IRC log of #maemo for Friday, 2009-08-07

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lardmanevening all00:47
Luddekgood evening00:47
fernand0_not kidding, that girl looks nice00:48
woglindehe lardman00:49
* lardman reminds people that he's not a girl....00:49
GAN800k-s, the eye candy may have overpowered your eye candy. ;)00:49
* lardman heads to the logs to see what this is all about00:50
woglindelardman the girl here on this video
lardmanah yes, not too bad00:51
k-sfernand0_: that's my alter-ego00:51
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fernand0_k-s, oh, you are Gustavo, I've always read your blog, hehe, I like the things you put on it about efl/edje/python00:53
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k-sfernand0_: see, now you like my alter ego as well ;-)00:54
k-skidding, mariana is the only girl at our office00:55
k-sfull of scarry nerds, we need someone to balance00:55
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woglindek-s lol how can she stand that?00:58
lardmanvery cool, I have a nice microphone input waveform displayed00:59
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fernand0_k-s, by the way, I'm currently downloading the indt maemo-sdk image, does it include the necesary tools to develop with python-ejde?01:01
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lardmanhmm, /me wonders about a glass of wine01:12
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florianthat's something to consider :)01:13
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Macerit is ok01:13
lardmanno, my wife will kill me if I open a bottle now01:14
Macera group of alcoholics were able to convince the world that alcoholism is a "disease"01:14
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lcuklardman, only one thing to do - all nite tesco and get a replacement01:14
Macerobease people are also close to this "diseased" classification01:14
lardmanlol, means I have to finish it tho'01:15
Maceras if stuffing their piglike fatass faces with disgustingly unhealthy food had nothing to do with it01:15
lcuksuch a hard life!01:15
lcukjust get the new bottle before you start that one ;)01:15
Macershow no pity for alcoholics, fat people, and drug addicts01:16
lardmanhmm, having been in the pub playing skittles, winning I hasten to add, and drinking, I think driving 20 miles to the nearest 24h Tescos would be a no-no :)01:16
lardmanobviously Tescos are placed every 10 miles or so01:17
lcukok, no then01:17
Macerit would be a true sign of alcoholism01:17
lcukwhen we were camping some guy drove back from the pub with his kid01:17
lcukto the campsite01:17
Macerlong drives to fool people01:17
lcukhe picked up another bloke and his kids01:18
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lcukand they crashe01:18
Macertell tale sign01:18
* lardman sticks to the water01:18
lcukand the kids were in hospital for the night01:18
lcukand one guy was in a cell01:18
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lcukshame really, the guy who got the lift was havin the time of his life01:18
lcukreallyhavin the best holiday ever01:18
lardmanthe cell was probably more comfortable than the tent, not sure about hospital ;)01:18
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lcuki hope not01:19
lcukhe only got a lift cos they were completely blind01:19
lcukthey forgot torches01:19
lcukbitch of it was we had walked back 5 mins before01:19
lcuksame route - his tent was next over01:19
lardmanhmm, bad luck01:20
lcukyeah - really killed his time, he was practically in tears about what had happened01:20
lcuknote - i dont give a shit about the driver himself01:20
lcukanyway, dont drink and drive01:21
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lcukcyas later01:21
lcuk(didnt mean it as a rant, it upset me01:21
woglindepoor kids01:21
lardmanno worries, wasn't planning on going to Tescos :01:22
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lcukwoglinde yeah, they are all fine physically01:22
lcukgnite anyway \o01:24
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* lardman tries to remember where data is placed when passed from ARM to DSP and whether it will allow a fast FFT01:27
lardmanglass of wine would doubtless help the thinking, but water it is :)01:27
derfA fast Fast Fourier Transform?01:28
derfTwice the fast for half the price.01:28
lardmanwell one hopes, assuming it's in the right type of memory01:28
derfTI does indeed have hand-optimized asm for FFT on C55x.01:28
lardmanyep, was planning on using their macro01:28
lardmanwhich calls the asm01:28
derfYou can map 16 MB of host memory, or do the message passing thing.01:29
lardmancan't actually map that much, not enough TLBs left over01:29
derfAh, true.01:29
lardmanat least not with the Nokia setup anyway01:29
lardmanhmm, ipbuf is in extmem anyway, so will need to be copied to DARAM on DSP side, so shared memory is probably the fastest transfer (saves a copy)01:32
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woglindehm I still at updating ti dsp stuff for omap3530 in oe01:34
lardmanI've not really looked at the omap3 stuff, been busy and have no hw so lack motivation01:35
woglindeno beagleboard?01:35
lardmannot especially cheap over here01:36
woglindelardman hm where do you live again?01:37
Luke-Jr_beagleboard isn't cheap period01:37
Luke-Jr_for what beagleboard is, it should be $5001:37
Luke-Jr_or less01:37
woglindewhat you mean with cheap?01:37
lardmanwell it's like >£100 iirc01:37
woglindehm look here available at sep01:38
lardmanall well and good for something I'll use day to day, but I won't with a beagleboard, so couldn't justify buying one01:38
woglindebut its 14901:38
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Luke-Jr_exactly, a ripoff01:38
Luke-Jr_149 would be a good price for a N810 if it were open01:39
Luke-Jr_but something that's barely usable, if usable at all?01:39
lardmanwas hoping to get a Pandora last Xmas and hack on that, but obviously it hasn't happened :)01:39
Luke-Jr_lardman: why obviously?01:39
lardmanwell as it's still not been produced and looks like it's at least a few more months off still01:40
woglindepnadora wasnt availble01:40
Luke-Jr_they claim to have one shipment out01:40
lardmanwas supposed to be for last nov01:40
Luke-Jr_probably the only one :þ01:40
lardmanLuke-Jr_: ah, that's news to me. Hmm01:40
lardmananyway that ship has sailed as far as I'm concerned, far too late01:41
Luke-Jr_ Newsletter: Enter email address  HOMEBLOGFORUMSDEVELOPERSPRESS AREA01:41
Luke-Jr_ARM® Cortex™-A8 600Mhz+ CPU running Linux01:41
Luke-Jr_430-MHz TMS320C64x+™ DSP Core01:41
Luke-Jr_PowerVR SGX OpenGL 2.0 ES compliant 3D hardware01:41
Luke-Jr_800x480 4.3" 16.7 million colours touchscreen LCD01:41
Luke-Jr_Wifi 802.11b/g, Bluetooth & High Speed USB 2.0 Host01:41
Luke-Jr_Dual SDHC card slots & SVideo TV output01:41
Luke-Jr_Dual Analogue and Digital gaming controls01:41
Luke-Jr_43 button QWERTY and numeric keypad01:41
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* Luke-Jr_ stabs browser01:42
lardmanI know the spec, just think something better will now come along01:42
Luke-Jr_I wasn't even trying to paste the spec01:42
Luke-Jr_The first batch of the Pandora is now sold out.01:43
Luke-Jr_ Thanks to everyone for the support so far, we should have some tasty new photos on the blog soon.01:43
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lardmanhmm, should01:44
lardmanall very tenous still01:44
lardmantenuous even01:44
GAN800Luke-Jr_, you're so epic at spinning utter bullshit.01:45
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Macertrying to get sats w n80001:45
Macerand mapper01:45
Luke-Jr_GAN800: no u01:45
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lardmanhi GAN80001:45
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GAN800Luke-Jr_, you should go back and take an econ clash or something.01:46
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GAN800Hey, Simon.01:46
Luke-Jr_GAN800: why? I couldn't care less about economics :D01:50
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* lardman wonders about twiddle table locations01:52
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Macerwtf can i use to use the internet to dl the almanac?01:56
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lardmanthe agps-ui should do the trick01:57
lardmanfrom the SUPL server01:57
lardmanor are you talking manually?01:57
Maceragps didnt seem to dl it01:58
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lardmanperhaps you didn't move far enough?01:58
lardmanor the file is corrupt, etc01:59
lardmanalso a time limit, won't download within a certain time for the same location01:59
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Maceryou have to move?02:00
Macerjust to get an almanac'02:00
Maceri stayed outside 30 mins grying to get a lock02:01
lardmansaves hammering their server, only download it if you've moved or it's out of date02:01
lardmanyeah, try deleting the nvd_data file then try again02:01
Macerok, screw it.. i will wait02:01
Maceruntil i am outside driving for a while02:02
lardmanso I've been told, should stop any corruption in there from stopping the GPS02:02
* lardman doesn't even bother will the built-in now, just uses a BT one02:02
Macermaemo itself has been searching for sats for a while02:02
Macerthat seems redundant02:03
Macerim sure once you get it going the 1st time the next time is far easier02:03
lardmannvd_data contains the almanac and ephemeris data, if it's corrupt it will be looking for the wrong sats02:04
Macerwhere does it store it?02:04
lardmanthat's a question :)02:04
lardmaniirc, somewhere under /var02:04
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lardmanhmm, google should find it I guess02:07
lardmansorry, it's been a while02:08
Macerno pipe on n810???02:08
Maceri have ¥02:08
lardmanoh, should be on the pop-up kb02:08
Macerand €02:08
Macerbut no pipe haha02:08
lardman£ is very useful thank you very much! ;)02:09
javispedroI just pooped myself02:10
javispedrotouched my n810 only to find it was in wsod-like trance02:10
javispedrowas happy to remember that I enabled /etc/no_lg_reboots02:11
javispedro(and maemo-desktop had crashed)02:11
lardmanMacer: ah, knew it was there somewhere :)02:11
Macerrm it?02:12
lardmanthen start agps-ui and the gps stuff again and it should be regenerated and filled, hopefully ;)02:12
Macergoing to stand in the yard til i lock02:12
lardmanMacer: see you tomorrow ;) :D02:12
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lardmanface South, or if you're in the southern hemisphere face North02:13
nomisMacer: also make sure...02:13
nomisMacer: that your clock is set correctly.02:13
Macerit is02:13
nomis(incl. proper timezone)02:13
lardmanso only 1h to lock then, rather than a week... :D02:14
* lardman should try his, last lock was in Australia I think02:14
Macerhome city?02:14
Maceri mean02:14
Macerthere isnt a place in maemo for timezone02:15
Maceronly home city in the clock settings02:15
lardmanah yes, depending on your chosen city02:15
Macerbbl ;)02:15
lardmangood luck!02:15
nomisMacer: we breathlessly await your fix  :)02:16
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GeneralAntillesLuke-Jr_, exactly.02:17
GeneralAntillesand it makes you look like a fool.02:17
Luke-Jr_GeneralAntilles: no u02:17
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lardmanon a whim I tried to get a fix sat in my study - one sat, no change in the last 5min, not going to work I don';t think02:20
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Macertook 5 mins to lock in maemo config02:26
Macerbut mapper keeps looking for a gps receiver02:26
Macerwhat dev is the internal gps?02:26
qwerty12_N810Bluetooth, leave device blank02:27
Maceri have /dev/pgps02:27
Macerwhich is like tty/002:27
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lardmannight all02:31
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Macerthink that was a bad move with the maps heh02:32
nomisMacer: hmm?02:32
Maceri selected like 802:32
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Macergot the lock and tracking tho02:33
javispedrotmo: "The rumors are that the next iPhone will have a multi-core Cortex A9. "02:34
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javispedroheh. it will ship before the N900 too.02:34
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woglindelol javis02:36
woglindeand good nite02:36
woglindeI am leaving02:36
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Maceram i still connected?02:37
wazdyes u are :)02:37
Macerlost my wifi for five mins02:38
Macerssh should have  died heh02:38
Macerit works.. thanks02:38
Macerneed to get a mini sd02:38
Macertear is too lacking in features02:39
Macerawesome browser so far for what it is tho02:39
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Macerguess i jumped the gun calling the n810 crappy heh02:40
Maceri have been using it nonstop for a whole day haha02:41
wazdMacer: I had a week with n800 only02:41
Macerit IS a little better than my older n800 i sent Stskeeps02:41
wazdMacer: not bad experience for such a small device :)02:42
Macerthe qwerty does take some getting used to02:42
Macerisnt that responsive02:42
Macerhave to press the space kind of hard02:42
wazdMacer: well, I had to get used to even my desktop keyboard :)02:42
Maceronce i get this damn ecu in my car... will be pretty fun02:43
Maceri have an su8w02:43
Macerused to use it with my n800 and n9502:43
Macerstill have it02:43
Macern810 makes it so i can keep my g1 in a bag02:44
Macermight have to get a bulk battery for the gq tho02:44
wazdMacer: hmm, g1 and n810 same time is a bit overkill :)02:44
javispedrothe ability that opensource gives me to fix the bugs that bit me most by myself is vastly underrated02:44
Macernot really02:44
Macerg1 is slow02:44
wazdMacer: oh02:45
Macerand closes apps on its own when out of mem02:45
javispedroi'm starting to even enjoy it :)02:45
wazdMacer: I prefer tiny phone and the tablet :)02:45
Macern810 has a bigger higher res screen02:45
* javispedro fills another bug report that'll be a WONTFIX in diablo and gets ready for bed02:45
Macerand a much better browser02:45
wazdjavispedro: that's great but it's nothing to deal with end-user same time :)02:45
Macerjavispedro: ?02:45
Macerwhat bug is that?02:46
Maceri need a minisd02:46
javispedrothat ossofilemanager thing that was pissing me yesterday02:46
Macergoing to order one02:46
Macerhopefully a 16G if i can find one02:46
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javispedrogood luck with your new N810 :)02:47
javispedroand gnite02:47
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Macerhad an n800 before02:51
Macernot much new wxcept the qwerty and gps02:51
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Macerordered a 16G03:08
Macerbut it didnt come with an adapter03:08
Macerand i saw a c6 4G with a minisd adapter for like $1103:08
Macerwow they sure are making them big03:09
Macersoon 32G microsd?03:09
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Maceris there a way to rm the default browser to replace it with tear?03:15
Macermicrob is so slow03:15
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chxI got the modified cover and a 32GB full sized SD card.03:20
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Macern810 nokia car charger for 50 cents? :)05:04
Macernot much demand for a nokia car charger i guess?05:04
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chxLOL 53 cents!05:17
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chx 99 cents wall brick rotflmao05:18
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b-man16i finally got my tablet back today :)06:02
b-man16but the company that i sent it to was unable to fix it >:(06:02
b-man16so it looks like i'll have to buy an N810 :(06:03
* b-man16 is really pissed06:04
LinuxCodesorry to hear that mate06:04
LinuxCodedi they at least tell you what the problem was ?06:04
b-man16theay claimed that there was corrosion damage06:05
b-man16but i took a look and there was no damage >:(06:06
LinuxCodethey charged you how much ?06:06
LinuxCodeI think you been had mate06:06
b-man16indeed :(06:06
LinuxCodetake pictures, get a witness06:07
LinuxCodedispute they did any work, and ask for a written clarification on where the damage is06:07
LinuxCodefor 108 dollars, you could have had almost 50% of a new n81006:07
b-man16my dad is going to file a complaint to the tech support center at nokia06:08
b-man16(it was sent out under his name)06:09
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b-man16the company's name is Palco btw06:20
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CutMeOwnThroatso will the N900 have solar panels on the back?06:31
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LinuxCodeCutMeOwnThroat, it will come with a nuclear power reactor that is portable...06:48
LinuxCodeis that helpful to you ?06:48
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CutMeOwnThroatfusion or fission?06:49
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LinuxCodefission, with a subscription for nuclear decommissioning06:51
LinuxCodeon a more serious note06:52
LinuxCodeI have given up hope to get a N810 replacement before the year is out06:52
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CutMeOwnThroatI only got my N810 a couple of months ago!07:01
CutMeOwnThroatI mainly use it for reading ebooks, though, it turned out07:01
CutMeOwnThroatcould as well have been a kindle07:01
CutMeOwnThroatbut... eww... proprietary formats07:03
CutMeOwnThroatalso... too big to lug around everywhere07:04
LinuxCodeI use it to read email, to do list07:05
LinuxCodesometimes irc...07:05
LinuxCodesync with evolution07:05
CutMeOwnThroatwireless is sometimes useful when there's enough free wireless around07:06
* LinuxCode has 3 spots in town where he can get free wlan07:06
LinuxCodeohh I lied07:06
LinuxCodesome pubs have it too07:06
CutMeOwnThroatI used to watch the (previously downloaded) German tv news on my way home07:07
CutMeOwnThroatreading is easier, though07:07
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Macerwtf convinced nokia to use a minisd08:06
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RST38hMacer: Funny, had the same question about MicroSD08:23
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Stskeepsmicrosd is at least easy to get here08:24
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RST38hMicroSDs are so tiny that I have trouble inserting them, anywhere08:33
MacerRST38h: they arent bad08:42
Macermini is just the bastard middle brother that no parent loves08:42
RST38hYep, unfortunately08:52
RST38hI am not buying a MIPS laptop. Had enough insight into guts of those.08:53
Stskeepsi find it ironic mips android works together with Open Embedded Software Foundation ( - extremely pro-android) .. vs the old old (same name, with a space..)08:54
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slonopotamusDarwinSurvivor, DarwinSurvivor_, surviving involves doing copies of yourself? :)10:14
DarwinSurvivor_slonopotamus, sorry, xchat likes to load without a panel applet, then close and leaves ghosts behind, i'm working on fixing it...10:14
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slonopotamusDarwinSurvivor_, just kidding :)10:15
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slonopotamushe didn't survive :/10:15
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JaffaMorning, all10:20
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Stskeepsmorning jaffa10:20
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* lardman curses his cold11:20
* Stskeeps is spending time with reimbursement forms and receipts11:21
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qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: How's the fight with the "Mer is dangerous" person going?11:22
lardmanthough good once done11:22
lardmanhi qwerty12_N81011:22
qwerty12_N810hi lardman11:22
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: ah, there was a bit of sarcasm, but it was the type of person who insists warning labels should be on things or something..11:25
qwerty12_N810Heh >.<11:25
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qwerty12_N810Oh, lardman, "dbus-send --type=method_call /com/nokia/osso_hp_ls_controller" is usually quicker to get the speaker working than rebooting11:28
lardmanah yes, I knew there was a command somewhere, thanks11:30
lardmanany ideas why it just stops working?11:30
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qwerty12_N810None at all :(. On an N800, that could be attributed to the FM Radio applet but no idea why on an N81011:31
lardmanmy mic also doesn't seem to work without the headphones plugged in, though I've not checked that by rebooting11:32
lardmanso perhaps some fault with one of the chips that senses the headphones, who knows11:32
lardmananyway thanks, have created a script so I can call that at will :)11:33
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Stskeepsphew, finally debconf9 reimbursement sent off to nokia11:35
sp3000Stskeeps: did mer microwave his cat?11:36
Stskeepssp3000: nah, it just kills people's devices11:36
* Stskeeps glances curiously on the "firefox on maemo" talk11:37
qwerty12_N810"My device survived Mer and all I got was this lousy T-Shirt"11:37
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: i'm so making you that tshirt11:37
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lardmanhave to pop out to the shops, back later on11:49
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Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: , (a must see)13:06
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qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: hehe, nice13:07
Stskeepspure fvwm13:08
JaffaStskeeps: purty13:11
Stskeepshalf the ram of hildon desktop13:11
qwerty12_N810Get OMWeather on there and you'll have people flocking to Mer by the numbers :P13:12
Stskeepswe'll probably have to adopt hildon-home13:13
JaffaStskeeps: There was a question on the new Mauku thread as to whether anybody had tried it on Mer yet. Given it's a fairly straightforward Fremantle app, it should be a good test case for "just running"13:14
StskeepsJaffa: sure, but mauku also uses the new desktop API13:14
Stskeepswhich we don't implement in 0.15 just yet13:14
JaffaIsn't that a separate widget?13:14
Stskeepsprobably, but yeah, it's a good case for testing if things run13:14
Jaffas/widget/app or pkg/13:15
infobotJaffa meant: Isn't that a separate app or pkg?13:15
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wazdhello everybody13:22
lbthey wazd13:22
Stskeepswazd: #mer , and see , (a must see)13:23
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lcukspeaking of purdy graphics, z4chh has been working on his zachmon
lcukStskeeps, thats really sweet looking13:24
Jaffalcuk: nice glassy look13:26
lcukyeah it surprised me too when i saw it13:26
JaffaStskeeps wazd: I've got a real problem with the way the Mer top bar stands out (or doesn't). Feels like the fading might need to be stronger (ideally, perhaps even a blur a la Aero ;-))13:27
JaffaBut I can't really put my finger on it13:27
wazdJaffa: that's temporary skin13:28
wazdJaffa: it will be something like this:
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lcukjaffa, why does the fading have to be stronger on areas where there is nothing?13:32
lcukor did you mean on the actual button areas?13:32
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wazdJaffa: And blur is a shader effect - not for old tablets :)13:33
X-Fadewazd: Pre-render?13:35
wazdX-Fade: pre-render what? :)13:35
X-Fadethe blur as image?13:35
wazdX-Fade: hmm, is it worth it? :)13:36
Jaffawazd: could be. Would look fab13:36
X-FadeThat is what the old hildon desktop did anyway.13:36
JaffaI was about to say that13:36
Jaffalcuk: There's something sitting on top of the background (the top panel), but it's totally transparent.13:37
wazdX-Fade: hmm, that's an idea to consider :)13:37
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Jaffawazd: Old Hildon desktop took your selected background, scaled it and drew parts of the theme over the top to make rendering quick.13:37
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JaffaSo blurring the top 50(?)px, and even doing the translucency and any borders would give a really fantastic looking effect (like OS X, Compiz or Vista's Aero) on low end hardware.13:38
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wazdJaffa: Well, I'm totally not against blur if it's not ruining the performance :)13:38
JaffaAs qwerty12_N810 says: some whizzy eye candy'll draw in the testers :)13:39
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wazdjaffa: so basically it can make anything with background underneath13:40
JaffaShould even be possible to do it with a single command using ImageMagick13:41
wazdJaffa: something like this:
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Jaffawazd: yup. I'd be tempted to make the bevel at the top and bottom a little less harsh too, FWIW.13:45
JaffaNice background btw :)13:45
JaffaMer should have a backgrounds package including some of these13:46
Andy80very nice :)13:48
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wazdJaffa: well, soft bevel will make the look too much like any other modern os13:59
wazdJaffa: I think these harsh stripes adds some uniique look14:00
JaffaThe harsh stripes reminds _me_ of old computers which didn't have the palette to do a more subtle appearance.14:01
wazdJaffa: like n800? :D14:01
JaffaAnd looking "like any other modern OS", when said modern OSes don't run on tablets etc. isn't a bad thing.14:02
slonopotamusany sed/awk gurus? i need to append some text to each line in a file14:02
Jaffawazd: I'm thinking 4-bit palettes of 16 colours in Windows 3.x, RISC OS 2, Amiga's Workbench, ...14:02
Jaffaslonopotamus: Something like : sed -e 's/$/ Appended text./' <in >out14:03
slonopotamusJaffa, thx14:03
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lcukgrrrr @ twitter not sending because of google-analytics14:05
lcukjaffa, coding the ui expecting low bit depths is actually a positive thing - sunlight readability.  subtle changes are wasted most of the time anyway14:08
lcukalso, it means it works better on devices that havent got super graphics available14:09
Jaffalcuk: I think assuming 8-bit colour is reasonable; and I use my tablet indoors more often than I do outside. <shrug/>14:11
JaffaIME, people'll make decisions as to try software (incl. Mer) based on screenshots.14:12
lcukheh, dont go too far - you will give wazd a heart attack14:12
lcukyou gotta give him at least 65k colors ;)14:12
Jaffalcuk: Right, so that's plenty then for a less harsh effect ;-p14:12
lcukhell yeah - its theme based anyway so its not a big deal either way14:12
lcukhgh contract theme14:12
lcukjaffa soft theme14:13
lcuki know konttori is doing the theme designer for fremantle, and i recall that they wont be compatible, but i wonder if there could be a sidestep path to allow fremantle themes to be used/converted for use in mer14:14
Stskeepsprimary problem is that the themes are not OSS right now :)14:14
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lcukbut once people start using the designer to make their own themes, they can be on whatever license they want14:16
Woollylardman: ping14:16
lcukhaving a path to use the themes would be good14:16
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wazdjaffa: again, soft gradient is slightly boring. If you have 65k colors, you shouldn't use them all same time :) The goal is to make the look attractive and slightly outstanding14:21
wazdSo user will look ath the screenshot and say: "Hey, it's Mer" :)14:21
Jaffawazd: IMHO, the harsh light bars at the top and bottom of the top bar put too much emphasis on trying to make the bar stick out compared with the content of the bar and the application beneath it. That's why "modern OSes" are moving towards softer edges, to not distract from the bits doing the actual work for the user.14:23
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* VDVsx sends ninjas to etrunko house/work place :P14:24
wazdJaffa: and btw, borders are not that contrast to distract14:24
wazdJaffa: <- to my mind it's pretty soft when the app is launched :)14:25
Jaffawazd: True. Perhaps I'm just mis-remembering and/or confused.14:27
wazdJaffa: and I'm defending this idea not because it's mine, it's zemvoid's :P14:27
wazdJaffa: more than that, I totally aggree with you that UI should be as much soft looking as possible14:28
wazdJaffa: You can see it in icons and stuff :)14:29
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VDVsxhumm, it seems that we will have nokia WRT in maemo5, cool :)14:31
wazdVDVsx: what's WRT? :)14:32
VDVsxweb runtime toolkit14:32
Stskeepsi'm even more pondering if we'll have firefox or fennec, honestly14:32
wazdStskeeps: microb? :)14:33
Stskeeps'Firefox on Maemo' is a bit awkward title for a talk14:33
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Stskeepsoh that's nice14:33
Stskeeps' Skype on Maemo'14:33
javispedrohmm... WRT implies WebKit14:34
VDVsxStskeeps, fennec was/will be renamed, isn't it ?14:34
javispedrowhat does that mean for MicroB?14:34
wazdoh, htwl widgets, cool :)14:34
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qwerty12_N810javispedro: hopefully, death.14:34
wazdMy fingers can't type what I want them to type :(14:34
javispedroqwerty12_N810, ah, don't be so harsh, I was actually starting to like it :D14:35
wazdmicrob is like a tank, it's slow but it goes anywhere :)14:35
wazdand to be fair, it's not always slow14:36
VDVsxwazd, good point :) and at least I can see flash videos :)14:36
VDVsx....coufg coufg HTC hero14:37
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javispedroi want to give it a try at good snes emulation. any suggestions where to start?14:38
javispedro^^^ pupnik14:38
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javispedroi saw you started porting drpocketsnes14:38
javispedroi was thinking something like LJP (cause I have no gp2x experience, but loads of PalmOS)14:39
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Woollylardman: ping14:47
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lardmanWoolly: pong14:47
lardmanthat was good timing, I just walked in14:47
Woollylardman: haha shweet :)14:47
Woollylardman: do you still have the compiled binary for maemo-barcode?14:48
lardmanyeah, let me find an url for you14:48
Woollylardman: ace of spades14:48
lardmanthe ui isn't very good by the way14:48
Woollylardman: that's okay :) Can it recognise EAN13s?14:49
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lardmanyeah, or perhaps better is to use the test program from trunk14:51
lardmanas that just spits out eans14:51
RST38hjavis: Avoid porting palmos stuff14:51
lardmanWoolly: I don't have a copy of that lying about though14:51
javispedroRST38h, I know what to expect :)14:52
RST38hjavis: Stick with gp2x - even if you have no experience, gp2x is a relatively generic linux machine14:52
lardmanderf: do you happen to have a copy of the 1D barcode test program?14:52
Woollylardman: that's okay, thanks for the binary :)14:52
lardmannp, am moving to python now, tell me what you need and I can put together a quick program for you. Or try at least :)14:52
lardmanusing zbar as the backend14:53
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derflardman: Not offhand, no.14:56
lardmannp and thanks, have pointed Woolly to zbar and some Python15:01
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RST38hhehe, LG wants $1200+ for a watch phone15:21
RST38halmost makes me think they have no idea that Chinese are selling these for a couple of years now15:22
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Woollylardman|lunch: FYI
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GeneralAntillesIrrational, meaningless MicroB hate.15:42
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RST38hGAN: not enough of it. add more hate! =015:43
GeneralAntillesAh, good, the Nokia Slowing Down thread has devolved into (mostly) a bunch of people whose opinions I don't care about bickering amongst themselves.15:43
wazd_n800I'm back)15:43
GeneralAntillesRST38h, troll it to death, please.15:43
RST38hGAN: I think I have completed the loop15:44
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RST38hthey labelled me a nokia fan and gave up =)15:44
RST38hmoo wazd15:46
GeneralAntillesRST38h, bunch of incoherent, inconsistent idiots.15:46
VDVsxGeneralAntilles, remember your talk about nokia wrt ? damn have to bet on the lottery :P15:46
wazd_n800RST38h, heya)15:46
GeneralAntillesVDVsx, my talk?15:46
RST38hpretty consistent and easily classifiable15:46
* GeneralAntilles doesn't recall ever having any talks.15:46
GeneralAntillesAh, that.15:46
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GeneralAntillesThat wasn't so much a prediction or guess as knowledge based on what Nokia's plans were. :P15:47
GeneralAntillesRST38h, sorry, inconsistent about who they choose to hate on and why.15:47
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GeneralAntillesVery consistently hypocritical.15:48
RST38hwazd: fire, water, people at work15:48
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VDVsxGeneralAntilles, I know  :), but you doubted, if I recall currently15:48
zapCan someone try to pull out the MMC card off N810, and then re-insert it: it won't automount after that on mine. Wonder if that's my problem or everybody have it.15:49
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GeneralAntillesVDVsx, you've either got the wrong person or it was another discussion I'm recalling.15:50
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GeneralAntillesI see a large-scale usage like the Pre as unlikely.15:50
VDVsxGeneralAntilles, nah15:51
GeneralAntillesBut MicroB's architecture certainly indicated that they planned to use it in several applications at once.15:51
GeneralAntillesThere's no way they're migrating to non-native, though.15:51
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RST38hyou mean browserd vs the shell?15:52
GeneralAntillesI mean it's time for me to go to work.15:52
RST38hgood luck15:52
RST38hzap: it requires umount first15:53
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zapRST38h: you mean, user Joe has to issue "umount" from root console before removing the mmc card?15:54
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zapbesides, if I insert the USB cable into N810 and then pull it out, it automounts fine15:54
Mekdo you close the cover over the mmc card?15:54
zapdoes it matter?15:55
zapI'll try to close it15:55
Mekit unmounts when you open it, and mounts when you close it15:55
VDVsxthe strange thing here, is that WRT runs under webkit, microB and fennec use gecko o_015:55
lcukwrt is just simplified html+js isnt it15:56
zapMek: thank you, it did the trick15:56
lcukie   half pint web experience - keep it simple and light to get best perf15:56
lcuka very good overview for folks, since its the topic ;)15:57
Jaffakonttori's interview from about 18 months ago shwos that Elephanta would likely have had WRT15:57
Stskeeps^ interesting15:57
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VDVsxlcuk, you need a render engine, I guess15:58
RST38hSts: cool15:59
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lcukVDVsx, where would i get one of those from..15:59
StskeepsRST38h: ultimate trolling place? ;p15:59
lcuki need to make my html  parser better :P15:59
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VDVsxlcuk, just pick one :)16:00
lcukall of them work in rgb16:00
lcukand render to those surfaces, converting one to liqbase would make it really poor16:00
RST38hSts: I guess this one can be taken seriously for a change16:00
lcuki looked a while ago :)16:00
RST38hSts: I doubt it will make a difference but still16:01
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lcukVDVsx, they wouldnt make best use of what liqbase can offer - i have a html parser and dynamic loading of images from web and  stuff and can do most of what i want (liqcells are at the lowest level equivilent to DOM elements)16:02
wazd_n801let's make a branch - «Troll's swamp» =)16:02
vilenhey, everybody16:03
vilen!i have a question16:03
VDVsxlcuk, :)16:03
vilenis there a way to compile kernel modules for maemo16:03
vilenand deploying them on the device16:03
vilenwithout flashing the kernel16:04
VDVsxStskeeps, RST38h bet $10, that we will have trolling posts there by the end of the day :)16:04
slonopotamusvilen, put them in any place you like and insmod?16:04
vilenhmm ok16:05
vilenso i can compile on the scratchbox and insmod the .ko file on the actual device?16:05
slonopotamusvilen, yep16:05
vilenok thanks16:05
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wazd_n801Lolz. Bout a week ago I thought that it would be cool to set "Mama, ooooo" from Bohemian Rhapsody as a ringtone for my mom calling16:09
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wazd_n801Just heard it from another guy's phone)16:10
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Zhilin_n800RST38h, the roof is on fire :)16:20
Zhilin_n800RST38h, I'm happy that there were no people16:20
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Zhilin_n800ok, my station, cya later chaps16:25
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lbtX-Fade: could you set -> ?16:32
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ideamonkguys I've got an amd64 machine, and I think the maemo SDK doesn't support that well, I'm on ubuntu 9.04 amd64, is there a linux distro which installs 32bit over amd64 hardware. I've been able to use fedora 11 32bit on my laptop, but it seemed broken.. any suggestion for such a distro ?16:48
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javispedroideamonk, I am using the maemo sdk 1 on my debian lenny amd64 machine fine, what's the problem?16:48
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ideamonkhmm installing over amd64 isn't possible right ?16:49
javispedroit is, but you have to install scratchbox manually16:49
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javispedro(does the scratchbox automated installer has an option for --force-architecture?)16:49
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ideamonkoh k, im gonna try again then :)16:50
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RST38h"It has proven difficult to obtain permission to utilize Foundation assets to obtain genetic samples directly from Pliocene-era life"16:50
ideamonkwill let you guys know if i find probs.. gonna try soon16:52
javispedroideamonk, the fremantle automated scratchbox installer definitely has an option for amd6416:53
javispedro"-FUse dpkg --force-architecture for 64-bit Linux"16:53
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lcukgahhh my twitter is not twittering17:09
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GAN800lcuk, twitter is silly and bad for your intelligence. :P17:14
lcuktwitter is irc2.017:14
lcukit suffices17:15
Stskeepsactually twitter reminds me much of personal irc channels + loggers tbh..17:16
thuxis twitter better than irc?17:16
Stskeepscentralized structure17:16
Stskeepsand with less line width :P17:17
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* GAN800 chuckles at Talk.17:18
RST38hBut it is Web2.0!17:18
RST38hIRC is soooo last century, isn't it? =)17:19
thuxwhich one take more bandwidth?17:19
RST38hWeb2.0 always takes more17:19
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thuxirc is easy to use17:21
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GAN800What (or which . . . ) idiot decided that it would be a good idea to let us flounder around with dead software and no new hardware for two years. . . .17:23
MekI doubt it was a conscious decision...17:24
StskeepsGAN800: i'm sure it's the same people deciding which libraries should be closed source ;)17:25
Stskeepslast one in question is a library to print debug output..17:26
GAN800Mek, sure it was, somebody killed Elephanta.17:26
GAN800Stskeeps, bugzilla.17:26
StskeepsGAN800: i have a good bunch of bugs in my belt right now, but i did ponder a bug on "request for information on what the hell you smoked when you chose to close source these things"17:26
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GAN800Just more community-killing idiocy from Nokia. They're getting pretty good at it.17:27
GAN800Stskeeps, do it.17:27
StskeepsGAN800: worst part is for some of it i can see the reasoning17:27
GAN800Stskeeps, don't make it easy for them to release unjustified closed stuff.17:27
Stskeepsfremantle will be the first "complete" implementation of the fremantle APIs, and you won't be seeing a fremantle clone right away on some random chinese device :P17:28
GAN800Ah fuck, Sotomayor. . . .17:28
lcukGAN800, if an event occurs and a development plan doesnt come along, no matter how many developers you throw at something, you cannot increase speed17:29
lcukits like the baby making paradox17:29
Mekprobably the waiting will soon be over... :)17:29
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* qwerty12_N810 can wait for the next device. After all, it's not like it'll be released running Harmattan.17:30
javispedrothat's wisful thinking. I still think september is a too early prediction.17:30
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* Stskeeps thinks it'll be september, tbh17:31
Stskeepsin terms of how the beta2 code felt17:31
Stskeepsand the fact they already started harmattan moves17:31
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Stskeepsalso, my telephone is dying, i rarely talk to people on the phone, and i want a new device ;)17:36
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GAN800It's probably never going to be released.17:38
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GAN800They're just stringing us along. They're satisfied with keeping us from buying anybody else's product.17:39
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lcukGAN800, does anything actually make you happy?17:40
* GAN800 can't believe they confirmed Sotomayor.17:40
GAN800Hello Constitution burning.17:40
GAN800lcuk, not lately.17:40
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GAN800I'm tired, lcuk.17:40
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* RST38h sells Stskeeps a RAZR17:54
StskeepsRST38h: if it wasn't for my k610i dying i don't mind it so much17:54
Stskeepsit is the perfect tethering phone17:54
RST38hNot Siemens? :)17:55
qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: what's wrong with it?17:55
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: when it gets squeezed it dies :P17:55
GAN800lcuk, I want an announcement, and I want Nokia to stop trying to kill the community.17:55
qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: heh :P - is the battery loose or anything? with my K750i, and my W810, I had to use paper to keep the battery in place17:56
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GAN800This slow death by idiocy and socialism the US is walking towards needs to stop, too.17:56
RST38hOh man17:57
RST38hGAN: Will reading about the latest misogynist massacre entertain you? :)17:57
RST38hand...ehh...envigorate you?17:57
JaffaGAN800: With the stuff happening at the summit, including the "co-creation" thing; Nokia've *got* to have got RX-51 into people's hands. Otherwise the summit's a bust.17:58
RST38hJaffa: That is why it is scheduled in Amsterdam. In the worst case, everybody can just get stoned.17:58
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zapWhat process is in charge for automounting memory cards? dsme?18:04
GAN800Jaffa, wouldn't put it past them.18:05
qwerty12_N810(It uses scripts to do the mounting (dpkg -L ke-recv for the list) and the source can be found in the Maemo SVN)18:05
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GAN800Jaffa, either that or 50 prototypes running the SDK beta 3.18:08
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RST38hOh well, going to take a leave from this place of hope and lament18:09
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RST38hSee you later gentlemen18:10
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GAN800Gonna be a long day.18:12
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javispedroco-creation. smells like a marketing word to me. hope it's fun at least :)18:20
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GAN800"Maemo Council" has now officially become the norm. :sigh:18:29
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GAN800Well, as the new Maemo Council I've decided it's time for Nokia to make an announcement.18:30
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Stskeepsit's council, community council, or what is it again? :P18:31
GAN800Maemo Community Council18:31
Stskeepsand = maemo community? :P18:32
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JaffaGAN800: Where's "Maemo Council"?18:32 is the home of the Maemo Community18:32
GAN800Jaffa, from every Nokian I've seen mention it in the past two months18:33
GAN800Most recently the co-creation email.18:33
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JaffaWe're not in charge of Maemo!18:33
GAN800Jaffa, Jussi in particular.18:33
Macerminisd is already out for delivery18:33
Macerordered it last night18:34
Macertigerdirect has to be like 1 mile from my ups office18:34
GAN800Jaffa, I've don't bother trying to correct anybody anymore since they all jump down my throat when I try.18:34
GAN800TigerDirect is evil.18:34
Macerprobably the same building18:34
GAN800Cheaper is never cheaper with them.18:34
Macerthey are like the walmart of electronics18:35
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GAN800High shipping costs, poor service, frequently ship incorrect or broken items.18:35
GAN800Newegg is where you want to shop.18:35
Macerive honestly only had 1 problem with one of their items18:36
GAN800Don't even think about processing an RMA through them.18:36
MacerGAN800: newegg used to do to me....18:36
Macerwhat you said about td18:36
Macerthey sent me a replacement vid card18:36
GAN800Half the time you can't even process warranty claims with the manufacturer on stuff you've purchased from TigerDirect.18:36
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Macerand i had to pay to send back their mistake18:37
Macerand they told me they didnt have a passive card18:37
Macerwhen i  told them in the order18:37
Macerit HAS to be passive and i dont want replacements18:37
Macerthey were such douches about it i never ordered from ne again18:38
Macerover a $20 vid card18:38
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Macerafter ordering tens of thousands of dollars with them18:39
Macerthey were total pricks about THEIR mistake18:39
Robot101how do you make oggs work on diablo?18:39
Robot101I had it working on chinook but since I reflashed, neither of mogg nor the ogg thing work for me18:39
Macertony hawk on yo gabba gabba18:40
Macerhe looks stoned18:40
VDVsxRobot101, there's a deb package, afaik18:45
VDVsxoggsupport or something like that18:45
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woglindehe lardman19:45
lardmanhi woglinde19:45
lardmanquiet, I guess everyone is glued to the cricket19:46
woglindesummer holdiay19:47
lardmanah, that too19:47
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woglindehe fiferboy19:47
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fiferboyHello woglinde19:49
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khertan_n810Hello !19:50
khertan_n810someone know where i can found information about hippocanvas ?19:53
khertan_n810google isn t really usefull19:53
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lcukkhertan_n810, might be an idea to bob into #sugar or #olpc19:56
lcuk(sugar is v active19:56
lcukevening guys \o (and lardman)19:56
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lardmanhi lcuk, why am I not a guy out of interest?19:57
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lardmanyou heard about my breast augmentation?19:57
lardmanjust the left one19:57
khertan_n810yep i see in the olpc wiki that this isnt a mature framework19:58
qwerty12_N810/nick lardwoman19:58
woglindeqwerty *g*19:58
lardmannot quite the same ring to it19:58
qwerty12_N810But it's more truthful ;P19:58
lardmanperhaps more PC - lardperson19:58
lcuklardman, no, you got yourself married19:58
lcukyou are an old fart now :D19:58
lardmanah, 'tis true, no longer one of the lads :(19:58
lcuklol qwerty12_N81019:58
lardmanand I'm sitting listening to test match special too, no pipe or slippers yet mind you19:59
lcukkhertan_n810, looks like it was replaced for sugar (the normal ui for olpc i believe19:59
lcukqwerty has a pipe he would let you use19:59
lcuk:D i tweeted from liqbase last night20:00
lcukqwerty, whats the difference between a pipe and a bong20:01
lcuki thought they were all the same thing20:01
lardmanah don't worry, I have some wine on the go and am DSP hacking, so almost like crack20:01
lcuk:D ballmer peak20:01
lcuki have a fridge full of bud20:02
lardmanso true :)20:02
lardmannot sure I'd go for Bud though, think I'd prefer to be at work than drink that stuff20:03
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lcuklardman, you would prefer to be at work anyway20:04
lcukyou get to play the same games all day lol20:04
lcukand probably have a faster net connection20:04
lardmannah, quieter at home now I have a shared office20:05
lcukooh, what happened then20:05
lcuki didnt know you had been downsized20:05
lardmanplus I have every bugger under the sun asking me questions at work20:05
lcuki know how that feels20:05
lardmannah not downsized, dept was moved a few years back and out whole group was moved into one office20:05
lcuki dont mind a shared office as long as i dont hear about WOW every 5 mins20:06
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CutMeOwnThroatGAN800, hmm?20:06
qwerty12_N810lcuk: if it ever comes back up, tell them that is an awesome resource20:07
lcukit does every day20:08
lcuki hear so much about mana and crit ratings and all that20:08
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RST38hso, anything new? a late evening n900 release?20:20
JaffaRST38h: (thanks Stskeeps)20:22
RST38hyea, seen that20:24
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RST38hunfortunately, using the phone right now, cant look at it20:24
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Khertan_n810Hello Again !20:47
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Khertan_n810someone with a maemo sdk can compile for me and upload to extras devel this phython binding ? (
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woglindecant you compile it yourself?20:48
Khertan_n810on the device nope20:48
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Khertan_n810and the home desktop pc is still displaying : Hardware Failure20:50
Khertan_n810ps i m in train connection could be reset by peer20:51
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lcukKhertan_n810, if you are reset by peer, hit him20:53
woglindekhertan hm20:54
Khertan_n810yerga has done a great job on MaemoWordPy20:55
Khertan_n810the ui is really nice20:55
Khertan_n810on Maemo20:55
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lcukyeah its sweet20:56
lcukhow you gettin on with mcal and stuff?20:56
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Khertan_n810Hello Again (copyright Apple Computer Inc 1984)21:58
lcukwhoa ! Khertan_n810 you got upgraded22:02
lcukwhat happened to the Apple I you used to have22:02
Khertan_n810Hello Again was the slogan of the Macintosh Plus _)22:03
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Khertan_n810... [extras-builds] [fremantle]: libquicktime 1.1.0+debian-1build1maemo1 FAILED   Maemo ?22:09
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sp3000hmm, I was going to complain about rsync in diablo extras I think22:35
sp3000it gave me an update depending on extras-devel :|22:36
sp3000some magic should probably check for that sort of thing22:39
qwerty12_N810I believe the new packages for Fremantle is meant to do just that22:40
qwerty12_N810s/packages/packages interface/22:40
infobotqwerty12_N810 meant: I believe the new packages interface for Fremantle is meant to do just that22:40
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k-splease vote, comment :-)23:14
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esaym153does pidgin work with the cam on the 810? or does any IM software work with the cam?23:42
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`0660_i don't think so23:44
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esaym153then what do I do with the cam? lol23:44
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`0660_you can use it as a low resolution mirror :)23:45
AStormwell, pidgin could work with the cam23:47
AStormthe cam is available via v4l... or is it?23:47
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esaym153I don't know, I haven't tried anything with it23:47
esaym153I think there is /dev/video23:48
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lcukgtalk thingy uses the cam23:51
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lcukand liqbase does23:51
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VDVsxgizmo also can use it, afaik23:53
lcukhiya vdv23:53
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