| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: plus | 00:00 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: But there is a good chance these can be found at Savelka | 00:00 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: can't wait to test it :) | 00:00 |
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| timeless_mbp | spider solitaire was similar | 00:00 |
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| RST38h | javis: I wanted to ask you to take care of passing it through autobuilder | 00:00 |
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| Dantonic | hey is it normal for the quality of sound from the FM transmitter to be not so good compared to a regular fm radio station? | 00:00 |
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| timeless_mbp | plus! for windows 98 | 00:00 |
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| Dantonic | or not as good I should say | 00:00 |
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| RST38h | javis: I will do all the packaging | 00:00 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: send me the source and what you want to appear on maintainer line and I'll take care of it | 00:00 |
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| * Arkenoi *suddenly* spent last night out of the home and ran out of the battery at the morning, for sure | 00:00 |
| crashanddie_mbp | Dantonic: you're lucky if you can receive anything at all | 00:00 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: ah, you'll take care of packaging, even better. | 00:01 |
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| Dantonic | crashanddie_mbp, oh? | 00:01 |
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| RST38h | javis: It is 29MB of code and data, with some crufty makefiles | 00:01 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | Dantonic: tried on 4 different cars, didn't work on either | 00:01 |
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| timeless_mbp | anyway, roughly ms added about 1 game per version | 00:01 |
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| javispedro | 29MiB!! | 00:01 |
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| RST38h | mhm maemo.org/packages does not load | 00:01 |
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| timeless_mbp | with most games first available in plus packs | 00:01 |
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| Arkenoi | did not have a charger or cable with me, as i did not expect that | 00:01 |
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| Dantonic | crashanddie_mbp, then it's pretty much useless really... I mean how much power does it need to send out a decent short range FM signal? | 00:01 |
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| RST38h | javis: Includes some ogg sounds, they do not play of course | 00:01 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | Dantonic: the antenna is more likely to be the issue | 00:02 |
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| javispedro | ah | 00:02 |
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| Dantonic | hmm | 00:02 |
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| * javispedro doesn't know why Modest mail account setup for gmail defaults to IMAP | 00:02 |
| crashanddie_mbp | Dantonic: you can put a 5MW transmitter connected to a hairpin, you're not going to reach the end of the block | 00:02 |
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| SpeedEvil | Dantonic: regulatory issues. | 00:02 |
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| RST38h | you do not want pop3, really | 00:02 |
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| Dantonic | crashanddie_mbp, btw I've found that I get a better signal on higher frequencies maybe around 97-102FM | 00:02 |
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| SpeedEvil | Dantonic: the globallegal maximum is _tiny_ | 00:03 |
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| RST38h | modest pop3 is broken | 00:03 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: I've been using pop3 on my n810 for ages | 00:03 |
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| Dantonic | SpeedEvil, ah I see | 00:03 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: did they break it even more in fremantle? | 00:03 |
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| SpeedEvil | modest pop is also broken for me | 00:03 |
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| RST38h | javis: they just never fixed it | 00:03 |
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| javispedro | i see this thing will need quite a bit of work to make it usable =) | 00:03 |
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| Dantonic | crashanddie_mbp, SpeedEvil, well it's definitely much worse than a regular FM signal... so much that I wouldn't bother with it unless I absolutely had to. | 00:03 |
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| SpeedEvil | What is the manner of the breakage - and is there a workaround? | 00:03 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: all things considered | 00:03 |
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| timeless_mbp | i'd expect that imap w/ gmail is painful | 00:04 |
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| RST38h | pop3 basically hangs after a few checks and can only be fixed with reboot (or killing modest) | 00:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | we don't support idle | 00:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | so w/ pop you should just get "new" messages | 00:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | whereas w/ imap we should check the whole index | 00:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless; oh - not that - it simply says 'wrong password' | 00:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | not sure if this actually works | 00:04 |
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| RST38h | What is NOT painful with modest? | 00:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: eh? | 00:04 |
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| RST38h | POP3 does not work. | 00:04 |
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| * Arkenoi needs 103.0 MHz | 00:04 |
| crashanddie_mbp | Dantonic: mini jack + line in uses less power and is more reliable | 00:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless: I setup my login details, I attempt to connect, and it says wrong password. | 00:05 |
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| Arkenoi | RST38h, pop3 worked for me | 00:05 |
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| javispedro | I actually like pop3, I have been deleting older messages in my n810 for a year now | 00:05 |
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| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: hrm, is it using tls? | 00:05 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: let it run for a while | 00:05 |
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| javispedro | gmail uses ssl | 00:05 |
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| Arkenoi | RST38h, kept it running for a couple of days | 00:05 |
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| javispedro | not tls afaik | 00:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless: tcpdump shows it - sometimes - when it doesn't just say 'CAPA, then quit before getting a response - sending the correct username and password, then quitting | 00:05 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: komkon? | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | SpeedEvil: i think you're supposed to use tls | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you can see CAPA, then it isn't doing TLS | 00:06 |
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| Dantonic | crashanddie_mbp, well yes, that's how I use it in my car atm... it sounds wonderfully | 00:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | timeless: well - yes - but the server doesn't support TLS | 00:06 |
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| Dantonic | wonderful* | 00:06 |
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| Dantonic | :P | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=13287 | 00:06 |
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| divinegod | what is the most optimal format to encode video and audio in for best viewing experience on the n900? | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | Incoming Mail (POP3) Server - requires SSL: pop.gmail.com | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | Use SSL: Yes | 00:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | Port: 995 | 00:06 |
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| javispedro | as I said, gmail uses sll. | 00:07 |
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| javispedro | *ssl | 00:07 |
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| timeless_mbp | sorry, ssl, not tls | 00:07 |
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| pwnguin | divinegod: uncompressed avi at 800x480 | 00:07 |
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| javispedro | I've just set it up on modest | 00:07 |
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| javispedro | and it worked | 00:07 |
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| RST38h | wow, speccy is up to 7 votes | 00:07 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: how much I'll have to wait until my brand new loaned n900 grins to a halt under the pressure of modest having to check a POP3 account? =) | 00:07 |
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| Arkenoi | RST38h, nope, nwgsm.ru (komkon still alive? wow, i wonder if ethereal is, also) | 00:08 |
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| divinegod | pwnguin: and for a compressed format? I don't think I'll be able to get uncompressed avi over the web. | 00:08 |
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| RST38h | javis: Takes me a day | 00:08 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: ethereal is alive | 00:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | I don't think uncompressed is actually best | 00:08 |
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| pwnguin | just buy a very very big sdhc ;) | 00:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | I would start out at 400*240 | 00:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | and a couple of megabits mpeg4. | 00:09 |
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| divinegod | I could get a lot of sdhcs and then mail that to the users.. | 00:09 |
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| * Arkenoi plays with meizu m8 (winCE6.0). could be a nice thing if they haven't try to mimick iphone closely | 00:10 |
| divinegod | that must be the most sensible thing to do | 00:10 |
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| RST38h | meizu still exists? | 00:10 |
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| Arkenoi | yep | 00:10 |
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| pwnguin | divinegod: the things to identify are the bandwidth available and the cpu available | 00:10 |
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| homeasvs_ | derf, so, building inside a chroot on the phone seems to be working, fingers crossed | 00:10 |
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| divinegod | pwnguin: and the capabilities of the dsp perhaps? | 00:11 |
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| pwnguin | i guess that too | 00:11 |
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| Arkenoi | actually it is not a smartphone, more a slim mediaplayer with native dvd resolution and gsm module | 00:11 |
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| Arkenoi | wifi is almost broken | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | "KDE SC 4.4 Beta 1 has introduced tabbed windows as a new feature. It is now possible to tab together windows from different applications. This looks like it will be a very good productivity tool." | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | "KDE invents screen" | 00:11 |
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| pwnguin | if you're trying to optimize for experience, the less compression the better | 00:12 |
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| Arkenoi | will blog a mini-review soon | 00:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | RST38h: cool | 00:12 |
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| Zeddeh | so, how exactly would one sync the n900 calendar with google calendar? :) | 00:12 |
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| pwnguin | but it sounds like you want to know how much compute is available to decompress | 00:13 |
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| divinegod | it would be good if the video decoding could be offloaded to the dsp. I had an mp4 with HighProfile h264 video.. mediaplayer didn't like that | 00:13 |
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| Arkenoi | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35594&page=4 <- said to work this way, haven't tried yet | 00:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | divinegod: eh | 00:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | you're sure that video decoding is never offloaded? | 00:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | iirc the problem we had was that the dsp stuff we got had support for a really useless profile of mp4 | 00:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | you're welcome to pay someone for a better dsp impl | 00:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | good luck w/ that | 00:14 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | I love how on tmo the plural of "anecdote" is "statistical proof" | 00:14 |
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| divinegod | timeless_mbp: it is. But the video file I have is not encoded in a compatible format, I created bug 6635, which is now resolved wontfix. | 00:14 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6635 OpenMax returns error when trying to play an mp4 file with h264 video | 00:14 |
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| pwnguin | is the dsp documentation available? | 00:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | (oh, and iirc the dsp impl was also buggy) | 00:14 |
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| Shapeshifter | mhh, skype on the n900, is it done using the telepathy backend? >.> | 00:14 |
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| andre__ | detective, three days ago? which product do you refer to? | 00:14 |
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| Shapeshifter | that would be a surprise. | 00:14 |
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| javispedro | Shapeshifter: seems so! | 00:14 |
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| javispedro | it's integrated with the dialer app | 00:15 |
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| woglinde | pwnguin hm not all | 00:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | divinegod: do us a favor | 00:15 |
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| woglinde | pwnguin read here -> http://www.schleef.org/blog/2009/11/11/theora-on-ti-c64x-dsp-and-omap3/ | 00:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | don't say "i wish the system would do something" | 00:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | when you know that for some definition of _something_, the system in fact does it | 00:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | you're basically lying | 00:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | which is really rude | 00:16 |
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| divinegod | I beg your pardon. | 00:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you want to wish that it would support video decoding of highprofile, that's fie | 00:16 |
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| Shapeshifter | mhh nah telepathy is still using skype in the background | 00:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | but claiming that it doesn't at all, which is what you did | 00:16 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | divinegod: I think I speak for the majority of us: shut the fuck up | 00:16 |
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| * timeless_mbp grumbles | 00:16 |
| felipec | divinegod: that's not MPEG-4, that's H.264 | 00:17 |
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| divinegod | oh my. | 00:17 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | divinegod: (that's a joke, by the way) | 00:17 |
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| code177 | fyi you guys | 00:17 |
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| woglinde | huhu felipec | 00:17 |
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| pwnguin | timeless_mbp: so it looks like i can't just pay "someone" to program the DSP | 00:17 |
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| code177 | i managed to get (at expense) an n900 at the santa clara event | 00:17 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | pwnguin: why not? | 00:17 |
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| code177 | and it's everything i ever dreamed of | 00:17 |
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| code177 | so ignore the haters lol | 00:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | pwnguin: sure you can | 00:17 |
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| pwnguin | crashanddie_mbp: because the documentation isn't available? | 00:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | you have your choice of ARM and TI | 00:18 |
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| *** hrw is now known as hrw|gone | 00:18 |
| felipec | pwnguin: or bug TI to provide a decent DSP compiler that can compile FFmpeg? | 00:18 |
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| pwnguin | heh | 00:18 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | pwnguin: eh? | 00:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | and probably 3 other companies in the world | 00:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | i didn't say "pay anyone" | 00:18 |
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| andre__ | code177, nice to hear that you're happy with it :) | 00:19 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | nice to hear someone.... finally | 00:19 |
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| felipec | crashanddie_mbp: pwnguin: there's plenty of documentation how to program the DSP | 00:19 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | felipec: did I ever say the contrary? | 00:20 |
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| pwnguin | "The DSP on the OMAP3 is even more compelling for video decoding because attached to the DSP are several units that accelerate motion vector copying, VLC decoding, and loop deblocking. Unfortunately, these pieces are not publicly documented by TI, so the current Theora port (which is open source) is unable to use them." | 00:20 |
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| felipec | crashanddie_mbp: did I say you did? | 00:20 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | felipec: point taken | 00:20 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | pwnguin: that doesn't mean the DSP as a whole isn't documented | 00:21 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | pwnguin: when you learn to drive a car, you don't learn how to make tyres, yet you can still drive a car, right? | 00:21 |
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| felipec | pwnguin: that's true, but the DSP part alone is quite powerful | 00:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | pwnguin: is http://pixhawk.ethz.ch/wiki/omap/dsp relevant? | 00:22 |
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| pwnguin | crashanddie_mbp: its more like trying to drive without tires | 00:22 |
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| felipec | pwnguin: TI's MPEG-4 decoder for example is not using the hardware accelerator | 00:22 |
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| pwnguin | timeless_mbp: assuming that's whats' in the n900, it's a goo dstart | 00:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | pwnguin: please don't assume i'd recognize one chip from a piece of burnt silicon | 00:23 |
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| Arkenoi | funny, there are quite decent applications for text note taking and for sketches but not for combined :-( | 00:23 |
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| timeless_mbp | crashanddie_mbp: speaking of which, how do brits spell the area in CA around Palo Alto/Mountain View/Santa Clara/Standford? | 00:23 |
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| felipec | pwnguin: we measured the performance of the DSP Theora decoder, and it wasn't using the DSP fully, so the bottleneck is something else | 00:23 |
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| timeless_mbp | Arkenoi: MaemoPad+ ? | 00:23 |
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| RST38h | Arkenoi: Maemopad+ | 00:23 |
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| Arkenoi | will try | 00:23 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: like where I'm at? | 00:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | sure | 00:24 |
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| woglinde | felipec hm | 00:24 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: at the moment, I just say "Around the US office" | 00:24 |
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| RST38h | Ok. Sleep. | 00:24 |
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| woglinde | nite rst | 00:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | crashanddie_mbp: _____ valley | 00:24 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | dunno | 00:24 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | I don't speak to people, i just talk to myself | 00:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | i'm reading a book written in british english | 00:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | and their spelling of that word irks me | 00:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | (i can tolerate the other abuses) | 00:25 |
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| kynky | lol | 00:25 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | oh, silicon? | 00:25 |
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| pwnguin | how do you misspell that? | 00:25 |
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| ashenburger | silicone? :p | 00:25 |
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| timeless_mbp | the same way you misspell potato? | 00:25 |
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| fnordianslippers | fetus? | 00:25 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | silicon is made from silicone | 00:25 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | but they are not the same thing | 00:25 |
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| ashenburger | to be fair, he only asked how to misspel. job well done imo :) | 00:26 |
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| kynky | isnt silicon an element ? | 00:26 |
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| pwnguin | mipsel! | 00:26 |
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| ashenburger | oh the irony | 00:26 |
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| ashenburger | misspell* | 00:26 |
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| timeless_mbp | ashenburger: it's great word to botch | 00:26 |
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| timeless_mbp | along w/ spelling and grammer [sic] | 00:27 |
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| pwnguin | spelling? | 00:27 |
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| pillar | what was it that I need to do to get network working in scratchbox? I saw somewhere some guide for it, but can't find it now | 00:27 |
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| *** detective has quit IRC | 00:27 |
| felipec | pillar: search for resolv.conf | 00:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | so, according to this, silcone valley is the san fernando valley (after breast implants) | 00:28 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: if they used silicone valley, they're talking about LA -- for all the implants | 00:28 |
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| timeless_mbp | but given the context which was technology | 00:28 |
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| timeless_mbp | that means a translator fscked up | 00:28 |
|---|
| * timeless_mbp sighs | 00:28 |
| timeless_mbp | idiots++ | 00:28 |
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| kynky | not the first time then | 00:28 |
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| timeless_mbp | most localizers should be shot | 00:28 |
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| timeless_mbp | (i say this as a localizer of the n8x0 and n900) | 00:29 |
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| pwnguin | almost as bad as their pronounciation of Aluminum | 00:29 |
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| javispedro | either the battery meter is much improved, or the battery life is really awful on this thing. | 00:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | heh | 00:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | i'd bet on the latter :) | 00:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | it sounds much safer | 00:29 |
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| * javispedro would too. then sigh. | 00:29 |
| ashenburger | it drains pretty fast | 00:29 |
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| pillar | felipec yes found something, trying that, thanks | 00:29 |
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| kynky | pwnguin, was thinking of al-u-min-e-um thing too | 00:30 |
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| pwnguin | how what exactly is scratchbox? a vm? | 00:30 |
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| pwnguin | its the british version of nucular | 00:30 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | I loved it when I received a card announcing the birth of some kid in a far far away part of the family | 00:31 |
|---|
| ashenburger | time to search for tel'aran'rhiod, night gents | 00:31 |
|---|
| crashanddie_mbp | and the card read "A Blessing in the Skies -- Our angel is born" | 00:31 |
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| *** ashenburger has quit IRC | 00:32 |
| crashanddie_mbp | (Blessing in disguise...) | 00:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | oh gosh | 00:32 |
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| pwnguin | robots in the skies | 00:32 |
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| kynky | lol | 00:32 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | not worse than HR sending out an email to warn about the "Carpool tunnel syndrome" | 00:33 |
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| kynky | autobots transform | 00:33 |
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| timeless_mbp | kynky++ | 00:34 |
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| timeless_mbp | i still think our mirophones and micorophones are better | 00:34 |
|---|
| timeless_mbp | heck, i'm not sure that my all time favorite wasn't a request from a release manager: | 00:34 |
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| timeless_mbp | to all, please release your changes in smaller junks | 00:34 |
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| timeless_mbp | <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junk_(ship)> | 00:34 |
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| pwnguin | thats what she said | 00:35 |
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| *** grinseka1ze is now known as grinsekatze | 00:35 |
| timeless_mbp | that's pretty much what He said, yes | 00:35 |
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| timeless_mbp | and i printed the wikipedia article for him and hand delivered it | 00:35 |
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| kynky | lol, wikipedia the trustworthy source :) | 00:35 |
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| timeless_mbp | junks are quite large, and can thus handle quite large deliveries | 00:36 |
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| timeless_mbp | a smaller junk would indeed handle slightly smaller large deliveries :) | 00:36 |
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| kynky | move quite slow | 00:36 |
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| timeless_mbp | kynky: actually 007 was my authoritative source: http://www.jamesbondmm.co.uk/vehicles/scaramangas-junk | 00:36 |
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| kynky | good good =) | 00:37 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | I hate the "nucular" armerican way of saying nuclear | 00:37 |
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| Arkenoi | will maemopad+ work on n900? | 00:37 |
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| ManuelSE | nice app | 00:38 |
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| ManuelSE | contact author | 00:38 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | buy him a device | 00:39 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | he'll see what he can do | 00:39 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | lardman you wanker! | 00:39 |
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| hotaru2k3 | most Americans don't say it that way, and most of the ones who do just do it to get back at the brits for "aluminum" | 00:40 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | aluminium | 00:40 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | they're both valid spellings, that being said | 00:40 |
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| timeless_mbp | yeah, but the latter is just plain stupid ;-) | 00:41 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | actually, not really | 00:41 |
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| kynky | artefacts was a crazy one to spell | 00:42 |
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| timeless_mbp | you're going to defend it w/ beryllium ? | 00:42 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | I remember reading that they both appeared at the same time, maybe within two weeks of each other, and that aluminum might actually be older than aluminium | 00:42 |
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| *** maxxle has joined #maemo | 00:42 |
| timeless_mbp | personally i'm waiting for transparent aluminum | 00:43 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | lol | 00:43 |
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| mavhc | they invented that | 00:43 |
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| kynky | aluminium rusts! | 00:43 |
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| mavhc | but it's only transparent to extremely high energy light, for extremely short periods of time | 00:43 |
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| kynky | or should i say it oxidizes | 00:44 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: you're going to have to invent something more powerful than a "nucular" device in order to have copious amounts of transparent aluminium | 00:44 |
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| timeless_mbp | would a macintosh do? :) | 00:45 |
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| timeless_mbp | (hey, it worked for Scotty!) | 00:45 |
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| kynky | a fusion device ? | 00:45 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | kynky: fusion isn't hard | 00:45 |
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| maxxle | A suggestion for n900: The device should check if it's in horizontal/vertical position if one presses the Power-Button to access the phone option. Would be nice! What do u think? | 00:45 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 00:45 |
| crashanddie_mbp | maxxle: and you don't think that the device needs to be on in order to access that information? | 00:46 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | oh, sorry, misread that | 00:46 |
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| maxxle | ok | 00:46 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | maxxle: yeah, could be interesting | 00:46 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | kynky: want to do a fusion experiment? | 00:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | maxxle: i don't understand | 00:47 |
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| maxxle | crashanddie_mbp: Do i have to file a bugreport for this? Or is there an other way for this feature-request? | 00:47 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | timeless_mbp: hold the device in portrait, press power button, phone shows up | 00:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | hrm | 00:47 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | maxxle: actually, it's probably going to be classified as invalid | 00:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | i held my device in portrait, phone appeared | 00:47 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 00:47 |
| timeless_mbp | i pressed the power button, and i got a vertical power menu | 00:48 |
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| javispedro | i'm sorry, is that a small, ugly, flatten, wince style 3mm wide scrollbar on ovi maps??? | 00:48 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | maxxle: get someone to program a daemon to allow live shortcuts | 00:48 |
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| derf | homeasvs_: Glad to hear it. | 00:48 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: probably | 00:48 |
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| timeless_mbp | picture? | 00:48 |
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| javispedro | other than that, the application is not as awful as I though | 00:49 |
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| timeless_mbp | microb gives out those scrollbars to web pages that misbehave | 00:49 |
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| kynky | crashanddie_mbp, thanks for the offer, but its not neccesary | 00:49 |
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| javispedro | timeless: it's on the map settings map | 00:49 |
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| javispedro | er.. | 00:49 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | kynky: take a glass of water, put it in your freezer | 00:49 |
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| javispedro | route settings | 00:49 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | kynky: wait 6 hours, TADA, fusion! | 00:49 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | literally, cold fusion | 00:49 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: you owe me for making me open maps | 00:49 |
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| maxxle | hum.... i will try it as a bug. Actually it's one because if i'm in phone-mode the menu shows correctly and not 90° rotated | 00:50 |
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| javispedro | timeless: hopefully it's not only a es_ES issue then | 00:50 |
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| * javispedro is surprised at how the thing managed to pinpoint its location indoors | 00:51 |
| timeless_mbp | ctrl-shift-p | 00:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | picture? | 00:51 |
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| javispedro | ok, wait a bit | 00:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | it probably cheated and asked your cell network for help | 00:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | ah yeah | 00:51 |
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| javispedro | yeah, but it was very precise for that | 00:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | cellular is much faster than gps | 00:51 |
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| sivang | hmm, odd error | 00:51 |
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| timeless_mbp | and yeah, that's microb rewarding them for being stupid | 00:51 |
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| javispedro | faster probably, preciser? | 00:51 |
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| sivang | I erased /scratchbox and remove --purge it | 00:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | not more precise | 00:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | but much much much faster | 00:52 |
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| sivang | I retry the installation | 00:52 |
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| sivang | and I get: E: Scratchbox command '/scratchbox/compilers/bin/gcc' is not executable. | 00:52 |
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| sivang | anybody idea? | 00:52 |
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| javispedro | ah, so no need for me to screenshot anything :) | 00:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | nope | 00:52 |
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| javispedro | timeless: note also that panning doesn't work | 00:52 |
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| sivang | and scratchbox does not even have /scratchbox/compilers dir | 00:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | it doesn't? | 00:52 |
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| sivang | what went wrong ? | 00:52 |
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| timeless_mbp | wfm in my post sales version :) | 00:52 |
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| kynky | thought h2o (room temperature) to h2o (below zero) was just a change of energy states, so frozen water has potential energy, i thought say combining 2h with o to produce h2o was fusion, the fusing of elements where energy is produced and the waste product water is produced | 00:53 |
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| javispedro | oh, nice :) | 00:53 |
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| javispedro | well, let the ugly scroll bar rest there then | 00:53 |
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| kynky | but i havent done chemistry in about 15 years | 00:53 |
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| sivang | what creates the compilers dir ? | 00:54 |
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| timeless_mbp | sivang: host devkits | 00:54 |
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| *** fluff|afk is now known as fluff | 00:54 |
| sivang | timeless_mbp: can I install it manually from the non scratchbox chroot ? | 00:54 |
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| javispedro | toolchains | 00:54 |
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| timeless_mbp | that's how you do it | 00:54 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: whateve | 00:55 |
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| javispedro | :) | 00:55 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: hmm, I have to add the maemo repo manually then? | 00:55 |
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| * sivang wonders why it broke | 00:55 |
| sivang | the installer was runnning beautofully a coule of times ago | 00:55 |
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| javispedro | sivang, so you're not using the automated setup? | 00:55 |
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| javispedro | ah, you are. | 00:56 |
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| sivang | javispedro: I am | 00:56 |
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| timeless_mbp | you would probably add the scratchbox repo | 00:56 |
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| sivang | javispedro: it just fails :) | 00:56 |
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| sivang | javispedro: and it used to work, but I removed the /scratchbox dir by hand after apt-get remove --purge scratchbox-core and removing the user | 00:56 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 00:56 |
| sivang | javispedro: so to have the system in a vanilla state as before the setup | 00:57 |
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| javispedro | check for any other scratchbox- packages installed | 00:57 |
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| sivang | javispedro: http://pastie.org/730994 | 00:59 |
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| sivang | javispedro: http://pastie.org/730997 | 01:00 |
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| javispedro | sivang: can't you launch synaptic or something like that and purge all of them | 01:00 |
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| sivang | javispedro: that's what I did before this error | 01:00 |
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| sivang | javispedro: but with apt-get remove --purge | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | everyone of them | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | ? | 01:01 |
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| sivang | javispedro: synaptic is the same | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | are you sure they all depend on -core? | 01:01 |
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| sivang | javispedro: ah | 01:01 |
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| sivang | javispedro: good point | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | no, I'm not sure. just asking. | 01:01 |
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| * sivang checks | 01:01 |
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| sivang | javispedro: this is the magic line, sudo dpkg -l | grep scratchbox | cut -d" " -f3 | xargs sudo apt-get -y remove --purge | 01:04 |
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| sivang | javispedro: now retrying | 01:04 |
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| sivang | javispedro: right, so now it created the compliers dir | 01:06 |
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| * sivang crosses fingers for the install process | 01:06 |
| woglinde | sdk+ | 01:06 |
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| woglinde | no pain | 01:06 |
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| javispedro | i didn't have any pain with the usual sbox too. | 01:07 |
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| javispedro | but on maebar I have found quite a bit of people having nightmares with the SDK so.. | 01:07 |
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| sivang | javispedro: what's maebar ? | 01:07 |
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| javispedro | sivang: the maemo barcelona event, which just ended | 01:08 |
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| sivang | javispedro: ah, right, Jure told me about it but I was too short in time and funds to make to there | 01:08 |
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| sivang | javispedro: was a good event I reckon ? | 01:08 |
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| * javispedro glances at (timeless's?) n900 autorun.inf icon | 01:08 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 01:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | :) | 01:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | i hope you like it | 01:08 |
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| sivang | thanks javispedro , it works now | 01:09 |
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| javispedro | timeless: there's practically no way to dislike it. it's just the appropriate one. | 01:09 |
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| sivang | javispedro: I assumed everything depended on -core | 01:09 |
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| sivang | wrong | 01:09 |
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| javispedro | sivang: yeah, it was very nice :) | 01:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | :) | 01:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: you wouldn't believe what kind of feedback we had internally | 01:09 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: you with Nokia ? | 01:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | ayup | 01:10 |
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| * sivang wonders if he asked that already | 01:10 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: ah cool, you know Sami ? | 01:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | maemo.org/profile/view/timeless/ | 01:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | 'sami' doesn't seem like a unique name | 01:10 |
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| rohanpm | "you know Sami ?" is a hilarious thing to say to someone working for Nokia :-) | 01:11 |
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| * javispedro glances at "how to make dot prefixed folders appear on macos x 101" | 01:11 |
| rohanpm | it's like saying "you know John ?" to a Mormon | 01:11 |
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| sivang | hehe | 01:11 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: did you see how we did it? | 01:11 |
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| timeless_mbp | we cheated | 01:11 |
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| sivang | sorry folks, I'm digging a link | 01:12 |
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| BBNS | sami, timo, hmm what else ... | 01:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | totally evil and stupid workaround for an incredibly lame thing | 01:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | jaakko? | 01:12 |
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| BBNS | or jukka | 01:12 |
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| javispedro | timeless: don't have a mac near, but I can guess it considering the hidden files they're in "that" folder | 01:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | tuomas | 01:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | pekka | 01:12 |
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| frals | mika? marko? | 01:12 |
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| javispedro | s/they're/that are | 01:12 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: the Mac OS one? | 01:12 |
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| javispedro | yep | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | yeah | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | totally stupid hack | 01:13 |
|---|
| * sivang barfs at OS X | 01:13 |
| timeless_mbp | to work around a braindead design | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | sivang: nothing wrong w/ OS X | 01:13 |
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| sivang | braindead it is | 01:13 |
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| BBNS | always has difficult time to remember his finish colleagues' name. | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | something terribly wrong w/ the maemo file system layout | 01:13 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: sorry, Mac OS | 01:13 |
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| javispedro | this comes from the unixy part of macos x, so it's fine. the workaround is ugly :) | 01:13 |
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| sivang | as in System X | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | BBNS =~ s/finish/finnish/ | 01:13 |
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| Dyresen | So anyone else had n900's go brick? | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: at least the workaround works! | 01:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | we don't have a workaround for Linux! | 01:14 |
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| BBNS | timeless_mbp: oops ...sorry. =P they are both available word and spell check didn't warn me. | 01:14 |
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| sivang | that's the name: sami.j.viitanen | 01:14 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: ^^ | 01:14 |
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| * javispedro realizes someone actually snapshotted him unboxing his n900! | 01:14 |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 01:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | "maybe" | 01:14 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: he's a pro services consultant AFAICT | 01:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | my phone only knows a different viitanen | 01:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | also not an uncommon name | 01:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | jaakko is roughly jack | 01:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | pekka is iirc peter | 01:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | tuomas is thomas | 01:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | sami is sam | 01:15 |
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| javispedro | so, I'm a Linux user, and I don't know where to put my music files on. | 01:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | marko is mark | 01:15 |
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| javispedro | Here's to hoping Nautilus has similar "aliases" support. | 01:15 |
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| mikhas | on your ipod | 01:15 |
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| mece | I'm getting a "you cannot add the items(s) here. Choose a different location." error while copying music to my N900? Not weird. What is weird is it started after ~300 songs were copied. | 01:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | mika is mike | 01:15 |
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| Dyresen | Can anyone confirm that they have rock solid stable n900's? | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: it doesn't | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | but remember... tracker indexes all files | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | so you don't have to get them into the right folder | 01:16 |
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| javispedro | Dyresen: they're all unstable and crazy. they will kill you while you sleep. nokia knows this and is hiding the truth from you. | 01:16 |
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| sivang | timeless_mbp: I met him and Jure Sustersic on the Developer Day | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: um | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | the file system is fat | 01:16 |
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| mece | yesh... and? | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | there's a limit to the number of files in the root of the fat file system | 01:16 |
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| AakashPatel | Is there an issue with signatures on the email app? | 01:16 |
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| mikhas | yup, I just have my music files directly in MyDocs/, and the player finds them easily | 01:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you did tried to stick all the files into the root | 01:16 |
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| *** koan has quit IRC | 01:17 |
| timeless_mbp | then you're asking for it | 01:17 |
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| vblazquez | i'm trying to compile an application for n900 in scrachbox, but i receive that message, /scratchbox/compilers/host-gcc/bin/ld: warning: libstdc++.so.6, needed by /opt/qt4-maemo5/lib/libQtCore.so, may conflict with libstdc++.so.5, anyone know what kind of proble i have? | 01:17 |
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| *** koan has joined #maemo | 01:17 |
| AakashPatel | I save a signature but it doesnt show up unless i create an email, swtich the from address to adiffernt one, and then swtich it back | 01:17 |
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| timeless_mbp | how'd you get libstdc++.so.5 ?! | 01:17 |
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| javispedro | note /scratchbox/compilers/HOST-GCC/.. | 01:17 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: well, mine has been like that actually. | 01:18 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, they are all neatly divided into MyDocs/.sounds/<artistname>/<album name>/<artistname> - <tracknumber> - <trackname>.mp3 | 01:18 |
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| javispedro | either he has no target setup or the autosetup went mad again, in which case, *sigh* | 01:18 |
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| sivang | going to sleep, bye all | 01:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: i don't suppose you foolishly including folders that are marked as readonly? | 01:18 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: So I just wonder if they are slightly unstable, or if I can expect it to be rock solid if I get it changed. | 01:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | s/including/included/ | 01:18 |
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| vblazquez | javispedro: i can't see it | 01:18 |
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| *** teh_redee is now known as redeeman | 01:19 |
| javispedro | Dyresen: what do you mean by "slight unstable"? | 01:19 |
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| timeless_mbp | vblazquez: what host vendor distro version of linux are you running? | 01:19 |
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| AakashPatel | so no issues on the email signature :/ | 01:19 |
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| vblazquez | arch linux | 01:19 |
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| AakashPatel | ? | 01:19 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: like random reboots | 01:19 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, didn't check that. I copied from my wifes windows machine... | 01:19 |
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| javispedro | Dyresen: how often? | 01:19 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: did it tell you the name of the folder? | 01:19 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, nope, and I can't put files in any other folder either... wait, I'll test under something else than audio | 01:20 |
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| timeless_mbp | you can use 'attrib /s /d' on windows to try to find that (or something like that) | 01:20 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: if its once a day its too damn often, but mine was like every fifth minute most of the time. After about 20 hours it just went brick without me even touching the thing. | 01:20 |
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| javispedro | Dyresen: and you're even asking? | 01:20 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: you're using Mass Storage and not PC Suite, right? | 01:20 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, using pc suite | 01:21 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: Im asking if people have devices that are stable and nice. | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: oh | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | um | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | most of us stay away from pc suite | 01:21 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, understandable :) | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | it's probably the better choice | 01:21 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, Ill switch | 01:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | Dyresen, I for one am rather happy | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | but um, we don't understand it | 01:21 |
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| javispedro | Dyresen: man, for more than five minutes? of course! what do you think this is, a red light district "company" or what | 01:22 |
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| ali1234 | Dyresen: i've had exactly one unexplained reboot in 2 months, and that was video decoder related | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | mece: i'd rather you figure out what went wrong | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | sadly i know very little about how it works | 01:22 |
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| ShadowJK | pc suite is made of evil and fail, like all "helper" software.. | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | typically i'd start w/ filemon/procmon | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | but i don't know if pc suite counts | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | i suspect it's just a shell class thingy | 01:22 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: please learn how to read. Im not asking if people experience reboots every fifth minute. | 01:22 |
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| javispedro | last time I used pc suite it used some stupid explorer shell extension for | 01:22 |
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| javispedro | timeless++ | 01:22 |
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| timeless_mbp | which probably doesn't count from file/proc-mon's perspective | 01:23 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, yep, works now. Thankee-sai! | 01:23 |
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| mece | timeless_mbp, what went wrong is what ShadowJK said... | 01:23 |
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| Dyresen | ali1234: DocScrutinizer51 ahh oki, thats exactly what Im wondering about. So Ill get it replaced, not asking for money back then. | 01:23 |
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| javispedro | Dyresen: so I asked for your definition of "stable" (actually, slight instable). but either way you got your answer | 01:24 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: yes I did. | 01:24 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: I said once a day to too often ;) | 01:24 |
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| Dyresen | s/to /is /g | 01:24 |
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| ShadowJK | re stabillity, i've used my n900 for over a week. I've had 0 spontaneous reboots. the browser has crashed maybe 4 times, that's all | 01:25 |
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| javispedro | but every fifth minute is not normal. once a day, depending on your use .... (for example, I already saw it reboot twice =) can't complain since I'm messing) | 01:25 |
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| jaem_ | AakashPatel, sorry I took so long | 01:25 |
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| jaem_ | what's up? | 01:25 |
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| ShadowJK | i rebooted mine 2 or 3 times for sim card changes | 01:26 |
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| AakashPatel | Tryin to figure out why my signatures on email's arent showing up | 01:26 |
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| Dyresen | javispedro: yeah, Ill just ask them to send me a new one. | 01:26 |
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| Dyresen | thanks | 01:26 |
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| javispedro | ouch, couldn't Nokia just have used the usual "AUDIO" folder for.. audio. | 01:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, were you mentioning the gesture for history on browser to me? Are you involved in the browser development? | 01:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | yes | 01:27 |
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| fnordianslippers | i've had mine for eleven days and not experienced a single uncommanded reboot although it did once make a noise like a geiger counter causing me to reboot it. uptime of 3 days currently. | 01:27 |
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| AakashPatel | jaem_, Does it do the same thing for you? in the email app when you save a signature it doesnt show up in the message when you create one/ | 01:28 |
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| jaem_ | let me see | 01:28 |
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| ersin | hi all | 01:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, I find it,s quite difficult to do the right to left slide sabsolutely without any Y component | 01:29 |
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| jaem_ | AakashPatel, worksforme | 01:29 |
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| AakashPatel | hm wtf | 01:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer51: *shrug* | 01:29 |
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| AakashPatel | ill delete the account and re-add it | 01:29 |
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| ersin | i was wondering if it's possible to use nokia's diablo images to create a qemu disk image to boot off of w/ qemu | 01:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | ersin: i hope you own an n8x0 | 01:30 |
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| ersin | timeless_mbp: i do | 01:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, maybe browser could tolerate a fewdegrees up or down from absolutely flat line | 01:30 |
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| timeless_mbp | so, roughly speaking | 01:30 |
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| timeless_mbp | you can use system-qemu | 01:30 |
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| ersin | how so? | 01:30 |
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| mece | Dyresen, I haven't had a single crash. some 60 hour uptime now. I let it run empty once after the full charge, so I don't have 100% uptime, but pretty close. | 01:30 |
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| timeless_mbp | it has been used | 01:30 |
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| ersin | i see | 01:30 |
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| timeless_mbp | dunno :) | 01:30 |
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| * javispedro likes the thing | 01:30 |
| ersin | lol | 01:31 |
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| ersin | well how about this | 01:31 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer51: stylus or finger? | 01:31 |
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| ersin | nokia has separate images for everything (rootfs, kernel, etc.) | 01:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | finger | 01:31 |
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| ersin | do all those correspond to diff partitions on the internal flash? | 01:31 |
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| timeless_mbp | how much pressure? | 01:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | hmm | 01:31 |
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| timeless_mbp | ersin: from memory, yes | 01:32 |
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| ersin | timeless_mbp: thanks, i think that's enough to get started ;-) | 01:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | tried all but think more pressure works better | 01:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer51: the more pressure i apply, the more likely i am to get the gesture | 01:32 |
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| Dyresen | mece: nice to hear. Makes me think I have a faulty device. Ill just have'em send a new one. Hardly managed to play with it at all before it bricked. | 01:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | the thing is | 01:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you don't apply much pressure | 01:32 |
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| javispedro | ersin: search for n810 qemu, somebody already did it | 01:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | we think you're a stylus | 01:32 |
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| javispedro | ersin: s/n810/n800/ | 01:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | and assume that your high precision pointing device is intentionally not gesturing | 01:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, aah | 01:33 |
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| AakashPatel | waht the fuck | 01:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | thanks | 01:33 |
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| ersin | javispedro: sweet, thanks for the tip | 01:33 |
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| ersin | cyall later | 01:33 |
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| AakashPatel | jaem_, It doesnt show up on mine unless i change the from email and change it back | 01:33 |
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| javispedro | btw, for those of you who didn't hear me boast it at maebar, the eduroam bug has now a nokia-made unofficial fix!! | 01:34 |
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| jaem_ | AakashPatel, sorry, not sure | 01:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, also sometimes the picture slides to left and then"gets stuck" leaving a ca 10mm empty space at right side | 01:34 |
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| * AakashPatel thinks | 01:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, while doing this gesture | 01:35 |
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| mece | Dyresen, sounds like the 32wd_to/sw_rst reboot bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6334 | 01:35 |
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| povbot` | Bug 6334: random reboots | 01:35 |
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| AakashPatel | jaem_, That's odd | 01:35 |
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| timeless_mbp | DocScrutinizer51: i can understand what you're trying to describe, but i can't trigger it | 01:37 |
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| mece | Dyresen, if you want to help with that one, read the comments by Eero Tamminen (Nokia) on the bug and follow his instructions. | 01:37 |
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| mece | this thing needs an automagical album art downloader | 01:38 |
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| Dyresen | mece: thanks, Ill look into it! =) | 01:38 |
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| Dyresen | Need to "unbrick" the device as well though. | 01:38 |
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| Dyresen | But it came this way, it kind of sucks I think. | 01:38 |
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| mece | Dyresen, here's some info on the unbricking I believe: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 01:39 |
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| mece | Dyresen, yep. That's why it would be nice to find a solutions. Looks like a lot of people are working hard on it too. | 01:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless_mbp, no big thing. maybe I can create a screenshot or photo eventually | 01:40 |
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| mece | Dyresen, I've been lucky. The three N900's I use have had none of the problems that I've read about. | 01:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | the only problem I've experienced is the sucky front cam | 01:41 |
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| mece | SpeedEvil, what do you use it for? | 01:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | Well - and the lack of DSP accelleration in video codecs | 01:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | mece: simply testing at the moment. | 01:41 |
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| Dyresen | mece: yeah, Ill ask the shop to replace it anyway tomorrow. We shop there for approx $200K a year so it's not like he's going to denie. | 01:42 |
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| SpeedEvil | mece: but I found it unusable in any but almost directly sunlit rooms. | 01:42 |
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| mece | Dyresen, well it's pretty obvious it's broken, so should be no problem even for one-time customers I'd think. | 01:42 |
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| Dyresen | mece: yeah | 01:43 |
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| ShadowJK | which video codecs? | 01:46 |
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| jebba | wow. front cam is like 90% static colored pixels... Not even that low light (running mirror) | 01:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | yep | 01:51 |
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| javispedro | ah, better than n810's then. | 01:51 |
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| mece | LOL | 01:51 |
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| SpeedEvil | It may be possible that it's not quite setup right in firmware | 01:51 |
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| jebba | gonna be crap to encode for video conferencing. | 01:51 |
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| SpeedEvil | so you might get some improvement | 01:51 |
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| SpeedEvil | jebba: try moving it _right_next_ to a light, and it improves | 01:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, I'd think so | 01:51 |
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| mece | has anyone tried the google-album-art-downloader? http://maemo.org/packages/view/google-album-art-downloader/ | 01:52 |
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| * javispedro has some pictures that were taken ON SUNLIGHT and they're indistinguishable from static noise | 01:52 |
| javispedro | (n810 cam) | 01:52 |
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| javispedro | basically -- I just tried video conferencing once then forgot about it | 01:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | SpeedEvil, like "max ISPO/ASA, min exposure time" | 01:53 |
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| jebba | i'm in a reasonably lit room with a 60W bulb like a foot from my face pointing at it and it's still pretty lam | 01:53 |
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| jebba | lame | 01:53 |
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| jebba | it's gotta be more than just the camera. Like above, something whacked in firmware | 01:54 |
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| SpeedEvil | jebba: yes - about 10* more light than that, and it gets sort-of-ok | 01:54 |
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| arachnist | is there a way to grab video from the front cam like from the gack one? | 01:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | is the cam driver open source? | 01:55 |
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| arachnist | the back one is accessible using mplayer tv:// | 01:55 |
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| SpeedEvil | as is the front | 01:56 |
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| jebba | it actually kind of looks ok in that i can see the detail of me, but it's almost like a video effect of pixels layered above a decent image | 01:56 |
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| SpeedEvil | mplayer tv:// -tv device=/dev/video1 | 01:56 |
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| arachnist | oh | 01:56 |
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| javispedro | the cam driver should be open source -- it's on the kernel after all | 01:56 |
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| SpeedEvil | -fps 25 maybe too | 01:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | might try to find better config then | 01:57 |
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| jebba | oh rad, thx for mplayer hint. /dev/video0 gets you back camera, video1 gets front | 01:57 |
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| AakashPatel | someone help me fix my email signature problem | 01:57 |
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| AakashPatel | :) | 01:57 |
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| farrel_antares | I've just installed the maemo 5 SDK. But I can't to find a repositories list to add some apps,. Does anyone can help me? | 01:58 |
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| farrel_antares | I wanna install some web browser, but I cant find anyone. | 01:59 |
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| jebba | farrel_antares: see http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba | 01:59 |
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| KenYoung | Does anyone know if there is a function call which can be made by C code to put the N900 in portrait mode? | 02:03 |
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| * javispedro watches very confusing "no files" message in file manager when device is in g_storage mode | 02:06 |
| simula_ | KenYoung... do you have the maemo sdk set up? | 02:06 |
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| KenYoung | simula, Yes, I can compile code with it, and it works. | 02:06 |
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| simula_ | there has to be something in the maemo sdk docs | 02:07 |
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| farrel_antares | jebba, thank you, It was I needing. I'll try out. | 02:08 |
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| jebba | interesting, the main camera supports these mplayer options, but the front camera doesnt: "-tv brightness=50:contrast=50:hue=0:saturation=-100:gain=40:device=/dev/video0" | 02:10 |
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| jebba | changing video0 to 1 works fine, but brightness and all that doesn't get changed on front camera | 02:10 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | jebba: that's exactly part of the problem with abyssmal quality | 02:14 |
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| Gadgetoid | wth do those options do? | 02:15 |
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| jebba | i assume -vo is best? Gadgetoid, well, pretty much what they say: change brightness, contrast, gain, hue, etc. | 02:16 |
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| ali1234 | they set the parameters on the camera chip | 02:16 |
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| Gadgetoid | ahh | 02:16 |
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| jebba | this was my old mirror script on Eee900, fwiw: http://pastebin.ca/1704916 | 02:17 |
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| jebba | i assume -vo xv is best i should have said above. | 02:17 |
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| Andy80 | hi all | 02:17 |
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| simula_ | hey andy | 02:18 |
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| Andy80 | hi :) | 02:18 |
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| Andy80 | all sleeping after #maebar :P ? | 02:18 |
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| javispedro | hi andy | 02:20 |
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| javispedro | na, too busy trying to mess with the device :) | 02:20 |
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| Andy80 | :D | 02:20 |
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| Andy80 | ok... my problem now is: I've probably talked with you at meeting, but cannot associate a name to a face :\ | 02:21 |
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| javispedro | don't worry, the forgetfulness is mutual :) | 02:22 |
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| javispedro | ah, I think we didn't talk much though :P | 02:22 |
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| Andy80 | it's possible... I almost tried to help Thomas or talked with some spanish guys :P | 02:23 |
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| AakashPatel | whats a good doc editor for maemo? | 02:25 |
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| AakashPatel | that supports graphs and stuff | 02:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | openoffice? ;-P | 02:26 |
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| AakashPatel | Lol is there OOo for maemo? | 02:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | actually dunno | 02:27 |
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| javispedro | there's qole's chroot | 02:28 |
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| javispedro | which contains certain version of debian, including openoffice | 02:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | well, it worked on my P-II/300 128MB toughbook, so... | 02:28 |
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| javispedro | well, it's slow as hell on my Athlon/1900 2048MB workstation, so... ;P | 02:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | yes, that as well XD | 02:29 |
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| javispedro | maybe the 1.x versions were much faster? | 02:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | iirc v1.99 was kinda bearable (not more than one cig to smoke while opening a document) | 02:31 |
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| javispedro | wow, Nokia PC Suite is 250MiB? what does it contain, an operating system? | 02:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | Mpeg help? | 02:32 |
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| KMFDM | javispedro, you sure you dont mean ovi suite | 02:32 |
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| javispedro | heh | 02:32 |
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| javispedro | KMFDM: it says "Nokia PC Suite 7.1.30.9" | 02:32 |
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| javispedro | which is the latest one avail on nokia spain site.. | 02:33 |
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| KMFDM | let me see what version i have | 02:33 |
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| KMFDM | my installer was only 80 megs | 02:33 |
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| javispedro | oh they're different programs actually | 02:33 |
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| javispedro | yes, the installer is compressed. | 02:33 |
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| KMFDM | yeah | 02:33 |
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| javispedro | but my hdd space is gone | 02:33 |
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| KMFDM | i have nokia pc suite version 7.1.40.1 | 02:33 |
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| javispedro | well, how bad can 0.0.1 be? | 02:33 |
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| javispedro | ah, it worked fine. it even gets the device picture. | 02:35 |
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| simula_ | what filesystem type are you folks formatting your sdhc card as? | 02:37 |
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| jebba | i formatted mine as ext3, but each time i boot up it complains it can't read it (which doesnt matter as i mount it manually) | 02:39 |
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| ali1234 | how much do we know about the tv out? | 02:42 |
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| ali1234 | (on n900) | 02:43 |
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| BabelO | hi ali1234 | 02:43 |
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| ali1234 | hi | 02:43 |
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| BabelO | what are you looking for ? | 02:43 |
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| ali1234 | i'm wondering if it can do a real native unscaled PAL or NTSC mode with overscanning | 02:43 |
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| ali1234 | i'd guess it can't though, without rewriting the DSP code or something | 02:44 |
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| ali1234 | ideally I'd like to be able to feed it a X11 modeline :) | 02:44 |
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| BabelO | ok, i just tested all the rds stuff today :) but still looking for BCM2048 datasheet | 02:44 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: i uploaded qlandkartem to garage maemo :) | 02:45 |
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| ali1234 | don't think i've ever used it... | 02:45 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: about qlandkartem ? it is just new from today :) raster maps, you can use geotiff file | 02:47 |
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| ali1234 | isn't it the one that's always under discussion on #htc-linux? | 02:47 |
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| BabelO | yes and we have our channel on #qlandkarte | 02:48 |
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| ali1234 | mapping isn't really my thing, i prefer to stay home and play video games :) | 02:49 |
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| BabelO | :) | 02:49 |
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| ali1234 | but i demand pixel accurate representation of my emulated systems, hence the question :) | 02:49 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: did you try the rds stuff of N900 ? trnasmitter and receiver ? | 02:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | simula: I created 3 partitions on my 16GB: 13.5 vfat, 2 ext3 with OM-SHR linux os, and 0.5 swap | 02:51 |
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| ali1234 | BabelO: the FM? RDS as in FM digital text/station name/genre stuff? | 02:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | simula: seems maemo5 does a mount for vfat only atm, on boot / insertion of card | 02:53 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: yes, i changed the RDS text displayed on my radio car, and looking to display mp3 tad on radio car now | 02:53 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: for the receiver i look to rds data to add TMC feature | 02:54 |
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| ali1234 | it can broadcast RDS? that's pretty neat | 02:54 |
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| ali1234 | you can spoof your signal to be a traffic update, and send it to nearby cars (with a amplifier of course) | 02:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | BabelO: that's awesome | 02:54 |
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| BabelO | ali1234: yes, wen you enbale the N900 fm transmitter | 02:55 |
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| BabelO | it add a i2c device to /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-0063 | 02:55 |
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| ali1234 | yeah, i assumed it would transmit the analogue part only | 02:55 |
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| BabelO | something like that | 02:55 |
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| BabelO | and you can change the displayed text on fm radio with echo "testtestes" > rds_ps_name | 02:55 |
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| BabelO | by default it display nokia | 02:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | BabelO: darn! share a pointer? | 02:56 |
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| BabelO | DocScrutinizer-8: ? | 02:56 |
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| ali1234 | that's really cool | 02:56 |
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| BabelO | just looking at drivers, that's all | 02:57 |
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| BabelO | the bigger interesting part is the fm receiver when you enable rds feature | 02:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | BabelO: do I need additional err... things ? where can I get? | 02:57 |
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| BabelO | DocScrutinizer-8: no additionnal thing required | 02:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | duh | 02:57 |
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| BabelO | it is there | 02:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | amazing | 02:58 |
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| AakashPatel | is there a good multiprotcol chat client for maemo? | 02:59 |
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| AakashPatel | that supports yahoo, facebook chat, etc? | 02:59 |
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| AakashPatel | like pidgin :) | 02:59 |
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| AakashPatel | hm there is a pidgin client ;0 | 03:00 |
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| AakashPatel | aw :( not for os2009 | 03:00 |
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| ali1234 | i think pidgin is available in testing or devel | 03:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | I think pidgin was on N900 ootb | 03:01 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: you can just add the telepaty plugin and you will see all protocol natively available | 03:01 |
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| AakashPatel | to the conversation app? | 03:01 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: look at account-haze for msn for example | 03:01 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: yes | 03:01 |
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| ali1234 | yeah, telepathy-haze | 03:02 |
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| AakashPatel | so install the telepathy-haze package? | 03:02 |
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| BabelO | yes | 03:02 |
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| ali1234 | something like that, yeah :) | 03:02 |
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| AakashPatel | terminal here i come! | 03:02 |
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| ali1234 | it's in the app manager | 03:02 |
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| AakashPatel | in extras? | 03:02 |
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| AakashPatel | i didnt see it :/ | 03:02 |
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| ali1234 | or extras-testing, or extras-devel | 03:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | BabelO: where you got the info about the RDS interface and functions from? Just educated guess? :-) | 03:03 |
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| BabelO | DocScrutinizer-8: just reading the radio-bcm2048.c driver for the receiver part | 03:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | aah | 03:04 |
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| BabelO | and just testing and some personnal knowledge on rds for the transmiter part | 03:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | sorce is the spec and the doc. As usual | 03:04 |
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| BabelO | DocScrutinizer-8: just look to /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-* | 03:04 |
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| AakashPatel | account-plugin-haze? | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | once you enabled the device :) | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | you will understand yourself | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: yes this one | 03:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | BabelO: thanks :-)) | 03:05 |
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| AakashPatel | :( | 03:05 |
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| AakashPatel | it doesnt have facebook chat | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: haze is just for msn | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | idle is for irc | 03:05 |
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| AakashPatel | on ubuntu and stuff i forgot you have to install libpurple-facebook | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | jabber is for jabber and others | 03:05 |
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| AakashPatel | purple/pidgin* | 03:05 |
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| BabelO | if you know a gateway on jabber for facebook | 03:06 |
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| BabelO | but i think facebook use only webservices, maybe that's why it isn't in telepathy protocols | 03:06 |
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| ali1234 | haze is actually for all libpurple protocols | 03:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | (FM-amp) quite problematic to almost impossible. you can't simply place the device next to antenna plugged to amp's input | 03:07 |
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| ali1234 | butterfly is the native telepathy msn | 03:07 |
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| AakashPatel | fuck im a retard | 03:08 |
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| AakashPatel | i enabled the extras-devel | 03:08 |
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| AakashPatel | and it told me there were updates to some of my apps | 03:08 |
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| AakashPatel | ...i installed them | 03:08 |
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| jebba | i do that all the time | 03:08 |
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| AakashPatel | i just uninsatlled the ones i updated | 03:09 |
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| AakashPatel | and disabled devel | 03:09 |
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| AakashPatel | and reinstalled | 03:09 |
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| fnordianslip | its hard to remember if those things were installed from devel in the first place | 03:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | the more interesting Q is, how to undo that | 03:09 |
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| AakashPatel | I uninstalled 'em | 03:10 |
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| jebba | any idea which kernel module is loaded for front camera? | 03:11 |
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| jebba | board_rx51_camera,omap34xxcam_mod,et8ek8,ad5820,adp1653,smia_sensor one of them, i presume | 03:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | actually it's a PITA you can't select the source repo of packages that are in multiple repos | 03:12 |
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| BabelO | AakashPatel: you have aMsn if you want to do MSN with webcam of N900 | 03:12 |
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| javispedro | DocScrutinizer: tried apt-get install package=version ? | 03:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | jebba: check for change of refcount when starting mirror? | 03:13 |
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| ali1234 | jebba: look in /sys/class/video4linux/ | 03:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | javispedro: actually not. Was somewhat limited in my perspective to app-manager | 03:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | ali1234: right, isn't there a "driver" node telling name of driver? | 03:15 |
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| ali1234 | somewhere in sys, yes | 03:15 |
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| jebba | $ cat /sys/class/video4linux/video1/name | 03:16 |
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| jebba | omap3/vs6555// | 03:16 |
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| yuizy | hmh, the network stopped working on my scratchbox | 03:16 |
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| jebba | but that doesnt appear to be the module | 03:16 |
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| yuizy | i cannot install packages | 03:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | jebba: o.O ?? | 03:18 |
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| yuizy | ah the problem is with dns | 03:19 |
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| jebba | refcnt goes from 8 to 10 whichever camera I use in omap34xxcam_mod | 03:20 |
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| code177 | hrmm | 03:21 |
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| yuizy | can anyone help me with the networking problem? | 03:24 |
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| yuizy | i see the right ip in /sbin/ifconfig and i can go to http://193.184.164.139 with the browser but cannot go to http://repository.maemo.org | 03:25 |
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| johnx | yuizy, might need to copy your hosts resolv.conf in if you have DNS problems | 03:25 |
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| jebba | check /etc/resolv.conf | 03:25 |
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| johnx | s/hosts/host's | 03:26 |
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| yuizy | ah thanks | 03:26 |
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| jebba | or just `echo "nameserver 8.8.8.8 > /etc/resolv.conf"` | 03:26 |
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| yuizy | ok | 03:27 |
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| yuizy | do i have to reset something now? | 03:27 |
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| johnx | you shouldn't need to | 03:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | <ope | 03:27 |
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| johnx | might need to restart whatever program you had open in the worst case | 03:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | check "host ct.de" | 03:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | should resolve now | 03:29 |
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| yuizy | apt-get can't still find the repositories :( | 03:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | does "host foo.com" work? | 03:30 |
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| yuizy | no such command | 03:30 |
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| jebba | yuizy: does ` host www.google.com 8.8.8.8 ` work? if DocScrutinizer-8's command doesnt fly | 03:30 |
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| jebba | oh | 03:30 |
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| jebba | heh | 03:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | 8.8.8.8 ??? | 03:31 |
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| zash | 8.8.8.8.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer google-public-dns-a.google.com. | 03:31 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | I found it to be pretty slow | 03:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | duh | 03:32 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | ? | 03:32 |
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| yuizy | is there an alternative name for 'host' | 03:33 |
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| zash | yuizy: name? | 03:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | yuizy: ping ct.de | 03:33 |
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| zash | dig @8.8.8.8 ct.de | 03:34 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | http://twitpic.com/s0vp1 | 03:34 |
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| yuizy | no ping either :E | 03:34 |
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| yuizy | no such command i mean | 03:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | name not found, dig not found | 03:34 |
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| johnx | nslookup? | 03:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | huh?? | 03:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | 0ing worked here | 03:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | ping even | 03:34 |
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| johnx | DocScrutinizer-8, in the sdk or on the device? | 03:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | errr, device | 03:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | sorry | 03:35 |
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| yuizy | no nslookup | 03:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | /usr/sbin/* ? | 03:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | i.e. check path? | 03:36 |
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| yuizy | i searched the whole fs | 03:38 |
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| yuizy | no ping or nslookup or host | 03:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | :-/ | 03:38 |
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| yuizy | argh | 03:39 |
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| yuizy | no ideas? | 03:42 |
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| javispedro | did you install fakeroot-net? | 03:42 |
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| javispedro | ah, it's with the command line. nothing then. | 03:43 |
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| yuizy | yep | 03:43 |
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| javispedro | sbox holds a lot of copies of the resolv.conf file | 03:43 |
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| yuizy | and it worked but now i have different network environment | 03:43 |
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| javispedro | I suggest you find all of them in /scratchbox and edit them | 03:43 |
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| yuizy | ah thanks | 03:43 |
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| VDVsx | javispedro, is your new shiny n900 working well ? :P | 03:43 |
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| javispedro | yuizy: for example I remember there's one in /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf that the devkit tools use. | 03:44 |
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| javispedro | VDVsx: so far, so good :) | 03:44 |
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| VDVsx | :) | 03:44 |
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| * javispedro is loading nokia maps now | 03:44 |
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| VDVsx | ugh | 03:44 |
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| ShadowJK | 42% battery, 2.5 hours left out of 9 | 03:45 |
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| ShadowJK | n900 might just make it | 03:46 |
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| javispedro | good luck. | 03:46 |
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| javispedro | I really want to wish you good luck :) | 03:46 |
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| ShadowJK | lol | 03:46 |
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| javispedro | (cause up so far my greatest complain is battery life -- the battery meter was going down just too fast) | 03:46 |
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| ShadowJK | i guess there's the risk that it goes 30 - 0 in one big leap :) | 03:47 |
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| yuizy | hey now it works | 03:47 |
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| yuizy | thanks everyone | 03:47 |
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| ShadowJK | I just noticed I have huge scratch in the screen protector (duratec cleartec or something) | 03:47 |
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| javispedro | yuizy: so which files you edited? | 03:47 |
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| javispedro | we should document this somewhere | 03:48 |
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| ShadowJK | big enough to impair readability.. looks like it's caused by finger-scrolling.. | 03:48 |
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| yuizy | /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf made it work | 03:48 |
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| javispedro | finger sc | 03:48 |
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| javispedro | ou | 03:48 |
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| javispedro | finger scrolling causing scratches? O.o | 03:48 |
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| ShadowJK | maybe i should try the "self-healing" hitec version instead :) | 03:48 |
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| yuizy | and then i also changed targets/FREMANTLE_*/etc/resolv.conf | 03:49 |
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| ShadowJK | javispedro: the scratches are exactly where i scroll, and same curve/length too | 03:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer-8 | ShadowJK: (battery) on my test the device stayed alive for almost 90 minutes with backlight, on a battery showing 0% charge left | 03:52 |
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| javispedro | ouc | 03:53 |
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| javispedro | I just realized that the n900 no longer exports the entire drive to g_storage but just a partition | 03:53 |
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| javispedro | (thank god I didn't decide to fdisk it) | 03:54 |
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| ShadowJK | lol | 03:54 |
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| johnx | huh. you should be able to do something like an extended partition, right? | 03:55 |
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| johnx | I mean, isn't that how extended partitions work? | 03:55 |
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| javispedro | I think not -- I mean, i believe extended partitions don't share the exact same header | 03:55 |
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| yuizy | btw is it possible rotate the """""emulator""""" to portrait mode? | 03:55 |
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| javispedro | because for example ext partitions don't have the 4 partition limit | 03:55 |
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| johnx | very true | 03:55 |
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| javispedro | so I guess a fdisk-like program would be confused.. | 03:56 |
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| code177 | alright. here's a question | 03:56 |
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| javispedro | (most probably, would destroy the partition table :) ) | 03:56 |
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| johnx | yuizy, try passing a different resolution to Xephyr | 03:56 |
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| code177 | im trying to install a .deb file of my own making on my n900.. it runs perfectly if i run it as root, but i cant run it as the regular user because it doesnt have access to create files in /opt/programname/.. | 03:56 |
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| johnx | javispedro, probably just for that one partition though | 03:56 |
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| code177 | any ideas? | 03:57 |
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| code177 | :/ | 03:57 |
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| johnx | code177, yeah. the user shouldn't create files there | 03:57 |
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| code177 | where should the user create files then? | 03:57 |
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| javispedro | $HOME | 03:57 |
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| johnx | /home/user | 03:57 |
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| ShadowJK | what kind of files is oit? | 03:57 |
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| johnx | and for bigger files: /home/user/MyDocs | 03:57 |
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| ShadowJK | iy* | 03:57 |
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| code177 | ok so MyDocs then | 03:57 |
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| code177 | right! | 03:57 |
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| code177 | thanks.. i'll try that now | 03:57 |
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| ShadowJK | what kind of files? | 03:57 |
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| code177 | .db and .png files | 03:58 |
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| johnx | generally, user accessible things go in /home/user/MyDocs and settings files go in /home/user/.my-cool-app or similar | 03:58 |
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| johnx | keep in mind that /home/user/MyDocs will get pulled out from under your app if the user plugs in to USB and selects mass storage mode | 03:59 |
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| code177 | hmm ok | 03:59 |
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| johnx | ...and also that /home/user/MyDocs is vfat, so you don't get to use permissions | 03:59 |
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| code177 | well that's fine.. the less the better in this case | 04:00 |
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| code177 | i just need to write image files | 04:00 |
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| code177 | lots of them | 04:00 |
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| code177 | so i guess ~/MyDocs/.program/ ? | 04:00 |
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| johnx | should the user be able to look at them directly? or are they "in progress"? | 04:00 |
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| ShadowJK | is there some sort of magic gesture that starts the calendar? because I'm accidentally starting it rather often and I dont know how I' doing that | 04:01 |
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| code177 | the user can look at them if they want, if anything that's a benefit | 04:01 |
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| johnx | /home/user/MyDocs/.images might be good then | 04:01 |
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| code177 | not for this :) | 04:01 |
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| johnx | why not? | 04:02 |
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| code177 | half the reason i'm doing this is to keep them out of .images ;) | 04:02 |
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| javispedro | so the user doesn't want to see them | 04:02 |
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| zerojay | code177: What are you trying to do? | 04:02 |
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| code177 | hang on let me test this | 04:02 |
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| code177 | 2 mins | 04:03 |
|---|
| * javispedro kills Nokia Map Loader | 04:03 |
| javispedro | didn't do anything | 04:03 |
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| zerojay | code177: btw, it doesn't matter where your wallpaper files are at... the user WILL see them in the Images program anyway. | 04:03 |
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| johnx | hmmm. kinda of a mixed bag. dunno if you really want to start your folder name with a . if you put it in MyDocs. Except for the folders that are already there, I think folders/files beginning with a . won't be visible in file manager | 04:03 |
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| johnx | is there a situation where users might want to delete them manually? | 04:04 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | I like deleting things | 04:05 |
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| code177 | ok building package.. | 04:06 |
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| javispedro | you'll like rm | 04:06 |
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| code177 | nah 99% of people will be doing things indirectly | 04:06 |
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| code177 | that 1% arent going to be stopped by hidden folders | 04:06 |
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| johnx | code177, just throwing out a random scenario: say Bob tries the app, makes a whole bunch of pictures, removes the app and wants his space back? | 04:07 |
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| johnx | (not really arguing either way, just throwing out random scenarios) | 04:07 |
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| Macer | lol | 04:07 |
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| code177 | ya I've still gotta figure out how to do the uninstall stuff | 04:07 |
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| Macer | i love eureka | 04:07 |
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| javispedro | I think it's interesting to put them on .images/Wallpapers or the like | 04:07 |
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| Macer | lexa doig is in this one haha | 04:08 |
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| code177 | hmm ya maybe | 04:08 |
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| johnx | javispedro, depends on if they get indexed in a way he doesn't want them to be | 04:08 |
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| code177 | well let's see if this works first | 04:08 |
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| javispedro | as zerojay said, they will always be indexed | 04:08 |
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| javispedro | and the system wallpapers are indexed so.. | 04:08 |
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| code177 | ya im still skeptical about that | 04:09 |
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| johnx | well, .hidden directories definitely aren't visible in filemanager | 04:10 |
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| code177 | actually on a completely different brief side topic | 04:10 |
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| johnx | it won't even let you create directories with a . in front, which I guess is a "good thing" | 04:10 |
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| code177 | (whilst i do this) | 04:10 |
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| code177 | does anyone else find they have a massive craving for sugar after eating carbs? | 04:10 |
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| code177 | or is that just me | 04:10 |
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| Ronaldo38741 | Just you | 04:10 |
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| code177 | i just noticed it just then | 04:10 |
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| code177 | anyway.. | 04:10 |
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| johnx | I have a massive craving for beer and nachos...mmm | 04:11 |
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| Macer | beer and nachos? hahaha | 04:12 |
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| redeeman | i have a craving for bacon | 04:12 |
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| code177 | oh jees im retarded.. rebuilt the package without the new files | 04:12 |
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| * code177 facepalm | 04:12 |
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| Vratha | hi | 04:16 |
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| johnx | hallo Vratha | 04:16 |
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| Vratha | got my n900 :) now i need to figure out how to install an ssh server on it | 04:17 |
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| Vratha | nokia didn't setup any sources in /etc/apt/sources.list | 04:18 |
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| johnx | Vratha, go to downloads.maemo.org | 04:18 |
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| johnx | search for ssh | 04:18 |
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| johnx | click to install (if you surf to it in the device) | 04:18 |
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| asidjazz | 0% [Connecting to repository.maemo.org] | 04:18 |
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| asidjazz | repos down? | 04:19 |
|---|
| * johnx tests | 04:19 |
| Vratha | johnx: will do. i take it they have instructions up there for adding a deb source? | 04:19 |
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| johnx | well if you want to do it manually, you can go to http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras | 04:20 |
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| johnx | but they have a "click to install" file that automagically adds the repo and tells the "app manager" (apt frontend) to apt-get the right thing | 04:20 |
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| zerojay | code177: It doesn't matter if you make your files hidden or the directory they are in hidden... they will still be indexed and will still show up in Images regardless of what we do. | 04:21 |
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| Vratha | johnx: hmm, i will check it out. thanks for the info. if i click to install it'll add a permanent entry into the sources.list? | 04:21 |
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| javispedro | Extras is on the device | 04:21 |
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| javispedro | just disabled on the app mgr | 04:21 |
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| johnx | Vratha, yeah | 04:21 |
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| javispedro | so you can go to to the app mgr and go to menu -> repositories/catalogues -> extras -> enable | 04:22 |
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| johnx | also, you should listen to javispedro as well. I totally forgot it was already there :) | 04:22 |
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| javispedro | (if you don't want to use the web interface) | 04:22 |
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| * javispedro is busy merging contacts | 04:22 |
| Vratha | johnx: sweet! i'll try that first then and go from there. thanks for the links and info | 04:23 |
|---|
| javispedro | correlating ten year old SIM card contacts with more recent gtalk+skype contacts is fun stuff | 04:23 |
|---|
| * zerojay is busy waiting for Nokia to tell him what to do with his dead N900. :/ | 04:23 |
| code177 | side question | 04:23 |
|---|
| code177 | the cpu monitor widget thing | 04:23 |
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| johnx | ugh. had to do that already. now my n900 is the definitive source for all my contacts...and I badly need to figure out a way to get that info imported into evolution on my desktop or something ... | 04:23 |
|---|
| code177 | with the little squares | 04:23 |
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| arachnist | javispedro: i know the pain | 04:23 |
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| code177 | is there something that tells us what those mean? | 04:23 |
|---|
| johnx | load-applet? | 04:23 |
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| zerojay | left = cpu use, right memory use | 04:24 |
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| zerojay | left = cpu use, right = memory use | 04:24 |
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| code177 | thanks :) | 04:25 |
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| code177 | i still have to write up my report on santa clara =s | 04:25 |
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| asidjazz | Err http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/sdk Release.gpg Temporary failure resolving 'repository.maemo.org' | 04:25 |
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| asidjazz | cidjazz@ubuntu:~$ ping repository.maemo.org | 04:26 |
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| asidjazz | PING a515.g.akamai.net (207.114.197.94) 56(84) bytes of data. | 04:26 |
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| asidjazz | ..? | 04:26 |
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| johnx | seems to work here, but different akamai nodes seem to fall over at different times of day :| | 04:26 |
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| asidjazz | sigh | 04:27 |
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| asidjazz | can i reboot the vm at this point? | 04:27 |
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| * code177 <3 n900 | 04:27 |
| asidjazz | and just /scratchbox/login after i boot up? | 04:27 |
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| tadthebuilder | zerojay what happened to kill your n900? | 04:27 |
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| johnx | yeah, I think so | 04:27 |
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| code177 | you're ahead of the game asidjazz | 04:27 |
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| code177 | i was developing for about 6 weeks before i discovered /scratchbox/login lol | 04:27 |
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| zerojay | tadthebuilder: I had a prototype, given to me before Summit. Micro USB port solder points broke... so I can't charge it anymore. | 04:28 |
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| tadthebuilder | ah | 04:29 |
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| Vratha | zerojay: you have a dead n900? was it DOA? | 04:29 |
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| tadthebuilder | that would be a problem | 04:29 |
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| javispedro | tadthebuilder: and you're not the only with that issue, which is something to worry about... | 04:29 |
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| javispedro | errr. | 04:29 |
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| javispedro | ^^zerojay | 04:29 |
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| tadthebuilder | haha | 04:29 |
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| tadthebuilder | my issue is no money | 04:29 |
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| zerojay | Vratha: No, I had my N900 for three months or so already. | 04:30 |
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| zerojay | javispedro: Yeah, Texrat also... anyone else? | 04:30 |
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| javispedro | no one that I know of so far. | 04:30 |
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| javispedro | (only texrat) | 04:31 |
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| tadthebuilder | is it possible to buy a external charger? | 04:31 |
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| tadthebuilder | i know i know | 04:31 |
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| tadthebuilder | not a good solution | 04:31 |
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| tadthebuilder | but | 04:31 |
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| tadthebuilder | ... | 04:31 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | Hi there fellows | 04:31 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :) | 04:31 |
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| zerojay | That's only half the problem fixed. | 04:31 |
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| javispedro | yes, one using microwaves to recharge the battery | 04:31 |
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| javispedro | or magic | 04:31 |
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| Pavlov | keeping track of power microusb power cables seems to be a full time job | 04:32 |
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| tadthebuilder | what would be the other half | 04:32 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: so repository.maemo.org is up for you? | 04:32 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, yeah. just downloaded from it | 04:32 |
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| johnx | is the web page up for you at http://repository.maemo.org ? | 04:33 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | does anyone know a couple of webpages where I can search for apps for n900? | 04:33 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 04:33 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: how come i can ping it via another shell? | 04:33 |
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| jebba | asidjazz: i got 30k/sec downloading the kernel sources.... | 04:33 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, http://downloads.maemo.org | 04:33 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: maybe my file in /etc/ file is messed up | 04:33 |
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| asidjazz | sources.list | 04:33 |
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| Pavlov | wish i could make the n900 pull more power over usb | 04:33 |
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| Oli`` | My power converter (nokia->microusb) just started squeaking (!!) after being in the phone for an hour or so... Is that normal/hilarious/dangerous? | 04:33 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | it's ok Oli | 04:33 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | don't worry | 04:34 |
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| johnx | like, it squeaks while sitting there, plugged in? or squeaks when you remove it? | 04:34 |
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| javispedro | and also please rate the intensity of the sound :) | 04:34 |
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| Oli`` | Just when it's having power sucked through it | 04:34 |
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| ShadowJK | squeaks plugged in | 04:34 |
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| ShadowJK | mine does that too sometimes | 04:34 |
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| johnx | aaah, like the transformer in the power brick makes a high pitched "screaming" sound, or the N900 makes the sound? | 04:35 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | seems like you guys have a n900 | 04:35 |
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| Oli`` | Very low volume, high-pitched squeak that sort of oscillates in volume. Hard to describe other than to say: it's a bit like having a cricket in your room | 04:35 |
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| ShadowJK | the converter make high-ish pitched sound | 04:35 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, guilty as charged | 04:35 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | that's great, because I would like to make a couple of questions, as I'm about to buy one | 04:35 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :P | 04:35 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | and throw my HTc HD2 to the garbage can | 04:36 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 04:36 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, alright. ask away :) | 04:36 |
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| ShadowJK | what's wrong with hd2 btw? | 04:36 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | but before, I need to know those things that usually the reviews neve rmention | 04:36 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: im wondering if mybe my scratchbox shell is lacking internet | 04:36 |
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| Pavlov | Sir_Lancelot: you can send your hd2 this way ;) | 04:36 |
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| Pavlov | i almost like mine, will take another;) | 04:36 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, ah. that's very possible. or at least lacking DNS | 04:36 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | HD2 is sllugish my friend... | 04:36 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > /sbin/ifconfig | 04:36 |
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| asidjazz | SIOCGIFCONF: Bad address | 04:36 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > | 04:36 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | huge hardware, but software is still shit.. | 04:36 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | after all this time, it's still shit... | 04:37 |
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| Pavlov | windows mobile? | 04:37 |
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| Pavlov | what do you expect? | 04:37 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | a miracle | 04:37 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 04:37 |
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| Pavlov | give it some more time | 04:37 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | well....I was naive...I admit it... | 04:37 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 04:37 |
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| Pavlov | they need to upgrade the kernel, to at least the ce6 one | 04:37 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | yeah | 04:37 |
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| Pavlov | the hw on the hd2 is great though | 04:38 |
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| Pavlov | the screen looks and feels great | 04:38 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: how can i check w/ no ping or telnet :) | 04:38 |
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| johnx | the N900 has huge potential, and it does a lot of things great already, but don't buy it based on what you think it might do or assume that it has some app just because android or WinMo have it | 04:38 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | it's amazing ... not even this huge cpu solves the problem... | 04:38 |
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| Pavlov | the camera sticking out is a little weird | 04:38 |
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| javispedro | asidjazz: you are doing dangerous things. If you have DNS problems check out a discussion we had like an hour ago | 04:38 |
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| Pavlov | Sir_Lancelot: it makes a pretty big different | 04:38 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I'm more business focus | 04:38 |
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| Pavlov | the hd2 is much faster than most winmo devices | 04:38 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, so you need exchange sync (or whatever it's called)? | 04:39 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I need a device with good funcionality on what business is concerned | 04:39 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | yes | 04:39 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | but not only | 04:39 |
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| * ShadowJK doubts n900 is for you | 04:39 |
| Sir_Lancelot | I need to sync all taks, calendar, contacts and so on from Outlook...via cable | 04:39 |
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| johnx | it works pretty well with exchange 2007, but not 2003 or google (from what I've heard) | 04:39 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | not via exchange | 04:39 |
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| johnx | aaah, I have no idea about syncing directly to outlook | 04:40 |
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| johnx | that might be a no-go | 04:40 |
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| Pavlov | johnx: yeah, it only supports the latest AS protocol | 04:40 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | does it sync via cable? | 04:40 |
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| javispedro | does it sync? | 04:40 |
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| Pavlov | does pc suite do it? | 04:40 |
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| javispedro | all I got from pc suite was garbage | 04:40 |
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| asidjazz | javispedro: how can i make sure its dns | 04:40 |
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| javispedro | asidjazz: it is a resolve error isn't it? | 04:40 |
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| asidjazz | n/m found it | 04:41 |
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| asidjazz | i duno but i have odd ip's in /etc/resolv.conf im gonna fix | 04:41 |
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| Dyresen | dig <hostname here> usualy gives you all dns info you want | 04:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | not only I need it to sync direclty all the shit with Outlook, I also need it so make all rmeoinders and alarms of it | 04:41 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, you very well might be out of luck | 04:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | if it makes this, I'll buy it tomorrow | 04:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | noooooooooooo | 04:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :( | 04:41 |
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| javispedro | yeah, the calendar is semiuseless for power-calendar-users | 04:41 |
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| asidjazz | hmm that didnt fix it | 04:42 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | why? | 04:42 |
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| asidjazz | javispedro: i dont konw if its a resolve or a netowrk error | 04:42 |
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| javispedro | so I'd guess it would be totally useless for power-calendar-business-users | 04:42 |
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| johnx | javispedro, works pretty well with invites sent from iCal users. heh | 04:42 |
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| johnx | but yeah, the PIM is still a little "light" | 04:42 |
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| javispedro | johnx: and from what I've seen i'll will be mostly fine with it -- but it has lest features than the original 1991 palmos one | 04:42 |
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| johnx | PalmOS in 1991? | 04:43 |
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| javispedro | bah | 04:43 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | what do you mean by light PIM? | 04:43 |
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| javispedro | you'll make me check the date now | 04:43 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | no appointment support? | 04:43 |
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| johnx | pretty light on features | 04:43 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | no alarms? | 04:43 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | no cable sync with outlook? | 04:44 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | no taks? | 04:44 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | no notes? | 04:44 |
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| johnx | it has alarms, and events, but no direct sync with outlook AFAIK | 04:44 |
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| johnx | lots of good notes apps actually | 04:44 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | shiiiiiiiitttttttttttttttttttttttt | 04:44 |
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| javispedro | alarms hardcoded to at most 15 minutes before the event | 04:44 |
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| johnx | that's where it really shines | 04:44 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: where is the thread that talks about dns/netowrk issues w/ scratchbox | 04:44 |
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| asidjazz | is this normal : | 04:44 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > /sbin/ifconfig | 04:44 |
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| asidjazz | SIOCGIFCONF: Bad address | 04:44 |
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| Pavlov | winmo is where you're going to have the best sync with outlook | 04:44 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, sorry. I have no idea. I don't use scratchbox | 04:44 |
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| Pavlov | period | 04:44 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | with previous S60 devices | 04:44 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I had the same funcionality as with WinMo | 04:45 |
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| johnx | Maemo is as different from S60 as S60 is from PalmOS4 | 04:45 |
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| asidjazz | sigh | 04:45 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | that's why I ike it so much | 04:45 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: you mean you hvaent messed w/ the sdk? or theres an alternative to sbox? | 04:45 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | don't understand why business devices can't be ebntertaining as well | 04:46 |
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| javispedro | asidjazz: you're trying to change your host ip stack settings using an armel binary from another operating system era | 04:46 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | for exmaple: great device...lot of apps and so on...but for business, it sucks big time! | 04:46 |
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| johnx | it's an N series. so I guess Nokia is pushing it towards non-business people, and keeping S60 for business | 04:46 |
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| javispedro | (yes I consider debian sarge THAT old) | 04:46 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | aww | 04:47 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | stupid people....why can't a business phone, be fun as well? | 04:47 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | don't badmouth the sarge | 04:47 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, huh. which one? | 04:47 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I'm criticising iphone | 04:47 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | which is a nice device | 04:47 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | tons of fun apps and so on | 04:47 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | but in the end, for business, it sucks | 04:48 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, haven't messed with it since diablo or chinook or something. I don't package for maemo anymore. It was pushing my sanity to close to breaking. But, let me see if I can dig up the thread on talk.maemo.org, though you'd probably have the same luck as me ... | 04:48 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | and seems like n900 is following the same path | 04:48 |
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| javispedro | it's called "following the masses" | 04:48 |
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| javispedro | just keep exploiting wince until it dies | 04:48 |
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| javispedro | then get used to the basically lower-featured alternatives | 04:48 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, I'm not sure if it's following the same path. Maemo ends up with better PIM every release. Maemo 4 didn't have a calendar ... at all | 04:48 |
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| javispedro | and try to make the best with the rest of the features :) | 04:49 |
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| johnx | (or at least not one from Nokia. plenty of interesting 3rd party stuff) | 04:49 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | aren't there any 3rd party PIM for n900? | 04:50 |
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| javispedro | there are, but none of them really are up to what you're asking | 04:50 |
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| johnx | not yet | 04:50 |
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| johnx | been out for like a week so far | 04:50 |
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| javispedro | well there's GPE already | 04:50 |
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| johnx | oops. totally forgot that was on maemo 5 already | 04:51 |
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| johnx | (even though I saw it in the repo) | 04:51 |
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| javispedro | i was trying to get it until I decided the builtin calendar would do for now :) | 04:51 |
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| johnx | but yeah, making a calendar that syncs with outlook isn't what free-software hackers tend to do in their down-time :) | 04:51 |
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| ersin | hi all | 04:51 |
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| johnx | allo ersin | 04:52 |
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| arachnist | too bad google servers don't implement exchange properly. "mail would be more useful" | 04:52 |
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| ersin | does anyone have any debian rules files experience? | 04:52 |
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| javispedro | gnite :) | 04:52 |
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| ersin | or makefile experience i guess? | 04:52 |
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| arachnist | mail for exchange"* | 04:52 |
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| johnx | ersin, a bit | 04:52 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, uhm. from outside scratchbox, look at /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf | 04:53 |
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| ersin | johnx: i'm trying to compile a program that requires libtool 2.2, whereas the scratchbox diablo version is older...so, ideally i'd like to make a new package for it, but scratchbox won't overwrite its dev tools since it stores them outside of the environment...thus, i'm trying to figure out how to set the PATH within the debian rules file while running configure | 04:54 |
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| * Arkenoi have seen just one mobile PIM that was powerful "enough", Agendus, and PalmOS version only, wm was different and worse | 04:54 |
| johnx | ersin, can you just call whatever utility you need with the full path name? (kind of a hack, I realize) | 04:55 |
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| ersin | johnx: eh not really, it's more like autoconf requires a certain libtool m4 macro that doesn't exist in maemo's version of libtool | 04:56 |
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| johnx | Arkenoi, yeah. I think I started on like PalmOS 3.x (whichever one supported color), getting used to the PIM and then being totally shocked when everything after that was worse | 04:56 |
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| ersin | johnx: hmm actually i just ran "which libtool", and now i'm wondering if i just compiled a new version with --prefix=/targets/links/arch_tools/bin as opposed to --prefix=/bin... | 04:57 |
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| johnx | ersin, so maybe I'm being dumb, but can you just call libtool explicitly when you need it? or maybe include the macro (.m4 file, right?) in the top directory of the source package? | 04:57 |
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| jebba | what is the "upstream" for the n900 kernel? I assume they aren't just working directly on vanilla 2.6.28. Is there some ARM git repo or something they track? | 04:57 |
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| hotaru2k3 | does garnetvm work on maemo 5? | 04:57 |
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| Arkenoi | johnx: that always make me wonder: PIM is the thing that is most important for mobile devices and it is so poorly implemented and has just basic functionality everywhere | 04:58 |
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| johnx | jebba, probably linux-omap | 04:58 |
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| asidjazz | johnx: you rule | 04:58 |
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| johnx | Arkenoi, I get the feeling that it doesn't sell devices or at least marketing thinks it doesn't | 04:58 |
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| johnx | or maybe no one has any idea what "good PIM" is these days | 04:58 |
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| ersin | johnx: probably including the macro would be alright, but it feels like a major hack...what if upstream changes and requires a new version of the macro? i'd have to update each time | 04:58 |
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| johnx | Arkenoi, but yeah, it's kind of a weird situation... | 04:58 |
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| jebba | because it has patches to things like reiserfs, and i doubt they are bothering with thigns like that, so some upstream is likely changing that and they are inheriting it. | 04:58 |
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| ersin | johnx: i mean all the solutions will be hacks, unless i figure out a way to overwrite scratchbox's default dev tools | 04:59 |
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| asidjazz | nokia maps is the slowest app ive ever seen on anything ever | 04:59 |
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| Arkenoi | john: i've heared quite popular opinion that agendus was "overwhelmed with useless functions" :-/ | 05:00 |
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| johnx | ersin, if you overwrite scratchbox's dev tools you might be in for a lot more pain than just copying a .m4 in place (or it might work with no problem. who knows? :) ) | 05:00 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I have the same feeling johnx...PIM is not having the same attention from the manufacturers, as they used to have.. | 05:00 |
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| ersin | johnx: fair 'nuff =) i'll try that, thanks | 05:00 |
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| johnx | well, they're phones or handhelds or internet talbets now, not personal digital assistants | 05:00 |
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| Arkenoi | asidjazz, that probably means you never owned a 9k series communicator before ;-) | 05:01 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | with the hardware they are having, they could be all those | 05:01 |
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| johnx | ersin, I don't usually encourage hacks when there's a reasonable fix. but playing around with scratchbox is a deep rabbit hole :) | 05:01 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, it's not the hardware, and you of all people should know that :P | 05:01 |
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| johnx | asidjazz, working for you now? | 05:03 |
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| johnx | hotaru2k3, actually, I know it's not officially available...but it *might* with some hacking | 05:04 |
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| johnx | anyone here played with funambol before? | 05:06 |
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| AakashN900 | is there an app in extras or something to look at the fronht cam | 05:08 |
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| johnx | mirror | 05:08 |
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| AakashN900 | what repo | 05:09 |
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| AakashN900 | devel? | 05:09 |
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| johnx | maybe? | 05:09 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | another question: how is 3rd party software going for maemo? | 05:09 |
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| redeeman | i think just extras | 05:09 |
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| redeeman | Sir_Lancelot: i've written a simple application maemo lacks: a stopwatch | 05:09 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, pretty good, IMHO :) | 05:10 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | are previous maemo versions apps supported by maemo 5? | 05:10 |
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| johnx | redeeman, I just used it the other day | 05:10 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, through some minor reworking, but not directly | 05:10 |
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| AakashN900 | ah yea in extras | 05:10 |
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| redeeman | johnx: do you know what will happen with maemo 6? since its gonna be mainly Qt, are they gonna remove support for the old sh**, or keep it around? | 05:10 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | are there any good forums and so on...a community for meamos like there is the Xda for WinMo devices? | 05:11 |
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| johnx | redeeman, I think the gtk stuff will be "community supported," so ... dunno how that will end up | 05:11 |
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| hotaru2k3 | anyone here use usb networking on an n810? | 05:11 |
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| redeeman | im kinda hoping it will be moved into something optional | 05:11 |
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| AakashN900 | ah yea in extras | 05:11 |
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| AakashN900 | what the hell | 05:11 |
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| AakashN900 | its sooo blurry | 05:11 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, almost everything maemo is on maemo.org right now | 05:11 |
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| AakashN900 | why is it this horrid? | 05:12 |
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| johnx | talk.maemo.org for forums, downloads.maemo.org for apps, and now we have maemo.org/support | 05:12 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | tomorrow I'm gonna search some stores where I can try the device | 05:12 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | check those PIM limitations that you mention | 05:13 |
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| AakashN900 | johnx is this normal? | 05:13 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | and find out if I can live with them, with the expectation that they will be overcome in the future | 05:13 |
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| AakashN900 | for such an awful image quality? | 05:13 |
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| johnx | AakashN900, dunno. never used the front camera. did you clean your screen before using it? :) | 05:13 |
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| AakashN900 | yeah lol | 05:14 |
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| AakashN900 | i mean this is *horrible* | 05:14 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, you will be very disappointed if you think someone will write a PIM that syncs to Outlook | 05:14 |
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| redeeman | im a tad disappointed in the imap support | 05:14 |
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| johnx | AakashN900, yeah. it's for little "postage stamp" sized video chat, not photography | 05:15 |
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| redeeman | for instance, it won't save sent messages on the server, and it won't show my folders (possibly because they are in the INBOX. namespace) | 05:16 |
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| redeeman | that's really my only complaints | 05:16 |
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| johnx | won't save sent on the server? weird. I think mine is doing that without me even setting anything | 05:16 |
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| redeeman | probably because my sent folder is in that namespace then | 05:16 |
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| redeeman | my imap server is dovecot, which is one of the few imap servers that's actually 100% compliant | 05:17 |
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| arachnist | http://qdb.us/299740 <| did that happen here? ;> | 05:17 |
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| redeeman | haha | 05:17 |
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| johnx | was just setting up dovecot the other day. I think there are plenty of options for configuring the namespace stuff | 05:17 |
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| redeeman | yes but i have already configured that, and now i cannot change it or other connecting clients are gonna go baserk :) | 05:18 |
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| jebba | new ofono release :) | 05:18 |
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| redeeman | johnx: namespace private { prefix = INBOX. inbox = yes } i think this is what makes it not be happy | 05:19 |
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| redeeman | johnx: another dude inhere told me his did not save sent mails on server aswell | 05:20 |
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| johnx | huh. well let me test it then. I thought I was seeing them, but maybe that's from other clients I use with this account | 05:20 |
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| redeeman | if theres some magic i can do to fix this without breaking the config for other clients it would be great | 05:21 |
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| johnx | yup. positive that it's working with gmail | 05:22 |
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| johnx | but I do seem to have *3* "Sent" folders | 05:22 |
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| redeeman | interresting | 05:23 |
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| johnx | one of them is from my N800 w/ modest. One is from gmail's webmail interface and one is from my N900 | 05:23 |
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| redeeman | i could live with that though | 05:23 |
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| johnx | maybe let the N900 keep them in a non-namespace folder? (probably showing my ignorance of IMAP here) | 05:25 |
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| redeeman | they arent on the server, fgrepped the entire maildir | 05:25 |
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| johnx | could the server be refusing to let the N900 create some folder outside the namespace? | 05:26 |
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| redeeman | quite possibly | 05:26 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I'm hopping that NOKIA will improve PIM features on further firmware releases... | 05:27 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, so were N8x0 owners | 05:27 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | you really don't we to encourage me don't you? | 05:28 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :d | 05:28 |
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| johnx | I'm "managing expectations" :P | 05:28 |
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| asidjazz | Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/nokia-binaries/4bc37c7c77ebe90177c050b805a8dc79/nokia-binaries/m/maemo-af-desktop-l10n/maemo-af-desktop-l10n-itit_6.0+r7237+0m5_all.deb Error reading from server - read (104 Connection reset by peer) [IP: 207.114.197.95 80] | 05:28 |
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| redeeman | its not as if it would be hard to improve stuff ALOT | 05:28 |
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| asidjazz | should i care? | 05:28 |
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| johnx | better that you're thrilled later when against all odds they fix things than totally pissed off later because I didn't tell you the whole truth now | 05:29 |
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| johnx | also: stop hopping or you'll wake up the people downstairs :D | 05:29 |
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| johnx | redeeman, I'm digging into the way it syncs stuff right now actually. I'm quite interested :) | 05:30 |
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| redeeman | theres lots of minor things that i think could easily be made better, but theres no way im touching any gtk stuff, and im not sure that stuff is opensource | 05:30 |
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| redeeman | oh also | 05:30 |
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| redeeman | it didn't wanna fetch my contacts from my SE phone via bluetooth | 05:30 |
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| johnx | yeah. I made the mistake of adding some contacts, then syncing from my SIM later | 05:31 |
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| luke-jr | #FreeHandheld ftw | 05:31 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | but, if n900 uses PC Suite to sync | 05:32 |
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| redeeman | johnx: well atleast the contact thing could import vcards | 05:32 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | why doesn't it sync outlook then? | 05:32 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, riiight then | 05:32 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: you gotta admit, there IS a market that wants a free software handheld/phone | 05:32 |
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| johnx | Sir_Lancelot, uhm. not disagreeing, but why would it sync to outlook just because it syncs to PC suite? | 05:32 |
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| redeeman | pc suite might do it? | 05:33 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, yup. and many of them are willing to compromise, while some of them are totally obstinate. The obstinate ones are still stuck without cell phones | 05:33 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | if not ith Outlook, then with what would Pc suite sync then? | 05:33 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: and the company that satisfies the obstinate ones will earn a market to themselves | 05:33 |
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| redeeman | it just doesn't seem as though nokia is fully comitted to N900 | 05:34 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: also, your terms are flawed, as "free software handheld" is itself a compromise | 05:34 |
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| johnx | redeeman, ah. that would be interesting, but I have no way to test either of those things here :) | 05:34 |
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| redeeman | johnx: i imported my contacts by transferring them from my SE phone to my workstation via bluetooth and kmobiletools, then i obex sent the file to my N900, which imported it | 05:35 |
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| redeeman | it also appears to have export capability | 05:35 |
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| redeeman | something the calender applications lacks | 05:35 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, yes. they will earn a market full of cheap, zealots who will probably put them on gplviolations.org at the slightest transgression. and instead of creating interesting apps they'll port 10 different linux distros to the device, none of them finished enough to be interesting to "normal" users in any way. Any of that sound familiar? | 05:36 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: free software supporters are not necessarily cheap | 05:36 |
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| luke-jr | and no, it doesn't sound familiar because nobody has ever made such a device | 05:36 |
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| johnx | openmoko? zaurus? | 05:36 |
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| redeeman | i think you will find that if someone made a fully open thing, i would shell down FAR more money than i have given nokia for the N900 | 05:37 |
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| johnx | redeeman, would you shell out the cash even without finished software? | 05:37 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | well, unless you're willing to give a few million dollars, they're going to need more incentive than one lonely bloke with a good credit card rating | 05:37 |
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| redeeman | that depends on what the state is, i need it to work, i don't mind if its not "user ready" | 05:38 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: you know very well Zaurus was the exact opposite of a free software handheld | 05:38 |
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| redeeman | because i can and would fix most of that | 05:38 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: OpenMoko doesn't fit my definition of handheld | 05:38 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | then get to work on the N900 | 05:38 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | it's on open platform, you can fix most of the things people are complaining about -- get coding | 05:38 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, and yet, in its own lifetime the zaurus had a fully open 2.6 kernel | 05:38 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | or pick up on starting to port mer to the N900 | 05:38 |
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| luke-jr | crashanddie_mbp: it's not open, no | 05:38 |
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| redeeman | crashanddie_mbp: arent most of the applications on the n900 closed still? | 05:38 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: you mean long past its lifetime | 05:38 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, no I actually don't | 05:39 |
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| redeeman | also, arent those applications dying, aka, gonna be replaced with brand new Qt ones in maemo 6? | 05:39 |
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| luke-jr | redeeman: the apps aren't the problem, the drivers are | 05:39 |
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| johnx | it had 2.6 before the 770, unless I'm quite mistaken | 05:39 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: and? | 05:39 |
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| asidjazz | any1 here have hte sdk properly setup? | 05:40 |
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| asidjazz | via the faq? | 05:40 |
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| asidjazz | err tutorial? | 05:40 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | asidjazz: no, it fails | 05:40 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | asidjazz: you talking about the af-sb-init.sh start failing with massive segfaults and whatnot? | 05:40 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, and it ended up with like 4-5 unfinished distros, then sputtered out. The openmoko ended up exactly the same way. Do you think that's a coincidence? | 05:40 |
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| asidjazz | crashanddie_mbp: i dont even hvae af-sb-init.sh from the nokia binaries install | 05:41 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | asidjazz: oh, so you were just unlucky with the servers, run the scripts again | 05:41 |
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| asidjazz | i am | 05:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | well guys, it's 3:41 a.m here | 05:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | have a nice day/night | 05:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | see you later | 05:41 |
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| johnx | you too | 05:41 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | [[]] | 05:41 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: 2.6 was only even half working after the Zaurus was a dead product | 05:41 |
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| luke-jr | OpenMoko suffered from closed (firmware) components, IIRC | 05:42 |
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| johnx | "suffered"? is that why people made like 5 different non-finished distros? | 05:42 |
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| jebba | johnx: doesnt appear to be based on linux-omap 2.6.28, as that has more recent changes than what is in nokia's linux-2.6.28 (e.g. in likely irrelevant places, such as reiserfs) | 05:42 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: if I need to write all the userland software myself, I can. | 05:43 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: all I want is a decent hardware platform I can use | 05:43 |
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| johnx | jebba, huh. that's somewhat interesting. let me dig for a sec | 05:43 |
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| jebba | i was just using this change for a reference a9dd364358fbdc68faee5d20c2d648c320dc3cf0 | 05:44 |
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| redeeman | it also seems to me nokia somehow screwed up really bad on only having 256mb ram on the n900 | 05:44 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, companies need to subsidize production costs. They do that by having a slightly wider target demo than "totally obsessed open source zealots" | 05:44 |
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| luke-jr | redeeman: afaik, it's not even possible to have more than 256 MB RAM on OMAP3 | 05:44 |
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| redeeman | that would explain that then | 05:44 |
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| redeeman | im also somewhat surprised at how much ram the n900 is using | 05:45 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: those who don't care certainly won't mind the openness | 05:45 |
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| johnx | versions of the OMAP3 PoC w/ 512MB are a very recent occurrence | 05:45 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: and by closing parts, they cut off some of the best developers | 05:45 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: plus, none of these compromise-of-a-compromise platforms have finished *one* half-complete OS either | 05:45 |
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| luke-jr | 5 half-complete distros is better than barely 1 | 05:46 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, those who don't care about openness, do care about having a working device. So far I haven't seen a device that's both open and working out-of-the-box. And I've seen it too many times to call it a coincidence | 05:46 |
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| redeeman | johnx: the problem is that nobody makes the hardware | 05:46 |
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| redeeman | johnx: and i don't just mean put together the specific product | 05:47 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: SmartQ and OpenMoko are the only open devices I know of, and SmartQ works fine AFAIK. So that's 1 of 2 | 05:47 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, uh huh. your version of "works" and mine are quite different | 05:47 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: not a single company has built a handheld hardware platform with open drivers, and put up a bounty contest for an OS | 05:48 |
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| johnx | ah. yup | 05:49 |
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| redeeman | or atleast freely available hardware documentation | 05:49 |
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| luke-jr | by that I mean, a bounty of the usual software development budget, with minimum requirements and the company selecting from candidates that make that requirement | 05:49 |
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| luke-jr | then shipping the production device with the winning OS | 05:49 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, no handheld company, but how about the Neuros guys? | 05:49 |
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| jebba | hmm. i'm looking at the kernel source to this thing. looks pretty damn open to me. | 05:49 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: IIRC that wasn't open either | 05:49 |
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| johnx | it was more open than closed | 05:50 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: I know one of their lead developers personally. | 05:50 |
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| redeeman | jebba: how about the driver for the powervr sgx? | 05:50 |
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| luke-jr | jebba: not all drivers are in the kernel | 05:50 |
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| johnx | the kernel part is open. the userspace libgl is closed | 05:50 |
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| luke-jr | jebba: Nokia likes to make thin userland wrappers | 05:50 |
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| jebba | use it in VESA mode :) | 05:51 |
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| redeeman | johnx: which effectively makes it impossible to use without their nonfree blobs | 05:51 |
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| luke-jr | jebba: if you remove all the closed software, the N900 will not be able to charge its battery, do 3D or video acceleration, and probably not GPS or phone | 05:51 |
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| AakashN900 | could i just take libpidgin-facebook and crosscompile it for arm and install it on the phone and my conversations app will get facebook chat? | 05:51 |
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| johnx | redeeman, very true | 05:51 |
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| luke-jr | redeeman: you can live without 3D perhaps, but not without battery charging | 05:51 |
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| redeeman | johnx: when theres even a single of such thing, that will totally destroy what the free software people might do | 05:51 |
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| redeeman | johnx: that THAT is why not a single device has succeeded | 05:52 |
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| luke-jr | AakashN900: no, because N900 doesn't use crappy Pidgin stuff AFAIK | 05:52 |
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| johnx | redeeman, which is why linux didn't get going until every mobo maker open sourced their BIOS? | 05:52 |
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| jebba | exactly. | 05:52 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | guys | 05:53 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | get the fuck out with the trolling and arguing | 05:53 |
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| redeeman | johnx: fortunately that cannot be compared, the bios inits stuff and turns over control to linux, in my example we have to suffer constantly through the closed crap | 05:53 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: bad logic. | 05:53 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: notice I didn't list NOLO | 05:53 |
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| redeeman | crashanddie_mbp: theres no trolling, this is a discussion | 05:53 |
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| jebba | crashanddie_mbp: do you know offhand which kernel source nokia uses for upstream? johnx suggested linux-omap, but that didn't quite seem to be it AFAICT. | 05:53 |
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| luke-jr | jebba: AFAIK, N900 dev is probably from mainline | 05:54 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | not off-hand | 05:54 |
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| crashanddie_mbp | but I have it in an email somewhere, lemme check | 05:54 |
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| asidjazz | crashanddie_mbp: dang dood i tihnk its working for me | 05:55 |
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| asidjazz | it started up | 05:55 |
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| asidjazz | i clicked apps | 05:55 |
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| asidjazz | shows apps | 05:55 |
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| jebba | :) | 05:55 |
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| johnx | ok, so let's do something more constructive: let's say I'll give you the point that having source to all the drivers is better in some way: What do you do to encourage hackers to move one distro for a handheld forward instead of fracturing into 5 different ones? | 05:55 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: you say that as if the fracturing is a bad thing | 05:56 |
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| johnx | luke-jr, it depends on how many resources you have | 05:56 |
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| johnx | resources being hacker/hours :) | 05:56 |
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| luke-jr | johnx: some hackers cannot work closely with each other | 05:57 |
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| luke-jr | the fractured distros eases that tension | 05:57 |
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| asidjazz | the _HACKERS_ | 05:57 |
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| luke-jr | yet at the same time, the distros can (somewhat) collaborate and share stuff | 05:57 |
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| johnx | and yet, maemo is the most cohesive group of hackers I've seen working on handheld stuff | 05:57 |
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| luke-jr | though I guess that might be compromised if they're all competing for a bounty | 05:57 |
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| * Arkenoi had a strong impression that it was a certification requirement for a gsm handset to be closed source and have restricted api not allowing user to send/recieve arbitrary frames over the radio | 05:58 |
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| luke-jr | really? I don't know anyone outside Nokia working on Maemo | 05:58 |
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| luke-jr | last I checked community was mainly working on Mer | 05:58 |
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| johnx | the "Maemo ecosystem" I should say | 05:58 |
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| johnx | Mer is a part of that too, though I admit that Mer is reinventing the wheel in some ways | 05:58 |
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| luke-jr | Arkenoi: it's stricter than that, the ENTIRE software stack, every part of it, must be closed | 05:58 |
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| luke-jr | Arkenoi: that's why N900 and every other smartphone needs a seperate CPU for the real phone | 05:58 |
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| luke-jr | and they talk to THAT via serial or whatever | 05:59 |
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| jebba | Arkenoi: then why ofono? | 05:59 |
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| luke-jr | but I consider that must-be-proprietary-on-another-CPU blob to be firmware and thus exempt | 05:59 |
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| AakashN900 | hmmm luke-jr just looked it up...looks like it works with empathy/telepathy-haze | 06:00 |
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| luke-jr | AakashN900: what does empathy have to do with it? | 06:00 |
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| luke-jr | AakashN900: telepathy is a KDE project, not GNOME | 06:00 |
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| jebba | it's kind of funny to watch this channel not seeing what luke-jr is saying | 06:00 |
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| AakashN900 | uh then their sites sretarded lol | 06:00 |
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| asidjazz | are there any tutorials out there describing the steps to compiling and running apps in the sdk? | 06:03 |
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| jebba | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba some there, brief | 06:06 |
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| asidjazz | hmm | 06:07 |
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| asidjazz | Using SDK? | 06:08 |
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| jebba | ya | 06:08 |
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| asidjazz | i wanna compile and run https://garage.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/example_desktop_widget/ | 06:08 |
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| jebba | asidjazz: http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba#SDK | 06:08 |
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| AakashN900 | and i want facebook chat :( | 06:09 |
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| jebba | asidjazz: can't yu just grab that, run autoconfigger and make? | 06:09 |
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| asidjazz | i already installed it all jebba | 06:09 |
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| asidjazz | jebba: thats what im asking | 06:10 |
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| * asidjazz trys | 06:10 |
| asidjazz | whats hte svn command again? :) | 06:11 |
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| johnx | Has anyone looked at syncevolution for the N900? | 06:11 |
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| johnx | i think it holds a good probability of working ... | 06:11 |
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| asidjazz | ah yea svn co | 06:11 |
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| jebba | rad, my kernel .deb built (no real mods to stock n900 kernel). :) | 06:14 |
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| ShadowJK | 30% battery in the end | 06:15 |
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| asidjazz | jebba: thats all done but how do i run the app in my virtual maemo? | 06:16 |
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| asidjazz | it doesnt even have internet | 06:16 |
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| jebba | uh, after it compiles, just run it. Are you running xephyr? | 06:17 |
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| asidjazz | yes | 06:17 |
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| AakashN900 | you should have net | 06:18 |
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| jebba | ./example-widget or whatever it is called | 06:18 |
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| asidjazz | run it via the scratch box? | 06:18 |
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| asidjazz | oo | 06:18 |
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| jebba | ya, int he scratchbox | 06:18 |
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| asidjazz | AakashN900: no net | 06:18 |
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| AakashN900 | yo'z jacked up | 06:19 |
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| asidjazz | hmm make completed successfully no binaries in the dir or src/ | 06:19 |
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| asidjazz | theres a .o in src/ | 06:19 |
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| asidjazz | ?? | 06:21 |
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| jebba | uh | 06:22 |
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| jebba | what URL did you svn co ? | 06:22 |
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| AakashN900 | im out | 06:22 |
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| AakashN900 | night | 06:22 |
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| jebba | ciao | 06:22 |
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| asidjazz | URL: https://garage.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/example_desktop_widget | 06:22 |
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| jebba | asidjazz: no clue. There isnt a regular executable in there for me either. is just widget, perhaps that's why (?) | 06:25 |
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| asidjazz | jebba: how do you test widges? | 06:27 |
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| asidjazz | widgets* | 06:27 |
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| jebba | dunno | 06:27 |
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| jebba | ya, widgets arent like regular executables to run, they get loaded by the desktop or some fella running around in yuour n900 | 06:28 |
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| asidjazz | so.. | 06:29 |
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| asidjazz | ok how about if i have a sample as just a .c and .h file | 06:29 |
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| asidjazz | gcc -o smaple sample.c def doesnt work | 06:29 |
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| asidjazz | example_banner.c:11:35: error: hildon/hildon-program.h: No such file or directory | 06:29 |
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| jebba | asidjazz: dont you have libhildon1-dev installed? | 06:31 |
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| asidjazz | ah i found http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK#Writing_GUI_Hello_World | 06:32 |
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| asidjazz | jebba: pretty sure i installed the sdk correctly .. shouldnt i? | 06:33 |
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| jebba | dpkg -l libhildon1-dev | 06:33 |
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| asidjazz | gtk_helloworld.c:15:21: error: gtk/gtk.h: No such file or directory | 06:36 |
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| asidjazz | lol | 06:36 |
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| jebba | dpkg -l libhildon1-dev asidjazz you got that? | 06:36 |
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| jebba | ah, you probably gotta do the includes and stuff, anyhooo | 06:37 |
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| asidjazz | yea esgfaults | 06:40 |
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| asidjazz | loks like it | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > dpkg -l libhildon1-dev | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | | Status=Not/Installed/Config-files/Unpacked/Failed-config/Half-installed | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | |/ Err?=(none)/Hold/Reinst-required/X=both-problems (Status,Err: uppercase=bad) | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | ||/ Name Version Description | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | +++-==================-==================-==================================================== | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | ii libhildon1-dev 2.2.0-2+ultrastabl Hildon libraries development files | 06:41 |
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| asidjazz | lol | 06:43 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > gcc -Wall -g gtk_helloworld-1.c `pkg-config --cflags gtk+-2.0` -o gtk_helloworld-1 | 06:43 |
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| asidjazz | /scratchbox/login: line 230: 22289 Segmentation fault (core dumped) /scratchbox/sbin/chroot-uid /scratchbox/users/acidjazz /scratchbox/tools/bin/env - _SBOX_USER_GROUPNAME="$_SBOX_USER_GROUPNAME" _SBOX_DIR="$SBOX_PATH" PATH="$PATH" SBOX_REDIRECT_FROM_DIRS="$SBOX_REDIRECT_FROM_DIRS" SBOX_REDIRECT_TO_DIRS="$SBOX_REDIRECT_TO_DIRS" SBOX_PRELOAD="$SBOX_PRELOAD" HOME="$HOME" USER="$USER" TERM="$TERM" LOGNAME="$LOGNAME" _SBOX_RESTART_FILE="$_SBOX_RESTART_FIL | 06:43 |
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| johnx | on the one hand: pastebin, please! | 06:48 |
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| johnx | on the other hand: wow that's fubar | 06:48 |
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| asidjazz | sorry | 06:49 |
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| asidjazz | i figured it out | 06:49 |
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| sivang | hey all | 06:58 |
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| sivang | what's the way to access bash from the running mameo session under Xephyr ? | 06:58 |
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| jebba | hmm. So if one builds a kernel.deb, why can't that be installed. The docs talk about flashing zImage, but not really about getting the kernel modules over to the n900. | 07:03 |
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| johnx | you would copy the modules over manually I believe, then flash the kernel | 07:05 |
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| jebba | johnx: hmm, but why not just install kernel_modules.deb ? | 07:06 |
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| johnx | cause I don't trust that kind of stuff :) | 07:07 |
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| jebba | maybe i'm reading some old docs or somethign ? http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Kernel_and_Debugging_Guide/Maemo_Kernel_Guide | 07:07 |
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| johnx | well of course, follow the guide over what I say. I thought you were stuck on how to proceed | 07:07 |
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| Macer | hm | 07:09 |
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| Macer | is there an alternative to X ? | 07:09 |
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| Macer | for "open" operating systems? :) | 07:09 |
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| jebba | well, it kind of leaves that part out. It does talk about *other* modules (e.g. if you have some weird new usbdevice or somethingyou want to attach), but the current running kernel uses tons of modules. It just sort of leaves that part out. And copying them over is a bit of a mess too--it's not like they are all just sitting in one place--except for in the deb. | 07:10 |
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| asidjazz | f tihs apt crap im installing yum | 07:10 |
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| jebba | but it makes no mention of doing a dpkg -i of them or such. | 07:10 |
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| jebba | wow. you're the first person i've ever heard to say they prefer yum over apt | 07:13 |
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| asidjazz | its 100x easier | 07:15 |
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| asidjazz | how do you list available packages in apt? | 07:15 |
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| RST38h | moo. | 07:16 |
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| derf | Moo RST38h. | 07:17 |
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| ShadowJK | apt-cache search . | 07:17 |
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| hardaker2 | yum and apt aren't really all that different | 07:17 |
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| hardaker2 | they suck in completely different ways | 07:18 |
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| hardaker2 | but they suck equally | 07:18 |
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| Arkenoi | iirc zaurus had some direct qt implementation bypassing X | 07:18 |
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| Arkenoi | i doubt there is any use for such tricks today | 07:18 |
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| RST38h | it is not a trick | 07:18 |
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| Arkenoi | my first x11-running pda was agenda vr3, it had 4 *MEGA*bytes of combined RAM+Storage | 07:19 |
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| Arkenoi | and that was enough for it | 07:19 |
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| Arkenoi | not to mention ridiculously slow cpu | 07:19 |
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| RST38h | QT/Embedded normally runs on the framebuffer | 07:19 |
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| asidjazz | hmm on vim-enhanced package | 07:19 |
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| RST38h | There is also MiniX library (or whatever it is called) that is a "client side" X11 | 07:20 |
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| RST38h | OMG, Qt introduced yet another RPC framework | 07:28 |
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| * RST38h queues up RPC framework creators right after audio framework creators in the line to the chopping block | 07:29 |
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| johnxx | WTH do laptops need like 10 indicator lights for? gah! | 07:37 |
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| Venomrush | i am considering getting rid of the N900 if there are no workarounds to install the apps elsewhere and stop it from constantly using up rootfs for each installations eventually leading to fail updates and limit the number of apps that you can have installed on the N900 | 07:39 |
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| microlith | err | 07:40 |
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| microlith | aren't the apps in the repos supposed to use /opt | 07:40 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, if you tell the authors of apps that aren't optified, they're likely to listen | 07:40 |
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| Arkenoi | indicator lights are cool, i like them | 07:40 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, ...and if you're in a hacking mood, you might want to look at a tool that lets you "auto-optify" some Nokia stuff to make room | 07:40 |
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| Venomrush | johnxx, i've contact them, they just sort of 'ignore' the suggestion | 07:41 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, are these apps in extras or extras-testing/devel? | 07:41 |
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| Venomrush | johnxx, which tool are you takling about? is it that python script? | 07:41 |
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| johnxx | it's a bash script | 07:42 |
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| johnxx | from ccooke I believe | 07:42 |
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| zash | why can't you do something like apt-get install --root=/opt somepackage | 07:42 |
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| Venomrush | ah yeh, bash script | 07:42 |
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| microlith | zash: because apt packages don't work like that | 07:42 |
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| johnxx | and because /opt is on vfat | 07:42 |
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| Venomrush | i installed alot of apps from different repos | 07:42 |
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| Venomrush | so i'm not exactly sure which apps are optified and what's not | 07:42 |
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| microlith | Venomrush: all bets are off for non-maemo repos | 07:43 |
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| zash | Venomrush: dpkg -L $package | 07:43 |
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| zash | Venomrush: or possibly dpkg -S /opt | 07:43 |
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| jebba | it's called maemo-optify it's in python | 07:44 |
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| asidjazz | man i cant get any of these example codes to compile | 07:44 |
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| johnxx | well yeah, not every app in extras-devel/testing is finished yet. it's called testing because you're expected to test, and give feedback, and devel is if you're a developer who wants to hack. | 07:44 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, all failing with missing headers? | 07:44 |
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| jebba | and it works easily. You just run maemo-optify-buildpackage -rfakeroot -b -uc to build.... SIMPLE | 07:44 |
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| Venomrush | zash, what do those commands do? | 07:44 |
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| johnxx | jebba, there's also one from ccooke that optifies packages that are already installed | 07:45 |
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| jebba | ah | 07:45 |
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| Venomrush | ideally, an easy GUI to find apps not optified, and optified them | 07:45 |
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| zash | Venomrush: dpkg -L pkg lists all files belonging to a package, and -S seaches for packages that has that file | 07:45 |
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| jebba | i'm out for the night. hasta mañana | 07:45 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, ccooke's is about as easy as it gets, but it's CLI. | 07:45 |
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| johnxx | of course, if you use it the wrong way, you'll need to reflash ;) | 07:45 |
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| Venomrush | that's why i'm not too comfortable running them | 07:46 |
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| zash | what about a proxy that transparently does optify | 07:46 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, then don't run testing software | 07:46 |
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| johnxx | problem solved | 07:46 |
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| Venomrush | i ran dpkg -S /opt | 07:46 |
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| Venomrush | outputs a list of packages | 07:47 |
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| Venomrush | are these optified or non-optified? | 07:47 |
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| ersin | hey everyone | 07:47 |
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| zash | Venomrush: it lists packages that have something in /opt | 07:47 |
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| ersin | i was wondering if anyone has had any experience recompiling gtk for maemo | 07:47 |
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| johnxx | zash, like an http proxy that sits between apt and the repository? that's pretty scary, but also neat | 07:47 |
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| ersin | i did apt-get source libgtk2.0-0 and looked in the debian folder, but i noticed that there weren't any patches | 07:48 |
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| ersin | but i can't imagine that nokia didn't patch their sources | 07:48 |
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| Venomrush | johnxx, do you mean non-testing software should be all optified? | 07:48 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, exactly. Software in "Extras" should be optified. | 07:48 |
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| johnxx | if it stores much of anything outside of /opt, that's a bug probably | 07:49 |
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| asidjazz | heres my output http://pastie.org/731399 | 07:49 |
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| asidjazz | where is hildon/hildon-program.h | 07:49 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, dpkg -S hildon-program.h | 07:50 |
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| johnxx | BTW, that's a neat pastebin | 07:50 |
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| asidjazz | /targets/FREMANTLE_X86/usr/include/hildon-1/hildon/hildon-program.h | 07:51 |
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| asidjazz | yea pastie is sweet | 07:51 |
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| asidjazz | why doesnt it see that include dir | 07:51 |
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| asidjazz | how do i see what my set include dirs are | 07:51 |
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| johnxx | and you're compiling on the _X86 target? | 07:51 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, did the instructions really say to type exactly that? | 07:53 |
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| johnxx | unless I'm quite confused, I think you need to say gcc -I/path/to/headers/ | 07:53 |
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| ShadowJK | Supposedly it's "ok" to store small files in / | 07:54 |
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| ShadowJK | since / is faster for small files | 07:54 |
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| Venomrush | there should be a requirement that apps must be optified before promoting from devel -> extras-testing | 07:56 |
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| Venomrush | current promoting process to Extras takes too long IMO | 07:56 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, then test and vote | 07:57 |
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| Venomrush | how can we expect to test them if we can't even install them :\ | 07:57 |
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| ManuelSE | agree with venomrush | 07:57 |
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| ManuelSE | vote down | 07:57 |
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| johnxx | I propose starting a brainstorm | 07:57 |
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| Venomrush | testing app becomes limited cos u can't really test that many apps at the same time | 07:58 |
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| Venomrush | this is the bottleneck | 07:58 |
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| ManuelSE | why do some gtk apps break my workflow into many windows | 07:58 |
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| ManuelSE | these must be reSTRUCTURED for maemo | 07:58 |
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| ManuelSE | gpodder, mpd client | 07:58 |
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| Venomrush | might as well spam with comments for apps in extras-testing => 'cant test you, my rootfs is full, optify!' | 08:08 |
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| johnxx | it only helps if you actually spam the right ones though | 08:11 |
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| johnxx | and I'm serious about starting a brainstorm. I think that's exactly the right way to see if a majority agree with you | 08:11 |
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| Venomrush | i'm too lazy to write a brainstorm :\ | 08:12 |
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| johnxx | then don't complain | 08:12 |
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| johnxx | or at least put up a poll | 08:12 |
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| Venomrush | how long does a brianstorm take to get to implementation stage | 08:12 |
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| Venomrush | months? | 08:13 |
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| ManuelSE | joydev missing from -devel | 08:13 |
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| johnxx | it depends on whether you're asking Nokia to do it or the community. Nokia won't act immediately, but if you're asking developers to optify before extras-testing (with the promise that you're more likely to test/vote on apps) it might go a lot faster | 08:14 |
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| johnxx | If nothing else, at least put up a yes/no poll and see if people agree with you. Just try to be diplomatic so you get devs on your side, not against you ;) | 08:14 |
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| johnxx | and in the spirit of spamming the right people to optify their stuff, I think there's a script that lists how much space is taken up in what directories... | 08:15 |
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| Venomrush | johnxx, would you be able to find this script that shows how much space is taken up? | 08:17 |
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| johnxx | if I can't find it I'll write it ... as long as you promise to use the heck out of it to bug people about optifying ;) | 08:17 |
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| ersin | du -h? | 08:18 |
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| johnxx | ersin, thinking specifically about how much space a given package uses in which partitions | 08:18 |
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| ersin | ah, sorry i jumped in without reading ;-) | 08:19 |
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| asidjazz | lol 80% of my contacts disappeared | 08:19 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, maemo knows who you really care about. it's a feature (tm) | 08:19 |
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| wazd | heya all | 08:22 |
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| simula_ | bug 9493: i don't really care about jennifer and maemo fails to delete her. | 08:22 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9493 was not found. | 08:22 |
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| johnxx | simula, maemo knows best! :D | 08:22 |
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| simula_ | :) | 08:23 |
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| * johnxx admits to actually having clicked the link without reading first :) | 08:23 |
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| imganquan | Hi. I'm new to maemo, now I have set a development environment on my debian lenny, but when I click the twitter in mameo ,nothing happened ,why? | 08:23 |
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| johnxx | there's lots of ways things can go wrong when trying to use the SDK to emulate maemo | 08:24 |
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| johnxx | are you using the _X86 target or the _ARMEL target? | 08:24 |
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| imganquan | X86 | 08:25 |
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| imganquan | johnxx: hi friend, Can you tell me how to install a new software in the emulator? | 08:28 |
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| johnxx | uhm, not really. It's really made for being able to test software you're writing, not running any program you can download | 08:29 |
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| imganquan | oh..thank. | 08:30 |
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| cehteh | well application manager and dpkg/apt works for many things | 08:32 |
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| cehteh | x86 .. the armel emulation lacks a lot hardware stuff | 08:32 |
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| Vratha | anyone else have an n900 on t-mobile USA and is having trouble getting a GPS signal? it's kind of annoying | 08:33 |
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| imganquan | OK, cehteh ,thank you. let me see... | 08:33 |
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| cehteh | uhm gps looks more and more borked | 08:34 |
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| Vratha | i don't even know if t-mo usa offers a SUPL server | 08:36 |
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| ShadowJK | it's a conspiracy to make N810 gps look good | 08:36 |
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| ShadowJK | Vratha, not needed. Nokia has one | 08:36 |
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| ShadowJK | and the N900 uses nokia's server... | 08:36 |
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| Vratha | yeah, nokia's doesn't seem to get me a reliable location | 08:37 |
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| ShadowJK | as long as tmobile isn't blocking that | 08:37 |
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| luke-jr | XD | 08:37 |
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| luke-jr | \ | 08:37 |
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| johnxx | works just fine for me on t-mo here | 08:37 |
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| Vratha | but i guess other people in the states are having bad GPS lookups as well? | 08:38 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: where are you? i'm in NY, about 30 mi. north of NYC | 08:38 |
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| johnxx | though indoors it will say it has a "fix" but it's really just doing cell-tower location | 08:38 |
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| johnxx | 10mi north of Seattle (more or less) | 08:38 |
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| Vratha | i can't tell if it's a bad GPS chip in my phone or not | 08:38 |
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| johnxx | heh. well everyone's N900 has the same bad GPS chip :) | 08:39 |
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| LinuxCode | +n810 | 08:39 |
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| microlith | isn't there a known issue where if the N900 can't get data service the GPS doesn't work at all? | 08:39 |
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| johnxx | yes | 08:40 |
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| LinuxCode | takes 40 years for me to get a lock | 08:40 |
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| johnxx | in that case it might be stuck using cell tower location | 08:40 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, do you have a data plan with t-mo? | 08:40 |
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| Vratha | yeah, i got their Even More Plus plan | 08:41 |
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| Vratha | but i don't think they set it up right | 08:41 |
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| Vratha | i have something called "Web First Data" as my data package | 08:41 |
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| Vratha | don't know if that's the right thing | 08:41 |
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| johnxx | can you use the web browser? | 08:42 |
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| Vratha | yes | 08:42 |
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| Vratha | i get about 1Mbps, which they said was pretty typical | 08:42 |
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| johnxx | can you use IM? | 08:42 |
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| Vratha | AT&T on my iphone (with a tethered jailbreak) got 3 Mbps | 08:42 |
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| Vratha | i don't know... would i test that with skype? | 08:43 |
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| johnxx | skype or AIM or MSN or whatever | 08:43 |
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| Vratha | hmm, i don't have an AIM client on it (would like one though) | 08:43 |
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| johnxx | just trying to think of things that aren't using port 80 (or the standard email ports) | 08:43 |
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| Vratha | i can try with skype (i've made skype calls over the 3G network) | 08:43 |
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| johnxx | ah, well then they're not blocking you for sure :) | 08:43 |
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| Vratha | hehe | 08:44 |
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| Vratha | my plan doesn't say anything about having texting on it, and i'm supposed to get unlimited texts | 08:44 |
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| Vratha | was planning to call them tomorrow to get it all straightened out | 08:44 |
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| johnxx | so where have you tested the GPS? | 08:44 |
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| Vratha | just at my place | 08:44 |
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| Vratha | i only got this phone yesterday and haven't been out of the house (just got back from AZ) | 08:44 |
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| johnxx | might be worth trying it by a window (not gonna suggest you go outside and hold it up to the sky in the middle of the night ;) ) | 08:45 |
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| johnxx | how far off did it have your location? | 08:45 |
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| ShadowJK | even by the window, GPS is a bit difficult in my house, even with "Known good" receivers | 08:45 |
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| ManuelSE | i am beginning to ctrl-i on pc now ...hihi | 08:46 |
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| ManuelSE | do you all know ctrl-i to tab? | 08:46 |
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| johnxx | at some point I had mangled a keymap so bad that all I had was letters and ctrl. I know a good number of the ctrl-<letter> combinations now | 08:47 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: valencia, spain | 08:47 |
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| Vratha | hahaha | 08:47 |
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| ManuelSE | who know how to make the | on keyboard????? | 08:47 |
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| johnxx | sooo, not just getting your location from the cell tower then :P | 08:47 |
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| johnxx | ManuelSE, use the symbols pop-up window | 08:48 |
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| Vratha | my iphone always got it, which is why i'm wondering if it's the AGPS that isn't working right or the GPS chip itself | 08:48 |
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| ManuelSE | no | 08:48 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: yeah, that's my guess | 08:48 |
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| ManuelSE | is too slow and does not always work | 08:48 |
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| Vratha | ManuelSE: press the "blue arrow" and then "Sym" | 08:48 |
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| Vratha | top left two keys on the keyboard | 08:48 |
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| ManuelSE | ah | 08:48 |
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| ShadowJK | Vratha, iphone has skyhook too though | 08:48 |
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| ManuelSE | i thought simultaneous press hahahaha | 08:48 |
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| Vratha | ShadowJK: oh, what is that? | 08:48 |
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| johnxx | ManuelSE, there's a way to add it to the xterm bar, or you can rebind keys if you can figure out how | 08:49 |
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| ManuelSE | manuel is a fooool | 08:49 |
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| ShadowJK | Vratha, it scans for wlans and such and queries a database that knows where each wlan network is located | 08:49 |
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| ManuelSE | thank you! | 08:49 |
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| Vratha | oh | 08:49 |
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| Vratha | ManuelSE: np | 08:49 |
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| Vratha | anyone know how to get video calls working on skype? i know this thing has a front-facing camera | 08:49 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: i'll just have to try GPS on my way to work tomorrow to see if it fairs better | 08:50 |
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| ManuelSE | skype say hno support for video | 08:50 |
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| ShadowJK | Skype doesn't support video calls on n900 | 08:50 |
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| Vratha | dang it | 08:50 |
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| ShadowJK | and the front camera is nearly useless atm :) | 08:50 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, it should behave better after it gets a fix in your area | 08:50 |
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| ManuelSE | very noisy cam- needs some dsp loving | 08:50 |
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| ManuelSE | denoise3d from mplayer | 08:50 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: yeah, but it refuses to do that :-/ | 08:51 |
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| ShadowJK | Personally I dislike denoisers.. | 08:51 |
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| ManuelSE | or smth more specific to hardware | 08:51 |
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| ManuelSE | ok | 08:51 |
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| Vratha | ShadowJK: dang; i hope they fix it up | 08:51 |
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| Vratha | also, i'd like a search ability in my inbox :) | 08:51 |
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| ManuelSE | shadowjk they are needed for quality vs bandwidth | 08:51 |
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| ShadowJK | sure | 08:51 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, letting it get a fix outside the first time should help I think | 08:51 |
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| ShadowJK | let's make it "denoisers behind my back" | 08:51 |
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| ManuelSE | mhm | 08:52 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: ah, maybe. i'll give it a try | 08:52 |
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| ManuelSE | in consumer cameras i hate them sometimes | 08:52 |
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| ShadowJK | Like someone else said, at some point the denoising artefacts get uglier than the noise itself | 08:52 |
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| Vratha | tomorrwo at least | 08:52 |
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| ShadowJK | yes | 08:52 |
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| ManuelSE | zoom in and picture looks like a Monet painting | 08:52 |
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| ManuelSE | give me choice to denoise later! | 08:53 |
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| ShadowJK | yes :-) | 08:53 |
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| Vratha | haha | 08:54 |
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| asidjazz | is there another maemo channel? | 08:55 |
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| asidjazz | for like developers.. | 08:55 |
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| Vratha | hmm, that would be nice. i'm personally curious if there is a build of python available in a repo | 08:56 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, yes. should be in Extras | 08:56 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, actually...this *is* the maemo develoeprs channel :) | 08:56 |
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| johnxx | still not getting it to include the headers? | 08:57 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: didn't see it. maybe it's in Extra-testing or something | 08:57 |
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| johnxx | ah, python itself won't be in the GUI application manager | 08:57 |
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| johnxx | you can grab it with apt-get | 08:57 |
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| Vratha | so, how do i change the root password (that i setup when installing openssh-server) if i accidentally entered it incorrectly (twice) | 08:57 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: aaaah, ok | 08:58 |
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| johnxx | install rootsh | 08:58 |
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| Vratha | that would do dandy | 08:58 |
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| Vratha | i have rootsh on... maybe that's an app on the GUI | 08:58 |
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| * Vratha checks | 08:58 |
| johnxx | well, if you have the rootsh app installed, just type 'root' in the xterm | 08:58 |
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| Vratha | sweet! got it via xterm | 08:58 |
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| johnxx | gah. Just downloaded 1.7GB and the md5sum doesn't match :| | 09:02 |
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| ruskie | youch | 09:02 |
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| asidjazz | johnxx: nope | 09:02 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, ok, so point me at the docs for the example thing you're trying to install | 09:03 |
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| Vratha | so, out of curiosity, why did nokia setup the n900 so it only has 2 GB of space for apps? | 09:04 |
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| Vratha | why not just share the whole drive for both data and apps? | 09:04 |
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| slonopotamus | Vratha, to prevent users losing their data upon reflash. | 09:05 |
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| johnxx | for somewhat annoying reasons involving compatibility with people using Windows and different speeds of flash | 09:05 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: i see | 09:05 |
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| johnxx | and also what slonopotamus said | 09:06 |
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| Vratha | hmm | 09:06 |
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| asidjazz | sec johnxx trying to -I | 09:06 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, ok. what example are you trying to compile? are you following a guide from somewhere? | 09:07 |
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| asidjazz | yea | 09:08 |
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| asidjazz | the sdk docs | 09:08 |
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| asidjazz | i made a script from readin them | 09:09 |
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| Vratha | man, is there any maemo package that has "less"? | 09:09 |
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| asidjazz | http://pastie.org/731446 | 09:09 |
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| asidjazz | haha you dont like more | 09:09 |
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| asidjazz | less is more | 09:09 |
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| slonopotamus | they're not interchangeable. | 09:10 |
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| Vratha | no, i hate more :) | 09:10 |
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| slonopotamus | that's like 'i hate forks, gimme a spoon' | 09:11 |
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| asidjazz | /usr/include/hildon-1/hildon | 09:11 |
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| Khertan_n900 | Hi ! | 09:11 |
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| slonopotamus | Khertan_n900, morning | 09:11 |
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| Khertan_n900 | Someone know what is the widget use in the email application, the one in the pannablearea listing all mail ? | 09:12 |
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| Khertan_n900 | hi slonopotamus | 09:12 |
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| asidjazz | so its looking for hildon | 09:12 |
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| asidjazz | not hildon-1 | 09:12 |
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| asidjazz | do i modify the code to go after hildon-1 or softlink hildon to hildon-1 | 09:13 |
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| johnxx | you include one level higher | 09:13 |
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| Khertan_n900 | does the calendar applications's source is available somewhere ? | 09:13 |
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| Khertan_n900 | i didn t found it on gitorious or with mxr | 09:13 |
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| johnxx | Khertan, I think it's closed | 09:14 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, you might want to jump back to here: http://wiki.maemo.org/Legacy_Maemo_5_Documentation/Graphical_UI_Tutorial/Getting_started | 09:14 |
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| Khertan_n900 | hum ... ok | 09:14 |
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| Khertan_n900 | i m trying to do a similar ui like in the task list of ther calendar | 09:15 |
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| asidjazz | aha! | 09:15 |
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| asidjazz | pkg-config hildon-1 --cflags --libs` | 09:15 |
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| Khertan_n900 | when you double click it s open details | 09:15 |
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| Khertan_n900 | it s look like a treeview in a pannablearea | 09:15 |
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| simula_ | aha! /etc/event.d/rcS-late | 09:16 |
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| Khertan_n900 | but i cannot got selection of a treeview in a pannable area .. so i suspect an other widget | 09:16 |
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| Khertan_n900 | any idea ? | 09:16 |
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| asidjazz | WORKED | 09:17 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, you can use pkg-config with a lot of other things too, such as gtk, glib, dbus | 09:17 |
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| asidjazz | can i do pkg-config hildon-1 gtk | 09:17 |
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| asidjazz | can i do pkg-config hildon-1 gtk+-20 | 09:17 |
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| asidjazz | can i do pkg-config hildon-1 gtk+-2.0 | 09:17 |
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| Stargazers | Hi! How long your battery life is in Nokia N900? And is lshal | grep battery realistic values? | 09:17 |
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| Stargazers | I mean, there is Battery percentages. | 09:17 |
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| asidjazz | lshal ? | 09:17 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, the pkg-config files are in /usr/lib/pkg-config (IIRC) | 09:17 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Start xterm and type lshal | grep battery | 09:17 |
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| johnxx | so just look at the names there and put in the right thing | 09:17 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: So you can see lots of information about battery | 09:18 |
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| ManuelSE_ | are maemo.org password databases inconsistent? | 09:18 |
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| PaulFertser | BTW, does anyone know any decent non-maemo-specific battery gadget that can monitor battery over HAL? | 09:18 |
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| asidjazz | thats cool | 09:18 |
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| Khertan_n900 | does the fremantle email application source is available ? mxr give me only mlodest source of diablo | 09:18 |
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| johnxx | ManuelSE, between talk and maemo.org? yes | 09:18 |
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| Vratha | so any package in maemo that offers "less"? | 09:18 |
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| Vratha | i can't find one so far | 09:18 |
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| ManuelSE_ | ty johnxx | 09:18 |
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| johnxx | PaulFertser, the gnome one comes to mind | 09:19 |
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| Stargazers | Anyone? | 09:19 |
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| Stargazers | That battery. | 09:19 |
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| johnxx | Khertan, I think it is | 09:19 |
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| johnxx | Stargazers, it seems at least roughly accurage. My device is showing charged and the batt percentage from lshal is 95 | 09:19 |
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| PaulFertser | Stargazers: they mostly use old /proc/apm or modern standard /sys/class/power_supply interfaces. | 09:19 |
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| ashenburger | i got 33 from mine, seems to be close at least | 09:19 |
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| Stargazers | PaulFertser: Thanks, have to look | 09:19 |
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| Khertan_n900 | johnx thx i ll try to look deeper | 09:20 |
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| PaulFertser | Stargazers: but nokia decided to avoid standard interfaces and rely on deprecated hal i guess. | 09:20 |
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| Stargazers | Well, yeah. | 09:20 |
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| johnxx | I think it was more a case of starting development when HAL was still the "right way to go" | 09:20 |
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| PaulFertser | johnxx: (gnome gadget) have you tried it on nit? Are you in fact using non-maemo WM? | 09:21 |
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| johnxx | PaulFertser, none of the above | 09:21 |
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| PaulFertser | johnxx: are you sure it's a good idea to not use power_supply interface? | 09:21 |
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| johnxx | but it should be able to pull from HAL and lshal on Maemo 5 seems to be sane sooo... | 09:21 |
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| johnxx | PaulFertser, no. of course I'm not sure. You asked so I just pointed out a tool. /me shrugs | 09:22 |
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| Stargazers | But strange stuff is that battery "bar" is over 50%, amost 80% or something but when I look at CLI with lshal | grep battery I can see that battery percentage is 60% | 09:22 |
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| PaulFertser | johnxx: ok, thanks. | 09:22 |
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| Stargazers | BBut that bar shows much higher | 09:22 |
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| Stargazers | In which one I should believe mroe? | 09:22 |
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| Stargazers | That CLI way? | 09:22 |
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| PaulFertser | Stargazers: lshal | 09:22 |
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| Vratha | things the n900 still needs: working GPS, skype with front-facing web cam, "less" :), and android in a JVM | 09:23 |
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| PaulFertser | Still no "less" in standard maemo? lol | 09:23 |
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| Stargazers | All right. | 09:23 |
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| Stargazers | PaulFertser: Yep. Noticed that too. | 09:23 |
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| asidjazz | is there any eclipse support for maemo? | 09:23 |
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| Khertan_n900 | asidjazz:pluthon :) | 09:23 |
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| Stargazers | I took my N900 out of charger at 06:00 at in this morning. I have used about an hour network and now there is no connection at all (disabled it) and battery is 60%. Well, not very much. | 09:24 |
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| asidjazz | whats pluthon | 09:24 |
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| Stargazers | Just quickly tested videos, about 3min. | 09:24 |
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| Stargazers | And couple of images. | 09:24 |
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| Vratha | PaulFertser: well, if there is, i don't know how to get it | 09:24 |
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| PaulFertser | Stargazers: i think lshal is more accurate since it seems to be the only interface the gadget can use. Nokia decided to avoid proper in-kernel battery monitoring support, instead they still rely on their proprietary user-space daemon and they provide a hal plugin to get data from it. | 09:24 |
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| asidjazz | ugh i dont wanna write python | 09:24 |
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| * Sargun needs to get a t-mobile plan | 09:24 |
| Vratha | i love python | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | PaulFertser: All right then. Well I must confess that I like that CLI way to look battery, it really rocks. | 09:25 |
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| Vratha | better than writing C or C++ | 09:25 |
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| PaulFertser | Vratha: i mean the first thing a reasonable hacker would do is "dmesg | less" and it's like nokia decided that's not a reasonable usecase :) | 09:25 |
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| asidjazz | you can harness the hardware as well Vratha and the apps you write will require pythong | 09:25 |
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| Vratha | PaulFertser: haha, yes | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | PaulFertser: Especially if I can make battery will stay long enough so I can keep SSH-pipe open. | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | :) | 09:25 |
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| simula_ | \simula prefers c++ | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | And SQLite3 for conversations log, it really, mreally ROCKS :) | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | I love it. | 09:25 |
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| Stargazers | It is fantastic that I can ssh to my phone, open sqlite3 and check what has happened and I do not need to check my phone :D | 09:26 |
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| Stargazers | If that is on charger, lol. | 09:26 |
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| Stargazers | It makes me feel little nerdy. | 09:26 |
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| asidjazz | how do you open sqlite3 on it | 09:26 |
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| Vratha | ugh, i write enough C++ at work to know it's not optimal | 09:26 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: xterm -> sqlite3 | 09:26 |
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| Vratha | takes too long to code it | 09:26 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: That is why there is always C \o/ | 09:26 |
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| Stargazers | ;) | 09:26 |
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| ruskie | hmm the first thing I did was learn how to use sfdisk and started repratitioning the mmc | 09:27 |
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| asidjazz | how do you list tables in sqlite3 | 09:27 |
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| asidjazz | show tables; dont do it | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: .tables | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | dot and tables | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: And put ".headers on" | 09:27 |
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| simula_ | what gui framework do you use with c++ at work vratha? | 09:27 |
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| jysky | how shitty is the mediaplayer's "suffle". i listened music yesterday, now it suffles same songs in same order | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | So you can see table fields too. | 09:27 |
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| asidjazz | nothing Stargazers | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well... did you opened any DB? | 09:27 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: If not then open some. | 09:28 |
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| asidjazz | oh no | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | Heh. | 09:28 |
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| asidjazz | i see main and temp | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well, start it with "sqlite3 somedatabase.db" | 09:28 |
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| asidjazz | oh you hvae to give it .db files | 09:28 |
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| asidjazz | where are those on the phone? | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: But conversations log is in /home/user/.rtcom-eventlogger/el.db | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: But be warned! | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | DO NOT REMOVE ANYTHING :) | 09:28 |
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| Stargazers | I have no idea what would happen. | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | So I made a copy of it. | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | And the sqlited it. | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | "Just in case" | 09:29 |
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| asidjazz | this is awesome | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: It really is. | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: in Events table is calls etc. | 09:29 |
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| Stargazers | So you can see last messages. | 09:29 |
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| asidjazz | what table logs converstaions | 09:29 |
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| asidjazz | ok | 09:30 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: dates are in timestamp | 09:30 |
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| Vratha | simula_: i don't. i only do backend development in c++ | 09:30 |
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| Stargazers | But in SQLite you can convert it with SELECT DATE( start_time, 'unixepoch', 'localtime' ) FROM Events; | 09:30 |
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| Stargazers | If I remember correctly. | 09:30 |
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| asidjazz | how sweet | 09:30 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: That is :) So you can make easily apps what will show many kind of information. | 09:31 |
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| Stargazers | I haven't found a way to see contacts numbers etc with any SQL, because adddressbook seems to be Berkeley DB | 09:31 |
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| Stargazers | Dunno how I can convert it to SQLite or similar. | 09:32 |
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| Stargazers | Or if I can do it anyway. | 09:32 |
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| asidjazz | so whats the best ide for coding maemo cpp/gtk/hildon | 09:32 |
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| simula_ | vratha, what do you write in python? | 09:32 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well my opinion is just pure VIM. No guis needed. | 09:33 |
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| asidjazz | i love vim | 09:33 |
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| Stargazers | Where do you need GUI? | 09:33 |
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| asidjazz | but i need like on the fly api help | 09:33 |
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| Vratha | simula_: usually STP tools | 09:33 |
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| asidjazz | since i dont really know gtk | 09:33 |
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| Stargazers | All right then. | 09:33 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: I see. | 09:33 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well, I just use GTK Api in web browser... | 09:33 |
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| Vratha | simula_: but for personal projects i'll sometimes use python to try out an algo or do some pretty basic AI search | 09:34 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: IMHO best way to create apps is just to learn it without any helps, because then you really _learn_ it. | 09:35 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: So you can use it in whatever editor you just want. | 09:35 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: But surely if some other works better for you, just use it :) | 09:36 |
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| Stargazers | Because most important is still to just do the apps if you want to. | 09:36 |
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| asidjazz | does sqlite have a command like mysql's \G | 09:37 |
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| asidjazz | to show the data easier | 09:37 |
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| Stargazers | Well, I don't know if there is any. | 09:37 |
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| Stargazers | But if you find, tell me too. | 09:38 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Maybe .ode | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | *.mode | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | http://www.sqlite.org/sqlite.html | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | Have to test | 09:39 |
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| asidjazz | sweet | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | It is. | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | .mode line | 09:39 |
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| Stargazers | Nice. | 09:39 |
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| *** croppa has joined #maemo | 09:40 |
| asidjazz | check this Stargazers | 09:40 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: What? | 09:40 |
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| asidjazz | sqlite3 -html el.db "select * from Events limit 10" | 09:40 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Nice! <3 | 09:41 |
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| Stargazers | Dammit that stuff rocks! | 09:42 |
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| Stargazers | If I can just find a way to create "server" on my N900 so I can just show that output in browser :) | 09:42 |
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| Stargazers | netcat would be nice. | 09:42 |
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| simula_ | lighttpd is in one of the repos | 09:42 |
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| Stargazers | Oh? Dammit, have to test it on home! | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | It would be super duper. | 09:43 |
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| asidjazz | http://www.notchill.com/conv.html | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | It would be sexy stuff to run on N900 :D | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Hehe, cool. | 09:43 |
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| asidjazz | i wouldnt run any daemons on the device Stargazers | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Why so. | 09:43 |
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| asidjazz | i would have the device periodically report this stuff to somewhere else | 09:43 |
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| asidjazz | cuz its inefficient | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | Well that is true. | 09:43 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: But how you do that reporting periodically without cron? Just bash script with sleeps on it? | 09:44 |
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| johnxx | alarmd I think? (or are they on to something new?) | 09:44 |
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| Stargazers | Hmm, alarmd... can it be run from cli directly somehow? | 09:44 |
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| Vratha | hmm | 09:46 |
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| Vratha | so when is nokia thinking about opening that Ovi Store for the n900? | 09:46 |
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| asidjazz | Stargazers: cron might be ok | 09:46 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well there is no cron. | 09:46 |
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| asidjazz | Stargazers: youd have to test load diff | 09:46 |
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| sejo | good morning! | 09:46 |
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| ruskie | a sleeping cron like fcron/hc-cran would to great | 09:46 |
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| asidjazz | then you while (true) sleep(1) | 09:46 |
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| asidjazz | theres gotta be some kinda cron functionality in maemo | 09:46 |
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| asidjazz | for events like getting mail | 09:46 |
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| Stargazers | asidjazz: Well maybe it just uses that alarmd | 09:47 |
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| ruskie | asidjazz, modest -t 30 | 09:47 |
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| ruskie | that's what I've seen in the ps ax list | 09:47 |
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| sejo | morning | 09:47 |
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| Stargazers | What is modest? | 09:47 |
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| Stargazers | Sounds familiar. | 09:47 |
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| ruskie | with modest set to check mail every 30 minutes | 09:47 |
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| ruskie | the mail client | 09:47 |
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| Stargazers | Oh. | 09:47 |
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| Stargazers | Thanks. | 09:47 |
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| asidjazz | so it runs constantly | 09:47 |
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| asidjazz | is the src availalbe of that i doubt it | 09:47 |
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| sejo | someone knows if there is a solitaire for the maemo?getting iPhone withdrawals *grin* | 09:47 |
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| ruskie | modest src is available | 09:47 |
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| pekuja | sejo: Klondike, or any solitaire? | 09:48 |
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| LinuxCode | sejo, I can help you with that dilemma | 09:48 |
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| *** bergie_ has joined #maemo | 09:49 |
| * LinuxCode takes sejo's n900 and hands sejo his own iphone | 09:49 |
| LinuxCode | ;-p | 09:49 |
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| LinuxCode | probably be a while before I get a N900 | 09:49 |
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| LinuxCode | ;-| | 09:49 |
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| Stargazers | Btw I really, really love FM transimtter in N900. | 09:50 |
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| ruskie | :) | 09:50 |
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| * ruskie really really loves he can do sfdisk and repartition things | 09:50 |
| pekuja | ... | 09:50 |
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| ersin | i wish the n900 stuck with the 4.1" screen like the n8x0's | 09:50 |
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| pekuja | yeah, that's what I want in a phone too | 09:50 |
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| ersin | and i bet i'm probably the only one who wants that lol | 09:50 |
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| pekuja | repartitioning | 09:50 |
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| Stargazers | When I came to work this morning it was soooo sweet to put Nightwish's Angels Fall First -album to radio \o | 09:50 |
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| LinuxCode | ersin, ? | 09:50 |
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| ruskie | pekuja, to be precise a device I can do more or less anything to ;) | 09:50 |
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| pekuja | sure :-) | 09:50 |
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| ruskie | to bad it seems to be rather annoyed at times with the repartitioning | 09:51 |
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| Stargazers | ersin: No you are not if you mean that you wish that screen size would be same than in n800. | 09:51 |
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| pekuja | I do like that too. | 09:51 |
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| ersin | the n900 is very far from nokia's original vision | 09:51 |
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| ruskie | sometimes simply stops booting properly | 09:51 |
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| Stargazers | But well, I love n900 still. | 09:51 |
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| ruskie | just black screen | 09:51 |
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| ersin | it's not really an internet tablet...i mean, it is fully a phone | 09:51 |
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| ruskie | lol | 09:51 |
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| ersin | i use my n800 to do desktop tasks believe it or not | 09:51 |
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| ManuelSE_ | has anyone biuld zeemoted for fremantle? | 09:51 |
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| ruskie | a phone is one app on it ;) | 09:51 |
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| ersin | but it's impossible with n900 | 09:51 |
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| LinuxCode | ersin, why ? | 09:51 |
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| simula_ | what can an internet tablet do that an n900 can't? | 09:52 |
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| ManuelSE_ | 10 percent smaller | 09:52 |
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| ersin | manuelse_: exactly | 09:52 |
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| *** fluff|afk is now known as fluff | 09:52 |
| LinuxCode | dont grow so chubby ahnds then | 09:52 |
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| LinuxCode | hehe | 09:52 |
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| LinuxCode | ;-p | 09:52 |
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| ersin | 4" is the bare minimum to get stuff done, imo | 09:52 |
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| pekuja | :-) | 09:52 |
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| ersin | and i like the bare minimum | 09:52 |
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| ManuelSE_ | many eyes are too old for n | 09:52 |
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| Stskeeps | then use a n8x0 tethered to a n900 ;p | 09:52 |
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| ManuelSE_ | n900 | 09:52 |
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| ersin | have you ever written a term paper on a n800? because i have done that many a time ;-) | 09:53 |
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| LinuxCode | Stskeeps, haha | 09:53 |
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| ersin | bah lol | 09:53 |
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| LinuxCode | just get a small portable bt keybaord | 09:53 |
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| ManuelSE_ | ersin has a point | 09:53 |
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| ersin | i do have a keyboard, ofc | 09:53 |
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| pekuja | I think maybe in an optimal world I would have an n800 tethered to a phone, but then I'd have to carry two devices around | 09:53 |
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| simula_ | i would rather have a 3" screen i'll actually carry around with me than a 4" screen that stays at home :) | 09:53 |
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| ManuelSE_ | some of us like bigger screens | 09:53 |
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| asidjazz | so what apps that are in the repository are written in python? | 09:53 |
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| pekuja | n900 is a better compromise I think | 09:53 |
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| LinuxCode | pekuja, exactly | 09:53 |
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| pekuja | well, currently I am carrying around a phone and an iPod | 09:53 |
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| LinuxCode | if you want to do more, get a cheap netbook | 09:53 |
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| ManuelSE_ | ersin, help make n900 awesome, and maemo popular | 09:54 |
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| Xisdibik | <ersin> 4" is the bare minimum to get stuff done, imo <<< isnt that also what she said? :P | 09:54 |
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| pekuja | but I only really have the iPod for the App Store | 09:54 |
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| ersin | pekuja, i don't see what it's a compromise between | 09:54 |
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| pekuja | got it for pretty cheap too | 09:54 |
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| Stargazers | Btw is there any way how I can make my N900 to work as wlan hotspot, like in JoikuSpot but without it? | 09:54 |
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| pekuja | ersin: an internet tablet and a phone | 09:54 |
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| pekuja | ersin: smaller than a tablet, more feature rich than a phone | 09:54 |
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| ManuelSE_ | then the market will vbe big enough to allow ppl to biold more device variety | 09:54 |
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| ersin | pekuja: i think it's pretty much 100% phone, and what n900 does is going to be standard real soon on phones | 09:54 |
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| simula_ | then n900 is a little computer that happens to have a phone in it :) | 09:54 |
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| ersin | manuelse_: i do plenty of work for the n800 as it is...as we speak i'm trying to recompile a new version of gtk+ ;-) | 09:55 |
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| Stargazers | Btw do any of you have made sync work with google calendar and n900 calendar, or is it possible at all? | 09:55 |
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| Stargazers | Just calendar stuff. | 09:55 |
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| ManuelSE_ | great thank you | 09:55 |
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| ManuelSE_ | :) | 09:55 |
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| ersin | manuelse_: i'm the de facto abiword maintainer for maemo, and i'm trying to get the svn trunk branch to work...the compile stopped working because abiword 2.9 is using new versions of gtk | 09:56 |
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| ersin | i have no idea if this is going to work | 09:56 |
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| ersin | lol | 09:56 |
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| simula_ | good luck ersin | 09:56 |
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| ersin | *sigh* i wish mer were...*fill in blank* | 09:56 |
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| johnxx | whoa. you're going to try and bring a newer gtk into maemo? | 09:56 |
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| ersin | simula_: thanks | 09:56 |
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| ersin | johnxx: yep | 09:57 |
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| johnxx | and like install it in /opt or something? | 09:57 |
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| ersin | nah | 09:57 |
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| ersin | just gonna install it roughshod, let's see what happens ;-) | 09:57 |
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| johnxx | no one will be able to install the application ... | 09:57 |
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| johnxx | app manager wouldn't let them ;) | 09:57 |
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| ersin | hmm, really? | 09:57 |
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| cehteh | ersin: does it really depend on newer gtk or is that just a bogus dependency .. if it really depends, why, can some thing be ported back? | 09:57 |
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| johnxx | also. it'd break the whole system if your forced it | 09:57 |
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| ManuelSE_ | ersin abiword? that sounds like a challenge | 09:58 |
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| ManuelSE_ | big one | 09:58 |
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| Stargazers | Btw can I send SMSes from command line somehow? | 09:58 |
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| * cehteh likes that emacs works :P | 09:58 |
| Stargazers | VIM ftw \,,/ | 09:58 |
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| Vratha | do you guys know where the pre-installed demo songs are located on the file system? i'm trying to remove them from the ssh session i have going on the phone | 09:58 |
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| Stargazers | Have to install that some day. | 09:58 |
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| johnxx | there was someone working on hildonizing abiword at some point ... | 09:58 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: /home/user/.sounds? | 09:58 |
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| Vratha | oops... i should clarify. that's on the n900 | 09:58 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, ~/MyDocs/.sounds | 09:58 |
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| Vratha | ah sweet. thanks | 09:58 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: Meant /home/user/MyDocs/.sounds | 09:58 |
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| ersin | cehteh: well it's not a real dependency *yet*, but it is real...basically new code was added to a header file that uses types that were introduced in gtk 2.18, whereas maemo uses gtk 2.10...so far not used yet, but prolly will be soon | 09:58 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: hahaah | 09:59 |
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| ersin | manuelse_: it's already been done ;) add extras-devel to your list | 09:59 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: over my dead body *grin* | 09:59 |
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| *** EricSagnes has quit IRC | 09:59 |
| * LinuxCode gets a knife | 09:59 |
| LinuxCode | ok! | 09:59 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: even without solitaire it's far out the best phone I ever had | 09:59 |
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| ersin | johnxx: abiword has been hildonized for a while | 09:59 |
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| cehteh | ersin: so maybe you can maintain a conditional build backport without the new gtk features? | 09:59 |
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| LinuxCode | sejo, glad you say that ;-D | 09:59 |
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| sejo | pekuja: any form is good, klondike would be cool though | 10:00 |
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| LinuxCode | just need more devs to package stuff | 10:00 |
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| ersin | cehteh: yeah, i mean probably that won't even be necessary yet, we're just talking about one header file...but it would be nice to have updated libs | 10:00 |
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| Vratha | johnxx, Stargazers : have either of you ever tried to sync your contacts from your iphone to the n900 using a mac? hoping i don't have to manually transcribe all that data | 10:00 |
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| Vratha | i can only assume iTunes doesn't play nice with it | 10:00 |
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| sejo | LinuxCode: having a 64bit sdk would help | 10:00 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: I have no mac nor iTunes. | 10:01 |
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| ersin | cehteh: some would say that i should just give up and work on mer, but i actually really enjoy diablo, i think it's a very well thought out system, and the hw integration is crucial for me | 10:01 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, can you have the iphone write them out to the SIM? | 10:01 |
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| Stargazers | I use Linux and synced my contacts from my N82. | 10:01 |
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| Vratha | ah, a quick google search revealed something | 10:01 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: no, but i found an article saying that OS X's address book can export the vcards to the n900 if it's setup as a mass storage device | 10:01 |
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| ruskie | hmm what is better to use? app manager or apt-get ? | 10:01 |
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| Sargun | app manager | 10:02 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, that might do it. | 10:02 |
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| ruskie | even if using some of the more dangerous repos? | 10:02 |
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| johnxx | You might even be able to blast the vcards at it en masse with bluetooth | 10:02 |
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| johnxx | ruskie, even then. though you should use apt-get instead of red pill | 10:02 |
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| ruskie | so far I had bad experience with the app manager... I'm thinking something from some repo maybe crashed something else | 10:03 |
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| ruskie | because it seems taht I had a boot failure 2/3 after installing something using the app manager | 10:03 |
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| cehteh | app manager is just a frontend | 10:03 |
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| ruskie | one time it was caused by maemo mapper freezing and doing a force shutdown | 10:03 |
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| ruskie | yeah but it doesn't list what is installing - if there are any dependencies | 10:04 |
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| asidjazz | how does concatenation work in cpp? | 10:04 |
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| cehteh | if some package is serious broken it doesnt matter which pill or if you used apt-get or dpkg | 10:04 |
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| johnxx | they're under details-> dependencies I think (or similar) | 10:04 |
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| cehteh | asidjazz: #define cat(a,b) a##b | 10:04 |
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| asidjazz | wtf | 10:05 |
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| ruskie | cehteh, well other than seeing what is being pulled in | 10:05 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: well, actually, turns out that won't be how i want to do it, since i won't be able to go from the n900 to the mac. hopefully nokia will release an iSync plugin for the n900 before long | 10:05 |
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| Stargazers | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=36148 | 10:05 |
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| asidjazz | cehteh: lets say i have something liek tihs | 10:05 |
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| asidjazz | like this* | 10:05 |
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| asidjazz | banner = hildon_banner_show_information(GTK_WIDGET(window), NULL, "Hi there! "); | 10:05 |
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| Stargazers | If someone knows the answer it would be nice :) | 10:05 |
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| asidjazz | i wanna concatenate a variable to "Hi there! " so i can see its contents | 10:05 |
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| Vratha | Stargazers: haha, that would be pretty sweet, especially for scripts/apps that you setup | 10:06 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: That would be. | 10:06 |
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| cehteh | the preprocessor cant evaluate variables | 10:06 |
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| Stargazers | Vratha: I feel a little bit a geeky nerd :D | 10:06 |
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| Stargazers | When I am asking stuff like that. | 10:06 |
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| cehteh | you have to contruct the string you want sprintf or whatever | 10:06 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, I'm not the best person to ask about syncing. My N900 has quickly become the definitive source of info on contacts in the brief time I've had it. I am looking at how to sync it back to linux, but only half-heartedly | 10:06 |
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| Stargazers | And when I am sshing in my phone via SSH-pipe (can't connet directly if on 3G because operator blocks ssh ports)... | 10:06 |
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| asidjazz | ok so | 10:07 |
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| johnxx | Stargazers, dbus maybe? I'd look at the SDK documentation | 10:07 |
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| Stargazers | johnxx: If you find it, it would be nice if you could post it on that forum (so I can check it easier later because in IRC there is sooo much talking). | 10:07 |
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| asidjazz | banner = hildon_banner_show_information(GTK_WIDGET(window), NULL, sprintf("Hi there! (%d)", banner_type)); | 10:08 |
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| Stargazers | Have to do some work now o/ See ya, keep the maemo rocking \o | 10:08 |
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| Vratha | johnxx: ah, okay. that was a nice thing about my iphone. i could pretty seamlessly keep everything integrated/synced easily | 10:08 |
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| johnxx | Stargazers, sorry. I meant "if I were you, I would look at the documentation" | 10:08 |
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| cehteh | asidjazz: i suggest you to get a C book :) | 10:08 |
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| johnxx | I'm not going to look for you :) | 10:08 |
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| Stargazers | johnxx: Oh, surely I will look it :) | 10:08 |
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| asidjazz | warning: passing argument 2 of 'sprintf' makes pointer from integer without a cast | 10:08 |
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| Stargazers | But now gotta go. | 10:08 |
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| Stargazers | -> | 10:08 |
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| asidjazz | cehteh: lol | 10:09 |
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| cehteh | yeah thats wrong :P | 10:09 |
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| johnxx | Vratha, like I said: maybe this stuff actually works and I just don't know because I'm on linux here | 10:09 |
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| Vratha | maybe; i'll be looking into it | 10:09 |
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| Vratha | nah, looks like nokia hasn't released an updated iSync for the n900 | 10:10 |
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| Vratha | they sure seem to be taking their time on making this device feature complete | 10:11 |
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| * ruskie tries the approach of reboot after every apt-get just to see if there's some app that shouldn't get installed | 10:12 |
| asidjazz | cehteh: do u know the right way? | 10:12 |
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| johnxx | I get the feeling they're busting @$$ as fast as possible, but their Maemo team is smaller than their Symbian | 10:12 |
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| cehteh | yes | 10:12 |
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| * Stskeeps is looking forward to seeing what pr1.1 updates | 10:12 |
| *** ab[out] is now known as ab | 10:12 |
| Vratha | johnxx: yeah, well, they gotta hurry up and catch up to Android and iPhone :) | 10:12 |
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| * ruskie disables extras-devel now that he got the one app he wanted from there | 10:13 |
| cehteh | asidjazz: char buffer[32]; snprintf(buffer, 32, "Hi there! (%d)", banner_type); ... | 10:14 |
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| Venomrush | im trying to edit a file with vi | 10:15 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 10:15 |
| Venomrush | can't find the 'Delete' key | 10:15 |
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| ruskie | Venomrush, insert mode use backspace | 10:15 |
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| cehteh | %d is never more than 20 character, be careful about the buffer size that you dont overflow it, if in doubt handle the return for snprintf! | 10:15 |
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| cehteh | err 10 chars .. n900 is 32 bit :) | 10:15 |
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| Venomrush | ruskie, erh how to get to insert mode? | 10:16 |
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| ruskie | i | 10:16 |
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| Venomrush | ah | 10:16 |
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| Venomrush | cool | 10:16 |
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| ruskie | esc to get out of it | 10:16 |
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| johnxx | where is esc? | 10:16 |
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| ruskie | on the terminal | 10:16 |
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| johnxx | right, right | 10:16 |
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| johnxx | that's what I get for asking without my N900 in front of me | 10:17 |
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| *** Khertan_n900 has quit IRC | 10:17 |
| Venomrush | to save | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | i tried ctrl+c | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | wont come out | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | or asked me anything | 10:17 |
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| ruskie | :x | 10:17 |
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| ruskie | after you hit esc | 10:17 |
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| johnxx | <esc>:wq | 10:17 |
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| Vratha | if in doubt, use std::string :) | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | yeh hit esc | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | doesnt seem to save? | 10:17 |
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| Venomrush | or pop up with any confirm text | 10:18 |
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| *** `0660_ has joined #maemo | 10:18 |
| ruskie | it won't | 10:18 |
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| ruskie | it'll just save it | 10:18 |
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| asidjazz | error: expected expression before 'char' | 10:18 |
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| asidjazz | hmm | 10:18 |
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| Venomrush | thats bad :\ | 10:18 |
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| ruskie | :wq | 10:18 |
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| ruskie | will write and quit | 10:18 |
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| ruskie | don't forget to hit enter after it | 10:18 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, then vi is probably not for you :) | 10:18 |
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| ruskie | it'll tell you ti saved | 10:18 |
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| Venomrush | i use nano on ubuntu | 10:19 |
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| Venomrush | not too keen with vi | 10:19 |
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| Venomrush | pressed enter | 10:19 |
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| Venomrush | nothing | 10:19 |
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| Venomrush | :\ | 10:19 |
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| Sargun | nano or bust | 10:20 |
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| asidjazz | i tried banner = hildon_banner_show_information(GTK_WIDGET(window), NULL, snprintf(buffer, 32, "Hi there! (%d) ", banner_type)); | 10:20 |
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| cehteh | thats not what i showed :P | 10:20 |
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| *** shpaq__ is now known as shpaq | 10:20 |
| cehteh | asidjazz: char buffer[32]; snprintf(buffer, 32, "Hi there! (%d)", banner_type); banner = hildon_banner_show_information(GTK_WIDGET(window), NULL, buffer); | 10:21 |
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| ruskie | hmm there any simple command to clean out /var/cache/apt/archives ? | 10:21 |
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| Venomrush | how do i exit vi mode :\ | 10:21 |
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| asidjazz | oh | 10:21 |
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| ruskie | hit: esc | 10:21 |
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| Venomrush | i did | 10:21 |
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| johnxx | ruskie, apt-get clean | 10:21 |
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| ruskie | type :q | 10:21 |
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| Venomrush | it didnt go back :\ | 10:21 |
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| *** asolsson has joined #maemo | 10:21 |
| ruskie | and hit enter after :q | 10:21 |
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| Venomrush | ''No write since last change' | 10:22 |
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| Venomrush | didnt save it :\ | 10:22 |
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| ruskie | so do: :wq | 10:22 |
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| ruskie | and again enter | 10:22 |
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| cehteh | or apt-get install emacs :P | 10:22 |
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| asidjazz | cehteh: that really sucks to have to do that | 10:22 |
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| asidjazz | <- spoiled by languages like php | 10:23 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: your post mentions you have maemo devel enabled, and hence any illusions about rootfs not filling up is gone :P | 10:23 |
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| Venomrush | i didnt install anything from devel | 10:23 |
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| Venomrush | beside haze | 10:23 |
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| Venomrush | or have any of the other apps with devel versions | 10:23 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: no, but you might have gotten updates from there or not realizing it's in devel :P | 10:24 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, depends if one does some extra tricks ;) | 10:24 |
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| asidjazz | where can i find example apps in python | 10:24 |
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| cehteh | asidjazz: well, i dont know gtk well, for my other stuff i have somethng like tmpbuf_snprintf("foo %d",1234) which returns a temporary buffer and you can use it like you tried to do | 10:24 |
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| cehteh | but there is no such thing in the C stdlib | 10:24 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: btw, crash reporter is bound to cause you full rootfs. it means it stores core files | 10:24 |
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| Stskeeps | (i think) | 10:25 |
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| * ruskie disables maemo-testing now as well | 10:25 |
| Stskeeps | but yeah, midori and python are the culprits | 10:25 |
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| Stskeeps | (probably) | 10:26 |
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| Venomrush | havent got pymaemo installed :\ | 10:26 |
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| Venomrush | midori so ja | 10:26 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: sure? dpkg -l | grep python | 10:26 |
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| Venomrush | 1 sec just rebooting | 10:26 |
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| asidjazz | cehteh: hm | 10:28 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: also i'm not sure openttd optifies it's data files | 10:30 |
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| Venomrush | is there anyway to check? | 10:30 |
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| dolfun | du | 10:31 |
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| *** Venomrush has quit IRC | 10:31 |
| ruskie | I wish there was better partitioning out of the box | 10:31 |
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| dolfun | dpkg -X package.deb . | 10:31 |
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| dolfun | move files to opt | 10:31 |
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| dolfun | then use ar to recreate the deb | 10:31 |
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| dolfun | 4 minutes | 10:31 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=33429&page=1 and http://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Extras-testing/QA_Checklist#Checking_root_filesystem_usage | 10:32 |
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| Stskeeps | Venomrush: i guess checking if the files you manually installed from the original TTD are on internal flash or not | 10:32 |
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| X-Fade | Morning | 10:32 |
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| *** X-Fade sets mode: -o X-Fade | 10:32 |
| Stskeeps | morning X-Fade and welcome back at work :P | 10:32 |
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| dolfun | if you don't want to patch against upstream directories, add symlinking to postinst | 10:32 |
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| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Thanks ;) | 10:33 |
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| asidjazz | /usr/include/libosso.h:38:23: error: dbus/dbus.h: No such file or directory | 10:33 |
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| asidjazz | grrr | 10:33 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 10:33 |
| Stskeeps | ruskie: not so much to do about internal flash really | 10:33 |
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| dolfun | does Till Harbaum have a nick on IRC? | 10:33 |
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| Stskeeps | dolfun: till-, i think | 10:33 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, well keep rootfs as is... but use the mmc for things like /usr as well | 10:34 |
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| Venomrush | what's the diff between poweroff and softpoweroff ? | 10:34 |
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| dolfun | it looks till- oh ty -- it looks like there is a way to get bluetooth mouse control for n900 | 10:34 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: the problem is that mmc is slower than internal flash | 10:34 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: so you'll feel that for sure | 10:34 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, hmm I don't really | 10:34 |
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| dolfun | for presentationns. can fremantle x.org handle joystick input devices | 10:34 |
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| ruskie | and that's what I did | 10:34 |
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| dolfun | put n900 attached to beamer, then use zeemote or usb device to control | 10:35 |
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| dolfun | this would sell many devices | 10:35 |
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| dolfun | hello world :) | 10:35 |
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| johnxx | also, swap is on mmc so if it thrashes bad and you need to swap out and launch an app at the same time it's not very OPTimal :) | 10:35 |
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| *** BBNS has joined #maemo | 10:35 |
| ruskie | iirc there is a bluemaeom app in one of the repos that gives HID profiles | 10:35 |
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| Mece | Venomrush, non soft is the -9 version? | 10:35 |
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| Stskeeps | that said, maemo changing to a system where it boots originally from MMC and then having fast-access stuff in NAND could be interesting | 10:36 |
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| dolfun | thank you ruskie, i will look into this. | 10:36 |
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| dolfun | very interesting Stskeeps | 10:36 |
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| dolfun | like /usr/bin or /tmp orwhat | 10:36 |
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| Stskeeps | well the stuff that has a performance need | 10:37 |
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| dolfun | can we profile filel access on maemo os | 10:37 |
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| dolfun | to find most accessed | 10:37 |
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| Stskeeps | probably | 10:37 |
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| dolfun | heh heh | 10:37 |
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| dolfun | power of linux | 10:37 |
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| dolfun | maybe some smart filter to lsof type data | 10:38 |
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| jaem_ | Stskeeps, why doesn't the Mer wiki have testing image pages anymore? | 10:38 |
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| johnxx | hmmm...I'd really like to see unionfs actually work ... | 10:38 |
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| Mece | how about swap in nand? | 10:38 |
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| Mece | that could use some speed... | 10:38 |
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| Stskeeps | jaem_: we just mention them on mer-chatter | 10:38 |
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| jaem_ | Stskeeps, ah... I was out of the loop for a while | 10:39 |
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| johnxx | Mece, I think the idea is that you either want root on nand and swap on mmc or vice-versa | 10:39 |
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| jaem_ | and bugs go to the main tracker, then? | 10:39 |
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| Stskeeps | jaem_: right | 10:39 |
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| johnxx | hands down, the N900 is the best phone of all time: http://answers.polldaddy.com/poll/2343947/?view=results | 10:42 |
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| Venomrush | any particular reason why n900 starts network carrier's on boot rather than using the available wlan? | 10:43 |
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| `0660_ | it's only for 2009 and i voted even though i haven't yet received my n900 :) | 10:43 |
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| johnxx | Venomrush, probably just a non-optimized situation since they don't expect you to reboot all that often | 10:44 |
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| Mece | johnxx, lol | 10:44 |
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| asidjazz | gcc -Wall -g $1.c -o $1 `pkg-config libosso gtk+-2.0 --cflags` -o $1 `pkg-config libosso gtk+-2.0 --libs` | 10:45 |
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| asidjazz | now were talkin | 10:45 |
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| johnxx | if it were any poll that actually mattered I'd feel a little pang of guilt that we totally stuffed the ballot boxes ... | 10:45 |
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| johnxx | I think you can give it --cflags and --libs at the same time | 10:45 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > gcc -Wall -g gtk_helloworld-1.c \ `pkg-config --cflags gtk+-2.0` -o gtk_helloworld-1 \ `pkg-config --libs gtk+-2.0` | 10:47 |
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| asidjazz | [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > | 10:47 |
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| asidjazz | how do i figure out which package thats in johnxx | 10:47 |
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| asidjazz | woops wrong paste | 10:47 |
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| johnxx | ah! a trick question | 10:47 |
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| asidjazz | example_statusmenu.h:4:47: error: libhildondesktop/libhildondesktop.h: No such file or directory | 10:47 |
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| asidjazz | im adding the hildon-1 libs/cfags | 10:48 |
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| johnxx | dpkg -S libhildondesktop.h | 10:48 |
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| johnxx | then: dpkg -L <pkg> | grep /usr/lib/pkg-config | 10:48 |
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| ruskie | johnxx, iirc it's /usr/lib/pkgconfig | 10:50 |
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| johnxx | thanks | 10:50 |
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| Mece | johnxx, simply reaping the benefits of a community | 10:50 |
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| asidjazz | libhildondesktop1-dev | 10:50 |
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| asidjazz | hmm | 10:50 |
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| * ruskie hopes ho won't get a brick this time around | 10:50 |
| asidjazz | Package libhildondesktop1-dev was not found in the pkg-config search path. | 10:51 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, yeah. I gave you two commands to run | 10:51 |
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| asidjazz | johnxx: that grep returned onthing | 10:51 |
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| johnxx | ah, cut the grep off then | 10:51 |
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| johnxx | I gave you the wrong dir as ruskie pointed out | 10:52 |
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| * Mece wonders whatm problems ruskie's ho had with her/his device before... | 10:52 |
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| ruskie | Mece, I'm doing insane things with it ;) | 10:52 |
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| asidjazz | johnxx http://pastie.org/731514 | 10:52 |
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| johnxx | Mece, I think he got a piece of build material instead of a phone :) | 10:52 |
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| ruskie | Mece, like repartitioning the eMMC, changing default shell etc... etc.. | 10:53 |
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| ruskie | though I just hit an issue it seems | 10:53 |
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| johnxx | asidjazz, looking at that ouput and my grep doesn't give you a clue as to what you're looking for? | 10:53 |
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| ruskie | seems like it doesn't like changing the default shell | 10:53 |
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| ruskie | atleast not for user | 10:53 |
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| Mece | ruskie, lol, I thought you were referring to your wife... | 10:53 |
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| ruskie | yay... fresh brick | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | good thing I backed up /home/user just now | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | though... f... | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | johnxx: gotcha | 10:54 |
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| Zeddy | guys, anyone here that happends to know how one could doa drag-drop with the n900 browser.. :P | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | I forgot to copy it over | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | this is odd | 10:54 |
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| Mece | ruskie, thanks for the heads up, i was acually just about to try that | 10:54 |
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| Zeddy | everytime i try dragging an element on a web page it just zooms in >-< | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | (.text+0x18): undefined reference to `main' | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | woops | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | Mece, :) | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | /scratchbox/compilers/cs2007q3-glibc2.5-i486/bin/../i486-pc-linux-gnu/libc/usr/lib/crt1.o: In function `_start': | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | (.text+0x18): undefined reference to `main' | 10:54 |
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| asidjazz | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | I do wonder why it has this issue though | 10:54 |
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| ruskie | it does lack a /etc/shells file | 10:55 |
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| johnxx | Zeddy, trag in from the left, off screen, then tap the pointer icon that shows up | 10:55 |
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| ruskie | so that might be it | 10:55 |
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| Mece | ruskie, what did you change it to? | 10:55 |
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| ruskie | zsh | 10:55 |
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| ruskie | yes I've built my own zsh package | 10:55 |
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| johnxx | ruskie, probably some script that's has some ash'ism and doesn't do the right thing in bash | 10:56 |
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| Zeddy | no pointer for me :o | 10:56 |
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| hrw | morning | 10:56 |
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| Mece | ruskie, i was going with bash... | 10:56 |
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| hrw | ~curse Quim for bug #5139 | 10:56 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5139 Provide multi-user chat (chatroom / IRC) support again | 10:56 |
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| johnxx | mornin' hrw | 10:56 |
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| asidjazz | ohwell im over this for a bit & | 10:56 |
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| Zeddy | ok, got the pointer, but lol when i try clicking the pointer vanishes :p | 10:56 |
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| ruskie | hmm I do wonder if there's a shells file somewhere that needs it in | 10:56 |
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| ruskie | reflashes | 10:57 |
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| hrw | ~curse DDP just to start a day | 10:57 |
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| ruskie | I'll probably need the better part of the week for this | 10:57 |
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| johnxx | Zeddy, keep trying. it should work. you just click on the pointer box once it shows up. then it should show a red line through it. drag all you want then click the pointer-box again to go back to normal mode | 10:58 |
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| ruskie | good thing I'm documenting most of my changes | 10:58 |
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| *** BBNS_ has joined #maemo | 10:59 |
| * johnxx heads off to bed | 10:59 |
| johnxx | 'night all | 10:59 |
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| ruskie | from repartioning to others | 10:59 |
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| Zeddy | oh you have to click the box :) thanks! | 10:59 |
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| LinuxCode | nn johnxx | 10:59 |
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| Zeddy | this is a pretty not-so-obvius thing :P | 10:59 |
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| ruskie | now I'll try without any changes and just change the shell to zsh | 10:59 |
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| ruskie | and see what happens | 10:59 |
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| johnxx | ruskie, you caused a mini-netsplit. that's what happens :P | 11:00 |
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| ruskie | rofl | 11:00 |
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| andre__ | whou. quim seems to be one a "moved to brainstorm" spree in bugzilla. | 11:01 |
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| Venomrush | yup | 11:02 |
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| Venomrush | but you can also argue it's a bug | 11:02 |
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| Venomrush | as user expects this to happen but system is not doing it | 11:03 |
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| Mece | hrw, that is actually annoying. i tested multi-user chat on gtalk. worked fine on N900.. | 11:03 |
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| Mece | hrw, too bad you can't initiate one. | 11:03 |
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| hrw | Mece: I hope that will not end in 'it was not made in first maemo5 releases so will never be done by Nokia' | 11:06 |
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| Stskeeps | andre__: mm, maybe a bit premature since m.o is horribly slow, especially in brainstorm atm :/ | 11:07 |
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| andre__ | well, I'm never sure either whether it's Brainstorm because it's too wide, or still an enhancement ticket in Bugzilla | 11:07 |
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| andre__ | and in doubt I keep it. | 11:07 |
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| bergie | Stskeeps: speed should be better when we get more reasonable hardware up :-) | 11:09 |
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| Stskeeps | bergie: yeah, of course - i'm just saying the timing isn't that good :) | 11:09 |
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| X-Fade | I just kicked it a bit, should be a little faster now. | 11:10 |
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| bergie | thx | 11:10 |
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| Stskeeps | a lot faster, too | 11:10 |
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| ruskie | hmm ok confirmed it doesn't like /bin/zsh on user shell | 11:11 |
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| hrw | how many regressions since maemo4 was already found? | 11:12 |
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| hrw | maemo5 dropped chatroom support, got ugly fingerfriendly ui, something more? | 11:12 |
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| ruskie | well reflash again | 11:13 |
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| andre__ | well, chatroom support was never officially supported. | 11:13 |
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| ruskie | atleast now I know what the prob is | 11:13 |
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| zaheerm | lcuk, ping | 11:13 |
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| asidjazz | what doesw * mean inside () in cpp | 11:13 |
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| asidjazz | like void example_init (AppData * data) | 11:14 |
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| zaheerm | it means a pointer | 11:14 |
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| asidjazz | data? | 11:14 |
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| zaheerm | so AppData *data is a pointer being passed as a parameter not the actual data | 11:14 |
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| asidjazz | same as *data ? | 11:14 |
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| asidjazz | oh so the space means nothing | 11:14 |
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| asidjazz | k | 11:14 |
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| zaheerm | nothing | 11:14 |
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| hrw | andre__: o rly? I just started IM on os2008 and in menu Chat I have "Enter char room..." "Chat rooms..." options | 11:14 |
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| hrw | andre__: I would not call it 'unsupported' | 11:15 |
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| asidjazz | zaheerm: and that means when data is modified outside of this function its reflected in the function? | 11:15 |
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| andre__ | hrw, oh really? thanks for misunderstanding my words by purpose | 11:15 |
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| andre__ | i think you know what i meant. | 11:15 |
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| asidjazz | zaheerm: and it can modify the stuff in data and itll replicate outside of the function ? | 11:15 |
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| zaheerm | asidjazz, there is no replication | 11:15 |
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| hrw | andre__: for me if feature is available in official firmware then it is supported. | 11:16 |
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| asidjazz | right but other than that im right? :) | 11:16 |
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| andre__ | hrw, then you've learned something today: it's not like that. | 11:16 |
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| lcuk | hey zaheerm | 11:16 |
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| hrw | andre__: sure. will maemo6 remove wifi encryption and tell that this was never supported even when available? | 11:17 |
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| andre__ | hrw, but sure, it sucks that it's missing in maemo5 :-/ | 11:17 |
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| zaheerm | lcuk, can you pm me your email address so i can send you that video editor slide | 11:17 |
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| andre__ | hrw, I can't talk in public about features, sorry. | 11:17 |
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| hrw | andre__: I am used to nokia devices missing obvious things or have them made in wrong way | 11:18 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: lol, that's maemo in action | 11:18 |
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| zaheerm | hrw, maemo 5 is not maemo 4 | 11:18 |
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| suihkulokki | 11:16 < hrw> andre__: for me if feature is available in official firmware then it is supported. | 11:18 |
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| andre__ | yeah. and not s60 either. but people don't get it... | 11:18 |
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| suihkulokki | so everything created by comminuty is not usable? | 11:18 |
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| hrw | zaheerm: I know. but I would except it to be next step ahead from maemo4 not next step back | 11:18 |
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| zaheerm | andre__, however there is no harm suggesting things in bugzilla that work in both s60 world, maemo 4 and other platforms as things to work on | 11:19 |
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| zaheerm | hrw, i don't think anyone will call maemo 5 a step back | 11:19 |
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| hrw | suihkulokki: I do not want to use pidgin for IM if system provides me IM | 11:19 |
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| andre__ | zaheerm, sure. but I get bored by people screaming "regression" when coming from s60 | 11:19 |
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| PaulFertser | zaheerm: suggesting is the key word. But nobody will even answer about whether it's planned to implement your suggestion or not just because no nokia employee is allowed to "talk about features". | 11:19 |
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| hrw | andre__: I have os2005/6/7/8 and s60v3fp1 experience and will move to maemo5 (if DDP will ever work) | 11:20 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, ask the marketing guys to get an answer. "nobody" is wrong. and you know that. | 11:20 |
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| zaheerm | PaulFertser, well some have mentioned that it is in process of implementation | 11:20 |
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| lcuk | zaheerm, why dont you put all the info up publicly and that way everyone gets benefit :) my address to ping the url to will be liquid@gmail | 11:20 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: nobody among the engineers. I can't trust marketing guys, sorry. | 11:20 |
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| lcuk | after work tonight im gonna write up a full thing about the weekend :) | 11:20 |
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| zaheerm | lcuk, i will, but want to scan all the slides first before putting what i already have digitally | 11:20 |
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| hrw | andre__: marketing guys can tell anything | 11:20 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, then enjoy live in North Korea. sorry for capitalism. | 11:20 |
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| andre__ | hrw, so if something accidentially works (like google sync for some people by using MfE) though it was ever tested it's "unsupported". but well, I think we both know :) | 11:21 |
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| hrw | andre__: and then engineers will kill marketing team for giving round popups for people | 11:21 |
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| lcuk | yeah so if you were gonna send to me if oyu need a couple of days to process themthen do that, dont rush on my behalf ive got work | 11:21 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: the fact capitalism is evil doesn't make North Korea's regime any better and you know that. | 11:21 |
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| hrw | andre__: yep | 11:21 |
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| * Stskeeps gets the popcorn | 11:22 |
| Stskeeps | openness discussion first at 10am instead of 8am, impressive | 11:22 |
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| ruskie | hmm ok definately does not like /bin/zsh... now tested a few times and it's consistent | 11:22 |
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| zaheerm | regarding google sync, i spent quite a chunk of my weekend working on multi calendar sync and it works (though command line only so far) | 11:22 |
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| zaheerm | http://www.flickr.com/photos/aandza/4164018365/ is a screenshot | 11:22 |
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| ruskie | atleast not as changed in passwd | 11:22 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: i'm not for discussion, i just loled again over "regression/offical feature" argument. I didn't come here again to lose everybody's time. | 11:23 |
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| PaulFertser | /me's off | 11:23 |
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| hrw | zaheerm: as long as it does not support any SyncML server (like scheduleworld) I will complain anyway | 11:23 |
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| SpeedEvil | how do I set the SMS centre number? | 11:23 |
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| ruskie | make it use te one from the sim card? | 11:23 |
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| andre__ | Stskeeps, I'm sorry that I got up that late ;-) | 11:23 |
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| asidjazz | so something like program = HILDON_PROGRAM(hildon_program_get_instance()); | 11:23 |
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| zaheerm | hrw, feel free to complain or add to the brainstorm about google sync (not that google calendar supports syncml) | 11:23 |
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| asidjazz | what exacty is HILDON_PROGRAM() | 11:23 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, I disagree already with "the fact capitalism is evil", obviously :) | 11:23 |
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| asidjazz | why is it in capitals | 11:24 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: as a sidenote, i bet you do not trust the marketing guys either. | 11:24 |
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| hrw | asidjazz: go to developer wiki and read examples + docs | 11:24 |
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| andre__ | depends on "trust"... | 11:24 |
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| zaheerm | hrw, you are free to modify my code and add some random syncml implementation to replace the gdata stuff | 11:24 |
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| asidjazz | hrw: i mean generally .. like why is it in capitals? | 11:24 |
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| hrw | zaheerm: iirc I added notes there | 11:24 |
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| hrw | asidjazz: because it is macro | 11:24 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, I don't know enough about their work to be able to say whether I trust them or not... | 11:24 |
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| asidjazz | ah a macro | 11:24 |
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| hrw | zaheerm: I am sick each time when I look at syncml libraries direction | 11:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | ruskie: SMS seems not to work outbound - hence the question - so I was wanting to check. | 11:25 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: that you can rely on them, that you can expect their answers to be honest etc. Just think about your attitude to the marketing of any other company, e.g. when you're buying a fridge or a car? I bet you're very sceptical about what they say and promise. Nokia's marketing can't be any different, since they share the same capitalistic attitude as you've noted. | 11:26 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, have Nokia marketing folks been dishonest to you? | 11:26 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, I like capitalism. | 11:26 |
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| * hrw hopes that n900 will not repeat 6310i bugs | 11:27 |
| hrw | ;D | 11:27 |
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| zaheerm | lcuk, ok will put everything on maemo wiki once i have it all digital | 11:27 |
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| lcuk | \o/ sounds like a plan | 11:27 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: i'd say the "supported features" issue is all about dishonest marketing. | 11:27 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, ah, i get your point | 11:28 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: also, the usb host issue. What's about that? Why nobody can get a distinct answer whether it can actually work or not and what are the restrictions? | 11:28 |
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| andre__ | hmm. I must admit that I don't know exactly that the usb host issue is | 11:29 |
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| Zeddy | btw, i just recently learned QT, and made a few graphical applications for the windows platform | 11:29 |
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| Zeddy | how different is it to code maemo apps with qt? | 11:29 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: keeping the information about this major feature is something dishonest i'd say. Everybody knows that the SoC used is indeed capable of that. So they expect to see usb host supported. Keeping silence is dishonest. Either they say it's possible with given restrictions or they say it's not possible due to that and that. Keeping silence _is_ dishonest. | 11:30 |
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| Zeddy | is there a crazy learning curve? =) | 11:30 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: many people want usb host support on n900. And nobody can tell for sure if it's possible with given hardware. | 11:30 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_host_mode ? | 11:31 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: officially it's unsupported, yes. But is it possible at all or not is of interest to the majority. Nobody cares about "officially supported", it's a general purpose computer after all, talking about the features just doesn't fit this context. But hardware is what matters. | 11:31 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: my application from destkop builds fine for maemo5 without code changes. but UI need lot of work | 11:31 |
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| andre__ | ...or is that wiki page for N8x0 only? /me wondering | 11:32 |
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| Zeddy | oh | 11:32 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: yes, this one. For n900. | 11:32 |
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| Zeddy | so the ui elements work differently depending on platform | 11:32 |
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| dolfun | UI on a lot of ports needs a lot of work to come up to Maemo5 standards | 11:32 |
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| Zeddy | allright | 11:32 |
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| dolfun | in the N800 days, it was ok to have a butt-ugly gtk mess | 11:32 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: basically prepare for making UI from scratch | 11:32 |
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| Zeddy | ouch | 11:32 |
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| dolfun | yea | 11:32 |
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| Zeddy | but a application built for maemo works fine on windows? | 11:33 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: my app has simple UI but amount of required changes make me stop maemo5 development of it for now | 11:33 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: will but will be not comfortable to use | 11:33 |
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| Zeddy | ok | 11:33 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: maemo5 UI bases on many QMainWindows linked to each other etc | 11:34 |
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| Zeddy | O_o | 11:34 |
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| Zeddy | that sounds ugly imo | 11:34 |
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| hrw | thats my feeling after some playing | 11:34 |
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| hrw | Zeddy: #qt-maemo will tell you more | 11:34 |
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| Zeddy | oh cool | 11:34 |
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| cehteh | QMainWindow? .. sounds like QT/Maemo6 | 11:34 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, good question. So did somebody ask Nokia about this? | 11:34 |
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| hrw | cehteh: maemo6? I use Qt on maemo5sdk | 11:35 |
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| hrw | ~curse ddp | 11:35 |
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| cehteh | ah ok | 11:35 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: they did, on the omap-kernel ml. The answer was that due to stupid nobody-needs-that-damn-usb-logo certification issue they decided to "disable it". No further clarifications followed. | 11:35 |
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| lcuk | zaheerm, since hte video editor had a lot of interest, are there any other people with notes that they can get uploaded. if you make a start on the wiki page about it, perhaps others can help you flesh it out | 11:36 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: ah, but they do need USB logo or face possible legal action if they have to claim it's USB :/ | 11:36 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, ahem, well, certification/PICS issues can easily trigger some lawsuits... | 11:36 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: URL for post? | 11:36 |
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| zaheerm | lcuk, yep will start, i collated all the notes people made on friday and i will scan them at some point today | 11:37 |
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| andre__ | btw, I guess that bug 5300 has some similar reasoning currently (certification issues) | 11:37 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5300 Support sending files via Bluetooth in file manager | 11:37 |
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| lcuk | yeah there was a big wodge of them, did you get them all, or has bilboed got some? | 11:38 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: certification is (sadly) a needed thing and something many open source projects don't pay attention to :/ if they did, some of the stuff might be less crazy | 11:39 |
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| Mece | Stskeeps, I kinda like the crazyness... | 11:44 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: cos otherwise they might be opening themselves to lawsuits if they claim Bluetooth support etc.. :P | 11:44 |
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| Stskeeps | (personally i think many open source projects are living in a fairy tale bubble but so it goes..) | 11:45 |
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| suihkulokki | PaulFertser: notice that the host usb (especially when using musb instead of ehci) on beagleboard isn't exactly reliable either | 11:49 |
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| * ruskie belives most of the world is living in a fairy tail called capitalism | 11:49 |
| hrw | I have some idea about testing is usb host possible on n900 but prefer to wait and check it on device | 11:51 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: Stskeeps: they can avoid claiming official usb support | 11:56 |
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| Stskeeps | might work in china or russia but doubt in europe.. | 11:57 |
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| andre__ | PaulFertser, do you have the URL for the omap-kernel ml posting? | 11:58 |
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| * andre__ searches the backlog | 11:58 |
| PaulFertser | andre__: sure, i'll find it | 11:58 |
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| andre__ | thanks | 11:58 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: what? You just do not claim your device is usb-compatible and that's it. | 11:58 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: yeah, and you lose a lot of money since your customers won't buy it cos it's seemingily not usb compatible.. | 11:59 |
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| hrw | my idea is: for now n900 has usb device + usb charging implemented. so all 4 usb lines are in use: +5V, GND, D+, D- ones. usb device require gnd/d+/d-, charging require +5v/gnd ones. usb host require same as usb device but is expected to have something on +5v line (which n900 cannot provide). | 11:59 |
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| dolfun | european government outlaws non-standard USB? | 11:59 |
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| Stskeeps | hrw: how was it on the 770? i think it might be a similar situation | 11:59 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: you can say that it's usb-like interface probably compatible with most other usb devices. And tell the story about the stupid certification. | 11:59 |
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| hrw | what if we use microusb cable with +5v line cutted off + self-powered usbhub/usbdevice and then load selfbuilt kernel module for ehci/musb? | 12:00 |
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| Stskeeps | hrw: that's what i'm thinking too.. | 12:00 |
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| dolfun | or invent a new name "USBplus!" | 12:00 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: it is same on all devices which has usbhost. on n900 you just need to cut +5v line for device safety | 12:00 |
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| andre__ | uhm, "usb like" instead of usb? well, don't know if i'd buy that... | 12:00 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: Stskeeps: linked from the WP n900 article :) http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-September/020830.html | 12:00 |
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| ruskie | hmm is there a way to remove all the google stuff out of the browser? i.e. I don't want to have a use google to search for this at all? | 12:00 |
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| andre__ | thanks! | 12:00 |
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| dolfun | (compatible witth most usb 2.0 devices) | 12:00 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: that's maemo-developers, not linux-omap, but OK :) | 12:00 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: either way, a company that deals highly in certification (telecommunications, etc), i doubt they're going to do that.. | 12:01 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: with 770 I did not played with usb host. with n810 nothing needs to be done - it just works when usbdevice has own power | 12:01 |
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| sejo | ruskie: i think it is possible yes | 12:01 |
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| sejo | ruskie: let me check | 12:01 |
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| ruskie | sejo, I checked about:config and removed stuff but that still showed up | 12:01 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: i'm not sure freerunners has passed any usb certification and it was never an issue with anything. | 12:01 |
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| ruskie | frankly I'm not to concerned if it would require recompiling it | 12:01 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: how it is with n900? no idea. so far I had less then 5 minutes in total with n900 in hands | 12:02 |
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| sejo | ruskie: ach no can't find something sorry | 12:02 |
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| Stskeeps | hrw: i am personally waiting for you and fanoush to get n900s in your hands :P | 12:02 |
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| * ruskie wonders why | 12:02 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: I wonder when my bank will decide to remove 250€ lock from my card. tomorrow it will be 4weeks since order | 12:03 |
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| dolfun | serge, fanoush, hrw could have been approached to receie prototypes | 12:03 |
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| dolfun | this was an oversight by (cough) someone | 12:03 |
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| Stskeeps | dolfun: serge..? | 12:03 |
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| dolfun | mplayer dude | 12:03 |
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| hrw | dolfun: que? | 12:03 |
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| Stskeeps | dolfun: works for nokia | 12:03 |
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| ruskie | hmm nice... my privacy guard for the n900 has been sent processed and will be shipped out today | 12:04 |
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| dolfun | oh | 12:04 |
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| dolfun | since when | 12:04 |
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| hrw | dolfun: and which n900 prototype? rover had many of them rather | 12:04 |
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| PaulFertser | andre__: this post http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-September/020836.html doesn't convince me. AFAIK there's nothing special about usb A connectors, i do not know of any extra line that should go from it anywhere. | 12:04 |
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| hrw | dolfun: I remember rover talks when OH existed so ~2 years ago | 12:04 |
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| dolfun | ah | 12:04 |
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| dolfun | sorry then it was just fanoush | 12:04 |
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| dolfun | but then again, recent activity is what gets noticed | 12:05 |
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| dolfun | <end> | 12:05 |
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| hrw | anyway time will show | 12:05 |
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| Stskeeps | dolfun: mm. the push was towards getting apps into extras (pre-summit), then the summit (300 loaner devices), and then the slightly malfunctioning DDP | 12:06 |
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| dolfun | do anyonen here use new vmware sdk prefinal_ | 12:06 |
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| dolfun | does | 12:06 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_OTG | 12:06 |
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| Stskeeps | go read the micro plugs | 12:06 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: DDP still is at 'we accept orders only' stage | 12:06 |
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| Stskeeps | hrw: hence my notion of slightly malfunctioning | 12:06 |
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| dolfun | wondering if it makes my live easy or difficult | 12:06 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: i know but SoC supports host-mode, there's no need for OTG. | 12:06 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: true, and that's why i wonder if it's possible to do with a special cable or kernel adjustment | 12:07 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: well, otg is not possible on n900, hell with it. But why a simple host-mode can be not possible is unclear. | 12:07 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: either way you'd need to switch it into host mode from very beginning | 12:07 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: sure | 12:07 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: so you see, everybody's wondering but nokia marketing guys do not give a damn about it, uncool, heh? | 12:08 |
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| hrw | PaulFertser: omap3 iirs has two usb ports - one of them is OTG, second is not. which one nokia used? | 12:08 |
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| Stskeeps | probably the otg one, for gadget | 12:08 |
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| hrw | yep | 12:08 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: well did anyone step up and ask specific questions? .. | 12:08 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: like, "what's the new pinout of the usb port then" or "wouldn't it technically be possible to force the port into host mode from kernel initialization" | 12:09 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: yes, the ML post was just about that, the specific questions. Where to ask those questions anyway? bugtracker? It's software-only. Maemo ML? Already tried, software-only too. Just where? | 12:09 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: show me your ML post | 12:09 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: that's not my ML post but it asks specific questions: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-September/020834.html | 12:10 |
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| PaulFertser | If it's "not possible at all" there's no point asking about registers or pinouts. | 12:10 |
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| sejo | is there someone working on the caldav support? | 12:11 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-September/020836.html | 12:12 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: btw, freerunner is not OTG-capable but we can switch to/from hostmode whenever is needed. | 12:12 |
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| Stskeeps | it was answered by one of the top honchos :P | 12:12 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: he says he's no usb expert. His answer lacks details so i doubt it's correct. | 12:12 |
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| hrw | btw - is there a way to grab maemo-dev ML archive as mbox? | 12:12 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: he's one of the main kernel guys and you have to consider that devices HW and SW was seperate until recently | 12:13 |
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| Stskeeps | chances are they might still be physically seperate | 12:13 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: there's no need for extra lines when you switch host/device manually. Probably otg is impossible, ok. But the host mode doesn't require anything extra. And he doesn't even say if the hardware has a power-converter to supply something over the usb or not. | 12:13 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: so whom to ask? Mythical hardware guys nobody's seen ever? | 12:14 |
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| * w00t notes that replying to that mail would have made a good first step | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: i'd say get going with checking out the pins on the USB plug and see if you can modify the kernel to force it into host mode. | 12:15 |
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| PaulFertser | w00t: do you propose me to reply to that mail asking specific hardware questions? | 12:15 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: and yes, then people have something to point at if they roam the buildings for people to ask about it. | 12:15 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: the pins are exactly the same. There're two additional pulldown (?) resistors needed and i do not know if they included in the design or should be connected externally. The same about power supply. | 12:16 |
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| Stskeeps | and get specific answers | 12:16 |
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| RST38h | <yawn> So, are we having another "all hardware must be free or ELSE" debate? | 12:16 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: nop | 12:16 |
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| w00t | that's what -i'd- do, yes | 12:16 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: well that's valuable knowledge then | 12:17 |
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| * sivang wonders why people call themselves w00t | 12:17 |
| RST38h | Good, 'cause it was getting boring | 12:17 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: ok, will do today's evening, thanks for the pointers. In fact if i could get a hold of the n900 schematics i think i could have obtained the answer myself. | 12:17 |
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| w00t | sivang: I've been called this for around 8-9 years now, it's a bit too late to change it really | 12:17 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: yeah, but chinese copyists yadda yadda :P | 12:17 |
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| sivang | w00t: I see, how old were you when you were named this ? | 12:18 |
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| w00t | sivang: 14ish | 12:18 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: but anyway, for any particular problem that's not easy to find information on, you need to poke people and roam the halls of either the internet or nokia offices to get a answer :P | 12:18 |
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| sivang | w00t: right, okay | 12:18 |
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| Stskeeps | so with good questions in your hand you can get far | 12:18 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: they were copying nokia phones before, they will continue to do that today and tomorrow. I seriously doubt hiding schematics has any measurable economical benefit. | 12:18 |
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| sivang | anybody knows how am I supposed to have a bash terminal spit out GUI to the Xephyr from the scratchbox shell ? | 12:19 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: ok, thanks a lot, i'll prepare a set of questions. | 12:19 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: i've had chinese manufactors ask me to not publish schematics. | 12:19 |
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| sivang | I want to run an app from there, and see the ouput and UI at the emulator | 12:19 |
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| Stskeeps | that's how tough the market is even over there. | 12:19 |
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| sivang | also, I cannot find where to install PyGTK on it, it is not in any catalogue or source that comes with the SDK | 12:19 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: anyway, CC me (carsten@maemo.org) on the questions, a | 12:20 |
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| Stskeeps | ta | 12:20 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: sure. Do you by any chance know if maemo-developers require subscription? | 12:20 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: can't recall sorry | 12:20 |
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| PaulFertser | np | 12:20 |
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| PaulFertser | see you later, thanks to all for constructive suggestions. :) | 12:21 |
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| Stskeeps | and if you need me to review it before sending, i'll be happy to | 12:21 |
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| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: i'll do my best to avoid all my nasty words and nokia criticism, so no need to worry ;) | 12:22 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah, it's easier to get answers on questions that doesn't come with papercuts that come out at you when you read them | 12:23 |
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| sivang | do I add sources by hand to the sources.list file ? | 12:23 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 12:23 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: what nasty worlds and nokia criticism? You should have had a SAMSUNG cell phone, then you'd feel the need to criticise and curse :) | 12:24 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: s/worlds/words/ | 12:25 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: btw, do you know raster is working on one? And it'll have proper upstream kernel, X and E preinstalled? Should be really fancy. | 12:25 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: ah nice, who is rater? | 12:26 |
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| sivang | raster | 12:26 |
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| sivang | what's E? | 12:26 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: i mean samsung hired raster quite some time ago and they aim to produce something fancy that will be a real GNU/Linux device. | 12:26 |
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| sivang | ah nice | 12:26 |
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| sivang | still their hardware and UIs are unintuitive to me and a bunch of Israeli custoemrs. | 12:26 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: Enlightment, and Raster is one of the great hackers/artists who's a primary author of E. | 12:26 |
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| sivang | (Actually a large base) | 12:26 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: I thougth enlightment was a goner, nice to see it will be resorected | 12:27 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: re that i don't think that's exactly what they're trying to do .. raster is trying to push something like it | 12:27 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: but as with any company it's an uphill battle | 12:27 |
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| * sivang pets GTK/Qt/Maemo | 12:27 |
| PaulFertser | Stskeeps: indeed. But i prefer to hope for the better ;) | 12:27 |
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| Stskeeps | PaulFertser: so technically you could end up with a locked up samsung phone that happens to run EFL | 12:27 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 12:27 |
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| glass_ | sammys prob is having too many baskets | 12:28 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: elementary is damn nice and fancy and in fact more optimised. Very clueful graphic optimisation code. And it also features another approach to the theming: most of the gui logic can be themed, that's quite the contrast with other popular toolkits. | 12:28 |
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| hrw | PaulFertser: you know that E17 do not require X? | 12:29 |
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| PaulFertser | hrw: i think yes, it has opengles render etc. But i can assure you that raster respects FDO standards much more than maemo designers. | 12:29 |
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| sejo | weird when calling people don't hear me? | 12:30 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: google finds stuff about elementary schools | 12:30 |
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| sejo | I hear them but not the way around | 12:30 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: did you install FM radio? | 12:30 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: yes | 12:30 |
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| sivang | sejo: dude, how do I install bash/ipython onto the scratchbox and run them from the maemo desktop? | 12:30 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: you'd want to get rid of that | 12:30 |
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| * sivang high fives sejo | 12:30 |
| PaulFertser | sivang: http://trac.enlightenment.org/e/wiki/Elementary | 12:31 |
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| sejo | hey sivang have no idea hoven't done that yet | 12:31 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: you'll need to reflash or remove fm radio to get your microphone back. FM radio breaks something atm it seems | 12:31 |
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| sivang | sejo: ah okay, I'll continue searching the wiki | 12:32 |
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| sivang | sejo: thanks anyway :) | 12:32 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: ah, looks a bit too minimalistic | 12:32 |
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| sivang | (in my tsate) | 12:32 |
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| sivang | as in 'doll' | 12:32 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: oops | 12:32 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: not really, you can use full Edje theming powers with it. | 12:32 |
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| hrw | btw - can someone remind me default prtitions on n900? | 12:33 |
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| sejo | bleh uninstall doesn't do the trick | 12:33 |
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| Sargun | hey PaulFertser, got your n900 yet? | 12:33 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: how do I reflash it? | 12:34 |
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| ruskie | hrw, / ubifs /home mmcblk1p2 /home/user/MyDocs mmcblk0p1 and swap mmcblk0p3 | 12:34 |
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| Sargun | ubifs? | 12:34 |
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| hrw | ruskie: what sizes? | 12:34 |
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| hrw | Sargun: ubifs | 12:34 |
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| hrw | Sargun: fs for flash chips | 12:34 |
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| ruskie | 256, 2gb, everything else, 768 | 12:34 |
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| hrw | ruskie: and /opt/ is? | 12:35 |
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| ruskie | ln -s /home/opt /opt | 12:35 |
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| hrw | argh | 12:36 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: | 12:36 |
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| Stskeeps | ~flashing | 12:36 |
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| Stskeeps | .. | 12:36 |
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| * Stskeeps pokes infobot | 12:36 |
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| ersin | yo this is a totally n00b question but here goes anyway | 12:37 |
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| ersin | how does everyone do that "pokes whatever" or "does action" stuff in irc? | 12:37 |
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| ruskie | /me something | 12:37 |
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| * ersin gets it finally | 12:37 |
| ersin | thank you very much, that's been driving me crazy | 12:37 |
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| w00t | hehe | 12:37 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: i'm not even going to | 12:38 |
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| ruskie | :) | 12:38 |
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| PaulFertser | Sargun: ^^ | 12:38 |
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| PaulFertser | sivang: Edje theming is a whole new world, just try it, who knows, probably you'll got hooked up ;) | 12:38 |
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| sivang | PaulFertser: I might :) | 12:40 |
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| Khertan_ | Hi ! | 12:41 |
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| RST38h | OMG another widget set | 12:41 |
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| ersin | hi khertan_ | 12:41 |
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| Khertan_ | hello ersin | 12:41 |
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| PaulFertser | RST38h: it's not | 12:42 |
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| Sargun | user__, happy t-mobile. | 12:42 |
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| * Sargun needs t-mobile. | 12:42 |
| RST38h | not another, not widget, or not a set? | 12:42 |
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| PaulFertser | RST38h: not widget set. | 12:42 |
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| PaulFertser | EFL is much more than that | 12:42 |
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| ersin | EFL port to maemo? lol | 12:43 |
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| * RST38h meant Elementary though | 12:43 |
| ruskie | that would actually be nice | 12:43 |
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| ersin | well samsung's pushing it now in bada | 12:43 |
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| ruskie | not really planing on moving away from nokia phones | 12:44 |
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| ruskie | the software might be crap for a few revisions but they tend to make solid devices | 12:44 |
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| ersin | very true | 12:44 |
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| ersin | though i've never used any nokia phone other than the candybars | 12:44 |
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| ersin | even those things were designed perfectly | 12:44 |
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| ruskie | I used a n5110 for 6 years | 12:44 |
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| ersin | right on | 12:44 |
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| ruskie | a n5140i for ~2 | 12:44 |
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| ruskie | and a n95 for 18 months | 12:45 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: raster didn't know anything about bada and was a bit surprised. i doubt it. | 12:45 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 12:45 |
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| ersin | O_O | 12:45 |
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| ersin | heh heh | 12:45 |
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| ersin | just you wait | 12:45 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: uninstall and reboot does the trick | 12:45 |
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| PaulFertser | I was using some really bad looking nokia 1100 that my friend found somewhere in dirt on street. Worked fine so far. Heard many similar stories. | 12:45 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: good | 12:45 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: but you need to reboot after removing the fm radio | 12:45 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: perhaps it should be removed from the repo? | 12:46 |
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| Stskeeps | sejo: wheels are in motion | 12:46 |
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| PaulFertser | But i didn't manage a dumbphone with a UI that was appealing to me: no useless animation, as much as possible information, shortcuts-based. No dumb cellphone was sane enough to provide that. | 12:46 |
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| sejo | Stskeeps: lol k :p | 12:46 |
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| * sejo is going to setup a VM and start writing CalDAV support... | 12:46 |
| ruskie | ersin, of course I only managed to get the n95 into a properly usable state like half a year or so ago | 12:47 |
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| ersin | ruskie: never used it, though i heard its praises sung | 12:47 |
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| ruskie | well I guess for me something like a n900 is the near ultimate device | 12:47 |
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| ruskie | the n95 was just to contrained for my needs | 12:48 |
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| ruskie | I'll use it as a gps device in the car now | 12:48 |
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| sejo | what would be the best OS to put the sdk on (ubuntu/fedora/...) | 12:49 |
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| ruskie | should probably run on anything | 12:49 |
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| ruskie | iirc it does go into a scratchbox install | 12:49 |
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| sejo | ruskie: yeah but on my 64bit gentoo the scratchbox doesn't work :/ | 12:49 |
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| ruskie | and the scripts are quite automated | 12:50 |
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| ruskie | it doesn't? | 12:50 |
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| ruskie | it does on my 64bit source mage | 12:50 |
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| ruskie | kernel with enabled 32bit binaries | 12:50 |
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| sejo | ach dang dunno if my kernel does that | 12:51 |
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| hrw | sejo: grab maemosdk virt image - it uses ubuntu | 12:51 |
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| sejo | I alsways get bash: ./hello: No such file or directory | 12:51 |
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| Lateralus | how do you start an app in scratchbox in the terminal as though it were launched by the application menu? | 12:52 |
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| hrw | Lateralus: find .desktop of app, read it, launch what you read from it | 12:53 |
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| Lateralus | hrw: I assume you mean the Exec line? | 12:54 |
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| sejo | hmm it does have IA32 config on | 12:55 |
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| Lateralus | hrw: I am using the same from scratchbox, /usr/bin/myapp, it opens when I do that, but not when I click the application icon in xephyr | 12:56 |
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| X-Fade | !seen pycage | 13:02 |
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| X-Fade | ~seen pycage | 13:02 |
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| hrw | Lateralus: yes, Exec line | 13:02 |
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| X-Fade | Hmm no bots anymore? | 13:02 |
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| hrw | Lateralus: no idea fro me | 13:02 |
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| range | ARGH. Please brainstorm, let me save my idea .... | 13:10 |
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| divinegod | I would like to contribute to danish l10n for n900, what should I do? | 13:13 |
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| andre__ | divinegod, how do you mean? | 13:13 |
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| andre__ | Improving the translation of existing software provided by Nokia? Or 3rd party applications that do not have a Danish translation? | 13:13 |
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| Stskeeps | andre__: i can only imagine he means improve the translation as it's utterly horrible | 13:14 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 13:14 |
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| andre__ | of course it is. that's where nokia saves money ;-) | 13:14 |
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| Stskeeps | divinegod: for harmattan there's supposed to be community localization, but i'm not sure there's any direct ways to submit l10n issues except for lengthy bug reports that may or may not be heard | 13:16 |
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| divinegod | andre__: I have the n900 but some of the translations seem odd.. | 13:16 |
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| Stskeeps | (og hej!) | 13:16 |
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| divinegod | Hej | 13:16 |
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| divinegod | :) | 13:16 |
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| * andre__ seconds what Stskeeps wrote | 13:17 |
| divinegod | ok, i'm filing a bug | 13:17 |
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| andre__ | garrr. now where is the N900 User Guide on the internet? sigh | 13:17 |
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| andre__ | divinegod: with good steps to reproduce, and don't dump 30 weird strings from all apps in one report, please. :) | 13:17 |
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| Stskeeps | divinegod: screenshots help | 13:18 |
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| Stskeeps | ctrl-shift-p, record the "weird" strings | 13:18 |
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| hrw | Stskeeps: I heard that maemo7 will be 105% community based | 13:18 |
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| divinegod | andre__: it's just a single weird string in the program manager | 13:19 |
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| andre__ | hrw, but if you don't help it will only be 102%... | 13:19 |
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| andre__ | divinegod, ah. go ahead under "Translations" | 13:19 |
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| Stskeeps | hrw: ah, maemo7, the "what, you expect us (nokia) to develop this system? it's open source. get working!" | 13:19 |
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| Stskeeps | +OS? | 13:19 |
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| ruskie | hmm maemo7 sounds interesting ;) | 13:23 |
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| ruskie | maybe it'll work from n770 up to the latest and greatest at the time ;) | 13:23 |
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| ManuelSE_ | and a z80 | 13:25 |
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| * ruskie waits to see an Ubuntu Tablet Remix ;) | 13:25 |
| ManuelSE_ | how can i make maemo n900 xchat autocomplete nicknames? | 13:26 |
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| ManuelSE_ | mer isnt bad, but basing on ubuntu means more forks | 13:27 |
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| Stskeeps | ManuelSE_: sometimes i do wonder if we would have been easier off with basing on top of busybox and all that jazz, but the development advantages and possibilities exceed that | 13:29 |
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| ruskie | busybox... scary | 13:29 |
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| ruskie | atleast the one on the n900 is lacking in some features | 13:30 |
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| ruskie | like ls with colours would be nice | 13:30 |
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| ManuelSE_ | stskeeps, your choice also means a more do-able mer, so it was a goood one | 13:31 |
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| lardman | timeless_mbp: ping | 13:31 |
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| hrw | ruskie: apt-get install bash | 13:31 |
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| ruskie | hrw, still lacks a colour ls | 13:31 |
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| ruskie | and I have both bash and zsh installed | 13:31 |
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| ManuelSE_ | doable is crucial, abstract dogma is a luxury | 13:31 |
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| hrw | sorry, | 13:31 |
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| hrw | ruskie: apt-get install coreutils | 13:31 |
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| ccooke | Morning, all | 13:31 |
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| hrw | hi lardman | 13:32 |
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| ruskie | no such package | 13:33 |
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| ruskie | not to mention it will probably overwrite or conflict with busybox | 13:33 |
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| lardman | hi hrw | 13:33 |
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| Lateralus | hrw: just my own stupidity; forgot to add dh_install lines for the service file in the deb | 13:34 |
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| ruskie | need to make a packagen for ls only... somethig like gls named :) | 13:34 |
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| ersin | *meanwhile, a lonely crazed hacker backports nokia patches to modern gtk...* | 13:34 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: keep me updated on that, am interested | 13:35 |
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| andre__ | same here. | 13:36 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: i finished glib and pango, just finished making the first round of patches for gtk, but now the hard part: i have to go through and weed out all the non MAEMO_CHANGES stuff | 13:36 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: glib is easy, did you see the set of debian/ patches? | 13:36 |
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| ersin | yep | 13:36 |
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| Stskeeps | k | 13:36 |
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| ersin | er but i didn't use 'em =P | 13:36 |
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| ersin | probably explains why it doesn't work | 13:36 |
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| Stskeeps | probably | 13:36 |
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| Stskeeps | it's stock glib + debian/patches dir (afaik) | 13:37 |
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| ersin | not quite | 13:37 |
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| Stskeeps | isn't it? | 13:37 |
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| ersin | some of the packages actually don't have any debian/patches | 13:37 |
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| ersin | some are just patched directly in | 13:37 |
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| Stskeeps | https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/projects/haf/trunk/glib/debian/patches/?root=maemo&sortby=date | 13:37 |
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| ersin | so i've been making my own | 13:37 |
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| Stskeeps | cos trunk/glib is just the debian packaging on stage.maemo.org | 13:37 |
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| Stskeeps | and that's what we use in mer too | 13:38 |
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| Stskeeps | (from fremantle glib) | 13:38 |
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| Stskeeps | which should apply fine on diablo, if that's what you're playing with | 13:38 |
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| ersin | odd | 13:39 |
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| Stskeeps | in the old glib, it was slightly more fucked :) | 13:39 |
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| ersin | i'm using diablo and i just did apt-get source libglib2.0-0 | 13:39 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | don't do that | 13:40 |
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| ersin | and i don't have debian/patches | 13:40 |
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| ersin | ... | 13:40 |
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| ersin | lol | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | grab the fremantle glib | 13:40 |
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| ersin | why fremantle? i'm using all diablo | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: 1) it's a later version and 2) it's the same patches | 13:40 |
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| ersin | makes sense | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | 3) packaging is so much saner | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 13:40 |
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| ersin | as if what i was attempting wasn't hackish enough lol | 13:40 |
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| Stskeeps | i'm very interested in the gtk+ work though | 13:41 |
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| Stskeeps | as we need to bring maemo gtk+ to some degree of sanity | 13:41 |
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| ersin | what's particularly insane about it? i'm doing this for my own selfish reasons, i'm not aware of the bugs that might be attached to gtk | 13:41 |
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| ersin | (all the better) | 13:41 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: well, that we don't have a proper way to upgrade to newer gtk+ | 13:41 |
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| ersin | ah | 13:42 |
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| Stskeeps | and that harms mer too obviously | 13:42 |
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| ersin | quick question for you stskeeps | 13:42 |
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| ersin | so i did compile glib and i'm absolutely sure i did it right, even though i didn't use debian/patches (as it doesn't exist in diablo extras-devel) | 13:42 |
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| * ruskie lets the N900 rest and charge up now for a while.. | 13:43 |
| ersin | but when i try to do af-whatever script it says there's a missing symbol | 13:43 |
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| ersin | do i have to recompile gtk with the new glib before that goes away? | 13:43 |
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| ersin | i.e. is there abi breakage? | 13:43 |
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| Stskeeps | not sure, depeds on the symbol | 13:44 |
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| ersin | hildon_g_scanner_cache_open | 13:44 |
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| Stskeeps | that's a missing patch in your glib then | 13:44 |
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| ersin | grr | 13:44 |
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| ersin | fremantle it is | 13:45 |
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| ersin | but i mean...damn this sucks, i just spent all night doing everything by hand from the diablo sources | 13:45 |
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| ersin | i've got to figure out some scripts here | 13:45 |
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| ersin | =P | 13:45 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: feel free to poke me if you have additional questions. i mean, i'm hired to faciliate OS devel :P | 13:45 |
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| ersin | really? by nokia? | 13:46 |
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| embedded | Is there anyone who owns a N900? | 13:46 |
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| ruskie | hmm will mer eventually support N900 ? | 13:46 |
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| ruskie | embedded, yes | 13:46 |
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| range | anyone left an hour ago. | 13:46 |
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| range | But yeah, I have one. | 13:46 |
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| wjt | embedded: nah, they're all an elaborate hoax | 13:46 |
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| ruskie | :) | 13:46 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: no, maemo.org | 13:46 |
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| Termana | lol range | 13:46 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: are they hiring ;)? | 13:46 |
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| Stskeeps | http://mer-project.blogspot.com/2009/10/my-first-day-as-maemoorg-distmaster.html , ersin | 13:46 |
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| Termana | which in turn is sponsored by Nokia :P | 13:47 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: yes, of course | 13:47 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: i have a port but weird touchscreen issues | 13:47 |
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| embedded | an N900 with firmware 1.2009.42-11 | 13:47 |
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| ruskie | embedded, naturally | 13:48 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, hmm and everything will function? | 13:48 |
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| ersin | wow, very cool, stskeeps | 13:48 |
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| ersin | people talk flak about nokia, but it's impressive to see a company sponsor such a position | 13:49 |
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| andre__ | Sigh. I hope that Nokia will push PR1.1 soon. Crossing fingers that this will reduce the number of incoming bug reports :-/ | 13:49 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: yes, we'll even make shiny ponies. general rule is that nokia doesn't mind nokia SW on nokia devices. that helps a lot of issues. | 13:49 |
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| ruskie | ok | 13:49 |
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| ruskie | another question... does mer have some more normal distro style setup? i.e. username/login and so on? or same as maemo... just boot to user and screw it all? | 13:50 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: we don't rely on /home/user | 13:51 |
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| range | andre__: quim seems to be moving some of those to "brainstorm" today :) | 13:51 |
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| ruskie | or better yet instead of asking... is there a page that compares the diffrences... from the low level setup to the highest level? | 13:51 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Reconstructed was the original thoughts | 13:52 |
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| Stskeeps | horribly outdated by now | 13:53 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: if i could ask you a debugging code section...i'm looking at glib/gscanner.c right now, which is where the missing symbol was from, and void hildon_gscanner_cache_open (...) is definitely within #ifdef MAEMO_CHANGES | 13:54 |
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| divinegod | Stskeeps: andre__: I've filed bug 6662. I hope it is described well enough. | 13:54 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6662 "Programmet 1 er installeret" is not a good translation | 13:54 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: did you -DMAEMO_CHANGES ? | 13:54 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: i'm explicitly calling CFLAGS="-DMAEMO_CHANGES", i even see it on my terminal screen scrolling by | 13:54 |
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| Stskeeps | divinegod: heh, that one made me cringe too | 13:54 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: check out the patches from newer glib .. something rings in my head re that | 13:54 |
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| divinegod | I'm glad i'm not alone :) | 13:54 |
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| ersin | yes | 13:55 |
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| ersin | it's in configure.in and then i ran autogen.sh to bring it into configure, not that that matters because i put it in the rules file for good measure | 13:55 |
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| ashenburger | is that danish_ | 13:55 |
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| ashenburger | ? | 13:55 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: k | 13:55 |
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| andre__ | range, actually I'm happy about that. Seems that my definition of Brainstorm was way more narrow than his one :) | 13:55 |
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| andre__ | divinegod, thanks :) | 13:55 |
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| kalikiana | ersin, maemo glib is just upstream + patches, you can check that in svn | 13:56 |
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| range | andre__: Okay, RfEs might really better be handled in brainstorm (although I am more used to a bugzilla like interface). | 13:57 |
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| ersin | kalikiana: do you know where the svn instructions are? i'm doing everything here by tarball | 13:57 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/ | 13:57 |
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| andre__ | range, depends on how complex they are. if they are easy to implement one module only issues, they should go to bugzilla | 13:57 |
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| ersin | great, ty stskeeps | 13:58 |
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| Stskeeps | (you can svn checkout from those paths) | 13:58 |
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| kalikiana | ersin, https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/glib/debian/patches/ | 13:58 |
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| range | andre__: :) I want calendar to be enhanced. That seems to count as "Do it via brainstorm" ... | 13:58 |
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| andre__ | yeah, most probably :) | 13:58 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, well a good document still... but I'm guessing replacing hal with devkit and polkit and such is one of the things that will go in | 13:59 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: i am still wondering about HAL and harmattan, personally | 13:59 |
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| ruskie | why? | 14:00 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: well, if they'll use hal or devkit there | 14:01 |
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| iDialekt | Too bad the n900 is on t mobile | 14:02 |
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| andre__ | i hope they kill HAL | 14:02 |
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| andre__ | iDialekt, ? | 14:02 |
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| iDialekt | The Nokia n900 | 14:03 |
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| range | Mine is on O2. | 14:03 |
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| andre__ | iDialekt, ah. very helpful :-P | 14:03 |
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| iDialekt | For USA | 14:03 |
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| andre__ | mine is on vodafone. | 14:03 |
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| andre__ | aha. USA. now we slowly get to the point. ;-) | 14:03 |
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| iDialekt | 3g is limited to the 1700 frequency | 14:03 |
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| andre__ | iDialekt, so you cannot get an n900 without going to a provider, or what is the issue? | 14:04 |
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| iDialekt | Yeah id have to switch to an inferior carrier | 14:05 |
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| frals | im going with the issue is US operators using weird 3g frequencies | 14:05 |
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| fnordianslip | hmm. on my n900 in File Manager, I have 2 copies of these directories: "n900/Audio clips", "n900/Camera", "n900/Documents, "n900/Images" and "n900/Cideo Clips". Whenever I plug the device into my Mac, and let it mount then unmoun the storage, I get another copy of all of these directories shown in File Manager. The most I've seen has been 4 copies of each. Looking in xterm, these directories don't seem to exist in MyDocs. Any | 14:05 |
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| fnordianslip | suggestions? | 14:05 |
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| iDialekt | I don't trust tmobile USA | 14:05 |
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| wjt | fnordianslip sounds like a bug :) | 14:05 |
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| Robot101 | fnordianslip: I think its a known issue, and a fix is on the way | 14:05 |
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| iDialekt | frals: Correct | 14:05 |
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| range | frals: I still wonder why 3G has to be that fractured and they couldn't really decide on one standard. | 14:05 |
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| ruskie | Stskeeps, frankly I think on a device such as this either solution is overkill... as is udev :) | 14:05 |
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| Robot101 | albanc: ^^ ? | 14:05 |
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| fnordianslip | er, "n900/Video clips", i meant | 14:05 |
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| range | frals: As it looks like there are no radios which implement the complete range. | 14:06 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, there is a bug report about that already in bugs.maemo.org :) | 14:06 |
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| range | *that | 14:06 |
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| fnordianslip | tnx | 14:06 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, feel free to comment and provide your steps | 14:06 |
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| iDialekt | Furthermore android is kinda a big deal right now | 14:06 |
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| fnordianslip | andre__: ok | 14:06 |
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| Stskeeps | ruskie: nah, that's embedded thinking. | 14:07 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, bug 5838 | 14:07 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5838 Certain directory entries are duplicated | 14:07 |
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| lardman | hmm, I can't create a brainstorm entry, is that normal? | 14:07 |
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| fnordianslip | thanks. my bug search fu is stlll weak | 14:07 |
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| lardman | oh no, just wrong password | 14:07 |
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| lardman | Xisdibik: ping | 14:08 |
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| lardman | Xisdibik: do you want to add the brainstorm entry that Quim talks of?> | 14:08 |
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| Lateralus | anyone have problems running apt-get update in the armel fremantle target of the vmware image? | 14:10 |
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| Lateralus | gzip errors? | 14:10 |
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| andre__ | divinegod, "Programmet %d er installeret" - what is the correct string for this? | 14:10 |
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| andre__ | or Stskeeps ^ | 14:11 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: what exactly is the svn you gave me for? | 14:13 |
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| range | Is there any possibility to see how many brainstorms are in "waiting" without clicking "next" until you reach a page which has no "next" button? | 14:13 |
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| andre__ | range, don't think so. Brainstorm interface has been discussed in the last weeks and improvements will take place I think | 14:14 |
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| * RST38h kinda doubts any of the brainstorms will end up in any useful action | 14:16 |
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| lardman | RST38h: likewise, but Quim said I should remove some stuff from the bugtracker and stick it in brainstorm | 14:16 |
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| range | Well, I was asked to take it out of bugs.maemo.org ... But I wonder how anyone who's not searching directly for a brainstorm like that would see it. | 14:16 |
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| range | Or find it. | 14:17 |
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| range | So one probably has to be vocal about it in bugs and on tmo. | 14:17 |
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| andre__ | range, yes, i guess so. crosslinking everything with everything is one of the things I try to do. | 14:17 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Which is probably a nice way to say "we are never ever gonna do it" | 14:18 |
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| andre__ | range, i think it's helpful to make all infrastructure known to many people (negative side effect: more comments in bugzilla that should go to a forum instead) | 14:18 |
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| lardman | RST38h: hmm | 14:18 |
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| lardman | yeah | 14:18 |
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| lardman | well the media player subtitles one should be easy to do | 14:18 |
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| divinegod | andre__: I guess it is "1 program installeret" and for plural "3 programmer installeret" | 14:18 |
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| RST38h | http://lj.karlson.ru/Canada/christmas.jpg | 14:18 |
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| RST38h | lardman: but they are never ever gonna do it :) | 14:18 |
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| range | andre__: Yeah. Makes more work for the reporter, though :) | 14:18 |
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| lardman | RST38h: you're making my morning so much better ;p | 14:19 |
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| andre__ | thanks | 14:19 |
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| RST38h | BTW, UrQuan masters is no longer installable, wants joydev package | 14:19 |
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| range | Ah well, at least if you are through with the bugzilla interface once, brainstorm interface doesn't put that much fear into a person then. And you will actually begin to like bugzilla :) | 14:19 |
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| lardman | Xisdibik: I'll add it for you | 14:19 |
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| RST38h | lardman: with subtitles, it may be worth looking at alternative paths | 14:20 |
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| lardman | yeah | 14:20 |
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| lardman | like a different media player that actually uses playbin | 14:20 |
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| RST38h | lardman: like making ffmpeg into a gst module and setting it up to suck the subtitle file in automatically | 14:20 |
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| andre__ | range, hehe. may I offer http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=34878 to discuss that? :-P | 14:20 |
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| lardman | RST38h: yeah, is an option | 14:20 |
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| range | andre__: LOL | 14:21 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Actually, I would be very happy with an optified, hildonized mplayer or vlc | 14:21 |
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| RST38h | lardman: I do not like the builtin media player anyway: would like to see actual files rather than tracker database entries | 14:21 |
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| lardman | I'd like both, but yeah agreed | 14:21 |
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| divinegod | andre__: should I add those translations to the bug for reference? | 14:22 |
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| andre__ | divinegod, no, it's fine. let's let the danish translation guys of nokia fuck it up again by mixing up %d and %s ;-)) | 14:22 |
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| lardman | RST38h: trouble with ffmeg is that it will direct video away from the DSP | 14:23 |
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| range | andre__: I know I commented somewhere in that thread :) | 14:23 |
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| divinegod | andre__: okay :) | 14:23 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Is it possible to play stuff through gstreamer AND have subtitles? | 14:23 |
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| andre__ | range, darn. :-P | 14:24 |
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| range | I have no problem with bugzilla. Things like integrated JavaScript editors freak me out, though. | 14:25 |
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| lardman | RST38h: yes, that's supported by gst | 14:25 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: glib is easy to compile w/ the patches, but i'm falling into dependency hell with everything else | 14:26 |
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| Stskeeps | ersin: chose -unlocked? | 14:26 |
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| ersin | stskeeps: does that just override all the dependencies? | 14:27 |
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| Stskeeps | it overrides the irritating ones. | 14:27 |
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| lardman | argh, bloody maemo.org is so bloody slow! | 14:27 |
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| ersin | i mean, if these are freemantle libs, then aren't i basically trying to port freemantle...? | 14:27 |
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| xorAxAx | why doesnt maemo 5 ship all gst codecs that are in good? | 14:27 |
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| mihu | Hi. Anybody using Canola2 on the N900? I have a couple of albums on the internal storage, in no particual direcotry tree order. The N900 media player finds them just fine, but Canola2 does not. The "audio folders" options just says "removable cards" and "Audio clips". Does it really expect songs to be in a separate directory? | 14:28 |
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| ersin | well ok dpkg-tools is irritating, but what about needing up to date fontconfig and libcairo for pango? | 14:28 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, like what? | 14:28 |
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| lardman | space? | 14:28 |
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| xorAxAx | 32 GB ought to be enough for everybody :) | 14:29 |
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| xorAxAx | zaheerm: see dpkg -L gstreamer0.10-plugins-good | 14:29 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, i mean what codecs do you want? | 14:29 |
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| xorAxAx | speex, flac for example | 14:30 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, install ogg-support | 14:30 |
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| xorAxAx | and is wma supported? | 14:30 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, yes wma is supported | 14:30 |
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| xorAxAx | and mp4? | 14:30 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Care to try compiling...ehhh...the ASSRENDER plugin? http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/documentation/plugins.html | 14:30 |
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| xorAxAx | (aac) | 14:30 |
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| zaheerm | xorAxAx, yes aac and mpeg4 video is supported | 14:30 |
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| xorAxAx | good | 14:30 |
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| w00t | assrender, lol. | 14:31 |
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| * w00t resists the urge to make immature jokes | 14:31 |
| zaheerm | xorAxAx, nokia legal was reason for no flac, speex, vorbis, theora i believe but it is in extras for anyone to install | 14:31 |
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| zaheerm | w00t, how is your n900 doing? | 14:31 |
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| w00t | zaheerm: legal, no, business, yes (from what I gathered from the bug report on vorbis) | 14:31 |
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| derf | zaheerm: There's Speex in there. | 14:31 |
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| zaheerm | derf, yah sorry, forgot about that | 14:31 |
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| range | w00t: I thought legal (panic of patent clowns) | 14:31 |
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| RST38h | lardman: there is also a bunch of other plugins for subtitles (subparse is part of gst-base and as well as subtitleoverlay) | 14:32 |
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| zaheerm | i think enough community pressure could make nokia change their minds at least for next devices.... | 14:32 |
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| w00t | zaheerm: marvellously. this morning's summary: alarm goes off at 8:00, hit snooze, wake up at 8:10, look at the weather and todo list on my desktop, check email, IM a few people, and go back to sleep until I had to rush to work. ;) | 14:32 |
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| RST38h | zaheerm: short question; how long have you been in this community? | 14:32 |
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| w00t | one moment, I'll find the bug | 14:32 |
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| lardman | RST38h: well they certainly exist | 14:32 |
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| zaheerm | w00t, great | 14:32 |
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| w00t | but a lot of people have been pushing for a long time | 14:32 |
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| RST38h | lardman: But this means that at least the gst-base stuff should be compilable and work for us, right? | 14:33 |
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| w00t | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=176 | 14:33 |
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| derf | lardman: If you were wondering, a weekend was, in fact, not enough to get things running on the DSP. | 14:33 |
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| povbot` | Bug 176: Ogg Vorbis support out of the box | 14:33 |
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| fnordianslip | andre__: re your recent comment on bug 5838, those dirs don't appear, at least with the same name, as hidden dirs in MyDocs/ | 14:33 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5838 Certain directory entries are duplicated | 14:33 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, yes, as they have other names | 14:34 |
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| andre__ | normal | 14:34 |
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| lardman | derf: :) | 14:34 |
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| andre__ | I think that's xdg-utils or whatever the name of it was | 14:34 |
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| sejo | all when trying to run an executable I get bash: ./hello: No such file or directory | 14:35 |
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| sejo | although ls shows the file and permissions correctly | 14:35 |
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| fnordianslip | andre__: why? | 14:35 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, why not? | 14:36 |
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| * andre__ confused | 14:36 |
| fnordianslip | andre__: to reduce confusion? :\) | 14:36 |
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| andre__ | sejo, what is the ls output for it? | 14:36 |
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| zaheerm | sejo, what is first line of the executable? | 14:36 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, pah! :-P | 14:36 |
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| andre__ | fnordianslip, actually, no idea. design decisions, probably... | 14:36 |
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| fnordianslip | ok. np | 14:36 |
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| lbt_ | hey GAN900 did you get rev kathy sorted with irc? | 14:37 |
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| sejo | zaheerm: like this? ^?ELF^A^A^A^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^@^B^@^C^@^A^@^@^@À~B^D^H4^@^@^@H | 14:37 |
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| zaheerm | sejo, ok no clue | 14:37 |
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| andre__ | sejo, what is the ls output for that file? | 14:38 |
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| derf | sejo: If it's a dynamic x86 executable in an armel scratchbox, it has to go under /host_usr/ | 14:38 |
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| sejo | -rwxrwxr-x 1 1000 1005 4951 Dec 7 11:51 hello | 14:38 |
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| sejo | derf: should be the x86 one nor the armel | 14:39 |
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| derf | Well then you have some other problem. | 14:39 |
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| sejo | derf: my scratchbox might not be correct | 14:40 |
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| sejo | derf: used this http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=33073 | 14:40 |
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| RST38h | lardman: I have checked contents of gst-bad and gst-base plugin packages on Maemo5. All subtitle stuff is missing | 14:43 |
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| sejo | how do I check if the scratchbox is installed correctly? I can login | 14:44 |
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| sejo | and i set my target as cs2007q3-glibc2.5-i486 | 14:44 |
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| ruskie | hmm anyone know how to do pining in apt? I never could figure it out... I'dl ike to pin the nokia repos above the others | 14:46 |
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| sejo | hmm didn't do a rootstrap is that needed? | 14:46 |
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| ruskie | I think you need to do a rootstrap iirc | 14:47 |
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| sejo | hmm going to restart everything | 14:50 |
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| fnordianslip | is there a keybd shortcut for delete rather than backspace in xterm on n900 ? | 14:53 |
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| ruskie | add the del key to the xterm bar? | 14:53 |
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| fnordianslip | ruskie: that's an idea | 14:53 |
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| fnordianslip | just wondered if there's an existing shortcut | 14:54 |
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| Laiska | doesn't ctrl + h work? :) | 14:55 |
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| ruskie | hmm | 14:55 |
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| ruskie | forgot about that one | 14:55 |
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| fnordianslip | almost, but no banana | 14:56 |
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| fnordianslip | ctrl+h acts like backspace, not delete | 14:57 |
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| kalikiana | fnordianslip, ctrl+d iirc | 14:58 |
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| ruskie | hmm | 14:58 |
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| Laiska | fnordianslip: true, ctrl + d is the correct one I think | 14:58 |
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| Laiska | misread your question | 14:58 |
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| fnordianslip | indeed. virtual banana awarded | 14:58 |
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| Laiska | ^^ | 14:58 |
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| kalikiana | heh | 14:58 |
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| Dantonic | damn | 15:00 |
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| Dantonic | everything I install from extras still fills up the root partition some... | 15:00 |
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| Dantonic | as in a good amount... | 15:01 |
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| Dantonic | thought everything there was optified | 15:01 |
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| * ruskie is happy he doesn't have to worry about that | 15:01 |
| ruskie | repartitioning ftw | 15:01 |
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| Dantonic | have you done it? | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | yup | 15:02 |
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| Dantonic | what tools did you use? | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | I hope there'll be an fmradio done in C... don't want all the python scary stuff | 15:02 |
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| Dantonic | did you do it by CLI? | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | sfdisk | 15:02 |
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| Dantonic | ok | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | and regular cp/mv/sed | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=411490&postcount=51 | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | old instructions... need to update them | 15:02 |
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| Dantonic | :( but seriously what a crock of shit though... why do I have to do that for apps from extras? | 15:02 |
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| ruskie | I wish it would have a better partitioning layout by default | 15:03 |
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| Dantonic | it's pretty ridiculous if you ask me... basically it has the same problem that N8X0 had | 15:03 |
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| * fnordianslip got so use to having an 8GB rootfs on his N800's SD card that the problems of small flash storage seem severely restrictive | 15:04 |
| ManuelSE_ | current maemo5 system has advantages as well | 15:04 |
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| Dantonic | ? | 15:05 |
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| ruskie | it does? | 15:05 |
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| ManuelSE_ | we get faster speed on small root fs | 15:05 |
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| Dantonic | ruskie, thanks for that guide I've bookmarked it | 15:05 |
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| Dantonic | ah I see | 15:06 |
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| ManuelSE_ | i think | 15:06 |
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| Dantonic | well but why can't we actually install programs in the advertised 2GB partition?!!! | 15:06 |
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| Dantonic | why do they filll up rootfs? | 15:06 |
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| ManuelSE_ | they are broken packages | 15:06 |
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| ManuelSE_ | help fix | 15:06 |
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| ManuelSE_ | even if just telling maintainer "please fix!" | 15:07 |
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| fnordianslip | I still have 47MB free in my rootfs and i've installed quite a lot of stuff. however, it looked like 37MB before i rebooted after getting to 3 days uptime. | 15:07 |
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| ManuelSE_ | but more help is better | 15:07 |
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| ManuelSE_ | join the community | 15:07 |
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| Dantonic | question, how close is too close to full rootfs? | 15:09 |
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| Dantonic | I mean how far can I fill it up before it becomes a problem? | 15:09 |
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| * loft306 triess to put the 900 down to go eat and showel but cant soooooo adictive... | 15:10 |
| ruskie | lol | 15:10 |
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| ruskie | I'm having this same problem mysel | 15:10 |
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| ruskie | f | 15:11 |
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| sejo | loft306: hahah know the feeling... working and really have to do a huge effort to actually work! | 15:11 |
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| hrw | Dantonic: leave 5MB as minimum | 15:11 |
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| ruskie | been at it since thursday afternoon when I bought it | 15:11 |
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| ruskie | sejo, I'm lucky there isn't much work today | 15:11 |
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| ruskie | hmm anyone know if ubifs supports reserved space? | 15:11 |
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| ruskie | like ext and others have it? | 15:11 |
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| * fnordianslip remembers being asked by someone using opennas why their rootfs showed as 104% full. i don't advocate going that far on the n900 | 15:11 |
| loft306 | heh sejo | 15:11 |
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| sejo | I'm doing an audit so way too much work | 15:11 |
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| loft306 | profl 104% | 15:12 |
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| loft306 | (r | 15:12 |
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| loft306 | gah | 15:12 |
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| sejo | bleh this is no good: /scratchbox/compilers/cs2007q3-glibc2.5-arm7/bin/../lib/gcc/arm-none-linux-gnueabi/4.2.1/../../../../arm-none-linux-gnueabi/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcc | 15:13 |
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| fnordianslip | didn't we have problems with SSUs and almost full rootfs before on the NITs? | 15:13 |
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| Dantonic | all right so 76% is nothing to complaing about I guess | 15:13 |
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| sejo | someone came across that when doing a simple hello world? | 15:14 |
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| fnordianslip | the opennas box with 104% full was hosed though | 15:14 |
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| *** javispedro changes topic to "to: Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org | http://maemo.nokia.com | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog" | 15:25 |
| javispedro | (maebar ended, so...) | 15:25 |
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| javispedro | and, morning :) | 15:25 |
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| javispedro | ah, first bug I'm going to file...http://share.ovi.com/media/javispedro.Pblico/javispedro.10002 | 15:30 |
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| ruskie | lol | 15:32 |
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| range | Can't you just shake the device to move the dialogue sideways? | 15:33 |
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| javispedro | no, but having to copy and paste this from Notes makes me want to shake it hard indeed. | 15:34 |
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| * achipa wonders which is better - asking for permission to upload a list of installed packages (privacy) or polling package lists from the server (bandwidth+speed)... | 15:35 |
| javispedro | polling lists from the server containing only recent changes | 15:36 |
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| javispedro | (like debian does...) | 15:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | ahh great to be home | 15:36 |
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| javispedro | oh, hi aSIMULAter! | 15:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | hola javispedro :) | 15:36 |
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| javispedro | was the sagrada familia open? you left me wondering for the entire day :) | 15:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | hehe yeah it was open, got to tour the inside and see the museum | 15:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | hi lcuk! | 15:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | literally just got home a few mins ago | 15:37 |
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| javispedro | morning lcuk2 | 15:37 |
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| javispedro | aSIMULAter: :) | 15:37 |
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| aSIMULAtor | i'm not sure what to think of sagrada familia | 15:37 |
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| tigert | hola | 15:37 |
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| achipa | javispedro: recent changes are not perfect as I don't know the state of the last update (i.e. you might have (un)installed something after I last updated in which case the diff will miss things) | 15:37 |
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| tigert | back @home sweet home | 15:37 |
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| aSIMULAtor | hey tigert are u home yet? | 15:37 |
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| aSIMULAtor | yyzzzzzzzz | 15:37 |
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| tigert | yeah | 15:37 |
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| aSIMULAtor | for real | 15:37 |
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| javispedro | hehe | 15:37 |
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| tigert | yeah | 15:37 |
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| * Myrtti gives in and installs the SDK to make the widget herself | 15:37 |
| aSIMULAtor | and it's nap time too lol | 15:38 |
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| lcuk2 | hey guys, can somebody please get me a big weapon, i have to sacrifice virgin | 15:38 |
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| Myrtti | lcuk2: what is it about? the great Tux prefers herring to virgins | 15:38 |
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| javispedro | achipa: I mean, diff changes on the entire packages list | 15:38 |
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| tigert | )---[==========> | 15:38 |
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| range | lcuk2: So you have virgins at hand but no weapons? Strange. | 15:38 |
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| tigert | big enough? | 15:39 |
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| * lcuk2 waves heartily @ tired aSIMULAtor | 15:39 |
| * ruskie wonders what widget is Myrtti making | 15:39 |
| javispedro | also, you can throw old gadgets to them | 15:39 |
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| lcuk2 | hows the chocolate? :D | 15:39 |
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| aSIMULAtor | haha it was mentholish :) | 15:39 |
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| Myrtti | ruskie: http://img.directindustry.com/images_di/photo-g/mechanical-counter-378810.jpg | 15:39 |
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| lcuk2 | Myrtti, my net has been up and down half the afternoon | 15:39 |
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| * tigert looks at new gpodder | 15:39 |
| javispedro | hope you all had a nice trip | 15:39 |
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| * fnordianslip offers his pork sword for use in virgin sacrifice | 15:39 |
| tigert | cool, progress showing | 15:39 |
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| Myrtti | feel free to do it for me, I know next to nothing about programming, if it's not bash scripting | 15:39 |
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| aSIMULAtor | yes javispedro it was nice | 15:40 |
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| tigert | not all is in yet, but we had really good time with thp | 15:40 |
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| aSIMULAtor | need to go back to barcelona again | 15:40 |
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| ruskie | Myrtti, nice | 15:40 |
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| Myrtti | ten points and a parrot starburst stamp for the one who guesses correctly what I need it for | 15:41 |
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| Myrtti | though, I did tell about it yesterday | 15:41 |
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| KMFDM | aSIMULAter, how was it besides the chocolates? | 15:41 |
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| sejo | hmm the ARMEL target fails :/ | 15:41 |
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| aSIMULAtor | it was pretty good, had some progress with a couple of apps | 15:41 |
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| aSIMULAtor | or do u mean the trip, the trip was nice...i gained like i dunno 10902930kg | 15:42 |
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| aSIMULAtor | ate so much | 15:42 |
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| aSIMULAtor | food is great | 15:42 |
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| sejo | the x86 target does work however | 15:42 |
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| lcuk2 | aSIMULAtor, did they have to sit you in the middle of hte plane to balance it out :D | 15:42 |
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| KMFDM | aSIMULAter, I meant both :) | 15:42 |
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| KMFDM | aSIMULAter, superior to the weird lunch thing they had at the summit, heh | 15:43 |
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| sejo | are there dependencies needed to get the ARMEL working? | 15:43 |
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| aSIMULAtor | lol | 15:43 |
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| lcuk2 | i am gonna do a writeup of everything later, ive got stuffs to do atm | 15:43 |
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| aSIMULAtor | well, yeah the summit had shit food, this place only fed us on friday | 15:43 |
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| aSIMULAtor | and it was like cheesy poofs and sandwiches as well | 15:43 |
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| aSIMULAtor | but i dig spanish food | 15:44 |
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| Shapeshifter | the hardware designers really had no clue when they decided to drop two arrow keys for umlauts on the german/swiss keyboard. | 15:44 |
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| ruskie | maybe someone told them that geeks were coming | 15:44 |
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| Shapeshifter | a single ¨ key would have sufficed. | 15:44 |
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| * ruskie is happy he has a qwerty kb | 15:45 |
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| * lcuk2 w00ts for kangaroo | 15:45 |
| Shapeshifter | I wonder if there will ever be aftermarket keyboards or replacements from nokia. | 15:45 |
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| ruskie | the seller even notified me taht it didn't have any local localisation and no MMS | 15:45 |
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| * lcuk2 has been bouncing aorund ever since | 15:45 |
| Shapeshifter | though I bet the nokia replacement parts would be extremely expensive | 15:45 |
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| aSIMULAtor | javispedro: i have some photos of sagrada familia on my flickr but u probably know what it looks like already :P and i think there's a photo of you too | 15:46 |
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| ruskie | I'd pay 10 eur for a replacement kb and 10 eur for their service to replace it | 15:46 |
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| javispedro | aSIMULAter: yeah, of me opening my loaned device :) | 15:46 |
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| ruskie | anything above that I'd consider to expensive | 15:46 |
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| aSIMULAtor | it was when we were working on liqcalendar | 15:46 |
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| sejo | i hope there will be a dvorak layout one day! | 15:46 |
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| sejo | sick of the other broken designs | 15:46 |
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| ruskie | actually for thumb typing I find qwerty quite good | 15:47 |
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| lardman | lcuk2: what's kangaroo? | 15:47 |
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| ruskie | though I am one of the few wanting a dvorak layout | 15:47 |
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| flux | there shuold be a bag of keycaps and a grid you could put them on! | 15:47 |
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| ruskie | flux, naturally | 15:47 |
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| ruskie | like the ibm model M ;0 | 15:47 |
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| lcuk2 | lardman, skippy | 15:47 |
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| Shapeshifter | flux: yeah | 15:47 |
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| ruskie | ;) | 15:47 |
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| Shapeshifter | scrabble keyboard | 15:47 |
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| sejo | heh | 15:47 |
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| flux | and, for the leet of us, a blank keycaps enough to have a blank keyboard. | 15:48 |
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| ruskie | hmm btw anyone know if the wirring for the fm antenna needs to be anything special? I'd just like to plug in a basic 3.5mm jack with no wires | 15:48 |
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| ruskie | or atleast very short wires | 15:49 |
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| X-Fade | ruskie: No, no special wiring, you just need a wire that sort of matches the wave length. | 15:49 |
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| javispedro | the event was pretty good indeed -- a lot of locals learned a lot of things and made their first contacts with sbox (sometimes you really need help with it), and of course talking with the ux people and designers was also very nice :) | 15:50 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: ! | 15:50 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: Welcome back, how was the holiday? | 15:50 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: Hi. Great! | 15:50 |
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| aSIMULAtor | must say it was also nice to meet the developers | 15:50 |
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| lardman | cool :) | 15:50 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: Although almost forgotten when looking at the TODO :) | 15:50 |
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| aSIMULAtor | i hope that us ux designers can work in closer collaboration with the community :) | 15:51 |
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| lcuk2 | i hope finnish ux designers can work closer as well :p | 15:52 |
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| aSIMULAtor | if i have time this evening i'll finish up some of the mockups for liqflow for u luck | 15:52 |
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| aSIMULAtor | c before u | 15:52 |
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| * lcuk2 nods heartily | 15:52 |
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| lcuk2 | ive gotta do some other things as well and see what else can be done | 15:53 |
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| aSIMULAtor | cool | 15:53 |
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| aSIMULAtor | but now, naptime! bbl :D | 15:53 |
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| javispedro | :) | 15:53 |
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| lcuk2 | javis how is your device doing | 15:53 |
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| javispedro | very good for now | 15:53 |
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| javispedro | I am already filing bugs :) | 15:53 |
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| javispedro | bug #6665 | 15:54 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6665 "manual IP address" textbox in advanced connection settings is partially hidden | 15:54 |
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| javispedro | wow, next one to file gets bug number #6666 ! | 15:54 |
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| Stskeeps | meh, 6667 is cooler | 15:55 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 15:55 |
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| sejo | lol | 15:55 |
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| javispedro | hiya Stskeeps! | 15:55 |
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| javispedro | so, I have a device now :) | 15:55 |
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| Stskeeps | javispedro: cool :) | 15:55 |
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| lcuk2 | Stskeeps, he was like a little kid | 15:57 |
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| javispedro | there's even a picture :) | 15:57 |
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| mgedmin | bug #6667: please add an IRC client to the standard apps? | 15:57 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6667 was not found. | 15:57 |
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| mgedmin | it's still free! | 15:57 |
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| javispedro | bug #6666 | 15:57 |
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| povbot` | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6666 was not found. | 15:57 |
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| javispedro | that one too :) | 15:57 |
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| javispedro | so you'll have to find and file two bugs :) | 15:58 |
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| mgedmin | bug #6666 can be "don't be evil" | 15:58 |
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| PaulFertser | mgedmin++ will be close with "wontfix" since we're a commercial company | 15:58 |
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| PaulFertser | closed :) | 15:58 |
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| mgedmin | like, e.g. Google ;) | 15:58 |
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| zaheerm | javispedro, you won one in the raffle? | 16:00 |
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| javispedro | zaheerm: nope, this is a short term loan so far | 16:00 |
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| VDVsx | hey aSIMULAter, lcuk2, javispedro, zaheerm, tigert et all :) | 16:01 |
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| VDVsx | *al | 16:01 |
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| javispedro | morning VDVsx | 16:01 |
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| mikhas | hi, too | 16:01 |
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| zaheerm | VDVsx, hiya | 16:02 |
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| VDVsx | hey mikhas | 16:02 |
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| javispedro | ah... I'm already forgetting about the faces. :) | 16:02 |
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| Myrtti | blonde tuning her laptop: http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/4166303372/ | 16:13 |
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| Stskeeps | heh | 16:14 |
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| Myrtti | (yes, I've got memory span the size of an ant) | 16:14 |
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| jaska | heh | 16:14 |
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| javispedro | it's better than my current solution with stickers | 16:14 |
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| jaska | well, its easier than looking at the symbols on the side so :) | 16:14 |
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| javispedro | or even tape :) | 16:15 |
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| Myrtti | javispedro: it's a piece of paper, stuck on with tape... | 16:15 |
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| Myrtti | coloured with gel pens | 16:15 |
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| jaska | if i need to plug anything into laptops 2.5mm jacks i need to twist my head to look on the side | 16:15 |
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| javispedro | Myrtti: ah, so then it's like what my computer has on its back, only with color :) | 16:15 |
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| lopz | hola :P | 16:17 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | I want a Meamo that would sync 100% with Outlook | 16:17 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 16:17 |
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| mikhas | besides the airport everything was great @ maebar. but then I found this @ BCN airport: http://taschenorakel.de/pictures/maebar/2009/12/07/gates-at-terminal2_bcn.jpg (yep, they start counting @ zero, isn't that great?) | 16:18 |
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| * nomis hands the Grail to Sir_Lancelot. Easier. :) | 16:18 |
| Sir_Lancelot | :D | 16:19 |
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| zaheerm | mikhas, what was wrong with the airport? | 16:19 |
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| mikhas | terminal2 | 16:19 |
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| Sir_Lancelot | does PC Suite sync everything with Outlook ? | |
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