| EspadaV8_N900 | hmmm crash | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| Shapeshifter | Has anyone who got an n900 tried putting on some screen protector? From past experience, does anyone have a clue how a screen protector would affect the touch screen? | 00:01 |
| EspadaV8_N900 | shouldn't make a difference | 00:01 |
| EspadaV8_N900 | but no, i didn't try | 00:02 |
| Shapeshifter | I wonder if these inivisble shield kinda covers are any good... | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, my Boxwave anti-glare had no effect on my tablets. | 00:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I recommend Boxwave, personally. | 00:04 |
| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: okay. | 00:04 |
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| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: gizmo does video as well on the n900? | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, no Gizmo client yet. | 00:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Built-in client doesn't do video so far. | 00:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think it may be coming later. | 00:08 |
| tbf | where do i file bugs about bounce? | 00:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | tbf, good question. | 00:09 |
| tbf | it's not kid compatible yet, 'cause they touch the screen with their thumbs too easily | 00:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre__! :P | 00:09 |
| Ceron^ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh6oGwOMVeY | 00:09 |
| tbf | so probably some border on left and right should be insensitive | 00:10 |
| sheepbat | I have an invisibleshield on my ATT Tilt, Shapeshifter | 00:12 |
| sheepbat | it's not exactly as scratch resistant as they say | 00:12 |
| sheepbat | and I actually wouldn't recommend it as a screen protector | 00:12 |
| sheepbat | it's very grippy, which is nice for the outside surfaces | 00:12 |
| sheepbat | but it's bad if you actually want to slide around on a surface, like on a screen | 00:12 |
| Shapeshifter | jkk seems to be a bit... uhm... dumb? | 00:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Personally I like to go to dealextreme - and pick up 4 or 5 protectors for the display cheap | 00:13 |
| SpeedEvil | and just swap them | 00:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Idiot | 00:13 |
| Shapeshifter | >.> I mean seriously, complaining about not being able to change things as a noob - well, of course you can't. but you can't change things on a closed system _at all_ | 00:14 |
| frals | he's not understanding the usage of *open* | 00:15 |
| Shapeshifter | *rolleyes | 00:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | No kidding, he's clueless. | 00:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | and I find it rather offensive that he's impinging my willingness to help newbies. | 00:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | When I've spent hundreds of hours doing so. | 00:16 |
| Shapeshifter | yeah | 00:16 |
| frals | and if you are not willing to even try to learn something new, the old familiar winmo is obviously gonna be easier for you | 00:16 |
| Shapeshifter | the n900 is about 60% of the price of a 3gs >.> at least here. | 00:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Well, at least I learned that JKKMobile is clueless. ;) | 00:19 |
| Shapeshifter | ack | 00:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, ping? | 00:19 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Yep? | 00:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, where do I drop the .pk3s? | 00:20 |
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| andre__ | tbf, Bounce is nothing official | 00:20 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: /home/user/baseq3 | 00:20 |
| tbf | andre__: i know. that's why i have to ask ;-) | 00:20 |
| andre__ | but not me.... | 00:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: But you may wanna symlink the pk3s from MyDocs into there instead... | 00:21 |
| andre__ | maintainer address of package :-P | 00:21 |
| tbf | andre__: i just asked lazychat, the general fingered you ;-) | 00:22 |
| Shapeshifter | what a windows fanboi. | 00:22 |
| andre__ | hehe | 00:22 |
| timeless_mbp | andre__: we really should support accepting bugs | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | I like him laughing when I mentioned open. | 00:23 |
| timeless_mbp | and he's right, bounce did have that problem | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's Navicore all over again, andre__. | 00:23 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: btw, navicore is better than nokia maps :) | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, yes, so I've noticed. | 00:23 |
| timeless_mbp | but oddly | 00:24 |
| javispedro | sigh then. | 00:24 |
| timeless_mbp | they agreed to fix some of my strings :) | 00:24 |
| timeless_mbp | "Ok" will not be written as such :) | 00:24 |
| timeless_mbp | (one small victory) | 00:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | yerga: Wow, nice job with the Fremantle version of StockThis! | 00:24 |
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| andre__ | yeah, it's sweet | 00:25 |
| tbf | hmm. the fremantle port of maemo mapper is not in -devel yet :-/ | 00:26 |
| timeless_mbp | so... | 00:27 |
| timeless_mbp | speaking of Ovi Store | 00:27 |
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| timeless_mbp | if you go to store.ovi.com | 00:27 |
| suihkulokki | don't speak of the devil | 00:27 |
| timeless_mbp | you'll find that we don't translate "Store" in French or German | 00:27 |
| tbf | suihkulokki: he's just behind you | 00:27 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone want to bet whether we do in the n900? | 00:27 |
| tbf | timeless_mbp: it will become "ovi Lager" for sure | 00:28 |
| range | What? | 00:28 |
| andre__ | harhar | 00:29 |
| range | laden.ovi.com? | 00:29 |
| Stskeeps | i thought it was ovi aldi or something :P | 00:29 |
| andre__ | "Ovi Kolonialwarenhandel" | 00:29 |
| tbf | range: you overestimate the german language team | 00:29 |
| range | Stskeeps: Haha. | 00:30 |
| Ceron^ | so when can i go buy n900 | 00:30 |
| SpeedEvil | Ceron^: now | 00:30 |
| Ceron^ | ;___; | 00:30 |
| Shapeshifter | range: you can download binaries at bin.laden.ovi.de | 00:30 |
| frals | :D | 00:30 |
| Shapeshifter | binaries for DESTRUCTION :D | 00:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | rofl | 00:30 |
| timeless_mbp | interesting | 00:30 |
| timeless_mbp | so we don't translate it for french or german on our device either | 00:31 |
| andre__ | Store is Store in the German version | 00:31 |
| timeless_mbp | yeah | 00:31 |
| andre__ | kind of surprises me after seeing the worst german translations | 00:31 |
| timeless_mbp | oh cute | 00:31 |
| Ceron^ | but in finalnd its Kauppa | 00:31 |
| Ceron^ | finland | 00:31 |
| Ceron^ | Ovi Kauppa | 00:31 |
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| Ceron^ | Door Store | 00:31 |
| timeless_mbp | FR CA does translate it ! | 00:31 |
| solarion | my karma royally sucks. :( | 00:31 |
| andre__ | in Czech it's also translated (Obchod which means Shop) | 00:32 |
| timeless_mbp | andre__: yeah, i'm reading the po's :) | 00:32 |
| timeless_mbp | or perhaps i'm reading msgunfmt mo's | 00:32 |
| timeless_mbp | whatever, anyone w/ a device can do it :) | 00:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, not launch. <_< | 00:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | launching* | 00:33 |
| timeless_mbp | http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/reuters/090924/tecnology/ctech_us_nokia_brazil | 00:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | ufail | 00:33 |
| javispedro | Ouvi Divulgacao e Marketing em Celulares Ltda | 00:34 |
| timeless_mbp | "What Nokia apparently has not realized is that the 190 million inhabitants of Brazil speak Portuguese and not Finnish," said Tore Haugland, chief executive of Ouvi, which is owned by Norwegian investment firm Diem Telekom. | 00:34 |
| range | Hmm. A store in german is a certain kind of curtain. | 00:34 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Using symlinks? | 00:34 |
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| range | ovi means door? So it is a curtain for a door? | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, yeah. | 00:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ah, no wonder. | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Copied the wrong stuff over. | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Carry on. :D | 00:35 |
| andre__ | timeless_mbp, what's that weird quote refering to? | 00:35 |
| timeless_mbp | url above | 00:36 |
| andre__ | ah | 00:36 |
| andre__ | too many conversations at the same time... | 00:36 |
| timeless_mbp | it's an awesome quote | 00:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Someone needs to tell konttori_ that the Type field in a desktop file does not go at the bottom... | 00:36 |
| Ceron^ | SpeedEvil: http://www.kuvalauta.fi/b/src/12553815307.jpg | 00:37 |
| Ceron^ | now give me n900 ;) | 00:37 |
| timeless_mbp | who is she? | 00:37 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Ceron^: I can get you a picture of one. Sound fair? | 00:38 |
| Ceron^ | nah, ;\ | 00:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Ceron^: you can buy one now - in your local nokia webshop. | 00:38 |
| javispedro | Ceron^: aw, come join #idonthaveann900 | 00:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Ceron^: It won't of course be delivered now. | 00:38 |
| Ceron^ | am i delaying the phone by asking about it? | 00:39 |
| Ceron^ | you guys fixing the bugs! | 00:39 |
| javispedro | there's a 50% chance you are. | 00:39 |
| vandenoever | Ceron^: did you take that pic with n900? | 00:39 |
| andre__ | Ceron^, no, just maintaining them actually | 00:39 |
| Ceron^ | vandenoever: sure ;=) il tell you her name for another n900 | 00:39 |
| javispedro | qwerty12_N810: you're evil. | 00:40 |
| timeless_mbp | dinner time | 00:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: yep, and I'm still grinning | 00:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, there it goes. | 00:40 |
| javispedro | :'( | 00:40 |
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| * javispedro goes back to cursing xerces | 00:41 | |
| Macer | ugh | 00:42 |
| Macer | perl.. another scripting abortion | 00:42 |
| frals | hmm, wonder if you get a dbus signal when theres an incoming sms | 00:42 |
| Shapeshifter | clueless people should be disallowed to report about open platforms. | 00:42 |
| vandenoever | Ceron^: no thank you | 00:43 |
| Macer | every time i think of perl it reminds me of years ago when this perl "developer" brought in his redhat box which had a broken hard drive | 00:43 |
| Macer | and i explained to him the hard drive was broken and i doubt it coudl be saved and that we would reinstall redhat on a new drive for him. and when he got the system back he was askign "where did my perl stuff go?" | 00:44 |
| * Macer looked around his office for a perl for dummies book | 00:44 | |
| eichi | does theremin works on latest maemo? it gives me a segment fault | 00:44 |
| Firebird | bah, I give up trying to get any sort of 3d accel in Xephyr :| | 00:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, it's sad. | 00:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, the worse part is that their preconceptions and bias means they will never listen to reason. | 00:45 |
| javispedro | Does anyone know of a "Maemo 5 Emulator" called Zephyr? sigh. | 00:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Did you see jkk laugh when I mentioned open source? | 00:45 |
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| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: no. but what I read was enough >.> What ignorance | 00:46 |
| Shapeshifter | really bugs me. | 00:46 |
| Macer | i think arrogance would be a better choice of word | 00:46 |
| Macer | :) | 00:46 |
| Macer | but then again ignorance and arrogance walk hand in hand | 00:47 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, it was really condescending. ;) | 00:47 |
| Shapeshifter | "I'm too dumb to learn a new device, therefore, an open system is inferior to a closed one, because with open systems, the community calls you ignorant if you're ignorant" | 00:47 |
| Shapeshifter | >.> | 00:47 |
| Shapeshifter | oh, and of course community support is virtually non-existing anyway | 00:48 |
| Shapeshifter | >.> | 00:48 |
| Shapeshifter | <.< | 00:48 |
| javispedro | I demand URL! | 00:48 |
| Shapeshifter | you all don't exist. | 00:48 |
| Shapeshifter | stop talking. | 00:48 |
| wazd | Damn, I have a freaking full drawn theme and can't build it! | 00:48 |
| wazd | Why world hates me :( | 00:48 |
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| javispedro | wazd: that ThemeMaker problem? | 00:49 |
| wazd | javispedro: yep | 00:50 |
| Firebird | javispedro, do to get glx you killed the main X :0 then started one just for scratchbox? | 00:50 |
| Firebird | *so | 00:50 |
| javispedro | wazd: tell RST38h to forget his Java hateness for a day and to fix the issue, should be easy enough considering OS X and Linux should be nearly same. ;) | 00:50 |
| javispedro | Firebird: yep | 00:51 |
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| javispedro | the reason was to prove that Xephyr is not related at all to color channel's bug. | 00:51 |
| javispedro | and also see how accelerated Fremantle was :) | 00:51 |
| cvandonderen | hi | 00:51 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: That's a little hardcore when you could've just gotten an... oh, wait | 00:52 |
| javispedro | Firebird: the reason Xephyr GLX passthrough doesn't work in my system is because too old version, and trying to build a newer xorg means pulling too many dependencies for my debian lenny. | 00:52 |
| cvandonderen | using QtNetwork in my app causes a QMaemoInternetConnectivity error: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NotSupported "Unsupported interface or method" | 00:53 |
| javispedro | Firebird: but you may want to try the newest Xephyr and maybe Xglx | 00:53 |
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| cvandonderen | are there any docs on that? | 00:53 |
| javispedro | qwerty12_N810: qwerty12_N810.evilJavaPoints++; | 00:53 |
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| * qwerty12_N810 doesn't drink tea/coffee | 00:53 | |
| kynky | iv drip ? | 00:54 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sometimes | 00:54 |
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| woilok | Hi | 00:55 |
| solarion | mmm, coffee. | 00:55 |
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| kynky | in uk ? | 01:05 |
| code177 | it's like | 01:05 |
| code177 | oooh, you | 01:05 |
| code177 | you're in canada? | 01:05 |
| code177 | that'll be a thousand bucks | 01:05 |
| Macer | code177: that should say it all :) | 01:05 |
| Macer | code177: which means in the US they'll be 1200 | 01:06 |
| Macer | haha | 01:06 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: I call it the "parent problem" :) | 01:06 |
| zerojay | code177: I hate that we have to pay just to import things. Ugh. | 01:06 |
| code177 | I'm getting increasingly tempted to order one to somewhere in the US and just go down and get it =/ | 01:06 |
| Macer | code177: close to detroit? | 01:06 |
| zerojay | My N900 cost me $30... which isn't bad, but they once charged me $120 for a computer that cost that much. | 01:06 |
| Macer | does canada really pay that much in an import fee? | 01:06 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: I remember you trying to package on the N810... Please :p | 01:06 |
| Macer | what happened to free trade? :) | 01:06 |
| code177 | nope, I'm in vancouver | 01:07 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: hahahaha | 01:07 |
| zerojay | code177: Meet up with qole. | 01:07 |
| ds3 | is the N900 shipping in the US yet? | 01:07 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: don't remind me. it's something i am trying to forget | 01:07 |
| zerojay | ds3: No. | 01:07 |
| Macer | i can package on the touchbook :) | 01:07 |
| ds3 | is the N900 FCC approved yet? ;) | 01:07 |
| Macer | haha | 01:07 |
| Macer | so far the touchbook is fail | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, been approved for a while. | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, not shipping yet. | 01:08 |
| Macer | IT NEEDS MER! :-D | 01:08 |
| ds3 | so it is potentially shippable | 01:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I'd say it'll ship soon. | 01:08 |
| ds3 | is there decent pictures of it up yet? | 01:08 |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: i sure hope so | 01:08 |
| code177 | zerojay: and what, mug him? ;) | 01:08 |
| Macer | i really want to get one :) | 01:08 |
| Macer | yeah. where are all the pictures? | 01:08 |
| * Macer wants to see n900 pics that aren't renders | 01:09 | |
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| zerojay | code177: lol | 01:09 |
| code177 | my priority for my n900 is getting final fantasy 7 running | 01:09 |
| Macer | or is this a massive conspired lie | 01:09 |
| code177 | so I can play it on the plane back to england this christmas | 01:09 |
| Pavlov | code177: please please don't | 01:09 |
| Macer | code177: ff X ! | 01:09 |
| Macer | screw 7 :) | 01:09 |
| Macer | 8 was good to | 01:09 |
| Pavlov | i'll never get work done again | 01:09 |
| Macer | too | 01:09 |
| code177 | whatever Macer, 7 was the best. | 01:09 |
| code177 | period. | 01:09 |
| code177 | lol | 01:09 |
| Macer | lies | 01:09 |
| Macer | :) | 01:09 |
| Macer | 7 wasn't 3D | 01:09 |
| Macer | heh | 01:09 |
| solarion | guess nobody's interested in floating-point | 01:09 |
| code177 | it sort of was | 01:09 |
| woilok | Made 5 posts | 01:10 |
| code177 | 7 would run nicely though, I think | 01:10 |
| woilok | 6 actually | 01:10 |
| wazd | woilok: inertia? :D | 01:10 |
| Macer | scrwe that... ff1! | 01:10 |
| woilok | But no "private message" ability :( | 01:10 |
| code177 | lol | 01:10 |
| Macer | hahahhaha | 01:10 |
| Macer | told you :) | 01:10 |
| code177 | hey also side note | 01:10 |
| Macer | "How do you pronounce maemo?" | 01:10 |
| code177 | side side note, i forgot how much irc destroys my grammar | 01:10 |
| Shapeshifter | määämo | 01:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | woilok: Sorry, it may be 10 then. But I'm not BSing you, I promise that there really is a post limit :p | 01:11 |
| code177 | but actual side note, there's 585 wallpapers up now :) | 01:11 |
| Macer | i'm going to be american and say MayMoe | 01:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Firebird, h-a-m got demoted too. :roll: | 01:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Please give Nokia one of your famous responses | 01:17 |
| wazd | reliable QA process | 01:17 |
| wazd | have they seen fucking Amazon widget?! | 01:17 |
| Firebird | GeneralAntilles, demoted? | 01:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, no energy left for that. | 01:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Firebird, they replaced it with Ovi Store in the root level of the applications manager. | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is just a freaking hyperlink. | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | er | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/manager/menu/ | 01:18 |
| MrGoose1 | hmmm, makes me wonder whether buying an n900 is worth it | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, they don't care if they're hypocrits. | 01:18 |
| Firebird | oh, so the h-a-m isn't in the app menu anymore? | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's hidden down a level. | 01:18 |
| luke-jr | MrGoose1: probably not. | 01:18 |
| Firebird | GeneralAntilles, under "More" ? | 01:19 |
| johnsq | MrGoose1: sure not | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why didn't anybody bring some frozen trout to the Summit? | 01:19 |
| javispedro | even more clear marketdroids have realized they have something between hands. | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | I dunno who the managers at Nokia are that keep screwing us over but they need to get the whole can. :\ | 01:19 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: and let me guess, Foreca will be distributed thru Ovi | 01:20 |
| Macer | ok | 01:20 |
| Firebird | ovi = money = win for nokia? | 01:20 |
| javispedro | preinstalled wazd, preinstalled ;) | 01:20 |
| Macer | 3rd world countries should be exempt as being official repositories | 01:20 |
| zerojay | Foreca isn't preinstalled. | 01:20 |
| Firebird | blarg, this Xgl stuff is too much, /me gives up and uses the SDK un accelerated | 01:21 |
| * Macer starts to remove all of the eastern european countries from his repo list | 01:21 | |
| zerojay | The shortcut which installs Foreca from the app manager IS preinstalled. | 01:21 |
| Macer | fbsd is trying to download a file from .cz | 01:21 |
| zerojay | So? | 01:21 |
| javispedro | zerojay: just teasing poor wazd :) | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | quim gil says "If the Maemo community is able to put a decent QA process in place for Extras, | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | then Nokia will trust it and enable this reository by default. This is the | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | desired scenario for everybody, but requires work (and Nokia is willing to help | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | sorry spam >.> | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | e.g. funding the work needed)." | 01:21 |
| Shapeshifter | so apparently, if a QA goes in place, it should be enabled. | 01:22 |
| Firebird | I thought we already had a "decent" qa process | 01:22 |
| Macer | haha | 01:22 |
| Macer | like android? :) | 01:22 |
| wazd | javispedro: hate you :D | 01:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Firebird, so did I. | 01:22 |
| Macer | with its horrible market | 01:22 |
| Firebird | no, like the one on maemo.org/packages | 01:22 |
| * javispedro wins one extra Evil point. take that qwerty12! | 01:22 | |
| GeneralAntilles | I though the legal warning were going to be less obnoxious in Fremantle. | 01:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | That didn't pan out either. | 01:22 |
| wazd | javispedro: seriously, we have a bunch of such cool ideas that user will learn how to enable extras just to install OMWeather :D | 01:22 |
| MrGoose1 | so how'd the n900/arduino hacking competition go? | 01:23 |
| * qwerty12_N810 considers sending javispedro a picture of the N900 in his hands | 01:23 | |
| * Firebird never bothered reading the legal stuff on his N810 | 01:23 | |
| javispedro | wazd: at least OMweather is in maemo-select. :P | 01:23 |
| wazd | but really, QA process! | 01:24 |
| wazd | Sounds like a joke | 01:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | They just wanted to see if they could get us to do it. | 01:24 |
| javispedro | "mass user"-ification. | 01:25 |
| javispedro | you get what you ask for :) | 01:25 |
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| wazd | http://maemo.nokia.com/images/app-screens/cache/amazon-screens-500x300.jpg <- Quality | 01:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm not sure what the point of disabling it is anyway. | 01:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not like Maemo Select isn't right there on the desktop. | 01:25 |
| Firebird | to protect users? | 01:25 |
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| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: so that people don't brick their phones | 01:26 |
| wazd | http://maemo.nokia.com/images/app-screens/cache/ap-screen-500x300.jpg <- maybe this is quality | 01:26 |
| Shapeshifter | brick on a noob level | 01:26 |
| wazd | http://maemo.nokia.com/images/app-screens/cache/facebook-screen-500x300.jpg <- or this | 01:26 |
| javispedro | easy. why does Dataviz offer DocsToGo when they have seen how easily KOffice can be ported? | 01:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Shapeshifter, how is shipping Extras disabled preventing brickings? | 01:26 |
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| javispedro | because DataViz/Nokia knows KOffice will remain a geek thing. Nokia will take care of that. | 01:26 |
| wazd | http://maemo.nokia.com/images/app-screens/cache/fring-screen-311x166.jpg <- no commentws | 01:26 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Well, I do hope someone uploads a dodgy app to Ovi just to teach Nokia. | 01:26 |
| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: it's an excuse | 01:27 |
| Firebird | wow, so many things already in the fremantle QA, I should probably hop on board :o | 01:27 |
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| wazd | qwerty12_N810: like dog porn feeder :D | 01:28 |
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| javispedro | qwerty12_N810: gnaughty. | 01:28 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: I like that idea... | 01:28 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: haha, I'm still waiting for your port | 01:28 |
| qwerty12_N810 | (of course, including x11vnc with it is not needed any more, but...) | 01:29 |
| javispedro | uh? | 01:29 |
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| wazd | qwerty12_N810: or redtube plugin for MAF :D | 01:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Aim higher: RedTube plugin for the desktop! | 01:31 |
| code177 | lol | 01:31 |
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| zerojay | Someone say "redtube"? | 01:31 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810 , +1 :P | 01:31 |
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| GAN900 | Somebody should do a calculator applet. | 01:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RedTube applet has higher priority | 01:33 |
| wazd | GAN900: who needs calculator when you have redtube?! | 01:34 |
| GAN900 | Me? | 01:34 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Although, I think someone made a one-line one for OS2008: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/pyculator/ | 01:34 |
| wazd | GAN900: quick tip: place calc shortcut to the desktop | 01:34 |
| VDVsx | GAN900, what are you using in the N900 for IRC ? | 01:34 |
| GAN900 | XChat | 01:35 |
| GAN900 | VDVsx, how was your roommate? ;) | 01:35 |
| crashanddie | GAN900, how was yours? | 01:35 |
| * qwerty12_N810 will upload XXXChat to Ovi, and integrate VDVsx's library into it | 01:35 | |
| GAN900 | He's a dumbass. | 01:36 |
| zerojay | lol | 01:36 |
| GAN900 | Ovi on S60 is so horrifying. | 01:37 |
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| wazd | GAN900: so you've made it to the summit? :) | 01:37 |
| zerojay | ls | 01:37 |
| javispedro | I don't think the summit was full of dumbasses. | 01:37 |
| GAN900 | ls: IRC: usuk | 01:37 |
| Macer | javispedro: beauty is in the eye of the beholder :) | 01:37 |
| Macer | damn i want to get some taco bell but it's rush hour | 01:37 |
| GAN900 | wazd, passport was 28 hours late | 01:38 |
| Macer | and raining | 01:38 |
| Macer | it would be faster to walk there | 01:38 |
| GAN900 | I wonder if Ovi for Maemo will be any better. | 01:38 |
| javispedro | no. | 01:38 |
| VDVsx | GAN900, was fine ;), timeless gave me the N1000 :P | 01:38 |
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| GAN900 | Bastard! | 01:39 |
| VDVsx | lol | 01:39 |
| crashanddie | dammit | 01:39 |
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| javispedro | The Maeminatrix. Did she try to kill you after you tried to install non-DRM'd app? | 01:39 |
| crashanddie | I've started trolling tmo | 01:39 |
| Macer | anybody watch the philanthropist? | 01:39 |
| * GAN900 high-fives crashanddie. | 01:39 | |
| crashanddie | is that like the mentalist on steroids? | 01:39 |
| qwerty12_N810 | samppa: please, please, please, use maemo-optify on mplayer | 01:39 |
| GAN900 | Did anybody get xmodmap working at the Summit? | 01:40 |
| crashanddie | the keyboard stuff? | 01:40 |
| GAN900 | Yeah | 01:40 |
| crashanddie | don't think so, but Khertan said he remaped ctrl + space to be tab | 01:40 |
| GAN900 | I want tab | 01:40 |
| GAN900 | How? | 01:40 |
| crashanddie | just by editing a text file | 01:40 |
| crashanddie | don't remember which one, I was drunk | 01:40 |
| GAN900 | I couldn't get it to take changes to the symbol file | 01:41 |
| Shapeshifter | xmodmap? | 01:41 |
| Shapeshifter | nvm | 01:41 |
| GAN900 | It does seem to play nice with whatever evil shit Nokia did. | 01:41 |
| crashanddie | I'm thinking about writing a LinkedIn app | 01:42 |
| crashanddie | create a new contact, invite him on LinkedIn immediately (or facebook/whatever) | 01:42 |
| crashanddie | bloody hell, it's like everyone from the summit is looking at their LinkedIn at the same time | 01:43 |
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| crashanddie | VDVsx, jussi, harri, kees, they're all accepting at the same time | 01:43 |
| VDVsx | eheh | 01:44 |
| code177 | So.. guys | 01:44 |
| code177 | does anybody know if there has been any progress with a PSX emu on the n900 yet? | 01:44 |
| VDVsx | crashanddie, I'm running through my 300+ e-mail at the moment :( | 01:45 |
| code177 | I can't find out anything useful on TMO or google | 01:45 |
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| VDVsx | code177, afaik, anyone in the community is working on this | 01:45 |
| code177 | .. | 01:46 |
| VDVsx | but the pandora guys are (same chip as the n900) | 01:46 |
| code177 | did you mean nobody in the commity? | 01:46 |
| wazd | http://timecapsuledead.org/ <- lulz | 01:46 |
| code177 | *community | 01:46 |
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| VDVsx | code177, yeah, nobody, but I can be wrong | 01:47 |
| code177 | well.. that sucks. | 01:47 |
| VDVsx | and I'm referring to the Maemo community of course | 01:47 |
| code177 | I wonder how compatible pandora would be | 01:47 |
| code177 | the pandora version i mean | 01:48 |
| wazd | code177: I think it will be near full compatible | 01:48 |
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| wazd | code177: if not fully | 01:48 |
| VDVsx | code177, me too ;) | 01:48 |
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| code177 | awesome! | 01:49 |
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| zerojay | qwerty12_N810: Working on packaging my stuff up myself. What kind of package do I tell dh_make it is? | 01:49 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | zerojay: single binary | 01:50 |
| zerojay | ok | 01:50 |
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| user__ | test | 01:52 |
| zerojay | Testies, 1 2. | 01:53 |
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| zerojay | Something I said? :/ | 01:53 |
| Xisdibik | yes | 01:53 |
| Xisdibik | you forgot his third, mean | 01:53 |
| GAN900 | zerojay, do it right. | 01:53 |
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| javispedro | i boot windows for the first time in months and it hangs at startup | 01:54 |
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| zerojay | GAN900: I'm working on it. Should be done soonish. | 01:55 |
| wazd | javispedro: you hate windows - windows hates you :) | 01:56 |
| * javispedro hits reset button | 01:56 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | In Soviet Russia, perhaps... | 01:56 |
| javispedro | i had to find it, dammit | 01:56 |
| javispedro | all glory to magic sysrq | 01:57 |
| GAN900 | zerojay, yeah, but is it done now? | 01:58 |
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| zerojay | GAN900: I'm in the middle of editing a few of the files needed for the packaging, like control. | 02:01 |
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| GAN900 | blah blah blah still lazy. :P | 02:02 |
| crashanddie | oh you can talk mister I don't do squat | 02:03 |
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| GAN900 | blah blah blah jealous. | 02:04 |
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| crashanddie_ | garage.m.o down for anyone else? | 02:15 |
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| timeless_mbp | not very up at least | 02:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer | where are the photos of N900-inside? with all cans removed and really closeup macro so you can read the chips names | 02:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | gimme a pointer to these photos, and 30min later I tell you what we might expect from usb-hostmode | 02:21 |
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| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, it won't happen | 02:23 |
| code177 | ugh | 02:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | why not? (lol) NDA? | 02:24 |
| code177 | i changed the attribution system on these wallpapers and now i have to go back through them all and update them =/ | 02:24 |
| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, no, the hardware doesn't allow for it | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | please elaborate | 02:24 |
| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, usb charging is a solid XOR with host mode | 02:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | not really | 02:25 |
| crashanddie_ | simply put, you can't have a port that supports host mode and usb charging | 02:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | see OM FR | 02:25 |
| crashanddie_ | well, I had 3 Nokia hardware engineers tell me that | 02:26 |
| crashanddie_ | and one ARM guy too | 02:26 |
| GAN900 | You can, actually. | 02:26 |
| crashanddie_ | not on this device apparently | 02:26 |
| GAN900 | The USB hardware we have supports it. | 02:26 |
| crashanddie_ | from what they said | 02:27 |
| crashanddie_ | I'd love to see it though | 02:27 |
| GAN900 | May require a different type of port or something though. | 02:27 |
| GAN900 | Stupid USB consortium. | 02:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: And here is an Openmoko EE telling you that's nonsense ;-D | 02:27 |
| crashanddie_ | one of they guy said "not possible unless you go scraping at the hardware connectors" | 02:27 |
| crashanddie_ | s/they guy/the guys/ | 02:27 |
| infobot | crashanddie_ meant: one of the guys said "not possible unless you go scraping at the hardware connectors" | 02:27 |
| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, and I should take the success of OpenMoko as proof that you're right? | 02:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | please don't play kidding games on me | 02:29 |
| crashanddie_ | oh sorry, I forgot the smiley | 02:29 |
| crashanddie_ | ";-D" | 02:29 |
| sheepbat | I think it'd matter most just if it worked from a technical standpoint | 02:29 |
| sheepbat | but I don't know if an openmoko can do both charging and USB-host | 02:30 |
| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, if someone told you "I work at Microsoft, which is why I can assert that Linux doesn't support USB", would you take their word for it? | 02:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: refer to http://downloads.openmoko.org/developer/schematics/GTA02/Schematics_Freerunner-GTA02_A5-A7cumulative_public_RC0.pdf p.7 LOCATION:49XX, particularly U4904, U4905 - you'll see it's there. And I tell you it works | 02:32 |
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| mikma | anyone knows a way to get in touch with canola2 devels? | 02:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | and for my word: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:JOERG and p.1 of aforementioned schematics | 02:33 |
| crashanddie_ | mikma, #canola might be a good place to start | 02:34 |
| crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer, god you're obtuse | 02:34 |
| mikma | crashanddie_: thanks mate! | 02:34 |
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| GAN900 | mikma, go harass etrunko until he answers. :D | 02:34 |
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| crashanddie_ | oh well, garage won't reply tonight it would appear | 02:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: to fulfill your expectations: how am I obtuse? | 02:35 |
| GAN900 | Holy crap | 02:35 |
| crashanddie_ | dftt | 02:35 |
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| GAN900 | All of MST3k is on Netflix. | 02:36 |
| crashanddie_ | clayton is alive? | 02:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer | sheepbat: charge at max 1A from USB. Hostmode with max 500mA supply from Openmoko Freerunner | 02:39 |
| sheepbat | hunh, interesting | 02:39 |
| javispedro | openpandora had a load of problems with it too | 02:40 |
| javispedro | and they're using omap. | 02:41 |
| javispedro | so guess the culprit... | 02:41 |
| GAN900 | You? | 02:41 |
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| * DocScrutinizer considers to apply at Nokia, for the next senior hw developer job | 02:46 | |
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| crashanddie_ | it must be mindblowing to work in such an environment | 02:48 |
| johnsq | DocScrutinizer: you forgot the point, develope bad machines, sell them, fix 1 failure and a new bug sell new machine, ... | 02:48 |
| crashanddie_ | I mean, not to diss your previous work or anything | 02:48 |
| SpeedEvil | The hardware of OM wasn't ever the major malfunction. | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | johnsq: hmm, sounds familiar -though highly disgusting to me | 02:49 |
| crashanddie_ | SpeedEvil, nope, however rewriting the software stack from scratch every other week and never allowing people to use the phone as a phone was | 02:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: you bet it is (mindblowing). Just I joined too late to really make a difference | 02:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: and no insult taken. I agree with your notion about slow and really bad EE at OM | 02:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer | though SpeedEvil is right it's not primarily the hw that's the problem. we had 1 or 2 major issues, but that's not been the *real* showstoppers | 02:53 |
| crashanddie_ | OpenMoko was a project started with noble intentions | 02:53 |
| Mousey | and ended with WebOS | 02:54 |
| Mousey | ^_^ | 02:54 |
| crashanddie_ | the problem is noble intentions don't solve the massive coordination issues that ensue with a project such as that | 02:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | with a vastly underpowered sw development department | 02:54 |
| SpeedEvil | That diddn't communicate what it was doing. | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | everybody underestimated the amount of effort it would take to get such a simple thing like standby right | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | or a dialer, a last-calls-history, etc | 02:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | and EE had no single guy to tell sw devels how to use the hw | 02:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | (as mentioned above: I joined way too late) | 02:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | well, nokia has an easy going on these parts. They just do it closed source, and I still don't see ofono anywhere around | 03:01 |
| GAN900 | ofono.org | 03:01 |
| GAN900 | Harmattan timeframe, probably. | 03:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | yup | 03:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, if any of the Nokia guys (or maemo heads) are listening: manpower for hire. email: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:JOERG | 03:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | gn8 | 03:05 |
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| zerojay | Question.. if I make a file in my home directory in the SDK... why is it that I can't see those same files when I open Nautilus? Where are they? | 03:10 |
| crashanddie_ | zerojay, Nautilus on the host? | 03:11 |
| crashanddie_ | zerojay, probably something like /scratchbox/users/$LOGNAME/ | 03:12 |
| crashanddie_ | err | 03:12 |
| crashanddie_ | you get the idea | 03:13 |
| crashanddie_ | just do a find /scratchbox -name filename.ext to find it | 03:13 |
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| zerojay | Yeah, I figured it out. | 03:14 |
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| b-man17 | ~seen xnt14 | 03:15 |
| infobot | xnt14 <n=xnt14@pool-98-113-71-187.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 3d 14h 1m 21s ago, saying: '~seen lcuk'. | 03:15 |
| b-man17 | hah | 03:15 |
| zerojay | Love triangle. | 03:15 |
| GAN900 | Is it in the builder yet? | 03:16 |
| * b-man17 is experimenting with video chat.... pretty interesting.... o.o | 03:17 | |
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| zerojay | GAN900: I have the deb made.. just need the wiki page for it... Uploading to Extras, I think it was called. | 03:19 |
| zerojay | And virtualbox just froze my ass. | 03:21 |
| b-man17 | lol | 03:22 |
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| zerojay | dead? | 03:22 |
| zerojay | dead | 03:22 |
| zerojay | fuuuuucl | 03:22 |
| GAN900 | lol | 03:24 |
| zerojay | ping | 03:25 |
| GAN900 | pong? | 03:26 |
| zerojay | even my term is dead... screen is no longer updating... wtf... i can't even see this and it's probably being typed directly into a command line that will somehow erase all my shit at once and i don't even care aarrrrrrrrrrrr | 03:26 |
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| zerojay | killall Virtualbox | 03:27 |
| GAN900 | lol | 03:27 |
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| zerojay | reboot | 03:27 |
| zerojay | shutdown -h now | 03:27 |
| b-man17 | "Segmentation Falt" | 03:27 |
| zerojay | beep | 03:27 |
| zerojay | fuck you | 03:27 |
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| zerojay | aaaaahhh | 03:27 |
| GAN900 | Haha | 03:27 |
| b-man17 | lol | 03:28 |
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| zerojay | soooo blank screen... it's just you and me now, huh | 03:28 |
| zerojay | i don't like you, you don't like me. | 03:28 |
| zerojay | i'm going to make you my bitch. | 03:28 |
| * GAN900 watches with interest | 03:28 | |
| zerojay | see this fucking plug? | 03:29 |
| b-man17 | "/sbin/init: Segmentation Fault" | 03:29 |
| zerojay | YOU LOSE. | 03:29 |
| b-man17 | xDDDDDDDDDD | 03:29 |
| b-man17 | ~burn his computer | 03:30 |
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| * infobot pours gasoline all over his computer, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze | 03:30 | |
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| b-man17 | wb xD | 03:31 |
| zerojay | Virtualbox decided to get stoned. | 03:31 |
| zerojay | Fuck it. | 03:31 |
| b-man17 | VMware? :) | 03:32 |
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| Macer | ugh | 03:36 |
| Macer | getting my damn web server back up and running has wound up being a total pain in the ass :) | 03:36 |
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| Macer | i hate mysql | 03:37 |
| zerojay | Anyone awake right now that can send me my invite to upload to extras? | 03:38 |
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| frewsxcv | what is most stable for nokia 770, 2008HE 2007HE or 2006 | 04:09 |
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| b-man17 | frewsxcv: OS2006 i'm assuming | 04:16 |
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| Firebird | woa, didn't know the maemo.org brainstorm was for hardware ideas too... | 05:12 |
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| vladovg | hi | 05:30 |
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| vladovg | need instrucktions to install Android on 810 | 05:31 |
| microlith | heh, those would be fairly intricate instructions | 05:33 |
| microlith | http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Android+Nokia+N810 | 05:34 |
| zerojay | lol | 05:35 |
| zerojay | love that. | 05:35 |
| microlith | it's handy | 05:35 |
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| vladovg | search allredi | 05:36 |
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| vladovg | but | 05:36 |
| vladovg | no matter | 05:37 |
| vladovg | thanks | 05:37 |
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| Macer | the big rip doesn't seem like the probable end of the universe | 05:42 |
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| jennyfast2 | Hi | 05:44 |
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| jennyfast2 | Is there a way to install international virtual keyboards on the N800? (i.e. Japanese) | 05:45 |
| falmeida | When is Maemo going to change to Qt? | 05:46 |
| jennyfast2 | Quicktime? | 05:46 |
| falmeida | toolkit | 05:46 |
| derf | jennyfast2: You probably want maemocjk. | 05:48 |
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| luke-jr | falmeida: 6 | 05:51 |
| luke-jr | gah, watchdog killed me | 05:52 |
| luke-jr | can't link kate anymore? :/ | 05:52 |
| zerojay | falmeida: Maemo 6 signals the switch to QT... the Harmattan release. QT is going to be supported by the community in the meantime. | 05:52 |
| falmeida | Will it have different look&feel for maemo 5? | 05:52 |
| jennyfast2 | derf: I'll check it out, thanks | 05:52 |
| zerojay | It will have a different look and feel FROM Maemo 5, yes. | 05:53 |
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| zerojay | Is there a syslog daemon on the N900 yet? :/ | 05:53 |
| falmeida | So if I develop a Qt application for maemo 5, it will look different from other applications? | 05:54 |
| jennyfast2 | Anyone get an N900 yet? | 05:54 |
| vladovg | another queston | 05:54 |
| luke-jr | jennyfast2: yes | 05:54 |
| jennyfast2 | Is it worth the huge amount of money? | 05:54 |
| luke-jr | jennyfast2: probably not. | 05:55 |
| falmeida | I sure want one :) | 05:55 |
| vladovg | is thear a wai to acses the config file of installet them | 05:55 |
| vladovg | and for exemple change the font size | 05:55 |
| zerojay | falmeida: I don't know.. check out the QT release on the SDK to find out. | 05:55 |
| luke-jr | I sure want a clamshell, open source N900 :p | 05:55 |
| jennyfast2 | luke-jr - It's cool that it can run quake 3 | 05:55 |
| jennyfast2 | But meh. | 05:55 |
| luke-jr | jennyfast2: can it? | 05:56 |
| zerojay | jennyfast2: It's quite worth the money. | 05:56 |
| zerojay | And yes, it can... even though it has autoaim in the worst way. lol | 05:56 |
| luke-jr | lol | 05:56 |
| falmeida | N900 is all that I wanted for a long time. A mobile that's also a very portable computer | 05:56 |
| zerojay | Seriously, it's completely cheating. lol | 05:56 |
| luke-jr | I'm leaning toward OpenPandora with MiFi when it becomes available | 05:56 |
| zerojay | Anytime anyone's in sight, you're locked on. | 05:56 |
| luke-jr | falmeida: Zaurus was doing that 10 years ago | 05:56 |
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| luke-jr | falmeida: but don't expect to use Maemo in that way | 05:57 |
| zerojay | luke-jr: Wha? | 05:57 |
| luke-jr | zerojay: ? | 05:57 |
| zerojay | luke-jr: Don't expect to use the N900 as a very portable computer? | 05:57 |
| falmeida | luke-jr: what do you mean? | 05:57 |
| luke-jr | zerojay: no, "computer" in that context means running KDE, arbitrary apps, etc | 05:58 |
| jennyfast2 | luke-jr: Yes it can play Quake 3 | 05:58 |
| luke-jr | not running only custom made software | 05:58 |
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| jennyfast2 | Quake III on the N900 -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHSZfhY25Jc | 05:58 |
| zerojay | luke-jr: And... why not? I was able to do that in previous tablets. | 05:58 |
| zerojay | jennyfast2: You got me in the mood to play. lol | 05:58 |
| luke-jr | zerojay: not with Maemo... | 05:58 |
| zerojay | luke-jr: uh... okay there. | 05:58 |
| falmeida | It seems it's not that hard to port most GTK applications to maemo, and the most important already are | 05:59 |
| * luke-jr thinks if Nokia wants to send him a N900 free of charge, he'll take the time to get Gentoo/KDE up and working with it, but probably not otherwise. | 05:59 | |
| luke-jr | falmeida: but they do require porting | 05:59 |
| falmeida | luke-jr: Well, I consider it a platform. All platforms need porting. It still is a small computer anyway | 06:00 |
| falmeida | luke-jr: With emacs ported, I don't even need much else lol! | 06:01 |
| luke-jr | falmeida: general purpose OS shouldn't need porting | 06:01 |
| |R | ;) | 06:01 |
| falmeida | luke-jr: You need porting from win32 to linux, both are general purpose OS | 06:01 |
| luke-jr | just packaging | 06:01 |
| luke-jr | falmeida: Win32 is an exception to the rule because Microsoft can't support standards properly | 06:02 |
| luke-jr | but even then, if you properly write a Qt app in Windows, it will build fine on Linux-based OS | 06:02 |
| luke-jr | I write apps for Win32 all the time, but I write them 100% on Linux, including building the EXE and installer | 06:03 |
| luke-jr | the difference between outputting an EXE and outputting an ELF bin is merely qmake spec | 06:03 |
| falmeida | luke-jr: If you use a portable layer, then ok. But you do need that. Besides, Qt doesn't have the same look&feel | 06:03 |
| luke-jr | Qt has a native look/feel on any platform | 06:04 |
| falmeida | It doesn't look that native to me :P | 06:04 |
| luke-jr | "portable layer" would be standards. you could write a C app too, but C doesn't support GUI | 06:04 |
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| luke-jr | falmeida: what OS? | 06:04 |
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| falmeida | win32 (XP common controls 6 or earlier) | 06:05 |
| luke-jr | Qt4 supports Windows, OS X, GTK, Symbian, WinCE, and I think a few others | 06:05 |
| luke-jr | ... | 06:05 |
| falmeida | Symbian seems quite alpha too | 06:05 |
| luke-jr | well, I can't say I've used XP more than a week after it was released | 06:05 |
| luke-jr | nor at all since I learned Qt | 06:05 |
| luke-jr | so I guess who knows :) | 06:06 |
| luke-jr | it looks the same as other Win32 apps in WINE | 06:06 |
| falmeida | I have my own GUI library for qt, win32 and porting to hildon and gtk | 06:06 |
| luke-jr | >_< | 06:07 |
| falmeida | unfortunately most look&feel can't really be abstract away with widgets | 06:08 |
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| GAN900 | zerojay, actually, Qt is official now. | 06:16 |
| GAN900 | and themeing should be transparent. | 06:16 |
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| philosopher | are they planning to get a dev version of the n900 | 06:34 |
| philosopher | or sould i get the beagleboard ? | 06:35 |
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| jennyfast2 | Anyone in here use ePassporte? | 06:40 |
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| jennyfast2 | No one uses ePassporte? | 06:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | philosopher? | 06:48 |
| philosopher | ? | 06:48 |
| philosopher | GeneralAntilles: ? | 06:48 |
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| johnx | philosopher, you mean like a developer program? | 06:56 |
| johnx | no one outside Nokia has heard anything | 06:56 |
| johnx | and no one inside Nokia is talking ;) | 06:56 |
| philosopher | i mean what is the prefered platform to start develloping on meamo ? | 06:56 |
| jennyfast2 | Does stuff that's compatible with the N800 work for the N900? | 06:58 |
| johnx | for maemo5? I guess the beagleboard. though it seems like actual product will be shipping in a matter of weeks | 06:58 |
| philosopher | ok | 06:58 |
| johnx | jennyfast2, at a source level: yes (with some small tweaks if any). at a binary level: maybe | 06:59 |
| jennyfast2 | So I can run any program, but I may have to go into terminal to run it? | 06:59 |
| johnx | that's exactly not what I meant :) | 07:00 |
| jennyfast2 | Uh oh.... | 07:00 |
| jennyfast2 | I'm not very good with linux. | 07:00 |
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| lopz | gst.ElementNotFoundError: jpegenc | 07:01 |
| johnx | I'm just trying to set your expectations low, so that in the vast majority of cases when someone does the (very small amount of effort) to make things work you'll be pleasantly surprised | 07:01 |
| lopz | any idea? | 07:01 |
| jennyfast2 | johnx - lol OK | 07:02 |
| jennyfast2 | Is it worth it to upgrade from the n800 to the n810? | 07:02 |
| cleary | jennyfast2: I've got both, but only used them fairly lightly | 07:03 |
| johnx | if you want the keyboard and better screen: yes | 07:03 |
| cleary | I like tactile keyboards, the n810 has it | 07:03 |
| jennyfast2 | cleary - looking to sell??? | 07:03 |
| cleary | jennyfast2: they're not mine to sell | 07:03 |
| jennyfast2 | oh | 07:03 |
| jennyfast2 | OK | 07:03 |
| cleary | -> work | 07:03 |
| jennyfast2 | Gotcha | 07:03 |
| jennyfast2 | If anyone has a n800 or n810 they want to sell then let me know :) | 07:04 |
| johnx | the downside is ending up with the mini-sd slot instead of two full-size sd slots | 07:04 |
| johnx | jennyfast2, though how about this: what apps are you worried won't run on the n900? | 07:04 |
| jennyfast2 | johnx - Anki | 07:04 |
| philosopher | jennyfast2: now why would you like to bye an n800 ? | 07:04 |
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| johnx | ah, the flashcards thing | 07:04 |
| jennyfast2 | Yes | 07:04 |
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| johnx | jennyfast2, my gut feeling is that anki is one of the apps that will just work on the maemo5 (n900) without any effort. So just a question of waiting for it to show up or asking the person who put it together for maemo4 to make it happen | 07:12 |
| microlith | oh that's cool | 07:14 |
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| johnx | gah. 500+ items in my RSS reader | 07:27 |
| johnx | at least work didn't burn down while I was away | 07:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Holy crap, it's my birthday. <_< | 07:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | I can't believe Talk reminded me. . . | 07:44 |
| RST38bis | Oh really? | 07:44 |
| * RST38bis congratulates General on another year lost =) | 07:44 | |
| GeneralAntilles | The slow march towards death continues onward. | 07:44 |
| Proteous | IT'S A TRAP! | 07:45 |
| Proteous | sorry, had to be said | 07:45 |
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| jennyfast2 | Can you run debian or fedora on a n800 and get everything to work, even the camera? | 07:49 |
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| Proteous | the site to site transporter even works if you can get Mr. Scott to fix it from time to time | 07:50 |
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| cmug | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHSZfhY25Jc&feature=youtube_gdata nice | 07:55 |
| jennyfast2 | Anyone run Fedora on their Nokia? | 07:56 |
| microlith | augh the flicker | 07:56 |
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| Proteous | jennyfast2: according to the wiki there is not support for the camera | 07:57 |
| Proteous | http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian | 07:57 |
| jennyfast2 | Yeah I saw that :( | 07:57 |
| jennyfast2 | But thanks though | 07:57 |
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| RST38bis | Who is working on Transmission for Maemo? | 08:06 |
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| zerojay | I think its qwerty. | 08:11 |
| zerojay | Faheem Pervez. | 08:11 |
| RST38bis | Not fiferboy? | 08:15 |
| RST38bis | 'cause I wanted to ask the maintainer to make some adjustments | 08:15 |
| * GeneralAntilles sighs. | 08:15 | |
| RST38bis | It literally brings N900 to the edge of meltdown | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's qwerty12 | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, he's looking into the "lock everything up" issue. | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm sure he'd appreciate some input. | 08:16 |
| RST38bis | Oh this is how he calls it :) | 08:16 |
| zerojay | I just decided to drop the amount of seeds I'll accept down to 20 from 60. | 08:16 |
| RST38bis | I think it is as simple as doing a usleep() every now and then | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | On that note, can we make sure we're getting as many of the new people with N900s as possible to test stuff in Extras? | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3279 | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't know what "basically" means, but. . . . | 08:17 |
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| * GeneralAntilles kinda feels like Nokia is moving the goal posts. | 08:17 | |
| RST38bis | We cannot, unfortunately. This is what I meant when I said that the current conditions for Extas admission are too strict | 08:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Why can't we? | 08:18 |
| RST38bis | Quim just posted on t.m.o that he does not want ordinary guys with n900s use Extras-testing | 08:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Go to http://maemo.org/packages and test. | 08:18 |
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| RST38bis | I have separate problems with the stuff at that URL | 08:18 |
| RST38bis | The interface has to be fixed so that it is no so hellishly tedious | 08:19 |
| RST38bis | But the bigger problem is here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32676 | 08:19 |
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| Stskeeps | morn | 08:26 |
| RST38bis | Mourning, Stskeeps | 08:28 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: happy birthday | 08:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thanks. ;) | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | The meaningless 22. | 08:30 |
| * GeneralAntilles feels like an old man. | 08:30 | |
| Stskeeps | meh :P 25 here | 08:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | You can rent a car at least! | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | not without a license | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, right, getting a drivers license over there requires selling your first born. | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: re app manager placement.. see why we need community variants and a os the community controls? :P | 08:32 |
| RST38bis | 11 more years until crucifixion | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | We just give them to everybody and let the road wars slim down the numbers. ;) | 08:33 |
| jaska | o, happy bday ga :p | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, no, this is why we need to beat Nokia managers about the head and shoulders with blunt objects until they see it our way. | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | jaska, thanks! :) | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | A freaking hyperlink in the _APPLICATIONS_ menu | 08:34 |
| * GeneralAntilles mutters. | 08:34 | |
| jaska | oddly enough mines tomorrow :) | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | jaska, lot of people seem to have it around this time. | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Weird | 08:34 |
| jaska | yea, b-man's was a couple days ago | 08:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, too. | 08:35 |
| jaska | o.O | 08:35 |
| RST38bis | Gentlemen, fighting Ovi store is a lost battle. | 08:36 |
| RST38bis | So, just sit tight and wait until it withers and dies on its own | 08:36 |
| RST38bis | Well, maybe suggest to Nokia to swap App Manage with some other first-tier icon | 08:37 |
| * GeneralAntilles still favors the blunt objects. | 08:38 | |
| RST38bis | You had your chance and you missed it | 08:38 |
| * RST38bis on the other hand, has got the Modest manager. Twice. | 08:38 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 08:38 |
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| Stskeeps | let us move ovi maps to second layer | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | it should be kept out of the publics eye until they fix it. | 08:40 |
| RST38bis | If they ever do | 08:40 |
| Stskeeps | or just fork maemo mapper | 08:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | I can't believe they screwed up Ovi Maps so horribly. | 08:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | I mean, really? | 08:40 |
| RST38bis | Some really pretty things at http://www.n900wallpapers.com/ | 08:41 |
| jaska | whatd they do? | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | They couldn't just take what works reasonably well on S60 and move it to Maemo? | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | jaska, they mutilated it with a meat grinder. | 08:41 |
| RST38bis | General: What is surprising there? | 08:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's a study in how not to make software. | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, always the optimist. ;) | 08:41 |
| RST38bis | You have got a team of people who have never done anything for the tablets and do not care | 08:41 |
| RST38bis | Anyways, among the bugs I carpet bombed bugzilla with, there is a bunch of Maps bugs | 08:42 |
| RST38bis | Go, vote, comment | 08:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, is there an Ovi Maps component? | 08:42 |
| RST38bis | Yeah | 08:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | zerojay, ping? | 08:42 |
| RST38bis | Nokia Maps | 08:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Where did we decide we're hiding background images? | 08:43 |
| RST38bis | General: Bugs 5332,5333,5336,5337 | 08:43 |
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| zerojay | GeneralAntilles: yo. | 08:46 |
| zerojay | Sorry... was playing snes with wiicontrol. | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | zerojay, where are we hiding the backgrounds? | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 08:47 |
| zerojay | And the stuttering makes it unplayable. | 08:47 |
| vandenoever | how can i take a screenshot in the N900? esp of the 'window manager'? | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | ctrl-shift-p? | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or the statusbar cpu applet is also an option. | 08:47 |
| jaska | lol, the ovi maps program is even less useful than the n810 wayfinder thingy? | 08:47 |
| zerojay | GeneralAntilles: I put the backgrounds in /opt/maemo-backgrounds/[set name]/ | 08:47 |
| zerojay | GeneralAntilles: And the .desktop files in /usr/share/backgrounds/ | 08:47 |
| vandenoever | GeneralAntilles: perfect! | 08:48 |
| zerojay | The SNES emulator is so stuttery that trying to fly in Super Mario 3 is impossible. :/ | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thanks | 08:48 |
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| RST38bis | zerojay: Controls stutter or gameplay stutter? | 08:50 |
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| zerojay | Both. | 08:50 |
| RST38bis | zerojay <-- can hardly be pleased (yes, I have read the comments on downloads) | 08:50 |
| zerojay | When frames aren't drawn to the screen, input is ignored. | 08:51 |
| zerojay | I haven't a clue to what you're refering to. | 08:51 |
| RST38bis | zerojay: Ok. start by setting a fixed frameskip of 3 | 08:51 |
| RST38bis | Do not use BT controllers, they lag | 08:51 |
| zerojay | Yeah, I figured there was some lag anyways. | 08:52 |
| RST38bis | See if you have anything running in the background | 08:52 |
| RST38bis | If you are, kill it | 08:52 |
| RST38bis | Aside from that, I have no idea what you are talking about: DrNokSnes works pretty well for me | 08:52 |
| RST38bis | For anything smoother you will have to visit a fleamarket and get a real SNES | 08:53 |
| zerojay | Perhaps the flying problem is caused by BT lag then. | 08:54 |
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| zerojay | What framerates are you seeing? | 08:56 |
| RST38bis | I am skipping 2 out of 3 | 08:58 |
| RST38bis | Skipping more will make gameplay jerky. Skipping less will make it slower. Autoskeep often leads to what you call "stuttering". | 08:59 |
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| * RST38bis out to work | 08:59 | |
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| Corsac | grmpf | 09:06 |
| wazd | heya all | 09:06 |
| Stskeeps | morning wazd | 09:07 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 09:09 |
| timeless_mbp | morning | 09:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, Eero needs help with the descriptions for the crash reporter. | 09:10 |
| vandenoever | can i just put an installfile anywhere? i put one on an apache but n900 browser just shows it as a textfile | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | you need a certain mimetype i think | 09:12 |
| vandenoever | Stskeeps: maemo server sends text/html as mimetype | 09:14 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: the crash reporter ui needs to get an update for maemo5 | 09:16 |
| timeless_mbp | and keep in mind that it probably doesn't ship in the final box | 09:17 |
| timeless_mbp | it'll probably be in my translation pack, which of course, makes things much more fun | 09:17 |
| * timeless_mbp hates debian packaging | 09:17 | |
| GeneralAntilles | What's the proper term for desktop widgets in Maemo 5? | 09:19 |
| timeless_mbp | um, dunno, they're probably just widgets | 09:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Widget or desktop widget? | 09:19 |
| timeless_mbp | if you tap the desktop and hit the menu area | 09:19 |
| timeless_mbp | you'll get a menu w/ a chance to add one | 09:20 |
| vandenoever | using 'text/html' for the $package.install file does not help | 09:20 |
| timeless_mbp | msgid "home_me_select_widgets" | 09:21 |
| timeless_mbp | msgstr "Add widget" | 09:21 |
| timeless_mbp | vandenoever: yeah well, the browser will helpfully render that ;-) | 09:21 |
| Stskeeps | vandenoever: | 09:21 |
| Stskeeps | Files with the extension ".install" are | 09:21 |
| Stskeeps | recognized to have the mime type "application/x-install-instructions". | 09:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | We should probably try to clean up the version strings for Extras. | 09:23 |
| vandenoever | Stskeeps: thanks, that opens the installer, now it says 'cannot install qtup, package not compatible' | 09:24 |
| Macer | yawn | 09:25 |
| Macer | i hate laundry | 09:25 |
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| Stskeeps | vandenoever: means it couldn't satisfy dependancies or your package isnt in user/ | 09:25 |
| vandenoever | i think it means, i forgot Package.gz, will add that | 09:25 |
| vandenoever | Stskeeps: it should be in dists/fremantle/user ? | 09:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, Mauku doesn't like Qaiku. | 09:27 |
| vandenoever | here's the install file: http://ktown.kde.org/~vandenoever/repo/install/ | 09:29 |
| vandenoever | here file: http://ktown.kde.org/~vandenoever/repo/ actually | 09:29 |
| * GeneralAntilles hits zerojay. | 09:30 | |
| timeless_mbp | vandenoever: tap the app's menu | 09:30 |
| timeless_mbp | select 'log' | 09:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Promote the Mauku desktop widget, really? :P | 09:30 |
| vandenoever | catalogue 'user' not found | 09:30 |
| timeless_mbp | your repo is 'main' not 'user' | 09:31 |
| timeless_mbp | err fremantle? | 09:31 |
| * timeless_mbp frowns | 09:32 | |
| * timeless_mbp can never remember how to parse those things | 09:32 | |
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| timeless_mbp | http://ktown.kde.org/~vandenoever/repo/dists/fremantle/user/binary-armel/ | 09:32 |
| timeless_mbp | so i think components is 'user' | 09:33 |
| vandenoever | timeless_mbp: i changed say 'components = user' now | 09:33 |
| timeless_mbp | as for catalogues, i think it's probably 'apps' | 09:33 |
| timeless_mbp | ask mvo :) | 09:33 |
| vandenoever | from maemo.org it is 'extras' | 09:34 |
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| * timeless_mbp ponders | 09:37 | |
| timeless_mbp | what the heck? | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | does tmobile use WCDMA? | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | http://quezi.com/10114 | 09:37 |
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| timeless_mbp | WCDMA frequencies 900/1700/2100 MHz (Europe, Asia, T-Mobile US) | 09:37 |
| Ceron^ | n900 in stores yet? | 09:37 |
| timeless_mbp | will you ask every day? | 09:38 |
| Ceron^ | not sure yet | 09:38 |
| wazd | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/omweather/0.24.5/ <- vote! | 09:38 |
| vandenoever | i want to blog about a package, could some one test it? http://ktown.kde.org/~vandenoever/repo/dists/fremantle/user/binary-armel/ | 09:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, still lingering UI issues. | 09:40 |
| vandenoever | it is a 3d object that listens to the accelerometers | 09:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | vandenoever, you should send it to the autobuilder and Extras. | 09:41 |
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| vandenoever | GeneralAntilles: it's bit small for that, just some funny app | 09:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | vandenoever, doesn't matter, send it to Extras-devel and just leave it there. | 09:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Better than more 3rd-party repos. ;) | 09:42 |
| vandenoever | ok, i'll have a go | 09:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | wazd, the over/under widget style also doesn't fit vertically. | 09:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Since the size that Hildon thinks the widget is and the size it actually is don't seem to match up. | 09:44 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: I haven't seen OMWeather under Fremantle so I don't understand what does it mean :) | 09:44 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: better report Vlad | 09:44 |
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| Macer | awesome. new episode of castle | 09:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, see: http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/4007120791/ | 09:46 |
| Macer | castle is awesome | 09:46 |
| Macer | this damn xfce4 desktop that is ont he touchbook seriously needs a pager :) | 09:47 |
| Macer | i need multiple screens damnit | 09:47 |
| Macer | if my crappy g1 can do it in android then so should this | 09:47 |
| Macer | the android market cracks me up.. every time a video player comes out people leave comments like "Will this play flash????????" | 09:48 |
| Stskeeps | fremantle desktop on touchbook could be nice | 09:48 |
| Macer | "1 star.. doesn't play flash!!" | 09:48 |
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| Macer | haha | 09:48 |
| Macer | it's a riot | 09:48 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: yeah.. too bad i don't know how to instal it | 09:48 |
| Macer | it uses some u-boot setup that i haven't quite bothered to learn yt | 09:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hopefully the Beagle project gets updated soon. | 09:48 |
| Macer | yet | 09:48 |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: that is what the touchbook is. a beagleboard in a laptop :) | 09:49 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: well, that's a feature I guess, ask unknown designer how that happened :D | 09:49 |
| Macer | with a touchscreen | 09:49 |
| Macer | and a huge battery | 09:49 |
| Macer | which realistically lasts for like 7 hours in use | 09:49 |
| Macer | probablyt because of underdeveloped kernel power management | 09:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | How big is the battery? | 09:50 |
| wazd | any kind people to help me with theme deb btw? | 09:50 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: if mail me the template.png and what settings to use i can probably get it going | 09:50 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: cool! | 09:51 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: catch with gmail :) | 09:53 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: some key shots like vkb, phone and some others would be super awesome :) | 09:55 |
| Ceron^ | timeless_mbp: il stop asking when its released :\ | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: trying to build | 09:56 |
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| wazd | timeless_mbp: any updates on icons size btw? | 09:57 |
| timeless_mbp | wazd: sorry, i really don't know, maybe GeneralAntilles or Jaffa or Stskeeps know? | 09:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, icon size? | 09:57 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm poking google wave for a few mins and trying to read email | 09:57 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: HAM icon | 09:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | 48x48, no? | 10:00 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: also the icon size for things in control panel :) | 10:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, hrm, want to try beveling the wind direction arrows a little bit more? | 10:00 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: I want t replace this whole thing honestly :D | 10:02 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: .deb sent back to you | 10:02 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: cool! | 10:03 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: everything works?) | 10:03 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: well the build did.. i cannot test rightnow as i don't have an updated flash image | 10:03 |
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| Stskeeps | and i don't want to risk my work ability today :P | 10:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ah, whore. | 10:06 |
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| GeneralAntilles | OmniWeb crashed with 3 unsubmitted bugs. <_< | 10:06 |
| Stskeeps | heh | 10:06 |
| Stskeeps | dear god, frost on the windows.. | 10:07 |
| frals | yey its snowing here \o/ | 10:07 |
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| frals | the snow flakes are kinda tiny and melt as soon as they hit the ground, but still | 10:07 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: well, thanks! | 10:07 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: did you do any changes to the template since the first rst sent me? | 10:07 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: yep | 10:08 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:08 |
| Stskeeps | then we need to change the mer version too i guess :) | 10:08 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: wat to test fresh theme? :) | 10:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hit me. | 10:11 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: e-mail?) | 10:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | rabelg5 at gmail.com | 10:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5363 | 10:12 |
| jennyfast2 | What OS do you guys have installed on your Nokia? | 10:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maemo 4 and Maemo 5. | 10:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Depending on the Nokia in question. ;) | 10:13 |
| Stskeeps | morning johnx | 10:13 |
| johnx | mornin' | 10:13 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: so are all the icons 48x48 in Maemo 5? :) | 10:13 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Happy birthday! :) | 10:13 |
| * johnx sets mode +zombie | 10:13 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, not the statusbar ones? | 10:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, thanks! | 10:14 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: ok :) | 10:14 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: oh! | 10:14 |
| timeless_mbp | but both HAM and normal launcher icons? | 10:14 |
| Xisdibik | GeneralAntilles: I want your nokia device with maemo 5 ;) | 10:14 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: happy birthday too then! :D | 10:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 10:14 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: still ill | 10:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Xisdibik, cold dead hands! | 10:14 |
| timeless_mbp | happy birthday GeneralAntilles | 10:14 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, feeling better...just drained | 10:14 |
| Xisdibik | and apparently happy birthday GeneralAntilles | 10:14 |
| johnx | what about you? | 10:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, thanks everybody. :) | 10:14 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: you're the only man that follows tmo reminders I guess :D | 10:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, less sick now? | 10:14 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: meh, coughing a bit but nothing bad | 10:14 |
| * johnx faxes GeneralAntilles a cake | 10:15 | |
| GeneralAntilles | color fax! | 10:15 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, well, less sick in a physical sense ... | 10:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, did the Nokians poison your mind? | 10:15 |
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| johnx | nah, just made sure I had lots to drink O_o; | 10:16 |
| johnx | (and rain to walk home in) | 10:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 10:16 |
| johnx | yup, heard it here first: Nokia engineered weather in Amsterdam | 10:16 |
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| * GeneralAntilles loves Flickr sharing. | 10:17 | |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: both of them combined is 16ah | 10:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Macer, gawd, that thing will run forever on Maemo. | 10:17 |
| Macer | lol. i guess if the kernel would run with proper power management | 10:18 |
| Macer | the touchbook os is worse than mer :) | 10:18 |
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| Macer | like.. random blanking of the screen.. misconfigured python network management scripts.. all types of beta type probelsm.. i sure hope it gets better soon | 10:19 |
| Macer | like.. at the very least a battery monitor would be nice heh | 10:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, startup animation is h264 avi, apparently. | 10:19 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: what does lshal | grep battery say? | 10:20 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, OK, time to mock something cool up in C4D | 10:21 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: a lot | 10:21 |
| Macer | what's another pasting site other than pastebin | 10:21 |
| Macer | pastebin turned gay as hell.. it has a ton of popups now | 10:21 |
| Stskeeps | pastebin.ca? | 10:21 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: oh :( | 10:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, yeah, qwerty12 is going to start shipping porn clip startup screens to Extras now. :( | 10:22 |
| Ceron^ | any news on USB OTG | 10:23 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Look, I told you GeneralAntilles that I do not want videos of you in my Gmail inbox | 10:23 |
| mvo | "son, what are you doing there in your room?" "Nothing, just rebooting my tablet..." | 10:23 |
| RST38h | General: Just out of pure masochism, I will try pushing an app into Ovi store (they say it will contian | 10:23 |
| RST38h | free apps first) | 10:23 |
| Macer | http://pastebin.ca/1617421 | 10:23 |
| Macer | there you go Stskeeps | 10:23 |
| Stskeeps | morning mvo :) | 10:24 |
| RST38h | (shit, it was the buffer) | 10:24 |
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| mvo | Stskeeps, morning! | 10:24 |
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| aSIMULAtor | hwhere is dr nok snes? | 10:25 |
| aSIMULAtor | i mean in the repositories | 10:25 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: looks fairly sane to get a battery applet on | 10:25 |
| aSIMULAtor | i can't seem to find it anymore | 10:25 |
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| Macer | Stskeeps: oh i'm sure | 10:25 |
| Ceron^ | i get so depressed reading Maemo Talk forums only bad news | 10:25 |
| Macer | i'm watching the NG special on hitler's stealth fighter | 10:25 |
| Ceron^ | no usb otg, no digital compass | 10:25 |
| johnx | 16Ah? O_o; | 10:25 |
| johnx | like, a couple car batteries? | 10:25 |
| Macer | the horton 229 | 10:25 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: Make sure it's a Python one | 10:25 |
| Macer | johnx: no. just 2 normal batteries | 10:26 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: i still wonder if status area allows python plugins | 10:26 |
| RST38h | Tes test test | 10:26 |
| glass | Macer: secret weapons of luftwaffe was a fine pc game | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: how do you install software on it btw? | 10:26 |
| RST38h | glass,Macer,wazd,zap: Moo all | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: like, do you have serial access to it or something? | 10:26 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: to install the os you write an image to it | 10:26 |
| Macer | to an sd | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | and it flashes it or boots everything from sd? | 10:27 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: it keeps its os on an sd | 10:27 |
| Macer | boots from the sd i'm sure | 10:27 |
| johnx | Ceron^, pretty sure usb otg is just a software issue (people: correct me if I'm wrong) | 10:27 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: Dunno, not really fussed about Python TBH :) | 10:27 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: i'm pretty sure putting another os on it would be fairly easy but i just haven't figured out how to do it yet | 10:28 |
| glass | moo | 10:28 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: let me just look up some info on it.. | 10:28 |
| Macer | i guess however you would boot a beagleboard with a different os | 10:28 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: so i can put mer on it? :) | 10:28 |
| Macer | heh | 10:28 |
| Macer | mer would probably run a lot better on it than this touchbook os crap | 10:28 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: i'm pondering how to do a port easiest without having access to it physically | 10:28 |
| Macer | with its xfce interface and horrible "tablet mode" | 10:28 |
| johnx | Macer, should be able to use the beagleboard mer, but a somewhat modified version might be more friendly | 10:29 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: haha.. if you want i'm sure i can give you ssh access to it.. but i'm not too sure if that would help you much | 10:29 |
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| johnx | Macer, you know fremantle desktop is open source, right? ;) | 10:29 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: got any online documentation for it/ | 10:29 |
| Macer | johnx: yeah but i'm not hardcore enough to get it working on this | 10:29 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: not really. only place i can think of are the forums on alwaysinnovating.com | 10:29 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: so, how's it overall? | 10:30 |
| Macer | under "support" on their site | 10:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, 2 steps forward and a couple steps back, as usual. | 10:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/couple/one/ | 10:30 |
| Macer | the nazi stealth fighter was made of wood haha | 10:30 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: wazd, 2 steps forward and a one steps back, as usual. | 10:30 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: can you give me some shots in return so I can finaly see it for myself :D | 10:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, theme? | 10:31 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: VKB, HAM< Phone and with something you don't like | 10:31 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: yep :) | 10:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Didn't get the email. | 10:31 |
| Stskeeps | IM view is a good one to check too | 10:31 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: oh | 10:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, wait. | 10:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Junk mail | 10:31 |
| johnx | Macer, convince AI they should send some mer dev a touchbook | 10:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | You got sorted in with all of the Cyrillic spam that I was getting about 6 months ago. :P | 10:32 |
| Macer | johnx: haha | 10:32 |
| crashanddie_ | yoooooooooo | 10:32 |
| crashanddie_ | bitches! | 10:32 |
| crashanddie_ | whassup johnx ! | 10:32 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: crap :) | 10:32 |
| Macer | i'm not that good of a minipulator | 10:32 |
| Macer | they are backed up enough as it is | 10:32 |
| Macer | it took me like... 5 months to get it :) | 10:33 |
| Macer | all the people are screaming about not getting theirs.. it's anarchy | 10:33 |
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| Macer | i was watching a west wing episode where someone managed to shoot down a stealth fighter | 10:34 |
| Macer | haha | 10:34 |
| Macer | and everybody keeps asking "how did they even see it to shoot it down?" | 10:35 |
| GAN900 | wazd, get this installing, not sure if it's meaningful. http://pastebin.com/m7f04fe03 | 10:35 |
| Macer | ooo.. i found hd versions of the original star trek | 10:35 |
| Macer | awesome | 10:35 |
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| RST38h | Anyone knows how to sense if the tablet is being locked via DBus? | 10:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GAN900: That's a Theme Maker problem; I had the same with another theme made with it | 10:36 |
| RST38h | There should be a DBus message for that (and unlock too) | 10:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Fire up dbus-monitor over SSH and watch? | 10:36 |
| Macer | the nazis didn't know the british had radar when they first attacked | 10:36 |
| Macer | how awesome | 10:36 |
| Macer | i guess radar was a new thing back then :) | 10:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, weird, theme change didn't go so well. | 10:37 |
| RST38h | qwerty: I really want the "official" way | 10:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lot of stuff is out of alignment. | 10:37 |
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| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: reboot, usual problem | 10:38 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Btw, tried Transmission. Works beautifully, bring the tablet to meltdown almost | 10:38 |
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| inte_ | anything new on AlternateLineService support by the N900? | 10:38 |
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| inte_ | Just curious... | 10:38 |
| RST38h | qwerty: You may want to insert some usleep() statements here and there, or show me where to look for the main loop and I will try to think of something sensible | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | inte_: there's a talk thread on it | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: touchbook installation seems like fun. | 10:39 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Good luck with that. You *may* have some service names and the like hardcoded in the headers with the mce-dev package, but I don't think you're get any better than that | 10:39 |
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| Macer | are you being sarcastic? :) | 10:39 |
| inte_ | Stskeeps you got a link? | 10:39 |
| RST38h | hmmm...ok | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | inte_: talk.maemo.org search for alternative line service | 10:39 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Yeah, I've shortened the time it locks up for, but it's still a problem | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: it uses a unionfs on ext3 over a squashfs | 10:40 |
| RST38h | qwerty: It does not really lock up. The way it looks to me, it is making shitloads of system calls | 10:40 |
| Macer | unionfs? | 10:40 |
| Macer | wtf? | 10:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I'd lighten up the level selection widgets. | 10:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd | 10:40 |
| RST38h | qwerty: If you simply point me to the source file (URL) which implements the main loop, I can try doing something about it | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: well, aufs | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: so it's always possible to revert to factory settings | 10:41 |
| inte_ | Stskeeps ah i opened that one :-) | 10:41 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: I'll have to look later, I'm not on a computer right now | 10:41 |
| Macer | yeah | 10:41 |
| Macer | by wiping the ext3 partition on the sd | 10:41 |
| Macer | i suppose it automatically rewrites to it | 10:42 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 10:42 |
| Meiz_n810 | i wonder if the aufs makes the Touch Book os so vunerable for hard-reboots | 10:42 |
| Macer | so does that mean you have to figure out how to access whatever it uses internally for the os? | 10:42 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: level selection? | 10:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, sliders and progressbars. | 10:43 |
| inte_ | is the n900 phone app open source? | 10:43 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Oh, BTW, any idea why the SDK repo is lacking source for so much stuff that comes on the N900? | 10:43 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Like powertop and hildon-welcome | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | hildon-welcome is in stage | 10:43 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | I remember seeing hildon-welcome code somewhere... | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: nah.. i pretty much get how it is done, but it's annoying way to do it | 10:43 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: heh | 10:43 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: oh, ok | 10:43 |
| Macer | then make me a mer intall for it :) | 10:44 |
| Macer | or better yet.. maemo5 :-D | 10:44 |
| Macer | that would kick ass.. might be able to find a compatible 3G modem for its internal usb port | 10:44 |
| Macer | omfg | 10:45 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: I think I'll post it on t.m.o. for public test | 10:45 |
| Macer | the screen on this thing keeps blanking on its own | 10:45 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: but I need some shots to showcase :) | 10:45 |
| Macer | it is absolutely annoying | 10:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, I'd also brighten up the button gradients and take the severity down by about a notch. | 10:45 |
| timeless_mbp | wazd: so, did you make a 48x48 icon? | 10:45 |
| * timeless_mbp finished reading 1 mailbox | 10:46 | |
| Stskeeps | Macer: how long are you awake for? | 10:46 |
| wazd | timeless_mbp: oh, so it's 48x48 :) | 10:46 |
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| timeless_mbp | wazd: i really don't know | 10:46 |
| timeless_mbp | but if GeneralAntilles says so, then trust him :) | 10:46 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Acknowledged. Let's get back to it tonight. | 10:47 |
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| wazd | timeless_mbp: http://i061.radikal.ru/0910/48/57d36d754978.png | 10:47 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: i actually have to go to work soon... why? | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | looks good :) | 10:47 |
| timeless_mbp | it actually feels fairly close to the one we used before | 10:48 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: i'll make you a ssquashfs image and you can try it later | 10:48 |
| timeless_mbp | i bet it was the same one :) | 10:48 |
| inte_ | is the n900 phone app open source? | 10:48 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: ok :) sounds good | 10:48 |
| RST38h | wazd: is it for the "Call The Marines!" application? =) | 10:48 |
| RST38h | inte: no | 10:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/ | 10:48 |
| wazd | RST38h: yep :) | 10:48 |
| * qwerty12_N810 laughs at the "2.5" in GeneralAntilles' screenshots | 10:49 | |
| Macer | have to go into the office at 6am .. i will be back pretty soon afterwards.. Stskeeps if you want i'll open up ssh on it and you can have all the fun you want with ti.. i have tow ork on getting my damn web server back up later though.. tech.rancorous.net has been down for like 3 weeks because i haven't had time to work on it | 10:49 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: i had 2's | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, Imma fly over there and kill you with a rusty spoon. | 10:50 |
| Macer | i'm almost done getting it back up | 10:50 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: are gradients screwed up the same way on the device? :( | 10:50 |
| timeless_mbp | marina looks nice | 10:50 |
| timeless_mbp | is it in extras? | 10:50 |
| Macer | but i'm going to have to start from scratch.. which i guess is good i only had 10 articles on it :) | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, yeah, it renders in 16bit | 10:50 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm not a fan of some of the art though | 10:50 |
| Macer | bbl | 10:50 |
| inte_ | RST38h thx | 10:50 |
| timeless_mbp | the icons are mostly old/blocky | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, overall, I'd say the theme is a little too dark. | 10:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Have a look at what you will never get: http://qwerty12.qole.org/imgdump/Screenshot-20091005-070447.png | 10:50 |
| timeless_mbp | http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2666/4007981934_1a8b0a478e_m.jpg | 10:51 |
| * GeneralAntilles didn't even get to go to the Summit to bitch about it. | 10:51 | |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, those icons are way better than that godawful S60 garbage. :P | 10:51 |
| inte_ | RST38h so I will have to contact nokia to get them integrating ALS-support in the phone app I guess | 10:51 |
| timeless_mbp | als? | 10:51 |
| Xisdibik | qwerty12_N810: diaf, i want that :( | 10:51 |
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| RST38h | inte: Depends on what ALS support is | 10:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Be nice if changing the theme didn't also change the background. | 10:52 |
| RST38h | inte: What is it? | 10:52 |
| timeless_mbp | andre__: | 10:53 |
| timeless_mbp | ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- | 10:53 |
| timeless_mbp | You are the QA contact for the bug, or are watching the QA contact. | 10:53 |
| timeless_mbp | You are the QA contact for the bug, or are watching the QA contact. | 10:53 |
| timeless_mbp | --- does it really need to tell me twice? | 10:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes | 10:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Otherwise you might forget. | 10:53 |
| inte_ | RST38h Alternate Line Service: http://your.rogers.com/business/wireless/services/secondvoicelineservice.asp | 10:53 |
| inte_ | RST38h you only get it from certain providers, like Orange, A1, One, Eplus, Rogers... but not from all - this is why it is so less known | 10:54 |
| RST38h | inte: This is something that has to be resolved between Nokia and Rogers | 10:54 |
| inte_ | RST38h but its a great service | 10:54 |
| timeless_mbp | RST38h: so | 10:55 |
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| timeless_mbp | having translated the ui | 10:55 |
| inte_ | RST38h I'm with Eplus (Germany) but I have the service as well | 10:55 |
| timeless_mbp | we'd need to have some more strings for it | 10:55 |
| RST38h | inte: However great it is, I doubt you can add it yourself or make Maemo people add it for you | 10:55 |
| timeless_mbp | we definitely don't support the outbound | 10:55 |
| wazd | damn, I need to remake buttons again then :( | 10:55 |
| inte_ | RST38h I only think that the Rogers description is very nice | 10:55 |
| timeless_mbp | yeah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternate_line_service mostly sucks | 10:55 |
| inte_ | RST38h this is wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternate_line_service | 10:55 |
| RST38h | inte: This is something that needs to get resolved at the baseband module level | 10:55 |
| wazd | I don't get it | 10:56 |
| wazd | http://images.dailymobile.se/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/maemo5-keyboard.jpg | 10:56 |
| inte_ | RST38h and this is the official specification: http://www.scribd.com/doc/14454041/T3000450 | 10:56 |
| wazd | gradients are fine | 10:56 |
| RST38h | inte: If the baseband chip supports it, then the next team would be core/kernel people at Maemo | 10:56 |
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| andre__ | timeless_mbp, known and not important enough to take a look at currently | 10:57 |
| timeless_mbp | ok | 10:57 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: would you mind to make vkb shot?) | 10:57 |
| inte_ | RST38h ah cool. since all nokia symbian phones support als, and the baseband chipsets are probably the same, the core/kernel people should work on it! | 10:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | wazd, was trying to but couldn't open the keyboard to hit ctrl-shift-p then got too lazy to do it through the applet. :P | 10:58 |
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| inte_ | RST38h I guess they are working on the phone app anyways, in order to allow video calling. how do i contact these people? | 10:58 |
| timeless_mbp | you can half open the last row | 10:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | enough to get ctrl and p but w/o losing the vkb | 10:58 |
| RST38h | andre: I am going to change some bug summaries and change them back from enhancements to bugs | 10:59 |
| timeless_mbp | inte_: the wiki page for attendees should have listed the marketing / sales people in attendance | 10:59 |
| RST38h | andre: Hope you will not be offended too much | 10:59 |
| timeless_mbp | RST38h: anything that's not part of the spec and requires feature work is an enhancement request | 10:59 |
| timeless_mbp | changing them away from enhancement will cause serious animosity | 10:59 |
| RST38h | it is different | 11:00 |
| Ceron^ | http://kuvaton.com/bshit/inadequate_warning_label.jpg | 11:00 |
| Ceron^ | is there software for the fm transmitter | 11:00 |
| Ceron^ | people say it works but i see no screenshots | 11:00 |
| timeless_mbp | Ceron^: yes | 11:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's built-in. | 11:00 |
| RST38h | There are a few bugs that I erroneously started with a verb, which makes it possible to mark them as enhancements | 11:00 |
| timeless_mbp | but the software is basically a control panel that lets you turn it on | 11:00 |
| timeless_mbp | and then some portion of audio is routed out via the radio | 11:01 |
| timeless_mbp | the ui lets you say on/off and frequency | 11:01 |
| timeless_mbp | incredibly boring, except to a localizer | 11:01 |
| * timeless_mbp changed at least one of those strings | 11:01 | |
| Ceron^ | GeneralAntilles: how come no screenshots or videos of fm-transmitter in use | 11:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ceron^, because they're really boring. | 11:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | It just works, basically. | 11:02 |
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| Ceron^ | GeneralAntilles: it has a GUI ? | 11:03 |
| Ceron^ | you can stream any audio to the fm transmitter? | 11:03 |
| Ceron^ | even movies? :P | 11:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | You just turn it on. | 11:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | The GUI consists of exactly what timeless described. | 11:03 |
| timeless_mbp | it only streams the audio | 11:04 |
| timeless_mbp | video doesn't get broadcast via fm .... | 11:04 |
| Ceron^ | ofcourse :D | 11:04 |
| Ceron^ | but audio from the movies | 11:04 |
| johnx | timeless, are you sure it isn't streaming the video to your radio? | 11:04 |
| Ceron^ | rofl | 11:04 |
| johnx | have you tested? | 11:04 |
| timeless_mbp | you're accusing my radio of being old and needing an upgrade? | 11:04 |
| Ceron^ | timeless_mbp: what about hands-free using the car radio as speakers | 11:05 |
| Ceron^ | does it work well | 11:05 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't have a license, or a car, or a car radio | 11:05 |
| timeless_mbp | or car radio speakers | 11:05 |
| johnx | just making sure you've tested on a wide variety of video-radios | 11:05 |
| Ceron^ | you would use the phone as a microphone and car-radio as speakers | 11:05 |
| johnx | though I think to stream video to one of those video-radios you need to use included cables ... | 11:05 |
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| Ceron^ | johnx: stop trolling! | 11:05 |
| * johnx gremlins instead | 11:06 | |
| Proteous | if it's anything like the FM trasmiter in my n97 then it sucks unless you have your phone taped to the radio anttenna | 11:06 |
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| johnx | Proteous, probably has more to do with FCC/CE regulations than poor construction of the transmitter | 11:07 |
| Lupu | Ceron^: I don't have a radio lying around, but when the FM-transmitter is enabled the device's internal speakers are silent | 11:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | 10' works just fine with my shitty clock radio. | 11:07 |
| Proteous | johnx: I've used extrnal fm trasmitters that worked much much better | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | Proteous: is your n97 targeted for Europe | 11:07 |
| Proteous | no | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | someone explained that radio transmitters for the USA are allowed to be more powerful than equivalent European products | 11:07 |
| timeless_mbp | yay CE | 11:07 |
| Lupu | There's no UI for the FM transmitter while playing video, but if you enable it in the Music player at least the internal speakers are silent while playing video | 11:08 |
| Proteous | interesting | 11:08 |
| Lupu | which leads me to thinking it's broadcasting to FM.. | 11:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/4007249481/ | 11:08 |
| Proteous | my n97 has funtionality in the music player to turn on the FM transimter but you can also use a seperate app to just turn it on and off when you want | 11:09 |
| Proteous | and it routes all audio out to the transmitter | 11:09 |
| timeless_mbp | Proteous: does it persist across power off? | 11:09 |
| Proteous | hmm, I don't know, I don't usualy turn off my phone :) | 11:10 |
| Proteous | I can see | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | set an alarm :) | 11:10 |
| * GeneralAntilles chuckles at Proteous's N97. | 11:10 | |
| timeless_mbp | i want to know if it sends the alarm to your fm radio if your device is off :) | 11:10 |
| johnx | timeless, actually that's a pretty cool idea :) | 11:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Leaving your radio on all night tuned to a non-existent station or setting an alarm on both? | 11:11 |
| johnx | using my FM alarm clock's alarm along with my N900's music | 11:11 |
| johnx | and the failure mode is terrifying static that will wake me up anyways | 11:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | My wakeup time varies by day, unfortunately. | 11:11 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, play music on the n900, set the radio alarm on the clock | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | my wakeup time varies by sun | 11:11 |
| timeless_mbp | what varies more is my getting out the door time | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, why involve the radio? | 11:12 |
| johnx | in that case you want a phone alarm | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, N900's speakers blast great. | 11:12 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: ta | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: fwiw, the n900's screen works to wake me up | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | i've had my device on silent but calendar had alarms | 11:12 |
| johnx | I have a soft spot for rube goldberg (sp?) style solutions | 11:12 |
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| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, you tape it to your eyes? | 11:12 |
| timeless_mbp | the alarm caused the screen to wake up, and that woke me | 11:12 |
| johnx | timeless, sometimes... | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, don't we all. But still. :P | 11:12 |
| Proteous | nope the FM transmitter doesn't stay on after power cycling my phone | 11:13 |
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| timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: does fm on persist for the n900? | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | i suspect it does | 11:14 |
| Proteous | probably not | 11:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, I've just rebooted about a half-dozen times. :P | 11:14 |
| Proteous | since it uses up battery quite fast | 11:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, I'm not testing that. :D | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | one more won't hurt :) | 11:14 |
| * wazd 's tired of fixing gradients :( | 11:14 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | wazd, make a monochrome display theme! | 11:15 |
| Stskeeps | wazd, afb said he had a svg version of template | 11:15 |
| * johnx tests | 11:15 | |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, for ebook readers? | 11:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, I want a theme that look like an old calculator. | 11:16 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: and? :) | 11:16 |
| Stskeeps | wazd, true, ps guy.. | 11:16 |
| johnx | and I want the ringtone from the newest star trek :> | 11:16 |
| wazd | I'll try one dirty trick | 11:16 |
| johnx | nope, fm transmitter is set to off on reboot | 11:18 |
| johnx | probably to save people who forget it's on and "fix" the problem with a reboot | 11:18 |
| Proteous | heh | 11:18 |
| Lupu | How about a theme with some fingerprints 'preinstalled'? Perhaps that would help me spend less time trying to clean the screen. | 11:18 |
| Proteous | it's the same reason all your other apps don't just start up when you reboot | 11:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | Lupu: heh | 11:19 |
| timeless_mbp | Proteous: um | 11:20 |
| timeless_mbp | most of our apps *do* start :) | 11:20 |
| johnx | Proteous, yeah. reboot is much more of a first-round troubleshooting trick these days than something that people do for power reasons (or it's becoming that way at least) | 11:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Need some documentation on the hildon-welcome conf. | 11:21 |
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| sarower | I have a server program and i am trying to bind it to port 80 | 11:26 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, bit more information? | 11:26 |
| sarower | But it is giving following error "Transport endpoint is not connected | 11:26 |
| sarower | " | 11:26 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: When running the server program inside scratchbox it can not bind using port 80 | 11:27 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: Giving above error | 11:27 |
| RST38h | Ok, I moved this bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5336 from enhancement to normal | 11:27 |
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| crashanddie_ | is there socket connectivity in scratchbox? | 11:29 |
| crashanddie_ | can't remember | 11:29 |
| sarower | yes | 11:30 |
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| sarower | crashanddie_: If i bind it to another port say 3024 it is ok | 11:30 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: but binding to port below 1024 is problem | 11:30 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:31 |
| wazd | well, dirty tricks doesn't work for .pngs :) | 11:31 |
| wazd | let's use some more advanced | 11:31 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, are you root/fakeroot? | 11:31 |
| RST38h | wazd: BTW, Maemo6 is supposed to go .svg | 11:32 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: inside scratchbox in PC | 11:32 |
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| sarower | crashanddie_: So it is as normal user mode and it is appplet | 11:33 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, sorry, I never use scratchbox | 11:33 |
| crashanddie_ | anyway, I need to get to work, talk later | 11:34 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: Oh ok i am developing applet.... | 11:34 |
| crashanddie_ | o/ Jaffa | 11:34 |
| johnx | sarower, you're trying to bind to :80 as part of your applet? | 11:34 |
| sarower | johnx: yes... | 11:34 |
| Myrtti | question is, *why* | 11:34 |
| sarower | johnx: right | 11:34 |
| RST38h | moo Myrtti. | 11:35 |
| johnx | you'll need root access to do that, and also it is very likely to conflict with other programs that might be "real" web servers | 11:35 |
| Myrtti | baa RST38h | 11:35 |
| sarower | johnx: That could be.. but I need this cause another application connects to this port so i must listen to this port | 11:36 |
| sarower | johnx: So how i can ndo this? | 11:36 |
| sarower | do* | 11:36 |
| johnx | you need to run your program as root | 11:37 |
| Myrtti | I wonder what he's up to | 11:37 |
| johnx | and you'll need to be running it as root on the device | 11:37 |
| johnx | but you app will also likely need to have some kind of code to make it conflict with anything that provides a web server | 11:37 |
| johnx | I would *highly* suggest that you separate it out into a daemon process and an applet process | 11:38 |
| RST38h | Myrtti: Asking a lot of questions, as always? =) | 11:39 |
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| sarower | johnx: Ok, But in the pc as root user i am using port 80. And first time it is working fine but second time immediately when i am trying to bind again it is producing the same error | 11:39 |
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| sarower | johnx: Why this error even i am root | 11:40 |
| sarower | ? | 11:40 |
| johnx | and also it will definitely need to elegantly handle the situation where something else is already bound to :80 | 11:40 |
| johnx | I assume you can't change the code of the other program, sarower? | 11:40 |
| sarower | johnx: yes... | 11:40 |
| sarower | johnx: You are right | 11:41 |
| wazd | RST38h: ok, I'll wait until 2011 then :D | 11:41 |
| RST38h | wazd: You said earlier that you hated SVG? =) | 11:41 |
| johnx | if it works once then fails a second time, maybe the first instance is still hanging around somehow? | 11:41 |
| andre__ | RST38h, still bug 5336 remains an enhancement | 11:41 |
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| johnx | might want to try: netstat -tnap | grep :80 | 11:41 |
| sarower | johnx: Yes I think so.... but i can not find the reason... | 11:42 |
| RST38h | andre: And Maps remain disfunctional wherever I need to travel. Thank you. | 11:42 |
| andre__ | i never disagreed with that. | 11:42 |
| andre__ | no "Thank you". | 11:42 |
| RST38h | Well, anything that makes application disfunctional is a defect and needs to be fixed. | 11:43 |
| andre__ | your definition of disfunctional is VERY wide. | 11:43 |
| andre__ | maybe that also explains why you file no reports as enhancements ;-) | 11:43 |
| RST38h | My definition of disfunctional is "Cannot make use of the application" | 11:43 |
| * RST38h does not file for enhancements because enhancements never get looked at | 11:44 | |
| andre__ | don't get me wrong, you have a very good point. but it simply was never announced or planned by nokia to provide that, i think. hence by that definition it's an enhancement | 11:44 |
| andre__ | so you want me to correct your severity every time? | 11:44 |
| RST38h | andre: Nokia provides offline map set downloading for its Maps application on Symbian phones | 11:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, bugs in bugzilla never get looked at by Nokia enhancement or not. | 11:45 |
| andre__ | aha. so why isn't that written in the bug report? | 11:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | So who cares? | 11:45 |
| RST38h | andre: Because I do not get exceedingly anal in my buug reports unless forced to. | 11:45 |
| sarower | johnx: It is showing first something like: 127.0.0.1:80 127.0.0.1:80 CLOSE_WAIT | 11:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, vote for this please: http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5369 | 11:45 |
| sarower | johnx: Then like 127.0.0.1:80 127.0.0.1:80 TIME_WAIT | 11:45 |
| johnx | yeah, looks like something is holding the port open | 11:46 |
| andre__ | RST38h, yeah. and that makes me waste a lot of time. be exact if you want your stuff to get fixed. | 11:46 |
| RST38h | andre: but yes, in a Symbian version there is Map Downloader that lets you download maps before you travel | 11:46 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, i take you've never written socket applications for linux? | 11:46 |
| johnx | sarower, it should list the PID as well | 11:46 |
| cvandonderen | where can I find docs about QMaemoInternetConnectivity? it gives me an error (with the Qt 4.6 alpha maemo version) | 11:46 |
| andre__ | RST38h, then please mention it. dude, it's way easier to convince people when having such arguments. really. it helps getting your reports fixed if you are exact... | 11:46 |
| crashanddie_ | johnx, no, not necessarily | 11:46 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, add proper error handling to your application, and signal handling as well. Catch SIGTERM and make sure to close every socket in your app before giving up the ghost | 11:47 |
| RST38h | andre: Ok, I will. Although back here at work, anything that does not let people use our product is a showstopping bug | 11:47 |
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| johnx | RST38h, if I "file a bug" that I can't use a core 2 duo because it won't run off 2 watts, how seriously will I be taken? | 11:47 |
| sarower | johnx: No PID | 11:47 |
| RST38h | andre: The only loophole is if you can prove that your user intends to do something unusual to the product | 11:47 |
| andre__ | RST38h, different definitions... i also have a different definition of such stuff when it comes to gnome instead of maemo... | 11:47 |
| RST38h | andre: But this loophole can't be taken here, I am afraid | 11:48 |
| RST38h | johnx: You will be directed to buy an Atom | 11:48 |
| andre__ | heh. yeah, looks harder :-/ | 11:48 |
| johnx | RST38h, try maemo mapper | 11:48 |
| crashanddie_ | let's put it another way: networking is a requirement for the maps application | 11:48 |
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| * GeneralAntilles hands andre__ and RST38h 2x4s to fight this out with. | 11:48 | |
| RST38h | johnx: Not available for N900. Not a Nokia product. | 11:49 |
| crashanddie_ | it's like browser, you don't see people moaning browser doesn't work as soon as there is no connectivity, right? | 11:49 |
| RST38h | johnx: I.e. it is like me suggesting you to switch to Arm ;) | 11:49 |
| Corsac | crashanddie_: well, no | 11:49 |
| Corsac | crashanddie_: you can browse local content | 11:49 |
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| Corsac | at least you should be able to | 11:49 |
| sarower | johnx: Any way what does this means........? Is it meaning that the previous binding is not yet closed yet? | 11:49 |
| RST38h | and some people do browse local content | 11:50 |
| Corsac | crashanddie_: wether maps or html pages | 11:50 |
| crashanddie_ | sarower, yup | 11:50 |
| andre__ | maps IS based on browser afaik | 11:50 |
| andre__ | in fremantle | 11:50 |
| johnx | RST38h, heh...well I'd be terribly surprised to see even an atom-based board hit 2 watts max draw | 11:50 |
| sarower | crashanddie_: Thank you | 11:50 |
| crashanddie_ | anyway, maps is shit, who uses it anyway? | 11:50 |
| johnx | crashanddie_, why wouldn't it show a PID? is it the busybox netstat? | 11:50 |
| andre__ | i agree that it could be in a way better state, yeah | 11:50 |
| johnx | crashanddie_, not much choice for maemo5 yet ... | 11:50 |
| tekojo | morning all | 11:51 |
| crashanddie_ | johnx, there is no process associated with it IIRC | 11:51 |
| RST38h | johnx: I won't | 11:51 |
| frals | *votes for maps working offline* | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | morning tekojo | 11:51 |
| RST38h | johnx: As long as it is only the Atom | 11:51 |
| andre__ | frals, voting is highly welcome, really | 11:51 |
| crashanddie_ | johnx, the process is effectively dead, it's just an ancient thing to allow clients to disconnect/notice there's a problem before allowing anyone else to use the port | 11:51 |
| Corsac | maemo mapper (or mapper) aren't ported yet? | 11:51 |
| andre__ | morning tekojo | 11:51 |
| Corsac | or not maintained at all? | 11:51 |
| frals | yeah, im voting whenever i see something good, like maps working offline :) | 11:52 |
| crashanddie_ | johnx, say you cause apache2 to crash, and then very quickly jump in and grab the 80 port, if the timing is right, you intercept a mouthful of posted data or whatever | 11:52 |
| andre__ | Corsac, haven't seen it yet for Fremantle, but would certainly be nice to have it | 11:52 |
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| Jaffa | It's a Fremantle Star, so it should be coming. | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | maemo mapper is ported but in a bad state last i checked | 11:52 |
| johnx | sarower, can you paste the whole output of netstat -tnap somewhere? | 11:52 |
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| crashanddie_ | anyway, off to work, have fun everyone | 11:53 |
| tekojo | Corsac there was a blog post in italian telling that there is work going on for MaemoMapper on Maemo 5 | 11:53 |
| johnx | 'later crashanddie_ | 11:53 |
| Corsac | http://git.tal.org/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=mapper.git;a=summary that doesn't look very good :) | 11:53 |
| johnx | the new map viewer for gnome might be reasonable | 11:53 |
| crashanddie_ | (just 2 hours late :-*) | 11:53 |
| Stskeeps | Corsac: it's in garage | 11:53 |
| Corsac | yeah but I don't see any code there: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mapper/ | 11:54 |
| Corsac | (this is mapper, not maemo mapper) | 11:54 |
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| frals | anyone with a device (or without) who could help me with http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=344886#post344886 ? :) (MMS support research stuff) | 11:56 |
| * frals heads off for a while to do an heuristic evaluation | 11:57 | |
| RST38h | frals: Was discussed at Summit | 11:57 |
| RST38h | frals: Basically, sending part can be done right now in user space by implementing a sharing plugin | 11:58 |
| RST38h | frals: Receiving part requires kernel work (as you probably know) | 11:58 |
| frals | cool | 11:58 |
| RST38h | frals: Nokia will not implement half-the-MMS because it will be a support nightmare | 11:58 |
| RST38h | frals: But if you wish to code a sharing plugin, help yourself, I can tell you whom to ask for documentation if there is something missing in the SDK | 11:59 |
| frals | should be possible to do receving only over http thou, which should work without kernel work right? | 12:00 |
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| frals | thanks, ill take a look at the sharing stuff when i get home :) | 12:00 |
| RST38h | receiving over http is useless | 12:00 |
| RST38h | sending over http to an internet connected MMSC is somewhat useless though as long as you find a free-MMS-forwarding service | 12:01 |
| RST38h | s/useless/useful/ | 12:01 |
| infobot | RST38h meant: sending over http to an internet connected MMSC is somewhat useful though as long as you find a free-MMS-forwarding service | 12:01 |
| sarower | johnx: tcp 0 0 127.0.0.1:56164 127.0.0.1:80 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:02 |
| johnx | and nothing on the line below it? | 12:02 |
| sarower | johnx: tcp 0 0 127.0.0.1:80 127.0.0.1:56164 TIME_WAIT | 12:03 |
| sarower | johnx: nothing | 12:03 |
| wazd | let's rock | 12:03 |
| johnx | netstat wraps lines in an 80 column terminal | 12:03 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: have time to make another .deb? :) | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | sure | 12:03 |
| frals | RST38h: thanks for the input :) do you have time to post it in the topic or should I? | 12:03 |
| RST38h | frals: Please do not post it verbatim | 12:04 |
| johnx | sarower, I think crashanddie's advice is probably closest, that somehow you're not closing the port when the applet dies | 12:04 |
| RST38h | frals: Also, it is all pretty useless information unless you are willing to code the actual plugin | 12:04 |
| frals | i was just gonna add the sending part could be done via the sharing pluginsystem pretty much and that receving requires kernel work | 12:05 |
| sarower | johnx: The thing is that it probably close the port after some time say 1/2 min | 12:05 |
| RST38h | frals: If you want to add the sending part properly (i.e. to your proivder's MMSC) it also requires kernel work | 12:06 |
| sarower | johnx: So when i am trying again very immediateky | 12:06 |
| wazd | wow, new .png is huge | 12:06 |
| johnx | don't know what to tell you... | 12:06 |
| sarower | johnx: It is giving this error | 12:06 |
| sarower | johnx: Cause if i try after some time sday 1/2 min it is again working fine | 12:07 |
| frals | RST38h: oh, right, the sharing plugin would require a free MMS-forwarding service.. | 12:07 |
| sarower | for once | 12:07 |
| johnx | sarower, sorry, but I'm off to sleep. make sure that your program is carefully closing sockets when it's killed | 12:08 |
| johnx | good luck | 12:08 |
| johnx | 'night all | 12:08 |
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| sarower | johnx: Ok thank you | 12:08 |
| sarower | and good night | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | morning sopi | 12:08 |
| sopi | good morning ;) | 12:09 |
| andre__ | RST38h, actually Map data should be cached so if you are in phone offline mode you should be able to use it if you have used the Maps app before. and that's a bug. maybe we can agree on that and we're both fine? :-) | 12:09 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: I've sent you new .png if you don't mind :) | 12:09 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: buildin' | 12:09 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: awesone | 12:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Damn, what do I need to do to get XTerm to see a new ttf? | 12:10 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: it's much heavier now though :( | 12:10 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: dithering is a bad thing for .pngs | 12:10 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: they are optimized for gradient rendering | 12:11 |
| frals | regarding Map data: is it possible to preload it with eg. nokia maps loader? or was that not supported | 12:11 |
| RST38h | andre: When I fly in from a different country, I do not have any cached data for the destination country | 12:11 |
| RST38h | andre: So, technically, what you have written is not the situation described by the bug report | 12:11 |
| andre__ | RST38h, I'd assume that you have GPRS available at an airport | 12:11 |
| RST38h | andre: I do not. | 12:11 |
| wazd | RST38h: buy a paper map :) | 12:11 |
| RST38h | andre: Do not assume that I have connectivity available. | 12:11 |
| johnx | RST38h, if you file it as an enhancement request, I'll vote for it | 12:12 |
| Jaffa | frals: There's a blog post I've found which makes it easy | 12:12 |
| RST38h | andre: The bug report explicitely talks about Maps being unusable when there is no connectivity (GPRS included) | 12:12 |
| Jaffa | You can just copy the maps over, no need for an app | 12:12 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: ready for round two? :) | 12:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, sure. | 12:12 |
| andre__ | RST38h, okay. that's simply not supported and not planned as far as I know. | 12:12 |
| frals | Jaffa: ah, awesome - got a link? | 12:12 |
| RST38h | johnx: I ultimately have no control on whether it is a defect or an enhancement | 12:12 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: The original bug description said "Document way to copy maps offline" | 12:13 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: gradients should look way better now | 12:13 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: See, it is not supported and not planned. | 12:13 |
| Jaffa | frals: Trying to find it | 12:13 |
| frals | cheers | 12:14 |
| RST38h | johnx: To me, not being able to use Maps in exact situations where I NEED Maps is a bug, really | 12:14 |
| Jaffa | http://handphone-solution.blogspot.com/2009/07/direct-download-for-ovi-maps-30-without.html | 12:14 |
| Jaffa | ^frals etc. | 12:14 |
| andre__ | Jaffa, interesting. Does that also work on the N900? | 12:15 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Your energies would be better spent getting a real company, who actually knows what they're doing when it comes to navigation software, to port their map app to the N900 | 12:15 |
| johnx | RST38h, but it's outside their planned use-cases. Just like using an atom-based system on 2 watts is outside Intel's use case. Both situations which they'd probably like to support, but don't currently | 12:15 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810++ | 12:15 |
| RST38h | qwerty: I simply want the included software to work as advertised | 12:15 |
| andre__ | hmm. was that advertised? | 12:16 |
| RST38h | johnx: 2Wt Atom system is not outside Intel's use case | 12:16 |
| RST38h | johnx: Just trust me on this :) | 12:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: If it's using the browser... C'mon, we both think the same way about browserd :) | 12:16 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Will this work on the tablet though? | 12:16 |
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| RST38h | johnx: And, unlike writing a document on how to download map sets, it is a hard physical problem | 12:17 |
| johnx | RST38h, but the point remains that, it's an enhancement, rather than something they promised but didn't deliver | 12:18 |
| andre__ | basically Maps IS a webservice. hence you need web (data connection). | 12:18 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: look in your inbox | 12:18 |
| RST38h | johnx: Haven't they promised the map use? =) | 12:18 |
| * RST38h will actually try Jaffa's directions on the tablet | 12:19 | |
| Corsac | browser can't work in offline mode at all? | 12:19 |
| Corsac | (though using midori or tear it'll work, I guess) | 12:20 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: thanks a lot! | 12:20 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: check your spam section :D | 12:20 |
| johnx | RST38h, it can be used under certain circumstances. you could take them to court and try and get money back, but if you want them to fix bugs it's probably better to work within the system rather than ending up with the bugmaster resenting you :P | 12:20 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: And enlarge your penis now for $9.99 btw :D | 12:20 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Yeah, should o | 12:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Stop being a tight-ass: It's his birthday, you pay for it :p | 12:21 |
| Jaffa | What's the bug, I'll add a link to http://www.maemopeople.org/index.php/jaffa/2009/10/13/downloading_ovi_maps_without_a_network_c | 12:21 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: oh! I almost forgot :) | 12:21 |
| RST38h | johnx: Given that this will never be implemented if filed as enhancement, neither route looks fruitful | 12:21 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5336 | 12:22 |
| johnx | RST38h, but the situation where the bugmaster doesn't automatically assume bugs filed by you are mis-catagorized might be more beneficial, if we look at this as a positive sum game | 12:22 |
| andre__ | RST38h, if you want to keep me away from work you could not only not set the priority correctly but also file it under wrong product ;-)) | 12:22 |
| RST38h | Ah, btw, GPS also seems not to work if there is no connectivity | 12:22 |
| RST38h | andre: That is not my goal when filing bugs. | 12:23 |
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| johnx | RST38h, though I suggest engineering a situation where the maps lead programmer ends up being sent to a conference in a country where he doesn't have cell access :) | 12:23 |
| andre__ | i was ironic of course. but saying that enhancement will remain totally ignored is not true either :) | 12:23 |
| frals | good thing im gonna be broke after getting my n900 so i wont have to worry going abroad with maps and get charged an arm and a leg for roaming ;) | 12:23 |
| RST38h | johnx: AFAIK, the strategy is to change any bug that even remotely asks for something extra as an enhancement, so it does not really matter what YOU mark them with | 12:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, much better. | 12:23 |
| andre__ | RST38h, that's not true | 12:24 |
| andre__ | bugs are bugs. | 12:24 |
| andre__ | but if stuff was never planned to be implemented it's an enhancement | 12:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre__, wants to steal all of our pocket lint! | 12:24 |
| RST38h | andre: Sorry I cannot believe that using maps without connectivity has never been planned | 12:24 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: I think ubersharp screen makes things even better | 12:25 |
| andre__ | RST38h, it IS planned, by caching. that is a valid bug, i already wrote here | 12:25 |
| RST38h | andre: Some other things I can believe, by stretching my imagination a little, but not this one | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | i thought there was preinstalled maps? :P | 12:25 |
| wazd | Japan phones have 848x480 2.5" screens though :D | 12:25 |
| RST38h | andre: Especially considering that Symbian phones HAVE this feature | 12:26 |
| johnx | getting this hildonized/maemo-ized seems like the answer: http://www.novopia.com/ | 12:26 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps has a point. We've been recieving generic eMMC images, remember | 12:26 |
| wazd | iPhone look like tetris near them | 12:26 |
| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: your bug has been demoted to an "enhancement" | 12:26 |
| Shapeshifter | GeneralAntilles: :| | 12:26 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, fixed in harmattan :D | 12:27 |
| * johnx is joking. don't kill me | 12:27 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Enhancement, my arse | 12:27 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, "enhance your arse for $7.96!" | 12:27 |
| * GeneralAntilles just really hates Nokia. | 12:27 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | johnx: Only if you pay | 12:27 |
| andre__ | RST38h, comparing to symbian does not really mean a lot in the context of a maemo bug report, i think. though of course it's still definitely helpful to mention it, to push devs a bit | 12:28 |
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| Corsac | well, the apps is called the same way | 12:29 |
| Corsac | one could even assume it's the same one | 12:29 |
| frals | well, to the average user they see "Ovi Maps" and expects it to work the same way imo | 12:29 |
| Corsac | definitely | 12:29 |
| * rmt_ notices that gmail is (now?) replacing links within emails to google redirects .. maybe time to setup my own webmail.. any suggestions? | 12:29 | |
| andre__ | True. Well, I'm not here to defend Nokia. I'm more trying to explain how processes work (and they of course can be criticized) | 12:30 |
| * RST38h already got how processes work =) | 12:30 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | andre__: Don't worry, we've already learnt how two-faced Nokia is | 12:30 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: some new shots and I'll leave you alone :D | 12:30 |
| frals | im just here so i wont have to do this heuristic evaluation im suppose to :p | 12:30 |
| andre__ | RST38h, I personally think that your point of view is a bit too negative. But I think most here have a certain level of frustration as we all faced some weird decisions in the past | 12:31 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, I kind of want to photoshop that batman villain's head on to one of the Nokia guys who was at maemo summit :D | 12:31 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | johnx: Since you're having doubts about doing it, I dare you :D | 12:32 |
| johnx | thanks :) | 12:33 |
| johnx | movie or comic? | 12:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Movie | 12:33 |
| johnx | ugh | 12:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Maybe that way they can include it with the N900 | 12:33 |
| johnx | just did the GIS for that... | 12:33 |
| RST38h | andre: You want positive viewpoint for a change, talk to General =) | 12:34 |
| RST38h | Although I suspect he is slowly crossing to the dark side as well... | 12:34 |
| Corsac | there's no dark side | 12:34 |
| Corsac | matter of fact, it's all dark | 12:34 |
| andre__ | hehe | 12:34 |
| RST38h | Corsac <-- has seen the light of truth =) | 12:34 |
| RST38h | or blacklight of truth, anyway | 12:35 |
| Corsac | backlight? | 12:35 |
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| RST38h | eh. | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | wb lcuk | 12:35 |
| Myrtti | lcuk: ohai, hows things? | 12:35 |
| tru | according to the place where I ordered a N900 it will ship on thursday. let's hope they are right :-) | 12:35 |
| RST38h | did they tell which thirsday? | 12:35 |
| johnx | backlight of truth? | 12:35 |
| lcuk | hi Stskeeps, Myrtti \o | 12:36 |
| lcuk | RST38h, johnx \o | 12:36 |
| Corsac | which place is it? | 12:36 |
| * qwerty12_N810 meows at lcuk | 12:36 | |
| RST38h | heya lcuk | 12:37 |
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| wazd | lcuk: heya | 12:38 |
| lcuk | hi wazd \o | 12:38 |
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| * wazd just read Mer slides | 12:38 | |
| Stskeeps | giving up all hope? :P | 12:38 |
| *** wazd is now known as tallented_russia | 12:38 | |
| tallented_russia | oh | 12:38 |
| Stskeeps | i didn't spell it with two l's did i? ;) | 12:39 |
| *** tallented_russia is now known as talented_russian | 12:39 | |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 12:39 |
| talented_russian | Stskeeps: :P | 12:39 |
| Corsac | are all the MS slides available somewhere? | 12:39 |
| Corsac | (especially the security track) | 12:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | talented_russian, http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/ | 12:40 |
| * lcuk still hasnt got over the lack of bacon in amsterdam | 12:40 | |
| RST38h | Jaffa: I *think* this trick with the maps may work | 12:40 |
| *** talented_russian is now known as wazd | 12:41 | |
| javispedro | security track... ohmy. | 12:41 |
| lcuk | Corsac, the security slides are available, but you need a license to view them | 12:41 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: And may even be automated with a really small Python program | 12:41 |
| johnx | lcuk, you missed the bacon pancakes or bacon waffles or whatever they were? | 12:41 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Will tell more in a few moments | 12:41 |
| lcuk | the quiche things? | 12:41 |
| javispedro | i wish i had been there to facepalm at the mention of capacitive then suicide at the next slide (about drm) | 12:41 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: awesome-o! | 12:41 |
| RST38h | javispedro: You will have your chance next year =) | 12:42 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: And not to get an N900? :p | 12:42 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: simple button failed though | 12:42 |
| javispedro | that too, ok >:) | 12:42 |
| Myrtti | mmmm quiche | 12:42 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, the n900 helped pretty well as a bribe | 12:42 |
| Corsac | lcuk: so I need an N900 first? | 12:42 |
| Corsac | lcuk: or which kind of license is it? | 12:42 |
| lcuk | and 2 pints of blood from your firstborn | 12:43 |
| * qwerty12_N810 yays at seeing Simple Brightness Applet | 12:43 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Capacitive at 800x480 and 3.5" will SUUUCK | 12:43 |
| * RST38h does not see what is the problem with capacitive screen option BTW | 12:43 | |
| Corsac | it's not yet born but I can give mine in advance | 12:43 |
| lcuk | i dont see problem with the option either | 12:43 |
| RST38h | They have got the precision problem more or less solved by now | 12:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, what if it isn't an option? | 12:43 |
| RST38h | General: Still ok with me | 12:43 |
| javispedro | i. want. stylus. | 12:43 |
| RST38h | General: With a tiny screen like this, you are not gonna use it as a tablet anyway =( =) | 12:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | I want to be able to sketch. | 12:44 |
| * lcuk does too | 12:44 | |
| johnx | javispedro, the DRM situation is only going to be lame for people who get the phone as part of a subsidized deal with a SIM lock | 12:44 |
| johnx | lcuk, nah, it was a restaurant. I tried to tell you about it. was like a block from the hotel | 12:44 |
| lcuk | o_O thats close | 12:44 |
| RST38h | javispedro: There is a certain door at Nokia HQ tat you can stick your finger into, and make it into a stylus | 12:44 |
| Corsac | johnx: which is the majority of people imho | 12:44 |
| lcuk | should i fly back and try it ?! | 12:44 |
| RST38h | javispedro: it will work on capacitive screens too | 12:44 |
| johnx | Corsac, then the phone isn't really yours. so as of now Nokia can't be in that market at all | 12:45 |
| Corsac | eh? | 12:45 |
| Corsac | Nokia already is in that market | 12:45 |
| lcuk | wazd Marina looks excellent! | 12:45 |
| johnx | Corsac, name a SIM locked, maemo-based phone | 12:45 |
| RST38h | General: You will probably be able to sketch with capacitive. Not like draw blueprints, but then it is not possible on such a small screen anyway | 12:45 |
| Corsac | I don't know about other countries, but in France the vast majority of phones are subsidied | 12:45 |
| wazd | lcuk: thx :) | 12:46 |
| Corsac | johnx: oh, maemo based :) | 12:46 |
| wazd | lcuk: lot's of small faults though | 12:46 |
| * lcuk nods | 12:46 | |
| johnx | Corsac, cause, I bet that you can't software unlock your Symbian SIM-locked subsidized phone, without some hacking | 12:46 |
| lcuk | RST38h, liqflow type stuff works with capacitive | 12:47 |
| lcuk | but not the kind of note taking and precision stylus work i do | 12:47 |
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| Corsac | johnx: I don't own a symbian phone so I can't really tell | 12:48 |
| Corsac | johnx: but unlock is free after 6 months in France | 12:48 |
| johnx | Corsac, then it'll be the same for a maemo based phone | 12:48 |
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| Corsac | definitely | 12:48 |
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| johnx | once it's not SIM-locked you never have to worry about any DRM-related software on your device | 12:49 |
| Corsac | johnx: btw, I think the DRM stuff won't be a problem for the same majority of people which will buy the n900 subsidied | 12:49 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Corsac: Wow, congrats to the French for not actually surrendering on something | 12:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Supporting the locked-device users is going to be hell. | 12:49 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles, why we'd need to do that? | 12:49 |
| johnx | Corsac, I could see it being kind a bummer in some specific circumstances, but keep in mind their implementation is still at least a year out | 12:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, because they're going to come to us. | 12:50 |
| javispedro | they won't be able to install extras apps either way. | 12:50 |
| johnx | javispedro, LOLwut? | 12:50 |
| javispedro | nor swap the kernel, nor modules, nor... | 12:50 |
| Stskeeps | sigh.. so much misinformation | 12:50 |
| johnx | not install extras apps? | 12:50 |
| glass | eh.. the simlocked would also lock user installation of any debs? | 12:50 |
| javispedro | wait and see :) | 12:50 |
| johnx | javispedro, I talked to the guys implementing this. back up your claim | 12:50 |
| * qwerty12_N810 wouldn't be surprised if that was true | 12:51 | |
| johnx | glass, no | 12:51 |
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| Corsac | it might depend on the carriers, too | 12:51 |
| glass | that would be even bigger shaft than symbian platsec. so can't see it really happening that way | 12:51 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | I mean, Application Manager is already becoming a second-class citizen to the Ovi Store | 12:51 |
| Corsac | I'm a bit wondering what will be the carrier power on the locking | 12:51 |
| javispedro | this is just a foresee. don't want to create a rumour. | 12:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ovi Store _hyperlink_ | 12:51 |
| Corsac | qwerty12_N810: does it only works online? | 12:51 |
| * Corsac hides | 12:51 | |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, does it on symbian? or android? or winmo? | 12:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Corsac, yes. | 12:52 |
| johnx | javispedro, then don't phrase it like it's fact and confuse people...that's exactly how rumors start | 12:52 |
| javispedro | ok, hint got. | 12:52 |
| qwerty12_N810 | johnx: How would I know? But you have 1001 links to the Ovi store, and one icon for the Application manager hidden away with Extras disabled | 12:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | So, yeah, I'd say it's a second-class citizen. | 12:53 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, not sure I really follow. there was the big "tableteer" link on the N800 desktop and look how it totally took over everything *rolls eyes* | 12:53 |
| johnx | javispedro, :) not meaning to be harsh... | 12:53 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, the kind of people who actually *want* to install apps tend to be pretty good about finding this stuff | 12:54 |
| johnx | but I guess I didn't realize it was going to be off by default on shipping devices | 12:54 |
| johnx | think I'll wait and see | 12:54 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: did you seriously make a mer image for the tb ? :) like. won't the hardware like not work? | 12:54 |
| Stskeeps | keep in mind this is not the final sw though | 12:54 |
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| Stskeeps | Macer: i made a generic ARM image. it might work. | 12:55 |
| Macer | i would figure you would need a kernel for it | 12:55 |
| Macer | oh | 12:55 |
| Stskeeps | want it? | 12:55 |
| IcanCU_ | so is maemo linux? | 12:55 |
| Macer | not now but later today yes | 12:55 |
| Stskeeps | k | 12:55 |
| javispedro | johnx, no no, you're right. it shouldn't let my pesimism out so much. | 12:55 |
| Macer | anything to get away from this tb os | 12:55 |
| Macer | :) | 12:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, Quim basically said it wont. | 12:55 |
| Macer | thanks | 12:55 |
| javispedro | specially with the recent news about the 3d drivers :) | 12:55 |
| Macer | it won't break my tb will it? :) | 12:55 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: you'll have to take your chances. | 12:56 |
| Corsac | isn't it already broken? :) | 12:56 |
| Macer | lol | 12:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, I keep getting burned every time I try to be optimistic. | 12:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Getting hard to not be pessimistic. | 12:56 |
| Macer | Corsac: haha.. depends on whgat you consider broken | 12:56 |
| Macer | technicallyl.. i can boot it and i can use stuff on it | 12:56 |
| johnx | javispedro, did they have a video of the security presentation online? or just the slides? | 12:56 |
| Macer | so i guess it's not broken.. just not working to its full potential | 12:56 |
| johnx | the slides look admittedly grim when viewed alone | 12:56 |
| Macer | it could be awesome if it could run maemo or even android | 12:56 |
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| javispedro | johnx, dunno. | 12:57 |
| Macer | but i need information on how to install other operating systems | 12:57 |
| johnx | IcanCU_, yes | 12:57 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: where did you find the info on how to install different operating systems? | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: i read the stuff to use to make a SD card and drew my own conclusions | 12:57 |
| Macer | oh | 12:58 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: iwannattestiwannatest | 12:58 |
| Macer | so realistically it won't really affect anything since it's all sd huh? | 12:58 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: oh shit | 12:58 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: forgot to attach deb :D | 12:58 |
| Macer | i could just use another sd :) | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 12:58 |
| Macer | awesome.. i have one handy | 12:58 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: :D | 12:58 |
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| Macer | i'll try it out when i get back. thanks Stskeeps ... i sure hope it works | 12:58 |
| Macer | :) | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: one twist to theme that would be nice.. something that indicates it's definately not nokian or something | 12:59 |
| Macer | but i suppose if it doesn't i can always just build a new kernel with the mer omap kernel src | 12:59 |
| Stskeeps | it having Droid Sans on Mer probably helps | 12:59 |
| Macer | since all the hardware in it is supposed to be "open" | 12:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Ah, I should promote it | 12:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | (Fremantle) | 12:59 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, wazd, thoughts about keeping the "mer" button for the task switcher and/or launcher? | 13:00 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: I'm thinking bout adding that nokia ship wallpaper :D | 13:00 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: panoramic version ;p | 13:01 |
| RST38h | wazd: Replace the boot up logo with the crazy fish! | 13:01 |
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| Stskeeps | Macer: uploading squashfs. eta 4m | 13:01 |
| Stskeeps | err | 13:01 |
| Stskeeps | 46m | 13:01 |
| wazd | Upload of file failed. | 13:01 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: A little Python app which had a list of countries and a "Download" button would be cool indeed | 13:01 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: I remember a time when you had rootfs' uploaded in minutes :p | 13:02 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: i live in poland now and i need to upgrade my internet connection. | 13:02 |
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| wazd | ah, max file size 488 kb | 13:03 |
| wazd | wtf :) | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | wb jeremiah | 13:03 |
| qwerty12_N810 | jeremiah: Loooong journey? :p | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah: when you have a minute, send the notes from the community SSU to maemo-developers | 13:03 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Exactly | 13:03 |
| jeremiah | qwerty12_N810: heh, not too bad. :) | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | (please) | 13:04 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: The really good question is *how the hell do you remove*??? | 13:04 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Your theme is too good for Talk? Make it lame! :p | 13:04 |
| jeremiah | Thunderstorms over Amsterdam made it a little bumpy though. | 13:04 |
| qwerty12_N810 | jeremiah: Heh, well, wb :) | 13:04 |
| jeremiah | Stskeeps: I am going to do that soon, today. | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah: yeah, that was a bit nasty :P | 13:04 |
| jeremiah | Stskeeps: You had more of that than I since we flew away from it, you flew into it! | 13:04 |
| frals | RST38h: sorry im a bit thick, but what is needed in the kernel to get the mms send/recv to work? from reading the MMS spec, this could all be done over http, assuming your carrier gateway supports it | 13:05 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: there you go :) | 13:05 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: http://lotro.ucoz.ru/marina.deb | 13:05 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Thank you, wazd | 13:05 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: sure we'll still have mer logo in the corner :) | 13:05 |
| jeremiah | waxd rocks | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | k | 13:06 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: btw, I was thinking bout slight restyling :) | 13:06 |
| jeremiah | sorry, I meant wazd rocks. :) | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: in what sense? | 13:07 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: what if I'll make small bubbles around "e" to move like galaxy? :) | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | hmm not sure | 13:07 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: it will reduce logo height and add some more subliminal sense :) | 13:07 |
| crashanddie | what a fucking wanker: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=345169&postcount=24 | 13:08 |
| johnx | wazd, pics! :D | 13:08 |
| crashanddie | he doesn't have the device, doesn't plan on buying it, and wants to organise a "class action"? | 13:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Clearly we should support him in any way possible. | 13:09 |
| johnx | crashanddie, where's the "please fall in a hole" tag? | 13:10 |
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| ccooke | a class action for... what? | 13:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody needs to yank the stylus control code from Quake 2 for Quake 3. | 13:10 |
| Stskeeps | bacon | 13:10 |
| ccooke | what is his alleged grievance? | 13:10 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, support him right into a passing bus? | 13:10 |
| ccooke | Stskeeps: oh, well. Sign me up! | 13:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | When did Maemo start attracting tossers and losers? :( | 13:10 |
| ccooke | qwerty12_N810: ... you've *read* the forums, right? | 13:11 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: I actually like the q3 one. | 13:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, ever since you got interested. :P | 13:11 |
| Myrtti | qwerty12_N810: age ago | 13:11 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Takes a bit of practice, but then it rocks ;) | 13:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, whenever I pick up my stylus and set it down somewhere else I look at the ceiling or the floor. | 13:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't like that. | 13:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | ccooke: Yes, and I refuse to believe what I'm seeing :( | 13:11 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: But I purely do that because I need to QA the package, of course :D | 13:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Myrtti: True :( | 13:11 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, just tell your friends that you liked maemo before it was cool | 13:11 |
| ccooke | qwerty12_N810: I'd have to refer you to Sturgeon's law at this point :-/ | 13:12 |
| glass | qwerty12_N810: with the sexy adverts of course | 13:12 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: What would you use the stylus for anyway? | 13:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, mouselook? | 13:12 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Ah, don't use that. | 13:12 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: I always hate it when things obscure your image. | 13:13 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Download the zip, unzip -l to find files and delete? Or, don't support removing ;-) | 13:13 |
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| glass | mouselook is pretty essential unless you want your ass whooped | 13:13 |
| X-Fade | glass: This one has autoaim. | 13:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Holy shit. | 13:13 |
| glass | X-Fade: even then | 13:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia actually fixed a docs bug. <_< | 13:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, yes, I know how much you love gazing upon my glorious visage. :P | 13:14 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: Nokia fixed a bug? | 13:14 |
| glass | X-Fade: mouselook was the key to whooping ass on duke3d even if it didn't support up/down on it properly, and even on doom | 13:14 |
| qwerty12_N810 | This calls for celebration! | 13:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, hooray, mediocrity! | 13:14 |
| * Stskeeps should try on his fixedinfremantle tshirt | 13:14 | |
| * GeneralAntilles wants his Summit goodies. :( | 13:15 | |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Btw, did Murphy kick in and deliver your passport on the day the plane was supposed to leave? | 13:15 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Or is it still not there yet. | 13:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, it was 28 hours late. | 13:15 |
| ccooke | ow. | 13:15 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Aw... sucks. | 13:15 |
| johnx | ahaha...I just got spam that told me to "go back to school" | 13:16 |
| ShadowJK | frals, I'm nots ure what kernel stuff you'd need even for non-http mms transport... it's "just" about opening a new ppp session with the mms APN and doing wap on that? ;-) | 13:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | johnx: Sure it was spam? ;D | 13:16 |
| ccooke | Receiving MMS properly will be harer | 13:16 |
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| ccooke | harder | 13:16 |
| frals | yeah shouldnt have had the http stuff in there | 13:16 |
| frals | i mean, as long as you dont have a current connection it shouldnt be a problem to just fetch the message i though | 13:17 |
| johnx | qwerty12_N810, yeah, yeah. you can go back to school too...oh wait, too soon for that one :P | 13:17 |
| ShadowJK | and multiple connections depends on the interface to the gsm/3g bits... | 13:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | johnx: College kicks its ass :p | 13:18 |
| johnx | not getting fed up with non-compsci classes yet? | 13:19 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Nope :) | 13:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Give it a semester. :P | 13:20 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: It's almost blasphemous in Nokia-land to have a picture of a Sony Ericsson as your phone icon | 13:21 |
| * GeneralAntilles wonders who it is that adds all of these ridiculous tags. | 13:22 | |
| GeneralAntilles | "pandora v linear time war" | 13:23 |
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| lardman | morning all | 13:25 |
| JamieBennett | morning | 13:26 |
| Stskeeps | morning lardman | 13:26 |
| lardman | hey chaps | 13:26 |
| lardman | JamieBennett: you'll be glad to hear the laptop survived the trip back | 13:26 |
| JamieBennett | lardman: The footage isn't great though :( | 13:26 |
| lardman | no? | 13:26 |
| lardman | shame | 13:26 |
| lardman | some post processing for you to do then? | 13:27 |
| JamieBennett | audio and positioning of the camera's is off and there is no n810 footage from the first day :( | 13:27 |
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| X-Fade | Next time we need to make sure we take auto from the mixer. | 13:27 |
| X-Fade | *audio ;) | 13:27 |
| JamieBennett | X-Fade: Yes | 13:27 |
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| lardman | andre__: ping | 13:28 |
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| lardman | or indeed everyone with an N900 w/ new sw, could someone take a look at bugs #5369 and #5368 and check it's valid for the latest, and if so change the target? | 13:29 |
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| lardman | s/everyone/anyone | 13:30 |
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| Jaffa | JamieBennett: I thought they were supposed to be professionals?! | 13:30 |
| JamieBennett | So did I Jaffa | 13:30 |
| Jaffa | Where did they take the audio from if not the mixer? | 13:30 |
| JamieBennett | From the camcorder mic without a directional setting so you get the audio from the camera position which was the back of the room for the n800 room :( | 13:31 |
| andre__ | lardman, yes, but what is "nigh-on"? | 13:31 |
| Jaffa | But what were the mics for then? | 13:31 |
| Jaffa | That's fscking ridiculous. | 13:32 |
| lardman | andre__: ah, nearly | 13:32 |
| lardman | andre__: sorry for my old-school English ;) | 13:32 |
| JamieBennett | Jaffa: Maybe the keynote footage from the n900 room will be mixed with audio when it comes back (I'm not doing that) but as for the other talks/rooms its only on the camera's. | 13:33 |
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| Jaffa | They shouldn't be paid. | 13:33 |
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| JamieBennett | lardman: Are you in front of your computer for a while today? I can't get into Bath before the weekend and I need day 2's footage. Can you uploaded it if I set up a ftp server? | 13:34 |
| SpeedEvil | andre__: It is close in meaning to 'near to' | 13:34 |
| JamieBennett | Jaffa: You'll soon see the footage :( | 13:34 |
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| andre__ | interesting. | 13:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: ping? | 13:36 |
| lardman | JamieBennett: yeah sure, will have to be after lunch tho as I left the laptop at home | 13:37 |
| lardman | can pop home and pick it up | 13:38 |
| JamieBennett | lardman: great. | 13:38 |
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| ensi | hmm are there some security policies or something on Maemo? I try to create a new file with QFile and it fails. | 13:41 |
| ensi | hmm | 13:41 |
| X-Fade | ensi: no, not in Maemo 5 or lower. | 13:41 |
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| ensi | so its just the normal *nix file permissions that apply then? | 13:42 |
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| X-Fade | ensi: yes. Apps run as 'user' | 13:42 |
| ensi | aight | 13:42 |
| ensi | thanks | 13:42 |
| SpeedEvil | Are tehre plans to make different apps run as different users? | 13:44 |
| crashanddie | Yes | 13:44 |
| crashanddie | well | 13:44 |
| crashanddie | depends | 13:44 |
| crashanddie | Elena, during her talk about Platform Security mentioned that it would be interesting to have application-level identification, allowing access to specific resources based on which application is running | 13:45 |
| jaska | sounds rather national-socialist | 13:45 |
| jaska | down that slope lies crap like symbian signed | 13:46 |
| glass__ | sounds rather symbian platsec shitness, yes | 13:46 |
| zaheerm | you know it is coming though... | 13:46 |
| crashanddie | depends, it depends on the implementation | 13:46 |
| jaska | also i wonder what api i need to fiddle with to filter calls | 13:46 |
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| glass__ | crashanddie: and then letting webruntime to do it all regardless of it | 13:46 |
| jaska | or do i have to go poking around in other processes memory spaces | 13:46 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: yeah, I already noticed that, but that's oxygen icons, I'm still making my own :) | 13:47 |
| crashanddie | by the way, wazd, were you at the summit? | 13:47 |
| wazd | crashanddie: nope | 13:47 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Awesome :D | 13:47 |
| keesj | The idea is apparently to perform application signing and even runtime in-memory checking | 13:47 |
| crashanddie | wazd: shame, a lot of people wanted to see you there | 13:47 |
| wazd | crashanddie: my army dep didn't :D | 13:48 |
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| crashanddie | keesj: don't think that will be the actual implementation | 13:48 |
| crashanddie | keesj: not if I have anything to do with it | 13:48 |
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| keesj | they need to indentify processes so there is no real choice if you ask me | 13:49 |
| crashanddie | there is, actually | 13:49 |
| ensi | you guys are pretty intimately involved with maemo? | 13:49 |
| glass | the signin houses will push for that anyhow(and some of them do maemo contracting) | 13:49 |
| crashanddie | I've been tinkering about it, and will expose my thoughts, still waiting for the thread to pop up any interesting ideas though | 13:49 |
| keesj | crashanddie: like what? | 13:49 |
| jaska | that kind of stuff was why i ran away from symbian as fast as i could | 13:50 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: as for SDK - I've made it work, but it crashes with segfault | 13:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Hmm, where? I use it VMware fine | 13:50 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: vmware too | 13:50 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: ubuntu vmware | 13:51 |
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| wazd | qwerty12_N810: oh | 13:51 |
| keesj | crashanddie: like what? | 13:51 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: vmware ubuntu :D | 13:52 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Oh, when reporting bugs, do you want me to be anal (you know, little things and such)? | 13:52 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: sure | 13:52 |
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| wazd | qwerty12_N810: you can even invite infobot and make out :D | 13:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: rofl :D | 13:53 |
| keesj | they will also have some closed storage and such but what they are trying sounds like a silver bullet. nothing like selinux or other stuff targeted at protecting some webserver from doing weird stuff | 13:53 |
| jeremiah | keesj: Well, a little bit. They do want to have priviledges which sorta says; "You can use the 3g modem, but you over there cannot." | 13:55 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah: "*should* be painless". This is a production system running a variety of websites, don't want to suffer a lot of pain ;-) | 13:55 |
| jeremiah | Jaffa: Yeah. | 13:55 |
| jeremiah | I hear you. | 13:55 |
| jeremiah | Well, it really should be painless. | 13:55 |
| * Jaffa should do it, but he'll need to allocate a weekend and notify everyone | 13:55 | |
| jeremiah | Yeah, you may need to do that. | 13:56 |
| jeremiah | Debian works really hard to make sure the transition from old-stable to stable goes smoothly. | 13:56 |
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| jeremiah | But of course, things break. :) | 13:56 |
| jeremiah | Although I didn't have any breakage. | 13:56 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: let's test your tiny detail notice skills :) | 13:57 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: Fine! But I can't promise that you'll like what you see :p | 13:58 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: for example grey arrow in the URL is a large detail - wrong background of the combobox is tiny detail :D | 13:58 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: well, the only way to fix something is to locate it :) | 13:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | True :) | 13:59 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N810: how's it overall? | 14:00 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Really good, I'm seeing no major issues that would make me need to switch back | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | check the IM window and see if it is better | 14:01 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I haven't added any accounts | 14:01 |
| Jaffa | jeremiah: Cool, thanks for the reassurance | 14:03 |
| RST38h | Back | 14:04 |
| jeremiah | :) | 14:05 |
| crashanddie | keesj: doing full blown PKI on process level is going to be a CPU hog | 14:05 |
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| crashanddie | keesj: if it's not implemented correctly, we're going to criple the whole system | 14:05 |
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| X-Fade | crashanddie: OMAP3 has hardware for that. | 14:06 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: If you told me anything about that Map Loader app after I was called to the meeting, please repeat (and I am sorry :)) | 14:06 |
| crashanddie | X-Fade: I don't believe signing/verification of 2048 keys is going to be fast enough | 14:06 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: It can do all kinds of encryption/decryption on separate hardware. | 14:06 |
| X-Fade | We might even want to try to get openssh to use it ;) | 14:07 |
| crashanddie | wouldn't be a bad thing | 14:07 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Nah, don't think so. Apart from a really hacky idea on removal ;-) | 14:07 |
| crashanddie | if it does have a cp, I'm definitely going to have fun with it though | 14:07 |
| lardman | I thought the idea was to validate the source repo (e.g. maemo.org or ovi stores) and that automatically validates the permissions, which are all stored in the central protected storage. i.e. 2x key validations per app? | 14:07 |
| Jaffa | crashanddie: Elena's talk had it doing a SHA-1 hash on a process binary and using that, rather than signing every single binary | 14:07 |
| Corsac | yeah, I'd be interested in using that for ipsec stuff | 14:07 |
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| crashanddie | Corsac: VPN would definitely be a big bonus | 14:08 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: M-Shield. Security Technology: SHA-1/MD5, | 14:09 |
| X-Fade | DES/3DES, RNG, AES, PKA, Secure WDT, Keys | 14:09 |
| crashanddie | I'd like to have 2FA soft-tokens on the device | 14:09 |
| X-Fade | http://focus.ti.com/lit/ml/swpt024b/swpt024b.pdf | 14:09 |
| crashanddie | Jaffa: sha-1 would be stupid IMHO | 14:09 |
| Jaffa | crashanddie: This was discussed in this channel at the time ;-) | 14:09 |
| Jaffa | Although "currently" was emphasised. | 14:09 |
| lardman | why stupid? slow? | 14:10 |
| crashanddie | Jaffa: 3DES would be sufficient, if regenerated and salted properly | 14:10 |
| Jaffa | We need to link http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2009-10-11.log.html#t2009-10-11T12:50:36 to Elena's slides and video when they're published | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Well for removal we can store file names when adding and then delete these same file names | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Actually, it is even easier: we can make deb packages of these4 map sets and place them into repo | 14:10 |
| zerojay | Can someone approve me for extras uploading? | 14:10 |
| Jaffa | lardman: Trivial to get one process signed which does A and then replace it (without changing SHA-1 signature) with binary B | 14:10 |
| RST38h | dpkg will then take care fo installaiton AND removal | 14:11 |
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| lardman | Jaffa: ok, not very unique then | 14:11 |
| Jaffa | lardman: Collisions are engineerable, yes. | 14:11 |
| lardman | fair enough, was only an example tho wasn't it | 14:11 |
| lardman | the use of this algo | 14:11 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: It said "processes verified using checksum stored in Aegis Protected Storage (currently SHA-1)" | 14:12 |
| * Jaffa could try uploading the few photos he took on his N900 | 14:12 | |
| lardman | yeah, but the algo used for the hash can be changed was my assumption, and they were using sha-1 for whatever reason during testing | 14:13 |
| Jaffa | lardman: agreed | 14:13 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, and maybe they just use multiple hashes. | 14:13 |
| X-Fade | although that would be slow ;) | 14:13 |
| Jaffa | Photos on their way to flickr | 14:13 |
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| crashanddie | Is gcobb around? | 14:16 |
| crashanddie | I just realised | 14:16 |
| crashanddie | He wrote GPE, did he? | 14:16 |
| zaheerm | Jaffa, your maps trick actually works? | 14:16 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: s/wrote/works on/ | 14:17 |
| zerojay | X-Fade: Can you approve me for extras uploading? | 14:17 |
| X-Fade | zerojay: Did you ask an invite? | 14:17 |
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| zaheerm | Jaffa, i do that on my e71 all the time, but didn't expect the n900's one to support downloaded data | 14:18 |
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| Jaffa | zaheerm: Yup. Definitely. | 14:18 |
| Jaffa | crashanddie_: He did. | 14:18 |
| zerojay | X-Fade: I did. | 14:19 |
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| zaheerm | here goes, putting the whole of usa on for my upcoming trip to SF | 14:19 |
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| tekojo | Jaffa what maps trick, saving maps to device? you got me curious :-) | 14:21 |
| zaheerm | http://www.maemopeople.org/index.php/jaffa/2009/10/13/downloading_ovi_maps_without_a_network_c | 14:21 |
| X-Fade | zerojay: When did you do that? I didn't see anything? | 14:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Hiya, tekojo | 14:21 |
| zerojay | X-Fade: Last night. | 14:22 |
| tekojo | qwerty12_N810 Hi! | 14:22 |
| zerojay | X-Fade: I'll request it again, I guess. | 14:22 |
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| Jaffa | tekojo: The URL pointed to by zaheerm documents how you can pre-download Ovi Maps maps to your device | 14:22 |
| tekojo | Nice, I didn't know that :-) | 14:23 |
| Jaffa | tekojo: heh | 14:23 |
| * Stskeeps bookmarks | 14:23 | |
| Jaffa | http://www.slideshare.net/peterschneider/maemo-6-platform-security | 14:23 |
| Jaffa | Slides | 14:23 |
| lardman | what we need is the api of the map renderer then we can get rid of crappy ovi-maps | 14:23 |
| lardman | tho the renderer is probably part of the crappy app too | 14:24 |
| X-Fade | lardman: it looks like maps is a c++ app with a javascript frontend. | 14:24 |
| lardman | hmm, interesting, so it might be doable then | 14:24 |
| X-Fade | So you might be able to use a different frontend ;) | 14:24 |
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| Stskeeps | like maemo mapper ;p | 14:25 |
| lardman | and most importantly a different backend to do searching | 14:25 |
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| lardman | sometimes not finding "Amsterdam" is not really good form in my book ;) | 14:26 |
| suihkulokki | X-Fade / tekojo, maemo extras seems to have pulled in a upgrade for a package that is included in PR configuration (libffi5) | 14:26 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: urf, flash only? | 14:26 |
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| X-Fade | suihkulokki: Hmmm need to investigate that. | 14:27 |
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| Corsac | ha no, I can request a link to download the pdf | 14:29 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Such API already exists | 14:30 |
| RST38h | lardman: http://projects.gnome.org/libchamplain/ | 14:30 |
| lardman | RST38h: cool, do you have a link? | 14:30 |
| lardman | ah | 14:30 |
| RST38h | lardman: And there is a viewer for it in GNOME | 14:30 |
| RST38h | Port the viewer, add a few more datasources and you are done | 14:31 |
| lardman | but does it understand the OVI maps? | 14:31 |
| RST38h | Of course not | 14:31 |
| RST38h | This requires hacking .cdt files | 14:31 |
| lardman | but is doable? | 14:31 |
| lardman | s/doable/done | 14:31 |
| lardman | proven at least? | 14:31 |
| RST38h | I have not looked at .cdt yet | 14:32 |
| RST38h | May try, if I have time | 14:32 |
| RST38h | Nokia will be pissed off, too | 14:32 |
| lardman | ah ok, was wondering if we could just re-wrap the app, so no treading on toes by reversing the format, etc | 14:32 |
| RST38h | gimme a moment | 14:32 |
| RST38h | Nothing on global forums. Looks like I will have to try Russian GPS forums next | 14:34 |
| lardman | :) | 14:34 |
| ensi | im looking for a way to backup device contacts, what would be the best way? find the system addressbook file and simply copy that file, or manually get a list of contacts and write another file or possibly through the backup api? | 14:35 |
| wazd | Anyone related to FM radio app for n900 here? | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | ensi: it has a bxport thing | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | export | 14:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wazd: No, but you can find pycage on Talk | 14:35 |
| ensi | Stskeeps: contact book? | 14:36 |
| Stskeeps | on n900 at least | 14:36 |
| RST38h | .cdt is a Smart2Go file format | 14:37 |
| ensi | Stskeeps: what function should i look at, somewhere in osso-abook? | 14:37 |
| RST38h | Also a CorelDraw drawing, which may not be a coinicidence | 14:37 |
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| Jaffa | ensi: Run "Backup" and select "Communication and Contacts" (top option in a backup, IIRC) | 14:40 |
| Jaffa | ensi: Or, within Contacts "Export contacts" | 14:41 |
| ensi | Jaffa: erm, im looking for a way to do this programmatically | 14:41 |
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| wazd | qwerty12_N810: I have a cool idea for FM ui :) | 14:41 |
| qwerty12_N810 | wao: Nice, it's a little barebones ATM :) | 14:42 |
| qwerty12_N810 | *wazd | 14:42 |
| qwerty12_N810 | sorry, wao | 14:42 |
| lardman | why is "Python for S60" the top download on Garage? | 14:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Who the hell knows. | 14:42 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Why is it even on Garage? | 14:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not sure how it got approved in the first place. | 14:43 |
| lardman | indeed | 14:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wasting our bandwidth for S60. . . . | 14:43 |
| lardman | X-Fade: any thoughts? | 14:43 |
| zaheerm | ensi, libosso-ab is probably api you want | 14:44 |
| wao | woz | 14:45 |
| lardman | so libchamplain or osm-gps-map for a map widget? Anyone have any experience with these (or others)? | 14:46 |
| zaheerm | libosso-abook even | 14:46 |
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| Jaffa | ensi: Iterate over all EContact records and save the vCard? Invoke the osso_abook API/backup API? | 14:47 |
| Jaffa | ensi: 3) Don't write s/w which'll fuck it up ;-) | 14:47 |
| Shapeshifter | does maemo have libio? | 14:48 |
| Shapeshifter | libgio | 14:48 |
| X-Fade | lardman: They needed a home. | 14:48 |
| ensi | Jaffa: sorry, dumb question whats s/w? :) | 14:48 |
| X-Fade | lardman: We gave it to them ;) | 14:48 |
| zaheerm | ensi, s/w == software | 14:48 |
| Shapeshifter | nvm | 14:49 |
| ensi | oh yeah well this will probably fuck it up | 14:49 |
| ensi | (; | 14:49 |
| lardman | X-Fade: I see | 14:50 |
| lardman | X-Fade: is there no equiv to Garage for the Symbian guys then? | 14:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lardman: Looking at Python, I'd guess Garage itself is the equivalent... | 14:51 |
| Jaffa | ensi: Warn the user about backups/do it yourself, if your app needs to programmatically back it up, your app is buggy ;-) | 14:51 |
| X-Fade | lardman: not at that moment at least. | 14:51 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, community assistance to evil operating systems is great! :D | 14:51 |
| ensi | Jaffa: im just doing what im told to do :) | 14:51 |
| lardman | lcuk: it's open source! | 14:51 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: We all love python, right? | 14:51 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: So, what's wrong with them using code.google.com or sourceforge.net or codehaus.org or ...? | 14:51 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: erf, just noticed | 14:52 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: the slides are about Maemo 6, not Maemo 5 :) | 14:52 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: They had problems with sourceforge, where they were before. | 14:52 |
| Corsac | is it the same in Maemo5 ? | 14:52 |
| * lardman heads for lunch | 14:52 | |
| Jaffa | Corsac: Yeah, there's no DRM in Maemo 5; or signed kernel or signed image or ... | 14:52 |
| lardman | JamieBennett: will ping you when I get back online there | 14:52 |
| lcuk | jaffa, cos maemo.org is a friendly place and offered things no other hosting service did | 14:52 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: But I don't know the reasoning anymore, long time ago. | 14:52 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: oki | 14:52 |
| lcuk | afterall, there is only one X-Fade | 14:52 |
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| JamieBennett | lardman: great, thanks | 14:52 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: so the N900 has no security architecture at the moment? | 14:52 |
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| Jaffa | Corsac: It has root. It has not-root. | 14:53 |
| Corsac | ok :) | 14:53 |
| tbf | ...i wonder if the clueless and aggressive trolling of the qt fanboys made them start thinking of DRM | 14:54 |
| xzsh | How/Where is contacts stored in Maemo? | 14:54 |
| tbf | xzsh: ~/.osso-abook | 14:54 |
| tbf | xzsh: have a look at libebook or libosso-abook to access them | 14:54 |
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| tbf | ensi: Jaffa: backup scripts are in /etc/osso-backup | 14:58 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: erf, so you removed everything from the Discussion page? | 14:58 |
| tbf | ensi: and you should seriously consider using/adoption those scripts unless you want proper backup/restore | 14:58 |
| Jaffa | Corsac: There wasn't anything on the discussion page (which confused me) | 14:59 |
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| tbf | ensi: there are dozens of tiny race conditions to consider for proper backup/restore | 14:59 |
| Jaffa | Corsac: Unless something went weird on the intertubes | 14:59 |
| zerojayN900 | fucking xchat crashing left and right.. | 14:59 |
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| Jaffa | Corsac: Ah, maybe Talk:MaemoSecurity wasn't moved to Talk:Maemo_security? | 15:00 |
| Corsac | hmhm, maybe | 15:00 |
| Corsac | http://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:MaemoSecurity | 15:00 |
| Corsac | definitely :) | 15:00 |
| ensi | tbf: basically im working on application that will do some stuff with the contacts in the addressbook and one of the requirements is that it needs to create a backup and be ableto restore the system addressbook from that backup | 15:01 |
| ensi | tbf: is there a C "backup" api or something? | 15:01 |
| Corsac | Jaffa: why Maemo_Security and Talk:MaemoSecurity? :) | 15:01 |
| Jaffa | Corsac: It's not, MaemoSecurity is not conformant with the wiki.maemo.org naming standards. | 15:01 |
| Jaffa | It's now Maemo_security and Talk:Maemo_security - I've merged the content across from the earlier discussion page | 15:02 |
| tbf | ensi: execl() :-D | 15:02 |
| tbf | ensi: afaik there also is some dbus API, but never really cared | 15:02 |
| Shapeshifter | How can I find out versions of apps and libs and such in maemo with apt-get? apt-get seems a bit broken, like it doens't know "apt-get search" | 15:02 |
| ensi | tbf: so the backup application is built on those scripts in /etc ? | 15:02 |
| tbf | ensi: but my brain still hurts from all the "getting backup right" discussions | 15:03 |
| tbf | ensi: yup | 15:03 |
| ensi | tbf: you mentioned race conditions before, can you clarify? I presume you mean something like application running a backup while some other service/user is adding/deleting contacts from the system address book? | 15:03 |
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| tbf | ensi: there are some dbus signals telling the system about backup running. afaik hildon-desktop reacts by killing apps and freezing the task launcher | 15:05 |
| tbf | ensi: but background daemons like EDS must be killed manually. all this concurrency. big mess. | 15:06 |
| Corsac | pff, I really don't like forum-based community, I so much prefer irc and mailing lists :) | 15:06 |
| tbf | ensi: what we do now for proper backup/restore is copying the raw db files on backup and restoring them under special name during restore | 15:06 |
| tbf | ensi: when EDS is started the next time it moves those special files at the right place | 15:06 |
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| tbf | ensi: but that's all implementation details, so i really encourage you do find docs on osso-abook or to figure out how to run those backup scripts manually | 15:07 |
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| tbf | ensi: if there is no documentation for the backup process it might be worth to ask | 15:07 |
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| tbf | ensi: (bugs.maemo.org, talk.maemo.org, facebook, ... you get the idea) | 15:08 |
| wazd | http://s16.radikal.ru/i190/0910/3b/ca2ad9bb1941.png <- tada! | 15:08 |
| timeless_mbp | andre__: ping | 15:08 |
| timeless_mbp | where do i file language bugs in bugs.maemo.org? :) | 15:08 |
| ensi | tbf: oh you are talking about backup from the backup perspective, i.e. when the backup scripts are run it emits signals through d-bus to make sure that no applications are messing about with the global state? | 15:08 |
| RST38h | wazd: Hurrah! Does it work? | 15:09 |
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| Corsac | with kinetic scrolling? | 15:09 |
| Corsac | and logarithmic stuff | 15:09 |
| tbf | ensi: yup | 15:09 |
| wazd | RST38h: sure not) | 15:09 |
| tbf | wazd: WTF? Radio plugin for the media player? | 15:09 |
| tbf | wazd: how is that possible? | 15:10 |
| RST38h | but definitely want it | 15:10 |
| wazd | tbf: UI concept for FM | 15:10 |
| tbf | ah, "just" a mockup | 15:10 |
| tbf | but looks awesome | 15:10 |
| ensi | tbf: so your opinion about taking a static list of contacts from the system addressbook and dumping those to a file? and when user wants to restore just read the file and insert back into system addressbook? | 15:10 |
| ensi | tbf: doomed to fail? | 15:10 |
| wazd | can't find pycage theme | 15:10 |
| tbf | wazd: well, you might want to hide "Settings" button in the app menu | 15:10 |
| andre__ | timeless, Translations maybe? ;-) | 15:11 |
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| timeless_mbp | which meta thing is that? | 15:11 |
| tbf | ensi: doomed | 15:11 |
| wazd | tbf: maybe | 15:11 |
| RST38h | wazd: If it is a mockup, you can light it up with warm vacuum tube glow =) | 15:11 |
| wazd | RST38h: well, it's "realistic" mockup :) | 15:12 |
| tbf | ensi: UIDs will be wrong, IM contacts will break. | 15:12 |
| tbf | ensi: also it will take quite some time | 15:12 |
| RST38h | wazd: there is no such widget as you have drawn, so there is no problem doing it either way you like | 15:13 |
| tbf | ensi: initially we did the same, but it just doesn't work | 15:13 |
| RST38h | wazd: you are not limited with system theme there | 15:13 |
| ensi | tbf: IM contacts refer to their master contact through the contact uid ? | 15:13 |
| ensi | tbf: and that would change in the process? | 15:13 |
| wazd | RST38h: Pannable area :) | 15:13 |
| tbf | RST38h: wazd: it's just a matter of putting a GtkViewPort into a HildonPanneable area and putting some little cairo code into the ViewPort's expose-event handler | 15:14 |
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| tbf | ensi: yup. you have to preserve UIDs. | 15:14 |
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| RST38h | tbf: Yea but may point is that you can draw whatever you want there | 15:14 |
| tbf | Jaffa: ^^ btw, that also applies for Hermes ;-) | 15:14 |
| RST38h | tbf: solid background, lit up "paper" panel, huge oiled screw, live animated snake etc | 15:15 |
| tbf | Jaffa: guess writing a Facebook/Twitter/GData CM for Telepathy would be a more robust approach to integrate those services | 15:15 |
| wazd | RST38h: yeah, retro style would be cool :) | 15:16 |
| tbf | Jaffa: investigating this | 15:16 |
| frals | RST38h: sorry to bother you again, but when you said kernelwork was needed for MMS, i assume this is for correct routing/setting up connection to the right apn, is this right? | 15:16 |
| wazd | RST38h: with rotating nub :) | 15:16 |
| jeremiah | heh: http://www.linux-mag.com/id/7573 | 15:16 |
| tbf | Jaffa: with a Telepathy CM facebook and co would show up in the addressbook's group dialog | 15:16 |
| jeremiah | ^^ Are app stores evil? | 15:16 |
| jeremiah | Topical. | 15:17 |
| tbf | jeremiah: there is an app for this! | 15:17 |
| Jaffa | tbf: Hermes doesn't add any contacts, or touch UIDs | 15:17 |
| jeremiah | :) | 15:17 |
| RST38h | frals: yes it is for establishing network connection to the provider's mmsc | 15:17 |
| Jaffa | tbf: But a Telepathy CM and then manually merging could be interesting | 15:17 |
| frals | alright, thanks | 15:17 |
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| tbf | Jaffa: ok? thought it would. didn't try yet. | 15:17 |
| RST38h | wazd: well, as you showed the horizontal panel, it seems more logical to go with the paper panel those old consumer radios had | 15:18 |
| Jaffa | tbf: No, since there's pretty much no useful information (apart from some URLs and birthday and picture) that you can get from the Facebook & Twitter APIs | 15:18 |
| Jaffa | tbf: So no use in creating new contacts you don't already have (unless people *want* to use Contacts to be a bookmark manager for social network URLs) | 15:18 |
| tbf | Jaffa: ah, ok. | 15:18 |
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| RST38h | lardman: the libchamplain thing has already got an application for gis browsing | 15:19 |
| lardman | is that the same stuff as the ovi maps then? | 15:21 |
| ensi | tbf: so in order to recap in order for this application to fully support proper backup and restore it would have to interact with the /etc/ backup scripts and that would involve copying the contacts db file and starting and stopping ESD (among other things? | 15:21 |
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| RST38h | lardman: no unfortunately, more like maemo mapper | 15:21 |
| lardman | JamieBennett: doh! just realised I had them all along on my N900, plus my Uni network is much faster, so will do it when I get back | 15:21 |
| lardman | and try to work out the wonders of WinXP ftp client | 15:21 |
| lardman | RST38h: ok | 15:21 |
| JamieBennett | lardman: thanks | 15:22 |
| lardman | RST38h: not a problem, was just interested in the ovi map stuff, but I do want a map widget for something else | 15:22 |
| RST38h | lardman: http://www.novopia.com/emerillon/ | 15:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Aw, rcadden wants back in the club. | 15:22 |
| RST38h | ? | 15:23 |
| RST38h | Somebody kicked him out or what? | 15:23 |
| lardman | RST38h: looks cool, but might be overkill for my first bit of testing | 15:23 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Stormed out | 15:23 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: He's been wanting back for ages, surely? | 15:24 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: What was the problem? (sorry for asking) | 15:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=345281&postcount=43 | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Didn't think Maemo had a future | 15:25 |
| tbf | ensi: yup, i think so | 15:25 |
| RST38h | lardman: libchamplain probably isn't an overkill, but the emerillon is | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Ah | 15:25 |
| RST38h | lardman: Would still be nice ot see it ported of course :) | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | Bah, Slideshare really doesn't work through our proxy :-( | 15:25 |
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| ensi | tbf: thanks a million | 15:26 |
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| RST38h | Jaffa: He still has a chance to be proven right =) | 15:26 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: True :) | 15:26 |
| tbf | RST38h: barisone tried to make it easily portable to fremantle | 15:26 |
| * RST38h laughes diabolically. Hello, zap | 15:26 | |
| RST38h | tbf: No success? | 15:26 |
| zap | hello | 15:26 |
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| tbf | RST38h: he just got distracted too much after starting emerillon | 15:27 |
| RST38h | tbf: Fame! | 15:27 |
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| lardman | hmm, one of my monitors looks very blue | 15:29 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stop playing blue movies on it | 15:30 |
| lcuk | tell it a joke | 15:30 |
| lardman | hmm, vga cable falling out | 15:30 |
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| ensi | tbf: you got any idea where to start studying how to invoke the backup process (either manually through xterm) or programmatically. is there like a single "master" script how does it work? | 15:32 |
| * lardman twiddles thumbs waiting for Garage | 15:33 | |
| RST38h | Folks, I have got a question: if my project supports both Maemo4 and Maemo5, am I supposed to create a new project in Downloads? | 15:34 |
| lardman | so did I hear correctly when a Nokian said that reverse geocoding was a service provided by a Nokia server somewhere? | 15:34 |
| RST38h | Because the interface does not let me add more than one supported platform | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | probably supl | 15:34 |
| RST38h | supl.nokia.com | 15:34 |
| RST38h | ? | 15:34 |
| lcuk | supl and i think it was timeless | 15:34 |
| lardman | timeless: ping | 15:34 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 15:34 |
| timeless_mbp | that's correct | 15:35 |
| lardman | does the supl server do reverse geocoding? | 15:35 |
| lardman | ah cool | 15:35 |
| timeless_mbp | it does | 15:35 |
| Jaffa | lardman: libaddress | 15:35 |
| timeless_mbp | because that's how the camera works | 15:35 |
| timeless_mbp | for geotagging | 15:35 |
| lardman | libaddress, wunderbar | 15:35 |
| Stskeeps | why can't it just tag GPS coordinatees.. | 15:35 |
| lcuk | but if timeless gets his way it will be tweaked | 15:35 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: i don't have time to get my way | 15:35 |
| * timeless_mbp needs to file bugs | 15:35 | |
| * lcuk nods | 15:35 | |
| lardman | Jaffa: is that on gitorious? | 15:36 |
| * lardman fires up scratchbox to see if the headers are lurking there | 15:37 | |
| Jaffa | lardman: Dunno. "libaddress" was the answer to the question that I asked on the liblocation talk; and I'm sure I'd heard of it before, too | 15:37 |
| zaheerm | ah is that why geotagging is so fast? :) | 15:37 |
| lardman | Jaffa: ok | 15:37 |
| lardman | zaheerm: ;) | 15:37 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: Do you know how long it takes for a git push to www to appear on <project>.garage.maemo.org | 15:38 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: I think it is an hourly cron job. | 15:38 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: So, what do I do about a Downloads project that supports both Maemo4 and Maemo5? | 15:39 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: ? | 15:39 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: ta | 15:40 |
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| tbf | ensi: not really. guess you have to strace osso-backup or google for docs | 15:40 |
| ensi | nice :/ | 15:43 |
| tbf | ensi: well, "strace -e exec" should tell you quickly what gets launched | 15:43 |
| ensi | i only got backup scripts on the hw but they wont run (at least not through the backup application but it fails with some error) | 15:43 |
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| Jaffa | RST38h: http://www.maemo-guru.com/2008/08/tablet-guru-on-hiatus-until-further-notice/ | 15:44 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Downloads now allows to create projects for OS2008 and Maemo5 | 15:45 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Separate platforms. | 15:46 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: But the problem is that you can't select two platforms for a project | 15:46 |
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| X-Fade | RST38h: They always have been separate | 15:46 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: So, is it a bug or are we really supposed to create the second project? | 15:46 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: What do you mean wih 'project'? | 15:47 |
| X-Fade | *with | 15:47 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Let us take fmsx. There is a Downloads page for it. | 15:48 |
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| RST38h | X-Fade: It says OS2008. If I have now got VGBA for Maemo5, what do I do? | 15:48 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Nothing | 15:48 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Maemo 5 version will be created automatically when it ends up in extras. | 15:48 |
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| RST38h | X-Fade: Will it become a copy of Maemo4? And how do I manage them? | 15:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: No, it will copy from packages. | 15:49 |
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| X-Fade | RST38h: All info there will be copied | 15:49 |
| RST38h | ok | 15:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: So make sure your package contains all the right info. | 15:49 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: do you plan/envisage clutter support for the old devices? | 15:50 |
| RST38h | it does. | 15:50 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: And of course you need to manually add a screenshot when it is in Downloads. | 15:50 |
| RST38h | yea | 15:50 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Then you are all set. | 15:50 |
| RST38h | which is probably never given the current extras promotion scheme :( | 15:50 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: for N8x0? of course | 15:50 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: I missed you at the round-table | 15:50 |
| lardman | Stskeeps: I thought so, just checking... | 15:50 |
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| RST38h | X-Fade: Sorry, probably ended up attending something else | 15:53 |
| RST38h | it was often a difficult choice =) | 15:53 |
| lardman | interesting, clutter 0.8 and 1.0 are on-device | 15:53 |
| Ceron^ | http://content.yieldmanager.edgesuite.net/ct/sf/1f/8f/1f8f4f145df4f06400cb4f40bdd29629.gif | 15:53 |
| lardman | one for Python, one for the rest? | 15:53 |
| RST38h | hmmm...why would it need a different one? | 15:54 |
| lardman | prob not, was just looking at which versions of libchamplain support python, was some issue with clutter, but looks to be sorted now | 15:55 |
| lardman | so I don't know | 15:55 |
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| lardman | bbiab | 16:04 |
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| * timeless_mbp sighs | 16:07 | |
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| zgold_ | crashanddie: is this US/EU/? | 16:19 |
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| zgold_ | (the t-mobile conversation) | 16:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | Does the camera app by default fill in the GPS exif - if the GPS is on? | 16:21 |
| RST38h | it will turn on the gps | 16:21 |
| RST38h | if you have geotags enabled of course | 16:21 |
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| lardman | re | 16:23 |
| lardman | I can't find any libs called libaddress | 16:24 |
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| jeremiah | "Enable RD mode" ? | 16:28 |
| jeremiah | if you want to break your device | 16:28 |
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| RST38h | http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/zachary-christie-suspended-bringing-camping-utensil-school/story?id=8812939 | 16:29 |
| lardman | jeremiah: old page text | 16:29 |
| jeremiah | So why is 'sudo gainroot' spitting that out at me? | 16:29 |
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| X-Fade | jeremiah: install rootsh | 16:29 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah: because you didn't install rootsh | 16:29 |
| jeremiah | ah | 16:29 |
| * jeremiah goes and installs rootsh | 16:30 | |
| crashanddie | zgold_: eh? | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah: It is about as bad a warning as debian does when doing sudo su ;) | 16:30 |
| jeremiah | heh, :P | 16:30 |
| jaska | why sudo su anyway? why not sudo -s?:) | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | BIG FAT WARNING :) | 16:30 |
| * RST38h yawns and types ssh root@localhost | 16:31 | |
| jeremiah | I like sudo su since it logs a lot of good stuff to /var/log/auth.log | 16:31 |
| jeremiah | RST38h: "ssh: not found" | 16:32 |
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| RST38h | jeremiah: then install it | 16:32 |
| RST38h | it is in the extras | 16:33 |
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| RST38h | ab: Hello? | 16:37 |
| ab | RST38h, hey | 16:38 |
| RST38h | ab: Ready to take a look at the Spacic stuff? | 16:38 |
| ab | RST38h, yep, have links? | 16:38 |
| RST38h | ab: /msg me your email address, then we will have to spend ~15 minutes going over the code | 16:38 |
| ab | RST38h, you have my email | 16:39 |
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| lardman | JamieBennett: still copying from N900 to PC, ~17min to go it reckons | 16:39 |
| JamieBennett | lardman: thanks | 16:40 |
| fiferboy | hey lardman | 16:40 |
| RST38h | ab: Not really =) | 16:40 |
| lardman | crap spoke too soon, just run out of space | 16:40 |
| lardman | perfect timing | 16:40 |
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| zerojayn900 | extras-devel's release file is broken again. | 16:41 |
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| zerojayn900 | and changing preferences in xchat causes a segfault. | 16:41 |
| jeremiah | yeah, I noticed that too. | 16:41 |
| X-Fade | Damn racecondition because of load. | 16:42 |
| jeremiah | i.e. extras-testing's release file. | 16:42 |
| qwerty12_N810 | zerojayn900: My fault, a downgrade is probably best ATM | 16:42 |
| clmntch | good morning | 16:42 |
| jeremiah | clmntch: Good afternoon. :) (here anyway it is afternoon - I guess you are on the other side of the Atlantic) | 16:43 |
| clmntch | yes | 16:43 |
| clmntch | it's not early enough to say good mornng, but it's morning to me | 16:44 |
| zerojayn900 | x-fade: got the invite now, btw. thanks. | 16:44 |
| jeremiah | clmntch: :) | 16:44 |
| X-Fade | zerojayn900: good | 16:44 |
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| epictetus | are you guys excited about n900 | 16:52 |
| X-Fade | epictetus: We all have one already ;) | 16:52 |
| Anunakin | me not | 16:53 |
| Anunakin | :-( | 16:53 |
| * SpeedEvil not either. | 16:53 | |
| * SpeedEvil will not be getting one. | 16:53 | |
| * Corsac either | 16:53 | |
| SpeedEvil | Owing to the whole needing to eat thing. | 16:53 |
| Corsac | we still don't have any official release date either :) | 16:53 |
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| X-Fade | Corsac: Well the month is getting shorter and shorter. | 16:53 |
| zerojayn900 | nokia doesn't do that. | 16:54 |
| Fargus | Anyone know the state of RTCOMM on Maemo 5? | 16:54 |
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| zerojayn900 | yes. what do you wanna know? | 16:54 |
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| Fargus | Was wondering if it was running stable enough to play with yet ? | 16:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | epictetus, don't let them fool you. They have N900s too. :P | 16:55 |
| Fargus | Not had time to do much play yet but that would save me running pidgin up all the time and a simple one to test to hell | 16:55 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Fargus, yes, there's no need for Pidgin. | 16:55 |
| Fargus | At last! | 16:56 |
| Fargus | Know it solved a lot of problems but ate resources! | 16:56 |
| zerojayn900 | for the most part, its stable. | 16:56 |
| Fargus | Ta for that GA! Will go apt get now! :) | 16:56 |
| Fargus | oop | 16:56 |
| Fargus | oops | 16:56 |
| zerojayn900 | msn likes to die. | 16:56 |
| Fargus | lol | 16:56 |
| zerojayn900 | install telepathy-extras. | 16:56 |
| Fargus | Ah well as long as it doesn't brick things too quickly be able to get some testing in | 16:56 |
| Fargus | MSN likes to die with MS client so that nothing new | 16:57 |
| Fargus | I'm more interested in IRC/ICQ and Yahoo at mo | 16:57 |
| Fargus | but thanks for the heads up - assume Jabber fairly stable though? | 16:57 |
| X-Fade | IRC doesn't make much sense in RTCOMM. | 16:57 |
| Fargus | legacy code that I wanted ot play with - someone else using RTCOMM as a hook | 16:58 |
| zerojayn900 | irc doesn't work. | 16:58 |
| Fargus | bugger | 16:58 |
| zerojayn900 | multiuser chat ui is gone. | 16:58 |
| Fargus | So have to have a single thread for each contact? | 16:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | XCaht for IRC | 16:58 |
| Stskeeps | zerojayn900: i had multiuser chat in skype though | 16:59 |
| * javispedro likes recent bugzilla activity. thanks andre! | 16:59 | |
| Fargus | Using xChat at mo but wanted as little clutter as possible | 16:59 |
| lardman | msn is so gay | 16:59 |
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| zerojayn900 | stskeeps, its what we were told. | 16:59 |
| lardman | I've just updated and now I can't log in with the Nxxx any more and stay logged in | 16:59 |
| Fargus | Cheers peeps - off to go play now | 16:59 |
| RST38h | IRC in RTCOMM makes sense as long as you send.receive private messages | 16:59 |
| amr | http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nokia-NOKIA-CHARGER-ADAPTOR-CA-44/dp/B000QRODF0 - this is the charger adaptor for the tablet isnt it? | 16:59 |
| RST38h | Which is what modern IM is about anyway | 16:59 |
| amr | i actually cannot find it ANYwhere | 16:59 |
| Fargus | lardman - my n810 stays on for at least a couple of hours without disconnect | 16:59 |
| lardman | Fargus: I updated my Windows box version, now it logs out when I connect N900 | 17:00 |
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| X-Fade | amr: for N8xx yes | 17:00 |
| amr | sweet, thanks | 17:00 |
| Fargus | Thanks RST38h - was what I was after - actually process to process comms | 17:00 |
| lardman | can someone tell me what my IM status message says please? | 17:00 |
| amr | i just know as soon as i purchase it, i'll find mine in a drawer or something | 17:00 |
| X-Fade | N900 has a nice one in the box. But then for all old nokia chargers to micro usb. | 17:01 |
| Fargus | Cheers guys - off to go play and file bug reports now! ttfn | 17:01 |
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| RST38h | lardman: "Another ViRC 2.0 user" | 17:01 |
| * RST38h cackles | 17:01 | |
| lardman | RST38h: ah no, I meant on Google talk | 17:01 |
| lardman | sorry | 17:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ah, yes, "butt ugly" always productive. | 17:05 |
| zerojayn900 | does gtalk show location info? | 17:05 |
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| RST38h | if you choose to share it it does | 17:06 |
| X-Fade | As comment it seems. | 17:07 |
| X-Fade | Not sure if it uses http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0080.html | 17:07 |
| zaheerm | no it doesn't | 17:07 |
| X-Fade | Would be cool if it did though ;) | 17:07 |
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| zaheerm | yah, you have to run your own jabberd to have it, most don't support it | 17:08 |
| RST38h | Isn't Google Latitude about sharing location? | 17:08 |
| zaheerm | it was mentioned at telepathy talk at maemo summit | 17:08 |
| X-Fade | zaheerm: Hmm.. | 17:08 |
| zaheerm | so the teleptahy stuff fiddle with the status for geolocation | 17:09 |
| X-Fade | Implementing it should not be that hard. But it would be nice if servers supported it ;) | 17:09 |
| lardman | I'm just hacking together a quick Friend finder app, would have been useful for the summit | 17:09 |
| RST38h | ah | 17:10 |
| lardman | not sure what to do about the location info though, shame the lat/long isn't provided directly | 17:10 |
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| RST38h | Make it possible to shoot friends with IR module once you find them | 17:10 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Parse it? | 17:10 |
| lardman | so reverse geocode might be the only way; though also some location accuracy data will be necessary to be really useful | 17:10 |
| lardman | X-Fade: doh! | 17:10 |
| lardman | X-Fade: I meant that a lat/long would be more useful | 17:10 |
| X-Fade | lardman: hehe ;) | 17:11 |
| X-Fade | There is this site that does that for you. | 17:11 |
| lardman | the reverse geocoding, yep | 17:11 |
| crashanddie | ~ping | 17:12 |
| infobot | ~pong | 17:12 |
| X-Fade | http://www.geonames.org/ | 17:12 |
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| lardman | yeah, that looks like the one | 17:13 |
| javispedro | wow. I can put in the "patch" permission by myself in bugzilla. | 17:14 |
| * javispedro feels like an idiot now | 17:14 | |
| RST38h | heh | 17:15 |
| RST38h | javis: DrNokSnes eats battery when the tablet is locked btw | 17:15 |
| RST38h | javis: You may want to block execution | 17:15 |
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| javispedro | that may be easy if the dbus event is captured by hgw, which I don't know. | 17:16 |
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| javispedro | system_inactivity_ind, ok. | 17:18 |
| javispedro | BTW, it already dumps a freeze file if the battery runs out. Never tried though ;) | 17:19 |
| Ceron^ | is there a working google earth for maemo5? | 17:19 |
| Ceron^ | n900 | 17:19 |
| RST38h | Wow... | 17:19 |
| Ceron^ | iphone has google earth | 17:19 |
| suihkulokki | ask google, not us... | 17:19 |
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| lcuk | lardman, LAN based, not internet | 17:23 |
| lcuk | broadcast | 17:23 |
| lcuk | "hello, im lardman" | 17:23 |
| lcuk | on the ap | 17:23 |
| nicktastic | I've installed OS 2008 on my N770 and it appears to be using Linux 2.6.16. Shouldn't it be using 2.6.21? | 17:23 |
| lcuk | anyone else on same ap can see you | 17:24 |
| lardman | yeah, but I want to know which pub people are in | 17:24 |
| lcuk | the same one as you if they are on same ap usually | 17:24 |
| lardman | indeed.... | 17:24 |
| lardman | not all that useful for this use-case, but fine once I find them and want to share videos of Qole singing, etc | 17:25 |
| lcuk | hah | 17:25 |
| lcuk | it wouldv been good to use at the tracks | 17:25 |
| lcuk | to know who was in which room | 17:25 |
| * lcuk was trying to code it up | 17:25 | |
| lardman | a Nokian said they would implement wifi ap recognition iirc, so that could be used as part of thier location framework, just needs to transmit the lat/long + lock quality | 17:26 |
| lcuk | lardman, a step up from there could be one machine pushing these lists to the internet | 17:26 |
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| lardman | I'd prefer to piggy back on something everone already has - IM | 17:27 |
| javispedro | RST38h: nah, hard. actually hgw gets the display off and inactivity signals only, but not the "locked" one. If I listen to the inactivity signal the game would pause itself every too much often. | 17:28 |
| RST38h | javis: display off is sufficient afaik | 17:29 |
| crashanddie | lardman: automate the status update with the name of the room, could be done with Skype/Jabber | 17:29 |
| RST38h | javis: you are not playing when the display is off, are you? | 17:30 |
| javispedro | RST38h: yes. | 17:30 |
| javispedro | most inefficient spc player ever done, I know. | 17:30 |
| lardman | crashanddie: if you have ap triangulation/etc., could just return very accurate lat/long and see where they are on a map, less complicated | 17:31 |
| javispedro | so if you want I can just force enable frameskipping... | 17:31 |
| RST38h | heh | 17:31 |
| javispedro | well, or make it user selectable. | 17:31 |
| RST38h | javis: I do not think this will reduce battery drain | 17:31 |
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| crashanddie | lardman: how would you have triangulation? Getting signal strength from wifi from multiple APs is very hard and inaccurate | 17:31 |
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| lcuk | lardman, "simon arrived at the n900 party" "simon left the n900 party" | 17:32 |
| RST38h | javis: I currently added while(FocusOut) gtk_main_loop_do(TRUE); to the code, this will block until the focus is back in | 17:32 |
| crashanddie | lardman: 2.4Ghz just doesn't lend itself that well for those kind of experiments | 17:32 |
| crashanddie | lardman: turn on a microwave and everyone just teleported themselves 2 miles north | 17:32 |
| lcuk | someone just has to make a beacon to indicate the event type | 17:32 |
| crashanddie | RST38h: wouldn't that be the other way around? | 17:33 |
| lcuk | once the beacon is switched off your IM stops sending those messages cos theres no trigger | 17:33 |
| RST38h | javis: it looks like the focus does go out when the device turns its screen off | 17:33 |
| javispedro | RST38h: SDL and battery savings never play along. | 17:33 |
| javispedro | only way would be to flush freeze state and quit. | 17:33 |
| RST38h | javis: There is another way | 17:33 |
| RST38h | javis: You still have functions that are called periodically even with the SDL | 17:34 |
| RST38h | javis: You can check for device activity in any of these functions and block there | 17:34 |
| kirma | nokia research center has certainly looked at the subject of wlan indoor positioning. last time I checked, their system was capable of at maximum per-room resolution, and was based on arduous manually defined coverage areas... | 17:34 |
| javispedro | I need to read if Fremantle SDL still has that 10ms tick | 17:34 |
| RST38h | javis: SDL or no SDL, this will work | 17:34 |
| kirma | but that's over a year ago. | 17:34 |
| RST38h | kirma: Did that back at the university. Does not work well. | 17:34 |
| RST38h | kirma: In fact we did it more like 5-6 years ago :) | 17:34 |
| kirma | I know... | 17:34 |
| crashanddie | just use directional antennas from the top of the room that goes straight down, irradiating the floor below | 17:35 |
| kirma | nothing new really. the "new" part was that nokia was interested pushing indoor positioning applications to regular phones. | 17:35 |
| crashanddie | that way you don't get wifi leaks that would result in false positives | 17:35 |
| lcuk | why are you trying to do it with gps - an event can occur in multiple zones | 17:36 |
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| lcuk | its the event thats important, not the location (thou events can exist over very long timespans) | 17:36 |
| crashanddie | make sure you have wifi all over the place, and that transitioning from one room to the other doesn't cause a wifi-bloop like we had at this summit | 17:36 |
| RST38h | kirma: The best bet would be tagging | 17:36 |
| ShadowJK | Kirma: iirc nokia did some live experiment with indoor positioning at that big mall in helsinki recently? | 17:36 |
| RST38h | kirma: Either RFIDs or reflective IR tags | 17:36 |
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| kirma | shadowjk: yes, I think kamppi.mobi or something might have it. | 17:37 |
| crashanddie | you know where each AP is. Simply have a machine look at all the traffic, and look which device is coming from which mac address | 17:37 |
| ShadowJK | Iirc you were supposed to visit some website with s60 browser | 17:37 |
| lcuk | hide an n900 with adhoc enabled at the top of everest and let people come and join the event | 17:37 |
| kirma | they have been experimenting it quite a time earlier on their own buildings though as far as I understood, or dare to disclose. | 17:37 |
| lardman | tbh if I'm at a party and know someone else is nearby I can just walk around and find them, I don't need to know exactly where they are (unless they are at the bar) | 17:37 |
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| crashanddie | lardman: my point exactly | 17:37 |
| lcuk | lardman, browse other events | 17:38 |
| lardman | my interest is more in making it easier for people to find one another in town, etc | 17:38 |
| crashanddie | lardman: you don't need "to the meter" precision, just a rough location so you can try to find them | 17:38 |
| RST38h | lardman: Google Latitude | 17:38 |
| lardman | crashanddie: yep | 17:38 |
| crashanddie | it was always a pain, having to wait for people, or getting somewhere and the people had already left | 17:38 |
| RST38h | lardman: Or use larger payloads, a 100Mt one will generally not require positioning | 17:38 |
| lardman | RST38h: exactly | 17:38 |
| crashanddie | RST38h: lmao | 17:38 |
| RST38h | openMoko is still alive and producing hardware! | 17:39 |
| kirma | with precise delay measurement, slightly augmented wlan base station group could perform amazingly precise positioning, but that would be, first of all, a network service, and secondly, would need to be implemented... | 17:39 |
| RST38h | $99 WikiReader! | 17:39 |
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| kirma | just look how poorly network-based positioning technologies have catched on in GSM networks. :/ | 17:39 |
| RST38h | kirma: They have caught pretty well in Moscow | 17:40 |
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| RST38h | kirma: both Google Maps and yandex Maps will happily locate you in the city, without GPS | 17:40 |
| lardman | using IP address? | 17:40 |
| RST38h | No, using cell IDs | 17:40 |
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| lardman | ok, but we already have that | 17:40 |
| RST38h | Exactly | 17:40 |
| kirma | RST38h: but I suppose that's cell location, not stuff like network delays etc, that are theoretically existing technologies | 17:41 |
| ShadowJK | Nokia maps on s60ed3fp2 iirc does network based positioning first while waiting for gps lock :) | 17:41 |
| kirma | cell location databases don't require base station support | 17:41 |
| RST38h | kirma: No, because the network delays stuff is damn unreliable | 17:41 |
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| RST38h | kirma: Well, they seem to do some triangulation as well | 17:41 |
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| RST38h | kirma: But if you are receiving a reflected signal (especially true outdoors or in urban setting) there go your signal delays | 17:42 |
| kirma | RST38h: well, regarding delays I mean the real radio delays measured with well synchronized base station clocks | 17:42 |
| RST38h | yes, I understand | 17:43 |
| kirma | well, of course you would need redundancy to work that out. I think all of this would work in wlan setting much better than with GSM/3G | 17:43 |
| RST38h | they still do not work very well inside concrete labyrinths =9 | 17:43 |
| solarion | clocks suck | 17:44 |
| solarion | most of 'em aren't even right twice a day | 17:44 |
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| RST38h | or half the day :) | 17:44 |
| solarion | but yet they rule your life | 17:44 |
| RST38h | DESTROY THEM ALL WHILE YOu CAN | 17:44 |
| solarion | how often dos karma get retabulated? | 17:45 |
| lardman | again, even inside a city, once you are within a street or two you can always look at the map and ask your friend to tell you their exact address, unless of course you're stalking someone | 17:45 |
| RST38h | lardman: In short: friend location by map is rarely useful | 17:45 |
| RST38h | So are computer based maps, if you have got a paper one :) | 17:46 |
| lardman | hmm, would have been in Amsterdam, assming it could locate to within a street or two | 17:46 |
| AndrewFBlack | does anyone have or can anyone get a copy of the Fremantle Default gtk-2.0 file I need to debug someones theme for and I think there problem is in there. | 17:46 |
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| orbarron | morning all | 17:47 |
| kirma | interesting locationing network support would be if wlan client node could request a wlan base station to send the node-specific time timestamp when it received specific locationing packet... and for the same packet, information from multiple base stations could be combined with their ideas about the relative timescales between neighbors and their coordinate information | 17:47 |
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| RST38h | kirma: Can it be done within the current MAC protocol? | 17:48 |
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| kirma | to me, it doesn't sound like an extremely hard or kludgy feature to implement on the hardware/station microcontroller, but it should get some acceptance to get implemented :) | 17:52 |
| solarion | does maemo have gio, particularly the ssh: url? | 17:52 |
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| kirma | the things, in addition to software parts it requires (which would be relatively simple) would be ability to send packets with precise delay and to timestamp them reliably by hardware on reception. I kind of think current base station chipsets could support it straight away with suitable firmware code if device manufacturers were interested. | 17:56 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: ping | 18:01 |
| lardman | X-Fade: pong | 18:01 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Just to be sure, you know about liblocation, right? | 18:01 |
| lardman | yes, but it doesn't do reverse geocoding afaik | 18:02 |
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| lardman | it does pass back fix quality info though, but one thing at a time | 18:03 |
| lardman | proof of concept using that website for the reverse geocoding, then look at how to improve things | 18:03 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: yeah indeed. Something else seems to do the street thing. | 18:03 |
| lardman | supl was mentioned before | 18:04 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/beta/libcityinfo/ | 18:06 |
| lardman | no, not the right thing | 18:06 |
| lardman | returns info about a city, including position on the world map | 18:06 |
| X-Fade | Well that helps you a bit with geocoding ;) | 18:07 |
| lardman | (should probably return a lat/long and have another fn to convert that to world map offsets, would make it more useful for other people then) | 18:07 |
| lardman | X-Fade: I'm relying on the built-in stuff to do the geocoding for me ;) | 18:07 |
| X-Fade | Indeed, seems that cityinfo is used for the clock. | 18:08 |
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| lardman | come on Garage! | 18:12 |
| lardman | twiddle, twiddle, twiddle | 18:12 |
| lardman | all those Symbianites downloading Python I bet ;) | 18:12 |
| X-Fade | 25 is the number you are looking for ;) | 18:13 |
| lardman | :) | 18:13 |
| wirelessdreamer | anyone with a trial n900 try out usb host support yet? | 18:13 |
| javispedro | Python I lol. | 18:15 |
| javispedro | (na, just remembered me certain sketch...) | 18:15 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 18:20 |
| javispedro | hiyo johnq | 18:24 |
| lardman | JamieBennett: ping | 18:24 |
| javispedro | er..johnsq (damn tab completion) | 18:24 |
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| zaheerm | the version stuff in settings, general, about device | 18:25 |
| zaheerm | where does it get it from? | 18:25 |
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| zaheerm | my wife's n900 has (null) there, noticed when she reported a bug | 18:25 |
| solarion | zaheerm! | 18:25 |
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| solarion | zaheerm: are you the gupnp guy? | 18:26 |
| zaheerm | no | 18:26 |
| zaheerm | that is zeenix | 18:26 |
| solarion | ah, the z confused me | 18:26 |
| zaheerm | lots of people get us confused | 18:26 |
| solarion | I think I know you, tho | 18:26 |
| zaheerm | possibly | 18:26 |
| zaheerm | i work on gstreamer | 18:26 |
| solarion | ah | 18:26 |
| solarion | and #gnome-hackers. :) | 18:27 |
| solarion | so, back to it. Zaheerm! :) | 18:27 |
| zaheerm | solarion, aah :) | 18:27 |
| solarion | how hard is it to put a video into a widget? | 18:28 |
| zaheerm | easy | 18:28 |
| solarion | is it better to use clutter? | 18:28 |
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| zaheerm | depends if you want to do anything funky with the video | 18:29 |
| zaheerm | xvimagesink will probably work for most use cases | 18:29 |
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| zaheerm | if you want to composite on top of the video, rotate the video, do animations with it then clutter will be a good fit | 18:30 |
| solarion | xvimagesink is a gtk widget? | 18:30 |
| zaheerm | xvimagesink is a gstreamer element | 18:30 |
| solarion | how does it hook into gtk+? | 18:30 |
| zaheerm | which you can embed in say a GtkDrawingArea or other gtk widget | 18:30 |
| andre__ | err, what is the "Rubber-banding effect" in Maemo5? | 18:30 |
| zgold_ | zaheerm: i think that it'd be awesome if you could put up a sample widget that does that on the wiki | 18:31 |
| solarion | ah | 18:31 |
| * andre__ gets lost in wordings | 18:31 | |
| * solarion hopes he can afford an n900; the likelihood of a dev discount is very low. :( | 18:31 | |
| lardman | andre__: when a kinetic scrolling list reaches the end and bounces back | 18:31 |
| solarion | maye if t-mobie bundles it | 18:31 |
| solarion | zaheerm: I second zgold's idea | 18:32 |
| andre__ | lardman, ahhhh! | 18:32 |
| andre__ | thanks | 18:32 |
| lardman | zgold_: which lang do you want? | 18:32 |
| zaheerm | zgold_, sure | 18:32 |
| lardman | andre__: and also when you grab the list and pull it too far and it springs back, etc | 18:32 |
| zgold_ | lardman: c/python, anything works | 18:33 |
| lardman | zgold_: maemo camera does this | 18:33 |
| lardman | I can give you Python or C, whichever you want | 18:33 |
| lardman | maemo-barcode basically, with everything scraped out | 18:33 |
| zgold_ | why not both? | 18:33 |
| lardman | more work for me to scrape, but if you want both that's not a big issue | 18:33 |
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| zaheerm | lardman may be a better guy to provide it, i haven't used video inside maemo yet | 18:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | kirma: refer to GSM TimeAdvance for basics about delay-based distance to AP/BTS. Also be aware 1m of precision means a resolution of ~3*10^-9sec. And atm 802.11 OTA prot doesn't support any timeslice scheme to base such delay measurement on | 18:35 |
| zaheerm | do we not have a HildonVideoWidget ? | 18:35 |
| lardman | no idea | 18:35 |
| lardman | I just went with the maemo camera app and hacked at it | 18:36 |
| Ceron^ | http://zip.4chan.org/o/src/1255417524674.jpg boobs(nsfw) n900 roadmap is bumpy enough | 18:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | kirma: see http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-April/002434.html if you're interested in more info and links | 18:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kirma: and especially http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-June/002987.html | 18:38 |
| johnsq | nice hacks | 18:40 |
| lardman | zgold_: am heading home now, ping me when I come back online (likely to be 30min or so) and I'll dig out some code for you | 18:40 |
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| zgold_ | lardman: cool, tks | 18:41 |
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| zeenix | solarion: anything you wanted to saw to me? :) | 18:49 |
| zeenix | s/saw/say/ | 18:50 |
| infobot | zeenix meant: solarion: anything you wanted to say to me? :) | 18:50 |
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| Gnuton | hi | 18:50 |
| solarion | zeenix: gupnp is aweome? :) | 18:50 |
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| solarion | zeenix: thanks for your hard work. | 18:51 |
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| zeenix | solarion: always glad to hear some appreciation, thanks :) | 18:53 |
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| bfrog | any chance maemo 6 will run on n900 for sure? | 19:00 |
| bfrog | I'm not going to get n900 unless it can run maemo 6, no point | 19:01 |
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| Stskeeps | there's always Mer if nokia doesn't want to support it :P | 19:01 |
| range | Dealbreaker! | 19:01 |
| bfrog | yeah | 19:01 |
| glass__ | how much you know of m6 anyhow | 19:01 |
| bfrog | not going to buy it then | 19:01 |
| glass__ | m5 is barely out? | 19:01 |
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| Stskeeps | bfrog: noone knows if it runs maemo 6 | 19:02 |
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| luke-jr | bfrog: look at Nokia's history. they don't support devices even up till the next model | 19:02 |
| bfrog | the only reason I'd buy a nokia phone is if it were based on Qt, so nice to program with | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | basically, it is OMAP3, GLES based | 19:02 |
| ccooke | bfrog: I doubt nokia know yet. | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | and so is maemo6 | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | so it -could- technically | 19:02 |
| luke-jr | bfrog: if Nokia bothers to donate a N900 to me, I'll get Gentoo w/ KDE up on it | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | bfrog: noone knows if it runs maemo 6 basically. nor does nokia. | 19:02 |
| bfrog | yeah but the whole resistive vs capacitive touch screen or whatever | 19:02 |
| ccooke | There will definitely be features of maemo6 that the n900 cannot support - multitouch and drm, for instance | 19:02 |
| ccooke | (the drm will require hardware support that is not present in the n900) | 19:03 |
| bfrog | drm... ? | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | but most interaction is singletouch | 19:03 |
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| bfrog | what do they need drm for? drm is evil evil evil | 19:03 |
| Corsac | ccooke: ha, I didn't notice that | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | nokia's DRM is less evil. | 19:03 |
| SpeedEvil | DRM not under the control of the user is evil. | 19:03 |
| bfrog | thats pretty much all drm | 19:03 |
| SpeedEvil | DRM can also mean nobody can use your stolen phone. | 19:03 |
| Corsac | ccooke: so all the security architecture won't be available *at all* for n900? | 19:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Even if they reflash it. | 19:04 |
| Stskeeps | or hardware enforced security | 19:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Done right | 19:04 |
| Corsac | ccooke: doesn't this mean that n900 won't have maemo6? | 19:04 |
| EspadaV8 | if you don't like drm, don't use anything that comes with it, surely? | 19:04 |
| bfrog | drm inherently means you don't have real ownership | 19:04 |
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| ccooke | Corsac: unless there's hardware we don't know about. Which there may be. | 19:04 |
| SpeedEvil | bfrog: No, it doesn't. | 19:04 |
| EspadaV8 | just use the free apps? | 19:04 |
| ccooke | Corsac: even that doesn't follow. | 19:04 |
| luke-jr | bfrog: that's always been the case with NITs | 19:04 |
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| ccooke | Nokia said there'd always be an open mode | 19:04 |
| |R | If the next n9x0 has a TPM chip and we can run it openly without caring for DRM and use it to secure encryption process for our own good, then yé! | 19:04 |
| zaheerm | well ovi store and stuff is coming for maemo05, so not sure re: drm what they will do for ovi store | 19:04 |
| bfrog | I go buy a cd, I can do whatever the hell I want, some drm'd crap has all sorts of odd restrictions | 19:04 |
| SpeedEvil | bfrog: Much like locks don't mean you have less freedom in your house. | 19:04 |
| ccooke | The n900 would, therefore, be in that mode all the time | 19:04 |
| luke-jr | bfrog: even without DRM, the specs are missing | 19:04 |
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| Corsac | ccooke: yeah but I'm interested in the security architecture for personal stuff | 19:05 |
| Corsac | well, personal/corporate | 19:05 |
| ccooke | So am I | 19:05 |
| ccooke | it's a nice architecture on paper | 19:05 |
| bfrog | so basically there's no point in buying a n900 then | 19:05 |
| bfrog | why'd nokia even bother making it then | 19:05 |
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| luke-jr | bfrog: #FreeHandheld ;) | 19:05 |
| ccooke | bfrog: that's entirely up to you. | 19:05 |
| Corsac | if I can do secure communications over mail/phone/im/whatever it'd be really nice | 19:05 |
| lardman | re | 19:05 |
| ccooke | bfrog: because they can't make the next device without getting lots of feedback from *this* one, at the very least | 19:05 |
| zaheerm | bfrog, if you want a nice phone, then you can get a lot worse than an n900...which has a very nice user experience | 19:05 |
| luke-jr | ccooke: if the point is to help Nokia, then Nokia can fund it | 19:06 |
| * EspadaV8 n900++ | 19:06 | |
| bfrog | it also requires a stylus doesn't it? | 19:06 |
| Corsac | n901? | 19:06 |
| * EspadaV8 had to ships his back :( | 19:06 | |
| glass | the drm is needed for commercial stuff, thats where the pressure comes | 19:06 |
| zaheerm | n900 does not require a stylus | 19:06 |
| ccooke | the way things are going, I would expect to see maemo 6 on the n900 - in fact, it seeme to me that Nokia were being *very* careful with what they said at the summit | 19:06 |
| zaheerm | EspadaV8, what happened? | 19:06 |
| bfrog | how would it not with a resistive touch screen and all those tiny little buttons | 19:06 |
| EspadaV8 | zaheerm: i'd say that there are some apps that need the stylus | 19:06 |
| bfrog | my fingers are fat | 19:06 |
| EspadaV8 | zaheerm: end of the loan time | 19:06 |
| range | bfrog: Which tiny little buttons? | 19:07 |
| ccooke | they never once said that maemo6 will run on the n900. However, they carefully listed many times that the hardware would be basically the same | 19:07 |
| zaheerm | EspadaV8, none of the default apps need a stylus | 19:07 |
| range | bfrog: Have you even looked at some of the videos and screenshots? | 19:07 |
| bfrog | yeah | 19:07 |
| bfrog | those are tiny buttons | 19:07 |
| ccooke | and the language all the way through implied multiple streams of hardware | 19:07 |
| zaheerm | EspadaV8, only ones people haven't ported to the ui guidelines | 19:07 |
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| ccooke | For instance, the thing about supporting multitouch was "On capacitive screens" | 19:07 |
| glass | sony-xperia, now thats tiny buttons.. | 19:07 |
| zaheerm | i haven't used my stylus yet on n900 | 19:07 |
| ccooke | which rather implies that they'll have devices which don't have capacitive screens and therefore don't have multitouch | 19:08 |
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| glass | you should by the device based on what you get on it right now though | 19:08 |
| zaheerm | ccooke, what they did say however was screensize would remain same and so would the processor architecture | 19:08 |
| glass | you always get shafted if you buy devices based on what they may have in 1-2years | 19:09 |
| lardman | zgold_: ping | 19:09 |
| ccooke | zaheerm: and use of gles | 19:09 |
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| zaheerm | ccooke, yes and use of gles | 19:09 |
| bfrog | if I write an app for maemo 5 in Qt will it look the same as the gtk apps? | 19:09 |
| zaheerm | bfrog, yes | 19:09 |
| ccooke | basically, they said very loudly that maemo6 *could* run on the n900, but very carefully didn't say it *would* | 19:09 |
| bfrog | or will it be a crappy tacked on step child | 19:09 |
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| luke-jr | bfrog: why the obsession with Maemo specifically? | 19:09 |
| zaheerm | bfrog, the screenshots i have seen show it looking native | 19:09 |
| orbarron | hi all: need some input. please correct me if I am wrong but Maemo SDK and scratchbox seem to be geared to app development. Does anyone know how I might be able to get, build, or test a Maemo filesystem? I was told that someone had created such a environment for beagle but I am not sure where to look. I'll take any pointers... | 19:10 |
| EspadaV8 | bfrog: it'll look native | 19:10 |
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| luke-jr | bfrog: I would assume Qt on Maemo5 uses QGtkStyle | 19:10 |
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| EspadaV8 | Qt4.5 isn't 'offically' supported though | 19:10 |
| EspadaV8 | but i use it for my app and it looks at home | 19:10 |
| bfrog | yeah, thats still not as good as just using gtk then | 19:10 |
| luke-jr | bfrog: yes it is | 19:10 |
| ccooke | bfrog: you'll need to port the app to harmattan, but I suspect that will not be hard | 19:10 |
| EspadaV8 | using Qt is better than using Gtk though ;-) | 19:10 |
| * EspadaV8 hides before the Gtk dudes popup | 19:10 | |
| luke-jr | bfrog: I would run KDE, if you're going to get one | 19:11 |
| ccooke | I think a lot of people will use qt on maemo 5 | 19:11 |
| lardman | zgold_: try here actually to save me some typing http://maemo.org/development/documentation/manuals/3-x/howto_camera_api_bora/ | 19:11 |
| bfrog | well thats my thought right... why bother getting n900 when it sounds like in another 6 months to a year maemo 6 with purely qt will be around | 19:11 |
| EspadaV8 | i can't see any reason not to use Qt now | 19:11 |
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| luke-jr | bfrog: why not KDE? | 19:11 |
| microlith | bfrog: because that's 6 months to a year away | 19:11 |
| bfrog | and I'll probably need a new $500 device | 19:11 |
| EspadaV8 | bfrog: so you have something to play with now :-) | 19:11 |
| lardman | zgold_: one you've got that running, I'll give you some mods (switch off double buffering for the camera sink widget, etc.) | 19:11 |
| luke-jr | microlith: some of us are patient | 19:12 |
| bfrog | luke-jr because I want a phone not a desktop | 19:12 |
| luke-jr | bfrog: then get a phone | 19:12 |
| luke-jr | N900 isn't even supposed to be a phone | 19:12 |
| luke-jr | that's just a bonus app | 19:12 |
| microlith | luke-jr: my current phone is a moto ming loaner, and before that I last bought a phone in 2004 | 19:12 |
| * EspadaV8 will be buying the n900 | 19:12 | |
| microlith | ignored all teh smartphones from 2006 to now, I think I've been plenty patient :) | 19:12 |
| lardman | luke-jr: no, it is designed to be a phone; the phone app is all-powerful | 19:12 |
| luke-jr | microlith: I've had my current phone since 2001 | 19:12 |
| EspadaV8 | and probably the n910 and then whatever has maemo | 19:12 |
| EspadaV8 | 6 | 19:12 |
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| luke-jr | yayz, my N810 has finished upgrading to KDE 4.3.2 | 19:17 |
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| slonopotamus | luke-jr, hehe :) how it goes? | 19:17 |
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| luke-jr | slonopotamus: Xorg 7.5 is not practical yet | 19:18 |
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| slonopotamus | luke-jr, why? | 19:18 |
| luke-jr | slonopotamus: supposedly the server 1.7 is supposed to work with the Xorg 7.4 framework, but not | 19:18 |
| luke-jr | and even the bleeding edge evdev driver still filters keys > 255 | 19:18 |
| slonopotamus | err | 19:18 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr, you need to use xinput2 somehow | 19:19 |
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| luke-jr | slonopotamus: irrelevant if the keys are filtered at the driver | 19:20 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr, dunno. i haven't dug into this problem deep | 19:22 |
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| lardman | anyone got usbnet working for N900 yet? | 19:23 |
| luke-jr | slonopotamus: any clue how to get bluetooth to not start at boot? | 19:23 |
| johnsq | luke-jr: it should be run by udev | 19:24 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr, tweak udev rules? | 19:24 |
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| luke-jr | slonopotamus: meh | 19:24 |
| slonopotamus | luke-jr, remove bluez-utils? :D | 19:24 |
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| johnsq | luke-jr: problem is bluez-4, very broken. | 19:25 |
| luke-jr | slonopotamus: meh | 19:25 |
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| luke-jr | johnsq: I wouldn't know, BlueTooth is too user unfriendly | 19:25 |
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| slonopotamus | johnsq, gentoo only has 2.25 and 3.x... | 19:27 |
| johnsq | slonopotamus: my has bluez-4 unmasked | 19:27 |
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| johnsq | slonopotamus: I mean from gentoo unmasked, not by me | 19:27 |
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| lardman | anyone compiled g_ether for N900? | 19:32 |
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| Stskeeps | lardman: i have a sneaking suspicion g_nokia is actually a g_ether composite too | 19:33 |
| Corsac | (what's g_ether?) | 19:33 |
| lardman | really, hmm, might give it a go then | 19:33 |
| lardman | Corsac: ethernet over usb | 19:34 |
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| lardman | usbcore: registered new interface driver cdc_ether | 19:35 |
| lopz | gst.ElementNotFoundError: jpegenc any idea? | 19:37 |
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| lardman | lopz: install jpegenc? | 19:45 |
| andre__ | whoah. 100 bug reports in 3 days. | 19:45 |
| lardman | andre__: we thought you looked bored at the summit ;) | 19:46 |
| zaheerm | andre__, it's good, right? :) | 19:46 |
| VDVsx | hehhe | 19:46 |
| andre__ | heh. | 19:46 |
| andre__ | looks like a long evening | 19:46 |
| zaheerm | i reported 2 of them, my wife reported 1 | 19:46 |
| andre__ | yeah, i've just triaged them | 19:46 |
| lardman | I reported 5 or so this morning | 19:46 |
| zaheerm | andre__, thx for your comment, my wife was chuffed to read a thank you | 19:46 |
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| zaheerm | andre__, i had to hand hold her into using bugzilla, she was scared of writing wrong stuff | 19:47 |
| lopz | lardman yes :S | 19:47 |
| andre__ | i normally try to always write Thank you, except for those folks that I definitely know. I need a Thank you script :-P | 19:47 |
| VDVsx | andre__, seems that everybody wants "fixed in harmattan" t-shirts ;) | 19:48 |
| lardman | lopz: ah, well which plugins set should it be in? | 19:48 |
| andre__ | harhar | 19:48 |
| andre__ | I mean - for many people this will be the first time to be in contact with open source. So let's be friendly... | 19:48 |
| lardman | VDVsx, andre__: the colour of yours was soooo nice ;) | 19:48 |
| zaheerm | andre__, yes, thx i really appreciate it | 19:48 |
| luke-jr | andre__: what open source? | 19:48 |
| luke-jr | N900 better not be marketting as open unless Nokia is going to actually open it. | 19:49 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, these 85% in the device. you have to open it to see it | 19:49 |
| andre__ | i know that you can only see the other 15% otherwise | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | "85% open" is closed. | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | especially when the 15% not included is the important bits | 19:49 |
| andre__ | lardman, i think that orange is color that i don't look good in at all :-P but tonight is a dutch party here so it wil fit | 19:49 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, i don't agree at all with your view. | 19:50 |
| andre__ | but that's no news. | 19:50 |
| luke-jr | andre__: then you're missing the point of free software | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | pretty orange | 19:50 |
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| wiretapped | luke-jr: what do you think of android? | 19:51 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, freedom does not mean "everything must be free" to me. it's the freedom of every writer to decide which license to use. | 19:51 |
| andre__ | "everything must be free" is exaclty the contradiction to freedom. | 19:51 |
| wiretapped | and freedom of users to not buy it | 19:52 |
| * wiretapped wishes someone would sell him a phone with all free software | 19:52 | |
| luke-jr | wiretapped: I hate Java. | 19:52 |
| wiretapped | me too. | 19:52 |
| microlith | wiretapped: only hope there is openmoko, enjoy a mediocre phone :) | 19:52 |
| luke-jr | andre__: your freedom to decide sale terms ends when it infringes on the recipient's freedom to decide what he does with it | 19:53 |
| wiretapped | i've held off getting an android phone waiting for maemo... even though it is less free, it is more of a real linux platform | 19:53 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, you can do whatever you want to with your device. feel free to. just do it. | 19:54 |
| zaheerm | android is much less developed in community than maemo | 19:54 |
| luke-jr | andre__: Nokia denies me the information on how to use it. | 19:54 |
| wiretapped | zaheerm: that may be, but I know more android devs in person than I do maemo devs | 19:55 |
| wiretapped | but many of them are drooling over the n900 now :) | 19:55 |
| Corsac | hmhm, is the SDK available for armel hosts? | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | OK, so, in /pool/maemo5.0 there is maemo5.0/tools and maemo5.0/tools | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | what other ones are there? | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | err | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | maemo5.0/sdk | 19:55 |
| lopz | lardman I quickly install extra plugins has been fixed, thanks | 19:55 |
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| Stskeeps | i don't care for the tokens, but i am missing what category busybox is in | 19:56 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, like? | 19:56 |
| lardman | lopz: good; was going to mention that some of the packages don't contain all of the components | 19:56 |
| zaheerm | i have an android device too | 19:56 |
| zaheerm | doesn't even compare to the n900 | 19:56 |
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| luke-jr | andre__: like specifications on what to send to the modem/GPS/etc to get it to do stuff | 19:57 |
| lopz | lardman yep | 19:57 |
| lopz | lardman ok, thanks again | 19:58 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, that was never promised. | 19:58 |
| andre__ | i talked about the software when i said 85%. :) | 19:58 |
| luke-jr | andre__: thus, Nokia denies me the right to use my own hardware. | 19:58 |
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| luke-jr | andre__: modifyable drivers would qualify as specifications to me | 19:59 |
| andre__ | luke-jr, you can do whatever you want with the hardware | 20:00 |
| microlith | andre__: without specs it is exceedingly difficult | 20:00 |
| andre__ | expecting that all specs are available to me is a very busted point of view. do you also get that for your car_ | 20:00 |
| andre__ | ? | 20:00 |
| andre__ | of course it's difficult. and i agree with the point, sure. but... | 20:01 |
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| andre__ | "it's my hardware so they must give me all the specs" is just wrong. because there's a big difference. | 20:01 |
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| microlith | not really | 20:01 |
| andre__ | anyway. we all have our opinions on this :) | 20:01 |
| luke-jr | andre__: yes, I get a manual for my car. if I look online, I can probably even get details on the individual components. | 20:01 |
| |R | well actually there are laws for cars to be easily accessible, forcing them to open the computer specs, so not to put every car fixer / garagist out of business ;) | 20:01 |
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| lardman | can I upgrade my fremantle beta to fremantle-1.0/ | 20:02 |
| lardman | ? | 20:02 |
| lardman | (sorry, was out of the country when it was released) | 20:02 |
| lardman | ah, SDK that is of course | 20:03 |
| zaheerm | andre__, am i meant to remove moreinfo keyword when i provide the info you asked for? | 20:03 |
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| zaheerm | lardman, i had issues when i did that, had to install afresh | 20:04 |
| lardman | zaheerm: ok, thanks | 20:04 |
| andre__ | zaheerm, yes :) | 20:04 |
| zaheerm | andre__, done, thx didn't know the maemo bugzilla etiquette | 20:05 |
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| andre__ | zaheerm, after update we'll have a needinfo state, finally | 20:11 |
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| ccooke | FYI: mauku on my n900 is a complete battery killer. Just found that it's left a process using 90% of the cpu, permanently | 20:18 |
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| wiretapped | lol @ nokia's meetup locations | 20:19 |
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| lcuk | wiretapped, at the flagship stores? | 20:20 |
| ccooke | Anyone running mauku: Check 'top' in the terminal for a process running at 90% cpu. you'll need to drop to root and apt-get remove microfeed to get rid of it. | 20:21 |
| wiretapped | yeah i guess i mean lol @ their flagship store locations | 20:21 |
| ccooke | (this will remove mauku, of course) | 20:21 |
| ccooke | (actually, I needed to kill the process, too) | 20:23 |
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| * lardman wanders off for a glass of wine while the 1.0 Fremantle SDK installs | 20:24 | |
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| * fiferboy goes for a three-hour coffee break while Qt 4.6 compiles in scratchbox | 20:31 | |
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| * lardman wonders if the length of the coffee break actually has anything to do with Qt compiling..... | 20:31 | |
| clmntch | qt takes some time to compile | 20:32 |
| clmntch | possibly more than a coffee break | 20:32 |
| clmntch | unless he's going to columbia to pick the beans himself | 20:33 |
| fiferboy | It is a lot better than before. 3 hours now versus 3 days (and not actually completing) before | 20:33 |
| Corsac | “i'm not slacking off, my code's compiling!” | 20:33 |
| SpeedEvil | If anything takes more time than a coffee break, you need a faster compile farm. | 20:33 |
| lardman | Is this the latest relases? | 20:33 |
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| fiferboy | 4.6 alpha | 20:33 |
| fiferboy | The "technology preview" | 20:34 |
| lardman | I thought it was still missing some bits & bobs that will be added soon? | 20:34 |
| fiferboy | Most likely. I am compiling for x86 right now to test in scratchbox | 20:34 |
| lardman | ok | 20:34 |
| fiferboy | If it runs my program well enough and is finger friendly, I will compile it for arm and try it on my device | 20:34 |
| lardman | cool, am looking forward to Harmattan goodness :) | 20:35 |
| fiferboy | Maybe they will go back to Qtopia for Harmattan :) | 20:36 |
| fiferboy | lardman: You are (were?) a Zaurus user, right? | 20:36 |
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| lardman | yes, was | 20:37 |
| lardman | don't think they will even boot now, batteries so old & dead | 20:37 |
| fiferboy | I thought I remember the nickname from somewhere. I have two SL-5000Ds that won't boot | 20:37 |
| lardman | yeah, I was very active on the oesf forums, and did some stuff in OpenZaurus, etc | 20:37 |
| fiferboy | I was somewhat active on the forums and wrote a couple Qtopia apps | 20:38 |
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| fiferboy | I used to use it as a LAMP stack to serve PHP and Mysql to myself :) | 20:39 |
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| lardman | I seemed to spend lots of time getting Octave and R to run | 20:40 |
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| lardman | all the while cursing fpa for always having bigendian ordering even while the processor was littleendian (or at least running in that mode for the pedants) | 20:40 |
| lardman | and also cursing the two above for using fp ordering to decide device endianness | 20:41 |
| lardman | all good fun | 20:41 |
| fiferboy | I had a CL-1000 before my N810, but I sold that too my brother. It was a pretty nice computer, but CF wifi cards didn't seem to last long on it | 20:41 |
| luke-jr | SL-C1000? | 20:42 |
| * microlith remembers drooling over the C-860 | 20:43 | |
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| lardman | wifi cards sticking out drove me mad/to the 770 | 20:43 |
| lardman | but no kb really was a step back | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | O.o | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | I really really want an upgraded Zaurus clamshell | 20:43 |
| microlith | wasn't the C1000 the first with an internal hard drive? | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | microlith: I think so | 20:43 |
| luke-jr | the new one is just SSD again, isn't it? | 20:44 |
| microlith | are there new ones? | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | yeah | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | but still no Bluetooth or phone capability | 20:44 |
| lardman | C1000 also had usb host iirc | 20:44 |
| microlith | I thought sharp killed the zaurus line | 20:44 |
| ccooke_ | the new sharp clamshell is not a Zaurus, though | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | microlith: they did, until recently | 20:44 |
| fiferboy | C3000 had the HD, C1000 did not | 20:44 |
| ccooke_ | and it's... not looking very good, to be honest | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | microlith: the new one is also larger IIRC | 20:44 |
| ccooke_ | a bit of a missed opportunity | 20:44 |
| luke-jr | and has a crappy keyboard from the reviews | 20:44 |
| microlith | I was always tempted to try and get one, but even the C700s in used shops were expensive as all get out | 20:45 |
| luke-jr | http://pocketables.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83451c9ec69e20120a602908a970c-800wi | 20:45 |
| microlith | oh, those things | 20:45 |
| lardman | microlith: c700 was crippled | 20:45 |
| luke-jr | I have a SL-C760 | 20:45 |
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| lardman | microlith: I bought a c750 which was not too bad, was considering upgrading to to C1000, but went for Nokia instead | 20:46 |
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| microlith | lardman: cool. this is my first move on a portable device like this (with the N900) | 20:46 |
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| traut | is there python-abook build for PyMaemo5 ? | 20:46 |
| lardman | I still quite fancy a Psion 5 replacement mind you :) | 20:47 |
| lardman | microlith: it's a good bit of kit | 20:47 |
| lardman | the N900 that is | 20:47 |
| microlith | yeah | 20:47 |
| traut | desperately trying to build it by my own | 20:47 |
| lardman | Psion 5 is a bit old now ;) | 20:47 |
| luke-jr | the OpenPandora would be tempting if it had phone chip :/ | 20:47 |
| microlith | it's replacing my phone and my iPod | 20:47 |
| lardman | or ever got released :p | 20:47 |
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| microlith | and my aspire one to some extent | 20:48 |
| * microlith grumbles, stupid cheap fan | 20:48 | |
| lardman | I put a CC order down for one a year ago, got money back and never bothered to re-order, and here we are one year on | 20:48 |
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| luke-jr | lardman: it seems to be shipping soon for real :p | 20:48 |
| lardman | lol | 20:48 |
| lardman | I've heard that before | 20:48 |
| lardman | :) | 20:48 |
| luke-jr | lardman: supposedly it's actually physically existing now | 20:48 |
| lardman | well that's a step closer at least | 20:48 |
| lizardo | traut: currently, no , but see this thread: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/pymaemo-developers/2009-October/000972.html | 20:49 |
| luke-jr | "1. ALL parts (including the nubs) have arrived at the factory! For ALL 4000 Pandoras!" | 20:49 |
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| traut | lizardo: thank you, I'll take a look | 20:49 |
| luke-jr | "CE testing will take place next week on Wednesday and will probably take about 1 - 2 hours." | 20:50 |
| luke-jr | that's tomorrow | 20:50 |
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| Jaffa | qwerty12: good find on the pvr cache thing | 20:51 |
| qwerty12 | Thanks | 20:51 |
| SpeedEvil | I personally have taken the approach of not believing any hardware is real until I can buy it for 40 quid on ebay. | 20:51 |
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| luke-jr | wtf is 40 quid | 20:52 |
| Xisdibik | headless Squid | 20:52 |
| lardman | £ | 20:52 |
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| timeless | 3-4 years late | 20:52 |
| SpeedEvil | $60 or so dollars | 20:52 |
| luke-jr | lol | 20:52 |
| timeless | or 2 years after warranty and support end | 20:52 |
| lardman | why do you foreigners not know what a quid is? Madness! ;) | 20:52 |
| luke-jr | I wonder if OpenPandora will have headers that might allow adding a cell phone | 20:52 |
| Xisdibik | lardman: Why do you pronounce colour color, but spell it colour ;) | 20:53 |
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| lardman | Xisdibik: ah no, I say it cooolooooeeeerrr, like a Frenchman ;) | 20:53 |
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| Xisdibik | ah a frenchie, nvm then your cool ;) | 20:53 |
| Jaffa | traut: If you get the Hermes sourcde tarball you'll find a basic osso-abook example in Python using ctypes | 20:53 |
| lardman | no, am English tbh | 20:53 |
| Xisdibik | oh | 20:53 |
| timeless | s/your/you're/ | 20:53 |
| glass__ | luke-jr: does it have bluetooth? just glue one bt phone to backside if it has | 20:53 |
| Xisdibik | phail then ;) | 20:53 |
| lardman | indeed | 20:53 |
| * GeneralAntilles waits to see where the wiki whining goes. | 20:54 | |
| timeless | wiki whining? | 20:54 |
| Xisdibik | and yea, I do my your/you're wrong on purpose for my friend ;) | 20:54 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: seen rcadden's tweet about tmo for consumers? | 20:54 |
| traut | Jaffa: I'll ask him by email, thanks | 20:54 |
| timeless | you only have one? | 20:54 |
| Xisdibik | only one what? | 20:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, don't follow twitter generally. | 20:54 |
| RST38h | These ssh problems are contagious | 20:55 |
| Jaffa | traut: Him? I wrote it ;-) | 20:55 |
| RST38h | First Extras-Devel, now Komkon | 20:55 |
| timeless | ssh problems? | 20:55 |
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| traut | Jaffa: oh, sorry :) | 20:55 |
| luke-jr | glass__: yeah | 20:55 |
| traut | Jaffa: can you please point where I can get the code? | 20:55 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38bis: I blame Russia and Finland being next to each other | 20:55 |
| lardman | how do I change sb target? | 20:55 |
| * lardman never uses x86, wants to escape asap | 20:56 | |
| timeless | sb-menu | 20:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, not jumping out at me in his history. Timeframe or link? | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | traut: It'll be in git soon enough, but the existing source is either in /opt/hermes/lib once installed or on repository.maem.org - more info at http://maemo.org/packages/view/hermes/ | 20:56 |
| lardman | timeless: thanks :) | 20:56 |
| RST38bis | qwerty: Komkon is in CT.US how did it get into this picture? | 20:56 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, http://www.flickr.com/photos/43419012@N04/4001322448/ ehhehe | 20:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless, another round of "everything at http://maemo.org sucks" | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Would've been under maemoguru account at about 1700 UTC | 20:57 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | RST38bis: Meh, I thought it was in Russia. | 20:57 |
| fiferboy | lardman: armel will not display anything if you are trying to use Xephyr | 20:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, proof! You're trying to steal my pocket lint! | 20:57 |
| lizardo | I suppose X-Fade is AFK, so anyone else could take a look on this build: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/pygtk_2.12.1-6maemo8/ on fremantle autobuilder and see why it is taking so long (it is building for a long time, and usually is very quick to build) | 20:57 |
| fiferboy | Unless that was fixed in the final SDK | 20:57 |
| traut | Jaffa: thanks | 20:57 |
| Jaffa | VDvdvhehe | 20:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, interesting. | 20:58 |
| traut | Jaffa: I'll take a closer look tomorrow. Thank you once again. | 20:58 |
| Jaffa | traut: I'll try and push the existing versions into git at http://garage.maemo.org/projects/hermes/ tonight | 20:59 |
| lardman | fiferboy: command line only ;) | 20:59 |
| traut | Jaffa: ok, great | 20:59 |
| fiferboy | lardman: Ah yes, you don't do GUIs | 20:59 |
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| Jaffa | traut: just shout if you have any questions; took me ages to get it working so happy to share my learning | 20:59 |
| * GeneralAntilles starts shameless ripping Apple logo animations off. | 21:00 | |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: startup screen? | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 21:00 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Gonna try to animate something interesting with the http://maemo.org logo. | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Where's our sound artist to mix us up a tune to go with it? :P | 21:01 |
| * qwerty12_N810 gets his amplifier, microphone and rigs it up to the toilet | 21:02 | |
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| javispedro | qwerty12_N810: great discovery! I love the documentation for hildon_gtk_window_take_screenshot(). you'd never guess what the function is for from reading it. ( http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/hildon/hildon-Additions-to-GTK+.html#hildon-gtk-window-take-screenshot ). | 21:03 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: lol, yeah, I thought it was what ctrl-shift-p did when I first saw it :) | 21:03 |
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| lizardo | well, pygtk now happily continues its building now :D thanks to the anonymous (or to the OOM Killer?) for letting the build continue :D | 21:04 |
| lardman | fiferboy: well I try very hard not to anyway | 21:05 |
| GAN900 | How is text rendering in the browser so broken. . . . | 21:05 |
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| GAN900 | This should really be a blocker bug. | 21:06 |
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| lardman | why do we still have an old version of debhelper? | 21:11 |
| javispedro | in SDK? mostly. | 21:12 |
| Stskeeps | cos of noone knowing how on earth to upgrade it in scratchbox | 21:13 |
| javispedro | yep, still debian-etch here. | 21:13 |
| lardman | hmm, curious, clutter-1.0 is on the device, but not in the SDK | 21:14 |
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| javispedro | well, debian lenny devkit is there at least (without debhelper) | 21:14 |
| javispedro | lardman: because someone uploaded it to extras iirc. | 21:14 |
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| lardman | ah, ok | 21:14 |
| javispedro | at least I got some OGLES2 tips from him. | 21:14 |
| timeless | gan: we don't really know much about kerning | 21:15 |
| timeless | have you installed fennec? | 21:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless, I did, it wasn't optfied and it was slow. | 21:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | The text rendering in MicroB has to be fixed. | 21:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It makes the whole zooming thing pretty useless. | 21:16 |
| timeless | was kerning better there? | 21:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Didn't bother to test that far. | 21:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | It was really slow and my rootfs was full by that point. | 21:17 |
| * timeless nods | 21:17 | |
| timeless | oh, i found my skypename | 21:17 |
| timeless | it was very creative | 21:18 |
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| lardman | hmm, I get: W: GPG error: http://repository.maemo.org fremantle Release: Couldn't access keyring: 'No such file or directory' | 21:18 |
| qwerty12_N810 | "timeless_da_pimp"? | 21:19 |
| lardman | any thoughts as to what that might be trying to tell me | 21:21 |
| lardman | ? | 21:21 |
| lardman | seemingly something to do with my trying to add extras | 21:21 |
| * qwerty12_N810 's carefree side points out that it is a warning, and not an error | 21:21 | |
| lardman | ah, that's good, thanks | 21:22 |
| fiferboy | I think it is just letting you know that anything signed in that repo won't be verified when you install it, since you don't have the key | 21:22 |
| fiferboy | I can't remember whether extras is signed or not | 21:22 |
| lardman | ah ok | 21:22 |
| lardman | still no clutter-1.0 anywhere though, perhaps I need extras-devel/testing/etc | 21:23 |
| wazd | fiferboy: heya, traveled back safely? :) | 21:24 |
| fiferboy | wazd: Yes. Now I just need to get my timezone adjusted again | 21:24 |
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| fiferboy | And there was a hectic (and expensive) cab ride to the airport when the train to the airport was cancelled... | 21:24 |
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| *** Xsidibik is now known as Xisdibik | 21:25 | |
| wazd | fiferboy: yeah, can't imagine :) | 21:25 |
| lardman | balls, can't install libclutter-1.0-dev due to missing deps: libgles2-sgx-img-dev, libgl1-mesa-dev, libgl-dev | 21:26 |
| lardman | hmm, supper first | 21:26 |
| lardman | bbiab | 21:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, while you're doing that, think about a calculator widget. | 21:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | wazd, now is the time to pick up 3D. :P | 21:26 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Desktop widget? | 21:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 21:27 |
| fiferboy | I would need to see a sensible layout to make it finger-friendly yet small enough. I can't picture that | 21:27 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: what? :) | 21:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, for startup animations. | 21:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, it can be stylus friendly. | 21:28 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: oh, yeah, wish I had time :) | 21:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Close something like this: http://www.mattballdesign.com/widgets/calculator/calculator.png | 21:28 |
| timeless | phone keypad 4x3 | 21:28 |
| fiferboy | True. A basic calulator has, what - 18 buttons | 21:28 |
| timeless | * changes numbers to operator | 21:29 |
| fiferboy | I'll take a look and see what I can come up with | 21:29 |
| timeless | # as = | 21:29 |
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| javispedro | lardman|gone: for when you return, it's funny, because the first one will only be avail in armel and the other two ones in x86 sdk. | 21:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Crap, I forgot how to animate. | 21:30 |
| aSIMULAter | omg haihai | 21:32 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, onion skinning! | 21:33 |
| lcuk | hi aSIMULAter | 21:33 |
| aSIMULAter | hai lcuk | 21:33 |
| Corsac | hmhm, has the n900 some videochat soft? | 21:33 |
| Corsac | like, jabber video support? | 21:33 |
| RST38h | well, ssh seems to have sorted itself out | 21:34 |
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| lcuk | aSIMULAter, was it as big as you expected | 21:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | We're talking about the Summit, right? | 21:35 |
| * qwerty12_N810 hides | 21:35 | |
| lcuk | lol | 21:35 |
| aSIMULAter | well it was an ok size | 21:35 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAter <== met RST38h at the summit but apparently didn't make a connection | 21:35 |
| aSIMULAter | i had a good time | 21:35 |
| aSIMULAter | maybe if i saw a photo of you i would remembmermelkt? | 21:36 |
| aSIMULAter | asdf | 21:36 |
| RST38h | Ehehe | 21:36 |
| aSIMULAter | http://www.flickr.com/photos/asimulator/3995305412/ | 21:36 |
| aSIMULAter | maemo crew \o/ big upppps | 21:36 |
| lcuk | yikes! i have been photographed | 21:37 |
| RST38h | asim: the fellow at the left is me | 21:37 |
| fiferboy | I'm in there too | 21:37 |
| aSIMULAter | oho! :) | 21:37 |
| lcuk | and Stskeeps | 21:37 |
| aSIMULAter | now i remember u | 21:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Maybe the revolution will be televised. | 21:37 |
| aSIMULAter | i'm using the n900 as my primary device now | 21:37 |
| aSIMULAter | <3 it | 21:37 |
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| aSIMULAter | i especially LOVE THE USER INTERFACE | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | :P | 21:38 |
| lcuk | about bloody time! you cant go designing conversations without using it yourself! | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | hehe | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | did u guys see our videos yet? | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | www.youtube.com/maemo5ui | 21:38 |
| lcuk | nopers | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | www.youtube.com/maemo5uiteam | 21:38 |
| aSIMULAter | rather | 21:38 |
| JoeBrain | I thought Maemo 6 was announced? | 21:38 |
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| javispedro | it was "announced" a few years ago. | 21:38 |
| JoeBrain | lol k, just reading the topic | 21:39 |
| aSIMULAter | please try and spread the url about our videos :D | 21:39 |
| * GeneralAntilles has a cheesy logo animation on the way. | 21:40 | |
| luke-jr | aSIMULAter: where'd you get it from so fast? O.o | 21:40 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: if it's anything Apple related prepare to die >:) | 21:40 |
| aSIMULAter | the device? | 21:40 |
| aSIMULAter | i uh...attended the maemo summit :P | 21:40 |
| luke-jr | oh, right | 21:40 |
| * lcuk giggles | 21:40 | |
| javispedro | aSIMULAter: the turn down to silence idea looks pretty! | 21:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre__, looool | 21:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | aSIMULAter, why can't we organize the applications menu? :( | 21:40 |
| aSIMULAter | good question | 21:41 |
| aSIMULAter | wasn't taht also a question at the summit | 21:41 |
| aSIMULAter | to the ux panel | 21:41 |
| andre__ | GeneralAntilles, hmmmm? | 21:41 |
| RST38h | the app menu is weird | 21:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre__, Harmattan, really? :Y | 21:41 |
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| andre__ | GeneralAntilles, FIXED in Harmattan! yay! | 21:41 |
| RST38h | 1-2-3-4 taps to get to an app | 21:41 |
| * lcuk facepalms | 21:42 | |
| GeneralAntilles | By that time Nokia's going to have built-in bricking devices that activate if you try to install things from Extras testing. | 21:42 |
| andre__ | yawn | 21:42 |
| VDVsx | fiferboy, didn't knew that you was at the summit o_0 | 21:42 |
| lcuk | adele, in the conversations vid, you answer the call - have a think and tell me how long you had been using the device | 21:42 |
| fiferboy | VDVsx: Yep, I made the trip. | 21:43 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, he was lurking | 21:43 |
| aSIMULAter | lcuk: :PP | 21:43 |
| qwerty12_N810 | VDVsx: How long have you been helping organising it? :p | 21:43 |
| lcuk | aSIMULAter, serious question | 21:43 |
| aSIMULAter | are you refering to the time stamps | 21:43 |
| lcuk | no | 21:44 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, how long I spent in the org ? lol | 21:44 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, we didnt do the signing thing | 21:44 |
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| lcuk | i have just been reminded now | 21:44 |
| fiferboy | VDVsx: I walked back to the hotel with you guys after the last summit day :) | 21:44 |
| VDVsx | fiferboy, .( | 21:45 |
| fiferboy | I was with qole when we caught up to you guys. | 21:45 |
| fiferboy | I don't think we were ever properly introduced, though. | 21:45 |
| VDVsx | fiferboy, yeah, it happened to me a lot, 'I missed a lot of introductions' lol | 21:46 |
| aSIMULAter | lcuk: well, technically for quite some time now | 21:46 |
| lcuk | i see - whats this also http://www.flickr.com/photos/asimulator/4008256538/ lol | 21:46 |
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| aSIMULAter | heheheh | 21:47 |
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| aSIMULAter | okok i kid........but today i actually started using it at my primary device | 21:48 |
| aSIMULAter | i have 2 sim cards, using it with my personal sim now | 21:48 |
| aSIMULAter | finally took the plunge | 21:48 |
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| aSIMULAter | 178kcal | 21:50 |
| aSIMULAter | er oops wrong channel | 21:50 |
| JosefAssad | that was for #bigmac huh | 21:50 |
| lcuk | hah | 21:50 |
| * lcuk wants one of those scooterbikes | 21:51 | |
| aSIMULAter | i'm talking about the stroopwafels i bought | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | in amsterdam | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | i bought a box of 6 packages | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | and each is 178kcal | 21:51 |
| lcuk | o_O | 21:51 |
| SpeedEvil | np: Scooter - The Logical Song. | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | and i ate 4 today :O :( | 21:51 |
| lcuk | i didnt eat a single rasher of bacon on this trip | 21:51 |
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| aSIMULAter | that's it..no more dutch food...bad for your health | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | no bacon at your hotel? | 21:51 |
| lardman | javispedro: indeed, slightly strange | 21:51 |
| lcuk | nope! | 21:51 |
| lcuk | and no pineapple either | 21:51 |
| aSIMULAter | what in tarnation | 21:52 |
| lcuk | breakfast consisted of a cup of coffee :D | 21:52 |
| lardman | javispedro: ah, they are OR deps | 21:52 |
| lardman | my mistake | 21:52 |
| javispedro | that'd make sense. | 21:52 |
| * lardman wonders if he needs to install nokia-binaries or somesuch | 21:52 | |
| javispedro | lardman: either way, why 1.0? iirc the compositor uses 0.8 | 21:52 |
| lardman | I have 1.0 on device and libchamplain wants it | 21:52 |
| javispedro | a, just curious. | 21:52 |
| fiferboy | lardman: Sounds like you are doing gui work... | 21:53 |
| lardman | yeah, I may go to an earlier version of libchamplain | 21:53 |
| lardman | fiferboy: yeah, nasty isn't it!? | 21:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: Did you get the same bad feeling as me? | 21:53 |
| javispedro | fiferboy: so, would you like to get help on writing a formal letter? (couldn't resist) ;) | 21:53 |
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| fiferboy | javispedro: I don't get it... | 21:54 |
| * RST38h still has not renamed his n900 into a real phone | 21:54 | |
| RST38h | Still called neopadlog | 21:54 |
| javispedro | fiferboy: office clippo reference, probably mistranslated. | 21:54 |
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| javispedro | Clippo: "It looks like you are doing GUI work... would you like some help on Hildon? NIAHIAHIAHIA" | 21:55 |
| lcuk | lardman, wine | 21:55 |
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| lcuk | much more wine | 21:55 |
| aSIMULAter | http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2009/10/checking-twitterfacebook-the-new-post-coital-cigarette.ars | 21:55 |
| lardman | right-ho | 21:55 |
| lcuk | and ask fiferboy and aSIMULAter ;) | 21:55 |
| lcuk | aSIMULAter, :O you will soon have to stand outside to check facebook, good thing you can with n900 | 21:56 |
| tbf | andre__: can we get one to package http://burtonini.com/bzr/eds-tools/? | 21:56 |
| aSIMULAter | <3 unlimited data plan | 21:57 |
| lardman | hmm, I wonder what I've broken?: > fakeroot apt-get install nokia-binaries | 21:57 |
| tbf | andre__: having them in fremantle-extras would help greatly in debugging contacts related bugs like 5365 | 21:57 |
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| lardman | E: Couldn't find package nokia-binaries | 21:57 |
| andre__ | tbf: asking in talk.maemo.org is usually a good way | 21:57 |
| fiferboy | lardman: Did you install the EULA repository? | 21:57 |
| aSIMULAter | geez, from roughly 10 mins of usage, i clocked in 8mbit of downloads (yay for hte data counter) that was 2,60e per mb | 21:57 |
| lardman | ah, reading the docs | 21:57 |
| lardman | I see my error now ;) | 21:57 |
| tbf | andre__: what would be a good forum? | 21:58 |
| RST38h | Ahhahaha | 21:58 |
| RST38h | They marked this as WONTFIX: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5321 | 21:58 |
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| andre__ | tbf: as i said: talk.maemo.org | 21:59 |
| RST38h | And this is an "enhancement": https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5332 | 21:59 |
| andre__ | "Request for packaging foo" | 21:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, holy shit. | 21:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's so awful. | 21:59 |
| tbf | andre__: YES! but which forum there? | 21:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | I still see those damn popups all of them time. | 21:59 |
| javispedro | that's why I still put my n810 in flight mode & silence at nights. | 21:59 |
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| GeneralAntilles | All they tell you is that Modest is buggy. | 21:59 |
| andre__ | tbf: don't know :) | 21:59 |
| aSIMULAter | omg kmfdm | 21:59 |
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| * RST38h sighs at the absolutely ridiculous manner in which bugs.maemo.org reports are treated | 21:59 | |
| tbf | andre__: trying devel - http://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=13 | 22:00 |
| KMFDM | hey aSIMULAter | 22:00 |
| andre__ | RST38h, i'm around for direct criticism :-P | 22:00 |
| aSIMULAter | hi | 22:00 |
| lardman | ok, hopefully that will fix things | 22:00 |
| * lardman goes for more wine to help the process | 22:00 | |
| andre__ | RST38h, with regard to 5321: nice that it works for you. bad that it does not work for many other people | 22:01 |
| * fiferboy wonders if the wine is at all related to the process | 22:01 | |
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| aSIMULAter | huh simula | 22:01 |
| RST38h | andre: I | 22:01 |
| frals | hmm, does it matter if people vote for a "WONTFIX"? | 22:01 |
| tbf | weird? do i have to register separately for talk.maemo.org? | 22:02 |
| frals | ye tbf | 22:02 |
| RST38h | andre: I have moved beyond direct criticism of you because it does not seem to produce any results | 22:02 |
| andre__ | tbf: SSO is not in place yet i think | 22:02 |
| lcuk | besides, shooting the messenger doesnt really solve anything | 22:02 |
| andre__ | RST38h, well, most of the time I'm only the messenger, yeah | 22:02 |
| andre__ | heh | 22:02 |
| andre__ | but I still love getting flamed :-P | 22:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I dunno, I'm still willing to put a few more rounds in andre__ to see if it changes anything. :P | 22:03 |
| andre__ | GeneralAntilles, just do. I'm also for changing some stuff. But it's complicated. We all know. | 22:03 |
| javispedro | andre__: btw, sorry for not putting any patch keyword. today I just realised how to use it :) | 22:03 |
| andre__ | nokia is not the small startup with 30 people where you can easily change everything... | 22:04 |
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| frals | does it matter if i vote for a "WONTFIX" or is it like talking to a wall? | 22:04 |
| andre__ | but i repeat myself :) | 22:04 |
| andre__ | javispedro, no problem | 22:04 |
| frals | *repeats himself* | 22:04 |
| lcuk | are you voting for the wontfix or the problem | 22:04 |
| qwerty12_N810 | /ignore frals | 22:04 |
| javispedro | frals: I guess it matters, but I don't think it will appear in the most N reports. | 22:04 |
| andre__ | basically it does not change anything. but i like the idea to cover also WONTFIX tickets in the statistics. might make sense to show Nokia where they are completely wrong | 22:05 |
| andre__ | i should consider that | 22:05 |
| lcuk | +1 | 22:05 |
| andre__ | because some decisions are just plain braindead | 22:05 |
| frals | voting for the bug | 22:05 |
| lcuk | the decisions may have been made on the specific request | 22:05 |
| lcuk | but with more work a better solution might appear | 22:05 |
| Mozillion | hmm, I just cannot find how to set my presence in the SDK so I can get online on Jabber and start doing things :) | 22:05 |
| lcuk | ie - fi rst asked for a configuration option instead of just saying its too much ? | 22:06 |
| javispedro | this is why I love OSS: because when not even smashing the developer against a wall to force him fix "feature" X, you can fix it yourself! :) | 22:06 |
| javispedro | unfortunately, telephaty-ui is closed source :( | 22:06 |
| lcuk | even if it were open source, it would be a long path to get anything in the official flashable image | 22:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Does anybody get more than 3 seconds out of this one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u2bTy9d0aI | 22:07 |
| javispedro | lcuk: but it would solve the hard situation of bug 5321 | 22:08 |
| frals | GeneralAntilles: i get all 4 seconds | 22:08 |
| aSIMULAter | well 4 seconds, but the animation stops at 3 seconds | 22:08 |
| javispedro | a novice user may prefer alt A, an advanced user prefers alt B, and Nokia prefers not to clutter the options dialog with settings for user B for reasons I'll never understand but marketdroids might. | 22:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Weird. :\ | 22:08 |
| frals | yeah same as aSIMULAter i guess | 22:09 |
| andre__ | bug 5321: a gconf setting would be nice | 22:09 |
| andre__ | for advanced users to tweak | 22:09 |
| andre__ | you could reopen and ask for a gconf setting as enhancment. | 22:09 |
| * GeneralAntilles hasn't had any success with that path. | 22:09 | |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: blender I guess? | 22:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, Cinema 4D. | 22:10 |
| javispedro | ah ,dunoo. | 22:10 |
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| andre__ | yeah. probably it's too deeply in the system and a dirty implementation that would require a lot of work to respect a simple gconf key... | 22:10 |
| lcuk | it would be tough to get that right as you say andre__ and especially because its all tied into the real phone too | 22:11 |
| javispedro | uh? | 22:11 |
| tbf | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=345642 | 22:11 |
| andre__ | yeah :-( | 22:11 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | 3 or 4 lines max, if even that | 22:12 |
| andre__ | tbf, thanks. feel free to subscribe to that thread too if you want | 22:12 |
| javispedro | just put an if(!user_said_no) before hildon_banner_* | 22:12 |
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| andre__ | i see somebody cooking a patch ;-)) | 22:12 |
| javispedro | it was qwerty12_N810! qwerty12_N810 first!!! | 22:12 |
| tbf | Mozillion: but Mission Control is FOSS | 22:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, movie's fine here, YouTube is having trouble. | 22:13 |
| aSIMULAter | good night my open source pals | 22:13 |
| tbf | Mozillion: the presence UI just is a frontend for MC | 22:13 |
| javispedro | gnite aSIMULAter | 22:13 |
| lcuk | gnite aSIMULAter | 22:13 |
| qwerty12_N810 | andre__: You can't patch source you don't have ;) | 22:13 |
| qwerty12_N810 | 'night, aSIMULAter | 22:13 |
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| andre__ | yeah. that sucks | 22:14 |
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| Mozillion | tbf: where is the presence UI? I found the config part... problem is that mc-tool is also not working | 22:16 |
| tbf | Mozillion: it's the stuff you access from the status menu to set your presence status | 22:16 |
| * fiferboy just spent three hours compiling Qt 4.6 alpha, and it fails on the last step! | 22:16 | |
| Mozillion | ah ok.. but the status menu only has clock+alarms in the SDK AFAIK | 22:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: wow, that... nah, forget it: HAHA | 22:17 |
| Hydroxide | fiferboy: it's always the last step if it's a fatal error :) | 22:17 |
| fiferboy | Hydroxide: Okay, one step before it would have finished :P | 22:18 |
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| tbf | Mozillion: oh. ok. | 22:22 |
| tbf | Mozillion: :-( | 22:22 |
| Mozillion | I might just be missing something here | 22:23 |
| Mozillion | yesterday when i configured the account it went online immediately :) | 22:23 |
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| * timeless_mbp sighs | 22:29 | |
| lcuk | fiferboy, speak to mek, he got it working and showed me some cool desktop widgets | 22:29 |
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| Mek | fiferboy: what's the problem? | 22:30 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: The SVG widgets? Sliders and such? | 22:30 |
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| lcuk | and i found out the eyes widget uses the accel smoothing i posted to wiki :D | 22:30 |
| lcuk | oh, hi mek \o | 22:30 |
| Mek | :) | 22:30 |
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| fiferboy | Mek: I got a dh_strip error on libQt4Core | 22:30 |
| Mek | ah, you're trying to actuallly build packages? I didn't do that... | 22:31 |
| fiferboy | I basically just downloaded the tech preview and did "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -nc -b" | 22:31 |
| fiferboy | Mek: Yes. The actual compile went fine. | 22:32 |
| Mek | I hadn't even noticed there was a debian directory in there... | 22:32 |
| fiferboy | That was the first thing I checked. I don't like playing around with the config in Qt | 22:32 |
| fiferboy | I'm trying it again in case it is a one time thing | 22:33 |
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| Mek | it might just be that the debian stuff is not yet supposed to work; if they had got it to work why wouldn't they also ahve provided binary packages. Also the build isntructions in the press release told you to compile manually with certain configure options... | 22:34 |
| fiferboy | That is true... | 22:35 |
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| fiferboy | I hadn't thought of why there would be a delay to release binary packages | 22:35 |
| Stskeeps | isnt the idea of tech preview to look at src? | 22:36 |
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| fiferboy | Hmm, same problem. Trying a make install | 22:37 |
| fiferboy | Nope, have to start clean. | 22:37 |
| fiferboy | Mek: What configure line did you use? | 22:38 |
| fiferboy | Just -maemo5 -opengl es2? | 22:39 |
| Mek | fiferboy: configure -maemo5 -opengl es2 (and I also added a -prefix to specify where I wanted it to install) | 22:39 |
| Mek | yeah | 22:39 |
| fiferboy | Cool, thanks :) | 22:39 |
| Mek | as long as you don't need libQtUiTools and/or qdbuscpp2xml or qdbusxml2cpp that sohuld be enough | 22:39 |
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| fiferboy | I don't think I need those | 22:40 |
| lcuk | yet | 22:40 |
| ds3 | talk of kcals? hmmmm are we measuring battery output now? ;) | 22:43 |
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| fiferboy | Mek: "The EGL functionality test failed!" I installed libgles2-dev and libgl-dev | 22:47 |
| fiferboy | This is building for X86 in scratchbox | 22:48 |
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| Mek | fiferboy: I think installing opengles-sgx-img-common-dev fixed that error for me | 22:48 |
| Mek | (but I only did an arm build anyway) | 22:48 |
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| lbt | o/ fiferboy | 22:52 |
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| fiferboy | Hey lbt! | 22:52 |
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| lbt | back home and awake? | 22:54 |
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| * Jaffa plays ever so slightly with Qt Creator on Ubuntu. | 22:54 | |
| Jaffa | Seems reasonable. Need to work out if I can change its keyboard shortcuts to match Eclipse's. | 22:55 |
| Jaffa | lbt: sorry I messed up Maemo_security's talk: page. You may still want to do some housekeeping | 22:55 |
| fiferboy | lbt: Indeed. Well, barely awake ;) | 22:55 |
| * lbt adds access control to Talk:Maemo_Security and blocks Jaffa | 22:56 | |
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| fiferboy | Mek: No dice. Maybe this is a sign I should wait until the binaries are out... | 22:58 |
| fiferboy | Although it is weird that the dpkg build didn't have this problem | 22:58 |
| * GeneralAntilles can't get DoF to play nice. | 22:58 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Nor YouTube. | 22:58 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, settling in period is always the worst for an ide. vb has a very high benchmark for me, and obviously eclipse for yourself | 23:04 |
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| fiferboy | Mek: Actually, that seems to work after cleaning up the directory. Thanks | 23:06 |
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| Ceron^ | http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/peugeot_art.jpg | 23:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Nice, Media player now shows a banner whenever you open a folder on a UPnP server. | 23:16 |
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| timeless_mbp | didn't it always do that? | 23:18 |
| * timeless_mbp waits for crash reporter to send 100 useless reports | 23:18 | |
| GeneralAntilles | It's new to me. | 23:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | and it makes me want to stab my device to death. | 23:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Now why in the world wont it see my movie shares. . . . | 23:19 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Have you turned its parental filter off? | 23:20 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Imma turn you off in a second, qwerty12_N810. :P | 23:20 |
| luke-jr | same thing | 23:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | :( | 23:21 |
| fiferboy | Mek: Did you use -prefix /usr ? | 23:24 |
| * GeneralAntilles waits to see if any of this wiki talk actually results in any progress this time. | 23:24 | |
| Mek | fiferboy: no, I installed it all in some seperate prefix in /opt/something | 23:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | help | 23:26 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone here know Spaniards or Latin Americans? | 23:26 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm looking for a common male first name for which there's a shorter nick name | 23:27 |
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| MrGoose1 | are you pretending to be someone spanish? | 23:28 |
| timeless_mbp | no | 23:28 |
| javispedro | timeless: Javier and Javi (proof: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Javi&redirect=no ) | 23:28 |
| timeless_mbp | thanks | 23:28 |
| MrGoose1 | timeless you lie | 23:29 |
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| timeless_mbp | MrGoose1: why would you accuse me of such a thing? | 23:30 |
| * timeless_mbp quickly issues: /part #mozilla-hispano | 23:30 | |
| javispedro | lol. | 23:31 |
| javispedro | i'm intrigued too. | 23:31 |
| qwerty12_N810 | The MBP part gives you away. The Spanish use real computers | 23:31 |
| lardman | hmm, dh_install: libchamplain-0.4-0 missing files (usr/lib/libchamplain-0.4.so.*), aborting | 23:31 |
| javispedro | qwerty12_N810: you wouldn't know.... ;P | 23:31 |
| * lardman curses debian building for the umpteenth time | 23:32 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: What? I can pretend to be Spanish too! | 23:32 |
| lardman | Si! | 23:32 |
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| * qwerty12_N810 changes the name displayed on his /whois info | 23:32 | |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5418 | 23:33 |
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| Firebird | timeless_mbp, what's the expected outcome? | 23:34 |
| timeless_mbp | Firebird: that's included somewhere in comment 1 | 23:34 |
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| Firebird | ah | 23:34 |
| frals | voting for bugs is a great way to fill your email appearently.. :D | 23:34 |
| timeless_mbp | Firebird: do you have a device? | 23:34 |
| timeless_mbp | frals: not necessarily | 23:35 |
| Firebird | no | 23:35 |
| javispedro | ah, you mean instead of examples generic names have been put in the translation... | 23:35 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: so... | 23:35 |
| timeless_mbp | using things instead of names was insane | 23:35 |
| timeless_mbp | the English is much worse | 23:35 |
| frals | yeah, could change so i dont get notices.. but thats no fun ;P | 23:35 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm using David Smith in my English because it's much easier for humans to understand | 23:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | frals: Ah, brilliant! You sound like just the person I need for testing my spambot | 23:35 |
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| thp | is it possible to get the current connection type (wifi, cellular) without having to watch events using conic? (on maemo 5) | 23:36 |
| timeless_mbp | the english nokia ships has: | 23:36 |
| timeless_mbp | "First name Last name" | 23:36 |
| frals | qwerty12_N810: ;D | 23:36 |
| timeless_mbp | which is um.... strange | 23:36 |
| timeless_mbp | it's also probably poor british english, where it should probably be surname and family name | 23:36 |
| timeless_mbp | nyway | 23:36 |
| javispedro | well the whole dialog is a mess either way. | 23:36 |
| javispedro | with the repeated entry in the screenshot at least. | 23:37 |
| javispedro | I'd just remove #3, unless it's common in certain countries. | 23:37 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: so... | 23:38 |
| timeless_mbp | some countries are stupid and really use that format | 23:38 |
| timeless_mbp | you can't remove it | 23:38 |
| javispedro | then, since I assume localisation can't hide it... | 23:38 |
| timeless_mbp | because if a user picks that format and then changes locale to esES | 23:38 |
| timeless_mbp | what should the locale show | 23:39 |
| timeless_mbp | "you haven't picked a setting" ? | 23:39 |
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| timeless_mbp | that'd be worse | 23:39 |
| javispedro | touché I guess. | 23:39 |
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| luke-jr | timeless_mbp: "I like pizza" | 23:39 |
| timeless_mbp | it could say "Sanchez Javier [no es usado en Espanol] | 23:39 |
| timeless_mbp | or something | 23:39 |
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| javispedro | actually, I'd be fine with the use of "Nombre" & "Apellido". | 23:39 |
| timeless_mbp | btw, if Sanchez is a bad choice for a last name, feel free to comment, but please try to keep the comment count low on bugs i file | 23:40 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: anyway, the English form is really bad | 23:40 |
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| timeless_mbp | since it has 4 words :) | 23:40 |
| javispedro | yeah, Ic. | 23:40 |
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| Mercury_ | Funky issue with my N810, the theme appears to have gotten, screwy. The hilights for selected areas in the menus are not showing up, making it a whole lot more interesting to use, since you can't tell what is selected. | 23:40 |
| timeless_mbp | and i claim the spanish form is bad since the localizer didn't understand what it meant | 23:40 |
| Mercury_ | Powercycle doesn't seem to help any. | 23:40 |
| timeless_mbp | if the localizer can't figure it out, the odds that the user will aren't great | 23:40 |
| javispedro | grab a sample name from first contact having both fields filled in? | 23:40 |
| javispedro | or from currently selected contact if any. | 23:40 |
| timeless_mbp | "Tell Me" | 23:41 |
| timeless_mbp | assume "tell" is first name and "me" is last name | 23:41 |
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| timeless_mbp | and yes, i really have a card like that | 23:41 |
| javispedro | lol. | 23:41 |
| javispedro | but | 23:41 |
| timeless_mbp | +1800555TELL | 23:41 |
| timeless_mbp | fwiw | 23:41 |
| javispedro | "Tell Me"; "Tell, Me"; "Me, Tell" would be easy. | 23:41 |
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| timeless_mbp | plus because of the stupid format messes | 23:41 |
| javispedro | to understand what's going on I mean. | 23:41 |
| timeless_mbp | it's quite likely that people have cards that aren't properly entered :) | 23:41 |
| Mercury | Is this a known issue with a known fix? :) | 23:42 |
| timeless_mbp | someday i'll find someone w/ 2 contacts "John Doe" and "Doe John" (distinct people w/ the obvious name parsings) | 23:42 |
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| timeless_mbp | Mercury: change theme? | 23:42 |
| timeless_mbp | the device ships w/ 4 iirc | 23:43 |
| timeless_mbp | pick one of the other 3 ... | 23:43 |
| javispedro | when in doubt, look at how Bill Gates does it (they introduced most computer terms either way) | 23:43 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm | 23:43 |
| timeless_mbp | i have multilingual w7 | 23:43 |
| timeless_mbp | but i don't think i have a spare license for outlook | 23:44 |
| timeless_mbp | i suppose OWA would work | 23:44 |
| Mercury | timeless_mbp: Hrm, worth a shot. | 23:44 |
| javispedro | my Palm has a dialog like that and just has "Apellidos, Nombre";"Compañía, Apellidos". | 23:45 |
| Mercury | timeless_mbp: Nope, same identical problems. | 23:45 |
| javispedro | lastname - firstname , company - lastname | 23:45 |
| Mercury | timeless_mbp: The scroll bar in the control panel is also not getting drawn. It's there and you can interact with it, but it's not being drawn. | 23:46 |
| javispedro | Mercury: rebooting? | 23:46 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't recognize that bug | 23:46 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Mercury: Erm, is your problem anything similar to: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=181668 ? | 23:46 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: he tried | 23:46 |
| Mercury | javispedro: Tried that. | 23:46 |
| javispedro | ouch. | 23:46 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: Reading, one moment. | 23:46 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: Yeah, that looks similar. | 23:47 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: But I didn't install or update anything before this happened. | 23:47 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: glad to see it was filed in talk instead of bugs | 23:47 |
| timeless_mbp | this way no one will do anything about it | 23:47 |
| javispedro | Outlook grabs the actual first/last names from contact. I knew I used a program that was doing that :) | 23:47 |
| timeless_mbp | in my case, David Smith is almost certainly in my contacts... | 23:48 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Mercury: #2 says installing bash fixed it... | 23:48 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: Yeah, doing that now. | 23:48 |
| javispedro | timeless: it's a bit more intelligent and if you don't fill the last name it won't show up in the list. | 23:48 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: He also changed the /bin/sh symlink, which is, interesting. | 23:49 |
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| javispedro | (I mean, it only shows "Show contact as: David [end of list]") | 23:50 |
| GAN900 | timeless_mbp, nobody's going to do anything about it either way. ;) | 23:51 |
| javispedro | not the exact same situation though, outlook allows one to set "Show contact as" individually for each contact. | 23:51 |
| mikhas | hm, how would I send a file via bluetooth to another device? cant find anything useful in the file manager | 23:51 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GAN900: You voiced what I was thinking, thank you | 23:51 |
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| javispedro | oh, cmon. you don't know about that prize Nokia gives you when you report in the # 5000 WONTFIX/ignored bug. | 23:52 |
| GAN900 | Still, it is 4 karma points. :P | 23:52 |
| RST38h | No sense in karma points if nobody is listening | 23:53 |
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| thp | mikhas: for images use the image viewer's share option | 23:56 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: Yep, that fixed it. | 23:56 |
| Mercury | qwerty12_N810: I'd love to know what started requiring bash on me. | 23:56 |
| thp | mikhas: for everything else, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5300 | 23:56 |
| mikhas | thp, thanks! | 23:57 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Mercury: No idea. I stopped booting from SD because I'd run into race conditions involving themes | 23:57 |
| javispedro | sigh. sigh. sigh. | 23:57 |
| javispedro | no sending via bluetooth of .txt files? | 23:57 |
| javispedro | and the file manager gui is still closed.... | 23:57 |
| qwerty12_N810 | FFS, that is a fucking joke | 23:57 |
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| mikhas | looks like a potential WONTFIX bug though | 23:58 |
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| thp | mikhas: please vote for that bug if you want to get it fixed ;) | 23:58 |
| qwerty12_N810 | thp: I'll vote, but seeing that fixed? Ha! | 23:59 |
| mikhas | bribing always worked better than voting, as history has shown ^^ | 23:59 |
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