formatted microsd from the command-line, and file manager sees that i have a memory card, but when i try to access it from the file manager, it keeps saying it's unsupported08:12
Vrathaany of you had a problem like that while being able to clearly mount it from the command line?08:12
crashanddie"" ... Oh the irony08:12
crashanddiehey Vratha, what's up?08:12
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Vrathahi crashanddie08:13
DocScrutinizerlucent: haven't you heard you're supposed to apply protectors either in a cleanroom, or in your bathroom while shower with hot water is creating nice dust08:13
infobotDocScrutinizer meant: lucent: haven't you heard you're supposed to apply protectors either in a cleanroom, or in your bathroom while shower with hot water is creating nice fogg08:13
uhsfi agree with cleanroom08:14
lucentwho does that though?08:15
uhsfdidn't think about foggy bathroom before. i might order a new set and try the foggy bathroom08:15
uhsfi think i have obsessive compulsive tendencies, these protectors wanted to drive me insane08:17
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crashanddieI think you suffer from paranoia rather than OCD if you honestly believe that plastic sheets of plastic are trying to drive you insane.08:21
crashanddies/plastic //08:22
infobotcrashanddie meant: I think you suffer from paranoia rather than OCD if you honestly believe that sheets of plastic are trying to drive you insane.08:22
* lucent taunts infobot 08:22
crashanddie~tell lucent about death08:23
Vrathabluemaemo is kind of annoying08:24
Vrathai can use it for keyboard and mouse input, but i can only do it through the onscreen input08:24
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crashanddiehow so?08:24
cehtehi never tried, how does the mouse work, as absolute touchpad?08:24
crashanddiecehteh: yeah08:25
Vrathahmm, didn't test if it was absolute08:25
Vrathalet me see08:25
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crashanddie20 minutes for a page to load :(08:25
cehtehwould be funny to use the accelerometer to detecht movements on a plain surface, aka using the n900 like a normal mouse :P08:25
Vrathathat would suck08:25
crashanddieit doesn't work very well08:26
cehtehits a toy anyway :P08:26
crashanddiedon't forget that mice pointers work through a combination of speed and distance08:26
Vrathano, i would actually use this08:26
Vrathanot the mouse part, but definitely the keyboard portion08:26
crashanddiespeed is hard to calculate based on accelerometer data08:26
cehtehcrashanddie: if the surface is plain you can calculate speed and distance, but horribly inprecise08:27
DocScrutinizerthe LIS302 isn't sensitive enough for such kind of low accel inertial08:27
Vrathacehteh: no, the bluemaemo mouse is not absolute08:27
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Vrathajust tested08:28
cehtehsure, i only talking about some fun toy, not useful beyond a "because we can" demo08:28
cehtehVratha: like a normal touchpad then08:28
cehtehthe thing i disabled on my laptop because i dont like it :P08:28
cehtehthis laptop has trackstick too ..08:28
cehtehand once i've written the trackstick emulation for the xorg synaptics driver :P08:29
cehtehold laptop had no trackstick08:29
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DocScrutinizeronly semi-usable thing you can do with accelmeter and mousepointer is a direct relation (orientation of accelmeter)->(absolute position of pointer)08:33
DocScrutinizerfor a full slide of pointer from one end of screen to the other you probably want to tilt the sensor device by at least 90°08:35
DocScrutinizer-45°=left border, 0°=middle, +45°=right border08:36
DocScrutinizersame for up/down08:36
Vrathaso, back to N900s and microsd cards08:38
Vrathaanyone have a vfat-formatted microsd that you can manually mount from the command line but file manager keeps saying "Memory Card Format Unsupported"?08:38
cehtehthat doesnt surprise me08:39
cehtehthe script trying to mount it is quite braindead08:39
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ShadowJKI wouldn't call it braindead08:39
Vrathaif you know the location of the script, i could take a look08:40
Vrathaalso, my n900 is retarded when i hook it up to my Mac via USB08:40
Vrathait keeps creating a new network device with a different Mac08:40
ShadowJK/usr/sbin/mmc-mount maybe08:40
Vrathawith a different MAC08:40
Vrathaso my mac keeps thinking it's a new device08:40
Vrathai had that fixed on my last install, but now i can't find the help i used to resolve that.  think it was some udev rules file08:41
Vrathaif any of you know08:41
cehteh /etc/event.d/rcS-late creates the fstab08:42
cehtehdunno if it cares for sd card too08:43
ShadowJKfstab isn't used for sd mounting08:43
Vrathahow do you know that?  i wouldn't have guessed to check /etc/event.d (didn't know it existed)08:43
DocScrutinizerI got 3 partitions on a 16GB uSD: 14GB VFAT, 1.5GB ext3, 500MB swap. works flawlessly so far08:44
cehtehgrep i've rewritzen it all ext3 here08:44
VrathaDocScrutinizer: straight out of the box with the latest version of maemo?08:44
Vrathalatest version of the nokia maemo, that is08:45
DocScrutinizer(and even boots SHR-U ;-] )08:45
Vrathai was also wondering what shr-u is08:45
cehtehcan be the that uSD is handled elsewhere08:45
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DocScrutinizerVratha: well, errr... yes08:45
DocScrutinizerarachnist: a distro for OM freerunner08:46
cehtehShadowJK: who calls that?08:46
* ShadowJK shrugs08:46
ShadowJKke-recv maybe?08:47
cehtehah yes08:48
Vrathathis is annoying08:48
DocScrutinizerthis is a mess08:49
* cehteh just removed the nokiaisms, reformatted to ext3 and mount the partitions statically at boot .. done08:49
Vrathawell, i'd rather just get it working without going around the barn to do it08:50
cehtehmhm i think i forgotten to remove ke-recv from te boot it still lingers around waiting for nothing08:50
cehtehVratha: how is your uSD formatted08:50
arachnistcehteh: you formatted the internal flash with ext3?08:51
Vrathacehteh: 1 partition, vfat08:51
cehtehVFAT on the device .. or one single partition containing the VFAT?08:51
ShadowJKiirc people add a || mount -t auto type thingy to he script to make their ext3 cards automount.:)08:51
arachnistas in, the one which contains the / and swap by default?08:51
cehteharachnist: the emmc yes08:51
arachnistcehteh: you know that this was a rather bad idea?08:51
cehtehnot the root, thats still ubifs of course08:51
cehteharachnist: the MyDocs part08:52
cehteharachnist: i know what i am doing08:52
DocScrutinizerarachnist: swap for sure no ext308:52
cehtehwould it be possible to run ext4 on top of the ubi block layer?08:52
ShadowJKcehteh: dont08:53
DocScrutinizerarachnist: also swap is on eMMC while / is on NAND08:53
ShadowJKeven if it worked, it's a bad idea08:53
cehtehDocScrutinizer: actually i even considered that .. swap files are as fast as partitions since ages .. having swap on one big ext3 would give advantage of broader wear leveling and eat less static space08:53
cehtehShadowJK: sure thats a bad idea, but i even wonder if it will actually work08:54
DocScrutinizercehteh: ack08:54
ShadowJKcehteh: probably not08:54
ShadowJKext4 wants a block device08:54
cehtehubi provides some kind of block device08:55
cehteh(bekow ubifs)08:55
cehtehon top of mtd08:55
ShadowJKcehteh: the better question would be: can you run ubifs on ubi on block2mtd on emmc/uSD?08:55
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DocScrutinizercehteh: though I'd guess wear leveling is done in eMMC controller, independently of any partitioning or file or inode08:55
cehtehthat would be awful too as long emmc has no raw access08:55
cehtehDocScrutinizer: yes it is but someone told me that it only spans relative small areas08:56
ShadowJKcehteh: well I dunno. block2mtd can emulate eraseblocks, so I'd set it to 256k or 512k08:56
cehtehso writes rotate over some megabyte big areas but not around the whole device08:56
DocScrutinizercehteh: that will not change by using a swapfile08:57
ShadowJKhopefully LogFS is merged soon and hopefully we can get recent linux to work on n900 again..08:57
cehtehDocScrutinizer: i'd use a swap daemon then which creates swapfiles on demand08:57
arachnistDocScrutinizer: i didn't say that swap is ext3. that'd be rather impossible08:57
cehteh'swapspace' works kinda well08:57
ShadowJKI would not worry about swap wearing out the device. not enough bandwidth :)08:58
cehtehhey a friend of me once managed to make his ufs (on BSD) a swap ... accidentally ... lmao :P08:58
cehtehShadowJK: yeah that calculation made me think too .. even if you write at full speed constantly it will take some time to wear it out08:59
cehtehBSD's normal filesystem (like whats ext3 for linux)08:59
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Vrathaif i manually mount the uSD, i can see its contents in file manager09:00
cehtehyeah the filemanager shows any extra mounts09:01
Vrathaif i then umount it, file manager still shows the uSD, but going into it causes "Memory card format unsupported"09:01
cehtehwhen i sshfs to the laptop it sees that too (at least when i mount it on /media/laptop .. didnt figured out the mechanics there yet)09:01
DocScrutinizerVratha: cache09:02
* ShadowJK 'd add some debug output to the mmc mount script to see if it's called and if the mount works or doesn't, and if it doesn't try do the same mount from shell to see why it fails09:02
VrathaDocScrutinizer: no09:02
Vrathathis card showed up like that before i ever did any mount09:03
cehtehVratha: is there data on the uSD?09:03
cehtehi mean valueable one?09:03
cehtehif not just reformat it from the device09:03
cehtehthen it should be recognized09:03
Vrathaalready have09:03
DocScrutinizerVratha: you possibly by any chance lost the little magbet holting the kickstand?09:04
DocScrutinizerVratha: you possibly by any chance lost the little magnet holding the kickstand?09:04
cehtehyeah that could cause it :P09:04
cehtehVratha: you put the back cover back on it?09:04
Vrathaif that was a problem, i wouldn't have been able to mount it manually09:04
Vrathawhich i said i did09:05
Vrathathen umounted09:05
DocScrutinizerI'm not sure about that09:05
* cehteh neither09:05
Vrathaanyway, it's not the problem09:05
Vrathathe SD card isn't even recognized if the cover is off09:05
DocScrutinizerI'd guess mount gives a shit about state of hotswap-detector09:05
cehtehVratha: speaking about cover on09:06
cehtehthe automatic mounting/unmounting is triggered by removing or applying the cover09:06
cehtehnot by inserting the card09:06
Vrathaokay.  it isn't the cover09:06
Vrathai know09:06
Vrathai just said that09:06
cehtehwell dunno then09:07
cehtehdid the card worked before? .. whats its capacity?09:07
Vrathano, it iddn't work09:07
Vrathathe card is fine09:07
DocScrutinizermight be borked09:07
Vrathajesus people09:07
cehtehmaybe its just not fully compatible with some curft which tries to recognize it09:08
Vrathai said i manually mounted it earlier and used it09:08
cehtehyeah and .. i give a shit about manual .. the nokiaisms are so much borked and make unneccessary assumptions about some stuff09:08
DocScrutinizerVratha: if it has timing issues, then you'll not see a deterministic behaviour09:08
ShadowJKhow about add some debug09:09
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VrathaDocScrutinizer: it's deterministic.  if i manually mount, it works.  if i try to have file manager do its thing, it doesn't work09:09
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VrathaShadowJK: yeah, i'd love to do that.  not sure where logs are kept or how to add debug09:09
cehtehi wont wonder if the thing which tries to mount it expects some special blocksize and vat parameters which your card fails to support09:09
cehtehthe linux kernel prolly doesnt care .. but the nokia daemon fails on that09:10
Vrathai mean, i would expect /var/log, but they only have a single file09:10
ShadowJKonly if you install syslog09:10
Vrathaoh, i'll install that09:10
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Vrathacehteh: what is the name of the nokia daemon(s)?  and how did you find out this information?09:11
Vrathawould love to have some docs on it09:11
cehtehhaha .. we too :P09:12
cehtehintuition, grep, sacrifice a virgin ...09:12
ptlonly if she's ugly09:12
DocScrutinizeryou're aware you easily can *mount* /dev/xyz1 as vfat, even when the actual filesystem lives on a partition /dev/xyz1p109:13
ptllet the beautiful virgins survive, puh-lease.09:13
VrathaDocScrutinizer: i know.  but i didn't do that09:13
ShadowJKit checks that partition type is fat09:13
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Vrathawell, i can manually run that09:25
Vrathamounts fine09:25
Vrathai hate File Manager, and i don't see it printing anything new to the logs09:25
crashanddieanyone seeing anything wrong with this regex? !(?:http|https)://(?:[a-z0-9\-_]+\.)+[a-z]{2-5}(?:|\.[a-z]{2})/[a-z0-9\./%&=\?#\-_]+!i09:27
Vrathawhat exactly do you want to do with the regex09:30
DocScrutinizerthat's a regex???09:30
DocScrutinizerduh, so what's the meaning/semantics of !(?: forex?09:31
flux! and ! appears to be a pair, with i being a flag09:31
Vratha(?:...) groups without capturing09:31
fluxin any case, I can't get that to match anything.. oh well.09:32
DocScrutinizerif you'd know what it's *supposed* to do, you might be able to decrypt it09:33
Vrathalooks like he just wants the 2-letter domain roots09:33
Vrathaplus a couple more chars09:33
Vrathadon't know why09:33
Vrathaoh wait; that was also in a (?:09:34
Vrathawell, without knowing the purpose of the regex or what the problem is, can't say i see anything wrong with it09:34
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DocScrutinizerwell what's definitely wrong with it: it's utterly ugly and illegible.09:38
* DocScrutinizer suggets things like :alnum:09:39
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cehtehmhm .. i need a couch with buildin espresso machine ..09:39
DocScrutinizercehteh: that's paradox :-P09:40
cehtehyeah ... but hey i have to go to the kitchen to make coffee :P09:40
DocScrutinizerbut you won't need the couch after that ;-D09:41
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crashanddieDocScrutinizer: ! is used instead of /09:43
crashanddieDocScrutinizer: considering there's a lot of slashes in the regex itself, so I don't have to escape the whole thing09:43
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crashanddieVratha & DocScrutinizer: the point is to match any basic URL. Whether it's .com, .info,, etc. Also, I need to grab the document + arguments and anchors09:45
DocScrutinizerwell I'd start like !https?\://09:45
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crashanddiewhy escape :?09:46
DocScrutinizerjust for fun :-)09:46
crashanddiegood point about the https though09:46
crashanddiethe (?: is to define a group without having it show up as a selector09:47
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DocScrutinizer(?:| looks odd09:51
arachnistthat emoticon looks like a regex09:52
arachnistoh, it is a regex09:52
DocScrutinizerand now I'm getting tired of regex \:\-\)09:53
crashanddieDocScrutinizer: !https?://(?:[a-z0-9\-_]+\.)+[a-z]{2-5}(?:\.[a-z]{2})?(?::[0-9]{2,5})?/?(?:[a-z0-9\./%&=\?#\-_]+!i09:54
crashanddiebetter nao :)09:54
crashanddieI'm going to hate myself in 6 months when I need to debug that09:55
DocScrutinizerhat's the whole point09:55
crashanddieRegex is such a temporary knowledge09:55
crashanddieyou understand it for about 2 weeks09:55
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crashanddieand then you can shove a sasquatch up your bottom09:55
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DocScrutinizererrr {2-5} ?09:57
DocScrutinizerisn't that s/-/:/ ?09:57
DocScrutinizeras you stated, temporary knowledge09:57
crashanddieDocScrutinizer: eh?09:58
crashanddieoh, should be 2,509:58
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DocScrutinizer{2:5} rather than {2-5}?09:58
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DocScrutinizeror even , - yeah09:58
crashanddieyeah, i typoed while typing it over09:59
DocScrutinizerwhy the (?: around the (?::[0-9]{2,5})  ?10:00
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crashanddiefor what it's worth:
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crashanddieDocScrutinizer: to group it so I can ? it10:03
DocScrutinizeryeah, seen10:04
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DocScrutinizerdoesn't really make sense to me though, as I still fail to get the intention10:04
crashanddieallows the port to be provided if it's non-default10:05
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crashanddiefor example
DocScrutinizerso obviously this part >(?::[0-9]{2,5})?/?< is false in semantics of last two chars10:06
DocScrutinizerinstead of10:07
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crashanddiewell spotted10:09
crashanddiejust changed it to (?::[0-9]{2,5})?(?:/|/[a-z0-9...10:10
* DocScrutinizer wonders what http://foo:99999 will get you - afaik port range is not up to 10^6-110:14
crashanddiedon't care about that10:15
DocScrutinizerhttp://foo:0 also an interesting thing to test ;-P10:15
ptlis PR 1.2 out yet?Z10:15
crashanddieptl: YES10:15
ptlhow do I get it?10:15
crashanddieptl: throw your N900 in the toilet10:15
crashanddienew delivery system10:15
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ptlok, did that. What now?10:16
ShadowJKhavent all releases so far started on a monday?10:16
crashanddiehowever, you'll have to kill a 3 month old chicken and smear its blood on a Citroen 205 while walking in counter-clock-wise direction with your eyes closed10:16
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DocScrutinizerptl: nokia will upgrade it for you, and deliver back to you via gas pipe10:17
crashanddieDocScrutinizer: is that a way of telling him to shove it?10:18
crashanddie"gas pipe"?10:18
ptlDocScrutinizer: wow, that's original, but I get my gas via caskets, not pipe10:18
DocScrutinizerooh, too bad10:18
crashanddieok, going to get food, laters10:18
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sivanghi all10:28
sivangman the scratchbox download takes ages10:28
sivangCan't we host it ona more throughput able server?10:28
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ptlsivang: no, you have to feel the pain of waiting, to give it proper value.10:34
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kkb110meego yes!10:47
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Termana_n810kkb110 - random much?11:10
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JaffaMorning, all11:34
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* ioeee saluda o/12:25
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ShadowJKuh oh. gartner says 10.5million tablets will be sold12:27
ShadowJKthe same gartner that predicted billions of itanium12:27
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* SpeedEvil bought 350 tablets today.12:28
cehtehhehe .. itanium tablets :P12:29
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* noobmonkey awakes from the dead12:39
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tarlanhello Milo12:51
* ioeee se despide y cierra o/12:54
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* ptl is ending his shift today12:57
* ptl weeeeeee!!!12:58
* ptl is going to take a good day of rest... he deserves it12:58
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jacekowskiis it possible to configure n900 to be able to recieve messages from unauthorised contacts13:02
jacekowskion jabber13:02
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Robot101it should already be able to - on gtalk the server prevents that though13:04
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jacekowskiwell i have my own jabber setrver13:07
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jacekowskiand i was flooded with messages when i started psi on my PC13:07
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Robot101? it can't have been connected on your N900 then13:08
Robot101it's not possible to selectively recieve messages like that - not anything the N900 does anyway13:09
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jacekowskiwell, all messages that came from unauthorised contacts were left on server13:11
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Robot101which server is this?13:11
* noobmonkey blinks13:11
jacekowskiejabberd 2.1.213:12
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* rzr is discovering
jacekowskignu excludes social13:12
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Robot101jacekowski: that's pretty weird, could you come back tomorrow and ask about it on #telepathy when the devs are around?13:13
Stskeepsand includes dead cheese smell ;)13:13
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sgbirchis there a discussion of rpm vs deb for meego? I would like to post a survey13:14
rzrsgbirch: a survey is on i think13:15
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rzrsgbirch: bookmark this
sgbirchrzr thanks13:24
pupnikdo you think meego should have a community with easy porting of linux software?  or a walled "linux garden" like iphone, android13:25
pupnikbsd, whatever13:25
sgbirchI really dont want to downgrade to rpm again13:25
sgbirchmeego should be open of course, with git repos IN ONE PLACE for all open code13:26
sgbirchman ... maemo got so close, but kept screwing up the fundamentals13:26
cehtehhehe one-place somehow perverts the idea of distributed revision control :)13:27
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* SpeedEvil wtfs at packaging fanbois.13:27
sgbirchLOL Not really, the one place is the location of the masters, the ones pushed to the phone13:27
sgbirchall development can be full distrubuted, but is has to come together at some point13:28
sgbirchjust like all debian code is in one place, dead easy to grab13:28
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rzrsgbirch: debian servers are mirrored :)13:34
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Bobatronanyone about thats done opengl stuff on the n900 (in c)?13:45
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* n00bmonk3y waves14:00
n00bmonk3ylcuk2 - are you alive and around? :D14:00
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madduckcan i not install perl on the n900/freemantle?14:10
madduck  perl: Depends: perl-modules (>= 5.8.3-3osso11+0m5) but it is not installable14:11
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n00bmonk3ymadduck - dont know much about perl, but take a look at this thread
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pupnikcrashanddie: what is a good candidate solution for security cams and push-to-n90014:18
crashanddiepupnik: mind qualifying that a bit more?14:19
pupniksomething that can send motion alerts via message or video over network/3g14:20
pupniklooks like ip cams with integrated motion sense/push are sensible14:21
crashanddieyeah, they're your best bet14:22
madduckn00bmonk3y: thanks, that sent me to and there i learnt to just add the SDK APT repository14:22
pupniknothing exotic - just "hey something moved, here is the cam link"14:22
crashanddieyou can get them pretty cheap, they include a webserver, you can easily program hooks and stuff14:22
SpeedEvilpupnik: there are quite nice wrappers round 'motion'14:22
pupnikgot some joker setting fire to summa my stuff14:22
crashanddieautomatically send out emails, they ftp something directly to a server, can email you the link14:22
SpeedEvilpupnik: composite cameras can be lots cheaper than ip - if appropriate14:23
SpeedEvilpupnik: and linux capable USB input sticks are $814:23
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crashanddiepupnik: I used a few in one of my projects during final year, I can probably get you modelnumbers and pricing information within a few days14:23
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SpeedEvilAlso more sensitive14:24
pupnikyeah the composite with a mess of inputs and ADCs is an option14:25
ShapeshifterDoes someone know how to make this busybox ash save the history after every command? Like putting export PROMPT_COMMAND="history -n; history -a" in .bashrc for bash.14:29
fnordianslipShapeshifter: Install bash?14:30
Shapeshifterfnordianslip: so, busybox doesn't support that?14:31
fnordianslipdunno, i installed bach14:31
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fnordianslipbash, even14:31
Shapeshifterfnordianslip: any problems with bash so far?14:32
fnordianslipi haven't set it for root, only user, but no probs so far14:32
fnordiansliphad it like that for about 3 months14:33
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ShapeshifterMh, and how can I change the colors for this X Terminal? .Xdefaults doesn't seem to work.14:37
Shapeshifterand googling didn't yield anything. surprisingly14:37
Shapeshifter but it seems to be possible.14:38
fnordianslipxterm text colours on Maemo5? Use Font options in menu?14:39
t-tanShapeshifter: every serious shell user should install bash or zsh and the *-gnu utils. busybox sucks14:39
fnordianslipare the gnu-utils packages ok?  optified?14:40
Shapeshifterfnordianslip: mhh. thanks. but there's only foreground/background14:40
Shapeshifterfnordianslip: but that's most important.14:40
Shapeshiftert-tan: okay. zsh? last time I checked it didn't have zsh.14:40
* Shapeshifter checks again14:40
* madduck wants zsh-beta14:42
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t-tanfnordianslip: yep, optified14:43
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fnordianslipgetting quite tight on rootfs space again here14:43
t-tanIIRC ruskie ported zsh14:44
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t-tangnu-tools are coreutils-gnu, findutils-gnu, sed-gnu, grep-gnu14:45
wazdis there any unified address to access activated m5 theme on the device?14:46
Shapeshiftermhh. his own repo.14:46
Shapeshifterwhy not just extras-devel14:46
t-tanbash is in SDK, gnu-tools in extras-testing14:46
Shapeshiftert-tan: I meant zsh by ruskie14:46
t-tandon't know why he didn't push it to extras14:47
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dreginis there any way of displaying my last 4 or 5 emails in a widget?15:00
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joppu Anyone care to test this for a little while?15:00
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ruskiet-tan, Shapeshifter because I don't really like the /optification crap15:02
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t-tanruskie: with echo none > debian/optify you can disable the craptification...err..optification15:12
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* n00bmonk3y grumbles.... debugging is seriously not fun :(15:41
fnordianslipits more fun if there are no bugs15:43
n00bmonk3yyeah :) - there awsnt... now i'm getting GTK Errors on a pyQT app not using GTK15:44
n00bmonk3yFigured out if i import GTK - app works with a warning15:45
n00bmonk3yif i dont import i get a segmentation fault15:45
fnordianslipeek.  i'm trying to edge into gui app development with qt but haven't really got close to starting yet.15:47
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fnordianslipwhat does your app do?15:48
ruskiet-tan, I simply don't run it through maemo-optify-deb :)15:49
n00bmonk3yhealthcheck :|15:49
n00bmonk3ylearning to code though, so gonna have to learn how to debug :D15:49
ruskiet-tan, I also have gcoreutuls and gtar since I prefer binary prefixed not installed to yet another crap location15:49
fnordianslipcan it tell if the usb socket has fallen out?15:49
n00bmonk3ylol :P - not yet15:49
fnordiansliphey, it could keep a log of accelerations to prove that the device wasn't mishandled :)15:50
n00bmonk3ylol good idea - app to record sudden movements ;)15:51
t-tanruskie: my new versions have both bin/g* prefix and bin/gnu/* without prefix. the latter is very useful if you don't want to modify sane scripts15:51
t-tanruskie: the "none" disables the optify step on autobuilder15:51
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t-tanruskie: does "rm -i" work with your version? it segfaults with mine. could be a libc problem15:54
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ruskieworks fine15:55
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t-tanruskie: ok, thanks. so I'll upgrade to a later version than 7.415:56
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The_Tall1Has anybody else here killed his/her N810 testing a bluetooth service? I've got two now15:58
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n00bmonk3ywhittled down my seg fault to one line16:15
n00bmonk3yand it really isnt helpful16:15
n00bmonk3y app = QtGui.QApplication(sys.argv)16:15
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davyghello i still have a probleme with my n900 when i try to film something it says me "échec de l'opération"(=operation failure ?), it's juste chan i push the button to film, i can take photos without problem16:23
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* n00bmonk3y is about to give up... gtk is persistent... yet i can find no trace of gtk in my code :(16:32
Arif_someone hid it in there16:32
crashanddien00bmonk3y: learn to debug?16:33
Arif_or rewrite the whole app16:34
crashanddieI think learning how to debug will be a better investment for future use16:34
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davygnobody has an idea someone has spoken that it can be linked with audio but i don't know how to get the app using the sound system16:35
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n00bmonk3ylol crashanddie - i agree entirely16:38
n00bmonk3yjust hard....16:38
n00bmonk3yand lol Arif_ - i added gtk to a qt app... but finally learnt how to do it properly, and seem t ohave screwed myself16:38
n00bmonk3yIrony is it works fine for me... just not for lcuk16:39
n00bmonk3y(i only get a warning)16:39
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Arif_stop mixing weird things with eachother16:40
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Arif_what are you writing anyway :D16:42
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n00bmonk3ylol trying to stop mixing things :P16:44
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n00bmonk3ywriting healthcheck -
Arif_someone should write a fart app16:44
n00bmonk3y:D will put that on my todo list16:45
n00bmonk3y'pull my finger' it shall be called16:45
Arif_you could call it "Appstore Clone"16:46
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n00bmonk3yhaha :P16:47
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aLopliiiHi, i need a help on which is better OS version for usability for 77017:02
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n00bmonk3yooo sorry i have no idea :)17:06
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* Arif_ wonders when N900 users will ask that17:13
* haltdef wants one17:14
haltdefmsm7200a WM device to cortex A8 maemo 5 .. hopefully I'll be blown away17:15
* n00bmonk3y goes to wrap xmas presents ;)17:16
Arif_in March?17:16
Arif_can I have some too?17:17
crashanddiethis is the most ghetto-style email I have ever sent17:17
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crashanddieI just sent a project status update through telnet/smtp because gmail won't load17:18
haltdefget paid end of the month for the first time, will be the most money I've had in one place ready to blow on whatever I want :p17:18
haltdef(first job)17:18
crashanddiehaltdef: put 10-20% on your savings account17:18
crashanddiehaltdef: and congrats on the first job17:19
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haltdefthanks :p17:19
crashanddiehaltdef: do you pay rent or are you still living at your parents'?17:19
crashanddieok, defo make that 20% :P17:19
crashanddiedon't blow it all at once, show your parents you can manage your money17:20
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crashanddiefor the first two months, be very humble with your money, don't buy a new sound system, get your MOT done on the car17:20
haltdefdon't have a car17:20
crashanddieafter that, you'll be free like a bird17:20
crashanddiethey won't ever bother you again17:20
haltdefthey don't bother me now :P17:21
crashanddieno, but they will if you live with 'em, make money, don't pay rent, and buy stupid crap :P17:21
haltdefI will be paying them rent, more than fair amount though17:21
crashanddieok, fair enough17:22
crashanddiecan I ask how much of your wage is going towards rent?17:22
crashanddieHow much do you pay for transport?17:22
Arif_whats your job? :P17:22
crashanddie(percentage, don't care about actual values)17:22
haltdef£250 or so for rent, £100/mo or so on transport .. not a clue how much I'll be earning a month, taxes and stuff17:23
haltdefand I stack shelves at a supermarket17:23
crashanddietake 20% off your gross17:23
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crashanddieor google "uk tax calculator"17:23
crashanddieput in your gross, it'll spit out your net17:23
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crashanddiehaltdef: there's a golden rule to follow: there's 3 main expenses for any worker. Transport, rent/mortgage and food. The way to do it is to split them in 3 (30% each). The 10% that are left over go into savings17:25
crashanddieJust setup monthly wirings from your checking to your savings, so you're not tempted to "skip it this month"17:25
crashanddieseriously, the amount of cash you can get just by putting a tenner or so in a savings account is massive17:26
Arif_crashanddie has bad experience with money? xD17:26
crashanddieArif_: far from it17:26
crashanddieArif_: I just know how tempting it is to blow a fat wad of cash on your first paycheck17:26
haltdefmm, gonna be very careful with my monies .. seen the mess my parents got themselves into17:26
haltdefbut if there's £499 left over it's going to nokia :P17:27
Arif_as a student I don't have transport costs17:27
* Stskeeps ponders idly if haltdef was on #unrealircd..17:27
haltdefyes, I thought I might run into you here :P17:27
* Arif_ eats goverment money :D17:27
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Stskeepshaltdef: got yourself a n900? :P17:28
Arif_apparently being visually disabled has its advantages after you're 18 ! :P17:28
haltdefnot yet17:28
haltdefonly recently realized I want one, was pleased with my xperia x1 until I got this job17:28
haltdefabsolutely useless for video playback, good job qualcomm17:29
Arif_you should wait for the N900 succesor17:29
Stskeepshaltdef: what job? :P17:29
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crashanddieok, last fag and then to bed17:29
Arif_haltdef watches movies while stacking goods17:29
haltdefspent 18 months unemployed looking for something non-shit, that isn't going to happen17:29
haltdefnah I wanted to just watch a bit of tv while waiting for trains and buses17:30
Arif_what OS does that run on17:30
haltdefmy htc universal did a great job of videos, doesn't even have a GPU17:30
haltdefwindows mobile17:30
n00bmonk3yArif_ - last years xmas pressies - delayed delivery :D17:30
* Arif_ used coreplayer on WM17:31
haltdefnot a lot coreplayer can do when all it can decode with is a painfully slow cpu17:31
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haltdefbe fine if there was gpu acceleration17:31
Arif_I kinda miss it on maemo though17:31
Arif_reencode your movies to 200Kbit :P17:31
Arif_at 320x240 :D17:32
* haltdef cringes17:32
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haltdefx1 is wvga17:32
Arif_I want KMPlayer with hardware decoding17:33
Arif_buffering a TV stream takes like a minute17:33
Arif_and if it stutters the audio/video gets desynced17:33
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haltdefmost I'd want to play on it is a 576p x264 in mkv17:35
Arif_the N900 can't do that either17:35
haltdefyea, that'd be rare17:36
haltdefmostly 480p x264 or much lower resolution xvid17:36
Arif_not the warezed mkvs I threw at it at least17:36
haltdefwould they have been 720p?17:36
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Arif_those 60MB TV reencodes17:37
haltdef.. 60MB?17:37
haltdefhow long were they, 4 minutes?17:37
Arif_22 :P17:37
haltdefoh dear god17:37
haltdefthose can't look good17:37
Arif_I usually watch 175MB rips on the phone17:37
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Arif_and 720ps on the PC :P17:38
haltdefthat's what I'd do, I can't stand most xvid dvdrips though, messing with the resolution for no good reason17:38
haltdefplaces you can get encodes that are the same res as the dvd, 720x576 for PAL :p17:38
haltdef2mbps bitrate or so, depends on the source17:39
Arif_I mostly stream my TV card17:39
Arif_but KMPlayer can't cope with higher than 384 video in H.264 format17:39
haltdefoh nice, what software do you use on the pc side to do that?17:39
Arif_DVBViewer+Recording Service that uses VLC as streamer17:40
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haltdefis the built in media player on the n900 no good then?17:40
Arif_the built in player doesn't support it at all17:41
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Arif_maybe because it's in a TS container17:41
w00tStskeeps: it seems we can't evade the IRC people.17:41
haltdefw00t :o17:42
Stskeepshaltdef: learnt any kind of programming language yet? :P17:42
haltdefhrm, I guess xchat on maemo can be configured to connect to multiple servers on start?17:44
haltdefbe nice not having to faff with rdp and use mirc, gets a bit painful over gprs17:45
Arif_there's a vnc viewer17:45
Arif_with no rightclick !17:45
haltdefvnc ftl17:46
haltdefuse rdp on my x1 now, nice over 3g17:46
haltdefvnc .. isn't.17:46
Arif_it's hard to use with no stylus and no zoom feature17:46
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haltdefyea I couldn't use a capacitive device17:47
* Arif_ refuses to pay €7 for a new stylus17:48
* SpeedEvil found old stylus :)17:49
* Arif_ waits till DX has N900 styli :P17:50
haltdefso what's this n900 sucessor? not heard anything about it17:50
Arif_there isn't one yet17:50
Stskeepswe don't know anything, but we're pretty happy with n90017:50
w00twhy would you not be17:51
* haltdef wants a nice bulky phone17:51
Arif_haltdef, get an iPhone!17:52
haltdefhtc universal was the perfect size, it hasn't had a successor though :(17:52
haltdefvga, no hsdpa or edge, no gpu, no gps17:52
Arif_iPhone has a GPU and GPS17:52
Terje1haltdef, how about a Psion 5mx design with a built-in phone?17:52
Arif_and it's lower than VGA :D17:53
haltdefHVGA and keyboardless :<17:53
Arif_480x320 or something17:53
Arif_it also has a half eaten apple on the back17:53
Arif_everyone seems to love it :P17:53
Terje1Arif, lower resolution is just fine 95% of the time.17:53
haltdefthe pda I had in 2003 was VGA, don't get why so many devices use such a crap res17:54
Arif_does it really matter on such small screens17:54
Terje1Only when viewing photos can you see any difference.17:55
haltdefvideos :p17:55
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Terje1On videos you won't notice any difference.17:55
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Terje1High resolution just makes it difficult to tap on things.17:56
satmdonly if not done right17:57
Kegetyswhat does the resolution have to do with that?17:57
satmdsame with 'high resolution makes text hard to read"... ofc... if you don't tune the dpi17:57
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Terje1Kegetys, encourages usage of small elements.17:58
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Terje1satmd, of course I don't adjust dpi. I don't like twiddling.17:59
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Arif_VNC viewer needs a zoom feature17:59
Arif_and XChat needs bigger buttons17:59
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lindi-Arif_: gvncviewer has zoom18:03
lindi-Arif_: (no idea if maemo has that)18:03
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TurkuaZnasýl kurarým linux ?18:05
TurkuaZHow do I set up linux18:06
haltdefStskeeps, do the turks just follow you around or something? :P18:06
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TurkuaZWhat do you haltdef18:07
andre__TurkuaZ, you're in the wrong IRC channel, maybe?18:07
TurkuaZWhich channel Giricek andre__18:08
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redTurkuaZ: well first you need to pick which distribution you wish to use18:08
redand find that channel18:08
redthis one is for Maemo, used in Nokia mobile phones for example18:09
redif you have never used linux before, I suggest heading into and #ubuntu18:09
TurkuaZthanks  red18:10
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* Arif_ hides18:11
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Arif_I don't know him and I don't have anything to do with him... = P18:13
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haltdefhrm, hope weave on mobile firefox will let you use a custom server18:17
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haltdefnowhere to do it through the gui on the windows build18:18
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pvanhoofMohammadAG, you'll like Marvin too:
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pvanhoofRead The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, I think the guys who made that 404 were inspired by marvin :)18:37
MohammadAGthought it'd never end lol18:38
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MohammadAGoh well, back to mounting the rootfs.jffs2 file18:39
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MohammadAGmount: unknown filesystem type 'ubifs' :/18:45
* Arif_ wonders what MohammadAG is doing18:46
MohammadAGArif_, trying to mount the rootfs image from a FIASCO image to get the PR1.0 keyboard files18:47
MohammadAGArif_, this :)18:48
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Arif_better vkb18:49
Arif_maybe it'll be fixed in PR1.2!18:49
MohammadAGthey broke it by intention, why would they fix it18:49
BactiusDamn how nostalic this feels. I haven't been using irc for at least 12 years.18:50
Arif_or else we'll stab Nokia with a fork!18:50
SpeedEvilArif_: pitch, or dinner?18:50
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Arif_I don't want evil Nokia on my eating fork :p18:51
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wizkoderhy everybody18:51
wizkoderhow can I deinstall the maemo sdk?18:51
BactiusHi wizkoder. Using debian?18:51
MohammadAGrm -r /scratchbox18:51
wizkoderkubuntu 9.1018:51
MohammadAGrm -rf /scratchbox18:52
wizkoderI renamed /scratchbox to /scratchbox_old. But when I start the installer I get errors18:52
MohammadAGwhich say?18:53
wizkoderE: Something went wrong with the install. Sorry.18:54
wizkoderV [11:54:18 07.03.2010]: Installer execution failed18:54
wizkoderV [11:54:18 07.03.2010]: ----- Begin logging exception -----18:54
wizkoderTraceback (most recent call last):18:54
wizkoder  File "", line 2921, in run18:54
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wizkoder    task()18:54
wizkoder  File "", line 2460, in __taskInstallScratchbox18:54
wizkoder    raise Exception("Installer execution failed")18:54
wizkoderException: Installer execution failed18:54
wizkoderV [11:54:18 07.03.2010]: ----- End logging exception -----18:54
wizkoderV [11:54:18 07.03.2010]: Executor set exit status to (status_error)18:54
wizkoderE: Scratchbox command '/scratchbox/sbin/sbox_adduser' is not executable.18:55
MohammadAGtry sudo apt-get autoremove scratchbox*18:55
MohammadAGthough I doubt it installs anything like that...18:55
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wizkoderFound it. When I start the installer when scratchbox is still there it asks if I want to uninstall18:57
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wizkoderI updated my packages yesterday inside scratchbox. then nothing works anymore! never do that!18:58
MohammadAGwizkoder, how exactly did you update18:59
MohammadAGfakeroot apt-get upgrade works well here18:59
MohammadAGdist-upgrade might break it though18:59
wizkoderfakeroot apt-get update && fakeroot apt-get upgrade18:59
wizkoderafter that I got "asm" errors19:00
wizkoderNow I will need another whole day to reinstall everything :-(19:00
Bactiusdoh >_<19:02
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franz_mobilehey, anyone here might know why aren't downloads working on microb for me?19:26
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franz_mobileno matter the sitw/file/folder I'm saving stuff too, progress just stays on 0%19:26
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franz_mobilewhoops quit xchat accidentally19:28
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Bactiusfranz: I haven't tried downloads from microB yet. Will try immediately19:29
franz_mobilethey were working until a while ago, my first guess would be permissions, but it all seems normal...19:30
Bactiusand it's not certain connections or sites?19:32
NoobMonk3yhmmm how do you view the user list in xchat?19:33
wazdDamn, I need that armor for paintball games :D
franz_mobileI don't think so, it happened on two different sites right now...19:34
franz_mobilemicrob works with rapidshare right? :P19:34
Bactiuswhat kind of files are you downloading?19:34
franz_mobileright now a .zip19:35
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Bactiushave you been testing with other files?19:35
franz_mobileno... hmm, maybe I should try testing it all before asking for help19:37
Bactiusyes, I'm just trying to isolate the problem :)19:38
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franz_mobilehmm, let me try a couple more things then, be back later if it still doesnt work19:40
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lcuk2Stskeeps, in all your dist investigations for maemo, did you writeup any notes on the maemo startup process19:51
Stskeepslcuk2: first recently i got into fremantle, but i don't have notes19:52
Stskeepsjust in my head19:52
Stskeepsso shoot with any questions19:52
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lcuk2i will have to work out the questions first, theres a few things that could do with shifting around19:53
* NoobMonk3y thinks stskeeps has a very impressive big head :)19:53
StskeepsNoobMonk3y: no, i'm a *master, it's required to contain it :P19:54
NoobMonk3ylol :)19:54
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lcuk2Stskeeps, i will be looking indepth tomorrow at the startup and what happens before during and after upstart19:55
lcuk2and any special modes and considerations it currently runs19:55
Stskeepslcuk2: OK, i'll probably be fairly busy with meetings here in hel tomorrow but feel free to mail me any19:56
Stskeepsstart at preinit and getbootstate19:56
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lcuk2yeah ofc19:56
* lcuk2 has some special sunglasses so eyes dont get stung from looking inside the tardis19:56
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lcukNoobMonk3y, how long does it take your app from submit to extras-devel request to being told there is a .deb available?19:58
NoobMonk3ylcuk about 50 mins19:58
lcukmmn i thought that had gonnen much quicker19:58
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lcukyou know the cleaning process that occurs with old versions19:59
lcuki just pondered then whether debs could be rebuilt on the fly, but it would probably be hard19:59
NoobMonk3yyeah.... tis avail for upgrade at about 6 mins tho19:59
lcukespecially knowing the time19:59
lcukahh thats ready then19:59
lcuki wonder..19:59
NoobMonk3yhehe. not at home at the mo though. birthday dinner tonight. so wont be back till 9ish19:59
lcuk:p that was pondering something else,  your birthday?20:00
NoobMonk3ygf's sisters20:00
lcukand you are ircing20:00
lcukyour gf WILL kill you :p20:00
NoobMonk3yyup. not started fooding yet :)20:00
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NoobMonk3yshe is sat next to me!20:01
NoobMonk3ywatching some rubbish 50's film!20:01
lcukshe will get her revenge on you!20:01
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lcukmrs NoobMonk3y, take the n900 off greg!20:01
lcukmake him watch the same movie20:02
frals"mrs NoobMonk3y" lol20:02
NoobMonk3ylol she saw that20:02
lcukStskeeps, does that mer on n900 also run on x86 (not in a VM, i mean native)20:03
fralshmm, i wonder how i should fMMS to my CV20:03
fralsand what title i should use for myself20:03
Stskeepslcuk: yes, it does20:04
Stskeepsnone handy, but it does20:04
lcukand why isnt that fact plastered all over meego20:04
Stskeepscos we'll get meego there :)20:05
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lcukcool, so i can take the 0.17 build myself and build for my x41?20:06
Stskeepsright, grab x86-generic and the guide20:06
NoobMonk3yfrals, god of mms'ing?20:06
fralsNoobMonk3y: well... no ;(20:07
dotblankdo you think the first release of meego on the n900 will work as a phone or have phone functionality?20:07
Stskeepsdotblank: noone knows20:08
* Jaffa looks overy the nascent MWKN issue #620:08
StskeepsJaffa: it's online again?20:08
infobotStskeeps meant: Jaffa: it's online now?20:08
Stskeepsdotblank: but since ofono works, there's hope20:08
JaffaStskeeps: Will go online tomorrow at 6am UTC20:08
lcukNoobMonk3y, dont believe frals :)20:08
StskeepsJaffa: k20:08
JaffaStskeeps: However, atm I'm looking over the articles we've got so far and writing the lead in/lead out and selecting quotes.20:09
NoobMonk3ylcuk? why not, and i thought he was such an honest chap.20:09
fralsim not sure the employer in question would take it seriously ;)20:09
NoobMonk3ynokia? hehe20:10
JaffaStskeeps: Mer^2 is top of devel section atm20:10
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JaffaStskeeps: How's it progressing?20:10
StskeepsJaffa: the snapshot 40 is latest, i am currently waiting for some OBS related issues20:11
* b-man|laptop attempts to build a kernel on his n900 hoping nothing goes wrong20:13
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samw_On my Nokia N900,if i go to Application Manager and click on Update or Download, i get a message "Checking for updates,please wait" and then nothing happens.20:17
samw_The Application catalogs on my phone are Nokia Applications,Nokia System Software Updates,Ovi,,Maemo Extras.20:18
samw_The firmware version on my phone is 3.2010.02-8. Any way to fix the problem ?20:18
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tank-manmaybe there are no new updates20:18
samw_Im able to browse websites from the browser, but i guess Application manager is unable to connect to the repositories20:18
samw_if i search for an Application , it says "No match found"20:19
b-man|laptoptry 'apt-get update' in the terminal as root and see what happens20:19
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samw_b-man|laptop: i dont know the roor password on my phone..any way to find that out ?20:21
samw_i tried searching for rootsh in the app manager, but it said no match found20:21
samw_i think rootsh is needed to get root on the i right ?20:21
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b-man|laptop1 sec20:22
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b-man|laptopwhat's in the log in Application Manager?20:23
cehtehsamw_: basically yes, but there are few other ways too20:23
cehtehsshd, R&D mode ...20:23
samw_b-man|laptop: it says 'hildon-application-manager'20:24
b-man|laptophave you tryed rebooting the device and refreshing again?20:25
VDVsxfrals, SW developer/ Open source developer ? then add during this period bla bla I did these projects bla bla :D20:25
samw_b-man|laptop: i didnt reboot, ill try that now20:25
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fralsVDVsx: yeah, ill stick with developer, cheers :)20:26
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b-man|laptopsamw_: any luck?20:31
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b-man|laptophe left :P20:32
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b-man|n900samw_: any luck?20:34
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samw_b-man|laptop: no, it still says "Checking for updates,please wait" and its stuck at that20:34
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samw_any other way to get root in the X-terminal , so that i can try apt-get update ?20:36
b-man|laptopyou could enable R&D mode20:36
samw_b-man|laptop: ok20:37
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arnoldthebatsamw_ are you expecting an update for something specific?20:37
samw_arnoldthebat: no, i wanted to install rootsh on the phone20:38
arnoldthebatah, sorry, my mistake20:38
b-man|laptopsamw_: be careful ;)20:38
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samw_b-man|laptop: thnkx, ill try that :)20:38
* b-man|laptop grabs a sandwich20:39
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samw_b-man|laptop: any reason u think why the phone is unable to get information from the repositories ?20:44
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paulioanyone here know about software engineering? requirements analysis and stuff?20:45
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Stskeepstrying to forget that class? ;)20:46
pauliolol no i just need some help with an activity diagram20:46
mahersamw_: if you can browse the web on the phone go to[1][property]=title&org_openpsa_products_search[1][constraint]=LIKE&org_openpsa_products_search[1][value]=rootsh&org_openpsa_products_search[2][property]=os&org_openpsa_products_search[2][constraint]=LIKE&org_openpsa_products_search[2][value]=Maemo5&fetch=Search and just click on the install bbutton20:47
samw_maher: ok20:47
mahersamw_: that url was kind of long - just browse downloads....20:47
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samw_maher: i went to from the phone. Then i searched for rootsh. After i clicked on the Install link, the application manager opened and now i have a message "Preparing for installation,please wait" but its not going any further :(20:51
mahersamw_: at the terminal, try sudo gainroot20:52
samw_i get a message "Enable RD mode if you want to break your device"20:53
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FIQinstall rootah20:53
infobotFIQ meant: install rootsh20:54
samw_FIQ: rootsh ?20:54
mikhasRD mode consumes more battery power20:54
mikhasyou dont want that =)20:54
FIQit's in extras20:54
samw_FIQ infobot : thats the problem20:54
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samw_i want to install rootsh, but im unable to fetch anything from the repository in the Application Manager20:55
mahersamw_: do you still have the app manager running on the device?20:55
samw_maher: yeah20:55
FIQtry to do it in xte... oh, lol20:55
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mahersamw_: try and shut down all copies of the app manager before trying to install rootsh manually20:56
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samw_maher: i closed App can i check if any more copies running ?20:56
mahersamperi: ps auxw at terminal20:57
mahersamw_: ps auxw - there will be a lot of output20:57
samw_maher: any particular program name i should be looking for in the ps auxw ouput ?20:59
mahersamw_: just try installing rootsh again20:59
samw_maher: ok20:59
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samw_maher: again it halts at the message "Preparing for installation,please wait"21:08
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samw_could it be some problem with the device ?. The firmware version on my phone is 3.2010.02-821:09
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mahersamw_: dunno21:11
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samw_is there a deb file for rootsh which i can directly install ?21:11
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* NoobMonk3y is full..... :)21:18
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* GAN900 feels like blaming Nokia for the poor candidate turnout.21:24
samw_wooooohooooo..finally everything seems to be working ! :)..went to
Stskeepswhat, deadline over? :P21:24
samw_seems like some problem with maemo repos...that site has a mirror21:24
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samw_rootsh installed...finally got root on the phone ! :)21:27
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frankS2Anyone got a xen image of maemo?21:31
NoobMonk3ynot meeeeeee21:32
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* NoobMonk3y blinks21:35
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NoobMonk3ywhy is tv so crap on sunday evenings?! where top gear when you need it21:36
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koala_manNoobMonk3y: on bitorrent?21:38
NoobMonk3yjust normal tv21:38
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NoobMonk3yHmmmm how do i pull up a user list on xchat?21:40
Stskeeps /names ?21:41
NoobMonk3ywoah.... big block o' txt!21:41
NoobMonk3ybut worked. thankee21:41
NoobMonk3yit is ticked.... but says ctrl-f7 next to it.21:44
DocScrutinizerthat doesn't mean anything21:44
NoobMonk3ybut also doesnt do anything :)21:44
DocScrutinizerif it "doesn't show up", then it's resized to width=0 probably on right side21:45
DocScrutinizertry grabbing the border frame and drag it to left21:45
NoobMonk3ywas on the left21:45
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NoobMonk3ywell done!21:45
NoobMonk3yand a more buttons. thanks!21:45
NoobMonk3yalot better21:46
NoobMonk3ythanks doc :)21:46
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Funnyfacejust ordered my N900 :) I hope it won't be a disappointment21:52
NoobMonk3yquestion.... if i use py2deb... should i also be using debian control files?21:52
NoobMonk3ywooooop fuuny! good buy21:52
NoobMonk3yyou eill love it21:52
JaffaNoobMonk3y: AIUI, it creates 'em.21:52
NoobMonk3ycool. mailed khertan cos my bugtracker link isnt updating. so was thinking i'd bypass it. maybe not then ?)21:53
NoobMonk3yty jaffa21:53
NoobMonk3yfunnyface on mirc on mine at the mo, got a skype txt going on, mails perm going, and got 3 web pages open. tis a little beast21:54
NoobMonk3yirc* lol21:54
arachnistFunnyface: depends pretty much on what you expect from a phone21:54
arachnistFunnyface: for me it's the best phone around21:55
NoobMonk3yme too. although dont use the phone part too much, hehe21:55
arachnistit has a reasonable operating system (winmo and symbian aren't reasonable) and has a decent hardware keyboard21:55
Funnyfacewell, to compare, my current phone is a HTC TyTN II21:56
FunnyfaceI am overly pissed off with winmo21:56
Funnyfaceand the device was never any good21:56
NoobMonk3ythis will be a change :)21:56
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Funnyfaceit was based on some qualcomm chipset where HTC didn't include video drivers21:56
joppuSo, why does .rpm suck so much?21:57
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Funnyfaceso basically, the display was just as sluggish as it is when you have newly reinstalled windows on a computer, without installing the video drivers yet21:57
NoobMonk3ymate of mine got an hd2 last week. he now wishes he got the n900.21:57
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Funnyfacethen, another problem was that the keyboard dropped keystrokes21:57
haltdefew kaiser21:58
haltdefmsm72xx is awful too :(21:58
NoobMonk3yjoppu, no idea, why did the chicken cross the road.... errrrm why doe ist suck so much?21:58
Funnyfaceif you tried to type, you'd end up with thanks to some debouncer. no idea if it was software or hardware, but I never found a solution21:58
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NoobMonk3yhmmmm... i miss keys cos i cant type!21:58
Funnyfacehalfdef: well, I think those chipsets could be great, if they had only just utilized the power in them21:58
haltdefno they suck21:59
haltdefslow cpu :<21:59
Funnyface400MHz, but that's what was advertised, and it is reasonable for a device like that, but..21:59
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haltdefmy ~520mhz htc univeral outperforms my similarly clocked xperia x1 easily22:00
Funnyfacethey didn't utilise the GPU, so the CPU had to handle video as well as its own tasks22:00
haltdefuniversal doesn't even have a gpu :P22:00
NoobMonk3yhmmmm... i need a mugen.....22:00
Funnyfacewell I am no expert, but even the TyTN I had a little GPU22:01
Funnyfacejust for 2D stuff22:01
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haltdefyep, universal's an old device22:02
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Funnyfaceby the way, is there a GPS app for maemo yet that lets you use preloaded maps so you don't have to waste money on data?22:04
NoobMonk3ymaep i think22:04
NoobMonk3ybut navit is on its way as well i think22:04
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`0660i thought nokia released an app for preloading map data22:05
NoobMonk3yyeah never used the map loader22:05
NoobMonk3yheard it works tho22:05
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Funnyfacehehe I am kind of surprised that nokia released such a tool22:10
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Funnyfacebit of the idea with "over the air as you go" is that the mobile phone companies that make deals with nokia know that they can charge their customers with data later on22:10
Trizthmm... map loader don't seem to work22:10
Funnyfacethat there is more to earn from the device than just the initial sales price and the subscription22:11
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Funnyfacewhen nokia releases a tool like that, the devices it works on may be less interesting for mobile phone providers22:11
microlithFunnyface: sideloading has no real impact on data plans, unless you think there are people who would by the device and play a non-plan rate for data22:12
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Funnyfacemine is semi flat rate22:12
FunnyfaceI pay a max price each day22:13
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Funnyfacewhich is around 1.50 USD22:13
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Lumpio-I think I got my flat rate ("3.5Mbps") plan for 10EUR/month22:14
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Lumpio-It was a limited time offer, however it lasts for 2 years22:14
Lumpio-After that it's probably going to be more like 20EUR/month22:14
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Funnyfaceunless prices drop by then22:16
Lumpio-After 2 years I'm free to change providers if I don't like them anymore anyways.22:17
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Funnyfacehowever, does that deal allow you to use the connection on your PC or just your phone?22:18
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Funnyfacesome providers have stupid "WAP only" deals etc22:18
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Lumpio-It's full Internet22:19
Lumpio-Not like they'd be able to tell apart N900 and PC traffic anyways22:20
Funnyfaceand others just disallow its usage on a real computer in its TOS, although I guess it's hard to enforce that :P22:20
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NoobMonk3ywhen do you get your N900 funny, next working day?22:20
Funnyfaceordered it now, so 1-3 days I guess22:20
Funnyfacethe website listed 6 in stock22:21
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FunnyfaceI will be really pissed off if they are sold out22:21
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Funnyfacelike "we got 10 orders during the weekend, and we don't update the stock count until after the weekend when we have shipped the phones" :P22:22
Funnyfacebrb 10 min'ish22:22
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NoobMonk3yanyone bored, and not already tested healthcheck, and ok with extras-devel fancy testing it for me? :)22:29
NoobMonk3ytrying to see if anyone else gets the vanishing act on load?22:30
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NoobMonk3yhmmm batterrrrrrrry dyinggggggg22:35
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* NoobMonk3y blinks22:39
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NoobMonk3yits ohhhhh so quieeeeet22:43
lcukits oh so still22:44
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NoobMonk3ywill watch it when i get near a charger....!22:48
dotblankbecause of this meego project. I actually tried moblin today22:48
NoobMonk3yrunning low on juice22:48
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lcuktop up n900 with guiness22:48
dotblankim impressed..22:48
lcuk+ another n22:48
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dotblankis a bit Lacking in some areas22:48
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NoobMonk3ylol lcuk!22:49
* lcuk cant wait until real fuel cells come about where thats practical22:49
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lcuk"ill have a pint, and a glass of vodka for my device"22:50
* lcuk would marry bjork22:50
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* lcuk gets chills listening to big time sensuality22:51
NoobMonk3yyeah! could do with a mugen and powermat22:52
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lcukthanks noob you reminded me to start copying music onto n90022:53
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NoobMonk3ymeh 12%battery22:53
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NoobMonk3ylol! i'm amazing me22:53
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lcukat the summit, my battery started moaning at me that it was low22:53
lcuknormally only has about 10 mins left at that point22:54
lcukso i sat down to take some notes quick before the battery died22:54
NoobMonk3yineed to find a decent place to get music from (pay site)22:54
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lcuktracy gets most of her stuff from itunes22:54
pupnikn900 is the most godly device i have ever seen22:55
NoobMonk3ygot spare styluses now tho. £2 for 3 on ebay :)22:55
lcukshame the 900 didnt come with music22:55
lcukwe know that pupnik22:55
SpeedEvillcuk: mine did22:55
NoobMonk3yyeah. not a fan of itunes.... its pesty22:55
SpeedEvil5 free tracks.22:55
SpeedEvil(that I haven't claimed yet)22:55
lcukSpeedEvil, kewl22:55
lcukbut 5 tracks isnt like the same deal the other devices have22:55
lcukdont some have unlimited22:55
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SpeedEvil   Hi,22:56
SpeedEvilIn a random act of kindness, we’ve set you up a Nokia Music Store account that’s ready to be credited with 5 free tracks - that’s almost half an album!22:56
NoobMonk3yi'd be happy to pay£10 or £20 a month for downloads....22:56
lcuki tihnk a lot of people would noob22:56
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NoobMonk3yjust dont like the online sites like spotify....22:57
NoobMonk3yi abuse may battery enough as is...22:57
Arif_WOW 5 TRACKS22:58
DocScrutinizerI'm happy I hadn't to pay that 10pound / month on top of the already expensive N900, for 24months of music download I don't need, so...22:58
NoobMonk3ybetter than 422:58
Arif_that you can't play on the N900!22:58
NoobMonk3ysounds like a nokia master plan22:59
Arif_Nokia Music Store=DRM22:59
lcukSpeedEvil, you just gotta find someone else who had a random act of kindness on them and you can almost have a full ablum together"!22:59
Arif_Nokia N900=No DRM22:59
StskeepsArif_: they're actually getting rid of that22:59
Stskeeps(as in, drm)22:59
Arif_Stskeeps, not for the unlimited plan I read somewhere22:59
Arif_could be wrong though22:59
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pupniki like buying excellent cds.  in 100 years some one might appreciate them23:00
NoobMonk3yso no decent drm free sites to buy music easily from?23:00
lcukok, so if everyone got given the 5 track thing - which would be your 5 tracks23:00
FunnyfaceI'd gladly pay a monthly fee to legally do all the "piracy" I want.. because pirated stuff is normally so much more convenient than the legal stuff..23:00
Stskeepsthey stand and gather dust for me (cds)23:00
DocScrutinizerpupnik: in 100 years they are all rotten23:00
Stskeepsand i'm better at preserving my data than my cds23:00
lcukcd rot is normally only the copied ink based discs isnt it23:01
lcukor have they fscked up the alu prints as well ?23:01
pupniki have seen a couple pressed cds rot23:01
DocScrutinizerthe silver also oxidizes23:01
SpeedEvilFunnyface: When I had the spare cash, I would download warez books - then if I'd read one - I'd buy a copy of the book by the same author in some format23:01
lcukwhat am i gonna do about my ace of base cd o_O will future generations not be able to listen to it?23:01
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: Al23:01
DocScrutinizereven worse23:01
DocScrutinizergo for gold23:02
Arif_lcuk, flac them !23:02
Stskeepslcuk: you'll lend my mp3 copy of it from my diamond storage ZFS23:02
DocScrutinizerfor 100 years23:02
* SpeedEvil puts on some Ace of Base.23:02
NoobMonk3yawwww ace of base!!! my first ever tape!!23:02
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* lcuk purchased that cd from the NAFI store in an army base somewhere in deepest darkest germany23:02
lcukand the same night tracy rung me to say she was pregnant with luke23:03
NoobMonk3ylol i lived in hamburg 19 yrs ago23:03
Funnyfaceanyway, I believe flat rate is the way to go. pay a monthly fee and watch as many films, play as many games and listen to as much music as you want23:03
Funnyfacebut even then that's not always the full flexibility you want23:04
lcukFunnyface, that doesnt work23:04
lcukcos (a) piracy is more than that23:04
NoobMonk3yssssssssh let us dream!23:04
Funnyfacesometimes you might want to for example add a song to a silly youtube video you've made23:04
lcukand the people iwll always find something to pirate23:04
dvoid_anyone had any nice results to report about lowering swappiness on the n900?23:04
lcukif you release all that23:04
lcukthen they move to software23:04
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Funnyfacebut.. gl trying to do that the legal way.. I wonder how much the recording industry would charge you for legally making that video23:04
lcukand no monthly fee could cover it23:04
lcukdvoid_, lowering swappiness? just do like you do on your pc23:05
lcukie, close apps you arent running23:05
lcuki know its fun having 400 active running apps (cos you can!)23:05
dvoid_been running at swappiness 10 for a day now, i feels smoother but its to early to tell23:05
lcukbut its not always practical23:05
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Funnyfacepractically it will be too hard to get a working system23:06
NoobMonk3yright 5% battery, back laters!23:06
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Arif_isn't eyetoons DRM free?23:06
lcukcya NoobMonk3y23:06
dvoid_lcuk, i always close all apps when im not using the device23:06
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dvoid_lcuk, still it slows down to a crawl after a few days without reboot23:07
lcukdvoid_, what kinds of swappy probems are you having then23:07
lcukwhat are you actually running that brings it to a halt23:07
dvoid_like runnig a windows pc with 128mb ram ;)23:07
ali1234lcuk: swappiness is a tunable param of linux kernel that makes it use swap even before RAM is used:
dvoid_    same thing23:07
dvoid_for some strange reason maemo 5 uses swappiness 100 as default23:07
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dvoid_wich basicly tells the kernel to swap out everything in favor of disk cache23:08
* lcuk doesnt notice slowdowns much23:09
* Arif_ has the weird issue the battery drains faster when the phone's on for a few days23:09
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dvoid_i have some huge problems :S cant explain them, after a few days its just slow. i have never had the phone on for more then 3 days because of this. its unusable without a reboot23:10
ali1234could be the hildon-desktop thing where it starts using 100% CPU for no reason23:11
SpeedEvildvoid_: odd. WFM23:11
lcukat 20:52, noobmonkey said he had 12% batter23:11
ali1234i have only seen it a couple of times so it seems like something specific triggers it23:11
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dvoid_i've heard that some ppl claim their phone got really faster after a reflash. but i dont know. i suspect it might get as slow after a few days anyway :P23:11
lcukat 21:05, noobmonkey said he had 05% battery23:11
lcuk2 questions, how the heck is he draining that fast, and what code is his healthcheck running so much that drains the battery23:12
dvoid_anyway a swapiness of 100 cant be god, most linux dists use 60 or less23:12
lcukpeople having slowdowns etc23:13
lcukrun powertop23:13
lcukand put reports up23:13
mgregsonddvoid_: Isn't the disk solid state?23:13
lcuklets see what is happening23:13
dvoid_mgregsond, yea?23:14
mgregsondlcuk: I get massive slowdowns.  Load average hits 5 with alarming frequency.23:14
ali1234it is normal for the battery to appear to drain faster as it gets emptier23:14
mgregsonddvoid_: Swapping is mildly less expensive?23:14
SpeedEvildvoid_: swapping is _bad_ - it hits in many cases worst case write performances.23:14
SpeedEvilThe swap algorithm hasn't been patched to do the right thing for flash.23:14
SpeedEvilWhich is basically to always write linearly.23:14
lcukali1234, its proably also running lots of new apps and running through lots of code23:14
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lcukevening mr javispedro23:15
javispedromikkov: turxtorxracer works! :)23:16
javispedroevening dr. lcuk23:16
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javispedroor should I say dr. evil? >:)23:16
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lcukon both counts23:17
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DocScrutinizerali1234: bat guessometer is non linear23:19
lcukjavispedro, are you just getting it working a little bit, or packaged and ready to play with23:19
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javispedrolcuk: well, the UI is broken. the game plays fine and fast!23:19
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lcukas it should, the device has a strong pvr23:20
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javispedroI need to check on accelemymote (or whatever is called :) )23:21
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DocScrutinizerArif_: ali1234: load applet should become mandatory part of the base package23:26
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* DocScrutinizer considers a daemon to make indicator LED flash red on excessive CPU load. The higer the load, the faster the flashing23:27
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DocScrutinizera shellscript 10-liner plus a crontab entry should do23:29
ptlI've just filmed the lamest video ever about N900, showing the use of gtalk with video23:30
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ptldoes the N900 have cron?23:30
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SpeedEvilit has alarmd23:31
ptlyeah, I've seen the interface to alarmd23:31
SpeedEvilwhich is perhaps harder to use for random hacking23:31
ptlI thought it would be weird if it had two processes doing the same stuff23:31
DocScrutinizercrond needs a patch then23:32
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ptldo you guys know the manual page for alarmd?23:33
* DocScrutinizer doubts there's any23:34
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DocScrutinizeryou found the cheep-torch23:35
SpeedEvilI meant to post23:36
SpeedEvilbut it's not helpful on actually reading23:36
DocScrutinizerwow, what a manpage :-P23:37
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DocScrutinizer*Uses SystemUI to show dialogs for alarms and calendar events.  o.O (???)23:39
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* RST38h moos23:41
heoaDoes n810 support multitasking? Does the keys ^+ALT F<key> work?23:43
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Jaffaheoa: No, there's no true console mode on the N810 kernel AFAIK. However, there's multitasking in the GUI.23:45
Jaffaptl: There's a GUI for alarmd under development, as well, FWIW.23:46
heoaJaffa: does n900 have multitasking in console mode?23:46
Jaffaheoa: NAFAIK. Why do you want console mode?23:47
SpeedEvilthere is no console on n90023:47
SpeedEvilwell - there is serial console in principle with screen.23:47
SpeedEvilBut I suspect that's not what you meant.23:47
heoaJaffa: what else do you need?23:47
b-man|n900shouldn't console mode be possible through modifying the kernel?23:47
Jaffaheoa: I've no idea, I've never tried as I've no need.23:48
ali1234it is, just enable framebuffer console23:48
* b-man|n900 doesn't see why it's not at all possible23:48
JaffaStskeeps or someone who's played with porting another OS would probably be your best bet.23:48
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Shapeshifterguys, is there a way to access the cpu temp sensor?23:48
heoaali1234: framebuffer console?23:49
SpeedEvilb-man|: much that is possible is unimplemented.23:49
ali1234not unimplemented, just disabled in kernel config23:49
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Shapeshifterand huh, theres "usbcontrol" in extras-devel which claims to enable usb host mode. what is that abot23:50
ptlJaffa: I've seen this gui but didn't know this talk page, thanks.23:50
ali1234someone recompiled it for n900 but it doesn't work23:50
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ptlShapeshifter: in the mailing list they said that it was developed before the device was out, so the guy who did it didn't know it wouldn't have host mode23:50
heoaali1234: so you can enable multitasking console mode from kernel, anyone done it?23:51
Shapeshifterptl: ah23:51
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ali1234heoa: yes, someone in this channel said they did it23:51
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user__can anyone help, i tried installing midnightcommander but says a file is missing without telling which one23:51
ptl"USBControl was uploaded before anyone had a device in their hands and23:51
ptldiscovered there's no USB Host mode."23:51
* b-man|n900 is compiling a fb console module right now23:51
t-tanfbcon crashes a lot. I've disabled it again23:52
Ken-YoungIs there a file busybox reads when a new session is starts, where things like command aliases can be defined?   Something like .cshrc for the C shell?23:52
ptluser__: try using through the terminal, sudo gainroot, then apt-get install mc23:52
ptlKen-Young: .profile23:53
JaffaShapeshifter: It's a republish of a diablo package. Doesn't work on N900.23:53
Ken-Youngptl, Thanks!23:53
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user__ok ta23:53
heoaali1234: same works with n810L23:53
ali1234heoa: you must recompile the kernel23:54
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heoaali1234: can you use n900's kernel in n810?23:54
user__i had a similar problem with healthcheck programme, it says pulseaudio is missing. what do i do?23:54
user__i cant find pulseadio anywhere23:55
Shapeshifterso, the cpu temp cant be read out?23:55
heoab-man|n900: cannot understand why23:55
SpeedEvilI'm unsure if there is a CPU temperature sensor23:56
SpeedEvilI haven't looked in the datasheet23:56
b-man|n900heoa: first off, it uses totally diffrent hw drivers23:57
ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: I'm guessing its used for security cpu downscaling if it gets too hot.23:57
ShapeshifterI'd be surprised if it had no sensor23:58
ali1234it is possible to build a kernel which runs on both mtypes but it would increase the kernel size for no good reason23:58
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