IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2009-10-28

fiferboy_n900qwerty, figures00:00
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, yes, it's useless.00:00
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qwerty12_N810Meh, not to me.00:00
fiferboy_n900GeneralAntilles - you got some ideas?00:00
pupnikbetter to flee to the list than quit talking00:00
rm_youqwerty12_N810: i use it to clear the conversation unread bug00:00
GeneralAntillesfiferboy_n900, a simple one that shows you total missed calls and maybe the last 1-4 in history.00:00
GeneralAntillesWith contact avatars, etc.00:00
rm_youperiodically add the widget, click thru everything i've already read but it for some reason says i haven't, and remove it again00:01
rm_youi really miss a button for "call this contact" when viewing an SMS conversation00:01
rm_youevery other phone i had did that00:01
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pupnikwish i could just flip a switch and mount n900 storage as a usb drive00:01
pupnikwith device off00:02
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rm_youactually what i miss most is a big green "phone" hardware button that performs the "call" action, and a big red "end" button that hangs up or cancels things.00:02
pupnikflashing would be dd if=image of=/dev/sdb00:02
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SpeedEvilpupnik: device off use would basicaly mean you'd need a whole nother processor in there00:03
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rm_youi still always try to find it and push it and then sadly remember that it doesn't have one00:03
pupniklike the processor in a usb pen drive, SpeedEvil ?00:03
qwerty12_N810rm_you: I sense a gap in the market for Advanced Call Button!00:03
rm_youqwerty12_N810: rofl... i can't make a new button tho T_T00:03
SpeedEvilpupnik: the openmoko Freerunner nearly had that - emergency boot ROM with a bootloader accessed when you pressed a hardware button on boot00:03
rm_yous/button/hardware button/00:04
infobotrm_you meant: qwerty12_N810: rofl... i can't make a new hardware button tho T_T00:04
SpeedEvilpupnik: much like that, though it's complicated lots by the fact that it would need parallel connected to the flash.00:04
rm_youmaybe repurpose the camera button...00:04
RST38hGeneral <-- hates tmo now but is not ready to make the next step00:04
pupnikthe politics of cellphones is such a jungle for devices00:04
SpeedEvilpupnik: OM emergency ROM couldn't be flashed without the debug board, in which case you can fix it anyway00:05
pupnikpandora says "boot from sd".  and it is good.00:05
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fralssolid post00:08
Dantonichey guys00:08
GeneralAntillesThankfully one or two people isn't the end of the world. ;)00:08
GeneralAntillespupnik, this is the sort of vicious cycle that's so much fun. ;)00:09
rm_youso thanks to the Mirror application I now know that the front camera on the n900 is as useless as the camera on the n8x0 was :P00:09
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GeneralAntillesThe ONLY place they've said anything officially about a release date is on Talk.00:09
GeneralAntillesrm_you, yeah, same on my 5800. I don't know why they bother.00:09
lcukat least now you have a sapre camera on n90000:09
rm_youwell they are probably (hopefully) busy fixing all the bugs we're finding before release00:09
lcukone that appears toa actually, you know, work!00:09
javispedroGeneralAntilles: tell that to some of the trolls. They start citing newspapers.00:10
GeneralAntillesrm_you, lot of WONTFIX and INVALID going on.00:10
FlyserGeneralAntilles: I guess they will delay it officially on the 30th of october00:10
Stskeepsrm_you: preprod?00:10
rm_youStskeeps: doubtful? dunno tho maybe00:10
* RST38h sighs 00:11
FlyserThats the last official release date ...00:11
RST38hFolks, you are taking things way too serious00:11
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rm_youI mean, i don't really *care* about the front camera00:11
Stskeepsyes, nokia surprised us all by only releasing 300 n900s, and then ditching the product line;)00:11
rm_youi just am glad I know how usefull (or not) it is now, so I won't bother trying to use it00:11
RST38ht.m.o is just an Internet forum. Have you expected it to be populated exclusively by well psychologically balanced nerdy eggheads?00:11
javispedroyes, the pandora will release first!00:12
Dantonichey anyone here use pidgin?00:12
RST38hthat would be funny =)00:12
Stskeepsnokia has money on the pandora bet00:12
Dantonicon the tablet that is00:12
javispedrowell, I voted for the pandora!00:12
GeneralAntillesFlyser, Peter already officially delayed it on Talk.00:12
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FlyserGeneralAntilles: Not as official as a press release ;-)00:13
GeneralAntillesRST38h, I'm just depressed over the fact that the idiots are driving the useful people out.00:13
GeneralAntillesFlyser, Nokia never announced an official ship date.00:13
Stskeeps"october in select markets"?00:13
RST38hGeneral: absolutely normal for the Internet00:13
Stskeepswhich turns out, means maemo summit00:14
javispedrothat's a nice way to see it.00:14
GeneralAntillesRST38h, unfortunate since it used to be a really productive place.00:14
RST38hstill is, just not in every thread00:15
GeneralAntillesRST38h, the Thanks! ratio for useful posts has gotten really bad.00:15
RST38hI do not expect thanks when posting.00:16
RST38hsimply not the point00:16
GeneralAntillesNot my point, so nevermind.00:17
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n000bthe n900 forum in t.m.o. is particularly full of imbeciles00:19
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timeless_mbpGeneralAntilles: have you used the third contacts view?00:22
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Stskeepsi want a "joined in october 2009" ban button00:23
Stskeepswell, ignore00:23
qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: s/october//00:23
timeless_mbprm_you: if you tap the avatar in a conversation you get a way to call the contact00:23
RST38hOr you can get creative and drive them out one by one00:23
RST38hBonus for cause 'em to suicide00:24
timeless_mbppupnik: the n900 does do usb storage while off under some conditions (not sure what)00:24
javispedrodamn. I knew I should've registered in tmo before, instead of lurking.00:24
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RST38htoo late!00:25
pupnikdor sale, one t.m.o. account from 200700:26
javispedrowell, you'll miss my random rantings and flaming posts.00:26
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javispedrook this is hilarious
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Flyserjavispedro: it is :D00:27
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javispedropupnik: maybe tmo should implement a "uid digit count" system à la slashdot.00:28
* hardaker resists the urge to post "r0eladn: ditto"00:28
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pupnikwhich is best xterm for me to work on for n810 / diablo?00:29
Dantonicrofl javispedro  was wondering how soon someone would post there00:29
qwerty12_N810hardaker: give in...00:29
Dantoniclet's all post00:29
rm_youtimeless_mbp: sweet, thanks. didn't realize that was clickable00:29
rm_youwas expecting it to be in the context menu as an option next to "clear conversation"00:29
* qwerty12_N810 could probably pass his one off as a retail one...00:29
javispedrowell, I hoped the chinese spam bot that randomly spams topics with certain keywords would post first.00:29
javispedrobut . well. tmo always surprises me.00:29
* hardaker resists the temptation to respond with "first post!"00:30
javispedros/chinese// (sorry)00:30
wazdApple fails in the design sometimes too00:30
timeless_mbprm_you: i don't consider the ui behavior sane00:30
timeless_mbpbut someone else told me00:30
timeless_mbpso please pass it along00:30
wazdcheck out bottom-right icon00:30
javispedroI'd say that's to make a printed copy of the map on the viewport.00:31
javispedrocause the jobsoPhone has a builtin printer, does it?00:31
RST38hno, it is to switch pages00:31
RST38hyea, and it makes a tatoo when you stick it where sun does not shine00:31
javispedrook, now it's more hilarious:
lcukif you want to switch pages dont you just turn the iphone over00:32
* hardaker resists the urge to respond with "does anyone know if it'll be possible to shop on Amazon with this phone?"00:32
wazdbackground square has rounded corners, and front square hasn't00:32
javispedrono, you shake the iphone like crazy then throw it to 10 friends, fill in a few forms then you can see something else than the cupertino map.00:33
lcukwazd only you would notice that00:33
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lcukand i pull square tissues out of a rounded hole all the time00:33
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wazdlcuk: yep, I'm a mad man, don't laugh at me :)00:35
* lcuk wasnt laughin00:38
lcukRST38h, does it actually switch pages?00:39
javispedrolcuk: hhe00:41
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lcukothers: that link is thread "[you *can*] post here before you have received a retail N900 in your hands"00:42
RST38hlcuk: Yea, it goes to some other screen afaik00:42
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* javispedro enjoys the latest tmo threads "n900 shipping in october" "no, n900 ships in november!" "you're all idiots. I have definite proof n900 ships in 2010!!"00:43
kynkyso not 16th :)00:43
* hardaker hates all forums and misses the age of mailing lists.00:43
javispedro"X estimates December 2009 release date"00:43
* RST38h suggests falsifying a Nokia press release about dissolving Maemo Devices and merging its team with N Series00:44
RST38hI would go for something less credible, but it makes sense to start slow00:44
kynkythe maemo/android article on slashdot is crazy00:44
javispedrodeal. so I register a tmo account "nokiapr", post something stupid, then edit a wikipedia article , appropiately quoting the tmo post.00:44
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javispedrowait until the first newspaper publishes the "news"00:45
florianhardaker: I feel with you...00:45
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RST38hPirates May Have Captured Around-the-World Liveblogging Couple!00:45
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RST38hHow do you twit about something like this? =)00:45
lcuklike you just did00:46
lcukbut put stuff like #pirates00:46
javispedroRST38h: that seems so true I am already believing it and hoping for it.00:46
lcukand things00:46
lcukso the other pirates will hear about it and get karma00:46
RST38hlcuk: Ahoy^H^Hoops00:46
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RST38hOh well. Sleep.00:48
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lcukgnite rst00:48
javispedro"Civil aviation disaster destroys 2000 N900s due to faulty battery"00:48
DantonicIf I wanted to report a bug with pidgin having to do with the hildon interface, where would I do that?  when I full qwerty type a message on my N800 the "enter" button does not enter send the message it goes down to the next line.  I have to exit the full qwerty and re open the small qwerty and hit enter with my stylus :(00:48
lcukqwerty12_N810, evil00:48
RST38hgood night00:48
javispedrognite RST00:48
qwerty12_N810night RST38h00:48
qwerty12_N810lcuk: EvilQwerty, that's me00:48
RST38hjavis: Actually, an "FCC report" about banning Li batteries on all US based flights will do good00:48
lcuklooks good00:48
RST38hjavis: That should generate a LOT of tmo traffic00:49
timeless_mbpDantonic: so...00:49
anideltmo's already slow00:49
timeless_mbpif pidgin is a standalone app00:49
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timeless_mbpthen it's giving the wrong hint to the IME00:49
timeless_mbpand it's a bug in pidgin00:49
timeless_mbpand you file the bug against pidgin or _|Nix|_00:50
Dantonicah is that right?00:50
Dantonicbut why does the enter key work under the half qwerty but not for the full qwerty...00:50
Dantonicthat's why I thought it might be a hildon issue idk...00:51
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timeless_mbpDantonic: did you try the browser url bar?00:51
timeless_mbpdoes the same behavior happen there?00:51
timeless_mbpand did you try fields in the addressbook?00:51
javispedroand in xterm.00:52
kirmahmm. does nokia allow pixel defects for its devices nowadays at all? apparently not for N900 at least...00:55
GeneralAntillesDantonic, the finger keyboard is broken.00:56
GeneralAntillesDantonic, Nokia doesn't care about virtual input. ;)00:56
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javispedroGeneralAntilles: oh, they'll care when the next device ships without a keyboard.00:57
Dantonicoh yeah I guess browser doesnt work either... :(00:58
Dantonicso it's maemo? :(00:58
javispedroand xterm? intro in finger keyboard in n810's xterm does work.00:58
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Dantonicjavispedro,  xterm works00:59
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Dantonicweak sauce!01:00
javispedronot a Maemo issue then. Grab xterm code, try to understand what black magic it applies to HildonIMContext, and try to apply the same incantations to Pidgin.01:00
Dantonicjavispedro I would if I knew how...01:01
Dantonicno idea01:01
GeneralAntillesAlright, no more refreshing Talk for me tonight.01:01
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javispedrooh, i just posted one last message :)01:01
GeneralAntillesI'm at "time to call out some goddamn idiots" stage.01:01
GeneralAntillesand that never ends well.01:01
lcukGeneralAntilles, you should use ispy01:03
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lcukyou can get frustrated without clicks01:03
GeneralAntillesispy sucks.01:03
GeneralAntillesIt's ugly and irritating.01:03
fiferboy_n900later all01:03
* fiferboy_n900 out01:03
lbtfiferboy_n900: hi01:03
lcukhow do you find anything?01:03
lcukhi fiferboy_n90001:03
lbtfiferboy_n900: bye :)01:04
fiferboy_n900lbt did you talk to gnuton at all01:04
lbtjust failing to build qt in fremantle sbox :(01:04
GeneralAntillesThe number of top-posting posts in the mailing list and Talk seems to correlate well to the increase in idiocy.01:04
fiferboy_n900I'll be back in a bit01:04
fiferboy_n900me too01:04
lbtusr/bin/quilt: line 143: /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash: No such file or directory01:04
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lbtanyone else know about quilt/sbox issues?01:04
javispedronever seen that :P01:05
javispedroand I've been using quilt for most of my packages.01:05
* lbt agrees with hardaker01:05
lbtjavispedro: it's odd01:05
hardakerheh.  I haven't said anything in about 10 minutes though.01:05
lbtsince /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash -> /bin/bash01:06
qwerty12_N810Sorry if I'm just stating the obvious: Have you done "apt-get install quilt"? Scratchbox comes with some incomplete shit...01:06
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hardakerqwerty12_N810: I've decided that scratchbox is designed for "roll your own" development :-)01:06
Dantonicall right time for work take care guys01:07
javispedroscratchbox iss best.01:07
Stskeepsroll your own joint?01:07
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qwerty12_N810Only if you're using it in Amsterdam01:08
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hardakerroll your own everything.  little functionality besides the bare screen to build off of and interact with.01:08
lbtqwerty12_N810:  yep... tried that...01:09
Stskeepsthe new sdk is hardly bare though01:09
javispedrowell. it has a C ompiler at least.01:09
javispedrowhat else could you need? A Eclipse-based 1 GiB-ish IDE? A Web 2.0 app with lots of XML input and output with dubious usefulness? :)01:10
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lcukhardaker, how far are you rolling your own tho?01:11
lbtthis is screwy01:12
lbt> /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash:01:12
lbtbash: /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash:: No such file or directory01:12
hardakerrecompling what I need under scratchbox rather than relying on packaged stuff :-P01:12
lbtand yet....01:12
lbtll /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash01:12
lbtlrwxrwxrwx  1 david 500 9 Oct 27 22:16 /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash -> /bin/bash*01:12
johnsqlbt: wrong system arm/x86 or missing shared libs01:12
lbtand   /bin/bash -c 'ls'     works01:13
javispedrolbt: I guess you're reaching a point where scratchbox's "illusion" stops working.01:13
lbtand yet01:13
lbt-rwxr-xr-x  1 david sbox 0 Oct 27 23:12 /bin/bash*01:13
lbtit has 0 size01:13
lbtjesus h ....01:14
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lbthmmm I wonder if I need to reset binfmt01:14
javispedrolbt: because on exec sbox will redirect the call to the native one.01:14
javispedroso it's a 0 size stub.01:14
javispedrobut that means you've not unpacked the rootstrap?01:14
Stskeepslbt: under armel that will show 0 size possibly01:14
lbtoh, it goes in there01:14
Stskeepscheck the real file01:14
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javispedrorootstraps contain both x86 /bin/bash and armel /bin/bash01:15
lbtah core dump, no we're talking01:15
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lbtseg fault....01:17
lbtglad it's so resilient01:17
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lbtjavispedro: I've compiled Qt apps using this sdk01:19
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lbtso it's all been sane01:19
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jeremiah_yeah man, you know you're not getting any work done until you dump core01:20
lbtI've quit/restarted sbox and reset the binfmt_misc01:20
lbtmy car stereo segfaulted tonight :(01:20
lbtit's kinda cool01:21
hardakerfor long term app development, I kinda wonder why there is a push to do GTK based current development when it's been announced that the future will be Qt.01:21
hardakerif Qt is mostly ready now, why not switch now?01:21
lbthardaker: KDE is also ready01:21
lbtGnome isn't dead01:21
jeremiah_Qt is mostly experiemental.01:21
jeremiah_More or less.01:21
jeremiah_For a company like Nokia anyway.01:22
lbt<cough> less</cough>01:22
jeremiah_lbt: Why don't you like it?01:22
lbtless experimental01:22
* lbt is a Qt boy01:22
jeremiah_I mean, I am more familiar with Gnome, but I don't mind Qt.01:22
jeremiah_Yeah, I think I kinda agree.01:23
jeremiah_Although Gnome is pretty well tested too01:23
jeremiah_I don't know why it is more popular than Qt, and KDE, but it is.01:23
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javispedrois that the official ad?01:25
lcuki like that01:26
Mouseyi'd still like to hear how left handed people love that spacebar01:27
SpeedEvilDoes anyone happen to have APN settings and stuff for ?01:27
lcukwhen you are typing it doesnt matter01:27
lbtjavispedro: do you have /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash01:28
lbtis it a symlink to /bin/bash01:28
* Mousey wonders01:28
javispedrolbt: /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash -> /bin/bash01:28
javispedro604K /bin/bash01:28
lbtfor me /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash -> Segmentation fault (core dumped)01:28
javispedro/bin/bash: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, ARM01:28
lbtso I lost /bin/bash somehow01:29
hardakerSorry...  kids came home.  Nokia has pretty much stated that Maemo6 will be mostly Qt based, right?  To me that says that they're moving to Qt for everything.01:29
lbtbut it kinda doesn't matter01:29
javispedroor you never got it :P01:29
lbt'cs sbox doesn't use it01:29
hardaker(granted, I'm about equal in experience with both of them and am not biased...  it's more with "what should I use now")01:29
javispedroit intercepts exec() calls01:29
lbthardaker: starting from zero ... Qt01:30
lbtstarting from 5k lines of Gtk/C.... Gtk01:30
lbtusing a shedload of gtk libs... gtk01:30
javispedrolaunching /usr/share/quilt/compat/bash execs the armel bash shell here.01:30
lbtnot hard really :)01:30
javispedrothus I guess sbox's "hack" is failing here.01:31
hardakerlbt: that's sort of what I've been thinking.01:31
* lbt looks for an armel bash01:31
lcuki was expecting a "...priceless" line then lbt :P01:31
javispedrolbt: try reinstalling package bash.01:31
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hardakerlcuk: writing in straight bash for console usage: priceless?01:31
lbtjavispedro: good idea01:31
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javispedrothe ad is good indeed. it could've been worse.01:32
* lbt hugs scratchbox01:32
lbtso hard it suffocateas01:32
lcukgive it room!01:32
* lbt is keeping a chokehold .... just to be sure01:32
jeremiah_SpeedEvil: Are you having trouble with a 3 sim card?01:33
qwerty12_N810Focus this energy on Ovi Maps...01:33
jeremiah_Because I had to change from 3 since it didn't work with the N90001:33
* lbt watches Ad in HD to see what he's obviously missing01:33
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jeremiah_Although that is not really an answer to your question. :/01:33
SpeedEviljeremiah: incidentally, I'm trying to get it working - as my broadband is likely to fall over01:33
javispedrolbt: expecting a worse one :)01:34
SpeedEviljeremiah: it does more or less daily.01:34
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* lbt has MythTV ... I haven't really seen TV ads for about 5 years01:34
lbtwe watch them sometimes for nostalgia01:34
lbtconclusion: we're not missing much01:35
fiferboylbt: back01:35
lbtphew Qt is building01:35
lbtgood timing fiferboy01:35
lbthow's you ?01:35
fiferboyGood, lbt.  You?01:36
lcuklbt, you can release scratchbox now, its turning a funny shade of purple01:36
lbtnah, it's still twitching01:36
lcukahh you installed the qt-birdwatching app as well01:37
fiferboylcuk: :)01:38
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hardakerlife without scratchbox would suck compared to life with it01:39
GAN900fiferboy, OK, now I've got a Talk user to smack down with the missed calls applet. ;)01:40
fiferboyGAN900: ?01:40
GAN900He says it's going to suck because there's no missed calls indicator on the desktop.01:41
qwerty12_N810GAN900: I want to laugh... and cry, at that statement.01:41
javispedrobtw, did the rss reader get an improvement in fremantle? I'm seeing screenshots of a redesigned one using stackable windows.01:43
* lbt admits that scratchbox is a pretty damned good solution to a hard problem and lets it breathe again01:43
hardakerdeveloping for a device without an emulator sucks.  I did that with a palm for a while.01:44
javispedrofor a while? do we have a palm emulator?01:44
hardakeryes, there is a palm emulator.01:44
hardakereven runs on linux ;-)01:44
javispedrothen you don't mean janeiro, but gvm.01:44
javispedroit missed half of the arm syscalls.01:45
javispedroit has since improved (new bugs added too) and was released for the n8x001:45
javispedrobut unfortunately NO new versions for desktop :(01:45
qwerty12_N810Why would one want a real Palm, let alone a Palm emulator?01:46
* qwerty12_N810 hides01:46
* javispedro tries to stripe qwerty12_N810 of his cloak01:46
javispedrojaneiro was a true palmos arm emulator. it was only released for windows and modified to run GHost/GVM instead01:47
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javispedrothey say it got leaked somewhere, and that's why I am curious :)01:48
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lbtnight all02:02
lcukgnite lbt02:02
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* zerojay is gonna post on the thread on which you don't post! Oooooohhhh!!02:37
Stskeepsand i thought the pre-launch paranoia was bad..02:38
zerojayIt's allll so retarded.02:39
airstrikei love these portuguese names :P02:42
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Stskeepsat least we can all agree with lbts blog post on ovi maps..02:43
zerojayI don't.02:43
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zerojayExcept for what he says about the UI.02:43
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StskeepsUI confuses the hell out of me02:43
zerojayI used Ovi Maps all weekend long in a city I've never been too before and never had any issues with it... worked fine, always knew where I was.02:44
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zerojayBut the UI breaking with the standards across the rest of the OS just sucks.02:44
zerojayIt's got other issues too... and feels like a mishmash of scripts and rather hacked together02:44
zerojayHmm.. did that "don't post here" thread get deleted?02:45
Stskeepsi wouldnt mind it if it just started with "here is a map. here are you. zoom here or on vol buttons. click here to find a route or look up an address.02:45
zerojayIt is like that, it's just that it's not easy to tell.02:46
zerojayWe're conditioned that the top right corner = close or go back.02:46
Stskeepsi am considering to submit the ui to my usability professor.02:46
zerojayIn maps, it brings you to routing/look up.02:47
zerojayThere's so many little random issues all over it.02:47
zerojayThat said... once you learn it, it works fine for the most part.02:47
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Stskeepsi just want maemo mapper back i guess :P02:49
Stskeepseven with some of the insane issues it has02:49
lcukcan original "maps" from n810 run on here02:50
zerojayeiffel's little "no thanks from me" threat is laughable.02:50
zerojayTime to see if he'll follow through. :P02:50
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Stskeepspoor ari.. the angry mob has spread to his blog02:58
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wurtogevening, maemo 5 is installable on nokia 810 ?03:01
infobotmethinks mer is, or on #mer03:01
Stskeepswe arent day to day usable yet, but.03:02
wurtogsecond question: there is some enhanced keyboard for maemo ? i want one with bigger letters to tip (fat fingers)03:02
* zerojay posted on the thread that should not be!03:02
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Stskeepswurtog: thumb keyboard?03:02
lcukwurtog, you can add a bluetooth fullsize keyboard if you like03:04
wurtogStskeeps, how i install it ?03:04
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Stskeepsoh, you mean physical keyboard?03:04
wurtogthere isnt nothing like:
Stskeepsthats called a n900. my fat fingers were never happier.03:05
wurtogStskeeps, no, i want a digital one. but with bigger buttos. my fingers are fat.03:05
zerojayStskeeps: Agreed.03:05
Stskeepsenable virtual keyboard and select always launch thumb03:05
Stskeepsin settings03:06
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wurtogStskeeps, works for 810 ?03:07
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wurtogStskeeps, thanks buddy03:09
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fureddoIs there someone here who have used the maemo-optify before?03:21
fureddoThe README mentions that it should be used like this: maemo-optify PACKAGE DIR.  I wonder if I have to put the version number or not for the PACKAGE parameter.  Is it important or not really?03:24
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uhsfis it possible to use a splitter/adapter with the Nokia N900 in order to use independent earphones and microphone for answering a call?03:41
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Analiascould someone explain the relationship between and to me?  Which one is the "official" source for the current release(s) of projects.  I'm interested in working with the latest stable releases and using them in an OE build of Angstrom on the mini2440.04:08
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GeneralAntillesAnalias, then you want git04:30
Analiasok - I still see very recent checkins on the SVN side - are there still projects that exist only in SVN that are core components?04:31
GeneralAntillesI believe so04:32
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GeneralAntillesNot entirely certain what's migrated and what hasn't.04:32
Analiasis there a "map"?  I assume the build tools have to know where to go.04:32
GeneralAntillesThere was a GSoC project to import everything into OE.04:33
GeneralAntillesYou may want to look at that.04:33
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GeneralAntillesHonestly, though, there's no way you're going to get the most recent Maemo 5 stuff running well on an ARM9. :)04:33
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AnaliasI found it and I'm using it, but it's lagging behind and many of the referenced source files have disappeared, been replace, or moved at  I'm still using it as a basis, but I would like to build  an overlay for OE/Angstrom that uses the most stable code right of the repository without relying on the source tar balls at  -- Does all of this seem like the right path to take?04:35
GeneralAntillesDoesn't seem unreasonably, but I'm probably not one of the best people to ask. ;)04:36
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, lbt or johnx are probably better.04:36
lcukAnalias, speak to rkirti04:37
lcukas well04:37
GeneralAntillesNot sure if she's still hanging around.04:37
GeneralAntillesGSoC, unfortunately, rarely sticks.04:37
lcukyeah she is :)04:37
Analiaswhen are they on typically?  - oh definitely I'll talk to rkirti04:37
lcukjust not everyday04:37
lcukmail her04:37
GeneralAntillesAnalias, lbt and Stskeeps are on European time04:38
lcukshould be easy to find04:38
lcukshe will come04:38
GeneralAntillesjohnx is West Coast USA.04:38
pupnikwhat project provides serverless p2p open source voice chat04:38
pupnikfor maemo04:38
Analiasok, much appreciated Antilles and Icuk.04:39
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GeneralAntillesThey're working themselves into a frothing frenzy over not having a widget to show missed calls when the info is one tap away.05:19
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microlithit's up to 7 notification windows already06:58
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pupnik..been watching videos on PC server from N810 over the network - with ukki's knots2 - very fast and fun nowâ!07:09
pupniktesting channel is #knots on freenode07:10
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johnxmalformed wallpaper set description .desktop files can cause h-d to behave badly. is this a known problem?07:48
RST38hnot that I heard of07:48
johnxI can send you a .desktop that makes it impossible to change your background. want it? :)07:49
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* RST38h hides in horror =)07:51
RST38hBut seriously, file a bug, get karma07:51
johnxah, right07:51
johnxthe karma07:51
johnxdunno how they missed it though07:51
johnxall you have to do is point to a file that doesn't exist and h-d crashes every time you try to change backgrounds07:52
RST38hthey nnever made mistakes in their desktop files?07:52
RST38hoh shit...07:52
johnxi wouldn't be surprised to learn that this is a problem with .desktop parsing in general...07:53
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johnxon the bright side, it does respawn without any problem07:53
RST38hwell, that is easy to check...07:53
johnxsuppose I might as well...07:53
* RST38h wonders if johnx's bug will be marked as enhancement: after all h-d does survive the crash07:54
johnxand it isn't an advertised feature that it should survive any kind of mistake on the user's part :)07:54
johnxI think it's just the background switcher that has the problem...07:55
johnxaaaah...whatever generates the thumbnail is probably to blame07:55
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* kirma sees that chips on N900 reflect typical weekend of nokia linux device engineer: first there's VAPAUS, then there's LYSTI and the day after it's RAPU-YAMA08:07
jaskawhat next, krapula?08:08
* johnx busts out google translate08:08
johnxmaybe that'd make a good h-d widget...08:08
kirmajaska: well, "rapu-yama" could be literally interpreted as "hangoverous condition" :)08:10
johnxgoogle called it "CRAB-YAMA" (am I right in guessing Finnish?)08:10
kirmaerr, s/literally/imaginatively/08:10
AnaliasJohnx:  I'm pretty new to Maemo development - are the git repos at the official releases of the Maemo core components.  I'm trying to build on the GSoC work done by rkirti and pull the sources directly from the repositories instead of using the tarballs
kirmajohnx: yes08:11
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johnxAnalias, yes, the repos are official (and it feels great to say that!)08:11
kirmathe chip even has a line profile of a shellfish/crab on its' labeling08:11
johnxI know 'yama' in Japanese, but have no guesses about what it means in Finnish08:12
AnaliasI can imagine - hehe - please put that notice somewhere  on the main site - I've been banging head trying to track that down08:12
* RST38h suspects fuji-yama also does not mean anything good in Finnish08:13
kirmait doesn't really mean anything in Finnish. "jama" means roughly "condition" or "situation", but I suppose there's some generational logic on the chip name or soemething08:13
johnxAnalias, done.
Analiaswoot - thanks08:14
kirmajohnx: like there are different generations of nokia EM ASICs: RETU, VILMA and now GAZOO, all from... the flintstones ;)08:15
johnxAnalias, heh. was kind of kidding, since it looks like the announcement was already there. Where do you think an announcement like that should go?08:15
RST38hGAZOO does not sound good08:15
johnxkirma, aaaah, right. I remember now08:15
* RST38h happens to know who Gazoo is08:15
johnxRST38h, yeah. sounds like gas + kazoo08:15
RST38hno, worse. a moment.08:15
johnxthe little alien, right?08:16
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johnxor whatever he was08:16
AnaliasI would have saved my self a lot of headaches if it was simply on the front page of the developers section - but, then again I'm pretty dense or blind at times08:16
kirmanot working at nokia and especially not at chip design I just find the names amusing :)08:16
johnxAnalias, it's a pretty new thing, really08:16
Analiaseight days - yep08:16
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johnxI'll probably just put a link on the development page and let someone else delete it if they feel it's not appropriate08:17
AnaliasI guess I can throw away my git-svn import of the old SNV tree08:17
RST38hA severe outbreak of the H1N1 pandemic could overwhelm internet providers' capacity, according to a report submitted Monday, which called on Department of Homeland Security officials to develop contingency plans to avert such a crisis.08:18
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johnxah, but first I need to file that bug...08:18
Analiasactually it's there - in the recent posts - but it would be nice as a call out08:18
timeless_mbpjohnx: sadly our testers aren't that interesting. they have absolutely no creativity08:19
johnxtimeless_mbp, I do the best testing at work when I'm actually avoiding other tasks08:19
johnxI still think a bug bounty that's a little higher than some karma points would help08:19
|R <- wow that's the most stupid thing i've seen this month08:20
RST38hjohnx: The only thing that would help is actually fixing the bugs rather than trying to mark more complicated bugs as "improvements" or "wontfix"08:20
ShadowJKI've seen some of them on random forums. They seem like the kind of people that key in a number and press another key, and then talk to themselves for awhile until pressing a key and putting their device away.08:20
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RST38hjohnx: I would actually agree to *spend* karma points on each bug actually fixed08:21
johnxwell, actually for the open source parts, that should be something that can be done on the forums...08:22
timeless_mbpjohnx: i'm likely to send some people tshirts08:22
johnxman, that'd be kind of an interesting social feature...08:22
timeless_mbpi need to figure out which shirts we have available08:22
johnxI want one of the Nokia "old logo" fish shirts :D08:22
timeless_mbpspecifically the login picker bug filer is quite likely to get a shirt08:23
RST38hjohnx: Well, you know that even open source parts are developed in house08:23
ShadowJKa "Fixed in Harmattan" t-shirt, with the "in Harmattan" part crossed out08:23
johnxRST38h, yeah, I know. who cares?08:23
RST38hjohnx: You suggested using forums08:24
RST38hProbably impossible08:24
timeless_mbpShadowJK: heh08:24
johnxRST38h, I did. I'm suggesting that if Nokia won't fix it, and you want it fixed no matter what, then you can pay karma (through a bounty) to other community members08:24
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RST38hjohnx: Ah08:25
* timeless_mbp sighs08:25
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RST38hjohnx: But what do you do with it afterwards? Keep your own fixed copy to yourself?08:25
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timeless_mbpi've almost gotten to down to 1500 unread bugmails08:25
johnxRST38h, one step at a time08:25
RST38hsounds pointless without the distribution solution08:26
ShadowJKtimeless, are these random ones from testers?08:26
RST38hAn Extras-Hacking repo with updated versions of system components? :)08:26
timeless_mbpShadowJK: this is a sample from all bugmail generated for bugzilla.mozilla.org08:26
johnxRST38h, honestly, I don't know. if it's really a defect, hopefully nokia will take it. if it's not a feature nokia wanted to do, then they wouldn't distribute it anyways08:26
johnxRST38h, that sounds good08:26
timeless_mbpthe sample rules are things like 'mentions "crash"'08:26
ShadowJKoh, right08:26
johnxRST38h, it should disable nokia's SSUs as well08:27
ShadowJKthat sounds dreadful08:27
johnxRST38h, and we could call it mer ...08:27
RST38hjohnx: One problem here is that there are really few platform people in the community willing+able to do this kind of work08:27
RST38hwhy disable Nokia SSUs?08:27
johnxRST38h, because if you have a custom change to your libgtk and nokia ssu replaces it, then you're kinda screwed08:27
RST38hwell maybe nokia's version is better? :)08:28
johnxRST38h, so the way I'd do it, is disable nokia's SSU repo and pull their SSU's into extras-hacking after vetting them08:28
RST38hNokia won't like it at all =)08:29
GeneralAntillesRST38h, you do have a way to "pay" to get bugs fixed. It's called voting.08:29
johnxRST38h, again: so?08:29
RST38hGeneral: the vote limits are pretty generous right now though, no scarcity that "paying" would imply08:31
RST38hjohnx: DMCA, lawsuit, incarceration =)08:31
johnxRST38h, just like they did to those poor mer guys08:31
GeneralAntillesErm, for pulling in open source components?08:31
johnxit was horrible, how they fly us around the world, and hand us prerelease hardware08:32
johnxI wouldn't wish it on anyone08:32
timeless_mbpaSIMULAtor: help08:32
timeless_mbpi had nice clear glasses yesterday08:32
timeless_mbpi woke up, and they look just like they did when visited your desk08:32
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timeless_mbpjohnx: yeah, and enabled you to do various things which are illegal in your native country08:33
johnxtimeless_mbp, hmm? missing your meaning...08:34
timeless_mbpjust listing other things you could do in AMS08:34
timeless_mbpabsolutely horrible, allowing legal access to things that are generally considered illegal08:35
johnxRST38h, I guess I should clarify: it's easy to override Nokia's update policy and still pull the updates from their servers08:35
johnxtimeless_mbp, yeah. too bad I was too sick to do anything about that08:35
RST38hGeneral: For pulling SSUs apart08:35
johnxstill, the party was fun :)08:35
RST38hjohnx; yea, I know08:35
Passelii have Qt + OpenGL question08:39
Passeliwhat is the difference with running application with -graphicssystem opengl|opengles vs. QGraphicsView::setViewport(new QGLWidget()) ?08:39
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johnxallo lardman09:00
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lardmanmorning johnx09:01
Xisdibikevening lardman ;)09:02
lardmanhi Xisdibik09:02
johnxis there anyone on right now who could make a quick change to: ?09:03
johnxI think it might be nice to mention on that page09:03
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lardmana job for dneary I think09:04
johnxthanks for hiliting him :)09:05
johnxah, but not logged in :/09:05
lardmanI certainly don't have access rights to that page anyway09:05
tekojojohnx I think I should have the rights09:06
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johnxtekojo, want me to write you something to add to it? or do you want to write it?09:07
tekojoWhat kind of change were you thinking about?09:07
tekojoPlease, you are the native :-)09:07
johnxjust adding a reference to (and maybe changing sdk 5b2 to 5 final)09:08
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tekojoSure those sound sensible, just throw a couple of lines09:09
johnxworking on it :)09:09
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johnxtekojo, . If you wouldn't mind putting that at the top, right under "Sources" and then removing the "beta2" from behind Maemo 5 a bit down the page, I'd really appreciate it09:18
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tekojoThere we go09:23
tekojoah links, I'll go and fix those09:23
johnxthank you :D09:23
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tekojoand couldn't help my english kick in, 'please see' is more polite than 'look' :-)09:24
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johnxsounds good. all I want is to get the word spread about maemo.gitorious.org09:25
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johnxhey lbt09:25
* lbt not really here :)09:26
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johnxhmm...must be hallucinating. obviously I've been working on LDAP schemas too much...09:26
* lbt going for shower, then work ;)09:26
lbtwantedt to tell fiferboy:  qwebframe.cpp:(.text+0xcdc): undefined reference to `QPrinter::pageRect() const'09:27
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lbthe's not here though...09:27
tekojojohnx a good cause, please tell more people about gitorious09:29
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tekojomorning lbt09:29
lardmanhmm, anyone know what I need to stick in my control file to get python placed in the autobuilder as a build-dep?09:29
lirihow do I install the boot menu?09:29
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lirion an n81009:29
lardmanmorning lbt09:29
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johnxliri, probably the easiest way is to use the mer installer. that will install the bootmenu-installer and the mer-installer as two separate menu entries. if you don't want to install mer, just run the bootmenu installer and ignore the mer installer09:32
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liriso what package am I looking for to install? bootmenu-installer?09:32
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johnxbest phrase ever to find on a power brick: "best results if plugged in"09:52
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tigertgood one ;)09:53
tigertand good morning09:53
tigertoh, litl came out of closet? :)09:54
johnxyeah. looks like a somewhat interesting product if they can find the right price/demographic09:54
tigertis it different from other netbooks!09:55
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tigertdarn keymap :)09:56
johnxit runs "litl OS"09:56
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johnxmostly a browser it seems09:56
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tigertno photos of the UI?09:57
tigertor are there somewhere?09:57
johnxbut here's the article at least:
johnxdidn't realize the gallery doesn't link back to it (weird)09:58
johnxguess it's a 'teaser' website and an fcc document right now09:59
tigerttoo much teasing is dangerous if the expectations are higher than what you reveal10:03
tigertlets see10:03
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tigertso many netbooks and mobile devices already10:03
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JaffaMorning, all10:29
johnxmornin' Jaffa10:29
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johnxI think that guy pushing the "xpPhone" on t.m.o actually believes what he's saying ...10:39
johnxmornin' hrw10:40
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andrilHello all10:40
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andrilAre there any working alteratives to wayfinder on the n81010:41
X-Fadelardman|gone: still missing build-depends..10:42
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johnxandril, do you need the turn-by-turn stuff? or just a decent mapping program?10:42
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andrilSomething that works with gps10:42
johnxhave you tried maemo mapper?10:43
andrilTurn by turn would be nice10:43
andrilHaven't got it to work properly10:43
johnxwhich part doesn't work? the map download?10:43
johnxI've only gotten the yahoo maps source to work very well recently10:44
andrilI wish google aps were out10:44
andrilDownloading mm now10:45
johnxI don't really see google officially supporting any apps on maemo ...10:46
andrilI know ;(10:47
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johnxlooking into this right now actually:
johnxlooks like it could be really nice in the future10:49
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andrilNot bad at all10:51
johnxright now it's crashing on startup on my desktop :)10:51
RST38hjohnx: talk to lardman10:52
RST38hjohnx: he is porting it10:52
johnxah! awesometastic10:52
johnxmaybe I should just start learning how to make plugins then10:52
andrilThhat would be awesome10:53
RST38h <=== fun!10:54
johnxRST38h, yeah10:54
RST38hJoin Date: Oct 200910:55
johnx1 post10:55
johnxhe's probably not even reading the threa10:55
RST38hguess so10:55
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RST38ha write-only user10:55
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johnxyup, the (*$&% of the day award goes to that guy. the xpPhone guy at least seems honestly convinced that xp on a phone is a good idea10:56
andrilWaiting on gps fix from mm10:56
RST38hwhich makes him insane. is it a better thing than being pissed off at life like the last guy? =)10:57
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lbt_johnx: sounds like a plan to me10:57
* lbt_ suggests MS focus on mobileXP10:57
johnxlbt, that's what windows "mobile" 7 is, unless I'm confused10:57
johnxRST38h, I've known plenty of people who were quite out of touch with reality, but led very happy lives10:58
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lbt_nah, why shrink it ... go BIG10:58
johnxand in small doses they're much more pleasant to be around than people who are mad at everything10:58
RST38hjohnx: yea, psychiatrists call it "socially adapted"10:58
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RST38hjohnx: in fact, as most mental ilnesses cannot be cured, achieving social adaptation in patients is what most psychiatrists do10:59
johnxRST38h, on the flipside, is it really an 'illness' if the person is well adapted and self-supporting?11:00
RST38hI.e. think of those green men waving at your from every corner as a pleasant haloween decorations and proceed with your life =)11:00
mihu1I'm trying to run Q3A with the demo version of Q3A. I downloaded and extracted the pak0.pk3 according to this post, and Q3A seems to start up, but then shuts down with an error message. Did anybody try to use the demo version?11:00
RST38hjohnx: I would say it is11:00
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johnxmihu1, can you try running it from the terminal?11:01
mihu1johnx: I do. Here is the log
johnxnot many clues11:02
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andrilMaemo seems to be nice but short on backwards compatibility11:05
andrilWe should be able to run the newer version on  the n810 just like newer distros of linux on a old pc11:05
johnxandril, that's where the (community supported) mer project comes in11:05
andrilI saw mer on youtube is there a easy way to install it11:06
johnxthis is probably what you want:
johnxdo you have a "spare" sd card you can use?11:07
RST38h"China's state-run newspaper, People's Daily, is accusing Google of unfairly censoring it's online book section from search results" hehe11:09
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johnxcan't get emerillon running anywhere11:11
RST38hjohnx: Do talk to lardman, he had some success with it11:11
johnxI will11:12
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RST38hjohnx: As a short term solution, eCoach does a pretty good job at displaying maps now. Multiple sources, etc11:12
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MyrttiRST38h: correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't google banned in China?11:12
RST38hMyrtti: not entirely, afaik11:12
andrilYes i do11:12
RST38hMyrtti: Besides, the famous firewall of China is more like herpes - certain sites tend to get banned and unbanned on seemingly random rate11:13
johnxRST38h, ah. hilariously, I'm actually ok with ovi maps for now. I was interesting in emerillon on netbook and/or mer, but I can't even make it run on my desktop11:13
* RST38h can't stand Ovi maps =(11:13
johnxI was trying it on linux/ppc and figured the segfault was arch dependent, but it does the same on my athlon11:13
hrwRST38h: you are not the only one11:14
RST38hhrw: Vote/comment on the bugs then11:14
hrwRST38h: on symbian ovi maps is usable for walk navigation more or less. but I will not drive with it (tried)11:14
johnxfor sure it's not very good, but when it's not fighting my control of the view and spinning the map at stop signs it's kind of helpful11:14
hrwRST38h: I did not used n900 version yet so will not vote11:15
RST38hhrw: Symbian version is fine for me, I mostly walk11:15
RST38hhrw: Maemo5 version is seriously screwed up11:15
hrwRST38h: you know... it is maemo - what you expected?11:15
RST38hjohnx,hrw: Bugs #5332,#5333,#5336, all labelled as "enhancements" i.e. they do not intend to fix them11:16
RST38hhrw: I expected apps that are usable11:16
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johnxhrw, well, lots of other stuff in maemo5 actually got lots better11:16
RST38hhrw: Not asking for anything special, just a usable product11:16
johnxI didn't really expect a usable maps app, so I'm not really surprised11:16
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lirihow do I check my OS version on N810?11:17
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hrwliri: control panel ->about product11:17
hrwRST38h: add some screenshots to bugs?11:17
RST38hhrw: And I also think that when a project manager from Nokia suggests that I use community-supplied apps rather than Nokia0supplied ones, it is a clear failure for Maemo11:17
* johnx should probably add a video of the "spinning while stationary" thing11:17
andrilThanks back to work i go11:18
lirithe bootmenu is gone after an upgrade. Is it possible to easily restore it with init_flasher which I already have installed?11:18
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RST38hhrw: screenshots are all over the web nowadays11:18
RST38hlemme see11:18
johnxliri, I think it's probably just as easy to install it again with the bootmenu installer11:19
johnxit should pick up your config11:19
hrwliri: reinstall bootmenu then11:19
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lirihow do I do that?11:19
johnxsame way you did it the first time11:19
lirijohnx: like I remember... that was like a year ago :)11:19
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hrwliri: go to mer install page - they point to nice bootmenu installler there11:20
lirijohnx: and I can't really do it again because back then I used it to also clone the OS and I don't want to mistakenly to overwrite my already functioning OS on the internal SD11:20
johnxliri, install the mer installer from here:
johnxit'll give you bootmenu installer and mer installer. if you don't want mer, just don't launch the mer installer11:21
liriok I'll see11:21
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johnxalright. time for me to catch some sleep11:22
johnx'night all11:22
lbt_night johnx11:22
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lirithanks johnx, installing the bootmenu worked11:37
liriI now have to figure out how to add the entries for the mmc there11:37
liriI remember its something related to editing a bootmenu.conf or something11:37
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hrwliri: look at /etc/bootmenu*11:39
liriyeah, there's a bootmenu.d/ entry there but its empty11:40
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liriso I'll have to re-flash it to update the bootmenu?11:43
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lirithat helped11:53
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hrwhi lardman11:58
lardmanhi hrw, how's things?11:58
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lardmanwhy oh why is there no sample code for using AWS from C12:05
RST38h"Somali pirates preparing ransom demand for British kidnap couple" <-- how business like12:06
RST38hlardman: talk to johnx, he wanted the maps app =)12:06
lardmanhopefully answered by "SAS/SBS storm Somali pirates' boat and kill all the pirates and free the couple"12:06
lardmanamazon web services12:06
RST38hlardman: that would be politically incorrect12:07
hrwlardman: how things... few troubles with one board but it has low priority, working on bug for most of time12:07
RST38hlardman: the politically correct way would be to treat them as human beings, talk to them for the next 3-4 months, then pay them money12:07
lardman~lart PCness12:08
* infobot rm -rf's PCness12:08
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msh_arvo. wondering, is diablo extras-devel not updating from the autobuilder properly atm?12:09
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lardmanspeaking of the autobuilder, how do I get it to install Python?12:10
qwerty12_N810python2.5 in Build-Depends?12:11
lardmanshould a build-dep on "python" be enough?12:11
lardmandoes it need to be python2.5?12:11
lardmancuriously the autobuilder didn't complain about straight python12:11
RST38han alias probably12:11
lardmanbut one that should work12:12
qwerty12_N810Hmm, I guess "python" is enough: "python" depends on python2.5 here12:12
lardman ?12:13
lardmanperhaps the configure script needs something more than just Python, will have to check when I get home12:13
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t_s_ohow is that 900 working out?12:18
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lardmanwhich, mine?12:19
t_s_oheh, i think it was Stskeeps that just logged on with one, and then off again...12:20
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lardmanah, I see12:20
Stskeepst_s_o: happy customer12:21
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* w00t still wants to steal Stskeeps' n90012:33
qwerty12_N810There are people more near to you that also have N900s...12:33
* qwerty12_N810 stares at lcuk12:34
SpeedEvil<panto> Look behind you!</panto>12:34
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t_s_onot sure i want to know the source of that tag...12:41
lardmanappend a -mime12:42
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SpeedEvilThe japanese have tea ceremonies, and samuri, we have Panto, and fish and chips.12:44
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lardmanand in the same way not all the Japanese are samurai, not all the British like or watch pantos12:45
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SpeedEvilOh yes they do!12:46
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* lcuk stares @ qwerty12_N810 12:47
fatal^does anyone know what license liblocation is distributed under?12:47
* qwerty12_N810 stares at lcuk12:47
t_s_osheesh, trying to find that wiki article on secure mode is not easy...12:47
fatal^AFAIK it's proprietary..... and maemo-mapper is GPLv3.... not a perfect match. ;P12:47
lardmanfatal^: did you see my question in #champlain?12:48
lardmanre mm12:48
qwerty12_N810~lart nautilus12:48
* infobot chops nautilus in half with a free Solaris 7 CD12:48
t_s_oah, it was called maemo security...12:48
Stskeepsfatal^: liblocation may qualify as system library12:50
Corsact_s_o: especially look at the Talk: page btw12:50
CorsacI've not yet propagated Elena comments on the main page12:50
fatal^Stskeeps: maybe.12:51
t_s_oi really "love" seeing the word consume used in the context of content...12:52
lcuki really "love" seeing the word create used in the context of content...12:53
SpeedEvilI really "love" seeing the word eggplant used in the context of content...12:53
t_s_ohaving fun?12:54
lcukwell bacon is preferable lol12:54
fatal^Stskeeps: guess I'll convince myself that's it and let someone else worry about potential licensing issues. :)12:55
fatal^I wonder why liblocation isn't free software.... isn't it just an abstraction layer after all? Shouldn't be much "extremely valueable Intellectual Property" in there...12:56
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* lcuk posted a bug last night about "silent" mode not being silent12:58
lcukanyone got any ideas on if its right - it sounds wrong to me12:59
Lupulcuk: Well, you do have the volume buttons to mute it for that use.13:00
rangeI don't know. On my S60 phone the alarm also rings when the phone is on "silent mode" - same goes for music.13:00
lcukLupu, much more faffing13:00
LupuThe silent mode is merely for event related sounds.13:00
rangeAnd I would be miffed if the alarm wouldn't sound in occasions like that.13:00
LupuIt wouldn't make sense that you can't listen to music and/or watch videos if you don't want to head noise from calls or messages.13:01
lcukalarm != music and stuff13:01
LupuThose are noises that you specifically request from the device.13:01
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LupuThat's specified behavior.13:02
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LupuIf you want full silence, turn down the volume to zero. Silent mode disables event-based "unexpected" sounds.13:02
lcukbut if i do that my alarm wont sound in the morning will it?13:03
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fatal^silent should have another name that makes it more obvious that it's not really going to be silent.13:03
LupuI don't think the alarm volume is related to that, but it's worth a test.13:03
* fatal^ would find a mute profile useful.13:04
* fatal^ has no use for "half-silent".13:04
LupuThe naming scheme is indeed a little misguiding.13:04
Corsacbasically, "silent" might not be the same thing for everyone13:05
Lupufatal^: Ok, just tried it. The volume slider doesn't influence alarm volume.13:05
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* lbt_ wonders about a dbus wrapper around liblocation and a dbus caller in Maemo Mapper...13:11
SpeedEvilwhat does liblocation do that gpsd doesn't?13:13
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lardmanallows access to the cell id info13:13
lardmanit's also power efficient13:13
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lardmancallbacks if position changes, etc13:14
lbt_seems like a rational way to link the two13:15
hrwSpeedEvil: gpsd is a bit old fashioned13:15
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lardmanlbt_: yep13:15
lbt_also allows the potential to reverse engineer the API to other stuff13:15
lbt_like Mer on N810 and other devices13:16
hrwdoes maemo5 provides geolocation based on gsm cells?13:16
lbt_Stskeeps: is liblocation on the list?13:16
lardmanwhat's the liblocation licence then?13:16
hrwlardman: closed13:16
lardmanhrw: yep13:16
lardmandoes gpl3 not allow the use of closed components then?13:17
lardmani guess not13:17
Stskeepslbt_: liblocation i cannot personally touch.. asking nokia to open headers would be nice though13:17
lbt_cf Na + hot H2013:17
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* timeless_mbp sighs13:25
timeless_mbpmy phone went on strike13:25
timeless_mbpit's churping for new messages and chirps for when a caller hangs up.... but it won't respond to me :(13:26
X-Fadetimeless_mbp: display stays blank?13:26
lcukbuy it new shoes13:26
timeless_mbpdisplay is "Address Book"13:26
lcukslide open keyboard?13:26
timeless_mbpkeyboard was open13:26
qwerty12_N810Give it the smackdown13:26
timeless_mbpopening the camera lens didn't do anything either :(13:26
lcuksounds b0rkened13:27
* timeless_mbp holds the power key until it dies13:27
LupuDid you try singing to it? Or twittering back at it?13:27
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petruxhi there13:31
lcuktimeless, back to life?13:32
petruxnewbie question: is there any entry-level tutorial about application development on maemo?13:32
lcukrather off13:32
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lardmanpetrux: yes, the tut on maemo.org13:33
petruxlardman: I'm on the page... do you mean the dev guide?13:34
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lcukpetrux, new to maemo development or new to linux development or new to development in general?13:35
petruxlardman: thanks.13:35
petruxlcuk: new to Maemo dev13:35
lardmanlcuk: yes, that's the next question13:35
petruxlcuk: quite-new to linux development13:35
lcukwhats your usual background?  windows? webdev? etc13:36
petruxlcuk: win/web13:36
petruxbut also "scientific" programming so not so bound to a platform (mainly Java/Python but now also .NET/Mono)13:36
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petruxso what I lack is experience in real-OS-usage (I hope you got what I mean... :-))13:37
lcukdo you use a linux machine normally?13:37
lcuklardman, btw - "gst-launch pulsesrc ! pulsesink"  on n900 and click fingers13:38
lcuknear mic13:38
petruxlcuk: for my personal development yes13:38
lcukits not the specific mic port but the mic audio goes through it13:38
petruxlcuk: at work no13:38
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petruxlcuk: our job is mostly on Win :-(13:38
lcuk-dang! thought that was simon13:38
lcuknothing wrong with win13:38
lcuki use it, but if your home machine is win also, you will need a VM with linux on it13:39
petruxlcuk: not so true... anyway, it's a question of points of view. :-)13:39
petruxlcuk: no, my personal machine is a Linux Machine13:39
lcuklbt, you just try that command?13:39
wazdheya all13:39
petrux(Ubuntu, but I'm testing also Debian 64studio to make some music)13:40
petruxlbt_: uh?13:40
lcukhi wazd of the north \o13:40
petruxlcuk: on WinXP I'm experiencing cygwin but I'd like to test andLinux too...13:40
lbt_just teasing lcuk....13:40
petruxlbt_: I see... :-)13:40
lbt_I'm more a linux user13:40
lardmancygwin is nasty13:40
lbt_what types of app are you wanting to do13:40
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petruxlardman: I see... I don't like it so much but... I couldn't find anything better.13:45
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lbt_cygwin is great!!13:46
lbt_(for using)13:46
* lbt_ installs on every windows machine he has to use13:46
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petruxlbt_: the greatest problem is that I cant type my favourite command13:47
petruxapt-get something something-else13:47
petrux(just kifdding)13:47
petruxlbt_: I basically *live* on emacs... but when I'm on WinXP (like now) I use the Win version13:48
lcukthats something i keep wanting to do from windows naturally13:48
lcuki like the WM, but wish the console was proper13:48
petruxlcuk: don't get it...13:48
* lbt_ too13:48
lcukwindows XP window manager feels "right"13:49
lcuki havent found a linux one yet which works as well13:49
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lcukbut the console in xp is crap13:49
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hrwxp window manager is good? we have different use of WM then ;d13:49
lardmanubuntu 9.10 is getting closer13:49
lardmanhrw: the feel I think he means13:49
lbt_lcuk: kde13:50
petruxlardman: I'll install Ubuntu 9.10 next week13:50
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fralsonly thing im missing in win7 is a proper console :(13:50
lardmantrue, will have to switch to Qt anyway13:50
AnunakinAll: Have a nice day!13:50
petruxanyway... what abou maemo dev under WinXP? I guess I must use a Virtual Machine, right?13:50
lcukbegrudgingly for some things, yes13:51
X-Fade_|Nix|_: libnss3-dev is now in sdk, but it seems that it has a missing dependency as well.13:51
* lcuk goes afk bbl13:52
_|Nix|_X-Fade: Not surprised. libnss3-dev and libnspr4-dev always go hand-in-hand.13:53
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Yeah, already pinged to get that fixed too.13:53
_|Nix|_X-Fade: Awesome! I was contemplating /really/ ugly hacks to get around that ...13:54
X-Fade_|Nix|_: No, please don't do that ;)13:54
X-Fade_|Nix|_: It is a bug and needs to be fixed anyway.13:54
_|Nix|_... however, I'm noticing that there's a version of pidgin (2.6.2-1maemo1) that was built successfully without libnss3-dev ...13:55
_|Nix|_It looks like it's straight from Debian.13:55
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Depends on some protocols perhaps?13:55
_|Nix|_It seems to depend on libnss3, but not libnss3-dev ...13:55
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Well then libnss3-dev is a build-depends ?13:56
_|Nix|_I'm re-doing my sb targets right now using the latest sdk installer to see if I can build pidgin without libnss3-dev ...13:56
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Which means it still needs to be there?13:56
_|Nix|_X-Fade: The control file says the source package depends on libnss3.13:56
_|Nix|_I'm pretty sure libnss3-dev is a build-dependency of Pidgin's.13:57
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_|Nix|_X-Fade: Correction. pidgin_2.6.2-1maemo1 /Build/-Depends on libnss3 ...13:57
_|Nix|_It gets weirder and weirder ...13:58
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_|Nix|_Anyway. libnss3-dev /should/ be in the SDK and fully usable.14:00
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Yeah, I'm sure that will be fixed.14:00
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petruxok... going to have lunch. see you later. :-)14:05
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SpeedEvilhrw: Old fashioned isn't always bad of course.14:10
lcukX-Fade, thanks for curing the packages script :D14:11
hrwSpeedEvil: I did not said 'bad'14:12
X-Fadelcuk: No problem, small oversight ;)14:12
SpeedEvilhrw: no, you diddn't.14:12
* lcuk nods14:12
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lcukdoes anyone know the RGB16 bit layout that maemo uses  (ie is B5G6R5 correct?)14:13
AndrewFBlackAnyone setup Google Sync on there n900 yet?14:13
hrwAndrewFBlack: googlesync? no syncml on n900?14:14
RST38hgoogle calendar you mean?14:14
AndrewFBlackI figureed it would work since google sync is just an exchange server and n900 has exchange support14:14
RST38hlcuk: it is 56514:14
RST38hWill tell you the exact format in a moment14:15
lcukthanks RST38h14:15
* lbt_ very disapointed in the data exchage limitations for an 'open' device too14:16
lcukmmm lbt?14:16
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RST38hlcuk: #define PIXEL(R,G,B)  (pixel)(((31*(R)/255)<<11)|((63*(G)/255)<<5)|(31*(B)/255))14:16
RST38hlcuk: he means no bt14:16
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RST38hNo BT browsing, no sending files over BT14:17
lcukok, your R G B are floats?14:17
hrwRST38h: no receiving too?14:17
RST38hThere are two bug tackers for this, mine is for browsing somebody elses is for sharing14:17
RST38hhrw: have nto tried14:17
lcukbt receiving is there14:17
RST38hprobably no14:17
lcukit pops up14:17
RST38hreally? cool14:17
lcuki got photos from people14:17
RST38hlcuk: They are not floats14:17
lcukvia bt14:17
lcukahh ok RST38h14:18
lbt_lcuk: l8r... but I can't get contacts off the phone14:18
RST38hlcuk: it is R5.G6.B514:18
X-FadeI've sent files over bt too.14:18
RST38hNot photos, files in general14:18
hrwlcuk: let me guess - sending contacts from phone -> n900 does not mean that contact will be added to contacts?14:18
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RST38hPhotos you can share, but not any other file14:18
lcuki dunno hrw14:18
X-Fadelbt_: Nokia suite?14:18
lcuki still use paper cards, test14:18
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lcukjust been asked a question in email, "is gps exposed to the browser via a W3C geolocation API?"14:19
lcukor is this something we were discussing the other night14:20
lcukabout extending it to support14:20
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* RST38h looked at N900 photos at 100% magnification. Oh shit.14:21
RST38h(Why do we need 5mpx there?)14:22
lbt_X-Fade: Nokia suite? Cool... where's the .deb ?14:23
X-Fadelbt_: Windows only of course ;)14:23
hrwX-Fade: s/nokia suite/ovi suite/14:24
lbt_X-Fade: I don't have windows14:24
lbt_or Mac14:24
X-Fadehrw: PC Suite even14:24
Jaffahrw: Sending contacts from phone to N900 opens the "BT receive file" notification for a vCard (.vcf) and if you tick "Open after saving" it will add to contacts.14:25
hrwanyway it is ovi suite now but still suxx14:25
hrwJaffa: so functionality from maemo4 works still14:25
qwerty12_N810Was still called "Nokia PC Suite", last time I looked...14:25
X-Fadelbt_: You can put the tablet in PC suite mode and get contacts through the modem function, I think.14:25
lbt_I've been looking at gnokki14:25
hrwJaffa: I just hope that it will be able to import my contacts. maemo4 was not able14:25
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_berto_I sent all my contacts from an old symbian phone with no problems14:26
hrwJaffa: put bigger photo into contact14:26
lbt_I suppose I'm just irritated that the syncml isn't exposed over IP.... but much less so if it's simply time-pressure14:26
hrwJaffa: but you will not make it with s6014:27
X-Fade_berto_: You don't need to send those. There is a sync function for that.14:27
lbt_it also failed to sync to my old nokia 311014:27
lbt_over BT14:27
_berto_X-Fade: yeah, using that one14:27
hrwJaffa: my SE k750i phone had contact with 2Mpix picture in it. n810 refused to import14:27
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lbt_lcuk: geolocation+dbus would be similar14:29
lcukgoelocation+dbus is not exposed in the browser is it?14:29
X-Fadehrw: n810 wasn't a phone.14:30
lcukie a web app cannot get at it14:30
hrwX-Fade: I know14:30
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lcukbut on the flip, maps is a web app14:30
lcukand obviously has access at some level14:30
X-Fadehrw: with N900 being a phone, they needed to step that up quite a bit ;)14:30
glasshow about webruntime on maemo?(i'm unaware of it's state, but.. webruntime has location apis)14:30
hrwX-Fade: n900 is a phone. so far worse then my e66 (also nokia)14:30
Jaffahrw: Send the VCF to a laptop and it makes it easy to attach to a bug ;-)14:30
lcukyes glass14:30
hrwJaffa: bug was reported long time ago14:31
Jaffaglass: Web Runtime doesn't exist for Maemo yet, except perhaps in some random Nokia developers' laptops14:31
Jaffahrw: With vcard attached?14:31
X-Fadehrw: So far it is a lot better for me than any Symbian phone I have owned before.14:31
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lbt_lcuk: earlier we suggested a dbus wrapper over liblocation - the same wrapper may provide web api14:31
Jaffahrw: If it's got the troublesome vcard attached, I'll test on my N90014:31
lcuklbt, no qualms whatsoever, so the email answer i should give is "not now"? or is the jury still out14:32
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lbt_I think "not yet" is about right14:33
_berto_X-Fade: depends on what you want it for :) for me it's better than any phone I've owned too14:34
lcuk+1 berto14:34
_berto_but depends on your needs14:35
_berto_some people want smaller phones14:35
hrwlooks like 2781 got fixed for maemo514:35
_berto_or phones that they can use with one hand14:35
_berto_or need some particular symbian app14:36
_berto_etc etc14:36
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hrwI need mail client which will show me 10 entries in inbox view - thats how profimail works on my current phone14:38
lcuklandscape or portrait?14:38
* lcuk nods14:38
hrw7 in landscape14:39
* RST38h facepalms at photos made by N900 camera14:39
lcukRST38h, quick lets see14:39
RST38hA moment14:39
lcukhrw, can you take photos or find on web14:40
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zap_lcuk: Hi! Can I ask you something? :)14:46
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lcuksure thing zap_ but i might not answer14:47
Jaffahrw: Is that "whole vCard" correct? Quotes seem very odd as displayed in comment #414:47
hrwlcuk: 4 and 5 are broken due to fact that screenshot app do not handle rotation14:47
hrwJaffa: thats how diablo exported vcard14:47
lcukthanks hrw, do you have a device yet?14:47
hrwlcuk: n900? nope. waiting for availability in eStore14:48
lcukok, im just gonna put that screenshot on device and see how the size of the text looks etc14:48
lcukit helps to see it in context14:48
lcukzap_, no sorry14:48
zap_ok, np14:49
lcukhrw, are you still involved with bugbase people?14:50
hrwlcuk: yes. I have two bugbases here (and ~8 modules)14:51
Corsachrw: estore?14:51
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hrwCorsac: n900 discounted devices14:51
hrwhi mgedmin14:51
mgedminhi hrw14:51
Jaffahrw: since I have no way of defining a SIP account (AFAIK), I can't test. Importing it without a SIP account of has put the whole of the X-SIP line in the entry14:52
lcukcool, some folks were saying yesterday modular component systems cant work, you have them there14:52
SpeedEvilNobody said they can't work.14:52
Corsachrw: can I haz? :)14:52
RST38hThey work but appear to be impractical14:52
SpeedEvilThere are many costs in modularity - in some applications these are prohibitive.14:52
lcukdepends on expected usages i suppose14:53
SpeedEvilAnd they may be larger than you think at first.14:53
RST38hdoes not depend on expected usages14:53
RST38hMODULAR = can be tailored for any usage14:53
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* timeless_mbp resumes fishing14:55
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mgedmininteresting bug: open PDF reader, select 'open' from the menu, start scrolling --> I see two directories named 'Documents'14:59
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samuelhi, any change installing Qt4.6 or Qt4.5 on N810?15:02
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qwerty12_N810mgedmin: I've had that in two flashes, in all applications using the Hildon File Chooser, and with all the "special folders"...15:07
mgedmin"two flashes"?15:07
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qwerty12_N810Ah, I reflashed first time to get rid of it. And now it's back :-)15:08
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msh_hm. working for anyone?15:09
msh_oh, it just loaded.15:09
msh_slow slow ;)15:09
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mgedminqwerty12_N810: have you filed a bug?15:14
qwerty12_N810No, I hate trying to search in Bugzilla15:14
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: What did I do?15:15
fiferboy~karma fiferboy15:15
infobotfiferboy has karma of 115:15
fiferboy~karma fiferboy15:15
lcukyou broke it15:16
qwerty12_N810fiferboy: HeColorButton :)15:16
fiferboyinfobot doesn't like repeats...15:16
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: It's working for you?15:16
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X-Fade_|Nix|_: Problem solved.15:20
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mgedminalso, ovi SUUUUUUUCKS15:21
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_|Nix|_X-Fade: Nice!15:22
timeless_mbp_|Nix|_: did you see the person who came in to complain about pidgin?15:26
_|Nix|_timeless_mbp: Into this chan?15:27
timeless_mbpyesterday ish15:27
* _|Nix|_ rans /lastlog15:27
RST38hmgedmin: is it ever going to load?15:27
RST38hmgedmin: Ah, the duplicate filename bug! Need the bug tracker #?15:27
mgedminif you have it15:27
RST38hThe Ovi I mean15:27
_|Nix|_Oh well, the guy quit.15:28
_|Nix|_That's what the "Send button" plugin is for.15:28
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* RST38h uses the occassion to thank Nix for Pidgin port15:29
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* aquatix wonders why lately the app manager crashes on use15:35
X-Fadeaquatix: I have seen a lot, but not that ;)15:35
aquatixsome other apps do too15:35
aquatixmaybe my internal flash is b0rked again15:35
X-Fadememory corruption? Or flash?15:36
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_|Nix|_RST38h: You're welcome :)15:36
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aquatixi suspect the internal flash, as i think it only happens with apps using storage15:36
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AndrewFBlackwhats best way to get google contacts on n900?  Export from Googe then import ot Nokia PC Suite?15:43
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alecrimI'm with some problems to bootup Maemo5 with BeagleBoard ! It's freezing! Any idea?15:46
tigerttried google activesync?15:46
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JaffaAndrewFBlack: Mail for Exchange can be used with Google to sync up/down details. I'm *told* it doesn't do pictures, though.15:50
AndrewFBlackJaffa, for contacts?15:51
JaffaAndrewFBlack: Yes, sorry15:51
AndrewFBlackok I'll try again, seemed to be taking forever so I stopped it15:52
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JaffaAndrewFBlack: See for more15:52
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mikkov__X-Fade: extras promoter doesn't work correctly
wazdhehe, FBReader has Loox 720 as icon :)15:54
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RST38hNokia launches *another* app store15:55
RST38hOh my god...15:55
X-Fademikkov__: What is wrong there?15:55
RST38hThey should start firing the guy who supervised the previous app store rollout every time the new one is launched15:56
mikkov__X-Fade: read it, try to install it, see version problem with python packages15:56
JaffaX-Fade: I think he's referring to the Python "consistency" issue described in the comments15:56
X-FadeYeah, that seems to be related to python in the SDK again.15:57
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_|Nix|_Boy ... the extras assistant is uncharacteristically slow ... wait ... uncharacteristically ?15:57
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mgedminI get too much mail15:59
lcukRST38h, im gonna open an app-store-store16:00
lcukwhere mobile operators can go and buy app-stores16:00
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* timeless_mbp fishes again16:01
RST38hlcuk; I already opened an app-store! where is my money fountain?16:02
timeless_mbphey, someone wanted me to poke someone about fbreader?16:02
RST38hNix: At least it lets you upload.16:02
RST38hNix: Try dput...16:02
_|Nix|_RST38h: Doesn't like my pubkey anymore, for some reason, but anyway. I'm just looking forward to getting my Pidgin via extras-devel, rather than building my own.16:02
_|Nix|_I hope everything works out OK.16:03
_|Nix|_... with the build.16:03
RST38hNix: No, it always prints that message when it fails16:03
msh_mikkov__: I reckon it's related to
RST38hNix: May not have anything to do with your pubkey16:03
msh_you're perhaps16:03
infobotmsh_ meant:  perhaps16:03
* mgedmin is waiting for a maemo5ified fbreader16:03
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wazdfirst Navigation that uses AA :)16:04
_|Nix|_Is there any package in Fremantle that provides a notification area?16:05
_|Nix|_... Pidgin has a notification area icon, but it does nothing in FM, because the FM status area doesn't act as a notification area, like it did in Chinook/Diablo.16:05
X-Fade_|Nix|_: Check what loadapplet does?16:06
StskeepsANNOUNCEMENT: My first day as distmaster,
_|Nix|_X-Fade: That makes a status area plugin.16:06
_|Nix|_... always did.16:07
qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: congrats16:07
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: ta16:08
X-FadeStskeeps: Congrats ;)16:08
X-FadeStskeeps: And welcome to the team of course ;)16:08
* w00t claps16:08
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Stskeepswhat i always wanted for almost half a year now16:08
JaffaStskeeps: Congratulations!16:08
wazdStskeeps: they've made up fake position for you? :D16:09
JaffaStskeeps: Glad it got started :)16:09
CorsacStskeeps: congrats :)16:09
X-FadeStskeeps: Let me create an email alias for you.16:09
wazdStskeeps: congrats :)16:09
_|Nix|_Dammit! I wanted to turn on voice/video for Pidgin, but that'd only work in FM, because libfarsight is only in FM. Is there a way to depend on a package, but only if it's available? I don't want to have a different control file for FM than I have for Diablo and Chinook.16:09
fiferboylardman: ping?16:09
Corsac_|Nix|_: no16:10
mgedminhm, does the app manager pay attention to the Recommends: field?16:10
Stskeepswazd: i have a role described so not entirely fake ;)16:10
Corsacwell, you could depend on libfarsight-dev |, but I'm not sure it's a good idea16:10
_|Nix|_Corsac: Great ... I'm starting to think about running fakeroot apt-get install ... from debian/rules ...16:10
Corsacdon't ever think about that16:10
mgedminif not, then something can be hacked with Depends: your-optional_library | some-package-that-is-only-in-diablo | some-package-that-is-only-in-mistral16:11
_|Nix|_Corsac: Well how else can I have one package for all these distros?16:11
lopzhi ;)16:11
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_|Nix|_mgedmin: But I don't want some-package-that-is-only-in-diable-that-pidgin-doesnt-normally-need.16:12
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mgedmin_|Nix|_: I was thinking about some system-preinstalled package16:12
_|Nix|_mgedmin: But, come to think of it, uploading a package to chinook extras devel called chinook, and one to diablo extras-devel called diablo would be nice.16:13
_|Nix|_Then, you could say libfarsight0.10-dev16:13
_|Nix|_Then, you could say libfarsight0.10-dev | diablo | chinook16:13
_|Nix|_... and you could do the same for any other package that is not available in all distros.16:13
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mgedminafter some thought I'm thinking it's not a very good idea16:16
mgedminleads to hacks16:16
mgedminit's better to test for functionality rather than software version16:17
mgedminif you always need libfarsight, depend on it16:17
mgedminif you don't need it but want to have it, use recommends:16:17
mgedminif it's already provided by some system package with a different name, use conditional depends16:17
_|Nix|_mgedmin: Yeah, but there's no such thing as Build-Recommends:, is there?16:18
mgedminaahm okay16:18
_|Nix|_... and the problem is the bot will not pull it if I don't depend on it.16:18
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mgedminmaintaining two different source packages is the only clean solution I can think of16:18
_|Nix|_Of course.16:19
_|Nix|_That always kills me.16:19
mgedminwith modern DVCSes that ought to be easy, no?16:19
_|Nix|_*sigh* ... I guess ... I'm about ready to do that.16:20
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_|Nix|_But for now I'll think I'll turn voice/video back off. Better to have Pidgin in FM without V/V and work on it later, than not have Pidgin in FM.16:20
javispedrocongrats Stskeeps :)16:20
_|Nix|_Although it'll probably fail on Chinook and Diablo and succeed on FM as it is now.16:21
mgedminperfect is enemy of the best16:21
Stskeepsjavispedro: ta16:21
mgedmins/the best/good/16:21
_|Nix|_So Pidgin will have V/V in FM ... unless something else is broken.16:21
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X-Fademikkov__: I think that manually pushing python-glade2 will help16:23
lardmanStskeeps: congrats btw16:23
fiferboylardman: Did you get your source to compile?16:27
lardmanyes thanks16:27
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lardmannot checked whether it runs yet16:27
RST38hStskeeps: way to go =16:28
f00bar80i found a lot of prices for the linux based 3G unlocked N900 , i can't get neither know a fixed price , any comment ?16:28
RST38hf00: not yet released, you are being swindled16:29
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lardmanfiferboy: segfault of course ;)16:29
SpeedEvilf00bar80: where are you?16:30
SpeedEvilf00bar80: and what do you mean by a fixed price?16:30
fiferboylardman: Any new code should segfault at least once16:30
fiferboyIt is like a right of passage16:30
lardmanof course :)16:30
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lardmanam back at work now, so will have to wait 'till this evening for me to fix the problem16:31
fiferboyI like to write code that crashes only for qwerty1216:31
f00bar80SpeedEvil, i want to nkow how much is it cause on , i found a lot of prices starting from $300 at the time i heared that it'll not be tooo expansive16:31
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RST38hjavis: NOT just on tmo...16:31
qwerty12_N810fiferboy: Talking of which, did you update personal-photo-frame? :p16:32
lardmanfiferboy: how do you manage that? Use tracked to check for lots of jpegs and avis in hidden dirs with names matching pron|porn|xxx ?16:32
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: Fixing it now :)16:32
javispedrolardman: IKEA catalogs...16:32
SpeedEvilf00bar80: Ignore - largely - froogle and small vendors.16:32
SpeedEvilf00bar80: It's going to be >$300, by quite a margin16:32
qwerty12_N810fiferboy: Thanks16:32
* qwerty12_N810 growls at javispedro 16:32
f00bar80SpeedEvil, and here i found it $699
fiferboylardman: lol16:32
lardmanjavispedro: do IKEA catalogues contain naked ladies these days?16:32
SpeedEvilf00bar80: that's the nokia price - some places have it at a relatively small discount.16:33
javispedrof00bar80: dunno where you read "cheap", but I wouldn't call the N900 cheap at all (not entering any qualite/price discussion)16:33
f00bar80SpeedEvil, like ?16:33
f00bar80SpeedEvil, so those who sell it for $300 are fake ?16:33
X-Fadef00bar80: Unless sold with a subscription, yes.16:34
javispedrolardman: well, dunno. But at least I know qwerty has a lot of them, efficiently downloaded through a P2P protocol :)16:34
SpeedEvilf00bar80: Given that the phone has not shipped at all, from anyone, I would hold off on ordering from anyone offering it at $300.16:34
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SpeedEvilf00bar80: It's not going to be half price any time soon at any legit store that does not subsidise it.16:34
lardmanjavispedro: interesting......16:34
SpeedEvil(barring one-off special offers)16:34
javispedrothere are a few ebayers selling at €400. I wouldn't buy from them, but I've seen several guys in the fansites already opening their wallets16:35
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f00bar80SpeedEvil, what could be safe stores other than nokia ?16:35
lardmanlocal phone shop?16:36
lcuk$300 for a phone, $50 for battery, $50 for charger, $200 for headphones.  and whats that sir, you want a box and instruction manual with that?16:36
SpeedEvilf00bar80: large stores. Amazon - direct - not through small merchants listing on amazon.16:36
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SpeedEvilf00bar80: places you see on every high-street.16:36
javispedro$200 for headphones? they better have gold plated contacts then.16:36
lardmanjavispedro: and low oxygen copper cable too! ;)16:36
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lcukno javis, gold is for l00sers, these are platinum tipped. only the best for you16:36
RST38hand the pads made of the purest argentinian guano16:36
derf$200 is not unheard of for headphones.16:37
lardmanfrom a golden goose?16:37
javispedrothat's a MONSTER headphone (pun intended)16:37
SpeedEvil hmm.16:37
RST38hlardman: from the freaking chupacabra16:37
SpeedEvilThat is quite awesome.16:37
derfAll those poor people with golden ears need headphones that expensive.16:37
SpeedEvilThere are other reasons16:37
RST38hderf: that is not golden ears, by purely mental problems16:38
SpeedEvilcomfort for long-term wear, light weight, sound isolation16:38
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RST38hderf: especially considering that a lot of them play mp3 s over that =016:38
X-FadeSpeedEvil: Hmm I'm pretty sure I've seen a tomtom patent on that? :)16:38
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SpeedEvilX-Fade: I think google have smart lawyers.16:38
derfRST38h: I work with audio codec developers.16:38
derfThere really _are_ people who can hear like that.16:38
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lardmanSpeedEvil: looks very cool16:38
mikkov__X-Fade: yes, promoting python-glade2 will help. Automatic promotion should check after updating packages that all other packages are still installable after the update to make it "fool proof".16:39
derfIt seems like more of a curse than a blessing.16:39
lardmanSpeedEvil: so we have some coding to do then :)16:39
SpeedEvillardman: and some mapping.16:39
RST38hGoogle adds free turn-by-turn navigation, car dock UI to Android 2.016:39
X-Fademikkov__: Yeah, something is not quite right in the promotion check. I'm trying to find what ;)16:39
X-Fademikkov__: But that is quite complicated.16:39
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RST38hderf: probably much fewer of them than "audiophiles"16:40
lardmanSpeedEvil: ah, we can scrape that ;)16:40
mikkov__X-Fade: yes it is ;)16:40
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derfRST38h: Yeah, but somebody's gotta subsidize the development :).16:40
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RST38hderf: hehe 8)16:40
mikkov__X-Fade: but I don't understand why python packages have hard version depencies16:40
X-Fademikkov__: They're in the same source package.16:40
X-Fademikkov__: but we should ask lizardo.16:41
mikkov__X-Fade: updating libraries by only trusting autopromoter to do handle it isn't very good practice imho16:42
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f00bar80SpeedEvil, can you help me find a store for an unlocked one, which you better advice it for me ?16:43
X-Fademikkov__: No, but usually we don't see this problem.16:43
derfRST38h: Monty is really rather scary. He'll sit down for a double-blind test at "transparent" bitrates and not only tell you what codec was used for each sample, but also what filtering was used on the supposed "original" source.16:43
X-Fademikkov__: Python mess in sdk triggers this issue.16:43
SpeedEvilf00bar80: Any large online or retail store. Avoid small retailers.16:43
wazdI wonder if Google will release any of their software on Maemo16:43
SpeedEvilwazd: unlikely - if they want to push the android platform16:44
f00bar80SpeedEvil, help me please find one16:44
SpeedEvilEspecially given that the maps app is not redistributable legally16:44
wazdSpeedEvil: well, they are releasing it on the iPhone :)16:44
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lardmanderf: and get it right I presume?16:44
derflardman: Right.16:44
lardmanrather impressive16:44
SpeedEvilf00bar80: the nokia store, or amazon - direct sales.16:44
derfWell, it's harder to verify the comments about the original source.16:45
f00bar80SpeedEvil, give me a link16:45
lardmanf00bar80: where are you based?16:45
f00bar80lardman, egypt16:45
lardmanah, ok, no deals on phone + tariff there then?16:45
f00bar80lardman, thin n900 not there yet and if it's , it'll be a lot expensive16:46
SpeedEvilf00bar80: I have no idea of where you'd go about buying a phone in egypt.16:46
SpeedEvilf00bar80: n900 is not available anywhere yet16:46
lardmanf00bar80: not here yet either16:46
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lardmanbut some of the subsidised deals make it pretty cheap, as you do need a data contract anyway16:47
lardmanwhen it's released of course16:47
f00bar80then what about this
lardman"This item has not yet been released."16:48
f00bar80lardman, when it should be ? next saturday/sunday ?16:48
lcukwhen the announcement happens16:48
lardmanI think people were talking about mid Nov on the forums#16:48
lcukits not released16:48
SpeedEvillardman: If it all works out for me, I'll have paid 17/mo for it over 18 months. (cashback/vouchers/...)16:49
lardmanbut who knows?16:49
SpeedEvilThough that's only 1G/mo data - which I think I can manage16:49
lardmanSpeedEvil: which deal are you going for?16:49
lardmanI get 500MB/month atm, and really only use 10Mb/day if I'm away from work/home and most of the time I have wifi anyway16:49
RST38hderf: Urgh16:49
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SpeedEvillardman: the voucher abuse one, and the subsidised cashback deal for the contract where you have to mail in stuff16:50
RST38hderf: Especially considering that I can't even say if there is some periodic noise in my audio, it all sounds the same16:50
lardmanSpeedEvil: ok16:50
derfRST38h: I know. My ears are complete crap.16:50
derfI can hear the difference between $5 headphones and $80 headphones, but after that they all sounds the same.16:51
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RST38hmore or less the same here16:53
RST38hwell, I do hear the difference between mp3 and lossless16:54
RST38hbut that is kinda easy to spot16:54
derfYes, mp3 is not transparent at any bitrate.16:54
derfBut even there I had to be trained.16:55
derfI used to think 22 kHz 96 kbps mp3s sounded just fine.16:55
derfThough part of that was just having really awful speakers at the time.16:56
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RST38hderf: Check percussion, it always suffers first16:59
derfI listen to mostly classical music... you can go a long time between cymbol crashes.17:00
RST38hvocal and melodic instruments don't need much bandwidth17:00
RST38hyea, classical you can even listen to over HSP =)17:00
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derfRST38h: Vocal I'll agree with (_if_ your codec is designed for it).17:01
derfBut I had to be disabused of the notion that simple melodies have compact frequency domain representations.17:01
derfAnd/or any real period to them at all.17:02
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RST38hderf: depends on the instruments not on the score17:03
derfRST38h: Yes, that's what I mean.17:03
RST38hstrings generally generate nice clean collections of sine functions, so they do not need the bandwidth17:04
derfThat is not true.17:04
RST38hmodern electric stuff is a bitch though17:04
RST38hderf: not completely true, you mean17:04
derfBasically, _nothing_ over 8kHz is periodic.17:04
derfRST38h: It's not true enough to be useful.17:04
RST38hIs there some physical reason for that btw?17:05
derfI don't know.17:05
derfIt's merely an empirical observation.17:05
*** GeneralAntilles changes topic to "Welcome Stskeeps, our new distmaster for! | | | Maemo Community Council | |"17:05
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derfFrom having actually built an audio codec with a pitch predictor.17:06
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* AndrewFBlack claps for Stskeeps 17:06
RST38hSomething must be changing at 8kHz...17:06
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RST38hWeird, AbiWord set up a collaborative editing site17:10
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AndrewFBlackkonttori_, Ping17:11
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mgedminheh, shows me a Nokia N900 add from amazon17:12
RST38hAh, Google OS is also ut and it is a Linux with Gnome, Chrome and OpenOffice.17:13
* RST38h feels like "who cares"17:14
VDVsxpossible time for the extras-testing marathon: 2pm - 7pm (UTC)17:14
VDVsxInterested parties: What do you think ?17:14
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derfRST38h: Because OMG Google!17:14
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RST38hderf: Google is not pink, has got no fur and does not look like a cuddly rabbit17:15
RST38hderf: so what the hell? =)17:15
timeless_mbp_|Nix|_: you around? can you swing by F5?17:15
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lardmaninteresting, Google mapmaker doing similar thing to OSM17:17
X-FadeI wish they would just join OSM...17:18
javispedro"But unlike most navigation systems, Google Maps Navigation was built from the ground up to take advantage of your phone's Internet connection"17:18
RST38hyea right17:18
RST38hjavis: Let me guess, Google invented the Internet?17:19
lardmanso only use it when you're in your home country17:19
javispedroGoogle invented pissing you17:19
lardmanor off?17:19
RST38hjavis: No. IBM did.17:19
derfRST38h: Al Gore is a "senior advisor".17:19
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RST38h"Pissing off. Pissing on." - good marketing slogan =)17:19
RST38hderf: orly? :)17:20
javispedroit seems all those companies are competing to see which one can make the WORSE navigation software.17:20
RST38hlardman: BTW, N900 gps apparently can't get a lock when you have no connectivity (bug tracker filed)17:20
RST38hlardman: So, Google is not alone there17:20
RST38hjavis: Google Maps are actually decent17:21
hrwRST38h: suxx17:21
nnod_does anyone know if it is possible to change the "slide to unlock" background on the n900? i assume one can edit the theme, but other than that...?17:21
lardmanRST38h: yes17:21
javispedrobut I want _offline_ vector maps :(17:21
lardmanRST38h: well supposedly it can get a lock, but you have to wait 5min or so17:22
hrwjavispedro: you can upload them to n900 for ovi maps17:22
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RST38hjavis: Best bet would be eCoach with OSM map renderer17:22
hrwlardman: 5 minutes and stay in one position for that time?17:22
javispedroI could die waiting for OSM maps quality to improve17:22
RST38hlardman: Waited for hours at a time in Amsterdam, no doughnut17:22
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mgedminjavispedro: or you could get off the couch and _work on improving OSM maps_17:22
lardmanjavispedro: there's an osm rendered being worked on for GSoC17:22
pupnikfix em where you go17:22
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javispedroEven If I would spent my lifetime filling map data by hand it would still be useless. I spent two years just to map the village where I was born..17:25
lardmanRST38h: yeah, is crappy though17:25
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lardmanRST38h: I did try to ask how the almanac/ephemeris data was handled and cached, and was told that it should be cached ok.17:25
lardmanRST38h: might be worth trying to get a lock with a connection, then immediately after get one without - it should still work, but I have a feeling it won't17:26
javispedrothe only I regret is using Garmin map data format. An open format would've been welcomed.17:26
SpeedEviljavispedro: of what population?17:26
javispedroSpeedEvil: 200017:26
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wazdGoogle Navigation is the first app to use Anti-Aliasing for maps17:26
X-FadeDoes maps even have a satellite view?17:26
lardmanjavispedro: who's using Garmin format?17:27
lardmanX-Fade: Ovi? yes17:27
SpeedEviljavispedro: that's not very fast - were you mapping _everything_ ?17:27
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X-Fadewazd: Maps does that too?17:27
RST38hlardman: when you get off an airplane in some country you have not been to, the connection is out of the question17:27
wazdX-Fade: oh?17:27
javispedroSpeedEvil: yes. for a large irregular area, including rural ways.17:28
RST38hwaz: hmm...but why is it important?17:28
lardmanRST38h: yeah, in which case would be nice to dowload alamanc + ephemeris predictions for offline use17:28
SpeedEviljavispedro: ah - rural areas are a problem if you want all the field boundaries and stuff17:28
wazdRST38h: why not? :P)17:29
wazdRST38h: it looks better :)17:29
RST38hlardman: and have a diablo-style manual location selector17:29
RST38hwazd: doesn't the mobile screen offer too few pixels for it though?17:29
lardmanRST38h: yeah17:29
javispedroactually, I don't regret using Garmin. It was the best choice back then (the only one useful at all).17:30
javispedros/Garmin/Garmin format17:30
SpeedEviljavispedro: checked it out on OSM recently?17:30
RST38hOSM is weird btw17:30
SpeedEvilRST38h: in many ways, yes.17:30
RST38hThere is some site showing bicycling maps based on OSM17:30
RST38hAnd that site seems to show way more data than OSM proper17:30
SpeedEvilRST38h: If you mean the contours, that's a seperate source17:31
SpeedEvilnot OSM, NASA17:31
RST38hjavis: Check your location here:
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javispedrocurrently, OSM data in Spain is subpar (not complaining to anybody, I know how the bazaar model works)17:32
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wazdanyone can advise me good car stereo? :)17:32
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: Fixed the crash17:32
fiferboyNow to add the filter, and try to remember the suggestion you made yesterday17:32
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javispedroan interesting thing would be to reuse at least some of the national cartography17:35
mgedmindiscovery: when using the n900 in portrait mode, the meaning of volume +/- keys is reversed17:35
RST38hmgedmin: you never knew?17:35
wazdRST38h: maybe, but it's the same stuff as dithering". It can help on small screens but it's not pure 18 bit :)17:35
javispedroit's free for non-commercial use here, and way better for most national roads than OSM.17:35
RST38hmgedmin; corollary: phone autorotate mode is unusable17:36
mgedminis surprising17:36
mgedminthe autorotation delay means it's not very usable17:36
mgedminis irritating17:36
RST38hthat is a different feature17:36
RST38hand yes, it is barely usable too17:36
RST38hthe delay is the first thing an unsuspecting user find out17:37
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SpeedEviljavispedro: you can't use that in OSM17:39
SpeedEviljavispedro: OSM is not non-comercial17:39
SpeedEviljavispedro: the non-commercial element actually makes your maps a _LOT_ less useful.17:39
javispedronot for me of course. But I can see the point.17:39
SpeedEvilFor example - any small buisness can't use that map for 'how to get to us' on their website, you can't print out a tourist map of your area, with attractions marked, ...17:40
javispedroopencyclemap has elevation lines :P17:41
SpeedEviljavispedro: yes - that's NASA data17:42
SpeedEviljavispedro: from an old shuttle mission.17:42
javispedroa. Ic. public domain then.17:42
lardmanis that in osm?17:42
RST38happarently not17:42
SpeedEvillardman: no - it's a dataset that's displayed over OSM - it's not in OSM as such17:42
lardmanthat map is really good17:42
SpeedEvil(the contours)17:42
lardmancertainly for round here17:42
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SpeedEvillardman: Where ar eyou again - longo?17:43
lardmanbath, uk17:43
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lardmaneven has some pubs marked on it :)17:44
SpeedEvilLarge towns in england are quite well mapped - in general17:44
SpeedEvildunno - only been to england once.17:44
SpeedEviltwice even.17:45
* RST38h always visits British airports =)17:45
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solarionI slept on the floor of Terminal 5; does that count?17:46
lardmannot sure I'd want to go near the floor in Heathrow17:47
RST38hof course17:47
lardmanI have slept on the floor in Singapore mind you17:47
solarionit was the floor inside or outside17:48
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lardmaninside; outside I'd probably be fined for littering ;)17:49
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mgedminlittering or loitering?17:50
solarionmgedmin: I suspect the wording was intentional17:51
lardmanI understand they have Draconian punishments for dropping chewing gum, so random sleeping bodies would probably not be looked on kindly17:51
solarionthere were plenty there17:52
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javispedrohum... countries without chewing gums all over the floor. nice.17:53
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LupuWhat if you drop a chewing gum while sleeping?17:55
lardmanwell exactly, that's why you'd get imprisoned straight away, on the off chance.....17:56
* ccooke restarts watches his n900 boot for the third time today17:58
n00bccooke: why17:58
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ccooken00b: Well, the first time was a random reboot - the first in two weeks. The second time I restarted deliberately because everything became horribly slow, *probably* relating to a (failing) attempt to configure exchange syncing to gmail.18:00
mgedminhmm, reminds me of
ccookeAnd the third time because after two hours of music, an hour of note taking, two reboots and some web browsing, the battery decided to die :-)18:00
mgedminrandom reboots + everything becoming horribly slow18:00
RST38hArnie has got a sense of humor:
mgedminalthough mine happen only when I use ad-hoc wifi and ssh socks proxy18:00
ccookemgedmin: I checked the RAM, not the same problem18:00
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ccookeIt's not really enough to bugreport yet, but I'll be trawling to see if I can confirm or add to an existing report in a bit18:01
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VDVsxhumm, a Twitt in Planet Maemo, awesome, lol18:01
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X-FadeVDVsx: Awesom isn't it? :)18:05
GeneralAntillesSomething like that, anyway.18:06
VDVsxX-Fade, lol, well depends on the number of twits that will appear there (/me is afraid )18:07
X-FadeVDVsx: These are selected by the Firefox mobile team.18:07
VDVsxah ok, so only one provider :P18:08
X-FadeVDVsx: Yeah, should not be too bad.18:09
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VDVsxX-Fade, btw, did you got any luck with the /opt check for packages.maemo.org18:14
X-FadeWhat website is that?18:14
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wazdCrazy hackers, they even use hacked display port to demo Plasma :D18:18
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javispedroX-Fade: if it was not suggest before, I suggest to redirect (or be the actual place for)
javispedrodebian synergy, you know.18:25
* Jaffa has suggested this before - it's also easier to type ;-)18:25
X-Fadejavispedro: yeah, some day...18:25
JaffaX-Fade: Isn't redirect a 5s job? [may be misremebering from when you've set them up before]18:26
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X-FadeJaffa: No, because I would then also need a ssl cert etc.18:26
javispedrono worries. even though it would be nice to allow also<packagename> redirection to search results page :)18:26
X-FadeOtherwise I will get complaints about https giving wrong certs etc ;)18:26
javispedro(like debian again)18:26
mgedminotoh I'd expect to have the same look & feel as packages.debian.org18:27
mgedminand provide the same features, e.g. search by file18:28
javispedrooh, current maemo interface is good :)18:28
mgedminyes, it is18:28
mgedminstyling is a bit broken in chromium18:28
X-FadeI first want the core to work as expected and then work on the making it friendly part ;)18:28
javispedrotimeless: also, mxr indexing fremantle sdk?18:29
JaffaX-Fade: Can't you just set to redirect and ignore the SSL cert issues? (And haven't we got a wildcard SSL cert by now?)18:29
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X-FadeJaffa: No, that would jus give me bug reports etc etc.18:29
mgedmin_http_:// has no SSL cert issues!18:29
X-FadeJaffa: Not doing that again ;)18:29
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X-Fademgedmin: yeah, but the cluster responds on https too.18:30
JaffaX-Fade: Trouble is, people are pushing people into being QA testers now so that there's lots of s/w in Extras for the N900 launch [not saying is that bad]18:30
JaffaX-Fade: Oh, and you can't have separate configs for HTTP & HTTPS? Bah.18:30
JaffaWildcard SSL FTW18:30
* Jaffa goes to find his plane.18:30
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X-FadeJaffa: Well, loadbalancer etc.. complicated issue. And we're about to move away from this setup anyway.18:30
JaffaX-Fade: What's the timescale?18:31
X-FadeWork starts in November18:31
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X-FadeSo things will get more complicated for a while while things are running in parallel ;)18:32
X-FadeBut if the move has been done, doing this should not be a big deal18:32
GeneralAntillespenguinbait, ping?18:32
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Anidelcongrats Stskeeps!18:34
AlienPenguinhello ppl, i am new at maemo devel, i just downloaded the virtualmachine containing the sdk, so i followed the instructions on the website and ran xephyr and the script start from the scratchbox environment, but i get lots of warnings and errors.18:34
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Texrathere I is18:35
XisdibikThere you are18:36
GeneralAntillespenguinbait, can you /quote nickserv register <password> ?18:36
* Texrat hears sound of trumpets blaring18:36
GeneralAntillesSame for you, Texrat.18:36
Texratwhen you say <password>, I insert one?18:36
TexratI'm such a newb at this18:36
lardmanmy word, hello Texrat18:36
Texratis it visible to everyone when I do so?18:36
GeneralAntillesTexrat, yes.18:36
Texrathey Lardy18:36
GeneralAntillesTexrat, not as long as you put /quote in front of it.18:37
GeneralAntillesYou can also open a new message window to nickserv if that makes you feel better.18:37
XisdibikTexrat, it wont be visible to anyone except nickserv which is fine as long as you send it how he did18:37
lardmanmake sure there's no spaces before the /18:37
Anidelit's a private chat between you and nickserv18:37
GeneralAntillesAnybody got a quick line to qole?18:37
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penguinbaitpenguinbait has now been verified18:38
TexratI guess the <> isn't included :D18:38
Anidelnope :)18:38
GeneralAntillespenguinbait, now you can set up your client to identify you to the server when you connect.18:38
TexratI blame senility18:38
vladovgangain the same problem18:38
GeneralAntillespenguinbait, that way nobody can steal your nick.18:38
GeneralAntilles /quote nickserv identify <password>18:38
vladovgattery indicator18:38
Texratthen I'll show up in lower case again and drive jaffa nuts18:39
Anidelthey can still do.. but for a minute.. until nickserv kicks them off18:39
vladovgdont move wen charging18:39
pupnikcan i probe voltage directly on battery with a multimeter to detect charge?18:39
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vladovghawe dis problem mont ago18:39
GeneralAntillesvladovg, sometimes the icon cache gets corrupted.18:39
pupnikif so, what voltage should i see on n900 batt18:39
GeneralAntillesvladovg, it's a cosmetic issue that should be fixable with a restart.18:39
lardmanprob not pupnik18:39
vladovgreflashed and now again18:39
Xisdibikits ok Texrat i blame Salinity18:39
SpeedEvilpupnik: es18:39
qwerty12_N810vladovg: become root, and run gtk-update-icon-cache -f /usr/share/icons/hicolor18:39
AnidelI need to find my old scripts for ircII, I live the terminal client much more than XChat18:39
Texratshit it ain't working for me, wtf18:39
qwerty12_N810vladovg: and then reboot18:39
GeneralAntillesTexrat, error of some sort?18:40
SpeedEvilpupnik: 4.2= fully charged, 3 = empty totally18:40
pupniklardman: might be confounded by battery circuitry?18:40
pupnikah ty SpeedEvil18:40
lardmanpupnik: the voltage should be reasonably independent of charge state until it gets to the end18:40
SpeedEvilpupnik: ~linear between 4.1V and 3.5V for 80 and 20%18:40
lardmanSpeedEvil: is it, oh right18:40
pupnikright so i should be able to tell a really dead battery - big thanks18:41
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TexratI r verified!18:43
qwerty12_N810Texrat: Good. Now I can kill you18:43
vladovgwork greath18:43
qwerty12_N810Cool :)18:44
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Anidel /kill cool. so cool18:44
javispedroBAN HIM! :)18:44
Texratjust try it qerty :p18:44
TexratI fear no fool18:44
qwerty12_N810Texrat: I have rat traps, and rat poison and... cheese18:44
Texratyou have my full attention18:44
Xisdibikeveryone knows that stuff doesnt work on texas rats18:44
Texratalthough peanut butter is better18:44
TexratI can only do this because my ^%$#&#!-ing boss is out today18:45
Texratman I need a new job18:45
Xisdibikthats a good thing not a bad thing Texrat18:45
solarionI want a new drug18:45
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Xisdibiku get paid to do nothing ;)18:45
Xisdibiksolarion, nutmeg18:45
solarionOne that won't make me sick18:45
solarionOr, as Weird Al said, I want a new duck.18:46
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AlienPenguinin my freemantle scratchbox (x86) the dir /usr/share/application/hildon-home is missing that is why the script fails... is there something else i am supposed to install?18:46
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javispedroAlienPenguin: nokia-binaries and nokia-apps?18:47
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AlienPenguinjavispedro, err... i supposed they were already installe din the virtual machine image18:47
javispedrodid you accept a Nokia EULA to download the virtual machine?18:48
AlienPenguinjavispedro, yes18:48
TexratXisdibik: what's a good thing?18:48
javispedrothen dunno. try verifying it's actually installed.18:48
AlienPenguinshould i use fakeroot before apt-get each time i use it in sbox?18:49
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: 0.2-7 is in the autobuilder with your problems fixed18:49
javispedroyep. else some packages' scripts can fail.18:49
qwerty12_N810Thank you18:49
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: No, thank *you*18:49
AlienPenguinjavis it wants to upgrade a bunch of things actually! :)18:49
javispedroupgrade? did you got sdk beta 2?18:50
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XisdibikTexrat, your boss not being there, so u have no work to do18:50
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AlienPenguinjavispedro, dunno, as i said i am new at maemo, i just downloaded the ubuntu virtualmachine with the sdk installed, it was dated oct 2009 i thought it was the latest one18:51
javispedroso, Ovi Files is a 10 GiB file storage Web service... requiring a Windows app for both uploading and downloading.18:51
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* fiferboy goes for coffee18:53
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TexratXisdibik: that's not how it works18:53
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Texratnot in my role18:53
TexratI am on lunch right now18:54
javispedroI see no Fremantle Final VM yet.18:54
lardmanwhat do I need flag-wise to make bt work properly in gdb?18:54
qwerty12_N810lardman: iamnotlardman18:54
lardmanqwerty12_N810: ah, so I shouldn't be using -notveryhelpfulqwerty then?18:55
javispedrolardman: -g -O018:55
lardmanthanks, will try that18:55
lardmandoes gcc default to optimisations other than -O0 by default?18:56
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javispedrolardman: it does not, but dpkg-buildpackage does18:57
lardmanhmm, didn't change things, still moaning about frames being identical18:57
javispedro(it sets CFLAGS to -O2 iirc)18:57
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lardmanI'm building by hand atm18:57
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lardmanlooks like I'm back to printfs18:58
javispedromaybe there's something really wrong. try setting a breakpoint somewhere before18:58
kirmathingie purchased in advance, sort of expecting N900 to need some extra charging:
kirmathe chinese say it's 2600 mAh (of chinese kind, I bet), and it costs 10 euros with shipping (some cables included, although not the microusb kind)18:59
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mgedminmy perception of the usability of the phone thingy on the n900 is constantly decreasing19:04
* Anidel nods to mgedmin19:05
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* kirma notes that he paid 22 cents for calls last month19:06
Anidelcool, flickr has been kind enough to teach me how to greet people in italian...19:06
* GeneralAntilles 's usage is limited to sending and receiving calls and SMS.19:06
SpeedEvilkirma: You people person you.19:06
* lardman paid nothing for calls, over and above his monthly subscription fee19:06
javispedrodon't worry. it will all be very quick. the n900 will be released, someone will say iphone killer (again), there will be a big public backslash over some stupid issue, like not having mms, some people will cancel their orders, some fanboys will start looking at the next symbian phone, and hopefully Maemo will go back to Internet tablets. >:)19:07
* mgedmin is usually under the mandatory "get XX minutes free" and so pays $0 for calls19:07
mgedminand $lots for car parking, smses and, especially, data19:07
kirmathe thing is that my phone contract doesn't have "free" anything19:08
Anideljavispedro: I actually wanted an Internet Tablet with a SIM slot for data. Nokia did a good move, for them, to put also GSM calls in it, but that meant smaller screen. :( so I got SIM data, but also smaller screen :/ fine...19:08
Anidelkirma; to make you happy, no contract has "free" anything ..19:09
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lcukGeneralAntilles, im sure your post had more than that when i looked before my shower19:09
GeneralAntilleslcuk, what post?19:09
lcukmap one19:09
ShadowJKkirma, looks way too small to fit a 3.7V 2600mAh battery19:09
kirmaanidel: just that the base price is like sixty cents per month... oh, I have unlimited data for 20 euros, but the calls cost from the first moment19:09
kirmaand still, 22 cents in a month ;)19:10
GeneralAntilleslcuk, nope, that's it.19:10
* lcuk is goin senile19:10
lcukhiya Anidel19:10
kirmashadowjk: yes, I'm suspicious too19:10
mgedminkirma: I pay a mandatory fixed charge that covers the "free" minutes19:10
* Texrat joins lcuk in senility19:10
ShadowJKkirma, I guess you about 4 minutes of calls19:10
Anidelhey lcuk19:10
mgedminwell, my company pays19:10
kirmabut it's cheap enough to just try.19:10
lcukTexrat, are 2 senile people talking better or worse?19:11
Anidelworse of course19:11
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lcuklol Anidel but how would they know19:12
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lcukto them, they would be having a great time19:12
* GAN900 typo fail.19:12
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Anidel"they", "them"? but it's you and textrat19:13
kirmatrying out the thing with E90 and this nokia usb-smallplug adapter. I get the feeling that voltage upconverter on the adapter eats most of the energy in the process ;)19:13
kirmahave to try also with direct cable19:13
ShadowJKyou've got two voltage converters there19:14
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* Texrat slaps Anidel with a large trout19:14
ShadowJKone in your "battery" and one in the usb-smallplug adapter (if you're using the official nokia one)19:14
* Anidel looks around looking for whoever just hit him.. mmmmmmm19:14
ShadowJKWith luck the battery puts out 5.6 or something instead of 5, and would work with a direct cable19:15
kirmashadowjk: and one is unnecessary. at least some charging occurs with just a direct cable19:15
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kirmaI'm mostly trying to figure out the limits of the battery19:15
* Anidel eats the trout19:15
kirmawithout actually starting precise experimentation19:15
* Anidel casts an evil spell on the trout's corpse19:16
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ShadowJKI have one of those 1xAA chargers.. it gives enough of a boost to my E75 for me to make it through a boring nightshift19:16
Anidelthis reminds me of MUD games .. Circle MUD.. ahhh funny times19:16
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* Anidel salutes qole19:17
qoleokay my nick is registered.19:17
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ShadowJKkirma, I've got two cheap external batteries too... Apart from the difference in battery and upconverter quality between the two "identical" batteries, the biggest issue on these cheapos seem to be the cables19:18
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ShadowJKunreliable cables and unreliable ports..19:18
kirmausb-a and miniusb-a on this one19:19
GeneralAntillesqole, thanks!19:20
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kirmashadowjk: just that one that I could assume to be even somewhat comparable with this one in local shop would be 30-50 euros, and this is 1019:21
ShadowJKI guess phillips is thee only thing you find in .fi19:21
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ShadowJKwhere did you buy it from btw?19:22
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kirmahmm, it recharged empty E90 in one hour with the converter. next, have to empty the battery and try again...19:23
ShadowJKthat would be impressive even if it really was 2000mAh :-)19:23
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kirmaone full recharge is enough for N900 I hope.19:24
lardmanhmm, crashing once it enters gtk_main()19:25
fiferboylardman: Are you using gtk_init() or hildon_inti()?19:26
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fiferboylardman: you have a link to the file?19:28
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AFBN900i thought problem with N900 filling up fast was fixed19:35
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Stskeepsif you add extras-devel i guess19:36
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AFBN900ones in devel are fixed or not19:37
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_Pete_How can I trikc n900 mediaplayer to seek medias from nfs-mounted dir?19:43
_Pete_now it only wants to play from mmcX19:43
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qole_Pete_, Make a playlist with full paths to your remote files, then load that into mediaplayer19:45
lardmanfiferboy: sorry for the delay, Tescos man just turned up19:46
fiferboylardman: No problem19:46
fiferboyHi qole!19:46
lardmanit's well printf'd :)19:46
_Pete_qole: how?19:46
lardmanhey qole, I've got some great videos of you singing  :)19:46
fiferboyqole: Me too!19:47
fiferboylardman: Which file?19:47
fiferboylardman: I've got some videos of you dancing :P19:47
qoleI would love to see them... but I would prefer that others did not (yet)19:47
lardman for the singing :)19:48
lardmanoh, perhaps too late for that.... :)19:48
qwerty12_N810qole: You were saying?19:48
qolefiferboy: post the dancing videos!19:49
lcukqole, open source media :P19:49
_Pete_qole: user~/.mafw-playlists ?19:49
lardmanfiferboy: s/-/_ you know I have troubles with underscores ;)19:49
lardmanqole: we were dancing too?!19:49
fiferboylardman: _you_ were dancing.  qole and I stayed out of it19:49
qoleI just made a textfile playlist in ~/MyDocs (forget which format, but .pls or something)19:50
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fiferboyOooh, I am singing too o_O19:51
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qoleI wish someone had video of the Jaaksi interview :(19:51
_Pete_qole: how is .pls format?19:51
lardmanthe guy behind the bar probably was too in the beginning, before he tried to get rid of us19:51
fiferboyThe guy in the other bar was hand whistling with us...19:52
tekonivelanyone remember those maemo UX-concept videos that circulated some time ago?19:52
lardmanI thought we were making like Owls?19:52
tekoniveli haven't been able to find them since19:52
lardmanOr was that for the wolf-whistle failures?19:52
fiferboylardman: I have a good video of that.  Everyone in the bar hand-whistling19:53
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qolelardman, fun videos, thanks.19:54
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qolei screwed up the words, oh well it was fun19:55
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lardmanwe were all pretty drunk by then, impressive we could still talk :) let alone sing19:55
qolelardman, i like how the camera starts to wiggle during Bohemian Rhapsody, you can tell the cameraman is headbanging too!19:56
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Texratqole I want to go drinking with you again :D19:57
lardmanoh yes :)19:57
fiferboylardman: I like the N900 battery drain race :)19:57
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lardmanah is that what it was, wasn't quite sure19:58
Texratbattery drain race... rofl;19:58
qolefiferboy shaking his head and doing a facepalm as I do my Prince imitation19:58
lardmanwhere is Samoff anyway, he should be here to receive some abuse19:58
fiferboyqole: lol, I haven't watched that one yet19:58
TexratI sent him a job listing but no response19:58
TexratNokia is looking for browser manager19:59
Texratlooks like he had the skills19:59
lardmanbbiab, cooking time19:59
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fiferboyqole: I look embarassed for you :)19:59
qolefiferboy, I was giving Canadians a bad name?20:00
* Texrat wonders what Mrs Qole thinks of the legends20:00
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fiferboyThat must have been it...20:00
Texratno qole you gave Greeks a bad name20:00
Texratthat head dress...20:00
TexratAdonis was spinning in his grave20:00
qoleMrs. Qole has, not surprisingly, seen me do similar things before, even when not drinking...20:01
Texratso has Mrs Texrat and it always comes out at holiday gatherings20:01
qolehead dress?20:01
Texrat"remember when you got so drunk on vodka you hung off a balcony at a party?"20:01
Texratyeah your flowers qole20:02
fiferboyI like Tim's funny walk toward the Dutch Road Sparker20:02
Texratmissed that20:02
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fiferboyYep, lardman's last video20:02
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qoleThe Skype flowers behind the ear was someone else's idea... Lbt maybe?20:04
qoleas was the text, "I was using these to keep track of how many drinks I've had, but I ran out of ears."20:05
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fiferboyqole: Yeah, that was lbt who said that (my idea though ;)20:06
fiferboyStskeeps had a flower in his beer, though20:06
qoleAh another great Canadian idea stolen without credit!20:07
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qoleargh, secure wlan connection silently drops, web auth connection silently starts, no indication that I'm offline except the green circle starts flashing with an X20:15
qoleam I online now?20:17
VDVsxqole, yes, lol20:17
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GeneralAntillesqole, /ping or ~ping. ;)20:17
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X-Fadehello .. hello... is this thing on? :)20:18
VDVsxhumm, we have OP's now :P20:18
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, no.20:18
qoleGeneralAntilles, thanks20:18
MeizirkkiGeneralAntilles, infobot seems to be slow today :P20:18
X-FadeHmm where did that come from..20:18
*** X-Fade sets mode: -o X-Fade20:18
GeneralAntillesMeizirkki, no, mostly dead.20:18
* GeneralAntilles runs!20:18
GeneralAntillesOr wait, escalates!20:19
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o GeneralAntilles20:19
* GeneralAntilles postures.20:19
X-Fadeugh ;)20:19
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qwerty12_N810OP WAR20:19
qolethe /ping command doesn't work20:19
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GeneralAntillesqole, what client?20:19
fiferboy~karma fiferboy20:19
GeneralAntillesinfobot's dead, so ~ping wont work either.20:19
qoleN900 xchat20:20
fiferboyOh no, I might have lost all the karma I accumulated!20:20
Meizirkki~lart infobot20:20
GeneralAntillesqole, it'll show up in the server tab.20:20
qolethis thing has tabs??!? But, but, ragnar said...20:20
GeneralAntillesqole, volume rocker switches them. :P20:20
_berto_i can't understand what's the criteria used by the media player to decide whether to use cover.jpg as the album cover20:21
* GeneralAntilles lost his belt somewhere in the ether.20:21
qoleah they are hiddenm buttons on the left, got it20:21
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GeneralAntillesqole, switch the tab location to the bottom.20:22
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lardmanhmm, my N900 just randomly phoned my parents20:22
lardmanI was holding it, waiting for the BT headset to get recognised, but no phone app in sight20:22
qwerty12_N810lardman: Its job is Connecting People, after all...20:23
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lardmanqwerty12_N810: yeah, I guess so :)20:23
qolebetter than phoning Nigeria.20:23
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lardmantrue, but I tend to make those expensive calls from work ;)20:23
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qolelardman, your N900 probably realised that it had been a long time since you called your Mom.20:24
GeneralAntillesSome photos from FLS if anybody's interested.
qwerty12_N810qole: Your SDK image rocks. I just produced a source package for something I've been working on, using the chroot...20:24
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qwerty12_N810qole: Mum20:24
lardmanqole: yeah, didn't realise that was a feature :)20:24
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AndrewFBlackany gone else have xchat crash on n900 when you try and put channel tabs on bottom of window20:25
qoleqwerty12_N810, no I'm not your Mum.20:25
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GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, no. :P
qwerty12_N810qole: Grr, imagine quotation marks were around that20:26
X-FadeAndrewFBlack: I don't know if I mailed you, but your feed has been added ;)20:26
AndrewFBlackX-Fade, thanks20:26
* GeneralAntilles wonders how the hell Hildon Desktop figure out which stuff to put in the top level of the applications menu.20:27
GeneralAntillesNone of the fields I've tried in the .desktop files seems to work.20:27
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GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, so, aside from the XChat crash, is it everything you dreamed of and more? ;)20:28
AndrewFBlackhmm xchat doesn't like my n90020:28
qwerty12_N810The latest build is buggy as fuck. Blame me.20:28
* RST38h blames qwerty20:29
AndrewFBlackwell everything is more then I dreamed of except I have filled my / partiion already accroding to it20:29
GeneralAntillesYeah, lot of stuff not optified.20:29
AndrewFBlackits ok I'll leave tabs where they are for now20:29
GeneralAntillesUnfortunately large libraries are the biggest culprit.20:29
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andre__some threads in t.m.o are so ridiculous that i should get a fake account to comment as a private person based on common sense, instead of a bugmaster20:30
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AndrewFBlackGeneralAntilles, keyboard is taking me some work to get used to20:30
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qwerty12_N810andre__: Make a new account in which you are rude and abusive as possible20:30
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, yeah, took me a while too.20:30
andre__qwerty12_N810, yeah. in progress20:30
GeneralAntillesandre__, I'm inclined towards reporting them and getting lardman to lock 'em.20:30
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AndrewFBlackAnyone know why konttori_ doesn't have Green Theme Maker Theme in extras?20:31
lardmanwhat's that?20:31
qoleso xchat crashes when trying to change the font.20:31
RST38handre: I suggest a more subtle approach20:31
SpeedEvilAndre: Alternatively, take the 'who will rid me of this meddlesome priest' approach. In that case, would we get karma?20:31
* Stskeeps yawns20:31
andre__GeneralAntilles, well, "ridiculous". not "insulting" :) but of course I agree in general...20:31
qolestuck with monotype i guess :(20:31
* lardman just skips the crap threads, perhaps he should pop his head in and threaten the wrath of lard?20:32
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qwerty12_N810lardman: I love it when you get all poetical20:32
RST38hWe should drive lemmings to insanity by feeding them obviously ridiculous, fake information20:32
AndrewFBlackI got a big speech from att saying that unlocked phone are not the best and that my data might not work and blah blah blah20:33
RST38hN900 for e666, Maemo6 based on WinMo 7.0, etc20:33
GeneralAntilleslardman, ton of dupe threads.20:33
GeneralAntillesNeed merging.20:33
lardmanRST38h: the cliff option works for me20:33
lardmanI don't know how to do that20:33
qwerty12_N810read: "I don't wanna do it"20:34
RST38hAndrewFBlack: "I understand the risk. Please, let me use my unlocked phone and fuck off like... NOW."20:34
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, when did they give you that?20:34
lardmanqwerty12_N810: I'll just one touch clean and ban everyone in a thread I think is repetitious :)20:34
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LinuxCodeAndrewFBlack, they seem quite eager to sell you a contract, obviously20:34
LinuxCodewith a locked phone20:34
AndrewFBlackGeneralAntilles, yesterday when I called in to drop my 30 a month iphone data and get 10 a month regular data plan20:35
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, interesting.20:35
AndrewFBlackI could have just been the person I talked to not the company saying it really20:36
fiferboyGeneralAntilles: Oh good, you got a screenshot of me complaining aboot my IRC karma...20:36
SpeedEvilThey have scripts for '_Everything_'.20:37
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SpeedEvil'Help - aliens stole my phone!' 'Did you ask if they need cellular service when on earth?'20:37
GeneralAntillesfiferboy, you never know when you'll be on GeneralAntilles' photostream of shame. :P20:37
GeneralAntillesOh, lardman, that reminds me.20:38
X-FadeI feel the power pain already ;)20:38
* VDVsx wonders about get a TMO troll account also :P20:38
GeneralAntillesWhen my mother got her new 3GS20:38
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GeneralAntilleswe were testing out the voice control feature20:38
GeneralAntillesshe was trying to get it to play/pause the music and it wasn't cooperating20:38
GeneralAntillesShe muttered something about it being an asshole under her breath when it started playing Dave Matthews for the 3rd time and it called my sister's orthodontist (who really is an asshole).20:39
GeneralAntillesVDVsx, what, you don't have one already?20:39
GeneralAntillesThey were all the rage back during the Talk transition.20:40
fiferboyGeneralAntilles: My old flip phone had voice dial and I told it to "Call Erin"20:40
VDVsxGeneralAntilles, no :´´)20:40
fiferboyMy phone asked me "Did you say 'Sex Dentist'?"20:40
lardmanGeneralAntilles: lol20:40
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AndrewFBlackDang I almost look like i know what I'm talking about
GeneralAntillesfiferboy, lol.20:40
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, this is my favorite:
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* SpeedEvil passes AndrewFBlack a traffic cone to wear to avoid that problem.20:41
AndrewFBlackGeneralAntilles, I have no idea what 'mtalking about there20:41
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GeneralAntillesOh, Stskeeps, ping?20:42
fiferboyThe weird thing was, I was going to call my sex dentist AFTER I called my wife...20:42
fiferboyThat is going to end up on GeneralAntilles photostream of shame, isn't it? :(20:43
GeneralAntillesfiferboy, no, I'm just emailing this one to your in-laws. :P20:44
AndrewFBlackI'm going to build my hello kitty theme tonight for the 3 15 year old girls that will buy the N90020:44
GeneralAntillesHELL YES!20:44
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qoleSex Dentist: giving "vagina dentata" new meaning.20:45
fiferboyqole: Tell them it is a common Canadian occupation...20:45
lardmanAndrewFBlack: slightly worried about the timing of your 15 year old girls statement there20:45
AndrewFBlackGeneralAntilles, btw my tablet came in a bag also no nice box to open20:45
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GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, too bad.20:46
qoleheh, wikipedia has an entry for that...20:46
* timeless_mbp goes fishing for testers20:46
fiferboyDoes the iPhone have an app for that?20:46
AndrewFBlacklardman lol sex denist is not realated to 15 year old girls20:46
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AndrewFBlackis it just me or does tmo look better on n900 then on n81020:47
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lardmanmust be my mind then20:47
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konttori_AndrewFBlack: what green theme maker?20:49
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AndrewFBlackkonttori_, template that comes with theme maker20:49
jubileumiHow can I make a shortcut on maemo 5 desktop that links to shell script?20:50
konttori_well, that's not green20:50
AndrewFBlackwhat color is it20:50
konttori_omFG? did I store that png with the overlay from the psd?20:50
fiferboyjubileumi: Right now you would have to make a .desktop file for it in /usr/share/applications/hildon20:50
konttori_I mean, on psd there is the overlay that is greennish20:50
AndrewFBlackyou might have20:50
konttori_and of course you want to disable it before making png file20:50
AndrewFBlackI have the svg also and I think its green20:50
konttori_oh damn.20:50
jubileumififerboy: thanks. I'll google more on that.20:51
AndrewFBlackkonttori_, one sec maybe I'm crasy i'll look again20:51
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konttori_you mean black main color, with some green?20:51
AndrewFBlackyeah black main color but green highlights20:51
AndrewFBlackits the theme FreDiablo is based off of20:51
timeless_mbpAndrewFBlack: did your n900 arrive ?20:51
GeneralAntillesThat's your new avatar. :P20:52
qoleah, i can edit .xchat2/xchat.conf directly and fix my fonts.20:52
AndrewFBlackbrb work20:52
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qolewe need a Fremantle version of Echowb for apps like xchat.20:53
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konttori_by the way, xchat sucks the battery like almost no other, at least if you are on 3g.20:57
RST38hweird. it is not the traffic for sure.20:58
RST38hmust be some timers that do not let the tablet sleep20:58
konttori_nope. there is that for every packet that the device has to send, the 3g connection must be kept at full strength for a (operator defined) period of time. In finland, on my operator that time is 1 minute.20:59
konttori_so, I guess that is the reason, but ... anyway, not so nice20:59
RST38hAh, makes sense20:59
RST38hBut then this is gonna be true for Skype and other messaging services as well, isn't it?20:59
glasswell, maybe xchat wouldn't suck power if you were just on channels with no chatter21:00
ShadowJKkonttori_, what operator?21:00
ShadowJKsucks :/21:01
konttori_sonera has it at 30 seconds21:01
ShadowJKdo you know about dna?21:01
konttori_also, funnily enough elisa doesn't have any firewall.21:01
konttori_so, I get pings and port scans like all the time to the device21:01
ShadowJKI think port 25 is firewalled21:01
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ShadowJKon both  DNA and Elisa (well, saunalahti..) I sometimes get the IP of someone who's been running edonkey (server or client, I guess), and get a steady stream of 100 - 400 bytes/sec of UDP noise :)21:02
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X-FadeImagine that happening on your data roaming connection. ;)21:03
* RST38h managed to get 3G reception at some coffee house this Sunday, it confused the hell out of N90021:03
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RST38hCould connect any incoming phone calls21:04
ShadowJKIt's sad that such issues still haven't been resolved :/21:04
RST38hNot blaming N900.21:04
ShadowJKIt's still in ping-pong between operators blaming the handset manufacturers and the handset manufacturers blaming the operators for misconfigured networks :-(21:05
RST38h3G network here is still highly experimental and only allowed inside some buildings21:05
RST38hIf this continues a year from now, I would worry though21:05
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ShadowJKAlthough I guess the problems have atleast been solved to some degree, I no longer see queues outside operator helpdesks in supermarkets21:06
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RST38hthat is because people stopped hoping for a solution =)21:07
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XisdibikRST38h, you just gave me a great idea       2 people 2 n900's  Bluetooth 3D glasses.   Virtual 3D ping pong with N900 paddles :O21:07
ShadowJKthere was this IPv6 conference thingy at google or something, before google was wideley accepted as being evil, and Nokia was there too and iirc quoted some figure for how long the average operator's broken NAT/firewalls will remember your TCP session21:07
Xisdibikwait no ShadowJK gaveme the idea21:07
ShadowJKiirc it was 10 seconds or something silly like that21:07
Xisdibiksorry :)21:08
ShadowJKmaybe worse case not average case :)21:08
wazdGeneralAntilles: hmm?21:08
RST38hXisdibik: talk to lcuk ;)21:08
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ShadowJKxchat does send periodic ping, but that can be disabled... then there's the server sending pings every 60 - 300 seconds depending on the server's configuration... I guess that can be mitigated with a bouncer in between though21:09
GeneralAntilleswazd, Hello Kitty. ;)21:09
ShadowJKIF your tcp sessions aren't killed by overzealous ISP though :)21:09
wazdGeneralAntilles: hey there, sweetheart :D21:10
RST38hHEADS UP: I have just committed the new versions of fMSX, Speccy, and AlmostTI to Extras-Devel21:10
ali1234ShadowJK: most SOHO routers have the opposite problem, they remember TCP connections for several DAYS after they have been closed and subsequently overflow the connection tables21:10
RST38hSo, go take a look =)21:11
wazdRST38h: you're a monster :)21:11
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RST38hwazd: Me? Ok, bring the gold and the virgins!21:11
wazdRST38h: dragon != monster :)21:11
ShadowJKali1234, there's that too :)21:11
RST38hYou mean, I can't have gold and virgins? =)21:11
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AndrewFBlacktimeless, yes I got it lat night21:18
AndrewFBlackkonttori_, Did you say why Black/Green theme isn't on Extras?21:19
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fiferboyhi infobot!21:28
fiferboy~infobot: hi21:28
infobothello, fiferboy21:28
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qwerty12_N810fiferboy: Sorry, you don't get karma by saying hi21:29
lcukXisdibik, bluetooth glasses?21:29
fiferboyqwerty12_N810: I was just happy to see infobot operational21:30
fiferboy~karma fiferboy21:30
infobotfiferboy has karma of 221:30
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skiburpidgin update what happen to the send button?21:30
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lardmanfiferboy: spot any obvious errors in that code?21:33
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luke-jr~karma fiferboy21:33
infobotfiferboy has karma of 221:33
fiferboyluke-jr: You can't karma sap me!21:33
fiferboylardman: Not really.  I will check against some of my apps to see if there are any differences in the gtk_main process21:33
fiferboylardman: The segfault happens after 8?21:34
Xisdibiklcuk, Bluetooth Virtual Reality Glasses/goggles/mask whatever you wanna call it :)21:34
luke-jr~karma luke-jr21:34
infobotluke-jr has karma of -121:34
lcukdoes BT support wireless video?21:34
lardmanyeah, and visible_func() runs through twice too21:35
luke-jr~karma qwerty1221:35
infobotqwerty12 has neutral karma21:35
luke-jr~karma qwerty1221:35
infobotqwerty12 has karma of -121:35
luke-jr~karma qwerty1221:35
infobotqwerty12 has karma of -121:35
skiburpidgin send button missing21:36
X-Fadeskibur: isn't there a pidgin plug in for that now?21:36
RST38hHere is a requirement. Please send me your updated resume along with21:36
lcuk~karma qwerty12_N81021:36
infobotqwerty12_n810 has neutral karma21:36
RST38hrate, contact details (both number and e-mail), availability period, bla bla bla21:36
skiburfor real21:36
fiferboylardman: I will check for you in a little bit.  Don't tell le coq, but I am compiling Qt...21:36
Xisdibiklcuk, i was just joking really, since i doubt that would be economical :)21:36
* RST38h likes this direct approach. 21:36
RST38hThe guy does not know me, I do not know the guy, but here is a requirement indeed...21:37
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GeneralAntillestekojo, ping?21:37
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X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Busy playing with his beagle board I think ;)21:37
derfI hope he actually said, "bla bla bla".21:37
RST38hderf: well, he went like that for another few lines21:37
tekojoGeneralAntilles pong21:37
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tekojoX-Fade close, but not quite, busy making the images :-)21:38
RST38hderf: Network Technician, 6-month contract in SC21:38
X-Fadetekojo: Ah ;)21:38
lardmanfiferboy: QT! No!......21:38
tekojodecided I should do it myself from scratch...21:38
fiferboylardman: Don't panic, it has been building for 3 hours, so it is almost done21:38
lardmanonly 3 hrs, not so bad then :)21:38
jubileumififerboy: Finally got time to try that .desktop file. I cloned one desktop file as irssi.desktop, but it seems it still cannot lauch a shell script. Do I need to use some special osso or mime type?21:38
RST38hAt least it is not a janitor...21:39
AndrewFBlackdoes application manger not have option to install from file anymore?21:39
fiferboyjubileumi: Do you want the script to run in a terminal?21:39
luke-jrfiferboy: qt-webkit won't link on 128 MB RAM21:39
fiferboyjubileumi: There is a flag for that.  Should be in the desktop file specification21:39
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, nope, use dpkg -i21:39
pupniki want a searchable website where guys describe their ex girlfriends, like a reverse resume search21:39
fiferboyluke-jr: It links fine in scratchbox for i38621:39
fiferboyarmel in scratchbox, on the other hand...21:40
jubileumififerboy: humm.. Let's google again..21:40
X-Fadepupnik: Bad experience?21:40
RST38hpupnik: really think you will find out anything new?21:40
luke-jrfiferboy: with 128 MB RAM?21:40
AndrewFBlackGeneralAntilles, we need that back : (21:40
pupniki think i could find a woman i love who annoys another dude21:40
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, no we don't.21:40
AndrewFBlackok I need that back I'm lazy21:40
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, there's an application installer package that will do it for you if you really need a GUI.21:40
GeneralAntillesAndrewFBlack, we're trying to make installing random .debs from the internet difficult. ;)21:41
jubileumififerboy: I just made a script that it automaticly changes some locales and makes ssh con to my server and opens screened irssi.21:41
AndrewFBlackbut I like random debs21:41
GeneralAntillesThen use dpkg. :P21:41
GeneralAntillesIt's faster anyway.21:41
lcukneeds root21:41
fiferboyluke-jr: With 405 MB of RAM21:41
lcukdoesnt it21:42
luke-jrfiferboy: big difference21:42
GeneralAntilleswget <url> && dpkg21:42
GeneralAntilles-i <package>21:42
fiferboyI never said I was using 128 MB21:42
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luke-jrfiferboy: nor Scratchbox, so I assumed you were building on N81021:42
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fiferboyI said scratchbox.  But I wouldn't attemp to build it on device! :)21:43
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luke-jrfiferboy: KDE libs builds fine :)21:44
luke-jrand links21:44
fiferboyOn device?!21:44
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fiferboylardman: Nothing is jumping out at me...21:48
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AndrewFBlackwow hitech theme looks good21:49
RST38hwhere? =)21:49
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lardmanfiferboy: yeah, I may just send it to the list and see what the abook experts think21:51
fiferboylardman: If you comment out all the abook stuff before gtk_main does it still segfault?21:52
fiferboyIt could just be application setup.  I realize I haven't written a hildon/gtk application for maemo521:52
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lardmanosso_abook_filter_model_set_visible_func(filter_model, visible_func, NULL, NULL); is the line that causes the later segfault21:52
fiferboydesktop widgets have initialization handled differently21:53
lardmanbut the visible_func() fn is called twice successfully, and it doesn't seem to segfault in that fn either21:53
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fiferboylardman: What printf is displayed before that segfault?21:54
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lardmanvisible_fun() not visible.21:55
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lardman(am just trying to find the > key to save the output)21:55
ablack_to funny I was trying to ssh into my into n900 I forgot my n810 was in the bag and connected to wrong device I was like what hte heck21:55
fiferboylardman: Hmm, that looks like it is segfaulting after coming out of the visible_func21:56
lardmanyeah, segfaulting somewhere in the gtk_main loop21:56
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lardmanhmm, can't seem to direct the output to file....21:58
fiferboyAh, I see now21:58
lardman./test_abook > output.txt produces empty file21:58
lardman./test_abook 2> output.txt produces "Segmentation fault"21:58
lardman./test_abook &> output.txt produces empty file21:59
lcuklardman, once you start threading the normal rules stop applying22:00
lardmancan I copy from the term?22:00
fiferboyVery strange.  printf output should be on stdout22:01
lardmaneven more strange, ./test_abook > output.txt doesn't show the normal output (as you'd expect it to go to the file)22:01
lardmanlcuk: not threading, or rather not threading any more than the standard gtk main loop does22:02
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lcukgulp then22:02
fiferboylardman: why do you call g_thread_init?22:02
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lardmanwas in the example code22:03
fiferboyHmm, strictly speaking I don't think you need it (I could be wrong though)22:03
lardmanyeah I think you're right22:03
lardmanthat part is shared between all the examples22:04
lardmanwas shared, before I pulled it into my code22:04
lardmanbut it should do no harm afaiu22:04
* lcuk beds22:05
lcuklong day tomorrow22:05
lcukcyas later \o22:05
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lardmannight lcuk22:06
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lardman output there22:07
Firebirdwoa, posts in off-topic don't count as posts?22:07
lardmantyped by hand, as still no clue why redirection doesn't work22:07
lardmananyway bbl, need to boot Windows and do some dayjob work22:08
lardmanfiferboy: thanks for looking :)22:09
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jubileumififerboy: I found a dirt pile.. Seems that it ain't so easy to launch sh through .desktop file. I'm not the only one:
fiferboyjubileumi: Maybe I should build personal-launcher for fremantle :)22:14
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, maybe reference the vim .desktop?22:14
jubileumiI only get a blank screen although terminal is true and exec is the shell script22:14
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qwerty12_N810jubileumi: Can you pastebin your desktop file?22:14
jubileumium.. wait a sec..22:15
qwerty12_N810jubileumi: The Terminal option is ignored under Maemo22:15
jubileumiI had epic typo! :DDD22:17
jubileumilet's try few more times..22:17
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jubileumiSam without typos..22:22
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jubileumiIrssi "app" is starting and there's this progress icon only scrolling.. :(22:24
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jubileumigot it working22:26
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johnsqi just start a terminal and type irrsi.22:26
jubileumiexec=/usr/bin/osso-xterm /home/user/irssiin.sh22:26
jubileumiwell I always had to change locale before connection.22:27
Andy80hi all22:27
jubileumiAnd now I have this fancy icon to use. :)22:27
jubileumiThanks guys for helping maemo n00b..22:27
qwerty12_N900Hiya, Andy8022:28
wazdI have a nice lockscreen idea :)22:28
johnsqjubileumi: you can move the osso-xterm into the script22:28
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qwerty12_N900jubileumi: I promise I was just gonna say to do that :)22:28
wazdwith all beeps and stuff :)22:28
jubileumiqwerty12_N900: yeah right.. :DD22:28
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timeless_mbpqwerty12_N900: so, is someone poking zenity? :)22:29
qwerty12_N900I just got it working :p22:29
timeless_mbpas in fingerable?22:29
johnsqwazd: 99% of the passwords are 1234567822:30
qwerty12_N900Remind me tomorrow :)22:30
wazdjohnsq: well, it's cool looking anyway :)22:30
jubileumiHate that the new keylock switch on n900 , because it ain't working correctly :(22:31
wazdsome sliding doors with keypad in the center :)22:31
jubileumiI was meaning the mechanical switch o.o22:31
jubileumiSometimes you need to yank it twice :/22:32
* lbt thinks 'yank' may be relevant22:32
lbttry 'caress'22:32
jubileumiBut it's obvious bug22:33
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jubileumiI only thought that symbian guys could do that type of flaw.. :DD22:33
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jubileumisorry for flaming, but i've seen these things too closely. Without really getting my hands dirty.22:35
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hcarregastatus on sales in europe?22:37
hcarreganovember 2?22:37
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SpeedEvilI vote for november 27.22:37
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hcarregaexpansys and fnac online in my country predicts november 222:38
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SpeedEvilSo wait a week22:38
SpeedEviland see if htey're right.22:39
hcarreganothing more i can do22:39
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hcarregaand if not i go to fnac and shit on door:)22:39
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, works great here.22:40
qwerty12_N900timeless_mbp: BTW, is having the Control Panel applet, for the strings, working a planned feature? :p22:42
timeless_mbpi'd like to, yes22:42
timeless_mbpbut someone needs to give me a bsd-ish launcher link host22:43
timeless_mbpfwiw, i'll be in next week22:43
timeless_mbpso not much will happen on my side there22:43
timeless_mbpi did start working on that launcher code, but i can't remember what happened to it22:44
GeneralAntillesPing anybody with > 500 karma who wants a cloak?22:44
timeless_mbpGeneralAntilles: how do i apply a cloak?22:44
qwerty12_N900GeneralAntilles: Me! Me! Me! (Please :))22:44
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qwerty12_N900timeless: Do you have the code for your current one available anywhere?22:44
timeless_mbplemme look22:45
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, good with /Maemo/community/contributor/timeless?22:45
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, X-Fade has to send a list to somebody at Freenode.22:45
GeneralAntillesJust collecting yes/nos from people for now.22:46
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timeless_mbpoh wait22:47
timeless_mbpi have to actively maintain my nickserv username/password?22:47
timeless_mbpthat'll suck22:47
* timeless_mbp doesn't know how cloaks work22:47
GeneralAntillesJust setup your client to autologin?22:47
GeneralAntillesIt replaces your hostmask22:48
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GeneralAntillesassuming you're identified with nickserv22:48
timeless_mbpyeah um... i've never really setup nickserv in my irc clients :)22:48
* timeless_mbp is old fashioned22:48
timeless_mbpnickserv is too new for me :)22:48
jubileumiGeneralAntilles: Wait that screen goes blank and caress the switch just after it.. For me the screen stays blank unles I YANK again. :)22:48
GeneralAntillesWell, it's pretty easy to do. :P22:48
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, weird.22:48
timeless_mbpqwerty12_N900: yes, i have sources22:48
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, nickserv has been around since, like the 90s.22:49
jubileumiand running 42-922:49
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timeless_mbpwell, i started irc'ing in roughly 9822:49
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, ah, 41-10 here.22:49
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jubileumiBut earlier I used this with some really old sw and it didn't have this "feature"22:50
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qwerty12_N900timeless_mbp: Give me the source for the CPA and I'll make it launch zenity. Any additions I do can be licensed under whatever22:50
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, probably it's blank -> lock -> unlock.22:50
qwerty12_N900Got it22:50
GeneralAntillesJust tap the screen instead.22:50
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jubileumiGeneralAntilles: NOT!22:51
timeless_mbpqwerty12_N900: ideally one could build it w/ -D LOCALE=enus22:51
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, hum?22:51
timeless_mbpqwerty12_N900: there's a major build error in the code22:51
timeless_mbpwe fixed it on another computer, but i didn't copy it back22:51
timeless_mbplemme find the magic for that22:51
jubileumiGeneralAntilles: how can I tell has it already locked or is it just blanked?22:51
GeneralAntillesjubileumi, depends on your autolock setting, I think.22:52
X-Fadejubileumi: if keyboard is in, it is always locked?22:52
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jubileumiWell that is the thing that this kind of switch should always lid the screen22:52
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GeneralAntillesAlternatively, I think you could just use the keyboard to unlock.22:52
jubileumiso maybe I just but all the timeouts to same value.22:53
timeless_mbpqwerty12_N900: reload the url22:53
hcarrega2 days22:54
qwerty12_N900timeless: got it :)22:54
X-Fadehcarrega: You don't have to actively poll for release dates. I'm sure you will know when it is available. ;)22:54
GeneralAntillesAh, Cap'n Corrupt picks the Droid.22:55
jubileumiyep.. You just go for a walk and suddenly notive tat everyone is carrying n900. :D22:55
jubileumi* notice22:55
* Mousey still harbors doubts about right handed space bar22:56
X-Fademillenomi: Got used to that in 30 secs or so..22:56
jubileumifor me it's goood22:56
timeless_mbpjubileumi: where are you walking?22:56
GeneralAntillesMousey, do you have trouble typing with your left thumb?22:56
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Mouseynot particularily22:56
Mouseyi do more of that than with my right thumb22:57
GeneralAntillesWell, why should the spacebar be any different?22:57
GeneralAntillesReverse that.22:57
Mouseybecause its farther from my left thumb22:57
X-FadeMousey: You can reach it with your left thumb.22:57
* GeneralAntilles is doing too much multitasking.22:57
jubileumitimeless_mbp: it was a reply for that poll for release dates.22:57
X-FadeMousey: If you really want to ;)22:57
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* Mousey still wonders22:58
timeless_mbphcarrega: 5 working days, they probably aren't currently working :)22:58
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hcarregai will wait22:59
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lbtwazd: ping23:06
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Proteousthe 2.0 update for my n97 thankfully addressed the one problem that annoyed me most23:09
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Proteousthe lock/unlock funtionality was always sorta sketchy23:10
Proteousnow it is rock solid23:10
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Proteousand they disabled the camera and zoom buttons from activiating the "THis phones is locked" dialog from poping up and activating the screen23:10
ProteousI always managed to hit one of thsoe buttons when taking the phone out of my picket23:10
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wazdlbt: pong :)23:11
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Proteousnow if they had only made the browsers 10 times faster it would almost be as good as a n900...23:12
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lbtwazd: msg23:13
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wazdlbt: sorry, I have weird msg system, please write again now)23:19
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GeneralAntillesMissed the BoC23:22
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* GeneralAntilles is really tired of the Droid commercials.23:30
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lbtJaffa: elena made some more comments today23:31
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lbtX-Fade: are we supposed to get email notifications for wiki edits on watched pages?23:33
X-Fadelbt: only once23:33
X-Fadelbt: until you visit the page again.23:34
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timeless_mbpqwerty12_N810: did that file compile?23:40
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qwerty12_N810timeless_mbp: Haven't tried, as I'm on a tablet23:41
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fiferboyN900 at the dinner table \o/23:42
Stskeepsfiferwife killing you yet?23:43
TomaszDanyone knows how to use tab autocompletion in xchat on the n900?23:43
qwerty12_N810fiferwife angry!23:43
lbtfiferboy: you bought her one?23:43
fiferboyfiferwife is done dinner :)23:43
GeneralAntillesTomaszD, figure out a way to bind tab to a key.23:44
qwerty12_N810GeneralAntilles: Oh, did I tell you? The N900 doesn't even read that rx-51 keymap file23:44
Andy80TomaszD: ehm... where is xchat on N900 ?23:44
TomaszDI don't even remember which repo I got it from23:45
TomaszDbut I do have it23:45
qwerty12_N810GeneralAntilles: ATM, my N900 is running with that file deleted and all the keys in a working state...23:45
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GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, yeah, that's the conclusion I came to.23:45
uhsfwhat does xchat have over pidgin?23:45
GeneralAntillesIt's getting its info from HAL, I assume23:45
GeneralAntillesbut I don't know where HAL gets the keymap.23:45
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GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, anybody you could poke internally? My pleas to the list went unheaded.23:46
infobotGeneralAntilles meant: timeless_mbp, anybody you could poke internally? My pleas to the list went unheeded.23:46
timeless_mbpabout which?23:46
GeneralAntillesHow to remap keys in Maemo 5.23:46
* timeless_mbp ponders23:46
GeneralAntillesThe xkb symbols files don't do anything.23:46
timeless_mbpis that an x11 thing?23:46
GeneralAntillesxmodmap just breaks stuff23:46
GeneralAntillesI think the binding is in HAL now23:46
GeneralAntillesbut I don't know where that would be.23:47
timeless_mbpso... the x11 side of things is a public guy23:47
GeneralAntillesDaniel still?23:47
timeless_mbpdaniel stone23:47
timeless_mbphe's no longer with us directly23:47
timeless_mbpbut he's still working on it23:47
timeless_mbpso if it has anything to do w/ x11, you can try contacting him23:48
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GeneralAntillesSupposedly he reads the lists23:48
GeneralAntillessince he often replies there, but he hasn't replied so far, unfortunately.23:48
timeless_mbpi have no idea who does hal23:48
timeless_mbpis there a listed maintainer?23:49
GeneralAntillesGuillem Jover23:49
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ifreq Applications communicate with HAL through the D-Bus IPC mechanism, which abstracts the hardware behind an object-based RPC mechanism.23:52
ifreqEach logical hardware device is represented as a D-Bus object, and its bus address is used as a unique identifier. Devices include abstractions like disk partitions and visible wireless networks. The device's functionality is exposed through D-Bus interfaces, and its state accessed through properties, a set of key-value pairs.23:52
ifreqthats how it works23:52
ifreqsorry for huge paste.23:52
ifreqon normal leenox: hal-setup-keymap binary that is necessary for the multimedia key re-mapping support.23:54
ifreqi mean on normal platform ie x64 or x8623:54
qwerty12_N810fiferboy: "Select color" in HeColorDialog should be "Select Colour" if the locale is en_GB (Mind, it should be that too if the locale is en_US, but that's another story...)23:54
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* timeless_mbp slaps qwerty12_N810 23:57
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